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| 00:01.51 | fpat | there were people some time ago with strange bash behavior. that was not resolved so far, right? |
| 00:03.04 | fpat | i can not invoke ~/bin/youtube-dl from within ~/Music except when i use the full path. the pass was not changed by me tho |
| 00:03.26 | fpat | pass/path |
| 00:04.04 | coruja | echo $PATH && ls -l ~/bin/ |
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| 00:05.17 | fpat | thats odd. default path now and my custom one is gone |
| 00:05.41 | fpat | .bashrc like i had not touched it |
| 00:06.20 | fpat | but the older edit about PS1 is still there. so that was not a script accident |
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| 00:15.29 | tomreyn | could be selinux or apparmor or whatever getting in the way, though that'd be quite the bug. |
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| 00:18.49 | *** topic/#debian is Debian Stretch: /msg dpkg stretch ; /msg dpkg 9.5 ; /msg dpkg jessie->stretch ; /msg dpkg install stretch | Oldstable: Debian Jessie /msg dpkg jessie ; /msg dpkg 8.11 | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | /msg bots NOT people | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing, unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog |
| 00:19.02 | fpat | hehe, well! |
| 00:19.25 | fpat | no, i installed it a few days ago. so that was quick |
| 00:20.26 | tomreyn | hmm, quite peculiar |
| 00:20.54 | fpat | there was something else yesterday. thats why i rebooted. the tab key no longer worked for switching between windows |
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| 00:25.55 | fpat | ah, i see parallels to annadane's situation |
| 00:27.28 | fpat | either browsing with krusader or browsing the web with firefox-esr could be the cause |
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| 00:40.18 | skapata | I'm trying to find out why my root's $PATH was automatically changed. So, after executing su, I've typed these commands: https://pastebin.com/WGUn9gBz |
| 00:41.42 | skapata | (I've commented the line "source /etc/profile" that I wrote by myself in .bashrc) |
| 00:41.53 | fpat | yeah, skapata. me too |
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| 00:43.13 | fpat | and it cant be overwritten by a package. the older line of me is still there |
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| 00:52.50 | maize-haze | Hi there. I need some help figuring out issues with installing Debian 9.5.0 on the Intel Skull Canyon NUC. I am experiencing a strange visual effect where the Debian text based installer appears 10 times in very tiny "windows" at the top of the screen, making it impossible to read text in the installer. |
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| 00:55.00 | maize-haze | For what it's worth: I've done my research (Googling, etc.) and tried two different display outputs (HDMI, Mini-Displayport) to no avail. The graphical installer doesn't even load, which is even less productive. Does anyone have any insights as to what could cause this and/or how to fix it? |
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| 00:57.59 | maize-haze | i see... nobody is online? |
| 00:58.01 | sussudio | maize-haze: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Workarounds#Laptop_LCD_display_top_half_is_garbled.2C_bottom_half_is_black ? |
| 00:58.59 | maize-haze | This isn't that issue -- this is a desktop, not a laptop, the GRUB menu remains on screen, and my display is 4K not 768. |
| 01:00.26 | sussudio | if you can't see that the problem is similar and you should adapt it to your situation, i'm done. |
| 01:00.31 | maize-haze | The top half also isn't garbled -- it's actually 10 very tiny vterms, all side-by-side at the top of the screen. |
| 01:02.21 | sussudio | so kill the window manager. |
| 01:02.35 | maize-haze | This is the text-based installer. |
| 01:03.16 | mason | maize-haze: You might be able to poke at the display mode from the installer's GRUB. |
| 01:03.45 | sussudio | that's the first thing i suggested and he doesn't want to. |
| 01:04.18 | mason | sussudio: Ah, hadn't read the link. But I've seen gop-gone-bad on my hardware. |
| 01:04.38 | maize-haze | "doesn't want to"? I'm sorry, linking me an answer about a laptop display that has almost no similarity to my issue, then saying I should restart the display manager when I clearly state that this is a text-based installer is not "doesn't want to", it's "refusing useless advice". |
| 01:04.39 | mason | maize-haze: Yar, follow sussudio's link. |
| 01:04.51 | sussudio | if, for some reason, you can't get the video to work, do a serial console install? |
| 01:04.56 | mason | maize-haze: You're on a modern system. It isn't text. |
| 01:05.39 | maize-haze | Then why does one say "graphical installer"? |
| 01:05.55 | mason | maize-haze: Irrelevant. I'm saying the text isn't in fact a plain text display. |
| 01:06.15 | mason | But anyway, sussudio gave you a good answer. Up to you if you do it. |
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| 01:10.11 | sussudio | i found why an upgrade to wheezy made my screen an unreadably high resolution... it replaced my fbdev-blacklist.conf without asking me. |
| 01:10.27 | annadane | "upgrade to wheezy" |
| 01:10.29 | annadane | jesus christ |
| 01:10.32 | sussudio | i can't see why anyone would want a 1920x1080 text console. |
| 01:10.55 | sussudio | oh you again. |
| 01:15.37 | abrotman | sussudio: because you have a 50" monitor :) |
| 01:15.52 | mason | abrotman: o/ |
| 01:15.56 | abrotman | howdy |
| 01:16.08 | abrotman | sorry, I saw that the other day, but it was much later |
| 01:16.15 | mason | No worries. |
| 01:16.27 | mason | I seem to be deploying more Debian lately, so I figured I'd hang out in here again. |
| 01:16.57 | sussudio | abrotman: no, it's 24" or something, and i'm only using it because the other one started to leak liquid from the power cable connector for some reason. |
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| 01:17.16 | abrotman | sussudio: that sounds awesome ... |
| 01:17.52 | sussudio | i really dislike lcd anyway. my trusty crt got rained on and started blinking. |
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| 06:21.09 | likcoras | How can I make weechat set 0644 on new log files? |
| 06:21.32 | likcoras | #weechat generally is not willing to support older versions, so I'm asking here instead... |
| 06:23.04 | mdk | likcoras: 0644 instead of what? Setting a umask may help |
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| 06:23.51 | likcoras | weechat automatically sets 0600 on log files, my umask is 0022, weechat just explicitly sets 0600 when creating new log files. |
| 06:24.21 | mdk | ok |
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| 06:28.36 | kopper | likcoras: Why do you need to give read permission to someone else than owner? |
| 06:29.04 | kopper | I mean, aren't you the owner of log file? |
| 06:29.34 | likcoras | I want to be able to read the logs served over my webserver (behind proper authentication, of course), but www-data can't read the files. |
| 06:29.55 | kopper | Ah. |
| 06:30.48 | likcoras | Luckily, it doesn't re-set the permissions, so I can just chmod it and it will stick, but new buffers are not readable unless I re-set permissions. |
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| 06:31.50 | kopper | Create a script which checks file permissions in log folder every 5 sec or so, and changes them to 644 if they are something else |
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| 06:33.58 | likcoras | I was doing something similar, I run chmod before logrotate. |
| 06:34.08 | likcoras | I guess that's all that I can do for now, then welp. |
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| 06:34.53 | eyeoh | my quick and dirty first thought was to set a script too |
| 06:36.14 | eyeoh | likcoras: also, is this for multiple log files? Because shouldn't it remember permissions if you set it once for a log file? |
| 06:36.43 | likcoras | Yeah, it's maintained, but I need to re-run when I eg. open a new query or join a new channel. |
| 06:36.48 | eyeoh | i.e., how often do you need this to happen? |
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| 06:37.51 | likcoras | Not super often, but it's something I need to remember occasionally when I want to look at the logs after joining a new channel. |
| 06:38.03 | likcoras | Logrotate runs daily, so I often need to run the script manually. |
| 06:38.25 | eyeoh | I'm just trying to think of the most elegant way to do this |
| 06:39.13 | eyeoh | crontab every 24 hours just before logrotate runs to chmod 604 folder/* ? |
| 06:39.34 | eyeoh | although they can be easy to forget, so a separate script might be safer |
| 06:39.57 | eyeoh | (or a crontab to run said script..) |
| 06:40.04 | likcoras | That's essentially my current setup, but still requires me to re-run if I need to look at logs before the crontab runs |
| 06:40.13 | eyeoh | php :p |
| 06:40.26 | kopper | Just set the crontab to run it more often? |
| 06:41.06 | eyeoh | and just for the record, irssi logs appear to be 600 by default too |
| 06:41.18 | likcoras | I'd expect 600 by default, too. |
| 06:42.38 | likcoras | I'll run the script more frequently, I guess. Thanks everyone! |
| 06:43.29 | eyeoh | it shouldn't take any more resources |
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| 07:02.33 | diogenes_ | Hello guys, what is the different between 9.5.0-live/ and current-live/, at first sight the isos look the same. |
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| 07:05.02 | Fox | once 9.6 will be current you'll see a difference ;) |
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| 07:05.49 | diogenes_ | Fox, but the installed packages are the same as 9.5.0-live? |
| 07:05.56 | diogenes_ | i mean at the moment |
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| 07:06.19 | Fox | at the moment 9,5 is current, so there's no difference |
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| 07:07.04 | diogenes_ | Fox, so there's absolutely no difference atm, it's like just the same iso but put into two different directories? |
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| 07:08.57 | Fox | diogenes_: did you check both sha sums ? it's the only way to tell they are exactly the same |
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| 07:10.25 | diogenes_ | Fox, i've never used debian, i used only a few debian based so i'm kind of a newbie here, completely clueless about how debian's roadmap works and i couldn't find any comprehensive info on the debian page so i decided to ask here. |
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| 07:14.02 | somiaj | diogenes_: debian is a mostly frozen system. The only changes that happen to stable are security and serious/grave bug fixes. |
| 07:14.29 | diogenes_ | somiaj, and what about kernel updates? |
| 07:14.49 | somiaj | diogenes_: the only difference between 9.5 and 9.6 is those fixes, you can install any version of debian stretch (even 9.0) and upgrade to the current version with all the bug and security fixes. |
| 07:15.10 | somiaj | diogenes_: the only kernel updates are security/bug fixes. There was a recent one (newer than 9.6) that if you ahve debian security sources, you can upgrade too |
| 07:15.26 | somiaj | debian tries not to change things (frozen system) but only when required, which boils down to secuirty/bugs |
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| 07:15.54 | diogenes_ | somiaj, so just sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade will keep you up to date with the latest security fixes? |
| 07:16.03 | somiaj | (note frozen is not always possible, and with some software is getting harder and harder, browers are already fixed by newer versions and in stretch vlc had to upgrade to 3.0 due to not able to backport security fixes. |
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| 07:16.33 | klys | you need a stretch-updates or stretch/updates source. |
| 07:16.53 | somiaj | you may to do apt dist-upgrade, but yes, that is all you need to do |
| 07:17.23 | somiaj | stretch/updates is the security one |
| 07:18.30 | somiaj | !stretch sources.list |
| 07:18.30 | dpkg | A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ stretch main" "deb http://security.debian.org/debian-security stretch/updates main" "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ stretch-updates main". Be sure to run «apt update» after editing sources.list. Also see <deb-src> <contrib> <non-free> <stretch/updates> <stretch-updates> <mirrors> and "man sources.list". |
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| 07:19.26 | diogenes_ | somiaj, so the apt/sources.list comes by default with that config or i need to add some of them manually? |
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| 07:22.04 | somiaj | the installer should set most of it up, but that factiod gives you an idea what sould be there |
| 07:22.35 | ArahaelPi | Is it possible to set up a transparent proxy that works for HTTPS sites, such that it's 1. Trusted, and yet 2. Doesn't extend that trust to third party certificates - if those are flawed, then they should still be blocked. |
| 07:22.48 | diogenes_ | ok thanks somiaj klys and Fox, i'm gonna try the live cinnamon. |
| 07:23.24 | ArahaelPi | In other words, if Iw ere to go to my banking site, via this proxy, then I should be able to "trust" my proxy (afterall, I set it up, it's effectively an extension of my desktop), but if some other website has hijacked it and I'm not expecting THAT, it should still be able to show a MITM attack. |
| 07:24.09 | ArahaelPi | ie, Me <-> Trusted Proxy <-> MITM Attacker <-> Bank; I should still be able to determine, clearly, that the MITM attacker is not representing the bank. |
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| 07:29.43 | Bustin | Hello, new user to debian and linux, but had a question. Is it possibe if I'm running debian stretch, to install a package from buster or sid? |
| 07:31.41 | ArahaelPi | Bustin: Possible, yes, but not recommended at all. |
| 07:31.41 | somiaj | no |
| 07:32.03 | ArahaelPi | !ssb |
| 07:32.03 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
| 07:32.08 | somiaj | well yes possible, but the question should have been, is it safe, and the answer is in most cases no. Use a backport, or other wasy to get newer software |
| 07:32.11 | somiaj | !don't break debian |
| 07:32.11 | dpkg | i heard dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian |
| 07:32.15 | somiaj | might be a good link to start with too |
| 07:32.55 | ArahaelPi | Bustin: Also, whilst debian testing will eventually become stable, mixed distros and especially sid, never ever becomes stable. |
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| 07:35.44 | cfoch | Hello, I am trying Debian as a Dom0 over a Xen Hypervisor... I have support for HVM and according forums you recognize a HVM guest VM if it has /dev/sda or /dev/hda partitions instead of /dev/sda... But according "xl list --long" my VM is HVM. I need a /Dev/sda partition because the distro i need install doesn't recognizes the /dev/xvda as a disk |
| 07:37.01 | cfoch | If i set vdev to sda it loads it as xvda anyway |
| 07:38.07 | Bustin | Thank you. |
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| 07:40.41 | cfoch | Or maybe there is an option un Xen setting everything by default yo xvda but I AM not sure |
| 07:40.51 | ArahaelPi | somiaj: Actually, saying "no", assuming that the original question was really asking "is it safe...", can backfire. Because if they then go and continue doing their research (why trust a random on IRC?), they may find that they can technically get the crap installed. |
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| 07:42.33 | somiaj | also asking xy problems are best to be avoided, asking what software you want a newer version of and why would get the best response. Some software is to much of a pain to backport and that can be learned |
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| 08:31.26 | beepnboop- | should i install xfce on "strong" desktop pc? |
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| 08:33.19 | beepnboop- | asking this stupid question cause i read that its really light weight de |
| 08:33.59 | beepnboop- | so shouldn't more weighty de be more appropriate? |
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| 08:35.11 | ksqsf | beepnboop-: install it if you like it |
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| 08:35.53 | kopper | Why would you install something heavier you don't like to use just because your pc can handle it? |
| 08:36.16 | kopper | If you like xfce, use it |
| 08:37.05 | slax0r | so you mean, I can add stronger hardware even if my tiling wm doesn't need it?! |
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| 08:38.13 | ksqsf | slax0r: you do use anything other than WMs, don't you? |
| 08:38.27 | slax0r | yes, terminal emulator |
| 08:38.38 | stevendale | I use Linux Mint 19 XFCE not because it is lighter, but because I prefer XFCE over Cinnamon or MATE |
| 08:38.43 | slax0r | and a browser |
| 08:38.50 | stevendale | If I liked Cinnamon or MATE more than XFCE, I'd use them |
| 08:39.05 | stevendale | Unused computer resources are wasted computer resources, and wasted money |
| 08:39.20 | stevendale | But just because you can run it, doesn't mean you should |
| 08:39.26 | stevendale | You should run what you enjoy using |
| 08:39.31 | stevendale | Regardless of the overhead |
| 08:41.02 | stevendale | Though there is a line to draw, if you try to run KDE Plasma on a 2 core 4 thread, Intel Atom, and enjoy running KDE on faster machines, that's not smart, because it won't run 'enjoyably' on a Dual core Atom |
| 08:41.57 | stevendale | Linux is good because everybody can have a personal favourite and use what they want to |
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| 08:43.11 | slax0r | unused resources are wasted yes, but this doesn't mean you should run SETI all the time, just to keep the iron busy |
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| 09:02.19 | comphuse | I am considering switching to debian testing. Any significant bugs I should be aware of before migrating? |
| 09:02.36 | stevendale | aNope comphuse |
| 09:02.40 | stevendale | You're good to go |
| 09:02.51 | stevendale | Just reboot after you've upgraded |
| 09:03.00 | epicmetal | comphuse: nothing except lack of timely security updates |
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| 09:37.17 | fUNKIAM` | hi all |
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| 09:38.35 | Azimoth | Hi, I just discovered that there's a way to update intel microcode early during boot an Gentoo and checked whether this also works on Debian (stretch). Unfortunately "dmesg | grep "microcode updated early to" returns nothing... what am I missing? |
| 09:38.54 | jelly | comphuse, well, there are always bugs in testing, if there weren't it would be declared stable |
| 09:40.00 | epicmetal | Azimoth: works for me on Sid |
| 09:40.14 | jelly | Azimoth, is intel-microcode package installed? Which debian release are you using? |
| 09:40.31 | petn-randall | Azimoth: works for me on stable. You need to have the {amd,intel}-microcode installed, and it'll do the magic for you. |
| 09:40.42 | jelly | it's usually the first line in dmesg, even before Linux ... |
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| 09:43.59 | eyeoh | maybe also just grep for microcode, single word only |
| 09:44.55 | Azimoth | jelly: intel-microcode is installed, I'm using Debian Stretch (and the backported version of intel micocode) |
| 09:46.04 | Azimoth | the first line of dmesg is "Linux version 4.9.0-7-amd64 (debian-kernel@lists.debian.org) (gcc version 6.3.0 20170516 (Debian 6.3.0-18+deb9u1) ) #1 SMP Debian 4.9.110-3+deb9u1 (2018-08-03)" |
| 09:46.37 | jelly | thne you've got everything for things to work. Perhaps there's no microcode for your cpu? |
| 09:47.09 | eyeoh | lscpu ? |
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| 09:47.33 | petn-randall | Azimoth: From skimming some webpages, the "microcode updated early" is deprecated and won't be printed in newer kernels. |
| 09:48.01 | Azimoth | petn-randall: Then I'd suggest updating https://wiki.debian.org/Microcode#Debian_9_.22Stretch.22_.28stable.29 |
| 09:48.02 | jelly | on my i3-4130 and stretch and 4.16.0-0.bpo.2-amd64 kernel, [11:39] ~ => sudo dmesg|head -n1 |
| 09:48.02 | jelly | [ 0.000000] microcode: microcode updated early to revision 0x24, date = 2018-01-21 |
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| 09:48.41 | Azimoth | eyeoh: I assume the important information is this one "Model name: Intel(R) Atom(TM) x5-Z8350 CPU @ 1.44GHz" |
| 09:48.53 | epicmetal | petn-randall: I'm running a 4.18 release candidate |
| 09:49.13 | petn-randall | Hmm, interesting. I have intel-microcode installed, but not this message. |
| 09:49.24 | petn-randall | Maybe the one in the BIOS is current enough. |
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| 09:50.08 | eyeoh | off the top of my head, intel atom shouldn't be affected by meltdown/spectre right? or not? |
| 09:51.13 | petn-randall | It should. |
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| 09:51.40 | eyeoh | and just for the record, fedora 28 with 4.17.11-200: Intel(R) Core(TM) i3-4130 CPU @ 3.40GHz "0.000000] microcode: microcode updated early to revision 0x24, date = 2018-01-21" |
| 09:51.41 | jelly | the "atom" brand spans like 6+ generations of CPUs |
| 09:52.32 | Azimoth | jelly: "dmesg | grep microcode" returns two lines... these: "microcode: sig=0x406c4, pf=0x1, revision=0x410" and "microcode: Microcode Update Driver: v2.01 <tigran@aivazian.fsnet.co.uk>, Peter Oruba" |
| 09:52.32 | Azimoth | jelly: this seems to me like there is something happening, just not as early as it could (or the message is actually removed) |
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| 09:53.09 | eyeoh | I get those two lines too; so I get three lines with that word |
| 09:53.34 | eyeoh | hmm what's rev 0x410 - that seems bigger than mine |
| 09:53.59 | eyeoh | microcode: sig=0x306c3, pf=0x2, revision=0x24 | microcode: Microcode Update Driver: v2.2. |
| 09:54.22 | Azimoth | eyeoh: maybe because I use the backported version? |
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| 10:00.29 | petn-randall | I wonder if there's a way to compare microcode versions. I imagine my BIOS vendor already has a current one, so it doesn't get loaded. |
| 10:00.36 | petn-randall | (x230 with latest BIOS here) |
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| 10:03.53 | jelly | Azimoth, I think that's the driver that comes later and is not actually used, and just reports the current version |
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| 10:04.18 | toruvinn | uh wb. |
| 10:04.18 | jediofthecode | ,backportupgrade appmenu-gtk-module |
| 10:05.29 | Azimoth | jelly: so the wikipage should be updated to remove the "microcode updated early" part as version check? |
| 10:05.41 | jelly | eyeoh, microcode firmware is cpu model specific (with some overlap for cpus within same generation), each cpu model has their own separate revisions |
| 10:05.45 | toruvinn | in stretch, do i need to edit grub.cfg to add resume=swappartition after dpkg-reconfigure uswsusp? |
| 10:05.47 | Azimoth | jelly: this one https://wiki.debian.org/Microcode#Checking_the_microcode_version_of_your_CPU |
| 10:06.00 | toruvinn | i remember that in old Debian I catually had to do this, scripts didn't resume otherwise. |
| 10:06.12 | toruvinn | s/catu/actu/ (nice typo!) |
| 10:06.47 | jelly | Azimoth, I don't think so. |
| 10:07.45 | jediofthecode | what is the command to check backport compat again ? |
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| 10:08.32 | Azimoth | jelly: So, there is something misconfigured on my system? (Because the check doesn't work) |
| 10:10.53 | jelly | Azimoth, hard to say. Perhaps you just don't have microcode available, even if Intel says intel-microcode 20180807 is relevant for your cpu: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/product/93361/Intel-Atom-x5-Z8350-Processor-2M-Cache-up-to-1-92-GHz- |
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| 10:11.14 | jelly | ,v intel-microcode |
| 10:11.15 | judd | Package: intel-microcode on amd64 -- wheezy/non-free: 1.20150121.1; jessie-backports/non-free: 3.20170511.1~bpo8+1; stretch/non-free: 3.20170707.1~deb9u1; jessie-backports-sloppy/non-free: 3.20180425.1~bpo8+1; stretch-backports/non-free: 3.20180425.1~bpo9+1; jessie/non-free: 3.20180425.1~deb8u1; stretch-proposed-updates/non-free: 3.20180425.1~deb9u1; buster/non-free: 3.20180703.2; sid |
| 10:11.16 | judd | /non-free: 3.20180703.2 |
| 10:11.35 | jelly | Azimoth, which version of intel-microcode is installed? |
| 10:12.05 | Azimoth | jelly: Version: 3.20180703.2~bpo9+1 |
| 10:12.25 | jelly | hmph, judd is still outdated |
| 10:13.10 | jelly | Azimoth, maybe only the very latest has fixes for your cpu, and the month old microcode does not? |
| 10:14.06 | Azimoth | jelly: But this is still unavailable in all versions of Debian repos, right? |
| 10:14.11 | jediofthecode | is there at least a way to get a list of all available bot commands for this channel ? |
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| 10:15.04 | jelly | Azimoth, that's what http://tracker.debian.org/intel-microcode says, yes |
| 10:15.18 | jelly | !ircbots |
| 10:15.34 | jediofthecode | !ircbots |
| 10:15.51 | Azimoth | jelly: how long does it usually take until stuff published by intel ends up in the repos? |
| 10:15.53 | jelly | !search dpkg |
| 10:15.53 | dpkg | You can search my database on the web at http://ircbots.debian.net/ or on IRC by asking me about <help listkeys> and <help-listvals>. My factoids are available at http://crito.ucr.edu/~dpkg/ in archives that are updated nightly and the previous 18 days are there. See also <search>. |
| 10:15.57 | jelly | jediofthecode, ^ |
| 10:16.14 | jelly | Azimoth, I have no idea |
| 10:16.24 | jediofthecode | well, i want to check the compatibility of backporting something, i forget the command |
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| 10:16.36 | jelly | jediofthecode, msg judd checkbackport |
| 10:17.21 | Azimoth | jelly: alright, then all I can do is continue to update on a regular basis and see what happens :) |
| 10:17.23 | jediofthecode | awesome, thankls |
| 10:17.37 | Azimoth | jelly: Thanks for your help, nevertheless :) |
| 10:17.47 | jelly | Azimoth, you could download from intel, unpack the tarball under /lib/firmware, rebuild initramfs and reboot and see what happens |
| 10:18.33 | jelly | maybe not the whole tarball but just the intel-ucode directory |
| 10:18.42 | jelly | or wait. |
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| 10:20.10 | Azimoth | jelly: since this system is fairly important to me (hence Debian and NOT Gentoo ;) ) I prefer not to bend over backwards too far to achieve something... I think waiting is the better option in this case |
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| 10:29.51 | aiRness | anyone knows why camorama is not on sid anymore ? |
| 10:30.01 | aiRness | I don't get why packages are getting off the repos somtimes |
| 10:31.25 | jelly | ,v camorama |
| 10:31.26 | judd | Package: camorama on amd64 -- wheezy: 0.19-2.2; jessie: 0.19-3; stretch: 0.19-5+b1 |
| 10:31.39 | jelly | ,bug rm camorama |
| 10:31.43 | judd | Bug http://bugs.debian.org/897002 in ftp.debian.org (closed): «RM: camorama -- ROM; abandoned upstream, unmaintained»; severity: normal; opened: 2018-04-26; last modified: 2018-05-29. |
| 10:32.25 | jelly | aiRness, you can ask the bot on your own for other packages that are gone, /msg judd bug rm packagename |
| 10:32.33 | aiRness | sure |
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| 10:48.44 | beepnboop- | yea i love xfce its the only de that looks like windows |
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| 10:49.00 | beepnboop- | and i love its design overall |
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| 10:50.22 | epicmetal | beepnboop-: not sure what version of Windows you're using! |
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| 10:51.00 | beepnboop- | 7 |
| 10:51.17 | stevendale | System: Host steven-GP62MVR-7RFX Kernel 4.15.0-30-generic x86_64 bits 64 Desktop Xfce 4.12.3 |
| 10:51.18 | stevendale | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:51.27 | beepnboop- | well not for long |
| 10:51.28 | stevendale | XFCE is great beepnboop- :) |
| 10:51.38 | beepnboop- | today debian becomes my main os |
| 10:52.18 | stevendale | I would use Debian but I am too lazy to hand pick all the packages, and tasksel gets stuff I don't want |
| 10:52.41 | epicmetal | tasksel is the worst |
| 10:52.46 | stevendale | Plus my NVIDIA card is a pain to get going in Debian |
| 10:52.54 | stevendale | GTX 1060 Mobile |
| 10:53.48 | darxmurf | I only miss Photoshop on linux to switch at home too |
| 10:54.03 | stevendale | GIMP works for me :) |
| 10:54.06 | plantroon | gimp is great |
| 10:54.07 | epicmetal | I found Xfce buggy lately on Arch/Ubuntu |
| 10:54.12 | darxmurf | or not :D |
| 10:54.25 | `whoami` | isn't photoshop working over ine ? |
| 10:54.26 | `whoami` | wine* |
| 10:54.35 | darxmurf | it's complicated I think |
| 10:54.37 | plantroon | probably but gimp is better |
| 10:54.42 | stevendale | Don't bother |
| 10:54.43 | `whoami` | ahah got it :) |
| 10:54.43 | epicmetal | I think the GTK3 port is taking its toll |
| 10:54.45 | stevendale | GIMP master race |
| 10:54.47 | stevendale | :D |
| 10:55.11 | darxmurf | gimp is fine to do basic things but I working with PS since version 4... impossible to switch to something else |
| 10:55.34 | plantroon | that's what I thought, but it's just about getting used to different things :) |
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| 10:55.48 | darxmurf | anyway, endless fight :D |
| 10:55.56 | stevendale | GIMP over photoshop, Blender over AutoCAD/Autodesk, mtpaint over Microsoft Paint, Inkscape over Illustrator, Audacity over Adobe Audition |
| 10:56.08 | `whoami` | yeah, and what about vim/emacs ? |
| 10:56.10 | darxmurf | gimp does not open my RAW camera files :-) |
| 10:56.34 | plantroon | then the camera is not ready for the future |
| 10:56.41 | darxmurf | voilà |
| 10:56.45 | darxmurf | it's probably the issue :D |
| 10:56.55 | stevendale | CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-7700HQ CPU @ 2.80GHz (801MHz) |
| 10:57.04 | stevendale | This lappy would handle Photoshop if it ran Windows tho |
| 10:57.07 | stevendale | Quite nicely |
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| 10:58.00 | Fox | darxmurf: gimp can read RAW files, but you can't work with them (quite useless actually :)) |
| 10:58.07 | epicmetal | stevendale: and here I am on my 2nd gen CPU |
| 10:58.18 | stevendale | I feel you epicmetal |
| 10:58.33 | stevendale | i have another lappy with a 3rd gen i5 and a desktop with a 1st gen i5 |
| 10:58.42 | stevendale | My Mac mini had a 2nd gen i5 but I sold that |
| 10:58.43 | plantroon | here I am on my Core 2 Duo Thinkpad X200 with Libreboot :D and guess what, I am watching a h265 encoded movie. I don't know how it works but it does. |
| 10:58.54 | epicmetal | stevendale: i3 here, kernel compile takes two hours |
| 10:59.08 | stevendale | I used to watch 720p on my Core 2 Duo P8700 2.53 GHz, plantroon |
| 10:59.21 | stevendale | The GMA 4500 MHD proved to be very powerful in Linux :) |
| 10:59.23 | plantroon | yeah P8700 here too. This is 1080p h265 :) |
| 10:59.32 | darxmurf | epicmetal: I have a 7 years old Atom machine if you want to compare :D |
| 10:59.41 | epicmetal | darxmurf: argh! |
| 10:59.43 | stevendale | Mine has 4 GB DDR2-800, what abouts your plantroon? |
| 11:00.09 | darxmurf | epicmetal: doing it's backup jobs, it's quite fine in the end :D |
| 11:00.22 | plantroon | stevendale: 4 GB but let me check about the speed |
| 11:00.42 | stevendale | plantroon: Mine's a Dell Latitude E5400 |
| 11:00.52 | epicmetal | darxmurf: I actually ran an Atom as my main rig temporarily a few years back. Wasn't bad except video decode |
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| 11:01.47 | beepnboop- | i wish vm in linux was a thing |
| 11:02.01 | beepnboop- | would've been so much better than dual boot |
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| 11:02.19 | oc0d | beepnboop-: PCI passthrough via OVMF |
| 11:02.21 | plantroon | stevendale: I think this is DDR3 1066 MHz :D I can't find the info anywhere. I bought my Thinkpad X200 only to run Libreboot with it. And it's become my main PC. |
| 11:02.41 | beepnboop- | i heard its pain int he ass |
| 11:02.45 | oc0d | it is |
| 11:02.50 | stevendale | I used to run Minecraft on my P8700 plantroon on Arch Linux + X.org + TWM + XDM + Java 8 |
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| 11:03.12 | stevendale | I had to install Optifine and turn everything to minimum, but it ran MC 1.12.2 at 40 - 60 FPS |
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| 11:03.21 | plantroon | stevendale: oh, minecraft is proprietary software but minetest is shaping up nicely. I also don't want to have that java stuff on my PC, nothing good ever came out of it :D |
| 11:03.41 | plantroon | stevendale: but I own minecraft since beta :D |
| 11:03.44 | stevendale | My dad works at Oracle, Inc. out of coincidence, plantroon :D |
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| 11:04.38 | plantroon | stevendale: nice :D well I have nothing against java, but just the runtime would be the biggest software package in my lightweight system lol |
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| 11:05.34 | stevendale | XFCE runs quite nicely on 2 gig DDR3, and an Intel Atom N2600 1.6 GHz 2 cores 4 threads :D |
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| 11:06.24 | stevendale | Only 393 MB RAM used at idle |
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| 11:07.38 | oc0d | I was at 8GB RAM, realized wireshark had been sniffing since yesterday |
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| 11:13.06 | oc0d | so, does debian live CD with gnome have any preinstalled firewall? can't connect to it nor ping it, shouldn't be anything on the network in the way, manage to ssh from it to another PC |
| 11:14.54 | Delurk | systemctl status sshd |
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| 11:15.26 | oc0d | its running |
| 11:16.02 | oc0d | i can't see any rules in iptables and doubt there should be anything else installed per default |
| 11:16.11 | oc0d | just cant figure out why it wont even answer ping |
| 11:16.32 | epicmetal | oc0d: no, but I like ferm |
| 11:17.16 | oc0d | epicmetal: hmm? |
| 11:18.06 | epicmetal | oc0d: nevermind I didn't read your question properly |
| 11:19.50 | oc0d | ah ok, it's answering now though, think it was the DHCP acting up |
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| 11:59.15 | kale | how do i find out which version of ocaml debians unison is built against. i am currently on stretch 9.5 |
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| 12:09.30 | jim | kale, first, it will help to have the package name... so try: apt-cache search ocaml |
| 12:10.17 | kale | jim, yeah, i just ran apt-get build-dep unison, then i'll check dpkg --list to se what i got, next i need to find a unison built for that same ocaml for my other system... |
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| 12:12.12 | jim | I ended up expanding that to: apt-cache search ocaml | grep ^ocaml # left side starts with 'ocaml' |
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| 12:12.41 | jim | and found some interesting packagenames, incl. ocaml and ocaml-base |
| 12:13.40 | jim | now that we have a couple of package names (and add ones you find interesting), you can try: dpkg -s ocaml |
| 12:13.57 | jim | look for Version: in the output |
| 12:15.54 | jim | also try the other one, and here I include a grep: dpkg -s ocaml-base | grep Version |
| 12:17.13 | jim | I don;'t know much about ocaml or unison, so I dunno anything about their relationship |
| 12:18.26 | kale | unison is built against a ocaml version, so you can have the same unison version, but built on two different ocaml versions, and the result is that the communication will fail. |
| 12:18.37 | jim | anyway, that should be it for version info, and, if you get stuck on any of that, of course speak up |
| 12:19.21 | jim | is unison an official stretch package/ |
| 12:19.22 | jim | ? |
| 12:19.36 | kale | yes |
| 12:20.00 | kale | its in many distros including non GNU |
| 12:20.15 | jim | ok, let me try something (there's a bot judd that searches the ultimate debian database) |
| 12:22.10 | kale | youve helped plenty, i got what i asked for, so thanks |
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| 12:22.27 | jelly | ,v unison |
| 12:22.28 | judd | Package: unison on amd64 -- wheezy: 2.40.65-2; jessie: 2.40.102-2; stretch: 2.48.3-1; buster: 2.48.4-1+b1; sid: 2.48.4-1+b1 |
| 12:22.58 | jelly | ,depends unison |
| 12:22.59 | judd | Package unison in stretch/amd64 -- depends: libc6 (>= 2.14). |
| 12:23.12 | jelly | ah, statically built goods |
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| 12:24.38 | jelly | ,build-dep unison |
| 12:24.39 | judd | Package unison in stretch -- Build-Depends: cdbs (>= 0.4.23), debhelper (>= 9), ocaml-nox (>= 3.10.0-8), liblablgtk2-ocaml-dev (>= 2.12.0-2), chrpath, librsvg2-bin (>= 2.18.2), imagemagick, dh-ocaml (>= 0.9.1). |
| 12:25.04 | jelly | so it needs at least ocaml (>= 3.10.0-8) |
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| 12:28.45 | jim | jelly, yeah, just saw that... but why does unison not depend on ocaml stuff? |
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| 12:31.32 | Zgrokl | hey what kind of hardware behaviour can triger this log : systemd-logind[427]: Power key pressed. |
| 12:32.11 | Zgrokl | i have a little celeron server and when i come back it turned off |
| 12:33.20 | jim | a very heavy spider? |
| 12:33.32 | jelly | jim, the magic of statically-linked libraries |
| 12:33.50 | Zgrokl | jim, you mean a big bug |
| 12:34.19 | jelly | Zgrokl, how big is your power button |
| 12:34.47 | jelly | can your kids or the cleaning lady accidentally graze it |
| 12:35.02 | Zgrokl | it in a closed inacessible local |
| 12:35.05 | Zgrokl | it's* |
| 12:35.52 | kale | lt cmdr. data has his in the back. |
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| 12:36.38 | jim | kale, if unison is statically linked to the ocaml stuff, it wouldn't need ocaml (or ocaml-anything) to also be installed... in that sense, it's self-contained |
| 12:37.55 | Zgrokl | Is it possible that maybe cpu is too high on temperature ? or something and power key is trigger ? |
| 12:38.24 | jim | kale, it just needs the ocaml pacakages listed in order to build the unison package |
| 12:39.14 | jim | Zgrokl, maybe you have to look in the bios... and/or set up lm sensors |
| 12:39.35 | jim | for the cpu and mobo temp |
| 12:39.57 | kale | jim, yes but the other unison has to be linked to the same ocaml version. |
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| 12:40.29 | jim | hmm... not sure I understand yet... other unison? |
| 12:41.09 | Zgrokl | Zgrokl, i already have watch sensors and the ssh stoped at the same time of the log with 53°C |
| 12:41.10 | kale | the other computer that runs unison and connect to the computer that runs debian and unison |
| 12:41.17 | jelly | unison is like rsync, jim |
| 12:41.23 | Zgrokl | jim, i mean |
| 12:41.56 | Zgrokl | but my question was : is it possible mobo can power off for temperature reason ? |
| 12:42.02 | jelly | kale, but why would they need to be built against the same or similar ocaml, is the protocol that broken? |
| 12:42.12 | jim | unison keeps specific folders synced? |
| 12:42.55 | kale | unison has some advantages over rsync, but can also run in rsync mode. you could say unison has another purpose than rsync. but the downside of unison is that the different systems using it, has to have a version built against the same version of ocaml, and if not, the error messages does not provide a clear picture of why communication fails. |
| 12:43.07 | jelly | Zgrokl, it's theoretically possible the chipset could trigger an ACPI event equivalent to poewr button press yes, but I have not seen it yet |
| 12:43.29 | jelly | Zgrokl, might want to ask in ##hardware about that possibility if you're interested |
| 12:44.02 | jelly | kale, eh, why not copy over the same binary |
| 12:44.15 | kale | on mac, windows and linux? |
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| 12:44.21 | jelly | ouch |
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| 12:48.34 | kale | it use it personally and sync my desktop against server. then before i leave i sync my laptop, when i get home i sync laptop again. so this way i have my date in three places, and it checks 250G in 10 secs, so its quite fast. at work i am forced to use non GNU systems, but use it here as well. |
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| 12:54.21 | jim | can you build it yourself on the other two platforms, and build ocaml too? |
| 12:54.44 | jim | mac should present less of a problem than win |
| 12:55.21 | kale | i guess i could, but the executeables are provided. you just need to know which executeable to download. usually you can see which version of ocaml the executeables are built against |
| 12:55.54 | jim | if you can see that, that should be ok... but? |
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| 12:56.40 | jim | that's a lot better than having to build them on what could be called "unknown" platforms |
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| 12:58.16 | kale | well i still have to run cygwin, so unison can use ssh, so its kinda troublesome to set up, but it syncs fast |
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| 13:00.24 | jelly | you can run that new linux ABI thing if you have windows 10 or 2016 |
| 13:00.46 | jelly | and then you really can use the same binary |
| 13:01.07 | epicmetal | WSL |
| 13:01.20 | jelly | yeah. They have a Debian image now, too |
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| 13:13.30 | stevendale | Windows is trash |
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| 13:14.08 | digdilem | Good old sweeping statements |
| 13:15.06 | stevendale | Why bother with linux ABI when you can run the real thing ;) |
| 13:16.56 | jelly | stevendale, interoperation of Debian with other systems is on topic. Keep your comments in here to constructive tech support if possible. |
| 13:17.34 | jelly | stevendale, if user asks how to sync up files on debian, mac and windows, "don't use windows" is not helpful |
| 13:17.47 | stevendale | Never used to be this strict |
| 13:17.57 | stevendale | Did you make this an official channel or something? |
| 13:18.02 | jelly | you get one warning. |
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| 13:18.06 | jelly | !offtopic |
| 13:18.06 | dpkg | #debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day. |
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| 13:54.33 | hoshineko | hello, I'm trying to use qemu on debian (testing) but for some reason apt install qemu only results in one package (qemu) being installed and more importantly I don't have any of the qemu binaries |
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| 13:57.24 | Fox | !debian-next |
| 13:57.24 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 13:57.29 | slax0r | have you read this: https://packages.debian.org/sid/qemu ? |
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| 13:57.37 | slax0r | hoshineko: ^ |
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| 13:58.00 | hoshineko | oh i see |
| 13:58.03 | hoshineko | thank you |
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| 14:04.53 | thescientist | hi. I'm having trouble installing cherrytree (it is a notetaking app). I'm getting an error message saying "Dependency is not satisfiable: python-appindicator". Can anyone help me with this? Thanks. |
| 14:05.06 | jelly | !bat |
| 14:05.06 | dpkg | In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use http://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>. |
| 14:05.10 | jelly | thescientist, ^^ |
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| 14:06.15 | petn-randall | eyeoh, jelly, I just talked to hmh (the maintainer for intel-microcode). You can compare /proc/cpuinfo and the output of `iucode_tool -Sl -tr /boot/<initrd>`. If both revision are the same, *and* you don't have a line like "microcode: microcode updated early to revision XXX", then you BIOS microcode is up-to-date and the kernel won't update it. |
| 14:08.06 | thnee | Is there some tool similar to FreeBSD's sysrc for setting environment variables in /etc/environment? |
| 14:08.23 | greycat | use a text editor |
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| 14:08.47 | thnee | I mean a tool that can either set it or update it regardless of if it is already there, and that doesnt write it multiple times |
| 14:08.57 | thnee | greycat: how old school |
| 14:08.59 | thescientist | @jelly, if I use gdebi the output is this http://paste.debian.net/1037282/ |
| 14:09.08 | greycat | Probably not. Mostly because /etc/environment is utter shit and useless 99% of the time. |
| 14:09.24 | greycat | You can't even put MAIL=$HOME/Maildir/ in it. |
| 14:09.31 | thnee | we actually define an environment variable called ENVIRONMENT in /etc/environment :D |
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| 14:13.29 | jelly | thescientist, okay, but where's the command line used, and outputs of points 2. and 3. |
| 14:14.28 | jelly | thescientist, put everything in a single paste entry if possible |
| 14:14.40 | eyeoh | petn-randall: ah, neat. |
| 14:14.55 | thescientist | @jelly, this is the gdebi output. which I usually use to install software that is not available from synaptic |
| 14:15.11 | greycat | *sputter* |
| 14:15.27 | jelly | thescientist, what is the exact, complete gdebi command line you used? |
| 14:15.34 | greycat | "I import random third-party .deb files so often that I consider it completely normal and I am surprised that the rest of you don't" |
| 14:16.14 | jelly | why does this gdebi thing run lintian? I guess it tries to impost some sanity |
| 14:16.19 | jelly | impose* |
| 14:16.21 | Brigo | greycat, who said that? |
| 14:16.37 | greycat | Brigo: it's implied by what thescientist wrote |
| 14:16.58 | Brigo | jelly, weird, gdebi is dpkg with some dependencies management. |
| 14:17.13 | thescientist | @jelly, just gdebi cherrytree_0.38.5-0_all.deb |
| 14:17.18 | jelly | Brigo, lintian is NOT dependencies management |
| 14:17.40 | jelly | thescientist, and where did you get cherrytree_0.38.5-0_all.deb from? And which Debian release is this? |
| 14:18.13 | Brigo | jelly, that's why the weird was there :). Any way i've checked the package description and it does run lintian. |
| 14:18.22 | greycat | jelly: see his comment at xx:14, "gdebi ... which I usually use to install software that is not available from [Debian]" |
| 14:18.26 | thescientist | @greycat, no, not at all, but thanks. I would be glad if you would care to explain to me why using it is a bad practice. |
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| 14:18.35 | greycat | !frankendebian |
| 14:18.35 | dpkg | When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall> |
| 14:18.35 | jelly | thescientist, (note that I would not have to ask so many questions if you provided the info) |
| 14:18.55 | jelly | ,v cherrytree |
| 14:18.56 | judd | Package: cherrytree on amd64 -- wheezy: 0.25.4-1; jessie: 0.35.2-1; stretch: 0.37.6-1; sid: 0.37.6-1.1 |
| 14:18.58 | thescientist | @jelly from the developers webpage |
| 14:19.19 | jelly | thescientist, does that webpage debian 9 is supported? |
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| 14:19.53 | thescientist | @jelly, it doesn't specify |
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| 14:20.28 | jelly | thescientist, which debian release are you using? There seems to be a 0.37.6-1 in Debian 9 |
| 14:20.43 | thescientist | @jelly, just states "debian/ubuntu package". I am usign buster. |
| 14:21.11 | jelly | thescientist, it does not seem to be a package built with debian in mind. |
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| 14:22.11 | jelly | thescientist, you will have to ask the developer to fix those issues if you want to install using gdebi, or use a lower level tool like dpkg to install it, or don't install that version at all and try using the one from stretch or sid instead. |
| 14:22.35 | jelly | dpkg, tell thescientist about debian-next |
| 14:22.39 | jelly | dpkg, tell thescientist about tum |
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| 14:23.33 | jelly | or tell gdebi not to run lintian, I guess |
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| 14:24.04 | greycat | Isn't "apt" supposed to replace this functionality of gdebi for auto-frankendebianing a system? |
| 14:24.29 | jelly | I now have a newfound respect for gdebi. |
| 14:24.58 | thescientist | @jelly, I assumed the latest version would be the best one to use. I'll see if the previous version works or check what you suggested. |
| 14:25.18 | jelly | !why is cherrytree not in testing |
| 14:25.18 | dpkg | cherrytree is not in testing for the reasons listed in https://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=cherrytree |
| 14:25.39 | thescientist | @jelly, I would like to understand if using gdebi is a bad thing as suggested by the other user. Thanks. |
| 14:25.40 | jelly | thescientist, the latest would be nice IF it was built for actual Debian |
| 14:26.13 | greycat | It's not that gdebi is inherently bad. It's that you are installing Ubuntu packages. |
| 14:26.15 | jelly | thescientist, gdebi is doing the right thing by stopping you from installing a package with minor issues |
| 14:26.42 | jelly | thescientist, so in that respect, it's better than a tool that would happily let you install such a .deb |
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| 14:28.44 | thescientist | @greycat, I have seen this "debian/ubuntu" before. I know the systems are different but thought that when this was stated there would be compatibility. Sorry if I am new to this and don't know everything yet. |
| 14:28.57 | thescientist | @greycat, That is why I am asking. |
| 14:29.55 | greycat | Basically, if it does not say "Built for Debian version ____" then you are taking your chances with something that is potentially incompatible with your system. |
| 14:30.08 | greycat | If it says "Ubuntu" ANYWHERE on the page, just run. Run far away. |
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| 14:32.15 | thescientist | @greycat, Ok, thanks. That is good to know. |
| 14:32.38 | thescientist | @jelly, Thanks for the explanation. |
| 14:32.41 | petn-randall | thescientist: This isn't twitter, you don't need an @ infront of names. It means something different on IRC. |
| 14:32.44 | jelly | well, if it says just "Ubuntu" on its own, you know it's not for your system. If it says "debian/ubuntu" that's a red flag. If it lists releases of debian and ubuntu it works on, that's better. |
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| 14:33.29 | jelly | more often that not, the author writing "debian/ubuntu" is confused about how different the releases of these OSes are |
| 14:33.48 | thescientist | petn-randall, sorry. forgot about that. |
| 14:33.57 | petn-randall | no worries :) |
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| 14:36.50 | greycat | Yes, OK, if it actually says "Here are package for Debian 9... Here are packages for Ubuntu 16.04..." then that would be OK. |
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| 14:37.39 | jhutchins_wk | I have seen packages that were offered as for Ubuntu or Debian and that actually checked to see which they were installing on. |
| 14:38.38 | jhutchins_wk | jelly: I would agree that if they specify releases it's a sign of more thorough preparation. |
| 14:38.40 | greycat | that's not reassuring to me |
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| 14:52.58 | thescientist | jelly, greycat, jhutchins_wk, thanks for the help and explanations. In this case I instead use a different program that is available from synaptic. Thanks. |
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| 15:33.37 | mefistofeles | hey |
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| 15:38.57 | klys | hi |
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| 16:31.24 | rajjan | hey guys |
| 16:31.34 | rajjan | anybody here to rescue my day ? |
| 16:31.49 | rajjan | i used the command apt-get remove perl |
| 16:32.20 | rajjan | and suddenly everything was messed up |
| 16:32.33 | rajjan | mainly no mysql command(mysql service is running) |
| 16:32.43 | rajjan | and apache2 service not running |
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| 16:35.30 | altker128 | rajjan: , apt-get install perl ? |
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| 16:37.11 | rajjan | already tried that |
| 16:37.22 | rajjan | so many packages were removed for no reason |
| 16:37.34 | rajjan | i had to reinstall my kde as well |
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| 16:38.55 | petn-randall | rajjan: You can check in /var/log/apt/history.log which packages got removed. For the future, actually check why gets removed, those must have been 100+ packages that scrolled past you on the CLI. |
| 16:39.03 | petn-randall | s/why/what/ |
| 16:39.32 | Bustin | new linux / debian user here. I am using xfce, but have used this https://github.com/jmaris/xfce4-panel-sanetrayspacing/releases (on arch), is there a way to compile this to a .deb package ? If so any help would be appreciated. |
| 16:39.56 | rajjan | yep exactly |
| 16:40.08 | rajjan | i'm not gonna use the apt-get remove anymore |
| 16:40.15 | rajjan | cost me a lot of worthy hours |
| 16:40.32 | petn-randall | It's close to 1,000 packages that would get removed on my system. |
| 16:40.49 | phogg | Bustin: get the source package for the panel, manually apply the patch, and then rebuild the package. |
| 16:41.00 | petn-randall | rajjan: Nothing wrong with using it, but you *must* read what it's actually telling you before confirming actions. |
| 16:41.00 | cfoch | Hello |
| 16:41.18 | cfoch | Has someone Here tried Xen on Debian? |
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| 16:44.30 | Bustin | phogg: easier said than done! I have downloaded the latest master for xfce4-panel, but am lost as how to recompile / rebuild the package, and then install it in replace of my current. |
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| 16:45.12 | phogg | Bustin: something along these lines: apt-get build-dep xfce4-panel ; apt-get install build-essential dpkg-dev ; apt-get source xfce4-panel ; cd xfce4-panel-* ; apply the patch ; dpkg-buildpackage |
| 16:45.29 | petn-randall | cfoch: Probably many people, best to ask your question. |
| 16:45.33 | phogg | Your mileage may vary, some steps possibly omitted. |
| 16:47.49 | cfoch | Why is disk LVG virtualized as /dev/xvda un HVM when I have specified sda in the config file |
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| 16:48.44 | phogg | Bustin: if you're not aware the "apply the patch" step is this line from your PKGBUID: patch plugins/systray/systray-box.c ../../spacing.patch # you may need to adjust the path to the spacing.patch file. |
| 16:49.36 | phogg | or just edit the file manually since this is a trivial one line change |
| 16:49.39 | cfoch | The DomU (the guest VM ) sees my disk as xvda, but the problem is that the distro I want to install seems to look for /Dev/sda |
| 16:50.08 | cfoch | And it Tells me it doesn't find my disk |
| 16:51.04 | Bustin | phogg: thank you for the information. I am currently running xfce, but in order to make the "one line change", I still have to take those steps (download the source of the xfce panel, make the change, recompile etc)? I can't edit my current config, without having to do those steps? |
| 16:51.46 | phogg | Bustin: it's not config, it's a constant in C. They didn't make it configurable. |
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| 16:52.11 | cfoch | I talk boutique Xen btw ^ |
| 16:52.15 | phogg | Bustin: you could instead change the panel to read the value from a config file, but that would require knowing how to do that. |
| 16:52.18 | cfoch | About* |
| 16:52.35 | cfoch | I talk about Xen |
| 16:52.37 | phogg | Bustin: if you do please submit patches back to the project |
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| 16:52.47 | Bustin | phogg: I would rather that, then I can manually adjust the spacing, and not have to recompile with a hit or miss guess each change :( |
| 16:52.51 | Bustin | do'h. |
| 16:53.05 | phogg | Bustin: Yeah, that would make a lot more sense. |
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| 16:57.06 | Bustin | phogg: that spacing "fix" would fix a lot of peoples annoyances with the panel. It's been an "issue" for quite a while, I wonder why the xfce team hasn't proposed a fix still. |
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| 16:58.05 | phogg | Bustin: they're waiting for a user like you to supply a patch |
| 16:58.27 | phogg | If enough people want it one of them will known enough C to add the feature. |
| 16:59.43 | Bustin | I guess, I'm not the one with enough C knowledge, lol. Dangit, I love xfce, but that spacing drives me bonkers. |
| 16:59.56 | Bustin | <-- ocd |
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| 17:02.44 | phogg | Bustin: there are websites where you can specify a feature request and set up a bounty for satisfying it. Crowd fund that change. |
| 17:03.20 | eyeoh | rajjan: I've made a similar mistake like that before but yeah, there's a debian wiki warning about removing without checking; which I wish I would have read back then for another system |
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| 17:04.36 | eyeoh | rajjan: there's probably an elegant fix but what I ended up doing was just clean installing again to be sure :\ (it was fedora in my case, a few days after first trying it) |
| 17:06.11 | eyeoh | rajjan: https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian#Don.27t_blindly_remove_software (sorry, you already know this now but maybe the rest of that page might be useful too; just in case) |
| 17:06.41 | eyeoh | don't know if others have a better fix for you than just reinstalling |
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| 17:08.13 | eyeoh | rajjan: ah I see history.log was mentioned by petn-randall |
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| 17:09.24 | eyeoh | I think I saw the list but freaked out and didn't want to go through the trouble of installing each package again |
| 17:09.28 | annadane | wonders if "don't blindly remove software" also considers "apt purge foo && apt autoremove --purge", which i'm in the habit of doing for every removal |
| 17:09.37 | annadane | which i assume is mostly fine |
| 17:09.38 | eyeoh | :\ |
| 17:10.01 | eyeoh | (I don't really know) |
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| 17:11.29 | annadane | (also, why does it still leave dot files in $HOME?) |
| 17:12.38 | greycat | because ransacking the entire system for user home directories and fucking with them would be rude |
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| 17:13.30 | p0lyph3m | *DON'T* apt remove libc6 |
| 17:13.56 | phogg | s0lar1s: sage advice |
| 17:14.04 | greycat | were you planning to? |
| 17:14.19 | phogg | you should also not chmod a-x `which chmod`, even though it's easier to fix. |
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| 17:14.55 | annadane | but the internet told me to, and besides, it works on kali |
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| 17:15.48 | phogg | does anything work on kali? |
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| 18:19.29 | jhutchins_wk | irc does. They come here. |
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| 18:26.57 | randymarsh9 | hello |
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| 18:27.24 | randymarsh9 | when i run ./configure that means i'm installing a program from source correct? |
| 18:29.10 | jhutchins_wk | Not necessarily. You're running a configuration script. Could be for anything. |
| 18:29.43 | randymarsh9 | jhutchins_wk: if i'm running it for this https://github.com/maxmind/libmaxminddb |
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| 18:29.52 | randymarsh9 | then it's for a program right |
| 18:30.35 | randymarsh9 | it seems like most of those start of with ./configure |
| 18:31.14 | randymarsh9 | if i'm installing from a tarball i mean? |
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| 18:35.01 | greycat | Typically a program named ./configure is used to prepare a source directory or a build directory for a "make" command to be run. |
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| 18:36.27 | randymarsh9 | ok so it just prepares the directory |
| 18:37.29 | greycat | Well, it does whatever the ./configure script says to do, but that's what it *usually* does. |
| 18:37.49 | randymarsh9 | i see |
| 18:38.27 | fpat | randymarsh9: watch out for files like README and INSTALL |
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| 18:38.33 | randymarsh9 | when i install a program (whether a binary or from source) do they both get placed into the same final directory? |
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| 18:39.17 | greycat | That depends on the installation process. Every one is unique. |
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| 18:39.42 | randymarsh9 | fpat: thanks, most of the readme's i've come across are very sparse and assume i already know what i'm doing |
| 18:39.57 | fpat | you cant judge one file by another |
| 18:40.14 | greycat | The *usual* result is that programs are installed in /usr/local/bin/ but any given program can do whatever the developer made it do. |
| 18:40.17 | keith4 | Can I PXE boot the buster installer and use that to install stetch? Need a newer kernel for new hardware |
| 18:40.22 | randymarsh9 | i'm just trying to establish a baseline where i kinda know what's going on here lmao |
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| 18:40.34 | fpat | i see |
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| 18:43.01 | fpat | a good baseline brain food example can be: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Software-Building-HOWTO.html |
| 18:43.44 | fpat | and this: http://moi.vonos.net/linux/beginners-installing-from-source/ |
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| 18:43.55 | randymarsh9 | fpat: i'll check those out thanks |
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| 18:46.17 | randymarsh9 | "Sometimes the archived file must be untarred and installed from the user's home directory, or perhaps in a certain other directory" |
| 18:46.33 | randymarsh9 | if the program doesn't specify then i can install it from anywhere right? |
| 18:46.46 | randymarsh9 | including /tmp/ ? |
| 18:46.46 | greycat | Every program is different. |
| 18:47.06 | randymarsh9 | fudgeeeeee |
| 18:47.09 | greycat | Where you untar and build *usually* does not matter, but for specific cases, you must read the developer's docs. |
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| 18:51.10 | rajjan | Hello guys, and thank you for everybody that tried to help took me a couple of hours |
| 18:51.28 | rajjan | i had to reinstall all missing packages and was careful with what i was replacing |
| 18:51.34 | rajjan | now everything is back to normal |
| 18:51.59 | fpat | rajjan: congrats |
| 18:53.31 | rajjan | i'm going on a job interview on monday and they asked me i was gonna have to pass a test with perl regex |
| 18:53.45 | greycat | good luck |
| 18:53.49 | rajjan | what would you think an advertisement company would required most in perl regex |
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| 18:56.49 | ksk | one that turns everything into advertisements. maybe try #debian-offctopic, as its not really related ;) |
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| 19:14.30 | karlpinc | Any idea how to use network manager to setup and run a pptp tunnel on a box without network manager? I've installed network manager and the network-manager-gnome-pptp. When I try to start from nmcli I get ""Error: Connection activation failed: Could not find a source connection." According to "https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/438224/networkmanager-fails-with-could-not-find-source-connection" network manager has to "own the |
| 19:14.30 | karlpinc | default route", whatever that means. I've poked it with a stick setting "managed=true" in the [ifupdown] section of /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf. That (IIRC) earns me a LCP error in the logs. Anyhow, I'm looking for a miracle answer here as to an easy way to get a pptp connection working. |
| 19:14.48 | karlpinc | (Don't ask mem about pptp. The basic plan is to use pptp to connect so I can fix ssh.) |
| 19:16.14 | karlpinc | I'm using network manager because that's what's "supposed to work". There's about a billion pptp and pppd config options. I'm hoping that this gets me something that works without me having to think about it. (I thought I was done with pppd. *sigh*) |
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| 19:30.26 | eyeoh | randymarsh9: I believe . or ./ means "current directory". (And .. is parent directory) |
| 19:31.06 | eyeoh | randymarsh9: so ls . means list files in current directory (but ls does that by default too), and ./ means run file in current dir |
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| 19:32.38 | eyeoh | so if you type "configure" on its own, the system will think you're trying to run a program called configure but not look in the directory you're in (because that's usually not in the $PATH) |
| 19:33.21 | eyeoh | configure is merely a script to configure stuff in preparation for building (linking and compiling right?) |
| 19:33.38 | greycat | The exact build steps will depend on the language(s) used in the project. |
| 19:34.16 | eyeoh | yeah although the most common scenaraio randymarsh9's wondering about I'm guessing is ./configure, make and make install? |
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| 19:34.28 | eyeoh | took me a while to understand what I just attempted to explain |
| 19:34.28 | greycat | yes, that's the usual case |
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| 19:35.41 | eyeoh | randymarsh9: I think there's a guide somewhere that branches off the Linux From Scratch (LFS) guide, that goes into depth on compiling software - if you really wanted to delve deep there |
| 19:35.56 | eyeoh | oh, fpat linked it |
| 19:36.43 | randymarsh9 | eyeoh: yea i was able to get it compiled, thanks |
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| 19:37.09 | randymarsh9 | greycat: you were right i just followed the steps in the developers docs lmao |
| 19:37.31 | eyeoh | randymarsh9: by the way just so you know, sudo make install isn't always required - depending on the package, you might be able to ./configure --prefix a location to install it to that doesn't require elevated privileges |
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| 19:38.26 | eyeoh | I think I accidentally a word somewhere there but you probably get what I mean |
| 19:38.44 | jhutchins_wk | Actually, source code is supposed to come with a README and/or INSTALL file that tells you excactly what steps are repsected to build and install the software. |
| 19:38.51 | eyeoh | to install it to, that doesn't require etc* |
| 19:39.18 | eyeoh | ah yeah that too; although sometimes they are a little sparse with mentioning how you need to fetch required dependencies |
| 19:39.34 | eyeoh | i.e., -dev packages with debian (and -devel for centos) |
| 19:40.03 | jhutchins_wk | randymarsh9: You might want to consider making a deb package and installing that rather than installing directly from the makefile. |
| 19:40.05 | greycat | or libperl* etc. |
| 19:40.30 | eyeoh | hah yes |
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| 19:40.36 | greycat | jhutchins_wk: oh, yes, because he needs his life to be suddenly 30 times harder |
| 19:41.02 | jhutchins_wk | Well, he's here to learn, isn't he? What better way than to suffer? |
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| 19:43.31 | eyeoh | haha this is debian, not _________ distro :p But to be serious, https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian#A.27make_install.27_can_conflict_with_packages probably should be kept in mind for some things at least |
| 19:44.25 | greycat | "make -n install" will often tell you where a thing *will* be installed when you drop the -n, but sometimes there's so much output from make -n install that you can't figure anything out |
| 19:44.47 | greycat | especially with the fancier automake-generated Makefiles |
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| 19:52.13 | eyeoh | oh yeah; -n for dry-run; works for many things. |
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| 19:52.52 | eyeoh | Probably something I should always remember to try more; it hardly takes any more time (and can sometimes save a lot of it) |
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| 20:05.35 | deadrom | hi |
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| 20:07.24 | deadrom | deb8 gives me all the SMART data from a usb3 hdd I want with nothing more than "-d sat". 3.x kernel, smarttools 6.4. Ubuntu with latest smarttools 6.7 from src and kernel 4.x I can tell what I want, -d sat, -T permissive, it just shrugs. what is it debian can do Ubuntu can't here? |
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| 20:10.31 | Stochastix_ | On debian 9.5, is the networking primarily being controlled by systemd? Im trying to figure out why I I am getting a blank /etc/resolv.conf |
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| 20:11.05 | greycat | No, systemd is not in charge of interfaces on Debian unless you make it do so. |
| 20:11.26 | greycat | What *is* in charge depends on how and what you installed. It could be either Network Manager, or /etc/network/interfaces |
| 20:11.26 | Stochastix_ | so dhclient is what runs on boot? |
| 20:12.17 | Stochastix_ | I have two setups that are basically identical but on differnet networks, one is getting dns information, but the other is not. |
| 20:12.54 | Stochastix_ | It is probably an issue with the dhcp server, but I was just trying to figure out what files I should be looking at on each system to compare for differences. |
| 20:13.01 | greycat | You can use ps to see if dhclient is running, but the important thing is to figure out whether it's NM or /e/n/i. |
| 20:14.29 | jhutchins_wk | Stochastix_: dhclient will either be run by the network start scripts or by Network Manager, depeneing on how you've configured the system. |
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| 20:15.00 | Stochastix_ | so, my systemd services like network-online.target and networking.service are enabled and active |
| 20:15.24 | Stochastix_ | Which is why I was asking if systemd was mostly managing it at this point. |
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| 20:15.35 | greycat | Only if you (or whoever has root) told it to. |
| 20:16.40 | greycat | Figure out the interface's name (probably from ip addr). See if that interface is defined in /e/n/i or not. See if /etc/resolv.conf is a real file or a symlink. See if it has Network Manager in a comment inside it. |
| 20:16.49 | Stochastix_ | I dont recall having to enable those services |
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| 20:17.01 | Stochastix_ | k, let me look |
| 20:18.27 | Stochastix_ | on one system(call it sysA) I have iface eno1 inet dhcp in the interfaces file |
| 20:18.57 | Stochastix_ | Same thing on SysB |
| 20:19.05 | deadrom | figured: uas is the culprit. |
| 20:20.00 | Stochastix_ | In this case, who is responsible for writing the /etc/resolv.conf file? |
| 20:20.11 | Stochastix_ | It is actually blank |
| 20:20.11 | greycat | dhclient |
| 20:20.16 | Stochastix_ | no writing at all in it |
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| 20:20.44 | Stochastix_ | Ok, I see there are no comments in the other one either |
| 20:20.56 | Stochastix_ | So blank just might mean there was nothing to put in there |
| 20:21.04 | greycat | Is it a regular file, or a symlink? |
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| 20:21.08 | Stochastix_ | Not that it got destroyed or anything. |
| 20:21.35 | Stochastix_ | regular file on sysA |
| 20:21.48 | Stochastix_ | same on sysB |
| 20:22.06 | greycat | Then for whatever reason, dhclient is not putting nameservers and search domains into it. |
| 20:23.00 | Stochastix_ | Perhaps it is not receiving any from the dhcp server. |
| 20:23.14 | Stochastix_ | resolution was working yesterday and earlier today. |
| 20:23.44 | Stochastix_ | Ill work it out, Just wanted to get a handle on what was handling networking in debian. |
| 20:23.49 | Stochastix_ | Thanks for the help. |
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| 20:43.44 | jhutchins_wk | Stochastix_: Your interface might have a different name. |
| 20:45.25 | greycat | I did say to find out the interface's name using ip addr. If he didn't listen.... |
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| 20:49.44 | Stochastix_ | So, when I run dhclient get: RTNETLINK answers: File exists |
| 20:49.52 | Stochastix_ | sh: echo: I/O error |
| 20:50.09 | greycat | What is your interface's name, from "ip addr"? |
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| 20:50.29 | Stochastix_ | eno1 |
| 20:50.53 | greycat | Does "ps auxw | grep dhclient" show a long dhclient command ending with " eno1" ? |
| 20:51.03 | Stochastix_ | Im getting an ip, and ip route looks normal |
| 20:51.21 | Stochastix_ | no, it does not on the troubled system |
| 20:51.35 | greycat | What DOES it show? |
| 20:51.38 | Stochastix_ | on the one that is working, it does have a long dhclient ending in eno1 |
| 20:52.00 | RoyK | "ip link list" will show them all |
| 20:52.11 | RoyK | "ip addr list" will show their addresses as well |
| 20:52.33 | Stochastix_ | Ok. I do have one now, |
| 20:52.44 | Stochastix_ | I didnt before, it was not running the last time I checked |
| 20:53.46 | greycat | If it's dying and being respawned on a regular basis, that could indicate something... but I have no idea what. |
| 20:54.24 | Stochastix_ | root 2976 0.0 0.0 20472 1100 ? Ss 16:53 0:00 /sbin/dhclient -4 -v -pf /run/dhclient.eno1.pid -lf /var/lib/dhcp/dhclient.eno1.leases -I -df /var/lib/dhcp/dhclient6.eno1.leases eno1 |
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| 20:54.58 | Stochastix_ | I had a couple, killed them all, did ifdown eno1, then ifup eno1, and it is running and that is the output of ps |
| 20:55.02 | RoyK | thought debian was using dhcpcd, not dhclient |
| 20:55.08 | greycat | looks normal except for the start time being so recent |
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| 20:58.16 | Stochastix_ | I put some supersede comments in /etc/dhcp/dhclient.conf for domain-name seach and name server |
| 20:58.40 | Stochastix_ | doe they have to be wrapped in a lease{} ? |
| 20:58.49 | maxrazer | Does apt replace gdebi? |
| 21:00.10 | maxrazer | I've installed local .deb packages using apt before, but never gdebi |
| 21:00.23 | maxrazer | And I mean apt, not apt-get |
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| 21:03.26 | greycat | maxrazer: I've heard it mentioned a few times but I've never actually tried it |
| 21:03.38 | maxrazer | greycat, Which one? |
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| 21:03.46 | greycat | using apt to install a .deb file |
| 21:04.13 | Stochastix_ | Ok guys, I figured out how I borked it |
| 21:04.31 | Stochastix_ | Remember the sh: echo: I/O error ? |
| 21:04.48 | Stochastix_ | One of my mounts disappeared and I filled up my / |
| 21:04.52 | Stochastix_ | 100% filled |
| 21:04.55 | Stochastix_ | lol |
| 21:04.56 | greycat | ouch |
| 21:05.08 | Stochastix_ | dhclient could not write resole.conf haha |
| 21:05.21 | Stochastix_ | but the system booted normally lol |
| 21:05.47 | Stochastix_ | cleaned it out and my supercede worked |
| 21:05.54 | maxrazer | If apt just calls various apt tools and gdebi is not part of those tools then that sounds like apt will not resolve missing dependancies for local .deb files, unless that was added as part of another tool when apt command was created. |
| 21:06.05 | Stochastix_ | going to put it back to normal and see if it works right |
| 21:06.24 | maxrazer | maybe gdebi should be added to apt. |
| 21:06.24 | greycat | When I started out as a junior sys admin back in the 1990s, I got into the habit of just continually typing things like "df" and "uptime" whenever I was idling on a system. |
| 21:06.47 | Stochastix_ | greycat, hehe, thats how I found it, df -h |
| 21:08.14 | Stochastix_ | I started to wonder what was going on when I was able to cat /etc/dhcp/dhclient.conf, but I was not able to open it in an editor anymore |
| 21:09.06 | Stochastix_ | hmm. well, actually, I still cant edit it lol |
| 21:09.29 | Stochastix_ | Error reading lock file /etc/dhcp/.dhclient.conf.swp: Not enough data read |
| 21:09.55 | greycat | remove the .swp file if you're confident no vim processes exist that have it opened |
| 21:09.57 | Stochastix_ | k all better |
| 21:10.11 | Stochastix_ | yeap, just removed it |
| 21:10.28 | Stochastix_ | Yea, I rebooted twcie already |
| 21:12.03 | Stochastix_ | k, we are back to normal, assuming other stuff isnt all jacked up from running out of mem :) |
| 21:12.13 | Stochastix_ | seems ok so far |
| 21:12.25 | Stochastix_ | Thanks for watching the show lol |
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| 21:23.08 | eyeoh | nice work |
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| 23:04.44 | ntd | what's debians stance on what ub did with bionic and netplan? |
| 23:07.56 | ntd | is it like this is gonna get showed down out throats with -next or is this just canonical fucking around like they did with upstart? |
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