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| 00:00.10 | dcordes | t00ns1ll, sorry I don't know. I'm only a guest as well. |
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| 00:00.41 | xavd | andyross: kind of agree here. We should put the generated java file (from resources or aidl) somewhere else |
| 00:00.43 | dcordes | ioerror, well I mean all of the printed doku you got in the box with the g1 |
| 00:01.03 | tomgibara | romainguy_: I have a working fix for this: http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=1094 |
| 00:01.04 | ioerror | dcordes, there's a bunch of stuff in there |
| 00:01.17 | romainguy_ | tomgibara: what's the fix? |
| 00:01.37 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr__: hey question about the file browser you wrote--does it offer a PICK intent for other apps to pick files? |
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| 00:02.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | umdk1d3: i'm going to add it in |
| 00:02.42 | tomgibara | romainguy_: Well, it's bothering me :( It's *a fix* to *a bug*, but I still can't say why it triggers the observed behaviour: In short the Animation class divides by the duration without checking for zero. |
| 00:02.42 | umdk1d3 | kk cool :) it would be awesome if connectbot could use it to pick privatekeys |
| 00:02.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | now that it runs on a device, i'm going to update it |
| 00:02.48 | dcordes | ioerror, did you read it? :) |
| 00:02.52 | michaelnovakjr__ | umdk1d3: you got it :) |
| 00:03.26 | romainguy_ | tomgibara: sounds like Animation should just throw an IllegalArgumentException in setDuration if the duration is 0 |
| 00:03.35 | ioerror | dcordes, i didn't see any section on debian etch udev configuration, i admit i might have missed it :-) |
| 00:04.28 | tomgibara | romainguy_: I wasn't sure if zero was valid or not, so I put an IAE if duration < 0 and put a guard so that if the duration is zero, the normalizedTime becomes 1f |
| 00:04.48 | romainguy_ | I would put the IAE in setDuration if duration <= 0 |
| 00:04.53 | romainguy_ | and remove the guard |
| 00:04.57 | tomgibara | okay |
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| 00:05.03 | romainguy_ | the less we do in that code path, the better :) |
| 00:05.15 | tomgibara | Yes, I wondered about that |
| 00:06.15 | dcordes | ioerror, sorry I'm only curious about the end user license agreements shipped in the box :) I'm using lenny now, if I had the g1 I sure would try and help. |
| 00:06.22 | romainguy_ | well the only reason to have a duration of 0 would be to apply a transformation on a new |
| 00:06.32 | romainguy_ | which you can do by just having fillBefore=true and never starting the animation |
| 00:07.23 | tomgibara | ah, ok. I'd been trying to do something similar when I'd tripped over this bug |
| 00:07.53 | tomgibara | I ended up producing my own simple Animation impl. |
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| 00:08.44 | ioerror | dcordes, ah |
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| 00:21.36 | mpardo | how can i procedurally get the version of my app? |
| 00:21.52 | mpardo | from the manifest |
| 00:21.58 | mpardo | for updates |
| 00:21.59 | umdk1d3 | mpardo: ive got code somewhere /me digs up |
| 00:22.05 | mpardo | k thx |
| 00:22.14 | mpardo | u publish ur app today? |
| 00:22.24 | umdk1d3 | mpardo: or you could use http://www.tomgibara.com/android/veecheck/ if your looking for something advanced |
| 00:22.50 | umdk1d3 | mpardo: http://code.google.com/p/connectbot/source/browse/trunk/connectbot/src/org/connectbot/util/UpdateHelper.java |
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| 00:23.04 | umdk1d3 | =O pcjjman |
| 00:25.27 | tomgibara | mpardo: re: veecheck I'm going to be changing the licence to something more commercial friendly (apache prob) so I'm turning a blind eye to transgressions at this time. |
| 00:26.15 | ioerror | fadden, still here? |
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| 00:26.40 | ioerror | fadden, http://pastebin.com/d1e285653 |
| 00:27.03 | ioerror | fadden, that udev rule sets up /dev/android like so: |
| 00:27.18 | ioerror | http://pastebin.com/m1fd7ff99 |
| 00:28.08 | ioerror | Strangely enough, now the adb can't see it but it can mount |
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| 00:31.52 | umdk1d3 | grr anybody remember the debug.keystore password? |
| 00:32.49 | umdk1d3 | damn you plusminus_ :P i just burnt my pizza |
| 00:33.02 | umdk1d3 | your timer app doesnt run when the phone falls asleep |
| 00:33.05 | umdk1d3 | its okay tho :P |
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| 00:35.00 | xavd | umdk1d3: the password is android for both they keystore and the key (easy to remember :)) |
| 00:35.16 | umdk1d3 | xavd: awesome thx ^.^ |
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| 00:36.03 | xavd | why do you need it anyway? are you making your own debug keystore? |
| 00:37.22 | mithro | what values is "public void schedule(TimerTask task, long delay, long period)" in? I guessed seconds, but it seems like it might be milliseconds? |
| 00:37.23 | umdk1d3 | xavd: someones eclipse borked and we still needed to sign an apk to resolve a package manager issue |
| 00:38.15 | romainguy__ | mithro: milliseconds |
| 00:38.28 | mithro | romainguy: could the doco be updated to include that information? :) |
| 00:38.30 | romainguy__ | mithro: all delays and periods, unless specified otherwise, are in ms in our APIs |
| 00:38.35 | xavd | umdk1d3: if you delete the keystore, eclipse should recreate it automatically. If you need to sign a app manually you may as well make a real key |
| 00:38.53 | romainguy__ | mithro: isnt't that the Harmony APIs? |
| 00:38.56 | romainguy__ | I thought that was specified |
| 00:39.16 | mithro | Harmony APIs? |
| 00:39.29 | romainguy__ | the java.* packages |
| 00:40.20 | umdk1d3 | xavd: he had a package that didnt get uninstalled all the way |
| 00:40.25 | umdk1d3 | so he was stuck between rock+hard place |
| 00:41.02 | umdk1d3 | remnants of the package with his debug key was stuck in the package mangaer, not letting another version into its place |
| 00:41.03 | xavd | umdk1d3: oh so you're just signing the package manually with the debug key? |
| 00:41.14 | umdk1d3 | right, because the manager needed to see that key to let it in |
| 00:41.22 | umdk1d3 | it worked for him to install it, then uninstall it |
| 00:41.27 | umdk1d3 | the first uninstall wasnt fully clean |
| 00:42.05 | xavd | ok cool. sorry for being inquisitive, I'm just curious about how people deal with the key/signing stuff as feedback to improve the tools |
| 00:42.28 | umdk1d3 | xavd: i know this package manager issue has come up several times tho |
| 00:42.35 | umdk1d3 | with connectbot, some older versions were signed with an old key |
| 00:42.45 | waldo_ | according to the market-- connectbot's had between 1K-5K downloads.. 87 ratings |
| 00:42.50 | xavd | yeah, we are aware of it |
| 00:42.53 | umdk1d3 | when people uninstalled it, somehow stuff was left in the mangaer |
| 00:43.12 | umdk1d3 | weve kept around all the old apks just in case, but in this case he had done his own build |
| 00:43.30 | umdk1d3 | lol im talking like hes not even here lol, sorry cpdiety :) |
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| 00:48.03 | umdk1d3 | SanMehat: NeTTwerk as in the music label? |
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| 00:48.26 | SanMehat | yeah |
| 00:48.38 | umdk1d3 | ooh :) andy hunter |
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| 00:54.33 | Dougie187 | New sprint plans this coming weekend supposedly. |
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| 00:58.27 | heat | word |
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| 00:59.22 | siliconplains | greetings |
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| 01:05.33 | cunning4u | is there a flash player plugin out yet? |
| 01:06.11 | cunning4u | ? |
| 01:06.24 | siliconplains | flash? |
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| 01:06.35 | siliconplains | for what browser? |
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| 01:06.37 | cunning4u | ya |
| 01:06.48 | cunning4u | for the android browser |
| 01:06.58 | cunning4u | to view videos on cnn |
| 01:07.07 | siliconplains | I would be amazed if one did exist considering iphone's safari does not have one |
| 01:07.38 | cunning4u | if you can watch youtube,why not flash |
| 01:08.01 | siliconplains | maybe they have built a special viewer for a specific codec in android |
| 01:08.15 | siliconplains | to specifically view youtube vids |
| 01:08.18 | cunning4u | hm,not yet |
| 01:08.22 | cunning4u | oh |
| 01:08.23 | wastrel | anyone tried that horrible virtual pet app? |
| 01:08.24 | cunning4u | ya |
| 01:08.27 | wastrel | it's hilarious |
| 01:08.31 | wastrel | also horrible |
| 01:08.34 | cunning4u | wasterl omg gay |
| 01:08.34 | waldo_ | no i read the reviews |
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| 01:09.02 | cunning4u | i cant believe they let shitty apps like that on the market |
| 01:09.54 | duey | oh you have no idea |
| 01:09.58 | duey | wait until i release mine! |
| 01:10.11 | cunning4u | lol |
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| 01:12.29 | spikebike | er |
| 01:12.37 | spikebike | I thought the whole point of the market was not to be a filter |
| 01:13.06 | mithro_ | woot! |
| 01:13.14 | mithro_ | my modification works |
| 01:14.14 | duey | yeah just wait, PictureFrame® --- Because Frames are Hot⢠is going to be a best seller |
| 01:14.36 | wastrel | i think i saw 3 flashlight apps |
| 01:14.53 | duey | lol |
| 01:17.13 | khert | . |
| 01:18.15 | romainguy | yay OTA |
| 01:18.37 | duey | Organic Trade Association? |
| 01:18.46 | spikebike | RC28 upgrade? |
| 01:18.51 | romainguy | over the air install |
| 01:18.55 | romainguy | spikebike: I guess |
| 01:19.05 | spikebike | you just got it? |
| 01:19.06 | romainguy | 3 wikipedia apps already on market |
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| 01:19.12 | michaelnovakjr__ | jeeze |
| 01:19.17 | duey | lol |
| 01:19.30 | umdk1d3 | hmmm do i risk an ota update |
| 01:19.38 | romainguy | another weather app? |
| 01:20.32 | languish | this is why i thought code.google for android should have been better organized. some overlap, but less of it |
| 01:20.57 | romainguy | code.google.com has nothing to do with it |
| 01:21.07 | romainguy | and if people want to write 20 weather apps, then so be it |
| 01:21.12 | spikebike | agreed |
| 01:21.14 | romainguy | I'm just surprised by how fast they all arrived :) |
| 01:21.14 | languish | it's gonna keep going like this for the dev's that don't have g1's to see what's actually in the market |
| 01:21.17 | languish | ahh |
| 01:21.19 | languish | lol |
| 01:21.27 | spikebike | it should get better since before today it was hard to tell what the rest of the population was going to write |
| 01:21.41 | romainguy | but yeah |
| 01:21.46 | romainguy | it'd be nice to browse apps on the web site |
| 01:21.49 | romainguy | or on the emulator |
| 01:21.50 | duey | are there any I Am Rich apps? |
| 01:21.51 | languish | any chance there's going to be a web-based list of what apps are in the market? |
| 01:21.55 | languish | nod |
| 01:22.03 | spikebike | market |
| 01:22.11 | spikebike | oops |
| 01:22.15 | umdk1d3 | duey: roooofl we totally need one |
| 01:22.19 | romainguy | speaking of apps |
| 01:22.19 | duey | obv |
| 01:22.21 | romainguy | time to work on mine |
| 01:22.23 | duey | makes one |
| 01:24.35 | Hongbo | does the status of android market developer console only refresh every few hours? my app status is been remain the same for quite some time... |
| 01:25.04 | romainguy | it should be real time |
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| 01:30.45 | waldo_ | how does android handle dependencies? Like lets say one app needs a file picker provided by another... |
| 01:31.01 | romainguy | it's not handled right now |
| 01:31.01 | duey | uh |
| 01:31.10 | romainguy | we're thinking about it :) |
| 01:31.15 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) |
| 01:31.18 | waldo_ | yeah, it's good question |
| 01:31.19 | michaelnovakjr__ | good thinking romainguy |
| 01:31.21 | waldo_ | it's a good quesiton |
| 01:31.30 | waldo_ | Hmm |
| 01:31.41 | duey | why would another app provide file pickers.. |
| 01:31.41 | romainguy | that said when you startActivity() for an intent that doesn't exist, you get an exception back |
| 01:31.41 | umdk1d3 | its a difficult problem too |
| 01:31.49 | romainguy | duey: and there's that too |
| 01:31.52 | romainguy | @!# file choosers |
| 01:31.56 | umdk1d3 | its taken a long time to linux distros to get their managers to a usable state |
| 01:32.01 | duey | i just copied what he said... |
| 01:32.02 | duey | :D |
| 01:32.21 | umdk1d3 | we need a file chooser tho :P |
| 01:32.25 | romainguy | no |
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| 01:32.27 | waldo_ | duey-- example michaelnovakjr__ has a file browser that ConnectBot might want to use to find sshkeys.. |
| 01:32.36 | umdk1d3 | exactly |
| 01:32.42 | waldo_ | or rather to allow the user to find their own sshkey off the sdcard |
| 01:32.53 | duey | and you can't provide that why? |
| 01:32.53 | michaelnovakjr__ | it makes sense |
| 01:33.02 | michaelnovakjr__ | why build it in |
| 01:33.13 | michaelnovakjr__ | why not use the same one across multiple apps? |
| 01:33.14 | waldo_ | rather than include all the code in ConnectBot it would be better to have michaelnovakjr__ offer the file chooser as a seperate app so others can use it too and so there's no repetition of code |
| 01:33.18 | waldo_ | exactly |
| 01:33.25 | duey | I agree on one level, but surely there are security problems with allowing that kind of access between apps |
| 01:33.30 | waldo_ | that's true too |
| 01:33.35 | umdk1d3 | more than just that--later when it has SCP the file picker will become even more important |
| 01:33.44 | waldo_ | yes that'st rue |
| 01:33.49 | umdk1d3 | duey: theres no permissions--i ask him to choose a file and return its name to me |
| 01:34.01 | waldo_ | but duey makes a good point about security.. how does connectbot know that filepicker.app is pointing to what it says it's pointing to |
| 01:34.06 | michaelnovakjr__ | and it doesn't run system calls outside the File class |
| 01:34.21 | michaelnovakjr__ | true, security is important |
| 01:34.40 | michaelnovakjr__ | i'll take a file chooser over a virtual pet :) |
| 01:34.41 | waldo_ | connectbot is trusting filepicker to return the user's choice |
| 01:34.53 | umdk1d3 | hmm true |
| 01:34.58 | waldo_ | although I suppose it could verify with the user "do you mean XXXX?" |
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| 01:35.11 | umdk1d3 | but i think thats the point, we dont want to create any explicit trust relationships |
| 01:35.21 | umdk1d3 | "you have to use Brand X app with Brand Y app" |
| 01:35.31 | umdk1d3 | intents are meant to be interchangable |
| 01:35.41 | michaelnovakjr__ | yes |
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| 01:35.50 | umdk1d3 | but yes there are some risks i suppose |
| 01:35.51 | waldo_ | when you're choosing an sshkey for example, trust is important. You don't want ConnectBot to install a key it thinks the user picked but was really downloaded from evil.com. |
| 01:36.02 | michaelnovakjr__ | very true |
| 01:36.21 | umdk1d3 | well in that case, they just try that evil.com key against a host that wont let them in with that key |
| 01:36.40 | michaelnovakjr__ | the intent will return a file path to the key |
| 01:36.40 | jcanfield_ | so why couldn't a portion of the fs be jailed for application access? |
| 01:36.58 | michaelnovakjr__ | some parts are |
| 01:37.08 | umdk1d3 | your malicious app could create a "wrapper" file |
| 01:37.08 | waldo_ | well yeah, in that case the key won't work, true. But you get the point |
| 01:37.18 | umdk1d3 | by adding a "." at the end or something |
| 01:37.33 | umdk1d3 | it would have same name, so user doesnt think anything of it (if we prompt them), but they still get evil file |
| 01:37.39 | Lenolium | Personally, I think you are worrying too much, if a file picker ends up not picking the correct file somebody will replace it (and fast) |
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| 01:38.05 | waldo_ | lenolium if this is the "designated" file picker by another app tho... |
| 01:38.08 | michaelnovakjr__ | that could also happen on your computer :) |
| 01:38.45 | michaelnovakjr__ | its not a blackhole either, it will/is open source |
| 01:38.49 | waldo_ | but you're more likely to d/l untrusted stuff on your device than on your computer because it's supposedly sandboxed |
| 01:40.08 | waldo_ | I could see the file picker or whaever it was called being used by a LOT of applications |
| 01:40.25 | michaelnovakjr__ | yes, its meant to be simple |
| 01:40.28 | waldo_ | yeah |
| 01:40.30 | waldo_ | exactly |
| 01:40.34 | waldo_ | and very fundimental |
| 01:40.52 | waldo_ | it can be used almost as a File->Open... type of thing |
| 01:40.57 | waldo_ | or File->Save... |
| 01:41.05 | waldo_ | from any app |
| 01:41.49 | michaelnovakjr__ | its open to possibilities... i feel it serves a good purpose |
| 01:42.01 | michaelnovakjr__ | especially for connectbot, provides a UI to key management |
| 01:42.26 | waldo_ | yeah but I could see it for like finding files to attach to emails for example |
| 01:42.35 | michaelnovakjr__ | sure |
| 01:42.36 | waldo_ | from your sdcard |
| 01:42.52 | waldo_ | any app that deals at the file-level with the sdcard would use it |
| 01:43.25 | waldo_ | I'm suprised this wasn't built into android itself |
| 01:44.13 | michaelnovakjr__ | like i said, there's the really early version available that was ported from m5, just doesn't have the intent setup yet |
| 01:44.22 | michaelnovakjr__ | needs work |
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| 01:44.25 | waldo_ | right, oh for sure.. |
| 01:44.25 | Disconnect | there's a reason most windowing OSs include a file picker :) |
| 01:44.34 | waldo_ | yeah.. exactly Disconnect |
| 01:44.43 | waldo_ | maybe this will be included in SDK 1.1 |
| 01:44.58 | jcanfield_ | I'm still trying to understand the concerns here? Applications already read write and create files, and the sdcard is freely accessible ...why not allow a sd file picker? |
| 01:45.16 | michaelnovakjr__ | jcanfield_: its been tested to work |
| 01:45.26 | wastrel | what's m5? |
| 01:45.28 | waldo_ | jcanfield_: the concern is only that everyone is going to have to write their own OR someone will become the standard |
| 01:45.35 | waldo_ | m5 = earlier version of android |
| 01:45.50 | waldo_ | it works- it's running on my device |
| 01:45.56 | waldo_ | albeit slightly buggy :) |
| 01:46.01 | Disconnect | oh and random side note.. for football fans.. the pro football app times are offset - missed most of the skins game yesterday cuz the app said 4pm and the reality said 1pm :( |
| 01:46.28 | michaelnovakjr__ | :) yes buggy |
| 01:46.37 | jcanfield_ | aww, but hey, that's the linux way....shouldn't we have 20 crappy file managers? |
| 01:46.50 | michaelnovakjr__ | haha |
| 01:47.48 | Disconnect | i'd settle for 1. except it takes root access for a decent file manager in android.. oops, oh well. can't let the users hurt themselves....... |
| 01:48.13 | romainguy | it's not about hurting the users |
| 01:48.14 | michaelnovakjr__ | Disconnect: depends on your needs... |
| 01:48.21 | romainguy | file managers are just clunky geeky beasts from ancient times |
| 01:48.23 | michaelnovakjr__ | i don't think root is necessary |
| 01:48.25 | Disconnect | michaelnovakjr_: ability to manage files |
| 01:48.39 | michaelnovakjr__ | you can manage your sdcard |
| 01:48.44 | Disconnect | but since there are tens to dozens of users on a well-used phone.. |
| 01:49.25 | Disconnect | had a file manager on his s60 phone, never once managed to stab himself in the eye with it or accidentally incinerate any household pets... |
| 01:50.03 | waldo_ | i think if you look at it as a file-picker instead of a file manager the uses become obvious |
| 01:50.26 | waldo_ | anyone who will use their phone w/files in any way... |
| 01:50.31 | *** join/#android o3u (n=slim@modemcable123.240-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 01:50.43 | waldo_ | sending attachments.. moving stuff to/from their sdcard, etc. |
| 01:51.05 | waldo_ | they could do it all on their computers OR on their phone w/a decent file manager |
| 01:51.10 | *** join/#android Delvien (n=Delvien@cpe-75-180-28-178.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 01:52.31 | plusminus_ | this is frustrating :'( some users cannot install my apps because android says they are not correcty signed :'( where installing works smoothly with others :/ |
| 01:52.35 | Disconnect | even the tmob guys were bitching about no pdf/doc viewer, no file manager, etc |
| 01:53.31 | waldo_ | plusminus- probably they had a previous version signed w/another key |
| 01:53.31 | waldo_ | there are pdf viewers written in java-- i checked. |
| 01:53.31 | plusminus_ | oh that could be ... |
| 01:53.32 | plusminus_ | damn |
| 01:53.37 | waldo_ | plusminus_: what they need to do is re-install those older versions and then uninstall them before trying to install your newer version |
| 01:53.45 | *** join/#android foobar`` (n=testuser@adsl-69-110-12-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 01:54.29 | foobar`` | is there any way to run the binary maps app against a basesystem compiled from the open-source version? |
| 01:54.46 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@c-24-130-144-56.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 01:58.20 | DJTachyon | anybody here have the android source building in cygwin? |
| 02:00.47 | DJTachyon | woo flex and bison .. haven't done those since college :P |
| 02:00.59 | *** join/#android kslater (n=kslater@206.193.247.78.nauticom.net) |
| 02:02.26 | romainguy | waldo_: I just checked and via the PackageManager your app can query whether an Intent can be responded to on the system |
| 02:02.41 | michaelnovakjr__ | nice |
| 02:02.44 | romainguy | for instance I just changed my app to check whether the SCAN intent is available when the user opens the menu |
| 02:02.55 | romainguy | and I gray it out if it cannot be used |
| 02:03.19 | romainguy | http://pastebin.com/m505a2724 |
| 02:03.48 | michaelnovakjr__ | that is good to have :) |
| 02:04.02 | michaelnovakjr__ | i must say android is a well designed platform :) |
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| 02:06.53 | foobar`` | for some reason networking doesn't work in the simulator |
| 02:07.01 | foobar`` | it worked before on the SDK builds |
| 02:07.09 | *** join/#android romainguy_ (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:07.11 | foobar`` | is there something new I need to setup ? |
| 02:07.41 | AussieGuy | could you install this on a plam centro? |
| 02:08.28 | waldo_ | romainguy yeah it's good... and I guess you can use it to make a suggestion to the end user that "Such and such app is required for this feature. go to the market and install it to unlock this." |
| 02:08.33 | romainguy | yep |
| 02:08.40 | romainguy | until we have better ways to do this |
| 02:08.56 | DJTachyon | ah just got repo going on cygwin |
| 02:08.57 | DJTachyon | nice |
| 02:08.59 | DJTachyon | :) |
| 02:09.44 | DJTachyon | should get his Sun ULTRA1 SPARC machine up and running. It runs a 64-bit build of Gentoo ;) |
| 02:11.48 | foobar`` | when I try to turn on wifi it says "unable to start wifi" |
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| 02:12.24 | Disconnect | foobar``: yah with 3g you don't need wifi. |
| 02:12.36 | foobar`` | im talking about the simulator |
| 02:12.38 | dmaynor | is there a shell app that doesn't require the SDK? |
| 02:12.58 | foobar`` | does the simulator use a fake wifi or fake ppp connection |
| 02:12.59 | foobar`` | ? |
| 02:14.10 | romainguy | it's an emulator btw |
| 02:14.15 | romainguy | </pendantic> |
| 02:14.17 | romainguy | gngn |
| 02:14.19 | romainguy | pedantic |
| 02:14.58 | DJTachyon | heh gnupg informed me that I am using insecure memory |
| 02:14.59 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 02:15.13 | dgilmore | DJTachyon: /me has lotsa sparc here |
| 02:15.52 | DJTachyon | hehehe |
| 02:16.00 | wastrel | hrm |
| 02:16.10 | DJTachyon | i tried for days to get the 2x2GB SCSI drives to SW RAID |
| 02:16.34 | DJTachyon | apparently the Ultra1 needed a BIOS upgrade to even run in 64-bit mode, but I managed to get it to work |
| 02:17.12 | DJTachyon | w00t .. just got the repo sync on cygwin .. but i couldn't find some of those dev lib's .. I hope I can build |
| 02:17.40 | foobar`` | does cygwin even have an arm toolchain? |
| 02:17.47 | DJTachyon | good question |
| 02:17.48 | cbeust | Are you trying to build on Windows? |
| 02:17.56 | DJTachyon | hehehe .. yeah figured I would give it a shot |
| 02:18.17 | DJTachyon | before I broke the Ultra1 out of the moving box |
| 02:18.45 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@72.14.224.1) |
| 02:18.58 | DJTachyon | wow 680k/sec from a version server |
| 02:18.59 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 02:19.20 | DJTachyon | i want to work on low-level audio API calls |
| 02:19.40 | foobar`` | networking should work in the emulator...right? |
| 02:20.40 | DJTachyon | you mean internet and such foobar? |
| 02:20.44 | foobar`` | yq |
| 02:20.45 | foobar`` | yes |
| 02:20.48 | DJTachyon | yeah of course |
| 02:20.54 | DJTachyon | it uses your internet connection |
| 02:20.56 | foobar`` | yeah |
| 02:20.58 | DJTachyon | you can browse the internet through it |
| 02:20.59 | foobar`` | have you used it |
| 02:21.02 | foobar`` | in linux? |
| 02:21.02 | DJTachyon | yeah |
| 02:21.04 | DJTachyon | oh |
| 02:21.06 | DJTachyon | no :P |
| 02:21.07 | foobar`` | with the new source release? |
| 02:21.09 | foobar`` | i mean |
| 02:21.12 | foobar`` | have you used it at all |
| 02:21.15 | foobar`` | with the new source released |
| 02:21.19 | foobar`` | it worked for the previous SDK releases for me |
| 02:21.22 | foobar`` | it doesn't work now |
| 02:21.24 | DJTachyon | well i just finished updating eclipse |
| 02:21.26 | DJTachyon | let me check |
| 02:21.58 | *** join/#android tchwbs (n=tchwbs@120.17.37.139) |
| 02:22.09 | DJTachyon | did you blow away the entire eclipse/sdk install and start from scratch? I had to do that once |
| 02:22.19 | foobar`` | ? |
| 02:22.29 | foobar`` | you don't build with eclipse |
| 02:22.37 | DJTachyon | oh well im running the emulator right now |
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| 02:22.45 | foobar`` | for which release |
| 02:22.47 | DJTachyon | 1.0 |
| 02:22.53 | DJTachyon | ill check internet |
| 02:22.56 | foobar`` | the 1.0 SDK pre-release |
| 02:22.57 | foobar`` | or |
| 02:23.10 | DJTachyon | android-sdk-windows-1.0_r1 |
| 02:23.14 | foobar`` | fully-from-source compiled |
| 02:23.17 | foobar`` | yeah |
| 02:23.19 | foobar`` | im not talking about that |
| 02:23.22 | DJTachyon | ah okay |
| 02:23.29 | DJTachyon | i hear yea |
| 02:23.43 | DJTachyon | im not there yet |
| 02:24.00 | DJTachyon | still doing my repo sync at 650k/sec |
| 02:24.00 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 02:24.15 | DJTachyon | no idea what will happen when i try to make |
| 02:24.54 | DJTachyon | alright well im gonna let this run |
| 02:24.56 | DJTachyon | goodnight all |
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| 02:29.27 | *** join/#android BruteSource (n=BruteSou@m130e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 02:33.21 | jt436 | argh, uploading a new version will still erase downloads/comments :( |
| 02:33.31 | romainguy__ | yeah :( |
| 02:33.49 | jt436 | is tempted not to upload until its fixed |
| 02:35.09 | jt436 | I just added random vibrations to throw the user off while using the accelerometer |
| 02:35.32 | jt436 | and some other fixes suggested |
| 02:35.43 | michaelnovakjr__ | romainguy__ even comments? |
| 02:35.56 | jt436 | some of the comments are actually useful, other's..... well they are on YouTube level |
| 02:36.11 | jt436 | michaelnovakjr__: yes |
| 02:36.24 | michaelnovakjr__ | that is pretty annoying |
| 02:36.50 | jt436 | tell me about it |
| 02:39.25 | michaelnovakjr__ | what's your app? |
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| 02:41.47 | d03boy | is there any sort of horizontal scrolling panel? |
| 02:42.51 | languish | one of the apps used that |
| 02:42.56 | languish | hang on |
| 02:43.36 | waldo_ | is away: back in a few |
| 02:44.10 | tmarble | fadden: ping |
| 02:44.11 | languish | d03boy, task switcher |
| 02:44.16 | languish | it's in the market |
| 02:44.39 | languish | at least that's what I think you mean |
| 02:44.47 | d03boy | i'd look it up but I cant google the link for the market |
| 02:44.54 | languish | one sec |
| 02:44.56 | d03boy | why doesnt it show up at the top of my "android market" search |
| 02:45.23 | solca | hi! does somebody knows how to change target when making, for release or debug? |
| 02:46.23 | michaelnovakjr__ | ant release does it solca, if you are using the command line |
| 02:47.05 | BruteSource | swetland are you around? |
| 02:47.17 | solca | michaelnovakjr__: I just typed make and everything is in out/... but I presume is for release |
| 02:47.37 | solca | michaelnovakjr__: how I change that for debug? |
| 02:47.50 | tmarble | anyone try to build for target = x86? |
| 02:48.03 | michaelnovakjr__ | solca: is there a build.xml file for the app solca ? |
| 02:48.44 | solca | michaelnovakjr__: oh sorry, I must say I'm compiling the android OS, I want to test it on real armv6 box |
| 02:48.54 | michaelnovakjr__ | ah |
| 02:49.01 | michaelnovakjr__ | haven't done that yet myself |
| 02:49.35 | solca | ok thanks |
| 02:50.38 | *** join/#android vip (n=denied@m255e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 02:51.10 | languish | d03boy the devs email is jasonparekh@gmail.com but I don't see a page for him |
| 02:51.17 | languish | i mean related to his app |
| 02:51.26 | d03boy | hmm |
| 02:51.30 | d03boy | i'll find something |
| 02:51.31 | languish | he's got a blog and dozen other hits otherwise |
| 02:51.44 | languish | he may be onna the google guys |
| 02:53.48 | tsunami | hey, does anyone know what the difference is between notifyDataSetChanged and notifyDataSetInvalidated in BaseAdapter? |
| 02:53.55 | romainguy | yeah |
| 02:54.04 | romainguy | when you invalidate the data that means that the adapter should not be used anymore |
| 02:54.19 | romainguy | (let's say when you empty all the data) |
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| 02:55.39 | tsunami | k, thought it might be something along those lines. are there any concrete effects to calling invalidate? does the list clear or something? |
| 02:56.06 | romainguy | which invalidate? |
| 02:56.12 | romainguy | invalidate() redraws the view |
| 02:56.21 | romainguy | invalidateChildren() forces ListView to rebuild its children anew |
| 02:56.31 | *** join/#android cfreak200 (n=cfreak20@p4FDB469C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:56.36 | romainguy | notifyDatasetInvalidated() tells ListView to stop using the adapter |
| 02:56.55 | romainguy | (at least until you put data back in the adapter) |
| 02:57.10 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 02:57.31 | solca | how I change target when making the Android OS source code, for release or debug? |
| 02:57.46 | tsunami | romainguy: thx |
| 02:59.13 | languish | d03boy, yeah, the app itself is credited to the guy I mentioned, but it has a google EULA |
| 02:59.32 | romainguy | which app? |
| 02:59.37 | languish | task switcher |
| 02:59.41 | romainguy | ah yes |
| 02:59.48 | romainguy | I like task switcher ^^ |
| 03:00.18 | languish | romainguy, d03boy was asking about a horizontal scrolling panel |
| 03:00.28 | languish | which is something task switcher does sort of |
| 03:00.37 | romainguy | it's using a Gallery view |
| 03:00.48 | languish | ah is that what that is |
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| 03:07.53 | BruteSource | well i dont think anyone has gotten the gsm hardware on any omap850 device to work and i have no clue howto, so it appears im at the end of my android experience |
| 03:08.04 | languish | BistroMath gets to be the tip calc we keep |
| 03:09.14 | languish | BruteSource, have you tried contacting TI? |
| 03:09.32 | parmaster | BruteForce: is GSM being actively worked on for any of the omap850 devices? |
| 03:15.06 | *** join/#android mithro_ (n=tim@unaffiliated/mithro) |
| 03:21.50 | BruteSource | languish, you think they will write linux drivers for us? |
| 03:23.02 | BruteSource | swetland had mentioned that the android team in early development were wirking with omap850 i wonder if they had all the gsm stuf working |
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| 03:26.40 | *** join/#android tchwbs_ (n=tchwbs@120.16.55.97) |
| 03:27.06 | romainguy | sweet |
| 03:27.13 | romainguy | 11 minutes to compile Android 1.0 on my machine |
| 03:28.03 | languish | BruteSource, TI? I believe they already have them |
| 03:28.15 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 03:28.35 | languish | TI developed the DSP for the omap850 |
| 03:29.26 | languish | find out who their platform support guys were/are |
| 03:29.46 | BruteSource | dsp? |
| 03:30.25 | languish | the OMAP850 contains two cores, an ARM926 application processor from ARM's family of ARM9E cores and a TI EDGE digital baseband chipset, the TCS3500 (an ARM7MCU coupled with Texas Instruments C54 DSP) |
| 03:30.59 | BruteSource | yes i know |
| 03:31.21 | BruteSource | why did ti write linux drivers for gsm? |
| 03:32.15 | languish | I said I beleive they have them, not that I know for a fact they do. the likelyhood is that they do, *IF ANYONE* |
| 03:32.55 | languish | the TI dsp deals with the gsm in that chip |
| 03:33.50 | *** join/#android jota- (n=jota@190.6.0.180) |
| 03:34.39 | languish | "TI is providing TCS3500 customers with a tested reference design to which it has already ported the most-popular operating systems, such as Java, Linux" |
| 03:34.53 | languish | yep, they have it |
| 03:35.14 | languish | here's your reference http://www.mdronline.com/publications/epw/issues/epw_170.html |
| 03:36.07 | *** join/#android Ya1 (n=nick@c-76-126-245-95.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
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| 03:37.39 | languish | the question is if you can get someone at TI to provide the driver, officially or otherwise |
| 03:39.41 | swetland | BruteSource: we did have gsm/gprs working. the code needs to be reviewed and cleaned up before we can release it (I don't think there are any IP issues, but it hasn't been scrubbed yet) and we'd actually want to get those devices booting again first |
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| 03:40.44 | rwhitby | swetland: hey, don't forget that you don't work for Google, so how would you know? |
| 03:41.24 | rwhitby | (according to BruteSource that is) |
| 03:41.29 | swetland | rwhitby: once again I am unmasked! |
| 03:42.58 | rwhitby | BruteSource: just kidding - glad you're over the hangover now ;-) |
| 03:45.14 | geist | swetland: LIES |
| 03:45.21 | geist | no way you work for google |
| 03:45.55 | BruteSource | oh man, come on guys |
| 03:46.02 | BruteSource | never drunken dialed before |
| 03:46.14 | BruteSource | its almost the same lol |
| 03:46.23 | languish | that's more like drunken tinhatting |
| 03:46.31 | BruteSource | lmao |
| 03:46.59 | cbeust_ | We need an app that will make you do math problems before letting you dial, like we already have for Gmail |
| 03:47.12 | languish | obfuscation and deception everywhere, lie, Lies, LIES!! |
| 03:47.18 | Disconnect | is better at math when drunk, does gmail have an inversion mode? :) |
| 03:47.29 | BruteSource | swetland did you get pm? |
| 03:47.49 | languish | cbeust_, we need irc sanity checkers built in to cliendts :/ |
| 03:47.50 | *** join/#android mib_jc3e3m (i=43dc0643@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-7a1d1671ebaf7ea8) |
| 03:47.54 | languish | -d |
| 03:47.54 | umdk1d3 | "what color purse is linsay lohan wearing this month?" <-- that would be your drunk question |
| 03:48.14 | umdk1d3 | if your better at math when drunk, then you would be worse at questions like that :P |
| 03:48.23 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@137.147.45.66.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 03:48.54 | d03boy | "Which is the correct version of you're/your?" |
| 03:49.03 | languish | c) ur |
| 03:49.05 | cbeust_ | Not the one that was just used |
| 03:49.20 | umdk1d3 | hey, my key doesnt work :P |
| 03:52.25 | plusminus_ | lol I never thought about a simple InputBox-Dialod in Android.. is there one? |
| 03:52.34 | plusminus_ | ...dialog |
| 03:53.09 | *** join/#android wastrel (n=wastrel@nylug/member/wastrel) |
| 03:54.06 | umdk1d3 | plusminus_: you can setView() on an AlertDialog that has a textview with a surrounding FrameLayout to give it a margin |
| 03:54.16 | umdk1d3 | also plusminus_ did you see my pizza feedback earlier? ;) |
| 03:54.42 | languish | <umdk1d3> damn you plusminus_ :P i just burnt my pizza |
| 03:54.43 | languish | hahaha |
| 03:54.54 | d03boy | im so hungry. stop it |
| 03:55.17 | languish | d03boy, did you see the horizontal scrolling box info? |
| 03:55.22 | *** join/#android RyeBrye (n=ryebrye@160.7.248.108) |
| 03:55.33 | d03boy | ya |
| 03:55.54 | languish | btw, someone just gave me the total munchies for an ice cream sandwich |
| 03:56.10 | languish | I have to decide now if I want a chipwich or traditional |
| 03:56.23 | languish | the stores that carry each are in opposite directions :/ |
| 03:56.27 | *** join/#android jota-_ (n=jota@190.6.0.180) |
| 03:56.56 | swetland | umdk1d3: any chance we can have an option for ctrl-on-ralt or ctrl-on-search? ^^ |
| 03:57.14 | umdk1d3 | swetland: the issue with using search is that its used for global hotkeys |
| 03:57.35 | umdk1d3 | still have a lot of customization to do |
| 03:57.42 | BruteSource | i still dont understand why ti would have omap850 linux drivers lol but i guess i wont |
| 03:57.44 | umdk1d3 | could have all sorts of key options |
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| 04:00.40 | plusminus_ | umdk1d3: just trying with FrameLayout? |
| 04:00.49 | languish | BruteSource, yeah.. the info I pasted to you explains it clearly. More clearly than I can explain it to ya. |
| 04:00.52 | plusminus_ | umdk1d3: your feedback was ? |
| 04:01.20 | languish | facepalms |
| 04:01.21 | wastrel | jesus i think 60% of the apps on the marketplace are tip calculators |
| 04:01.50 | languish | wastrel, we're going with the BistroMath tip calc |
| 04:01.53 | umdk1d3 | plusminus_: your timer stopped when the phone fell asleep normally |
| 04:01.53 | languish | lol |
| 04:02.07 | wastrel | my wife is the tip calculator :] |
| 04:02.09 | umdk1d3 | aaaaand my pizza was, umm slightly brown |
| 04:02.09 | wastrel | no worries there |
| 04:02.23 | BruteSource | had to many acronymns i didnt know in it |
| 04:02.31 | languish | wastrel, normally I'm the tip calc, but I've been known to err after a dozen drinks |
| 04:02.31 | plusminus_ | umdk1d3: really :-D sorry |
| 04:02.37 | BruteSource | like saying ya gjgyjd is hgdu for udhfhf |
| 04:02.57 | umdk1d3 | lol its okay ;) |
| 04:04.17 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-250-117-78.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 04:04.21 | d03boy | what % of tip do you guys give? |
| 04:04.55 | d03boy | easiest way to do it for me is to give either 15 or 20%. This can be done by moving the decimal over on teh final bill 1 spot. That will be 10%. Double the amount for 20%. etc.. |
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| 04:05.10 | swetland | careful there |
| 04:05.28 | swetland | you're going to have a mob of angry tip calculator authors out for your blood if you spread that around |
| 04:05.39 | d03boy | <_< |
| 04:05.44 | d03boy | >_> |
| 04:06.45 | spikebike | heh |
| 04:06.47 | umdk1d3 | how many tip calculators are we up to now? sigh |
| 04:07.01 | spikebike | I just multiply by the tax |
| 04:07.05 | romainguy | umdk1d3: how many barcode scanners? :) |
| 04:07.16 | spikebike | around here it's 7.5% ish so double = 15 % |
| 04:07.23 | BruteSource | what is dsp? |
| 04:07.31 | umdk1d3 | romainguy: touche ;) |
| 04:07.50 | wastrel | i just unwrapped my earphones |
| 04:07.53 | romainguy | I wish that not all the apps required GPS :) |
| 04:07.55 | wastrel | there's a mic on there eh? |
| 04:08.00 | romainguy | even todo lists ask for GPS :) |
| 04:08.06 | *** join/#android Stskeepz (n=chobits@84.238.11.16) |
| 04:08.28 | languish | BruteSource, digital signal processor, google it |
| 04:08.50 | languish | romainguy, i noticed that too |
| 04:08.50 | romainguy | er |
| 04:08.56 | romainguy | somebody forked the Email app |
| 04:09.04 | romainguy | I haven't seen the contributions back :(( |
| 04:09.32 | languish | some apps ask for contacts info access that have nothing to do with contacts :/ |
| 04:09.46 | BruteSource | i hate when people say gole it or rtfm |
| 04:09.51 | BruteSource | google |
| 04:10.02 | BruteSource | if i could i would have lol |
| 04:10.03 | spikebike | I've seen some pretty funny reviews |
| 04:10.04 | languish | BruteSource, there's a reason forf it. You're not using your brain, or are being lazy. |
| 04:10.22 | languish | BruteSource, why can't you access google? |
| 04:10.22 | spikebike | "if you made this game shoot urself in the manhood with a potato launched so u won't ..." |
| 04:10.34 | BruteSource | can you see me or my system, or what its capable of at the current moment? |
| 04:11.12 | snadge | http://kingofgng.com/media/20080919_google_vs_microsoft.jpg |
| 04:11.14 | snadge | cute ;) |
| 04:11.17 | languish | yes, so far, the two most entertaining things about the android experience have been BruteSource's random accusations, and the market apps feedback |
| 04:11.22 | BruteSource | because i dont have a tabed browser on my phone, and im using my browser for something right now |
| 04:11.46 | wastrel | the browser can open multiple windows |
| 04:11.50 | BruteSource | i have 3 pages typed on a blog |
| 04:11.53 | languish | doesn't want to know.. just remember to use paper towels dude |
| 04:12.00 | BruteSource | no opera mini cannot |
| 04:12.06 | BruteSource | and i have no fee ram |
| 04:12.07 | umdk1d3 | spikebike: loool where is that review? |
| 04:12.18 | spikebike | android store |
| 04:12.39 | umdk1d3 | wow chuckle |
| 04:12.43 | spikebike | -> games |
| 04:12.52 | spikebike | -> sort by time |
| 04:12.55 | spikebike | top one |
| 04:13.02 | gambler | Its kind of gay that as a registered vendor I cant even browse what apps are there. |
| 04:13.13 | umdk1d3 | this device has quite the broad brush of users |
| 04:13.19 | BruteSource | anyways thats circumstantial really, my point is dont say google it or rtfm as the person may not have the ability to, and he they did why would they ask anyways? |
| 04:13.38 | languish | BruteSource, because too many people are lazy |
| 04:13.41 | RyeBrye | Is there a bot for this channel that you can say stuff like !google foo and it will reply with a google link? |
| 04:13.45 | wastrel | still need some decent productivity apps, ebook reader, offline html viewer |
| 04:13.46 | RyeBrye | !bot |
| 04:13.50 | BruteSource | so thats always the case? |
| 04:13.52 | languish | !google BruteSource |
| 04:13.56 | languish | note |
| 04:13.58 | RyeBrye | !install google bot |
| 04:13.59 | languish | &nope |
| 04:14.00 | RyeBrye | ;) |
| 04:14.39 | d03boy | RyeBrye, yes, jsut type /run http://google.com?q=foo |
| 04:14.45 | BruteSource | lmao i love when a bunch of people who arent usually on irc all come together on irc all of the sudden |
| 04:15.01 | spikebike | wastral yeah, ebook would be a big one |
| 04:15.01 | languish | spikebike, oh fishocopter, yeah.. it's...umm.. lulz |
| 04:15.09 | BruteSource | makes for a fun time |
| 04:15.27 | *** join/#android mib_xhiqxp8m (i=47929e4e@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-6873b2f4869289ad) |
| 04:15.33 | spikebike | I'm hoping for something maemo mapper like, with on device storage for when the net is out |
| 04:15.59 | RyeBrye | has been on IRC since you all were babies at home, pooping your pants, and wiping crap all over your face |
| 04:16.50 | wastrel | i've been on irc since carter was president |
| 04:16.58 | BruteSource | i was on bbs's with my 14k baud modem when most were still a twinkle in daddies eye |
| 04:17.10 | mmattice | wtf does amazon mp3 not work for me? |
| 04:17.15 | wastrel | needs wifi |
| 04:17.20 | cbeust_ | Age challenge? |
| 04:17.35 | spikebike | heh, I was on bitnet before irc existed |
| 04:17.47 | mmattice | wastrel: has it, you trys again now? |
| 04:17.49 | wastrel | i was on irc before irc existed |
| 04:17.56 | Adamant | IRC is a really poor substitute for BBS's or IM |
| 04:17.59 | OpenVirus | in Java, I would use sockets to connect to a server right? like an irc server |
| 04:18.01 | Adamant | there |
| 04:18.01 | BruteSource | thats what my comment implied |
| 04:18.09 | BruteSource | before irc and www was bbs |
| 04:18.29 | Adamant | actually that's bullshit, it's better |
| 04:18.45 | BruteSource | what? |
| 04:18.46 | d03boy | Adamant, I disagree |
| 04:18.50 | spikebike | and if memory serves on irc before channels could have names |
| 04:18.56 | BruteSource | whats bullshit? |
| 04:18.58 | spikebike | or maybe that was bitnet... memory is fading |
| 04:19.04 | Adamant | d03boy: maybe if you lived in a metro area |
| 04:19.07 | d03boy | OpenVirus, are you writing an irc client? |
| 04:19.24 | Adamant | but BBS's sucked otherwise except for nostalgia purposes |
| 04:19.34 | OpenVirus | d03boy, hey! well Im learning Java so I can start to make and IRC client for Android, I forgot you were doing it also |
| 04:19.37 | BruteSource | lmao |
| 04:19.43 | *** join/#android jerkface03 (n=jerkface@24.87.111.92) |
| 04:19.48 | BruteSource | thats all there was |
| 04:20.00 | Adamant | yup, and now there's more |
| 04:20.05 | OpenVirus | d03boy, but ya I am going to try, unless you want me to help :) |
| 04:20.11 | BruteSource | yiu could dial into someones elses box or a bbs |
| 04:20.31 | spikebike | does the android opensource drop include the google talk client? |
| 04:20.38 | spikebike | er I guess it's called the IM client |
| 04:20.42 | d03boy | OpenVirus, you can help if you want.. might be kind of hard to help unless you know Java though :) |
| 04:21.21 | OpenVirus | d03boy, ya, well thats the only way I am going to learn by having to make things :) how would you go about making one? |
| 04:21.21 | wastrel | what are you doing to learn java? |
| 04:21.30 | OpenVirus | trying to make a irc cleint |
| 04:21.43 | OpenVirus | i made a simple calculator, but thats it so far |
| 04:21.49 | d03boy | pm me |
| 04:21.52 | OpenVirus | all command line, no graphical interface |
| 04:21.54 | OpenVirus | ok |
| 04:22.32 | BruteSource | why cant you use irssi via theterminal emulator? |
| 04:23.32 | languish | some people like gui and local apps |
| 04:23.40 | languish | or what if your shell server's down |
| 04:23.51 | languish | variety of reasons |
| 04:24.04 | BruteSource | i mean locally |
| 04:24.09 | wastrel | should i use my main/android google account for google code, or a new one? |
| 04:24.28 | languish | BruteSource again, gui. not everyone's comfortable being a command line warrior |
| 04:24.35 | *** join/#android jerkface0 (n=jerkface@S0106000d3a2c0806.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 04:24.52 | languish | wastrel, depends on how much random noise you want to deal with in your main account |
| 04:24.57 | *** join/#android Stskeeps (n=chobits@84.238.11.16) |
| 04:25.16 | languish | if your main gmail account is already all over the web, it won;t matter much more |
| 04:25.22 | BruteSource | i like the sound of thay |
| 04:25.25 | BruteSource | that |
| 04:25.36 | BruteSource | commandline warrior |
| 04:26.07 | wastrel | my main gmail is new, just created for phone. and it's google apps custom domain |
| 04:26.18 | wastrel | so i can't even sign in to google code with it :] |
| 04:27.34 | cbeust_ | wastrel: not sure why you wouldn't use your main |
| 04:27.41 | languish | wastrel, yeah I had that same issue |
| 04:27.49 | languish | I use GAFYD too |
| 04:28.13 | BruteSource | languish does android have ssh? |
| 04:28.32 | languish | BruteSource, connectbot |
| 04:28.53 | languish | it's an ssh/tunnel client |
| 04:28.55 | wastrel | cbeust_: spam being my principal concern |
| 04:28.56 | spikebike | heh, I just noticed |
| 04:29.00 | BruteSource | connectbot... never heard of that |
| 04:29.10 | spikebike | gtalk makes a cute little android icon besides your buddies that are on g1s |
| 04:29.15 | cbeust_ | Spam is not really an issue on gmail |
| 04:29.22 | BruteSource | so it can be just a normal cli ssh client? |
| 04:29.32 | BruteSource | hah for me it is |
| 04:29.43 | cbeust_ | You're receiving spam on your gmail account? |
| 04:29.50 | BruteSource | i get lots of spam onmy gmail account |
| 04:29.59 | BruteSource | ya about 12 a day |
| 04:30.11 | cbeust_ | I receive 100+ every day, they all land in my spam label |
| 04:30.13 | spikebike | damn dude |
| 04:30.14 | languish | I'd actually like to get a nice Android logo sticker for the back of my G1 |
| 04:30.15 | cbeust_ | never see themin my inbox |
| 04:30.20 | *** join/#android rwhitby` (n=rwhitby@au1.astc-design.com) |
| 04:30.20 | BruteSource | they all seem to b about me being eligible for a 1500 dollar payday loan |
| 04:30.34 | languish | man.. |
| 04:30.37 | spikebike | do you report them all as spam? |
| 04:31.01 | languish | I have a very public gmail account, the only span that gets through is in chinese |
| 04:31.25 | BruteSource | yes i report them as spam everyday |
| 04:31.30 | wastrel | i get several hundred a day at work |
| 04:31.49 | BruteSource | gmails spam filter is good but not perfect |
| 04:31.59 | BruteSource | there is no perfect filter |
| 04:32.07 | wastrel | about 80% are caught in our spamfilter |
| 04:32.40 | BruteSource | spammers adapt just like the people who make the filters adapt |
| 04:32.49 | BruteSource | its a never ending battle |
| 04:33.23 | BruteSource | it helps alot to have a junkmail account only used for online registrations |
| 04:33.26 | RyeBrye | I get tons of spam on my gmail account |
| 04:33.32 | RyeBrye | Oh... Should I purge my account before I set up my G1? |
| 04:33.32 | languish | fishcopter randomly opens a url after the game ends.. without user intervention. I wonder if the dev just really need smore time to squash bugs, or is trying to point people at an exploit |
| 04:33.44 | RyeBrye | my gmail inbox currently has 3657 messages in it |
| 04:34.15 | RyeBrye | and the "all mail" section of the IMAP (which includes archives?) has 40226 messages |
| 04:34.23 | RyeBrye | I would hate to even download headers for all those messages to the phone |
| 04:34.44 | wastrel | BruteSource: that junkmail account is my original gmail acct :] |
| 04:36.32 | romainguy | RyeBrye: if you don't purge, change the sync settings to "Sync recent" instead of "Sync all" for your inbox :) |
| 04:36.39 | RyeBrye | Ok, that's good to know |
| 04:36.50 | RyeBrye | my G1 comes Wednesday |
| 04:39.32 | *** join/#android ioerror (n=ioerror@mail.lostinthenoise.net) |
| 04:39.37 | ioerror | evening |
| 04:42.05 | *** join/#android jasonparekh_ (n=jasonpar@67.218.104.234) |
| 04:42.37 | languish | :/ |
| 04:43.38 | BruteSource | i remember getting gmail way early in the beta days and registering lots of comon names thinking they would be rare when it got popular |
| 04:43.48 | ioerror | So i've managed to get /dev/android and can mount the flash drive with udev |
| 04:44.07 | ioerror | and it (in debian etch) auto mounts the disk: |
| 04:44.09 | ioerror | /dev/android on /media/usbdisk type vfat (rw,noexec,nosuid,nodev,quiet,shortname=mixed,uid=1000,gid=1000,umask=077,iocharset=utf8) |
| 04:44.11 | BruteSource | sean kenny samantha kim allan etc. @gmail.com |
| 04:44.32 | BruteSource | only to have them all repod by google |
| 04:44.46 | wastrel | good for google |
| 04:44.53 | languish | srsly |
| 04:44.59 | languish | BruteSource wtf |
| 04:45.06 | BruteSource | wht? |
| 04:45.12 | ioerror | Sadly, once I've done this, I don't seem to ever be able to attach to the android physical device with adb |
| 04:45.18 | BruteSource | what? it was like 10 accounts |
| 04:45.24 | ioerror | Is there something totally wacky going on? |
| 04:45.28 | languish | the mindset man |
| 04:45.29 | *** join/#android BHSPitMonkey (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) |
| 04:45.35 | languish | You're just, wrong. |
| 04:45.38 | languish | :/ |
| 04:45.43 | BruteSource | the mindset? |
| 04:45.44 | BHSPitMonkey | Does anyone else get an error when adding the Android repo into Eclipse in Ubuntu? |
| 04:45.50 | BruteSource | i wasnt going to sell them |
| 04:45.56 | languish | n/m not worth it |
| 04:46.08 | wastrel | oki bedtime |
| 04:46.10 | BruteSource | i knew people with those names |
| 04:46.11 | languish | o/ |
| 04:46.20 | BruteSource | lol i dont see the big deal |
| 04:46.34 | *** join/#android cbeust (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 04:46.40 | BruteSource | im just glad i got to keep the one with my name |
| 04:47.08 | BHSPitMonkey | Anyone? |
| 04:47.34 | languish | BHSPitMonkey, not my area of expertise, but it might help if you stated the error you're getting |
| 04:48.18 | ioerror | Can someone explain to me how adb actually communicates over usb? |
| 04:48.21 | BHSPitMonkey | No repository found at https://dl-ssl.google.com/android/eclipse/ Error reading update site https://dl-ssl.google.com/android/eclipse/. Unconnected sockets not implemented |
| 04:49.41 | languish | BHSPitMonkey, try it with http:// not https |
| 04:50.29 | languish | oh |
| 04:50.32 | languish | BHSPitMonkey.. |
| 04:50.45 | BHSPitMonkey | languish, showoff. |
| 04:51.07 | BHSPitMonkey | What was the second highlight for? (It worked, by the way) |
| 04:51.15 | languish | ahh it worked, good |
| 04:51.32 | languish | n/m if it worked, had a second suggestion |
| 04:52.32 | languish | seems sometimes adding a space after the url caused an issue, so going to the end of the url and deleting(backspacing) over any "spaces" worked for some people |
| 04:53.21 | languish | just glad you got it working :) |
| 04:53.27 | *** join/#android Stskeeps (n=chobits@84.238.11.16) |
| 04:58.15 | DarkriftX | lol |
| 04:59.06 | languish | o.O |
| 05:00.41 | *** join/#android satadru (n=satadru@cpe-69-201-133-23.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 05:02.18 | DarkriftX | so hows the market treating you languish ? |
| 05:02.33 | languish | amusingly |
| 05:02.42 | languish | I'm enjoying reading the comments |
| 05:02.47 | BHSPitMonkey | treats languish amusingly |
| 05:02.52 | languish | Hey baby, I just saw your photo and I've gotta say nice pigmented fibrovascular tissue connecting your sphincter pupillae illuminated sparkingly by the aqueous humour setting off the iris pigment epithelium beautifully |
| 05:02.54 | languish | err |
| 05:02.57 | languish | wrong channel |
| 05:03.00 | languish | :/ |
| 05:03.06 | DarkriftX | wow |
| 05:03.08 | BHSPitMonkey | REALLY wrong channel |
| 05:03.11 | DarkriftX | pervert |
| 05:03.22 | languish | it's geek for "nice eyes" |
| 05:03.27 | languish | specifically, the irises |
| 05:03.51 | BHSPitMonkey | NO IT'S NOT I HEARD 'SPHINCTER' |
| 05:03.54 | languish | yes |
| 05:04.08 | languish | the tissue in the iris is a sphincter muscle |
| 05:04.31 | BHSPitMonkey | LIES, I LEARNED THE WORD ON "WAYNE'S WORLD" |
| 05:04.48 | BHSPitMonkey | All right, I'm done with the caps |
| 05:06.52 | ioerror | One thing that's strange is that adb keeps trying to open /dev/bus/usb/001 |
| 05:07.04 | ioerror | Rather, /dev/bus/usb/001/001 |
| 05:07.18 | fadden0 | ioerror: the sources for adb are included in the distribution |
| 05:07.25 | fadden0 | there are some verbose-debug macros in there that might be useful |
| 05:07.35 | fadden0 | I think it's linux_usb.c |
| 05:07.41 | ioerror | in the sdk? |
| 05:07.48 | fadden0 | No, in the open-source git stuff. |
| 05:07.51 | *** join/#android muthu (n=mobeegal@218.248.24.81) |
| 05:08.03 | ioerror | Ah, I don't have enough disk space to download much more on this machine :-( |
| 05:08.09 | fadden0 | Hrm. |
| 05:09.17 | *** join/#android jake_ (n=chatzill@cpe-98-148-141-149.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 05:09.55 | ioerror | It's quite strange, it's as if its gone from the usb tree at times. |
| 05:09.57 | fadden0 | system/core/adb/usb_linux.c is the one |
| 05:10.51 | *** join/#android mocsrox (n=wliu@c-24-6-189-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 05:11.54 | BHSPitMonkey | Is there any way, directly or indirectly, of using python code on android? |
| 05:12.28 | ioerror | hrm, I see with strace that it opens /dev/bus/usb and then iterates over things |
| 05:12.40 | BHSPitMonkey | (I'm sure in a technical sense it is, since we're working with linux here; I just have no idea about what stance Google takes regarding the market and all) |
| 05:12.47 | fadden0 | ioerror: if you pull that file out of the git repository you can see the source logic |
| 05:12.51 | BHSPitMonkey | s/it is/there is/ |
| 05:12.56 | ioerror | it then opens /dev/bus/usb/005 |
| 05:13.02 | fadden0 | (use the web viewer) |
| 05:13.05 | ioerror | fadden, link? |
| 05:13.08 | BHSPitMonkey | infobot, uh ,thanks! |
| 05:13.35 | mocsrox | ne way to logout to the eclipse console when using the android emulator? |
| 05:13.47 | ioerror | ah, got it |
| 05:14.14 | fadden0 | It's easy to find stuff there once you have the full path. Without that it's sort of a grind. :-) |
| 05:16.08 | ioerror | Huh, I see the issue and it's unrelated to the source |
| 05:16.15 | ioerror | the device is properly setup with udev |
| 05:16.21 | ioerror | it mounts /dev/android all right |
| 05:16.30 | ioerror | But now the device doesn't show up in lsusb at all |
| 05:16.53 | ioerror | Rather, the usb charging icon isn't even going on the phone |
| 05:18.28 | languish | http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/10/28/g1-themes-help-sidekick-users-cope-with-feelings-of-inadequacy/ |
| 05:18.29 | languish | hahaha |
| 05:18.33 | ioerror | When I disable to udev rule (http://pastebin.com/d787f6371) |
| 05:18.42 | ioerror | The device shows up again with lsusb |
| 05:19.09 | ioerror | and *now* the device is there: List of devices attached |
| 05:19.09 | ioerror | HT842GZ39778 device |
| 05:19.20 | ioerror | However, the usb disk is now no longer mounting |
| 05:19.36 | ioerror | and of course, /dev/android (as expected) is gone |
| 05:23.08 | *** join/#android israr (n=israr@203.99.190.49) |
| 05:23.59 | fadden0 | That's pretty bizarre. |
| 05:24.04 | ioerror | Yes, it's totaly wacky. |
| 05:24.10 | ioerror | So now I've got a shell. |
| 05:24.38 | ioerror | So I'm pretty confused as to how the hell that works. I guess it's directly writing to some /dev/bus/usb stuff, rather than a specifically configured block device (via udev) |
| 05:25.03 | ioerror | It would be useful if adb could just force a device once it's been configured with udev |
| 05:25.40 | languish | what the hell... |
| 05:25.49 | languish | arm joined the symbian foundation |
| 05:25.51 | ioerror | the -d switch is confusing like that |
| 05:26.10 | languish | way to turn your back on customers arm |
| 05:26.25 | ioerror | hrm, I guess the next question is: "how can i cross compile c programs for android?" |
| 05:26.30 | fadden0 | ioerror: "-d" and "-e" are only interesting when a device is connected and the emulator is running at the same time |
| 05:26.40 | ioerror | fadden, right, I learned that :-) |
| 05:26.44 | fadden0 | It used to just pick one by default. |
| 05:26.52 | muthu | do you create a branch, to browse android sources? |
| 05:27.06 | fadden0 | After several episodes of head-banging caused by not accessing the intended device, we decided to make it so that adb would refuse to do anything if ambiguity existed. |
| 05:27.44 | fadden0 | muthu: I don't believe you need a branch just to poke at them |
| 05:27.52 | fadden0 | s/poke/peek/ |
| 05:28.17 | ioerror | fadden0, i didn't find that source file |
| 05:28.24 | fadden0 | Which one? |
| 05:28.27 | ioerror | if you link me, I'll look at writing a patch to explictly force a given device :-) |
| 05:28.31 | ioerror | linux_usb |
| 05:29.16 | fadden0 | http://git.source.android.com/?p=platform/system/core.git;a=tree;f=adb;h=dc18f2554fb32398e5ce007d38baa4046b43809b;hb=HEAD |
| 05:30.11 | fadden0 | Please note that the last couple of people who tried to modify ADB were driven permanently insane by the experience. |
| 05:30.23 | romainguy | I did modify adb once |
| 05:30.30 | ioerror | hrm, is it that bad? |
| 05:30.34 | ioerror | I mean, using git is bad enough ;-) |
| 05:30.35 | romainguy | but my mind has already been driven insane by ListView |
| 05:30.58 | fadden0 | The sources are for both device and host, with some parts overlapping and some not. It works on Linux, Windows, and Mac OS X. |
| 05:31.03 | muthu | fadden0: thx, was wondering about the junk that the ide creates |
| 05:31.09 | romainguy | fadden: and it deals with USB :p |
| 05:32.34 | *** join/#android sujith (n=sujith@202.88.237.83) |
| 05:34.03 | exman | hello ~ |
| 05:34.10 | ioerror | hi |
| 05:34.17 | exman | i am beginnner. i have a question |
| 05:34.27 | exman | how can i use Timer using event loop ? |
| 05:36.02 | exman | i cant find event loop related API. |
| 05:38.40 | *** join/#android plusminus_ (i=4421a620@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1b096023c9613a61) |
| 05:41.05 | f00f- | is there a Location Provider that uses cell id? |
| 05:41.46 | *** join/#android hongjiujing (n=tommy@58.213.73.95) |
| 05:42.27 | sujith | hello guys i have quick question |
| 05:43.24 | hongjiujing | who porting GPE to s3c2410? |
| 05:43.27 | hongjiujing | anyone . |
| 05:43.36 | sujith | i am planning to port the android kernel to a specific board, so while porting what are the changes which i have to make in android code specific to the board? |
| 05:44.56 | sujith | i know that there is userspace Hardware Abstraction Layer in android to avoid the GPL issue with Linux kernel |
| 05:45.36 | tsunami | f00f: LocationManager.NETWORK_PROVIDER docs state it uses cell and wifi points for location |
| 05:45.47 | sujith | thats why i asked what specific changes i have to make in the android source code specific to the board in order to make things work out |
| 05:45.55 | hongjiujing | anyone in China? |
| 05:47.28 | f00f- | thanks tsunami i will take a closer look |
| 05:47.59 | hongjiujing | anyone know GPE? |
| 05:48.31 | *** join/#android Bonkz (i=j4y@ip70-162-41-192.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 05:48.52 | exman | i know GPE. but never use it |
| 05:49.45 | Bonkz | ok i've created a hello world application for the second time after 3 months and it runs int he simulator. now how do i transfer it to my phone? |
| 05:49.58 | Bonkz | i've been searching forums for maybe an hour and no luck =/ |
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| 05:51.05 | *** part/#android hongjiujing (n=tommy@58.213.73.95) |
| 05:53.42 | exman | anyone know qt or gtk? i confuse android app's event loop. |
| 05:53.51 | exman | app can access or use event loop of main thread ? |
| 05:53.58 | *** join/#android hongjiujing (n=tommy@58.213.73.95) |
| 05:55.15 | romainguy | exman: no, you don't get access to the event loop |
| 05:55.21 | romainguy | but all the UI code is invoked from that loop |
| 05:55.26 | *** join/#android rwhitby` (n=rwhitby@au1.astc-design.com) |
| 05:55.41 | exman | romainguy, thankyou |
| 05:55.49 | romainguy | Bonkz: if you're using Eclipse, just plug in your phone (enable USB debugging in the settings first) and run your app |
| 05:55.56 | romainguy | otherwise, use adb install yourapp.apk |
| 05:57.00 | exman | romainguy, if i want use simple timer, i must add thread using Sleep ? |
| 05:57.10 | romainguy | you can do this |
| 05:57.11 | romainguy | or better yet |
| 05:57.14 | romainguy | use the built-in timers |
| 05:57.17 | romainguy | like java.util.Timer |
| 05:57.27 | romainguy | or Handler.sendMessageDelayed() |
| 05:57.30 | exman | oh good information. |
| 05:57.30 | romainguy | or View.postDelayed() |
| 05:57.36 | hongjiujing | ? |
| 05:57.39 | romainguy | the last two are the preferred way to do it |
| 05:57.42 | Bonkz | romainguy: thanks i got it. also had to install usb drivers |
| 05:57.43 | romainguy | because they work on the UI thread |
| 05:58.10 | *** part/#android jake_ (n=chatzill@cpe-98-148-141-149.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 05:58.11 | exman | thankyou thankyou~ |
| 05:59.37 | exman | i am not java programmer. so i really confused.. thank you so much |
| 05:59.59 | exman | one more question... |
| 06:00.21 | exman | how can i use select or poll ? |
| 06:00.32 | romainguy | look at java.io and java.nio |
| 06:00.43 | exman | is it java style? |
| 06:00.50 | romainguy | what do you mean? |
| 06:01.15 | exman | i was find some java code. but they use thread for socket read. |
| 06:01.28 | romainguy | then look at java.nio |
| 06:01.43 | exman | thankyou.~ |
| 06:02.31 | hongjiujing | does anyone port GPE? |
| 06:05.34 | exman | what the good way for pass data between activities? |
| 06:05.51 | exman | i tested sendBroadcast with intent |
| 06:05.55 | umdk1d3 | exman: packing extras into the intent you send |
| 06:06.09 | umdk1d3 | and startActivityForResult if you need to return data |
| 06:06.17 | sujith | i am planning to port the android kernel to a specific board, so while porting what are the changes which i have to make in android code specific to the board? i know that there is userspace Hardware Abstraction Layer in android to avoid the GPL issue with Linux kernel |
| 06:06.43 | sujith | thats why i asked what specific changes i have to make in the android source code specific to the board in order to make things work out |
| 06:06.53 | hongjiujing | sujith,are you here? |
| 06:07.00 | exman | umdk1d3, if target activity already started, can i use startActivityForResult ? |
| 06:07.59 | sujith | yes , hongjiujing any props? |
| 06:07.59 | Bonkz | what's the next tutorial I should do after the Hello, Android app? I was previewing the notepad app on google but are there any other tutorial which has a difficulty between that and the hello android app? i do have programming experience, but in C#.NET |
| 06:08.29 | hongjiujing | sujith,where are you form ? |
| 06:08.32 | hongjiujing | are you from ? |
| 06:10.57 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@64-142-66-175.dsl.static.sonic.net) |
| 06:11.17 | sujith | not from china :) |
| 06:13.37 | hongjiujing | o. |
| 06:13.50 | hongjiujing | i can give you some material about android |
| 06:13.59 | hongjiujing | do you have MSN? |
| 06:14.07 | *** join/#android rwhitby (n=rwhitby@nslu2-linux/rwhitby) |
| 06:15.11 | Bonkz | hong could i see some of that material? |
| 06:16.05 | hongjiujing | ? |
| 06:16.11 | sujith | whats MSN? |
| 06:16.21 | hongjiujing | he he |
| 06:16.33 | hongjiujing | I am in China |
| 06:17.02 | sujith | ok |
| 06:17.10 | sujith | what's MSN? |
| 06:17.26 | hongjiujing | oh,my god |
| 06:17.31 | hongjiujing | www.msn.com |
| 06:17.34 | Bonkz | lol |
| 06:17.51 | sujith | oooooooooooooh god this MSN |
| 06:17.55 | sujith | hehehehehhe |
| 06:18.15 | sujith | i thought its something specific to android lol |
| 06:19.28 | hongjiujing | he he he |
| 06:19.30 | sujith | ok can you give me those materials |
| 06:19.35 | sujith | i wanna see those |
| 06:19.46 | sujith | if will be good if you send me those |
| 06:20.13 | hongjiujing | http://www.loveandroid.com/index.php |
| 06:20.16 | hongjiujing | access it , |
| 06:20.22 | hongjiujing | but Chinese |
| 06:20.33 | sujith | translation must be there |
| 06:20.37 | sujith | from google |
| 06:21.23 | hongjiujing | he he |
| 06:22.33 | sujith | so which part to lokk for hongjiujing? |
| 06:22.40 | sujith | ook* |
| 06:22.53 | jota-_ | http://htcunlock.net/ hey does anyone know if those guys are scammers or can you actually get an unlock code from them? |
| 06:23.23 | hongjiujing | sujith: so which part to lokk for hongjiujing? |
| 06:23.25 | hongjiujing | what ? |
| 06:24.15 | sujith | i mean you send me one link |
| 06:24.30 | sujith | in that which part i is specific to me? |
| 06:24.51 | hongjiujing | you want ? |
| 06:25.08 | sujith | you know what i am asking for right? |
| 06:25.23 | sujith | i am planning to port the android kernel to a specific board, so while porting what are the changes which i have to make in android code specific to the board? |
| 06:25.36 | hongjiujing | tart board is ? |
| 06:25.39 | hongjiujing | mcu is what? |
| 06:25.43 | sujith | s3c6400 |
| 06:26.16 | hongjiujing | my god |
| 06:26.20 | hongjiujing | i am use S3C6400 |
| 06:26.22 | sujith | what? |
| 06:26.25 | hongjiujing | ha h a |
| 06:26.30 | sujith | hey g8 |
| 06:26.36 | hongjiujing | my company is doing MID |
| 06:26.41 | hongjiujing | by S3C6400 |
| 06:26.43 | sujith | ooh |
| 06:26.53 | sujith | can you guide me regarding this |
| 06:26.58 | sujith | ? |
| 06:27.47 | hongjiujing | you must find android website in your country |
| 06:27.55 | sujith | i have it |
| 06:27.58 | hongjiujing | o |
| 06:28.21 | sujith | see android sites are accessible here |
| 06:28.42 | sujith | what i need is the proper steps to port the android on s3c6400 |
| 06:29.07 | sujith | as you have done it you can guide me through this process |
| 06:30.06 | hongjiujing | android use ARMV5T? |
| 06:30.21 | sujith | ARM v6 |
| 06:31.07 | hongjiujing | o |
| 06:31.25 | hongjiujing | you should build android develop environment |
| 06:31.31 | hongjiujing | and emulator |
| 06:31.42 | sujith | that all i have |
| 06:32.01 | sujith | i already downloaded the latest android source code from git |
| 06:32.06 | hongjiujing | o |
| 06:32.10 | hongjiujing | where are you ? |
| 06:32.10 | sujith | and built it and ran it in emulator] |
| 06:32.14 | hongjiujing | o |
| 06:32.26 | hongjiujing | just test it by nfs root |
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| 06:32.46 | sujith | noo we can't do it directly like this |
| 06:32.57 | sujith | we have to make some changes to suit the board |
| 06:33.18 | hongjiujing | yes |
| 06:33.26 | hongjiujing | need kernel knowledge |
| 06:33.27 | sujith | as i said android has a user space hardware abstraction layer of its own |
| 06:33.41 | hongjiujing | o |
| 06:33.57 | sujith | which differentiates it from linux kernel to avoid the GPL problem |
| 06:34.07 | hongjiujing | http://www.loveandroid.com/viewthread.php?tid=94&extra=page%3D1 |
| 06:34.11 | hongjiujing | look at it |
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| 06:35.07 | sujith | first of all hongjiujing i am not able understand chinese |
| 06:35.14 | sujith | the page you sent is chinese |
| 06:35.33 | sujith | google have no translation for it |
| 06:35.33 | hongjiujing | http://benno.id.au/blog/ |
| 06:35.36 | hongjiujing | just watch video |
| 06:36.21 | sujith | ok |
| 06:38.46 | hongjiujing | http://benno.id.au/blog/ ,benno is a hacker |
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| 06:43.45 | hongjiujing | sujith,where are you ?your company is ? |
| 06:46.50 | *** part/#android pfft1 (n=vds@43.57.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 06:47.17 | sujith | I am a student |
| 06:47.34 | BruteSource | cs? |
| 06:47.35 | sujith | and its a part of my academic project |
| 06:47.37 | BruteSource | ee? |
| 06:48.26 | hongjiujing | which country |
| 06:49.26 | sujith | can you guide me through the porting porcess hongjiujing? |
| 06:49.45 | sujith | yuo had already ported the android to s3c6400 |
| 06:50.07 | sujith | so you must be an expert in it now |
| 06:50.32 | BruteSource | whats a s36400? |
| 06:51.02 | hongjiujing | no |
| 06:51.16 | hongjiujing | i have no porting android to s3c6400 |
| 06:51.43 | hongjiujing | porting is not hard,the difficult is testing |
| 06:51.46 | hongjiujing | and modify |
| 06:51.59 | sujith | yeah i need guidance regarding that |
| 06:52.29 | sujith | beacuse for porting android to board you need to make some board specific changes |
| 06:52.38 | geist | BruteSource: it's a samsung cpu |
| 06:52.39 | sujith | thats where i got stuck |
| 06:52.40 | geist | arm1176 |
| 06:52.51 | geist | dealt with it before, it's not too bad |
| 06:52.59 | sujith | :) |
| 06:53.32 | geist | sujith: you really need to know the board and the cpu pretty well |
| 06:53.42 | sujith | i am stuck at this point regarding android userspace kernel |
| 06:53.46 | geist | you'll have to tweak things like pin settings, voltage settings |
| 06:53.50 | sujith | hmm i will dig into it |
| 06:53.56 | geist | which peripheral is attached to what |
| 06:54.15 | sujith | but for the time being i need proper steps for porting the android on to this board |
| 06:54.22 | sujith | and get this thing done |
| 06:54.43 | geist | i dont think there are proper steps |
| 06:54.51 | geist | you either know how to do it and then go about doing it |
| 06:54.56 | geist | or you have to figure it out |
| 06:55.00 | sujith | any modifications needed in the android source code? |
| 06:55.25 | geist | probably |
| 06:55.59 | hongjiujing | sujith ,i wanna go |
| 06:56.15 | sujith | thats where i got stuck i need to know what are all the changes which i have to make in the source code to make it run on that board |
| 06:56.21 | hongjiujing | see you .my msn :hongjiujing@hotmail.com |
| 06:56.33 | sujith | ok hongjiujing nice talking to you |
| 06:56.46 | hongjiujing | you can add me as your msn friend |
| 06:56.56 | sujith | i have a gmail id you can ping me at sujit2405@gmail.com |
| 06:56.56 | hongjiujing | and i reconfirm |
| 06:57.11 | sujith | sorry buddy i have no hotmail id |
| 06:57.16 | sujith | if you have gmail |
| 06:57.22 | sujith | then that wil be better |
| 06:57.59 | hongjiujing | i have set your email |
| 06:58.06 | sujith | ok g8 |
| 06:58.09 | hongjiujing | my mail id is hongjiujing@126.com |
| 06:58.18 | sujith | ok |
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| 06:58.48 | sujith | so geist: do you have any porting android experience? |
| 06:59.12 | sujith | if you had just share with us that will be a g8 help to new comers like us |
| 07:00.50 | sujith | i searched the entire android related sites, videos and forums but nowhere anything is mentioned about the changes in the android code for specific target |
| 07:00.56 | BruteSource | i tried to help but i have never heard of your device, is it pxa, msm, xscale, omap? |
| 07:02.47 | *** join/#android nesoi (n=quigg@h-67-101-96-125.snfccasy.dynamic.covad.net) |
| 07:03.21 | nesoi | sprint just said they aren't going to have android for a while... what sprint phone should I get to put android on? or should I wait for a better device? |
| 07:03.48 | DarkriftX | good luck getting radio working :S |
| 07:03.53 | BruteSource | sprint said that a while a go |
| 07:03.59 | spikebike | nesoi that's standard practice for a company who does't have a product ready yet |
| 07:04.03 | nesoi | it was in the news yesterday |
| 07:04.10 | spikebike | we aren't in that market yet, so by default that market isn't ready |
| 07:04.15 | nesoi | spikebike, nah, they had said end of 4q or beginning of 1q |
| 07:04.22 | spikebike | right |
| 07:04.25 | nesoi | now they say "android's not ready" |
| 07:04.26 | BruteSource | ya no one has got radio working on anydevice for android yet, besides dream of course |
| 07:04.38 | nesoi | dream? |
| 07:04.48 | spikebike | brute oh? |
| 07:05.03 | nesoi | why? the mfg don't provide enough documentation? |
| 07:05.06 | DarkriftX | dream is the g1 |
| 07:05.08 | spikebike | I saw zillions of videos on youtube (just google for "android on") |
| 07:05.15 | BruteSource | lmao dream is the first device to have android on it... tmobile calls it a g1 |
| 07:05.16 | spikebike | I didn't realize none used the radio |
| 07:05.37 | BruteSource | well none have the release version + radio |
| 07:05.38 | nesoi | how does dream compare to touch diamond pro? |
| 07:05.45 | BruteSource | that i know of |
| 07:05.50 | geist | sujith: i have experience in that sort of thing but i really shouldn't port android |
| 07:05.57 | BruteSource | its faster, has more, ram, and more rom |
| 07:06.01 | spikebike | nesoi there's a zillion g1 reviews out there |
| 07:06.10 | nesoi | dream is faster than touch diamond pro? |
| 07:06.31 | BruteSource | msm7201a |
| 07:06.32 | nesoi | yeah, but I don't want to switch to t-mobile. no reception in my house, etc. |
| 07:06.48 | geist | the 7200 is a reasonably quick cpu |
| 07:06.55 | BruteSource | fastest mobile processesor in a phone i believe |
| 07:06.59 | geist | it's an arm11, so it's almost the fastest set of arms you can get |
| 07:07.12 | spikebike | nesoi seems like there should be a few options in the next 2 quarters or so |
| 07:07.15 | geist | there are some cortex based cpus out there, but none have made it into a fone yet |
| 07:07.40 | nesoi | dream is faster than touch diamond pro? you're sure? |
| 07:07.44 | BruteSource | i have heard rumors of a 1ghz dual core xscale coming |
| 07:08.03 | geist | from marvell? not sure about that |
| 07:08.08 | BruteSource | nesoi what did we just say? it has the faster proc in a phone out there |
| 07:08.17 | geist | well, not really |
| 07:08.18 | BruteSource | fastest |
| 07:08.24 | BruteSource | yes really lmao |
| 07:08.25 | geist | there are quite a few arm11s out there running about that speed |
| 07:08.36 | BruteSource | ya and none of them faster |
| 07:08.46 | *** join/#android Hai-Fai (n=jarmo@hoasnet-fe35dd00-42.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 07:08.47 | geist | well.... |
| 07:08.56 | geist | yeah, but it's all about the same |
| 07:09.08 | geist | the msm cpu isn't a real super fast one |
| 07:09.13 | BruteSource | okay? |
| 07:09.18 | geist | but it's pretty respectable |
| 07:09.31 | geist | it's within 2x or so of the fastest arm11s |
| 07:09.35 | geist | so it's up there |
| 07:09.35 | BruteSource | well benchmark tests disagree, what would you like me to say? |
| 07:09.42 | geist | oh? |
| 07:09.47 | geist | chuckles |
| 07:10.01 | BruteSource | im not in the mood to argue with a troll, ignire is my friend |
| 07:10.04 | geist | whatever you want, man |
| 07:10.08 | BruteSource | ignore even |
| 07:10.18 | geist | i'm not saying it sucks or anything |
| 07:10.28 | geist | just it's not that special as far as cpus are concerned |
| 07:10.39 | geist | i've had to deal with this same cpu for other projects, and it's mostly a nightmare |
| 07:10.55 | geist | but it's really a testamont to android that they got something so nice out of it |
| 07:10.56 | BruteSource | more cpu + more ram = faster, period. |
| 07:11.07 | geist | sure, but there are faster cpus out there |
| 07:11.08 | spikebike | heh |
| 07:11.13 | geist | some of which are in products |
| 07:11.31 | spikebike | not saying it sucks == mostly a nightmare? |
| 07:11.34 | geist | but like i said, android did a great job with what they got |
| 07:11.44 | geist | mostly a nightmare is for other reasons |
| 07:11.49 | geist | dealing with the radio, specifically |
| 07:11.56 | BruteSource | please show me a faster proc in a phone than msm7201a please? |
| 07:12.02 | DarkriftX | who gives a shit |
| 07:12.09 | geist | that's kind of my feeling |
| 07:12.11 | nesoi | according to what I'm seeing online, the dream and touch diamond pro both have the same CPU and 528Mhz clock rate |
| 07:12.22 | nesoi | BruteSource, do you have different info? any URL? |
| 07:12.34 | geist | it's a compliment to android |
| 07:12.41 | geist | they did a lot with a relatively ho hum cpu |
| 07:13.03 | BruteSource | i didnt say it had a slower proc, i said its faster because it has more ram |
| 07:13.18 | DarkriftX | i wish someone would port android to my axim x51 so i could play with it :( |
| 07:13.29 | geist | usually the limiting factors these sort of things is the design of the memory bus |
| 07:13.34 | DarkriftX | that thing has been in a cabinet for over a year |
| 07:13.44 | geist | how fast you can drive sdram, what the wait states are, etc |
| 07:13.50 | BruteSource | dark is it xscale? |
| 07:14.22 | geist | pxa250 it seems |
| 07:14.27 | BruteSource | i had one lol just dont remember |
| 07:14.34 | BruteSource | aw |
| 07:15.01 | geist | yeah, older pxas are no fun |
| 07:15.08 | BruteSource | well i only know about porting to omap850 |
| 07:15.20 | DarkriftX | yes BruteSource |
| 07:15.20 | BruteSource | and no idea about radio |
| 07:15.31 | BruteSource | oh it is xscale? |
| 07:15.31 | geist | good ole 850 |
| 07:15.41 | geist | that was a good one |
| 07:15.42 | nesoi | BruteSource, I'm seeing that touch diamond pro has 512MB of RAM and ROM and the dream has 128MB |
| 07:15.48 | nesoi | or do you have a better source? |
| 07:16.10 | geist | you sure about that nesoi ? |
| 07:16.16 | BruteSource | touch pro has 512mb ram? |
| 07:16.19 | nesoi | just what I'm reading online |
| 07:16.23 | BruteSource | i doubt that |
| 07:16.33 | BruteSource | phonescoop doesnt agree lol |
| 07:16.35 | DarkriftX | go to pdadb.(com|net) and they will have the info |
| 07:16.37 | geist | i dont think the 7200 supports that much ram |
| 07:16.46 | geist | iirc, it maxes out at 128MB |
| 07:16.48 | BruteSource | it doesnt lol |
| 07:17.05 | geist | later revisions of the cpu (7225, etc) support more |
| 07:17.15 | DarkriftX | 51x102x18.05mm, Microsoft Windows Mobile 6.1 Professional , 32bit Qualcomm MSM7501A, 528MHz CPU, 256MiB RAM, 512MiB ROM, 2.8" 480x640 color transflective TFT display, video out, Proprietary audio jack, CDMA800/CDMA1900, cdmaOne, CDMA2000 1xRTT, CDMA2000 1xEV-DO Rel. 0, CDMA2000 1xEV-DO Rev A, microSD/microSDHC/TransFlash/SDIO, mini-USB port, Bluetooth, WLAN, GPS, A-GPS, QuickGPS, FM radio, Slide-out QWERTY-type keyboard, scroll wheel, |
| 07:17.16 | DarkriftX | accelerometer, 3.1MP camera, AF, flash, secondary camera, |
| 07:17.26 | geist | yeah, 256MB |
| 07:17.33 | DarkriftX | 512mb ROM |
| 07:17.36 | DarkriftX | but 256 ram |
| 07:17.44 | geist | right |
| 07:17.46 | DarkriftX | still, seems better in most regards |
| 07:17.47 | BruteSource | he doesnt know the difference between ram and rom |
| 07:17.53 | nesoi | here it says 288MB RAM, 512MB ROM http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_touch_pro-2413.php |
| 07:17.56 | DarkriftX | he prob read it wrong or the site was wrong |
| 07:17.57 | nesoi | but that's a GSM version |
| 07:18.09 | DarkriftX | why do we have to be dicks to each other? |
| 07:18.14 | geist | the 288 is almost assuredly because they added the basedband ram to the 256 |
| 07:18.16 | BruteSource | why would anyone use cdma? |
| 07:18.23 | DarkriftX | if you dont want to argue, then dont |
| 07:18.31 | geist | 7200 has a seperate sdram bank for baseband cpu |
| 07:18.34 | nesoi | BruteSource, don't be an idiot. I was the CTO of an internet company. Don't know ROM from RAM... dumbass |
| 07:18.45 | geist | 7225 runs both from the same bank |
| 07:18.50 | geist | but supporst more (256MB) |
| 07:19.00 | BruteSource | your the one who sad it has 512 ram |
| 07:19.19 | BruteSource | and what does .com business have to do with ram vs rom? |
| 07:19.25 | geist | so the 288 is 256 + 32 |
| 07:19.39 | DarkriftX | 51x102x18.05mm, 165g, Microsoft Windows Mobile 6.1 Professional , 32bit Qualcomm MSM7201A, 528MHz CPU, 288MiB RAM, 512MiB ROM, 2.8" 480x640 color transflective TFT display, video out, Proprietary audio jack, |
| 07:19.41 | DarkriftX | 288 there |
| 07:19.48 | DarkriftX | same device, different model |
| 07:19.53 | nesoi | I was quoting what I read on some site |
| 07:20.00 | nesoi | they said 512MB of both |
| 07:20.01 | DarkriftX | and a 3rd model: |
| 07:20.02 | DarkriftX | 58x99.9x13.9mm, 112g, Microsoft Windows Mobile 6 Professional , 32bit Texas Instruments OMAP 850, 201MHz CPU, 128MiB RAM, 256MiB ROM, 2.8" 240x320 color transflective TFT display, Proprietary audio jack, |
| 07:20.18 | geist | wonders why this matters? |
| 07:20.21 | BruteSource | omap diamond? |
| 07:20.21 | DarkriftX | wait, last one is the "touch" not "touch pro" |
| 07:20.23 | nesoi | if knowing ROM from RAM isn't among the requirements of being a CTO of a tech company, something is really wrong |
| 07:20.50 | BruteSource | hardware has nothing to do with a .com |
| 07:20.54 | nesoi | so, based on those specs, is the dream faster or much faster than the touch pro? |
| 07:21.01 | BruteSource | unless thay have there own web ervers lmao |
| 07:21.04 | geist | same thing |
| 07:21.06 | nesoi | trying to figure out if android will run well on it if and when it's ported |
| 07:21.14 | geist | same cpu, touch pro hs more ram. that's it |
| 07:21.18 | geist | same thing with the treo pro |
| 07:21.19 | nesoi | ok, good |
| 07:21.26 | BruteSource | the dream has slightly more ram, so its barely faster |
| 07:21.27 | nesoi | so now I can forget about believing anything BruteSource has to say |
| 07:21.47 | BruteSource | nesoi, stop embaressing yourself |
| 07:22.00 | nesoi | BruteSource, I'm not the one who can't spell |
| 07:22.22 | geist | anyway, my experience has been that the omap2430, another arm11 in a similar category, is somewhat faster than the msm cpus, since it has a much nicer memory bus |
| 07:22.29 | BruteSource | it also has better ril and radio firmware i hear |
| 07:22.31 | geist | but they're within 20 or 30% of each other |
| 07:22.41 | geist | cortex based cpus, however, mostly stomp the arm11s |
| 07:23.01 | nesoi | geist, you seem to know what you're talking about... are there any devices coming soon that would be better for android (if ported) than touch pro? |
| 07:23.02 | geist | dont think oneof those has shown up in a fone yet, though |
| 07:23.08 | BruteSource | what devices are omap2430? |
| 07:23.09 | nesoi | I'm pretty sure porting will happen |
| 07:23.24 | geist | BruteSource: n8xx, treo 800w |
| 07:23.29 | geist | i think some other ones |
| 07:23.39 | BruteSource | ya but cortex hs no real world applications in the phone world yet |
| 07:23.44 | geist | it's a much more traditional arm11, fully documented, since its a TI think |
| 07:23.46 | solca | hi! does somebody knows how to make a debug target in android from source code |
| 07:23.55 | geist | and linux already runs great on it |
| 07:24.01 | BruteSource | i thought treo was xscale |
| 07:24.09 | geist | nope |
| 07:24.10 | BruteSource | or maybe that was centro |
| 07:24.20 | geist | palm switches around |
| 07:24.31 | BruteSource | i hate palms os |
| 07:24.34 | geist | treo 800w is an omap2430, treo pro is a msm7201a |
| 07:24.48 | nesoi | geist, you seem to know what you're talking about... are there any devices coming soon that would be better for android (if ported) than touch pro? |
| 07:24.57 | spikebike | treo pro seems like an ideal device for a android port ;-) |
| 07:24.58 | geist | yes |
| 07:25.05 | BruteSource | quit repeating yourself |
| 07:25.16 | nesoi | which ones geist ? |
| 07:25.27 | DarkriftX | sounds like someones been drinking again |
| 07:25.31 | BruteSource | as far s kernel goes but i dunno about the radio |
| 07:25.47 | geist | I have to disclose myself before getting too much farther: I work for palm |
| 07:25.57 | BruteSource | naw i just dont like trolls, they annoy me |
| 07:26.05 | DarkriftX | you were one the other night |
| 07:26.10 | DarkriftX | we didnt treat you like shit |
| 07:26.11 | geist | which is why i know what's in the treos |
| 07:26.15 | nesoi | interesting |
| 07:26.21 | BruteSource | especially when the dont know hat they are talking about |
| 07:26.24 | nesoi | so geist what about an android port to palm hardware? |
| 07:26.25 | BruteSource | well he is now |
| 07:26.28 | DarkriftX | you didnt know what you were talking about |
| 07:26.30 | spikebike | the er touch HD has a bigger screen and more flash/ram, not sure how similar the hardware is though |
| 07:26.32 | geist | nesoi: should be easy |
| 07:26.36 | DarkriftX | "you are fake google devs" |
| 07:26.42 | BruteSource | yes but i was drinking |
| 07:26.44 | DarkriftX | "i sent you an email and you cant respond" |
| 07:26.46 | nesoi | geist, does palm supply enough docs to get everything working? |
| 07:26.49 | DarkriftX | so fucking waht, chill out |
| 07:27.01 | geist | nesoi: no, but i'm sure someone will figure it out |
| 07:27.11 | BruteSource | if he comes in tomorow with a hangover and apologizes ill forgive him |
| 07:27.15 | geist | 800w would be super easy, it's just an omap |
| 07:27.21 | geist | which is fully publically documented |
| 07:27.22 | BruteSource | dark chill dude |
| 07:27.27 | nesoi | interesting |
| 07:27.31 | geist | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:27.50 | geist | treo pro, guess that'd be easy too, since it's the same cpu as the G1 |
| 07:27.59 | geist | but the baseband firmware is liekly different |
| 07:28.08 | geist | and thus not really easy to get linux running |
| 07:28.11 | DarkriftX | easy is good, gets your foot in the door and gets people interested |
| 07:28.19 | geist | since on msm cpus you can't seperate the two |
| 07:28.38 | nesoi | palm isn't going that direction though? |
| 07:28.46 | geist | no comment |
| 07:28.50 | nesoi | ;) |
| 07:29.06 | geist | on that or any future stuff |
| 07:29.43 | nesoi | how do I sign up to beta test? |
| 07:29.50 | geist | just can't talk about it, but i can talk about stuff that has shipped |
| 07:29.57 | geist | though i haven't worked on any of the shipping stuff |
| 07:30.25 | BruteSource | it was fun getting android on omap850 |
| 07:30.33 | geist | but we generally dont mind peope hacking our fones, since after all, we already made our money if you have one in your hand |
| 07:30.39 | BruteSource | kinda stuck now with radio though |
| 07:30.58 | BruteSource | we have a working gsm driver but no proper tty for it |
| 07:31.03 | geist | yeah, that's really the elephant in the room |
| 07:31.11 | geist | you can hack stuff onto any of these cpus, and it's fun |
| 07:31.15 | BruteSource | so we can make silent calls thats it |
| 07:31.21 | geist | but the radio is usually a big black box of fail |
| 07:31.49 | geist | it's worse on the msm cpus, since the arm11 is a slave to the radio |
| 07:31.49 | nesoi | how about getting palm to release some documentation? |
| 07:31.58 | BruteSource | well someone is slowly but surely getting a tty for it |
| 07:32.08 | geist | you have to match the a11 stuff with the radio firmware version, so the rpc calls between them work, etc |
| 07:32.36 | BruteSource | thankfully omap850 has a seperate core for radio |
| 07:32.38 | geist | nesoi: you think we have docs? |
| 07:32.49 | geist | shit, I'm doing good to get a schematic from the hardware guys |
| 07:32.49 | BruteSource | tried and true |
| 07:33.16 | geist | BruteSource: msm does too, but the radio core has access to all the hardware ad the arm11 has to ask permission from the radio to do anything |
| 07:33.21 | geist | it's a really annoying architecture |
| 07:33.33 | nesoi | geist, really? no docs? usually you'd do development to some specs |
| 07:33.42 | geist | nesoi: usually it's the schematic |
| 07:34.00 | nesoi | so why not release that? |
| 07:34.07 | geist | shrugs |
| 07:34.16 | geist | same at apple, same at danger |
| 07:34.29 | geist | hardware guys make a thing, software guys hack stuff to run on it |
| 07:34.36 | BruteSource | ew danger |
| 07:34.44 | nesoi | sounds like the old proprietary minicomputer days |
| 07:34.55 | geist | the loop can be pretty tight, since you can just go down and talk to the hw folks |
| 07:35.06 | geist | but for the most part most of the guts are on the SOC anyway |
| 07:35.23 | geist | and the schematic is just how the voltage domains are set up and what ports the peripherals are connected to |
| 07:35.26 | geist | and how to set up the gpios |
| 07:35.42 | geist | so usually you end up with a couple hundred lines of board specific bits |
| 07:36.45 | geist | and on top of that the hw folks usually stick to the default pins |
| 07:37.04 | geist | so really you just have to look where the schematic does something unusual |
| 07:41.25 | BruteSource | i would just find a device that already has linux running nicely + radio support, that would make a nice android port |
| 07:41.46 | geist | n800? |
| 07:41.51 | geist | does it have a radio? I forget |
| 07:41.58 | spikebike | no |
| 07:42.03 | BruteSource | i dont know |
| 07:42.03 | spikebike | awesome device |
| 07:42.03 | Stskeeps | fm radio :P |
| 07:42.11 | spikebike | no cellular |
| 07:42.24 | BruteSource | oh wait i forgot htc vogue has release android with radio and audio |
| 07:42.25 | spikebike | I've got a n800 and 2 n770s |
| 07:42.27 | geist | but yeah, there just aren't a lot of linux based cell phones out there right now |
| 07:42.44 | spikebike | htc vogue has an android release? |
| 07:42.47 | geist | didn't motorola try to get one out at some point? |
| 07:42.54 | spikebike | geist yeah, openmoko, and a few motorolas |
| 07:42.58 | BruteSource | not talking about linux based phones, just phones people have hacked lunux onto |
| 07:43.08 | spikebike | yeah a780, razr2, a1200 and a few others |
| 07:43.11 | geist | BruteSource: yeah, but mst of the time that clobbers the radio |
| 07:43.14 | BruteSource | spike yes some guy name martin |
| 07:43.24 | geist | usually the radio interface is highly proprietary |
| 07:43.30 | spikebike | I really like the A1200 for a phone |
| 07:43.44 | geist | to the point that you essentially cant use it if you hack linux onto something that already didn't |
| 07:43.49 | BruteSource | geist what? i mean a phone with linux that already has radio support |
| 07:44.03 | spikebike | rumors claim motorola's trying to increase their android team from 50 to 350.. so I'd expect a product in the not too distant future |
| 07:44.04 | BruteSource | there are plenty out there |
| 07:44.14 | geist | well good then |
| 07:44.25 | spikebike | openmoko is shipping |
| 07:44.25 | geist | i havne't heard of that many, but guess i'm wrong |
| 07:44.31 | spikebike | not sure if the hardware is stable |
| 07:44.45 | spikebike | motorola has 8 ish, I've got a devel account if you really want the list |
| 07:45.11 | BruteSource | that was on slashdot like a month ago they probably already have |
| 07:45.14 | BruteSource | seems like vogue has everything but power management and a few other things |
| 07:45.14 | spikebike | motorola sells linux phones by the million |
| 07:45.25 | spikebike | but strangely very few hear (just one of the razr2's) |
| 07:45.35 | geist | that's probably true |
| 07:45.37 | BruteSource | and yes its release, so is the android on my excalibur |
| 07:45.39 | spikebike | not sure why they take on of their most popular foreign phones and don't sell it here |
| 07:45.41 | geist | and a lot of them aren't really androidable, right? |
| 07:45.44 | geist | little screens, etc |
| 07:45.58 | spikebike | well dunno |
| 07:46.28 | BruteSource | most phones that have hacked linux with radio are smartphones with big screens |
| 07:46.45 | BruteSource | alot of htc devices |
| 07:47.22 | spikebike | 320x240 isn't as high as the g1 |
| 07:47.32 | spikebike | but not what I'd call tiny |
| 07:47.57 | BruteSource | lol android looks great on my qvga |
| 07:48.10 | spikebike | yeah I'd love something more like my n800 |
| 07:48.12 | spikebike | 2 storage slots |
| 07:48.15 | spikebike | and 800x480 |
| 07:48.36 | DarkriftX | so android on an xscale isnt happening any time soon? |
| 07:48.52 | BruteSource | who knows |
| 07:48.53 | nesoi | htc touch is full vga at least |
| 07:49.15 | BruteSource | we didnt annonce anything or nake a git tree, we just did it |
| 07:49.15 | spikebike | touch hd is 800x480 I think |
| 07:49.16 | *** join/#android davidw (n=davidw@213.47.186.146) |
| 07:49.25 | waldo_ | is back (gone 04:52:16) |
| 07:49.39 | BruteSource | so there could be many projects going on we dont know about |
| 07:50.00 | spikebike | I was shocked and amazed how many android videos there are on youtube |
| 07:50.17 | spikebike | no idea how many are just emulating android, or missing major functionality (like the radio) |
| 07:50.41 | BruteSource | well thats the first step... |
| 07:50.51 | geist | yeah, my suspicion is that the successful projects dont spend all day talking about it on irc |
| 07:51.04 | BruteSource | not emulating but the kernel and userpace |
| 07:51.34 | BruteSource | or posting it on forums or sourceforge lol |
| 07:52.08 | BruteSource | but i posted it on xda and man did that thread get hot |
| 07:52.11 | spikebike | I'd prefer they spent all day advertising their success and telling me where to send the $$$ ;-) |
| 07:52.25 | spikebike | but for now the g1 keeps me happy |
| 07:52.33 | BruteSource | cant sell anything with a gpl lol |
| 07:52.33 | spikebike | and I have to say 192MB ram works much better than I feared |
| 07:52.55 | parmaster | more people need to thank GOOG |
| 07:53.31 | spikebike | indeed |
| 07:53.44 | spikebike | I think the iphone might have been a necessary prereq |
| 07:53.50 | BruteSource | i thank the devs not google, i mean a killswitch? a locked bootloader, no root, wtf? |
| 07:53.54 | spikebike | raise the bar, show how much the GUI matters |
| 07:54.08 | *** join/#android hackbod (n=hackbod@72.14.224.1) |
| 07:54.09 | DarkriftX | seems some ppla re working on an axim x5? port already: 58x99.9x13.9mm, 112g, Microsoft Windows Mobile 6 Professional , 32bit Texas Instruments OMAP 850, 201MHz CPU, 128MiB RAM, 256MiB ROM, 2.8" 240x320 color transflective TFT display, Proprietary audio jack, |
| 07:54.13 | DarkriftX | erm..... oops |
| 07:54.15 | BruteSource | i duno about comparing it to the iphone |
| 07:54.19 | DarkriftX | http://forum.htcgeeks.com/local_links.php?catid=60 |
| 07:54.38 | spikebike | well android plays to the iphone weakness... while having a very nice GUI |
| 07:54.38 | BruteSource | still doesnt compare in alot of ways |
| 07:55.09 | spikebike | I agree they are very different |
| 07:55.25 | Adamant | you're right, it has a real KB |
| 07:55.30 | BruteSource | ya but no multi touch, no huge internal flash disk, not even a 3.5 jack |
| 07:55.37 | Adamant | so it's that much better |
| 07:56.00 | spikebike | I'm hoping they work out something for the storage |
| 07:56.05 | DarkriftX | think of the g1 as a beta :) |
| 07:56.07 | spikebike | seems a shame to limit apps to the internal storage |
| 07:56.09 | DarkriftX | there ARE more to come |
| 07:56.10 | BruteSource | thay have |
| 07:56.16 | DarkriftX | whereas iphone will just get upgrades |
| 07:56.23 | Adamant | 8 gig flash drive = 8 gig iThings |
| 07:56.37 | DarkriftX | goes to bed |
| 07:56.39 | parmaster | its funded by GOOG is what i mean |
| 07:56.39 | DarkriftX | gn all |
| 07:56.41 | BruteSource | up to a 32gb |
| 07:56.56 | spikebike | 8GB cost $30... I couldn't justify $90 ish for 16. |
| 07:57.02 | Adamant | yeah, but soon there will be 16 gig cards |
| 07:57.08 | Adamant | or there are |
| 07:57.13 | BruteSource | even higher |
| 07:57.19 | spikebike | I figure a factor of 8 is enough for now |
| 07:57.31 | spikebike | but from what I can tell you can't use the 8 to store apps |
| 07:57.33 | spikebike | just data |
| 07:57.55 | BruteSource | yup, until its rooted anyways |
| 07:58.37 | *** join/#android tchwbs (n=tchwbs@210-84-32-12.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 08:01.02 | spikebike | cool my tiny python program to send XMPP messages works |
| 08:01.06 | BruteSource | i like android because of the linux side, i wouldnt buy a g1 untill im sure there is a rootkit. |
| 08:01.22 | spikebike | now I can have an email page address that will find me via cellular or wifi |
| 08:01.42 | spikebike | Brute I'm linux top to bottom everywhere I go |
| 08:01.56 | spikebike | access points, laptops, desktops, servers at home, work, etc. |
| 08:02.08 | spikebike | I'd like a rootkit, but it's still damn nice even without |
| 08:02.33 | BruteSource | i have push gmail already, if thats what your referring to. |
| 08:02.33 | spikebike | (and pda's of course) |
| 08:05.13 | BruteSource | i cant believe there isnt a rootkit yet, i think this device is making history as far as that goes. |
| 08:06.10 | *** join/#android mib_8k6r7i (i=d59d0fcf@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-4aac1313bcf8d3c5) |
| 08:06.36 | spikebike | ? |
| 08:06.55 | spikebike | you mean time from release -> rootkit? |
| 08:07.25 | BruteSource | ya |
| 08:07.31 | languish | holy fuck |
| 08:07.40 | Adamant | if you mean the equivalent of jailbreaking, that != rootkit. |
| 08:07.43 | languish | there's a file manager on in the market |
| 08:08.08 | BruteSource | no i mean a way to become root user pid=0 |
| 08:08.12 | BruteSource | uid |
| 08:08.38 | Adamant | when you already have root access or to get root access when you don't have that initally |
| 08:08.56 | Adamant | #1 is a rootkit, #2 is just an exploit |
| 08:09.16 | spikebike | yeah, most iphone hacks seem to be #2 |
| 08:09.16 | Adamant | apologizes for playing the definitions game |
| 08:09.26 | spikebike | and even then it seems incompalete |
| 08:09.35 | spikebike | i.e. they can install apps, but not unlock the phone |
| 08:10.55 | BruteSource | i dont think there has been a linux device released ever that has gone this far without making an exploit to gain root |
| 08:11.34 | BruteSource | without someone... i mean |
| 08:11.40 | spikebike | to be honest there seems less incentive than usual |
| 08:12.09 | BruteSource | i dont see why |
| 08:12.13 | spikebike | I suspect most folks are playing with android and eclipse |
| 08:12.26 | spikebike | making use of all the android bindings etc. |
| 08:12.46 | BruteSource | most linux geeks dont care thereon a mission to be first to root something |
| 08:12.51 | spikebike | sure it would be nice to turn a g1 into a 3g <-> wifi router |
| 08:12.53 | BruteSource | show there linux balls |
| 08:14.39 | *** join/#android cutmasta (n=cutmasta@62.225.134.181) |
| 08:15.22 | *** join/#android anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07E6A4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:19.22 | BruteSource | i have never experienced 3g |
| 08:19.33 | BruteSource | is it really that fast? |
| 08:20.20 | *** join/#android rednode (n=RDN@user-5446dbdd.lns5-c13.telh.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 08:20.35 | rednode | Guys this may sound dumb but what is a android and the purpose of it? |
| 08:20.44 | languish | mine's not "that" fast. but for everything I've done on the g1 so far.. it's smooth enough to say it's nice |
| 08:21.08 | languish | rednode, it's a mobile platform, in lay terms consider it an operating system... |
| 08:21.48 | languish | and it has more "openess" for programmers to create applications and games, than other mobile devices |
| 08:22.20 | languish | so *sight now* it's a cellp phone OS, that almost anyone can create a program for, just as they would your desktop pc |
| 08:22.27 | languish | *right now |
| 08:22.33 | waldo_ | rednode: yeah basically it's an operating system for phones that let you do cool things. |
| 08:22.44 | waldo_ | BruteSource: yes |
| 08:23.09 | waldo_ | it's suprisingly fast |
| 08:23.10 | spikebike | googles goal seems to be to improve cell phones enough so that more people use the web/search/exposed to google advertising |
| 08:23.39 | rednode | ahh ok |
| 08:23.44 | rednode | and what languages can you use? |
| 08:23.47 | rednode | C++ or only Java? |
| 08:23.47 | nesoi | and so they can know even more about everyone, which will help them to become Big Brother even quicker |
| 08:24.21 | waldo_ | red only java for end-user applications |
| 08:24.37 | waldo_ | or any program that can output to java bytecode |
| 08:25.19 | waldo_ | that is, language |
| 08:31.09 | *** join/#android Wander_w (n=wander@ip5653a3cb.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 08:31.21 | *** join/#android jasta_ (n=jasta@71-217-4-103.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 08:31.24 | jasta_ | hmm |
| 08:31.40 | *** part/#android nesoi (n=quigg@h-67-101-96-125.snfccasy.dynamic.covad.net) |
| 08:31.53 | spikebike | someone told me today that google's working on a native sdk |
| 08:31.53 | jasta_ | "No repository found at https://dl-ssl.google.com/android/eclipse/" |
| 08:34.42 | muthu | jasta_: try 'http' |
| 08:35.24 | *** join/#android mqt (i=tran@monaco.nirv.net) |
| 08:35.27 | jasta_ | worked. wonder what that's all about. |
| 08:35.37 | muthu | weird |
| 08:36.40 | *** join/#android alo (n=QUAKEIII@142.Red-81-37-222.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 08:37.41 | *** join/#android nebi (n=nebi@c-498fe253.02-145-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 08:45.11 | waldo_ | what's a native sdk? |
| 08:47.12 | muthu | jasta_: awake? |
| 08:47.50 | jasta_ | yes |
| 08:48.09 | muthu | am looking at the sources.. how do you test/debug that mess? |
| 08:48.21 | *** join/#android zhobbs_ (n=zach@132.245.8.67.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 08:48.23 | jasta_ | first of all, it's not a mess |
| 08:48.32 | muthu | good |
| 08:48.35 | jasta_ | second, pick a component |
| 08:48.48 | jasta_ | you can't "test/debug" the whole thing unless you mean how to you just run it in the emulator |
| 08:49.05 | jasta_ | in which case just run make and then look in out -- everything the emulator needs is in there |
| 08:49.16 | muthu | oh right |
| 08:49.24 | muthu | ok, running the emu is the only way? |
| 08:49.40 | jasta_ | as opposed to? running it on your phone? |
| 08:50.25 | muthu | running it by eclipse? |
| 08:50.42 | jasta_ | do you understand what the source code _is_? |
| 08:50.55 | muthu | why don't you enlighten me? |
| 08:50.59 | jasta_ | it isn't a Java program. |
| 08:51.27 | jasta_ | it's the entire platform source, including the kernel, C/C++ libraries, middleware, and a bunch of Android apps. |
| 08:51.40 | waldo_ | jasta how long did it take to build? |
| 08:51.43 | waldo_ | just out of curiousity |
| 08:51.47 | jasta_ | about 20 minutes on my box (a powerful box) |
| 08:51.51 | waldo_ | the whole 2 gigs? |
| 08:51.53 | waldo_ | holy crap |
| 08:51.58 | jasta_ | maybe 30 minutes, i dunno, i wasnt realy watching it |
| 08:52.06 | waldo_ | wow |
| 08:52.12 | jasta_ | yeah i have a quad core machine so i just parallelized |
| 08:52.14 | waldo_ | I thought you were going to say about 10 hours |
| 08:52.24 | waldo_ | that's amazing |
| 08:52.33 | jasta_ | this isn't 1990 |
| 08:52.42 | muthu | haha |
| 08:52.43 | waldo_ | still |
| 08:52.59 | waldo_ | Hey-- It took many many hours just to build everything in gentoo |
| 08:53.01 | waldo_ | like 12 |
| 08:53.02 | muthu | but its kinda crazy to build this whole stuff |
| 08:53.11 | waldo_ | and that was 4 years ago? |
| 08:53.11 | muthu | just to see if my 2 lines is working.. |
| 08:53.20 | jasta_ | waldo_: everything in ubuntu is quite a lot larger than android |
| 08:53.24 | waldo_ | 1990 linux didn'te ven exist |
| 08:53.31 | jasta_ | android's two largest components, for instance, are Linux and WebKit |
| 08:53.37 | languish | [23:27] <romainguy> sweet |
| 08:53.37 | languish | [23:27] <romainguy> 11 minutes to compile Android 1.0 on my machine |
| 08:53.43 | waldo_ | okay the kernel takes me 5 minutes maybe |
| 08:53.45 | jasta_ | Linux can be built in like 2 minutes or so |
| 08:53.53 | jasta_ | waldo_: not this kernel, it's very slim., |
| 08:54.04 | jasta_ | the configuration calls for almost nothing to be built |
| 08:54.17 | muthu | wow, 11 mins |
| 08:54.18 | *** join/#android eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-5-30.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 08:54.23 | waldo_ | the kernel used to take like 30 minutes in 1995 or even longer |
| 08:54.40 | jasta_ | waldo_: again, that's probably building a fully modular, desktop kernel |
| 08:54.44 | waldo_ | yes |
| 08:54.44 | jasta_ | android' skernel is much slimmer |
| 08:54.54 | languish | in 1995 the kernel complexity and the systems it built on were different :| |
| 08:55.02 | muthu | jasta_: tell me how you tested your stuff, before sending in the patch |
| 08:55.07 | waldo_ | i'm still amazed.. 2 gigs of anything to compile in 20 minutes is amazing |
| 08:55.28 | jasta_ | muthu: well since i was only working on the Email app, i merely built the Email app into an APK and installed it onto the emulator |
| 08:55.46 | waldo_ | jasta how's your push stuff coming |
| 08:55.53 | jasta_ | if i was working on, for isntance, dalvik i would have had a totally different environment. |
| 08:55.53 | waldo_ | and did you see there was another email fork in the market? |
| 08:56.00 | muthu | ok |
| 08:56.02 | jasta_ | waldo_: it works, but it needs major cleanup |
| 08:56.11 | jasta_ | waldo_: i did yeah, i was going to contact that guy. our goals are similar. |
| 08:56.21 | jasta_ | i was going to work on searching next, but he took care of it :) |
| 08:56.37 | waldo_ | yeah i'm starting to see where developers can start working together so we don't have, say, 15 weather programs, but zero net tools... |
| 08:57.27 | waldo_ | i was talking to michael novak about that so I think he's working on something |
| 08:57.40 | *** join/#android ArteK_Work (n=Miranda@80.50.33.246) |
| 08:58.24 | *** join/#android noclouds (n=mhfan@61.190.36.114) |
| 08:59.06 | noclouds | build/core/api/1.xml:240357: error 1: required string: "exception" |
| 08:59.08 | noclouds | hi, there |
| 08:59.17 | noclouds | i cann't build android~ |
| 09:00.01 | noclouds | [~/devel/hhdroid>-986$ make |
| 09:00.02 | noclouds | build/core/product_config.mk:229: WARNING: adding test OTA key |
| 09:00.02 | noclouds | Checking API: checkapi-last |
| 09:00.02 | noclouds | build/core/api/1.xml:240357: error 1: required string: "exception" |
| 09:00.02 | noclouds | ****************************** |
| 09:00.02 | noclouds | You have tried to change the API from what has been previously released in |
| 09:00.04 | noclouds | an SDK. Please fix the errors listed above. |
| 09:00.06 | noclouds | ****************************** |
| 09:00.08 | noclouds | make: *** [out/target/common/obj/PACKAGING/checkapi-last-timestamp] Error 38 |
| 09:00.21 | languish | noclouds stop. use pastebin instead |
| 09:00.58 | noclouds | what is `pastebin'? |
| 09:01.02 | languish | http://pastebin.com/ |
| 09:01.03 | muthu | noclouds: is this the latest source? |
| 09:01.12 | noclouds | of course~ |
| 09:01.17 | languish | you paste your text in to it. then it gives you a url to share the text |
| 09:01.30 | languish | so on irc, you share 1 line, not a flood |
| 09:01.36 | jasta_ | jesus this new machine is so fast :) |
| 09:01.40 | languish | heh |
| 09:01.42 | jasta_ | i have 6GB of ram now |
| 09:01.45 | languish | nice |
| 09:01.54 | muthu | 6? oooh |
| 09:01.55 | jasta_ | faster quad core than my work machine too |
| 09:01.57 | languish | home built or ? |
| 09:02.04 | muthu | am stuck at 2gb |
| 09:02.15 | jasta_ | nah i just picked up an acer today from fry's. i really can't be bothered to build my own machines anymore. |
| 09:02.18 | jasta_ | such a waste of my time |
| 09:02.22 | languish | haha |
| 09:02.28 | noclouds | thinks, languish |
| 09:02.35 | languish | noclouds, no problem |
| 09:03.16 | *** join/#android eton (n=eton@ppp-58-8-8-87.revip2.asianet.co.th) |
| 09:03.21 | muthu | need to get quad core and 8gb ram |
| 09:03.46 | muthu | is there a loptop with that kinda config? |
| 09:04.08 | swetland | dual-dualcore (older macpro), 2.8GHz, 2GB ram, linux, make -j8 can build the full system in ~15min |
| 09:04.35 | swetland | which is slower than I'd like but survivable |
| 09:04.48 | jasta_ | just for kicks, im gonna build it right now :) |
| 09:04.50 | muthu | 15 min not bad |
| 09:04.53 | jasta_ | on my new machine |
| 09:05.11 | muthu | jasta_: clock it |
| 09:05.11 | noclouds | http://pastebin.com/m55184864 |
| 09:05.23 | noclouds | so this my problem~ |
| 09:05.30 | *** join/#android BruteSource (n=BruteSou@m070e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 09:06.03 | swetland | I find -jN where N is 2x the number of cores is usually a happy thing, but if you have a ton of memory more than 2x might be worth it |
| 09:06.38 | BruteSource | how ya doing swetland? |
| 09:06.56 | swetland | hanging in there. about to call it a day. |
| 09:07.53 | noclouds | google told me there is someone else got the same problem as mine: |
| 09:07.55 | noclouds | http://www.talkandroid.com/android-forums/android-development/388-android-source-build-problem-under-ubuntu.html |
| 09:09.16 | BruteSource | swetland you guys should be prod no one has rooted g1 yet |
| 09:09.43 | swetland | we'll see how long it lasts. a week is a nice start though |
| 09:11.04 | swetland | the system's designed to run an absolute minimum number of processes as root, run nothing as setuid root, and generally be cautious about privilege escalation |
| 09:11.23 | BruteSource | im trying to think of the last linux device that made it this long |
| 09:12.02 | jasta_ | i think we should get a booky involved :) |
| 09:12.26 | BruteSource | lol my money is on 3 weeks |
| 09:12.34 | *** join/#android noclouds (n=mhfan@61.190.36.114) |
| 09:12.40 | jasta_ | i'd like to be able to take bets on what part of the platform is gonna fail |
| 09:12.44 | swetland | if you're going to start betting, I'd propose a couple different pools: - gaining root locally - bootloader exploit - remote code execution in the browser |
| 09:13.22 | jasta_ | yeah, totally |
| 09:13.27 | jasta_ | i think we should get more granular even :) |
| 09:13.41 | BruteSource | well if bootloader comes first it should be easy for the other 2 |
| 09:13.49 | jasta_ | for instance, local root i think is gonna come from...erm, i'll say adbd. |
| 09:14.04 | swetland | jasta: it runs as a nonpriv user |
| 09:14.17 | jasta_ | are you sure? i show it as root |
| 09:14.26 | swetland | on the emulator |
| 09:14.29 | jasta_ | oh :) |
| 09:14.31 | swetland | not on a production ubild |
| 09:14.52 | jasta_ | damn ok, ill need to plug in my device and revise my betting |
| 09:15.10 | swetland | the emulator looks more like what we call a userdebug build (adb runs as root, su is installed, no restrictions on debugger usage) |
| 09:15.30 | BruteSource | god swetland, what ere you thinking with this useless terminal emulator |
| 09:15.40 | swetland | hm? |
| 09:15.44 | BruteSource | were |
| 09:15.56 | languish | BruteSource, if there something about this time of day/night that makes you grumpy? |
| 09:16.02 | BruteSource | no history support, tab completion... |
| 09:16.02 | swetland | ahahha |
| 09:16.09 | languish | :) |
| 09:16.16 | BruteSource | im not grumpy? |
| 09:16.21 | swetland | bs: technically that's a shell limitation not a terminal emulator limitation |
| 09:16.25 | BruteSource | why do i seem grumpy? |
| 09:16.35 | swetland | and honestly, I came this close to not shipping with the shell at all |
| 09:16.39 | *** join/#android mz2 (n=mz2@guest169.wtgc.org) |
| 09:16.45 | swetland | too useful for debugging though |
| 09:16.52 | BruteSource | last i checked ash had history and tab completion |
| 09:16.58 | swetland | if built with editline |
| 09:17.20 | swetland | which then needs curses |
| 09:17.41 | swetland | both doable, but were not essential, would burn a bit more flash, didn't get much love for 1.0 |
| 09:17.41 | BruteSource | aw |
| 09:18.08 | BruteSource | well im sure a decent terminal will come from a 3rd party app maker soon |
| 09:18.17 | swetland | if somebody got a nice minimal port of editline / some lightweight bsd licensed curses library built, we'd consider picking that up |
| 09:18.55 | swetland | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:19.38 | BruteSource | i ran top on it and it didnt even make it fit on my screen |
| 09:19.46 | BruteSource | but that might be my screen |
| 09:20.39 | languish | hahha oh man.. I just had my first android app experience |
| 09:20.40 | *** join/#android nebi (n=nebi@c-498fe253.02-145-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 09:21.01 | BruteSource | android app experience? |
| 09:21.14 | languish | I had the G1 in my pocket, went to hit the head... and the lightbulb in the bathroom blew out |
| 09:21.24 | languish | pulled out the G1, hit the flashlight app |
| 09:21.30 | languish | worked like a charm |
| 09:21.32 | swetland | ahaha |
| 09:21.33 | languish | rolf |
| 09:22.52 | swetland | catches up on xda-developers threads on dream |
| 09:22.59 | jasta_ | i like that app |
| 09:23.00 | BruteSource | wow |
| 09:23.21 | jasta_ | swetland: is that a fun game for you? watching all your lab rats explore the maze? :) |
| 09:23.23 | *** join/#android malcolm_ (n=malcom@151.65.91.174) |
| 09:23.27 | BruteSource | i just press a button to bring my device to life and thats enough light to see in the dark for me |
| 09:23.47 | swetland | it's fun watching people try to take the system apart, yes |
| 09:24.03 | swetland | I was always sad at danger that nobody seemed to care enough to even try to hack the system ^^ |
| 09:24.10 | parmaster | haha |
| 09:24.23 | parmaster | when were you at danger swetland? what years |
| 09:24.29 | languish | BruteSource, I have a dark background image. not ebough light. so the flashlight app helped |
| 09:24.29 | swetland | or maybe we just did a really good job, but I know we had a couple exploitable bugs in earlier revs of the os |
| 09:24.33 | swetland | 2000-2004 |
| 09:24.40 | BruteSource | look at the sidekicks demographic |
| 09:24.46 | parmaster | i met with some folks from there in july when i had some training in sf |
| 09:24.56 | parmaster | they showed me the new sidekick prototype |
| 09:25.14 | swetland | I still know a few of the danger folks. most of the original team has moved on though |
| 09:25.22 | BruteSource | i dont know any 14 yr old mallrat hackers |
| 09:25.28 | swetland | bunch of us at google, a couple worked on iphone and iphone 3g, etc, etc |
| 09:25.38 | parmaster | yeah, everyone i was with was stoked to be microsoft then |
| 09:26.28 | BruteSource | give it 5 years and i say 80% of devices will have android |
| 09:26.33 | BruteSource | stock |
| 09:26.45 | parmaster | heh, i know people like their database architect.. ldap and auth ppl.. etc. |
| 09:26.52 | swetland | 80% of all mobile devices? |
| 09:27.04 | BruteSource | i bought a sidekick 08 |
| 09:27.07 | BruteSource | ya |
| 09:27.20 | swetland | seems like a stretch to me. mind you, I wouldn't complain, but mobile is a huge space |
| 09:27.40 | parmaster | i'd like the option to load the android environment on boot |
| 09:27.42 | BruteSource | thats my guess, i give 20% to cheap flip phones that have very basic hw |
| 09:27.49 | swetland | I'm skeptical we'll see a single dominant player the way win32 is on pcs |
| 09:28.33 | parmaster | or a virtualization also supporting android |
| 09:28.37 | tric | hmm, still no new builds of sdk released. |
| 09:28.54 | languish | swetland, yeah.. symbian is wroking up for a big move now |
| 09:28.58 | tric | swetland will there ever be snapshots released? cause else ill have to go back to 0.9 again :( |
| 09:28.58 | languish | *working |
| 09:29.15 | swetland | what's wrong with 1.0? |
| 09:29.16 | languish | android really kicked some groups in the pants |
| 09:29.22 | parmaster | as it is right now i just compile it for arm5te |
| 09:29.31 | BruteSource | symbian used to be my favorite mobile os |
| 09:29.36 | parmaster | whatever programs |
| 09:29.39 | BruteSource | s60 anyways |
| 09:29.45 | Adamant | I think Android is going to beat WinMo and Symbian. And I think given Apple's current iThing strategy, it may very well marginalize those devices. then again I'm in #android is I'm not exactly a neutral observer |
| 09:30.10 | languish | Adamant, you engadget reader you |
| 09:30.11 | tric | swetland: emulator cannot handle -qemu flag. bug filed and reviewed. maybe fixed in source. but i dont really have time to build and maybe patch all of it. |
| 09:30.18 | Adamant | but I doubt anything will ever have 80% of the market |
| 09:30.28 | Adamant | it's too big and too varied |
| 09:30.31 | Adamant | languish: ? |
| 09:30.34 | BruteSource | i dont like iphone dream comparisons |
| 09:30.45 | swetland | I'm sure there will be updates to the sdk. dunno any details, but I know we're not just going to stop at 1.0 |
| 09:30.46 | languish | Adamant, you're use of the iThing moniker |
| 09:30.51 | languish | :) |
| 09:30.55 | languish | *your |
| 09:30.56 | parmaster | i'm really impressed with what android ended up bein. |
| 09:30.57 | languish | damnit |
| 09:31.05 | Adamant | languish: ah, I don't know if I got it from them or came up with it myself |
| 09:31.07 | tric | swetland: sadly the issue tracker still looks broken. no links to patches included and so on. |
| 09:31.26 | tric | would help to know if its fixed or not, and not to read all changelogs in git. |
| 09:31.29 | BruteSource | im curious how well the first non ts android launch will go |
| 09:31.49 | swetland | tric: infrastructure is being worked on. many known issues with bug tracking stuff. once repo/gerrit/git is solid I'm sure the bugtracker will get some more love |
| 09:32.06 | BruteSource | swetland the next device will be motorola right? |
| 09:33.15 | jasta_ | yay, got my first change merged into the git tree :) |
| 09:33.43 | swetland | I can't comment on unannounced devices / rumors / etc. also, given that the source is completely open, I fully expect to be utterly surprised by devices I'd never heard of suddenly shipping at some point |
| 09:34.49 | swetland | in any case, way late here. 'night folks. happy hacking |
| 09:34.49 | languish | swetland, some wacky co already made an announcement |
| 09:34.54 | BruteSource | manufactures would just ship a device with android w/o even mentioning it to google? |
| 09:35.01 | languish | though for now they're vapor |
| 09:35.09 | swetland | they could! they might! who knows |
| 09:35.19 | languish | heh, 'nigth man |
| 09:35.22 | languish | *night |
| 09:35.23 | swetland | 'later |
| 09:35.25 | BruteSource | lol that would be great |
| 09:35.30 | BruteSource | night bud |
| 09:36.20 | languish | lenovo is doing an android phone in china |
| 09:36.30 | languish | http://gizmodo.com/5069604/china-goes-with-lenovo-for-its-own-google-phone |
| 09:36.57 | BruteSource | or there just hyping |
| 09:37.10 | BruteSource | lenovo why do i know that name |
| 09:37.21 | languish | lenovo took over ibm laptops |
| 09:37.27 | languish | they produce thinkpads now |
| 09:37.28 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 09:37.40 | languish | among other things |
| 09:38.11 | BruteSource | ibm no longer makes laptops? |
| 09:38.23 | languish | they haven't for awhile |
| 09:38.26 | *** join/#android neekers (n=chatzill@71-35-119-246.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 09:38.30 | BruteSource | they were the best laptop manufacturer |
| 09:38.38 | BruteSource | thats sad to hear |
| 09:38.40 | languish | they sold their operation to lenovo |
| 09:38.47 | languish | some years ago |
| 09:38.49 | languish | ahh |
| 09:38.52 | languish | here we g |
| 09:38.56 | tric | lenovo produced ibm thinkpads for several years. they only bought the brand and development from ibm maybe 2-3 years ago aswell |
| 09:39.00 | languish | theother android announcement http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/10/24/hop-on-promises-android-phone-at-ces-cookies-rainbows/ |
| 09:39.11 | neekers | is this channel for android coders? |
| 09:39.17 | languish | neekers yes |
| 09:39.23 | neekers | thank you |
| 09:39.23 | BruteSource | i hate not being able to click or copy links |
| 09:39.51 | languish | BruteSource, save the links as notes, then check them out later |
| 09:39.58 | BruteSource | guess ill have to switch to alienware |
| 09:40.08 | BruteSource | i cant save them s notes.... |
| 09:40.08 | languish | alienware is owned by dell now |
| 09:40.16 | BruteSource | yup |
| 09:40.16 | languish | BruteSource, pen, paper. |
| 09:40.46 | BruteSource | im not riting a url down to read an article, why would you even say that? |
| 09:40.52 | BruteSource | writing |
| 09:40.54 | languish | facepalms |
| 09:41.10 | BruteSource | you act likeyou would, just shhh. |
| 09:41.13 | languish | because you're the guy who can't open a webbrowser :) |
| 09:41.20 | BruteSource | oh i hate this keypad |
| 09:41.21 | languish | I would and I have |
| 09:41.24 | tric | did anyone here build the sdk from source and can try to start the emulator with -qemu flag? `emulator -qemu`, is it working or just telling "(null): invalid option -- '-qemu'"? |
| 09:41.29 | BruteSource | i can open a browser |
| 09:41.41 | languish | ok shh let this guy find some assistance |
| 09:41.53 | BruteSource | wtf are you even talking about? do you know? |
| 09:42.05 | BruteSource | no im sick of you, click. |
| 09:42.28 | jasta_ | impatiently waits on repo1.maven.org to repsond |
| 09:44.22 | BruteSource | no one would write down a link that long to read a useless article, of course it's easy to say you would, just to be a nag. |
| 09:45.37 | languish | tric, it looks like you're not the only one with the problem.. it's a bug most likely.. and has been reported... http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=906 |
| 09:46.09 | neekers | if you have an app you created running on the G1 and you hit the home button, I assume the app continues to run in the background, how do you stop the app? |
| 09:46.34 | languish | BruteSource, when I'm discussing an issue I'm interested in, I do and have recorded information, including urls, by hand, to check out later on |
| 09:46.52 | BruteSource | im sure |
| 09:47.36 | tric | languish: hehe, its me who filed that bug. and thats why i wanna know if its fixed in the current git repository |
| 09:48.06 | languish | neekers, it depends on the app, some will run in the background others are ... *as I understand it* save stated. the user does not end the applications, instead the OS will save state up to 6 apps, then the 7th is ended automatically |
| 09:49.04 | BruteSource | you can stop them with top in the terminal emulator |
| 09:49.35 | languish | neekers, so you start 6 apps, then start another one, the first app you started and aren't using, will be eneded by the OS, then you start another app, and the second one you started will be ended by the IS |
| 09:49.37 | languish | *OS |
| 09:50.35 | BruteSource | or killall -9 if you know the process name |
| 09:50.36 | languish | so you always have up to 6 apps (assuming you started 6 apps since a shutdown), and for each new app you start, the oldest app is ended |
| 09:50.50 | languish | BruteSource, he asked on the G1 |
| 09:50.50 | neekers | i have a little map application and i hit the home button and every minute i see a toast dialog display the gps location on the home page, can i progamatically stop the app by pressing the menu button and displaying a stop button? is that the proper way to do it? |
| 09:51.12 | languish | BruteSource, you can't do that on a G1 yet |
| 09:51.12 | neekers | yes, on the G1 |
| 09:51.27 | BruteSource | why? what stops you? |
| 09:51.40 | languish | BruteSource, there's no shell access on the G1 |
| 09:52.02 | BruteSource | what are you talking about? |
| 09:52.14 | languish | dude, stop trolling, seriously |
| 09:52.18 | BruteSource | dev tools, terminal emulator |
| 09:52.29 | BruteSource | no one is trolling your wrong. |
| 09:52.43 | languish | BruteSource, that's if you have it plugged in for dev |
| 09:52.51 | BruteSource | no... |
| 09:53.41 | languish | most people won't and that's not what he asked |
| 09:53.50 | BruteSource | everyone has it |
| 09:53.59 | languish | sure, what's the UI path to it |
| 09:54.03 | BruteSource | me and swetland were just talking about it |
| 09:54.04 | languish | on the G1 |
| 09:54.10 | languish | without a usb connection |
| 09:54.18 | BruteSource | i just told you |
| 09:54.22 | languish | do you even own a G1? |
| 09:54.24 | languish | no. |
| 09:54.26 | languish | you don't. |
| 09:54.38 | BruteSource | this guy. |
| 09:54.50 | BruteSource | who in here has a g1? |
| 09:55.09 | BruteSource | ill prove it to him |
| 09:55.10 | neekers | i got my g1 last thursday, it is very cool, i love it |
| 09:55.26 | BruteSource | okay neekers do you have a dev tools menu? |
| 09:55.28 | languish | neekers, beware of BruteSource |
| 09:55.50 | BruteSource | he is scared of being embaressed |
| 09:56.33 | BruteSource | and proven wrong, you can just read the scroll back me and swetland were just talking about the terminal emulator |
| 09:56.45 | neekers | no, i dont see dev tools on here |
| 09:57.02 | BruteSource | okay then there is another path to it |
| 09:57.16 | languish | <swetland> not on a production ubild |
| 09:57.25 | neekers | i was actaully wondering about a terminal emulator, that would be cool, but for now, i just need to get my app going |
| 09:57.38 | languish | BruteSource, it's only on google-issues dev models, not production G1's |
| 09:57.50 | BruteSource | languish no |
| 09:57.58 | BruteSource | what was right before that? |
| 09:58.16 | neekers | anddev.org has a lot of nice code samples, are there other sites that have a lot? |
| 09:58.27 | BruteSource | i know because my androi is the release userspace not the dev userspace and i have a terminal emulator |
| 09:58.37 | BruteSource | android |
| 09:59.45 | BruteSource | he said not on a production ubild after i asked if they could get root |
| 10:00.16 | languish | BruteSource, on the production G1's, it's not accesible through the GUI |
| 10:00.25 | languish | what do you not understand about that? |
| 10:00.54 | BruteSource | lmao your such a fool |
| 10:01.05 | BruteSource | just dont speak to m anymore |
| 10:01.07 | languish | "you're" |
| 10:01.20 | BruteSource | lol its urc |
| 10:01.22 | BruteSource | irc |
| 10:02.04 | BruteSource | whydont you paste the line where swetland said I ALMOST DIDNT SHIP IT WITH A TERMINAL EMULATOR? |
| 10:02.23 | muthu | is the market app available for download? |
| 10:02.42 | jasta_ | i dont think so, no |
| 10:02.50 | muthu | hmm |
| 10:02.55 | languish | BruteSource, he shipped the android code base with it. The carrier (T-Mobile) made their own changes |
| 10:03.26 | muthu | neekers: apps-for-android.googlecode.com |
| 10:03.30 | BruteSource | GOD I WISH I COULD LINK |
| 10:03.37 | BruteSource | Ooops |
| 10:03.41 | neekers | thanks muthu |
| 10:03.49 | muthu | np |
| 10:04.02 | muthu | hope you saw the topic ;) |
| 10:04.14 | BruteSource | i have 4 videos of people with g1's using the terminal emulator to do various things |
| 10:04.45 | languish | BruteSource, and those people has DEVELOPER htc dreams |
| 10:04.58 | languish | NOT retail T-mobile G1's |
| 10:05.06 | BruteSource | i knew you would sa that |
| 10:05.15 | languish | even if they were branded |
| 10:05.20 | BruteSource | these were normal people, one is 15 year old |
| 10:05.32 | jasta_ | you guys are both wrong ;) |
| 10:05.39 | neekers | i wasn't paying attention, i suffer from internet induced ad-blindness |
| 10:05.44 | jasta_ | languish: there are terminal apps available on the commercila G1 |
| 10:05.45 | muthu | would be nice to run my own custom brand android ;) |
| 10:05.50 | BruteSource | you just havent foung the gui path to the terminal yet |
| 10:06.00 | jasta_ | BruteSource: no, it's not a terminal emulator, it just is an interactive java app simulating it using Process.open |
| 10:06.05 | languish | likely so. jasta, my point is that while it may be there, it's not in the G1 gui as an option |
| 10:06.36 | languish | it's something that has to be added, isn't it? an apk? or enabled through the dev kit |
| 10:06.37 | jasta_ | languish: i cant parse that statement on account of it being excessively stupid. there is no term app bundled with the G1 system image. |
| 10:06.45 | languish | right |
| 10:06.58 | languish | which is what I've been saying |
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| 10:07.44 | BruteSource | now your saying ash isnt even included at all in android? |
| 10:07.50 | jasta_ | but again, this is not a terminal emulator. even google's is not a terminal emulator, though some naive folks have called it that. |
| 10:08.14 | jasta_ | BruteSource: when we say app, we mean above Android's middleware layer. as in, an "android" apk. |
| 10:08.18 | languish | I'm just using his terminology, not assuming it is |
| 10:08.18 | BruteSource | what no one is calling android a terminal emulator |
| 10:08.21 | jasta_ | below that, of course there is a shell |
| 10:08.30 | jasta_ | you can get one by running adb shell with a device plugged in over usb |
| 10:08.55 | languish | and what swetland was talking about was the shell |
| 10:09.05 | jasta_ | BruteSource: i didn't mean this as in android. i meant this app you guys are referring to. it's a really lame trick, not a terminal emulator. |
| 10:09.08 | BruteSource | you can get one by running "terminal emulator" from the gui |
| 10:09.09 | languish | which again, is not accessible from the GUI |
| 10:09.15 | jasta_ | for instance, you could not run a curses app with this, as it is not really a term :) |
| 10:09.31 | languish | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:09.32 | jasta_ | please stop referring to the GUI incorrectly, both of you. |
| 10:09.42 | BruteSource | thats why its called a terminal "emulator" |
| 10:09.43 | languish | fine, from the menus |
| 10:09.47 | jasta_ | the GUI does not mean the standard system image. |
| 10:10.21 | jasta_ | BruteSource: no, actually, that isn't what a terminal emulator is at all |
| 10:10.26 | BruteSource | its a graphical user interface by black and white defenition, i dont care what google named it, its still a gui |
| 10:10.35 | jasta_ | opening processes and writing to them / reading from them is _NOT_ a terminal emulator. |
| 10:10.35 | languish | *sigh* |
| 10:11.01 | BruteSource | how is it not a gui? |
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| 10:11.33 | BruteSource | its graphical... you use the user use it to interface with the os.... |
| 10:11.35 | jasta_ | BruteSource: please explain your point succinctly. you are lost in semantic hell. |
| 10:11.51 | BruteSource | blah |
| 10:11.53 | jasta_ | i can't argue with this nonsense you are using now. |
| 10:12.08 | languish | "when you look at the screen, you see icons, not a command line" is what he's saying |
| 10:12.15 | BruteSource | i mean you the "user" use it to "interface" with the os |
| 10:12.33 | BruteSource | no thats not what im aying, just dont talk |
| 10:12.33 | jasta_ | BruteSource: that's a ridiculous definition of a GUI |
| 10:12.36 | BruteSource | saying |
| 10:12.54 | languish | and BruteSource, there is NO option in the menuing of the G1 to access a command line interface to the filesystem |
| 10:13.10 | jasta_ | well that's not true either languish. |
| 10:13.16 | BruteSource | thats a rediculous defeniti of a graphical user interface? |
| 10:13.17 | languish | jasta, there is? |
| 10:13.20 | jasta_ | because Android can install applications, you could merely write such an app and load it. |
| 10:13.22 | neekers | command line has always been the opposite of gui |
| 10:13.34 | jasta_ | you could write a terminal emulator, and then install it to your phone. |
| 10:13.37 | languish | jasta, I'll reiterate |
| 10:13.57 | tomgibara | jasta is right, this debate is semantically bankrupt :) |
| 10:14.03 | jasta_ | it's just that writing a terminal emulator would require allocating a UNIX pty, which the Java userland can't do. |
| 10:14.04 | languish | and BruteSource, there is NO option in the default menuing of a retail T-mobile G1 to access a command line interface to the filesystem |
| 10:14.11 | BruteSource | neekers they are windows users they dont even understand the terminology they are talking about |
| 10:14.46 | jasta_ | tomgibara: yeah neither of these fools knows what the hell they are talking about. |
| 10:14.55 | languish | thanks jasta |
| 10:15.00 | jasta_ | well it's true |
| 10:15.01 | BruteSource | jasta_ please explain why the developers android has an app labeled terminal emulator in dev apps then? |
| 10:15.10 | languish | *sigh* |
| 10:15.21 | jasta_ | BruteSource: because Google wrote a crude terminal emulator app, and that app could be loaded onto anyone's phone if you had it. |
| 10:15.31 | jasta_ | and also, other people wrote crude terminal emulator apps |
| 10:15.35 | jasta_ | so they could just load those ones too |
| 10:15.43 | jasta_ | and of course there are SSH apps, so those "look" like terminal apps. |
| 10:15.53 | BruteSource | whywas i able to use it to run top and change inits then? |
| 10:16.10 | jasta_ | because you installed a crude terminal app and you ran it. |
| 10:16.15 | neekers | can you putty into a G1 over usb? |
| 10:16.24 | BruteSource | no this is the one on android |
| 10:16.34 | jasta_ | BruteSource: "on android" meaning the emulator or the G1? |
| 10:16.48 | languish | he doesn't own a G1 |
| 10:16.59 | BruteSource | and by the way straight from tldp.com if it is not a cli its a gui. period |
| 10:17.07 | BruteSource | the source |
| 10:17.09 | languish | he believes everything on the emulator is exactly what the G1 has |
| 10:17.18 | tomgibara | neekers: No because that would require sshd running on the device |
| 10:17.22 | BruteSource | neither of the naive options you just said |
| 10:17.45 | BruteSource | i dont even use a fucking emulator |
| 10:17.46 | jasta_ | BruteSource: so can you explain what you mean? "on android" is the emulator? what precisely did you click on the emulator? |
| 10:17.53 | neekers | tomgibara: ahh, yeah.. good point |
| 10:18.05 | BruteSource | omg you guys are stupd |
| 10:18.13 | languish | BruteSource, what are you running android on? what hardware? |
| 10:18.18 | jasta_ | BruteSource: Android is a platform, not a phone, do you understand that? |
| 10:18.25 | jasta_ | it isn't the emulator either. |
| 10:18.33 | BruteSource | i compiled the kernel for my device as well as the userspace for my device |
| 10:18.51 | jasta_ | Android as a platform can do whatever the hell you want it to do. so i don't relaly know what you're saying. |
| 10:18.57 | BruteSource | i did not add anything to the userspace |
| 10:19.13 | languish | BruteSource, what device? make and model? |
| 10:19.17 | jasta_ | so you're saying the source tree includes a terminal app? yeah, i think that it does in fact. |
| 10:19.25 | BruteSource | the terminal emulator is a real terminal emulator trust me. |
| 10:19.36 | jasta_ | and no, it's not a real terminal emulator. trust _me_. |
| 10:19.45 | BruteSource | your a fool |
| 10:19.57 | jasta_ | the version that google wrote is just a crude process interaction app |
| 10:19.58 | BruteSource | im not ven listening to you anymore |
| 10:20.11 | jasta_ | a real terminal emulator would allocate a UNIX pty |
| 10:20.17 | jasta_ | which android's java userland cannot do, as i said. |
| 10:20.29 | jasta_ | only with a JNI layer could you do this, and to my knowledge, no one has written such a library |
| 10:20.41 | BruteSource | no its not, it can pass commands to the kernel, i halted my device with it, i started top with it, i su'd with it |
| 10:20.52 | jasta_ | that is not a terminal emulator |
| 10:21.06 | jasta_ | a terminal emulator emulates a dumb video terminal. it implements a very particular protocol to do that. |
| 10:21.09 | jasta_ | it does not merely run commands |
| 10:21.27 | jasta_ | if you want evidence of this, try running an app using ncurses with your "terminal" |
| 10:21.49 | jasta_ | it will fail :) |
| 10:21.51 | BruteSource | if it emulates everything a terminal can do its a terminal emulator, period. look it up. |
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| 10:22.14 | muthu | there's something called 'Terminal Emulator' in dev tools |
| 10:22.31 | BruteSource | so it oesnt support ncurses, that just means its a terminal emulator without ncurses |
| 10:22.36 | jasta_ | BruteSource: ok, if you run an app that calls isatty() will it return 1? |
| 10:22.40 | neekers | well, i still have this darn application popping up toast dialogs every minute.... |
| 10:22.58 | BruteSource | yes i know muthu, he doesnt understand at he is going on about. |
| 10:23.09 | jasta_ | hehe, no, i do understand. |
| 10:23.14 | muthu | not sure if its bundled with G1 |
| 10:23.17 | jasta_ | i know precisely what a terminal emulator is, and i know that google idd not produce one |
| 10:23.20 | jasta_ | despite them naively calling it such |
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| 10:23.45 | BruteSource | he uses windows, bought a g1 and thinks he knows about linux now, we are going to see alot of this in the future. |
| 10:24.09 | jasta_ | BruteSource: ok, well you do me a favor. man isatty |
| 10:24.13 | jasta_ | compile a program that calls isatty |
| 10:24.16 | languish | neekers, hold down the HOME button, the last (6?) apps you used will show. pick the one that's your issue, and then when it comes up, see if there's a method IN the app, the end/exit it, or stop the functionality that's bothering you... |
| 10:24.18 | BruteSource | yes they just named it "terminal emulator" to be ironic huh? |
| 10:24.18 | jasta_ | and run it with your "terminal emulator" |
| 10:24.21 | jasta_ | you tell me what it returns. |
| 10:24.41 | jasta_ | because i know that it returns 0. i have used google's terminal emulator app. it is a misnomer. |
| 10:24.50 | jasta_ | it merely opens processes and writes to them / reads from them. |
| 10:24.50 | tomgibara | jasta_: I don't think there's much to gain by pressing this |
| 10:25.18 | BruteSource | yes and thats the defenition of emulation |
| 10:25.39 | jasta_ | BruteSource: so you think isatty only returns true on real dumb video terminals? :) |
| 10:26.29 | neekers | languish: thanks, i just tired that. there is no method in the app yet to exit the app. i haven't written one yet, that's what i'm tryiing to figure out how to do |
| 10:26.32 | BruteSource | i dont care hat works ad what doesnt, thats just the quality of the emulator, not if it is an emulator or not. |
| 10:26.47 | jasta_ | tomgibara: this is really amusing to me. being that i know so much about this topic he knows nothing of :) |
| 10:27.00 | tomgibara | jasta_: That is evident. |
| 10:27.01 | BruteSource | your arguing symantics, so i am done. |
| 10:27.15 | BruteSource | is it? |
| 10:27.22 | jasta_ | and he spells semantics like the anti-virus company |
| 10:27.36 | neekers | heh |
| 10:28.17 | jasta_ | tomgibara: incidentally, i did work on producing a real terminal emulator for android. i quit because i realized that the G1 would be so locked down that getting a shell was useless ;) |
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| 10:28.25 | BruteSource | yes my spelling of course for english being my 3rd language should be perfect |
| 10:29.00 | jasta_ | tomgibara: but maybe if someone gets a custom image flashed i will take another crack at it. it's really simple, you just need a JNI library that can pass through to ioctl for you. |
| 10:29.02 | neekers | what are you're first 2 languages? |
| 10:29.12 | jasta_ | this way you can allocate a UNIX pty to your java layer and use it |
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| 10:29.18 | neekers | your even |
| 10:29.19 | BruteSource | it woulnt be useless a month in after the device has been rooted |
| 10:29.29 | BruteSource | c and java |
| 10:29.32 | languish | BruteSource, just to note. The app you call a terminal emulator, was not made an accessible option on the G1's T-mobile sells to customers. It may be "in the firmware" or can be added as an installable .apk, or accessed by attaching to usb and running adb |
| 10:29.36 | BruteSource | just kidding |
| 10:30.06 | BruteSource | arabic and persian |
| 10:30.11 | neekers | ahh |
| 10:30.32 | neekers | do you live in iran? |
| 10:30.52 | tomgibara | jasta_: Yes it's a small gap to bridge |
| 10:30.57 | BruteSource | i live in portland oregon |
| 10:31.06 | jasta_ | well there's your problem ;) |
| 10:31.06 | neekers | i see |
| 10:31.17 | jasta_ | tomgibara: i'm hoping the native SDK comes out soon-ish so we can do this really nicely |
| 10:31.20 | BruteSource | i dont have a problem |
| 10:31.46 | BruteSource | i have been on linux since redhat minix 1 |
| 10:31.52 | neekers | i live in seattle, i'm caucasian, but i almost married an iranian girl when i was in college, her name was roya |
| 10:31.53 | BruteSource | ooops no redhat |
| 10:32.01 | jasta_ | neekers: ditto ;) |
| 10:32.04 | jasta_ | i mean, about the first two. |
| 10:32.06 | BruteSource | minix 1 |
| 10:32.10 | tomgibara | jasta_: I'm looking forward to the native SDK so that I can rework my image processing algos into C. |
| 10:32.20 | neekers | she told me roya meant "sweet dreams" |
| 10:32.27 | BruteSource | i was going to say redhat, forgot to delete it |
| 10:32.36 | neekers | she was very sweet |
| 10:33.03 | jasta_ | neekers: do you live in seattle proper? |
| 10:33.23 | languish | neekers, did you get the application stopped? |
| 10:33.27 | BruteSource | anyways the emulator dies use a crude method to emulate, but it still emulates, therefor is by defenition a terminal emulator |
| 10:33.35 | neekers | jasta_: actually i live in issaquah, on tiger mountain |
| 10:33.46 | BruteSource | and thats all that needs to be said |
| 10:33.48 | jasta_ | ahh |
| 10:34.03 | jasta_ | neekers: i'm in north seattle area, south of northgate |
| 10:34.07 | BruteSource | also saying menus isnt a gui is just retarded |
| 10:34.17 | neekers | languish: not yet but i think i found some code to exit an application, i'll have it coded up shortly... :o) |
| 10:34.19 | jasta_ | neekers: there's another regular in #android who lives on capital hill |
| 10:34.35 | BruteSource | i am near seattle now |
| 10:34.44 | BruteSource | tacoma washington |
| 10:34.45 | neekers | jasta_: do you guys go to school over there? |
| 10:34.59 | BruteSource | about 30 miles south |
| 10:35.09 | jasta_ | neekers: no, i'm 25 ;) |
| 10:35.17 | neekers | ahh |
| 10:35.45 | BruteSource | jasta do you know western washington? |
| 10:35.53 | BruteSource | wwu i mean |
| 10:36.05 | BruteSource | north of you in bellingham? |
| 10:36.54 | jasta_ | neekers: actually three's one more too. the guy behind slideme.org is from Seattle |
| 10:37.03 | jasta_ | he also wrote the android maven plugin (masa) |
| 10:37.43 | neekers | what do you guys think about having an android app that interfaces with a subscriptoin website? |
| 10:38.14 | jasta_ | what do you mean specifically? |
| 10:38.19 | neekers | a paid subscription website |
| 10:38.36 | jasta_ | i dont know why i'd have any feelings about that. not like i'm required to install it :) |
| 10:38.59 | BruteSource | languish you correct there is no dev apps at all included in commercial release, sorry i was incorrect. |
| 10:39.10 | languish | facepalms |
| 10:39.16 | neekers | well, i'm creating a website that costs $7.99 to use and it requires either an android app or a j2me app to use the website |
| 10:39.32 | jasta_ | i hope it does more than just take your money :) |
| 10:39.41 | neekers | $7.99 per month |
| 10:39.49 | neekers | yes, it does... :o) |
| 10:40.15 | BruteSource | porn? |
| 10:40.19 | jasta_ | deploys the latest build of five and starts syncing his music from scratch |
| 10:40.25 | jasta_ | *waiting* :) |
| 10:40.37 | neekers | i have some open source stuff on sourceforge.com that is pretty popular and i have my reputation to uphold |
| 10:40.48 | neekers | no, it's a gps tracking website |
| 10:41.13 | jasta_ | neekers: i think people care about your reputation less than you do, honestly. |
| 10:41.31 | tomgibara | neekers: There may be restrictions on that in the Google Maps API TOS, I can't remember |
| 10:41.52 | neekers | jasta_: you're probably right, but i have to live with myself |
| 10:42.14 | BruteSource | your upset that i admitted i was wrong? |
| 10:42.21 | neekers | tomgibira: i think you are right |
| 10:43.32 | languish | BruteSource, no.. I just see this as a semi-regular event. You say something, someone corrects you, a... discussion ensues, you eventually realize you were wrong, you applogize, rinse and repeat. :/ |
| 10:44.10 | languish | *apologize |
| 10:44.15 | BruteSource | it happened twice? |
| 10:44.21 | BruteSource | but okay lol |
| 10:44.21 | neekers | basically what i am doing is creating a subscription website that tracks people, it's the same as my open source app so it's actuallly freely available, but i get so many requests from non programmers that i really need to create a subscription site for all the non coders |
| 10:44.26 | languish | :D |
| 10:44.29 | BruteSource | sorry for being human |
| 10:44.47 | languish | don't be, it's entertaining |
| 10:44.55 | tomgibara | neekers: Tracks people for what purpose? |
| 10:46.10 | neekers | tomgibara: it allows someone to put an app on a cell phone and track them on google maps on a website, so a parent can track a kid or an employer can track an employee |
| 10:46.12 | BruteSource | i only thought it did since i was under the impression the release code was identical to what is on g1 and the discussion i just had with swetland about the terminal emulator |
| 10:46.37 | tomgibara | neekers: Then that's probably in violation of the TOS (IANAL blah blah blah) |
| 10:46.38 | BruteSource | just like shaperone already does |
| 10:46.53 | neekers | my open source app has been downloaded 50,000 times so what i'm doing now is feverishly creating a G1 client for my app |
| 10:47.07 | tomgibara | from the TOS: ...but you are not permitted to use the Maps APIs to create \ldblquote Business Asset Tracking\rdblquote applications... |
| 10:47.27 | tomgibara | (that includes people) |
| 10:47.40 | BruteSource | maybe he isnt using the maps app |
| 10:47.47 | BruteSource | api |
| 10:48.08 | neekers | tomgibara: i have been through this ad nauseum in the google maps forum, what i'm doing doesnt break the TOS |
| 10:48.50 | neekers | tracking a cell phone is ok, tracking a *vehicle* requires an enterprise license from google |
| 10:48.54 | BruteSource | i wouldnt think so since there are numerous services like this already |
| 10:49.12 | tomgibara | Well, I'm not going to argue because I have no legal training - I'd just point out that the TOS for Android are different from those for Google Maps |
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| 10:50.09 | tomgibara | The TOS go on to say: ...that track or locate business or government users\rquote field sales or field service personnel |
| 10:50.39 | neekers | yeah, they want you to purchase the enterprise license for $10,000 dollars |
| 10:50.53 | BruteSource | wow |
| 10:51.07 | neekers | when you start using google maps for a business |
| 10:51.46 | BruteSource | okay off to sleep |
| 10:53.08 | neekers | sleep? it's only 4am... :o) |
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| 10:53.33 | languish | 6:53am here :/ |
| 10:53.43 | languish | and I still don't see any sun :( |
| 10:53.50 | neekers | languish: you are in the east coast? |
| 10:53.56 | languish | yeah, ny |
| 10:54.12 | neekers | ahh |
| 10:54.19 | neekers | this.finish(); is what i think i need |
| 10:54.26 | languish | ahh |
| 10:54.27 | languish | heh |
| 10:54.47 | languish | Wish I could have done that sooner with... ahh nevermind |
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| 11:07.06 | neekers | to languish: you usually work at night time? |
| 11:07.15 | neekers | languish: you usually work at night time? |
| 11:08.37 | muthu | is that a long weekend there? |
| 11:08.37 | languish | neekers, no, I work during the day, but review things at night. And I mostly just don't sleep much. |
| 11:08.46 | muthu | everyone seems to be awake |
| 11:09.05 | neekers | how can you survive without sleep? |
| 11:09.20 | languish | *shrug* been like this since I was 6 |
| 11:09.34 | neekers | i usually need about 8 hours a day |
| 11:09.38 | languish | 2 hours/night and I'm solid |
| 11:09.44 | neekers | wow |
| 11:10.01 | languish | don't worry, I'll likely die early for it |
| 11:10.27 | neekers | i've read lots of studies on sleep deprivation... |
| 11:10.45 | neekers | 2 hours is certainly pushing the envelope |
| 11:10.55 | muthu | neekers: it depends |
| 11:10.59 | muthu | not everyone needs 8 hrs |
| 11:11.02 | languish | I'm quite capable of taking looong sleep periods, but.. I just haven't had the need to to be functional |
| 11:11.06 | neekers | that's true |
| 11:11.23 | muthu | 2 hrs might be perfectly fine for some |
| 11:12.13 | languish | Yeah, when I sleep I'm practically comatic |
| 11:12.25 | neekers | muthu: how many hours do you average? |
| 11:12.38 | languish | but if I have to wake up, I do naturally |
| 11:12.46 | muthu | 4 to 5 max |
| 11:13.24 | languish | do you need an alarm to wake up, or do just find yourself awake and not tired after 4 or 5 hours? |
| 11:14.06 | muthu | would like to sleep more.. |
| 11:14.25 | languish | yeah, that's how I feel if I oversleep |
| 11:14.26 | neekers | i sleep when i'm tired. i work from home. i like sleeping especially if i have a hard problem to solve, i sleep on it and let my mind work on it while i'm sleeping |
| 11:15.03 | DJTachyon | lol! |
| 11:15.35 | DJTachyon | Protect our precious, precious DRMd ringtones by only allowing decoding of http, but not filesystem paths or content Uris. |
| 11:15.54 | DJTachyon | comment in the mediaplayerservice.cpp |
| 11:17.02 | muthu | hehe |
| 11:17.48 | neekers | my precioussss |
| 11:18.26 | DJTachyon | okay off to work .. ttyal |
| 11:18.51 | neekers | later |
| 11:21.45 | neekers | if i want to store a username/password to log into a website, should i use a preference or do i need to use sqlLite? |
| 11:22.23 | muthu | either is ok |
| 11:22.36 | neekers | which is less work? :o) |
| 11:22.54 | muthu | preferences |
| 11:23.35 | neekers | thanks |
| 11:24.18 | neekers | ok, i've figured out how to add a menu to my app and now i think i can add a little exit routine |
| 11:25.02 | neekers | i probalby should have started learning a while back but i wanted to wait until i actually had a phone |
| 11:25.31 | muthu | yeah, good timing |
| 11:30.08 | landslide | what do you guys think of azure? too little too late? |
| 11:30.27 | muthu | what's azure? |
| 11:30.35 | cutmasta | cloud computing in MS words |
| 11:30.45 | muthu | oh |
| 11:30.50 | landslide | it's all bs... |
| 11:30.57 | neekers | well, it is microsoft, they have a habit of coming up from behind and dominating |
| 11:30.59 | landslide | reactionary to google appengine. |
| 11:31.13 | muthu | hmm |
| 11:31.17 | neekers | it's the eqivalent of the amazon cloud |
| 11:31.25 | neekers | for windows |
| 11:31.34 | muthu | microsoft can't win because of the closed mindset |
| 11:32.02 | landslide | i don't get it... azure means tinted blue like the sky... devoid of clouds. |
| 11:32.07 | landslide | yet it's for cloud computing? |
| 11:32.15 | landslide | very strange nomenclature. |
| 11:32.44 | neekers | well, there will be 3 major clouds now, amazon, google and microsoft... azure is the reason that amazon started windows in thier cloud last week |
| 11:33.07 | landslide | ah i see |
| 11:33.15 | neekers | each will have significant market share |
| 11:34.27 | muthu | yeah there's a lot of .net stuff running |
| 11:34.52 | kslater | so I've been gorging on Market items on my G1. Is all of that stored on the phone's internal memory? Or does it get stored on the SD card? |
| 11:35.00 | muthu | appengine needs to expand to other languages |
| 11:35.26 | muthu | kslater: all apps live in internal memory |
| 11:35.36 | kslater | hmm |
| 11:35.42 | kslater | seems like we'll all be running out |
| 11:35.54 | landslide | muthu: apparently that is in the works? |
| 11:35.57 | neekers | what i've been wondering is what happens when there are thousands of app on the market, how will you ever find stuff... |
| 11:36.14 | muthu | landslide: guess so |
| 11:36.40 | kslater | and I just got a low memory message from the phone. LOL |
| 11:36.42 | muthu | neekers: isn't there a search? |
| 11:37.13 | neekers | muthu: i think so... |
| 11:38.36 | landslide | muthu: rumour is that it'll be java. |
| 11:39.04 | neekers | kslater: how many apps do you have loaded? |
| 11:39.12 | kslater | too many I guess |
| 11:39.14 | kslater | hehe |
| 11:39.24 | kslater | I'd guess 20 or so? |
| 11:39.35 | neekers | ahh |
| 11:39.40 | kslater | thought it was an all you can eat buffet |
| 11:39.44 | neekers | how many running? |
| 11:39.58 | muthu | landslide: makes sense |
| 11:40.08 | kslater | not many at all |
| 11:40.25 | kslater | I try to keep that number as low as possible, but some apps don't seem to have a way to exit |
| 11:41.12 | *** join/#android WaterDragon (n=nick@note-nopalmer.few.vu.nl) |
| 11:42.00 | neekers | yes, that is the exact problem i'm dealing with |
| 11:42.18 | *** join/#android jbq_ (n=jbq@72.14.224.1) |
| 11:43.07 | kslater | neekers 29 installed apps |
| 11:43.23 | neekers | i found an android book that actually covers 1.0 |
| 11:43.27 | kslater | some of which I only loaded to check out. I'll do a little house cleaning |
| 11:43.31 | neekers | http://commonsware.com/Android/?p=developerlife |
| 11:43.55 | neekers | sounds like a good plan |
| 11:44.01 | landslide | i don't get why they market windows azure as using "popular standards and protocols including SOAP, REST and XML"... how is that relevant? most of microsoft's standards usage are heavily extended... have you ever seen an xsd generated by visual studio? |
| 11:44.21 | landslide | there are so many microsoft extensions, the core xsd is useless. |
| 11:45.00 | neekers | soap is dead... well, maybe not in the enterprise, but it's certainly not used much on web |
| 11:45.13 | *** join/#android BBHoss (n=bbhoss@c-68-62-170-33.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 11:45.14 | kslater | hey, I saw someone mention clearing the browser's cache. This must be internal memory, right? How does one do that? |
| 11:45.31 | landslide | i've been using JSON for everything because it's lean and mean. |
| 11:45.43 | neekers | kslater: i saw that in setting somewhere |
| 11:45.56 | neekers | it deletes all the apps except for the default apps |
| 11:46.19 | neekers | landslide: i agree, json is very nice |
| 11:47.05 | neekers | i like the way how json is automatically an object in javascript |
| 11:47.14 | cutmasta | the word SOAP is wrong |
| 11:47.19 | cutmasta | remove the leading S |
| 11:47.25 | landslide | haha.. |
| 11:47.26 | landslide | misnomer |
| 11:47.27 | cutmasta | and replace it with D |
| 11:47.32 | cutmasta | DIFFICULT |
| 11:47.39 | landslide | doapy |
| 11:47.40 | cutmasta | or COMPLEX |
| 11:47.45 | cutmasta | :) |
| 11:48.41 | cutmasta | json is lightweight |
| 11:48.51 | cutmasta | i like it very much |
| 11:49.00 | cutmasta | using it where i can |
| 11:49.04 | cutmasta | but i also have to use soap |
| 11:49.07 | cutmasta | and i HATE it |
| 11:49.26 | landslide | i think this is what happens with 'trend' technologies.. They solve specific problems, but the hype following them means they are applied in all sorts of places that arn't relevant. |
| 11:49.42 | cutmasta | yap |
| 11:50.04 | landslide | solutions don't often transition across problem spaces... that's why people use the best tool for the job at hand. |
| 11:50.19 | landslide | no point using a screwdriver when you need a hammer. |
| 11:50.33 | landslide | the same is happening with REST. |
| 11:51.31 | cutmasta | :) |
| 11:51.38 | landslide | you'll see people applying that structure in all sorts of places where it doesn't fit. It's an idealism... |
| 11:51.38 | cutmasta | defenitly |
| 11:51.42 | landslide | anyway enough ranting. |
| 11:51.47 | cutmasta | hehe |
| 11:51.53 | cutmasta | is away now for lunch |
| 11:51.54 | neekers | i have used json a number of times, but i mostly just use raw xml most of the time, i use sql server a lot and it can build xml in a query, makes things nice and easy |
| 11:51.56 | cutmasta | bbl |
| 11:53.48 | landslide | true, a project running where I work is using .NET datasets with all the automatic change management using diffgrams, etc... I almost fell off my chair after seeing how the IDE generates stored procs for updates. |
| 11:54.24 | landslide | it really is a mess, but it makes sense if you're trying to apply a solution for all cases... so try and do something similar and you're carrying the baggage of concurrency and integrity... all that jazz. |
| 11:55.24 | neekers | i love sql server, i've been using it for about 10 years, the past 2 years i had to use mysql, it has NO xml support, what a pain in the @ss that was.... |
| 11:55.41 | landslide | so microsoft layer another technology on top, bloat it all to solve these problems... hence ado.net's entity framework. |
| 11:56.00 | *** join/#android WaterDragon (n=nick@note-nopalmer.few.vu.nl) |
| 11:56.08 | landslide | neekers: yeah the in-built xml support is VERY useful. |
| 11:56.32 | neekers | i use .net extensively to build websites but i *do not* use ado.net |
| 11:56.46 | neekers | you're right, it is total bloatware |
| 11:59.39 | neekers | i've developed a nice framework using dotnetnuke and yahoo YUI on the front end to make nice website that look good minus the bloat |
| 12:00.18 | neekers | the android routing project i'm building right now will integrate with one of these websites |
| 12:00.34 | landslide | that sounds cool, what does the routing project actually route? |
| 12:01.27 | neekers | i have 2 projects i'm working on, one will track employees, kids etc and the second is used to plan routes for trucks |
| 12:01.57 | landslide | sounds like projects we are working too, who are you working for? |
| 12:03.48 | neekers | the first project is actually a subscription website of an open source project i have on sourceforge, it's been downloaded 50,000 times and i keep getting requests on youtube from non developers, so i am making a paid version |
| 12:03.49 | landslide | especially the truck routing.. the company i work for is touchstargroup.com |
| 12:04.01 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 12:04.06 | landslide | that's fantastic. |
| 12:04.12 | neekers | the truck routing is fleetsweep.com |
| 12:04.43 | neekers | i've been building that site for 2 years now |
| 12:05.02 | landslide | big job... do you deal with the energy market? |
| 12:05.27 | neekers | no, it acutally is with street sweeping trucks |
| 12:05.40 | landslide | ah.. doh ;) hehe. |
| 12:05.57 | neekers | but the site is generic enough to be *easily* converted to any type of trucking business |
| 12:06.02 | landslide | so you're based out of seattle? |
| 12:06.05 | neekers | yes |
| 12:07.19 | landslide | wow, sounds like a nice niche market. |
| 12:07.49 | landslide | makes sense too, there must be a lot of wasted resource (ie. overlap) in big cities. |
| 12:07.52 | neekers | so do you consider yourself a competitor of gearworks.com and xora.com? |
| 12:08.30 | neekers | yes, i am working with a couple of guys who run a large street sweeping company and manufacture street sweeping trucks |
| 12:08.50 | DJTachyon | hmm make is complaining about not finding javac ... |
| 12:09.46 | neekers | landslide: touchstar is pretty extensive |
| 12:09.58 | *** join/#android dsargeant (n=dsargean@cpe-66-68-19-51.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 12:09.59 | Dougie187 | so theres a new update out eh? |
| 12:10.08 | landslide | more so with xora, but location is just one facet of the business. |
| 12:10.31 | landslide | we really grew up in the energy industry, but there are lots of smaller competitors growing up.. the market is maturing. |
| 12:11.20 | neekers | i've had lots of dealings with xora... |
| 12:11.55 | neekers | i know the guys who built thier vehicle route optimization package |
| 12:15.05 | landslide | cool, I actually work in the australian division... but work pretty closely with the US offices. Locally, pioneered a lot of the mobile technology over the past 15 years or so... So the north american competitors i'm not too familiar with. :) |
| 12:16.00 | neekers | what is your average cost for tracking and scheduling a resource? |
| 12:16.17 | neekers | ballpark figures |
| 12:17.15 | neekers | the people i'm partnering with want to charge $79 dollars a truck but i think that is to much |
| 12:17.43 | neekers | much more than what xora charges |
| 12:17.46 | DJTachyon | bah stupid windows/cygwin |
| 12:17.50 | landslide | that, i couldn't tell you... I'm far too much on the technical side. |
| 12:17.56 | landslide | is that per month? |
| 12:17.58 | neekers | ahh, i see |
| 12:18.06 | neekers | yes, per month |
| 12:18.25 | neekers | i think it should be more like $39 per truck per month |
| 12:18.42 | landslide | i know some of our competitors here in australia are charging around 50-60AUD for a full application and hosted solution. |
| 12:18.51 | landslide | location is just one aspect. |
| 12:19.05 | neekers | whats an aud compared to us? |
| 12:19.12 | landslide | that is like a field service application. |
| 12:19.40 | landslide | right now it's hard to compare... two months ago the AUD to USD was almost at parity (98c to the dollar) now it's like 60c... |
| 12:19.53 | neekers | ahh |
| 12:20.21 | neekers | landslide: so what are you doing with android? |
| 12:20.31 | *** join/#android topeira (n=lucio@unaffiliated/topeira) |
| 12:20.49 | landslide | the economy is really screwed up ;) strange thing is australia is positioned really well being driven by the resource sector and heavily involved with china... no idea why our dollar tanked... |
| 12:20.53 | landslide | something we don't know I guess. |
| 12:21.00 | landslide | not being told by the powers that be. |
| 12:21.06 | neekers | oh.. |
| 12:21.17 | landslide | i'm looking at it as an alternative to windows ce. |
| 12:21.24 | neekers | so your company told you to just learn android? |
| 12:21.28 | landslide | i think it has plenty of technical merits... it's amazing. |
| 12:21.35 | landslide | nah i'm going about it on my own account. |
| 12:21.55 | landslide | i'm usually thinking about things that might happen in the business in a couple of years or so. |
| 12:22.06 | neekers | well for me, after 2 years of j2me programming, i'm really happy to be working with android |
| 12:22.17 | landslide | google have a way with simplification. |
| 12:22.18 | neekers | landslide: exactly |
| 12:22.25 | landslide | actually it's an elegance... |
| 12:23.17 | landslide | their technology is not too simple and it's not overly complex... they seem to exist in that sweat-spot... so far anyway. |
| 12:23.29 | landslide | i've been impressed with the chromium source too.. it has my attention ;) |
| 12:24.30 | neekers | chrome kinda cracks me up, it's like the browser of choice for pron surfers... :o) |
| 12:24.40 | DJTachyon | mmm sweat spot |
| 12:24.48 | *** join/#android neerhaj (i=chatzill@203.115.94.174) |
| 12:25.21 | landslide | they have the benefit of sitting back and really thinking about problems from the ground up.. with little thought or need for legacy... the model for processes, intents and parcels.. solve major issues with the footprint of mobile devices. it really is an elegant solution. |
| 12:25.53 | neekers | yeah... that's what you get when you have an endless supply of money... |
| 12:26.26 | landslide | haha. sweat-spot.. that had to be freudian.. hehe. |
| 12:27.50 | DJTachyon | hehehe |
| 12:28.07 | neerhaj | anyone has a MediaScanner code snippet ? |
| 12:28.30 | DJTachyon | im still trying to build in cygwin :P |
| 12:28.57 | landslide | so far i'm a total n00b. i've built my own emulator image from the source. so i'm starting to play around at that level. the SDK tools are pretty good. |
| 12:29.02 | neekers | what kind of media? |
| 12:29.04 | DJTachyon | make: *** No rule to make target `out/host/windows-x86/framework/droiddoc.jar', |
| 12:29.04 | DJTachyon | needed by `out/target/common/docs/framework-timestamp'. Stop. |
| 12:29.32 | neekers | neerhaj: what kind of media? |
| 12:29.42 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 12:30.04 | DJTachyon | mediascanner.cpp probably |
| 12:30.07 | neerhaj | jpg, png |
| 12:30.23 | neerhaj | i want to see how to initiate a scan |
| 12:30.29 | DJTachyon | oh heh |
| 12:30.37 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-224-182-102.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 12:31.10 | neekers | there is a camera demo in the android docs |
| 12:31.36 | neerhaj | thanks , i'll look into that |
| 12:32.22 | DJTachyon | my goal here is to get the source compiled and add new low-level audio API calls |
| 12:33.15 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 12:33.45 | DJTachyon | such as a tone generator that isn't limited to their enumerated list and calls to the raw audio buffer, and maybe even playback speed functions directly |
| 12:34.12 | DJTachyon | that should at least make some cool audio java applications possible |
| 12:35.01 | *** join/#android bnovc (n=bnovc@67.159.57.227) |
| 12:37.00 | DJTachyon | can anybody help me with that error I posted above? |
| 12:38.11 | neekers | DJ: where is the makefile? |
| 12:39.56 | DJTachyon | i pretty much followed the directions for linux but on cygwin, so i have a mydroid in my home cygwin folder |
| 12:40.17 | DJTachyon | so Makefile is right there, i am checking some of my cygwin packages to make sure i have everything |
| 12:41.15 | DJTachyon | oh jesus .. i forgot mingw/gcc :P |
| 12:42.49 | *** join/#android kslater (n=kslater@206.193.247.78.nauticom.net) |
| 12:43.17 | landslide | i didn't think they supported building android from cygwin? |
| 12:43.21 | *** join/#android krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:43.59 | DJTachyon | they dont |
| 12:44.00 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 12:44.29 | DJTachyon | but im too lazy to break my 64-bit gentoo ULTRA1 SPARC out of moving boxes ;) |
| 12:44.35 | jbq_ | But if you get it to build and run we'll gladly accept patches. |
| 12:45.23 | Dougie187 | jbq_: heres a question, assuming from that comment that you work for google. Supposed someone submits a patch for a phone app, is there any timeline on when that app will then be updated on everyones phones? |
| 12:45.29 | jbq_ | Don't count on being able to get it to work on the sparc, though - for now it's pretty much exclusively 32-bit x86. |
| 12:45.33 | jbq_ | Yes I work for Google. |
| 12:45.38 | DJTachyon | hehe |
| 12:45.47 | neekers | is it possible to have an application start up when the phone is turned on? |
| 12:45.59 | DJTachyon | im on x64 windows xp so this should be even more difficult :P |
| 12:47.01 | jbq_ | Dougie187: it depends on so many factors that it's pretty much impossible to answer. |
| 12:47.25 | Dougie187 | jbq: well, is there a timeline on how often you guys are planning to update phone regularly? |
| 12:47.39 | DJTachyon | hmm wonder if I should use the windows jdk or the cygwin java compiler |
| 12:47.42 | *** join/#android smr (n=patrick@c-98-215-144-59.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 12:47.50 | DJTachyon | the windows jdk im using is x64 |
| 12:48.09 | jbq | Dougie187: well, Google doesn't make phones, so it's really up to the OEMs and carriers... |
| 12:48.25 | jbq | (it's a very complex industry) |
| 12:48.31 | Dougie187 | jbq: so for patches, do you submit the patch to the carrier who then has to test it and apply it to all the phones? |
| 12:48.59 | jbq | That's likely to be the case in may situations, yes. |
| 12:49.05 | jbq | s/may/many/ |
| 12:49.46 | neekers | jbq: do you know if an app can be started when the phone starts up? |
| 12:49.49 | Dougie187 | jbq: im just curious how the whole patching scheme works. That way we can have a basic idea of how long we should expect our patches (assuming they are not patches that introduce more bugs and fail testing) would take to be applied to phones. |
| 12:50.31 | jbq | neekers: yes. An Intent gets broadcast at the end of the boot sequence. You can have a receiver for it. You need a permission for it. |
| 12:50.47 | neekers | ahh, ok, thank you |
| 12:51.02 | kslater | DJTachyon: by cygwin java compiler do you mean gcj? That usually doesn't turn out well. But maybe it works for Android stuff? |
| 12:51.09 | kslater | I'd be surprised actually. |
| 12:51.16 | blount | android.intent.action.BOOT_COMPLETED |
| 12:51.58 | neekers | thanks |
| 12:52.15 | blount | np |
| 12:52.44 | neekers | i am so happy with android, j2me can blow it out my rear end |
| 12:52.56 | jbq | Dougie187: you'll be counting in months for sure (except for some emergency security patches). I can't guess how many months. |
| 12:53.00 | DJTachyon | argh still getting that error |
| 12:53.31 | thoraxe | i don't suppose there's like a logging console? |
| 12:53.42 | Dougie187 | jbq: i figured months would be the measure. Do you guys know how often you plan on giving carriers minor version patches? |
| 12:53.58 | Dougie187 | jbq: or is that not going to be a standard time interval? |
| 12:54.14 | kslater | neekers, I was just listening to Java Posse last night and they talked about the requirements for some J2ME app |
| 12:54.20 | kslater | too many details |
| 12:54.29 | kslater | too much complexity and variance in devices |
| 12:54.34 | TreyB_ | Why would they "give" carriers versions when everyone has access to the repo? |
| 12:55.06 | kslater | and I'd be classified as a Java fan boy |
| 12:55.16 | michaelnovakjr | howdy |
| 12:56.06 | jbq | Dougie187: I don't have much visibility in that process, to be honest. They'll be able to get individual changes from the source code repository for sure. |
| 12:56.28 | Dougie187 | jbq: ok. Thanks |
| 12:56.43 | neekers | the final thing that really pissed me off with j2me was i had purchased a razr2 from sprint to do some gps development and i then found out that sprint blocks gps to developers on all of thier cdma phones, but not iden phones, they wanted 5000 DOLLARS from me to become a partner so that i could get the gps api on my razr.... bunch of @sshats. |
| 12:56.48 | TreyB | Good morning, jbq. Have you slept yet, or did you move east? |
| 12:56.58 | DJTachyon | hmm still getting this: make: *** No rule to make target `out/host/windows-x86/framework/droiddoc.jar', needed by `out/target/common/docs/framework-timestamp'. Stop. |
| 12:57.13 | jbq | TreyB: I have slept, and I'm still in sunny CA (well, for a few more days, rain is coming). |
| 12:57.34 | DJTachyon | the weather is miserable here in NJ/NYC |
| 12:57.42 | kslater | same here in PA |
| 12:57.45 | smr | neekers: carriers do things like that all the time. it's standard practice |
| 12:58.10 | michaelnovakjr | yea its pouring in downtown NYC |
| 12:58.11 | neekers | it took me months of pestering sprint to get them to take the razr back and cancel my account without the termination fee but they finally did |
| 12:58.38 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: you see the new sprint plans? |
| 12:58.42 | michaelnovakjr | nope |
| 12:58.46 | *** join/#android yakischloba (n=jake@209.160.56.254) |
| 12:58.50 | smr | i bought a verizon xv6900 with built in GPS. Verizon wants an extra 9.99 per month to activate its GPS |
| 12:58.50 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: check it out. http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sprint11208plansig0.jpg |
| 12:58.51 | neekers | smr: yes, i know, it's quite disgusting... that's why i'm hoping that android will level the playing field |
| 12:59.01 | *** join/#android plusminus_ (i=81020c44@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-05630504209fdfe9) |
| 12:59.02 | TreyB | Down here in Houston we got our first taste of "winter": 44F and clear skies. |
| 12:59.21 | Dougie187 | TreyB: its 42F here in Florida and clear skies as well. heh |
| 12:59.25 | smr | I had to scrape my car windsheild today for the first time this season :( |
| 12:59.47 | *** join/#android Goosey (n=Goosey@cpe-67-9-174-97.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 13:00.38 | smr | I'm really struggling with writing my first Android app |
| 13:00.42 | *** join/#android VickiWong (n=denvar@p5B054BB3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:01.11 | TreyB | Turn the backlight on and use it as a scraper in the dark ;-) |
| 13:01.20 | neekers | smr: what's it do? |
| 13:01.23 | DJTachyon | i got about 50% done with my first one before I realized I will have to add new API calls to the low-level audio sub-system :P |
| 13:01.43 | smr | The problem is just that there isn't enough documentation out on it yet |
| 13:02.32 | smr | Either it's that or there are some missing features in the API. Right now I'm trying to open an asset or raw resource in random access mode |
| 13:02.49 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-250-123-145.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 13:03.02 | Delvien | smr what app are you writing |
| 13:03.03 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr (n=chatzill@204.141.14.170) |
| 13:03.03 | smr | I can only get an InputStream or a file descriptor. I can't find out how to get random access from either of those |
| 13:03.17 | michaelnovakjr | Dougie187: 99 for everything is pretty good |
| 13:03.29 | Dougie187 | yeah, or the everything family. |
| 13:03.31 | smr | Well, I'm writing a game. I need to be able to load a binary 3D model file. |
| 13:03.43 | Dougie187 | 1500 minutes with unlimited data and messaging for 70 |
| 13:03.52 | Dougie187 | and that comes with BBIS, and GPS Navigation. |
| 13:03.59 | Dougie187 | and 2 lines |
| 13:04.33 | michaelnovakjr | just no android :( |
| 13:04.33 | Delvien | thats not bad Dougie187 |
| 13:04.33 | Dougie187 | its better than the old SERO plans. |
| 13:04.33 | smr | I could load the entire file into one big bytebuffer, but that seems dumb. If I could get a randomaccessfile that would be optimal |
| 13:04.42 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: i know, but that will come at some points. |
| 13:04.47 | Dougie187 | Delvien: yeah i know, pretty sweet. |
| 13:04.53 | smr | michaelnovakjr: get you an HTC Vogue and you can run android on it |
| 13:05.05 | DJTachyon | ill be excited when turn by turn is integrated into the gps google maps |
| 13:05.06 | smr | Sprint sells the vogue |
| 13:05.14 | michaelnovakjr | smr i wrote a bunch of software for it... i had one.... it wasn't that great :) |
| 13:05.26 | smr | I am running android on my vogue now |
| 13:05.29 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: i want android on a Touch Pro |
| 13:05.30 | Delvien | Dougie187: i pay about 50 for 300 mins unlim txt/web |
| 13:05.40 | michaelnovakjr | smr, i ran android m5 on the vogue |
| 13:05.43 | neekers | smr: http://www.helloandroid.com/forum?c=showthread&ThreadID=35 |
| 13:05.45 | DJTachyon | i have a moto Q I would like to see android on :) |
| 13:05.47 | michaelnovakjr | android was good, the phone just sucks |
| 13:05.49 | Dougie187 | Delvien yeah, my wife and I together pay 70 a month for 500 mins each and unlimited text/web. |
| 13:05.52 | smr | m5 was teh suck. |
| 13:06.08 | neekers | smr: didnt read that carefully but the answer might be there |
| 13:06.17 | *** join/#android annodomini (n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda) |
| 13:06.37 | smr | It's decent with the new version. A guy down in NZ is doing most of the porting. It's coming along. Once the input framework is complete we can have a proper on-screen keyboard |
| 13:06.57 | smr | thanks let me try it |
| 13:07.07 | DJTachyon | well that is being integrated into the android os already |
| 13:07.20 | DJTachyon | or are you trying to beat them to it?:) |
| 13:07.33 | smr | cool! I know it's scheduled for a 2009 deliverable. I wonder when it'll get in the SDK |
| 13:07.36 | michaelnovakjr | smr, is it using the built in sms? |
| 13:07.37 | *** join/#android satadru (n=satadru@cpe-69-201-133-23.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 13:07.45 | smr | michael: yes |
| 13:07.53 | michaelnovakjr | that is good |
| 13:07.56 | smr | it's been reworked for CDMA though |
| 13:08.01 | michaelnovakjr | m5 didn;t have one so i wrote one |
| 13:08.01 | Dougie187 | man, michaelnovakjr whats up with your client? |
| 13:08.06 | michaelnovakjr | ? |
| 13:08.37 | Dougie187 | you keep leaving and rejoining. |
| 13:08.43 | michaelnovakjr | yea? |
| 13:08.47 | smr | neekers: thanks! it's not really what I'm looking for though. I don't want to have to reed the local file system |
| 13:09.00 | neekers | ahh |
| 13:09.06 | smr | I want to use the getAsset or openRawResource |
| 13:09.32 | neekers | i saw openrawResource in there |
| 13:09.49 | neekers | down towards the bottom |
| 13:10.14 | smr | still looking... :) thanks! |
| 13:10.59 | DJTachyon | argh |
| 13:11.03 | smr | no, I don't think it has the answer :( |
| 13:11.10 | DJTachyon | still can't get a compile in cygwin :P |
| 13:11.19 | Delvien | so is there a irc client working on the g1 yet? |
| 13:11.21 | michaelnovakjr | DJTachyon: don't have vmware? |
| 13:11.24 | DJTachyon | make: *** No rule to make target `out/host/windows-x86/framework/droiddoc.jar', needed by `out/target/common/docs/framework-timestamp'. Stop. |
| 13:11.26 | smr | why don't you compile in linux? |
| 13:11.28 | d03boy | Delvien, working on it |
| 13:11.35 | smr | I use andLinux on windows |
| 13:11.38 | DJTachyon | because im too lazy to get my nix machine up |
| 13:11.44 | smr | It's so easy |
| 13:11.45 | michaelnovakjr | Delvien: there is an IRC client |
| 13:11.48 | Delvien | d03boy: whats your client called? |
| 13:11.52 | d03boy | ircell |
| 13:11.53 | michaelnovakjr | its floating around somewhere |
| 13:11.58 | Delvien | michaelnovakjr: that works? |
| 13:12.05 | michaelnovakjr | i'm pretty sure |
| 13:12.21 | michaelnovakjr | one of the forum sites has it i believe |
| 13:12.29 | DJTachyon | andLinux eh? |
| 13:12.31 | smr | djtachyon: andlinux.org. Simple setup to get linux running within windows. |
| 13:12.33 | smr | Yes |
| 13:12.38 | Delvien | michaelnovakjr: the two i know of are ircell and androidcxhat neither instasll.or are finiahed |
| 13:12.39 | DJTachyon | oh interesting .. |
| 13:12.41 | smr | It's just one install file |
| 13:13.11 | Delvien | d03boy: oh. i left a comment on your site. |
| 13:13.25 | d03boy | im sure I read it :) |
| 13:13.30 | DJTachyon | sweet .. ill give it a shot .. thanks |
| 13:13.40 | smr | You'll get a minimal ubuntu installation. You'll have apt-get and synaptic. Those make it easy to get your android toolchain built |
| 13:13.47 | DJTachyon | does this run in vmware? |
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| 13:14.00 | *** part/#android bricode (n=bricode@200.122.185.24) |
| 13:14.06 | smr | Plus it integrates with your windows desktop, so you can have X11 windows and MS windows up at the same time |
| 13:14.10 | smr | No, it uses colinux |
| 13:14.18 | smr | it does not use VMWare |
| 13:14.40 | Delvien | d03boy: anticipating it very much. my only concern is how much net traffic it will create (battery life concerns me) |
| 13:14.58 | DJTachyon | nifty |
| 13:15.27 | Delvien | d03boy: im sshed to my server atm asnd it burns a lil bat because od the i/o |
| 13:15.38 | Delvien | of * |
| 13:15.44 | d03boy | Delvien, not much you can really do about that though. Yeah, ssh has to do encryption so I'd imagine ti uses a bit more resources |
| 13:15.48 | smr | You will need to make your linux drive image larger though. It comes with a 2 gig image. You'll probably want to extend it to 40 gigs |
| 13:16.11 | DJTachyon | im remote desktop'd through the telnet port from work ;) |
| 13:16.21 | *** join/#android vbabiy (n=vbabiy@rrcs-24-97-148-190.nys.biz.rr.com) |
| 13:16.45 | DJTachyon | apparently IT hasn't noticed 150k/sec of binary traffic through port 23 :P |
| 13:16.48 | Delvien | d03boy: how far is the project? |
| 13:17.16 | smr | me too! my work blocks just about everything except the standard ones. I use ssh to get home. With tunneling I can do whatever I want |
| 13:17.35 | *** join/#android ieatlint (n=ieatlint@tehinterweb.com) |
| 13:17.58 | DJTachyon | hehe |
| 13:18.00 | *** join/#android mpardo (n=chatzill@75.144.91.181) |
| 13:18.31 | d03boy | Delvien, not that far. The hardest parts are to handle the disconnections and the layout itself |
| 13:18.51 | d03boy | Delvien, I really have only started in the last day or two though |
| 13:19.14 | Delvien | d03boy: cool. cant wait to see it :) |
| 13:19.43 | ieatlint | has anyone else noticed that the adb aliases the command logcat to "lolcat" ? |
| 13:20.12 | Delvien | back to work :( |
| 13:20.48 | *** join/#android Payal (n=fkp021@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
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| 13:24.02 | *** join/#android tethridge (n=tale@207.235.54.1) |
| 13:26.02 | thoraxe | has anyone noticed that AOL IM frequently disconnects but doesn't tell you that it disconnected? |
| 13:26.50 | ieatlint | that's aol... the built in aim app uses aol's sms interface, which will disconnect you after a certain period of inactivity |
| 13:27.10 | DJTachyon | Noooo!! |
| 13:27.21 | DJTachyon | andLinux doesn't support x64 .. bahhh |
| 13:27.41 | DJTachyon | any other thoughts? :) |
| 13:27.49 | DJTachyon | VMWare? :P |
| 13:27.55 | landslide | yep |
| 13:27.59 | landslide | that's what I do. |
| 13:28.05 | landslide | i run esxi on a quad core. |
| 13:28.11 | landslide | it's free. |
| 13:28.21 | DJTachyon | oh cool .. |
| 13:28.44 | DJTachyon | yeah I have a 30% overclocked Q6600 Quad Core on x64 XP |
| 13:28.47 | thoraxe | ieatlint: ah. hopefully someone will come out with a non-sms based client... or hack the builtin client to not do that |
| 13:28.56 | thoraxe | because it basically defeats the purpose of having an im client on the phone |
| 13:29.07 | thoraxe | at the very least, you should get a notification that you've been disconnected |
| 13:29.13 | landslide | arn't google using xmpp for the im client? |
| 13:29.20 | ieatlint | well, you would hack the built in client to send a message every x hours to prevent the timeout |
| 13:29.36 | thoraxe | i'll file a bug for the no-notification |
| 13:29.42 | TreyB | That'll help battery life, for sure. |
| 13:30.14 | smr | You could build a web service on pidgin IM's libraries then consume it from an android web app |
| 13:30.29 | michaelnovakjr | or just write a native one :) |
| 13:30.29 | thoraxe | smr: oooh... pidgin on android would be hot |
| 13:30.30 | ieatlint | depending on how talky aol's OSCAR is, it won't affect battery life |
| 13:30.53 | ieatlint | pidgin is gtk, which android will never support |
| 13:30.54 | thoraxe | oscar is pretty talky -- you get all the signon/signoff notifications and away/idle information, no? |
| 13:31.07 | ieatlint | yeah, you do |
| 13:31.08 | thoraxe | booo |
| 13:31.09 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-224-176-247.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 13:31.13 | smr | pidgin is but not the network code |
| 13:31.15 | ieatlint | but i meant more keepalive type stuff |
| 13:31.26 | DJTachyon | what about trillian? |
| 13:31.26 | thoraxe | i would give up battery life to have a proper aim client |
| 13:31.31 | smr | the network code is ui agnostic |
| 13:31.43 | michaelnovakjr | you could just write a java aim api if there isn't one already |
| 13:31.50 | michaelnovakjr | then tie a UI to it |
| 13:31.50 | smr | besides, if the network code were running on a server somewhere it wouldn't matter. |
| 13:31.57 | ieatlint | libpurple is the code you mean, and it's written in c with various libraries that are not presently on android... it would be an impressive job to get it working methinks |
| 13:32.12 | ieatlint | expect aol to be writing a client methinks |
| 13:32.18 | smr | michael: you are right, but I think using a web service would be better on the battery life. |
| 13:32.50 | thoraxe | ieatlint: that would be nice. |
| 13:32.59 | thoraxe | i need to file a bunch of IMAP bugs |
| 13:33.05 | smr | yeah, libpurple ;). But I don't know that you can install native libraries on android without some hackery. Can you do it through an apk? |
| 13:33.21 | michaelnovakjr | smr, battery life? not if you wrote it correctly :) |
| 13:33.42 | ieatlint | apk is dalvik jvm code only... so you can do android libs, but not c |
| 13:33.42 | *** join/#android annodomini (n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda) |
| 13:33.43 | smr | how often does that happen? |
| 13:33.47 | michaelnovakjr | thoraxe: IMAP is being worked on |
| 13:33.58 | michaelnovakjr | thoraxe: so good idea :) |
| 13:34.06 | ieatlint | it is possible to cross compile native code... i've done some hello world apps in c running on it |
| 13:34.34 | ieatlint | but the lack of root is a huge restriction... i'm vainly snooping around now trying to learn more... already picked up a few interesting tidbits |
| 13:34.36 | thoraxe | michaelnovakjr: yeah, it does some WEIRD things. |
| 13:34.59 | michaelnovakjr | thoraxe: i've heard, its going to improve |
| 13:35.10 | thoraxe | like... never ever ever ever figuring out you deleted a folder on the server :P |
| 13:35.15 | thoraxe | but yes, off to file bugs I go |
| 13:35.23 | *** join/#android invain (n=invain@218.209.85.168) |
| 13:35.28 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 13:35.30 | smr | Sure, but I think the intent is for any application to have native code that isn't already there in Android distribution |
| 13:35.59 | smr | I mean "I don't think the intent was" |
| 13:36.18 | michaelnovakjr | smr you dont need native code for an im app |
| 13:36.30 | DJTachyon | heh there are like 3 flashlight apps up on marketplace already |
| 13:36.33 | smr | I know. ieatlint was talking about native code |
| 13:37.21 | ieatlint | yeah, basically... there are a handful of potential uses for native code |
| 13:37.26 | ieatlint | none of which involve the gui |
| 13:37.45 | ieatlint | but if you wanted to run something as a daemon... native is better |
| 13:37.46 | smr | Does having an idle cellular TCP connection drain battery life? |
| 13:37.56 | ieatlint | no |
| 13:38.19 | ieatlint | there are no keepalive messages, and it only uses battery when transmitting/recieving |
| 13:38.35 | smr | true, but for maximum compatibility, I wouldn't count on being able to install a daemon or any other native code |
| 13:39.00 | ieatlint | i'm not talking compatibility :) |
| 13:39.19 | smr | K. Guess I don't know what we're talking about anymore! |
| 13:39.51 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-224-187-45.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 13:39.54 | ieatlint | half it's the classic wanting to do what i'm not supposed to, and the other half is the potential to add functionality to the phone |
| 13:40.26 | smr | I gotcha. Well, I'd love to write some python myself. I hope someone releases a python->dalvik compiler |
| 13:40.31 | ieatlint | for instance, i could right now compile a tiny proxy and run it on the device, combine it with the adb and its port forwarding, and have a half-assed tethering setup |
| 13:40.55 | smr | I wrote a socks 5 proxy for Windows Mobile and .NET 2.0 |
| 13:41.18 | DJTachyon | i just realized ive never installed vmware before :P |
| 13:41.22 | smr | Well, hacked together, mostly. I didn't write the SOCKS5 code from scratch. I just ported it to the compact framework |
| 13:41.31 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@69.36.227.135) |
| 13:42.03 | *** join/#android jbq_ (n=jbq@72.14.224.1) |
| 13:42.04 | ieatlint | that describes most applications... stringing together existing pieces of code into something new |
| 13:42.40 | smr | You should see some of the crap I've delivered during my years as a developer :D |
| 13:43.57 | ieatlint | there's something annoying about not even having the cp command on the shell and needing to use cat :P |
| 13:44.03 | DJTachyon | sooo anybody want to guide me through installing ESXi |
| 13:44.15 | landslide | it's pretty simple |
| 13:44.24 | landslide | just make sure you have a supported network card |
| 13:44.28 | DJTachyon | just want to make sure i dont miss anything |
| 13:44.34 | landslide | i ended up buying a gigabit server grade one. |
| 13:44.49 | DJTachyon | i have two integrated NICs |
| 13:44.52 | DJTachyon | both gigabit |
| 13:45.03 | DJTachyon | EVGA 780i mobo |
| 13:45.15 | landslide | same here with ASUS.. but not supported.. lemme try and find a link. |
| 13:45.22 | TreyB | They give gigabit nics away as party favors these days. |
| 13:45.23 | DJTachyon | bah |
| 13:46.12 | Death_Syn | he's right |
| 13:46.25 | Death_Syn | I can get a gigabit realtek for <$15 anytime I want |
| 13:46.33 | DJTachyon | i think i need to get the VMware concept more concrete in my brain first |
| 13:46.33 | Death_Syn | often times under $10 |
| 13:46.40 | DJTachyon | looks like I have a misunderstanding of how it works |
| 13:47.21 | TreyB | DJTachyon: how so? You install it, boot the virtual machine, and then install your OS. |
| 13:47.24 | DJTachyon | im an DSP Software/Firmware engineer .. I don't usually get so high level :) |
| 13:47.33 | DJTachyon | interesting |
| 13:47.55 | TreyB | DJTachyon: Think whole-machine-ICE |
| 13:48.05 | landslide | http://www.vm-help.com/esx/esx3.5/Whiteboxes_SATA_Controllers_for_ESX_3.5_3i.htm |
| 13:48.15 | DJTachyon | right .. hmm .. well the install is a linux binary on an iso |
| 13:48.20 | DJTachyon | how do you install that from within windows? |
| 13:48.40 | TreyB | Point the virtual machine's virtual CD/DVD at the iso image. |
| 13:48.50 | TreyB | It'll boot right into it. |
| 13:48.57 | landslide | on windows you install vmware infrastructure client |
| 13:49.00 | DJTachyon | -_- .. |
| 13:49.03 | DJTachyon | ahhhh |
| 13:49.07 | DJTachyon | that was the missing piece |
| 13:49.09 | DJTachyon | hehe |
| 13:49.35 | DJTachyon | i knew some sort of client was needed or something |
| 13:50.03 | landslide | you just point your browser to the IP of the ESXi box and it'll download the infrastructure install. |
| 13:50.12 | landslide | there is a link on the homepage. |
| 13:50.17 | DJTachyon | interesting |
| 13:50.20 | landslide | http://ultimatewhitebox.com/ might be useful too |
| 13:50.35 | DJTachyon | well either way I would prefer to have something running native in windows |
| 13:50.47 | DJTachyon | the whole point was to not have to put another box together |
| 13:50.53 | landslide | i compiled the android source (use make -j 5) for parallel jobs with the quad core shared to ubuntu 8.04 in under an hour. |
| 13:51.00 | DJTachyon | cool |
| 13:51.16 | DJTachyon | my spare machine is running media portal on xp in my living room :P |
| 13:51.27 | landslide | i didn't time it, but it was quicker than what people suggested my expectations be. |
| 13:52.01 | DJTachyon | maybe i should just dual boot this machine |
| 13:52.08 | DJTachyon | i have a spare partition set aside for it |
| 13:52.21 | DJTachyon | hurmm |
| 13:52.30 | landslide | wouldn't hurt... |
| 13:52.45 | DJTachyon | just need to move my swap file back over |
| 13:53.46 | landslide | good luck, i'm crashing ;) later. |
| 13:53.46 | DJTachyon | gnight, thanks for your help |
| 13:53.46 | landslide | no probs. |
| 13:58.43 | *** join/#android anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07E6A4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:58.44 | *** join/#android mlester (n=mlester@ip70-171-23-245.ga.at.cox.net) |
| 13:59.20 | mlester | hey I am trying to mount an image in the emulator and when I try and push a file to the sdcard image it says its read only |
| 13:59.26 | Disconnect | jasta: k-9 is yours? |
| 14:00.17 | mlester | can someone help me with this issue |
| 14:00.18 | DJTachyon | will vmware workstation run without a slave PC? |
| 14:00.52 | DJTachyon | mlester, just use an app like winiso to copy files into the image |
| 14:00.56 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 14:01.15 | DJTachyon | or does your application need to write to it? |
| 14:01.48 | mlester | nah it doesn't but I just want to know why it mounts the image as readonly |
| 14:02.11 | mlester | even if I use the shell and try and mkdir in there its still read only |
| 14:02.22 | *** join/#android unix_lappy (i=614133e2@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-827b970a7a1c678e) |
| 14:03.18 | jbq_ | do you have multiple emulators running? |
| 14:03.41 | mlester | not that I am aware of |
| 14:03.51 | jbq_ | (only the first emulator has r/w access to the disk images, subsequent instances use them r/o) |
| 14:04.06 | *** join/#android jSpazz (n=jSpazz@141.117.174.33) |
| 14:04.17 | mlester | ok |
| 14:08.07 | DJTachyon | mlester: trying a reboot might be a good idea |
| 14:08.14 | mlester | yeah that got it |
| 14:08.26 | DJTachyon | :) |
| 14:08.31 | mlester | I think daemon tools had write priviledges |
| 14:08.39 | mlester | and I thought I killed it but I didnt |
| 14:08.49 | DJTachyon | wants his replacement G1 already |
| 14:08.58 | mlester | u broke it already |
| 14:09.11 | DJTachyon | nah the accelerometer/compass package is defective |
| 14:09.16 | mlester | thanks btw |
| 14:09.19 | DJTachyon | np |
| 14:09.26 | mlester | ah how can u tell |
| 14:09.37 | kslater | yeah, how do you know it's bad? |
| 14:09.39 | *** join/#android malcolm_ (n=malcom@151.65.91.174) |
| 14:09.53 | DJTachyon | well the AMAZEd and PACMAN and Street View Compass mode all do not work |
| 14:09.58 | Disconnect | has serious doubts about his wifi antenna |
| 14:10.09 | DJTachyon | amazed just sits there and crashed |
| 14:10.15 | DJTachyon | pacman darts to the left and stays there |
| 14:10.27 | DJTachyon | and compass mode in maps street view just looks at the ground |
| 14:10.32 | ieatlint | well, i just found out how to get into the bootloader... but can't interface with it |
| 14:11.08 | DJTachyon | there is a fairly long thread on the t-mobile forums concerning it |
| 14:11.22 | mlester | him I might need to check that my street view works wierd |
| 14:11.37 | DJTachyon | try pacman or amazed |
| 14:11.48 | mlester | yeah downloading right now |
| 14:12.24 | DJTachyon | or the video player |
| 14:12.38 | DJTachyon | that is supposed to turn sideways like the iphone when you rotate it |
| 14:13.46 | DJTachyon | luckily with all the syncing with google, swapping sim cards or master resetting doesnt hurt too much |
| 14:14.29 | DJTachyon | just personalization settings, ringtones, backgrounds, desktop, etc |
| 14:14.34 | mlester | yeah the google thing is really helpful |
| 14:14.51 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@nat/google/x-acb2187c053539f6) |
| 14:15.03 | DJTachyon | wow .. @nat/google/x-acb2187c053539f6 |
| 14:15.10 | DJTachyon | fancy |
| 14:16.00 | *** join/#android michaelnovakjr__ (n=chatzill@pool-96-224-190-168.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 14:16.22 | Disconnect | DJTachyon: downloads, ringtones, app data, sent/received sms... there's a very long list of "skipped" and a very short list of "saved" (email, contacts, calendar) |
| 14:16.33 | *** join/#android tmccrary (n=tmccrary@68.78.185.226) |
| 14:16.47 | DJTachyon | i dont care about most of that stuff .. and because all the apps can be quickly downloaded again |
| 14:17.04 | DJTachyon | i am curious how google has addressed the "bought apps" if you reset |
| 14:17.08 | *** join/#android jt436 (n=jtomlins@sdserver66.mforma.com) |
| 14:17.37 | thoraxe | lol you can't even move imap mail between folders? |
| 14:17.42 | DJTachyon | your memory card doesnt disappear .. so its all there, just needs to be setup |
| 14:17.45 | Disconnect | thoraxe: erm, you can't even delete imap mail |
| 14:17.50 | thoraxe | yeah |
| 14:17.55 | thoraxe | well, you can move it to the "local trash" |
| 14:17.56 | thoraxe | haha |
| 14:17.57 | Disconnect | DJTachyon: none of the data is on the memory card |
| 14:18.18 | thoraxe | i like that it doesn't sort accounts by any particular order either |
| 14:18.21 | thoraxe | just the order added |
| 14:18.21 | Disconnect | thoraxe: it doesn't push read/deleted state to teh server in any sort of reliable way (some read/unread gets pushed, no deletes) |
| 14:18.32 | thoraxe | Disconnect: is there an active bug for state? |
| 14:18.53 | thoraxe | 1029 is for delete |
| 14:19.00 | Disconnect | no, it got closed "oh we fixed this in engineering already" .. lot of good it does for the rest of us |
| 14:19.00 | thoraxe | and there's a spurious comment about state in general |
| 14:19.25 | thoraxe | Disconnect: which bug are you referring to? |
| 14:20.51 | Disconnect | actually i was thinking of 1050 (doesn't poll) but according to romainguy its all one bug anyway |
| 14:21.21 | Laz | nothing on reflashing G1's yet? |
| 14:22.09 | thoraxe | ahh, 1050 is different... that's not a super concern for me |
| 14:22.19 | thoraxe | but i don't think romain understands the issue |
| 14:22.26 | DJTachyon | i am surprised how sparsly commented the android cpp is |
| 14:23.19 | DJTachyon | brb reboot |
| 14:23.31 | DJTachyon | (trying out an eval of VMware Workstation) |
| 14:23.41 | mlester | has anyone notice that sometimes the market on the g1 has trouble downloading apps even when your on wifi |
| 14:23.50 | DJTachyon | not here mlester |
| 14:23.53 | DJTachyon | always fast |
| 14:24.00 | DJTachyon | even on EDGE |
| 14:24.06 | DJTachyon | download 10apps at once :) |
| 14:24.14 | mlester | yeah its fast when it works but sometimes it just cant get started |
| 14:24.18 | mlester | dang thats nice |
| 14:24.29 | DJTachyon | it just queues them all up and goes |
| 14:24.32 | DJTachyon | i never have a problem |
| 14:24.48 | mlester | sometimes it is fast but like now |
| 14:25.05 | mlester | internet is fast but the apps I am trying to download just wont start downloading |
| 14:25.09 | DJTachyon | hmm dunno .. until they build the cell tower in the back parking lot here, I have no reception |
| 14:25.15 | mlester | stays in the starting app phase |
| 14:25.19 | DJTachyon | so i can't compare |
| 14:25.31 | DJTachyon | anyway i gotta reboot this machine .. brb |
| 14:26.36 | smr | Anyone have T-Mobile 3G? |
| 14:27.59 | Death_Syn | smr: i do |
| 14:28.08 | smr | How is it? |
| 14:28.16 | Death_Syn | its pretty fash |
| 14:28.19 | Death_Syn | er fast |
| 14:28.23 | Death_Syn | get just under 900kbps |
| 14:28.27 | *** join/#android dipen (n=fdd001@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 14:29.25 | thoraxe | Disconnect: if you rename an imap folder on the server and refresh the mail account, you have both the old folder name AND the new folder name. |
| 14:29.31 | Disconnect | ooh neat |
| 14:30.06 | Death_Syn | my office is on the border of edge/3g |
| 14:30.16 | Death_Syn | so i often get edge depending on my phone's orientation |
| 14:30.16 | Disconnect | i can't get it to stay on wifi if my life depended on it tho :( |
| 14:30.16 | thoraxe | Disconnect: http://pastie.org/302248 <-- do you think this bug text is adequate to file? |
| 14:30.32 | Death_Syn | though most anywhere else I get 3g |
| 14:30.53 | *** join/#android tmarble (n=tmarble@user-38q4et6.cable.mindspring.com) |
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| 14:31.30 | Disconnect | thoraxe: looks good. |
| 14:31.43 | Disconnect | has 3-4 more bugs to file this morning. once i get firefox to stop crapping itself. |
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| 14:38.44 | smr | Anyone have the Android Market APK? |
| 14:39.51 | Delvien | smr you remove it? hehe |
| 14:40.18 | smr | No :) I'm running android on a different phone and the distribution doesn't include the market |
| 14:40.28 | hexa | is it possible to make a c/cpp backend app on android ? is there doc on the toolchain needed , libs avail etc? |
| 14:40.35 | Dougie187 | smr: are you running android from source? or from the SDK? |
| 14:41.36 | smr | It's based on the SDK |
| 14:42.03 | smr | Though the APKs from the source are included *i think* |
| 14:42.24 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 14:42.35 | Dougie187 | smr: it's based on the SDK? |
| 14:42.43 | smr | Yes |
| 14:43.11 | zhobbs | Hmm, calling stopSelf() in a Service still leaves the process alive, is that normal? |
| 14:43.16 | *** join/#android DannyB (n=dannyb@c-69-139-151-245.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 14:43.30 | Dougie187 | smr what do you mean by that? |
| 14:44.04 | zhobbs | smr, what device? |
| 14:44.14 | thoraxe | http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=1097 <-- fun. |
| 14:44.38 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
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| 14:45.47 | smr | I have the HTC Vogue, aka Verizon xv6900 |
| 14:46.02 | zhobbs | thoraxe: I agree with the poster though...would be nice to have an option for a notification icon for IM status |
| 14:46.37 | jbq | it's sometimes surprisingly hard to know when you've been disconnected - sometimes the socket looks all right but in reality it's dead. |
| 14:46.52 | *** join/#android matt_c_ (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
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| 14:47.37 | thoraxe | zhobbs: i'm the poster :P |
| 14:47.52 | Death_Syn | guh, in the videos I've made so far for my G1, I seem to either get working video or audio |
| 14:47.54 | thoraxe | jbq: i consider "disconnected" when the android im client shows that you are disconnected |
| 14:47.55 | Death_Syn | but not both |
| 14:47.58 | Death_Syn | :( |
| 14:48.06 | thoraxe | so, if you reach that state and you didn't initiate the disconnect, you should get a notification |
| 14:48.11 | thoraxe | we can't help if the aol side of the house dies |
| 14:48.27 | thoraxe | but once the android side of hte house decides that the party is over, it should turn out the lights |
| 14:48.39 | thoraxe | instead it just passes out on the couch and you wake up with the dog licking your face |
| 14:48.42 | thoraxe | :) |
| 14:48.43 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 14:48.51 | Disconnect | jbq: also, istr aim allows for keepalive/are-you-there pings |
| 14:48.52 | smr | I quit T-Mobile because I got sick of waiting for 3g. So I went to Verizon and got the xv6900 because I knew it could run Android. Then T-Mobile announced they'd be the first with android and are installing 3g. I was sad :(... |
| 14:48.53 | jbq | ...assuming that the android side of the house knows that the party is over... |
| 14:49.09 | jbq | pings = battery suckers. |
| 14:49.15 | *** join/#android wastrel (n=wastrel@nylug/member/wastrel) |
| 14:49.23 | thoraxe | jbq: well, if i leave AIM on all day, it frequently disconnects. so, at some point, it is deciding the party is over. it just never tells me |
| 14:49.59 | thoraxe | or, to rephrase -- the android aim client is at some point deciding the connection is gone. it doesn't provide any notification of the fact that it made this decision -- it simply updates the client to show it's no longer connected |
| 14:50.08 | Death_Syn | nm |
| 14:50.10 | Death_Syn | now I've got it working! |
| 14:50.12 | Death_Syn | yay! |
| 14:50.15 | jbq | ah, I see. |
| 14:50.26 | thoraxe | so until you go into the IM client, you have no idea that it "disconnected" |
| 14:50.36 | thoraxe | you basically have to manually run to the IM client every once in a while to see if you're still there |
| 14:50.36 | jbq | gotcha. |
| 14:50.38 | *** join/#android cbeust (n=cbeust@69.36.227.135) |
| 14:50.52 | thoraxe | i'll append that statement to the bug |
| 14:51.31 | jbq | (sorry about the confusion) |
| 14:51.47 | *** join/#android oinkboink (n=dingdong@p5B125BE0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:51.54 | Disconnect | christ. no way to mute an ongoing notification. |
| 14:52.07 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 14:53.55 | smr | Android market doesn't seem to be in the git repository. Is it not open source? |
| 14:54.06 | Disconnect | (eg email comes in, if you have a 45 second ringtone you are getting 45 seconds of sound, period) |
| 14:54.19 | Disconnect | smr: nope. market is closed, gmail is closed, maps (iirc) is closed.. |
| 14:54.34 | smr | bollocks |
| 14:54.37 | jbq | smr: correct. It's not part of the platform. |
| 14:54.43 | Disconnect | (and before certain people freak out at me, i don't think thats a problem. i think its a problem that those apps get to use special apis in a so-called "open" platform..) |
| 14:54.50 | smr | I guess I'll not find the market APK then :( |
| 14:55.18 | ttuttle | Disconnect: I assume that the APIs will eventually be documented and shared, after Google is comfortable with them. |
| 14:55.41 | jbq | ...or the apps will be modified to only use public API (which is what I'm doing right now). |
| 14:55.41 | Disconnect | ttuttle: given that they've pretty much said no to much of it (eg the marketplace api that allows non-interactive installation/removal of apps) I doubt it.. |
| 14:55.45 | cbeust_ | smr: What do you want to do with Market? |
| 14:55.48 | Disconnect | thats a much better option :) |
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| 14:56.02 | smr | I would assume they aren't being shared because of the cellular providers. Market payments will be charges on your phone bill |
| 14:56.18 | ttuttle | Disconnect: ...they can share them for the benefit of people porting Android, and simply lock them on the G1 using the security system. |
| 14:56.34 | zhobbs | smr: someone can pull the apk off a G1 |
| 14:56.38 | zhobbs | not sure if it works |
| 14:56.42 | ttuttle | zhobbs: How? |
| 14:56.54 | smr | I wonder if it won't work because it's probably tied to T-Mobile somehow |
| 14:57.02 | Disconnect | smr: thats a server-side function though. |
| 14:57.08 | zhobbs | ttuttle: adb pull /system/app/Vending.apk |
| 14:57.33 | smr | Right. But what if the server side function is necessary for the market client to function. |
| 14:57.39 | ttuttle | has a copy now. |
| 14:57.40 | ttuttle | Cool. |
| 14:57.48 | Disconnect | i don't think its a problem that - eg - gmail app is closed source and uses funky google-only server apis. (it'd be nice if not but whatever..) its simply the restricted platform apis that I object to. |
| 14:57.59 | smr | longs for Vending.apk |
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| 14:58.08 | Death_Syn | smr: I'd seen somewhere on tmobile site that market billing would be through google checkout |
| 14:58.19 | smr | I read today it would be on your phone bill |
| 14:58.30 | smr | patrick.chasco@gmail.com |
| 14:58.31 | Death_Syn | weird |
| 14:58.33 | jbq | Disconnect: actually, we've been thinking of ways to allow a third-party marketplace to install its apps with the same APIs as teh built-in marketplace. |
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| 14:58.34 | *** mode/#android [+o morrildl] by ChanServ |
| 14:58.40 | ttuttle | morrildl: morning |
| 14:58.45 | Disconnect | jbq: cool :) |
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| 14:58.56 | Death_Syn | lovely |
| 14:58.58 | ttuttle | tries installing Market on emulator. |
| 14:59.02 | Death_Syn | i can now watch my torchwood in the video player |
| 14:59.04 | smr | good idea |
| 14:59.14 | Disconnect | (I also think its balls that marketplace apps aren't allowed in the marketplace, but again, that doesn't impact "open platform" so much so..) |
| 14:59.20 | *** join/#android omv1975 (n=Mihnea@dublin-proxy.adobe.com) |
| 14:59.26 | thoraxe | jpq so you're talking about a "community marketplace" app that would allow non-official stuff to be downloaded/installed? |
| 14:59.29 | zhobbs | ttuttle: it would install, but I couldn't authenicate on the emulator |
| 14:59.31 | smr | I am really wanting to abandon this verizon contract so I can go back to T-Mobile |
| 14:59.34 | ttuttle | zhobbs: hmm |
| 14:59.49 | smr | All they've got is GPRS in my location though :( |
| 14:59.52 | thoraxe | smr: keep calling verizon until they let you out of your contract for free. how long have you been a customer? |
| 15:00.24 | smr | Well, the problem is that I've moved to my girlfriend's contract. She gets really annoyed by my gadget-mongering |
| 15:00.31 | smr | last time i brought it up she got pissed |
| 15:00.33 | ttuttle | Hmm, the market seems to just exit when I run it. |
| 15:00.36 | ttuttle | smr: lol |
| 15:00.44 | BHSPitWeb | Yeah, just keep calling and asking for managers and then play "If You Love Someone Set Them Free" over the speaker |
| 15:00.53 | ttuttle | BHSPitWeb: ... |
| 15:00.54 | smr | I've only been on Verizon for about four months |
| 15:00.59 | zhobbs | ttuttle: yeah, it asked for credentials and then exits...now when I run it it just exits |
| 15:01.04 | BHSPitWeb | ttuttle: by The Police. |
| 15:01.07 | thoraxe | oh |
| 15:01.09 | thoraxe | you're screwed |
| 15:01.15 | ttuttle | BHSPitWeb: heh |
| 15:01.24 | thoraxe | i was a tmobile customer since 1998 when they were voicestream. they let me out of one of my 2 lines |
| 15:01.32 | thoraxe | "we can not charge you, but we can't waive the fee" |
| 15:01.41 | smr | it looks like the market apk is probably tied to the provider |
| 15:01.46 | BHSPitWeb | Does Android have any inherent ability to run old J2ME apps? |
| 15:01.47 | ttuttle | smr: /me bets it's just crashing. |
| 15:01.51 | ttuttle | BHSPitWeb: No, thank god. |
| 15:01.55 | jbq | thoraxe: well, it's been a thought experiment more than anything else at this point, i.e. a bunch of engineers brainstorming on what it would take to make such an API available to third-party apps, without weakening the security model. There's a huge gap between a 10-minute brainstorm in a hallway and a tested, documented and supported API! |
| 15:02.07 | thoraxe | oh sure |
| 15:02.09 | ttuttle | BHSPitWeb: It appears that GLU (the maker of Bonsai Blast and Brain Genius Deluxe) has a J2ME-to-Android thing set up. |
| 15:02.15 | ttuttle | BHSPitWeb: Unfortunately, it makes all their apps 7 MB. |
| 15:02.18 | thoraxe | i mean, code.google kindof already is the "marketplace" |
| 15:02.34 | thoraxe | you just have to manually go there and download apks |
| 15:02.35 | thoraxe | haha |
| 15:02.41 | thoraxe | anyone know if there is an ipsec vpn client yet? |
| 15:02.43 | davidw | so |
| 15:02.50 | davidw | is it possible to even run native code on the phones? |
| 15:02.54 | ttuttle | Yeah, the problem with Market appears to be "com.android.vending.TosChecker$TosDialogAccessor$TosDialog.onStart(): Could not read ToS URL from GServices." |
| 15:02.57 | davidw | your own phone, for instance |
| 15:03.00 | zhobbs | does Bonsai Blast use OpenGL? |
| 15:03.02 | smr | davidw: with some hackery |
| 15:03.05 | ttuttle | zhobbs: Dunno. |
| 15:03.16 | Disconnect | thoraxe: vpn requires root. root isn't safe for the people, so ... no. |
| 15:03.17 | smr | I can run native code on my phone |
| 15:03.30 | ttuttle | smr: How? |
| 15:03.36 | BHSPitWeb | Me too, and I'm on WinMo :( |
| 15:03.43 | davidw | smr, yeah? |
| 15:03.48 | smr | I'm not using a G1 |
| 15:03.52 | smr | my phone is unlocked |
| 15:03.55 | BHSPitWeb | In a few ways, it's more open than Android phones |
| 15:03.58 | ttuttle | Also, has anyone looked at the source code for the Term app? There's an undocumented class called android.os.Exec -- you can run native code from Java! |
| 15:04.02 | zhobbs | I need to learn how to make games....just wondering if OpenGL is the route to take.... |
| 15:04.15 | ttuttle | zhobbs: Depends what you're doing, I guess. |
| 15:04.16 | zhobbs | ttuttle: yeah, I saw that |
| 15:04.38 | smr | I've got a shell on mine too |
| 15:04.46 | smr | I can telnet to it now :) |
| 15:04.53 | jt436 | zhobbs: you need to msg me about games ;) |
| 15:05.16 | smr | zhobbs: yes, it is |
| 15:05.21 | BHSPitWeb | zhobbs: or go to college :P |
| 15:05.34 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 15:05.43 | smr | I'm writting a game, or at least trying. I'm new to Java and Android development |
| 15:05.51 | *** join/#android treb0r (n=rob@89.21.12.17) |
| 15:06.00 | wastrel | what game |
| 15:06.02 | smr | It's definitely a learning experience. I can't even get a random access file.... |
| 15:06.17 | BHSPitWeb | Java's easy, it's just C++ made horrible |
| 15:06.33 | cbeust_ | You mean Java is C++ made easy, right? |
| 15:06.33 | smr | It's not the language as much as the framework that I'm learning |
| 15:06.47 | smr | Java is almost exactly C# |
| 15:07.10 | BHSPitWeb | Yeah, frameworks are usually the hard part to "get into" on a new platform |
| 15:07.23 | smr | the language differences are cosmetic for most purposes. |
| 15:07.27 | phillijw | C++ is by far one of the worst languages :) |
| 15:07.29 | BHSPitWeb | Although I've been trying to get into iPhone development, and the language is getting me too :/ |
| 15:07.37 | smr | phillijw: agreed |
| 15:07.52 | smr | I wish there were a python compiler for android |
| 15:08.13 | BHSPitWeb | in theory it shouldn't be hard to port python |
| 15:08.25 | BHSPitWeb | you'd have to package it up with your app though, I guess |
| 15:08.32 | Disconnect | jpython |
| 15:08.38 | BHSPitWeb | jython |
| 15:09.07 | smr | I'd rather it compile directly to dalvik bytecode |
| 15:09.24 | smr | Is jython an interpreter? |
| 15:09.56 | smr | no. it compiles it to java bytecode |
| 15:09.58 | BHSPitWeb | http://www.jython.org/Project/ |
| 15:09.59 | Death_Syn | is T-Mobile still pushing 1.1 updates |
| 15:10.00 | Death_Syn | +? |
| 15:10.04 | ttuttle | 1.1?! |
| 15:10.04 | Death_Syn | I'm still on 1.0 RC19 |
| 15:10.12 | smr | It would be really difficult to port jython. You'd have to write a new compiler backend |
| 15:10.17 | ttuttle | Death_Syn: Are you sure you're not on TC4-RC19? |
| 15:10.25 | Death_Syn | let me read it, just a sec |
| 15:10.26 | smr | by that I mean you'd have to write the code generator |
| 15:10.41 | Death_Syn | the forums last week said they were pushing firmware updates starting on release day |
| 15:10.59 | cbeust_ | Or just a converter .class -> .dex |
| 15:11.07 | Death_Syn | ttuttle: yeah, I'm on TC4-RC19 |
| 15:11.10 | ttuttle | Death_Syn: I'm not sure if it was starting on release day, but I believe TC4-RC28 has been pushed, and Engadget suggests RC29 is being pushed to fix the Browser security hole. |
| 15:11.14 | ttuttle | Death_Syn: Ok. |
| 15:11.25 | ttuttle | thinks they should put a "BETA" in the Android logo ;-) |
| 15:11.32 | ttuttle | (and just leave it there) |
| 15:11.32 | Death_Syn | i got the firmware revision number and the android number mixed up, I guess |
| 15:13.09 | davidw | smr, you can run Hecl:-) |
| 15:13.15 | Disconnect | anyone at tmob want to push me up the stack, see if you \\ |
| 15:13.21 | Disconnect | er, send me the update i mean :) |
| 15:13.29 | eldenz | is there a fast way to render pixels? (~30'000) |
| 15:13.40 | *** join/#android inZane-_ (i=nemo@dslb-084-058-003-170.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:14.54 | ttuttle | Disconnect: I don't think T-Mobile can do that. |
| 15:15.43 | Disconnect | -something- out there determines who gets the OTA updates. and istr that (a very very long time ago) they could force an update for certain 'critical' problems if you escalated with customer service. but i'm too lazy to spend an hour on 611 doing that :) |
| 15:17.19 | *** join/#android andreaf (n=andrea@82.112.213.98) |
| 15:18.24 | *** join/#android Tauno (n=chatzill@118.192.50.195.sta.estpak.ee) |
| 15:24.04 | michaelnovakjr | anyone work with non standard intent filters? |
| 15:24.54 | zhobbs | michaelnovakjr: sure |
| 15:25.22 | michaelnovakjr | zhobbs: if i want to handle the PICK intent but return a string value is that possible? |
| 15:25.37 | michaelnovakjr | i'm sure i am missing something simple here |
| 15:28.06 | marcone | what do you mean by "return" ? |
| 15:28.18 | michaelnovakjr | pass back to the calling intent |
| 15:28.26 | cbeust_ | Use setResult() for that |
| 15:28.45 | marcone | sub-activities return results as Intents, and you can stick (almost) whatever you want in there. |
| 15:29.16 | michaelnovakjr | i'm calling setResult with an intent with extras as the second parameter, should that work? |
| 15:29.23 | davidw | smr, so what kind of hacking is necessary to compile and run native code on the phones ? I don't want to distribute anything, just know if it's possible for someone wanting to play around |
| 15:29.24 | cbeust_ | Yup |
| 15:29.35 | cbeust_ | Override onActivityResult() in the calling activity |
| 15:29.56 | cbeust_ | davidw: it's possible but of course, unsupported |
| 15:30.14 | davidw | obviously it's unsupported |
| 15:30.36 | *** join/#android WaterDragon_ (n=nick@dyn116.roaming.few.vu.nl) |
| 15:30.46 | *** join/#android d0nets (n=hebs@75-121-110-19.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 15:31.04 | d0nets | hey yall |
| 15:31.08 | smr | I don't know how to do it on the G1 |
| 15:31.10 | d0nets | i run the chan on efnet |
| 15:31.16 | d0nets | would you want to relay? |
| 15:31.17 | mlester | if there is a database file on a sdcard what string would you use to open it in an applicaation for example hello.db would I use SQLiteDatabase.openDatabase("sdcard/hello.db",null,SQLiteDatabase.OPEN_READONLY) |
| 15:31.20 | d0nets | we have about 65 users |
| 15:31.25 | davidw | no |
| 15:31.28 | davidw | sounds annoying |
| 15:31.33 | davidw | and here we have all the guys from google |
| 15:31.39 | davidw | we win;-P |
| 15:31.45 | zhobbs | hehe, tell them to come here :) |
| 15:31.46 | d0nets | lol its not about win or lose |
| 15:31.50 | smr | But for my phone I build an app natively, then copy it to my device's filesystem, then run it |
| 15:31.50 | Tauno | I can't believe it.. Clickin2DaBeat app thats on apps-for-android... I made the same app (only difference is that there is a youtube vid.. I have just an mp3) last week and was like "oh great.. that's a neat idea that I had.. I can surely make a few bucks with it and pay this months rent".. and now I see that there.. is it just me that gets always punched in the face? :P |
| 15:31.51 | d0nets | its about collaboration |
| 15:32.01 | d0nets | and efnet has a nice hacking base |
| 15:32.07 | smr | really there isn't anything special to do. I have access to the filesystem |
| 15:32.13 | d0nets | which could be good for the platform |
| 15:32.24 | davidw | smr, well is it some development phone that lets you do more than the g1? |
| 15:32.28 | d0nets | is there any word of an ssh server? |
| 15:32.41 | *** join/#android salman (n=salman@office.quietcaresystems.com) |
| 15:33.02 | d0nets | and how do i get the micro sd card to show up in ubuntu |
| 15:33.22 | davidw | d0nets, plug it in to the slot in your computer?:-) works for me |
| 15:33.25 | zhobbs | d0nets: just enable USB mass storage on the phone |
| 15:33.29 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@nat/google/x-8684dfa55e87348b) |
| 15:33.34 | salman | Hi. Anyone know of any file browsers for the g1? the two I found on anddev don't seem to work |
| 15:33.49 | zhobbs | salman: saw one in the Market this morning |
| 15:33.49 | d0nets | david and zhobbs i did that |
| 15:33.53 | *** join/#android WaterDragon (n=nick@130.37.26.116) |
| 15:33.55 | d0nets | salman check the market |
| 15:34.01 | cbeust_ | salman: not sure but it' seems to be of limited use |
| 15:34.08 | salman | ah. is there one out now? I'll check |
| 15:34.19 | salman | I got a broken app which I have to try and remove |
| 15:34.39 | cbeust_ | Did you try adb uninstall? |
| 15:34.49 | salman | was trying to install connectbot and something went screwy, now I can't see it under app manager or access it on the phone |
| 15:35.04 | d0nets | its prolly not instaled salman |
| 15:35.04 | smr | davidw: no I have an HTC Vogue. It normally runs windows mobile, but utilizing an application called "Haret" I can run any OS on it I want, provided it will operate on the device |
| 15:35.09 | d0nets | just hold press and drag it to trashcan |
| 15:35.12 | salman | no, I don't have the sdk on this laptop |
| 15:35.13 | d0nets | then try to reinstall |
| 15:35.23 | d0nets | but install it from http://code.google.com/p/connectbot |
| 15:35.23 | *** join/#android WaterDragon__ (n=nick@dyn116.roaming.few.vu.nl) |
| 15:35.27 | d0nets | as the market version is up to date |
| 15:35.31 | d0nets | isnt* |
| 15:35.56 | salman | d0nets: already tried. when I tried to install connectbot now, it says 'incompatible update' which makes me think the previous version wasn't removed properly |
| 15:36.10 | smr | davidw: basically haret is a bootloader that runs in windows mobile. It loads up the kernel in memory then disables memory protection then starts executing |
| 15:36.14 | d0nets | is there a google bot in here? |
| 15:36.17 | cbeust_ | It doesn't appear in the package list? |
| 15:36.22 | d0nets | !google android connectbot incompatible update |
| 15:36.25 | salman | no, cbeust_ |
| 15:36.29 | wastrel | no google bot |
| 15:36.38 | d0nets | weird |
| 15:36.40 | cbeust_ | Only real Google people |
| 15:36.45 | d0nets | we really need to relay my chan with this one |
| 15:37.07 | jbq | Who needs bots when you have droids? |
| 15:37.13 | salman | guys in #connectbot seem to think the old ver may still be installed so I just want to check |
| 15:37.13 | wastrel | i don't care for googlebots |
| 15:37.15 | cbeust_ | jbq++ |
| 15:37.34 | d0nets | wastrel its nice once you realize how it works |
| 15:37.48 | d0nets | it saves lots of clicks and changing windows to google something for someone |
| 15:38.03 | RyeBrye | the googlebot was called in for extra shifts indexing. a few of the other bots called in sick ;) |
| 15:38.06 | zhobbs | d0nets: but you're spamming the channel |
| 15:38.14 | Death_Syn | d0nets: you the dude working on ircell? |
| 15:38.23 | d0nets | death_syn no |
| 15:38.26 | d0nets | but i have an irc solution |
| 15:38.28 | Death_Syn | k |
| 15:38.29 | d0nets | bitchx in connectbot |
| 15:38.31 | d0nets | (10:38:06 AM) St0ned: !google android connectbot incompatible update |
| 15:38.31 | d0nets | (10:38:08 AM) den0tS: 5 Results | Linux and Android for Vogue - Page 78 @ http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2556086 |
| 15:38.37 | d0nets | its not alot of spam |
| 15:38.39 | Death_Syn | yeah, i'm using connectbot+irssi |
| 15:39.03 | d0nets | ive been helping them with reporting issues |
| 15:39.25 | d0nets | i reported the issue with the error when you hit back , it happened when you had "keep screen lit" disabled |
| 15:39.43 | d0nets | im really digging the infrastructure google has lain for us |
| 15:40.01 | cbeust_ | d0nets: glad to hear that |
| 15:44.00 | Disconnect | d0nets: googlebot is for facebook users. "ooh look everyone look at me i'm searching the INTERNETS!! quick, pay attention!" |
| 15:44.14 | d0nets | no disconnect |
| 15:44.18 | d0nets | its nice when people have an issue |
| 15:44.20 | d0nets | and they should google |
| 15:44.30 | d0nets | instead of saying "use google and search for blah blah" |
| 15:44.34 | d0nets | you type !google blah blah |
| 15:44.44 | ttuttle | Facebook news feed: "ttuttle searched for: "android is awesome"" :-P |
| 15:44.49 | cbeust_ | d0nets: I'd rather do that in a browser personally |
| 15:45.05 | michaelnovakjr | cbeust_: thanks for the intent help.... i got it working now |
| 15:45.12 | michaelnovakjr | i'm a little rusty on intents |
| 15:45.13 | cbeust_ | michaelnovakjr: cool |
| 15:46.23 | *** join/#android andyross (n=andy@static-71-245-107-194.ptldor.fios.verizon.net) |
| 15:46.24 | BHSPitWeb | "ttuttle searched for: "bikini shots plz"" |
| 15:46.53 | solca | hi! does somebody knows how to compile the debug target in the android source code? |
| 15:49.39 | wastrel | i got my 4gb microsd |
| 15:49.47 | smr | anyone know how to get a randomaccessfile using either openRawResource or getAsset? |
| 15:50.12 | d0nets | any word on running apps on the micro sd card |
| 15:50.25 | Cedric2 | d0nets: not possible at the moment |
| 15:51.17 | wastrel | heh didn't notice there's already music on the sd card |
| 15:51.48 | BHSPitWeb | Is there any way to monitor what goes on with the phone's wifi connection? |
| 15:51.49 | d0nets | yea wastrel, when you plug in the headphones the first time it starts playing automatically |
| 15:52.01 | salman | now if we could only install apps directly onto the sd card :) |
| 15:52.02 | d0nets | i almost fell out of my chair because the volume was all the way up and it came outta nowhere |
| 15:52.14 | davidw | salman, you can't? |
| 15:52.16 | d0nets | who is using ubuntu? |
| 15:52.26 | salman | I don't see any way to, davidw |
| 15:52.31 | d0nets | i cant get my micro sd card to show up in ubuntu |
| 15:52.31 | ieatlint | BHSPitWeb, monitor in what way? |
| 15:52.32 | salman | everything goes directly to phone |
| 15:52.36 | d0nets | and yes i set the setting |
| 15:52.41 | salman | d0nets: as root, fdisk -l |
| 15:52.51 | salman | should show a scsi type disk |
| 15:52.54 | d0nets | one sec lemme plug it in |
| 15:52.54 | salman | sda, sdb, etc |
| 15:53.02 | salman | make sure usb storage is enabled on the phone |
| 15:53.03 | kslater | d0nets: I use ubunut |
| 15:53.11 | kslater | and ubuntu |
| 15:53.24 | salman | then just mount /dev/sdX /some/path and you're set |
| 15:53.43 | davidw | can the phone charge via usb? |
| 15:53.45 | *** join/#android mikez5 (n=lockwood@nat/google/x-2c789836f66275f1) |
| 15:53.46 | marcone | d0nets: the music player only starts playing "automatically" when you long-press the button on the headset. |
| 15:53.49 | salman | davidw: yes |
| 15:53.49 | davidw | that irritates me about the nokia I just got |
| 15:53.57 | wastrel | yes usb charging works, but you need a powered usb port. |
| 15:54.10 | Cedric2 | davidw: yes, although it's slower than on a power outlet |
| 15:54.28 | d0nets | wastrel what do you mean |
| 15:54.31 | davidw | Cedric2, sure, but on trips it's nice to have one less thing to bring |
| 15:54.32 | d0nets | oh marcone maybe that was it |
| 15:54.44 | Cedric2 | davidw: definitely, I use it a lot |
| 15:55.00 | wastrel | d0nets: some usb ports don't provide the necessary power to support charging. |
| 15:55.21 | wastrel | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PoweredUSB |
| 15:55.25 | d0nets | wastrel i have read things about battery performance |
| 15:55.34 | d0nets | that the g1 uses a more powerful charger |
| 15:55.44 | d0nets | and using regular usb cables and othe rusb charrgers dont support that |
| 15:55.53 | d0nets | and causes bad batt performance |
| 15:55.54 | salman | the phone charges up really quickly, that's for sure |
| 15:56.04 | *** join/#android jasonparekh_ (n=jasonpar@nat/google/x-cc5b1d046ca5a255) |
| 15:56.16 | d0nets | yea it drains real quickly too |
| 15:56.22 | *** part/#android soundmonster (n=leonid@poirot.aot.TU-Berlin.DE) |
| 15:56.48 | salman | I disabled most of the syncing |
| 15:56.55 | salman | just left contact syncing enabled |
| 15:57.05 | salman | lasts about 2 days now for me if I dont' youtube a lot |
| 15:57.10 | marcone | wastrel: the wikipedia page you refer to doesn't really apply here. You can charge the phone off a standard USB port, it just won't charge as fast as it would when using the charger. |
| 15:57.22 | smr | 3g radios drain the battery fast in any phone |
| 15:57.35 | *** join/#android DubLo7 (n=DubLo7@70.238.110.130) |
| 15:57.47 | morrildl | Always charge the G1 off the wall wart |
| 15:57.51 | ieatlint | you can expect any usb port on a computer to provide the phone 500mA, which will charge the phone quickly |
| 15:58.04 | ieatlint | the wall charger is rated at 1A, but may not be able to always pull that |
| 15:58.10 | morrildl | Charging off USB doesn't always necessarily charge the device :) |
| 15:58.11 | d0nets | salman can i pm you? |
| 15:58.18 | salman | sure |
| 15:58.19 | *** join/#android Goosey (n=Goosey@168.215.170.99) |
| 16:03.30 | d0nets | could someone help me get my sd card to show up in ubuntu? |
| 16:03.37 | d0nets | i dont think i see it in fdisk -l |
| 16:03.44 | d0nets | i get this in dmesg, is this related? |
| 16:03.45 | tmccrary | Is your reader detected? |
| 16:03.45 | cutmasta | d03boy, #ubuntu ? |
| 16:03.45 | d0nets | [ 8555.048318] usb 2-5: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 80 |
| 16:03.45 | d0nets | [ 8555.456098] usb 2-5: device not accepting address 80, error -71 |
| 16:03.57 | d0nets | tmccrary im not wanting to use the reader |
| 16:03.58 | davidw | d0nets, sounds like it's fucked up. |
| 16:04.05 | tmccrary | ??? |
| 16:04.09 | d0nets | im wanting to plug the g1 in |
| 16:04.11 | d0nets | via usb |
| 16:04.13 | tmccrary | ah |
| 16:04.20 | tmccrary | mine "just works" w/ ubuntu hardy |
| 16:04.26 | Disconnect | d0nets: its set to use usb storage right? |
| 16:04.31 | salman | same here |
| 16:04.34 | d0nets | yea |
| 16:04.40 | d0nets | im using gutsy |
| 16:04.51 | d0nets | i prepared for tomorrows install of 8.10 though |
| 16:04.54 | davidw | morrildl, hey, question from a friend of mine - can you compile, and then run something on your own phone, with the G1? |
| 16:05.12 | loke | davidw: yes. you can do that will all phones |
| 16:05.16 | loke | davidw: except the iphone |
| 16:05.22 | loke | (in general) |
| 16:05.46 | *** join/#android romainguy_ (n=gfx@67.218.107.201) |
| 16:06.23 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@72.14.224.1) |
| 16:06.36 | wastrel | gutsy i think is still using udev |
| 16:06.38 | *** join/#android xnixan (n=xnixan@unaffiliated/xnixan) |
| 16:06.43 | wastrel | libusb on hardy |
| 16:06.48 | wastrel | iirc i dn't follow that stuff |
| 16:07.42 | davidw | d0nets, reinstallation is for windows, not linux |
| 16:07.56 | Tauno | sorry for spamming and whining again but.. I'm starting to think that I'm sleepwalking (or.. sleepcoding) and I have copied the code and logic from Clickin2DaBeat. I mean.. the whole logic of the app is exactly the same.. storing beats in an xml.. xml tag names. creating new "beats" file.. loading it.. displaying it.. recording touch events etc. |
| 16:08.18 | d0nets | david are you recommending upgrading? |
| 16:08.23 | Laz | How can I reflash my phone |
| 16:08.25 | Tauno | and I thought that there are a million ways of designing/coding something like that.. turns out htere is just one :P |
| 16:08.45 | davidw | d0nets, yeah. |
| 16:09.05 | d0nets | nah im good |
| 16:09.07 | jasta | hmm |
| 16:09.08 | smr | One obvious way maybe! |
| 16:09.16 | salman | there's a format option in settings, Laz |
| 16:09.16 | d0nets | even in ubuntu alot of the time upgrades dont go as planned |
| 16:09.26 | *** join/#android DubLo71 (n=DubLo7@70.238.110.130) |
| 16:09.36 | d0nets | im gonna try a different cable salman |
| 16:09.45 | Laz | I want to retheme android |
| 16:09.48 | d0nets | this cable it came with smells like new shoes and laughing gas |
| 16:10.00 | Disconnect | fucking amazon. "thats not a common problem, you should call us on the phone" and then a 2 page form letter about why i should use their online forms instead of calling... |
| 16:10.13 | davidw | jasta, hey, do you know this? have you tried running some native code on your phone? |
| 16:10.32 | d0nets | that worked salman |
| 16:10.35 | d0nets | strange |
| 16:10.39 | d0nets | its my cable |
| 16:10.48 | d0nets | i wsa using a little usb to mini usb retractable |
| 16:10.52 | salman | neat |
| 16:10.55 | d0nets | whats special about the g1's? |
| 16:11.04 | d0nets | cause i would like to get retractable ones for it |
| 16:11.32 | jasta | davidw: no, pretty sure it would work very much like the emulator tho |
| 16:11.35 | salman | don't think there's anything special |
| 16:11.41 | salman | it's just a standard cable |
| 16:11.52 | salman | I mixed and matched at work and had no problems |
| 16:12.37 | Disconnect | hahaha and you can't even reply to their emails. what a joke. |
| 16:12.47 | Disconnect | jasta: k-9 is you right? |
| 16:14.01 | jasta | Disconnect: no, but im going to contact them today |
| 16:14.52 | Disconnect | it notifies great but doesn't have a menu or back button or anything. awkward... open a message and you have to wait for android to kill the app before you can get back to the list :( |
| 16:15.04 | Disconnect | is your version done? :) |
| 16:15.57 | jasta | no, i need to do major surgery to the Email app |
| 16:16.03 | jasta | but it does work |
| 16:17.38 | d0nets | jasta you have anything to do with masa? |
| 16:18.05 | d0nets | i saw a tutorial for installing a streaming app earlier |
| 16:18.11 | d0nets | and there was a step to patch a file |
| 16:18.14 | d0nets | and it was .jasta |
| 16:18.19 | mlester | if there is a database file on a sdcard what string would you use to open it in an applicaation for example hello.db would I use SQLiteDatabase.openDatabase("sdcard/hello.db",null,SQLiteDatabase.OPEN_READONLY) |
| 16:18.46 | davidw | I'd open it with 'ed'. |
| 16:18.48 | zhobbs | /sdcard/hello.db |
| 16:19.48 | mlester | ok thanks |
| 16:20.02 | *** join/#android charleswyble_ (n=charlesw@12.46.70.2) |
| 16:20.04 | d0nets | anyone know if google gives out g1 for scolarships lol |
| 16:20.05 | d0nets | for devs |
| 16:20.21 | d0nets | i know a chick that might be able to provide a solution for running apps from the sd card |
| 16:20.36 | d0nets | but she doesnt use phones and doesnt have $ to get one out of contract |
| 16:20.50 | d0nets | plus i hear you cant even use one without activating it |
| 16:20.58 | davidw | well that sounds like a great elevator pitch to use with google to get a free phone |
| 16:21.15 | davidw | like, I know this chick, like, and she has this friend, see... |
| 16:21.16 | Cedric2 | d0nets: she can stick to the SDK |
| 16:21.24 | d0nets | lol davidw sorry |
| 16:21.40 | mlester | hmm I am getting no such table exception |
| 16:21.42 | davidw | I don't think they hand out hardware though |
| 16:22.04 | d0nets | cedric do you think she could get apps from sd card accomplished in sdk? |
| 16:23.05 | Cedric2 | d0nets: very few people could do that today, so I doubt it, but she's welcome to try |
| 16:23.34 | d0nets | so its impossible? |
| 16:23.45 | d0nets | she is pretty smart |
| 16:23.48 | d0nets | she created the open wii |
| 16:23.49 | Cedric2 | It's software, so it's not impossible, just very hard right now |
| 16:23.50 | ieatlint | nothing is impossible, but it would be very difficult, and google wouldn't like it |
| 16:23.54 | d0nets | and sigma fw for surfboard modems |
| 16:24.01 | romainguy__ | why wouldn't we like it? |
| 16:24.04 | Cedric2 | Oh I don't think we would care that much |
| 16:24.15 | jbq | I wouldn't count on being able to do it in the SDK. From source, it might be possible, if you modify the mount table and format the sd card with e.g. e2fs, that might work. I didn't try. |
| 16:24.17 | Disconnect | d0nets: sounds like a perfect project for the sdk then. total control. |
| 16:24.23 | ieatlint | because you went out of your way to restrict what one can do on such things |
| 16:24.24 | jbq | That won't work on production devices, of course. |
| 16:24.26 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 16:24.31 | romainguy__ | ieatlint: er, no |
| 16:24.33 | Disconnect | (well, yah, from emulator i mean) |
| 16:24.43 | Cedric2 | ieatlint: no, we didn't, but there are other forces at work here |
| 16:24.49 | d0nets | thats my point |
| 16:24.52 | ieatlint | i agree, such as the market |
| 16:24.54 | *** join/#android pandora-- (n=pandora-@66.238.50.126.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 16:25.02 | d0nets | theres things that rely on hands on time with device |
| 16:25.12 | jasta | d0nets: that app was http://five.googlecode.com, which i wrote |
| 16:25.16 | davidw | is really hoping to get a definitive answer: can I compile something and run it on a G1? |
| 16:25.21 | ieatlint | i would still love to have root on the device :( |
| 16:25.22 | jasta | d0nets: and Five uses Masa, i believe its one of the only big projects using it so far |
| 16:25.32 | DubLo71 | is there any timeline on when bluetooth serial support might be added back into android? |
| 16:25.33 | d0nets | jasta can i pm you? |
| 16:25.37 | jasta | sure |
| 16:25.38 | d0nets | does that app work on the g1 yet? |
| 16:25.48 | jasta | of course, i use it every Tue/Thu at the gym :) |
| 16:25.49 | ieatlint | davidw, yes, but not gui apps |
| 16:25.50 | Disconnect | davidw: depends on your level of skill :) but possibly. its been done, its not supported, and its not simple. |
| 16:25.59 | Disconnect | and yah its not gui |
| 16:26.05 | davidw | I know that guis aren't possible |
| 16:26.10 | davidw | we've been over that before |
| 16:26.27 | ieatlint | you need a arm toolchain with the gnu eabi library |
| 16:26.35 | davidw | but you can do it with a real live g1? |
| 16:26.38 | ieatlint | and you need to do something a bit odd for dynamic linking |
| 16:26.43 | davidw | ieatlint, sure, cross compiling is not the problem |
| 16:27.02 | ieatlint | yeah, you can do it on a g1 |
| 16:27.35 | Disconnect | sucks up storage iirc - gotta basically save all the bins (and any necessary libs) twice |
| 16:28.07 | *** join/#android im (n=im@bnet215.zg.x3d.CARNet.hr) |
| 16:28.10 | ieatlint | if you statically link, yeah... which is a lot easier than dynamic (and, also, not too many libs are on the device) |
| 16:28.31 | ieatlint | there's a bin of busybox floating around that's been statically compiled for it |
| 16:28.45 | ieatlint | adds a bit of functionality, like vi |
| 16:29.02 | *** join/#android InfiL00p (n=bowserj@S0106001ff33fa167.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:29.33 | ieatlint | but google was kind enough to explicitly force everything on the sdcard to not be executable, and attempt to restrict all the rw mtd partitions |
| 16:29.34 | ieatlint | :) |
| 16:31.47 | Disconnect | does love being told what he can't do with the "open" platform.. |
| 16:32.12 | ieatlint | open platform, not open devices |
| 16:33.12 | ieatlint | anyway, /data/local gives the shell user rw on mtd5, where you can upload programs and run them |
| 16:33.20 | smr | I've got busybox on my phone :D |
| 16:34.02 | *** join/#android greudin (n=g@wikipedia/Greudin) |
| 16:34.54 | *** join/#android mithro (n=tim@unaffiliated/mithro) |
| 16:37.04 | andyross | Dumb java question: I have an InputStream and an OutputStream I want to copy. Is the standard idiom just to loop on read/write pairs, or is there a "join" or "pipe" operation I'm missing somewhere? |
| 16:37.28 | *** join/#android androoid (n=android@12.193.57.162) |
| 16:37.52 | jasta | androoid: i have wondered abotu this for ages and it truly appears that there is not. |
| 16:38.16 | andyross | ieatlint: No need for anything wierd with dynamic linking that I've seen yet. You just can't use a uclibc toolchain and expect it to work, you have to build against the native libc instead. |
| 16:39.22 | ieatlint | my libc isn't compatible then... perhaps an issue of it looking for libc in the wrong place |
| 16:39.44 | ieatlint | i found info about using the linker on the phone, which worked, so i stopped there |
| 16:41.55 | andyross | "linker on the phone" ? That's the shared object linker, it's a runtime thing, you don't need to use it specifically. You have a link? I'm playing with this stuff myself and rediscovering things I think are already known. |
| 16:42.05 | *** join/#android cutmasta (n=cutmasta@62.225.134.181) |
| 16:42.42 | *** join/#android sirxs (n=sirxs@cmr-208-97-118-19.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 16:42.48 | ieatlint | http://honeypod.blogspot.com/2007/12/dynamically-linked-hello-world-for.html |
| 16:42.51 | mlester | do all sqllite databases need to have a android_metadata |
| 16:43.20 | michaelnovakjr | jasta, yea i was thinking about the build process |
| 16:43.30 | *** join/#android rup_deb (n=rupeng@122.48.249.251) |
| 16:43.36 | michaelnovakjr | activitycreator should support ant, masa and eclipse projects by default |
| 16:43.37 | *** part/#android rup_deb (n=rupeng@122.48.249.251) |
| 16:44.10 | mlester | because I am getting a exception becaue it can find one |
| 16:44.21 | andyross | ieatlint: OK, yeah. Those are instructions about how to force a default toolchain to set the runtime linker field in the generated binaries correctly. I figured out the same stuff by watching what the Android prebuilt toolchain did during a build of the system. |
| 16:45.25 | ieatlint | hmmm |
| 16:45.41 | ieatlint | i was guessing as much when i was briefly playing with that that it was a location issue |
| 16:47.12 | Poohba | is there a program where u can play a song and it will tell u the name of the song? |
| 16:47.27 | mlester | shazam |
| 16:48.02 | jasta | michaelnovakjr: yeah, at least with options for all of them |
| 16:48.10 | jasta | but masa would be a good one. i much prefer the maven way |
| 16:48.12 | michaelnovakjr | yea |
| 16:48.21 | jasta | ant is yucky, requiring that you bundle all your dependencies |
| 16:48.26 | jasta | which is a strategy that makes me sick :) |
| 16:48.33 | michaelnovakjr | plus if you distribute code you have all options to build from |
| 16:48.48 | michaelnovakjr | activitiycreator --all -out . ..... |
| 16:49.19 | *** join/#android satadru (n=satadru@cpe-69-201-133-23.nyc.res.rr.com) |
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| 16:56.20 | tomgibara | andyross: You might want to look at PipedInputStream/PipedOutputStream |
| 16:57.15 | smr | any way to extend the length of a byte array in Java? |
| 16:57.25 | andyross | It's not performance critical. Writing a loop on the bytewise read() and write() works fine. My first intuition is that there'd be some tool to chain these together and flush them. But then I realized that this is Java and any such tool would triple the complexity of the code and not be worth it. |
| 16:59.13 | jasta | smr: you must create a new array and copy your old array's data into it |
| 16:59.29 | smr | I was afraid of that |
| 17:00.12 | andyross | How else would it work? Either you do it manually or the runtime needs to make the copy for you. Arrays are contiguous regions of address space, there's no guarantee that the space you want after the array is available (and in practice it never is, because allocators try to avoid fragmentation) |
| 17:00.34 | smr | I understand. I was just hoping that there would be something in the framework that would do it for me |
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| 17:00.45 | smr | I feel like I am reinventing too many wheels |
| 17:00.47 | jasta | smr: well there might be some utility in android |
| 17:00.59 | jasta | android has a lot of those types of things |
| 17:01.01 | jasta | so who knows |
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| 17:01.24 | waldo_ | is back (gone 07:23:55) |
| 17:01.34 | michaelnovakjr | i doubt for primitive types |
| 17:01.37 | andyross | In C we call it realloc(). No doubt in java it's called something like ByteArraySizeModifierAllocationManagerFactory. |
| 17:01.41 | smr | Yes, though the API is rather new and there isn't a whole lot of doc out there |
| 17:01.52 | smr | ha |
| 17:02.03 | michaelnovakjr | you do know what realloc does right? |
| 17:02.36 | andyross | FWIW, the javadocs for the Android APIs seem reasonably good to me. Terse maybe, but complete. (And yes, I know what realloc does -- it makes a copy and returns the new pointer, just like what we were discussion) |
| 17:02.53 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 17:02.58 | smr | Well, the ByteArraySizeModifierAllocationManagerFactory doesn't actually do any resizing. It just constructs a ByteArraySizeModifierAllocationManager for you based on the SsytemRandomAccessMemoryContext you must pass it |
| 17:03.36 | michaelnovakjr | andyross: its basically what you are doing, but for primitive types i haven't come across anything like that |
| 17:03.41 | *** join/#android gustavold (n=gustavol@orlandia.ime.usp.br) |
| 17:03.47 | Meph|sto | well there you have the difference between java and C in a nutshell ;) |
| 17:04.12 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 17:04.50 | smr | so it turns out to be something like byte[] array = ByteArraySizeModifierAllocationManagerFactory.BuildByteArraySizeModifierAllocationManager(getSystemRandomAccessMemoryContext()).ResizeByteArray(oldArray, oldArray.length + 4 * 1024); |
| 17:05.06 | andyross | pronounces this joke dead, now. |
| 17:05.23 | smr | is wasting time at work |
| 17:05.23 | gustavold | hi, is android already released for production with some smart phone? I'd like to buy a smart phone running android... is it possible today? |
| 17:06.20 | michaelnovakjr | haha |
| 17:06.23 | thoraxe | gustavold: in the usa, yes. elsewhere, don't know |
| 17:06.25 | michaelnovakjr | sorry for the laugh |
| 17:07.07 | michaelnovakjr | yes tmobile g1 |
| 17:07.25 | smr | meh I just wrote my own array resizer... lame |
| 17:07.34 | gustavold | thoraxe: where can I buy it (in the usa)? |
| 17:07.49 | Disconnect | tmobile |
| 17:08.02 | thoraxe | gustavold: you may be able to get one with no contract from t-mobile, but it would be locked |
| 17:08.17 | gustavold | hummm |
| 17:08.24 | Disconnect | (hence calling it the "tmobile g1" .. sprint is unlikely to get away with naming it "tmobile" even if they wanted to. although with the condition of the preinstalled apps it'd be pretty good misdirection..) |
| 17:08.33 | Meph|sto | I just found this for resizing arrays, don't know if its any help.. http://www.source-code.biz/snippets/java/3.htm |
| 17:09.24 | gustavold | do you know if it's going to be selled outside usa this year? |
| 17:09.28 | smr | is reflection availble in dalvik? |
| 17:10.01 | jasta | smr: yes, but do remember that reflection is _slow_ |
| 17:10.15 | thoraxe | gustavold: probably not any android production outside the USA in 2008. other manufs are supposed to produce phones for 2009 |
| 17:10.29 | thoraxe | gustavold: the G1 is manuf by HTC. not sure what arrangements tmobile made with htc over exclusivity |
| 17:10.29 | Meph|sto | it's probably better to do it fo a specific type without reflection |
| 17:10.40 | smr | the code for resizing arrays that Meph gave me uses reflection. |
| 17:11.05 | smr | Thanks for it. I went ahead and wrote my own though. |
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| 17:11.39 | smr | Is it stupid that I wrote a function to accept an InputStream and read it all into a big byte array? |
| 17:12.31 | muthu | smr: why not use the java.io packages? |
| 17:13.10 | smr | does it have something to do that? |
| 17:13.11 | andyross | InputStream is in java.io. The answer depends on what you want to do with that data, obviously. |
| 17:13.13 | smr | I couldn't find anything |
| 17:13.16 | gustavold | thoraxe: I'm working in on an open source project and we are planning which platforms are we going to support... it includes buying some devices... I'd like to include android in the supported platforms, but I don't think I can if there isn't android devices for selling... =( |
| 17:13.17 | Meph|sto | did anyone manage to get a street number from getFromLocation() in the Geocoder class? |
| 17:13.46 | smr | I need to get an asset or raw resource and read it with random access |
| 17:13.52 | mithro | how does one change the email address setup with repo? |
| 17:14.23 | thoraxe | gustavold: use an emulator in the meantime |
| 17:14.34 | andyross | smr: My understanding is that they are stored uncompressed in the .apk, so seeks should be fast. If you aren't needing to seek for every byte, it's probably faster to avoid the copy. |
| 17:14.55 | morrildl | davidw: not sure if you got your answer yet, but yes -- retail devices support adb (though it has to be turned on in the device by the user first.) That lets you debug your own apk's process, although you are prevented from debugging processes owned by other apks |
| 17:15.51 | davidw | morrildl, meaning you could x-compile some code, put it on the phone, and see your 'hello world' pop up? |
| 17:15.57 | smr | All I can get from the Android framework it seems is an InputStream or file descriptor. I don't want to have to know the actual file name or path of the data |
| 17:16.16 | smr | I want to use Android's facilities |
| 17:16.23 | *** join/#android romainguy_ (n=gfx@216.239.45.19) |
| 17:16.30 | davidw | morrildl, I mean on the console - I know that graphics go through dalvik |
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| 17:17.21 | andyross | smr: Assets and resources are not files, sadly. They're stored on the device in the same .apk you packed for installation. |
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| 17:18.18 | smr | yep. I've figured that out :( So that's why I've written something to stream a file directly into a byte array. |
| 17:18.32 | gustavold | thoraxe: isn't it possible to install android in another smart phone like htc tytan? All the development/test is done with emulators? |
| 17:18.51 | thoraxe | gustavold: no idea about what devices currently support android |
| 17:19.03 | Disconnect | gustavold: why does everyone who comes in here automatically assume we're lying if they don't get an answer they like? |
| 17:19.27 | Meph|sto | the htc G1 is the only one officially supporting android right now, afaik |
| 17:23.34 | Disconnect | yay k-9 is fixed. :) |
| 17:24.14 | morrildl | davidw: ah, you mean native code |
| 17:24.42 | davidw | morrildl, yeah... I don't mean anything official or supported or distributed or anything like that |
| 17:25.03 | davidw | morrildl, I want to settle an argument with a friend - he sustains that it's not possible to put your own code on the g1 and run it. |
| 17:25.13 | davidw | I simply don't know, and thus my question |
| 17:25.19 | morrildl | davidw: you can load native .so libs via System.loadLibrary(). You can also store a native binary as something like a res/raw/ resource, and copy it to /data/app/<package> as an executable, and I believe that should work |
| 17:25.31 | romainguy_ | it does work |
| 17:25.36 | morrildl | davidw: but /sdcard is mounted noexec for security reasons on production devices |
| 17:25.37 | romainguy_ | but it uses twice the storage :( |
| 17:25.45 | morrildl | romainguy_: indeed :( |
| 17:26.23 | davidw | romainguy, I'm not asking if it's recommended or efficient or if I can put apps in the marketplace that do it... I just want to know if it's possible, and what restrictions there are |
| 17:26.27 | morrildl | davidw: that, the lack of easy access to the graphics pipeline and framework code, and the fact that your binary will only be able to access your own /data/app/<package>and SD card are the main limitations |
| 17:26.47 | davidw | morrildl, right... there's something about not being able to do root? |
| 17:26.58 | romainguy_ | davidw: and I'm just calling out the drawback of this solution |
| 17:26.59 | morrildl | davidw: su is not present on the device |
| 17:27.20 | morrildl | davidw: you might be able to invoke the syscall for chuser(0) but I can't remember if that's disabled or not |
| 17:27.36 | davidw | romainguy, it's an "intellectual curiousity" thing... not something I'm about to do |
| 17:27.51 | morrildl | swetland: will chuser(0) work on retail devices, from native code? |
| 17:28.14 | enf | you mean setuid(0)? |
| 17:28.19 | morrildl | enf: er, duh, yeah |
| 17:28.38 | morrildl | hasn't written unix system code in way too long |
| 17:28.48 | Disconnect | davidw: hasn't this been explained 3 or 4 times already just today? |
| 17:28.53 | davidw | eheheh... I have been doing some C work for a client and I understand |
| 17:29.01 | enf | not unless the process running it has the setuid bit set or is already root, which isn't supposed to happen on production devices |
| 17:29.03 | Disconnect | seems like every time i come back i see you asking the same question and getting the same answer |
| 17:29.08 | morrildl | enf: right |
| 17:29.10 | *** join/#android dipen (n=fdd001@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 17:29.13 | davidw | Disconnect, a lot of people said "I think so", but I wanted to hear it from the horse's mouth |
| 17:29.19 | Death_Syn | gd i love this phone |
| 17:29.23 | morrildl | davidw: so there you are :) |
| 17:29.24 | Disconnect | ..a lot of people said "yes" and a few said "i did it" |
| 17:29.28 | davidw | Disconnect, I trust romainguy and morrildl's answers more than I do random people:-) |
| 17:29.37 | davidw | Disconnect, one guy did it with some other device. |
| 17:29.39 | morrildl | enf: thx |
| 17:29.46 | davidw | some people did it with the emlator |
| 17:29.53 | davidw | morrildl, thanks for taking the time to answer:-) |
| 17:29.58 | enf | in the emulator, adb is running as root |
| 17:30.03 | Death_Syn | funky |
| 17:30.26 | Death_Syn | if I use my cdma phone to interfere with the edge tower's signal, I've got a reliable 2 bars of 3G |
| 17:30.43 | Death_Syn | heehee |
| 17:31.24 | smr | bah, I tire of MD2 models. I'll just use my own format. |
| 17:34.27 | mithro | can I get thoughts on - http://review.source.android.com/1545 ? It's my first attempt at a patch which adds escalate support to the alarm clock |
| 17:34.31 | androoid | how come I am getting jarsigner: unable to open jar file: when i try to sign my app? |
| 17:34.53 | androoid | 'ooh |
| 17:35.48 | *** part/#android penguinz (n=opera@66-168-215-122.dhcp.athn.ga.charter.com) |
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| 17:36.04 | oinkboink | hoi |
| 17:36.57 | blount | mithro: I suspect we'd want to first decide wheter notification manager continues to manage alarm volume |
| 17:36.59 | androoid | always user error :< |
| 17:37.09 | romainguy_ | mithro: wait for the review :) |
| 17:37.22 | oinkboink | why this programm doesnt runs? http://nopaste.org/p/a8CfNLwwz |
| 17:37.34 | blount | there are reasons to do it directly in the clock, but to date volumes are managed by the platform rather than the clock ap |
| 17:37.36 | romainguy_ | mithro: what do you call "escalate" alarms? the volume gets louder? |
| 17:37.46 | mithro | romainguy: yes |
| 17:38.00 | mithro | starts at zero and the sound grows |
| 17:38.33 | blount | wrote the alarmclock :-) |
| 17:38.56 | mithro | blount: ha :) |
| 17:39.10 | blount | I'm pretty unhappy with the lack of volume control, but we haven't nailed down exactly what to do about it |
| 17:39.15 | mithro | it works pretty well |
| 17:40.03 | mithro | and I'm fairly careful to restore the volume after the escalate |
| 17:40.21 | blount | heh, unless your app gets killed... |
| 17:41.18 | mithro | I wondered if volumes at the system level or at the app level? |
| 17:41.20 | jbq | And if the volume gets changed in the middle you're probably going to restore the old value, not the one that was changed. |
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| 17:42.30 | solca | hi! does somebody knows how to compile the debug target in the android source code? |
| 17:42.53 | romainguy_ | just type make? |
| 17:43.16 | solca | romainguy_: i get the release target |
| 17:44.05 | mithro | blount: it seems to me that there probably needs some differentiation between the system and current application volume |
| 17:44.47 | romainguy_ | different volume per application? |
| 17:44.52 | blount | mithro: as it stands (and as you've no doubt figured out), the alarm clock has its own audio channel, that is currently always hardwired to max |
| 17:45.16 | blount | this has the downside that you can't silence alarms |
| 17:45.26 | mithro | blount: I thought that channel was just a generic "alarms" channel |
| 17:45.38 | mithro | (which the alarm clock made use of) |
| 17:45.41 | blount | I think the clock is the only thing on it |
| 17:45.54 | blount | (I haven't looked in a while to be sure) |
| 17:46.15 | blount | but it has the upside that you can't mistakenly miss an alarm since you silenced your fone |
| 17:46.49 | blount | imho, we are needing a better platform way of showing what all the current alarm statuses and volume levels are than we currently have |
| 17:46.55 | thoraxe | has anyone tried K9 mail yet? |
| 17:47.09 | blount | I'd very much like to get an escalating alarm in as you've done, but just not sure where to put it yet |
| 17:47.19 | *** join/#android chab7 (n=kvirc@212.92.4.114) |
| 17:47.20 | blount | btw, it's great to see code like this come in! |
| 17:47.42 | davidw | morrildl, http://code.google.com/android/roadmap.html - you guys might want to update that:-) |
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| 17:47.53 | ttuttle | blount: So is the open-source community thing actually working? |
| 17:47.59 | ttuttle | blount: Are good patches getting rolled in to the tree? |
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| 17:48.40 | blount | ttuttle: honestly, I've been too busy working to look at it much |
| 17:48.40 | morrildl | davidw: yeah we're working on a docs refresh |
| 17:48.42 | romainguy_ | thoraxe: our Email guy looked at K9 and apparently the way they handle IMAP delete is not correct |
| 17:48.47 | thoraxe | good bugs are getting filed. whether they make it in is left to be seen |
| 17:48.50 | morrildl | davidw: it will get updated soon |
| 17:49.10 | thoraxe | romainguy_: i filed some bugs today about imap. hopefully they help |
| 17:49.14 | ttuttle | thoraxe: I assume they'll get fixed eventually. |
| 17:49.35 | Disconnect | thoraxe: i use it, now that its working |
| 17:50.01 | Disconnect | romainguy_: is that the same Email guy that released the current disaster on the world? if so, its a resounding endorsement of k-9.... |
| 17:50.10 | romainguy_ | ??? |
| 17:51.03 | Disconnect | no deletes. few updates (read/unread, etc). no moves. no notifications. no subscribe/unsubscribe. no multi-delete. no offense, but thats not someone i'd trust to define whats correct in an email app.. |
| 17:51.09 | romainguy_ | deletes work ine for me |
| 17:51.13 | romainguy_ | notifications word fine |
| 17:51.16 | jasta | ohh, jason responded to me this morning |
| 17:51.29 | romainguy_ | and the other ones I agree, these are missing features |
| 17:51.33 | Disconnect | romainguy_: on production units? or is this more "ooh we've got an engineering fix" noise? |
| 17:51.39 | thoraxe | Disconnect: you use which? |
| 17:51.41 | romainguy_ | production unit |
| 17:51.44 | Disconnect | thoraxe: k-9 |
| 17:51.58 | thoraxe | romainguy_: deletes don't work at all |
| 17:52.01 | Disconnect | romainguy: then you are amazingly lucky. nobody else seems to be able to mark mail deleted. |
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| 17:52.08 | thoraxe | not with imap at least |
| 17:52.20 | Disconnect | (you could technically call 'expunge' a feature not a bug) |
| 17:52.25 | jbq | Disconnect: even if I agreed with your statement, I'd still argue that there are many ways to do something wrong - the fact that something is done differently from a wrong approach doesn't mean that it's right. |
| 17:52.40 | thoraxe | hahaha |
| 17:52.49 | fadden | See also: Vista |
| 17:53.55 | marcone | jbq: that's so pre 9/11 of you. In this post 9/11 world, there is only right and wrong, black and white. Never grey. |
| 17:53.56 | Disconnect | jbq: sure, but i'm just saying i would hesitate to take cooking advice from someone arrested by the dept of health... |
| 17:53.56 | mithro | blount: I think I fixed the problem with if the app crash with a low volume |
| 17:53.56 | Disconnect | random side note, is vibration supposed to fire for incoming emails or gmails? |
| 17:53.56 | Disconnect | if its in vibrate-only silent mode? |
| 17:53.58 | smr | Never grey. Always gray. |
| 17:53.59 | jbq | marcone: heh, how about Michael Jackson? black, or white? |
| 17:54.07 | Disconnect | jbq: gray |
| 17:54.19 | Disconnect | ..but speaking of people i don't take advice from :) |
| 17:55.03 | marcone | as MJ himself said: "It don't matter if you're black or white" |
| 17:55.09 | jasta | romainguy_: yay, looks like I got Jason's endorsement of my design. |
| 17:55.18 | jasta | so i'll proceed this weekend |
| 17:56.02 | oinkboink | any idea why that programm isnt running? http://nopaste.org/p/a8CfNLwwz |
| 17:56.03 | romainguy_ | cool |
| 17:56.51 | romainguy_ | Disconnect: fwiw, here's the email author's remark about K-9's implementation |
| 17:56.56 | romainguy_ | "Their first change was to add IMAP delete functionality... which was already there. They added new code that ignores the delete policy and deletes without copying the message to Trash first. Unless I'm not getting it, it seems like they just missed a setting that enables this feature already" |
| 17:57.54 | thoraxe | romainguy_: can you explain how the trash folder is supposed to work? |
| 17:58.05 | androoid | how would i sign my app through eclipse? |
| 17:58.12 | Disconnect | not an unreasonable statement so far as it goes. but - at least on my production unit - there is no policy setting, and i've -never- seen a client that built a trash folder by magic without copying status (deleted, read, etc) to teh server |
| 17:58.12 | romainguy_ | I push pixels, I don't know anything about IMAP :) |
| 17:58.21 | wastrel | pixels eh |
| 17:58.24 | wastrel | there's a lot of them on this thing |
| 17:58.42 | kslater | not as many as I'd have liked to see though |
| 17:58.43 | kslater | ;-) |
| 17:58.53 | Disconnect | ugh meetin,g bbl |
| 17:58.54 | kslater | 840 x 480 |
| 17:58.59 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 17:59.03 | smr | Anyone know about general 3D programming? |
| 17:59.09 | thoraxe | romainguy_: well, you would expect that pressing "delete" on an email would do what imap does (mark for deletion). it just appears that the android email app doesn't do that |
| 17:59.19 | thoraxe | romainguy_: it also likes to think email exists that doesn't |
| 17:59.22 | thoraxe | and folders |
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| 18:00.07 | thoraxe | hmm... which romain is the romain |
| 18:01.19 | romainguy__ | all of them |
| 18:01.35 | thoraxe | ah ok |
| 18:01.43 | thoraxe | well, hopefully the delete/email/folder stuff will get fixed |
| 18:01.56 | thoraxe | until then i will just have to use the email client to read |
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| 18:03.20 | tethridge | who is happy for the g1 price cut at wal-mart? :-) |
| 18:03.20 | Dougie187 | Wow, G1 at walmart for $150? |
| 18:03.29 | ttuttle | Dougie187: What?! |
| 18:03.31 | tethridge | $148 |
| 18:03.32 | michaelnovakjr | Dougie187: with a contract only? |
| 18:03.39 | ttuttle | michaelnovakjr: of course |
| 18:03.44 | michaelnovakjr | gr |
| 18:03.46 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: probably |
| 18:03.51 | tethridge | it's still tmo |
| 18:03.51 | Dougie187 | http://www.engadget.com/2008/10/28/t-mobile-g1-coming-to-walmart-for-148-88/ |
| 18:03.59 | michaelnovakjr | tethridge: doesn't matter to me |
| 18:04.04 | *** join/#android Payal (n=fkp021@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 18:04.06 | michaelnovakjr | i just want a test device |
| 18:04.22 | Dougie187 | go get it month to month. |
| 18:04.30 | *** join/#android ironfroggy_LT (i=474cf63f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-9aecb10912cf6d8e) |
| 18:04.38 | androoid | i just did jarsigner -verify myapp.apk and it came out jar verifid. |
| 18:04.38 | michaelnovakjr | you mean the prepaid ones? |
| 18:04.45 | androoid | then i try to load it to my phone and it won't install |
| 18:04.55 | michaelnovakjr | what's your error androoid ? |
| 18:05.08 | androoid | application install unsuccessful |
| 18:05.13 | androoid | when I try to install it |
| 18:05.14 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: yeah. |
| 18:05.24 | michaelnovakjr | interesting, didn't know you could do that |
| 18:05.42 | ironfroggy_LT | hi from my g1! |
| 18:05.47 | michaelnovakjr | Dougie187: do you still get the phone for $180 or do you have to pay the full full price |
| 18:06.04 | Dougie187 | you pay $400 but you can cancel you don't need a plan. |
| 18:06.13 | ironfroggy_LT | now to find a real irc client... |
| 18:06.17 | Dougie187 | just activate it, add your gmail acct, and cancel your plan then use wifi |
| 18:06.21 | ttuttle | should write an IRC client. |
| 18:06.38 | ironfroggy_LT | im on via mibbit |
| 18:06.45 | *** join/#android danW_ (n=dan@sdsl-104-051.dsl.bway.net) |
| 18:06.53 | michaelnovakjr | Dougie187: $400 is a lot |
| 18:06.57 | michaelnovakjr | kinda sucks |
| 18:07.12 | Dougie187 | michaelnovakjr: its not terrible for a test device... |
| 18:07.16 | michaelnovakjr | i dont care if its locked down... |
| 18:07.30 | Dougie187 | you could always just get it and keep it for 14 days. |
| 18:07.31 | Dougie187 | then return it |
| 18:08.20 | *** join/#android cybereagle (n=cybereag@unaffiliated/cybereagle) |
| 18:09.00 | DarkriftX | yes you should ttuttle |
| 18:09.04 | ironfroggy_LT | yea this arrived today and it turns out ive got 0 coverage at home |
| 18:09.20 | michaelnovakjr | Dougie187: i'll end up getting one eventually |
| 18:09.35 | smr | ironfroggy: you can get out of your contract if that's the case |
| 18:09.39 | ironfroggy_LT | thank FSM for wifi. wife isnt so lucky. |
| 18:09.54 | ironfroggy_LT | oh? |
| 18:10.18 | ironfroggy_LT | thinking of getting a booster. if they really work... |
| 18:10.24 | BHSPitWeb | argh |
| 18:10.24 | BHSPitWeb | I want to see that engadget link, but I can't |
| 18:10.28 | BHSPitWeb | DNS is screwed up in my building, half the internet can't resolve |
| 18:10.41 | smr | can you use alternate DNS? |
| 18:10.43 | androoid | after I sign it, does it only work in the market? |
| 18:10.54 | Dougie187 | BHSPitWeb: why not use opendns? |
| 18:11.08 | Dougie187 | or ssh and socks proxy your traffic. |
| 18:11.19 | *** join/#android disappearedng (n=disappea@CPE001e5840eff4-CM001ac316d50e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 18:11.21 | disappearedng | hi everyone |
| 18:11.36 | disappearedng | What is the new method for getCurrentPostition for the position manager? |
| 18:12.04 | *** join/#android ironfroggy_ (i=474cf63f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-d392cc248e3ba6aa) |
| 18:12.47 | disappearedng | ? |
| 18:14.18 | *** join/#android mpardo (n=chatzill@75.144.91.181) |
| 18:15.03 | *** join/#android romainguy_ (n=gfx@nat/google/x-7557764923701f96) |
| 18:15.42 | mpardo | umdk1d3: ur app published yet? |
| 18:15.44 | androoid | http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/2f65a7d31e3648d5/0c2e6e7254ac8c01?lnk=gst&q=application+install+unsuccessful#0c2e6e7254ac8c01 |
| 18:15.48 | *** join/#android DrTune (n=raplin@c-24-6-43-37.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:16.14 | marcone | disappearedng: getLastKnownLocation() perhaps? |
| 18:17.31 | disappearedng | nah I am getting an error from that |
| 18:17.54 | disappearedng | This is what I am doing: getLastKnownLocation(myManager.getBestProvider(new Criteria(), true)).getLatitude(); |
| 18:18.07 | disappearedng | I tried getLastKnownLocation() already thx |
| 18:18.33 | marcone | what is the error you're getting? |
| 18:19.17 | *** join/#android ralfz (n=ralf@69.36.227.131) |
| 18:20.18 | disappearedng | Stopped unexpectedly please try again |
| 18:20.30 | disappearedng | All I want is a simple location |
| 18:21.08 | marcone | "Stopped unexpectedly" sounds like you're getting an exception in your application. 'logcat' should tell you what the exception is. |
| 18:21.33 | disappearedng | how do I go about logcat? |
| 18:21.57 | michaelnovakjr | adb logcat on the command line disappearedng |
| 18:22.02 | marcone | 'adb shell logcat', or use the DDMS plugin in eclipse and view the logcat tab |
| 18:22.08 | disappearedng | ok |
| 18:22.12 | disappearedng | public LocationProvider getProvider(String name) |
| 18:22.16 | disappearedng | What string can I try |
| 18:22.18 | disappearedng | brb |
| 18:22.50 | eldenz | iirc there is also a standalone tool, binary called `ddms` which displays the same as the eclipse view |
| 18:23.15 | eldenz | (there is definitely one just not sure about the binary name) |
| 18:23.17 | *** join/#android jmo (n=joeo@74.125.60.1) |
| 18:23.32 | marcone | in any case, my guess would be you're getting a null pointer exception. Since you've chained a bunch together on to one line, that makes it a bit hard to debug. I would suggest breaking that up in to multiple calls, and then stepping through it in the debugger to see where it goes wrong. |
| 18:23.33 | zhobbs | disappearedng: try LocationManager.NETWORK_PROVIDER or GPS_PROVIDER |
| 18:23.49 | androoid | here is my post on google groups to my problem... http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/b1e42d421cc94b26 |
| 18:25.36 | *** join/#android freemymind (n=freemymi@12-219-131-129.client.mchsi.com) |
| 18:26.40 | TreyB | marcone: Just exactly how does one get a Null-Pointer-Exception in a garbage collected language (unless the GC doesn't work)? |
| 18:27.17 | eldenz | Integer i = null; i;? |
| 18:27.56 | TreyB | The compiler should barf all over that, I would think. |
| 18:28.25 | ttuttle | TreyB: String s = null; String t = s + "\n"; |
| 18:28.48 | marcone | TreyB: in the example above, if 'myManager' were null, then myManager.getBestProvider() would result in an NPE. |
| 18:29.07 | Meph|sto | myManager.getBestProvider() might return null, if no provider can be found |
| 18:29.34 | androoid | ooh I see andnav on the apps |
| 18:31.07 | *** join/#android WaterDragon (n=nick@82-171-181-208.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 18:31.15 | *** join/#android matt_c_ (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 18:32.41 | TreyB | should probably resist the urge to post under the influence of cold medicine. |
| 18:32.58 | Death_Syn | w00t, got my ExtUSB to 2.5mm adapter |
| 18:33.12 | ttuttle | Death_Syn: nice |
| 18:33.20 | Death_Syn | yep |
| 18:33.22 | Death_Syn | works, too |
| 18:33.30 | *** join/#android ralfz_ (n=ralf@nat/google/x-655c4ffe61ac13b4) |
| 18:33.33 | *** join/#android hackbod (n=hackbod@nat/google/x-2f9d311bc9006863) |
| 18:33.34 | Death_Syn | nobody around me that sells HTC devices seems to carry such a thing |
| 18:33.37 | Death_Syn | I don't get why |
| 18:33.38 | *** join/#android JoeBrain (n=JoeBrain@adsl-70-232-148-93.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 18:33.43 | Death_Syn | there's so much headset sales they're losing |
| 18:33.44 | neekers | treyb: codeine cough syrup? |
| 18:34.09 | TreyB | I hope it doesn't come to that. |
| 18:34.40 | TreyB | I mean, it works great, but I'd rather not need it :-) |
| 18:35.51 | *** join/#android greencookie (n=greencoo@199.17.248.93) |
| 18:36.13 | smr | I wound up buying two. One to keep at work and the other to keep in my car |
| 18:36.14 | greencookie | sweet. I typed /join #android on impulse..and boy its packin! :) |
| 18:36.44 | Death_Syn | smr: 2 what? |
| 18:36.50 | greencookie | G1s? |
| 18:37.02 | smr | extUSB adapter |
| 18:37.08 | greencookie | :) |
| 18:37.10 | Death_Syn | ahh |
| 18:37.24 | Death_Syn | next i want to get a splitter so I can charge my phone and run headset at the same time |
| 18:38.03 | smr | I got one of those in my car. I have that in my car and a extUSB->3.5mm at my desk here |
| 18:38.18 | smr | They're dirt cheap on Amazon, but then there's shipping |
| 18:38.23 | greencookie | Anyone in here on the Nov 10th G1 list? |
| 18:38.29 | andyross | Hrm... my phone is whining about the update now. What's contained in that? |
| 18:38.49 | Death_Syn | andyross: bug fixes, amazon mp3 store file corruption fix, and a security fix for the browser |
| 18:39.06 | neekers | geencookie: i was, but i canceled it and went in and bought my g1 at the local tmobile store |
| 18:39.06 | ttuttle | andyross: which update is it offering? |
| 18:39.30 | zhobbs | Death_Syn: was the amazon problem an android problem, or just an update for the amazon app? |
| 18:39.44 | greencookie | neekers, nice. I should have done that too. I just upgraded over the internet yesterday, only to find out they were in backorder :( |
| 18:39.46 | Death_Syn | zhobbs: dunno, only what I read on the forums |
| 18:39.52 | andyross | I don't know, it just says "an update is available" and warns that I won't be able to make emergency calls (?) while it's in progress. But it sounds like it's nothing that's going to hose any development work. |
| 18:40.25 | Death_Syn | andyross: i haven't seen/heard of anyone having issues with it so far |
| 18:40.26 | *** part/#android jt436 (n=jtomlins@sdserver66.mforma.com) |
| 18:40.37 | neekers | greencookie: call tmobile customer service and tell them you would rather buy locally, i'm sure they will cancel it for you |
| 18:40.51 | Death_Syn | the tmobile people on forums seem to indicate that they're being conservative on updates right now to not rock the boat too much |
| 18:41.01 | greencookie | neekers, I should try that today. |
| 18:41.03 | smr | Damn, it's tough being on the bleeding edge... Writing code is so tough right now because of the lack of good documentation |
| 18:41.04 | *** join/#android jt436 (n=jtomlins@sdserver66.mforma.com) |
| 18:41.19 | Death_Syn | G1 launches in UK Thursday, apparently |
| 18:42.02 | mpardo | is there any way to see the market and reviews and such from pc? |
| 18:42.12 | Death_Syn | mpardo: good question |
| 18:42.12 | zhobbs | mpardo: no |
| 18:42.17 | mpardo | blah |
| 18:42.19 | andyross | smr: That cuts both ways though. People who can't figure stuff out for themselves are at a comparative disadvantage in the market. :) |
| 18:42.20 | mpardo | k thx |
| 18:42.34 | neekers | heh |
| 18:42.37 | smr | andyross: right, but this is really a son of a bitch |
| 18:43.56 | waldo_ | the total shit apps are hitting the market as we speak :) |
| 18:44.01 | waldo_ | demos and such |
| 18:44.24 | ttuttle | waldo_: We should get a group of people together to systematically rank demos with 1 star, like the Amazon thing. |
| 18:44.31 | blount | waits for the wave of "I am rich" knockoffs |
| 18:44.33 | jt436 | well not every app is going to be great |
| 18:44.35 | ttuttle | waldo_: The other things will work themselves out. |
| 18:44.38 | andyross | Yeah. Hopefully they start culling or hiding some of the junkier stuff as the market fills up. I guess there's a popularity scale, which will help some. |
| 18:44.38 | waldo_ | ttuttle yeah |
| 18:44.42 | greencookie | is there a list of g1 apps somewhere on the web? |
| 18:44.55 | greencookie | s/g1/android/g :) |
| 18:45.46 | zhobbs | greencookie: andapps.org , helloandroid.com/apps , slideme.org |
| 18:45.55 | Disconnect | fwiw the stores have been warned that the g1 upgrade might wipe out all user-generated data (ie non-cloud stuff - app installs, saved data, etc. anything not on sd card.) |
| 18:45.55 | greencookie | sweet! thanks zhobbs |
| 18:46.00 | neekers | it's like people, a lot of them are just demos of what they could really be. |
| 18:46.06 | zhobbs | greencookie: but none of them compare to the Market |
| 18:46.08 | jt436 | ha |
| 18:46.10 | jasta | zhobbs: well, come on, none of those repos are anything like the market ;) |
| 18:46.11 | greencookie | rofl neekers |
| 18:46.15 | jasta | oh, you already admitted that |
| 18:46.16 | jasta | hehe |
| 18:46.24 | waldo_ | greencookie try http://andappstore.com |
| 18:46.36 | greencookie | thnx waldo_ |
| 18:47.51 | greencookie | interesting apps :) |
| 18:48.13 | greencookie | offcourse a lot of people must have put their hard work into it so :) :D |
| 18:48.43 | greencookie | are these apps free ? |
| 18:49.05 | jt436 | for now yes, paid apps are not yet supported |
| 18:49.12 | michaelnovakjr | sweet |
| 18:49.20 | michaelnovakjr | keep it that way :) |
| 18:49.30 | *** join/#android mz2 (n=mz2@cpc4-cmbg1-0-0-cust1013.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:49.44 | herriojr | I'm having an issue where my application is dying on the line "if (someclassinstance == null) {" |
| 18:49.44 | michaelnovakjr | ::wishful thinking:: |
| 18:49.53 | herriojr | it doesn't make sense |
| 18:50.31 | greencookie | oh there's iSkoot for skype app? I thought tmobile didnt allow for making voice calls over their data plan..or was i mistaken>/? |
| 18:50.59 | Disconnect | iskoot doesn't do voice calls afaik |
| 18:51.10 | Disconnect | thought it was basically just IM |
| 18:51.16 | smr | I think that's the case |
| 18:51.28 | herriojr | it says I have a null pointer exception |
| 18:51.34 | herriojr | but I'm checking the pointer against null |
| 18:51.52 | greencookie | From the description: Acess your Skype contacts, make & receive Skype calls, chat, and place SkypeOut calls to phone numbers all over the world." |
| 18:51.55 | Disconnect | found the info. it makes straight voice calls into a skype gateway.. |
| 18:52.19 | Disconnect | " iSkoot for Skype leverages the voice-optimized circuit-switched wireless networks of mobile carriers, allowing for full operation even without access to WiFi or 3G networks and ensuring the best possible call quality. Normal carrier voice and data charges always apply." |
| 18:52.23 | Disconnect | http://news.softpedia.com/news/iSkoot-Announces-the-First-VoIP-Application-for-Android-G1-96589.shtml |
| 18:52.26 | Disconnect | so its fine - its just a voice call |
| 18:52.47 | greencookie | Oh. okay. cool |
| 18:53.05 | greencookie | i was kinda excited that I could do it over wifi or the data plan :) |
| 18:53.28 | Meph|sto | herriorj: are you sure that line shouldn't read "if (someclassinstance != null) {" ? |
| 18:54.05 | herriojr | ok, I figured it out, the line numbers are inaccurate |
| 18:57.53 | *** join/#android DJTachyon (n=DJTachyo@ool-43517dec.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 18:58.47 | *** part/#android DrTune (n=raplin@c-24-6-43-37.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:59.45 | Meph|sto | does anyone know if it's possible to get street numbers from the reverse geocoding built into android? i only get street names so far.. |
| 18:59.50 | DJTachyon | so what distro you guys recommend to dev android source on? |
| 19:00.34 | jasta | DJTachyon: there is no recommendation for that |
| 19:00.44 | michaelnovakjr | windows!!!!!!!!!! |
| 19:00.45 | jasta | in general, i recommend ubuntu, but that has absolutely nothing to do with android. |
| 19:00.50 | michaelnovakjr | totally a joke |
| 19:00.55 | michaelnovakjr | i use ubuntu as well |
| 19:00.58 | DJTachyon | heh |
| 19:01.07 | DJTachyon | i am running VMWare Workstation |
| 19:01.10 | DJTachyon | in XP |
| 19:01.16 | jasta | _ugh_ |
| 19:01.25 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 19:01.57 | neekers | eclipse on xp works just fine for me |
| 19:01.59 | DJTachyon | im too lazy to get a linux box out |
| 19:02.09 | jasta | DJTachyon: then why'd you ask? |
| 19:02.16 | jasta | actually nevermind, i don't care |
| 19:02.36 | DJTachyon | because im trying to figure out which distro to install on the VM |
| 19:02.38 | Disconnect | oh and for the record, the vibe does fire when an email comes in in silent mode. its just so weak and brief that i miss it every single time :( |
| 19:02.53 | DJTachyon | Ill probably put on Ubunu |
| 19:02.55 | mpardo | Has anyone here tried the whitepages caller id? |
| 19:02.55 | DJTachyon | +t |
| 19:03.06 | Disconnect | DJTachyon: fwiw i use ubuntu and osx |
| 19:03.13 | *** join/#android ian_brasil (n=ian@dasasob.nokia.com) |
| 19:04.10 | DJTachyon | okays .. last distro I used was gentoo 64-bit on a SPARC ULTRA1 .. otherwise I just use cygwin |
| 19:04.14 | DJTachyon | i know .. I'm lame ;) |
| 19:04.56 | tomgibara | romainguy_: In retrospect, there's an obvious problem with disallowing zero animation durations - animations generated from attribute sets often don't specify a duration which defaults to zero. |
| 19:06.00 | smr | Anyone every have any problems loading assets with getAssets().openXmlResourceParser()? |
| 19:06.33 | smr | I get a filenotfound exception when the file is clearly there. I can only think that maybe the build process is not including the assets in my apk |
| 19:09.51 | fadden | smr: you can view the contents of your APK with "unzip" |
| 19:09.53 | Laz | we still cant theme android? |
| 19:10.51 | herriojr | when doing a query on People.CONTENT_URI on the G1, and I pass in People.DISPLAY_NAME + " desc" as the orderBy, it isn't sorting it, has anyone else experienced this, or am I doing it wrong? |
| 19:11.05 | *** join/#android Mephyst (n=m@78.142.163.74) |
| 19:11.08 | smr | ah, the documentation is wrong |
| 19:11.24 | DJTachyon | hmm the 64AMD build of ubuntu is intel 64 compatible too? |
| 19:11.27 | androoid | how do i delete all app data? |
| 19:11.46 | *** join/#android undiscover (n=presiden@ip98-164-212-99.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 19:13.12 | thoraxe | man i can't wait for vpn client |
| 19:13.21 | DJTachyon | or vnc ;) |
| 19:13.34 | thoraxe | ooh vnc would be interesting |
| 19:13.55 | Death_Syn | DJTachyon: not IA64, but EM64T, yes |
| 19:14.29 | undiscover | Anyone know if there's a better way to access the device than using adb shell? It seems useless -- no permission to kill processes or even to view most directories. |
| 19:14.51 | andyross | Not until someone finds a way out of the lockdown, now. |
| 19:14.52 | andyross | er, no |
| 19:14.57 | *** join/#android meoblast001 (n=meoblast@dynamic-acs-24-239-93-241.zoominternet.net) |
| 19:15.16 | zhobbs | fyi, this works: http://www.unlock-tmobileg1.com/ We just unlocked a few of them |
| 19:15.20 | smr | It seems that opening an asset requires me to include 'assets/' in the path, though everything I've read on the internet shows otherwise |
| 19:15.25 | DJTachyon | oh alright .. so this ubuntu-8.04.1-desktop-amd64.iso will work on my Q6600 then? |
| 19:15.28 | undiscover | zhobbs: thank |
| 19:15.28 | danfuzz | blort |
| 19:15.29 | undiscover | *thanks |
| 19:15.37 | Death_Syn | DJTachyon: yes |
| 19:15.46 | smr | It's like Android is fighting me every step of the way on my way to creating an application |
| 19:15.51 | BHSPitWeb | heh |
| 19:16.46 | andyross | smr: FWIW, I crawled around in the code for assets yesterday and decided that they're basically cruft. Raw resources seem to be the better supported API. |
| 19:17.22 | smr | But conceptually my files are not resources, they are assets |
| 19:17.39 | smr | Specifically 3D models and the various textures and shaders to go along with |
| 19:17.43 | DJTachyon | my first time installing a VM, this should be fun :) |
| 19:17.44 | andyross | Meh. Physically, they're exactly the same things: files in your .apk zip archive. |
| 19:18.30 | smr | No, as far as I have read resources are compiled in |
| 19:18.43 | andyross | No, raw resources are files in your archive. Take a look. :) |
| 19:18.45 | *** join/#android BruteSource (n=BruteSou@m070e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 19:18.54 | undiscover | Do any of you know where the Messaging app stores its data? My most pressing need is to back up my text messages. My phone is physically defective & I need to swap it out. |
| 19:19.41 | andyross | It's true that resources have the device-type and I18N indirection features, which you might not care about or want. It's a thicker API. But like I said, it's easier to figure out. My guess is that assets were an early idea that didn't quite get dropped before 1.0 was stamped. |
| 19:19.51 | waldo_ | oh joy-- Wal Mart gets the g1 tomorrow I think http://androidcommunity.com/wal_mart-confirmed-to-sell-t-mobile-g1-very-soon-20081028/ |
| 19:20.00 | smr | perhaps you're right, though the documentation is misleading: "Resources are external files (that is, non-code files) that are used by your code and compiled into your application at build time." |
| 19:20.17 | Disconnect | undiscover: thats one of those things you aren't to be trusted with on the g1 unfortunately |
| 19:20.44 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 19:20.50 | andyross | I'm certainly no expert, and maybe some of the googlers here want to step in and explain what the point of assets is. But I couldn't see one. |
| 19:21.25 | *** join/#android matt_c (n=mcroydon@gozur.sunflowerbroadband.com) |
| 19:21.31 | *** join/#android cutmasta (n=cutmasta@ip-78-94-145-44.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 19:21.54 | undiscover | disconnect: ah, sucks. |
| 19:21.58 | DJTachyon | recommendations on the NIC? NAT or Bridged for the CM? |
| 19:22.08 | jmo | andyross: you're right, assets came first |
| 19:22.17 | DJTachyon | aww workstation only supports 2 CPUS :P |
| 19:22.21 | BruteSource | untill someone roots the g1 that is. |
| 19:22.22 | jmo | assets are files that are bundled directly into the apk file |
| 19:22.25 | jmo | which is just a zip file |
| 19:22.46 | smr | One frustrating inconsistency with assets is that AssetManager has a method called "openXmlResourceParser", but it only seems to parse binary XML resources. XML files in assets are not compiled to binary." |
| 19:22.53 | jmo | resources are built into a file that's indexed reasonably, and identified by the resource id |
| 19:23.10 | Disconnect | BruteSource: sure but thats not today. and with a defective unit he could really use that most basic of smartphone apps.. the backup/restore app. oops.. except thats not secure enough. its way more secure to lose everything periodically :( |
| 19:23.29 | jmo | aapt will convert xml files to binary xml if they're in a directory called xml |
| 19:23.31 | BruteSource | lol |
| 19:23.59 | BruteSource | it could be today, who knows.. suprised it has taken this long really. |
| 19:24.00 | jmo | some resources, like drawables and xml files are pointers to assets |
| 19:24.03 | *** join/#android juice_d (n=juice_d@1.8.124.24.cm.sunflower.com) |
| 19:24.34 | thoraxe | i wonder if facebook will make an app |
| 19:24.46 | jmo | and like andyross said, resources handle i18n and all of the other configurations. assets are just blobs. |
| 19:24.52 | BHSPitWeb | thoraxe: their platform is open. |
| 19:24.55 | pawalls | thoraxe, The APIs are freely available. |
| 19:25.07 | smr | this is frustrating |
| 19:25.28 | BHSPitWeb | Facebook doesn't make apps for computers/devices |
| 19:25.33 | Disconnect | thoraxe: they've said unequivicably no, they don't like google. but they aren't going to hassle anyone else who does it. |
| 19:25.41 | Disconnect | BHSPitWeb: actually istr they did the iphone app in house |
| 19:25.48 | smr | I just want a folder called "models" that has XML files which I can read with AssetManager.openXmlResourceParser |
| 19:25.51 | DJTachyon | thoraxe: With word from Motorola about their planned Android phone, I'm sure Facebook integration will come in some form or another |
| 19:25.56 | waldo_ | seriously tehy'er selling htem at walmart tomorrow |
| 19:26.11 | unix_lappy | The conundrum is, how would the facebook app provider make money off the app until there's a paid mechanism to generate returns. |
| 19:26.15 | Disconnect | DJTachyon: yah but thats moto dev money not fb dev money. |
| 19:26.22 | waldo_ | Whoever writes the first NASCAR app makes a billion dollars |
| 19:26.38 | unix_lappy | i'm not sure facebook allows ad revenue from 3rd party app vendors that plugin to their api to be carried over from 3rd party ad networks. |
| 19:26.48 | BHSPitWeb | Disconnect: it was a facebook employee's project, so yes, it was technically "in-house", but they don't claim it as being official. |
| 19:27.30 | DJTachyon | heh apparently so Waldo .. wow |
| 19:27.37 | DJTachyon | $150 for a G1 at Walmart |
| 19:28.18 | *** join/#android shackan (n=frob@host24-192-dynamic.3-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 19:28.29 | unix_lappy | DJTachyon: imho, a more reasonable price. |
| 19:28.30 | thoraxe | cuz the facebook website doesn't work awesome |
| 19:28.34 | BruteSource | ya with a 2 yr contract |
| 19:28.38 | DJTachyon | yeah |
| 19:28.42 | DJTachyon | still a contract involved |
| 19:28.45 | unix_lappy | especially for the quality of device you're getting. |
| 19:28.45 | thoraxe | i am pissed about the walmart price, but whatever, $30 |
| 19:28.52 | DJTachyon | yeah |
| 19:29.01 | DJTachyon | guess my wife gets hers cheaper next month now ;) |
| 19:29.02 | thoraxe | sigh imap email let's fix you |
| 19:29.34 | jgib | thoraxe: jlapenna-laptop made an app for facebook |
| 19:29.38 | jgib | thoraxe: it's called Statusinator |
| 19:29.50 | Disconnect | i thought it just did status |
| 19:29.52 | jgib | thoraxe: it just handles status and pictures for now |
| 19:29.52 | thoraxe | jgib: i thought that was just for status |
| 19:29.54 | jgib | true. |
| 19:29.55 | Disconnect | i can do that (and more) with hellotxt.com |
| 19:30.01 | thoraxe | yeah... i'd like the phonebook |
| 19:30.06 | BruteSource | looks like ebay is still my only choice |
| 19:30.07 | Disconnect | and without sucking down the seriously limited storage |
| 19:30.16 | thoraxe | not that it would've helped me yesterday cuz the guy's number wasn't on FB but still |
| 19:30.17 | DJTachyon | argh my VMWare setup is hanging |
| 19:30.17 | jgib | seriously limited storage indeed :( |
| 19:32.35 | *** join/#android poetic_folly|G5 (n=poetic_f@213-39.103-97.tampabay.res.rr.com) |
| 19:33.03 | jlapenna-laptop | The api does not provide access to phone numbers. :( |
| 19:33.11 | jgib | wow thats lame |
| 19:33.13 | jlapenna-laptop | I'd have to screen scrape, and that is against TOS |
| 19:33.33 | BHSPitWeb | How much storage is onboard a G1? |
| 19:33.48 | jgib | nobody needs more than like 16k right? |
| 19:34.02 | *** join/#android kennyz (n=kennyz@uralnet.org) |
| 19:34.17 | *** join/#android nebi (n=nebi@c-498fe253.02-145-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 19:34.38 | jgib | it's 128MB i think, for apps |
| 19:34.58 | andyross | 101MB according to /proc/meminfo |
| 19:35.02 | wasabi | I'd sure like a GPhone. |
| 19:35.08 | wasabi | =( Hope they move beyond TMobile soon |
| 19:35.14 | fadden | You get about 100MB of RAM and 70MB of internal flash. |
| 19:35.45 | smr | is frustrated with Android API |
| 19:35.45 | waldo_ | and then of course there's the MiniSD Card which can have 16GB |
| 19:35.49 | thoraxe | you can't store apps on the sdcard? |
| 19:35.50 | disappearedng | How do I just get a location? |
| 19:35.55 | geist | 128 but some is carved off at the top to deal with some multimedia stuff |
| 19:35.57 | fadden | Putting apps on /sdcard has some issues, in that apps can be modified/corrupted by any other app, and removing the sdcard or enabling USB mass storage causes running apps to freakk. |
| 19:36.01 | *** join/#android cdickerson (n=cdickers@ip65-44-219-34.z219-44-65.customer.algx.net) |
| 19:36.04 | geist | that's pretty common with SOCs that dont support scatter gather dma |
| 19:36.38 | morrildl | what's a GPhone? |
| 19:36.54 | waldo_ | its one higher than an FPhone |
| 19:37.00 | mithro | do we have screenshots of each widget somewhere? |
| 19:37.06 | BHSPitWeb | And two lower than an iPhone :( |
| 19:37.10 | cdickerson | In theory now that the android source is OSS if a phone company made a locked down android phone or someone makes a patch I want can I "re flash" an android phone? |
| 19:37.32 | blount | we really need a faq |
| 19:37.34 | fadden | Yeah. |
| 19:37.39 | cdickerson | sorry :( |
| 19:37.40 | fadden | FAQ #1: google does not make phones |
| 19:37.47 | andyross | fadden: It's not that hard, plain old MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_POPULATE will get you a copy that other applications can't hose with file access. |
| 19:37.51 | geist | BHSPitWeb: actually more like 35 lower. caps comes first |
| 19:38.02 | geist | 34 even |
| 19:38.04 | disappearedng | like |
| 19:38.19 | cdickerson | I didnt say google, was I being a bad? |
| 19:38.22 | BHSPitWeb | fadden: sounds more like a frequently sought answer than a frequently asked question |
| 19:38.25 | disappearedng | I keep getting an error for Double latPoint = myManager.getLastKnownLocation(myManager.GPS_PROVIDER).getLatitude(); |
| 19:38.31 | fadden | andyross: that'll keep mods/truncation from affecting the app while it runs, but remember that Android apps can be killed and restarted pretty freely. |
| 19:38.40 | *** join/#android jgib (n=jgibson@nat/google/x-b7a2314e92da57d0) |
| 19:38.48 | BHSPitWeb | geist: I anticipated that sort of reply from somebody. Nerd. |
| 19:38.59 | geist | guilty as charged |
| 19:39.04 | andyross | Yes, and a failed application load isn't that huge a deal, is it? Just a checksum over the .apk file stored somewhere under /data is enough to fix that. |
| 19:39.59 | fadden | andyross: I'm not saying it's a non-starter. I'm saying it has issues. |
| 19:40.11 | unix_lappy | fadden: I always thought that you couldnt run apps off the SD Card b/c it was mounted as noexec? |
| 19:40.14 | fadden | sdcard ejection is going to be the one that bites people. |
| 19:40.25 | fadden | unix_lappy: you can run interpreted (Dalvik) code. |
| 19:40.34 | waldo_ | is away: eating |
| 19:40.36 | fadden | And put your big fat APK files with tons of graphics there. |
| 19:40.46 | waldo_ | is away: eating |
| 19:40.52 | fadden | But things can get corrupted, or fall over, or disappear completely when you swap sdcards. |
| 19:41.24 | fadden | It creates a variety of new failure modes that customer service will have to address. |
| 19:41.34 | unix_lappy | ahh, so you essentially read from SD Card to memory and executes from there. |
| 19:41.40 | waldo_ | is away: eating |
| 19:41.54 | unix_lappy | waldo_ is annoying: #android |
| 19:42.09 | fadden | unix_lappy: actually, we memory-map the input file, so that the pages can be discarded and reloaded when things get tight |
| 19:42.15 | disappearedng | Hi everyone |
| 19:42.23 | disappearedng | how do I debug in android? |
| 19:42.49 | waldo_ | is away: eating this time for real |
| 19:42.55 | andyross | disappearedng: ... carefully? |
| 19:43.15 | *** part/#android cdickerson (n=cdickers@ip65-44-219-34.z219-44-65.customer.algx.net) |
| 19:43.20 | fadden | disappearedng: I believe the Eclipse / Android docs cover debugging. |
| 19:43.55 | disappearedng | ok |
| 19:44.11 | fadden | Look for stuff about "DDMS" in particular. |
| 19:44.34 | BruteSource | snakes on a phone |
| 19:44.38 | BruteSource | awesome |
| 19:45.21 | *** join/#android jgib (n=jgibson@66.227.77.146) |
| 19:46.17 | unix_lappy | BruteSource: no, snakes on a phone is when you get python or a derivative working :-P |
| 19:46.57 | tmccrary | I've had it with these motherfscking snakes on this motherfscking phone! |
| 19:46.57 | disappearedng | Can anyone help me debug? Constructor: service = android.location.ILocationManager$Stub$Proxy@433737c0 threadid=3: thread exiting with uncaught exception (group=0x40010e28) |
| 19:47.06 | tmccrary | so slow ;) |
| 19:47.16 | disappearedng | where my code is Double latPoint = myManager.getLastKnownLocation("gps").getLatitude(); |
| 19:48.00 | andyross | disappearedng: stick a try block around it, catch Throwable, and log the stack trace? |
| 19:48.19 | disappearedng | ok hold on |
| 19:48.26 | fadden | What exception is being thrown? |
| 19:48.47 | andyross | e.g. try { ... } catch(Throwable e) { Log.i("TAG", Log.getStackTraceString(e); } |
| 19:48.47 | andyross | That's been working well for me. |
| 19:49.32 | DJTachyon | well just tried creating an Ubuntu VM and it hung :P |
| 19:49.38 | fadden | You can also Log.i("TAG", "whoops", e), though you'll probably get the same info out of it. |
| 19:49.48 | disappearedng | k |
| 19:50.13 | andyross | It takes exceptions as raw parameters? Good to know. |
| 19:50.51 | fadden | Optional third arg. It just turns into "msg + '\n' + getStackTraceString(tr)". |
| 19:51.49 | smr | I've found an inconsistency with the AssetManager |
| 19:52.47 | smr | AssetManager.open will find "cube.xml", but AssetManager.openXmlResourceParser() will not |
| 19:53.05 | smr | openXmlResourceParser requires that I user "assets/cube.xml" |
| 19:55.30 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 19:56.46 | BruteSource | shove it inside |
| 19:58.01 | DJTachyon | woo hoo Ubuntu is installing on my VM :) |
| 19:59.54 | DJTachyon | doh it has an issue detecting my sound card b/c im through xp remote desktop |
| 20:03.20 | mithro | has anyone already implemented a SeekBarPreference before I go an do it myself? |
| 20:04.31 | *** join/#android greudin_ (n=g@AMarseille-156-1-7-146.w90-9.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:05.47 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@nat/google/x-1b885904c45a88f9) |
| 20:10.45 | andyross | Hah! One installable .apk file containing native code: http://plausible.org/andy/NativeAPK-debug.apk Install and run (the java side is just a clone of HelloActivity) and then check your logcat for interesting stuff. It just hits libc and libcutils functions right now, mostly exploring the process environment. I need to write some docs, then I'll have source code available too. |
| 20:11.11 | romainguy__ | I think the Mandelbrot app on Market has native code |
| 20:11.30 | andyross | Didn't say no one had done it before, just that I hadn't. And no one here seems to have gotten that far either. |
| 20:11.43 | michaelnovakjr | not trying :) |
| 20:13.11 | *** join/#android d0net2 (n=hebs@75-121-110-19.dyn.centurytel.net) |
| 20:13.13 | f00f- | that's cool, yeah mandelbrot has native stuff |
| 20:13.29 | d0net2 | any word on killing processes and services? |
| 20:14.51 | fadden | The Mandelbrot author had a head start. :-) |
| 20:15.02 | f00f- | hehe |
| 20:16.52 | *** join/#android ericrw (n=eric@pool-71-162-251-90.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) |
| 20:22.40 | BHSPitWeb | So is that largely G1-specific? |
| 20:23.16 | andyross | Bah. Checked the mandelbrot source. Pure CPU code there, no library integration. I win. Except, that is, for having an actual application to use it. :) |
| 20:23.38 | herriojr | this may sound dumb, but I can't find where to set alarms on the G1 |
| 20:23.55 | BHSPitWeb | herriojr: Alarm Clock |
| 20:23.59 | herriojr | omg |
| 20:24.06 | herriojr | I need to slap myself |
| 20:24.14 | Dougie187 | I was going to say check the users manual. |
| 20:24.14 | Dougie187 | lol |
| 20:24.18 | BHSPitWeb | and I don't even have a G1 :P |
| 20:24.47 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@wg-d232071.dsl.fsu.edu) |
| 20:25.18 | *** part/#android dipen (n=fdd001@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 20:25.27 | *** join/#android infil00p (n=jbowser@S0106001ff33fa167.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 20:25.34 | herriojr | I guess I got used to it being in settings on other phones |
| 20:25.54 | BHSPitWeb | Yeah, I'm that way too |
| 20:26.30 | BHSPitWeb | On my iPod Touch, every time I mean to go to the alarm (in the Clock app), I automatically tap the Settings app by mistake first |
| 20:26.44 | BHSPitWeb | As per my Windows Mobile conditioning... |
| 20:27.09 | d0net2 | hey could someone help me? im trying to install five-alpha |
| 20:27.14 | d0net2 | i have the server installed |
| 20:27.21 | d0net2 | i have the sdk installed |
| 20:27.27 | d0net2 | but i need to install the client on the phone |
| 20:27.48 | *** join/#android mz2 (n=mz2@cpc4-cmbg1-0-0-cust1013.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) |
| 20:28.12 | d0net2 | http://pastebin.ca/1238965 |
| 20:28.35 | d0net2 | i have the prereqs |
| 20:29.00 | d0net2 | but i need guidance from steps 1 on |
| 20:29.12 | *** join/#android greudin__ (n=g@AMarseille-156-1-7-146.w90-9.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:31.20 | BruteSource | whats a pumtucky leftover flappy? |
| 20:36.09 | *** join/#android tmarble (n=tmarble@user-38q4e4l.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 20:37.49 | d0net2 | nothin eh? |
| 20:42.31 | *** join/#android ralpht (n=ralpht@76-191-208-98.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net) |
| 20:43.09 | d0net2 | we need a guitar tuning app |
| 20:43.12 | d0net2 | or guitar toolkit |
| 20:43.53 | BHSPitWeb | all will come in due time |
| 20:44.08 | BruteSource | we need a proper shell |
| 20:44.19 | *** join/#android thesquib (n=squibble@202-78-145-31.cable.telstraclear.net) |
| 20:44.55 | Disconnect | backup/restore app. or just root and i'll do it myself with tar. |
| 20:47.23 | mikez5 | d0net2: a guitar tuner / metronome app would be cool |
| 20:48.33 | BruteSource | a rootkit would be beautiful |
| 20:48.38 | BruteSource | and an irc client |
| 20:49.29 | smr | is finally past the loading xml assets BS and writing *real* code |
| 20:50.44 | BruteSource | smr what are you writing? |
| 20:50.45 | *** join/#android yakischloba (n=jake@209.160.56.254) |
| 20:52.52 | smr | A game |
| 20:53.14 | smr | Using opengl ES |
| 20:53.26 | BruteSource | oh |
| 20:53.39 | BruteSource | why not write an irc client? =) |
| 20:53.54 | d0net2 | theres 2 being worked on |
| 20:54.03 | d0net2 | and you can use bitchx or irssi in connectbot |
| 20:54.10 | d0net2 | it seams to drain mad battery though |
| 20:54.32 | *** join/#android xnixan (n=xnixan@41.196.64.42) |
| 20:54.32 | BruteSource | lol a local irc client lmao |
| 20:54.42 | BruteSource | not ssh i |
| 20:54.51 | d0net2 | yea theres 2 being worked on |
| 20:54.54 | d0net2 | androidchat and ircell |
| 20:54.55 | *** join/#android anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07E6A4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:55.04 | BruteSource | nice |
| 20:56.35 | smr | no one will buy an IRC client! |
| 20:56.44 | smr | Or few will. But lost of people buy games |
| 20:58.41 | michaelnovakjr | i don't buy |
| 20:58.58 | eldenz | yoooo steal! |
| 20:59.12 | michaelnovakjr | i don't steal either :) |
| 20:59.18 | BruteSource | i do |
| 20:59.22 | eldenz | D : |
| 20:59.23 | Disconnect | it'd be nice if the platform did wifi powersaving too |
| 20:59.45 | eldenz | you code yourself! |
| 20:59.48 | jasta | Disconnect: using wifi at all _is_ power saving ;) |
| 21:00.35 | eldenz | you are all so lucky this is a virtual room... otherwise i'd probably walk out of here with at /least/ one G1.. and someone of you missing one :p |
| 21:00.43 | Disconnect | yah but i've got devices with similar battery (n800) and much larger base power use that can go 16 hours on wifi in a reasonable power-save mode without ever dropping association or losing packets. |
| 21:01.18 | jasta | Disconnect: well, Android powers off wi-fi some number of seconds after the screen goes off |
| 21:01.25 | jasta | the cellular radio, however, never automatically powers off |
| 21:01.27 | *** part/#android gustavold (n=gustavol@orlandia.ime.usp.br) |
| 21:01.43 | *** join/#android duey (n=duey@203.96.223.40) |
| 21:01.51 | BHSPitWeb | eldenz: using Free Software is neither buying nor stealing. |
| 21:01.59 | Disconnect | which hurts more - reassociating every 5 mins at full power just to check email (and maybe every 3 minutes if its out of sync between gmail, email and twidroid for example) or throttling down to a 1-second beacon (or less) and just hanging out on wifi the whole time? chip is off in both cases, but its a -real- fast ping/pong in powersave mode ("got packets?" "no") vs the big new-association mess |
| 21:02.30 | BruteSource | thats why ya use push? |
| 21:02.42 | Disconnect | BruteSource: push still requires a connection somewhere. |
| 21:02.43 | spikebike | disconect n800 has a mcuh lower power CPU, no gps, no edge/gprs/3g, and a screen that's not nearly as bright |
| 21:02.45 | eldenz | ah right, didn't think about that |
| 21:03.29 | spikebike | er well I'm not sure on the power, but it's much slower anyways |
| 21:03.35 | BruteSource | ya but you dont need to reconnect over and over |
| 21:03.42 | Disconnect | spikebike: screen is -way- brighter actually, at least on mine. and gps off, wifi off the g1 does pretty well against it. wifi on - low traffic, lower than the n800 even (since i'm not ssh'd into it mucking around) and it dies faster than a baby in a blender |
| 21:04.02 | Disconnect | BruteSource: ..how do you think it 'pushes'? its a tcp connection over edge/3g/wifi.. |
| 21:04.06 | spikebike | have you run your g1 down to zero yet? |
| 21:04.24 | Disconnect | its slower because its older. what, 3 years now? at least 2. |
| 21:04.24 | jasta | Disconnect: all push goes over the cellular radio |
| 21:04.41 | jasta | what seems to be is that it connects gtalk and gtalk gets "tickled" when new google data is available |
| 21:04.49 | jasta | which wakes up the radio to use a different connection to do the heavy lifting |
| 21:04.52 | jasta | so it'll use wifi to download changes |
| 21:05.00 | jasta | but the cellular radio to receive notifications of changes |
| 21:05.01 | Disconnect | jasta: so if i go into a basement with solid wifi and no gsm i get no email? suckage. |
| 21:05.08 | BruteSource | lol tickle |
| 21:05.09 | jasta | Disconnect: you get no push e-mail, yes. |
| 21:05.12 | Disconnect | (well, ok, "no email without polling") |
| 21:05.15 | waldo_ | is back (gone 01:09:45) |
| 21:05.19 | jasta | BruteSource: it's literally called a tickle, look at adb logcat. |
| 21:05.30 | jasta | Disconnect: you can just open gmail to get email :) |
| 21:05.34 | BHSPitWeb | Disconnect: unless there's a non-push method of automatic checking set up |
| 21:05.35 | BruteSource | i believe you |
| 21:05.39 | fadden | In return, your battery lasts longer. |
| 21:05.41 | BruteSource | just a funny word |
| 21:05.52 | waldo_ | is away: I'm.. busy. |
| 21:05.53 | BHSPitWeb | My phone's not ticklish. |
| 21:06.00 | BruteSource | like jiggle or smerp |
| 21:06.09 | *** join/#android meoblast001 (n=meoblast@dynamic-acs-24-239-93-241.zoominternet.net) |
| 21:06.26 | jasta | fadden: hey i talked to the guy that wrote the Email app |
| 21:06.36 | Disconnect | either way.. a wifi association, dhcp and connection establishment takes what, 10-15 seconds at full power? you -can't- claim thats lower power than waking up for a few ms every couple of seconds... |
| 21:06.48 | jasta | he's sponsoring my redesign of the Email internals tos upport IMAP IDLE and other sophisticated features |
| 21:06.48 | jbq | would love to see "real" server-initiated push available... but not in a NAT IPv4 world. |
| 21:07.00 | fadden | Cool. |
| 21:07.17 | jasta | jbq: completely agree. but also, on a cellular network that would be some damn fancy switching to allow. |
| 21:07.41 | jasta | jbq: each device would need a unique ip address, roughly for the life of the phone |
| 21:07.48 | jasta | or at least some way to use DNS to get it. |
| 21:07.54 | jasta | (involving DNS would be even more trouble!) |
| 21:08.07 | jasta | and when you port to a new carrier, your server would need some way to know that this all is different now |
| 21:08.11 | BruteSource | is vedeo phone available over 3g? |
| 21:08.13 | jbq | FWIW, is looking at what it takes to recompile the Email app (or any other app) in a way that allows to use it on a device side-by-side with the original one. |
| 21:08.22 | BruteSource | video |
| 21:08.26 | jasta | jbq: i already wrote a script |
| 21:08.37 | wastrel | yesss password safe hits the marketplace |
| 21:08.45 | jasta | i wrote a perl script that swaps package namespaces arbitrarily to allow you to load system apps with a new name |
| 21:08.46 | jbq | I'm trying to see if I can reduce it to a one-liner. |
| 21:08.47 | wastrel | thank you! |
| 21:08.57 | Lenolium | BruteSource: Video phone doesn't seem like it would be useful on the G1, the camera is on the back, and the screen is on the front. |
| 21:08.59 | jasta | jbq: how? |
| 21:09.17 | Disconnect | Lenolium: carry one of those mirrored sprint phones to use as .. well.. a mirror. |
| 21:09.38 | jasta | my script translates the whole package namespace because i was under the impression the AndroidManifest wasn't sophisticated enough to pretend to be one package space to android, but then use reflection against another package space |
| 21:09.53 | jasta | nor should it be :) |
| 21:09.54 | BruteSource | wasnt specific to g1 |
| 21:10.51 | jbq | it *might* be possible to do it from just the manifest. It seems like the manifest's package name doesn't actually need to match the source files' package names. |
| 21:11.03 | jasta | jbq: when doing push, am i correct in assuming that the AlarmManager is the only way to keep the connection alive? |
| 21:11.36 | jasta | jbq: really? i thought the exact opposite. it looked to me like the manifest describes the package space then runtime uses reflection to get at the classes with that package space |
| 21:11.53 | jasta | thats hwy you do things like say activity name=".suffix.Foo" |
| 21:12.14 | romainguy_ | jasta: actuall you can simply rename the package name in the manifest and leave the Java files alone |
| 21:12.22 | romainguy_ | and then use the f ully qualified package name for activities |
| 21:12.27 | romainguy_ | argh |
| 21:12.28 | romainguy_ | jbq beat me |
| 21:12.31 | jbq | the key here is that you can say android:name="com.android.email.foo.bar" with an absolute class name regardless of the manifest's package. |
| 21:12.34 | romainguy_ | needs to learn the logs :) |
| 21:12.41 | jasta | well yeah i figured that would be true |
| 21:12.47 | jasta | but thats not desirable for my purposes |
| 21:13.11 | jasonparekh_ | jbq: don't forget about any string literal in code referring to the app's package name (in manifest terms) will also need to be changed too |
| 21:13.15 | jasta | i'm not just trying to load it onto the phone, i'm trying to maintain a clean diff :) |
| 21:13.48 | romainguy_ | and the R file is apparently generated in the package defined by the manifest |
| 21:14.04 | jasta | romainguy_: also, what about setClassName("foo", "package.foo")? |
| 21:14.10 | jasta | that will fire intents against the original package |
| 21:14.31 | romainguy_ | Email uses Strings instead of TheClass.class |
| 21:14.58 | jasta | hmm, well, my script doesnt have to deal with any particulars of the app being converted |
| 21:15.32 | *** join/#android malcolm_ (n=malcom@151.65.91.174) |
| 21:16.19 | jasta | all mine does is just basically a mass translate of all java, aidl, and XML files. |
| 21:16.29 | romainguy_ | yes |
| 21:16.35 | romainguy_ | I was just wondering out loud |
| 21:16.45 | romainguy_ | if Email does this, it should use TheClass.class instead |
| 21:16.45 | jbq | that requires to move the files around, right? |
| 21:16.51 | jasta | which is of course fallable in its own terrible way, but still more general. |
| 21:16.55 | jasta | romainguy_: i know for a fact that it does ;) |
| 21:17.06 | romainguy_ | then fix this while you're at it :) |
| 21:17.28 | jasta | jbq: well, a single mv of for example com/android/email com/android/whatever |
| 21:17.58 | jasta | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:18.01 | jasta | ;) |
| 21:18.11 | jasta | romainguy_: i'm encouraged after talking to Jason about some of these issues |
| 21:18.21 | jasta | he admits that his design isn't right but he just didnt know that at the time |
| 21:18.33 | jasta | so he seems to be behind all of my proposed changes |
| 21:18.47 | jbq | "the design isn't right but I didn't know it at the time" hey, that's MY excuse! |
| 21:18.54 | DJTachyon | ugh what horrible weather |
| 21:19.11 | jbq | back on track, I was looking for way to avoid moving files around, but now I think it's probably not such a big deal. |
| 21:19.28 | DJTachyon | well im almost done install kubuntu |
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| 21:19.36 | DJTachyon | +ing |
| 21:20.31 | DJTachyon | figured kubuntu would ease me back into a nix interface than ubuntu's osx feel. |
| 21:20.33 | jasta | jbq: the problem is that it's not general enough to fool all apps |
| 21:20.36 | smr | is happy because my 3D model loader is finally coming along |
| 21:20.50 | jasta | or even most apps, really |
| 21:20.55 | andyross | wonders if he should tell DJTachyon that intrepid is due for release in about 36 hours... |
| 21:21.02 | DJTachyon | doh |
| 21:21.06 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 21:21.30 | DJTachyon | hmmm |
| 21:21.32 | jbq | jasta: I think it'd be valuable if there could be a way that works for all apps that come with the platform, so that people could at least use the same process to build and test their app changes on a device. The simpler the better. |
| 21:21.49 | jasta | jbq: ok, then commit my script :P |
| 21:22.30 | DJTachyon | andy, wait .. intrepid is an off the shelf appliance? |
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| 21:22.52 | jbq | I'm sure that someone would want to rewrite it in python first. Since I don't real perl or write python, that "someone" isn't going to be me. |
| 21:22.54 | andyross | Intrepid Ibex is Ubuntu 8.10 |
| 21:23.07 | DJTachyon | oh right .. |
| 21:23.20 | DJTachyon | hmm is kubuntu going to be updated immediately with it? |
| 21:23.30 | jasta | jbq: of course, because google is allergic to perl |
| 21:23.37 | DJTachyon | oh looks like it |
| 21:23.42 | DJTachyon | somehow i missed the giant banner :P |
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| 21:24.13 | DJTachyon | hmmm .. maybe i should install the release candidate then |
| 21:24.19 | morrildl | jasta: I think of it more as an immunity than an allergy: we effectively defend ourselvse against infection. ;) |
| 21:24.32 | tomgibara | romainguy_: My patch for Animation had to permit zero duration animations in the end. There are legitimate reasons for the duration to be zero. |
| 21:24.34 | jasta | oh brother |
| 21:24.49 | jasta | your python rewrite of my perl script will be ugly and less correct anyway :) |
| 21:24.50 | jasta | uglier* |
| 21:25.05 | jasta | snaps his fingers |
| 21:25.23 | pawalls | chuckles.. |
| 21:26.23 | ericrw | did I just hear that Intrepid is due in 36 hours ? |
| 21:26.29 | jasta | ponders whether pawalls has converted to the dark side |
| 21:26.40 | romainguy_ | tomgibara: yeah, initialization I bet? |
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| 21:27.19 | DJTachyon | hey have you guys tried Minefield yet? |
| 21:27.21 | pawalls | jasta, I favor practicality. Sometimes (however rarely) Perl is the better choice. |
| 21:27.43 | thoraxe | intrepid? |
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| 21:27.58 | tomgibara | romainguy_: yep, that and the restrictDuration() method |
| 21:28.17 | andyross | pawalls: I feel the opposite: you *can* write tight python, but usually end up in a mess of weird libraries. Perl scripts can often do more with fewer dependencies. |
| 21:28.20 | pawalls | jasta, Though I increasingly find Perl to be a pain in the ass the more I work in Python and have powerful language syntax like "in" |
| 21:28.41 | romainguy_ | tomgibara: line 611 in your patch, there's an extra 4 spaces indent |
| 21:29.06 | tomgibara | romainguy_: I copied that from the original file |
| 21:29.15 | romainguy_ | you added and indent |
| 21:29.16 | romainguy_ | -d |
| 21:29.22 | romainguy_ | or you used tabs |
| 21:29.25 | romainguy_ | which is bad :) |
| 21:29.31 | pawalls | andyross, Clearly it depends on what you're doing. If you think re is a "weird" library, then I suppose I can see why you'd continue to use Perl ;-) |
| 21:29.41 | romainguy_ | I actually think there's a better way to do this |
| 21:29.44 | romainguy_ | switch to pm |
| 21:30.37 | jasta | bites his tongue about the tab comment |
| 21:30.39 | pawalls | Python is far from perfect. But I find it's a joy to code in more often than not. |
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| 21:30.55 | DJTachyon | 4 space tabs ftw :P |
| 21:31.21 | umdk1d3 | wait, tabs are evil? |
| 21:31.22 | romainguy_ | jasta: it's bad in our source tree |
| 21:31.26 | pawalls | jasta, They're called style guidelines.. no one agrees on them, so you might as well just settle on some and get over it :-P |
| 21:31.28 | andyross | I find every time I'm in python, I'm constantly looking at docs. It's a similar problem to Java or C++, the environment just doesn't fit in one's brain. Perl and C don't have that problem. |
| 21:31.29 | romainguy_ | if you like them, good for you |
| 21:31.32 | romainguy_ | but not in our tree |
| 21:31.46 | jasta | pawalls: did you really just say that to me? :) |
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| 21:31.55 | herriojr | so, is there a reason we can't override the search from the main menu ( Intent { action=android.intent.action.MAIN categories={android.intent.category.LAUNCHER} flags=0x10200000 comp={com.android.contacts/com.android.contacts.DialtactsActivity} } |
| 21:31.57 | herriojr | ) |
| 21:32.03 | pawalls | jasta, Feh! |
| 21:32.04 | jasta | pawalls: you don't really remember me, do you? :) |
| 21:32.32 | pawalls | jasta, If I recall correctly, you think small tab widths are retarded? |
| 21:32.39 | jasta | i used to spend hours hand formatting patches and work contributed by others. often, you. :) |
| 21:32.54 | pawalls | jasta, :-P |
| 21:32.56 | DJTachyon | wooo you got served |
| 21:33.09 | jasta | actually i've relaxed that attitude though |
| 21:33.14 | jasta | and my code style is not even like it was then |
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| 21:33.26 | pawalls | jasta, Cut me some slack, I was like 12. |
| 21:33.34 | jasta | corporate environments i still agree with format nazis, but open source projects can get as spaghetti as they want for all i care :) |
| 21:34.04 | DJTachyon | alright .. time to install kubuntu 8.10 RC on my VM instead :p |
| 21:34.21 | pawalls | snickers. |
| 21:34.21 | jasta | pawalls: we should go out drinking again some time ;) |
| 21:34.46 | pawalls | andyross, I don't suppose you know how to quickly check if an item is in an array in Perl off the top of your head? You can't *really* be saying 'grep' is intuitive :-P |
| 21:34.59 | pawalls | jasta, I couldn't agree more. |
| 21:35.04 | DJTachyon | dont even get me started on military or medical standards guys |
| 21:35.19 | stadlero | herriojr: When you say override search, what are you looking to do? |
| 21:35.24 | ericrw | pawalls, huh? grep isn't intuitive? |
| 21:35.38 | pawalls | ericrw, I'm referring to the Perl function. |
| 21:35.43 | pawalls | ericrw, When working w/ arrays. |
| 21:35.49 | herriojr | so, when I start typing something in while at the home screen, I want it to bring up my app instead of the phonebook |
| 21:36.15 | ericrw | pawalls, even still... ? :) |
| 21:36.19 | jasta | pawalls: not sure when i'll be in the bay are again tho. do you snowboard at all? maybe we could go to tahoewith some fools ;) |
| 21:36.21 | herriojr | stadlero: but the intent thrown specifies a certain component/activity, so it can't be overridden |
| 21:36.30 | DJTachyon | end up spending 1/2 the year on documentation, code comments, style, code restriction standards, unit testing, and brand/statement coverage |
| 21:36.47 | DJTachyon | s/brand/branch |
| 21:37.17 | stadlero | it's not about the intents, in this case - the launcher app is hardwired to present two kinds of search only, contacts (from typing) and web search (via the widget or via menu-search) |
| 21:37.24 | pawalls | ericrw, You're telling me that 'grep {$_ eq "whatever"} @array;' is intuitive? |
| 21:37.45 | pawalls | It's certainly wordy if nothing else. |
| 21:37.47 | andyross | pawalls: grep certainly is intuitive: "grep /MYSTRING/ @list;" will do it if the elements are strings. Or write a block to test for reference equality, etc... But note that "in" is a dangerous operator, and algorithmically slow. Unless you know your data really well, you really want that to be a hash lookup. |
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| 21:38.40 | herriojr | but if the intent could be overridden, any application could catch the intent and process it instead of the dialer |
| 21:38.44 | andyross | But that kind of argument is a straw man anyway. You could easily "prove" that python is a disaster because of how much code it requires to parse text files relative to perl, and be equally wrong. |
| 21:39.10 | herriojr | this would allow any application to catch the presses |
| 21:39.31 | andyross | The test for me isn't the number of tokens, it's the mental effort required to get those tokens out of my head and into the editor. Perl just wins, sorry. And I've been working with python on a semi-regular basis for over a decade now. |
| 21:39.32 | ericrw | pawalls, and yes, I think that is intuitive, but not as intuitive as a simple grep /regex/ @list |
| 21:39.32 | pawalls | andyross, I'm not trying to "prove" that Perl is better or worse than Python. I'm simply relaying that I find "in" to be indispensable from a convenience perspective. |
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| 21:42.59 | pawalls | andyross, I'm not a Python fanboy. I use Perl when appropriate (when I need a way to Practically Extract data and Report on it using a Language suited for such a task.) |
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| 21:43.00 | jasta | pawalls: *poke*, do you snowboard? :) |
| 21:43.01 | pawalls | andyross, But there are many things I miss when I'm using Perl after getting used to a lot of the syntactic sugar in Python (such as generators, classmethods, etc) |
| 21:43.01 | pawalls | jasta, I have once and it was a lot of fun. |
| 21:43.36 | pawalls | I was sore for about 2 weeks after, but I'd definitely like to do it again. |
| 21:44.08 | pawalls | I have a feeling I'd suck a bit less at skiing though, since I'm more accustomed to inline skates. |
| 21:44.10 | DJTachyon | pizza, french fries? |
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| 21:46.25 | herriojr | I actually pasted the wrong intent |
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| 21:46.38 | herriojr | but the correct one still has the same issue |
| 21:46.48 | umdk1d3 | freenode is quite the rollercoaster today ^.^ |
| 21:46.54 | greencookie | woo |
| 21:48.14 | jasta | pawalls: maybe we should hit tahoe then :) |
| 21:48.20 | jasta | thats the most likely reason i'd make it down to your area |
| 21:48.23 | jasta | and fred would be down too |
| 21:49.32 | unix_lappy | umdk1d3: yea, not so much the markets IRL. |
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| 21:52.00 | jasta | pawalls: we had a cabin up there last winter. that was so f'n sweet |
| 21:54.14 | DJTachyon | argh the new iGoogle homepage is driving me mad, mostly that hyperlinks don't work in the GMail panel |
| 21:56.05 | languish | I wonder if any network printing apps will be forthcoming |
| 21:57.05 | michaelnovakjr | languish: like? |
| 21:57.09 | languish | DJTachyon, have you pressed and held your finger on the hyperlinks? |
| 21:57.32 | languish | michaelnovakjr, an app to connect to wifi network printers, to print documents off the microsd |
| 21:57.42 | michaelnovakjr | oh cool |
| 21:57.47 | languish | :D |
| 21:57.52 | herriojr | so the intent I'm complaining about is: Intent { action=com.android.contacts.action.FILTER_CONTACTS flags=0x10000000 comp={com.android.contacts.DialtactsContactsEntryActivity} } |
| 21:58.39 | languish | also, for password wallet style apps, it would be handy to have a function to print out the password list (after a proper user authentication of course) |
| 21:58.57 | languish | or print daily tasks lists to hand to other people |
| 21:58.58 | languish | ..etc etc |
| 21:59.11 | DJTachyon | languish: the hyperlinks don't even show up |
| 21:59.21 | languish | DJTachyon ahh, odd |
| 21:59.41 | DJTachyon | this is in firefox im talking about |
| 21:59.53 | languish | ooohh |
| 22:00.38 | languish | i guess pressing and holding the link would be rather difficult |
| 22:01.24 | Laz_ | any themes apps coming? |
| 22:01.37 | languish | laz most certainly |
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| 22:02.38 | DJTachyon | http://www.djtachyon.com/pub/Broken_iGoogle_GMail_Links.jpg |
| 22:02.56 | DJTachyon | i tried Firefox Minefield today at work .. holy god that browser is fast |
| 22:03.02 | Laz_ | can you reflash g1's yet? |
| 22:03.09 | languish | no |
| 22:03.18 | DJTachyon | brb |
| 22:03.23 | Laz_ | aww man that would be the day!!1 |
| 22:04.07 | languish | wait, DJTachyon, are you the one that put up the android logo clothing? |
| 22:04.24 | d0net2 | has anyone installed five? |
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| 22:24.29 | jcanfield_ | arrgh...g1 wifi is no bueno. |
| 22:25.05 | marcone | nono, es MUY bueno! |
| 22:25.25 | jcanfield_ | ;P you must be three feet from your AP. |
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| 22:25.41 | marcone | makes no guarantee that was actually a valid spanish phrase |
| 22:26.10 | Laz_ | i was 1/4 mile away from a days inn and i was getting signal |
| 22:26.49 | jcanfield_ | perhaps i have a manufacturing defect....I can go to the other side of my house. |
| 22:26.54 | jcanfield_ | can't* |
| 22:27.30 | jasta | mine is bad too |
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| 22:27.45 | jasta | i just dont use wifi. 3g is great :) |
| 22:27.55 | marcone | my G1 picks up random people's open WiFi when I walk around the neighborhood |
| 22:27.57 | jcanfield_ | no 3G in Tulsa yet. |
| 22:28.15 | Dougie187 | maybe with RC29 wifi will be better. |
| 22:28.34 | jasta | .window 5 |
| 22:28.35 | jasta | oops |
| 22:32.09 | umdk1d3 | ooh im in videoz ^.^ |
| 22:32.29 | Laz_ | really? |
| 22:32.58 | jasta | hes in lots of em |
| 22:33.06 | jasta | including the g1 launch |
| 22:33.15 | Laz_ | show me one |
| 22:33.19 | jasta | jeffrey's the man :) |
| 22:40.21 | Laz_ | family force 5 |
| 22:40.39 | Bonks | does android automatically update applications from Market? |
| 22:40.45 | umdk1d3 | Laz_: =D |
| 22:40.51 | wastrel | am i missing something about documentation for marketplace apps? or is it dependent on the developer including something in the app itself? |
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| 22:42.05 | Bonks | I noticed some applications that are at the bottom of the "sort by date" list go back to the top because the version incremented. For those that I already have installed, I don't see any option to update, just Open and Uninstall. so I was wondering how does android market handle new builds of applications? |
| 22:42.21 | languish | bonks, apps don't auto update from the market yet. |
| 22:42.40 | languish | you would have to uninstall the old version, and then download and install the new one |
| 22:43.02 | Bonks | hmm thats unfortunate |
| 22:43.05 | wastrel | i wish devs would stop updating their apps |
| 22:43.05 | languish | sometime in the future, devs will put auto updating in to their own apps, and the market likely will handle it too |
| 22:43.50 | herriojr | well, the store should allow us to do update checks, and if there is an update, download the new one |
| 22:44.04 | Bonks | some apps, when open, doesnt even say what it's current version is =/ |
| 22:44.15 | Bonks | unless im not looking in the right place? |
| 22:44.25 | herriojr | yeah, it's up to them to put in there |
| 22:44.51 | Bonks | but shouldnt I be able to view details of an app and see its version |
| 22:45.31 | herriojr | if they want you to, yeah |
| 22:45.39 | herriojr | they just aren't following good programming practices |
| 22:45.53 | herriojr | android doesn't enforce programming practices |
| 22:46.07 | herriojr | ls |
| 22:46.14 | herriojr | oops |
| 22:46.17 | wastrel | isn't there a version number in the settings > applications |
| 22:46.17 | wastrel | ? |
| 22:46.25 | Bonks | wastrel no, im looking now |
| 22:47.01 | Bonks | but there is a version number in the description in market |
| 22:48.01 | jcanfield_ | the apps just keeps rolling into market...5 ways to check the weather. and 3 flashlights. |
| 22:48.19 | languish | the flashlight came in handy yesterday :| |
| 22:48.21 | Bonks | yea lol. couple of todo's too |
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| 22:48.40 | languish | I had the G1 in my pocket, went to hit the head... and the lightbulb in the bathroom blew out |
| 22:48.43 | languish | pulled out the G1, hit the flashlight app |
| 22:48.46 | languish | worked like a charm |
| 22:49.01 | cbeust | Real life testimony! |
| 22:49.15 | jcanfield_ | my flashlight=google.com |
| 22:49.51 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 22:49.55 | languish | my bathroom's like a faraday cage |
| 22:50.19 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 22:50.28 | wastrel | jcanfield_: are you keeping track of the tip calculators too? |
| 22:50.33 | Bonks | someone needs to comeup with a movie showtime app |
| 22:50.42 | jcanfield_ | wastrel, oh forgot about those. |
| 22:51.00 | languish | there was an app I used to use on pocketpc for movie showtimes and locations |
| 22:51.01 | languish | hrm |
| 22:51.21 | Bonks | i havent found a site that provides xml feeds for showtimes yet |
| 22:51.31 | Bonks | well fandango is one but you have to license it |
| 22:51.43 | languish | i think the app parsed info off imdb |
| 22:51.57 | Bonks | well thats different. showtimes are dynamic information |
| 22:52.16 | languish | i mean imdb's movie showtime listings |
| 22:52.21 | languish | which are updated, not static |
| 22:52.39 | Bonks | ah, i'll have to take a look at that when i get home |
| 22:54.37 | Bonks | how do i access the android file system from my pc? |
| 22:55.51 | waldo_ | is back (gone 00:05:31) |
| 22:56.33 | markf_ | languish: you don't necessarily have to uninstall an app in order to install a new version. If the package names and signatures match then you can just install the updated app and it will replace the old one. Unfortunately, folks can't or don't keep thos things the same and then the install of the updated app will fail. |
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| 23:06.09 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 23:07.34 | *** join/#android nebi (n=nebi@c-498fe253.02-145-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
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| 23:11.21 | eldenz | there is no way to browse teh market w/o a G1 right? |
| 23:12.04 | DJTachyon | there are 3rd party sites |
| 23:12.21 | DJTachyon | http://www.androidapps.com/ |
| 23:12.32 | DJTachyon | all those are on the market |
| 23:12.49 | DJTachyon | IM+ just got added recently, glad i never paid $20 for that on windows mobile |
| 23:12.50 | eldenz | thanks |
| 23:13.02 | *** join/#android duey_ (n=duey@203.96.223.40) |
| 23:13.46 | DJTachyon | they are def not all up there though |
| 23:13.53 | DJTachyon | good 50 apps or so |
| 23:14.07 | DJTachyon | its growing fast |
| 23:14.28 | *** join/#android NeTTwerk (n=san@nat/google/x-de2f18646c712f6f) |
| 23:14.35 | *** mode/#android [+o SanMehat] by ChanServ |
| 23:14.51 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 23:14.57 | BruteSource | hey san |
| 23:15.29 | SanMehat | hey |
| 23:15.53 | BruteSource | hows life |
| 23:16.04 | SanMehat | its good. on vacation. and you? |
| 23:16.40 | BruteSource | im doing good |
| 23:16.44 | DJTachyon | wow sweet .. god Kubuntu 8.10 RC running in VMWare :) |
| 23:16.51 | DJTachyon | s/god/got |
| 23:16.59 | BruteSource | besides not having money for cell bill |
| 23:18.13 | jasta | SanMehat: how's the honeymoon? :) |
| 23:18.26 | jasta | ...how was the wedding? :) |
| 23:18.48 | SanMehat | jasta: its on friday |
| 23:18.53 | SanMehat | :) |
| 23:18.56 | DJTachyon | nice one |
| 23:20.28 | DJTachyon | hmm how do you change the screen resolution in KDE4? |
| 23:20.41 | umdk1d3 | its still xorg, right? |
| 23:20.42 | *** join/#android xnixan (n=xnixan@41.196.244.46) |
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| 23:20.50 | michaelnovakjr | anyone who's interested can check out the file browser i wrote.... http://androidnerds.com |
| 23:21.04 | umdk1d3 | ooh! /me clix |
| 23:21.18 | DJTachyon | O_O |
| 23:21.21 | ttuttle | SanMehat: /me is happy for you. |
| 23:21.35 | BruteSource | ctrl alt + and - i thought |
| 23:21.44 | DJTachyon | yeah i just tried that |
| 23:22.01 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: it offers the PICK intent for mime=*/* yes? |
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| 23:22.04 | DJTachyon | im running Kubuntu 8.10 RC if that makes a difference |
| 23:22.15 | michaelnovakjr | yes PICK for any type of file |
| 23:22.38 | umdk1d3 | very cool, will try integrating it soon ;) |
| 23:22.38 | michaelnovakjr | i'm writing a quick doc on the app now |
| 23:22.39 | BruteSource | maybe your only configured for one res in the xorg config |
| 23:22.59 | DJTachyon | but im running it in VMware and CTRL+ALT is the I/O switch comand |
| 23:23.01 | DJTachyon | :P |
| 23:23.49 | BruteSource | aw |
| 23:24.07 | BruteSource | then there must be a way to do it through the gui |
| 23:24.29 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: is there a source dump somewhere? |
| 23:24.53 | BruteSource | whats your host machine? |
| 23:24.59 | michaelnovakjr | yea, there's the git repo, I'm cleaning up the source now that the application works |
| 23:25.00 | jt436 | is happy, just found a clipping solution that matches J2ME! |
| 23:25.17 | jcanfield_ | File Managers=2 |
| 23:25.28 | michaelnovakjr | Good FileManagers=1 :) |
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| 23:25.38 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: do you have android:configChanges="keyboardHidden|orientation" on your browse activity? |
| 23:25.40 | michaelnovakjr | i'm bias |
| 23:25.48 | michaelnovakjr | nope |
| 23:25.50 | michaelnovakjr | should i? |
| 23:26.00 | umdk1d3 | it /really/ helps speed up keyboard in/out |
| 23:26.05 | umdk1d3 | otherwise it reloads the entire activity |
| 23:26.08 | michaelnovakjr | i'll add that in |
| 23:26.24 | michaelnovakjr | still some stuff i want to clean up in it |
| 23:26.27 | jcanfield_ | lol 18 more and we will have reached a viable linux distro. |
| 23:26.58 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: also, does tapping on a file try launching a VIEW intent for it? |
| 23:27.03 | waldo_ | is back (gone 00:12:12) |
| 23:27.09 | DJTachyon | BruteSource: Ah .. I think the monitor settings can be forced in VMWare, so ill try that. |
| 23:27.12 | michaelnovakjr | umdk1d3: not yet... i was looking into that earlier |
| 23:27.20 | michaelnovakjr | it'll be added |
| 23:27.32 | BruteSource | whats your host system? |
| 23:27.39 | michaelnovakjr | me? |
| 23:27.48 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: also would be awesome to have filesize floating right ;) lol too many ideas |
| 23:27.54 | michaelnovakjr | :) |
| 23:28.10 | michaelnovakjr | i've got the tracker for ideas too.... its definitely going to get improvements |
| 23:28.46 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: eek, might want to override the "back" keyboard button |
| 23:28.54 | umdk1d3 | to mean "up dir" |
| 23:28.59 | umdk1d3 | not sure if thats possible |
| 23:28.59 | DJTachyon | brutesource: im running it native in VMware Workstation |
| 23:29.18 | DJTachyon | on my 30% OC Q6600 w/ 4GB Dominator Memory |
| 23:29.21 | BruteSource | where do yo work? |
| 23:29.25 | michaelnovakjr | umdk1d3: i was thinking about it, i have the parent directory item at the top of the list |
| 23:29.35 | jcanfield_ | michaelnovakjr, nice work...looks neeto. |
| 23:29.38 | umdk1d3 | also, might want to reset the selected index to 0 when entering subfolder |
| 23:29.47 | DJTachyon | who me? |
| 23:29.51 | michaelnovakjr | umdk1d3: yea, that's on my list :) |
| 23:30.00 | umdk1d3 | michaelnovakjr: true, but im loving rolling throguh it with the trackball, and i instictively hit the back button to go up a folder |
| 23:30.17 | michaelnovakjr | umdk1d3: i can restructure it to do that |
| 23:30.18 | BruteSource | ya most people dont have a vmware workstation in there basement lol |
| 23:30.31 | DJTachyon | its only $180 |
| 23:30.58 | DJTachyon | im making $500 on a VJ gig this weekend ... I work in aerospace if you must know :P |
| 23:31.02 | BruteSource | wow |
| 23:31.11 | *** join/#android foobar`` (n=testuser@adsl-69-110-12-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 23:31.40 | languish | markf_, yeah I know we "should" be able to just install over an app, but I've seen enough complaints in various forums about people having to dig up an old version, install it, then uninstall it, just so they can install the new version properly. |
| 23:31.41 | DJTachyon | what? |
| 23:31.49 | languish | So I advise people to uninstall the old app first |
| 23:32.28 | foobar`` | has anyone run the emulator built entirely from the source release? |
| 23:32.29 | DJTachyon | bah forcing the screen res didnt work |
| 23:32.31 | foobar`` | under linux |
| 23:33.10 | gdsx | foobar``: "yes" |
| 23:33.27 | BruteSource | oui languish =) |
| 23:33.28 | foobar`` | gdsx, does the internet work in it for you? |
| 23:34.03 | gdsx | foobar``: I believe DNS is known to be broken (or, at least, was at some point). I'm not sure if that's still the case |
| 23:34.13 | foobar`` | ah |
| 23:34.21 | foobar`` | is there a bug listed somewhere? |
| 23:34.23 | languish | 'lo Brute |
| 23:35.06 | gdsx | foobar``: no idea, sorry |
| 23:35.20 | gdsx | foobar``: it'd be enough to check if you can get to places using only the IP address |
| 23:35.24 | foobar`` | yeah |
| 23:35.27 | foobar`` | i just tried it |
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| 23:35.29 | foobar`` | you're right |
| 23:35.49 | foobar`` | well google ip tries to redirect to m?hl=en&gl=us |
| 23:35.56 | foobar`` | but I assume it must have connected to the IP to know that |
| 23:36.00 | jasta | bbl, heading home |
| 23:37.03 | waldo_ | is away: auto-away |
| 23:37.16 | mlester | what would be the best class to use to access a sqlite db |
| 23:38.16 | BruteSource | wow drake and josh is supposed to be for kids, but its funny |
| 23:38.23 | mlester | I agree |
| 23:38.54 | BruteSource | glad im ot alone on that |
| 23:38.59 | mlester | but anyways what would u think is the best class to use if u just want to read from a sqlite database |
| 23:40.06 | Bonks | mlester, whats your nick mean? just curious :] |
| 23:40.11 | tsunami | mlester: look at the docs for SQLiteDatabase |
| 23:40.53 | mlester | its my first letter of my first name followed by my last name |
| 23:40.53 | f00f- | molester |
| 23:42.32 | Bonks | :p |
| 23:42.36 | neekers | mlester: try this tutorial, http://www.anddev.org/working_with_the_sqlite-database_-_cursors-t319.html |
| 23:43.16 | mlester | I tried that one but thats from a old tutorial |
| 23:43.26 | mlester | but I am trying myDB = SQLiteDatabase.openDatabase("/sdcard/bbe.db",null,SQLiteDatabase.OPEN_READONLY); |
| 23:43.34 | neekers | hey lanquish |
| 23:43.51 | mlester | and its throws an exception that table android_metadata doesnt exist |
| 23:43.55 | languish | hey neekers. about to run man, heading out to eat |
| 23:44.01 | languish | bbl :) |
| 23:44.06 | neekers | ttyl |
| 23:44.44 | foobar`` | lol |
| 23:45.01 | foobar`` | i don't think they intended to put build-system.html in the tree |
| 23:45.10 | foobar`` | "The build system will need to be able to build tools on Linux (definitely Goobuntu and maybe Grhat), MacOS, and to some degree on Windows." |
| 23:46.06 | BruteSource | goobuntu? |
| 23:46.25 | foobar`` | google's internal version of ubuntu that you're not supposed to know about |
| 23:46.43 | ttuttle | foobar``: Eh, it's been mentioned before. |
| 23:47.00 | foobar`` | true |
| 23:47.02 | unix_infidel | foobar``: more accurately that no one has a copy of :-P |
| 23:47.19 | ttuttle | unix_infidel: Untrue. Many Google employees do. I did over the summer, as an intern. (It works great!) |
| 23:47.51 | unix_infidel | ttuttle: they made you delete it? |
| 23:48.03 | ttuttle | unix_infidel: No, they just didn't let me bring the desktop home after I left :-P |
| 23:48.09 | ttuttle | unix_infidel: It was a work machine ;-) |
| 23:48.57 | unix_infidel | heh, that makes more sense, CDs floating around with the image are much less containable :-P |
| 23:49.06 | ttuttle | unix_infidel: Oh yeah, I've never seen a CD with it. |
| 23:50.21 | unix_infidel | been almost a year since I ran linux on anything other than a server or virtual machine. |
| 23:50.34 | unix_infidel | should probably run it natively here pretty soon for some upcoming projects. |
| 23:50.39 | foobar`` | what about your phone? |
| 23:50.52 | unix_infidel | foobar``: I decided against getting a G1. |
| 23:51.44 | Laz_ | what do you have an iphone? |
| 23:52.24 | neekers | unix_infidel: why? |
| 23:52.59 | unix_infidel | neekers: because it's a terrible device compared to the iPhone, in my opinion. |
| 23:53.14 | Laz_ | I want to replace the android boot screen, how do i do that? |
| 23:53.22 | neekers | i really like my g1 so far |
| 23:53.45 | ttuttle | neekers: they're pretty nice. |
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| 23:53.57 | neekers | version 1 of the iphone wasn't all that great... |
| 23:54.42 | unix_infidel | neekers: nope, but version one of the iPhone still has much better hardware than the G1. |
| 23:54.49 | neekers | the keyboard rocks in my opinion and i actuall like the look of it |
| 23:55.35 | Laz_ | its not how much or how small, its how you use it :p |
| 23:55.48 | jcanfield_ | I want the iphone clock on my G1 |
| 23:56.03 | khert | has anyone tried iSkoot? is it any good? |
| 23:56.04 | jcanfield_ | that analog POS was gone in like f minutes. |
| 23:56.20 | neekers | i was actually planning on getting an iphone later in addition to the G1 so that i can code up all my apps on the iphone as well, but i'm going to focus on the g1 for now |
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| 23:58.42 | unix_infidel | neekers: If you can justify the expense I say go for it. |
