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| 00:15.36 | *** topic/#debian is Debian 10 Buster released! /msg dpkg buster; /msg dpkg stretch->buster; /msg dpkg apt suite changed | Oldstable Stretch: /msg dpkg stretch ; /msg dpkg 9.9 ; 9.9 needs dist-upgrade | Jessie: jessie-{updates,backports} removed, /msg dpkg jessie-lts | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net| chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog |
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| 00:24.15 | jak2000 | hi all |
| 00:24.38 | dvs | oh noes! |
| 00:25.36 | jak2000 | i have a server with next specs: Dell (Mec) Power Edge T140 i install debian, in a SSD hard disk... but when boot not recognize the SSD disk, not boot any advice why? |
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| 00:57.51 | srukle | jak2000, check if you can find the SSD in the BIOS. |
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| 01:00.35 | Bushmills | at that occasion, check whether software RAID is turned off |
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| 01:01.21 | Bushmills | though RAID with one SSD doesn't make an awful amount of sense |
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| 01:09.23 | jak2000 | srukle ok checking |
| 01:09.41 | jak2000 | Bushmills if turn off the Raid.... i need make the raid with linux? right? |
| 01:10.24 | ZaZaGX | rant! are you there? I broke something!! |
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| 01:27.14 | GenTooMan | It has been over 2.7 hours since he said anything so ... maybe? |
| 01:27.20 | annadane | if i want to wipe this partition and back up my home folder first... what's the best way? creating a tar is taking forever, i'd downloaded a program called snapper which can do backups, i'm just wondering about less time intensive ways |
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| 01:28.55 | GenTooMan | annadane tar can be extremely fast, you just should not put tar file onto the same drive that will cause a lot of extra seeking to occur and slow things down. |
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| 01:32.46 | GenTooMan | annadane I normally create a tar file on a USB HD actually, works fast and interleaves the IO hardware to work somewhat efficiently. If you are using BZIP2 and or compression this will not be IO bound easily in that fashion. It won't be instant though it will take a fair amount of time took me a few hours for my /home for example. |
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| 01:35.18 | luoyedaren | how to handle the light of screen ? who konws |
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| 01:36.45 | annadane | which light? screen brightness? |
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| 01:37.06 | annadane | i use the redshift package to reduce my screen brightness |
| 01:38.14 | luoyedaren | yes |
| 01:38.35 | luoyedaren | thank you I'll try |
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| 01:44.19 | fraktor | I am running Debian Testing, and for a while I've been getting this output whenever I install/remove a package: https://pastebin.com/NYvmdbke |
| 01:44.56 | dvs | !debian-next |
| 01:44.56 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 01:44.57 | fraktor | I don't know where to start diagnosing the issue, and I'm a little concerned since uninstalling my graphics drivers has historically been a pain to fix. |
| 01:45.05 | luoyedaren | annadane why not use xflux |
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| 01:45.14 | annadane | because i don't know xflux |
| 01:45.37 | luoyedaren | oo |
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| 01:52.36 | b00^ | anyone know show to make tor proxy accept incoming connections from outside the box / not just from 127.0.0.1 ? |
| 01:52.44 | b00^ | knowS |
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| 02:06.10 | karlpinc | luoyedaren: xflux does not seem to be packaged for debian, is it? |
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| 02:08.41 | karlpinc | ,v xflux |
| 02:08.42 | judd | No package named 'xflux' was found in amd64. |
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| 02:13.05 | DammitJim | do you guys know how I can fix my dns client? |
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| 02:13.29 | DammitJim | it seems when I have my laptop connected to my docking station at the office and it's on ethernet, things work just fine |
| 02:14.00 | DammitJim | but then when I get home and I use wifi, the DNS servers don't get updated and I can't connect to anything unless I edit the /etc/resolv.conf and change the dns servers manually |
| 02:14.36 | theraspberry | Network manager should update the resolv.conf for you when connecting to WIFI |
| 02:16.28 | lolcat-007 | theraspberry: how can i restart the entire network by console??? |
| 02:16.42 | DammitJim | I think I'm using connman |
| 02:16.58 | DammitJim | oh no! maybe I have both? |
| 02:18.07 | ZaZaGX | something broke! |
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| 02:23.53 | DammitJim | what manages the network configurations in buster by default? |
| 02:24.02 | DammitJim | maybe I need to disable something since I installed connman |
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| 02:26.04 | lolcat-007 | can i restart the local network with /etc/init.d/networking restart |
| 02:26.05 | lolcat-007 | ?? |
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| 02:26.19 | DammitJim | that's what I would do, lol768 |
| 02:26.22 | DammitJim | lolcat-007, |
| 02:26.26 | Peek95 | Hi |
| 02:26.45 | Peek95 | After some days reading about wayland, I know I want to use it rather then X11. However as a graphical-linux-noob, I'm a bit lost as to get it "going". How would one upgrade a minimalist Debian text installation to run KDE plasma on top of Wayland ? |
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| 02:29.55 | lolcat-007 | DammitJim: but why when i run /etc/init.d/networking stop the network still working |
| 02:29.58 | lolcat-007 | ?? |
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| 02:30.37 | CaptainDusty | DammitJim: When you remove the laptop from dock; does the wired interface go down? |
| 02:32.07 | tabemann | when I apt upgraded recently, power management started getting rather wonky |
| 02:32.17 | tabemann | I'm on testing |
| 02:32.36 | tabemann | now half of the time it refuses to properly suspend, hibernate, or shutdown |
| 02:32.47 | CaptainDusty | tabemann: I think that's a debian-next query. |
| 02:33.00 | CaptainDusty | !debian-next |
| 02:33.00 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 02:33.06 | CaptainDusty | (I only know this due to a recent similar query..) |
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| 02:34.25 | DammitJim | CaptainDusty, yes, it goes down and wifi picks up |
| 02:34.34 | DammitJim | but since the network is the same at work, there is no problem with DNS |
| 02:34.56 | CaptainDusty | DammitJim: Oh. So both interfaces share the same default gateway? |
| 02:35.26 | DammitJim | both interfaces use the same DNS servers... not sure about the same gateway |
| 02:35.52 | CaptainDusty | My bad. Bit of a silly question on my behalf, sorry. |
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| 02:39.33 | tabemann | back |
| 02:39.42 | tabemann | okay, went to #debian-next, no one is awake |
| 02:39.47 | tabemann | on oftc |
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| 02:43.11 | CaptainDusty | tabemann: That's inconvenient. It's not exactly ideal hours, I guess. |
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| 02:44.48 | tabemann | it's unfortunate that support for testing is relegated to some other server (which is likely not known to the average person), when testing isn't just something for developers to use |
| 02:45.19 | tabemann | (I personally have always used testing or unstable - after doing a fresh debian install I always switch it over to one of the two) |
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| 02:46.12 | CaptainDusty | tabemann: It's a pretty large ecosystem for people to know. |
| 02:46.20 | CaptainDusty | Testing, additionally; can be fundamentally different to release. |
| 02:47.13 | CaptainDusty | Either way; no time is convenient for me and support :P Everyone sleeps whilst I'm awake - timezones. Yay. |
| 02:48.23 | ZaZaGX | okay i fixed it! it works now!! |
| 02:48.26 | ZaZaGX | OMG |
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| 02:58.11 | moldovak_ | hi |
| 02:58.14 | ZaZaGX | hi |
| 02:58.23 | moldovak_ | how is life ? |
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| 02:59.01 | ZaZaGX | i'm okay. this isn't a chatroom. lol. its help with debian support |
| 02:59.10 | GenTooMan | anyone familiar with why Debian doesn't set the udev rules for rtl-sdr USB devices when you install the drivers? |
| 02:59.11 | moldovak_ | oooh sorry |
| 03:00.11 | strgout | howdy all! over the past few weeks i've dove into madness by attempting to learn and understand pam. My goal is getting a pam module libpam-tacplus working. |
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| 03:01.33 | strgout | I pretty much have it working with recent git package but I was trying to understand what the point of using tacplus for session or account would be. I think the same would be true of radius. My end goal is account must exist in /etc/passwd and if tacacs is down failover to shadow password |
| 03:02.14 | strgout | all of which i have working. I'm just trying to understand if there is down sites to not sending session and account over to tacacs and just doing auth. |
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| 03:03.58 | strgout | err down side to not sending .. |
| 03:05.11 | strgout | If that isn't ob sure enough maybe someone can help me with a custom .cf for sendmail 8.8.8? |
| 03:05.51 | strgout | oof.. obscure |
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| 03:11.14 | Strum | hi, i'm trying to boot the live image and i'm getting a no display found error and it's going into and endless loop |
| 03:11.21 | Strum | Dell latitude |
| 03:15.35 | dvs | !firmware image |
| 03:15.35 | dpkg | Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/amd64/iso-cd/ |
| 03:16.32 | Strum | ok i'll try that |
| 03:16.36 | Strum | thatnks |
| 03:16.38 | Strum | thanks |
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| 03:18.31 | ZaZaGX | `/exit |
| 03:18.41 | Strum | is there a more complete system image? |
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| 03:19.30 | dvs | Strum, what do you mean "more complete"? |
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| 03:19.54 | Strum | with packages installed |
| 03:20.17 | Strum | at least desktop |
| 03:20.34 | Strum | the standard images are over 2 gig |
| 03:21.12 | dvs | http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/10.0.0-live+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/ ? |
| 03:22.30 | Strum | that looks more like it cheers |
| 03:26.01 | Strum | i've been trying slackware, but with having to do so much manually and it not being easily compatible I'm looking for something i can actual get some work done with instead of spending all my time just getting things working |
| 03:26.44 | dvs | ...and that's why I like Debian |
| 03:26.59 | Strum | i tried ubuntu, but it's so dumbed down now you might as well just use windows so debian seems somewhere in between |
| 03:27.22 | dvs | t |
| 03:27.39 | Strum | i tried arch |
| 03:27.50 | dvs | The only time I would want to upgrade is when my hardware is too new for the current packages. |
| 03:27.51 | GenTooMan | Strum slack is pretty hard core actually :D |
| 03:27.51 | Strum | the rolling release is a pita, things keep breaking |
| 03:28.15 | Strum | not as hardcore as gentoo |
| 03:28.22 | Bushmills | Dell laptops are generally very Linux compatible. |
| 03:28.23 | Strum | :) |
| 03:28.25 | GenTooMan | strum I feel that pain too often, I did gentoo also. |
| 03:28.47 | Bushmills | I'm running Debian on a latitude myself, but a somewhat older model |
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| 03:29.59 | GenTooMan | GenToo biggest issue was configuring the boot to be honest, the next was the X drivers ugh. I wanted to use the system not configure it all the time. |
| 03:30.09 | Strum | yep |
| 03:30.20 | Strum | that might be fine if you just want to be a sysadmin |
| 03:30.37 | Strum | but i want a development system that i don't have to mess about with too much |
| 03:31.08 | Strum | so i can get soem develop,ent done instead of just administering the sytem |
| 03:31.09 | dvs | GenTooMan, not even the WiFi drivers? |
| 03:31.39 | GenTooMan | You can install eclipse straight from eclipse.org I found so that's not to bad. You do have to be sure to install all requirements first however. |
| 03:32.01 | GenTooMan | dvs I used ethernet only so no wifi Worries. I lucked out I guess. |
| 03:35.54 | Strum | so i have a dilemma |
| 03:36.49 | Strum | i'm having an internal battle between my inner Richard Stallman and accpetance of the inevitable closing in of the matrix on all aspects of the web |
| 03:37.33 | Strum | it's becoming almost impossible to do anything without compromising privacy and security |
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| 03:38.15 | Strum | or going to great lengths to protect those things |
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| 04:13.10 | GenTooMan | Strum well that's more of a political statement but unfortunately true. however that is something to discuss in a different channel I guess. |
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| 04:13.57 | cluelessperson | I'm having trouble with network interfaces |
| 04:14.17 | cluelessperson | systemd-networkd appears to create interfaces, but some of them seemingly get renamed. uplink.101 -> rename6 |
| 04:14.25 | cluelessperson | I can't seem to figure out what's renaming them |
| 04:14.28 | cluelessperson | can someone help? |
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| 04:15.19 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: renameN is usually used as an intermediate step when renaming interfaces |
| 04:15.37 | SerajewelKS | if an interface with that name is hanging around then an interface rename half-finished |
| 04:16.11 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS well, the syslog says it was renamed *from* uplink.101 |
| 04:16.26 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: right so something didn't like that name and came along to change it |
| 04:16.33 | cluelessperson | why |
| 04:16.37 | cluelessperson | and what is that something |
| 04:16.38 | SerajewelKS | which debian release? |
| 04:16.49 | cluelessperson | Linux aspen 4.19.0-5-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.19.37-5+deb10u1 (2019-07-19) x86_64 GNU/Linux |
| 04:16.59 | SerajewelKS | so.... buster? |
| 04:17.03 | cluelessperson | yes |
| 04:17.12 | SerajewelKS | what mechanism are you using to get the name uplink.101? |
| 04:17.45 | SerajewelKS | udev rules, systemd .link file, virtual interface definition (VPN etc)? |
| 04:18.17 | cluelessperson | in `/etc/systemd/network/` I have 3 files, essentially. |
| 04:18.22 | cluelessperson | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:18.46 | cluelessperson | 10-uplink.network which enables DHCP on it, and recognizes VLANs on it. 101-106 |
| 04:19.16 | cluelessperson | 11-uplink.netdev which creates a network interface, to represent that vlan with id 101, naming it `uplink.101` |
| 04:19.47 | SerajewelKS | so uplink.100 carries tagged vlan and uplink.10[1-6] are virtual untagged vlan interfaces on the uplink.100 physical interface? |
| 04:19.59 | cluelessperson | yes! :D |
| 04:20.10 | SerajewelKS | anything in /etc/udev/rules.d? |
| 04:20.18 | cluelessperson | all specified here: https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd.netdev.html |
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| 04:20.42 | SerajewelKS | my theory is that udev rules exist and conflict with the systemd rules, and they fight over the name |
| 04:20.45 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS absolutely nothing in `/etc/udev/rules.d/` however there are things in `/usr/lib/udev/rules.d/` |
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| 04:21.09 | SerajewelKS | i don't even have that directory!? is it standard? |
| 04:22.46 | jmcnaught | If it is a buster install then /usr/lib and /lib are the same. |
| 04:23.02 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS https://gist.github.com/cluelessperson/e2f23bfbe909ec9866d9248f8499afaa |
| 04:23.30 | SerajewelKS | jmcnaught: true. though i don't have either directory. |
| 04:23.40 | SerajewelKS | on buster or stretch. so did you create this directory cluelessperson? |
| 04:23.42 | cluelessperson | hm, Well this is a fresh install of buster. |
| 04:24.16 | cluelessperson | `/usr/udev/` and `/usr/lib/udev/` exist |
| 04:24.20 | cluelessperson | they don't appear to be symlinks? |
| 04:24.21 | SerajewelKS | nevermind. i do have them. |
| 04:24.49 | SerajewelKS | i wouldn't expect the distro-provided rules to conflict with .link files |
| 04:25.54 | SerajewelKS | it looks like having a "renameN" interface can be a symptom of having rules that give the same name to two different interfaces |
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| 04:26.38 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: can you upload everything in /etc/systemd/network somewhere? |
| 04:27.23 | SerajewelKS | BTW if you have a bunch of units that differ only by some string (such as 101 vs 102 etc) then you can use systemd template units |
| 04:27.42 | SerajewelKS | i assume that works with netdev units |
| 04:28.32 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS I dunno, but I can upload |
| 04:28.39 | SerajewelKS | so you could have uplinkvlan@.netdev and "systemctl enable uplinkvlan@101.netdev" and poof, you have the 101 interface |
| 04:28.55 | SerajewelKS | then repeat for 102-106. and they all share the same template. |
| 04:29.09 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS for now, I expect this to work, I'd prefer not to complicate it |
| 04:29.28 | SerajewelKS | right. not suggesting we do that right now, just putting that thought in the back of your mind for later. |
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| 04:30.56 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: even just uploading a tarball to S3 would be fine |
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| 04:32.11 | alkisg | grep -r . /etc/systemd/network | pastebinit => might also help |
| 04:32.55 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS https://gist.github.com/cluelessperson/592035c436ed853e28cff263abc93cfb |
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| 04:34.46 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: that omits a lot of the files. my suspicion is that the name uplink.101 is accidentally reused |
| 04:35.27 | SerajewelKS | BTW, MAC addresses are not sensitive information since they don't exist out of the network they live on :) |
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| 04:36.21 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: that suspicion will be stronger if it's always uplink.101 and uplink.103 that have this problem |
| 04:36.56 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS I avoid exposing anything identifiable, so that if you somehow used this information to gain access my information, you lack information to know where you're going. |
| 04:37.10 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS The first step to defeating security/monitoring, is to understand how it works, and where things are. |
| 04:37.26 | cluelessperson | I'll see you poking around/scanning long before you know where to go, much less identify an exploit you can use. |
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| 04:37.39 | SerajewelKS | if it's sometimes a different set of interfaces that have the problem then it's not a naming clash most likely |
| 04:37.51 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS uplink.101 is not reused. |
| 04:37.57 | cluelessperson | checks with grep |
| 04:38.37 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS https://gist.github.com/cluelessperson/e2f23bfbe909ec9866d9248f8499afaa#gistcomment-2990843 |
| 04:38.44 | cluelessperson | it's not repeated, none of them are |
| 04:39.31 | SerajewelKS | what's the syslog line where you see the renaming? |
| 04:40.06 | SerajewelKS | i wonder if the dependency of 11-uplink.netdev requires 10.uplink.network is automatically derived by systemd or if you need a Requires= line |
| 04:40.20 | SerajewelKS | maybe this could be caused by the interfaces starting in the wrong order? |
| 04:41.12 | SerajewelKS | hmm it doesn't seem to be necessary |
| 04:42.26 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS I would expect one of the dozen "tutorials" to mention that, or it to be more obvoius, but it's possible |
| 04:42.59 | SerajewelKS | can you paste the relevant syslog sections without having to redact too much? |
| 04:44.47 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS https://gist.github.com/cluelessperson/72cadaba22686f6fde90527d865d3091 |
| 04:45.26 | cluelessperson | I agree it looks like udev is doing weird shit. It's just unclear what/how/why |
| 04:45.35 | SerajewelKS | oh man that is strange |
| 04:45.44 | SerajewelKS | lines 9-14 are _really_ weird |
| 04:46.10 | SerajewelKS | where are the lines where uplink.101 is renamed to a renameN? |
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| 04:47.34 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS that appears to me, that its networkd bringing up the interfaces, and udev immediatley trying to rename them |
| 04:47.37 | SerajewelKS | but even with those lines i'm not sure i'll be too much help. udev has always been a black box to me. perhaps someone else can assist with that. |
| 04:47.54 | cluelessperson | sounds like I should maybe give up on systemd |
| 04:48.18 | cluelessperson | sounds like debian doesn't support it well, unsure |
| 04:48.43 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: cat /proc/cmdline |
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| 04:49.16 | cluelessperson | `BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-4.19.0-5-amd64 root=UUID=REDACTD ro quiet` |
| 04:49.27 | SerajewelKS | mmm so no net.ifnames=1, that's good |
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| 04:52.06 | SerajewelKS | okay. google has some information on this exact problem and the solution appears to be NamePolicy=kernel |
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| 04:52.29 | SerajewelKS | but this is for .link units |
| 04:53.13 | SerajewelKS | so i THINK a .link name will work: [Match] \n OriginalName=uplink.* \n [Link] \n NamePolicy=kernel |
| 04:53.19 | SerajewelKS | .link unit* |
| 04:53.23 | hatter_ | I am trying change my default kernel on Debian 9, changing the default kernel in /etc/default/grub is having no effect, any clues ? |
| 04:54.04 | SerajewelKS | NamePolicy=keep might also work |
| 04:54.24 | cluelessperson | I was just looking at that, will try now. :) |
| 04:55.07 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: Name= actually is a fallback if all NamePolicy= mechanisms fail |
| 04:55.37 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: an empty "NamePolicy=" could also work |
| 04:57.08 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: NamePolicy= has no effect, I believe, if the kernel option net.ifnames is 0. i think 0 is the default on debian. so AIUI this shouldn't fix anything. however, the default was 1 at one time. so i dunno. |
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| 04:58.34 | hatter_ | My reason for using an older kernel is the system hangs with an ACPI error on kernel 4.9 |
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| 04:59.05 | SerajewelKS | hatter_: after changing the default, did you run update-grub? |
| 04:59.17 | hatter_ | serajewelKS, yes |
| 04:59.32 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS hey, THATS IT! |
| 04:59.42 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: nice! it doesn't make sense but happy it's working. |
| 04:59.49 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: clearly i don't know enough about net.ifnames |
| 04:59.56 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS it appears udev respects the keep policy. |
| 05:00.02 | hatter_ | it is apparently not recognising or being overridden somewhere else /etc/default/grub |
| 05:00.09 | cluelessperson | and I overlooked that, but it's not very obvious |
| 05:00.15 | SerajewelKS | hatter_: any objection to just uninstalling the newer kernel? |
| 05:00.30 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: it's not obvious and also isn't in any of the systemd vlan tutorials i saw |
| 05:00.39 | hatter_ | @serajewelKS, that is an option, I will do that |
| 05:00.53 | alkisg | hatter_: pastebin your /etc/default/grub and your /boot/grub/grub.cfg? |
| 05:01.33 | hatter_ | alkisg, ok |
| 05:01.52 | hatter_ | serajewlKS, the problem with uninstalling hte newer kernel, an update will put it back again |
| 05:02.16 | SerajewelKS | hatter_: only if you use the metapackage that depends on the latest. you can just uninstall that metapackage. |
| 05:02.27 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS yeah, I mean I was staring at the man page for an hour, but that's a completely different section, and it didn't hit me that it was killing the connection of the other child interfaces. |
| 05:02.49 | cluelessperson | rather, it was killing the parent, so midway though starting up children interfaces, it would fail |
| 05:02.51 | SerajewelKS | hatter_: trying to remove the newer kernel should complain about the dependency problem. just accept the solution that removes the metapackage. |
| 05:04.10 | hatter_ | https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/YjZrRmtGky/ |
| 05:04.35 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: i recently diagnosed a problem that's been plauging my server for months as well... some days my server would become unresponsive overnight and take until like 2PM to start responding again |
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| 05:04.56 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: this week i finally put the pieces together that it only happens sunday AM when i have a specific VM running |
| 05:04.58 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS what was it? |
| 05:05.11 | cluelessperson | heavy disk IO |
| 05:05.12 | cluelessperson | ? |
| 05:05.35 | hatter_ | https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/6RTmJF3n7P/ |
| 05:05.40 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: combination of multiple factors: daily backups at 2AM and 4AM (different directories), RAID scrub at 12:57 AM on sunday, VM running |
| 05:06.09 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: the VM used enough memory to cause the backup process to push other stuff into swap |
| 05:06.11 | hatter_ | in the /etc/default/grub the kernel I am asking it to use is GRUB_DEFAULT=3 |
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| 05:06.22 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS aha, Disk IO indeed. I had similar with ZFS early on |
| 05:06.30 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: the box can handle that most days. but not when the disks swap is on were being scrubbed. |
| 05:06.32 | alkisg | hatter_: that's the wrong part, you should be using the text>text syntax there, since it's in a submenu |
| 05:06.33 | cluelessperson | I enabled ZFS deduplication, and it burned me hard. |
| 05:06.43 | alkisg | hatter_: update-grub should be telling you about this |
| 05:06.54 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: so i just make sure the VM is shut down saturday night :) |
| 05:07.14 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS or change the schedule |
| 05:07.19 | hatter_ | alkisg, update-grub is going through without an error |
| 05:07.26 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: yes i thought of moving the backups |
| 05:07.55 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: scrubbing usually takes many hours though and starts around midnight. i don't want the backups before 1am or after 7am. |
| 05:07.55 | alkisg | hatter_: I think it's this: GRUB_DEFAULT="gnulinux-advanced-38e2124f-d4aa-44d7-911e-f32a2f8d70f5>gnulinux-3.16.0-4-amd64-advanced-38e2124f-d4aa-44d7-911e-f32a2f8d70f5" |
| 05:08.06 | hatter_ | alkisg, are you saying I should not be using : GRUB_DEFAULT=3 ? |
| 05:08.13 | alkisg | hatter_: yes |
| 05:08.14 | hatter_ | Alkisg, OK thx I will try |
| 05:08.28 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: i could change the scrub to 6am but then i'm messing with distro-provided conf files and i try to avoid that |
| 05:08.49 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: clearly the best solution is to add 3 hours to every day, the backups can run then |
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| 05:09.46 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: what drives me nuts is that the box runs my DNS server so DNS stops working too, despite the DNS service being niced -15 |
| 05:09.48 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS you also don't necessarily have to scrub that often either. |
| 05:09.54 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: i need a way to tell the system "never ever swap anything in the DNS server" |
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| 05:10.09 | alkisg | hatter_: using numbers, it would be something like: GRUB_DEFAULT="1>3", but it's better to use identifiers than numbers |
| 05:10.20 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS You might want to limit the IO usage, slow down the scrub. Honestly, you might want to ditch RAID as well, depending. |
| 05:10.38 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: nah, RAID already saved me time when one of the disks died |
| 05:10.53 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: i have backups but it's much easier to swap a disk than to spend hours restoring |
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| 05:11.26 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: lowering the minimum scrub rate is probably the best solution, TBH |
| 05:11.48 | SerajewelKS | aside from the peak of swapping during backups, the I/O rate on the system is pretty close to zero |
| 05:12.04 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS ah, yeah, didn't know you could do that, but yes. You want to lower the scrub rate and backup rate so they only hit like 50% of disk IO |
| 05:12.28 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS I use ZFS storage, NFS, and I'm currently implementing Docker containers. |
| 05:12.29 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: backup is to different disks. there's no I/O to slow in the backup process itself. |
| 05:12.48 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: it's the backup process needing RAM that swaps other stuff to disk. which doesn't happen when the VM isn't running as there's an extra GB of RAM. |
| 05:13.57 | hatter_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:14.16 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS I'm a bit confused, I wouldn't expect backups to require much ram |
| 05:14.16 | hatter_ | alkisg: that was it, thank you |
| 05:14.22 | alkisg | You're welcome |
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| 05:15.22 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS thanks for the help btw. but yeah. |
| 05:16.47 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: i use restic which is a deduplicating and encrypted backup solution. it's a bit RAM-hungry to store the set of blob hashes in the repository in RAM to be able to quickly discard duplicate blobs. |
| 05:17.12 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: and np, i learned useful stuff about systemd-networkd today in the process. |
| 05:17.23 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS ah. I got fed up and setup a dedicated storage server with ZFS. It's certainly RAM hungry |
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| 05:18.18 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: aside from the high RAM usage, restic is pretty fantastic. the developer is working on a patch that stores the hash set on disk instead of in RAM. the trade-off is slower dedupe but less RAM usage. |
| 05:18.39 | SerajewelKS | it's basically just pre-swapping the hash set |
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| 05:18.45 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS that's what ZFS does. you can effectively snapshot it and what not |
| 05:19.10 | SerajewelKS | right. the advantage of restic for me is the backends it supports, which includes B2 and S3. |
| 05:19.37 | SerajewelKS | and you can also back up to a local directory and rsync/rclone it somewhere else. it's rsync-friendly. |
| 05:19.57 | SerajewelKS | so it's very compatible with just about any off-site storage you'd want to use. |
| 05:20.07 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS hm. I'm confused about whether or not you're describing a storage backend, or a backup tool. |
| 05:20.37 | cluelessperson | SerajewelKS ZFS is a filesystem backend, I use a tool like rclone or similar to send backups to S3 or backblaze buckets. |
| 05:21.19 | SerajewelKS | restic is just a deduplicating backup tool that supports backing up to various storage systems (local directory, B2, S3, sftp...) |
| 05:25.07 | SerajewelKS | AIUI it's kind of like borg, but doesn't require a server component |
| 05:26.40 | binaryhermit | is resistance futile? |
| 05:27.09 | SerajewelKS | if it's to me implementing a backup policy, yes |
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| 06:12.00 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: was just digging into mdadm's cron checkarray and it's not every sunday, my bad... it's the first sunday of each month. which is another reason this took so long to track down; it's very infrequent. |
| 06:12.09 | SerajewelKS | if you can guess, it happened again on the 4th :) |
| 06:12.13 | SerajewelKS | that's when i figured it out |
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| 06:20.59 | SerajewelKS | cluelessperson: the current raid minimum sync speed is 1MB/s. that seems to low to be affecting things this much. |
| 06:21.38 | SerajewelKS | though i suppose that with a decent amount of swap activity happening at a different part of the disk, the disk could easily start to thrash trying to seek back and forth |
| 06:22.10 | SerajewelKS | i've never really figured out how to effectively identify I/O bottlenecks on linux, either the metrics i'd use aren't present or i don't know how to identify/read them |
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| 06:22.20 | SerajewelKS | i'd hope that SATA NCQ would help a bit :/ |
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| 06:28.13 | SerajewelKS | i guess i'll change the min sync speed 1000 -> 100 and see if that helps prevent thrashing |
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| 06:58.09 | ZaZaGX | I'm reading about Wajig, do debian users still use that command? |
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| 07:00.13 | humpled | don't believe i've ever used it |
| 07:01.12 | ZaZaGX | i have never heard of it, even when i first used Ubuntu in the wee early stage of it too |
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| 07:03.45 | cluelessperson | ZaZaGX what is that? never heard of it |
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| 07:06.00 | ZaZaGX | i think its like sudo or something. not sure |
| 07:06.10 | becks` | hi, when connecting with ssh/putty to an appliance (not sure if it is debian...), my up key just prints an A on the console... somebody knows which setting I need to change? |
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| 07:07.01 | cluelessperson | becks` what interpreter/shell are you in? |
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| 07:07.44 | cluelessperson | becks` also, why don't you look? |
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| 07:09.01 | ayekat | "not sure if it is debian"...? Ã_ô |
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| 07:09.35 | cluelessperson | becks` do, `uname -a` |
| 07:09.43 | cluelessperson | becks` do, `uname -a` |
| 07:09.46 | becks` | cluelessperson because it is a hardened linux, nothing bash-like |
| 07:09.56 | becks` | Invalid command "uname" :) |
| 07:10.07 | cluelessperson | becks` "hardened" linux? you mean it's a minimal appliance? |
| 07:10.33 | becks` | cluelessperson yes |
| 07:10.59 | cluelessperson | becks` I don't believe hardening is a thing. |
| 07:11.18 | cluelessperson | but yeah, it's probably a minimal appliance, you can probably run sh and get whatever version it's running |
| 07:11.28 | cluelessperson | becks` what's the appliance? |
| 07:11.44 | becks` | it's a session border controller from audiocodes |
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| 07:11.54 | humpled | my up arrow generates ^[[A just on an un-logged-in tty |
| 07:11.57 | ayekat | if it's just /bin/sh, it's possible that it doesn't support arrow keys anyway, regardless of "is the terminfo missing or not" |
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| 07:12.22 | becks` | okay, thank you :) |
| 07:12.51 | becks` | I'm just getting A B C and D when playing with the arrow keys ;D |
| 07:13.56 | humpled | what do you expect them to do though? |
| 07:14.49 | becks` | I'd at least expect the up key to repeat the last command |
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| 07:15.29 | humpled | tried ctrl-p ? |
| 07:15.48 | ayekat | given how extraordinarily minimalistic your system there appears to be, I doubt the shell has any advanced capabilities like convenient command line editing |
| 07:16.01 | becks` | woah this works! thanks :D how did you figure out? |
| 07:16.39 | ayekat | oh - if ctrl-p works, it appears to have readline (or readline-like) capabilities - so it might indeed be a terminfo issue :-) |
| 07:16.52 | ayekat | becks`: what does `echo $0` say? |
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| 07:17.04 | becks` | Invalid command "echo" |
| 07:17.12 | ayekat | ... |
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| 07:17.34 | humpled | path... |
| 07:17.37 | ayekat | that's a very weird shell you've got there |
| 07:18.17 | becks` | heh, they only want me to execute their own commands :P |
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| 07:24.36 | SerajewelKS | ZaZaGX: i believe that the "apt" command line tool more or less shares the goal of wajig: unify all of the various apt-* tools into a single command |
| 07:25.29 | ZaZaGX | ohh |
| 07:25.38 | ZaZaGX | yeah i meant to say that :P |
| 07:26.12 | SerajewelKS | becks`: i've seen lots of appliances that provide their own shells |
| 07:26.45 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: that's about right. apt is meant to be a user-friendly frontend for the most common functions |
| 07:26.46 | SerajewelKS | becks`: HP's iLO environment, for example |
| 07:27.39 | BCMM | of note, it explicitly does not aim to maintain a stable interface for scripting |
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| 07:49.12 | ZaZaGX | even since Google gave me the prototype chromebook. i felt in love with the chromebook. but i got dumb with linux |
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| 07:52.27 | tarzeau | ZaZaGX: how's that? for free? |
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| 07:55.50 | ZaZaGX | yes, the laptop was called a cr-48 |
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| 07:56.24 | ZaZaGX | but using a chromebook made me dumb with linux. i didn't play with the terminal. |
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| 08:06.37 | Strum | ok so i tried the non free 3rd party image and am getting the same gtk cannot open display error |
| 08:07.02 | alkisg | Strum: can you summarize the issue? |
| 08:07.17 | Strum | nm |
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| 08:07.40 | Strum | didn't work with defult but seems to be booting if i select it from the menu |
| 08:07.57 | Strum | hmmm |
| 08:08.01 | Strum | i spoke too soon |
| 08:08.12 | Strum | here we go |
| 08:08.14 | Strum | desktop up |
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| 08:12.46 | Haohmaru | is amuzed about the errors that get printed sometimes during systemd, and then poof - it goes away and you get yer login manager like nothing happened |
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| 08:31.54 | ZaZaGX | hello nurse |
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| 08:41.47 | newtodeb | Hey Guys, i openend a question at the unix stackexchange and wanted to ask if some of you expierenced the same or a similar problem maybe you can help me %n https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/533939/getting-following-error-message-after-using-su-user-mesg-cannot-open-dev |
| 08:43.05 | netcrash | Hello, Does anyone know what driver should be used for proxmox scsi in Debian 10? |
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| 08:54.38 | toruvinn | newtodeb, you shouldnt touch /dev/pts whatever permissions. the "problem" here seems to be that you have `mesg' somewhere in your shell's profile. |
| 08:54.44 | toruvinn | newtodeb, do yu need that? |
| 08:54.54 | newtodeb | exit |
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| 08:55.59 | newtodeb | <PROTECTED> |
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| 08:56.50 | fireba11 | netcrash: scsi in debian10? ambitious :-D |
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| 08:57.24 | toruvinn | newtodeb, right, so probably as the USER you su to you have stuff in your .bash_profile or something like this, im not sure what shell you use. probably bash, though. |
| 08:57.48 | toruvinn | newtodeb, if you dont have anything special in your shell profile files, you can just copy the default from /etc/skel |
| 08:58.32 | newtodeb | toruvinn thank you that drove me kinda crazy just commented out the mesg line thank you for that fast advise.... was beginner mistake ^^ |
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| 09:01.35 | newtodeb | oh thanks for the advise on /etc/skel will do that next time |
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| 09:26.26 | humpled | wait does /etc/skel stuff really go in /root? |
| 09:30.03 | ayekat | /etc/skel stuff is copied to a newly created user's home by tools like useradd - but the root user is never "created" in a conventional way |
| 09:31.01 | humpled | i can't tell which one newtodeb was talking about |
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| 09:33.49 | ayekat | it's hard to reason about anything there, since they deleted the original question - how kind of them -.- |
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| 09:37.41 | jeanre | does the installer allow you to choose the DE? |
| 09:37.44 | jeanre | or WM? |
| 09:38.28 | alkisg | Heh, funny, `debootstrap jessie jessie` actually creates a different /root/.profile than /etc/skel/.profile; same for .bashrc; while /root/.bash_logout doesn't exit |
| 09:38.28 | ayekat | jeanre: afaik it proposes at least some DEs, yes |
| 09:38.48 | jeanre | ok because I would like to not use gnome / kde, i3 maybe |
| 09:38.52 | jeanre | not sure yet :P |
| 09:39.05 | jeanre | although gnome is seriously awesome |
| 09:39.15 | ayekat | jeanre: you can always install without any DE/WM and install the tools of your choice afterwards |
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| 09:39.34 | jeanre | ayekat: what are you running |
| 09:40.02 | ayekat | jeanre: dwm... in some sense |
| 09:40.12 | jeanre | I gave fedora a spin, I hate DNF |
| 09:41.36 | jeanre | and stupid flatpaks |
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| 09:42.32 | jeanre | does debian use flatpaks? |
| 09:42.36 | jeanre | or snaps? |
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| 09:43.33 | BCMM | jeanre: you *can* use them on debian. but debian isn't packaging stuff like that instead of as .debs or anything. |
| 09:43.34 | ayekat | distributions use distribution packages - but I believe you can install appimage/snapd/flatpak on most distributions if you like that sort of thing |
| 09:44.20 | jeanre | yeah Fedora tries to force you |
| 09:44.56 | ayekat | I've never used fedora, but I highly doubt that |
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| 09:45.24 | jeanre | I dont mean its the only way |
| 09:45.37 | jeanre | but for certain apps, it would use flatpak |
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| 09:46.54 | ayekat | ah well, if you use tools that refer to software as "apps", I'm not surprised that they use upstream packages :-) |
| 09:47.11 | jeanre | for instance vs code |
| 09:47.20 | jeanre | its only a flatpak |
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| 09:47.29 | jeanre | unless you jump through hoops |
| 09:47.46 | ayekat | but if you stick to your distro package manager, you can usually entirely ignore that madness - but really, this is also a bit off-topic IMHO |
| 09:48.16 | jeanre | my apologies |
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| 09:48.59 | jeanre | now my choice is testing or stable |
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| 10:12.30 | lope | how can I install pinta on buster? |
| 10:13.30 | jelly | looks at non-empty output of "apt-cache show code" and wonders about <jeanre> for instance vs code <jeanre> its only a flatpak |
| 10:14.08 | humpled | ,v pinta |
| 10:14.09 | judd | Package: pinta on amd64 -- jessie: 1.3-3; sid: 1.6-2; stretch: 1.6-2 |
| 10:14.24 | jelly | !why is pinta not in testing |
| 10:14.25 | dpkg | pinta is not in testing for the reasons listed in https://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=pinta |
| 10:16.10 | jelly | the package seems to suffer from inattentive maintainer, there's a "grave" bug that seems unreproducible but noone lowered the severity |
| 10:16.38 | lope | I tried adding the pinta PPA, but apt update says: Not Found [IP: 91.189.95.83 80] https://pinta-project.com/pintaproject/pinta/howto/installing-pinta |
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| 10:16.56 | jelly | PPA repos are not for debian |
| 10:17.25 | diogenes_ | don't use PPAs on debian. |
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| 10:17.38 | lope | are PPA's a ubuntu only thing? |
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| 10:17.50 | lope | Then why does ubuntu feature apt add repository? |
| 10:18.14 | jelly | why does Debian feature it? Because it's part of apt now. |
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| 10:18.46 | lope | does debian explicitly not support PPA? |
| 10:18.53 | jelly | you could try adding back repos for stretch, apt-get update, and try to install from there. |
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| 10:19.17 | lope | jelly, I've never heard of a back repo |
| 10:19.23 | lope | is it similar to adding backports? |
| 10:19.44 | jelly | "add back" |
| 10:19.54 | jelly | not "back repo" |
| 10:20.40 | lope | I'm on buster |
| 10:20.47 | jelly | yes, you said that. |
| 10:21.00 | lope | I installed buster from scratch, so stretch repos have never been on my system |
| 10:21.24 | jelly | you could try adding a repo from the older stretch release temporarily |
| 10:21.34 | lope | oh, I see |
| 10:21.40 | lope | I'd rather just try get the tarball |
| 10:21.54 | lope | if I'm not going to get updates I'd rather not involve apt |
| 10:22.36 | jelly | there's not much activity for that package, same version in stretch (oldstable) and sid (unstable) |
| 10:22.42 | jelly | updates not likely |
| 10:23.22 | jelly | if upstream is providing a build newer than 2016 1.6-2 then sure, use that |
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| 10:29.40 | lope | Hmm, yeah the tarball was just source, I'd rather not compile it, will try your stretch suggestion |
| 10:29.49 | lope | why do I have all these blah.list.save in /etc/apt/sources.list.d |
| 10:29.56 | lope | Can I delete all the .save files? |
| 10:30.06 | jelly | yes |
| 10:30.23 | lope | thanls |
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| 10:32.06 | lope | I literally just duplicated my debian buster line in sources.list as stretch (so I have both) then installed pinta |
| 10:32.13 | lope | pinta is working |
| 10:32.18 | lope | now removing stretch |
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| 10:32.34 | lope | wow, what a hack. |
| 10:32.37 | lope | Thanks |
| 10:33.16 | jelly | it's reasonably safe to add _older_ debian release to install just one thing |
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| 10:33.33 | lope | I see, thanks, never knew that |
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| 10:33.41 | jelly | it's horribly unsafe to add a _newer_ branch however |
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| 10:33.56 | lope | Yeah I've done that once before and messed up my system :) |
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| 10:36.39 | dusty128 | Hi, I have troubles with the startup of a systemd service. When I start it manyually after boot, it works, but it fails starting during boot. Any clue how to fix this / find out the problem? |
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| 10:37.50 | ayekat | dusty128: the journal might contain useful information |
| 10:38.30 | ayekat | `journalctl -u myweirdunit.service` for instance |
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| 10:42.25 | dusty128 | ayekat: Thanks for help, yes, if I start it manually, "journalctl -u " tells me that it is started. But during boot, it there is no log entry at all. It seems almost as if it does not even try to start. |
| 10:42.48 | ayekat | dusty128: did you actually enable the service? |
| 10:43.35 | dusty128 | ayekat: I did a "systemctl enable dirsrv@mail" - is there any way to check if it is really enabled? |
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| 10:44.18 | dusty128 | (It seems I need to update myself now, I'm still in the SYSV-init way of thinking)... |
| 10:45.20 | ayekat | `systemctl status dirsrv@mail` should state whether it's enabled or not |
| 10:45.36 | ayekat | (on the second line, "Loaded: ...") |
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| 10:45.56 | g0zzy | Grrr. I have "goose ALL=(ALL) NOPASSWD:ALL" in sudoers and sudo is STILL asking for a password. Is that not quite right syntactically? |
| 10:46.19 | dusty128 | ayekat: The output is as follows: "dirsrv@mail.service - 389 Directory Server mail. |
| 10:46.19 | dusty128 | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:46.19 | dusty128 | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:46.19 | dusty128 | " |
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| 10:46.52 | ayekat | g0zzy: if it's syntactically incorrect, visudo should've complained, but... I would still try to add a space after the colon there |
| 10:47.13 | g0zzy | Ah OK. Shall try |
| 10:47.29 | dusty128 | ayekat: I wonder if there are any dependencies the service is waiting for? If I start it manually, it tells me "systemd[1]: Starting 389 Directory Server mail...." |
| 10:47.56 | Habbie | g0zzy, can you show the full sudoers file? |
| 10:48.41 | ayekat | dusty128: what's the output of `systemctl cat dirsrv@.service`? (to a paste service, not directly into the IRC chat) |
| 10:48.51 | g0zzy | Actually that did it ayekat. Thanks |
| 10:49.09 | ayekat | weird that visudo did not complain... |
| 10:49.12 | ayekat | tries it out himself |
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| 10:50.10 | dusty128 | ayekat: The output looks like the following: https://pastebin.com/tRjPZLKg |
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| 10:50.33 | g0zzy | notes that on another box, the lack of space is not a problem (??) |
| 10:50.50 | g0zzy | (both buster) |
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| 10:53.45 | ayekat | "WantedBy=dirsrv.target" |
| 10:54.06 | ayekat | dusty128: what's the output of `systemctl list-dependencies --reverse dirsrv.target`? |
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| 10:54.40 | dusty128 | ayekat: The output is just "dirsrv.target" |
| 10:55.58 | ayekat | hmm... so it appears that nothing actually requires dirsrv.target, and thus the dirsrv@.service is never started at system startup |
| 10:56.54 | ayekat | dusty128: I'm not familiar with dirsrv, but is it possible that it's meant to be started together with some other services? |
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| 10:57.19 | dusty128 | ayekat: O.k., strange. (Btw. the problem applies to a debian 9 with Kolab 16 / a mail service). I did an apt-get upgrade yesterday and since then it is broken. |
| 10:57.19 | ayekat | maybe you might need to actually start another service that then pulls in the dirsrv service as a dependency (through the dirsrv.target) |
| 10:58.48 | ayekat | alternatively (but this is more of a hack), you could override the WantedBy= option, and set WantedBy=multi-user.target or something else that you know will be reached at system startup |
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| 10:58.54 | ayekat | but again, that's not really a clean solution |
| 10:59.06 | dusty128 | ayekat: Well, unfortunately I'm also not familiar with this, the system has another service called "dirserv-admin": https://pastebin.com/Nv6ZKYdV |
| 10:59.26 | ayekat | dusty128: OH!, yeah, that one is probably meant to be enabled |
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| 11:00.01 | ayekat | it states After=[â¦] dirsrv.target, so that will also start everything that dirsrv.target depends on (including your dirsrv@ service) |
| 11:00.13 | ayekat | it also states WantedBy=multi-user.target |
| 11:00.22 | dusty128 | ayekat: Oh my, yes, this one is disabled! |
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| 11:01.42 | centrix | I have a system that stabilized at cca 550MB used ram and about 3.5GB cached RAM. I noticed 2.5MB of RAM borrowed from swap. I wonder why there's swap being used while there is 3.5GB cached? |
| 11:02.09 | centrix | vm.swappiness=1 may help? |
| 11:03.23 | jelly | centrix, Linux kernel does that, just ignore it and don't touch vm.swappiness for 3 MB |
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| 11:04.18 | jelly | the values you described are not any kind of a problem |
| 11:04.25 | centrix | jelly, This is a test machine. vp.swappiness=60 => 40% of RAM left, go swap. Correct? |
| 11:04.30 | jelly | no |
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| 11:05.02 | centrix | The opposite? |
| 11:05.03 | jelly | it's a heuristic roughly affecting how aggressively kernel is going to page out things when needed |
| 11:05.18 | jelly | there's no direct correlation to any specific amount |
| 11:05.36 | Haohmaru | aggressive kernel, down boy, DOWN |
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| 11:05.57 | centrix | OK. However the higher the number the more often swap will be used. |
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| 11:06.07 | liquid-silence | oh man it feels good being back in debian land |
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| 11:06.25 | jelly | centrix, in general, yes, but 3 MB is too little for you to have to care |
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| 11:06.59 | jelly | (my personal opinion is vm.swappiness=60 _is_ too aggressive and 10 or 5 yields a bit more sanity on workstations and some server loads) |
| 11:07.28 | jelly | (but if you see a few MB swapped, and now a few GB, you don't have to care about it at all) |
| 11:07.32 | jelly | and not* |
| 11:08.34 | centrix | jelly, I agree. I set it up to 5. But the swap is used by winbindd which takes care of authenticating users. Generally I want winbind to be as fast as it can go. |
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| 11:08.56 | centrix | No swapping if possible. |
| 11:10.48 | jelly | active swapping is problematic. Idle pages on swap that go unused will not affect speed of active page access in the same process |
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| 11:11.41 | doom_ster | heya all |
| 11:11.44 | netcrash | Hello, Does anyone here use clonezilla has a server for image distribution? |
| 11:11.47 | jelly | centrix, a couple MB on swap won't hurt your precious daemon's speed |
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| 11:11.59 | centrix | jelly, I understand. Thanks :) |
| 11:13.10 | centrix | I comparred to the same config I had on CentOS 7. I had about 50MB swapped by squid and winbind. |
| 11:13.59 | centrix | I suppose 50MB may still be bearable, but should draw attention. Just for sure. |
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| 11:14.11 | dusty128 | ayekat: Ok, I also had to enable "dirsrv.target" - now it starts. Thanks a lot for help! |
| 11:14.36 | ayekat | dusty128: you're welcome ^^ |
| 11:15.05 | jelly | centrix, 50MB is also nothing to worry about. Set up monitoring of _active_ swapping if you want to care about something that actually affects performance |
| 11:15.57 | centrix | OK. |
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| 11:55.12 | GenTooMan | looks like Epson has drivers for Linux however they seem only for ubuntu and require lsb >= 3.2 the package however is actually lsb-base (linux standard base - base?) in buster suggestions thoughts (give up?) |
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| 11:56.35 | Bushmills | centric, "RAM left" may indicate that your concept of RAM used is a tad flawed |
| 11:57.03 | Bushmills | question: why should it be good if there's any RAM "left"? |
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| 11:58.27 | jelly | GenTooMan, what does dpkg --info blah.deb actually say? |
| 11:58.29 | jelly | !paste |
| 11:58.29 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
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| 12:02.28 | GenTooMan | jelly good morning (for me) and http://paste.debian.net/1094589/ |
| 12:02.41 | Guest94815 | good morning, newbie here, how do i connect with wify , debian 9 and icewm window manager... |
| 12:03.05 | Bushmills | automatically, no interaction? |
| 12:03.39 | humpled | i also would like to connect with a wifey |
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| 12:06.33 | macondo123 | Bushmills, thank you |
| 12:06.47 | Bushmills | macondo123: what for? |
| 12:06.51 | GenTooMan | jelly matching package (with different name) http://paste.debian.net/1094590/ |
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| 12:07.31 | jelly | GenTooMan, hard to say why the Depends: lsb (>= 3.2) without looking at installation scripts |
| 12:08.26 | macondo123 | Bushmills, I see no icons, i have never used a laptop, i thought i had to click some icons, newbie you know... |
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| 12:09.49 | jelly | ,v lsb |
| 12:09.50 | judd | Package: lsb on amd64 -- jessie: 4.1+Debian13+nmu1 |
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| 12:10.04 | jelly | ,v lsb-printing |
| 12:10.06 | judd | Package: lsb-printing on amd64 -- jessie: 4.1+Debian13+nmu1 |
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| 12:11.07 | Bushmills | sometimes called "cavemen interface" for pointing at pictures and grunt |
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| 12:15.58 | GenTooMan | jelly looks like the package was made on an older version of Ubuntu as an RPM then it was made into a package. |
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| 12:18.43 | ggjjkb | hi |
| 12:18.47 | ggjjkb | how to is possible to install Linux on old tablet? |
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| 12:19.43 | jelly | ggjjkb, answer varies from "not easily" to "not possible at all" |
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| 12:20.31 | ggjjkb | you any tips about? |
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| 12:23.54 | Bushmills | Android tablet? |
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| 12:25.49 | Bushmills | Is there anything scary about me that peope tend to leave the channel once I asked them anything? |
| 12:26.49 | Bushmills | bad breath, maybe? |
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| 12:27.16 | Haohmaru | bad aroma from the bushes |
| 12:27.44 | humpled | what lurks behind those eyebrows, i don't want to stay and find out |
| 12:28.10 | jelly | Bushmills, too afraid to comment on that |
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| 12:28.18 | Haohmaru | i don't wanna step into a suspicious bush |
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| 12:35.04 | Bushmills | How do you people feel about Microsoft involvement with github? Is that reason for you to consider migration, are you just doing business as usual, or what else actions are you prompted into because of that? |
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| 12:36.05 | whislock | Doesn't factor into anything at all for me. |
| 12:36.24 | BCMM | Bushmills: github was a proprietary, centralised platform from the start |
| 12:36.26 | whislock | I don't have any particular animus towards Microsoft. |
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| 12:36.50 | BCMM | Bushmills: the microsoft purchase doesn't affect it's suitability for serious open-source projects, because it was already unsuitable. |
| 12:37.27 | whislock | That's a bit of a stretch, but to each their own. |
| 12:38.03 | tarzeau | i like github web interface best. i dislike microsoft, but keep using github.com |
| 12:38.06 | fireba11 | hm ... i had to downgrade ghostcript on buster with the older version ... installed manually with dpkg -i, now i'm trying to use apt-mark hold to prevent the package from getting updated again but apt list --upgradeable still shows it? |
| 12:38.26 | BCMM | whislock: the thing is, it's not just a git repo. if it was just a git repo, it could be easily replaced |
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| 12:38.39 | whislock | Sure it is. |
| 12:38.40 | fireba11 | ah, never mind apt upgrade doesn't actually upgrade it |
| 12:38.56 | whislock | I have quite easily and repeatedly migrated entire repos to other platforms as needed and lost nothing. |
| 12:39.01 | BCMM | whislock: but a project that has integrated github's issue tracking etc. in to it's workflow is a project that is now locked-in to a proprietary platform |
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| 12:39.28 | whislock | Gitlab. |
| 12:39.38 | whislock | Doesn't seem very locked in to me. |
| 12:40.00 | BCMM | was gonna say, there's a good reason major projects like kde, gnome, debian, etc. go for self-hosted gitlab instances instead |
| 12:40.15 | Bushmills | actually a reason for my question. After creating gitlab account, I am now a bit undecided how to proceed |
| 12:40.41 | whislock | As long as I can export an entire GitHub project, issues and all, into another platform any time for any reason, "locked in" is an extremely inaccurate descriptor. |
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| 12:41.12 | whislock | So, too, is the statement that GitHub is by its own nature unsuitable for open source projects. |
| 12:41.21 | whislock | Maybe by your standards, but that's you. |
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| 12:44.53 | centrix | My boxes root has set 16385 open files. Can I set double for my squid process without troubles? |
| 12:45.31 | zodd_ | Have the TTYs changed with the release of Buster? (it used to be 1-4 console, 7 X) |
| 12:47.39 | humpled | they have changed in so far as they are not created until they are switched too, but the numbering is the same |
| 12:47.47 | humpled | switched to* |
| 12:47.50 | Bushmills | doesn't seem so. login.defs still comments CONSOLE out, apparently defaulting to console:tty01:tty02:tty03:tty04 |
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| 12:49.54 | jelly | centrix, systemctl edit whatever-service-for-squid, put in something like [Service], new line, LimitNOFILE=55555, new line |
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| 12:52.35 | jelly | centrix, man systemd.service, man systemd.exec |
| 12:53.31 | centrix | jelly, I considered it as one way. I used max_filedescriptors parameter of squid.conf. I think I should also consider the file-max (lsof|wc -l) and consider the different to se a reasonable max. |
| 12:54.03 | centrix | the difference to see |
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| 12:54.19 | centrix | file-max = fs.file-max |
| 12:55.18 | jelly | fs.file-max is the global amount for the whole system, and is typically set reasonably large by default (millions) |
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| 13:03.34 | Akuw | hi, i need some help with a Proliant server boot process |
| 13:06.27 | jelly | Akuw, there are ten generations of proliant servers, state actual model and debian version you're trying to install or boot |
| 13:07.17 | Akuw | Proliant D835 G7 Debian 9 |
| 13:08.16 | jelly | Akuw, there's no such thing as Proliant D835 G7 |
| 13:08.24 | Akuw | the problem is i can install but when server boot is booting from another place, but i dont know from where, because i delete all partitions, it has 1 small disk and one array |
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| 13:08.31 | jelly | Did you mean: Proliant DL385 G7 |
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| 13:09.05 | Akuw | DL385 sorry |
| 13:09.32 | Akuw | when boot it load some kind of grub |
| 13:09.48 | Akuw | but i dont know from where is loading that |
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| 13:10.09 | jelly | can you boot a liveusb/livecd and show the output of "lsblk"? |
| 13:10.10 | Akuw | i checked BIOS and manual and cant find anything that show me |
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| 13:10.22 | Akuw | yes i installed linux from usb |
| 13:10.29 | jelly | is there internal usb or SD card maybe? |
| 13:10.47 | jelly | I have no experience with AMD-based models |
| 13:12.08 | L4j140 | #netfilter |
| 13:13.34 | Bushmills | Dell servers feature "soft RAID" - heard before that enabled and active soft RAID resulted in boot problems |
| 13:14.09 | Bushmills | disabling soft RAID appears to help |
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| 13:15.16 | Akuw | dont know |
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| 13:17.24 | Akuw | in bios is an option Removable Flash Media Boot Sequence |
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| 13:19.18 | Bushmills | (for using soft RAID with Linux, consider to use linux multiple devices support. Install mdadm - I think the installer offers installation to md volume already) - Removable flash as in booting from usb stick / thumb drive. Should be irrelevant as long no usb drive inserted. |
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| 13:23.07 | jelly | Akuw, did you answer the question about internal usb/sd, I was away |
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| 13:24.35 | Akuw | i have to see manual |
| 13:24.41 | Akuw | to see where is that located |
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| 13:30.37 | humpled | time was... |
| 13:31.00 | jelly | Akuw, just open the thing and look at the chart on the back side of the cover |
| 13:31.43 | jelly | I'm not even sure G7 had those, G8 did |
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| 13:33.49 | Akuw | i found a flash internal |
| 13:33.55 | Akuw | i will remove to check |
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| 13:38.52 | Akuw | i took SD out and can boot |
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| 13:38.56 | Akuw | was that SD |
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| 13:39.49 | dvs | ... |
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| 13:40.35 | jelly | !win Akuw |
| 13:40.35 | dpkg | Congratulations, Akuw! You have won a one way ticket to Gaza! |
| 13:40.43 | dvs | D'oh! |
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| 13:41.15 | jelly | pick your side... carefully, over there. |
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| 13:41.59 | Akuw | hehehehehe |
| 13:42.03 | Akuw | Gaza? |
| 13:42.09 | Akuw | are you kidding me |
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| 13:45.34 | Akuw | thanks |
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| 13:46.42 | jelly | I'm pretty sure there's a way to make usb/sd lesser priority than smartarray but explaining that over irc, on a bios I've never seen in real life would be time consuming |
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| 13:55.42 | g0zzy | Can anyone think of a way to test unattended-upgrades such that they run on a package 'update'? |
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| 14:07.49 | newtodeb | if a screen session is running on 2 different users (which the root is noone off) can i attach to them from the logged in root user? |
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| 14:08.45 | nifker | Where can I setup the automatic start of Pulseaudio, systemwide? |
| 14:08.46 | greycat | A screen session is running as *one* user. Nothing runs as two users. Not even screen. |
| 14:09.15 | newtodeb | so if the screen session is running on User X i cant attach to it from user Y? |
| 14:09.31 | greycat | Root can chameleon itself as anyone else. Just drop privileges down to the target user account, then run screen -x (or whatever) to attach to that user's screen session. |
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| 14:10.08 | jelly | the screen process probably needs w permissions to the tty |
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| 14:10.39 | newtodeb | just asking because im having trouble executing a screen script to function on my systemuser and my root user |
| 14:10.48 | jelly | so then you have to change permissions and/or ownership to a tty that has processes from different users attached |
| 14:11.04 | greycat | The sockets that you use to actually *talk to* the screen session are in /run/screen/S-username/ and they are strictly permissioned. |
| 14:11.08 | greycat | srwx------ 1 wooledg voice 0 Jul 23 08:19 1198.pts-9.wooledg |
| 14:11.26 | jelly | did your e dangle off |
| 14:11.45 | greycat | First 6 letters of lastname, first letter of firstname, digits to disambiguate. |
| 14:12.06 | jelly | so it was all an accident |
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| 14:12.10 | greycat | drwx------ 2 wooledg voice 80 Jul 23 08:19 /run/screen/S-wooledg/ |
| 14:12.55 | greycat | So if root wants to attach to my screen session(s), it can -- just needs to point to the right places, and the *easiest* way to do that is for root to "become" me first. |
| 14:13.15 | newtodeb | so i just need to add the usergroup from my systemuser? |
| 14:13.16 | greycat | Nobody else is going to have the permissions to do it. |
| 14:13.26 | greycat | newtodeb: what are you *talking* about |
| 14:13.56 | greycat | If you logged in as newt and ran "screen", then you have a screen session, owned by, and running as, user newt. |
| 14:14.32 | greycat | If root wants to connect to that, you login as root, then you do something like "sudo -u newt -s", and then you have a shell running as user newt. That shell will have the privileges and the environment variables and so on, to connect to newt's screen sessions. |
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| 14:15.48 | newtodeb | ok understand it now but that means i just can su to my user where the screen is running |
| 14:15.54 | newtodeb | thanks for the clarification |
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| 14:17.46 | Strum | ok so the password i gave the install program won't log me in when it boots up |
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| 14:18.23 | greycat | Root password, or regular user password? Be aware that if you installed a desktop environment and are using a graphical login ("display manager"), root is usually not allowed to run desktop stuff. |
| 14:18.31 | Strum | regular user |
| 14:18.46 | greycat | Check the obvious stuff (typos, caps lock is on, etc.). |
| 14:18.50 | Strum | yep |
| 14:19.00 | Strum | doesn't say wrong password |
| 14:19.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1556] by debhelper |
| 14:19.12 | Strum | screen goes blank and the login box comes up again |
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| 14:19.26 | greycat | Sounds like the desktop, or X, is crashing. Not a login problem. |
| 14:19.35 | greycat | (or Wayland) |
| 14:20.18 | Strum | so what do you do to fix it? |
| 14:20.47 | Mathisen | what would be the smartest way to purge all packets from a 3.rd party repo when you forgot exactly what is installed from that repo |
| 14:20.55 | newtodeb | can someone look over the terrarid script and tell me why it works on my root user but now my systemuser? https://www.linode.com/docs/game-servers/host-a-terraria-server-on-your-linode/ |
| 14:20.59 | greycat | First, figure out what the issue is, which means probably logging in on a console (Ctrl-Alt-F2 or similar) so you can poke around in a shell and find logs with error messages. |
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| 14:21.35 | Strum | ok that worked, can login to console ok |
| 14:21.36 | greycat | Also look for missing firmware (sudo dmesg | grep -i firmware), and be prepared to install non-free firmware if needed. |
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| 14:22.05 | Strum | used non free image to install fom |
| 14:22.09 | Strum | from |
| 14:22.31 | bleach | Strum> I suggest typing ctrl,-alt-F1 (2,3,4, or 5) and try logging in on a tty. If you can login then it is an X-problem, if not then it is a password problem. |
| 14:22.49 | greycat | see if there's a .xsession-errors file in the user's home directory, or whatever the GNOME equivalent of that is, if you're trying to use GNOME, |
| 14:22.58 | greycat | also look for |
| 14:23.01 | greycat | !xorg.0.log |
| 14:23.01 | dpkg | Xorg.0.log is in /var/log/ unless you are on stretch-or-later and running X as non-root. Then it's in ~/.local/share/xorg/ instead. |
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| 14:23.38 | grobi | hello debians !:) |
| 14:23.47 | newtodeb | hello grobi! |
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| 14:25.53 | grobi | i have to admit, that i would like to install i3-gaps to my almost fresh buster installation ... |
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| 14:26.58 | grobi | according to https://wiki.debian.org/i3 i cloned i3-gaps-deb. |
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| 14:27.33 | grobi | can someone tell me, what to do next? |
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| 14:27.53 | Strum | startkde: not found |
| 14:28.01 | Strum | well i used the xfce4 image |
| 14:28.14 | Strum | so no surprise there i guess |
| 14:28.15 | greycat | Strum: do you have a file named .xsession or .xinitrc in your home? |
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| 14:28.27 | Strum | ye |
| 14:28.28 | Strum | s |
| 14:28.33 | Strum | both |
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| 14:28.41 | greycat | try renaming whichever one of those exists, to something like .xsesssion.bak |
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| 14:28.52 | greycat | or maybe fewer esses |
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| 14:29.14 | Strum | both of the exist |
| 14:29.15 | Strum | them |
| 14:29.23 | greycat | rename both of them |
| 14:29.35 | Strum | and then what? |
| 14:29.42 | greycat | Then try your graphical login again. |
| 14:29.51 | greycat | Ctrl-Alt-F1 or Ctrl-Alt-F7 most likely. |
| 14:30.40 | Strum | what's the command to rename |
| 14:30.45 | greycat | mv |
| 14:31.50 | Strum | ok |
| 14:31.55 | Strum | working now |
| 14:32.24 | rant | grobi: that script looks broken to me.. it calls a main() function which calls a checkhelp() function which in any case exits the script |
| 14:32.31 | greycat | you can try to reconstruct whatever your .xsession wants to be, but using the start command for xfce4 instead of startkde... |
| 14:32.45 | greycat | (and don't ask me what the start command for xfce is) |
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| 14:33.40 | rant | grobi: looks like someone did a lot of work to make a handy script to automate building of a deb package for whatever the hell i3-gaps is, and it is all for nothing cause the script doesnt work |
| 14:33.57 | grobi | rant aha thanks, and i though that i have to move this script into a directory or sth. |
| 14:34.28 | rant | grobi: no, at a glance it looks like if you were to comment out the checkhelp thing in the main() function it would otherwise run as its suppose to though |
| 14:34.37 | Strum | works after reboot now |
| 14:34.42 | Strum | staright into xfce4 |
| 14:34.47 | rant | https://github.com/maestrogerardo/i3-gaps-deb/blob/master/i3-gaps-deb is the script we're talking about fwiw |
| 14:34.54 | grobi | rant cool thanks |
| 14:34.55 | Strum | gnome is bloatware |
| 14:35.08 | Strum | kde is ugly and also bloated |
| 14:35.19 | greycat | Strum: your .xsession overrides the default X session start-up stuff, so if you use a .xsession it's your job to get it working |
| 14:35.34 | Strum | well it was there by default |
| 14:35.39 | rant | grobi: I just glanced at it, didnt really read it all but commenting line 553 would at least make it not exit immediately |
| 14:35.41 | greycat | No, it's not. |
| 14:35.49 | Strum | ah i know what happened |
| 14:35.54 | greycat | You migrated a home directory from your previous system or something. |
| 14:36.08 | Strum | I remounted by rpeviosu /home partition from the slackware install |
| 14:36.12 | greycat | yup |
| 14:36.15 | Strum | snap |
| 14:36.24 | grobi | ok and yes the webside is what i was talking about |
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| 14:37.06 | Strum | anyway pleased i could do that without having to wipe disk and re-partition |
| 14:38.28 | rant | grobi: if it turns out to be useful, I'd contact the creator and point out the fact that they call that checkhelp function and it in all possible paths in the case statement exits the script, making the script effectively do nothing |
| 14:39.09 | rant | they wrote an elaborate script that is crippled by a small issue of trying to implement commandline parameters |
| 14:39.24 | rant | none of which make it do what it was intended to do :P |
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| 14:41.12 | grobi | rant: i commented out line 553 with vim with '"' so the rest of that part went purple :| |
| 14:41.37 | rant | grobi: comments in bash are # you just put a # at the beginning of the line |
| 14:41.46 | grobi | ok |
| 14:42.08 | rant | if it never calls the checkhelp to parse the command line options, the script should run as intended |
| 14:42.14 | rant | if it has other errors I can't be certain |
| 14:43.16 | rant | I dont know what i3-gap is, have little to no interest in it and the script is a tl;dr kinda situation.. I just parsed enough to see why it wouldnt do anything at all :P |
| 14:43.25 | grobi | rant: one more question: how to run that script? |
| 14:43.42 | rant | grobi: you'd have to chmod +x first then just ./scriptname |
| 14:44.02 | grobi | in the directory? |
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| 14:44.28 | rant | grobi: for arguments sake, and a disclaimer I wouldnt recommend running a script with such a simple coding error.. who knows what it may muck up |
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| 14:44.52 | rant | grobi: but if you're desperate and willing to deal with the consequences.. heh.. go for it. |
| 14:44.56 | greycat | Especially if you're so noob at bash scripts that you don't even know how to run one, and you think " is a comment character. |
| 14:45.03 | rant | heh |
| 14:45.41 | grobi | greycat: you're right i doubt that as well |
| 14:45.52 | rant | they either needed to implement a parameter to actually do the build/install or make *) fallback to continue running the script rather than print the help |
| 14:46.03 | rant | as-is the script is useless |
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| 14:46.47 | rant | I don't feel like reading nearly 600 lines of bash to figure out what it does exactly and check for more serious errors |
| 14:46.58 | rant | I'm bored, but not /that/ bored |
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| 14:48.06 | grobi | so the other option is to build from source wich would be https://github.com/Airblader/i3 |
| 14:48.17 | Piraty | easy |
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| 14:48.35 | rant | from my glancing it seems like for the most part it does what you'd expect, checks to see git is installed, grabs source, fixes it up with patches, builds a deb package.. but I didnt pay enough attention to see that it does this sanely and properly |
| 14:48.40 | Piraty | airblader is not i3wm upstram grobi |
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| 14:49.03 | grobi | yes he mentioned |
| 14:49.19 | Piraty | stapelberg is. |
| 14:49.43 | Piraty | stapelberg "winded down" his engagement in debian |
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| 14:50.16 | rant | I just wouldn't without going through it line by line run that on my machine after seeing such an elementary mistake that renders it totally useless.. there is some demonstration of bash knowledge there.. but with such a simple issue that makes the script do nothing, I have to doubt the credibility of the author |
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| 14:51.57 | grobi | Piraty: that's a pity |
| 14:52.15 | Piraty | i agree with his points he made about it though. |
| 14:52.33 | grobi | what did he mentioned? |
| 14:52.48 | Piraty | he has a blog and posted a long text about it. |
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| 14:53.49 | Piraty | is it just me, or does the GFOC block connections to debian mirrors' .gpg signature files? |
| 14:54.10 | rant | has no idea what GFOC is |
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| 14:54.36 | Piraty | using debootstrap works fine , download all packages. but sig download aborts |
| 14:54.38 | rant | oh, china |
| 14:54.38 | greycat | google... something of code.... no, wait... great firewall of china? |
| 14:54.52 | tarzeau | gsoc? google summer of code? |
| 14:54.58 | Piraty | china |
| 14:55.23 | Piraty | sig download aborts reproducably |
| 14:55.51 | greycat | We have no idea what your nation's routers are doing. You'd be in the best position to answer your own questions. |
| 14:56.50 | rant | yeah the chinese don't tend to like to talk about their nation's issues, so its a mystery to most of us |
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| 14:57.21 | rant | I still dont understand that whole firewall thing.. my father has gone there twice on business and says he was able to access things the chinese couldnt without issues |
| 14:58.02 | rant | I tried reading up on it and its all vague.. something about even minors are required to get some sort of ID credential for it.. idk |
| 14:58.31 | Bushmills | rant, that would be shellcheck, not checkhelp, I think |
| 14:58.52 | rant | Bushmills: did you read the script? |
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| 14:59.38 | Bushmills | No. Just the context, and the suggested web checking service |
| 15:00.03 | Bushmills | (Processing backlog) |
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| 15:00.13 | rant | Bushmills: we were talking about https://github.com/maestrogerardo/i3-gaps-deb/blob/master/i3-gaps-deb on line 577 it calls a main function which first calls igd_checkHelp ${@} which has a case statement and exits the script in all possible code paths so the rest of main() never gets executed |
| 15:00.32 | greycat | it literally has ${@} without double quotes? |
| 15:00.32 | rant | so nearly all of the script is dead code |
| 15:00.43 | rant | greycat: yes |
| 15:00.47 | greycat | Fuuuuuck. |
| 15:00.59 | greycat | Yeah, do *not* try to run this thing. It's definitely bad news. |
| 15:01.15 | Bushmills | I see. My misunderstanding |
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| 15:01.32 | Bushmills | Apologies |
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| 15:01.41 | Mathisen | what would be the smartest way to purge all packets from a 3.rd party repo when you forgot exactly what is installed from that repo? |
| 15:01.44 | BobBarker | when I try to test my software RAID 1 by pulling a drive, GRUB won't automatically start it and I have to manually run it with mdadm, decrypt the drives and start the volume group. |
| 15:02.03 | rant | grobi: fwiw, greycat is something of a bash expert, wrote the BashFAQ and has a blog on the subject.. if he says its not good, I'd take the advice :P |
| 15:02.05 | BobBarker | even if I run the mdadm, grub won't decrypt the drive properly |
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| 15:02.08 | elios | you could install vrms |
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| 15:02.26 | greycat | Not a blog. |
| 15:02.38 | elios | shows you all contrib and non-free packages |
| 15:02.51 | rant | ah, its a wiki |
| 15:03.09 | greycat | you could try running shellcheck (http://www.shellcheck.net/) against the script to see how many issues it finds, if you want a good laugh |
| 15:03.16 | rant | heh |
| 15:03.23 | rant | will rise to that challenge |
| 15:03.24 | elios | HAH |
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| 15:04.49 | greycat | For some reason I don't completely understand, but which seems to be related to Gentoo Linux, a bunch of people have somehow convinced themselves that you can write ${foo} instead of "$foo" in shell scripts. You can't. They are NOT equivalent. |
| 15:05.04 | elios | vrms | grep '^[a-z0-9]' | awk '{print $1}' | xargs dpkg --purge |
| 15:05.04 | rant | output of shellcheck on the script: http://paste.debian.net/1094618/ |
| 15:05.18 | greycat | Seeing someone write ${@} instead of "$@", together with all the stuff rant has already pointed out, tells me this script is bad news. |
| 15:05.33 | themill | elios: vrms isn't really a useful tool at the best of times and particularly not in this context |
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| 15:05.35 | grobi | rant: greycat: sure i will take it :) |
| 15:06.03 | grobi | i mean the advise not the script ;) |
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| 15:06.55 | greycat | !not available |
| 15:06.55 | dpkg | To get a list of packages you have installed now, that are not available from any repository in your sources.list: aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))' |
| 15:07.00 | greycat | Maybe you're looking for that? |
| 15:07.55 | greycat | Line 73: |
| 15:07.56 | greycat | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:08.15 | greycat | In addition to what shellcheck said... they're writing the terminal escape sequences to stdout, but the message to stderr. |
| 15:08.28 | rant | total of 27 errors on shellcheck |
| 15:08.35 | greycat | That will *only* work when stdout and stderr are both pointing to the same place. |
| 15:10.00 | rant | greycat: maybe we should remove the link to this from our wiki or at least put some commentary on it |
| 15:10.05 | grobi | wow |
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| 15:10.23 | greycat | Well, if it doesn't even *run*, that's a reason to stop recommending it. |
| 15:10.41 | greycat | I know nothing about i3 (other than i3lock), let alone any third-party i3 add-ons. |
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| 15:11.15 | elios | why would one install random github code *thinking face* |
| 15:11.46 | greycat | local debs=$(echo i3_*"${igd_TIMESTAMP}"*deb i3-wm_*"${igd_TIMESTAMP}"*deb) |
| 15:11.49 | greycat | Gaaaaah. |
| 15:11.51 | rant | well https://wiki.debian.org/i3 links to it.. what do you think, remove the link or add a disclaimer/commentary? |
| 15:12.04 | rant | heh |
| 15:12.35 | greycat | I have no opinion on what you say on the i3 wiki page, because I don't know anything about i3. |
| 15:13.37 | rant | yeah, I don't have any opinion on i3 or this at all either.. I just think that since we're aware of the issue now, and that its our debian wiki pointing to a ghastly script.. we should do /something/ about it :P |
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| 15:14.04 | greycat | The lines 306/309 on shellcheck's output are really a bigger problem: the author is trying to store a LIST of filenames in a scalar (string) variable, and then use unquoted variable expansion to pass the filenames as arguments to dpkg. Which will absolutely NOT work if any of the filenames contain whitespace or glob characters, and is conceptually NOT the right way to store and process lists. |
| 15:14.06 | elios | uses a towel to gently fan greycat some air. |
| 15:14.51 | rant | I personally hate wikis particularly use of the niche markdown.. so I am not real experienced with any sort of ettiquite or such involved with such things.. I was deferring to your expertise |
| 15:15.09 | greycat | I don't know whether this is a bash script or an sh script. If it's a bash script, the correct answer is to store the list in an array. If it's sh, the correct answer is to bash your head against the desk until the pain stops. |
| 15:15.23 | rant | all I know is, I'm all for addressing an issue we spent this long being aware of and making fun of :P |
| 15:15.36 | grobi | guys i have to cook a meal now.. i'm really happy to have asked you fro advise !:) thanks so far |
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| 15:17.09 | rant | logs in to the wiki |
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| 15:19.27 | rant | I just removed the mention of it altogether and put in the comments for the change that its horrendously buggy and thankfully has such a trivial bug that made it exit immediately before causing any harm |
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| 15:38.44 | netcrash | Hello, anyone knows why a clonezilla server will not show the option image-device ? Everything else shows up |
| 15:40.47 | Strum | for some reason the services i'm installing won't start from the install script |
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| 15:45.33 | quantum | Forwarding set properly on systemB, yet I can not ping through it from systemA, to cameras on the other side. |
| 15:46.05 | quantum | tcpdump shows ping does not make it through systemB. |
| 15:46.05 | quantum | net.ipv4.conf.all.forwarding=1 |
| 15:46.08 | jelly | and you think #debian is more likely to be helpful than ##networking? |
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| 15:46.29 | quantum | I've clearly baffled ##networking. |
| 15:47.12 | quantum | Any other criticisms or suggestions? |
| 15:48.55 | jelly | sure, over there |
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| 15:56.33 | EmleyMoor | How do you configure vino on buster? It has changed radically since stretch, and I need it on my latest machine as it will be mainly remotely controlled. |
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| 16:05.18 | dashs | What is the current way to make systemd wait until a given remote directory is accessible in order to start a service unit? |
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| 16:08.52 | Xalys | I'm experiencing dependency hell on Debian 9 and 10. zfs-dkms depends on spl-dkms 0.7.13 but only 0.7.12-2 is available. But, according to https://packages.debian.org/sid/spl-dkms , spl-dkms is no longer needed as its code is merged into zfs-dkms. Why does zfs-dkms require spl-dkms then? |
| 16:09.26 | Habbie | that url is not for 9 or 10 |
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| 16:09.42 | greycat | also how can it be "9 and 10"? |
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| 16:10.00 | Xalys | greycat: what do you mean |
| 16:10.13 | greycat | It's either Debian 9 or it's Debian 10. You need to pick one. |
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| 16:10.30 | greycat | ,v zfs-dkms |
| 16:10.31 | judd | Package: zfs-dkms on amd64 -- stretch/contrib: 0.6.5.9-5; stretch-backports/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1; stretch-backports-sloppy/contrib: 0.7.13-1~bpo9+1; buster-backports/contrib: 0.7.13-1~bpo10+1; bullseye/contrib: 0.8.1-3; sid/contrib: 0.8.1-3 |
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| 16:11.05 | Xalys | greycat: I don't understand what you mean. I tried on 9, then 10. Issue on both. |
| 16:11.33 | greycat | And what is the actual, exact issue? |
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| 16:16.01 | grobi | rant: look what i have found (it has the status: 'solved'): http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?t=130543 |
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| 16:17.19 | Xalys | Found. zfs-dkms depends on spl-dkms-0.7.13-1 but the package in buster-backports is called spl-dkms=0.7.13-1~bpo10+1 |
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| 16:22.24 | rant | grobi: its also a year and a half old and the solution seems to be that script we talked about earlier |
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| 16:25.09 | alpha | hello |
| 16:25.28 | alpha | queit |
| 16:25.37 | alpha | quit |
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| 16:27.59 | grobi | rant: so more other people might be lead to confusion.. |
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| 16:41.36 | netcrash | How do I share a directory via nfs to all rw in my network ? |
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| 16:43.41 | Akuw | to access samba share is neccesary to specify workgroup in smb.conf ? |
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| 16:46.43 | netcrash | Akuw: no |
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| 16:47.00 | netcrash | Akuw: if you specify the ip there should be no need |
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| 16:48.48 | Akuw | humm, i am getting "You dont have permission to access.." |
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| 16:50.04 | netcrash | Akuw: have you specified a user and password? |
| 16:50.13 | Akuw | yes |
| 16:50.32 | Akuw | wait, the the moment of connection? |
| 16:50.47 | Akuw | it doesnt request for user or password |
| 16:51.14 | netcrash | It's probably using anonymous |
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| 16:55.00 | SerajewelKS | i don't suppose this would be an appropriate place to ask for recommendations of reliable 2TB+ external hard drives to be used for backups |
| 16:56.20 | Akuw | netcrash: where can i check? in smb.conf ? |
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| 16:56.50 | netcrash | Akuw: are you trying to access or receive a connection? |
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| 16:57.34 | Akuw | i am trying to connect from Windows 10 to Samba Server |
| 16:58.22 | netcrash | Then you need to have a Workgroup defined on the samba server, also you need to specify the access has user in smb.conf and set the user password using smbpasswd -a <user> |
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| 16:59.14 | Akuw | netcrash: password was done |
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| 17:00.51 | Akuw | but when connecting using IP it is neccesary to use workgroup? |
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| 17:01.37 | humpled | necessary |
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| 17:02.03 | greycat | It isn't necessary in my experience. And correcting a spelling error in that way is EXTREMELY confusing, humpled. |
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| 17:02.41 | humpled | sorry i didn't realise |
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| 17:04.28 | enri | hi |
| 17:04.40 | enri | how to properly install anonsurf ? |
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| 17:12.07 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: get something that's got a standard hard drive inside, so you can rip it out of the enclosure when the enclosure electronics dies :) |
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| 17:12.36 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: also get an enclosure that's known to work with smartctl so you can check the health of the drive |
| 17:13.19 | BCMM | i bought a wd my book but i don't know if i can recommend the enclosure because i bought it to take the drive out |
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| 17:14.13 | BCMM | but they're noted for having quality drives inside. (wd rebranded the stickers on the drives to obfuscate the fact that the drive inside is frequently worth more than the whole unit) |
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| 17:15.12 | BCMM | i mean, can't say anything about reliability. but it's a reasonably performant drive, fast usb3 interface, decent build quality, and smartctl worked |
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| 17:22.29 | Bushmills | netcrash: you're trying to export a rw nfs directory? A but confused because there's "samba" popping up in this context |
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| 17:26.16 | annadane | is it a debian specific thing why fluxbox-update_configs won't work after editing .fluxbox/keys or is this common knowledge and i'm just doing it wrong? |
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| 17:28.28 | SerajewelKS | BCMM: yeah i use internal wd red drives |
| 17:28.45 | lucyl | Hi all, trying to update Debian Lenny (Wii hardware, can't upgrade). Can gpg checks be disabled ? Can't run apt-get update due to KEYEXPIRED |
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| 17:29.52 | greycat | lucyl: you can try https://wiki.debian.org/DebianSqueeze#FAQ just adapted for Lenny... |
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| 17:32.30 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: wd reds were the original drives in wd's external drives |
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| 17:34.07 | lucyl | greycat: Tried already, the flag doesn't seem to be recognized. |
| 17:34.53 | greycat | Oh, that's fun. Then you may have to read the apt docs and find an equivalent, or backport a newer apt. |
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| 17:46.09 | lineageosfan | How can I install remmina on Debian 9? |
| 17:46.27 | lineageosfan | These instructions do not work: sudo apt install -t stretch-backports remmina remmina-plugin-rdp remmina-plugin-secret remmina-plugin-spice |
| 17:46.53 | greycat | ,v remmina |
| 17:46.54 | judd | Package: remmina on amd64 -- jessie: 1.1.1-2; stretch-backports: 1.3.3+dfsg-2~bpo9+1; buster: 1.3.3+dfsg-2; bullseye: 1.3.4+dfsg-3; sid: 1.3.4+dfsg-3 |
| 17:47.01 | dvs | !buster backports |
| 17:47.02 | dpkg | Some packages intended for Bullseye (Debian 11) but recompiled for use with Buster (Debian 10) can be found in the buster-backports repository. See http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/ . Ask me about <bdo>, <backports>. |
| 17:47.02 | lineageosfan | After those 3 lines I get: Reading package lists... DoneE: The value 'stretch-backports' is invalid for APT::Default-Release as such a release is not available in the sources |
| 17:47.18 | greycat | Do they fail because you didn't add stretch-backports to your sources, or because something in the packages is actually broken? |
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| 17:47.44 | greycat | Did you follow http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/ ? |
| 17:47.45 | lineageosfan | greycat: I am not sure. |
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| 17:51.28 | lineageosfan | I added it to sources list and then did an update. However, afte trying to install I get: E: The value 'stretch-backports' is invalid for APT::Default-Release as such a release is not available in the sources |
| 17:51.59 | Crapoto | Hello guys. I'm installing Debian on an old eeepc, i want to try the LXQt desktop environement, should i also install the "Debian desktop environement" as proposed by the setup ? (Default was Debian DE checked and XFCE4 checked also) |
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| 17:52.26 | lineageosfan | Meaning, after: sudo apt install -t stretch-backports remmina remmina-plugin-rdp remmina-plugin-secret remmina-plugin-spice |
| 17:52.29 | dvs | Crapoto, no, that would be gnome |
| 17:52.35 | karlpinc | Crapoto: Not necessarily. You can always install it later. |
| 17:53.00 | karlpinc | Crapoto: But I can't see gnome running well on an eee. |
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| 17:53.41 | karlpinc | lineageosfan: You could pastebin your sources.list and we can check it. |
| 17:53.47 | Crapoto | Thank you guys :) If i install XFCE4 and LXQt, i suppose i will be able to switch from one to another from the login screen ? Except hard disk space, does this solution impact the ram and CPU usage ? |
| 17:54.15 | lineageosfan | dpkg: Where can I paste it? |
| 17:54.16 | dpkg | lineageosfan: I don't know, could you explain it? |
| 17:54.19 | karlpinc | Crapoto: The only impact on RAM and CPU is when you run it. |
| 17:54.26 | greycat | http://paste.debian.net/ |
| 17:54.27 | karlpinc | !paste |
| 17:54.27 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 17:54.32 | Crapoto | I get it, thanks alot |
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| 17:55.34 | lineageosfan | dpkg: https://pastebin.com/gUyMjAwi |
| 17:55.34 | dpkg | lineageosfan: I wish you would RTFM. |
| 17:55.46 | karlpinc | lineageosfan: dpkg is a bot |
| 17:56.17 | lineageosfan | karlpinc: Thx. I understand: https://pastebin.com/gUyMjAwi |
| 17:56.17 | dvs | lineageosfan, why are you using buster-backports for stretch? |
| 17:56.30 | lineageosfan | ups |
| 17:56.48 | greycat | probably the same reason he asked us where to paste it, two beings told him paste.debian.net, and then he went and used pastebin.com |
| 17:57.06 | lineageosfan | Sorry, I am not an expert |
| 17:57.20 | *** join/#debian oo_miguel (~miguel@89-72-186-97.dynamic.chello.pl) |
| 17:57.41 | lineageosfan | changed it to strech and will try again. thx for the hint |
| 17:58.16 | lineageosfan | Now I get: W: The repository 'https://ftp.debian.org/debian stretch-backports Release' does not have a Release file.N: Data from such a repository can't be authenticated and is therefore potentially dangerous to use. |
| 17:58.37 | dvs | lineageosfan, did you "apt update" first? |
| 17:58.46 | lineageosfan | yes, I did |
| 17:58.51 | lineageosfan | that is where I get the error |
| 17:59.35 | lineageosfan | N: Updating from such a repository can't be done securely, and is therefore disabled by default.N: See apt-secure(8) manpage for repository creation and user configuration details. |
| 17:59.36 | dvs | lineageosfan, do you have any files in you /etc/apt/sources.list.d directory? |
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| 18:00.20 | lineageosfan | dvs: yes, these: google-chrome.list qubes-r4.list stretch-backports.list |
| 18:00.25 | *** join/#debian LaunchDirector (~pi@unaffiliated/launch-director/x-8216596) |
| 18:00.39 | dvs | lineageosfan, stretch-backports.list? hmmmmm... |
| 18:00.44 | *** join/#debian DammitJim (~DammitJim@173.227.148.6) |
| 18:00.52 | lineageosfan | dvs: No, only those posted |
| 18:00.55 | *** join/#debian MrShared (~mrshared@213.86.128.146) |
| 18:01.33 | greycat | if you're putting the stretch-backports line(s) in /etc/apt/sources.list then you probably want to REMOVE /etc/apt/sources.list.d/stretch-backports.list |
| 18:01.56 | greycat | In either case, you want to pick one or the other. |
| 18:02.15 | dvs | and I suspect there's something wrong with the latter |
| 18:02.38 | SerajewelKS | BCMM: 3.5" though right? most of the WD external drives i see are clearly 2.5" form factor. |
| 18:02.55 | humpled | do you have the necessary for apt over https though? |
| 18:03.00 | lineageosfan | dvs: I removed the stretch-backports.list file |
| 18:03.03 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: oh yeah, the mybook is a full-size thing |
| 18:03.04 | lineageosfan | Will try again now. |
| 18:03.33 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: iirc originally the white label drives were wd reds without the branding (or warranty). mine appears to be an ultrastar! |
| 18:03.38 | lineageosfan | dvs: better, seems to install alright now |
| 18:03.40 | lineageosfan | thx |
| 18:03.44 | dvs | np |
| 18:03.59 | BCMM | He ultrastar, i mean |
| 18:05.11 | SerajewelKS | BCMM: the mybook is more expensive than the same capacity wd red :( |
| 18:05.26 | BCMM | SerajewelKS: when i got mine, it was a pretty good discount |
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| 18:05.42 | BCMM | i think it goes on sale, unlike bare drives? |
| 18:05.54 | SerajewelKS | BCMM: i'm considering getting two and mirroring them for the 3-2-1 policy |
| 18:06.38 | DammitJim | do you guys know how I can troubleshoot my buster system where if I'm in the office and I'm on ethernet or wifi, network connectivity works, but when I get home, my machine associates to my WiFi and I get an IP address, but the DNS client doesn't work... I think it's because /etc/resolv.conf still has the DNS servers from my office |
| 18:06.46 | DammitJim | I installed connman on my system |
| 18:06.52 | *** part/#debian zenix_2k2 (~zenix@unaffiliated/zenix-2k2/x-8691202) |
| 18:07.58 | lucyl | Fixed it ! It was just a warning ... |
| 18:08.29 | diogenes_ | DammitJim, try: sudo systemctl restart Networkmanager |
| 18:08.38 | diogenes_ | NetworkManager* |
| 18:08.51 | Bushmills | DammitJim: you'd look at file /etc/resolv.conf and check whether its contents changes accordingly |
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| 18:11.10 | Bushmills | a thing to consider could be to install a recursive nameserver locally on your machine, which it then can always use to resolve hostnames. A program like unbound is a good candiate |
| 18:11.38 | greycat | It'll depend on what kind of insane networks your laptop has to connect to. |
| 18:12.12 | Bushmills | right, knowledge of the resp. environment helps there |
| 18:12.57 | greycat | A regular recursive resolver will simply try to connect directly to the root nameservers and then the .COM nameservers and so on. On some captive or restricted networks, you might have to go through the DNS nameservers provided on the network BY the network admin. |
| 18:13.36 | Bushmills | needing extra configuration where to forward specific requests to |
| 18:14.03 | *** join/#debian solarnetone (~scott@23.130.80.34) |
| 18:14.05 | greycat | Just yesterday, I got yet another email from one of the network admins here griping that one of my unix servers is sending DNS traffic without going through THEIR resolvers. I haven't heard the last of this discussion, I'm sure. |
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| 18:14.33 | lineageosfan | I installed the vncserver on one machine and remmina on the other but I can not connect. What could be the problem? |
| 18:14.50 | Bushmills | why should they have to be bothered who resolves your queries? |
| 18:15.16 | greycat | They believe that if they restrict what domains we look up, it will improve security somehow. |
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| 18:15.54 | Bushmills | so that policy is enforced by complaining? |
| 18:15.54 | greycat | I think the immediate goal is for them to return erroneous results for certain blacklisted domains, to prevent Windows PCs from being infected. |
| 18:16.55 | Bushmills | reminds me of a security "solution" in a showroom on a computer with a sign "don't touch" - I asked whether that sign was part of the security solution. |
| 18:17.06 | greycat | Bushmills: still waiting to hear the next chapter. Right now all I said was "yes, that's mine". |
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| 18:19.35 | Bushmills | what'd they do i your computer queries a remote resolver through an encrypted tunnel? |
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| 18:20.01 | croddy | usually either they will stop you with deep packet inspection or they will just see it and worry |
| 18:20.37 | Bushmills | encrypted tunnel to remote port 443 ... |
| 18:21.05 | croddy | i've definitely been stopped from exchanging non-https encrypted traffic to a remote 443 |
| 18:21.40 | Bushmills | to port 22 then? |
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| 18:22.05 | croddy | see, this is why i have an ssh server listening on a whole buffet of interesting ports |
| 18:23.12 | Bushmills | there are plenty of ports assigned to encrypted services which could be used to hide such traffic |
| 18:23.21 | croddy | indeed |
| 18:23.47 | Bushmills | many SSL services - while encrypted tunnels can be SSL too |
| 18:24.13 | Bushmills | 990+ port range, for example |
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| 18:56.42 | coregrl | hi I'm trying to use debian 10 on an ancient notebook, debian 9 works perfectly, debian 10 freezes using lightdm, if I startx manually it works, how can I understand what's wrong? |
| 18:57.27 | greycat | look for .xsession-errors in the user's home directory, or the Xorg.0.log file in the user's home directory or in /var/log |
| 18:58.01 | greycat | I'm assuming it's X because lightdm isn't gdm3 but I can't even be sure whether you're using X, or Wayland. |
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| 18:59.49 | coregrl | greycat: how can I know? I installed the xfce environment |
| 19:00.18 | greycat | Then you're probably not using a Wayland session, because the only default Wayland sessions in buster are with GNOME |
| 19:00.23 | *** join/#debian n_1-c_k (~n_1-c_k@2a02:8010:63a6::70) |
| 19:00.39 | greycat | so, .xsession-errors and/or Xorg.0.log might have some clues |
| 19:01.25 | alkisg | Does it freeze in lightdm, or when you try to login? |
| 19:01.44 | coregrl | it freexes when it tries to start lightdm |
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| 19:01.52 | coregrl | no way to legin except resume mode |
| 19:01.56 | coregrl | login |
| 19:02.41 | greycat | Ctrl-Alt-F2 to get to a console, and login there? |
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| 19:02.54 | alkisg | What's the output of this? lspci -nn -k | grep -A3 VGA | nc termbin.com 9999 |
| 19:04.00 | coregrl | greycat: no way when it startx i hear "CLUNK" and everything freezes |
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| 19:04.27 | greycat | You said "if I startx manually it works". |
| 19:04.42 | Guest27028 | debian buster 10 cinnamon with rx 570 amdgpu running in software rendering mode and i'm lost |
| 19:04.47 | coregrl | yes I boot in recovery mode |
| 19:05.16 | coregrl | and then logging in console, i run startx and it works |
| 19:05.26 | greycat | coregrl: so now are you saying that startx gives a "CLUNK" and does not work? Or did you mean that lightdm itself gives a "CLUNK" and does not work, even before you try to login? Or is the CLUNK after you login? |
| 19:06.11 | greycat | coregrl: the objective at this point is to identify EXACTLY what causes the failure, and then find some log files that have error messages created during that failure |
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| 19:07.13 | coregrl | well if i boot debian normally it tries to start lightdm i hear the disk working, then i hear a strange rumor everything hangs and I need to press power button for 5 secs, if I bootin recovery mode after the ctrl-d message i put root password and then I run startx, it works |
| 19:08.17 | alkisg | Do you `startx` as user or as root? |
| 19:08.39 | greycat | After the failure, after the power cycle, after you boot in recovery mode, INSTEAD of running startx and wiping out the trail, just look for the log files immediately. |
| 19:09.00 | coregrl | alkisg: it says amd/ati rv250/m9 gl, 1002:4c66 |
| 19:09.04 | greycat | !xorg.0.log |
| 19:09.04 | dpkg | Xorg.0.log is in /var/log/ unless you are on stretch-or-later and running X as non-root. Then it's in ~/.local/share/xorg/ instead. |
| 19:09.09 | greycat | or ~/.xsession-errors |
| 19:09.10 | greycat | or both |
| 19:09.27 | coregrl | ok let me clean and retry |
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| 19:13.25 | coregrl | uh no logs... |
| 19:13.55 | coregrl | i deleted Xorg.log before the "normal" boot and was not recreated |
| 19:13.57 | Bushmills | coregrl: is it essential for you to have a graphical login dialog? |
| 19:14.04 | greycat | OK, for now, just disable lightdm entirely. Either remove the lightdm package, or use "systemctl set-default multi-user.target" |
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| 19:15.12 | coregrl | greycat: i done the last one |
| 19:15.34 | coregrl | Bushmills:yes is not for me but for a friend |
| 19:15.44 | greycat | ... |
| 19:15.54 | Bushmills | in that case, maybe a "dummy" display manager like nodm could suit you or him. boots into graphical desktop no question asked |
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| 19:16.12 | alkisg | I think I've seen some graphics card that don't support kms, having trouble running xorg as non-root... |
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| 19:19.10 | *** join/#debian Akuw (~x@200.27.52.37) |
| 19:19.38 | Akuw | can i share file and dirs using NFS and browse from windows |
| 19:19.40 | Akuw | ? |
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| 19:21.22 | greycat | Not with a standard Windows setup. NFS on Windows requires optional stuff and is way off topic here. |
| 19:21.50 | Bushmills | there exists something called Services for NFS which has an NFS client |
| 19:22.02 | Bushmills | but I think that's not coming with all windows versions |
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| 19:24.35 | BCMM | I think the NFS client is in Pro and up now, instead of just Enterprise |
| 19:24.41 | coregrl | it hanfs at starting terminate plymouth boot screen |
| 19:24.43 | coregrl | hangs |
| 19:24.50 | BCMM | Akuw: do you have Windows 10? |
| 19:25.00 | Akuw | yes |
| 19:25.05 | BCMM | Akuw: what edition? |
| 19:25.21 | Akuw | Pro |
| 19:26.16 | *** join/#debian tehnull (~tehnull@unaffiliated/tehnull) |
| 19:26.52 | BCMM | Akuw: you have to add an optional feature called "Services for NFS" in the Windows Features dialog |
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| 19:27.17 | BCMM | then apparently they have something that kind of looks like the mount command but probably doesn't work the same |
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| 19:27.31 | Akuw | added |
| 19:27.55 | Akuw | actually i am trying to use Samba, but there is a problem |
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| 19:28.21 | Akuw | http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=0f51f6f34551c43db4f96e7e3b1fb528 |
| 19:28.31 | Akuw | i can see resource but cant connect |
| 19:29.08 | BCMM | Akuw: well hang on, are you trying to do SMB or NFS? they are different protocols |
| 19:29.27 | Akuw | first Samba, everything is configured |
| 19:29.45 | Akuw | if i can do with samba is ok, else i have to use NFS |
| 19:31.46 | Bushmills | the Window distribution is a tad limited what concerns flexibility of choice regarding networked file systems. |
| 19:31.55 | Bushmills | Windows ... |
| 19:32.19 | Bushmills | but that also goes for disk file systems, thus file systems in general |
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| 19:33.21 | Bushmills | appears unfinished :) |
| 19:33.57 | bindi | Akuw: smbpasswd -a username |
| 19:34.18 | Akuw | bindi: done |
| 19:34.25 | bindi | give it same password as your windows logon and it should work ootb |
| 19:34.34 | bindi | if not, permissions problems :P |
| 19:34.41 | Akuw | one question, i created a dir /samba |
| 19:34.53 | Akuw | is root sambashare |
| 19:35.05 | Akuw | i gave the same password |
| 19:35.48 | karlpinc | Akuw: You also need the clocks on the various ends synced (ntp or whatnot). I forget how much slop is allowed, some is. |
| 19:36.08 | karlpinc | Akuw: There is also #samba.... |
| 19:36.39 | Akuw | synced |
| 19:36.52 | Akuw | nobody answer in samba |
| 19:37.58 | greycat | If you have a second Debian system, you can verify that the Samba on Debian1 is working by using smbclient -L Debian1 -U yourusername |
| 19:38.19 | greycat | Where "yourusername" is one that you used smbpasswd to create. |
| 19:39.11 | Akuw | let me test |
| 19:39.12 | Akuw | wait |
| 19:40.08 | DammitJim | ugh, I didn't realize I wasn't connected!!! |
| 19:40.27 | DammitJim | my question again about my dns servers not getting updated in /etc/resolv.conf |
| 19:40.33 | DammitJim | when I go from my office to my house |
| 19:40.41 | DammitJim | at my office I mostly use the ethernet connection |
| 19:40.46 | Akuw | greycat: i test from my ownserver and that show output |
| 19:40.47 | DammitJim | then when I get home I only use wifi |
| 19:40.49 | Akuw | no error |
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| 19:41.31 | greycat | Akuw: OK, good. Now, what is the client that produces the error, and what is the EXACT sequence of steps you're doing on the client to produce the error? |
| 19:41.52 | dvs | DammitJim, Do you even get a WiFi connection at home? Can you ping your router via IP address? |
| 19:42.36 | DammitJim | dvs, I get an IP address |
| 19:42.47 | DammitJim | but if I do a dnslookup, I can see it's trying to use the DNS servers from my office |
| 19:43.19 | dvs | DammitJim, do you can an IP address using DHCP at home? |
| 19:43.37 | DammitJim | yes, I get an IP address at home |
| 19:43.43 | dvs | uding DHCP? |
| 19:43.48 | Akuw | greycat: File Manager->This Pc->Add a network Location->Choose custom network location->\\192.168.0.200\x |
| 19:43.48 | dvs | using DHCP? |
| 19:43.52 | DammitJim | if I manually edit /etc/resolv.conf and put my home DNS server, I can use my network |
| 19:44.01 | DammitJim | yup, it's DHCP at home |
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| 19:44.19 | DammitJim | btw, no other laptop/device at home has this problem (they all work properly with dhcp on wifi |
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| 19:44.24 | Akuw | greycat: last screen says that i connected successfully |
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| 19:44.27 | dvs | DammitJim, Then I think it's your router not giving you a DNS server IP |
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| 19:44.47 | dvs | Oh? |
| 19:44.53 | DammitJim | dvs, right |
| 19:45.18 | Akuw | greycat: but when try to access resource got error |
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| 19:46.29 | greycat | Akuw: does it work if you use a hostname instead of an IP address? It's funny, because just last week we had a Windows 10 PC trying to mount one of our Samba shares, and using the hostname failed but using the IP address worked. |
| 19:46.53 | Akuw | greycat: letme test |
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| 19:47.26 | greycat | I still don't know all this Samba stuff very well, why sometimes you can use a hostname and sometimes you can't. |
| 19:47.45 | Akuw | same error using \\nemo\user |
| 19:47.49 | greycat | "This PC" in your description makes it sound like Windows 10. |
| 19:47.52 | Akuw | nemo is my server name |
| 19:47.59 | greycat | It was x before, and now it's user? |
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| 19:48.18 | Akuw | user is x sorry |
| 19:48.26 | Akuw | \\nemo\x |
| 19:49.17 | dvs | DammitJim, what does your /etc/network/interfaces file say? |
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| 19:52.59 | coregrl | greycat: how can i undo the multi-user.target? |
| 19:53.43 | humpled | i think systemctl set-default graphical.target |
| 19:55.00 | greycat | yes, graphical.target is the default default |
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| 19:56.09 | coregrl | well i disabled some power management stuffs |
| 19:56.12 | coregrl | and now it works |
| 19:56.27 | humpled | yaya |
| 19:56.33 | coregrl | systemctl mask sleep.target suspend.target hibernate.target hybrid-sleep.target |
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| 20:00.09 | DammitJim | dvs, let me paste it |
| 20:00.36 | DammitJim | https://paste.debian.net/1094659/ |
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| 20:03.05 | dvs | DammitJim, you only have one entry in there and it looks like it's the ethernet one. Are you using another manager to handle the WiFi connection? |
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| 20:04.25 | DammitJim | connman |
| 20:04.38 | dvs | ok, I know nothing about connman. |
| 20:04.46 | DammitJim | what manager am I using besides connman? |
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| 20:05.38 | Bushmills | I liked to call some of those "managers" mismanagers |
| 20:05.54 | dvs | DammitJim, dhclient is handling the entry in the interfaces file. |
| 20:06.02 | DammitJim | ok |
| 20:08.14 | newtodeb | hey guys ! |
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| 20:09.34 | developer_su | Hi! I'm stuck trying to upgrade zfs-dkms @ stretch. System doesn't do enything and only message I see is 'Building initial module for 4.9.0-8-amd64'. Could you please tell me where should I look for verbose information? |
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| 20:13.18 | developer_su | Ok, really sorry for bothering you guys.. It seems like a just really slow installation process. I finally see new lines in console ^-^ |
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| 20:22.09 | karlpinc | developer_su: You can open up another virtual terminal and use commands like "top" or "ps" to see what is happening. |
| 20:22.13 | karlpinc | !vt |
| 20:22.13 | dpkg | i guess vt is Virtual Terminal, like the console; change VTs using Alt+Left/Right or Alt+F1, Alt+F2 etc. To get from X to a VT, use Ctrl+Alt+F1 (and Alt+F7 to get back, most likely). You can also use "chvt" to switch VT. VT is also used to mean Intel VT-x or VT-d (virtualization support; the AMD counterpart is called AMD-V or Pacifica), ask me about <xve>. |
| 20:22.45 | developer_su | karlpinc: yeah.. it's installed as expected. |
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| 20:25.26 | karlpinc | developer_su: (That was more of an FYI for the future.) |
| 20:25.48 | janie_lane | what pastebin service is preferred in channel ? |
| 20:25.58 | karlpinc | !paste |
| 20:25.58 | greycat | http://paste.debian.net/ |
| 20:25.58 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 20:26.00 | developer_su | karlpinc: thanks =) |
| 20:26.17 | janie_lane | thank you greycat |
| 20:27.24 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094661 |
| 20:27.45 | janie_lane | im confused trying to get my amd rx 470 graphics adapter to play nice |
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| 20:29.34 | towo` | janie_lane, firmware-amd-graphics is installed? |
| 20:30.09 | janie_lane | yes it is |
| 20:30.31 | janie_lane | 20190114-1 |
| 20:30.45 | towo` | janie_lane, your system is using vesa for x |
| 20:30.59 | towo` | that's not how it should be |
| 20:31.20 | janie_lane | so custom xorg.conf |
| 20:31.34 | towo` | no |
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| 20:31.52 | towo` | xserver-xorg-video-amdgpu installed? |
| 20:32.09 | greycat | the *first* thing you do is get rid of any xorg.conf or pieces thereof, and see what happens using the defaults |
| 20:32.31 | greycat | only create xorg.conf(.d/*) snippets if absolutely necessary |
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| 20:32.50 | towo` | janie_lane, and dmesg | grep -i amd and Xorg.0.log could be helpfull |
| 20:32.51 | janie_lane | yes it is installed version 18.1.99+git20190207-1 |
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| 20:33.16 | janie_lane | it is a completely new install no custom xorg |
| 20:33.36 | towo` | janie_lane, your system has not tryed to load amdgpu-ddx: unloaded: fbdev,modesetting,radeon |
| 20:34.17 | towo` | and since modesetting was unloaded, your kernel driver is not loaded propper |
| 20:34.27 | towo` | or the firmware was not found |
| 20:34.31 | towo` | or, or, or |
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| 20:35.21 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094662 |
| 20:35.37 | janie_lane | thats the dmesg | grep -i amd |
| 20:35.50 | towo` | [ 20.447930] [drm:amdgpu_pci_probe [amdgpu]] *ERROR* amdgpu requires firmware installed |
| 20:35.58 | towo` | dmesg | grep -i firmw |
| 20:37.19 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094663 |
| 20:38.23 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094664 |
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| 20:39.17 | towo` | janie_lane, have you rebootet your system after installing firmware-amd-graphics? |
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| 20:39.58 | janie_lane | yes |
| 20:40.03 | janie_lane | but i will again to be sure |
| 20:40.07 | janie_lane | firmware-linux is already the newest version (20190114-1). |
| 20:40.07 | janie_lane | firmware-linux-nonfree is already the newest version (20190114-1). |
| 20:40.25 | janie_lane | brb |
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| 20:43.31 | janie_lane | right off the bat cinnamon is still in software rendering mode |
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| 20:44.08 | towo` | janie_lane, normal, since your system does not use amdgpu |
| 20:45.04 | janie_lane | right |
| 20:45.16 | janie_lane | but my rx 470 should |
| 20:46.32 | towo` | it would, if the system would load the firmware |
| 20:46.34 | janie_lane | i ran both dmesg | grep -i amd\firmw |
| 20:46.41 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094666 |
| 20:46.44 | janie_lane | after reboot |
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| 20:47.40 | towo` | janie_lane, something is wrong on your system |
| 20:47.57 | towo` | all your hardware complains about missing firmwares |
| 20:48.39 | janie_lane | its built on a ga-970a-ds3p v2.0 board |
| 20:48.55 | towo` | and btw amdgpu.si_support=1 should not needed |
| 20:49.10 | towo` | rx470 is polaris not southern island |
| 20:49.10 | janie_lane | ok ill correct that |
| 20:49.33 | janie_lane | i was taking shots in the dark i see |
| 20:49.35 | janie_lane | lol |
| 20:50.21 | janie_lane | can confirm polaris firmwares exist in /usr/lib/firmware/amdgpu |
| 20:50.51 | towo` | and /lib is a symlink to /usr/lib? |
| 20:51.10 | janie_lane | yes |
| 20:51.55 | LtL | janie_lane: from what i see amdgpu requires firmware-realtek from non-free |
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| 20:52.11 | towo` | oddly enough in dmesg is no sign of trying to load amdgpu firmware |
| 20:52.19 | towo` | LtL, no |
| 20:52.31 | towo` | LtL, the network card needs that firmware |
| 20:53.23 | towo` | janie_lane, normaly dmesg should show [Di Aug 6 11:00:28 2019] amdgpu 0000:08:00.0: firmware: direct-loading firmware amdgpu/polaris10_vce.bin or the fail |
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| 20:54.23 | jhutchins_wk | janie_lane: Have you posted lspci -nn somewhere? |
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| 20:55.40 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094669 |
| 20:55.48 | janie_lane | i just corrected the realtek issue tho |
| 20:55.55 | jhutchins_wk | Ok, cool. |
| 20:56.23 | jhutchins_wk | We have a database where we can look up specific hardware to see if it wants firmware and if so what. |
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| 20:58.03 | janie_lane | http://paste.debian.net/1094671 <<<< with -k |
| 20:59.16 | jhutchins_wk | ,pciid 1002:67df |
| 20:59.17 | judd | [1002:67df] is 'Ellesmere [Radeon RX 470/480/570/570X/580/580X/590]' from 'Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]' with kernel modules 'snd-hda-intel', 'amdgpu' in stretch. See also http://kmuto.jp/debian/hcl/index.rhtmlx?check=1&lspci=1002:67df and the out-of-tree 'snd-hda-intel' module. |
| 21:00.25 | jhutchins_wk | !radeon |
| 21:00.25 | dpkg | Radeon is a brand of graphic processing units by AMD/ATI (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon). The radeon open source display driver is packaged for Debian as xserver-xorg-video-radeon, optionally install libgl1-mesa-dri for 3D acceleration. Also ask me about <radeon firmware>, <radeon audio>. https://wiki.debian.org/AtiHowTo http://x.org/wiki/radeon #radeon on irc.freenode.net. For the proprietary driver, see <fglrx>. |
| 21:00.45 | jhutchins_wk | !radeon firmware |
| 21:00.45 | dpkg | Binary-only firmware for the radeon <DRM> driver is packaged for Debian as firmware-linux-nonfree. Without this package installed, poor 2D/3D performance in the <radeon> xorg driver is commonly experienced. To install, ask me about <non-free sources>. This is not required for use of the <fglrx> driver. |
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| 21:05.18 | Akuw | still can do samba work |
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| 21:14.00 | janie_lane | after removing firmware-linux-nonfree and firmware-amd-graphics i get exactly same dmesg info |
| 21:14.02 | martinm | So now that I'm moving to Buster, along with other long outdated dust I'm trying to shake off, the one I need help with is Python v.2. Is it practical to change the alternatives to just make python3.7 the default for the python alias, or are there still important bits of Debian that rely on that calling up 2.7? I've been googling for info, but it keeps finding Debian docs that are 3+ years old and of no help to me. :-( |
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| 21:20.05 | tarzeau | martinm: well try to remove python2 package and see what it'd remove |
| 21:20.50 | CaptainDusty | martinm: Negative. Last time I tried the defaults to Python there were still core components (such as apt) that failed. |
| 21:21.16 | whislock | martinm: Do not change the system default Python. |
| 21:21.21 | whislock | That way lies dragons and pain. |
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| 21:21.44 | CaptainDusty | martinm: This is why dependency and package managers exist. There's clean functions to remove packages that are no longer required. |
| 21:21.57 | martinm | hah! thanks, for some reason that didn't occur to me tarzeau. Oops, apt and dragons and pain, oh my! |
| 21:22.02 | humbot | what is the point of changing the default? if you want python3 just call it? |
| 21:22.12 | jmcnaught | ^ |
| 21:22.45 | CaptainDusty | humbot: It's one less keystroke. |
| 21:22.54 | martinm | well, this was upgraded from 9, so I was wistfully thinking that maybe it wasn't really needed |
| 21:23.03 | humbot | :þ |
| 21:24.02 | humbot | alias py3="/usr/bin/python3" ? |
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| 21:24.35 | jmcnaught | martinm: https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#deprecated-components "Debian hopes to drop python-2.7 for Debian 11." |
| 21:25.17 | jelly | that's about when upstream hopes to drop it as well |
| 21:25.59 | martinm | humbot, thanks, but a shell alias would actually make things worse, eg., I'd forget that modern Django isn't py2 tolerant any longer. Until it failed to restart the server or some such. |
| 21:26.47 | jelly | either venv or virtualenv are your friends? |
| 21:26.49 | martinm | okay, I'll forget about making it simple. venv isn't really much better, guess I just have to patch some she-bang lines |
| 21:27.15 | martinm | nah, venv is only better than setting up DLL hell by hand |
| 21:27.19 | martinm | IMO :-) |
| 21:28.11 | jhutchins_wk | martinm: Does django/python not have the ability to get it's code path from an environment variable or switch, like java and oracle do? |
| 21:28.36 | jhutchins_wk | !python |
| 21:28.36 | dpkg | Python is a very nice scripting language, easy to learn and still quite powerful and elegant if you know how to use it. See http://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide . #python and ##python on irc.freenode.net, #python on irc.oftc.net. See also <python 2.6>, <python 2.7> and <python 3>. |
| 21:29.02 | jhutchins_wk | !python 3 |
| 21:29.03 | dpkg | Python 3 is available in the python3 package and installs /usr/bin/python3 for you. Don't be tempted to change the symlink for /usr/bin/python to point to a Python 3 interpreter as that is supposed to be for Python 2 and lots of things will break if you change it. If you want Python 3, invoke 'python3'; explicit is better than implicit! |
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| 21:30.32 | martinm | jhutchins_wk: thanks, but I've been using Python in (mostly) Debian setting since Py1.5 IIRC. And I've been bemoaning Python's lack of clue about versioning almost as long. You'd think I'd be used to it by now :-/ |
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| 21:31.07 | martinm | amazing... apparently my optimism hasn't worn out entirely yet! |
| 21:31.48 | CaptainDusty | humbot: You raise a valid alias - but update alternatives exists for a reason :P I've certainly ran into the exact same issue before, though I forget what I was attempting to achieve. |
| 21:32.12 | martinm | Okay, thanks all! Back to plan, this was B, C was deprecated already... D? :-) |
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| 22:09.42 | kilobyte_ch | Anyond having a multistrap minimal debian buster config ready? |
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| 22:09.52 | Akuw | hi |
| 22:10.05 | Akuw | this problem wit samba is a hueso duro |
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| 22:17.54 | Akuw | i install samba in my virtual machine debian and work without any problem |
| 22:23.15 | humbot | have you compared configs? |
| 22:24.20 | Akuw | i will check 2 lines |
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| 22:38.32 | Akuw | no way |
| 22:38.46 | Akuw | there is something in centos blocking client |
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| 23:35.58 | whislock | Check your SELinux configuration. |
| 23:36.17 | whislock | If you're trying to access your home directory over samba, there's a SELinux boolean that has to be adjusted. |
| 23:36.19 | whislock | Akuw: ^ |
| 23:36.51 | Akuw | i am using this /samba/user |
| 23:36.57 | Akuw | not home |
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| 23:37.00 | Akuw | thanks |
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| 23:41.28 | SerajewelKS | semi-OT: any experiences using WD elements external drives with md raid1 as a backup destination? are they decent hardware or junk? |
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