| 00:00.55 | Damm | sure it is |
| 00:01.00 | Damm | it's called evolution |
| 00:01.15 | Damm | there are those that would say who the heck cares about gifs anymore |
| 00:01.46 | wastrel | evolution is a mail client |
| 00:02.08 | andyross | The point wasn't to defend GIF89a as a file format. It was just to point out that even in 2008 huge chunks of the web are using gifs even for new stuff. |
| 00:02.29 | Damm | andyross, and there is no such thing as animated jpegs |
| 00:04.23 | *** join/#android schmylan (n=schmylan@ppp-70-251-116-85.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) |
| 00:04.55 | *** join/#android docpaul (n=Paul@c-98-215-71-171.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 00:05.01 | spikebike | there is an animated PNG I believe |
| 00:05.53 | Damm | spikebike, right but PNG support in Internet Exploder is still pathetic |
| 00:05.58 | Damm | we won't even mention SVG support in IE |
| 00:06.02 | wastrel | ie is bad |
| 00:06.11 | wastrel | animated svg is coooool |
| 00:09.31 | *** join/#android johnnyboy (n=johnnybo@roaming-35-201.nss.udel.edu) |
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| 00:13.53 | lgbr | I'm using a verizon phone on windows mobile. It's kinda sucky and I'm considering switching. T-Mobile G1 a good idea or no, considering I'd no longer be contract-free? |
| 00:14.48 | `vip | i like android over winmo |
| 00:14.56 | `vip | i did the same thing, left winmo for android |
| 00:14.57 | `vip | it's faster |
| 00:15.11 | *** join/#android bmandrin (n=bmandrin@acces0106.res.insa-lyon.fr) |
| 00:15.21 | `vip | what do you use your phone for mostly |
| 00:15.30 | *** join/#android mocsrox (n=wliu@c-24-6-189-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 00:15.32 | `vip | why'd you choose winmo over lets say an ENv or something |
| 00:18.04 | lgbr | `vip: I chose winmo because of price and because of applications available (android beats it hands down on applications, I know). I don't get to use data because verizon has no data plans. I guess my concern is the contract. |
| 00:18.24 | spikebike | "android beats it hands down on applications"? It does? already? |
| 00:18.40 | lgbr | spikebike: yes |
| 00:18.44 | spikebike | I thought winmo has zillions of programs |
| 00:19.03 | lgbr | well, that's true. But a lot of them don't do any good without data |
| 00:19.05 | spikebike | skype, SIP compatible voip, spreadsheets, word docs, etc. |
| 00:19.06 | *** join/#android gambler (n=gambler@124-171-152-107.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 00:19.34 | `vip | vzw doesnt have data plans ? |
| 00:19.44 | spikebike | android seems mostly tip calculators, and related silly stuff |
| 00:19.44 | lgbr | `vip: they're roughly $40/month |
| 00:19.46 | *** join/#android terret (i=41a1bc0b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-93b6e98e607771e7) |
| 00:20.28 | donomo | with <ListPreference android:key="record"... what value goes in PREFS_NAME for getSharedPreferences(PREFS_NAME, 0); so i can get at that preference |
| 00:21.26 | `vip | ah lgbr ... well i pay 35 for G1plan |
| 00:21.39 | `vip | unlim txt/pic/data :/ |
| 00:22.07 | lgbr | I'm looking at the $25er |
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| 00:44.05 | romainguy_ | http://www.intomobile.com/2008/11/17/adobe-brings-flash-to-t-mobile-g1-android-and-adobe-flash-together-at-last.html |
| 00:45.20 | andyross | looks at his spinning firefox instance and wonders if that's entirely a good thing... |
| 00:45.21 | sfuentes | woohooo! |
| 00:45.24 | herriojr | what does pdu stand for in reference to an sms? |
| 00:47.31 | Damm | romainguy_, yeah... engadget had a wonderful post about it that didn't link the video or article or source |
| 00:47.34 | Damm | :( |
| 00:47.37 | gambler | funny I was thinking that android could be a stealth competitor to Flash |
| 00:47.52 | romainguy_ | I'm bummed |
| 00:47.55 | romainguy_ | I had a pass for MAX |
| 00:47.58 | romainguy_ | I should have gone |
| 00:48.07 | gambler | meh, Im just waiting for Processing to be ported over |
| 00:48.23 | sfuentes | romainguy: when will it be available? |
| 00:49.18 | romainguy_ | Flash? I don't know, read the article :) |
| 00:49.49 | Damm | sfuentes, barely alpha |
| 00:51.39 | *** join/#android shackan (n=frob@host6-82-dynamic.61-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 00:54.41 | sfuentes | at least its a start |
| 00:55.00 | sfuentes | we got a headstart over iphone :) |
| 00:57.36 | Leeds | herriojr: packet data unit, or something along those lines - it's essentially the 'binary format' of an SMS |
| 00:59.31 | *** join/#android waldo (n=waldo@cpe-76-170-48-18.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 01:05.30 | elad | could you make a background service to listen for key presses to take screen shots? |
| 01:05.42 | romainguy_ | you cannot take screenshots |
| 01:05.46 | Disconnect | sure, except according to goog there is no way to do screenshots |
| 01:05.50 | romainguy_ | and you cannot listen for key events that are not in your window |
| 01:05.54 | elad | i see |
| 01:06.08 | sfuentes | need python for dalvik |
| 01:06.28 | jasta | romainguy_: and thank god for that :) |
| 01:06.35 | romainguy_ | :) |
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| 01:11.32 | *** join/#android `vip_ (n=denied@m0a5e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 01:11.35 | gambler | jasta, I figured out why it wasnt working for me yesterday |
| 01:11.49 | gambler | I added my LinearLayout to a TableRow |
| 01:12.04 | gambler | From what Ive seen you cant do that |
| 01:12.09 | jasta | you can add LinearLayouts to a TableRow |
| 01:13.36 | gambler | hmmm |
| 01:14.39 | gambler | In my current code, Adding the LinearLayout to the TableLayout works, but adding it to a tableRow then->Layout doesnt |
| 01:14.51 | *** part/#android terret (i=41a1bc0b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-93b6e98e607771e7) |
| 01:15.01 | jasta | you are not supposed to add anything but TableRows to a TableLayout |
| 01:15.56 | jasta | your problem likely remains your misuse of layout parameters |
| 01:16.13 | Maxpower57 | someone needs to make an IRC client for android |
| 01:16.26 | gambler | yeah it must be |
| 01:18.33 | romainguy_ | jasta: that's not true |
| 01:18.42 | romainguy_ | jasta: you can add children that are not TableRows |
| 01:18.47 | romainguy_ | the API demos even show that |
| 01:19.02 | jasta | what is the effect? just like a tablerow with stretch all columns? |
| 01:19.02 | romainguy_ | fwiw, a TableRow is a LinearLayout anyway |
| 01:19.11 | jasta | or, span across all columns |
| 01:19.12 | *** join/#android unix_infidel (n=blue@unaffiliated/unixinfidel/x-8383745) |
| 01:19.31 | jasta | regardless, you can still have LinearLayouts as children of <TableRow> |
| 01:19.41 | romainguy_ | yes |
| 01:20.41 | gambler | yeah i read that in the doco. ...why though would tablelayout.addView(linearlayout) work but tablerow.addView(linearLayout) tablelayout.addView(tablerow) cause me so much grief |
| 01:20.48 | waldo | So okay everyone.. there is now a SIP (VOIP) client up for Android. It compiles but has a problem with the configuration file not being found. http://www.hsc.com/resourceCenter/resource.aspx |
| 01:21.05 | waldo | also comes with STUN |
| 01:21.35 | waldo | builds though w/eclipse. |
| 01:21.52 | gambler | waldo there is another one too. the problem atm is you cant directly record audio afaik |
| 01:21.59 | waldo | really...? |
| 01:22.02 | spikebike | er |
| 01:22.07 | spikebike | there's a voice recorder |
| 01:22.18 | spikebike | it seems to record voice just fine |
| 01:22.19 | waldo | Isn't there some program that takes audio and blinks colored lights.. plus the voice recorder |
| 01:22.45 | spikebike | there is a fft lib that blinks lights but doesn't actually record |
| 01:22.53 | spikebike | or do so in response to audio |
| 01:23.59 | waldo | oh crap got it to accept the configuration! |
| 01:24.01 | waldo | wonder if this will work |
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| 01:24.31 | gambler | spikebike, I dont think it does real-time processing |
| 01:24.52 | spikebike | right |
| 01:24.58 | spikebike | but there is a voice recorder |
| 01:25.04 | spikebike | that writes voice to a sd card |
| 01:25.55 | gambler | sigh. this was about VOIP |
| 01:26.34 | gambler | I think the current way the best you could do would be like walkie talkies |
| 01:27.19 | sfuentes | is it possible to capture the phonenumber of a call that comes in as it rings but before its picked up? |
| 01:27.56 | waldo | i got it trying to dial... |
| 01:28.00 | waldo | but I don't think it is |
| 01:28.17 | waldo | problem is I have my phone dialing w/my sip so no number to dial.. |
| 01:29.00 | waldo | it said it was registering bu I have no idea if it did or not |
| 01:29.16 | gambler | speaking of spans, why cant you set the span through the API ? (Am I missing it in the docs?) |
| 01:36.36 | skbohra | how much space and time does it take to compile android? |
| 01:37.27 | waldo | depends on your computer.. ive heard from 1 to 8 hours |
| 01:37.32 | waldo | This thing isn't dialoing out |
| 01:37.34 | waldo | dialing |
| 01:45.53 | *** join/#android infernixx (i=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 01:45.55 | herriojr | has anyone found a way to get around the fact that you can't do port-directed sms? |
| 01:47.14 | Leeds | sfuentes: that should be possible - there's a broadcast intent in the docs for "incoming call" |
| 01:47.19 | skbohra | what is gperf? |
| 01:47.46 | skbohra | i got error while compling : gperf: Command not found! |
| 01:49.43 | Leeds | GNU 'gperf' generates perfect hash functions. |
| 01:49.44 | sfuentes | Leeds: broadcast intent ... thank u Leeds |
| 01:49.46 | Leeds | apparently :-) |
| 01:50.05 | Leeds | broadcast intents remind me strongly of Palm launch codes - in a good way |
| 01:50.15 | skbohra | i need that for android |
| 01:50.26 | skbohra | got it! |
| 01:53.09 | *** join/#android jlapenna (n=jlapenna@nat/google/x-ab3d05be8c179599) |
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| 02:01.22 | skbohra | help me |
| 02:01.24 | skbohra | [out/target/product/generic/obj/SHARED_LIBRARIES/libwebcore_intermediates/CSSGrammar.o] Error 1 |
| 02:01.39 | skbohra | what to do of this error |
| 02:02.17 | *** join/#android KNY (n=KNY@leonidas.kickersny.com) |
| 02:03.23 | unix_infidel | i have emulator.lnk in %path% setup, but i still have to spell out the .lnk part. is there anyway to simply invoke the emulator shortcut without the extension? |
| 02:03.57 | waldo | update for anyone who cares. SIPdroid doesn't save your configuration properly. Which is where having root comes in. I manually edited the xml configuration files to the correct values but it stil is having problems registering. |
| 02:04.05 | waldo | fooling around with the settings a bit... |
| 02:04.20 | lgbr | I'm doomed. I just ordered a G1 |
| 02:04.46 | skbohra | help me |
| 02:04.49 | gambler | unix_infidel, that sounds suspiciously like a windows question. and you are unix_infidel. |
| 02:05.02 | Leeds | skbohra: you do nothing - that's a useless error message |
| 02:05.09 | *** join/#android BHSPitMonkey (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) |
| 02:05.16 | unix_infidel | gambler: heh, 1) it's satire. 2) suspiciously indeed. |
| 02:05.16 | *** join/#android ismarc (n=mbrace@cpe-70-113-7-83.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 02:05.29 | skbohra | Leeds: but compiling stopped |
| 02:05.43 | Leeds | you're going to need to find the actual error |
| 02:07.06 | skbohra | Leeds: seems like something wrong with CSSGrammar.cpp |
| 02:07.44 | gambler | skbohra, probably a deps issue. |
| 02:07.51 | Leeds | good start... *what* is wrong with it? |
| 02:08.51 | *** join/#android keby (n=keby@cpe-24-243-6-179.satx.res.rr.com) |
| 02:08.53 | skbohra | Leeds: PropertyNames.c:214: error: expected ',' or ';' before '{' token |
| 02:10.11 | Leeds | hmm... that doesn't sound like an error you'd expect to get with code which other people can compile... the first thing which comes to mind, similar to what gambler said, is an include problem |
| 02:15.20 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 02:16.00 | skbohra | Leeds: no solutions.. |
| 02:16.23 | Leeds | report a bug... |
| 02:17.07 | eldenz | can anyone tell me how i write a comment on slashdot as child of the news item? |
| 02:17.15 | eldenz | looking for 5mins already (not exaggerating) |
| 02:17.22 | eldenz | i'm logged in |
| 02:17.57 | Leeds | er, you hit the 'Reply' link under the story? |
| 02:18.10 | eldenz | aaaah lol |
| 02:18.15 | eldenz | it's a submit button though |
| 02:18.35 | eldenz | i was looking on the left side... where all the other 'Reply to This' button were :x |
| 02:18.37 | Leeds | it's a link on my screen |
| 02:18.39 | eldenz | thanks |
| 02:20.25 | skbohra | Leeds: it is a reported issue |
| 02:20.33 | waldo | crap sipdroid will not register. |
| 02:23.34 | d03boy | is sipdroid a program to judge alcohol content/ |
| 02:23.36 | skbohra | Leeds: they are suggesting a make clean |
| 02:29.30 | waldo | sipdroid is a SIP phone. A VOIP phone. Same technology that Vonage uses basically |
| 02:34.06 | ttuttle | s/Vonage/most VoIP providers/; |
| 02:34.46 | *** join/#android infernixx (i=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
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| 02:51.05 | Andomic | Any Irc apps yet for droid? |
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| 02:51.17 | *** mode/#android [+o cbeust] by ChanServ |
| 02:53.14 | waldo | offtopic-- anyone think I'd hurt a bluetooth headset meant for .5a by charging it with a 2a usb charger? |
| 02:53.46 | waldo | I know it's four times the amperage but... |
| 02:53.47 | Disconnect | no |
| 02:53.53 | waldo | same voltage |
| 02:53.56 | Disconnect | its a max |
| 02:53.56 | waldo | 5v I think |
| 02:54.02 | waldo | disconnect what do you mean |
| 02:54.06 | waldo | .5 not 5 |
| 02:54.19 | andyross | The amp rating is how much it can supply. Electrical loads aren't like fois gras, you can't force feed. :) |
| 02:54.29 | Disconnect | it will give up to 2 amps. it won't cram 2 amps down if its not requested. |
| 02:54.35 | waldo | but I want it's liver to taste buttery! |
| 02:54.42 | waldo | Disconnect: ah I see |
| 02:55.27 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 02:55.27 | *** mode/#android [+o cbeust_] by ChanServ |
| 02:55.28 | waldo | so no danger in using my gps charger (and my g1 charger now too) and not have to get a whole new car charger just for the headset? If so, I love my dead gay bluetooth handset |
| 02:55.34 | waldo | headset |
| 02:55.59 | waldo | its liver, not it's-- I hate when I mess up the grammar. |
| 02:56.11 | herriojr | does the android.permission.INSTALL_PACKAGES not work? I have it listed in my manifest, yet it doesn't work |
| 02:56.19 | *** join/#android weihsiu (n=walter@61-219-17-40.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 02:58.05 | spikebike | the danger is in using a device designed to draw more than the charger is designed to provide |
| 02:58.26 | herriojr | it throws a security exception saying I need the INSTALL_PACKAGES permission, which of course, I have |
| 02:59.08 | Damm | spikebike, the G1 isn't that much of a battery pig |
| 02:59.19 | waldo | spikebike: i would think the opposite would overheat the charger.. ie, it's supplying 2a but the device is only taking .5.... |
| 02:59.22 | Damm | i'm at 75% and i had 30minutes of connectbot over 3G, and several phonecalls |
| 02:59.33 | waldo | or in the case of the g1.. it takes 1a but hte charger supplies 2 |
| 02:59.35 | Damm | ahh |
| 02:59.49 | Damm | waldo, i'm guessing there's something cutting it down inside |
| 03:00.02 | waldo | damm hope so cuz I'm gonna start using it to charge things :) |
| 03:00.06 | waldo | and we'll see what happens |
| 03:00.40 | wastrel | so can you play music over the bluetooth headset? |
| 03:01.28 | waldo | good question i should try that |
| 03:02.36 | *** join/#android romainguy (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:04.12 | spikebike | well many chargers I have are 0.5 amps at 5v |
| 03:04.21 | spikebike | the g1 is supposed to have 1amp at 5v |
| 03:04.25 | Disconnect | spikebike: standard usb iirc |
| 03:04.42 | spikebike | usb is I believe 5 watts per pair of ports |
| 03:05.19 | *** join/#android unix_remote (n=blue@unaffiliated/unixinfidel/x-8383745) |
| 03:06.21 | Leeds | wastrel: no :-( |
| 03:06.22 | spikebike | "hi power" usb devices are supposed to draw no more than 500ma |
| 03:06.33 | *** part/#android MattSchultz (i=abstract@ip72-208-144-54.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 03:06.48 | wastrel | would be nice to be able to push all audio over bluetooth |
| 03:06.49 | wastrel | ah well |
| 03:06.56 | unix_remote | spikebike: mostusb ports are only rated at 900mA tops |
| 03:07.17 | Leeds | probably my number 1 'need' |
| 03:08.53 | unix_remote | anyone know of some decently done android screencasts? |
| 03:09.11 | unix_remote | preferably CC or open license. |
| 03:10.53 | *** join/#android MattSchultz (i=abstract@ip72-208-144-54.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 03:11.11 | *** join/#android ivantis (n=ivantis@2002:3ff5:9f4e:1234:20c:f1ff:fea6:2c87) |
| 03:12.40 | unix_remote | anyone? |
| 03:16.06 | *** join/#android z4chh (n=zach@cpe-75-186-150-159.woh.res.rr.com) |
| 03:20.49 | *** join/#android ALoGeNo (n=QUAKEIII@unaffiliated/alogeno) |
| 03:22.45 | z4chh | does android involve c programming at all? |
| 03:26.05 | *** join/#android khert_ (n=Kol@cpe-72-134-103-199.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 03:27.30 | andyross | z4chh: The official API is all Java. Native code is possible though, with a little study of the open source release. |
| 03:30.31 | *** part/#android brocktice (n=brock@c-66-41-18-146.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 03:30.45 | *** join/#android Goosey (n=Goosey@cpe-67-9-174-97.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 03:31.21 | skbohra | where will i find the complied image of android |
| 03:31.40 | gambler | Buy a G1 holla |
| 03:31.53 | skbohra | i just complied it |
| 03:32.37 | skbohra | i got three .img files |
| 03:33.56 | skbohra | how to compile android for a specific target |
| 03:34.10 | *** join/#android kironono (n=kironono@150.43.248.78) |
| 03:36.05 | d03boy | goats goats goats goats |
| 03:36.11 | wastrel | drm is bad |
| 03:36.12 | d03boy | developers developers developers developers developers |
| 03:40.12 | *** join/#android p_quarles (n=lee@unaffiliated/pquarles) |
| 03:41.55 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@c-24-130-144-56.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 03:42.32 | skbohra | :( |
| 03:43.53 | Leeds | skbohra: has android been ported to your platform, whatever it is? |
| 03:48.29 | skbohra | Leeds: I think i just successfully compiled it |
| 03:48.46 | Leeds | for what platform? |
| 03:49.04 | skbohra | don't know :) |
| 03:49.33 | Leeds | er... |
| 03:50.02 | d03boy | platform shoes |
| 03:51.48 | skbohra | linux x86 |
| 03:53.12 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@72.14.224.1) |
| 03:53.44 | skbohra | Leeds: I think I need to learn more |
| 03:53.46 | *** join/#android dglazkov_ (n=dglazkov@72.14.224.1) |
| 03:53.58 | Leeds | yes, I think you probably do |
| 03:54.09 | Leeds | I know I do :-) |
| 03:54.19 | Leeds | what are you trying to achieve? |
| 03:55.44 | skbohra | Leeds: I want to port it on real hardware |
| 03:55.55 | Leeds | what hardware? |
| 03:56.15 | skbohra | Leeds : freerunner |
| 03:56.29 | Leeds | and is the freerunner an x86 device? |
| 03:56.37 | skbohra | Leeds: no |
| 03:56.39 | Leeds | (also, I believe people have already ported it) |
| 03:56.45 | Leeds | so why are you trying to build Android for x86? |
| 03:57.09 | *** join/#android kironono (n=kironono@150.43.248.78) |
| 03:57.16 | skbohra | Leeds: where to specify the architecture |
| 03:57.25 | unix_remote | it's already been "ported" to quite a few non android devices. |
| 03:57.29 | Leeds | no idea! |
| 03:57.36 | unix_remote | obviously not everything is functional. |
| 03:57.39 | skbohra | Leeds: ahhh |
| 03:57.44 | Leeds | unix_remote: but are they all ARM? |
| 03:57.46 | ExpiredPopsicle | I'm actually curious as to how well Android would work on my tablet PC. |
| 03:58.00 | ExpiredPopsicle | But just curious. |
| 03:58.05 | unix_remote | Leeds: heh, yes afaik. |
| 03:58.29 | *** join/#android ecubuntu (n=ecubuntu@c-67-180-162-169.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 03:59.49 | *** join/#android atari2600a (n=atari260@098.230-93-216-fuji-dsl.dhcp.surewest.net) |
| 03:59.57 | atari2600a | I has a question |
| 04:00.13 | `vip_ | ?? |
| 04:00.21 | atari2600a | does apple have an official opinion on android being haxxed up & installed on other phones? |
| 04:00.33 | offby1 | I haz a flavor |
| 04:00.38 | Leeds | I think there was a suggestion on TWiT that Android was meant to be a trojan horse, an attempt for Google to introduce a platform which could then be moved to PCs |
| 04:00.41 | Leeds | er, apple? |
| 04:00.52 | offby1 | atari2600a: I'd be very surprised if anyone here knew the answer to that |
| 04:01.01 | Leeds | atari2600a: do you mean google? |
| 04:01.10 | atari2600a | was that tonight's TWiT? |
| 04:01.18 | Leeds | nah, a few weeks back |
| 04:01.25 | atari2600a | Leeds: google or any employed-by-google devs |
| 04:01.32 | Leeds | so not Apple then? :-) |
| 04:01.36 | atari2600a | oh yeah I remember that episode! |
| 04:01.39 | *** join/#android andyross (n=andy@static-71-245-107-194.ptldor.fios.verizon.net) |
| 04:01.58 | *** join/#android muthu_ (n=mobeegal@218.248.24.81) |
| 04:02.08 | atari2600a | but yeah, according to Wikipedia, Android was successfully installed on 2 phones other than the G1 |
| 04:02.35 | atari2600a | hey there's ops here! |
| 04:02.41 | Leeds | anyway, I would guess the answer is "Google corporate is cautiously happy, but would prefer to do platform deals than have it hacked on, Google devs are really happy to see people playing with Android and probably have a beer every time it's ported to a new device" |
| 04:02.48 | ttuttle | Good evening #android. |
| 04:02.49 | atari2600a | over in #chromium they said Freenode hates ops! |
| 04:03.05 | ttuttle | Freenode does hate ops. |
| 04:03.10 | jbq | Leeds: and we'd want to see more ports so that we could have more beer! |
| 04:03.11 | ecubuntu | hey guys i'm looking for install IRC client on G1, did you know something? |
| 04:03.25 | ttuttle | They generally suggest that channel ops don't leave their ops turned on, to avoid flaunting them. |
| 04:03.26 | Leeds | atari2600a: I'm an op in a couple of channels, and the general idea is to only take your @ when you need it |
| 04:03.38 | Leeds | jbq: good! how do we contribute to the beer fund? :-) |
| 04:03.50 | ecubuntu | hey guys i'm looking for install IRC client on G1, did you know something? |
| 04:03.51 | *** join/#android neerhaj (i=neerhaj@203.115.94.245) |
| 04:04.02 | atari2600a | ecubuntu: has Pidgin been ported to Android yet? |
| 04:04.17 | ecubuntu | no yet atari2600a |
| 04:04.24 | atari2600a | aww |
| 04:04.41 | Leeds | there are at least a couple of IRC clients under development... and porting *anything* native from 'linux' to 'android' is going to take a long time because it'll need to be rewritten in Java... |
| 04:04.43 | atari2600a | my bestest friend Adrian Lamo has Pidgin on his Nokia 810 I believe |
| 04:04.44 | jbq | Leeds: at the risk of other droids shouting at me, I'd like to see more Android on the OpenMoko devices. They might not be the best, but they're meant to be used that way. |
| 04:05.01 | jbq | N810 is also a good target. |
| 04:05.23 | jbq | (probably much easier to port to) |
| 04:05.41 | Leeds | I'd be quite happy to see the xda-developers hackers take on Android... get it on as many HTC devices as possible :-) |
| 04:06.04 | atari2600a | so |
| 04:06.29 | atari2600a | say w/o an actual *phone*, do you guys think Android would work well as a PDA OS? |
| 04:06.31 | Leeds | jbq: without wanting you to say anything you shouldn't... is it fair to say we should expect a number of other out-the-box Android devices to be on the market next year? |
| 04:06.37 | atari2600a | I've never really ran the emulator, too busy |
| 04:07.14 | jbq | Leeds: Android would have kinda failed if nobody managed to do a device within 12 months of the source being released. |
| 04:07.18 | *** join/#android neerhaj (i=neerhaj@203.115.94.245) |
| 04:07.37 | Leeds | atari2600a: if your PDA has some net access... wifi being the obvious one... it would seem to make sense |
| 04:07.46 | atari2600a | yeah |
| 04:07.49 | atari2600a | then just run Skype :P |
| 04:07.59 | atari2600a | ooh is Skype on android yet |
| 04:08.10 | Leeds | without net access... to be honest, most computing devices seem pretty pointless without net access nowadays |
| 04:08.46 | Leeds | there is no skype, and I doubt there will be any time soon... best bet would either be a callback-to-Skype thing, or a gateway... I'd quite like to see fring on my g1 |
| 04:09.46 | languish | atari2600a, technically there's a skype-compatible app on android already. It logs in to skype, uses your skype contacts..etc, BUT.. it also uses your cellular minutes when you make calls :| |
| 04:10.08 | atari2600a | aww, that's no fun |
| 04:10.12 | languish | exactly |
| 04:10.14 | atari2600a | I'd like to see a skype phone running Adroid |
| 04:10.37 | jbq | I'd love to see the framework evolve in a direction where it can support multiple VOIP apps. |
| 04:10.38 | Leeds | skype is nasty and proprietary |
| 04:10.41 | atari2600a | I mean, with SkypeOut / SkypeIn rates as low as they are, it makes perfect sense! |
| 04:10.47 | Leeds | I'd like to see a nice simple SIP app |
| 04:11.05 | atari2600a | how about Ventrilo, any ventrilo apps? |
| 04:11.07 | languish | My wife uses skype to call Japan nightly. |
| 04:11.13 | languish | on her PSP |
| 04:11.36 | Leeds | languish: to call Japan, or to call another Skype user on the internet somewhere? |
| 04:11.52 | languish | Leeds, to call japanese landlines (my inlaws) |
| 04:12.10 | Leeds | get your inlaws online... |
| 04:13.10 | atari2600a | I have video conferences with this dude I know in Lebanon on skype, I was suprised how low the latency was |
| 04:13.14 | languish | Leeds, some are. the older gen isn't ... 70+yrs |
| 04:13.35 | *** join/#android snopi (n=snopi@sigmil.acm.uiuc.edu) |
| 04:14.50 | atari2600a | hey I'm looking for the android emulator, can't exactly find it |
| 04:15.05 | Leeds | atari2600a: grab the sdk, it's at tools/emulator |
| 04:15.13 | atari2600a | ah |
| 04:15.33 | atari2600a | now to learn Java :P |
| 04:17.53 | atari2600a | so |
| 04:18.04 | atari2600a | I know very little about Adroid |
| 04:18.13 | Leeds | so we see :-P |
| 04:18.32 | atari2600a | why Java acceleration, instead of simply C/C++? |
| 04:19.35 | Leeds | three main reasons come to mind: it's a managed platform, which suits a limited-resource device, it's a vm so it abstracts away the particular device, and there are lots and lots and lots of java developers in the world, many of whom are used to doing mobile development |
| 04:19.42 | Leeds | but they are all guesses :-) |
| 04:19.46 | *** join/#android G94B (i=jimmy123@c-68-84-33-205.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 04:19.55 | wastrel | nice nickname |
| 04:20.22 | atari2600a | mine? |
| 04:20.34 | atari2600a | or g94b's? |
| 04:20.51 | Leeds | mine, I assume ;-) |
| 04:21.45 | *** part/#android snopi (n=snopi@sigmil.acm.uiuc.edu) |
| 04:21.57 | *** join/#android bert-0h (n=bert@c-71-230-145-119.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 04:22.44 | bert-0h | whats new? anybody awake in here? |
| 04:23.01 | atari2600a | until last wednesday I always thought Java was a solely interpreted language, until my professor told me otherwise :P |
| 04:23.13 | Leeds | man gcj |
| 04:23.16 | atari2600a | I just assumed cross-platform == interpreted :P |
| 04:23.38 | Leeds | C is one of the most cross-platform languages ever |
| 04:24.03 | atari2600a | definitely not the executable :p |
| 04:24.32 | spikebike | heh |
| 04:24.53 | spikebike | cross compilation is relatively rare |
| 04:24.58 | spikebike | (compared to non) |
| 04:25.15 | spikebike | but yeah C's pretty portable |
| 04:26.32 | spikebike | C compatibility on linux is pretty good |
| 04:26.44 | bert-0h | what is c useful for? what are its weeknesses? |
| 04:27.02 | bert-0h | obviously spelling is one of mine |
| 04:27.09 | spikebike | and runs on an amazing number of platforms, 32 bit, 64 bit, mips, parisc, sparc, arm, powerpc, ia64, x86-32, x86-64, etc. |
| 04:27.21 | atari2600a | c is useful for everything ever? |
| 04:27.33 | atari2600a | if anything the syntax will throw people off if they're not used to it |
| 04:27.38 | *** part/#android G94B (i=jimmy123@c-68-84-33-205.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 04:27.41 | Leeds | it's useful for pretty much anything |
| 04:27.42 | spikebike | it's not particularly easy to write secure code in |
| 04:27.57 | spikebike | nor is it particularly efficient use of programmer time |
| 04:28.00 | atari2600a | someone did a 'eh' 6502 C compiler :P |
| 04:29.02 | atari2600a | but if you want your app to be FAST, C is the way to go, excluding ASM :P |
| 04:29.19 | bert-0h | what are some examples of commonly used applications written in c? |
| 04:29.33 | atari2600a | the linux kernel? |
| 04:29.44 | spikebike | linux and 90+% of the applications |
| 04:29.48 | Leeds | pretty much every kernel, I think |
| 04:29.51 | atari2600a | most Xbox games if you count objective-C? |
| 04:29.57 | spikebike | firefox, thunderbird |
| 04:29.59 | spikebike | what? |
| 04:30.09 | spikebike | xbox games in obj c? |
| 04:30.14 | atari2600a | I believe so |
| 04:30.24 | spikebike | I believe not, did you mean .net? |
| 04:30.29 | spikebike | c sharp? |
| 04:30.51 | atari2600a | been a long time since I looked into it, & it seems pointless to write an xbox game in .net |
| 04:30.59 | spikebike | why? |
| 04:31.14 | spikebike | 99% of obj c is for osx |
| 04:31.33 | atari2600a | seems like it'd slow things down on a platform designed for gaming |
| 04:31.34 | spikebike | in case you hadn't noticed, apple and microsoft aren't best buddies |
| 04:31.55 | spikebike | well the bottlenck is mostly programmer time not performance |
| 04:31.56 | *** join/#android unix_infidel (n=blue@unaffiliated/unixinfidel/x-8383745) |
| 04:32.20 | bert-0h | how many different ways can you write C and whats the difference? |
| 04:32.50 | spikebike | c sharp, obj c, c++ and c mostly |
| 04:33.41 | bert-0h | and you know how to write all of them? |
| 04:33.47 | Leeds | would you include D? |
| 04:33.47 | *** join/#android skbohra (n=best@117.199.115.129) |
| 04:34.15 | atari2600a | wait |
| 04:34.24 | Leeds | no, go! |
| 04:34.25 | atari2600a | I might have been thinking about C# for the xbox |
| 04:34.35 | Leeds | oh, really? |
| 04:34.40 | atari2600a | yeah |
| 04:34.45 | atari2600a | XNA games are C# |
| 04:35.04 | spikebike | ya C# is a microsoft specific language, so not too surprising |
| 04:35.17 | Leeds | it's a microsoft knock-off of Java, AIUI |
| 04:35.49 | bert-0h | is android a google knockoff of java? |
| 04:36.05 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@c-24-130-144-56.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:36.11 | atari2600a | android is an operating system |
| 04:36.27 | atari2600a | that's like saying 'is my toothbrush toilet paper?' |
| 04:36.38 | *** part/#android romainguy (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:36.40 | bert-0h | what language do you use then |
| 04:36.50 | *** join/#android romainguy (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:36.53 | atari2600a | android developers? |
| 04:36.55 | Leeds | dalvik is a Google adaption of the java platform for use in mobile devices |
| 04:36.56 | atari2600a | 99% Java |
| 04:37.02 | *** part/#android romainguy (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:37.09 | *** join/#android dglazkov_ (n=dglazkov@72.14.224.1) |
| 04:37.23 | bert-0h | so dalvik is a google knockoff of java? |
| 04:37.27 | Leeds | no |
| 04:37.35 | wastrel | dalvik is an implementation of a java virtual machine |
| 04:38.06 | wastrel | there are many different JVM implementations, they're all java |
| 04:38.12 | atari2600a | bert-0h: how's the weather in NJ? |
| 04:38.24 | Leeds | wastrel: not if they haven't passed the tests they aren't |
| 04:38.30 | spikebike | wasterl er not really |
| 04:38.34 | andyross | Strictly, no. Dalvik is its own virtual machine, but is designed to be similar enough to java that java bytecode can be directly converted into it. |
| 04:38.43 | Leeds | java vs. Java[TM] |
| 04:38.48 | spikebike | right |
| 04:39.06 | Leeds | somewhat similar to unix vs. UNIX[TM] |
| 04:39.13 | spikebike | but java will run on any hardware |
| 04:39.36 | spikebike | so that's not a particularly restrictive limitation |
| 04:39.43 | bert-0h | so i am not wasting my time reading this java book to learn programming for android then |
| 04:39.51 | spikebike | not at all |
| 04:39.58 | bert-0h | phwew |
| 04:40.26 | wastrel | what book? |
| 04:40.30 | bert-0h | its crappy weather in jersey, why |
| 04:40.46 | atari2600a | but if you can't tell the difference between a programming language & an operating system, you might want to take a few steps back, maybe take an introductory computer science course at your local communty college |
| 04:41.09 | andyross | Or you might be sitting at a Symbolics machine. :) |
| 04:41.56 | wastrel | or using emacs? |
| 04:42.00 | wastrel | i'm no good at this game |
| 04:42.02 | bert-0h | the book is Java an introduction to Problem Solving and Programming |
| 04:42.07 | Leeds | C and unix were pretty tightly coupled in the early days |
| 04:42.37 | bert-0h | by Walter Savitch and Frank M. Carrano |
| 04:42.40 | spikebike | still are |
| 04:43.03 | Leeds | bert-0h: java is three things: a language, a standard library set, and a virtual machine/platform... dalvik uses the same language, a similar standard library, and a different virtual machine - but you don't really need to care about the VM |
| 04:43.11 | bert-0h | thanks for helping me through this guys |
| 04:43.46 | spikebike | er sort of |
| 04:43.56 | spikebike | dalvik is a superset of the java virtual machin |
| 04:43.58 | spikebike | e |
| 04:44.08 | Leeds | a true superset? |
| 04:44.09 | spikebike | there is a java -> dec translater |
| 04:44.13 | spikebike | er dex |
| 04:44.21 | wastrel | i have a question |
| 04:44.32 | wastrel | is there a way to turn off the notification when i plug in to USB? |
| 04:44.58 | spikebike | but for instance perl 6 or python could be ported to dalvik and do things not possible under java |
| 04:45.13 | wastrel | hrm |
| 04:45.42 | Leeds | spikebike: except that - as has been discussed - dalvik is unlikely to deal well with dynamic code |
| 04:45.45 | atari2600a | hey I'm running the emulator right now, but It's at ANDROID_ |
| 04:45.52 | atari2600a | is there something I'm missing here? |
| 04:46.00 | bert-0h | could you port c as well? |
| 04:46.07 | Leeds | atari2600a: it's a bit slow to boot - leave it and it should start up |
| 04:46.31 | atari2600a | there it goes |
| 04:46.37 | wastrel | anyone in nyc having crapulous 3g tonight? |
| 04:46.40 | Leeds | spikebike: jython or jruby could be used to run things under dalvik, in theory... |
| 04:46.40 | atari2600a | I hope it's this slow due to the emulation :P |
| 04:46.44 | spikebike | leeds true, at least for now |
| 04:46.56 | spikebike | leeds except for the no dynamic thing |
| 04:47.28 | *** join/#android irig (i=ca5030af@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c132944a3d2526f6) |
| 04:47.41 | bert-0h | what does xml stand for? |
| 04:47.45 | Leeds | I did briefly get excited about the possibility of pypy->java, but it's not that interesting, I think |
| 04:47.52 | Leeds | extensible markup language |
| 04:47.58 | irig | extended markup langauge |
| 04:48.07 | Leeds | ex-something |
| 04:48.16 | irig | hi all i am facing some problem |
| 04:48.25 | irig | when i am trying to make it says |
| 04:48.26 | irig | ld/core/java.mk:9: *** development/samples/HelloActivity/tests: Target java module does not define any source or resource files. Stop |
| 04:48.33 | andyross | Meh. It's HTML with an "X" in front because X is cool, of course. XML was mostly a mistake. |
| 04:48.48 | irig | whnt may be the issue ? |
| 04:48.51 | wastrel | xml is used in android |
| 04:49.13 | bert-0h | so whats the diff html vs. xml |
| 04:49.21 | Leeds | bert-0h: everything |
| 04:49.28 | atari2600a | this reminds me of GNOME a little |
| 04:49.46 | andyross | HTML is a markup language for text. XML is a metadata format that happens to look like it (because HTML was cool at the time, so XML must be even better!) |
| 04:49.51 | Leeds | xhtml is a variant of HTML which is also XML... they both descend from SGML |
| 04:50.08 | d03boy | im watching matlock |
| 04:50.13 | Leeds | I have soup |
| 04:50.13 | d03boy | and they're calling it "codes" |
| 04:50.15 | d03boy | computer codes |
| 04:50.26 | Leeds | lumpy soup |
| 04:50.31 | bert-0h | i need to learn xml also then...i suppose if it is at all like html there is a good online resource for doing so? |
| 04:50.49 | irig | hi all i am facing some problem when i am trying to do make it says ld/core/java.mk:9: *** development/samples/HelloActivity/tests: Target java module does not define any source or resource files. Stop |
| 04:50.58 | Leeds | irig: eclipse problem? |
| 04:51.09 | Leeds | bert-0h: you don't really need to learn that much xml |
| 04:53.16 | jmob | andyross: xml is a document mark-up language, it gets abused as a data exchange format only because There Isn't Anything Better (TM) |
| 04:53.18 | skbohra | what is the best way to quit from android sdk |
| 04:53.33 | skbohra | my fc9 box hangs after quiting |
| 04:53.47 | skbohra | i have to restart |
| 04:53.50 | irig | what is eclipse problem ? |
| 04:53.57 | skbohra | :) |
| 04:54.07 | skbohra | Leeds : you tell him |
| 04:54.07 | irig | do i need to install something else ? |
| 04:54.25 | Leeds | I don't use eclipse |
| 04:54.29 | *** part/#android atari2600a (n=atari260@098.230-93-216-fuji-dsl.dhcp.surewest.net) |
| 04:54.56 | skbohra | Leeds: Ctrl+C is the way to quit? |
| 04:54.58 | andyross | jmob: xhtml is a document markup language. XML on the whole is used pervasively for strict data formats (c.f. AndroidManifest.xml) where other things like JSON (that, yes, are better) would be more appropriate. |
| 04:55.05 | wastrel | is there a feature request in for being able to turn off that notification when plugging in to USB? |
| 04:55.31 | andyross | Why would you want to? I mean, it's not like it's interrupting you -- you just plugged the phone in, by definition you're not using it. |
| 04:55.33 | Leeds | xml is a meta-markup-language |
| 04:55.40 | Leeds | skbohra: quit what? |
| 04:55.55 | skbohra | Leeds: android emulator |
| 04:56.01 | Leeds | just close the window? |
| 04:56.16 | skbohra | it makes my system un-responsive |
| 04:56.26 | wastrel | json yaml xml yay |
| 04:56.43 | skbohra | Leeds: the only way i could rescue is reboot |
| 04:56.44 | skbohra | :( |
| 04:56.54 | wastrel | andyross: it's loud and annoying |
| 04:56.59 | Leeds | what system? |
| 04:57.01 | wastrel | andyross: it wakes up my wife |
| 04:57.04 | wastrel | and baby |
| 04:57.09 | andyross | Mute the notification sound? |
| 04:57.19 | jmob | andyross: you need to define your metrics, why would json be better |
| 04:57.21 | Leeds | put your thumb over the speaker as you plug it in? |
| 04:57.22 | wastrel | so then i don't get other notifictaions |
| 04:57.26 | Leeds | skbohra: what OS? |
| 04:57.36 | irig | hi all i am facing some problem when i am trying to do make android source code it says ld/core/java.mk:9: *** development/samples/HelloActivity/tests: Target java module does not define any source or resource files. Stop |
| 04:57.40 | skbohra | Leeds:FC9 |
| 04:57.53 | Leeds | you're not running it as root, are you? |
| 04:58.03 | skbohra | Leeds: no |
| 04:58.03 | Leeds | mmm... good soup :-) |
| 04:58.07 | jmob | just because stupid humans want it tp be "readable"? |
| 04:58.12 | andyross | JSON is more readable, more writable, terser, cleaner, has a much shorter specification, requires less string escaping, and is a better fit for object data models where fields are not order-sensitive. Those metrics specific enough for you? |
| 04:58.22 | Leeds | then there's no way it should be able to make your system unresponsive... what happens if you kill the process? |
| 04:58.45 | skbohra | Leeds: it is making |
| 04:59.01 | Leeds | making? |
| 04:59.20 | andyross | Oh, and JSON can represent "list of" natively, unlike XML. |
| 04:59.28 | irig | hi all i am facing some problem when i am trying to do make android source code it says ld/core/java.mk:9: *** development/samples/HelloActivity/tests: Target java module does not define any source or resource files. Stop |
| 04:59.42 | irig | wht may be the issue ? |
| 04:59.47 | irig | please help me out |
| 04:59.57 | Leeds | I should try living on this soup for a while... probably a good way to lose weight |
| 05:00.04 | skbohra | Leeds: it is making system un-responsive, each time i kill the process, by clicking on the close button or using ctrl+z |
| 05:00.04 | jmob | irig: dude, stop reasking the question |
| 05:00.18 | Leeds | skbohra: if you use kill or kill -9 doesn't it go away? |
| 05:00.37 | Leeds | irig: if anyone knew, they would have helped you by now |
| 05:01.23 | irig | have any one of you built android on ubantu ? |
| 05:01.23 | bert-0h | irig, can you make other source code just fine? |
| 05:01.43 | wastrel | thumb over thingy muffles but doesn't completely mute it |
| 05:01.55 | andyross | "built android" meaning the open source release of the platform? Partially. |
| 05:01.55 | wastrel | it's still loud and annoying and unnecessary |
| 05:02.02 | wastrel | and there should be a preference to disable it <3 |
| 05:02.25 | bert-0h | thumb over speaker, arse over hand |
| 05:02.35 | irig | yes opensource release avaialble here http://source.android.com/download |
| 05:02.48 | irig | have any one of you built it on ubantu ? |
| 05:03.10 | bert-0h | is ubantu the same as ubuntu? |
| 05:03.23 | jmob | andyross: there's no schemas for json, how am i supposed to know what i'm allowed to put in a data structure? |
| 05:04.28 | andyross | jmob: You could ask the same question of python or ruby data structures, and yet people use those tools all the time. You could *also* say the same for probably 90% of production XML formats in the world. Schemas are cute. They're hardly dealbreakers. |
| 05:05.03 | irig | bert-0h,ya same |
| 05:05.13 | jmob | andyross: i can write tools that write the xml correctly for me, without possibility of human error |
| 05:05.47 | bert-0h | i have, although very simple apps |
| 05:06.00 | andyross | Sure, but s/xml/json/g and that statement is still true. A JSON verifier is a trivial task in any scripting language. Javascript can even do it natively. |
| 05:06.07 | jmob | andyross: how do i compose two different data structures without namespaces in json? |
| 05:06.28 | bert-0h | according to a google search many people have |
| 05:07.16 | andyross | Hammer/nail argument. "Composition" is something very specific to xhtml and related formats like svg. It's something you do in markup. It's *not* something you do in data formats for some very good reasons (hint: encapsulation). |
| 05:07.26 | Leeds | jmob: there are cases where all these super xml features matter - but in most cases they don't, and something like json is probably better |
| 05:07.40 | *** join/#android skbohra1 (n=best@117.199.115.129) |
| 05:07.49 | andyross | And yes: xml makes a fine markup language. But it's an innapropriate and clumsy choice for data formats, which is my core point. |
| 05:07.54 | skbohra1 | Leeds: It happend again |
| 05:08.29 | andyross | c.f. AndroidManifest.xml again, by the way, which is specified in a mixed namespace and has terrible readability problems as a result. |
| 05:08.54 | jmob | andyross: rss feeds do it -all- the time, composing data |
| 05:08.55 | Leeds | skbohra: oh no! what did? |
| 05:09.30 | skbohra1 | Leeds: killing android sdk made my fc9 box un responsive |
| 05:09.31 | skbohra1 | :( |
| 05:09.33 | jmob | i imagine androidm...xml it really a data structure in disguise too, not appropriate for markup |
| 05:09.40 | Leeds | how did you kill it? |
| 05:09.57 | skbohra1 | Leeds: pressed X |
| 05:10.08 | Leeds | didn't I suggest using kill instead? |
| 05:10.39 | skbohra1 | Leeds: kill in adb shell? |
| 05:10.49 | Leeds | no, kill in Linux shell |
| 05:10.53 | jmob | andyross: sorry, i'm mostly playing devils advocate, i hate xml too |
| 05:11.30 | jmob | andyross: never had my eyes bleed more than when i had to write a bunch of xslt junk |
| 05:11.30 | RyeBrye | Oh? Is it XML bashing time? |
| 05:12.03 | jmob | emephasis on the /had to/ bit |
| 05:12.09 | RyeBrye | I was in a job interview once for a company that used some crazy XML file to transfer data between different systems... The guy doing the interview was extremely proud that they used XSLT for what it was "originally intended for" |
| 05:12.36 | RyeBrye | I replied: "transforming an XML document into something else?" |
| 05:12.49 | bert-0h | what parts of xml do i need to learn for android developing? |
| 05:12.53 | RyeBrye | and he said "No." (pause - he cocks his head back) "LOGIC" |
| 05:13.09 | RyeBrye | That was kind of a red flag |
| 05:13.12 | Leeds | bert-0h: very little |
| 05:13.17 | wastrel | bert-0h: just get a general idea of how to read an xml document... which you mostly know from html |
| 05:13.20 | Leeds | bert-0h: you know how HTML tags work? |
| 05:13.33 | jmob | RyeBrye: uh, i dont get it, i thought xslt was for transforming xml docs too |
| 05:13.34 | bert-0h | yes |
| 05:13.38 | wastrel | bert-0h: then learn the android-specific stuff |
| 05:13.47 | skbohra1 | Leeds: I need to be su to start android emulator |
| 05:14.00 | Leeds | skbohra1: I *asked* you if you were running it as root, and you said no |
| 05:14.36 | jmob | andyross: hope i didnt scare you off |
| 05:14.43 | skbohra1 | Leeds: i did a su :-[ |
| 05:14.45 | MattSchultz | I have an API question - given the URI to an image on the phone (obtained by using the photogallery), I'm trying to get the bytestream of that image so I can use it. According to the API, the best way to do that seems to be to get a ContentResolver, then call getInputStream, passing my URI. Which all seem to work, except I can't seem to get my hands on a ContentResolver object. Both the Google Code website and the Android API docs bui |
| 05:14.45 | MattSchultz | say it has a constructor which takes a single arguement - a context. But when I try to actually make a new one, using "ContentResolver resolver = new ContentResolver(applicationContext);", I see an error which tells me "Cannot instantiate the type ContentResolver". What's going on here? |
| 05:14.50 | bert-0h | wastrel: i meant what parts of xml are android-specific |
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| 05:15.04 | skbohra1 | Leeds: without su |
| 05:15.15 | skbohra1 | Leeds: I can't start android |
| 05:15.22 | Leeds | skbohra1: then work out why not |
| 05:15.37 | wastrel | bert-0h: android uses xml files in some configuration for application development. |
| 05:15.39 | skbohra1 | Leeds: ya |
| 05:15.45 | skbohra1 | Leeds: lemme |
| 05:15.53 | wastrel | bert-0h: learn how to use those files, not "xml" |
| 05:15.53 | Leeds | did you, maybe unpack the sdk package as root? |
| 05:16.09 | wastrel | bert-0h: AndroidManifest.xml, for example |
| 05:16.20 | skbohra1 | Leeds: yes I did |
| 05:16.39 | Leeds | try again as a regular user - no need to do it as root |
| 05:16.46 | bert-0h | ok, thank you wastrel |
| 05:16.56 | RyeBrye | jmob - that's the point... XSLT is NOT made for logic, and that guy (their VP of engineering) obviously had his head up his rear |
| 05:17.00 | bert-0h | i will look into that |
| 05:17.38 | llight | any1 knows how to use ashmem ? |
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| 05:24.56 | RyeBrye | Is the Flash player that was demoed on a G1 today at MAX - was that a normal flash player or flash lite? |
| 05:25.38 | bert-0h | wha? do you have a link to more info on that? |
| 05:25.44 | g1er | looks like flash lite |
| 05:25.46 | g1er | http://www.intomobile.com/2008/11/17/adobe-brings-flash-to-t-mobile-g1-android-and-adobe-flash-together-at-last.html |
| 05:26.50 | wastrel | any news about ebook readers or offline html? |
| 05:27.02 | wastrel | desperate for offline content :] |
| 05:27.15 | RyeBrye | flash lite? :( |
| 05:27.54 | ionstorm | anyone figure out how to unlock this thing yet |
| 05:27.57 | RyeBrye | That makes me wonder - is the thing Adobe has waiting in wings for the iPhone a flash lite? I thought part of the objection Steve Jobs had was that Flash Lite sucked and Flash was too big |
| 05:28.06 | RyeBrye | ionstorm - call T-mobile and get an unlock code? |
| 05:28.19 | RyeBrye | ionstorm- did you see the stuff about multi-touch? |
| 05:28.24 | ionstorm | ah, im more of a do-it-yourselfer |
| 05:28.32 | ionstorm | what stuff? |
| 05:28.40 | ionstorm | oh the source |
| 05:28.43 | ionstorm | commented? |
| 05:28.45 | ionstorm | yea |
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| 05:29.04 | mileena449 | hello room |
| 05:29.06 | ionstorm | i seen u talk about it when I was too drunk to type the other nite |
| 05:29.06 | RyeBrye | ionstorm - no... what happens when the code is uncommented |
| 05:29.06 | ionstorm | lol |
| 05:29.09 | RyeBrye | inostorm - http://www.ryebrye.com/blog/2008/11/17/proving-the-g1-screen-can-handle-multi-touch/ |
| 05:29.11 | RyeBrye | Ok :) |
| 05:29.15 | ionstorm | ah |
| 05:29.49 | ionstorm | nice blog, where do u host it |
| 05:29.56 | mileena449 | hello i got a question about prices on g1 android how come some of them are 180 then 300 then goes to 400, whats the real price of the phone? |
| 05:30.15 | RyeBrye | right now it's on a vps at eapps.com, but I might move it soon to another server I have (I've just been lazy) |
| 05:30.29 | ionstorm | thanks for the props |
| 05:30.32 | ionstorm | reads |
| 05:31.08 | mileena449 | :/ |
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| 05:31.27 | ionstorm | neat find RyeBrye |
| 05:31.29 | RyeBrye | mileena449 - depends upon how soon you are up for an upgrade |
| 05:31.30 | ionstorm | ;) |
| 05:31.39 | mileena449 | anyone knows the real price of the4 g1 android? |
| 05:31.51 | ionstorm | 400 w/o contract |
| 05:32.07 | RyeBrye | ionstorm - the real bitch is that whole "G1 is spec'ed as a single-touch screen" :/ |
| 05:33.14 | ionstorm | yea, maybe google has an agreement with synaptics just for single touch |
| 05:33.21 | ionstorm | and they may have to pay extra for double |
| 05:33.22 | ionstorm | lame |
| 05:33.43 | ionstorm | we could just finish the src code ourselves |
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| 05:34.21 | mileena449 | ionstorm o got a quick question, my brother and i purchased 2 nokia expressmusic for 300 dollars mine is defected then i exchange it for a g1 android then they asked me to pay another 150 dollars even we had the two year contract, so it seems i purchased it for 300 dollars |
| 05:34.46 | mileena449 | i was thinking i supposed to 179 it says in the t mobile website |
| 05:35.01 | spikebike | right, but you already used up your sponsored phone |
| 05:35.03 | RyeBrye | It's HTC - but I think it's most likely that the screen they have right now might be capable because perhaps synaptics only has multi-touch capable screens or something.. and in the future it might be that they can source one that isn't capable... |
| 05:35.21 | ionstorm | u will get the 150 returned back most likely, they just bill u the difference for the phone |
| 05:35.26 | ionstorm | call up tmo |
| 05:35.39 | mileena449 | ok i im just double checking, they didnt phuked me over? |
| 05:36.08 | ionstorm | dunno, when I exchanged mine they billed me 179 until I returned it |
| 05:36.45 | ionstorm | RyeBrye, this really dont make sense lol |
| 05:36.52 | mileena449 | i returned the phone becuase its defective i followed the 14 day policy |
| 05:36.58 | mileena449 | its not an upgrade |
| 05:37.16 | mileena449 | theyre the one who told me to get g1 i said ok |
| 05:37.26 | g1er | mileena449: did you do all this through a store? |
| 05:37.30 | ionstorm | mileena449, call 1-800-672-5390 |
| 05:37.42 | mileena449 | yes inside the store |
| 05:37.51 | ionstorm | oh hmm |
| 05:37.55 | ionstorm | call the store |
| 05:38.03 | ionstorm | ask for clarification |
| 05:38.03 | mileena449 | i just want to know if they as me over on it or not |
| 05:38.08 | mileena449 | ok |
| 05:38.50 | wastrel | pines for offline content |
| 05:39.35 | spikebike | pines for offline maps |
| 05:39.43 | RyeBrye | Interesting - the Android browser identifies itself as safari |
| 05:39.47 | spikebike | I was thinking of offering maemo mapper's author $200 for a port |
| 05:39.54 | ionstorm | rofl |
| 05:39.57 | RyeBrye | It probably does this for compatibility reasons |
| 05:40.04 | ionstorm | yea |
| 05:40.09 | ionstorm | spoof |
| 05:40.29 | wastrel | maps are content |
| 05:40.40 | ionstorm | i wonder if gnash would work w/android's browser |
| 05:40.45 | wastrel | i need to make a subway map speaking of offline maps |
| 05:41.02 | spikebike | I find it very strange that when you really need a map in the middle of nowhere you can't get a map |
| 05:41.09 | wastrel | v. true |
| 05:41.24 | wastrel | also strange when you're on the subway and have some downtime to read, you can't get any web pages |
| 05:41.27 | spikebike | thus my love for maemo mapper |
| 05:41.39 | bert0 | when you declare an applications content provider does that mean T-Mobile? |
| 05:41.47 | spikebike | well that's easy to fix, audio books, music, games, etc. |
| 05:42.00 | wastrel | i don't use audio much |
| 05:42.13 | wastrel | headphones are a pain in the ass. and you can't pipe audio over bluetooth |
| 05:42.16 | wastrel | and games are boring |
| 05:42.40 | spikebike | I've enjoyed some audiobooks |
| 05:42.47 | wastrel | i prefer reading :] |
| 05:43.01 | spikebike | yeah, but you can listen in many conditions where you can't read |
| 05:43.07 | spikebike | like a crowded train |
| 05:43.07 | wastrel | and i much prefer not having to fool around with headphones |
| 05:43.11 | spikebike | or driving |
| 05:43.19 | wastrel | easy to read on a train if you have ebook on pda |
| 05:43.25 | wastrel | that's why i like it |
| 05:43.26 | spikebike | even in bed if the lights are out ;-) |
| 05:43.36 | wastrel | again, pda = lighted screen |
| 05:43.42 | wastrel | tho i do wish i could dim the backlight more |
| 05:43.50 | spikebike | actually I think you can |
| 05:43.57 | wastrel | i haaaate fooling with headhpones, try that in a crowded train |
| 05:44.11 | spikebike | I usually put the earphones on before you get on the train |
| 05:44.22 | spikebike | s/you/i/ |
| 05:44.30 | wastrel | how do you dim more? |
| 05:44.30 | spikebike | heh |
| 05:44.38 | wastrel | i've got it on the lowest setting |
| 05:44.47 | spikebike | ya umm I think that's 50 or so |
| 05:44.53 | spikebike | it does down to 8 |
| 05:44.58 | spikebike | umm |
| 05:45.03 | wastrel | i'd have to write an interface |
| 05:45.05 | wastrel | yes |
| 05:45.13 | spikebike | I think it's /sys/dev/light/backlight or something |
| 05:45.15 | spikebike | just echo |
| 05:45.23 | wastrel | i don't have root |
| 05:45.31 | spikebike | gasps |
| 05:45.38 | spikebike | wtf not |
| 05:45.41 | RyeBrye | cool. It goes down to 8? |
| 05:45.53 | wastrel | i've been thinking of writing an app and throwing it up on the market |
| 05:45.58 | spikebike | someone else claimed it went down to 8 before it went off |
| 05:46.17 | wastrel | max is 250 iirc |
| 05:46.55 | spikebike | I'll look for it, might not require root |
| 05:47.03 | spikebike | after all the app to control it shouldn't run as root |
| 05:47.26 | wastrel | anyway i've been using fbreader but it needs a lot of work |
| 05:48.05 | wastrel | i need to start carrying my palm tx again for ebooks |
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| 05:51.31 | RyeBrye | I wish mobipocket reader would work in that midp thing |
| 05:51.33 | RyeBrye | but it doesn't |
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| 05:53.16 | wastrel | i hate mobipocket :] |
| 05:53.32 | *** join/#android romainguy__ (n=gfx@adsl-75-55-215-117.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 05:53.32 | wastrel | but it's a functional reader yeah if it worked |
| 05:53.48 | wastrel | fbreader is pretty broken. i read a book but it wasn't easy |
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| 05:54.10 | *** mode/#android [+o morrildl] by ChanServ |
| 05:54.41 | *** join/#android zhobbs (n=zach@2.136.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 05:54.48 | wastrel | we're no longer dmorrilized |
| 05:55.03 | morrildl | wastrel: it's a trap |
| 05:55.12 | morrildl | My last name is actually Morrill |
| 05:55.13 | DarkriftX | RyeBrye, 999 members on my forums :) |
| 05:55.25 | RyeBrye | cool |
| 05:55.33 | DarkriftX | waiting for number 1k lol |
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| 06:00.38 | wastrel | we're no longer dmorrillized |
| 06:00.59 | DarkriftX | lol |
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| 06:02.32 | *** join/#android unix_infidel (n=blue@unaffiliated/unixinfidel/x-8383745) |
| 06:05.12 | RyeBrye | So... When a touch event registers in the touchscreen driver - where does it go next? What path does it go down to eventually get into the java land |
| 06:06.26 | ionstorm | lsof |
| 06:06.30 | ionstorm | grab it |
| 06:06.40 | ionstorm | +strace |
| 06:06.59 | zhobbs | I want to keep a log of 50 or so Strings, so when I add a new string the oldest string goes away...what's the most efficient way to do this? Is doing a List<String>.remove(0), List.add(String) inefficient? |
| 06:08.02 | RyeBrye | I'll have to put the debian chroot stuff in place to do that |
| 06:09.30 | ionstorm | just compile them both for arm |
| 06:11.12 | MattSchultz | Anyone know a good tutorial on doing HTTP requests? |
| 06:11.47 | muthu_ | zhobbs: use a queue |
| 06:12.29 | ionstorm | MattSchultz, use netcat for basic stuff |
| 06:13.17 | ionstorm | o for android, search google |
| 06:13.21 | ionstorm | plenty of examples |
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| 06:18.42 | MattSchultz | I've got most of it down, but I'm not sure exactly how to set the body of HttpPost... |
| 06:19.29 | zhobbs | OutputStreamWriter wr = new OutputStreamWriter(conn.getOutputStream()); |
| 06:19.29 | zhobbs | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:19.29 | zhobbs | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:19.55 | zhobbs | String data = URLEncoder.encode("arg", "UTF-8") + "=" + URLEncoder.encode(value, "UTF-8"); |
| 06:20.17 | ionstorm | MattSchultz, http://groups.google.com/group/android-beginners/search?group=android-beginners&q=http+post&qt_g=Search+this+group |
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| 06:25.10 | kRutOn | MattSchultz: Did you figure out the trying to instantiate an abstract class thing.... |
| 06:27.49 | kRutOn | ttp://tinyurl.com/httpclient-post |
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| 06:49.40 | tauno | "<romainguy_> tauno: what were the complaints you wanted to voice ealier?" <- nevermind, it won't change anything anyway I guess |
| 06:50.16 | romainguy__ | you won't know if you don't say :) |
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| 06:51.51 | unix_infidel | hopes the G1 goes on sale black friday. |
| 06:53.09 | DarkriftX | me too lol |
| 06:53.16 | DarkriftX | although not sure ill have enough for it anyways |
| 06:53.25 | DarkriftX | if you find it anywhere, please let me know lol |
| 06:54.01 | unix_infidel | it'll be interesting to see if IMF and flash drop at the same time. |
| 06:54.08 | unix_infidel | early christmas present. |
| 06:54.25 | *** join/#android dream_kill_aw (n=dream_ki@host86-159-227-83.range86-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 06:55.20 | tauno | ok, here we go -> StaticLayout -> is ther any way to reuse this object? I haven't found a setText() or something like that.. and its a really heavy object also.. try creating a few of these for some big texts.. the GC starts to spin around like crazy |
| 06:55.37 | romainguy__ | you can't reuse it |
| 06:56.01 | *** join/#android anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5492DB95.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:56.07 | Fnord^- | romainguy__, there should be a way to use multiple google accounts, or at least switch :P |
| 06:56.15 | romainguy__ | Fnord^-: we never though about that :) |
| 06:56.31 | Fnord^- | romainguy__, really? o.o |
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| 06:57.45 | romainguy__ | Fnord^-: take a guess :)) |
| 06:57.51 | romainguy__ | more seriously, we know |
| 06:57.53 | RyeBrye | unix_infidel I haven't seen any BF ads listing the G1 |
| 06:57.57 | Fnord^- | I somehow doubt it was overlooked :P |
| 06:57.59 | romainguy__ | most googlers have at least 2 Google/gmail accounts |
| 06:58.00 | RyeBrye | It's flash lite, right? |
| 06:58.11 | Fnord^- | Just wondering if it's technical limitation or a policy limitation |
| 06:58.16 | romainguy__ | neither |
| 06:58.23 | romainguy__ | we didn't have time to do it properly |
| 06:58.23 | Fnord^- | Oh |
| 06:58.26 | Fnord^- | Ahhh |
| 06:58.32 | romainguy__ | you can ask cbeust when he's around |
| 06:58.35 | romainguy__ | it's not trivial |
| 06:59.02 | Fnord^- | I've built perl with dbi/sqlite but the script I could make wouldn't help users that are not naughty XD |
| 06:59.11 | tauno | romainguy_, yeah, I figured that.. that leads me to implementing my own text wrapping/painting classes, which means I have to measure my text somehow.. now paint.measureText() pretends to return int's but is only capable of measuring till 32767 pixels (eg it uses shorts) so If I have a really long string I can't just measure it and divide it with the width of the screen to get a good guess at the total line count.. (sure, I can implement it ot |
| 06:59.29 | languish | [01:58] <romainguy__> neither |
| 06:59.29 | languish | [01:58] <romainguy__> we didn't have time to do it properly |
| 06:59.37 | romainguy__ | tauno: that's not quite the right way to do this |
| 06:59.51 | romainguy__ | tauno: even if it could measure to the max of an int, you could hit the limit |
| 07:00.13 | languish | caving in to external forces of evil is giving in to evil, when unleashing the unfinished (ala microsoft) on the general consumer |
| 07:00.20 | languish | :( |
| 07:00.21 | tauno | romainguy__ that was just my initial attempt to do it and that's why i discovered the wrong return type.. I'm not saying it's a good way of doing it :/ |
| 07:00.27 | languish | weeps for the souls of the many |
| 07:00.32 | romainguy__ | languish: it's not unfinished since you can use Gmail |
| 07:00.45 | romainguy__ | languish: and let's face it, users with multiple Gmail accounts are not the majority |
| 07:00.46 | languish | talk to me about bluetooth progiles |
| 07:00.53 | languish | *profiles |
| 07:00.59 | romainguy__ | languish: no |
| 07:01.03 | Fnord^- | <romainguy__> most googlers have at least 2 Google/gmail accounts <---- :-O!!! |
| 07:01.03 | languish | lol |
| 07:01.04 | Leeds | is there any way to get a more exact timestamp in the call log than "1 hour ago"? |
| 07:01.18 | Leeds | Fnord^-: think 'home' and 'work' |
| 07:01.31 | Fnord^- | Leeds, yeah that's the problem I hit today. |
| 07:01.37 | RyeBrye | Leeds - more like "Clark Kent" and "Superman" |
| 07:01.50 | Fnord^- | romainguy__, oh and googledocs mobile should allow one to unsubscribe :P |
| 07:02.00 | Fnord^- | romainguy__, btw, good job >.> |
| 07:02.02 | romainguy__ | that has nothing to do with Android |
| 07:02.06 | Fnord^- | Yeah I know |
| 07:02.08 | romainguy__ | so go tell the Google Docs people :) |
| 07:02.20 | romainguy__ | (and don't you mean log out?) |
| 07:02.22 | Leeds | romainguy_: they aren't conveniently on IRC :-) |
| 07:02.47 | Fnord^- | Nah, unsubscribe from a feed. And I figure you could corner them at the watercooler or such |
| 07:02.53 | Fnord^- | Assuming you have watercoolers. |
| 07:02.59 | RyeBrye | or send an autopiloting helicopter after them? |
| 07:03.03 | Fnord^- | Yeah |
| 07:03.16 | Fnord^- | Or yell obnoxiously over the cubicle farm |
| 07:03.30 | Fnord^- | "HAY GUYS, YOU FORGOT SOMETHING!" |
| 07:03.34 | languish | I'd rather yell at whoever develops gmail/chat contacts to "hide" not "remove" |
| 07:03.54 | Leeds | anyone, detailed timestamps in call log? |
| 07:04.48 | Fnord^- | Eh |
| 07:06.24 | tauno | romainguy_ it would be great if there was something lighter that you could use to draw text. I know there was no time and that I'm the only one who is in need of something like this.. it's just.. can we have it in vesion... 5 maybe? :) |
| 07:06.58 | romainguy__ | how is drawText() not light? |
| 07:07.20 | tauno | sorry,, forgot to write draw/wrap text :) |
| 07:07.41 | tauno | basically something like StaticLayout.. only lighter.. |
| 07:07.42 | Fnord^- | Whoops I meant reader, not docs |
| 07:08.06 | Leeds | Fnord^-: you mean the mobile version? |
| 07:08.16 | romainguy__ | tauno: wrapping text, correctly, is not light :) |
| 07:08.17 | Fnord^- | yup |
| 07:08.26 | romainguy__ | what is your problem with StaticLayout anyway? |
| 07:08.27 | Fnord^- | Can't unsubscribe from feeds, or I'm missing something |
| 07:08.38 | Leeds | just unsubscribe on a computer... do you really unsub so often? |
| 07:08.58 | Fnord^- | I play with the phone alot o.o So yeh |
| 07:08.59 | Leeds | incidentally, are you using the true mobile version or the 'iphone' one? |
| 07:09.20 | Fnord^- | Whichever one the default homepage on a g1 links to |
| 07:10.05 | Fnord^- | google.com/m?page=2#reader |
| 07:10.55 | Fnord^- | which isn't the same as http://www.google.com/reader/m/view/ <--iphone one? |
| 07:11.02 | Leeds | does it have iphone-like buttons and load items with AJAX, or does it do one item per page? |
| 07:11.41 | Fnord^- | It seems to do ajax stuff. It's not barebones text. I've never seen an iphone button :P |
| 07:11.56 | *** join/#android g1er (n=sonik@c-67-161-176-213.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 07:12.14 | Fnord^- | 3d buttons with light grey -> dark grey gradient going from top to bottom? |
| 07:13.05 | Leeds | yeah, that's the iphone - should probably say mobile webkit - one... it doesn't seem to work for me, read items don't stay read |
| 07:13.26 | Fnord^- | works great here |
| 07:13.43 | *** join/#android raidfive (n=adam@c-71-236-205-80.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 07:15.26 | Leeds | I think it works if I manually "mark as read" but not if I just read it and scroll on to the next item |
| 07:16.17 | tauno | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:16.54 | Fnord^- | hrm |
| 07:19.19 | *** part/#android bdjnk (n=bdjnk@71-212-85-175.tukw.qwest.net) |
| 07:20.32 | tauno | and just now I see that romain left.. great :D |
| 07:22.28 | Fnord^- | =[ I don't think android's openssl has rsa support |
| 07:26.03 | BHSPitMonkey | What's the bare minimum specs Android can be made to run on? |
| 07:27.00 | spikebike | er, what's the right answer? |
| 07:27.15 | spikebike | and how do you define run? |
| 07:28.09 | BHSPitMonkey | I've just read varying reports about the requirements, i.e. 64MB ram vs 128MB |
| 07:28.23 | gambler | BHSPitMonkey, in theory, an abacus. In practice anything linux-2.6 can run on. |
| 07:28.35 | spikebike | yeah that sounds right |
| 07:28.51 | spikebike | if you just want a dialer and a contact database I would be surprised if 64 MB wasn't plenty |
| 07:28.51 | Fnord^- | Tue Nov 18 01:28:39 2008 Cipher algorithm 'BF-CBC' not found (OpenSSL) |
| 07:28.52 | Fnord^- | =[ |
| 07:29.16 | spikebike | if you want user applications, youtube, and the browser than 128-192 seems more reasonable |
| 07:29.45 | gambler | Fnord^-, include bouncy castle and it works |
| 07:30.02 | Fnord^- | gambler, clarify 'bouncy castle' ? |
| 07:30.04 | BHSPitMonkey | Mmk. I read posts from people claiming 128MB to be a hard requirement, thought it seemed suspect. |
| 07:30.19 | spikebike | you can fire up the emulator with 64MB |
| 07:30.21 | gambler | Fnord^-, its a java crypto provider |
| 07:30.51 | BHSPitMonkey | Well, thanks for the answers. Night! |
| 07:30.54 | Fnord^- | gambler, oh. this is linking to /system/lib/lib(crypto|ssl).so and is an ansi c program |
| 07:30.56 | gambler | Fnord^-, its included in the source distribution but its a cut down version I believe and its been hidden from the public APIs |
| 07:30.57 | spikebike | if the g1 can handle 6 ish processes going changing that to 1-2 and avoiding the biggest ones should help alot |
| 07:31.20 | Fnord^- | gambler, trying to use bionic and the native openssl for openvpn. looks like that's not feasable |
| 07:32.11 | gambler | Fnord^-, there is indeed a wrapper around openssl that works but you need BC to handle dealing with KeyStores and TrustStores |
| 07:33.11 | BHSPitMonkey | spikebike, my phone has no wifi/gps, and I don't use data apps in particular. For my needs, I may be able to get it chugging along it sounds like. |
| 07:33.11 | Fnord^- | gambler, so I can link a native app against this and it's compatible with openssl functions? |
| 07:33.30 | Fnord^- | wouldn't think I could with a java lib |
| 07:33.54 | gambler | Fnord^-, oh. your program? ...well android doesnt support C code officially. |
| 07:34.18 | Fnord^- | gambler, this is openvpn. no way will it run in dalvik |
| 07:34.31 | Fnord^- | rebuilds openssl and statically links. twitch. |
| 07:34.53 | gambler | ah ok. I thought you were just trying to use the java ssl support |
| 07:35.34 | Fnord^- | neh |
| 07:35.47 | Fnord^- | This is root level tinkery |
| 07:37.57 | *** join/#android Kongtender (n=ckong@mail.tradeshiponline.com.my) |
| 07:38.10 | *** part/#android Kongtender (n=ckong@mail.tradeshiponline.com.my) |
| 07:38.22 | gambler | Fnord^-, your working on OpenVPN client - is that to use the phone as a modem? |
| 07:39.21 | Fnord^- | gambler, to route all traffic securely through one's server |
| 07:39.57 | Fnord^- | I imagine it could be useful in tethering, if you're paranoid |
| 07:40.14 | Fnord^- | It's pretty much point to point IP over UDP |
| 07:41.23 | gambler | yep I was just wondering what your usecase was |
| 07:41.42 | Fnord^- | is paranoid :> |
| 07:42.02 | Fnord^- | Not that g1 is really secure but eh |
| 07:42.06 | Fnord^- | It's also neat |
| 07:42.52 | gambler | yeah well. whatever traffic leaves your serves endpoint ... |
| 07:42.59 | jasta | i wouldnt think paranoid people would even use cell phones |
| 07:43.11 | gambler | hes a progressive paranoid |
| 07:43.17 | gambler | the ICBM will go to his server room instead |
| 07:43.18 | Fnord^- | :P |
| 07:43.34 | gambler | :p |
| 07:43.51 | jasta | sigh cant skleep |
| 07:44.00 | jasta | curses android |
| 07:44.41 | Leeds | Android is keeping you awake? |
| 07:48.49 | Foxdie | he has nightmares |
| 07:49.00 | Foxdie | about how there won't be anymore RC patches :) |
| 07:49.18 | Leeds | heh |
| 07:50.43 | zhobbs | remembers having dreams about Android code during ADC crunch time |
| 07:56.35 | *** join/#android spackest1 (n=judi@c-76-23-34-252.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 08:00.00 | *** join/#android nebi (n=nebi@c-ac8fe253.02-145-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 08:02.42 | jasta | night folks |
| 08:02.52 | Leeds | afternoon |
| 08:02.59 | *** part/#android spackest1 (n=judi@c-76-23-34-252.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
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| 08:20.53 | *** join/#android zezu (n=zezu@c-24-14-8-40.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 08:22.31 | zezu | are there any / many accelerated drivers for 3d chipsets for android? specifically looking for newer PowerVR drivers |
| 08:25.42 | *** join/#android rubik_ (n=rubik@cpe-76-167-55-89.socal.res.rr.com) |
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| 08:44.43 | *** join/#android __avatar (n=avatar@cpe-76-88-201-161.bak.res.rr.com) |
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| 08:49.04 | *** join/#android Gary|tp (n=gary@c-66-41-234-235.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 08:49.12 | rem1x | test |
| 08:50.21 | spikebike | tset |
| 08:51.42 | *** join/#android dasilvj (n=dasilvj@163.5.255.61) |
| 08:52.45 | *** join/#android pjv (n=pjv@91.178.165.66) |
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| 09:03.07 | Fnord^- | http://g1.fnord.to/crypto/ |
| 09:03.08 | Fnord^- | :P |
| 09:05.07 | rem1x | init |
| 09:05.25 | *** join/#android cutmasta (n=cutmasta@62.225.134.181) |
| 09:13.57 | *** join/#android P1ro (n=Piro@gentoo/user/p1ro) |
| 09:14.05 | P1ro | o_O |
| 09:14.07 | P1ro | hi |
| 09:14.12 | *** join/#android Smoke777Screen (n=Smoke@dsl-245-248-143.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 09:19.55 | *** join/#android skbohra1 (n=best@117.199.119.36) |
| 09:22.28 | P1ro | anyone around ? |
| 09:23.08 | *** join/#android cmonex (n=xy6091@bg6qbbr4pc.adsl.datanet.hu) |
| 09:23.12 | *** join/#android kid (n=xuan@58.187.117.91) |
| 09:23.15 | Leeds | P1ro: no |
| 09:23.23 | P1ro | muahahhaa |
| 09:24.06 | *** join/#android Smoke777Screen (n=Smoke@dsl-245-248-143.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 09:24.10 | P1ro | anyone here own a G1 ? |
| 09:24.19 | Leeds | lots of people |
| 09:24.28 | kid | but not me |
| 09:24.31 | P1ro | have lots of question about it |
| 09:24.55 | P1ro | how many space it have ? |
| 09:25.31 | P1ro | im reading on gsmarena it have just 192 MB RAM, 256 MB ROM |
| 09:25.38 | P1ro | but that its kinda low |
| 09:25.53 | Adamant | 192mb RAM is more than the iTouch IIRC |
| 09:26.21 | Leeds | and a microSDHC slot |
| 09:26.41 | P1ro | microSDHC tested? |
| 09:26.42 | P1ro | nice |
| 09:27.13 | Leeds | I believe there are reports of 16GB cards working |
| 09:27.40 | P1ro | i cant find any 16G |
| 09:27.46 | P1ro | on newegg right now |
| 09:28.11 | kid | they sell g1 phone cost $800 in my local |
| 09:28.31 | kid | what about ur local? |
| 09:29.36 | spikebike | where are you kid? |
| 09:29.39 | spikebike | $400 ish here |
| 09:29.53 | kid | vietnam |
| 09:30.01 | spikebike | 8GB cards are cheap and work fine |
| 09:30.03 | spikebike | $30 USA |
| 09:30.10 | kid | wow |
| 09:30.13 | spikebike | I've not tried a 16, those are much more expensive/rare |
| 09:32.53 | *** join/#android Smoke777Screen (n=Smoke@dsl-245-248-143.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 09:36.09 | P1ro | 8G should be the best option |
| 09:36.52 | kid | 8G come with g1 phone as default ? |
| 09:38.10 | languish | G1 comes with 1 or 2 gig microsd card, depending on if it's USA or .uk G1 |
| 09:39.05 | d0nets | anyone have the svn link to jasta's five-alpha? |
| 09:39.13 | languish | it can support up to 16GB microSDHC currently (and possibly greater when they hit the market) |
| 09:39.46 | kid | languish: thanks |
| 09:41.03 | *** join/#android bodhian (n=bodhi@89.121.200.106) |
| 09:41.53 | kid | why do you like android ? (why not iphone) ? lol |
| 09:42.06 | languish | physical keyboard |
| 09:42.18 | languish | n the G1 |
| 09:42.32 | d0nets | plus its more open |
| 09:42.59 | languish | 'eh |
| 09:43.21 | spikebike | MMS, Multitasking, unrestricted apps |
| 09:43.25 | P1ro | spikebike where you found the G1 on 400$ |
| 09:43.26 | kid | opensource |
| 09:43.37 | spikebike | piro tmo stores |
| 09:43.45 | P1ro | o_O |
| 09:43.55 | P1ro | and if i wanna buy it without plan ? |
| 09:43.56 | d0nets | i saw a seller sell 5 g1's within 4 days for 550+ shipping |
| 09:43.59 | d0nets | unlocked though |
| 09:44.03 | spikebike | $400 |
| 09:44.08 | spikebike | $180 with |
| 09:44.09 | languish | $400 is the no plan price |
| 09:44.33 | P1ro | wonder if turbo sim will work for G1 |
| 09:45.09 | spikebike | dunno |
| 09:45.13 | Leeds | it does |
| 09:45.17 | spikebike | tmo gives unlock for free after 3 months |
| 09:45.17 | P1ro | since i wanna buy it but its not avaliable on my country |
| 09:45.22 | Leeds | or at least, they're being sold in HK with turbosim |
| 09:45.24 | spikebike | $23 buys an instant unlock |
| 09:45.38 | P1ro | to t-mobile ? |
| 09:45.56 | Leeds | spikebike: are they actually *available* for $399? |
| 09:45.58 | P1ro | or anyother people ? |
| 09:46.03 | spikebike | leeds ya |
| 09:46.17 | spikebike | usually requires some searching/arm twisting |
| 09:46.26 | spikebike | they prefer to sell on contract of coruse |
| 09:46.28 | Leeds | the impression I'd got was that they said it would be, but they hadn't got around to it |
| 09:46.49 | Leeds | anyway, that's still a locked phone, I assume |
| 09:46.59 | spikebike | ya, thus the $23 |
| 09:47.46 | Leeds | so why aren't they flooding the world for $450? |
| 09:49.03 | spikebike | because supply is contrained |
| 09:49.13 | spikebike | and it's a pain in the ass to get one |
| 09:49.23 | spikebike | so folks want at least another $100-$200 |
| 09:49.37 | spikebike | after all they are fronting $400 |
| 09:49.43 | *** join/#android mokolade (n=mokolade@85.221.112.173) |
| 09:49.51 | spikebike | I suspect supply will catch up in the next month or two |
| 09:50.34 | Leeds | ah, the cost of being an early adopter :-() |
| 09:50.38 | Leeds | :-( |
| 09:51.26 | spikebike | heh, was cheap to me |
| 09:51.37 | spikebike | $140 ish |
| 09:52.13 | *** join/#android synfault0 (n=synfault@ip68-3-201-53.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 09:52.13 | Leeds | on contract though? |
| 09:52.20 | spikebike | ya |
| 09:52.27 | Leeds | how much is the contract? |
| 09:52.54 | spikebike | I've yet to get the first bill |
| 09:53.03 | spikebike | $109 list for 2 lines, 2 data plans |
| 09:53.08 | spikebike | and er 700 minutes |
| 09:53.14 | spikebike | free nights, weekends, and m2m |
| 09:53.17 | Leeds | so say $55 each |
| 09:53.30 | spikebike | this a discount takes 18% of that or somessuch |
| 09:54.37 | Leeds | works out almost *exactly* the same over the next year |
| 09:54.51 | Leeds | my monthly is more like US$20 |
| 09:55.05 | spikebike | for just voice? |
| 09:55.08 | spikebike | or voice and data? |
| 09:55.33 | Leeds | voice and EDGE/wifi |
| 09:55.43 | Leeds | not 3G |
| 09:55.45 | spikebike | nice, that's hard to beat |
| 09:55.50 | spikebike | with who? |
| 09:55.58 | Leeds | Peoples |
| 09:56.14 | spikebike | heh, well I "have" 3g, but don't receive 3g |
| 09:56.35 | Leeds | http://www.peoples.com.hk/p_tariff_tariff_data_iso.jsp |
| 09:57.21 | *** part/#android kid (n=xuan@58.187.117.91) |
| 09:58.17 | *** join/#android gambler_ (n=gambler@203-206-248-89.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 09:58.52 | Leeds | I could get a similar package on 3G, with 60MB of data thrown in, then usage charges capped around US$50 total |
| 09:59.13 | spikebike | g1 3g is not compatible with any other 3g afaik |
| 09:59.21 | spikebike | it's usa specific |
| 09:59.32 | spikebike | even in the use, it's tmo only. |
| 09:59.35 | spikebike | usa |
| 09:59.41 | Leeds | so the ones being sold in the UK are a different model? |
| 10:00.02 | spikebike | that I don't know |
| 10:00.04 | tric | hmm, isnt the us t-mo 3g the same as used by all in .eu? |
| 10:00.29 | spikebike | the usa is a strange one |
| 10:00.34 | tric | so its t-mo specific in the us |
| 10:00.42 | spikebike | ya, maybe that's it |
| 10:01.01 | Leeds | so in fact it's compatible with *every* other 3G, apart from AT&T? :-) |
| 10:01.26 | tauno | spikebike, the UK model works with any operator in Europe (I mean 3G) (and I don't know for sure for Germany.. since they are a little weird there) |
| 10:01.28 | tric | its compatible with every other 3g *outside* of the us, _afaik_ |
| 10:01.48 | tric | tauno: thats wird in germany? |
| 10:01.52 | Leeds | I happen to have a 3G SIM here, which may or may not be active... let's try it |
| 10:01.52 | tric | thats=whats? |
| 10:02.05 | tric | send me a g1 and ill test it ;) |
| 10:02.19 | P1ro | si the 3G will not work on my network (movistar) 3G ? |
| 10:02.34 | P1ro | its same 3G as iphone right ? |
| 10:02.49 | spikebike | iphone 3g != g1 3g |
| 10:02.51 | spikebike | at least in the usa |
| 10:03.30 | P1ro | then should be the same on thers places |
| 10:04.07 | Leeds | let's see what this SIM does then |
| 10:04.08 | tauno | tric, aren't they using some kind of strange cdma netowrk there? :) |
| 10:06.24 | DarkriftX | gn all |
| 10:06.26 | DarkriftX | bed time for me |
| 10:07.25 | P1ro | what is the faster microSDHC around ? and what class stand for microsd? |
| 10:07.38 | spikebike | type 6 |
| 10:08.13 | P1ro | then class/type its about the speed |
| 10:08.38 | P1ro | lol no kinston class 6 microSDHC 8G :s |
| 10:08.54 | languish | type 8 is the fastest currently available for any sane pricing |
| 10:08.56 | spikebike | g1 does well, i can irc and walk B-) |
| 10:09.07 | Leeds | seems not to be booting very much with this (possibly-inactive) 3G SIM |
| 10:09.09 | languish | *class 8 |
| 10:09.39 | languish | but class 6 is just fine. on a g1 you're not going to see any difference that matters so greatly |
| 10:09.55 | spikebike | 6 was the fastest reanonably priced i found |
| 10:10.04 | Leeds | 6 and 4 are the common ones |
| 10:10.57 | spikebike | brrr,kinda cool |
| 10:11.02 | spikebike | out |
| 10:11.38 | *** join/#android oavdeev (n=oavdeev@79.120.41.39) |
| 10:12.36 | tric | tauno: dunno |
| 10:13.40 | *** join/#android gambler__ (n=gambler@203-214-37-239.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 10:13.49 | *** join/#android shackan (n=frob@host186-151-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:18.01 | Leeds | argh, not booting! |
| 10:18.25 | *** join/#android Gary|tp (n=gary@c-66-41-234-235.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 10:21.52 | Leeds | veyr argh! |
| 10:22.38 | Leeds | why the fuck won't my phone boot? |
| 10:23.54 | P1ro | the G1 have opengl ? |
| 10:24.09 | spikebike | outya |
| 10:24.15 | spikebike | ya es |
| 10:24.36 | kIDDAI | cg 4 bricking :) |
| 10:24.50 | P1ro | nice |
| 10:25.05 | P1ro | 1.0? 2.0? |
| 10:25.55 | spikebike | 6dunno, gooogle is your friend |
| 10:26.03 | P1ro | hahaha |
| 10:26.24 | P1ro | btw its there any other phone coming soon with android ? |
| 10:26.58 | spikebike | open.oko and some strange .auphone |
| 10:27.00 | *** join/#android Smoke_Screen (n=Smoke@dsl-245-248-143.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 10:27.25 | neerhaj | and some chinese phones |
| 10:27.41 | P1ro | so the G1 its best option for android |
| 10:28.00 | spikebike | yup, for now |
| 10:28.08 | P1ro | i dont know why if there are others better HTC phones thet choose G1 :s |
| 10:28.31 | P1ro | wonder if they gonna name other G2 |
| 10:28.32 | P1ro | lol |
| 10:28.59 | spikebike | well the touch HD has a nicer screen, more pixels, more ram, but worse touchscreen |
| 10:29.05 | spikebike | but no android 8-( |
| 10:29.09 | P1ro | yeah |
| 10:29.33 | P1ro | i have a wizzard and touch screen SUCKS |
| 10:29.46 | Leeds | is getting a little scared |
| 10:30.00 | P1ro | the G1 have same touch screen as iphone ? |
| 10:30.10 | spikebike | same tech |
| 10:30.24 | P1ro | the touchscreen of iphone its the best i have see |
| 10:30.33 | P1ro | nice |
| 10:32.09 | Fnord^- | I'd like something bigger. Bigger keyboard, bigger battery |
| 10:32.17 | Leeds | seriously now folks... I got me something like a brick |
| 10:32.23 | P1ro | no shit |
| 10:32.27 | P1ro | bigger sucks |
| 10:32.31 | Fnord^- | Leeds, what did you do? |
| 10:32.40 | spikebike | fnord I hear ya |
| 10:32.46 | spikebike | and agree |
| 10:32.48 | spikebike | even just 10% |
| 10:32.58 | P1ro | thats one of the good stuuf of the iphone its too small |
| 10:32.59 | Leeds | shutdown |
| 10:33.01 | spikebike | not that I'd mind 25% |
| 10:33.13 | P1ro | stuff* |
| 10:33.34 | spikebike | n800 size would be nice, ideally with a display that's somewhat bigger in the same physical size as the n800 |
| 10:33.35 | Fnord^- | Leeds, shut down the phone, or 'shutdown' as root? |
| 10:33.41 | Leeds | Fnord^-: shutdown the phone |
| 10:33.51 | spikebike | might actually fit from the ear and the mouth on a normal human head |
| 10:34.00 | Fnord^- | What happens when you try to start it up? |
| 10:34.11 | Leeds | I can get into the bootloader with power+camera, otherwise all I get is the big G1 logo |
| 10:34.26 | Fnord^- | Then it just sits there, or turns off? |
| 10:34.36 | spikebike | ugh, leeds what happened? |
| 10:34.56 | Leeds | just sits there |
| 10:35.00 | Leeds | spikebike: no idea |
| 10:35.08 | spikebike | just spontaneously? |
| 10:35.13 | spikebike | did you have root? |
| 10:35.13 | Leeds | pretty much |
| 10:35.14 | Fnord^- | adb work? |
| 10:35.18 | neerhaj | Leeds: tried the recovery mode ? |
| 10:35.27 | Leeds | I did have root, can't get to recovery mode, haven't tried adb |
| 10:35.42 | Leeds | but it doesn't appear to be getting far enough up to appear on the USB |
| 10:35.50 | Leeds | need a console :-( |
| 10:35.53 | spikebike | it never appears on usb |
| 10:36.14 | spikebike | sounds like you could do an update.zip from the bootloader |
| 10:36.18 | neerhaj | was the battery low ? |
| 10:36.29 | spikebike | oh is that only from recovery mode? |
| 10:36.31 | Leeds | neerhaj: not particularly |
| 10:36.34 | Leeds | spikebike: I think so |
| 10:36.35 | Fnord^- | update.zip needs recovery not bootloader |
| 10:36.42 | P1ro | well thank you guys alot! :D i will idle here ! and i hope i dont change y mind on buying a G1 :D i just love teh open source os :D |
| 10:37.00 | spikebike | yeah I'd fully charge it |
| 10:37.16 | Fnord^- | regardless it should boot if it's getting power via usb |
| 10:37.19 | spikebike | leeds where are you physically? |
| 10:37.21 | Leeds | the battery wasn't particularly low - above 50% at least, I think |
| 10:37.25 | Leeds | spikebike: Hong Kong |
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| 10:37.41 | spikebike | ah, I wonder if a bad sd card would do that |
| 10:37.49 | spikebike | factory card? |
| 10:37.59 | Leeds | let me take my card out |
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| 10:38.52 | spikebike | have you dropped it lately? |
| 10:38.56 | Leeds | nope |
| 10:39.14 | spikebike | ugh, best of luck, I need sleep |
| 10:39.28 | Leeds | so do I :-( |
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| 10:56.48 | kRutOn | Leeds: were you hacking on it or something? |
| 10:57.05 | Leeds | no |
| 10:57.07 | kRutOn | Leeds: or did you let those folks at Golden Computer City 'borrow' it? :-) |
| 10:57.21 | P1ro | ok back |
| 10:57.33 | Leeds | I was taking it down to try a different SIM, but I think it happened when it went down, rather than when it came back up with the wrong SIM |
| 10:57.42 | P1ro | btw, anyone know wich wireless chipset G1 have ? |
| 10:58.05 | Leeds | really not happy |
| 10:58.21 | Leeds | and it's from Mongkok, not SSP, thank you very much |
| 10:58.57 | languish | leeds |
| 10:59.11 | Leeds | I could try the real emergency factory reset at http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Boot_Modifiers but I'd prefer not to lose everything |
| 10:59.22 | Leeds | languish: ? |
| 10:59.37 | languish | something similar happened to me. I pulled the battery. then put it back in. then without turning it on, chraged it up full with the wall outlet charger |
| 10:59.42 | languish | then turned ti on |
| 10:59.45 | cmonex | <spikebike> n800 size would be nice --->no no, go for n810 size :) |
| 10:59.47 | languish | it just worked after that |
| 10:59.50 | Leeds | was it sticking at the G1 logo? |
| 10:59.54 | languish | yes |
| 11:00.05 | Leeds | hmm, I guess I'll try it, thanks |
| 11:00.09 | languish | good luck |
| 11:00.15 | Leeds | pity I've got to go out in a couple of minutes |
| 11:00.22 | cmonex | Leeds: i guess the radio image is what doesnt boot up |
| 11:00.26 | Leeds | thanks |
| 11:00.27 | cmonex | well maybe that battery trick fixes it! |
| 11:00.46 | neekers | leeds: what time is it where you are? |
| 11:00.47 | languish | hopefully :/ |
| 11:01.01 | neekers | hi languish |
| 11:01.04 | Leeds | neekers: 7pm |
| 11:01.07 | languish | heya neekers |
| 11:01.09 | languish | how goes |
| 11:01.54 | neekers | pretty cool, still digging my ditch out to my barn and loving it way more than coding at my box |
| 11:02.01 | languish | :) |
| 11:03.38 | neekers | leeds: hong kong? |
| 11:05.39 | Leeds | yup |
| 11:06.21 | neekers | nice place, i like staying at the ymca on kowloon |
| 11:07.10 | Leeds | never stayed there |
| 11:07.20 | Leeds | got to go, will report back status of phone in a couple of hours |
| 11:08.22 | neekers | take care |
| 11:09.05 | neekers | i'm listening to "play that funky nusic white boy"... do i need a life? |
| 11:09.09 | neekers | musinc even |
| 11:09.21 | neekers | crap... |
| 11:10.18 | neekers | time for a little rush |
| 11:10.28 | neekers | spirit of radio |
| 11:11.21 | neekers | i should get back on topic, but at 3 in the morning, i'm not highly motivated |
| 11:14.17 | Fnord^- | http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1890303 |
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| 11:18.37 | neekers | ok, that was wierd |
| 11:19.39 | neekers | weird.... sorry languish, i blew it on the i before e rule again... :o) |
| 11:20.00 | languish | o.O |
| 11:20.51 | neekers | do you know young lust by pink floyd? |
| 11:20.52 | languish | the spelling of my nick may indicated my great concern, or lack thereof, for such things :| |
| 11:21.01 | languish | *indicate |
| 11:21.40 | languish | yeah |
| 11:21.43 | Smoke_Screen | Hi everyone |
| 11:21.54 | neekers | i don't know you well. but i have wondered what you are languishing about |
| 11:24.07 | Smoke_Screen | Was wondering if some knows how Android handles networking with ports |
| 11:24.07 | Smoke_Screen | I see you can port forward from the host machine to the emulator but is that necessary if the port you want to use is available on te host machine and not blocked? |
| 11:24.07 | Smoke_Screen | ie the port I create a connction with on the emulator is accessed externally via the internet by that same port number? |
| 11:24.13 | neekers | do you ever get tired of your own music collection? |
| 11:25.07 | languish | neekers, the nick is a double entendre in a way, or a homonym if you prefer. perhaps the meaning you take it for is the lack of bluetooth? |
| 11:25.08 | languish | :P |
| 11:25.23 | tric | smoke_screen: its qemu, you can access it by its ip 10.0.2.15 with the correct startup params |
| 11:26.04 | tric | smoke_screen: so there is no need for crazy port forwarding and stuff |
| 11:26.06 | neekers | do you lack bluetooth? |
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| 11:26.31 | *** join/#android ExpiredPopsicle (n=mal@c-98-234-62-40.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 11:26.45 | languish | well lack of a2dp, among other things. not bluetooth overall |
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| 11:26.50 | languish | bit tired :) |
| 11:27.31 | neekers | me too |
| 11:28.12 | neekers | i'll have to show you pictures of the "big dig", the sewer pipe back to the barn |
| 11:29.01 | languish | heh |
| 11:29.24 | neekers | tonight was a big night, after 3 weeks of digging i finally completed hooking up the sewer pump, will the excitement never end... |
| 11:29.31 | languish | so teh livestock will have 'el sanito facilitores? |
| 11:29.34 | languish | :P |
| 11:29.56 | neekers | i'm going to move into the barn and rent out my house |
| 11:30.07 | languish | o.O |
| 11:30.55 | languish | call it a "loft" |
| 11:31.00 | languish | it may be a hayloft |
| 11:31.06 | languish | but who's gonna tell... |
| 11:32.17 | neekers | it's a very nice loft... :o) |
| 11:32.29 | languish | :) |
| 11:32.50 | languish | just fon't start wearing red and blue and asking people to call you "clark" |
| 11:32.54 | languish | *don't |
| 11:33.00 | languish | :| |
| 11:33.48 | neekers | i stopped believing i was superman was i was young... it was a rude awakening to find out i wasn't |
| 11:34.35 | languish | at least you weren't concerned with finding out you weren't wonder woman either |
| 11:34.39 | languish | :) |
| 11:34.48 | neekers | heheh |
| 11:34.54 | neekers | that is a good thing.... |
| 11:34.58 | languish | hah |
| 11:35.40 | languish | I'm such a cityboy, I can't relate to digging a ditch to run a sewer line to the barn |
| 11:35.43 | languish | *sigh* |
| 11:36.58 | languish | then again, crickets drive me nuts too |
| 11:37.02 | neekers | i used to be, living in l.a. for 17 years, but living on a septic is cool, it's quiet and i like that |
| 11:37.13 | languish | nod |
| 11:37.29 | languish | i need the sound of traffic in the distance, or outside:| |
| 11:37.44 | languish | those are my "sounds of nature" |
| 11:37.55 | languish | damned electric cars'll ruin my sleep |
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| 11:40.08 | neekers | i guess being able to hear things is ok, to keep quiet the noise in the head |
| 11:40.10 | neekers | :o) |
| 11:40.40 | languish | :) ya it's my music |
| 11:41.11 | languish | gonna go get my 2hrs shuteye |
| 11:41.14 | P1ro | btw, anyone know wich wireless chipset the G1 have ? |
| 11:41.44 | neekers | later |
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| 12:12.04 | gambler__ | can I: layout.addView(TableLayout) retrieved with findViewById ? I get NPE |
| 12:14.20 | gambler__ | same with addView(View.inflate(context,R.layout.foo,this)); |
| 12:16.32 | *** join/#android bmandrin (n=bmandrin@134.214.238.142) |
| 12:21.46 | Leeds | well, that was a lot quicker than I expected, but the phone seems to still be dead :-( |
| 12:23.08 | languish | :( |
| 12:23.11 | Leeds | of course, if there was a way to backup the device... eh, I probably wouldn't be using it |
| 12:23.41 | Leeds | let's try leaving it without power for a while... never know |
| 12:24.34 | Disconnect | you can back it up with root. |
| 12:26.23 | *** join/#android ALoGeNo (n=QUAKEIII@120.Red-79-156-83.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 12:31.48 | Leeds | I shall leave it battery-less while I watch Heroes, then see what happens |
| 12:34.01 | *** join/#android mpagano (n=mpagano@gentoo/developer/mpagano) |
| 12:35.26 | filosofico | hi ... there is a way to access android.os.ServiceManager within an application? ... thanks |
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| 13:22.21 | tauno | whoopsie - : ERROR/dalvikvm-heap(1335): Out of memory on a 195521645-byte allocation. |
| 13:22.25 | bert0 | When does the next version of the sdk come out? |
| 13:22.43 | bert0 | good morning by the way |
| 13:22.55 | languish | when it finds a belt to go with those pumps |
| 13:22.56 | languish | :| |
| 13:23.21 | bert0 | erm... ok |
| 13:23.34 | jbq | bert0: the fewer dates we announce in advance, the less likely we are to slip. |
| 13:23.46 | bert0 | I can appreciate that |
| 13:24.37 | tauno | ..so I guess i won't be able to allocate >160MB just for fun.. |
| 13:24.58 | tauno | (; |
| 13:25.24 | jbq | tauno: correct ;-) |
| 13:26.35 | jbq | bert0: non-commitments aside, there's some work going on to help release future SDKs (e.g. refining the tools that help us maintain application compatibility). |
| 13:28.24 | bert0 | can you name some of the tools in specific that you all are innovating? non-commitments aside of course |
| 13:28.58 | jbq | the two tools I have in mind right now are droiddoc and apicheck. |
| 13:29.17 | bert0 | I love the OS by the way and I'm having a blast learning java in order to make my own apps |
| 13:29.33 | languish | also, as it's been stated you won't break binary compatibility, then.. what could break with the future sdk's and G1 uodates? |
| 13:29.51 | languish | *updates |
| 13:29.56 | jbq | Hopefully, nothing ;-) |
| 13:30.00 | languish | heh |
| 13:30.20 | Disconnect | jbq: is any of the history/discussion that lead to the security policy online anywhere? (selinux vs user/group, limitations, etc) |
| 13:30.29 | languish | keeps his fingers crossed |
| 13:31.13 | jbq | Disconnect: probably not - a lot of that happened behind my time, and I assume that things happened as hallway discussions and weren't necessarily recorded. |
| 13:32.27 | jbq | languish: seriously, there could be some unwanted API changes (e.g. changes in intents that get sent/received, or changing in content provider schemas) that are actually hard to track. |
| 13:32.47 | languish | nod |
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| 13:33.35 | languish | I'm actually hoping for certain changes that would likely break a few existing apps |
| 13:33.45 | languish | but would be better for all |
| 13:33.54 | languish | + here on in |
| 13:33.54 | jbq | languish: there could also be some subtle changes in the way some APIs work, which could break things (e.g. in the threading model of certain things changes) |
| 13:34.17 | *** part/#android cnoolon (n=cnoolon@61.153.148.197) |
| 13:34.30 | Disconnect | would love to see temporary/partial security permissions. (.."I love app foowiki but wtf does it keep sending my location to their server?") |
| 13:34.31 | jbq | very obviously, there could be all the cases where apps use unsupported APIs. |
| 13:34.45 | languish | I mean, I hope the changes don't break things, but personally I'd be ok with it if the functionality were what I hope for |
| 13:35.06 | languish | so long as the "next big update" were the last time it happened |
| 13:35.19 | languish | (in any significant sense) |
| 13:35.38 | jbq | finally, there could be cases where apps have bugs (i.e. make wrong assumptions) and break when those assumptions become inaccurate. |
| 13:35.47 | jbq | languish: any specific issue you have in mind? |
| 13:36.23 | languish | jbq, nothing we haven't discussed before.. the rule based access and filtering of incomming sms's and such |
| 13:36.25 | Disconnect | ..multitouch :) |
| 13:36.44 | languish | nah, I'm not as hung up on multitouch as I pretend to be :) |
| 13:37.11 | languish | though, i could use a bit more accuracy with the touch functions |
| 13:37.12 | jbq | languish: I'm pretty sure that those can be refined or added without breaking compatibility. |
| 13:37.40 | *** join/#android mpardo (n=chatzill@75.144.91.181) |
| 13:37.41 | jbq | languish: the accuracy is not as much an API issue as a hardware (and possibly framework) issue. |
| 13:38.08 | languish | and finger functionality :) |
| 13:38.20 | bert0 | and copyright? |
| 13:38.34 | languish | I'm considering getting a capacitive friendly stylus, but.. no place om the G1 to store it |
| 13:38.37 | mpardo | what's this i'm reading about multitouch on gizmodo? |
| 13:38.50 | dsargeant | I'm having trouble figuring out how to enable/disable bluetooth programmatically. Anybody know how? |
| 13:38.56 | languish | mpardo ignore it. instead there |
| 13:39.05 | languish | 's a better link that's more definitive |
| 13:39.07 | languish | hang on |
| 13:39.14 | mpardo | ryeblog? |
| 13:39.21 | languish | yes |
| 13:39.25 | Disconnect | http://tinyurl.com/g1multi |
| 13:39.43 | languish | if it links to that, read his comments at the bottom |
| 13:39.48 | Disconnect | can't tell you what you are reading on gizmodo tho |
| 13:39.56 | languish | the "Update" |
| 13:40.20 | languish | Disconnect's tinyurl leads to what I was talking about |
| 13:40.32 | bert0 | mpardo do you have a link? |
| 13:40.35 | mpardo | yep |
| 13:41.42 | mpardo | bert0: wait to what? the giz article? there's nothing there really it just links to ryeblog |
| 13:43.26 | Disconnect | does anyone know of a pin-compatible identically-sized/resolution/etc ts unit that is only singletouch? thats kinda a big piece of "they might swap it out" (and looking at the synaptic website didn't turn one up, although a couple much smaller manufs do have single-touch capacitive screens in small sizes) |
| 13:43.44 | Disconnect | no exact-match sizes that i saw tho |
| 13:44.05 | filosofico | hi ... An intent launched with startActivityForResult could return an object of type "IBinder"? ... thanks |
| 13:44.44 | Leeds | left it powerless for more than an hour, will it boot? |
| 13:45.44 | Leeds | all signs point to 'no' :-( |
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| 13:47.27 | Disconnect | Leeds: did you try reflashing it from sd? |
| 13:47.34 | Leeds | jbq: any idea on a G1 which won't boot past the big G1 logo? |
| 13:47.41 | Leeds | Disconnect: no, I didn't try that |
| 13:47.41 | *** join/#android Smoke777Screen (n=Smoke@dsl-245-248-143.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 13:47.48 | Disconnect | (with either the stock rc30 or the modified, depending on which one you had on there before) |
| 13:47.55 | Leeds | that would require getting as far as recovery mode, right? |
| 13:47.59 | Disconnect | or rc28/29 if you weren't on 30 yet |
| 13:48.05 | jbq | Leeds: ow, that doesn't sound good. |
| 13:48.06 | Disconnect | yah but thats before the logos |
| 13:48.16 | Disconnect | er, before the robot anyway |
| 13:48.24 | Leeds | I'm not getting as far as the robot |
| 13:48.34 | jbq | Leeds: did you happen to have USB debugging enabled before that happened? |
| 13:48.41 | Leeds | I can get to the bootloader, or the 'blue light special' |
| 13:48.45 | Leeds | jbq: I believe so |
| 13:48.53 | *** join/#android cdarwin (n=toor@kirby.macluvjay.name) |
| 13:49.22 | Disconnect | if you got to the bootloader, you can reflash from sd |
| 13:49.25 | jbq | Leeds: if you could plug into USB and run "adb logcat" while that happens, that'd give us some information (or tell us that it dies so early that it doesn't even get there). |
| 13:49.46 | Leeds | jbq: I did try connecting with adb before, and it didn't seem to get that far |
| 13:49.49 | Leeds | Disconnect: how? |
| 13:50.33 | Disconnect | http://www.cellfanatic.com/2008/11/03/how-to-manually-update-your-g1-with-rc29 |
| 13:50.38 | jbq | Leeds: then I really don't know what that could be. Can you get into recovery? |
| 13:50.41 | Leeds | certainly adb devices wasn't reporting any connection |
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| 13:51.11 | Leeds | jbq: as above - doesn't seem to want to go into recovery... that's power+menu, right? |
| 13:51.31 | jbq | hole home while booting (menu is safe mode) |
| 13:51.38 | jbq | s/hole/hold/ |
| 13:51.40 | Leeds | ah, sorry, yes... |
| 13:51.41 | Disconnect | http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2847622&postcount=77 has pics |
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| 13:52.09 | Leeds | let's see if logcat does anything first |
| 13:52.12 | Leeds | Disconnect: thanks |
| 13:52.29 | Disconnect | but use the correct signature (if you had stock images, use another stock image.. if you had sd-modified images, use those. and if you weren't on rc30 and might want root, use rc29 :) ..) |
| 13:52.40 | Leeds | I was on modified r30 |
| 13:52.54 | Leeds | which is slightly worrying... |
| 13:54.37 | Disconnect | if it worked once it'll keep working :) but use that image to reflash cuz those are the keys that it'll have |
| 13:55.01 | *** join/#android mpagano (n=mpagano@gentoo/developer/mpagano) |
| 13:56.17 | Leeds | actually, the update.zip which I installed from should still be there... |
| 13:56.44 | *** join/#android plusminus_ (i=81020c44@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-3863b586447a0d11) |
| 13:57.38 | Leeds | hmm, oops :-) |
| 13:59.07 | Disconnect | ? |
| 13:59.34 | Leeds | the USB hub which I have my cable plugged into wasn't powered up... |
| 14:00.06 | Leeds | I was wondering why my phone was behaving as though it had power when plugged into the mains, but not when plugged into USB |
| 14:00.57 | Disconnect | ..so it wasn't charged? |
| 14:01.10 | Leeds | nah, I left it on the mains while I went out - it's well charged |
| 14:02.13 | Disconnect | ah ok |
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| 14:04.47 | Leeds | right, have (apparently) done reset... will it boot? |
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| 14:05.46 | Leeds | Disconnect: you know the difference between the bootloader and the recovery mode? |
| 14:06.30 | Disconnect | you were talking about safe mode i thought (menu button) |
| 14:06.46 | Leeds | no, I said I could get to the bootloader, but not recovery mode |
| 14:07.40 | Leeds | I cannot get past the big G1 logo |
| 14:08.17 | languish | leeds, have you removed the microsd card yet? |
| 14:08.27 | Leeds | I've just put it back in |
| 14:08.42 | Disconnect | even holding down home? cuz you also said you were holding menu |
| 14:08.59 | Leeds | Disconnect: and I corrected myself soon after |
| 14:09.24 | Disconnect | ok. i didn't read that as "i'm holding home" I read that as "oh yeah, thats the wrong mode" and i never saw that holding home didn't work. sorry. <shrug> |
| 14:09.51 | Leeds | fuck |
| 14:11.27 | Leeds | holding down home+menu while booting does get me to a bootloader screen which offers to do a factory reset... unfortunately it doesn't seem to make any difference |
| 14:12.33 | Disconnect | factory reset just wipes out your user data. prolly didn't want to do that :) try reflashing the update. |
| 14:13.05 | languish | reflash with a new download of the modded r30, so you have the correct keys |
| 14:13.32 | Leeds | reflash *how*? |
| 14:15.45 | Leeds | languish, Disconnect: reflash *how*? seriously, if I could, I would |
| 14:16.05 | languish | Leeds, when you turn off the g1, then hold down home on boot for 10/20 seconds.. what exactly happens on screen? It freezes at the G1 logo? |
| 14:16.21 | Disconnect | when i hold home+menu during boot i get the triangular warning bootloader. menu-l shows text, menu-s applies sdcard. |
| 14:16.25 | Leeds | nothing... just G1 logo |
| 14:16.48 | Leeds | I can't get to the bloody recovery mode, just the bloody bootloader! |
| 14:17.06 | *** join/#android skmidry (n=skmidry@59.92.153.131) |
| 14:17.13 | Leeds | sorry, appreciate the help, but getting quite unhappy with this situation |
| 14:17.14 | languish | hmm, leeds, go through the steps, as if it went in to recovery mode.. do it blindy. |
| 14:17.38 | languish | hold down home when it boots, keep home held down for say. 15 seconds |
| 14:17.52 | languish | then let go, and hit alt-l ..etc |
| 14:18.03 | languish | make sure the update is on the sdcard |
| 14:18.10 | Leeds | seems like a pretty long shot, but okay |
| 14:18.31 | *** join/#android tethridge (n=tale@nat/hp/x-e22461e88bbdccfd) |
| 14:18.32 | languish | go through the process, take your time for each step since you're doing it blindly |
| 14:18.46 | languish | yeah, it's just a shot in the dark |
| 14:18.49 | Leeds | the alt-l shouldn't be neede |
| 14:19.08 | languish | nod |
| 14:20.46 | languish | after it's supposed to be flashed, hold down home and the back buttons |
| 14:20.53 | languish | (sure you know that) |
| 14:21.06 | Leeds | didn't know that |
| 14:21.09 | languish | ah |
| 14:21.18 | Leeds | anyway, nothing |
| 14:21.25 | languish | :( |
| 14:21.52 | Disconnect | so power+camera works but nothing else does? or..? just trying to figure out where you are. |
| 14:22.25 | Leeds | power+camera works, power+ball works (makes the LED go blue), and power+back+home works, offers me a factory reset |
| 14:22.45 | Leeds | anything else never goes past the big G1 |
| 14:23.17 | languish | may be the restore image was currupt |
| 14:23.19 | *** join/#android Blice (n=blice@rrcs-71-40-143-174.se.biz.rr.com) |
| 14:23.36 | *** join/#android KNY (n=KNY@leonidas.kickersny.com) |
| 14:23.41 | Blice | join #n7c |
| 14:23.42 | Blice | .. |
| 14:23.45 | Leeds | maybe |
| 14:23.45 | languish | no. |
| 14:23.47 | Blice | Supposed to be a '/' |
| 14:23.48 | Blice | :/ |
| 14:24.38 | languish | oh. well in that case, no. |
| 14:24.41 | languish | :) |
| 14:24.46 | Blice | :> |
| 14:25.16 | languish | leeds, man.. you were in hong kong right? |
| 14:25.21 | Leeds | yes |
| 14:25.23 | languish | :( |
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| 14:25.45 | Leeds | :( |
| 14:27.06 | Leeds | this is really quite exceptionally not good |
| 14:27.14 | Disconnect | are you in a position to get it replaced by tmob? |
| 14:27.21 | Disconnect | "it went to flash rc30 and then died" |
| 14:27.39 | languish | leeds, source for it was in .uk? |
| 14:27.47 | Leeds | I don't think tmob do warranty cover for devices which have been exported and resold on the grey market |
| 14:27.49 | Leeds | no, US |
| 14:28.21 | Leeds | I guess about all I can do is take it back to the store where I got it... |
| 14:28.35 | Disconnect | yah thats prolly your only bet |
| 14:28.36 | languish | ah, you bought it yourself? |
| 14:28.37 | Leeds | which I *really* don't have time to do this week, and I'm going away for the weekend :-( |
| 14:28.45 | Leeds | who else would have bought it? |
| 14:28.48 | Disconnect | but don't run off yet |
| 14:28.55 | languish | you may have gotten it via ebay or whatnot |
| 14:29.06 | Leeds | Disconnect: I'm not going anywhere except bed soon... 10:30pm here and I'm exhausted |
| 14:29.34 | Leeds | it's a grey import - I don't know what route it took to get to me, but I do know it came unlocked, so it probably officially belongs to someone else |
| 14:29.52 | languish | ah so you didn't buy it directly, gotcha |
| 14:30.11 | Leeds | I bought it from 'a store' - I didn't buy it from t-mobile |
| 14:30.17 | languish | thought for a moment you had. my bad |
| 14:30.57 | languish | I was going to offer to have a chat with my local tmo store manager to do a swap for you |
| 14:31.03 | languish | but an unknown source.. not so sure about |
| 14:31.04 | Leeds | thanks, but that ain't gonna work :-) |
| 14:31.07 | languish | nod |
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| 14:31.18 | Leeds | Disconnect: did you have some idea? |
| 14:31.57 | *** part/#android skbohra (n=best@117.199.119.36) |
| 14:31.57 | Disconnect | i might - not mine tho, someone else. they have to decide. |
| 14:32.27 | Disconnect | just ooc what happened to start hte problem? |
| 14:32.28 | Leeds | ok, brb |
| 14:32.58 | Disconnect | (ok not ooc, but for real, what started this?) |
| 14:33.30 | tauno | a silly question - how do I get the cursor position in a EditText? |
| 14:33.38 | Disconnect | is relaying questions |
| 14:34.28 | *** join/#android orci (n=orci@24-177-53-93.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) |
| 14:35.07 | languish | Leeds, see if they have a depot in HK, perhaps they have a few dreams in stock for wtf knows why. http://www.htc.com/hk-en/about_htc.aspx?id=20148 |
| 14:35.21 | orci | hi, where is the gps unit located inside the t-mob g1? is there a proper way to hold it to facilitate gps find th elocation sooner? |
| 14:35.46 | languish | orci, you have to be in full view of the sky. |
| 14:35.52 | languish | and it can take some time.. |
| 14:36.06 | languish | it needs to lock on to 3-4 satellites |
| 14:36.34 | orci | languish, I am inside however I am in fornt of a huge window that does not mean the full view of sky I assume |
| 14:36.50 | languish | a window may be ok, it can still take time |
| 14:37.06 | orci | languish, and my house is by a lake :) |
| 14:37.12 | languish | let it sit there with the gps on and some app seeking location.. for about 15 minutes |
| 14:37.16 | languish | see if that help |
| 14:37.23 | languish | *helps |
| 14:37.31 | languish | beign outside is better |
| 14:37.35 | languish | *being |
| 14:37.39 | Disconnect | orci: if its still it can pick up pretty quick. make sure network assist is on also. |
| 14:37.49 | Disconnect | if its moving, even with network assist, it can be 15 mins or more. pretty terrible :( |
| 14:38.14 | Leeds | languish: I doubt it - it's not a 'dream', it's a 'T-Mobile G1'... in other words, t-mobile are the vendor, not HTC |
| 14:38.43 | languish | Leeds, I understand, but it doesn't hurt to ask. |
| 14:38.48 | kslater | It would be interesting to see an app that details what sats the GPS is locked onto |
| 14:39.03 | languish | i've had manufacturers do some really nice stuff for me in odd situations |
| 14:39.11 | kslater | My G1 seems to vary in its ability to lock onto gps |
| 14:39.17 | languish | orci, <morrildl> vol: So you have to 1) wait to get a signal lock on 4 different satellites, 2) wait for them each to broadcast their ephemeris data, 3) do the GPS calculation |
| 14:39.26 | Leeds | Disconnect: there was discussion about different 3G standards, and if a US G1 would work on 3G elsewhere... I normally use EDGE/GPRS, but I have a 3G SIM here which is probably inactive |
| 14:39.33 | kslater | sometimes really quick even in a fast moving car. sometimes really slow, standing outside. |
| 14:39.35 | languish | <morrildl> if it's cloudy or if you don't have line-of-sight to 4 satellites (e.g. in the mountains or in Manhattan) then 1) can take a long time just by itself. |
| 14:39.55 | languish | morrildl> Then if by dumb luck you tune in just after the start of the ephemeris sequence, you have to wait a whole cycle for it to start over again |
| 14:39.56 | Leeds | Disconnect: so I took the phone down to try the (probably inactive) 3G SIM, which didn't boot... put back my active 2G SIM, which didn't boot... |
| 14:40.11 | languish | i think he said that "cycle" took about 12.5 minutes |
| 14:40.12 | Leeds | Disconnect: but I think it's just co-incidence, to be honest |
| 14:40.23 | Disconnect | hmm. that shouldn't have affected anything. but i'd take it to the store and pitch a fit. |
| 14:41.21 | orci | I felt like the gps is a bit worse than the gps on iphone. I am not sure if the problem is the hardware or the software because google maps locator seem to work better |
| 14:41.22 | languish | and hope the store owner/rep isn't in here now. :) |
| 14:41.41 | Leeds | extremely unlikely... |
| 14:41.54 | Leeds | but I also really don't have time to go this week, which is a fucker |
| 14:42.14 | languish | well, try htc anyway, just fro the heck of it. worst they can say is no |
| 14:42.36 | languish | the link i gave you was their HK contact |
| 14:42.41 | Leeds | yeah, thanks |
| 14:42.44 | Disconnect | orci: my experience (comparing to when i had a 1st gen iphone) is that acquisition is similar to 1999 devices, but once it finds a hit if you can keep it up its pretty good. and it can get a hit - given time - in more adversarial positions than my coworker's 3g (farther from the window basically) |
| 14:43.05 | Leeds | what I'm really looking for is "how to flash your G1 from the bootloader" |
| 14:43.46 | languish | yeah, they don't wanna give us that one. hence my htc suggestion.. because it's their key in the bootloader |
| 14:44.22 | Leeds | yeah... |
| 14:44.44 | *** join/#android skbohra (n=best@117.199.119.36) |
| 14:44.46 | Leeds | my other emergency possibility is a passing acquaintance with a hardware-type droid |
| 14:45.02 | Leeds | except he isn't online at the moment |
| 14:45.15 | skbohra | does any body has a http://people.openmoko.org/sean_mcneil/androidfs.jffs2 |
| 14:45.19 | tauno | orci, does the iphone have aGPS? morrildl said yesterday that the g1 does not have aGPS but just plain ol' GPS.. |
| 14:45.21 | skbohra | copy of it |
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| 14:45.36 | skbohra | seems like they have removed it |
| 14:45.57 | languish | from what I gather, T-mobile has to enable it on the entwork side |
| 14:45.57 | skbohra | if anybody down-loaded it |
| 14:45.58 | orci | may it be different when an apllication abc finds the location or google maps finds the location? |
| 14:46.10 | Leeds | I thought there was no agps, but I could be wrong |
| 14:46.15 | tauno | orci, nope AFAIK |
| 14:46.17 | languish | aGPS isn't enabled on t-mobiles network yet |
| 14:46.19 | orci | tauno, yes ihone has an assist gps |
| 14:46.44 | tauno | languish, aGPS has nothing to do with the network that you use |
| 14:46.44 | orci | tauno, g1 also has an asst gps |
| 14:46.46 | Blice | Can I write apps in python for Android or does it have to be Java? |
| 14:47.01 | languish | tauno, yes, it seems it does |
| 14:47.14 | Leeds | Blice: just java, for now at least |
| 14:47.15 | tauno | orci, no g1 hasn't (if you believe morrildl :) ) |
| 14:47.22 | Blice | Aw :[ |
| 14:47.44 | orci | tauno, agps is what when you enable "use network to find location" thing I would say |
| 14:47.47 | Blice | I wonder if anyone's written a python interpreter in java... |
| 14:48.23 | orci | tauno, I am sure iphone has agps though |
| 14:48.38 | Leeds | no, that's not agps |
| 14:48.49 | Leeds | Blice: yes, it's called jython, and no, it doesn't fit dalvik very well |
| 14:49.03 | tauno | languish, aGPS means just that the phone asks for the ephemeris data from a central server - my nokia uses for example supl.nokia.com.. it has nothing to do with the network that you use :) |
| 14:49.36 | Leeds | I'm interested to see that the bootloader *is* attempting to load some image, because it says it can't find it... what that image might be and where it's looking, I have no idea |
| 14:49.56 | Leeds | tauno: I think it might also mean that the cells can provide extra information to the device |
| 14:50.23 | orci | how does the compas app work? does it need gps? |
| 14:50.28 | Disconnect | languish: it frequently finds me 8 or so miles from my house, on a giant tower by the highway. if thats not agps, what is it? |
| 14:50.51 | orci | by the way that bubble application is very cool |
| 14:51.20 | vol | Yeah |
| 14:51.22 | tauno | Leeds nope.. that's not the point of aGPS (yes, poeple confuse network assisted GPS with aGPS and these terms are interchanged frequently) |
| 14:51.26 | vol | the bubble app is what blows my mind absolutely |
| 14:51.31 | vol | my phone |
| 14:51.32 | vol | is a level |
| 14:51.35 | vol | mind blown. |
| 14:51.45 | KNY | it should smooth the data, but yeah |
| 14:51.47 | tauno | orci, no, compas does not use gps |
| 14:51.51 | Disconnect | vol: mine is wildly out of calibration. 5-10 degrees ('wildly' for a bubble level not wildly for a phone :) ..) |
| 14:51.54 | KNY | it jumps between 0 and 1 :) |
| 14:52.03 | orci | tauno, that is also mind blowing for me at least |
| 14:52.06 | vol | Disconnect: I haven't tried using it for anything important yet. |
| 14:52.08 | vol | Just to show it off. |
| 14:52.15 | vol | "Hay guys my phone has a bubble level!" |
| 14:52.17 | KNY | Disconnect, you can calibrate it... |
| 14:52.22 | orci | vol, I think mine needs some adjustments though |
| 14:52.27 | vol | orci: the compass uses a compass : ) |
| 14:52.53 | orci | vol, a digital compass? how would that work? |
| 14:53.09 | orci | I must be an old fart already at my age |
| 14:53.11 | Leeds | I thought there was a compass built-in? |
| 14:53.15 | KNY | there is |
| 14:53.16 | vol | orci: there's a built in compass |
| 14:53.23 | vol | it's... a compass. |
| 14:53.30 | languish | <Disconnect> languish: it frequently finds me 8 or so miles from my house, on a giant tower by the highway. if thats not agps, what is it? |
| 14:53.31 | KNY | 's mind is blown |
| 14:53.32 | vol | it works the same way as one you hold in your hand (I assume?) |
| 14:53.35 | languish | <tauno> Leeds nope.. that's not the point of aGPS (yes, poeple confuse network assisted GPS with aGPS and these terms are interchanged frequently) |
| 14:53.43 | languish | that's your answer |
| 14:53.50 | languish | also check the wikipedia artcile on agps |
| 14:53.55 | languish | *article |
| 14:54.00 | *** join/#android bmandrin (n=bmandrin@134.214.238.142) |
| 14:54.32 | vol | So, anyone who has done debugging with android, have you ever tried integrating with Eclipse CDT, or any other visual tools? Or do you just use gdb from the command line? |
| 14:55.17 | tauno | languish, that was to me? |
| 14:55.56 | tauno | languish, the wikipedia article on agps is wrong :) |
| 14:57.12 | Leeds | tauno: and your source is...? |
| 14:57.22 | tauno | (who the hell was it here who I had the exact same discussion two weeks ago?) |
| 14:57.30 | KNY | vol, the eclipse debugger works just fine |
| 14:57.48 | tauno | Leeds, gimme a sec |
| 14:58.06 | vol | KNY: for arm-eabi-gdb? I haven't tried it yet, wanted to know if someone else had first. If it works, that's very encouraging. |
| 14:58.34 | KNY | vol, oh, I thought you meant for application debugging. Nevermind :) |
| 14:58.38 | vol | ... yeah |
| 14:58.45 | vol | sorry, wasn't specific : ) |
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| 14:59.12 | vol | So, anyone who has done C library debugging with android, have you tried integrating arm-eabi-gdb with Eclipse CDT, or any other visual tools? Or do you all just use arm-eabi-gdb from the command line? |
| 14:59.56 | languish | GPS/aGPS convo: here's a pastebin of the log from the convo w/morrildl http://pastebin.com/d742fa880 |
| 15:00.11 | languish | he explains the G1's GPS capabilities somewhat |
| 15:00.45 | languish | tauno> languish, the wikipedia article on agps is wrong :) <- so fix it. |
| 15:02.42 | *** join/#android nevin (n=nannan_b@119.19.8.2) |
| 15:03.01 | tauno | languish, you don't happen to have logs for this channel going back a month or tow? |
| 15:03.24 | orci | so when there is a circle around my location, that does not mean that I was helped by agps mechanism, so what does it mean? |
| 15:03.54 | languish | tauno no |
| 15:04.02 | tauno | orci, that's cell ID based location |
| 15:04.03 | vol | orci: cell tower location |
| 15:04.09 | languish | tauno that convo was still in my buffer |
| 15:04.14 | languish | it was yesterday |
| 15:04.14 | vol | the dot in the center is the cell tower, and the shaded circle is where you COULD be |
| 15:04.23 | jbq | Actually, there's also a circle in GPS, but if you can see enough satellites it's very very very small. |
| 15:04.32 | vol | :o |
| 15:04.40 | vol | I've never actually seen that, but i don't think I zoomed in close enough either |
| 15:04.44 | tauno | languish, yes I know.. but there was a guy here (don't remmeber who) who I had the same chat that we currently have.. only he was me and I was you :P |
| 15:04.57 | languish | :) |
| 15:05.12 | orci | so what the hell is agps? :) |
| 15:05.33 | jbq | anyway, when you have a GPS-based location, the GPS icon in the notification bar stops flashing. |
| 15:05.43 | languish | tauno, another issue is.. how GPS or agps or tower ID or tower triangulation is or is not enabled and functionaing on the G1 itself, as compared to anything else |
| 15:06.06 | *** join/#android jexe (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 15:06.16 | tauno | orci the "correct" answer is that it's a "faster lock" GPS (eg downloading ephemeris data from netowrk and calculating your poistion faster thanks to that) :) |
| 15:06.21 | Leeds | okay, going to leave my G1 charging and turned off overnight, then all will be good in the morning... I believe, I BELIEVE! g'night all |
| 15:06.39 | orci | tauno, so it is fgps :) |
| 15:06.39 | languish | 'night leeds, g'luck |
| 15:06.42 | jbq | If you want it to be really off, take the battery out. |
| 15:07.02 | vol | wrap it in tin foil |
| 15:07.06 | languish | he's charging it up |
| 15:07.11 | languish | while off |
| 15:07.12 | Leeds | jbq: I'm not sure if I want it to be off or on! |
| 15:07.27 | tauno | orci, there are also 10+n other definitions of aGPS.. ranging from cell id base dlocation to cell ID + base station + operator servers + assistance servers + some voodo magi + GPS definitions |
| 15:07.29 | Leeds | oops, he left again |
| 15:08.28 | orci | did you guys ever notice/feel like that the gps is not turned on although settings claims to do so? |
| 15:08.35 | orci | sometimes of couse |
| 15:08.36 | tauno | languish, if you believe morrildl, then on the G1 you have GPS and you have cell ID based location (not triangulation) |
| 15:08.39 | *** join/#android jbq (n=jbq@nat/google/x-83b6b3a95f62b428) |
| 15:08.47 | languish | tauno, yep |
| 15:09.03 | languish | tauno, though it would be nice to get confirmation |
| 15:09.10 | orci | who is morrild? hald god? |
| 15:09.15 | orci | half |
| 15:09.16 | bert0 | What is the best place to buy laptop batteries? |
| 15:09.21 | languish | orci, he's a google dude |
| 15:09.22 | Leeds | jbq: if you have any idea of a period *off* or a period *charging* is more likely to revive my phone, please spill :-) |
| 15:09.25 | *** join/#android vbabiy (n=vbabiy@63.139.20.134) |
| 15:09.31 | orci | ah ok |
| 15:09.51 | vol | half man half bear half pig |
| 15:10.20 | Leeds | incidentally, a hald god would be someone who knew a *lot* about the hardware on a system... |
| 15:10.22 | Leeds | gone now |
| 15:10.51 | languish | heh |
| 15:10.54 | orci | my restaurant finder and gas station finder were showing me the same stupid location where once I had been then I rebooted the system and then they began showing me the right location |
| 15:11.17 | orci | before rebooting i tried turning the on gps to off then to on that did not help |
| 15:11.32 | orci | although it looked like in went off and on |
| 15:11.54 | languish | hopefully gps functionality will be part of the impovements coming up |
| 15:12.02 | languish | *improvements |
| 15:12.04 | orci | is it possible to calibrate accelerator or bubble application? |
| 15:12.15 | KNY | orci, yes. hit Menu |
| 15:12.21 | orci | languish, that is really good to hear |
| 15:12.29 | *** part/#android nevin (n=nannan_b@119.19.8.2) |
| 15:12.31 | languish | orci, i said hopefully |
| 15:12.32 | *** join/#android topeira (n=lucio@unaffiliated/topeira) |
| 15:13.04 | orci | languish, still somewhat good :) |
| 15:13.07 | languish | heh |
| 15:13.10 | orci | KNY, OK thanks |
| 15:13.23 | orci | KNY, did I calibrate accelerator or bubble app? |
| 15:13.43 | KNY | bubble app |
| 15:15.16 | KNY | does anyone know how to get rid of the Outline pane in eclipse? |
| 15:15.24 | KNY | I keep closing it but it keeps coming back |
| 15:15.30 | KNY | it's like herpes |
| 15:18.15 | orci | heh guys this pocket computer is the best toy I have got for a loong time since I got my LEGOs as a present |
| 15:20.00 | *** join/#android Terdhex (n=fes004@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 15:22.16 | tauno | [16:33] <tauno> a silly question - how do I get the cursor position in a EditText? |
| 15:22.52 | *** join/#android jexe (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
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| 15:23.58 | *** mode/#android [+o cbeust] by ChanServ |
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| 15:24.22 | unix_lappy | RyeBrye: you made gizmodo... ;-) |
| 15:25.19 | *** join/#android dglazkov (n=dglazkov@c-24-130-144-56.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 15:25.40 | tauno | come on.. it can't be that hard. someone has to know it? ;) |
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| 15:26.41 | KNY | tauno, you mean like, if it's on the second letter? |
| 15:26.45 | tauno | http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/d1f2296bbb2f09ad/2a30e40caf025ea4?show_docid=2a30e40caf025ea4 |
| 15:26.49 | tauno | KNY, yes |
| 15:28.15 | KNY | tauno, interesting. If you find out, let me know? |
| 15:29.05 | tauno | it like the most basic thing that you could to to an input box (eg set/get cursor position) other than setting and getting the actual text value of the input :) |
| 15:29.17 | *** join/#android KNY (n=KNY@leonidas.kickersny.com) |
| 15:29.46 | tauno | and I can't find it..I'm blind or stupid (or both) I guess :/ |
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| 15:30.54 | KNY | tauno, EditText uses Selection, could look into that |
| 15:32.19 | tauno | I'm looking at getSelectionStart and end atm.. |
| 15:32.19 | KNY | tauno, the one in frameworks/base/core/java/android/text seems more relevant |
| 15:32.23 | KNY | yeah |
| 15:33.13 | *** join/#android morrildl (n=chatzill@nat/google/x-789fc605de197506) |
| 15:34.15 | tauno | KNY, yes, that did the trick :) |
| 15:34.19 | languish | 'lo morrildl |
| 15:34.28 | KNY | tauno, glad to hear it |
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| 15:34.43 | languish | you were indirectly topic of convo related to GPS/aGPS again today |
| 15:34.56 | KNY | yeah, morrildl has some stalkers in here |
| 15:35.22 | wastrel | stalkers eh |
| 15:35.29 | skbohra | hi everybody |
| 15:35.52 | skbohra | http://perpetual-notion.blogspot.com/search/label/FreeRunner |
| 15:35.53 | morrildl | heh |
| 15:36.04 | skbohra | there is a diff |
| 15:36.18 | skbohra | I am not getting where to apply this |
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| 15:38.10 | skbohra | Is it the most stupid question ever asked here> :) |
| 15:38.27 | tauno | skbohra, you think you can beat me that easily? :) |
| 15:38.53 | languish | no, it's not a stupid question, just an uneducated one. big difference |
| 15:39.41 | skbohra | languish: I believe its a patch for android kernel |
| 15:39.57 | unix_lappy | still has trouble understanding the reason for porting over to the free runner. |
| 15:40.04 | languish | skbohra, that person's working on porting android to another device |
| 15:40.13 | skbohra | same is me |
| 15:40.38 | skbohra | wishes to do that one day :) |
| 15:40.48 | tauno | skbohra, "Please, I don't recommend even trying to apply the diff as a patch - it will do nothing and may even inflict pain on some remote small kitten... and you wouldn't want that," |
| 15:40.51 | languish | to what device? |
| 15:41.08 | skbohra | neo freerunner |
| 15:41.16 | languish | ah |
| 15:41.22 | languish | well, good luck :) |
| 15:41.42 | jbq | is happy to see android being ported to the openmoko phones. |
| 15:41.48 | skbohra | its a long way ahead |
| 15:41.58 | vol | hooray, android on openmoko |
| 15:42.02 | vol | they'll have an OS that works |
| 15:42.24 | Blice | lol... Harsh... |
| 15:42.37 | Blice | They did a pretty good job with their OS, come on. Give them some slack, that's not an easy task :[ |
| 15:42.47 | skbohra | so is that diff of any use to me |
| 15:42.48 | jbq | would like the relevant patches to go beyond "one-time hacks" and to eventually make their way back to the android code. |
| 15:42.53 | morrildl | jbq++ |
| 15:43.42 | morrildl | There are a bunch of patches that were submitted to gerrit that we are looking at |
| 15:44.06 | morrildl | But they are essentially just submissions of the "porter's frenzy", and aren't cleanly integrated with the build system and so on |
| 15:44.46 | morrildl | That's a process of course, and it's early days |
| 15:45.04 | skbohra | when I complied android source code, it doesn't give me a kernel img :( |
| 15:45.07 | jbq | Yes. We'll get there. |
| 15:45.33 | jbq | skbohra: the kernel has to be built separately, it's not integrate with the rest of the android build system. |
| 15:45.47 | jbq | s/integrate/integrated/ |
| 15:47.11 | skbohra | jbq: http://honeypod.blogspot.com/2007/12/compile-android-kernel-from-source.html is this tutorial pointing the right way? |
| 15:48.18 | jbq | I'm not an expert, but that looks like old instructions from "back then" when android hadn't been open-sourced yet. |
| 15:49.52 | jbq | You might get it to work along those lines, of course (by adapting the relevant parts), but it'd be better if you could know the "preferred" way to do that. I honestly wouldn't know where to look, other that reading the archives of android-kernel and android-porting. |
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| 16:07.21 | bert0 | anyone else in here had the non-pleasure of dealing with Verizon Online? |
| 16:07.40 | vol | ha |
| 16:07.57 | *** part/#android an_dev (n=fih\paya@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 16:08.03 | bert0 | not funny. They billed me and I never recieved service in any form |
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| 16:08.32 | bert0 | I try to call them and they transfer me to a number that is no longer in service |
| 16:08.44 | languish | how is this relevant to android? |
| 16:08.59 | bert0 | </rant> |
| 16:09.03 | vol | that's not that bad |
| 16:09.04 | languish | ah :) |
| 16:09.07 | vol | when I try to call 611 on my phone |
| 16:09.12 | vol | and finally get on the line for support |
| 16:09.21 | vol | it just sends me back to the start of calling 611 |
| 16:09.25 | vol | so I have to use another phone to call for support :D |
| 16:09.31 | vol | should do something about that at some point |
| 16:10.26 | bert0 | I do find it hard to press numbers mid-call for their menus though...why doesn't the keypad stay up during calls? |
| 16:11.12 | vol | because then you'd dial with your earlobe |
| 16:11.48 | wastrel | i've done that |
| 16:12.27 | wastrel | this phone needs a lot of work i tell you what :] |
| 16:12.38 | bert0 | ok well maybe the screen could stay on so I don't have to unlock? |
| 16:13.26 | offby1 | bert0: ah fell yo' pain |
| 16:13.29 | offby1 | feel |
| 16:13.45 | offby1 | maybe open the keyboard? I assume the digit keys would work |
| 16:13.58 | joel | hi all |
| 16:14.15 | joel | Got an question about dbus. |
| 16:14.22 | joel | As far as I know, Bluez use DBus. Are there other framework component in android using DBus except Bluez? |
| 16:15.07 | Disconnect | offby1: wow, yah. cuz every caller on a conf call wants to hear sssshhhWHACK when you go to push # for mute :) and i doubt vm systems would appreciate it either. "press 1 for english." "<ssssshhhWHACK!> beeep <sshWHACK>" "you have selected: esperanto." |
| 16:16.52 | Disconnect | actually, doesn't opening the kb turn on speakerphone automatically? |
| 16:17.13 | offby1 | dunno |
| 16:17.21 | offby1 | it was just an idea. No need to flame |
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| 16:17.27 | wastrel | esperanto voice menus would be hilarious |
| 16:17.49 | Disconnect | thought about "you have selected: latin" but.. |
| 16:17.49 | wastrel | the solution would be to get a bluetooth headset |
| 16:17.56 | wastrel | which i would do if they were useful for anything else |
| 16:18.06 | wastrel | but they're not so i'll wait |
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| 16:26.54 | pi-meson | can android apps make arbitrary connections to IPs/ports? |
| 16:27.26 | jbq | pi-meson: yes, as long as they have permission to access the internet. |
| 16:28.18 | pi-meson | do the android devices generally do the right thing if they can get wifi in an environment? like, is there any provision for seamless wifi-phone-data handoff? |
| 16:29.02 | jbq | pi-meson: for some definition of "seamless", yes. |
| 16:29.10 | vol | You will be informed about wifi in the area, but you have to specify that you want to use it (unless it's a saved AP) |
| 16:29.15 | jbq | Don't expect to keep your connections connected. |
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| 16:29.26 | pi-meson | right, the IP will likely change and whatnot |
| 16:30.12 | jbq | There are APIs (ConnectionManager or ConnectivityManager, I can never remember) that allow to query the state of the connections and to be notified when the state changes. |
| 16:33.01 | pi-meson | I'm basically considering using a gphone as a blinged-out remote control for my data acquisition hardware in lab |
| 16:33.19 | pi-meson | and we're mostly in a wifi-rich, cell-phone-poor environment |
| 16:33.36 | vol | don't say "gphone" or certain angry channel members will get enraged |
| 16:33.38 | Disconnect | bad news for connections like that: 2 mins after the screen goes blank, it turns off wifi (even if its in use, or at least thats been my xp) |
| 16:33.40 | vol | it's an HTC G1 :) |
| 16:33.46 | pi-meson | haha, my apologies :) |
| 16:33.50 | Disconnect | vol: htc dream, tmobile g1. |
| 16:34.02 | vol | Disconnect: Microsoft Netscape |
| 16:34.17 | pi-meson | no, you're totally correct, I should not be so sloppy |
| 16:34.37 | vol | so yeah G1 |
| 16:34.48 | vol | I haven't noticed this wifi issue, though I'll try it when I have connectbot up and running |
| 16:34.58 | vol | is this possibly tied into "keep screen alive" ? |
| 16:35.05 | Disconnect | if the screen is on, it doesn't time out |
| 16:35.23 | Disconnect | it can lose connections for any of a dozen other reasons (including sheer meanness) but not for that :) |
| 16:36.03 | pi-meson | right, it might be worthwhile to think about trying to do this in a manner that didn't depend on persistent connections |
| 16:37.13 | Disconnect | or just be ready to catch dropped connections cleanly. although wifi association seems hit or miss in some (many? or i'm unlucky) environments |
| 16:37.36 | vol | pi-meson: You might want to limit it to reasonably stateless TCP connections, like HTTP 1.0 |
| 16:37.42 | Disconnect | i should say automatic association. usually 1 or 2 manual connection attempts (open the list, click on the wlan) will work |
| 16:40.08 | Disconnect | is pretty sure its phase-of-the-moon problems most of the time, as superficially-identical environments (my desk, at work, on battery, locked for an hour or so) sometimes works, sometimes not.. |
| 16:40.47 | Disconnect | but there are some straight bugs (moving from AP to AP at home - something that my other mobile devices are good at and the macbook is ok at - fails 100% of the time) |
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| 17:05.45 | BluesLee | some freerunner user here? |
| 17:10.28 | donomo | BluesLee: try #openmoko |
| 17:11.12 | BluesLee | donomo: did that |
| 17:11.30 | donomo | BluesLee: i have a freerunner. havent put android on it. have you? |
| 17:11.58 | BluesLee | yes i did |
| 17:12.28 | BluesLee | there are some mp3 license problems so sean removed the images |
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| 17:15.37 | BluesLee | donomo: android looks good, user friendly |
| 17:16.18 | BluesLee | donomo: i think it will be ready within this year on the freerunner |
| 17:16.59 | donomo | BluesLee: great because the openmoko images are unusable for me |
| 17:18.15 | BluesLee | donomo: try qtextended or even better shr |
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| 17:30.17 | d0nets | anyone have an svn link to jasta's source for five? |
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| 17:31.22 | Damm | it's on five.googlecode.com |
| 17:32.33 | d0nets | gotcha thanks |
| 17:34.59 | RyeBrye | unix_lappy RyeBrye: you made gizmodo... ;-) <-- Cool... Although what's really funny is that I actually sent a "tip" into engadget about it when I first posted the blog but apparently Gizmodo is more 'with it' in recognizing cool stuff :) |
| 17:36.13 | jeld | RyeBrye, congratz :) |
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| 17:40.26 | donomo | RyeBrye: is your story 'Flash 10 on the G1'? |
| 17:40.43 | Disconnect | donomo: tinyurl.com/g1multi |
| 17:40.49 | tethridge | is there video of the flash 10 on the g1 demo? |
| 17:41.00 | donomo | tethridge: yes though i havent watched it myself |
| 17:41.08 | donomo | Disconnect: thx |
| 17:41.15 | tethridge | i couldn't find any video |
| 17:41.35 | obra | Is there a public release date for beta1? |
| 17:42.00 | donomo | tethridge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghIGj9r3_vc |
| 17:42.11 | RyeBrye | donomo - no, the multitouch one |
| 17:42.33 | donomo | RyeBrye: ok, i saw that one yesterday. i was really excited for a moment. |
| 17:42.37 | unix_lappy | RyeBrye: engadget is more of a gadget publication, or at least it thinks of itself as more of one. |
| 17:42.41 | RyeBrye | Oh, you thought itw as in the API :) |
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| 17:43.05 | unix_lappy | gizmodo is more of a gadget blagh, gawker in general is more relaxed about stuff. |
| 17:43.44 | unix_lappy | no, there is no framework that I know of. |
| 17:43.45 | RyeBrye | I've started looking into what it would take to put multi-touch into Android properly |
| 17:43.50 | RyeBrye | It's not trivial, to say the least |
| 17:44.23 | RyeBrye | but given enough time and enough monkeys, it can obviously be done |
| 17:45.11 | unix_lappy | RyeBrye: it bothers me that HTC didnt give the Android Team the heads up...hey, it might be cool to have a multitouch framework on the roadmap, because we recently got some killer deals. |
| 17:45.20 | RyeBrye | Yes, I know |
| 17:45.39 | Disconnect | suspects the android team knew/knows its multitouch capable. hence the patents quote from way back when. |
| 17:46.09 | RyeBrye | unix_lappy - HTC should have said "well, even if your OS will only use single touch for now - we found that synaptics price on a multitouch capable screen is no cheaper than one that isn't - so it's going to have a multi screen in the specs" |
| 17:46.16 | Disconnect | i haven't been able to find even a hint of non-EGR-capable capacitance touchscreens from synaptics.. so.. |
| 17:46.35 | jbq | The feature list for Android 1.0 got frozen far before HTC could have known about that. And that's not counting the lead time that'd be necessary to propagate it through the driver to the framework, the view system and the apps. |
| 17:46.45 | RyeBrye | jqb - fair enough |
| 17:47.10 | RyeBrye | s/jqb/jbq/ |
| 17:47.16 | Disconnect | jbq: sure, i'm not saying it should have been supported or anything. (whether or not it should have been on the 1.0 roadmap is a different issue :) ..) |
| 17:47.19 | Disconnect | timewise i mean |
| 17:47.30 | unix_lappy | what Disconnect said. |
| 17:47.50 | RyeBrye | But the spec of the HTC being a single-touch screen seems like it will limit the G1 to officially only being a single-touch device, even when the Android multitouch does get built |
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| 17:47.56 | andyross | RyeBrye: was it you that was asking about streaming audio the other day? I got a chance to play with AudioTrack last night, and indeed, it seems to work correctly the way I expected. |
| 17:48.08 | RyeBrye | andyross - that's cool |
| 17:48.41 | RyeBrye | andyross - yes, I was looking into that the other day and I gave up |
| 17:48.46 | kRutOn | Are the patents for multitouch not an issue now |
| 17:48.47 | kRutOn | ? |
| 17:49.03 | RyeBrye | Who knows |
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| 17:49.06 | Disconnect | kRutOn: not an issue yet more likely - until they are approved they are just potential disasters |
| 17:49.28 | Disconnect | the big ones (pinch for relative zoom in/out) are likely to be rejected, but some of the others might be ok. |
| 17:49.42 | Disconnect | (but then again, this is the us patent system. so 'likely' is a relative term) |
| 17:50.03 | RyeBrye | Yeah, didn't MS effectively patent the "page up" / "page down" key recently? |
| 17:50.48 | RyeBrye | andyross - so the AudioTrack will just fill a buffer for you in realtime of uncompressed audio from the mic? |
| 17:51.34 | andyross | Other way around: you set it up with a callback that gets invoked automatically when the shared buffer needs to be filled. Simple C++ rig: http://pastebin.ca/1260555 |
| 17:51.46 | RyeBrye | Ahh, gotcha |
| 17:52.14 | andyross | Actually there's a lower level API where you can do the buffer acquire/release yourself, but the callback is just that wrapped in a separate thread (which is probably the right way to go for low-latency audio) |
| 17:53.01 | RyeBrye | cool. I will definitely try to use this later |
| 17:53.02 | andyross | And you may want to nice the CPU-bound threads too, although I had this running alongside my transform-limited OpenGL stuff without any skips. |
| 17:53.42 | RyeBrye | andyross - did you get to look around at any of the audio routing stuff at all? I.e. can you route audio playback to the phone? (for music on hold type apps or a vocodor... etc.) |
| 17:54.15 | cmonex | RyeBrye |
| 17:54.19 | cmonex | look in other channel =) |
| 17:54.41 | andyross | Just barely, in the context of seeing what would be needed to get A2DP working for generic output. And AFAICT most of the routing decisions are hard-wired. There's not a lot of pluggability in the API. |
| 17:54.57 | andyross | Other channel? |
| 17:55.22 | kRutOn | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:58.25 | cmonex | kRutOn is correct. |
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| 18:03.29 | languish | so just push blue packets momentarily through a hell dimension instead, like nighcrawler. |
| 18:03.54 | languish | +t |
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| 18:04.39 | P1ro | anyone know wich wireless chipset the G1 have ? |
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| 18:08.45 | cmonex | ttuttle you there? |
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| 18:08.54 | ttuttle | cmonex: yeah |
| 18:09.14 | ttuttle | cmonex: hat's up? |
| 18:09.18 | ttuttle | *what's |
| 18:10.18 | cmonex | ttuttle when you said your radio was unlocked what did you mean? |
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| 18:15.28 | d0nets | anyone have a link to the guide for installing jasta's five-alpha? |
| 18:15.37 | d0nets | i cant find it on google |
| 18:15.44 | d0nets | wait lemme try with quotes |
| 18:15.45 | michaelnovakjr | d0nets: its in the source :) |
| 18:15.48 | michaelnovakjr | its called INSTALL :) |
| 18:15.53 | d0nets | i see |
| 18:16.02 | d0nets | i think i ran into that last time |
| 18:16.04 | d0nets | thanks |
| 18:16.18 | michaelnovakjr | np |
| 18:16.26 | jasta | hey mike |
| 18:16.30 | michaelnovakjr | hy |
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| 18:23.49 | cmonex | ttuttle: nevermind, can just search the channel logs for what you said =) |
| 18:26.03 | romainguy_ | cmonex: he meant that his phone is not sim-locked |
| 18:26.44 | cmonex | that's not a big feat |
| 18:26.46 | cmonex | to achieve |
| 18:26.57 | cmonex | iirc unlock codes are like 10GBP |
| 18:27.08 | romainguy_ | except he didn't use an unlock code |
| 18:27.09 | cmonex | oh well |
| 18:27.12 | romainguy_ | his phone has always been unlocked |
| 18:27.12 | cmonex | yeah, but |
| 18:27.17 | romainguy_ | he can also flash the firmware |
| 18:27.18 | cmonex | there is a much more interesting mode |
| 18:27.28 | cmonex | when the radio allows access to all commands |
| 18:27.39 | cmonex | (htc's version of the qc radio I mean) |
| 18:28.11 | cmonex | so I wondered if eng devices (such as ttuttle's) had that too |
| 18:28.34 | romainguy_ | no idea |
| 18:29.00 | cmonex | ok, just thinking aloud =) |
| 18:29.10 | jasta | romainguy_: are the engineering builds physically the same as the G1, just with a different firmware? |
| 18:29.34 | romainguy_ | the phones are the same yes |
| 18:29.44 | DarkriftX | steals one of romainguy's 10 g1's |
| 18:29.55 | cmonex | so. let's dump the fw off them |
| 18:30.39 | romainguy_ | you still won't have the proper bootloader |
| 18:30.56 | cmonex | fw dump would include bootloader dump |
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| 18:35.06 | ttuttle | cmonex: oh... |
| 18:35.22 | ttuttle | cmonex: so, basically, the radio half of the MSM7201A has, like most cell phone radios, a SIM lock. |
| 18:35.37 | ttuttle | cmonex: Mine is unlocked, so it will accept any SIM. Most are locked, so they will only take T-Mobile SIMs. |
| 18:35.47 | ttuttle | cmonex: This is *not* fixable by simply flashing the firmware. |
| 18:35.53 | ttuttle | cmonex: It requires actually entering an unlock code. |
| 18:36.38 | cmonex | ttuttle, thanks for the education =) |
| 18:36.46 | jasta | something which t-mobile is likely to hand out freely |
| 18:36.54 | cmonex | of course the unlock code is ALWAYS in an extra "secure" area |
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| 18:37.01 | cmonex | or it would be pointless to have it |
| 18:37.13 | cmonex | jasta: yes they do it if you ask, for umm, like 7 usd? |
| 18:37.18 | cmonex | iirc |
| 18:37.33 | jasta | they charge? i doubt that. no other mobile carrier in the US charges for this. |
| 18:37.45 | cmonex | oh, well, someone said that |
| 18:38.04 | jasta | i recently even had AT&T unlock one of my older phones by just claiming i was visiting europe |
| 18:38.07 | Disconnect | cmonex: they do it free |
| 18:38.19 | Disconnect | i got mine done 2 weeks or so after it arrived. |
| 18:38.26 | Disconnect | said i might be going to london for business in a week. |
| 18:38.33 | dd94300 | yes t-mobile is giving unlock code for free upon request |
| 18:38.33 | cmonex | nice |
| 18:38.40 | cmonex | weird |
| 18:38.43 | cmonex | jesusfreke said it cost him money |
| 18:38.51 | cmonex | and others said the same too |
| 18:38.56 | Disconnect | he prolly walked in somewhere and got ripped of. :) i just called 611 and asked. |
| 18:38.56 | cmonex | maybe they started to be nice now ::P |
| 18:39.00 | cmonex | oh |
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| 18:42.38 | jasta | have you guys seen this news about Fomalhaut b and d? |
| 18:42.46 | jasta | thats really exciting |
| 18:44.10 | skbohra | which |
| 18:44.51 | jasta | that they just found visible light pictures confirming 3 planets orbiting fomalhaut |
| 18:45.19 | Disconnect | jasta: thought it was IR |
| 18:46.24 | jasta | well all the idiot news sites call it visible light, let me see if i can confirm from nasa themselves |
| 18:47.23 | jasta | fomalhaut b was captured in visible light, c, and d are in infrared. |
| 18:48.11 | Delvien | is zoom possible on the g1 camera? |
| 18:48.26 | *** join/#android orci (n=orci@24-177-53-93.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) |
| 18:48.42 | ttuttle | Delvien: not yet |
| 18:49.00 | orci | hi, I see list of apps on websites, some of them are not on market, is there other ways of installing software on android? |
| 18:49.07 | Delvien | kk :( |
| 18:49.21 | Delvien | orci what site? |
| 18:49.49 | orci | Delvien, http://www.networkworld.com/news/2008/090808-google-best-android-applications.html?ts |
| 18:49.56 | Disconnect | jasta: yah just found that :) |
| 18:50.07 | orci | Delvien, such as softrace |
| 18:50.18 | orci | Delvien, there are more that are not on market |
| 18:50.38 | Disconnect | orci: yah check out your manual |
| 18:50.52 | orci | Disconnect, heh I was not aware there was a manual |
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| 18:53.22 | orci | Disconnect, you mean this one? http://www.engadget.com/photos/t-mobile-g1s-getting-started-manual/1057805/ |
| 18:53.37 | Disconnect | the one in the box with the phone |
| 18:53.45 | jasta | Disconnect: fun stuff :) |
| 18:54.11 | orci | Disconnect, I do not have any box or manual anymore |
| 18:54.18 | orci | well nevermind |
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| 18:54.36 | jasta | orci: lol, that article you pasted says TuneWiki is open source |
| 18:54.57 | orci | jasta, i was just looking at the names of apps |
| 18:55.22 | jasta | i was just commenting about their poor journalistic integrity |
| 18:55.27 | orci | stupid networkworld journal |
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| 18:56.48 | vol | So, anyone who has done C library debugging with android, have you tried integrating arm-eabi-gdb with Eclipse CDT, or any other visual tools? Or do you all just use arm-eabi-gdb from the command line? |
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| 19:00.31 | RyeBrye | "Flash Lite, which until now has largely stood in for Flash on handheld platforms, doesn’t pack anywhere near the punch of its full-fledged sibling, which is itself sluggish on the iPhone. The proposed new ARM-optimized Flash would use OpenGL ES 2.0-capable hardware and newer, faster processors to allow complex apps and advanced video to come to portable devices, without sacrificing speed and usability" |
| 19:00.40 | ttuttle | does not want Flash! |
| 19:01.23 | RyeBrye | So... what is the flash that was demoed on the G1 - "Flash Lite" ? "Flash Normal" "Some-new-flash-that-is-neither-light-nor-normal-and-will-have-to-have-crap-custom-made-for-it?" |
| 19:01.40 | RyeBrye | ttuttle - why don't you want flash? |
| 19:01.47 | romainguy_ | my understanding is that it was the normal Flash player |
| 19:02.15 | romainguy_ | (at least from what friends that were at Adobe MAX told me) |
| 19:02.18 | RyeBrye | romainguy - I was hoping that was the case. I saw some article refer to it as "flash lite" - but they may have just been making asuptions |
| 19:02.30 | RyeBrye | should be at MAX right now - but forgot about it until it was too late :( |
| 19:02.41 | vol | I'm just fine with flash, as long as there is a very explicit flashblock option |
| 19:02.42 | romainguy_ | should be at MAX right now but has work to do |
| 19:02.43 | romainguy_ | :) |
| 19:02.56 | RyeBrye | Yeah, ditto to the "work to do" part |
| 19:04.00 | Disconnect | i thoguht it was flash-normal. same as nokia tablets ahve. |
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| 19:05.24 | RyeBrye | Does flex stuff work on the nokia tablets? |
| 19:05.29 | RyeBrye | I haven't tried |
| 19:05.42 | romainguy_ | if a recent Flash player works, it should |
| 19:06.18 | RyeBrye | Cool. Flex developers around the world will rejoice if Android can play back Flex stuff |
| 19:06.46 | romainguy_ | that said when I see the sometimes poor performance of Flex on the desktop... :) |
| 19:06.58 | RyeBrye | I would never develop on Flex if I was directly targeting a mobile device... but the fact that they might be able to get access to some stuff would be cool |
| 19:07.22 | romainguy_ | I'm much more excited about Flash Catalyst |
| 19:07.28 | RyeBrye | Oh, yeah |
| 19:07.38 | RyeBrye | That looks awesome |
| 19:07.48 | RyeBrye | Now we need an mxml -> Android UI translator ;) |
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| 19:18.34 | raidfive | is it possible to create a global menu item that shows up for all activities ? |
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| 19:24.02 | herriojr | do permissions you set for your application not apply to broadcast receivers? |
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| 19:27.33 | herriojr | raidfive: I don't think so |
| 19:27.51 | herriojr | you can't force anything of yours to show in other applications |
| 19:28.05 | raidfive | yea I mainly meant just is activites managed by my app |
| 19:28.34 | raidfive | and I just discovered that since I'm using a TabActivity for navigation, I can add the menu item to that and it will show up in all activities managed by the TabActivity |
| 19:28.35 | herriojr | I would create a base class activity which has the menu item, and then extend it for your other activities |
| 19:28.47 | herriojr | ah ok |
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| 19:29.33 | herriojr | I don't do much activity work, so you might know more than I do about it :) |
| 19:30.01 | herriojr | it sounds to me like you are using an ActivityGroup? I'm just curious |
| 19:30.37 | tripps | so shuffle on the music player isn't random at all. it's the same exact order every time I play it :-/ |
| 19:31.04 | tripps | i should clarify that - every time I reshuffle it |
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| 19:37.27 | wastrel | anyone in contact with fbreaderj developers? |
| 19:37.42 | wastrel | so it's shuffling the playlist |
| 19:37.47 | wastrel | then you play the playlist something like that? |
| 19:38.37 | tripps | wastrel, I just bring up the various artists album, for example, and click shuffle all and it always plays the same order |
| 19:38.58 | tripps | there are quite a few bugs ("features") in the music player IMO |
| 19:39.23 | raidfive | herriojr: TabActivity and TabHost |
| 19:39.30 | herriojr | is there a way to give my BroadcastReceiver my application permissions instead of using the context of the calling application? |
| 19:40.32 | raidfive | but I don't think my solution is going to work :) ... it doesn't seem to want to call my method when I click the menu item |
| 19:41.05 | herriojr | yeah, try making a base class and extending it to your other activities |
| 19:41.14 | tripps | Another one is when I click artists, and I see an artist that says, for example, 1 album, 2 songs. when I click on that artist presumably I only want to see the songs by that artist. instead it displays the album which that artist is on. In my case, with a lot of dj mixed compilations, it ends up showing 50 songs rather than the 2 that he did |
| 19:41.55 | raidfive | herriojr: I'll try that |
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| 19:43.31 | tripps | what I really want to see, however, more than any other single thing on the player, is support for streaming music |
| 19:43.35 | wastrel | fbreader fbreader |
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| 19:49.48 | vol | fbreader |
| 19:51.52 | floppyears | is there a way to read pdf files in the g1 ? |
| 19:52.04 | ttuttle | floppyears: no |
| 19:52.39 | floppyears | :( |
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| 19:53.18 | Rob-cs | whats up people? |
| 19:53.48 | Rob-cs | did anyone see the articles floating around the interwebs about how ANDROID supports Multi-Touch... but it is merely just "commented out" of the source code? |
| 19:54.35 | herriojr | check out the sourcecode and check |
| 19:54.58 | trigatch4 | i was just wondering if any devs had seen it and had an opinion |
| 19:55.01 | herriojr | ok, android.permission.INSTALL_PACKAGES is not a valid permission for some reason |
| 19:55.39 | herriojr | my app has it, and I'm using the context of my service, yet it gives me an error due to me not having the permission I declared myself as using |
| 19:55.49 | wastrel | trigatch4: i saw a blogpost about it , it was commented out in the driver |
| 19:56.11 | wastrel | that's aside from the fact that there's no support for it in the app framework |
| 19:56.20 | androoid | whats the best way to use web service via the android? |
| 19:56.25 | trigatch4 | right... it was noted that it may have been for patent reasons |
| 19:56.42 | trigatch4 | which would make one think that Google/OHA is trying to either find a way to license the tech |
| 19:56.49 | trigatch4 | or get around the patent somehow or? |
| 19:56.51 | floppyears | does anybody know how long had apple been working in iphone vs how long google had been working on android ? |
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| 19:57.08 | jbq | herriojr: I think it's a system-only permission. |
| 19:57.27 | mikey| | http://www.ryebrye.com/blog/2008/11/17/proving-the-g1-screen-can-handle-multi-touch/ |
| 19:57.46 | androoid | hey it's RyeBrye |
| 19:58.09 | herriojr | I wish the documentation would reflect that |
| 19:58.48 | jbq | herriojr: lemme see. Do you have a URL to the doc? |
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| 19:59.50 | herriojr | jbq: actually, from the android source code, it doesn't seem to do anything different than if I were to check against a permission |
| 19:59.50 | mikey| | pastebin.ca is always down it seems :/ |
| 19:59.51 | herriojr | http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/Manifest.permission.html#INSTALL_PACKAGES |
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| 20:01.15 | vol | RyeBrye: awesome |
| 20:03.22 | jbq | herriojr: thanks for the URI. I'll try to dig a bit. In a nutshell, that permission can only be granted to apps that are signed with the same signature as the framework itself. See like 760 in http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=platform/frameworks/base.git;a=blob;f=core/res/AndroidManifest.xml;h=104ba8846e8e209feea13b51cd2a2a0e55c534f2;hb=HEAD |
| 20:03.56 | herriojr | and here: http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/content/pm/PackageManager.html#installPackage(android.net.Uri, android.content.pm.IPackageInstallObserver, int) |
| 20:05.12 | jbq | Yup. |
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| 20:05.51 | unix_lappy | mikey|: that doesnt mean much in the short term, especially for the G1. |
| 20:06.16 | mikey| | aye, but thought it was worth posting here |
| 20:06.21 | mikey| | shame pastebin.ca is down again |
| 20:06.26 | mikey| | wanted to see the output |
| 20:06.36 | *** join/#android infernixx (n=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 20:07.14 | herriojr | that stinks |
| 20:07.17 | Disconnect | mikey|: first someone has to add it to the event system (or, better, get the EGR stuff into the touchscreen firmware) .. then add it to the platform (requires rooted device, and slightly risky to reflash those) and then write an app that can handle it. |
| 20:07.37 | unix_lappy | unless Android already has a framework for a multitouch device already good to go for other devices, but was just not aware and thus not focusing on making the G1 a multitouch device. |
| 20:07.51 | herriojr | well, I guess at the very least, I can download the application and have the user install it |
| 20:08.35 | jbq | herriojr: sorry about the confusion. I left a note for the documentation guys to clear this up. This is a very dangerous permission (it literally controls every other permission) so you shouldn't expect it to become public "as is". |
| 20:09.11 | jbq | herriojr: yes, the proper path is to put the apk in either a file (typically on the SD card) or in your content provider, and invoke "ACTION_VIEW" on it. |
| 20:10.17 | jbq | Here's a bit of code that does it: http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=platform/packages/providers/DownloadProvider.git;a=blob;f=src/com/android/providers/downloads/DownloadReceiver.java;h=e5bc4e1f19c6bfab1bc9b6dc37e217327b511e09;hb=master#l100 (you'll probably have to dig around a bit) |
| 20:11.51 | herriojr | jbq: thanks |
| 20:13.31 | mikey| | http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=21&can=1&colspec=ID%20Type%20Version%20Security%20Status%20Owner%20Summary |
| 20:13.32 | mikey| | lol |
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| 20:14.02 | herriojr | jbq: I'm curious, can apk's be signed with multiple signatures? |
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| 20:15.14 | mikey| | iirc, yes |
| 20:15.33 | *** join/#android orci_ (n=orci@24-177-53-93.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) |
| 20:15.48 | mikey| | ".... Note that you can sign an APK multiple times with different keys....." |
| 20:16.03 | mikey| | http://code.google.com/android/devel/sign-publish.html |
| 20:16.08 | orci_ | hi, anybody have any idea why I cannot find this on youtube app on android? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2eYLK6TpRs&feature=PlayList&p=51CACD5B1F58C40C&index=0 |
| 20:16.09 | RyeBrye | mikey| - is pastebin not working for those links? |
| 20:16.29 | RyeBrye | one of them is pastebin.com and not pastebin.ca |
| 20:16.45 | mikey| | ah, ok |
| 20:16.54 | mikey| | pastebin.ca has poor uptime |
| 20:17.07 | RyeBrye | mikey| - they all seem to work for me, but they might be cached for me |
| 20:17.18 | orci_ | when I search in youtube app am i searching in a smaller databse than the actual youtube.com database? |
| 20:17.27 | RyeBrye | http://pastebin.com/m3d671b69 is not as interesting as some of the others - just shows me varying pressure on each finger independently while one of them gets tapped in different places |
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| 20:18.03 | mikey| | strange, I can ping pastebin.ca from a .US server, but not from home or from a .uk server |
| 20:18.14 | herriojr | jbq: it would be cool if you guys added in the notion of a Package Group, so choosing it in the Market will install all of the packages in the group |
| 20:18.15 | floppyears | orci_: yes, I believe the same case is for the iphone. |
| 20:18.37 | orci_ | floppyears, any idea why would that be? |
| 20:19.01 | floppyears | because the videos in youtube are actually re-encoded to play in those devices |
| 20:19.09 | orci_ | floppyears, aah |
| 20:19.54 | unix_lappy | orci_: try clicking on the youtube link for that video from youtube.com |
| 20:20.01 | unix_lappy | it should bring up the youtube player on android. |
| 20:20.03 | jbq | herriojr: I think I've heard some discussions inside google about something like that. not quite sure, though, but it's fairly natural anyway. |
| 20:20.11 | orci_ | unix_lappy, that's a good idea |
| 20:20.15 | orci_ | I'll try |
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| 20:20.39 | herriojr | ok |
| 20:22.06 | orci_ | unix_lappy, this video is processing and may take a while. please try again later. |
| 20:22.24 | mikey| | flash will be on android soon, so you can watch all the youtube want :) |
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| 20:22.45 | orci_ | mikey|, I wish that was not true |
| 20:23.00 | mikey| | why so? |
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| 20:23.27 | orci_ | I believe flash is not a good way of presenting stuff on the web |
| 20:23.37 | orci_ | though it is shiny |
| 20:23.55 | mikey| | how would you prefer youtube streamed videos? |
| 20:23.59 | unix_lappy | orci_: like floppyears said, it's reencoded. that video hasnt been processed yet. |
| 20:24.07 | orci_ | mikey|, using html+ogg |
| 20:24.12 | herriojr | jbq: I don't know if you'll be able to answer this one, but will there be a change to allow applications to allow other applications use one of its activities without having to share a userId? |
| 20:24.30 | unix_lappy | orci_: if you REALLY need the video try vixy.net |
| 20:24.33 | jbq | herriojr: you can do that today. startActivity with the right intent. |
| 20:24.58 | herriojr | jbq: what I mean is display it in an activitygroup |
| 20:25.05 | herriojr | jbq: sorry, forgot that part :) |
| 20:25.15 | orci_ | unix_lappy, yeah, any idea what is google's algorithm to priotize the encodings? |
| 20:25.16 | jbq | herriojr: I don't know what those are, sorry (I never did any UI on Android). |
| 20:25.28 | jbq | goes to lunch, people are waiting. |
| 20:25.37 | herriojr | basically, I want to display another application's activity in my activity |
| 20:25.47 | herriojr | as kind of a sub-screen |
| 20:26.12 | herriojr | jbq: ok, np :) |
| 20:26.13 | vol | RyeBrye: Have you been using arm-eabi-gdb in your hacking? If so, have you hooked it up to any sort of visual debugger, or are you doing straight up command line (for life) |
| 20:26.14 | unix_lappy | herriojr: romainguy might now. |
| 20:26.22 | unix_lappy | know* |
| 20:26.42 | herriojr | unix_lappy: I just wanted to see if they have plans on changing it, currently they only allow it with a shared user id |
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| 20:37.40 | herriojr | jbq: last question for the day, if deleting is also a signature-based permission, what activity can I redirect them to in order to prompt to delete? |
| 20:37.57 | herriojr | or actually, the user experience for that would be awful |
| 20:38.03 | herriojr | nevermind |
| 20:40.09 | jasta | i am trying to debug why it appears that home is being reaped for memory before other apps (including mine)? |
| 20:40.18 | jasta | anyone have a good place to start debugging something like that? |
| 20:40.37 | jasta | almost every time i open the browser home gets restarted, when i look at running processes a bunhc of things that i think should be killed first are still alive |
| 20:43.33 | wastrel | that's annoying yes |
| 20:43.53 | jasta | must be some sort of bug? i'd like to see if i could understnad this a bit better |
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| 20:43.58 | wastrel | i don't like waiting a minute for home to reload after using browser |
| 20:43.59 | jasta | but im not sure where to begin |
| 20:44.09 | jmo | I think "adb shell dumpsys activity" will give you the table of priorities for reaping |
| 20:44.10 | wastrel | i recommend complaining to romainguy_ |
| 20:44.16 | jmo | (and a lot of other stuff) |
| 20:44.17 | jasta | for instance, i can see my app process is taken up like 8 or 9MB of ram, but is totally inactive |
| 20:44.20 | jasta | why not kill it first? |
| 20:44.35 | fadden | jasta: adb shell dumpsys activity | grep oom_adj |
| 20:45.25 | jasta | also, how can i tell if a process has in fact been reaped by the oom killer? can i guess based on its pid? |
| 20:45.47 | fadden | adb shell dmesg |
| 20:46.18 | RyeBrye | vol - I've just been using the command line for now, but I'm not against using arm-eabi-gdb |
| 20:46.44 | *** join/#android RyeBrye (n=RyeBrye@108.248.sfcn.org) |
| 20:48.24 | vol | RyeBrye: You mean you haven't been using a debugger at all? |
| 20:48.54 | vol | fadden: same question for you, since you're here; do you use a visual frontend for arm-eabi-gdb, or do you just use the command line? |
| 20:49.15 | vol | romainguy_ too I suppose, though he's not here |
| 20:49.28 | romainguy_ | I don't use native code |
| 20:49.35 | romainguy_ | (well except right now, but I'm not using a debugger :) |
| 20:49.39 | vol | shakes his fist |
| 20:49.47 | *** join/#android AttractiveApe (n=phil@office.gossamer-threads.com) |
| 20:49.52 | vol | curses |
| 20:49.54 | RyeBrye | vol - have you been using arm-eabi-gdb? |
| 20:49.55 | romainguy_ | I just wait for the native to blow up |
| 20:50.00 | romainguy_ | then I use tools/stack :) |
| 20:50.04 | *** join/#android ZeZu (n=null@c-24-14-8-40.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 20:50.12 | andyross | very occasionally uses gud-mode in emacs (although not yet for the G1) if he's stepping through very diffuse code (e.g. OOP stuff where every call is virtual and you don't know where it's going). But usually just plain gdb is good enough. |
| 20:50.15 | RyeBrye | I'd have to recompile most of my stuff for it to be useful, I imagine - since I think all debug symbols are stripped |
| 20:50.35 | vol | RyeBrye: Yes, we just got arm-eabi-gdb to actually work correctly for us |
| 20:50.47 | RyeBrye | cool |
| 20:50.52 | RyeBrye | you have instructions somewhere? |
| 20:51.13 | vol | I do, but they're not particularly special |
| 20:51.55 | vol | our biggest stumbling block was figuring out A) that we're debugging against dalvikvm and B) solib-absolute-prefix and solib-search-path have to be set up right |
| 20:52.08 | fadden | vol: I do most of my native work on the desktop ("lunch 2") build. I'm nearly unique in that respect though. |
| 20:52.44 | vol | it's probably simpler for you to just use the gdbclient function once you've set up lunch |
| 20:53.01 | vol | fadden: boo |
| 20:53.02 | fadden | vol: yup |
| 20:54.12 | *** join/#android shackan (n=frob@host194-136-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:54.14 | jasta | how do i read oom_adj? higher numbers are likely to be killed first? |
| 20:54.31 | fadden | Yes. |
| 20:55.00 | Disconnect | probably (i'm just guessing) home is supposed to launch way faster than it actually tends to, so its first on the block for ram recovery |
| 20:55.28 | jasta | interesting, my app is at 0, below android.process.acore at7. |
| 20:55.39 | jasta | ohhh, i bet i know |
| 20:56.05 | jasta | i call setForeground(true) but i think i never set it to false. i just figured i'd die after stopSelf and it wouldn't matter... |
| 20:56.31 | jasta | but there must still be activities bound to it which are keeping the whole thing alive with a high priority |
| 20:56.50 | jasta | thanks guys. |
| 20:57.33 | fadden | We're here to help. In my case, we're here to help with as few words as possible. |
| 20:57.38 | Disconnect | lol |
| 20:57.38 | fadden | ;-) |
| 20:59.45 | raidfive | can anyone point me in the right direction for documentation related to audio recording/playback? |
| 21:00.22 | jasta | zhobbs: did you ever come to a conclusion about leaking when your player service is in a separate process? |
| 21:01.53 | zhobbs | jasta: no, I keep putting it off...I even converted to using a RemoteCallbackList and it's still happening for me... |
| 21:02.04 | zhobbs | I need to create a simple example and see if it happens |
| 21:03.13 | jasta | i'm reluctant to switch to using a remote process for fear of your bug surfacing in my app as well |
| 21:03.47 | zhobbs | jasta: I'll try to reproduce in a small project today... |
| 21:07.21 | jbq | herriojr: If there's a way to directly invoke the uninstaller for a package, I'm not aware of it, sorry. |
| 21:09.27 | *** join/#android Ramblurr (n=rmblr@amarok/developer/Ramblurr) |
| 21:09.55 | Ramblurr | eclipse stopped generating the R.java file |
| 21:10.03 | Ramblurr | i suspect there is an error that is making it die |
| 21:10.10 | Ramblurr | but i can't figure out how to generate it with the aapt tool |
| 21:10.30 | vol | Look in eclipse's problems tab |
| 21:10.42 | vol | also, make sure it's loaded as an android project instead of a java project |
| 21:10.42 | herriojr | jbq: np |
| 21:10.53 | herriojr | jbq: thanks for all the help :) |
| 21:11.04 | Ramblurr | vol: the problem tab only shows the "R cannot be resolved" error |
| 21:11.09 | Ramblurr | vol: and yes it is an android project |
| 21:11.28 | jbq | herriojr: np, sorry that you had to spend some time walking into a dead end because of some incomplete documentation. |
| 21:11.31 | *** part/#android lloyd_fedora (n=darkstar@86.99.16.93) |
| 21:11.51 | vol | er, huh. Right click the little folder for the project and hit refresh? |
| 21:12.17 | Ramblurr | already tried that |
| 21:12.20 | Ramblurr | no luck :( |
| 21:12.52 | jasta | fadden: interesting, i found another bug which prevents my service from stopping any longer |
| 21:13.08 | jasta | so both of those issues combined lead to my app having much too high a priority |
| 21:13.17 | jasta | which is bad considering i sling a lot of memory :) |
| 21:13.41 | jasta | this oom_adj metric is very helpful |
| 21:15.02 | Ramblurr | vol: heh |
| 21:15.23 | *** join/#android porter1 (n=cameron@156.26.173.219) |
| 21:15.23 | Ramblurr | ./aapt p -m -J . -M AndroidManifest.xml -S res/ -I ~/src/android_sdk/android.jar => Segmentation fault |
| 21:15.27 | vol | gg |
| 21:15.35 | vol | stop messing up |
| 21:15.37 | _avatar | my ListView rows are clickable, and work fine if the user touches them to perform a click. however, the user uses the trackball to select one, then presses the trackball down, the onClickListener isn't fired. i don't remember having this problem in my other app, and i can't find any real code differences. can someone remind me if i have to flip a bit somewhere to get this to work? |
| 21:16.01 | _avatar | the rows focus just fine, btw, using the trackball, and even display a "pressed" state when the trackball is down |
| 21:16.13 | herriojr | jbq: well, if it weren't for me walking into a dead end, the documentation probably wouldn't get fixed :) |
| 21:16.49 | jbq | herriojr: true. Now we've got to hope that the doc gets fixed before other people bump into the issue. |
| 21:18.31 | Ramblurr | bah so aapt segfaults when you reference a non-existent image file in an xml file? |
| 21:19.37 | herriojr | jbq: now if I could only get the Sms Broadcaster to instead do Ordered Broadcasts or actually allow port-directed Sms's :) |
| 21:19.44 | zhobbs | jasta: it's pretty bad I put this service example off for so long, I'm almost done :) |
| 21:20.05 | jasta | lol |
| 21:20.13 | jbq | herriojr: sadly, I don't know anything about that part to be able to help (or even make changes for future versions). |
| 21:20.13 | jasta | are you able to demonstrate the issue? |
| 21:20.25 | zhobbs | don't know, not done yet |
| 21:20.31 | jasta | yay, i got my app working properly again, i now have higher priority than home so i can be reaped when the browser gobbles up all the memory |
| 21:20.47 | jasta | err, higher oom_adj, lower priority |
| 21:20.47 | herriojr | I have the code checked out, so I can modify it |
| 21:21.14 | herriojr | then submit a patch |
| 21:21.16 | jasta | hey, does anyone else notice the SMS app's conversation list activity is really slow? |
| 21:21.32 | herriojr | jasta: haven't looked into it |
| 21:21.47 | jasta | scrolling around in that app is the choppiest experience i've seen in any other app by a long shot |
| 21:21.54 | *** join/#android ignaciogggg (n=ignaciog@host161.190-226-114.telecom.net.ar) |
| 21:21.55 | jasta | stutters for about a second or more during each fling |
| 21:22.07 | vol | goes on another downloading orgy |
| 21:22.15 | vol | I can't get enough 30k apps :D :D :D |
| 21:22.40 | zhobbs | jasta: I noticed that and scrolling is slow in the IM app...and the text isn't formatted correctly until the fling/scroll is finished |
| 21:22.47 | wastrel | i've sent maybe 3 sms'sses |
| 21:23.17 | *** join/#android jexe (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 21:23.18 | RyeBrye | vol - I had 49 notifications sitting up in my notifications bar once telling me about all the apps I just downloaded |
| 21:23.23 | *** join/#android dpino (n=dpino@cm217166.red91-117.mundo-r.com) |
| 21:23.32 | RyeBrye | went on a DL orgy |
| 21:23.36 | vol | heh |
| 21:23.47 | *** part/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@144.174.57.3) |
| 21:23.53 | jasta | zhobbs: i looked at the code and it doesn't seem too weird |
| 21:24.13 | jasta | i had begun to doubt whether the android source matches the app that is installed on the g1 |
| 21:24.36 | *** part/#android AttractiveApe (n=phil@office.gossamer-threads.com) |
| 21:25.31 | unix_lappy | RyeBrye: lol, you have space after install 49 apps? |
| 21:25.56 | *** join/#android AttractiveApe (n=phil@office.gossamer-threads.com) |
| 21:26.02 | *** part/#android AttractiveApe (n=phil@office.gossamer-threads.com) |
| 21:26.03 | RyeBrye | How does the T-mobile billing you for AIM messages work out? Is the piece that sends AIM messages in the IM client set to go through a specific server or somethign? |
| 21:26.21 | RyeBrye | unix_lappy - I had just done a factory wipe, so I was re-installing everything :) |
| 21:26.43 | vol | RyeBrye: if it doesn't go through the data service I would be very surprised indeed, so I would expect it to be free |
| 21:27.38 | unix_lappy | still, 49 apps seems a little too much and regardless would fill things up. |
| 21:27.47 | Disconnect | vol: it goes through data, but its not free. (well, people go back and forth. on other tmob phones it bills as an sms.) |
| 21:27.55 | vol | orly? |
| 21:28.28 | vol | unix_lappy: I have 62 items in my menu. |
| 21:28.31 | Disconnect | ok i'd love to look that up real quick btu my f'ing laptop is going crazy. |
| 21:28.36 | Disconnect | anyway :) goog it |
| 21:28.37 | vol | Admitted a few of them are apps from work / personal development |
| 21:28.43 | vol | but still. |
| 21:29.50 | RyeBrye | Disconnect - so on the G1 it doesn't charge AIM messages as if they were SMS? That was one thing that wasn't ever made too clear either way |
| 21:30.13 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: i think it does. at least, the fine print claims it does. |
| 21:30.42 | RyeBrye | Ok. Even if they go over my wifi? that seems a little ridiculous |
| 21:30.47 | *** join/#android dustym (n=dustym@static-129-44-56-112.ny325.east.verizon.net) |
| 21:30.54 | Disconnect | yep |
| 21:31.00 | RyeBrye | should send T-mobile a bill for every message his phone sends out over his wifi |
| 21:31.40 | vol | wait, seriously? It's not billing me for XMPP messages, is it? |
| 21:31.44 | vol | oh shi |
| 21:31.55 | RyeBrye | Not for google talk ones |
| 21:32.00 | Disconnect | vol: not for gtalk but supposedly its doing it for the others. |
| 21:32.05 | vol | ugh |
| 21:32.05 | RyeBrye | vol - you can go online and check your current billing details and see what it says |
| 21:32.25 | RyeBrye | vol - go look at the bill for this month under "current usage" and see for sure what it's doing - I'm curious to know if they show up like SMS or not |
| 21:32.33 | RyeBrye | you have to use to popup to switch to "messaging" iirc |
| 21:32.38 | vol | hmm |
| 21:32.38 | sfuentes | xmpp is not billed |
| 21:37.00 | vol | interesting. |
| 21:37.04 | vol | I'm still not billed for data? |
| 21:37.15 | Disconnect | "within reason" iirc |
| 21:37.40 | Disconnect | was 1g, now its "excessive" |
| 21:37.42 | wasabi | So has anybody been writing about their experiences getting a standard linux distro booting on the device? |
| 21:38.04 | Disconnect | ..has anybody been getting a standard linux distro booting? |
| 21:38.19 | Disconnect | thats kinda a perquisite for writing about it :) |
| 21:38.33 | kRutOn | There was a guy that wrote about installing Debian |
| 21:38.49 | Disconnect | its not installed, its chrooted in a loopback mount on the sd. |
| 21:39.02 | Disconnect | thats a couple steps down from livecd even :) |
| 21:39.44 | wasabi | Yeah. Somebody had Debian booting. |
| 21:40.01 | vol | jej |
| 21:40.02 | wasabi | really? |
| 21:40.04 | wasabi | no way. |
| 21:40.04 | vol | *heh |
| 21:40.07 | Disconnect | see above. they didn't have it booting. they had it chrooted. |
| 21:40.13 | wasabi | That's retartded. |
| 21:40.15 | wasabi | Why even announce that |
| 21:40.21 | wasabi | Thats equiv to "I have root" |
| 21:40.40 | Disconnect | although everyone seems to be calling that "booted" or "ported" :/ |
| 21:40.59 | kRutOn | well, you have to compile it for the ARM... :-) |
| 21:41.01 | Disconnect | oh its saurik. http://www.saurik.com/id/10 |
| 21:41.19 | wasabi | That's dumb. |
| 21:41.25 | Disconnect | kRutOn: ..why? |
| 21:41.34 | Disconnect | its already got an armel port |
| 21:42.37 | kRutOn | Okay, he has an image, but normally you'd just have to compile the whole thing because there are several options when doing ARM stuff |
| 21:42.52 | wasabi | Not really. |
| 21:42.54 | wasabi | Armel runs. |
| 21:43.03 | wasabi | All he's doing is debootstrapping that. |
| 21:43.53 | kRutOn | Have you compiled Linux for an ARM target before? I'm just saying that there isn't one standard tree because there are a couple options depending on what the hardware supports. |
| 21:44.04 | wasabi | Sure there is. Armeb and armel. |
| 21:44.14 | Disconnect | right. the hardware does armel in this case. no compiling needed. |
| 21:44.43 | vol | Ah, ok, I am getting billed for it, it just wasn't part of that cycle. |
| 21:44.53 | vol | Hmm, forgot to ask whether AIM costs for SMS or something |
| 21:45.23 | wasabi | I'd sort of expect somebody to have listed all the binary only bits on the device by this point. |
| 21:45.34 | wasabi | And explained what changes in the kernel they made, and what missing drivers we'll have to fight with. |
| 21:45.43 | kRutOn | uh-huh.. what about ELF vs. FLAT, no-FPU vs FPU, etc |
| 21:45.59 | wasabi | http://wiki.debian.org/ArmEabiPort |
| 21:46.18 | wasabi | FPU is emulated in kernel. |
| 21:46.38 | wasabi | Oh, Is ee what you mean though. |
| 21:46.54 | wasabi | And so Debian is making decisions about what to do for what packages. |
| 21:46.59 | wasabi | Like they do for non arm stuff. |
| 21:46.59 | Disconnect | istr the fpu stuff is handled in glibc. |
| 21:47.31 | Ramblurr | is it possible to generate radial gradients using the xml <gradient> tag? |
| 21:48.10 | geist | both actually. if you run a fpu instruction the kernel can emulate it |
| 21:48.17 | geist | but it's really slow, the best bet is never to emit them |
| 21:48.20 | geist | which the compiler will do |
| 21:48.28 | geist | that's only just slow |
| 21:49.02 | vol | I really find it bizarre that the FPU is emulated |
| 21:49.23 | geist | why? |
| 21:49.23 | wasabi | It's emulated when not available in hardware. Does the G1's hardware have a FPU? Guessing so. |
| 21:49.28 | geist | it does not |
| 21:49.32 | wasabi | Oh? |
| 21:49.41 | geist | for some reason QC picked the absolute crappiest arm11 you can get |
| 21:49.43 | Disconnect | i'd be surprised if it did, really |
| 21:49.52 | vol | I'd have paid another $10 for an FPU :P |
| 21:49.56 | geist | most arm11s have it, but it's technically an option when you license the core |
| 21:49.58 | vol | probably would have made things absolutely fly |
| 21:50.15 | geist | this is the only cpu family i know if that didn't include it |
| 21:50.19 | Disconnect | vol: yah but the problem is, nobody else would. and you lose some compatibility. |
| 21:50.22 | geist | it's probably a die size problem more than anything else |
| 21:50.23 | zhobbs | jasta: not able to reproduce that remote service issue in my small demo app |
| 21:50.31 | Disconnect | its a standard for arm to have no fpu and suck ass :) |
| 21:50.39 | jasta | hmm, lame |
| 21:50.46 | geist | the more modern arm11+s almost always have fpus |
| 21:50.47 | Disconnect | (suck ass @ fp math i mean) |
| 21:50.50 | geist | *except* this one |
| 21:50.54 | Disconnect | not in the consumer devices. |
| 21:50.58 | geist | sure they do |
| 21:51.02 | geist | arm11s |
| 21:51.05 | zhobbs | jasta: so back the drawing board on my problem |
| 21:51.11 | geist | i know of no other arm11 that does't have an fpu |
| 21:51.17 | Disconnect | at least on linux, only time i've seen an arm with fpu being sold was an option on the various viper boards. |
| 21:51.22 | geist | mx31, all the omaps, etc |
| 21:51.34 | Disconnect | but that doesn't really count for "consumer devices" |
| 21:51.39 | geist | what? |
| 21:51.47 | geist | zune, treos dont count? |
| 21:51.54 | geist | iphone? |
| 21:52.00 | geist | i hear that people use those |
| 21:52.12 | Disconnect | viper doesn't count, but feel free to get all indignant. its funny. |
| 21:52.23 | Disconnect | and seriously, nobody uses the zune. :) |
| 21:52.31 | vol | Zune? |
| 21:52.32 | vol | srsly? |
| 21:52.33 | geist | i'm just saying, pretty much every real arm11 that ships has a fpu |
| 21:52.39 | geist | *except* the one based on the msm cpus |
| 21:52.42 | geist | it sucks |
| 21:54.09 | Disconnect | actually.. http://www.managedobjects.com.au/2008/4/9/fixed-point-arithmetic-on-the-iphone says no fpu |
| 21:54.16 | geist | it has one |
| 21:54.16 | kRutOn | Maybe we'll get a device based on NVidia's embedded SoC |
| 21:54.20 | geist | i guarantee it |
| 21:54.44 | wasabi | Update: Thanks to John in the comments. Looks like iPhone does have an FPU. |
| 21:54.45 | zhobbs | jasta: ahh, I can reproduce it actually.... |
| 21:54.48 | wasabi | ^ on the same page |
| 21:54.55 | Disconnect | geist: 3g or original? |
| 21:55.03 | geist | both |
| 21:55.04 | geist | same cpu |
| 21:55.07 | jasta | zhobbs: can you post the code? |
| 21:55.12 | zhobbs | jasta: sure |
| 21:55.16 | jasta | i'd love to ook at this |
| 21:55.28 | Disconnect | http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1683879&tstart=210 here it is from apple. "Yes, the iPhone has an FPU. It's the VFP, so you can also do SIMD with it." |
| 21:55.38 | geist | right |
| 21:55.48 | geist | it's a standard arm1176 + vfp |
| 21:56.44 | kRutOn | I think the NVidia chip is supposed to be like the iPhone's chip but up to 4 core |
| 21:56.58 | geist | the thumb thing is what clobbers it. since most of the code on the iphone is thumbv1 it can't get to vfp |
| 21:57.10 | geist | idea is that code that actually needs the fpu should be compiled ARM |
| 21:57.21 | geist | which is exactly what they said in that thread |
| 21:59.35 | mikey| | anyone else have problems with the emulator taking forever to load? |
| 22:00.02 | zhobbs | jasta: http://www.helloandroid.com/files/RemoteServiceLeak.tar.gz |
| 22:00.07 | kRutOn | geist: hm, is thumb faster in the general case? |
| 22:00.12 | jasta | fadden: sigh, no dumpsys activity on the G1 :( |
| 22:00.13 | *** join/#android meoblast001 (n=meoblast@dynamic-acs-24-239-93-241.zoominternet.net) |
| 22:00.14 | Disconnect | not forever. couple mins. once it gets locked it stays, you have to hit menu to unlock it and start it going |
| 22:00.28 | geist | kRutOn: on cached starved cpus, it a lot of times is |
| 22:00.37 | zhobbs | jasta: it won't leak if: 1) you don't bind to the service in the first Activity, or 2) change the service to be a local service |
| 22:00.39 | geist | for general code that doesn't need to do really fancy stuff (like fpu) |
| 22:01.06 | geist | most arms, even high end ones, are only running on a 16K/16K cache, so they realy take a hit |
| 22:01.16 | jasta | zhobbs: gah, you used 1.6-isms ;) |
| 22:01.16 | geist | thumb code tends to be somewhat denser, so a lot of times it's a win |
| 22:01.23 | zhobbs | jasta: :) |
| 22:01.36 | geist | when i worked at apple I pushed real hard to get stuff compiled on thumb, and did a bunch of benchmarking to back up my case |
| 22:02.16 | zhobbs | jasta: hopefully I'm just doing something wrong and you can point it out |
| 22:02.28 | geist | android is aggressively using thumb as well, IIRC |
| 22:03.09 | geist | the usual downside to using thumbv1 is there arne't any vfp instructions in it, but it's a moot point on the msm cpu, since it doesn't have an fpu anyway |
| 22:03.17 | *** join/#android duey (n=duey@203-190-208-12.innovationwaikato.co.nz) |
| 22:03.20 | zhobbs | jasta: whoops...forget to do mListeners.finishBroadcast() in that example, will see if that makes a difference |
| 22:03.37 | kRutOn | geist: ah, yeah, I wasn't thinking about the size of the generated code |
| 22:04.18 | geist | that's the key. it's kind of counter intuitive, since thumb code tends to emit more instructions to do the same thing |
| 22:04.30 | geist | it's a further risc on the already risc instruction set |
| 22:04.30 | zhobbs | jasta: didn't make a difference |
| 22:04.35 | jasta | zhobbs: how are you testing for the leak? |
| 22:04.42 | geist | but since it decreases cache pressure, it a lot of times works much better |
| 22:04.44 | jasta | which object in particular is leaking as well? |
| 22:05.01 | zhobbs | jasta: just watching the heap size in the ddms perspective in eclipse |
| 22:05.20 | jasta | ahh, well, that isn't necessarily a leak... |
| 22:05.28 | zhobbs | just launch/close that 2nd activity over and over and watch the heap grow |
| 22:05.35 | jasta | oh ok that is :) |
| 22:05.40 | mikey| | how do you uninstall an app from the emulator? |
| 22:05.46 | jasta | adb uninstall |
| 22:05.55 | vol | or settings -> applications -> uninstall |
| 22:06.00 | jasta | or that |
| 22:06.04 | *** join/#android lresende (n=luckbr19@32.97.110.52) |
| 22:06.09 | zhobbs | jasta: yeah, force GC often...you can try it as local and remote and see the difference... |
| 22:06.29 | *** join/#android KNY (n=KNY@leonidas.kickersny.com) |
| 22:06.31 | *** join/#android unix_lappy (i=614133e2@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-9bb44ab49a57c8b0) |
| 22:06.40 | mikey| | I installed the Term.apk, I tried adb uninstall Term and Term.apk, neither worked |
| 22:06.45 | jasta | ok this will take me a second to setup and test... |
| 22:06.47 | mikey| | I dont know the package name >.< |
| 22:06.56 | jasta | mikey|: adb shell ls /data/app |
| 22:07.00 | kRutOn | mikey|: You can do pm list packages |
| 22:07.10 | kRutOn | mikey|: In the adb shell |
| 22:07.12 | mikey| | can the emulator do that? |
| 22:07.15 | mikey| | ok |
| 22:07.32 | jasta | zhobbs: which process is the leak in? |
| 22:07.36 | jasta | the remote or local? |
| 22:07.39 | zhobbs | local |
| 22:08.07 | herriojr | ok, so I see there are port directed sms |
| 22:08.25 | herriojr | I just don't know how to specify from a server what port to send to the phone |
| 22:11.29 | jasta | zhobbs: well i can say pretty confidently that your usage matches mine to the letter, so i won't be able to suggest any quick fixes :) |
| 22:11.47 | jasta | well, except that i do destroy the remotecallbacklist in the service, but the services ondestroy isnt gonna get called here anyway |
| 22:13.25 | jasta | zhobbs: i guess what we need to look at here is finding the object in particular that's getting leaked |
| 22:13.28 | jasta | and ddms should help there |
| 22:16.43 | *** join/#android filosofico (n=filippo@adsl-ull-66-125.48-151.net24.it) |
| 22:17.14 | jasta | zhobbs: i am unable to show the heap consistently growing, however... |
| 22:17.30 | herriojr | has anyone tested port-directed sms? |
| 22:18.48 | zhobbs | jasta: no? mine starts at just under 32k objects, and if I open/close the 2nd activity a bunch of times I'm now up to 37k objects and GC isn't making it any smaller |
| 22:19.08 | zhobbs | jasta: the heap updates only happen after GC, so you need to force GC |
| 22:19.35 | zhobbs | just under 33k* |
| 22:19.36 | herriojr | I found that there is a broadcast for port-directed with the intent... sendBroadcast(new Intent("android.intent.action.DATA_SMS_RECEIVED", Uri.parse("http://localhost:port")) |
| 22:20.20 | *** join/#android jexe (n=jesseboy@static-64-115-213-78.isp.broadviewnet.net) |
| 22:21.52 | jasta | yeah i know, i just tested that and it didn't happen for me. |
| 22:21.58 | jasta | it did seem to grow, but then it went down again |
| 22:22.11 | jasta | overall consistently growing, but at a crawling pace |
| 22:22.25 | jasta | i will definitely look at this tho |
| 22:22.47 | zhobbs | ok...you on the device or emu? |
| 22:23.42 | *** join/#android nowi (n=nowi@e180229124.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:26.08 | *** join/#android Dralspire (n=dral@81-196.126-70.tampabay.res.rr.com) |
| 22:26.32 | *** join/#android Olipro (n=Olipro@uncyclopedia/Olipro) |
| 22:27.36 | zhobbs | heap grows for me on device and emu |
| 22:27.50 | jasta | im on emu |
| 22:30.12 | *** join/#android eTiger13 (n=eddie@adsl-67-125-22-211.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 22:35.11 | P1ro | anyone know wich wireless chipset the G1 have ? there its no lspci command like ? |
| 22:37.43 | andyross | Unsurprising, given the lack of a pci bus. :) The wifi driver identifies itself as a "TI WLAN Embedded Station" FWIW. |
| 22:38.38 | jbq | I'd say TI 1251 for the wifi part, but what do I know... http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=platform/system/wlan/ti.git;a=summary |
| 22:40.27 | andyross | Heh, I saw the module and just assumed it was proprietary. Looks like that's the source, even. Nice. |
| 22:44.01 | raidfive | is it possible to use the MediaRecorder APIs to simulate the recording of audio on the emulator? |
| 22:44.53 | raidfive | emulator seems to crash on recorder.start() and I'm trying to figure out if I have something wrong or you just can't use these APIs in the emulator |
| 22:49.15 | mikey| | trying to get feedback from my siblings about my app, siblings that know zilch about irc, is pointless :/ |
| 22:49.39 | andyross | First rule of marketing is identifying your market. :) |
| 22:49.44 | Disconnect | heh |
| 22:52.44 | Disconnect | ok so how do i take a screenshot in teh emu? |
| 22:52.47 | *** join/#android mikey- (n=mike@93-96-140-104.zone4.bethere.co.uk) |
| 22:53.02 | mikey- | router rebooted :/ |
| 22:54.43 | Disconnect | how do i take a screenshot in the emu? and what format(s) does the app icon need to provide? |
| 22:56.56 | romainguy_ | you take a screenshot using DDMS |
| 22:57.03 | romainguy_ | works with the device as wel |
| 22:57.45 | romainguy_ | and for the app icon, a 48x48 bitmap (or bigger) |
| 22:59.12 | Disconnect | cool :) |
| 22:59.31 | *** join/#android Slackwise__ (i=Lance@c-71-194-229-18.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 22:59.41 | romainguy_ | if you make it bigger, make it 96x96 |
| 22:59.45 | romainguy_ | the resizing will be better |
| 22:59.48 | trigatch4 | michaelnovakjr: como esta frijoles |
| 23:00.17 | andyross | Is there any advantage to a bigger icon? Does it show up in a larger format somewhere? |
| 23:00.27 | *** join/#android plusminus_ (i=4421a620@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-605cb4808fdf3f34) |
| 23:00.49 | romainguy_ | andyross: no, no advantage |
| 23:01.01 | romainguy_ | you'll make Home startup slower though |
| 23:01.23 | Disconnect | ..thats just what i need, make it still slower :) |
| 23:02.24 | _avatar | romainguy_: did you happen to catch my ListView question a little while ago? |
| 23:02.39 | romainguy_ | nope |
| 23:02.40 | RyeBrye | is off to make an app called "HomeTurtle" that does nothing, but has a 1024x1024 icon |
| 23:02.45 | Disconnect | hehe |
| 23:03.56 | ttuttle | romainguy_: ... |
| 23:03.58 | Disconnect | 320x240 animated gif screenshot of your app |
| 23:03.59 | ttuttle | er |
| 23:03.59 | vol | I suspect they shrink it. |
| 23:04.01 | ttuttle | RyeBrye: ... |
| 23:04.17 | RyeBrye | ? |
| 23:04.33 | ttuttle | RyeBrye: Why would you make an app with a huge icon? |
| 23:04.38 | _avatar | romainguy_: my ListView rows are clickable, and work fine if the user touches them to perform a click. however, the user uses the trackball to select one, then presses the trackball down, the onClickListener isn't fired. i don't remember having this problem in my other app, and i can't find any real code differences. can you remind me if i have to flip a bit somewhere to get this to work? |
| 23:04.52 | _avatar | the rows focus just fine using the trackball, and even display a "pressed" state when the trackball is down |
| 23:04.58 | _avatar | (sorry for repasting my question from a little while ago) |
| 23:05.10 | RyeBrye | ttuttle - because: "andyross: no, no advantage you'll make Home startup slower though" (re: icon size) |
| 23:05.17 | ttuttle | RyeBrye: :P |
| 23:05.23 | RyeBrye | ttuttle - for those who want the home screen to slow down for them |
| 23:05.28 | RyeBrye | you know, and give them time to think while it loads |
| 23:05.31 | ttuttle | RyeBrye: That's already built in to Home :P |
| 23:05.41 | Disconnect | yah :( |
| 23:05.45 | romainguy_ | _avatar: wait, you are using OnClickListeners? |
| 23:06.14 | _avatar | i just have a ListView in a regular Activity, and yeah, was just setting the OnClickListener for the row's View, as returned by BaseAdapter.getView() |
| 23:06.26 | romainguy_ | don't do that :) |
| 23:06.30 | _avatar | uh oh :O |
| 23:06.34 | romainguy_ | use OnListItemClickListener on ListView |
| 23:06.46 | romainguy_ | er |
| 23:06.51 | romainguy_ | OnItemClickListener |
| 23:07.03 | _avatar | looks at the docs |
| 23:07.15 | _avatar | erm. |
| 23:07.19 | _avatar | hangs his head in shame |
| 23:07.19 | _avatar | thanks |
| 23:07.42 | mikey- | is there anyway to listen when a user on an editText field and presses up? |
| 23:07.43 | RyeBrye | just realizes 12 hours has passed since he checked the market... and panics and grabs his phone |
| 23:07.52 | mikey- | in the emulator, the editText loses focus |
| 23:08.40 | romainguy_ | mikey-: use an OnClickListener or an OnTouchListener |
| 23:09.30 | mikey- | will that work when the focus is on the editText and up is pressed? |
| 23:09.42 | *** part/#android dd94300 (n=fdd001@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 23:09.57 | romainguy_ | mikey-: oh sorry, I misunderstood what you meant |
| 23:10.04 | mikey- | i dont have the phone yet, so I cant even test to how it would actually react on the phone, on the emu, the focus moves to another element |
| 23:10.12 | RyeBrye | also realizes it's been more than a day without making a plug for integrating OCR into Android |
| 23:10.14 | romainguy_ | the phone behaves like the emulator |
| 23:10.17 | RyeBrye | hmm.. a receipt tracking application - now if only there was OCR in the platform - that would be even sweeter :) |
| 23:10.40 | _avatar | romainguy_: my trackball click is working well now. :) |
| 23:10.42 | _avatar | thanks |
| 23:10.54 | RyeBrye | Has anyone sniffed out how that iPhone audio search app works? |
| 23:11.05 | Disconnect | you mean shazam? its already ported |
| 23:11.11 | RyeBrye | No, the one that does google |
| 23:11.25 | RyeBrye | You say stuff like "Find rabbid corn" and it returns search results for rabbit porn |
| 23:11.42 | Disconnect | infobot: logs |
| 23:11.43 | infobot | All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. |
| 23:12.16 | *** part/#android famast (n=famast@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 23:12.17 | RyeBrye | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:12.21 | RyeBrye | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:12.54 | vol | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:13.06 | vol | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:13.17 | Cedric2 | s/infobot/vol |
| 23:13.23 | vol | :< |
| 23:13.24 | Cedric2 | Ah darn infobot is asleep |
| 23:13.29 | zhobbs | can you search the logs with infobot? |
| 23:13.45 | Cedric2 | Ah it probably only does the substitution when it's request by the person that made the comment |
| 23:13.47 | RyeBrye | Cedric2 - I think it only does the s/ on stuff you say |
| 23:13.51 | mikey- | mmm..time to catch up on tv shows me thinks |
| 23:13.54 | mikey- | laters |
| 23:13.55 | *** part/#android mikey- (n=mike@93-96-140-104.zone4.bethere.co.uk) |
| 23:13.58 | RyeBrye | s/think/know/ |
| 23:14.12 | *** join/#android Lieutenant (n=Lieutena@70.251.108.34) |
| 23:14.25 | Cedric2 | s/request/requested |
| 23:14.30 | zhobbs | infobot: help |
| 23:14.31 | Cedric2 | infobot hates me |
| 23:14.32 | infobot | yes. |
| 23:14.54 | rwhitby | Cedric2: you forgot the terminating / |
| 23:15.06 | Lieutenant | what does it mean by "this channel may now be logged on the web" ? |
| 23:15.20 | vol | s/</>/ |
| 23:15.21 | armooo | RyeBrye: this is all i have about the voice search http://waxy.org/2008/11/deconstructing_google_mobiles_voice_search_on_the_iphone/ |
| 23:15.21 | vol | testing |
| 23:15.25 | vol | ah. |
| 23:15.27 | rwhitby | Lieutenant: there are at least three different sites that are logging this channel |
| 23:15.31 | rwhitby | !logs |
| 23:15.33 | Cedric2 | s/request/requested/ |
| 23:15.46 | rwhitby | Cedric2: it also only works on the last thing you said |
| 23:15.58 | vol | s/\./!/ |
| 23:16.01 | Cedric2 | infobot is a bit braindead |
| 23:16.09 | Cedric2 | s/a bit/very/ |
| 23:16.15 | Cedric2 | rests his case |
| 23:16.43 | *** join/#android Lieu10ant (n=Lieu10an@ppp-70-251-108-34.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) |
| 23:17.06 | Lieutenant | oh i see. |
| 23:17.29 | Lieu10ant | im typing on my G1! |
| 23:17.58 | Disconnect | i'm typing on my wii! |
| 23:18.03 | Disconnect | ..wait, thats not right. |
| 23:18.11 | Disconnect | s/on/with/ |
| 23:18.17 | Disconnect | i'm typing -with- my wii. thats more like it. |
| 23:18.22 | *** join/#android spearce (n=spearce@nat/google/x-6ee03a7532109c8c) |
| 23:19.37 | P1ro | have anyone any clue if the wifi of the G1 can support injection ? |
| 23:19.44 | *** join/#android Dougie187 (n=doug@68.35.245.156) |
| 23:19.52 | jasta | hey dougie |
| 23:19.58 | Dougie187 | Hey |
| 23:19.59 | Dougie187 | hows it going? |
| 23:20.06 | jasta | good, doing some tweaking :) |
| 23:20.12 | jasta | squashing little bugs |
| 23:20.16 | RyeBrye | armooo - interesting. Sounds like they are doing something clever / tricky in that app |
| 23:20.18 | Dougie187 | nice |
| 23:20.25 | Dougie187 | bugs deserve to be squashed |
| 23:20.28 | Disconnect | RyeBrye: app? |
| 23:20.35 | RyeBrye | http://waxy.org/2008/11/deconstructing_google_mobiles_voice_search_on_the_iphone/ |
| 23:22.06 | *** join/#android Leeds (n=richardc@219.73.57.22) |
| 23:22.23 | Disconnect | cool |
| 23:22.29 | RyeBrye | armooo - I just sent that link to a friend who is a PhD in information theory. If anyone can pick apart what kind of data can be sent in those files, he might be able to... if he feels like it |
| 23:22.52 | Dougie187 | jasta: what app are you working on now? Still email? or back to five? |
| 23:22.54 | *** join/#android philsw__ (n=phil@124.168.43.126) |
| 23:27.44 | Leeds | well, a night of charging didn't seem to help |
| 23:27.49 | jasta | Dougie187: back to five |
| 23:28.00 | jasta | been aggressively changing the UI and polishing |
| 23:28.01 | Dougie187 | awesome, you get everything done on email that you wanted? |
| 23:28.16 | jasta | not quite yet, i need to revisit and squash a few bugs soon |
| 23:28.23 | jasta | and finish separating the processes |
| 23:28.28 | Dougie187 | thats cool. |
| 23:28.33 | Dougie187 | at least you have a game plan |
| 23:29.12 | RyeBrye | How does sqlite perform on the G1? - Would a table with 2k rows be ok? |
| 23:29.50 | RyeBrye | I know it's dependent on the tables, but something with say - a dozen columns of varchar data |
| 23:30.37 | vol | I'm sure that's just fine. |
| 23:30.41 | RyeBrye | i.e. order by operations... etc |
| 23:31.07 | RyeBrye | Yeah, someone said they brought the G1 to its knees importing 1200 bookmarks, so that made me wonder - but I can't imagine 2k rows being too hard |
| 23:31.22 | vol | yeah, I think that involves complicated parsing more than sql |
| 23:31.30 | vol | you have to load up an XML parsing engine, etc. |
| 23:31.47 | vol | you could always just try it. |
| 23:32.07 | RyeBrye | Oh, yeah - I will have to parse XML to populate my sqllite db - but I assume that will take effort - but that's the reason why I'd use the Db woudl be to avoid having to reparse that file again |
| 23:32.22 | *** part/#android Terdhex (n=fes004@host-208-68-238-61.biznesshosting.net) |
| 23:32.23 | vol | for(int i = 0; i < 2000; i++) { sqlStatement = "INSERT INTO FOO('x','" + i + "');"; } |
| 23:32.24 | RyeBrye | is tinkering with a geocaching app that would handle large sets of the gpx pocket query files |
| 23:33.11 | RyeBrye | I'm hoping that I can be lazy and use XMLBeans with decent performance to import it all - since xmlbeans takes all of 30 seconds to generate really nice typed objects that get pulled from the xml when they are requested |
| 23:33.37 | RyeBrye | well, xmlbeans takes not 30 seconds to do it - but it takes 30 seconds to set up an xmlbeans based parser |
| 23:35.42 | Disconnect | importing bookmarks? |
| 23:36.58 | gambler__ | RyeBrye, there is a lib called XStream which does that and is really nice to use |
| 23:37.06 | *** join/#android Slackwise (n=Lance@c-71-194-229-18.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:37.18 | RyeBrye | gambler__ - I'll look at that one - is it android specific? |
| 23:37.30 | gambler__ | no just java |
| 23:38.23 | RyeBrye | gambler__ - does it generate it all from an .xsd file? that's what I like about xmlbeans... you point it at the xsd files and you are basically done |
| 23:39.22 | gambler__ | RyeBrye, from the object |
| 23:39.56 | Lieutenant | can i download .jar games for the G1 or no? |
| 23:39.58 | gambler__ | it might do that too but I havent checked it out |
| 23:40.04 | gambler__ | Lieutenant, no |
| 23:40.09 | RyeBrye | gambler__ - oh, gotcha. I'm in the opposite situation. I have an existing XML I Just need to suck data from |
| 23:41.05 | Lieutenant | k |
| 23:41.09 | Disconnect | Lieutenant: yes kinda. j2me runner app runs them |
| 23:41.17 | Lieutenant | oh, i see. |
| 23:41.24 | Lieutenant | cause i was lookin at the G2 phone |
| 23:41.32 | Lieutenant | and it said it could run .jar apps |
| 23:41.54 | Disconnect | what said? cuz it lied. that app lets you kinda run them but its not great. |
| 23:42.04 | Lieutenant | or something like that. |
| 23:42.07 | Leeds | the G2 is a China special, vapourware for now |
| 23:42.21 | Lieutenant | http://www.mysciphone.com/G2Specia.asp |
| 23:42.23 | Disconnect | oh g2 not g1. yah. |
| 23:42.29 | Lieutenant | yeah |
| 23:42.33 | Disconnect | its got no kb except android doesn't support onscreen kb. so..... |
| 23:42.45 | Disconnect | yah good luck with that. |
| 23:42.49 | Lieutenant | lol |
| 23:42.55 | Disconnect | and isn't it supposed to be super cheap? |
| 23:43.53 | Disconnect | "Google Search, Google Maps, Gmail, YouTube, Google SMS, GOOG-411,Blogger, Google Calendar, Picasa Web Albums, Google Notebook, Google Reader, Google Docs, Google News, iGoogle" |
| 23:43.54 | Lieutenant | no clue |
| 23:43.59 | Disconnect | great. so it ships with a browser. |
| 23:44.07 | Disconnect | and a list of apps from google labs. |
| 23:44.19 | Lieutenant | even better, it has Google Docs!! when is G1 getting those? |
| 23:44.22 | Disconnect | and google chrome. wow. its not just vaporware its totally crack-addled |
| 23:44.22 | Lieutenant | pissing me off.... |
| 23:44.42 | Disconnect | and office docs |
| 23:45.00 | Disconnect | android "home edition" ahhahaha this thing is such a joke, the farther i read the better it gets |
| 23:45.01 | Lieutenant | yeah, why does it seem like it has so much more functionality than our G1's ? |
| 23:45.11 | Lieutenant | whaa? |
| 23:45.39 | Lieutenant | u don't like that it has google chrome, google docs and reads microsoft office documents? |
| 23:45.58 | Lieutenant | and a 4 megapixel camera! |
| 23:46.08 | Disconnect | http://www.mysciphone.com/G2Accessories.asp |
| 23:46.21 | Disconnect | don't forget to downdload some drivers |
| 23:46.24 | spikebike | Lieutenant gdocs doesn't work with the g1 |
| 23:46.56 | spikebike | but yeah I'd expect incoherent engrish with a chinese phone |
| 23:47.10 | Lieutenant | i knwo it doesn't work with the G1, but it works on the G2. i was wondering why it doesn't work on the G1. |
| 23:47.37 | Disconnect | ..because the g2 is made of crack and fairies and the g1 is made of actual hardware. |
| 23:47.41 | spikebike | I suspect it might work if I faked the agent |
| 23:47.43 | spikebike | true |
| 23:47.52 | Disconnect | same reason the g2 can play duke nukem forever and the g1 can't. |
| 23:48.19 | Lieutenant | shouldn't google be making a google docs app for the g1 or what are they thinking about that? does anyone know anything about it? |
| 23:48.35 | spikebike | or at least a compatible website |
| 23:48.48 | Disconnect | right now they're more interested in making basic things like email and camera work. |
| 23:48.49 | Lieutenant | yeah :( |
| 23:49.05 | *** join/#android cbeust_ (n=cbeust@72.14.224.1) |
| 23:49.05 | *** mode/#android [+o cbeust_] by ChanServ |
| 23:49.14 | spikebike | seems like chrome basically means they are looking to avoid apps on devices |
| 23:49.28 | spikebike | gears + webapps seems to be the direction |
| 23:49.34 | spikebike | (i.e. chrome) |
| 23:52.21 | Leeds | Lieutenant: I'd be happy if my G1 booted... |
| 23:52.33 | spikebike | oh leeds I had to sleep.. |
| 23:52.35 | spikebike | any news? |
| 23:52.40 | Leeds | no change :-( |
| 23:52.50 | spikebike | won't boot without SD? |
| 23:52.59 | Leeds | won't boot full stop (period) |
| 23:53.09 | spikebike | recovery mode? |
| 23:53.32 | Leeds | with SD, without SD, with SIM, without SIM, not recovery mode, no safe mode... it'll go to the HTC bootloader, or stick on the G1 logo - and that's it |
| 23:54.18 | spikebike | where did you get the phone? Can you return it? |
| 23:54.48 | Leeds | got it from a semi-dodgy shop... will be taking it back there today, expecting a painful argument |
| 23:54.59 | spikebike | leeds keep me posted |
| 23:55.07 | RyeBrye | Leeds - did you get root on it or anything? |
| 23:55.16 | cbeust_ | Not sure how they could argue in front of a phone that doesn't boot |
| 23:55.18 | Leeds | RyeBrye: sure I did |
| 23:55.49 | Leeds | cbeust_: it's a very gray import... they might try to argue I've had it more than a week, it's not their problem, for example |
| 23:56.00 | RyeBrye | Leeds - it it a T-mobile US phone? |
| 23:56.02 | cbeust_ | Oh it's not in the US? |
| 23:56.17 | Leeds | it's a T-Mobile US phone, but I'm in Hong Kong |
| 23:56.34 | RyeBrye | Leeds - did you do anything to screw it up? |
| 23:56.37 | cbeust_ | Ah ok, might be more tricky indeed |
| 23:56.43 | cbeust_ | It never worked or you altered it? |
| 23:56.45 | Leeds | RyeBrye: nope |
| 23:56.56 | Leeds | it worked fine for a week, I rebooted it yesterday and it didn't come back up |
| 23:57.07 | RyeBrye | Leeds - will it boot into the android recovery mode? Power + Home button? |
| 23:57.23 | Leeds | <Leeds> with SD, without SD, with SIM, without SIM, not recovery mode, no safe mode... it'll go to the HTC bootloader, or stick on the G1 logo - and that's it |
| 23:57.47 | Leeds | I think the only way to fix it is going to be reflashing from the bootloader |
| 23:57.59 | RyeBrye | You will need to get a signed .NBH file to do that |
| 23:58.22 | RyeBrye | at least, that's how other HTC phones work |
| 23:58.31 | spikebike | think the store has that? |
| 23:58.35 | Leeds | no chance |
| 23:58.47 | RyeBrye | I don't even know if T-mobile US stores have that |
| 23:58.54 | RyeBrye | HTC likely has that |
| 23:58.55 | spikebike | doesn't hurt to ask |
| 23:59.00 | Leeds | they'll have to send it back up their supply chain |
| 23:59.29 | Leeds | spikebike: it's a tiny little stacked-to-the-ceiling phone store in a mall full of them, there isn't a chance in hell they can fix it themselves |
| 23:59.30 | spikebike | although to be honest |
| 23:59.46 | spikebike | seems like there might be a fault in the phone |
| 23:59.50 | spikebike | it shouldn't just "do" that |