| 00:00.08 | dm7freek | Boobalaja: yes. everything is pretty much fine through the login screen (the L in "Loading, please wait..." disappears during the boot after GRUB). after I log in, the desktop shows, but only a single digit in the time in the center of the top of the screen shows. similarly, only 2 characters (of 4) in the username show. I go to the upper left corner and the app launcher shows (icons and all, except under Application th |
| 00:00.08 | dm7freek | e right sidebar only shows random letters e.g. "Gam" instead of "Games"... 'e' and 's' are missing from the username too), but when I select an app, only the outline of a window opens (and the taskbar goes blank). I can click where the X should be and the window will close. then if I go back up to the app launcher, everything i blank. |
| 00:00.54 | dm7freek | jmcnaught: ok, I'll try #nouveau first. just out of curiosity... what alternatives are there to Nvidia? |
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| 00:02.14 | jmcnaught | dm7freek: Nouveau and Nvidia's closed source drivers are the only two that I'm aware of, unless this computer has a different GPU available such as an onboard video perhaps |
| 00:02.58 | Boobalaja | he could switch to vesa for the time being |
| 00:03.09 | Boobalaja | would make troubleshooting easier if you could use the computer having the issues XD |
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| 00:03.55 | TJ- | dm7freek: Have you tried limiting the AGP bus to x4 or x2, if it is running at x8 ? |
| 00:03.59 | jmcnaught | dm7freek: oh yeah Boobalaja is right you could also use VESA driver |
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| 00:04.21 | Boobalaja | wouldn't get 3D accelleration |
| 00:04.33 | Boobalaja | but it would at least get stable video going |
| 00:04.51 | Boobalaja | from there, I'd suggest checking out the xorg config |
| 00:05.01 | Boobalaja | to make sure it's not trying to load modules the video card can't handle |
| 00:05.36 | dm7freek | jmcnaught: I meant if I were to get a diff graphics card. but what is VESA? |
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| 00:05.43 | dm7freek | TJ-: not sure what that is |
| 00:06.02 | Boobalaja | vesa is a basic vga driver |
| 00:06.47 | TJ- | dm7freek: AGP is the bus the graphics card is connected to. It has various speed multipliers. The system BIOS usually offers a way to change the multiplier. In cases of random drop-out it can help to reduce the multiplier |
| 00:07.23 | Boobalaja | TJ, if he doesn't know what an AGP bus is, i don't think he's going to know anything more technical than that... |
| 00:07.35 | dm7freek | TJ-: ah, haven't messed with the BIOS. should I try that or VESA first? |
| 00:07.37 | Boobalaja | just a thought... |
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| 00:08.36 | TJ- | dm7freek: data can 'drop out' if the bus is running at too high a multiplier ... its an easy test to do, although you may need to consult the motherboard manual to find out where in the BIOS setup pages, that option is |
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| 00:09.24 | Boobalaja | the bios option would be far less complicated to try first |
| 00:09.39 | Boobalaja | and easily reversable |
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| 00:10.15 | Boobalaja | should also try turning off all caching options in the bios while you're there |
| 00:11.15 | dm7freek | Boobalaja: Ok, #nouveau suggested I boot into GNOME classic, so I'll try that first, then BIOS, then VESA, then proprietary. |
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| 00:12.15 | dm7freek | Thanks everyone, I'll be back. |
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| 00:14.20 | Boobalaja | i have a feeling switching to gnome classic will be a dead end but good luck to him ! |
| 00:15.01 | dm7freek | Boobalaja: GNOME Classic seems to work fine! |
| 00:15.17 | Boobalaja | damn, am I lucky or what ? ! |
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| 00:16.15 | shay_shay | judd |
| 00:16.25 | shay_shay | why are you slow as heck |
| 00:16.36 | dvs | still? |
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| 00:17.28 | jvelasquez | aloha. pardon my ignorance, but I'd like to run Debian testing (jessie) on my laptop with the Intel I5 processor. Which architecture should I use? From reading http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64, am I correct in the assumption that the netinstall for AMD64 architecture would work better than i386? |
| 00:17.52 | Cpuroast | AMD64 |
| 00:17.56 | Cpuroast | forget about 32bit |
| 00:17.58 | Boobalaja | mips ! |
| 00:18.00 | Boobalaja | jk... |
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| 00:19.55 | jmcnaught | jvelasquez: you should also consider running Debian Stable (currently Wheezy) while you learn to use Debian. Testing/Jessie is unfinished and meant primarily as a development branch for bug fixing and well, testing. It's broken before, and will break again. |
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| 00:20.21 | jvelasquez | Cpuroast, ok. now, I already installed Debian jessie i386 on my laptop, should I redo the entire installation using a AMD64 netinstall, or how could I tell apt to switch architectures? |
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| 00:20.33 | jmcnaught | dpkg: tell jvelasquez -about testing |
| 00:20.50 | Cpuroast | jvelasquez: redo it with AMD64 |
| 00:20.53 | jvelasquez | jmcnaught, I've been using debian for 15 years. I know my way around. |
| 00:21.11 | Cpuroast | any reason you used the I386 from the start |
| 00:21.11 | Cpuroast | ? |
| 00:21.25 | jmcnaught | jvelasquez: Okay it was hard to tell because you used i386 on a 64-bit processor :) |
| 00:21.37 | Boobalaja | jve you just walked right into laugh in your face forest... |
| 00:22.14 | jvelasquez | yea. |
| 00:22.30 | jvelasquez | thanks though. |
| 00:22.46 | Cpuroast | jvelasquez: what was the reason you chose I386 over AMD64? |
| 00:22.50 | Cpuroast | when you started this |
| 00:22.50 | Cpuroast | ? |
| 00:23.19 | jmcnaught | jvelasquez: Nobody's going to stop you from using Jessie, just wanted to warn you it can be bumpy :) Also it's probably best to get support for Jessie in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net. |
| 00:23.52 | jvelasquez | Cpuroast, mostly stupidity. and cause I already had the disk. and the confusing instruction set terms used by the industry recently |
| 00:23.56 | Boobalaja | jmc is right, no one is going to hold you back from attempting to help the debian community |
| 00:24.16 | Cpuroast | jvelasquez: confusing |
| 00:24.17 | Cpuroast | ? |
| 00:24.28 | Cpuroast | the reason it's called AMD64 |
| 00:24.33 | Boobalaja | cpu extension |
| 00:24.36 | Cpuroast | is cause AMD came up with it |
| 00:24.47 | Cpuroast | and Intel later adopted it |
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| 00:24.59 | Cpuroast | it's also known as x86-64 |
| 00:25.00 | jvelasquez | Cpuroast, oh. |
| 00:25.07 | Cpuroast | or x64 for short |
| 00:25.49 | jvelasquez | alright then. AMD64 it is. thanks guys. |
| 00:26.13 | Cpuroast | 64bit Linux is the only choice on anything that supports it |
| 00:26.14 | Cpuroast | pretty much |
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| 00:26.26 | Cpuroast | 32bit is mostly still around for legacy systems |
| 00:26.41 | jmcnaught | Not to be confused with "ia64" which is Itanium. |
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| 00:26.48 | Cpuroast | lol, no |
| 00:26.49 | Cpuroast | :) |
| 00:26.51 | robin_ | my pc is not a legacy system its my pc ( ._.) |
| 00:26.59 | rim-k | soulshake: o/ |
| 00:27.09 | Cpuroast | robin_: anything pre x86-64 is legacy |
| 00:27.11 | soulshake | rim-k: greetings |
| 00:27.47 | blackjack | hello |
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| 00:27.59 | rim-k | hey blackjack |
| 00:28.00 | dm7freek | What graphics cards are most Linux friendly (well... Debian-friendly)? |
| 00:28.01 | rim-k | how u doing |
| 00:28.01 | robin_ | So I need a whole new motherboard if I want to be hip again. |
| 00:28.02 | Boobalaja | anything pre-8qbit = super legacy |
| 00:28.02 | blackjack | how do i saved folder on my shell to another server vps? |
| 00:28.06 | blackjack | is there a quick way |
| 00:28.20 | rim-k | blackjack: scp? |
| 00:28.31 | blackjack | scp |
| 00:28.32 | blackjack | ok |
| 00:28.35 | rim-k | archive then scp |
| 00:28.42 | Cpuroast | robin_: x86-64 has been around in 2003 |
| 00:28.58 | Boobalaja | quantum computers ftw |
| 00:28.59 | rim-k | blackjack: or use rsync |
| 00:29.12 | Cpuroast | robin_: so 11 years or so |
| 00:29.15 | blackjack | i just want to copy a single folder |
| 00:29.20 | blackjack | and all its contents |
| 00:29.21 | dvs | Cpuroast: Really? Didn't think it was that old. |
| 00:29.32 | Cpuroast | I'd say anything that doesn't handle x64-64 is well, legacy :) |
| 00:29.35 | blackjack | can someone give me the command like the right switches |
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| 00:29.55 | jmcnaught | blackjack: "man scp" it has a recursive mode for copying the contents of a directory |
| 00:30.08 | Cpuroast | unless it's an Intel core duo or core solo |
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| 00:30.11 | Boobalaja | or you can go the longer but more straight forward route |
| 00:30.16 | Boobalaja | install an ftp server with apt |
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| 00:30.19 | Boobalaja | and just ftp it over |
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| 00:30.26 | Cpuroast | which is the only relatively modern CPU which didn't support 64bit |
| 00:31.08 | jmcnaught | I think at this point the CPU architecture discussion would be better in #debian-offtopic. Also let's all try not to use <enter> as punctuation :) |
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| 00:31.20 | Cpuroast | dvs: AMD was pimping Opteron/Athlon64 back in the day |
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| 00:31.32 | dvs | Cpuroast: Yeah, I thought it started with the Core 2 family |
| 00:31.45 | Cpuroast | dvs: even late Pentium 4s had it |
| 00:31.59 | blackjack | jmcnaught, can you give me a sample of how to use the scp sir jmcnaught? |
| 00:31.59 | Boobalaja | sorry habbit... |
| 00:32.31 | Boobalaja | blackjack, ssh into your vps and run man scp |
| 00:32.39 | rim-k | Boobalaja: +111111 |
| 00:32.41 | Boobalaja | which was jmc's suggestion above |
| 00:32.42 | Cpuroast | dvs: that would imply that Intel came up with it, all the credit goes to AMD on this, and they completely changed the industry as we know it |
| 00:32.44 | Cpuroast | because of it |
| 00:32.53 | Falhawk | Why is Tomcat8 not in the debian repository? |
| 00:32.59 | Falhawk | too new? |
| 00:33.05 | jmcnaught | blackjack: I'm hesitant to give people commands like they're spells if they don't understand them. The information is in the manual. It will be something like "scp -r" though |
| 00:33.14 | thorie | anyone know why i would get this error? debuild: unknown dpkg-buildpackage/debuild option: --source-option=--include-binaries |
| 00:33.26 | rim-k | jmcnaught: -p to keep permissions |
| 00:33.34 | rim-k | but yeah, RTFM |
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| 00:33.54 | robin_ | poweroff |
| 00:33.57 | robin_ | oops |
| 00:35.22 | ckuehl | Falhawk: yes, it's in wheezy-backports though if that interests you |
| 00:35.51 | jmcnaught | Falhawk: yes it's probably too new. The software in Debian Stable mostly stays at the same versions, with security and bug fixes getting backported. You could check wheezy-backports like ckuehl suggests though |
| 00:35.53 | Falhawk | just found that. thanks |
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| 00:35.56 | Boobalaja | oh scp is a solution to one of my problems XD |
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| 00:36.14 | Falhawk | forgot about them |
| 00:36.16 | Falhawk | thanks guys! |
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| 00:40.51 | Boobalaja | is there a way to recovery/undelete a file in debian while the system is running ?( vps ) |
| 00:41.31 | Boobalaja | I've googled it and all the stuff I found required me to either boot a live cd or go into some sort of recovery mode |
| 00:41.37 | Boobalaja | which isn't a viable option for me. |
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| 00:44.32 | jmcnaught | Boobalaja: there are a few tools that come up when I run "apt-cache search undelete" but I've never tried any of them. "extundelete" might be worth a try but check out the descriptions of the others too. Or you can restore from your backups. |
| 00:45.09 | Boobalaja | ya the backups got deleted by a genius piece of software written by someone else |
| 00:46.12 | Boobalaja | what's even better is, it didn't even create those backups and it still deleted them ! |
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| 00:56.01 | thorie | what is the filename extension for a debian source pacakge? |
| 00:56.41 | soulshake | Boobalaja: sorry for your loss. What what the culprit software? |
| 00:56.49 | Boobalaja | webmin |
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| 00:59.42 | jmcnaught | Boobalaja: There's a reason Webmin is not available in the Debian repositories, you should look into its security track record. As an alternative you might consider a software configuration management tool (Puppet, Chef, Ansible, Salt are some examples). Then you can manage the configuration of your servers in a VCS repository (like Git, Subversion etc). It's probably also worth looking into storing backups on a separate system. |
| 01:00.54 | Boobalaja | it has a track record ? o.O every person I've asked personally has never even heard of it or seen it before |
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| 01:02.53 | jmcnaught | Boobalaja: http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-358/Webmin.html for example. Most mentions I see of it online are followed by "kill it with fire." |
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| 01:03.15 | Boobalaja | and they are right to make such comments :) |
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| 01:06.17 | Boobalaja | "Unspecified vulnerability in Webmin before 1.370 on Windows allows remote authenticated users to execute arbitrary commands via a crafted URL." wow all that trouble for something they can do in terminal... |
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| 01:06.38 | Boobalaja | oh that says windows... i mean command prompt :) |
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| 01:15.56 | nullfaith | From what I have read online, Sid does not seem as wonky as some make it out to be. Sid is stable enough for main desktop you guys would say, right? |
| 01:16.52 | Boobalaja | i think the warning is more about |
| 01:17.03 | Boobalaja | updates that you download could break the system... |
| 01:17.32 | nullfaith | So just read ahead, like arch or what not... |
| 01:17.34 | nullfaith | Correct? |
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| 01:18.55 | Boobalaja | if they could give you advanced warnings about bugs that could break the system, I don't think it would be an issue... just my thought though |
| 01:19.46 | jmcnaught | nullfaith: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable you should read the FAQ there. Remember it's not meant to be a usable release, it's a development branch. Stuff can break. If you want a system that works well day after day, and where you don't have to worry that applying security updates might also change behaviour or introduce new major bugs, use Debian Stable. |
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| 01:20.54 | somiaj | Boobalaja: apt-listbugs does the best it can at just that. (: |
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| 01:21.31 | Boobalaja | I wasn't bashing debian XD |
| 01:21.31 | nullfaith | But for any kernel after 3.2 you have to backport in stable right? |
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| 01:22.11 | jmcnaught | nullfaith: wheezy-backports has newer kernel and several other packages |
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| 01:23.57 | Boobalaja | I used to use __some_evil distro_of_linux_here__ for a while for bleeding edge stuff but then I got sick of the bugs :) |
| 01:26.11 | Boobalaja | Then I switched to ubuntu until it got that stupid UI. That's when I decided to just move to debian and found out that stupid UI was gnome's fault.... |
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| 01:27.24 | nullfaith | I have been running a debian deriv called crunchbang for the last year +, but it is stable debian. I figured I would just reinstall and upgrade to testing or unstable for newer kernels as I am not sure how complex backporting is. |
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| 01:28.06 | somiaj | nullfaith: debian wheezy provides backported kernels for you. Support and discussion of debian based distros is also off topic here. (: |
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| 01:28.22 | Boobalaja | I stick to what works and don't run any desktop managers at all XD |
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| 01:28.25 | nullfaith | wow |
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| 01:28.44 | nullfaith | Just because I mentioned a name? |
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| 01:29.01 | Boobalaja | people need to get in their 2 cents |
| 01:29.04 | Boobalaja | just ignore it :) |
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| 01:29.38 | nullfaith | Thanks Boobalaja, I guess not everyone is master racing it in here. XD |
| 01:30.43 | jmcnaught | nullfaith: my advice is to go with Debian Wheezy and use wheezy-backports (described here: http://backports.debian.org/). I'd also appreciate it if you don't use the term "master racing" in this channel :) |
| 01:31.00 | somiaj | I was just mentioning this conversation is drifting off topic, please resepect the support community and keep it to debian only support questions. You can join #debian-offtopic if you wish to talk about the various distros. |
| 01:31.01 | Boobalaja | I don't even know what that means... |
| 01:31.26 | nullfaith | Alright, well thanks for your help and passive aggresiveness. It has been appreciated as well. |
| 01:31.29 | nullfaith | Later. |
| 01:31.35 | somiaj | but as I said nullfaith debian wheezy provides the backports for you. |
| 01:31.45 | nullfaith | I was aware. |
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| 01:33.21 | some-cowbell | say I install django on a wheezy machine from backports, then I later install whatever the latest python 3 that's available... would I then have django under the newer python? |
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| 01:35.24 | acu | some-cowbell, you run django in a python virtual environment, not on the OS |
| 01:36.09 | jordanm | some-cowbell: only if you installed python3-django, which doesn't appear to be in backports |
| 01:36.30 | some-cowbell | oh ok, that makes sense |
| 01:37.07 | some-cowbell | , v python3-django |
| 01:37.09 | judd | Package: python3-django on i386 -- jessie: 1.6.5-2; sid: 1.6.5-3; experimental: 1.7~c1+20140722-2 |
| 01:37.30 | some-cowbell | so it's not in wheezy at all right now |
| 01:37.37 | jordanm | correct |
| 01:38.00 | jordanm | I would probably go the venv route if you need it on wheezy |
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| 01:38.32 | somiaj | could it be run in a chroot or are you wanting gui tools with it? |
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| 01:39.59 | jordanm | somiaj: chroot would be problematic depending on what wsgi container he was using |
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| 01:40.15 | jordanm | with mod_wsgi he would have to run apache in the chroot as well |
| 01:40.20 | some-cowbell | need is a strong word... I did the django tutorial with django-1.6 and python-2.7, which kept mentioning differences between that and py-3 so I wanted to do the tutorial using that |
| 01:40.39 | some-cowbell | I haven't used anything but python manage.py runserver |
| 01:40.43 | jordanm | then a venv is definately the way to go |
| 01:41.34 | jordanm | ,v python3-virtualenv |
| 01:41.40 | judd | Package: python3-virtualenv on i386 -- jessie: 1.11.6-2; sid: 1.11.6-2 |
| 01:41.41 | jordanm | nevermind... |
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| 01:42.47 | some-cowbell | so I'd build up a stack if I get motivated |
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| 01:51.59 | some-cowbell | , v python3 |
| 01:52.02 | judd | Package: python3 on i386 -- squeeze: 3.1.3-12+squeeze1; wheezy: 3.2.3-6; jessie: 3.4.1-1; sid: 3.4.1-1 |
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| 01:55.28 | brokendeb | hello #debian, i tried to install steam by adding the jessie nonfree to /etc/apt/sources.list as instructed on https://wiki.debian.org/Steam |
| 01:55.50 | brokendeb | unfortunately on reboot that broke network manager and xorg |
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| 01:56.58 | brokendeb | running startx returns /etc/X11/xinit/xserverrc 3 X not found |
| 01:57.24 | brokendeb | i would just reinstall X and nm, but i fear more than that was removed |
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| 01:58.25 | some-cowbell | you might have logs that tell you what may have been removed |
| 01:59.04 | centrx | brokendeb, You partially upgraded your system to jessie. You need to either finish the upgrade and you will be running testing, or re-install stable. |
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| 02:00.21 | brokendeb | centrx, will just updating sources.list, apt-get update, apt-get upgrade fix.that? |
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| 02:03.00 | centrx | brokendeb, Downgrading packages is not supported. It may or may not work. |
| 02:03.41 | brokendeb | do you think its worth trying? |
| 02:04.04 | jmcnaught | brokendeb: If you wan to finish the upgrade to Jessie you could ask the dpkg bot for some information about it by typing "/msg dpkg wheezy->jessie" in your IRC client. It has additional topics in <brackets> that you can ask it about. Keep in mind that Jessie is not finished and breaks sometimes. My advice is to reinstall Debian Wheezy from scratch and stick with that. |
| 02:04.06 | brokendeb | and if not, should i just full on apt-get upgrade? |
| 02:04.42 | centrx | brokendeb, If you want to use Steam, you will want to upgrade to testing. But you should be warned about potential problems with testing |
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| 02:04.57 | brokendeb | ok, thanks. |
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| 02:17.36 | jvelasquez | man, things are really starting to work well in Jessie. I love it. |
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| 02:20.15 | debbroken | how do i upgrade if dhclient is broken |
| 02:20.30 | debbroken | or nonexistent |
| 02:21.54 | centrx | debbroken, How is it broken? You are unable to connect to the network? |
| 02:22.07 | debbroken | centrx appears so |
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| 02:22.52 | debbroken | is there some utility i can use? auto doesnt exist, ping does exist, dhclient doesnt |
| 02:23.00 | centrx | If it got uninstalled, the package file may be in /var/cache/apt/archives |
| 02:23.13 | centrx | You may or may not be able to install one of those files, with dpkg -i <filename> |
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| 02:24.28 | debbroken | centrx dpkg -i? |
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| 02:30.06 | centrx | debbroken, dpkg -i installs .deb files |
| 02:30.29 | centrx | debbroken, Other possibility is to rig some other way of getting on the network, such as setting a static IP |
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| 02:30.52 | centrx | debbroken, Once apt-get is able to install packages, upgrading the rest of your system, it should work. |
| 02:31.13 | centrx | as though it never happened, except you will not be using the pre-release next version of Debian |
| 02:31.17 | centrx | *will be using |
| 02:32.53 | debbroken | centrx, i have ifconfig |
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| 02:33.38 | centrx | debbroken, Try setting up with a static IP address, preferably the one your DHCP client used to get |
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| 02:38.50 | debbrkn | is there a way to bootstrap an ethernet connection with ifconfig? |
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| 02:58.45 | debbrkn | ok, so i tried connecting to ethernet using ifconfig, where did i go wrong |
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| 02:58.53 | debbrkn | http://imgur.com/dzD0PSX |
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| 02:59.52 | centrx | debbrkn, ping 8.8.8.8 |
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| 03:00.27 | centrx | debbrkn, If that is successful, set that as your nameserver in /etc/resolv.conf |
| 03:00.49 | Boobalaja | no, ping 8.8.4.4 |
| 03:00.59 | debbrkn | centrx network unreachabke |
| 03:01.10 | DucBlangis | debbrkn can you take a scrot of just ifconfig |
| 03:01.11 | debbrkn | where did i go wrong |
| 03:01.12 | sandman13 | debbrkn: did you disable your eth0? |
| 03:01.32 | debbrkn | sandman13 not intentionally |
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| 03:01.52 | sandman13 | debbrkn: try this: ip link set eth0 up |
| 03:02.08 | Boobalaja | <debbroken> is there some utility i can use? auto doesnt exist, ping does exist, dhclient doesnt |
| 03:02.31 | Boobalaja | maybe he's just missing the entire networking stack ? >.> |
| 03:03.03 | debbrkn | sandman13 didnt change anything |
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| 03:03.42 | jmcnaught | debbrkn: it's pretty unlikely that your computer's IP address should be 192.168.1.1 and that the broadcast would be 192.168.1.29 |
| 03:04.10 | sandman13 | it would be 192.168.1.255 or something |
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| 03:04.22 | dvs | jmcnaught: Why can't it be 192.168.1.1 ? |
| 03:04.49 | debbrkn | ducblangis http://imgur.com/byvIjVq |
| 03:04.58 | jmcnaught | dvs: not that it can't, just that if debbrkn is using a consumer router it's unlikely |
| 03:05.35 | DucBlangis | thanks |
| 03:05.41 | debbrkn | jmcnaught: how do i find what it should be? |
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| 03:06.06 | Boobalaja | debbrkn, how'd you get yourself into this mess in the first place ? |
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| 03:06.32 | debbrkn | boobalaja adding jessie stuff to sources.list |
| 03:06.48 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: Did you already edit /etc/network/interfaces |
| 03:06.53 | dvs | *sigh* mixing releases |
| 03:07.24 | sandman13 | debbrkn: what is the output of dpkg -l | grep network |
| 03:07.24 | debbrkn | lducblangis: no, how should i modify it? |
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| 03:07.29 | DucBlangis | yes |
| 03:07.42 | debbrkn | how? |
| 03:07.42 | DucBlangis | change it to |
| 03:07.45 | DucBlangis | iface eth0 inet dhcp |
| 03:07.45 | jmcnaught | debbrkn: If you have another computer on the local network you could check what its network config is. I suspect that 192.168.1.1 is most likely your router's IP address (but I don't know obviously). If you're having this much trouble, I'd reconsider completing the upgrade to Jessie and reinstall Wheezy instead. |
| 03:07.50 | DucBlangis | auto eth0 |
| 03:07.58 | DucBlangis | fire line iface second line auto |
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| 03:08.03 | DucBlangis | use your text editor |
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| 03:08.05 | DucBlangis | of choice |
| 03:08.15 | DucBlangis | so vi /etc/network/interfaces |
| 03:08.18 | DucBlangis | or whatever you use |
| 03:08.23 | Boobalaja | if DucBlangis' suggestion doesn't work |
| 03:08.31 | Boobalaja | i suggest you follow jmc's suggestion XD |
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| 03:09.36 | rawfodog | my sound doesnt work. Anyone want to help me trouble shoot ? |
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| 03:09.43 | DucBlangis | after editing the interfaces reboot and run "service networking start" when you get back to your terminal and then try to ping |
| 03:10.04 | Boobalaja | are you on a laptop rawfodog ? |
| 03:10.13 | rawfodog | yes |
| 03:10.29 | Boobalaja | plug in headphones and tell me if there is sound |
| 03:11.23 | jmcnaught | dpkg: tell rawfodog -about alsa checklist |
| 03:11.43 | jmcnaught | rawfodog: if you're using pulseaudio you should also check pavucontrol |
| 03:11.55 | debbrkn | jmcnaught, i happen to have an rpi connected to my wifi |
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| 03:12.41 | debbrkn | ducblangis i dont have auto |
| 03:12.45 | debbrkn | wait, is that acommand? |
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| 03:12.54 | Boobalaja | debbrkn no |
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| 03:13.06 | Boobalaja | please follow ALL of his instructions... |
| 03:13.12 | Boobalaja | they'll make more sense that way |
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| 03:13.30 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: no its not a command |
| 03:13.39 | DucBlangis | you will put that in the interfaces file with your text editor |
| 03:13.48 | DucBlangis | vi /etc/network/interfaces |
| 03:14.02 | DucBlangis | fire line (after comments) should be: iface eth0 inet dhcp |
| 03:14.12 | Boobalaja | first* |
| 03:14.14 | DucBlangis | secon dline: auto eth0 |
| 03:14.19 | DucBlangis | yes first, thanks ;) |
| 03:14.26 | rawfodog | Boobalaja, nothing |
| 03:14.27 | DucBlangis | ugh cant type tonight |
| 03:14.40 | jmcnaught | DucBlangis: examples like that would be a lot easier to follow if you used http://paste.debian.net/ |
| 03:14.58 | rawfodog | jmcnaught, what is alsa checklist how do I run it ? |
| 03:15.14 | DucBlangis | your right |
| 03:15.23 | jmcnaught | rawfodog: did you get the message from dpkg bot? It's probably in another tab/window of your IRC client |
| 03:15.32 | DucBlangis | didnt even think of that |
| 03:15.41 | Boobalaja | i usually have trouble with debian with my headphone jack |
| 03:15.53 | Boobalaja | it doesn't auto switch and think headphones are in ALL the time XD |
| 03:16.07 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: do you know how to use vi? |
| 03:16.20 | Boobalaja | he mostly likely doesn't even have terminal open |
| 03:16.42 | debbrkn | ducblagis yes |
| 03:16.44 | Boobalaja | he stated early ping did not exist |
| 03:16.46 | DucBlangis | ok cool |
| 03:16.51 | DucBlangis | hah |
| 03:16.52 | *** join/#debian apetc (~apetc@hardchat.net) |
| 03:16.54 | debbrkn | ok, so reboot and |
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| 03:17.02 | DucBlangis | did you edit the interfaces? |
| 03:17.03 | rawfodog | oh got the message jmcnaught |
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| 03:17.38 | rawfodog | I have pulse audio and alsa on this thing I think. should I remove one ? |
| 03:17.39 | debbrkn | ducblanis yes |
| 03:17.41 | DucBlangis | reboot and after that "service networking start" in terminal |
| 03:17.45 | ovan | http://vim-adventures.com/ |
| 03:18.03 | DucBlangis | if it doesn't work I have another idea |
| 03:18.25 | debbrkn | sorry, im having trouble following all this scollback on my phone :P |
| 03:19.12 | jmcnaught | rawfodog: don't go removing things :) did you have sound previously but now you don't? did you try all the steps in the alsa checklist? have you tried pavucontrol? |
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| 03:19.39 | rawfodog | I tried all the steps but I did not try pavucontrol |
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| 03:19.42 | debbrkn | lots of dhcpdiscover |
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| 03:20.01 | rawfodog | can I aptitude it ? |
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| 03:21.35 | debbrkn | ducblangis, configured network interfaces, but unable to ping 8.8.8.8 |
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| 03:21.53 | DucBlangis | ok |
| 03:21.58 | DucBlangis | one sec |
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| 03:22.24 | DucBlangis | You using ipv4 yea? |
| 03:22.45 | debbrkn | ya |
| 03:22.52 | antranigv | hay, I just noticed that NetworkManager's icon is gone... I'm using Gnome ... any help ? |
| 03:23.14 | debbrkn | how do i check that my raspberry pi that im bridging through isnt the issue |
| 03:23.16 | Boobalaja | right click on the panel and add it again ? |
| 03:23.49 | antranigv | Boobalaja: not working :/ |
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| 03:24.21 | Boobalaja | you're on that stupid unity UI aren't you ? |
| 03:24.33 | antranigv | I'm on Gnome classic |
| 03:24.39 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: brctl show |
| 03:24.42 | Boobalaja | oh good good XD |
| 03:24.53 | antranigv | Hate Gnome 3 :P |
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| 03:25.08 | DucBlangis | if they are both eth0 instead of one being eth1 that could be the problem |
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| 03:25.25 | debbrkn | ducblangis nothing listed |
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| 03:26.21 | Boobalaja | antranigv this is kind of stupid but have you tried just restarting ? |
| 03:26.24 | DucBlangis | can you cat /etc/network/interfaces and link to the screenshot |
| 03:26.52 | DucBlangis | i knows its probably a chore on your phone but I just wanna see something since you said you are using a bridge |
| 03:27.09 | antranigv | I did :D I'm not noob :D but nothing is working... btw, today apt deleted lot's of stuff and I didn't notice |
| 03:27.37 | Boobalaja | I'm not implying you are, but sometimes stupid ideas work XD |
| 03:27.52 | antranigv | :D |
| 03:28.09 | antranigv | DucBlangis: here you go... |
| 03:28.09 | antranigv | cat /etc/network/interfaces |
| 03:28.09 | antranigv | # This file describes the network interfaces available on your system |
| 03:28.09 | antranigv | # and how to activate them. For more information, see interfaces(5). |
| 03:28.09 | antranigv | # The loopback network interface |
| 03:28.10 | *** kick/#debian [antranigv!~debhelper@unaffiliated/debhelper] by debhelper (flood. Please use http://paste.debian.net instead.) |
| 03:28.23 | Boobalaja | i guess he didn't read the topic |
| 03:28.25 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: also, "ifconfig eth0 up" but I dont need a screen shot of that :P |
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| 03:28.34 | debbrkn | ducblangis http://imgur.com/8mFaWCD |
| 03:28.38 | DucBlangis | sorry antranigv I was talking to debbrkn |
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| 03:29.13 | antranigv | DucBlangis: never mind ) |
| 03:29.25 | debbrkn | ducblangis ran that command |
| 03:29.42 | DucBlangis | and you're on a wired connection not wifi right? |
| 03:29.55 | antranigv | Boobalaja: any ideas ?? or I should go with Mint ? |
| 03:29.55 | debbrkn | correct |
| 03:29.59 | DucBlangis | ok |
| 03:30.09 | Boobalaja | isn't mint based off debian ? |
| 03:30.31 | antranigv | I dnw actually... how can I reinstall gnome classic ?? |
| 03:30.44 | debbrkn | a wired connection to my rpi which is wirelessly connected to my router which has a wired connection to my mode. |
| 03:30.46 | Boobalaja | apt-get reinstall gdm3 ? |
| 03:30.54 | debbrkn | *modem |
| 03:30.58 | Boobalaja | or something to that effect... |
| 03:31.09 | DucBlangis | ok one more time with the "ifconfig eth0 up" but this time after you run that run "/etc/init.d/networking restart" after |
| 03:31.11 | antranigv | gnome-classic :) I'll try and let you know ) |
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| 03:32.00 | debbrkn | ducblangis then? |
| 03:32.20 | DucBlangis | debbrkn: after that run "sudo vi /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-eth0" and make sure ONBOOT="yes" |
| 03:32.29 | dvs | ???? |
| 03:33.44 | jmcnaught | DucBlangis: isn't that something you would do on Redhat not Debian? |
| 03:33.47 | DucBlangis | does lspci show your wired module is even detected |
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| 03:34.26 | DucBlangis | jmcnaught: I asked my senior admin down the hall what he thought might be the problem and he yelled to try that so... |
| 03:34.44 | Boobalaja | so the idea is scrap |
| 03:34.48 | DucBlangis | could be |
| 03:34.51 | dvs | smacks the admin down the hall |
| 03:35.10 | jmcnaught | debbrkn: if you had reinstalled Wheezy from scratch it would probably be done by now. You've got a FrankenDebian and it's broken. |
| 03:35.13 | DucBlangis | hey debbrkn lspci |
| 03:35.18 | Boobalaja | i have as much faith is network admins as I do in phone tech support :) |
| 03:35.23 | DucBlangis | hah |
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| 03:36.27 | DucBlangis | I just got a new job as a netsec admin and have to listen to these guys all day it can be annoying, I get to goto SANS convention in Vegas in October though |
| 03:36.55 | jmcnaught | !ot |
| 03:36.55 | dpkg | #debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day. |
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| 03:40.41 | DucBlangis | I can't even remember what I came in here for now. Something about GNS3 and a SIP error |
| 03:40.45 | DucBlangis | :\ |
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| 03:41.03 | Boobalaja | if I knew what either of those were, I'd help you |
| 03:41.59 | Duc|afk | Well it's working now but I don't llike when something corrects itself and I don't know how it did so |
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| 03:42.33 | Duc|afk | and GNS3 is a network simulator |
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| 03:57.37 | brkndebian | my phone died and its still not working yet :/ |
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| 03:59.21 | brkndebian | tried ifconfig eth0 up |
| 03:59.52 | brkndebian | then restarted networking, but i still cant reach |
| 03:59.56 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: My advice is to not attempt completing the upgrade to Jessie (which is unfinished and breaks sometimes anyways). You've got a FrankenDebian. In the time you've been working on this you probably could have reinstalled Wheezy from scratch twice by now. |
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| 04:00.35 | brkndebian | jmcnaught, how do i backup my environment and installed programs? |
| 04:00.57 | Boobalaja | don't use a single partition for the entire install |
| 04:01.15 | brkndebian | its LUKS |
| 04:01.57 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: if you have an external drive you can hopefully still use "mount" and "cp" for your files. |
| 04:03.36 | brkndebian | jmcnaught, yeah... but i dont know what all i need to copy. /home obv, but i want all my chromium history, irssi, etc |
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| 04:04.05 | Boobalaja | tell the debian installer not to touch /home |
| 04:04.10 | Boobalaja | and you shouldn't need to back it up |
| 04:04.33 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: all of that should be in your /home. as for installed programs you could normally do "dpkg --get-selections" but I wouldn't trust that from a broken system such as yours. |
| 04:04.38 | brkndebian | boobalaja: chromium history isnt in /home is it? |
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| 04:05.04 | Boobalaja | no idea, sorry brkn |
| 04:05.11 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: Boobalaja: telling the installer not to touch /home only works if it's on a separate volume. |
| 04:05.37 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: all of your user's files and settings including chromium history would be in /home |
| 04:05.50 | brkndebian | ok, i suppose i will back it all up, and copy home back over and hope for the best. thanks guys |
| 04:06.06 | Boobalaja | don't install it all to 1 partition |
| 04:06.29 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: you should read https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian as well |
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| 04:06.58 | Boobalaja | I wonder if mounting the debian mount points on different hdd's would speed it up XD |
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| 04:07.24 | brkndebian | jmcnaught I should since this would be the 3rd time :) |
| 04:07.49 | Boobalaja | do what I do, get more computers to test silly stuff on |
| 04:08.02 | Boobalaja | when you find out it doesn't break your debian install, then do it on the main box XD |
| 04:08.06 | jmcnaught | brkndebian: Also check out the Debian Reference and Debian Administrator's Handbook before considering an upgrade to Jessie |
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| 04:08.32 | brkndebian | will do. bye |
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| 04:09.55 | jmcnaught | Boobalaja: telling people they "shouldn't need to back it up" because /home is on a separate volume if they're using the installer probably isn't the best advice. Everybody should backup, all the time :) |
| 04:10.41 | Boobalaja | i meant to add "but you should back it up anyways", but by then it was moot |
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| 04:13.33 | Boobalaja | the only thing I ever backup on debian when/if I reinstall is my web directory |
| 04:14.09 | Boobalaja | everything else I just add to a very long line for apt-get |
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| 04:34.36 | thorie | can someone help me with lintian? |
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| 04:46.18 | unclezipper | Does Debian still host repos for Squeeze? |
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| 04:48.16 | Cpuroast | unclezipper: see Debian-LTS |
| 04:48.18 | Cpuroast | oups |
| 04:48.21 | Cpuroast | Squeeze-LTS |
| 04:48.35 | Cpuroast | unclezipper: https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Using |
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| 05:05.44 | pharvey | I'm having an enormously difficult time getting my 27", mid-2011 iMac12,2 to run X. What's up with the fglrx being dropped from jessie? It seems I have to run linux-image-3.12-1-amd64 + firmware-linux-nonfree in order to get anything to work. linux-image-3.14-1-amd64 results in an utterly blank screen at boot, no console. |
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| 05:09.16 | jmcnaught | pharvey: From what I understand recent upgrades to Xorg broke fglrx (because it's not compatible yet, and being open source cannot be patched by Debian). This kind of thing happens in Jessie because it's not finished yet, it's the testing branch which is primarily for testing and finding bugs. If you run Wheezy/Stable this sort of thing wouldn't happen. Installing some packages from unstable might help ("/msg dpkg tum") and it's probably also bett |
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| 05:09.39 | jmcnaught | err.. fglrx not being open source that is |
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| 05:10.32 | pharvey | I understand, however it seems to be a regression that the proprietary driver is required at all. |
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| 05:12.15 | jmcnaught | pharvey: you might have better luck using the open source radeon driver, but the non-free firmware is still required for it to work |
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| 05:15.58 | unclezipper | Cpuroast: Thanks, I just got a VPS with Dreamhost and it's garbage |
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| 05:18.35 | unclezipper | Perhaps I'm unlucky, but any time I've tried using the open-source nvidia and radeon drivers, something always happens to lock up the computer. |
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| 05:19.53 | pharvey | I wish I could just tell it to use i915. At some point along the way I had to start using proprietary drivers. Perhaps I should install MacOS again and go back to rEFIt |
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| 05:22.32 | pdvyas | pharvey: Is there not boot param to force it to use the intel card? |
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| 05:25.28 | pharvey | pdvyas: well, I've seen references to i915.disable=1. The real trick is finding out how to switch display inputs on the internal display. |
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| 05:29.56 | pdvyas | pharvey: did you try switcharoo? |
| 05:30.11 | pharvey | that's not available in 3.14 AFAICT |
| 05:31.36 | pdvyas | pharvey: oh. I am on 3.15 on a macbookpro. Blessing my stars that it's intel only. Hope you find a way. |
| 05:31.45 | pharvey | thanks :) |
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| 05:32.25 | martinjungblut | pharvey: sorry, what is your issue again? I wasn't here ealier, so I couldn't have read it, but I got interested just now |
| 05:33.07 | pharvey | jmcnaught: FWIW I haven't used fglrx on my current attempt (3 hours old). modprobe radeon (because I had it blacklisted) appears to give promising dmesg messages (over ssh) but then I have a blank screen. |
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| 05:34.31 | pharvey | martinjungblut: I've just done a fresh install of jessie on an iMac12,2 with a brand new hard disk (installed an SSD). Out of the box, jessie doesn't seem to support this mac unless I downgrade the kernel to 3.12 |
| 05:34.49 | pharvey | and install linux-firmware-nonfree |
| 05:35.27 | pharvey | This is an EFI install without any trace of MacOS, FWIW. Perhaps it's a grub thing. |
| 05:35.27 | martinjungblut | tried reading dmesg? |
| 05:35.45 | martinjungblut | what happens during boot? |
| 05:35.47 | pharvey | dmesg with kernel 3.14 + firmware-linux-nonfree looks normal. |
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| 05:36.12 | pharvey | During boot things look normal until the point at where I suspect radeon driver is loaded. Then I get blank screen until reboot. |
| 05:36.34 | pharvey | With kernel 3.12 I see the init scripts fire up and it will boot straight to kdm login |
| 05:36.36 | martinjungblut | ah, I see.. and you have already tried blacklisting radeon, right? |
| 05:36.47 | pharvey | yes, that's what I mentioned before just as you jumped in. |
| 05:37.26 | martinjungblut | and what happens when you blacklist it? |
| 05:37.41 | pharvey | X won't start, I get a text console only. |
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| 05:37.45 | pharvey | X segfaults. |
| 05:37.56 | martinjungblut | anything in dmesg then? |
| 05:38.25 | pharvey | Sorry, no segfault that time - just no screens found. |
| 05:38.34 | martinjungblut | ah |
| 05:38.45 | martinjungblut | is this one of the dual-GPU laptops? |
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| 05:38.51 | pharvey | It's a dual-GPU iMac |
| 05:38.51 | martinjungblut | radeon+i915 ? |
| 05:38.53 | pharvey | yeah |
| 05:39.11 | martinjungblut | have you tried disabling KMS? |
| 05:39.23 | pharvey | no |
| 05:39.39 | pharvey | okay blacklisted radeon -> boot -> startx = segfault |
| 05:40.00 | pharvey | [KMS] drm report modesetting isn't supported |
| 05:40.04 | pharvey | after that it segfaults |
| 05:40.25 | pharvey | or does X just always segfault after that kind of error |
| 05:40.27 | pharvey | shall try disabling KMS |
| 05:40.46 | martinjungblut | try that.. looks like it isn't working because KMS is not supported |
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| 05:41.52 | pharvey | well, it works with kernel 3.12 but that was dropped from jessie (still available on snapshot.debian.org though). |
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| 05:42.29 | jmcnaught | pharvey: have you considered wheezy + backports? |
| 05:43.40 | pharvey | I've always used testing - I'm not hear to complain or seek sympathy, just work through this particular issue. Perhaps file a bug if that seems appropriate. |
| 05:44.09 | pharvey | I seem to be the only person on the planet using a dual-GPU mac and native Debian efi boot |
| 05:44.14 | pharvey | :) |
| 05:44.46 | pharvey | not hear? not here... |
| 05:44.52 | jmcnaught | pharvey: Jessie is supported in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net :) |
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| 05:45.37 | martinjungblut | is jessie off-topic here? |
| 05:46.06 | pharvey | I normally would log on to oftc but my IRC config on that laptop is missing that server. Guess I'll add it now |
| 05:46.08 | martinjungblut | or are you simply trying to help, pointing at a better channel for this particular purpose? |
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| 05:46.27 | jmcnaught | martinjungblut: the topic suggests that it is. I think it's not that big a deal if it's a general problem not specific to Jessie. |
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| 05:47.19 | jmcnaught | but in the #debian-next channel on irc.oftc.net (which is where all the other official debian channels are) there are people using Jessie who might be more familiar with its quirks |
| 05:49.00 | jmcnaught | I think some of the ops don't really care, but I've seen others bring it up quite frequently. I don't see why it's a big deal to use the correct channel though |
| 05:49.44 | nullvibe | in this particular case, it probably wouldn't be |
| 05:50.14 | themill | it's not offtopic but most of the time you are far more likely to find people who know what is happening on any particular day in testing/unstable over in #debian-next. |
| 05:50.15 | nullvibe | some of us use stuff like tor though, and many irc networks block it and other proxies (but not oftc) |
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| 05:59.46 | nurupo | notices double-spaces in /topic |
| 05:59.59 | nurupo | 's eyes bleed |
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| 06:01.14 | hanasaki | will there be support in wheezy to build newer kernels? something has changed that breaks on kernel-package when making the .deb for the most current kernel.org download |
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| 06:03.50 | jmcnaught | hanasaki: do you need a kernel newer than the 3.14 in wheezy-backports? that's the same version jessie has |
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| 06:06.50 | hanasaki | jmcnaught: the backport seems to lock /hang on shutdown and has corrupted my filesystem . also I need newer for supprot of my Nick |
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| 06:09.44 | DucBlangis | What do you guys use for backup? |
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| 06:09.52 | hanasaki | tar |
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| 06:10.07 | jmcnaught | DucBlangis: I use Duply |
| 06:10.08 | DucBlangis | oh heh |
| 06:10.10 | DucBlangis | I like ukopp |
| 06:10.26 | martinjungblut | tar, xz, XFS and redundancy |
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| 06:11.38 | hanasaki | martinjungblut: curious... why xfs over raid or ext4 or btrfs ? |
| 06:12.08 | hanasaki | has used rsync too |
| 06:12.16 | martinjungblut | XFS has much better scalability and performance when compared to ext4 |
| 06:12.22 | martinjungblut | btrfs isn't that stable yet |
| 06:12.36 | martinjungblut | XFS also has better user space tools |
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| 06:12.49 | hanasaki | thought it btrfs wasn't stable. but its in debian stable? |
| 06:13.04 | martinjungblut | it's merged in upstream kernels already |
| 06:13.11 | martinjungblut | but it is not yet production-ready |
| 06:13.14 | DucBlangis | ever tried JFS? |
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| 06:13.22 | martinjungblut | me? never |
| 06:13.28 | pharvey | I used to use JFS for years |
| 06:13.30 | martinjungblut | I hear it's not maintained that actively any more |
| 06:13.48 | hanasaki | martinjungblut: why xfs over a raid mirror? |
| 06:13.48 | DucBlangis | ah |
| 06:14.15 | pharvey | it had very decent performance compared to ext3, very CPU efficient. But nowadays ext4 is perhaps a better choice for most workloads. |
| 06:14.20 | martinjungblut | hanasaki: I don't have that many drives where a RAID set-up would be applicable |
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| 06:14.47 | hanasaki | ah |
| 06:14.58 | martinjungblut | hanasaki: my backups aren't that big.. a couple thousand gigabytes on two external HDDs |
| 06:15.06 | cafuego | raid is always applicable |
| 06:15.10 | hanasaki | just did 2 x 1TB raid mirrors .. with mdadm. is that good enough? |
| 06:15.11 | pharvey | I've been using BTRFS on all my servers, laptops, desktops now for about 18 months. I never had any issues until I started using Docker, which creates a huge number of snapshots in normal use. |
| 06:15.30 | martinjungblut | cafuego: if you have the resources, sure |
| 06:15.42 | martinjungblut | my main machine is a laptop with a single drive slot |
| 06:15.50 | cafuego | martinjungblut: An extra HDD is a lot cheaper than losing your data when a disk dies. |
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| 06:16.02 | martinjungblut | cafuego: raid isn't needed for that |
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| 06:16.27 | cafuego | martinjungblut: continual backups works too, sure. But restoring costs time too. |
| 06:16.33 | martinjungblut | true |
| 06:16.47 | martinjungblut | if I had a modern desktop, I'd go with RAID |
| 06:16.52 | martinjungblut | and many drives |
| 06:17.02 | cafuego | The only place I don't is on my laptop (1 drive bay) |
| 06:17.15 | cafuego | But that does do continuous backups :-) |
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| 06:17.23 | hanasaki | pharvey: I just started with docker and lxc fun stuff... docker doesn't save the system state for a restart like lxc :( does it? |
| 06:18.05 | hanasaki | does duply handle backups ok for files that are open when backed up? like a db file? |
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| 06:19.38 | cafuego | hanasaki: Depends on the DB I guess. |
| 06:19.43 | pharvey | hanasaki: docker's philosophy is that you should separate your data storage + containers. Or at least that's what they tell me on #docker :-) Try http://docs.docker.com/userguide/dockervolumes/ there are quite a number of ways around it. |
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| 06:20.42 | pharvey | many people create "data-only" containers and map those in, In my usage of docker I just create volumes from the parts of the host filesystem where I want to persist something. |
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| 06:21.05 | hanasaki | pharvey: I agree with that. ex: lets say I update the docker container and install jenkins ci . when the docker container shuts down... its gone |
| 06:21.05 | pharvey | btrfs subvolume/snapshot + btrfs send is a great way to run backups. |
| 06:21.33 | pharvey | Sadly btrfs send/receive isn't that robust to eg. system going to sleep half-way through, however I think there's been some recent improvements in that area |
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| 06:21.44 | hanasaki | pharvey: can the subvol/snapshot be saved to an external backup disk? |
| 06:21.55 | pharvey | hanasaki: absolutely. I do this daily. |
| 06:21.58 | cafuego | hanasaki: You can't backup the files-on-disk for mysql, eg. |
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| 06:22.28 | cafuego | Well, you can, but there's no guarantee you can restore that to a working db. |
| 06:22.34 | hanasaki | cafuego: nice. the mysql server needs to be shutdonw so the file stays consistent? |
| 06:22.42 | hanasaki | ah :) |
| 06:23.05 | cafuego | hanasaki: No, you use mysqldump to dump databases to file, then abckup the dumps and your binary logs. |
| 06:23.25 | hanasaki | pharvey: how do you partition your root/tmp/var etc? subvolumes on a single large parent vol? |
| 06:23.35 | cafuego | If performance is an issue, you do that on a slave server. |
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| 06:24.21 | pharvey | hanasaki: depends on the machine purpose. I actually have a read-only rootfs on some stuff, but they're machines that can lose power at any time. Those aren't btrfs either :) But with btrfs, yes, I just do one large vol and create a few subvolumes |
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| 06:24.58 | pharvey | sadly you can't be very selective with snapshots. So I have to carve up the subvols a bit so that very large media files aren't included in my daily snapshots. |
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| 06:27.37 | hanasaki | cafuego: is there a better option for LARGE DB's? as in many TB? |
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| 06:29.12 | cafuego | hanasaki: Yes, assuming you're not using myisam tables. |
| 06:29.53 | cafuego | hanasaki: Have a look at xtrabackup |
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| 06:32.29 | hanasaki | thank you |
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| 06:33.47 | hanasaki | when aptitude shows "i A .... pakcage name" what is the "A"? |
| 06:33.53 | Mountain_r | Hi, can I ask what kind of desktop uses this downloadable version? debian-live-7.6.0-amd64-standard.iso.torrent |
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| 06:34.52 | Boobalaja | I have a witty remark to say about but it'd be off-topic... |
| 06:35.08 | jrabbit | Mountain_r: 64 bit consumer pcs |
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| 06:37.13 | Mountain_r | jrabbit, after the installation what desktop environment has? gnome? |
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| 06:40.35 | MO_Handes | how can I get a list of installed hardware on my laptop? for example what is my SSD brand and model? |
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| 06:41.44 | themill | Mountain_r: if you want to install, you'd do better with the installer images than the live images. The DE that gets installed is the one you choose to install. |
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| 06:41.54 | themill | MO_Handes: lshw is handy for that |
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| 06:44.17 | nullvibe | MO_Handes: dmidecode, lshw, lsscsi, dmesg, and smartctl. although if you know what you're looking for, you can pull most of it by cat'ing stuff in /proc by hand too |
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| 06:44.24 | scotty12 | Why can't I run GPA on Debian? I get this error http://i.imgur.com/Qz6oRgW.png |
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| 06:44.33 | nullvibe | oh...lsusb and lspci too |
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| 06:48.53 | NotJimCarrey | need some help getting transmission-daemon to run from /etc/init.d/ |
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| 06:49.33 | NotJimCarrey | getting "Starting transmission-daemon (via systemctl): transmission-daemon.serviceJob for transmission-daemon.service failed" |
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| 06:49.36 | Mountain_r | themill, thanks |
| 06:50.39 | NotJimCarrey | only thing i'm noticing is "transmission-daemon.service: main process exited, code=killed, status=11/SEGV" |
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| 06:51.14 | NotJimCarrey | runs fine if i just run the actual command though |
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| 07:01.18 | scotty12 | does anyone know how to use GPA (the gui for gpg) on debian? I get errors when ever I try to run it: http://i.imgur.com/Qz6oRgW.png |
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| 07:06.21 | Mountain_r | On this download page http://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/7.6.0/amd64/bt-dvd/ i can see 3 dvd iso torrents. why there are 3 of them? Do I need to download and install all of them? |
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| 07:07.05 | formorer | you should never download a dvd unless you plan to install debian on a system without any internet (or with very very bad internet) |
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| 07:07.17 | formorer | for all other cases netinst oder cd1 is enough |
| 07:09.42 | Mountain_r | oder? you mean or? |
| 07:11.11 | formorer | Mountain_r: eh sorry. sure. |
| 07:11.29 | Mountain_r | get it. thanks |
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| 07:56.15 | krejsi | hi, can some one tell me what this does in a preseed skript "d-i preseed/run string classes.sh" |
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| 07:58.29 | formorer | krejsi: https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/apbs05.html.en |
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| 07:58.51 | formorer | krejsi: in short: it runs a script that returns a preseed configuration. |
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| 07:59.14 | krejsi | formorer: like anaconda file in redhat? |
| 07:59.28 | formorer | I am not familiar with anaconda, so: maybe. |
| 07:59.31 | krejsi | for kickstart |
| 07:59.34 | krejsi | ok |
| 07:59.36 | krejsi | thanks |
| 07:59.48 | formorer | it is just a method for generating a preseed configuration file on the fly |
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| 08:01.26 | krejsi | another question, what would be the best RAID setup for a server that has 4x 4TB harddrives that is intended to sniff and log traffic at 1.25gb/s |
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| 08:04.37 | MO_Handes | according to this info do I have two kernels installed now? can I remove one? http://paste.debian.net/112328/ |
| 08:04.56 | formorer | ii linux-image-amd64 3.13+56 amd64 Linux for 64-bit PCs (meta-package) |
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| 08:05.04 | formorer | the meta package means: this is not a real package. |
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| 08:05.29 | formorer | it just depends on the latest available kernel package |
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| 08:55.18 | alt^255 | Hi. Is there any reason why .xsession is not sourced? I remember reading somewhere about .xsession.d but the startup scripts seems to be fine. |
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| 08:59.25 | SynrGy | alt^255: see man Xsession |
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| 09:00.02 | SynrGy | alt^255: read SESSION TYPES and under SUPPLIED SCRIPTS, /etc/X11/Xsession.d/50x11-common_determine-startup |
| 09:01.24 | alt^255 | SynrGy: all matches. In fact, allow-user-xsession is set in /etc/X11/Xsession.options, and 50x11... should execute .xsession in my $HOME |
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| 09:04.04 | SynrGy | alt^255: is it started by a display manager? did you read about the argument that specifies which to start? |
| 09:04.25 | SynrGy | alt^255: if the display manager dictates what to start, then that is used instead of .xsession |
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| 09:17.26 | chomwitt_ | my vps provider doesnt support upgrades to wheezy. could please somenoe sugest to me providers more debian friendly with more upgradable virtualization technlogy? |
| 09:17.51 | pclov3r | what does uname -a output? |
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| 09:20.21 | SynrGy | chomwitt_: i can't recommend any one particular one, but i do know that a bunch are listed at https://wiki.debian.org/DebianHosting |
| 09:20.59 | pclov3r | chomwitt_, can you do a uname -a output or do they know what they use? Is it OpenVZ? |
| 09:21.29 | Stummi | shouldn't you be able to upgrade a VPS your own without the need of the providers support? |
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| 09:21.41 | Stummi | thats the purpose of a VPS. Or do you have something managed? |
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| 09:21.53 | chomwitt_ | one moment |
| 09:21.53 | futex | Do you know a tool to crypt a usb key, supported by linux and windows, other truecrypt |
| 09:22.45 | chomwitt_ | Linux e-nous 2.6.18-028stab092.1 #1 SMP Wed Jul 20 19:47:12 MSD 2011 x86_64 GNU/Linux |
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| 09:23.34 | Stummi | futex, why not truecrypt? |
| 09:24.27 | chomwitt_ | Stummi: not being expert i think that the kernel running in the hardware must be compatible with the debian kernel u want to use |
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| 09:25.06 | futex | Stummi: because i'm paranoid :) |
| 09:25.17 | pclov3r | yeah that's OpenVZ |
| 09:25.38 | alt^255 | SynrGy: the display manager is wmii, it does not have its own startup manager. |
| 09:25.43 | Stummi | futex, erm, actually truecrypt is the encryption suite for the paranoid folks |
| 09:26.06 | SynrGy | alt^255: wmii isn't a display manager |
| 09:26.35 | SynrGy | ok. so you're using startx to start, and it ignores ~/.xsession? |
| 09:26.36 | alt^255 | SynrGy: I meant window manager. Sorry. The display manager should be whatever is the default 'desktop' in debian testing nowadays |
| 09:26.36 | Stummi | chomwitt_, yeah, right, if you are on paravirtualization like xen, didn't thought on that |
| 09:26.41 | alt^255 | SynrGy: yes. |
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| 09:27.16 | pclov3r | chomwitt_, i'd find a new host just from that uname -a output |
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| 09:27.24 | alt^255 | SynrGy: no, my bad. startx uses .xinitrc, I'm using the default login manager |
| 09:27.24 | SynrGy | execution bit is set on .xsession? (shouldn't matter. Xsession(5) says it sets it if it isn't set ...) |
| 09:27.32 | pclov3r | it's clear your webhost does not give a shit about updates and security |
| 09:27.36 | alt^255 | SynrGy: it's a symbolic link to my repository of dotfiles |
| 09:27.50 | pclov3r | that kernel is 3 years old and still not updated |
| 09:27.58 | pclov3r | sounds like it's time to move |
| 09:28.08 | SynrGy | alt^255: it == ~/.xsession? what about the file it points at. is the execution bit set on it? |
| 09:28.32 | Stummi | futex, actually, if you are that paranoid, you shouldn't use windows at all |
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| 09:28.49 | SynrGy | alt^255: i can see how Xsession might misfire if it's dealing with a symlink and fail to set the exec bit on the linked to file ... |
| 09:28.58 | Stummi | however, there are some projects which continue TC. take a look here: https://truecrypt.ch/ |
| 09:29.15 | futex | Stummi: i never use windows, but not other people |
| 09:29.19 | alt^255 | SynrGy: I'll try to fix it. But I'm positive I read once that I had to create a .xsession.d directory in my home |
| 09:29.21 | pclov3r | chomwitt_, i'd suggest a vm with KVM or XEN |
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| 09:29.42 | alt^255 | but I can't find anything in the official docs. |
| 09:30.26 | futex | Stummi: https://ciphershed.org/ |
| 09:30.37 | futex | a truecrypt fork :) |
| 09:31.19 | Stummi | well, yeah, or use this if you think its safer. Your decission |
| 09:31.25 | SynrGy | alt^255: you said: |
| 09:31.28 | SynrGy | 06:27 < alt^255> SynrGy: no, my bad. startx uses .xinitrc, I'm using the default login manager |
| 09:31.37 | SynrGy | "the default login manager" is gdm3? |
| 09:32.07 | alt^255 | SynrGy: to be honest I have no idea. It's not gdm for sure, the first X session ran with xfce so it's probably XFCE's login manager. |
| 09:32.09 | SynrGy | lightdm |
| 09:32.22 | banjo | alt^255: i think you are using lightdm as displaymanager so you need .xprofile to be sourced from .xinitrc..thats what i remember lightdm reads automatically windowmanagers. but some windowmanagers doesnt come with a .desktop-file so you need to creat one... |
| 09:32.32 | banjo | maybe this helps:) |
| 09:32.57 | alt^255 | banjo: .xprofile! darn. Ok. cheers. will try that too |
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| 09:33.39 | banjo | look at https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Lightdm |
| 09:33.55 | Stummi | futex, be aware that security software is a sensible topic. You should handle especially new projects with care. Take a look on how much contributors it has (open source doesn't bring anything if no one look into the source) and if they have some background with security software |
| 09:34.08 | banjo | not debian specific but i think you get it |
| 09:34.41 | alt^255 | banjo: ta. I was hoping debian's own documentation for their own login manager were up to date tho :( |
| 09:35.50 | banjo | alt^255: yeah its sad that the debian wiki isnt the best |
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| 09:37.04 | futex | Stummi: yes of course, but i'm not sur about truecrypt too http://www.esecurityplanet.com/open-source-security/are-truecrypt-users-screwed.html |
| 09:37.20 | SynrGy | i don't think this is a failing in debian's doc, but rather in lightdm's doc. it should ship with adequate documentation |
| 09:37.27 | SynrGy | apparently it doesn't |
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| 09:37.40 | SynrGy | feel free to file bugs/patches upstream :) |
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| 09:37.49 | alt^255 | SynrGy: true, but debian's doc still talks about .xsession, which is wrong. |
| 09:38.00 | SynrGy | wrong? no |
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| 09:38.22 | SynrGy | all reasonable *dms allow you to start using .xsession |
| 09:38.34 | SynrGy | so debian's doc that refers to it is correct. |
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| 09:39.06 | alt^255 | SynrGy: true, but debian ships with lightdm by default, which doesn't, so either it should stop doing that, or point out where to find more information about lightdm. The current state of the doc is inconsistent. |
| 09:39.18 | SynrGy | lightdm's documentation should address that |
| 09:39.24 | SynrGy | this is an upstream issue. |
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| 09:40.12 | SynrGy | the only (oblique) hint i get is by looking in /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf |
| 09:40.28 | SynrGy | if i search for 'sessions' in there, i find: |
| 09:40.31 | SynrGy | #sessions-directory=/usr/share/lightdm/sessions:/usr/share/xsessions |
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| 09:40.36 | banjo | SynrGy: thats right. but i find often myself searchin in archwiki than in debians:) |
| 09:40.46 | lxsameer | hey guys, does debian included "mkinitcpio" utility ? |
| 09:40.48 | ftc- | does kde on debian come with the exact same default settings using the kde debian live cd -vs- doing a normal install then installing the kde packages? |
| 09:40.56 | alt^255 | SynrGy: good point. I think lightdm config files should go under X11 |
| 09:41.13 | SynrGy | banjo: for a few pages, i do. they seem to be extremely dedicated at writing and maintaining doc that upstream should've provided instead. |
| 09:41.37 | SynrGy | banjo: so, props to them for their efforts. but it's too bad that stuff doesn't flow back upstream |
| 09:41.45 | alt^255 | anyhow, I think I'll sort it out now. Thanks everyone. |
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| 09:41.50 | SynrGy | then everyone would benefit |
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| 09:42.39 | SynrGy | banjo: as for debian's wiki "not being best", only you can fix that ;) |
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| 09:43.18 | banjo | SynrGy: thats a good point. never thought about that. from wiki ro upstream |
| 09:43.58 | banjo | SynrGy: i think i would break it;) |
| 09:44.06 | SynrGy | banjo: i think debian's wiki does its best to deal with debian-specific issues, and should xref other doc when appropriate, not strive to rewrite it |
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| 09:46.40 | SynrGy | banjo: also, for reference doc, debian strongly encourages writing man pages where none exist (many upstreams have received and now ship man pages originally written by debian contributors) |
| 09:47.04 | SynrGy | i think a lightdm.conf man page needs to be written. feel free to file a bug. |
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| 09:49.11 | SynrGy | oh great, and then there's #656863 |
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| 10:00.48 | banjo | can someone proof on testint: 'debmany sakura' and 'debmany lightdm' isnt working |
| 10:00.55 | banjo | on testing |
| 10:01.11 | banjo | debmany sakura worked yesterday |
| 10:02.05 | banjo | i get: ERROR: There is no package called 'sakura'. but the package is available |
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| 10:03.39 | babilen | banjo: wfm (on unstable) |
| 10:03.46 | babilen | Err, no on testing |
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| 10:04.25 | SynrGy | ,v debian-goodies |
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| 10:04.28 | judd | Package: debian-goodies on i386 -- squeeze: 0.53; wheezy: 0.61; jessie: 0.63; sid: 0.63 |
| 10:04.38 | SynrGy | same version in both |
| 10:05.18 | banjo | packages like rxvt, gnome-shell, xmobar get downloaded |
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| 10:06.27 | babilen | banjo: Could you run "apt-get update" and then show us the output of "apt-cache policy sakura" and "debmany sakura" (obviously not the ncurses dialog) |
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| 10:07.44 | banjo | sakura: Installed: (none) Candidate: 3.1.3-1 Version table: 3.1.3-1 0 |
| 10:08.45 | banjo | 500 URL testing/main |
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| 10:10.53 | PunIntended | <PROTECTED> |
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| 10:11.35 | PunIntended | banjo: change your mirror like dpkg's instructions. |
| 10:11.56 | SynrGy | eh? |
| 10:12.09 | SynrGy | i think he just abbreviated what he saw instead of pasting |
| 10:12.33 | banjo | PunIntended: no. have correct mirror. just wanted to shorten through URL |
| 10:12.35 | SynrGy | banjo: please use paste.debian.net. you can use nopaste to direct output there |
| 10:12.44 | SynrGy | !nopaste |
| 10:12.45 | dpkg | nopaste is a command-line tool to send data to a <pastebin>. To paste e.g. your sources.list do "aptitude install libapp-nopaste-perl; nopaste /etc/apt/sources.list"; to paste the output of a program do e.g. "dmesg | nopaste". |
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| 10:13.29 | banjo | https://paste.debian.net/112346/ |
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| 10:14.04 | PunIntended | banjo: 404 is normal, 500 is a mirror problem. |
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| 10:15.09 | blackjack | hello i have problem with apt-get and it does stop to work when i apt-get install oidentd |
| 10:15.16 | blackjack | on the line |
| 10:15.19 | blackjack | 0% [Connecting to apt.rackster-server.ch (2a01:4f8:0:a101::1:1)]^C |
| 10:15.26 | blackjack | how to solve this issue? |
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| 10:16.10 | banjo | PunIntended: why is 500 a mirror problem? |
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| 10:16.40 | nkuttler | blackjack: we need the entire output... paste.debian.net |
| 10:16.43 | banjo | apt-cache rxvt i have 500 too and its getting downloaded and displayed |
| 10:16.56 | banjo | apt-cache policy rxvt i mean |
| 10:17.43 | PunIntended | banjo: You are talking about package priority not mirrrors, completly separate. |
| 10:18.00 | themill | PunIntended: you're not helping |
| 10:18.10 | banjo | so i dont understand you PunIntended |
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| 10:19.18 | blackjack | http://paste.debian.net/112349/ |
| 10:19.45 | blackjack | maybe my mirrors too is broken? |
| 10:19.48 | blackjack | how to fix it |
| 10:19.55 | nkuttler | blackjack: does that even exit? or time out? or..? |
| 10:20.01 | blackjack | it just stops there |
| 10:20.01 | blackjack | no |
| 10:20.05 | nkuttler | blackjack: yeah, trying a different mirror is an option |
| 10:20.13 | blackjack | ok it finished |
| 10:20.16 | blackjack | weird |
| 10:20.16 | SynrGy | blackjack: fix your ipv6 connectivity or disable ipv6, perhaps? |
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| 10:20.49 | blackjack | i shall paste another version. where in it continued |
| 10:21.08 | PunIntended | banjo :It is normal for noninstalled packages, the priority is higher when the package is installed. |
| 10:21.24 | SynrGy | blackjack: i would guess a routing issue |
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| 10:22.03 | banjo | PunIntended: my problem is not the priority of packages but that i cant download with the command 'debmany sakura' any info |
| 10:23.16 | PunIntended | banjo: It also does not work on my Sid system, but fine on Wheezy. |
| 10:23.34 | blackjack | SynrGy, nkuttler . here it is |
| 10:23.37 | blackjack | http://paste.debian.net/112350/ |
| 10:23.51 | blackjack | Does this it it still updated correctly? |
| 10:23.57 | level7 | hi guys, I am not so happy about the file manager and the pdf "viever". So to improve my debian experience I would like to have a nicer file manager (more similar to the windows thing). Also for PDF I am looking someting like pdf xchange |
| 10:23.57 | ivanshmakov | Is there an easy way to force pbuilder(8) to use ‘linux32 dpkg-buildpackage’ instead of dpkg-buildpackage? I guess I could substitute one for another by making a suitable /usr/local/bin/dpkg-buildpackage wrapper, but perhaps there’s a better way? |
| 10:24.04 | banjo | PunIntended: ok can you try package 'lightdm' too |
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| 10:24.58 | nkuttler | blackjack: yeah, well, that times out for me as well.. use another mirror |
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| 10:25.08 | formorer | ivanshmakov: --architecture |
| 10:25.11 | SynrGy | blackjack: so everything points at a problem with apt.rackster-server.ch itself, not ipv6 |
| 10:25.25 | banjo | level7: what filemanager and pdfviewer you are using now? |
| 10:25.27 | blackjack | ok |
| 10:25.38 | level7 | the default from the Debian install |
| 10:25.49 | blackjack | SynrGy, but it says starting ident daemon: oidentd |
| 10:25.54 | blackjack | is it now ok? |
| 10:26.01 | SynrGy | it says it is. |
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| 10:26.17 | blackjack | ok |
| 10:26.19 | PunIntended | banjo: The same with lightdm and gdm3 here. |
| 10:26.19 | banjo | level7: are you using Gnome-Shell? |
| 10:26.28 | SynrGy | you apparently have two sets of mirrors in your sources.list |
| 10:26.50 | SynrGy | just comment out the non-working mirror line(s) |
| 10:26.59 | SynrGy | then apt-get update |
| 10:27.01 | banjo | PunIntended: i can download gdm3 |
| 10:27.05 | banjo | courious |
| 10:27.22 | QuestPC | Hi! Can you help me with broken locales, please? One guy installed debian in a strange way, packages are reported to conflicting each other. |
| 10:27.33 | level7 | I just installed Debian 7.6.0 so it's what is shipped with it, i.e. nautilus |
| 10:27.42 | SynrGy | QuestPC: |
| 10:27.44 | SynrGy | !bat |
| 10:27.44 | dpkg | In order for us to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, aptitude or dselect we need the following information: The complete output of your apt-get/aptitude/dselect run (including the command you used); the output from apt-cache policy PKG1 PKG2...; for the relevant packages and "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>. |
| 10:28.07 | PunIntended | banjo: What version of Debian do you use (? |
| 10:28.37 | ivanshmakov | formorer: AIUI, # pbuilder --architecture requires two separate --basetgz’s, which is what I’d like to avoid. |
| 10:29.32 | SynrGy | banjo, level7: so i guess that means evince for the pdf viewer. as for gnome-shell, relevance? (would the file manager appearance be any different under gnome-shell vs. classic, i mean?) |
| 10:29.46 | PunIntended | ivanshmakov: Is modifying the string in the source code adequate ? |
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| 10:30.05 | QuestPC | SynrGy: http://paste.debian.net/112352/ and please wait a minute I also will provide the output of commands the bot suggested |
| 10:30.34 | banjo | level7: so it should be nautilus. you can look at 'thunar' for example or 'xfe' or 'pcmanfm' but i dont know how its working with gnome-shell |
| 10:30.40 | level7 | banjo, SynrGy: I am in the classic view... for the pdf, I just would love a more featurefull application, for the file manager, I really do not like much the nautilus |
| 10:30.43 | banjo | PunIntended: im on testing |
| 10:30.50 | ivanshmakov | PunIntended: As in: in /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-buildpackage? I guess that chaning it back in forth isn’t all that sensible. |
| 10:31.15 | level7 | I do not like the "gnome3d" teletubbies-phone thing |
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| 10:31.32 | ivanshmakov | OTOH, a dpkg-buildpackage(1) wrapper could check its command-line arguments and use linux32, linux64, or neither as appropriate. |
| 10:32.03 | PunIntended | banjo: Have a Debian Sid here. |
| 10:32.12 | QuestPC | SynrGy: http://paste.debian.net/112353/ |
| 10:32.35 | PunIntended | ivanshmakov: I would use an automated script to do that. |
| 10:32.44 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Why there is wheezy and jessie at the same time? apt-get update also mentions both. Is that really bad? |
| 10:33.21 | TJ- | ivanshmakov: In my scripts they simply do "linux32 pdebuild ..." |
| 10:33.46 | ivanshmakov | TJ-: ACK, thanks, will check if it’d work for me. |
| 10:33.56 | SynrGy | QuestPC: yes. that's bad. distro mixing is not supported. |
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| 10:34.32 | QuestPC | SynrGy: http://paste.debian.net/112355/ Is it possible to do anything with that except for re-installation, which is very undesitable? |
| 10:34.36 | SynrGy | QuestPC: this system is probably screwed. either fully upgrade to jessie or reinstall pure wheezy ... |
| 10:34.42 | PunIntended | dpkg: tell QuestPC -about FrankenDebian |
| 10:34.44 | TJ- | ivanshmakov: My documentation (and more) is here: http://tjworld.net/wiki/Linux/Ubuntu/Packages/CreatingPbuilderVariations#Cross-compilingarchitectureproblems |
| 10:34.45 | SynrGy | QuestPC: and use backports for newer stuff |
| 10:35.26 | PunIntended | QuestPC: It is not supported at all. |
| 10:35.34 | banjo | level7: for pdf you can look at epdfview. but be aware that in the next release of debian it will not be anymore in the repos |
| 10:35.47 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Is it possible to fully upgrade to jessie? I never worked with debian, only redhat and ubuntu. |
| 10:35.55 | SynrGy | level7: you might consider kde / okular to be better |
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| 10:36.43 | QuestPC | PunIntended: It seems like works, nginx mysql and rest of stuff works, but perl and another packages complain about locale :( |
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| 10:37.30 | SynrGy | QuestPC: what it "seems like" aside, it is not supported. at all. |
| 10:37.32 | ivanshmakov | TJ-: I just can’t refrain from asking: why not use Wikibooks for such instructions? For one thing, it may make contributing easier for anyone interested, – and that includes translations, too. |
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| 10:37.45 | SynrGy | QuestPC: get this machine into a supported configuration and then we can help. |
| 10:37.58 | TJ- | ivanshmakov: Those articles are my aide mémoire |
| 10:38.25 | PunIntended | QuestPC: You may can. Disable all wheezy lines in the source. Then apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade. It may work. |
| 10:38.50 | QuestPC | SynrGy: How complex is that locale package? Is that a binary or shell scripts? Maybe it can be built from source? Managers will not allow to re-install it from zero, because that is downtime for hosting sites. |
| 10:39.05 | SynrGy | QuestPC: caution. if you do as PunIntended suggests, you'll be on testing. this is not recommended for a production web server. |
| 10:39.31 | SynrGy | QuestPC: the system is already badly broken and not supportable. downtime here is unavoidable. |
| 10:39.38 | ivanshmakov | TJ-: Well, this Wikibooks participant – https://ru.wikibooks.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Dipsy – claims the same about his own contributions. |
| 10:39.40 | QuestPC | PunIntended: Is there an example of apt source file for jessie somewhere? |
| 10:39.42 | SynrGy | the person who installed this has screwed it up |
| 10:39.47 | PunIntended | SynrGy: QuestPC can't downgrade. |
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| 10:40.15 | themill | PunIntended: blindly upgrading to testing is also not a good option |
| 10:40.19 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Is jessie very much experimental? I notice the machine has php 5.4 while Ubuntu 14.04lts already has php 5.5. |
| 10:40.28 | SynrGy | !testing security |
| 10:40.30 | dpkg | Jessie is unlikely to receive full security support for some time -- don't run Jessie on things where good security support and stability are important. |
| 10:40.41 | SynrGy | QuestPC: ^^ big reason not to run a production web server on jessie. |
| 10:40.51 | SynrGy | and that's only one of many |
| 10:40.53 | QuestPC | SynrGy: I think better is jessie that screwed. |
| 10:41.25 | QuestPC | SynrGy: It was not me installing such weird way, I'd install Ubuntu 14.04lts but no luck. |
| 10:41.26 | SynrGy | QuestPC: "better" is relative ... is it better to be eaten by sharks or drown? :) |
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| 10:41.47 | ivanshmakov | TJ-: I currently hold administrator rights at the Russian Wikibooks, and also contribute to English Wikibooks, so if there’s anything that could be improved there, – I’d very much like to know about that. |
| 10:41.56 | PunIntended | QuestPC: If you have a 99,9percent disponibility contract, Jessie is better. |
| 10:42.33 | QuestPC | SynrGy: 12.04 lts for example has ancient php 5.3. but it is recommended to upgrade to 14.04lts. both however are not jessie based (seems so) - I do not know for sure. |
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| 10:43.24 | SynrGy | QuestPC: i can't make any recommendations concerning ubuntu ... |
| 10:43.29 | TJ- | ivanshmakov: I don't like hosting my content elsewhere; I host so that I have control over it |
| 10:43.31 | SynrGy | QuestPC: if you're entertaining that option, ask them. |
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| 10:43.52 | PunIntended | QuestPC: You can recompile a newer PHP. |
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| 10:43.56 | QuestPC | PunIntended: Is there currect /etc/apt/sources.list for jessie available anywhere? |
| 10:43.58 | SynrGy | ,v php5 |
| 10:44.00 | judd | Package: php5 on i386 -- squeeze: 5.3.3-7+squeeze17; squeeze-security: 5.3.3-7+squeeze17; squeeze: 5.3.3-7+squeeze19; squeeze-security: 5.3.3-7+squeeze19; squeeze-security-lts: 5.3.3-7+squeeze21; wheezy: 5.4.4-14+deb7u11; wheezy-proposed-updates: 5.4.4-14+deb7u12; wheezy-security: 5.4.4-14+deb7u12; jessie: 5.6.0~rc2+dfsg-5; sid: 5.6.0~rc2+dfsg-5 |
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| 10:44.24 | SynrGy | QuestPC: wheezy has php 5.4. recent enough? |
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| 10:44.47 | QuestPC | PunIntended: I do not recompile anything for about 5 years or so.. |
| 10:45.02 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Yes machine has php 5.4. But it has broken locale. |
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| 10:45.18 | QuestPC | SynrGy: 5.4 is enough, 5.6 is experimental and mad, you are right. |
| 10:45.35 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Try apt-get --reinstall install localr |
| 10:45.41 | PunIntended | *locale |
| 10:45.55 | QuestPC | SynrGy: But there were "sury" external debs for php 5.5, maybe they will work with jessie - I do not know, they are for 12.04lts |
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| 10:46.19 | formorer | dpkg-reconfigure locales |
| 10:46.27 | themill | QuestPC: mixing in things for other releases is exactly the source of your problems.... |
| 10:46.29 | SynrGy | QuestPC: this sounds worse and worse. |
| 10:46.33 | themill | formorer: that's not the problem here. |
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| 10:47.03 | themill | QuestPC: can you remove all those entries for jessie from your sources.list and then run "apt-get update" for me? then pastebin the output of: aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))' |
| 10:47.24 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Trying Ubuntu debs on Debian .... worst choice. |
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| 10:47.40 | QuestPC | PunIntended: http://paste.debian.net/112356/ |
| 10:47.57 | QuestPC | themill: I'll try, wait a minute. |
| 10:48.20 | SynrGy | QuestPC: i think you need to deliver the bad news to your employer that the system needs reinstallation. even if you *could* downgrade it, package by package, the system would forever have a shadow of doubt over its stability due to: |
| 10:48.25 | SynrGy | !downgrade |
| 10:48.25 | dpkg | Downgrading is not, nor will ever be supported by apt. Programs change their data in a way that can't be rolled back, and package maintainer scripts support upgrades to new config file formats but not downgrades. Try: "dpkg -i olderversion.deb" or "aptitude install package=version" using "apt-cache policy package" to get the old version number. See also <partial downgrade>, <unstable->testing>, <sdo>. |
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| 10:49.00 | SynrGy | QuestPC: but yes, themill's suggestion may get you back up and running for now ... |
| 10:49.18 | themill | well, it will tell us how messy it is |
| 10:49.20 | SynrGy | QuestPC: still. if it were me, i'd talk to my employer about scheduling downtime for a complete clean reinstall. |
| 10:50.05 | PunIntended | themill: He needs to use --force because he installed a newer glibc and coreutils. |
| 10:50.12 | themill | PunIntended: no. |
| 10:50.17 | SynrGy | good lord |
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| 10:50.48 | scotty12 | Why does "apt-get install gpa" not work? I can't get GPA to work I' |
| 10:50.51 | scotty12 | http://i.imgur.com/Qz6oRgW.png |
| 10:50.52 | scotty12 | I |
| 10:50.54 | level7 | hi again. Any hint on how to "migrate" from icedove to icedove? I am not happy of the current profile settings (some dirty file) and I would love to start fromt he scratch and reimport emails, folders and profile... any hint ? |
| 10:50.57 | scotty12 | I have tried like everything |
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| 10:51.28 | scotty12 | I just get "GPA is rebuilding the trust database." |
| 10:51.54 | scotty12 | "The GPGME library returned an unexpected error." |
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| 10:52.31 | krejsi | is there some log I can check after an automated installation to see what happened during install? |
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| 10:53.51 | bazhang | krejsi, for debian or ubuntu |
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| 10:54.13 | krejsi | ubuntu |
| 10:54.19 | krejsi | and debian |
| 10:54.34 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Try to follow Partial downgrade Dpkg's suggestions. |
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| 10:54.39 | SynrGy | scotty12: see #634930 |
| 10:54.41 | SynrGy | ,v gpa |
| 10:54.46 | judd | Package: gpa on i386 -- squeeze: 0.9.0-1; wheezy: 0.9.0-4; sid: 0.9.4-1 |
| 10:54.46 | tralala | scotty12, start it from the command line and see if it gives any useful information there. |
| 10:55.03 | SynrGy | scotty12: please note that it has been unfixed for a *very* long time and is removed from testing |
| 10:55.12 | scotty12 | i've read all the bug reports, nothing works |
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| 10:55.26 | scotty12 | one guy reccomended installing it from a ubuntu package or somthing |
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| 10:55.34 | scotty12 | sounded like a good way to break somthing |
| 10:56.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1433] by debhelper |
| 10:56.09 | QuestPC | themill: here's the output: http://paste.debian.net/112360/ |
| 10:56.16 | ivanshmakov | TJ-: ACK, understood. |
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| 10:56.38 | PunIntended | scotty12: Don't install Ubuntu packages on Debian , it is the same as kill -11 1. |
| 10:57.01 | scotty12 | i wasnt going to, but that was the only recommendation I found for getting it to work |
| 10:57.09 | scotty12 | it runs differently in different desktop enviorments |
| 10:57.15 | scotty12 | i normally use gnome classic |
| 10:57.19 | scotty12 | i tried running it on xfce |
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| 10:57.25 | scotty12 | it poped up a different error |
| 10:57.39 | krejsi | bazhang: |
| 10:57.48 | krejsi | both |
| 10:57.50 | PunIntended | scotty12: Recompile ? |
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| 10:58.06 | scotty12 | what do you mean |
| 10:58.35 | PunIntended | scotty12: Trying to recompile gpm. |
| 10:58.51 | PunIntended | <PROTECTED> |
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| 10:59.11 | scotty12 | ive tried that |
| 10:59.18 | SynrGy | scotty12: there were other suggestions in that bug that didn't involve installing from ubuntu packages. |
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| 10:59.32 | SynrGy | scotty12: the very last update to the bug at the bottom? |
| 10:59.34 | scotty12 | which ones can i get a link please |
| 10:59.45 | SynrGy | https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=634930#183 |
| 10:59.47 | scotty12 | thx |
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| 11:00.40 | QuestPC | themill: Are you here? I provided the output of aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))' |
| 11:01.01 | babilen | QuestPC: It typilly helps to also mention the URL of your paste |
| 11:01.16 | babilen | (we don't really monitor all pastebins available on the internet in real-time) |
| 11:01.53 | SynrGy | 07:56 < QuestPC> themill: here's the output: http://paste.debian.net/112360/ |
| 11:02.12 | SynrGy | that's a metric buttload of non-wheezy stuff |
| 11:02.40 | babilen | uh oh! |
| 11:02.45 | SynrGy | looks like the purpose of this exercise was to get a whole bunch of node stuff |
| 11:02.47 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Half of packages are node.js? |
| 11:02.59 | SynrGy | yep |
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| 11:03.12 | PunIntended | QuestPC: That FrankenDebian is fixable, but I have doubts on reliability. |
| 11:03.18 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Yes that is related to node, gcc maybe too, not sure about python. |
| 11:03.20 | SynrGy | and wheezy didn't really have "production ready" mode.js imho |
| 11:03.24 | SynrGy | node.js* |
| 11:03.36 | SynrGy | it doesn't even have npm |
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| 11:03.38 | SynrGy | ,v npm |
| 11:03.40 | judd | Package: npm on i386 -- jessie: 1.4.4+ds-1; sid: 1.4.4+ds-1 |
| 11:03.43 | SynrGy | not even a backport :p |
| 11:04.00 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Yeah, ubuntu also has troubles with node.js, 12.04 has really ancient version frowned by some node.js applications. |
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| 11:04.33 | PunIntended | SynrGy: It is apparently a lazy one which didn't try a backport. |
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| 11:04.58 | QuestPC | SynrGy: There should be analog of "sury debs" but for debian, not ubuntu. |
| 11:05.11 | *** part/#debian Shuro__ (~anonymous@mail.larptreff.de) |
| 11:05.22 | QuestPC | SynrGy: Maybe these can be simply removed and installed via something like "sury debs" but for debian. |
| 11:05.44 | *** join/#debian dpkg (~dpkg@unaffiliated/dpkg) |
| 11:06.22 | QuestPC | SynrGy: I remember it's called adding ppa |
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| 11:07.46 | SynrGy | QuestPC: backports is the way to support it. but backports aren't always easy. |
| 11:07.48 | colo-work | how can ordinary (non-dd) users encourage including a certain package in wheezy-backports? |
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| 11:08.09 | SynrGy | read the instructions for contributing at backports.debian.org |
| 11:08.16 | formorer | colo-work: ask the maintainer. |
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| 11:08.37 | formorer | the contribution document is not for users. |
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| 11:08.45 | QuestPC | SynrGy: https://chrislea.com/2013/03/15/upgrading-from-node-js-0-8-x-to-0-10-0-from-my-ppa/ |
| 11:09.16 | SynrGy | formorer: no, but it is for contibuting, non-DD maintainers. |
| 11:09.18 | QuestPC | SynrGy: I am not sure about backports but what if I just will remove all these packages and will add node 0.10 ppa? |
| 11:09.27 | SynrGy | formorer: it explicitly says "If you are not a Debian Developer, please upload your backport somewhere (binaries and sources, e.g. to mentors.debian.net), post a link to its .dsc file on debian-backports@lists.debian.org and ask for review and upload." |
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| 11:09.31 | PunIntended | QuestPC: PPAs on Debian !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!????????? |
| 11:09.46 | PunIntended | It is for Ubuntu. |
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| 11:09.56 | formorer | SynrGy: the question was: how can a user request a package for inclusion. |
| 11:09.59 | QuestPC | SynrGy: But I am affraid to force remove glibc, it must be used everywhere. |
| 11:10.09 | formorer | SynrGy: this question isn't answered by the contribution document. |
| 11:10.13 | SynrGy | PunIntended: before issuing knee-jerk responses, please put some extra effort into reading, and respond politely and professionally |
| 11:10.15 | QuestPC | PunIntended: Aren't ubuntu just debian with nautilus, no? |
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| 11:10.45 | QuestPC | PunIntended: Sorry I work with Ubuntu, it really wasn't me installing Debian there. |
| 11:11.01 | SynrGy | there has been serious discussion in the past about something "ppa-like" for debian. search the debian-devel mailing list archives. |
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| 11:11.11 | SynrGy | further discussion here about it, however, is off-topic. |
| 11:11.25 | SynrGy | can we get back to solving the problem at hand? |
| 11:11.47 | SynrGy | QuestPC: you want a supported platform on which recent node.js (and possibly other stuff) can be run. apparently debian wheezy isn't it. |
| 11:11.57 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Ubuntu is a derivated distribution of Debian created by Canoncial ltd . It can't use the same packages. |
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| 11:12.30 | SynrGy | QuestPC: while an upgrade to jessie would probably put the system back in a working state, it is not a recommended configuration due to inadequate security support. |
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| 11:13.23 | SynrGy | QuestPC: your options, then, are to do this risky move to jessie (but make sure your employer understands the risks), or fall back to wheezy and compile everything node.js-related from source yourself, or fall back to wheezy and try to backport all the node.js packages ... |
| 11:13.29 | QuestPC | PunIntended: I see. Too bad there is not 14.04lts at that server :( Look how that's easy: http://tecadmin.net/install-latest-nodejs-npm-on-ubuntu/ |
| 11:13.51 | SynrGy | or give up. use a mainstream linux distro with support for the versions of things you need. |
| 11:14.09 | sine0 | when doing a net install will i get options to choose between the versions of debian |
| 11:14.11 | SynrGy | however, helping you select one of those is also off-topic for here. |
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| 11:14.52 | tralala | sine0, no |
| 11:14.55 | SynrGy | and now, i'm sorry, but i have to get to work. later, folks. |
| 11:15.01 | QuestPC | SynrGy: There will be 14.04lts if I'll persuade manager to reinstall. jessie is a bit too new php 5.6 is not even an release. |
| 11:15.14 | SynrGy | yep |
| 11:15.16 | tralala | sine0, you will get to choose the packages to install |
| 11:15.18 | QuestPC | SynrGy: one minute, will jessie become stable or it will move to php 5.7? |
| 11:15.37 | QuestPC | SynrGy: will it allways be very unstable or its a future lts? |
| 11:15.45 | SynrGy | QuestPC: jessie will become stable. it is likely that before it does, upstream php 5.6 will become stable |
| 11:15.47 | some-cowbell | jessie can change before release |
| 11:15.49 | SynrGy | ,v php5 |
| 11:15.49 | judd | Package: php5 on i386 -- squeeze: 5.3.3-7+squeeze17; squeeze-security: 5.3.3-7+squeeze17; squeeze: 5.3.3-7+squeeze19; squeeze-security: 5.3.3-7+squeeze19; squeeze-security-lts: 5.3.3-7+squeeze21; wheezy: 5.4.4-14+deb7u11; wheezy-proposed-updates: 5.4.4-14+deb7u12; wheezy-security: 5.4.4-14+deb7u12; jessie: 5.6.0~rc2+dfsg-5; sid: 5.6.0~rc2+dfsg-5 |
| 11:15.56 | sine0 | tralala: are there different versions of debian like ubuntu has codenames. such as a stable version and old version and a unsafe/untested |
| 11:16.00 | SynrGy | since it is at "rc2" |
| 11:16.03 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1439] by debhelper |
| 11:16.29 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Ir |
| 11:16.30 | PunIntended | *it will become stable and release. |
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| 11:16.54 | QuestPC | PunIntended: What commands should I issue to fully upgrade from wheezy to jessie? |
| 11:17.19 | tralala | sine0, there are, but the only one that normal users are expected to use is the current stable version. Debian's versioning is different than Ubuntu's. |
| 11:17.22 | SynrGy | and now i'm out. good luck |
| 11:17.39 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Did you talk with your employer before, about the risks ? |
| 11:17.43 | QuestPC | SynrGy: thank you a lot |
| 11:17.48 | SynrGy | you're welcome |
| 11:18.47 | QuestPC | PunIntended: yes I really do not like php 5.6. Back about 5 years ago when working with redhat I used to compile and install php from source. is there something else so much horrible and unstable in jessie? |
| 11:18.51 | sine0 | ok tralala i get the whole stable thing. it seems like a real good idea for server use etc. im going to be using it on my laptop, i will be able to install the latest version of software myself right ? say one or two softwares that are important to me |
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| 11:19.51 | QuestPC | PunIntended: I am thinking about upgrading to jessie, removing php and compiling it from source. |
| 11:19.59 | PunIntended | The nearest thing to a FrankenDebian that I've created is a 32-bit Jessie part and a 64-bit Wheezy part. |
| 11:20.17 | sine0 | im sort of repeating myselt but im going to install debian today. i stripped and backup my windows install last night but was too tired to go tyhrough with it all |
| 11:20.53 | QuestPC | sine0: Ubuntu seems to be easier. However hard ways maybe better to learn more. |
| 11:21.42 | kingkong|here | how do you make motd message with info as cpu/ram usage users colored info etc? |
| 11:21.55 | PunIntended | QuestPC: Replace every wheezy or stable word to Jessie in your source.list then pastebin it. |
| 11:22.23 | sine0 | QuestPC: im not totally new. ive run linux before i like the command line side of things really, not so much the desktop |
| 11:22.31 | QuestPC | PunIntended: 1 min |
| 11:22.46 | sine0 | ive ran gentoo and gentoox on my xbox and ubuntu on my desktop. i have raspbian on my pi atm |
| 11:22.58 | sine0 | so im hoping that i will be ok |
| 11:23.08 | SynrGy | PunIntended: before i completely vanish, QuestPC's pin priorities are screwed too and should be fixed. |
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| 11:23.21 | SynrGy | PunIntended: otherwise it may not upgrade properly |
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| 11:24.27 | PunIntended | SynrGy: You mean it should also update /etc/apt/preferences ? |
| 11:24.56 | QuestPC | PunIntended: http://paste.debian.net/112373/ |
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| 11:25.55 | SynrGy | yes, probably just removing everything |
| 11:26.12 | SynrGy | also check /etc/apt/preferences.d/ |
| 11:26.25 | QuestPC | sine0: I think Ubuntu may support wider range of laptops hardware but I might be wrong. I am not a pro, just ordinary user and web programmer. |
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| 11:27.10 | sine0 | QuestPC: okwell any problems ill put ubuntu on |
| 11:27.15 | BradND | man ansible is a real lifesaver |
| 11:27.18 | BradND | <3 |
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| 11:28.06 | QuestPC | sine0: But that jessie is so much new so it should be almost at edge of linux development, similar to self-compiled systems, Do not know whether it is good for laptop. |
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| 11:29.42 | QuestPC | PunIntended: '/etc/apt/preferences.d/' is empty here |
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| 11:30.37 | BradND | http://i.gyazo.com/b1ae211e949055e6f6dce714dd4ee20a.png the effect of a rootkit \0/ |
| 11:31.31 | heudebeu | I'm currently running Debian Wheezy on a laptop, it runs fine :) |
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| 11:32.22 | QuestPC | PunIntended: On the second thought, its probably better to downgrade to wheezy then compile node.js |
| 11:32.46 | tralala | sine0, install Debian stable and see if you can live with it. I'm using it on my laptops and desktops. There's some limited amount of newer software in backports. |
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| 11:47.52 | petern_ | Hmm, just installed Wheezy on a Dell R210 with UEFI. Finishes install, and on boot it says... "Boot Failed: debian" |
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| 11:48.49 | tralala | dpkg, uefi |
| 11:48.52 | dpkg | Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" supports installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is currently not supported. See also <errata>. http://www.uefi.org/ |
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| 11:53.27 | tralala | petern_, do you have secure boot enabled? |
| 11:53.37 | petern_ | No |
| 11:54.29 | ivanshmakov | (PunIntended: I thought it was running Systemd that’s the same as # kill -11 1.) |
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| 11:55.27 | tralala | petern_, I assume that's UEFI boot, before it reaches grub, right? |
| 11:55.43 | petern_ | Yes, that's right. Nothing of grub appears on screen. |
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| 11:57.50 | tralala | petern_, maybe try this: https://wiki.debian.org/GrubEFIReinstall |
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| 12:03.21 | blackjack | guys, how do i restart oidentd service? |
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| 12:04.06 | heurist | blackjack: /etc/init.d/oidentd restart |
| 12:05.52 | blackjack | i did "service oidentd -restart" |
| 12:05.58 | blackjack | is that also same result? |
| 12:06.01 | *** part/#debian anikras (~anikras@90.193.9.232) |
| 12:06.18 | heurist | blackjack: that works on many sysmte too, but not -restart, just restart |
| 12:06.20 | tralala | it is, assuming it's "restart" and not "-restart" |
| 12:06.23 | babilen | blackjack: That would be "service oidentd restart" not "service oidentd -restart" |
| 12:06.34 | PunIntended | dpkg: tell QuestPC -about partial downgrade |
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| 12:06.39 | blackjack | ok sorry |
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| 12:16.20 | halma | hey all |
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| 12:17.37 | halma | what is the earliest "shutdown/reboot" runlevel ? |
| 12:18.06 | halma | cause id like to run a script before the sytem is going to reboot or shutdown |
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| 12:18.22 | tralala | halma, doesn't man init mention it? |
| 12:18.32 | halma | yes an init script at shutdown |
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| 12:18.54 | tralala | yes, I get that |
| 12:18.54 | halma | but it needs to start at first before all other shutdown/reboots script are excuted |
| 12:19.12 | halma | runlevel 2-5 ? |
| 12:19.33 | tralala | man init, check for explanation of runlevels |
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| 12:19.53 | tralala | if I'm not mistaken it's rcS |
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| 12:20.09 | halma | rcS is for start i thnk |
| 12:20.21 | halma | but i need reboot and shutdown |
| 12:20.33 | halma | rc0.d i think is what i need |
| 12:20.50 | tralala | did you check the fine manual yet? |
| 12:21.08 | halma | i am reading also ... |
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| 12:24.05 | babilen | dpkg: tell halma about init scripts |
| 12:24.08 | babilen | dpkg: tell halma about init script |
| 12:24.24 | halma | Runlevel 0 is used to halt the system; runlevel 6 is used to reboot the system |
| 12:24.26 | babilen | dpkg: tell halma about missing lsb tags |
| 12:24.54 | babilen | halma: You essentially have to write an init script that defines suitable LSB headers so that it is ordered before other services. |
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| 12:25.12 | halma | i did with level 0 1 6 |
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| 12:25.25 | halma | and also update-rc.d myscript defaults |
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| 12:26.10 | halma | but it seems the kill -HUP doesnt work properly cause if i do kill -HUP PID its fine but not if i excute this with at reboot |
| 12:26.16 | halma | with init.d/script |
| 12:27.11 | halma | rc0.d/K01 is excuted before all others ? |
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| 12:33.25 | halma | "update-rc.d foobar start 01 S . stop 01 0 6 ." does this mean it will be executed as first ? |
| 12:33.45 | halma | sequene number 01 is the first right ? |
| 12:33.57 | halma | *sequence |
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| 12:35.46 | halma | sequence number will be executed from the lowest Number or Highest Number ? of an init script ? |
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| 12:38.09 | bsdator | now that grub menu was overwritten,i can't log in debian.how to fix that? |
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| 12:38.47 | Stummi | what do you mean with grub menu overwritten? |
| 12:39.00 | PunIntended | dpkg: tell bsdator -about recovery |
| 12:39.06 | Stummi | you can load the kernel and initrd with the grub cli as well. Or use a live system to fix your grub |
| 12:39.16 | bsdator | Stummi: it's just not there.no entries shown |
| 12:39.40 | Stummi | what do you see instead of grub? |
| 12:39.45 | PunIntended | bsdator: Solution sent. |
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| 12:42.52 | petern_ | tralala, oh... found the issue. The installer has decided the USB stick I had plugged in to load firmware from is the EFI boot partition... |
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| 12:45.22 | tralala | petern_, so it's all good now? |
| 12:45.33 | petern_ | Well, no, but I know what it's doing. |
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| 12:47.33 | ntz | hello |
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| 12:47.51 | ntz | can anybody tell me why this "super-dooper-stable" debian does this: |
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| 12:47.56 | ntz | # snmpstatus -c public -v2c 10.34.100.12 |
| 12:47.56 | ntz | [UDP: [10.34.100.12]:161->[0.0.0.0]]=>[] Up: 0:00:00.00 |
| 12:47.57 | ntz | Segmentation fault |
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| 12:49.32 | ntz | ^^ omg, how can be this ka-boom debian so retarded ? I'd never use it if it up to me but bunch of complete morons wants here debian molesting my solaris servers over snmp but surprisingly debian's snmp* stuff segfaults |
| 12:49.51 | tralala | what's in /etc/debian_version? |
| 12:49.54 | ntz | is it please some known issue ? my problem is that stupid debian admins can't resolve it at their own |
| 12:49.59 | ntz | tralala: 6 .. |
| 12:50.32 | ntz | tralala: 6.0.9 accordingly to etc/debian_release |
| 12:50.40 | ntz | should be up to date |
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| 12:51.30 | petern_ | It's not. |
| 12:51.46 | petern_ | 6.0.10 is the last version of Squeeze. |
| 12:51.52 | tralala | 6 is old stable, but still supported. |
| 12:51.54 | petern_ | But 7.6 is the current version of Debian Stable |
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| 12:52.21 | *** join/#debian Almtesh (~Almtesh@unaffiliated/almtesh) |
| 12:52.25 | Almtesh | Hi! |
| 12:52.37 | themill | fsvo "supported". |
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| 12:52.47 | Almtesh | I'm looking for a way to bridge a wifi interface on debian wheezy. |
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| 12:53.30 | PunIntended | Almtesh: For what application ? |
| 12:53.39 | Almtesh | Bridge. |
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| 12:54.01 | tralala | ntz, check the bts, perhaps it's a known problem |
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| 12:54.14 | mad_moses | Hi, I installed on my vserver running debian vnc4server and I installed firefox. If i lunch firefox, i got this error http://pastebin.com/cymAbhdL . Is my dbus brokoen? |
| 12:54.16 | Almtesh | PunIntended, the wifi interface is not a AP. |
| 12:54.46 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Bridge for a VM ? Or for sharing Internet via Ethernet ? |
| 12:54.58 | Almtesh | PunIntended, I manage wireless connexion with wpa_supplicant. |
| 12:55.14 | Almtesh | Bridge for VM. |
| 12:55.26 | tralala | what VM? |
| 12:55.34 | Almtesh | tralala, this one. |
| 12:55.43 | Almtesh | showing the VM. |
| 12:55.54 | tralala | I mean the software |
| 12:56.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1458] by debhelper |
| 12:56.16 | Almtesh | tralala, I don't know, what do you mean? |
| 12:56.19 | PunIntended | Almtesh: What hypervisor ? Xen, KVM , VMware, VirtualBox ? |
| 12:56.25 | tralala | qemu and VirtualBox don't need bridging |
| 12:56.31 | Almtesh | PunIntended, it's for KVM. |
| 12:56.43 | Almtesh | tralala, really? |
| 12:57.08 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Qemu has NAT support. |
| 12:57.10 | joinmetaleerpedo | sup Metaleer |
| 12:57.19 | doebi | qmlscene: could not exec '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qt4/bin/qmlscene': No such file or directory |
| 12:57.23 | Almtesh | PunIntended, I know, and I know how to use it. |
| 12:57.29 | doebi | just installed qt5 + qmlscene and this is all i got |
| 12:57.34 | Metaleer | !ops joinmetaleerpedo |
| 12:57.34 | dpkg | Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly: metaleer complains about: joinmetaleerpedo |
| 12:57.44 | *** mode/#debian [+o babilen] by ChanServ |
| 12:57.45 | *** mode/#debian [+b *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip.125.212.209.61] by babilen |
| 12:57.45 | *** kick/#debian [joinmetaleerpedo!~babilen@unaffiliated/babilen] by babilen (you should know better) |
| 12:57.45 | *** mode/#debian [-o babilen] by babilen |
| 12:57.50 | tralala | Almtesh, so why bridging then? |
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| 12:58.23 | Almtesh | tralala, because I don't use NAT. |
| 12:58.54 | tralala | do you have a server running in the VM? |
| 12:59.05 | PunIntended | Almtesh: do a man qemu, bridge to wlan0. |
| 12:59.13 | Almtesh | tralala, I don't know yet, but it could nearly. |
| 12:59.22 | Almtesh | tralala, why? |
| 12:59.22 | dvs_ | found another way to leave a channel |
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| 12:59.42 | PunIntended | dvs_: What is that way? |
| 12:59.44 | Almtesh | PunIntended, a what? |
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| 13:00.13 | dvs_ | PunIntended: Call the operators on himself. ;-P |
| 13:00.22 | tralala | Almtesh, man qemu. A command that will give you the manual. |
| 13:00.31 | Almtesh | dvs_, of course, it's abvious. |
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| 13:00.44 | Almtesh | dvs_, but you will pearhaps be banned. |
| 13:00.50 | petern_ | tralala, I need to reinstall, paying attention to where the EFI partition is... oh well :-) |
| 13:00.52 | tralala | dvs_, that won't work unless you're trolling. |
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| 13:00.59 | Almtesh | tralala, yes, I open it. |
| 13:00.59 | dvs_ | Almtesh: details, details... |
| 13:01.21 | tralala | petern_, really?! I would expect that this is something fixable. |
| 13:01.47 | Almtesh | PunIntended, tralala, and then? |
| 13:02.09 | PunIntended | Almtesh: View the -net chapter. |
| 13:02.23 | petern_ | tralala, it is, by moving partitions, lvm and data around. |
| 13:02.33 | *** join/#debian netj (~netj@128.12.159.224) |
| 13:02.34 | petern_ | tralala, frankly on a fresh install it's easier to just reinstall properly. |
| 13:03.32 | Almtesh | PunIntended, yes, and then? |
| 13:03.50 | tralala | Almtesh, search for "bridge", see the examples |
| 13:03.58 | *** part/#debian marceloamorim (~marcelo@189-90-192-72.isimples.com.br) |
| 13:04.06 | Almtesh | PunIntended, because I want a VM-independant bridge. |
| 13:04.28 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Use one bridge per VM. Works fine. |
| 13:05.05 | Almtesh | PunIntended, I have only one wireless interface. |
| 13:06.07 | Almtesh | PunIntended, the host has an ethernet and a wireless interface, I want to bridge them and give to unknow number of VM the result. |
| 13:06.14 | Almtesh | And to the host too. |
| 13:06.30 | *** join/#debian h3ron (~h3ron@pool-71-160-93-29.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) |
| 13:06.40 | *** join/#debian chth0n (~forcefsck@193.120.208.221) |
| 13:06.49 | petern_ | You can have a bridge with no physical interface. |
| 13:06.51 | Almtesh | And I want it VM-and-hypervisor-independant. |
| 13:07.10 | Almtesh | petern_, what's the point? |
| 13:07.22 | phealy | Almtesh: the setup I use with qemu/kvm is a single bridge, consisting of eth0 and one tap interface per vm. |
| 13:07.25 | *** join/#debian BradND (~BRAD@unaffiliated/brad-2/x-3843653) |
| 13:07.25 | petern_ | Once the bridge device is set up, you can add whichever real interface to it. |
| 13:07.27 | *** join/#debian cference (~vezril@64.187.189.2) |
| 13:07.37 | PunIntended | Almtesh: virt-manager manages that in an good way. |
| 13:07.41 | phealy | so one bridge, one-to-many VMs. |
| 13:07.58 | PunIntended | ( a GUI app) |
| 13:08.06 | *** join/#debian gracee (~gracee@203.177.202.152) |
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| 13:08.14 | Almtesh | phealy, yes, I know this setup and that's exactlly what I don't want. |
| 13:08.31 | petern_ | So... what do you want again? |
| 13:08.32 | Almtesh | PunIntended, oups, no GUI on this host. |
| 13:09.08 | *** join/#debian BluesKaj (~kaj@184.75.214.138) |
| 13:09.08 | *** join/#debian BluesKaj (~kaj@unaffiliated/blueskaj) |
| 13:09.16 | Almtesh | I wanted something… |
| 13:09.21 | Almtesh | What was it? |
| 13:09.23 | *** join/#debian centrx (~centrx@pool-72-74-93-20.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
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| 13:09.35 | Almtesh | Oh, yeah, bridge a wireless interface on a bridge. |
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| 13:10.28 | Almtesh | I have a basic bridge and on it, I want to add a basic wireless interface. |
| 13:10.42 | PunIntended | Almtesh: For more than zero VMs, it may be depending of your router. |
| 13:10.55 | Almtesh | Just because I want to have a basic bridge for my basic using. |
| 13:11.01 | petern_ | I guess "brctl addif br0 wlan0" isn't what you mean? |
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| 13:11.15 | PunIntended | (If it supports multiple MACs per VM) |
| 13:11.18 | Almtesh | PunIntended, my basic router can handdle it very well. |
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| 13:11.52 | PunIntended | Almtesh: My ISP router does not handle that. |
| 13:11.58 | Almtesh | petern_, "can't add wlan0 on bridge br0: Operation not supported." |
| 13:12.16 | petern_ | Ok, then you can't do that. Not all wifi interfaces support it. |
| 13:12.27 | Almtesh | PunIntended, you're not lucky, I am, because I don't have a ISP router, but a basic one. |
| 13:12.28 | petern_ | (Or maybe none) |
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| 13:12.37 | petern_ | Or maybe the interface names I used are wrong in your setup... |
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| 13:12.59 | Almtesh | petern_, wlan0 is the wireless interface. |
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| 13:13.21 | Almtesh | petern_, and br0 is the bridge. |
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| 13:14.05 | BluesKaj | Hiyas folks |
| 13:14.17 | petern_ | Yup, then you're out of luck with bridging it. |
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| 13:15.12 | PunIntended | WiFi is not the best choice for bridges . Do you use a laptop? |
| 13:15.32 | Almtesh | PunIntended, no, it's not a laptop. |
| 13:15.55 | Almtesh | PunIntended, it's a basic computer. |
| 13:16.00 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1464] by debhelper |
| 13:17.06 | phealy | on the topic of KVM, does anyone have a recommendation for a web based management portal? I've got a headless server with some extra resources and I wanted to set up kvm, but I don't really want to use a remote X app to handle it. |
| 13:17.07 | petern_ | You can cheat and use NAT. |
| 13:17.34 | *** join/#debian cYris212 (c12f6805@gateway/web/freenode/ip.193.47.104.5) |
| 13:17.37 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Hoping that the performance will be good. |
| 13:17.41 | petern_ | Add an extra IP address to the host, and use iptables to redirect that to a guest. |
| 13:17.48 | PunIntended | ( machine context change latency) |
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| 13:18.02 | cYris212 | Does the Debian Installer use LUKS to encrypt the partition? |
| 13:18.07 | phealy | a lot of the tools I've seen are bare-metal images, not something that would sit on top of a stable box. |
| 13:18.20 | Almtesh | petern_, why would I keep it simple if I can make it complicated? |
| 13:18.26 | tralala | phealy, use ssh |
| 13:18.39 | petern_ | Almtesh, because bridging doesn't work for you. |
| 13:18.40 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Does that PC have AMD-V or Intel Vanderpool ? |
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| 13:19.07 | phealy | tralala: I have been using ssh+vnc for consoles, but I'd like to let a few less technical people use this as well, and a web interface would be handy for that. |
| 13:19.10 | petern_ | If it didn't, kvm wouldn't work. |
| 13:19.26 | Almtesh | PunIntended, my basic PC has a basic virtualisation extension on its basic processor. |
| 13:19.48 | Almtesh | That's why KVM works, but it's a little offtopic. |
| 13:20.11 | PunIntended | Almtesh: Did the solution work ? |
| 13:21.19 | Almtesh | PunIntended, the linux bridge, no ; the qemu bridge, no ; the NAT, I don't want it ; the multiple IPs, I would make it, but through a bridge. |
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| 13:21.28 | tralala | phealy, what are the less technical people going to use exactly? |
| 13:22.29 | Almtesh | phealy, a home-made script with a huge shortcut on the desktop should be the best solution. |
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| 13:23.25 | PunIntended | <PROTECTED> |
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| 13:23.40 | petern_ | tralala, I'm so glad I chose to use a proxy for installation... much quicker second time :D |
| 13:23.49 | MY123 | Crap IRC client. |
| 13:24.48 | phealy | tralala: very basic - power on, power off, kvm, maybe deploy a few new images and install an OS from an ISO |
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| 13:26.17 | MY123 | phealy: The only tool that I know that conforms to your requirement is a GUI tool : virt-manager. |
| 13:26.22 | tralala | petern_, and it even boots this time? |
| 13:26.47 | petern_ | Trying. These things take ages to get through the millions of BIOS screens... and no, it doesn't. |
| 13:26.51 | petern_ | Le sigh. |
| 13:27.14 | *** join/#debian Ninetoe (~Ninetoe@80.197.202.84.customer.cdi.no) |
| 13:27.24 | MY123 | ( the libvirt console can also do that , but doesn't know how to use it) |
| 13:27.25 | jordanm | MY123: virsh, the cli version of virt-manager, offers all the virt-manager functionality and more |
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| 13:27.30 | Ninetoe | anyone know what apt-get package contains the copy command ? |
| 13:27.52 | jordanm | ,file bin/cp |
| 13:27.58 | judd | Search for bin/cp in wheezy/i386: coreutils: bin/cp |
| 13:28.16 | Ninetoe | ty |
| 13:28.20 | coffeeplz | dpkg -S |
| 13:28.20 | dpkg | coffeeplz: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox? |
| 13:28.28 | petern_ | Still needs the USB stick in... :S |
| 13:29.31 | *** join/#debian chth0n (~forcefsck@193.120.208.221) |
| 13:29.53 | Almtesh | OK. |
| 13:29.57 | petern_ | New efi partition is... empty o_O |
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| 13:32.22 | MY123 | petern_: UEFI is a pain. Even with Microdollar. |
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| 13:32.38 | petern_ | If this doesn't work, I'm giving up and switching to BIOS :p |
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| 13:34.49 | MY123 | petern_: The only system that I know which works is Ubuntu's "Secure Boot compatible" ISO. |
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| 13:36.11 | BluesKaj | petern_, switch to legacy mode in uefi/bios |
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| 13:37.18 | etheraap | Hi folks, i'm thinking about building a redundant openvpn setup on debian, simular to the following example; http://www.linuxjournal.com/files/linuxjournal.com/linuxjournal/articles/099/9915/9915f1.jpg |
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| 13:37.35 | etheraap | does anyone have advice or best practices etc? |
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| 13:38.26 | etheraap | most solutions i found include dynamic routing, i think that overcomplicates things |
| 13:38.56 | MY123 | etheraap: For try ,it is better to do and test it with VMs. |
| 13:39.01 | MY123 | ( on one PC) |
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| 13:39.32 | etheraap | MY123: agree that's what i'm about to do |
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| 13:39.40 | petern_ | Holy moly, it's booting by itself ... Although there's mention of an efidisk error. |
| 13:40.20 | etheraap | but i'd like to know if people here did it before and possibly can share some of their wisdom :) |
| 13:40.33 | Brigo | etheraap, host5 from datacenber b directly connected to datacenter a ?? |
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| 13:41.19 | etheraap | Brigo: it's easy to setup two vpn servers in different LAN's and simulate a multi location scenario |
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| 13:41.47 | etheraap | i'm doing with with kvm |
| 13:41.52 | Brigo | the blue lines are vpns? |
| 13:42.26 | etheraap | Brigo: yes |
| 13:42.42 | Brigo | ah, ok. And the green one? |
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| 13:42.52 | etheraap | and the green ones, are the vpn servers and management network / connection |
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| 13:44.07 | ntz | can any responsible adult help me with debian with snmp ? |
| 13:44.18 | mtn | they all left |
| 13:44.18 | Brigo | and the green line only connects the hosts, do not forward traffic? |
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| 13:44.53 | MY123 | ntz: For setting upa |
| 13:45.00 | level7 | hi all... not sure if it's due to profile import.. my iceweasel has no "back/forward" button. I mean how do I go back of one webpage? |
| 13:45.04 | MY123 | *a router |
| 13:45.05 | Brigo | ntz, i hade never seen a responsible adult here. |
| 13:45.23 | etheraap | they should forward traffic, because hosts connected to vpnA should be able to connect to hosts from vpnB |
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| 13:45.35 | ntz | it just doesn't work here .. snmpwalk even segfaults in debian .. OMG, I'd never never use debian and debian knows it (that I'm using centos when I need some linux for free) and now debian molests me ultimately |
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| 13:45.51 | mtn | level7: rename your .mozilla folder and see how it looks after you do that |
| 13:45.56 | level7 | it should be on the left of the url, but there is nothing there.. just the url till the window border |
| 13:46.09 | level7 | ok... I will try to get with another profile and see what happens |
| 13:46.18 | heurist | level7: try right-click |
| 13:46.25 | etheraap | Brigo: when ne of the vpn servers dies, the clients should connect to the other vpn server |
| 13:46.43 | etheraap | and that part is easy, with multiple connection sections on the clientside |
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| 13:54.57 | Brigo | etheraap, did you think in bonding? |
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| 13:56.20 | etheraap | Brigo: why bonding? Thats for combining NICs, it is also some sort of redundancy indeed |
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| 13:56.40 | mtn | ntz: which version of debian and which version of snmpwalk? |
| 13:56.57 | etheraap | but if one vpn server goes down, the other should take over |
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| 13:57.04 | Brigo | and wasn't our talking about redundancy? |
| 13:57.51 | Brigo | etheraap, then you should have all computers coonected to both server, the graphick do not show that. |
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| 13:59.09 | Brigo | the other approach is using heartbeat. |
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| 14:00.12 | etheraap | Brigo: the clients can define two servers, if one is down they connect to the second |
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| 14:00.51 | Brigo | etheraap, that is exactly wich bonding can do for your clients. |
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| 14:02.00 | sine0 | should i have the whole of my harddrive for debian or should i give it say 5 gb and then do another partition for the storage |
| 14:02.06 | Brigo | s/witch/that/ i think. Sorry for my bad english. |
| 14:02.28 | etheraap | Brigo: sounds interesting, but i don't completely understand the connection between vpn and bonding |
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| 14:03.06 | etheraap | the point is that if the server goes completely down, my clients won't be disconnected |
| 14:03.20 | etheraap | a small hickup is acceptable though |
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| 14:03.38 | Brigo | you can create a bonding interface with the two vpns, the master and the fallback. Bonding inteface will automaticaly change the vpn when the master vpn go down |
| 14:03.46 | *** join/#debian nullvibe (~nv@gateway/tor-sasl/nullvibe) |
| 14:04.20 | etheraap | ah you mean bonding multiple tunnel interfaces |
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| 14:04.39 | etheraap | i didn't think about that yet :) |
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| 14:06.43 | Brigo | etheraap, are there another way? |
| 14:06.57 | Zzeiss | quick check: to upgrade from Wheezy to Testing: Edit /etc/apt/sources.list to change "Wheezy" to "testing"; then "apt-get update", "apt-get upgrade". Correct? |
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| 14:07.39 | etheraap | i thought about giving both vpn servers a client from the other server, from there it's just routing it in a smart way |
| 14:07.41 | babilen | Zzeiss: I'd configure a testing/unstable mix and you definitely want a dist-upgrade too, but more or less, yeah |
| 14:07.45 | etheraap | but maybe that's dirtyy |
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| 14:07.47 | babilen | dpkg: tell Zzeiss -about tum |
| 14:07.47 | formorer | Zzeiss: if you have to ask. don't do it. |
| 14:08.14 | babilen | Zzeiss: I would also like to warn you that you will have to deal with a *lot* more complex problems every now and then if you track testing. |
| 14:08.20 | babilen | dpkg: tell Zzeiss -about sid faq |
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| 14:09.37 | Zzeiss | Hmmm... maybe unstable will be a better choice. Problem is that I need OpenGL 3+ for work, and Wheezy is only 2.x |
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| 14:15.19 | Zzeiss | Yeah. jessie looks like the right thing to do. |
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| 14:17.42 | sine0 | when installing from the dvd it wont fill my computer full will it? i just want the basics and then install myself which X etc |
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| 14:17.47 | Brigo | sine0, you will be asked about what to install. |
| 14:17.51 | DammitJim | sine0, you'll be fine... Debian is very basic |
| 14:18.04 | DammitJim | if you don't select to install a bunch of stuff |
| 14:18.05 | sine0 | brilliant |
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| 14:18.31 | sine0 | i liked it with gentoo when i did it from source ball |
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| 14:19.59 | babilen | sine0: The DVDs (the entire collection) contain *all* packages in Debian. If you have a working internet connection you really don't need anything but the netinstall (or CD1 if you don't want to download during the install) -- The installer is the same on all images, some of them contain just more packages (that you don't have to download if you decide to install that software) |
| 14:20.09 | babilen | dpkg: tell sine0 -about netinstall |
| 14:20.17 | babilen | dpkg: tell sine0 -about firmware image |
| 14:20.22 | babilen | dpkg: tell sine0 -about various cd1 |
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| 14:20.37 | babilen | (that flood of messages should hopefully clarify that) |
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| 14:21.04 | Brigo | babilen, i hope :) |
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| 14:27.51 | Zzeiss | yeah, going for "testing". doing the --download-only right now. |
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| 14:32.26 | ntz | again .. is here responsible adult (optionally with sysadmin skill) who would be able to help me with debian 6.0.9 snmp ? everywhere else (solaris, centos, redhat, even my suse workstation) it works but not in debian .. I really don't know what else I can do with this retarded distro |
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| 14:33.39 | avshalom | ntz: wow, you know how to make friends |
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| 14:35.36 | sine0 | thanks babilen but the installer fails so i will have to reread or just go with ubuntui |
| 14:35.39 | ntz | avshalom: i'd prefer working snmp in debian rather than debian friends |
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| 14:41.43 | Aleric | Hi, how can I tell dh_auto_configure to use a different --prefix ? |
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| 14:47.05 | babilen | sine0: Fails how? |
| 14:48.08 | sine0 | black screen |
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| 14:48.31 | sine0 | im reading up about acpi=off |
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| 14:56.15 | sine0 | it doesnt give me the options to insert any command lines unless i go to grub but i thought that was the boot loader |
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| 14:58.10 | sine0 | i have nvidia laptop card :/ |
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| 14:58.29 | roboman2444 | is there any easy way i can switch between gpu drivers? |
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| 14:58.48 | abrotman | Why? |
| 14:59.01 | roboman2444 | i wish to use the nvidia binary .run, because it is fast and good for native things, but i also wish to try out the d3d9 stuff in gallium3d |
| 14:59.11 | roboman2444 | and i dont want a seperate installation |
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| 15:00.47 | heurist | roboman2444: blacklist modules and reboot? |
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| 15:01.47 | roboman2444 | hm |
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| 15:02.56 | cyrus_ | hi there, would be possible to downgrade xorg to a specific version so to return compatible with ATI proprietary drivers? (jessie here) |
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| 15:03.27 | cyrus_ | i've googled a bit bout one thing is to downgrade a single pkg anf one thing is to do it with the whole xorg |
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| 15:04.05 | heurist | cyrus_: probably best to ask the #debian-next guys on irc.oftc.net about jessie stuff |
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| 15:06.53 | abrotman | cyrus_: it's not supported, you can try anything you like |
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| 15:11.22 | cyrus_ | ... because the radeon module causes kernel panic quite often... like now |
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| 15:13.27 | anikras | hi |
| 15:13.31 | Junka | anikras: hi |
| 15:13.58 | anikras | can i add PATH with directories |
| 15:14.02 | anikras | for example |
| 15:14.08 | anikras | i have a directory scripts |
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| 15:14.33 | anikras | inside of directory scripts i have other directories |
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| 15:14.46 | anikras | network, system, ... |
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| 15:14.52 | formorer | you mean recursive? no. |
| 15:14.56 | anikras | yes |
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| 15:16.51 | anikras | can i test PATH="$PATH:/usr/local/bin:~/bin**" |
| 15:17.05 | heurist | anikras: but you can add them manually. |
| 15:17.23 | anikras | but, if i have 5 directorys |
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| 15:17.35 | anikras | i need introduce 5 declarations |
| 15:17.41 | heurist | anikras: then add 5 directories |
| 15:17.59 | anikras | oki |
| 15:18.04 | heurist | dpkg: tell anikras about enter |
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| 15:19.27 | heurist | anikras: this is not dos, you do not need to worry about the size of environment variables, make it as long as you need. but you may want to reorganize that scripts folder. maybe look into symlinks. |
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| 15:20.36 | anikras | yes, sylinks |
| 15:20.41 | anikras | symlinks |
| 15:20.51 | anikras | it's a possible solution |
| 15:21.17 | gjvc | anikras, you probably want multiple lines PATH=${PATH}:/where/ever/1, PATH=${PATH}:/where/ever/2 etc because then you can comment them out easily. files like that are also easier to diff in git etc |
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| 15:22.04 | anikras | exactly |
| 15:22.11 | anikras | for my git |
| 15:22.25 | Junka | in a minimal installation what does "install xfce" install really |
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| 15:22.30 | gjvc | really, the main measure of all of this is how quickly you can get set up on a machine from scratch. anything else veers towards hubris. |
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| 15:24.15 | Rug | Howdy all. |
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| 15:24.55 | terr1_ | Can anyone recommend any debian project to start work on for newbies? If there is such a thing :) |
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| 15:25.38 | zzing | I have debian-stable setup on a server and I wanted to look into setting up a virtual machine so I could experiment with setting up a servlet container. What would be good options for setting up a virtual machine with a minimum of fuss? |
| 15:25.49 | Rug | In the debian version of Bind9, there is an '@' infront of some of the entries. Could anybody explain that to me? What does it mean? Why do some records have it and others dont? |
| 15:26.04 | Rug | i.e. @ IN NS sid.example.com. |
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| 15:26.52 | abrotman | terr1_: debian.org/intro/help |
| 15:27.00 | terr1_ | abrotman: Thank you |
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| 15:27.21 | zzing | Rug, http://www.bind9.net/arm910.pdf section 6.3.5.1 |
| 15:27.35 | Rug | zzing: thanks |
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| 15:29.47 | heurist | zzing: kvm would need the least software, if that is what you mean by "fuss" libvirt, virt-manager. and virsh are fontends for it if you want an easier initial configuration. |
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| 15:30.29 | zzing | I noticed the wiki page on that, it looked good. Do you know the status of lxc? I just noticed it is at 1.0 upstream. |
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| 15:31.20 | anikras | when i have echo$PATH i can't look my directory |
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| 15:31.27 | anikras | for example: |
| 15:31.31 | heurist | zzing: there are two "versions" of lxc, one in the lxc package and one in libvirt, they are completely unrealted to each other, they just use the same basic underlying technology |
| 15:31.31 | anikras | export PATH="$PATH:$HOME/Programing/workspace/Bash/network" |
| 15:32.16 | heurist | zzing: lxc is not "virtualisation" it is containers, they are theoretically very nice, but still newish. |
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| 15:33.38 | zzing | heurist, do you think too newish? |
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| 15:34.53 | heurist | zzing: not sure yet, still dubious about trusting them in extreme secutity areas, but for most they are probably good enough. the tooling is still a bit wonky at times and you may need to do a bit of debugging. |
| 15:35.01 | zzing | I get the impression that some of the good stuff is on a newer kernel, but I am running 3.2 |
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| 15:35.23 | zzing | I think I will go into kvm then |
| 15:35.26 | heurist | zzing: that is debugging of the setup stuff, once set up they are "stable" enough. |
| 15:35.43 | heurist | zzing: you can get 3.14 from backports |
| 15:36.00 | zzing | I am not sure I want to change the kernel |
| 15:36.10 | zzing | Especially if I can do this with kvm without doing it |
| 15:36.15 | heurist | zzing: probably wise |
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| 15:36.42 | zzing | I made a mistake with this server before of going with testing before, so I want to be relatively conservative now — like I should have been originally. |
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| 15:37.07 | heurist | zzing: I would also not trust containers without selinux, and selinux is not up to scratch in debian. |
| 15:37.20 | heurist | zzing: backports are not testing, testing will bite you. |
| 15:37.30 | zzing | selinux is a little scary to me |
| 15:38.08 | heurist | zzing: selinux is a bit broken in debian, fear is apropriate. if you want to play with it try centos. |
| 15:38.30 | heurist | zzing: just to be clear, selinux is awesome. |
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| 15:39.54 | zzing | I understand the goals of it, but don't really have the time to learn about it (I run a relatively minor student server at a school) |
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| 15:40.54 | heurist | zzing: sure, was just clarifying my scary statements. |
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| 15:46.57 | Junka | when i install debian |
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| 15:47.37 | Junka | in the step when there is checked the desktop environment |
| 15:47.56 | heurist | dpkg: tell Junka about enter |
| 15:47.56 | Junka | and other options, there is an option of "laptop" what does it install |
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| 15:48.17 | zzing | heurist, thank you for the information |
| 15:48.20 | somiaj | Junka: these are tasksel options, you can look up the various packages each 'task' installs |
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| 15:48.47 | Junka | somiaj: how |
| 15:49.12 | somiaj | Junka: the desktop enviorment most likely installs gnome (though if you use another DE cd1 or you select another DE at the boot of the netinstall, you can install any DE you want with it). Laptop installs some laptop tools that aren't needed on tower or server sysetms. |
| 15:49.30 | somiaj | Junka: https://wiki.debian.org/tasksel |
| 15:50.23 | Junka | somiaj: thanks! |
| 15:51.40 | Junka | somiaj: so these are just tools, they are not impact the laptop's performance. Am i right? |
| 15:52.36 | somiaj | Junka: look at the wiki, if you want more control over what is installed on your system skip tasksel completely and just manually install only what you want. You can always install the tasks later. |
| 15:52.43 | somiaj | or just parts of them |
| 15:53.07 | somiaj | but yes they shoudlnt' effect preformancef speed, but there is a lot of acpi/power saving types and wireless tools included that aren't int he default min insgtall in the laptop task |
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| 15:54.52 | Junka | somiaj: thanks |
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| 15:56.25 | Junka | I want to install mate desktop, i can see that's in wheezy's backports. Can i setup a min installation without a de and install mate-desktop? Is it possible? |
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| 15:56.49 | heurist | Junka: that would be the advised way, yes. |
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| 15:57.16 | Junka | heurist: thanks |
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| 16:01.20 | zzing | I accidently installed linux-image-3.14-0, so I just removed it (and removed linux-image-amd64, but just readded it), and I got some warnings about /vmlinuz and initrd.img being damaged and that I might need to rerun my boot loader (output: https://gist.github.com/iaefai/8d0517675eabf8540c5b ) I want to make sure I don't screw this system up, is there a way to ensure this is in good order? |
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| 16:02.44 | heurist | zzing: if the only errors were about the symbolic links than you should be fine, unless you fiddled with the bootloader in the past. |
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| 16:03.02 | zzing | I have not, although those symlinks are not there anymore |
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| 16:03.54 | zzing | A post on stackoverflow implies those symlinks are not needed, but I could run update-grub |
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| 16:04.03 | heurist | zzing: check /boot/grub/grub.cfg (or whatever it is) for references to /vmlinuz you should not find any, so you should be fine. |
| 16:04.46 | zzing | nothing |
| 16:04.50 | zzing | So hopefully I am find |
| 16:04.53 | zzing | fine* |
| 16:05.06 | petern_ | Those symlinks are an old lilo thing I think... |
| 16:05.50 | petern_ | Don't quote me on that though :p |
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| 16:11.08 | votick | Going to try setting up debian for first time on my new desktop build. Should be fun, and it is time for a change from mint. |
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| 16:12.55 | babilen | votick: Enjoy! If you have internet access during the installation I'd recommend to use the <firmware image> for installation -- /msg dpkg firmware image -- Do you know which, if any, desktop environment you'd like to install? |
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| 16:13.34 | votick | I have not clue which one yet, as I'm still kind of new to using linux over windows; but I'll be using the pc for computer science in university. |
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| 16:14.25 | votick | babilen: Also I don't think I'll have internet access since this new build has never even run anything before. I'd like to take the easiest path to install though, and the live boot was welcoming (from usb) |
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| 16:17.31 | babilen | votick: Oh, I never use the live CDs for installation, but sure, give them a try. How come you have no internet? Do you literally don't have internet or do you simply doubt that the installer will be able to connect to it? |
| 16:18.11 | votick | Um, well from my experience I need wireless stuff and this is up in my room with no wired connection @babilen. |
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| 16:18.27 | babilen | votick: Either way, in that case you probably want to grab the CD1 image and install from there. You can also write it to an USB stick (cf. <usb install>) if you prefer to do that. |
| 16:18.40 | babilen | votick: And that new box doesn't have wireless? |
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| 16:19.19 | votick | I'm not actually sure. I have a rocket-stick or whatever they're called, that connects as a usb and gives my current desktop connection @babilen |
| 16:19.45 | votick | babilen: I'll be using a 4gig usb for the setup, however I do it. |
| 16:20.08 | babilen | votick: One more thing. It is more common to address people like "NICKNAME:" or "NICKNAME" in IRC (your client should offer tab-completion on nicknames, bab<TAB>) |
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| 16:20.45 | votick | babilen: I'm thinking of going with either KDE or Xfce as an environment. Also, I'll address you like this for now on, thanks. |
| 16:20.54 | LiENUS | i have a screen session i leave running long term at work that contains my development setup, one window is a log file viewer the default dir for screen is set to the source code folder so when i open a new window its right there |
| 16:21.13 | LiENUS | it'd be nice to be able to cd and it go back to the top level of my source instead of the home directory |
| 16:21.29 | babilen | votick: Okay, it is just that most wireless adaptors require firmware and we only make the netinstall image available with firmware. If you install from CD1 or DVD1 and don't configure networking during the installation you will have to configure that later on. You will probably also require firmware. |
| 16:21.35 | babilen | dpkg: tell votick -about install xfce |
| 16:21.36 | LiENUS | is there a way to a) tell bash that cd with no parameters go to a specified dir instead of ~ and b) have screen automagically do that? |
| 16:21.38 | babilen | dpkg: tell votick -about install kde |
| 16:21.45 | bsdator | yesterday i got a huge problem. I tried to boot and my Grub didn't show up. The only screen that showed up was a black screen with: "Couldn't find a boot partition." and a command line input "Grub rescue:". |
| 16:21.46 | bsdator | I'd be very happy to solve this problem |
| 16:22.09 | babilen | votick: Are you running Linux right now? |
| 16:22.50 | mtn | bsdator: https://wiki.debian.org/GrubRecover |
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| 16:23.29 | votick | babilen: Currently on windows but I have dual boot for linux mint. My new desktop has a 1tb hdd and 60gig ssd |
| 16:23.52 | babilen | votick: Ah, sorry .. I have to leave now. Forgive me and I hope that the information I gave you suffices. You can download firmware packages from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/firmware/wheezy/current/ -- Once you've written the image (CD1 / DVD1) to your usb stick you can create a filesystem on its second partition (e.g. "mkfs.vfat /dev/sdX2" with /dev/sdX being your usb stick and something like /dev/sdb) |
| 16:24.04 | babilen | Then mount it and unpack the firmware.tar.gz there. |
| 16:24.20 | votick | babilen: thanks for the help, I'll give it my best shot! |
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| 16:24.56 | babilen | And don't use unetbootin to write it, but win32imagewriter or cp (linux) as mentioned in <usb install> -- /msg dpkg usb install |
| 16:25.40 | votick | babilen: Alright I'll read up on this stuff. I've got the next 2 weeks to grind through all this. |
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| 16:46.36 | clandestine | hi guys |
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| 16:52.12 | generetoo | Hello, Ive heard a lot about roxterm and other terminal application, like aterm, rxvt etc. How can I know which one is a "good" one, is it just the configurability of the terminals that makes them so different? |
| 16:52.53 | videoxy | heya guys, please help if anyone has an idea - i've been messing around with plymouth scripting (so been doing alot of restarts), and after one restart gnome3 looks "zoomed" |
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| 16:53.22 | videoxy | resolution is correct, but it's like the screen is to small to cover it |
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| 16:53.53 | videoxy | i'm out of ideas :S tried to reinstall the (radeon) driver |
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| 16:54.37 | atannus | Is using Debian packages (metapackages?) a good way to setup a system? Ir regularly have to setup or maintain system config files, etc, are deb packages a good strategy or is there something more practical? |
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| 16:55.04 | lepine | Is there a channel for the debian cloud project? |
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| 16:56.16 | [TheFlash] | hi, does anyone know how long will sysvinit be available in debian? |
| 16:56.35 | sine0 | ok well wow at last i got an install but it was ubuntu and not debian. debian installer even the current jessie failed numberous times. im sure its great and will have another go in the future or on a seperate partition |
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| 16:59.51 | [TheFlash] | also, i see that boycottsystemd.org |
| 17:00.24 | [TheFlash] | is down for some reason |
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| 17:01.06 | FourOClock | I guess their server's sysvinit failed. :> |
| 17:01.08 | atannus | sine0: I just got jessie back up a couple days ago. |
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| 17:01.31 | [TheFlash] | FourOClock: sysvinit can't fail, it doesn't even do anything - which is good |
| 17:02.02 | [TheFlash] | FourOClock: i believe that users should have the option to use sysvinit |
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| 17:02.26 | [TheFlash] | and at the same time, systemd (or upstart if it's still maintained) |
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| 17:02.53 | goose | Anyone have any idea why my /home/goose/.forward isn't forwarding? |
| 17:03.10 | some-cowbell | Hi, I might try building django today under wheezy. Now, the backports have the django I want, but for python-2 and I want it for python-3. Can I get the build deps for the backported django? if so, how? |
| 17:03.32 | fireant | goose: which mta? |
| 17:04.00 | goose | fireant: sendmail iirc, let me check |
| 17:04.40 | sine0 | first of all i would get a black screen when at the install menu. then when i tried jessie i could see but it would not talk to my wifi with wpa2 even though it detected them both. its probably a bit too advanced for me to patch my way through it for now but i will return soon. |
| 17:04.45 | goose | fireant: mailx it would appear |
| 17:05.00 | jmcnaught | [TheFlash]: sysvinit will still be available in Jessie, and probably for some time after it considering Debian supports FreeBSD and HURD which don't do systemd |
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| 17:05.35 | sine0 | although i dont feel like i am hardcore any more :( |
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| 17:06.19 | some-cowbell | sine0, you could try installing just the base of jessie (with netinstall that can happen without net), then establish net, then finish the install with whatever you want |
| 17:06.29 | [TheFlash] | jmcnaught: that's good to know, i can't imagine a server running systemd |
| 17:06.52 | some-cowbell | or, if you have a wired interface and wired nic, you could use that to install |
| 17:06.57 | [TheFlash] | thanks, and bye |
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| 17:07.07 | jmcnaught | sine0: from what I understand the Jessie installer is for testing the installer. If you want to install Jessie the way to do it is install Wheezy and upgrade |
| 17:09.09 | sine0 | some-cowbell: jmcnaught the normal wheezy would not allow me GUI past the boot screen. even non gui install would hang. i have nvidia laptop card and ii heard it doesnt like them. something to do with third party support. so when i tried jessie it must be newer becauuse it allowed me past the boot menu but it would not talk via wifi with wpa2. my guess is that if jessie didnt like the wifi then wheezy wouldnt... but im just a noob |
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| 17:09.26 | fireant | goose: I'd recommend switching to postfix for security reasons, have a look at this forum http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/configuring-sendmail-for-mail-forwarding-to-server-451723/ |
| 17:09.49 | sine0 | i will free up some space for an install later and learn about grub a bit more and then try to install debiian. |
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| 17:10.06 | goose | fireant: alright. I'll check it out. thanks. |
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| 17:10.26 | some-cowbell | ok, sounds like the kernel in wheezy doesn't support your card(s) |
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| 17:11.48 | some-cowbell | there might be a solution for that involving wheezy installer images with newer kernels |
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| 17:16.21 | *** topic/#debian is openssl: /msg dpkg dsa2896 | wheezy released: /msg dpkg squeeze->wheezy | current point release: /msg dpkg 7.6 | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | /msg bots NOT people | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next (irc.oftc.net) |
| 17:16.24 | vizzy | the update migrated my system from init to systemd |
| 17:16.26 | Junkafood | what should i do? |
| 17:16.27 | vizzy | sysvinit i mean |
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| 17:16.40 | somiaj | there is a way to search you services with systemctl, but I would have to look it up |
| 17:16.42 | vizzy | so, is it safe to reboot? :D |
| 17:16.45 | sandman13 | if kdm is installed then this might work: sytemct enable kdm.service |
| 17:17.03 | sandman13 | somiaj: you mean systemctl | grep <servicename> |
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| 17:17.40 | vizzy | systemctl says: Failed to get D-Bus connection: No connection to service manager. |
| 17:17.42 | vizzy | ouch |
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| 17:18.01 | vizzy | shit, i did no backup of my sysvinit system befor e:( |
| 17:18.08 | juveniz | Hello, guys! I did a full backup using tar (tar -cpvf /bkp/full.rar --directory=/ --exclude=bkp .) The tarball is ok and contains all the files. My question is about how to restore such backup in case my debian machine breaks completely? Do I reinstall Debian and untar the pakage,ovewriting everything? |
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| 17:18.23 | some-cowbell | rartar? |
| 17:18.31 | somiaj | sandman13: I saw systemctl list-units | grep kdm (maybe systemctl does that by default, I'm still new to it) |
| 17:18.34 | UsecAgo | Hi people! perhaps a bit off topic question , anyways, I want to try to install wordpress... should i use debian repositories (3.6) or straight from wordpress site (3.9)? |
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| 17:18.53 | somiaj | vizzy: yea you might have to restart to get running on systemd for all these commands to work |
| 17:19.05 | somiaj | vizzy: have you done a full dist-upgrade and are running current jessie first? |
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| 17:19.12 | vizzy | ok, so is it safe to reboot? ill write down the command on paper before |
| 17:19.14 | some-cowbell | UsecAgo: 3.6 useful to you? |
| 17:19.24 | vizzy | somiaj, i installe dtesting, dont know what the name is |
| 17:19.36 | vizzy | its jessie i guess, current testing |
| 17:19.42 | UsecAgo | some-cowbell, is it safe enough? |
| 17:19.47 | somiaj | UsecAgo: choice is up to you, the debian version will have security patches applied to it as needed, so if 3.6 works for you, use it. If you need newer features use 3.9 but then you have to deal with security issues on your own. Either option si viable on debian. |
| 17:19.49 | vizzy | and upgraded recently via synaptic |
| 17:19.51 | some-cowbell | I have no idea :) |
| 17:19.54 | sandman13 | vizzy: how did you upgrade? |
| 17:20.00 | vizzy | but last time i stuck because of (%/(/ systemd 'upgrade' |
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| 17:20.28 | sandman13 | vizzy: do you have working internet connection on that box? |
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| 17:20.30 | vizzy | sandman13, start synaptic, update packagelist, mark updated, apply |
| 17:20.41 | sandman13 | vizzy: noooooo |
| 17:20.45 | some-cowbell | is it possible to install and use systemd under wheezy? |
| 17:20.48 | vizzy | sandman13, i'm on this box now. if reboot breaks, no more internet |
| 17:20.56 | somiaj | vizzy: how about you give us the output of 'apt-cache policy' at paste.debian.net |
| 17:21.10 | sandman13 | vizzy: and you sources.list too |
| 17:21.20 | somiaj | some-cowbell: yes, systemd was included in wheezy as a technology review, the packages are all there though they may not be as nice as the ones in jessie. I'm unsure of any issues/work required beyond just installing it. |
| 17:21.36 | somiaj | sandman13: that command should give us everything in his sources.list (and extra stuff in sources.list.d/ |
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| 17:21.51 | sandman13 | oh didn't know that somiaj |
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| 17:22.10 | somiaj | apt-cache policy -- give the current souces configured for apt on the system. |
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| 17:22.40 | some-cowbell | somiaj: from what I understand, systemd is capable of handling services that used sysvinit and haven't been updated for systemd... is that true? |
| 17:22.41 | UsecAgo | I'll take the risk... I'm not a pro anyway |
| 17:22.58 | vizzy | sandman13, http://paste.debian.net/112470/ |
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| 17:23.10 | somiaj | though sometimes apt and synamptic don't play nicely together, don't know if that will be an issue here or not |
| 17:23.21 | Junkafood | running "Startx" does not run mate, do i have to install xorg? |
| 17:23.48 | some-cowbell | UsecAgo: what are you planning to do with wordpress? (or more specifically, with the wordpress you would install on your machine)? |
| 17:24.15 | some-cowbell | run a tutorial? that should be fine |
| 17:24.20 | somiaj | Junkafood: what does running startx run? You may just have to change your $HOME/.xession to tell it to run mate |
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| 17:24.57 | Junkafood | somiaj: ~bash: startx command not found |
| 17:25.02 | vizzy | somiaj, http://paste.debian.net/112470/ |
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| 17:25.21 | somiaj | vizzy: the only issue I see is you hare mixxing third party stable repos there. Since those packages are built against stable they could be preventing some core things from upgrading (this is only a possibility). But either way I would make sure you are fully 'apt-get dist-upgrade' to jessie before rebooting. |
| 17:25.28 | jmcnaught | UsecAgo: As mentioned above the Debian wordpress package has security fixes backported to it. You could start with that one, and check the README.Debian file in /usr/share/doc/wordpress for notes on how it's set up in Debian. If it turns out you need newer features you could always try the one from the Wordpress website |
| 17:25.44 | somiaj | Junkafood: sounds like the mate packages didn't depend on the default xorg, there is a xserver-xorg-core package |
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| 17:25.48 | sandman13 | vizzy: looks okeyish except that opensusre repo |
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| 17:26.05 | somiaj | Junkafood: and the 'xinit' package contains startx (I think that is part of the core, but may not be) |
| 17:26.19 | vizzy | its just for one package, openvas, and has no dependencies afaik |
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| 17:27.08 | vizzy | hmmm, ok , lets see what apt-get dist-upgrade says |
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| 17:27.18 | sandman13 | type this in your terminal vizzy (as root): apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade |
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| 17:27.40 | vizzy | sandman13, yepp, on my way :) |
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| 17:28.34 | Resilience | hello to everyone.. in he last updating ofo debian it installs systemd, how can I revert the init system to initd? |
| 17:28.39 | sandman13 | Junkafood: installing xorg solves the problem, 77MB package I guess |
| 17:28.42 | jmcnaught | juveniz: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ch10.en.html#_backup_and_recovery has some information on choosing what to backup. You definitely don't want to untar a tarball of / from an older system over a new install. There's also a list of backup utilities you could use. I use Duply myself. |
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| 17:29.30 | Junkafood | sandman13: hmm do i need to? what if i install xinit? |
| 17:30.23 | vizzy | ok, looks fine so far, just some packages from cups should be updated it says.... but in synaptic i configured those packages to stay at a specific version, because cups-driver etc were broken a few times a drive me crazy... and i need to print in landscape etc, which was not possible with newer packages (i experienced this 6 weeks ago or so) |
| 17:30.25 | juveniz | jmcnaught: Thank you. I'll check out that documentation. |
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| 17:30.42 | somiaj | Resilience: this is just a default to automate the transition to systemd from wheezy. You will have to manually install the new sysv packages |
| 17:30.42 | jmcnaught | juveniz: also if you use any databases you should check their documentation on how to backup safely. With MySQL for example you probably want to use mysqldump to dump the database to a text file before archiving it. |
| 17:31.05 | vizzy | sandman13, , somiaj http://paste.debian.net/112473/ |
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| 17:31.14 | vizzy | i see nothing critical |
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| 17:31.18 | Resilience | somiaj, yes, but I'm asking how... |
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| 17:31.42 | somiaj | Resilience: looks like you need the package sysvinit-core -- install that package it should remove the systemd packages and get you back to sysvrc |
| 17:31.50 | vizzy | does aptitude safe-upgrade do the same? |
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| 17:32.11 | somiaj | Resilience: you can also ask #debian-next on irc.oftc.net (this is testing/unstable support) maybe people there have experience. I personally switched to systemd a bit ago on my unstable box so I could learn it. |
| 17:32.17 | Resilience | somiaj, sysvinit-core? I'm trying right now, i a few minutes I will tell you, thank you |
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| 17:32.35 | Junkafood | is there a xorg alternative? |
| 17:32.39 | somiaj | vizzy: safe-upgrade (aptitude) and upgrade (apt) actually have slight differences in what they will upgrade |
| 17:32.51 | Resilience | somiaj, some of us don't want to learn it, prefer keepign on learning the right way ;D |
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| 17:32.57 | somiaj | vizzy: but full-upgrade (aptitude) and dist-upgrade (apt-get) do the same thing (for the most part, there is still differnt logic behind it) |
| 17:33.10 | vizzy | mmmh, ok |
| 17:33.11 | zzing | If I have just added an ip address to an interface using the iproute2 method described in the wiki, is there a way I can have those changes effective without restarting and from an ssh connection? |
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| 17:33.50 | somiaj | vizzy: apt-get is a very simple what is considered safe, aptitude puts a little more 'thought' around it. I use mostly apt-get myself though. |
| 17:33.56 | vizzy | somiaj, so do you think i should dis-upgrade or safe-upgrade ? i always used synaptic, aptitude or apt-get - in this order |
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| 17:34.07 | vizzy | k |
| 17:34.29 | vizzy | so i cant see any critical packages that would be upgraded.... i guess its safe to reboot..... |
| 17:34.33 | vizzy | no risk... no fun |
| 17:34.34 | somiaj | vizzy: do a full-upgrade or a dist-upgrade from aptitude (or apt-get) make sure you have all packages upgraded to current jessie, then reboot and get running on systemd |
| 17:34.42 | vizzy | ok |
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| 17:34.55 | jmcnaught | vizzy: I'm pretty sure Synaptic uses a different mechanism for hold packages back than apt-get and aptitude. Did you hold anything else back besides cups? |
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| 17:35.10 | vizzy | nope |
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| 17:35.13 | vizzy | only cups |
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| 17:35.29 | vizzy | but i could reinstall old package if ti fails with the newer ones |
| 17:35.38 | vizzy | s/ti/it |
| 17:35.39 | somiaj | in the past synaptic didn't always play nicely with apt, not sure if that is the case, but I strongly suggest learning apt or aptitude |
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| 17:36.26 | vizzy | synaptic is easy ;) just search, click, install...... isnt it just a frontend to apt-get? aptitude? |
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| 17:36.38 | vizzy | i thought its just a gui for apt... |
| 17:36.55 | some-cowbell | is there an apt (apart from apt-get and aptitude)? |
| 17:37.16 | some-cowbell | vizzy, that's what I thought too |
| 17:37.17 | jmcnaught | some-cowbell: there is an apt command introduced in Jessie |
| 17:37.43 | somiaj | vizzy: type 'aptitude' in a terminal, there is a gui for ya. (: |
| 17:37.52 | some-cowbell | is it the one whose build was turned off in the original apt package or something else? |
| 17:37.53 | somiaj | well I guess it doens't work with a mouse |
| 17:38.01 | vizzy | oh no please not that 'gui' |
| 17:38.23 | userf | aptitude is commandline and has gui |
| 17:38.26 | vizzy | somiaj, i have no problems on console... use linux for years, but debian packagesystem is always fun |
| 17:38.43 | somiaj | some-cowbell: no, I think apt is trying to consilade all of apt-get, apt-cache, etc into a single command (and might be taking some features from aptitude). I read a blog on it a couple of months back. |
| 17:38.45 | vizzy | ok, doing dist-upgrade now |
| 17:39.05 | userf | or aptitude full-upgrade |
| 17:39.13 | some-cowbell | somiaj: hmm, ok... |
| 17:39.48 | some-cowbell | different subject, is there a doc that compares and contrasts ifconfig/route with ip? |
| 17:40.41 | jmcnaught | some-cowbell: http://www.tty1.net/blog/2010/ifconfig-ip-comparison_en.html will get you started |
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| 17:41.03 | some-cowbell | perfect :) I'll bookmark that :) |
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| 17:41.52 | vizzy | ok, rebooting, cya... hopefully ... in a few seconds.... otherwise you can imagine i'm jumping around, crying, headbanging... |
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| 17:47.48 | paul_grozav | any way to scp files while preserving permissions and owners ? |
| 17:50.33 | heurist | paul_grozav: try a tar pipe |
| 17:50.34 | jhambo | Hi all, is there any way to ask the dpkg bot questions directly from the command line instead of having to get on irc? |
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| 17:50.54 | jhambo | simple way, I should say |
| 17:51.07 | heurist | jhambo: dpkg bot *lives* on irc |
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| 17:51.34 | jmcnaught | jhambo: http://ircbots.debian.net/factoids/search.php it's on a website that you can search, might work from w3m or lynx okay |
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| 17:51.45 | vizzy | hi again |
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| 17:52.10 | vizzy | ok, now im sitting on my daigthers stable debian laptop, because systemd did break everything after upgrade testing |
| 17:52.36 | vizzy | it starts when asking for the password for crypted devices after 2 minutes |
| 17:52.42 | teraflop | just pipe anyway man scp shows a -p option paul_grozav |
| 17:52.55 | vizzy | then after a while... 5minutes or so starts some sort of rescue system, or emergency |
| 17:53.03 | vizzy | but no login, nothin wokrking |
| 17:53.25 | vizzy | 'welcome to emergency... blabla, type sysctl after logging in' ... |
| 17:53.31 | vizzy | snd >NO chance to log in |
| 17:53.45 | vizzy | after waitung 7 minutes now, no login prompt or anything similar |
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| 17:54.18 | vizzy | and when booting, uses a lot of time to send commands to disk <uuid...blablaxys |
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| 17:55.03 | jmcnaught | dpkg: tell vizzy -about enter |
| 17:55.07 | vizzy | sandman13, do you have any idea how to get back to sysvinit? |
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| 17:55.30 | sandman13 | vizzy: no |
| 17:55.55 | jhambo | heurist: jmcnaught cool thanks. |
| 17:56.18 | vizzy | jmcnaught, just try to put my words in a readable format, but thank you |
| 17:56.46 | vizzy | someday people will just communicate via pastebin links i guess ;) |
| 17:57.01 | vizzy | sandman13, can you tell me who was the other guy i was talking to>? |
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| 17:57.19 | sandman13 | vizzy: it's somiaj |
| 17:57.20 | jmcnaught | vizzy: it's easier to get help if you don't make it harder to read what you're saying :) I think you just need to install sysvinit, but if you ask on #debian-next on irc.oftc.net they probably no more |
| 17:57.31 | vizzy | sandman13, no for : no its impossible, or no for: no idea :) |
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| 17:57.42 | sandman13 | vizzy: no idea |
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| 17:57.47 | vizzy | ah ok |
| 17:58.05 | sandman13 | I have tried to move Testing 2 times but everytime I returned back to Wheezy |
| 17:58.11 | akhman | selamat malam |
| 17:58.20 | somiaj | vizzy: I'm unsure, looks like your system is encrypted and that is the issue, you'll have to manually chroot and set it up. I don't have enough experience with systemd and don't use encryption so I can be of little help. |
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| 17:58.29 | vizzy | sandman13, i use testing because stable gets outdated so fast |
| 17:59.00 | vizzy | somiaj, only /home and /mnt/ext1 is crypted, not root / |
| 17:59.24 | sandman13 | vizzy: except for a DE (MATE is expection I guess) you can get newer packages |
| 17:59.30 | sandman13 | via backports |
| 17:59.44 | vizzy | and it asks for a password, but that took 2 minutes and te screen get scrambled because systemd wants to animate things or so |
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| 17:59.58 | dalias | .... |
| 18:00.01 | somiaj | mate is in wheezy-backports I belive now |
| 18:00.06 | dalias | how is debian's systemd disaster going so far? :) |
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| 18:00.21 | teraflop | vizzy: is the systemd-sysv package installed on your system? |
| 18:00.33 | vizzy | what is a DE and what is a MATE? |
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| 18:01.05 | vizzy | teraflop, yes, with the upgrade a few minutes ago it was installed, and sysvinit-core got uninstalled |
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| 18:01.33 | vizzy | oh what a pain, i knew i should never upgrade after i mentioned systemd in the list... i'm so stupid :P |
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| 18:02.17 | teraflop | please reinstall the package and restart your session manager |
| 18:02.26 | teraflop | please reinstall the package and restart your session manager <=v |
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| 18:02.32 | vizzy | the question is how can i login , activate network, kick over systemd and get sysvinit back |
| 18:03.03 | vizzy | teraflop, reinstall what package? and what session manager? |
| 18:03.19 | vizzy | if i cant login <.9 |
| 18:03.25 | teraflop | vizzy: you cant even login into a tty? |
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| 18:04.32 | vizzy | teraflop, NO, it only says: welcome to emergency mode... after loggin in ... blablabla and NO login prompt here. i have no clue what to do now |
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| 18:04.49 | teraflop | nice ... |
| 18:04.52 | jmcnaught | vizzy: can you boot with "init=/sbin/init" as a boot parameter? |
| 18:05.05 | vizzy | without sysvinit core ? |
| 18:05.10 | vizzy | lemme try |
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| 18:05.26 | jmcnaught | vizzy: you probably do need sysvinit-core for that to work |
| 18:05.42 | vizzy | sure, but without a prompt i cant get this installed |
| 18:05.52 | vizzy | and upgrade wisely deinstalled it :P |
| 18:06.02 | jmcnaught | vizzy: in addition to #debian-next on irc.oftc.net, there's also #debian-systemd |
| 18:06.24 | *** join/#debian m3tti (~m3tti@bchm-4db66398.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 18:06.41 | Resilience | somiaj, it worked, it took away somempackags from freedesktop but doe snot matter |
| 18:06.41 | vizzy | also on oftc.net ? |
| 18:06.48 | *** join/#debian tschundeee (~tschundee@aftr-37-24-145-63.unity-media.net) |
| 18:07.04 | jmcnaught | vizzy: yeah, all the official Debian channels are on that network |
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| 18:08.45 | vizzy | init=/sbin/init still starts up and uses systemd, muahahahaha, omfg..... |
| 18:09.07 | vizzy | ok, got a brick now, a very expensive and unproductive brick.... pffff |
| 18:09.20 | *** part/#debian dlitz (~dwon@2604:5500:4:80:216:3eff:fe3c:d8bc) |
| 18:09.44 | sandman13 | vizzy: revert back to wheezy and use backports |
| 18:09.57 | vizzy | ok, will have a nice evening now creating boot usb sticks, bbooting some rescure system, chroot, .... fire up network somehow.... install sysvinit and maybe get a totally fucked up system |
| 18:10.11 | vizzy | sandman13, no, never stable debian again |
| 18:10.25 | jmcnaught | vizzy: surprise changes like this are one of the costs of using Jessie, you've got to stay on top of things. What's wrong with using Stable? |
| 18:10.31 | sandman13 | I don't know if this is correct but upgrade to testing after November |
| 18:10.33 | vizzy | that was hell last time. after a year or so everything got outdated, broken, ... even if i used backports |
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| 18:11.04 | sandman13 | or say after the freeze |
| 18:11.07 | vizzy | jmcnaught, had a lot of problems and testing was nice... until systemd came into play |
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| 18:11.29 | vizzy | however, dont lets discuss about personal preferences ;) anf flavour |
| 18:11.51 | sandman13 | btw I have read somewhere that sysvinit is perfect for server uses and systemd is perfect for rolling releases |
| 18:11.53 | marcidy | how do i find the right repositoty for a package? I can find the packages I want, I can find the package listed on packages.debian.org, but finding the right repo seems practicalyl impossible. Is there some index or lookup I am not aware of? specifically trying to find the icetea web plugin. |
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| 18:12.20 | teraflop | sandman13: why? |
| 18:12.25 | vizzy | however, systemd should not fuck up a whole system.... even if testing |
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| 18:12.58 | jmcnaught | vizzy: I also recommend giving Wheezy another try. It shouldn't break unless you're using third party repositories. The software isn't that old, there's backports for some newer stuff, and everything works a lot better. Testing breaks sometimes, it's not simply "stable but with newer packages" or it would already be released :) |
| 18:13.04 | sandman13 | vizzy: I have upgraded to Testing twice but that never happened to me |
| 18:13.29 | teraflop | vizzy: sorry but there are a lot of people running ssystemd on testing so dont blame the init system stuff |
| 18:13.51 | sandman13 | teraflop: this is the link: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-general-1/what-are-the-advantages-disadvantages-of-using-systemd-versus-sysvinit-4175422544/ |
| 18:14.04 | teraflop | oh thanks sandman13 |
| 18:14.17 | vizzy | teraflop, i have a good reason now to blame it.... and believe me, i have no special setup on my machine... only 2 crypted partitions which are not necessary for booting |
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| 18:14.45 | heurist | marcidy: post a link to the package on packages.debian.org |
| 18:14.48 | teraflop | vizzy: whatever |
| 18:15.07 | marcidy | heurist: https://packages.debian.org/source/sid/icedtea-web |
| 18:15.24 | petern_ | Welcome to testing :D |
| 18:15.25 | ivanshmakov | Is it just me, or https://bugs.debian.org/ is out of order right now? |
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| 18:15.30 | vizzy | yes, whatever, but fucked up system now. good i copied all data for work to my sd card |
| 18:15.38 | centrx | ivanshmakov, main page works |
| 18:15.41 | sandman13 | vizzy: how long have you been using Debian? |
| 18:15.43 | centrx | for me |
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| 18:15.59 | vizzy | sandman13, since 8 years now or so |
| 18:16.01 | marcidy | heurist: sorry, wrong version. This one: https://packages.debian.org/source/wheezy/icedtea-web |
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| 18:16.32 | vizzy | and i still dont know how the automagism in debian works ;) |
| 18:16.53 | heurist | marcidy: that is a good question, how DO you tell if it is main, contrib, or non-free ? |
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| 18:18.00 | jmcnaught | marcidy: icedtea-6-plugin and icedtea-7-plugin are both in main |
| 18:18.20 | bakeneko_ | apt-get purge icedtea-6-plugin |
| 18:18.21 | sandman13 | vizzy: 8 years? are you always on Testing? |
| 18:18.23 | marcidy | heurist: ok, actually i found it, it's just slightly non-intuitive for me. I went through the download links which then gets me to a page that says "please use a package manager" instead. I wasn't ignoring the download links because i didn't want to download the package from the website. |
| 18:18.30 | heurist | jmcnaught: but how do you tell, without adding them to sources? |
| 18:18.33 | teraflop | vizzy: I think this is a case of pebcak http://arch.har-ikkje.net/gfx/pebcak.jpg |
| 18:18.47 | marcidy | heurist/jmcnaught: thanks for help, here's the link i found eventually: https://packages.debian.org/wheezy/amd64/icedtea-7-plugin/download |
| 18:18.59 | ivanshmakov | centrx: What about, say, https://bugs.debian.org/737921? |
| 18:19.08 | jmcnaught | marcidy: why not use apt-get to install it? |
| 18:19.10 | sandman13 | teraflop: nice one |
| 18:19.11 | centrx | ivanshmakov, Internal Server Error |
| 18:19.24 | heurist | marcidy: why are you downloading? use apt-get or aptitude |
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| 18:19.34 | centrx | ivanshmakov, I guess it is down. Luckily I enjoy admiring the front page. |
| 18:19.52 | marcidy | jmcnaught/heurist: because i didn't have the right repo |
| 18:20.10 | jmcnaught | heurist: on packages.debian.org if it's in contrib or nonfree it will show that in the search results. marcidy was looking at a source package |
| 18:20.11 | heurist | marcidy: this is not ubintu, we only have one repo |
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| 18:20.22 | marcidy | jmcnaught/heurist: now that i do, i don't have to download it. I was ignoing the download links before, but only by following the download links does it list the right one |
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| 18:20.55 | heurist | jmcnaught: ah, so nothing means main. bit cryptic, but it will do, thanks. |
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| 18:21.18 | jmcnaught | marcidy: "apt-get install icedtea-7-plugin" and if that doesn't work put the output on http://paste.debian.net (along with your /etc/apt/sources.list) |
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| 18:22.11 | Derpadong | Question, is there a program to select your type of keyboard you are using in Openbox? |
| 18:22.25 | bluesceada | hi, since updating to systemd (or all kinds of things that happened during that upgrade), derived keys in /etc/crypttab seem to be ignored |
| 18:22.47 | vizzy | teraflop, so apt-get distupgrade is a pebcak? ouch, thats nbot |
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| 18:22.50 | vizzy | not funny! |
| 18:23.01 | valdez | ` |
| 18:23.15 | centrx | Derpadong, I can't find anything about that in Obconf. I would expect "selecting type of keyboard" would be more the domain of X itself |
| 18:23.18 | bluesceada | i have swap with password and my data with swap as the 3rd parameter with keyscript=/lib/cryptsetup/scripts/decrypt_derived as one of the options |
| 18:23.20 | jmcnaught | vizzy: do you use apt-listchances and apt-listbugs? |
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| 18:23.25 | teraflop | yeah now blame the packag manager |
| 18:23.36 | bluesceada | this worked before, but now I got asked a password two times |
| 18:23.41 | vizzy | jmcnaught, never heard of that |
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| 18:23.54 | bluesceada | luckily I still knew the password of data that was in another luks password slot |
| 18:23.55 | Junkafood | aptitude xf86-video intel is not found, why? |
| 18:24.10 | vizzy | and i read a lot about systemd before, but now it came to testing, so i give it a try... hmpf, failed! |
| 18:24.12 | bluesceada | anyone any idea why this is happening? systemd problem? |
| 18:25.05 | jmcnaught | vizzy: if you're going to use Testing you probably should use those tools, and maybe also lurk in #debian-next on oftc to keep your ear to the ground for potential problems like this |
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| 18:25.55 | bluesceada | :S |
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| 18:26.36 | unclezipper | Is there any way to trick dm-crypt into using a file rather than a block device? |
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| 18:26.42 | bluesceada | vizzy: same for me, not total fail, but not very clean |
| 18:27.02 | bluesceada | soon I have a new notebook and will try to make a new installation without systemd, hope that is possible... |
| 18:27.59 | frostschutz | unclezipper, dm-crypt? or cryptsetup? the latter automatically creates a loop device for you |
| 18:28.00 | bluesceada | unclezipper: with luks it should probably work, but no idea with dm-crypt alone |
| 18:28.31 | Junkafood | i installed xserver-xorg-video-intel but still i cant login to DE with startx |
| 18:28.32 | unclezipper | frostschutz: cryptsetup, preferably |
| 18:28.36 | jmcnaught | bluesceada: it's a lot harder to follow what you're saying when you press <enter> so much especially on a busy channel :) sysvinit will still be available in Jessie but I've heard on #debian-next on OFTC that it might not be working as well as systemd at this point in the transition. There's also a #debian-systemd on OFTC if you don't get a better answer here |
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| 18:29.04 | leeeeeroy | um, is it possible to set a box up with a static route that is to be used beyond the default gateway? |
| 18:29.06 | frostschutz | unclezipper, cryptsetup just works. at least, current versions do, not sure about "stable" ones ;). it uses loop devices under the hood though, so if it doesn't work for some reason, you'll just have to losetup yourself |
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| 18:29.29 | Haritz | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:29.30 | Haritz | :-) |
| 18:29.39 | unclezipper | frostschutz: I'm running Squeeze on a Dreamhost VPS. Trying to run a mail server but I don't want my e-mails stored unencrypted on their drives |
| 18:29.45 | marcidy | jmcnaught/heurist: http://paste.debian.net/112476/ |
| 18:30.05 | bluesceada | jmcnaught: okay thank you, at the moment it's systemd that doesn't seem to be working as well as sysvinit .... |
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| 18:30.26 | Evropi | is it true that the latest jessie ships systemd by default |
| 18:30.35 | Evropi | I'm planning on installing debian soon on my main machine |
| 18:30.42 | unclezipper | Ah... Guess I'll have to do it manually then. When I try to use cryptsetup it fails with error code 22: Cannot read device |
| 18:31.23 | ivanshmakov | centrx: Well, I enjoy a (partial) local mirror of rsync://bugs-mirror.debian.org/bts-spool-db/, so it’s not all that a big issue. The only problem is that I’ve last updated this mirror around a week ago, and wanted to look if one of the bug reports I watch for has changed since then. |
| 18:31.24 | jmcnaught | marcidy: you forgot a d in icedtea-7-plugin. I would also remove/comment the last line in your sources.list, "stable" is an alias for "wheezy" right now, but when Jessie is released you don't want that line causing a surprise release upgrade for you |
| 18:31.25 | frostschutz | unclezipper, here's an example that uses cryptsetup on a file (sorry, it's gentoo): https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Custom_Initramfs#Encrypted_Keyfile |
| 18:31.39 | marcidy | jmcnaught: that is deeply embarrasing |
| 18:31.46 | centrx | ha |
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| 18:32.01 | marcidy | jmcnaught I will go hang my head in shame. thank you. |
| 18:32.05 | unclezipper | frostschutz: Thanks. No worries about it being Gentoo |
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| 18:32.38 | jmcnaught | marcidy: not a big deal. also "apt-cache search foo" is helpful for searching for packages (aptitude search is even more powerful :) |
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| 18:33.07 | iveevue | Is there any point compiling your own kernel? |
| 18:33.30 | ivanshmakov | iveevue: Rarely. |
| 18:33.41 | jaakkos | iveevue: if you don't know why you would want to, you probably don't |
| 18:33.46 | iveevue | Thought so |
| 18:33.56 | marcidy | jmcnaught: thanks, i use those, but unfortunately they are stil prone to PIBCAK errors too. |
| 18:34.01 | unclezipper | iveevue: You could maybe run your microwave on Linux |
| 18:34.20 | jaakkos | iveevue: a common reason might be to get some very recent hardware to run |
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| 18:34.33 | jaakkos | like a new laptop. |
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| 18:34.55 | Haritz | That's what happens |
| 18:34.57 | Haritz | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:35.00 | Haritz | alberto@acer-Linux:~$ gnome-control-center |
| 18:35.01 | Haritz | Segmentation fault |
| 18:35.02 | Haritz | This |
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| 18:35.34 | iveevue | Haritz, Why use testing? |
| 18:35.50 | Evropi | you probably want to pop to the gnome 3 channel to ask that Haritz |
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| 18:35.54 | Junkafood | unable to locate xorg-server, why? |
| 18:36.00 | jmcnaught | Haritz: maybe look for bugs related to that package on bugs.debian.org. Someone in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net might be more familiar with that problem too. |
| 18:36.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1470] by debhelper |
| 18:36.03 | birdinatux | hello. Fresh install of Debian 7.6 w/ Gnome3. Hot corner not active. Added nonfree repo and install firmware-nonfree but must still be missing something. Any Ideas? |
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| 18:36.09 | sandman13 | The number of Testing users trying to get help is damn too high |
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| 18:36.24 | Evropi | testing is pretty stable tbh :P |
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| 18:36.35 | jaakkos | yes until you install systemd :D |
| 18:36.36 | Evropi | and stable is so stable this channel would be dead :P |
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| 18:36.47 | teraflop | hah |
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| 18:36.51 | Haritz | iveevue: Because I need glib 2.15 to run som apps :) |
| 18:36.54 | Evropi | jaakkos: I think it comes by default now, which is what I came in to ask |
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| 18:37.10 | Haritz | jmcnaught, * Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only). |
| 18:37.13 | Evropi | debian testing now comes with systemd by default right? If I install it I get testing |
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| 18:37.20 | jmcnaught | birdinatux: what graphics card you you have? what does "lspci -nn | grep VGA" give you. Are you in Gnome fallback mode? |
| 18:37.30 | jmcnaught | Haritz: it's on irc.oftc.net, not freenode |
| 18:37.30 | sandman13 | Haritz: irc.oftc.net |
| 18:38.01 | centrx | Evropi, That's the plan for the release, but not necessarily the case if you install it now. |
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| 18:38.27 | DammitJim | if I have 3 nameservers in my resolv.conf |
| 18:38.28 | birdinatux | jmcnaught, first boot went to fallback, doesn't say fallback now. 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: Intel Corporation Haswell Integrated Graphics Controller [8086:0412] (rev 06) |
| 18:38.30 | centrx | Evropi, My testing system has not tried to upgrade itself to systemd, but I initially installed it a long time ago |
| 18:38.35 | DammitJim | does the system try to use all 3 servers? |
| 18:38.39 | DammitJim | how about 4? |
| 18:38.49 | DammitJim | like if the first and second are offline |
| 18:38.51 | birdinatux | Never had a problem w/ Gnome3 hot corner until installed Debian... so don't think its underpowered hardware |
| 18:38.52 | jmcnaught | I think part of the problem is there's a lot of people out there saying "Debian Testing/Unstable is pretty stable" and users without enough experience to fix the inevitable problems that happen are getting tripped up by major transitions. |
| 18:38.54 | Haritz | k, thanks |
| 18:39.00 | Haritz | Ok ,thanks, and sorry |
| 18:39.10 | jmcnaught | ,pciid 8086:0412 |
| 18:39.12 | judd | [8086:0412] is 'Xeon E3-1200 v3/4th Gen Core Processor Integrated Graphics Controller' from 'Intel Corporation' with kernel modules 'ata_generic', 'snd-hda-intel' in wheezy. See also http://kmuto.jp/debian/hcl/index.rhtmlx?check=1&lspci=8086:0412 |
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| 18:41.29 | jmcnaught | birdinatux: I think others have had trouble with Haswell graphics on Wheezy. Can you put your /var/log/Xorg.0.log on paste.debian.net? |
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| 18:42.37 | Evropi | centrx: yeah I'm looking to do the install now |
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| 18:42.47 | Evropi | I actually want systemd :D |
| 18:42.59 | bakaneko | Evropi, =\ |
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| 18:43.23 | Evropi | please, let's not debate this |
| 18:43.31 | Evropi | I just seek an answer to my question, no flame wars |
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| 18:44.20 | mechanicalduck_ | Hi! |
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| 18:44.25 | birdinatux | jmcnaught, thanks for the help here is the link http://paste.debian.net/112480/ |
| 18:44.27 | mechanicalduck_ | So smbfs is replaced by cifs(-utils) in Wheezy, right? |
| 18:44.27 | centrx | I heard systemd eats babies |
| 18:44.28 | heurist | Evropi: systemd works fine in wheezy too |
| 18:44.39 | jmcnaught | Evropi: systemd is also available on wheezy, with a newer version in wheezy-backports |
| 18:44.43 | mechanicalduck_ | Or can I still install smbfs? I need it as cifs still doesn't support inotify (which really sucks). |
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| 18:45.05 | Evropi | well yes, but I want testing and I have a cap so I can't download many hundreds of MBs at a time |
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| 18:46.28 | heurist | Evropi: testing will eat more data due to more frequent updates though. |
| 18:46.54 | Evropi | the main thing is to not get them all at once, and besides I'd switch to testing anyway |
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| 18:47.45 | jmcnaught | birdinatux: It looks like your computer is starting X with the fallback VESA drivers. Do you have xserver-xorg-video-intel and libgl1-mesa-dri packages installed? |
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| 18:48.38 | birdinatux | yes both installed according to APT |
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| 18:49.53 | jmcnaught | birdinatux: you could try using a newer kernel from wheezy-backports, but I believe your problem is that the version of xserver-xorg-video-intel in Wheezy doesn't properly support your GPU. Maybe someone else knows better, my hardware is pre-Haswell |
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| 18:51.44 | birdinatux | jmcnaught, kk, can live without the hot corner for now but got so used to it with Fedora. Thanks for your help and input! |
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| 18:54.18 | parakeit | any ideas how to play adobe flash on a powerpc running debian? I have gnash and lightspark? |
| 18:54.23 | parakeit | and vlc |
| 18:54.28 | parakeit | but still can't get all flash to work |
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| 18:55.59 | mtn | parakeit: flashplugin for iceweasel and pepperflashplugin for chromium |
| 18:56.07 | jhutchins | parakeit: There are lots of variations of flash. Adobe changes it periodically to force developers to buy new tools. |
| 18:56.27 | parakeit | ah ...hm... i have trouble finding a chromium for powerpc on debian . is it not supported or? |
| 18:56.34 | parakeit | jhutchins, wow |
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| 18:56.38 | parakeit | mtn ah |
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| 18:57.27 | jmcnaught | parakeit: adobe flash was never available for powerpc on linux, and i imagine the same is true for pepperflash. You probably need to use gnash, or try to find HTML5 ways of playing online videos |
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| 18:57.48 | parakeit | ah yeah i have html5 working on youtube and gnash works on some sites but not all |
| 18:58.00 | parakeit | seems like it's a battle |
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| 18:58.29 | parakeit | how come cpu architecture comes into play? i don't know computer science |
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| 18:59.14 | jmcnaught | parakeit: same here, I have amd64 but use gnash, only works in a few places. if Adobe Flash were open source Debian could just recompile it for all the architectures, but because Flash is proprietary the company that wrote it decides which platforms to support. |
| 18:59.31 | parakeit | ah |
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| 18:59.38 | parakeit | that is nuts |
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| 18:59.51 | centrx | parakeit, Compiled software is targeted towards a type of CPU. The resulting instructions have to match the instruction set for the CPU. |
| 19:00.15 | parakeit | ah they never gave compiled version to powerpc/debian |
| 19:00.28 | centrx | parakeit, Adobe Flash is non-free, closed source, otherwise it would have been ported to other architectures by now |
| 19:00.33 | parakeit | i would assume it's trivial for them to do |
| 19:00.42 | Junkafood | reboot,poweroff does not work. I get the ~bash: not found, why |
| 19:00.55 | jmcnaught | parakeit: adobe doesn't update flash for linux at all any more, but they never supported powerpc |
| 19:01.02 | parakeit | oh |
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| 19:01.27 | parakeit | think of how many sites uses adobe flash |
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| 19:01.38 | parakeit | so it's just a matter of telling sites to stop using adobe flash right? |
| 19:01.59 | jmcnaught | Junkafood: those commands are in /sbin which isn't in a regular user's $PATH by default and need to be run by root anyways |
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| 19:02.23 | centrx | parakeit, I haven't used Flash in years, it's not much of a problem |
| 19:02.30 | parakeit | oh nice |
| 19:02.41 | centrx | parakeit, For example, for video sites like Youtube there are many alternate programs to access it |
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| 19:03.28 | centrx | parakeit, Also many sites are starting to use HTML5 now instead of Flash. You can opt-in to HTML5 for Youtube, for example. |
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| 19:03.35 | Junkafood | jmcnaught: thanks sudo reboot worked :D |
| 19:03.42 | parakeit | oh ye4ah youtube runs fine now |
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| 19:04.46 | Junkafood | OMG i just login my new DE :D it feels so great when you install your system on your own :D |
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| 19:05.30 | jmcnaught | parakeit: In addition to separate programs for accessing videos from online sites, you could look into add-ons for Iceweasel like "unplug" and "video-without-flash" |
| 19:05.42 | parakeit | ah |
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| 19:06.12 | votick | Hey guys I'm currently running the debian install (live from usb), but it says can't find ethernet card so select driver from list. |
| 19:06.27 | votick | How do I know which driver I'm using? I have a bunch of new parts; but can't tell what to look for or do right now. |
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| 19:08.19 | parakeit | hm... my debian on powerpc keeps saying i'm in year 1980 |
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| 19:08.29 | parakeit | i think this is why my security certificates visitng sites are expired |
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| 19:09.19 | jmcnaught | votick: 'lspci -nn| grep -iE "Ethernet|Network"' should tell you, and if you tell us the pciid ([abde:123]) we can try and figure out what you need to get it to work. |
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| 19:09.51 | votick | jmcnaught: I don't even have an OS setup yet though, no terminal or anything by the looks of it. |
| 19:10.08 | jmcnaught | parakeit: If you install the "ntp" package it will keep your system time up to date. You might need to replace a CMOS battery on your motherboard or something like that too |
| 19:10.12 | votick | jmcnaught: perhaps I should download a full install disk to usb. |
| 19:10.23 | parakeit | ok |
| 19:11.01 | jmcnaught | votick: Alt-F2 should bring you to a different tty you can run commands on, Alt-F1 to get back to installer. You might also have better luck with the firmware installer |
| 19:11.14 | jmcnaught | !firmware image |
| 19:11.15 | dpkg | Unofficial <netinst> images - containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages - for installing Debian 7 "Wheezy" are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/ . See also <install guide>. |
| 19:11.23 | parakeit | nice jmcnaught found unplug and installed in iceweasel |
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| 19:12.04 | votick | jmcnaught: so I just put that iso onto the usb along with live boot stuff? |
| 19:12.05 | ShalokShalom | Will jessy ship wayland and plasma 5 ? |
| 19:12.09 | jmcnaught | parakeit: unplug lets you download the video for playing in a separate program. Not ideal, but it might work :) |
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| 19:13.11 | parakeit | nice |
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| 19:13.56 | jmcnaught | votick: You would prepare the USB stick following the instructions in the Install Guide (basically "cp debian.iso /dev/sdX ; sync" where sdX is your USB stick). I'm not sure what you mean about "live boot stuff" though |
| 19:15.50 | votick | jmcnaught: alright, well I tried lspci -nn first and I see atheros 1969:e091 as the ethernet |
| 19:16.05 | jmcnaught | ,pciid 1969:e091 |
| 19:16.06 | judd | [1969:e091] is 'Killer E220x Gigabit Ethernet Controller' from 'Qualcomm Atheros' with no known kernel module in wheezy but has kernel module 'alx' in sid. See also http://kmuto.jp/debian/hcl/index.rhtmlx?check=1&lspci=1969:e091 http://wiki.debian.org/alx |
| 19:16.31 | jmcnaught | votick: you're probably going to need a newer kernel from wheezy-backports |
| 19:17.10 | votick | Oh, newer kernal |
| 19:17.21 | votick | jmcnaught: So do I need to get a different .iso file or something? |
| 19:17.32 | jmcnaught | votick: check the wiki link from judd ^^^ for more details.. do you have another way of connecting this computer to the network during the install? |
| 19:18.18 | votick | jmcnaught: I have a usb wireless stick that I'm connecting to the internet with on my current desktop; but I doubt it would just work by plugging it into my new build. |
| 19:19.20 | Yoshi1 | anyone hear this thing about ubuntu is going to be terminated? |
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| 19:19.59 | tadni| | Yoshi1: What do you mean? |
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| 19:20.31 | babilen | Yoshi1: That doesn't really strike me as a Debian support issue and you might want to ask in #debian-offtopic or #ubuntu (and there probably in #ubuntu-offtopic too). It would also help to cite sources. |
| 19:20.34 | jmcnaught | votick: running the installer (with the firmware image) and that USB wifi stick might be the easiest way to go, then install newer kernel from wheezy-backports before removing the wifi stick. Otherwise you might need to use a larger installer image (CD1 for example) that contains enough packages, then install the newer kernel from wheezy-backports from a stick while your system is still offline |
| 19:20.57 | ShalokShalom | Will jessy ship wayland and plasma 5 ? |
| 19:21.01 | babilen | .oO( Haven't we been through all that? ) |
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| 19:21.21 | votick | jmcnaught: I'll try the larger installer image first, since then I don't have to take my current desktop offline. |
| 19:22.02 | votick | jmcnaught: I'm just confused with how the tutorial explains this process (https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch04s03.html.en#usb-copy-isohybrid) |
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| 19:22.29 | formorer | ShalokShalom: yes for wayland |
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| 19:23.03 | babilen | judd: v xwayland |
| 19:23.04 | judd | Package: xwayland on i386 -- jessie: 2:1.16.0-1; sid: 2:1.16.0-1 |
| 19:23.20 | babilen | ShalokShalom: ^^^ (along with weston et al) |
| 19:23.30 | ShalokShalom | ok |
| 19:23.40 | babilen | No idea what plasma 5 might be |
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| 19:23.51 | votick | jmcnaught: I navigated to the list of images here (http://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/7.6.0/amd64/bt-cd/) and I'm thinking of using the kde-cd-1 option |
| 19:23.53 | ShalokShalom | ? |
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| 19:25.16 | babilen | votick: If you want to install KDE you can use that image to do so (cf. "/msg dpkg install kde" and "/msg dpkg various cd1") - Please note that it does *not* contain firmware and that you would have to supply those seperately as indicated and detailed earlier (download firmware.tar.gz and unpack it to the second partition or deal with that once you've installed Debian) |
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| 19:25.26 | Andymeows | Hello, is there known issues with Intel ValleyView in regards to video drivers? |
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| 19:26.15 | babilen | Andymeows: Nobody explicitly mentioned it, but it might be the case that they require a newer xserver-xorg-video-intel and/or kernel module than what is available in wheezy. Why? Do *you* have problems? |
| 19:26.17 | votick | babilen: Alright I'll look into that. |
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| 19:27.38 | Andymeows | babilen: yeah, I've got a Gigabyte GB-BXBT-2807, and it's only giving real basic resolutions as options |
| 19:27.57 | babilen | On wheezy? |
| 19:28.33 | Andymeows | yes, and I'm actually running it through ltsp |
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| 19:28.41 | babilen | ltsp? |
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| 19:28.58 | babilen | Andymeows: #intel-gfx can probably tell you exactly which kernel and xserver-xorg-video-intel version you need. |
| 19:29.06 | babilen | judd: v xserver-xorg-video-intel |
| 19:29.06 | judd | Package: xserver-xorg-video-intel on i386 -- squeeze: 2:2.13.0-7; squeeze-backports: 2:2.15.0-3~bpo60+2; wheezy: 2:2.19.0-6; jessie: 2:2.21.15-2+b2; sid: 2:2.21.15-2+b2; experimental: 2:2.99.914-1~exp1 |
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| 19:29.18 | Andymeows | linux terminal server project. It boots with PXE |
| 19:29.34 | Andymeows | I'll check it out. thanks babilen! |
| 19:30.01 | babilen | Andymeows: You could try installing a newer kernel from backports -- follow "/msg dpkg bdo kernel" and use a sources.list such as http://paste.debian.net/112500/ -- but that doesn't cut it if you *also* need a newer Xorg version. |
| 19:30.22 | babilen | Andymeows: We currently offer 3.2 as standard kernel in wheezy and 3.14 in wheezy-backports. |
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| 19:30.49 | heurist | LeandroLuiz: look for NOPASSWD in man sudoers |
| 19:30.52 | babilen | Andymeows: Just show them (and us?) the output of "lspci -nn|grep -i vga" |
| 19:30.56 | heurist | LeandroLuiz: sorry |
| 19:31.00 | LeandroLuiz | ok |
| 19:31.07 | Andymeows | yeah, it's using 3.2 currently |
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| 19:32.15 | Andymeows | 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: Intel Corporation ValleyView Gen7 [8086:0f31] (rev 0e) |
| 19:32.27 | Junkafood | after i booted into mate desktop i dont have internet, neither ethernet or wifi |
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| 19:34.52 | babilen | judd: pciid 8086:0f31 |
| 19:34.52 | judd | [8086:0f31] is 'Atom Processor Z36xxx/Z37xxx Series Graphics & Display' from 'Intel Corporation' with kernel modules 'ata_generic', 'snd-hda-intel' in wheezy. See also http://kmuto.jp/debian/hcl/index.rhtmlx?check=1&lspci=8086:0f31 |
| 19:35.09 | Junkafood | pls help |
| 19:35.53 | babilen | Andymeows: Please ask in #intel-gfx, they develop those kernel modules/Xorg drivers and can tell you immediately what you need. We can then tackle it on how to achieve that in Debian. (I'll be afk for a while though) |
| 19:36.05 | PunIntended | judd: Don't expect support for PowerVR graphics. |
| 19:37.04 | aguitel | is anyone triyng to install in chromebook ? |
| 19:37.33 | jmcnaught | Junkafood: is this a fresh install, or was networking working before? How are you trying to connect to network, using NetworkManager? |
| 19:37.34 | votick | babilen: I think I'm going to boot into linux mint to try this usb setup. It's so confusing doing this while I'm on windows, I have no clue what they mean by partitioning and syncing/etc. |
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| 19:37.52 | votick | babilen: As in, is that supposed to be on my new pc build while doing the install, or do I do this on a usb from different pc and bring the files over then. |
| 19:38.28 | jmcnaught | votick: to prepare the USB stick with the installer image you can use win32diskimager |
| 19:38.40 | jmcnaught | dpkg: tell votick -about win32diskimager |
| 19:38.40 | Junkafood | jmcnaught: yes fresh minimal install, it was working before i rebooted, yes now i have networkmanager but no internet |
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| 19:39.33 | jmcnaught | Junkafood: is networkmanager showing itself in MATE? (I don't use MATE so I don't know what to expect). Do you get an error message? |
| 19:39.34 | votick | jmcnaught: Ohh, thanks. That extra bit about unmasking it from .img to . helps, since I downloaded a .iso and couldn't find any .img |
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| 19:40.18 | Junkafood | jmcnaught: yes i installed network-manager-gnome, i dont get any error and when i click connection information i have an ip and all |
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| 19:40.44 | Junkafood | but when i run update in a terminal its like i dont have internet |
| 19:41.05 | babilen | votick: On Windows you would, naturally, use the win32diskimager mentioned in the <usb install> factoid I gave you earlier (as you can't use cp on Windows ;) |
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| 19:41.19 | ivanshmakov | Junkafood: Does ‘$ ip addr’ show your IP addresses? |
| 19:41.47 | babilen | votick: Did you take a look at the links I mentioned or should I give them to you again? |
| 19:42.16 | votick | babilen: Sorry I kinda went dumb and completely overlooked the fact that I'm on windows, and was following terminal commands... |
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| 19:42.35 | votick | babilen: It makes more sense using the win version then. I thought all those terminal commands were meant for the new pc during installation screen. |
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| 19:42.56 | Junkafood | ivanshmakov: yes. also, networkmanager says for ethernet connections device not managed |
| 19:43.35 | babilen | No, not at all. There are simply different ways to write our images to the usb stick depending on the operating system you are writing from. Windows simply doesn't come with *anything* that allows you to copy directly to the USB stick directly from the command line. |
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| 19:43.41 | jmcnaught | Junkafood: by default network-manager will not manage any interfaces defined in /etc/network/interfaces |
| 19:44.15 | votick | Going to go walk outside quick, I'll work on installation more shortly and update you guys on my struggle |
| 19:44.59 | Junkafood | jmcnaught: yes, i just found this https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkManager |
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| 19:47.19 | ivanshmakov | Junkafood: What specific errors the system shows? |
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| 19:50.27 | crsuarez | wc |
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| 19:51.40 | Junkafood | ivanshmakov: could not resolve "debian server" |
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| 19:52.50 | ivanshmakov | Junkafood: What’s in /etc/resolv.conf? Are there any IPs of your DNS server (forwarder)? |
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| 19:54.34 | Junkafood | ivanshmakov: i just edited /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf and modified manage=false to true rebooted and now i have internet!! :) |
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| 19:55.00 | Junkafood | thanks |
| 19:55.27 | jmcnaught | Junkafood: instead of doing that you could also have commented out the eth0 and wlan0 stanzas from /etc/network/interfaces :) |
| 19:55.37 | babilen | votick: It really isn't that horrible. The most important part is to get started. I'd also *strongly* recommend to use the partitioning scheme in which everything is in one partition. |
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| 19:56.35 | babilen | votick: Once you have Debian installed we can easily tell you exactly what to do to solve specific problems. The pelthora of information that is being offered is simply there so that you can do the most perfect installation ever. But you don't have to as we can work on other parts later without problems. |
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| 19:57.28 | votick | babilen: that is a bit more comforting, heh. I think to setup the usb I'll switch over to my linux mint boot, so I can at least follow the tutorial exact |
| 19:57.45 | votick | babilen: It is weird seeing them extract that .tar.gz but I'm on windows here unsure of how to see partitions. |
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| 19:58.23 | votick | babilen: Welp, I'm off to do a couple other things today but I'll report back asap tomorrow, thanks for the advice. |
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| 20:02.03 | babilen | votick: You can download the .zip on Windows (that is why we provide it) -- but forget about the firmware if that makes it too complicated for you. Just install it! Try the firmware image and see if you can get online with it or use the XFCE (or KDE) CD1 and install that and we'll take it from there. |
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| 20:03.21 | babilen | votick: It's just that if you write any image to the usb you'll have a second (empty) partition on which you *can* create a filesystem (i.e. "format" it on Windows) and then unpack firmware.zip / firmware.tar.gz) so that you can use the firmware (which *might* be needed by your wireless stick) during the installation already. |
| 20:03.42 | babilen | votick: The important part is, however, just to get the damn system installed. Once you've done that a lot will be easier :) |
| 20:04.22 | babilen | It shouldn't take you longer than 30/45 minutes (unless you ponder every single question) ;) |
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| 20:04.47 | votick | babilen: Sounds good :) As mentioned I have to go out somewhere now; but I'll be back on and will just go through with installation then, dealing with other stuff later. Thanks pal |
| 20:04.59 | somiaj | windows lots of times will not allow multiple partitions on thumbdrivers. There is a hardware bit that says if it is a thumbdrive vs a full usbhd, if windows detects that protable bit (at least in 7) it will not allow you to access or use the secon partition. |
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| 20:05.55 | zykotick9 | somiaj: anti-features are great aren't they? /sarcasm |
| 20:06.36 | babilen | somiaj: Why would it do such a stupid thing? |
| 20:07.21 | somiaj | babilen: don't ask me, but I ran into that issue when I tried to do just what you suggested about adding the firmware (or additional files) to that second partition. Windows would give me no access to it |
| 20:08.03 | somiaj | I found some hacks on the internet you can phiscally change the hardware bit on the device so windows thinks it is an usbhd over a portable hd (like a thumbdrive or sd card). I didn't want to go though the hassel to do that |
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| 20:09.01 | babilen | somiaj: Okay, I'll keep it in mind. What a stupid thing to do. |
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| 20:09.40 | jhutchins | I've seen several drives that came with windows management software that auto-installed and bypassed windows handling of the drive (at least for XP). |
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| 20:10.39 | somiaj | babilen: in the end it depends if the hardware has that 'portable bit' or whatever it is actually called turned on or enabled. But my experience is most thumb drives and sd cards have it. |
| 20:10.53 | somiaj | but my experience is limited, I just found it very annoying when I ran across it |
| 20:12.30 | mns | how do I tell if I've got a systemd box or one based on the init scripts ? |
| 20:12.39 | somiaj | mns: what version of debian? |
| 20:12.43 | jhutchins | somiaj: Isn't that part of the USB handshaking that handles that? |
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| 20:13.02 | jhutchins | somiaj: When the device identifies itself to the system on connect? |
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| 20:13.47 | mns | somiaj: debian/testing |
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| 20:14.54 | somiaj | mns: dpkg -l | grep systemd -- it is become default that jessie will change you to systemd unless you do something about it |
| 20:15.25 | mns | I do have systemd installed. |
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| 20:16.15 | somiaj | mns: you can also do a ps fax and see if systemd is running, if so it has been switched and you are using systemd |
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| 20:16.58 | somiaj | jhutchins: not sure how windows detects this bit, When I found out about it and saw the hacks to disable it I said who cares and got another thumbdrive to transfer data to that windows box. |
| 20:17.01 | mns | somiaj: the only one I see is /lib/systemd/systemd-logind when I do ps fax |
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| 20:17.23 | somiaj | mns: ls -l /sbin/init (does that point at systemd) |
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| 20:17.52 | mns | somiaj: no it does not |
| 20:18.12 | somiaj | mns: is it still pointing at sysvinit, seems like you have a strange mix |
| 20:18.46 | mns | dpkg-query -S /sbin/init says its from syvinit-core |
| 20:19.33 | mns | I installed debian/testing about 1.5 years ago on this box and have been doing safe-upgrade with aptitude ever since. |
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| 20:19.37 | somiaj | mns: isn't /sbin/init a link, I thought that was the new standard, let me log onto my unstable box |
| 20:19.51 | somiaj | mns: you should be doing full-upgrades, could be things are only partially upgrades. |
| 20:19.58 | mns | somiaj: no its not a link |
| 20:20.00 | somiaj | upgraded, you need to keep curent with testing to get support |
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| 20:20.59 | mns | let me try that, see what happens |
| 20:21.33 | somiaj | yea 1.5 years fo only safe-upgrade, could be you have a lot of very old packages still on your system that are not changing |
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| 20:21.42 | somiaj | be prepared this will do some things 1) it will change you to systemd |
| 20:21.53 | somiaj | 2) if you use non-free dirvers (nvidia or fglrx) it will remove them as they are currently not working in testing |
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| 20:26.38 | mns | somiaj: yeah there is a lot of things getting upgraded, and a bunch of things getting removed, including sysvinit-core. which is being replaced by systemd-sysv which makes the link for /sbin/init to systemd. |
| 20:27.22 | mns | I dont use propriety drivers for video, so I'm fine with that. I don't believe in all that fancy eye candy, so I stick to the onboard intel chipset. |
| 20:27.31 | somiaj | mns: correct, the safe-upgrade has been keeping you behind. It is good at times. I use apt-get but this is my upgrade strat. 1) apt-get upgrade, 2) apt-get dist-upgrade (I do this as two seperate steps that way I can isolate any bugs that happen with the dist-upgrade) |
| 20:28.07 | somiaj | but on testing to get support and to be able to submit decent bugreports, ensure you full-upgrade (or dist-upgrade) all the way before sending in bugreports and testing things. |
| 20:28.38 | somiaj | My biggest issue is I sometimes go 6 months to a year between upgrades once everything is working. But it also makes my upgrades a lot harder to debug when something breaks. To much changed. |
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| 20:29.46 | mns | somiaj: I have just done safe-upgrade on an almost daily basis. I did have to do a full-upgade once or twice some time ago, but can't remember when or why, so its been a long time for that too. |
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| 20:30.47 | mns | the big thin I'm worried about is that cups is getting removed. I'll have to see what happens. |
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| 20:31.50 | somiaj | mns: install apt-listbugs, and check the bugreports, in some cases holding back a few things is needed. But as I said you will get very little support if you aren't fully upgraded as is the bug an bug in jessie or a bug with new jessie packages mixing with old jessie packages. |
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| 20:32.21 | jordanm | mns: when you wait 6 months between upgrades on testing, it's basically like upgrading to a new release every 6 months |
| 20:32.25 | jordanm | without release notes |
| 20:32.28 | jordanm | or stable support... |
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| 20:34.29 | mns | somiaj, jordanm: I've been using testing from before woody came out. I've not had many issues in all the while since then. some hiccups now and then, where I've done full-upgrade. for the most part safe-upgrade has worked to keep things "stable" on my testing system :) I do tend to fall behind certain things, and then have a big update which takes care of things. |
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| 20:36.01 | mns | in this case I lost the ability to suspend/hibernate in xfce, due to upower getting upgraded to a version that dropped suspend/hibernate capabilities and passed them onto systed. |
| 20:36.03 | somiaj | mns: Yea just givin you pointers (espically when you have bugs and want to submit bugreports). My sid install has been around since 2002 and it has been 'fun times' after waiting a year to do a full-upgrade |
| 20:36.53 | mns | somiaj: yeah I can imagine that. I've never ventured to using sid. |
| 20:37.10 | mns | and the pointers are very much appreciated. |
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| 20:37.51 | somiaj | since I don't plan to ever stablize that machine I enjoy it. with apt-listbugs I rarely get hit by a critical bug. Sure thigns break a bit more often, but they are fixed way faster and testing gets some really strange issues during package migration (like removal of tons of packages from the testing repos). |
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| 20:38.17 | somiaj | But I like sid more than testing. I run stable on all my work machines as I don't like fixing things when I need to work. |
| 20:38.28 | fireant | i've just configured i3 and I have to recommend it. its exelent wm |
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| 20:38.50 | heurist | fireant: agreed |
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| 20:39.52 | mns | somiaj: yeah this is my daily work laptop that I run testing on. hence the use of safe-upgrade. |
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| 20:42.33 | nymous | hello guys |
| 20:43.16 | nymous | i'm making a package... how can I get package version number during build? i mean inside debian/rules |
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| 20:43.55 | petern_ | Hmm, just installed loganalyzer, mongodb along with rsyslog from backports, but it's running really slow :( |
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| 20:44.20 | petern_ | There's only 2000 entries, and the page says it took ~ 2 seconds, but it actually takes much longer. |
| 20:44.21 | somiaj | nymous: isn't it in the debian/control file? |
| 20:44.49 | nymous | somiaj: yes, but i need it inside rules for automation |
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| 20:46.42 | somiaj | nymous: why, you need more than the debian/rules file to et a good build, the control file is a part of what is needed/used? |
| 20:47.08 | somiaj | nymous: this is a bit out of my league though. Maybe ask in #debian-mentors on irc.oftc.net and ask them what the best approach would be |
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| 20:47.33 | somiaj | nymous: I would ask your question though, i would say, "im trying to automate this and I want this effect, what would be the best way to go about it in building a pckage' |
| 20:48.10 | nymous | i need package version in a variable inside rules script to automate my build |
| 20:48.44 | nymous | ok, i'll try to ask there |
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| 20:57.25 | sebastien | hello world |
| 20:57.30 | SubaruSVX | http://www.aboutdebian.com/ |
| 20:57.33 | SubaruSVX | hi sebastien |
| 20:57.39 | sebastien | hi SubaruSVX |
| 20:57.39 | SubaruSVX | I'm looking for a website similiar to taht |
| 20:57.44 | SubaruSVX | does anyone know of one? |
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| 21:01.16 | Skaag | anyone here happens to know how the 'interval' option in debian's watchdog package works? |
| 21:01.30 | Skaag | in the context of pinging a remote IP address |
| 21:02.53 | jhutchins | I didn't even know debian HAD a dog. |
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| 21:11.11 | innmalint | nvidia issues: fresh install of non-free, immediate upgrade to testing. xinit says Fatal Server Error: no screens found. /var/log/Xorg.0.log says (WW) Warning, couldn't open module nvidia (EE) Failed to load module "nvidia" (module does not exist, 0). |
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| 21:12.48 | innmalint | Card is DELL OEM Nvidia GTX 645. Linux 3.14-1-amd64, I've reinstalled and dpkg-reconfigure'd the drivers. According to systemctl nvidia-kernel is active |
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| 21:14.17 | mtn | innmalint: if you don't get help here, you should try #debian-next on the oftc.net server |
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| 21:16.43 | innmalint | thanks mtn |
| 21:16.53 | mtn | innmalint: yw |
| 21:16.53 | heudebeu | modprobe nvidia |
| 21:16.57 | heudebeu | lsmod | grep nvidia ? |
| 21:17.23 | innmalint | I just discovered nvidia-current, which I'm not sure what that is, is missing/not installed |
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| 21:19.34 | innmalint | modprobe: ERROR: could not insert 'nvidia_current': No such device. |
| 21:20.14 | innmalint | oh i forgot about lsmod...looks like nouveau is hanging around also. I thought nvidia blacklisted it by default |
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| 21:23.12 | strawbs | whatd happen if i unmounted /boot and forgot to remount it before apt installing or upgrading kernel? just error out and no harm done, or pretty bad? |
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| 21:24.18 | strawbs | or for that matter, any package update that requires eg an update-grub or initramfs |
| 21:24.36 | heurist | strawbs: at worst you will end up with kernel in the /boot on / |
| 21:24.38 | Guest20251 | Hey, I'm trying to install debian on my acer notebook, but it has no cd tray and I'm having trouble using a USB stick. I have the netinst iso on my harddrive, and I currently have lubutnu installed. Can I just install debian from lubuntu? |
| 21:24.51 | strawbs | heurist: i see |
| 21:24.55 | strawbs | thats good |
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| 21:25.38 | heurist | strawbs: unmount /boot look if anything is there, if not then you you had no problem. I recall something about it being auto-mounted when needed by apt |
| 21:26.08 | strawbs | so if i list fstab entries with noauto, it will try mount those for me? |
| 21:26.57 | heurist | stack: not sure, some systems do, I think there was an option in debian to turn it off, but try it. |
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| 21:27.07 | strawbs | alright, cool |
| 21:27.10 | strawbs | thanks |
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| 21:27.23 | jmcnaught | deop #deptadapt aaronp |
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| 21:28.02 | heurist | Guest20251: installing from iso on hdd is not easy, what trouble is the usb stick giving you? |
| 21:28.30 | jmcnaught | sorry ^^ wrong window :) |
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| 21:30.37 | dvs | !lart jmcnaught |
| 21:30.37 | dpkg | stabs jmcnaught |
| 21:31.08 | Guest20251 | heurist: When I burn the netinst iso, I get a problem like 'no common cd-drive', if I burn the live install it dosen't boot at all |
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| 21:31.33 | dvs | Guest20251: How do you burn the ISO to a USB. |
| 21:31.45 | Guest20251 | Sorry, that was worded badly, when I try to install it with the netinst |
| 21:31.46 | wulllst | how/where can i browse file lists of every debian release since the very beginning? |
| 21:31.52 | Guest20251 | I get the rror in the debian installer |
| 21:31.55 | Guest20251 | *eror |
| 21:31.57 | Guest20251 | *error :P |
| 21:32.04 | dvs | What error? |
| 21:32.06 | Guest20251 | I checked the hash and it was okay too |
| 21:32.20 | Guest20251 | It says something along the lines of 'no common cd-drive found' after I select my language |
| 21:32.25 | Guest20251 | And from there it fails |
| 21:32.48 | dvs | Guest20251: how did you get the ISO onto the USB drive? |
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| 21:33.28 | Guest20251 | dvs: pendrivelinux on a windows laptop |
| 21:34.49 | dvs | Guest20251: if you already have lubuntu on it, you can copy the ISO onto that then copy the ISO image from there to the USB drive. |
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| 21:36.19 | Guest20251 | dvs: I'm not having any issue burning the ISO onto the USB, I've already done that |
| 21:36.37 | Guest20251 | dvs: It just gives me an error on my notebook when I try to install it |
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| 21:36.48 | Guest20251 | by that I mean install debian |
| 21:37.17 | dvs | Guest20251: Do you get the boot: prompt when you boot from the USB flash drive? |
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| 21:38.42 | Guest20251 | dvs: Yeah, I get the install menu with all the options, I can start the install process just fine, but after I select my language and it says 'detecting cd-rom hardware' or whatever, it says 'no common cd-drive found', even though my notebook dosen't have a cd-drive and I'm installing from a USB anyway |
| 21:39.36 | Guest20251 | dvs: Then after that point it says installation failed and just trys again |
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| 21:40.11 | dvs | Guest20251: Yeah, I don't think it's copied onto the USB properly. I'd try copying the ISO image from Lubuntu. |
| 21:40.53 | Guest20251 | dvs: Okay, I'll fire it up and give it a go |
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| 21:45.06 | Guest20251 | dvs: Which software should I use on lubutnu? |
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| 21:46.05 | dvs | Guest20251: cp XXXXX.iso /dev/sdY where XXXXX is the name of the iso file and Y is the letter of the USB drive. |
| 21:46.36 | Guest20251 | dvs: Oh, I just copy the ISO? I thought it had to be burned? |
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| 21:46.59 | dvs | Guest20251: See? I knew it was the way the drive was written |
| 21:47.53 | heurist | Guest20251: but note that you cp it to the drive , as in /dev/sdX not a partition or a mountpoint/ |
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| 21:53.12 | Guest20251 | Okay, I can't find my original usb stick but I have another one, will I have to move all my other files off of it first? |
| 21:54.04 | heurist | Guest20251: yes, it will get trashed, all your data will go away. |
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| 21:54.16 | Guest20251 | Okay |
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| 21:55.07 | gabo | hi o/ |
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| 22:01.40 | kung_fu_mike | Has anyone ever had an issue where their hard drives did not show up in /dev/ ? I have a Squeeze based Open Media Vault installation on a SuperMicro X7SPA-H-D525 motherboard (Atom). It boots fine, I can ssh in, hit the web gui, everything, but my additional hard drives besides my boot drive do not appear to be listed. |
| 22:02.08 | kung_fu_mike | Anyone heard of anything like this? BIOS toggle of some sort maybe? My Google-fu didn't return anything |
| 22:02.51 | lepine | How are the drives connected? usb? (e)sata? fw? |
| 22:03.05 | kung_fu_mike | SATA |
| 22:03.21 | kung_fu_mike | SATA2 specifically, according to the docs for the board |
| 22:03.24 | lepine | are they spinning? |
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| 22:03.52 | kung_fu_mike | in a good modern drive would you be able to feel it? |
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| 22:04.10 | lepine | yeah, it should be getting warm at least |
| 22:04.17 | ObrienDave | you should be able to feel the heads seeking |
| 22:04.21 | kung_fu_mike | ok, let me boot and see |
| 22:04.43 | lepine | while you're there, try to find them in the bios |
| 22:04.51 | atannus | md array shows up on /proc/mdstat, fdisk -l, but not on partition manager. Why? |
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| 22:06.46 | kung_fu_mike | I think if I had to guess I would say no |
| 22:07.06 | kung_fu_mike | It is a Wester Digital RED 2.0TB drive |
| 22:07.16 | lepine | did you check in the bios? there might be options to enable/disable |
| 22:07.31 | lepine | but you can easily check if they're visible in the boot sequence menu |
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| 22:09.38 | kung_fu_mike | Yeah the BIOS is only showing the one boot drive connected |
| 22:10.10 | kung_fu_mike | but I have tried multiple cable and power outlets from the PS |
| 22:10.54 | lepine | there might be an option to en/disable extra sata ports in the bios |
| 22:11.58 | kung_fu_mike | Yeah, I am poking around in there more |
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| 22:21.05 | yoLo_ | is a debian server better than centOS/redhat ? |
| 22:21.27 | dvs | yoLo_: hmmmm... I wonder what people in this channel will say... |
| 22:22.21 | mtn | yoLo_: yes, no, maybe |
| 22:22.26 | teraflop | yoLo_: use whatever |
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| 22:22.59 | StolenToast | one of my coworkers likes fedora because it comes with SELinux |
| 22:24.13 | yoLo_ | StolenToast, SElinux = ? |
| 22:24.30 | yoLo_ | oh ok |
| 22:24.31 | StolenToast | it's liek a permissions system |
| 22:24.37 | StolenToast | whitelist style |
| 22:24.37 | mtn | yoLo_: google, wikipeidia |
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| 22:24.45 | yoLo_ | i have already |
| 22:25.06 | yoLo_ | and mtn , plz stop using google |
| 22:25.12 | teraflop | ^ |
| 22:25.19 | yoLo_ | the right word is "search" |
| 22:25.22 | mtn | yoLo_: ok, sure I will do that. I will get right on it |
| 22:25.55 | yoLo_ | google this google that... that's just bad english |
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| 22:26.26 | mtn | yoLo_: since I meant to use google, it was very proper english. if I meant something else I would have said something else |
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| 22:26.43 | mtn | yoLo_: thank you for your concern :P |
| 22:27.07 | babilen | Could we maybe get back to Debian support? |
| 22:27.29 | yoLo_ | well next time you're referring to bing or yahoo just say bing , wikipedia or yahoo, wikipedia |
| 22:27.40 | yoLo_ | ohh yes, sorry babilen |
| 22:27.54 | babilen | yoLo_: Please be specific what you consider "better" -- "better" for what? What are the exact attributes that would allow you to rate one over the other. |
| 22:28.02 | babilen | dpkg: tell yoLo_ -about why debian |
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| 22:29.04 | yoLo_ | babilen, for security , scalability and in terms of support |
| 22:29.15 | babilen | yoLo_: This is also #debian and we cannot (nor do we want to) discuss other distributions. Debian is a solid and good distribution and I never regretted to have chosen it. Try it and see what you think. Try the others and see which of them all better suit your needs. |
| 22:30.18 | yoLo_ | babilen, i have never been through linux server before. i have been using xubuntu for a year a and half |
| 22:31.02 | yoLo_ | now i'm building a project that would require a server.. |
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| 22:34.04 | babilen | dpkg: tell yoLo_ -about install debian |
| 22:34.23 | babilen | yoLo_: Have fun and let us know if you have more specific questions/problems. |
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| 22:36.47 | kingkong|here | how do you make motd message with info as cpu/ram usage users colored info etc? need to install something or edit motd file manually? |
| 22:36.49 | atannus | How up to date is this? https://wiki.debian.org/SoftwareRAID |
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| 22:52.46 | gabo | hi, i'm using Debian testing and i need to install nvidia-cuda-toolkit, but it isn't on the repos. anyone knows why it has been removed? |
| 22:53.27 | dalias | it's probably in non-free |
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| 22:53.48 | dalias | which you'd need to add to your repo sources if you want to use it |
| 22:54.09 | dvs | ,v nvidia-cuda-toolkit |
| 22:54.10 | judd | Package: nvidia-cuda-toolkit on i386 -- squeeze-backports/non-free: 4.2.9-1~bpo60+2; wheezy/non-free: 4.2.9-2; wheezy-backports/non-free: 5.0.35-8~bpo70+1; sid/non-free: 5.5.22-4 |
| 22:54.27 | dvs | not in Jessie |
| 22:55.49 | dalias | oh |
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| 22:57.49 | yoLo_ | why is it that debian image has 3 CD's ? |
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| 22:58.07 | yoLo_ | why so big ? |
| 22:58.29 | jaakkos | yoLo_: you only need the first one, or even just "netinst", to install. |
| 22:59.20 | binaryhermit | I actually thought it was 3 DVDs |
| 22:59.29 | jaakkos | yoLo_: netinst is 222 MB (for stable amd64) |
| 22:59.34 | binaryhermit | but yeah, you only need the 1st one |
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| 23:00.52 | dvs | binaryhermit: The whole thing is more like 10 DVDs |
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| 23:13.56 | yoLo_ | jaakkos, i will download this one debian-7.6.0-ia64-CD-1.iso.torrent |
| 23:14.00 | yoLo_ | is that ok |
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| 23:14.26 | yoLo_ | or will i be prompt for sec CD ? |
| 23:14.26 | blackjack | hello. how do i fix my mirrors? apt.rackster-server.ch seems always down |
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| 23:14.52 | cra1g321 | blackjack edit your /etc/apt/sources.list file |
| 23:15.41 | themill | yoLo_: you don't want IA64, you want amd64. |
| 23:15.44 | dvs | yoLo_: That won't work for a Core/AMD CPU |
| 23:16.16 | yoLo_ | sp netinst is the better one ? |
| 23:16.24 | yoLo_ | so* |
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| 23:17.36 | blackjack | cra1g321, yeah i mean is. what should i put in their? I dont know the valid links that should put me to the right mirror sites |
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| 23:18.25 | cra1g321 | blackjack |
| 23:18.30 | cra1g321 | https://www.debian.org/mirror/list |
| 23:18.39 | blackjack | oh thanks |
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| 23:20.12 | themill | yoLo_: there are two different things you need to choose here: (a) which architecture (you want amd64 not ia64) (b) which sized cd. If you have a wired ethernet connection while you're installing, then the netinst is fine. |
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| 23:24.41 | blackjack | cra1g321, some links on the server can be fetched |
| 23:24.54 | cra1g321 | ? |
| 23:24.57 | blackjack | i chose a german server |
| 23:24.58 | blackjack | W: Failed to fetch http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/packages/dists/wheezy/main/binary-amd64/Packages 404 Not Found |
| 23:25.09 | blackjack | among the others |
| 23:25.34 | blackjack | cant* be fetched |
| 23:25.50 | blackjack | im using apt-get |
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| 23:26.18 | cra1g321 | paste your sources.list file - http://paste.debian.net/ |
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| 23:29.54 | blackjack | http://paste.debian.net/112541/ |
| 23:30.14 | blackjack | did i edit it wrong |
| 23:30.26 | cra1g321 | quick glance , the answer is yes |
| 23:30.27 | dvs | blackjack: remove the word "packages" from line 4 |
| 23:30.34 | rim-k | blackjack: wrong edit |
| 23:30.36 | rim-k | indeed |
| 23:31.04 | cra1g321 | i belive line 9 is also a duplicate of line 4 |
| 23:31.16 | cra1g321 | without the packages word |
| 23:31.23 | blackjack | the packages there is existing. what i just changed was the main url |
| 23:31.32 | blackjack | should the /packages be out? |
| 23:31.40 | blackjack | and also maybe /security ? |
| 23:31.48 | dvs | blackjack: actually, delete line 4 |
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| 23:32.19 | blackjack | deleting it would solve everthing? |
| 23:32.28 | blackjack | how about line 9 |
| 23:32.35 | dvs | leave it |
| 23:32.39 | dvs | its a dup |
| 23:32.42 | dvs | of 4 |
| 23:32.45 | blackjack | ok |
| 23:33.08 | dvs | !tell dvs about enter |
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| 23:33.31 | themill | (pot meet kettle) |
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| 23:34.16 | blackjack | deb http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/security wheezy/updates main contrib non-free |
| 23:34.20 | blackjack | is that good? |
| 23:34.25 | dvs | no |
| 23:34.27 | blackjack | or should i edit something from there? |
| 23:34.33 | blackjack | the 5th line |
| 23:34.37 | themill | dpkg: tell blackjack about wheezy sources.list |
| 23:35.03 | blackjack | dvs: i thought by just deleting line 4 everthing should be ok |
| 23:35.24 | cra1g321 | line 5 i think is also wrong |
| 23:35.34 | cra1g321 | been a while since i used debian |
| 23:35.41 | dvs | Sorry, I missed the "security" part. dpkg should have sent you the correct lines |
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| 23:36.04 | blackjack | thats whats it set by default, and i remember evertying is acting up good, until the rackster server acted up badly |
| 23:36.46 | dvs | So why was it changed? |
| 23:36.55 | blackjack | dunno. racster server is down |
| 23:37.00 | blackjack | or not functioning well |
| 23:37.06 | blackjack | so i changed it to german server |
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| 23:37.12 | blackjack | coz my vps is based on germany |
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| 23:38.24 | blackjack | any idea guys? |
| 23:38.31 | themill | stop making up URLs that don't exist? |
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| 23:38.41 | cra1g321 | give me a min and i'll get you the right lines |
| 23:38.47 | blackjack | themill, why should i make up urls |
| 23:38.58 | themill | you shouldn't. you currently are. |
| 23:39.16 | dvs | cra1g321: dpkg already has |
| 23:39.20 | themill | you've already been given the correct line by dpkg. You just need to copy and paste it. |
| 23:39.24 | cra1g321 | ah |
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| 23:39.53 | blackjack | apt.rackster-server.ch |
| 23:40.01 | blackjack | this is the server thats been acting up bad |
| 23:40.05 | blackjack | so i just changed it |
| 23:40.14 | themill | Hosters may offer you their local mirror of the security repo but they won't necessarily do so with the same URL scheme as debian. |
| 23:40.35 | themill | (I'd also advise against relying on 3rd party mirrors of the security archive) |
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| 23:52.30 | yoLo_ | themill, is this what you recommend ? debian-7.6.0-ia64-netinst.iso.torrent |
| 23:52.51 | dvs | NOT IA64!!!!!!! |
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| 23:53.05 | dalias | haha |
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| 23:53.12 | dalias | ia64 is such a misleading arch name |
| 23:53.28 | dalias | debian really should use the preferred colloquial name for it, itanic :) |
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| 23:54.40 | blackjack | themill: how come the url dpkg told me are not on the url listing in https://www.debian.org/mirror/list ? |
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| 23:56.08 | blackjack | on the main most of them has ftp starting on it |
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