| 00:18.43 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=Garrett@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 00:19.03 | Naka | k got some progress |
| 00:20.08 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/ (inc/menus.h src/client.cpp src/menus.cpp): menu stuff |
| 00:20.44 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/common/ (inc/URLManager.h src/URLManager.cpp): unused data |
| 00:21.25 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/3d/ (inc/display.h src/display.cpp): set a matrix with Z up |
| 00:27.16 | *** join/#bzflag wizart (n=wizart@dslb-084-058-162-198.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 00:50.47 | *** join/#bzflag sgk284 (n=stevek@ACA95840.ipt.aol.com) |
| 01:02.39 | menotume | Naka: <EMBED src="file.wav" autostart=true loop=false volume=100 hidden=true><NOEMBED><BGSOUND src="file.wav"></NOEMBED> |
| 01:02.52 | menotume | or similar |
| 01:03.11 | Naka | Yes I got it.. |
| 01:03.19 | Naka | Yor right |
| 01:03.31 | Naka | but its still not working right |
| 01:05.12 | Naka | menotume: I got this far http://www.geocities.com/tanktuner/Music_matt.html |
| 01:11.56 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (8 files in 6 dirs): texturing and menuing to work better ( better then 15 fps ) |
| 01:15.31 | *** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (n=frank@p5481BC37.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 01:21.42 | *** join/#bzflag blast007 (i=blast007@24-196-92-143.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
| 01:23.58 | blast007 | woah...almost hit a deer on the way home... :/ |
| 01:24.15 | blast007 | I could have probably reached out the window and touched it |
| 01:31.20 | *** join/#bzflag BIYA (n=chatzill@dialup-4.129.82.244.Dial1.Atlanta1.Level3.net) |
| 01:36.47 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (n=jeffm@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/JeffM2501) |
| 01:36.47 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ |
| 01:55.05 | *** join/#bzflag ElectricElf (n=david@debian/developer/dbharris) |
| 01:58.46 | *** join/#bzflag RPG_ (n=Garrett@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | This is it now |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | Everybody get down |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | This is all I can take |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | This is how a heart breaks |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | Now take a hit now you feel it break down |
| 02:13.26 | JeffM2501 | Make you stay wide awake |
| 02:13.29 | JeffM2501 | This is how a heart breaks |
| 02:31.40 | trepan | mushy song spam? |
| 02:34.07 | JeffM2501 | I think I swolowed a bug |
| 02:34.42 | RPG_ | i bet it isn't the most pleasant thing you've ever had |
| 02:35.21 | *** join/#bzflag XxtartarusxX (n=404dc5c2@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 02:36.35 | XxtartarusxX | hmm |
| 02:36.41 | XxtartarusxX | so this is irc |
| 02:37.14 | XxtartarusxX | lots of famous names on the right side of the screen // but nobody talking |
| 02:37.17 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=silent@adsl-64-108-223-145.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 02:37.18 | JeffM2501 | I am a leaf on the wind... watch me soar |
| 02:37.20 | RPG_ | always has been, always will be |
| 02:37.25 | RPG_ | hey Silent_swan |
| 02:37.45 | XxtartarusxX | i see // hi both of u |
| 02:38.22 | XxtartarusxX | curious question for anybody? |
| 02:38.31 | trepan | ~ask |
| 02:38.32 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. Remember, we're all volunteers. Please don't /msg people without permission. See also http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html |
| 02:38.39 | XxtartarusxX | ok |
| 02:38.45 | XxtartarusxX | on secretplace |
| 02:38.57 | XxtartarusxX | wierd -not responding |
| 02:39.08 | XxtartarusxX | and then server disconnect |
| 02:39.22 | XxtartarusxX | well not lag related -that I can tell |
| 02:39.42 | XxtartarusxX | oops ibot didnt read that |
| 02:39.54 | RPG_ | maybe the server computer got hit by lightin |
| 02:39.55 | RPG_ | g |
| 02:40.17 | blast007 | ~bzfquery bzflag.secretplace.us:5355 |
| 02:40.17 | XxtartarusxX | no the admins dont like some anon players @ the top |
| 02:40.22 | XxtartarusxX | ,:) |
| 02:40.40 | XxtartarusxX | great game |
| 02:41.07 | blast007 | if you were kicked by an admin, you would have been notified |
| 02:41.23 | XxtartarusxX | thats true |
| 02:41.49 | XxtartarusxX | ok - how about fixing jitter? |
| 02:42.03 | JeffM2501 | fix the internet |
| 02:42.05 | XxtartarusxX | sometimes i seem to have horrible jitter 20ms |
| 02:42.18 | XxtartarusxX | lol |
| 02:43.15 | RPG_ | in ./configure, does --disable-client disable BZAdmin as well? |
| 02:43.24 | blast007 | XxtartarusxX: what version? |
| 02:43.31 | XxtartarusxX | 2.02 |
| 02:43.35 | blast007 | 2.0.4 is out |
| 02:43.37 | JeffM2501 | RPG_, yes |
| 02:43.46 | JeffM2501 | bzadmin uses client code |
| 02:43.53 | XxtartarusxX | ,it locks up for me |
| 02:44.10 | blast007 | JeffM2501: is there a way to just build bzadmin, but not the graphical client? |
| 02:44.15 | JeffM2501 | no |
| 02:44.25 | XxtartarusxX | perhaps my video card~ |
| 02:44.36 | JeffM2501 | what do you have? |
| 02:45.04 | *** join/#bzflag Naka (n=chatzill@dialup-4.129.82.244.Dial1.Atlanta1.Level3.net) |
| 02:45.45 | XxtartarusxX | i have older mx400 and fx5200 cards |
| 02:45.58 | JeffM2501 | should run fine |
| 02:46.08 | JeffM2501 | current drivers? |
| 02:46.28 | XxtartarusxX | yes // i have experienced total lockup |
| 02:46.36 | JeffM2501 | what OS? |
| 02:46.37 | XxtartarusxX | . so i uninstalled |
| 02:46.46 | XxtartarusxX | ,gasp w32 |
| 02:46.51 | JeffM2501 | I gathered that |
| 02:46.55 | XxtartarusxX | w98se lol |
| 02:46.59 | JeffM2501 | what version of widiwos |
| 02:46.59 | JeffM2501 | oh |
| 02:47.05 | JeffM2501 | there is your problem |
| 02:47.08 | XxtartarusxX | :) |
| 02:47.19 | XxtartarusxX | i tried lindows |
| 02:47.21 | XxtartarusxX | ;) |
| 02:47.26 | blast007 | ick |
| 02:47.28 | XxtartarusxX | ,lol |
| 02:47.32 | JeffM2501 | get XP |
| 02:47.43 | JeffM2501 | or a real linux |
| 02:47.51 | DTRemenak | RPG_, JeffM2501: --enable-client and --enable-bzadmin are separate and independent switches |
| 02:47.52 | RPG_ | define "real linux" |
| 02:47.56 | XxtartarusxX | lol |
| 02:48.03 | JeffM2501 | see what they get for listening to me |
| 02:48.16 | XxtartarusxX | it's based on a debain build |
| 02:48.24 | JeffM2501 | lindows is crap |
| 02:48.30 | XxtartarusxX | debian |
| 02:48.32 | blast007 | lindows charges you for Open Office |
| 02:48.37 | XxtartarusxX | no |
| 02:48.40 | XxtartarusxX | maybe |
| 02:48.51 | *** join/#bzflag chopp (n=chopp@S01060013109107f3.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 02:48.53 | XxtartarusxX | i payed the 50 last year and didnt re-up |
| 02:49.07 | XxtartarusxX | i'd rather pay them then m$ |
| 02:49.17 | RPG_ | i downloaded it for free this year and am writing a paper now. |
| 02:49.30 | blast007 | I'd rather download linux for free |
| 02:49.39 | blast007 | and get something I can actually use |
| 02:50.11 | JeffM2501 | a proper liunux |
| 02:50.14 | JeffM2501 | with real driers |
| 02:50.20 | XxtartarusxX | apt-get |
| 02:50.45 | chopp | could anyone give me any suggestion's on how to fix my lag time? |
| 02:50.57 | JeffM2501 | what is you lag? |
| 02:51.07 | blast007 | chopp: and what kind of internet connection do you have? |
| 02:51.18 | RPG_ | wax your modem |
| 02:51.48 | chopp | broadband. 5mb/down 650/up |
| 02:52.02 | JeffM2501 | and what is your lag? |
| 02:52.07 | RPG_ | yep, all it needs is a coat of wax |
| 02:52.20 | bryjen | try different server. ones on the same continent as you are usually best. |
| 02:52.31 | chopp | lowest I have got so far was 500ms |
| 02:52.35 | JeffM2501 | ouch |
| 02:52.47 | RPG_ | *sustained gasp* |
| 02:52.48 | JeffM2501 | anything else using the connection while you play? |
| 02:52.52 | XxtartarusxX | probably a firewall |
| 02:52.55 | chopp | how do I know where the server's are located |
| 02:53.00 | BenUrban | you don't |
| 02:53.02 | JeffM2501 | and is your framereate REALY low? |
| 02:53.04 | chopp | iptables |
| 02:53.12 | bryjen | ask, or guess :) |
| 02:53.58 | blast007 | there are services to determine the ISP location of an IP address |
| 02:54.09 | JeffM2501 | what is your famerate |
| 02:54.14 | JeffM2501 | it may not even be real lag |
| 02:54.14 | chopp | yes I will check them out |
| 02:54.20 | bryjen | ah, that'd be let someone else guess ;) |
| 02:54.24 | RPG_ | chopp: www.dnsstuff.com |
| 02:54.34 | blast007 | RPG_: beat me to it ;) |
| 02:55.04 | chopp | JeffM2501: 800x600 |
| 02:55.10 | JeffM2501 | that is a resolution |
| 02:55.11 | blast007 | when in the game, press 't' to show your framerate |
| 02:55.13 | JeffM2501 | not a frame rate |
| 02:55.24 | chopp | ok |
| 02:55.37 | blast007 | it will take a second or two to show up, and will appear above the mouse box |
| 02:55.39 | chopp | and what should it be? |
| 02:55.45 | blast007 | higher is better |
| 02:55.56 | JeffM2501 | just tell us the number |
| 02:55.57 | chopp | and how to change it? |
| 02:56.03 | JeffM2501 | you don't |
| 02:56.07 | JeffM2501 | just tell us the number |
| 02:56.11 | chopp | ok, brb |
| 02:56.19 | XxtartarusxX | hows 11ms |
| 02:56.31 | RPG_ | that's video card lag |
| 02:56.38 | RPG_ | we want actualy frames per second |
| 02:56.47 | XxtartarusxX | hmmm |
| 02:56.52 | JeffM2501 | fps is video card lag :) |
| 02:57.26 | blast007 | the 'y' does ms per frame |
| 02:57.42 | XxtartarusxX | 45ms |
| 02:57.58 | JeffM2501 | that is 1/fps :) |
| 02:58.09 | blast007 | no |
| 02:58.16 | blast007 | that would be 1000ms |
| 02:58.32 | blast007 | 22FPS |
| 02:58.47 | JeffM2501 | fps and time per frame are inverses |
| 02:58.49 | XxtartarusxX | well i hit T - i'll got back and hit Y |
| 02:59.04 | blast007 | time per frame is in ms, so 1000ms is a second... |
| 02:59.11 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 02:59.26 | JeffM2501 | you have to convert it to seconds of course |
| 02:59.27 | blast007 | so if it takes 45ms to draw a frame, that is 22 frames in a second |
| 02:59.33 | XxtartarusxX | ahh 21ms |
| 03:00.12 | XxtartarusxX | when I hit Y matters naught / i play almost minimum graphics |
| 03:00.56 | blast007 | I can play with maxed out graphics at 1024x768 with my 5200, and I can get 40 to 80FPS |
| 03:02.26 | XxtartarusxX | i dont like shadows/ all the screens are 15 or 17" - i had 22" (hugE) but it's my cheap interent provider |
| 03:02.39 | XxtartarusxX | AHH! here is the ? I wanted to ask |
| 03:02.53 | blast007 | what does shadows have to do with your ISP? |
| 03:03.07 | RPG_ | 42 |
| 03:03.10 | XxtartarusxX | How does my jitter affect other players? |
| 03:03.19 | RPG_ | they can't shoot you |
| 03:03.23 | RPG_ | 'cause you jump around |
| 03:03.25 | blast007 | they probably see you jumping all over the place |
| 03:03.26 | RPG_ | and then they get angry |
| 03:03.31 | XxtartarusxX | ah |
| 03:03.35 | chopp | 0fps hmmm |
| 03:03.41 | XxtartarusxX | -well i;ve played with people with higher jitter than me |
| 03:03.45 | RPG_ | some of them even /poll ban laggers |
| 03:03.47 | blast007 | chopp: that would be your lag reason then ;) |
| 03:03.49 | XxtartarusxX | and i didnt see them jumping all over the place |
| 03:04.14 | chopp | how can I fix that |
| 03:04.14 | XxtartarusxX | anger is good - i like shooting u |
| 03:04.22 | blast007 | chopp: what video card do you have, and do you have the latest drivers? |
| 03:04.27 | XxtartarusxX | but my jitter is typcially 3-4ms |
| 03:04.39 | blast007 | 3-4 is normal |
| 03:05.03 | blast007 | probably 10 is fairly normal too |
| 03:05.05 | JeffM2501 | yeah your lag is not real lag |
| 03:05.05 | RPG_ | ~bzfquery secretplace |
| 03:05.07 | XxtartarusxX | thats what ive been told - and I leave when I find out my jitter is hight |
| 03:05.18 | RPG_ | ~bzfquery bzflag.secretplace.us:5355 |
| 03:05.20 | JeffM2501 | chopp, what card do you have? |
| 03:05.32 | chopp | this computer: onboard intel other pc: radeon 7000 they both perform about the same....not at all |
| 03:05.44 | JeffM2501 | ahh and your on linux? or windows? |
| 03:05.49 | chopp | linux |
| 03:05.53 | JeffM2501 | your screwed |
| 03:06.03 | bryjen | naa |
| 03:06.08 | JeffM2501 | you can try to updae DRI |
| 03:06.13 | JeffM2501 | and turn down some of your settings |
| 03:06.16 | JeffM2501 | that's about it |
| 03:06.16 | RPG_ | ~bzfquery bzflag.secretplace.us:5255 |
| 03:06.22 | JeffM2501 | no real drivers for you |
| 03:06.27 | bryjen | probly doesn't have dri on to be getting 0 |
| 03:06.32 | JeffM2501 | probalby not |
| 03:06.36 | JeffM2501 | DRI still blows |
| 03:07.25 | chopp | do I need a better vid card, or do I have to run m$ to play? |
| 03:07.37 | bryjen | and dri is fairly integrated with X. i would not attempt to upgrade it separate. just getting it turned on helps greatly tho ;) |
| 03:08.04 | JeffM2501 | well start with getting the current dri |
| 03:08.08 | JeffM2501 | no you don't need windows |
| 03:08.23 | JeffM2501 | just for the radeon 7000, ATI only offers hardware drivers for windows |
| 03:08.29 | JeffM2501 | better video cards will help you a lot |
| 03:08.32 | JeffM2501 | but are not required |
| 03:08.43 | JeffM2501 | I would also turn down your settings |
| 03:08.45 | JeffM2501 | in game |
| 03:08.48 | bryjen | chopp: if you do glxinfo in a terminal window, does it say "direct rendering: Yes" neaer the top of the output? |
| 03:08.56 | JeffM2501 | but make sure you leave DEPTH BUFFER on |
| 03:08.58 | chopp | I'm running 2.6.13. that should have the latest driver's no? |
| 03:09.04 | chopp | I'll check |
| 03:09.11 | JeffM2501 | chopp, not neisaraly |
| 03:09.29 | JeffM2501 | your kernel has nothing to do with X drivers |
| 03:09.41 | bryjen | the kernel's only half of it. need recent X window packages too. |
| 03:10.09 | chopp | slackware 10.2......dri is off |
| 03:10.21 | JeffM2501 | you want dri |
| 03:10.32 | JeffM2501 | you need some driver tha is going to do openGL for you |
| 03:10.45 | JeffM2501 | your lag is so high because your CPU has too draw everything |
| 03:11.03 | chopp | ok, I'll research that |
| 03:11.43 | bryjen | in the Module section of xorg.conf Load "glx" Load "dri" and a Section "DRI" with Mode 0666 |
| 03:12.19 | chopp | bryjen: thank's I'll try that |
| 03:12.49 | *** part/#bzflag XxtartarusxX (n=404dc5c2@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 03:16.20 | chopp | bryjen: I uncommented the Load "dri" but not sure about the "DRI" do I have to add it as you typed it? |
| 03:18.25 | chopp | my bad....I see it now |
| 03:18.50 | JeffM2501 | the intel onboard one isn't gonna run great tho, even with dri :) |
| 03:19.16 | bryjen | it ain't no GF, but it's better than software :P |
| 03:19.40 | blast007 | bryjen: my 8MB savage IX is worse than software in some cases :) |
| 03:20.01 | bryjen | S3 = Suck Suck Suck |
| 03:20.12 | chopp | just uncomment the Mode 0666. It will make a difference though? How bout the 7000, will these changes make it perform better |
| 03:20.56 | blast007 | bryjen: yup, I agree |
| 03:21.13 | JeffM2501 | blast007, not really, at least software gets it right, the intel implemenation is just WRONG in many cases |
| 03:21.15 | blast007 | at least it plays Oni and Blood 2 for me |
| 03:21.33 | bryjen | this is enabling X to use the 3D hardware on the card. In most cases *cough*blast007*cough* it should be better. |
| 03:22.32 | chopp | so just uncomment the Mode 0666 part of the DRI section? |
| 03:22.40 | bryjen | yeah |
| 03:23.21 | blast007 | JeffM2501: yes, I said that software was doing a better job |
| 03:23.26 | chopp | ok thank's. Maybe I can build a real pc here someday soon. :P |
| 03:24.11 | JeffM2501 | ahh I meant bryjen sorry |
| 03:24.21 | blast007 | ah |
| 03:24.27 | JeffM2501 | some of the cheap chipsets will be worse then software |
| 03:24.30 | blast007 | yeah |
| 03:24.31 | JeffM2501 | the 3d decellerators |
| 03:24.44 | blast007 | I get weird texture swapping on here |
| 03:24.53 | bryjen | supposedly they're getting better |
| 03:25.18 | bryjen | at least they're not calling them *Extreme* anymore |
| 03:25.42 | blast007 | I still find it funny that my 800MHz with a GF can beat my Aunt's AMD 3000 with an onboard Unichrome |
| 03:25.47 | JeffM2501 | doubt any intel onboard chipset will ever be beter then a good 4MX |
| 03:25.54 | bryjen | it's a budget setup. mobo makers want onboard video |
| 03:26.13 | JeffM2501 | nforce3+ and the new ATI mobos have good onboard video |
| 03:26.27 | JeffM2501 | gives you a FX5200 or an X300 basicly |
| 03:26.29 | bryjen | well, look who's making them... |
| 03:26.59 | bryjen | err, the chips at least |
| 03:27.29 | bryjen | did you ever get linux running on your new box? |
| 03:28.07 | JeffM2501 | no |
| 03:28.09 | JeffM2501 | didn't try much more |
| 03:28.12 | JeffM2501 | should again |
| 03:29.22 | chopp | 4fps on the intel, time to try the radeon. :( |
| 03:29.53 | bryjen | eep |
| 03:31.06 | bryjen | i guess i haven't tried on an intel recently. used to have one that did OK on pre-mesh maps... |
| 03:32.00 | JeffM2501 | what quality mode do you run in? |
| 03:32.41 | chopp | best, and no restart of x |
| 03:32.47 | JeffM2501 | oh dude |
| 03:32.49 | JeffM2501 | turn that sucker down |
| 03:32.58 | chopp | ok :) |
| 03:32.59 | JeffM2501 | you can't do best on that little chipset |
| 03:33.05 | blast007 | and you need to restart X to get that changed to apply |
| 03:33.15 | blast007 | the config is loaded when you start xorg |
| 03:33.17 | chopp | silly me, thx |
| 03:40.18 | Naka | can I ask a favor forrom someone? Go here and tell me if music plays or not. If it asks you to download a plugin can you do it? http://blog.myspace.com/32019561 |
| 03:40.27 | Naka | from someone* |
| 03:40.32 | RPG_ | This blog is set to private. This user must add |
| 03:40.32 | RPG_ | you as a friend to see his/her blog. |
| 03:40.37 | Naka | oo |
| 03:40.40 | Naka | okay |
| 03:40.42 | Naka | hold on |
| 03:42.49 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=silent@adsl-64-108-223-145.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 03:46.34 | Naka | umm this might work http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog |
| 03:47.24 | RPG_ | uhh... language on that one |
| 03:47.37 | Naka | ?!?! |
| 03:47.40 | Naka | where |
| 03:47.43 | RPG_ | commenror |
| 03:47.45 | RPG_ | commentor |
| 03:48.07 | Naka | umm what? |
| 03:48.57 | Naka | for some reason it shows me somthing different for you guys then it does me so im sorry for the language from someone |
| 03:50.51 | jpa- | it gives a registration form |
| 03:52.09 | Naka | hmm |
| 03:52.42 | RPG_ | myspace and xanga are both communist |
| 03:54.40 | Silent_Swan | hmm |
| 03:58.33 | RPG_ | yes? |
| 04:02.28 | *** join/#bzflag silverfox (i=vircuser@198.78.49.101) |
| 04:02.43 | RPG_ | hows the wiki going silverfox? |
| 04:03.02 | silverfox | I'm pleased with it. |
| 04:03.12 | silverfox | a lot of variety, and no real abuse. |
| 04:03.55 | RPG_ | if you ever do need a new idea, i have the BZFlag mapatorium which selects a random map daily from it's repositor |
| 04:04.15 | RPG_ | the highly-rated maps are weighted more in teh selection than the lower-rated oens |
| 04:04.33 | silverfox | Anyone know how I could add a ";" to the end of every line of output of the command `cat foo | cut -d, -f1` |
| 04:05.55 | Silent_Swan | | sed s/$/\ |
| 04:06.03 | Silent_Swan | oops |
| 04:06.07 | Silent_Swan | that didn't show for some reason |
| 04:06.13 | Silent_Swan | | sed s/$/\ |
| 04:06.17 | Silent_Swan | *sigh* |
| 04:06.26 | silverfox | I get the idea. thanks swan. |
| 04:06.26 | Silent_Swan | | sed s/$/\SEMICOLON/ |
| 04:06.33 | Silent_Swan | stupid irc client |
| 04:06.38 | silverfox | sed -i ? |
| 04:07.06 | Silent_Swan | not sure what -i does off the top of my head |
| 04:07.22 | Silent_Swan | don't see it in the man page either |
| 04:07.58 | bryjen | edit in place? don't think that applies to stdin/out |
| 04:08.08 | silverfox | Silent_Swan, in gnu sed, it changes in place. |
| 04:08.12 | Silent_Swan | oh |
| 04:08.14 | silverfox | bryjen, I think you're right. |
| 04:08.32 | Naka | Well thanks for the help RPG, i need to sleep so bye! |
| 04:08.50 | RPG_ | me too |
| 04:08.54 | silverfox | gnu sed is nice. ;) |
| 04:08.54 | RPG_ | 'tis lateless |
| 04:08.57 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=Garrett@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 04:10.25 | silverfox | crud. |
| 04:10.51 | Silent_Swan | ? |
| 04:11.15 | silverfox | hmm... I could probably do this better in perl: |
| 04:11.18 | silverfox | print `cat /opt/https/IP_Space/region.csv | cut -d, -f1 | sed \"s/$/\;/\" `; |
| 04:11.19 | Silent_Swan | probably |
| 04:11.30 | Silent_Swan | ugh |
| 04:11.38 | Silent_Swan | what's with the `cat...`? |
| 04:11.38 | silverfox | of course, I'm a complete perl hack... |
| 04:12.06 | Aribeth | knit 1 perl 2 |
| 04:12.27 | silverfox | cats the file to STDOUT, then pipe to cut. |
| 04:12.40 | Silent_Swan | anyplace you use cat ... | you should probably be using < instead |
| 04:12.40 | silverfox | don't think cut will read files. |
| 04:12.46 | silverfox | oh... |
| 04:12.48 | Silent_Swan | :) |
| 04:13.30 | orange | the gain of efficiency is not worth the loss of clarity in almost all cases |
| 04:13.51 | bryjen | and cut will take filenames |
| 04:14.18 | Aribeth | hey oeange |
| 04:14.28 | orange | hiya aeibeth |
| 04:17.08 | silverfox | Silent_Swan, I'd agree, but perl seems to freak out about the ; in the backticks. |
| 04:18.47 | silverfox | err, sorry, that was directed to orange. |
| 04:19.10 | silverfox | I communicate so poorly in irc sometimes... |
| 04:19.22 | orange | silverfox: I meant about the 'useless use of cat stuff' -- sometimes cat makes sense to make things clearer |
| 04:28.36 | Silent_Swan | need a \ |
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| 04:37.11 | silverfox | Silent_Swan, I escaped it. |
| 04:37.21 | Silent_Swan | there ya go |
| 04:37.22 | silverfox | it works find from bash, but in perl it throws up. |
| 04:45.46 | *** join/#bzflag lan56 (i=lan56@user-vcauvb6.dsl.mindspring.com) |
| 05:01.49 | silverfox | http://sial.org/pbot/13617 |
| 05:01.52 | silverfox | got it. |
| 05:26.49 | SportChick | silverfox: you're missing a great game of pillbox |
| 05:27.29 | orange | silvercat 5155 |
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| 05:33.48 | silverfox | ~silvercat:5155 |
| 05:33.56 | silverfox | ~bzfquery silvercat.tybox.net:5155 |
| 05:34.25 | silverfox | I'm gonna get in on that. |
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| 06:10.34 | lan56 | ehh |
| 06:10.47 | lan56 | JR got fired on monday night raw |
| 06:29.22 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/data/model/ (btank.png gtank.png ptank.png rtank.png styleTank.obj): stylised tank model |
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| 07:04.55 | LePoulpe303 | where can i find a list of required libraries to compile v 2.0.4 on linux ? ./configure tells me "no curses!" "no bzflag client binary!" , and i have (i think) all curses related libs |
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| 07:54.49 | LePoulpe303 | kahcepb[Ru] : are u there ? |
| 07:58.42 | LePoulpe303 | are "no curses!" and "no bzflag client" configure message linked or not ? |
| 08:09.52 | DTRemenak | nope |
| 08:12.53 | LePoulpe303 | DTRemenak : ok ; i was sad having 1 problem ; in fact i have 2 then :D |
| 08:15.37 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/bzflag.cxx: set "saveSettings" to force config saves |
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| 08:33.42 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/ (OptionsMenu.cxx defaultBZDB.cxx): if you want something done right... |
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| 10:49.18 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/OptionsMenu.cxx: do it yourself, but with due diligence |
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| 11:01.34 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03trepan * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/OptionsMenu.cxx: the call exists, use it |
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| 16:12.15 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, I need to change the list server to test for public servers using UDP, woudl you prefer a udptest=1 param, or something that tests udp if TCP fails? |
| 16:12.28 | JeffM2501 | I prefer the flag |
| 16:15.48 | Pimpinella | JeffM2501: does BZFlagG3D build on linux? |
| 16:15.55 | Pimpinella | somehow? |
| 16:21.06 | JeffM2501 | Pimpinella, no |
| 16:21.12 | JeffM2501 | no makefile |
| 16:21.23 | Pimpinella | figured that :/ |
| 16:21.24 | JeffM2501 | it should |
| 16:21.28 | JeffM2501 | it just needs the makefile |
| 16:21.43 | Pimpinella | ok |
| 16:21.58 | JeffM2501 | oh |
| 16:22.01 | JeffM2501 | I made a makefile |
| 16:22.06 | JeffM2501 | when did I do that? |
| 16:22.17 | JeffM2501 | it probably just needs to be updated |
| 16:22.20 | JeffM2501 | and have the server added to it |
| 16:22.23 | JeffM2501 | and raknet |
| 16:23.21 | Pimpinella | ok |
| 16:23.54 | JeffM2501 | it dosn't do anything yet tho |
| 16:28.42 | JeffM2501 | if you want to make a scons file for it, I'd not complain :) |
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| 16:30.13 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/ (inc/menus.h src/client.cpp): proper SDL headers |
| 16:34.58 | menotume | JeffM2501: the flag sounds better, no need to tie up an apache thread, and delay your listing |
| 16:39.20 | JeffM2501 | agreed |
| 16:39.30 | JeffM2501 | but I wanted to know from the riker |
| 16:39.35 | JeffM2501 | just in case |
| 16:39.43 | TimRiker | JeffM2501: explain some more... you are planning for the list server to call back to game servers and record if it can reach them over udp? then what? not show those that can't? or add a new bit indicating those that can? or what? |
| 16:40.03 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, it's a new proto version |
| 16:40.11 | JeffM2501 | so it won't affect old games at all |
| 16:40.18 | JeffM2501 | this server just dosn't listen on TCP |
| 16:40.24 | JeffM2501 | so it won't list at all |
| 16:41.01 | JeffM2501 | right now when we check to see if the server is reachable we only check via UDP |
| 16:41.02 | TimRiker | hmm. so where do reliable packets go? or is this the g3d stuff? |
| 16:41.05 | JeffM2501 | sorry TCP |
| 16:41.17 | JeffM2501 | this implments it's own reliable system in UDP |
| 16:41.23 | JeffM2501 | no TCP packets are sent |
| 16:41.30 | JeffM2501 | and yes it's G3dish stuff |
| 16:41.47 | JeffM2501 | I just wanted to use the real list server |
| 16:41.52 | JeffM2501 | using proto version 5001 |
| 16:41.54 | TimRiker | so existing clients can't talk to it anyway? |
| 16:42.00 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 16:42.18 | JeffM2501 | totaly incompatable thing |
| 16:42.27 | JeffM2501 | they would never even list it |
| 16:42.55 | TimRiker | hmm. and you don't want to just use a different url? ie: m.b.o/g3d or some such? |
| 16:43.01 | JeffM2501 | I could |
| 16:43.05 | JeffM2501 | but then duped code |
| 16:43.13 | JeffM2501 | but that's one reason I'm asking you :) |
| 16:43.15 | TimRiker | planning to use the same user db and stuff then? |
| 16:43.18 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 16:43.30 | JeffM2501 | same auth, same list, all that |
| 16:43.58 | TimRiker | ah. well if it checks the version or something and then does the udp call back on only that version, that's ok with me. need to document why it's there. |
| 16:44.18 | JeffM2501 | yeah, thought about doing it on the version |
| 16:44.30 | JeffM2501 | also thought about sending in an optional paramater like udpcheck=1 |
| 16:44.32 | TimRiker | perhaps you'll add the bzupdate.pl stuff while you're in there. ;-) |
| 16:44.38 | JeffM2501 | so it's more apeant what is happening |
| 16:44.47 | JeffM2501 | apearant |
| 16:45.00 | JeffM2501 | what is bzupdate.pl? |
| 16:45.23 | TimRiker | well it would be nice to check udp on normal servers at some point. so I'd prefer g3d=1 or similar. |
| 16:46.00 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, well since bz also uses TCP, testing for udp or tcp on normal servers could cause somone to get a false listing of a server that may not work |
| 16:46.05 | JeffM2501 | if they routed UDP only |
| 16:46.07 | JeffM2501 | and not TCP |
| 16:46.08 | TimRiker | the stats tables get updated by a perl script that polls servers. that should really get pulled into bzfls.php as a call back when the servers do an ADD. |
| 16:46.28 | JeffM2501 | ahh stats |
| 16:46.34 | TimRiker | I mean checking udp as well as tcp for normal servers. |
| 16:46.43 | JeffM2501 | yeah, that would be good to check both |
| 16:46.49 | JeffM2501 | since TCP only isn't viable |
| 16:47.10 | JeffM2501 | unless you go turn based :) |
| 16:47.59 | TimRiker | well, there are folks that are udp challenged do to firewalls. it would be nice to have them only see servers that allow tcp only connections (ie: not the busy ones) |
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| 16:48.10 | JeffM2501 | maybe some param like netcheck=X, where 1 = tcp only ( and is the default ), 2 = both tcp and udp, and 3 = udp only |
| 16:48.11 | TimRiker | s/do/due/ |
| 16:48.33 | JeffM2501 | I don't think a tcp only game is playable over the net |
| 16:48.40 | JeffM2501 | not in this day |
| 16:48.53 | TimRiker | with 2 or 3 players it's ok. with more, it's useless. |
| 16:48.58 | bryjen | or just netcheck= ( tcp | udp | both ) its all strings anyway, no data type |
| 16:49.02 | JeffM2501 | maybe on a good connection |
| 16:49.04 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 16:49.11 | JeffM2501 | keep forgeting it's php :) |
| 16:49.34 | JeffM2501 | silly typeless langauges ;) |
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| 16:49.53 | teh_conqerer | this new modem seems to be alot better than my 3 year old com 21 :-P |
| 16:50.01 | TimRiker | sounds fine to me. |
| 16:50.29 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, and what it sounds like, is you'd like to store that setting per server, so that later we could filter on it right? |
| 16:50.40 | JeffM2501 | for those TCP only people |
| 16:50.45 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 16:50.46 | JeffM2501 | got it |
| 16:51.05 | blast007 | if you need them, I have ported over most of the nboPack and nboUnpack functions to PHP |
| 16:51.22 | TimRiker | make a copy o fthe script, then point to the copy. when it all works there, then update the real script. |
| 16:51.31 | JeffM2501 | TimRiker, that's what I've been doing |
| 16:51.37 | JeffM2501 | to make sure it's even viable |
| 16:51.42 | JeffM2501 | but I hate dupe code |
| 16:51.48 | JeffM2501 | so I wanted to see how you felt about it |
| 16:52.01 | JeffM2501 | bzfls_udp.php is in the dir now |
| 16:52.17 | JeffM2501 | sql storage just was never my strong point |
| 16:53.07 | TimRiker | have you tested regular servers/clients against it? |
| 16:53.12 | JeffM2501 | not yet |
| 16:53.19 | JeffM2501 | I will before I make it go tho |
| 16:53.40 | JeffM2501 | right now it's just testing only UDP, to make sure I can test for udp |
| 16:53.50 | JeffM2501 | since the udp test is a "little" diffrent |
| 16:54.00 | JeffM2501 | have to read or write something to be sure |
| 16:54.06 | JeffM2501 | can't just connect |
| 16:55.10 | JeffM2501 | tho now that I think about it, it may be good to have the server listen on TCP just for stats |
| 16:55.24 | JeffM2501 | since geting stats over the UDP in a non C language will be iffy |
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| 16:56.15 | JeffM2501 | mehh, better to just have the server send out stats by http then people poll it |
| 16:57.21 | blast007 | http isn't the best solution for dumping stats |
| 16:57.30 | JeffM2501 | possibly not |
| 16:57.45 | JeffM2501 | but having the server know to send them somewhere is better then somewhere allways polling for them |
| 16:57.58 | JeffM2501 | since the somewhere dosn't know when they change, and the server does |
| 16:58.08 | JeffM2501 | what ever the protocoll |
| 16:58.45 | blast007 | the server could tell the 'somewhere' that there was a change, and the 'somewhere' could decide if it wants to poll the server (could limit the # of polls per minute) |
| 16:59.01 | JeffM2501 | why not just give it the data when it tells it that it changed? |
| 16:59.08 | JeffM2501 | and then somewhere can ignore it if it wants to :0 |
| 16:59.20 | JeffM2501 | the problem with the poll is, you have to implement the game proto in the somewhere too |
| 16:59.34 | blast007 | only for like two packets |
| 17:00.01 | blast007 | I've got PHP that can do much more than get the current scores and players |
| 17:00.44 | blast007 | of course, the info it pulls would be for a constant connection, so that's not really relevant |
| 17:00.52 | blast007 | (chat, kills, etc) |
| 17:01.14 | JeffM2501 | blast007, in this case it's not just 2 little packets |
| 17:01.23 | JeffM2501 | since this uses a 3rd party library |
| 17:01.23 | blast007 | ah |
| 17:01.23 | JeffM2501 | you'd have to implent all its' connection stuff |
| 17:01.26 | JeffM2501 | and compression |
| 17:01.27 | JeffM2501 | etc.... |
| 17:01.31 | JeffM2501 | better to detach them |
| 17:01.34 | blast007 | k |
| 17:01.50 | JeffM2501 | then you don't have to update your somewhere every single time the game proto changes |
| 17:01.50 | blast007 | I was thinking G3D was just a graphics engine |
| 17:01.55 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 17:02.05 | blast007 | k |
| 17:02.05 | JeffM2501 | heck the "g3d" project isn't even using g3d :) |
| 17:02.17 | TimRiker | it's raknet or some such, yes? |
| 17:02.30 | JeffM2501 | raknet is the netlib I am testing yes |
| 17:02.38 | JeffM2501 | there are a couple of UDP only ones that look promicing |
| 17:02.48 | blast007 | ok, wasn't aware that it would completely change the protocol |
| 17:02.59 | blast007 | I was thinking it was just implemented with a different library |
| 17:03.05 | JeffM2501 | that's why I kept saying "totaly incompatable" :) |
| 17:03.15 | JeffM2501 | and "new protocoll" :) |
| 17:03.24 | JeffM2501 | raknet has some prety cool features |
| 17:03.31 | JeffM2501 | easy ways to sync data in classes |
| 17:03.36 | JeffM2501 | prioritys |
| 17:03.44 | JeffM2501 | PRC stuff |
| 17:03.59 | blast007 | cool |
| 17:04.06 | JeffM2501 | and compression |
| 17:04.22 | JeffM2501 | I'm still using libcurl for the list server tho |
| 17:04.45 | JeffM2501 | from a pure design point, if you want stat collection to be a real feature, you'd give it it's own procoll and function set |
| 17:04.54 | JeffM2501 | HTTP is very easy for the server |
| 17:04.59 | JeffM2501 | but you are right it is limiting |
| 17:05.25 | JeffM2501 | if you wanted a poll interface I'd make the server listen on TCP just for stat polls, and give it it's own stat protocoll |
| 17:05.33 | JeffM2501 | that way it would not have to change as often |
| 17:05.55 | JeffM2501 | but if you are going to "hit" a poller to tell it that you have data, why not just send the data? stat data isn't huge |
| 17:07.12 | blast007 | mainly I was saying hit them through http, and then while the script is still running, have it query then |
| 17:07.30 | JeffM2501 | why query back? |
| 17:07.39 | JeffM2501 | why not have the http hit send the data? |
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| 17:08.42 | JeffM2501 | asuming all new code |
| 17:08.47 | JeffM2501 | and no need to support old stuff |
| 17:08.50 | JeffM2501 | of course |
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| 17:15.38 | bryjen | the callback lets the list server check that the game server is actually reachable from the 'net. you could do a simple ping<->echo or a statsRequest<->reply. needs to know about two packet types and enough to ignore any others |
| 17:16.26 | JeffM2501 | in this case I don't controll the low level listen |
| 17:16.29 | JeffM2501 | even in UDP |
| 17:16.51 | JeffM2501 | there are packets that go back and forth that the client app isn't aware of |
| 17:17.31 | JeffM2501 | that's why I'd do it where the server listetens on TCP, just for the listserver/ stats |
| 17:18.59 | bryjen | in that case, you're probly right about just pushing the stats with the http update-listing request |
| 17:19.16 | JeffM2501 | or just a http stat push as another option |
| 17:19.37 | JeffM2501 | give the server a list of sites to push stats too |
| 17:19.51 | JeffM2501 | in adition to the list server listing request |
| 17:20.02 | JeffM2501 | it woudl be nice if we only had to send stats once to one place |
| 17:20.07 | JeffM2501 | thent hat one place hande the distro |
| 17:21.11 | bryjen | calling back to separate port and proto other than the game runs on reduces the certainty of "if the list callback is working, clients should be able to connect" |
| 17:23.11 | *** join/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 17:23.12 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ |
| 17:24.02 | *** part/#bzflag ToughShooter (n=ts@p54B003A1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:25.44 | JeffM2501 | well list shoudl at least ping the game proto port |
| 17:26.05 | JeffM2501 | I don't think it should be the servers job to host stats to everyone, there should be a central collector |
| 17:26.09 | JeffM2501 | who just does stats |
| 17:26.09 | *** join/#bzflag ToughShooter (n=ts@p54B0392D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:26.22 | JeffM2501 | like send the stats to the list server, then have it just publish them |
| 17:26.26 | JeffM2501 | to anyone who wants it |
| 17:26.28 | menotume | yes |
| 17:26.39 | JeffM2501 | let the game server do the game :) |
| 17:26.44 | menotume | yep |
| 17:27.04 | menotume | push the data to a central collector |
| 17:27.10 | menotume | and don't bother the game server with polls |
| 17:27.18 | ToughShooter | Tupone: If the check of movements would go up from 30 to 60, would that stagger the needed bandwidth exponential? |
| 17:27.41 | Tupone | you should multiply that for the number of player |
| 17:29.13 | Tupone | so is likely doubling the max message rate |
| 17:29.20 | ToughShooter | Sounds like no players with ultra-low bandwidth could play I suppose |
| 17:30.11 | ToughShooter | ..as of now ADSL2+ is low bandwidth ;) |
| 17:30.47 | JeffM2501 | why would you need to send out updates 60 times a sec? |
| 17:31.27 | ToughShooter | Just being curious about the mouse acceleration symtoms and how they could be eliminated |
| 17:31.38 | Tupone | that is the max rate, not the actual rate. This rate will be reached by ME player and by very fast machine |
| 17:31.52 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 17:31.59 | JeffM2501 | still seems like overkill |
| 17:32.06 | JeffM2501 | usualy people can't see that fast :) |
| 17:32.15 | ToughShooter | If you want to take away different mouse behaviour, you can fire a serious of ME events |
| 17:32.24 | ToughShooter | s/serious/series |
| 17:33.12 | ToughShooter | enchanced mouse functionality means auto-positioning of cursor, in my memories |
| 17:34.04 | ToughShooter | at least on Mac OS X you can check whether the mouse has moved and set a new cursor point via API |
| 17:34.05 | SportyGal | can someone direct me to someplace that compares "font size" to "point" type, such as is used in books |
| 17:34.14 | SportyGal | I need to convert between the two |
| 17:34.52 | JeffM2501 | there isn't a hard 1 to 1 comparison |
| 17:35.00 | JeffM2501 | usualy it's 72 points to an inch |
| 17:35.01 | ToughShooter | so it would be easy to convert acceleration into speed |
| 17:35.22 | JeffM2501 | most books uses 7-8 point fonts |
| 17:35.24 | blast007 | font size is typically measured in points |
| 17:35.29 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 17:35.32 | JeffM2501 | or pikas :) |
| 17:35.35 | JeffM2501 | mmmm pikas |
| 17:35.35 | blast007 | yup ;) |
| 17:35.50 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, what are you trying to do? |
| 17:35.50 | ToughShooter | the LCD I'm using right now has 110 points per inch, IIRC |
| 17:36.08 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, that's pixels per inch |
| 17:36.11 | SportyGal | Jeff, I need to figure out what font is comparable to 6.2 point and 9.5 point |
| 17:36.23 | ToughShooter | JeffM2501: :( |
| 17:36.31 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, a point is a point |
| 17:36.46 | JeffM2501 | so on the computer the same font at 6.5 points is the same size |
| 17:36.48 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: the point sizes are what are used in descriptions of text siz in a book |
| 17:36.58 | JeffM2501 | comptuers use points too |
| 17:37.02 | JeffM2501 | it's the same measurement |
| 17:37.03 | SportyGal | JeffM2501: I tried it and I couldn't even read 6.5 |
| 17:37.12 | JeffM2501 | 6.5 is very small |
| 17:37.15 | ToughShooter | Tupone: What do you think of the idea altering the mouse movement itself? |
| 17:37.16 | JeffM2501 | did you use the same font type? |
| 17:37.23 | JeffM2501 | not all fonts are the same |
| 17:37.34 | Tupone | what you mean by altering? |
| 17:37.51 | ToughShooter | Like I typed before, check for movement |
| 17:37.57 | JeffM2501 | an 8 point letter in arial is not the same size as an 8 point letter in courier |
| 17:38.01 | Tupone | you want to move the client control the cursor? |
| 17:38.11 | Tupone | s/to move// |
| 17:38.14 | JeffM2501 | SportyGal, in general, you eyeball it :) |
| 17:38.31 | SportyGal | jeff, I don't have the book - that's the whole point - I'm trying to decide what to order, and I'm having to guess |
| 17:38.42 | JeffM2501 | what do you mean what to order? |
| 17:38.52 | JeffM2501 | you are buying a font? |
| 17:39.03 | ToughShooter | I think it would make things fair if all mouse movements move the cursor equal |
| 17:41.14 | bryjen | fonts are measure in points. it's the same on paper on a computer. the problem comes in if the pc doesn't know the correct dpi for your monitor, it can't correctly convert points to inches to dots (pixels) on the screen. |
| 17:42.02 | bryjen | s/paper on/paper or/ |
| 17:42.17 | ToughShooter | Tupone: That would be the root of all differences, not the root of the problems (the low bandwidth connections) |
| 17:42.44 | Tupone | ToughShooter: the acceleration of tank is already controlled by the -a setting |
| 17:43.11 | ToughShooter | That would be unfair when you get agility |
| 17:43.34 | Tupone | and I don't like to move cursor from the application. Is already a forced things to confine it inside the windows |
| 17:43.52 | bryjen | is agility not affected by the -a parameters? |
| 17:43.59 | Tupone | is affected |
| 17:44.05 | ToughShooter | bryjen: That's the problem |
| 17:44.15 | bryjen | uhm... |
| 17:44.48 | ToughShooter | I've played with acceleration and speed (only using one thing at a time) and agility was of more use with speed |
| 17:45.49 | ToughShooter | it makes accelerations better controlled, not having angular movements influence so easily |
| 17:46.31 | bryjen | so you're saying -a make the agility flag more powerful? |
| 17:46.47 | ToughShooter | no |
| 17:47.07 | ToughShooter | mouse speed makes the agility flag more powerful |
| 17:47.44 | bryjen | ah, and does the -a parameter not help limit that? |
| 17:48.14 | ToughShooter | partly but not really noticeable |
| 17:48.46 | ToughShooter | acceleration moves the mouse more dynamic, you can't draw straight lines with cursor as easy as with mouse speed |
| 17:49.02 | bryjen | so the ME players still have some advantage if they can find an Agility flag... |
| 17:49.35 | bryjen | Windows ME? |
| 17:49.42 | ToughShooter | no, mouse stuff |
| 17:50.10 | bryjen | yeah. I keep thinking Windows __ |
| 17:50.23 | ToughShooter | ancient logitech drivers I used had a function called "enchanced mouse behaviour" |
| 17:50.49 | ToughShooter | that was making the cursor jump to default buttons of dialogs ;) |
| 17:51.10 | bryjen | it's not just old drivers.... I've seen that recently |
| 17:51.20 | ToughShooter | bryjen: The problem is that ones who use mouse acceleration do profit _less_ from agility |
| 17:51.37 | ToughShooter | yeah, but that how it was called in my old drivers |
| 17:51.48 | bryjen | less than they did before, or less than non-ME players? |
| 17:52.05 | ToughShooter | both |
| 17:53.18 | ToughShooter | -a limits their angular movement, so no advance when they want to move angular and they can't drive as easy as the others straight forward (and more importantly: shooting) |
| 17:55.02 | bryjen | hmm |
| 17:55.19 | ToughShooter | without -a, agility is less useful, too because the difficult to control bullets weight more in gameplay |
| 17:57.12 | ToughShooter | when I am chased with bullets and escape with higher jumping speed due to agility I can never say in with direction my tank will point when I land |
| 17:57.30 | ToughShooter | s/with/which |
| 17:57.54 | bryjen | :( |
| 17:59.06 | ToughShooter | the only thing that would really make things equal is either having all cursors move the same or more updates per second |
| 18:03.05 | Grumbler | so is the problem that ME tanks cant jump the way they want with -a? |
| 18:04.12 | ToughShooter | no |
| 18:04.14 | bryjen | Grumbler: iirc, ToughShooter says Mac's exhibit some ME behavior by default |
| 18:04.38 | Grumbler | well, Mac's have funky mouse control by default |
| 18:04.49 | ToughShooter | agility is much less powerful at all with mouse acceleration |
| 18:05.25 | ToughShooter | if you limit the angular movements abilities the difference gets even higher |
| 18:06.40 | bryjen | yes, the disadavantage or Agility is it's harder to control. a sensitive mouse makes that worse. and, i guess, the inertia from -a could make it even harder to correct over-control |
| 18:06.46 | bryjen | s/or/of/ |
| 18:08.15 | Grumbler | from the ME user standpoint yes |
| 18:08.30 | ToughShooter | when the mouse is more sensitive the feeling gets better |
| 18:08.52 | ToughShooter | because then you use less acceleration and more speed |
| 18:09.13 | Grumbler | it acts less like a tank and more like a human.....the ability to dodge and quickly alter direction |
| 18:10.15 | ToughShooter | yeah, and humans aren't as precise as a special machine for controlled shots |
| 18:11.39 | ToughShooter | but I've to state, that I'm using BZFlag now quite a while and no one has ever complained about me being jittery |
| 18:13.20 | bryjen | iirc, the problem Tupone's trying to solve also involves players with laggy or inconsistent network connections |
| 18:14.02 | *** join/#bzflag Legoguy (n=Legoguy@ppp-68-252-215-7.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 18:15.15 | Tupone | ToughShooter: I think I have removed some laggy effect of ME players at the cost of removing smoothness of all the other player |
| 18:17.03 | ToughShooter | Tupone: Refering to something in 2.0.4? |
| 18:17.04 | Tupone | now when packet travel time take more/less then average, you see tank at non-uniform position |
| 18:17.08 | Tupone | 2.0.4 |
| 18:17.49 | ToughShooter | Ah, that's what Birdie complained about then |
| 18:18.28 | Birdie | and in 2.0.5 thats fixed? |
| 18:19.05 | Tupone | that is in > 2.0.4 until ME player stop that, or server put -a at acceptable limit |
| 18:19.43 | ToughShooter | but -a is injust |
| 18:19.44 | TimRiker | SportyGal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_%28typography%29 |
| 18:19.47 | Tupone | that algorithm do not work with those kind of acceleration |
| 18:20.42 | Tupone | ToughShooter: any things is a compromise, you want ME, and not -a ? you get laggy vision |
| 18:21.21 | TimRiker | ~convert 1 inch to points |
| 18:21.30 | *** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (n=jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 18:21.51 | ToughShooter | Tupone: I don't want that, either. I want a compromise |
| 18:22.09 | TimRiker | ~convert 1 inch to bigpoints |
| 18:22.52 | Tupone | ToughShooter: I have not found any workable solution to this problem |
| 18:23.09 | ToughShooter | Former DDR already has glas fibre infrastructure for internet |
| 18:23.58 | TimRiker | the server could keep track of connection speeds and send less frequent updates to slow players. |
| 18:24.04 | ToughShooter | at something around 30 players |
| 18:24.04 | Tupone | Deutch demoKratic Republic ? |
| 18:24.29 | bryjen | I bet the "Computer points" number came from 72dpi displays so point would equal pixels |
| 18:24.48 | ToughShooter | Tupone: Yes, but the spelling could be improved ;) |
| 18:24.55 | Tupone | yeah :) |
| 18:25.13 | Tupone | ~DDR |
| 18:25.17 | ibot | hmm... ddr is "Dance! Dance! Revolution!" Addictive dancing game. Implementations for Linux include pyDance and Stepmania. a word meaning 'double-data-rate' - namely used for doing things on both edges of a clock pulse. |
| 18:25.23 | ToughShooter | heh |
| 18:25.49 | bryjen | ~x en de German Democratic Republic |
| 18:26.16 | SportyGal | TimRiker: thanks |
| 18:26.44 | bryjen | 1 word of 3. |
| 18:26.47 | bryjen | ibot sucks |
| 18:26.48 | ibot | Look who's talking |
| 18:26.54 | bryjen | heh |
| 18:26.56 | Tupone | lol |
| 18:27.16 | bryjen | somebody's changed that... |
| 18:28.32 | jpa- | i think it is random |
| 18:28.35 | jpa- | ibot sucks |
| 18:28.36 | ibot | Bite me. |
| 18:28.45 | bryjen | ~brlcad++ |
| 18:28.56 | jpa- | ibot literal sucks |
| 18:28.57 | ibot | "sucks" is "<reply>(For twenty bucks I'll do more than that|Bite me.|Look who's talking|You suck.|You'd like that, wouldn't you?|For five bucks I just might|I'm only as good as you've helped make me .. idiot|If you give me $50 I'll do more than that!|I bite too.)" |
| 18:28.59 | jpa- | :) |
| 18:29.15 | bryjen | ibot factinfo sucks |
| 18:29.15 | ibot | sucks -- last modified at Sun May 1 18:43:03 2005 by learner!~brlcad@brlcad.bronze.supporter.pdpc; it has been requested 12 times, last by jpa-, 39s ago. |
| 18:29.31 | JeffM2501 | ibot sucks less |
| 18:31.42 | *** join/#bzflag ToughShooter (n=ts@p54B0030E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:31.49 | TimRiker | ibot knows all |
| 18:31.51 | ibot | and don't you forget it |
| 18:32.02 | JeffM2501 | TheLastSpartan rocks |
| 18:32.03 | TheLastSpartan | yes I do |
| 18:32.14 | ToughShooter | DDR stands for "Deutsche Demokratische Republik" |
| 18:32.24 | JeffM2501 | Dance Dance REVOLUTION!!!! |
| 18:32.41 | TimRiker | ibot: ddr is also Deutsche Demokratische Republik |
| 18:32.43 | ibot | TimRiker: okay |
| 18:32.45 | ToughShooter | that was so democratic because you could elect one party |
| 18:35.45 | Tupone | about democracy, look for italy there: http://www.freedomhouse.org/research/pressurvey/allscore2005.pdf |
| 18:38.20 | ToughShooter | Tupone: Wow, italy is behind so called US :o |
| 18:38.30 | Tupone | :) |
| 18:39.05 | ToughShooter | but DDR was better, you had one party (only one!) and it's spies and fans everywhere around |
| 18:40.56 | Grumbler | in russia there are no partys, just vodka. |
| 18:43.31 | ToughShooter | Germany has so many funny things, like saying we don't produce and don't have atomic bombs...sure |
| 18:44.35 | Grumbler | well, you dont....we do....they just so happen to be located there.....under the autobahn |
| 18:45.43 | *** join/#bzflag Silent_Swan (n=pepper@adsl-64-108-223-145.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 18:47.40 | Silent_Swan | JeffM2501 may i pm you for a sec? |
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| 19:15.37 | *** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (n=jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:27.39 | JeffM2501 | Silent_Swan, of course |
| 19:36.28 | Grumbler | EVER, really.... |
| 19:37.18 | JeffM2501 | EEVVAAARR! |
| 19:37.21 | *** join/#bzflag PrezKennedy (n=Apathy@pcp0011645240pcs.aberdn01.md.comcast.net) |
| 19:41.34 | Grumbler | does it have bluetooth? |
| 19:41.38 | JeffM2501 | no |
| 19:41.51 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03atupone * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfs.cxx: Don't loop indefinitely if not able to position flags |
| 19:41.54 | Grumbler | does it have gps tracking? |
| 19:42.02 | JeffM2501 | tho I know a guy who could get one that did have bluetooth |
| 19:42.05 | JeffM2501 | and the GPS |
| 19:42.18 | JeffM2501 | in the pentop computer :) |
| 19:47.11 | Grumbler | so what makes yours....the best EVER |
| 19:47.28 | JeffM2501 | fountant pen |
| 19:47.30 | JeffM2501 | made out of metal |
| 19:47.34 | JeffM2501 | nice and heafty |
| 19:47.47 | JeffM2501 | with celtic knots |
| 19:48.29 | ToughShooter | Tupone: Why save settings in main menu and not in options? |
| 19:48.51 | Tupone | Save setting save everythings |
| 19:49.00 | Tupone | like it was when you exit |
| 19:49.21 | Tupone | I don't like to save anything when in the club :/ |
| 19:50.08 | Tupone | so I put in a place where the old saving was (Quit) |
| 19:50.08 | JeffM2501 | you should probably put a "this is a public computer" option in options |
| 19:50.14 | JeffM2501 | like so many things do |
| 19:50.20 | JeffM2501 | and make it not save anything on quit |
| 19:50.57 | Tupone | now trepan did the save-on-exit/donot-save things |
| 20:04.11 | *** join/#bzflag BearPerson (i=karsten@sourcemage/pdpc.sustaining.BearPerson) |
| 20:08.23 | JeffM2501 | can somone run a pubic server to test something for me? |
| 20:08.43 | JeffM2501 | just set your list server to http://my.bzflag.org/bzfls2.php |
| 20:08.47 | JeffM2501 | with -publiclist |
| 20:10.55 | *** join/#bzflag TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 20:10.55 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 20:11.18 | bryjen | looks like it works |
| 20:11.27 | JeffM2501 | it listed properly? |
| 20:12.07 | bryjen | yes |
| 20:12.11 | JeffM2501 | cool thanks |
| 20:14.20 | JeffM2501 | at least I didn't break anything :) |
| 20:17.36 | JeffM2501 | shake it up baby |
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| 20:24.06 | *** join/#bzflag blast007 (i=blast007@24-196-92-143.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
| 20:25.48 | ToughShooter | Dogfight between BZFlag and Nanosaur 2: http://pastebin.com/390450 |
| 20:30.41 | *** join/#bzflag RPG_ (n=Garrett@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:32.10 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (3 files in 3 dirs): obj reader class |
| 20:50.05 | *** join/#bzflag WonderMop (n=heywood@user-11fa9oo.dsl.mindspring.com) |
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| 21:06.43 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/3d/src/display.cpp: proper SDL headers |
| 21:08.34 | *** join/#bzflag BearPerson (i=karsten@sourcemage/pdpc.sustaining.BearPerson) |
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| 21:19.39 | *** join/#bzflag SportyGal (i=DonnaCra@24-75-159-182.vnnyca.adelphia.net) |
| 21:47.40 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (3 files in 3 dirs): audio framework |
| 22:00.23 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=Garrett@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:06.23 | *** join/#bzflag I (n=mofo@pcp0010382004pcs.savana01.ga.comcast.net) |
| 23:08.07 | BenUrban | hahaha |
| 23:08.51 | blast007 | darn... |
| 23:08.53 | blast007 | * ` :Nickname is already in use. |
| 23:11.34 | *** join/#bzflag I_Died_Once (n=mofo@pcp0010382004pcs.savana01.ga.comcast.net) |
| 23:18.12 | I_Died_Once | que pasa? |
| 23:22.12 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (audio/inc/audio.h audio/src/audio.cpp client/src/client.cpp): play an intro tune |
| 23:22.13 | JeffM2501 | nada mass |
| 23:30.09 | I_Died_Once | anyone know a good NES emulator for linux that has a gui ??? |
| 23:31.03 | JeffM2501 | nesticle |
| 23:31.11 | JeffM2501 | oh linux |
| 23:31.16 | I_Died_Once | yeah |
| 23:31.24 | JeffM2501 | never used on one linux |
| 23:31.31 | I_Died_Once | FCEUltra doesnt have a gui |
| 23:31.41 | JeffM2501 | isn't there like znes? |
| 23:31.47 | I_Died_Once | yeah for SNES |
| 23:31.49 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 23:31.56 | I_Died_Once | *has it already |
| 23:31.58 | JeffM2501 | nesticle and wine :) |
| 23:32.04 | I_Died_Once | ooohhhh |
| 23:32.15 | I_Died_Once | now THATS an idea |
| 23:32.53 | I_Died_Once | I got a LOAD of hacked mario bros games |
| 23:32.53 | *** join/#bzflag triclops (n=triclops@203-206-249-42.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:33.06 | I_Died_Once | with funnied up graphics and names |
| 23:34.45 | blast007 | http://www.zophar.net/unix/nes.html |
| 23:35.24 | I_Died_Once | I'm already there |
| 23:35.33 | I_Died_Once | I been going to that site for years |
| 23:35.48 | I_Died_Once | they got alot, but nothing they have for linux his any good |
| 23:35.50 | I_Died_Once | gah |
| 23:35.54 | I_Died_Once | thx anyway |
| 23:35.58 | blast007 | :) |
| 23:38.24 | I_Died_Once | Quick! I need a pound cake recipe! |
| 23:40.58 | BenUrban | put a pound of cake on a plate |
| 23:41.23 | I_Died_Once | (you guys are so quick at most everything else, thought I'd test y'all) |
| 23:42.25 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (audio/inc/audio.h audio/src/audio.cpp client/src/client.cpp): URL sound streaming |
| 23:43.46 | JeffM2501 | anyone got the URL of an icecast or shoutcast stream? |
| 23:44.22 | blast007 | www.shoutcast.com ;) |
| 23:44.57 | JeffM2501 | they hide the raw URLs |
| 23:45.02 | blast007 | ah |
| 23:46.46 | blast007 | even in their .pls files? cuz one has http://70.69.160.20:9000 |
| 23:46.58 | JeffM2501 | that's where it's buried |
| 23:47.29 | blast007 | k |
| 23:47.30 | JeffM2501 | cool |
| 23:47.32 | JeffM2501 | that worked thanks |
| 23:47.46 | blast007 | ah :) |
| 23:47.57 | JeffM2501 | they take a bit to start tho |
| 23:48.32 | JeffM2501 | tho the gameclient is basicly playing a shoutcast stream now :) |
| 23:48.40 | blast007 | sweet |
| 23:50.24 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/src/client.cpp: don't use a local bgm file till we get one we can legaly use, so here is a shoutcast stream :) |
| 23:51.34 | JeffM2501 | sadly debian will never see that feature in apt |
| 23:58.36 | *** join/#bzflag wizart (n=wizart@dslb-084-058-154-187.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 23:59.29 | I_Died_Once | did ya get that Jeff? |