| 00:01.00 | armin | ohai, i noticed that imapsync is available in freebsd pkg, but not in debian apt. on the other hand, imapcopy is available in debian apt, but not in freebsd pkg. any insight? |
| 00:01.14 | armin | *shamelessly crossposting from #freebsd* |
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| 00:01.52 | Kadigan | Funny. I was making imapsync work on Debian today. |
| 00:02.33 | armin | Kadigan: mind to share some elaboration? |
| 00:02.49 | akko | karlpinc: reinstalled debian with XFCE and everything's working now :) |
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| 00:03.01 | akko | although this laptop really (I mean REALLY) sucks |
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| 00:03.15 | Kadigan | armin: first I followed this guide: https://gist.github.com/facelordgists/8660827 <-- but I got hung up on "sh examples/install_modules_linux.sh" -- no such file/directory. |
| 00:03.17 | akko | it lags on i3wm |
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| 00:03.47 | Kadigan | armin: then I followed up w/ this guide: https://tecadmin.net/use-imapsync-on-ubuntu/ and it worked. |
| 00:03.58 | armin | Kadigan: ah, so you also experienced that imapsync wasn't available on the apt repositories of your used debian flavor and decided to try to build it by hand on the system where you need it? |
| 00:04.30 | armin | Kadigan: interesting. thanks for sharing that info. |
| 00:04.30 | Kadigan | Essentially, yes. It seems imapsync -used- to be in the repo, but it's no longer there for whatever reason. |
| 00:04.42 | karlpinc | akko: Well, you don't _need_ to run a DM. I always keep one for a browser though. |
| 00:04.48 | armin | Kadigan: i noticed there's "imapcopy" now, did you notice it? |
| 00:05.33 | armin | akko: did you try if adding a compositor decreases a bit of the lag maybe? |
| 00:05.37 | Kadigan | To be honest, I did not. I googled for a tool to do IMAP syncing, found imapsync and decided not to look further until I've given it a fair try. That try did end up succeeding, so I looked no further. |
| 00:05.46 | karlpinc | Kadigan: Where does "make install" install it? |
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| 00:05.55 | armin | karlpinc: fair enough. ;) |
| 00:06.11 | armin | imapcopy/unstable,unstable 1.04-2.1+b1 amd64 |
| 00:06.12 | armin | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:06.21 | Kadigan | Ah, I had that issue too. I don't remember - I did a quick `find /usr -iname "imapcopy"` and it found it, I believe. |
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| 00:06.28 | armin | karlpinc: pretty much looks like that would get the job done, too, but i also didn't test it, yete. |
| 00:06.44 | Kadigan | Sorry, "imapsync" |
| 00:06.49 | Kadigan | is confused at this hour :/ |
| 00:07.30 | armin | no _I_ was confused by the two nicknames starting with ka which i, lazy as i am, just nickcompleted and didn't focus further. |
| 00:07.35 | armin | my apologies for the confusion. |
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| 00:09.02 | karlpinc | Kadigan: Is imapsync installed in /usr/local/? If not you'll have no end of headaches. |
| 00:10.11 | karlpinc | armin: There is also fetchmail and mailsync offlineimap and others in stretch. Hard to say what's good becase I don't know what you want to do. |
| 00:10.12 | Kadigan | Do elaborate? (I don't have ready access to that machine, so I can't currently tell you) |
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| 00:11.36 | karlpinc | Kadigan: https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian#A.27make_install.27_can_conflict_with_packages |
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| 00:12.22 | Kadigan | Oh, that. |
| 00:12.24 | karlpinc | Kadigan: There are tools that help with installation of non-debian software. (Type "/msg dpkg stow" in irc and get info on one of them.) |
| 00:12.53 | Kadigan | Well, I intend to use this tool about once, and then forget it exists. It doesn't spawn any daemons, so I'm fairly confident it won't be a security risk in the long run. |
| 00:13.06 | akko | armin: I think it will probably have the opposite effect |
| 00:13.09 | akko | but i'll try |
| 00:13.29 | karlpinc | Kadigan: Also, upgrading non-debian software after upgrading major debian releases becomes really problematic unless you're careful. |
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| 00:13.54 | Kadigan | Thank you for the heads-up. I'll keep it in mind. |
| 00:14.42 | Kadigan | Everything else except for cacti-spine is currently added from a repo, and I doubt I'll be updating cacti-spine anytime soon... We'll see. |
| 00:14.49 | karlpinc | Kadigan: If I want to use something once I don't even bother with /usr/local/. I make a ~/local/ and install into there. (Then often delete ~/local/.) |
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| 01:26.38 | RoyK | but then - it seems apple tends to move towards making macos more like ios with closing everything, so I guess my next laptop will be running linux only |
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| 01:28.14 | outoftime | annadane: I have installed gnome, lightdm service is active, gdm - inactive. I can see only xfce on Ctrl+Alt+F7, I haven't rebooted machine. Using Ctrl+Alt+F1 to stay connected to this channel. |
| 01:28.28 | RoyK | I wonder how it'd be if all primary schools would have access to 3d printers - I guess the kids would learn a bit |
| 01:28.47 | outoftime | annadane: looks like I have to stop lighdm and start gdm |
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| 01:29.33 | RoyK | outoftime: iirc that's controllable with dpkg-reconfigure something |
| 01:30.06 | annadane | update-alternatives |
| 01:30.33 | annadane | but yeah restart your window manager |
| 01:30.39 | RoyK | annadane: oh - it's there as well? |
| 01:30.56 | annadane | i don't know about whether you can just stay connected or not, my technical sophistication isn't at that level |
| 01:31.40 | annadane | ah no sorry you're on virtual terminal |
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| 01:31.46 | RoyK | start your irc session in a tmux on another server¨ |
| 01:31.48 | annadane | you'll be able to |
| 01:32.05 | RoyK | then log back in when you're done |
| 01:32.10 | outoftime | RoyK: I'm using screen |
| 01:32.18 | RoyK | has a separate vm for irc clients |
| 01:32.24 | annadane | RoyK, is employing very subtle tmux propaganda |
| 01:32.27 | annadane | oops |
| 01:32.27 | RoyK | outoftime: nice nick |
| 01:32.31 | annadane | dumb , with autocomplete |
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| 01:34.19 | RoyK | I found virsh autocomplete for bash today - nice |
| 01:34.40 | RoyK | autocomplete saves your day |
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| 01:40.47 | SerajewelKS | are there any encrypted file-based filesystems that can be mounted by regular users (e.g. encfs) but that are known to be secure, and perform well with extremely large (~100GB) files that have parts changed frequently? |
| 01:42.30 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: ecryøt |
| 01:42.48 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: sorry - ecryptfs is known to be stable and good |
| 01:44.00 | RoyK | but then, if things change a lot, there'll be a lot of encryption and decryption going on, so you should have a cpu with AES support |
| 01:44.56 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: but then, if you want to secure the system, keep in mind that a mounted filesystem, encrypted or not, is available if someone gets in |
| 01:45.24 | outoftime | RoyK: why is that? |
| 01:45.41 | RoyK | outoftime: what? |
| 01:46.29 | michael2 | outoftime: because practically any process - which can run under your account could access that file system. |
| 01:47.09 | RoyK | or - if it's mounted, root can access it |
| 01:47.22 | michael2 | RoyK: so whats the solution to secure a mounted encrypted filesystem? |
| 01:47.38 | RoyK | nada |
| 01:47.45 | RoyK | secure your machine |
| 01:47.53 | RoyK | don't let people in |
| 01:48.51 | RoyK | an encrypted filesystem is secure so long it's not mounted |
| 01:49.42 | RoyK | read up on firewalling, different security systems like selinux etc |
| 01:50.05 | RoyK | selinux is a real PITA, but it's quite secure |
| 01:50.38 | mutante | there is also tomoyo which does similar things to selinux but is a bit easier to setup |
| 01:50.47 | mutante | the kernel has 4 different "MACs" |
| 01:50.59 | michael2 | what do you think about owncloud/nextcloud? |
| 01:51.02 | RoyK | there are several selinux-like things |
| 01:51.09 | RoyK | uses nextcloud |
| 01:51.19 | RoyK | works well |
| 01:51.46 | michael2 | do you use debian packaged version? |
| 01:51.50 | mutante | i meant to try out owncloud but never got to it. what is the difference between the 2? |
| 01:52.02 | RoyK | that is - as for the present, it doesn't, because my server crashed and I haven't set it up yet |
| 01:52.29 | RoyK | michael2: I use the new stuff, not the packaged ones - but that's up to you |
| 01:52.34 | michael2 | mutante: nextcloud is a fork of owncloud |
| 01:52.51 | mutante | michael2: to remove Mozilla logos ?:) |
| 01:53.02 | RoyK | mutante: nextcloud was forked from owncloud after owncloud wanted to sell off the whole shite |
| 01:53.14 | mutante | ooh. interesting. thanks |
| 01:53.56 | RoyK | better setup a separate vm for it with nextcloud from the source |
| 01:53.56 | michael2 | RoyK: assuming it wasn't crashed, hehe, how would you keep it up to date - its not in repos. can't `apt-get udate/upgrade' |
| 01:54.28 | RoyK | michael2: it's got automatic updates |
| 01:54.32 | outoftime | RoyK: you wrote "nice nick" |
| 01:54.34 | RoyK | pretty neat |
| 01:54.51 | RoyK | outoftime: yes, you said you were using screen ;) |
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| 01:58.05 | RoyK | needs to get a 2d printer |
| 01:58.38 | michael2 | RoyK: auto-updates. ah, now I know why your nextcloud is crashed :) |
| 01:59.01 | outoftime | Stil not able to run gnome DE without rebooting. I have gdm login sreen, but xfce de, maybe I have to restart window manager |
| 01:59.16 | RoyK | michael2: no, nextcloud didn't crash - there was corruption on the rootfs |
| 01:59.22 | annadane | i did say that earlier. |
| 01:59.33 | annadane | or log out... |
| 01:59.48 | RoyK | michael2: so I setup a new root on a pair of SSDs |
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| 02:00.19 | michael2 | RoyK: why a pair? are you running RAID or something? |
| 02:00.36 | RoyK | then I recovered the data from that and I'm rebuilding the system now |
| 02:00.46 | RoyK | michael2: yeah - I like redundancy |
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| 02:01.14 | RoyK | michael2: 10x2TB in RAID6 for the data and 2x120GB for the root |
| 02:01.22 | RoyK | lvm on top of course |
| 02:01.34 | michael2 | RoyK: how do you backup the nextcloud data? i.e. the files and the SQL database? |
| 02:02.22 | RoyK | the data goes to disk, backup goes to jotta via rclone |
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| 02:02.31 | RoyK | database is postgresql |
| 02:02.40 | RoyK | mysql/mariadb is rubbish |
| 02:02.44 | michael2 | 20TB ?! are these physical disks or rented? |
| 02:03.45 | RoyK | 10x2TB, that is, 10x1.8TiB-2x1.8TiB=15TiB-ish |
| 02:03.54 | RoyK | that's in my flat |
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| 02:04.10 | RoyK | plus a couple of spare drives |
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| 02:04.50 | RoyK | since I sometimes go away a month or two and I don't want my RAID to die |
| 02:05.44 | RoyK | and some of those disks are rather old |
| 02:07.12 | RoyK | having worked with storage for 20 years or so, I've learned one imporant thing: Disks fail |
| 02:07.25 | michael2 | RoyK: sounds like a solid system. so are you `rclon'ing the postgres dbase files directly? i.e. you are not dumping the database, then backing up the SQL dump? |
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| 02:07.35 | RoyK | spinning rust fails slower, SSDs fail faster |
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| 02:08.32 | RoyK | michael2: postgresql is quite nice on the backup part - you can just do "alter database start backup" and then backup the data files and then "aler database end backup" |
| 02:08.41 | RoyK | I prefer to dump the db, though |
| 02:08.56 | RoyK | unless the db is very large, that is |
| 02:09.10 | RoyK | but mine isn't |
| 02:09.45 | michael2 | so you are just copying the files straight out of /var/lib/postgres/<thedatabase> or something? |
| 02:11.07 | RoyK | michael2: if you do the alter database start backup, yes |
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| 02:11.33 | RoyK | michael2: but again, if you don't have a very large database, dumping it is probably better |
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| 02:12.41 | RoyK | michael2: better do pg_dump -Fc dbname > dbname.dump |
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| 02:12.56 | michael2 | is that because if you are reading from the files directly, and the DB is in the middle of a INSERT or UPDATE, you could take a bad copy? |
| 02:13.05 | RoyK | -Fc means "custom format" - easier to restore from and already compressed |
| 02:13.51 | RoyK | when you do that "alter database start backup", you freeze the db files and all inserts/updates go to the log |
| 02:14.09 | RoyK | then it get flushed when you ALTERÂ DATABASEÂ ENDÂ BACKUP |
| 02:14.38 | RoyK | postgresql is nice ;) |
| 02:14.39 | michael2 | and users just get an error message during that time that the DB is unavailable? |
| 02:14.52 | RoyK | no |
| 02:15.00 | RoyK | all changes go to the logs |
| 02:15.15 | RoyK | and then the logs are flushed when you end backup |
| 02:15.22 | michael2 | oh, ok, yes, that sounds nice |
| 02:15.38 | michael2 | does mariaDB do that? |
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| 02:15.49 | RoyK | don't think so |
| 02:16.04 | RoyK | but then - mariadb has some clustering things that are neat |
| 02:16.17 | RoyK | if you have three machines or more |
| 02:16.28 | michael2 | is clustering sharding? or replication? |
| 02:16.50 | RoyK | I don't know what sharding is |
| 02:16.58 | RoyK | clustering is replication |
| 02:17.02 | RoyK | basically |
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| 02:17.18 | RoyK | I've setup clustering with postgres as well, but only master/slave |
| 02:18.01 | michael2 | so - my understanding is replication is when you have multiple DB's which are clones of some main DB and are read only |
| 02:18.05 | RoyK | there are multimaster systems for postgres too, but they aren't that good as for what I've heard |
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| 02:18.42 | michael2 | sharding is when you have so many write operations you need to spread the INSERTs over lots of machines |
| 02:18.45 | RoyK | with three nodes of mariadb, you can have a multimaster cluster |
| 02:18.49 | RoyK | works well |
| 02:19.07 | RoyK | mariadb can't do that very well |
| 02:19.40 | michael2 | but then you would have to merge data of all the separate instances back - that seems the hard part |
| 02:21.21 | RoyK | cassandradb is very good at that |
| 02:21.33 | RoyK | but then - it's not good at transactions |
| 02:22.15 | RoyK | so - as normal - you have to choose between different aspects |
| 02:22.42 | RoyK | cassandra was developed by facebook, since mysql didn't scale |
| 02:23.03 | RoyK | but then, facebook doesn't care shit about transactions |
| 02:23.52 | RoyK | cassandra scales horizontally so well it's almost annoying |
| 02:24.05 | michael2 | the mysql mariadb forking makes them more difficult to work with too |
| 02:24.22 | RoyK | mysql is dead |
| 02:24.35 | RoyK | oracle took over and all the good developers fled |
| 02:24.59 | RoyK | that is, those oracle didn't hire |
| 02:25.20 | michael2 | yeah, but maria hasn't got everything up and running to the same degree as when mysql was at its peak. e.g. no workbench for mariadb |
| 02:25.54 | RoyK | what's nice about postgresql, is that it doesn't do much memory management |
| 02:26.09 | RoyK | it leaves that to the OS, much the same way as with Varnish |
| 02:26.42 | RoyK | since OSes are pretty good at memory management, it's no longer any need for separate memory management for the db itself |
| 02:26.49 | RoyK | mariadb still does that |
| 02:26.54 | RoyK | as does mysql |
| 02:27.35 | RoyK | what made Varnish the fastest proxy in the world was just that - let the OS do the memory job! |
| 02:27.42 | RoyK | postgresql does the same |
| 02:28.01 | RoyK | some memory is allocated for indicies, but that's a bare minimum |
| 02:30.03 | RoyK | if someone has spent 20 years fine-tuning memory allocation algorithms, it's no reason to do it again on top of the OS, is it? |
| 02:31.12 | RoyK | I worked a bit with Oracle in the ninetees and memory management back then was a PITA - really |
| 02:31.48 | RoyK | postgres does this better now without doing much, mostly relying on the buffers in kernel |
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| 02:32.32 | michael2 | good if you have a VM with only few hundred MB's of RAM |
| 02:33.11 | RoyK | how large is that db? |
| 02:33.49 | michael2 | well Im thinking about setting up a next cloud instance - so thats the DB Im thinking about |
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| 02:34.41 | RoyK | michael2: never mind that - it'll be tiny |
| 02:35.01 | RoyK | I doubt you'll hit 10MB |
| 02:35.17 | RoyK | depending on the number of users, obviously |
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| 02:35.27 | RoyK | and objects |
| 02:35.43 | RoyK | but the nextcloud db isn't big - it's just metadata |
| 02:36.08 | michael2 | yeah, not a huge load. nextcloud is capable of doing client side encryption - before it sends to the server right? |
| 02:36.27 | michael2 | but thats not the default is it? |
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| 02:36.38 | RoyK | I don't think so |
| 02:37.02 | RoyK | but you could setup https to it and use encryption on the server side |
| 02:37.25 | RoyK | but if you lose the key - goodbye to your data |
| 02:37.50 | RoyK | I'm not sure about that client-side encryption |
| 02:38.31 | RoyK | Most of the clients I have on my server have encrypted storage |
| 02:38.36 | michael2 | I think it has a client side encryption scheme - and it has a server side key recovery option |
| 02:38.45 | RoyK | meaning I, as the admin, can't see shit |
| 02:39.15 | RoyK | you can setup a server side recovery option and you can choose not to |
| 02:39.36 | michael2 | yeah, but did your server do the encryption - it was it encrypted when your server received it? |
| 02:39.37 | RoyK | that all depends on whom to trust et cetera |
| 02:40.02 | RoyK | not sure now - my nextcloud is down at the moment |
| 02:40.26 | RoyK | took some time to get the piece of shit up again after it crashed |
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| 02:40.52 | RoyK | the data is all there of course, but I haven't really prioritised it |
| 02:41.36 | michael2 | does anyone know if there is a linux desktop program which does kanban boards? similar to trello? |
| 02:41.46 | michael2 | I know nextcloud has "deck" |
| 02:42.17 | michael2 | but it sounds like nextcloud requires a lot of work to maintain |
| 02:42.36 | RoyK | no idea ;) |
| 02:42.55 | RoyK | erm |
| 02:43.08 | RoyK | nextcloud does *not* take a lot to maintain |
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| 02:43.15 | RoyK | it just works |
| 02:43.41 | RoyK | what should it be there to maintain? |
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| 02:44.25 | RoyK | michael2: setup a vm, kvm is nice, or use docker or whatever, and test nextcloud with it |
| 02:44.54 | RoyK | I generally suggest not using the host OS for services |
| 02:45.04 | RoyK | well, if you can avoid it |
| 02:46.21 | michael2 | is that in case of problems with a specific service, the host and other services won't be affected? |
| 02:47.05 | RoyK | it's just how I work |
| 02:47.10 | RoyK | separation is nice |
| 02:47.36 | RoyK | setup a server with this or that service, and you you may need some extra libs from ... |
| 02:47.39 | RoyK | and so on |
| 02:48.11 | RoyK | and if you do that all on the host OS, suddenly you have a havoc of competing libs |
| 02:48.18 | michael2 | well, you can run different versions of PHP and databases too..., I guess. can you install docker via apt-get? |
| 02:48.39 | RoyK | if you just use separation, one service here, one there, kvm separates completely |
| 02:49.12 | RoyK | better setup a kvm vm for the db itself |
| 02:49.18 | RoyK | one for postgresql |
| 02:49.25 | RoyK | one for maridb, if you need it |
| 02:49.58 | RoyK | then just shut those down when you don't need them - no need to clean up trash on the host os |
| 02:50.33 | michael2 | kvm is a hypervisor though right? thats a different thing to containers |
| 02:51.04 | RoyK | kvm is a hypervisor, interfacing with the cpu hypervisor |
| 02:51.08 | SerajewelKS | RoyK: re encrypting filesystems: yeah of course the fs is accessible if mounted. i've read a bit on ecryptfs. maybe it's time to try it out. |
| 02:51.11 | RoyK | be it amd or intel |
| 02:51.24 | RoyK | or even arm, I think, at least soon |
| 02:51.29 | SerajewelKS | i've been using encfs for a long time |
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| 02:52.15 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: the only reason for using encrypted filesystems is to ensure they're not readable when they're not moounted |
| 02:52.24 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: and mostly they're mounted |
| 02:52.31 | SerajewelKS | well... yeah. that's fairly obvious, i would think. |
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| 02:52.41 | SerajewelKS | it's for protection against offline attacks, not online |
| 02:52.42 | RoyK | so better spend time securing the server |
| 02:52.45 | michael2 | SerajewelKS: is the filesystem on a local or remote machine? |
| 02:52.54 | SerajewelKS | local |
| 02:53.13 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: is the machine turned on all the time? |
| 02:53.31 | SerajewelKS | it is. but the filesystem is not mounted very much of that time. |
| 02:53.54 | michael2 | SerajewelKS: what are you wanting to protect against? driveby downloads? remote code execution? laptop theft? |
| 02:53.57 | RoyK | then keep the encrypted part separate |
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| 02:54.15 | RoyK | no need to encrypt the whole thing when it's online anyway |
| 02:54.51 | SerajewelKS | i like how you guys are assuming i haven't actually done any threat modeling. i was asking for input on file-level encrypted filesystems, not an overall security strategy. |
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| 02:55.10 | SerajewelKS | this is one component of a broader strategy |
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| 03:06.09 | jetscreamer | where do you tell the system that the bios clock is not set to UTC? the dpkg factoid gives me 'If the hardware (BIOS) time is set to UTC, change the setting to "UTC=yes" in the "/etc/default/rcS" ' but there is no rcS there |
| 03:07.12 | jetscreamer | creating one and setting it to 'no' will work? |
| 03:07.39 | jetscreamer | tests |
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| 03:08.35 | ryouma | are file-level systems used enough to be secure? |
| 03:09.10 | ryouma | filesystems* |
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| 03:14.50 | jetscreamer | nope. unless it needs to be executable or something |
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| 03:17.09 | jetscreamer | this maybe eh timedatectl set-local-rtc 1 --adjust-system-clock |
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| 03:31.35 | jetscreamer | yay team. you guys rock. |
| 03:31.45 | jetscreamer | !congratulate #debian |
| 03:31.45 | dpkg | Woohoo #debian, you did it! |
| 03:33.19 | jetscreamer | then there's the utc factoid it seems... :/ |
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| 03:37.45 | outoftime | jetscreamer: can you show me that line, where do you found it? |
| 03:38.14 | jetscreamer | it functions |
| 03:38.35 | jetscreamer | i've rebooted 5 times or so |
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| 03:38.51 | outoftime | jetscreamer: problem is gone? |
| 03:39.07 | jetscreamer | google. yeah. i didn't do it the debian way it seems? |
| 03:39.11 | jetscreamer | !utc |
| 03:39.11 | dpkg | Coordinated Universal Time (UTC) is the standard by which the world regulates clocks and time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coordinated_Universal_Time). For Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later, set "UTC" or "LOCAL" in /etc/adjtime (man 8 hwclock). For Debian 6.0 "Squeeze", set the UTC option in /etc/default/rcS appropriately (man rcs). For all systems, run «service hwclock.sh restart» to apply changes. See also <windows utc>. |
| 03:40.06 | jetscreamer | that other was a systemd thing |
| 03:41.47 | jetscreamer | so, man timedatectl should work |
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| 04:19.51 | seekr | waves @ diogenes_ o/ |
| 04:20.34 | diogenes_ | waves back at seekr |
| 04:22.40 | RoyK | waves in no distinct direction |
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| 07:46.46 | talin | hello. i want to erase the data on my PC (with dd, for example), from a bootable USB stick. what image should i put on the stick for this? can i use the netinst.iso ? |
| 07:47.03 | talin | not sure if it has a shell and dd? |
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| 07:59.54 | _pbx_ | I was wondering, where should I ask questions about the current CA list in debian |
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| 08:27.48 | Henry151 | talin: I think you would need to use the netinst iso on one usb, to install a live version of debian on the other usb, if i'm not mistaken. i don't think you can directly boot into debian from the netinst iso itself, and i don't think you can use the netinst iso to install onto the same medium that the iso is already on. |
| 08:29.38 | Henry151 | https://www.pendrivelinux.com/debian-live-flash-drive-install-from-windows/ this may help you? if you're working from windows |
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| 09:16.48 | at0m | talin: the netinstaller indeed has a shell and dd. you could dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sd?? bs=4096 from there, or use /dev/zero instead of urandom |
| 09:18.18 | at0m | talin: careful wit dd if you have multiple partitions, dd isn't Destroyer of Disks for no reason. lsblk or ls -l /dev/disk/by-../ will give you more information on the existing partitions before you dd |
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| 09:55.09 | Urbanecm | Hey all, I'm currently getting "403 Forbidden" on apt-get install <package>. apt-get update works fine. wget http://ftp.debian.org is 403 as well. |
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| 09:55.16 | Urbanecm | Any idea what to try? |
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| 09:57.43 | RoyK | Urbanecm: pastebin the error message |
| 09:57.53 | RoyK | dpkg: tell Urbanecm about pastebin |
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| 09:59.13 | Urbanecm | RoyK, http://paste.debian.net/1045992/ |
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| 10:00.39 | Urbanecm | RoyK, this http://paste.debian.net/1045994/ is interesting. |
| 10:00.43 | Urbanecm | Random websites are failing |
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| 10:02.19 | RoyK | Urbanecm: erm.... is your ISP proxying these things or something? |
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| 10:03.10 | Urbanecm | Don't know, I've sent an query to the service provider |
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| 10:04.09 | RoyK | Urbanecm: you may want to try to use an external proxy to bypass whatever they do, or a vpn tunnel, but a proxy is quicker to use for test |
| 10:04.17 | Urbanecm | thank you |
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| 10:05.37 | talin | at0m: thank you! there's nothing on these machines i want to keep, so i'll just go crazy :-) |
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| 10:08.42 | balance | hi |
| 10:10.02 | balance | When installing debian, I really have to choose my country in order to choose the correct time zone? |
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| 10:11.57 | Fox | balance: might help to choose the closest mirrors too |
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| 10:15.15 | pricing | balance: You don't have to. You can reconfigure the time zone at any time later, by typing "dpkg-reconfigure tz" as root. |
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| 10:21.53 | balance | pricing, yeah ofc was just wondering Fox ok ty :) |
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| 10:27.21 | pongo | hello all |
| 10:27.30 | pongo | whats about you all |
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| 10:29.33 | rafalcpp | how to disable ipv6 that is autoconfigured on my cards |
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| 10:29.56 | rafalcpp | somehow I magically get ipv6 connectivity |
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| 10:30.29 | rafalcpp | one of computers in LAN, is getting IPv6 via tunnel (HE) |
| 10:30.38 | rafalcpp | and does routing advertisment to LAN I think |
| 10:30.49 | rafalcpp | how to set on computers to ignore that? |
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| 10:31.49 | gkgk | hello |
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| 10:33.15 | gkgk | sure |
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| 10:34.06 | RoyK | rafalcpp: sysctl net.ipv6.conf.all.disable_ipv6=1 |
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| 10:34.31 | RoyK | rafalcpp: then add that line to /etc/sysctl.d/12-disable-ipv6.conf or something |
| 10:34.54 | pkpkpk1 | which lne |
| 10:35.08 | gkgk | what are you said pk |
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| 10:43.46 | Rico | hello |
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| 10:44.11 | Rico | how do I install mysql-dev on debian jessie ? I don't have any mysql server dev packages in apt ? |
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| 10:44.12 | rafalcpp | RoyK: though I do want in fact few other IPv6. just not to accept advertisment from LAN |
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| 10:44.38 | rafalcpp | RoyK: I have custom ipv6 in VPN, and such |
| 10:46.34 | RoyK | rafalcpp: https://superuser.com/questions/33196/how-to-disable-autoconfiguration-on-ipv6-in-linux |
| 10:46.37 | RoyK | perhaps |
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| 10:51.06 | darxmurf | awk question, why this works: awk '{ if (tolower($0) ~ /[0-9]\/[0-9] +raid[0-9]+/) { print $3 }}' but not this awk '{ if (tolower($0) ~ /[0-9]\/[0-9][[:space:]]+raid[0-9]+/) { print $3 }}' |
| 10:51.24 | darxmurf | I tried with \s instead of [[:space:]] but same same |
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| 10:52.41 | darxmurf | okay, it's working with gawk instead of mawk |
| 10:52.48 | Rico | how do I fix that on deb 8 ? checking for mysql_init in -lmysqlclient... no |
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| 11:15.22 | nkuttler | i don't get it, can't install enigmail, https://paste.debian.net/1046000/, apparently 1:60.0-3~deb9u1 < 1:52.0 |
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| 11:20.21 | nkuttler | hm, backported thunderbird Breaks: enigmail (<< 2:1.9.8.1-1~) |
| 11:20.24 | nkuttler | ,v enigmail |
| 11:20.25 | judd | Package: enigmail on amd64 -- wheezy: 2:1.8.2-4~deb7u1; wheezy-security: 2:1.9.9-1~deb7u1; jessie: 2:1.9.9-1~deb8u1; jessie-security: 2:1.9.9-1~deb8u1; stretch: 2:1.9.9-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 2:1.9.9-1~deb9u1; buster: 2:2.0.8-4; sid: 2:2.0.8-4 |
| 11:21.00 | nkuttler | nope, backported thunderbird breaks enigmail (<< 2:2~) |
| 11:21.07 | nkuttler | shrugs |
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| 12:22.30 | gkgk_ | dkkdd |
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| 12:29.48 | tw | is there a script to tell if you've messed up your security updates? For example, detecting if the linux-image-{arch} metapackage is missing. |
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| 12:55.39 | tsglove | Rico, what did you do? |
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| 13:19.12 | grandfso | Hi, not sure if this is just me, but I feel music sounds better on Debian, compared to Windows. Same hardware, same source --> any reason that might be the case or I am simply feeling stuff? |
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| 13:20.45 | kirk781 | grandfso, There is no technical reason for music to sound better on Debian assuming drivers/software are properly set up on both systems. |
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| 13:21.17 | kirk781 | In my case, music playback takes a dip on Linux based systems since no my bluetooth headphones stutter/skip a lot on pairing |
| 13:22.01 | greycat | There are so many possible variables involved. Data source, decoder/player, drivers, firmware, .... |
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| 13:22.59 | tvm | yep, i had same experience in the past |
| 13:23.09 | blackflow | default sample rate.... |
| 13:23.37 | greycat | Yeah, it's really quite complicated. |
| 13:23.45 | tvm | windows usually have even some silly surround processing or some other stuff going on around that changes the sound further |
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| 13:31.42 | grandfso | Thanks for the response... Something's fishy here ;) My gut was telling me I should expect windows to sound better. The source for both systems is Spotify on high quality... @blackflow.. The sample rate ---> this could be it. Not sure what's the default for windows, but difference in sample rate will definitely influence how good the sound sounds. |
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| 13:32.37 | greycat | You can eliminate variance in the data source by actually downloading an audio file and playing it locally. |
| 13:32.57 | greycat | Ideally you'd decode it to .WAV or some other uncompressed format, too. |
| 13:33.13 | blackflow | technically, assuming no DSP is going on, it should sound exactly the same, being digital and all. there's no ADAC/DAC going on anywhere, so only (forced) processing, or sample rate, could explain the difference. |
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| 13:33.32 | blackflow | (obvs there's DAC going on at the sound card, but that's OS agnostic) |
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| 13:34.44 | blackflow | or ambient sound :) my GPU has different coil whine under linux and windows, so that could too, affect the perception of audio. |
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| 13:35.02 | grandfso | Uh :) |
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| 13:38.21 | grandfso | I can't spare time to get to the bottom of it, and I am not really that interested as I am simple music consumer. I am happy that some of you had also simiar 'experience', and it's not my recent 'debian fanboyism' making me hear things. |
| 13:38.42 | grandfso | cheers! |
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| 13:40.20 | blackflow | (though I never said I had the same experience. just listed some things that _might_ objectively alter sound perception :) other than the coil whine affecting ambience, I never noticed the difference, personally) |
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| 13:40.58 | grandfso | my bad, so I hear things I want to hear XD |
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| 13:41.17 | blackflow | maybe. or read. :))) |
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| 13:50.19 | no_gravity | Will changing /etc/hostname usually break something? |
| 13:50.52 | greycat | If there are programs that have stored the old hostname somewhere else, you'll want to track all of those down and repair them. |
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| 13:51.08 | no_gravity | How would I find them? |
| 13:51.16 | greycat | By knowing what you have installed and what you have done. |
| 13:51.44 | greycat | At the very minimum, the hostname is probably also in /etc/hosts on the 127.0.1.1 line. |
| 13:52.06 | no_gravity | Yeah, it's there. |
| 13:52.14 | pagios | Hello, does anyone know of any cloud providers other than AWS that provides instant docker images provisioning? Like i can spawn an instance in a matter of seconds , run it for 2 or 3h and then close it, i can spawn 100 isntance docker and close after few hours and get charged accordingly. Can anyone point me to such providers? |
| 13:52.30 | no_gravity | pagios: One moment, we are talkinig about /etc/hostname at the moment. |
| 13:52.38 | no_gravity | greycat: Can I have a comment in that file? |
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| 13:52.46 | greycat | We're allowed to have multiple conversations. |
| 13:52.54 | no_gravity | greycat: Sure |
| 13:53.13 | greycat | no_gravity: there is already a comment IN that file by default. So yes. Also man hosts. |
| 13:53.23 | no_gravity | In my /etc/hostname, there is no comment. |
| 13:53.40 | greycat | I meant in /etc/hosts. Obviously. Why would there be a comment in /etc/hostname? |
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| 13:54.06 | no_gravity | greycat: I would like to keep the old hostname there as a comment. |
| 13:54.10 | greycat | "man 5 hostname" is the man page for it if you need one for some reason |
| 13:54.21 | greycat | It says you can. |
| 13:54.26 | no_gravity | Yay |
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| 13:54.54 | pagios | ? |
| 13:55.01 | no_gravity | It was localhost.localdomain. I guess that is the default used by Debian. |
| 13:55.14 | greycat | ... no, that is you screwing up. |
| 13:55.21 | no_gravity | pagios: Docker hosting is probably more a topic for #docker or a hosting channel. |
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| 13:55.37 | no_gravity | greycat: I can't remember screwing at all. It's a pretty plain debian install. |
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| 13:56.01 | greycat | As far as I remember, the default hostname in the Debian installer is "debian". DEFINITELY not "localhost.localdomain" or "localhost". |
| 13:56.27 | greycat | Calling your machine "localhost" is utterly wrong and will almost certainly break things. |
| 13:56.29 | no_gravity | greycat: Well, it's the default image of a VM provider. I did never see the installer. |
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| 14:00.15 | ewew | Hi. Is it possible to bridge a one bonding interface if the bridge has only one device specified ? Looks like the ifupdown can not handle this ? is this a bug or it suppose to work like this. Thank you for your time. |
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| 14:05.59 | afidegnum | hello, i m having an issue, using alpine or mutt, i can't read mail from my local account |
| 14:06.01 | TvL2386 | ewew: what do you mean? |
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| 14:06.19 | ewew | create a bonding interface a the put it in a bridge |
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| 14:06.47 | greycat | afidegnum: where's the mail stored, what's the $MAIL environment variable set to, what is the mutt command you're typing? Or did you use .muttrc to try to configure where the inbox is? |
| 14:06.54 | TvL2386 | ewew: yeah you can do that: create a bond0 and do `brctl addbr mybridge && brctl addif mybridge bond0` |
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| 14:07.07 | afidegnum | wait let me see |
| 14:07.11 | ewew | and is this possible with ifupdown ? |
| 14:07.31 | afidegnum | greycat: it's in /var/mail |
| 14:07.34 | TvL2386 | ewew: that should work fine in /etc/network/interfaces |
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| 14:08.08 | afidegnum | greycat: there is root and mail |
| 14:08.26 | afidegnum | but when i tried to access mail, i have permission denied error, |
| 14:08.33 | greycat | Well, then you probably want to configure your MTA to deliver root's and mail's mail to you. |
| 14:08.39 | ewew | because i read on one forum that this does not assign a ip address to the bridge device. I see only issue in timing of creating the devices. |
| 14:08.54 | afidegnum | what's the directive ? |
| 14:09.10 | afidegnum | i have both alpine and mutt installed |
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| 14:09.36 | greycat | afidegnum: If your MTA is exim4, then it should be simply editing /etc/aliases and changing where "root:" and "mail:" point |
| 14:09.52 | greycat | exim4 doesn't *appear* to have a newaliases command that you'd need to run... or at least I can't find one |
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| 14:10.11 | greycat | If you're using postfix or something else, then it may be different. |
| 14:10.34 | TvL2386 | ewew: I don't know ewew, I just know I've done it in the past, but I can't find it in my docs |
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| 14:11.30 | afidegnum | greycat: in /etc/aliases only mailer-daemon points to postmaster, the rest points to root |
| 14:11.48 | greycat | And what does root point to? Is there no "root: " line at all? Then add one. "root: yourname" |
| 14:11.50 | ewew | ok. i think this kind of setup is overcomplicated and maybe some change refuses to accept this kind on config. |
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| 14:12.25 | ewew | only thing left is just start vbox and test. |
| 14:12.58 | afidegnum | greycat: there is nobody, hostmaster, usenet, news, webmaster, www, ftp, abuse, noc, security pointing to root |
| 14:13.07 | greycat | Add "root: yourname" |
| 14:13.18 | afidegnum | ok |
| 14:13.30 | afidegnum | you mean the Linux user account? |
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| 14:13.51 | greycat | Wherever you want root's mail to go. |
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| 14:16.36 | afidegnum | no success |
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| 14:16.50 | greycat | What MTA are you using? |
| 14:17.23 | afidegnum | exim |
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| 14:17.26 | afidegnum | exim4 |
| 14:18.07 | Fox | afidegnum: did you type 'newaliases' after editing /etc/aliases ? |
| 14:18.18 | greycat | Does echo test | mail "$LOGNAME" generate a message to you in /var/mail? Are there any useful errors in /var/log/exim4/mainlog ? |
| 14:18.22 | afidegnum | not yet |
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| 14:19.19 | afidegnum | echo test | mail "$LOGNAME" return no output |
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| 14:19.32 | greycat | That's good, but doesn't mean anything by itself. |
| 14:19.49 | afidegnum | let me check the log |
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| 14:20.03 | afidegnum | /var/log |
| 14:20.07 | afidegnum | oh, sorry |
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| 14:21.11 | greycat | Hmm, I'm not sure I actually have a fully working exim4 machine here... |
| 14:21.59 | greycat | Ah, here's one on jessie. Yes, it has a "newaliases" command -- sorry about misrepresenting that earlier. |
| 14:22.06 | afidegnum | no error log so far, |
| 14:22.49 | greycat | Did it create a file named /var/mail/$LOGNAME (after shell expansion)? |
| 14:22.57 | afidegnum | ok, to start, how do i find the existing smtp and pop address? |
| 14:23.06 | greycat | There aren't any by default. |
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| 14:23.29 | greycat | If you want to send or receive email by SMTP with other systems, you need to run "dpkg-reconfigure exim4-config" or something similar. |
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| 14:25.08 | afidegnum | for the default mail cofiguration, i have "local delivery only; not on a network" |
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| 14:25.25 | afidegnum | but there is a mail box with mesasages, |
| 14:25.37 | afidegnum | if possible to empty the existig one and start afresh |
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| 14:26.28 | greycat | If you mean a file in /var/mail/ then yes. They're just text files. You can edit them, truncate them, delete them, whatever you wish. |
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| 14:28.46 | afidegnum | no that's not where the mail is located, let me check elsewhere, |
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| 14:29.37 | greycat | If your echo|mail test didn't PUT mail there, then something is wrong. |
| 14:29.53 | greycat | Hopefully the exim4 logs will help you figure out what. |
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| 14:33.24 | grandfso | Hi guys, I have one more question with regards to sound on debian. I was trying to have the volume control set on per-application basis, because currently, when I increase the volume in Spotify, it changes the global volume level which causes the system sounds to be quite painful :) Is there a way to control the system volume separately ? I've tried to set flat-volumes=no in /etc/pulse/daemon.conf but it seems like it didn't do the trick... |
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| 14:35.03 | jak2000 | sorry and escuse me: always that i restart my server with: shutdown -r now after restarted if i try access to mysql i get the error: "ERROR 2002 (HY000): Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.sock' (2)" and i need type: sudo mysqld_safe --tc-heuristic-recover=COMMIT because i cant connect immediatly, why? (need stop the service before the restart?) |
| 14:35.04 | jak2000 | any advice? |
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| 14:39.52 | karlpinc | jak2000: You shouldn't have to do anything special with mysql to restart. You might try looking at the logs to diagnose the problem. Or, if you're using systemd then try "systemctl restart" instead of "shutdown -r now", possibly. |
| 14:40.19 | greycat | that shouldn't be necessary |
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| 14:41.52 | TvL2386 | I always type `reboot`. No problems whatsoever with any services |
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| 14:42.07 | TvL2386 | like greycat says: doesn't matter |
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| 14:47.10 | njsg | I'm still trying to debug a PCMCIA ethernet NIC which is not working out of the box. |
| 14:47.27 | njsg | Is there up-to-date Debian documentation on PCMCIA hardware? |
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| 14:47.52 | njsg | Especially something a bit more... exhaustive than https://wiki.debian.org/PCMCIA |
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| 14:51.47 | jak2000 | karlpinc: how to know if used systemd? |
| 14:52.30 | greycat | jak2000: ls -l /sbin/init |
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| 14:59.58 | blackflow | jak2000: you're receiving help for that issue in #ubuntu-server. So you should really just use one, and appropriate one, channel for help. |
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| 15:03.13 | jak2020 | blackflow i have some servers with debian and ubuntu... thanks |
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| 15:04.53 | blackflow | and they both have the same problem, right? |
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| 15:46.46 | zleap | debian 9.5 now running nicely, however a combination of wordpress and nfl.com in browser tabs seem to cause issues. |
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| 16:08.37 | SerajewelKS | zleap: you may be out of memory. check top, also you didn't even specify which browser or DE. |
| 16:09.24 | zleap | lxde, and the firefox ESR browser |
| 16:09.26 | njsg | That depends on what the "issues" are, or was that already explained before? |
| 16:10.02 | zleap | i only installed yesterday i need to do some poking around probably to see if the issue can be narrowed down |
| 16:10.40 | petn-randall | zleap: But how is the "issue" showing? |
| 16:11.00 | petn-randall | Does the computer turn off, does it kill your cat, does it display a blank page? |
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| 16:12.15 | greycat | https://xkcd.com/293/ |
| 16:13.15 | njsg | is there any reason why pccardctl ident/info or lspcmcia wouldn't print the card identifiction except if the correct driver has been loaded? non-PnP hardware? |
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| 16:14.26 | zleap | petn-randall: it just seems to slow to a crawl |
| 16:14.42 | zleap | but I am not sure if there are items on the nfl.com page that are doing that, |
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| 16:15.06 | petn-randall | zleap: How much RAM does the machine have? |
| 16:15.12 | zleap | 3GB |
| 16:15.35 | petn-randall | Hmm, that's not too much, but ok. Did you check with top how much firefox uses for that page? |
| 16:15.37 | greycat | Have you installed non-free firmware if your video chipset wants that? |
| 16:15.42 | somiaj | you could check the output of 'free -h' and see if you are using any swap. |
| 16:15.53 | zleap | yes it is debian non free install iso |
| 16:15.58 | njsg | That's a lot, but not for certain dynamic websites and web 3.0 features |
| 16:16.18 | njsg | er, 2.0 |
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| 16:17.11 | njsg | somiaj: that won't help much, AFAIK linux's default behaviour is to swap out even if there is no immediate need for free memory |
| 16:17.25 | jelly | yeah you with your 2000 hardware don't get to have a 2018 opinion on what's a "lot" of memory! |
| 16:18.14 | njsg | really? |
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| 16:19.01 | greycat | ... |
| 16:19.03 | somiaj | njsg: it should only be swaping when it is idel and if memeory is too low for enough cache. It may at least show lots of memeory ussage (depending on cache). |
| 16:19.05 | jelly | /s |
| 16:19.10 | jelly | too late! |
| 16:20.14 | zleap | i seem to be using swap, 212M even though I have 2.1G ram free |
| 16:20.28 | jelly | somiaj: it should, but it does more than that. |
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| 16:21.32 | n4dir | wondering how smartphones do webpages if on a PC way more memory isn't considered sufficient (but then: i don't even know what specs modern smartphones have. Sure more than my hardware ... ). |
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| 16:22.58 | bites | you don't have a dozen tabs in memory simultaneously on a smartphone. |
| 16:23.27 | jelly | well maybe you have a dozen, but not a hundred |
| 16:23.29 | n4dir | neither have i on a PC. |
| 16:23.53 | n4dir | but yeah, that might explain it. |
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| 16:51.05 | ctcx | I installed a standalone file server, but users need to access their files from outside local network as well. Port forwarded samba kind of works but slower and laggy, using scp users would be able to see entire Linux filesystem, even when they cannot do any changes (no write permissions). |
| 16:51.15 | ctcx | And VPN does slow down speed transfer. |
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| 16:51.32 | ctcx | Any advise by chance? |
| 16:52.11 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Set up sftp, transfer the files one time. Don't pretend to have real-time local access. |
| 16:52.24 | Poster | your WAN bandwidth and latency is going to be the bottleneck there |
| 16:52.39 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Samba over internet is a VERY BAD idea. |
| 16:52.50 | ctcx | Problem is, users are Windows-only users |
| 16:52.56 | Poster | I would probably go with a VPN solution though, I agree that exposing file servers directly to the Internet is not a good idea |
| 16:53.00 | ctcx | Problem is, users are Windows-only users |
| 16:53.10 | Poster | OpenVPN is quite good and works across both platforms well |
| 16:53.15 | ctcx | Which is why I mentioned samba, winscp and vpn |
| 16:53.17 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Even worse. |
| 16:53.41 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: There are plenty of Windows sftp clients. |
| 16:54.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1282] by debhelper |
| 16:54.10 | ctcx | Worse what? The WinSCP client? |
| 16:54.36 | ctcx | I cannot make users learn Linux and abandon Windows... |
| 16:54.38 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Worse that they're inherently insecure Windows clients. |
| 16:55.00 | ctcx | Who are? Clients such as WinSCP? |
| 16:55.01 | karlpinc | ctcx: I've always told my MS Windows people to use the fireftp firefox extension to do sftp. |
| 16:55.14 | ctcx | ^ Ohh... |
| 16:55.38 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: If you use a file sharing protocol over the internet, you're begging for file corruption. Do the transfers cleanly with a protocol that does CRC checks. |
| 16:55.39 | karlpinc | ctcx: That was a while ago. Don't know what else is out there, but there's plenty of sftp clients. |
| 16:56.04 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: VPN is wasteful when all you need is scp. |
| 16:56.33 | ctcx | The bad thing about FireFTP is, it's not compatible with latest Firefox versions (Quantum) |
| 16:57.11 | Poster | The reason I mention VPN is that it will use the already configured service (Samba, I am assuming) as well as authentication and permission restrictions. If you opt for something else, you will have to work through setting up permissions and possibly authentication if it not local (such as Active Directory). |
| 16:57.18 | ctcx | Ok, ok, I kind of knew this from the beginning, but now I've been told for sure: definitely Samba over internet is a no go. Understood. |
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| 16:58.13 | Poster | From a security perspective, exposing SSH to the Internet with password only authentication can be a bit risky, if you do go that route, I'd look into restricting it's access to ssh-key only. OpenVPN itself can use SSL certificates to help prevent things like guessing a password as well. |
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| 16:59.26 | jhutchins_wk | Poster: I think you have your facts backwards. VPN is much less secure than ssh/sftp. |
| 17:00.27 | jhutchins_wk | Poster: Yes, key access is better than password, as is port-shifted service, but password-based ssh is reasonably secure if password standards are reasonable. |
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| 17:00.37 | Poster | ok I am not sure where you're getting that information, neither is perfectly secure, I am suggesting whatever is chosen have more than simple password only authentication |
| 17:02.27 | Poster | If you setup OpenVPN to use UDP as a transport with hmac authentication, it will not even respond to a connection that does not contain the valid hmac, as far as I know the SSH protocol does not have such a mechnism |
| 17:03.00 | jhutchins_wk | VNC is a waste of bandwidth for simple file transfer. |
| 17:03.13 | jhutchins_wk | s/transfer/access |
| 17:03.31 | karlpinc | ctcx: There's also putty. Apparently there's cyberduck. |
| 17:04.42 | karlpinc | Poster: The other issue is that vpns are complicated to setup and that leaves problems that can be security problems. E.g. If you setup openvpn without a hmac. |
| 17:04.49 | jhutchins_wk | Bitvise, Cygwyn, SFL |
| 17:05.23 | Poster | yeah there is complexity on both sides, missing a few directives in sshd_config can open up issues as well |
| 17:06.03 | jhutchins_wk | Poster: Dinking around with the default configurations when you only think you know what you're doing is more dangerous. |
| 17:06.20 | Poster | neither is perfect, I am attempting to share what knowledge I have for ctcx so they can make an informed decision, I am not trying to argue with anyone as to what they think is "best" |
| 17:06.45 | Poster | an absence of knowledge by the user is not the fault of the software |
| 17:07.02 | Poster | it's fine to have a preference, but keep in mind others may have knowledge in areas you may not |
| 17:07.02 | ctcx | I have already worked with putty and winscp |
| 17:07.25 | karlpinc | ctcx: What are the factors under consideration? |
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| 17:07.37 | karlpinc | ctcx: As far as your users go. |
| 17:07.51 | ctcx | Sorry, factors such as which ones? |
| 17:08.12 | karlpinc | ctcx: Well, why not winscp or putty? |
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| 17:09.38 | ctcx | Ah, ok, that was actually part of my original doubt. |
| 17:10.11 | ctcx | Well, in fact I left the users with winscp access in the meanwhile. What worries me is, |
| 17:11.09 | ctcx | While browsing through winscp they could certainly browse all the other areas of the Linux file system, such as /var, /etc, and others. Even when they cannot do any changes nor write, they can see them. |
| 17:11.21 | greycat | So what? There is nothing secret there. |
| 17:11.39 | ctcx | greycat: hello sir. Thanks for answering. |
| 17:11.48 | ctcx | Ok, if you say so... |
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| 17:12.03 | zleap | what about config files, |
| 17:12.08 | Poster | That is one of the reasons I was recommending you continue to use Samba and work on getting connected clients connected using a VPN system |
| 17:12.10 | greycat | What about them? |
| 17:12.26 | zleap | users could read any config files |
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| 17:12.32 | karlpinc | zleap: There should be no secrets in config files, unless the file has restricted permissions. |
| 17:12.41 | zleap | karlpinc: yeah |
| 17:13.05 | karlpinc | zleap: /etc/passwd anyone can access. /etc/shadow, they can't. |
| 17:13.34 | zleap | and /etc/passwd won't have any passwords in plain text anyway |
| 17:13.41 | karlpinc | zleap: Exactly. |
| 17:13.43 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: It is possible to chroot sftp, although that's not unbreakable. If they're curious enough to brows the OS files though, they ought to learn linux. |
| 17:13.44 | greycat | And if you're paranoid about them knowing the names of login accounts, you probably have the accounts *really* defined in LDAP or whatever anyway. |
| 17:13.56 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Most config files are not user readable. |
| 17:14.10 | ctcx | greycat, karlpinc: I never touch any of the system's other files and directories; I know system has its reasons for leaving its stuff with the permissions they have. |
| 17:14.28 | zleap | i think this is what ctcx was worried about, |
| 17:14.30 | greycat | Most *are* readable, but harmless. "I found out the name of your ethernet interface! It's eth0! FEAR!!!!" |
| 17:14.37 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Try to read sshd_config as a regular user. |
| 17:14.42 | ctcx | But out of paranoia I was thinking............. |
| 17:14.46 | ctcx | ^ |
| 17:14.47 | ctcx | er |
| 17:14.48 | zleap | yeah good point |
| 17:14.51 | ctcx | Ok, nevermind... |
| 17:15.23 | zleap | ctcx: i don't think there is any harm is being cautious, the opposite to that is complacency which is more problematic |
| 17:15.52 | ctcx | Unless a rotten/envious users hired a hacker to break into the server... but he'd have to invite him personally to the place... and this would be a bit... extreme example |
| 17:15.57 | karlpinc | ctcx: You do leak information. The users can know what version of what OS your running, and on and on. The point is that people have been living with letting users see what's visible for a very long time. If you do the same you're in fine company. |
| 17:15.59 | ctcx | s/users/user/ |
| 17:16.28 | karlpinc | ctcx: Hopefully each user has their own credentials so you can trace nefarious activity back to an individual. |
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| 17:16.52 | ctcx | Unless a rotten/envious user hired a hacker to break into the server... but he'd have to invite him personally to the place... and this would be a bit... extreme example |
| 17:16.56 | Poster | You also need to consider that a trusted user could become compromised themselves, so whatever their access is gets handed to whomever has compromised their system |
| 17:16.57 | karlpinc | ctcx: Or block it, or whatever. |
| 17:17.02 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: I would recommend running ssh on a non-standard port, if for no other reason than to spare your system the load of brute-force attacks. ( port 222 is well known ) |
| 17:17.14 | Poster | in general you want to expose enough to them to perform their job functions and nothing else |
| 17:17.19 | zleap | karlpinc: can anything help ctcx with that, e.g enable logging on services not normally logged |
| 17:17.19 | ctcx | Ah, I already did change the default ssh port on server |
| 17:17.27 | ctcx | Sorry, forgot to say that |
| 17:17.33 | jhutchins_wk | Poster: Do you manage security for someone other than yourself? |
| 17:17.35 | ctcx | And also disabled root access through ssh |
| 17:18.02 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Xlnt. |
| 17:18.05 | Poster | yeah actually we've got a few thousand employees and 20-30k contractors using our systems |
| 17:18.06 | karlpinc | ctcx: I tend to deal with brute force ssh attacks at the firewall level, but more layers of precaution do not hurt. |
| 17:18.07 | zleap | ctcx: fail2ban could be useful, allow 3 attempts to ssh in, if that fails that ip / host is blocked (if I understand how it works properly) |
| 17:18.43 | ctcx | The only "admin" user is the one I have there; the other users are "normal" and only have write permission to their own stuff |
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| 17:18.54 | jhutchins_wk | I've found iptables throttling to be fairly adequate, but that does mean the packets are touching the kernel, which can eventually overload the system. |
| 17:19.21 | ctcx | "xlnt"? |
| 17:19.38 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: AKA Very Good. |
| 17:19.50 | karlpinc | jhutchins_wk: I tend to use openbsd's pf and after enough connections put the source ip in a black hole for a while. Whatever works. |
| 17:19.51 | ctcx | Yes, already have seen fail2ban |
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| 17:20.22 | zleap | hi akko |
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| 17:20.24 | jhutchins_wk | karlpinc: Yeah, that's essentially what throttling does. |
| 17:20.28 | akko | zleap: hi |
| 17:20.39 | ctcx | Does "xlnt" mean "very good"? How's that? I cannot see any similarity with an acronym or emoticon... |
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| 17:20.55 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: fail2ban has a certain tendency to bite the admin. |
| 17:21.04 | karlpinc | ctcx: eXceLliNT |
| 17:21.11 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Excellent |
| 17:21.19 | ctcx | Ah! |
| 17:21.24 | plujon | Is there a surefire way to discover what package I need to install to satisfy -lz ? |
| 17:21.30 | zleap | i am guessing debian 9 has a firewall does it have a gui config tool for that |
| 17:21.34 | greycat | zlib1g-dev |
| 17:21.35 | ctcx | Sorry everyone, English is not my native language. |
| 17:21.41 | ctcx | But I understood once and for all. |
| 17:21.58 | greycat | zleap: It has firewalls *available*, but none by default. |
| 17:21.58 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: There are several iptables front ends that set up "firewalls". |
| 17:22.06 | zleap | ok |
| 17:22.08 | plujon | greycat: Thanks! Is there a way to discover that without asking in this channel? |
| 17:22.15 | zleap | i am not too sure how secure my system us |
| 17:22.17 | zleap | is |
| 17:22.22 | ctcx | So in summary, |
| 17:22.42 | greycat | plujon: -lz tells the linker that it should look for a file (or symlink) named "libz.so" or "libz.a", so you could do an apt-file search for those files. |
| 17:22.42 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: Your English is also very good. |
| 17:22.46 | karlpinc | zleap: I prefer working directly with a text based config for firewalling. This lets me put in notes so I document why I'm doing what I do. I tend toward using ferm as syntatic sugar for iptables. Makes for easier to read and work with firewalling. |
| 17:22.49 | greycat | ,file libz.so |
| 17:22.52 | ctcx | Thanks for that. |
| 17:22.54 | judd | Search for libz.so in stretch/amd64: lib32z1-dev: usr/lib32/libz.so; zlib1g-dev: usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libz.so |
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| 17:23.17 | ctcx | So in summary, |
| 17:23.31 | kexec | hello, please, what does the red "security" text means? https://packages.debian.org/stretch/firefox-esr |
| 17:23.33 | karlpinc | zleap: If you don't document your firewall you will forget why the rules exist. |
| 17:23.34 | Poster | If you are just looking for bandwidth limiting, wondershaper is in the apt repo and can apply limits to upload and/or download speeds independent of iptables usage |
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| 17:23.40 | plujon | greycat: Thanks! apt-file # command not found hmm |
| 17:23.46 | greycat | kexec: it means you're seeing a version that is newer in security.debian.org than in the main repository |
| 17:23.53 | zleap | karlpinc: only installed debian yesterday |
| 17:24.00 | jhutchins_wk | plujon: Optional, must be installed. |
| 17:24.02 | greycat | plujon: install it, or use judd as I just did, or use packages.debian.org |
| 17:24.04 | karlpinc | plujon: You'll want to install apt-file then. |
| 17:24.23 | zleap | i don't always understand it, i know e-mail works so i would assume the port for e-mail is open |
| 17:24.34 | zleap | same for irc and web |
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| 17:25.04 | plujon | Duh, thanks. I thought I tried `apt-get install apt-file`, and it failed, but I forgot the `install` |
| 17:25.05 | ctcx | Installed Samba file server on Linux, have Windows-only users. They work their shared folders normally on Windows in LAN; they use WinSCP to copy and modify their stuff while outside LAN. |
| 17:25.34 | ctcx | With WinSCP they can indeed read more of the filesystem's stuff, yet do no changes at all due to permissions. |
| 17:25.36 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Those protocols from a desktop system make outbound calls on known port, and establish two-way communication on random, unprivileged ports. No worries, especially if you're behind a NAT router. |
| 17:25.51 | ctcx | Server has ssh port changed, and root access not allowed. |
| 17:25.52 | zleap | yeah should be |
| 17:25.53 | karlpinc | zleap: Unless you installed some firewalling you probably have none. In and of itself this is not a problem. If you are not running daemons which listen for network connections the outside world will not be able to talk to you. |
| 17:26.02 | ctcx | In summary, am I good enough? |
| 17:26.38 | zleap | the only firewalli have set up is on another box, running assault cube and ssh, so i had to set up ssh forwarding and assaultcube forwarding |
| 17:26.42 | karlpinc | ctcx: (I tend to allow root access only via keys, just in case I want root access for something like backup.) |
| 17:27.05 | zleap | so ufw allow 22 |
| 17:27.13 | akko | what do I have to install to be able to click with synaptic (like, click without pressing the button, idk how to say it but i think you guys may know what i'm talking about) |
| 17:27.14 | zleap | this was on ubuntu server |
| 17:27.17 | jhutchins_wk | ctcx: I think that would probably get a pass for a system running financial transactions for the US government from our security team. |
| 17:27.22 | karlpinc | ctcx: Should be good enough. You could do "ss -ltn" to see if anything else is listening on publicly available ports. |
| 17:27.45 | greycat | Debian has ufw available as a package, if you wish to use it. |
| 17:28.03 | zleap | ok |
| 17:28.06 | zleap | do i need it though |
| 17:28.09 | greycat | No. |
| 17:29.30 | karlpinc | ctcx: By the by. When any random stranger (like me) tells you to type something you'd be well served to look up the command in the man pages and check the arguments and see what it is that is supposed to happen. _Before_ you do any typing. I could be telling your system to send my bank all your money. ;) |
| 17:30.01 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Probably not. |
| 17:30.09 | zleap | karlpinc: that is good advice there |
| 17:30.09 | greycat | !rules |
| 17:30.11 | dpkg | 1) Don't ask to ask. Just state your problem, 2) Don't repeat until 10 mins after, 3) Read and re-read the docs first, then admit it if you REALLY don't understand. You're wasting your time and ours if you haven't at least tried. 4) If your problem ain't solved, come back in 12 hrs or 24 hrs later. We're very international. 5) Be polite and patient. 6) #debian supports only Debian (see <based on debian>) |
| 17:30.18 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: on-system firewalls are really more of a Windows thing. |
| 17:30.28 | greycat | Oh, hmm, that one doesn't have "don't type anything you don't understand" in it. |
| 17:30.36 | zleap | well like you said my router should protect me |
| 17:30.37 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: You won't have random ports open and listening for outside connections. 22 is ssh. |
| 17:30.56 | zleap | unless i run ssh-server locally to allow local lan connections |
| 17:30.57 | greycat | I know there was a bot factoid with that... maybe that factoid, but it was changed, or maybe a different factoid.... |
| 17:31.08 | zleap | i can see why i would need a firewall in that sense, installed locally |
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| 17:31.43 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: You don't need a firewall, just a good configuration for sshd. |
| 17:31.50 | karlpinc | zleap: For true paranoia you have a firewall that denies all traffic. Then, you get slightly less paranoid and allow outbound traffic to port 443 and other select ports. That way when your system is compromized it is less likely to be able to reach out to the world. |
| 17:31.50 | zleap | yeah |
| 17:31.52 | greycat | If you port-forward one TCP port from your router to your computer's ssh port, a firewall isn't going to do anything. |
| 17:31.55 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: You can tell it to only allow local connections. |
| 17:32.22 | karlpinc | zleap: But all that is overkill, most of the time. |
| 17:32.26 | zleap | jhutchins_wk: hosts_allow or specific ip addresses |
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| 17:33.05 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Specific users/groups. Then there's tcp wrappers. |
| 17:33.06 | zleap | the media and linux user groups don't alwasys help |
| 17:33.21 | zleap | the latter would say xyz is bad, but don't really explain why or what to do very well |
| 17:33.50 | zleap | always* |
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| 17:34.55 | karlpinc | jhutchins_wk: Does openssh still support tcpwrappers. I thought they were going to remove it some time ago. You can still support tcpwrappers by running sshd via xinetd if you want.... |
| 17:35.01 | ctcx | jhutchins_wk: so from your perspective I'm still just insecure? |
| 17:35.26 | greycat | It's still linked with libwrap according to ldd. |
| 17:35.36 | greycat | And TCP wrappers is ... just silly in 2018, really. |
| 17:35.44 | karlpinc | greycat: Agreed. |
| 17:35.52 | *** join/#debian boturk (~boturk@unaffiliated/boturk) |
| 17:36.13 | greycat | It was invented to protect plaintext services like telnetd and ftpd that were launched by inetd in the previous century. |
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| 17:36.49 | karlpinc | ctcx: I think jhutchins_wk thinks you're good. |
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| 17:39.06 | ctcx | jhutchins_wk: that's why I mentioned English is not my native language. AFAIU, he said "your setting grants access for a US government bank system". Also, "from his security team"? |
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| 17:39.10 | karlpinc | greycat: Looks like the openssh source package has a restore-tcp-wrappers.patch file. |
| 17:39.20 | ctcx | Is jhutchins from the CIA? |
| 17:39.23 | ctcx | Not fair! |
| 17:39.23 | akko | what's the most lightweight browser that supports JS on the debian 9 repos?? |
| 17:39.38 | karlpinc | ctcx: No, but he seems to work somewhere where there's a security team. |
| 17:40.06 | karlpinc | ctcx: He ment that if you were a bank in the U.S. you would be ok on security. |
| 17:40.20 | karlpinc | ctcx: With your current setup. |
| 17:40.26 | ctcx | ... |
| 17:40.35 | ctcx | (re-reading message...) |
| 17:40.39 | ctcx | Aahh |
| 17:40.46 | ctcx | Yes, that could also mean |
| 17:40.49 | ctcx | that |
| 17:40.52 | ctcx | ... |
| 17:40.54 | ctcx | Thanks. |
| 17:41.00 | ctcx | Thanks everyone again. |
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| 17:43.30 | karlpinc | akko: Maybe dillo? Try typing "/msg dpkg search" in irc for help on searching for packages. |
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| 17:44.08 | akko | karlpinc: idk if dillo supports JS, but I actually need a browser that can complete a captcha |
| 17:44.10 | zleap | i am sure the pi used to use dillo, it kept crashing, they use chromium now i think |
| 17:44.52 | greycat | akko: well, try it and see. |
| 17:45.08 | akko | I have it installed and I don't think it supports JS |
| 17:45.08 | greycat | I didn't think it does either, but who knows. It's been years since I last looked at it. |
| 17:46.04 | zleap | if it lacks js support it could be an explanation as to why it keeps crashing, or websites run js, and the browser doesn't do anything. |
| 17:46.10 | jelly | akko: if the captcha and the site is on public internet, the only two browsers with security support are firefox-esr and chromium |
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| 17:46.38 | akko | jelly: I just wanna post on 4chan |
| 17:46.40 | jelly | avoid using anything else on networks you don't control completely |
| 17:46.58 | petn-randall | You need captchas for that nowadays? |
| 17:47.17 | jelly | probably if you're coming from a detected vpn or tor exit point |
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| 17:47.41 | jelly | because surprise, there's lots of abuse from tor. |
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| 17:48.41 | zleap | jelly: isn't tor now (thanks to the media) synonomous with the so called 'dark web' ? |
| 17:48.48 | akko | petn-randall: yes, 4chan requires captchas to post |
| 17:49.26 | zleap | i think packt does to login, explaisn why one browser the captch is there and on another isn't |
| 17:49.51 | zleap | not that the website seems to allow for that, says solve captch, the one that is not displayed |
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| 17:57.51 | jhutchins_wk | karlpinc: You can run pretty much any service from xinetd, doesn't require any particular support within the service. |
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| 17:59.25 | jelly | zleap: do you consider 4chan to be any kind of pastel or lighter colored web? |
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| 17:59.53 | zleap | not sure isn'tit a tv channel site for channel 4 |
| 18:00.14 | greycat | Words like "cesspit" come to mind. |
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| 18:01.21 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: "dark web" has a number of different meanings. It was originally unused address space and or infrastructure. |
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| 18:01.51 | zleap | that makes sense |
| 18:02.19 | zleap | the media just use it to describe a part of the internet normal browsers can't reach, and it is full of criminal activity |
| 18:02.28 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Tor got a bad reputation for people using it to hide illegal activity, but it's really not secure enough that anybody serious would use it for that. |
| 18:03.11 | zleap | so are the media actually refering to Tor or something else |
| 18:03.18 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: Mostly it's useful for casual stuff like geo-limited sites or downloading stuff from usenet. |
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| 18:03.43 | zleap | usenet, not used that for ages |
| 18:03.49 | zleap | i always found it very useful |
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| 18:04.01 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: The media have a vague notion of a more organized conspiricy of criminal activity than actually exists. |
| 18:04.15 | zleap | yeah |
| 18:04.36 | zleap | gets rather frustrating |
| 18:04.53 | zleap | and actually does damage to reputations, Tor does sound useful for some legit stuff |
| 18:05.03 | zleap | i am guessing there are a lot of usenet server things on Tor then |
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| 18:05.37 | PinkBellyNagger | Hi guys |
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| 18:05.57 | zleap | hi |
| 18:05.58 | PinkBellyNagger | I have a quick question, after seeing tor mentioned. |
| 18:06.03 | zleap | ok |
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| 18:06.25 | zleap | PinkBellyNagger: ask away :) |
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| 18:07.09 | jhutchins_wk | zleap: I think tor is more of a networking client sort of thing, you don't put a server "on" tor. It's a anonymising routing protocol. |
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| 18:07.09 | PinkBellyNagger | So I was on the train this evening (London) and saw a guy browsing some seriously dodgy video of kids (disguised as gymnastics or some shit on his mobile - i don't think he was using tor or anything, just a standard samsung) |
| 18:07.43 | PinkBellyNagger | I memorised his face and stop, but wasn't sure what else I could do or say to the piece of shit... any ideas what one should do in this situation? |
| 18:07.56 | jhutchins_wk | PinkBellyNagger: Phone snapshot? |
| 18:08.16 | PinkBellyNagger | jhutchins_wk: Like take a photo of him & his phone? |
| 18:08.19 | zleap | PinkBellyNagger: Report to the british transport police, perhaps, they can help further, give as much info as possible, esp times, |
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| 18:09.23 | zleap | however the normal police would be better, 101, non emergency, hopefully you get to talk to someone |
| 18:09.29 | PinkBellyNagger | zleap: Do you think they'd follow up? as I guess "technically" he wasn't breaking any law |
| 18:09.39 | zleap | depends on what he was watching |
| 18:10.03 | greycat | I'd imagine they'd put him on a list of people to watch. A single report wouldn't do much, but if there have been others.... |
| 18:10.05 | zleap | PinkBellyNagger: i worked in a school it is NOT the job of staff to investigate, if we get a disclosure or see / hear / feel something is wrong we just report it |
| 18:10.08 | jhutchins_wk | PinkBellyNagger: I think you're right about that, reasonable expectations of privacy would probably keep anything from being done. |
| 18:10.38 | zleap | jhutchins_wk: however people HAVE reported things like this and it has led to prosecutions |
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| 18:10.43 | PinkBellyNagger | Pretty sure it was youtube, but seriously questionable content. I could tell it wasn't his family as 1. he didn't really look like a family man, and 2. he was white and one screen the kids were asian. |
| 18:11.32 | zleap | i think it is worth reporting, if nothing else it gets logged, your report is probably like 1 piece of a 5000 piece jigsaw, get enough pieces and you have something to go on |
| 18:11.55 | jhutchins_wk | PinkBellyNagger: I suppose if it was open enough that you were able to see it it might be considered a public nusiance. |
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| 18:12.38 | jhutchins_wk | I think without being able to identify him any action is unlikely, but why not. |
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| 18:12.49 | PinkBellyNagger | greycat, zleap, jhutchins_wk: Thanks for your input, I stared at his face to get a good imprint + clothing etc. It's my regular line, I will definitely snap a pic of the guy if I see him again. |
| 18:13.05 | zleap | jhutchins_wk: i think in the situations that have led to prosecutions,the person on the phone / computer / tablet was openly looking at child abuse or perhaps on chat and clearly talking in a way that is grooming (sexual talk) so they had something to go on |
| 18:13.33 | zleap | in fact in this case person behind took a photo, |
| 18:13.52 | PinkBellyNagger | greycat, zleap, jhutchins_wk: Thanks for your input, I stared at his face to get a good imprint + clothing etc. It's my regular line, I will definitely snap a pic of the guy if I see him again. [resending message in case automated spam filter stopped my last] |
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| 18:14.09 | zleap | remember there is NO privacy in a public place, i have a card that says t hat and says that unless someome has a warrent delting pictures off a camera or phone etc without one is assault |
| 18:14.22 | jelly | points over to #debian-offtopic |
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| 18:15.03 | zleap | not sure if a train is public or private |
| 18:15.05 | PinkBellyNagger | Finally I feel i could beat the hell out of that guy so no way he's going to be able to make me delete a photo :) |
| 18:15.46 | zleap | this is more if you take a photo of himand he deletes the photo from your site |
| 18:15.58 | zleap | but if you even touch him, he will have you for assault |
| 18:16.20 | somiaj | PinkBellyNagger: please stay on topic. I do not see a debian support issue. |
| 18:16.24 | zleap | site , sorry phone |
| 18:16.39 | zleap | this is more a safeguarding issue |
| 18:16.54 | zleap | PinkBellyNagger: yeah this is kinda off topic, i would go with the advice given, |
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| 18:17.34 | zleap | i am off to watch something on TV, backlater |
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| 18:18.12 | PinkBellyNagger | somiaj: Apologies |
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| 18:19.25 | PinkBellyNagger | On a debian note, I'm nearing a year uptime on my server: 19:19:30 up 337 days, 10:22, 2 users, load average: 3.05, 3.28, 3.27 |
| 18:19.53 | jelly | patch that thing. |
| 18:19.58 | jhutchins_wk | PinkBellyNagger: That probably means you've missed some kernel security updates. |
| 18:20.13 | greycat | Many. |
| 18:20.23 | greycat | Plus microcode, probably. |
| 18:20.25 | jelly | about 3.50 |
| 18:20.26 | PinkBellyNagger | It's not internet facing, only VMs that are rebooted frequently are internet facing |
| 18:20.57 | jelly | there are cross-VM issues. |
| 18:21.02 | PinkBellyNagger | It shall not be rebooted until > 365 days |
| 18:21.28 | jhutchins_wk | PinkBellyNagger: It's your system. |
| 18:21.33 | jelly | (and that means the hosts need patching, too) |
| 18:21.57 | PinkBellyNagger | I have monitoring systems, all is well with it and the network. |
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| 18:22.55 | jhutchins_wk | We stumbled across a Solaris system that had been up for something like seven years. |
| 18:23.36 | mason | system uptime is no longer all that exciting - service uptime is what matters. A lack of unplanned reboots also matters. |
| 18:25.22 | jhutchins_wk | "There will be unplanned downtime. There will be data loss. Our job is to minimize those factors." |
| 18:26.21 | mason | That too. |
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| 18:48.57 | DonAlex | Hey guys.. |
| 18:49.30 | DonAlex | Just got a really weird error. fc-cache keeps failing but I cannot for the life of me figure out why ? |
| 18:49.48 | somiaj | DonAlex: how does it fail? Any errors? |
| 18:50.43 | DonAlex | somiaj: running it with all the options here https://paste.debian.net/1046073/ |
| 18:51.00 | DonAlex | None of them seem fatal per se |
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| 18:53.09 | somiaj | I think it is lines like 14/16, it is failing to write the cache. Maybe due to permissions? Disk size? somethign else? |
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| 18:53.45 | DonAlex | somiaj: I don't think so.. but there are also no fonts in those folders so how can it write a cache? |
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| 18:56.55 | somiaj | that is the only line I see where something 'fails' |
| 18:57.37 | DonAlex | somiaj: https://pastebin.com/Mk85ybqC |
| 18:57.40 | somiaj | maybe you have some config file having it look in |
| 18:57.45 | somiaj | what version of debian are you running? |
| 18:57.53 | somiaj | my fc-cache has no -E option. |
| 18:57.53 | DonAlex | 9 testing |
| 18:58.00 | somiaj | 9 is not testing. |
| 18:58.04 | DonAlex | No I am runnning it from the command line |
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| 18:58.23 | somiaj | in stretch it has no -E option. |
| 18:58.27 | DonAlex | I dont know what options it uses by default but they fail too what ever they are |
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| 18:58.57 | DonAlex | fontconfig version 2.13.1 |
| 18:59.19 | DonAlex | -E, --error-on-no-fonts raise an error if no fonts in a directory |
| 18:59.27 | somiaj | anyways, when I run it here to test, I get on 'failed to write' messages, that to me is why it is failing. As to why, maybe it is a bug in testing maybe not. In general testing qeustions should be in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net |
| 18:59.43 | somiaj | but I would look at those directories that it is faling to write the cache. |
| 18:59.59 | greycat | You are not running Debian 9. Debian 9 has fontconfig 2.11.0-6.7+b1 |
| 19:00.19 | somiaj | do you think the -E errors on each directory, and that is why it is fialing, it is erroring on the directories that have no fonts. |
| 19:00.23 | somiaj | does it error out if you remove the -E |
| 19:00.41 | DonAlex | hang on |
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| 19:03.01 | DonAlex | yes.. still fails. as does the system reconfig.. This is how I noticed it. it is breaking apt update |
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| 19:03.56 | greycat | So you're testing testing, and you found a bug. Report it. If you need further help, ask the #debian-next channel over on the other IRC Network. |
| 19:04.30 | DonAlex | https://paste.debian.net/1046076/ |
| 19:04.46 | DonAlex | Which other IRC network ? |
| 19:04.51 | greycat | !debian-next |
| 19:04.51 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 19:05.13 | greycat | !testing |
| 19:05.13 | dpkg | Testing is a continuously updated release between <stable> and <unstable>, currently codenamed <buster>. See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTesting . Support in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net and ask me about <testing faq> <jessie->stretch> <testing security> <moving target> <apt-listchanges> <apt-listbugs> and <bts>. You need a sound knowledge of Debian and be prepared for a very bumpy ride. Don't use it on things that are critical! |
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| 19:05.54 | DonAlex | I am a seasoned Debian guy.. about 15 years.. but this is the first time I have come across this issue. |
| 19:06.18 | DonAlex | There is not enough debug info to tell me what is wrong. . |
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| 19:08.51 | DonAlex | Ok let me go knock the debian-next guys up.. see if it shakes anything loose. |
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| 19:10.21 | annadane | thinks to self, if Debian has 3 branches, and the main official one is basically Stable, if you use Testing, why not *say* you're using Testing from the outset... |
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| 19:11.40 | DonAlex | Because I am not sure this is a 'testing' problem.. we shall see what the debian-next guys say. |
| 19:11.42 | greycat | He's a "seasoned" Debian user who (for 15 years) didn't know that all of the IRC channels are on irc.debian.org, and (currently) did not know that Debian 9 is not testing. |
| 19:12.08 | sdk | greycat: rude |
| 19:12.44 | DonAlex | greycat: Yes you are right.. most of the time I don't need to seek out help from IRC debian so I didn't know there were seperate channels. |
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| 19:14.34 | petn-randall | greycat: There are plenty of other support options (forums, mailinglists, your local LUG) that don't involve IRC. I see no contradiction there. |
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| 19:15.54 | pkpkpk1 | hi |
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| 19:20.26 | Noldorin | my raid1 disk mountpoint is suddenly empty. what could have happened? |
| 19:20.41 | greycat | check whether it's actually mounted |
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| 19:23.02 | DonAlex | Noldorin: cat /proc/mdstat make sure there is not a missing member |
| 19:23.51 | Noldorin | DonAlex, md127 : active (auto-read-only) raid1 sda1[0] sdb1[1] |
| 19:23.55 | Noldorin | weird... wasn't auto-read-only before |
| 19:24.19 | DonAlex | Sounds like you have a fialing disk or and error. Any unclean reboots recently ? |
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| 19:24.27 | Noldorin | greycat, d'oh. that may be it. I wonder why it stopped automounting though |
| 19:24.34 | Noldorin | DonAlex, don't think so. how can I check? |
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| 19:25.38 | Noldorin | (I mean, would it be apparent from the log?) |
| 19:26.30 | DonAlex | NoCode: mdadm --detail /dev/md0 |
| 19:27.18 | DonAlex | Noldorin: mdadm --detail /dev/md0 |
| 19:27.30 | DonAlex | NoCode: Sorry. misdirect |
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| 19:28.52 | DonAlex | Noldorin: Looks like sda1 is offline.. |
| 19:29.06 | Noldorin | DonAlex, it's https://gist.github.com/d8496df9031d9457814c4f2f310207c2 (note it's md127 now, not md0 like before... odd) |
| 19:29.07 | Noldorin | oh |
| 19:29.20 | DonAlex | Either is failed or is unlugged |
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| 19:29.29 | Noldorin | let me check then. |
| 19:29.31 | Noldorin | be back in a bit |
| 19:29.34 | DonAlex | ok |
| 19:29.37 | Noldorin | and thank you, DonAlex |
| 19:29.42 | DonAlex | Noldorin: S'ok |
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| 19:44.01 | outoftime | pkpkpk1: !ask |
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| 19:46.41 | annadane | you can't invoke ! commands like that |
| 19:46.45 | annadane | !ask |
| 19:46.45 | dpkg | If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>. |
| 19:47.04 | annadane | or dpkg: tell foo about bar |
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| 19:57.07 | outoftime | dpkg: tell outoftime about ask |
| 19:57.31 | annadane | it's just a nice way to not spam the channel if there's a lot of activity |
| 19:58.09 | outoftime | annadane: yes, but it is private message... nobody reads them, even I can miss few... |
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| 19:59.00 | outoftime | annadane: where I can read all commands of dpkg? |
| 19:59.09 | annadane | !search dpkg |
| 19:59.09 | dpkg | You can search my database on the web at http://ircbots.debian.net/ or on IRC by asking me about <help listkeys> and <help-listvals>. My factoids are available at https://dpkg.donarmstrong.com/ in archives that are updated nightly and the previous 18 days are there. See also <search>. |
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| 20:18.35 | rcm888 | I have problem with hdmi sound output - fails |
| 20:19.06 | rcm888 | 4.9.0-8-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.110-3+deb9u5 (2018-09-30) x86_64 GNU/Linux |
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| 20:30.38 | pringau | rcm888, what do you mean with fails? |
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| 20:31.18 | outoftime | annadane: https://wiki.debian.org/IRC/DpkgBot "USAGE documentation" link is broken, just in case I'll be not able to send a bugreport or figure out how to send patchnote. |
| 20:31.44 | annadane | well anyone can edit the wiki, just need an account |
| 20:31.57 | greycat | you also need to know where the USAGE documentation has moved to |
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| 20:32.02 | greycat | that's the hard part |
| 20:33.02 | karlpinc | greycat: I tried looking for the "don't blindly type commands" factoid. Can't find it. |
| 20:33.34 | annadane | dontbreakdebian has a section, i dunno about dpkg factoid |
| 20:33.37 | greycat | Maybe it was overwritten. |
| 20:34.00 | outoftime | karlpinc: also you can use regexp search |
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| 20:34.58 | outoftime | rcm888: have you checked `dmesg` and syslog? |
| 20:35.37 | annadane | i'll look for dpkg documentation later when i'm not lazy |
| 20:36.02 | annadane | read: never |
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| 20:40.37 | Noldorin | hmm, the problem with my raid seems to be that the HDs have gone into sleep |
| 20:40.41 | Noldorin | they're not showing any light |
| 20:40.43 | Noldorin | (they're USB disks) |
| 20:42.22 | DonAlex | Noldorin: That is prolly because they are eco drives.. Not good for raid configurations |
| 20:42.43 | outoftime | annadane: "Account creation failed: To prevent spam, this wiki requires additional information from some people. Please contact wiki@debian.org and describe what you want to do in the wiki..." according to https://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/Contact#editors there is no way to register new account. |
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| 20:43.07 | annadane | i never got that personally |
| 20:43.11 | annadane | anyway, contact the email then |
| 20:43.17 | Noldorin | DonAlex, aha |
| 20:43.24 | Noldorin | DonAlex, you must be right... |
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| 20:43.36 | Noldorin | DonAlex, any way I can work around this? tell them not to sleep somehow? |
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| 20:43.57 | DonAlex | well only if you constantly spin them up.. |
| 20:44.13 | DonAlex | but that will affect the life of the drive |
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| 20:44.56 | outoftime | annadane: it suggests to use bugreport tool I have mentioned above |
| 20:45.04 | DonAlex | You could also reset the drive when it goes offline |
| 20:45.53 | annadane | ok, or use reportbug then |
| 20:45.57 | Noldorin | DonAlex, "reset"? |
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| 20:46.40 | outoftime | annadane: that is why I wrote you, just in case I'll fail |
| 20:47.16 | annadane | people trust me with *anything*? |
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| 20:49.05 | DonAlex | Noldorin: find the bus id of your devices then you can turn it off by echo "0" > /sys/bus/usb/devices/<USB-ID>/authorized |
| 20:49.21 | DonAlex | and Turn it on again echoing "1" |
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| 20:49.55 | jhutchins_wk | Noldorin: You might be able to set that with hdparm - but READ THE DOCS and BE VERY CAREFUL, hdparm can kill a drive. The fact that they're USB may prevent you from accessing some settings. |
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| 20:51.32 | DonAlex | If it is a usb drive then I doubt the conroller will work with hdparm |
| 20:51.56 | DonAlex | I've never had luck with that and usb drives.. |
| 20:53.44 | Noldorin | hmm |
| 20:54.37 | Noldorin | DonAlex, how do I find the bus ID? |
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| 20:56.02 | DonAlex | Noldorin: usb-devices |
| 20:57.25 | DonAlex | Noldorin: it is part of usbutils package |
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| 20:59.15 | Noldorin | DonAlex, okay. and how do I find the usb ID then? |
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| 20:59.38 | DonAlex | Noldorin: It is listed there in the usb-devices output |
| 21:00.14 | DonAlex | T: Bus=01 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=03 Cnt=03 Dev#= 14 Spd=480 MxCh= 0 |
| 21:00.44 | DonAlex | lsusb should show it too |
| 21:01.19 | Noldorin | DonAlex, okay but the dirs under /sys/.../devices look like `1-1.1.3.2:1.0` |
| 21:01.25 | Noldorin | how do I get something like that? |
| 21:01.38 | DonAlex | Bus 001 Device 015: ID 14cd:6116 Super Top M6116 SATA Bridge |
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| 21:01.57 | DonAlex | So that is bus 1 device 15 |
| 21:03.51 | Noldorin | jhutchins, sounds like I want to set the Advanced Power Management byte to a value that doesn't permit spin-down, right? |
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| 21:12.36 | DonAlex | Noldorin: check the product name. cat /sys/bus/usb/devices/*/product |
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| 21:12.43 | Noldorin | aha |
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| 21:14.05 | Noldorin | DonAlex, anyway what does changing .../authorized to 0 or 1 actually do? |
| 21:14.29 | DonAlex | connects and disconnects it from the bus. so like unplugging it and plugging it in again |
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| 21:16.13 | Noldorin | aha |
| 21:19.13 | Noldorin | DonAlex, the only way to get the USB ID is by looking at the /sys/bus/usb/devices dir and inspecting the files in it right? |
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| 21:20.36 | ctcx | Got another different issue... |
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| 21:21.18 | ctcx | When trying to send email through command line with nail/mailx, I get "550 access denied invalid helo name see rfc 2821" |
| 21:21.30 | ctcx | But the ugly thing is, it varies on the daytime! |
| 21:21.46 | ctcx | Say, at 8:00 and 16:00 mail gets sent correctly. |
| 21:21.57 | ctcx | Only at night I get the error with very exact command! |
| 21:22.04 | ctcx | And this is everyday. |
| 21:22.24 | ctcx | What would it sound for you? |
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| 21:24.34 | anothertorusr | anyone know why this wouldn't forward sound to my default interface on deb? rdesktop -g 1600x900 -a 16 -r sound:remote -r disk:2TB=/media/2TB/ -r disk:3TB=/media/3TB/ -T "IRC" 192.168.1.74 |
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| 21:26.30 | somiaj | ctcx: google seems to suggest it is with the fqdn name. Wonder if there is a resolving issue at certain times on your system. |
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| 21:31.13 | bluenemo | hi guys. I'm running debian 9 on amazon aws ec2. I want to set some custom nameservers and hence edited /etc/dhcp/dhclient.conf with "prepend domain-name-servers 172.16.0.1, 172.16.0.2;". However every now and then the /etc/resolv.conf is set back to the original amazon one. Running a `dhclient` solves this again.. What else could write my /etc/resolv.conf? |
| 21:32.14 | somiaj | bluenemo: what are you actually using to manage your network? You aren't using network-manager by chance? |
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| 21:32.47 | somiaj | bluenemo: another option is to install either resolvconf or openresolv and use that to manage your /etc/resov.conf file |
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| 21:33.17 | bluenemo | somiaj, no, amazon provides an /etc/network/interfaces.. but I just found out there is a manage-resolv-conf in amazons instance config.. I'll try that out first. that fixed it for the /etc/hosts + reboots for me.. |
| 21:33.37 | bluenemo | somiaj, I never got how resolvconf package prevents other processes from writing the /etc/resolv.cofn ? |
| 21:34.54 | somiaj | bluenemo: it turns it into a link, and doesn't allow other process to write to it directly. |
| 21:35.08 | bluenemo | ah.. that sounds nice too. |
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| 21:35.20 | somiaj | not sure on the exact details, but it is a way to keep things from writing to resov.conf, though it is in my opinoin better to track down what is actually changing the file and why |
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| 21:35.33 | bluenemo | thx somiaj , I'll do that if the way with /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg.d/01_debian_cloud.cfg manage_resolv_conf = False doesnt work |
| 21:35.43 | bluenemo | yeah i think so too |
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| 21:40.19 | bluenemo | hm ironic.. I followed this exactly: https://aws.amazon.com/premiumsupport/knowledge-center/ec2-static-dns-ubuntu-debian/ but sth is still messing up the resolv.conf.. |
| 21:40.20 | bluenemo | weird. |
| 21:40.56 | somiaj | I'm unsure, care to share the interfaces file you are using. |
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| 21:47.40 | bluenemo | somiaj, its the default: https://paste.debian.net/hidden/eed0cd2f/ |
| 21:47.46 | bluenemo | (default for debian stretch amazon instances) |
| 21:49.04 | somiaj | ahh, yea I have no clue. Seems that they are passing all the networking stuff to some /usr/local/sbin/foo helper script |
| 21:49.12 | somiaj | so you would have ot dig into the script to see what is really happening |
| 21:50.34 | somiaj | hmm, only seems like the ipv6 stuff gets passed to the helper script. Unsure about ipv6, so wonder what the script is doing there, and why it would be messing with resolv.conf |
| 21:50.50 | somiaj | also is dhclient the only dhcp client installed? Double check dhcpcd isn't installed and being used as default. |
| 21:51.39 | bluenemo | somiaj, there is this cloud-init thingy that one can configure |
| 21:51.55 | bluenemo | I already tought it to leave my /etc/hosts alone.. I hope that the same worked for /etc/resolv.conf (now after a reboot) |
| 21:52.29 | bluenemo | wasnt there a inotifywatch command that you can leave running in a tmux that tells you what process wrote to the file you're watching.. |
| 21:52.32 | somiaj | maybe someone with more knowledge of aws can help. Or as I suggested using some tool to take control of resolv.conf (I've seen setups that have made that file read only to avoid anything writting to it) |
| 21:52.47 | somiaj | yea, there are ways to track it down, I'm fuzzy on the details though. |
| 21:52.48 | bluenemo | i only know how to do that with auditd but i dont want to install and configure auditd x) wasnt there a oneliner for this.. |
| 21:53.24 | anothertorusr | chattr +i /etc/resolv.conf |
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| 21:56.21 | karlpinc | bluenemo: Just use SELinux! ;-) |
| 21:56.46 | somiaj | or resovlconf/openresolv |
| 21:56.54 | somiaj | so many solutions to this just shows how many things mess with that file |
| 21:57.32 | outoftime | bluenemo: after reboot or in runtime? |
| 21:57.42 | bluenemo | nah i dont like chattr.. i need dhcp, aws may change their resolvers... i just want to prepend mine |
| 21:58.02 | bluenemo | lol yeah (multiple solutions show how messy things are) ;) |
| 21:58.46 | outoftime | bluenemo: you have modified resolv.conf only after rebooting machine on in runtime? |
| 21:59.57 | bluenemo | outoftime, during runtime |
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| 22:00.45 | outoftime | bluenemo: so article https://aws.amazon.com/premiumsupport/knowledge-center/ec2-static-dns-ubuntu-debian/ can not help, becaues it talks about reboot |
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| 22:01.18 | bluenemo | hm. i see. I would have thought they were addressing all writes to resolv.conf |
| 22:02.05 | bluenemo | now I have # grep resolv /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg.d/01_debian_cloud.cfg -> manage_resolv_conf: false lets see if that is picked up by cloud-init |
| 22:02.14 | bluenemo | (which i think also does things during runtime) |
| 22:02.48 | outoftime | bluenemo: can you provide link to docs? |
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| 22:04.15 | bluenemo | outoftime, I found it here: # cat /etc/cloud/templates/resolv.conf.tmpl -> ## template:jinja \n # Your system has been configured with 'manage-resolv-conf' set to true. |
| 22:04.16 | bluenemo | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:04.40 | bluenemo | that "manage" sounded familiar so i thought I'd try that. it works for manage_etc_hosts |
| 22:05.22 | bluenemo | after setting that and shutting down and booting again (because of another thing i didnt reboot) it seems to work so far.. but i'll keep an eye open.. sometimes it takes a while |
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| 22:08.01 | Noldorin | hmm, is there any way to get the USB ID from a /dev/name ? |
| 22:09.26 | outoftime | bluenemo: tail -f works? |
| 22:10.14 | outoftime | Noldorin: https://wiki.debian.org/HowToIdentifyADevice/USB this? |
| 22:11.44 | Noldorin | outoftime, not quite. I want the ID of the form e.g. 1-1.1.1:1.0 |
| 22:13.00 | outoftime | Noldorin: I'm now sure what you are talking about except VID:PID pair |
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| 22:13.47 | Noldorin | outoftime, the directory names under /sys/bus/usb/devices/ are USB (bus) IDs... I want to get that, corresponding to a /dev/name (or failing that, corresponding to a VID:PID pair or equivalent) |
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| 22:16.06 | bluenemo | sry my internet went away outoftime (in case you wrote sth before me saying "after setting..") |
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| 22:17.34 | outoftime | bluenemo: just asked if tail -f shows changes in resolv.conf |
| 22:18.27 | outoftime | Noldorin: IMHO this is not debian question (OS), but linux question (kernel) |
| 22:18.38 | bluenemo | tail -f ? on syslog |
| 22:18.39 | bluenemo | ? |
| 22:18.59 | outoftime | bluenemo: no, on resolv.conf |
| 22:19.46 | bluenemo | but tail -f wont show what process writes to it, does it? |
| 22:19.56 | Noldorin | outoftime, yes, probably... |
| 22:22.54 | outoftime | Noldorin: it is about mapping stuff, you probably will not found any docs in debian wiki. Just ask about mapping in #linux channel. |
| 22:23.56 | outoftime | bluenemo: no, it will not, it just confirms the fast at realtime |
| 22:23.57 | Noldorin | okay sure, thanks |
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| 22:25.32 | outoftime | Noldorin: last question was pretty clear, you can repeat it |
| 22:27.33 | Noldorin | outoftime, already got a reply, cheers |
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| 22:31.12 | Nematocyst | I need to have both libfreetype6-dev and libfreetype6-dev:i386 at the same time. installing one removes the other and vice versa. how to correct this? (amd64 and i386 arch both added) |
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| 22:34.08 | somiaj | Nematocyst: multiarch only works for binary libaries (not the headers). You can't have both installed at the same time. |
| 22:34.33 | somiaj | Nematocyst: is your goal to build something that depends on 32bit libfreetype or something that depends on 64bit. I personally have a clean 32bit chroot and clean 64bit chroot I use for building just for htis reason. |
| 22:34.50 | Nematocyst | somiaj, yes, building wine |
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| 22:35.24 | somiaj | are you trying to build a 32bit wine on a 64bit host? |
| 22:35.34 | somiaj | Or are you trying to build a WoW64 build |
| 22:36.02 | somiaj | I build wine all the itme, but I use a clean 32bit chroot and only build a 32bit wine. I don't build a WoW64 wine. |
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| 22:36.13 | Nematocyst | somiaj, i'm not sure. i want to test a patch in gdi32. using a testcase that is a 32-bit app |
| 22:36.35 | somiaj | Nematocyst: also any reason why you are building wine, the winehq.org packages are actually quite good. Ahh you want to test a patch |
| 22:36.41 | somiaj | I would just build a 32bit vresion of wine in a 32bit chroot. |
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| 22:37.27 | somiaj | Nematocyst: http://paste.debian.net/1046103/ |
| 22:37.39 | Nematocyst | somiaj ok, thank you. spent too many hours on this toady, but i think i understand the issue fully now |
| 22:37.40 | somiaj | that is a little dated, but those are some old notes for building a .deb package from a custom wine build in a 32bit chroot |
| 22:38.00 | somiaj | I use to do that before debian and winehq started providing better wine packages. Now I just use the winehq packages |
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| 22:42.00 | annadane | question about headers, do you need to restart after you install those? i just ask because i installed nvidia-driver from backports, it previously complained about missing headers, i installed those without rebooting and then the driver installed fine |
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| 22:49.44 | annadane | also i guess i'll mention i have multiarch and installed headers-4.9.0-8-amd64 and not 4.9.0.8-all, i wonder if i should have installed the latter |
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| 22:52.05 | annadane | apt didn't *complain*, in any event |
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| 23:08.51 | annadane | well anyway i think i did it correctly |
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| 23:17.35 | rcm888 | outoftime, no sound |
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| 23:22.32 | rcm888 | no hdmi sound! |
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| 23:23.17 | simbalion | Can someone explain to me what 'pulseaudio' does besides crashing and breaking things? Is it possible to run a debian system using ALSA alone? |
| 23:25.05 | rcm888 | simbalion, https://pastebin.com/2pgPcuUY |
| 23:25.43 | simbalion | rcm888: I don't know what that is? |
| 23:25.48 | rcm888 | no hdmi sound debian 9 |
| 23:25.59 | rcm888 | 4.9.0-8-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.110-3+deb9u5 (2018-09-30) x86_64 GNU/Linux |
| 23:26.06 | rcm888 | https://pastebin.com/2pgPcuUY |
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| 23:27.10 | phogg | simbalion: it's possible, sure. A lot of things expect pulse but almost all of them work with also, too. For the rest there's apulse. |
| 23:27.18 | phogg | s/also/alsa/ |
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| 23:31.40 | rcm888 | pringau, read above |
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| 23:42.28 | simbalion | phogg: Thanks |
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| 23:44.50 | rcm888 | why dmesg shows HDMI-A-1 where as xrandr shows HDMI-A-0 ??? |
| 23:45.15 | rcm888 | whadda.... |
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