irclog2html for #bzflag on 20050224

00:13.33*** join/#bzflag wegstar (~foo@adsl-67-121-191-222.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net)
00:53.18*** join/#bzflag Brad2901 (brad2901@ACCAAA31.ipt.aol.com)
01:02.32*** join/#bzflag wegstar (~foo@adsl-67-121-191-222.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net)
01:31.40*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@2002:45a6:876a:0:0:0:0:1)
01:35.16GrumblerNoodle-sensei<  no you first
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02:08.59bz7495ibot 63.224.229.58:5154
02:09.37*** join/#bzflag bz0041 (~3fe0e53a@webchat.bzflag.bz)
02:09.45bz0041~bzfquery 63.224.229.58:5154
02:11.05bz0041bzfquery 63.224.229.58:5154
02:11.37bz0041~bzfquery 63.224.229.58:5154
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02:12.10lethaldude~bzfquery 63.224.229.58:5154
02:13.16lethaldude~bzfquery 63.224.229.58:5154
02:15.22Aribeth_away~query taz4.fiberhosting.com
02:20.58Aribeth_away~bzfquery taz4.fiberhosting.com
02:24.13*** join/#bzflag doughecka1 (~Doug@adsl-210-145-22.sdf.bellsouth.net)
02:33.37`ls`wow. lethal
02:39.07wegstar?
02:42.05blast007hehe, rot13  :)
02:45.53*** join/#bzflag lan56 (lan56@h-68-167-2-152.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)
02:48.59*** join/#bzflag bzflaginator (~183a61f4@webchat.bzflag.bz)
02:49.14bzflaginatorbryjen?
02:50.05*** join/#bzflag bzflaginator (~183a61f4@webchat.bzflag.bz)
02:50.11bzflaginatorhelllloooo???
02:50.15bryjenyes?
02:50.24bzflaginatorlol
02:50.27bzflaginatori need help
02:50.33bzflaginatorwith my registration
02:50.46bzflaginatorhow do i PM you?
02:51.23bryjen<PROTECTED>
02:52.10SportChickNidhoggr: ping
02:52.19*** join/#bzflag bzflaginator (~183a61f4@webchat.bzflag.bz)
02:52.23SportChicktimmy and hw got into another altercation around 5pm
02:52.32bzflaginatorlol
02:52.41bzflaginatorso its /msg bryjen?
02:53.10bryjento send a one-liner directly to me here
02:53.37*** join/#bzflag mother (~45f06abf@rw08.de)
02:58.21*** join/#bzflag lan56_ (lan56@h-68-165-17-63.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)
03:01.11orchidhttp://www.burj-al-arab.com/tennis/agassi_6.jpg
03:01.37orchidhttp://www.burj-al-arab.com/tennis/agassi_3.jpg
03:02.18bryjen!seen Nidhoggr
03:02.18guubryjen: Nidhoggr was last seen here 5 hours, 13 minutes, and 49 seconds ago saying: <Nidhoggr> :) yum.
03:03.15bryjeneek. I'd want a much wider net
03:05.42orchid:)
03:07.39PizbitI'd want a higher one too.
03:07.58PizbitAnd that better be an extremely strong material it's made of.
03:08.26PizbitAnd parachutes that you can grab as you fly off the edge so you don't die.
03:11.27PizbitAlso a bouncy castle at the bottom to land on. :D
03:12.05bryjenin the second one, looks like there's water below
03:22.03*** join/#bzflag cods_ (~admin@tuxee.net)
03:22.58bryjen1386 registered forum users
03:23.52*** join/#bzflag MeBigFatGuy (dave@balt-209-150-117-117.dynamic-dial.qis.net)
03:26.50*** join/#bzflag ElectricElf (dbharris@electricelf.user)
03:35.20lan56_bryjen: the growth is truly stunning
03:38.34MeBigFatGuyshould have a dermatologist look at it, then
03:42.46lan56_heh
03:44.01purple_cowit's a good thing he's still got that quit message
03:45.31wegstar:)
03:45.35bryjenMeBigFatGuy: eww.
03:45.56MeBigFatGuypurple_cow, heh
03:46.17bryjenat least you didn't make a "natural male enhancement" joke
03:52.47*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~JeffM@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)
03:52.47*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ
03:55.41*** join/#bzflag JeffM2502 (~JeffM@ppp-69-236-20-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net)
03:56.19*** join/#bzflag Legolas_ (~twgin@ppp-69-233-96-144.dsl.frs2ca.pacbell.net)
03:56.39wegstarok.. ask here
03:56.53Legolas_does anyone know how to set waterlevel in one spot
03:57.27wegstarhave to wait a while... :)
03:57.34Legolas_ok
03:58.16Legolas_WIATING ............ :)
03:58.46MeBigFatGuyput a building ontop of the water you don't want :)
03:58.53bryjenthe waterlevel thing is to cover the whole map
03:59.04wegstarthere we go :)
03:59.28cods_add a meshbox with death physics and dynamic texture to "emulate" waterlevel somewhere
04:00.24Legolas_ow do i get it blue matref blue
04:01.21Legolas_how do i make dynamic textures?
04:01.39wegstarhttp://bzflag.org/wiki/MapMaking
04:01.41*** join/#bzflag LouMan (~42e39a3f@webchat.bzflag.bz)
04:01.53Legolas_ok bbl
04:02.02wegstarhi louman
04:02.06LouManhi
04:02.22Legolas_and test out me map Goliath.servegame.org
04:02.29codsLegolas_: you can use WaterMaterial in your object
04:02.31Legolas_thats my callsign
04:02.42Legolas_how
04:02.58creeperzwhat is Water Level?
04:03.02creeperzis there literal water?
04:03.11codsLegolas_: see wegstar link
04:03.15Legolas_yes and you tan rusts
04:03.19wegstarhttp://bzflag.org/wiki/MapMaking :)
04:03.27creeperzwha?
04:03.36creeperzthey went that deep before the release? :-S
04:03.37wegstartank rusts
04:03.46*** join/#bzflag bz9090 (~41dd3315@webchat.bzflag.bz)
04:03.48creeperzinstantly?
04:03.53creeperzor just over time?
04:04.04wegstarwell.. yes
04:04.05bryjeninstantly. touch water and die
04:04.14creeperzoh
04:04.15creeperzwow
04:04.18creeperztat sucks
04:04.48Legolas_bye
04:04.50*** part/#bzflag Legolas_ (~twgin@ppp-69-233-96-144.dsl.frs2ca.pacbell.net)
04:05.40*** join/#bzflag Silver1 (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
04:06.15wegstarhmm.. I've met a lot of people with windows servers that have no global reg....
04:07.11creeperzmapmaking is so much more complex :-(
04:07.40wegstarwhy?
04:07.43LouManmore freedom though...
04:07.54creeperzyeah
04:07.58MeBigFatGuytrue
04:08.00wegstaroh yeah... nice map louman..
04:08.00creeperzlots to do stuff with
04:08.04LouManthx
04:08.10creeperzcan you make animated meshes?
04:08.16*** join/#bzflag Legolas_ (~twgin@ppp-69-233-96-144.dsl.frs2ca.pacbell.net)
04:08.18wegstarno...
04:08.25*** join/#bzflag ArmyofOne (~41dd3315@webchat.bzflag.bz)
04:08.28creeperzgr
04:08.47creeperzi saw a moving ramp the other day
04:08.49*** join/#bzflag Legolas_ (~twgin@ppp-69-233-96-144.dsl.frs2ca.pacbell.net)
04:08.51creeperzhow can that be done?
04:09.00LouManthat was a shifting texture
04:09.04creeperzah
04:09.04Legolas_so what do i do?
04:09.14creeperzcrazy
04:09.18LouManuse shift in texmat
04:09.44wegstar?
04:09.54wegstarI'm rusting away on your server...
04:10.06LouManmine?
04:10.20wegstarno... Legolas's brother's
04:10.44ArmyofOnehow do you test your server network to determine how many people you can host
04:11.03Legolas_hehe
04:11.06wegstar"server network"?
04:11.31MeBigFatGuyput an add message in that says $10,000 to the first player to reach 100
04:11.36wegstardid you set a limit?
04:11.53MeBigFatGuyyou should be able to find out quick, then
04:13.02ArmyofOnei have high speed connection average about 380kbps up
04:13.57Grumbler~MeBigFatGuy++
04:14.05MeBigFatGuyw00t!
04:14.59GrumblerArmyofOne<  its a combination of # of shots and # of players....probably 10 with 4 shots....its all guesstamation
04:16.00ArmyofOnei have 20 with no probs and 10 shot-just would like to find out what my max is if i can some how
04:17.03LouMandoes anyone know why lagstats for all players skyrocket on server when observers with high lag join game?
04:17.45*** join/#bzflag Silver2 (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
04:18.51*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.user)
04:21.08sgk284ping nidhoggr
04:22.57LouManping nidhoggr?
04:24.47sgk284~ping
04:24.48ibotpong
04:25.07sgk284louman, you ping someone when you want their attention or to see if they are here
04:25.17sgk284they typically reply with pong
04:25.36LouMansorry - new to this
04:25.42sgk284no problem:)
04:25.46codsdoes anyone know if a mesh exist for the actual tank in 2.0 ? (for blender for example)
04:26.12sgk284cods, not officially, and not unofficially either as far as i know
04:26.28sgk284or i guess its gotta be somewhere juding by some of the backgrounds and stuff i've seen
04:26.32codsok.
04:26.38codsI guess I can extract it from the source code.. :)
04:26.41sgk284but its hard coded into the source, you know where it is?
04:26.44sgk284yea okay:)
04:27.21sgk284ever done it before?
04:28.16codsme? what?
04:28.22sgk284heh nevermind
04:28.27LouMani did it from the 1.10.8 version and it was... interesting
04:28.41MeBigFatGuynow thars a nifty tuel -> http://cvsgrab.sourceforge.net/
04:29.00sgk284yea the tank body, trads and top are all in different files iirc, in addition to that, each has three levels of detail
04:29.04sgk284treads*
04:29.14sgk284i think
04:29.17sgk284its been a while
04:29.18*** join/#bzflag creeperz (~creeperz@host-40-145-230-24.midco.net)
04:29.35sgk284err in 2.0 its probably a lot different...
04:29.47sgk284i know trepan did alot with tank models, or at least the treads
04:29.49LouManyep - and figuring out the opengl commands versus mesh vertices was hard
04:30.33codssgk284: yep, I see that. But seem easy to extract.
04:30.55sgk284its easy, just not the funnest job in the world:)
04:31.15LouManfor someone that knows opengl maybe - not 4 me!
04:31.54sgk284shouldnt take too long though... you can probably copy and paste, then write a quick awk script (or do it manually) to make it intoa more 3d friendly format
04:32.28codsI will use Python, and generate a POV output.
04:32.48sgk284yea, that seems like a sane plan
04:33.43*** join/#bzflag Pizbit_ (~Pizbit@203-79-124-44.adsl.paradise.net.nz)
04:37.13*** join/#bzflag Silver1 (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
04:39.16*** part/#bzflag LouMan (~42e39a3f@webchat.bzflag.bz)
04:41.20sgk284MeBigFatGuy, indeed, that is pretty neat
04:55.06wegstar~seen DTRemenak
04:55.14ibotdtremenak <~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-84.caltech.edu> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 2d 2h 17m 41s ago, saying: 'SportChick: that's been fixed...it's what we were discussing'.
04:55.28wegstaroh...
04:55.29DTRemenakwegstar: need something?
04:55.53wegstaryes.. you said that your version of windows bzfs has global logins right?
04:56.01DTRemenakyup
04:56.04wegstaroh...
04:56.13DTRemenakthey even work
04:56.22wegstarmany windows servers I have gone to do not have it ..
04:56.50DTRemenakmany windows servers are not started with a userdb and groupdb file
04:58.10wegstarthey are.. and they don't work for some reason...
04:58.33orangewegstar, publicly listed servers?
04:58.41wegstaryes
04:58.45DTRemenaksince it doesn't work for you, I'd guess it probably doesn't work for someone else too.  unique problems are rare.
04:59.14wegstarI got it working some time ago :)
04:59.19DTRemenakah, good
04:59.24DTRemenakwhat was it?
04:59.35wegstarJeffM siad it may be a network lib issue.. and i think it may be true...
04:59.53wegstarI just built my own copy of bzfs and it just worked...
05:00.06DTRemenakheh
05:00.23wegstarhmm...
05:01.12wegstarhow about the other poor people...?
05:02.31wegstarBTW, d o you have problems spawning if you have too many flags on the field... lets say 100?
05:04.58sgk284DTRemenak, does auth use port 80?
05:05.12DTRemenaksgk284: out, yes
05:05.46sgk284k
05:05.46DTRemenakwegstar: I've heard of that, haven't experienced it though
05:06.01sgk284my linux server cant do auth either... i have to ssh to one of Nidhoggr's servers and run it from there to test :/
05:06.07wegstarguess what... it happens on windows servers .. :)
05:06.08sgk284dont know if its a windows only issue
05:06.29wegstarit could be... anyone willing to try on a linux server?
05:06.36sgk284wegstar, i have
05:06.47sgk284from my linux server it cant do auth, but from other's it can
05:07.03sgk284thought it may have been a router issue, but port 80 is open
05:07.12Pizbit_Sub 1024 ports need super use acess to bind
05:07.20wegstarsgk284: could you spawn?
05:07.25sgk284yea
05:07.45sgk284everything else works, and actually auth works too (at least for me) it just takes very long
05:07.47DTRemenakPizbit: it's 80 out, not in.  if a web browser works, bzfs should.
05:07.51sgk284so i may be a unique case
05:07.53PizbitOh, right heh
05:07.53wegstarthis issue wasn't in the 1.10.8 version.. I had up to a 1,000 flags
05:08.28sgk284what is it? +f 100
05:08.33wegstarwell.. yes
05:08.42DTRemenak+f good{5}
05:08.47DTRemenakwill give you ~130 flags
05:09.30DTRemenakseems to be just particular clients affected, and only on remote servers (local servers work).  I'm betting that flag negotiation is timing out or something
05:09.44DTRemenakmm, wouldn't be negotiation
05:09.53DTRemenakmight be when the flags are first sent
05:09.57*** join/#bzflag QuantumBeep (~4321d554@webchat.bzflag.bz)
05:10.04wegstarnwhat happened?
05:10.17wegstarnhi QuantumBeep
05:10.17DTRemenakwegstar: what?
05:10.20DTRemenak~n
05:10.21ibothmm... n is the disease bzflag players get when they play too much
05:10.21QuantumBeepThou hast been "n"ed.
05:10.29wegstarargh
05:10.35wegstarcould you spawn?
05:10.51sgk284wegstar, with 500 flags i cant spawn
05:10.57sgk284seems i cant spawn with 99 either
05:11.01wegstarah...
05:11.05*** join/#bzflag gvdm (~gvdm@210-246-16-56.paradise.net.nz)
05:11.21QuantumBeepOkay... I got a good deal of help with the "spin" parameter and the use of vectors, but I still am not getting it. Is there a good online resource for learning the use and function of vectors in this context?
05:11.49sgk284in fact i'd bet money on it, unless someone says the spawn algorithm doesn take flags into consideration
05:11.52sgk284:)
05:11.53wegstarThanks.. good to know that it isn't affecting only windows users
05:11.59wegstarerr.
05:12.07wegstarnope it doesn't
05:12.11sgk284let me go peek at the code
05:12.14sgk284you sure?
05:12.15DTRemenaksgk284: spawn algo doesn't consider flags
05:12.18sgk284ugh
05:12.21sgk284why not?
05:12.26DTRemenakwhy should it?
05:12.34sgk284i dunno, itd solve the problem
05:12.36sgk284;)
05:12.44DTRemenakheh, you mean it'd cause the problem :P
05:12.48sgk284heh
05:12.57wegstari.e. Jpa's ocean map thingy
05:13.09sgk284i'm gonna go see what the limit on the flags seems to be before you cant spawn
05:13.37wegstar:)
05:15.02*** join/#bzflag QuantumBeep (~4321d554@webchat.bzflag.bz)
05:15.10sgk284DTRemenak, do you kow of anywhere in the source off the top of your head where bzfs would constantly be looping through the flags?
05:15.34DTRemenaksgk284: plenty of places.
05:15.43DTRemenaksgk284: look for somewhere it tries to send them all though
05:16.01DTRemenakI'm pretty sure it's network-dependant
05:16.03sgk284bzadmin has trouble connecting too
05:16.20sgk284connects very slowly
05:16.32sgk284actually its using 92% of the processor... thats not normal
05:16.44DTRemenakheh
05:17.08QuantumBeepOkay... when I use the spin parameter on an object, the entire objects goes to a seemingly random spot on the map. I'm a bit lost.
05:17.45QuantumBeepI know little of vector graphics, but  I'm OK placing objects in XYZ land.
05:17.54DTRemenakQuantumBeep: spin spins it around the origin.  if you're doing both shift and spin, spin first, then shift
05:18.01sgk284QuantumBeep, the order of the transformations matters, you probably have the wrong coords or the wrong order
05:18.22DTRemenake.g. an object at 0,0 spun 90 will be at 0,0 still
05:18.36DTRemenakbut an object at 100,0 spun 90 will end up at 0,100
05:18.51QuantumBeepHmm. Is "spin 90 <value> <value> <value> valid?
05:19.09DTRemenakwhat's the syntax?
05:19.25QuantumBeepLet's see. Understand that I know nothing here...
05:19.33QuantumBeepnI got an arc at
05:19.47sgk284DTRemenak, think i found the problem, hopefully
05:19.49QuantumBeep60 386 169
05:19.51sgk284Player sgk284 [0] removed at 2005-02-23 12:19:23: send queue too big
05:19.59DTRemenaksgk284: yup, I'm betting that's it
05:20.06DTRemenakconnection can't keep up
05:20.08sgk284makes sense
05:20.11QuantumBeep, and I want the arc to lay down, putting the end down the y coord.
05:20.17DTRemenakI can spawn on a 3000-flag server on a lan
05:20.30sgk284this is on a localhost though... you think itd be fast enough:)
05:20.35DTRemenakheh
05:20.43sgk284linux tends to handle local connections really well
05:20.47DTRemenakhow fast is your loopback stack, that's the question :)
05:20.54QuantumBeepSo I tried "spin 90 60 -100 169"
05:21.02sgk284err faster then bzfs would lead you to believe ;)
05:21.12QuantumBeepThe I tried "spin 90 0 -100 0"
05:21.18DTRemenaksgk284: what server command are you starting with?
05:21.22QuantumBeepRandomness ensued
05:21.38DTRemenakQuantumBeep: the other three values are a vector
05:21.41sgk284src/bzfs/bzfs -password xxxxxx +f good{500} -j -s 10 -d -d -d
05:21.46DTRemenakif I had a chalkboard I could draw it for you
05:21.58DTRemenaksgk284: +f good does ~25 flags per :)
05:22.12DTRemenakso you're close to 12000 flags
05:22.16sgk284haha
05:22.18wegstartoo bad there's no such place as a "drawbin":)
05:22.29DTRemenak+f good means "one of EACH good flag" :)
05:22.29QuantumBeepLet's see. A vector is the location I want the "base" to point, ne?
05:22.39DTRemenakQuantumBeep: yeah, pretty much
05:22.46sgk284oh okay
05:22.52DTRemenakdraw a line from 0,0,0 to x,y,z and rotate around that line
05:23.16QuantumBeepThat's what I'm missing. How does 0,0,0 fit into this?
05:23.20DTRemenakif you want it to stay on the ground, then you'd want 0,0,n
05:23.21sgk284DTRemenak, so its a non issue, right? i mean not much to do about it
05:23.29DTRemenakwhere n is an arbitrary value
05:23.37DTRemenaksgk284: it's still an issue
05:23.44*** join/#bzflag Silver2 (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
05:23.51DTRemenakprobably whatever's flooding the queue should be broken into parts like the worlds are
05:24.07DTRemenakmy dad, on 56k out in the boonies, can only join servers with ~15 flags or less
05:24.25sgk284is that 15*25? or 15?
05:24.29DTRemenak15
05:24.33QuantumBeepOkay. Lemme go try this some more. Thanks for the help
05:24.39DTRemenaklike 4-team ctf + 10 wings
05:24.40sgk284hrmm okay, yea thats an issue
05:24.54DTRemenakcourse with his lag I'm amazed he plays at all
05:24.59sgk284heh
05:25.05Silver2hmm... that should be enough flags.  What's the problem?  ;)
05:25.27DTRemenakQuantumBeep: the line from the origin to whatever point you specify is the axis of rotation.  the actual point doesn't matter.
05:26.23DTRemenakit could be represented by a heading and an elevation too, but that would be even sillier
05:26.57DTRemenakSilver2: that's on a good day :)
05:28.13*** join/#bzflag Silver[a] (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
05:29.18MeBigFatGuyi find it rare to play for more than 5 minutes w/o getting lag kicked, anymore
05:29.47DTRemenakMeBigFatGuy: noticed any problems spawning on servers with lots of flags?
05:29.56MeBigFatGuyyes
05:30.14wegstar:)
05:30.36DTRemenakyup, must be bandwidth then
05:31.05wegstarchatting would get you disconnected from the server when you can't spawn... right?
05:35.38QuantumBeepThe point of origin for a cylinder-shaped arc is the visible base of the cylinder, right?
05:35.51QuantumBeepIf so, spin seems to be moving my point of origin.
05:36.41wegstaror so it seems....
05:37.01DTRemenakQuantumBeep: hmm?
05:44.17*** join/#bzflag Privia (~Privia@h000d93444438.ne.client2.attbi.com)
06:00.39MeBigFatGuytransform to the origin, spin, transform back
06:12.06SportChick<PROTECTED>
06:12.08ibotnidhoggr is currently on #bzflag.  Has said a total of 44 messages.  Is idling for 8h 23m 40s
06:13.43Aribeth_awayhi SportChick
06:13.51SportChickhi aribeth
06:13.58SportChickAribeth_away: you seen nid anywhere in a while?
06:14.08Aribeth_awayno i havn't
06:14.12SportChicknm - I found him
06:18.06*** join/#bzflag stevek_ (~stevek@AC8F04FB.ipt.aol.com)
06:32.16*** join/#bzflag Silver1 (trilluser@68-116-47-254.or.charter.com)
06:44.48*** join/#bzflag Pizbit (~Pizbit@203-79-124-44.adsl.paradise.net.nz)
07:06.00wegstarnite all
07:12.08*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)
07:56.06*** join/#bzflag ToughShooter (~ts@pD9EA655B.dip.t-dialin.net)
08:10.34*** join/#bzflag QuantumBeep (~4321d554@webchat.bzflag.bz)
08:10.42QuantumBeepDT, you awake?
08:11.50QuantumBeepLooks like the vector parameters are switched around in the spin parse.
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13:16.10Grumblerhmmm, tim is getting exotic with his names
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13:25.48jpa_hi Brad2901
13:25.58Brad2901hey jpa_
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13:27.19Grumblerhttp://www.surplusshed.com/pages/category/solar_1.html
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13:35.38tuponeUnpacking replacement clamav-freshclam ...
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14:49.03QuantumBeepHmmm. Are server textures working in 2.0.0?
14:49.35Grumbleryou mean texture downloads?
14:49.52QuantumBeepYes
14:50.30Grumblernot in 2.0.0, i believe....2.0.2, ie cvs head
14:50.56QuantumBeepWill a 2.0.0 client work with it?
14:51.11QuantumBeepI've got the cvs bzfs
14:51.29Grumbleri think you need the 2.0.2 client as well...
14:51.37QuantumBeepOh shoot. Okay. Thanks
14:51.55Grumblerits not certain, but i am pretty sure from lurking in on those conversations
15:05.16Grumblerhttp://www.usatoday.com/news/gallery/2005/02-23-calif-storms/flash.htm
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15:29.02Grumblerthis dog foot warmer thing is worth it
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15:29.59TheRedBarongrumbler: for the dog or?
15:30.10Grumblerfor my feet
15:30.33TheRedBaronyou have dog feet? :)
15:31.03[dmp]Grumbler is a dog :)
15:31.09Grumblerwell, i have gotten a few comments along those lines.......
15:32.11MotherHubbardhmm, look my cupboard is bare...
15:32.17Grumblermy web cam shot   http://www.galkire.net/photos/Picture%20008.html
15:33.04MotherHubbardmy what big eyes you have grumbler...
15:33.36Grumblerme playing after work    http://www.galkire.net/photos/DSCN0056.html
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15:37.02brlcadGrumbler: highly recommend the yuppy puppy treat machine :)
15:37.25brlcadI got that for my dog this past christmas and it's been great
15:37.29brlcadhttp://shop.store.yahoo.com/willie/yuppuptreatm.html
15:37.43Redsoxfan90lol :)
15:38.24Grumblerbrlcad<  how big is your dog now?
15:38.54brlcadhe's a small fella about 20 pounds
15:39.10brlcad12 years
15:39.13Grumblermust have some great self control
15:39.28Grumbler12 years, wow
15:40.08brlcadhe loves attention and food .. so he learned how slapping that thing bar caused a treat pretty quick :)
15:41.00brlcadhttp://bzflag.bz./tmp/barney_small.jpg
15:41.00Grumblerbrlcad<  what no pics?
15:41.07brlcadheh
15:41.26Grumblerwow, dog with attitude
15:41.37brlcadhuge underbite
15:41.51brlcadhe's a big sweetheart though
15:42.12Grumblerdont lose him in the snow ;)
15:42.14brlcadthat was last summer, haven't cut his hair since so he's more of a mop right now
15:42.53Grumblerwell, for that size dog looks like he will go 18 years easy
15:43.05brlcadhopefully
15:43.13Grumblerthink positive
15:44.14Grumblerbetty?
15:44.20brlcaddaisy :)
15:44.41Grumblerruins that whole fred flintstone theme.
15:44.43brlcadmaybe if she'd had a daughter
15:45.02Grumblerlitter of one
15:45.08brlcadbarney's brother's name was fred
15:45.18Grumblergot a fred here.
15:45.25brlcadhe was bigger, darker, more grumpy
15:46.26Grumbleryou thinking of getting another...
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15:53.26Grumblerdang door bell, lost my foot warmer
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15:54.46Legolas_whats up?
15:55.14Legolas_ibot, hello is <reply> how is it going?
15:55.16ibot...but hello is already something else...
15:55.24Legolas_ibot, hello
15:55.25ibotHowdy Bub
15:55.34Legolas_ibot, forget hello
15:55.44Redsoxfan90legolas!
15:55.50Legolas_hey redsox
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15:55.55Redsoxfan90go in my chat
15:56.02Legolas_what is that one called?
15:56.04Redsoxfan90#tankkillers
15:56.07Legolas_ok
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16:15.03QuantumBeepIs there any way to create a material that gives off "light" the way a bullet does?
16:21.36orangeI guess you're not talking about a laser world weapon :-)
16:25.22QuantumBeepNot this time. That comes later :)
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16:36.05*** join/#bzflag linuxaddict1980 (~linuxaddi@194.washington-28rh16rt.dc.dial-access.att.net)
16:36.08linuxaddict1980hello
16:36.08bzbotHey linuxaddict1980
16:36.15linuxaddict1980wow
16:36.22linuxaddict1980there are ***10*** ops here
16:36.29linuxaddict1980this is a little overdone
16:36.31linuxaddict1980:)
16:36.37jpa_?:)
16:36.54linuxaddict1980anyway, I have a quick question
16:37.01linuxaddict1980I have a HTTP proxy
16:37.08linuxaddict1980how can bzflag connect thru that
16:37.09linuxaddict1980?
16:37.14jpa_it can not
16:37.18linuxaddict1980you sure?
16:37.26linuxaddict1980or are you just saying that
16:37.28jpa_yes
16:37.36linuxaddict1980How about 2.0?
16:37.38TheRedBaronlinxaddict1980: you don't know what it takes to control the people here ;)
16:37.43jpa_there was a bzfrelay project once
16:37.47linuxaddict1980TheRedBaron, :)
16:37.56jpa_but i do not think even that exist with version 2.0 anymore
16:38.00linuxaddict1980it does
16:38.04linuxaddict1980I am trying to use it
16:38.15jpa_but, bzflag uses totally different ports that http-proxies
16:38.34linuxaddict1980oh I think I know what to do....
16:38.39jpa_(and different protocol, too)
16:38.49linuxaddict1980a pass-through
16:38.59linuxaddict1980its going to be hard-coded into the proxy
16:39.00linuxaddict1980:)
16:39.05orangedon't forget it's UDP not TCP
16:39.07orangeor both
16:39.08orangethat is
16:39.15linuxaddict1980orange, almost forgot :)
16:39.22jpa_orange: bzflag can run tcp only, if necessary
16:39.30linuxaddict1980UDP is faster
16:39.32orangeyeah, but don't most servers set requireudp
16:39.37linuxaddict1980I use a modem >:o
16:39.41jpa_linuxaddict1980: what proxy are you using? and you probably do not have access to it?
16:39.50jpa_oh
16:39.54JeffM2501linuxaddict1980, does your proxy just do port 80?
16:39.55TheRedBaronjpa_, i've never seen a bzserver run without udp
16:39.56linuxaddict1980it's my own home proxy
16:39.57JeffM2501or all HTTP?
16:40.00jpa_so why do you need proxy
16:40.05linuxaddict1980its a long story
16:40.10jpa_TheRedBaron: but not all have requireudp
16:40.16jpa_TheRedBaron: (i do not, mind you :)
16:40.28JeffM2501most people get around the proxy for list server by using port 81 for the list server
16:40.36TheRedBaronjpa_: then i sit corrected.  I haven't seen your server :)
16:40.44linuxaddict1980;)
16:40.56JeffM2501the game itself is unplayable thru an HTTP proxy, you must have a viable TCP and UDP connection to the game server on the game server ports
16:40.57jpa_TheRedBaron: and how do you notice that a server does not require udp?
16:41.19TheRedBaronjpa_: turn it off and see if you get kicked...
16:41.24linuxaddict1980actually I have a proxy which can do many types of passthrus
16:41.32jpa_TheRedBaron: so,  you do that for every server? :D
16:41.35JeffM2501then pass those ports thru
16:41.39linuxaddict1980yeah
16:41.40linuxaddict1980:)
16:41.44JeffM2501but the only thing that is HTTP is the list server
16:41.50JeffM2501bzflag dosn't support proxy
16:42.03linuxaddict1980I have to reprogram the pass through every time I connect to a different server
16:42.04JeffM2501you can use port 81 for the list server to bypass it and let it thru
16:42.09TheRedBaronjpa_: no but...
16:42.18orangeI thought it was fairly standard these days to require udp too... I will admit I don't check, but the docs I read when I set up my server implied that it should generally be one
16:42.22JeffM2501linuxaddict1980, well your system is locked down, so yes.
16:42.23orangeon*
16:42.23jpa_linuxaddict1980: why can't you allow all traffic outwards?
16:42.38TheRedBaronmy point was is that the clean install used to default for udp being off... and that caused problems with lag.
16:42.43linuxaddict1980my linux box can only access the internet thru a windows box
16:42.45linuxaddict1980:(
16:42.59JeffM2501TheRedBaron, UDP is allways used now, has been for a VERY long time.
16:43.00orangecool that you don't need it on jpa_ ... does the logging show who uses tcp only?
16:43.10JeffM2501linuxaddict1980, that is not the best system for playing games.
16:43.15linuxaddict1980lol
16:43.21jpa_orange: no, it does not i think
16:43.22TheRedBaronJeffM2501: yes, that's what i was telling jpa_
16:43.40jpa_TheRedBaron: no you were not :)
16:43.51linuxaddict1980where can I get a server list
16:43.52jpa_TheRedBaron: you were telling that _all_ servers have requireudp
16:43.58jpa_TheRedBaron: and _that_ is not default
16:43.58linuxaddict1980from the home site?
16:44.04orangethat's kinda what JeffM2501 just said too
16:44.06jpa_linuxaddict1980: my.bzflag.org
16:44.15linuxaddict1980ah
16:44.17linuxaddict1980thanks
16:44.53TheRedBaronjpa_, i would be more correct to say,  bzflag lags with udp turned off...
16:45.07TheRedBarontherefore its need/requirement for udp to be on.
16:45.27linuxaddict1980brb -- need to setup my little annoying proxy
16:45.38jpa_TheRedBaron: that is true
16:46.20TheRedBaronjpa_: see! i told you I sat corrected :)
16:47.02linuxaddict1980ok I am going to try this
16:47.02jpa_~TheRedBaron++
16:47.03linuxaddict1980:)
16:47.20TheRedBaron~jpa_++
16:47.23*** part/#bzflag linuxaddict1980 (~linuxaddi@194.washington-28rh16rt.dc.dial-access.att.net)
16:47.49JeffM2501linuxaddict1980, you can have the list server use port 81
16:47.54JeffM2501that may work around your poxy
16:48.15JeffM2501run bzflag with -list http://my.bzflag.org:81/db/
16:48.41*** join/#bzflag linuxaddict1980 (~linuxaddi@194.washington-28rh16rt.dc.dial-access.att.net)
16:48.44linuxaddict1980argh
16:48.46linuxaddict1980it failed
16:48.47linuxaddict1980:(
16:49.08JeffM2501then your locked down too tight
16:49.13orangethree of the top ten servers right now don't require udp
16:49.16orangethat's interestintg
16:49.31JeffM2501orange, the require UDP option in bzflag dosn't realy do anything anymore IIRC
16:49.40JeffM2501it's just a leftover flag
16:49.45JeffM2501in the list server
16:49.49linuxaddict1980nah its something to do with my forwarding
16:50.06JeffM2501yeah your problem is your proxy
16:50.14linuxaddict1980anybody know how to setup bzrelay?
16:50.20orangewell, let me rephrase... I joined all top 10 servers with udp off, and 7 of them kicked me off as soon as I fired a shot, three did not
16:50.20JeffM2501it dosn't work
16:50.23JeffM2501hasn't since 1.7
16:50.25JeffM2501was never updated
16:50.28JeffM2501so don't bother
16:50.36linuxaddict1980>:O
16:50.55JeffM2501it's a game, games arn't made to be played behind locked down systems
16:51.15JeffM2501bzflag was made as a lan game, and net support was added later, it's core networking system dosn't know how to support proxys and stuff.
16:51.36JeffM2501your going to have to make your system conform to it, it won't conform to you.
16:51.44JeffM2501if you wish to play that is.
16:52.35*** part/#bzflag linuxaddict1980 (~linuxaddi@194.washington-28rh16rt.dc.dial-access.att.net)
16:52.48JeffM2501and on dialup too, how sad
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16:53.18Silver1probably banned somewhere?
16:54.23Noodle-senseiCHEESECAKE!!!
16:54.50Thumper_so well enabling requireudp help with perceived lag problems?
16:55.36Thumper_s/well/will/
16:55.54TheRedBaronnoodle-sensie: I brought my fireproof undies today!
16:56.26Noodle-senseiTheRedBaron: hehehe
16:56.38TheRedBaronThumper_: by default it is enabled on all servers... so unless the client user disables it...
16:56.45Noodle-senseii brought my flamethrower :-)
16:57.07TheRedBaronoh crap,  I forgot mine..
16:57.13orangethere is *something* different between, say, the olympic server and secretplace
16:57.21orangeolympic let me play with udp off, secretplace did not
16:57.22Thumper_TheRedBaron: by default it is enabled in the client you mean?
16:57.46Thumper_and tuxee rabbit allows it off too
16:57.58Thumper_so maybe we should change that... if it's useful
16:57.58TheRedBaronThumper_: yes
16:59.01TheRedBaronorange: could that something be the udp turned off? ;)
16:59.46orangeTheRedBaron: JeffM2501 said it's always on now
16:59.46TheRedBaronorange: but you said you turned it off :)
16:59.54orangeclient, not server
16:59.56JeffM2501yeah we do all kinds of stuff UDP only now, even if you ask for it "off"
17:00.13JeffM2501it's not realy viable to do a TCP only game
17:00.15orangeahhh, there's the disconnect
17:00.16JeffM2501it's way to slow
17:00.39TheRedBaronorange: the server can turn of udp?
17:00.41orangeyou can still turn off udp for shots (I guess), and you can still set requireudp or not on your server
17:00.42TheRedBaron*off
17:00.51orangeTheRedBaron: no, not turn it off... require it or not
17:00.57Thumper_the server can not require UDP
17:00.58orangebut JeffM2501 is saying it doesn't matter
17:01.01TheRedBaronI was of the opinoin the server always used udp, but had the option not to require it
17:01.18TheRedBaronas in, if it required it, and client had it off, server would kick client
17:01.19orangeyou need UDP regardless... in other words, if your firewall or whatever blocks udp, you're out of luck
17:01.24TheRedBaronand vice versa
17:01.39Thumper_so why not just always -requireudp by default?
17:01.46JeffM2501I don't think that option does anything anymore
17:01.48Thumper_or does it really do nothing?
17:01.51JeffM2501why not remove it
17:01.51orangeJeffM2501: it does
17:02.07orangeit makes a difference in server behavior when client is set to not send udp
17:02.08JeffM2501we should be doing reuireUDP by default now
17:02.17Thumper_well you aren't :)
17:02.19orangebut I agree... not just default, but not changeable
17:02.19JeffM2501yeah it'll be slower then crap
17:02.23blast007I got kicked from Secretplace the other day for "not using UDP", but strangly after a reconnect it worked fine
17:02.32Thumper_unless it changed in CVS recently
17:02.39orangeblast007: I've seen that too... transient network issues, I think
17:02.49TheRedBaronblast007: yes that happens randomly, even though udp is on, I had it happen to me at ducati
17:02.55JeffM2501your UDP route may have been jacked
17:04.03TheRedBaronJeffM2501: yes i say require by default to.  Like we had UDP turned to ON by default while back.
17:04.27jpa_still talking about udp-tcp which is default? :)
17:05.22TheRedBaronjpa_, yup, hard to teach an old dog new tricks :)
17:05.35jpa_yes
17:05.52jpa_server _can_ turn udp off, but it uses it by default if available
17:05.57JeffM2501patches welcome
17:06.09JeffM2501like it realy maters
17:06.11jpa_and server _can_ require udp, but with default it does not require it
17:06.12JeffM2501the defaults work
17:06.19*** join/#bzflag cods (~admin@tuxee.net)
17:06.20jpa_JeffM2501: no-one complains :)
17:06.36jpa_JeffM2501: i see nothing wrong with the current behaviour
17:07.02TheRedBaronyea, if it aint broke, don't fix it :P
17:07.22jpa_(not the way i do things :)
17:07.30jpa_if you have time, fix it
17:08.06jpa_if you are tired of fixing bugs, just add some features :)
17:08.25JeffM2501fix what? it's not broke
17:08.45jpa_something is always broken
17:08.57jpa_or if it isn't, break it :)
17:09.20TheRedBaronoh thats good...
17:11.08TheRedBaronjpa_, you break, you buy :)
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17:15.18*** part/#bzflag |zongo| (~zongo@131.152.41.89)
17:21.06JeffM2501jpa_, people don't pay you to code fro them do you?
17:26.51*** part/#bzflag bookworm (~45f06abf@rw08.de)
17:29.36*** part/#bzflag tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-137-210.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)
17:33.19jpa_JeffM2501: umm.. they do
17:33.54jpa_sometimes :)
17:33.54jpa_umm
17:33.54jpa_"do you?" ??
17:34.10JeffM2501no I don't pay you :)
17:34.27JeffM2501and yes I get paid to write things
17:34.29JeffM2501all the time
17:34.33JeffM2501like right now :)
17:34.36jpa_i mean
17:34.49jpa_why is there "do you?" after your sentence
17:35.08JeffM2501ohh sould have been do they?
17:35.13Thumper_on the playerlist does the 'udp+' indicate that client has udp enabled?
17:35.30JeffM2501the englich she, eludes me
17:35.39jpa_Thumper_: what else could it mean? :P
17:36.11Thumper_jpa_: :E answer my own question by connecting w/o udp - thx :)
17:36.17Thumper_answered*
17:38.36JeffM2501are there realy systems that don't have UDP these days?
17:38.56JeffM2501I'm making OpenCombat not even have a choice for it, it's UDP or nothing
17:39.59JeffM2501there is a probablilty that all game data will be sent via UDP
17:40.11JeffM2501with just TCP used for chat, and login and stuff
17:40.31Thumper_one client on tuxee rabbit right now (not observer) does not have udp enabled
17:41.00*** join/#bzflag ibot (ibot@apt.bot.TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)
17:41.00*** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/bb/ || http://my.BZFlag.org/ || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || Shellshock is revived http://shellshock.bzflag.bz || Simple Map Help - http://bzflag.org/wiki/MapMaking || BZFlag 2.0.0 is Released! - Go to http://sf.net/projects/bzflag http://bzflag.org/wiki/Download |
17:41.00*** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ
17:41.10Thumper_um low 40 +/- 6
17:41.17Brad2901.away
17:41.20JeffM2501wonder if it's inentional
17:41.20Brad2901oops
17:41.21Thumper_he's the lowest actually
17:41.45TheRedBaronwell it could be his geographical location.
17:41.55Thumper_there is also 49 62 76 182 275
17:42.26JeffM2501be interested to know why people turn UDP off
17:42.41*** join/#bzflag Redsoxfan90 (Redsoxfan9@h000c6e3d2914.ne.client2.attbi.com)
17:42.45JeffM2501is it mostly due to firewall/proxy restrictions?
17:43.11JeffM2501I know like all the modern comercial games use UDP
17:43.17JeffM2501can those people not play them?
17:44.19TheRedBarongood question, perhaps thats why they play bz?
17:44.48Thumper_he's not responding to my questions...
17:45.12TheRedBaroncoincedence?
17:46.18orangethis is where admin pause would come in handy :-)
17:46.32TheRedBaronmccgeorge
17:46.46TheRedBaronsorry, wrong window...
17:47.17RedBaron2rofl!!
17:47.23Thumper_<PROTECTED>
17:48.43JeffM2501so it's a lockdown thing
17:50.38*** join/#bzflag zongo_ (~zongo@80-218-158-197.dclient.hispeed.ch)
17:51.00TheRedBaron!dict blob
17:51.02guuTheRedBaron: web1913, jargon, foldoc, vera, and wn responded: vera: BLOB Binary Large OBject; foldoc: BLOB 1. {binary large object}. 2. <architecture> {blitter object}. [{Jargon File}]; wn: blob n : an indistinct shapeless form v : make a spot or mark onto; "The wine spotted the tablecloth" [syn: {spot}, {fleck}, {blot}] [also: {blobbing}, {blobbed}]; web1913: Blob \Blob\ (bl[o^]b), n. (2 more messages)
17:51.16*** join/#bzflag Redsoxfan90 (Redsoxfan9@h000c6e3d2914.ne.client2.attbi.com)
17:51.25*** join/#bzflag zongo_ (~zongo@80-218-158-197.dclient.hispeed.ch)
17:53.54Thumper_jpa_: massive tank suicides/fireworks on olympics right now
17:55.28jpa_Thumper_: do not let them jump!
17:55.35jpa_every life is worth living
17:56.01Thumper_jpa_: absolutely
17:59.34cods:)
18:00.11Thumper_hi cods :)
18:01.02codshi
18:01.02bzbotHey cods
18:11.45*** join/#bzflag Sbgodin (~Chris@sbgodin.dyndns.org)
18:11.48Sbgodinhi!
18:12.02blast007hello  :)
18:12.13SbgodinI've a network problem:
18:12.32SbgodinSome PC cannot connect to my server "error login to server" as other can.
18:12.48Sbgodinping works from my server to his pc and the DNS is ok. Any suggestions ?
18:13.26blast007is BZFlag blocked by a software firewall?
18:13.38SbgodinHe can play on other server.
18:13.43blast007ah
18:13.54SbgodinThe ping to his pc worked.
18:14.04SbgodinHe owns a m$win
18:14.15blast007oh, your server..so this is on your local network?
18:14.40Sbgodinin fact, I use one in Canada. Most people can connect on it.
18:14.47SbgodinMy personnal server can be reached by my friend
18:14.55SbgodinTwo servers with the same config
18:16.05blast007so what server can't your friend connect to? a local one? or a remote one?
18:16.49Sbgodincannot connect to "bzflag.spaggiari.org" can connect to "sbgodin.dyndns.org"
18:18.33Grumblerwhats the error message if you fail with global login
18:18.52blast007so I'm assuming that bzflag.spaggiari.org is hosted somewhere else?
18:20.03Sbgodinyes, in Canada. Mine is in France.
18:20.26SilverFoxso, something is wrong with sbgodin.dyndns.org [213.41.156.135] then?
18:20.32SbgodinMy friend does not reach the global login. He has "error connecting to the server"
18:20.36SilverFoxerr... bzflag.spaggiari.org that is.
18:20.51*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)
18:20.51SbgodinEverythings is good with sbgodin.dyndns.org. Wrong with bzflag.spaggiari.org
18:20.51*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ
18:20.57SbgodinBoth server has last cvs
18:21.28SilverFoxcan anyone connect to it?
18:21.46SbgodinMany people. Other cannot. Didn't find why.
18:21.46SilverFoxCheck the logs/stdout to see the server is running ok?
18:22.04SbgodinNothing in the logs. Even with -v -v -v
18:22.12SilverFoxsome can, some can't.  probably a network issue then.
18:22.34SilverFoxthe ones that can't don't have a network path to the server (ie, banned, blocked by firewall, no route, etc)
18:22.38SbgodinYes. But don't know where. For my friend, the ping and traceroute worked.
18:22.59SbgodinI ping his pc from the server. His pc answered in 150ms.
18:23.02blast007~nslookup sbgodin.dyndns.org
18:23.06blast007~nslookup bzflag.spaggiari.org
18:23.06SilverFoxthen look at the server.  Are there any bans in place?  Does it run any firewall software?
18:23.38SbgodinIt runs a netfilter. No filters on IP, only on protocols and ports.
18:24.03Thumper_cods: hi
18:24.07SilverFoxbans?
18:25.27SbgodinIIRC, bans should display a message. I verified again, to be sure: no pb.
18:28.20Grumbler-v -v -v ?   => -d -d -d -d
18:28.32Sbgodinyes :-o
18:28.38Grumblerjust making sure
18:29.20Grumblerdo you have the same groups set up on both servers
18:31.05*** join/#bzflag Tupone (Tupone@host-84-222-137-210.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)
18:32.39Sbgodinyes.
18:33.03SilverFoxwhat do groups matter if you can't connect?
18:34.09SbgodinI wonder, too.
18:34.23Sbgodin"everybody" can "spawn" of course
18:35.05SbgodinMy friend has kick and shortban privs. But it should not...
18:36.32*** join/#bzflag Tartaros (~icechat5@r2b100.chello.upc.cz)
18:38.29SilverFoxnetwork.  Check simple things like making sure he's using the right port?
18:39.05*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (revol@AToulouse-106-1-5-60.w80-15.abo.wanadoo.fr)
18:40.29*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.user)
18:42.51SbgodinHe choosed the server from the server list. The port used is the default port, 5154.
18:42.57Grumblertrying to clear up the problem in my mind is all......   "can not connect" has been stated many different times, and it covers several problems.  "error login to server", is not the message if you cant reach a server
18:43.44Grumbler"server not found" is the message if you cant reach a server.  so, he is reaching the server, but then has another problem.
18:44.26Grumblerso, pings, etc......are not covering the problem this dude is having
18:44.29SbgodinI should have write down the exact message. It's a message like "error connection to server"
18:45.02SbgodinI suspect it appears from m$win clients.
18:45.06Grumbleryeah, the exact error message can save time
18:45.25SbgodinMore, some m$win server does not allow connection if there are too much flags.
18:45.30Grumbleri am running wins, and "server not found" is the message if the server does not exist/cant be reached
18:45.47SbgodinCan you reach bzflag.spaggiari.org ?
18:46.51SbgodinHe can.
18:47.24SbgodinAnd the same m$win did not allow global login...
18:47.49Grumblerfyi, i did not use a global login in name....have the dude try it without a global login name
18:47.57SilverFoxoh, I thought he said can not connect.
18:48.04Sbgodinyes. He tried.
18:48.21SbgodinAt that time, He was not playing with his regular name§.
18:50.19Grumblerafter this point, i am not much help, sry......is he playing with UDP on(just thinking from the discussion previously today)
18:54.59SbgodinThe UDP is required by the server. But the server should cut down only at the first shot, I tried it.
19:01.14SbgodinAnother pb : some m$win does not allow global login even if the server is in the list.
19:03.59*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@198.150.76.4)
19:06.01GrumblerSbgodin<  win clients, or win servers....little confused by the last statement
19:09.53SbgodinSorry. It's another pb :-/
19:10.21SbgodinOne of my another friends has a m$win and use bzfs on it
19:10.30SbgodinWhen you log on, you don't have the "+3
19:10.41JeffM2501is your S key broken?
19:10.50SbgodinI'm eating...
19:11.04JeffM2501usualy the local auth problems are due to cachin HTTP proxys upstream, not the OS
19:11.11SbgodinThe server is 3shots.bz.mydns.jp:5159
19:11.16JeffM2501using port 81 for the list server often takes care of it.
19:11.26SbgodinI've global login everywhere, except on his server
19:11.26JeffM2501global auth not local auth sorry
19:11.36JeffM2501he's probalby not geting tokens
19:11.37SbgodinTry it.
19:11.42JeffM2501I know for a fact it works fine on windows
19:11.48JeffM2501I belive you
19:11.58JeffM2501it's probalby just a small config change he needs to make
19:12.01SbgodinIt may be the M$ firewall buit-in ?
19:12.06JeffM2501no
19:12.16JeffM2501if it was that he wouldn't list ether
19:12.26JeffM2501it's probably a caching proxy somewhere upstream
19:12.32SbgodinTrue.
19:12.34JeffM2501we've seen the problem a lit
19:12.36JeffM2501lot
19:12.41JeffM2501on multiple OSs
19:12.50SbgodinHe's going to install a Linux. I'll have another test.
19:12.55JeffM2501changing the port bypasses a lot of trasnperant proxys
19:13.10JeffM2501changing the port is a lot faster and simplier
19:13.12SbgodinSo he would use -serverlist with another port ?
19:13.16JeffM2501yeah
19:13.27JeffM2501http://my.bzflag.org:81/db/
19:13.27SbgodinI say it to him right now!
19:13.56Sbgodinlol. I cannot connect on his server :-o
19:14.15JeffM2501he's probalby installing a linux
19:14.28SilverFoxgroups?  You can tell the list server what groups are...  allowed?
19:14.41JeffM2501bzbb handles the groups
19:14.44Sbgodinto spawn. Everyone can spawn.
19:14.46JeffM2501the list server just returns them
19:15.04JeffM2501then your local groups config tells your server what those group names mean and can do
19:15.17JeffM2501you should have some groups, we made them for you right?
19:15.33SbgodinCan you try 3shots.bz.mydns.jp:5159 ? To connect and play some seconds.
19:15.44JeffM2501I can't play anything I'm at work
19:16.05SbgodinLol :-) It's 8PM at Metz/France.
19:17.28JeffM2501well not being in france, that helps me not :)
19:18.04SbgodinWell, I'll advise my friend for the alternate port and try it on my own server. Thanks :-)
19:19.15JeffM2501sure
19:19.26JeffM2501I'm actualy thinking we should default it to 81
19:19.29JeffM2501dosn't hurt anything
19:19.36JeffM2501and would probalby work for more people
19:20.21Chestalbut have 80, too. 81 is blocked for me
19:20.39JeffM2501yeah 80 allways of course
19:20.53JeffM2501maybe try 81 first then try 80
19:21.04JeffM2501automagicly
19:21.38Chestalmight be hard to do. In my case, 81 will only fail after a timeout
19:21.38JeffM2501problem with 80 on the proxys is that it does apear to the app to work, it just gets old cached data.
19:21.51JeffM2501maybe just beter documentations then
19:22.02Chestalboth networks setups are broken
19:22.14Chestalthe port 80 transparent proxies as well as the silent filtering of port 81 here
19:23.05JeffM2501maybe start on 80, get a URL from the list server, and verify it's time is close to the system time, and try to figure out if your proxied
19:23.16JeffM2501or just ship a server hosting FAQ in the manpage
19:23.29JeffM2501saying "if your global auth don't work, try 81"
19:24.08Chestalhmm, maybe it coud figure it out autmatically on first start
19:24.28Chestalthen an additional delay would be acceptable
19:24.39JeffM2501yeah just a one shot test
19:24.41JeffM2501not every time
19:24.44JeffM2501that'd be silly
19:25.28JeffM2501maybe just make a php page that returns the time, check it twice and verify that it returns difrent times on each hit
19:25.45JeffM2501then you know if your geting "live" data
19:25.53JeffM2501and can pick a port acordingly for the session
19:27.10*** join/#bzflag Ares (~user@113.175.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com)
19:27.37Areshi guys
19:32.08*** join/#bzflag sgk284 (~stevek@AC8F04FB.ipt.aol.com)
19:32.22sgk284ping Nidhoggr
19:33.06*** join/#bzflag Redsoxfan90 (Redsoxfan9@h000c6e3d2914.ne.client2.attbi.com)
19:34.56TimRikerare there header bits we could add to the central list to fix some of those proxies?
19:35.33Nidhoggrsgk284: pong
19:37.10TimRikerlooks like we don't add and of Cache-Control, Expires, Pragma, or Connection at present and we likely should.
19:37.48*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.145)
19:41.03sgk284~nidhoggr++
19:45.55Nidhoggr:)
19:47.38GrumblerTimRiker<  that sounds like a better solution then trying to create something automagic
19:50.48SilverFoxheh... makes me think of some RPG character who just magically waves his hands and crazy things start happening.
19:52.18*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@198.150.76.4)
19:55.53TimRikerSome call him "Tim"!
19:56.44*** join/#bzflag DarthValou (~none@lsn-boi-catv-c126-p001.vtx.ch)
19:58.12CIA-5BZFlag: 03timriker * 10db/bzfls.php: no-cache, and convert some quotes while I'm in there
19:59.11TimRikerk. sends Cache-Control: no-cache  and  Pragma: no-cache  now which should fix most, if not all, proxies.
19:59.13*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.151)
20:04.41*** join/#bzflag SportyGal (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)
20:07.50Redsoxfan90time riker
20:08.19*** join/#bzflag meno2ume (~meno@pcp08396790pcs.cnclrk01.pa.comcast.net)
20:09.15*** join/#bzflag menotume (~meno@pcp08396790pcs.cnclrk01.pa.comcast.net)
20:20.53SilverFoxwhat's a good value for -tkkr on a ffa server?
20:22.04jpa_how many shots?
20:22.11SilverFox3
20:22.24SilverFoxtk's on overlord are getting out of hand.
20:22.38jpa_20% i would say
20:22.44SilverFoxfair enough, thanks!
20:23.13jpa_:)
20:25.30Noodlemanwikipedia is _sloooow_ today
20:25.43jpa_it was slow yesterday too
20:26.21*** join/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
20:26.43*** part/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
20:32.01*** join/#bzflag wizart (~wizart@dsl-084-058-004-058.arcor-ip.net)
20:39.05*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.151)
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20:53.14*** join/#bzflag Goliath_ (~Goliath_@adsl-68-127-112-141.dsl.frsn02.pacbell.net)
20:53.20Goliath_hi all
20:53.31ruskielo
20:53.51Goliath_bzbot:servers on bzflag
20:54.07Goliath_i:bot
20:54.14Goliath_ibot:
20:54.18*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.145)
20:54.19jpa_~bzflist
20:56.00Goliath_~bzflag starting servers on mac osx
20:56.10*** part/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.145)
20:56.59Goliath_`time
20:57.06Goliath_~time
20:57.07ibotwell, time is 1 dimensional, or everlasting
20:57.08GrumblerGoliath_<  what are you trying to do?
20:57.25Goliath_~server
20:57.45Goliath_oh well
20:57.50Brad2901?
20:58.01Grumbleragain, what are you trying to do?
20:58.21jpa_hi Brad2901
20:58.21Goliath_have any of you started a server on mac osx
20:58.26Brad2901hi
20:58.27bzbotHi Brad2901
20:58.32Goliath_hey brad!
20:58.34Brad2901hi
20:58.34bzbotsup Brad2901
20:58.37Brad2901:)
20:58.49jpa_who is this bzbot?
20:58.54Goliath_have any of you started a server on mac osx
20:58.58Redsoxfan90lol!
20:59.01jpa_and why does it like Brad2901
20:59.17jpa_~goliath_--
20:59.18Redsoxfan90its his admin and blast007 master
20:59.27*** part/#bzflag DarthValou (~none@lsn-boi-catv-c126-p001.vtx.ch)
20:59.28GrumblerGoliath_<  not many have, but there are a couple around
20:59.35Goliath_Redsox im on {R}an{T}oo {F}ar team too
20:59.37Grumblerwhat issues are you having
20:59.44Brad2901bzbot is my friend :)
21:00.06Grumblereverybody should have at least one
21:00.25Goliath_nbrad go to Goliath.servegame.org
21:00.33Brad2901later goliath
21:00.38Goliath_ok
21:00.45Goliath_Redsox im on {R}an{T}oo {F}ar team too
21:01.01Redsoxfan90kool
21:01.10SilverFoxany of you folks read this: http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3010 ?
21:03.18*** join/#bzflag SC (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)
21:03.58Grumbleryes, trepan/cods/DTR/purple_cow/scanline/jeff are probably good sources...heck even tim riker may know.....otherwise go to some of the web sources trepan has posted elsewhere
21:04.24Grumbler...and i suppose jpa_ may know, but he is evil
21:04.24jpa_read the Source :P
21:04.37jpa_i do not know
21:04.54jpa_i could look it up in the source and refuse to tell it to be evil, anyway :)
21:04.55Grumblerthen i am wrong again, at least i am consistent
21:07.17*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.151)
21:07.45*** join/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
21:09.07SilverFoxOK, I'll just keep moving through the list.  ;)
21:09.24javaJake~seen redsoxfan90
21:09.29ibotredsoxfan90 is currently on #botpark (1m 48s) #bzflag (1m 48s).  Has said a total of 5 messages.  Is idling for 11s
21:09.30bzbotredsoxfan90 is currently on #BotPark #tankkillers #bzflag #brad2901, has been idle for 6secs, and has been online for 1hr 36mins 15secs
21:09.30javaJakenope, no bzbot
21:09.39javaJakeAHA!
21:09.49jpa_Brad2901: change that command charachter :D
21:09.54Brad2901oops
21:10.00Brad2901bzbot, part #bzflag
21:10.00*** part/#bzflag bzbot (Brad2901@ACC87473.ipt.aol.com)
21:10.16*** part/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
21:11.40*** join/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
21:11.42*** part/#bzflag Goliath_ (~Goliath_@adsl-68-127-112-141.dsl.frsn02.pacbell.net)
21:11.45*** part/#bzflag javaJake (Lynne@c-24-60-92-231.ne.client2.attbi.com)
21:12.13Nidhoggrhrm. bzadmin isn't working properly on my rh7.2 system.
21:12.31Nidhoggrit connects, but nothing is displayed other than the bottom prompt.
21:12.50menotumehmmm, ncurses ?
21:12.56NidhoggrI have ncurses.
21:13.09menotumemaybe need a new one, dunno
21:13.14Grumbleryou try an old version to see if its just a version issue
21:13.33menotumeyes, what he said
21:13.36Nidhoggr/usr/lib/libncurses.so.5
21:13.36menotume:)
21:14.06Nidhoggrit's probably old.
21:14.13menotumei have 5.3 here
21:14.46menotumebut, it really _should_ work
21:14.51menotumewhat kind of terminal ?
21:15.12menotumenative, or xterm, or ... ?
21:15.34jpa_try bzadmin -ui stdboth
21:15.40Nidhoggrcompiling 5.4
21:15.48Nidhoggrwhat does that do, jpa_?
21:16.01jpa_uses bare stdin/stdout
21:16.04menotumeahh, yes bypasses curses
21:16.04jpa_without ncurses
21:16.08Nidhoggrmenotume: should be native.  using vt100 from my phone.
21:16.14menotumeahh
21:16.15Nidhoggrand from an xterm both.
21:16.34Nidhoggrcan't do that.  it's too much of a pain on my phone without curses.
21:16.54menotumeit works from xterm ?
21:17.03Nidhoggrnope
21:17.06Nidhoggrneither.
21:17.09menotume80x25 ?
21:17.20jpa_but does stdboth work?
21:17.20Nidhoggr80x47 on xterm
21:17.24menotumejust try rezing the xterm window, see what it does
21:17.29jpa_so it is only ncurses problem?
21:17.37menotumehmm
21:17.48menotume*resizing*
21:18.34Nidhoggrmany control-Ls causes the screen to redraw correctly 1 line at a time.
21:18.39Nidhoggrwith xterm
21:19.05Nidhoggrresizing does nothing.
21:19.28menotumehmmm
21:19.28Nidhoggrwill recompile with new curses when it finishes.
21:19.49NidhoggrI got a few warnings when compiling bzadmin/bzfs.
21:19.53*** join/#bzflag kyelewis` (~kyelewis@kyelewis.user)
21:19.59Nidhoggrif they are still there, I'll mark them down.
21:21.19menotumehmm, is it only ctrl-L that makes it 'work', or other key combos too ?
21:21.59menotumesounds like it's checking stdin, and expecting a linefeed
21:22.36*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~JeffM@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)
21:22.36*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ
21:23.19Nidhoggrrecompiling now.
21:25.50menotumehmmm, do you have any NCURSE* env vars set ?
21:25.56menotumeokies - see if that works
21:26.02Nidhoggrnope.
21:26.05Nidhoggrno env vars
21:26.08menotumehmm
21:26.23menotumewell, simple then - keep hitting Ctrl-L
21:26.26NidhoggrStateDatabase.cxx
21:26.26NidhoggrStateDatabase.cxx: In method `float StateDatabase::evaluate
21:26.26Nidhoggr(vector<StateDatabase::ExpressionToken,
21:26.26Nidhoggrallocator<StateDatabase::ExpressionToken> >) const':
21:26.26NidhoggrStateDatabase.cxx:266: warning: control reaches end of non-void
21:26.29Nidhoggrfunction
21:26.35Nidhoggrone of the warnings.
21:28.29*** join/#bzflag Goliath_ (~Goliath_@adsl-68-127-112-141.dsl.frsn02.pacbell.net)
21:29.40*** join/#bzflag creeperz (creeperz@host-40-145-230-24.midco.net)
21:29.40*** join/#bzflag Goliath_ (~Goliath_@adsl-68-127-112-141.dsl.frsn02.pacbell.net)
21:31.12Nidhoggripod shuffle?
21:31.43JeffM2501yup
21:31.48*** part/#bzflag Goliath_ (~Goliath_@adsl-68-127-112-141.dsl.frsn02.pacbell.net)
21:32.00JeffM2501and an iMic so I can get audio into the mini
21:32.16jpa_hi Sportyistheresomereasonwhyyoucouldn'tjustbesportchick_Gal
21:33.40Brad2901anybody know how to correctly spell 'unlobatomy'?
21:34.03orangeI think lobotomy is, well, like that.
21:34.09orangebut I've never heard of unlobotomy
21:34.17sgk284~spell unlobatomy
21:34.22jpa_Brad2901: um.. is that like the opposite operation of lobotomy (removing parts of brains)
21:34.56JeffM2501how is that even poisible?
21:34.56Brad2901It's a bot command, I used it the other day but can't spell it correctly to do it again
21:35.08jpa_unlobotomy is probably putting the parts back :)
21:35.25jpa_JeffM2501: it is easy.. open the scull and take some stuff out
21:35.43jpa_JeffM2501: 90% of people die, but some might just become retarded
21:35.49jpa_:)
21:40.44TimRikerjpa_: I think he meant how is an unlobotomy possible. ;-)
21:41.28Redsoxfan90hey tim
21:41.40jpa_well
21:42.18jpa_it is like putting the stuff back :P
21:42.18jpa_oh
21:42.18jpa_jpa_ said it already
21:42.18jpa_uh.. i mean i said it already
21:45.14menotumejpa_: Are you looking into having it done (UNlobotomy) ?
21:45.59jpa_i do not know.. i like it this way better
21:46.06jpa_my head felt so heavy before
21:46.08Nidhoggrthe window totally locked this time with recompile.
21:46.11menotume:D
21:46.13Nidhoggrafter I got it to draw.
21:46.36menotumeoh my
21:47.21menotumedunno, Nidhoggr, sry :(
21:47.34jpa_dump redhat :)
21:47.37Nidhoggrprobably going to have to get someone on the box to check it out.
21:47.43Nidhoggrjpa_ that's constructive.
21:47.44Nidhoggrthanks
21:48.16jpa_aren't I getting any karma for that?
21:49.22Nidhoggrnope.  maybe the other direction.
21:49.24Nidhoggr:)
21:49.34jpa_:)
21:49.39jpa_you are not being nice
21:49.39menotumemaybe go into the source, and stubout wgetch - it won't fix the problem, but my best guess is that it's hanging on KB input
21:49.43jpa_i like that :)
21:49.54menotumewell, he could have done --
21:50.52jpa_he does not because he likes me
21:51.09jpa_we are both evil and evil people are nice to eachother
21:52.34purple_cowhehe
21:53.07jpa_JeffM2501: trade it for an apple?
21:53.15creeperzi have a napple
21:53.21creeperzan apple*
21:53.24creeperznot a napple :-P
21:53.25JeffM2501I got a snaple
21:53.36creeperzhmm
21:53.36jpa_~dict napple
21:53.38creeperzok
21:53.46jpa_~dict snaple
21:53.51creeperzi'll trade you a napple for the snapple
21:53.58jpa_you are using strange words
21:54.05creeperztheyre not real words
21:54.12creeperzSnapple is a juice drink
21:54.13jpa_so do not use them!
21:54.21creeperznapple is just a typo :-P
21:54.21jpa_we permit only real english here
21:54.30JeffM2501snapple's are good
21:54.35creeperzthat they are
21:54.36jpa_i see that n.. i laugh at the n :P
21:55.12creeperzi laugh at the jpa_ ...
21:55.14creeperz:-P
21:55.41Grumblersnapples are evil
21:56.27jpa_grumblers are evil.. at least snapples do not crawl to you bedroom at night and eat your toes
21:56.43creeperzGrumbler: you eat toes, too?
21:56.55creeperzthats my hobby since i was like, 6
21:56.56creeperz:-)
21:57.25jpa_ok.. i need to find some really stinky pair of socks :)
21:58.44Grumbler~cluebat creeperz
21:58.46ibotACTION pulls out a ClueBat (tm) and thwaps creeperz.
21:59.30*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~JeffM@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)
21:59.30*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ
22:00.18jpa_oh no! it is already today
22:00.34SilverFoxfunny, yesterday I thought it was today.
22:01.37jpa_umm
22:01.59jpa_it is from russia afaik
22:02.14Grumblerpoland maybe
22:02.23jpa_or maybe there is finnish polka too..
22:02.30jpa_but i have never heard of it :P
22:02.37Grumbler~dict polka
22:02.52Grumbleroriginal czech dance
22:03.09jpa_oh.. now i know what polka is
22:03.10Grumblerhttp://www.centralhome.com/ballroomcountry/polka.htm
22:03.18jpa_and actually i know how to dance it, too :D
22:04.15Grumblerhttp://www.brainerd.net/~pwilson/timmerhus/klubb.html
22:04.31jpa_while.. i wonder if jenkka equals polka..
22:05.12Grumblerdepends if they are the same value
22:05.24Nidhoggrpolka is easy to dance to.
22:05.28Nidhoggrmy mom does a mean shaddish.
22:06.52Grumblerah, a shade of radish
22:07.15jpa_yes.. polka is like _-_·-_-._-_·
22:08.14Grumblerwhich makes you want to   .-.-.-.-.-.-.
22:08.15*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)
22:09.16jpa_how can one do .-.-.-.-. without any _ in it?
22:14.34menotumeugggh .... http://my.bzflag.org/league/index.php?link=bzforums&forumid=5&threadid=911&top=0
22:14.36codsgrrr.. these bzadmin process that eat all the cpu...
22:14.44codss/process/processes/
22:15.20jpa_hmm
22:15.28orchidmenotume: :-\
22:15.32menotumeya
22:15.37menotumeI'll try to talk to him
22:15.39orchidRomy is so nice too
22:15.43menotumeyes
22:15.55orchidhes on a Mac?
22:16.02menotumei guess so
22:16.10menotumebut, he' still nice IMO
22:16.12menotume:P
22:16.48jpa_mac users are always nice :)
22:17.02jpa_no-one can be evil with a computer without any sharp corners
22:17.22menotumelol jpa_
22:17.40JeffM2501brlcad, is so very small
22:17.58*** join/#bzflag Legoguy (~Lego|Desk@adsl-67-36-178-174.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net)
22:18.03jpa_or hmm.. does mac mini have sharp corners? can't remember
22:18.19brlcadJeffM2501: I'm packing on the bacon to take care of any smallness
22:18.33JeffM2501heh
22:18.39orchidwho here has ever eaten a full pack of bacon in one go?
22:18.41JeffM2501I forgot the term "it" in there
22:18.51*** join/#bzflag triclops (~caleb@c211-31-49-112.rivrw7.nsw.optusnet.com.au)
22:18.52orchidis this normal behaviour
22:19.08JeffM2501I can't say I've ever had the urge to eat that much fat
22:19.10jpa_nope, mac mini has no sharp corners either :D
22:19.20JeffM2501don't bag on the mini
22:19.38JeffM2501ton of sharpies inside that little thing
22:19.50jpa_but none on the outside
22:20.01jpa_no-one cares about the inside anyway
22:20.01JeffM2501so
22:20.12JeffM2501nether do my Dell PCs
22:20.37jpa_aargh
22:20.45jpa_i was looking for some pics of mac mini
22:20.53jpa_ended up on the apple product space
22:21.04jpa_read some details.. damn i want that box! :D
22:21.11jpa_s/space/page/
22:21.15JeffM2501the macII VX had sharpies
22:21.27JeffM2501the mini is nice
22:21.34jpa_yes..
22:21.39jpa_too nice :(
22:21.44JeffM2501got a USB soundcard
22:22.05brlcadmmm
22:22.13Nidhoggrhrm.
22:22.25JeffM2501so the mini can get sound in
22:22.27Nidhoggrusb soundcard?  sounds scary. :)
22:22.29Nidhoggrah.
22:22.33Nidhoggrthat might be cool.
22:22.33jpa_$500.. too much :S
22:22.39Nidhoggrhow many inputs?
22:22.41JeffM25011
22:22.45JeffM25011 in 1 out
22:22.47JeffM250135$
22:23.03Nidhoggrnot shabby.
22:23.12JeffM2501it's by griffin tech
22:23.23JeffM2501and I got the shuffle
22:23.39JeffM2501windows is in the process of filling it with crap right now
22:23.58Nidhoggrw00
22:24.11jpa_hmm..
22:24.36jpa_my harddrive kept this "strym..clickclick" sound :S
22:24.59jpa_but my computer hasn't crashed yet
22:25.21jpa_i dare not try to access the disk :)
22:27.17jpa_humm.. seems ok :)
22:27.41codsbackup backup backup.. :)
22:28.27jpa_nothing important here :)
22:28.32jpa_just my gentoo
22:29.04JeffM2501orchid uupdating my kernel to 2.6 made the USB work just fine :)
22:29.40supergrassJeffM2501: yay
22:30.01supergrassnow your a kernel ninja
22:30.06JeffM2501heh
22:30.15JeffM2501oh yeah, I can type apt-get....
22:30.45jpa_oh no
22:30.57jpa_that is not the right way to go :)
22:31.04JeffM2501it worked
22:31.10jpa_of course it does
22:31.20JeffM2501then what's wrong with it working?
22:31.49jpa_but real users always download their kernels from kernel.org and blame debian when it wants to install kernel-headers and stuff
22:32.01JeffM2501I'm a real user
22:32.02JeffM2501I exist
22:32.05JeffM2501I used apt
22:32.09supergrass:)
22:32.13jpa_:D
22:32.56menotume'real' users spend 50% of their time doing productive work, 50% trying to make their system work (again)
22:33.22JeffM2501wonder if I can paint the shuffle
22:33.33Nidhoggr:)
22:35.49JeffM2501and put a cold cathode in it
22:36.05jpa_ew
22:36.11jpa_that sounds bad
22:36.20JeffM2501it's a light :)
22:36.23jpa_led's consume much less electricity :)
22:36.34JeffM2501yeah probably better choice
22:42.20SilverFoxI download from kernel.org and my debian boxes do just fine.
22:42.42jpa_you are a real user, then
22:43.08SilverFoxSome how I don't feel all that accomplished.
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22:43.34*** part/#bzflag DarthValou (~none@lsn-boi-catv-c126-p001.vtx.ch)
22:46.09SilverFoxI just follow http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 pretty much.
22:46.51SilverFoxworks well for me (better than apt, and better than doing it manually.)
22:47.22SilverFoxthats a tad old, but the principle is solid.
22:53.01JeffM2501apt was realy easy
22:53.23JeffM2501apt-get install kernel-image-2.6.10-2-k7
22:53.34JeffM2501even updated lilo for me
22:55.12*** join/#bzflag LouMan (~42e39a3f@webchat.bzflag.bz)
22:55.42jpa_JeffM2501: yes.. it is just too easy :(
22:56.00jpa_feels like make menuconfig and everything is completely useless
22:56.29JeffM2501like I'd know what to build into my kernel
22:56.35JeffM2501why do you think gentoo kicks my butt :)
22:56.59jpa_but if everyone used apt-get, soon no-one would remember how to compile kernel by hand.. and then apt-get would just crash and we would run out of kernels
22:57.11jpa_that is why i do not use apt-get/genkernel, mind you
22:58.35JeffM2501what ever floats your boat
22:58.54JeffM2501I prefer to spend time using the computer, not mucking with it :)
22:59.04*** part/#bzflag LouMan (~42e39a3f@webchat.bzflag.bz)
22:59.10TimRiker~piglatin I prefer to spend time using the computer, not mucking with it.
22:59.12JeffM2501where "using the computer" == "looking at crap on the net"
22:59.37purple_cowhehe'
22:59.45JeffM2501TimRiker, if I can part together a 1 gig durron or better, you what it?
23:00.09JeffM2501mr k6-300
23:00.10TimRikerJeffM2501: if it's just going to collect dust, sure.
23:00.10jpa_where "mucking with it" == "trying to remove all the history marks"
23:00.25JeffM2501it's going to be thrown away when I move
23:00.45JeffM2501jpa_, naw, don't care about my history, only I use the computer
23:00.53TimRikerJeffM2501: sure then.
23:01.03JeffM2501it may have crap video
23:01.18JeffM2501I'll put it together and see what it does
23:01.31JeffM2501just replaced second machine with a Semperon 2400
23:01.34JeffM2501it runs well
23:01.36TimRikerJeffM2501: my wife (Keri) is planning to do some dvd publishing. videos of the kids. I'll likely have to upgrade a machine for her anyway.
23:02.00JeffM2501the 1 gig will actualy over clock to 1.3 just fine
23:02.16JeffM2501or I have a real 1.3 I'll try to see works in it.
23:02.26JeffM2501tho the overclocked is faster then the real 1.3
23:02.33JeffM2501133 bus instead of 100
23:02.56TimRikershe'll want a firewire port and a dvd writer etc. might just end up picking up a new system.
23:03.08JeffM2501get a mini :)
23:03.11JeffM2501got all that built in
23:03.16jpa_JeffM2501: just about to say that :)
23:03.22JeffM2501and comes with iDVD
23:03.35TimRikerhmm... even more tempting...
23:03.45jpa_only thing i do not like about macs is this i-syndrome
23:03.53JeffM2501dvd burner will add 100$ to the price
23:04.03JeffM2501yeah the I names are kinda stupid
23:05.02JeffM2501if you get a mini don't pay apple to put ram in, it's realy easy
23:05.06JeffM2501you just need the iSpatula
23:05.35JeffM2501mine runs fine with a gig dimm I got for 160$
23:05.45jpa_how much iRam does mini come with?
23:05.48JeffM2501as oposed to apple who wants like 350$
23:05.50JeffM2501256
23:06.11jpa_oh, same as i have on this box
23:06.28JeffM2501yeah it's not much
23:06.35JeffM2501I bumped it to 512 right away
23:06.40JeffM2501then orderd the giger
23:06.43jpa_enough for bzflag
23:06.49JeffM2501you'll want more
23:06.51jpa_as long you do not turn depth buffer off
23:06.53JeffM2501with OSX
23:07.00jpa_so it is bloated
23:07.11JeffM2501all that graphical niceness costs ram
23:07.16JeffM2501512 is fine
23:07.27jpa_kde runs fine with 256
23:07.28JeffM2501no modern system should have less then 512
23:07.28jpa_Mem:    255236k total,   221304k used,    33932k free,    20244k buffers
23:07.45JeffM2501all my systems have 512 or more
23:07.50JeffM2501ram is so cheap why not
23:08.02JeffM2501it run bzflag and Worlds of Warcarft just fine
23:08.07JeffM2501and I got the slow one.
23:08.16jpa_no so cheap IMO
23:08.24jpa_i'm just a poor student, anyway :P
23:08.29JeffM2501512's are like 55$
23:08.33JeffM2501that is cheap
23:08.40JeffM2501you spend more on that in food in a week
23:08.59jpa_so i will just not eat for a week and i get more ram? :)
23:09.13JeffM2501eat 1/2 for 2 weeks :)
23:09.56JeffM2501the mini did run fine with 256
23:10.05JeffM2501building was a lot faster with 512
23:10.38jpa_it was a problem with my gentoo too
23:10.57jpa_but then i just put -j1 so it does not paraller compilations and it is fine now
23:11.02codsdamn.. another bzadmin eating 100% of the cpu..
23:11.09codsvery annoying
23:11.39cods(probably occur when a server restart, or at least it's network related)
23:11.40jpa_cods: modify bitblt to be a irc-bzadmin proxy :)
23:11.48codsbitblt ?
23:11.58jpa_it is a irc-msn proxy
23:12.19codsbah, I plan to try to create a plugin for gaim for that.
23:13.07jpa_hmm.. better go to sleep soon
23:13.17jpa_so i will wake before cods goes to sleep ,)
23:13.39codsprobably :)
23:13.50codseven in almost the same timezone :)
23:13.56codss/in/if in/
23:14.02*** part/#bzflag |zongo| (~zongo@80-218-158-197.dclient.hispeed.ch)
23:14.14TimRikerhow quiet is a mac-mini?
23:15.59jpa_" - all whisper-quiet."
23:16.03jpa_says apple site :)
23:17.31jpa_"nod" must be the cutest word in english language :)
23:19.01Pizbitjpa_: Why is that?:)
23:19.22jpa_it just is :)
23:19.27Pizbitheh
23:19.59jpa_or maybe i associate it with the cute penguins in hackles that could not express themselves other than "nod" or "quark"
23:20.48PizbitHahaha:)
23:21.07Noodle-senseijpa_: no, "squeaky" is the cutest word in the english language :-)
23:21.20Noodle-senseisqueaky, squeaker, squeaking...
23:21.22Noodle-senseithink about it
23:21.26Noodle-senseiyou know i'm right :-)
23:21.37PizbitNoodle-sensei: Looks ordinary to me... :)
23:22.22Noodle-senseiPizbit: ok hotshot, what do YOU think is the cutest word, huh??
23:22.38JeffM2501my CD drive gets noisy every so often, but it's very quiet otherwise
23:23.54purple_cowTimRiker: is there somewhere i can look re: newly-uploaded debian packages?
23:24.45jpa_http://www.hackles.org/cgi-bin/archives.pl?request=77
23:36.06Noodle-senseipenguins == t3h win
23:36.44Noodle-senseioh sure, you probably get to see penguins all the time, being from NZ :-(
23:37.13Noodle-senseiand you don't think they are CUTE
23:38.38*** join/#bzflag Pizbit (~Pizbit@203-79-124-44.adsl.paradise.net.nz)
23:39.16*** join/#bzflag Tupone_ (Tupone@host-84-222-136-41.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)
23:39.57TimRikerpurple_cow: I used to ssh into auric to check that, but that hasn't worked since the debian systems were cracked. don't know a way to see in incoming queue now, but there has to be a web interface for it someplace.
23:42.10CIA-5BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/ (7 files in 2 dirs): revert -poll disable*=bool options, remove the associated backend, and implement POLLSET, POLLFLAGRESET, POLLKICK and POLLBAN permissions, granted to VERIFIED by default. mostly untested.
23:50.52*** join/#bzflag S1gn (~ngis@bzq-218-167-100.red.bezeqint.net)
23:50.57S1gnhi
23:51.50S1gnwhat is "tank rusted" message?
23:52.03S1gnwhen should it happen?
23:54.25DTRemenakwhen you fall into the water, you die, with that message.
23:54.37DTRemenakdon't fall into the water :)
23:54.59S1gnhmmmm It happend immediatly after entering the game :)
23:55.04S1gnhappens
23:55.55Noodle-senseithe tanks can rust?
23:56.11Noodle-senseiwhat next, they will be bound to the earth like real tanks??
23:56.14Noodle-senseiheaven forbit
23:56.19Noodle-senseiforbid*
23:57.02purple_cowi guess it's highly chlorinated water?
23:57.52DTRemenakS1gn: probably whoever's running the server forgot to turn on -sb, so you're spawning underwater.
23:58.03DTRemenakdon't play there :)
23:58.30Simon-Richardunless it's your server :-)
23:58.52S1gnDTRemenak: It's me :) saved world...
23:58.58DTRemenakheh :)
23:59.05DTRemenakadd -sb to your server commandline
23:59.18DTRemenakor config file
23:59.20S1gnok... I'll try now :)

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