| 00:35.51 | *** part/#brlcad alecs1 (i=alex@193.170.134.154) |
| 02:40.54 | starseeker | Ralith: any luck with QT/Ogre? |
| 02:42.08 | Ralith | starseeker: not quite yet; there turned out to be more posisbly relevant functions than I expected. |
| 02:42.11 | Ralith | working through them now. |
| 02:43.25 | Ralith | isn't quite sure how qgraphicsscene and qgraphicsview relate |
| 02:43.34 | Ralith | and I haven't worked out how to use gdb reliably on C++ yet. |
| 02:46.19 | ``Erik | gdb still isn't c++ friendly? O.o |
| 02:47.13 | Ralith | I dunno, I probably am just misusing it |
| 02:47.26 | ``Erik | http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~jos/pasp/Dealing_C_gdb.html |
| 02:47.39 | Ralith | it demangles names and basic stuff like that fine |
| 02:47.44 | Ralith | I just have trouble getting it to break on class member functions |
| 02:47.59 | ``Erik | line# breaks don't do it? |
| 02:48.14 | Ralith | huh? |
| 02:48.16 | Ralith | oh |
| 02:48.19 | Ralith | didn't try that >_> |
| 02:48.23 | ``Erik | heh |
| 02:48.28 | Ralith | didn't know gdb could do that, even. |
| 02:48.39 | ``Erik | yeah, break file.cxx:42 |
| 02:48.39 | Ralith | first, though, food! |
| 02:48.42 | Ralith | cool, thanks |
| 02:48.59 | ``Erik | tends to use line # more than function name |
| 02:49.06 | Ralith | probably will now that he knows it |
| 03:05.16 | Ralith | ugh, qt builds slow. |
| 03:08.39 | starseeker | yeah, line # breaking works better for me in c++ |
| 03:09.15 | Ralith | it's packages like qt that I wish would use cmake |
| 03:09.19 | Ralith | so I'd have some idea how far along it was |
| 03:11.26 | louipc | ls |
| 03:11.28 | louipc | bah |
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| 03:54.23 | Ralith | reaids paradigms of artificial intelligence programming while he waits. |
| 03:54.34 | Ralith | trace is a really neat function :D |
| 04:18.37 | Ralith | starseeker: line number breaking works within every instance of a class (for non-static funcs), right? |
| 05:28.13 | Ralith | woo, qt rebuilt! |
| 05:54.52 | Ralith | argh. |
| 05:56.04 | Ralith | it looks like I'm going to have a very hard time building with a custom Qt without uninstalling my system one |
| 05:58.32 | Ralith | tries a really dirty hack |
| 06:04.11 | Ralith | damn. |
| 06:13.22 | Ralith | hack seems to work, but I'm not getting anywhere with g3d. |
| 06:30.17 | *** join/#brlcad elena (n=elena@92.86.0.28) |
| 06:31.19 | elena | hi |
| 06:32.06 | Ralith | hullo |
| 06:34.08 | Ralith | well crap |
| 06:34.16 | Ralith | that just about exhausts my Qt modding ideas |
| 06:34.20 | Ralith | no luck there either |
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| 11:35.27 | d-lo | Merning all. *READREADREAD* |
| 11:42.39 | d-lo | Ralith / madant: Was just annoyed that ogre had a dep to boost, thats all. Personal preference. |
| 11:54.35 | d-lo | Ralith: Thanks for dropping a few comments here and there in irc and the wiki. Keep that wiki log going, so we/I can track whats going on. It will also help people who want to chip in advice not tell you something you already tried. I know that frustrates me when people do that :/ |
| 12:15.50 | ``Erik | d-lo: the server side thingymajigger you were looking at was projectdorkstar? (saw mention of someone looking to combine panda3d with dorkstar) |
| 12:16.17 | d-lo | what thingymajigger? |
| 12:16.23 | ``Erik | server side game mgmt |
| 12:17.16 | d-lo | Hrm, I am at a loss. I don't remember looking at projectdorkstar... |
| 12:17.22 | ``Erik | darkstar, rather |
| 12:17.23 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 12:17.33 | ``Erik | http://projectdarkstar.com/ |
| 12:17.42 | d-lo | ah, havne't really looked at that in a while. |
| 12:20.03 | ``Erik | *shrug* just noticed it mentioned and went "huh, that looks real familiar" |
| 12:20.25 | d-lo | kk, thanks! I will book mark it and look for that panda3d reference. |
| 12:26.09 | ``Erik | does shadowbane do mob ai on the server? |
| 12:26.34 | ``Erik | or, did it, rather O:-) |
| 12:26.52 | d-lo | Heh, calling it AI would be rather generous. |
| 12:28.25 | ``Erik | heh, well, yeah, but you know what I mean |
| 12:28.56 | d-lo | a bit. |
| 12:29.15 | d-lo | Its one of the major issues we are looking to rectify with the Emu. |
| 12:29.38 | ``Erik | <-- was pondering how to 'share the love' of ai computation time with clients that could arbitrarily disconnect |
| 12:29.55 | d-lo | Oh, so kinda like AI at home? |
| 12:30.00 | d-lo | err AI@Home? |
| 12:30.28 | ``Erik | if you have a group of half a dozen people whacking on a baddy and someone crashes or disconnects when they're housing the ai for it, it'd be retarded for the mob to simply freeze up for the other players |
| 12:31.45 | ``Erik | game ai has to respond fairly quickly and have some randomness, so I d'no if packet bundling across multiple hosts like an @home is pragmatic |
| 12:32.26 | _clock_ | I think Artifical Intelligence is not a good approach to model human behaviour |
| 12:32.29 | ``Erik | but doing ai for 10000 mobs, plus all the message management, plus state persistence, don't wanna overload the server |
| 12:32.30 | d-lo | What about redundant calcs? 2 or 3 of the same calc on machines. First one to return a result is used. |
| 12:32.44 | _clock_ | I think we won't move from place until we master AS - Artificial Stupidity. |
| 12:33.10 | ``Erik | if(random() > .5) mob->special1(); else mob->special2(); <-- cuz of that |
| 12:33.13 | ``Erik | ? |
| 12:33.28 | ``Erik | sorry, misread |
| 12:33.52 | d-lo | Yeah, I mistyped a bit too. I ment several different machines performing same calc for redundancy. |
| 12:34.25 | ``Erik | hm, latency issues, I guess... two machines calc and start doing their thang, send to the server to redistribute, do you wait the .8 seconds on all machines for the mob to hop to the appropriate state? |
| 12:34.31 | *** join/#brlcad docelic__ (n=docelic@78.134.207.99) |
| 12:35.37 | ``Erik | _clock_ we're not talking about making a single smart 'ai', we're talking about scaling to a buttload of stupid videogame ai's :D mmorpg style |
| 12:37.24 | _clock_ | ``Erik: again I contribute to a discussion I haven't read much about :) |
| 12:38.43 | d-lo | I would imagine there would have to be minimum Calculational ability and network latency requirements in order for a 'node' to be accepted on the AI Compute 'cloud' |
| 12:38.48 | ``Erik | mebbe the 'repeatably random' notion from upstairs actually DOES have a practical use |
| 12:39.42 | ``Erik | custom random function, each mob has its own seed/state for the function... |
| 12:40.18 | ``Erik | with an occasional key packet to make sure everything is sync'd up |
| 12:41.04 | ``Erik | or mebbe it's not the pig and I'm burning cycles thinking about the wrong thing :D |
| 12:41.28 | d-lo | Server side has final say on the sync for the simultaneous calcs, correct? |
| 12:41.39 | ``Erik | server is never wrong |
| 12:41.54 | ``Erik | to prevent abuse |
| 12:42.59 | d-lo | Right, but putting AI in the hands of the 'Enemy' still makes me quesy. |
| 12:43.12 | ``Erik | having the clients periodically send "this is what I think is happening" packets and having the server do a quick check might be an effective way of rooting out cheaters |
| 12:43.50 | ``Erik | "wow, you sent a dozen bunk state packets in the last 60 seconds, why don't you take a breather for an hour disconnect();" |
| 12:45.01 | ``Erik | meh, an amusing thought exercise, but optimizing vapor in the end :/ |
| 12:45.27 | ``Erik | didja get time to work on your server component over the weekend? |
| 13:00.52 | d-lo | sorry, got disctracted... 'server component' ? SBEmu or GS? |
| 13:06.37 | ``Erik | sbemu |
| 13:06.46 | ``Erik | it's my rdo, soz I'm not thinking work O:-) |
| 13:06.54 | d-lo | Right on. |
| 13:07.04 | d-lo | I am at work and having trouble thinking work. :) |
| 13:07.09 | d-lo | A bit. |
| 13:07.13 | d-lo | Mostly infrastructure now. |
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| 13:07.41 | d-lo | Seeing as I have found myself in the Dev Team Lead, Design Team Lead and overall PM..... |
| 13:08.05 | d-lo | annoying since that means less time for code. |
| 13:08.05 | ``Erik | yeah, been there, done that heh |
| 13:08.38 | d-lo | I think the 4th weekend was poor timing for spinning up the SBEmu project, but thats the way the cards fell. |
| 13:08.45 | ``Erik | I started working on a freebsd driver for nvidia cards long ago, other people joined the cause and I ended up doing less and less code, more and more dealing iwth people and with nvidia |
| 13:08.56 | d-lo | Working to make the Design team as autonomous as possible. |
| 13:09.25 | ``Erik | I assume all the volunteers are code monkeys? |
| 13:10.09 | d-lo | Anyone who doesn't have code skills but are seemingly mature enough to write up a decent Application are being used on the design team. |
| 13:10.21 | d-lo | They are the ones who are going to formalize the existing SB game processess. |
| 13:10.42 | d-lo | aka Class.Race restriction tables, etc. |
| 13:10.53 | d-lo | all that junk that us Devs don't really wanna do :) |
| 13:10.58 | ``Erik | imagines that with an accessable vcs, irc channel and skeleton to start from, it'll be fairly self-organizing |
| 13:11.17 | ``Erik | right, coders aren't glorified data entry clerks O:-) |
| 13:11.45 | d-lo | Thats what I am hoping. Now that the holiday weekend is over, I am hoping things will get rolling. |
| 13:11.49 | ``Erik | "make the target modellers do it, not our problem" "butbutbut" *sigh* :) |
| 13:12.23 | ``Erik | too bad ya picked c++ *duck* :D |
| 13:13.35 | d-lo | lol. We have a good solid plan now. Your comment on Java got me thinking and fired off a discussion on the boards. |
| 13:14.09 | d-lo | Java Crypto doesn't play right with the SB Client, so we need to *at least* have a C/C++/openSSL proxy running in the server suite. |
| 13:14.23 | ``Erik | so that means you're looking to do it in CL using iolib and cl-prevalence (or elephant? or rucksack?) |
| 13:14.25 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:14.56 | d-lo | We've rounded up a good team of Pascal 'grammers and are ready to have at it! =D |
| 13:15.41 | ``Erik | I thought I was clever thinking up an image/event system for fast data storage only to find a java implementation from a few years ago, and a paper from '87 about the idea |
| 13:16.21 | d-lo | doh! |
| 13:16.27 | ``Erik | heh, I've seen people try to write quake style engines in a combination of pascal and assembly... ahhh, the bad old days of efnet #opengl :) |
| 13:16.28 | d-lo | so... did they confirm it was a good idea? |
| 13:17.00 | ``Erik | for a data set that can stay in memory, it's a really nice solution *shrug* |
| 13:17.20 | ``Erik | when you start looking for bigger data sets, replication, etc, it starts falling apart |
| 13:17.58 | ``Erik | but it's sexier than the orm approach |
| 13:18.17 | d-lo | heh, true :) |
| 13:19.44 | ``Erik | http://www.prevayler.org/ |
| 13:26.09 | d-lo | good link. thanks :) |
| 13:28.55 | ``Erik | is somewhat amused that BRL-CAD does not compile on brlcad.org :) |
| 13:29.26 | ``Erik | (c++ template fudgetry in libpc) |
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| 15:29.05 | elena | starseeker? |
| 15:34.03 | d-lo | He's around, what's up? |
| 15:44.41 | elena | hi. |
| 15:44.47 | starseeker | hey elena |
| 15:44.52 | elena | just requesting some help |
| 15:44.56 | starseeker | sure, what's up? |
| 15:45.19 | elena | i need some help with setting up brlcad on the server. |
| 15:45.33 | elena | Erik did it for me yesterday |
| 15:45.53 | starseeker | OK... |
| 15:45.54 | elena | but there's on more variable LD_LIBRARY_PATH that needs to be set. |
| 15:46.16 | starseeker | you mean in the system LD_LIBRARY_PATH/ |
| 15:46.19 | starseeker | ? |
| 15:46.34 | elena | yes. i guess. |
| 15:46.52 | elena | in my account, erik showed me to use export ..... |
| 15:46.53 | starseeker | depending on how you're launching things, you should be able to set that locally |
| 15:46.57 | starseeker | right |
| 15:47.05 | elena | but i need it to work in apache's account, too. |
| 15:47.11 | starseeker | ah |
| 15:47.44 | ``Erik | hrm, php doesn't have a setenv() equivalent? |
| 15:48.06 | ``Erik | (once the migration happens, this problem disappears, btw) |
| 15:48.12 | elena | hi Erik. |
| 15:48.19 | elena | maybe it does. |
| 15:48.27 | starseeker | hands elena to the *BSD guru |
| 15:49.05 | elena | yes. it has something. i just imagined it's better to have it set properly. |
| 15:49.11 | elena | whatever that means :) |
| 15:49.23 | starseeker | the quick fix is probably to tack it onto the system LD_LIBRARY_PATH, but I'm not sure where to do that on BSD and I probably don't have the admin rights anyhow |
| 15:49.35 | elena | so, should I implement it on my side? |
| 15:49.39 | starseeker | (at least, I don't think so...) |
| 15:49.56 | starseeker | elena: If you can set it yourself, that's more robust |
| 15:50.04 | elena | ok. |
| 15:51.01 | elena | thank you. |
| 15:51.30 | elena | and, Erik, thanks again for yesterday. |
| 15:52.51 | ``Erik | np, elena, that's what I'm here for O.o |
| 16:00.27 | ``Erik | ok, I regenerated the ld hints file, it SHOULD work without settig the env variable, I think |
| 16:01.07 | ``Erik | d'no why tcl isn't sharing rpath info with libbu, though :/ |
| 16:01.18 | elena | testing |
| 16:01.29 | elena | yep. it works. |
| 16:01.54 | elena | i'll revert my changes. |
| 16:08.48 | elena | http://more.brlcad.org/ partially working. |
| 16:08.59 | elena | bug: title is not retrieved correctly. |
| 16:09.21 | d-lo | Gotta admit... I like the layout and color scheme! |
| 16:09.31 | elena | bug: raytrace images created in the wrong directory. |
| 16:10.26 | elena | local file selection (ie. uploading through ftp/scp) works, but it's not enabled. |
| 16:10.54 | elena | theme is open source. i like it, too :) |
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| 16:55.00 | starseeker | elena: nifty! |
| 16:58.52 | elena | :) |
| 17:13.09 | ``Erik | green and beige, seems a bit... armyish *duck* :D |
| 17:13.32 | starseeker | neutral and environmentally friendly ;-) |
| 17:13.50 | starseeker | has been watching too much HGTV |
| 17:14.16 | ``Erik | what, the color scheme, or the army? if it's the latter, I might have to explain a few things to ya ;> |
| 17:14.30 | starseeker | heh |
| 17:14.42 | ``Erik | got my bsd hack box running, w00t |
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| 17:47.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03jdoliner * r34975 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/brepintersect.cpp: |
| 17:47.28 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: The first step in the long processes of implementing the methods for keeping |
| 17:47.30 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: track of intersection data we get out in order the reconstruct the mesh later. |
| 17:47.32 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: Implements a class with the specific responsibility of keeping track of the |
| 17:47.34 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: intersections in the triangles to later reconstruct the faces. |
| 17:48.14 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedyII (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) |
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| 19:55.24 | *** join/#brlcad alecs1 (i=alex@193.170.135.119) |
| 19:58.24 | alecs1 | hi, I would like to add some tolerancing information to some brl-cad structures |
| 19:58.53 | alecs1 | the first idea is to just add a pointer to custom data to the primitives |
| 19:59.20 | alecs1 | and then create some data structures for the types of tolerances I might need |
| 19:59.50 | alecs1 | but if there's some plan of how to do it properly I would love to integrate my work with that |
| 20:00.11 | alecs1 | how would you suggest to go about it? |
| 20:01.49 | jdoliner | which structure were you looking at? |
| 20:05.22 | alecs1 | first the rcc |
| 20:06.02 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.99) |
| 20:06.45 | alecs1 | here's the original thread where I asked long ago: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=15b5efbc0904270528tb2ebb13y8110236e67d65439%40mail.gmail.com |
| 20:25.56 | ``Erik | *readreadread* hm, and brlcad answered you... are attributes not sufficient? |
| 20:30.50 | alecs1 | I don't know; variant c) from the reply looked like and attractive and easy way to get accustomed to brl-cad code |
| 20:32.07 | ``Erik | funny, it looks like the least easy to me :D |
| 20:32.35 | ``Erik | a looks like the easiest and most simple to me *shrug* |
| 20:34.36 | alecs1 | look at it from the pov of a guy that doesn't know too much about brl-cad; a programmer's first idea is to just add one more data structure :) |
| 20:34.46 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03Ebautu 07http://brlcad.org * r1539 10/wiki/More_Changelog: July 6 activity. |
| 20:35.23 | ``Erik | 'cept we have to maintain backwards compatability for the saved files |
| 20:38.52 | starseeker | brlcad: I think we found your next car: http://www.wired.com/reviews/product/pr_veyron_convertible |
| 20:41.04 | elena | i open a database in read-only mode. I type title |
| 20:41.15 | elena | and I get "Sorry, this database is READ-ONLY." |
| 20:41.20 | elena | why is that? |
| 20:41.58 | starseeker | I'm guessing bug |
| 20:42.14 | elena | that's in 7.14.9. |
| 20:42.24 | elena | in 7.10.4 works ok. |
| 20:43.07 | starseeker | Bob's on it |
| 20:43.32 | starseeker | Bob's fixed it |
| 20:43.56 | elena | :) |
| 20:44.24 | elena | bob's quick. I should look for a meaner bug :) |
| 20:45.35 | ``Erik | do not anger the bob! |
| 20:47.06 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r34976 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/title.c: Check if read-only only if modifying the title. |
| 20:48.00 | starseeker | possibly the fastest bug turnaround ever :-P |
| 20:48.32 | elena | thanks. now I can go to bed happy. |
| 20:48.38 | elena | bye. |
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| 21:55.20 | Ralith | d-lo: right; just getting a bit discouraged with all the things not working. |
| 21:55.36 | Ralith | Still got some stuff left to test in the qt-hacking area before I move on to the ogre-centric approach, though |
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| 22:29.26 | *** join/#brlcad tegtmeye (n=tegtmeye@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 22:29.46 | tegtmeye | ping brlcad |
| 22:31.37 | ``Erik | he hasn't said anything all day, I think he was heading to some rowing thing u p north for the weekend, he might be chumming or on his way back (or recovering) |
| 22:32.33 | tegtmeye | ot an interesting cad bug |
| 22:33.03 | tegtmeye | os x 10.5 seg fault with two monitors connected |
| 22:33.06 | tegtmeye | works ok with one |
| 22:33.57 | tegtmeye | hear that there is no working version w/10.5 currently? |
| 22:33.59 | ``Erik | funky, my only 10.5 box is my laptop, so no dual head :/ |
| 22:34.02 | tegtmeye | is that correct? |
| 22:34.09 | tegtmeye | jsut found it |
| 22:34.09 | ``Erik | but I thought his desktop was on 10.5 |
| 22:34.22 | tegtmeye | brlcads? |
| 22:34.24 | ``Erik | it works on my laptop *shrug* |
| 22:34.25 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 22:34.51 | tegtmeye | can't find any bugreports for this but someone overthere says its a known issue |
| 22:35.41 | tegtmeye | trying to get it into ports over here |
| 22:37.08 | tegtmeye | I'll track him down tomorrow, thanks |