irclog2html for #bzflag on 20031203

`00:02.06`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`00:02.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey guys`
`00:03.11`	`Death_Barrel`	`~d`
`00:03.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`~q2`
`00:03.40`	`Death_Barrel`	`~qoul`
`00:03.46`	`Death_Barrel`	`~quol`
`00:03.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`~q`
`00:04.32`	`CIA`	`03atupone * 12bzflag/src/bzflag (RobotPlayer.cxx): Same fix done on LocalPlayer to limit explosion vertical speed.`
`00:06.52`	`*** part/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-82-84-96-102.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`00:16.47`	`*** join/#bzflag cniV (~kchan@c211-30-113-108.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`00:21.06`	`Patlabor221`	`cap, you around?`
`00:29.21`	`purple_cow`	`sortof`
`00:29.43`	`Patlabor221`	`just waned your opinion :)`
`00:29.44`	`Patlabor221`	`http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh.png`
`00:30.39`	`purple_cow`	`shiny`
`00:31.00`	`purple_cow`	`the numbers look weird`
`00:34.33`	`Patlabor221`	`that they do`
`00:34.35`	`Patlabor221`	`http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh2.png`
`00:35.19`	`scanline`	`somehow I don't think that gear would function too well`
`00:35.22`	`scanline`	`:)`
`00:35.37`	`Patlabor221`	`well as a speed bump, it would`
`00:36.43`	`Patlabor221`	`http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh3.png`
`00:37.43`	`Patlabor221`	`the entire gear makes it look like a ship wheel for a pirate ship :)`
`00:38.04`	`Patlabor221`	`it odly reminds me of the comodore 64 logo`
`00:39.27`	`scanline`	`well, that's because the gear teeth are shaped funny`
`00:39.40`	`Patlabor221`	`not funny`
`00:39.41`	`Patlabor221`	`real`
`00:39.50`	`Patlabor221`	`I used our cad package gear creation tool :)`
`00:40.02`	`Patlabor221`	`it has adendum and dedendum`
`00:40.48`	`Patlabor221`	`ya think a square one would look better?`
`00:41.03`	`scanline`	`a slightly trapazoidish one would look better`
`00:41.16`	`Patlabor221`	`like with chamferd corners?`
`00:41.32`	`scanline`	`sure, whatever that is :)`
`00:43.10`	`Patlabor221`	`square but with the corners loped off at a 45`
`00:45.24`	`scanline`	`nah, trapezoid would look better`
`00:50.51`	`Patlabor221`	`more like this? http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/gear.png`
`01:02.20`	`scanline`	`sure`
`01:05.34`	`Patlabor221`	`http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh4.png`
`01:14.03`	`scanline`	`yeah, that gear is cooler`
`01:14.15`	`scanline`	`the gear is way too big compared to the tank though`
`01:14.24`	`Patlabor221`	`I concur`
`01:14.31`	`scanline`	`the tank is also kind of hard to make out`
`01:14.34`	`Patlabor221`	`gonna tweak it when I get home`
`01:14.44`	`Patlabor221`	`yes it does not have a clean silouete`
`01:27.28`	`Patlabor221`	`http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh5.png`
`01:27.32`	`Patlabor221`	`just another idea`
`01:33.43`	`KR`	`I liked 3 and 4 best - but make the gear like 50% smaller, so that the tank shape is emphasized :)`
`01:34.10`	`Patlabor221`	`ok I will try that when I get home, thanks`
`01:34.21`	`KR`	`looks cool, though, I like it`
`01:34.37`	`Patlabor221`	`thanks`
`01:34.57`	`Patlabor221`	`one GF2MX as the prize :)`
`01:38.47`	`purple_cow`	`heh`
`01:39.11`	`Patlabor221`	`hah, the KFJ people sent me a catolouge`
`01:42.09`	`Patlabor221`	`cap did you get all the .hack// eps?`
`01:42.21`	`purple_cow`	`i don't think i have any`
`01:42.26`	`purple_cow`	`but i can get them elsewhere`
`01:42.28`	`Patlabor221`	`oh`
`01:42.30`	`purple_cow`	`in dual-audio .ogm`
`01:42.31`	`Patlabor221`	`ok`
`01:42.51`	`*** join/#bzflag Carnage (strayer@dyn216-8-133-252.ADSL.mnsi.net)`
`01:43.06`	`Patlabor221`	`well see I have a DVD enabled machine siting at home with remote access on it, and my friend is gonna try riping stuff with subs`
`01:43.24`	`Patlabor221`	`so was thinking you could rip how you wanted`
`01:43.37`	`Patlabor221`	`I will be building a *nix box for the same thing tonight`
`01:43.52`	`purple_cow`	`well - the best way is to use dvd::rip to create a dual-audio .ogm and then rip the subs separately using the bare transcode + gocr tools`
`01:43.55`	`purple_cow`	`and then merge at the end`
`01:44.20`	`Patlabor221`	`well this .hack only has one audio track`
`01:44.23`	`Patlabor221`	`it's an impirt`
`01:44.29`	`Patlabor221`	`like my noirs`
`01:44.33`	`purple_cow`	`ah`
`01:45.07`	`purple_cow`	`speaking of noir`
`01:45.07`	`purple_cow`	`have you watched more?`
`01:45.09`	`Patlabor221`	`sadly no`
`01:45.15`	`Patlabor221`	`haven't watched anything`
`01:45.20`	`purple_cow`	`loser`
`01:45.30`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah I know`
`01:45.36`	`Patlabor221`	`need more time in the day`
`01:45.56`	`Patlabor221`	`I haven't even watched the DVD of the short that I helped make`
`01:46.04`	`Patlabor221`	`I gotta rip that too`
`01:48.04`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`01:48.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey guys!`
`01:49.29`	`\|tim\|`	`hey Death_Barrel`
`01:49.38`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey dude :)`
`01:49.41`	`Death_Barrel`	`shit`
`01:49.45`	`Death_Barrel`	`my wife is here`
`01:49.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`i gotta get :(`
`01:49.55`	`\|tim\|`	`hehe, ok`
`01:49.56`	`\|tim\|`	`later`
`01:50.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`cu man`
`01:50.17`	`Death_Barrel`	`you and carngae find a match!`
`01:50.23`	`\|tim\|`	`okay`
`01:50.53`	`Death_Barrel`	`i just told carnage :)`
`01:51.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`you guys go whoop some ass ! :D`
`01:51.06`	`Death_Barrel`	`cu tomorrow man :)`
`01:55.57`	`KR`	`~d`
`01:56.11`	`KR`	`~q2`
`02:07.19`	`Carnage`	`~q2`
`02:12.36`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~JeffM@adsl-67-115-245-57.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net)`
`02:12.36`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ`
`02:30.47`	`*** join/#bzflag MrApathyCream (~MeBigFatG@balt-209-163-100-252.qis-dynamic-dialup.coretel.net)`
`02:30.50`	`*** join/#bzflag orchid (~orchid@toronto-hs-64-26-176-100.s-ip.magma.ca)`
`02:31.07`	`orchid`	`~botmail`
`02:31.52`	`MrApathyCream`	`memoserv?`
`02:32.23`	`orchid`	`no, ibot msg me`
`02:32.31`	`orchid`	`said i have botmail`
`02:32.39`	`Patlabor221`	`yes you do :)`
`02:32.51`	`orchid`	`heh`
`02:35.11`	`CIA`	`03dbrosius * 12bzflag/ (BUGS): tup0n3 r0xurs`
`02:37.14`	`*** join/#bzflag captain_proton (~blardebla@navi.cs.colorado.edu)`
`02:37.14`	`*** join/#bzflag cniV (~kchan@c211-30-113-108.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:37.14`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_proton] by tolkien.freenode.net`
`02:37.14`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+bbb !@.dip.t-dialin.net !edelstei@* !@68.111.116.228] by brin.freenode.net`
`02:37.14`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+bbb sussudio!@ gorb!@ cell!@] by brin.freenode.net`
`02:37.37`	`MrApathyCream`	`ibot, seen learner?`
`02:37.41`		`learner is currently on #project24 #bzflag. Has said a total of 1 messages. Is idling for 13h 9m 21s`
`02:40.43`	`learner`	`ibot: seen learner?`
`02:40.44`		`learner is currently on #project24 #bzflag. Has said a total of 2 messages. Is idling for 1s`
`02:40.51`	`MrApathyCream`	`anyone know what learner is smokin? RE: MG fires nonstop`
`02:40.51`	`MrApathyCream`	`?`
`02:41.15`	`learner`	`hrmm`
`02:42.48`	`learner`	`What's their names?`
`02:45.30`	`MrApathyCream`	`the big guy didn't even duck to have that go over his head`
`02:45.31`	`learner`	`oh, yes indeed`
`02:45.33`	`learner`	`"booom"`
`02:46.14`	`MrApathyCream`	`their? names?`
`02:46.20`	`Patlabor221`	`leaner, what think thee? http://p24.bakadigital.com/p24bb/viewtopic.php?p=73#73`
`02:46.52`	`learner`	`Well.. the horsies of course!`
`02:47.55`	`MrApathyCream`	`ah`
`02:48.02`	`MrApathyCream`	`heh`
`02:48.07`	`learner`	`:)`
`02:49.40`	`MrApathyCream`	`Martini No Olive, Restless Eric, Rio, Heart's Echo, First Love, Razzle Dazzle Rose, Just Whisper, Lexus`
`02:51.01`	`orchid`	`i like Razzle Dazzle Rose`
`02:51.06`	`learner`	`Nice`
`02:51.28`	`MrApathyCream`	`heh`
`02:51.48`	`learner`	`That's quite a few, and the names are rather creative to be stable horses`
`02:51.54`	`learner`	`do you race them?`
`02:52.05`	`MrApathyCream`	`no`
`02:52.10`	`MrApathyCream`	`show`
`02:52.14`	`learner`	`ah, :)`
`02:52.16`	`MrApathyCream`	`well`
`02:52.22`	`MrApathyCream`	`Rose, Lexus and Whisper are broodmares`
`02:52.34`	`MrApathyCream`	`Heart's Echo, First Love are babies`
`02:52.41`	`orchid`	`~dict broodmare`
`02:53.00`	`MrApathyCream`	`thar ya go`
`02:53.09`	`learner`	`hence why they were awarded the more "simple" names :)`
`02:53.36`	`learner`	`I like "Martini, No Olive" :)`
`02:53.59`	`MrApathyCream`	`heh`
`02:54.20`	`MrApathyCream`	`Martini No Olive and Restless Eric where bred to be race horses`
`02:54.24`	`MrApathyCream`	`but never got to the track`
`02:54.29`	`MrApathyCream`	`we bought them`
`02:54.31`	`learner`	`Razzle Dazzle sounds rather playful :)`
`02:54.52`	`learner`	`Do the names match their personalities?`
`02:55.05`	`MrApathyCream`	`heh`
`02:55.09`	`MrApathyCream`	`Martini is a drunk`
`02:55.11`	`learner`	`lol`
`02:55.17`	`*** join/#bzflag \|tim\| (~\|tim\|@ip68-106-184-191.sb.sd.cox.net)`
`02:55.51`	`*** join/#bzflag TimKohler (~\|tim\|@ip68-106-184-191.sb.sd.cox.net)`
`02:58.02`	`MrApathyCream`	`There are other nick names that tend to match personalities more`
`02:58.06`	`MrApathyCream`	`Lexus -> Fang`
`02:58.12`	`MrApathyCream`	`First Love -> Dizzy`
`02:58.20`	`MrApathyCream`	`Heart's Echo -> Ariel`
`03:01.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`anyhooo`
`03:01.19`	`MrApathyCream`	`learner: care to explain the MG problem?`
`03:01.29`	`learner`	`sure..`
`03:01.36`	`learner`	`I pick up MG, and it begins firing non-stop`
`03:01.41`	`learner`	`done`
`03:01.45`	`MrApathyCream`	`must be a mac bug`
`03:01.47`	`MrApathyCream`	`:)`
`03:01.48`	`learner`	`:)`
`03:01.52`	`learner`	`sounds like it`
`03:02.10`	`learner`	`though it only started a few weeks ago and I haven't changed anything`
`03:02.13`	`MrApathyCream`	`any particular world or world options?`
`03:02.18`	`learner`	`nope`
`03:02.29`	`learner`	`happens on playground`
`03:02.33`	`MrApathyCream`	`did you remap the fire button?`
`03:04.05`	`learner`	`nope`
`03:04.50`	`learner`	`but there is a funkyness of the identify binding that is repeatedly borked for some reason`
`03:05.58`	`MrApathyCream`	`wow how big is the test playground?`
`03:06.15`	`learner`	`which one? test I is 10x default`
`03:06.19`	`MrApathyCream`	`coo`
`03:06.26`	`MrApathyCream`	`it is disconcerting`
`03:06.29`	`MrApathyCream`	`:)`
`03:06.44`	`learner`	`I haven't gotten around to mapping the world var changes necessary for it to be "fun"`
`03:07.05`	`MrApathyCream`	`so when you put a breakpoint at fireShot what is the callstack?`
`03:07.05`	`learner`	`_tankSpeed=200, _shotSpeed=300, etc`
`03:07.21`	`learner`	`dunno, lemme check`
`03:07.50`	`MrApathyCream`	`LocalPlayer`
`03:12.07`	`learner`	`ugh, wasn't setup as debug.. recompiling`
`03:15.14`	`MrApathyCream`	`wow were i week away...`
`03:15.36`	`learner`	`where i=42 ? :)`
`03:15.59`	`*** join/#bzflag death_barrel (~chatzilla@adsl-64-219-212-46.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net)`
`03:17.54`	`MrApathyCream`	`wow u rebuilding the kernel at the same time?`
`03:18.03`	`learner`	`heh`
`03:18.59`	`death_barrel`	`~d`
`03:19.13`	`death_barrel`	`~q`
`03:19.26`	`learner`	`~quol`
`03:24.05`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh6.png`
`03:25.28`	`death_barrel`	`where the hell is everyone? all the CTF players?`
`03:26.04`	`learner`	`db got an itch?`
`03:26.12`	`death_barrel`	`hehe`
`03:26.15`	`death_barrel`	`no why?`
`03:26.26`	`death_barrel`	`i just want to play :D`
`03:26.26`	`learner`	`:)`
`03:26.46`	`death_barrel`	`brb need to switch accounts`
`03:28.00`	`*** join/#bzflag Big_Barrel (~chatzilla@adsl-64-219-212-46.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net)`
`03:28.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`ok back :D`
`03:28.32`	`Death_Barrel`	`~d`
`03:28.54`	`learner`	`Oh suure... now it works again`
`03:28.58`	`learner`	`jeesh mac..`
`03:29.50`	`MrApathyCream`	`heh`
`03:30.12`	`MrApathyCream`	`move the book away from the keyboard`
`03:30.21`	`MrApathyCream`	`i think it was sitting on the enter key`
`03:30.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`~q`
`03:30.52`	`learner`	`heh, and I wasn't even drinking when it happened..`
`03:31.07`	`learner`	`lemme see if I can provoke it .. maybe debug build masks it`
`03:38.53`	`*** join/#bzflag cniV (~kchan@c211-30-113-108.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`03:41.20`	`MrApathyCream`	`well?`
`03:41.37`	`MrApathyCream`	`CIA: Bugs: ah i was delusional`
`03:41.51`	`learner`	`heh`
`03:42.06`	`learner`	`still looking`
`03:43.18`	`MrApathyCream`	`oh boy, spooge found sf`
`03:43.43`	`learner`	`yea.. i noticed`
`03:44.44`	`learner`	`deleted`
`03:49.10`	`trepan`	`what did that idiot post?`
`03:50.02`	`learner`	`hi commented on his taste in jewelry`
`03:50.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`he`
`03:50.36`	`trepan`	`with spooge, i'm guessing c*** rings or some such thing`
`03:51.21`	`trepan`	`not an individual who does constructive things with his/her spare time`
`04:06.31`	`Patlabor221`	`where?`
`04:07.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`was on sf`
`04:07.17`	`Patlabor221`	`ahhh`
`04:07.29`	`Patlabor221`	`suprised it took him that long`
`04:07.37`	`Patlabor221`	`maybe he had to work up the nerve to post`
`04:09.50`	`MrApathyCream`	`well it looks like we're in good shape for 12/9 no?`
`04:11.18`	`*** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (~JBDiGriz@adsl-63-204-119-95.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net)`
`04:11.27`	`MrApathyCream`	`so i guess that means we can shove a few more things in...`
`04:12.22`	`learner`	`heh`
`04:12.53`	`learner`	`the key settings menu is fubar'd if you're a buga huntin'`
`04:13.29`	`MrApathyCream`	`yeah? how so`
`04:14.26`	`MrApathyCream`	`did you move that book yet?`
`04:15.27`	`learner`	`heh`
`04:15.41`	`learner`	`it doesn't work very well`
`04:15.58`	`learner`	`and some keys are just unsettable for some reason`
`04:16.32`	`learner`	`like try to bind the identify key to something else, quit and return -- it's not set`
`04:16.56`	`trepan`	`are you going to allow setting 'email' in the config file to an empty string in 1.10?`
`04:17.42`	`JBdiGriz`	`That's the signal to use the default value for email currently. Unfortunately the default is the odd string that it builds.`
`04:19.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`well looky there`
`04:19.14`	`MrApathyCream`	`you might be right`
`04:19.49`	`learner`	`heh`
`04:21.47`	`trepan`	`JBdiGriz: ya, could use another trigger though. i like an empty string.`
`04:22.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`Personally, I think it should only build the string if it doesn't find email in the config file.`
`04:22.43`	`trepan`	`i think it should build the email if there is no config file, and if it is explitcitly set to "" in the config, then so be it`
`04:23.06`	`trepan`	`don't care enough to post a dormant patch though ;)`
`04:23.54`	`trepan`	`it's just that an empty string isn't saved into the config file`
`04:23.59`	`*** join/#bzflag cniV (~kchan@c211-30-113-108.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`04:28.43`	`JBdiGriz`	`hmmm, bzadmin includes singleton.h which it can't find during the build. I wonder who was monkeying around with that, and didn't check it out. :)`
`04:29.36`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh6.png`
`04:29.42`	`Patlabor221`	`damnit`
`04:29.42`	`learner`	`actually, i was just fixing that mess :)`
`04:29.42`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh7.png`
`04:29.51`	`Patlabor221`	`how is that learner?`
`04:30.04`	`MrApathyCream`	`it would appear that there are no callbacks installed`
`04:30.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`I guess I should wait a few minutes, or would you like some assistance?`
`04:30.47`	`learner`	`going okay so far..`
`04:31.03`	`learner`	`took me a while to find where the dang aggregate targets were listed`
`04:31.41`	`JBdiGriz`	`Are you in xcode, or pb now?`
`04:32.21`	`learner`	`patlabor.. nice clean pic, but it's a bit too generic -- i'm not sure many people will recognize it`
`04:32.25`	`learner`	`in xcode`
`04:32.34`	`learner`	`distributed building isn't working..`
`04:32.49`	`learner`	`but I think that's because we set it to use 3.1 or something (i'm guessing)`
`04:33.26`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's because they are classic targets rather than native targets. We have to update everything to get distributed build and cross compile working.`
`04:34.21`	`learner`	`you found that out?`
`04:34.26`	`learner`	`ugh. that sucks`
`04:34.33`	`learner`	`there has to be a way to simply convert`
`04:35.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`I was reading about it in the xcode docs. There is a command to convert, but it didn't work simply the last time I tried. Select target to convert Project->Upgrade target to native`
`04:36.21`	`JBdiGriz`	`I tried piecemeal conversion and had no luck. I should try massively converting everything and then see what problems arise.`
`04:36.35`	`learner`	`k`
`04:37.15`	`MrApathyCream`	`off to get drunk with martini`
`04:37.32`	`learner`	`:)`
`04:39.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`good night`
`04:59.30`	`*** join/#bzflag Noodleman_laptop (~tuckerm@adsl-66-72-30-2.dsl.kntpin.ameritech.net)`
`05:02.24`	`MrApathyCream`	`spoogy!`
`05:03.17`	`learner`	`hrm.. not exactly offensive..`
`05:03.33`	`learner`	`I sense restraint`
`05:03.49`	`MrApathyCream`	`inane however`
`05:05.54`	`learner`	`where is the freaking ground drawn green in the code??`
`05:06.39`	`Patlabor221`	`backgroun renderer`
`05:06.45`	`Patlabor221`	`I remember changing it once`
`05:06.46`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh9.png`
`05:06.58`	`learner`	`i changed that and the ground didn't change..`
`05:07.15`	`Patlabor221`	`it could be saved in the state`
`05:07.53`	`learner`	`good point`
`05:07.54`	`MrApathyCream`	`wow i have multiple binds in my bzc file for the same thing`
`05:08.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`bind F9 up "roam zoom stop"`
`05:08.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`bind F10 up "roam zoom stop"`
`05:08.11`	`MrApathyCream`	`bind F11 up "roam zoom stop"`
`05:08.13`	`MrApathyCream`	`for instance`
`05:08.33`	`learner`	`OOoo.. pat`
`05:08.43`	`captain_proton`	`MrApathyCream: well - roam * stop should all work the same`
`05:08.44`	`learner`	`now we're getting somewhere :)`
`05:10.20`	`MrApathyCream`	`captain_proton: do you know where the binds are written out?`
`05:10.46`	`captain_proton`	`MrApathyCream: KEYMGR is iterated on bzflag quit`
`05:11.20`	`learner`	`every time??`
`05:12.05`	`*** part/#bzflag trepan (~trepan@CPE0040f42db082-CM00e06f15f704.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`05:15.18`	`Patlabor221`	`flaming ninja tank!`
`05:15.19`	`Patlabor221`	`:)`
`05:23.20`	`learner`	`jeesh.. I cannot change the ground color..`
`05:23.33`	`Patlabor221`	`I know I've done it before`
`05:23.39`	`learner`	`BackgroundRenderer.cxx:464`
`05:23.46`	`Patlabor221`	`check the phantom zone code`
`05:23.49`	`Patlabor221`	`cus it changes it too`
`05:23.52`	`Patlabor221`	`maybe it sets it back`
`05:26.06`	`learner`	`I'm forcing glClearColor to always be a static color, and it's not doing anything`
`05:26.26`	`learner`	`something else must be clearing`
`05:26.42`	`scanline`	`why would glClearColor set the ground color?`
`05:27.12`	`learner`	`I didn't write the code`
`05:27.12`	`scanline`	`why would bzflag need glClearColor at all? I thought it used a skydome`
`05:27.32`	`scanline`	`it could be that's only used on some of the lower quality modes`
`05:27.34`	`Patlabor221`	`that only sets the color for the wipe`
`05:27.39`	`learner`	`I'm just reading it, and that's the section that says "draw ground" and it uses clearcolor`
`05:27.41`	`Patlabor221`	`the ground poly has it's own color`
`05:27.52`	`Patlabor221`	`that comment is wrong then`
`05:27.53`	`learner`	`hrm.. good point.. low quality`
`05:28.13`	`Patlabor221`	`if your using a textured ground then the ground object has a color`
`05:28.17`	`Patlabor221`	`2 of them to be exact`
`05:29.01`	`Patlabor221`	`cus I've also changed the texture scale for the ground in the same place`
`05:29.25`	`learner`	`ugh.. indeed that was the color setting for the "low" quality mode`
`05:29.36`	`learner`	`so where exactly is the high mode then?`
`05:29.42`	`Patlabor221`	`looking`
`05:29.51`	`Patlabor221`	`it's where getGroundUV is called`
`05:31.00`	`MrApathyCream`	`theres a bunch of colors iirc, zombie color, dead color, playing color, etc, etc`
`05:31.14`	`Patlabor221`	`backgroundRenderer::DrawGround`
`05:31.21`	`Patlabor221`	`the glColor3fV call`
`05:31.26`	`Patlabor221`	`in that iff`
`05:31.32`	`MrApathyCream`	`well, on load the bind gets to`
`05:31.33`	`MrApathyCream`	`voidKeyManager::bind(const BzfKeyEvent& key,`
`05:31.33`	`MrApathyCream`	`<PROTECTED>`
`05:31.43`	`Patlabor221`	`groundColor[styleIndex]`
`05:31.44`	`MrApathyCream`	`with the correct args. But somewhere from here, the option isn't set`
`05:32.06`	`learner`	`ahh.. "d"rawGround..`
`05:32.24`	`Patlabor221`	`the colors are set static`
`05:32.33`	`Patlabor221`	`at the top of that file`
`05:32.53`	`Patlabor221`	`BackgroundRenderer::groundColor[4][3]`
`05:33.03`	`learner`	`shweet. thanks!`
`05:33.10`	`Patlabor221`	`sure`
`05:33.14`	`*** join/#bzflag GenRommel (~gene@24-193-123-145.nj.rr.com)`
`05:33.15`	`Patlabor221`	`what are you doing?`
`05:33.31`	`Patlabor221`	`and what do you think of numba 11`
`05:33.36`	`Patlabor221`	`no more flaming ninja tanks`
`05:34.11`	`learner`	`I'm playing with a realistic background drop`
`05:34.24`	`learner`	`but it's a wintery mountain panorama`
`05:34.32`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh then put some color in that texture`
`05:34.41`	`Patlabor221`	`and set all those ground colors to 1,1,1`
`05:35.37`	`learner`	`ha.. sweet.. looks cool :)`
`05:35.47`	`Patlabor221`	`screenie?`
`05:36.21`	`learner`	`can't :(`
`05:36.27`	`learner`	`this client no do captures`
`05:36.35`	`Patlabor221`	`what bout your OS?`
`05:36.39`	`learner`	`that's the problem`
`05:36.56`	`Patlabor221`	`ctrl F3 dosn't make the click noise anymore?`
`05:37.00`	`learner`	`the ogl buffer has to be locked before the capture, otherwise the capture has update tears`
`05:37.14`	`Patlabor221`	`so don't move :)`
`05:37.19`	`learner`	`it's cmd-shift-3 now, and it does :)`
`05:37.27`	`learner`	`doesn't matter if you move :)`
`05:37.34`	`Patlabor221`	`we don't have problems on the windows`
`05:38.03`	`Patlabor221`	`OSX is just letting me down big time today`
`05:38.07`	`learner`	`if the client's implementation was "better" it would work`
`05:38.10`	`KR`	`learner , when you get the chance - think this will get BB ready to play? :-D http://bzflag.org/league/index.php?link=bzforums&forumid=4&threadid=473&`
`05:39.30`	`learner`	`kr: snort!`
`05:39.46`	`KR`	`:)`
`05:40.27`	`learner`	`bz's textures are too low res :(`
`05:40.49`	`Patlabor221`	`that they are`
`05:41.00`	`Patlabor221`	`seems SGIs didn't have much texture mem`
`05:41.23`	`Patlabor221`	`and number 11?`
`05:42.20`	`scanline`	`you should steal pybzflag's textures :)`
`05:42.29`	`Patlabor221`	`yes it was good`
`05:42.48`	`Patlabor221`	`probably still is good :)`
`05:42.59`	`learner`	`Patlabor: here's the initial pic I stitched together http://brlcad.org/tmp/mountainpanorama.png`
`05:43.24`	`Patlabor221`	`keen`
`05:43.50`	`Patlabor221`	`that is a much better skyring`
`05:43.54`	`learner`	`http://brlcad.org/tmp/mountain.png was the dorked up one to make bz happy`
`05:44.02`	`scanline`	`neat.. though how exactly did a huge slab of green concrete end up floating above a mountain range?`
`05:44.28`	`Patlabor221`	`with some bricks on it`
`05:44.45`	`Patlabor221`	`too bad there is skyblur in the image`
`05:44.55`	`learner`	`it looks really cool if you change the sky color to match that blue and keep the transparency`
`05:45.14`	`Patlabor221`	`well that and only at one time of the day :)`
`05:45.19`	`learner`	`yep`
`05:45.35`	`Patlabor221`	`mmmm skybox :)`
`05:46.50`	`captain_proton`	`Patlabor221: lemme see 11`
`05:46.56`	`Patlabor221`	`how many were you able to save`
`05:47.01`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh11.png`
`05:47.08`	`learner`	`lol, I hadn't seen 11..`
`05:47.14`	`learner`	`I like :)`
`05:47.20`	`Patlabor221`	`he didn't like`
`05:47.20`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh10.png`
`05:47.28`	`scanline`	`http://navi.picogui.org/images/screenshots/pybzflag/`
`05:47.28`	`Patlabor221`	`the flaming death ninja tank`
`05:47.33`	`scanline`	`that looks kind of like all of them`
`05:47.34`	`captain_proton`	`what the hell is that spelling about?`
`05:47.44`	`scanline`	`ergh...`
`05:47.46`	`Patlabor221`	`well it is MY logo :)`
`05:47.50`	`scanline`	`all of those are thumbnails :-/`
`05:48.33`	`learner`	`yea scan.. I meant to ask what happened to all the shiny pics`
`05:48.37`	`Patlabor221`	`I lub the cloud memory coruption one`
`05:48.57`	`scanline`	`learner: navi crash`
`05:49.14`	`learner`	`backups?`
`05:49.25`	`scanline`	`too big to back up`
`05:49.34`	`learner`	`eek!`
`05:49.51`	`learner`	`that's just more of a reason to _require_ a backup.. lots of data`
`05:50.05`	`captain_proton`	`how exactly do you suggest we back up a 1.1T filesystem?`
`05:50.09`	`captain_proton`	`(within our budget)`
`05:50.21`	`learner`	`get 4 250 mb drives`
`05:50.24`	`learner`	`ata`
`05:50.37`	`Patlabor221`	`but then you could jsut fill those drives with MORE date`
`05:50.46`	`scanline`	`learner: we already use RAID-5, it's safe against most hardware failures`
`05:50.46`	`Patlabor221`	`a DVD ram and a trained monkey`
`05:50.53`	`scanline`	`learner: the problem was tools eating our filesystem`
`05:51.18`	`learner`	`right.. raid doesn't save you from idiots/instrusions/etc`
`05:51.34`	`scanline`	`learner: all the really important stuff (source code) was backed up on several machines... the rest was just too big and not important enough to back up`
`05:51.52`	`learner`	`hey, it's your system .. have fun! :)`
`05:52.04`	`scanline`	`feel free to buy us another navi for backup`
`05:52.10`	`Patlabor221`	`when did apple put DVD RAM drives in systems?`
`05:52.23`	`learner`	`couple years ago`
`05:52.32`	`learner`	`2`
`05:52.33`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh`
`05:52.35`	`Patlabor221`	`they are funky`
`05:52.48`	`learner`	`dvd burners in a laptop are fun :)`
`05:53.06`	`Patlabor221`	`send me one and I'll tell you if that is true`
`05:53.13`	`learner`	`heh`
`05:54.54`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh12.png`
`05:54.57`	`Patlabor221`	`that better cap?`
`05:55.12`	`captain_proton`	`yes`
`05:55.25`	`learner`	`bah`
`05:55.27`	`Patlabor221`	`at least I resisted the backwards K :)`
`05:55.34`	`captain_proton`	`heh`
`05:55.40`	`learner`	`I liked the null`
`05:55.58`	`captain_proton`	`the slash makes it either a zero or a norwegian letter :)`
`05:56.17`	`Patlabor221`	`I think it was the norwegian one`
`05:56.25`	`Patlabor221`	`it was lower in the charset then the numbers`
`05:56.45`	`captain_proton`	`well - few people write zeros with slashes anymore`
`05:57.23`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh13.png`
`05:57.44`	`learner`	`better :)`
`05:58.29`	`learner`	`cap: actually, I'd say more people that ever write zero with a slash now.. 0 see?`
`05:58.56`	`captain_proton`	`learner: most fonts just use something a little blockier than a capital O`
`05:59.41`	`learner`	`er, not any font I'm looking at now except for maybe an arial font`
`05:59.51`	`Patlabor221`	`cap, the other recent, ponderances`
`05:59.52`	`Patlabor221`	`http://p24.bakadigital.com/p24bb/viewtopic.php?p=74&sid=dc76395063eb6b94d0d085a25fa1a7a5#74`
`06:01.24`	`Patlabor221`	`I could do it in the indiana jones font :)`
`06:01.30`	`Patlabor221`	`SF-fedora`
`06:02.24`	`captain_proton`	`i like the "another tank game" one`
`06:02.35`	`Patlabor221`	`I though you would`
`06:02.53`	`Patlabor221`	`ooo I have the sliders font :)`
`06:04.50`	`Patlabor221`	`and for some reason one called "anime pornstar"`
`06:16.24`	`*** join/#bzflag creeperz (~creeperz@host-11-76-220-24.midco.net)`
`06:36.03`	`Pimpinella`	`~d`
`06:44.46`	`KR`	`#12 looks great`
`06:44.57`	`learner`	`uh oh mac..`
`06:45.07`	`learner`	`TextureManager uses stuff in texture.cxx`
`06:45.22`	`learner`	`one's in libglkit, the other is in bzflag client front end..`
`06:45.37`	`learner`	`getTexture`
`06:46.51`	`learner`	`eep! mac left..`
`06:46.52`	`learner`	`:(`
`06:47.20`	`captain_proton`	`so learner`
`06:47.31`	`captain_proton`	`you'll be happy to hear that i'm reasonably impressed with the construction of the new ibooks`
`06:47.38`	`captain_proton`	`they're actually a little sturdy`
`06:47.40`	`learner`	`you got one?`
`06:47.46`	`captain_proton`	`and the keyboard doesn't feel like jello`
`06:47.48`	`captain_proton`	`we got one at work`
`06:47.52`	`learner`	`cool`
`06:48.31`	`captain_proton`	`i think the keyboard is the clincher, really`
`06:48.45`	`learner`	`heh :)`
`06:50.34`	`learner`	`running 10.3 yet?`
`06:52.26`	`captain_proton`	`yeah, came with`
`06:53.57`	`captain_proton`	`and i must say`
`06:54.01`	`captain_proton`	`expose is rediculous`
`06:54.27`	`captain_proton`	`i wonder when people are going to realize that apple is making poor UI decisions`
`07:10.17`	`JBdiGriz`	`I rather like expose. it depends on your usual mode of work i suppose.`
`07:17.37`	`CIA`	`03brlcad * 12bzflag/src (2 files in 2 dirs): moved fatal error handler to the common error handler, and delete display inside of usage if it was set (that was probably a bug before -- no check)`
`07:18.15`	`JBdiGriz`	`texture.h was missing from xcode as well as singleton.h. I've added them back in and trying to compile the client.`
`07:18.52`	`KR`	`bzflag is in the Lycoris Game Pak - only $35 and you too can play this awesome game :)`
`07:18.52`	`learner`	`there are about 4 others too`
`07:19.05`	`CIA`	`03brlcad * 12bzflag/src/platform/MacOSX/BZFlag.pbproj (project.pbxproj): updated project a lil bit to Xcode.. still not working due to link issues`
`07:20.12`	`learner`	`Jb: a ran into a handful of issues when I got to libGLKit`
`07:20.50`	`JBdiGriz`	`It looks like it's missing texturemanager.cxx among other things`
`07:20.55`	`learner`	`it wasn't finding libz for some reason, and mac's TextureManager.cxx has a dependancy on the client front end code`
`07:21.47`	`learner`	`texturemanager should be fixed before we can move too far forward`
`07:22.35`	`JBdiGriz`	`I don't see a direct dependency on libz in libglkit, but that shouldn't make a difference until link time.`
`07:22.38`	`learner`	`src/bzflag/texture.cxx could be moved into src/ogl and added to libGLKit, but there's dependancies on libCommon and libMedia in it`
`07:23.01`	`learner`	`yea, I think the libz problem was after I tried moving texture.cxx`
`07:23.24`	`learner`	`I couldn't link libMedia because of libZ`
`07:25.17`	`*** join/#bzflag ddurst (~ddurst@adsl-gte-la-216-86-192-34.mminternet.com)`
`07:25.20`	`ddurst`	`wow`
`07:25.26`	`ddurst`	`lots of peepz`
`07:25.35`	`learner`	`hi ddurst`
`07:25.51`	`ddurst`	`can anyone tell me why so many people cheat at bz?`
`07:26.12`	`ddurst`	`its really lame and has gotten me to a point of no longer wanting to play`
`07:26.13`	`learner`	`it's rather easy to make and get away with a cheat client`
`07:26.17`	`Patlabor221`	`1) they suck, 2) it's easy, 3) they have really nothing better to do /small penis'`
`07:26.22`	`JBdiGriz`	`because they can't play the game without winning, and they can't win without cheating`
`07:26.59`	`ddurst`	`anyone know of a server in which people tend not to cheat?`
`07:27.17`	`KR`	`ddurst - play more CTf on ducati or quols or q2`
`07:27.25`	`ddurst`	`all of the servers I get by default tend to have people that have done subtle cheats`
`07:27.27`	`KR`	`we dont tolerate cheaters`
`07:27.31`	`learner`	`most of the ducati-style servers are heavily admin'd`
`07:27.33`	`Patlabor221`	`the more admined they are the harder it is for the cheatsers to stay`
`07:28.21`	`Patlabor221`	`these are based off KRs sugestions`
`07:28.24`	`Patlabor221`	`http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh14.png`
`07:28.26`	`KR`	`if "cheaters" >0, thenkick/ban :)`
`07:28.28`	`Patlabor221`	`and http://ryoko.bakadigital.com/temp/mehh15.png`
`07:28.33`	`learner`	`there are generally admins always in here on hand to take care of xmission, ducati, and quol's servers`
`07:29.55`	`learner`	`ddurst: often subtle cheating can easily be confused with consistent network lag, don't be too quick to accuse subtle cheating -- there's enough blatent cheating`
`07:32.23`	`ddurst`	`weelll`
`07:32.28`	`ddurst`	`when the server limits 10 shots`
`07:32.38`	`ddurst`	`and someone shots 20 off at you`
`07:32.40`	`learner`	`that's not subtle :)`
`07:32.41`	`ddurst`	`with out rapid fire`
`07:33.16`	`JBdiGriz`	`gettexture seems to be defined in src/bzflag/texture.cxx. There should be an option to prevent it from prebinding, but it's not the obvious one.`
`07:33.45`	`learner`	`jb: as a framework, it has to resolve completely`
`07:34.02`	`learner`	`that dependancy shouldn't be there, regardless`
`07:34.20`	`JBdiGriz`	`then that's what's causing the problem.`
`07:34.59`	`learner`	`at quick glance, it looks like getTexture is pretty generic and could be moved into libGLKit or libCommon or libMedia`
`07:37.33`	`learner`	`past my sleep time, cya`
`07:37.39`	`JBdiGriz`	`It looks like the typical c++ overloading until i can't find which is the real definition.`
`07:37.46`	`Patlabor221`	`see ya`
`07:38.07`	`learner`	`the real definition is higher up in that file`
`07:38.28`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-10-101.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`07:42.22`	`JBdiGriz`	`I think I'll wait until I can ask the c++ gurus about it. I don't see it, and neither does the compiler.`
`07:45.20`	`learner`	`src/bzflag/texture.cxx:45`
`07:45.47`	`ddurst`	`grrr`
`07:46.00`	`JBdiGriz`	`I'm looking at the texture.h file, and realizing that it's using the initialized arguments.`
`07:46.18`	`learner`	`ah`
`07:46.39`	`JBdiGriz`	`and it's the one at line 70`
`07:47.09`	`learner`	`right, and the one on 70 calls the one on 45`
`07:47.41`	`JBdiGriz`	`yep, convolutions wrapped around convolutions, and the library shouldn't depend on source from the program in order to work.`
`07:47.43`	`learner`	`yes, the one on 70 is completely unnecessary`
`07:48.01`	`JBdiGriz`	`but that's the one that's invoked.`
`07:48.45`	`learner`	`we could probably just change that, get rid of the dummy one`
`07:48.56`	`learner`	`change the instances of use`
`07:49.08`	`JBdiGriz`	`probable worthwhile, but it wouldn't solve the current problem`
`07:54.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`there's a fair number of functions required by texture.cxx before we can move it out. I'll try splitting it up in the morning.`
`07:54.50`	`CIA`	`03brlcad * 12bzflag/ (TODO): TextureManager is dependant on client front end code`
`08:19.14`	`*** part/#bzflag ddurst (~ddurst@adsl-gte-la-216-86-192-34.mminternet.com)`
`09:00.23`	`*** part/#bzflag KR (~k@cae168-234-054.sc.rr.com)`
`09:13.50`	`Pimpinella`	`~d`
`09:14.03`	`Pimpinella`	`~xmission`
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`13:51.13`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_proton] by ChanServ`
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`14:25.05`	`*** join/#bzflag Grumbler (~Bagheera@h-68-165-122-98.MCLNVA23.covad.net)`
`14:33.15`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (frank@p50820B87.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`14:41.58`	`*** part/#bzflag Grumbler (~Bagheera@h-68-165-122-98.MCLNVA23.covad.net)`
`14:42.07`	`*** join/#bzflag Bagheera (~Grumbler@h-68-165-122-98.MCLNVA23.covad.net)`
`14:48.58`	`*** join/#bzflag str_ (~8b1410a1@server24.greatnet.de)`
`14:49.56`	`str_`	`hi`
`14:51.21`	`Grumbler`	`hallo`
`14:58.58`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:02.00`	`str_`	`Death_Barrel: hiho ;o)`
`15:03.09`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com)`
`15:03.09`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`15:05.32`	`Death_Barrel`	`hi strayer :)`
`15:05.40`	`Death_Barrel`	`how you doing man :)`
`15:07.12`	`str_`	`nothing to complain about :o)....and U?`
`15:07.56`	`str_`	`Death_Barrel: sry man....have to leafe now...CU`
`15:08.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:13.19`	`*** join/#bzflag lurgyman (~lurgyman@navi.cs.colorado.edu)`
`15:19.03`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:20.48`	`*** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (~JBDiGriz@adsl-63-204-119-95.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net)`
`15:21.37`	`Grumbler`	`morin Jb`
`15:27.51`	`*** join/#bzflag BZFlag (~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com)`
`15:28.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`morin`
`15:28.27`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o BZFlag] by ChanServ`
`15:28.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`mornin jb and grumbler`
`15:29.01`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:33.40`	`*** join/#bzflag MrCooper (~daenzer@zhhot-zy-r1s5.cyberlink.ch)`
`15:39.04`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:40.54`	`Nidhoggr`	`yay for opensource rdesktop`
`15:41.17`	`Nidhoggr`	`forgot my laptop at home, and couldn't get to my home desktop.`
`15:42.50`	`Grumbler`	`morin DB, Nid, general lurkers`
`15:45.33`	`Death_Barrel`	`hello`
`15:45.40`	`Nidhoggr`	`hiya`
`15:45.40`	`Death_Barrel`	`hi nidhoggr`
`15:45.46`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`15:45.52`	`Nidhoggr`	`I'm all happy now.`
`15:45.57`	`Death_Barrel`	`watcha guys up to this morning?`
`15:46.05`	`Nidhoggr`	`I only ever used my windows laptop to rdesktop to my home machine.`
`15:46.12`	`Nidhoggr`	`now I don't really need ti.`
`15:46.12`	`Nidhoggr`	`it.`
`15:46.40`	`Death_Barrel`	`cool`
`15:46.52`	`Death_Barrel`	`i am getting ready to take some screen shots :D`
`15:46.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`of?`
`15:47.04`	`Death_Barrel`	`my desktop`
`15:47.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`15:47.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`installing VB first`
`15:47.18`	`Death_Barrel`	`or Visual Studio`
`15:47.22`	`Nidhoggr`	`at work I use OS X for all my admin stuff.`
`15:47.52`	`Nidhoggr`	`if I need windows, I can use laptop, but now I can just put stuff on home machine and use windows there through rdesktop.`
`15:47.54`	`Death_Barrel`	`btw: anyone here need a copy of Visual Studio? it is the corporate version and needs no key code :D`
`15:48.04`	`Nidhoggr`	`might be handy.`
`15:48.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`patlabor gave me copy a while ago, but that machine died.`
`15:48.25`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`15:48.34`	`Death_Barrel`	`well let me know if you want :)`
`15:48.44`	`Nidhoggr`	`okie.`
`15:48.46`	`Death_Barrel`	`i am more of a linux man`
`15:48.49`	`Nidhoggr`	`let me get situated at work today.`
`15:48.53`	`Nidhoggr`	`same here.`
`15:48.56`	`Death_Barrel`	`but here at work we use Win2k pro`
`15:49.05`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:49.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`but I use windows and mac for all my graphic/multimedia stuff.`
`15:49.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`I do a LOT of that. and desktop publishing.`
`15:50.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`I found out that office xp has a feature that I've been looking for for years. something that I do by hand all the time... book fold printing.`
`15:50.08`	`Death_Barrel`	`cool`
`15:50.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah i just perfer linux`
`15:50.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`much better os than win`
`15:50.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`way more stable`
`15:50.34`	`Nidhoggr`	`takes HOURS and HOURS to do a 40 page booklet by hand. :(`
`15:51.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`you have to compose each individual page, and paste to half page columns, and hope you don't need to edit it.`
`15:51.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`and you have to figure out what page is back to back with what other page.`
`15:51.43`	`Nidhoggr`	`so now I open word, set to landscape, set to booklet printing, and paste whole document into it.`
`15:51.49`	`Nidhoggr`	`edit and print.`
`15:52.06`	`Death_Barrel`	`sounds like a pain in the ass`
`15:52.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`then I can bind it however I want.`
`15:52.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`new way is so easy. I really have spent WEEKS on some projects in just print formatting.`
`15:53.18`	`Death_Barrel`	`have u seen Pirates of the Caribean yet?`
`15:53.36`	`Death_Barrel`	`i rented it last night....but fell asleep cause it was super late :(`
`15:53.47`	`Death_Barrel`	`so i have to watch it again tonight :D`
`15:53.51`	`Nidhoggr`	`not yet. we'll probably rent it. :)`
`15:54.05`	`Nidhoggr`	`we finished the last episode of "Taken" from our TiVo last night.`
`15:54.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`cool, is that series any good?`
`15:54.26`	`Death_Barrel`	`stephen king right?`
`15:54.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`it was really quite excellent for a scifi production.`
`15:54.47`	`Death_Barrel`	`i miss X-Files :(`
`15:55.22`	`Nidhoggr`	`no... it was........`
`15:55.29`	`Nidhoggr`	`brain lock.... thinking.`
`15:55.36`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah`
`15:55.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`steven speilberg`
`15:55.51`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah`
`15:55.53`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`15:56.05`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah i have seen the epesiodes at blockbuster`
`15:56.22`	`Death_Barrel`	`"ET phone home!"`
`15:56.24`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`15:56.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`I really liked it, but I'm not as picky as some.`
`15:56.38`	`Nidhoggr`	`and for a scifi production, it rocked.`
`15:56.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`scifi's earlier stuff was HORRIBLE.`
`15:56.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`thats good`
`15:56.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`now they have money.`
`15:57.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`the scifi channel you mean?`
`15:57.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`and they are spending it.`
`15:57.04`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`15:57.08`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah`
`15:57.08`	`Grumbler`	`the new dune wasnt bad....`
`15:57.17`	`Nidhoggr`	`it was okay.. I kinda liked it.`
`15:57.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah it will never compare to the movie :)`
`15:57.40`	`Nidhoggr`	`the original movie was too short, and didn't explain much.`
`15:57.46`	`Grumbler`	`compared with the first.......but then again, anything would be better without Sting acting....hahaha`
`15:57.54`	`Nidhoggr`	`I hated the book, though... go figure. too much sand.`
`15:57.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`lmfao`
`15:57.58`	`Death_Barrel`	`sting`
`15:57.59`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`15:58.53`	`*** join/#bzflag Bagheera (~Grumbler@h-68-165-122-98.MCLNVA23.covad.net)`
`15:59.04`	`Bagheera`	`somehow that movie always had an appeal....the uneditted version of the old one explained more things`
`15:59.08`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`15:59.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`bagheera = grumbler right?`
`15:59.24`	`Bagheera`	`bagheera is retired`
`15:59.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`15:59.35`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah i read the post on bzbb`
`15:59.38`	`Bagheera`	`unless the network fails...`
`15:59.51`	`Death_Barrel`	`like it just did? lol`
`16:00.14`	`Death_Barrel`	`damn Visual Studio is packed!! it is a long install :(`
`16:00.37`	`Nidhoggr`	`how big is the iso?`
`16:00.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`have to look`
`16:00.53`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`16:01.02`	`Death_Barrel`	`i will tell you when install is done :)`
`16:01.27`	`Nidhoggr`	`okie`
`16:01.54`	`Death_Barrel`	`hmmmm, i think about 615MB`
`16:02.41`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow, i saw screen shots of HALO.....it looked really badass!`
`16:02.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`patlabor posted them`
`16:04.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`I wish I liked some of those first person shooters.`
`16:05.02`	`Death_Barrel`	`i have not played that kinda stuff in quite a while`
`16:05.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`i am really just a BZ dude`
`16:05.17`	`Nidhoggr`	`I just get bored with it really fast.`
`16:05.25`	`Death_Barrel`	`with BZ and work i have no time for anything else really`
`16:05.35`	`Nidhoggr`	`bz is nice because the maps make it interesting.`
`16:06.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`16:06.08`	`Death_Barrel`	`i just stick to CTF :)`
`16:06.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`brb need to restart machine :(`
`16:06.24`	`Nidhoggr`	`I don't play enough lately to get good at ctf`
`16:06.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`okie.`
`16:06.26`	`Death_Barrel`	`install is complete after the restart`
`16:06.28`	`Death_Barrel`	`brb`
`16:06.39`	`[dmp]`	`~seen badin`
`16:06.41`		`badin <Paramount@81.193.130.153> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 85d 21h 12m 33s ago, saying: 'ol�'.`
`16:06.52`	`*** join/#bzflag brlcad (~brlcad@chr160dhcp1509.chrchv01.md.comcast.net)`
`16:11.52`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`16:11.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`back :)`
`16:12.20`	`Grumbler`	`god aften?....hmmm, i am forgetting`
`16:12.59`	`Death_Barrel`	`god aften?`
`16:13.15`	`[dmp]`	`Grumbler: Correct.`
`16:13.52`	`Grumbler`	`[dmp]: danke (?)`
`16:14.02`	`[dmp]`	`Grumbler: tak :)`
`16:14.25`	`Grumbler`	`ok`
`16:14.52`	`[dmp]`	`i've seen two other bzflag player.. one of them have already registered bzflag.dk .. bastards.. i think ill challenge them to a 1on1`
`16:15.20`	`[dmp]`	`insert danish before bzflag :)`
`16:16.37`	`Grumbler`	`inserting a danish before playing bzflag makes it difficult to cheer when you destroy a tank.. ;)`
`16:16.49`	`[dmp]`	`hehehe`
`16:18.01`	`[dmp]`	`Im hungry. If i eat one of my groupmates, would that be illegal?`
`16:18.37`	`JBdiGriz`	`don't know the laws in Denmark, but you would have to be consenting adults around here.`
`16:21.51`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`16:25.25`	`*** join/#bzflag CIA (CIA@cia.utility.freenode)`
`16:28.38`	`Death_Barrel`	`everyone say hi!! my screenshot is about to be taken`
`16:31.53`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`16:41.55`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`16:42.47`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~JeffM@208.48.199.202)`
`16:42.48`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ`
`16:49.50`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`16:49.51`	`*** join/#bzflag larsl (~larsl@c213-100-62-55.swipnet.se)`
`16:49.51`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o larsl] by ChanServ`
`16:50.51`	`Death_Barrel`	`screenshots complete :D`
`16:51.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`16:57.25`	`larsl`	bzflag.cxx:364: error: `printFatalError' undeclared (first use this function)
`17:02.00`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`17:03.42`	`Noodleman`	`f00mz0rz`
`17:03.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`17:03.46`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey dude`
`17:03.51`	`[dmp]`	`hu`
`17:03.55`	`[dmp]`	`hi`
`17:04.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah my proxy spits me off every 15min it seems like`
`17:04.26`	`Noodleman`	`why do you use a proy?`
`17:04.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`work`
`17:04.32`	`Noodleman`	`proxy, even`
`17:04.33`	`Noodleman`	`ah`
`17:04.34`	`Death_Barrel`	`at work`
`17:04.44`	`Death_Barrel`	`at home >>>> hell no!!`
`17:04.45`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:04.50`	`Death_Barrel`	`http proxy`
`17:04.57`	`Noodleman`	`that sucks`
`17:04.59`	`Death_Barrel`	`winproxy i think :(`
`17:05.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:05.05`	`Death_Barrel`	`yep it sure does`
`17:05.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`otherwise i would be playig bz 24/7 at work :D`
`17:05.25`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`17:05.34`	`Noodleman`	`yup, that's really productive :-)`
`17:05.37`	`Death_Barrel`	`we are getting a 2nd T-1 line on the 19th`
`17:05.50`	`Death_Barrel`	`and then we should be able to bypass the proxy to run bz`
`17:05.56`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`17:06.07`	`Noodleman`	`don't get yourself fired :-P`
`17:06.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`$1,600 per month`
`17:06.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`$10,000 per / month for a T-3`
`17:06.45`	`Death_Barrel`	`the company a few blocks down has 2 T-3's`
`17:06.53`	`Death_Barrel`	`$20,000 month`
`17:06.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow`
`17:07.04`	`Nidhoggr`	`wow. I can get a T1 for about 300/month.`
`17:07.36`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah that is about $8,000 month`
`17:07.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`but faster than T-3 :)`
`17:07.47`	`larsl`	`What's a T-1?`
`17:08.02`	`Noodleman`	`24 DS3's :-)`
`17:08.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`modem`
`17:08.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`E1 in europe is closest equiv iirc`
`17:08.09`	`Noodleman`	`DS1's even`
`17:08.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`T1 is a DS1`
`17:08.26`	`CIA`	`03larsl * 12bzflag/include (ErrorHandler.h): Don't forget the function prototypes`
`17:08.34`	`Death_Barrel`	`i think DSL is faster than T-1 except for the upload`
`17:08.37`	`Nidhoggr`	`errr`
`17:08.38`	`Noodleman`	`oh, i thought that DS1 was one channel of a T1`
`17:08.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`that's probably right`
`17:08.51`	`Nidhoggr`	`you said ds3 and scared me`
`17:08.53`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`17:08.53`	`larsl`	`~dict E1`
`17:08.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`~dict T-1`
`17:08.58`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:09.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`1.54 mbps`
`17:09.09`	`Noodleman`	`hehe`
`17:09.12`	`Nidhoggr`	`24 phone lines (64K)`
`17:09.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`a T-3 is 30 T-1's crammed together`
`17:09.51`	`Nidhoggr`	`phone line is 56K plus control data. you can make it clear channel (no control data) and have 64K`
`17:10.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`T3 is 45mbps`
`17:10.30`	`larsl`	`Somebody's paying $10,000 / month for 45 mbit/s?`
`17:10.31`	`Patlabor221`	`and a t1 is 15mips right?`
`17:10.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`yes i think`
`17:10.39`	`Death_Barrel`	`or is it 54mbps`
`17:11.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`it's not the bandwidth you pay for, it's the specialty cabling required for a the circuit.`
`17:11.08`	`Death_Barrel`	`well T-1 is actually 1.3 mips`
`17:11.10`	`Nidhoggr`	`it's 45 mpbs for ds3/t3`
`17:11.17`	`Patlabor221`	`I thought at T3 was 3 T1s not 30`
`17:11.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`that is what i ment :)`
`17:11.28`	`Nidhoggr`	`huh? where you do you get your t1s?`
`17:11.28`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:11.33`	`Nidhoggr`	`you guys are so confused.`
`17:11.38`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:11.40`	`Patlabor221`	`hence why I ask :)`
`17:11.47`	`Death_Barrel`	`i hit that 0 by mistake`
`17:11.57`	`Noodleman`	`hehe, that's why they aren't network admns :-)`
`17:12.02`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`17:12.23`	`Noodleman`	`i just can't seem to hit the keys today`
`17:12.49`	`Patlabor221`	`I'd rather just draw my new rank icos`
`17:12.51`	`Patlabor221`	`icons`
`17:13.03`	`Noodleman`	`:-)`
`17:13.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`A private dedicated full T3 circuit provides 45Mbps of bandwidth.`
`17:13.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:13.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`A T3 circuit is made up of 28 T1s or 672 64Kbps channels.`
`17:13.33`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`17:13.47`	`Death_Barrel`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:13.52`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`17:13.56`	`Death_Barrel`	`the circut`
`17:15.01`	`Patlabor221`	`I'll just take that as "a lot"`
`17:15.14`	`Nidhoggr`	`672 phone lines. :)`
`17:15.15`	`Patlabor221`	`Nidhoggr, wana change the rank icons on BZBB? :)`
`17:15.21`	`Noodleman`	`i could host a lot of 100 shot servers on that...`
`17:15.24`	`Patlabor221`	`and how many phone lines is a T1?`
`17:15.29`	`Nidhoggr`	`24`
`17:15.33`	`Noodleman`	`but, then i'd never wanna play on it :-)`
`17:15.48`	`Death_Barrel`	`how about 2 T-3's?`
`17:15.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:15.54`	`Death_Barrel`	`that would kick ass!!`
`17:16.00`	`Patlabor221`	`and how large is an OC48?`
`17:16.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`Patlabor221, you really should get an account on the machine, no matter how much you resist.`
`17:16.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`not sure`
`17:16.10`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`17:16.13`	`captain_proton`	`very large`
`17:16.17`	`captain_proton`	`OC12 is 675mbit`
`17:16.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow`
`17:16.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`smokin!!`
`17:16.28`	`Noodleman`	`woo, /me wants`
`17:16.38`	`Patlabor221`	`Nidhoggr, I will, I'm not gonna do it, I mostly just wonder if you are amiable to the idea or if you like the current icons`
`17:16.44`	`stibnite`	`oc48 is 2.45 Gbps`
`17:16.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`when you see OC## multiply the ## by 45mbps`
`17:16.57`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow`
`17:16.58`	`Death_Barrel`	`really?`
`17:17.07`	`Noodleman`	`so an OC## is ## T3's?`
`17:17.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`OC## means that the optical circuit carries ## DS3s (data version of T3)`
`17:17.23`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`17:17.23`	`Patlabor221`	`that is a fatty piple`
`17:17.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`yes`
`17:17.36`	`Noodleman`	`ok`
`17:17.41`	`stibnite`	`I'd be happy with an OC0.3`
`17:17.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`that would be correct according to nidhoggr's calculation :)`
`17:17.48`	`Nidhoggr`	`fastest in production right now is OC192, iirc.`
`17:17.57`	`Patlabor221`	`Nidhoggr, I did a set of rank icons for P24 and I think they may work well on bzbb, but I wanted your opinion, or if everyone likes the flag thing.`
`17:17.59`	`Death_Barrel`	`i want an OC500 then!!!!`
`17:18.10`	`Patlabor221`	`get some solder then`
`17:18.15`	`Death_Barrel`	`lmao`
`17:18.21`	`captain_proton`	`pfft`
`17:18.26`	`Noodleman`	`< Death_Barrel> i want an OC500 then!!!! <@Patlabor221> get some solder then`
`17:18.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`that is fast!`
`17:18.33`	`Nidhoggr`	`they have a OC4/192 in the labs.. so OC768`
`17:18.35`	`Noodleman`	`that just kinda hit something funny :-)`
`17:19.01`	`Noodleman`	`lol`
`17:19.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:19.11`	`Noodleman`	`ibot, go take a nap`
`17:19.13`		`i haven't a clue, Noodleman`
`17:19.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`you are a little late today ibot :D`
`17:19.24`	`Noodleman`	`that's why you need to toake a nap`
`17:19.39`	`Death_Barrel`	`ibot: whois death barrel?`
`17:19.40`		`death barrel is, like, the master all bzleagues and he loves beer!`
`17:19.41`	`Nidhoggr`	`pat, what is addy of other board so I can look?`
`17:19.46`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`17:19.47`	`Patlabor221`	`http://p24.bakadigital.com/p24bb/viewtopic.php?t=6`
`17:19.51`	`Patlabor221`	`the ones in the second post`
`17:20.23`	`Patlabor221`	`the top post is the older ones I had`
`17:21.00`	`[dmp]`	`nice graphics, pat`
`17:21.03`	`*** join/#bzflag orchid (~orchid@toronto-hs-64-26-176-100.s-ip.magma.ca)`
`17:21.05`	`Patlabor221`	`I don't mind the flags of the current BZBB ranking system, but the names and stuff don't really conotate an order`
`17:21.06`	`Patlabor221`	`thanks`
`17:21.14`	`Nidhoggr`	`hrm. they look nice enough.`
`17:21.39`	`Nidhoggr`	`did you make them?`
`17:21.42`	`Patlabor221`	`yes I did`
`17:21.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`very good work`
`17:21.54`	`Patlabor221`	`worked till 2AM on em, just cus I wanted to get them done :)`
`17:21.55`	`captain_proton`	`BAH`
`17:21.59`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`17:22.00`	`Death_Barrel`	`nice ranks`
`17:22.09`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`17:22.09`	`Nidhoggr`	`qwest could use regular kicking`
`17:22.14`	`[dmp]`	`Patlabor221: What do you use? Photoshop?`
`17:22.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`partner works for qwest. they are evil.`
`17:22.24`	`Death_Barrel`	`pat: when will project24 be released?`
`17:22.24`	`captain_proton`	`they decided to reallocate VCIs last night`
`17:22.25`	`Patlabor221`	`yes photoshop`
`17:22.29`	`captain_proton`	`so now i have to rethink all my routing tables`
`17:22.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`ack!`
`17:22.35`	`Nidhoggr`	`that sucks, proton. :(`
`17:22.36`	`Patlabor221`	`when it is done`
`17:22.41`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`17:22.48`	`Death_Barrel`	`do you have a time frame on it?`
`17:22.52`	`Patlabor221`	`trepan got the basicl client working on linux this weekend :)`
`17:22.53`	`Death_Barrel`	`just curious`
`17:22.58`	`Patlabor221`	`it's hard to say`
`17:23.01`	`Noodleman`	`what ILEC isn't evil?`
`17:23.22`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow, it really looks like a badass game :D`
`17:23.27`	`Patlabor221`	`the system is so open that game mods can happen after release and peopel will get automaic updates`
`17:23.34`	`Patlabor221`	`but I am working on it as fast as I can`
`17:23.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`wow`
`17:23.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`that is cool`
`17:23.50`	`Death_Barrel`	`take your time ;)`
`17:23.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`no rush :)`
`17:23.56`	`larsl`	`Automatic updates?`
`17:23.56`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`17:24.03`	`Patlabor221`	`yes they will be an option`
`17:24.17`	`Patlabor221`	`if you don't have the current game module for a server you will be given a location to go get it`
`17:24.24`	`Patlabor221`	`or the option to automaticly install it`
`17:24.24`	`larsl`	`Ah. Neat.`
`17:24.35`	`Death_Barrel`	`that is too cool`
`17:24.42`	`Patlabor221`	`and warned if it looks to be modified code`
`17:24.52`	`larsl`	`Same thing for data like graphics and models?`
`17:26.21`	`Death_Barrel`	`well i am starving.....must go eat /me thinks McDonalds sounds good today :)`
`17:26.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`bbl guys`
`17:28.22`	`Patlabor221`	`yes when you connect to a server it sends a list of resources, if you don't have them, it sends you the address of a CMS ( contenet mangaement server )`
`17:28.24`	`Patlabor221`	`and you get it`
`17:28.54`	`captain_proton`	`hrmy hrm hrm`
`17:29.12`	`captain_proton`	`# ip route add default via 198.11.20.1 dev eth2 table apt2dsl`
`17:29.13`	`captain_proton`	`RTNETLINK answers: Network is unreachable`
`17:29.32`	`Nidhoggr`	`ut oh, capt.`
`17:30.04`	`captain_proton`	`i have no clue why its doing that... i can dhcp an address on that interface just fine`
`17:35.33`	`Patlabor221`	`I posted the ranks on bzbb, lets see what people think, change or stay with the flags.`
`17:35.40`	`JBdiGriz`	`captain_proton: what's the address you receive for that iface?`
`17:36.04`	`captain_proton`	`JBdiGriz: right now, 198.11.20.73`
`17:36.19`	`JBdiGriz`	`I assume that's /24`
`17:36.20`	`captain_proton`	`it used to be that our two dsl links got addresses on different subnets, now they're both on .20/24`
`17:36.22`	`captain_proton`	`yeah`
`17:38.49`	`JBdiGriz`	`Are you running any sort of routing daemon?`
`17:39.19`	`captain_proton`	`nope`
`17:39.40`	`captain_proton`	`the only difference i can see between the two interfaces is that this one doesn't have a rule in the main table`
`17:39.54`	`captain_proton`	`but that shouldn't matter, as there's a pointer to look at a different table with that source address`
`17:39.57`	`larsl`	`Patlabor221: Would "Developer Guru" be translated to "Technical Sergeant"?`
`17:40.59`	`JBdiGriz`	`It sounds like the routing table is unable to deal with the two addresses on the same routing subnet. You might need to look into some routing software which can load balance the interfaces.`
`17:41.20`	`captain_proton`	`but they're in separate tables =/`
`17:41.35`	`JBdiGriz`	`Are these on separate machines?`
`17:41.42`	`captain_proton`	`no`
`17:42.57`	`JBdiGriz`	`Perhaps I'm not understanding the physical setup of the machine, and the network interfaces.`
`17:43.14`	`captain_proton`	`i'm using source-based routes`
`17:43.22`	`captain_proton`	`so it chooses the routing table to use based on the source address`
`17:44.52`	`*** join/#bzflag Dave2 (~dave@teppic.demon.co.uk)`
`17:47.08`	`captain_proton`	`aha`
`17:47.35`	`captain_proton`	`apparently i just needed an entry in the main table for that interface, even if that rule isn't used`
`17:47.45`	`captain_proton`	`198.11.20.0/24 dev eth1 proto kernel scope link src 198.11.20.195`
`17:47.46`	`captain_proton`	`198.11.20.0/24 dev eth2 proto kernel scope link src 198.11.20.73`
`17:52.03`	`captain_proton`	`yay, back to multilink goodness`
`17:52.12`	`captain_proton`	`SCREW YOU, QWEST`
`17:54.11`	`JBdiGriz`	`It doesn't sound like qwest did anything wrong.`
`17:54.34`	`captain_proton`	`well`
`17:54.37`	`captain_proton`	`they reallocated stuff`
`17:54.44`	`captain_proton`	`without choosing to tell anyone first`
`17:55.02`	`captain_proton`	`if they had told the university, i would have gotten notification`
`17:55.18`	`JBdiGriz`	`I've often hoped for an ISP that would send out notices before changes, I've never found one.`
`17:55.59`	`JBdiGriz`	`Your uni must be far better organized than most. Things like that usually get lost in administration, and never make it down to the tech people.`
`17:56.04`	`captain_proton`	`well - the isp gives me notices, just because i work for a sysadmin group at the uni and we get all network announcements`
`17:57.08`	`scanline`	`yay, university employment`
`17:57.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`I used to work for the university in the computer center. I received notices because I helped the network people get their job done. If they told me first, they could get it done faster.`
`17:57.23`	`captain_proton`	`heh`
`17:58.35`	`JBdiGriz`	`Of course, this was in the days before the web and google. Now everyone is an expert. I could tell by reading the discussion regarding T1 vs. T3 above. :)`
`17:58.45`	`captain_proton`	`hehe`
`17:59.04`	`Patlabor221`	`hey at least I poised my statements as questions :)`
`18:00.12`	`captain_proton`	`and make it cheap =}`
`18:00.26`	`JBdiGriz`	`cheap is good?`
`18:00.36`	`captain_proton`	`<-- starving college student`
`18:00.46`	`JBdiGriz`	`I'm now posing my statements as questions so I don't seem like an expert?`
`18:01.08`	`captain_proton`	`oh, ok`
`18:01.40`	`Patlabor221`	`hmm I can get 6 megs down, 384 up and 5 staic IPs for $80 a month`
`18:01.51`	`JBdiGriz`	`Of course, our resident log keeper will treat me like an idiot, but that's no different from anyone else?`
`18:04.34`	`larsl`	`~convert 190 SEK to USD`
`18:05.50`	`JBdiGriz`	`Patlabor221: That's $80 per month for 3 months, and then $160 per month for the next 9 months.`
`18:06.13`	`Patlabor221`	`it is?`
`18:06.14`	`brlcad`	`~change 190 SEK to USD`
`18:06.18`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh that sucks`
`18:06.40`	`brlcad`	`Mmm.. Corona`
`18:06.51`	`JBdiGriz`	`I knew it sounded too good. I might have gone for a deal like that.`
`18:07.01`	`Patlabor221`	`well it used to be 200 a month so guess it is coming down slowly`
`18:07.12`	`*** part/#bzflag drinian (~drinian@pcp03995358pcs.hamntn01.nj.comcast.net)`
`18:07.18`	`Patlabor221`	`how much is 1 dynamic at that speed?`
`18:07.26`	`larsl`	`$80 seems rather expensive for 6mbps/384kbps. Is it the extra IPs you would be paying for?`
`18:07.30`	`Patlabor221`	`and how is your new line going`
`18:07.46`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's $100 per month.`
`18:07.46`	`captain_proton`	`larsl: broadband is expensive in the USofA`
`18:08.23`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm ok with my 1.5 meg down, 256 up line`
`18:08.24`	`JBdiGriz`	`It seems to be going well. I was losing a couple of packets playing last night when my family was on, but it wasn't as bad as it has been.`
`18:09.13`	`JBdiGriz`	`I haven't switched all outgoing connections over to one server yet. The internal network changes are almost complete.`
`18:10.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`larsl: SBC doesn't provide single static IP's, only in sets of 5. The additional charge is about $40 per month for the static vs. the dynamic.`
`18:10.37`	`brlcad`	`my goodless, how I'd drool for a T1 at $50 a month .. if you've got half duplex at $25 -- that's sweet`
`18:10.59`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah we are paying like 700 for our full T1`
`18:11.06`	`Patlabor221`	`or something like that`
`18:11.06`	`brlcad`	`exactly`
`18:11.30`	`brlcad`	`I've not seen lower than $500 yet, without wierd clauses/caveats/sharing`
`18:11.42`	`larsl`	`~200 is the standard price in Swedish cities.`
`18:11.44`		`okay, larsl`
`18:11.45`	`Patlabor221`	`Im thinking we should get a 6 meg DSL here, use it for the emploies to browse, and leave the T1 for the web and mailservers`
`18:11.53`	`JBdiGriz`	`~200`
`18:11.54`		`from memory, 200 is the standard price in Swedish cities.`
`18:11.54`	`larsl`	`ibot: Not you.`
`18:11.56`		`larsl: are you using Windows?`
`18:11.58`	`captain_proton`	`the problem with the US is that the last mile is far too long`
`18:12.05`	`larsl`	`ibot, forget 200`
`18:12.05`		`larsl: i forgot 200`
`18:12.28`	`JBdiGriz`	`That seems a bit expensive, but maybe my mind is in the gutter again. :)`
`18:12.41`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah I thought it was only 50$`
`18:12.45`	`captain_proton`	`when i visited ietf/itu in japan, there was a presentation on FTTH in tokyo - $40/mo for 80mbit guaranteed, up to 450mbit burst`
`18:12.57`	`Patlabor221`	`damn`
`18:13.19`	`Nidhoggr`	`if you're in phoenix, our T1 prices are really low.`
`18:13.24`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor222 (~JeffM@208.48.199.202)`
`18:13.41`	`Patlabor221`	`how low is really low?`
`18:13.50`	`larsl`	`450 mbit burst = 450 mbit/s for a short while?`
`18:14.00`	`JBdiGriz`	`Nidhoggr: Any contracts for systems programmers in Phoenix?`
`18:14.14`	`captain_proton`	`larsl: yeah`
`18:14.18`	`larsl`	`That's fast. =)`
`18:15.28`	`Nidhoggr`	`as employees we just pay local loop.`
`18:15.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`which is about 250. we charge 200ish for the circuit... so customer would pay around 450 depending on location.`
`18:16.22`	`Patlabor221`	`I don't know what we are paying thru GlobalX now`
`18:16.35`	`*** join/#bzflag KR (~k@cae168-234-054.sc.rr.com)`
`18:16.49`	`KR`	`hola`
`18:17.09`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`18:17.15`	`Death_Barrel`	`back from lunch :)`
`18:17.23`	`KR`	`heya loser`
`18:17.33`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey ass clown`
`18:17.35`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:17.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR do you use the gimp?`
`18:17.54`	`JBdiGriz`	`¿Que tal?`
`18:17.57`	`KR`	`somewhat - not very well, as Pat can tell you ;)`
`18:18.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`hhe`
`18:18.04`	`Patlabor221`	`he's learning :)`
`18:18.05`	`KR`	`bien bien, tu?`
`18:18.13`	`Patlabor221`	`tho sucks that gimp dosn't do layer effects`
`18:18.26`	`Death_Barrel`	`well i forgot how to give an image a transparent background`
`18:18.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`do you guys know how?`
`18:18.32`	`JBdiGriz`	`muy bien, tampoco.`
`18:18.37`	`Patlabor221`	`put it in a layer`
`18:18.38`	`KR`	`draw it on plastic?`
`18:18.41`	`Patlabor221`	`then remove the background layer`
`18:18.46`	`KR`	`:)`
`18:18.48`	`Patlabor221`	`then save it`
`18:18.51`	`Patlabor221`	`that's the easyest way`
`18:18.54`	`Death_Barrel`	`as .gif right?`
`18:19.00`	`Patlabor221`	`or a png yes`
`18:19.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`ok`
`18:19.05`	`Death_Barrel`	`cool`
`18:19.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`thx`
`18:19.22`	`Patlabor221`	`there are other ways, but usualy the involve masks and alpha channels`
`18:19.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`i did it with my HoW patch`
`18:19.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`but it has been so long i forgot`
`18:19.32`	`Patlabor221`	`use the power of layers`
`18:19.38`	`Patlabor221`	`they are your friends`
`18:19.42`	`KR`	`lol`
`18:19.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`18:20.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`hey any of you guys want a copy of Visual Studio Enterprise Edition?`
`18:20.05`	`Patlabor221`	`I could not do 1/10th of the things I do with out layers`
`18:20.06`	`KR`	`I dont remember that from school, but will take your word on it ;)`
`18:20.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`doen't require a key code :)`
`18:20.17`	`Patlabor221`	`as brlcad can atest too :)`
`18:20.31`	`JBdiGriz`	`I'm not sure they ever taught layers in school.`
`18:20.32`	`Patlabor221`	`what version of VS?`
`18:20.36`	`KR`	`barrel - does it run on Linux? ;)`
`18:20.40`	`Death_Barrel`	`let me look`
`18:20.41`	`KR`	`jj`
`18:20.47`	`Patlabor221`	`probably under wine :)`
`18:20.54`	`JBdiGriz`	`KR: Start wining about it.`
`18:20.56`	`Death_Barrel`	`6.0`
`18:21.03`	`KR`	`wine wine wine`
`18:21.05`	`Patlabor221`	`VC6 is old`
`18:21.11`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah`
`18:21.13`	`KR`	`in my best feminine voice...`
`18:21.20`	`Death_Barrel`	`what is the current version?`
`18:21.23`	`Patlabor221`	`7.1`
`18:21.26`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah`
`18:21.27`	`Patlabor221`	`aka .net 2003`
`18:21.36`	`KR`	`one word barrel`
`18:21.38`	`KR`	`ebay`
`18:21.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`yeah, i will be getting that end of Janurary`
`18:22.04`	`Death_Barrel`	`how much could i sell copies for on ebay?`
`18:22.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`and isn't that illegal?`
`18:22.12`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:22.26`	`Patlabor221`	`is it a legit copy with a licesne?`
`18:22.29`	`KR`	`youre right - its probably SCO's IP anyway...`
`18:22.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`yes`
`18:22.34`	`Death_Barrel`	`legit`
`18:22.38`	`Patlabor221`	`has it been registerd to anyone?`
`18:22.48`	`Death_Barrel`	`probabally`
`18:22.50`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:22.51`	`Patlabor221`	`and has the seal been broken?`
`18:22.53`	`KR`	`lol`
`18:22.58`	`Death_Barrel`	`yes`
`18:23.02`	`Death_Barrel`	`i said copy`
`18:23.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:23.06`	`Patlabor221`	`then I don't thknk your suposed to sell it`
`18:23.07`	`KR`	`if you broke the seal, I'll call PETA`
`18:23.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`lmao`
`18:23.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`i though so`
`18:23.14`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh geting vC on warez is easy`
`18:23.25`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR r u trying to get me thrown i prison???`
`18:23.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:23.46`	`KR`	`heh - u can play bz with your prison lover, erm, "cellmate"`
`18:23.50`	`Patlabor221`	`use it to get a .net 2k3 update, its' better :)`
`18:24.24`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR don't drop the soap`
`18:24.25`	`JBdiGriz`	`M$ will always tell you to pay money for the update, since it's "better". :{)`
`18:24.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`18:24.40`	`Patlabor221`	`ok, well we use the term "sucks less"`
`18:24.49`	`KR`	`lol`
`18:24.49`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:24.57`	`Patlabor221`	`we actualy made a fake banner for our product to freak out the boss`
`18:25.07`	`Patlabor221`	`"GibbsCAM 2000: It sucks less!"`
`18:25.12`	`KR`	`lmao`
`18:25.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`lmfao`
`18:25.20`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`18:25.39`	`Death_Barrel`	`ummmmmm, i just ate chick-a-filet`
`18:25.43`	`Death_Barrel`	`it was good`
`18:25.55`	`Patlabor221`	`for our last version we wanted to put in "Now with non crapy interface"`
`18:25.56`	`larsl`	`"- Machine gun fires non-stop when you pick it up" - how do I reproduce this bug?`
`18:26.00`	`KR`	`I'm calling PETA for sure now`
`18:26.06`	`Death_Barrel`	`pat: lol`
`18:26.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`larsl: lol`
`18:26.35`	`larsl`	`It seems to work as usual for me.`
`18:26.36`	`Death_Barrel`	`sometimes you guys make me laugh`
`18:26.44`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR you always make me laugh`
`18:26.45`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:26.46`	`larsl`	`Death_Barrel: That was from the BUGS file.`
`18:26.55`	`JBdiGriz`	`Patlabor221: stealing lines from bbedit and apple now.`
`18:26.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`18:27.05`	`Death_Barrel`	`oic`
`18:27.17`	`Patlabor221`	`I am?`
`18:27.31`	`KR`	`JB is the real reason behind all the SCO stuff in the Linux jernel...`
`18:27.31`	`Patlabor221`	`well we did get rid of our mac centric inteface`
`18:28.15`	`JBdiGriz`	`There was an article in cnet about the guy who was behind all the SCO stuff in Linux.`
`18:28.21`	`KR`	`Pat - did you play with that graphic any more?`
`18:28.51`	`KR`	`JB - Hellwig or something like that?`
`18:28.54`	`Patlabor221`	`JBdiGriz, imagine this, our app makes calls to the OS6/7 MacOS API, then reads in Mac resourece files that have been converted to data forks, then draws them all using windows API calls :)`
`18:29.08`	`Patlabor221`	`no KR, I have not, been doing real work today sadly.`
`18:29.14`	`KR`	`lol pat`
`18:29.28`	`larsl`	`Patlabor221: Uh? On which OS is that?`
`18:29.34`	`Patlabor221`	`we do this on windows`
`18:29.49`	`JBdiGriz`	`It was slashdot, and you're right KR, it was Chris Hellwig. It seems that SCO told him to put it into Linux. http://slashdot.org/articles/03/12/03/007222.shtml?tid=123&tid=130&tid=185&tid=187&tid=190&tid=88&tid=99`
`18:29.51`	`Patlabor221`	`but all our app gui calls the MacOS API:)`
`18:30.49`	`Patlabor221`	`ohh and we use the Mac resource manager to manage all our part data, but its keept in a data fork on the file :)`
`18:31.48`	`Patlabor221`	`at least we are better now, we used to draw all our own UI`
`18:32.07`	`Patlabor221`	`now at least we create native controlls and windows`
`18:32.43`	`KR`	`JB - Groklaw had a huge story on that too - maybe the /. story references it...`
`18:32.49`	`*** join/#bzflag jolly (~k@jvnineteen.ne.client2.attbi.com)`
`18:33.29`	`JBdiGriz`	`kr, /. is pointing to the groklaw story. It's truly wonderful reading.`
`18:33.59`	`JBdiGriz`	`I don't usually bother with the /. responses. :)`
`18:34.31`	`JBdiGriz`	`hello jolly, what are you up to today?`
`18:35.44`	`jolly`	`hey JB`
`18:35.48`	`jolly`	`im not up to much`
`18:35.50`	`jolly`	`yourself? :)`
`18:36.10`	`Patlabor221`	`so they acted all happy and open when it suited them, now want to sue people for code the gave away cus they are outa money?`
`18:36.59`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`18:37.24`	`KR`	`pretty much Pat, although they are getting rich atthe same time`
`18:37.36`	`KR`	`based on the pump and dump of their stock, IMO`
`18:37.54`	`KR`	`and they continue to give the code away, btw`
`18:38.14`	`Patlabor221`	`humans are wierd`
`18:38.20`	`KR`	`agreed`
`18:38.28`	`KR`	`all of em except me that is :0`
`18:38.45`	`KR`	`it helps if you wine a lot...`
`18:38.59`	`JBdiGriz`	`i'm sitting here typing about various subjects and avoiding getting my real work done. :)`
`18:39.21`	`Death_Barrel`	`pat: can you guide me through the layer stuff on gimp?`
`18:39.22`	`jolly`	`heh`
`18:39.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`can i pm you about it?`
`18:39.33`	`Death_Barrel`	`i can't seem to remember`
`18:39.35`	`Death_Barrel`	`:(`
`18:39.43`	`KR`	`ndoing a good job of it too, JB ;)`
`18:39.56`	`JBdiGriz`	`Try drinking less beer, it helps you remember. :)`
`18:40.00`	`KR`	`barrel - google "grokking the GIMP"`
`18:40.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:40.15`	`Death_Barrel`	`~kr`
`18:40.18`		`well, kr is = Krotch Rubber`
`18:40.19`	`Death_Barrel`	`~death barrrel`
`18:40.25`	`JBdiGriz`	`KR has the 'n' disease. (too much bzflag typing)`
`18:40.33`	`Death_Barrel`	`hehe`
`18:40.33`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`18:40.36`	`Death_Barrel`	`i get that sometimes also`
`18:40.43`	`Nidhoggr`	`n:)`
`18:40.44`	`Nidhoggr`	`;)`
`18:40.58`	`KR`	`http://gimp-savvy.com/BOOK/ - look there you putz`
`18:41.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`thx Krotch donkey`
`18:41.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`:D`
`18:41.30`	`KR`	`oh btw - tell your mom I said Hi... ;)`
`18:41.32`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR: that is where i am`
`18:41.34`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:41.39`	`Death_Barrel`	`i have already looked there`
`18:41.51`	`Death_Barrel`	`doesnt' explain trancparency that well`
`18:42.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`i will figure it out`
`18:42.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR likes FAT Women :)`
`18:42.26`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:43.00`	`JBdiGriz`	`nothing wrong with personal taste. someone has to like all sorts of women, and men. :)`
`18:43.17`	`brlcad`	`more to hold on to`
`18:43.22`	`Death_Barrel`	`eeeeeewwwwwwwwwwww`
`18:43.24`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:43.42`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR: JB said you like men ....lol`
`18:43.43`	`JBdiGriz`	`someone is highlighting their inexperience.`
`18:44.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`put a bag over their head and it always looks good :D`
`18:44.34`	`JBdiGriz`	`I've never tried that technique, I'll have to take your word for it.`
`18:45.07`	`KR`	`barrel - I'll send my skinny little Vietnamese girlfriend over there to put some kung-foo on ya if you don't watch it :)`
`18:45.26`	`KR`	`she's purty, but she's meee-eean`
`18:45.30`	`KR`	`lol`
`18:45.33`	`JBdiGriz`	`kr, I'll watch it :)`
`18:46.02`	`brlcad`	`:)`
`18:46.03`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR you do that!! asian women like their hair pulld and liked to be choked while fornicating :D`
`18:46.09`	`KR`	`omg`
`18:46.11`	`KR`	`lol`
`18:46.21`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:46.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`serious`
`18:46.36`	`KR`	`I'll tell her you said that - lol - what was your address again? :)`
`18:46.37`	`Death_Barrel`	`they loved to be choked for some reason`
`18:46.48`	`Death_Barrel`	`i don't understand why`
`18:46.52`	`Death_Barrel`	`but they just do :D`
`18:47.01`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`18:47.07`	`Death_Barrel`	`ask her i beat she will say she likes it :)`
`18:47.16`	`KR`	`hi barrel - your evil cousin just left...`
`18:47.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`???`
`18:47.32`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:47.35`	`JBdiGriz`	`his connection has more sense than the operator.`
`18:48.23`	`KR`	`did you guys see Fortix new website?`
`18:48.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`url?`
`18:48.36`	`KR`	`league page...`
`18:49.01`	`KR`	`http://flightboards.4gigs.com/fortix/index.php`
`18:49.37`	`Patlabor221`	`decently clean, don't know if I like the texture on the fortix part, but it's a nice layout`
`18:49.53`	`[dmp]`	`<html><title>TDS Homepage</title><body>Under construction. KR will do it</body></html>`
`18:50.01`	`brlcad`	`hehe, I like the screenshot of daBomb :)`
`18:50.07`	`Death_Barrel`	`ah fooey, they don't need a page, they don;t even play matches :)`
`18:50.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:50.32`	`KR`	`they have a comment book too - not that I'm saying we should fill it up or anything...`
`18:50.45`	`KR`	`O:-)`
`18:50.51`	`[dmp]`	`Let'`
`18:50.58`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol kr`
`18:51.04`	`KR`	`barrel has an easier time with transvestency`
`18:51.05`	`[dmp]`	`let's coordinate a brute-force attact on their guestbook :)`
`18:51.05`	`Death_Barrel`	`i might just take your advise`
`18:51.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR you donkey chode`
`18:51.19`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`18:51.19`	`KR`	`DDOS the Guestbook!`
`18:51.20`	`Patlabor221`	`did you make another layer?`
`18:51.27`	`Death_Barrel`	`yes pat`
`18:51.36`	`Patlabor221`	`did you paste your image into that layer?`
`18:51.50`	`Patlabor221`	`and erase the parts of the iamge you want transperant`
`18:52.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`hmmm, i can't tell, i think i pasted the new layer on my image and that is why the hard time`
`18:52.10`	`Death_Barrel`	`ok pat: i will try that`
`18:52.12`	`KR`	`barrel - the "smart scissors" work good to cut shapes from the background`
`18:52.19`	`Patlabor221`	`also remove the orogonal layer`
`18:52.23`	`Patlabor221`	`the "Background" one`
`18:52.33`	`Patlabor221`	`we call it the Magic wand :)`
`18:53.13`	`Death_Barrel`	`ok pat: i think i figured it out :D`
`18:53.16`	`Death_Barrel`	`thx fot eh help :)`
`18:53.23`	`Patlabor221`	`sure`
`18:53.32`	`KR`	`lol pat`
`18:53.34`	`Patlabor221`	`you shoudl see a gray checkerboard in all the areas that are transperant`
`18:53.51`	`Death_Barrel`	`now everyone attack the fotrix guestbook!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1`
`18:53.56`	`Death_Barrel`	`charge!~!!!!`
`18:54.22`	`Patlabor221`	`really man, there are many brands of decaf that are just as tasty as the regular brands`
`18:54.33`	`JBdiGriz`	`that's what the #bzflag channel is here for, gimp assistance and web design.`
`18:54.52`	`Patlabor221`	`well it's cerntaly not for development discussions`
`18:55.18`	`brlcad`	`Ah.. I haven't heard a real genious quote in a long time :)`
`18:55.39`	`Patlabor221`	`yay lookit gimp crash`
`18:55.40`	`KR`	`barrel needs TP`
`18:55.43`	`JBdiGriz`	`at least not before 10pm (EST)`
`18:55.58`	`brlcad`	`gimp?? no photoshop?`
`18:56.04`	`Patlabor221`	`they don't have PS`
`18:56.15`	`Patlabor221`	`so I was making sure my instructions were correct for them`
`18:56.20`	`brlcad`	`arr`
`18:56.21`	`JBdiGriz`	`must be the starving college student syndrome again.`
`18:56.36`	`Patlabor221`	`silly people can't even have layer effects, can you imagine that!!?!?`
`18:56.55`	`Death_Barrel`	`brlcad: i have found that i like gimp better than photoshop :)`
`18:57.02`	`brlcad`	`PS elements is nearly complete even for college kiddies at 99 bucks`
`18:57.03`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`18:57.09`	`Patlabor221`	`I sent KR the PSD for the logos, and all he could see was the all white base shapes :)`
`18:57.14`	`larsl`	`What's a layer effect?`
`18:57.39`	`Patlabor221`	`like having the software automaticly put a dropshadow on all things in a layer`
`18:57.42`	`Patlabor221`	`not as a filter`
`18:57.45`	`JBdiGriz`	`Patlabor221: Have you added that to the P24 glossary?`
`18:57.47`	`Patlabor221`	`but as a paramaetic effect`
`18:57.57`	`brlcad`	`gimp has some rather creative filters/plugins, but it can't touch photoshop's high-definition capabilities`
`18:58.01`	`KR`	`yes - but I am a Gimpignoramus and may have done something wrong - its entirely possible`
`18:58.04`	`Patlabor221`	`so you edit the layer and it updates the shadow`
`18:58.13`	`larsl`	`Ah.`
`18:58.15`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah gim can only do it with a filter`
`18:58.24`	`Patlabor221`	`PS has like 10 difrent layer effects`
`18:58.31`	`brlcad`	`or more`
`18:58.41`	`Patlabor221`	`all I really "drew" in all those logos was white shapes`
`18:59.00`	`Patlabor221`	`all the shadows/bevels/gradents were added by the layer effects`
`18:59.14`	`Patlabor221`	`so as I edit the logo the effects just propigate`
`18:59.17`	`Patlabor221`	`it's really cool`
`18:59.28`	`Patlabor221`	`I was guessing brlcad :)`
`18:59.34`	`brlcad`	`12 major modes`
`18:59.37`	`Patlabor221`	`did you get PS CS yet?`
`18:59.50`	`Patlabor221`	`or I guess just the entire CD`
`18:59.52`	`Patlabor221`	`CS`
`18:59.53`	`JBdiGriz`	`KR: you don't do coding, or art. What is your function? (besides sailing)`
`18:59.54`	`Nidhoggr`	`I need to get ps cs`
`19:00.03`	`KR`	`beer. food.`
`19:00.22`	`Patlabor221`	`they busted the TGA writer again :(`
`19:00.32`	`Nidhoggr`	`what does it do?`
`19:00.34`	`Patlabor221`	`and we have DXF issues in illustrator`
`19:00.38`	`KR`	`I make semi custom outdoor gear for people, tents mostly.`
`19:00.45`	`Patlabor221`	`it won't write out a 32 bit TGA file`
`19:00.53`	`KR`	`a seamstress`
`19:00.56`	`Nidhoggr`	`that's not good.`
`19:00.57`	`KR`	`;)`
`19:01.06`	`JBdiGriz`	`KR: cool, expedition quality?`
`19:01.17`	`brlcad`	`kr: beer, food, and foreign relations with asian dignitaries, no? :)`
`19:01.23`	`Patlabor221`	`sucks even when you spec an alpha channel`
`19:01.27`	`KR`	`yeah, but super lightweight`
`19:01.36`	`KR`	`lol brl - yes!`
`19:01.46`	`KR`	`I need some diplomacy - its been a few days ;)`
`19:01.49`	`JBdiGriz`	`expedition is always super lightweight.`
`19:01.53`	`brlcad`	`rotfl!`
`19:02.27`	`KR`	`JB - most of the big companies sell this stuff they tout as "bombproof" etc, so its way heavier than what is really needed`
`19:02.34`	`JBdiGriz`	`Is everything custom, or do you do work for some of the outdoors companies.`
`19:03.17`	`KR`	`a lot of my customers are doing 2000+ mile hikes, and their base packweight is sub-15 pounds (ie no food or water, but everything else)`
`19:03.26`	`JBdiGriz`	`I used to buy my stuff at REI, and Adventure 19. That was in the days before kids.`
`19:03.27`	`KR`	`only for individuals`
`19:03.29`	`larsl`	`~2000*1.6`
`19:03.31`		`3200`
`19:03.52`	`larsl`	`Ick.`
`19:04.45`	`KR`	`OK - post office time (which sucks during this season) C u all later`
`19:04.48`	`JBdiGriz`	`larsl: There are lots of people who enjoy that sort of thing. I used to spend a lot of time on skis traveling into the backcountry.`
`19:05.10`	`larsl`	`I enjoy hiking, but 3200 kilometers is very long. =)`
`19:05.49`	`KR`	`I have one guy who, at age 62, walked from Key West to Maine, then through Quebec to the Cape Gaspe Peninsula, then took a boat to Newfoundland, and hiked across it - all in one year`
`19:05.53`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's not something you undertake lightly. :)`
`19:06.08`	`KR`	`last year he hiked from Cape Haterras to San diego`
`19:06.26`	`JBdiGriz`	`What time of year did he get through the Rockies?`
`19:06.48`	`KR`	`this year he;s going up the west coast, then across the NW, down through the Dakotas, and will wind up back midwest somewhere before winter sets in`
`19:07.05`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`19:07.11`	`KR`	`that was in August IIRC JB`
`19:07.34`	`JBdiGriz`	`Is he taking the coastal route along the beach, or taking the Sierra trail?`
`19:07.55`	`KR`	`he's walking the new Pacific Coast Trail - or what there is of it so far`
`19:08.16`	`JBdiGriz`	`August in the Rockies isn't bad, but that puts you in the desert around september which can be a problem.`
`19:08.21`	`KR`	`he kind of trailbreaks - helps find routes for others`
`19:08.56`	`KR`	`the Key West to Quebeck route is now known as the International Appalachian Trail`
`19:09.06`	`KR`	`ack sp Quebec wrong`
`19:09.43`	`KR`	`OK, off`
`19:09.44`	`brlcad`	`eh, take off`
`19:09.54`	`KR`	`lol`
`19:10.39`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's the inland trail, which was recently completed iirc. http://www.pcta.org/calmaps.asp`
`19:11.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR you mentioned smart sissors before?`
`19:11.29`	`Death_Barrel`	`where the hell are they?`
`19:13.24`	`larsl`	`Death_Barrel: Do you mean the magic wand (that selects connected regions with the same color)?`
`19:17.07`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`19:27.09`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`19:31.01`	`Death_Barrel`	`larsl: not sure`
`19:31.09`	`Death_Barrel`	`KR just said something about smart sissors`
`19:31.19`	`Death_Barrel`	`just exploring my options :D`
`19:32.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`anyone wanna borrow my extra sharp running scissors?`
`19:32.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`19:32.53`	`Death_Barrel`	`lol`
`19:33.19`	`Death_Barrel`	`sure, email them to me>>> scissorman@razorsharp.com`
`19:33.28`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`19:34.23`	`Death_Barrel`	`they have the funniest free web mail addresses out there>>>> http://tshirthell.com/emailhell.htm`
`19:34.31`	`Death_Barrel`	`take a look`
`19:37.17`	`*** join/#bzflag Death_Barrel (clx@gss-tech.com)`
`19:37.48`	`*** join/#bzflag Nidhoggr (mandrake@tiphareth.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`19:37.48`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+bbb !@.dip.t-dialin.net !edelstei@* !@68.111.116.228] by pratchett.freenode.net`
`19:37.48`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+bbb cell!@ sussudio!@ gorb!@] by pratchett.freenode.net`
`19:45.14`	`Death_Barrel`	`bbl guys :)`
`19:55.32`	`*** join/#bzflag corndawg (~who_cares@c-24-131-245-105.mw.client2.attbi.com)`
`19:55.34`	`corndawg`	`hey all`
`20:04.46`	`*** join/#bzflag learner1 (~brlcad@chr160dhcp1509.chrchv01.md.comcast.net)`
`20:05.59`	`Grumbler`	`learner comes, learner goes, and the clients still turn`
`20:08.22`	`*** join/#bzflag Chikorita (Chikorita@AC8C4BE0.ipt.aol.com)`
`20:13.26`	`Chikorita`	`~weather khgr`
`20:13.52`	`Chikorita`	`~d`
`20:14.03`	`Chikorita`	`~quol`
`20:16.30`	`*** join/#bzflag brlcad (~brlcad@chr160dhcp1509.chrchv01.md.comcast.net)`
`20:17.20`	`larsl`	`~weather essb`
`20:19.17`	`Grumbler`	`alrighty.......snow forcast for thursday night`
`20:20.16`	`corndawg`	`hum...`
`20:20.30`	`corndawg`	`normal jump for a tank is what 15 with bzedit?`
`20:20.39`	`corndawg`	`<-- trying to remember`
`20:21.36`	`larsl`	`bzedit?`
`20:22.10`	`corndawg`	`yea`
`20:22.14`	`corndawg`	`map builder`
`20:22.20`	`larsl`	`I know.`
`20:22.28`	`larsl`	`But can you set the jump height in the map?`
`20:22.48`	`corndawg`	`for the blocks you can`
`20:23.01`	`corndawg`	`ya can em as high up or low as ya want`
`20:27.01`	`Pimpinella`	`~d`
`20:27.15`	`Pimpinella`	`fein fein`
`20:37.46`	`Patlabor221`	`tanks can jump about 18 high`
`20:37.51`	`Patlabor221`	`but it is hard`
`20:37.57`	`corndawg`	`ahh ok`
`20:37.59`	`Patlabor221`	`15 is a common norm`
`20:38.14`	`corndawg`	`k good... cause i been doing 15`
`20:39.00`	`corndawg`	`lol i quit doing 2 level maps... too much work... and a royal pain in the ass to do`
`20:42.30`	`Patlabor221`	`wow spoogie is sad if all he can do is jsut keep reposting the same messages`
`20:42.45`	`Patlabor221`	`hey cap is there way to ban a SF account?`
`20:44.24`	`brlcad`	`I'd give him a few days to pluder before annoying the sf admins, unless there's a way to ban him specifically from bzflag on the admin interface`
`20:44.56`	`Patlabor221`	`that is my query`
`20:45.09`	`Patlabor221`	`cap has access to the full admin interface`
`20:45.09`	`brlcad`	`something new since last night?`
`20:45.16`	`brlcad`	`I hadn't seen an e-mail`
`20:45.37`	`Patlabor221`	`he has reposted a second one a couple of times`
`20:45.49`	`Patlabor221`	`it's very weak`
`20:46.42`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`20:46.44`	`larsl`	`Patlabor221: There are no such settings in the SF forum admin interface.`
`20:46.55`	`Patlabor221`	`k`
`20:47.36`	`larsl`	`All you can do is make the forums public or not public and allow or not allow anonymous posts.`
`20:47.43`	`larsl`	`And set an email to send everything to.`
`20:48.01`	`Patlabor221`	`that is what I saw in the admins I could do, I didn't know if cap had any more options then I had`
`20:48.16`	`Patlabor221`	`as he is set higher then we are`
`20:48.28`	`larsl`	`I was checking my own project. =)`
`20:48.28`	`Pimpinella`	`some admin for ducati here?`
`20:49.35`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh ok, thanks :)`
`20:49.40`	`Patlabor221`	`what is your project`
`20:49.49`	`larsl`	`http://keso-project.sf.net`
`20:49.59`	`larsl`	`Csound front end. Very not finished.`
`20:50.24`	`Patlabor221`	`coo`
`20:50.46`	`Pimpinella`	`somebody can imagine snOw mOnkey is cheating? i dont know him really...`
`20:51.06`	`captain_proton`	`Pimpinella: snow isn't cheating unless its an imposter`
`20:51.09`	`larsl`	`Pimpinella: Could be someone using his/hers/its callsign too.`
`20:51.42`	`Pimpinella`	`his shots seem to be slightly too fast, but maybe im wrong`
`21:01.08`	`TimRiker`	`brlcad: there isn't a ban feature that I'm aware of on sf admin.`
`21:01.19`	`captain_proton`	`ban on sf?`
`21:02.23`	`*** join/#bzflag brailsmt (~michael@c-67-169-252-177.client.comcast.net)`
`21:02.52`	`brailsmt`	`howdy all...`
`21:03.03`	`brailsmt`	`:)`
`21:10.56`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~JeffM@208.48.199.202)`
`21:10.56`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ`
`21:19.43`	`*** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`21:24.16`	`*** join/#bzflag creeperz (~creeperz@host-11-76-220-24.midco.net)`
`21:34.06`	`*** join/#bzflag o (nikt@sl225.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)`
`21:48.04`	`brlcad`	`how do the unixers feel about .bzflag.d instead of .bzf?`
`21:48.27`	`brlcad`	`I've seen a couple other apps go with a suffix approach like that`
`21:48.35`	`*** join/#bzflag captain_pistachi (~blardebla@navi.cs.colorado.edu)`
`21:48.35`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_pistachi] by ChanServ`
`21:56.23`	`larsl`	`brlcad: I haven't seen that before, but it doesn't really matter to me.`
`21:57.06`	`larsl`	`All of the config directories in my home directory is ".appname" though.`
`21:57.12`	`larsl`	`s/is/are/`
`21:58.21`	`brlcad`	`right, I mean for apps that previously/currently use a file named .whatever though too`
`21:58.24`	`brlcad`	`like .emacs`
`21:58.30`	`brlcad`	`they have a .emacs.d now`
`21:58.53`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's very System V'sh ala ATT, Novell, SCO.`
`21:58.55`	`larsl`	`Ah. I only have XEmacs installed.`
`21:59.00`	`brlcad`	`I believe mozilla had something similar at one point too (could be mistaken)`
`22:01.11`	`brailsmt`	`how close is 1.8?`
`22:01.17`	`brlcad`	`hehe`
`22:01.22`	`JBdiGriz`	`1.8 is dead`
`22:01.24`	`larsl`	`I think Tim liked .bzf because it could mean both bzfs, bzflag, bzfls etc.`
`22:01.48`	`brailsmt`	`ok, so how far off is the next version?`
`22:01.48`	`brlcad`	`but in practice it doesn't mean any of them really`
`22:02.09`	`larsl`	`brailsmt: Anything from a few weeks to several months.`
`22:02.17`	`JBdiGriz`	`When TimRiker decides that it's ready for release, he'll let us know.`
`22:02.19`	`brailsmt`	`larsl: great answer...`
`22:02.20`	`larsl`	`brailsmt: We are mostly fixing bugs now.`
`22:02.28`	`brailsmt`	`ok, that is more like it :)`
`22:02.29`	`brlcad`	`i.e. that the name isn't directly associateable to any of them`
`22:02.58`	`larsl`	`brailsmt: It will be called "1.10".`
`22:04.30`	`larsl`	`brlcad: We could call it .bzf* (with a literal '*'). =)`
`22:04.32`	`brlcad`	`1.10.0`
`22:04.36`	`brlcad`	`larsl: heh`
`22:05.28`	`brlcad`	`if the other binaries need config files, we could rather easily have .bzfs .bzflag .bzfs.d .bzflag.d, etc`
`22:05.52`	`JBdiGriz`	`brlcad: I'm not sure it makes a large difference. The latest convention seems to be .appname rather than .appname.d although there is certainly nothing consistent these days.`
`22:05.52`	`brlcad`	`there's comfort in the names matching the binary`
`22:06.16`	`*** join/#bzflag sbo491 (~cgiirc@66.62.140.111)`
`22:07.41`	`brlcad`	`jb: i quite agree (hasn't that always been the convention?), I also think .bzflag (the file) should still be used too`
`22:08.52`	`JBdiGriz`	`It used to be that the config files were scripts, and so were quite often .<appname>rc where rc stands for run command.`
`22:09.41`	`JBdiGriz`	`emacs came from the gnu (Gnu's not unix) world, so they had to be different, and they're script file was .emacs.`
`22:09.47`	`brlcad`	`./bzflag < .bzflag # :)`
`22:09.57`	`JBdiGriz`	`excuse me, their`
`22:11.06`	`JBdiGriz`	`People started putting together more config files, and it tended to go into .<appname> directories although sometimes they just populated the home directory with a dozen different files.`
`22:11.33`	`larsl`	`.bzf/config is a list of commands to run now.`
`22:11.42`	`larsl`	`set, bind etc.`
`22:12.00`	`JBdiGriz`	`AT&T redid the /etc/rc* system and put in the /etc/rc.d/* system, and so people adopted the .d extension as meaning it's a directory.`
`22:12.11`	`JBdiGriz`	`Personally, Im`
`22:12.24`	`JBdiGriz`	`not fond of the three letter extensions.`
`22:12.33`	`JBdiGriz`	`too DOS'ish`
`22:12.41`	`brlcad`	`three letter? heh`
`22:13.13`	`JBdiGriz`	`8.3 was rather in vogue for a while. :)`
`22:13.33`	`*** join/#bzflag trepan (~trepan@CPE0040f42db082-CM00e06f15f704.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`22:13.38`	`brlcad`	`what would you use if you had/wanted to represent both a file and a directory for an app?`
`22:13.46`	`larsl`	`I like having all of the files in a single directory, the more stuff that is placed directly in the home directory the harder it is to find the files you're looking for.`
`22:14.51`	`JBdiGriz`	`I would use the .appname as a directory, put the config file in the directory as .config, and check at startup to make sure it's a directory. If not, make the appropriate adjustment and be done with it.`
`22:17.48`	`brlcad`	`The problem I run into with that approach is that an app begins to utilize the dir more and more and files are added, you end up having to explain which file to edit (why .config instead of some other random convention). whereas a .whatever or .whateverrc in the home should never require explanation. then the dir can be used and be made non-backwards compatible on a whim as users will/should never edit anything in there.`
`22:18.35`	`brlcad`	`it basically becomes a persistent scratch space for the application`
`22:19.48`	`brlcad`	`hrm, no biggie to me really. just pondering alternatives`
`22:20.29`	`*** join/#bzflag purple_cow (~jupiter@navi.cs.colorado.edu)`
`22:20.43`	`JBdiGriz`	`Always good to bring up issues which might affect the population. One of these days we might come up with some brilliant solution, patent it, and then we could sue SCO in order to finance bzflag development. :)`
`22:21.04`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`22:23.52`	`brlcad`	`writing grant proposals sucks major cough, unless you win`
`22:23.59`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-82-84-96-102.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:24.04`	`larsl`	`Are there any plans to change the format of the cached worlds to plain text instead of binary (perhaps zipped)? Or would that slow down the cache too much?`
`22:24.24`	`Patlabor221`	`they are binary?`
`22:24.35`	`larsl`	`They are definitely not text.`
`22:24.37`	`JBdiGriz`	`There are people who are good at writing such things. I'm happy to assist them if they know their job.`
`22:24.52`	`Patlabor221`	`well it wouldhave more info then what is in the text based worlds`
`22:24.59`	`Patlabor221`	`and there is the world saver now isn't there?`
`22:25.09`	`brlcad`	`there is indeed`
`22:25.17`	`larsl`	`Yup. Just wondering.`
`22:25.37`	`Patlabor221`	`so the cache world is not really the same as the servers text world, it has some server specific info`
`22:25.56`	`larsl`	`Isn't that stored in the "BZFS191Servers.bzs" file?`
`22:26.05`	`JBdiGriz`	`Given that bzflag is now being used for coursework, we might consider looking into an education or darpa grant, if there's someone here who knows about such things.`
`22:26.30`	`Patlabor221`	`what is the money needed for?`
`22:26.35`	`Patlabor221`	`somone gonna go full time on it?`
`22:26.50`	`brlcad`	`sure, I would for AI development`
`22:26.53`	`JBdiGriz`	`learner, you interested in taking a leave of absence from the army?`
`22:27.16`	`brlcad`	`JB: they're called weekends and afternoons :)`
`22:27.37`	`brlcad`	`I can fit two 30-40 hour weeks in easy :)`
`22:27.39`	`JBdiGriz`	`I would guess that MrAC might be interested in serious development rather than piecemeal.`
`22:28.20`	`JBdiGriz`	`learner (like rust) never sleeps :)`
`22:28.34`	`Tupone`	`brlcad: hi`
`22:28.38`	`brlcad`	`rust doesn't sleep? go figure.`
`22:28.43`	`brlcad`	`heya tupone`
`22:29.07`	`larsl`	`Good night.`
`22:29.25`	`JBdiGriz`	`brlcad: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000002KDG/103-3941932-7805457?v=glance`
`22:29.28`	`brlcad`	`learner has found some rather interesting documentation ideas on the ldp site`
`22:29.48`	`brlcad`	`hehe`
`22:30.12`	`JBdiGriz`	`brlcad: url?`
`22:30.50`	`brlcad`	`http://www.tldp.org/`
`22:31.04`	`JBdiGriz`	`specific to these ideas?`
`22:31.35`	`brlcad`	`in particular, I found wikitext and their docbook templates rather interesting`
`22:31.52`	`brlcad`	`I followed them a couple years ago when they had just started converting to docbook`
`22:31.58`	`brlcad`	`they've matured some`
`22:34.31`	`*** join/#bzflag MrCooper (~daenzer@dclient80-218-113-133.hispeed.ch)`
`22:34.33`	`brlcad`	`e-mailed the wikitext author as the database doesn't appear to be in use any more, curious as to why`
`22:38.05`	`brlcad`	`but I'm pretty sure I can set up a similar system for us that ties into the new website`
`22:43.30`	`*** join/#bzflag MortimeR (~MortimeR@80.102.71.127)`
`23:06.54`	`*** join/#bzflag cniV (~kchan@c211-30-113-108.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`23:07.00`	`brlcad`	`users don't know or care about any difference they may have behind the scenes`
`23:07.09`	`brlcad`	`to them it's just a command`
`23:07.13`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`23:07.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`and if commands are consistant (with or without slash, etc), all the better.`
`23:07.45`	`brlcad`	`indeed`
`23:07.49`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`23:07.56`	`JBdiGriz`	`Having every command begin with a / would make sense, so people wouldn't see me typing lagtsats all the time.`
`23:07.59`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`23:08.37`	`Nidhoggr`	`hrm. what is the actual command if you were to send a private message on the server, and you couldn't arrow to a recpient?`
`23:08.57`	`Nidhoggr`	`or is it possible?`
`23:09.11`	`JBdiGriz`	`I don't think there is such an interface`
`23:09.41`	`Nidhoggr`	`for instance.. i want to run bzadmin in command line mode and send specific user a message... would it be possible?`
`23:09.41`	`brlcad`	`yes, I don't think such a thing exists ala /msg JBdiGriz`
`23:10.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`if I'm going to write a perl bot that does some adminny tasks, something like that would be handy.`
`23:10.09`	`brlcad`	`sounds like an easy little command to add, though`
`23:10.12`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`23:10.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`Feed your trained programmer a banana, and have him add it.`
`23:10.36`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`23:10.41`	`Nidhoggr`	`he hasn't touched bzadmin yet.`
`23:11.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`vicious is a good guy... he's hard to train though. ;)`
`23:11.22`	`JBdiGriz`	`He doesn't like bananas?`
`23:12.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`dunno :)`
`23:13.16`	`JBdiGriz`	`I have found that most programmers are pretty easy to train, once you understand how they approach problems. They tend to think in fairly discrete steps, so you can just lead them to the answers you like.`
`23:13.19`	`KR\|po`	`bananas in pajamas are a rare sight these days`
`23:13.40`	`JBdiGriz`	`That was a long time at the post office.`
`23:13.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`well, I want to keep him fresh for 1.10 mods. :)`
`23:13.48`	`KR`	`I took a nap`
`23:13.55`	`Nidhoggr`	`naps are good. I need one.`
`23:14.04`	`Nidhoggr`	`I'm supposed to make soap with a friend tonight.`
`23:14.04`	`KR`	`the PO guy was mad at me when I woke up ;)`
`23:14.10`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`23:14.20`	`JBdiGriz`	`Like bananas, you should never put programmers in the freezer/refrigerator.`
`23:14.23`	`KR`	`jj, had dinner afterwards, and read a bit`
`23:14.27`	`Nidhoggr`	`good idea.`
`23:14.32`	`JBdiGriz`	`It doesn't keep them any fresher.`
`23:14.43`	`KR`	`neither does the oven...`
`23:15.06`	`KR`	`sailing movie on A&E tonight - Horatio Hornblower - ARRRR!`
`23:15.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`banana smoothie... mmmmmm.`
`23:15.19`	`JBdiGriz`	`Giving them an unusual task which requires them to think slightly differently than before or learn something new will often freshen up a programmer though.`
`23:15.27`	`Nidhoggr`	`even better with a little chocolate syrup.`
`23:15.28`	`brlcad`	`oh, drat.. that's why wget didn't stash dutchrai's images.. damn robots.txt...`
`23:15.38`	`KR`	`I'm with Nid on the smoothies -mmmmm`
`23:15.44`	`KR`	`better is summer tho`
`23:15.48`	`KR`	`in not is`
`23:15.49`	`Patlabor221`	`google dosn't have it?`
`23:16.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`I am big on frozen fruit smoothies. every morning for breakfast.`
`23:16.09`	`brlcad`	`don't think so pat`
`23:16.30`	`KR`	`I freeze my fruits so I don't have to use ice - makes the smoothie thicker :)`
`23:16.37`	`Patlabor221`	`I can check if my chace at home has it`
`23:16.42`	`Nidhoggr`	`that's what I do.. I buy frozen fruit.`
`23:16.50`	`Nidhoggr`	`is really good.`
`23:16.57`	`KR`	`maybe my frozen fruit is why I aint gettin no diplomacy lately, come tothink of it`
`23:17.04`	`Patlabor221`	`mmmmm beries fo cran,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,`
`23:17.06`	`brlcad`	`Patlabor221: that'd be cool, thanks`
`23:17.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`strawberries, raspberries, peaches, boysenberries`
`23:17.28`	`KR`	`I saw them do it that way in Hawaii, and they were the best smoothies`
`23:17.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`those are my mainstay`
`23:17.40`	`KR`	`I do freeze banan tho`
`23:17.40`	`Nidhoggr`	`sometimes a little pineapple with the peaches is good.`
`23:17.54`	`KR`	`my fav is strawberrie bannannanananana`
`23:17.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`nod`
`23:18.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`that's pretty good.`
`23:18.11`	`Nidhoggr`	`strawberry/peach is good, too.`
`23:18.12`	`KR`	`with choco protein powder`
`23:18.17`	`Nidhoggr`	`oooh.`
`23:18.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`that does sound good.`
`23:18.26`	`KR`	`hehe`
`23:18.37`	`KR`	`i just ate - now getting hungry again :/`
`23:18.48`	`Nidhoggr`	`I use only vanilla protein powder lately... but I do add choc syrup.`
`23:19.22`	`KR`	`yumbly`
`23:19.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`and silk soy milk is a lot better than milk for my sensitive tummy.`
`23:20.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`I'm sorta addicted to silk now.`
`23:20.29`	`Nidhoggr`	`they have a silk nog that is really awesome.`
`23:20.38`	`Nidhoggr`	`gotta try it with rum or brandy next`
`23:20.50`	`KR`	`or bourbon :)`
`23:21.39`	`Nidhoggr`	`hrm I have some crown royal (2 bottles 1 in freezer, 1 on shelf).`
`23:21.41`	`KR`	`JB - the trail in the map you posted a link to - thatis the Pacific Crest Trail`
`23:21.43`	`Nidhoggr`	`i wonder how that'd be.`
`23:22.05`	`KR`	`i was speaking of the Pacific Coast Trail - a different, newer trail that is just now being set up`
`23:22.13`	`KR`	`just FYI`
`23:22.38`	`KR`	`Nid - down here in the South, we always put bourbon in our nog :)`
`23:22.46`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`23:23.04`	`brlcad`	`Mmm.. bourbon`
`23:23.13`	`KR`	`course, a buncha rednecks live here who prolly put bourbon in their bourbon...`
`23:23.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`my weakness is bombay sapphire`
`23:23.24`	`brlcad`	`I like to put bourbon in my noggin' too :)`
`23:23.28`	`KR`	`lol`
`23:23.29`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`23:23.35`	`KR`	`Woodfords bourbon is my fav`
`23:24.07`	`KR`	`fine sippin bourbon - $30 a bottle - but oh so smooth on the gullet`
`23:24.15`	`Nidhoggr`	`I have a great lemon drink. in a tall glass put juice of a whole fresh lemon. add ice. 2 shots of sapphire and fill rest with sprite.`
`23:24.24`	`Nidhoggr`	`mmmmm`
`23:24.46`	`KR`	`do you slice the lemon or prepare it otherwise?`
`23:24.52`	`KR`	`ndoh - juice`
`23:24.58`	`KR`	`n`
`23:24.59`	`Nidhoggr`	`slice and use juicer`
`23:25.00`	`KR`	`nvm`
`23:25.22`	`Nidhoggr`	`I love fresh lemon.`
`23:25.31`	`Nidhoggr`	`ah`
`23:25.34`	`Nidhoggr`	`sounds like fun.`
`23:25.35`	`Nidhoggr`	`:)`
`23:25.43`	`Nidhoggr`	`I have a lot of desktop publishing to do`
`23:25.53`	`Nidhoggr`	`about 200 pages worth.`
`23:25.57`	`KR`	`Pat told me that if I didnt help, he would code bzflag to where I couldnt play it anymore...`
`23:26.05`	`Nidhoggr`	`ut oh`
`23:26.05`	`KR`	`:)`
`23:26.15`	`KR`	`ok, i lied`
`23:26.38`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`23:26.46`	`Nidhoggr`	`I need to redo one of my old publishing projects in new office page format.`
`23:26.55`	`Patlabor221`	`hmm it's not in chace here`
`23:27.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`and do a few sample bindings in leather.`
`23:27.31`	`Nidhoggr`	`if I can find my bookbinding leather in the craft closet.`
`23:27.47`	`KR`	`now thats serious desktop publishing..`
`23:27.49`	`Nidhoggr`	`and my tiny drill bit for drilling pages for binding.`
`23:28.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`I do hand bound books.`
`23:28.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`they are a real treat.`
`23:28.06`	`KR`	`ah kewl`
`23:28.08`	`Nidhoggr`	`and it's holiday season.`
`23:28.21`	`KR`	`whats in them?`
`23:28.36`	`brlcad`	`is dervish active? where might I find him usually?`
`23:28.49`	`Patlabor221`	`have not seen him post in ages`
`23:28.51`	`Patlabor221`	`could try mail`
`23:29.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`the ones lately are liturgy for my contemplative Order.`
`23:29.19`	`KR`	`r u a monk?`
`23:29.22`	`Nidhoggr`	`da`
`23:29.29`	`KR`	`neat`
`23:29.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`www.sacredcup.org`
`23:29.32`	`KR`	`where?`
`23:29.36`	`Nidhoggr`	`phoenix az`
`23:29.37`	`KR`	`ok will look`
`23:29.43`	`Nidhoggr`	`<--- abbot`
`23:30.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`okay.. I gotta head home. back later.`
`23:30.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`&`
`23:36.04`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-82-84-96-102.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`23:36.33`	`Patlabor221`	`sw3333t auto updating prefs, they auto update :)`
`23:44.13`	`JBdiGriz`	`KR: I have friends who have hiked the PCT, but not all in one shot.`
`23:45.35`	`*** part/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se)`
`23:46.47`	`KR`	`lots of people using my tents hike there - PCT thru-hikers, JMT hikers, etc etc`
`23:47.11`	`KR`	`I'm going to try and come out to San Diego for the PCT kick-off party this coming May`
`23:48.50`	`Patlabor221`	`anyone have any objections to the new rank icons on bzbb?`
`23:49.01`	`brlcad`	`they are good stuff`
`23:49.19`	`Patlabor221`	`I think i'm just gonna hook them up`
`23:49.28`	`Patlabor221`	`I changed mine and the dev one, and they look prety good`
`23:49.33`	`Patlabor221`	`and caps :)`
`23:49.56`	`Patlabor221`	`this means there will be a larger number of divisions`
`23:50.19`	`brlcad`	`OOoooh.. i like the logo on the main page now :)`
`23:50.29`	`JBdiGriz`	`Let me know, I'll introduce you to http://www.arrogantbastard.com/`
`23:50.30`	`Patlabor221`	`heh`
`23:50.39`	`Patlabor221`	`disn't look like a wang does it?`
`23:50.49`	`brlcad`	`not yet :)`
`23:50.54`	`JBdiGriz`	`Patlabor221 has a minor obsession :)`
`23:51.28`	`Patlabor221`	`he was the one that said they all looked like weenies`
`23:51.34`	`Patlabor221`	`noone else thought that`
`23:52.13`	`brlcad`	`not true, bzg agreed`
`23:52.53`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh well then it must be true`
`23:53.00`	`Patlabor221`	`tho I do like the new logo a lot more`
`23:53.11`	`Patlabor221`	`I may play more at a later date`
`23:53.17`	`Patlabor221`	`I did kinda like the shooting one`
`23:54.18`	`brlcad`	`it wasn't all bad either.. a theme is starting to shape finally, though, which was what was needed`
`23:54.50`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`23:55.08`	`Patlabor221`	`I thank everyone for their comments`
`23:55.15`	`Patlabor221`	`I think it has helped it evolve emensly`
`23:57.03`	`JBdiGriz`	`it evolved e-mens-ly ???? i think i understand learner and bzg's comments a little better. :)`
`23:57.13`	`Patlabor221`	`heh`
`23:57.45`	`Patlabor221`	`at least I didn't say "by 3 inches or more in a month"`
`23:57.55`	`JBdiGriz`	`it probably would have only helped a little bit if you had said immensely though.`
`23:58.13`	`Patlabor221`	`ok a whole bunch`
`23:58.58`	`Patlabor221`	`bwahahaha, everyone is a cadet on bzbb now :)`
`23:59.36`	`brlcad`	`you would probably be able to find some more coders and players if you promised enlargments`
`23:59.46`	`Patlabor221`	`heh`
`23:59.48`	`brlcad`	`ahem`

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