| 00:20.13 | *** join/#bzflag Will07c5_ (n=William@c-67-173-127-196.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 00:27.33 | *** join/#bzflag em (n=em@c-24-20-183-163.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:40.09 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v SportChick] by ChanServ |
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| 01:06.07 | *** join/#bzflag em (n=em@c-24-20-183-163.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 01:07.11 | Not_Gabe_G23 | Would putting "bind z down "set leadingShotLine 0"" in config.cfg make the client change from leading to lagging shots on the radar in *live-time*? |
| 01:07.32 | Not_Gabe_G23 | Live-time meaning immediately - not requiring a client restart. |
| 01:13.48 | *** join/#bzflag trepan (n=trepan@unaffiliated/trepan) |
| 01:13.50 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v trepan] by ChanServ |
| 01:20.53 | Not_Gabe_G23 | No one :| |
| 01:21.09 | JefferyM | try it and see |
| 01:24.00 | JefferyM | depends on the code, but local bzdbvars are set on the key events |
| 01:28.37 | *** join/#bzflag Swigg (n=Default@bzflag/player/Swigg) |
| 01:30.59 | trepan | DVI cables do make a difference :) |
| 01:33.02 | *** join/#bzflag nsquare (n=chatzill@c-71-56-70-78.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 01:33.58 | JefferyM | that they do |
| 01:36.03 | Bulldozer | Should I submit an application for review first to GSoC, or make it available via some other means? (PDF, Wiki, Blog, etc.) |
| 01:36.23 | Bulldozer | is also KingRobot, fyi |
| 01:36.38 | JefferyM | you can edit it after you submit |
| 01:36.43 | JefferyM | and we all will comment on it |
| 01:36.49 | JefferyM | so yeah right into the SOC app |
| 01:36.50 | JefferyM | :) |
| 01:36.52 | DTRemenak | submit it. when you get our comments you can edit it. |
| 01:37.00 | Bulldozer | Okey dokey |
| 01:37.58 | JefferyM | thinks the VC2005 installer should say "really?" when he installs it on the netbook |
| 01:39.02 | *** join/#bzflag em (n=em@c-24-20-183-163.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 01:39.09 | trepan | heh |
| 01:39.22 | em | Hey |
| 01:39.35 | JefferyM | it's got a 160 gig drive, what else am I going to put on it? |
| 01:39.48 | em | Idk |
| 01:39.56 | JefferyM | huh? |
| 01:40.04 | em | Idk |
| 01:40.10 | JefferyM | that is not a word |
| 01:40.15 | em | I don't know (idk) |
| 01:40.17 | JefferyM | and we weren't really talking to you ;) |
| 01:40.25 | em | Ok |
| 01:40.37 | em | Then bi I guess |
| 01:40.47 | JefferyM | you don't have to leave |
| 01:40.55 | *** join/#bzflag Abominable_ (n=Abominab@cpe-071-077-060-196.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 01:40.58 | JefferyM | just that comment was not directed at you at that moment :) |
| 01:40.59 | em | Idc |
| 01:41.07 | em | Lolz |
| 01:41.12 | JefferyM | riiighht |
| 01:41.13 | em | :j |
| 01:41.24 | JefferyM | IRC is not your cell phone |
| 01:41.47 | em | Huh? |
| 01:41.53 | JefferyM | exactly |
| 01:42.05 | em | I'm really confused |
| 01:42.15 | JefferyM | so you see my point then |
| 01:42.18 | JefferyM | excelent |
| 01:42.19 | em | Wut r u talking bout |
| 01:42.32 | JefferyM | please use real english here |
| 01:42.51 | em | *sigh* |
| 01:42.56 | em | Fine |
| 01:43.18 | em | I don't know what u re talking about |
| 01:43.21 | JefferyM | ohhh.. SO sorry for putting you through ALLL the trouble of using a known language |
| 01:43.34 | JefferyM | I know you don't |
| 01:43.41 | em | ??? |
| 01:43.42 | JefferyM | there isn't a requirement that you do |
| 01:43.44 | trepan | s/u re/you are/ |
| 01:43.52 | em | Me? |
| 01:44.11 | JefferyM | you were the one that poped in to another conversation |
| 01:44.21 | em | Who me |
| 01:44.46 | JefferyM | nevermind |
| 01:44.52 | em | Ok |
| 01:45.04 | em | So how old are you? |
| 01:45.10 | JefferyM | older then you |
| 01:45.12 | JefferyM | that's for sure |
| 01:45.15 | JefferyM | 12? |
| 01:45.16 | em | Ok |
| 01:45.17 | JefferyM | 13? |
| 01:45.30 | em | Your 12 or 13? |
| 01:45.37 | JefferyM | no, my guess is that you are |
| 01:45.42 | JefferyM | not more then 15 probably |
| 01:45.47 | em | What makes you guess that |
| 01:45.49 | trepan | hopefully? |
| 01:45.55 | JefferyM | the way you act |
| 01:46.06 | JefferyM | or you are looking to pull some flaimbait |
| 01:46.06 | em | I see |
| 01:46.08 | JefferyM | and that's a possibility |
| 01:46.21 | em | U never know |
| 01:46.27 | em | You |
| 01:46.31 | JefferyM | actualy, I usualy do |
| 01:46.36 | em | O yea |
| 01:46.41 | trepan | em: You, getting better :) |
| 01:46.57 | em | Nm |
| 01:47.00 | em | Hmmm |
| 01:47.08 | JefferyM | how big is your display trepan ? |
| 01:47.11 | em | Better about what? |
| 01:47.18 | spldart | :-/ |
| 01:47.57 | em | î·î·î¶î¶ |
| 01:48.18 | JefferyM | ok, that's about enough |
| 01:48.20 | JefferyM | bye |
| 01:48.22 | trepan | 24", 1920x1200 |
| 01:48.25 | *** kick/#bzflag [em!n=JefferyM@bzflag/projectadmin/JeffM] by JefferyM (JefferyM) |
| 01:48.34 | *** join/#bzflag em (n=em@c-24-20-183-163.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 01:48.36 | JefferyM | yeah, DVI helps a lot with that |
| 01:48.46 | em | ....... |
| 01:48.54 | JefferyM | are you done, em ? |
| 01:48.55 | em | What I do? |
| 01:49.00 | em | With? |
| 01:49.01 | JefferyM | anoyances |
| 01:49.09 | em | I guess |
| 01:49.10 | JefferyM | k |
| 01:49.31 | Think_Differentl | mmm, people trolling #bzflag. tasty. |
| 01:49.43 | em | ? |
| 01:50.11 | JefferyM | Think_Differentl, it happens, tis the nature of internet + anonimity |
| 01:50.14 | JefferyM | such is life |
| 01:51.20 | em | Huh? |
| 01:51.57 | em | ? |
| 01:52.19 | JefferyM | can we help you with anything em? why did you come here? |
| 01:52.45 | em | Um no idea |
| 01:53.07 | JefferyM | you have no idea why you came into IRC and joined this channel? |
| 01:53.35 | em | Nope none at all |
| 01:53.57 | JefferyM | I find that very hard to believe |
| 01:54.28 | em | Ok then I guess your gonna have 2 |
| 01:54.41 | Bulldozer | JeffM: Nice about the 160Gb hard-drive... You should dual-boot OS X on it. |
| 01:54.43 | em | Because I have no idea |
| 01:55.04 | JefferyM | em, going to call BS on that one, based on your channel list. |
| 01:55.14 | em | ? |
| 01:55.21 | spldart | For a long time I didn't really see the need for an upgrade from your standard vga connect.. but when you get to HD + or - territory then dvi and hdmi really do shine. |
| 01:55.48 | Bulldozer | Devs/Mentors et. al. If you have a moment to to take away from your troll, I just submitted a first draft of my application; if you guys could look it over and let me know what you think, that'd me fantastic. |
| 01:55.56 | Bulldozer | ;) |
| 01:56.28 | JefferyM | it'll be a bit before I can look at it |
| 01:56.32 | spldart | Not to mention the elimination of ground loops. |
| 01:56.35 | JefferyM | what project is it for? |
| 01:56.41 | JefferyM | bots? |
| 01:56.46 | *** part/#bzflag em (n=em@c-24-20-183-163.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 01:57.07 | Bulldozer | Yes; I'm KingRobot from earlier... Bulldozer is my bz nick though; I thought it'd be more useful. |
| 01:57.24 | JefferyM | I know |
| 01:57.31 | JefferyM | you were just pondeting more then one project |
| 01:57.39 | JefferyM | so I was just curious what one you ended up picking |
| 01:57.44 | JefferyM | are you going to submit more then one? |
| 01:58.03 | Bulldozer | Well this one is for bots... |
| 01:58.24 | Bulldozer | I may submit more than one based on your advice, but this is the one I'm primarily interested in. |
| 01:59.15 | Bulldozer | And the bots project could end up benefitting a lot of areas you want worked on, depending on how it ends up. |
| 02:00.09 | JefferyM | possibly |
| 02:00.21 | JefferyM | I'm not a fan of students getting sidetracked down other tasks |
| 02:00.28 | JefferyM | even if it's work that's needed |
| 02:01.01 | Bulldozer | I think you'll see from my background that shouldn't be much of a concern. |
| 02:01.20 | JefferyM | no mater how much you think you can handle it, stuff happens :) |
| 02:01.26 | JefferyM | also it's a lot harder to track |
| 02:01.44 | Bulldozer | Presumably I will be working with mentors all along the way - so there should be plenty of you to make sure it doesn't happen. |
| 02:01.51 | JefferyM | SOC goes REALLY fast when you get into it |
| 02:01.56 | Bulldozer | I believe it. |
| 02:02.14 | JefferyM | well I'm thinking on the lines of us all having you do logic cleanups on the way in the main code, etc... |
| 02:02.19 | JefferyM | those kinds of side tasks |
| 02:02.29 | Bulldozer | You know Constitution? |
| 02:02.39 | JefferyM | I do |
| 02:02.46 | JefferyM | he was my student last year |
| 02:02.55 | JefferyM | I've also had the pleasure of meeting him personaly |
| 02:02.56 | Bulldozer | He's a good friend of mine (geographically, even) |
| 02:03.03 | JefferyM | bzflag done bought him a pizza |
| 02:03.13 | Bulldozer | So, I think I have some idea of what I'm getting into :) |
| 02:03.21 | Bulldozer | I followed his work last year with interest. |
| 02:03.35 | JefferyM | then you shold know that even he had a number of problems last year with his project |
| 02:03.43 | Bulldozer | I was actually his supervisor at his other job at the time, lol. |
| 02:03.49 | Bulldozer | Oh yes, I heard about them. |
| 02:04.46 | JefferyM | most of that was because of me, and how I got him sidetracked doing a task that was related to his poject, but ended up being a lot nastier then he needed |
| 02:04.57 | JefferyM | it was somewhat of a cleanup project too |
| 02:05.01 | JefferyM | that is just why I fear :) |
| 02:05.12 | Bulldozer | Anyhow, point being, from that and other experience, I know how easy it can be to get off track. |
| 02:05.29 | JefferyM | cool |
| 02:06.30 | Bulldozer | So, if after looking the app over, you don't think it will work out, let me know, and I'll apply for some other project. |
| 02:07.06 | JefferyM | oh I don't think it'll be that bad :) |
| 02:07.19 | JefferyM | we actualy rank em all after we get all the applications |
| 02:07.27 | JefferyM | that's why we recomend submiting more then one |
| 02:07.37 | JefferyM | and we rank on person not just project |
| 02:08.39 | Bulldozer | I saw the ranking criteria somewhere on the wiki |
| 02:08.57 | Bulldozer | assuming it's still current :) |
| 02:09.02 | JefferyM | it is |
| 02:09.30 | Bulldozer | These, yes? http://my.bzflag.org/w/Google_Summer_of_Code_Evaluation |
| 02:10.07 | JefferyM | yeah that's what we plan to use again |
| 02:10.39 | Bulldozer | My wife says to say that 2.99 look nice, btw, lol :) (She likes the graphics improvements) |
| 02:10.54 | Bulldozer | s/look/looks/ |
| 02:11.44 | Bulldozer | Is there going to be any further work on the new server list gui? |
| 02:12.14 | Bulldozer | I thought it could use a semi-transparent background, to make it easier to see/read all the text. |
| 02:12.34 | JefferyM | only if someone does it |
| 02:12.43 | JefferyM | we don't realy "plan" most of our features |
| 02:13.09 | Bulldozer | has an idea for the required patch then... |
| 02:13.40 | JefferyM | feeds |
| 02:13.47 | Bulldozer | food is a good idea |
| 02:13.49 | Bulldozer | bbl |
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| 02:23.33 | a_meteorite | I'm afraid to announce that zombies had invaded Jeff's house and stole his food, which prompted his quick IRC exit to retrieve said food. |
| 02:23.41 | a_meteorite | ;) |
| 02:26.46 | Bulldozer | does he live near here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTzfXYF6BPg |
| 02:27.22 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=Jeff@adsl-76-243-140-190.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:27.23 | a_meteorite | They're spreading |
| 02:27.36 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM] by ChanServ |
| 02:28.09 | a_meteorite | Bulldozer: They're comin%!$*%& [NO CARRIER] |
| 02:29.44 | a_meteorite | Very subtle quit message. |
| 02:36.02 | brlcad | Bulldozer: did you get my answers earlier about bzrobots? |
| 02:36.38 | brlcad | also, the eval categories and motivation on the wiki are correct, but not the actual ranking values -- that part has changed |
| 02:37.07 | JeffM | brlcad, so you are going to go with the "kittens" method this year? |
| 02:37.19 | brlcad | kittens? :) |
| 02:37.24 | JeffM | joke |
| 02:38.27 | brlcad | actually been thinking a fair bit about how we did it last year .. there were some really nice aspects and some not-so-nice aspects |
| 02:38.42 | brlcad | better than the year before, but still lacking |
| 02:38.45 | JeffM | should paint this thing white, and put an apple logo on it and call it the "macbook air mini" |
| 02:39.00 | JeffM | yeah it could use a refactor |
| 02:39.19 | a_meteorite | put osx86 on it and sell it for $1500 at that point. |
| 02:39.27 | a_meteorite | if you want to be completely evil. :) |
| 02:39.32 | JeffM | it'll run as a hackintosh |
| 02:39.48 | JeffM | I may do it, if I partion the drive ever again |
| 02:40.08 | JeffM | well and find non-msi windows media |
| 02:40.15 | *** join/#bzflag nightstrike (n=nightstr@210.212.97.141) |
| 02:40.22 | brlcad | given we're only taking two or three, an even more simplified process will probably work |
| 02:40.28 | JeffM | yeah |
| 02:40.31 | brlcad | like a modified condorcet vote |
| 02:40.35 | a_meteorite | I think for the most part osx86 sets up on the netbooks quite well |
| 02:40.42 | JeffM | think she will try to force us to take more again? |
| 02:40.57 | brlcad | no |
| 02:41.01 | JeffM | good |
| 02:41.06 | brlcad | already told her we were intentionally taking way fewer |
| 02:41.09 | JeffM | k |
| 02:41.09 | brlcad | she was intrigued |
| 02:41.29 | JeffM | quality over quantity |
| 02:41.42 | brlcad | (as part of the motivation is to see how things change if we focus same amount of attention on way fewer students) |
| 02:42.09 | brlcad | yeah, especially given some of the sentiments she's noticed for some orgs where more students per org seems to help the org |
| 02:42.12 | a_meteorite | any good proposals yet (even better, are they on the wiki)? |
| 02:42.18 | JeffM | a_meteorite, 2.0.10 runs at about 70fps at full res with eveything on, on a moderatly simple server |
| 02:42.23 | brlcad | because the students form their own community (which I could see as good and bad) |
| 02:42.36 | JeffM | yeah you could be lazy mentors that way |
| 02:42.37 | brlcad | a_meteorite: check wiki edit history, there are a few |
| 02:42.48 | a_meteorite | JeffM: GMA 950? sounds about right considering the CPU |
| 02:42.57 | JeffM | yeah |
| 02:43.00 | JeffM | must overclock it :) |
| 02:43.05 | a_meteorite | hehe |
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| 03:07.12 | nightstrike | hey everyone, any clue as to how I can test the changes I make to the RegionPriorityQueue file? |
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| 03:55.45 | Bulldozer | ping brlcad |
| 04:18.40 | Will07c5 | thinks he may have figured out the dead reckoning bug for real |
| 04:20.36 | blast007 | cool |
| 04:20.42 | Will07c5 | it seems to be caused by inputPos in the Player class not being updated when it should, which causes the tank to be suspended in the air for a split second following a jump |
| 04:22.05 | Will07c5 | my "fix" was just to change one line to use state.pos but I think the correct fix would be to figure out why setDeadReckoning isn't being called when it should |
| 04:23.35 | JeffM | it should be called on each update |
| 04:25.13 | Will07c5 | ok |
| 04:25.24 | Will07c5 | should inputPos and state.pos ever be different? |
| 04:25.40 | JeffM | IIRC input pos is only valid for local players |
| 04:25.45 | JeffM | remotes should never have input :) |
| 04:25.51 | JeffM | DR should totaly work on the sate |
| 04:26.01 | JeffM | what line are you talking about? |
| 04:27.08 | Will07c5 | line 1120 in Player.cxx |
| 04:27.45 | Will07c5 | well inputPos seems to be used extensively for dead reckoning |
| 04:28.28 | Will07c5 | and it is definitely not just for local players |
| 04:28.41 | JeffM | it is the state at the start of the update |
| 04:28.53 | JeffM | it's basicly where it was when the timestamp was stamped |
| 04:29.06 | JeffM | see setDeadReckoning |
| 04:29.20 | JeffM | that's basicly the "known good" point |
| 04:29.38 | JeffM | the rest of DR is extrapolating from that point to where we think they are now |
| 04:30.03 | Will07c5 | that makes sense |
| 04:31.28 | Will07c5 | hmmm... actually maybe this is because at that point it may not have received the packet telling it that the remote player has hit the ground |
| 04:32.18 | JeffM | yeah, the remote player won't send the packet untill they hit the ground |
| 04:32.25 | JeffM | DR is suposed to stop them first |
| 04:32.39 | JeffM | that's why it set the Z vector to 0 |
| 04:32.42 | JeffM | to stop it from falling |
| 04:32.51 | JeffM | so it'll just move along the ground untill the next update |
| 04:33.00 | JeffM | then we'll have valid vectors from when it was on the ground |
| 04:33.08 | Will07c5 | ok |
| 04:33.08 | JeffM | basicly DR always has to play a catchup game |
| 04:33.11 | JeffM | it can never be perfect |
| 04:33.24 | JeffM | so there will always be some error when we get an update |
| 04:33.29 | JeffM | but the goal is to make it a very small error |
| 04:33.39 | Will07c5 | yeah I know that |
| 04:35.36 | Will07c5 | couldn't it just be fixed by setting inputPos[2] = 0 when DR detects that it hit the ground? |
| 04:35.55 | JeffM | no |
| 04:36.07 | JeffM | hmmm |
| 04:36.27 | JeffM | but that gives me an idea |
| 04:36.34 | JeffM | make a fake startpont |
| 04:36.48 | JeffM | set the pos XYZ to be where we hit the ground |
| 04:36.57 | JeffM | set the Z of the vector to be 0 |
| 04:37.02 | JeffM | and set the timestamp to be "now" |
| 04:37.08 | JeffM | then we'll DR from there |
| 04:37.11 | JeffM | sliding along the ground |
| 04:37.23 | JeffM | if you just set the Z, the X and Y and time won't match |
| 04:37.34 | JeffM | the point of that postion is that it matches the timestamp |
| 04:37.44 | JeffM | but if we make a new point that matches a new timestamp.... |
| 04:37.51 | JeffM | so try this |
| 04:37.55 | JeffM | when we hit the ground |
| 04:37.59 | Will07c5 | ah so just call setDeadReckoning with the current timestamp when it hits the ground? |
| 04:38.26 | JeffM | after the state is updated to the postion |
| 04:38.35 | JeffM | and the Z vector is set to 0 |
| 04:38.45 | JeffM | or just update the stuff directly |
| 04:38.51 | JeffM | since the rest of it isn't going to change |
| 04:39.13 | JeffM | we need to do that when we hit anything in Z tho |
| 04:39.15 | JeffM | not just the ground |
| 04:39.34 | JeffM | basicly we have to predict the falling to driving transition |
| 04:39.59 | Will07c5 | hmm... alright |
| 04:40.06 | Will07c5 | I'll get to it! |
| 04:40.48 | Will07c5 | thanks for the guidance :) |
| 04:40.53 | JeffM | sure |
| 04:40.58 | JeffM | good job narowing in on it :) |
| 04:41.16 | Will07c5 | thanks |
| 04:44.38 | JeffM | that does explain why it happens in 2.0.x too, just to a lesser degree, not as long as a DT |
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| 06:27.10 | Constitution | hi Bulldozer :) |
| 06:27.36 | Bulldozer | Hi Consti :) |
| 06:27.45 | Bulldozer | Got freenode to drop my nick for me :) |
| 06:28.56 | Bulldozer | is now KingRobot & Bulldozer |
| 06:29.25 | Constitution | congrats |
| 06:29.30 | Bulldozer | 'twas registered but hadn't been used for 3.5 years... |
| 06:30.31 | *** join/#bzflag kumarabhi (n=chatzill@115.241.50.34) |
| 06:31.14 | Constitution | now you just need a shiny bzflag cloak :) |
| 06:31.14 | *** join/#bzflag kumarabhi (n=chatzill@115.241.50.34) |
| 06:34.43 | pacman87 | Constitution: a shiny cloak defeats the purpose of CL |
| 06:35.41 | PositiveG | no, he means a bzflag cloak to hide your host (?) when you join IRC. I think... |
| 06:36.01 | PositiveG | unless I misunderstand you both |
| 06:36.26 | pacman87 | i know what he meant, i was referring to the CL flag in the game |
| 06:36.38 | PositiveG | Ok, nvm then |
| 06:40.42 | Constitution | hehe |
| 06:41.02 | Constitution | technically if it makes you invisible I don't think it matters how shiny it is |
| 06:41.10 | Constitution | because there's no opacity to reflect anything |
| 06:41.22 | pacman87 | then it can't be shiny |
| 06:41.37 | Constitution | I suppose |
| 06:41.41 | Bulldozer | cloak as in mine (unaffiliated/kingrobot) vs his (bzflag/developer/Constitution), the latter of the two being Shiny |
| 06:42.12 | Bulldozer | PositiveG had it right |
| 06:44.28 | Constitution | pacman87 made an informed observation, nonetheless :) |
| 06:44.42 | Bulldozer | :) |
| 06:47.31 | Constitution | Bulldozer: it seems that your proposal includes a good deal of code refactoring and modularization, to abstract code needed by both bzrobots and the client. would you say that's correct? |
| 06:48.11 | Bulldozer | yep |
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| 06:49.44 | Constitution | ok, so where the code is duplicated you would remove the duplicate code, make bzrobots dependant on the client code again, and abstract as you go? |
| 06:51.04 | Bulldozer | Correct; JeffM says there's a lot of duplicate code that (possibly) has been patched in the client but maybe not in the robots |
| 06:51.46 | Constitution | ok, well abstracting code is a big job in itself |
| 06:52.05 | Bulldozer | Since the refactoring/modularizing/abstracting is going to take place anyway, I'd see it better to just get rid of the duplicate code and start from the client code. |
| 06:53.07 | Constitution | yeah, the client code wasn't written for bots |
| 06:53.47 | Bulldozer | Also it will help with other projects that need some of that code abstracted anyway. |
| 06:54.00 | Bulldozer | My primary goal is not to be abstracting the code. |
| 06:54.07 | Constitution | or their work can help you :) |
| 06:54.28 | Bulldozer | But anything that needs to be abstracted to get the bots cleaned up, I'd take up that task. |
| 06:54.45 | Bulldozer | And yes, either way, assuming that someone gets that project... |
| 06:56.23 | Constitution | would you agree that if we're going to have code refactored into libgame and liblogic or libwhateverelse, perhaps *that* would be a better thing for you to link into rather than tying back into the client code and factoring it out again? |
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| 06:57.14 | Bulldozer | Not sure I understand what you're asking... |
| 06:57.43 | Constitution | well, it sounds like you are proposing to modularize code used by both the client and robots |
| 06:57.56 | Bulldozer | Correct... |
| 06:58.16 | Constitution | we have something of a Plan (tm) for how that should go, or we kinda do |
| 06:58.54 | Bulldozer | Well, of course I would be planning to follow whatever plan you guys have for that. |
| 06:59.10 | Constitution | but that's like an entire summer project's worth and more... and it seems like just one bullet point of your proposal |
| 06:59.27 | Constitution | unless I'm misunderstanding you |
| 07:00.08 | Bulldozer | I'm not proposing to do -all- of that. |
| 07:00.12 | Bulldozer | For example... |
| 07:00.29 | Bulldozer | Currently, bzrobots must be linked to CrackedGlass.cxx in order to run... |
| 07:01.22 | Bulldozer | Clearly CrackedGlass.cxx isn't necessary for a command line robot... maybe for the gui. |
| 07:02.00 | Bulldozer | bzrobots is linked to AutoPilot.cxx |
| 07:02.06 | Bulldozer | It shouldn't need that at all. |
| 07:02.26 | Bulldozer | So whatever code is causing dependencies like that would be reworked |
| 07:03.43 | Constitution | so you would be abstracting strictly the code that's bzrobots-related and client-related? |
| 07:03.49 | Bulldozer | right |
| 07:04.11 | Bulldozer | The other thing is that if you look in botplaying.cxx, there's a lot of code in there that is identical to code in the client |
| 07:05.03 | Bulldozer | Since most of that code is (and will be) the same, it ought to be split out from both the client and the bot into something shared. |
| 07:05.36 | Bulldozer | Besides those two things, I don't plan on much more redoing of existing code. |
| 07:05.45 | Bulldozer | But I do expect those two things to take a good while. |
| 07:08.02 | Constitution | here... Jeff summarized the libgame idea really well in a comment on one of the other applicant's proposals: http://my.bzflag.org/w/User_talk:IneQuation.pl |
| 07:11.05 | Constitution | if another student proposes and is accepted for the "modularization of game logic" idea on our list, how would you coordinate your work with his to avoid duplicate effort and make sure you're moving in the same direction? |
| 07:17.05 | Constitution | it seems to me the logical order is to make our "state library" and then tie bzrobots into it, rather than factoring client and robot stuff out piece by piece |
| 07:17.43 | Bulldozer | That depends on if you see the robot as having a GUI or not... |
| 07:19.04 | Bulldozer | The way it's set up now, the bots have a gui, which requires a huge portion of the client code (a lot more than just the "state library") |
| 07:19.56 | Bulldozer | In other words, the robots need almost everything from the client |
| 07:20.17 | Bulldozer | ... except the actual UI; meaning the key commands, menus, etc. |
| 07:20.44 | Constitution | okay I see |
| 07:21.27 | Constitution | so bzrobots doesn't depend on the client code for the state stuff (shots, movement, collisions,etc.)? |
| 07:21.41 | Bulldozer | depends on it for that too |
| 07:21.51 | Constitution | ok |
| 07:23.34 | Bulldozer | So, to use the example from the IneQuation info, I don't really plan on doing any of that |
| 07:25.35 | Constitution | I would be interested in hearing more details about what you _would_ be abstracting out |
| 07:26.02 | Constitution | the more detailed your proposal is (even if we need to help you refine it), the more interested we are in it :) |
| 07:26.46 | Bulldozer | I plan on reducing the dependencies to what is actually necessary; presumably that is the state info and the "raw gui" (by which I mean the basic 3d rendering done to show the world and the other tanks) |
| 07:28.06 | Bulldozer | Currently that isn't possible due various things that are cross-referenced by other code that is necessary - that's the only area I'd be changing in the client |
| 07:28.50 | brlcad | Bulldozer: pong |
| 07:28.57 | Bulldozer | ah brlcad |
| 07:29.13 | Bulldozer | you asked if I saw a response you'd made about the robots |
| 07:29.19 | Bulldozer | my thought was "what response" |
| 07:29.27 | Bulldozer | so I either didn't see it, or missed it... |
| 07:30.38 | Bulldozer | ... or didn't understand it |
| 07:30.48 | Bulldozer | ... or some other such thing :) |
| 07:31.30 | Bulldozer | Anyhow, if you could restate it, I'd be obliged :) |
| 07:36.49 | brlcad | Bulldozer: sure |
| 07:36.51 | brlcad | 16:12 < brlcad> KingRobot: if you have the time to do two polished applications, I would recommend that just because we're taking so few slots for bz this year |
| 07:36.54 | brlcad | 16:14 < brlcad> KingRobot: and yeah .. an inter-server communication proposal would have a *really* fantastic from a strong dev to beat out some of the other higher-priority refactoring projects |
| 07:36.58 | brlcad | 16:14 < brlcad> continuing previous gsoc projects and projects that focus on improving our existing code quality (instead of just adding to it with new code) are the main focus this year |
| 07:37.02 | brlcad | 16:15 < brlcad> and part of the reason to take fewer slots, so we can focus on those people |
| 07:37.05 | brlcad | 16:15 < brlcad> as for the patch, best way to impress the devs no matter what your project is to make an impressive patch (or set of patches) ;) |
| 07:38.05 | brlcad | second line was crap-worded, "would have to be a *really* fantastic proposal" |
| 07:38.20 | Bulldozer | I gathered as much... |
| 07:38.35 | Bulldozer | Have you had a chance to see my first application? |
| 07:38.40 | brlcad | i.e. stick to the robots one, that's good stuff -- but maybe submit something else just in case |
| 07:38.56 | Bulldozer | gotcha |
| 07:39.00 | brlcad | (if you have time, of course, and it doesn't detract from making your main application even better) |
| 07:40.05 | brlcad | you don't have to, and if it comes down to spending time on a patch or a second proposal, go for the patch |
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| 14:24.21 | adityav | Hi, I am Aditya. I am interested in working on the project "Modularization of OpenGL logic" as a GSOC applicant. I am hoping someone would give me details on the same |
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| 16:08.08 | blast007 | adityav: basically our OpenGL code is mixed in with game logic, networking, input, etc |
| 16:08.38 | blast007 | :/ |
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| 16:21.15 | blast007 | adityav: (in case you missed this) basically our OpenGL code is mixed in with game logic, networking, input, etc |
| 16:21.30 | blast007 | have you looked at the code yet? |
| 16:22.45 | adityav | i have downloaded it, haven't browsed it yet |
| 16:23.36 | blast007 | ok |
| 16:25.04 | blast007 | this might be of help: http://trepan.bzflag.bz/gl-files.txt |
| 16:25.32 | adityav | oki |
| 16:26.55 | adityav | lots of files |
| 16:27.31 | adityav | so basically i would be making an abstract class which will bring together all the opengl code? |
| 16:29.49 | blast007 | not sure if "abstract class" would be the right term (I'm much better with PHP than C++) ;) but the idea is to get it centralized into a library |
| 16:32.17 | blast007 | as JeffM has said, the OpenGL one should be easier than the game logic project because it's quite obvious what is "drawing" code |
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| 16:34.24 | blast007 | adityav: have you read our acceptance requirements? |
| 16:34.40 | adityav | well, game engines use an abstract class to handle all functions |
| 16:34.41 | adityav | yes i have |
| 16:36.48 | adityav | i was planning to go make a patch once i understood what kind of requirements are there for the project |
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| 16:58.10 | blast007 | hi JefferyM |
| 16:58.26 | JefferyM | sup |
| 16:58.36 | blast007 | adityav is interested in the OpenGL modularization project |
| 16:58.45 | JefferyM | ok |
| 16:59.05 | blast007 | 11:27:31 < adityav> so basically i would be making an abstract class which will bring together all the opengl code? |
| 16:59.16 | JefferyM | that'd be one way |
| 16:59.30 | JefferyM | I think it should be more then one class :) |
| 16:59.37 | JefferyM | drawables, etc.. |
| 16:59.47 | blast007 | right :) |
| 17:00.11 | blast007 | adityav: do you have any idea of what kind of patch you wanted to do? |
| 17:00.17 | JefferyM | state should keep the octree code because collisions still need it |
| 17:00.33 | JefferyM | the drawing code should query state for the objects that are vissable, then add drawables for them |
| 17:00.46 | JefferyM | then simply sort those drawables by material and draw them |
| 17:01.22 | JefferyM | the drawable classes, and some sort of "world" renderer class should all work using a master "renderer" thingy |
| 17:01.31 | JefferyM | it dosn't have to be a class |
| 17:01.34 | JefferyM | it can be static methods |
| 17:01.42 | JefferyM | but a class would be easy to overide later |
| 17:02.02 | JefferyM | but a phase one would be just to move all the code to a known set of Cpp files |
| 17:02.10 | JefferyM | just so you know where it all is :) |
| 17:03.40 | KingRobot | JeffM/blast007 et al: Have you guys had a change to look over my app yet? |
| 17:04.13 | KingRobot | s/change/chance/ |
| 17:04.47 | JefferyM | I haven't no |
| 17:04.54 | JefferyM | I was at work rather late last night |
| 17:05.01 | JefferyM | and now I'm in the middle of 2 things |
| 17:05.13 | JefferyM | hasn't even figured out how to login to the thingy |
| 17:05.46 | JefferyM | must figure out how to make a custom filter to merge bugs |
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| 17:06.49 | KingRobot | Okay, fair enough |
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| 17:20.08 | trepan | if you look at http://trepan.bzflag.bz/gl-files.txt, it's mostly the bzflag/* files that have 'mixed' code |
| 17:20.28 | trepan | geometry/, scene/, and ogl/ are dedicated to rendering anyways |
| 17:22.48 | trepan | (and 3D/ :) |
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| 17:26.50 | JefferyM | you have been reviewed KingRobot |
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| 17:27.30 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03bthansen * r19532 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/logDetail/logDetail.cpp: |
| 17:27.30 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: Add support for callsign display of server generated messages |
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| 17:28.25 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: Plugin generated events that come from the server should not generate |
| 17:28.26 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: raw chat events which get filtered since that generates two events |
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| 17:28.30 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: message event. |
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| 18:20.59 | JefferyM | joevano, accept your mentor invite, you slacker |
| 18:21.07 | blast007 | hehe |
| 18:21.09 | JefferyM | you need a SOC shirt that fits ;) |
| 18:21.35 | brlcad | haha |
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| 18:24.04 | JefferyM | spldart, sign up to be a mentor, you slacker |
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| 18:25.12 | brlcad | BulletCatcher: interested in being a mentor? |
| 18:25.36 | JefferyM | Greywhind, you gonna be a student this year? |
| 18:25.48 | JefferyM | can you tell I'm going down the user list? :) |
| 18:26.12 | BulletCatcher | Sort of, but I don't think I can afford the time commitment. |
| 18:26.32 | JefferyM | we could not asign a student to you |
| 18:26.33 | Greywhind | JefferyM: heh. i'm definitely going to apply to at least one org. |
| 18:26.49 | JefferyM | just to have you as "if you are around to comment" kinda thing |
| 18:26.52 | JefferyM | and you get a free shirt |
| 18:26.56 | JefferyM | Greywhind, cool |
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| 18:27.23 | JefferyM | BulletCatcher, we like to have extra mentors around just to have people "there" |
| 18:27.35 | Greywhind | JefferyM: would you like to talk about what kind of project i might apply to do for BZFlag? |
| 18:27.44 | JefferyM | you seem to be on a decent amount, care about the code, have knowledge, communicate wel, etc.. |
| 18:28.07 | JefferyM | Greywhind, if you want to. I was just curious, you had mentioned that you had thought about applying last year |
| 18:28.16 | Greywhind | yeah, but i wasn't 18 yet :P |
| 18:28.24 | JefferyM | are you now? |
| 18:28.25 | Greywhind | yes |
| 18:28.26 | BulletCatcher | I don't need a t-shirt, but I am happy to contribute what I can. |
| 18:28.30 | JefferyM | cool |
| 18:28.33 | Greywhind | agreed :D |
| 18:28.41 | JefferyM | BulletCatcher, it's not about need, free shirt :) |
| 18:28.50 | Greywhind | anyway, i would be interested in applying to BZFlag, if there's a good project I think I could work on |
| 18:29.03 | JefferyM | there are lots of good proejcts |
| 18:29.09 | brlcad | Greywhind: well is there a good project you think you would work on? |
| 18:29.20 | Greywhind | i haven't had time to look at the list yet - let me do that now |
| 18:29.45 | brlcad | we'd be interested in having you apply to BZFlag, if there's a good project you are sure you could work on ;) |
| 18:29.48 | JefferyM | BulletCatcher, sign up here, http://socghop.appspot.com/ and give us your "link ID" |
| 18:29.50 | JefferyM | we' |
| 18:29.56 | JefferyM | we'll then send you a mentor request |
| 18:30.02 | JefferyM | then you just have to fill in some crap |
| 18:30.12 | JefferyM | if you want |
| 18:30.29 | JefferyM | like I say it's just to kinda fill out the ranks so that students don't feel left in the dark |
| 18:30.38 | JefferyM | we won't demand you make any specific time or anything |
| 18:30.44 | BulletCatcher | k |
| 18:30.57 | JefferyM | and you can always leave if you want, there is a nice "resign" button |
| 18:31.09 | BulletCatcher | reads the web page |
| 18:31.24 | brlcad | well, JefferyM doesn't -- I expect your third born child as payment for services rendered |
| 18:31.48 | JefferyM | brlcad, what do you do with all of them? |
| 18:32.21 | brlcad | growing an army of code monkies |
| 18:32.26 | BulletCatcher | I'll have to check with Mrs. Catcher to see if we are willing to part with our cat. ;-) |
| 18:32.39 | Greywhind | do you guys know of any projects that you'd like to see done that haven't gotten many apps so far? |
| 18:33.21 | blast007 | Greywhind: well, what kind of project would you want to do? |
| 18:33.31 | JefferyM | what are your area's of interest :) |
| 18:34.05 | Greywhind | i have experience with C++, and i pretty much enjoy any part of working on game development. |
| 18:34.19 | blast007 | have you seen our ideas page? |
| 18:34.28 | Greywhind | i've also used SDL, but I haven't done much 3D graphics work |
| 18:34.44 | Greywhind | i've been looking at the page just now |
| 18:34.47 | brlcad | Greywhind: we're taking fewer slots this year and trying to focus on release so you're best bet will be to pick one of our higher priority projects, even if it means you're competing against others |
| 18:34.51 | blast007 | k |
| 18:34.57 | Greywhind | brlcad: ok. |
| 18:35.11 | brlcad | otherwise, you'll have to really make a fantastic proposal to get a lower-priority project accepted |
| 18:35.31 | brlcad | e.g., from the apps already received, two-player tanks doesn't have a chance ;) |
| 18:35.54 | Greywhind | so you'd be most interested in seeing a bug fixing or cheat prevention proposal |
| 18:35.58 | Greywhind | even if there are already a bunch |
| 18:36.41 | brlcad | bug fixing, refactoring, anticheats, or continuation of a previous gsoc project |
| 18:36.56 | Greywhind | ok, thanks |
| 18:37.13 | nightstrike | hi guys, can you review my application again? |
| 18:38.48 | brlcad | in due time, someone will :) |
| 18:38.54 | brlcad | or is |
| 18:38.58 | nightstrike | :) |
| 18:39.50 | KingRobot | JeffM et al: So, if I eliminate Phase II, part 2, then it looks good? |
| 18:40.14 | *** join/#bzflag adityav (n=bl@59.178.42.43) |
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| 18:45.40 | nightstrike | shall I submit it as a proposal from the GSoC page? |
| 18:46.11 | spldart | 8-0 |
| 18:46.23 | *** join/#bzflag jcp (n=jw@unaffiliated/javawizard2539) |
| 18:46.33 | brlcad | nightstrike: from the sochop site, yes |
| 18:46.44 | me1 | bzbb spammer: http://my.bzflag.org/bb/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=37587 |
| 18:47.04 | brlcad | release the hounds! |
| 18:47.18 | nightstrike | seems like we have to type it in there. Can't use my pdf :| |
| 18:48.15 | brlcad | nightstrike: you could provide a link to your pdf |
| 18:48.28 | nightstrike | nah, the copy paste works perfectly :) |
| 18:49.30 | nightstrike | done! I've just submitted it |
| 18:49.50 | brlcad | great! |
| 18:54.28 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19536 10/trunk/bzflag/include/common.h: * parenthesis for macro parameters |
| 18:54.42 | nightstrike | brlcad, is it ok? |
| 18:55.11 | nightstrike | I think the formatting got screwed again :| |
| 18:58.47 | brlcad | few extraneous things in there |
| 18:59.12 | brlcad | nightstrike: just did a quick pass over, looks detailed -- someone will add comments :) |
| 18:59.32 | nightstrike | thanks |
| 18:59.55 | brlcad | curious, what did the original pdf look like |
| 18:59.59 | nightstrike | I've put up a link as well to the pdf as well, hope it lives up to i'ts hype :D |
| 19:00.29 | nightstrike | I'm going to make it snappier, as soon as I can complete that patch. Will be ready with it by Monday hopefully. |
| 19:01.26 | brlcad | likes the pdf better ;) |
| 19:01.41 | brlcad | cool |
| 19:01.46 | nightstrike | :) |
| 19:02.00 | brlcad | yeah, patches are going to be even more important this year than they were last year |
| 19:02.13 | KingRobot | brlcad: did you see my application? |
| 19:02.23 | brlcad | yep |
| 19:02.35 | nightstrike | the code I wrote was running well independently, but somehow didn't fit well into the app, most strangely. I'll get it done soon and show it to you guys |
| 19:02.36 | brlcad | few comments, I'll post them later today |
| 19:02.42 | KingRobot | brlcad: ok, thanks |
| 19:03.24 | nightstrike | I'm calling it a day. Real tired. Will you guys be posting the comments somewhere or should I come here and discuss it with you all? |
| 19:03.26 | brlcad | nightstrike: er, "fit well into the app" means what? |
| 19:03.48 | nightstrike | hehe, it's throwing a seg fault which I'm struggling to find |
| 19:04.04 | brlcad | comments are posted right on the application, but you be available here to discuss it as well from time to time |
| 19:04.26 | brlcad | you can idle if you're not here and let the irc client keep highlights of people talking to you |
| 19:04.40 | nightstrike | sure thing |
| 19:04.50 | nightstrike | so I'll leave my laptop here in the server room itself :) |
| 19:04.55 | brlcad | or if you do leave, just be sure to come back from time to time :) |
| 19:04.56 | KingRobot | Have any of you experienced a bug with trunk where, using keyboard, the tank will get "stuck" moving forward? |
| 19:05.46 | nightstrike | I'll be online right after breakfast tomorrow. Thats like around 9 hours from now |
| 19:06.18 | brlcad | reiterates that he thinks someone should show their skill by fixing src/3D/FontManager.cxx:~FontManager destructor crash on clear() |
| 19:07.24 | brlcad | nightstrike: cool, cya |
| 19:07.37 | nightstrike | see ya! Thanks for your time |
| 19:08.04 | nightstrike | leaves |
| 19:08.05 | trepan | brlcad: or by rewriting the class, preferably with ref-counting and optional time holdoffs ;) |
| 19:09.00 | brlcad | trepan: I don't think the problem is actually in that class |
| 19:09.54 | trepan | i haven't seen the crash in a while, how to reproduce these days? |
| 19:10.05 | brlcad | uncomment the code that causes the crash :) |
| 19:10.32 | trepan | where ? |
| 19:10.36 | trepan | not tagged with a FIXME ? |
| 19:10.43 | brlcad | src/3D/FontManager.cxx:~FontManager |
| 19:11.17 | trepan | there isn't any commented code in FontManager::~FontManager() |
| 19:12.14 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r19537 10/trunk/bzflag/src/3D/FontManager.cxx: and on the sixth day, he said 'let there be crashes' |
| 19:13.34 | KingRobot | brlcad: how to reproduce? |
| 19:13.37 | trepan | so removing code (that should be there anyways), causes the crash? |
| 19:16.09 | brlcad | hm, this looks rather different from the last time I poked around in here -- someone's already changed it pretty substantially |
| 19:17.27 | brlcad | trepan: before, there were contains that were iterated over during FontManager::clear() -- that just did a delete on the memory and removed the items from the container |
| 19:18.14 | brlcad | it'd crash deep up in a freetype destructor while destructing the fonts |
| 19:18.29 | *** join/#bzflag Swigg (n=Default@bzflag/player/Swigg) |
| 19:18.39 | brlcad | short term fix was just don't release the memory *ahem* |
| 19:18.45 | brlcad | let application exit deal with it |
| 19:19.41 | brlcad | KingRobot: if it's still there, you can't miss it -- all you have to do is run bzflag and it'll crash on exit |
| 19:19.56 | brlcad | checking now |
| 19:21.40 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r19538 10/trunk/bzflag/src/3D/FontManager.cxx: unregister the context invalidated callback as well |
| 19:23.01 | KingRobot | ... building now |
| 19:23.56 | brlcad | it's changed so much, I wouldn't be surprised if it's gone now .. but someone would have to check with valgrind first to make sure we're actually cleaning up memory |
| 19:25.32 | KingRobot | won't be able to check under linux for a bit, but I'll give valgrind a go later today |
| 19:26.42 | Thumper_ | JefferyM: is there any reason the plugin code is .cpp while the rest of the BZFlag source is .cxx? |
| 19:27.12 | Thumper_ | ... reason *why* the ... |
| 19:27.36 | brlcad | Thumper_: because he's a rebel! |
| 19:27.38 | brlcad | with a leather jacket |
| 19:27.45 | brlcad | and a bike |
| 19:27.56 | Thumper_ | I knew that... that does explain it.. :) |
| 19:28.54 | brlcad | there was no reason other than the plugins are arguably a subproject, at least no technical reason |
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| 19:29.40 | trepan | r19538 = reverted r19537? :) |
| 19:30.05 | brlcad | trepan: no, there was just a space removed |
| 19:30.22 | brlcad | first comment uncommented clear(), second uncommented the deregister |
| 19:31.09 | trepan | svn diff -r 19536:19538 src/3D/FontManager.cxx (just changes in comments) |
| 19:33.34 | Thumper_ | nope. first commented unregister, second uncommented it. clear() just changes in the indent |
| 19:36.06 | KingRobot | brlcad: r19538 doesn't crash on exit here... (under Vista) |
| 19:37.26 | *** part/#bzflag KingRobot (n=mathew@unaffiliated/kingrobot) |
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| 19:49.29 | brlcad | huh, that is bizarre |
| 19:50.01 | brlcad | oh ya know what, I bet I had it locally modified already |
| 19:52.09 | brlcad | aaaand, that'd be why it was locally modified... crash |
| 19:52.37 | trepan | cool :) |
| 19:52.40 | brlcad | I'd apparently commented it out at some point to avoid the crashes |
| 19:53.31 | brlcad | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m4d316f24 |
| 19:53.48 | brlcad | it's a corrupt stack, fwiw |
| 19:55.27 | brlcad | it does catch several of the assertions you added trepan |
| 19:55.50 | trepan | i removed assertions, iirc |
| 19:56.04 | brlcad | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m7fa76e0d |
| 19:56.12 | brlcad | ftgl assertions |
| 19:56.21 | brlcad | or maybe that was sam |
| 19:56.24 | trepan | ya, i limited the count to 8 |
| 19:56.48 | trepan | they were a nuisance ;-) |
| 19:56.52 | brlcad | heh |
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| 21:07.04 | brlcad | black_pearl: glad to hear you're interested, but you should speak up in public |
| 21:07.29 | black_pearl | srry...it is my first time here. |
| 21:07.41 | *** join/#bzflag KingRobot (n=mathew@unaffiliated/kingrobot) |
| 21:07.43 | brlcad | don't be shy, DTRemenak is the only one you should fear, he's a mean mo-fo |
| 21:10.52 | black_pearl | the faqs listed on the bzflag-site were very helpful in building src from vc++8 |
| 21:13.19 | black_pearl | BZRobots seems a very interesting project... do we have to design the algo for the bots as well? |
| 21:13.29 | joevano | JefferyM:done, didnt realize there was more to do.. I submitted a request and it said org_accepted |
| 21:14.15 | joevano | i figured, I submited a request and they accepted so me having to accept that they accepted didn't reall follow :P |
| 21:15.19 | blast007 | black_pearl: we use VC++ 9 for trunk code, actually |
| 21:15.23 | blast007 | the 2008 version |
| 21:15.39 | blast007 | builds with the express edition |
| 21:16.00 | black_pearl | yeah...i used VC++ 9 |
| 21:16.04 | blast007 | k |
| 21:16.19 | brlcad | black_pearl: absolutely not |
| 21:16.38 | brlcad | you wouldn't be working on the bots themselves, that's for later -- this is setting up the basic infrastructure |
| 21:16.48 | brlcad | and is a continuation of a previous gsoc project from two years ago |
| 21:17.25 | black_pearl | i will check out the project details of the previous years |
| 21:18.03 | brlcad | black_pearl: there's some info on the wiki http://my.bzflag.org/w/BZRobots as well as in the sources it's mostly at src/bzrobots |
| 21:18.27 | brlcad | if you have any questions, just ask them here |
| 21:18.34 | black_pearl | k |
| 21:21.00 | brlcad | black_pearl: you can read a (very) high-level overview of the project on page 6 of http://my.bzflag.org/gsoc/bzflag_gsoc2007_post_mortem.pdf |
| 21:21.19 | brlcad | Thumper_: invite pending |
| 21:38.01 | Erroneous | yeah, gotta watch out for that DTRemenak character... |
| 21:42.14 | black_pearl | what are developments which are to be done this year in BZRobots |
| 21:46.11 | *** join/#bzflag black_pearl (i=nhmsdg@h1342075.stratoserver.net) |
| 21:50.04 | black_pearl | i am also interested in the project "modularization of openGL logic" , do i have to submit a patch ? |
| 21:50.51 | Erroneous | all prospective students need to submit a patch. doesn't have to be anything major, just something that shows us you understand the code and can build the project. |
| 21:53.00 | black_pearl | can u please suggest an idea for which a patch would be suitable |
| 21:54.23 | TyroneFHornigh | You can always check the bug list |
| 21:54.35 | black_pearl | k |
| 21:57.30 | blast007 | black_pearl: getting BZRobots to build/work on Windows would be one of the major goals ;) |
| 21:58.11 | black_pearl | ya , will definitely be trying on that . |
| 21:58.43 | blast007 | black_pearl: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d1fdd9df3 |
| 21:58.46 | Thumper_ | brlcad: thx |
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| 22:02.14 | *** join/#bzflag PositiveG (n=sniper15@S0106002191dd19a8.gv.shawcable.net) |
| 22:03.06 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19539 10/trunk/bzflag/tools/modeltool/ (Q3BSP.cxx model.h modeltool.cxx wavefrontOBJ.cxx): (log message trimmed) |
| 22:03.06 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * changed the re-indexing algorithm to use a std::map<> (much faster) |
| 22:03.06 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * changed the floating point output format to "%g" |
| 22:03.06 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * added 'o' as an OBJ grouping type (wings3d and blender both use it) |
| 22:03.06 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * added the -nogroup option (OBJ 'o' and 'g' grouping is ignored) |
| 22:03.10 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * added the -noground option (do not clamp the model to z=0) |
| 22:03.12 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * added the -rr option (reportReindex) |
| 22:05.08 | *** part/#bzflag KingRobot (n=mathew@unaffiliated/kingrobot) |
| 22:07.57 | trepan | forgot to note, changed the vertex/normal/texcoord data accumulation for OBJ grouped wavefront parsing (was using 1.2G to parse a meager 25K vertex mesh, instead of 20M) |
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| 22:13.21 | delerious | trepan, if -noground means that obj exports do not include the bzgroud object, i think you should make -noground the default |
| 22:14.12 | trepan | 19:03 < CIA-11> BZFlag: * added the -noground option (do not clamp the model to z=0) |
| 22:15.12 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19540 10/trunk/bzflag/tools/modeltool/modeltool.cxx: * bumped the version to v1.9.9 |
| 22:16.23 | trepan | http://trepan.bzflag.bz/modeltool-v1.9.9.exe (windows exec) |
| 22:17.31 | trepan | cross-compiled, but it does work in WINE :) |
| 22:20.36 | delerious | optigon the wings developer has added automatic inside point generation to the wings exporter, i'm testing it now. What happens if it adds an inside point to a zero-width plane? |
| 22:27.28 | *** part/#bzflag black_pearl (i=nhmsdg@h1342075.stratoserver.net) |
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| 22:47.50 | delerious | it sure would be nice if we had a unix build system for tankview |
| 22:52.01 | *** join/#bzflag RAHu|_ (n=heavensd@117.201.97.190) |
| 22:52.32 | RAHu|_ | hello |
| 22:53.09 | RAHu|_ | hey anyone there?? |
| 22:55.03 | Thumper_ | RAHu|_: somebody is usually here... |
| 22:55.19 | trepan | delerious: i'd suggest he not add those points (unless a point-in-polyhedron test is being test is performed, with significant slop) |
| 22:55.19 | RAHu|_ | hello... |
| 22:55.27 | trepan | ~ask |
| 22:55.28 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 22:55.38 | trepan | RAHu|_: that's for you ^^^ |
| 22:56.06 | RAHu|_ | okay. |
| 22:56.34 | JefferyM | Thumper_, cus I like cpp |
| 22:56.57 | trepan | heck, the #define is __cplusplus, not __cxx :) |
| 22:57.17 | RAHu|_ | well, i want to know something about the project "modularization of OpenGL logic" |
| 22:57.20 | Thumper_ | JefferyM: fair enough :) I'll just have to think more when trying to open files |
| 22:57.33 | JefferyM | RAHu|_, ask away |
| 22:58.42 | trepan | delerious: http://trepan.bzflag.bz/ball.obj & mtl (~25K vert mesh for testing: before = 9min22sec before, after = 6.4 sec :) |
| 22:59.16 | delerious | trepan, dont add inside points in zero-width planes.. or ALL objects? |
| 22:59.19 | blast007 | RAHu|_: hehe, so apparently you didn't read what ibot said ;) |
| 22:59.20 | trepan | all |
| 22:59.31 | delerious | ok |
| 22:59.50 | trepan | unless he does the point-in-polyhedron test ... |
| 23:00.03 | delerious | ah, thankyou |
| 23:00.06 | trepan | (which the flat plane test will always fail, if it's done with slop) |
| 23:00.20 | sam | brlcad: I doubt I added any asserts, most of the time they can be replaced by unit tests |
| 23:03.00 | JefferyM | Thumper_, vc sees them the same |
| 23:04.46 | CBG | hugs Thumper_ |
| 23:04.51 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19541 10/trunk/bzflag/tools/modeltool/modeltool.cxx: |
| 23:04.51 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: * output the mesh 'name' property instead of a comment |
| 23:04.51 | CIA-11 | BZFlag: (unless the mesh name is empty) |
| 23:06.10 | *** join/#bzflag mindnull (n=mindnull@71-90-96-211.dhcp.aldl.mi.charter.com) |
| 23:08.40 | BulletCatcher | FWIW, as of r19538 the bzflag crash-on-exit behavior remains the same for me as it has been for many months. Linux does not crash, and MacOS 10.4 does (in the FreeType library). |
| 23:09.40 | trepan | mac'tastic, i won't bother :) |
| 23:10.02 | JefferyM | does 10.5? |
| 23:10.14 | RAHu|_ | i was just having a look on the bzflag-2.0.12 source code.. the project asks to encapsulate all the opengl calls into one place..what exactly we need to do here??.. creating a different class of having only opengl calls and then inheriting that class in other classes that uses those calls?? |
| 23:10.30 | JefferyM | RAHu|_, first, that's not the code we use |
| 23:10.39 | RAHu|_ | ohk.... |
| 23:10.40 | BulletCatcher | I only have 10.4, so someone else will have to report about MacOS 10.5. |
| 23:11.00 | JefferyM | second, the idea would be to make a lib, containing one or more classes/functions that encapsulate the drawing in a sane API |
| 23:11.10 | JefferyM | not just one big class with all the GL calls |
| 23:11.35 | RAHu|_ | okay... |
| 23:11.49 | JefferyM | I would think something like a main renderer class that had subclasses that would know how to draw various things |
| 23:11.56 | JefferyM | such as tanks, backgrounds, etc.. |
| 23:12.02 | RAHu|_ | where can i have the source from that we are going to work? |
| 23:12.15 | JefferyM | and could take there input from the existing structures such as Players, shots, and obstacles. |
| 23:12.17 | JefferyM | SVN |
| 23:12.22 | JefferyM | it's our trunk |
| 23:12.31 | RAHu|_ | okies |
| 23:12.57 | JefferyM | it's more of an abstraction of the rendering system rather then just the openGL calls |
| 23:13.16 | JefferyM | as the final goal would be to have the system be able to use a different renderer |
| 23:13.17 | RAHu|_ | hmm... got it |
| 23:13.31 | RAHu|_ | i need to look at the code first.. |
| 23:13.34 | JefferyM | k |
| 23:13.39 | RAHu|_ | thanks.. |
| 23:13.55 | JefferyM | feel free to ask stuff as you look |
| 23:14.31 | RAHu|_ | hmm |
| 23:14.40 | trepan | fwiw, http://trepan.bzflag.bz/gl-files.txt |
| 23:15.00 | RAHu|_ | is this the files we need to look at? |
| 23:15.04 | JefferyM | no |
| 23:15.32 | JefferyM | you need to understand the entire client drawing pipleline |
| 23:15.38 | JefferyM | cus there is also platform code involved |
| 23:15.55 | JefferyM | openGL setup is done at the window level |
| 23:16.23 | JefferyM | you'll also need to understand how the map is pulled from the obstacle system and drawn |
| 23:17.13 | RAHu|_ | hmmm... |
| 23:17.42 | JefferyM | if I was going to do it, I'd start with a Visual class |
| 23:17.54 | JefferyM | it would init GL and call platform to bring up the window |
| 23:18.07 | JefferyM | then it would provide a Renderer class |
| 23:18.38 | JefferyM | that renderer would provide drawing implemntations for the background, world, hud, players, shots, etc.. |
| 23:19.23 | JefferyM | then you have something somehwere, that pulls the vissable items from the world, tanks, shots, and sends them to the renderer to draw |
| 23:19.28 | JefferyM | then draws the hud etc.. |
| 23:19.39 | JefferyM | that part ends up being render indpendent |
| 23:20.01 | JefferyM | then if we want to replace the rendering stuff, we can just make a different visual or renderer class |
| 23:20.40 | RAHu|_ | thats a really good idea |
| 23:21.11 | JefferyM | part of the problem is the scenegraph, it would be nice to have that in the renderer too, but we need it for non rendering things |
| 23:21.15 | JefferyM | like collisions |
| 23:21.21 | RAHu|_ | hey i couldn't find the source yet. i need to study it a lot |
| 23:21.22 | JefferyM | so it's simpler to leave it external for now |
| 23:21.34 | JefferyM | have you ever used svn? |
| 23:21.48 | RAHu|_ | after having that i can ask more specific questions |
| 23:21.52 | RAHu|_ | no sir :( |
| 23:21.53 | JefferyM | ibot bzsvn |
| 23:21.54 | ibot | [bzsvn] http://my.bzflag.org/w/BZFlag_SVN and svn co https://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/bzflag/trunk/bzflag bzflag |
| 23:22.19 | trepan | JefferyM: what are the current scenegraph / collisions interactions? |
| 23:22.26 | RAHu|_ | ohkay.. thank you |
| 23:22.39 | JefferyM | trepan, don't you use the octree to get what is near the tank? |
| 23:22.43 | trepan | yup |
| 23:22.50 | trepan | one of the two |
| 23:23.00 | JefferyM | that was the main one I was thinking of |
| 23:23.06 | trepan | one of the *two* |
| 23:23.08 | JefferyM | probably shots |
| 23:23.14 | trepan | not shots |
| 23:23.21 | JefferyM | how abouty you just tell me |
| 23:23.35 | trepan | i was wondering where you came up with the statement ;-) |
| 23:23.44 | trepan | don't really know of any major interactions |
| 23:23.46 | JefferyM | I was going on recolection |
| 23:24.13 | JefferyM | spawns would be the other that come to mind |
| 23:24.20 | trepan | ? |
| 23:24.37 | JefferyM | dosn't the server use the octree in obstacle to see what is near a spawn drop? |
| 23:24.50 | trepan | spawn locations are decided server side, no gfx, no "scenegraph" |
| 23:24.54 | trepan | there are 2 octress |
| 23:24.57 | trepan | *octrees |
| 23:24.57 | JefferyM | ahh |
| 23:25.03 | JefferyM | I thought there was one |
| 23:25.10 | trepan | 1 for ZSceneDatabase |
| 23:25.15 | JefferyM | then it may be viable to move one into renderer |
| 23:25.19 | trepan | 1 for CollisionManager |
| 23:25.21 | JefferyM | and just let "libstate" use the obstacle one |
| 23:25.24 | JefferyM | ok |
| 23:25.26 | JefferyM | that I was not aware of |
| 23:25.58 | JefferyM | so then you could move that in and just keep the state of render objects updated each frame with a drawables system that is mat/z sorted |
| 23:26.02 | JefferyM | that'd be fine |
| 23:26.30 | trepan | that's what's currently done |
| 23:26.41 | trepan | OpenGState is material sorted |
| 23:26.45 | JefferyM | cool |
| 23:26.55 | JefferyM | then it shouldn't be too hard to just wraper that up :) |
| 23:27.08 | JefferyM | mostly the GL project is just moving existing code into more consoldated APIs |
| 23:27.29 | trepan | so look at the file list i posted, and move junk :) |
| 23:27.44 | JefferyM | I'd rather the sudent understand the full picture |
| 23:27.48 | trepan | ditto |
| 23:28.14 | trepan | but it's a starting point (as opposed to jumping into common/ :) |
| 23:29.17 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon1 (n=LongDon@host-091-097-009-238.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 23:29.25 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon1 (n=LongDon@host-091-097-009-238.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 23:29.48 | JefferyM | true, but so is going into the main and finding the init and playing loop :) |
| 23:29.55 | JefferyM | then you get an idea of the per frame flow |
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| 23:55.36 | JefferyM | cool I'm banned from planet mofo! |
| 23:55.46 | PositiveG | lol |
| 23:55.50 | PositiveG | why? |
| 23:56.21 | JefferyM | "Connsisent cheating"it says |
| 23:56.33 | blast007 | heh |
| 23:56.46 | PositiveG | wow |
| 23:56.51 | PositiveG | who did the ban? |
| 23:57.00 | dexter- | ..range ban |
| 23:57.01 | blast007 | range ban |
| 23:57.04 | JefferyM | yeah |
| 23:57.09 | *** join/#bzflag Bulldozer (n=KingRobo@student4945.student.nau.edu) |
| 23:57.17 | JefferyM | what's funny is this is the static IP at work :) |
| 23:57.23 | blast007 | hello again Bulldozer |
| 23:57.32 | PositiveG | heh |
| 23:57.32 | Bulldozer | Hello blast007 |
| 23:57.43 | blast007 | JefferyM: maybe they banned the whole iterweb! |