| 00:00.00 | Mets | alright I'll give it a try |
| 00:00.05 | JeffM | and they should have build and install instructions for solaris |
| 00:00.13 | JeffM | but yeah that error is a problem with your curl |
| 00:00.38 | JeffM | our curl has been tweaked to work in our build system. so using it for a system install may be harder then using the offical ones |
| 00:02.44 | Mets | yeah the readme for bzflag under solaris is from 1999, and that talked about a few fixes that had to be made, so if it's just curl I'd be happy :) |
| 00:02.57 | JeffM | it's not a commonly used OS |
| 00:03.07 | JeffM | probaby be one of the first droped when the hammer comes |
| 00:03.14 | Mets | lol, for sure |
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| 00:03.32 | Mets | i just happened to have a sunblade or two to play around with, so I thought I'd give it a go |
| 00:03.49 | Mets | my total solaris experience is getting this to compile |
| 00:03.56 | JeffM | install linux |
| 00:03.59 | JeffM | a lot easier ;) |
| 00:04.30 | Mets | heh, I agree but I don't administer the computers, I just have an account on them |
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| 00:11.46 | Winny | any developers on OS X: http://www.versionsapp.com/ |
| 00:11.55 | Winny | looks pretty cool |
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| 00:29.34 | Epyon | Again, a big sorry to all. Sunday it should be all cleared up. |
| 00:35.43 | blast007 | Winny: oooooo |
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| 00:46.05 | Jeffm | Wheee tiny irc |
| 00:50.37 | Thumper_ | hey jeff - line 323 of bzflag/plugins/plugin_utils/plugin_HTTPTemplates.cpp I changed |
| 00:50.40 | Thumper_ | - data = format("%.3d",bz_getCurrentTime()-startTime); |
| 00:50.43 | Thumper_ | + data = format("%.3f",bz_getCurrentTime()-startTime); |
| 00:51.00 | Thumper_ | should that have been %.3d", (int)(bz_getCurrentTime()-startTime) instead? |
| 00:51.18 | Thumper_ | the result is currently a float |
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| 00:54.56 | Erroneous | Mets: it has been some time since I built on Solaris, but I think the trick was to build all the dependencies yourself, so you had the right compiler and linker through the whole stack. --prefix is your friend if you are not root. |
| 00:56.25 | Thumper_ | Jeffm: actually it looks like this is used in the webstats plugin and that isn't responding anymore... I'll dig |
| 00:56.30 | Thumper_ | hope you're feeling better soon |
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| 00:58.00 | Mets | Erroneous: It looks like Jeff's first suggestion is winning right now, I think I've had about enough of Solaris for a while :) |
| 00:58.09 | Erroneous | heh |
| 00:58.24 | Mets | I was bored, it was worth a shot :p |
| 00:59.43 | Erroneous | it should work if everything's set up correctly. 2.0.8 did at least. |
| 01:00.20 | Erroneous | goes home |
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| 01:21.07 | _Lukstr | ... |
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| 03:50.48 | _Lukstr | any devs around? |
| 03:55.34 | brlcad | nope |
| 03:56.34 | Flash | Mets: ping |
| 03:56.46 | _Lukstr | aw :( |
| 03:56.55 | Mets | Flash: pong |
| 03:57.12 | Flash | want some help with your solaris box? |
| 03:57.59 | Mets | certainly if you are inclined :) |
| 03:58.09 | brlcad | _Lukstr: heh "ask" |
| 03:58.26 | _Lukstr | :P |
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| 03:59.59 | Flash | _Lukstr: I don't recognize you. Your name is reserved to the C++ implementation (unless scoped) |
| 04:00.26 | _Lukstr | haha. If you read up I was D/C'd within two minutes of fixing my name, so I give up :P |
| 04:00.40 | _Lukstr | clearly someone, somewhere wants that underscore there |
| 04:00.53 | Flash | D/C'd? |
| 04:01.03 | _Lukstr | disconnected |
| 04:01.44 | Flash | Winny: Verions looks OK, but I wouldn't be inclined to pay for it. |
| 04:01.50 | Flash | command line works just fine for me |
| 04:16.43 | _Lukstr | this seems most unfortunate... |
| 04:17.10 | _Lukstr | I'm resizing my ubuntu partition and it's hanging at 50% for the past 20 minutes... |
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| 04:19.03 | Mets | ok, solaris compile, take 14 |
| 04:19.10 | Flash | Mets: your link error http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m2eb0163c is looking for a C++ signature in libcurl curl_multi_perform(void*, int*) |
| 04:19.25 | Flash | but your library only has C linkage (curl_multi_perform) |
| 04:19.48 | Flash | the header file that declares the function needs to have extern "C" in front of the function |
| 04:20.14 | Flash | like: extern "C" void curl_multi_perform(void*, int*); |
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| 04:20.29 | Flash | (although I can't tell the return type from your output |
| 04:20.33 | Mets | i'm wondering why that wouldn't have been there already |
| 04:20.42 | Flash | where are the curl functions declared? |
| 04:20.57 | Mets | somewhere in the code for bzfs i'm guessing |
| 04:21.31 | Mets | this is 2.0.10 I was testing it on |
| 04:23.45 | Flash | look in /usr/local/include/curl/multi.h |
| 04:25.27 | Mets | looking |
| 04:26.10 | Flash | or maybe curl/curl.h |
| 04:27.08 | Mets | yeah there is no extern |
| 04:27.32 | Mets | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m328bb8c0 |
| 04:27.37 | Mets | that's multi.h |
| 04:28.04 | Flash | ok, for a quick hack try this: change include/cURLManager.h |
| 04:28.22 | Flash | line 22 add extern "C" { |
| 04:28.36 | Flash | after curl/curl.h add } |
| 04:28.51 | Flash | so 22: extern "C" { |
| 04:28.59 | Flash | 23: #include <curl/curl.h> |
| 04:29.03 | Flash | 24: } |
| 04:29.28 | Mets | this is /usr/loca/include/curlmanager.h |
| 04:30.06 | Flash | it's .../bzflag/include/cURLManager.h |
| 04:30.42 | Mets | ah |
| 04:32.02 | Mets | so wrap the system headers in extern "C" { } |
| 04:32.10 | Mets | or just curl/curl.h part |
| 04:32.16 | Flash | just the curl |
| 04:32.36 | Mets | ok done |
| 04:34.04 | _Lukstr | this is the worst week ever. |
| 04:34.09 | Flash | of course..... I may be laboring under the assumption that nm on a gcc-produced library is similar to that produced for SunPro |
| 04:34.56 | Mets | well let's see |
| 04:35.28 | Flash | ok, I have to help my son beat Halo, so I'll be back later |
| 04:35.45 | Mets | alright thanks a lot flash |
| 04:35.53 | Mets | *still compiling* |
| 04:36.04 | Mets | aww shucks |
| 04:36.16 | Mets | seems to have returned the same error |
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| 04:40.41 | Mets | we shall wait for dr. flash, and his son to beat halo :p |
| 04:44.09 | AAA_awright | ~ibot ping |
| 04:44.10 | ibot | pong |
| 04:44.10 | AAA_awright | er |
| 04:44.23 | Mets | lol |
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| 04:46.45 | JeffM | Constitution: how goes it? |
| 04:53.19 | _Lukstr | I think I'm going to cry now |
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| 05:16.19 | JeffM | ? |
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| 05:37.05 | CIA-33 | BZFlag: 03blast007 * r17382 10/trunk/bzflag/tools/ (BZFSLauncher/ BZWTestLauncher/): Rename BZWTestLauncher to BZFSLauncher, Part 1. (Renaming the directory) |
| 05:42.20 | _Lukstr | JeffM: Directed at me? |
| 05:45.18 | _Lukstr | no sleep pour moi |
| 05:50.11 | _Lukstr | Well I guess not |
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| 06:13.57 | CIA-33 | BZFlag: 03blast007 * r17383 10/trunk/bzflag/tools/BZFSLauncher/ (7 files): Rename BZWTestLauncher to BZFSLauncher, Part 2. (Modifying the files) |
| 06:15.08 | CIA-33 | BZFlag: 03blast007 * r17384 10/trunk/bzflag/BUGS: Add a bug regarding a minimized client failing to restore into view. Occurs when it is started with -window. |
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| 06:44.51 | CIA-33 | BZFlag: 03blast007 * r17385 10/trunk/bzworkbench/ (README README.MSWindows): Fix a typo in the Windows readme and wrap at 80 characters |
| 06:49.22 | blast007 | fun, I get to build OSG again :/ |
| 06:54.45 | Flash | what's OSG? |
| 06:58.37 | blast007 | OpenSceneGraph |
| 06:59.00 | blast007 | trying to build bzworkbench |
| 06:59.05 | blast007 | (a map editor) |
| 06:59.22 | blast007 | I had a built copy of OSG, but it was on my crashed laptop HD ;) |
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| 09:15.57 | sam | brlcad, DTRemenak: can you think of anything that's currently preventing an FTGL release? |
| 09:17.28 | sam | especially things that would require an API extension or modification |
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| 12:09.43 | brlcad | sam: yeah, having an api version to key on -- there's no upgrade path at the moment and with the Advance() change there really needs to be a way to #ifdef |
| 12:11.00 | brlcad | keeping Advance as just returning a float and adding something like an AdvanceObj or something would help, but even for header inclusion it would help |
| 12:16.54 | sam | brlcad: one can #ifdef __ftgl__ |
| 12:16.59 | sam | do you think that's enough? |
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| 12:31.28 | brlcad | sam: not prior to header inclusion, though -- higher level version to key on from ftgl-config or pkg-config (or even keying on __ftgl__ as a configure test, but that seems really weak) |
| 12:32.05 | brlcad | just looking at what we had to hack into our simple use in bz main it a bit painful to "upgrade" and we had a trivial use |
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| 13:33.07 | sam | brlcad: how about the mere presence of FTGL/ftgl.h? |
| 13:34.54 | KTL | is there a channel more devoted to mapmaking? and how can i startup bzfs and let bzflag connect to it in 1 command? |
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| 14:02.25 | KTL | is there a way i can make textures tile correctly, i got a long small meshbox now for example and the texture on top is stretched with it making it unrecognizable |
| 14:08.39 | KTL | searches for a way to add texcoords to meshboxes |
| 14:23.00 | KTL | http://users.edpnet.be/dpf/bz/bzfi0003b.png <- the textures are copied and cut the right way vertically, but not horizontally |
| 14:23.10 | KTL | that is from svntrunk btw |
| 14:25.03 | KTL | and something that makes me worry: in svntrunk boxes seems to be automatically converted to meshboxes? i dont know why because of that conversion a teleporter on a box does not want to let me come out of it |
| 14:25.28 | brlcad | sam: that was what I started with, but then there was an error with the old FTGL.h header, case-insensitive filesystems, and linux distros putting the header into an FTGL subdir by default |
| 14:25.48 | brlcad | that was encountered shortly after updating bzflag to an HAVE_FTGL_FTGL_H check |
| 14:28.38 | brlcad | not intractable show-stopper, as I did find a path that worked, but it was a fair bit of testing/work that I fear others wouldn't have gone through |
| 14:34.51 | KTL | surprised to see that a meshbox is a CustomArc while a box is a CustomBox |
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| 15:21.48 | sam | brlcad: is that a real-life case? what linux distro uses a case-insensitive filesystem? |
| 15:30.24 | DTRemenak | linux is not the only os out there |
| 15:30.57 | DTRemenak | our mingw build uses autotools on a case insensitive filesystem, for one |
| 15:31.30 | DTRemenak | though I doubt that's the case brlcad ran into |
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| 15:54.17 | Thumper_ | isn't OSX case insensitive? |
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| 16:01.00 | KTL | thinks the idea around the texsize of a box is wrong. 4 numbers are given, first 2 affect the textures at the sides, second affects them vertically, first one horizontally, there should be 2 numbers to affect them horizontally |
| 16:02.14 | KTL | the first number gives a hint on how many times the texture should be repeated on every face of the sides, while the front/back faces can be different in width than the left/right faces |
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| 16:06.02 | KTL | am i right?? |
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| 16:53.23 | KTL | JeffM, i think the texsize with 4 float arguments for meshboxes is insufficient or not totally correct |
| 16:54.14 | KTL | it's ok for a cube, but not for a box because the width of the sides can differ, it should be 5 floats instead of 4 i guess |
| 16:56.48 | JeffM | KTL, wha are you talking about? I cant read your mind |
| 16:57.00 | KTL | i tried to texture a box properly |
| 16:57.07 | JeffM | then don't use a meshbox |
| 16:57.09 | JeffM | use a mesh |
| 16:57.14 | JeffM | and define the UVs |
| 16:57.17 | JeffM | meshbox is a hack |
| 16:57.32 | KTL | myes, the whole map has allready been made using old boxes |
| 16:57.36 | JeffM | so? |
| 16:57.45 | KTL | do you have converters? |
| 16:57.58 | JeffM | sure, save the map as obj from bzflag |
| 16:58.04 | JeffM | then convert it with modeltool |
| 16:58.33 | JeffM | blender can do it too probably |
| 16:58.37 | KTL | the bzflag client can save a map as wavefront? |
| 16:58.44 | JeffM | but yeah trepan didn't make meshbox perfect |
| 16:58.48 | JeffM | yep |
| 16:59.10 | KTL | but only the svn trunk client i suppose? |
| 16:59.20 | JeffM | no, I don't think so |
| 16:59.33 | JeffM | IIRC he added that back in .8 or something |
| 16:59.40 | JeffM | it's an option on /saveword |
| 16:59.53 | JeffM | /saveword -obj or something |
| 17:00.00 | KTL | and not in the manpage ah interesting |
| 17:00.13 | JeffM | lots of things aren't in the man page ;) |
| 17:00.30 | JeffM | gotta love open source |
| 17:00.30 | KTL | and another issue i am afraid for |
| 17:00.34 | KTL | in modified mad city there are some porters on top of boxes |
| 17:01.01 | KTL | and when these get converted to meshboxes, something is different, cant use these porters anymore, without jumping |
| 17:01.13 | JeffM | yeah meshes have there own sets of problems |
| 17:01.25 | JeffM | bzflag's engine is not 100% generic for all geometry types |
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| 17:04.26 | JeffM | bugQ, how's your stuff coming? |
| 17:04.57 | bugQ | trying to figure out your template system |
| 17:05.07 | JeffM | cool |
| 17:05.12 | JeffM | got any questions? |
| 17:05.20 | bugQ | I may have some soon |
| 17:05.31 | JeffM | you don't have to use it if you don't want to, it's just there and prety simple. |
| 17:05.48 | bugQ | well, it seems cool, so I'd like to |
| 17:05.53 | JeffM | cool |
| 17:06.05 | JeffM | it's mostly just replacement callbacks |
| 17:06.13 | JeffM | and then the loop and logic controllers |
| 17:06.24 | JeffM | what plugin are you looking at as a sample? |
| 17:07.13 | sam | DTRemenak: but mingw doesn't put FTGL.h in an FTGL subdir, does it? |
| 17:07.34 | sam | brlcad, DTRemenak: anyway, I'm open to any suggestion, or direct fix :) |
| 17:08.17 | Erroneous | probably not, dunno...never tried it :) |
| 17:08.59 | Erroneous | tends to build with the in-tree dependencies |
| 17:16.19 | JeffM | Wyk3d, how is your stuff coming? |
| 17:17.13 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=wheeeeee@about/essy/indecisive/TD-Linux) |
| 17:18.53 | Wyk3d | JeffM: not too well .. haven't been able to get any work done this week inbetween exams |
| 17:19.28 | JeffM | ibot bzsocreport is Wyk3d, bugQ, lukster,KingOfCamelot, constitution, and epyon. sound off, report time! |
| 17:19.29 | ibot | okay, JeffM |
| 17:19.33 | JeffM | Wyk3d, suck |
| 17:19.40 | JeffM | when are they over? |
| 17:19.46 | Wyk3d | 25th is the last one |
| 17:19.54 | JeffM | ouch |
| 17:21.47 | Wyk3d | and as for how much has been done so far .. well take a gander at the bzauthd folder ;) .. got the libs ported, linked up and wrote some test code |
| 17:21.58 | JeffM | cool |
| 17:22.14 | JeffM | mostly just wanted to check and see if you are responsive, and you are, so good job ;) |
| 17:26.57 | *** join/#bzflag KingofCamelot (i=KingofCa@SCT-52-221.resnet.ucsb.edu) |
| 17:29.32 | *** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org) |
| 17:35.54 | JeffM | KingofCamelot, how's your stuff going? |
| 17:39.33 | *** join/#bzflag zee477 (n=554df0bf@gateway/web/cgi-irc/zeebrothers.net/x-8a58e6359639d8a9) |
| 17:43.19 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
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| 17:52.49 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 17:58.04 | *** join/#bzflag boots-and-braces (n=smiley@user-544538a6.lns4-c11.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 18:14.04 | KTL | good, if i can get the map as good looking in bzflag as it currently looks in blender it will be fine. |
| 18:14.36 | JeffM | looking good is easy, playing well is hard |
| 18:14.49 | JeffM | meshes have collision issues, that is a known problem |
| 18:15.30 | JBdiGriz | Wyk3d: It looks like your checkins are compiling for windows. Will you be building the bzauthd for Linux as well? |
| 18:53.01 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@pdpc/supporter/student/whodaman-) |
| 19:00.50 | *** join/#bzflag Constitution (n=const@unaffiliated/macsforme) |
| 19:02.12 | blast007 | KTL: it's /saveworld -o filename.obj |
| 19:02.26 | blast007 | and there is a ##BZW channel to, to answer your earilier question |
| 19:02.29 | blast007 | too* |
| 19:02.31 | KTL | myes, got that, it saves everything in a 1x1 area |
| 19:02.52 | KTL | and so after some blender operations i just discovered my world was euhm a small item in huge green field |
| 19:03.03 | KTL | i just scaled it up facter 800 |
| 19:03.06 | KTL | ah cool |
| 19:03.48 | *** join/#bzflag O-Neil (n=Miranda@dslb-088-070-235-227.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
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| 19:38.21 | CIA-33 | BZFlag: 03bthansen * r17386 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/Plan.cxx: Whitespace, Add editor footer |
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| 20:07.40 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v L4m3r] by ChanServ |
| 20:11.57 | KTL | if the texcoord's are given for a mesh, but the faces dont explicitly refer to them, what are the default references to them? (texcoords 0 1 2 3?) |
| 20:12.23 | JeffM | no |
| 20:12.38 | JeffM | if a vertex in a face dosn't have cooridantes, it tries to auto compute them |
| 20:12.48 | JeffM | then indexes you defined in the mesh will be ignored |
| 20:13.00 | JeffM | you ether define all the info or none of the info |
| 20:15.47 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-091-096-006-082.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 20:28.55 | *** join/#bzflag Think_Differentl (n=shedelj@unaffiliated/thinkdifferentl/x-838543) |
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| 21:05.35 | KTL | http://users.edpnet.be/dpf/bz/bzfi0106.jpg |
| 21:05.35 | KTL | http://users.edpnet.be/dpf/bz/bzfi0107.jpg |
| 21:05.35 | KTL | http://users.edpnet.be/dpf/bz/bzfi0108.jpg |
| 21:05.35 | KTL | converted modified mad city to meshes |
| 21:05.35 | KTL | and textured them |
| 21:05.35 | KTL | added skydome and mountains |
| 21:05.35 | _Lukstr | looks sexy |
| 21:05.35 | _Lukstr | JeffM: was the ? directed towards me last night? |
| 21:05.36 | KTL | most textures come from http://cbg.bzflag.org/images/A-Delusion |
| 21:05.36 | CBG` | KTL, with permission? |
| 21:05.36 | KTL | still got to find that out, but i dont distribute the files, i only refer to them |
| 21:05.36 | JeffM | CBG`, how are they licensed? |
| 21:05.36 | CBG` | JeffM: Not entirely sure, they're not mine. But as they're hosted on my domain (well, we can argue over who's it is if you like) I feel I ought to take an interest. |
| 21:05.42 | JeffM | was just curious |
| 21:05.48 | JeffM | but you show a good reason why auto trusting *.bzflag.org was a stupid idea ;) |
| 21:05.57 | CBG` | _I_ show? |
| 21:05.59 | JeffM | we really need to get those converted to bzflag.net |
| 21:06.20 | JeffM | CBG`, that stuff hosted on .bzflag.org domains may not be licensed for public viewing |
| 21:06.46 | CBG` | Indeed it might. But I'm not sure why you'd point the finger at me for that :P |
| 21:06.58 | JeffM | I didn't |
| 21:07.06 | JeffM | I just said that you just showed an example |
| 21:07.07 | JeffM | jeez man |
| 21:07.15 | CBG` | I've actually been meaning to have "the guys" stop using cbg.bz.org, fwiw. |
| 21:07.24 | JeffM | it's not always about you |
| 21:07.32 | CBG` | I didn't say it was. |
| 21:07.47 | CBG` | You did: ___you___ show a good reason why auto trusting *.bzflag.org was a stupid idea |
| 21:08.15 | JeffM | I was just saying that it was an example case |
| 21:08.16 | JeffM | that's all |
| 21:08.32 | JeffM | TimRiker, what say you about converting all the .orgs to .nets? |
| 21:08.57 | *** join/#bzflag mithro (n=tim@unaffiliated/mithro) |
| 21:09.19 | CBG` | Yes, it's an example case. I still don't see why you would reference it to me. That's all I was saying. |
| 21:09.20 | TimRiker | huh? wha? /me reads |
| 21:09.46 | CBG` | If Mr Riker finds it to be a problem, he's more than welcome to drop cbg.bzflag.org. |
| 21:09.49 | KTL | (tell me where the freely available pics are, if they exists pls ...) |
| 21:09.51 | JeffM | TimRiker, I propose that you take all the bzflag.org domains you've given out to people and make them JUST be .bzflag.net domains |
| 21:10.15 | JeffM | then .org is for official stuff, .net is users |
| 21:10.30 | JeffM | I know you have them setup for all .com, .org and .net right now |
| 21:10.46 | JeffM | but that gets into that problem with the image policy that we've talked about before |
| 21:11.11 | CBG` | ~seen delusional |
| 21:11.19 | ibot | delusional <n=delusion@unaffiliated/delusional> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 22h 21m 28s ago, saying: 'get crazy with the cheez whiz'. |
| 21:13.00 | TimRiker | well, the image policy should be to allow images.bzflag.org or something like that. |
| 21:13.10 | JeffM | TimRiker, we've changed that |
| 21:13.15 | JeffM | but I'd like to have further seperation |
| 21:13.35 | *** join/#bzflag bier (n=bier@p54A57D8E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:13.54 | JeffM | that will also help with certificates and cookies |
| 21:14.28 | CBG` | Is anyone else with access to a subdomain of bzflag.org using it for image hosting? |
| 21:14.33 | JeffM | we can do blind *.bzflag.org cookies and stuff if we know that only official stuff is on .org |
| 21:14.35 | TimRiker | k. we'd need to notify anc convert everyone to referencing the other name, then I could remove the .orgs. |
| 21:14.46 | JeffM | CBG`, techincaly anyone who has one can. |
| 21:14.59 | JeffM | TimRiker, yes, we need a transition |
| 21:15.09 | JeffM | TimRiker, do you have a list of the domains? |
| 21:15.12 | JeffM | I can do the contacting. |
| 21:15.16 | TimRiker | I'm not against it. |
| 21:15.17 | CBG` | Can, sure... But I suspect mine is the only one doing so, and if it is easier or more convenient, mine can be dropped. I won't cry. |
| 21:15.30 | JeffM | CBG`, probably |
| 21:15.35 | KTL | just a banner message in the message box of the client |
| 21:15.45 | CBG` | KTL: That won't be enough. |
| 21:15.51 | JeffM | CBG`, tho trepan had one but I don't know where it was hosted |
| 21:16.05 | TimRiker | wait... I thought JeffM said we already changed the images to not use *.bzflag.org ? |
| 21:16.13 | JeffM | TimRiker, for trunk |
| 21:16.17 | TimRiker | ah! |
| 21:16.18 | JeffM | it's a client change |
| 21:16.23 | JeffM | we can't cahnge old code |
| 21:16.32 | JeffM | that's why I'd like to do the .org -> net thing too |
| 21:16.36 | CBG` | The download access file is now default set to images.bzflag.org explicitly, as I take it |
| 21:17.24 | ts | Some running servers also use *.bzflag.org domains. |
| 21:17.37 | JeffM | ts, that's what we are talking about |
| 21:17.45 | JeffM | moving them to bzflag.net |
| 21:18.05 | JeffM | then disablin the .org |
| 21:18.17 | JeffM | and leaving .org for offical org related stuff |
| 21:18.53 | ts | I thought you only refered to the http stuff and probably forgot the running bzfs servers. |
| 21:19.05 | JeffM | ts, we don't diferentate |
| 21:19.11 | JeffM | so it has to be all of them |
| 21:19.35 | JeffM | it's great that we have the .net domain and can use it for users |
| 21:19.40 | JeffM | that's kinda what .nets are for |
| 21:19.42 | JeffM | networks :) |
| 21:20.14 | TimRiker | we have .com too, not that we use it for anything special. |
| 21:20.21 | JeffM | yeah I know |
| 21:20.42 | JeffM | tho following the origonal domain name standard, we'd use that for comercial aspects |
| 21:20.44 | JeffM | like the store |
| 21:20.45 | JeffM | but meh |
| 21:20.53 | JeffM | I'd just make it point to the .org domains |
| 21:21.02 | CBG` | nobody uses those "standards" :P |
| 21:21.09 | JeffM | I know |
| 21:21.15 | CBG` | but jeff's idea is sound imho |
| 21:21.45 | TimRiker | I don't see a downside other than just the work involved in moving. |
| 21:22.03 | JeffM | if you can get me the list I can start contacting everyone |
| 21:22.23 | TimRiker | pm me an email and I'll send you the zonefile. it has email contacts in it. |
| 21:22.28 | JeffM | and then just start giving you lists of them to knock off after they get converted. |
| 21:23.09 | JeffM | cool, I'll build up a form letter and send out |
| 21:24.12 | Thumper_ | JeffM: it was http://trepan.bzflag.bz/ IIRC most of that stuff has moved to louman.bzflag.bz I think |
| 21:24.24 | JeffM | Thumper_, ahh |
| 21:24.39 | KTL | belize ... |
| 21:25.15 | CBG` | expensive ... |
| 21:26.04 | Thumper_ | JeffM: the store should be at teh .com addr :) |
| 21:26.58 | TimRiker | Thumper_: yeah, he said that. it's at all three now, though I've not tried them all. |
| 21:27.21 | TimRiker | 4 if you count .bz |
| 21:27.42 | Thumper_ | sorry... /me isn't reading all the way down before typing... |
| 21:28.13 | Wyk3d | JBdiGriz: i was indeed planning to have it run linux .. i don't have one set up right now but i figured i could test it with mingw/cygwin for the time being .. and now that you mention it that's probably what i'm going to do next |
| 21:28.24 | TimRiker | though all the internals of the store use the .bz which they should not really. |
| 21:30.38 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-091-096-006-082.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:30.57 | TimRiker | from the store: "They are not longer offering..." hmm. not longer than what? :) |
| 21:31.11 | *** join/#bzflag AAA_awright_ (n=AAA_awri@wsip-68-14-251-102.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 21:31.38 | JeffM | yeah I have to redo the domains one of these days on the store |
| 21:31.41 | JeffM | it's just a PITA |
| 21:33.39 | TimRiker | nods |
| 21:34.59 | *** join/#bzflag AAA_awright__ (n=AAA_awri@wsip-68-14-251-102.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 21:35.50 | _Lukstr | Finally! A working system |
| 21:37.40 | TimRiker | JeffM: other than that, how's zen cart working out? I've not played with it yet. |
| 21:38.45 | JeffM | it's nice |
| 21:38.59 | JeffM | USPS changed pricing and formats so that screwed us up a bit |
| 21:39.27 | JeffM | and on it's products section I can't configure the pages exactly the way I want to, but I've goten to to work |
| 21:39.34 | JeffM | I wish it had better stock tracking options. |
| 21:39.36 | brlcad | yeah, I've been getting free t-shirts shipped to my house every day for months now, some bug in the cart |
| 21:39.44 | JeffM | heh |
| 21:39.48 | JeffM | you wish |
| 21:39.55 | brlcad | :) |
| 21:40.54 | JeffM | somehow I think ether myself or DTRemenak would notice that |
| 21:41.29 | JeffM | I wish I could do the sizes and colors in pulldowns and have it track the sock on them from a single product page, rather then having one product page per size/color combo |
| 21:41.41 | JeffM | but that's kina a minor thing for the little work it's taken to get it setup |
| 21:41.53 | JeffM | form an order processing standpoint it's prety easy |
| 21:42.14 | JeffM | I've had no problems, and Erroneous was even able to do it with a few simple instructions over IRC when I was sick |
| 21:44.58 | TimRiker | nods |
| 21:45.47 | TimRiker | you are aware of this: https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/ssl/ssl_opensource.asp yes? |
| 21:46.02 | JeffM | nope |
| 21:46.06 | TimRiker | are you using an ssl cert now? |
| 21:46.09 | JeffM | no |
| 21:46.15 | JeffM | cus we don't get any CC info |
| 21:46.21 | JeffM | it's all done via paypal |
| 21:46.26 | TimRiker | k. |
| 21:46.37 | JeffM | so a cert is used for them for all the financial info |
| 21:46.47 | JeffM | made it easier |
| 21:46.59 | JeffM | tho it'd be nice to have one |
| 21:47.16 | TimRiker | afaik godaddy will offer us a free cert that we have to renew each year. looks like they will NOT do a wildcard cert in that program, just a specific host cert. |
| 21:47.28 | JeffM | ahh |
| 21:48.03 | TimRiker | so something like secure.bzflag.org (or com) would be possible. and everything that wants ssl needs to be there. |
| 21:48.15 | JeffM | that could be very viable |
| 21:48.24 | TimRiker | nods |
| 21:48.28 | _Lukstr | I finally switched away from godaddy this month |
| 21:48.41 | TimRiker | _Lukstr: to what, if I may ask? |
| 21:48.42 | JeffM | I was going to wait on that untill we figured out what we wanted to do for money and biz stuff in the long run |
| 21:48.59 | _Lukstr | namecheap.com |
| 21:49.13 | JeffM | and on that note, brlcad any more work on an org? ;) |
| 21:49.25 | TimRiker | I'm pretty happy with godaddy, though the web interface keeps sucking more and more. |
| 21:49.28 | _Lukstr | they also support windows and linux clients for dynamic IPs |
| 21:49.32 | CBG` | domainsite.com has always been cheaper than godaddy afaik and seems to suffice |
| 21:49.33 | _Lukstr | that's precisely why I changed |
| 21:51.07 | TimRiker | I like the free dns from godaddy. no dyndns there though. I wish they would be secondary dns so I could avoid the ugly web interface. I host my own dns, but I consult with a few companies that use the godaddy stuff. |
| 21:58.33 | JeffM | there we go all tabulated, 49 domains to change |
| 21:58.37 | JeffM | or remove |
| 21:58.39 | JeffM | many look old |
| 21:58.49 | TimRiker | JeffM: looks like the ssl is not renewable. just good for a year. |
| 21:58.56 | JeffM | secretplace is gone isn't it |
| 21:59.05 | Mets | ~wanda++ for fixing compiling on solaris |
| 21:59.10 | JeffM | TimRiker, ahh, well once we figure out orgness we can buy one :) |
| 21:59.18 | JeffM | TimRiker, we've actualy turned a profit |
| 21:59.30 | TimRiker | ooh. rolling in the dough then? |
| 21:59.50 | JeffM | we've made back the inital investemenet |
| 21:59.53 | JeffM | and a little more |
| 22:00.00 | JeffM | and I still have like 40 items to sell |
| 22:00.14 | JeffM | so if all goes well, we'll have come close to doubling the money |
| 22:00.33 | TimRiker | I get donations from time to time. they have more than covered the domain registrations. the rest I apply to my internet connection. Not anything to write home about, but it's appreciated. |
| 22:01.01 | JeffM | I think the store's account is at like 580$ today |
| 22:01.36 | TimRiker | nice. you going to add the cafe-press logos we did before? they are still up, but not getting any traffic afaik. |
| 22:02.05 | JeffM | I'm not doing print on demand so I don't think I'll use those |
| 22:02.16 | JeffM | haven't decided what to do for a third run logo wise |
| 22:02.22 | JeffM | probalby have another contest |
| 22:03.10 | *** join/#bzflag CBG (n=CBG@cpc2-stme1-0-0-cust307.cdif.cable.ntl.com) |
| 22:03.57 | TimRiker | http://www.cafepress.com/bzflag/ heh. still says I'm in dallas. |
| 22:04.10 | TimRiker | everything there is at cost, so I never got any $$ from it. |
| 22:04.27 | TimRiker | course I never spent any setting it up either. |
| 22:04.52 | JeffM | there printing process sucks |
| 22:05.00 | JeffM | and the prices are HORIBLE |
| 22:05.43 | JeffM | that white sirt with 2 colors I could print for like 6$ |
| 22:05.47 | JeffM | shirt |
| 22:06.49 | TimRiker | yeah. but it was easy to setup. I'd like a higher quality O'Really shirt though. the cp ones do suck. |
| 22:08.01 | TimRiker | but if you're selling them at a profit, I don't know what the O'Reilly folks will think. |
| 22:09.35 | JeffM | even hanes is meh |
| 22:10.00 | JeffM | we used gildan ultra coton, they are very nice |
| 22:10.22 | Thumper_ | likes his cardinal red one |
| 22:10.29 | JeffM | yeah that one came out nice |
| 22:10.33 | JeffM | I like the navy too |
| 22:10.38 | JeffM | more then the charcoal |
| 22:10.40 | Thumper_ | those were my other two :) |
| 22:10.54 | JeffM | I do still have one hat left if anyone is interested |
| 22:11.11 | JeffM | only have 3 charchoal ones left oo |
| 22:11.15 | JeffM | 1 small 2 XL |
| 22:12.09 | JeffM | TimRiker, did you see the pictures of the polo shirt? |
| 22:12.13 | JeffM | it came out sweet |
| 22:12.17 | TimRiker | yep. gotta run. |
| 22:12.46 | CBG | jeff, can you do posters? i'm too lazy to find the store :P |
| 22:12.49 | *** join/#bzflag mithro (n=tim@unaffiliated/mithro) |
| 22:12.57 | JeffM | purple_cow, do you still need bhaskara.bzflag.org ? |
| 22:13.01 | purple_cow | hahaha, no |
| 22:13.10 | JeffM | cbg I've looked into it |
| 22:13.17 | JeffM | purple_cow, didn't think so :) |
| 22:14.26 | JeffM | blast007, you got anything using bzexcess.bzflag.org ? |
| 22:14.30 | CBG | JeffM: what was the price going to be, roughly? |
| 22:14.52 | JeffM | cbg it depended on how many we printed, but probably in the 8-10$ range |
| 22:14.57 | JeffM | that was the big variable |
| 22:15.03 | CBG | notices the alphabetical order and suspects he'll be next. |
| 22:15.04 | JeffM | the more I printed the lower it went |
| 22:15.15 | JeffM | heh |
| 22:15.23 | CBG | JeffM: I see.. and what's postage likely to be on that to the UK? |
| 22:15.29 | JeffM | dunno |
| 22:15.50 | JeffM | guess would be in the 17$ range |
| 22:16.04 | CBG | oh, ouch. I was gonna guess at $10 |
| 22:16.04 | JeffM | since that'd be the "under 4 lb" package price |
| 22:16.19 | JeffM | pfff. I can't even send a flat rate envelope to the UK for 10$ |
| 22:16.26 | CBG | $30 is a lot for a poster, despite the years spent playing bz... |
| 22:16.42 | JeffM | cheapepest to europe is 11.50 for the flat rate envelope |
| 22:16.50 | CBG | really? my bad... 've never posted anything anywhere so i'm aking wild guesses |
| 22:17.06 | JeffM | well it used to be cheaper |
| 22:17.10 | JeffM | but USPS raised rates |
| 22:17.14 | CBG | everything used to be cheaper |
| 22:17.25 | CBG | petrol (gas) USED to be under £1 |
| 22:17.38 | JeffM | and yeah the price for shipping and posters has not made me look into it that much |
| 22:17.50 | JeffM | I think I'd have to have printed like 250 posters |
| 22:17.54 | JeffM | and that's just a lot for us |
| 22:18.05 | JeffM | I don't think we'd sell that many |
| 22:18.26 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (n=vircuser@c-98-197-19-50.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 22:18.26 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 22:18.26 | JeffM | the next thing I look at will be different hats, and maybe coffie cups |
| 22:18.32 | CBG | Yeah, i understand |
| 22:18.53 | JeffM | so on your domain, CBG can you start to convert the links to .net? or do you care? |
| 22:18.56 | _Lukstr | oooh coffee cups is a good idea |
| 22:18.57 | CBG | it'd be a poster that I'd look at speficically, to be honest. |
| 22:19.28 | CBG | JeffM: I would like to keep the domain, albeit the .net, but it will take a while to get everything switched about |
| 22:19.41 | JeffM | yeah I figured it would |
| 22:19.50 | JeffM | the .net should be setup right now |
| 22:20.02 | JeffM | so I'll just mark you as converting in the ist |
| 22:20.03 | JeffM | list |
| 22:20.10 | JeffM | I figure this will take a while ( weeks ) |
| 22:21.16 | CBG | yeah |
| 22:21.21 | JeffM | just the ones I can talk to here are easier then sending form letters to :) |
| 22:21.50 | CBG | well, I'm totally out of the loop as it is. cbg.bz.org is mostly just used by the mofo group so I gotta contact everyone there to change their map files and whatnot. :( |
| 22:21.54 | CBG | true |
| 22:22.31 | Thumper_ | coffee cups!! :) |
| 22:22.56 | blast007 | JeffM: nope, I don't have anything using that hostname |
| 22:23.08 | JeffM | blast007, do you want to convert it or delete it? |
| 22:23.11 | JeffM | Thumper_, maybe |
| 22:23.36 | JeffM | I can do 25 cups for under 10$ each our cost so it may be viable. |
| 22:23.36 | blast007 | delete it |
| 22:24.18 | blast007 | I think I had it there for the BZWGen textures |
| 22:24.36 | blast007 | but we should migrate those to the official image hoster |
| 22:26.23 | Thumper_ | most of the louman map textures are at louman.bzflag.bz now - they should probably all be moved too |
| 22:26.50 | Thumper_ | louman sent the textures to me and I hosted them on louman.bzflag.bz - should I get LouMan to submit them to the official image hosting site? |
| 22:27.09 | Thumper_ | there are lots I think |
| 22:27.38 | CBG | I'd say, Louman and yourself are trusted enough just to load them straight on and skip the verification process - but it's nothing to do with me so I'll butt back out. |
| 22:27.55 | blast007 | I think delusional suggested that we should make a batch import system |
| 22:28.09 | *** join/#bzflag PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@208.43.126.194) |
| 22:28.43 | Thumper_ | there's 161 png texture files at louman.bzflag.bz |
| 22:28.45 | blast007 | just not entirely sure how that would work |
| 22:29.03 | spldart | I think I'd be in on a coffee cup if one becomes available |
| 22:29.04 | blast007 | I assume we'd want to have valid license/author info for all the files, right? |
| 22:29.46 | blast007 | as well, there *are* currently some files in images.bzflag.org that don't have license info, since they didn't have the license .txt file when I upgraded |
| 22:29.59 | CBG | I'd take a pint glass at the right price. |
| 22:30.26 | spldart | ooOOoo.. BZFlag flasks |
| 22:31.10 | CBG | Forget flasks... BZflag branded TVs, PCs, Phones, Consoles, Microwaves |
| 22:31.22 | CBG | Toasters, Ovens, Fridge Freezers |
| 22:31.42 | CBG | Washing Machines, Tumble Dryers, Light Bulbs. |
| 22:31.52 | spldart | yikes |
| 22:32.21 | JeffM | L4m3r, you using L4m3r.bzflag.org for anything? |
| 22:32.22 | CBG | Forget the game, that's not important, it doesn't turn anything over! This whole BZ-Branded Merchandise is where the money (and action!) is at! |
| 22:34.44 | JeffM | I could probably do a pint glass, have to figure out how to ship em |
| 22:35.13 | JeffM | probably do them under 10$ a glass |
| 22:35.44 | JeffM | probably find out how these guys do it, and match that pricing, http://www.goats.com/store/pints/ |
| 22:35.50 | CBG | I'd definitely consider it... depends on the price and shipping costs again though. |
| 22:36.46 | JeffM | they are basicly 17$ for a glass, shipped to europe |
| 22:37.34 | CBG | I'd take one at that price. Would you combine items and reduce shipping if I took more than one thing? :) |
| 22:38.03 | JeffM | for those, I'd probably need special boxes for them. so they'd have to go seperately |
| 22:38.11 | CBG | ahha, ok. |
| 22:38.15 | JeffM | and I don't think I could put anything else in there |
| 22:38.25 | JeffM | it's not like I'd toss them in a bag or something ;) |
| 22:38.38 | JeffM | the store currently combines shipping by weight |
| 22:38.40 | *** join/#bzflag Falseprophet (n=Chee@unaffiliated/emonemo) |
| 22:38.54 | CBG | You wouldn't? But I thought i was ordering glass shards... |
| 22:43.42 | JeffM | yeah glass or ceramics would be hard |
| 22:44.37 | JeffM | Winny, you using fusion.bzflag.org ? |
| 22:45.23 | Winny | was using it for textures and a GU match server, not sure if I used it for the server anymore.. lemme check |
| 22:45.44 | Winny | nope, only for textures now |
| 22:45.57 | JeffM | you need to change the links on those textures to .net |
| 22:46.00 | JeffM | from .org |
| 22:46.04 | Winny | ok |
| 22:46.05 | JeffM | the .org will be removed |
| 22:46.24 | Winny | is *.bzflag.net on the whitelist? |
| 22:46.28 | JeffM | nope |
| 22:46.31 | Winny | hmm |
| 22:46.40 | JeffM | get your textures on images.bzflag.org |
| 22:46.43 | Winny | does the image uploader allow >4mb PNGs now? |
| 22:46.49 | JeffM | dunno |
| 22:46.55 | Winny | pokes blast007 |
| 22:47.02 | JeffM | but if not we can work it out for you if you want |
| 22:47.12 | JeffM | they all your images? |
| 22:47.16 | Winny | yeah |
| 22:47.31 | JeffM | how many of them are there? |
| 22:47.46 | Winny | 25-30 maybe? |
| 22:47.55 | JeffM | what license? |
| 22:48.07 | Winny | creative commons |
| 22:48.21 | JeffM | hmmm, then they need to go into the submiter |
| 22:48.50 | Winny | http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/2.5/ca/ |
| 22:48.59 | JeffM | don't care about the specific |
| 22:49.02 | Winny | k |
| 22:49.19 | JeffM | if it's not "anyone" I can't just throw them into a dir for you, since they need the license display of the submiter |
| 22:50.35 | *** join/#bzflag Constitution (n=const@unaffiliated/macsforme) |
| 22:52.12 | *** join/#bzflag Constitution (n=const@unaffiliated/macsforme) |
| 22:52.37 | *** join/#bzflag QuantumT1m (n=tim@62-249-230-206.no-dns-yet.enta.net) |
| 22:54.33 | KTL | with all these meshes |
| 22:54.46 | KTL | how is the system supposed to know what is the inside of a building? |
| 22:54.56 | KTL | so that nothing can spawn there |
| 22:54.57 | JeffM | KTL, with inside points |
| 22:55.26 | KTL | ... what if the mesh is not continous, has gaps? |
| 22:57.19 | KTL | and i got the feeling that flags dont fall on flat meshes either |
| 22:57.21 | CBG | multiple inside points |
| 22:58.13 | KTL | but those points are just coordinates in real space, what rule prevents something from spawning between them? |
| 22:59.28 | JeffM | KTL, we fire a ray from the inside point to the tank, if it crosses an odd number of faces it's outside |
| 22:59.57 | CBG | Say you have the eight points required to mark out a cube? You add an inside point that is inside the cube, this makes the cube solid. |
| 23:00.21 | KTL | oki, makes sense |
| 23:00.48 | spldart | Kewl.. I always wanted to know how that worked. |
| 23:00.56 | spldart | really needs to add some inside points. |
| 23:01.21 | JeffM | so yeah gaps, are bad |
| 23:01.35 | JeffM | you want your geometry to be manifold |
| 23:01.51 | JeffM | if there are no inside points we'll use the center of the bounding box |
| 23:01.51 | KTL | mmm this needs to be checked for ... all inside points for the whole map -> dont add to many inside points |
| 23:02.17 | JeffM | for manifold convex shapes, that is fine |
| 23:02.24 | JeffM | you use inside points for concave shapes |
| 23:02.42 | JeffM | like I said, meshes have there own sets of problems |
| 23:02.43 | JeffM | ;) |
| 23:03.04 | KTL | mmm fun :) |
| 23:03.20 | JeffM | Constitution, you using fairserve.bzflag.org ? |
| 23:04.59 | Constitution | yes |
| 23:05.08 | Constitution | why? |
| 23:05.14 | JeffM | Constitution, you need to convert it to bzflag.net |
| 23:05.19 | JeffM | we are getting rid of the .orgs |
| 23:05.22 | Constitution | okay |
| 23:05.26 | JeffM | thanks |
| 23:05.32 | Constitution | np |
| 23:06.15 | JeffM | AHA, you still using aha.bzflag.org ? |
| 23:12.03 | *** join/#bzflag Epyon (n=Epyon@90-156-93-82.magma-net.pl) |
| 23:14.50 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (n=bryjen@CPE-76-177-176-191.natsoe.res.rr.com) |
| 23:14.51 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v bryjen] by ChanServ |
| 23:19.23 | AHA | JeffM, nope |
| 23:20.06 | JeffM | AHA, then I'll delete it, thanks |
| 23:20.13 | AHA | no prob :) |
| 23:20.21 | AHA | thanks for letting me use it :D |
| 23:20.42 | JeffM | that was all Tim :) |
| 23:20.49 | *** join/#bzflag mithro (n=tim@unaffiliated/mithro) |
| 23:20.52 | JeffM | I just need to know what to convert to .net |
| 23:21.50 | AHA | JeffM, your not using bzflag.org any more? |
| 23:21.58 | JeffM | not for users |
| 23:22.02 | JeffM | just for official stuff |
| 23:22.04 | AHA | ah |
| 23:22.06 | AHA | okay |
| 23:22.09 | JeffM | .org for offiical, .net for users |
| 23:22.23 | JeffM | then we can do more with cookies and certificates on .org |
| 23:25.48 | AAA_awright | http://bzflag.redjacket.ws/ is finally running on a dedicated server which I can sabotage with process intensive tasks |
| 23:26.55 | Constitution | JeffM: .com for pay-to-play? ;) |
| 23:27.14 | JeffM | Constitution, heh |
| 23:27.25 | JeffM | probably just have the com's point to the .orgs |
| 23:31.23 | JeffM | JBdiGriz, you guys still use proxs.bzflag.org? |
| 23:34.51 | JBdiGriz | Someone was using it, but I'm not sure they are around anymore. |
| 23:35.03 | JBdiGriz | I can check with the email list. |
| 23:35.17 | JeffM | I don't think it's active now, it' just going to convert to .net |
| 23:35.41 | JBdiGriz | If anyone complains, I'll let them know, but I doubt anyone will. |
| 23:35.44 | JeffM | k |
| 23:36.18 | JeffM | it'll be nice to clear out the dead ones too :) |
| 23:36.26 | AAA_awright | Those don't point to the my.bzflag.org server I assume |
| 23:36.46 | Constitution | blissfully recalls silvercat.bzflag.org |
| 23:36.48 | JeffM | AAA_awright, no, I'm just doing the ones that don't point to the project web servers. |
| 23:40.03 | spldart | aaaahhhh...... silvercat :) |
| 23:44.21 | Constitution | is there any way to submit images to images.bzflag.org without licensing them for just anyone to use? |
| 23:44.32 | AAA_awright | remembers the origional HiX on xmission.bzflag.org and twin spirals on Secretplace |
| 23:45.55 | Constitution | not something I'm terribly worried about, but I really don't want other people using our Divibox logos and stuff in their maps |
| 23:46.15 | JeffM | Constitution, no |
| 23:46.24 | JeffM | that is the point of sharing |
| 23:46.30 | AAA_awright | You can license it to prohibit that I thought |
| 23:46.39 | JeffM | AAA_awright, you can sure, but we won't host it |
| 23:46.50 | JeffM | we offer hosting for those that offer free reuse |
| 23:46.55 | JeffM | share and share alike |
| 23:47.03 | AAA_awright | "propritary" isn't a license option? |
| 23:47.15 | JeffM | not for our hosting |
| 23:47.41 | JeffM | if you want to have us host images for you then anyone has to be able to use them |
| 23:47.48 | JeffM | just like us hosting map releases on bzbb |
| 23:48.10 | JeffM | we are in it for the sharing |
| 23:48.52 | Constitution | the difference being that you can host a map without releasing it on the bzbb, whereas you won't be able to use textures without sharing them with everyone else |
| 23:49.02 | AAA_awright | Personally I would give users the choice to write their own license (not to get into RMS vs Torvalds debates) |
| 23:49.23 | JeffM | AAA_awright, they can, they just cant do that and host thru us |
| 23:49.34 | JeffM | the image submiter is only for stuff WE will host for YOU |
| 23:49.39 | AAA_awright | Which basically means you can't use the image |
| 23:49.52 | JeffM | sure you can, the user would just have to edit the access file |
| 23:50.12 | JeffM | or hit the "allow 3rd party images" thing we want to impllement later |
| 23:50.21 | AAA_awright | I mean, it isn't effectively feasible |
| 23:50.36 | AAA_awright | Oh, that idea |
| 23:50.37 | JeffM | noone ever said we had to provide hosting for any image |
| 23:51.06 | JeffM | or that the default configuration of the software had to be setup to work with every possible use |
| 23:51.09 | AAA_awright | Well seeing that the default config only allows BZFlag-approved images (in some way or another) |
| 23:51.15 | JeffM | so? |
| 23:51.18 | JeffM | that's just a default |
| 23:52.10 | AAA_awright | How many people will change an access file even if you tell them to. Didn't you consider some sort of parental control option that would allow any images? |
| 23:52.11 | JeffM | the default config also only lists games on our list server... |
| 23:52.26 | JeffM | yeah the file can be perm locked on the OS |
| 23:52.29 | JeffM | by the parrent |
| 23:52.43 | AAA_awright | That could work well, if it was implemented for each OS effectively |
| 23:52.51 | AAA_awright | idk much about that though |
| 23:53.02 | JeffM | it's up to the OS to lock it |
| 23:53.03 | JeffM | not us |
| 23:53.07 | JeffM | that's how it is now |
| 23:53.43 | JeffM | I'd just like to eventualy have a nicer interface on it where when you go to a server that uses forbiden images, you get a prommpt to allow |
| 23:53.47 | AAA_awright | For Vista you at least have to register with the OS what resources are locked I thought |
| 23:53.52 | JeffM | and you can pick that server, or any, etc.. |
| 23:54.00 | JeffM | AAA_awright, naw you can lock a file |
| 23:54.08 | JeffM | that's what the shell does ;) |
| 23:54.18 | JeffM | file perms and groups, etc.. |
| 23:56.44 | AAA_awright | Constitution: Couldn't you create the logo with textured object primitives? |
| 23:57.02 | Constitution | eh heh |
| 23:57.28 | JeffM | that can be stolen just as easy |
| 23:57.45 | *** join/#bzflag CBG` (n=CBG@cpc2-stme1-0-0-cust307.cdif.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:57.55 | AAA_awright | It would be messy though |
| 23:58.01 | JeffM | no, just save the map |
| 23:58.03 | Constitution | I don't care about it being stolen... it was obviously available on my server before to be downloaded. I care about being able to do something about it when it is. |
| 23:58.42 | AAA_awright | It is about the license, not if you can steal it or not |
| 23:58.52 | JeffM | menotume, you guys use league.bzflag.org still? |
| 23:59.02 | Constitution | Sharing software is cool; sharing maps are cool; both are generic, re-usable things. Using someone else's server logo isn't quite the same thing. |
