irclog2html for #bzflag on 20041203

`00:00.08`	`Patlabor221`	`ok`
`00:00.10`	`FerrarisRule`	`nwell bye now`
`00:00.15`	`Patlabor221`	`perhaps it would be best if you didn't type something you think`
`00:00.20`	`Patlabor221`	`have fun`
`00:00.23`	`FerrarisRule`	`THE 'N' CURSE MUST HALT!`
`00:00.29`	`Patlabor221`	`so must the caps`
`00:00.48`	`FerrarisRule`	`u should implament a text thing like this one`
`00:00.55`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`00:01.08`	`FerrarisRule`	`the little line at the bottom`
`00:01.17`	`Patlabor221`	`bottom of what?`
`00:01.22`	`Patlabor221`	`we can't read your mind`
`00:01.28`	`FerrarisRule`	`of the screen`
`00:01.33`	`Patlabor221`	`what screen?`
`00:01.36`	`Patlabor221`	`in bzflag?`
`00:01.37`	`Patlabor221`	`what?`
`00:01.38`	`FerrarisRule`	`the one u type in`
`00:01.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`no here`
`00:01.49`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`00:02.01`	`FerrarisRule`	`ok`
`00:02.01`	`Patlabor221`	`on IRC?`
`00:02.07`	`Patlabor221`	`hell are you talking about?`
`00:02.09`	`FerrarisRule`	`YES!`
`00:02.13`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: not all IRC clients look the same, so we can't guess what you are describing`
`00:02.13`	`FerrarisRule`	`on IRC`
`00:02.18`	`FerrarisRule`	`oh`
`00:02.22`	`FerrarisRule`	`damn`
`00:02.27`	`Patlabor221`	`I have a line at the bottom I type in`
`00:02.38`	`Patlabor221`	`your on some crap web IRC`
`00:02.40`	`blast007`	`a text box :)`
`00:02.43`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes that is what i'm talking about`
`00:02.50`	`Patlabor221`	`get a real IRC client`
`00:03.18`	`FerrarisRule`	`i'm talikng about what you have t line at the bottom to type in`
`00:03.32`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`00:03.37`	`FerrarisRule`	`u just click to type then continue on your way`
`00:03.45`	`Patlabor221`	`huh?`
`00:04.05`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: you mean the text box, right?`
`00:04.12`	`Patlabor221`	`all clients have those`
`00:04.16`	`FerrarisRule`	`YES! the text box`
`00:04.19`	`Patlabor221`	`it's right next to my nic`
`00:04.21`	`*** join/#bzflag miggity (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:04.24`	`Patlabor221`	`what bout the text box?`
`00:04.53`	`TimRiker`	`Patlabor221: he's asking for a text input box in bzflag to type without hitting n`
`00:05.01`	`FerrarisRule`	`u shoud put somthing like that in so u don't have to always press n to type`
`00:05.02`	`Patlabor221`	`ohhhh`
`00:05.05`	`Patlabor221`	`why didn't he say so`
`00:05.14`	`FerrarisRule`	`YES! TIM YOU RULE!`
`00:05.14`	`Patlabor221`	`you needed to say WHAT you wanted it in`
`00:05.26`	`FerrarisRule`	`i was`
`00:05.26`	`Patlabor221`	`I think the key should be changed to enter`
`00:05.26`	`TimRiker`	`he does not realise that would require a mouse click instead which would move your tank.`
`00:05.29`	`Patlabor221`	`makes more sense`
`00:05.34`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah`
`00:05.35`	`TimRiker`	`FerrarisRule: no caps please.`
`00:05.38`	`Patlabor221`	`enter is the best choice`
`00:05.43`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes sir`
`00:05.50`	`Patlabor221`	`then it dosn't screw up habbits :)`
`00:05.51`	`TimRiker`	`enter is fire in kbd nav.`
`00:05.52`	`FerrarisRule`	`i agree`
`00:05.58`	`FerrarisRule`	`true`
`00:05.58`	`Patlabor221`	`so move it :)`
`00:06.01`	`Patlabor221`	`space should be fire`
`00:06.04`	`Patlabor221`	`and tab should be jump`
`00:06.06`	`FerrarisRule`	`true`
`00:06.07`	`TimRiker`	`space is drop flag.`
`00:06.10`	`FerrarisRule`	`it is`
`00:06.19`	`FerrarisRule`	`so is scoll wheel`
`00:06.20`	`Patlabor221`	`such a big button for a little feature`
`00:06.26`	`TimRiker`	`heh`
`00:06.26`	`Patlabor221`	`techicnaly middle mouse`
`00:06.30`	`Patlabor221`	`not everyone has a wheel`
`00:06.36`	`FerrarisRule`	`true`
`00:06.40`	`Patlabor221`	`make ~ be drop`
`00:06.44`	`FerrarisRule`	`like mac users`
`00:07.00`	`FerrarisRule`	`yeah, that would work`
`00:07.17`	`FerrarisRule`	`it would be right above jump`
`00:07.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`that would be easy to remember`
`00:07.46`	`Patlabor221`	`enter is common in most MMORPGs since they can't click ether`
`00:07.55`	`Patlabor221`	`for a chat key`
`00:07.59`	`Patlabor221`	`same for the FPS games`
`00:08.10`	`Patlabor221`	`but have to have a compatability mode for the old school users`
`00:08.24`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes, u still can though`
`00:08.37`	`Patlabor221`	`we know we can`
`00:09.00`	`FerrarisRule`	`i see that u can do the same here with messages as in bzflag`
`00:09.20`	`Patlabor221`	`?`
`00:09.29`	`FerrarisRule`	`use the up arrow key to see your last message, or even enter it again`
`00:09.46`	`Patlabor221`	`a common feature`
`00:09.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`it onlt goes back so far`
`00:09.50`	`Patlabor221`	`in many things`
`00:09.58`	`Patlabor221`	`including terminal shells in OSs`
`00:10.03`	`FerrarisRule`	`oh, i did not know that`
`00:10.09`	`blast007`	`I typically use 'q' for fire shot`
`00:10.10`	`Patlabor221`	`I gathered that`
`00:10.25`	`FerrarisRule`	`u did what?`
`00:10.41`	`Patlabor221`	`that you didn't know that`
`00:11.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have never heard a statement like that`
`00:11.45`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm going to guess you use windows`
`00:11.58`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes, yes i do`
`00:12.02`	`Patlabor221`	`so it woudl make sense that you've never seen a terminal`
`00:12.12`	`FerrarisRule`	`XP with SP2`
`00:12.15`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm sorry`
`00:12.19`	`Patlabor221`	`AOL?`
`00:12.31`	`FerrarisRule`	`no, earthlink`
`00:12.35`	`Patlabor221`	`ahh`
`00:12.38`	`Patlabor221`	`next best thing`
`00:12.42`	`FerrarisRule`	`internet explorer`
`00:12.58`	`FerrarisRule`	`well bye`
`00:13.00`	`blast007`	`internet exploder*`
`00:13.10`	`FerrarisRule`	`hey it's not that bad`
`00:13.11`	`Patlabor221`	`again I'm sorry`
`00:13.15`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah, yeah it is`
`00:13.21`	`FerrarisRule`	`not for me`
`00:13.25`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: yeah, it sucks`
`00:13.38`	`Patlabor221`	`only because you know nothing difrent`
`00:13.44`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have pop up blokers, 2 of them for double blockage`
`00:13.46`	`blast007`	`Firefox is much better`
`00:13.55`	`Patlabor221`	`ooo double blockage`
`00:13.58`	`blast007`	`2 blockers? :)`
`00:14.05`	`Patlabor221`	`firefox is a lot better`
`00:14.06`	`FerrarisRule`	`i've seen that, but not real sure about it`
`00:14.09`	`DTRemenak`	`FerrarisRule, the fact that you need 2 blockers implies that the browser is broken :)`
`00:14.19`	`FerrarisRule`	`:P`
`00:14.25`	`Patlabor221`	`it probably won't run his flash games`
`00:14.26`	`blast007`	`that's like having 2 speedometers in your car`
`00:14.35`	`FerrarisRule`	`acualy yopur wrong`
`00:14.45`	`FerrarisRule`	`flash games work`
`00:14.47`	`Patlabor221`	`since they only work if the spyware is installed properly`
`00:14.52`	`Patlabor221`	`I mean in firefox`
`00:14.53`	`FerrarisRule`	`any game works`
`00:15.00`	`Patlabor221`	`sure it does`
`00:15.16`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have 2 spyware programs`
`00:15.24`	`Patlabor221`	`of course you do`
`00:15.26`	`DTRemenak`	`and you're proud of that?`
`00:15.29`	`FerrarisRule`	`and Windows Washer`
`00:15.33`	`blast007`	`I hope you mean anti-spyware programs ;)`
`00:15.34`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes`
`00:15.40`	`DTRemenak`	`ah, that makes more sense`
`00:15.42`	`Patlabor221`	`I'm sure you have more then 2 :)`
`00:15.46`	`miggity`	`no spyware with firefox`
`00:15.50`	`FerrarisRule`	`no`
`00:15.51`	`Patlabor221`	`less`
`00:15.58`	`DTRemenak`	`but the fact that you need anti-spyware programs implies that your OS is broken, too :)`
`00:15.59`	`Patlabor221`	`nothing is ever foolpoof`
`00:16.26`	`Patlabor221`	`aww come on that wonderfull SP2 firewall is protecting him from all the evil`
`00:16.34`	`FerrarisRule`	`SpySweeper and McAfee Security Center`
`00:16.48`	`FerrarisRule`	`those kick arse`
`00:16.49`	`blast007`	`hmm, I think SpySweeper is actually spyware`
`00:16.54`	`amathis`	`heh`
`00:16.55`	`blast007`	`let me check`
`00:16.57`	`miggity`	`hahah`
`00:16.57`	`Patlabor221`	`it has some in it`
`00:17.06`	`amathis`	`SpySweeper is almost as awesome as subseven`
`00:17.07`	`FerrarisRule`	`yeah, it thinks it's own update is spyware`
`00:17.16`	`amathis`	`:)`
`00:17.24`	`FerrarisRule`	`it's a bit queer`
`00:17.34`	`Patlabor221`	`it must take him forever to download all the spyware on the dialup`
`00:17.46`	`FerrarisRule`	`i tried to delete it and the thing said fatal error`
`00:17.54`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: The only free anti-spyware tools I would recommend are Spybot Search & Destroy, and Adaware SE`
`00:18.12`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have the fastest service under T1`
`00:18.14`	`DTRemenak`	`S&D does a very nice job. clean interface, fast.`
`00:18.16`	`blast007`	`there's also HijackThis, but that's for experienced users`
`00:18.24`	`Patlabor221`	`FerrarisRule, not thru earthlink`
`00:18.33`	`Patlabor221`	`are you on a DSL?`
`00:18.35`	`amathis`	`haha`
`00:18.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`Yes`
`00:18.46`	`Patlabor221`	`it's not a T1`
`00:18.52`	`Patlabor221`	`you get 1.5 down, but not up`
`00:18.56`	`Patlabor221`	`T1 gets it both ways`
`00:19.02`	`*** join/#bzflag sgk284 (~sgk284@ACAB88FD.ipt.aol.com)`
`00:19.23`	`Patlabor221`	`and you'll never get true 1.5`
`00:19.27`	`Patlabor221`	`not on a DSL`
`00:19.35`	`Patlabor221`	`ppoe overhead`
`00:19.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`i've got this Motorola Surfboard thingy plugged into our internet downstairs in the basement`
`00:19.50`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah that's just called a DSL modem`
`00:19.54`	`Patlabor221`	`everyone has those`
`00:20.07`	`FerrarisRule`	`unless u have dial up`
`00:20.10`	`FerrarisRule`	`ha ha`
`00:20.18`	`FerrarisRule`	`those are the real suckers`
`00:20.19`	`Patlabor221`	`few here do`
`00:20.30`	`Patlabor221`	`http://www.dslreports.com/stest`
`00:20.33`	`Patlabor221`	`run the speed test`
`00:20.35`	`Patlabor221`	`see how you do`
`00:20.38`	`FerrarisRule`	`k`
`00:21.51`	`FerrarisRule`	`brb`
`00:21.56`	`FerrarisRule`	`gotta log off`
`00:21.59`	`FerrarisRule`	`this`
`00:22.40`	`Patlabor221`	`hmm if I knew that's all it took.....`
`00:23.00`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:23.29`	`blast007`	`I can imagine him calling tech support...`
`00:23.36`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah`
`00:23.46`	`blast007`	`"that bar at the bottom doesn't show up anymore"`
`00:23.50`	`blast007`	`"What bar?"`
`00:23.57`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:23.59`	`blast007`	`"The one you type in"`
`00:23.59`	`FerrarisRule`	`ok`
`00:24.00`	`Patlabor221`	`"THE BAR!"`
`00:24.05`	`sgk284`	`lol!`
`00:24.10`	`amathis`	`:)`
`00:24.14`	`Patlabor221`	`in the thing`
`00:24.15`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have 2572 up`
`00:24.16`	`blast007`	`:)`
`00:24.20`	`Patlabor221`	`no you don't`
`00:24.28`	`amathis`	`o.0`
`00:24.28`	`sgk284`	`haha no way`
`00:24.32`	`FerrarisRule`	`sry 469 up`
`00:24.33`	`Patlabor221`	`maybe down`
`00:24.36`	`Patlabor221`	`there ya go`
`00:24.38`	`FerrarisRule`	`2572 down`
`00:24.45`	`Patlabor221`	`std 3 meg down line`
`00:24.53`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes`
`00:24.53`	`Patlabor221`	`3 meg down 512 up`
`00:25.01`	`Patlabor221`	`not a horible connection`
`00:25.08`	`FerrarisRule`	`by the way, is firefox free?`
`00:25.10`	`Patlabor221`	`yet you still use web IRC ;)`
`00:25.11`	`Patlabor221`	`yes`
`00:25.15`	`blast007`	`yeah`
`00:25.20`	`FerrarisRule`	`sweet`
`00:25.24`	`Patlabor221`	`www.getfirefox.com`
`00:25.36`	`FerrarisRule`	`u answered my question`
`00:25.44`	`FerrarisRule`	`before i asked it`
`00:25.48`	`sgk284`	`FerrarisRule, its also open source`
`00:25.53`	`FerrarisRule`	`k`
`00:26.02`	`sgk284`	`but for some reason i dont think you code`
`00:26.18`	`Patlabor221`	`probably a safe bet`
`00:26.23`	`amathis`	`sgk284: don't judge a book by it's cover >D`
`00:26.24`	`FerrarisRule`	`code?`
`00:26.33`	`sgk284`	`nevermind...`
`00:26.34`	`Patlabor221`	`book == cover;`
`00:26.39`	`amathis`	`program`
`00:26.44`	`FerrarisRule`	`what does code mean?`
`00:26.49`	`amathis`	`FerrarisRule: program`
`00:26.51`	`sgk284`	`amathis: still want to hold on to that statement?`
`00:26.56`	`sgk284`	`;)`
`00:26.57`	`FerrarisRule`	`oh, sry`
`00:27.04`	`amathis`	`sgk284: I pleade the fizith`
`00:27.04`	`FerrarisRule`	`:D`
`00:27.18`	`sgk284`	`FerrarisRule, firefox will save you tons of headaches`
`00:27.24`	`sgk284`	`its a nice web browser`
`00:27.27`	`amathis`	`FerrarisRule: what OS are you?`
`00:27.35`	`Patlabor221`	`he's on XP`
`00:27.36`	`sgk284`	`no sane person still uses intenet explorer`
`00:27.37`	`Patlabor221`	`SP2`
`00:27.41`	`Patlabor221`	`so he's totaly hacker proof`
`00:27.43`	`FerrarisRule`	`oui`
`00:27.47`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`00:27.49`	`sgk284`	`Patlabor221, lol`
`00:27.53`	`amathis`	`Patlabor221: ah, the l33t OS`
`00:27.55`	`FerrarisRule`	`oui, i'm on sp2`
`00:28.05`	`amathis`	`oui?`
`00:28.12`	`Patlabor221`	`he apears to be multi lingual`
`00:28.13`	`FerrarisRule`	`yes, in french`
`00:28.22`	`amathis`	`ohh...`
`00:28.25`	`blast007`	`oh, I thought he dropped something heavy on his foot`
`00:28.31`	`amathis`	`heh.`
`00:28.32`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:28.35`	`amathis`	`I.E french`
`00:28.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`if i ask u what's best to install for firefox`
`00:28.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`would u tell me`
`00:28.49`	`amathis`	`evidentally he cannot speak english`
`00:28.55`	`amathis`	`'u' != 'you!`
`00:28.55`	`amathis`	`ARG`
`00:28.57`	`sgk284`	`i thought he just mixed up his vowels and forgot a few`
`00:29.06`	`FerrarisRule`	`no, i speak spanglish`
`00:29.23`	`sgk284`	`what do you mean whats best to install firefox?`
`00:29.26`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-165.caltech.edu)`
`00:29.30`	`sgk284`	`download the exe and double click it`
`00:29.41`	`amathis`	`sgk284: that has two too many steps.`
`00:29.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`i know hold u'r panties on`
`00:29.59`	`Patlabor221`	`he could hit the super safe "open" instead of save as when he clicks the link`
`00:30.02`	`amathis`	`Darn, I thought no one would ever find out >_<`
`00:30.04`	`Patlabor221`	`that's less steps`
`00:30.05`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:30.20`	`amathis`	`Holy PVC pipe batman!`
`00:30.25`	`FerrarisRule`	`what is better custom or standard`
`00:30.31`	`FerrarisRule`	`to install`
`00:30.33`	`amathis`	`for you, standard`
`00:30.34`	`Patlabor221`	`use your gray matter`
`00:30.38`	`sgk284`	`standard`
`00:30.41`	`FerrarisRule`	`if i asked u`
`00:30.42`	`Patlabor221`	`this is not #firefox`
`00:30.46`	`blast007`	`amathis: I was gonna say that exact same thing`
`00:30.47`	`amathis`	`custom has some development packages`
`00:30.51`	`FerrarisRule`	`would u tell me what to do fro custom`
`00:30.59`	`amathis`	`FerrarisRule: you don't need it`
`00:31.03`	`sgk284`	`dont worry abotu custom`
`00:31.04`	`Patlabor221`	`well if you had a fro I'd tell you to pick it`
`00:31.07`	`sgk284`	`even i use standard`
`00:31.08`	`FerrarisRule`	`ok ok`
`00:31.14`	`amathis`	`FerrarisRule: do you know any Programming languages?`
`00:31.19`	`FerrarisRule`	`no`
`00:31.21`	`amathis`	`because if not, you dont need custom`
`00:31.24`	`*** part/#bzflag Grumbler (~galkire@grumbler.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`00:31.30`	`amathis`	`it is a bunch of development stuff.`
`00:31.33`	`FerrarisRule`	`I don't speak computer`
`00:31.39`	`Patlabor221`	`or english it seems`
`00:31.57`	`sgk284`	`heh`
`00:32.10`	`FerrarisRule`	`hold on i'll be back in a second`
`00:32.14`	`FerrarisRule`	`nswitching`
`00:32.20`	`sgk284`	`okay good luck`
`00:32.21`	`sgk284`	`have fun`
`00:32.23`	`Patlabor221`	`we'll be on the lookout`
`00:32.25`	`sgk284`	`dont break anything`
`00:32.25`	`amathis`	`nbye`
`00:33.04`	`DTRemenak`	`yay for high-speed internet. 7878 down, 4103 up.`
`00:33.10`	`Patlabor221`	`very nice`
`00:33.12`	`blast007`	`wow`
`00:33.18`	`*** join/#bzflag Grumbler (~galkire@grumbler.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`00:33.36`	`sgk284`	`yey for Internet2 101 Gbps down / some crazy number up ;)`
`00:33.39`	`Grumbler`	`~seen Nidhoggr`
`00:33.41`	`ibot`	`nidhoggr is currently on #bzflag (16h 55m 33s). Has said a total of 50 messages. Is idling for 2h 7m 7s`
`00:33.58`	`FerrarisRule`	`holy hermapherdites`
`00:34.03`	`FerrarisRule`	`that's fast`
`00:34.07`	`purple_cow`	`sgk284: i doubt your machine is connected to anything faster than 100mbit`
`00:34.12`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:34.17`	`sgk284`	`shh dont tell anyone`
`00:34.26`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:34.36`	`FerrarisRule`	`ok all done`
`00:34.54`	`blast007`	`what is? the download? or the install?`
`00:35.05`	`FerrarisRule`	`internet explorer is now obselete`
`00:35.08`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`00:35.11`	`FerrarisRule`	`install done`
`00:35.15`	`blast007`	`it always was ;)`
`00:35.20`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:35.29`	`FerrarisRule`	`ha ha, true :)`
`00:35.33`	`DTRemenak`	`not always - ie5 beat the pants off netscape 4 :)`
`00:35.43`	`FerrarisRule`	`oh, wouldn't know`
`00:35.45`	`blast007`	`well, true`
`00:35.46`	`sgk284`	`but lynx was still better then both ;)`
`00:35.52`	`FerrarisRule`	`word`
`00:35.52`	`amathis`	`sgk284: haha`
`00:35.52`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`00:35.53`	`DTRemenak`	`~sgk284++`
`00:36.10`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:36.18`	`sgk284`	`FerrarisRule, what are you doing?`
`00:36.27`	`sgk284`	`cat on your keyboard?`
`00:36.28`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:36.32`	`FerrarisRule`	`arg`
`00:36.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`too confusing`
`00:36.45`	`FerrarisRule`	`wel bye`
`00:36.50`	`blast007`	`bye`
`00:36.51`	`sgk284`	`cya`
`00:36.56`	`FerrarisRule`	`i think i've annoyed u enough`
`00:37.14`	`FerrarisRule`	`that's the only problem when my meds wear out`
`00:37.28`	`FerrarisRule`	`ADHD is a real problem for me`
`00:37.38`	`FerrarisRule`	`see i juyst keep rambling on`
`00:37.42`	`FerrarisRule`	`well bye`
`00:37.47`	`sgk284`	`good luck`
`00:37.55`	`sgk284`	`wow.....`
`00:38.03`	`blast007`	`he must be why tech support gets paid as much as they do...`
`00:38.07`	`*** join/#bzflag brian__ (~brian@adsl-68-21-130-241.dsl.euclwi.ameritech.net)`
`00:38.08`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:38.12`	`Patlabor221`	`he has to be the poster child for SOMETHING`
`00:38.23`	`sgk284`	`i've never been so amused by irc in all my life`
`00:38.34`	`sgk284`	`i didnt think people like that existed`
`00:38.36`	`DTRemenak`	`sgk284, you're pretty easily amused :)`
`00:38.41`	`sgk284`	`lol`
`00:38.43`	`*** part/#bzflag triclops (~caleb@c211-31-49-112.rivrw7.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`00:38.57`	`Patlabor221`	`yeah that was prety much an average kid`
`00:39.15`	`amathis`	`at least he doesn't argue with you.`
`00:39.19`	`amathis`	`like some kids...`
`00:39.20`	`sgk284`	`very true`
`00:39.26`	`amathis`	`cough shorty cough`
`00:39.26`	`blast007`	`I had someone call where I work that thought their data was stored on their monitor ;)`
`00:39.40`	`amathis`	`blast007, haha`
`00:39.54`	`blast007`	`and then they called their tower a "modem"`
`00:40.01`	`Noodleman_`	`blast007: that's not as bad as saying it's too frustrating to click a link`
`00:40.01`	`amathis`	`I convinced a guy taht his cd tray was a coffe holder.`
`00:40.08`	`amathis`	`I am dead serious.`
`00:40.11`	`blast007`	`:)`
`00:40.23`	`*** join/#bzflag CIA-3 (~CIA@to.je.spocco.com)`
`00:40.47`	`*** join/#bzflag sgk284_testing_c (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:40.49`	`brian__`	`Any bzflag protocol experts here tonight?`
`00:40.58`	`sgk284_testing_c`	`wow`
`00:41.03`	`*** part/#bzflag sgk284_testing_c (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`00:41.12`	`amathis`	`brian__: sure`
`00:41.13`	`sgk284`	`thats nifty`
`00:41.16`	`DTRemenak`	`brian__, noone is a protocol expert - noone.`
`00:41.20`	`amathis`	`heh.`
`00:41.27`	`sgk284`	`its like quantum mechanics`
`00:41.39`	`sgk284`	`except qm makes sense sometimes ;)`
`00:41.45`	`Patlabor221`	`what did you need to know?`
`00:41.52`	`Noodleman_`	`brian__: you can ask a question and see if someone answers it`
`00:42.00`	`Noodleman_`	`that's as far as we can go :-)`
`00:42.06`	`brian__`	`I'm having trouble connecting, and after an ethereal dump it looks like my client is getting the world, then just hanging.`
`00:42.17`	`Patlabor221`	`happens sometimes`
`00:42.25`	`amathis`	`brian__: it is called... karma`
`00:42.34`	`Patlabor221`	`server's outbound connection is probably flooded`
`00:42.41`	`amathis`	`brian__: what did you do in your past life?`
`00:42.45`	`amathis`	`must have been bad`
`00:42.45`	`DTRemenak`	`if it happens consistently, you can try breaking it with gdb and see what's going on`
`00:42.50`	`Patlabor221`	`try a difrent server with a better route`
`00:42.51`	`sgk284`	`run from the command line and enable debugging... shouldnt that tell him is its the servers fault or his?`
`00:43.01`	`Patlabor221`	`that would help`
`00:44.00`	`brian__`	`I can't seem to get debugging output. I try bzflag -debug -debug -debug... etc. but nothing extra seems to pop up`
`00:44.04`	`*** join/#bzflag triclops (~caleb@c211-31-49-112.rivrw7.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`00:44.14`	`Patlabor221`	`it's -d -d -d`
`00:44.23`	`brian__`	`well now that might make a difference`
`00:44.59`	`brian__`	`but when I tried it just now it didn't recognize -d as an option`
`00:45.00`	`DTRemenak`	`Patlabor221, no, he's right, it's -debug. -d is short for -directory.`
`00:45.12`	`DTRemenak`	`or maybe it's unrecognized`
`00:45.17`	`Patlabor221`	`realy?`
`00:45.20`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah`
`00:45.26`	`Patlabor221`	`oh -d is the server`
`00:45.28`	`DTRemenak`	`server side is -d or -debug`
`00:45.32`	`Patlabor221`	`does the client even do debug`
`00:45.40`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, but it's pretty minimal`
`00:45.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Nikaji (~switched@Nikaji.student.supporter.pdpc)`
`00:46.02`	`Patlabor221`	`gdb idea is probably best`
`00:46.15`	`amathis`	`what OS?`
`00:46.37`	`brian__`	`Fedora Core 3, updated. bzflag 1.10.6.20040810`
`00:46.49`	`amathis`	`ok`
`00:47.01`	`amathis`	`brian__: do you have 'gdb' ?`
`00:47.03`	`Patlabor221`	`did it used to work and then stop?`
`00:47.08`	`Patlabor221`	`or never work?`
`00:47.18`	`Patlabor221`	`and are you behind any sort of proxy that may block UDP?`
`00:47.41`	`brian__`	`Used to work. Then worked intermittently... sometimes had to run as root.... now doesn't work at all.`
`00:47.43`	`Patlabor221`	`IIRC the world is sent TCP, then it waits for a UDP responce`
`00:47.58`	`Patlabor221`	`other servers work?`
`00:48.11`	`brian__`	`not lately, no.`
`00:48.24`	`*** join/#bzflag dacut (dacut@c-24-3-139-35.client.comcast.net)`
`00:48.32`	`brian__`	`world conversation appears to be complete. My client sends the final acq, then sits there doing nothing.`
`00:49.19`	`Patlabor221`	`your not blocking UDP or anything with a firewall?`
`00:50.25`	`DTRemenak`	`after the world is recieved, it's the client's job to enter the game`
`00:51.35`	`brian__`	`No explicit UDP blocking on any of the firewalls I can see`
`00:51.39`	`DTRemenak`	`does the client ever send a msgenter? header should be 65 6e`
`00:52.04`	`DTRemenak`	`it "should" be sent immediately after the last world peice is recieved`
`00:52.15`	`DTRemenak`	`unless the client gets a msgsuperkill`
`00:53.08`	`brian__`	`The last message from the client with any data is a get-world. Last message from server is 67 77`
`00:53.24`	`brian__`	`then the client acqs the 67 77 message and sits`
`00:53.47`	`DTRemenak`	`what are the two bytes after 67 77?`
`00:54.03`	`DTRemenak`	`should be 65 64, if the server's really done`
`00:54.58`	`brian__`	`first six data bytes of last server message are 03 3b 67 77 00 00`
`00:55.18`	`brian__`	`last two bytes are indeed 65 64`
`00:55.31`	`DTRemenak`	`ah, ok`
`00:55.34`	`brian__`	`then 831 or so bytes of data`
`00:55.40`	`brian__`	`(in between0`
`00:57.09`	`DTRemenak`	`mm, that sounds like something's being concatenated. the last message should be 00 02 67 77 65 64`
`00:57.21`	`DTRemenak`	`mm, or maybe not`
`00:57.42`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, that looks like it should work, actually.`
`00:57.52`	`DTRemenak`	`provided the world data in the middle is good`
`00:58.04`	`brian__`	`it made sense to me according to the docs at http://www.bzflag.org/developers/protocol.php but I thought they could be dated`
`00:59.10`	`DTRemenak`	`heh, yeah it is. BZFS107b`
`00:59.39`	`DTRemenak`	`but yeah, the world's sent as a stream and only divided for convenience, so your world packet looks good`
`01:00.20`	`brian__`	`do you know offhand the corner of the source world where this takes place? I have some 1.10.8 source that I have been looking at`
`01:00.22`	`DTRemenak`	`does the client give you any message when it drops the connection, or just freeze?`
`01:00.59`	`DTRemenak`	`mm, dunno for 1.10. ServerLink.cxx if it's there, for the actual sending/receiving stuff`
`01:01.20`	`brian__`	`freezes. When I finally kill it three messages (two from me, one from server) show up`
`01:01.44`	`DTRemenak`	`which ones?`
`01:02.22`	`brian__`	`There's no data in any of the packets`
`01:02.35`	`DTRemenak`	`the indexes are in include/Protocol.h. join game procedures are in src/bzflag/playing.cxx, in joinGame, joinInternetGame, joinGame2, or something like that.`
`01:02.56`	`DTRemenak`	`no headers or anything?`
`01:03.16`	`DTRemenak`	`that's strange`
`01:03.40`	`*** join/#bzflag BIYATankTuner (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`01:04.15`	`BIYATankTuner`	`aaaa finally`
`01:04.22`	`brian__`	`Near as I can tell they are all just TCP/IP overhead stuff`
`01:04.30`	`DTRemenak`	`hm, ok`
`01:06.25`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Can a favor from anyone?`
`01:06.55`	`DTRemenak`	`BIYATankTuner, don't ask to ask, just ask.`
`01:06.56`	`blast007`	`BIYATankTuner: if you have a question, it's better to just ask it ;)`
`01:07.10`	`blast007`	`:)`
`01:07.14`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`01:07.23`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Crappy key board`
`01:08.41`	`BIYATankTuner`	`but im Connection handicap (I use dial-up) and I would love for someone to run my map on a server. I can run one and play on it but it has FPS problems and I can only hold 2 or 3 people on it.`
`01:08.46`	`BIYATankTuner`	`whew`
`01:10.32`	`*** join/#bzflag patlabor221 (~jeffm@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`01:10.32`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o patlabor221] by ChanServ`
`01:10.49`	`BIYATankTuner`	`It's a great map and all but I dont have enough of a connection to actually beable to play with alot of peopple`
`01:13.15`	`BIYATankTuner`	`06`
`01:14.13`	`DTRemenak`	`BIYATankTuner, I only run 1.11 servers.`
`01:16.05`	`*** join/#bzflag BIYATankTuner (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`01:16.27`	`BIYATankTuner`	`sorry clicked the wrong button`
`01:16.48`	`amathis`	`:)`
`01:17.20`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nDial-up sucks but`
`01:17.21`	`brian__`	`later`
`01:17.23`	`BIYATankTuner`	`butt*`
`01:17.27`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nbye`
`01:17.35`	`amathis`	`nadios`
`01:18.35`	`*** join/#bzflag BIYATankTuner (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`01:18.57`	`amathis`	`again?`
`01:19.00`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Why do I keep clickin that button`
`01:19.05`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nyeah`
`01:19.21`	`BIYATankTuner`	`need to stop playin BZ`
`01:19.26`	`blast007`	`nyep ;)`
`01:19.28`	`BIYATankTuner`	`to many n`
`01:22.19`	`blast007`	`I'm not sure of the status of bzbb.bzflag.org, but you could try asking there`
`01:22.33`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Lost my user and password`
`01:23.31`	`DTRemenak`	`heh, rock on. Segmentation fault (core dumped)`
`01:23.52`	`BIYATankTuner`	`brb`
`01:25.52`	`*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (~frank@p50821841.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`01:26.28`	`Noodleman_`	`they think this cheddar is extra sharp??`
`01:28.04`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`01:30.21`	`BIYATankTuner`	`no`
`01:30.23`	`Noodleman_`	`it's so blunt you could bash somebody's brains out with it`
`01:30.24`	`BIYATankTuner`	`:)`
`01:31.02`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Are you acting stupid or are you realy that retarded?`
`01:31.57`	`blast007`	`he's just acting :)`
`01:32.28`	`BIYATankTuner`	`whew`
`01:32.39`	`BIYATankTuner`	`thought there was somone stupider than me for a sec.`
`01:32.43`	`*** join/#bzflag MeBigFatGuy (dave@balt-209-150-118-8.dynamic-dial.qis.net)`
`01:32.54`	`Noodleman_`	BIYATankTuner: you don't know me :-P``
`01:32.57`	`DTRemenak`	`anyone want to make some sense of http://pastebin.ca/2591 ?`
`01:33.38`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`null ptr ex`
`01:33.52`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`the obstacle is null`
`01:33.58`	`DTRemenak`	`doesn't make sense if you look at the code tho`
`01:34.06`	`DTRemenak`	`because it used the obstacle a couple lines before`
`01:34.59`	`*** join/#bzflag CannonFodder (~chatzilla@dialup-4.238.224.203.Dial1.Philadelphia1.Level3.net)`
`01:35.03`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Wait I got an Idea for bzflag if anyone here is one of the creators or whatever`
`01:35.16`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Moving buildings?`
`01:37.28`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`r u sure src an obj is synced?`
`01:37.45`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`could be`
`01:37.47`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`<PROTECTED>`
`01:37.57`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`couple lines up`
`01:38.02`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, it's synced`
`01:38.52`	`DTRemenak`	`besides, int index = (fvec3*)vertices[i] - mesh->getVertices(); should have triggered it if mesh was invalid`
`01:39.13`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Moving buildings?`
`01:39.55`	`patlabor221`	`BIYA that has been disucssed before and has some issues`
`01:39.56`	`Grumbler`	`g'day MAC`
`01:40.01`	`DTRemenak`	`BIYATankTuner, maybe someday ;)`
`01:40.14`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`true dt`
`01:40.16`	`Grumbler`	`right after the flying dragons`
`01:40.30`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`give trepan another day`
`01:40.41`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`he's already got moving sidewalks`
`01:41.12`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nice`
`01:42.42`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`DTRemenak, perhaps put a print of mesh above the if (noclusters && !mesh->noClusters()) {`
`01:42.45`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`just to check`
`01:42.59`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`perhaps it's stack corruption at some point, smashing the local variable`
`01:43.26`	`DTRemenak`	`hm, could be`
`01:47.10`	`BIYATankTuner`	`When will BzEdit get its new version?`
`01:47.23`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`lo grumbs`
`01:47.37`	`patlabor221`	`what new version?`
`01:47.56`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`heh`
`01:48.02`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Is there gonnaq be an upgrade or somthing like that?`
`01:48.05`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`to support all the new stuff, patlabor221`
`01:48.15`	`patlabor221`	`dono, who is working on it?`
`01:48.21`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`noone,`
`01:48.26`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`01:48.27`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`:)`
`01:48.31`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nvm then`
`01:49.06`	`blast007`	`BIYATankTuner: pyBZEdit can do world weapons, though it's not the best editor`
`01:49.24`	`patlabor221`	`it's fugly`
`01:49.28`	`blast007`	`yup`
`01:49.39`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Nice choice of words`
`01:55.51`	`Grumbler`	`the addition of meshes has added a level of skill to the task of bzedit, that i can not achieve.`
`01:56.59`	`DTRemenak`	`Grumbler, I can't imagine a simple UI to create meshes without going all-out and making a 3d modelling program. and at that, we'll be better off with the blender plugin if anyone ever finishes it.`
`01:57.14`	`patlabor221`	`the blender plugin is probably the best way to go`
`01:57.28`	`patlabor221`	`or maybe a gmax exporter`
`01:57.33`	`Grumbler`	`hence my statement`
`01:57.38`	`patlabor221`	`not like any of you all would work on it :)`
`01:57.44`	`DTRemenak`	`Grumbler, something you might think about doing is adding a mesh-import function. like use trepan's 3ds2bzw and have an option in bzedit to "import mesh"`
`01:57.50`	`Grumbler`	`not now.....`
`01:57.58`	`BIYATankTuner`	`blender?`
`01:58.05`	`patlabor221`	`blender`
`01:58.13`	`blast007`	`BIYATankTuner: it's a 3D modeling program`
`01:58.14`	`Grumbler`	`yes, with crushed ice and vodka`
`01:58.17`	`BIYATankTuner`	`and that is?`
`01:58.19`	`BIYATankTuner`	`oooooooo`
`01:58.27`	`patlabor221`	`something you google for`
`01:58.28`	`BIYATankTuner`	`?`
`01:58.43`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Plugin for B`
`01:58.46`	`DTRemenak`	`~blender`
`01:58.47`	`ibot`	`[blender] Extremely fast and versatile 3D Rendering Package. URL: http://freshmeat.net/projects/blender/`
`01:58.49`	`BIYATankTuner`	`BZEdit?`
`01:59.03`	`patlabor221`	`no`
`01:59.07`	`patlabor221`	`blender is not bzedit`
`01:59.17`	`patlabor221`	`blender is blender`
`01:59.17`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Then what is it?`
`01:59.19`	`BIYATankTuner`	`for?`
`01:59.21`	`patlabor221`	`READ`
`01:59.27`	`BIYATankTuner`	`What does it do?`
`01:59.28`	`patlabor221`	`use the gray matter`
`01:59.38`	`blast007`	`BIYATankTuner: look it up ;)`
`01:59.43`	`patlabor221`	`aperatnly it dosn't look up`
`02:00.00`	`BIYATankTuner`	`I was indetention today and read for 4 and a half hours`
`02:00.07`	`patlabor221`	`I'm sure you were`
`02:00.10`	`BIYATankTuner`	`thats enough reading`
`02:00.12`	`patlabor221`	`but thats not our problem is it?`
`02:00.22`	`BIYATankTuner`	`:)`
`02:00.27`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nope guess not`
`02:00.38`	`DTRemenak`	`some people read all day you know`
`02:00.46`	`patlabor221`	`just like you are doing right now`
`02:00.49`	`BIYATankTuner`	`My grandma`
`02:00.52`	`dacut`	`That's nothing. I was in detention for 9.5 hours.`
`02:00.56`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Im not that old :)`
`02:01.00`	`dacut`	`Though some people call it "work."`
`02:01.02`	`BIYATankTuner`	`ndamn`
`02:01.08`	`DTRemenak`	`language please`
`02:01.15`	`BIYATankTuner`	`sorry`
`02:01.25`	`BIYATankTuner`	`I was surprised O:)`
`02:01.25`	`patlabor221`	`really your not? I would have never guessed it`
`02:01.34`	`BIYATankTuner`	`not what?`
`02:01.37`	`BIYATankTuner`	`old?`
`02:01.39`	`patlabor221`	`that old`
`02:01.46`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Nope`
`02:01.47`	`BIYATankTuner`	`5 years old`
`02:01.53`	`patlabor221`	`I'm a gonna say 12`
`02:02.00`	`BIYATankTuner`	`wrong`
`02:02.13`	`BIYATankTuner`	`more like 15`
`02:02.21`	`BIYATankTuner`	`with a good sense of humor`
`02:02.21`	`patlabor221`	`ohh that's SO very difrent`
`02:02.22`	`Grumbler`	`do they give detention to 12-year-olds......i thought they shipped them out to iraq`
`02:02.32`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:02.39`	`patlabor221`	`I mean what your way older then those kids right?`
`02:02.51`	`BIYATankTuner`	`What kids?`
`02:02.53`	`DTRemenak`	`patlabor221, 25% older :)`
`02:03.03`	`Grumbler`	`percentages lie`
`02:03.11`	`DTRemenak`	`so do people`
`02:03.24`	`Grumbler`	`70% of the people`
`02:03.27`	`DTRemenak`	`but that's never stopped anyone from listening to them`
`02:03.32`	`BIYATankTuner`	`oooooooooooooo`
`02:03.34`	`BIYATankTuner`	`nice`
`02:03.40`	`dacut`	`Hm. Did I read a comment in the source correctly that the clients tell the server where the tanks really are?`
`02:03.41`	`DTRemenak`	`85.1% of statistics are made up on the spot`
`02:04.21`	`Grumbler`	`and that spot is 34.7% common to all spots`
`02:04.34`	`DTRemenak`	`dacut, clients tell the server where they are, yes. the server checks that against legal values.`
`02:04.34`	`dacut`	`(that is, the canonical position is maintained by the client owning the tank; all others dead reckon.)`
`02:04.39`	`dacut`	`Ahh.`
`02:04.42`	`DTRemenak`	`that's correct`
`02:05.04`	`DTRemenak`	`it's a client-side game state. one of the reasons we have a big problem with cheating. patches welcome.`
`02:05.10`	`dacut`	`Heh.`
`02:05.22`	`*** part/#bzflag CannonFodder (~chatzilla@dialup-4.238.224.203.Dial1.Philadelphia1.Level3.net)`
`02:05.30`	`Grumbler`	`speaking of which ........opencombat?`
`02:05.56`	`patlabor221`	`it's not a patch`
`02:05.59`	`dacut`	`Yeah, the whole lag in state updates between clients and the server is something I could never find a nice solution for.`
`02:06.03`	`patlabor221`	`it's more of a supository`
`02:06.12`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:06.21`	`BIYATankTuner`	`I hate those ;)`
`02:06.26`	`patlabor221`	`dacut there are ways, we just don't do them`
`02:06.38`	`Grumbler`	`curosity keeps me checking the website, but i assume that 1.12 is taking priority`
`02:06.45`	`dacut`	`Oh, there are ways, but all of them involve (IMHO ugly) tradeoffs.`
`02:06.48`	`patlabor221`	`1.12?`
`02:06.49`	`DTRemenak`	`how do you print a pointer nicely? %x?`
`02:06.55`	`dacut`	`This is why I'm not a game programmer.`
`02:06.57`	`dacut`	`DT: %p`
`02:07.01`	`DTRemenak`	`thx`
`02:07.11`	`patlabor221`	`dacut, not realy, most of the rest of the games in the known universe do it ok`
`02:07.14`	`dacut`	`(%x works on 32-bit platforms, but not 64)`
`02:07.47`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Pentium 4 and Athon 64`
`02:07.55`	`dacut`	`pat: Oh, I know... it just offends the purist in me. :-)`
`02:07.57`	`BIYATankTuner`	`I know my hardware`
`02:08.00`	`DTRemenak`	`dacut, knew it was something like that, just not specifics`
`02:08.13`	`DTRemenak`	`BIYATankTuner, most P4s are not 64-bit`
`02:08.24`	`patlabor221`	`games are all about just doing what you can, if you come from an "it must be exact" background you'll never cut it :)`
`02:08.26`	`BIYATankTuner`	`There 32`
`02:08.32`	`BIYATankTuner`	`bit`
`02:08.46`	`BIYATankTuner`	`is there a 64bit P4?`
`02:08.56`	`blast007`	`not that I'm aware of`
`02:09.11`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Thought so`
`02:09.14`	`dacut`	`P4 w/EMT has been announced, not shipping.`
`02:09.19`	`patlabor221`	`intel adopted the AMD64 arch`
`02:09.25`	`patlabor221`	`I find that funny`
`02:09.33`	`blast007`	`heh`
`02:09.42`	`BIYATankTuner`	`OMG really?`
`02:09.45`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:10.04`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Why?`
`02:10.25`	`patlabor221`	`because they were late :)`
`02:10.26`	`DTRemenak`	`http://developer.intel.com/technology/64bitextensions/`
`02:10.29`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`02:10.40`	`DTRemenak`	`because the opteron kicked the Itanium's butt in the marketplace :)`
`02:10.53`	`purple_cow`	`DTRemenak: opteron and itanium have different markets`
`02:11.08`	`dacut`	`The Merced performance was... bleh.`
`02:11.08`	`purple_cow`	`itanium is a replacement for RISC big-iron. xeon is opteron's competitor`
`02:11.23`	`DTRemenak`	`purple_cow, intel was trying to move towards ia-64 on small-scale stuff too`
`02:11.24`	`*** join/#bzflag tupone (~atupone@dhcp64-134-38-251.whs.nyc.wayport.net)`
`02:11.25`	`*** join/#bzflag BIYATankTuner (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:11.30`	`dacut`	`(Ironically, the former Merced/Itanium GM is now my CEO.)`
`02:11.54`	`dacut`	`Itanium fell victim to feature-creep by marketing.`
`02:11.59`	`purple_cow`	`DTRemenak: yeah, but it's unfair to compare raw market numbers. there are a lot more departmental servers out there than supercomputers`
`02:12.05`	`DTRemenak`	`purple_cow, yeah`
`02:12.52`	`patlabor221`	`man I hope this works`
`02:12.55`	`Grumbler`	`feature-creep = software guys asking for everything to be done in hardware so they dont have to write the crap themselves`
`02:13.11`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:13.18`	`purple_cow`	`i think intel is still on track for a price-point merge between ia64 and xeon in 2k8`
`02:13.23`	`Grumbler`	`ok, i am a little bitter`
`02:13.35`	`dacut`	`Grumbler: you a chip guy?`
`02:13.54`	`Grumbler`	`yep, nanometer metal for me`
`02:14.03`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:14.05`	`dacut`	`Ah, cool.`
`02:14.50`	`Grumbler`	`.....if you work on BuildGates, I have a few issues we need to discuss`
`02:15.04`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:15.07`	`purple_cow`	`hehe`
`02:15.08`	`dacut`	`Heheh... no, I'm in CIC (Virtuoso).`
`02:15.52`	`Grumbler`	`ah well......have to put that hammer away then.......`
`02:16.00`	`BIYATankTuner`	`heh`
`02:16.15`	`dacut`	`And only at Cadence through an acquisition (but, then, who isn't?).`
`02:16.36`	`BIYATankTuner`	`okay, big words (im lost)`
`02:16.39`	`BIYATankTuner`	`big*`
`02:16.55`	`patlabor221`	`why do you feel the need to follow?`
`02:17.04`	`Grumbler`	`yeah, cadence is a big word.......although it is a four letter word in the office`
`02:17.10`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Cause Im learning`
`02:17.46`	`DTRemenak`	`patlabor221, lurking is a good way to learn. BIYATankTuner, lurking implies not saying stupid stuff. Ask relevant questions if you want.`
`02:17.52`	`dacut`	`Heh... I don't think anyone likes Cadence. Including (especially?) the people who work there. It's really bizarre.`
`02:18.17`	`Grumbler`	`they have always been a funny company`
`02:18.23`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Cadence?`
`02:18.36`	`dacut`	`Cadence makes chip design software.`
`02:18.54`	`dacut`	`Not exactly stuff you're going to find at your local CompUSA. :-)`
`02:19.17`	`Grumbler`	`yeah, a one year license can buy a CompUsa franchise`
`02:19.22`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Darn`
`02:19.30`	`BIYATankTuner`	`:)`
`02:20.21`	`purple_cow`	`dacut: nobody likes EDA software`
`02:20.27`	`purple_cow`	`no matter who makes it`
`02:20.30`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Naa im to young to even think about putting stuff like HT Technology P4's and 2Gb ram`
`02:20.34`	`purple_cow`	`it's a necessary evil`
`02:20.38`	`Grumbler`	`hence us small guys go to the tanner's of the world......which, considering they have only one support person, has awesome techinical help`
`02:20.38`	`BIYATankTuner`	`inot my comp`
`02:20.50`	`dacut`	`Well, we felt more love as a startup.`
`02:21.06`	`dacut`	`I teethed on Tanner LEdit.`
`02:21.39`	`dacut`	`Gumbler: Are you at a fabless house?`
`02:21.52`	`Grumbler`	`yeah, well, i am gum-ing on the tool now......wishing for the TI days of avanti`
`02:22.06`	`Grumbler`	`dacut, yep`
`02:23.32`	`Grumbler`	`we are actually working with tanner on a couple beta versions now........`
`02:23.43`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:23.48`	`dacut`	`One of the things I'd like to do is make an open platform for design (schematic) and layout based on OpenAccess. There's no justifiable reason why a license of Cadence Composer should run $50k/year.`
`02:23.49`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Is there such thing as a T11 connection?`
`02:23.59`	`FerrarisRule`	`hello`
`02:24.04`	`blast007`	`BIYATankTuner: yep, there is`
`02:24.13`	`blast007`	`oh wait`
`02:24.19`	`FerrarisRule`	`who advised me to download firefox`
`02:24.20`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:24.21`	`blast007`	`thought you said T1 ;)`
`02:24.27`	`BIYATankTuner`	`no`
`02:24.29`	`patlabor221`	`yay for qick reply`
`02:24.30`	`BIYATankTuner`	`T11`
`02:24.40`	`patlabor221`	`oo and it's super quick reply`
`02:24.45`	`Grumbler`	`firefox has a nice little tracking cookie that gets installed.....good luck`
`02:24.45`	`FerrarisRule`	`it was u blast007 wasn't`
`02:25.03`	`blast007`	`probably`
`02:25.05`	`BIYATankTuner`	`It was me :)`
`02:25.16`	`FerrarisRule`	`i have horrible downloading rates with this thing`
`02:25.24`	`BIYATankTuner`	`and....`
`02:25.30`	`dacut`	`BIYA: There probably is (dig through IEEE standards, you're bound to find something), but nobody uses such a beast that I know of.`
`02:25.34`	`FerrarisRule`	`16.3 kb/sec`
`02:25.37`	`blast007`	`I doubt that's the browsers fault`
`02:25.41`	`Grumbler`	`FerrarisRule, have never seen that, it is probably your connection`
`02:25.46`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:25.55`	`blast007`	`it's most likely the site you are downloading from`
`02:25.57`	`Grumbler`	`yep, its your connection`
`02:25.57`	`BIYATankTuner`	`And......`
`02:26.10`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/ (8 files in 3 dirs):`
`02:26.10`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: - fixed DTR's invalid meshface bug (don't print faces if there's no mesh)`
`02:26.10`	`CIA-3`	`BZFlag: - renamed "refmat" to "matref"`
`02:26.20`	`DTRemenak`	`yay`
`02:26.23`	`blast007`	`:)`
`02:26.25`	`DTRemenak`	`~trepan++`
`02:26.26`	`FerrarisRule`	`explorer has around 200 kb/sec on average for every site`
`02:26.42`	`BIYATankTuner`	`so.....`
`02:26.46`	`BIYATankTuner`	`point is....`
`02:26.59`	`FerrarisRule`	`comare 200 and 16.3`
`02:27.07`	`FerrarisRule`	`which is better`
`02:27.17`	`*** join/#bzflag Legoguy (~Lego\|Desk@adsl-67-37-236-141.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net)`
`02:27.22`	`FerrarisRule`	`:(`
`02:27.30`	`DTRemenak`	`FerrarisRule, I get about 900 kb/sec with firefox. it's not the browser, dude.`
`02:27.37`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:27.38`	`Grumbler`	`looks like trep is awake`
`02:28.00`	`FerrarisRule`	`god dam backspace!`
`02:28.14`	`Grumbler`	`really should buy trep a beer one of these days`
`02:28.16`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: get a real IRC client and backspace won't do that`
`02:28.34`	`FerrarisRule`	`it keeps going back to different pages`
`02:28.41`	`DTRemenak`	`FerrarisRule, http://hacksrus.com/~ginda/chatzilla`
`02:28.48`	`Grumbler`	`or just learn to type`
`02:28.53`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`02:29.19`	`FerrarisRule`	`so what about it`
`02:29.19`	`blast007`	`XChat is what I have on here, and it works good`
`02:29.23`	`patlabor221`	`and please watch your language`
`02:29.25`	`FerrarisRule`	`will it work here`
`02:29.29`	`FerrarisRule`	`got ya`
`02:29.31`	`patlabor221`	`where is here?`
`02:29.39`	`patlabor221`	`you seem like a MIRC user to me`
`02:29.40`	`blast007`	`here is there`
`02:29.43`	`FerrarisRule`	`it just PO's me`
`02:29.44`	`DTRemenak`	`hahaha`
`02:29.54`	`blast007`	`hehe, I almost suggested mIRC ;)`
`02:30.01`	`DTRemenak`	`patlabor221, you might be right about that...`
`02:30.11`	`patlabor221`	`xchat is now 30 day trial`
`02:30.15`	`BIYATankTuner`	`CONFUSING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!`
`02:30.18`	`FerrarisRule`	`i use http://stats.bzflag.org/irc/irc.cgi`
`02:30.19`	`patlabor221`	`mirc will be better for thim`
`02:30.21`	`dacut`	`Dude, if you were l33t, you'd just telnet into the IRC server... ;-)`
`02:30.21`	`blast007`	`although it's a rather "busy" looking client`
`02:30.29`	`BIYATankTuner`	`AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1`
`02:30.35`	`patlabor221`	`Biyatankturner, ANOYING.............`
`02:30.37`	`patlabor221`	`stop it`
`02:30.37`	`patlabor221`	`now`
`02:30.46`	`BIYATankTuner`	`Cant read that fast`
`02:30.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`i use http://stats.bzflag.org/irc/irc.cgi`
`02:30.48`	`BIYATankTuner`	`geeeeezz`
`02:30.52`	`patlabor221`	`then scrool`
`02:30.56`	`*** join/#bzflag Patlabor2221 (~JeffM@adsl-69-232-110-87.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net)`
`02:30.59`	`patlabor221`	`we don't need to know about your literacy issues`
`02:31.01`	`blast007`	`CGI:IRC is crap`
`02:31.03`	`BIYATankTuner`	`It keeps building up`
`02:31.06`	`*** part/#bzflag patlabor221 (~jeffm@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`02:31.08`	`BIYATankTuner`	`lol`
`02:31.22`	`FerrarisRule`	`i use http://stats.bzflag.org/irc/irc.cgi`
`02:31.23`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o patlabor221] by ChanServ`
`02:31.33`	`FerrarisRule`	`i use http://stats.bzflag.org/irc/irc.cgi`
`02:31.34`	`scanline`	`BIYATankTuner: try not to type faster than you read`
`02:31.40`	`FerrarisRule`	`i use http://stats.bzflag.org/irc/irc.cgi`
`02:31.41`	`blast007`	`FerrarisRule: we heard you the first time :P`
`02:31.42`	`patlabor221`	`naw just done with the update so don't need to use IRC on the mac anymore`
`02:31.47`	`FerrarisRule`	`oh`
`02:31.57`	`blast007`	`no need to tell us 5 times`
`02:31.57`	`patlabor221`	`FerrarisRule: we know we can see your IP`
`02:31.59`	`DTRemenak`	`FerrarisRule, we know you do, we can tell.`
`02:32.18`	`DTRemenak`	`FerrarisRule, that's why I sent you the nice clicky URL so you can get a real IRC client`
`02:32.31`	`dacut`	`... scanline: same scanline of PicoGUI?`
`02:32.37`	`patlabor221`	`yes`
`02:32.57`	`dacut`	`Ah. Pleasure to be in your company again, then!`
`02:33.12`	`patlabor221`	`if he's awake :)`
`02:33.31`	`dacut`	`He just typed above, which is what alerted me...`
`02:34.32`	`patlabor221`	`sometimes he type in his sleep`
`02:34.51`	`Grumbler`	`yep, thats how pybzflag got started`
`02:34.57`	`amathis`	`he is just that good`
`02:38.26`	`*** join/#bzflag Mikkel_ (~Mikkel@h000d93444438.ne.client2.attbi.com)`
`02:41.42`	`FerrarisRule`	`so what were u saying about my IP?`
`02:41.46`	`patlabor221`	`your not`
`02:41.56`	`patlabor221`	`your calling OnKillGame directly from update input`
`02:41.59`	`patlabor221`	`on escape`
`02:42.04`	`patlabor221`	`all you have to do is return true`
`02:42.06`	`FerrarisRule`	`hello?`
`02:42.07`	`patlabor221`	`and it'll auto bail`
`02:42.11`	`patlabor221`	`oops :)`
`02:42.12`	`patlabor221`	`ww`
`02:42.16`	`FerrarisRule`	`so what were u saying about my IP?`
`02:42.16`	`amathis`	`heh :)`
`02:42.28`	`FerrarisRule`	`i was doing some chores`
`02:42.38`	`patlabor221`	`we see your IP as the one from the web IRC`
`02:42.43`	`patlabor221`	`we know exactly what your using`
`02:42.50`	`FerrarisRule`	`so why ask`
`02:43.03`	`FerrarisRule`	`to PO me more`
`02:43.15`	`FerrarisRule`	`u think it's funny don't you`
`02:43.26`	`patlabor221`	`huh?`
`02:43.31`	`patlabor221`	`no we just know web IRC sucks`
`02:43.32`	`blast007`	`yes, CGI:IRC is funny`
`02:43.40`	`patlabor221`	`we see your using it every time you login`
`02:43.48`	`patlabor221`	`see when the last user loged in`
`02:43.53`	`patlabor221`	`those things after his name`
`02:43.56`	`patlabor221`	`that's his hostmask`
`02:44.07`	`patlabor221`	`all the web IRC users have a common part in the hostmask`
`02:44.27`	`patlabor221`	`so we know right off the bat`
`02:44.45`	`patlabor221`	`we can also do this`
`02:45.00`	`FerrarisRule`	`i'll be right back`
`02:45.01`	`patlabor221`	`and you return.... VERSION CGI:IRC 0.5.4 (2004/01/29) 24.223.149.35 - http://cgiirc.sf.net/`
`02:45.08`	`FerrarisRule`	`wait`
`02:45.18`	`FerrarisRule`	`i just installed chatzilla`
`02:45.24`	`patlabor221`	`that's fine`
`02:45.24`	`FerrarisRule`	`what does it do?`
`02:45.27`	`patlabor221`	`are you using it?`
`02:45.32`	`blast007`	`it's an IRC client`
`02:45.33`	`FerrarisRule`	`how do u use`
`02:45.34`	`FerrarisRule`	`it`
`02:45.37`	`patlabor221`	`run it`
`02:45.41`	`scanline`	`dacut: hello`
`02:45.42`	`FerrarisRule`	`how?`
`02:45.55`	`scanline`	`dacut: I really hope you're not still using picogui ;)`
`02:45.56`	`patlabor221`	`same way you run all things on windows`
`02:46.04`	`FerrarisRule`	`it said it would be installed when i restart firefox`
`02:46.12`	`patlabor221`	`then there ya go`
`02:46.15`	`blast007`	`then restart firefox ;)`
`02:46.17`	`FerrarisRule`	`ok thanks`
`02:46.25`	`blast007`	`...wow...`
`02:46.39`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`02:46.44`	`blast007`	`we're doomed`
`02:46.49`	`patlabor221`	`totaly`
`02:47.23`	`blast007`	`:)`
`02:48.22`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:48.53`	`patlabor221`	`nope still webIRC`
`02:49.01`	`patlabor221`	`just get mirc`
`02:49.03`	`patlabor221`	`it's simpler`
`02:49.19`	`*** join/#bzflag FerrarisRule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:49.27`	`patlabor221`	`just get mirc`
`02:49.28`	`blast007`	`XChat is actually just about as easy`
`02:49.28`	`FerrarisRule`	`I don't think it worked`
`02:49.30`	`patlabor221`	`it's simpler`
`02:49.45`	`patlabor221`	`it didn't`
`02:49.51`	`FerrarisRule`	`well duh`
`02:49.54`	`patlabor221`	`blast but the current download is shareware`
`02:50.00`	`patlabor221`	`well sorta`
`02:50.06`	`FerrarisRule`	`i came to this one for a reason`
`02:50.25`	`FerrarisRule`	`what do i do to open it`
`02:50.30`	`patlabor221`	`ftp://ftp.efnet.us/clients/win32/mirc/mirc616.exe`
`02:50.34`	`patlabor221`	`just get that and run it`
`02:50.41`	`patlabor221`	`it's not tied to firefix`
`02:50.48`	`FerrarisRule`	`so?`
`02:50.57`	`FerrarisRule`	`use explorer`
`02:51.07`	`patlabor221`	`no download that link`
`02:51.09`	`patlabor221`	`run it`
`02:51.14`	`patlabor221`	`it will install MIRC`
`02:51.19`	`patlabor221`	`then run MIRC`
`02:51.28`	`patlabor221`	`then use it`
`02:52.01`	`patlabor221`	`ahhh the joy of KDE`
`02:52.20`	`FerrarisRule`	`brb`
`02:53.26`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007_ (~blast007@dialup-4.159.68.145.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net)`
`02:54.16`	`*** join/#bzflag ferrarisrule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:54.21`	`ferrarisrule`	`which room`
`02:54.29`	`ferrarisrule`	`chat room i mean`
`02:54.52`	`ferrarisrule`	`pat, hello`
`02:55.02`	`ferrarisrule`	`which chat room`
`02:55.14`	`ferrarisrule`	`or am i going on a wild goose chase here`
`02:55.15`	`patlabor221`	`the one your in :)`
`02:55.17`	`blast007`	`server: irc.freenode.net channel: #bzflag`
`02:56.11`	`patlabor221`	`how do I go to a single usermode`
`02:56.16`	`patlabor221`	`like init 3 or something?`
`02:56.23`	`ferrarisrule`	`i don't think it's working`
`02:56.34`	`patlabor221`	`need to kill X and not have gdm restart`
`02:56.41`	`patlabor221`	`so I can install nvidias`
`02:56.47`	`ferrarisrule`	`????`
`02:56.52`	`patlabor221`	`ferrarisrule: why not tell us what is happening`
`02:56.52`	`scanline`	`patlabor221: there should be an init script for gdm that you can stop`
`02:56.55`	`patlabor221`	`and that wasn't for you`
`02:57.04`	`*** join/#bzflag ferrarisrule (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`02:57.10`	`ferrarisrule`	`i'm using mIRC`
`02:57.23`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007_ (~blast@dialup-4.159.68.145.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net)`
`02:57.34`	`ferrarisrule`	`there are none of the servers or channels u mentioned`
`02:57.35`	`patlabor221`	`what does mirc say that makes you say it's not working?`
`02:57.40`	`patlabor221`	`one is freenode`
`02:57.46`	`patlabor221`	`or just type it in`
`02:57.48`	`ferrarisrule`	`i only one in room`
`02:58.01`	`blast007`	`I think i had to create an entry for freenode on my mIRC client`
`02:58.11`	`blast007`	`but XChat had one already`
`02:58.14`	`ferrarisrule`	`so what i do?`
`02:58.15`	`patlabor221`	`perhaps IRC is a bit much for you`
`02:58.21`	`ferrarisrule`	`yes`
`02:58.32`	`patlabor221`	`well if you can't figure out how to set up a new server entry`
`02:58.32`	`ferrarisrule`	`i'm only 14 u know`
`02:58.35`	`patlabor221`	`so`
`02:58.36`	`patlabor221`	`your here`
`02:58.40`	`blast007`	`ferrarisrule: http://www.mirc.com/irc.html`
`02:58.45`	`patlabor221`	`age should not mater in competency`
`02:58.49`	`patlabor221`	`I asume you can read`
`02:58.55`	`nilson`	`I am 14 as well...`
`02:59.01`	`nilson`	`It's not a limiting factor`
`02:59.01`	`patlabor221`	`many are`
`02:59.03`	`patlabor221`	`and they do fine`
`02:59.31`	`patlabor221`	`to me it just looks like you need to be show how to do everyting and don't want to try anyting`
`02:59.50`	`ferrarisrule`	`g2g try tommarow`
`02:59.50`	`blast007`	`and don't want to read documentation ;)`
`02:59.53`	`nilson`	`What is the problem, anyway?`
`03:00.11`	`patlabor221`	`he can't make an IRC client go`
`03:00.13`	`blast007`	`he can't figure out how to use an IRC client`
`03:00.16`	`nilson`	`I got over my anti-RTFM spree`
`03:00.20`	`nilson`	`a long while back`
`03:00.25`	`patlabor221`	`yeah`
`03:00.28`	`patlabor221`	`he just dosn't care`
`03:00.53`	`*** join/#bzflag miggity (www-data@69.28.129.166)`
`03:02.18`	`nilson`	`No one in here has experience setting up an MTA, by any chance?`