| 00:00.00 | Aebian | hu? but 1 subnet has 1 gw and another 1 has another? If thats wrong I need to redo all my linux boxes where it obviosly works |
| 00:00.13 | trek00 | NetGirl: /sbin contains utilities used by the admin |
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| 00:01.11 | Aebian | well then I'll fix that |
| 00:01.25 | ratrace | Aebian: well iirc the problem is with "gateway" keyword in interfaces, you can have only one. |
| 00:01.28 | NetGirl | trek00: some say that that's not needed anymore and that that's from an era when boot sectors and such limited stuff |
| 00:01.40 | Aebian | ok I see |
| 00:01.49 | ratrace | Aebian: iirc multiple gws (per subnet) are done with post-up rules or something like that |
| 00:02.39 | trek00 | NetGirl: it's for convenience, not anymore for technical limitations |
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| 00:02.45 | ratrace | Aebian: though I'm not 100% sure of that. "default gateway" is the gateway for all traffic not specifically routed, so there really can be only one |
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| 00:03.46 | nb-ben | you can have many of these if you have many routing tables and use forwarding rules |
| 00:03.55 | nb-ben | but yes only one per routing table |
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| 00:04.47 | ratrace | NetGirl: you're talking about "usrmerge" where /bin and /usr/bin are merged (into the latter, the former being a symlink to it), and equally for /sbin and /usr/sbin |
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| 00:04.56 | ratrace | NetGirl: so the symlinks must remain for backwards compatibility |
| 00:05.26 | trek00 | or if you don't run usrmerge |
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| 00:06.00 | ratrace | NetGirl: and yeah the reason they were separate are ancient dogmas, so usrmerge is there to remedy that. it's decided that /usr/ shold be the target of the merge |
| 00:06.42 | ratrace | trek00: one shoudl though. if you have multiple installations and some are upgrades, you get non-homogenous installations and that's gonna cause bugs |
| 00:06.43 | martigan | jaakkos, that makes sense. Thank you a ton man for explaining this. I'm reading through the man page still looking at your commands. If those ufw commands allow any already established connections that would not be ideal. I don't know anything about firewalls or iptables. Literally nothing. I need to pick up a book or spend a day on youtube. |
| 00:07.28 | trek00 | ratrace: i never installed with usrmerge and never got a bug, but i have always luck :) |
| 00:07.54 | ratrace | trek00: if you installed fresh buster, you got usr merged. if you upgraded from stretch, you might need to run usrmerge |
| 00:08.22 | trek00 | ratrace: fresh buster installation, with separate /usr partition |
| 00:08.37 | ratrace | the bugs that hit ME were assumptions that /usr/bin is the real dir, and testing worked on freshly installed staging systems. production failed on systems that were upgraded. :( |
| 00:08.58 | ratrace | trek00: so your usr is merged. /bin is a symlink to /usr/bin no? |
| 00:09.10 | NetGirl | why was iptables installed into /usr/sbin/iptables? |
| 00:09.22 | trek00 | ratrace: not, separate directories |
| 00:09.44 | trek00 | NetGirl: without usrmerge is /sbin/iptables |
| 00:09.54 | ratrace | trek00: must be the separate /usr partition then, I'm not sure what the rules are for that |
| 00:10.27 | jaakkos | martigan: no problem :) if you want to make the configuration persistent, take a look at "iptables-persistent" |
| 00:11.26 | martigan | And firewall rules aren't permanent by default it would appear. So if I wreck this playing with it I should be fine after a reboot ya? |
| 00:11.36 | ratrace | trek00: btw why do you separate /usr? any special reason? |
| 00:11.43 | trek00 | ratrace: i don't know, but really happy that my old setup is still running fine :) |
| 00:12.02 | jaakkos | martigan: yeah. btw if ufw is installed, it may be that it generates a bunch of rules by default that will interfere with your own iptables efforts |
| 00:12.11 | ratrace | trek00: old setup or fresh installed buster? |
| 00:12.29 | trek00 | ratrace: for many reasons, but mostly about disk speed, fragmentation and to mount it readonly |
| 00:12.38 | trek00 | ratrace: old way to do a setup |
| 00:12.38 | martigan | jaakkos: I haven't installed it yet. And don't plan to at this point. |
| 00:13.39 | ratrace | trek00: is there some special config setup required with systemd for separate /usr? systemd doesn't support it out of the box iirc |
| 00:13.58 | trek00 | ratrace: i don't know, i'm still using sysv sorry :) |
| 00:15.05 | trek00 | ratrace: but i remember that systemd was mounting /usr shortly after / and before any other partition |
| 00:15.19 | Aebian | well to be fair the following command fixed my issue: sudo ip route add default via 10.0.0.2 & sudo ip route delete default via 10.0.0.2 as long as I don't restart the networking service. If I do that it gets reverted to 10.0.0.2. I wonder where he pulls that info from then |
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| 00:15.28 | trek00 | ratrace: and may be the initrd was modified to mount /usr early |
| 00:15.33 | Aebian | eh default via 10.0.0.1 |
| 00:15.38 | Aebian | the first one |
| 00:15.38 | ratrace | trek00: must've been :) |
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| 00:16.27 | jaakkos | martigan: but there is a shortcoming in the rule that I pasted - it is possible for programs to send unencrypted traffic to the VPN gateway address itself (but nowhere else) |
| 00:16.38 | trek00 | ratrace: nitramfs-tools (0.121) init: Always mount /usr before looking for the real init |
| 00:16.42 | ratrace | Aebian: wait... add default & delete default ? what does that do |
| 00:16.47 | jaakkos | martigan: if that's a problem. |
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| 00:17.45 | ratrace | Aebian: you should really need just one gateway. that's the IP where packets are framed for, typically for LAN/WAN boundary, ie. "the way out of LAN". |
| 00:17.49 | Aebian | ratrace: I added a default to 10.0.0.1 (the gw and that what should be used) and deleted the present default to 10.0.0.2 |
| 00:18.08 | ratrace | Aebian: did you try just having one gateway entry in the interfaces file? |
| 00:18.33 | ratrace | maybe you're confusing "route to subnet" with gateway (Default route for packets)? |
| 00:18.35 | Aebian | I will uncomment then but I have no gateway set with 10.0.0.2. |
| 00:18.54 | Aebian | so it is confusing that debian pulls that, but only on this machine |
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| 00:19.22 | ratrace | you mean you will _comment_ them out :) |
| 00:19.30 | Aebian | yeah sorry |
| 00:19.34 | trek00 | Aebian: you should configure only one gateway in you interfaces file |
| 00:19.45 | ratrace | Aebian: try it, I'm curious now. I'd say that it should work just fine with that ONE gateway entry in interfaces file, for 10.0.0.1 |
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| 00:20.24 | ratrace | the framework will set up proper routing for subnets and you can always add custom routes |
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| 00:22.22 | Aebian | commented them out, restarted a dozen times, works fine. Commented them back in, restarted a dozen times as well, also default gw 10.0.0.1 is active and used. all fine now as well |
| 00:22.48 | Aebian | only thing I havent done is a full system restart |
| 00:22.55 | ratrace | Aebian: you still have that add default & delete default ? |
| 00:23.07 | Aebian | well I haven't executed it |
| 00:23.22 | Aebian | so no didn't change it after I commented back in |
| 00:23.33 | Aebian | works like it worked before |
| 00:23.40 | Aebian | which is weird |
| 00:23.53 | Aebian | I'll do a full sys restart to see if that breaks things |
| 00:24.26 | Aebian | ip route before the restart https://i.imgur.com/txvACY7.png |
| 00:24.30 | ratrace | Aebian: yea but make sure you have only one gateway entry. mutliple gateways make no sense. |
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| 00:27.23 | ratrace | Aebian: you'll see that the routing table is already set as it should be, eg. packets destined for 10.145.50.x/24 will be routed through eth2. packets destined for 10.145.20.x/24 through eth1, and packets destined for 10.0.0.x/24 through eth0. packets for any other subnet will go through the gateway 10.0.0.1 unless you specifically route their subnet through a NIC |
| 00:27.51 | Aebian | ratrace: https://i.imgur.com/kMbEqk5.png that's a screen of one of my windows servers. since it is on the other subnet it uses another "default gw". |
| 00:27.54 | Aebian | hmm |
| 00:28.08 | Aebian | buthow does eth2 know which is his default gw if I set it static? |
| 00:28.18 | ratrace | Aebian: default gateway == send packets through this IP when no route is known |
| 00:28.24 | Aebian | ah |
| 00:28.39 | Aebian | so the gateway thing is just the universal catch all |
| 00:28.39 | ratrace | Aebian: there is no such thing as "his default gw" for nics. default gw is only one, "route packets through here, when no routing is known" |
| 00:28.45 | ratrace | Aebian: exactly |
| 00:28.55 | Aebian | damn |
| 00:29.00 | Aebian | learned something today |
| 00:29.04 | Aebian | thanks |
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| 00:29.39 | jaakkos | martigan: to fix that, you could use the 'mark' option in openvpn config to mark encrypted packets for iptables, then modify the iptables rule: "iptables -I OUTPUT -o ethX -d $VPN_GW_ADDRESS -p udp --dport $VPN_PORT -m mark --mark $MARK -j ACCEPT" |
| 00:31.04 | jaakkos | martigan: people here recommended also filtering by openvpn user, could do that with -m owner --uid-owner. But openvpn client runs as root so it's not very nice. |
| 00:32.47 | ratrace | martigan: "And firewall rules aren't permanent by default" they are if you set up through ufw. playing with iptables command direclty isn't permanent unless you install something like iptables-persistent and it dumps the rules through /etc/iptables/rules.v4 (and .v6 for ipv6) |
| 00:32.58 | trek00 | Aebian: the weird behavior come from your broken setup and parallel interface setup during boot: each time it setup an interfaces it rewrite the default gateway, but with parallel startup sometimes the last interface is the one with the right gateway and sometimes not; on older systems ifupdown was used, that start sequentially the interfaces and then the last gateway was always setup |
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| 00:35.08 | Aebian | so it baiscally was a lucky "I'm working all the time" and today it then "crashed" |
| 00:35.17 | trek00 | yes |
| 00:35.23 | trek00 | :) |
| 00:35.27 | ratrace | held by duct tape and staples. |
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| 00:36.53 | Aebian | well just restarted, issue is there again. interfaces file: https://i.imgur.com/Iub0cLN.png // ip route: https://i.imgur.com/53eVKRb.png |
| 00:37.09 | Aebian | or should I remove the gateway on eth0 as well? |
| 00:37.29 | Aebian | it is back to 10.0.0.2 but it should be 10.0.0.1 |
| 00:37.31 | trek00 | Aebian: no, the interfaces file now is correct |
| 00:38.30 | ratrace | Aebian: can you pastebin the output of ip a ? |
| 00:38.35 | ratrace | and ip route |
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| 00:38.45 | martigan | jaakos: Ya, that would be a problem, I mean it's not really a problem, at this point I don't do anything really sensitive, but the reason I'm learning how to do this is to disallow *anything* leaving me unencrypted. Looking at openvpn config and the mark option and mark in the iptables man page. |
| 00:39.00 | trek00 | ratrace: ip route is the second link |
| 00:39.10 | ratrace | oh, right. |
| 00:39.24 | ratrace | it still shows last config. |
| 00:39.30 | trek00 | ratrace: may be there is a systectl command to regenerate interfaces? |
| 00:39.53 | ratrace | systemctl restart networking.service but that just does ifdown & ifup |
| 00:40.11 | ratrace | Aebian: so question, you don't any systemd-networkd configs there too? |
| 00:40.15 | jaakkos | martigan: you should keep in mind that your machine is going to give out information about itself on the L2 network ("local area network") |
| 00:40.26 | jaakkos | martigan: such as MAC address and possibly hostname |
| 00:40.36 | ratrace | Aebian: and when you say "restarted" do you mean reboot, or you restarted some service? |
| 00:40.59 | Aebian | restarted the whole server |
| 00:41.03 | Aebian | ratrace: https://gist.github.com/Aebian/26a5b1fbd23373432d758ada5ad97a6a |
| 00:42.13 | martigan | jaakkos: https://linuxconfig.org/how-to-create-a-vpn-killswitch-using-iptables-on-linux This explains some of the rules to me to use. If I don't use the "-A OUTPUT -d 192.168.1.0/24 -j ACCEPT" rule it wouldn't give out anything on my lan? |
| 00:42.22 | ratrace | Aebian: if you restarted the whole server, how does it know about gateways that are no longer in the interfaces file, but WHERE before reboot? are you sure you don't have som eother setup messing stuff up? like another rootfs or some nfs somethign... those are VMs, right? |
| 00:42.40 | ratrace | Aebian: also, no systemd-networkd settings? |
| 00:43.18 | Aebian | this is a vm yes |
| 00:43.21 | ratrace | Aebian: does networkctl status begin with line WARNING: systemd-networkd is not running, blah blah blah ? |
| 00:43.34 | martigan | jaakkos: MAC and Hostname are a given in order to get an ip from the DHCP on my network right. |
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| 00:43.58 | Aebian | WARNING: systemd-networkd is not running, output will be incomplete. |
| 00:44.00 | Aebian | correct |
| 00:44.26 | martigan | And I don't really care about hiding on my LAN. And I can change my hostname and MAC if needed. |
| 00:44.31 | ratrace | Aebian: and no file in /etc/network/interfaces.d/ ? what you posted above is /etc/network/interfaces ? |
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| 00:44.58 | jaakkos | martigan: right, if you omit that rule (note that your LAN subnet may be different from the example), you won't be able to talk on LAN either |
| 00:45.19 | Aebian | nothing https://i.imgur.com/7YmJqPz.png |
| 00:45.31 | martigan | It is for sure. |
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| 00:45.57 | ratrace | Aebian: so that's now nearing the twilight zone.... you sure your VM is not restoring rootfs from a snapshot or something like that? |
| 00:46.00 | martigan | Also VPN port is different and I was told to use TCP over UDP. |
| 00:46.03 | jaakkos | martigan: hostname is leaked by dhcp client yeah, MAC address is leaked no matter what unless you change it before you connect on L2 |
| 00:46.12 | ratrace | Aebian: is that Debian proper or some derivative that's doing gods know what? |
| 00:46.44 | jaakkos | martigan: dhcp client uses raw sockets so even though it's UDP, you can't catch it with iptables |
| 00:47.01 | jaakkos | (and if you did, it wouldn't work) |
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| 00:47.31 | Aebian | I don't have setup anything like that so no. And this is a legit Debian https://i.imgur.com/i4hRaWG.png |
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| 00:47.54 | Aebian | installed from an official debian dvd way back |
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| 00:48.41 | ratrace | Aebian: I have no idea how that's possible then, unless what you pastebin'd is NOT /etc/network/interfaces |
| 00:48.44 | trek00 | Aebian: just to debug, what if you comment out any interfaces but not the first one? |
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| 00:49.04 | Aebian | will do it now |
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| 00:49.54 | trek00 | Aebian: comment too the allow-hotplug directives but not the first one |
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| 00:51.24 | Aebian | uh https://i.imgur.com/93C1OPr.png I did it like this |
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| 00:51.29 | Aebian | and rebooted |
| 00:51.36 | Aebian | but issue is still present |
| 00:51.46 | martigan | jaakkos: I use a random MAC always so no issue there. And for the time being I'm on my LAN so I'm not concerned with it. Just my traffic going out into the world. |
| 00:51.53 | jaakkos | martigan: the linuxconfig article seems quite sloppy. First of all, net.ipv4.ip_forward=1 is not needed for anything here and will make your configuration less secure |
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| 00:52.19 | trek00 | Aebian: it seems /etc/network/interfaces is not read at all |
| 00:52.48 | Aebian | that's weird |
| 00:52.50 | jaakkos | martigan: "-A OUTPUT -o lo -j ACCEPT" is a good idea though. |
| 00:52.59 | martigan | jaakkos: I kinda thought that, I have used it before when playing around with middling traffic in my house and didn't see the reason for it here. |
| 00:53.01 | jaakkos | martigan: the DNS part is only relevant if you don't get DNS over VPN |
| 00:53.04 | ratrace | Aebian: no network-manager or something like that? |
| 00:53.10 | jaakkos | and you do I'm sure |
| 00:53.39 | martigan | I'm using ipvanish and I'm pretty sure it's over VPN. |
| 00:53.39 | trek00 | found a similar issue https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/463356/how-can-i-override-systemds-choice-of-default-route-with-two-network-interfaces |
| 00:53.39 | jaakkos | martigan: though if VPN config specifies VPN GW as DNS name instead of IP address, you will need working DNS before you can connect |
| 00:53.46 | ratrace | Aebian: oh also... please check /etc/initramfs-tools/{initramfs.conf,conf.d/*} if something is forcing network config through initramfs |
| 00:54.51 | ratrace | trek00: though look at the ip route output, those gateways have different metric, so that per se is no ta problem, that first gateway being 10.0.0.2 is |
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| 00:56.00 | Aebian | I checked the folder and config file. Nothing in there that relates to network. In the conf.d is a resume file |
| 00:56.11 | trek00 | ratrace: just to know that modifying interfaces file is not useful :) |
| 00:57.49 | trek00 | Aebian: it prints something in the logs? |
| 00:58.04 | martigan | jaakkos: I think it does. "las-c13.ipvanish.com" paste.debian.net/1115178/ |
| 00:58.16 | jaakkos | martigan: right, that's a bit of a problem |
| 00:58.35 | martigan | So I need to figure out the IP dns ip address. |
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| 00:59.43 | Aebian | is that relevent? https://i.imgur.com/e7izACW.png |
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| 01:00.06 | trek00 | Aebian: may be |
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| 01:00.45 | trek00 | Aebian: do you have an /etc/rc.local file? |
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| 01:01.19 | ratrace | oh rc.local good catch |
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| 01:02.09 | Aebian | yeah, there was a ifup call for eth1 and eth2 inside. removed it and rebooted to check |
| 01:02.39 | martigan | *ipvanish dns ip address |
| 01:03.04 | Aebian | it works for all the other interfaces, just eth0 gets default to 10.0.0.2 instead of 10.0.0.1 |
| 01:03.47 | trek00 | Aebian: i think you should comment out any ifup/ip/route stuff from your rc.local |
| 01:04.21 | trek00 | Aebian: but to be sure i would like to see that file |
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| 01:05.14 | setuid | Anyone here good with hacking initrd? |
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| 01:06.01 | trek00 | setuid: me not, but may be i can help if you ask your question :) |
| 01:06.03 | Aebian | https://i.imgur.com/2EVhYsz.png |
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| 01:06.28 | trek00 | Aebian: the file is ok, it is running fine now? |
| 01:07.18 | setuid | trek00: I'm trying to inject a dkms module into the initrd, so it gets installed at boot time over PXE |
| 01:07.20 | Aebian | negative |
| 01:07.35 | Aebian | it still defaults to 10.0.0.2 on eth0 |
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| 01:09.11 | Aebian | just restarted my second debian vm, works there like a charm and eth0 is defaulted to 10.0.0.1 |
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| 01:10.44 | trek00 | setuid: you should add the module to /etc/modules and rebuild initramfs, but you can also build a bigger initrd or with a selected list modifying /etc/initramfs-tools/initramfs.conf |
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| 01:12.08 | trek00 | Aebian: it seems to me some weird setup is still breaking routing |
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| 01:12.49 | setuid | trek00: I've done all of that, by overwriting the in-tree foo.ko with the dkms version of foo.ko, and it boots, but kernel crashes because the module is tainted |
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| 01:13.53 | trek00 | setuid: is it running fine if you modprobe it after boot? |
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| 01:14.27 | trek00 | Aebian: you could try to rgrep eth0 / |
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| 01:14.43 | setuid | trek00: it won't boot, crashes at initial boot and never gets past it |
| 01:14.48 | trek00 | Aebian: or rgrep '10\.0\.0\.2' / |
| 01:15.12 | setuid | So I'm thinking I need to add the module to initrd.gz as a dkms module, not by overwriting the in-tree module, causing the taint and crash |
| 01:16.13 | jordila | for a small (almost) personal VPS (Apache & PHP + some Nodejs)... i'm willing to try Debian testing, as can be seen performing quite solid in my laptop |
| 01:16.31 | trek00 | setuid: ok, but with the original kernel, modprobe /your/foo.ko fails? |
| 01:16.37 | jordila | any thoughts to share on that crazy (?) idea ? ^^ |
| 01:17.29 | whislock | jordila: You get to keep the pieces when it breaks. |
| 01:17.33 | trek00 | jordila: it could be ok for a development server, but for a production server i would install stable |
| 01:17.52 | jordila | ah. Nice to know ... |
| 01:18.23 | martigan | jaakkos: Thanks again for all your help, I'll let you know how it goes. =) |
| 01:21.17 | setuid | trek00: there is no 'original kernel', it's the same kernel. |
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| 01:21.51 | trek00 | setuid: you said you ovverwritten |
| 01:21.56 | trek00 | ops |
| 01:22.01 | setuid | trek00: I take the original netboot's initrd, unpack it, replace in-tree foo.ko with vendor's foo.ko module built against the same kernel with dkms. |
| 01:22.13 | Aebian | trek00: gues what, updated to buster, issue gone. |
| 01:22.18 | Aebian | guess* |
| 01:22.24 | setuid | Then I repack the initrd.gz, and put it on the server, where cobbler feeds it to a PXE client |
| 01:22.29 | trek00 | Aebian: well done! :) |
| 01:22.38 | Aebian | debian vm was on stretch still |
| 01:23.10 | Aebian | now it is on buster and seems resolved. Honestly I still loved to use your regrep search thogh |
| 01:23.21 | Aebian | thanks for all your help |
| 01:23.23 | trek00 | setuid: may be it has secure boot enabled? |
| 01:23.27 | teclo | hi there, I've done a clean install of 10.1 and it works very well, I have writtent my new firewall iptables script... I've put a symlink to it from /etc/network/if-pre-up.d/ ... but it's not executed at boot time. Some tutorial says I should put the script in /etc/rc.local, but here in 10.1 I see no /etc/rc.local and I'm not sure I should create a rc.local (pehaps there is no rc.local because of systemd) |
| 01:23.32 | setuid | trek00: No, that's not it |
| 01:24.52 | trek00 | setuid: the dkms module has a different name from the one shipped with default kernel, right? |
| 01:25.00 | setuid | It does not, no. |
| 01:25.21 | Gerowen | Cut her "Power on to login screen visible" down to 1:08 by disabling the option in "Sign in Options" that says something like, "Use my credentials to automatically log in and restart my apps". |
| 01:26.37 | trek00 | setuid: what is the error message when it crashes? |
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| 01:27.34 | Gerowen | Whoops |
| 01:27.37 | Gerowen | Wrong IRC channel guys, sorry. |
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| 01:31.10 | dvs | !lart Gerowen |
| 01:31.10 | dpkg | breaks out the Hoover and sucks up Gerowen |
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| 01:31.29 | OS-58438 | exit |
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| 01:31.37 | dvs | !exit |
| 01:31.37 | dpkg | /quit you fool! |
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| 01:34.36 | setuid | trek00: One sec, had to record the ILO output |
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| 03:49.35 | rue_shop1 | hi, new install of buster, trying to compile freecad: apt-get build-dep freecad; apt-get source freecad; cd freecad-0.16+dfsg2/src; cmake . == Unknown CMake command "generate_from_xml". THE SOURCE PACKAGE APPEARS TO BE BROKEN? |
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| 03:52.51 | setuid | rue_shop1: https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?t=1221 |
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| 03:54.48 | themill | I'd love it if we could stop going on about the source package being broken, since it quite clearly isn't, and instead ask how to fix the problem. Building it with the correct command is more likely to work, after all |
| 03:55.51 | setuid | feels like he's doing something nobody has ever done before.. |
| 03:58.24 | rue_shop1 | I'm having an issue finding the fix part, I picked up that the source MUST be installed in a verry particular directory? |
| 03:58.36 | themill | no, that's absolutely not the case |
| 03:58.49 | rue_shop1 | starts from the top again |
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| 03:59.05 | themill | rue_shop1: you need to run "cmake ." from the correct directory |
| 03:59.18 | rue_shop1 | freecad-0.16+dfsg2/src |
| 03:59.20 | themill | no |
| 03:59.44 | themill | the beautiful part about a package is that the exact compilation instructions are already documented in code |
| 04:00.30 | themill | (meaning that you could either read what they are doing or, better, use them) |
| 04:00.39 | rue_shop1 | the compile instructions say to go to the website which we did and that didn't work |
| 04:01.02 | themill | I have no idea what that actually means. |
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| 04:03.17 | rue_shop1 | am I reading right that freecad defualt installs in the users home directory? |
| 04:03.35 | rue_shop1 | so you if you try compile it without the directory existing it dies? |
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| 04:04.04 | jvava | I can not turn off screensaver, I had tried xset, xscreensaver, but both not work, it is debian buster, please help |
| 04:04.09 | themill | rue_shop1: I have no idea where you're getting these ideas from |
| 04:04.21 | rue_shop1 | jvava, |
| 04:04.26 | themill | rue_shop1: none of this is what the freecad documentation says, what the package does or what I'm saying |
| 04:04.27 | jvava | rue_shop1 |
| 04:04.40 | rue_shop1 | jvava, xset s off dpms force on s noblank s expose -dpms |
| 04:04.52 | rue_shop1 | I have it in a script called turnthedamnscreensaversoffalready.sh |
| 04:05.49 | rue_shop1 | try to find a CMakeLists.txt |
| 04:05.58 | crestfallen | I can't get my buster to install. I tried 3 versions now on 'firmware-included-10.1.0' somesuch. I tried to edit the sources.list file precisely has the channel bot instructed me. then a member suggesteed I look into editing the DNS nameserver listings, but in the recovery shell I cannot install the 'resolvconf' program. I've worked 5 hours on trying to install debian. irony is I'm writing you from my home machine which I |
| 04:05.58 | crestfallen | upgraded from stretch and never had a problem. |
| 04:05.59 | rue_shop1 | apparently its in the wrong place of this project |
| 04:06.06 | rue_shop1 | ugh, wrong channel |
| 04:06.13 | themill | rue_shop1: it's in an unusual place, it is not in the wrong place |
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| 04:06.40 | rue_shop1 | I want to be working on my stm32 ADC code |
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| 04:06.57 | rue_shop1 | I'm apply half my brain to try to help a guy compile freecad |
| 04:07.12 | crestfallen | any suggestions? |
| 04:07.20 | jvava | rue_shop1, I can't get your idea |
| 04:07.21 | jvava | could you please show me your script? |
| 04:07.22 | rue_shop1 | "ou are both correct, hardly surprising, what was happening was that I was pointing Cmake to the wrong source directory, BUT ... the reason why is that there was no CMakeLists.txt in the correct directory.... an" |
| 04:07.23 | jvava | rue_shop1, more turnthedamnscreensaversoffalready.sh |
| 04:07.40 | rue_shop1 | jvava, xset s off dpms force on s noblank s expose -dpms |
| 04:07.53 | rue_shop1 | ^^^ that command should turn off all the stupid screensavers / layers |
| 04:07.59 | crestfallen | its been a deep rabbit hole |
| 04:08.06 | jvava | rue_shop1, thank you |
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| 04:08.40 | rue_shop1 | that combination took me 2 weeks to work out, cause, you would think any one of them would be enough |
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| 04:09.11 | jvava | rue_shop1, 'xset s off dpms force on s noblank s expose -dpms', is one line command |
| 04:09.23 | jmcnaught | crestfallen: at which point does the installation fail? |
| 04:09.34 | jvava | unknown option force, rue_shop1 |
| 04:09.45 | rue_shop1 | :( |
| 04:09.55 | rue_shop1 | they must have changed the options |
| 04:10.16 | crestfallen | jmcnaught, thanks one thing first, the machine is two miles down the road at my university... |
| 04:10.25 | jvava | rue_shop1, 'server does not have extension for dpms option' |
| 04:10.47 | rue_shop1 | it took me 2 weeks to come up with, I cant help you fix it |
| 04:11.05 | jvava | thank you |
| 04:11.13 | crestfallen | it fails while booting, the cursor blinks at 'Installing Gnome Settings' I believe. |
| 04:11.25 | crestfallen | that is the last listing on the bootup |
| 04:11.47 | crestfallen | it hangs I guess is the term |
| 04:11.55 | jmcnaught | crestfallen: do you have remote access to this computer? How do you expect to troubleshoot? |
| 04:12.07 | rue_shop1 | we found the dir to run cmake from! |
| 04:12.37 | rue_shop1 | /usr/src/freecad-0.16+dfsg2/ |
| 04:12.50 | crestfallen | I'm not expecting to troubleshoot. If there is something that I may be missing I hope to be directed to it , where I can read up and try again tomorrow. :) |
| 04:12.52 | rue_shop1 | so the website compile instructions are wrong |
| 04:13.06 | rue_shop1 | thanks (kinda) |
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| 04:13.25 | crestfallen | I did all of the 'buster main contrib non-free' lines in sources.list |
| 04:14.33 | crestfallen | the debian bot gave a precise entries for that file. though my buster system at home looks different; that buster came via an upgrade |
| 04:14.46 | crestfallen | *gave precise entries |
| 04:17.06 | dvs | crestfallen, what was the name of the iso you used for the install? |
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| 04:19.32 | crestfallen | dvs thanks it contained similar to " 'firmware-included-10.1.0' .. 'netinst.iso' |
| 04:20.06 | crestfallen | which was my third iso attempt |
| 04:20.18 | crestfallen | based on suggestion here from a member |
| 04:20.23 | dvs | That would be the one I reccommend |
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| 04:22.02 | crestfallen | so I've been following this tutorial : https://www.tecmint.com/set-permanent-dns-nameservers-in-ubuntu-debian/ |
| 04:22.26 | crestfallen | but I couldn't install the resolvconf package |
| 04:22.43 | crestfallen | this was from the recovery mode shell |
| 04:23.08 | crestfallen | two members said it looked like a DNS issue |
| 04:25.03 | dvs | recovery mode shell? I guess that means that GRUB started debian properly |
| 04:25.55 | crestfallen | well I"m able to get into advanced setup and open a recovery shell and use nano |
| 04:26.39 | crestfallen | $ sudo apt install resolvconf won't work after updating |
| 04:26.54 | dvs | so that's from the install iso and not from the finished install |
| 04:27.16 | crestfallen | I believe that's correct |
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| 04:28.02 | dvs | doing an install from the install iso won't put it on the finished install |
| 04:29.39 | crestfallen | I cannot add these two entries to etc/resolconf : nameserver 8.8.4.4 nameserver 8.8.8.8 ok copy that.that is sinking in dvs |
| 04:29.55 | crestfallen | resolv.conf* |
| 04:30.36 | crestfallen | ok yeah that makes sense so it's hanging even worse then. :) |
| 04:31.20 | dvs | you have to get it so that you can start Debian without the install iso. |
| 04:31.47 | crestfallen | right so anything I'm missing? I've installed debian before happily |
| 04:32.49 | dvs | I'd personally would not install the Desktop GUI during the initial install if you are having trouble starting it up. |
| 04:32.51 | crestfallen | Cannot resolve deb.debian.org comes up a lot. and missing Firmware error messages. |
| 04:32.58 | dvs | OH! |
| 04:33.24 | dvs | Missing deb.debian.org is serious. that is a nameserver (or network) issue. |
| 04:34.14 | crestfallen | yes so I was trying to use that tutorial but it's arbitrary since I don't know if that's my precise issue |
| 04:35.13 | crestfallen | I work at a university with secure networks |
| 04:35.14 | dvs | Chances are that you just have to edit the /etc/resolv.conf file with the proper nameservers |
| 04:35.59 | dvs | secure networks could also be preventing you from connecting to the Internet at large. |
| 04:36.43 | crestfallen | one deb mirror is actually at uc berkeley I think I used it to download |
| 04:36.49 | crestfallen | my uni |
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| 04:37.58 | crestfallen | not sure if I even have the /etc/resolv.conf file. does that make sense? |
| 04:38.00 | crestfallen | dvs |
| 04:38.18 | crestfallen | when looking in the recovery mode on the install iso |
| 04:39.04 | dvs | crestfallen, changing the recovery mode would change it |
| 04:39.15 | dvs | *would not |
| 04:39.27 | crestfallen | how to do it then |
| 04:39.37 | dvs | The Berkeley mirror is at http://mirrors.ocf.berkeley.edu/ by the way. |
| 04:39.56 | crestfallen | yeah I used it pretty certain |
| 04:40.38 | dvs | crestfallen, you have to get it to boot without the recovery mode of the install iso first. |
| 04:41.02 | crestfallen | but it hangs |
| 04:41.41 | dvs | That problem needs to e resolved first though. |
| 04:41.57 | crestfallen | ok |
| 04:46.03 | crestfallen | dvs another hint is that I tried to install antiX , a debian derivative, and I had the same types of error messages cannot resolve deb.debian.org |
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| 04:52.51 | trek00 | crestfallen: if you do not have /etc/resolv.conf file, you can create it and you don't need resolvconf package |
| 04:53.13 | trek00 | crestfallen: but you need to put the correct nameserver address |
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| 04:54.43 | crestfallen | trek00, I can do that from the recovery shell? It's all I have.. |
| 04:55.34 | trek00 | crestfallen: yes |
| 04:56.04 | crestfallen | so I create the file and then put what nameserver addresses in it? |
| 04:56.20 | trek00 | crestfallen: but, why a recovery shell? what it blocks the boot? |
| 04:57.11 | crestfallen | can I use a terminal that is not recovery mode? I don't know what I'm doing :) |
| 04:57.29 | trek00 | crestfallen: if you don't know which nameserver to use, you can create a file with: nameserver 8.8.8.8 |
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| 04:57.59 | crestfallen | ok there's also 4.4.8.8 based on this tutorial: |
| 04:58.12 | crestfallen | https://www.tecmint.com/set-permanent-dns-nameservers-in-ubuntu-debian/ |
| 04:58.27 | trek00 | crestfallen: there are many terminal emulators you can run from the graphical desktop if you need a terminal |
| 04:58.47 | crestfallen | sorry 8.8.4.4 |
| 04:59.36 | crestfallen | no I'm getting nowhere near the graphical desktop . it hangs while booting with a blinking cursor at the bottom with 'installing Gnome Settings' I believe |
| 04:59.51 | trek00 | ok |
| 05:00.13 | crestfallen | 'installing Gnome Settings' is the last thing listed above a blinking cursor |
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| 05:03.20 | crestfallen | trek00, did you see my post above re: my attempt to install antiX, and getting similar error messages read: 'cannot resolve deb.debian.org' |
| 05:03.40 | trek00 | crestfallen: to resolve you need to setup your resolv.conf file |
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| 05:04.18 | crestfallen | I see, just with those nameserver 8.8.8.8 nameserver 8.8.4.4 ? |
| 05:04.41 | trek00 | crestfallen: yes, on two different rows |
| 05:05.13 | trek00 | crestfallen: you can also try booting without graphic desktop, adding 'text' kernel command line https://superuser.com/questions/974797/how-to-boot-a-linux-system-without-graphical-server |
| 05:06.37 | crestfallen | ok get into a shell, create /etc/resolv.conf file, and list those 2 nameservers on separate lines. the recovery term should work? trek00 |
| 05:07.00 | trek00 | crestfallen: try to ping goole.com |
| 05:07.36 | crestfallen | excellent if that fails I'll try second strategy at superuser.com . ok will do thanks kindly trek00 dvs |
| 05:07.51 | trek00 | :) |
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| 06:03.27 | Kats99 | pls help me this time. the for loop in bash is behaving strange. for i in {1..$loop}; do echo $i done; why does this print {1..5} instead of 1 2 3 4 5 |
| 06:04.04 | Kats99 | and if i substitute 5 in place of $loop, it works correctly |
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| 06:06.09 | trek00 | Kats99: try with: for i in $(seq 1 $loop); do echo $i; done |
| 06:07.27 | Kats99 | thank you very much trek00. it works |
| 06:07.34 | trek00 | :) |
| 06:07.44 | lembron | seq is a thing? neat, then i can replace my unholy `TEST_STEPS=$(eval "echo {1..$TEST_TOTAL}")` too :D |
| 06:08.49 | trek00 | lembron: seq is posix compatible, unlike bashish {1...5} |
| 06:09.48 | lembron | seems to inject linebreaks tho - guess thats fine for most usecases |
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| 06:34.02 | fling | Hello. |
| 06:34.18 | fling | Is su binary getting dropped from shadow package via a configure option? |
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| 06:35.08 | trek00 | fling: check util-linux |
| 06:35.26 | fling | trek00: what do you mean? |
| 06:35.57 | trek00 | fling: /bin/su is inside util-linux package |
| 06:36.14 | fling | trek00: right, I'm asking how is debian building shadow |
| 06:36.25 | fling | trek00: because I don't see how to disable su there via configure options |
| 06:36.49 | trek00 | fling: probably it is compiled but not copied to the package |
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| 06:37.55 | trek00 | fling: this is the makefile used to build the package https://sources.debian.org/src/shadow/1:4.7-2/debian/rules/ |
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| 06:42.31 | fling | trek00: thanks |
| 06:42.48 | trek00 | fling: if you check, the su binary is missing from *.install files https://sources.debian.org/src/shadow/1:4.7-2/debian/ |
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| 07:05.00 | setuid | Well, this isn't working. A bare initrd with the in-tree module, boots but fails because of the missing support in that module. I insert the out-of-tree module, overwriting the in-tree module, re-pack the initrd, boot it and it crashes just after unpacking. |
| 07:05.40 | setuid | Not a very useful kernel crash either: https://www.dropbox.com/s/fkypxz1m9bl091e/Screenshot_2019-11-08_02-04-32.png?dl=0 |
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| 07:14.52 | noln | "attempted to kill init" means kernel cannot find init or that init exited |
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| 07:16.34 | setuid | All I did was unpack the working initrd.gz, ovewrite in-tree foo.ko with a vendor's out-of-tree (dkms-built, for the same kernel) foo.ko, and repacked the initrd back into a .gz |
| 07:16.50 | setuid | Well, and updated etc/modules inside the init, to load foo |
| 07:17.08 | setuid | I know I'm missing some piece of detail here, I'm just not sure what |
| 07:18.36 | anoncon | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:18.38 | noln | reusing debian's kernel cmdline? Add: break |
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| 07:19.21 | setuid | noln: Where? |
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| 07:21.55 | noln | would be grub's linux line |
| 07:22.05 | noln | But really must be a cleaner way. Maybe put the module somewhere in /etc for initramfs-tools to include it? then update-initramfs -u |
| 07:22.41 | setuid | noln: run update-initramfs from inside a chroot of /bin/ash inside the unpacked initrd? |
| 07:22.46 | setuid | I don't think that'll work |
| 07:23.04 | towo^work | yor way eevn would not work |
| 07:23.09 | towo^work | *even |
| 07:23.12 | noln | you want a custom module in initrd, let initramfs-tools do that instead of unpacking/repacking |
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| 07:23.21 | noln | you're going to redo all this on every kernel update? |
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| 07:24.49 | setuid | noln: this is a one-time deal, we don't update kernels that often |
| 07:25.11 | setuid | This is just to get the box pxe booted, once it's on the network, we can use the vendor's dkms package and insert it into newer kernels |
| 07:28.07 | setuid | noln: I can't let initramfs-tools do anything, because the box has no OS on it yet |
| 07:28.07 | setuid | I need the out-of-tree module inside the netboot's initrd, so I can PXE boot it through Cobbler |
| 07:28.08 | trek00 | setuid: update-initramfs should create the initrd image for you |
| 07:28.08 | setuid | trek00: How does update-initramfs run from pxe boot? |
| 07:28.08 | trek00 | setuid: you should run on the machine where you are creating the initrd |
| 07:28.08 | setuid | trek00: I have a piece of hardware (actually, hundreds of them), with no OS on them at all. |
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| 07:28.08 | trek00 | setuid: where you build dkms module? |
| 07:28.08 | setuid | trek00: I've installed the same OS + kernel in a VM, where I"m building the initrd, and rsync'ing it over to the cobbler server |
| 07:28.08 | setuid | update-initramfs in that VM, does not create an initrd.gz that I can use with cobbler to pxe boot |
| 07:28.34 | setuid | I need to create a netboot that contains this module, so I can pxe boot the box with a working network |
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| 07:34.26 | setuid | The initrd.img that update-initramfs builds, only contains 1 file, "GenuineIntel.bin", but the initrd in netboot, has hundreds of files (and is significantly larger) |
| 07:35.23 | trek00 | setuid: you should set MODULES=netboot to /etc/initramfs-tools/initramfs.conf |
| 07:35.57 | trek00 | setuid: check man initramfs.conf |
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| 07:37.42 | trek00 | setuid: you should also run update-initramfs with -b switch to don't overwrite the system initrd |
| 07:37.48 | setuid | Changed it to netboot, still builds exactly the same thing |
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| 07:40.10 | noln | re: GenuineIntel, double-check with lsinitramfs or another inspection method per <https://unix.stackexchange.com/q/163346> |
| 07:40.26 | trek00 | setuid: anyway if the initrd image is correct, you should check if the dkms module is running fine on the building machine, just to check if it can be loaded |
| 07:41.14 | setuid | trek00: I can't do that, because I can't get the OS installed, without network, which the missing/crashing module provides |
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| 07:41.48 | setuid | Enabling the NIC using the module I'm trying to inject, is what allows the install to complete via pxe |
| 07:41.56 | trek00 | setuid: you should try to modprobe the module on the machine where you built that module |
| 07:42.05 | setuid | update-initramfs does _not_ build a netboot initrd |
| 07:42.30 | setuid | Yes, I can insmod/modprobe the module on my VM, where I've built it, using dkms, and that works. modinfo also confirms its the right module. |
| 07:42.37 | trek00 | setuid: and check the last message of noln it was for you i think |
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| 07:42.57 | jelly | setuid: that file name sounds like microcode, it's put as a special part of initramfs. Should be able to get rid of it by remove intel-microcode package and rebuilding. |
| 07:43.31 | setuid | jelly: So if I remove the intel-microcode package from my VM, and re-run initramfs, it's going to build a full netboot? |
| 07:43.37 | noln | why get rid of it? the inspection method could be ignoring what comes after that |
| 07:44.01 | setuid | noln: It's a 7Mb initramfs, the netboot initrd compressed is 49Mb |
| 07:44.05 | noln | The microcode and the normal initrd's are concatenated to get the final initrd |
| 07:44.12 | setuid | I'd be surprised if they fit 49+ Mb into < 7Mb |
| 07:44.13 | noln | ah ok |
| 07:44.14 | jelly | setuid: it's going to build the same thing as before, just without microcode |
| 07:44.34 | jelly | won't be netboot unless you make it that way |
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| 07:45.20 | jelly | I don't know how netboot for d-i is created |
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| 07:48.05 | setuid | Ok, removing the microcode package does change the nature of the initrd.img, but it still doesn't contain the module I need, and that module _is_ declared in /etc/modules. I'll poke around... this whole process is a nightmare of cobbled-together tools that don't work very well. |
| 07:48.49 | setuid | Ok, _now_ I've got it in the initrd... needed it in /etc/initramfs-tools/modules |
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| 07:50.22 | trek00 | setuid: may be this can help you, but i never used it https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/NetbootAssistant |
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| 07:56.24 | setuid | damnit... well, it didn't crash at boot, but instead, dropped to initramfs prompt, couldn't find most of the root fs in the netboot, /etc/fstab missing, /root/dev missing, etc. |
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| 07:58.41 | bibble | Debian 10 OK to install Tor normally, or very behind and should install their repo in source.list ? |
| 07:59.25 | bibble | deb https://deb.torproject.org/torproject.org buster main |
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| 08:04.49 | setuid | trek00: Interesting project, but won't be useful for what I'm trying to do |
| 08:05.07 | setuid | Either the resulting initrd is too small, lacking the components necessary to boot, or crashes |
| 08:07.06 | trek00 | setuid: if you have done an initrd which don't crash but drops to a shell, probably you need to copy some init file, but they should already copied |
| 08:07.25 | trek00 | bibble: you could use backports too |
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| 08:08.18 | bibble | trek00: Ah, yeah :) |
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| 08:08.53 | trek00 | bibble: the buster-backports version seems updated |
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| 08:11.46 | setuid | trek00: I'm floored this is so difficult and there are no tools to create bootable images, netboot images, etc. |
| 08:12.02 | setuid | it's all a pile of broken pieces everyone has to try to figure out how to tape together to get this done |
| 08:12.46 | trek00 | probably no one found time to write a good guide |
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| 08:14.46 | bibble | the dream is get.debian.org is "choose default", download bootable USB image. |
| 08:14.50 | setuid | Clearly someone is making these, they're shipped on every release |
| 08:14.57 | bibble | *default apps |
| 08:15.41 | trek00 | setuid: probably there are the scripts to build these images, but i don't know where in debian repositories |
| 08:15.56 | leden | setuid, just for record witch module you need |
| 08:16.14 | setuid | leden: it's a network module, can't mention the vendor at this point. |
| 08:16.36 | setuid | I need to use the out-of-tree dkms version, because the in-tree one does not support their card on these specific releases |
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| 08:18.03 | setuid | 802525 |
| 08:18.28 | ratrace | setuid: can you tl;dr your issue? I just ran through the scrollback and it's something about custom initramfs? |
| 08:18.34 | setuid | oops, yubi... so update-initramfs omits the init= value, so it can't complete a boot |
| 08:19.12 | setuid | ratrace: I have a working, bootable initrd, which cobbler happily hands to my hardware over pxe boot. But that default initrd, lacks the module needed to bring up the NIC. |
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| 08:19.31 | setuid | So I have a dkms version of the module which I built in an identical version of the OS + kernel in a VM. |
| 08:19.48 | ratrace | setuid: and now you want to put it in the intramfs? |
| 08:19.51 | setuid | I've injected that module into the unpacked initrd, and re-packed it |
| 08:20.20 | setuid | ratrace: just want a clean, working initramfs/initrd, with the out-of-tree dkms module in it, so I can complete the pxe boot and install |
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| 08:22.00 | ratrace | setuid: well there's two things you can do, if this was a regular boot, I don't know how cobbler/pxe fit into it. You can write a simple initramfs-tools hook in which you copy your module in, and you add it to the list of modules to forcefully load up. |
| 08:22.02 | jelly | setuid: you could get the netboot image for 10.1 release, make sure you have the same kernel, build and plug your module in that? |
| 08:22.50 | setuid | It feels like all of these tools are 75% working, and 25% broken |
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| 08:23.51 | ratrace | well, that's kinda what I do on my systems, as I don't use cryptsetup-initramfs, and instead have a custom hook that pulls in the crypto modules. |
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| 08:24.48 | ratrace | setuid: you can look up any /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/* for an example, and unfortunately I'm now aware of a detailed guide how to construct these, I just copypasted cryptoroot's default hooks and modified to my needs reading source |
| 08:24.52 | setuid | They're pulled into the initramfs by /etc/initramfs-tools/modules, which is fine... but there's something missing, it's not building a working init |
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| 08:25.54 | ratrace | okay if it's just modules and no userland components to that? |
| 08:26.20 | setuid | ratrace: this is just a simple netboot install, but I need the NIC module to complete the install |
| 08:27.22 | setuid | Going to try something else |
| 08:27.36 | setuid | I can't believe this is so difficult; I've been trying to figure this out for over 10 days |
| 08:27.44 | setuid | I tried repacking the install iso, that didn't work |
| 08:27.57 | ratrace | what's the module needed for, to even begin pxe/netboot? |
| 08:28.07 | leden | setuid, did you read https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/NetbootFirmware |
| 08:28.11 | setuid | I mean, I can unpack squashfs, put the modules in it, all that works, but the initial boot doesn't include the module, because the iso's initramfs doesn't include it |
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| 08:28.23 | b_and_w | hi. |
| 08:28.24 | setuid | But the resulting install _from_ that booted ISO, does have the right module laid out on disk |
| 08:28.34 | b_and_w | im a newbie to shell scripting. i just wrote my very first shell script. |
| 08:28.46 | setuid | leden: I don't need any custom firmware |
| 08:28.52 | b_and_w | i have barely a month's experience with linux, so im still learning. I have a question: is there a difference between a batch file and a script? |
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| 08:29.35 | ratrace | b_and_w: you mean like a windows .BAT file? |
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| 08:31.42 | setuid | Fundamentally, no, there is a minimal difference. Both execute commands line-by-line. The mechanism they are executed, differs (mostly by the executed interpreter called to run those commands) |
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| 08:33.28 | noln | b_and_w, channel #bash |
| 08:34.11 | noln | setuid, where is your netboot going to find a rootfs? |
| 08:35.28 | setuid | noln: I have no idea. If I use 'update-initramfs -c -k $(uname -r) -b .' and then take that initramfs that is made, along with /boot/vmlinuz-$(uname -r), and ship those over to cobbler, it does boot, and gets to the point where it tries to mount /sys, /proc, /dev, etc. and fails. "No init found" |
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| 08:35.43 | setuid | so whatever update-initramfs is building, is incomplete |
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| 08:36.59 | trek00 | setuid: may be running with -v will add some info? |
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| 08:37.23 | noln | above you said the netboot worked but it didn't find fstab? |
| 08:37.32 | setuid | 333967 |
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| 08:39.02 | setuid | noln: The default netboot/initrd.gz boots successfully, gets into the installer, and then fails because it can't find network. So I started with that. |
| 08:39.43 | setuid | So I took that, unpacked it, then created a new initramfs, unpacked that _over the top of_ the same tempdir that I unpacked the netboot/initrd.gz into, combining both. |
| 08:39.56 | setuid | Then I repacked that into a new initrd.gz, which now fails to boot, lacking init |
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| 08:42.24 | trek00 | setuid: have you tried to concatenate the build initrd with dkms module to the initrd from netboot? zcat yourinitrd.gz netboot/initrd.gz | gzip -9v newinitrd.gz |
| 08:43.22 | ratrace | that's exactly explained in the link leden posted, for Jessie and above: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/NetbootFirmware#New_Simple_Method_for_Debian_8_Jessie_and_above |
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| 08:43.47 | ratrace | so, just figure out the hierarchy of firmware.cpio.gz and prepare your own similar, but for the correct paths |
| 08:44.00 | ratrace | and cat them both together |
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| 08:44.22 | trek00 | setuid: well yes you don't need to zcat and gzip, only cat as ratrace is saying |
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| 08:57.35 | setuid | Testing a boot of that combined init now |
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| 09:00.43 | setuid | aww... damnit. It booted, but now is trying to mount a CD to find the rest of the installer components. |
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| 09:02.20 | trek00 | setuid: i must go now, good luck! :) |
| 09:02.48 | setuid | Thanks |
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| 10:10.31 | Wulf | Good Morning. How do I disable bluetooth by default? Buster + gnome3. |
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| 10:11.31 | diogenes_ | Wulf, you can add a startup command: bluetooth off |
| 10:11.31 | colo-work | the most surefire way is probably to disallow the appropriate kernel modules from loading :) |
| 10:12.21 | Wulf | colo-work: I might want to use it every now and then |
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| 10:13.09 | wskyx | you can disable the bluetooth deamon in systemd from loading |
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| 10:20.46 | Wulf | diogenes_: thanks. I installed "tlp" (contains bluetooth command) and configured it to disable bt on startup. |
| 10:21.04 | Wulf | errr |
| 10:21.14 | Wulf | after logging into gnome, it's enabled again. wtf :( |
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| 10:21.54 | diogenes_ | Wulf, i use the bouetooth off at startup and it stays disabled until i enable it. |
| 10:22.31 | diogenes_ | also afaik this is a bug in tlp, i've seen people using tlp from sid which has the bug fixed. |
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| 10:27.28 | Wulf | bpo has same version as sid, I can try that |
| 10:28.57 | ratrace | diogenes_: where do you write that "startup command"? |
| 10:29.32 | diogenes_ | tarzeau, just make a .desktop file in .config/autostart |
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| 10:29.46 | ratrace | disabled systemd services can still be started as a dependency for something else, or by NM or some other DE component. to truly disable it, one must "mask" the service unit |
| 10:29.57 | tarzeau | diogenes_: why would i? |
| 10:30.14 | tarzeau | diogenes_: i'm using gnustep/wmaker i don't like fd.o and desktop files, nor gnome, nor systemd |
| 10:30.39 | ratrace | tarzeau: I think that was for Wulf and you were mistabbed :) |
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| 10:31.10 | diogenes_ | tarzeau, yes, that's for Wulf :) |
| 10:32.23 | Wulf | upgrading tlp doesn't help. Changing /etc/default/bluetooth doesn't help. |
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| 10:38.37 | Wulf | changing /etc/bluetooth/main.conf doesn't help. Adding a .desktop file doesn't help. |
| 10:38.45 | Wulf | colo-work: I'll follow your approach. |
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| 10:39.59 | ratrace | Wulf: in case that fails too (because all you can do is blacklist modprobe on boot, but it should still be modprob-able manually or by a service, unless I'm mistaken), you can systemctl mask bluez.service I think that's the service name? |
| 10:40.26 | ratrace | that means you'll have to unmask+start when you do want to use BT, and stop+mask again when you don't |
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| 10:55.14 | vampirefrog | I used to use wmaker too |
| 10:55.20 | vampirefrog | even wrote some dockapps for it |
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| 11:12.15 | Wulf | disabling+masking the systemd services helped. |
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| 11:14.28 | Erhu | I heard that debian can be installed without vscode and systemd: is that true? |
| 11:15.23 | ratrace | Erhu: vscode? yes, you can replace systemd with sysv, more or less, so they say. otherwise there's Devuan. |
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| 11:16.46 | Erhu | Great thanks |
| 11:17.34 | Erhu | found it #debianfork |
| 11:17.44 | ratrace | Erhu: and #devuan |
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| 11:17.57 | Erhu | even better |
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| 11:45.43 | Guest_76 | zfs with debian yay or nay? |
| 11:52.04 | Wulf | Guest_76: zfs has incompatible licenses, so nay. |
| 11:52.23 | Guest_76 | afraid so :( |
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| 11:53.21 | Guest_76 | any recommendations you'd have btrfs? Something else? |
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| 11:54.55 | Wulf | I use ext4 + lvm on hardware raid and it works for me. But I'm not an expert on these things. |
| 11:55.47 | Guest_76 | Fair enough, thanks for chiming in, trying to stay away from hw raid as i don't have proper/interchangeable raid controllers :) |
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| 12:02.29 | ratrace | Guest_76: Zfs works just fine on Debian |
| 12:02.37 | ratrace | Wulf: pls no FUD kthnxbai |
| 12:02.56 | Wulf | ratrace: I didn't say that it does not work. |
| 12:03.13 | ratrace | Wulf: but you're spreading FUD with that license nonsense |
| 12:03.24 | Wulf | ratrace: how is that nonsense? |
| 12:03.48 | ratrace | because it is. ZFS license does not prevent it from being used and installed on debian systems. it does not violate the kernel or any GPL or any other license |
| 12:04.07 | ratrace | it's also not proprietary code, it's open source. |
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| 12:04.49 | Wulf | ratrace: does debian ship zfs? no? why not? |
| 12:04.55 | ratrace | it does... |
| 12:04.57 | ratrace | !info zfsutils-linux |
| 12:05.09 | ratrace | studpid bot |
| 12:05.23 | colo-work | lol |
| 12:05.25 | Cyanoxygen | what |
| 12:05.41 | ratrace | it msg'd me that it's updating the database and then it ragequit lol |
| 12:05.56 | Wulf | :) |
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| 12:06.02 | ratrace | !info zfsutils-linux |
| 12:06.04 | dpkg | zfsutils-linux: (command-line tools to manage OpenZFS filesystems), section contrib/admin, is optional. Version: 0.8.2-3 (sid), Packaged size: 357 kB, Installed size: 1192 kB |
| 12:06.09 | Wulf | ratrace: okay, that's userspace utilities. What about the kernel modules? |
| 12:06.10 | ratrace | !info zfs-dkms |
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| 12:06.11 | dpkg | zfs-dkms: (OpenZFS filesystem kernel modules for Linux), section contrib/kernel, is optional. Version: 0.8.2-3 (sid), Packaged size: 1817 kB, Installed size: 13614 kB |
| 12:06.13 | Wulf | ah |
| 12:06.55 | Wulf | Then I take back what I said. |
| 12:07.25 | ratrace | V d^.^b V |
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| 12:07.43 | Wulf | Guest_76: looks like it's easily installable on Debian. |
| 12:08.23 | ratrace | there's just one bug with buster's packaging, it requires spl-dkms be installed _first_ and when zfsutils-linux fails on modprobe, it must be modprobe'd manually and apt install resumed |
| 12:08.47 | Guest_76 | ran into that bug on test install i think :) |
| 12:08.53 | Guest_76 | thanks all for input |
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| 12:09.05 | Guest_76 | zfs it is |
| 12:09.20 | ratrace | NoRegrets(tm) |
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| 12:36.57 | Erhu | if I have two debian distros on my sda ; is it ok if I just create one SWAP since only one of them will be used one-at-a-time. Is this ok |
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| 12:37.24 | Erhu | and have both use the swap when either one is started. |
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| 12:38.22 | f0x1 | I'm curious what's up with my hdd RAID1 array (dm-3), write times are extremely slow https://stats.pixie.town/d/9CWBz0bik/node-exporter-terra?orgId=1&from=1573215261489&to=1573215697906&fullscreen&panelId=160 |
| 12:38.31 | tarzeau | Erhu: i think so, yes |
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| 12:38.44 | f0x1 | it could also be the luks perhaps? |
| 12:38.58 | f0x1 | it's weird because write times to both it's disks, sdb and sdc, are fine |
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| 12:39.14 | Erhu | tarzeau, ;-) |
| 12:39.17 | tarzeau | f0x1: does dmesg -T show anything? |
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| 12:39.45 | tarzeau | f0x1: can you run badblocks on individual disks? maybe with -sv ? |
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| 12:40.32 | ross` | Why doesn't buster include synergy in the repo |
| 12:40.37 | ross` | repo seems to be part of strech and sid |
| 12:41.07 | ross` | synergy seems to be a part of stretch and sid |
| 12:42.00 | tarzeau | ross`: because it comes with something better called "barrier"? |
| 12:42.55 | ross` | tarzeau: thank you@ |
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| 12:43.08 | ross` | Are old synergy configuration files comptatible? |
| 12:43.11 | ross` | specifying screen and links |
| 12:43.16 | tarzeau | i think so, not sure though |
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| 12:47.00 | Kats99 | ls -ld [c-i] |
| 12:47.01 | Kats99 | why isn't this command printing out the directories? |
| 12:47.31 | Kats99 | it says ls: cannot access '[c-i]': No such file or directory |
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| 12:49.12 | Erhu | I use ls -alh |
| 12:49.25 | Erhu | I don't know what your trying to do... I am a noob |
| 12:49.40 | diogenes_ | Kats99, ls -d */ |
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| 12:50.50 | Kats99 | no im trying to use regex here |
| 12:51.05 | Kats99 | this expression [a-z] should work |
| 12:51.11 | ratrace | f0x1: those being averages, the numbers are useless. you'd have to perform specific tests for iops and bandwidht |
| 12:52.36 | Erhu | what is the GTK ... apt-get install GTK doesn't work, I tried apt-cache search GTK but too many .. have anyone here installed GTK |
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| 12:52.51 | ratrace | Erhu: apt search --names-only gtk |
| 12:53.53 | ratrace | Erhu: that said, you almost never install it directly, it's pulled in as a dependency, because as you see there are several bindings and variants |
| 12:54.55 | Erhu | Geany said to install gtk first... but didn't say how. |
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| 12:55.24 | Erhu | I think, now I have to go back to the page I forgot.. for installing. |
| 12:55.30 | ratrace | Erhu: what are you trying to do? geany is packaged in debian, and it will pull in all the dependencies |
| 12:55.47 | ratrace | apt install geany |
| 12:56.04 | Erhu | yes, in the devuan version it is 1.29 ... or over 2 years old |
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| 12:56.22 | Kats99 | people use devuan? |
| 12:56.24 | Erhu | trying to build and install the 1.36 version of geany |
| 12:56.25 | ratrace | Erhu: which is not a #debian problem, is it? :) |
| 12:56.33 | ratrace | ,v geany |
| 12:56.34 | judd | Package: geany on amd64 -- jessie: 1.24.1+dfsg-1; stretch: 1.29-1; buster: 1.33-1; bullseye: 1.35-1; sid: 1.35-1 |
| 12:56.35 | Erhu | Kats99, hell ya |
| 12:57.37 | Erhu | so, I might be on stretch... |
| 12:57.59 | Erhu | so that means I should leave things be. |
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| 12:58.29 | Erhu | how can I tell if I have stretch? |
| 12:58.29 | ratrace | you can easily upgrade to buster. and if you're on devuan, then yeah, their next release, based on buster, is nowhere in sight. |
| 12:58.44 | jelly | Erhu: lsb_release -sc |
| 12:59.04 | jelly | !debian suite |
| 12:59.05 | dpkg | cat /etc/debian_version (or lsb_release -sc). Or check /etc/apt/sources.list. If unsure about the distribution, $ cat /etc/{*version*,*release*,*issue*} should grab almost all distributions. |
| 12:59.21 | Erhu | jelly, ASCII |
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| 12:59.46 | jelly | Erhu: that's not debian. That's some release of Devuan, so ask in #devuan |
| 12:59.54 | Erhu | ok |
| 13:00.33 | Erhu | I thought it was just old Debian |
| 13:00.40 | Erhu | take care , my bad |
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| 13:00.57 | ratrace | that's the price of hating systemd :) |
| 13:01.55 | Erhu | In China you can not use a device until it has a face scan with your id,,, Systemd is just the start of all that, IMHO |
| 13:02.18 | ratrace | nah, systemd has nothing to do with that. chiniese devices are probably not even running systemd. |
| 13:02.23 | ratrace | *those chinese |
| 13:02.46 | Erhu | understood,,, but where it is going is the same. |
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| 13:03.13 | ratrace | Erhu: no, it's not. the two are unrelated. evil governments can use devuan for evil purposes just as well. |
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| 13:06.56 | n_1-c_k | Why is firefox-esr 68.2.0esr sometimes showing me https://0x0.st/zghk.png ? |
| 13:07.48 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: it will show that if you're running FF and the package has updated |
| 13:08.08 | ratrace | now the question is what do you mean by sometimes. how often? |
| 13:08.12 | Erhu | ratrace, did ms buy github? if so Why? |
| 13:08.31 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, what is "the package has updated"? The debian package? |
| 13:08.37 | ratrace | Erhu: you can ask me that in #debian-offtopic |
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| 13:08.42 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: yes |
| 13:08.50 | rander2 | hello |
| 13:08.53 | Erhu | your awesome |
| 13:09.32 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, but this isn't via apt. It happened twice, more or less at random while browsing. Is this a debian-managed thing? |
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| 13:09.46 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: not that I know of. |
| 13:10.02 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: unless you installed FF by unpacking int in your ~/ dir, it cannot update itself |
| 13:10.08 | ratrace | *it |
| 13:10.16 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, ok. Lucky me. I'm guessing no one else is seeing this. |
| 13:10.48 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: it's possible that some core extensions updated and it wants you to restart it? |
| 13:10.56 | rander2 | I'm lookling from install exim authentication in send mail |
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| 13:11.40 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, I have no auto update enabled (that I know of!). I'm not sure it really is updating as there is no change in the version number in help/about. |
| 13:11.42 | TomyWork | iirc, there was a command to specifically mark one package version as bad and have the autoupdate ignore it, but install the next one. I have a use case for that with a 3rd-party package but I cannot remember the command. |
| 13:13.50 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, thanks for your responses. I do suspect the 'update' is bogus as my bandwidth is so puny I think I'd notice the download. But am unsure. |
| 13:13.56 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: are you sure you're not runnign unattended-upgrades or something and FF updated (As it recently upgraded from ESR-60 to ESR68) without you knowing? |
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| 13:14.44 | ratrace | I ran into exactly that once, that's how I saw that FF page for the first time. was testing gnome and I didn't know it came in unattended-upgrades and FF updated without me noticing |
| 13:14.53 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, unless unattended-upgrades has installed itself, no, I've never run it. |
| 13:15.03 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: it is on GNOME installations afaik |
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| 13:15.12 | n_1-c_k | I don't use Gnome. |
| 13:15.28 | ratrace | easy to check if you have unattended-upgrades. also easy to check if FF updated, via /var/log/apt/history.log |
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| 13:15.48 | n_1-c_k | 'dpkg --status unattended-upgrades'? I'll try... |
| 13:16.01 | TomyWork | I turned unattended-upgrades off when it forced me to choose between restarting firefox and being unable to open new tabs |
| 13:16.19 | n_1-c_k | No to that one.. I'll check that log... |
| 13:16.34 | TomyWork | imo, firefox shouldn't be unattended-upgradable |
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| 13:16.53 | ratrace | TomyWork: unattended-upgrades should not be used at all, if you ask me. |
| 13:18.32 | rander2 | to use tls in exim am I register a certificate ? |
| 13:18.36 | n_1-c_k | Last mention of firefox in history.log* was Oct 24th, requested by me. Odd... |
| 13:18.59 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: now the $1M question. is this Debian or a derivative? ;) |
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| 13:19.13 | n_1-c_k | Yes, there was a security update. It's debian stable. |
| 13:19.25 | ratrace | rander2: yes, you need a TLS/SSL certificate if your MTA is to accelpt TLS connections |
| 13:19.40 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: upgrade from esr-60 to esr-68? |
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| 13:20.08 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, yes, "Upgrade: firefox-esr:amd64 (60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1, 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1)" |
| 13:20.15 | rander2 | ratrace, so must I buy it from a certification autority ? |
| 13:21.02 | rander2 | is it possible use a free system or must I buy it ? |
| 13:21.04 | n_1-c_k | I'm getting more sure that it's a bogus message from Firefox. It often warns me of OCP(?) errors that go away when I restart ff. |
| 13:21.19 | n_1-c_k | I hope it's nothing nefarious. |
| 13:21.46 | ratrace | rander2: you can use free certificates from LetsEncrypt. Also some registries and CAs are offering free options, like Comodo |
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| 13:22.08 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: first thing I'd suspect in that case is filesystem corruptions |
| 13:22.17 | rander2 | ok |
| 13:22.43 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, oh that sounds bad. How does one verify or correct such a thing? |
| 13:24.01 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: depends on the filesystem. you can see if there are any hints of it in dmesg. you can run e2fsck with the -c option (I think it might require unmounted filesystem for that). |
| 13:24.12 | ratrace | that's for ext filesystems for example |
| 13:24.55 | n_1-c_k | Hmm... there's a way to force fsck on the next reboot isn't there? I'll try that and hope I guess. Thanks for advices. |
| 13:25.22 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: yes but I don't think it does -c (badblocks scan) |
| 13:25.53 | n_1-c_k | Oh... that's getting more complicated :( |
| 13:26.26 | n_1-c_k | I guess that calls for a rescue disk? |
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| 13:30.58 | fighter_fish | hello running debian 10 on a VM. So far everything ran fine, but once I was tinkering with open box and accidentally messed up. So I fix my error and restart the VM, however on boot I find I can't access the internet. What went wrong? How does tinkering with my WM mess with my ethernet? |
| 13:32.18 | oiaohm | With modern day drives by the time file system is showing badblocks you are really in big trouble because the smart system on the drive has to have failed. |
| 13:32.33 | oiaohm | Or the cable to the drive has failed. |
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| 13:42.57 | rander2 | I'm configuring exim4 for sending mail, the server is on a vps. I may send mail locally throught mutt , but not from remote . How may I end mail using exim4 from vps without enable mail spamming ? |
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| 13:50.56 | ratrace | n_1-c_k: I suppose oiaohm is right about badblocks... and you'd bee seeing other symptoms first. |
| 13:51.18 | ratrace | rander2: "end mail"? |
| 13:51.48 | rander2 | mail too, the mail go only from localhost |
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| 13:53.43 | ratrace | rander2: "end mail"? |
| 13:54.16 | rander2 | ratrace, mutt and mail are 2 text client locally in vps |
| 13:54.46 | ratrace | rander2: I'm just trying to understand your question. "How may I end mail" .... what do you mean by "end mail"? |
| 13:55.09 | ratrace | "end mail ... from vps without enable ... spamming" what does that mean |
| 13:55.21 | greycat | If you're sending mail via a command-line client like mailx which is reading from stdin, you end the message the same way you *always* end tty stdin -- by pressing Ctrl-D on a line by itself |
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| 13:55.48 | greycat | But really, you shouldn't be making a habit of sending mail by mailx reading from canonical-mode tty stdin. |
| 13:55.52 | rander2 | locally in vps the mail outgoing, but from remote no. An error accour... |
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| 13:56.15 | greycat | rander2: paste for us the error message you are seeing |
| 13:56.21 | ratrace | greycat: I don't think that was the question, I think it's a language barrier... they probably mean something else and i'm trying to figure out what |
| 13:56.36 | greycat | yeah, subsequent messages from this user confirm that it's still very ambiguous |
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| 13:58.32 | Fox | I think he is afraid fo creating an open relay, and he asks how to prevent anyone from connecting to his mail server to send mail |
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| 13:58.56 | Guest_76 | isn't ending mail ... ? |
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| 13:59.11 | greycat | maybe it's a typo for "send mail" |
| 13:59.23 | greycat | meanwhile, we wait for them to actually PASTE something |
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| 14:00.46 | Guest_76 | I'm happy. been trying to get ubuntu server installer to work nicely with nvme while debian minimal install worked oob. :) |
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| 14:03.13 | Shahnaz | any way to bind glusterfsd volumes to internal ips only? |
| 14:03.27 | Shahnaz | per default its on *:49152 |
| 14:03.52 | n_1-c_k | ratrace, oiaohm, thanks. I rebooted with 'fsck.mode=force' which found nothing, so I'll hope for best and assume ff is playing tricks. |
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| 14:06.41 | rander2 | https://justpaste.it/5w6w4 # cat /var/log/exim4/mainlog |
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| 14:07.16 | rander2 | paste.debian.net block me as smammer |
| 14:08.54 | ratrace | rander2: relay not permitted -- you probably didn't set up a1@tinco.ga as a local mailbox |
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| 14:09.52 | ratrace | rander2: by "local mailbox" I mean... mailbox for delivery. "local" has other meaning with MTAs (delivery to local system users' maildir/mailbox) |
| 14:10.34 | rander2 | ratrace, I'm trying to send mail from thunderbird, I haven't exim here, cause I'm in back a NAT |
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| 14:11.14 | wwilliam | hello I installed supertux but is not running |
| 14:11.15 | wwilliam | $ supertux2 |
| 14:11.17 | wwilliam | bash: supertux2: command not found |
| 14:11.45 | greycat | wwilliam: dpkg -L supertux | grep bin/ |
| 14:12.05 | wwilliam | $ dpkg -L supertux | grep bin/ |
| 14:12.06 | wwilliam | afernandez@debian:~$ |
| 14:12.28 | greycat | OK, then it's time to read the documentation and find out how you're supposed to run the thing. |
| 14:12.40 | teclo- | afternoon, I am a regular Debian GNU/Linux user and I just clean-installed Debian 10.1 on a server... I got a problem in screen and/or irssi: ctrl-n and ctrl-p for next and previous channels work, but esc-1 or esc-2 or esc-3 do not bring me to the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd channel... what is the next step ? |
| 14:12.44 | ratrace | rander2: I think your bad english prevents you from having quality support here. either try google translate or try your language specific channel. which language is it? |
| 14:12.50 | wwilliam | Ok thank you greycat |
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| 14:19.52 | Fox | wwilliam: add /usr/games to your PATH or just use full PATH to start it: /usr/games/supertuxkart |
| 14:20.04 | greycat | Oh. I forgot about /usr/games/. |
| 14:20.29 | greycat | ... dpkg -L supertux | grep -E 'bin/|games/' |
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| 14:21.15 | Fox | nobody's perfect :) |
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| 14:22.04 | greycat | tab completion might work as well. supert<TAB> |
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| 14:24.35 | wwilliam | Thanks Fox |
| 14:26.18 | wwilliam | Fox: worked :) thanks |
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| 14:36.44 | utail_ | User travism may run the following commands on vacuum: (ALL : ALL) NOPASSWD: ALL (ALL) ALL |
| 14:37.01 | utail_ | grr...it won't past properly! |
| 14:37.16 | greycat | looks like sudoers syntax |
| 14:37.39 | utail_ | where did the last (ALL) ALL rule come from? |
| 14:37.54 | utail_ | in sudoers it doesn't seem to be listed |
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| 14:38.12 | utail_ | if I could remove the (ALL) ALL rule I could use sudo with no password |
| 14:38.36 | greycat | what do you mean "where did [it] come from". it's your sudoers file. you put it there. |
| 14:39.04 | greycat | either in /etc/sudoers or a file in /etc/sudoers.d/ |
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| 14:44.36 | utail_ | erm...how do I get Xfce 4.14? |
| 14:47.14 | petn-randall | utail_: It's not in stable, so you'd have to wait for the next Debian release in a few years. |
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| 14:47.39 | utail_ | debian backports? |
| 14:47.52 | petn-randall | utail_: The other option is to run testing, but that implies a whole set of other potentially difficult things. |
| 14:47.54 | greycat | conceivable, but I wouldn't count on it |
| 14:48.11 | greycat | ,v xfce4 |
| 14:48.12 | judd | Package: xfce4 on amd64 -- jessie: 4.10.1; stretch: 4.12.3; buster: 4.12.5; bullseye: 4.14; sid: 4.14 |
| 14:48.21 | greycat | nary a backport in sight |
| 14:48.41 | utail_ | oh wow slackware |
| 14:48.47 | utail_ | if they had a new releae |
| 14:48.52 | utail_ | release |
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| 14:54.15 | aexl | hi. what is going on here? http://paste.debian.net/1115256/ security updates want to remove gdm3 and gnome-shell. (i haven't updated those since 10.1 though.) |
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| 14:55.48 | greycat | ,v gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0 |
| 14:55.49 | judd | Package: gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0 on amd64 -- jessie: 2.6.2+dfsg1-4; stretch: 2.18.6-1~deb9u1; stretch-multimedia: 2.18.6-1~deb9u1.0; stretch-backports: 2.24.2-1~bpo9+1; buster: 2.24.3-1~deb10u1; buster-proposed-updates: 2.24.4-1~deb10u1; buster-multimedia: 2.24.4-dmo0+deb10u1; stretch-backports-sloppy: 2.26.1-3~bpo9+2; buster-backports: 2.26.1-3~bpo10+1; buster-security: |
| 14:55.50 | judd | 2.26.1-3~deb10u1; bullseye: 2.26.1-3; bullseye-multimedia: 2.26.1-dmo3; sid: 2.26.2-1; sid-multimedia: 2.26.2-dmo1; experimental: 2.27.2-1 |
| 14:56.38 | greycat | That buster-security update for gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0 looks out of place, but I don't know the story here. |
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| 14:58.23 | JordiGH | ratrace: I guess it just took longer: https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/7dd563f9-9933-41d9-b274-c1f3d0191108 https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/a92432f2-7632-4d39-b2ea-fa9a30191108 https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/f85685e5-9972-470f-93d1-ccb710191108 |
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| 15:00.00 | greycat | Seems it's related to https://www.debian.org/security/2019/dsa-4558 even though the package name isn't mentioned explicitly. |
| 15:00.46 | greycat | I'd probably file a bug report about it. The upstream version bump introduced by the DSA is causing dependency issues. |
| 15:00.59 | greycat | (or maybe there's already a bug... I didn't check yet) |
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| 15:02.18 | jelly | aexl: which debian release is supposed to be installed on this machine? |
| 15:02.35 | greycat | jelly, it's coming from buster-security |
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| 15:03.15 | aexl | 10.1 (but i upgraded since 6, i think) |
| 15:03.23 | aexl | thanks for looking into it |
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| 15:03.56 | greycat | whatever /media/WHEEZY1 is, it doesn't have wheezy packages |
| 15:04.14 | aexl | it's the image of buster 10.1 |
| 15:04.27 | aexl | dvd |
| 15:04.42 | interrobangd | how is that called if the key changed during a encypted session? |
| 15:05.12 | interrobangd | to protect the data if the session was captured? |
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| 15:06.08 | Habbie | interrobangd, there are two things in your question |
| 15:06.23 | Habbie | interrobangd, one is the establishment of session keys, usually through Diffie-Hellman |
| 15:06.45 | interrobangd | no, i mean not the estab. |
| 15:06.56 | Habbie | interrobangd, that one gives you Forward Secrecy, protecting the data from decryption under capture |
| 15:07.21 | Habbie | interrobangd, the other one might be something like periodic session key refresh, but i'm not sure |
| 15:07.28 | Habbie | interrobangd, ssh calls it rekeying i think |
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| 15:07.56 | interrobangd | thanks! |
| 15:08.04 | interrobangd | i think it was perfect forward secrecy (PFS) |
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| 15:08.33 | interrobangd | thank you |
| 15:08.55 | aexl | greycat: file a bug here? https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37 |
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| 15:10.52 | rander2 | I have a vps running exim4 , how can I make exim accept mail from a different host, but with an existing sender? He always tells me "relay not permitted" |
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| 15:11.06 | revolutionary | hi all. i wanna use debian onion sourcelist (https://wiki.debian.org/SourcesList#Using%20Tor%20with%20Apt) but apt is using 9050 port for connection. How can i change that to 9150 for Tor Browser? Thanks |
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| 15:12.25 | revolutionary | Here is the apt connection view |
| 15:12.26 | revolutionary | 0% [Connecting to SOCKS5h proxy (socks5h://127.0.0.1:9050)] |
| 15:12.29 | greycat | rander2: if you're trying to RECEIVE mail (rather that pass it along, which is called "relay"), you need to tell exim what your domains are. So when exim receives a message that says "to jonnie@your.domain", and "your.domain" is considered local, exim will accept it and deliver it. |
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| 15:13.53 | greycat | On the other hand, if you ARE trying to relay mail (a -> b -> c and you are currently looking at b), then that's a WHOLE different question and a whole lot harder to answer. |
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| 15:16.31 | rander2 | greycat, I'm trying to relay mail using exim as smtp , but with existing users on vps. In other worlds to send mail without using local account on vps |
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| 15:17.21 | greycat | OK, then I can't help you. I don't know exim well enough to set it up in relaying mode. |
| 15:17.34 | rander2 | classic relay mean send mail from another doman |
| 15:17.52 | greycat | Conceptually, the issue is "how do you know which message to relay, and which messages to reject". |
| 15:18.25 | greycat | In the good old days, you simply accepted messages based on source IP addresses, because you were relaying for the users in your corporate network. |
| 15:18.51 | rander2 | greycat, to avoid spamming ralay is disable, I must usa some type of smtp authentication , but I dont know exactly how do this |
| 15:18.57 | greycat | But around 20 years ago, it became the Cool Thing for people to work from home and shit, so now you can't use IP addresses to judge which messages are allowed. |
| 15:19.26 | greycat | rander2: OK, good, at least you understand what the issues are. If nobody here knows, then find an exim channel. |
| 15:20.18 | lunchslut | anyone using ibus on 10.1? ive been having issues switching input methods in Qt apps since updating to stable. i have the same issue on multiple distinct machines |
| 15:20.45 | lunchslut | i havent been able to find any relevant bug reports though and it works fine on oldstable |
| 15:21.39 | rander2 | I must set up ssl/tls to authenticate the sender user , but I dont know exacly |
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| 15:22.44 | greycat | there is an #exim channel |
| 15:22.56 | rander2 | as all know , the original stmp protocol isnt secure, it was abusated too much in past, so now it is disable |
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| 15:27.04 | revolutionary | !ping |
| 15:27.04 | dpkg | Yes, revolutionary you are either online or you are not... http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20000326 |
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| 15:27.27 | ratrace | oh wow I forgot about the userfriendly cartoon! |
| 15:27.33 | aexl | greycat: i solved i by allowing stable updates (xD) and also installing xdg-dbus-proxy and also upgrading gir1.2-webkit2-4.0 and libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37 |
| 15:27.38 | revolutionary | ohh ratrace how do you do? |
| 15:28.12 | rander2 | all major mail provider as google , yahoo, for example , use this approach to avoid spamming and fake mail sender. So my question isnt so strange |
| 15:28.35 | revolutionary | rander2 maybe you should use SPF/DKIM |
| 15:29.01 | greycat | Nobody said your question was strange. I said I don't know how to do it with exim. Ask the #exim channel if nobody else here knows either. |
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| 15:32.21 | rue_mohr | is there a kernel module to give me the /proc/config ? |
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| 15:32.55 | rue_mohr | (/proc/config.gz) |
| 15:33.10 | greycat | Debian keeps /boot/config-* files. |
| 15:33.12 | petn-randall | hi, how do I find out by which process a file is created? I tried inotifywait, but that doesn't list the process doing the file access. |
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| 15:33.58 | jelly | rue_mohr: CONFIG_IKCONFIG |
| 15:34.29 | jelly | rue_mohr: not a module, but a build-time tunable that Debian does not typically have enabled |
| 15:35.29 | engine20191 | hi How can I disconnect an operating system from a USB port, ie disconnect and connect it again? |
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| 15:36.05 | ratrace | petn-randall: inotify + quickly lsof? otherwise I can't think of a way other than using a MAC and having an audit trail |
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| 15:38.47 | petn-randall | ratrace: I'm trying to give fnotifystat a spin, but it's always just outputting "Duration must be 0.5 or more." The man page does not mention any duration. |
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| 15:40.22 | ratrace | petn-randall: take a look at the audit(d) subsystem and auditctl, even without a MAC framework in effect |
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| 15:43.44 | ratrace | petn-randall: https://www.linux.com/tutorials/customized-file-monitoring-auditd/ |
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| 15:49.44 | revolutionary | anyone? |
| 15:50.18 | jelly | Bueller? |
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| 15:51.02 | revolutionary | jelly maybe you know my problem |
| 15:51.30 | jelly | maybe, but it's Friday 5PM |
| 15:51.34 | greycat | does a /lastlog. Tor something. Something about Tor. And a SOCKS5 proxy. |
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| 15:52.33 | revolutionary | actually not completely irrelevant with Tor. It is relevant with apt-transport-tor package on Debian |
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| 15:52.59 | revolutionary | apt-transport-tor is using 9050 port but i wanna change with 9150 |
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| 15:53.58 | revolutionary | i gotta go now and i will come in 15 minutes. don't forget me :) |
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| 15:54.09 | dvs | who? |
| 15:54.17 | petn-randall | Starlord |
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| 15:54.29 | dvs | I am root! |
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| 15:54.35 | petn-randall | hehehehe |
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| 15:56.20 | webstrand | Is there a way to mark a package for autoremoval? I've `apt-mark auto mlocate`, but `apt-get autoremove` doesn't remove the package |
| 15:56.52 | greycat | why not simply remove it? |
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| 15:57.08 | jelly | webstrand: autoremove won't remove any package if some other Depends or Recommends on it |
| 15:57.09 | webstrand | Bascially, I want to queue up manually installed packages for removal, then let apt figure out which packages are still needed and which aren't |
| 15:57.27 | Habbie | webstrand, trying to explicitly remove it may show you why it is not being autoremoved |
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| 15:57.28 | jelly | webstrand: "aptitude why mlocate" |
| 15:57.35 | Habbie | oh even nicer |
| 15:57.44 | greycat | "I want my computer to guess which things it should remove! What could possibly go wrong?!" |
| 15:57.48 | ratrace | aptitude tho |
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| 15:58.17 | revolutionary | hi again. i found how to change port but i couldn't find where is that file. https://github.com/diocles/apt-transport-tor if you look to the configuration section he is explaining with acquire but i don't know where is it |
| 15:58.18 | zodd_ | rm -f / |
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| 15:58.28 | greycat | zodd_: not funny, and not tolerated. |
| 15:58.48 | webstrand | Ah, "findutils Suggests mlocate | locate" I guess suggested packages are considered optional dependencies? |
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| 15:59.02 | jelly | that shouldn't prevent autoremoval |
| 15:59.02 | Erhu | zodd that just evil |
| 15:59.14 | jelly | only Recommends and Depends |
| 15:59.16 | ratrace | that rm won't do anything tho |
| 15:59.36 | zodd_ | yep. But nowadays there is protection against it ´just hapening´ |
| 15:59.46 | ratrace | zodd_: no, you forgot -r. it won't work at all :) |
| 15:59.49 | Habbie | zodd_, 'rm -f /' did nothing before that protection either |
| 15:59.53 | webstrand | jelly: That's everything that aptitude reports. `apt-get remove -s mlocate` also reports no dependencies |
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| 16:00.28 | xormor | I think the command with the '-r' included will also wipe out the UEFI. |
| 16:00.37 | xormor | if UEFI is in use, that is. |
| 16:00.51 | ratrace | xormor: you mean efivars? |
| 16:01.03 | xormor | ratrace, maybe. I am not an expert on that. |
| 16:01.19 | xormor | ratrace, yes, probably. |
| 16:01.26 | ratrace | xormor: you mean the thing that, if removed, would brick your bios and turn it into an overpriced paper weight? |
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| 16:02.08 | jelly | webstrand: interesting. Can you confirm it's marked auto? |
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| 16:02.56 | webstrand | jelly: yep it's marked as auto. `apt-get remove -s findutils` WILL remove mlocate |
| 16:03.04 | jelly | webstrand: i A findutils Suggests mlocate | locate <-- is there a capital A |
| 16:03.15 | jelly | oh, okay |
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| 16:03.27 | webstrand | I guess suggestions block autoremove |
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| 16:03.44 | jelly | perhaps apt is configured for something unusual on your system or the defaults changed |
| 16:04.47 | webstrand | It's a clean image of debian/bullseye from linuxcontainers.org. So I suspect it's changed defaults |
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| 16:04.59 | greycat | *shudder* |
| 16:05.08 | jelly | webstrand: I don't know anything about apt from testing yet. |
| 16:05.08 | webstrand | Is that a bad source? |
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| 16:05.15 | jelly | !bullseye |
| 16:05.16 | dpkg | The release following Debian 10 "Buster" is codenamed "Bullseye" (Woody's horse in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 11. It is the current "testing" release. Remember that straight after a stable release, all sorts of mess suddenly lands in "testing" and it is best avoided if you don't like debugging things. https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2016/07/msg00002.html |
| 16:05.16 | greycat | how on earth can you work the word "clean" into that sentence with a straight face |
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| 16:05.44 | ratrace | lol |
| 16:05.44 | webstrand | Ah, I'll retry on debian 9 and report back |
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| 16:05.55 | greycat | Why not stable? |
| 16:05.58 | petn-randall | turns the rant mode down from 10 to 4 on greycat. |
| 16:06.02 | jhutchins_wk | revolutionary: locate |
| 16:06.38 | jelly | webstrand: current release is Debian 10 "buster" |
| 16:06.47 | webstrand | greycat: misread your quote. I'll grab debian buster |
| 16:07.18 | xormor | ratrace, yes, but I think it is /dev/sda1 or /dev/sda2. I will check. |
| 16:08.10 | ratrace | xormor: I meant /sys/firmware/efi/efivars :) on buggy firmwares, deleting those turns your motherboard into frisbee. |
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| 16:08.47 | xormor | ratrace, yes, it is good to know that. |
| 16:08.49 | greycat | You can't "delete" the "files" in /sys. Unless I'm missing something profound. |
| 16:08.58 | revolutionary | jhutchins_wk which file? |
| 16:09.05 | revolutionary | did you look to the link? |
| 16:09.19 | ratrace | greycat: you're missing that it's a path mounted rw by systemd with all sorts of gotchas and warnings |
| 16:09.20 | xormor | ratrace, "/dev/sda1 on /boot/efi type vfat" this is some EFI. then there is the /boot in "/dev/sda2", and then there is the efivars. |
| 16:09.46 | xormor | ratrace, "efivarfs on /sys/firmware/efi/efivars type efivarfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec,relatime)" |
| 16:09.47 | ratrace | greycat: https://lwn.net/Articles/674940/ |
| 16:10.03 | xormor | greycat, good to know. |
| 16:10.15 | ratrace | xormor: yes, which would be (attempted to be) removed with that nasty rm -rf no preserve root thingy |
| 16:11.12 | ratrace | xormor: but efivars is mounted rw so it IS modifiable, unlike the rest of /sys |
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| 16:11.23 | xormor | ratrace, aha! |
| 16:11.31 | ratrace | on buggy firmwares, that's the important tidbit here. |
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| 16:16.07 | webstrand | debian buster has the same issue. Is it possible that update-alternatives is preventing the package from being removed? |
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| 16:16.39 | greycat | What "issue"? That "suggests" prevents autoremoval? That sounds eminently sensible to me. |
| 16:16.39 | webstrand | `apt-mark showauto | grep mlocate` shows that mlocate is marked auto |
| 16:17.54 | greycat | Maybe I'm slightly biased, because I *completely* disable autoremove on my systems, but I would think that the default behavior of autoremove (if it's to be tolerated at all) should be *extraordinarily* conservative. Nothing should be removed if there's even a *hint* that something might want it. |
| 16:18.44 | annadane | yep should be pretty conservative |
| 16:18.44 | jhutchins_wk | If you use aptitude in menu mode it's possible to go through and mark a selection of packages to remove then remove them. |
| 16:18.57 | webstrand | But suggested packages /have/ to be manually installed in the first place, right? |
| 16:19.03 | greycat | No. |
| 16:19.12 | revolutionary | jhutchins_wk which file i should locate or edit? |
| 16:19.19 | greycat | apt has modes of operation where it installs Suggests, or not. |
| 16:19.21 | revolutionary | i couldn't find file name on that page |
| 16:23.27 | greycat | apt-get has the command-line option --install-suggests and the doc points to config file item APT::Install-Suggests as its parallel. |
| 16:23.42 | jhutchins_wk | revolutionary: That project hasn't had a commit in over three years. If you installed it from the debian repos, dpkg -L will show you what files it installed, but I would think an un-maintained package that doesn't have clear documentation and addresses something that really isn't a real need might best be avoided. |
| 16:23.52 | annadane | only depends and recommends are installed by default and you can --no-install-recommends if you're really adventurous |
| 16:24.26 | revolutionary | jhutchins_wk i will try now dpkg -L |
| 16:24.26 | ratrace | I only install with --no-install-recommends :) too opinionated for my taste. |
| 16:24.49 | annadane | not a bad approach. i'd probably go crazy if i did it myself though |
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| 16:25.19 | webstrand | Is there some way I can `apt-get remove foo bar` where remove will skip package foo if it's a dependency of another package? |
| 16:25.23 | jelly | it's a good approach if you don't ask questions why stuff does not work, in here |
| 16:25.24 | ratrace | of course it sometimes has a point, but things like smartmontools pulling in an entire MTA suite? nope nope nope nope. |
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| 16:26.06 | webstrand | I've been using autoremove, but I know which packages I no longer need, I just don't know if they're dependencies of other installed packages |
| 16:26.08 | greycat | webstrand: what are you actually trying to do? |
| 16:26.08 | jelly | ratrace: install a tiny one like dma, or you won't get mail when a disk fails |
| 16:26.36 | ratrace | jelly: I know and I don't want it to send any emails. |
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| 16:27.00 | webstrand | greycat: I'm trying to remove a list of packages that I installed previously. But I don't want to remove dependencies of other packages that I'm not explicitly removing |
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| 16:27.20 | greycat | And this is a one-time thing? With a finite list? |
| 16:27.23 | webstrand | yep |
| 16:27.30 | ov3rmind | hey guys please gimme some attemption, oneof myfirst used distros is slackware butineed to beinvited to join in this freenode channel, anyone can invite me please? |
| 16:27.37 | greycat | Just do "apt-get remove foo" and if it says "I want to remove three things", say no, and move on to the next one. |
| 16:27.51 | annadane | ov3rmind, i believe it's ##slackware |
| 16:28.04 | annadane | note the double number sign |
| 16:28.12 | ratrace | isnt there usually an autoredirect? |
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| 16:28.19 | ov3rmind | ok very thanks |
| 16:28.21 | annadane | no afaik |
| 16:28.23 | greycat | only if they chose to make it autodirect |
| 16:28.42 | ratrace | #slackware-linux according to alis. |
| 16:28.43 | annadane | speaking of not having stuff auto-install auto-start, slackware... |
| 16:29.07 | jelly | when you're already in said channel, the autoredirect tells you need an invite |
| 16:29.09 | greycat | The topic of #slackware says "it's currently forwarded", but who knows. |
| 16:29.14 | ratrace | uh sorry, #slackwarelinux. #slackware is some "owner only" thing nobody should join |
| 16:29.58 | ov3rmind | i understood |
| 16:30.10 | ov3rmind | very thanks gys |
| 16:30.23 | ratrace | ov3rmind: there's a bunch of channels really, /msg alis list slackware and read the descriptions |
| 16:30.32 | greycat | #slackwarelinux has 1 user, and ##slackware has a couple hundred |
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| 16:31.14 | ratrace | ah yeah wasn't even looking at the number of users |
| 16:31.17 | Haohmaru | i've installed slackware in advanced mode x_x |
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| 16:31.20 | Haohmaru | when i woz a n00b |
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| 16:31.44 | JordiGH | greycat: What makes you think my Firefox crashes are related to dsa-4558? |
| 16:31.51 | greycat | what |
| 16:32.03 | swift110 | lol greycat |
| 16:32.04 | ratrace | me too! then I was, like "what do you mean there's no package manager!? what do you mean I have to resolve deps myself!" and then it was removed, pronto espresso schnell. |
| 16:32.06 | JordiGH | lol |
| 16:32.06 | JordiGH | <JordiGH> ratrace: I guess it just took longer: https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/7dd563f9-9933-41d9-b274-c1f3d0191108 https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/a92432f2-7632-4d39-b2ea-fa9a30191108 https://crash-stats.mozilla.org/report/index/f85685e5-9972-470f-93d1-ccb71019110 |
| 16:32.08 | JordiGH | <greycat> Seems it's related to https://www.debian.org/security/2019/dsa-4558 even though the package name isn't mentioned explicitly. |
| 16:32.14 | greycat | what makes you think anything I said about a dsa was directed at you |
| 16:32.22 | ratrace | JordiGH: bet lost eh |
| 16:32.25 | greycat | that was a different discussion |
| 16:32.35 | JordiGH | greycat: The fact that you said it right after I said it and you didn't address anyone. |
| 16:32.41 | JordiGH | That's what makes me think you were talking to me. |
| 16:32.47 | JordiGH | It's a reasonable assumption to make. |
| 16:33.08 | JordiGH | Especially since you said "even though the package name isn't mentioned explicitly [in the stack trace]". |
| 16:33.27 | JordiGH | ratrace: Yep. I should have insisted on it. |
| 16:33.55 | greycat | *sigh* |
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| 16:34.50 | JordiGH | ratrace: I'm not the only one crashing here, there are other Firefox versions, but we're all on lunix. |
| 16:35.05 | greycat | JordiGH: http://paste.wooledge.org/374 |
| 16:35.30 | JordiGH | greycat: I see, thanks. |
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| 16:38.31 | annadane | slackware is A Lot Of Fun but you're still using a project run by one person and its way of doing things can be peculiar |
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| 18:19.10 | luca | Buonasera a tutti |
| 18:19.17 | greycat | !it |
| 18:19.17 | dpkg | Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help. |
| 18:19.50 | tradar | !de |
| 18:19.50 | dpkg | Deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in #debian.de (auf irc.oftc.net, irc.freenode.net oder irc.belwue.de) - German speaking users please go to #debian.de (on irc.oftc.net, irc.freenode.net or irc.belwue.de). |
| 18:19.56 | tradar | ĸeĸ |
| 18:20.12 | luca | Grazie, sono qui solo per fare due chiacchere su debian, sapete dove posso trovare un canale per parlare con gli sviluppatori? Ho qualche idea in merito per migliorarlo |
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| 18:20.52 | lupulo | luca try to send an email to the package which you want to improve |
| 18:21.08 | luca | Faccio computer per amici e collaboro con un negozio dunque sono riuscito a ottimizzare l'interfaccia in modo che sia userfriendly per tutti |
| 18:21.18 | luca | Basata su Xfce |
| 18:21.21 | lupulo | luca you could try to speak with the mantainer of the package |
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| 18:21.31 | luca | yes |
| 18:21.49 | luca | ci sono maintainer su Irc? |
| 18:22.08 | lupulo | luca irc is a protocol |
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| 18:22.29 | luca | Intendo nella rete |
| 18:22.57 | lupulo | luca https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1459 |
| 18:23.04 | Akuw | i am checking my ntpq -p that shoul be 10.3.16.40 configured in ntp.conf |
| 18:23.10 | luca | Grazie |
| 18:23.21 | Akuw | but ntpq show 192.168.0.22 |
| 18:23.24 | Akuw | why? |
| 18:23.44 | Akuw | i checked ntp.conf and there is server 10.3.16.40 |
| 18:23.58 | greycat | what *else* does ntp.conf say? |
| 18:24.22 | ayekat | also, what's the full output of ntpq -p? |
| 18:24.34 | Akuw | <PROTECTED> |
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| 18:24.53 | Akuw | the other host is ok and show |
| 18:24.54 | Akuw | *10.3.16.40 200.54.149.19 2 u 68 1024 377 1.178 3.793 2.890 |
| 18:25.52 | Akuw | the other is showing that IP ? |
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| 18:27.10 | greycat | Is "the other host" 10.3.16.40 itself? Or a third computer that's using 10.3.16.40 as its NTP server? |
| 18:27.24 | jelly | luca: non ci sono molti di qua in freenode, prova #debian-it su irc.oftc.net |
| 18:27.26 | greycat | And what does ntp.conf say on the problem child, and what do the logs say? |
| 18:27.43 | Akuw | is another computer using same NTP |
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| 18:29.34 | Akuw | restrict -4 default kod notrap nomodify nopeer #noquery |
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| 18:29.43 | Akuw | that line if diferent in problem child |
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| 18:29.48 | Akuw | noquery commented |
| 18:29.54 | Akuw | that could be the problem ? |
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| 18:31.29 | greycat | google gives me a page that includes http://support.ntp.org/bin/view/Support/AccessRestrictions#Section_6.5.1.1.3. |
| 18:31.59 | greycat | looks like noquery affects info you give to your CLIENTS if you are acting as their server |
| 18:34.00 | Akuw | the good host does not has that word commented |
| 18:34.13 | greycat | whatever, don't care, try it and see |
| 18:34.26 | Akuw | try what, uncomment? |
| 18:34.39 | greycat | you refuse to show the conf file or the log files, instead doling out one line at a time |
| 18:34.42 | Akuw | the problem is i cant restart ntp |
| 18:34.46 | greycat | WHY NOT |
| 18:34.54 | Akuw | i am not admin |
| 18:34.59 | greycat | *plonk* |
| 18:35.04 | Akuw | let me past ntp.conf |
| 18:35.08 | greycat | What . The .. ... |
| 18:35.31 | Akuw | https://paste.debian.net/1115279/ |
| 18:36.13 | Akuw | there is no log for ntp |
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| 18:40.16 | Akuw | greycat: what? |
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| 18:43.37 | Akuw | noquery is used for? |
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| 18:47.26 | jhutchins_wk | Akuw: If you are not admin there is no way you can fix ntp. |
| 18:47.37 | Akuw | i know |
| 18:48.35 | jhutchins_wk | Akuw: What you coul do is spend some time reading the documentation so you will at least understand what you're seeing. |
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| 18:57.30 | Akuw | why ntpq is showing wrong mail |
| 18:57.35 | Akuw | admin is confused |
| 18:57.37 | Akuw | :/ |
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| 19:07.33 | jhutchins_wk | Where did mail come into it? |
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| 19:07.49 | jhutchins_wk | Akuw: You really should at least read the manpages. |
| 19:08.05 | Akuw | working |
| 19:08.39 | NetTerminalGene | how is amd rx570 gpu on debian buster? |
| 19:08.45 | NetTerminalGene | gnome |
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| 19:14.10 | mati | Hi, I have a question regarding GRUB. I was looking for an answer, but couldn't find it on Arch Wiki. I've changed the resosution of GRUB ( in /etc/default/grub GRUB_GFXMODE=) from auto to 1920x1080. Before the change, GRUB loaded instantly but with 1080p resolution it loads from bottom to top, if you know what I mean. Is there any way to mitigate/eliminate this and make the loading faster? |
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| 19:16.38 | diogenes_ | mati, do you also have GRU_THEME, GRUB_BACKGROUND? |
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| 19:19.16 | mati | diogenes_: I do have GRUB_THEME but don't have GRUB_BACKGROUD (theme.txt points to the background) |
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| 19:20.31 | diogenes_ | mati, try comment #GRUB_THEME, update-grub, see if that helps. |
| 19:22.42 | mati | diogenes_: can't really do that, because I have a custom theme. That's another reason why I wanted to change the resolution to higher (I wanted the theme to look good) |
| 19:23.53 | diogenes_ | mati, and that's why it's laggy, it has to do with framebuffer device. |
| 19:24.33 | mati | diogenes_: So there isn't a way to make the loading faster without lowering the resolution, right? |
| 19:25.07 | diogenes_ | mati, UEFI/legacy? |
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| 19:27.01 | mati | diogenes_: legacy BIOS |
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| 19:28.31 | diogenes_ | mati, then there is a hope you can get a better result with UEFI. |
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| 19:30.12 | mati | diogenes_: I'd rather not switch to UEFI; dual booting Linux with Windows on UEFI is a pain |
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| 19:31.36 | diogenes_ | mati, no pain but ok, you decide. |
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| 19:34.14 | mati | diogenes_: I'll try on another machine, though. My friend once tried to dual boot windows and linux and he didn't manage to do it. He uses Arch and even Arch Wiki says that this option is not recommended and it's better to go with BIOS in that case |
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| 19:36.07 | diogenes_ | mati, i've done that on tons of PCs with no issues so, if you know what you do, all is fine. |
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| 19:38.07 | f8e3 | can i send a mail from a fresh deb9 install to foo@bar.com ? |
| 19:38.34 | mati | diogenes_: Yeah, I probably should get familiar with UEFI cuz I hardly ever used it. Thanks! |
| 19:38.46 | greycat | f8e3: if you installed an MTA, yes |
| 19:39.13 | f8e3 | does MTA need to be a mail provider/hoster or just custom setting-up? |
| 19:39.22 | greycat | !mta |
| 19:39.22 | dpkg | A Message/Mail Transfer Agent (MTA) is a program that transfers e-mail in or out of a system, most often using SMTP. An MTA is usually accessed by calling /usr/sbin/sendmail and thus usually includes that binary. Therefore, in Debian, all MTAs (<exim4>, <postfix>, <qmail>, <ssmtp>, <nullmailer>, etc) mutually conflict. Ask me about <which mta>, <mta comparison> and <why an mta>. http://wooledge.org/~greg/mail.html |
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| 19:40.09 | diogenes_ | mati, you're welcome and btw, Debian is one of the few distros that can do secure boot. |
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| 19:55.51 | jhutchins_wk | mati: That's pretty strange, we've been dual-booting with Windows since the 90's. |
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| 19:56.46 | greycat | "secure boot" is relatively new, though |
| 19:57.57 | jhutchins_wk | True. |
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| 20:01.15 | somiaj | I dual boot just fine with uefi (though haven't tested secure boot), I just use the firmware to select which efi file to boot from, not grub. I kinda hope bootloaders become less common with uefi, since they aren't really needed anymore |
| 20:01.32 | somiaj | though I guess they do allow you to have multiple kernels easier, than having to put extra enteries into the efi partition |
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| 20:09.15 | f8e3 | greycat https://blog.codinghorror.com/so-youd-like-to-send-some-email-through-code/ "reverse PTR record" is that correct, i can give up then |
| 20:10.23 | greycat | If you do not have a working mail server of your own, you'll probably have to relay your outgoing mail through a smart host, typically using SMTP Authentication (name and password) so the relay will permit you to use it. |
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| 20:10.57 | greycat | !ssmtp |
| 20:10.57 | dpkg | sSMTP is an extremely simple <MTA> to get mail off the system to a mailhub. It does not receive mail, expand aliases or manage a queue. http://wiki.debian.org/sSMTP . See also <nullmailer>. |
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| 20:12.26 | f8e3 | do mean sth like sendgird/mailgun etc, 'smart host' i am very new, so i need sth else out there, uff, not a simple setup then, yet unclear what |
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| 20:27.47 | dokma | So I cannot get systemd to leave my sshd subprocecesses alive after logout. Did the usual KillMode=process dance but no go. |
| 20:28.09 | dokma | TMux is the process that gets whacked but I suppose that is not really relevant. |
| 20:28.30 | dokma | Is there any way to check if KillMode=process is active in the current session? |
| 20:28.42 | petn-randall | f8e3: Setting up a mail server that its mail will get accepted by 3rd parties is a larger undertaking than setting up a web server. It needs experience and a lot of fixing of small but annoying things. |
| 20:28.43 | somiaj | check /etc/ssh/sshd_config? |
| 20:29.33 | greycat | dokma: are you saying that you do something like ssh yourhost 'sleep 1111 >/dev/null 2>&1 &' and it dies after the ssh connection terminates? |
| 20:29.52 | dokma | greycat: let me try that exact thing |
| 20:30.48 | dokma | greycat: hmmm... sleep remains running. So it's something about tmux. |
| 20:31.19 | greycat | also for the record, Debian's ssh.service already has KillMode=process |
| 20:31.38 | dokma | greycat: I know... I added it to the per process service too |
| 20:31.56 | dokma | Now I'm wondering what is killing tmux on logout... |
| 20:32.25 | f8e3 | petn-randall yes i will refrain, and wait for the next tech |
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| 20:32.40 | f8e3 | well what can i do |
| 20:33.39 | petn-randall | f8e3: That's what sendgrid/mailgun and others do: You pay them to take care of the gritty details of successful mail delivery. |
| 20:35.37 | f8e3 | my goal is to have a simple decentralized setup far from data/censor silos |
| 20:35.39 | somiaj | and even if you do everything correct, if you happen to get an ip that some spammer in the pass abused, you still get your emails rejected by the big guys. |
| 20:36.12 | f8e3 | why is there no solution to this, a p2p message exchange everyone uses and is reachable by |
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| 20:36.19 | greycat | Because of spammers. |
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| 20:37.04 | petn-randall | I've been running my own mail server for several years now, and I just recently fixed an issue that negatively affected delivery. Timewise it's better to spend it elsewhere and pay someone. Unless you do it for fun and to learn things. |
| 20:37.12 | f8e3 | why is there no builtin simply mech: please only by [x,y...], so simple |
| 20:37.27 | greycat | I can't parse that sentence. |
| 20:37.31 | shinobi | Hello All, can I achieve 256 clrs in pure tty? (no yaft, no fterm)? |
| 20:37.47 | petn-randall | f8e3: But ... mail is a decentralized p2p message exchange service? |
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| 20:38.13 | greycat | Email *is* a decentralized peer to peer messaging system that everyone uses ... in 1992. |
| 20:38.15 | f8e3 | p2p message exchange: the decentralized network queues the messages for y until received, you need to whitelist senders, voila no spam since y can explictly balcklist again |
| 20:38.56 | f8e3 | greycat i dont own a domain, i need to register at central x,y; i dont have static ip to be reachable under etc, its centralized |
| 20:39.06 | greycat | "the decentralized network queues the messages"? huh? where are they actually queued up, then? |
| 20:39.32 | f8e3 | greycat by peers connected buffering done by a balancing algo (yet to written) |
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| 20:39.55 | f8e3 | * all peers participating in the network being 'online' |
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| 20:41.28 | f8e3 | it was never designed for scale, + ecnrytped stuff pulumping is horrible (i guess); theresll be aanother solution wihtin the next decade for sure |
| 20:41.36 | f8e3 | these messaging apps are just a precursor |
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| 20:47.05 | _DeLa_ | Hi there! I have installed Zotero (https://www.zotero.org/) and Pycharm CE (https://www.jetbrains.com/pycharm/download/#section=linux) both the same way: Extract the archive into /opt/zotero and /opt/pycharm respectively and run the binaries from there. |
| 20:47.05 | _DeLa_ | Now, updating Zotero from within the software worked without root privileges, while updating Pycharm from within the software forced me to use root privileges. How is this possible!? |
| 20:47.44 | petn-randall | _DeLa_: I'm actually surprised that you could install zotero without root, as /opt should only be writable by root. |
| 20:48.12 | _DeLa_ | petn-randall: Sorry! Copying both programms to opt/folder was done using root |
| 20:48.37 | petn-randall | _DeLa_: I guess one has the permissions for your unprivileged user, and the other doesn't. |
| 20:49.06 | petn-randall | file and directory owner is probably uid=1000 for the upgradable case. |
| 20:49.54 | _DeLa_ | petn-randall: it seems that way...but I cannot remember changing permissions... |
| 20:50.43 | petn-randall | _DeLa_: Maybe you used 'mv' in one case, and 'cp' in the other. |
| 20:50.56 | petn-randall | Or unzipped one as root, and the other as normal user. |
| 20:51.13 | _DeLa_ | petn-randall: hmm...maybe |
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| 20:52.07 | f8e3 | to understand linux/debian whats the best way to start from medium progermmer pov to get to know the 'system' ? |
| 20:52.53 | greycat | !handbook |
| 20:52.53 | dpkg | The Debian Administrator's Handbook is at http://debian-handbook.info/ and can be browsed, bought and downloaded. From Debian 7 "Wheezy" onwards, it can also be installed from the debian-handbook package. Also ask me about <books> <docs>. PDF at https://debian-handbook.info/download/stable/debian-handbook.pdf |
| 20:52.57 | mutante | f8e3: use it as your everyday desktop |
| 20:53.24 | tpo2 | why is pulseaudio `netstat -anp|grep pulseaudio` listening on all interfaces `tcp 0 0 0.0.0.0:45285 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN 1034/pulseaudio`? |
| 20:53.26 | petn-randall | f8e3: A fundamental problem of every p2p messaging system will be spam. |
| 20:54.17 | petn-randall | f8e3: You can already just whitelist people/servers with mail. You'll just have a serious bootstrapping problem if someone wants to send you something that you don't know yet. |
| 20:54.18 | f8e3 | petn-randall i am willing to pay for each message, imagine, spammers will pay me for sending me, making them poor the receiver of spam rich, good deal |
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| 20:54.47 | petn-randall | That has already been invented. And it failed. |
| 20:55.03 | f8e3 | petn-randall pointer please, it will come again, seems flawed approach |
| 20:55.16 | f8e3 | *implemntation |
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| 20:58.52 | petn-randall | f8e3: Microsoft had a system where you'd have to pay them money to send mail to anyone, like 15 years ago. I forgot how they called it. It failed because no one was willing to pay MS for something that everyone could do for free. |
| 20:59.01 | amflir | I set my apt prefs like this. Why it wants to upgrade to testing when I do apt-get dist-upgrade? https://paste.debian.net/1115306/ |
| 20:59.23 | greycat | "prefs"... |
| 20:59.49 | greycat | "Pin". Gaaaahhh. Frankendebian in progress. |
| 21:00.15 | greycat | petn-randall: I am just going to /ignore this person now, so you don't have to be angry at me when I get angry at them. |
| 21:00.33 | somiaj | !don't break debian |
| 21:00.33 | dpkg | well, dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian |
| 21:00.34 | mutante | pay to send mail = LinkedIn business model |
| 21:00.51 | somiaj | amflir: ^^ what you are doing will end you up in a world of pain |
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| 21:01.54 | petn-randall | greycat: hehehe :) |
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| 21:02.44 | petn-randall | amflir: You should be mixing several releases on a system, anyway. So even if your pinning would work, you'd be breaking your system. |
| 21:03.00 | somiaj | s/should/should NOT/ |
| 21:03.03 | amflir | somiaj, thanks for letting me know about FrankenDebian. But I still like to know what is wrong with my apt pins? |
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| 21:03.26 | amflir | apt-cache policy returns different results than my pins |
| 21:03.31 | petn-randall | should NOT, yes |
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| 21:03.47 | petn-randall | I don't know why I'm sometimes dropping crucial words. :-S |
| 21:03.52 | somiaj | then they are not configured properly, but we don't support this, you are on your own. |
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| 21:05.10 | amflir | I found my answer. thanks. |
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| 21:06.31 | petn-randall | amflir: Either way you shouldn't mix releases. Whatever your goal is, there are proper options. |
| 21:06.47 | petn-randall | amflir: What are you trying to achieve with mixing releases? |
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| 21:11.30 | amflir | petn-randall, nothing much. just comfort. this is a PC and I like to be able to install whatever I want without hassle until I break the system. |
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| 21:13.34 | petn-randall | amflir: You already did by mixing releases. It'll bite you subltly in the long run. |
| 21:13.47 | greycat | usually not subtle |
| 21:14.28 | petn-randall | amflir: The correct way is to use backports, or backport it yourself if you need to. |
| 21:14.31 | petn-randall | !ssb |
| 21:14.31 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
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| 21:16.44 | amflir | building packages takes much more time that mixing releases and break the system once in a while. |
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| 21:20.22 | f8e3 | petn-randall curcial miss and the consumer is correct, why pay some centralized party if another with same feature does it for free; miss is do it p2p + pay for mail = voila, network is buffering, and the digital cash is some crypto-thingy |
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| 21:20.36 | f8e3 | i think were on to something here |
| 21:20.57 | f8e3 | :D sure |
| 21:22.21 | petn-randall | amflir: Do as you wish. You should just know that we don't support such a setup, so if anything breaks, you get to keep all the pieces. |
| 21:23.08 | petn-randall | f8e3: Uuuh, you do your thing. Let us know when you've implemented it. |
| 21:23.20 | f8e3 | greycat jessie != buster/stretch |
| 21:23.47 | petn-randall | I think he's aware of that. |
| 21:24.04 | greycat | it has come up once or twice in the past |
| 21:24.48 | f8e3 | :D, so no breaking changes learning 8 to use in 9/10 |
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| 21:25.47 | greycat | ah, you're talking about the Debian Administrator's Handbook. Well, there isn't a newer one. And sure, there are some changes from 8 -> 9 -> 10, but most things are basically similar. |
| 21:28.08 | f8e3 | is AppArmor inspired by quebuesOs which i also eye |
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| 21:35.33 | ratrace | f8e3: no, the two mechanisms are unrelated |
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| 22:12.25 | f0x1 | if I update my /etc/crypttab, do I need to run some command to update things? |
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| 22:13.54 | petn-randall | f0x1: Maybe update the initramfs with `update-initramfs -k all`? I think a copy lands in the initramfs. |
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| 22:24.21 | GenTooMan | hmm I have a problem my kernel keeps loading the dvb_usb_rtl28xxu module WHICH blocks me using rtl-sdr. Since I don't have a DVB-T toy on my machine but an SDR based on RTL any suggestions? I looked at the rtl-sdr and the suggestion was modprobe -r dvb_usb_rtl28xxu but that just reports a "can't do" (ran as root). |
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| 22:29.38 | petn-randall | GenTooMan: "can't do"? Can you be more specific? What is the error you get? |
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| 22:45.41 | GenTooMan | petn-randall "modprobe: FATAL: Module dvb_usb_rtl28xxu is in use" however I just tried GQRX and nrsc5-gui and ... weird it works now, I wonder if the last kernel update fixed the issue. |
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| 23:00.30 | GenTooMan | petn-randall well anyhow thanks? LOL |
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| 23:03.54 | kadiro | wow first time i see someone in irc have dvb device except me |
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| 23:12.43 | GenTooMan | kadiro I use it for 24MHz-1700MHz instead of DVB digital FM for example or HAM or looking at 868MHz range. |
| 23:13.13 | kadiro | cool |
| 23:13.26 | kadiro | Mine is dvb-s |
| 23:13.53 | kadiro | GenTooMan, can dvb-t catch the FM? |
| 23:14.31 | kadiro | I mean any dvb-t |
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| 23:18.36 | GenTooMan | you have to use a different antennae 87.5 108MHz according to EN 302 018 which is lower than DVB-T which is EN 302 296 174MHz - 230MHz 470MHz - 790MHz |
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| 23:19.42 | kadiro | GenTooMan, ah nice, thanks |
| 23:21.54 | GenTooMan | kadiro if you want a reference https://www.ecodocdb.dk/download/2ca5fcbd-4090/ERCREP025.pdf |
| 23:22.25 | GenTooMan | kadiro that should give you the entire European spectrum used |
| 23:22.46 | kadiro | thank you very much |
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| 23:24.27 | GenTooMan | kadiro you can tune the entire range using GQRX you do need to change your receiver element (antennae) depending on the frequency. GQRX is in debian sd gqrx-sdr. |
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| 23:25.57 | senecaty | im wiping a usb stick with cat /dev/zero > /dev/sdb, but it hangs my terminal after emitting `No space left on device` |
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| 23:26.24 | kadiro | GenTooMan, gotcha, It will be my first time using dvb-t |
| 23:26.33 | senecaty | CTRL-C does not end the cat process |
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| 23:27.21 | kadiro | senecaty, I think using dd in that case is much better |
| 23:27.23 | ratrace | senecaty: it'll finish. kernel is buffering writes and reporting finished sooner than it actually wrote to the device, and since usb is slow, it has to catch up |
| 23:28.41 | ratrace | dd with conv=sync and a reasonable block size (say 128k) will show status closer to the real time truth |
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| 23:29.33 | ratrace | conv=fdatasync I mean |
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| 23:32.01 | oxek | on debian, does systemd fully replace cron? |
| 23:32.31 | kadiro | it has timer |
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| 23:40.16 | pedahzur | If there is a better place to ask this, please point me there. :) I'm trying to create a repo (with reprepro) and sign it. I'm signing it with a key with signature FFFFB3557. On the system accessing the new repository, `apt-key list` shows a key imported with signature FFFB 3557. However, when I run apt-get update, I get "InRelease: The following signatures were invalid: 347D7D44139452B2214B771EC0C819FFFFFB3557" That's obviously the |
| 23:40.18 | pedahzur | key I signed it with, and that key is imported. So, if it has the key imported, why is the signature (which appears correct) invalid? What is the best way to go about troubleshooting this? Pointers to docs welcome. :) |
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| 23:42.49 | somiaj | There might not be many here who understand the details of creating a signed repo. You may want to ask on the mailing list (though unsre which one is most appropriate) https://lists.debian.org/ or maybe one from https://lists.debian.org/devel.html |
| 23:43.06 | somiaj | pedahzur: you could also check out the channels on irc.oftc.net https://wiki.debian.org/IRC |
| 23:43.26 | pedahzur | somiaj: Thanks! |
| 23:45.04 | somiaj | the debian-custom mailing list looks promising (Developing common infrastructure for custom Debian distributions) -- since this might be something common a distribution has to do |
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| 23:50.54 | pedahzur | somiaj: I appreciate it! #debian-apt on irc.oftc.net looks like it might be a good place, but it's a small channel. I posted there. Might try a mailing list next if I don't hear back. |
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| 23:54.34 | somiaj | pedahzur: yea, some questions are just better asked on the mailing list, with a wat. |
| 23:54.37 | somiaj | wait |
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