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| 12:24.21 | joevano_ | Y |
| 12:33.56 | blast007 | M |
| 12:40.52 | alezakos | C |
| 14:27.06 | blast007 | A |
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| 19:21.44 | cods | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:18.02 | cods | I feel stupid.. How to generate a new key on http://my.bzflag.org/listkeys/index.php ? |
| 20:18.35 | JeffM | you don |
| 20:18.36 | Flak18 | you have to ask blast i think |
| 20:18.39 | JeffM | you don't |
| 20:18.46 | JeffM | you send blast a PM on the forums |
| 20:18.54 | cods | oh ok |
| 20:19.06 | JeffM | there were so many servers he took the generator off line |
| 20:19.10 | cods | I just moved by server to another machine. Ok. |
| 20:19.13 | JeffM | so now they have to be approved by him |
| 20:19.14 | cods | my* |
| 20:19.56 | JeffM | was your key by IP or by domain? |
| 20:21.35 | cods | I've for both. But even the domain is changing anyway. |
| 20:21.55 | cods | I will PM him. |
| 20:33.41 | JeffM | is it still like 5+ servers per player? |
| 20:40.13 | cods | what's the normal way to be an admin on my own server? I was used to use a password with the -password option, but that seems a bad idea. Now, I'm reading about -groupdb and -userdb, but the documentation says for -userdb to use "global groups" instead. I'm lost. |
| 20:41.58 | Flak18 | for a local server you can use the -password option |
| 20:42.02 | Flak18 | like in lan |
| 20:42.26 | JeffM | you request one or more global groups on the forums |
| 20:42.29 | allejo | use global groups |
| 20:42.34 | allejo | and use the -groupdb option |
| 20:42.51 | JeffM | then in your groupDB file you say what permissions each group has |
| 20:42.59 | JeffM | on the forums you say who is in what group |
| 20:43.10 | Flak18 | iirc |
| 20:43.11 | JeffM | then if you login to your server with a registered username, you get put into that group |
| 20:43.23 | JeffM | and get those permissions |
| 20:44.14 | cods | Flak18: I thought using -password was not recommended for security reasons. |
| 20:44.27 | Flak18 | only for a local server |
| 20:44.28 | JeffM | do you log chat? |
| 20:44.32 | Flak18 | as in lan |
| 20:44.52 | Flak18 | but for public ones |
| 20:44.52 | JeffM | basicly your password is sent over the chat |
| 20:44.54 | cods | Flak18: oh, I get it. No, it's for my public servers. Ok. |
| 20:45.27 | Flak18 | i'm explaining a bit on the servers... |
| 20:45.33 | cods | JeffM: in cleartext you mean? |
| 20:45.36 | JeffM | yeah |
| 20:45.45 | JeffM | nothing in bzflag is encrypted except the connection to the list server |
| 20:46.03 | JeffM | thats why -password is bad unless it's a temporry lan server |
| 20:46.17 | cods | I guess the login is also encrypted (using hash or something like that) |
| 20:46.31 | JeffM | nope |
| 20:46.36 | cods | oh |
| 20:46.36 | JeffM | it uses a token |
| 20:46.47 | JeffM | the game server doesn't get your password, but the token is not encrypted |
| 20:46.50 | JeffM | it's just temporary |
| 20:46.54 | JeffM | it's only good for some time |
| 20:47.02 | JeffM | and it's tied to your IP |
| 20:47.24 | JeffM | your client contacts the list server over HTTPS (encrypted) sends it's password, and gets a token |
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| 20:47.38 | JeffM | then in unencrypted game protocoll, you send that token to the game server. |
| 20:47.48 | JeffM | then the game server contacts the list server and validates the token |
| 20:47.56 | cods | ok, the password is sent through the same channel as the server list. |
| 20:47.59 | JeffM | a man in the middle can totaly see your token |
| 20:48.12 | JeffM | the password for regular global logins |
| 20:48.21 | cods | yep |
| 20:48.28 | JeffM | when you do -password in chat to a server, that goes right over the game protocll to the server |
| 20:48.39 | JeffM | just the same as you saying "hello" |
| 20:48.53 | cods | understood |
| 20:49.02 | JeffM | it's not sent to the other payers, but its still a bad idea |
| 20:49.20 | JeffM | there is a thread on the forums for requesting global groups |
| 20:49.39 | JeffM | once it's made, it shows up in your forum options and you can add people to it |
| 20:49.57 | JeffM | then on your game server, with -groupDB, you specifcy what permssions each group name gets |
| 20:52.09 | Flak18 | iirc |
| 20:52.17 | Flak18 | correct me if i'm wrong |
| 20:52.33 | Flak18 | there's something called the superuser plugin |
| 20:53.08 | Flak18 | and i think it allows one to give perms based on global ID |
| 20:53.34 | JeffM | yes |
| 20:53.52 | Flak18 | what would be the consensus on it? |
| 20:54.14 | JeffM | well I wrote it, so it's a good thing :) |
| 20:54.35 | JeffM | if you just have a small number of people you want to have admin, then it's simpler then groups |
| 20:55.21 | JeffM | if you want different perms for larger numbers of users, then groups is better |
| 20:56.38 | Flak18 | cods: it might be an option for you |
| 20:56.42 | cods | in the meantime, I was trying to use -userdb.. But I'm unable to find the right syntax for it. It seems that it should be updated by some means (command from within the server?) |
| 20:56.51 | JeffM | userdb was removed |
| 20:56.54 | JeffM | IIRC |
| 20:56.59 | JeffM | I don't recomend it |
| 20:57.17 | JeffM | I pulled local auth a long while ago |
| 20:57.21 | JeffM | the file is updated manualy |
| 20:57.24 | cods | hmm, it works (the server says "using userDB file "/home/fred/bzusers"" when started) |
| 20:58.23 | cods | well.. so it seems that I need to pass through the forum. That feel kind of weird that the forum is actually an authority for the game itself. (Not used to it.) |
| 20:59.49 | cods | I created an account 11 years ago.. but I think I connected maybe 1 or 2 times :) |
| 21:01.22 | allejo | Jeff, last time superuser was brought up with me you wanted to nuke it and I said it had its uses ;) |
| 21:01.26 | cods | to summarize: -password is a bad idea, -userdb is deprecated. I need -groupdb but for that I need someone to create a group on the forum. |
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| 21:12.31 | JeffM | allejo: I am wrong a lot |
| 21:12.45 | JeffM | and an ass sometimes |
| 21:13.11 | JeffM | cods: superuser will probalby do what you need if it's just a few people |
| 21:13.54 | JeffM | allejo: if my group manager idea was implmeented, then superuser would not be needed, but that ain't going to happen ever, at least not in this game. |
| 21:14.02 | JeffM | so superuser shoudl be fine |
| 21:14.10 | JeffM | mabye I didn't write it, maybe I only ported it |
| 21:14.13 | JeffM | I checked it in |
| 21:14.14 | cods | JeffM: that's just for me! :) I will try. |
| 21:14.39 | JeffM | cods: if its just you, then just find your bzID and add all the perms to your user |
| 21:15.49 | cods | bzID is something different from the login name? (sorry, it seems that I've not followed any new thing in bzflag for the past 10 years) |
| 21:16.33 | JeffM | yeah, it's a number |
| 21:16.59 | cods | the account ID on the forum? |
| 21:17.03 | JeffM | yeah |
| 21:17.05 | JeffM | I think |
| 21:17.37 | JeffM | it's the u= number for any link to a user on the forums |
| 21:17.57 | cods | ok |
| 21:18.31 | JeffM | what is your forum name? |
| 21:18.42 | cods | Cods |
| 21:19.12 | cods | it seems to be 1144, if I understand. |
| 21:19.23 | JeffM | that sounds like a reasonable number |
| 21:23.11 | cods | hmm, but then, given this number, how I'm supposed to define permissions? That goes in the groupdb or something entirely different? |
| 21:23.26 | JeffM | completely different |
| 21:23.32 | cods | I'm looking at the wiki, and googling some keywords, and I don't get it. |
| 21:23.36 | JeffM | thre is a documentaiton file for the plugin |
| 21:23.40 | JeffM | in the source |
| 21:23.51 | cods | oh, you were still talking about the superuser plugin? |
| 21:23.56 | JeffM | yes |
| 21:24.13 | JeffM | a global group for a single user is overkill |
| 21:24.33 | JeffM | https://github.com/BZFlag-Dev/bzflag/blob/2.4/plugins/superUser/README.superUser.txt |
| 21:25.44 | alezakos | cods: you can quickly find a player's BZID ingame by typing /idlist |
| 21:25.58 | alezakos | (as long as that player is logged in) |
| 21:26.25 | JeffM | wasn't threre a webpage that let you search too? |
| 21:27.38 | cods | pff, it works! :) |
| 21:27.56 | cods | I think this is sufficient for me. |
| 21:29.47 | cods | thanks for your help |
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| 21:49.37 | JeffM | what is the current servers/players ratio? |
| 21:51.13 | moriah | dismal and lopsided....16 pages of servers ...only top 2-3 at best have players |
| 21:51.25 | alezakos | ~8 |
| 21:51.25 | infobot | 8 is a number, silly |
| 21:51.41 | JeffM | how many players? |
| 21:51.52 | alezakos | 23 |
| 21:52.02 | Flak18 | it's better if we have some players then none |
| 21:52.07 | moriah | atm, 19 players, 23 obs the listserver says |
| 21:52.08 | JeffM | and 180 server? |
| 21:52.19 | moriah | 159 according to listserver |
| 21:52.26 | JeffM | so many choices :) |
| 21:53.08 | moriah | most of those obs are bzadmins |
| 21:53.45 | JeffM | poor webadmin.. you died on the vine :( |
| 21:54.25 | Flak18 | i think moriah might mean "Bzfscron" rather then bzadmin ;) |
| 21:54.51 | blast007 | I only know of one server that uses bzfscron |
| 21:55.11 | moriah | I mean exactly what i said |
| 21:55.13 | JeffM | heh, the only use of SSPs IIRC |
| 21:55.23 | blast007 | JeffM: yep :) |
| 21:55.33 | blast007 | well, besides that sample plugin |
| 21:55.40 | JeffM | and the IRC bridge I did once |
| 21:55.43 | moriah | ie bztanks' Gicu bzadmin |
| 21:56.04 | blast007 | well, how else are they going to log chat? oh wait... |
| 21:56.14 | moriah | :) |
| 21:56.27 | JeffM | if only there was some kind of I don' tknow.. API to do that on the server.... |
| 21:56.38 | JeffM | but then nobody will use the API, they'll just apply patches |
| 21:56.55 | blast007 | maybe we could make a plugin called logDetail that writes consise but detailed enough logs to stdout |
| 21:57.23 | JeffM | didn't you read? nobody uses plugins.. it's all about patches |
| 22:08.58 | blast007 | I thought everyone uses Borland Tasm |
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