| 00:00.26 | deviant | So no new libc coming in 7.8 and resolver rotate option still broken? |
| 00:01.55 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: i will google it how to do it without display manager... and if i couldn't find any solutions... i'll install the lightest DM :) |
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| 00:02.09 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: thanks again :) |
| 00:03.08 | Brigo | DeaDSouL, the lightest is nodm -i think- it could make wath you want, check it it is called "no display manager" it is no really a display manager, only a workaround. |
| 00:03.22 | Panikku | DeaDSouL: If you want a light DM (if you can't find a solution), try openbox or xmonad then modify the autostart to lauch XMBC |
| 00:04.15 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: great , :) |
| 00:04.36 | DeaDSouL | Panikku: I don't want any WMs :) |
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| 00:06.05 | Camellia23 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 00:14.39 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: found one: (/etc/rc.local) ---> su -l xbmc -c startx xbmc |
| 00:14.46 | DeaDSouL | trying it now :P |
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| 00:15.08 | Brigo | quite smart :) |
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| 00:16.23 | furrywolf | more install fun... grub-install is failing miserably, because the installer is trying to install it to the usb thumbstick! wtf? |
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| 00:19.03 | Panikku | furrywolf: try installing w/o grub, boot live cd/usb, install grub with grub-install /dev/sd* |
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| 00:19.47 | furrywolf | and I can't find grub-install to try running it manually... |
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| 00:21.08 | Delf | Where do I ask questions about Jessie? |
| 00:21.11 | Panikku | furrywolf: I think Ubuntu live has it on it, I only use CrunchBang, Windows 8 (on my tab) and SqueezePop (my distro on a spare pc) |
| 00:21.24 | GJdan | Hmm, it seems you need the 343 driver for the gtx970 |
| 00:21.34 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: ok.. now it said not found /home/xbmc/.Xauth something.. and the user is not allowed to (use or start) x server... or something :P |
| 00:21.39 | GJdan | Which is in experimental :/ |
| 00:22.21 | Brigo | DeaDSouL, did you already start X with that user? |
| 00:22.30 | furrywolf | found grub-install... had to chroot to target for it to work. |
| 00:22.51 | furrywolf | how the hell is the installer being so brain-damaged as to try installing grub on the usb thumbdrive the installer is running from? |
| 00:23.12 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: in normal console... I could launch xbmc with "startx xbmc" by the user: xbmc |
| 00:23.36 | Brigo | did you have the /home/xbmc/.Xauth file? |
| 00:24.34 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: so, I thought letting the xbmc user launching it when the systemp boots (su -l xbmc -c startx xbmc) |
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| 00:25.17 | Mousey | mm, kodi |
| 00:25.53 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: I have /home/xbmc/.Xauthority but it's empty |
| 00:25.59 | Brigo | DeaDSouL, the problem could be the environment variables. When you run 'su' you lost your environment varibles (like $HOME) and then the system cannot find your configuration files. |
| 00:27.13 | Brigo | try su -l xbmc -c "startx xbmc" |
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| 00:28.14 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: trying that now |
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| 00:30.55 | DeaDSouL | Brigo: X: not authorized to run X server. Aborting |
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| 00:36.50 | Brigo | DeaDSouL, try nodm, then. I have no clues. |
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| 00:44.49 | GJdan | hm the experimental driver won't install |
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| 00:46.50 | GJdan | welp it's been fun. I'm off to more familiar territory for now :\ |
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| 00:59.08 | GJdan | oh nvm... dpkf --configure -a got it |
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| 01:02.36 | SuspiciousFart | what is the functional doifference between CTRL + D and CTRL + C ? |
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| 01:04.07 | rryoumaa | in teh shell youmean? |
| 01:04.15 | SuspiciousFart | yes |
| 01:04.16 | rryoumaa | eof vs. interrupt, typically |
| 01:04.38 | rryoumaa | interrupt is a unix signal, sigint |
| 01:04.49 | dltl | go back to original transmission codes |
| 01:05.00 | dltl | it goes back to original transmission codes |
| 01:05.14 | dltl | ^s ^q etc |
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| 01:07.40 | rryoumaa | man ascii shows them but gives them unusual these days names |
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| 01:14.56 | Panikku | how do you send file from debian in Virtualbox to a windows 8 host? |
| 01:17.00 | dltl | what is running on the windows box |
| 01:19.03 | Panikku | dltl: Windows 8.1, Virtualbox (with debian inside). It's an ASUS T100TA Tablet |
| 01:19.26 | dltl | i mean what servers? |
| 01:19.53 | dltl | setup and ftp server (on the windows box) or samba |
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| 01:20.43 | Panikku | dltl: none. I could ftp to my VPN (but it's shit slow upload from where i live) |
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| 01:21.38 | dltl | what is on the linux side? |
| 01:21.56 | dltl | sshd on linux should already be setup - just install putty on the windows |
| 01:22.10 | SuspiciousFart | sftp :D |
| 01:22.28 | SuspiciousFart | or sneakernet |
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| 01:23.39 | dltl | you got a floppy drive on both computers? ;) |
| 01:24.00 | Panikku | dltl: OK. Thanks for that, will just have to get IP and i'll putty into it |
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| 01:24.56 | dltl | filezilla on the windows box |
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| 01:44.59 | Delf | Where it says upgrade package. Do they mean upgrade packagename or is it suppose to be install packagename, when upgrading? https://wiki.debian.org/DebianExperimental |
| 01:45.39 | jordanm | Delf: install |
| 01:45.48 | SuspiciousFart | how do i update me nvida drivers without completely wrecking my system? |
| 01:45.50 | jordanm | Delf: install upgrade if there is an upgrade available |
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| 01:46.09 | jordanm | Delf: upgrade is a global thing - it's not specific to a single package |
| 01:46.26 | jordanm | SuspiciousFart: what version do you have now? |
| 01:46.35 | jordanm | SuspiciousFart: and what version of debian? |
| 01:46.35 | Delf | jordanm: I thought it was global unless specified. |
| 01:46.42 | jordanm | Delf: always global |
| 01:46.51 | SuspiciousFart | i think a default safe driver |
| 01:46.59 | Delf | jordanm: even for aptitude? |
| 01:47.02 | SuspiciousFart | how do i display that information? |
| 01:47.09 | jordanm | !tell SuspiciousFart about nvidia |
| 01:47.13 | jordanm | Delf: yes |
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| 01:48.11 | jordanm | Delf: no, i was wrong about aptitude |
| 01:48.19 | SuspiciousFart | jordanm: thanks |
| 01:48.32 | jordanm | Delf: it can take a package name, but install will still function the same as it does with apt-get as far single package upgrades |
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| 01:49.13 | SuspiciousFart | heh, how do i close a tell window in irssi? :> |
| 01:49.24 | jordanm | SuspiciousFart: /part |
| 01:49.40 | jordanm | or /window close <num> |
| 01:49.42 | Delf | jordanm: So, aptitude install package name will install if not installed and upgrade if there's an upgrade available? |
| 01:49.50 | jordanm | been a while since i used it, try the tab completion |
| 01:50.14 | abrotman | Delf: after an update, yes |
| 01:50.18 | jordanm | Delf: not available, if the candidate version is higher |
| 01:50.43 | jordanm | Delf: due to pinning there can be an upgrade "available" but is not the candidate for installation |
| 01:51.25 | SuspiciousFart | the second worked |
| 01:51.28 | Delf | I see. That makes sense, why I was unable to install the experimental fglrx-drivers. |
| 01:52.05 | Delf | I'm guessing the candidate version of the fglrx-driver is lower than the one in the experimental. |
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| 02:09.25 | Delf | Why is the package "ipx" not in Jessie? |
| 02:10.51 | dvs | judd: version ipx |
| 02:10.52 | judd | Package: ipx on i386 -- squeeze: 2.2.6-8; wheezy: 2.2.6-9 |
| 02:11.01 | dvs | ouch |
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| 02:13.23 | jordanm | Delf: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=712779 |
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| 02:17.56 | Delf | Ahh :( |
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| 02:21.09 | tortib | Hello. Does anyone know when an update will be issued to fix this? https://www.openssl.org/news/secadv_20150108.txt |
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| 02:23.29 | abrotman | tortib: jeez .. how long were they sitting on those |
| 02:24.06 | dgeary2 | trying to bring down a wireless interface to change its mode but it won't go down. any ideas why? |
| 02:24.35 | dltl | ifdown wlan0 ? |
| 02:24.57 | dltl | /13/13 |
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| 02:26.07 | VectorMan2000 | sup |
| 02:26.31 | abrotman | tortib: probably in a few days, they're moderate/low |
| 02:26.41 | tortib | alright. |
| 02:26.42 | tortib | ty |
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| 02:27.11 | abrotman | tortib: are you subscribed to the DSA stuff? |
| 02:27.29 | bootstrappm | Been wrestling for the better part of the day on getting wireless working in wheezy on a hp dv4 laptop w Intel WIFI Link 1000BGN. Installed wireless-tools wpasupplicant and all the firmwares. 'ip a' doesn't see any wireless devices. Does that mean I'm out of luck? |
| 02:27.59 | eheil | Ok guys, just a test here. |
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| 02:28.52 | dltl | does lsmod show the driver? does it need firmware? |
| 02:29.00 | dltl | bootstrappm: ^^ |
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| 02:29.24 | dgeary2 | dltl, i fear i have screwed it up badly enough that ifup/ifdown don't work to bring it up/down. have tried 'ip link set wlan0 down' and 'ifconfig wlan0 down', but they didn't work either. |
| 02:29.35 | dgeary2 | the interface was part of a batman-adv mesh |
| 02:29.57 | dgeary2 | but has been removed with: 'batctl if del wlan0' |
| 02:30.07 | dltl | is it reupping with network manager ?? |
| 02:30.24 | dgeary2 | network-manager isn't installed |
| 02:30.28 | dltl | rmmod the driver |
| 02:31.01 | dgeary2 | which driver? |
| 02:31.17 | dltl | which driver are we talking about? |
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| 02:32.21 | bootstrappm | dltl I'll check |
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| 02:34.06 | dgeary2 | dltl, rmmod and modprobe rt2800usb (is a ralink usb device), still showing as up |
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| 02:34.39 | dltl | dgeary2: that doesn't make sense - |
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| 02:34.56 | dltl | just rmmod it and the interface can not be up |
| 02:35.09 | dgeary2 | when the driver was unloaded, the interface didn't exist |
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| 02:36.49 | bootstrappm | dltl it does indeed show up in lsmod and the Internet says iwlwifi is the driver for Intel WIFI 1000BGN. |
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| 02:37.11 | bootstrappm | I've explicitly installed that as well as installing the unofficial images w all the firmwares |
| 02:37.27 | bootstrappm | Getting nothing |
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| 02:37.52 | abrotman | probably needs jessie |
| 02:38.25 | dltl | do you have the firmware installed ? firmware-iwlwifi |
| 02:38.26 | bootstrappm | Gave jessie a shot too, same issue |
| 02:38.32 | bootstrappm | Yes I do |
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| 02:38.52 | dltl | any errors in the log files? |
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| 02:39.18 | bootstrappm | I tried grepping around but I didn't see any. Any specific log file it would show up in? |
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| 02:39.37 | dltl | i have /var/log/messeges or dmesg |
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| 02:40.42 | dltl | i had to bring down the the eth0 driver before the iwlwifi driver worked - then i could bring the eth0 backup - took me a lot of debuging to figure it out |
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| 02:42.32 | bootstrappm | Nevermind no logs on wheezy but I'm getting something on jessie. Failed to load firmware with error - 2 |
| 02:42.50 | bootstrappm | How do I bring down the eth0 drive er |
| 02:42.55 | bootstrappm | ? |
| 02:43.20 | dltl | ifdown |
| 02:43.42 | dltl | check the /lib/firmare dir for the firmware |
| 02:43.46 | shellox | can you give me some feedback about this bash script please? paste.debian.net/plainh/1a19c58f |
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| 02:45.10 | dltl | there is also #bash |
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| 02:46.08 | GuidovanPossum | hi, I'm trying to do a fresh install of Jessie on a Asus z97-a MB with a usb netinst, I chose Other OS which diasabled Secure Boot and made the netinst usb Boot Option #1 |
| 02:46.44 | GuidovanPossum | but when it loads off of the usb I just get a blank screen and a flashing cursor in the upper left corner and ideas? |
| 02:47.05 | metabsd | Hi all. I have problem with my boot on Debian Unstable. I use lvm and i have to vgchange -ay each time i boot. Anyone can help me to fix that |
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| 02:47.54 | bootstrappm | Yeah the firmware is there dltl. Thanks for the help, think I'm gonna table the install for another day. Need to get some kind of environment going for dev |
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| 02:50.24 | karlpinc | GuidovanPossum: Try an install image with non-free firmware. Just a guess. |
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| 02:52.19 | karlpinc | !tell GuidovanPossum about firmware images |
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| 03:09.54 | metabsd | Hi all. I have problem with my boot on Debian Unstable. I use lvm and i have to vgchange -ay each time i boot. Anyone can help me to fix that |
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| 03:10.43 | DeaDSouL | Hi, I've added a new source to /etc/apt/sources.list .. and when i apt-get update... it says : E: The method driver /usr/lib/apt/methods/https could not be found. |
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| 03:11.01 | DeaDSouL | its https not http... any idea how to solve that ? |
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| 03:11.55 | Seylerius | Grr... Lost my connection during an apt-get upgrade, now I've reconnected and it's still sitting there. |
| 03:12.07 | Seylerius | It had been waiting for my attention when the connection was lost. |
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| 03:14.55 | Seylerius | Is there any way to get back on it? |
| 03:15.55 | DeaDSouL | guys ? |
| 03:18.07 | furrywolf | since debian-installer's grub install was broken, I installed grub manually. however, d-i seems to have removed grub afterwards?! wtf? I have grub in the mbr, but no config, or anything else related to it... |
| 03:18.40 | furrywolf | I can get the kernel to load from the grub command line, but I can't seem to make it load whatever module it needs to mount the root fs. |
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| 03:19.58 | DeaDSouL | ok, it should be fixed by : aptitude install apt-transport-https ... but the problem now that it says 'untrusted version of package' ... wth ?? |
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| 03:21.34 | furrywolf | I'm used to debian Just Working. how the hell did the installer get broken this badly? |
| 03:22.14 | abrotman | which installer? |
| 03:22.16 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, which version of the installer are you using? |
| 03:22.30 | furrywolf | the latest stable mini.iso |
| 03:22.37 | furrywolf | as of two weeks ago or so, at least. |
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| 03:22.45 | abrotman | it wouldn't have changed |
| 03:22.55 | DeaDSouL | guys... is it ok to install untrusted version of apt-transport-https ?? |
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| 03:23.35 | DeaDSouL | from the main default repos ? |
| 03:24.17 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, also 1. is your /boot directory on a separate partition? 2. If not, (i.e. it's on the same partition as your root filesystem), what filesystem is it? Is it part of a RAID setup? |
| 03:25.29 | ArtVandalae | DeaDSouL, if it's from Debian's main repos, why would it be untrusted? Maybe try an apt update/upgrade before trying to install apt-transport-https |
| 03:25.33 | furrywolf | art: the problem is d-i is broken. it tried installing grub to the usb key I was using for the install. since that obviously didn't work, I chrooted to /target and ran grub-install manually with the correct device. but it seems d-i then purged grub when I selected "continue without bootloader", as that was the only option it would let me do... |
| 03:26.21 | furrywolf | yay, got it to boot! I was specifying the wrong root= format. |
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| 03:27.39 | ArtVandalae | In the future, don't blame the tool, unless you're absolutely certain it's the tool, and not a user error. |
| 03:27.44 | DeaDSouL | ArtVandalae: idk... is it because I've added the "contrib non-free" to the main repos ? |
| 03:28.05 | furrywolf | artv: when did I blame grub? I blamed d-i, which I'm quite sure is broken. |
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| 03:29.14 | furrywolf | d-i insisted on grub-install /dev/sda, which was the usb key, while /dev/sdb is the hard drive. it didn't give me any option to specify anything else. manually running grub-install /dev/sdb put it on the right drive, but d-i, probably when I selected the only option that would continue the install, continue without bootloader, removed important bits. |
| 03:29.38 | furrywolf | the only reason I'm typing a root= option is grub is half installed, with no config file. |
| 03:29.46 | hikenboot | hi! can anyone tell me is there an easy way to tell online if CONFIG_LDM_PARTITION is enabled for Debian Jessie as a kernel option? |
| 03:29.58 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, I'm not sure about d-i for Wheezy/7, but I know d-i for Jessie/8 asks you which disk/partition to install Grub to |
| 03:30.21 | furrywolf | it only asked me if I wanted to install it in the mbr. |
| 03:30.25 | DeaDSouL | ArtVandalae: coudl it be the reason ? |
| 03:30.27 | furrywolf | I've never installed jessie. |
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| 03:31.41 | abrotman | hikenboot: grep |
| 03:31.57 | ArtVandalae | DeaDSouL, apt-get update first. To "refresh" your local knowledge of repos/packages, then try again. I think it shouldn't matter, because I imagine apt-transport-https is in main. |
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| 03:34.29 | hikenboot | yes. I know i can do that I just thought that there might be a list online on debians website that might list the options that are enabled...no problem I will download jessie live cd and check |
| 03:34.38 | DeaDSouL | ArtVandalae: that's odd... now it works fine :/ |
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| 03:34.58 | furrywolf | so now that I can boot it manually... how do I get a working grub.cfg etc without writing one by hand? any way to re-run whatever generates it? |
| 03:35.02 | abrotman | dpkg: tell hikenboot about kernel config |
| 03:35.10 | abrotman | furrywolf: update-grub ? |
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| 03:35.18 | abrotman | hikenboot: not sure if that website still exists |
| 03:35.23 | abrotman | hikenboot: or ask me :) |
| 03:35.30 | irssii | Hello I am trying to find out how many session as root is in progress, I try with who, but it's not working, would you have any idea? thx |
| 03:35.41 | abrotman | $ grep CONFIG_LDM_PARTITION /boot/config-3.16.0-4-686-pae |
| 03:35.41 | abrotman | CONFIG_LDM_PARTITION=y |
| 03:35.43 | furrywolf | yay, that says generating grub.cfg :) |
| 03:35.44 | abrotman | hikenboot: ^^ |
| 03:35.51 | ArtVandalae | irssii, ``users'' command |
| 03:35.54 | hikenboot | thanks abrotman |
| 03:37.12 | furrywolf | yay! now it boots automatically. |
| 03:37.48 | irssii | I see no connection, even with the "users" command. (I'm Connect with sudo su) ArtVandalae |
| 03:38.08 | furrywolf | http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=102889 looks like other people have had this issue, and bugs filed.... I'd rate this bug as absolutely critical and requiring an immediate patch. "non-expert users unable to install" is not ok. |
| 03:38.12 | ArtVandalae | irssii, are you sure root is logged in? |
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| 03:39.10 | irssii | yes, it is same with him that I run the command and no "root" in the list |
| 03:40.16 | ArtVandalae | irssii, first, are you certain that you're logged into the same host? Second, what way is root logged in (e.g. sitting in front of the computer, over SSH, etc)? |
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| 03:41.28 | ArtVandalae | ah, I just saw your 'sudo' comment. run: 'ps aux | grep -i sudo' <--- which users are running sudo (most likely running as root) |
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| 03:42.20 | irssii | thank you very much! |
| 03:42.45 | furrywolf | ok, next question. I can't afford to download .debs more than once. can I copy the contents of /var/cache/apt/archives between boxes, and it'll think it already downloaded them, and not do so again? |
| 03:43.11 | GuidovanPossum | tried the net install image with non-free firmware for Jessie, but still got a blank screen and flashing cursor again, I'll try and see if I can find anything else out |
| 03:43.57 | ArtVandalae | GuidovanPossum, I've had that. Check terminal 4 (Ctrl+Alt+F4), it's very likely that DHCP is stuck in a loop (an known bug) |
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| 03:44.38 | furrywolf | and, do you have to write a complete config for wpa_supplicant to use it? surely there's a command-line way to set it up? |
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| 03:44.52 | GuidovanPossum | tried that no luck yet |
| 03:45.00 | maher | furrywolf: yes |
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| 03:46.04 | ArtVandalae | GuidovanPossum, can you switch terminals at all? |
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| 03:46.37 | abrotman | dpkg: tell furrywolf about approx |
| 03:46.39 | abrotman | dpkg: tell furrywolf about apt-zip |
| 03:46.45 | abrotman | dpkg: tell furrywolf about apt-zip |
| 03:46.55 | GuidovanPossum | nope can't get anything besides a blank screen and flashing cursor so far |
| 03:46.57 | irssii | (but the command is not very reliable, if we run the command "sudo su". During the time that tappe password, the command "ps aux | grep -i sudo | grep -v grep | wc -l" indicates 1, while the root connection is not established.) |
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| 03:49.37 | ArtVandalae | irssii, if that's a case, have a look in /var/log/auth.log <--- you might have to write a script to show sudo open/close sessions. |
| 03:50.48 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, your /var/cache/apt/archives solution should work. |
| 03:51.20 | irssii | i hope that there is a cleaner solution than that, but that's what I'll do I think, thank you again |
| 03:51.22 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, as for wpa_supplicant: is this a server/non-gui machine? |
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| 03:52.37 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, unfortunately Wheezy ships with an old version of networkmanager (0.9.4, I think). Jessie ships with 0.9.10 which offers a cli and curses interface see: http://blogs.gnome.org/dcbw/2014/06/20/well-build-a-dream-house-of-net/ |
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| 03:53.04 | abrotman | judd: versions network-manager |
| 03:53.06 | judd | Package: network-manager on i386 -- squeeze: 0.8.1-6+squeeze2; squeeze-backports: 0.8.4.0-2~bpo60+1; wheezy: 0.9.4.0-10; sid: 0.9.10.0-5; jessie: 0.9.10.0-5 |
| 03:53.13 | abrotman | nope, no backport, oh well |
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| 03:54.15 | furrywolf | grrr. it won't associate with the ap. I know it works bloody fine, since the installer set it up and used it. |
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| 03:55.43 | furrywolf | I hopefully do not have network-manager installed. n-m is an evil entity that breaks networking, and should absolutely not be installed unless explicitly requested by the user. I wasted way too much time on a box where I found it had been installed automatically, but no front-end to control it had been installed... and it was happily sitting there resetting interfaces as you tried to configure them! |
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| 03:57.24 | DeaDSouL | how to remove the downloaded packages ? |
| 03:57.34 | Drakken | apt-get clean |
| 03:57.42 | Drakken | and or apt-get auto remove |
| 03:57.58 | DeaDSouL | aptitude autoclean ... apt-get autoclean && apt-get autoremove .. didn't work |
| 03:58.00 | furrywolf | art: no, but due to bandwidth limitations, I haven't installed anything on it other than what tasksel did for the laptop and standard utils options. |
| 03:58.00 | DeaDSouL | ok thanks |
| 03:58.20 | furrywolf | I got wpa_supplicant to connect... it just failed the first 20 times it tried. no idea why. |
| 03:58.31 | Drakken | maybe run an apt-get -f first then make sure there are not any broken packages |
| 03:58.43 | furrywolf | I'm hoping to install the rest of the software using as many of the debs still left on this box as I can. |
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| 04:00.27 | furrywolf | if n-m is installed, and it gets dragged in in some cases without installing any frontend that talks to it, networking is broken. it runs in the background, and every few seconds clobbers the interfaces with useless/random settings. so if you ifconfig an interface, it works for a few seconds... then stops. if you install a wifi manager, it works for a few seconds... then stops. etc. absolutely evil software. |
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| 04:01.02 | furrywolf | it should only be installed if you request it, and with at least one frontend, and should only manage interfaces it's explicitly told to manage, not every interface on the system. |
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| 04:04.20 | furrywolf | how far off is jessie, anyway? maybe I should just wipe this install, go to town and find some wifi to use, and install it... save me having to upgrade everything later when it's released. |
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| 04:05.44 | ArtVandalae | furrywolf, there's no firm release date. I'd guess ~2 months. Pure speculation on my part |
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| 04:07.05 | furrywolf | and, while I'm asking... any suggestions for a window manager that scales properly with dpi settings? I really like icewm, but at 1920x1200 on a 15" lcd... |
| 04:07.19 | furrywolf | I also like to be able to read menus. :) |
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| 04:09.01 | ArtVandalae | GNOME is putting in serious work, to get its desktop working well across high PPI setups |
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| 04:10.03 | furrywolf | I won't comment on my opinion of gnome and kde. it will piss people off and start a discussion I'm not in the mood for. heh. |
| 04:10.30 | furrywolf | is too tired for flamewars |
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| 04:10.49 | dvs | !start a de war |
| 04:10.49 | dpkg | Xfce makes me vomit! |
| 04:11.22 | furrywolf | lol |
| 04:14.14 | furrywolf | I like simple. I do not want large icons. I do not want ani animation, fades, or other effects in any way, shape, or form. I do not want an interface that ever gets in my way for any reason. |
| 04:14.19 | furrywolf | s/ani/any |
| 04:14.46 | furrywolf | icewm is simple, fast, and makes me happy. :) |
| 04:15.33 | maher | i'm having problems building evince on jessie - dpkg-buildpackage complains about packages that don't seem to exist.... |
| 04:15.41 | furrywolf | if there's ever a choice between text and an icon, text should be the default. |
| 04:18.13 | shellox | I have the following script: http://paste.debian.net/plain/139848 It's working fine, however i can't understand how debian knows to execute /etc/update-motd.d/00-main on login? |
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| 04:21.21 | furrywolf | pam_motd |
| 04:22.34 | shellox | furrywolf: where can i read more about that? |
| 04:24.15 | iWaldo | furrywolf: any opinion on openbox? |
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| 04:24.39 | furrywolf | googles |
| 04:24.40 | furrywolf | http://man.he.net/man5/update-motd |
| 04:25.05 | furrywolf | iwaldo: haven't tried it |
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| 04:25.13 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i think you'd love it |
| 04:25.17 | rommel092079 | may i ask what is the default file system of debian? |
| 04:25.50 | furrywolf | rommel: ext4 |
| 04:26.14 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i use the crunchbang distribution of debian, primarily because it has an awesome openbox/tint defualt configuration |
| 04:26.48 | rommel092079 | thanks furrywold |
| 04:26.50 | rommel092079 | thanks furrywolf |
| 04:27.11 | iWaldo | in any case, does anybody here know if debian's version of chromium connects to google to send information back to them? |
| 04:27.30 | iWaldo | according to google, this decision is left up to whoever packages chromium |
| 04:27.36 | shay_shay | iWaldo: crunchbang is not debian, just as ubuntu is not debian |
| 04:27.37 | furrywolf | no clue. I'd avoid using any google product or service if you care about privacy. |
| 04:27.45 | shellox | furrywolf: this man page is from ubuntu tho right. I couldn't find anything like that for debian |
| 04:28.04 | furrywolf | shellox: I didn't even know it worked on debian, so... :P |
| 04:28.18 | iWaldo | shay_shay: i know, but it uses purely debian repos for everything besides config files and #! setup scripts |
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| 04:28.30 | furrywolf | it could well have been sent upstream from ubuntu and then included in debian |
| 04:28.46 | iWaldo | shay_shay: ubuntu is so far away from debian that i don't recognize it |
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| 04:29.09 | shellox | furrywolf: i looked into ubuntu 14.04 and just tried to create it on debian |
| 04:29.12 | rommel092079 | furrywolf: where can i read that ext4 is the default file system of debian? |
| 04:29.14 | shellox | i didn't install anything or so |
| 04:29.35 | furrywolf | rommel: dunno where you can read it.... I just know that when you create a partition, that's the default type. |
| 04:29.36 | shellox | just renamed /etc/motd and made a new symlink from /etc/motd to /var/run/motd haha |
| 04:29.49 | shay_shay | ?crunchbang |
| 04:30.01 | shay_shay | how to get the factoid , lol |
| 04:30.13 | rommel092079 | i see. |
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| 04:30.26 | iWaldo | shay_shay: #! just tweaks the desktop environment in a way that is pretty much what i would do to a vanilla debian install. i think the fact that #! is maintained by a single person is why i like it so much... on developer made a perfect OS for his use (no bickering/factions) |
| 04:30.32 | iWaldo | i guess i share his taste |
| 04:30.39 | iWaldo | so i like his repackaging of debian |
| 04:30.54 | shay_shay | dpkg tell iwaldo about crunchbang |
| 04:31.46 | shay_shay | dpkg temm me about based on debian |
| 04:31.46 | dpkg | wish i knew, shay_shay |
| 04:31.52 | shay_shay | dpkg tell me about based on debian |
| 04:32.47 | iWaldo | shay_shay: i could be wrong, but i think #! is just some configs and scripts to tailor debian for openbox |
| 04:32.50 | shay_shay | huh, well,. |
| 04:32.54 | iWaldo | if i'm wrong i'd love to know |
| 04:33.07 | danlamanna | yeah, plus their own repos for nonfree stuff. |
| 04:33.14 | iWaldo | considering i'm here to ask about debian's chromium privacy |
| 04:33.23 | furrywolf | hasn't tried lxde in a while, should try it |
| 04:33.30 | furrywolf | I really wish I had a useful internet connection. |
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| 04:34.03 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i know the feeling, using satellite right now |
| 04:34.39 | furrywolf | you have only slightly higher latency, and much much higher bandwidth. unless it's globalstar, in which case you have much lower latency and not much worse bandwidth... |
| 04:34.54 | iWaldo | the latency is the killer |
| 04:35.01 | iWaldo | unless i'm connecting to udp |
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| 04:35.08 | iWaldo | which i dont think i ever am |
| 04:35.14 | iWaldo | but tcp waits for confirms |
| 04:35.25 | furrywolf | so you're on geo not leo, then... which means slightly higher latency than my connection, but much much higher bandwidth. |
| 04:35.39 | iWaldo | and high latency turns that into a bandwidth killer |
| 04:35.53 | iWaldo | the bandwidth they advertise might be theoretically true |
| 04:36.08 | iWaldo | but when i have to constantly confirm reception of packets... the latency kills bandwidth |
| 04:36.26 | iWaldo | danlamanna: thanks fer the info |
| 04:36.49 | iWaldo | danlamanna: do you know if #! does anything besides script/config/nonfree? |
| 04:36.50 | furrywolf | actually, my latency isn't that horrid tonight... it's under 1s! rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 141.115/554.689/732.402/225.232 ms |
| 04:37.19 | danlamanna | iWaldo: don't think so. there's a set of bash scripts somewhere on github that takes a debian install and makes it a CB install |
| 04:37.25 | furrywolf | iwaldo: there's a bunch of tcp tuning you can do for satellite, but I don't offhand remember any of it... been a while since I've dealt with satellite. you might google for the right tcp tweaks. |
| 04:37.49 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i'll check into it |
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| 04:38.03 | iWaldo | furrywolf: thanks for the info, i didn't even know that this was a possibility |
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| 04:38.17 | furrywolf | if you use windows, the satellite providers generally include a program that tweaks the windows settings... |
| 04:38.30 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i might not actually do it, considering i may move to an area with fiber soon |
| 04:38.41 | iWaldo | but i'm glad to know that tcp tweaking is possible in the fist place |
| 04:39.07 | iWaldo | haven't used windows for anything beyond a steambox in years |
| 04:39.11 | furrywolf | I'm on virgin mobile 3g, which is about as bad as satellite... |
| 04:39.39 | furrywolf | my not-too-horrid-tonight pings, as you saw, averaged 554ms... and I'm happy when I get 20K/sec. |
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| 04:39.51 | iWaldo | i suppose there's a lot more competition for the bandwidth on 3g |
| 04:39.55 | iWaldo | plus it's 3g |
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| 04:40.19 | iWaldo | in any case, i think you'd really like #!, though i don't want to steer you away from vanilla debian on #debian |
| 04:40.25 | furrywolf | latency and bandwidth are better in the middle of the night... but that's when I'm asleep. heh. |
| 04:40.53 | furrywolf | also, I pay $55/month for this piss-poor performance, with a 5GB data cap... |
| 04:41.01 | iWaldo | aw damn |
| 04:41.21 | iWaldo | friend of mine just got 30GB/month for just over what you're paying |
| 04:41.24 | iWaldo | on 4G |
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| 04:41.50 | iWaldo | he can pull 10Mb/s from anywhere that isn't a boondock |
| 04:41.56 | furrywolf | no 4g here. sprint claims to have 4g on their coverage map, but talking to local people, including the sales reps, says it doesn't actually exist. |
| 04:42.13 | furrywolf | I suspect I'm not the only one here in a boondock, since you're on satellite. :P |
| 04:42.24 | iWaldo | :P |
| 04:42.43 | iWaldo | less than a mile from legit high bandwidth connection |
| 04:42.44 | kj4 | furrywolf: +1 for #! worth a look |
| 04:42.44 | furrywolf | I went in there to ask about a 4g hotspot, and the girl told me she has no idea why their coverage map shows it, but we have no 4g. |
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| 04:43.28 | iWaldo | kj4: am i wrong when i support #! in a debian channel? i swear it's just debian with an awesome openbox interface |
| 04:43.41 | furrywolf | kj4: if it's just slight tweaks to debian, using the standard repos, can't I install exactly the same desktop on debian? heh |
| 04:44.07 | kj4 | iWaldo: agreed- it's probably not kosher, but I had to pipe up : ) |
| 04:44.09 | iWaldo | i'd be using freeBSD if only it had better driver support. as far as linux goes debian is my flavor, and #! does a lot of the work for me |
| 04:44.30 | iWaldo | furrywolf: you can, but the work has been done! |
| 04:44.36 | kj4 | furrywolf: sure, you could install openbox on debian and then spend a day tweaking it like #! |
| 04:44.46 | iWaldo | perhaps more than a day |
| 04:44.52 | iWaldo | depending on free time constraints |
| 04:45.12 | kj4 | furrywolf: it's just very well sorted, it's the closest thing to a distro I don't have to customize at all... |
| 04:45.27 | iWaldo | that's the way i'd state it, kj4 |
| 04:45.38 | iWaldo | and it isn't even ripping on debian to say so |
| 04:45.56 | iWaldo | it's too specific for a project as large as debian to cater to |
| 04:46.08 | kj4 | iWaldo: agreed. |
| 04:46.09 | iWaldo | my only fear is that corenominal decides to stop making #1 |
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| 04:46.25 | kj4 | iWaldo: yeah, that would really suck. |
| 04:46.35 | iWaldo | in the event that he does, it'd be awesome if the debian team picked up the slakc |
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| 04:46.48 | iWaldo | and let a SINGLE developer tailor the distro |
| 04:47.05 | iWaldo | i'm convinced that the reason i like it so much is the fact that it is made by ONE person |
| 04:47.20 | iWaldo | i change a few things, but his overall vision is great |
| 04:47.32 | iWaldo | and that can't be replicated by a team of people |
| 04:47.33 | kj4 | iWaldo: you are probably right. and yep, same for me |
| 04:48.04 | kj4 | iWaldo: we're going to get thrown out of here any minute now lol |
| 04:48.19 | iWaldo | the only thing i'd change about #! is already a popular change, and that is simply including fewer default programs |
| 04:49.30 | iWaldo | kj4: i dunno, debian devs can't be TOO upset over the success of #!... after all it is pretty much pure debian (even gives this option to pass on nonfree), but it gives a configuration |
| 04:49.44 | iWaldo | #! made me into a diehard debian fan |
| 04:49.58 | iWaldo | so if anything it helps its parent distro |
| 04:50.45 | kj4 | iWaldo: agreed |
| 04:51.25 | iWaldo | ok, last time i'll pester regarding this |
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| 04:51.51 | iWaldo | does anybody know if debian's chromium package reports back to google? |
| 04:53.40 | srg | dpkg: sound |
| 04:53.40 | dpkg | Ask me about <alsa>, <alsa checklist>. See also <default alsa>, <pulseaudio>. |
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| 04:56.03 | iWaldo | dpkg: alsa |
| 04:56.03 | dpkg | Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) is a Linux kernel component providing device drivers for sound cards. Ask me about <install alsa>. See also <alsa-checklist>, <default alsa>, <alsa firmware>. http://wiki.debian.org/ALSA http://www.alsa-project.org/ #alsa on irc.freenode.net. |
| 04:56.42 | iWaldo | is there any consensus in #deb on the int vs system.d thing? |
| 04:56.42 | hassoon_flies | dpkg: virtual-box-gyuest-additions |
| 04:56.43 | dpkg | hassoon_flies: no idea |
| 04:56.46 | hassoon_flies | bah |
| 04:56.55 | jaggzt | drwxrwxr-x 4 root utmp 80 Jan 2 00:09 /var/run/screen screen says this must be 777 .. but I didn't change this |
| 04:56.58 | hassoon_flies | dpkg: virtual-box-guest-additions |
| 04:56.58 | dpkg | hassoon_flies: are you using Windows? |
| 04:57.04 | jaggzt | I recently accidentally did chown -R jaggz / |
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| 04:57.15 | jaggzt | but I don't know why my var/run/screen would break |
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| 04:58.32 | furrywolf | grrr. this laptop debian install might have to wait. the keyboard seems to have issues. |
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| 04:59.08 | furrywolf | all the keys work, but the upper right quarter of the board has to be pushed abnormally hard. |
| 05:00.05 | iWaldo | sounds like a hardware issue |
| 05:00.27 | furrywolf | no, debian caused the keys to stick! it's all debian's fault! :P |
| 05:00.51 | iWaldo | well... better try #! |
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| 05:04.38 | shay_shay | iwaldo systemd pwns and everyone knows it |
| 05:04.50 | shay_shay | some retrogrouches are being retrogrouchy |
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| 05:06.05 | shay_shay | they are the minority, but by the way they shout about it to the ends of the earth you would think they were the majority. dont be fooled |
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| 05:10.17 | furrywolf | damnit. the box I wanted to copy the .debs from is amd64, while the new one seems to be i386... hrmm, it probably should be amd64! |
| 05:10.26 | iWaldo | shay_shay: so is it untrue that systemd violates the whole "unix philosophy" thing? |
| 05:13.00 | furrywolf | a core2duo should be amd64, right? |
| 05:13.48 | iWaldo | yessir |
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| 05:14.11 | furrywolf | which means I grabbed the iso image for my other laptop when I installed this one. bleh. |
| 05:14.15 | shay_shay | iWaldo: of course thats just nonsense. see #10 ---> http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/the-biggest-myths.html |
| 05:15.32 | iWaldo | shay_shay: thanks for the link. my skepticism kicked in as soon as i read "we proposed systemd", but i'll read it in any case |
| 05:16.53 | iWaldo | shay_shay: for example, i do not wish to turn off a bunch of features in order to keep it minimally intrusive, re: #18 |
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| 05:17.07 | iWaldo | why are they on in the first place? |
| 05:17.36 | shay_shay | iWaldo: its up to the distros to decide what will be in it |
| 05:17.44 | furrywolf | I disagree with most of that. lol |
| 05:17.45 | iWaldo | everything will begin as "optional", but if it is convenient enough for the distros will all include it |
| 05:17.54 | iWaldo | and as long as they aren't stallman himself |
| 05:17.57 | furrywolf | non-portable is bad. that's not just a myth. |
| 05:18.11 | iWaldo | they'll use convenient things to their users' detriment |
| 05:18.22 | iWaldo | i guess i don't like it |
| 05:18.28 | iWaldo | though i'm pretty ignorant |
| 05:18.33 | shay_shay | you've never even used it. |
| 05:18.34 | iWaldo | smacks of windows to me |
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| 05:18.39 | furrywolf | doesn't think all those things should be combined into one, ever. |
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| 05:19.24 | shay_shay | how can you form an opinion on it just by reading some propaganda and not trying it yourself? |
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| 05:21.00 | furrywolf | I've never been stabbed in the eye with flying shrapnel from my milling machine, but I read all the propaganda, and wear safety glasses anyway. |
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| 05:21.21 | shay_shay | lol, my mill has a door. |
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| 05:22.18 | furrywolf | I agree the current init system could be improved upon greatly. I do not thing systemd is that improvement. |
| 05:22.24 | furrywolf | think |
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| 05:22.54 | shay_shay | well, you're wrong. its here to stay. |
| 05:23.17 | furrywolf | it doesn't just replace init, which would be a good thing... it also replaces a few dozen (or more) other things that are not interrelated, should not be combined, and should function just fine no matter what os they run on. |
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| 05:24.42 | iWaldo | see my earlier comment on unix phlosophy |
| 05:24.49 | iWaldo | and even philosophy |
| 05:25.16 | furrywolf | hopes that by the time it has enough functionality to even remotely consider including in any real distribution, people realize it's a huge bloated mess |
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| 05:26.02 | iWaldo | i'm looking through some of the "pros" in adapting systemd |
| 05:26.13 | iWaldo | they're marketing speech |
| 05:26.27 | iWaldo | "Better integration with Gnome for interoperability." |
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| 05:27.05 | iWaldo | why do i need initialization process to be integrated with gnome? i don't use gnome |
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| 05:27.47 | iWaldo | "Concurrent and parallel processing at boot." booting takes less than 10 seconds on my 8 year old T400 |
| 05:28.11 | iWaldo | "Track process using kernels cgroup and not PID." is PID a bad thing? |
| 05:28.33 | furrywolf | tracking using pid is mildly annoying for things that fork a lot, but not hugely so. |
| 05:28.34 | iWaldo | "Logs are stored in binary file." admittedly nice |
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| 05:29.02 | DrakkenWarr | do you have the t400 or hte t400s iWaldo |
| 05:29.08 | iWaldo | T400 |
| 05:29.35 | DrakkenWarr | boot time on my 400s is around 12 seconds ish.. so wanted to clarify, thanks |
| 05:29.35 | furrywolf | systemd has always smelled to me like someone's pet project, that despite being open-source, will exist only to serve some exact specific task the main devs want... in this case, idiot-friendly gnome installs. |
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| 05:30.15 | DrakkenWarr | that is what I thought at first as well furrywolfl, but it seems to not be the case |
| 05:30.16 | iWaldo | i've read criticism of the lead dev |
| 05:30.20 | DrakkenWarr | with the way things are changing |
| 05:30.20 | furrywolf | also note the dev's opinions on everyone who disagrees with him in any way, even when they're perfectly valid concerns. |
| 05:31.13 | furrywolf | it might as well be gsystemd. heh. |
| 05:31.59 | DrakkenWarr | fair enough, but it is what it is furrywolf, and it is being adopted as the main stream |
| 05:32.12 | iWaldo | in the case that systemd IS the way to go, conceptually, i still don't think i'd support something created by somebody like the developer is supposed to be being in charge of a huge chunk of the linux world |
| 05:32.37 | iWaldo | even linus dislikes him |
| 05:32.47 | DrakkenWarr | and that is a bone of contention with a lot in the open source world.. I will give you that |
| 05:32.49 | iWaldo | and linus isn;t exactly mr cupcake sunshine |
| 05:33.00 | DrakkenWarr | lulz, no he is not.. |
| 05:33.26 | furrywolf | I suspect that for consumer-only users, they'll like it just fine, which may slightly improve adoption of linux, which is a good thing. I don't think it's good for the long-term health of linux. too much focus on a single core developer with serious attitude issues, massive huge bloat, combining things that shouldn't be combined, completely and totally non-portable,... |
| 05:33.28 | iWaldo | so if competent asshole A calls competent asshole B an asshole |
| 05:33.40 | iWaldo | how big of an asshole must competent asshole B be? |
| 05:33.42 | furrywolf | drakken: says who? so far I've never seen it actually installed. |
| 05:34.32 | DrakkenWarr | systemd? Really? I am using it now |
| 05:34.38 | furrywolf | there's no reason the same blob should handle logins, networking, init, task scheduling, etc, etc, etc. |
| 05:35.00 | iWaldo | i agree with furrywolf on this |
| 05:35.08 | DrakkenWarr | And I can see that argument |
| 05:35.24 | iWaldo | the argument as merit beyond technicality |
| 05:35.35 | peterrooney | furrywolf: what would be adopted bears little resemblance to traditional linux. It would be more GNOME/Linux than GNU/Linux. |
| 05:35.47 | iWaldo | what if 95% of distributions adopt the monolithic systemd... and it turns out to be a bust |
| 05:35.52 | iWaldo | 10 years down the road |
| 05:36.06 | furrywolf | I also especially think every single one of those functions should be entirely portable to other kernels, or even very different platforms. |
| 05:36.08 | iWaldo | it destroys linux's "success by chaos" model |
| 05:36.13 | peterrooney | iWaldo: you mean 10 weeks ago |
| 05:36.36 | iWaldo | peterrooney: i think debian 8 will ship with init |
| 05:36.42 | aypea[1] | chaos has corner cases. ;) |
| 05:36.52 | furrywolf | fragmenting the *nix world is a very bad idea, and hurts all systems. |
| 05:36.55 | iWaldo | and if i didn't want chaos i'd use BSD |
| 05:36.57 | peterrooney | iWaldo: it shall not. that ship has sailed. |
| 05:37.21 | iWaldo | peterrooney then i guess so shall i |
| 05:37.23 | furrywolf | ... debian 8 has systemd? |
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| 05:37.47 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i thought it had options for either systemd or init |
| 05:37.58 | iWaldo | but our friend peterrooney informs me that it is only systemd |
| 05:38.01 | iWaldo | so i dunno anymore |
| 05:38.08 | DrakkenWarr | the sad fact is this: If you want to make money with linux on the main stream? You better be familiar with systemd |
| 05:38.13 | furrywolf | I guess I should have paid more attention, then. maybe I will try whatever the dist is iwaldo keeps suggesting. heh. |
| 05:38.34 | peterrooney | go look at the debian-devel mailing list. it became a freakishly impolite place in November and December. |
| 05:38.37 | iWaldo | furrywolf: don't bother, #! is debian as far as mostly anyhting matters |
| 05:38.47 | iWaldo | petterrooney i was keeping tabs |
| 05:38.53 | iWaldo | peterrooney( |
| 05:38.55 | iWaldo | ** |
| 05:39.01 | DrakkenWarr | #! users since 2008 here :D |
| 05:39.20 | iWaldo | no wonder your name is familiar |
| 05:39.21 | bootstrappm | So elementaryOS detected my wifi fine. Will have to see what it's doing behind the scenes and see if I can reproduce it in debian |
| 05:39.24 | furrywolf | drakken: if I wanted to make money, I wouldn't work on open-source software. I work on open-source software to benefit the community. I'm not going to work on things that do not benefit it. |
| 05:39.27 | DrakkenWarr | slacker from 1998 to 2008 |
| 05:39.29 | iWaldo | i started ~2009 or 2010 |
| 05:39.46 | peterrooney | a major point that was raised and left unchallenged is that there's no documented method to switch between init systems, but "So what." |
| 05:39.47 | iWaldo | used ubuntu since most of the CS labs at my university did |
| 05:40.05 | furrywolf | bootstrap: I don't know what your original question was, but debian doesn't include firmware for a lot of wifi cards that other distributions might, which can cause doesn't-work-on-debian issues. |
| 05:40.12 | iWaldo | but when it took a sharp turn away from debian i decided to find another debian based distro |
| 05:40.16 | iWaldo | #! ever since |
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| 05:40.28 | peterrooney | iWaldo: crunchband is not debian. period. |
| 05:40.32 | peterrooney | !based on debian |
| 05:40.32 | shay_shay | iWaldo: this is a debian support channel |
| 05:40.32 | dpkg | Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare http://futurist.se/gldt/). #debian only supports Debian and pure <blend>s; please respect our choice to volunteer here to help Debian users. Support for other distributions is off-topic on #debian, even if your own distro's channel is clueless or non-existent. |
| 05:40.38 | iWaldo | peterrooney: mmk |
| 05:40.56 | furrywolf | I know! we can remove all DEs and WMs other than gnome! most people won't have a problem with that at all! |
| 05:41.14 | DrakkenWarr | noted dkpg |
| 05:41.20 | shay_shay | furrywolf: what are you talking about, I dont have gnome on my system and i am using systemd |
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| 05:41.34 | shay_shay | it doesnt force you to use gnome |
| 05:41.40 | peterrooney | furrywolf: I would not recommend e16 (my favourite wm) to anyone as their first window manager. |
| 05:41.47 | bootstrappm | Yeah I jumped through all the hoops to see if I could get it to work on debian but no dice. That includes unofficial images w non free firmware, downloading specific packages, etc. |
| 05:41.49 | DrakkenWarr | what dm/wm are you using shay_shay |
| 05:41.59 | shay_shay | kde on jessie |
| 05:42.12 | bootstrappm | Thanks though furrywolf |
| 05:42.16 | DrakkenWarr | aye peterrooney e16 or 17 is not for the begginer |
| 05:42.28 | furrywolf | I'm referring to the attitude that systemd seems to go with... let's pick one piece of bloat and tell everyone they get to use it. |
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| 05:43.05 | furrywolf | bootstrap: what wireless card? |
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| 05:45.51 | furrywolf | I've used debian since my 386 wasn't outdated... I guess it's time to rethink that. but, before rethinking, sleep. bbl. |
| 05:46.15 | Rusty1 | is it that one cannot remove systemd from debian? and live with the limited desktop apps that depend upom it? |
| 05:46.23 | iWaldo | gnight furrywolf |
| 05:46.28 | shay_shay | no, you CAN remove systemd |
| 05:46.57 | shay_shay | as long as you dont use gnome. but if you must use gnome then funtoo has a solution for you |
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| 05:47.26 | Rusty1 | i seem to have, not pretty but pretty functional desktop ,razorqt, xfe dot dot dot |
| 05:47.41 | peterrooney | Rusty1: it can be removed, but it is not straightforward. |
| 05:47.46 | furrywolf | I don't like gnome, or anything to do with gnome. heh. |
| 05:48.33 | furrywolf | gnome (and kde) are both over-sized bloatware, trying to combine all sorts of things together... your window manager shouldn't also manage networking, etc. many of the same problems as systemd.... |
| 05:48.37 | peterrooney | and, as near as I can tell from the -devel mailing list, loaded with bug opportunities. |
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| 05:49.05 | shay_shay | window manager doesnt manage networking, lol |
| 05:49.17 | VectorMan2000 | sup |
| 05:49.21 | shay_shay | thats network manager, and it's indepependent from xorg |
| 05:49.58 | furrywolf | shay: except networkmanager ONLY has interfaces for DEs, with no command-line control, and if installed without those managers, breaks networking until it is removed. |
| 05:49.59 | Rusty1 | peterrooney: a systemd-less debian is more vulnerable, or did i misunderstand? |
| 05:50.21 | shay_shay | furrywolf: wrong, network manager has command line and ncurses interfaces |
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| 05:50.25 | iWaldo | shay_shay: systemd handles networking... opinion on that |
| 05:50.41 | furrywolf | and anyway, systemd will be replacing networkmanager soon enough. |
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| 05:51.33 | furrywolf | systemd already does dhcp, right? I bet they'll roll wpa into it too... |
| 05:51.35 | iWaldo | from what i understand of the *nix philosophy... "do one thing and do it well" does not include being both the root process AND the networking process |
| 05:51.53 | iWaldo | though, to be honest |
| 05:52.02 | iWaldo | i wouldn't mind being rid of wpa_supplicant |
| 05:52.05 | furrywolf | iwaldo: and the periodic scheduler, device manager, etc, etc. :P |
| 05:52.21 | iWaldo | furrywolf: i'm ignorant of a lot of it |
| 05:52.25 | iWaldo | but even to my untrained eyes |
| 05:52.28 | shay_shay | init has always handled networking initialization |
| 05:52.44 | shay_shay | sysvinit does that too |
| 05:52.56 | peterrooney | Rusty1: not more vulnerable, just... what came out last year on the -deve list is that it's not clearly documented anywhere, has many buggy cases (and calling them corner cases doesn't help anyone), and apt-get + aptitude are both liable to choke trying to do it. |
| 05:53.15 | iWaldo | shay_shay: init does ipv4 and DHCP? |
| 05:53.21 | furrywolf | no, init hands it off to inetd and various distro-specific scripts. |
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| 05:53.42 | furrywolf | init is, like most unix tools, simple, small, and doing one thing... initializing the system. |
| 05:53.49 | shay_shay | furrywolf: yes, thats what I said |
| 05:53.59 | iWaldo | networkd (part of systemd) does a lot more than initialize basic hardware networking functionality |
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| 05:54.29 | iWaldo | it controls it completely |
| 05:54.39 | iWaldo | if it is calling DHCP |
| 05:54.43 | iWaldo | it isn't init-like |
| 05:54.44 | peterrooney | shay_shay: init calls ifupdown. init does not handle networking. |
| 05:55.08 | iWaldo | even on this small point about networking |
| 05:55.29 | iWaldo | i believe it can be easily established that systemd doesn't follow the "do one thing and do it well" philosophy |
| 05:55.36 | shay_shay | who cares if systemd handles some small part of networking? you never said why that is bad |
| 05:55.38 | iWaldo | which is the one thing that keeps *nix growing |
| 05:55.40 | shay_shay | you just said "because" |
| 05:55.41 | furrywolf | oh well, as I said, if debian is going to include it, I'll start looking at other distros, after decades (!) of using debian. I don't like gnome or kde for many of the same reasons I don't like systemd, and I don't use those either. but first, sleep. |
| 05:55.43 | iWaldo | feature creep |
| 05:55.47 | iWaldo | it will fucking creep |
| 05:55.50 | iWaldo | until it is windows |
| 05:55.52 | peterrooney | saying init handles networking is wrong. |
| 05:55.54 | iWaldo | because it will be easier |
| 05:56.05 | iWaldo | if it is slightly more convenient |
| 05:56.12 | iWaldo | it will be the choice of shithead devs |
| 05:56.31 | iWaldo | and it will be 95% of the *nix ecosystem before people figure out why it is wrong |
| 05:56.36 | iWaldo | but then it will be too late |
| 05:56.45 | iWaldo | and we'll be back to M$ and BSD |
| 05:57.00 | furrywolf | iwaldo: "it will" implies "it hasn't". I disagree. :) |
| 05:57.22 | furrywolf | thinks it has already crept |
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| 05:58.23 | iWaldo | god damn |
| 05:58.31 | iWaldo | i just perused my system |
| 05:58.34 | iWaldo | init is PID 1 |
| 05:58.41 | iWaldo | but i have a bunch of systemd shit in here |
| 05:58.45 | iWaldo | oh wel |
| 05:58.52 | iWaldo | windows here we come |
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| 05:59.01 | iWaldo | i hear windows 10 will have a command line package manager |
| 05:59.08 | iWaldo | so there's always that |
| 05:59.15 | DrakkenWarr | windows? Really? Why would you do that? |
| 05:59.39 | iWaldo | drakkenwarr: because systemd will eventually engulf most of *nix |
| 05:59.47 | DrakkenWarr | aye it and it is nuetured to shit, sucks ass and makes powershell look like a fuckin joke |
| 05:59.50 | iWaldo | and we will have *nix registries |
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| 06:00.08 | iWaldo | and *nix NT API calls |
| 06:00.09 | DrakkenWarr | I do not see that in the near or long future iWaldo, but that is me |
| 06:00.38 | iWaldo | DrakkenWarr: i base that prediction off of human nature more than i base it upon the nature of computer science |
| 06:01.01 | iWaldo | if systemd makes things easier, it will be adopted... whether or not it keeps its hands to itself |
| 06:01.04 | DrakkenWarr | fair enough, but I will stand by calling bollox on it |
| 06:01.22 | iWaldo | only time will tell |
| 06:01.36 | peterrooney | time has already told. |
| 06:01.36 | DrakkenWarr | agreed Sir |
| 06:01.48 | iWaldo | told what |
| 06:01.49 | iWaldo | ? |
| 06:01.49 | shay_shay | ok, thats enough. you guys are going in circles |
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| 06:02.44 | iWaldo | if only bsd had better out of the box wifi firmware/drivers |
| 06:02.58 | iWaldo | bah |
| 06:03.08 | iWaldo | hmm, that gives me an idea |
| 06:03.14 | iWaldo | repackage freeBSD as #! |
| 06:03.25 | iWaldo | though the drivers will still be a bitch |
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| 06:04.08 | DrakkenWarr | FÄicháng gÇnxiè nÇ duì kà n dà o jÃwén jÃwén |
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| 06:04.42 | spradnyesh | i cloned (using dd) a debian disk (entire HDD w/ 2 partitions "/" & "/home") and put the new HDD in another PC. now only 1 of them gets a successful DHCP ACK from the router, even though both have different hostnames (and obviously different MAC addresses). what might have i forgotten to change? |
| 06:05.21 | DrakkenWarr | purge arp spradnyesh |
| 06:05.33 | DrakkenWarr | then purge dhcp |
| 06:05.37 | DrakkenWarr | try again after that |
| 06:05.56 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: k, thanks; i'll try that |
| 06:06.16 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: how does a (cloning) newbie know/search about this? any pointers? |
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| 06:06.44 | iWaldo | use IRC? |
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| 06:07.27 | spradnyesh | iWaldo: obviously ;) but what i meant was "how does one *search* the Internet' before coming to IRC |
| 06:07.33 | DrakkenWarr | duckduckgo is your friend spradnyesh as well as the forums for debian |
| 06:08.17 | DrakkenWarr | also fundamentals of basic networking.. what arp does, how it effects dhcp and dns helps |
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| 06:08.29 | DrakkenWarr | selinux rules iptables |
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| 06:11.21 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: i've been using linux (debian, sabayon, etc) for last 12 years, but did a dd based hdd clone for the 1st time. what you're suggesting is ok for a systems engineer, but maybe too much (IMO) for a typical home user. what i was looking for was a wiki/forum like documentation which lists gotchas for a hdd clone (maybe debian specific) |
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| 06:12.16 | DrakkenWarr | fair enough and well said spradnyesh |
| 06:12.25 | spradnyesh | eg: i had to remove /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules before networking started on the new PC |
| 06:12.29 | DrakkenWarr | I seem to forget where I started from at times as well |
| 06:12.30 | spradnyesh | what else should one do? |
| 06:13.12 | spradnyesh | fortunately i knew about udev (from earlier related (but not hdd clone) experience) |
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| 06:13.36 | spradnyesh | maybe i'll write a blog post about my experiences and share here :) |
| 06:13.37 | DrakkenWarr | I would still purge arp and dhcp |
| 06:13.53 | DrakkenWarr | blog.. someday I should do one of those.. |
| 06:14.28 | DrakkenWarr | you need to clear up your router/switch tables, so unless you have done something wonky with those? That should clear it up |
| 06:15.11 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: you mean i need to purge arp/dhcp from router side. not debian PC side? maybe restarting the router will help? |
| 06:15.30 | spradnyesh | sorry, i'm not much good w/ networking |
| 06:15.49 | DrakkenWarr | no that is fine, purge it from the computer side |
| 06:16.17 | DrakkenWarr | once you purge the computer side, it will force a refresh to your router |
| 06:16.27 | DrakkenWarr | or switch depending on your setup |
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| 06:17.51 | DrakkenWarr | afk a tick |
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| 06:31.24 | iWaldo | anybody know whether or not debian's chromium package sends data to google? |
| 06:32.01 | pingfloyd | why would it, it isn't tainted by google yet |
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| 06:32.12 | pingfloyd | the tainted version is chrome |
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| 06:33.13 | iWaldo | not necessarily |
| 06:33.27 | iWaldo | chromium leaves reporting up to the devs |
| 06:33.56 | iWaldo | and there's at least one case of a user testing chromium (unsure of the distro) that found it was reporting to google |
| 06:34.06 | iWaldo | it actually sounded kind of sneaky |
| 06:34.28 | iWaldo | chromium didn't open up a port to talk to google for a few minutes |
| 06:34.46 | iWaldo | but it eventually did |
| 06:35.03 | iWaldo | and google's own spec for chromium "leaves it up to the packager" |
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| 06:35.22 | iWaldo | oh and fyi chromium is a google project |
| 06:35.30 | iWaldo | it might be open source, but it is google |
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| 06:38.08 | spradnyesh | i thought that debian simply packaged the chromium source-code "untouched". not true? |
| 06:38.48 | shay_shay | debian is notorious for lots of downstream patching |
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| 06:40.01 | shay_shay | in general |
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| 06:42.10 | dondelelcaro | iWaldo: it's possible, but normally we try to patch that sort of thing out |
| 06:42.15 | dondelelcaro | iWaldo: if it is, please file a bug |
| 06:42.57 | rozie | spradnyesh: you can compare sources. there should be upstream tarball and debian patches as... patches |
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| 06:44.41 | rozie | iWaldo: what do you mean by "sends data to google"? even default installation of iceweasel connects to external services (to get malware site list for example) |
| 06:44.42 | shay_shay | also in scripts folder |
| 06:44.53 | shay_shay | removals and upstream-removals |
| 06:45.28 | shay_shay | tin hatters everywhere :( |
| 06:45.42 | iWaldo | rozie: deliberately connects to a server and sends (something) to it, even if i haven't left the "open a new tab" page |
| 06:45.57 | iWaldo | dondelelcaro: thanks m8 |
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| 06:48.56 | Lady_Aleena | Hello. Does anyone know of any card game packages I can install which won't crash? (I'm looking to play spider solitaire, free cell, and tri-peaks mostly) |
| 06:49.24 | Lady_Aleena | I installed KDE games, but they crashed so I removed them. |
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| 06:49.55 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: ace-of-penguins, maybe? I don't play solitare that much, though |
| 06:50.21 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: and really, if things are crashing, please file bugs |
| 06:50.44 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, I tried, but the bug reporting software also crashes. |
| 06:50.47 | dondelelcaro | (well, with ace-of-penguins, don't view the help, apparently) |
| 06:50.56 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: uh.. if reportbug crashes, you've got issues |
| 06:51.06 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, you think? |
| 06:51.26 | shay_shay | :o |
| 06:51.31 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: hardware issues. reportbug just uses python, and really shouldn't crash. It might give you a traceback, but that's it. |
| 06:51.45 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: and you can still file bugs even then using anything which can send mail. |
| 06:52.21 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, I've never gotten my system to work the way I want it in the year since I've installed Debian. I've learned to live with the buginess of it. |
| 06:53.10 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: ok... but things really shouldn't just crash. |
| 06:53.18 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: if they do, it's a bug. Bugs can be fixed. |
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| 06:54.07 | Lady_Aleena | I have problems with some of the software which came with Debian's KDE, so I went to #kde to get help. I was told to update KDE. Well Debian hasn't updated KDE, so I can't. I told a person in #kde that, and was told I was on my own. |
| 06:54.51 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: which software? |
| 06:54.58 | Lady_Aleena | I don't want to have to backport EVERYTHING I have on this computer. |
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| 06:55.22 | Lady_Aleena | KDE the desktop environment. Debian Wheezy is like 3 or 4 versions behind now. |
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| 06:56.37 | iWaldo | change all sources to sid |
| 06:56.40 | Lady_Aleena | And KDE games is the games suite I installed which constantly crashed, which brought up the bug reporter which did nothing. |
| 06:56.56 | iWaldo | or install arch |
| 06:57.02 | Lady_Aleena | iWaldo, I don't know if that is a good idea. |
| 06:57.04 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: that's not reportbug. |
| 06:57.23 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: anyway, you can wait until jessie releases to upgrade to the newest version, and see if that fixes your problem |
| 06:57.33 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: or alternatively, you can upgrade now, and test to see if it works, and if it doesn't, file bug |
| 06:57.51 | dondelelcaro | jessie does have 4.14, and wheezy is using 4.8 |
| 06:58.16 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, should I really be mixing Debian versions like that? |
| 06:58.17 | shay_shay | I am using KDE on jessie right now, its excellent |
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| 06:58.40 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: no, you should upgrade completely. |
| 06:58.44 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: if you're going to upgrade |
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| 06:59.04 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, is jessie the new stable yet? |
| 06:59.05 | dondelelcaro | if you're not, then dunno; I would have thought KDE wouldn't be crashing like that, but I don't use KDE |
| 06:59.13 | iWaldo | change all repos to testing/sid if you need new stuff |
| 06:59.14 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: no, it won't be until February or later. |
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| 06:59.26 | Lady_Aleena | dondelelcaro, next month? |
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| 06:59.56 | dondelelcaro | Lady_Aleena: like late next month. Possibly March. |
| 07:00.05 | dondelelcaro | maybe later if there are still RC bugs |
| 07:00.12 | Lady_Aleena | RC bugs? |
| 07:00.20 | dondelelcaro | !rc bugs |
| 07:00.21 | dpkg | Release-Critical bugs are Debian bugs with critical, grave or serious severities, preventing the next release of Debian. See the graph at http://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/ or the lists at http://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/other/all.html http://udd.debian.org/bugs.cgi?release=wheezy&patch=ign&pending=ign&merged=ign&done=ign&rc=1 . See also <rc-alert>. |
| 07:00.40 | iWaldo | bugs in the release candidate |
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| 07:00.51 | iWaldo | it won't freeze until deb and ian are happy |
| 07:00.57 | iWaldo | in spirit at least |
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| 07:04.26 | Lady_Aleena | So, one day soonish when I do an upgdate and upgrade, I'll get a whole new system? |
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| 07:05.34 | shay_shay | Lady_Aleena: it will update all your packages so in a way yes, but the update is very uneventful usually |
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| 07:06.12 | shay_shay | its not the same as starting from scratch |
| 07:06.56 | Lady_Aleena | So instead of searching for my sources file again, just wait until jessie is released as stable. |
| 07:06.58 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: i did http://askubuntu.com/a/431385 and http://g33kinfo.com/info/archives/4356 on both PCs. i also tried restarting router and both PCs. but still both PCs trying for same IP address |
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| 07:07.33 | spradnyesh | maybe i'm missing anything else? you have any idea? |
| 07:07.53 | DrakkenWarr | have you checked if config on both boxes to change dns records? |
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| 07:08.53 | DrakkenWarr | via ifconfig with ether eth0 or wlan0 or whatever designation you can change the address for the device and specify a port |
| 07:09.13 | shay_shay | Lady_Aleena: well if you're sure your solution is to update and the issue is pressing then the benefit of waiting doesnt outweigh the disadvantages. but... it seems you havent fully diagnosed your problem |
| 07:09.37 | Lady_Aleena | still doesn't know what she is doing most of the time when she works on system stuff. |
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| 07:10.15 | pingfloyd | Lady_Aleena: when you do the upgrade, make sure to use apt-get and not aptitude |
| 07:10.17 | shay_shay | so really updating would just be a "shot in the dark" move, correct? |
| 07:10.33 | pingfloyd | Lady_Aleena: between releases that is |
| 07:10.35 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: 1] only 1 PC works at a time (since i have only 1 video-card), so i cannot test them simultaneously. 2] i have not done anything for DNS caching. should that matter? i think the issue is still at DHCP layer, since when i start both PCs together, the router webpage shows only 1 of them having assigned an IP. 3] when either is working, it gets the same IP address |
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| 07:11.02 | Lady_Aleena | pingfloyd, alias up="sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade && sudo apt-get autoclean" |
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| 07:11.26 | pingfloyd | Lady_Aleena: hold off on clean/autoclean after a release upgrade |
| 07:11.36 | shay_shay | dist-upgrade is usually safer |
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| 07:11.42 | pingfloyd | you may need the packages if you run into the problems |
| 07:11.56 | DrakkenWarr | spradnyesh: so you need to use ifconfig to make sure each computer has an independent ip address on each given interface |
| 07:11.59 | shay_shay | albiet more agressive |
| 07:12.00 | pingfloyd | like apt-get/aptitude crapping out afterward |
| 07:12.02 | DrakkenWarr | from there you need to flush arp |
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| 07:12.07 | Lady_Aleena | pingfloyd, how would I know when to turn the autoclean off? |
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| 07:12.56 | DrakkenWarr | o7 Lady_Aleena |
| 07:13.02 | Lady_Aleena | Hello DrakkenWarr. |
| 07:13.06 | DrakkenWarr | I hope your night finds you well |
| 07:13.15 | pingfloyd | autoclean keeps your local repository tidy, but you want to do it when you know everything is working good |
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| 07:13.26 | darxmurf | hi all |
| 07:14.06 | Lady_Aleena | DrakkenWarr, I was ill on Monday, weak on Tuesday, ill in another way on Wednesday, weak today. Bad week. I am a bit tired and cranky right now. You? |
| 07:14.08 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: you mean i should use ifconfig (on currently running PC) to assign it a different IP (than has been assigned by DHCP), and then flush arp? is my understanding correct? |
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| 07:14.09 | pingfloyd | like after you're confident all the current package versions are working good |
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| 07:14.57 | DrakkenWarr | Lady_Aleena: I am sorry to hear that, but understand it is a part of life that we all have to endure |
| 07:15.04 | Lady_Aleena | pingfloyd, how would I know when they are working good when I've not seen this system EVER working good? |
| 07:15.07 | pingfloyd | because if your apt-get or aptitude, or whatever manager you use craps out, it can make recovering less hell |
| 07:15.27 | pingfloyd | Lady_Aleena: the most important thing is that you maintain the ability to install/remove/reconfigure packages |
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| 07:15.30 | DrakkenWarr | spradnyesh: yes. if you have a DHCP conflict dns will be borked and an arp refresh will not fix it |
| 07:15.45 | DrakkenWarr | you have to assign ip addies first |
| 07:15.48 | pingfloyd | otherwise you get into a bit of a pickle, that is fixable, but a lot more hell |
| 07:15.54 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: hmmm. i understand. let me try that. thanks for the help :) |
| 07:16.13 | Lady_Aleena | pingfloyd, I'm getting overwhelmed again. |
| 07:16.16 | DrakkenWarr | no worries spradnyesh |
| 07:16.43 | pingfloyd | Lady_Aleena: if the system is that broke, you might want to just reinstall fresh |
| 07:16.54 | DrakkenWarr | if you are working with a 192.168.0.0/24 I would assign one to 192.168.1.10 and the other to .20 |
| 07:16.56 | pingfloyd | backup all your important data first of course |
| 07:16.56 | Lady_Aleena | pingfloyd, too afraid I'll lose stuff. |
| 07:17.24 | DrakkenWarr | why are you looking to pave and reinstall Lady_Aleena? |
| 07:17.24 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: yes, i get the idea. trying it now on PC-1 |
| 07:17.34 | DrakkenWarr | 10-4 spradnyesh |
| 07:18.08 | Lady_Aleena | DrakkenWarr, when I first came in here, I was just looking for games, and the conversation lead to updating/upgrading and much much more. |
| 07:18.45 | DrakkenWarr | ah, it does seem to go that way Lady_Aleena, what sort of games are you looking for? |
| 07:18.46 | shay_shay | Lady_Aleena: if I am not mistaken, you told us the #kde folks told you to update |
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| 07:19.21 | iWaldo | take their advice... install openbox |
| 07:19.45 | Lady_Aleena | shay_shay, yes, they told me to update KDE, but Wheezy hasn't, and I'm too afraid to do a scorched earth thing on this system because I don't know where some stuff is which is important to me. |
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| 07:20.33 | DrakkenWarr | so the scorched earth approach would not be conducive in any way |
| 07:20.59 | Lady_Aleena | I just wish someone had snagged me AWAY from KDE and told me to use some other DE. I might not be in such a mess right now. |
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| 07:21.15 | darxmurf | what kind of RAID would you configure with 18x4Tb HDD on a hardware RAID card ? |
| 07:21.23 | DrakkenWarr | aye, kde is pretty much worthless and a bitch to get away from |
| 07:21.36 | DrakkenWarr | but it can be done Lady_Aleena |
| 07:21.38 | shay_shay | working fine here |
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| 07:22.00 | DrakkenWarr | no kde is the bastard child of windows for linux and it should be avoided at all costs |
| 07:22.01 | ChrisH | darxmurf: a) Real HW Raid card? b) depends on your needs |
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| 07:22.27 | Lady_Aleena | I mean, just because I can write some basic (and I mean SIMPLE) perl scripts doesn't mean I can swin in the deep end of the Linux swimming pool (which is what Debian seems to be). |
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| 07:22.43 | SirLagz | Debians more like the middle ground. |
| 07:22.44 | darxmurf | a) yes b) sorry yes, storage, backups |
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| 07:22.53 | ChrisH | DrakkenWarr,Lady_Aleena disagree. I am using KDE as all experience with Gnome were really ugly |
| 07:23.13 | SirLagz | darxmurf: I'd configure it into 2x 9x raid6 arrays |
| 07:23.15 | darxmurf | I thought 3xRAID6 but this RAID6 is quite slow :-/ |
| 07:23.24 | SirLagz | darxmurf: software raid that is |
| 07:23.30 | darxmurf | hmm |
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| 07:23.42 | Lady_Aleena | ChrisH, I can't play music or use Twitter's website on this computer without it slowing to a crawl. |
| 07:23.44 | ChrisH | darxmurf: so performance is not the main goal, but disk space. I would put it into Raid5 with a Hotspare or Raid 6 w |
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| 07:24.12 | darxmurf | talking about performance, RAID5 is a bit better than 6 or ? |
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| 07:24.25 | darxmurf | for writing for sure but reading ? |
| 07:24.25 | DrakkenWarr | too all those, KDE for me is not an option. It is resource heavy, full of bloat and really not much a better option than windows |
| 07:24.34 | ChrisH | darxmurf: Raid 5 has 1 parity disk and Raid 6 shopuld have 2 of them |
| 07:24.35 | Lady_Aleena | This computer was at least 5 times faster with Windows XP on it. |
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| 07:24.47 | SirLagz | Lady_Aleena: are you still using KDE ? |
| 07:24.52 | darxmurf | yep |
| 07:24.53 | SirLagz | *shudders* |
| 07:25.23 | darxmurf | 1st time I have a machine with that much disks, it's quite hard to make the "good" choice :D |
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| 07:25.31 | DrakkenWarr | then as I said Lady_Aleena, mate would even be a better option |
| 07:25.33 | shay_shay | Lady_Aleena: free -h |
| 07:25.33 | darxmurf | 4 disks is not that complicated in the end :D |
| 07:25.43 | Lady_Aleena | SirLagz, Yes, I have no choice since I started using KMail and don't know how to export my emails to any other email client from KMail. I don't even know what client I should be using. |
| 07:25.44 | ChrisH | Lady_Aleena: My expierience with my current Laptop is the opposite. Win 7 is much slower then KDE. Never used twitter webpage. I use mplater to play music. |
| 07:25.56 | shay_shay | DrakkenWarr: I just switched from mate to KDE, kde runs faster |
| 07:25.59 | SirLagz | Lady_Aleena: you could always run something else but still use KMail |
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| 07:26.14 | DrakkenWarr | I would call bollox on that shay_shay |
| 07:26.36 | shay_shay | DrakkenWarr: you'll be wrong |
| 07:26.38 | Lady_Aleena | And even KMail is buggy unless I am running a resource gobbling nepomuk(sp). |
| 07:26.42 | SirLagz | darxmurf: or you could RAID1 the 2x RAID6 arrays for ultimate redundancy lol |
| 07:26.57 | DrakkenWarr | export from kmail to iceweasel is not all that hard, but I know it can be hard to transition from something you know so well |
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| 07:27.14 | DrakkenWarr | I do not agreed shay_shay |
| 07:27.24 | ChrisH | SirLagz: without haven the 2 Raid6 on different Controllers, this is a silly approach |
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| 07:27.33 | darxmurf | or RAID6 the 4xRAID10 with 2 hot spares |
| 07:27.34 | SirLagz | ChrisH: that is why I said Software Raid |
| 07:27.36 | darxmurf | :D |
| 07:27.41 | shay_shay | you don't need to agree, it's not up fopr discussion. my system runs faster now, period. |
| 07:27.46 | Lady_Aleena | DrakkenWarr, I can barely get KMail to download my email. I don't know it that well. I never thought I would miss Outlook so much. |
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| 07:27.54 | DrakkenWarr | here on my i7 with 6 gig of ram, kde was a slog at best, with mate? it is a dream, with openbox? It screams |
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| 07:28.18 | darxmurf | I think I have 2 controllers in the machine |
| 07:28.25 | shay_shay | DrakkenWarr: placebo effect on your mate vs kde observation |
| 07:28.30 | Lady_Aleena | I'm already brokenhearted I lost my entire addressbook. |
| 07:28.37 | darxmurf | or 3 |
| 07:28.52 | DrakkenWarr | shay_shay: again I am sorry but bollox |
| 07:29.04 | SirLagz | darxmurf: what controllers do you have ? |
| 07:29.28 | darxmurf | areca |
| 07:29.38 | darxmurf | I don't know it |
| 07:29.44 | SirLagz | so that's the brand...:P lol |
| 07:29.51 | darxmurf | usually I'm working with LSI but ... |
| 07:30.27 | darxmurf | I don't know which controller they did put in the machine we just received it and I did not choose the config :) |
| 07:30.35 | SirLagz | darxmurf: lol kk |
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| 07:31.30 | darxmurf | http://www.areca.com.tw/products/1882.htm |
| 07:31.32 | darxmurf | this one |
| 07:31.54 | shay_shay | DrakkenWarr: one system I switched to KDE is a 2007 iMac with Intel Core2 Duo, Radeon HD2600 (mobility)... it couldn't even run gnome 3 and I used crunchbang on it for the longest time because I was convinced that if the desktop was lighter then it would run smoother |
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| 07:32.24 | shay_shay | then I tried a livecd with gentoo and KDE and was amazed by how fast it was |
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| 07:32.34 | darxmurf | talking about performances, I have no idea about it :-/ |
| 07:32.42 | shay_shay | it ran better than anything else and took down my preconceptions |
| 07:32.52 | DrakkenWarr | shay_shay: as a user of crunchbang since 2008 and I have used it on macs time and again, you cannot even start to tell me kde ran faster in anyway than openbox |
| 07:33.06 | maziar | hi every one i want to instal "python-ldap" on my web server ( my web site is python based) and its says that some application must be removed, is it make problems for my web site ? |
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| 07:34.16 | SirLagz | maziar: maybe. You should paste the output of the command somewhere. |
| 07:34.57 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: what did you mean by "10-4 spradnyesh" earlier? |
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| 07:35.19 | DrakkenWarr | 10-4 is a simple call in cop-speak for understood |
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| 07:36.46 | shay_shay | CB-speak |
| 07:36.55 | DrakkenWarr | pretty much shay_shay |
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| 07:39.40 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: ohh, k |
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| 07:40.40 | maziar | SirLagz, http://pastebin.com/xnwtNqFK |
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| 07:40.55 | maziar | hi every one i want to instal "python-ldap" on my web server ( my web site is python based) and its says that some application must be removed, is it make problems for my web site ? (here is my out put on pastbin http://pastebin.com/xnwtNqFK ) |
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| 07:44.02 | SirLagz | maziar: I'd do a apt-get update && apt-get upgrade before doing anything else |
| 07:47.45 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: tried ifconfig based static IP and then arp cache clean on both PCs (one-by-one), but still they don't work simultaneously (still fighting for same IP). should i do DNS clean? |
| 07:48.09 | DrakkenWarr | aye I would try that next |
| 07:48.18 | spradnyesh | k, doing that |
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| 07:51.03 | spradnyesh | DrakkenWarr: i don't have any of nscd, dnsmasq, bind9 installed. do i not have any dns cache? |
| 07:51.52 | DrakkenWarr | aye if it is a base install deb |
| 07:52.07 | DrakkenWarr | have you looked in /var/log/cache? |
| 07:52.34 | spradnyesh | i don't have /var/log/cache |
| 07:52.53 | DrakkenWarr | on arch atm, give me a tic |
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| 07:54.32 | spradnyesh | grep -rc <1st-PC-hostname> | grep -v ':0' ===> in "/etc" directory gives me "ssh/....pub" files. these should not cause any problems in the 2nd PC right? |
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| 07:58.57 | Lady_Aleena | is back. |
| 07:59.28 | shay_shay | waves |
| 07:59.36 | da_didi | is it usual that ssh keys with ed25519 are shorter than "old" rsa keys? |
| 07:59.41 | Lady_Aleena | waves shay_shay. |
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| 08:02.10 | Lady_Aleena | Is there a way to tell Debian when I plug in ANY usb stick to mount it without me telling it to? |
| 08:02.24 | iWaldo | #! |
| 08:02.56 | Lady_Aleena | had the stray thought cross my mind. |
| 08:03.31 | shay_shay | s/my/her |
| 08:03.53 | SirLagz | Lady_Aleena: yes it's possible. |
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| 08:04.10 | Lady_Aleena | shay_shay, thank you. |
| 08:04.57 | Lady_Aleena | Also, is it possible for all my usb sticks to NOT be squirreled away in /media? I'd prefer they be top level directories I can get to. |
| 08:05.34 | SirLagz | Lady_Aleena: also possible...but why ? |
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| 08:06.46 | DeaDSouL | I'm installing the debian to my usb again.. which lives in /dev/sdc ... where should i install the grub boot loader ? to /dev/sdc or /dev/sdc1 ? |
| 08:07.03 | SirLagz | DeaDSouL: /dev/sdc |
| 08:07.10 | Lady_Aleena | SirLagz, directory string length. With my Document files already squirreled away in /home/me/Documents some of my directories can almost reach from one side of my monitor to the other in length. |
| 08:07.36 | Lady_Aleena | I have a huge and deep directory structure in my Documents. |
| 08:07.54 | SirLagz | Lady_Aleena: must do if it stretches from one side of your monitor to the other |
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| 08:09.58 | Lady_Aleena | "/home/me/Documents/fantasy/files/data/Role_playing/Locations/Nubilar/Triador/Peldeta/The_Acrema_Empire" is my longest. |
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| 08:11.37 | Lady_Aleena | And "me" is my real name which isn't much longer. |
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| 08:12.22 | Lady_Aleena | So, shortening directory locations for my usb drives would be nice. |
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| 08:16.03 | Lady_Aleena | Sorry, I'm now babbling. |
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| 08:17.34 | iWaldo | could always shorten the name of every directory to a single letter |
| 08:17.40 | suexec | I have a strange document. "file" tells me it's a "Composite Document File V2 Document". How can I convert that to a readable format - or am I stuck having to use windows to read it ? |
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| 08:18.31 | Lady_Aleena | iWaldo, I use semantic names for almost everything these days. |
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| 08:18.52 | Lady_Aleena | iWaldo, you don't want to see some of my file names. |
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| 08:28.30 | STMelon | bbiab |
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| 08:28.48 | Lady_Aleena | waves night night. |
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| 08:41.41 | darxmurf | I think I'll go for RAID60 |
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| 08:43.03 | ilgnome | I'm trying to install a package from squeeze into wheezy. Is this an easy thing to do or am I just in a world of pain? |
| 08:44.16 | tkl2 | ilgnome: Depends on the package :) |
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| 08:44.44 | tkl2 | Anyone around here with a NUC DN2820FYKH <--- ?? |
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| 08:45.15 | ilgnome | tkl2: it's intel536ep-oneiric |
| 08:45.27 | ilgnome | an old modem drive package |
| 08:46.03 | ilgnome | compiled for kernel 3.0 |
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| 08:50.34 | tkl2 | ilgnome: and, did you get any error messages? |
| 08:51.26 | ilgnome | when using gdebi linux-image-3.0.0-12-generic|linux-image-3.0.0-13-generic|linux-image-3.0.0-14-generic |
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| 09:00.25 | peterrooney | ilgnome: possibly both. /msg dpkg frankendebian |
| 09:01.20 | ilgnome | heh |
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| 09:03.26 | zach-- | anyone know why an apt-get upgrade (initscripts) on wheezy 64-bit would give dpkg error unable to create /var/log/dmesg ? |
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| 09:06.38 | Stargazers | Hi. Any tips what can be broken because sometimes my spamassasin & procmail filters spam, sometimes not. I have configured my .procmailrc to delete emails with Subject filtering. Sometimes it just does not seem to work. Any ideas? |
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| 09:10.45 | Judge | Hi everyone! I'm running Debian trusty inside a docker container and want to install postfix , configured as a satelite system. When I install it with "apt-get install postfix", no dpkg-configure dialog apears. When I issue "dpkg-reconfigure --priority=low", no dialog is shown also. |
| 09:10.52 | Judge | What am I doing wrong? |
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| 09:12.25 | netfrog | Judge: using Dockerfile for the buil? I think it does not have attached TTY and that's why there is no dialog. |
| 09:12.26 | Stargazers | Judge: What about dpkg-reconfigure postfix |
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| 09:14.41 | ilgnome | oh dangnabbit. looks like I can't even compile from source as the only source I can find was released in 2011 and it wants the 2.6 kernel |
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| 09:15.16 | groovehunter | hi. I need to know the cmd to restart the debian-installer. Or at least the netcfg ? |
| 09:15.34 | Judge | Stargazers: That's what I meant by "dpkg-reconfigure --priority=low" - should have written "dpkg-reconfigure --priority=low postfix", sorry. No dialog with this. |
| 09:15.42 | groovehunter | the documentations names all the components, but these are not cmds |
| 09:15.46 | Stargazers | Judge: Oh, ok. |
| 09:16.04 | Judge | netfrog: You mean while issuing "docker run" ? |
| 09:16.21 | Judge | netfrog: With "-t -i" or such? |
| 09:16.49 | netfrog | Judge: oh, you're installing it when it's already running... i was thinking about build time |
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| 09:17.02 | groovehunter | reason is I did a netinstall and had no inet. So now I want to change the sources and install a somewhat complete system |
| 09:17.37 | Judge | netfrog: Ah, sorry - yes, for testing purposes I'm trying while it's running; when it works, I want to do it by Dockerfile in the build. |
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| 09:18.18 | netfrog | Judge: I think it will behave differently when tty is absent during the build |
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| 09:19.16 | netfrog | Judge: when building, there is a method which i don't remember how called, to populate config database so you won't need dialogs because it will have all the answers |
| 09:19.33 | Judge | netfrog: My main goal is to create a fiting config with it - when I have to copy a preconfigured file during the build process, then it is OK to go that road. |
| 09:20.06 | Judge | netfrog: It already helps that docker might be the reason the dialog doesn't show up. I will create the config on a non-docker container then. |
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| 09:20.15 | Judge | netfrog: Thank you so far :) |
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| 09:20.29 | netfrog | Judge: welcome, HTH :) |
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| 09:24.03 | zach-- | any assistance with apt-get upgrade dmesg error? - http://paste.debian.net/hidden/1cac3a9a/ |
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| 09:25.10 | Vroomfon1le | zach--: does /var/log exist? |
| 09:25.22 | Vroomfon1le | or has it somehow gone missing? |
| 09:25.38 | zach-- | yep, it exists |
| 09:25.56 | zach-- | it's a prodction system with a working apache2/mysql/php install |
| 09:26.20 | netfrog | can "touch /var/log/dmesg" ? |
| 09:26.36 | zach-- | yes, and that's what it appears the postinst script does too |
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| 09:28.32 | netfrog | sorry for brutality... strace -e file ... can give some insight. give it 5 minutes. if you don't find the reason, probably strace is not the optimal tool |
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| 09:29.03 | netfrog | don't forget -f |
| 09:29.44 | zach-- | lol, can't install strace via apt-get, it wants initscripts first |
| 09:29.54 | netfrog | :) |
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| 09:32.10 | netfrog | edit the script, add bash trace flag "-x", might help |
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| 09:33.33 | zach-- | will it re-download the script from the repo after i edit it, or will it just run that script? |
| 09:33.58 | zach-- | or should i just bash -x initscripts.postinst |
| 09:34.04 | netfrog | not sure. you can check for right args and run it manually. |
| 09:34.29 | netfrog | ... then you don't have to edit it :) ... bash -x SCRIPT |
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| 09:36.56 | zach-- | http://paste.debian.net/hidden/96fd1e52/ |
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| 09:37.26 | Slashman | hello, I have added the backports on a new install but I cannot find initramfs-tools version 0.115~bpo70+1 ( "aptitude -t wheezy-backports show initramfs-tools" shows the version "0.109.1" ), on an older install, I correctly see the version "0.115~bpo70+1"... any idea? I need this package to install linux-image-3.16.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
| 09:37.36 | zach-- | looks like /var/log/dmesg is a socket and not a regular file |
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| 09:38.31 | netfrog | oh, i would move it away then |
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| 09:38.50 | maziar | how should i tell snmpd to only communicate with only with Specific IP Address ? |
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| 09:39.00 | Devastator | ,v initramfs-tools |
| 09:39.01 | judd | Package: initramfs-tools on i386 -- squeeze: 0.98.8; squeeze-backports: 0.109.1~bpo60+1; wheezy: 0.109.1; wheezy-backports: 0.115~bpo70+1; jessie: 0.116; sid: 0.118 |
| 09:39.13 | netfrog | ,v ? |
| 09:39.14 | judd | No package named '?' was found in i386. |
| 09:39.19 | zach-- | should i replace it with dmesg.0 i guess just rename it, and move original dmesg to /root/ or something |
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| 09:39.57 | netfrog | i would move it to dmesg.screwed in same folder , just in case |
| 09:40.04 | Devastator | Slashman have you run aptitude update after adding backports? |
| 09:40.05 | zach-- | lol |
| 09:40.38 | Slashman | Devastator: of course, I see the packages linux-headers-3.16.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 and linux-image-3.16.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 |
| 09:40.45 | netfrog | should be regular file i guess... |
| 09:41.07 | Devastator | Slashman well, it's there |
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| 09:43.30 | Slashman | Devastator: http://apaste.info/8mN |
| 09:43.48 | zach-- | netfrog: awesome that worked |
| 09:43.51 | zach-- | ty |
| 09:44.04 | Devastator | Slashman could you please paste your /etc/apt/sources.list? |
| 09:44.20 | Marqin | is there way to disable counting D processes to system load or get rid of them without rebooting? (there was little down with network storage, now it's back, but some imagemagick processes seem stuck and pushing load up) |
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| 09:44.37 | netfrog | zach--: welcome! |
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| 09:45.23 | Slashman | Devastator: http://apaste.info/jdu |
| 09:46.08 | Devastator | Slashman add contrib and non-free to backports lines and run aptitude update again |
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| 09:47.35 | Slashman | Devastator: no change |
| 09:48.07 | *** join/#debian schu-r (~Thunderbi@82-149-107-2.wco.wellcom.at) |
| 09:48.08 | maziar | hey gus can i set this domain : john.test.domain.com ? |
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| 09:49.18 | maziar | hey gus can i set this domain : john.test.domain.com ? |
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| 09:50.51 | maziar | hey gus can i set this domain : john.test.domain.com ? |
| 09:50.57 | Stargazers | maziar: Mm? Set in where? On domain settings? |
| 09:51.04 | Stargazers | I mean, what that domain should do? |
| 09:51.06 | Stargazers | Website? |
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| 09:51.29 | maziar | Stargazers, on dns server to resolve ip to this name john.test.domain.com ? |
| 09:51.38 | Devastator | Slashman can you please paste updated /etc/apt/sources.list? |
| 09:51.51 | Devastator | just checked package list from your mirror, it's there |
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| 09:52.16 | Stargazers | maziar: Well, why not? At least I think it should work, but never tested. Only xxx.yy.com |
| 09:52.50 | maziar | Stargazers, my domain is test.domain.com ,,,,,,,,,,,,,, can tell dns server to set joh.test.domain.com |
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| 09:52.55 | Stargazers | maziar: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/archive/2012/04/12/10292868.aspx |
| 09:53.32 | sebastianlutter | what would you suggest for file sharing on a server accessible via VPN tunnel, and that is available like a server in local lan. Clients are Linux, MacOSX and maybe Windows as well some day. Should I use WebDAV, Samba, NFS or something like AFS? Thanks |
| 09:53.55 | Slashman | Devastator: http://apaste.info/XiH |
| 09:54.14 | Stargazers | sebastianlutter: Samba at least should work on everything. |
| 09:54.31 | maziar | Stargazers, this doc says that, it could be work, is it true ? |
| 09:54.33 | Stargazers | But on my local lan it has been slow, I have configured myself samba & AFS |
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| 09:54.40 | Devastator | Slashman pastebin the output of aptitude update please |
| 09:55.03 | Stargazers | maziar: Never tested, I have only used mypage.somepage.com or similars. |
| 09:55.16 | Stargazers | Just test? |
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| 09:55.23 | Devastator | Slashman or apt-get update even |
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| 09:56.24 | sebastianlutter | Stargazers, are there well known problems with webDav and OSX/Windows? WebDAV looks less bloated to me, but I have not much experience with it. Any hint? |
| 09:56.35 | Slashman | Devastator: http://apaste.info/A44 |
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| 09:57.04 | Stargazers | Sorry, never used it myself. I have shared stuf only on local lan and I use AFS if I really really really need GUI on OSX, but mostly I just use SFTP almost evrything. |
| 09:57.22 | Stargazers | sebastianlutter: I mean, much easier to use SFTP as a nerd than any of those. :/ |
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| 09:58.13 | Stargazers | But surely Samba shares and AFS shared I have used only when need to stream music from server (unless SSHFS is installed). Dunno if it is available on Windows. |
| 09:58.30 | Devastator | Slashman have you tried to actually install it? because maybe aptitude show doesn't know you are consulting a package from wheezy-backports |
| 09:58.49 | Devastator | it's weird, it should install the one from backports, it's there |
| 09:58.54 | Slashman | Devastator: yes I tried, but it doesn't install anything |
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| 09:59.28 | Slashman | Devastator: I installed it directly |
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| 09:59.35 | Devastator | Slashman can you pastebin aptitude -t wheezy-backports install initramfs-tools? |
| 09:59.53 | Slashman | Devastator: wget http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/i/initramfs-tools/initramfs-tools_0.115~bpo70+1_all.deb && dpkg -i initramfs-tools_0.115~bpo70+1_all.deb |
| 10:00.04 | Slashman | Devastator: that did nothing |
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| 10:00.43 | Slashman | Devastator: the crazy thing is that I already installed the backported kernel on many servers... |
| 10:00.57 | Devastator | Slashman which one? the "wget" line or the one I asked? |
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| 10:01.26 | Slashman | your line, already tried this, it did nothing |
| 10:01.44 | Slashman | my line worked, but it's not very clean |
| 10:01.58 | Devastator | Slashman no output at all? |
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| 10:02.47 | Slashman | Devastator: http://apaste.info/Jgt |
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| 10:03.33 | sebastianlutter | Stargazers, I need to deal with non nerd people |
| 10:03.52 | Devastator | weird, let me see if I can reproduce it here |
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| 10:05.54 | levo | i chose to install desktop environment while installing debian via CD but when i start the system it goes to command line. am i missing something? plus in Grub my keyboard doesn't work (since i have got xp side by side i need to toggle between these two OS.es) |
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| 10:07.50 | Stargazers | levo: Have you tried to manually install GDM or KDM or similar just in case? |
| 10:08.02 | Stargazers | Dunno what that DE packaged install... |
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| 10:08.53 | levo | Stargazers: no, i just used the CD and at the last step asked me if i want to install desktop environment and core utilities and i said yes to that |
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| 10:09.16 | Devastator | Slashman not reproduceable here, maybe try another mirror?! |
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| 10:09.55 | Stargazers | levo: Does your X work at all? |
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| 10:10.35 | levo | Stargazers: what command should I execute? i'm used to Ubuntu |
| 10:10.59 | Stargazers | Uhm. If you write "startx" does it go to X. |
| 10:11.04 | Slashman | Devastator: already tried http://http.debian.net/debian before http://ftp.fr.debian.org/debian , but nevermind, I installed the package manually, I'll consider some other solution if I have the same problem on an other server later |
| 10:11.10 | levo | let me give it a go |
| 10:11.21 | Stargazers | If I remember right, startx is a script which can be found on debian also. |
| 10:11.33 | Devastator | Slashman ok :) |
| 10:11.34 | maziar | Stargazers, i have a force question |
| 10:11.40 | Stargazers | maziar: ? |
| 10:11.41 | Slashman | Devastator: thanks for your time, unfortunately, I'll tell you if I understand the issue :p |
| 10:11.47 | Stargazers | Use the force. |
| 10:11.57 | Stargazers | maziar: Can you explain a little bit more? :D |
| 10:12.01 | Devastator | Slashman please do :) |
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| 10:13.04 | maziar | Stargazers, i have 16 Gig memory, and i have only Nginx to serve static content, i dont have mysql or php or someting like that, but all of my memory is full, how could i know why memory is full ? |
| 10:13.40 | Stargazers | maziar: It is quite normal, it is how Linuxes handles memory. |
| 10:14.02 | levo | Stargazers: out of frequency on tty7. |
| 10:14.03 | Stargazers | It takes all it have, and shares it went required. Different than in Windows memory management. |
| 10:14.11 | levo | maziar: chakere hame khafana |
| 10:14.11 | petn-randall | maziar: How are you measuring "memory full"? |
| 10:14.20 | Stargazers | levo: Out of frequency? So X does not start? |
| 10:14.33 | Stargazers | levo: Maybe you should reconfigure Xorg. |
| 10:14.46 | maziar | root@cdnmap:~# free -m |
| 10:14.46 | maziar | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:14.46 | maziar | Mem: 16087 15919 167 0 2782 9083 |
| 10:14.46 | maziar | -/+ buffers/cache: 4052 12034 |
| 10:14.46 | maziar | Swap: 7811 0 781 |
| 10:14.47 | *** kick/#debian [maziar!~debhelper@unaffiliated/debhelper] by debhelper (flood. Please use http://paste.debian.net instead.) |
| 10:14.53 | Stargazers | :D |
| 10:15.02 | Stargazers | Flood kick. |
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| 10:15.14 | petn-randall | facepalms. |
| 10:15.22 | petn-randall | !tell maziar -about paste |
| 10:15.24 | petn-randall | !tell maziar -about free ram |
| 10:15.33 | levo | Stargazers: no it doesn't start |
| 10:15.52 | Stargazers | levo: Well, that is propably the reason why GDM or KDm or whichever you have won't start either. |
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| 10:15.56 | petn-randall | maziar: Read the topic, is says NO FLOOD in all caps. |
| 10:16.09 | maziar | Stargazers, but it show only 200Mb is free |
| 10:16.13 | Stargazers | So, do as a root "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg" (or is that right package?) |
| 10:16.15 | petn-randall | !tell maziar -about free ram |
| 10:16.15 | Stargazers | brb phone |
| 10:16.23 | levo | Stargazers: ok |
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| 10:16.29 | maziar | Stargazers, and server ssh is slow |
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| 10:19.54 | levo | Stargazers: nothing happened after "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg" , problem insists |
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| 10:20.41 | Stargazers | Let me see if that package name is just wrong, can't remember and I have no gui... |
| 10:21.14 | Stargazers | levo: And you did it as a root? Or with "sudo"? |
| 10:21.20 | znh | im seeing duplicate cpu usage for processes in top/htop but not in ps aux. Is this known? stressing a process with parent/child shows both parent and child taking up 100% while loadavg is 1.0, ps aux shows only one process taking up 100% |
| 10:21.39 | znh | ^ this is in jessie not wheezy |
| 10:21.49 | levo | Stargazers:â i logged in as root |
| 10:21.57 | Stargazers | Ok. Hmm.. |
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| 10:22.17 | levo | and i also don't have sudo |
| 10:22.37 | Stargazers | Ok, but as a root it shuld work anyway so no matter. |
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| 10:23.15 | Stargazers | It does nothing? No questions, no output, just a back to CLI after that? |
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| 10:24.39 | levo | Stargazers: nothing at all, just goes to the next line prompting for commands. not even an error or something |
| 10:24.57 | Stargazers | levo: What about X -configure, does that do anything |
| 10:25.07 | levo | let me try |
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| 10:25.29 | Stargazers | I have not used it myself, but it should at least do something config stuff also. |
| 10:25.31 | petn-randall | znh: Can you paste us the output? top/htop also show process threads by default, which might be what you're seeing. |
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| 10:26.24 | Melissa_ | Can anyone help me with installing Debian on a reiserfs filesystem? |
| 10:27.18 | levo | Stargazers: configuration failed, the number of screen doesn't not match number of detected devices |
| 10:27.22 | Stargazers | maziar: Are you sure that SSH is slow because of mem? |
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| 10:27.58 | maziar | i think because free memory is only 250Mb |
| 10:27.59 | znh | petn-randall: but if it shows the process threads, only the thread would show 100% right? |
| 10:28.02 | Stargazers | levo: Ok. Do you have a /etc/X11/Xorg.conf file? |
| 10:28.14 | maziar | Stargazers, i think because free memory is only 250Mb |
| 10:28.29 | Stargazers | maziar: I don't think so, I have much less and still it works very well. |
| 10:28.39 | Stargazers | If you use "free" tool to see memory. |
| 10:28.56 | Stargazers | Memory management is just different in Linuxes/BSD's and it is normal. |
| 10:29.23 | Stargazers | maziar: http://www.linuxatemyram.com/ |
| 10:29.27 | levo | Do you have: no that file doesn't exist |
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| 10:30.48 | Stargazers | levo: Does "Xorg -configure" makes you a file? |
| 10:31.41 | Stargazers | maziar: Did that link help to explain that memory? |
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| 10:32.29 | maziar | Stargazers, let me read it |
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| 10:33.10 | Stargazers | Yup |
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| 10:34.53 | Stargazers | Phone... -> |
| 10:36.21 | levo | Stargazers: (++) using config file "/root/xorg.conf.new" (--) using system config directory "/usr/share/x11/xorg.conf.d" |
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| 10:38.36 | levo | Stargazers: this was the line before "configuration failed" after running X -configure |
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| 10:46.18 | maasha | I am getting mail errors -> DNS Error: MX lookup of maasha.dk returned error DNS server refused query. How can "manually" test this? |
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| 10:49.41 | bezaban | maasha: dig MX maasha.dk |
| 10:50.51 | maasha | bezaban: I suppose that all look normal. Why can't gmail do it then? |
| 10:51.02 | bezaban | maasha: interestingly enough I just did that when you asked the question and didn't get a mx |
| 10:51.05 | bezaban | but now I do |
| 10:51.13 | bezaban | did you just add the entries? |
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| 10:52.20 | maasha | bezaban: it has been running for months, but the last couple of days people tell me that my mail bounces (I have mailforward with gratisdns so that mail to maasha.dk is forwarded to my gmail) |
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| 10:53.26 | Stargazers | levo: Sorry, was on a phone, customer called. Well can you copy that file from /root/Xorg.conf.new or whatever it was to /etc/X11/Xorg.conf and startx again and see if it works, if not, edit that file? |
| 10:53.42 | levo | ok |
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| 10:54.55 | maasha | bezaban: so what does this mean? |
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| 10:56.00 | Shadow_7 | My DNS for my ISP has been a bit quirky the past few days. Seems like qwest is trying to muck things up a bit. |
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| 10:58.11 | bezaban | maasha: not sure |
| 10:59.36 | maasha | bezaban: I suspect temporary fault @ gratisdns, however, despite the word "gratis" they charge for support - so I would like to be rock sure before contacting them. |
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| 11:01.59 | maasha | I wonder if my MX record is broken |
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| 11:02.23 | Stargazers | maasha: Why? |
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| 11:03.01 | maasha | Stargazers: I am getting this error message from gmail: "DNS Error: MX lookup of maasha.dk returned error DNS server refused query" |
| 11:04.00 | Stargazers | Hmm. |
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| 11:05.53 | levo | Stargazers: how am i supposed to edit it in order for startx to work properly? |
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| 11:06.09 | Stargazers | maasha: maasha.dk. 21599 IN MX 10 forwardsrs.net. <-- is that right? |
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| 11:06.32 | levo | Stargazers: after copying it to /etc/X11/xorg.config it didn't start again |
| 11:06.38 | superrorc | Hi there! Anyone know C ? i build and run http://shell-storm.org/shellcode/files/shellcode-859.php exploit, how can i revert changes and close port in my system? |
| 11:06.46 | Stargazers | No, it should be /etc/X11/Xorg.conf no xorg.config |
| 11:06.53 | Stargazers | Note that big and small letters makes diff. |
| 11:07.03 | levo | Stargazers: oh yes, but there i did it correctly |
| 11:07.15 | Stargazers | Oh, ok. And you got that same error? |
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| 11:07.18 | levo | because the destination PC is in the next room |
| 11:07.26 | levo | yes |
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| 11:07.37 | Stargazers | Frequerncy out of range or what it was? |
| 11:07.39 | levo | out of frequency |
| 11:08.04 | levo | yes and it show proper frequencies it can handle and current frequency imposed on it |
| 11:08.10 | levo | *shows |
| 11:08.22 | Stargazers | Oh. |
| 11:08.36 | Stargazers | CRT display? |
| 11:08.56 | maasha | Stargazers: Yes, I think so |
| 11:09.17 | levo | Stargazers: sure, a memorabilia from 90s :) |
| 11:09.27 | Stargazers | master_o1_master: Can't be sure? Is that server not in your control? Can you ask from them if they have probles? |
| 11:09.30 | Stargazers | levo: :) |
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| 11:11.02 | Stargazers | levo: Sorry, no time to search at this moment (at work...), but try to google with that exat error message and search sample Xor.conf which works or boot from live CD if you have one, and check if that goes to X -> check if there is /etc/X11/xorg.conf and see if you can find which differences it has. |
| 11:11.09 | Stargazers | now gotta continue working o/ |
| 11:11.15 | Stargazers | See ya, hopefully you can fix it :) |
| 11:11.40 | levo | Stargazers: thanks for your time :) i'll do that |
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| 11:14.20 | chrisc | is there a https mirror of security.debian.org? |
| 11:14.36 | chrisc | i'm on a cafe wifi that intercepts http traffic but not https traffic... |
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| 11:20.47 | jelly | chrisc: no, there isn't. The repos are signed anyway, so MITM can only see what you're downloading, but not make you install their packages easily. |
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| 11:31.05 | chrisc | jelly: thanks, trying this... https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/78335/apt-get-via-ssh-tunnel-if-only-port-22-is-allowed |
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| 11:32.09 | levo | how would i know if i ever have a desktop manager? starting startx requires having a desktop (like gnome, kde, ...) installed? |
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| 11:33.34 | Vroomfon1le | startx doesn't require a DE, necessarily |
| 11:33.52 | Vroomfon1le | you can start X without a DE or WM and just run applications from the console/ssh if you like |
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| 11:38.11 | levo | Vroomfon1le: and in which file I can edit the frequency for monitor (i've got a CRT monitor) and i get the out of frequency error on my monitor |
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| 11:38.50 | levo | i didn't have /etc/X11/Xorg.conf i copied the output from X -configure instead to that place |
| 11:39.50 | Vroomfon1le | you did the right thing. I imagine you will need to change a modeline somewhere. Try using http://www.arachnoid.com/modelines/ to find out what modeline you need. |
| 11:42.58 | jelly | chrisc: what's your goal? |
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| 11:43.52 | jelly | chrisc: I mean, do you care about webcafe being able to see what packages you're updating? |
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| 11:54.00 | ui_ | Why do I get 'failed to run command â/bin/bashâ: Permission denied' when chroot'ing an aufs made of a tmpfs=rw and /=ro ?? |
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| 11:55.36 | relaxed | ui_: use sudo |
| 11:55.51 | ui_ | relaxed: I am using sudo chroot myChrootDir |
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| 11:56.51 | Shadow_7 | ui_: is bash installed? debians default is dash |
| 11:56.58 | ui_ | Shadow_7: yes, it is |
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| 11:58.12 | toolz | Hi, I am running debian 6.x 64bit and I want to install libsqlite3-dev, heres what I get when I try to, http://pastebin.com/6tn78zHf |
| 11:58.51 | Shadow_7 | ui_: anything exotic like trying to do it over ssh? |
| 11:59.43 | ui_ | Shadow_7: no, doing locally on a live cd with a terminal |
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| 12:00.09 | ui_ | ... in order to exclude all possible factors |
| 12:00.44 | Shadow_7 | ui_: might try sudo -s to become root. and # export LANG=C; chroot /mnt/path /bin/bash |
| 12:01.48 | Shadow_7 | ui_: could be a read-only influence coming from a live image though |
| 12:01.59 | ui_ | Shadow_7: same :( |
| 12:03.42 | Shadow_7 | ui_: what are you trying to use the chroot for? typically I share /proc/ and /dev/ when doing debootstrap install via chroot. |
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| 12:04.59 | ui_ | Shadow_7: for learning purposes |
| 12:05.11 | ui_ | Shadow_7: dev dev/pts proc and sys are bind-mounted |
| 12:05.17 | jelly | toolz: you have previously installed libsqlite3-0 from squeeze backports repo. You'll have to install the matching -dev package from there as well |
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| 12:05.44 | Shadow_7 | ui_: sys? not needed unless you're going to share the gui of the host system. |
| 12:06.10 | Shadow_7 | ui_: at which point run and a few others need sharing too |
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| 12:06.45 | Shadow_7 | ui_: dev/pts also not needed except for gui sharing |
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| 12:07.01 | cek | installed 3.16 kernel on 7 , doesn't boot. what a piece of crap. |
| 12:07.12 | cek | it's using dracut instead of initramfs now |
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| 12:08.25 | jelly | cek: that means you installed dracut or installed something that pulled dracut in instead of initramfs-tools |
| 12:08.41 | cek | of course it did. kernel 3.16 pulled dracut |
| 12:08.55 | cek | now 3.16 doesn't boot. it shows some mesages, but doens't boot |
| 12:08.57 | jelly | cek: I have linux-image-3.16.0-0.bpo.4-amd64 on wheezy and no dracut |
| 12:09.17 | cek | aptitude proposed deps resolution. it needed dracut |
| 12:09.30 | jelly | you don't have to accept the first proposed solution |
| 12:09.41 | cek | and this is a server in datacenter. now I'm trying to solve this over ipkvm |
| 12:09.47 | cek | thanks for "great" QA guys |
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| 12:10.16 | jelly | cek: this is a non-default kernel, and bpo is never that well tested |
| 12:10.18 | cek | dracut replaces initramfs, right? Will older kernel boot? |
| 12:11.09 | jelly | cek: boot the older kernel or a livecd/liveusb, install initramfs-tools (also from bpo if necessary), rebuild initramfs and see if that works |
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| 12:11.36 | cek | remote hands cost $60/30 mins |
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| 12:12.50 | toolz | jelly, thanks, I figure it out... I thought so aswell :) |
| 12:13.38 | jelly | cek: tell that to your finances next time they make you buy servers without remote mgt (iLO/DRAC/whatever) |
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| 12:14.00 | cek | already told that to person responsible for that |
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| 12:14.22 | cek | even accounting that, it shouldn't behave like so. It's a generic kernel, it should boot. |
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| 12:18.29 | jelly | well, file a bug report. Venting here doesn't solve your problem. |
| 12:20.21 | jelly | You're using a backport kernel, and a less tested initramfs generator. If the same kernel manages to work with initramfs-tools from bpo, the report should probably be against dracut. If you have full output of the apt/aptitude run, someone can take a look to see why dracut got installed. There might be a different bug there as well. |
| 12:20.51 | Shadow_7 | depends on how you made the kernel probably. make-kpkg ? or whatever the .deb way was. I did a make install one recently (on jessie) and the initramfs didn't include the filesystem modules and such needed to boot it. |
| 12:21.06 | jelly | Shadow_7: I'm assuming it was the wheezy-backports kernel. |
| 12:21.11 | Shadow_7 | change the config to not make them modules and it booted. |
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| 12:21.48 | Shadow_7 | Eventually getting too frustrated with the wonky wifi that I got an apple usb to ethernet and now use a standard kernel. |
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| 12:22.31 | Shadow_7 | wifi worked, but it seems that if any other wifi device was on, it overpowered it and cause high latency and packet loss |
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| 12:23.40 | toolz | jelly, do you have any idea what could cause this -- /usr/lib/libmysqlclient.so: could not read symbols: File in wrong format -- I am trying to install something and it complaints about this, the library exists but.. |
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| 12:25.03 | jelly | toolz: no. Which debian release is this? What exactly are you trying to install and how exactly (full command, full output)? which package and version does path /usr/lib/libmysqlclient.so belong to? |
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| 12:27.36 | toolz | jelly, https://wiki.multitheftauto.com/wiki/Building_MTASA_Server_on_GNU_Linux#Installing_and_Running_MTASA_server_on_Linux this is what I am trying to install, I use debian 6.0.10 64bit, mysql server and client version 5.1.73-1 |
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| 12:27.50 | toolz | jelly, and I get that at: make |
| 12:28.15 | toolz | jelly: https://wiki.multitheftauto.com/wiki/Building_MTASA_Server_on_GNU_Linux#Compiling_on_64-bit |
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| 12:29.30 | cek | i can't boot the damn thing |
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| 12:29.41 | cek | it even touched old kernels, why? i didn't ask for that. |
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| 12:30.15 | jelly | that's probably a bug. Are there any /boot/initrd*.old left over? |
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| 12:31.52 | cek | have no idea |
| 12:32.00 | cek | it's grub2, i can't autocomplete to see the list |
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| 12:48.40 | cek | yes, there's a .bak |
| 12:48.43 | cek | will try that. thanks |
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| 12:57.02 | andhoy | anyone knows the syntax needed with useradd to function the same way as: adduser username :) |
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| 12:57.59 | ChrisH | andhoy: man useradd and man adduser will tell you |
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| 13:01.32 | BlackStar10 | Hello |
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| 13:13.08 | caraconan | Hi there. I have 2 physical interfaces which are bonded. It is possible to assign several VLAN to this bond? Thanks |
| 13:13.42 | osram | caraconan: sure |
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| 13:16.15 | osram | caraconan: Assuming your bond is called bond0 and you want to bring up vlan 345 on it you can do `ip link add link bond0 name bond0.345 type vlan id 345' followed by `ip link set bond0.345 up'. |
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| 13:17.04 | DelphiWorld | hi debianists |
| 13:17.09 | osram | and `ip addr add x.x.x.x/y dev bond0.345' |
| 13:17.13 | DelphiWorld | how to add backport to my wheezy? |
| 13:17.16 | DelphiWorld | deb http://http.debian.net/debian-backports squeeze-backports(-sloppy) main |
| 13:17.19 | DelphiWorld | 404 not found |
| 13:17.41 | caraconan | osram: ok, many thanks |
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| 13:18.01 | osram | caraconan: you're welcome |
| 13:18.06 | osram | DelphiWorld: deb http://mirror.internode.on.net/pub/debian wheezy-backports main |
| 13:18.22 | osram | or whatever your mirror of choice is |
| 13:18.25 | DelphiWorld | osram: yeah just did it;) |
| 13:18.28 | DelphiWorld | osram: updating |
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| 13:20.19 | osram | Sweet. |
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| 13:20.25 | DelphiWorld | osram: looking here: |
| 13:20.42 | DelphiWorld | osram: https://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=jscommunicator |
| 13:21.01 | DelphiWorld | osram: but apt-cache search dont get it from the repo |
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| 13:26.00 | osram | DelphiWorld: idk, works here. |
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| 13:26.18 | DelphiWorld | not here... ;( |
| 13:27.16 | osram | DelphiWorld: http://http.debian.net/debian-backports gets me a `Not Found' |
| 13:27.32 | DelphiWorld | osram: me too so |
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| 13:27.43 | Devastator | try wheezy-backports |
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| 13:28.09 | Devastator | hum, nevermind |
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| 13:28.37 | osram | Devastator: what's your regular wheezy mirror? |
| 13:29.15 | osram | ie. what do you have in sources.list for regular wheezy? |
| 13:29.16 | Devastator | I use one from my country |
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| 13:29.33 | osram | Sorry, meant to ask that question of DelphiWorld |
| 13:29.40 | Devastator | oh |
| 13:29.41 | DelphiWorld | hehe osfe hold on |
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| 13:29.58 | DelphiWorld | osram: here we go: http://paste.debian.net/139897/ |
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| 13:33.07 | osram | DelphiWorld: I'm just trying your sources.list, give me a minute |
| 13:33.17 | DelphiWorld | osram: ;) |
| 13:34.08 | osram | DelphiWorld: damn. Sure enough, apt-cache search jscommunicator returns nothing. |
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| 13:34.36 | osram | DelphiWorld: maybe ftp.no.debian.org isn't up to date or doesn't mirror backports? |
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| 13:38.34 | tremon | I see no mention of debian-backports in that sources.list |
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| 13:41.35 | osram | tremon: ugh. you're right! |
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| 13:43.20 | abrotman | wheezy-backports? |
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| 13:45.40 | osram | abrotman: wheezy-backports. |
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| 13:46.37 | osram | It's slowly coming together :) If only DelphiWorld was still here ... |
| 13:46.57 | wheezysrc | i have been looking for a howto doc on installing aircrack-ng from svn on *Wheezy* but i have not found any. Can anyonehelp? |
| 13:47.31 | petn-randall | ,v aircrack-ng |
| 13:47.32 | judd | Package: aircrack-ng on i386 -- wheezy-backports: 1:1.2-0~beta3-3~bpo70+1; sid: 1:1.2-0~beta3-4; jessie: 1:1.2-0~beta3-4 |
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| 13:47.44 | petn-randall | wheezysrc: Install it straight from wheezy-backports. |
| 13:47.51 | petn-randall | !tell wheezysrc -about wheezy-backports |
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| 13:48.11 | abrotman | osram: I meant instead of "debian-backports" |
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| 13:48.48 | osram | abrotman: yep, got that. You're absolutely right. |
| 13:49.00 | abrotman | isn't crazy |
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| 13:49.10 | osram | otoh ... |
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| 13:50.49 | wheezysrc | i did install aircrack-ng from wheezy-backports but upon running airodump-ng -c 3 mon0 i ran into the fixed channel mon0 -1 issue |
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| 13:51.43 | wheezysrc | --ignore-negative-one is not the solution because I cannot deauth any Clients from AP |
| 13:52.28 | petn-randall | wheezysrc: Which issue is that? |
| 13:52.36 | wheezysrc | petn-randall, are you running aircrack-ng on wheezy? |
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| 13:53.10 | petn-randall | wheezysrc: Not at the moment, but I used it a few days ago on jessie, which is nearly the same package. |
| 13:53.52 | cek | The following packages will be REMOVED: |
| 13:53.52 | cek | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:53.56 | cek | okay, any ideas ? |
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| 13:54.30 | wheezysrc | jessie is not wheezy, does *anyone* here use aircrack-ng on wheezy? |
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| 13:55.13 | wheezysrc | abrotman, i did install aircrack-ng from wheezy-backports but upon running airodump-ng -c 3 mon0 i ran into the fixed channel mon0 -1 issue |
| 13:55.15 | cek | jelly, there's no way of keeping dracut and installing initramfs-tools |
| 13:55.21 | cek | only 3 solutions. |
| 13:55.40 | jelly | cek: can you pastebin the whole output? |
| 13:55.48 | cek | output of aptitude? |
| 13:55.55 | jelly | cek: and the command line you used, yes |
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| 13:56.20 | petn-randall | wheezysrc: There's no point in randomly asking people in the channel. Explain the actual problem, and we might be able to fix that. |
| 13:56.29 | jelly | ,v initramfs-tools |
| 13:56.31 | judd | Package: initramfs-tools on i386 -- squeeze: 0.98.8; squeeze-backports: 0.109.1~bpo60+1; wheezy: 0.109.1; wheezy-backports: 0.115~bpo70+1; jessie: 0.116; sid: 0.118 |
| 13:56.32 | cek | https://gist.github.com/celesteking/f4c57cdbe2db438a5e98 |
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| 13:57.13 | cek | ideas are welcome. dracut rebuilt ALL kernels, thus making machine inoprable. It didn't make any backups. |
| 13:57.40 | cek | this is a totally INSANE decision. I didn't ask for old initrd rebuilt. |
| 13:57.42 | jelly | cek: aptitude -t wheezy-backports install initramfs-tools |
| 13:58.20 | cek | gist updated |
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| 13:58.38 | jelly | that seems sane |
| 13:59.03 | jelly | (doesn't remove the kernel) |
| 13:59.09 | wheezysrc | petn-randall, i already explained the problem. Whenever i run airodump-ng -c 3 mon0 i get the error "fixed channel mon0 -1" |
| 13:59.14 | cek | oh, i see that now. That's wonderful news! |
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| 14:00.00 | jelly | I'm not sure why initial installation of kernel decided to go with dracut instead of backported initramfs-tools |
| 14:00.11 | petn-randall | wheezysrc: Can you show us the full output of creating the monitor device and running airodump, including all output? â http://paste.debian.net |
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| 14:00.25 | DelphiWorld | osram: back |
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| 14:00.53 | cek | update-initramfs: /boot/initrd.img-3.2.0-4-amd64 has been altered. |
| 14:00.53 | cek | update-initramfs: Cannot update. Override with -t option. |
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| 14:00.59 | cek | okay, at least this time it asks for it |
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| 14:01.21 | cek | dpkg: dracut: dependency problems, but removing anyway as you requested: |
| 14:01.22 | cek | <PROTECTED> |
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| 14:01.22 | dpkg | You are person #1 to send an unparseable request, cek |
| 14:01.53 | jelly | dpkg: huash |
| 14:01.53 | dpkg | no idea, jelly |
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| 14:01.55 | jelly | dpkg: hush |
| 14:01.55 | wheezysrc | petn-randall, will do so in about 5 min |
| 14:02.10 | DelphiWorld | lol jelly |
| 14:02.11 | carnau | Hello, I've changed the apticron email value in the /etc/apticron/apticron.conf. Should I reload a service to apply the new config? |
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| 14:02.41 | petn-randall | dpkg: hash jelly |
| 14:02.41 | dpkg | petn-randall: are you using Windows? |
| 14:02.53 | feurd | Hi. I just installed a fresh Debian Wheezy on my laptop. I did not install any Desktop environment because I use i3. But it might have been a mistake, because I can't even load i3. I'm stuck at the opening terminal. I tried 'startx', but it says 'no screens found'. I'm a bit too new to this to manage this on my own... Could I have some help? |
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| 14:03.28 | petn-randall | feurd: You probably want to install a login manager, like lightdm, gdm or kdm. |
| 14:03.53 | feurd | petn-randall: That could be a start indeed |
| 14:04.06 | feurd | what's the most recommended for a laptop? |
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| 14:07.17 | feurd | petn-randall: I installed it, but now I'm stuck on a black screen (I can still go to the terminal of course= |
| 14:07.57 | feurd | Is it normal that 'echo $DISPLAY' returns nothing? |
| 14:08.32 | jelly | feurd: in the console, yes. Inside X, no |
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| 14:09.18 | feurd | jelly: Ok. But I can't go inside X. If I type Ctrl-Alt-F7, it's just a black screen |
| 14:09.32 | feurd | (with a tilting underscore) |
| 14:10.09 | feurd | and if I type startx, I still have 'Fatal error: no screens found' |
| 14:10.28 | jelly | that implies X is not running at all, and that error means it fails to start |
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| 14:10.40 | jelly | there will be a bit more details in /var/log/Xorg.0.log |
| 14:10.45 | cek | Well, standard kernel 3.2 started perfectly after initrd update. Now only to find the problem with 3.16. |
| 14:11.04 | jelly | oh, bpo kernel still fails to boot? |
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| 14:15.25 | feurd | jelly: Thanks, it was an error in my synaptic file. It works again now. |
| 14:15.27 | EdePopede | hello. does debian 7 have a program called "gesettings" the change settings for gtk3? |
| 14:15.50 | wald0 | can somebody tell me what is the package "spass" for ? |
| 14:15.52 | EdePopede | * gsettings |
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| 14:16.32 | jelly | EdePopede: try searching yourself: /msg judd file bin/gsettings |
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| 14:17.17 | EdePopede | jelly: is there a documentation for judd? |
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| 14:17.26 | EdePopede | i hope this is a bot |
| 14:17.27 | jelly | wald0: also: /msg judd info spass (or run apt-cache show spass) |
| 14:17.31 | jelly | !ircbots |
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| 14:17.46 | jelly | EdePopede: yes, ircbots.debian.net |
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| 14:17.54 | jelly | dpkg: ping |
| 14:17.55 | dpkg | Sorry jelly, you're not online. |
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| 14:19.05 | jelly | EdePopede: there are other ways of searching package contents, like apt-file or web interfaces at http://packages.debian.org/ |
| 14:19.27 | L0aD1nG | EdePopede: there is a packager "dconf-gsettings-backend" , but has nothing to do with GTK. |
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| 14:19.54 | EdePopede | jelly: my problem is i simply can't keep overview on a dozen programs handling package stuff. 90% of cases i use (thinking.......) aptitude |
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| 14:21.23 | jelly | EdePopede: aptitude's search is complex and doesn't do package contents as far as I know |
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| 14:23.37 | EdePopede | jelly: right. and i *know* there is *some* other commad to get filelist even from not installed packages. only there are *far too many* binaries to remember without an organised tutorial and daily use for a very long time. |
| 14:23.50 | gnugr | EdePopede: you might also need 'gnome-tweak-tool' |
| 14:23.57 | EdePopede | and i know i used that program some time ago. weeks or month.. |
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| 14:24.59 | jelly | EdePopede: then remember just this: /msg dpkg search |
| 14:25.01 | jelly | :-) |
| 14:25.19 | EdePopede | seems to be libglib |
| 14:26.08 | EdePopede | btw, does dpkgbot have its own channel? looks like an interesting piece of software |
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| 14:28.10 | jelly | dpkg: what are you |
| 14:28.11 | dpkg | I am an infobot. For more information, ask me about <infobot>. |
| 14:28.14 | musca | EdePopede: you can have a query with the bot. |
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| 14:28.19 | musca | /msg dpkg selftell |
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| 14:28.52 | jelly | EdePopede: it's basically just an infobot with a populated database of "factoids" |
| 14:29.27 | musca | heavily populated, nearly 40,000 factoids, i think |
| 14:29.36 | Walex | feurd: did you fix your situation? "no screens found" has a specific technical meaning |
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| 14:29.41 | cek | jelly, it booted with updated initrd |
| 14:29.49 | jelly | yay |
| 14:30.01 | eth0 | hey, anyone looking for a long term sys admin job? |
| 14:30.09 | feurd | Walex: Yes. I made a mistake in my synaptic config file. I fixed it, it's fine now. |
| 14:30.34 | jelly | cek: so it's either a bug in dracut, or a missing versioned dep on dracut in the bpo kernel package |
| 14:30.43 | petn-randall | eth0: remote? |
| 14:30.47 | eth0 | yes |
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| 14:30.50 | EdePopede | without knowing exactly what factoid are (i remember i've read about things called factoids not really being factoids gut factlets or so...), and since dpkg is on git: would it be possible to use it as a kind of concierge in a channel with more than just saying hello on JOIN and answering on thing like !weather? |
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| 14:31.15 | petn-randall | eth0: Query me with details if you like. |
| 14:31.19 | eth0 | thanks |
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| 14:31.43 | jelly | EdePopede: you could set up your own bot, grab dpkg's database, and add different plugins for weather etc |
| 14:32.48 | EdePopede | jelly: weather was just an example as what an eggdrop would do... lack of fantasy on my side ;) |
| 14:33.25 | EdePopede | so i'll take this as a yes and keep it in my mental dungeons |
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| 14:33.57 | afx237 | I've got a debian guest VM inside KVM. Programs freeze up at random times, sometimes for up to a minute, then continue running. Other programs continue to function at the same time. It's not a resources problem, it's barely using any cpu or memory. Also there's nothing in the messages/syslog logs. anybody got any idea what i can do to try and narrow it down? My hunch is that it's related to being a KVM guest, as I haven't encountered this before, but |
| 14:33.57 | afx237 | could be wrong. Programs that I've noticed freezing are apache and htop. |
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| 14:35.27 | albertag | im having problems with my usb Alfa wireless card (AWUS036H) and debian 7. The card keeps disconnecting and reconnecting, and is constantly being blocked by rf-kill. Here is the dmesg logs and rkfill output http://paste.debian.net/139909/ |
| 14:35.35 | jelly | EdePopede: I'm not sure whether you're asking hypothetically, for some other channel, or suggesting dpkg here could have more features. My answer is for the former option. For the latter, having too many automated features in a heavily populated channel creates more noise and potential for abuse than it brings benefits. |
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| 14:38.43 | jelly | afx237: strace the process/app, see if it hangs in a particular syscall |
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| 14:39.03 | Brigo | albertag, the hard switch refers to hardware switch like a button in your laptop |
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| 14:39.18 | afx237 | jelly: ok thanks, i'll look into that. |
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| 14:39.41 | Evropi | hey, any networking experts here? |
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| 14:39.52 | jelly | !ask |
| 14:39.52 | dpkg | If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>. |
| 14:39.59 | Evropi | I wonder if it's possible to turn my laptop into a router of sorts but I want to still be able to use wifi on it |
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| 14:40.23 | Evropi | the reason being that Microsoft charges an outrageously high amount for its wifi adapter for the original xbox 360 |
| 14:40.26 | albertag | Brigo: hmm. i dont see any buttons on my laptop about disabling wifi, and non on the usb adapter either |
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| 14:40.29 | GivenToCode | hi all, not sure if this is a debian problem but I am on 7.4 and when i press and hold down the backspace key (or any key) it only registers 1 key press instead of multiple key presses |
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| 14:40.33 | Evropi | so I want to hook it up to my laptop via ethernet instead |
| 14:40.52 | GivenToCode | this was working recently, not sure if i fat fingered something... |
| 14:40.59 | albertag | Brigo: I am running debian in a VM |
| 14:41.01 | Evropi | albertag: try the rfkill program (sudo apt install rfkill), you can unblock physical buttons with that |
| 14:41.07 | jelly | Evropi: it's possible to make a linux machine into a wireless AP, but not all drivers and hardware work for that |
| 14:41.32 | Evropi | jelly: no, I want to make my laptop a *wired* AP, that takes wireless 'input' if you will |
| 14:41.32 | afx237 | Evropi: not sure, but assuming one of your wifi interfaces is instead being used as a WAP, maybe you can just add a second usb wifi stick |
| 14:42.17 | Brigo | albertag, and you have a wifi there? |
| 14:42.21 | albertag | Evropi: `rfkill unblock all` doesnt do anything. And i think the issue would still persist if the USB device is continually disconnecting and reconnecting |
| 14:42.35 | jelly | Evropi: what do you meant by "wireless input"? Where would its clients be, and where would the internet connection be? |
| 14:42.53 | albertag | Brigo: I have wifi via the wifi adpter on my laptop. I want to use the USB wifi adpater exclusively with my VM |
| 14:43.15 | Evropi | jelly: it would go WAP > laptop > ethernet to xbox 360 |
| 14:43.32 | Brigo | albertag, virtualbox? |
| 14:43.38 | Evropi | jelly: is that all possible do you reckon? :x |
| 14:43.41 | albertag | Brigo: VMWare Workstation |
| 14:43.50 | albertag | Brigo: The Host is windows 7 |
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| 14:44.21 | jelly | Evropi: yes, it's possible to make a laptop into a router and dhcp server for a wired network. |
| 14:44.28 | Brigo | albertag, someone, if not button pressent, should be "closing the door" windows or vmware, i think |
| 14:44.40 | Evropi | jelly: ah excellent, is there a guide on how to do that anywhere? |
| 14:45.14 | Evropi | jelly: I tried just hooking it up to my desktop pc a while ago but I don't think it worked, then again my memory is fuzzy |
| 14:45.15 | albertag | Brigo: i agree. Do you know of a way to confirm if its Debian (guest) or not? |
| 14:45.37 | Brigo | cat /etc/debian_version |
| 14:45.47 | albertag | Brigo: 7.7 |
| 14:45.58 | wald0 | is there any howto about how correctly use a newer kernel from backports on wheezy? |
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| 14:46.15 | Brigo | albertag, then you are using debian 7.7 |
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| 14:46.21 | wald0 | like other packages that should update too to be used with newer kernel, mmh udev may should too? |
| 14:46.26 | jelly | Evropi: I don't know of guide I'd recommend. Google for soemthing like "debian as router" |
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| 14:46.52 | albertag | Brigo: yes |
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| 14:47.21 | Brigo | albertag, that was not your question? |
| 14:47.23 | albertag | Brigo: oh, i meant do you know of a way to confirm if debain is causing the problem or not |
| 14:47.28 | albertag | Brigo: sorry :P |
| 14:47.37 | jelly | Evropi: your eth0 would be the private interface, and your wireless device would be the public interface |
| 14:47.39 | L0aD1nG | Anyones knows any stable way to replace gnome-screensaver with xscreensaver, on gnome3? |
| 14:47.48 | Evropi | jelly: fair enough. FWIW, if worse comes to worse I don't mind not having wifi to be honest, the laptop is very much a secondary computer and it's from 2005 :) I use my desktop pc exclusively at home |
| 14:47.50 | EdePopede | jelly: actually there is someone with a new channel for his, hm.... not a hotel, a cabin in the woods with grill and beds and stuff, and he has some windows bot for the moment greeting the people (so they see the're not alone) and messaging him on his mobile via trillian. only there's no free reaction on stuff like "tell $user about" or "how are you open during holidays?" -- and since dpkg is the first bot i've seen d |
| 14:47.50 | EdePopede | oing such stuff for some time now, i thought..... |
| 14:48.09 | Brigo | albertag, yes, install another operating system i see. |
| 14:48.25 | EdePopede | apologize for texting too much again :/ |
| 14:48.45 | albertag | Brigo: right. thanks for your help :) |
| 14:48.53 | Brigo | albertag, np :) |
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| 14:56.08 | jelly | EdePopede: if you're starting from scratch, look at limnoria or supybot instead of hacky perl infobot |
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| 14:59.13 | wald0 | It is suggested to update "udev" too if i use a kernel from backprots? |
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| 15:00.40 | jelly | wald0: no need |
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| 15:04.43 | jelly | Evropi: well, if your desktop is 24/7 on with linux booted, you can use that too |
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| 15:06.49 | wald0 | jelly: what about initramfs-tools? |
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| 15:09.44 | cek | thanks! |
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| 15:16.50 | L0aD1nG | Anyones knows any stable way to replace gnome-screensaver with xscreensaver, on gnome3? |
| 15:17.34 | SynrGy | screensavers are an outmoded concept and contribute to global warming |
| 15:18.24 | SynrGy | i.e. it is deliberately omitted from gnome3. if you disagree, don't use gnome3. |
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| 15:19.22 | L0aD1nG | SynrGy: ommited? |
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| 15:21.05 | L0aD1nG | SynrGy: its not ommited gnome3 contains a screensaver app, It just doesn't function well or at all. The thing is that the specific app is also responsible to locking the screen and its unable to be purged cause it holds gnome dependencies. |
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| 15:22.29 | SynrG | the screensaver hacks that used to be run by gnome-screensaver aren't anymore. if you need something other than gnome-screensaver (which is what i thought you were after with xscreensaver) they don't support that. |
| 15:22.40 | SynrG | aren't there* anymore |
| 15:23.03 | RayzrShrp | screensavers are a relic back to monochrome days |
| 15:23.06 | SynrG | what do you mean by "doesn't function well or at all"? |
| 15:23.17 | RayzrShrp | monitor burn-in doesn't really happen much these days |
| 15:23.30 | jelly | RayzrShrp: tell that to the burn-in on my IPS matrix monitor |
| 15:23.56 | SynrG | anyway, the solution to monitor burn-in is to power down the screen when not in use |
| 15:24.03 | RayzrShrp | bingo |
| 15:24.23 | RayzrShrp | unless jelly sits and watches it 24 hours a day |
| 15:24.33 | SynrG | so unless you're driving a display in a public space or so ... |
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| 15:24.40 | feurd | As many others, I have issues setting up my wireless connection. I have no wlan interface. I installed the iwlwifi drivers, and wicd to manage my interfaces. But there's still nothing. Where should I look for to identify the problem? |
| 15:24.43 | jelly | RayzrShrp: 8-10 at least |
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| 15:24.59 | SynrG | jelly: hope you're redshifting :) |
| 15:24.59 | jelly | /usr/lib/xscreensaver/lcdscrub helped, a bit, but not enough |
| 15:25.02 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: it just turns the screen black and lock it, its like a locker... and it doesn't provide any screensaver options at all. |
| 15:25.08 | RayzrShrp | so you watch a screen for 8-10 hours with no updates or refreshes to the screen |
| 15:25.19 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: yes, that's by design. that's not "doesn't work" |
| 15:25.31 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: yea right. |
| 15:25.40 | SynrG | if you want screensaver options, you want something Wrong, according to gnome3 |
| 15:25.50 | SynrG | your desires are fundamentally incompatible with their design |
| 15:26.02 | RayzrShrp | yes gnome knows what you need |
| 15:26.08 | jelly | RayzrShrp: indeed, the parts of the screen with browser edge and panels are unchaging enough |
| 15:26.10 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: which brings me back to my original recommendation. if you don't like this, don't use gnome3. |
| 15:26.21 | Sh3r1ff | gnome knows what you need even before you know it yourself! :) |
| 15:26.25 | SynrG | it's not like you don't have options |
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| 15:26.57 | L0aD1nG | I like gnome3 really, I can let it go just for the cause that they don't provide a good screensaver app by default... |
| 15:27.03 | RayzrShrp | im using gnome-shell right now, not a fan but meh it works |
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| 15:27.26 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: yes they do. it's "good" in that it doesn't contribute to global warming. |
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| 15:27.30 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: you think installing xscreensaver and using it won't function well with gnome3? |
| 15:27.36 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: it's just that your version of "good" is not their version of "good" |
| 15:27.37 | RayzrShrp | not a fan how you can run 2 windows side by side |
| 15:27.42 | RayzrShrp | its one or the other |
| 15:27.50 | RayzrShrp | can't |
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| 15:28.52 | jelly | kde4 has the maximize-to-{left,right}-half |
| 15:28.56 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: it is not a drop-in replacement for gnome-screensaver, no. otherwise, the metapackage would allow it as an alternative. |
| 15:29.05 | jelly | I'm not sure whether they stole it from windows, or vice versa |
| 15:29.13 | RayzrShrp | huh i take that back i guess im running xfce4 right now |
| 15:29.20 | RayzrShrp | havent been on my debian VM in a while |
| 15:29.30 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: either upstream forbids it, or the debian gnome team is uninterested in supporting it. and i can't be arsed to figure out which. |
| 15:29.34 | RayzrShrp | gnome3 runs on my macbook pro under the VM |
| 15:29.36 | SynrG | either way, it's unsupported. |
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| 15:30.11 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: the replacement thing is out of the concept as it holds dependencies, even purging it specifically with dpkg may cause me problems... |
| 15:30.41 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: I am thinking about installing it and using it, then just disable gnome-screensaver from starting. |
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| 15:31.10 | L0aD1nG | *installing and using xscreensaver . |
| 15:31.34 | L0aD1nG | what would be the potential disfunctions that this operation may cause? |
| 15:31.36 | L0aD1nG | any ideas? |
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| 15:31.50 | RayzrShrp | death, dismemberment |
| 15:31.56 | L0aD1nG | hahahahaha |
| 15:31.58 | RayzrShrp | tremors,hives |
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| 15:32.01 | RayzrShrp | memory loss |
| 15:32.05 | RayzrShrp | vertigo |
| 15:32.12 | RayzrShrp | night terrors |
| 15:32.13 | L0aD1nG | RayzrShrp: stop watching american series that much. |
| 15:32.31 | SynrG | and you will be a Bad Person who hates the environment |
| 15:32.43 | L0aD1nG | -_-' |
| 15:32.46 | RayzrShrp | everytime it runs a kitten will die |
| 15:32.51 | SynrG | either it will keep you up nights worrying, or else your conscience will be seared |
| 15:33.12 | RayzrShrp | incontenence |
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| 15:33.27 | RayzrShrp | explosive dirreah |
| 15:33.31 | L0aD1nG | who cares about kittens. |
| 15:33.34 | SynrG | in any case, i have not fully investigated the dependency chain. it looks like it *could* be removed in jessie |
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| 15:33.53 | L0aD1nG | I am on backports. |
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| 15:34.06 | SynrG | doesn't help |
| 15:34.09 | SynrG | gnome isn't backported |
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| 15:34.17 | RayzrShrp | my work juses suse and i despise it |
| 15:34.32 | SynrG | my vague recollection is that in wheezy you're stuck with it |
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| 15:34.57 | L0aD1nG | SynrG: by "jessie" you mean wheezy testing/unstable right? |
| 15:35.13 | SynrG | ? |
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| 15:35.28 | SynrG | "wheezy testing/unstable" is a nonsensical designation ... |
| 15:35.52 | RayzrShrp | jessie is testing |
| 15:35.53 | SynrG | (i.e. we are long, long past the days when wheezy *was* testing) |
| 15:35.58 | RayzrShrp | wheezy is stable |
| 15:36.00 | L0aD1nG | one of those.. |
| 15:36.38 | L0aD1nG | ohhh got it now, sorry my bad. |
| 15:36.39 | SynrG | and the 'testing/unstable' designation is only because /etc/debian_version has to be set to *something* and it would be ridiculous to update it to be only one and not the other |
| 15:36.54 | SynrG | jessie is testing. sid is unstable. |
| 15:37.10 | SynrG | sid will *always* be unstable. jessie will someday be stable. |
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| 15:37.35 | L0aD1nG | Jessie is using gnome 3.14? |
| 15:37.47 | SynrG | ,v gnome-shell |
| 15:37.48 | judd | Package: gnome-shell on i386 -- wheezy: 3.4.2-7+deb7u1; jessie: 3.14.2-3+b1; sid: 3.14.2-3+b1 |
| 15:38.01 | jelly | "probably" |
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| 15:38.32 | jelly | there was that web page with all the gnome components and upstream and packaged versions |
| 15:39.37 | jelly | L0aD1nG: http://pkg-gnome.alioth.debian.org/ News 2014.10.10 â Debian 8.0 (Jessie) will ship with GNOME 3.14 |
| 15:39.40 | tvlooy | I'm installing phpmyadmin with a remote server (unattended install). Is there a way to apt-get install a package without it starting debconf to configure itself? |
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| 15:40.13 | tvlooy | so pma on server 1, mysql on server 2. debconf fails because there is no local mysql server |
| 15:40.25 | L0aD1nG | jelly: I knew that, I wanted to verify from someone that is actually using it right now. |
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| 15:41.26 | SynrG | jelly: this? https://www.0d.be/debian/debian-gnome-3.14-status.html |
| 15:41.39 | abrotman | L0aD1nG: yes, I use it. |
| 15:41.40 | jelly | I use xfce on my jessie system, but, "right now" may be slightly different from what ships when jessie gets released |
| 15:42.25 | jelly | SynrG: yes, seems to be linked from the alioth page |
| 15:42.35 | SynrG | and from /list #debian-gnome @ oftc |
| 15:42.41 | jelly | shiny |
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| 15:43.26 | daifuco | hello I tried to install jessie from the beta 2 net installer but it could not find the kernel!!! O_o I am pretty sure i used that same installer when it was released in november |
| 15:43.33 | SynrG | L0aD1nG: i use it. "right now" is relative here, too. currently on lxde |
| 15:43.57 | SynrG | daifuco: did you screw up how you wrote the boot media? |
| 15:44.23 | SynrG | i.e. don't use unetbootin and its ilk |
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| 15:44.45 | SynrG | just cp (or dd) and sync |
| 15:44.46 | daifuco | yes it was unetbootin |
| 15:44.53 | SynrG | yeah. don't do that. it's a steaming pile |
| 15:44.56 | SynrG | !unetbootin |
| 15:44.57 | dpkg | UNetbootin (Universal Netboot Installer) allows creation of bootable USB drives for a variety of Linux distributions. http://unetbootin.sf.net/ Not recommended for use with Debian CD/DVD images, as it mangles the installer in cruel and unusual ways, resulting in hard to debug problems. Ask me about <hybrid images>, <usb install>, <win32diskimager>. |
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| 15:45.27 | daifuco | oh shit , I didnt read that |
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| 15:45.42 | daifuco | thanks!!! |
| 15:45.43 | SynrG | !usb install |
| 15:45.43 | dpkg | You can install Debian from a USB stick/thumbdrive/pen drive/key on x86 systems, as long as your system's BIOS can boot from USB. Details are in the Installation Guide, see http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch04s03 and ask me about <install debian> for hybrid CD/DVD images. Use http://sf.net/projects/win32diskimager/ to write images from Windows. For BIOSes not capable of USB boot, ask me about <plop>. |
| 15:45.49 | SynrG | that ^^ |
| 15:46.08 | daifuco | oh I see |
| 15:47.29 | L0aD1nG | So the only way to install and image on a USB properly on Debian is by hand...? |
| 15:47.37 | L0aD1nG | an image* |
| 15:48.16 | nkuttler | L0aD1nG: wat? |
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| 15:50.52 | L0aD1nG | Does debian provide an image without graphical enviroment? Installing the base system and let you install the graphical enviroment by hand? |
| 15:51.08 | L0aD1nG | I think I searched for it in the past without luck. |
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| 15:52.53 | GuidovanPossum | so after trying installing for a long time yesterday, I changed the format of the USB I was trying to netinst from Master Boot Recort to Don't Partition using DiskUtil |
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| 15:54.34 | GuidovanPossum | and copied the iso over to it, then when I restarted the install machine with it in it gave me the choice of loading from that USB or UEFI same USB |
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| 15:55.46 | GuidovanPossum | where the UEFI option wasn't available before and the install is running now thanks, (I'm excited)! |
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| 15:59.52 | JyZyXEL | how can Steam not have amd64 builds |
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| 16:04.18 | jelly | L0aD1nG: yes. All the installer images have that option. |
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| 16:05.00 | jelly | some default to installing a DE, but you can always disable that task |
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| 16:07.40 | darxmurf | by all, good week-end ! |
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| 16:14.28 | jhutchins | GuidovanPossum: Installing on a Mac? |
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| 16:15.52 | jhutchins | L0aD1nG: I believe the minimal install doesn't do the graphical, and I believe in the advanced install you can opt not to install it. I know I've built several servers without a GUI, but don't remember the details. |
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| 16:19.46 | afx237 | jelly: thanks for your strace tip before. turned out to be a file io issue due to the fact that i was using a split unallocated vmdk disk image. on a single allocated raw image now, and its rockin. |
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| 16:23.23 | afx237 | was hanging when writing to disk. so maybe i imagined the htop bit freezing. apt was doing it pretty consistently |
| 16:24.37 | tonythomas | hi ! I am not able to get any output through my laptop headphone jack - its running Debian Wheezy |
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| 16:25.44 | jelly | afx237: we avoid snapshots on vmware like the plague (they're meant only for temporary use), thin allocation seems to work reasonably well tho |
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| 16:28.23 | afx237 | jelly: i was just using a split vmdk image that I'd originally created in vmware. running under kvm now. not doing any snapshots. not sure if the problem was the fact that it was split into separate files or the fact that it wasn't preallocated... maybe it was the split thing seeing you mentioned thin allocation is ok. |
| 16:28.40 | chrisc | jelly: the issue was that all http requests got a spash page with a click through advert for the cafe, but i'm now longer in the same city now... |
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| 16:29.00 | chrisc | however i am getting "A error occurred during the signature verification. The repository is not updated and the previous index files will be used. GPG error: http://security.debian.org wheezy/updates Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG 8B48AD6246925553 Debian Archive Automatic Signing Key (7.0/wheezy) <ftpmaster@debian.org>" ... |
| 16:29.26 | chrisc | s/now/no/ |
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| 16:30.00 | jelly | chrisc: wipe any old /var/lib/apt/lists/*security.debian* /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/*security.debian* and do an update again |
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| 16:30.45 | chrisc | jelly: thanks :-) |
| 16:30.49 | jelly | sometimes partial downloads have a similar result |
| 16:30.56 | chrisc | nods |
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| 16:31.06 | chrisc | jelly: that fixed it :-) |
| 16:31.40 | chrisc | having https on security.debian.org still seems like a good idea to me, fwiw |
| 16:31.54 | chrisc | i'm using https for all other updates |
| 16:32.22 | chrisc | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:32.38 | greycat | I would NEVER want https: on my apt-gets because then it can't be cached. I rely very heavily on a local caching proxy that all my Debian boxes go through. |
| 16:33.44 | chrisc | greycat: fair enough but different people are in different situations... |
| 16:34.13 | jelly | greycat: your cache is just not good enough, then. You could set it up to do decryption/caching/reencryption |
| 16:34.21 | chrisc | fwiw this script mostly work to find https mirrors https://gist.github.com/eighthave/7285154 |
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| 16:35.22 | chicognu | i have debian wheezy dvd2 iso already mounted, i wissh to use it as a local repository, how to do it ? |
| 16:35.49 | EdePopede | how unstable is unstable after all? |
| 16:36.06 | jelly | chrisc: file a Severity: wishlist or minor bug on virtual package "security.debian.org" asking for https://, and explain your use case (esp. the html frame insert in every http request). Maybe if it's easy enough to do, someone might consider it worth the while. |
| 16:36.06 | greycat | EdePopede: 99% of the time it's fine, and 1% of the time it eats your babies |
| 16:36.24 | chicognu | EdePopede, debian unstable are pretty much stable :P |
| 16:36.25 | EdePopede | greycat: fine for me as long as it shares |
| 16:36.36 | jelly | chicognu: that just means you were lucky |
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| 16:36.38 | chrisc | jelly: cheers, i'll do that when i have a spare moment |
| 16:37.40 | chicognu | jelly, i don't use unstable to be honest because i don't need cut edge software, in fact i will be just fine with some software from 1998 |
| 16:37.41 | jelly | chrisc: but with proxying _that_ broken, I wouldn't hope too much |
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| 16:38.05 | chrisc | jelly: the cafe wasn't interefering at all with https traffic, only http... |
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| 16:38.08 | chicognu | but i think unstable are not that much unstable 99% of the time |
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| 16:38.44 | chicognu | i have debian wheezy dvd2 .iso already mounted, i wissh to use it as a local repository, how to do it ? |
| 16:39.04 | greycat | If you're comfortable fixing broken package dependencies and the like, then go ahead and run unstable. Make sure you have reasonable backups of course. |
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| 16:40.47 | jelly | chicognu: man apt-cdrom, perhaps |
| 16:40.48 | EdePopede | and did the situation with nvidia change in the meantime? i suspect it to be the responsible for the freezes since i didn't have this problem before with the ATI |
| 16:41.36 | EdePopede | (so i'm not used to have uptimes of half a year anymore anyway) |
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| 16:45.50 | chicognu | jelly, don't work :( |
| 16:46.18 | jelly | I don't use that at all, sorry |
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| 16:51.21 | Dreamix | Peanut butter, Jelly time! :D |
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| 16:52.33 | tsunamik | I'm trying to patch the rtl8187 driver, so I did `apt-get install linux-source-3.2`, chdir to /usr/src/ unpacked linux-source-3.2.tar.bz2 and copied /boot/config_.._ to .config, applied the patch and did make path/to/driver/d.ko. Everything built successfully, yet im getting "Invalid module format" on insmod and 'no symbol version for module_layout' in dmesg |
| 16:52.43 | tsunamik | whats going on here? |
| 16:53.07 | greycat | If you're building a module from source, you want the linux-headers package that matches your running kernel. |
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| 16:53.33 | tsunamik | greycat: im sure i have the matchig linux-headers package |
| 16:53.45 | greycat | Then you *do not* want the linux-source package. |
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| 16:54.29 | tsunamik | greycat: then how will i rebuild the module? |
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| 16:55.39 | greycat | Oh, so you're not building a module from source. The module is part of the original kernel package, not a standalone thing? |
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| 16:55.53 | tsunamik | greycat: yeah. its rtl8187 |
| 16:56.22 | greycat | !kernel handbook |
| 16:56.22 | dpkg | The Debian Linux Kernel Handbook http://kernel-handbook.alioth.debian.org/ - packaged as debian-kernel-handbook since Debian 7 "Wheezy" - serves as a single access point to all kernel-related documentation. See chapter 4.2 to rebuild official Debian kernel packages, see chapter 4.5 to build a custom kernel from Debian kernel source. |
| 16:56.30 | greycat | that's all I know at this point |
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| 16:57.28 | tsunamik | greycat: thanks |
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| 17:04.56 | g105b | Is it possible to alternately switch all TCP connections over two network interfaces? |
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| 17:09.03 | tsunamik | g105b: probably with some iptables and a control script |
| 17:09.09 | tsunamik | iptables rules** |
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| 17:11.45 | g105b | hmm, not sure I have the ability to do that. Will have to do some reading. |
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| 17:28.11 | ROG3R | Hi, I run debian 32 bits. how come i see 3300MB of RAm being used? http://picpaste.com/pics/screenshot_2015-01-09_08_36_22-VdAappxj.1420824325.png |
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| 17:28.37 | ksk | ROG3R: linux is not windows ;) |
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| 17:29.42 | felix___ | ROG3R: you need more bits |
| 17:29.58 | ksk | ROG3R: the limit is at about 4G, its just a windows thingy you loose some memory |
| 17:30.26 | ksk | are there still pae kernels around? using them you would be able to even address more then 4G using a 32bit kernel |
| 17:30.30 | ROG3R | ksk: i tought it can see 4GB but can only use 3GB.... |
| 17:30.59 | ROG3R | ksk: my kernel is 3.2.0-4-686-pae |
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| 17:32.30 | ROG3R | felix___: How do I know if my machine can handle 64 bit OS ? |
| 17:32.31 | ksk | so you can use maaany rams, to make it short.. |
| 17:33.20 | ROG3R | ksk: my 7 years old can only handle 4GB top |
| 17:33.42 | ksk | ROG3R: dmidecode -t processor - see if you have "flags ..., lm , ..." - or just google your processor ;) |
| 17:33.44 | ROG3R | but for my browsing needs, is enough |
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| 17:33.58 | moss | hi |
| 17:34.06 | moss | oops brb |
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| 17:34.53 | GuestUser1337 | I dd'd an iso of debian 7.7 to a usb thumb drive on my Macbook, and it works great on my PC, and on my Macbook, but on my thinkpad x200 it wont show the menu to boot - any idea why this could be? |
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| 17:35.34 | ksk | does a x200 support booting from usb GuestUser1337? dd-ing to an usbstick is fine in general.. |
| 17:35.49 | ROG3R | ksk Handle 0x0004, DMI type 4, 35 bytes |
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| 17:36.15 | ROG3R | ksk I guess the 35 bytes is the part we were looking for, right ? |
| 17:36.17 | GuestUser1337 | ksk: yes it does |
| 17:36.37 | GuestUser1337 | ksk: what's funny is - the netboot installer works fine when dd'd to USB stick on my x200, but the amd64 version doesnt |
| 17:36.45 | GuestUser1337 | ksk: my only issue is that i am on slow internet here |
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| 18:01.26 | GuestUser1337 | just tried booting from usb with an i386 version and it still wont boot on my thinkpad x200 |
| 18:01.33 | GuestUser1337 | I think it has to do with UEFI |
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| 18:12.43 | ksk | g105b: eh, that x200 hat 32bit, no? |
| 18:12.51 | ksk | i mean, it had no 64bit cpu |
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| 18:15.07 | g105b | ksk: wrong person? |
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| 18:15.59 | ksk | yes, im sorry. he parted.. |
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| 18:41.06 | Evropi | update on the thing from earlier. Any idea how I can replicate this with a Debian machine? http://www.instructables.com/id/Connect-an-Xbox-360-to-Wirless-without-an-official/ -- it does seem wonderfully easy in that article... |
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| 18:44.18 | jordanm | interesting, there exists 360s without the built-in wifi that have not bricked yet |
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| 18:45.24 | jordanm | !tell Evropi about bridge setup |
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| 18:46.12 | GeekDude | I'm attempting to install debian on my iMac G3. I think "debian-7.7.0-powerpc-lxde-CD-1.iso" is the iso I'm looking for, can anyone confirm? |
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| 18:47.49 | Evropi | jordanm: thanks! It did brick actually, so it had to get repaired for 3 weeks back in 2009. Then my house flooded in 2010, little did I know the thing was so sturdy that it survived |
| 18:48.15 | Evropi | only had the chance to test it out as a friend came around with his xbox, only the cable going to the power supply needed replacing |
| 18:48.41 | Evropi | so while the software is pants, the build quality is truly outstanding (I also threw it off my table by accident a *lot* of times) |
| 18:48.58 | MrFrood_ | !tell GeekDude about ppc |
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| 18:52.58 | jordanm | Evropi: the hardware is what caused the failures, not the software |
| 18:53.04 | jordanm | Evropi: heating was not adequate |
| 18:53.11 | jordanm | s/heating/cooling/ |
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| 18:56.27 | GeekDude | MrFrood_: It appears that the iMac G3 isn't a popular platform for debian, compared to the iBook |
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| 18:58.34 | shingouz | GeekDude: afaik, the ppc macs can be slightly frustrating at install time. there seem to be a bunch of different flavors of them and they all have their own tricks. |
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| 18:58.56 | GeekDude | A common theme among them is that the xorg config is out of whack |
| 18:58.59 | mns | GeekDude: I run debian on a PowerMac G4, and used to run it on a PwerMac blue/white G3. I didn't have any problems with it. I would suggest you get the net cd ISO, and then install whatever you need after that via network. |
| 18:59.15 | GeekDude | Mine's blue/white. Can I do a netboot over airport? |
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| 19:00.03 | GeekDude | iMac G3 blue/white, slot-loading with airport |
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| 19:00.26 | shingouz | GeekDude: read the install manual first, you'll save yourself (and us) a lot of blood, sweat, and tears ;) |
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| 19:00.35 | GeekDude | shingouz: which install manual? |
| 19:00.39 | mns | I didn't have airport, I just used wired. airport is something you will enable after you've got things installed. I think it requires some firmware or such which isn't there in the installer. |
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| 19:01.11 | shingouz | !tell GeekDude about install manual |
| 19:01.13 | GeekDude | Ah, ok. I'm in a tricky spot when it comes to ethernet (my laptop's ethernet port has gone out) |
| 19:01.18 | shingouz | GeekDude: that one |
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| 19:01.23 | GeekDude | Ah |
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| 19:01.29 | ychaouche | Hello |
| 19:01.36 | ychaouche | Anybody uses ccze ? |
| 19:01.38 | shingouz | just pick the correct version, of course |
| 19:01.43 | shingouz | !anybody |
| 19:01.44 | dpkg | Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>. |
| 19:01.50 | ychaouche | I wish to pipe ccze to less. |
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| 19:02.49 | shingouz | ychaouche: usually it would be done ccze | less (without knowing anything about ccze so ymmv) |
| 19:03.01 | ychaouche | I tried cat /var/log/syslog | ccze | less -R to no avail |
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| 19:03.24 | ychaouche | less -R shows correctly the colors, but has hard times with line breaks. I see ^M everywhere |
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| 19:04.11 | greycat | Is your input source using Microsoft line endings (CR-LF), or Mac line endings (CR)? |
| 19:04.49 | ychaouche | greycat: I don't understand what you just said. I have no idea. |
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| 19:04.53 | ychaouche | what's my input source ? |
| 19:04.59 | ychaouche | ccze ? |
| 19:05.05 | greycat | whatever's producing the ^M stuff |
| 19:05.08 | *** join/#debian vera1 (~vera1@unaffiliated/vera1) |
| 19:05.16 | ychaouche | it's probably ccze |
| 19:05.18 | ychaouche | cat /var/log/syslog | ccze | less -R |
| 19:05.25 | ychaouche | that's my command |
| 19:05.29 | greycat | I don't have a clue what ccze is. |
| 19:05.35 | ychaouche | it's a log colorizer |
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| 19:05.46 | ychaouche | only debian has a packet for it IIRC. |
| 19:05.49 | greycat | Then why is it producing CR (^M) characters? |
| 19:05.50 | ychaouche | package |
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| 19:06.08 | ychaouche | I only see them when I pipe it to less |
| 19:06.08 | *** join/#debian Chakka_ (~smuxi@24.113.9.46) |
| 19:06.17 | ychaouche | otherwise it doesn't print them |
| 19:06.31 | *** join/#debian Cyph3r (~Cyph3r@71-84-66-147.dhcp.rvsd.ca.charter.com) |
| 19:06.32 | ychaouche | or rather I don't see them |
| 19:06.37 | greycat | I bet it does, but your terminal ... |
| 19:06.49 | ychaouche | that's what I wanted to say, yes. |
| 19:07.05 | vera1 | ychaouche: you mean that with less you can see the colored text? |
| 19:07.16 | ychaouche | vera1: no, with less -R |
| 19:07.18 | greycat | OK, well, let's assume it's producing MS-DOS style line endings. Then the fix would be ccze < logfile | tr -d \\r | less -R |
| 19:07.27 | ychaouche | otherwise there's a ton of character codes |
| 19:08.22 | greycat | I can't imagine *why* a Debian program would do such a thing, but if that works, then we know I guessed right. |
| 19:08.52 | ychaouche | ok google told me to use -A switch and that fixed it |
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| 19:09.00 | vera1 | ychaouche: |
| 19:09.02 | ychaouche | sorry I didn't google ard enough |
| 19:09.09 | vera1 | sorry |
| 19:09.12 | vera1 | greycat: |
| 19:09.17 | *** join/#debian FAMAS (~FAMAS@182.48.84.140) |
| 19:09.22 | vera1 | well, there are people that like to colorize their logs |
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| 19:09.44 | ychaouche | vera1: you spot errors, ip adresses and hostnames quicker |
| 19:09.47 | greycat | "-A, --raw-ansi If one wants to enable raw ANSI color sequences instead of using curses, this option does just that." What the fuck.... |
| 19:09.48 | shingouz | ychaouche: when doing syslog, use ccze -p syslog |
| 19:09.54 | vera1 | this is particularly useful when you have a mix of different kind of messages (warnings, different output levels) inside an unique log |
| 19:10.20 | shingouz | greycat: i just tried it. neat. makes the syslog faster to read |
| 19:10.26 | greycat | What idiot wrote a program that emits curses cursor-movement crap to stdout when stdout isn't a tty?? |
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| 19:10.34 | LT9866 | hi |
| 19:10.50 | LT9866 | I have some questions regarding damaged LUKS partition recovery, is anyone up to it? |
| 19:10.58 | greycat | It would be, like, a 1-line change to toggle -A when isatty(1) returns false. |
| 19:10.59 | LT9866 | Q: beginning of an ext4 partition was overwritten, it was encrypted with LUKS, the header has been saved with luksHeaderBackup. Is it possible to access the encrypted data by creating a new partition table and then luksHeaderRestore? |
| 19:11.22 | ychaouche | the -p switch didn't work for me |
| 19:11.49 | ychaouche | ccze: No plugins found. Exiting. |
| 19:12.06 | shingouz | ychaouche: read the manual. "-p syslog" when you do the syslog |
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| 19:12.24 | ychaouche | oh sorry the syslog option not the syslog file ok that worked now :) |
| 19:12.31 | ychaouche | but it didn't change anything |
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| 19:12.54 | ychaouche | I guess even without the -p switch it automagically figured out it's reading syslog and colorized it accordingly |
| 19:13.25 | shingouz | could be. interesting gewgaw |
| 19:14.11 | ychaouche | vera1: what's also nice about it is that you can customize it via a simple css-like file |
| 19:14.23 | ychaouche | vera1: so you can add your own keywords and colors |
| 19:14.29 | vera1 | yeah |
| 19:14.41 | vera1 | well, I'm not a fan of colorized output in logs |
| 19:14.53 | vera1 | but as I said, I have seen some use of it |
| 19:14.58 | vera1 | not with this ccze tool |
| 19:15.16 | vera1 | but with another software |
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| 19:15.59 | vera1 | without the colorized log you become lost pretty fast reading those logs I mention :) |
| 19:16.03 | vera1 | they are quite complex |
| 19:17.43 | tremon | LT9866: why would you need to create a new partition table? |
| 19:18.03 | greycat | Well, I confirmed that you need the -A switch when piping ccze's output to less -R. Which means the author overlooked the most common use-case. |
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| 19:19.20 | shingouz | greycat: and the cczerc does not seem to support the -A so it has to be manually slapped into the command... neat gadget in anycase |
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| 19:20.48 | sweb | is there any good web based (with acl) password manager ? |
| 19:21.41 | LT9866 | tremon: so, do I just write the header at the supposed beginning of the partition? |
| 19:22.29 | greycat | Yes, I was correct. I added one line of code to src/ccze.c and fixed it. |
| 19:22.53 | greycat | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:22.59 | tremon | LT9866: you don't write anything. First you create a backup or snapshot of the current situation, to avoid making things worse |
| 19:23.53 | tremon | LT9866: after that, I recommend you use luksOpen --header, to test whether the luks container can be opened/recognized at all |
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| 19:25.43 | shingouz | greycat: now just get it into the next version of ccze? |
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| 19:26.22 | greycat | A proper fix would also include a sentence in the man page. I'm not sure I'm that dedicated to a thing I've never heard of before today. |
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| 19:28.08 | shingouz | true... maybe i am interested enough to do that one of these days if you are ok with that |
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| 19:28.44 | greycat | You can use my one line of code however you like. I placed it right above the switch (key) line in parse_opt in src/ccze.c |
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| 19:29.46 | jhutchins | greycat: I wonder if this isn't something that got ported over from Windows? |
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| 19:30.46 | greycat | I don't know. The program is very weird. If you *don't* pipe it to less, it writes nothing at all. |
| 19:30.57 | feurd | What's the equivalent to the .xsession file in Debian Wheezy? |
| 19:31.08 | greycat | Or at least, I got no output when I ran ccze < /var/log/dpkg.log |
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| 19:31.33 | greycat | feurd: it depends on how you log in. If you login with xdm, then .xsession is correct. |
| 19:31.46 | ychaouche | it works fine without piping to less here |
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| 19:32.10 | shingouz | greycat: i'll slap it into the codebase if i get a sudden inspiration. credit to you if/when i do it |
| 19:32.12 | feurd | greycat: Mhmm. How can I know that? I don't have the .xsession file so I guess I use something else |
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| 19:32.48 | greycat | feurd: if /etc/init.d/gdm exists then it's probably GNOME's gdm. |
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| 19:33.47 | teraflops | feurd: /etc/gdm/Xsession ? |
| 19:33.49 | feurd | greycat: I'm sure it's not Gnome. I use I3wm, but I installed a session launcher in "light" something... |
| 19:34.16 | teraflops | feurd: also ~/.xprofile? |
| 19:34.27 | greycat | feurd: well, figure out how you log in. Then figure out how to configure whatever it is. |
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| 19:35.11 | feurd | greycat: can it be lightdm? |
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| 19:35.58 | greycat | If it ends with dm then it sounds like a candidate. |
| 19:36.22 | tuxcrafter | hi all, i was wondering why the kernel in debian stable wheezy is 3.2 but in wheezy backport 3.16 and in sid as well? |
| 19:36.23 | teraflops | feurd: how do you start x btw? |
| 19:36.25 | tuxcrafter | https://packages.debian.org/wheezy/linux-image-amd64 |
| 19:36.41 | tuxcrafter | i am kinda looking for a 3.7 kernel with TRIM support for SSD |
| 19:36.56 | feurd | Ok I'm sure I installed lightdm as a login manager |
| 19:37.13 | feurd | teraflops: Well, it launches when I login, no? |
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| 19:37.32 | teraflops | feurd: login where? |
| 19:38.00 | tuxcrafter | hmm wait |
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| 19:38.18 | tuxcrafter | 3.16 may be higher then 3.2... |
| 19:38.23 | feurd | teraflops: Sorry, I don't understand your question. I launch my computer, there's a login page, I login. |
| 19:38.49 | LT9866 | tremon: but doesn't it need to know the offset where the LUKS container begins to use the --header with luksOpen? |
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| 19:40.12 | teraflops | feurd: thats weird you dont know where are you login, anyway did you see search sometnig like that? https://faq.i3wm.org/question/2483/howto-debian-wheezy-lightdm-i3/ |
| 19:40.19 | *** part/#debian Feaso (~Feaso@gateway/tor-sasl/feaso) |
| 19:40.21 | feurd | teraflops: This login page should be provided by lightgm, because before I installed it, I had to login from the terminal, and then launch stratx |
| 19:40.28 | teraflops | s/see/search |
| 19:40.54 | teraflops | feurd: that is easy to find out |
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| 19:41.05 | tremon | LT9866: what got overwritten? The beginning of a partition, or the beginning of your disk? |
| 19:41.54 | feurd | teraflops: What is this see/search thing? |
| 19:42.11 | feurd | feels dumb |
| 19:42.24 | teraflops | feurd: typo i just meant search not see search |
| 19:42.44 | feurd | teraflops: search for a xsession file? |
| 19:43.27 | LT9866 | tremon: beginning of the disk |
| 19:43.36 | feurd | all I have are .xssesion-errors |
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| 19:43.56 | tremon | LT9866: ah. Yes, in that case you need to recreate the partition table first. |
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| 19:44.34 | tremon | LT9866: unless you used GPT partitioning, in which case a copy of the partition table is at the end of the disk |
| 19:44.52 | Nightray | Hello |
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| 19:45.18 | Nightray | could anyone help me with installing Debian? I am not sure about partition sizes |
| 19:46.15 | LT9866 | tremon: or open it with losetup at the proper offset? |
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| 19:47.44 | tremon | LT9866: If you feel comfortable with losetup, that's probably a better option yes |
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| 19:48.37 | mtn | Nightray: http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/35676/how-to-choose-a-partition-scheme-for-your-linux-pc/ |
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| 19:48.46 | LT9866 | tremon: and how would I find out the offset at which the luks container begins? |
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| 19:50.19 | tremon | LT9866: you'd have to guess, or use a program like testdisk to scan the disk for known partition signatures |
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| 19:50.37 | LT9866 | ok |
| 19:51.10 | LT9866 | tremon: and does luks container begin right after the partition table? |
| 19:51.18 | jhutchins | Nightray: You can take the 'suggested' sizes, but they make very archaic assumptions. I usually recommend 1 partition + swap. |
| 19:51.28 | tremon | usually the first partition starts either at (63*512) bytes or at 1MB, depending on which tool you used to create the partitions |
| 19:51.59 | jhutchins | Nightray: Unless you know exactly what your system will be doing and where data will accumulate, chopping the system up into partitions guarantees that you will run out of space on one when there is plenty on another. |
| 19:52.11 | Nightray | mtn, jhutchins, quick question. I can have only 4 primary partitions, I ona dedicate two to windows. Two to linux |
| 19:52.38 | Nightray | and Debian guids recomend chopping everything into separate partitions |
| 19:52.42 | mtn | Nightray: I would say one for / and then a swap partition |
| 19:52.52 | jhutchins | Nightray: If you make the fourth partition an extended partition you can have more than four. |
| 19:53.13 | mtn | I'll bet the link I gave him mentions that :P |
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| 19:54.19 | jhutchins | Nightray: That multiple partition arrangement really dates back to when hard drives were the size of washing machines and held like 1MB. |
| 19:54.31 | Nightray | jhutchins so / primary and /home, /usr, /var, /tmp extended? |
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| 19:55.06 | mtn | yuck |
| 19:55.08 | ninti | Hi, I have a question |
| 19:55.10 | greycat | Don't forget swap. |
| 19:55.24 | tremon | Nightray: don't fragment your disk. I recommend at most three partitions, swap, / and /home. |
| 19:55.24 | jhutchins | Nightray: Again, I recommend that you have one partition for / and one for swap. |
| 19:55.28 | teraflops | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:55.30 | ninti | With Debian 8 is dpkg not more? |
| 19:55.41 | *** part/#debian ychaouche (~chaouche@41.200.54.243) |
| 19:55.49 | mtn | ninti: don't worry, it is still there |
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| 19:55.53 | greycat | A separate /home is nice if you want to experiment and keep your $HOME across reinstalls, multiple OSes on the same system, etc. |
| 19:55.58 | jhutchins | Nightray: For some systems, var is what uses up all the space, for others it's /home. Unless you know, make it a single partition. |
| 19:56.03 | ninti | mtn: thanks! :) |
| 19:56.19 | jhutchins | A seperate home isn't necessary if you have backups of /home. |
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| 19:56.39 | greycat | (Well, for me /home is NFS mounted from a different box anyway.) |
| 19:56.40 | tremon | ... and have the time to restore 2TB worth or junk :) |
| 19:56.49 | tremon | s/or/of/ |
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| 19:57.16 | ninti | I have next and last question :) when i install new debian, but my partitions are on it still, can i at installationroutine give the same username? |
| 19:57.18 | jhutchins | There's also the issue that different versions of software may reconfigure the hidden configuration files such that they can't be used by older versions. |
| 19:57.34 | greycat | Rare enough that I just deal with that on a case by case basis if it happens. |
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| 19:58.06 | ninti | dont will deleted my old files? |
| 19:58.06 | tremon | ninti: you can, but it may not preserve your existing userid nor group memberships |
| 19:58.06 | jhutchins | ninti: Yes, user@server1 != user@server2 - but the same name might have a different numeric ID, and the numeric ID is what counts. |
| 19:58.24 | Nightray | jhutchins ok, so /var nad /home as one. but I am correct as for the scheme? / primary and the rest of them as extended? |
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| 19:58.55 | jhutchins | Nightray: Again, / is one partition. /var and /home are folders on that partition. |
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| 19:59.45 | jhutchins | The engineers in the next cube are currently discussing partition sizes for the system they have to rebuild because they ran out of space on one of the partitions. |
| 19:59.47 | tremon | Nightray: whether you put everything as extended partitions, or which one you use as primary makes no difference |
| 20:00.02 | jhutchins | A large datacenter means different policies and constraints. |
| 20:00.36 | ninti | see you later :) and have a nice time with Debian! :) |
| 20:01.22 | Nightray | tremon, jhutchins I don't know much about Linux. I've been using Ubuntu for some time, but I hate unity so I thought about checking out Debian. I's probably a terrible mistake, cuz I am too stupid for ubuntu, so Debian will eat me up |
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| 20:02.02 | jhutchins | Nightray: Or maybe it will teach you what you actually need to know. Ubuntu pretty much avoids you learning anything. |
| 20:02.13 | mtn | Nightray: debian is very easy, you are just over thinking the whole thing |
| 20:03.48 | Nightray | mtn, you will see that after installing Debian I'll be back here in no time asking the most stupid questions you have heard |
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| 20:04.10 | mtn | Nightray: you won't be the first or last, so don't worry about it |
| 20:05.52 | turnedtodust | in my sources.list, I am currently using testing and testing/updates, Could I change that to jessie itself to prevent from pushing to testing when jessie is released as stable? |
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| 20:06.22 | greycat | turnedtodust: yes, I would do that. |
| 20:07.02 | turnedtodust | greycat: thank you |
| 20:07.31 | jhutchins | Nightray: We all had to start somewhere. Reading the documentation and the wiki will help. |
| 20:07.38 | Nightray | btw. Any of you, fine gentlemen, are into gaming? Because I am not really sure if I need that windows partition, but because of Diablo 3 and Heroes of the Storm I feel like I cannot let windows go |
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| 20:08.30 | jhutchins | Nightray: Windows games run best on Windows. No harm in keeping an install around (aside from having to keep it updated). |
| 20:09.06 | jhutchins | Nightray: You might even find that by migrating non-game tasks to Linux you free resources for the games. |
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| 20:10.08 | Nightray | jhutchins, I know. But with my friends buging me to play with them all the time I'll be spending more time on Windows then on Linux. It makes me lazy and I usually end up not using Linux after all |
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| 20:11.04 | jhutchins | Nightray: There are cross-platform (and Linux-only)games, and some Windows games will run under Wine. Steam is gearing up to work on Linux (works in testing?). |
| 20:11.48 | GeekDude | shingouz: I can't the CRT to come on now. I'm not sure what's wrong. I ended up burning a CD anyways and sticking it in, but I'm not holding down "c" as I boot, so it should be booting MacOS, right? I can hear the classic boot sound, but I see nothing |
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| 20:12.45 | jhutchins | GeekDude: Have you checked the relevant mac install pages? |
| 20:13.02 | shingouz | GeekDude: sorry, man. you are talking mac and i only have a very vague idea on how the m68k macs worked. i have never been running a ppc mac |
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| 20:13.31 | jhutchins | !ppc |
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| 20:13.32 | dpkg | PowerPC is a <RISC> architecture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerPC). See "Debian for PowerPC" at http://www.debian.org/ports/powerpc . Debian CDs are not (and cannot be made) bootable on Old World PowerMacs. Information on proper partitioning is at http://www.alaska.net/~erbenson/doc/mac-fdisk-basics.txt . See also <macsound>, <yaboot>, <quik>, <bootx>, <ppc64>. #debianppc on irc.oftc.net and irc.freenode.net. |
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| 20:14.08 | Nightray | Thanks for all the help. Now I can go install Debian... I'll be back with stupid questions soon enough so take care in meantime! |
| 20:14.21 | zq | hi. i am uid = 1004. for ext4, is possible to map file own by 1003 to my uid = 1004? |
| 20:14.38 | jhutchins | What's funny is that Debian on ppc has better support than osx on ppc. |
| 20:15.19 | greycat | zq: ... why not chown them? |
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| 20:16.23 | jhutchins | zq: You will need to do this as root. |
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| 20:18.28 | tremon | zq: as for your question, no it's not possible |
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| 20:19.04 | rryoumaa | zq: chown, but beware putting symlinks on the command line |
| 20:19.04 | GeekDude | jhutchins: I have looked at the relevant pages. I'm not sure if my CRT problem is actually related or not (Seeing as I'm not actually booting from the CD I've inserted in it) |
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| 20:28.33 | jhutchins | GeekDude: I seem to recall something called a hard reset that cleared BIOS settings. |
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| 20:40.35 | GeekDude | attempts to zap the pram |
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| 20:53.13 | L0aD1nG | jelly: in which part I have the option to disable the graphical installation? |
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| 21:07.13 | jcorgan | is there a way to have apt-get upgrade automatically choose the default 'N' when a conffile already exists? adding -q and DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive doesn't do it |
| 21:07.23 | jcorgan | and -y too |
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| 21:12.46 | jordanm | jcorgan: debconf-set-selections |
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| 21:13.05 | NoiseEee | Hi folks, I've created a new user on my system for someone to work on a specific project (in their home directory). How can I "jail" them to their ~ directory (and subfolders) after the fact? |
| 21:13.28 | tremon | jcorgan: -o dpkg::options=--force-confold. see man dpkg. |
| 21:13.37 | jcorgan | excellent, thanks |
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| 21:14.11 | jordanm | tremon: I think that does the opposite of what he wants |
| 21:14.46 | tremon | jcorgan: in case my suggestion does the opposite of what you want, there's also force-confnew :) |
| 21:15.17 | jcorgan | actually, i want the already installed conffile to continue to be used, not the new one, so i think your original answer is right, but i'll test of course |
| 21:15.24 | aisqwe | how can i make my windowing system to show everything smaller without changing the resolution |
| 21:15.56 | jhutchins | aisqwe: Painstakingly change the fonts for every element. |
| 21:15.58 | jcorgan | thanks again |
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| 21:17.25 | aisqwe | jhutchins: i imagine there would be a more sufficient way implemented by now |
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| 21:18.31 | tremon | NoiseEee: if it's a local user, you can't. At least not in a sane way. Jailing a local user means they have no access to any executables on your system |
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| 21:19.01 | greycat | Now I'm wondering what other kind of users you're thinking of. |
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| 21:19.14 | NoiseEee | tremon: hmmm, I see. I do want them to use git. I just don't want them downloading things in other directories other than their home |
| 21:19.24 | greycat | File permissions should cover that. |
| 21:19.36 | greycat | A normal user only has write perms on $HOME, /tmp and /var/tmp. |
| 21:20.08 | jhutchins | NoiseEee: How are they accessing the system? |
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| 21:20.10 | NoiseEee | greycat: right, but in my "database_backups" folder for example, and other 'special' ones, I guess I can just chmod them so only the user can read them eh? |
| 21:20.13 | tremon | greycat: I was thinking of someone accessing the home directory as a samba share or sftp mount |
| 21:20.17 | NoiseEee | jhutchins: ssh |
| 21:20.26 | greycat | tremon: ah. |
| 21:20.53 | jhutchins | NoiseEee: You can do an ssh chroot that restricts them to their home directory. |
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| 21:21.37 | greycat | Only if you install all the programs they will need to run (and all of the shared libs that those programs use, and a miniature /etc/* hierarchy) in the user's chroot. |
| 21:21.58 | greycat | Which is just a daft amount of work for very little gain. |
| 21:22.02 | NoiseEee | jhutchins: that sounds great |
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| 21:24.14 | preyalone | New Debian/Raspbian user. When will transmission 2.84 move from jessie to wheezy? |
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| 21:24.23 | greycat | Never. |
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| 21:24.49 | greycat | Wheezy is a stable release, so it doesn't get new versions of things (except in extremely rare security-fix situations.) |
| 21:25.00 | tremon | ,v transmission |
| 21:25.01 | judd | Package: transmission on i386 -- squeeze: 2.03-2; wheezy-security: 2.52-3+nmu2; wheezy: 2.52-3+nmu2; sid: 2.82-1.1; sid: 2.84-0.2; jessie: 2.84-0.2 |
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| 21:26.01 | rapha | hi! |
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| 21:26.41 | rapha | is there a way i can get a list of packages at the top of the dependency tree, i.e. ones i requested to be installed in the past? |
| 21:27.00 | tremon | aptitude search '~i!~M' |
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| 21:28.26 | babaw | hey guys |
| 21:28.44 | babaw | i need to only download the gdbserver package and its deps--notinstall anything |
| 21:28.46 | babaw | how can i do this? |
| 21:29.04 | greycat | apt-get --download-only install pkgname |
| 21:29.09 | babaw | when i "apt-get download gdbserver", it says it cannot find that package |
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| 21:29.32 | greycat | --download-only install |
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| 21:30.19 | babaw | it says gdb is already the newest version |
| 21:30.34 | babaw | but i 1) am not installing it, and 2) want gdbserver, not gdb itself |
| 21:30.52 | babaw | gdbserver is not going to be installed locally |
| 21:31.33 | babaw | any ideas? |
| 21:32.03 | greycat | *sigh* |
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| 21:34.08 | abrotman | !apt-zip |
| 21:34.08 | dpkg | Update a non-networked computer using apt and removable media. Just aptitude install apt-zip and read the docs in /usr/share/doc/apt-zip, or ask me about <apt offline> <apt-walkabout>. http://wiki.debian.org/AptZip |
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| 21:36.20 | tremon | NoiseEee: it's not entirely clear to me how you want to set things up, but if all you want is to provide a git repository to a remote user, you could set up git-daemon or use the command= option in authorized_keys to restrict your users without jailing them |
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| 21:39.33 | jcorgan | --force-confold solved my problem, now another question |
| 21:39.52 | jcorgan | how do i stop dpkg from trying to restart services when updating packages in a chroot? |
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| 21:43.34 | LT9866 | xvkbd is not working...is there an on-screen keyboard with foreign languages like it that works? |
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| 21:47.05 | babaw | greycat: i ran the command you said and got "gdbserver is already the newest version." |
| 21:47.25 | greycat | babaw: ok, then maybe try: apt-get --reinstall --download-only install gdbserver |
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| 21:48.11 | babaw | Reinstallation of gdbserver is not possible, it cannot be downloaded. |
| 21:48.12 | babaw | ??? |
| 21:48.26 | greycat | missing the relevant sources.list entry? |
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| 21:49.01 | babaw | so i should let you know that "apt-get download gdbserver" gives: E: Can't find a source to download version '7.4.1+dfsg-0.1' of 'gdbserver:amd64' |
| 21:49.09 | babaw | greycat: maybe the name is wrong? |
| 21:49.14 | greycat | I never said to run "apt-get download" anything. |
| 21:49.27 | babaw | yea i tried both variations |
| 21:49.43 | babaw | i just read the manpage |
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| 21:50.07 | greycat | ,versions gdbserver |
| 21:50.08 | judd | Package: gdbserver on i386 -- squeeze: 7.0.1-2+b1; squeeze-backports: 7.3-1~bpo60+1; wheezy: 7.4.1+dfsg-0.1; jessie: 7.7.1+dfsg-5; sid: 7.7.1+dfsg-5; experimental: 7.8.1-1 |
| 21:50.23 | GeekDude | jhutchins: pressing the CUDA button fixed it |
| 21:50.29 | rapha | tremon: thank you! |
| 21:50.31 | greycat | Are you *sure* your sources.list is intact, and that you've done an apt-get update? |
| 21:50.46 | babaw | ahh ok |
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| 21:52.35 | tworkin | in gnome on jessie is there a way to "maximize window to left/right half of screen" like windows+left or windows+right in win7? |
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| 21:53.18 | mtn | tworkin: you mean snap to left or right half of screen? |
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| 21:53.54 | tworkin | sure |
| 21:54.07 | tworkin | oh wow its the same keystroke |
| 21:54.19 | tworkin | lol. :| |
| 21:54.20 | mtn | tworkin: yes, by default. heh, you didn't even try it?!! |
| 21:54.30 | rapha | tremon: there's still packages in that list that are being depended on by packages installed after them. can these also be removed from the list? |
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| 21:55.36 | mtn | tworkin: by the way, windows got it from linux ;) |
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| 21:55.57 | tworkin | sure i was just trying to specify :) |
| 21:56.11 | en1gma | debian amd64 on z97 chipset using onboard hdmi out through cpu. i have no sound |
| 21:56.33 | en1gma | is there a fix or do i just have something configured wrong |
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| 21:57.12 | jhutchins | !alsa checklist |
| 21:57.12 | dpkg | 1) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out & in again) 2) unmute and raise channels w/ alsamixer (also try muting some & toggle jack sense if available) 3) <pulseaudio> or other daemon stopped? 4) speakers on? 5) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? 6) purge any installed <oss4> packages to remove ALSA blacklist. See also <list alsa users>, <alsa firmware>. |
| 21:57.33 | babaw | greycat: yea i just ran "apt-get update" and im still gettin gthe same errors |
| 21:57.52 | greycat | gdbserver should be in a standard repository. I don't know what you've done to muck things up. |
| 21:57.59 | jhutchins | en1gma: Start with the checklist. Your hardware is a bit unusual, you may find more knowledge in mailing lists and forums. |
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| 21:58.34 | babaw | greycat: i have this is sources.list |
| 21:58.35 | babaw | deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free |
| 21:58.47 | babaw | thats what it would use, right? |
| 21:58.51 | en1gma | yea. dont come to the debian chat channel and ask anything. my hardware is very usual |
| 21:59.03 | greycat | babaw: yes, that looks fine |
| 21:59.20 | babaw | i have updates pending on my system. would that matter? |
| 21:59.31 | babaw | like new packages i need to update? |
| 21:59.49 | tremon | rapha: I guess you could add !~R~i to that query to filter out packages that are also required by a dependency, however there may be circular dependencies so that might give skewed results |
| 22:00.50 | LT9866 | how do you get xvkbd work? It just makes sound when clicked upon , does not print anything |
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| 22:01.06 | LT9866 | IT works out of the box in Fedora |
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| 22:01.26 | tremon | rapha: my workflow includes running aptitude search '?installed ?not(?automatic) ?reverse-Depends(?installed)' (which is ~i !~M ~R~i) a few times a year, and markauto'ing those packages to keep the manual-list short |
| 22:01.32 | babaw | greycat: any other ideas? |
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| 22:02.19 | greycat | Fix anything you can see that's obviously not right, like those "pending" packages you mentioned, just on general principle. Then see if *other* things can't be downloaded (like, I dunno, bash or binutils). |
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| 22:08.39 | LT9866 | SOmething is wrong with xvkbd...it does not print anything and "Automatic click" OFF does not go away |
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| 22:09.13 | LT9866 | Click it Off then reopen Properties and it's Off again |
| 22:11.21 | LT9866 | xvkbd is so broke..does not stay on top either when selected so in Properties |
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| 22:16.42 | LT9866 | Ok, I got it printing, needed to "focus" but after every click it reverts back to english from the foreign layout |
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| 22:23.13 | LT9866 | ok found it...seems like enabling "lock AltGr" keeps layout from changing...how bizarre |
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| 22:24.40 | brentaarnold | What are some of your favorite every-system programs you like to use? |
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| 22:25.01 | brentaarnold | And by every-system I do mean just Debian :P |
| 22:25.52 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: vim |
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| 22:25.57 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: screen |
| 22:26.00 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: ssh |
| 22:26.10 | brentaarnold | sudo apt-get install ssh |
| 22:26.13 | brentaarnold | ? |
| 22:26.30 | brentaarnold | yes thats correct lol |
| 22:27.16 | brentaarnold | Are there any Debian equivalents to MS' SQL Management Studio? |
| 22:27.17 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: I like vim-nox |
| 22:27.31 | brentaarnold | jhutchins: Never heard of it, sounds interesting though |
| 22:27.43 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: I suppose the closest thing would be phpMyAdmin for MySQL. |
| 22:27.49 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: It's web based. |
| 22:27.56 | brentaarnold | right |
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| 22:28.28 | jhutchins | brentaarnold: There are several levels of vim, including one with a drict Xwindows interface. I want everything except the gui, which Debian packages as -nox (no x). |
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| 22:29.16 | brentaarnold | jhutchins: Niiiice, I understand |
| 22:29.58 | jhutchins | I almost always install nmap and lynx too. |
| 22:31.41 | brentaarnold | What are those two? |
| 22:31.42 | brentaarnold | I'll google it |
| 22:31.44 | brentaarnold | fmw |
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| 22:33.19 | brentaarnold | Are there any Debian equivalents to Fedora's DevAssistant? |
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| 22:43.15 | rapha | tremon: thanks again; that pointed me at some good pieces of documentation i'd never seen so far. |
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| 22:44.29 | rapha | tremon: what do you do with things such as libc, bash, base-files? do you allow these to be markauto'd, too? |
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| 22:54.28 | babaw | anyone else having issues contacting wheezy package repos? |
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| 22:55.38 | tremon | rapha: yes, those packages are marked as automatically installed. IIRC you can markauto any package that is marked as essential (aptitude markauto ~E), as they will never be removed anyway |
| 22:59.01 | Quatroking | can i end an ssh session but keep the programs i started running? |
| 22:59.19 | Vroomfondle | Quatroking: you can if you use GNU Screen |
| 22:59.31 | Quatroking | well, crap, i didn't |
| 22:59.36 | teraflops | Quatroking: or tmux |
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| 23:00.07 | Quatroking | I ssh'd into my debian box and opened gparted using xming on my windows box |
| 23:00.18 | Quatroking | went to format a 2tb drive and it's still busy with that |
| 23:01.13 | Vroomfondle | an X app? hrm... others with more experience of remote X may correct me on this, but I think you need to keep the connection open |
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| 23:02.30 | Quatroking | Yeah, X. runs pretty well too, really low latency http://a.pomf.se/zmmsnx.png |
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| 23:03.12 | teraflops | Quatroking: use a login manager or something like *vnc* |
| 23:03.36 | Quatroking | isn't vnc for full remote desktop? |
| 23:03.56 | teraflops | yep |
| 23:04.13 | GeekDude | jhutchins: New battery for the iMac G3 bios ordered to be here tuesday. Turns out it can't boot properly without it |
| 23:04.17 | Quatroking | yeah I'm not really looking for that, what i got now is per-program |
| 23:04.31 | Quatroking | so it merges really well with my desktop |
| 23:04.35 | paultag | Quatroking: you're looking for screen for X? |
| 23:05.04 | paultag | Quatroking: so, the way X forwarding works over SSH makes that really hard, and no one's bothered to implement it (if so) |
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| 23:05.19 | Quatroking | paultag, I came to ask if I could keep gparted running while closing my ssh connection, but the answer seems to be "no" |
| 23:05.20 | paultag | (since you mangle DISPLAY to hit the local X forwarded to the target box) |
| 23:05.38 | paultag | so you'd need a screen-like X session to attach back out of |
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| 23:05.43 | paultag | but no one's done this as far as I know |
| 23:06.07 | OSVG | Quatroking: Is the SSH connection over CLI? |
| 23:06.12 | OSVG | Or is it some sort of gui? |
| 23:06.18 | Quatroking | CLI |
| 23:06.21 | Quatroking | i use putty |
| 23:06.25 | OSVG | Because if it's CLI, then yes, that is what screen is made for. |
| 23:06.41 | paultag | well, screen on your local machine won't work if you shut your laptop down |
| 23:06.50 | paultag | since that will break the X connection by breaking the SSH connection |
| 23:06.55 | faca | hi, i have a crypt partitions and raid0 (stupid mdadm)... and /boot in pendrive..... pendrive crash, howto recovery entery /boot ? write now o boot whitch systemrescuecd... mount mdadm, mount crupt, chroot to real root..... put new stupid pendrive... |
| 23:06.57 | OSVG | Screen needs to be installed on the receiver, yes. |
| 23:07.00 | faca | sorry for my english |
| 23:07.02 | paultag | sigh |
| 23:07.06 | Quatroking | the whole chain is MTPuTTY>PuTTY>SSH>X over SSH |
| 23:07.09 | Vroomfondle | thing is, by the sound of it Quatroking already has a process running which he wishes to continue with |
| 23:07.17 | Quatroking | Yeah I have |
| 23:07.17 | OSVG | Ok, so why the x over ssh? |
| 23:07.29 | Quatroking | OSVG, so I can run X programs |
| 23:07.31 | paultag | so you can use a X app on the remote box locally |
| 23:07.49 | OSVG | Ok, obviously I'm misunderstanding the question here, so I'll bow out. |
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| 23:08.13 | Quatroking | I'm too lazy to walk all the way to the other side of my room, turn on my old 20" CRT tube, use the crappy keyboard and do my stuff there while I could just SSH in and run X stuff this way |
| 23:08.17 | paultag | the answer you're looking for is "No one's written that yet because it's hard and most people tend to find workarounds" |
| 23:08.38 | Vroomfondle | also: "even if they had, you already started the process so, sorry, you're stuck" |
| 23:08.41 | Vroomfondle | :) |
| 23:08.51 | Quatroking | then I'll just keep my windows rig running :) |
| 23:08.51 | faca | please help |
| 23:08.59 | faca | this server is mail server... :( |
| 23:09.13 | Vroomfondle | is that a bad thing, faca? |
| 23:09.25 | Vroomfondle | did you not want a mail server? |
| 23:09.29 | Quatroking | my condolences |
| 23:09.35 | faca | Vroomfondle, i have a crypt partitions and raid0 (stupid mdadm)... and /boot in pendrive..... pendrive crash, howto recovery entery /boot ? write now o boot whitch systemrescuecd... mount mdadm, mount crupt, chroot to real root..... put new stupid pendrive... |
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| 23:11.17 | Vroomfondle | er... blimey |
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| 23:11.45 | Vroomfondle | if /boot is gone and you have no backup I don't think there's anything you can do except start again, and then mount your encrypted RAID from the new install |
| 23:12.16 | Quatroking | why would you have /boot on a pendrive |
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| 23:12.53 | Quatroking | I'm sorry if I'm thinking wrong here but that sounds as bad as my seagate NAS storing its settings and OS on the drive itself instead of on-board flash storage |
| 23:13.12 | Vroomfondle | Quatroking: that does sound really dumb |
| 23:13.27 | Quatroking | Vroomfondle, no kidding, once the drive died the entire unit died |
| 23:13.47 | Quatroking | guess what drive I'm reformatting now! |
| 23:13.51 | Vroomfondle | I'm fairly sure my Synology doesn't do that... at least, I hope it doesn't... I have just assumed it doesn't because it didn't occur to me that it might be silly enough to store the OS on the array |
| 23:13.55 | Vroomfondle | heh |
| 23:14.24 | Quatroking | You want another joke? This was the initial partition layout: http://a.pomf.se/wdyfdp.png |
| 23:14.29 | OSVG | Synologys do not do that. They store their firmware on an embedded flash. |
| 23:14.41 | babaw | hey guys |
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| 23:14.53 | Quatroking | the NAS is a 1-drive unit. Why would you ever use raid at all |
| 23:14.54 | babaw | if im running wheezy and i run dist-upgrade, what will happen? |
| 23:15.03 | babaw | will it install a newer distribution on debian? |
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| 23:16.02 | Vroomfondle | OSVG: I'm glad of the confirmation! |
| 23:16.09 | Vroomfondle | Quatroking: was it cheap, at least? |
| 23:16.23 | OSVG | Vroomfondle: My business deploys a lot of synologies. Good stuff. |
| 23:16.34 | Vroomfondle | babaw: only if you have edited your /etc/apt/source.list and /etc/apt/sources.list.d/* files and then run apt-get update |
| 23:16.35 | Quatroking | i paid a 100 bucks for it, got it on discount |
| 23:16.57 | babaw | Vroomfondle: yea i just updated sources.list |
| 23:16.58 | Quatroking | damn thing started breaking 2 weeks after the warranty ran out |
| 23:17.08 | babaw | i ran update |
| 23:17.11 | babaw | and it updated |
| 23:17.17 | babaw | then upgrade, and it didnt do anythning |
| 23:17.19 | Vroomfondle | OSVG: yeah, very happy with this one so far. It's only the cheapest of the range so the processor's a bit slow, but for my (single-user) purposes it is very good and the OS is excellent |
| 23:17.25 | babaw | but i cannot incall mplayer |
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| 23:17.33 | babaw | E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages. |
| 23:17.39 | babaw | install* |
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| 23:17.50 | Vroomfondle | what did you try to upgrade to? Testing? |
| 23:18.05 | Quatroking | I've been running it with an amber light for over a year because it had 2 dead sectors at the very end of the drive |
| 23:18.28 | babaw | no |
| 23:18.36 | babaw | i just changed the mirrors |
| 23:18.42 | babaw | rand update, and then upgrade |
| 23:18.44 | babaw | nothing else |
| 23:18.47 | Vroomfondle | oh, well that will make no difference |
| 23:18.57 | babaw | but im having some issues with package deps |
| 23:19.01 | Vroomfondle | each mirror is the same as the others. Hence they are called "mirrors" :) |
| 23:19.17 | babaw | but the previous mirror was down and giving 404s for awhile |
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| 23:19.23 | Vroomfondle | Quatroking: 100 bucks == $100? So, about £70 or something like that? |
| 23:19.24 | babaw | so i think some part of my packages might be out of sync |
| 23:19.28 | babaw | ie old |
| 23:19.34 | babaw | from a few months |
| 23:20.11 | Quatroking | Vroomfondle, ah, sorry, 100 eurobucks |
| 23:20.12 | Vroomfondle | if update + upgrade/dist-upgrade did nothing, that suggests that apt thinks you're up to date |
| 23:20.25 | babaw | i havent done dist-upgrade yet |
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| 23:20.38 | babaw | will that upgrade to something newer than wheezy? |
| 23:20.45 | Quatroking | though I wouldn't be surprised if it was sold in the US for the same damn amount but with a dollar sign instead |
| 23:21.11 | Vroomfondle | babaw: if you haven't specifically put the newer release in your sources.list, it won't upgrade to a newer release, no |
| 23:21.25 | babaw | ok |
| 23:21.34 | Vroomfondle | Quatroking: so about £80 then. Well, fairly cheap. |
| 23:21.38 | babaw | so i should dis-upgrade now if i only changed the mirror, right? |
| 23:21.48 | Quatroking | yeah, I'm never buying seagate ever again |
| 23:22.16 | Vroomfondle | even so I'd expect it to keep the OS in firmware. Why on earth does it need a gigabyte of disk space for an OS which is just managing a RAID?! ;) |
| 23:22.22 | Vroomfondle | babaw: it will not hurt |
| 23:22.41 | babaw | wtf it says theres nothing to update... |
| 23:23.05 | Vroomfondle | that means you are up to date. Have you done "apt-get -f install" ? |
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| 23:24.20 | babaw | <PROTECTED> |
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| 23:25.50 | Vroomfondle | babaw: what does it say if you do "apt-get install libdvdnav4" ? |
| 23:26.19 | babaw | libdvdnav4 is already the newest version. |
| 23:27.08 | faca | howto create new /boot ? old crash (pendrive) |
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| 23:27.16 | faca | heeelp please |
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| 23:27.39 | jhutchins | babaw: dist-upgrade will do a couple of things that a regular upgrade won't do, but it won't change which release you're running unless you've changed that in the sources.list. |
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| 23:28.05 | jhutchins | babaw: It will upgrade the kernel, and if there are packages that have different names that replace existing packages it will do that upgrade. |
| 23:28.08 | babaw | jhutchins: yea but dist-upgrade is not installing anything |
| 23:28.13 | babaw | and i have this issue with mplayer |
| 23:28.16 | jhutchins | babaw: That usually only happens when you _are_ upgrading versions. |
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| 23:28.49 | jhutchins | babaw: Yes, you have broken dependencies. Please pastbin your sources.list - I suspect you might have mixed versions. |
| 23:28.57 | jhutchins | !paste |
| 23:28.57 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: http://paste.debian.net/ http://pastie.org/ or http://picpaste.com/ for pics. Use wikisend.com for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 23:29.51 | babaw | http://pastebin.com/qgxrhe9Y |
| 23:31.35 | faca | this channel is support ? |
| 23:31.55 | jhutchins | babaw: Have you installed packages from any other non-debian sources? |
| 23:32.00 | Vroomfondle | yes faca, but you have an odd problem |
| 23:32.11 | Vroomfondle | most people do not run their /boot from a pen drive! |
| 23:32.41 | jhutchins | Vroomfondle: You can try (re)installing grub and the kernel, but that might not generate an initramfs. |
| 23:32.51 | jhutchins | Vroomfondle: You might have to do that manually. |
| 23:32.55 | jhutchins | !initramfs |
| 23:32.56 | dpkg | hmm... initramfs is the new <initrd>. See http://www.ducea.com/2006/10/10/debian-etch-kernels/ for Sarge and Etch kernel differences (forward looking as we know it prior to etch's release), or ask me about <initramfs debug>. See also <targeted>. http://wiki.debian.org/initramfs |
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| 23:33.01 | faca | Vroomfondle,if you need crypt partitions and raid !!!! howto ? you need another disk to stupid grub but stupid grub don't go in crypt raid partitiones... |
| 23:33.02 | jhutchins | !dracut |
| 23:33.03 | dpkg | hmm... dracut is a "cross-distribution" <initramfs> (a cpio archive of the initial filesystem that gets loaded into memory at boot time) which looks to replace the initramfs patchwork. http://lwn.net/Articles/317793/ |
| 23:33.49 | Vroomfondle | faca: I think usually you put your /boot in an unencrypted raid partition and put the rest in encrypted. |
| 23:34.17 | faca | Vroomfondle, if you identical disk, don't more space to another partition in one disk.... |
| 23:34.48 | Vroomfondle | faca: /boot is small, it doesn't take much space... |
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| 23:36.05 | babaw | jhutchins: no i dont think so |
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| 23:36.31 | babaw | jhutchins: i compiled a few apps from source though... |
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| 23:36.52 | faca | Vroomfondle, in another time, the disk have a boot partition crash !!!!, for this reason i use pendrive... but fs linux in pendrive is DISASTER!!! it is a This is the third pendrive crash... o don't have another... only old copy |
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| 23:38.44 | jhutchins | babaw: Did you try aptitude -f install? |
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| 23:39.23 | jhutchins | faca: Anything on a pen drive isn't really yours. |
| 23:40.18 | babaw | jhutchins: ok, thats giving me an option now |
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| 23:42.07 | babaw | jhutchins: libdvdnav4 : Breaks: mplayer (< 2:1.0) but 2:1.0~rc4.dfsg1+svn34540-1+b2 is to be installed. |
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| 23:42.16 | faca | Vroomfondle, sorry, o try now update-initramfs -u -t and FAILD grrrrr "warning: error while trying to store keymap file - ignoring request to install /etc/boottime.kmap.gz |
| 23:42.32 | babaw | and i chose: Keep the following packages at their current version: 1) mplayer [Not Installed] |
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| 23:42.52 | babaw | but then some text flashed in-place and mplayer was not actually installed |
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| 23:44.18 | faca | can downloaded /boot to stable debian ? entery boot directory ??? howto ? i need entery dir |
| 23:46.43 | babaw | jhutchins: any i dont see mplayer in my path |
| 23:47.03 | babaw | jhutchins: so i guess it didnt install mplayer |
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| 23:56.17 | babaw | jhutchins: any idea what i should try now? |
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