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| 00:15.36 | urk | ok. I am back after getting logged out at the library. My current configuration file is http://paste.debian.net/1108768/, but get a lot of errors such as those found at http://paste.debian.net/1108769/ |
| 00:16.20 | urk | What does this Clearsigned file not valid, and how do i correct it? |
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| 00:21.56 | J_C | urk: sounds like a problem with the network. have you logged in properly? does the library wifi require authentication? |
| 00:23.54 | urk | Ok, the authentification got rid of some of it, but I have some dupes at 2,8, 13, and 16, but it isn't apparent to me what should be deleted. |
| 00:24.35 | J_C | urk: how do you mean 'dupes'? are you talking about your sources list? |
| 00:25.11 | kingsley | Why is systemd more controversial than the kernel? Both are big. Bugs? |
| 00:25.19 | urk | J_C> Yes |
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| 00:30.39 | J_C | urk: seems like you've got some parts of the sources.list commented out, and some missing outright. delete lines 1 through 5, and lines 12 and 13. uncomment (by removing the # symbol) lines 7 and 15. on line 10, place the following text: "deb-src http://deb.debian.org/debian/ buster-updates main contrib non-free" (without quotations) |
| 00:31.10 | J_C | save the file, then run "apt update" |
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| 00:37.49 | urk | I am being logged off at the library, but pulled up IRC on the laptop. |
| 00:38.19 | urk91 | J_C> here is the latest status of the update. i think I did something wrong. |
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| 00:39.28 | urk91 | Looks like something is wrong with lines 13 & 16. |
| 00:41.17 | urk91 | I noticed that the security updates are not valid, but it says they will be valid in a few hours. Should I leave that comment in the configuration file? |
| 00:42.01 | urk91 | maybe tesla needs to start making electric ships. |
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| 00:43.44 | urk91 | signing off. The library is closing. |
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| 00:47.42 | J_C | urk: if you mean line 13 from the most recent sources.list you posted, you should delete that line along with the other changes i advised per my previous message |
| 00:48.15 | J_C | ah, they're gone. :( |
| 00:48.22 | oiaohm | kingsley: systemd has been kind of controversial for a few reasons the project merges into systemd make it clear how much of the init process was and is being maintained by redhat. Systemd also requires people to change the way they do things and humans resist change. |
| 00:49.14 | oiaohm | kingsley: and the need for a different service start up solution particular one using cgroups traces back to early Linux kernel issue causes by Linus miss reading the posix standard and doing process management sightly differently. |
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| 00:53.30 | kingsley | oiaohm: One of your explanations of why systemd is more controversial than linux's kernel seems plausible to me: It's newer. |
| 00:53.55 | somiaj | systemd has some nice features, though my biggest complaint is it should have been made more modular |
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| 00:57.48 | oiaohm | somiaj: define modular. Those building systemd for embedded use it quite modular. |
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| 00:58.45 | oiaohm | One of the prior problems systemd set out to address was all the different independent projects that made up init that you had to have matched versions so that everything already worked. |
| 00:58.57 | somiaj | oiaohm: for a user to enable disable the pieces they need. I've never built systemd, so unsure how much control you have at that level. |
| 00:59.01 | oiaohm | Yes consolekit breaking because you had wrong udev and items like that. |
| 00:59.26 | somiaj | but overall I found debian introduced systemd nicely, for the most part I didn't notice the change. |
| 00:59.30 | oiaohm | Lot of that problem is packaging. |
| 01:00.08 | oiaohm | Like you can run systemd without journald by just deleting and removing journald the systemctl complains but still works. |
| 01:01.11 | oiaohm | The idea that parts of systemd cannot disabled is mostly that people have not tried. Systemd mandating cgroups so process tracking would work upset a lot. |
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| 01:03.44 | J_C | yes, a common reason i see spoken among discussions like these is that systemd allegedly strays from the UNIX philosophy |
| 01:04.08 | sponix | J_C: the KISS one ? |
| 01:04.13 | oiaohm | https://freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/MinimalBuilds/ Some of it comes from the documentation here. |
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| 01:04.34 | Domains | new site for coding http://godlikelunatics.freeforums.net/ |
| 01:04.36 | oiaohm | That a bare min build of system from source built 3 parts systemd core udev and journald. |
| 01:04.43 | oiaohm | system/systemd |
| 01:04.45 | J_C | sponix: i think so. the "do one thing and do it well" one |
| 01:04.54 | oiaohm | Those working in embedded found out it can go down to 2. |
| 01:04.59 | sponix | J_C: KISS = Keep It Simple Stupid ;) |
| 01:05.05 | oiaohm | You build 3 you delete journald and it still works. |
| 01:06.00 | somiaj | Domains: this is not the place to advertise such things. |
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| 01:06.18 | J_C | sponix: yes i know, i didn't know if KISS embodied the philosophy i mentioned before. :) |
| 01:06.23 | oiaohm | J_C: where is something like gnu coreutils to the UNIX philosophy |
| 01:06.45 | oiaohm | Reality is systemd and gnu coreutils has a lot in common in project design. |
| 01:07.03 | soda | 1. is there some way i can apt-get NOT install? (in other words, use apt-get to "just GET the package"? and if so, then 2. where on the directory structure would the package be "apt-gotten" to? (IOW "downloaded" to?) |
| 01:07.25 | oiaohm | Pull stack of individual projects into 1 project so that you now have multi maintainers so the complete project does not stop because one maintainer is no longer accessable. |
| 01:07.38 | J_C | oiaohm: you'd have to ask someone who cares enough about it. i feel that they're means to an end. i don't really care much for the systemd controversy. :) |
| 01:08.42 | oiaohm | J_C: it a question to remember to throw at them and watch them get screwed because most of their arguements against systemd could be used as anti gnu coreutils. |
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| 01:09.31 | sponix | oiaohm: does systemd in face do things _better_ though ? |
| 01:09.42 | sponix | "in fact" |
| 01:09.59 | J_C | oiaohm: yeah, i'll have to remember that question |
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| 01:11.01 | sponix | Like if I take say MX Linux ... Put a clone of it in a VM -- Run one with standard init, and install the optional systemd in the other -- what difference am I going to notice, other than systemd is MUCH more complex ? |
| 01:11.16 | sponix | Is it going to shave 5 milliseconds of my boot time ? |
| 01:11.51 | oiaohm | soda: you would be looking for the --download-only flag that downloads all the parts to /var/cache/apt/archives as normal but then does not install them. This can be useful for getting files to install on offline machines. |
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| 01:12.53 | oiaohm | sponix: You have started with a mistake that systemd is way more complex. Its different. Remember bash as a tcp client in it. So that shell you init is using is a highly complex bit of works and possible a large nasty security hole in itself. |
| 01:13.16 | soda | oiaohm: EXACTLY. That is exactly what I am trying to achieve with this command. Thank you! |
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| 01:15.25 | oiaohm | sponix: one of the reasons why systemd is used embedded is cut to the bare bones it is in fact less complex than a normal init/script combination when you have to audit it. You have functional service watchdogs with systemd this comes from the better process tracking caused by using cgroups and being faster is just icing on the cake. |
| 01:15.26 | sponix | oiaohm: init shouldn't be using "bash" anyway /bin/sh is normally something much more stripped down - you didn't notice that ? |
| 01:15.47 | ectospasm | SysV init is essentially linear, one startup script can keep the entire system from booting and it won't always be clear why. Systemd adds parallelism which *can* boot MUCH faster. |
| 01:16.30 | sponix | ectospasm: see, there you are onto something I can get behind |
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| 01:18.20 | ectospasm | Systemd introduces proper dependencies as well, so you can guarantee service B won't start until service A is up and online. |
| 01:18.40 | sponix | ectospasm: well, that dep hell just makes things linear again :) |
| 01:18.44 | oiaohm | sponix: should not and what happens real world are two different things. Remember sysvinit scripts are commonly provided by third parties yes you do find ones with #!/bin/bash so you are now running some random script with random interpret at highest possible privilege just because you missed something. Systemd unit files basically gave a nice tight limit. |
| 01:19.46 | ectospasm | sponix: but it's not exactly linear. Two service chains which don't have any interdependency can be started simultaneously with systemd. |
| 01:19.50 | sponix | ectospasm: but that does has its upside, I was able to tell my rtorrent not to run with systemd unless my networking was already up :) |
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| 01:20.52 | ectospasm | With SysV init they're essentially started in alphabetical order, which may not always be what you want. |
| 01:22.54 | sponix | ectospasm: hmm, not really, they are split up in different run levels for sequence, and then yes 00Servie goes before 20Service and so forth -- So kinda alphabetical in that way |
| 01:23.30 | ectospasm | But you are only in one runlevel at a time with SysV init. |
| 01:23.39 | sponix | Dream of making the boot process parallel was around since the early days though |
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| 01:24.09 | ectospasm | So everything in say, rc3.d gets started alphabetically. The only way to make things depend on something else is to put them later in the sequence. |
| 01:24.20 | ectospasm | Which is quite simple, and dumb at the same time. |
| 01:24.29 | sponix | So, if systemd is a step toward this, I guess it isn't as terrible as I thought |
| 01:25.00 | sponix | ectospasm: Yes, but "Simple" has been part of the Linux appeal (Slackware 1995 at least) |
| 01:25.05 | ectospasm | It's just vastly different than the old SysV way of doing things. |
| 01:25.30 | ectospasm | SysV predates Linux by at least five years! |
| 01:26.09 | soda | oiaohm: one other related question, then im out... hope i dont flood/clog up the channel with this a stupid question here (because i notice you guys have a *VERY* interesting and enlightening convo WRT systemd going on): does Ubuntu's "Software Manager" use apt-get (or any of its "parts", if it has any) on the backend? also, does Synaptic Package Manager use apt-get on the backend? (i give you my word ill lurk as soon as i get the answer to this |
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| 01:27.02 | sponix | oiaohm ectospasm : well thanks for the explanations of why systemd is becoming so popular, and why it can be useful or even better |
| 01:27.46 | ectospasm | soda: if Ubuntu is using dpkg for its backend, then yes. I haven't used Synaptic in so long I forget, but it's all built on dpkg. |
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| 01:27.48 | sponix | soda: Yes Ubuntu uses apt / apt-get and Synaptic does also |
| 01:29.52 | oiaohm | soda: ubuntu software manager has a few different backend apt is one of them. Remember you have snap and other things there as well. synaptic package manager also directly uses apt |
| 01:31.03 | soda | thank you so very much for that ectospasm, sponix, and oiaohm |
| 01:31.21 | soda | i suspected that was the case. |
| 01:32.28 | soda | so if that is SO, then WHY doesn't apt-get install save an archive of programs i downloaded using Ubuntu's Software Manager? (afterall, it seems to always do so whenever i summon apt-get from the command line!) |
| 01:32.32 | themill | (most things use libapt rather than calling cli tools) |
| 01:33.26 | oiaohm | Please do note take this as me like systemd I have my own fair share of hate for it. Just I hate sysvinit more when it comes to debugging problems that third parties manage to cause. |
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| 01:34.26 | soda | perhaps Ubuntu "summons apt-get on the backend using DIFFERENT FLAGS" (or perhaps the archives are somehow saved in a different location (or file format) when apt-get install is used by Ubuntu |
| 01:34.35 | soda | Ubuntu's Software MAnager?) |
| 01:35.05 | sponix | soda: If you want to know a lot more about Ubuntu specifics. I'm sure there is a channel for that right here on freenode |
| 01:35.22 | soda | sponix: sry to push my luck with the additional questions. |
| 01:35.47 | soda | im a newbie to linux (27 days) and newbie to irc too. |
| 01:35.55 | soda | thx for your help. |
| 01:35.58 | soda | lurks |
| 01:35.59 | sponix | I don't mind answering them... Most of my background is on Ubuntu based stuff (Linux Mint) |
| 01:36.18 | sponix | Just saying, there are other places where you might have better luck |
| 01:36.50 | ectospasm | #ubuntu is like drinking from the firehose, though. |
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| 01:37.17 | sponix | ectospasm: so busy you can't even catch the text as it scrolls by aye ? |
| 01:37.21 | soda | the reason i ask is because... |
| 01:37.52 | ectospasm | sponix: exactly |
| 01:38.35 | soda | i always trust an installer that is ON my hard drive to be there when i need it. (a repository OTOH could theoretically be inaccessible at a future point in time, for *ANY NUMBER* of reasons) |
| 01:39.27 | soda | i suppose it's therefore "SAFER" to download using apt-get instead of Ubuntu Software Manager |
| 01:40.07 | soda | re-lurks |
| 01:40.36 | sponix | soda: the "Software Manager" is the recommended method, especially for newer users -- on Ubuntu stuff |
| 01:40.53 | themill | there's a keep-downloaded-packages setting for each apt tool that is relevant here |
| 01:41.45 | soda | sponix: Oh. is it "recommended" simply cuz its "easier for noobs"? or is there some kinda TECHNICAL advantage to using Ubuntu Software Mangaer, that I am not yet aware of? |
| 01:42.40 | sponix | soda: just because it is more friendly for n00bz |
| 01:42.52 | soda | sponix: ok. :) |
| 01:44.44 | themill | partly because it does things like clean up after itself automatically |
| 01:45.36 | soda | themill: ok. that might be a compellng advantage for U.S.M. over apt-get |
| 01:46.33 | soda | ive used BOTH, ever since instaling my linux a little less than a month ago. |
| 01:46.59 | soda | i wanted to get maximum granular control over the process |
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| 01:47.44 | soda | but i dont wanna "bite off more than i can chew" (apt-get APPEARS to be rather noob-friendly, so far though!) |
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| 01:48.17 | themill | you can also use apt instead of apt-get as apt will also clean the cached files after installation |
| 01:48.33 | soda | i just recently came from the "windows world." so im still new to a lot of these linux terms and concepts. |
| 01:49.32 | soda | themill: so in general, typing "apt at the command prompt" is preferable to tyiping apt-get? |
| 01:49.50 | themill | for interactive use it is marginally better |
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| 01:50.25 | soda | u mean like: "sudo apt install <nameofutil>"? |
| 01:54.33 | soda | ok. did it. it works! \o/ |
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| 01:55.05 | soda | (i just tested it by downloading htop. which i have been meaning to install for a while.) |
| 01:55.15 | soda | lurks |
| 01:55.42 | sponix | I like mate-system-monitor (GUI) |
| 01:55.54 | sponix | to the point, I even install that on my xfce rigs |
| 01:56.02 | sponix | only has a few deps |
| 01:57.31 | soda | yeah. my linuxmint os which im running right now has that as the default i believe. |
| 01:58.01 | soda | but it requires more resources, plus it cannot be run from the tty as far as i know |
| 01:59.19 | sponix | soda: Well, you know your Linux Mint install has hexchat configured to connect to spotchat network and join #LinuxMint-help by default ? |
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| 02:00.38 | soda | sponix: yeah. i asked too many questions there already. :) might irk ppl if i do it too much. (im prob irking u guys right now. lol) |
| 02:01.36 | sponix | soda: Well, you should lurk in the #LinuxMint-chat over there also. Questions normally don't bother "us" |
| 02:02.22 | soda | sponix: Good. :) i give you my word i will not abuse my priveledge, tho. |
| 02:02.37 | soda | thx for being extremelyhelpful |
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| 02:04.15 | soda | </newb-ques>... re-re-lurks |
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| 02:47.12 | kingsley | somiaj: I'm curious if your preference for systemd being more modular also applies to the linux kernel. |
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| 02:49.04 | oiaohm | kingsley: reality if you look closely at systemd is already quite modular. |
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| 02:50.49 | kingsley | oiaohm: That's interesting. If it would be convenient, comfortable, and all those good things, maybe you elaborate on what you consider "modular". |
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| 02:54.27 | oiaohm | kingsley: systemd as a project is a collection of different programs. Many of those programs will run and work even if systemd is not your init system. |
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| 02:55.16 | kingsley | oiaohm: I understand your reason. Thanks. |
| 02:57.06 | oiaohm | Yes there are areas like systemd-logind that does require more work to work with other init solutions but it to work perfectly cgroups has to be used. This cgroup requirement is due to a limitation caused by the Linux kernel implementation of processes. |
| 02:58.22 | oiaohm | kingsley: https://github.com/elogind/elogind this has required extra patches that really in a lot of ways should go mainline. |
| 02:59.06 | oiaohm | Big thing I would like to see is systemd built system altered so you can choose to build like systemd-logind without building udev/journald and systemd service management. |
| 02:59.46 | kingsley | If "modular" is defined as parts that can run independently, I suppose it could be argued that systemd is more modular than the linux kernel. |
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| 03:01.09 | oiaohm | The code of systemd is highly modular. The build system is a ass. |
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| 03:02.46 | kingsley | oiaohm: Again, if it would be convenient, comfortable, and all those good things, I'd be interested in any explanation you may have for my observation that upgrading individual packages in Debian's unstable distribution seems to me to also require upgrading systemd and udev more often than the linux kernel. |
| 03:03.19 | oiaohm | lot of parties ask for modular are are meaning independent projects like sysvinit solutions were. Completely missing the screws ups of having like X version of udev with Y version of consolekit and now system does not work . |
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| 03:03.50 | oiaohm | A stack of different projects with stack of different version numbers and you require the parts synced so they work comes a complete nightmare. |
| 03:04.31 | oiaohm | Same problem use to happen with what was moved into gnu coreutils way back in time. |
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| 03:06.19 | JadedJ | Hi, how can I install Debian 10 testing? |
| 03:06.30 | JadedJ | I have already installed a minimal install of debian 10 stable |
| 03:06.53 | JadedJ | I followed this guide. https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTesting |
| 03:07.12 | JadedJ | But I'm stuck at the part where it says 'Verify that your installation is not fixed to a specific release in' |
| 03:07.17 | oiaohm | kingsley: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/releases << systemd is on a roughly 2 months release cycle compared to Linux kernel LTS that is like yearly. |
| 03:07.37 | JadedJ | I don't have a file in the path '/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/00default-release' |
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| 03:08.16 | kingsley | oiaohm: Is my understanding correct that version dependencies are a concern with init software like systemd? |
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| 03:09.27 | kingsley | JadedJ: Humble suggestions: 1.) Ask in the #debian-next channel of the OFTC network. 2.) Don't use DVDs. |
| 03:09.34 | oiaohm | JadedJ: I don't have that file either and I installed this system using debian testing install media. |
| 03:09.43 | JadedJ | Hmmmm |
| 03:10.21 | JadedJ | debian-next is invite only |
| 03:10.37 | oiaohm | JadedJ: its not on this network. |
| 03:10.47 | oiaohm | JadedJ: its on the OFTC irc network. |
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| 03:12.14 | oiaohm | kingsley: with systemd make that version dependancy problem simple for systemd builds. You just download systemd project build it and everything is already in sync. Before systemd with sysvinit and other init systems it was download udev, consolekit.... and cross you fingers you had download compadible versions. |
| 03:13.04 | oiaohm | kingsley: this is also why busybox end up doing like a systemd as well and having it own internal init and mdev solution instead of udev. |
| 03:14.23 | kingsley | oiaohm: Do you happen to have an opinion on how well Debian's package dependencies work? |
| 03:15.30 | oiaohm | kingsley: lot of ways it works well but its really the wrong solution. |
| 03:15.51 | oiaohm | ELF dynamic applications were design with a loader binary. |
| 03:16.28 | oiaohm | That was in fact designed in for compatibility reasons. We do not have a easy way at this stage to change the loader that loads the binary. |
| 03:17.08 | kingsley | oiaohm: Can you suggest a better way to reconcile package dependencies than Debian? |
| 03:17.15 | oiaohm | I am mucking around when I feel like it to see if I can get xttr on file system to be able to be used to change the loader. So binary file no modified but using different loader so allowing dependancy hell to possible be solved. |
| 03:17.53 | oiaohm | Really its accepting the fact that it will not always be possible to reconcile package dependencies with the applications users want. |
| 03:18.09 | oiaohm | So you will need to support at times conflits in dependancies. |
| 03:20.31 | oiaohm | kingsley: some time look at nix and it patchelf usage to change the loader. Doing this would allow you to say X program is debian stable. Y program is debian testing Z program is debian sid and have different ld.so for each with different directories to look up for dependancies. |
| 03:20.38 | kingsley | oiaohm: Have you had the opportunity to check out Debian's apps for reconciling versions? It has many. |
| 03:21.14 | oiaohm | I have had a few cases of the years off dependancy hell with debian forcing me to chroot an application I need. |
| 03:21.36 | oiaohm | Lot of ways that should not be required and wastes space. |
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| 03:22.28 | oiaohm | kingsley: please note I am not saying that debian does not do a decent job but there is a serous limitation to debian route. |
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| 03:23.33 | oiaohm | kingsley: have you ever looked at how nixos does it? |
| 03:24.09 | oiaohm | Please note I don't like the nixos bit of patching the binaries as that screws up system validation. |
| 03:25.47 | kingsley | oiaohm: I'm curious about how robustly Debian reconciles package dependencies. It seems to me to address an important topic: software complexity. Much like you mucking with the loader, I've been upgrading packages individually on Debian unstable for years. Graphs of some of what I found are at http://morse.kiwi.nz/kingsley/lib/exe/detail.php?id=technology%3Astart&media=technology:package_ages_on_a_debian_computer.png |
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| 03:27.57 | kingsley | oiaohm: Yes, I seem to recall I have looked at nixos. |
| 03:28.25 | kingsley | At the risk of appearing rude, I need to go soon... |
| 03:28.59 | oiaohm | kingsley: this is IRC people disappear without notice all the time. Its not rude its normal. |
| 03:29.57 | oiaohm | Even with a loader solution you still need some form of dependency resolve/deduplicate. |
| 03:30.03 | kingsley | oiaohm: Yes, you're right of course. I try to be a polite nice guy and observe common courtesies. |
| 03:30.44 | oiaohm | I have run debian testing set of update as much as possible and only run into minor issues. |
| 03:30.54 | oiaohm | Mostly with old software dependancy problems. |
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| 03:31.32 | oiaohm | As in you have document writting with X version of software does not open with newer so now you need to install X version and debian like no you are not doing that. |
| 03:31.54 | oiaohm | writting/written |
| 03:32.14 | SerajewelKS | oiaohm: debian packages expect to put files in specific locations. two versions of the same package cannot coexist simply because their contents could overlap. |
| 03:32.33 | SerajewelKS | oiaohm: there are plenty of mechanisms to get around this problem. chroots, custom-built packages, and containers all come to mind. |
| 03:32.38 | SerajewelKS | (this is not a Debian-specific problem) |
| 03:33.08 | SerajewelKS | there are some cases where having two versions installed _is_ supported (see python 2 and python 3 packages) |
| 03:33.20 | SerajewelKS | but it must be _explicitly_ planned and designed for |
| 03:33.51 | oiaohm | Common package manger design issue. nixos 0install and others showed there are ways around this. |
| 03:34.11 | SerajewelKS | there are ways around this. i just listed three options on Debian. |
| 03:35.22 | SerajewelKS | your initial statement of "A stack of different projects with stack of different version numbers" sounds like the right solution is containers |
| 03:35.39 | SerajewelKS | this is one of the primary issues that containerization is designed to address |
| 03:35.42 | oiaohm | custom build packages really does not work out when its an exact binary issue required. Change in complier can change way some programs process there save files. |
| 03:36.06 | oiaohm | chroot and containers end up being the options you have to go with with the disk space hit. |
| 03:36.11 | SerajewelKS | you can use whatever compatible compiler you need to but that's beside the point |
| 03:36.20 | SerajewelKS | disk space is cheap |
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| 03:37.03 | SerajewelKS | it's usually a better use of your time to get an additional disk vs. spending hours custom-building things |
| 03:37.38 | SerajewelKS | as a side benefit you get better isolation between processes as well as better portability (now your application stack can run on _any_ distro supporting your container software) |
| 03:38.09 | oiaohm | I am not looking at the custom build route. |
| 03:38.29 | oiaohm | I am looking at alter the binary loader for minor incompadibleis |
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| 03:38.47 | SerajewelKS | well, good luck... |
| 03:39.20 | SerajewelKS | seems like a weird way to spend time unless you like tinkering with that kind of stuff |
| 03:39.58 | SerajewelKS | seems like building a container would take less time and be more reusable but *shrug* |
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| 03:48.04 | Data44 | Hello all. Anybody know a good command to use in a bash script to get the next instance of a date? For example, to always output the next instance of the 28th day of the month. Kind of like a rolling due date. |
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| 03:48.33 | Josh` | I'd like to set up debian as a headless bluetooth receiver. While many guides exist, they all seem to be outdated. is there an updated guide for debian buster? |
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| 03:52.52 | oiaohm | SerajewelKS: messing with the loader is also comes about looking at having something better than binfmt_misc for .exe files run by wine. binfmt_misc does not work with multi wine prefixes well. |
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| 04:09.25 | SerajewelKS | Data44: you may need to describe that more precisely |
| 04:11.47 | SerajewelKS | Data44: i can think of a few possible solutions to a few possible meanings of your request, but as it's a bit ambiguous i don't know which answer to give |
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| 04:21.57 | soda | i just discovered that "super cow powers" is a JOKE! (i had been curious about that, ever since first firing up apt-get) |
| 04:23.19 | rwp | A joke and a program easter egg! |
| 04:23.38 | soda | is that kinda thing "common" to linux? |
| 04:23.52 | rwp | Have you mood today? |
| 04:24.17 | rwp | Easter eggs are very common to programs in general. |
| 04:24.30 | soda | I just did moo, actually. :) |
| 04:24.33 | rwp | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_egg_(media) |
| 04:24.37 | soda | literlly. |
| 04:24.45 | rwp | Try: apt-get moo |
| 04:25.05 | soda | rwp: oh cool it makes cow. |
| 04:25.11 | rwp | Try: aptitude moo |
| 04:25.13 | soda | just like cowsay |
| 04:25.40 | rwp | That aptitude says it has no easter eggs is itself an easter egg. |
| 04:25.51 | soda | it says it doesnt have any |
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| 04:26.43 | rwp | Of course it *says* it doesn't have any. But the act of saying it is itself an easter egg. :-) |
| 04:28.44 | soda | try aptitude -v moo... then keep going with more "-v"s... |
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| 04:29.29 | soda | (i just read that online, just now.) |
| 04:29.36 | soda | on stackexchamge |
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| 04:33.01 | somiaj | aptitude -v moo; aptitude -vv moo; aptitude -vvv moo; and so on |
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| 04:42.02 | soda | exactly. it makes what looks like a mountain but its actually a snake that ate an elephant |
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| 04:43.40 | soda | BTW, what "DRM" (Digital Rights Management"), IF any, is built into DEbian, Ubuntu, and/or LinuxMint? ANybody know anything about this? (I ask, because I keep finding folders under "DRM"! |
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| 04:46.58 | soda | im using linuxmint |
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| 04:47.45 | soda | rwp: (btw, thanks for pointing out that easter egg thing) |
| 04:47.53 | somiaj | dpkg -S path gives package that owns that path, but you should really be asking mint about their os. |
| 04:47.53 | dpkg | You Fool! path gives package that owns that path, but you should really be asking mint about their os. is installed! |
| 04:47.55 | sponix | soda: I'm not sure what it stands for in this usage, but the term DRM is also used in video drivers and other such places. Not always meaning the "locked content" way you are thinking |
| 04:48.00 | themill | !drm |
| 04:48.01 | dpkg | i heard drm is Direct Rendering Manager, a <DRI> component (http://dri.freedesktop.org/wiki/DRM, http://dri.sf.net/doc/drm_low_level.html), or Digital Rights Management (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management) |
| 04:48.05 | somiaj | I don't know if I have seen any drm |
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| 04:48.12 | rwp | soda, :-) |
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| 04:49.36 | soda | ok. wow that was fast. thx sponix and themill and somiaj! |
| 04:50.08 | soda | is this dpkg fella a bot? |
| 04:50.29 | themill | dpkg, botsnack |
| 04:50.29 | dpkg | themill: :) |
| 04:50.41 | soda | !drm |
| 04:50.41 | dpkg | i guess drm is Direct Rendering Manager, a <DRI> component (http://dri.freedesktop.org/wiki/DRM, http://dri.sf.net/doc/drm_low_level.html), or Digital Rights Management (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management) |
| 04:50.56 | soda | i see... |
| 04:51.38 | soda | what commands can he take? can he roll over or fetch? (seriously tho, what commands DOES he take? do they all precede with a ! symbol?) |
| 04:52.20 | soda | !apt-get |
| 04:52.20 | dpkg | apt-get is a program (part of the apt package) used as a simple command line tool to libapt. apt-get is the original frontend for <apt>, but <aptitude> is now the recommended tool for managing packages. See also <why aptitude>, <reference>, <synaptic>, <apt-cache>, <gdebi>. http://wiki.debian.org/apt-get http://tinyurl.com/3g4d4d9 |
| 04:52.27 | soda | !ubuntu |
| 04:52.27 | dpkg | Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian. Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu on chat.freenode.net instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>. |
| 04:52.37 | soda | woah. |
| 04:53.13 | soda | uh oh. lol |
| 04:53.32 | soda | i just read that last part. ill try not to be too offtopic :) |
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| 04:53.40 | soda | !linuxmint |
| 04:53.40 | dpkg | Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at http://forums.linuxmint.com/ or join #linuxmint-help on irc.spotchat.org for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>. |
| 04:54.01 | soda | !mint |
| 04:54.01 | dpkg | Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at http://forums.linuxmint.com/ or join #linuxmint-help on irc.spotchat.org for support. Linux Mint is variously based on <Ubuntu> with a "Linux Mint Debian Edition" (LMDE) also available. See also <based on debian>, <mintppc>. |
| 04:54.08 | soda | !linux |
| 04:54.08 | dpkg | somebody said linux was closed |
| 04:54.09 | somiaj | Please dont spam the channel, /msg the bot |
| 04:54.20 | soda | somiaj: ok. |
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| 04:55.11 | soda | goes OUTSIDE the house to play with doggie... |
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| 05:03.12 | soda | LOL @ what dpkg says about windows and apple! |
| 05:08.12 | Data44 | SerajewelKS: A command to output, in MM/DD/YYYY format, the next instance of nth day, e.g., let's say I want to output the next MM/23 date, currently it would output 10/23/2019, but on 10/25/2019 it would output 11/23/2019, and on 11/2 it would still say 11/23/2019, but on 11/24 it would say 12/23/2019. |
| 05:08.43 | soda | LOL! "DOS: Descent Operating SYstem" |
| 05:08.57 | soda | decent game |
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| 05:14.16 | SerajewelKS | Data44: what would it say on 10/23? |
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| 05:14.37 | somiaj | soda: this is a support channel for debian OS, you are mostly off-topic. |
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| 05:18.58 | Data44 | SerajewelKS I suppose having it say 11/23 would work best in my use case. |
| 05:19.38 | somiaj | Data44: you could use date to do this |
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| 05:23.21 | SerajewelKS | Data44: what about a script like this: http://paste.debian.net/plain/1108818 |
| 05:24.13 | SerajewelKS | date has no built-in mechanism to do this, but this script asks what day of the month it currently is; if it's >= the date of the month you're asking for, it pushes to next month. then hard-codes the day of month in the output to be the one you're asking about. |
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| 05:24.43 | somiaj | date -d "now next day" "+%m/%d" |
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| 05:25.12 | SerajewelKS | i don't know how that answers his question |
| 05:25.15 | somiaj | oh wait, that is the next day... |
| 05:25.21 | SerajewelKS | yeah |
| 05:26.06 | SerajewelKS | i don't think there is a way to do this in a script using date without invoking date twice. which is fine, that's why we have scripts in the first place: to do stuff with utilities that they can't do by themselves. |
| 05:26.36 | Data44 | SerajewelKS Looks like it will do nicely, thanks! |
| 05:26.42 | SerajewelKS | np |
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| 05:27.19 | SerajewelKS | obviously if you give it something that's not an integer between 1 and 31 then it might do lots of other weird stuff |
| 05:27.30 | SerajewelKS | and less obviously, integers between 29 and 31 may not work correctly either |
| 05:28.04 | SerajewelKS | since not all months have those dates |
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| 05:28.45 | SerajewelKS | but input integers in the range 1-28 should work consistently |
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| 05:31.04 | somiaj | hmm, wish I could find more info on the --date=STRING |
| 05:32.13 | Data44 | Alright. I'll keep that in mind. I try to avoid having billing cycles on those dates for the same reason, so I should be safe for awhile. |
| 05:32.35 | SerajewelKS | somiaj: 'info date' |
| 05:32.56 | SerajewelKS | i already looked in there, unless i missed something you can't do what he asks with that string alone |
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| 05:34.04 | somiaj | yea, I didn't have info installed, was looking online. And I agree, I don't see something that allows a conditional or even next day is 23 |
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| 06:22.54 | warsoul | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:23.01 | warsoul | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:23.13 | warsoul | sorry |
| 06:23.31 | warsoul | missed typed |
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| 07:03.12 | Zeptic | yo? |
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| 07:04.13 | Zeptic | where the dark-Army at |
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| 07:43.10 | wrksx | h |
| 07:43.19 | wrksx | <PROTECTED> |
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| 07:46.30 | Psyndrome | hi |
| 07:47.46 | Psyndrome | Is there a way to use my full capacity of RAM? |
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| 07:49.44 | colo-work | run a 64bit kernel? |
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| 07:51.47 | Psyndrome | Well it should be because the system is 64bit |
| 07:53.06 | colo-work | then you're already golden |
| 07:53.14 | colo-work | relax, sit back, and enjoy the ride |
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| 07:53.54 | Psyndrome | But when i open the system monitor screen it says memory 3.3gb |
| 07:54.08 | oiaohm | Psyndrome: normally Linux systems will use all the ram they have. What is not used by applications normally end up filled by disc cache. |
| 07:54.59 | colo-work | Psyndrome, what does `uname -m` on your shell produce? |
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| 07:56.15 | Psyndrome | x86_64 |
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| 08:01.51 | klys | psyndrome, $ less /proc/meminfo |
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| 08:07.11 | Psyndrome | its a long list of numbers... |
| 08:08.00 | klys | psyndrome, the top line should say MemTotal. |
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| 08:10.17 | Psyndrome | <PROTECTED> |
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| 08:10.39 | klys | psyndrome, how much ram do you have installed? |
| 08:10.57 | Psyndrome | It is 4gb |
| 08:11.29 | klys | I have 6 GiB and it shows MemTotal: 5807648 kB |
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| 08:13.56 | Psyndrome | So the system is using that portion? |
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| 08:18.00 | klys | found this line in dmesg | grep Memory; [ 0.000000] Memory: 5662108K/6005604K available (14364K kernel code, 1605K rwdata, 4640K rodata, 1604K init, 524K bss, 343496K reserved, 0K cma-reserved) |
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| 08:28.06 | gidna | Hello |
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| 08:28.16 | gidna | Which package provides "convert" ? |
| 08:29.58 | themill | imagemagick (via several indirections) |
| 08:30.19 | colo-work | also, graphicsmagick with graphicsmagick-imagemagick-compat |
| 08:30.19 | gidna | ok got it I think is this: graphicsmagick-imagemagick-compat |
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| 09:03.39 | jelly | ,file bin/convert* |
| 09:03.44 | judd | Search for bin/convert* in buster/amd64: [truncated] ncbi-blast+: usr/bin/convert2blastmask; python3-presto: usr/bin/ConvertHeaders.py; pixelmed-webstart-apps: usr/bin/ConvertAmicasJPEG2000FilesetToDicom; ncl-ncarg: usr/bin/ConvertMapData; imagemagick-6.q16hdri: usr/bin/convert-im6.q16hdri; caffe-tools-cuda: usr/bin/convert_cifar_data, usr/bin/convert_imageset, usr/bin/convert_mnist_data, |
| 09:03.45 | judd | usr/bin/convert_mnist_siamese_data; changeo: usr/bin/ConvertDb.py; foxtrotgps: usr/bin/convert2gpx, usr/bin/convert2osm; syrthes-tools: usr/bin/convert2syrthes4; quantlib-examples: usr/bin/ConvertibleBonds; bitseq: usr/bin/convertSamples; imagemagick-6.q16: usr/bin/convert-im6.q16; graphicsmagick-imagemagick-compat: usr/bin/convert; lilypond: usr/bin/convert-ly; sim4db: (1 more message) |
| 09:03.54 | jelly | omgwtf |
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| 09:04.38 | colo-work | hehe |
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| 09:09.46 | ratrace | you axed it, you gots the answers |
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| 09:46.35 | millaus564578568 | Ciao a tutti :)) |
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| 09:46.40 | millaus564578568 | Hi all |
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| 09:48.46 | millaus564578568 | i add in fstab file a string connection for samba direnctory and give credential with _netdev,credential=/home/credenziali but when i restart system it call root credential and when i give it say me _netdev,credential unknow option.... i've debian 10 buster |
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| 09:52.05 | Ether_Man | millaus564578568, 1. The options is credentials not credential. 2. You need to give it a path to an actual credentials file, not your home dir. |
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| 09:55.56 | ratrace | I think that IS the credentials file, it's just placed directly in /home/ |
| 09:56.09 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: ok the problem was credentials and not credential... thk u, but now i have failed to mount error -13, how can i see again the log booting cause i can see just "failed -13" |
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| 09:57.50 | _Fremen_ | hello everyone |
| 09:58.39 | _Fremen_ | I am currently installing debian and I had an error for "cannot reach security.debian.org" and found this solution online http://hdrlab.org.nz/articles/linux-troubleshooting/how-to-fix-cannot-access-security-debian-org/ |
| 09:58.57 | Ether_Man | millaus564578568, that's a permission denied error. Either it can't read your credentials file when it is mounting, or it is being denied access to the remote server with the credentials you provided. |
| 09:58.59 | _Fremen_ | Are there any alternative solutions I should try? |
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| 10:01.29 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: wich permission need atm /home/credenziali is -r-w-r--r-- |
| 10:01.35 | Simplar | Hey guys, can someone explain me what does `Enhanced support for edge to HPC workloads` means? |
| 10:01.43 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: wich permission need atm /home/credenziali is -rw-r--r-- |
| 10:01.58 | Simplar | Is it 'enhanced support for the cap performance of HPC'? |
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| 10:04.06 | Ether_Man | millaus564578568, generally, the permission would be 600/-rw------- since you don't really want just any user to be able to read the file. But permission on that file is unlikely to be the issue. But rather either the permission inside, or that the path is not available during that stage, such as that /home is itself a partition that is not yet mounted or similar. |
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| 10:05.24 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: dependency failed for remote filesystem |
| 10:06.44 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: u think is better i place the username and pwd in fstab? _netdev, usrname=*** .... where can i fint right sintax ? |
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| 10:08.47 | ratrace | millaus564578568: do you have /home as a separate partition? |
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| 10:09.34 | Ether_Man | millaus564578568, I doubt that's the issue. If it is, you can try it with manual mounting rather than going through fstab all the time. mount -v -t cifs //server/share /mnt -o username=username,password=password,domain=domain |
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| 10:10.18 | millaus564578568 | ratrace: no i have home in the same partition |
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| 10:10.29 | wrksx | My system has a permanent IP address, in my /etc/hosts, should I use: |
| 10:10.29 | wrksx | <my_ip> <my_host.my_domain.com> |
| 10:10.29 | wrksx | or |
| 10:10.29 | wrksx | <my_ip> <my_host.my_domain.com> <my_host> |
| 10:10.52 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: i just tryed with manual mount and it wark |
| 10:10.56 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: i just tryed with manual mount and it work |
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| 10:11.15 | Ether_Man | millaus564578568, then that's not going to cause an issue. fstab mounting during boot is done by init, which doesn't really care about what us puny mortals set as permissions :) |
| 10:11.41 | Ether_Man | Sounds more like you have an invalid credentials file |
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| 10:14.02 | no_gravity | Is there a way to start screen and bypass my screenrc? |
| 10:14.08 | millaus564578568 | Ether_Man: ok is not a permission problem but i used this comand mount -t cifs //192.168.1.200/miacartella -o user=usr1,pass=miapassword,uid=1000,gid=1000 /media/samba and work but fstab wont work |
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| 10:15.06 | no_gravity | Nevermind, the prob is not my screenrc |
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| 10:15.55 | no_gravity | Strange, when I run screen, it only uses 79x24 chars of the terminal. End when I exit screen, that size sticks and the terminal suddenly only uses 79x24 chars. Any ideas what that could be? |
| 10:17.09 | ratrace | wrksx: the second form |
| 10:17.31 | wrksx | ok thx ratrace |
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| 10:19.48 | Ether_Man | Don't suppose there's anything in the Stable repos that is similar to Portainer, but that runs on the host rather than inside docker? Don't like relying on Docker to manage Docker :/ |
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| 10:24.05 | annadane | weird question but does anyone remember that auto generating debian sources.list website? i'm installing testing on a vm and i can't remember what i need |
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| 10:24.39 | annadane | nvm i guess it's just https://debgen.simplylinux.ch/ |
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| 10:33.12 | Ether_Man | annadane, that site on some things. If you select the OMV repo as an example with Debian Stable, it selects Erasmus as the dist name for omv, but OMV erasmus is 3.x, which corresponds to Debian Jessie, so oldoldstable. OMV's distname corresponding to stable/buster is usul. Point is, verify what the site tells you before using, or you may end up with very incorrect settings |
| 10:33.25 | Ether_Man | that site is wrong on some things* |
| 10:33.52 | annadane | well i wouldn't use it if dpkg had a testing sources.list factoid |
| 10:34.10 | annadane | IIRC if you !testing sources.list it just tells you "if you have to ask you shouldn't be using it" |
| 10:34.27 | nkuttler | sounds about right |
| 10:34.36 | annadane | never mind |
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| 10:35.07 | annadane | the !bullseye sources.list kinda tells you... though not really |
| 10:35.16 | annadane | and yeah i don't disagree but i wish it would just *tell you* |
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| 10:36.19 | annadane | never mind; wiki tells you how |
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| 10:40.25 | hexnewbie | What would be a good way to ensure systemd-tmpfiles-setup.service starts on boot on Debian 9 so that services like ssh don't fail due to missing /run directories? I tried âsystemctl enable systemd-tmpfiles-setup.serviceâ, but it complains about a missing [Install] section. I've put âsystemctl start systemd-tmpfiles-setup.serviceâ in rc.local along with others to be able to SSH into the system, but |
| 10:40.26 | hexnewbie | that's not ideal. |
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| 10:43.23 | ratrace | hexnewbie: no need for tmpfiles, you can use the RuntimeDirectory unit directive |
| 10:43.53 | hexnewbie | ratrace: So I edit the services files for all services to add one? |
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| 10:44.44 | ratrace | hexnewbie: you can just add the overrides via systemctl edit <service unit name>.service and it'll open the $EDITOR |
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| 10:45.12 | gidna | HEllo |
| 10:45.18 | gidna | I've to write this character: Ã |
| 10:45.56 | hexnewbie | I know one was added for SSH in bug #864190, so maybe someone didn't upgrade this server for a very long time. Let me see if I can fix that. But I'm not into manually editing all 6 failing services. |
| 10:45.57 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/864190 in openssh-server (closed, patch): «openssh-server: Missing privilege separation directory: /run/sshd»; severity: important; opened: 2017-06-05; last modified: 2017-10-09. |
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| 10:46.48 | ratrace | hexnewbie: I found that service units on debian are in a bit of a sorry state. I fully rewrite all of them for services I use. |
| 10:47.25 | ratrace | it's primarily due to debian's policy to support multiple inits, so the systemd units are not fully taken advantage of, with proper daemon configuration and security features. |
| 10:48.54 | ratrace | (which btw I really hope will be solved for Bullseye and systemd set as the only init supported) |
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| 10:51.29 | Ede|Popede | is it possible to change the input in such a way that i can use the keyboard for (multi)click or button down and the mouse to move around? i used keyboard mouse years ago, but don't remember its options. or how hard it was to switch between mouse and keys on the number keys. not even if it was some hotkey or i had to type a command with options. |
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| 11:24.14 | wrksx | would you discourage using the ufw package to manage the firewall rules? |
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| 11:28.53 | ratrace | wrksx: nothing wrong with ufw, but I'd always recommend simplicity. iptables has ability to import and export state, which is taken advantage of by iptables-persistent package. That's how I run firewalls. |
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| 11:29.17 | ratrace | wrksx: for complex scenarios which might need an abstraction tool, I'd recommend shorewall. |
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| 11:40.54 | Furry_Kitty | Is Debian going to shift to SystemD, like in, going all the way in, fully utilizing it? Because, there is Devuan as the non-systemD Debian for the people who do not like SystemD, it's inefficient for Debian to do both SystemD and SysVInit imho. |
| 11:43.11 | diogenes_ | Furry_Kitty, Debian is not making Devuan. |
| 11:43.13 | diogenes_ | !devuan |
| 11:43.14 | dpkg | Devuan (https://devuan.org/) is a Debian <derivative>, meant to avoid dependencies on <systemd>. Not supported in #debian, please see #devuan on chat.freenode.net for support. |
| 11:43.47 | Furry_Kitty | Okay |
| 11:44.55 | ratrace | Furry_Kitty: I surely hope that for Bullseye and onward, Debian would implement the one init policy and support systemd only. |
| 11:45.32 | Furry_Kitty | Is this chat (this Debian one) is the official Debian IRC chat, that's connected to the Debian project? |
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| 11:47.42 | ratrace | Furry_Kitty: this channel is about Debian Linux yes, not sure if it's "official" or "unofficially official" :) since "officially official" would be debian channels on OFTC |
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| 11:55.20 | wrksx | ratrace: thanks, I'll check into iptable-persistant, that might be a nice one. Ufw is dead simple that's what I liked, specialy since I have a very simple use case |
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| 11:57.13 | Furry_Kitty | ratrace: ok. |
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| 12:00.37 | countdr | <PROTECTED> |
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| 12:08.19 | millaus564578568 | Hellooooooooooo!!! |
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| 12:09.51 | jelly | Furry_Kitty: the official official #debian channel is on irc.oftc.net (= irc.debian.org), OFTC network |
| 12:10.16 | Furry_Kitty | jelly: Thanks. |
| 12:10.27 | jelly | but this one is bigger! |
| 12:10.33 | Furry_Kitty | Ok |
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| 12:13.22 | Lope | are /dev/mdN first come first serve? |
| 12:13.48 | Lope | so if I make an array on some disks, and connect/disconnect different from a system the number of md will change? |
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| 12:14.08 | Lope | in the same way that /dev/sdX depends on the port order? |
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| 12:15.39 | countdr | mdX is on the command line though |
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| 12:17.42 | Lope | what other place is there besides the commandline? |
| 12:18.09 | countdr | man mdadm There is a file in etc |
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| 12:20.02 | Lope | The machine I'm working on has /dev/md0. I'm setting up what will be the boot drive of another machine. I've created /dev/md1 on that drive. And I'm expecting that when I connect the new drive to the new machine, the array will be /dev/md0 ? |
| 12:20.16 | Lope | because it'll be the first array found? is that how it works? |
| 12:20.39 | darxmurf | quick question about MDADM, how do the system choose to put a disk in fail mode? I have a RAID1 with 2x1Tb SSD samsung which losts a disk this week-end. I installed a new disk in there but the failed one is listed as good by the windows samsung tool with only 27Tb of use and 2 CRC errors |
| 12:21.37 | Lope | mdadm --detail /dev/mdN; mdadm --fail /dev/sdXn |
| 12:22.16 | Lope | Sorry that's wrong. |
| 12:22.26 | Lope | mdadm /dev/mdN --fail /dev/sdXn |
| 12:22.44 | Lope | mdadm /dev/mdN --remove /dev/sdXn |
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| 12:26.12 | countdr | darxmurf: Some times solid state gives bad data without knowing it.. A format may help. |
| 12:26.58 | jelly | darxmurf: #linux-raid channel might know |
| 12:28.01 | jelly | there's a small amount of read errors tolerated before failing a raid1 member IIRC |
| 12:28.36 | countdr | Mmm. I think what happened is that the SSD gave a bad raid meta data |
| 12:28.45 | darxmurf | okay, and the 2 CRC errors played a role too I would say |
| 12:29.13 | darxmurf | mdadm is probably quite sensible about that and prefers to fail it. |
| 12:29.25 | countdr | I believe that your SSD is fine. |
| 12:29.32 | darxmurf | it looks like :D |
| 12:29.34 | annadane | is this description wrong? https://packages.debian.org/buster/kde-plasma-desktop "This metapackage pulls in the core modules released with the KDE Software Compilation including the basic KDE Plasma Desktop, minimal set of basic applications (browser, file manager, text editor, system settings, panel, etc.), important libraries and data." i'm looking for firefox in 'browser' and i can't find it (which is the stock |
| 12:29.34 | annadane | browser that comes with debian) |
| 12:29.35 | darxmurf | I'll keep it |
| 12:29.44 | darxmurf | I changed it anyway in the server |
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| 12:32.10 | jelly | annadane: it probably is. task-kde-desktop however Depends: [...] firefox-esr | firefox. |
| 12:33.04 | jelly | annadane: or they might count konqueror as browser |
| 12:33.12 | annadane | ugh konqueror |
| 12:33.15 | annadane | but yeah i didn't think of that |
| 12:33.24 | diogenes_ | annadane, or Falkon. |
| 12:33.46 | jelly | TECHNICALLY it counts, even if it's unsafe to use for untrusted web sites |
| 12:34.23 | annadane | screw it, i'll install kwin by itself |
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| 12:38.36 | jelly | sometimes you kwin sometimes you klose |
| 12:38.52 | dvs | ... |
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| 12:44.39 | boktan | why i do get this error : https://pastebin.com/rXzYhHpA |
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| 12:47.40 | ratrace | !jellysnack |
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| 12:49.00 | DammitJim | if I have something mounted on /mnt/testing |
| 12:49.09 | DammitJim | but there were files in /mnt/testing before the mount |
| 12:49.26 | greycat | those files are not accessible until you unmount |
| 12:49.29 | DammitJim | is there any way to read info about the files in /mnt/testing ? |
| 12:49.36 | greycat | mope |
| 12:49.38 | DammitJim | thanks greycat for confirming |
| 12:49.41 | greycat | nope |
| 12:50.59 | ratrace | boktan: installed all the required (if any) realtek firmwarez? |
| 12:51.32 | boktan | i installed many packages but i dont know which one is missing now how to find it? ratrace |
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| 12:52.21 | ratrace | boktan: dmesg | grep -i firmware and see if it's complaining about missing firmware, then locate the package with apt-file for that firmware path |
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| 12:53.17 | boktan | https://pastebin.com/a5jL9v1a this is the output ratrace |
| 12:53.19 | themill | DammitJim: you can bind mount the filesystem containing the original /mnt/testing somewhere else and then it becomes visible |
| 12:53.24 | ratrace | boktan: journalctl -k might be better than dmesg if you have high uptime and/or dmesg ring buffer wrapped initial boot messages out |
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| 12:54.32 | ratrace | boktan: those seem related to the intel wifi.... nothing about that realtek? what about dmesg | grep -i realtek ? |
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| 12:54.41 | boktan | https://pastebin.com/nNGxdSPm |
| 12:55.00 | boktan | i did installed the driver from realtek but i will now run that command ratrace |
| 12:55.25 | boktan | https://pastebin.com/9RDwqwcv this is the output ratrace |
| 12:55.33 | DammitJim | themill, seriously? |
| 12:55.37 | ratrace | boktan: btw that journalctl output looks incomplete |
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| 12:56.22 | ratrace | boktan: can you grep -i r8169 from dmesg? |
| 12:56.57 | boktan | https://pastebin.com/hEzspQHr |
| 12:57.31 | boktan | https://pastebin.com/zechTeUc |
| 12:57.32 | karlpinc | DammitJim: Makes sense. It is still mounted (so a bind mount is neeced.) |
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| 12:58.57 | millaus564578568 | Ciao a tutti :P |
| 12:59.03 | ratrace | boktan: that doesn't look right. dmesg | grep -i realtek shows only your ethernet card but not a peep about the wifi... is the wifi nic connected? |
| 12:59.20 | greycat | maybe the wifi isn't realtek |
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| 12:59.26 | ratrace | boktan: dmesg | grep wlx00c0caa51d03 please |
| 12:59.26 | Haohmaru | moi nicht parles espana |
| 13:00.05 | boktan | the wifi was connected where i put those commands (sorry for my bad english) |
| 13:00.29 | boktan | dmesg | grep wlx00c0caa51d03[ 8.573066] rtl88xxau 1-3:1.0 wlx00c0caa51d03: renamed from wlan0[ 99.813207] IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): wlx00c0caa51d03: link becomes ready[ 598.277220] IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): wlx00c0caa51d03: link becomes ready |
| 13:01.02 | ratrace | boktan: ok now please dmesg | grep rtl88 |
| 13:01.21 | boktan | [ 8.534382] usbcore: registered new interface driver rtl88xxau[ 8.573066] rtl88xxau 1-3:1.0 wlx00c0caa51d03: renamed from wlan0 |
| 13:02.08 | boktan | and the name of the wifi is so bad :D on kali linux it was wlan1 or 0 but on ubuntu or maybe on my new laptop wlx00c0caa51d03 |
| 13:02.37 | ratrace | boktan: does this return anything? dmesg | grep rtlwifi ? |
| 13:02.52 | boktan | no |
| 13:03.06 | boktan | there is no output |
| 13:03.11 | ratrace | boktan: then I guess your nic doesn't need firmware |
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| 13:04.09 | boktan | also i need to remove somethings? |
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| 13:04.48 | ratrace | boktan: you can rename interfaces, depends what you want exactly |
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| 13:06.05 | boktan | renaming i do want just for writing faster on command line :) but it is not neccesary... i cannot use airmon-ng or any tools about wifi which creating AP |
| 13:06.32 | boktan | i think if i fix airmon-ng than all tools will work |
| 13:06.51 | boktan | ratrace |
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| 13:07.44 | ratrace | sorry I wouldn't know about airmong-ng. but if you want to rename interfaces, you can rename only some of them, or perhaps you want to completely revert to ethX and wlanX naming scheme? |
| 13:08.22 | karlpinc | Every now and then I want to sum numeric output in shell. I always wind up writing an awk script. Is there some handy command? |
| 13:08.39 | greycat | awk is the tool of choice for that |
| 13:08.55 | boktan | one of your commands i put it was saying renamed from wlan0... it is automatic renamed before also can do now too i think ratrace |
| 13:09.11 | ratrace | karlpinc: bc works too in some cases |
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| 13:09.54 | boktan | [ 8.573066] rtl88xxau 1-3:1.0 wlx00c0caa51d03: renamed from wlan0 |
| 13:10.10 | boktan | [ 1.129662] r8169 0000:03:00.0 eno2: renamed from eth0 |
| 13:10.28 | boktan | dmesg | grep -i r8169 this was giving that output |
| 13:10.31 | ratrace | boktan: yes, that's kernel assigning the name according to the naming scheme |
| 13:10.45 | karlpinc | ratrace: If I'm going to use bc I may as well go all computer-science and use dc. ;-) |
| 13:11.00 | boktan | ratrace does it means that i can change it again? |
| 13:11.01 | diogenes_ | boktan, btw there is a recently discovered vulnerability in rtl wireless drivers. |
| 13:11.03 | ratrace | boktan: if you put net.ifnames=0 in the (grub's) kernel command line, it won't rename them and will leave them at ethX and wlanX |
| 13:11.27 | greycat | bc and dc only do the arithmetic. you need some other tool to scrape the numbers out of the input. since that tool is likely awk, you might as well also let awk do the arithmetic. |
| 13:11.50 | ratrace | boktan: if you do that, make sure you update any static network configurations you might have in /etc/network/interfaces or elsewhere, as the NIC names will change! |
| 13:13.10 | boktan | but because of it changed automatic; it means also the system updated all configurigations automatic before right? ratrace |
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| 13:13.44 | boktan | diogenes the think is but it was working before on older laptop with kali linux :/ |
| 13:13.53 | boktan | diogenes the think is but it was working before on older laptop with kali linux :/diogenes_ |
| 13:14.24 | boktan | *thing sorry for my bad english |
| 13:14.51 | diogenes_ | boktan, that vulnerability is there since kernel 3. |
| 13:15.24 | boktan | and if i try AP; i can see the wifi but cannot connect |
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| 13:16.00 | ilikeyou | jelly: hi, did anything transpire from that "make deb-pkg" issue? I ran through some different configs on a fresh old-stable install, and they worked fine. either I have a borked 10 upgrade, or it's broken . I was just looking for confirmation before I submit a bug report |
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| 13:16.14 | boktan | diogenes_ does it means now cannot use alfa wifi adapter anymore? |
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| 13:16.53 | diogenes_ | boktan, of course you can, just be careful. |
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| 13:18.26 | boktan | but there is no fix for this problem now? diogenes_ |
| 13:18.26 | resc_054b1_5917 | gey |
| 13:18.32 | resc_054b1_5917 | i meed help |
| 13:18.56 | diogenes_ | boktan, not sure whether it's been patched yet. |
| 13:20.07 | karlpinc | !ask |
| 13:20.07 | dpkg | If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>. |
| 13:20.58 | boktan | the thing is because of im noob i dont know what informations i need to give :/ diogenes_ |
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| 13:22.07 | diogenes_ | boktan, https://threatpost.com/critical-linux-wi-fi-bug-system-compromise/149325/ |
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| 13:25.14 | diogenes_ | let's see if bot has anything on it. |
| 13:25.17 | diogenes_ | !CVE-2019-17666 |
| 13:25.29 | jelly | ilikeyou: sorry, did not have _any_ time to look things up, my build system is on stretch right now |
| 13:25.44 | jelly | dpkg: cve lookup CVE-2019-17666 |
| 13:25.44 | dpkg | Information about the security advisory CVE-2019-17666 may be found at https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2019-17666 |
| 13:26.20 | diogenes_ | boktan, all Debian versions are vulnerable as of right now. |
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| 13:27.35 | boktan | diogenes_ but i did not understand with vulnerable... do someone need to update some packages or we_ |
| 13:27.37 | boktan | ? |
| 13:27.57 | diogenes_ | boktan, the updates will come when ready. |
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| 13:48.48 | FinalX | ,v openssl |
| 13:48.49 | judd | Package: openssl on amd64 -- jessie: 1.0.1t-1+deb8u8; jessie-security: 1.0.1t-1+deb8u12; stretch: 1.1.0k-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 1.1.0l-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 1.1.0l-1~deb9u1; buster: 1.1.1c-1; buster-proposed-updates: 1.1.1d-0+deb10u2; buster-security: 1.1.1d-0+deb10u2; bullseye: 1.1.1d-2; sid: 1.1.1d-2 |
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| 13:55.03 | wrksx | what's the /etc/group- file (as opposed to the same without the trailing hyphen)? |
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| 13:56.22 | inlakesh | hint: check file dates |
| 13:57.02 | wrksx | is it kind of an automatic backup ? |
| 13:57.47 | wrksx | dates are 2 minutes apart |
| 13:57.56 | wrksx | I added a user then removed it |
| 13:58.00 | greycat | wrksx: it's a backup copy |
| 13:58.18 | wrksx | greycat: okay thanks |
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| 14:01.44 | boktan | result is same :/ |
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| 14:07.14 | ayekat | wrksx: typically created by tools in the `shadow` package |
| 14:07.39 | Haohmaru | that's some shady package there |
| 14:07.45 | wrksx | =) |
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| 14:08.07 | wrksx | Is this possible to allow a user to execute a command if it's shell is set to /usr/sbin/nologin? |
| 14:08.35 | greycat | sudo -u username command to execute |
| 14:08.40 | wrksx | it sounds stupid now that I phrase it that way |
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| 14:09.02 | wrksx | Hum yeah I forgot to say 'over ssh' |
| 14:09.21 | wrksx | but thx greycat |
| 14:09.51 | greycat | For ssh, the user needs a "real" shell. |
| 14:10.22 | greycat | Of course, you could always simply do ssh root@yourhost sudo -u user your command |
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| 14:20.34 | wrksx | I created a user with adduser --system --shell /bin/bash. Does that user has password login disabled? |
| 14:20.42 | wrksx | I mean that's what I want don't get me wrong |
| 14:21.52 | greycat | wrksx: grep your user's line from /etc/passwd and from /etc/shadow and find out |
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| 14:24.07 | wrksx | man /etc/shadow |
| 14:24.10 | wrksx | woops |
| 14:24.20 | greycat | "man shadow" might work |
| 14:24.27 | wrksx | yeah figured that =) |
| 14:24.29 | wrksx | ty |
| 14:25.13 | wrksx | my user is in the shadow file |
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| 14:25.33 | wrksx | and I see no field used to disable password login |
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| 14:25.52 | greycat | Password logins can be disabled in either of those two files, by putting the "wrong" thing in the second field. |
| 14:25.52 | wrksx | what's weird is that I wasn't asked for a password at the user creation |
| 14:26.27 | wrksx | I have an "x" in /etc/passwd and a "*" in /etc/shadow |
| 14:26.40 | greycat | then it's "locked" (no password authentication possible) |
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| 14:28.03 | wrksx | greycat: ty once again. |
| 14:28.38 | ilikeyou | jelly: no problem. I'll upgrade my other system tonight and try from there. if same issue, I'll submit bug . thnx |
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| 14:36.05 | darxmurf | for my nis problem, nscd was missing on some machine and this was messing UP USB mounts and all |
| 14:36.09 | darxmurf | lolz :-/ |
| 14:36.19 | darxmurf | maintenance of NIS :-/ |
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| 14:44.44 | wrksx | Hum I just found out that the path is not the same when loggin in from ssh that when executing command throught ssh |
| 14:45.27 | wrksx | Weirdly I got sbin paths when executing with: ssh host "echo $PATH" |
| 14:45.44 | greycat | you're expanding $PATH on the client side, because you used double quotes |
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| 14:45.50 | wrksx | omg |
| 14:45.55 | wrksx | facepal |
| 14:45.56 | greycat | if you want to expand it on the server side, ssh host 'echo "$PATH"' |
| 14:47.30 | wrksx | ok so sbin is not in the path, thanks |
| 14:47.37 | wrksx | that was stupid |
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| 15:38.56 | jak2000 | hi wll, yesterday my server was stoped, the user go to turn of and turn on (power button0 is possible read any log message ? around 2019/10/20 from 10:20 am to 11:00am ? thanks |
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| 15:39.27 | jak2000 | *all |
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| 15:39.30 | greycat | cd /var/log and then start reading the files whose timestamps indicate they may have something |
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| 15:40.39 | jak2000 | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:40.52 | greycat | ... no |
| 15:41.07 | greycat | files with a date of Oct 21 could *also* be relevant |
| 15:41.18 | greycat | Just pick one and read it. |
| 15:41.20 | jak2000 | ok |
| 15:41.25 | jak2000 | https://paste.debian.net/1108963/ |
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| 15:41.53 | dmk | Does anyone know why Firefox and Chromium would be using a different keyboard layout to everything else? I have Input Sources set to "English (UK)" in gnome, and it's right in the terminal open office etc, but shift+2 in FF an d Chromium gives me @ |
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| 16:12.20 | jhutchins_wk | dmk: That's what US keyboards do, what do you expect? |
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| 16:13.30 | dmk | jhutchins_wk: Yeah, but I've got everything set to UK as far as I can see. I'm using Polari here: shift+2 = " |
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| 16:17.02 | trysten | i've got a user unit.service that wasn't running on startup. what do I check to make sure it's enabled to start appropiately? |
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| 17:02.43 | jhutchins_wk | trysten: systemctl <service> status |
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| 17:03.09 | greycat | systemctl status servicename |
| 17:03.43 | greycat | scroll scroll scroll ... looks like they're talking about a user service, so they might need to add --user |
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| 17:06.38 | kreyren | How do i "put together" 'data' files on debian? They seems to be some kind of archive.. https://github.com/Winetricks/winetricks/pull/1391#issuecomment-544603789 |
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| 17:06.55 | kreyren | probably alternative to compressed .rar in multiple parts |
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| 17:08.21 | thiras | hello. Does debian has designated tmpfs file system tmp folder as like ubuntu has? |
| 17:08.42 | greycat | Not by default. But you can set it up if you wish. |
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| 17:19.32 | kreyren | greycat, afaik debian has /tmp by default |
| 17:19.50 | kreyren | at least on my system it has.. |
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| 17:23.29 | fireba11 | kreyren: he was talking about a dedicated partition with tmpfs for it |
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| 17:24.00 | kreyren | ah mb |
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| 17:25.35 | _DeLa_ | I downloaded https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/10.1.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-dvd/firmware-10.1.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso and successfully created an USB stick from it, with which I managed to install Debian Buster. I was wondering: Is replacing every instance of the string "buster" (or "stable") in sources.list with the string "testing" really enough to turn my Debian Buster into Debian Testing? |
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| 17:26.28 | uRock | yes |
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| 17:26.50 | uRock | at least that's what I did back when I did it. |
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| 17:30.41 | jhutchins_wk | _DeLa_: Using "testing" instead of "bullseye" is not recommended. Read the relese notes before executing. |
| 17:30.51 | jhutchins_wk | buster->bullseye |
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| 17:31.09 | jhutchins_wk | _DeLa_: Nevermind, no release notes on unreleased testing. |
| 17:31.24 | jhutchins_wk | goes for more caffein. |
| 17:33.08 | uRock | believes he actually used the codename buster back when he did it. Looking that far back is kinda fuzzy though. |
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| 17:33.44 | greycat | Use "testing" if you plan to follow testing forever. Use "bullseye" if you plan to converge to the stable release of bullseye. |
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| 17:34.06 | SerajewelKS | and never use "stable" |
| 17:34.06 | _DeLa_ | So I would replace "buster" with "testing" in "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian buster main contrib non-free". But what about the lines "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian-security/ buster/updates main contrib non-free" and "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian buster-updates main contrib non-free"? If I understand the info @ https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTesting correctly, I should comment them out or delete them?! |
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| 17:34.25 | greycat | There is no testing-security to speak of. |
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| 17:34.49 | uRock | greycat beat me to that one. I learned the hard way |
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| 17:35.30 | _DeLa_ | So I basically have only "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free" in my sources.list then with Testing? |
| 17:35.32 | jelly | using "testing" forever is VERY likely to result in horrible breakage right after each release and for a few weeks |
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| 17:36.07 | greycat | Testing support is also not to be sought in this channel. |
| 17:36.14 | jelly | that too |
| 17:36.19 | jelly | !debian-next |
| 17:36.20 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. |
| 17:36.41 | jelly | if you join there you might be told about !tum |
| 17:37.04 | uRock | !tum? |
| 17:37.04 | dpkg | «echo 'APT::Default-Release "testing";' >> /etc/apt/apt.conf», edit sources.list, copy your non-security testing lines and change one set to unstable, then apt-get update. Use apt-get -t unstable install foo; to install foo from unstable rather than testing as usual. WARNING to SYNAPTIC users: Synaptic ignores Default-Release: set Preferences->Distribution. |
| 17:37.09 | _DeLa_ | jelly: Well, I'm still standing with one foot in stable ;-) |
| 17:37.25 | greycat | !don't break debian |
| 17:37.25 | dpkg | i heard dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian |
| 17:38.34 | jelly | moo |
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| 17:39.27 | rwp | jelly, Cow super powers! |
| 17:39.38 | _DeLa_ | So instead of going with Testing forever, it would be a better idea to choose a genuine rolling release distro? |
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| 17:40.50 | jelly | _DeLa_: if what you want is a rolling release distro, then yes, Debian testing is not that. And neither is unstable. |
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| 17:41.49 | _DeLa_ | jelly: I would love to install Debian with LXDE on an older machine and from then on, never have to do a fresh install again (just running updates & upgrades). Suggestions? |
| 17:42.24 | greycat | Upgrade to each new release as it is released. |
| 17:42.50 | _DeLa_ | greycat: you mean, replace "buster" with "name of new stable" when it's time? |
| 17:43.04 | jelly | _DeLa_: debian has working in-place release upgrades. |
| 17:43.19 | greycat | That's how Debian is meant to be used, yes. |
| 17:43.39 | _DeLa_ | greycat: Long-time Lubuntu noob here ;-P |
| 17:43.49 | jelly | a release upgrade is a little bit more involved than "replace buster with bullseye" but that's the most important step |
| 17:44.02 | jelly | for example, |
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| 17:44.08 | jelly | dpkg, stretch->buster |
| 17:44.08 | dpkg | Read (at least) the upgrading chapter of the <release notes> http://deb.li/JFKc . TL;DR: In /etc/apt/sources.list, change "stretch" to "buster", remove stable-specific lines like stretch-backports. apt update && apt upgrade && apt full-upgrade. 3rd party repos like <dmo> are known to cause problems with the upgrade. |
| 17:44.21 | greycat | I'd argue the most important step is reading the upgrade notes, and/or the wiki page that says what you can expect to break. |
| 17:45.13 | _DeLa_ | jelly: I have just bookmarked that page. thanks. |
| 17:46.07 | _DeLa_ | greycat: or waiting a few weeks (months?) after initial release of new stable and hope that the biggest problems are fixed by then? :-) |
| 17:46.28 | jelly | _DeLa_: no, the biggest problems will be documented in release notes |
| 17:46.48 | greycat | https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster |
| 17:47.11 | jelly | there's no "do-release-upgrade" script that fixes (some of) those automagically |
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| 17:49.15 | _DeLa_ | Alright! Thanks for all the input! Helped me a lot! Already looking forward to updating to the next Debian stable in 5 years ;-) |
| 17:49.32 | jelly | nod |
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| 17:49.50 | jelly | would have nothing against releases coming only every 5 years |
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| 17:52.02 | _DeLa_ | jelly: I was thinking of the LTS-support ... |
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| 17:53.44 | _DeLa_ | new stable release is every 2 years, right? |
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| 17:54.53 | jelly | !release history |
| 17:54.53 | dpkg | Named after "Toy Story" characters. Buzz(1.1; 1996-03-14), Rex(1.2; 1996-10-28), Bo(1.3; 1997-05-01), Hamm(2.0; 1998-07-24), Slink(2.1; 1999-03-09), Potato(2.2; 2000-08-15), Woody(3.0; 2002-07-19), Sarge(3.1; 2005-06-06), Etch(4.0; 2007-04-08), Lenny(5.0; 2009-02-14), Squeeze(6.0; 2011-02-06), Wheezy(7; 2013-05-04), Jessie(8; 2015-04-25), Stretch (9; 2017-06-17), Buster (10; 2019-07-06). Next: Bullseye. http://deb.li/it56U |
| 17:55.29 | jelly | it certainly looks the cadence has been about once every two years for a couple releases now doesn't it |
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| 17:55.45 | _DeLa_ | When will they run out of toy story - character names? :-) |
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| 17:56.28 | sponix | _DeLa_: Yeah -- when they do, maybe they will use Porn Star names next ! |
| 17:56.54 | jelly | that's extremely unlikely |
| 17:57.44 | uRock | Character names from How to Train You Dragon could keep them busy until 2120. |
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| 17:59.41 | uio | After the Toy Story names they should use the names of other distros. |
| 18:00.07 | uio | Debian Fedora. |
| 18:00.15 | uio | For maximum confusion. |
| 18:00.29 | sponix | Great Idea |
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| 18:00.36 | uRock | Lol, Debian Mint |
| 18:00.39 | uio | sponix, Thank. |
| 18:00.43 | sponix | Debian Slackware edition |
| 18:00.43 | uio | uRock, lol |
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| 18:01.14 | uio | Debian Debian : the meta-edition. |
| 18:01.44 | sponix | uRock: exactly, instead of LMDE - Linux Mint Debian Edition.. It would be DLME - Debian Linux Mint edition ;) |
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| 18:03.03 | uio | What if Ian had met a Babara instead? |
| 18:03.10 | uRock | sponix, that would be funny and very confusing. They'd still go to ubuntuforums for support. |
| 18:03.22 | uio | uRock, lol |
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| 18:04.03 | uio | *Barbara |
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| 18:04.16 | uRock | Barbian |
| 18:04.22 | uio | uRock, Yes!! lol |
| 18:04.26 | uRock | I'd use it |
| 18:05.10 | J_C | When will we get Debian Zerg? Hmm |
| 18:05.16 | uio | I'm going to auto-censor myself into offtopic... |
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| 18:13.59 | plantroon | is there a proper documentation on partman for automated installs? I cant figure out how to make lvm on luks on mdraid via the preseed file |
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| 18:15.39 | uRock | plantroon, search for partman in this doc http://www.vm.ibm.com/education/lvc/lvc0803.pdf |
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| 18:18.11 | plantroon | uRock: thx that looks good |
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| 18:24.25 | plantroon | there are only examples which don't fit my use case. I still feel like I'm reading random noise xD the docs for this are really sparse |
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| 18:27.18 | thiras | greycat, thanks for the answer. I'll set a path for it |
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| 18:29.04 | Lope | How can I run a v >=5 kernel in debian? is there a kernel backport for buster yet? or would I need to run sid or something? |
| 18:29.13 | greycat | ,kernels |
| 18:29.14 | judd | Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.3.0-trunk-686-pae (5.3.2-1~exp1); sid: 5.2.0-3-686 (5.2.17-1); bullseye: 5.2.0-3-686 (5.2.17-1); buster-backports: 5.2.0-0.bpo.3-686-pae (5.2.17-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-6-686 (4.19.67-2+deb10u1); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.19.67-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.9.0-11-686-pae (4.9.189-3+deb9u1); jessie-backports: |
| 18:29.15 | judd | 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.11-686-pae (4.9.189-3+deb9u1~deb8u1) |
| 18:29.27 | greycat | "buster-backports: 5.2.0-0.bpo.3-686-pae" |
| 18:29.32 | Lope | sweet, thanks greycat |
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| 18:34.21 | Habbie | greycat, ohh |
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| 18:36.44 | wrksx | I'm looking implementing custom compeltion in a bash script, currently I'm using read to get user input, I've been reading man pages (read and readline) a bit, but can't really understand how to move forward... |
| 18:37.25 | greycat | https://debian-administration.org/article/316/An_introduction_to_bash_completion_part_1 and #bash-completion in OFTC (irc.oftc.net) |
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| 18:37.50 | wrksx | thanks, some useful reading I guess =) ty |
| 18:37.56 | greycat | bash programmable completion has *nothing* to do with 'read' |
| 18:38.26 | wrksx | ha maybe I wasn't clear, I want my script to read user input, and allow for completion |
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| 18:38.51 | greycat | You want the user to be able to use the Tab key to enter filenames? read -e |
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| 18:39.25 | wrksx | greycat: not filenames, a custom set of strings |
| 18:39.31 | greycat | ... |
| 18:39.42 | greycat | /msg greybot b2 |
| 18:40.10 | wrksx | like the user type "enable <tab>" and I want to displaya list of things that are enable-able |
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| 18:40.56 | greycat | Then what you do is accept ARGUMENTS, and you set up a programmable completion so the user can type wkrscript enablne f<TAB> |
| 18:41.15 | greycat | Using 'read' is clumsy and horrible. |
| 18:41.52 | greycat | And so now we're back to the *original* answer. |
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| 18:52.00 | wrksx | greycat: yeah, I see |
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| 18:53.17 | wrksx | Too bad |
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| 19:00.32 | xormor | can you see my GECOS field from over there? |
| 19:00.40 | xormor | I am using Debian buster |
| 19:00.48 | greycat | You can use "/whois xormor" to see what we can see. |
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| 19:01.52 | xormor | greycat, should I use my real name on the net? in IRC for example? |
| 19:02.13 | xormor | greycat, my real name is Lauri Friberg, and I am Finnish. |
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| 19:08.45 | uRock | xormor, why would you want to use your real name on the interwebs and what does it have to do with Debian? |
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| 19:13.23 | xormor | uRock, maybe I can be remembered for something? Or maybe people think I am more credible if I don't use a fake name like "Batman" or "Robin". |
| 19:14.14 | SerajewelKS | nobody really cares what your identity is |
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| 19:14.30 | SerajewelKS | "xormor" is your identity as far as we are concerned |
| 19:14.38 | uRock | It's not the name, but what you do that gets you remembered. Just as most of the regulars here know I will drop in and ask for an answer that was already smacking me in the face. |
| 19:15.15 | uRock | Oh wait, I usually log in with a different alias for that. |
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| 19:16.25 | uRock | Just as there are a few names I am surprised haven't popped up to tell us we're off topic. That said, I'll mute. |
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| 19:22.44 | somiaj | xormor: I credit it down to personal choice, and I'm to lazy to hide my real name, but others like to. No one (except trolls) really care. |
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| 19:23.37 | somiaj | though yea, this is probably more a topic for #freenode, it really isn't getting in the way of support. |
| 19:23.53 | glassresistor | I'm running buster with a vanilla source file for apt and im having an issue with curl giving me this error "curl: error while loading shared libraries: libssl.so.1.0.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 19:24.26 | greycat | what does "type -a curl" say? |
| 19:24.52 | glassresistor | greycat: oh thanks it looks like its using curl form conda of all places |
| 19:25.31 | greycat | if you want this other curl to work, you may need to install the old libssl1.0.0 package from an older release |
| 19:25.46 | greycat | (looks like... jessie) |
| 19:26.04 | glassresistor | greycat: no its fine i didn't know conda had added curl to my base install |
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| 19:37.26 | Sack_Lunch | Seeking advice/perspective: I have a dell server with recent PERC raid card in it. Server boots fine. I add an LSI SAS HBA (non raid) with external 8088 ports. Nothing connected |
| 19:38.05 | Sack_Lunch | now system boots up to grub, but hangs at "Loading vmlinuz". Any ideas what is happening? |
| 19:38.34 | greycat | get rid of the "quiet" boot parameter to see more information |
| 19:38.35 | Sack_Lunch | System is Debian 9 AMD64 |
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| 19:39.32 | Sack_Lunch | ok - commented out in /etc/default - that is a good idea |
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| 19:53.42 | RoyK | hm - what's printing out the 'no fortunes found' message on login? |
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| 19:54.55 | greycat | you're running "fortune" in a dot file (/etc/profile or ~/.profile or similar) |
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| 19:56.30 | RoyK | greycat: I can't find any 'fortune' command in the whole of /etc and I certainly haven't added one manually. Running fortune manually works |
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| 19:56.43 | RoyK | hence the question |
| 19:56.50 | greycat | PS4='+($?) $BASH_SOURCE:$FUNCNAME:$LINENO:' bash --login -xc : 2>&1 | grep -i fortune |
| 19:57.48 | greycat | (assuming your login shell is bash) |
| 19:58.00 | RoyK | my PS4 seems to be + |
| 19:58.25 | greycat | It won't be for the duration of this command. |
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| 19:59.43 | RoyK | greycat: so where to add that? I take it this is a debug statement of sorts? |
| 19:59.53 | greycat | You don't *add* it. You *run* it. |
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| 20:05.12 | RoyK | greycat: thanks |
| 20:05.27 | greycat | If there's no output, then you may have to get more desperate. You can remove the | grep ... part and just read everything your login shell does. Or try shortening the search pattern (e.g. fort). |
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| 20:07.39 | humpled | when you say "on login" when does that mean exactly, maybe it's in /etc/motd |
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| 20:21.59 | porco | Hi. I am running Debian !0, a fresh install, but cannot connect to any X display as su |
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| 20:22.44 | porco | I got the error: qt.qpa.screen: QXcbConnection: Coud not connect to display |
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| 20:25.18 | noln | no idea for qt, but generally pkexec is used for graphical apps, not su |
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| 20:28.39 | somiaj | porco: one shouldn't be trying to run gui apps as root with su. sudo sometimes does a better job. |
| 20:29.27 | porco | got it. i was just following the steps from my class... i will try with sudo |
| 20:30.00 | DammitJim | what class is this? |
| 20:30.18 | porco | Cybersecurity |
| 20:30.38 | DammitJim | cool |
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| 20:32.13 | noln | I thought sudo is discouraged for GUI (to the point that gksudo and kdesudo were made) https://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/graphicalsudo |
| 20:32.17 | porco | Yep. I was supposed to run # wirehsark ftp.pacp & as root |
| 20:32.54 | karlpinc | porco: That's usually ungood. Instead capture pcap with tcpdump to a file and use wireshark on that. |
| 20:34.05 | karlpinc | porco: Or if you _really_ need real-time send the tcpdump output to a fifo or a unix socket and have wireshark read that. |
| 20:34.16 | porco | I generate the pcap with tcdump |
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| 20:34.54 | karlpinc | porco: Then why run wireshark as root? |
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| 20:39.06 | porco | karlpinc: i just don't know. i think the instructor was a bit lazy and do this way just to not changing directories and users, since the tcpdump was perform as su |
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| 20:50.25 | xormor | how do I create an X11 window system connection to my debian buster computer? I will try to use it locally. I might use it from afar later. |
| 20:50.50 | xormor | I tried ssh -X ::1 but it gave me a normal shell. |
| 20:51.44 | somiaj | xormor: ssh -X doesn't create a session, but runs a gui app |
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| 20:51.57 | Sack_Lunch | in your ssh -X shell type "xterm" |
| 20:52.00 | somiaj | xormor: so ssh -X user@host command will run common on your machine |
| 20:52.14 | somiaj | though ssh -X is slow, even on a lan, you may want to look into VNC |
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| 20:52.23 | lupine | soon: wayland |
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| 20:54.02 | Sack_Lunch | @xormoe |
| 20:54.26 | Sack_Lunch | you might want to look at x2Go if you want a full screen, remote GUI experience on linux. |
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| 20:55.40 | wakawako | hi, are the instructions at avast fully compatible with debian to add a repository? |
| 20:56.17 | wakawako | http://deb.avast.com/lin/doc/techdoc.pdf |
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| 21:06.43 | nezZario | Uhm |
| 21:06.55 | nezZario | I need a little help here ... I have something on my local system just going bonkers |
| 21:07.16 | nezZario | `tower : Oct 21 17:05:02 : ab : problem with defaults entries ; TTY=unknown ; PWD=/home/ab ; USER=root ; ` .. .I have about 80,000 of these in my mbox right now |
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| 21:09.16 | nezZario | I just have no idea where it's coming from ... I am using OpenSMTPD ... the subject is "SECURITY information for tower" (tower=hostname) |
| 21:09.24 | nezZario | just won't stop |
| 21:09.37 | nezZario | I mean that 80k = several days worth, but |
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| 21:12.02 | wakawako | How did it happen? |
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| 21:13.25 | nezZario | I don't know, it's been doing this for some time |
| 21:13.37 | nezZario | I mean it's not enough to really bother much except filling up my disk every few days |
| 21:13.41 | nezZario | in which a single rm fixes |
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| 21:14.04 | nezZario | and endless "You have new mail" notifications. I turned on the smtpd tracing and it really dosen't tell me anything |
| 21:14.14 | nezZario | I guess I could turn on auditd? |
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| 21:21.19 | sorko999 | @nezZario look in the user ab's home directory: /home/ab. The script(?) appears to be running out of there according to that email. Is 'ab' a known user? |
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| 21:32.48 | HelloShitty | Hello guys... How do I make X to start automatically at boot time? I have upgraded my Debian 9 to Buster and after a few problems I had to reinstall Xorg but now everytime I reboot, I don't go to the login manager... I get into text mode and only then I issue 'startx' to go to login manager |
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| 21:35.33 | Habbie | HelloShitty, ls -al /etc/systemd/system/default.target |
| 21:36.41 | HelloShitty | Habbie: I don't have that ....default.target file |
| 21:36.45 | HelloShitty | in that directory |
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| 21:37.14 | jmcnaught | 'systemctl get-default' |
| 21:37.25 | LtL | HelloShitty: systemctl set-default graphical.target |
| 21:37.26 | somiaj | HelloShitty: user overrides are in /etc/systemd |
| 21:37.30 | Habbie | thanks |
| 21:37.34 | Habbie | i forgot the actual commands for that |
| 21:37.38 | somiaj | HelloShitty: system files are in /lib/systemd/ |
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| 21:38.00 | HelloShitty | systemctl get-default already says graphical.targert |
| 21:38.03 | somiaj | don't edit system files (in /lib), make a file of the same name in /etc and edit that, or use systemctl -e unitname |
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| 21:43.43 | HelloShitty | So if systemctl get-default already says it's graphical.target |
| 21:44.00 | HelloShitty | Can I do anything else to ensure it boots to the login manager? |
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| 21:47.24 | somiaj | HelloShitty: what does cat /etc/X11/default-display-manager say? |
| 21:47.36 | jmcnaught | what does 'systemctl status display-manager.service' say? |
| 21:48.00 | HelloShitty | Unit display-manager.service could not be found. |
| 21:48.06 | HelloShitty | :s |
| 21:48.26 | jmcnaught | do you have one installed? |
| 21:48.39 | HelloShitty | Isn't Plasma-Desktop one? |
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| 21:49.02 | HelloShitty | Or is it sddm ? |
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| 21:49.23 | jmcnaught | sddm is the display manager used with KDE in Debian |
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| 21:49.51 | lefrosch | Hi |
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| 21:50.31 | dvs | wonders what the problem with the name "kdm" |
| 21:50.53 | lefrosch | When I switch my theme in xfce under "appearance", nothing changes. I'm trying to figure out why. I found out that the themes are stored in /usr/share/themes, but how does xfce what my current theme is ? |
| 21:51.03 | lefrosch | * xfce decide what |
| 21:51.27 | HelloShitty | installing sddm now |
| 21:51.30 | HelloShitty | it was not installed |
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| 21:51.57 | HelloShitty | now sddm is running |
| 21:52.15 | jmcnaught | HelloShitty: if it was me I would install the task-kde-desktop package to get the whole DE |
| 21:52.46 | HelloShitty | ok |
| 21:52.47 | HelloShitty | thanks |
| 21:53.49 | HelloShitty | jeezzzz, that's going to install so much shit... Ouch |
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| 21:54.08 | lefrosch | I figured out that the changes apply to some programs like Hexchat, but not others. Strange for me. |
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| 22:37.42 | oxek | I am following this guide to create an encrypted system with a keyfile stored on a usb stick https://askubuntu.com/questions/59487/how-to-configure-lvm-luks-to-autodecrypt-partition |
| 22:38.00 | oxek | everything works except for a systemd issue |
| 22:38.16 | oxek | "A start job is running for dev-sda8:-keyfile.device (1min 18s...)" |
| 22:38.34 | oxek | it appears after the keyfile correctly unlocks the encrypted container |
| 22:38.59 | oxek | after the 90s systemd errors out and boot continues just fine, everything is correctly unlocked |
| 22:39.10 | oxek | how do I get rid of this systemd issue that is making my boot 90s slower? |
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| 22:40.16 | oxek | the answer at https://askubuntu.com/questions/59487/how-to-configure-lvm-luks-to-autodecrypt-partition/1012372#1012372 is bad because it breaks everything after any update-initramfs |
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| 22:42.00 | plantroon | after hours of trying, I conclude that it is impossible to preseed lvm on luks on mdraid :( any recommendation on better deployment tool that can handle such partitioning? |
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| 22:56.07 | oxek | this bug from a few years ago might be relevant https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=786559 |
| 22:56.08 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/786559 in cryptsetup (open): «cryptsetup: broken boot delay when using keyfile»; severity: normal; opened: 2015-05-22; last modified: 2016-09-14. |
| 22:58.38 | SerajewelKS | are there any pitfalls with having / on an mdadm raid1 where one disk is attached with SATA and the other iSCSI? |
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| 23:00.05 | SerajewelKS | I suspect that the iSCSI disk will be inaccessible until after the initrd pivots, meaning the mirror would be degraded for a bit during boot |
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| 23:02.34 | SerajewelKS | if true then the system probably could not boot if the sata disk dies? |
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| 23:04.34 | SerajewelKS | note there would be a local /boot |
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| 23:12.11 | SerajewelKS | hmm looks like this is supported |
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| 23:12.44 | RoyK | SerajewelKS: should work |
| 23:16.31 | n0a110w | what are some alternatives to `dialog` [if any] for receiving user input in the shell? (looking to see if anything else exists other than `read` or `dialog`) |
| 23:16.54 | n0a110w | for use in scripts |
| 23:17.10 | oxek | I worked around my issue by `systemctl mask systemd-cryptsetup\@sda5_crypt.service` |
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| 23:17.57 | oxek | anyone know if that can cause any trouble? |
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| 23:20.55 | dabc | haha, since systemd came around everyone is looking for a way to avoid/bypass/not use it |
| 23:22.47 | oxek | dabc: systemd has good parts until you run into something that systemd took over and has not implemented in full (yet), such as full cryptsetup support |
| 23:23.46 | SerajewelKS | okay so second iscsi-during-boot question. i have two nics and use one for iscsi and one for internet access. i already have an ip= parameter for unlocking luks volumes with dropbear. |
| 23:24.02 | SerajewelKS | can i somehow configure both interfaces during boot? |
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| 23:26.16 | SerajewelKS | i haven't found any docs for multiple ips at boot time |
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| 23:51.00 | annadane | i understand if people don't know the answer but does a firefox downloaded from upstream also need pulseaudio for sound? |
| 23:51.05 | annadane | or just esr from the repos |
| 23:51.16 | annadane | i think you can use apulse? i'm not sure |
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| 23:52.26 | annadane | what i should do is search first... |
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| 23:53.31 | annadane | well esr for stable and i think sid's firefox also needs pulse or apulse |
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