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| 00:10.34 | l_r | could you suggest a simple command line for a simple wolrd in bzfs? |
| 00:13.35 | Matt123 | to get a random world just dont include a -world |
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| 02:43.48 | gyre | hello |
| 02:51.18 | A-Delusion | hello gyre... very quiet in here tonight... |
| 03:00.31 | gyre | yesh |
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| 03:03.58 | gyre | yo |
| 03:04.40 | High | hello? |
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| 03:28.44 | I_Died_Once | any of the devs around? |
| 03:29.02 | I_Died_Once | I'm trying to compile a 1.10 client, and getting funky errors during make |
| 03:30.06 | I_Died_Once | http://bzflag.pastebin.ca/69579 |
| 03:30.55 | I_Died_Once | which... i compiled my own 2.0.8 from source.... |
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| 03:50.36 | trepan | I_Died_Once: BZFlag 1.10.8, 2004-10-05, why? |
| 03:51.01 | I_Died_Once | legacy server |
| 03:51.16 | trepan | src from where? and try an older gcc? |
| 03:51.41 | I_Died_Once | src from sourceforge, linked from the main site |
| 03:52.08 | trepan | tgz pkg? |
| 03:52.25 | I_Died_Once | .tar.bz2 |
| 03:53.47 | A-Delusion | gcc 3.3? |
| 03:54.14 | I_Died_Once | whatever adept put on me... |
| 03:55.03 | trepan | try a pre-3 version, ex: 2.95 |
| 03:55.09 | I_Died_Once | ok..... |
| 03:55.26 | I_Died_Once | silly question, 2.95 is avaiable on adept, and i already have other versions installed |
| 03:55.26 | DTRemenak | 4 won't work. 3.x ought to. |
| 03:55.30 | trepan | either that or predefine the class in that file: class SortedGState; at the top |
| 03:55.50 | I_Died_Once | do i need to specify anything? |
| 03:56.25 | trepan | add "class SortedGState;" to the top of ogl/OpenGLGState.cxx |
| 03:56.27 | I_Died_Once | do i need to uninstall the newer gcc's? |
| 03:56.37 | I_Died_Once | ok |
| 03:57.49 | I_Died_Once | i think that worked |
| 03:57.57 | I_Died_Once | adding class SortedGState; |
| 03:58.06 | I_Died_Once | its chugging along |
| 03:58.08 | trepan | you may encounter similar problems along the way, read the errors, try the same thing |
| 03:58.18 | I_Died_Once | thx |
| 04:04.42 | I_Died_Once | its still compiling... I see this line alot.... |
| 04:04.44 | I_Died_Once | `-mcpu=' is deprecated. Use `-mtune=' or '-march=' instead. |
| 04:05.00 | trepan | let it slide |
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| 04:23.10 | Legoguy | trepan: do you have any patches i can fiddle with to test the fullscreen radar, unless its already in cvs or something |
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| 04:23.41 | I_Died_Once | well, it compiled.......... |
| 04:23.52 | I_Died_Once | didnt know there is a debian/ubuntu bug that makes it unplayable |
| 04:24.15 | I_Died_Once | then when i try to exit, my computer completely freeses up |
| 04:24.20 | I_Died_Once | *feezes |
| 04:25.57 | trepan | Legoguy: no |
| 04:26.22 | Matt123 | there is fullscreen radar, weird |
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| 04:30.27 | Legoguy | trepan: ok, thanks anyway i guess :) is it something intended to be included in 2.1? |
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| 05:35.11 | spatialguru | hi all |
| 05:35.22 | spatialguru | anyone here compile bzflag on macbook (intel proc.) ? |
| 05:41.55 | TimRiker | spatialguru: try http://eidotter.de/~alexx/bzflag/ |
| 05:42.06 | spatialguru | hi TimRiker thx will look |
| 05:43.27 | spatialguru | Say, i see there is this concept of bzflag 'leagues' |
| 05:43.42 | TimRiker | I got an email from someone with that link. I've not tested it. |
| 05:43.45 | spatialguru | is there a league or team I can join and contribute my stats to? just curious what leagues are. |
| 05:44.00 | spatialguru | i had the darwin port install of bzflag running fine |
| 05:44.03 | spatialguru | for a week or so |
| 05:44.16 | spatialguru | then i think i installed a bunch of x11 sdks or something and now it stopped working :( |
| 05:44.23 | L4m3r | JeffM2501: ping |
| 05:45.01 | JeffM2501 | ? |
| 05:45.16 | L4m3r | could you approve a texture for me real quick? |
| 05:46.58 | JeffM2501 | sure |
| 05:47.07 | L4m3r | thanks :) |
| 05:48.05 | JeffM2501 | L4m3r, did you sumbit it already? |
| 05:48.18 | L4m3r | yeah, you already got it |
| 05:48.23 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 05:48.24 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 05:48.29 | JeffM2501 | cus I just denied one :) |
| 05:48.34 | L4m3r | thx again :) |
| 05:48.37 | JeffM2501 | don't think it was yours |
| 05:48.37 | L4m3r | heh |
| 05:48.44 | L4m3r | mine was that funky blue-gray one |
| 05:48.50 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 05:49.11 | L4m3r | triangular texture for an icosahedron ;) |
| 05:49.13 | JeffM2501 | one had what looked like a stock photo of a US tank thingy, and wanted to GPL it |
| 05:49.24 | L4m3r | heh |
| 05:50.56 | L4m3r | photos look out of place in maps |
| 05:51.05 | JeffM2501 | very |
| 05:51.24 | L4m3r | except maybe as backdrops for Louman's stuff |
| 05:52.17 | L4m3r | my crappy photoshop stuff and rough meshes fit together perfectly :P |
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| 12:36.34 | Mr_Molez | mikl: sup :P |
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| 12:49.02 | mikl | Mr_Molez: er, the sky ;) |
| 12:49.08 | mikl | or, in my case, a white ceiling and a lot of cables :) |
| 12:51.00 | PuMpErNiCkLe | ooo. cables |
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| 12:56.02 | Zenix | Hey, everyone! |
| 12:58.36 | PuMpErNiCkLe | hey, you |
| 12:59.05 | Zenix | "/shutdown is disabled by the server" is reported by my server, when I'm admin, when I type it in... |
| 12:59.10 | Zenix | Know why? |
| 13:01.47 | Zenix | I've looked through the variables list, the man pages, and I found no references to it being disabled |
| 13:07.31 | Zenix | 'ello? |
| 13:08.12 | Zenix | Please? |
| 13:09.55 | Chestal | never heard of it. Is this the exact message you get? which server version? any plugins? |
| 13:12.36 | Zenix | Exact message. Only when I type "/shutdown". I'm admin when I do it. BZFlag server 2.0.4.20060510-STABLE-linux-gnu-SDL (protocol 0026) No Plugins. (unless it came with the server...) |
| 13:16.02 | Zenix | How do you take a screenshot within the program? I could show you. |
| 13:16.28 | Chestal | F5 IIRC, I disabled it here, because it used to crash my ATI drivers |
| 13:17.30 | Zenix | I hit "F5" to get a screenshot within BZFlag? |
| 13:17.53 | PuMpErNiCkLe | yeah |
| 13:18.07 | Chestal | the command is called 'shutdownserver' btw., at least in current version |
| 13:27.46 | Mr_Molez | mikl: ceilings are cool |
| 13:28.03 | mikl | Mr_Molez: yes, decidedly :) |
| 13:29.41 | Mr_Molez | nothing better than a good ceiling |
| 13:30.39 | PuMpErNiCkLe | cables > ceiling |
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| 14:36.20 | Zenix | so the command is "shutdownserver" not "shutdown" |
| 14:36.29 | blast007 | yup |
| 14:36.32 | Zenix | Thnks |
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| 15:34.02 | Gnurdux | anyone know where in the server init stuff like worldsize gets set? |
| 15:40.27 | Gnurdux | how would i easily make it so that worldSize once the game starts becomes default |
| 15:42.10 | Mr_Molez | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:42.25 | Gnurdux | Mr_Molez, no, when it autogenerates the worldsize |
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| 15:42.30 | Mr_Molez | :-S |
| 15:42.31 | Matt123 | put _worldSise in map file i htin |
| 15:42.39 | Matt123 | i think |
| 15:42.42 | Gnurdux | i know, that would do it |
| 15:42.51 | Gnurdux | but sometimes it autogeneratesi t |
| 15:43.06 | Matt123 | dunno |
| 15:46.34 | Gnurdux | puytting it in the map file WILL do the job hto |
| 15:48.41 | Matt123 | should |
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| 15:49.17 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ |
| 15:49.45 | Gnurdux | it was MY idea to make stuff in map files and configs and var files all get saved in the defualts.. but Jeff broke my code, so that it doesnt work for var files |
| 15:50.00 | Gnurdux | but it never supported world files |
| 15:56.16 | Gnurdux | i mean -worldSize |
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| 16:52.36 | [dmp] | ~cvs |
| 16:52.37 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, cvs is concurrent versions systems. more info here http://www.cvshome.org/. The asterisk CVS is no more. Please see svn. |
| 16:52.41 | [dmp] | ~bzcvs |
| 16:52.43 | ibot | cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs.bzflag.org:/cvsroot/bzflag co -P bzflag (this is for HEAD ie: 2.1 see also bz20cvs) |
| 17:11.25 | spldart | Is that correct? |
| 17:11.52 | spldart | I thought it was @bzflag.sourceforge :confuzled: |
| 17:15.17 | JeffM2501 | both are right |
| 17:15.28 | JeffM2501 | cvz.bzflag.org points to the right place |
| 17:22.40 | spldart | ah.. thanks |
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| 18:15.15 | ggSh | hi all |
| 18:16.07 | blast007 | hello again :) |
| 18:16.29 | ggSh | hell blast007 :) my graphic card seems to work, but now i run into another error: firegl_FreeBuffer() failed |
| 18:16.54 | ggSh | sry i wanna say: hello blast007 |
| 18:16.59 | blast007 | hehe |
| 18:17.37 | uso | what influence does the availablity of SDL have to the bzflag server? should it have any? |
| 18:17.53 | DTRemenak | none |
| 18:18.00 | DTRemenak | bzfs does not link to sdl |
| 18:18.04 | ggSh | blast007: i everytime think that my probs are the hell ... |
| 18:18.36 | DTRemenak | mm, firegl...dontcha hate ati yet? :) |
| 18:18.40 | JeffM2501 | and people think I'm wrong for not buying ATI ;) |
| 18:18.45 | DTRemenak | heh :) |
| 18:18.46 | uso | why is there a HAVE_SDL in game/NetHandler.cxx, which is used by the server? |
| 18:18.55 | ggSh | yes, i hate it now |
| 18:19.46 | ggSh | that firegl_FreeBuffer() deals with my damn ati card ? |
| 18:20.10 | DTRemenak | firegl is an ati brand, so I'd say yes |
| 18:20.51 | uso | i get a strange behaviour, people going nr for others, but not for themself, cannot shoot others but can get killed |
| 18:21.20 | uso | i get a lot of 'uread() discard packet!' messages in the server log |
| 18:21.48 | uso | in such a case |
| 18:21.49 | TheRedBaron | uso - that happens quite a lot to me |
| 18:21.59 | TheRedBaron | especially, if i minimize bz to the desktop |
| 18:21.59 | DTRemenak | uso: those #if's seem to be for multithreaded stuff, but I suspect the logic is wrong |
| 18:22.32 | TheRedBaron | i can then spawn, everyone sees me as NR, but i'm driving around, I can shoot at tanks, cannot kill them, they cannot see me, but can kill me |
| 18:22.33 | DTRemenak | the discard packet messages are normal with network faults |
| 18:22.53 | DTRemenak | particularly some clients which have wierd firewall configurations will trigger a ton of them |
| 18:23.55 | uso | but the server still has the player slot, but does not find the player id with the iteration over the player list |
| 18:24.31 | DTRemenak | uso: that does not sound right. patches welcome? ;) |
| 18:24.50 | uso | i'm not sure where it goes wrong ;) |
| 18:26.19 | uso | either the player->closed or ->isMyUdpAddrPort seems to miss |
| 18:34.58 | uso | configure seems to ignore --without-sdl, still lists SDL as build option at the end of the configure run |
| 19:02.23 | uso | what does the client use the 3 ports for? the first port seems to be used for initiating a server connection, the second one if the connection is established, but what's the 3rd for? |
| 19:02.53 | uso | packages from the 3rd port are the ones which causing the log messages |
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| 19:51.30 | JeffM2501 | the 3rd may be for lan game scans |
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| 20:05.12 | [NP]Tangent | you know what bz needs |
| 20:06.02 | [NP]Tangent | in the server config, have some variables like SCORE_KILL (point for killing a tank), SCORE_TEAM_KILL (point for teamkilling_, SCORE_DIE (point for dying), and SCORE_SUICIDE |
| 20:06.07 | [NP]Tangent | and SCORE_CAP |
| 20:06.37 | [NP]Tangent | of course, negative values would take a point, and positive values would give a point |
| 20:07.08 | [NP]Tangent | another game, Armagetron, works like that, and it's really nice, because you can then emphasize certain parts of the gameplay |
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| 20:11.57 | blast007 | [NP]Tangent: version 2.1 could do that properly through a plugin |
| 20:12.21 | blast007 | each client in 2.0 tracks their own score, and only accepts score updates of other players |
| 20:12.26 | blast007 | 2.1 fixes that |
| 20:14.09 | CIA-6 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/ (12 files in 2 dirs): refactor help menus. |
| 20:15.20 | DTRemenak | blast007, JeffM2501: need to add a handful of new files to vc71. easy list to go by is http://bzflag.cvs.sourceforge.net/bzflag/bzflag/src/bzflag/Makefile.am?r1=2.29&r2=2.30 |
| 20:15.35 | DTRemenak | whoops |
| 20:15.49 | JeffM2501 | if blast dosnt' get it I'll get it later tonight |
| 20:15.59 | JeffM2501 | I'm in the middle of updating 90 DLLs |
| 20:17.16 | CIA-6 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/Makefile.am: headers are headers |
| 20:17.35 | DTRemenak | make that http://bzflag.cvs.sourceforge.net/bzflag/bzflag/src/bzflag/Makefile.am?r1=2.29&r2=2.31 |
| 20:18.32 | JeffM2501 | just into the bzflag prog? |
| 20:18.39 | *** join/#bzflag I_Died_Once (n=I_Died_O@c-69-136-41-111.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 20:18.52 | DTRemenak | yeah. cxx's go in the menus subfolder |
| 20:18.57 | JeffM2501 | k |
| 20:19.13 | DTRemenak | not that it really matters to me what folder you put them in in that project :) |
| 20:19.26 | JeffM2501 | VMM updates are melting... brain.... |
| 20:19.27 | DTRemenak | heh |
| 20:20.22 | JeffM2501 | building now |
| 20:20.56 | DTRemenak | I don't think I did anything that should break it |
| 20:21.06 | JeffM2501 | mostly to make sure I have them all ;) |
| 20:21.09 | DTRemenak | hehe :) |
| 20:21.31 | I_Died_Once | Before I start banging my head... I cannot get a 1.10 server going for the life of me, even with lots of -d's, the program just hangs |
| 20:21.47 | DTRemenak | I_Died_Once: any particular reason to run 1.10? |
| 20:21.58 | *** join/#bzflag Tropican8 (n=Tropican@4.23.226.238) |
| 20:21.59 | CIA-6 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/MSVC/VC71/bzflag.vcproj: help menu files |
| 20:21.59 | I_Died_Once | legacy server |
| 20:22.10 | DTRemenak | like I said, any particular reason? ;) |
| 20:22.26 | DTRemenak | 1.10 is vulnerable to even more cheats and attacks than 2.0 is |
| 20:22.30 | I_Died_Once | yeah, so we can have a 1.1 server available for the 1.10 clingers on |
| 20:22.57 | I_Died_Once | while we can |
| 20:23.07 | I_Died_Once | i can't even get it going on my local LAN |
| 20:23.44 | JeffM2501 | that's great .. it starts with an earthquake.. birds and snakes and airoplane... lenny bruce is not afraid... |
| 20:23.51 | I_Died_Once | it LOOKS (and I could be wrong) like its not hitting the internet and not communicating with the server list at all |
| 20:23.57 | JeffM2501 | you build it yourself? |
| 20:24.01 | I_Died_Once | I am a Hurricane |
| 20:24.02 | I_Died_Once | yeah |
| 20:24.15 | Tropican8 | Has anyone noticed that 1.10's hit detection seems more 'accurate' than 2.0's? |
| 20:24.19 | JeffM2501 | how far dos it get before it hangs? |
| 20:24.27 | I_Died_Once | same machine i built MoFo's 2.0.8 binary |
| 20:25.33 | JeffM2501 | so with gcc4? |
| 20:25.54 | DTRemenak | you need to build with gcc3, and as 32-bit |
| 20:26.02 | JeffM2501 | what he said ;) |
| 20:26.12 | DTRemenak | otherwise you will have Problems |
| 20:26.47 | I_Died_Once | bzflag.pastebin.ca/70141 |
| 20:27.02 | I_Died_Once | how do I specify what version of gcc to use? |
| 20:27.14 | DTRemenak | that looks like it's running |
| 20:27.31 | DTRemenak | can you not join it, or what? |
| 20:27.31 | I_Died_Once | yeah, but it just hangs |
| 20:27.40 | I_Died_Once | nope, i get error connecting to server |
| 20:28.27 | I_Died_Once | ...do I need to manually delete gcc4, then re-install gcc3? or is there a simple command? |
| 20:28.29 | DTRemenak | I_Died_Once: if you have gcc4 installed, you need to find out where you have gcc3 installed also. probably going to be called "gcc-3.3" or something |
| 20:28.47 | DTRemenak | no, you should be able to install them in parallel |
| 20:28.57 | I_Died_Once | locate gcc-3.3 ?? |
| 20:28.58 | DTRemenak | if your distro provides packages for both |
| 20:29.04 | DTRemenak | or something.... ;) |
| 20:29.21 | DTRemenak | could be gcc-3, or gcc-3.4, or gcc3, or gcc33, or... |
| 20:29.22 | I_Died_Once | the distro on the machine in question is suse 9.3 |
| 20:30.38 | DTRemenak | do gcc --version |
| 20:30.49 | DTRemenak | I think stock was 3.3.5 or something |
| 20:31.11 | DTRemenak | in which case you'd be ok, assuming you're not on amd64 |
| 20:31.39 | I_Died_Once | no amd64, and yeah, its 3.3.5 |
| 20:31.55 | DTRemenak | k, that's not the problem then |
| 20:33.25 | I_Died_Once | its at 69.136.41.111:4200 fwiw |
| 20:33.52 | blast007 | ~bzfquery 69.136.41.111:4200 |
| 20:34.08 | DTRemenak | blast007: bzfquery has been updated to 2.0 protocol |
| 20:34.17 | blast007 | aww ;) |
| 20:34.37 | DTRemenak | I_Died_Once: I get connection refused from telnet when trying to gonnect to that |
| 20:34.37 | I_Died_Once | i can switch binaries and succesfully run a 2.x server |
| 20:35.02 | DTRemenak | gonnect...sweet word. wonder if it means anything. |
| 20:35.12 | I_Died_Once | >udict gonnect |
| 20:35.19 | blast007 | I_Died_Once: wrong window ;D |
| 20:35.27 | I_Died_Once | ....heh |
| 20:36.21 | I_Died_Once | I re-created a new conf from the sample one given |
| 20:36.30 | DTRemenak | hmm, that machine isn't firewalled, is it? |
| 20:37.02 | I_Died_Once | it was, but i had the ports opened in them... then i manually stopped the firewall, still no dice |
| 20:37.04 | I_Died_Once | so no |
| 20:37.15 | DTRemenak | fyi 1.10 uses a two-port connect sequence that doesn't like firewalls. |
| 20:37.25 | I_Died_Once | the one on our server does the same thing, hangs up at the same exact place |
| 20:38.27 | *** join/#bzflag WolverineJrDUB (i=Alessio@d81-211-177-59.cust.tele2.it) |
| 20:38.27 | DTRemenak | can you connect to it from localhost? |
| 20:39.20 | I_Died_Once | machien has no client, no open gl |
| 20:39.36 | *** join/#bzflag Blue-Eyes (n=Blue@host100-145.pool8260.interbusiness.it) |
| 20:39.43 | DTRemenak | did it build bzadmin? |
| 20:39.53 | I_Died_Once | ok... i just started a server with no cong, just ./bzfs -d -d -d and i connected |
| 20:40.10 | DTRemenak | k, something's broken in your config |
| 20:40.14 | I_Died_Once | yeah |
| 20:47.34 | Tropican8 | How much BW does the 2.1 protocol use currently in comparison with 2.0? |
| 20:47.46 | JeffM2501 | bout the same I think |
| 20:47.50 | JeffM2501 | nothing major has changed |
| 20:47.59 | Tropican8 | :-( |
| 20:48.17 | JeffM2501 | but then it's not like ti's final |
| 20:48.24 | DTRemenak | bots use a lot less |
| 20:48.35 | JeffM2501 | when they work ;) |
| 20:48.39 | DTRemenak | heh |
| 20:48.42 | bryjen | s/when/if/ |
| 20:48.46 | JeffM2501 | right now they use 0 |
| 20:48.50 | DTRemenak | they've been tuponified |
| 20:48.53 | JeffM2501 | acutaly they use negitive |
| 20:48.59 | DTRemenak | I haven't tested them |
| 20:48.59 | JeffM2501 | since they kick you |
| 20:49.01 | Tropican8 | Well that's just because they're serverside.... |
| 20:49.09 | JeffM2501 | Tropican8, what? |
| 20:49.11 | JeffM2501 | no they arn't |
| 20:49.18 | Tropican8 | huh, in 2.1? |
| 20:49.21 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 20:49.24 | DTRemenak | not yet |
| 20:49.24 | JeffM2501 | same old bots |
| 20:49.27 | JeffM2501 | they are just busted |
| 20:49.36 | JeffM2501 | they try to share your player conteciton, and it dosn't work |
| 20:49.44 | JeffM2501 | server side bots are not fully implemented |
| 20:49.59 | *** join/#bzflag JBdiGriz (n=jbdigriz@206-15-67-2.static.twtelecom.net) |
| 20:49.59 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JBdiGriz] by ChanServ |
| 20:50.17 | Tropican8 | ah |
| 20:51.25 | JeffM2501 | there are a couple new messages too, so 2.1 may use ever so slightly more bandwith |
| 20:51.30 | JeffM2501 | but nothing realy measurable |
| 20:56.01 | ToughShooter | JeffM2501: Umm, I don't think 2.1 uses more or equal bandwidth right now :( |
| 20:56.15 | JeffM2501 | umm ok |
| 20:56.21 | ToughShooter | Global login makes server crashing in 2.1 |
| 20:56.28 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 20:56.30 | ToughShooter | So join and crash |
| 20:56.34 | JeffM2501 | it's busted in many ways |
| 20:57.00 | JeffM2501 | debug it and help fix it ;) |
| 20:57.19 | ToughShooter | Maybe I would rather wish it to be rewritten |
| 20:57.28 | WolverineJrDUB | i gtg bye |
| 20:57.33 | JeffM2501 | you think that will help it? |
| 20:57.39 | ToughShooter | No time to do that for me though |
| 20:58.00 | JeffM2501 | then it stays there |
| 20:58.13 | ToughShooter | Yes, sadly |
| 20:58.26 | JeffM2501 | I don't think it would crash on all OSs, cus DTR just checked in some changes to it |
| 20:58.34 | JeffM2501 | and he would have probably test ran it |
| 20:58.56 | DTRemenak | worked for me |
| 20:59.01 | JeffM2501 | why would you want to rewrite it? |
| 20:59.03 | DTRemenak | didnt' join a game though |
| 20:59.05 | JeffM2501 | what would you do difrent |
| 20:59.25 | ToughShooter | A lot of things are FPS-dependant |
| 20:59.33 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 20:59.39 | JeffM2501 | why not just fix them? |
| 21:00.01 | ToughShooter | I don't understand the code and it looks odd at some places |
| 21:00.08 | JeffM2501 | it is odd ;) |
| 21:00.22 | DTRemenak | it certainly is |
| 21:00.26 | JeffM2501 | and you think it woudl take you longer to learn it then to just remake it |
| 21:00.27 | ToughShooter | The whole hit algorithm makes me astonishing that it works "somehow" |
| 21:01.00 | JeffM2501 | would you write it all up from scratch? |
| 21:01.01 | ToughShooter | Connections need to be made to check if players drive through maps |
| 21:01.34 | ToughShooter | I don't think all is bad |
| 21:01.44 | JeffM2501 | how long do you think that would take you? |
| 21:01.54 | ToughShooter | The SDL idea looks neat :) |
| 21:02.20 | ToughShooter | Heh, that would take a looong time |
| 21:02.42 | JeffM2501 | so in reality your saying it has to be fixed |
| 21:02.47 | JeffM2501 | not rewriten |
| 21:02.56 | JeffM2501 | or at least rewriten in parts |
| 21:03.13 | ToughShooter | "refactoring" is the buzz word ;) |
| 21:03.18 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 21:03.35 | JeffM2501 | but with noone taking the time to refactor, it's pointles to wish |
| 21:04.10 | ToughShooter | I spent so much time on analysing the code what types of cheats are possible and that made me sad |
| 21:04.27 | JeffM2501 | it is a lan game |
| 21:04.33 | JeffM2501 | so it should not have been a big suprise |
| 21:04.52 | ToughShooter | The whole internet is a "LAN" |
| 21:05.02 | Gnurdux | ToughShooter, it WAS a lan game |
| 21:05.05 | Gnurdux | originally |
| 21:05.08 | DTRemenak | the internet is not a lan |
| 21:05.08 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, it still is |
| 21:05.10 | DTRemenak | it's a wan |
| 21:05.11 | bryjen | for very wide definitions of "Local" |
| 21:05.14 | Gnurdux | it started before the internet existed |
| 21:05.18 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, not true |
| 21:05.20 | DTRemenak | on a lan you can sock the guy next to you if he cheats ;) |
| 21:05.25 | JeffM2501 | leanr your facts ;) |
| 21:05.29 | Gnurdux | or before the internet existed for home users |
| 21:05.38 | Gnurdux | other than dialing into a mainframe |
| 21:05.39 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, best to just top why you are behind; |
| 21:05.44 | ToughShooter | DTRemenak: Punishing people physically may not be legal |
| 21:05.58 | DTRemenak | ToughShooter: ok, then you can disconnect them from your lan |
| 21:06.01 | JeffM2501 | also the latencys on a lan are usualy a LOT lower then a WAN |
| 21:06.02 | DTRemenak | you can't do that on the internet |
| 21:06.14 | JeffM2501 | hence why it has no lag comps |
| 21:06.18 | ToughShooter | It is not my LAN ;) |
| 21:06.23 | DTRemenak | lan is low-lag, high-bandwidth, close proximity to enforce social contracts |
| 21:06.23 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, one would hope so :P |
| 21:06.25 | JeffM2501 | and trust of the client |
| 21:06.34 | ToughShooter | local is the planed :) |
| 21:06.45 | ToughShooter | s/planed/planet |
| 21:06.57 | DTRemenak | I can't disconnect you from the internet if you cheat |
| 21:07.03 | JeffM2501 | bzflag work great when everyone has a ping of 10 ms ;) |
| 21:07.10 | DTRemenak | I can't look you in the eye and say "knock that off, jackass" |
| 21:07.26 | DTRemenak | it's global and relatively anonymous |
| 21:07.36 | DTRemenak | not local |
| 21:07.50 | JeffM2501 | when it was made, the network latency usualy fit within a frame time, so everyone had a state that was usualy within 1-2 frames of each other |
| 21:08.07 | JeffM2501 | the code still has a number of those asumptions |
| 21:08.38 | ToughShooter | What I want to say it may be better to make the people's view of their own tanks lag and compute all as it comes in inside the server |
| 21:08.54 | JeffM2501 | personaly I'd just port the gameplay over to an existing engine/framework |
| 21:09.13 | DTRemenak | ToughShooter: that is the plan |
| 21:09.17 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, we know that, "somone" has to code it ;) |
| 21:09.19 | trepan | JeffM2501: which parts are worth potring? the excellent gfx, net, snd? |
| 21:09.27 | JeffM2501 | trepan, the gameplay, tha'ts it |
| 21:09.35 | I_Died_Once | OK, it turns out to be my map |
| 21:09.37 | JeffM2501 | flags, what they do, etccc |
| 21:09.43 | JeffM2501 | that's all I'd save |
| 21:09.59 | trepan | ah, the excellent phy and state mgmt :) |
| 21:10.03 | JeffM2501 | and maybe the IDL, it's kinda cool |
| 21:10.06 | ToughShooter | I mean no one really seems to know how the hit zone looks in 3D |
| 21:10.12 | JeffM2501 | trepan, no, I'd replace that part too |
| 21:10.15 | JeffM2501 | just keep the basic rules |
| 21:10.25 | JeffM2501 | so basilcy not much ;) |
| 21:10.32 | JeffM2501 | no real code |
| 21:10.37 | trepan | no specific code to "port" for game rules |
| 21:10.42 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 21:10.44 | ToughShooter | The graphics as is are really good for playing |
| 21:10.49 | JeffM2501 | reimplement is a better word |
| 21:10.53 | spldart | Is that even an option or just being discussed to make a point? |
| 21:10.59 | ToughShooter | Though the 2.1 bullets look bad |
| 21:11.13 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, how would you know? you can't join a game ;) |
| 21:11.39 | ToughShooter | JeffM2501: I went to an older server, which worked |
| 21:11.45 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 21:11.48 | trepan | ToughShooter: just add batteries |
| 21:11.50 | JeffM2501 | well you can turn off the new shots |
| 21:12.14 | JeffM2501 | spldart, no solutions are being discussed |
| 21:12.18 | JeffM2501 | as there is no plan |
| 21:12.27 | ToughShooter | I know, but the flags look better with new graphics |
| 21:12.34 | spldart | IC |
| 21:12.46 | ToughShooter | The new bullets look cool from obs perspektive roaming |
| 21:12.47 | JeffM2501 | the code up an interface to turn them off seperate |
| 21:12.57 | ToughShooter | not so good while playing |
| 21:13.09 | JeffM2501 | some people like them |
| 21:13.20 | JeffM2501 | they are optional for that reason |
| 21:14.11 | ToughShooter | See, it is not really critical how the bullets look but checking for misbehaving tanks |
| 21:14.13 | JeffM2501 | tupone still in hungaray? |
| 21:14.27 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, sure, but noone wants to do the hard work |
| 21:14.33 | JeffM2501 | it's not like we asign stuff to people to do |
| 21:14.40 | *** part/#bzflag Tropican8 (n=Tropican@4.23.226.238) |
| 21:14.43 | JeffM2501 | and are skiping over the "important" things |
| 21:15.06 | JeffM2501 | you yourself have said your also unwilling/unable to do it |
| 21:15.12 | CIA-6 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/ (HelpInstructionsMenu.cxx HelpInstructionsMenu.h): HelpInstructionsMenu fonts are resized dynamically based on the longest localized string, so they aren't all cramped up in one corner. |
| 21:15.14 | DTRemenak | dang, that was easy once it was all refactored :) |
| 21:15.16 | JeffM2501 | others have similar reasons/excuses |
| 21:15.19 | ToughShooter | bug fixes ain't fun if the dev doesn't play the game |
| 21:15.40 | JeffM2501 | bug fixes aren't fun for anyone |
| 21:15.49 | DTRemenak | depends on what bugs ;) |
| 21:15.55 | JeffM2501 | but it still dosn't change the fact that noone wants to do his one |
| 21:15.56 | DTRemenak | and how sick the person is |
| 21:16.01 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 21:16.10 | JeffM2501 | we had the discussion on net proto changes |
| 21:16.20 | JeffM2501 | we were unable to get somone to do it |
| 21:16.24 | ToughShooter | What was when all those obvious cheaters came some months ago? |
| 21:16.41 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, how about you get to your point? |
| 21:16.56 | ToughShooter | It was lucky that not all people quit playing |
| 21:17.30 | DTRemenak | if people want to quit playing, it's fine with me |
| 21:17.57 | JeffM2501 | if noone is willing to make the code to fix the cheats, what other choice do they have? |
| 21:17.58 | ToughShooter | I obverve myself more and more asking me whether a bullet got through and enemy didn't explode, whether they drive a little bit fast, turn faster etc |
| 21:18.14 | JeffM2501 | ToughShooter, that's just looking at the known problem a lot |
| 21:18.16 | JeffM2501 | that dosn't fix it |
| 21:18.34 | JeffM2501 | staring at it won't make it magialy go away ;) |
| 21:18.44 | ToughShooter | I would like to but I don't know the code good enough, investigating would take all my time away from playing |
| 21:19.11 | JeffM2501 | so that then cancels out all that time observing |
| 21:19.20 | trepan | we know how to fix it, but we all have our reasons for not implementing it |
| 21:19.42 | JeffM2501 | if the only other option for players then is to quit, it's understandable |
| 21:21.11 | ToughShooter | I love the game but those missing cheat checks and legacy dependings are taking some fun away |
| 21:21.25 | JeffM2501 | you keep saying the same things |
| 21:21.27 | *** join/#bzflag A_Meteorite (n=daniel@adsl-75-15-143-116.dsl.snlo01.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:22.17 | DTRemenak | ToughShooter: is the missing fun a greater pain than the pain of fixing it? if so, fix it. if not, keep playing, with reduced fun. it's all economics. |
| 21:24.12 | ToughShooter | I have no real start looking where to fix and it would be all rather big changes, I suppose. I never did big changes in a programming language I don't use frequently. |
| 21:24.59 | ToughShooter | It could mess the old code up totally :/ |
| 21:25.24 | DTRemenak | ToughShooter: the really nice thing about cvs is that it doesn't matter if you mess old code up :) |
| 21:25.29 | JeffM2501 | so then for you it comes out as nothing |
| 21:26.14 | ToughShooter | DTRemenak: True but having a lot of revert messages in CIA could be not so nice |
| 21:26.32 | DTRemenak | ToughShooter: branches means you don't have to revert |
| 21:26.37 | JeffM2501 | umm don't commit untill you are sure it's good |
| 21:26.40 | DTRemenak | you just abandon the branch if it doesn't work out |
| 21:26.54 | DTRemenak | yes, you totally did :) |
| 21:27.17 | DTRemenak | and nobody cared, except when you went crazy with the cheese whiz on HEAD ;) |
| 21:27.19 | JeffM2501 | there is some good code to pull from that |
| 21:27.25 | trepan | JeffM2501: "don't commit untill you are sure it's good", bz heresy? |
| 21:27.42 | I_Died_Once | finally |
| 21:27.43 | DTRemenak | yeah, that's on my todo list too |
| 21:27.48 | JeffM2501 | just cus I make the mistakes, dosn't mean I don't know they are mistakes ;) |
| 21:27.59 | I_Died_Once | not that anyone cares, but theres a new 1.10 server on the list |
| 21:28.09 | I_Died_Once | the passion of the flag capture: red vs blue |
| 21:28.09 | spldart | oh? |
| 21:28.11 | JeffM2501 | joy and rapture ;) |
| 21:28.13 | DTRemenak | pretty much nobody cares :) |
| 21:30.11 | spldart | interesting to see that map on 1.10 |
| 21:31.17 | *** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org) |
| 21:31.29 | JeffM2501 | was the ensign in a red shirt? |
| 21:31.40 | DTRemenak | hope not, he'd end up dead |
| 21:31.58 | DTRemenak | hehehe |
| 21:32.08 | JeffM2501 | what happens if a bunch of red shirts get into a firefight with stormtroopers? |
| 21:32.15 | DTRemenak | everybody dies |
| 21:32.18 | *** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (n=Blue@host100-145.pool8260.interbusiness.it) |
| 21:32.24 | JeffM2501 | how? the troopers can't hit anything? |
| 21:32.34 | DTRemenak | random fire |
| 21:32.38 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 21:32.40 | bryjen | lotsa of ricochet dead |
| 21:32.42 | DTRemenak | the redshirts can't hit anything either |
| 21:32.45 | bryjen | s/dead/death |
| 21:32.54 | JeffM2501 | they'd have to shot themselves |
| 21:32.57 | DTRemenak | remember, the redshirts can be hit just randomly and die |
| 21:33.01 | A-Delusion | batlestar galactica ceylons swwop in |
| 21:33.08 | DTRemenak | nobody has to shoot at them :) |
| 21:33.13 | JeffM2501 | A-Delusion, that's just stupid ;) |
| 21:33.27 | DTRemenak | not to mention crazily typoed |
| 21:33.44 | spldart | You would have some good 'stock' footage for a random sci fi movie in the future |
| 21:33.46 | DTRemenak | "batlestar"..."ceylons"..."swwop"... |
| 21:33.48 | JeffM2501 | and if it was BSG boomer...that'd be fine ;) |
| 21:34.14 | A-Delusion | bidi bidi bidi |
| 21:34.27 | spldart | Robotech carrier 'folds' in |
| 21:34.32 | DTRemenak | A-Delusion: write in hebrew or arabic much? |
| 21:34.42 | A-Delusion | no. |
| 21:34.54 | DTRemenak | then whatcha need bidi for? ;) |
| 21:35.10 | spldart | Duck Rodgers pft pft |
| 21:35.28 | JeffM2501 | then does god show up with his starship? |
| 21:35.42 | spldart | He's sitting back laughing |
| 21:35.44 | DTRemenak | why does god need a starship? |
| 21:35.49 | JeffM2501 | for partys |
| 21:35.56 | JeffM2501 | the ladies LOVE starships |
| 21:35.58 | DTRemenak | sweet, I'd totally go to those parties |
| 21:35.59 | spldart | To float in the bathtub |
| 21:36.03 | bryjen | ~DTRemenak++ |
| 21:36.23 | spldart | squeeky squeeky |
| 21:36.48 | bryjen | the star trek line |
| 21:36.51 | DTRemenak | ah, ok :) |
| 21:37.02 | JeffM2501 | awww.. and I don't get one for the setup? |
| 21:37.03 | bryjen | and on that note: why does god need a bath? |
| 21:37.08 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501 set me up for it though |
| 21:37.15 | DTRemenak | and he types faster than I do, too |
| 21:37.22 | JeffM2501 | I mean that was a T-ball class setup ;) |
| 21:37.34 | DTRemenak | ~JeffM2501++ |
| 21:37.41 | JeffM2501 | not that I need anymore |
| 21:37.45 | spldart | Don't point out holes in my plot :-0 :-) |
| 21:37.48 | DTRemenak | ~karma JeffM2501 |
| 21:37.48 | ibot | jeffm2501 has karma of 332 |
| 21:37.57 | DTRemenak | up a bit from 221 |
| 21:38.02 | DTRemenak | 111 up, in fact |
| 21:38.03 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 21:38.05 | DTRemenak | interesting |
| 21:38.13 | JeffM2501 | well I was told that everyone hates me |
| 21:38.20 | DTRemenak | heh |
| 21:38.20 | JeffM2501 | so I figure karma is like golf |
| 21:38.26 | DTRemenak | ~karma CBG |
| 21:38.26 | ibot | cbg has karma of -324 |
| 21:38.32 | DTRemenak | he's winning, in that case |
| 21:38.35 | JeffM2501 | people must LOVE him |
| 21:38.46 | spldart | heh |
| 21:39.16 | spldart | So neutral karma is EXTREME indifference? |
| 21:39.18 | JeffM2501 | you know me, I just live to piss people off |
| 21:39.34 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501: that's why you admin the forums, right? :) |
| 21:39.39 | JeffM2501 | totaly |
| 21:39.47 | JeffM2501 | I get paid per curse |
| 21:40.19 | DTRemenak | wow |
| 21:40.30 | DTRemenak | I know a couple people who got you the big bucks, then |
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| 21:40.37 | bryjen | perhaps its that the people who'd go around saying everyone hates you, just because they do, hate you ;) |
| 21:40.38 | JeffM2501 | how do you think I could aford my new case |
| 21:40.41 | DTRemenak | wondering if you got anything for mikeeusa's post though :) |
| 21:40.54 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, your shooting holes in my story ;) |
| 21:40.59 | DTRemenak | no cursing there, but he's praying for us to die in a car crash, that's gotta be worth something :) |
| 21:41.01 | JeffM2501 | my truck |
| 21:41.09 | spldart | lol |
| 21:41.18 | JeffM2501 | no no, he said he'd come murder me with his bow |
| 21:41.29 | JeffM2501 | and his state was going to "kick my state's ass" |
| 21:41.33 | DTRemenak | ah, that was a good one too |
| 21:41.42 | bryjen | strangle you with the line, or knock you over the head with it? |
| 21:41.49 | JeffM2501 | bryjen, I don't know |
| 21:41.50 | DTRemenak | ~bryjen++ |
| 21:42.05 | bryjen | as there was no mention of arrows... |
| 21:42.19 | JeffM2501 | well he's not allowed near sharp objects... so... |
| 21:42.22 | DTRemenak | haha |
| 21:42.25 | bryjen | hehe |
| 21:42.43 | JeffM2501 | his actions on the debian list were the best tho |
| 21:43.11 | DTRemenak | heh, he just got laughed off of it though |
| 21:43.27 | JeffM2501 | banned actualy |
| 21:43.33 | JeffM2501 | I found out later |
| 21:43.36 | DTRemenak | yeah |
| 21:43.45 | JeffM2501 | he submited a petion to prevent women from using linux |
| 21:43.50 | DTRemenak | got himself banned from freshmeat too |
| 21:44.00 | DTRemenak | we're not the only people to ban him |
| 21:44.08 | JeffM2501 | at least there is a great posibility that he will never breed |
| 21:44.12 | DTRemenak | haha |
| 21:44.20 | DTRemenak | i'd be worried if he did |
| 21:44.35 | DTRemenak | worried for her, that is |
| 21:44.52 | JeffM2501 | oh $5 says he's in canada geting his same gender marage in 10 years |
| 21:45.06 | trepan | we don't want him |
| 21:45.11 | ruskie | who who? |
| 21:45.12 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 21:46.20 | JeffM2501 | ruskie, just an idiot from a while ago, read up, he's not worth futher discussion |
| 21:47.21 | ruskie | yeah just did... |
| 21:47.29 | ruskie | very amusing... |
| 21:48.15 | ruskie | it's incredible what ppl are still around today... |
| 21:50.55 | ruskie | wrt: petition... I think he confused geek with gay ;) |
| 21:51.19 | ruskie | anyway off for a shower before I melt... |
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| 21:56.59 | DTRemenak | nice, visual studio just crashed :S |
| 22:00.13 | JeffM2501 | you see the price on the 3800X2 and SLI mobo DTRemenak ? |
| 22:00.45 | DTRemenak | nope |
| 22:00.49 | JeffM2501 | 278$ |
| 22:00.52 | DTRemenak | sweet |
| 22:01.00 | DTRemenak | guess the price war is kicking in |
| 22:01.04 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 22:01.14 | DTRemenak | yay :) |
| 22:01.46 | JeffM2501 | and a decent price on a PCI-E 6500 |
| 22:03.26 | ruskie | sleep |
| 22:07.41 | *** part/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@63.147.94.149) |
| 22:24.44 | CIA-6 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/HelpInstructionsMenu.cxx: when scaling, start big and get small, instead of vice versa, so that long lines of text fit correctly when using unscaled or tiny fonts |
| 22:25.10 | DTRemenak | now to see if I can switch out of lithuanian... |
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| 22:50.27 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak|RDP] by ChanServ |
| 22:58.10 | [NP]Tangent | alright, now this time limit thing has always confused me a bit |
| 22:58.46 | [NP]Tangent | if I set a time limit, and also set the game to reset, does that mean that everyone is booted off? or does it just say which team won, then resets the scores and continues? |
| 22:59.04 | A-Delusion | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:59.16 | JeffM2501 | and that boots everyone off |
| 22:59.32 | A-Delusion | most users of a time limit also use a rotation script |
| 23:00.08 | [NP]Tangent | I should do a rotation thing |
| 23:00.10 | [NP]Tangent | ah well |
| 23:00.13 | [NP]Tangent | when I get more maps, perhaps |
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| 23:00.17 | [NP]Tangent | hey that rhymes |
| 23:00.30 | [NP]Tangent | oh, |
| 23:00.37 | [NP]Tangent | and what about if I set a team score limit? |
| 23:00.42 | [NP]Tangent | does that do the same thing as a time limit? |
| 23:01.32 | JeffM2501 | anything that "ends the game" does the same thing |
| 23:02.57 | [NP]Tangent | well, that's just poor design, isn't it? :P |
| 23:03.03 | [NP]Tangent | I'll work on making a rotation |
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| 23:06.05 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak|RDP] by ChanServ |
| 23:12.15 | TD-Linux | ~say hi |
| 23:12.16 | ibot | hi |
| 23:12.19 | TD-Linux | ~literal hi |
| 23:12.21 | ibot | "hi" is "<REPLY>hello, $nick" |
| 23:12.30 | TD-Linux | ~literal hi $1 |
| 23:12.33 | ibot | Many greetings, $1, most strange traveller, to this IRCdom of plenty. |
| 23:12.40 | TD-Linux | errr |
| 23:12.49 | TD-Linux | ~literal say |
| 23:12.50 | ibot | "say" is "<reply> say what?" |
| 23:12.53 | JeffM2501 | perhaps you could inteogate the bot in /msg ;) |
| 23:12.57 | TD-Linux | I suppose :) |
| 23:17.01 | [NP]Tangent | ~slap JeffM2501 |
| 23:17.03 | ibot | ACTION slaps JeffM2501, keep your grubby fingers to yourself! |
| 23:17.06 | JeffM2501 | ? |
| 23:17.07 | [NP]Tangent | :D |
| 23:17.14 | [NP]Tangent | I had no idea that was even a trigger |
| 23:17.18 | [NP]Tangent | I just randomly typed it |
| 23:17.22 | JeffM2501 | the bot knows many things |
| 23:17.30 | [NP]Tangent | it's a smart bot, I see |
| 23:17.42 | Gnurdux | ~lart Gnurdux |
| 23:17.48 | Gnurdux | ~lart ibot |
| 23:17.54 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, perhaps botpark |
| 23:17.57 | Gnurdux | ok |
| 23:18.06 | JeffM2501 | that was not an invitation for bot abbuse |
| 23:18.47 | Gnurdux | why do you PUT the bot in here if you dont like its awesome functions? |
| 23:19.04 | JeffM2501 | we didn't |
| 23:19.10 | JeffM2501 | the bot is shared over many channels |
| 23:19.13 | JeffM2501 | like 60 |
| 23:19.23 | I_Died_Once | the bot servers it purposes |
| 23:19.27 | JeffM2501 | in other channels ( like #botpark) it's ok |
| 23:19.39 | I_Died_Once | ~bzfquery 216.55.160.43:4200 |
| 23:19.50 | JeffM2501 | that is the main reason it is here |
| 23:20.26 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, why dont you get Tim to disable allf of the unnecesary commands in this channel |
| 23:20.46 | JeffM2501 | because it's usualy ok to just ask people to not be anoying ;) |
| 23:20.58 | Gnurdux | lol true |
| 23:21.10 | JeffM2501 | not every problem has a techincal solution |
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