| 00:11.28 | *** join/#bzflag beanpole (n=beanieme@ip68-99-16-127.om.om.cox.net) |
| 00:19.08 | TheRedBaron | KCI |
| 00:19.13 | TheRedBaron | Keyboard Chair Interface |
| 00:19.32 | L4m3r | no way, I got it to work |
| 00:19.45 | L4m3r | in linux, even |
| 00:19.57 | L4m3r | dual-screened bzflag! :P |
| 00:26.45 | *** join/#bzflag TheRedBaron (n=Kalen@c-68-35-238-65.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 00:29.17 | spldart | SCHWEEEEEEEEEETT!!! |
| 00:29.49 | L4m3r | with a stock client, even. |
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| 00:30.23 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v L4m3r] by ChanServ |
| 00:31.35 | TheRedBaron | i missed the link :( |
| 00:31.59 | Winny | TheRedBaron: don't think you did |
| 00:32.02 | spldart | ZZ ... ZZZ .... ZZZ .. ZZ... Z |
| 00:32.07 | Winny | or I didn't see it either.. |
| 00:33.41 | L4m3r | eh? |
| 00:33.48 | L4m3r | I'm gonna post some shots to the forums |
| 00:34.20 | Winny | uhoh |
| 00:34.40 | Winny | be prepared for "lul how did u du dat its so cul lol!!11` :) :I :O :E :D :S:S:S" |
| 00:34.51 | L4m3r | it's not that difficult |
| 00:35.05 | Winny | hasn't stopped 'em before ;) |
| 00:36.13 | L4m3r | is there no way to open a hidden folder with gimp? gah GTK sucks |
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| 00:55.08 | L4m3r | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=12069 |
| 00:55.54 | Winny | nice |
| 00:56.07 | L4m3r | radar would be better on the right, but oh well :P |
| 00:56.16 | Winny | except for the horrible jittery camera :p |
| 00:56.28 | spldart | That's right up there with my 12 foot projected bzflag png!!! LOL |
| 00:56.31 | L4m3r | yeah, it blows |
| 00:56.47 | Winny | CRT ick |
| 00:56.51 | L4m3r | yup |
| 00:57.05 | L4m3r | it'd be nice to stick the CRT far away, and use the radar up close |
| 00:57.06 | Constitution | is that a Zune? |
| 00:57.20 | L4m3r | I wish |
| 00:57.24 | L4m3r | Zen Vision:M |
| 00:57.37 | L4m3r | gotta run, enjoy :P |
| 00:57.44 | Winny | bye |
| 00:57.45 | L4m3r | will add more info later, maybe |
| 00:58.07 | spldart | Kaplau |
| 01:05.17 | brlcad | jeez, *now* the freaking caffeine kicks in... |
| 01:07.34 | a_meteorite | I had some strong stuff this morning, lasted a few hours |
| 01:08.02 | a_meteorite | I need to calm down while under the influence of caffeine, I bet people at school thought I was high |
| 01:08.10 | a_meteorite | I start talking really fast and make no sense |
| 01:08.59 | spldart | Always mix large doses of caffiene with some donuts.. slows absorbtion and fuels the rush... But watch out for that crash |
| 01:09.35 | Macrosoft | a_meteorite: i guy i work with smoked some sage, and he started running around wearing shrink wrap, and was shaking up a bottle of ginger ale to spray people with :D |
| 01:09.37 | a_meteorite | I just needed something to wake me up, I should have stuck with the one cup of green tea (green tea and black coffee probably isn't a good caffeine combo) |
| 01:09.37 | brlcad | i had a decent dose before a long hard workout .. and it started kicking in right after I finished showering |
| 01:09.44 | brlcad | now I'm kinda jittery |
| 01:09.57 | a_meteorite | heh I get that too |
| 01:10.10 | brlcad | and tinglie |
| 01:10.29 | a_meteorite | not gotten to that stage yet, I'd be afraid of a heart attack.. lol |
| 01:11.10 | Macrosoft | bbl, changing heatsink |
| 01:11.29 | spldart | ooOOoo... a delicate operation... POP... cracked die |
| 01:12.41 | Winny | better then online gambling ;) |
| 01:12.46 | JeffM | indeed |
| 01:13.01 | JeffM | that's what he built for me after I mentioned that I'd already purchased an RC kit |
| 01:13.37 | JeffM | that's techicnly the outside of his house |
| 01:13.48 | spldart | But I love rc :) |
| 01:13.52 | JeffM | it's a premanufactured home in arizona |
| 01:14.05 | JeffM | and tha'ts the back end of the room that was tacked onto one side |
| 01:30.20 | blast007 | man, I miss all the good discussions ;) reading all the scrollback for the server list interface |
| 01:31.30 | blast007 | one thing that would be interesting is, instead of choosing your team before you hit "Join", choose it after join (and join initially as an observer) |
| 01:31.32 | brlcad | random columns every time the server list menu is selected! |
| 01:31.42 | blast007 | that way you can see who is online, and join teams accordingly |
| 01:32.15 | blast007 | and 2.99.x protocol already has the ability to change teams on the fly |
| 01:32.26 | blast007 | I haven't tested it much though ;) |
| 01:32.33 | blast007 | just wrote a hackish command quick |
| 01:32.41 | a_meteorite | ooh, team changing on the fly allows for lots of cool things |
| 01:32.45 | blast007 | yup |
| 01:33.02 | inchworm | hehe, can you do it while holding a team flag :E |
| 01:33.02 | blast007 | I think I even changed from observer to a team |
| 01:33.09 | blast007 | inchworm: probably |
| 01:33.15 | blast007 | the command I had was minimal |
| 01:33.35 | blast007 | didn't kill you after you ran it, or just did something like "On the next spawn, you will be XXX color" |
| 01:33.36 | inchworm | i can see the joys of punk kids on servers now... |
| 01:33.38 | blast007 | it was just instant |
| 01:34.06 | inchworm | flag running to a whole new level :) |
| 01:34.27 | a_meteorite | if you make a plugin to do that :) |
| 01:35.52 | blast007 | can't recall if the API has a function to do that |
| 01:36.05 | blast007 | hmm, tutorial servers |
| 01:36.06 | blast007 | 16:02:56 <+Erroneous> a tutorial would work fine. the idea would be to spawn a local server for it |
| 01:36.09 | blast007 | 16:03:13 <+Erroneous> not dump all the newbies into a single server |
| 01:36.44 | blast007 | local server is one option, though another option would be to modify bzfs to have different "sectors" or areas, and put each player into their own area |
| 01:37.14 | blast007 | once they complete the tutorial, if there are more than one player online, throw them into a battlefield together |
| 01:37.43 | blast007 | that's also the main way that I see "trans-server teleporters" being implemented |
| 01:37.55 | inchworm | oh dear.. |
| 01:38.00 | blast007 | not really trans-server, but just teleporting from one area on the server to another |
| 01:38.14 | blast007 | same connection, same process, just a different zone |
| 01:38.18 | inchworm | ahh |
| 01:38.28 | inchworm | how would one determin newb status? |
| 01:38.58 | inchworm | because someone install on a new box, and maybe registering a new nick, may not in fact be new... |
| 01:39.01 | blast007 | areas would enable you to have more players on a single server as well, since players in an area would only receive player updates from that area |
| 01:39.12 | blast007 | inchworm: well, they would join the tutorial server on their own |
| 01:39.13 | inchworm | hmm |
| 01:39.19 | inchworm | ahh ok |
| 01:39.45 | inchworm | zones do sound interesting... |
| 01:40.06 | inchworm | especially if the bot logic expands... |
| 01:40.50 | inchworm | i'm thinking you have a "leveled" server where a team goes zone by zone, where each subsecuent zone has harder/more bots to blast... |
| 01:41.09 | inchworm | and getting killed drops back a zone.. |
| 01:41.48 | inchworm | i suppose you could make such a map even now... with a large map and teleporters... |
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| 01:44.24 | Constitution | ~donny_baker++ |
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| 01:46.21 | Winny | ~donnny_baker++ |
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| 02:09.47 | Winny | ~dns 84.119.44.242 |
| 02:09.53 | Winny | hmmm...... |
| 02:10.04 | Winny | ~dns 84.119.62.10 |
| 02:10.08 | Winny | weird. |
| 02:10.48 | Macrosoft | Winny: does it respond to pings? |
| 02:11.06 | Winny | appears to have no DNS. |
| 02:11.11 | Winny | but he was cheating on my server |
| 02:11.22 | blast007 | Winny: use 'nslookup' and 'whois' |
| 02:11.24 | blast007 | great tools |
| 02:11.35 | blast007 | no reverse DNS |
| 02:13.09 | Macrosoft | Winny: whois says its in australia |
| 02:13.22 | spldart | nslookup 68.87.85.98 |
| 02:14.05 | spldart | ~nslookup 68.87.85.98 |
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| 02:14.28 | spldart | ~whois 68.87.85.98 |
| 02:16.26 | blast007 | spldart: I mean on the linux terminal ;) |
| 02:18.33 | Macrosoft | brb, switching |
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| 02:32.23 | F687s | why don't we have a server for all of the vets and non-n00bs to hang out at? |
| 02:32.45 | JeffM | who is this "we" you speak of? |
| 02:33.09 | F687s | I mean, why couldn't there be? |
| 02:33.30 | JeffM | there could be |
| 02:33.35 | blast007 | F687s: make one |
| 02:33.41 | blast007 | or pay me to make one |
| 02:33.59 | F687s | blast007: I thought of making a mapchange that hosts classic maps and servers. |
| 02:34.17 | JeffM | then there ya go |
| 02:34.40 | blast007 | I was on the Spirals map yesterday |
| 02:34.51 | blast007 | it would have been fun if there wasn't Wings flags and tons of jitter... |
| 02:35.58 | F687s | I don't know, it seems like a lot of maps are overrun by "unpleasant people" |
| 02:37.49 | JeffM | how do you plan on filtering them out? |
| 02:38.15 | F687s | JeffM: Rule #1: only allow verified people to spawn. |
| 02:38.44 | F687s | JeffM: Rule #2: Okay, I'm kinda stuck after that... |
| 02:41.27 | inchworm | F687s: Thumper_ has tried that before more than once... |
| 02:41.40 | F687s | and what happened? |
| 02:41.54 | inchworm | number of players alway dropped to a trickle... |
| 02:42.08 | JeffM | I think that's what he wants |
| 02:42.18 | inchworm | could be :) |
| 02:43.02 | inchworm | cause if he coges reg only... that's what he will get... unless he is the most uber map maker ever and nobody copied his map and ran it on another server |
| 02:43.23 | inchworm | coges??? goes... |
| 02:43.36 | inchworm | wow, little inchworm... you are messed up |
| 02:44.02 | JeffM | if you had read ist fist line, he wanted a server to get rid of "n00bs" |
| 02:44.29 | F687s | and I meant running classic maps like HiX and Overlord and all those maps that look "plain" nowadays |
| 02:44.54 | inchworm | F687s: might check with CBG.. i think he also had a similar goal at one point... |
| 02:45.12 | inchworm | JeffM: agreed :) |
| 02:45.54 | F687s | inchworm: to make a sanctuary for people with a brain, or to systematically kill all idiots? |
| 02:46.15 | inchworm | F687s: to host older maps |
| 02:47.03 | inchworm | F687s: come to a norang admin war... 8 admin out of 10-15 players seems to work well :) |
| 02:47.57 | F687s | inchworm: huh.... */kick inchworm "Who's your daddy!"* |
| 02:48.12 | inchworm | that wouldn't be me... |
| 02:48.57 | inchworm | "Who's your daddy" seems to be.. pathetically lame these days... |
| 02:49.19 | inchworm | was he registered? |
| 02:49.31 | inchworm | or am i missing something? |
| 02:50.30 | F687s | meh, forget it... |
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| 05:54.27 | JeffM | L4m3r: dude your camera sucks |
| 05:56.32 | JeffM | blast007 you arround? |
| 06:01.06 | brlcad | heh |
| 06:03.58 | JeffM | actuly goes down to a 27k patch |
| 06:04.14 | JeffM | once you get rid of the object files |
| 06:05.21 | JeffM | too bad it's useless code, can't be put into trunk |
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| 07:47.32 | Macrosoft | brb, reboot |
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| 10:49.01 | Constitution | ~JeffM++ |
| 10:54.33 | praetorian | mm |
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| 17:59.12 | JeffM | Constitution, it's very easy for plug-ins to modify spawn postions |
| 18:12.11 | Constitution | that's what I thought... couldn't remember for sure though |
| 18:12.23 | JeffM | there is an event that is called that passes you the postion |
| 18:12.25 | JeffM | you can change it |
| 18:12.27 | JeffM | and it'll use that |
| 18:12.35 | JeffM | was one of the first events :) |
| 18:12.45 | Constitution | okay cool |
| 18:13.19 | JeffM | after I did the world weapon and cap code, airspawn was the first plug-in IIRC |
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| 18:30.41 | JeffM | Constitution, and you could do the stealth SW thing in trunk right now |
| 18:30.46 | JeffM | with shot types |
| 18:32.06 | Constitution | ah |
| 18:32.21 | JeffM | just set the shot type for the tank on flag pickup |
| 18:32.45 | JeffM | while allowing for some cool thigns, sadly it also allows for abominations :( |
| 18:33.11 | Constitution | that would change the shot type from the user's perspective as well? |
| 18:33.19 | JeffM | yeah |
| 18:33.28 | JeffM | that's the entire point of the enhancment |
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| 18:33.33 | L4m3r | you can do some special combos in 2.0 ;) |
| 18:33.43 | JeffM | to send the shot message to the client so everyone sees it |
| 18:33.47 | L4m3r | Superstealth... ST+IB :P |
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| 18:33.58 | JeffM | so that you don't have the deiscrepeancy like L4m3r seems to have loved ;) |
| 18:34.09 | JeffM | L4m3r, yeah but the player with ST dosn't see the shot as IB |
| 18:34.26 | JeffM | Constitution, it's also so you can do a default shot type with out a flag |
| 18:34.41 | Constitution | great |
| 18:34.43 | JeffM | so say give everyone MG by defalt |
| 18:34.43 | L4m3r | JeffM: yeah, but the behavior is exactly the same so it doesn't really matter |
| 18:34.49 | JeffM | or give people PZ for the zombie stuff |
| 18:35.05 | Constitution | if( username == Constitution ) shotType = "Laser"; |
| 18:35.18 | JeffM | Constitution, it woudl be sadly that easy |
| 18:35.25 | JeffM | tho it's an enumeration |
| 18:35.42 | Constitution | wasn't there going to be a JeffWins flag? ;) |
| 18:35.45 | L4m3r | this should make handicaps a little more interesting |
| 18:35.51 | JeffM | don't even need a flag ;) |
| 18:36.27 | Erroneous | and with custom flags, you can now make your own flags with mixed-and-matched existing effects. scary, eh? |
| 18:36.36 | JeffM | indeed |
| 18:36.40 | Constitution | guided laser geno, ftw |
| 18:36.47 | L4m3r | >_> |
| 18:36.49 | JeffM | tho you can't give not shot effects to people |
| 18:36.52 | JeffM | and you can't guide laser |
| 18:36.56 | JeffM | yet |
| 18:37.00 | Erroneous | heh, yet |
| 18:37.08 | L4m3r | you could tweak the shot to aim it for them |
| 18:37.14 | Constitution | well maybe guided super geno, then |
| 18:37.14 | JeffM | well with server side shot updates, all shot strats can go server side |
| 18:37.26 | JeffM | geno laser |
| 18:37.31 | JeffM | super laser |
| 18:37.53 | JeffM | super, invible, geno, are mutualy exclusive |
| 18:37.59 | JeffM | and a couple others |
| 18:38.26 | Erroneous | geno is easy to simulate server-side |
| 18:38.27 | Constitution | well I guess you could emulate geno just by killing everyone |
| 18:38.37 | JeffM | IIRC the shot types are, normal, laser, SW, GM, and theif. |
| 18:38.44 | JeffM | yeah geno is fully server side now. |
| 18:38.49 | Erroneous | theif is a kind of laser |
| 18:38.56 | JeffM | it has a difrent shot graphic |
| 18:39.08 | JeffM | they use the same strat tho |
| 18:39.12 | Erroneous | yeah, but the same behavior |
| 18:39.14 | Erroneous | yeah |
| 18:39.26 | Erroneous | SB is different if you count graphics |
| 18:39.27 | JeffM | it was simpler to split them |
| 18:39.28 | L4m3r | theoretically, we could separate the bolt type and manipulate the shot properties with a bitmask |
| 18:39.55 | Erroneous | patches welcome? |
| 18:40.04 | L4m3r | :P |
| 18:40.08 | JeffM | L4m3r, yeah that would be the next step, seperate the graphic from the strat |
| 18:40.10 | Erroneous | patches to fix the server are welcome too :) |
| 18:40.12 | L4m3r | I don't need no stinking patches! |
| 18:40.20 | JeffM | and move all the hit responce to the server. |
| 18:40.24 | Erroneous | 'cause none of that new stuff is testable until it gets fixed |
| 18:40.37 | L4m3r | oh, it's broken-broken? :( |
| 18:40.40 | JeffM | well I can't fix that at work ;) |
| 18:40.43 | JeffM | yeah |
| 18:40.50 | JeffM | serve dosnt' send the correct shizzle |
| 18:40.55 | Erroneous | sure you can...bzfs+bzadmin dupes the problem, right? :) |
| 18:41.09 | JeffM | I'd have to get curl |
| 18:41.11 | JeffM | curses |
| 18:41.18 | JeffM | I was going to look at it tonight |
| 18:41.23 | L4m3r | ok, class over, gotta bail |
| 18:41.26 | L4m3r | bbl :P |
| 18:41.27 | Erroneous | can run bzadmin w/o curses |
| 18:41.31 | JeffM | november 15 had good stuff right? |
| 18:41.35 | Erroneous | yeah |
| 18:41.45 | Erroneous | your checkins started early december iirc |
| 18:42.08 | Erroneous | and sometime in there it broke (I wasn't testing thoroughly) |
| 18:43.13 | JeffM | I have some real work to do too |
| 18:43.21 | JeffM | but I'll start a check out |
| 18:43.30 | Erroneous | ah, I thought you were waiting for a build at this point |
| 18:43.48 | JeffM | for that bug |
| 18:43.55 | JeffM | I have other things to work on |
| 18:44.05 | Erroneous | fun |
| 18:44.33 | *** join/#bzflag keith80403 (n=keith804@71-208-225-46.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 18:44.33 | JeffM | tho I think I'm probably best off out of everyone, I only have 8 things for 9.0 over priority 2 |
| 18:44.33 | Erroneous | I don't think we ever updated the baseline for 43. you'll have lots of output to poke through. |
| 18:44.53 | JeffM | there should be no diffs from the last bump |
| 18:45.18 | Erroneous | all gary's stuff in 43, remember? |
| 18:45.41 | JeffM | then we should bump for that if he says it's cool |
| 18:45.47 | JeffM | you did? |
| 18:45.50 | Erroneous | MTM was bad anyway |
| 18:46.19 | JeffM | brlcad, seriously do you know what the issue is? |
| 18:46.37 | brlcad | no :) |
| 18:46.41 | JeffM | you suck |
| 18:46.42 | brlcad | just kidding |
| 18:46.43 | JeffM | ;) |
| 18:47.06 | JeffM | now that is a big CNC machine, 50 ft x 20ft x 8 ft |
| 18:47.54 | brlcad | eek |
| 18:48.02 | brlcad | that is a room |
| 18:48.08 | Erroneous | large room |
| 18:48.10 | JeffM | indeed |
| 18:48.20 | brlcad | clone people |
| 18:48.38 | JeffM | naw it cuts more important things |
| 18:48.42 | JeffM | spaceships |
| 18:48.55 | JeffM | http://www.scaled.com/services/cms_mill.html |
| 18:49.20 | JeffM | that's what Eric works on now |
| 18:49.49 | Erroneous | nifty |
| 18:51.01 | brlcad | hey chickie |
| 18:51.04 | JeffM | she lives |
| 18:51.15 | SportChick | I live :) |
| 18:51.20 | brlcad | mm scaled composites |
| 18:51.22 | Erroneous | 'tis a good thing to live! |
| 18:51.28 | SportChick | hehe yes, indeed |
| 18:52.21 | brlcad | geez, a room that big and they couldn't afford the $250 to make the controls wireless? |
| 18:52.43 | JeffM | brlcad, I belive they do wired for accuracy sake |
| 18:52.44 | brlcad | $2.5M, no prob. but $250, no way |
| 18:52.57 | JeffM | it's got wireless probing |
| 18:53.22 | JeffM | and from what I understand wireless signals arn't the best around large industrial motors ;) |
| 18:53.46 | JeffM | "stop the machine, it's killing bob", "it says it can't find an IP" |
| 18:53.54 | brlcad | pfft, they'll never get to poke the aliens then |
| 18:54.49 | brlcad | nobody liked bob anyways |
| 18:55.21 | Constitution | brlcad: looking forward to MWSF? |
| 18:55.34 | JeffM | I do notice how they didn't list "explostions" in the list of services :) |
| 18:59.05 | brlcad | Constitution: usually, but i'm pretty content at the moment .. |
| 18:59.19 | Constitution | yeah |
| 18:59.22 | Erroneous | contentment is a good state |
| 18:59.24 | brlcad | unless the come out with 50" displays |
| 18:59.43 | brlcad | new hpone upgrade would be cool |
| 19:00.45 | Constitution | the rumored subnotebook looks interesting... although I'm not in the market for something like that atm |
| 19:01.16 | Constitution | but I'm hoping to pick up an MBP soon if they update it in the next few months |
| 19:01.41 | brlcad | my first laptop was a "subnotebook" back in the day, loved it .. but these days I like the power in the surfboard on the go |
| 19:01.50 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman-_ (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
| 19:02.17 | brlcad | heh, E.T. HPOne home |
| 19:02.39 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman-_ (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
| 19:03.42 | brlcad | be glad to see more reasons for me to tell comcast to shove it |
| 19:06.06 | brlcad | roaming profile sync that *actually* works and works fast.. |
| 19:11.14 | JeffM | ok, so client sends us the MsgEnter, but I can't find out where we send data back |
| 19:15.09 | JeffM | hmm we do that after the DNS authentication |
| 19:18.19 | brlcad | huh, client doesn't check the result of MsgEnter either..joinInternetGame2() doesn't seem right |
| 19:18.52 | brlcad | server should relay back the Enter with a potential rejection iirc |
| 19:19.15 | brlcad | serverlink handles it with readEnter() |
| 19:20.36 | brlcad | looks like 2.0 has the same 'deficiency' (boo) |
| 19:20.51 | JeffM | wel I dug |
| 19:21.03 | JeffM | what we do is not sent the accept back untill we've done the reverse DNS |
| 19:22.00 | JeffM | but I must feed first |
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| 20:07.26 | QuantumTim | does anyone know what the "confine mouse" setting does? |
| 20:10.30 | *** join/#bzflag keith80403 (n=keith804@71-208-225-46.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 20:11.13 | QuantumTim | it sounds like it should keep my cursor inside the mouse box (which would be useful) or something, but changing it doesn't seem to have any effect |
| 20:11.32 | Winny | IIRC its when in windowed mode, it confines it to the window |
| 20:11.43 | Winny | or on dual monitors it confines it to that monitor(?) |
| 20:11.53 | QuantumTim | hmm, okay |
| 20:11.58 | QuantumTim | not so useful then :( |
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| 21:15.22 | JeffM | I'm not saying it isn't but it LOOKs like it's not in my code... |
| 21:15.51 | JeffM | I added notes to the BUGS file if anyone else would like to look at the problem. |
| 21:18.56 | JeffM | and both Erroneous and myself can not figure it out at this time |
| 21:19.10 | JeffM | even using real live colaborative bzflag developer debuging and stuff |
| 21:20.22 | Winny | the obvious solution it so rewrite BZFlag ;) |
| 21:20.32 | L4m3r | real live collaborative bzflag developer debugging? |
| 21:20.32 | JeffM | ok |
| 21:20.39 | JeffM | L4m3r, he came over to my desk |
| 21:20.44 | L4m3r | is that just a long way of saying "a cubicle visit"? |
| 21:20.46 | JeffM | and we like pointed |
| 21:20.49 | L4m3r | ahahaha I knew it :P |
| 21:20.59 | Winny | hehe |
| 21:21.06 | JeffM | see you could be all in on that if you'd come to work here :) |
| 21:21.15 | L4m3r | tbh, I wish I had. >_< |
| 21:21.38 | JeffM | we could hire you to be Erroneous's replacement |
| 21:21.45 | L4m3r | :o |
| 21:21.49 | L4m3r | is he leaving? |
| 21:21.56 | JeffM | when he becomes developer |
| 21:21.59 | L4m3r | (or being promoted) |
| 21:22.02 | L4m3r | ah |
| 21:22.08 | JeffM | he'll be moved to a dev at some point |
| 21:22.48 | L4m3r | we'll see what happens... ucla is trying to screw me over again |
| 21:23.08 | JeffM | let us know, there are a couple places you could possibly go here. |
| 21:25.08 | JeffM | and so far I'm 3 for 3 on recomendations :) |
| 21:26.07 | L4m3r | heh |
| 21:26.22 | L4m3r | well, it'll most likely be through the end of the year, if I decide to leave |
| 21:26.23 | JeffM | tho it'd be up to the new corporate overlords now |
| 21:26.51 | L4m3r | it'd really suck to bail now that I've taken a loan, but if I can't get housing I don't see any way I can keep going to school |
| 21:28.29 | JeffM | that woudl suck |
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| 21:57.05 | Winny | JeffM: I added a couple of team flags, if you wanna check them out some time |
| 21:57.56 | *** join/#bzflag Warinthestar (n=Warinthe@1.168.188.72.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 21:58.03 | whodaman- | :) |
| 21:59.43 | *** join/#bzflag ShftOptnK (n=NAME@adsl-75-5-5-155.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:00.06 | JeffM | k |
| 22:02.18 | ShftOptnK | Hi, when I try and join a game hosted on bzflagr or any of the servers that use global login, everything loads and it says global login accepted, but when I try to right-click or press "i" to join, nothing happens |
| 22:03.11 | Winny | can you log in without a registered callsign? |
| 22:03.40 | ShftOptnK | Everyone I tried said that global login failed |
| 22:03.55 | JeffM | not all server require global login to play |
| 22:04.05 | Winny | can you log in without a registered callsign, though? |
| 22:04.18 | ShftOptnK | I'll try and find one that wasn't in use |
| 22:04.20 | ShftOptnK | Just a sec |
| 22:04.48 | whodaman- | Just do something like "afhsfkdi" |
| 22:05.27 | ShftOptnK | 'k, well I could login with one that wasn't registered but when it got to the right-click screen nothing was happening |
| 22:05.50 | JeffM | you have a firewall or anything? |
| 22:05.56 | JeffM | do any other servers work? |
| 22:06.10 | Winny | this happened to me about a a year ago, it was soemthing to do with my ISP's routing |
| 22:06.15 | ShftOptnK | Yeah, servers that were just IP addresses worked fine |
| 22:06.27 | Winny | could join, got approved, but couldn't spawn or talk |
| 22:06.41 | ShftOptnK | Yeah, that's my problem |
| 22:06.56 | JeffM | sounds like networking issues where we arn't getting your msg join |
| 22:07.13 | ShftOptnK | Any idea how I would fix that? |
| 22:07.37 | JeffM | you have any sort of firewalls or funky filtering/routing? |
| 22:07.44 | Winny | have you tried resettings your router? it might do something. |
| 22:08.20 | ShftOptnK | I'm behind a router, yeah |
| 22:08.44 | JeffM | check and see if that is screwing you up |
| 22:08.55 | ShftOptnK | I'm working on it |
| 22:09.08 | ShftOptnK | Should I be forwarding the port? |
| 22:09.14 | JeffM | you should not have to |
| 22:09.22 | ShftOptnK | I would think so |
| 22:09.25 | Winny | nope |
| 22:09.32 | Winny | only need to do it if you host servers |
| 22:09.45 | ShftOptnK | I've got a different computer in the DMZ(I have Linksys router), could that be doing it? |
| 22:10.04 | Winny | I use a linksys WRT54GS with no issues |
| 22:10.18 | ShftOptnK | But, is the DMZ part the problem? |
| 22:10.21 | JeffM | again it "shold not" |
| 22:10.30 | JeffM | but it depends on how your router handles it |
| 22:10.41 | JeffM | we arn't router experts |
| 22:10.49 | Macrosoft | Winny: what's the 's' stand for? |
| 22:10.52 | Winny | has this always happened, or did it just start? |
| 22:10.58 | ShftOptnK | Just started last night |
| 22:11.03 | ShftOptnK | It was working earlier last night |
| 22:11.03 | JeffM | what changed? |
| 22:11.06 | ShftOptnK | Nothing |
| 22:11.09 | ShftOptnK | The time, maybe |
| 22:11.14 | Winny | ISP, probably then. |
| 22:11.16 | JeffM | something had to change |
| 22:11.19 | JeffM | yeah probalby your ISP |
| 22:11.23 | JeffM | or something else changed |
| 22:11.24 | ShftOptnK | My IP is still the same, though |
| 22:11.31 | JeffM | dunno man |
| 22:11.35 | Winny | they might ve having routing problems |
| 22:11.41 | ShftOptnK | Grr |
| 22:11.47 | *** join/#bzflag nn-main (n=nn@74.94.43.196) |
| 22:11.54 | Winny | for me, it just starting working again after a couple weeks |
| 22:12.23 | ShftOptnK | Do you think forcing a DHCP renew would do it? |
| 22:12.29 | JeffM | can't hurt to try |
| 22:12.32 | ShftOptnK | 'k |
| 22:12.34 | ShftOptnK | Brb |
| 22:12.48 | Winny | unplug your router as well, there could be some fun settings that got messed up |
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| 22:16.39 | nn-main | i think i need to revise that script |
| 22:17.12 | JeffM | hang on man, we don't have our mentalisit's hats on |
| 22:17.13 | F687s | what script? |
| 22:17.16 | JeffM | what script? |
| 22:17.20 | F687s | heh |
| 22:17.21 | Winny | what script? |
| 22:17.28 | Winny | oh dear |
| 22:18.11 | *** join/#bzflag sigonasr2 (i=sigonasr@ip72-200-88-154.tc.ph.cox.net) |
| 22:21.16 | Winny | LOL |
| 22:21.20 | Winny | we're up tp 881 servers?! |
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| 22:22.05 | Winny | oh my god nn |
| 22:22.08 | whodaman- | wow |
| 22:22.15 | ShftOptnK | Yeah, so that didn't do it |
| 22:22.17 | whodaman- | userbin.net |
| 22:22.48 | whodaman- | 885 |
| 22:23.05 | Winny | nn-main: why do you need so many servers.. |
| 22:23.38 | Winny | 537 servers. |
| 22:23.42 | Winny | Plus BZFmaps. |
| 22:23.54 | whodaman- | Yeah, there are things like the MapChange plugin. |
| 22:25.06 | JeffM | yeah I'm geting close to calling that list server spam |
| 22:25.16 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
| 22:25.31 | AHA | JeffM: 639 servers is a *bit* much |
| 22:25.35 | JeffM | yes |
| 22:25.53 | JeffM | specialy when the owner is unresponsive to questions presented to him |
| 22:25.55 | sigonasr2 | nn's pushed it too far |
| 22:26.18 | AHA | nn-main: ping |
| 22:26.19 | JeffM | I'm not for having hard limits on servers |
| 22:26.30 | JeffM | but there is a limit of what is reasonable |
| 22:26.36 | L4m3r | considering the rarity of cases, I'd say it's subject to our discretion |
| 22:26.38 | JeffM | for a given expressed use |
| 22:26.42 | JeffM | yes it is |
| 22:26.51 | L4m3r | I mean, the next largest server cabal is some 60 servers |
| 22:26.56 | JeffM | yeah |
| 22:27.07 | sigonasr2 | bzfmaps.net itself has 102 servers too |
| 22:27.12 | JeffM | since he won't even talk to me |
| 22:27.15 | AHA | and i thought norang hosted alot of servers |
| 22:27.15 | catay | JeffM: Do you have an idea why slashcommands that start with a number are not seen as a command? |
| 22:27.23 | whodaman- | And ALL of these could be just put into one mapchange server |
| 22:27.27 | catay | for example like /1vs1 |
| 22:27.38 | JeffM | catay, not off the top of my head, but probalby just how they are parsed. |
| 22:28.17 | L4m3r | yeah, mofo runs a mapchange with over a thousand maps |
| 22:28.49 | whodaman- | L4m3r, although, nn has a lot of people using SSH account that he gave them |
| 22:29.03 | F687s | true. |
| 22:29.04 | L4m3r | it's still his responsibility |
| 22:29.33 | whodaman- | L4m3r, Indeed. You could fit those into like 20 servers max |
| 22:29.35 | L4m3r | one could argue that there's no way in hell he could support even 5% of those servers simultaneously |
| 22:29.36 | F687s | of course, it's also the map hoster's responsibility to make sure the list server is not abused. |
| 22:29.49 | JeffM | well we don't have a policy on that |
| 22:29.53 | JeffM | but I'm making one now |
| 22:29.54 | catay | JeffM: ok, thanks, i'll avoid using a number then ;) |
| 22:30.23 | F687s | well, it's also the server owner's responsibility to make sure the map hosters are acting responsibly |
| 22:30.31 | Winny | nn-main: care to respond? |
| 22:30.32 | whodaman- | L4m3r, and like 90% aren't even played on |
| 22:31.03 | sigonasr2 | nn-main is just putting up a bunch of random maps though. They're all based off of his database. |
| 22:32.10 | L4m3r | he could easily set up a script to start and run maps on demand instead of spamming the crap out of the list |
| 22:32.24 | whodaman- | L4m3r, yep |
| 22:32.54 | F687s | of course, you must consider that he WANTS all of those servers up at the same time (to appease teh map makers) |
| 22:33.32 | sigonasr2 | hahaha, he's getting lag on one with 9 players right now anyway |
| 22:33.39 | L4m3r | -_- |
| 22:34.12 | whodaman- | F687s, last time I checked you had all your maps hosted with him too. |
| 22:34.25 | Winny | ...but not 683 maps. |
| 22:34.37 | F687s | whodaman-: yep, because I don't wanna pay for hosting |
| 22:35.10 | sigonasr2 | This is different. These aren't other player's maps. (Well, some were made from others), but nn's choosing to host them, not another player |
| 22:35.28 | JeffM | it is done, at least till he talks to us |
| 22:35.58 | L4m3r | how long will it take for the list server to clean them out? |
| 22:36.03 | JeffM | up to 30 min |
| 22:36.07 | Winny | ah |
| 22:36.10 | sigonasr2 | ok, thanks JeffM |
| 22:36.49 | whodaman- | It's not like we haven't TOLD him many times already |
| 22:36.52 | F687s | wait....what does that policy cover? |
| 22:36.56 | L4m3r | hehehe |
| 22:37.01 | JeffM | uses of the list server |
| 22:37.03 | Winny | F687s: proper use of the listserver |
| 22:37.05 | L4m3r | prof just asked "How does the internet work?" |
| 22:37.07 | Winny | bah, too slow |
| 22:37.10 | whodaman- | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=11992 |
| 22:37.11 | L4m3r | and someone answered "Series of tubes!" |
| 22:37.15 | Winny | L4m3r: raise your hand |
| 22:37.21 | Winny | and say "its a series of tubes" |
| 22:37.24 | Winny | oh |
| 22:37.30 | L4m3r | :P |
| 22:37.31 | sigonasr2 | that's not right whodaman |
| 22:37.32 | Winny | darn.. didn't type fast enough |
| 22:37.33 | F687s | a removal of all bzfmaps.net domains? |
| 22:37.36 | sigonasr2 | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=11788 |
| 22:37.40 | F687s | from the list server? |
| 22:37.41 | JeffM | actualy I doin't have to |
| 22:37.56 | whodaman- | sigonasr2, I just wanted to post the thread where we told him to stop |
| 22:37.57 | JeffM | since it's got the terms fair and reasonable and non disruptive |
| 22:38.02 | JeffM | he's being disruptive |
| 22:39.18 | F687s | I have a feeling I'm going to be very unhappy soon... |
| 22:39.33 | Winny | nn-main: when you get back, read up. |
| 22:39.39 | sigonasr2 | Conflict time |
| 22:39.40 | Erroneous | and I still don't see the problem with having lots of servers |
| 22:40.02 | JeffM | Erroneous, nor do I, that's why I'm heastant to put any sort of limit |
| 22:40.09 | JeffM | but there is a point where it becomes spam |
| 22:40.15 | JeffM | all I want to do is talk to the dude |
| 22:40.33 | JeffM | but he's ignored me at every turn |
| 22:40.38 | L4m3r | one way to be fair would be to require him to use userbin.net or some other low domain |
| 22:40.45 | L4m3r | so his superfluous servers will stay down |
| 22:40.46 | JeffM | /msg, PM, e-mail, etc.. |
| 22:41.00 | JeffM | L4m3r, it's not right to require him to do anything |
| 22:41.03 | F687s | anyone know anything about the ryanaka (?) that's supposed to be assisting him? |
| 22:41.05 | Erroneous | I mean, sure, he's going way overboard, but that's his problem not ours afaiac |
| 22:41.06 | JeffM | since the problem is with our software displaying it |
| 22:41.23 | L4m3r | it'd be less disruptive |
| 22:41.25 | L4m3r | :P |
| 22:41.25 | *** join/#bzflag sigonasr (i=sigonasr@ip72-200-88-154.tc.ph.cox.net) |
| 22:41.26 | JeffM | but I think there should be a reasonable level of give and take on both sides. |
| 22:41.38 | Erroneous | yeah, he's certainly not being helpful |
| 22:41.39 | JeffM | and at the very least he shoudl be willing to talk to us about it |
| 22:41.44 | JeffM | that's all I want |
| 22:41.46 | JeffM | to talk to him about it |
| 22:42.10 | L4m3r | I don't think we need a hard limit either |
| 22:42.13 | JeffM | he's going for a use that noone will ever use |
| 22:42.29 | L4m3r | it should be with respect to capacity |
| 22:42.34 | JeffM | and I'd be more then willing to work oout a script that would list servers then start an instance with that server |
| 22:42.47 | JeffM | so he can have the map makers thing he wants |
| 22:42.53 | Erroneous | that'd be cool |
| 22:42.58 | L4m3r | clearly he doesn't need hundreds of servers to be played on instantly, on demand, because he cannot support that |
| 22:43.00 | Erroneous | fire them off on demand |
| 22:43.07 | JeffM | Erroneous, blast had a php setup like that |
| 22:43.10 | JeffM | or someone did |
| 22:43.13 | JeffM | it's not THAT hard |
| 22:43.18 | JeffM | he just needs to work with us |
| 22:43.18 | Erroneous | yeah, I'm sure someone did/could/will |
| 22:43.26 | L4m3r | Norang has something sort of like that too, I think |
| 22:43.37 | JeffM | I get the feeling he's doing it to brag about it |
| 22:43.39 | JeffM | and that is all |
| 22:43.44 | JeffM | and that is not what the list server is for |
| 22:43.53 | JeffM | so untill he talks to us about it, he can be delisted. |
| 22:44.10 | Erroneous | he'll probably brag about that too :P |
| 22:44.20 | JeffM | if that's what he wants then he can stay delisted |
| 22:44.21 | sigonasr2 | I bet he'll brag about that lag he gets also ;) |
| 22:44.29 | JeffM | as he's not hosting servers to help the game or community |
| 22:44.41 | JeffM | he can run his servers all he wants, we don't have to list them |
| 22:44.45 | JeffM | not that I want it to go that way |
| 22:44.56 | JeffM | but if it becomes an ego issue, then we don't need it |
| 22:45.08 | L4m3r | helping the community should not be a requisite of using the list, yeah |
| 22:45.12 | F687s | I know for a fact that he's running a gentoo box with a good amount of resources, so you can't be too suspicious |
| 22:45.17 | *** join/#bzflag TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
| 22:45.17 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 22:45.27 | F687s | (about how he can host the servers) |
| 22:45.29 | JeffM | F687s, he's on a home cable connection |
| 22:45.35 | JeffM | he can't be THAT good |
| 22:45.37 | L4m3r | yeah, the box hardly matters |
| 22:45.47 | JeffM | he's got what a meg down? |
| 22:45.49 | L4m3r | it's all about the pipe, and he ain't got it |
| 22:46.01 | JeffM | 2 of those servers fill and he's dead |
| 22:46.04 | F687s | yes, but none of the maps are populated, so does it really matter? |
| 22:46.26 | JeffM | he could get flooded off by players right now they just all connected. |
| 22:46.37 | L4m3r | well, if he can't support those servers, why list them all? |
| 22:46.51 | L4m3r | he could find a "friendlier" way to make his games available |
| 22:46.53 | Erroneous | L4m3r: that's his problem not ours |
| 22:46.58 | JeffM | if his goal is to provide access to every map for refrence, I can see that |
| 22:47.02 | JeffM | but there are better ways to do that |
| 22:47.07 | L4m3r | exactly |
| 22:47.09 | Erroneous | and I don't see what's unfriendly about hosting stuff |
| 22:47.13 | JeffM | and yeah his abbility to host is his issue |
| 22:47.27 | JeffM | the problem is that he's just unwilling to talk to us |
| 22:47.31 | JeffM | that's the only issue I have now |
| 22:47.35 | L4m3r | it's not that it's our issue |
| 22:48.03 | L4m3r | we know for a fact that he cannot host all those maps simultaneously, with players, so he should have no problem using a method that doesn't flood the list |
| 22:48.11 | Erroneous | it's none of our business whether he can support what he's offering or not, nor should it be |
| 22:48.27 | JeffM | google dosn't care how many connections you can have, they will still list your site :) |
| 22:48.48 | JeffM | but if you start abbusing that google bot to gain advantage in the google listing, then they care |
| 22:48.57 | Erroneous | if someone wants to host a public server on dialup, what do we care? |
| 22:49.05 | F687s | of course, domains aren't free, either |
| 22:49.22 | JeffM | you can host as many sites as you want on one main domain |
| 22:49.27 | JeffM | same as he's doing |
| 22:49.31 | F687s | each public server instance is like a domain listing, in that respect |
| 22:49.32 | whodaman- | F687s, you can get free ones |
| 22:49.54 | JeffM | we'll see what he says when he decides to talk |
| 22:50.07 | Erroneous | we could charge for server listing, sure. that'd clean up the list pretty fast. |
| 22:50.12 | JeffM | heh |
| 22:50.13 | L4m3r | heh |
| 22:50.27 | F687s | it's on your resources, that's pay enough |
| 22:50.30 | Erroneous | it'd also make the barrier to serving higher. which might not be a bad thing either, come to think of it |
| 22:50.54 | Erroneous | hm, I suggested it as a joke but I'm not seeing many downsides :) |
| 22:51.03 | F687s | and then we'd have, what, 25 servers? |
| 22:51.16 | Erroneous | sure. we only have 10 with players at any given time anyway |
| 22:51.21 | whodaman- | 406 servers |
| 22:51.21 | L4m3r | so? people only use 15 of them at any given time, at most |
| 22:51.23 | JeffM | make it so you have to ether submit a patch, code, or a dontation :) |
| 22:51.30 | whodaman- | there are still userbin.net ones though |
| 22:51.31 | sigonasr2 | Let's put it toward the developer encouragement fund ;) |
| 22:51.40 | L4m3r | yay! beer money! |
| 22:51.49 | F687s | we could also make BZFlag proprietary software, and that would clear out the n00bs, too ;-) |
| 22:51.54 | whodaman- | JeffM, didn't you just take out all userbin,net server? |
| 22:52.04 | L4m3r | whodaman-: they don't clear out immediately |
| 22:52.04 | sigonasr2 | whodaman-: Should be still clearing |
| 22:52.12 | JeffM | I added 3 Ips |
| 22:52.24 | JeffM | and yah they take up to 30 min to clear |
| 22:52.28 | sigonasr2 | It seems to have gone away |
| 22:53.04 | L4m3r | heh, another fun way to weed out some servers would be to show an average lag in the list |
| 22:53.10 | ryanakca | all of nn's servers seem to be having trouble connecting to the list server/?, none of our players seem to be able to identify. |
| 22:53.21 | F687s | heh... |
| 22:53.23 | ryanakca | Anything we can do? |
| 22:53.25 | sigonasr2 | weird |
| 22:53.27 | JeffM | ryanakca, have him come talk to me |
| 22:53.33 | Erroneous | read the last few pages of scrollback please |
| 22:53.41 | JeffM | that's what you call can do |
| 22:53.45 | JeffM | get him to talk to me |
| 22:53.47 | F687s | read the above 200 lines? |
| 22:53.48 | ryanakca | JeffM: will do :) |
| 22:54.03 | L4m3r | did I mention that he posted a thread the other day? |
| 22:54.09 | JeffM | there is no need to joke about this with him guys |
| 22:54.16 | L4m3r | "bzfmaps.net is STILL hosting maps!" |
| 22:54.26 | Macrosoft | JeffM: " make it so you have to ether submit a patch, code, or a dontation :)" i submitted a broken patch, does that count :p |
| 22:54.29 | JeffM | I know he's made himself a laughing stock, but this isn't something that is being done for enjoyment |
| 22:54.48 | F687s | some of it is made out of a willingness to contribute |
| 22:54.54 | L4m3r | I baleeted it and told him not to post redundant threads -_- |
| 22:55.01 | F687s | the improved bzadmin, for instance |
| 22:55.05 | JeffM | yeah he's not to keen on the rules etc.. |
| 22:55.11 | *** join/#bzflag beanpole (n=beanit@ip68-99-16-127.om.om.cox.net) |
| 22:55.13 | sigonasr2 | ryanakca: Is this for any other bzfmaps.net server? |
| 22:55.16 | JeffM | he's very young and very excitable |
| 22:55.22 | JeffM | that's why all I want to do is talk to him |
| 22:55.41 | Erroneous | I have no problem with him doing anything he's doing. There's a bit of a community issue with the, err, quantity. |
| 22:55.43 | F687s | from what it looks like, he just wanted to contribute to bzadmin, and you still yelled at him (or maybe I read it wrong...) |
| 22:55.48 | ryanakca | sigonasr2: I don't know. *checks* |
| 22:55.51 | nn-main | I found having so many bzfmaps servers clogs everything at the Time 10 or 15 minits a go it was fun but I think mass hosting is a waist of resources so that is it of that test |
| 22:56.04 | JeffM | nn-main, please talk to me in my PMs I've sent you |
| 22:56.19 | ryanakca | Erroneous: in my opinion, quality over quantity. I'd have him take down his maps library so that those who are hosting really nice maps don't suffer lag |
| 22:56.21 | JeffM | respond to one when you are ready and we can talk |
| 22:56.52 | Erroneous | ryanakca: if it was mine, I'd agree. it's his choice though (imho) |
| 22:56.54 | JeffM | I think he's just typing and not reading. |
| 22:57.07 | Winny | yay, 292 again \o/ |
| 22:57.21 | Erroneous | I think a script to fire off a map on demand would be cool |
| 22:57.44 | Winny | IMO, it would work quite nicely if he set up 3-5 servers and ran mapchange on them |
| 22:58.00 | Winny | surely 5 different maps would allow people to play on the ones they want |
| 22:58.14 | Erroneous | mapchange has the disadvantage that you can't get any particular map on demand. |
| 22:58.16 | F687s | Where'd Terra go? *searches the list server frantically* |
| 22:58.23 | Erroneous | you have a little selection, but that's it |
| 22:59.19 | ryanakca | F687s: I was "volunteered" to help him host maps... I have an account on his servers, just like cruel dog and everybody else who hosts with him. I have no more power than that |
| 22:59.30 | Erroneous | the list server needs to be able to handle large numbers of servers anyway. if it can't, it's a bug, not a social problem. |
| 22:59.50 | ryanakca | F687s: at the moment, I have 3 maps hosted, one of them was 2nd in the list before this "issue". |
| 23:00.35 | F687s | ryanakca: just wondering. |
| 23:00.57 | JeffM | I'm sure the issue will be resolved shortly |
| 23:01.02 | JeffM | if all goes well |
| 23:01.50 | Winny | grouping in trees by domain (on inactive servers) would be cool, for sure |
| 23:02.17 | JeffM | I'd work on that if I could get the server connection issue fixed :) |
| 23:02.24 | Erroneous | heh |
| 23:02.43 | Winny | more "collabarative BZFlag developers debugging"? :p |
| 23:02.54 | JeffM | I don't know what else we can do |
| 23:03.27 | Erroneous | careful if you decide to play with the server list menu. it's rather fragile (better than it used to be, but still...) |
| 23:04.17 | JeffM | I was going to redo the entire menu screen |
| 23:04.20 | Erroneous | seriously needs a rewrite |
| 23:04.22 | Erroneous | yeah |
| 23:05.00 | Winny | would it be possible to do an "advanced" menu setting, and a "default" one that is simpler? |
| 23:05.02 | L4m3r | it'd be nice to have launchers with native OS UI |
| 23:05.03 | Erroneous | favorites and searching both made it much dirtier, and in different ways (I wasn't entirely happy with favorites for that reason) |
| 23:05.08 | L4m3r | but those could be stand alone :) |
| 23:05.13 | Winny | I imagine all the options confuse alot of people |
| 23:05.56 | F687s | the main problem with favorites is that your favorites aren't always populated (unless you're an exclusive Missile War/Bloodbath fanatic) |
| 23:06.08 | sigonasr2 | :D |
| 23:06.13 | L4m3r | that's the problem with maps in general |
| 23:06.15 | Erroneous | L4m3r: it'd be fairly easy to do. I've been wanting to talk to the xfire people about getting a list server parser built in there (they do it for other games) |
| 23:06.48 | L4m3r | it could get crufty maintaining three or four separate launchers, but the end user experience would be so much better |
| 23:07.43 | Winny | L4m3r: what would be the point, they need to launch the game eventually... |
| 23:07.51 | L4m3r | Remember Doom 95? :) |
| 23:10.08 | L4m3r | it was the later edition of Doom, which came with a nice Windows launcher |
| 23:10.36 | L4m3r | you picked a game (Doom, Doom II, Final Doom), an episode, and a level, and launched the game |
| 23:10.46 | L4m3r | it'd put you right where you wanted |
| 23:11.54 | F687s | what advantage would that have from putting it in-game? |
| 23:12.00 | L4m3r | more efficient |
| 23:12.26 | L4m3r | and you could check the list, find out there was nothing worth playing, and exit without needing to start a client |
| 23:12.38 | F687s | maybe, but couldn't you just have something like that that just bootstraps the current client? |
| 23:12.59 | F687s | doesn't the client have command-line options? |
| 23:13.03 | L4m3r | sure, but then we'd have to write in UI, and mouse handling, and all that |
| 23:13.22 | L4m3r | yes, it does, and a launcher could easily just call the client and start it on a given server |
| 23:13.38 | F687s | so, why not make it complementary to the conventional way? |
| 23:15.05 | JeffM | so you want us to maintain another app on all the platforms? |
| 23:15.29 | brlcad | ~tupone++ |
| 23:15.31 | L4m3r | maybe not "us" |
| 23:15.41 | L4m3r | but it would be nice if Someone (tm) did it :P |
| 23:15.49 | JeffM | we are us |
| 23:15.59 | F687s | well, if you wrote it in platform-independent libraries.........yeah, it'd still suck. |
| 23:16.02 | JeffM | a better in game list is not that hard. |
| 23:16.09 | JeffM | it just needs to be done |
| 23:16.11 | brlcad | we're also someone (tm) unfortunately most of the time too :) |
| 23:16.29 | JeffM | listing butloads of servers is not rocket science, every FPS with multiplayer does it |
| 23:16.34 | L4m3r | yeah, but it shouldn't be an official project priority for obvious reasons |
| 23:17.18 | L4m3r | better font handling would probably solve most of the problem |
| 23:17.29 | L4m3r | the current setup makes poor use of screen real estate |
| 23:18.21 | Erroneous | JeffM: most fps' do it poorly though |
| 23:18.35 | JeffM | Erroneous, they do it better then us ;) |
| 23:18.41 | Erroneous | heh, true |
| 23:18.44 | JeffM | we just have to use them to see what NOT to do |
| 23:18.59 | JeffM | I have a design in mind |
| 23:19.02 | Erroneous | actually I really would like to have bzflag's wildcard search in most fps' |
| 23:19.08 | JeffM | hopefully I can get it dine and then we can see how it works. |
| 23:19.21 | L4m3r | Perhaps a hierarchical system would work |
| 23:19.29 | L4m3r | though I'm not sure how we'd organize the servers |
| 23:19.32 | Erroneous | but I'd like to see the usual filter method for us too, so we could sort by game style/shot count/whatever |
| 23:20.24 | Erroneous | I think the two together would be more than adequate. plus maybe a "recently visited" and "most popular" |
| 23:20.48 | L4m3r | well, the servers that acutally have people on them should be up front, regardless |
| 23:21.05 | L4m3r | we can use some sort of organization scheme to deal with the hordes of empty servers :P |
| 23:21.21 | JeffM | yeah I want to allow the definition of searches and sorts in tabs |
| 23:21.31 | JeffM | so you can have it do any sort of search/sort/filter you want |
| 23:22.42 | L4m3r | perhaps we could just sort empty servers into groups by domain (not IP) |
| 23:23.18 | TheRedBaron | we have a cheater on mofo |
| 23:23.22 | L4m3r | this would give server owners to group their servers as they see fit |
| 23:23.25 | L4m3r | ugh |
| 23:24.24 | Winny | TheRedBaron: who is it? |
| 23:24.33 | TheRedBaron | squirrel piss off |
| 23:24.46 | L4m3r | temp is taking care of it |
| 23:28.05 | TheRedBaron | i think he's asleep |
| 23:28.09 | TheRedBaron | temp that is |
| 23:29.10 | TheRedBaron | scratch that, temp is no longer there, and now we have some one steering in the air without wings |
| 23:29.31 | Erroneous | heh |
| 23:29.56 | Winny | TheRedBaron: the same guy? |
| 23:30.03 | TheRedBaron | could be, |
| 23:30.11 | TheRedBaron | actually, no |
| 23:30.19 | TheRedBaron | unless the same guy can operate two computers at once |
| 23:30.29 | Winny | who's the new guy? |
| 23:30.32 | TheRedBaron | because both cheaters were on, no just the one is on |
| 23:30.39 | TheRedBaron | aciclobe |
| 23:30.41 | *** join/#bzflag sigonasr (i=sigonasr@ip72-200-88-154.tc.ph.cox.net) |
| 23:31.38 | Winny | L4m3r: what was his IP? |
| 23:31.45 | L4m3r | I don't know |
| 23:31.53 | Winny | ick, k |
| 23:32.45 | *** join/#bzflag a_temp_work (n=temporal@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 23:33.11 | L4m3r | 84.119.5.66 |
| 23:33.41 | Winny | thanks |
| 23:33.54 | Winny | ahh, that guy |
| 23:34.07 | Winny | he was on my server yesterday, I had to ban the range 84.119.*.* |
| 23:34.18 | Winny | changes his IP and comes right back |
| 23:35.08 | L4m3r | I'm watching from bzadmin |
| 23:39.43 | *** join/#bzflag BZ_Win (n=KyleVE@unaffiliated/winny) |
| 23:40.35 | Winny | wahoo... |
| 23:48.58 | brlcad | nifty, new channel peak |
| 23:50.03 | *** part/#bzflag trepan (n=trepan@unaffiliated/trepan) |
| 23:51.25 | *** join/#bzflag keith80403 (n=keith804@71-208-225-46.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 23:58.19 | ryanakca | :D |