IRC log for #debian on 20170405

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00:02.19pylepfc4evrfuck u crooked ni66er dick suckin lyin thieving girl murdering nazi jew trash. you bastards need to die and burn in hell 4evr
00:03.41mutantepylepfc4evr: that's reserved for people who randomly insult strangers
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00:03.48pylepfc4evrat least obiwan cut the goddamn nigger on half for messing with his white friend quai gon
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00:05.20pylepfc4evryou goddamn filth let those nigger trash fire a doctor unjustly
00:05.44karvalhus_lol wtf dude
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00:14.25baribalHi. I installed Dunst as notification daemon, but it doesn't get started automatically, neither at booting nor logging into X, nor when a notification is sent. Also, when it starts, it reports "Name Lost. Is Another notification daemon running?" (but then works just fine nonetheless). How do I check whether a notification daemon is running, and how do I set Dunst to be my default notification daemon?
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00:15.49karvalhus_can't you do something in rc.local?
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00:21.40*** topic/#debian is Debian Stretch frozen 2017-02-05; /msg dpkg stretch freeze | Unwanted private messages? /umode +R | point release 8.7 of Debian Jessie released! /msg dpkg jessie ; /msg dpkg 8.7; /msg dpkg wheezy->jessie ; /msg dpkg install jessie | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | /msg bots NOT people | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next (irc.oftc.net) | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog
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00:25.47karvalhus_guys can you recommend me cli applications like lynx? i want to use just these apps in my desktop
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00:26.40bazhangkarvalhus_, why use a desktop at all with that
00:26.51somiajkarvalhus_: what do you mean like lynx? why not just use lynx? Or are you wanting something along the same lines like links2?
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00:28.42karvalhus_i want apps that can do what i want without a user interface
00:29.02somiajso what kinda of apps do you need, be more specific.
00:29.29karvalhus_text edition, reading, browsing net
00:30.07somiajwell reading/browsing the net you had covered with lynx or links2
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00:30.23somiajtext editors there is nano (default), the big names vim and emacs all run in consoles
00:31.10baribal_Sooo, I wrote a .xsession file, now not even notion gets started...
00:31.19emax0075Hey, I am setting up a VPN, but I am having a pain of a time getting the routing to work right. I am not really sure how to troubleshoot
00:31.45emax0075I am connected. I can see traffic come in and out the tun, but it isn't coming back to my device
00:32.58emax0075actually all I see going out the server connection is DNS queries
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00:40.44somiajbaribal_: well you have to start notion from inside the .xsession file
00:40.47baribal_Ah, got it! Dunst doesn't fork a background process and exit, so a `&` at the end did the trick. And apparently having an .xsession makes all the other Debian magic not work, so I had to start notion in there, too.
00:42.12baribal_Do I assume correctly that dunst, being a child process of the .xsession script, will be killed automatically when my session ends?
00:43.25gryI think yes
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00:45.00twnot unless they're killed by a signal or by systemd.
00:45.05baribal_Excellent. Then I'm one step closer to creating my own personal DE. ^^
00:45.54karvalhus_nice!!
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00:53.34grybaribal_ what is its name?
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00:55.04baribal_gry, er... None? It's not a big project, it's just me using a bunch of tools that don't get in each other's way.
00:55.40gryyou may be able to make a debian blend (oftc #debian-blends) if you think that sharing this with other people would be useful
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00:56.28baribal_Not really... At most I might write a bunch of notes about how to do it, and what options there are for each kind of tool.
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00:59.21grythat would be nice
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01:41.20mekeoruh, i don't understand why rsync skipped files. now i'm using unison to copy a big directory from one disk to another...
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02:40.20acu!utc
02:40.20dpkgCoordinated Universal Time (UTC) is the standard by which the world regulates clocks and time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coordinated_Universal_Time).  For Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later, set "UTC" or "LOCAL" in /etc/adjtime (man 8 hwclock).  For Debian 6.0 "Squeeze", set the UTC option in /etc/default/rcS appropriately (man rcs).  For all systems, run «service hwclock.sh restart» to apply changes.  See also <windows utc>.
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02:41.06SakuraCatcan someone help me with c++ please
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02:46.06dvsSakuraCat, not in this channel
02:46.34SakuraCatyes i know
02:46.42SakuraCatsomeone suggested this to me
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02:46.57SakuraCatI will leave if you want
02:47.02SakuraCatI just needed help on coding
02:47.39HoolootwoI would be very surprised if there wasn't another channel for that
02:48.02SakuraCatI already found 3
02:48.25SakuraCatso I'll just leave now
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02:59.10nickgawHi, I am trying to find the rt package from bestpractical but apt-get install does not show it is it listed as something else?
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03:02.43awal1<PROTECTED>
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03:19.30nickgawI found it in request-tracker4
03:20.23nickgawIs there a way to configure apt to install suggested packages for a certain package like if I do apt-get install request-tracker4 as suggested packages exist can apt install those suggested packages?
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04:01.24awal1nickgaw, what do you mean exactly?
04:02.23awal1if you want suggests of pkg A just do  apt-get/apt --install-suggests install A
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04:03.38awal1by default autoinstalling suggests is set to false
04:04.04nickgawhow do I change it to true?
04:04.12awal1Item: APT::Install-Suggests
04:05.33awal1nickgay, but that will install suggests all the time
04:06.19awal1you may end having all available debian software installed
04:06.27awal140 000 + :D
04:06.58awal1nickgaw
04:07.20awal1man apt, man apt-get, man apt_preferences
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05:01.59paradizelost<PROTECTED>
05:02.20paradizelosti've got one of the usb microscopes i need to have auto-launch and full screen
05:02.58paradizelostgucview /dev/video0 displays, but not full screen and launches other apps
05:03.06paradizelostor rather, the full app with other crap open
05:04.08paradizelostcvlc will launch and play, but it hits full CPU and is a framerate of about 1 frame every minute or so
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05:44.57paradizelostgot it, guvcview has cli options for full screen and no gui
05:45.18gryyay
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06:18.51monstercoI have an HP server connected to an APC UPS. If I take the UPS power cable out of wall (UPS running on battery), the server senses it and shuts off. Server is put on Battery outlet and not on Surge. Why is this happening?
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06:29.18hargutHello.
06:30.08gryhi :)
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06:30.34hargutIs there a way to do a "apt-get build-dep" on a debian/control file? E.g. the package has no binary available. And I'm too lazy to copy that stuff and remove all the (<> xxY) things. :-)
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07:31.02FalsonHello assholes
07:31.10Falsonoh shit sorry
07:31.14FalsonWrong channel
07:31.30FalsonYou are good people, not assholes :)
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08:18.54brontosaurusrex#debian-next < cannot join, must be invited (perhaps you should remove that channel from this channel topic?)
08:19.32petn-randallbrontosaurusrex: It's on OFTC, not on freenode, as it says.
08:19.44brontosaurusrexoh.
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09:09.49lostbitHow much does it cost to use linux?
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09:10.26petn-randalllostbit: Which distro are you using?
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09:10.40lostbitdebian
09:10.53petn-randalllostbit: It costs nothing to install and use.
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09:37.46caraconanHi there. I followed different approaches, such as http://jaqque.sbih.org/kplug/apt-pinning.html but I'm not able to install firefox-esr from SID from apt. Any help will be appreciated. Thanks
09:38.05petn-randall!frankendebian
09:38.05dpkgWhen you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess.  There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try.  See if you can convince ##linux to help.
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09:38.40missmbobwhy the hell would you? jessie and sid have the same firefox esr version
09:38.44petn-randallcaraconan: See above. You should never mix stable and testing/sid on the same system, as it will break lots of things for you in the long run.
09:38.44colo-workcaraconan, why not use http://mozilla.debian.net/ ?
09:39.05petn-randall,v firefox-esr
09:39.06juddPackage: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 45.6.0esr-1~deb8u1; wheezy-security: 45.8.0esr-1~deb7u1; jessie-security: 45.8.0esr-1~deb8u1; stretch: 45.8.0esr-1; sid: 45.8.0esr-1; jessie-backports/firefox-release: 52.0.2esr-1~bpo80+1; experimental: 52.0.2esr-1
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09:39.36caraconanok, I see now its called "experimental", and maybe backports is a good solution. Thanks
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09:41.12petn-randallcaraconan: You can also get the latest firefox releases from http://mozilla.debian.net/, it's conveniently a repository made by the same people packaging firefox for Debian.
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09:41.41caraconancool thanks
09:42.31sine0using a livecd to overwrite data on a harddrive with random junk do i have to specifiy the size with dd or can i just write a command that will stdoutt /dev/urandom to the drive?
09:43.29petn-randallsine0: You can, but /dev/urandom is quite slow for that.
09:43.41petemcand pointless, zeroes work just as well
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09:43.47sine0i read a stack post that said it was quick. wahts the quicker way
09:44.10sine0petn-randall: i will zero it again afterwards, i want an initial random overwrite
09:44.16petn-randallsine0: There was a python script that does it much faster, you'd have to do an internet search. It involved the numpy module IIRC.
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09:44.30sine0ok
09:44.42petemcsine0: no need to do it multiple times
09:45.00petn-randallwhat petemc said
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09:45.33petn-randallsine0: Is it a HDD or SSD?
09:45.37sine0HDD
09:45.49sine0law firm data
09:46.19petn-randallsine0: I'd just do a secure erase with hdparm, then overwrite it if you need to.
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09:47.33DarkStar1Hi people. Where do I drop a service file for systemd in Jessie
09:47.41DarkStar1a custom .service file
09:47.45SlutSex123mist muted me on #freenode for pasting http://imgur.com/m5L2xgp
09:47.59SlutSex123so i found random channel here to come bitch about mist being a fag
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09:48.06rpd_sine0: dd is good if you match the blocksize parameter to HDD maximum write buffer else it will take forever
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09:48.35rpd_better to use dedicated tools like DBAN
09:48.43SlutSex123see, some people don't appreciate a good pair of tits
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09:48.58petn-randall!ops SlutSex123
09:48.58dpkgHydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly: petn-randall complains about: SlutSex123
09:48.59SlutSex123so they mute or ban when paste imgur link
09:49.08SlutSex123!ops dpkg is so fucking gay
09:49.09dpkgHydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly: slutsex123 complains about: dpkg is so fucking gay
09:49.56sine0I want the quickest solution really. I tried DBAN before and it took forever...
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09:50.25petn-randallsine0: secure erase is pretty much the fastest it can get
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09:51.15petn-randallDarkStar1: Usually /etc/systemd/system/. You'll also need to enable it with 'systemctl enable <service>'
09:53.13DarkStar1petn-randall: Thanks
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09:57.02petn-randallDarkStar1: You're welcome!
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09:58.07BluesKajHI folks
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10:05.23teldixHey, can you help me? I have an ubuntu Server that break my whole local network after a while. It also freezes my desktop of the server. After a restart the network and also the desktop are fine again
10:07.11missmbob!ubuntu
10:07.11dpkgUbuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian.  Only Debian is supported on #debian.  Use #ubuntu on chat.freenode.net instead.  Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian.  See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>.
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10:51.11DarkStar1Is there anyway to get the list of say the last 5 system restarts?
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11:04.27rpd_DarkStar1: man last
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11:22.47dadinnhi all
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11:23.49dadinndoes anyone know why the debian live images (gnome-desktop ones) don't boot in KVM?
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11:34.43afidegnumhello, i have been trying for the past many days now, the Fn key is not repsonding in linux/debian, how can i fix it?
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11:39.49nickgaw[A
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11:40.06nickgawhow do I have apt always install suggested packages?
11:40.14richeze<PROTECTED>
11:40.43baribal_afidegnum, I don't think it's even supposed to do anything on it's own, but is used on the hardware side to create another layer of keys.
11:41.14Stumminice password
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11:41.30afidegnumbaribal_: i don't understand
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11:42.05nickgawthink you sent that to the channel your cmdchar might have been changed.
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11:44.12baribal_afidegnum, we're talking about the Fn key that's usually on notebook keyboards, usually on the bottom left with the other modifiers, and used to control volume, brightness, lock the screen etc.?
11:44.46nickgawDoes your system normally require non-free firmware as that might be the case?
11:45.26afidegnumbaribal_: yes
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11:46.06nickgawThere is the linux for laptops site that might  help.
11:47.46afidegnumwell, i can't seems to find a resolute documentation that will fix it up
11:47.49baribal_afidegnum, that key doesn't produce a key event in itself, that's normal; at least it doesn't for me.
11:48.33afidegnumyes, it supposed to work with combinations
11:48.41afidegnumwhich are also not responding,
11:48.49afidegnumi ran xev as well,
11:49.05afidegnumthe other keys are responding except the combination key
11:49.24baribal_I see. Okay, then indeed something's broken, and I have no idea what.
11:49.54nickgawDo you have windows installed as well so you can test out the keys on another operating system?
11:50.52afidegnumi have a dual-boot with windows and the key works on it,
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11:51.13nickgawok that is good then it is not a hardware issue.
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11:52.46afidegnumis there another way to test if the key is functionning apart from xev ?
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12:02.17notwithstandingwhats the most popular desktop for debian jessy?
12:02.18notwithstandinggnome ?
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12:05.55tdnIs there a way to keep the fileindex/file system metadata cached on an ext4 filesystem? Kind of like having a "find /" or "find / -ls" run continously in the background. So that short file lookups are faster.
12:07.59Stumminotwithstanding, depends on your definition of popular
12:08.26Stummiif you want to compare desktops by installation count:  curl -s http://popcon.debian.org/by_inst | grep 'task-.*-desktop'
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13:02.19OtakuSenpai,v jdownloader
13:02.20juddNo package named 'jdownloader' was found in amd64.
13:03.13abffI remember that
13:05.02sine0how can i search for a particular line of code from all files with all subdirectorys of where i am
13:05.19sine0I can grep it right?
13:05.27abffctags
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13:06.42babilensine0: I'm partial to ag
13:06.49babilenjudd: info silversearcher-ag
13:06.50juddPackage silversearcher-ag (utils, extra) in jessie/amd64: very fast grep-like program, alternative to ack-grep. Version: 0.26.0-1; Size: 28.3k; Installed: 113k; Homepage: https://github.com/ggreer/the_silver_searcher
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13:12.25RenariIs there an auto logout feature in debian? I notice my user account gets logged out (which terminates it programs) after a period of inactivity.
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13:13.35BluesKajRenari, laptop? if so then check your power management settings
13:13.49RenariIt's a server, but I'll look there.
13:14.19RenariHm only had turning off the screen when inactive for 10 minutes.
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13:18.25BluesKajRenari, Startup&Shutdown>Desktop Session
13:18.51BluesKajif you're using a desktop
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13:19.22RenariI don't have anything named Startup&Shutdown.
13:19.58BluesKajok, nm , i keep fordetting hardly anyone here uses kde , sorry
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13:33.57jellykde users are well hidden
13:35.09jellybabilen: ag is out, ripgrep is what the cool kids use (notavailableindebianatthistime)
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13:35.59teraflopshey KDE users! are you ashamed of running KDE? lol
13:36.08teraflops.gm
13:36.29teraflopsugh wrong chan sorry
13:36.54teraflopsfeels ashamed now
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13:37.02jelly.pal teraflops
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13:37.08jelly!pal teraflops
13:37.09dpkgpoints at teraflops and laughs
13:37.36teraflopsfair enough hehe
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13:38.27babilenjelly: I'm sure it'll land in Debian eventually
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13:53.14n3sso_o
13:53.28n3ssrunning debiant stretch, trying to run apt-get updaate
13:53.46n3ssit just sits at "get:10 http://cdn-fastly.deb.debian.org/debian stretch/main DEP-11 128x128 Icons"
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13:53.48n3ssany ideas
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14:00.02no_gravityHello! I'm a bit confused, how the Debian updates work. For example irqbalance has a known memory leak. Why is it not fixed in Debian 8?
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14:01.49DarcidrideHi, I installed gnome-twitch and i'm on a Debian Jessie (Stable / Backports), I installed it with flatpak, but i'm wondering, how can I install backend-gstreamer dependency in my case ? (I didn't find a flatpak gstreamer backend package available)
14:02.17themillno_gravity: bug number?
14:02.22jellyno_gravity: if it's a known issue but only happes for some people, it may be noted and fixed in next release.
14:02.37no_gravityjelly: I *think* it always leaks.
14:02.41no_gravityI see it leak pretty fast on all Debian machines. Like 100MB per day or so.
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14:03.33jellyroot       1912      1  0  2016 ?        00:07:48 /usr/sbin/irqbalance --pid=/var/run/irqbalance.pid
14:03.34no_gravitythemill: Not sure if there is one for Debian. Googling "irqbalance memory leak" brings up a lot.
14:03.39jelly^^ does not leak
14:03.53jellythere's a newer upstream version in jessie-backports
14:04.02jellyyou may try that
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14:04.02no_gravityjelly: Is that on a server that is running under load and has some days of uptime?
14:04.17themillno_gravity: if there's no bug report, it definitely doesn't get fixed.
14:04.18jellyno_gravity: see that "2016", that's when the process started
14:04.27jellyit's a year
14:04.28no_gravitythemill: Ubuntu has a bug number for it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/irqbalance/+bug/1247107
14:04.43themillDebian bugs have debian bug numbers
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14:04.46no_gravityThey say it's fixed in version 1.1
14:04.53jellyif debian doesn't have the bug reported, it's not likely to get fixed in _debian_
14:05.03jellyfunny how that works
14:05.09themillno report means no-one knows about it
14:05.21jelly,v irqbalance
14:05.22juddPackage: irqbalance on amd64 -- wheezy: 1.0.3-3; wheezy-backports: 1.0.6-2~bpo70+1; jessie: 1.0.6-3; jessie-proposed-updates: 1.0.6-3+deb8u1; jessie-backports: 1.1.0-2~bpo8+1; stretch: 1.1.0-2.3; sid: 1.1.0-2.3
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14:06.19zxdany idea why I get this when trying to mount ?  mount /dev/sdb2 /a mount: block device /dev/sdb2 is write-protected, mounting read-only mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/sdb2,        missing codepage or helper program, or other error ...?
14:06.36jellyno_gravity: that example was a mail server for ~100k users.  It gets some load.
14:06.43no_gravitythemill: This seems to be a Debian bug number: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=797993
14:06.44juddBug http://bugs.debian.org/797993 in irqbalance (closed, patch): «irqbalance: Memory Leak / Excessive Memory usage in Xen guest»; severity: normal; opened: 2015-09-04; last modified: 2015-11-24.
14:06.55no_gravityjelly: Strange.
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14:07.40no_gravitySo it seems to be fixed. In the sense that its fixed in a newer version of irqbalance.
14:07.43no_gravityBut why do Debian 8 machines not get that fix?
14:07.43jellylike I said, it doesn't happen for everyone (else I'd have noticed it quickly, having 100+ debian installs)
14:07.49zxd<PROTECTED>
14:07.50zxdI am root
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14:08.04jelly!proposed-updates
14:08.04dpkgstable-proposed-updates is a repository containing packages being prepared for the next <point release>.  While they have already been, your additional testing is most welcome prior to wider release.  http://www.debian.org/releases/proposed-updates  http://release.debian.org/proposed-updates/stable.html .  See also <oldstable-proposed-updates>, <testing-proposed-updates>.
14:08.15jellyno_gravity: ^^ it's not enabled by default
14:08.27no_gravityjelly: What is not enabled?
14:08.37jellythe jessie-proposed-updates repo
14:09.03no_gravityjelly: But why isn't fixed by default? I mean ... other stuff *is* fixed, right?
14:09.13jelly<judd> Package: irqbalance on amd64 -- [...] jessie: 1.0.6-3; jessie-proposed-updates: 1.0.6-3+deb8u1; jessie-backports: 1.1.0-2~bpo8+1
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14:10.04jellyno_gravity: because it was not considered a serious enough bug to warrant upload to the fastest security updates repo.
14:10.12themillIs that s-p-u relevant to this bug?
14:10.31no_gravityjelly: "fastest security updates repo"?
14:10.33themill(seems to be for #784391)
14:10.34juddBug http://bugs.debian.org/784391 in irqbalance (closed, fixed-upstream, jessie, patch, sid, upstream): «irqbalance: Logs flooded with "irq ### affinity_hint subset empty"»; severity: important; opened: 2015-05-06; last modified: 2017-03-29.
14:10.50themilldpkg: tell no_gravity about s-p-u
14:10.52jellynot sure, I didn't read the bts O:-)
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14:11.53jellyno_gravity: fixes for stable get uploaded either to proposed-updates repo, or to security updates repo
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14:12.08jellynothing gets uploaded to stable repo directly
14:12.28themill(path of least resistance is to get the package from jessie-backports)
14:12.56jellyits existence in backports suggests SOMEONE was aware the thing was buggy enough for at least some people
14:13.02petn-randall,v e2fsprogs
14:13.03juddPackage: e2fsprogs on amd64 -- wheezy: 1.42.5-1.1+deb7u1; wheezy-security: 1.42.5-1.1+deb7u1; jessie: 1.42.12-2+b1; jessie-backports: 1.43.3-1~bpo8+1; stretch: 1.43.4-2; sid: 1.43.4-2
14:13.17themilljelly: or that there were other features people wanted
14:13.19petn-randallzxd: What distro are you running?
14:13.37jellythemill: it's irqbalance!  It has one purpose and one feature!
14:13.37no_gravityjelly: Or wait for the next point release?
14:13.40jellyno_gravity: yes
14:13.46no_gravityjelly: When will that be?
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14:13.51jellyfiik
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14:14.29themillthere is no sign that this will be fixed in the next point release
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14:14.46zxdpetn-randall: debian
14:14.57no_gravitythemill: No?
14:15.09petn-randallzxd: Which release?
14:15.10themillno_gravity: what makes you say that it is?
14:15.17zxdpetn-randall: woody
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14:16.11jellylol
14:16.13petn-randallzxd: And you installed e2fsprogs from a newer version?
14:16.13no_gravityjelly: Jelly said so.
14:16.23no_gravitythemill: Jelly said so.
14:16.44themillno_gravity: no, jelly said that there was an updated package in progress not that it fixed this bug.
14:16.46jellyno_gravity: I also said I didn't actually look at the bug reports to see which exact versions things got fixed in
14:16.53themillno_gravity: you could test that package right now and find out if it does
14:17.05petn-randallzxd: woody released 2002, and you are using e2fsck from 2010.
14:17.15themillno_gravity: if you want it fixed in jessie (rather than jessie-backports), test out that patch and let the maintainer know that it works
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14:17.43no_gravitySounds scary.
14:17.56themillpackages don't test themselves
14:18.08jellyzxd: that error can mean no kernel driver for desired filesystem type is loaded
14:19.31jellyzxd: (that's for the mount error) if you have some sort of live or rescue image booted, try to "modprobe ext2" or "modprobe ext3"
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14:19.40petn-randallguesses a 2002 linux kernel might not know anything about ext4.
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14:20.11zxd<PROTECTED>
14:20.19zxdnot livecd,  machine with two hds
14:20.28petn-randallzxd: So which release *are* you running?
14:20.36zxdnot sure
14:20.52zxdwhy?
14:21.04petn-randallzxd: Because it's relevant to your problem.
14:21.13zxdfile -s /dev/sdb2 /dev/sdb2: Linux rev 1.0 ext4 filesystem data (needs journal recovery) (extents) (large files) (huge files)
14:21.30petn-randallzxd: Can you paste the output of 'apt-cache policy' to http://paste.debian.net?
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14:28.14jellyzxd: woody would not have been able to mount ext4 at all, it did not exist at that time
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14:28.23jellyext3 was really new
14:29.43jellyand reiserfs v3 was the shiz.  Until people started losing data a lot
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14:30.16petn-randallI heard reiserfs v4 even lost the lead developer ...
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14:52.23Verigo_89_89Hi
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14:54.44centrx!hi
14:54.44dpkghello, centrx
14:55.33_Noxhi centrx
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15:00.25dadinnhas this bug been addressed? https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=583534
15:00.26juddBug http://bugs.debian.org/583534 in virt-manager (closed): «virt-manager: Seriously fucked up keyboard layout in VNC»; severity: important; opened: 2010-05-28; last modified: 2010-08-22.
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15:01.04dadinnit seems to me the kvm keymap is still seriously fucked up
15:01.59centrxdadinn: Maybe now it's only moderately fucked up?
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15:03.46dondelelcarodadinn: it has been closed, but it's possible that the but has reappeared
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15:06.24dadinncentrx: I use dvorak layout, and it seemingly does not help, I have been struggling for years to be able to get into an environment where debian doesn't discriminate against me (https://superuser.com/q/605690/84358) but even though with rescue mode I can choose my layout KVM doesn't translate it correctly...
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15:09.31dadinnEssentially I use dvorak on the host (it works fine), and would like to use it on the guest too (which doesn't work). It doesn't matter if I change the layout on the host to US English.
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15:15.16dadinndondelelcaro: can it be reopened?
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15:16.46dondelelcarodadinn: yes, if you're sure that's the right bug
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15:18.24dondelelcarodadinn: I'd actually file a new bug which has information on the specifics of what the conn-info is set to, what keymaps you're using, and how the keys aren't being properly mapped
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15:18.49dondelelcaroactually doesn't know much about the keyboard mapping, since I never use that particular bit
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15:35.37dadinndondelelcaro: what information would you need from me?
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15:53.47Enrico_MenottiHello. I'm running Debian 8 (Jessie). I need a cross-compiler. According to https://wiki.debian.org/CrossToolchains, I need to install it (it is not provided by the standard system). Do I really need all the steps reported in that page?
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16:01.06petn-randallEnrico_Menotti: That page looks current to me.
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16:04.09Enrico_MenottiSo it is necessary to create the crosstools.list, pointing to emdebian.org, install the archive key, etc. In particular, it is not clear to me what the dpkg --add-architecture armhf instruction does.
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16:06.00petn-randallEnrico_Menotti: It's explained in 'man dpkg'.
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16:06.51Enrico_MenottiOk, I will have a look there. Thanks.
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16:26.12dondelelcarodadinn: sorry for the delay; I actually don't need any information, but the bug report would need more information, about what keymap you are using, what type of console you were using, etc.
16:26.33dondelelcarodadinn: basically, enough information so that someone who is reading the bug report could reproduce it
16:26.43crash_when will firefox5.2-esr come to debian?
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16:26.48crash_*52
16:27.00dondelelcarocrash_: it's already in experimental
16:27.09autofsckk<PROTECTED>
16:27.18dondelelcaro,versions firefox-esr
16:27.19juddPackage: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 45.6.0esr-1~deb8u1; wheezy-security: 45.8.0esr-1~deb7u1; jessie-security: 45.8.0esr-1~deb8u1; sid: 45.8.0esr-1; stretch: 45.8.0esr-1; jessie-backports/firefox-release: 52.0.2esr-1~bpo80+1; experimental: 52.0.2esr-1
16:27.23crash_dondelelcaro: nice, it's on the way :)
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16:40.46Azulflameno ban?
16:40.55abrotmanI doubt it wants to come back
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16:54.53tgunrI am trying to use tshark to analyze an IPv6 RA problem, after installing tshark and trying to ececute it, I get a message "Wireshark doesn't appear to be located at /Applications/Wireshark.app." which looks like a Mac installation. Does tshark require wireshark? I do NOT want to have to install GTK.
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17:00.30OerHekstgunr, yes, tshark depends on wireshark-common
17:00.55OerHeksand libwireshark3
17:01.06tgunryes, i saw that it had installed wirehark-common
17:01.23tgunrbut why the error about the application path
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17:35.12Enrico_MenottiI have problems with the locales when accessing Debian via ssh from a Mac. On Debian I have set no standard locale. On the Mac, LANG is not set, LC_ALL neither, but all other LC_* variables are set to "C", except LC_CTYPE which is set to "UTF-8". When I connect to Debian via ssh, it complains it cannot set LC_CTYPE and LC_ALL to default locale (no such file or directory). If I login from the Debian machine, no
17:35.12Enrico_Menotti<PROTECTED>
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17:35.47greycat!locales
17:35.47dpkgUse 'dpkg-reconfigure locales' to get it up and running.  This generates <locale> definitions and also edits /etc/default/locale which sets the $LANG environment variable at login time.  Use "LANG=C command" to change the output language for a one off command, ask me about <localised errors>.  See also <mac locales>.  http://wiki.debian.org/Locale
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17:36.27Enrico_MenottiSeems Debian is not getting the settings from the Mac, or keeps on trying to set the default locale, which is not set. It is set as "none".
17:36.37Enrico_MenottiI already tried with dpkg-reconfigure locales.
17:37.06greycathttps://wiki.debian.org/Locale
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17:37.23Enrico_MenottiAlready read.
17:37.51greycat!mac locales
17:37.51dpkgIf you're getting "Cannot set LC_CTYPE to default locale" when connecting from an Apple Macintosh to a Debian host over ssh: (a) In Terminal, uncheck  Settings->Advanced->"Set locale environment variables on startup", or (b) change SendEnv in ~/.ssh/config to not send LC_CTYPE (man ssh_config), or (c) change AcceptEnv on remote sshd, or (d) overwrite that value in your login scripts (.profile or similar).
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17:42.19Enrico_MenottiOk, I got it. But I don't understand what's going on. I'd like to have locale environment variables set on the Mac, and have them sent to the Debian server. If I understand it, on the Mac LC_CTYPE is set as UTF-8, and it should be sent to the server, which should accept it (everything seems to be set right on both client and server). So why is the server trying to set default values?
17:44.08greycatToo many unknowns.  Did you check ssh_config on the client, sshd_config on the server, and /etc/default/locale on the server?
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17:45.34Enrico_Menottissh_config on the client has SendEnv LANG LC_*. sshd_config on the server has AcceptEnv LANG LC_*. Let me check the /etc/default/locale.
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17:50.55Enrico_MenottiThe line setting LANG is commented out. Only LANGUAGE is set. But according to wiki.debian.org/Locale, LANG determines the default locale in the absence of other locale related environment variables. Since the other variables are sent from the Mac, it should not be necessary, right?
17:52.07greycatI don't have a Mac to test with.  But I do it from HP-UX to Debian all the time.
17:55.23greycathttp://paste.debian.net/926142/
17:55.51Enrico_MenottiOk. I see that, on the Mac, LANG is not set, so it is not sent to Debian. So Debian looks for it on the standard file. And doesn't find it. But why is it complaining about LC_CTYPE, which on Mac is UTF-8?
17:56.19greycatIt's literally just "UTF-8" with no language?
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17:57.11Enrico_MenottiYes.
17:57.24greycatThen it's complaining because that's not a valid value.
17:58.59Enrico_MenottiBut then if I run "locale" on Debian I get LC_CTYPE=UTF-8. But let me look at the terminal on the Debian machine.
17:59.06spookyhey everyone. i'm looking for a very simple FTP server to setup on my machine. every FTP server i have found needs to be setup in terminal or by editing a script. is there one where i can do that thru a gui?
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17:59.48greycat2017 and people are still setting up FTP services
17:59.54greycatWhy....
18:00.15spookyis there another way i can get a friend to send me some huge files without going through another party?
18:00.29greycatsftp/scp
18:00.31sandiegohi, i wish to know How to fix this issue, https://pastebin.com/4LBQ8aca
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18:01.15spookygreycat: unaware of that
18:01.18spookylooking into it
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18:02.37sandiegohttps://pastebin.com/4LBQ8aca
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18:03.59baribalspooky, saft was made for that purpose, and there's a successor to that already, too. Also, how about HTTP?
18:04.11sandiego$100
18:05.19spookybaribal: i'm unaware of saft
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18:06.09sandiegoanyone advice me room for assistance under debian?
18:06.24spookyis there something more simple to use? everything seems the only way to set it up is through the command line?
18:07.08Azulflamespooky, we recommend CLI here because it's easy to tell you what to type instead of walking you through a GUI
18:07.16greycatSFTP needs no setup at all.  If openssh-server is installed, then you can SFTP in as any user (except root, or users with no password) with any SFTP client, of which there are GUI ones for Windows if you need that.
18:07.23Azulflameand if you just need to copy large files, you should use the sneakernet
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18:08.51spookygreycat: i got a very long url on how to setup SFTP: https://is.gd/pK8Ff4
18:09.25greycatDo you want me to write "apt-get install openssh-server" on a web page so you can have that as a URL?
18:10.12spookyi think i installed that already because i tried to get vsftpd and proFTPD
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18:11.06mutantejust create a user and set their shell to "scponly" is also nice if you want them to copy files but not have shell
18:11.57spookyunfortunately, i have no idea how to do that. or even understand what scponly is. i'm very new to debian hence was looking for something easier
18:12.12greycatThen just use SFTP without changing ANY of the defaults.
18:12.12mutantespooky: adduser
18:12.19Enrico_Menottigreycat On the server I have en_GB.UTF-8. So if I understand it, the LC_CTYPE on the Mac is not valid on Debian. I.e., Mac conventions are different from Debian's. Right? But other variables are set to "C" on the Mac. If I understand it, this means en_US with ASCII encoding, right? However, when I connect to Debian via ssh, these variables are not reflected to be set to "C". They are set to "en_UK.UTF-8" (that is
18:12.19Enrico_Menotti<PROTECTED>
18:13.03mutantespooky: we are trying to give you the easier variant already. not installing additional software = easier
18:13.37spookymutante: appreciate. i just don't understand some of the words used. i don't mind installing something if i'll understand what to do/how to do it
18:13.50spookyinstalling  openssh-server right now
18:14.15mutantespooky: ok, sounds good
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18:17.44spookyafter installing open-server, how do i use sftp? or start it?
18:18.14greycat"sftp localhost" to check quickly
18:18.32greycatYou can use that very much like a command-line FTP client.  There are also graphical clients.
18:19.06spookyyes. i wanted the graphical clients because they're easier for me to understand but i guess it's okay
18:19.29spookysays the authenticity of host can't be established
18:20.43qqxThat's normal the first time you connect to a host.
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18:21.17spookyoh so it's normal not to be able to establish authenticity? thats fine then
18:21.57spookyis there anyway to start the server? to adjust things? i wish i had a way to "launch" a program and fix it as i see fit, but seems everything works in the background?
18:22.43spookywrite failed: broken pipe
18:22.51spookycouldn't read packet: connection reset by peer
18:23.04petn-randallspooky: You can verify it by checking the host key fingerprint out-of-band. That means by looking it up on the host side, and using mail/telephone/SMS/whatever to send it to the receiving side on first use.
18:23.26spookythanks
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18:24.08spookyhere is where i'm confused: is my server now "online"? how do i see this? how do i turn it off? can i set some parameters for the enduser? how? can i see this? how can i see what my enduser/friend is doing?
18:24.31Enrico_Menottigreycat Ok, I was wrong, "C" sets the locale to default, which is not set on Debian. So clearly I get those errors. But Debian wiki states: If you chose a default locale other than None above, it will be in /etc/default/locale and will override the LANG variable supplied by ssh. This is highly inconvenient.
18:25.26greycatEnrico_Menotti: if you are reading the output of "locale", it may say "C" for variables that are not actually set.  That's why I used "declare -p ..." in my pastebin.
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18:25.46greycatspooky: try to sftp to it from another machine
18:26.06spookyokay
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18:29.39spookygreycat: doesn't connect :P
18:29.59spookyof course, i don't understand what i did anyway during the setup so.... maybe that's normal?
18:30.00spookyhaha
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18:31.15greycatIf "sftp localhost" works on the machine itself, but "sftp yourhostname" does not work from another machine, then it's probably a firewall issue.
18:31.28spookyah okay.
18:32.04spookysftp localhost worked coz i got an ECDSA key fingerprint, but then the write failed with a broken pipe
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18:32.28spookyanyway, thank you to EVERYONE that tried to help me
18:32.48spookyi'm sorry i don't understand what i'm doing. i'll read more into it and hopefully get something working
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18:34.13Enrico_Menottigreycat So the situation is as follows. On Mac, I have "set locale environment variables on startup" enabled. But for some reason it doesn't set LANG, and maybe also other variables. So Debian doesn't get variables and looks for defaults, right? But defaults are not set, etc. Now: how to let defaults be only chosen if the Mac does not provide variables, and not if the Mac does?
18:34.49greycatAre you QUITE sure you read the wiki's locales page?  The part where it says to put this thing in /etc/profile?
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18:36.32theYellowRacerwhere do I put my nonfree wifi drivers on the install usb?
18:36.41theYellowRacerin /firmware?
18:36.52somiajtheYellowRacer: you can't really put them on the same usb stick that you install from, you need a second usb stick
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18:36.55somiaj!firmware images
18:36.55dpkgUnofficial <netinst> images - containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages - for installing Debian 8 "Jessie" are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/ .  See also <install guide>.
18:37.06somiajtheYellowRacer: I would just download the installer image that contains all the firmware
18:38.04theYellowRaceri tried those images and they don't work. it still doesn't seem to recognize them on the usb. i'm using freebsd until i can get debian running.
18:38.31theYellowRacercould it be a problem with rufus?
18:38.39theYellowRacer(my image writer?)
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18:40.50Enrico_Menottigreycat Yes I had read it, but I did not understand it fully. Also, they say "optionally", which led me to think this part to be unnecessary. Now maybe I got it better. But do I only have to edit the /etc/profile file, or also the /etc/csh/login.d/lang?
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18:40.58mutanteShuttleworth announced Ubuntu is giving up on Unity and going back to Gnome. Seriously, aren't they just Debian at that point? wondering what differences even remain
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18:41.23greycatDo you use csh?
18:41.31greycatDo any of your users use csh?
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18:42.27Enrico_MenottiI don't even know what it is. And there are no other users. So I am right in thinking this is not required. Just the last sentence, which is referring again to ssh, was misleading me.
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18:46.02jellymutante: their hardware support is better
18:46.33jellyalso they _have_ paid support at all
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18:47.02jellypeople use Linux for more than workstations
18:47.17orbFor some reason I can't seem to make pptpd work. I can't connect a windows box to it over the internet? Perhaps I'm just not finding the best howtos.
18:47.32mutantejelly: fair, i guess many companies want the "paid support" even if they actually never use it. but a manager of a manager is happy if there is a support contract
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18:56.27joltorb: I'm no expert (and since pptp is broken by design you shouldn't use it). But that being said, if pptpd is running, are you 100% sure that a) your firewall is open on the relevant ports (1723) and that the router you are trying to connect over/from has enabled proto 47? If that seems right, then TCP-dump on the host to see if traffic gets trough, and read logs if it can connect.
18:57.42orbthe port, yes, but i don't know about protocol 47
18:58.01orband yeah, i'm seeing it's quite not secure so I may just pass on it
18:58.10orbthanks
18:58.12joltorb: Openvpn! Best VPN there was
18:58.33orbok, that may be the route i go
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18:59.23joltthere are even ok windows clients for openvpn these days
18:59.29teraflopsyep
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19:00.16orbexcellent
19:00.33teraflopsorb: if you want the site-to-site approach tinc is a thing too
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19:03.14morphvhalo serach german debian
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19:05.23greycat!de
19:05.23dpkgDeutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in #debian.de (auf irc.oftc.net, irc.freenode.net oder irc.belwue.de) - German speaking users please go to #debian.de (on irc.oftc.net, irc.freenode.net or irc.belwue.de).
19:08.14orbi'll look into it, thanks teraflops
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19:18.53earlybirdThere was an option to apt-get which would print apt's solution strategy a.k.a. solver output -oAPT::* something. I've lost the command and seem not to be able to find it by just googling. Anybody can help me out?
19:19.15earlybirdIt's NOT In the man page.
19:19.59IridosI don't even think apt-get is using different strategies…
19:20.38Iridosapt-get uses some different way to calculate needed packages than aptitude does
19:21.25morphvthank you very much
19:21.32Iridoswhich manpage, btw?
19:21.36earlybirdFound it: -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=1
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19:22.13earlybirdnevermind. Stupid Ruby1.8.
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19:23.21Iridosand btw. that option IS in the manpage for apt.conf
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19:41.47Enrico_Menottigreycat I experimented a bit and quite solved my problem, or at least I have found its nucleus, I think. If I unset LC_CTYPE on the Mac, and issue "locale", it is listed as "C". So evidently also the other variables listed as "C" are actually unset. Then if I ssh to Debian I don't get errors anymore. But all locales are set to POSIX. To have en_GB I need to specify it in the profile file, as explained in the wiki.
19:41.48Enrico_Menotti<PROTECTED>
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19:46.37somiajEnrico_Menotti: if you run dpkg-reconfigure locales on the debian system, what is the default set to? Is it set correctly, or set to none?
19:47.46c-cIs it ok to ask people to test this openbox -desktop installer for Debian Jessie, on Debian Jessie or Stretch?  https://github.com/csmr/jesbang
19:48.21Enrico_Menottisomiaj It is intentionally set to none, as explained in Debian's wiki page: https://wiki.debian.org/Locale. This should allow getting locales from the other system, right?
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19:49.02nkuttlerc-c: what is openbox -desktop ? openbox is already in debian
19:49.06greycatOnly if the other system actually *sends* a valid one.
19:49.28somiajEnrico_Menotti: just checking, and yes, if set to none it should let the user set it in various ways. Though if the system is only used by you, you could just set the defaults there if needed.
19:49.49somiajnkuttler: looks like a bash script to install/configure openbox and various other things...
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19:50.13greycatsomiaj: that fails horribly on an ssh server that you may connect to from multiple clients with different character encodings.
19:50.16c-cnkuttler: openbox desktop, is an openbox desktop, like the lighter desktop kit like this one installs https://github.com/csmr/jesbang
19:50.25nkuttlerc-c: generally speaking, nobody wants to see ads on irc
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19:51.11c-cits a script for Debian Jessie
19:52.47c-cnkuttler: it is basically the setup I use for my desk&laptop&netbook
19:53.10nkuttlerc-c: i'm not interested, but thanks
19:53.27c-cnkuttler: np, thanks for your comments
19:53.55somiajc-c: there have been various scripts like that get mentioned here, very rarely does anyone actually use them. Partly because running random scripts (as root) without knowing what they do is dangerous
19:54.00nkuttlerc-c: also, your license is non-free
19:54.35c-cwow, thanks for the pointer
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19:56.59theYellowRacerif the drive on which I stored my ~/.ssh keys for my server failed, how do I get back in? Or should I nuke the server
19:57.38somiajdo you not have a backup of your keys?
19:58.02theYellowRacerno, I had just created them, and it failed 2 minutes later after I rebooted
19:58.03somiajdid you disable password login? Do you have some recovery console you can get to to force a root login and change the keys?
19:58.21somiajdo you have physical access to the machine?
19:58.24theYellowRaceri think i have console from a web interface but i haven't checked
19:58.27theYellowRaceri'll check
19:58.56theYellowRacerbetter to do full drive backups in the future, huh
19:59.11theYellowRaceror at least my home directory
19:59.23mo1991_now that compiz is back in debian (stretch) can anyone tell me how to change the theme of the window decorator?
19:59.49theYellowRaceroh there we go, i can just create a new key and update it through the web interface
20:00.10teraflopsmost vps providers have serial console access thingy from inside the Web interface
20:00.19theYellowRaceryep, mine does too
20:00.37theYellowRacerit was just hard to find
20:01.12teraflopsmine used to use java or vnc..
20:01.14c-cmo1991_: which one do you use?
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20:01.40jhutchins_wk<PROTECTED>
20:01.40dpkgWebmin is a lame web-based interface for unsafe system administration for Unix.  Check it out at http://webmin.com/  Remember, dondelelcaro *hates* webmin.  "i'd rather sit on the floor shoving table knives into live electrical outlets than run webmin on an exposed server."  Removed from Debian post-Sarge, see http://bugs.debian.org/343897 .  The Debian package from webmin.com is of poor quality.  See <free whcp> for alternatives.
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20:02.20c-cuse ssh
20:02.31mo1991_c-c - the version that is now packaged with stretch.   As for window decorator I use the default /usr/bin/gtk-window-decorator
20:02.48mo1991_good that compiz is "official" again
20:03.02blackfloweh?
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20:03.19somiajmo1991_: more that the project came back to life, it was dead for a while, outdated and buggy (why it was orignially removed)
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20:03.52c-cmo1991_: afaik gtk packages include several theme changers
20:04.37emax0075How would you manually configure a name record on Debain? My brother is using my VPN from Germany, so I want to screw with him
20:04.42mo1991_c-c any suggestions?   I have looked around in gconf-editor and dconf-editor as this used to be the way to change theme.
20:04.59mo1991_it seems like these settings change a lot in various versions of compiz
20:05.00greycatemax0075: /etc/hosts
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20:05.17c-cmo1991_: in Jessie "gtk-chtheme",
20:05.27emax0075thanks grey
20:06.23somiajc-c: there are various ways to change gtk themes, one is just wirte a .gtkrc-2.0 file or whatever it is called, sure something similar is there for gtk3, though I think gtk-chtheme is just gtk2
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20:08.31c-csomiaj: mo1991_ on my openbox desktop, I just use the included OB Gui Config Tool, which has a theme changer
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20:09.06somiajI use to use gtk-theme-switch
20:09.18somiajI was just saying you can do it by only editing a config file (thoug hthis dosn't give you a preview)
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20:10.18mo1991_c-c I can change the gtk themes with gtk-chtheme but this only changes my xfce themes and not the window decorator that compiz uses.   Perhaps compiz window decorator uses gtk3 as opposed to gtk2 as somaj hints at.....
20:10.29mo1991_somiaj let me try that
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20:10.55somiajmo1991_: unsure what compiz uses, but that will only change gtk2 themes, gtk3 themes are different
20:11.20DeaDSouLhi, how to enable the virtual-keyboard in KDE ?
20:12.26c-csomiaj: I suppose its the job of the desktop config gui
20:13.43mo1991_somiaj - installed gtk-theme-switch - i then try to run the command gtk-theme-switch and get a command not found.   ???
20:14.13mo1991_running stretch btw
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20:16.26somiajmo1991_: command is gtk-theme-switch2, note this program won't be any different than gtk-chtheme in what it affects, two different gtk2 theme changes.
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20:16.33somiajif the compiz isn't using gtk2 these won't work
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20:24.29mo1991_somiaj - ya, none of these work.   any way to tell what /usr/bin/gtk-window-decorator is using gtk wise?   I have changed these themes before using dconf-editor, but the settings seem different on this newer version of compiz
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20:25.01somiajmost likely it is gtk3, and you need a gtk3 theme utility
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20:26.32mo1991_ya i don't seem to be able to find a good gtk3 theme utility so far, any ideas?
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20:27.49cokegood && gtk .. can't parse
20:28.24somiajI don't know any, I haven't done to much with gtk3
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20:29.22c-cmo1991_: what is your desktop?
20:32.15mo1991_c-c xfce 4.12 with compiz  - I have gnome default installed as well
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20:35.09c-cmo1991_: try install & run lxappearance
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20:41.41Lady_AleenaHello. Is there a way to clean up the Firefox mess on my computer? I still see Iceweasel, Firefox-ESR, and Firefox when updating and upgrading. I only want to see the backported Firefox. So is there a Firefox clean up tool out there?
20:43.02somiajLady_Aleena: you can remove the iceweasel package as it is just a meta package
20:43.22mandeepfirefox-esr and firefox are also different packages aren't they?
20:43.25somiajfirefox-esr and firefox are different, and firefox is not part of jessie
20:43.51somiajLady_Aleena: are you getting the firefox package form mozilla.debian.net, this is a different package than the firefox-esr provided in jessie.
20:44.06Lady_Aleenasomiaj, jessie-backports firefox
20:44.08somiajsorry iceweasel is transitional (not meata)
20:44.15somiajLady_Aleena: that is from m.d.n
20:44.35Lady_Aleenasomiaj, what is m.d.n.
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20:44.44somiajmozilla.debian.net
20:44.45jelly!mdn
20:44.46dpkgFor stable releases, newer versions of Firefox, Icedove and Iceape can be found at http://mozilla.debian.net/ ; you will want the "esr52" repository. For users of testing and unstable, updated packages are normally in <experimental>; only Extended Support Release (ESR) versions are suitable for release in <stable> so only those versions can be uploaded to unstable. As of v52, only the ESR version can be compiled for Jessie.
20:45.04jellyLady_Aleena: purge the packages you don't need
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20:46.06jelly!installed
20:46.06dpkgTo list installed packages, dpkg -l |awk '/^[hi]i/{print $2}'; or aptitude search -F '%p' '~i'; or ask me about <aptitude clone>, <debian clone>.  See also <installed test>.  For one package, use "dpkg -l packagename" or "apt-cache policy packagename" or (from squeeze onwards) "aptitude versions packagename".
20:46.09jelly!purge
20:46.10dpkg"purge" means to completely wipe away a package, including its configuration files.  Use «aptitude purge $package» or «dpkg -P $package» (note: before wheezy, you can't 'apt-get purge' a package that is already removed; use aptitude or dpkg instead).  To purge all "removed" packages: «aptitude purge '~c'».  To restore configuration files, ask me about <confmiss>.  Also ask me about <why aptitude>.
20:46.24greycatsees "experimental" and "firefox" and runs and hides
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20:51.10Lady_AleenaACK! Pages and pages of packages starting with 'lib'.
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20:56.36Lady_AleenaIt would be nice if there were just a list of programs installed by the main program instead of all the component parts listed. For example I have apache2 installed. Do I really need to see apache2-bin, apache2-data, apache2-doc, apache2-utils, libapache2-mod-perl, libapache2-reload-perl?
20:56.57greycatSoounds like something aptitude should be able to tell you.
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20:58.00Lady_Aleenagreycat, I just don't understand why they are all listed separately, when they are all part of apache2.
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20:58.30greycatDebian breaks source packages into a billion little binary packages for obscure reasons.
20:59.35alekzLady_Aleena: you may not need to see that list, pero some other sysadmin do ;)
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20:59.57mo1991_c-c xfce 4.12 with compiz  - I have gnome default installed as well
21:00.07jellyalekz: s/pero/but/ ?
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21:01.29Lady_Aleenaalekz, it is just frustrating looking at the output of dpkg -l |awk '/^[hi]i/{print $2}' and not know what goes with what. It would be nice if the list were more organized.
21:01.36jellygreycat: now that there's multiarch "same" to safely deal with multiple architecture debs shipping same files, the reasons are even more obscure than before
21:01.37greycatgets as far as aptitude list '?not(~M)' but does not know how to make it show only the package names/versions in a single line like dpkg, instead of dumping whole descriptions
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21:02.21war9407Does anyone know why this happens? # conntrack -L -> conntrack v1.4.4 (conntrack-tools): Operation failed: Operation not supported
21:02.26alekzsorry jelly haha, *but*
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21:03.16Voldenetwar9407: because the operation was not supported
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21:03.22Voldenetyou're welcome ;)
21:03.47jellyLady_Aleena: I assumed you could use grep on "list installed packages" output, since I remember you having written perl scripts
21:04.18jellywar9407: which debian release and which kernel
21:04.51Voldenetwar9407: what's your kernel and does `less /proc/net/nf_conntrack` show you anything?
21:04.53Lady_AleenaAt the bottom of the list is xorg and xserver-xorg with a whole bunch of other packages starting with xorg and xserver-xorg. It is maddening.
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21:05.13jellywar9407: nf_conntrack_netlink should get autoloaded if you're using a distro kernel
21:05.14war9407jelly: debian testing x86_64, conntrack 1.4.4, compiled my own -> 4.10.8
21:05.41war9407CONFIG_NETFILTER_NETLINK=y
21:05.51jellywar9407: that's just the backend
21:05.57Lady_AleenaI don't know if xserver-xorg is part of xorg or something else entirely.
21:06.17greycatOh come on.
21:07.07jellyLady_Aleena: what's your goal?
21:07.31Lady_Aleenajelly, to get things organized on my system.
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21:07.55greycatHow does "organized" differ from the current state?
21:08.12Lady_Aleenajelly, for example, just one firefox (the backported one so I have the newest version).
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21:08.33jellyLady_Aleena: why are you not grepping for firefox and iceweasel, then
21:08.40jellywar9407: /boot/config-4.9.0-2-amd64:CONFIG_NF_CT_NETLINK=m
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21:09.05Lady_Aleenajelly, I haven't worked on the command line for a while, so I have forgotten a lot.
21:09.55jellygreycat: there are menu entries/icons for both Iceweasel and Firefox-ESR.  And Firefox!
21:10.24jellythere are menu entries/icons for all three of Iceweasel, Firefox-ESR, and Firefox.  And Web Browser.
21:10.31war9407$ grep CONFIG_NF_CT_NETLI .config
21:10.31war9407CONFIG_NF_CT_NETLINK=y , # CONFIG_NF_CT_NETLINK_TIMEOUT is not set # CONFIG_NF_CT_NETLINK_HELPER is not set
21:10.34war9407maybe it needs the other two
21:11.20Lady_Aleenajelly, so dpkg -l | grep '(firefox|iceweasel)'?
21:11.26jellywar9407: tell us again why you're not using default stretch kernel, which has those enabled
21:11.42Enrico_MenottiI need an explanation about a statement in this Debian wiki page: https://wiki.debian.org/CrossToolchains. In the section "installation", at the end of the line where the key fingerprint is reported, it says: "you will need to install curl in a bare chroot". I don't get the meaning of "bare", and I don't understand why this particular installation is needed.
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21:11.58jellyLady_Aleena: grep wants -E  to be able to handle (...|...)
21:12.02war9407jelly: been compiling my own kernel (static, no modules) for past 20+ yrs, just a habit I guess
21:12.12zykotick9dpkg -l | egrep '(firefox|iceweasel)'
21:12.12dpkgNo packages found matching | egrep '(firefox|iceweasel)'
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21:12.25Lady_Aleenajelly, thank you.
21:12.31jellywar9407: ah, I've lost that habit a decade or more back
21:12.49jelly,kernels
21:12.50juddAvailable kernel versions are: experimental: 4.10.0-rc6-686-pae (4.10~rc6-1~exp2); sid: 4.9.0-2-686 (4.9.18-1); stretch: 4.9.0-2-686 (4.9.13-1); jessie-backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.2-686-pae (4.9.13-1~bpo8+1); jessie: 3.16.0-4-686-pae (3.16.39-1+deb8u2); wheezy-backports: 3.16.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.16.39-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-4-686-pae (3.2.86-1)
21:13.02jelly,kernels --arch amd64
21:13.03judd(kernels [--release <squeeze>]) -- Outputs the kernel versions in the archive, optionally restricted to one release. Note that semi-major releases like etchnhalf are treated as separate releases.
21:13.12jellymeh
21:13.21war9407jelly: Im building those in now and hopefully that fixes it, brb
21:13.25war9407ty
21:14.03jellythere's 4.10.0-trunk-amd64 in experimental if you're after shiny new stuff for no reason
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21:14.41jellybut only 4.10.7
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21:19.26jelly,v apt
21:19.27juddPackage: apt on amd64 -- wheezy-security: 0.9.7.9+deb7u6; wheezy: 0.9.7.9+deb7u7; jessie-security: 1.0.9.8.4; jessie: 1.0.9.8.4; stretch: 1.4~rc2; sid: 1.4
21:19.38jellyIridos: see?
21:20.31Iridosfake news!
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21:22.59Lady_AleenaBy the way, are we still on jessie as stable(?)?
21:23.43Iridosyes … 8.7  according to /topic
21:23.43jellyyes
21:23.44Lady_AleenaWhen wheezy went to jessie, I was months behind.
21:24.04jellyIridos: someone removed the direct association of "jessie" and "stable" from topc
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21:24.37jellyAFAIR it was someone with temporary access, they never got ops again
21:24.39Iridosnot necessarily a bad thing… the worst time to upgrade is when the fresh new stable release just came out ^^
21:25.20Iridosjelly, yeah, I can see that… in the text "point release 8.7 of Debian Jessie released! /msg dpkg jessie"  the association is totally removed, I can see that
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21:25.57jellyIridos: don't see any stables there
21:26.00Iridosjelly, but you're totally right… it's the real, important ops who should do that kinda thingsies ^^
21:26.34Enrico_MenottiSorry, anybody noticed my question? (Don't want to be insistent, it's just in case.)
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21:28.09jelly"bare" is probably "before you do anything else with that chroot".  No idea what makes curl required there tho.
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21:32.24Enrico_MenottiOk, I will just try getting the archive key with curl in the main filesystem.
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21:36.56Iridosif your chroot isn't bare… it's probably got  curl installed?
21:37.30Iridosjelly, anyway… you got the powa to put some staples in…
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22:07.38war9407jelly: that was it, enabled all of that stuff, good now, ty
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22:16.40Lady_AleenaWill sudo apt-get purge iceweasel affect firefox and firefox-esr?
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22:18.49rudi_sLady_Aleena: No, unless they are autoinstalled and only depend on iceweasel. But apt-get purge will tell you that.
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22:20.33Lady_AleenaAnd I just read https://mozilla.debian.net/ and plain Firefox is gone, we are all stuck with firefox-esr?
22:22.29rudi_sLady_Aleena: AFAIK yes.
22:22.45rudi_sUse firefox-esr from the official repository to get security updates.
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22:22.57dannyLopezHi, I install WPS Office, but in Awesome cant launch, I need to know the name CLI to launch with Mod4+R
22:23.12Lady_AleenaIt says it is gone because of the upcoming requirement of rust to build them. What is rust?
22:23.46rudi_sLady_Aleena: A programming language, Mozilla is rewriting some parts of Firefox in Rust.
22:24.39Lady_AleenaAnd jessie has problems with Rust?
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22:26.30rudi_sLady_Aleena: I guess backporting rust is difficult.
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22:29.12Lady_AleenaSo my devotion to Firefox over Firefox-ESR is pointless?
22:30.16Lady_AleenaFrom what I think "Mozilla Firefox web browser - Transitional package" means is that Firefox is just a link to Firefox-ESR.
22:30.42Lady_Aleena"Mozilla Firefox web browser - Transitional package" came from dpkg -l list.
22:31.14rudi_sLady_Aleena: Well, -ESR is the stable version and the only one with security updates in Debian. So yes, I think you should get used to it.
22:31.29rudi_s(Personally I'd recommend Chromium which has a better security record.)
22:32.05Lady_AleenaChromium's interface doesn't get out of my way the last time I looked at it a few years ago.
22:32.39alekzlol
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22:32.50alekzLady_Aleena: you really miss old times right?
22:33.09Lady_AleenaAnd the last time I tried importing my Firefox bookmarks, and it was a jumbled mess.
22:33.13tw"a few years ago" I wonder if there's any UI code left from then.
22:33.32Lady_Aleenaalekz, when I get used to something, it is very hard for me to change gears.
22:34.09alekzwell, you can try downloading an older Debian version and stick to those packages
22:34.14alekzor start moving on ;)
22:35.18Lady_AleenaI would have to search Chrome's plugins to see if how many are analogous to my Firefox plugins.
22:35.18rudi_salekz: Please don't recommend this when you're talking about browser!
22:35.39alekzrudi_s: I'm being saracastic, sorry!
22:35.43rudi_sNever use an outdated version of a browser. They are insecure enough even when you're always using the latest version.
22:35.46rudi_s;-)
22:36.01twIt'd be nice if there were enduring browser ui standards w/ 10 year support.
22:36.08twthat'd never happen
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22:41.21TomTomTo1upstream firefox-esr and firefox release are the same right now anyway, at least for the next two weeks or so.
22:43.33Lady_Aleenais looking into Chromium
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22:47.01JuPanamefree shell account contact PM =)
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23:00.32Lady_Aleenahead desks.
23:00.53Lady_AleenaWell, Chrom(e|ium) is a pita to set up.
23:01.37Lady_AleenaChrom(e|ium) doesn't have a File Edit View ... Help bar.
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23:07.48rudi_sLady_Aleena: The "bar" is behind the three dots. It reduces the clutter.
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23:12.50Lady_Aleenarudi_s, but without that toolbar, alt-b doesn't bring up my bookmarks.
23:13.34Lady_AleenaAlso Chrome uses ctrl-k to go to the address bar instead of ctrl-l.
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23:16.41Lady_AleenaI think I will stick with Firefox. I've spent years customizing it, and having to try to customize Chrome is a daunting task.
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23:19.48rudi_sLady_Aleena: Well, to show all bookmarks you can use Ctrl-Shift-O.
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23:20.23rudi_sAnyway, I use Chromium with Vimium (not quite as good as vimperator from firefox, but still very good) which provides me with Vim-like bindings which are very fast and powerful.
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23:22.10Lady_Aleenarudi_s, Chrome is lacking another big thing, a standard separate search box.
23:22.39rudi_sLady_Aleena: To be honest I have no idea why you'd need that. You can specify a prefix character to search in different search engines.
23:23.05Eryn_1983_FLhi peeps i need some help..
23:23.20Eryn_1983_FLhow can i monitor a folder for permission changes or ownership changes?
23:23.21Lady_Aleenarudi_s, sometimes I go on a search binge, and in Firefox, search always opens in a new tab.
23:23.26rudi_sLady_Aleena: So I type "w foo" (without the quotes) to search for foo on wikipedia (the search "engine" is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%s), or "wd foo" for the German wikipedia.
23:23.35rudi_sAnd so on for other search services.
23:23.36Eryn_1983_FLi got some rogue app changing the permissions to 750 and changing my owner
23:23.51rudi_sWhen I want to open a new tab, I open a new tab first.
23:24.04rudi_sEryn_1983_FL: inotify
23:24.13Eryn_1983_FLok
23:24.24rudi_sEryn_1983_FL: But I don't know if you can get the process which changed it.
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23:56.41*** join/#debian CME_ (~CME@ipb2181ad5.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de)
23:58.52*** join/#debian r2d2_ (~r2d2@ool-2f11ba46.dyn.optonline.net)
23:59.02*** join/#debian noone11 (9b8f0e4a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.155.143.14.74)
23:59.19*** join/#debian Rothgar` (~admin@ppp201-15.static.internode.on.net)
23:59.41*** join/#debian dTal (~dtal@host217-37-98-253.in-addr.btopenworld.com)

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