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| 00:24.56 | bit1 | annadane, I've removed local server apt --purge remove cups-server-common |
| 00:26.06 | annadane | that's... weird, but ok |
| 00:28.10 | bit1 | annadane, no so weird, I didn't understand printer idea, I've a server and a client. On the client-side mustn't exist any server. |
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| 00:31.50 | whislock | That's not right. |
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| 00:32.30 | whislock | The cups server is what applications submit print jobs to. It's entirely possible that every debian workstation would have the cups server installed, if they've all individually configured their printers. |
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| 00:35.07 | bit1 | whislock, oki, but I've sending my file to my localhost which were sending to remote host. It's easier to sent directly to remote host. Haven't I? |
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| 00:35.30 | whislock | Depends on how you have the thing configured. |
| 00:35.45 | whislock | But the idea that the client can't also have the server installed is wrong. |
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| 00:36.16 | bit1 | whislock, ok, let's change to .. don't need to be installed |
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| 00:58.00 | nyov | How can I find the package a file belongs to, when the package is not installed? I know there was a way... |
| 00:58.42 | bit1 | nyov, apt-file search ? |
| 00:59.05 | nyov | testing |
| 00:59.44 | bit1 | nyov, " Search in which package a file is included. A list of all packages containing the pattern pattern is returned." |
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| 01:02.20 | nyov | bit1: so if it doesn't find anything, that means the file is not in any package in the current release? |
| 01:04.16 | nyov | bit1: yeah, that seems legit :) Thanks a ton, works as expected |
| 01:07.40 | bit1 | nyov, you're welcome :) |
| 01:08.40 | nyov | yeah, this amazing. doesn't even need a full path, I can't remember why I forgot about this gem. |
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| 01:45.17 | subcool | i know im asking a stupid one, but- idk. I cant seem to ssh into my laptop. |
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| 01:45.28 | subcool | i dont even get a denial status |
| 01:45.51 | subcool | and when i try to SSH the otherway, the other laptop is refusing my passowrd. |
| 01:45.55 | subcool | wtf? |
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| 01:47.50 | subcool | the guides mention turning off UFW. which i dont have. |
| 01:47.55 | subcool | i suppose i should.. |
| 01:48.05 | subcool | i am running a vpn, but that should stop it... should it? |
| 01:48.14 | whislock | No. |
| 01:48.22 | whislock | VPNs route traffic outbound. They do nothing to control traffic inbound. |
| 01:49.08 | subcool | thats my only guess. i didnt htink so |
| 01:49.09 | whislock | A VPN could conceivably cause a problem for you in this case. |
| 01:49.39 | whislock | I don't have enough information about the systems involved to be able to guess, though. |
| 01:50.01 | subcool | i am viewing the Sshd_config. root password allowed |
| 01:50.05 | subcool | it was a clean install |
| 01:50.08 | whislock | Shouldn't be. |
| 01:50.19 | subcool | i turned it on |
| 01:50.22 | whislock | Bad idea. |
| 01:50.32 | subcool | im just trying to get any reaciton |
| 01:50.39 | subcool | ill disable it now. |
| 01:51.26 | whislock | So, describe the client and server in this scenario, including IP addresses. |
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| 01:51.48 | subcool | Client A: 192.168.1.11 Client B: 192.168.1.11 |
| 01:51.52 | subcool | i mean 12 |
| 01:51.56 | whislock | I was about to say. :P |
| 01:51.57 | subcool | debian 9 on both. |
| 01:52.03 | whislock | So they're adjacent hosts on the same LAN? |
| 01:52.08 | subcool | yep |
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| 01:52.14 | whislock | Yeah, a VPN wouldn't have any effect here. |
| 01:52.21 | whislock | Can you ping back and forth? |
| 01:52.29 | subcool | client b shows connection attempts and failures |
| 01:52.30 | subcool | yes |
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| 01:53.10 | whislock | And which way are we trying to go right now? A->B or B->A? |
| 01:53.20 | subcool | ok nvm. now that i am using a user, i can connect into CLient B. |
| 01:54.09 | subcool | but- CLient A is not even acknowlding client b requests |
| 01:54.35 | whislock | !paste |
| 01:54.36 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 01:54.45 | whislock | subcool: paste the output (see above) of 'ss -lt4n'. |
| 01:54.49 | whislock | From client A. |
| 01:56.18 | subcool | http://paste.debian.net/1120284/ |
| 01:57.38 | whislock | Same thing, 'iptables -S'. |
| 01:59.57 | subcool | http://paste.debian.net/1120285/ |
| 02:01.07 | whislock | Yeah. Client A's iptables rules are dropping the traffic. |
| 02:01.38 | subcool | i thought it was acting that way, but - ive never had nord do that before. |
| 02:01.41 | whislock | I also feel compelled to tell you that you're wasting money on NordVPN, or any other public VPN provider. |
| 02:01.58 | subcool | we were talking about this before- making my own vpn |
| 02:02.02 | subcool | its on the list of things to do |
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| 02:02.12 | whislock | It's a lot easier to do than dealing with that crap. :P |
| 02:02.24 | subcool | im in a couple groups ttyring to make my way there. Pfsense and i arent going to counsleing |
| 02:02.47 | whislock | You could easily set up strongswan on a Debian box. |
| 02:02.57 | subcool | ive been considering that- |
| 02:03.04 | whislock | That's what I do. |
| 02:03.04 | subcool | but from what i know, its basically doing IPtables |
| 02:03.18 | whislock | strongswan? |
| 02:03.27 | subcool | which is also basically just getting a cisco router, and knowing ur routes anyways. |
| 02:03.32 | whislock | What? |
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| 02:03.44 | subcool | idk what strongwan is.. but- from what i hear, the best way to manager a network is with iptalbes. |
| 02:03.52 | whislock | No. |
| 02:03.58 | subcool | whats the new thing? |
| 02:04.02 | whislock | iptables is host firewalling, nothing more. |
| 02:04.07 | whislock | I have no idea what you're talking about. |
| 02:04.21 | whislock | strongswan is an IPsec VPN daemon. |
| 02:04.22 | subcool | i havent done it- |
| 02:04.26 | subcool | oh. |
| 02:04.36 | ksk | ipsec. so 1990 :P |
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| 02:05.04 | whislock | And yet it works, is performant, and is secure. |
| 02:05.17 | whislock | And also standardized. |
| 02:05.22 | ksk | sure, horses work, too. |
| 02:05.35 | subcool | I am confused- but duh. How does that encrypt your traffic to the web? |
| 02:05.52 | ksk | did you have a debian related problem we could help with btW? :) |
| 02:05.56 | whislock | Doesn't, same as your VPN. |
| 02:06.08 | whislock | ksk: Yeah, I've already handled that? |
| 02:06.16 | ksk | great :) |
| 02:06.37 | whislock | subcool: What it does do is allow me to maintain a secure tunnel to my home, and then out to the internet. |
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| 02:07.16 | whislock | subcool: Same concept as Nord, I just don't have to pay another provider to quite possibly monitor my traffic while promising they don't. |
| 02:08.13 | whislock | ksk: Your horses comment is as bizarre as it is irrelevant, by the way. |
| 02:08.14 | subcool | yeah.. still confusing. i get the secure access to home network. |
| 02:08.29 | whislock | subcool: Which you then route out to the internet the same as your home traffic. |
| 02:08.39 | whislock | It's the *exact same thing* Nord is doing. |
| 02:08.42 | subcool | but then your local ISP sees it anyways |
| 02:08.44 | ksk | I am just trolling, nevermind me. You are still using sys-v-init I suppose? ;) |
| 02:08.49 | whislock | ksk: No. |
| 02:08.56 | subcool | i get that, but they are IN the cloud already. |
| 02:09.02 | subcool | kinda |
| 02:09.02 | whislock | subcool: "the cloud" |
| 02:09.05 | subcool | yeah i know |
| 02:09.13 | whislock | So... Two comments. |
| 02:09.27 | whislock | 1. If you're going to insecure websites, everyone sees the traffic anyway. Doesn't matter if you're going through Nord or not. |
| 02:09.43 | whislock | 2. If you're going to secure websites, no one can see that traffic, including your home ISP. |
| 02:09.56 | subcool | kinda.. |
| 02:09.58 | subcool | right. |
| 02:09.59 | ksk | your home ISP will however be able to see which site you visit. |
| 02:10.12 | subcool | because they have the inital key to the certs |
| 02:10.12 | whislock | ksk: Not with TLSv1.3. |
| 02:10.17 | whislock | subcool: No. |
| 02:10.20 | ksk | (totally valid what whislock said though) |
| 02:10.36 | ksk | whislock: eh, okay? you mean they cannot see the server name in the handshake? |
| 02:10.42 | ksk | they for sure still can see the IP you connect to |
| 02:10.45 | whislock | ksk: Correct. TLSv1.3 includes encrypted SNI. |
| 02:10.48 | whislock | So? |
| 02:10.52 | ksk | kk, good to know. |
| 02:11.02 | whislock | Most everything goes through a CDN or something, so the endpoint IPs for most web traffic tell you jack. |
| 02:11.04 | wsky | is bored |
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| 02:12.16 | whislock | subcool: This whole "omg, my home isp" thing is kinda pointless. My home isp isn't my concern. It's what connection I'm using when I'm not at home. |
| 02:12.50 | subcool | see, like for me. i cant torrent at home. |
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| 02:12.53 | whislock | Your home ISP is regulated. Nord isn't. |
| 02:13.01 | subcool | right- |
| 02:13.12 | nb-ben | you're shifting your trust to your VPN |
| 02:13.17 | whislock | Which is a huge downgrade. |
| 02:13.21 | subcool | VPN cant turn off my internet |
| 02:13.28 | subcool | idgaf |
| 02:13.29 | nb-ben | it may actually not be |
| 02:13.30 | whislock | lul yes they can |
| 02:13.53 | subcool | they can limit me- ya. but- They arent going to serve me with some copyright infringment bs |
| 02:13.58 | nb-ben | regulations for ISPs may not be in your favor |
| 02:14.09 | subcool | i cant change vpn;s - there are only two ISP;s here |
| 02:14.24 | whislock | subcool: The fact that you believe that BS is kinda sad, not going to lie. |
| 02:14.38 | subcool | which part? |
| 02:14.50 | valdyn | subcool is probably in a country where the isp is obligated to disclose his identity for copyright infringement while nordnet may not be |
| 02:14.52 | whislock | That they're not going to hit you with copyright infringement letters. |
| 02:14.58 | subcool | I get notifications from my ISP about this BS copyright shit- They turn off my internet. LIterally. |
| 02:15.12 | subcool | valdyn: yea~ |
| 02:15.16 | whislock | You think Nord is going to take liability for you? Good luck with that. |
| 02:15.19 | nb-ben | "Internet service providers in many countries are legally required (e.g., via Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act (CALEA) in the U.S.) to allow law enforcement agencies to monitor some or all of the information transmitted by the ISP, or even store the browsing history of users to allow government access if needed (e.g. via the Investigatory Powers Act 2016 in the United Kingdom)." ... and more stuff |
| 02:15.27 | nb-ben | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_service_provider#Law_enforcement_and_intelligence_assistance |
| 02:15.28 | subcool | They dont take liability- they hide what im doing. |
| 02:15.36 | whislock | subcool: No, they don't. They quite literally do not. |
| 02:15.43 | whislock | VPN providers give you neither anonymity nor privacy. |
| 02:15.56 | valdyn | its really simple, in germany your isp is obligated, in skandinavia the vpn providers are not |
| 02:15.57 | subcool | because they have access to everything you do. |
| 02:16.00 | valdyn | and it works |
| 02:16.28 | ksk | 02:14 < subcool> I get notifications from my ISP about this BS copyright shit- They turn off my internet. LIterally. -- uk eh? :D |
| 02:16.30 | whislock | https://gist.github.com/joepie91/5a9909939e6ce7d09e29 |
| 02:16.32 | whislock | Read. |
| 02:16.46 | valdyn | now you cant use this for serious crimes, because then nordnet would be obligated to disclose your id |
| 02:16.56 | whislock | Seriously, read. |
| 02:16.59 | ksk | he has a valid point |
| 02:17.01 | whislock | subcool: VPNs do not do what you think they do. |
| 02:17.03 | subcool | ksk: yeah. i use to have verizon. |
| 02:17.06 | ksk | you are right of course whislock, but still |
| 02:17.23 | ksk | if you live for example in germany, and you torrent some copyrighted foo, they will come after you. |
| 02:17.31 | ksk | if your ip is "from somwhere else" they will most likely not bother |
| 02:17.50 | ksk | ..not that I would support pirating copyrighted materials :P |
| 02:17.58 | whislock | ksk: Even that assumption is becoming more and more tenuous as countries join into mutual assistance treaties. |
| 02:18.24 | ksk | yeah. I suppose EU will have kind of the same (internet) laws some time in the future.. |
| 02:18.40 | whislock | Believe me, I get the fundamental concept behind what VPNs market themselves as and what people want them to be. |
| 02:18.42 | subcool | so actually- um- how do i get my computer to accpet connections on port 22? lol |
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| 02:18.51 | whislock | But they're complete bull. |
| 02:19.04 | nb-ben | you could host your own VPN on a VPS or something like that |
| 02:19.05 | valdyn | subcool: your router needs to forward that port to your local ip |
| 02:19.06 | whislock | subcool: Modify the iptables rules to accept the connection. Should just require adding a single rule. |
| 02:19.10 | nb-ben | and not save any logs |
| 02:19.13 | whislock | valdyn: It's internal connection. |
| 02:19.13 | ksk | subcool: eh? there would be nothing to do in a default debian setup. just make something listen at port 22 |
| 02:19.18 | whislock | valdyn: same LAN. |
| 02:19.24 | whislock | It's not a default setup. |
| 02:19.27 | ksk | if you setup a firewall or service filter, you will need to adjust that. |
| 02:19.33 | nb-ben | hmm, actually then your provider still has the outgoing data |
| 02:19.34 | whislock | Something's added filtering rules. |
| 02:19.38 | ksk | then we cannot tell, without additional information. |
| 02:19.42 | whislock | I have the information,. |
| 02:19.54 | whislock | This was discussed way back before the VPN rabbithole. |
| 02:20.13 | nb-ben | suppose if you live in a certain juristiction you could use a VPN to make your local authorities unable to get information from a local ISP |
| 02:20.13 | whislock | Two hosts, same LAN, this one won't accept SSH connections, most likely because Nord added http://paste.debian.net/1120285/ |
| 02:20.44 | nb-ben | by using a VPN in another country |
| 02:20.47 | ksk | whislock: I dont see a "22" in that paste :P |
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| 02:20.58 | whislock | ksk: No shit. |
| 02:21.02 | whislock | ksk: That's the PROBLEM. |
| 02:21.13 | whislock | -P INPUT DROP and no SSH rule means...? |
| 02:21.24 | whislock | SSH session initiation gets dropped. |
| 02:21.32 | whislock | He needs to add an SSH INPUT rule. |
| 02:22.55 | whislock | subcool: iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --dport 22 -m conntrack --ctstate NEW,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT |
| 02:23.15 | whislock | subcool: That should do the trick, but the problem is if Nord rewrites your iptables rules again, I have no idea what will happen. |
| 02:23.41 | subcool | THanks, i appreaciate it. Ill note it. |
| 02:23.52 | subcool | Thats so stupid. |
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| 02:25.01 | subcool | ok.. so- then. i have Iptables setup, but no firewall? |
| 02:25.10 | whislock | iptables == firewall. |
| 02:25.17 | subcool | i really gotta go bakc and take a class on this agian. |
| 02:25.21 | whislock | subcool: Nord basically set one up without your knowledge. |
| 02:25.34 | subcool | how nice... |
| 02:25.54 | subcool | ive atleast touched ufw. ive avoid iptables. |
| 02:26.10 | subcool | ill figure it out- thanks alot. |
| 02:26.14 | whislock | Sure thing. |
| 02:26.24 | subcool | where does Iptables reside? |
| 02:26.41 | whislock | In terms of...? |
| 02:26.50 | subcool | config files? rules? |
| 02:26.58 | subcool | something i can backup for that config |
| 02:27.00 | whislock | rules exist in-memory |
| 02:27.17 | subcool | what about that command we just ran? |
| 02:27.37 | whislock | You'll need to look into the iptables-persistent package. |
| 02:28.04 | whislock | Should give you commands like iptables-save and iptables-restore. |
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| 02:29.51 | hussar | the default bindings for tmux bothers me a lot |
| 02:29.53 | whislock | https://wiki.debian.org/iptables |
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| 02:43.10 | fx7 | Hi. May you help please? I have WD My Cloud device and as I use factory settings, I lost EXT4 partition. It means.. The old with all data was remowed and quick formated. So Data are not owerwritten. But the question is, how to renew EXT4 partition, or which tool to use to find lost dat. |
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| 02:44.04 | valdyn | fx7: just create the partition with fdisk |
| 02:44.51 | whislock | If it formatted it, it rewrite all of the superblocks. |
| 02:44.55 | whislock | Rewrote, rather. |
| 02:45.00 | fx7 | but there is already one |
| 02:45.14 | fx7 | was quick format |
| 02:45.39 | valdyn | fx7: have you tried fsck ? |
| 02:45.59 | whislock | What? |
| 02:46.02 | fx7 | no i did not |
| 02:46.06 | whislock | That's not going to help. |
| 02:46.23 | whislock | fsck is only going to refer to the contents of the current filesystem on disk, not the one that was there before the format. |
| 02:46.56 | fx7 | i have new ext4 partition on top of the old one with data |
| 02:47.08 | whislock | fx7: You're going to need something like 'testdisk,' that can search the entire disk from end to end for recoverable data. |
| 02:47.18 | whislock | fx7: This is going to be a long and slow process, unfortunately. |
| 02:48.05 | fx7 | i tried testdisk but it finds 4096 blocks of data because of many dif pertitions on wd disk |
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| 02:48.23 | whislock | fx7: That's your *only* option. |
| 02:48.45 | fx7 | it is like it cannot detrmine type of part seeking |
| 02:48.48 | cheapie | fx7: You want photorec, not plain testdisk. |
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| 02:49.05 | fx7 | ok |
| 02:49.09 | cheapie | They're somehow related but do different things. |
| 02:49.49 | valdyn | fx7: https://askubuntu.com/questions/873348/recover-ext4-file-system-after-quick-format |
| 02:49.51 | cheapie | Don't expect to be able to recover much, or any file names or anything, but it can probably get you *some* of your data back. |
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| 02:49.58 | fx7 | so if i use it from start of partition i googled it should find data, right? |
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| 02:50.33 | fx7 | all camera stuff, photoes, videos |
| 02:50.42 | valdyn | fx7: quick format may not have gotten all superblocks - so you may still be able to use fsck if you help it some |
| 02:50.44 | cheapie | Most likely it will find at least some of it. |
| 02:50.55 | cheapie | Try what valdyn said first though. |
| 02:51.07 | whislock | valdyn: Superblock locations are determined by the size of the media. |
| 02:51.12 | fx7 | yes, opening that |
| 02:51.15 | fx7 | thnx |
| 02:51.20 | whislock | valdyn: If you format it twice, it will write superblocks to the same locations, both times. |
| 02:51.32 | cheapie | whislock: Not if the second format wasn't ext*. |
| 02:51.44 | whislock | It's a WD appliance. |
| 02:52.01 | whislock | All he did was factory reset through their interface. It's the same filesystem both times. |
| 02:52.01 | cheapie | It sounds like their problem is some "smart" device overwrote it with something else, presumably NTFS. |
| 02:52.12 | fx7 | it made ext4 on the same place, but emty |
| 02:52.33 | cheapie | Hmm, that might not work so well then. |
| 02:52.39 | fx7 | i looked in gpart |
| 02:52.50 | cheapie | At any rate... you've learned your lesson now about backups, right? :) |
| 02:52.52 | whislock | cheapie: Yeah, the WD My Cloud uses ext4 internally. |
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| 02:53.04 | fx7 | same start sector and the end |
| 02:53.44 | fx7 | cheapie: yes, be sure of that.. |
| 02:55.03 | fx7 | thnx guys |
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| 02:56.31 | nyov | first though, a dd backup or such; then you can play around with the disk as many times as wanted |
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| 02:58.02 | fx7 | ok, i will play later prepared ;) the link above looks usefull |
| 02:58.29 | fx7 | thnx to all once again |
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| 03:01.35 | nyov | fx7: I would also visit any ext* FS developer channels, they probably know best how metadata can be recovered, if any, without superblocks |
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| 03:08.20 | CanadaAboveAll | CANADA WILL RULE ABOVE ALL! LONG LIVE CANADA! |
| 03:08.26 | CanadaAboveAll | CANADA! |
| 03:08.40 | dvs | I blame you! |
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| 03:09.05 | CanadaAboveAll | for what? |
| 03:09.07 | CanadaAboveAll | being awesome? |
| 03:09.32 | dvs | I dunno. Trey and Matt blame you. |
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| 03:09.48 | jnash | Hello |
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| 03:10.52 | CanadaAboveAll | CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! CANADA! |
| 03:10.56 | CanadaAboveAll | oh hi glguy |
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| 03:11.06 | CanadaAboveAll | have you come to watch canada take over the universe? |
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| 03:19.53 | annadane | s/universal operating system/operating system belonging to canada |
| 03:20.31 | dvs | oh noes! |
| 03:23.19 | joepublic | I was wondering earlier why anyone would want to settle the "consolation prize" freezeland, but then observed that the population centers are quite properly in the southern part of same, so that makes a little more sense I guess. |
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| 03:28.12 | LaurentDumont | It's still stupid cold :) - Quebec can be a harsh place during Winter. |
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| 03:31.51 | joepublic | Having consulted a globe, I see that it does appear that Canada is above all. |
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| 03:38.17 | nyov | that depends where "up" is on your globe |
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| 07:35.50 | Lope | is it possible to get my PC to shutdown when my UPS battery is low, without getting a PhD in nut? |
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| 07:36.25 | Lope | I bought a UPS with the brand kstar, which claims linux support. |
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| 07:36.52 | Lope | my PC gets /dev/hidraw0 when the UPS is connected. |
| 07:37.07 | Lope | Doesn't seem like the most reliable thing to rely on that number, but okay. |
| 07:37.35 | Lope | My UPS's lsusb description says: ID 0001:0000 Fry's Electronics |
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| 07:43.32 | jm_ | Lope: tried using nut-scanner -h |
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| 07:44.00 | jm_ | without -h |
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| 07:44.24 | Lope | jm_, thanks buddy, I don't have nut-scanner |
| 07:44.36 | Lope | nor nut-scanner. and apt-cache search nut | grep scan yields nothing |
| 07:44.41 | Lope | I've got contrib non-free enabled |
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| 07:46.12 | jm_ | ahh crap it's only available in sid version |
| 07:46.24 | jm_ | ,check-backports nut-server |
| 07:47.08 | Lope | okay sure |
| 07:47.08 | jm_ | looks trivial to backport though |
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| 07:47.56 | Lope | jm_, is there an apt repo to run the bleeding edge nut? |
| 07:48.23 | jm_ | Lope: unstable has the newest stuff, but I wouldn't recommend that to you |
| 07:49.21 | jm_ | I would try this with nut-server package: |
| 07:49.23 | jm_ | !ssb |
| 07:49.23 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
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| 07:52.48 | nvz | Lope: in re: rely on that number, this is what udev is for.. |
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| 07:53.20 | nvz | Lope: match the device based on model/serial number or such criteria, symlink it to /dev/ups or something custom |
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| 07:55.30 | nvz | ,checkbackport nut-server |
| 07:55.31 | judd | Backporting package nut-server in sid→buster/amd64: all build-dependencies satisfied using buster. |
| 07:55.48 | nvz | ,v nut-server |
| 07:55.49 | judd | Package: nut-server on amd64 -- jessie: 2.7.2-4; stretch: 2.7.4-5; buster: 2.7.4-8; sid: 2.7.4-10+b1 |
| 07:56.05 | nvz | ,file nut-scanner |
| 07:56.12 | judd | No packages in buster/amd64 were found with that file. |
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| 07:56.20 | nvz | ,file nut-scanner --release sid |
| 07:56.26 | judd | Search for nut-scanner in sid/amd64: nut-server: bin/nut-scanner |
| 07:56.43 | nvz | o.O |
| 07:57.15 | Haohmaru | if i've installed 32bit debian10 (i don't drink, but i must have been drunk or something), and i haven't done severly naughty things with it.. like.. the most eggzotic thing i've done is installed a few programs from backports.. synaptic doesn't show any "obsoleted" packages ... is it a bad idea to try to "crossgrade" it to 64bit? |
| 07:57.30 | Haohmaru | ..or can things still "break" |
| 07:57.47 | nvz | heh |
| 07:58.29 | Haohmaru | i got customizations on it that i don't wanna redo again, otherwise i'd just install over it |
| 07:58.48 | Lope | nvz, thanks bud, I've gotta sort out internet then will be back to try get NUT working. |
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| 07:59.09 | Lope | But in the mean time I'll mention, I came up with this for the ups.conf |
| 07:59.11 | Lope | http://codepad.org/BiX6n2fV |
| 07:59.19 | Lope | I don't know if it's right etc. |
| 08:00.02 | nvz | idk what a ups.conf even is so.. |
| 08:00.14 | Lope | I also got this error trying to start the nut-monitor service: "Fatal error: insufficient power configured!" |
| 08:00.32 | Lope | oh, I suppose I should have told jm_ instead :) |
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| 08:01.07 | Lope | nvz, so did you find nut-scanner in the buster backports? |
| 08:01.12 | nvz | Haohmaru: attempting to convert a i386 install to amd64 is going to be a VERY difficult thing to do.. and won't even be remotely possible if your kernel is 32bit |
| 08:01.15 | Lope | I'll try enable it later. |
| 08:02.14 | nvz | Lope: no, its not backported.. what I didnt get is why buster has 2.7.4-8 and sid has 2.7.4-10 which suggests both are upstream 2.7.4 and one has nut-scanner and the other doesnt |
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| 08:02.28 | nvz | Lope: all build deps are satisfied for an ssb though |
| 08:03.11 | Haohmaru | nvz yeah, that's what everyone says so far.. but there is some script here: https://wiki.debian.org/CrossGrading so i was thinking maybe if my "synaptic situation" is not uber crazy it could work |
| 08:03.20 | nvz | Haohmaru: its far easier to just gather up your custom configurations |
| 08:03.25 | Haohmaru | unless there are things i'm not aware about |
| 08:03.39 | Haohmaru | aww :/ |
| 08:04.44 | nvz | I can't believe someone even wrote that |
| 08:04.53 | Haohmaru | the page? |
| 08:04.55 | nvz | yes |
| 08:05.09 | nvz | why the hell would anyone go through that trouble |
| 08:05.33 | nvz | it'd be easier to just debootstrap amd64 or something |
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| 08:06.16 | nvz | Haohmaru: idk why I hear pepole say crap like that all the time.. it makes no sense |
| 08:06.27 | nvz | you only have access to one thing.. your homedir |
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| 08:06.31 | Haohmaru | i don't know what that means ^ |
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| 08:06.50 | nvz | anything you'd gone and used root permissions to modify like /etc/whatever.. you'd have to f'n remember doing it |
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| 08:07.02 | nvz | otherwise EVERYTHING you changed is in your homedir |
| 08:07.15 | nvz | so thats the only thing you need to save or simply not format |
| 08:07.32 | nvz | that and your list of installed packages |
| 08:08.28 | nvz | I am a rather advanced user.. and even I only have a few scripts in /usr/local/bin/ and maybe 6 at most files in /etc/ I've edited |
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| 08:08.48 | nvz | everything else that I've customized is in my homedir |
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| 08:09.38 | Lope | nvz, so should I build it from source? |
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| 08:10.33 | nvz | people act like there are just dark crevices like HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\CLSID\{645FF040-5081-101B-9F08-00AA002F954E} where they renamed their Recycle Bin, in linux.. |
| 08:10.35 | Haohmaru | i don't know.. all i know is that a pile of the default settings on a debian are not very noice for me, like mouse config, bitmap fonts (they banned by default), a few others i forgot.. then i have also done some fancy file associations, i don't remember if all of these things are in /etc/ |
| 08:10.37 | nvz | thats not the case.. |
| 08:11.18 | Haohmaru | my /home/ is in a separate partition |
| 08:11.55 | nvz | Haohmaru: so copy all 10 megabytes of /etc to a 2 megabyte tar and stick it on that partition too :P |
| 08:12.05 | nvz | then reinstall and don't format that partition |
| 08:12.27 | nvz | add to that a list of installed packages.. |
| 08:12.34 | Haohmaru | you mean like.. to copy/paste the whole /etc afterwards? |
| 08:12.42 | Haohmaru | wouldn't that mess up a lot of things then? |
| 08:12.46 | nvz | more like tar/untar but yeah.. |
| 08:12.58 | nvz | how the hell could it mess anything up? |
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| 08:13.06 | Haohmaru | i don't know |
| 08:13.14 | Haohmaru | apt stuff is in /etc |
| 08:13.14 | apt | ACTION grab's is in /etc, fills them up with stuffing, and sticks them in the oven |
| 08:13.24 | nvz | sure.. the sources.list |
| 08:13.40 | Haohmaru | i know i shouldn't be naughty with apt and its files |
| 08:13.51 | Haohmaru | that's why i mainly use synaptic |
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| 08:14.02 | nvz | those kinds of files are in /var/ not /etc |
| 08:14.09 | Haohmaru | hm |
| 08:14.15 | nvz | and those files in /var and everywhere else will be reinstalled from the mirrors |
| 08:14.16 | Haohmaru | my life has been a lie |
| 08:14.41 | nvz | apt's naughty bits as you seem to think of them are in /var/cache/apt/ |
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| 08:16.33 | Haohmaru | okay.. so copying the whole /etc from my 32bit installation and then pasting it onto a 64bit installation shouldn't cause a mess? |
| 08:16.57 | Haohmaru | perhaps i need to clear /etc before pasting ;P~ |
| 08:17.11 | nvz | I not long ago moved my father to a completely different system... simple.. you dpkg --get-selections or such dump that to a file.. thats all the packages that are installed.. you tar up /etc/, you backup /home/ then you go install debian.. just a base even .. then migrate /home to new install, set all the package selections, install all same packages, untar /etc/ its the same damn system |
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| 08:18.01 | nvz | the /etc/ is for global configuration, config files aren't platform specific |
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| 08:18.14 | NetTerminalGene | ,v firefox-esr |
| 08:18.15 | judd | Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; stretch: 60.7.1esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 60.9.0esr-1~deb9u1; jessie-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb9u2; buster: 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 68.2.0esr-1+b1; sid: 68.3.0esr-1 |
| 08:18.24 | Haohmaru | okay |
| 08:18.37 | Haohmaru | what do you mean with "migrate /home" ? |
| 08:19.16 | nvz | Haohmaru: not required in your case you're staying on the same system.. in your case you just have to make sure you say "keep existing data" and don't format that partition |
| 08:19.32 | nvz | Haohmaru: you can backup to be safe if you have some means of doing so.. but its not really necessary |
| 08:20.04 | Haohmaru | i already zipped up muh projects and tossed them to another place |
| 08:20.37 | Haohmaru | i've reinstalled debian before while keeping the /home partition, so i know that trick |
| 08:20.59 | Lope | nvz, should I build nut from source? |
| 08:21.25 | nvz | Lope: a simple sid backport is way simpler than that |
| 08:21.33 | nvz | Lope: apt does it all for you |
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| 08:21.43 | nvz | !ssb |
| 08:21.43 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
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| 08:22.59 | nvz | Lope: as long as you have the backports enabled and a deb-src line for sid and the apt cache is updated, you need only apt build-dep nut-server and apt -b source nut-server then dpkg -i nut-server.deb |
| 08:23.09 | Lope | nvz does that mean when there are updates it will recompile the new versions? |
| 08:23.17 | nvz | Lope: nope |
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| 08:23.42 | Lope | nvz, well then it seems a lot more complicated than just building nut from source instead of frankensteining my sources.list? |
| 08:23.47 | nvz | Lope: you'd have to apt -b source nut-server and dpkg -i nut-server again |
| 08:24.23 | Haohmaru | no idea how i've installed 32bit last time, all i remember was that the debian was on btrfs, and then the harddisk broke, and i evacuated it to ext4 (installed debian on ext4, then iirc i rsync'ed everything from the dying hdd) .. i guess i've put the wrong netinst iso and didn't notice it |
| 08:24.29 | nvz | Lope: its not really frankensteining.. a deb-src line is only for source packages, backports only pulls things when you explicitly say -t buster-backports.. |
| 08:24.55 | Haohmaru | or maybe it was 32bit originally |
| 08:24.58 | nvz | Lope: and doing it with apt, you need not know anything about the build system, it automatically fetches the dependencies, and automatically rebuilds the deb |
| 08:25.27 | nvz | Lope: and in this case you don't even need to enable backports |
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| 08:26.22 | Lope | Oh I see |
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| 08:27.18 | nvz | Lope: all you're doing with an ssb is building a sid package against stable dependencies |
| 08:27.26 | nvz | and apt does all the hard work |
| 08:28.15 | Lope | nvz, okay, sounds good. Should I remove nut before I do this? |
| 08:29.02 | nvz | Lope: should be no need.. when you install the deb that apt -b source nut-server creates, it will isntall over top of it.. cause its going to be a higher version number |
| 08:29.07 | nvz | dpkg will see it as an upgrade |
| 08:29.07 | dpkg | bugger all, i dunno, nvz |
| 08:29.13 | nvz | dpkg: shaddup |
| 08:29.13 | dpkg | No, I won't, you shaddup, you |
| 08:30.47 | Haohmaru | huehuehue |
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| 08:33.40 | MaxFrames | hello |
| 08:33.54 | nvz | Haohmaru: dpkg --get-selections > /home/packages.lst |
| 08:34.08 | MaxFrames | I am trying to copy text from nano running in putty terminal emulator to the clipboard, and paste it in windows, but I am unable |
| 08:34.11 | Haohmaru | i remember this command |
| 08:34.11 | nvz | Haohmaru: dpkg --set-selections < /home/packages.lst && apt install |
| 08:34.28 | Haohmaru | i mean, it smells familiar |
| 08:34.31 | nvz | Haohmaru: and I would imagine you know how to tar up /etc/ |
| 08:34.39 | MaxFrames | I select a multiple line text with ctrl+6 and then ctrl+k to cut it, but when I paste it, only the first line is pasted, dunno why |
| 08:34.44 | Haohmaru | uhm, i don't know how to tar |
| 08:34.50 | Haohmaru | i use .zip |
| 08:35.05 | nvz | !yinzersmite Haohmaru |
| 08:35.05 | dpkg | pooshes Haohmaru aht da winda an yells "chawt dahnere". |
| 08:35.20 | Lope | nvz thanks |
| 08:35.36 | Haohmaru | chawt dah-wat? |
| 08:35.38 | nvz | Haohmaru: tar cvf etc.tar /etc |
| 08:35.48 | Haohmaru | grabs onto teh curtains |
| 08:36.09 | Haohmaru | is zipping it not gonna work? |
| 08:36.12 | nvz | or perhaps tar cvf /home/etc.tar /etc |
| 08:36.32 | nvz | I doubt a zipfile will preserve the permissions |
| 08:36.39 | Haohmaru | hm |
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| 08:38.52 | nvz | tar cfpvz /home/etc.tar.gz /etc |
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| 08:39.26 | nvz | the pz is probably advisable.. heh |
| 08:39.39 | Haohmaru | tar cfpvzwtfomgyudodisnvz /home/etc.tar.gz /etc |
| 08:39.41 | nvz | though /etc/ is probably not more than 20mb so the z isn't too important |
| 08:40.17 | nvz | but the p is for preservation of owner and such.. which probably isnt real important either.. since pretty much all of it is gonna be owned by root :P |
| 08:40.34 | nvz | but the permissions may be varied |
| 08:40.37 | nvz | so.. |
| 08:40.52 | Haohmaru | i thought so too but who knows wut creepz in teh shady cornerz of /etc |
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| 08:41.43 | Haohmaru | i also thought the .zip would contain user permissions, but i haven't akchually checked that |
| 08:41.54 | nvz | Debian's filesystem is rather clearly defined. |
| 08:42.07 | nvz | even within /etc/ there is a structure |
| 08:42.16 | Haohmaru | i know.. if you RTFM |
| 08:42.25 | Haohmaru | but <aintnobodygottimefodat.gif> |
| 08:43.32 | nvz | I wonder why its always a gif.. not a .wav or .webm or a hashtag.. |
| 08:43.39 | Haohmaru | at least i learnt not to use "dd" for writing isos, but cp ... and then sync |
| 08:43.48 | nvz | irc memes are so odd :P |
| 08:43.50 | Haohmaru | i do also post wavs and sh*t |
| 08:44.00 | Haohmaru | u just haven't seen me in action |
| 08:44.17 | Haohmaru | i try to contain myself in here |
| 08:44.28 | nvz | well you may have misunderstood that |
| 08:44.42 | Haohmaru | it's poshiburu |
| 08:44.47 | nvz | debian's ISOs are special |
| 08:44.52 | nvz | they're hybrid ISOs |
| 08:45.06 | Haohmaru | no i was using dumb dd arguments |
| 08:45.07 | nvz | and there is nothing really wrong with using dd, its just not required |
| 08:45.31 | Haohmaru | had conv=sync thinking it does.. what it turns out it doesn't do |
| 08:45.32 | nvz | what works for debian's hybrid ISOs will not necessarily work for just any ISO |
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| 08:46.20 | nvz | the underlying copying of data.. thats all just modern kernel gnu utils thing.. |
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| 08:46.42 | nvz | but the ISO actually booting on a media is specific to debian's hybrid ISO |
| 08:46.57 | Haohmaru | cp has less arguments, that's gud, the only thing i miss is some kind of feedback |
| 08:47.10 | Haohmaru | like.. status, indication that it hasn't stopped or crashed |
| 08:47.12 | Haohmaru | ;P~ |
| 08:47.21 | Haohmaru | progress.. |
| 08:47.33 | Haohmaru | but for smol netinst it's not a big deal |
| 08:47.39 | nvz | zenity --progress :P |
| 08:47.48 | nvz | I wrote a tool for this you know.. |
| 08:47.54 | Haohmaru | u wot |
| 08:48.03 | Haohmaru | does it mine bitcoinz? ;P~ |
| 08:48.35 | Haohmaru | i already copied teh iso to ze flash stick |
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| 08:48.51 | nvz | http://iamcowhearme.mooo.com/iso |
| 08:49.07 | nvz | its a bash script using zenity.. a simple iso writer.. |
| 08:49.22 | nvz | fancy way of doing cp debian.iso /dev/sdc kinda deal |
| 08:49.26 | nvz | with visuals |
| 08:49.27 | Regor | i am using default vim-tiny package in debian 10... Does it support spell check ? |
| 08:49.42 | MaxFrames | is it normal on debian 10 that it responds to ping even after installing ufw and setting the default block rule? I did not explicitly create a rule to allow ping reply |
| 08:50.01 | nvz | Regor: thats kind of a silly question.. you're using it.. I'm not.. and you're asking me. :P |
| 08:50.01 | Regor | what packages do i need to enable it? |
| 08:50.01 | MaxFrames | sorry echo request I mean. default is DROP incoming and ALLOW outgoing |
| 08:50.06 | Haohmaru | nvz the point is, there should be some built-in thing for this in debian, IMO |
| 08:50.26 | Haohmaru | if i gotta install sh*t just to get a progress bar then meh |
| 08:50.39 | Haohmaru | unless it's a huge ISO, then i would |
| 08:51.22 | nvz | Haohmaru: my solution is 32 lines of bash code :P |
| 08:51.22 | tarzeau | dd has an option called status=progress |
| 08:51.47 | Haohmaru | tarzeau i know, that's what i used |
| 08:52.03 | Haohmaru | anyway, can i tar /etc while the system is akchually running? |
| 08:52.39 | tarzeau | Haohmaru: yes absolutely, not sure about systemd/* though |
| 08:52.53 | Haohmaru | systemd is naughty |
| 08:52.59 | nvz | you're probably not ever gonna touch that tarball anyhow |
| 08:53.02 | tarzeau | if you want a complete system config file backup you ought to not forget /var/spool/cron though |
| 08:53.07 | nvz | cause there probably wont be anything in it you need |
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| 08:53.27 | Haohmaru | uh, i certainly need muh mouse config, for starters |
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| 08:53.40 | tarzeau | nvz: before puppet/ansible, i used /etc backups often: http://aiei.ch/linux/ibackup/ |
| 08:53.44 | Haohmaru | i can't stand the default mouse acceleration, and there is no GUI to change it |
| 08:54.09 | jm_ | Regor: I was hoping vim --version would show something, but I don't see it with regular vim package |
| 08:54.10 | tarzeau | Haohmaru: is that not a user setting? with xset? not in /etc but $HOME? |
| 08:54.17 | Haohmaru | then i also want my bitmap fonts all enabled |
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| 08:54.33 | nvz | tarzeau: could be a udev rule, an xorg.conf.. who knows |
| 08:54.41 | Haohmaru | tarzeau no, iirc it involved creating configs in xorg |
| 08:54.52 | Haohmaru | with speshul text and sh*t |
| 08:54.55 | Haohmaru | same for the monitor |
| 08:54.58 | nvz | wrote a tool for this too :P |
| 08:55.01 | Haohmaru | but in a different file |
| 08:55.05 | nvz | !tkpoint |
| 08:55.05 | dpkg | tkpoint is a python/tkinter tool for real-time adjustment of trackpoint settings on linux. http://iamcowhearme.mooo.com/tkpoint |
| 08:55.21 | nvz | for my trackpoint anyhow.. not just in general for mice |
| 08:55.37 | Haohmaru | i use a normal 3 butten mouse |
| 08:55.44 | Haohmaru | but i don't like acceleration |
| 08:56.08 | nvz | but I was thinking of writing a more general tool that just is a regular settings wizard.. for navigating complexities of things like sysfs, udev, etc. |
| 08:56.15 | Haohmaru | the GUIs in the desktop for adjusting mouse settings no longer akchually work since debian9 |
| 08:56.35 | nvz | they work for my touchpad.. the stuff in MATE anyhow |
| 08:56.37 | BazookaTooth | what is this hooked on phonics bullshit? |
| 08:56.41 | Haohmaru | because something with the drivers changed and the GUIs adjust settings for the previous driver |
| 08:56.49 | Haohmaru | xinput is the current one or something like that |
| 08:56.49 | nvz | but I just use it to disable my touchpad |
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| 08:59.19 | Haohmaru | okay, tiem to boot ze netinst |
| 08:59.50 | Haohmaru | if my debian breaks, imma see u in court, nvz |
| 08:59.53 | Haohmaru | ;P~ |
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| 09:00.24 | Haohmaru | muh 15 lawyers r gonna suck teh blood out of u |
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| 09:06.38 | nvz | those sound like vampires |
| 09:06.53 | nvz | which would be more useful than lawyers.. cause I have several pints of blood.. |
| 09:07.30 | nvz | but trying to sue me on the other hand, all they'd get is practice |
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| 09:10.22 | Haohmaru | it woz a metaphore |
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| 09:11.03 | Haohmaru | during the installation, woz it the "Hostname" that you later see during the login screen? |
| 09:11.36 | Haohmaru | sorta as a computer name |
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| 09:12.37 | nvz | yes |
| 09:12.45 | nvz | its easily changed |
| 09:13.09 | Haohmaru | on this machine it's gonna be "Cadillac Dinozavroff" >:) |
| 09:13.23 | nvz | echo "newhostname" > /etc/hostname; hostname -F /etc/hostname |
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| 09:14.08 | nvz | and to avoid certain annoyances you may also want to change /etc/hosts so that 127.0.1.1 points to the correct hostname |
| 09:14.58 | nvz | a hostname can't contain spaces |
| 09:15.12 | Haohmaru | yeah it didn't let me have a space there |
| 09:15.28 | Haohmaru | ..the installation i mean |
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| 09:18.08 | MaxFrames | I need help with arpwatch.... I was able to make it work with exim4 following this: https://sources.debian.org/src/arpwatch/2.1a15-7/debian/etc/README/ |
| 09:18.52 | MaxFrames | now it no longer sends any email... exim4 log says it did not even try... all I did after I checked it was working, is changing the ip address of debian (same eth0 adapter) |
| 09:19.20 | MaxFrames | I am forcing triggering send mail by changing the ip address of a pc.... exim4 does not send any mail |
| 09:19.22 | inhetep | exit |
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| 09:20.48 | rabbitear_g | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bhJzXTf6KE |
| 09:20.56 | MaxFrames | the only mail it sent was the one when it detected that its own ip address had changed... this mail was sent and I can see it in exim4 mainlog... but after that, it did not send any other |
| 09:21.24 | MaxFrames | rabbitear_g: what is that supposed to mean? |
| 09:21.32 | jm_ | tried restarting exim after changing IP? |
| 09:21.50 | MaxFrames | jm_: yes, I actually rebooted the whole machine multiple times |
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| 09:22.48 | MaxFrames | ps -ex | grep arpwatch => arpwatch is running, so that is not an issue |
| 09:23.01 | metbsd | how do i edit sources |
| 09:23.04 | metbsd | in apt |
| 09:23.04 | rabbitear_g | nobody cares |
| 09:23.11 | metbsd | is there an editor to edit sources |
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| 09:23.22 | metbsd | repositories. |
| 09:23.25 | rabbitear_g | you'll be fine |
| 09:23.27 | jm_ | metbsd: it's a text file |
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| 09:24.54 | jm_ | MaxFrames: but exim still doesn't work? even if you use exim4 directly via exim4 -v? |
| 09:25.20 | MaxFrames | exim is listening but does not receive any mail send requests from arpwatch |
| 09:27.11 | metbsd | but what about sources.list.d |
| 09:27.15 | metbsd | that's not a file |
| 09:27.28 | jm_ | that's a dir that can contain sources.list files |
| 09:27.57 | jm_ | MaxFrames: maybe try arpwatch -d to see if it can show more info |
| 09:28.24 | metbsd | so i just delete it in sources.list.d? |
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| 09:29.29 | jm_ | what are you trying to achieve with apt's sources entries? |
| 09:29.47 | metbsd | i want to delete a repositories |
| 09:29.51 | MaxFrames | arpwatch -d => no echo |
| 09:30.06 | metbsd | uninstall everything about this repository |
| 09:31.19 | MaxFrames | "/var/lib/arpwatch/eth0.dat" (the file that is supposed to keep a database of mac/ip pairs) does not have any entry for my recent ip changes. so arpwatch is not updating this file anymore |
| 09:31.41 | jm_ | well if you only want apt to prevent installing stuff from that repository, then yeah, if it's a file in sources.list.d, you just delete the file, otherwise if it's /etc/apt/sources.list edit it and remove the lines for it |
| 09:31.56 | jm_ | if you want to uninstall packages from that repository, then this shall help: |
| 09:32.01 | jm_ | !which repo |
| 09:32.01 | dpkg | To see what repository a package may have come from, try https://www.palfrader.org/gitweb/?p=tools/weaselutils.git;a=blob_plain;f=apt-listrepository or use dpkg -l | awk '/^.i/ {print $2}' | xargs apt-cache policy | awk '/^[a-z0-9.-]+:/ {pkg=$1}; /\*\*\*/ {OFS="\t"; ver=$2; getline; print pkg,ver,$2,$3}', or ask me about <obsolete>, or http://people.debian.org/~dannf/apt-inventory, or <bdo list>, or <dmm list> |
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| 09:33.24 | MaxFrames | ps -ef says that arpwatch is running like this: " /usr/sbin/arpwatch -u arpwatch -i eth0 -f eth0.dat -N -p -m myemailaddress@foo.com -F" |
| 09:34.06 | MaxFrames | locate says that the only eth0.dat is in /var/lib/arpwatch, but it is not being updated |
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| 09:38.52 | MaxFrames | -p is undocumented; -D is undocumented |
| 09:38.56 | MaxFrames | -F |
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| 09:41.31 | MaxFrames | if I stop arpwatch and then manually give the same command "usr/sbin/arpwatch -u arpwatch -i eth0 -f eth0.dat -N -p -m myemailaddress@foo.com -F" it does not accept it, like the syntax is wrong |
| 09:41.58 | jelly | MaxFrames: what's the actual error you get doing it manually |
| 09:42.18 | MaxFrames | it just throws the "usage:" text |
| 09:42.29 | MaxFrames | usage: arpwatch [-dN] [-f datafile] [-F "filter" ][-i interface] [-n net[/width]] [-r file] [-s sendmail_path] [-p] [-a] [-m addr] [-u username] [-Q] [-z ignorenet/ignoremask] |
| 09:43.33 | MaxFrames | the problem is "-F" |
| 09:44.04 | MaxFrames | if I omit it, there is no error... but ps -ex says that arpwatch is not running :X |
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| 09:44.21 | Regor | jm_ yeah i checked it.its limited ..so i would install complete package .https://paste.debian.net/1120324/ |
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| 09:46.20 | jm_ | Regor: even the full version doesn't mention anything like "spell" there |
| 09:46.38 | Regor | yeahh... |
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| 09:52.28 | MaxFrames | ok, I've stopped arpwatch, renamed eth0.dat to eth0.nope.dat, then restarted arpwatch |
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| 09:52.54 | MaxFrames | result: arpwatch is not running, eth0.dat was not recreated |
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| 09:53.20 | neoclust | Hello, a friend have a pb with his debian. His syslog is flooded by [ 5394.854366] hid-sensor-hub 001F:8087:0AC2.0003: hid_field_extract() called with n (192) > 32! (kworker/1:1) |
| 09:53.52 | neoclust | he tried to add :msg, contains, "hid-sensor-hub 001F:8087:0AC2" ~ in /etc/rsyslog.d/10-hidesensor.conf but still the same issue |
| 09:54.50 | neoclust | does someone has an idea ? |
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| 09:55.24 | Tekmans_ | hello i'm the one who is flooded by "hid-sensor-hub 001F:8087:0AC2" |
| 09:55.53 | Tekmans_ | my /etc/rsyslog.d/10-hidesensor.conf is not working |
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| 09:56.50 | Tekmans_ | and it slows my computer.. to the point i can't have a correct access to internet |
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| 09:57.17 | Tekmans_ | is there something to do ? is it a bug? |
| 09:58.06 | ratrace | Tekmans_: "not working"? can you pastebin it? along with an example log line that the config should take care of |
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| 09:58.36 | Tekmans_ | the flood message |
| 09:58.38 | Tekmans_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:58.49 | Tekmans_ | the conf file in used |
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| 09:59.11 | Tekmans_ | :msg, contains, "hid-sensor-hub 001F:8087:0AC2" ~ |
| 09:59.18 | Tekmans_ | in /etc/rsyslog.d/10-hidesensor.conf |
| 10:00.44 | ratrace | Tekmans_: that's not valid, where's the target file |
| 10:01.07 | ratrace | there must be one more line after that "contains" filter |
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| 10:01.57 | Tekmans_ | hum.. strange .d/file.conf are imported before global conf no ? |
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| 10:03.18 | ratrace | Tekmans_: also don't forget that if you have persistent journal, that's also gonna hammer the disk |
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| 10:06.30 | MaxFrames | now I have rebooted. /var/lib/arpwatch/eth0.dat was automatically created. arpwatch is running. eth0.dat is empty and is not being updated when I change ip address. |
| 10:06.45 | MaxFrames | all this happened just because I've change the ip address of the arpwatch machine |
| 10:07.36 | Haohmaru | well, wuddayaknow.. "the attempt to mount a file system with type ext4 in SCSI2 partition #2 at / failed" <- this in the debian installation |
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| 10:07.52 | Haohmaru | eyeballz nvz |
| 10:08.07 | Haohmaru | i've never seen this kind of thing before |
| 10:08.56 | Haohmaru | what i did was, in the partitioning step, i formatted the / partition, set it to be used as ext4, and mounted as / ... then i set the existing /home partition to be mounted as /home, and that's all |
| 10:08.57 | Tekmans_ | ratrace, thx i'll check for the target file |
| 10:09.37 | Haohmaru | and now it says "you may resume partitioning" |
| 10:10.30 | ratrace | Tekmans_: there's nothing to check, you specify it immediately after the filter line... & ~ that's why I asked to pastebin the file so we can see the full stanza |
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| 10:11.06 | MaxFrames | journalctl | grep arpwatch => it is running, listening on eth0, and there are even three "new station" entries, so it is working somehow, but not writing anything to the .dat file and not sending mail |
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| 10:14.53 | MaxFrames | I will have to throw away 10 days of work because of this silly arpwatch situation... it only detects changes in its own subnet range it seems... but arp should listen at layer 2... I change my laptop ip address to a random ip and arpwatch does not detect it... they are in the same lan... makes no sense |
| 10:15.50 | MaxFrames | upon starting it only detected its own ip address and the gateway's, and btw did not write them to eth0.dat, and now it won't do anything else |
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| 10:17.53 | Haohmaru | if i continue partitioning (everything appears right) and just click finish partitioning, it says "No partition table changes and no creation of file systems have been planned. if you plan on using already created file system, be aware that existing files may prevent the successiful installation of the base system" |
| 10:18.31 | Haohmaru | shall i shrug and continue with the installation? |
| 10:18.37 | MaxFrames | gosh... eth0.dat was finally updated and mail sent... it looks like this latest arpwatch does not react in realtime... as opposed to the old one? |
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| 10:23.24 | bestwin | Hi. How I can use "usb smart protection" on lenovo thinstation in Debian? |
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| 10:24.50 | ratrace | bestwin: quick googling suggests that has nothing to do with the OS |
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| 10:36.14 | coding_horribly | Hi all, noob networking fail here. I can't connect to the internet, and have tried everything I can think of. Currently `ip route` comes up blank, and I'm not sure what to do next. Anyone want to try and work me through this? |
| 10:37.23 | coding_horribly | ip a s shows a connection (DOWN), but ifup tells me it's already configured. |
| 10:37.31 | jm_ | Haohmaru: check other tty-s if there are any details about the issue |
| 10:38.59 | jm_ | coding_horribly: you will have to describe the basics first, what kind of connections, what have you configured so far etc. |
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| 10:40.22 | coding_horribly | jm_: Ethernet connection, it worked out of the box, but then I messed it up by accident because I thought it needed a static connection when it didn't, |
| 10:40.47 | coding_horribly | after that I'm pretty sure I got it back up by adding a line into /etc/network/interfaces, |
| 10:40.55 | coding_horribly | needed to restart today, and no internet. |
| 10:41.21 | coding_horribly | I've been messing around with /etc/network/interfaces and NetworkManager, so I may have managed to make things worse. |
| 10:41.35 | coding_horribly | (Hard for me to retrace everything I've tried so far, though.) |
| 10:42.08 | jm_ | ok, first of all, decide which you want to use, NM or ifupdown |
| 10:42.37 | coding_horribly | I'd rather NM |
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| 10:43.48 | hesco | I'm having troubles writing an /etc/network/interfaces which survives a service networking restart without a trip to the datacenter and manual intervention to flush an interface. Can anyone please take a look at this and advise? Your help is appreciated. Thanks. |
| 10:43.50 | hesco | https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20 |
| 10:44.33 | jm_ | coding_horribly: sorry, NM is not my thing :) |
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| 10:45.08 | coding_horribly | I could do ifupdown then. I'd really like my internet back. |
| 10:45.36 | hesco | coding_horribly: is your box local or remote? |
| 10:46.11 | coding_horribly | local |
| 10:46.26 | hesco | that makes things easier. |
| 10:46.38 | hesco | how many interfaces and IPs do you need to manage? |
| 10:47.07 | coding_horribly | I have one router, and my desktop isn't connecting |
| 10:47.21 | coding_horribly | So I'm assuming that's one. |
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| 10:48.02 | hesco | coding_horribly: so you are concerned with internet connectivity from your desktop, through your router to the world. Is that right? |
| 10:48.13 | coding_horribly | Yes. |
| 10:48.38 | hesco | is your router running dhcp? or are you assigning your desktop a static IP? |
| 10:49.07 | coding_horribly | I'd like to be dhcp. I got into this mess by thinking I needed static, but I'm pretty sure it's running dhcp now. |
| 10:49.17 | MaxFrames | bah. arpwatch in debian is one of the most poorly documented, badly implemented pieces of crap :( |
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| 10:50.30 | hesco | coding_horribly: mv your /etc/network/interfaces aside, please and recreate it based on the guidance at this link. https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfiguration#Using_DHCP_to_automatically_configure_the_interface |
| 10:50.35 | bestwin | ratrace: Ok. Maybe you known how I can get value from BIOS? |
| 10:51.27 | coding_horribly | hesco: Okay, I'm going to work on this, thanks a bunch! |
| 10:52.03 | hesco | coding_horribly: once you have done that, use service networking restart and see if that gets you to the promised land. |
| 10:52.55 | hesco | most routers will record your desktop's nic'smac address in its routing table and assign you a static private IP on the subnet it manages. |
| 10:52.56 | *** join/#debian Marbug (~Marbug@d515361F5.access.telenet.be) |
| 10:53.33 | ratrace | bestwin: nope, sorry. also keep in mind that's a bit offtopic here. |
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| 10:55.29 | hesco | bestwin, as root, plenty of hardware information is accessible with use of dmedecode, but generally for BIOS documentation you need to review what your hardware manufacturer provides. |
| 10:57.29 | hesco | Just in case my own networking issue got lost in my back and forth with coding_horribly discussing his connectivity issues, I'm seeking guidance on how to resolve issue documented here: |
| 10:57.34 | hesco | https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20 |
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| 11:01.33 | ratrace | hesco: first of all, you only need "address" (in CIDR notation) and "gateway" in the inet static stanza. the rest is calculated from the CIDR and deprecated. second, you can't have two "gateway" entries. |
| 11:01.36 | *** join/#debian ahalo (~fx@a95-92-110-45.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 11:02.39 | ratrace | hesco: then to add multiple IPs, you just have multiple inet static stanzas, as described here (iproute2 method) :: https://wiki.debian.org/NetworkConfiguration#Multiple_IP_addresses_on_one_Interface |
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| 11:07.04 | hesco | thanks ratrace. testing that now |
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| 11:17.30 | Haohmaru | jm_ i see some warning from FBDEV about xf86SetGamma() i guess that's a display thing tho |
| 11:18.21 | Haohmaru | okay, on ctrl+alt+F4 i see moar things |
| 11:20.34 | *** join/#debian Lope (~lope@197.185.113.166) |
| 11:21.41 | Haohmaru | when i retry the operation (so as to get to the "failed to mount /" i see 3 things printed behind the scenes: |
| 11:23.01 | Haohmaru | "kernel: [ some.numbers ] intel_rng: FWH not detected" "net/hw-detect.hotplug: Detected hotpluggable network interface enp2s4 / lo" |
| 11:24.13 | *** join/#debian hesco (~hesco@209.195.11.75) |
| 11:24.13 | hesco | ratrace: may I ask you please to take another look at this? https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20 |
| 11:24.33 | jm_ | <those message look harmless |
| 11:25.03 | Haohmaru | the last two smell like ethernet stuff |
| 11:25.18 | jm_ | yeah it's telling you it detected a NIC |
| 11:25.29 | *** join/#debian mkowalski (mkowalskim@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-tfkdyjpwtwjrsaaw) |
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| 11:25.35 | hesco | a my `systemctl restart networking.service` still fails to bring up the second IP on that device |
| 11:25.48 | *** join/#debian Guest25 (~NetTermin@unaffiliated/dontknow) |
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| 11:26.38 | ratrace | hesco: you still have two gateways |
| 11:27.07 | ratrace | hesco: a "gateway" is just an IP where all packets with no explicit routing are sent, and thus there can be only one. |
| 11:27.43 | ratrace | technically you can have more than one, but not with "gateway" option, you'd need to do some manual routing |
| 11:29.44 | Haohmaru | jm_ on that screen, somewhere above (earlier in the installation) i see some stuff like "partman: No matching physical volumes found" "partman: " Reading all physical volumes. this may take a while..." "kernel [ some.numbers ] perf: interrupt took too long ( .. > .. ), lowering kernel.perf_event_max_sample_rate to ..." |
| 11:30.31 | tarzeau | why can't i run qemu without vnc anymore? |
| 11:30.37 | tarzeau | and -display sdl is not supported??? |
| 11:31.04 | jm_ | Haohmaru: [some.numbers] is a timestamp, dmesg -T will give you human readable times - try to remember last line in dmesg output, repeat the issue, see if anything pops up after remembered line |
| 11:31.25 | nyov | tarzeau: just remove the -display sdl. you can still have a display |
| 11:31.27 | Haohmaru | that's what i did |
| 11:31.38 | tarzeau | nyov: i'm not getting a display i get some freaking vnc shit |
| 11:31.43 | Haohmaru | when it says it can't mount /, i see only 3 new lines printed |
| 11:31.45 | tarzeau | VNC server running on ::1:5900 |
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| 11:32.38 | Haohmaru | so.. what to do now? step back before the partitioning and then step into it again? i doubt that's gonna make any difference but should be easy to try |
| 11:32.53 | nyov | tarzeau: try -display gtk then, perhaps |
| 11:34.14 | Haohmaru | as a side note: it's a little funny how the partition manager has "Done setting up the partitions, write changes to disk" when before that, when you click on "erase data on this partition" - it simply erases it immediately |
| 11:34.43 | Haohmaru | luckily i think i clicked on the right one ;P~ |
| 11:34.45 | nyov | tarzeau: I have -vga std in there, maybe that's needed |
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| 11:36.49 | tarzeau | nyov: sorry all is fine it works :) |
| 11:37.07 | tarzeau | i was on the wrong host (focal shit, and theirs is broken/outdated) |
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| 11:37.43 | Haohmaru | okay i stepped back, then forward, clicked around in the partition manager, "Done setting up partitions" and now it told me it's gonna format the / partition to ext4 |
| 11:37.59 | Haohmaru | this smells right.. let's see |
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| 11:39.15 | jm_ | just as long as it has / on the right one |
| 11:39.47 | Haohmaru | hm, maybe what i've done before that was.. the / partition by default was probably "do not use this partition" and then i've "erase data on this partition" and it filled with zeros, then i've changed it to ext4 and set it to mount as /, but i guess this didn't "format" it to ext4 |
| 11:40.27 | Haohmaru | does this sound plausible? |
| 11:41.04 | Haohmaru | seriously, i'm kinda worried that you are allowed to erase stuff before selecting "done setting up partitions, write changes to disk" |
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| 11:41.20 | hesco | ratrace: thanks. I had to `ip addr flush dev eno3` to get a clean restart, but now it seems to be working to attach the IPs to the interface. But I seem unable to traceroute the 2d IP, or to ping it, or ssh into it, obviously. |
| 11:41.20 | *** join/#debian sn5aY (~sn5aY@62.102.148.154) |
| 11:41.21 | Haohmaru | but oh well, that's "manual partitioning" |
| 11:41.23 | hesco | https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20#file-0300-unable_to_find_2d_ip |
| 11:41.24 | sn5aY | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:41.24 | sn5aY | everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to |
| 11:41.24 | sn5aY | everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to |
| 11:41.25 | sn5aY | everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to everyone in Clarion PA your cell phone is hacked by the police to |
| 11:41.30 | Haohmaru | dafuq |
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| 11:41.50 | ratrace | cyber puh leece! |
| 11:41.57 | ratrace | consequences will never be the same. |
| 11:42.04 | Haohmaru | Clarion PA, wut is this? somewhere in america? |
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| 11:43.55 | Haohmaru | okay, well, it went thru to the next steps, so it seems gud now |
| 11:44.00 | hesco | Haohmarus: PA here in usa means Pennsylvania |
| 11:44.02 | jelly | the "content" spammers use is designed to provoke reaction and add noise to channels, avoid commenting in here |
| 11:44.35 | jelly | #debian-offtopic if you really want to |
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| 11:44.50 | Haohmaru | eggscuse me, again |
| 11:44.53 | ratrace | hesco: which computer (IP) are you trying that ping from? |
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| 11:45.42 | Haohmaru | shakes jelly gently, in a friendly way |
| 11:45.43 | sn5aYy | spam fuku 20000 |
| 11:45.50 | sn5aYy | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:46.09 | hesco | ratrace: marcus010, my notebook, is on a desk at the data center. Not many hops from here to the cluster in the rack back on the floor. But if I can sort this out, I'm hopeful I can do this from home. |
| 11:46.21 | ratrace | ops, can I haz 62.102.148.0/24 ban pls |
| 11:46.57 | ratrace | hesco: so, you can ping the .75 but not .94 ? |
| 11:47.09 | hesco | yes |
| 11:47.24 | ratrace | hesco: and you're sure the routing TO it is set up properly? or, on the other side, proper subnet is allocated to that NIC? |
| 11:48.44 | ratrace | hesco: can you ping the gateway, from that machine using .94 as source addr? ping -I 209.195.11.94 -c2 209.195.11.65 |
| 11:50.13 | hesco | https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20 |
| 11:50.18 | hesco | testing that next |
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| 11:52.34 | hesco | ratrace: results of your latest requested test: https://gist.github.com/hesco/ec2c0084346cbd24f0071e72261aae20#file-0500-ping_gateway_from_d021 |
| 11:53.04 | jelly | ,checkbackport phpmyadmin |
| 11:53.13 | judd | Backporting package phpmyadmin in sid→buster/amd64: unsatisfiable build dependencies: Build-Depends: php-phpmyadmin-motranslator (>= 4.0), php-phpmyadmin-sql-parser (>= 4.3.2), php-phpmyadmin-shapefile (>= 2.0), php-tcpdf, php-twig-extensions, php-google-recaptcha. |
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| 11:53.28 | jelly | ouch |
| 11:53.34 | coding_horribly | hesco: (I'm back after a break) Do I need to disable NM for this to work? |
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| 11:54.05 | ratrace | hesco: swell. seems like routing outside of that machine could be borked. can you repeat that test but try a public IP? say, ping googs at 8.8.8.8. no need to pastebin, just confirm it passed |
| 11:54.07 | jm_ | coding_horribly: you don't want two things managing a single device |
| 11:54.12 | coding_horribly | Got it |
| 11:55.26 | hesco | ratrace: --- 8.8.8.8 ping statistics --- |
| 11:55.28 | hesco | 2 packets transmitted, 2 received, 0% packet loss, time 3ms |
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| 11:56.38 | ratrace | hesco: neat. it works then. do you perhaps have packet filtering in place that doesn't allow new ICMP packets (non-established) to that IP? |
| 11:57.04 | coding_horribly | Alas, no connection after configuring dhcp using the link and disabling & stopping NM then restarting networking |
| 11:57.34 | ratrace | coding_horribly: can you pastebin some configs? like /etc/network/interfaces |
| 11:57.48 | coding_horribly | sure |
| 11:58.07 | coding_horribly | but it's super simple (3 lines) should I just put it in here? |
| 11:58.36 | coding_horribly | (whoops, 4 lines) |
| 11:58.46 | jm_ | better use the paste site then |
| 11:58.51 | coding_horribly | Got it. |
| 11:59.11 | Regor | https://paste.debian.net/ |
| 11:59.17 | Regor | coding_horribly: |
| 12:02.15 | hesco | ratrace: ah, of course. thanks. let me check iptables then |
| 12:03.09 | coding_horribly | Here's /etc/network/interfaces : http://paste.debian.net/1120337/ |
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| 12:05.32 | jm_ | coding_horribly: have you rebooted since then? |
| 12:06.23 | coding_horribly | Don't recall - I've rebooted a few times, don't remember which one was the last time. I'll give it a shot. |
| 12:06.28 | ratrace | tis ain't windows yo. just restart the networking.service (which does ifdown & ifup dance). |
| 12:06.29 | jm_ | wait |
| 12:06.44 | jm_ | just use systemctl or ifup -a now |
| 12:07.13 | coding_horribly | Oops - started restart already. |
| 12:07.25 | ratrace | might wanna ip addr flush dev enp3s0 too, just in case (hesco reminded me about that particular need in some cases) |
| 12:07.28 | coding_horribly | Last time I did ifup enp3s0 it didn't work, though |
| 12:08.07 | coding_horribly | I'd already done a systemctl restart, too |
| 12:08.31 | ratrace | coding_horribly: is that the correct inteface name? after reboot, if it still doesn't work, please pastebin ip link show |
| 12:08.34 | coding_horribly | I do see that I'm getting a start job for Raise network interfaces |
| 12:09.03 | coding_horribly | sure, I got enp3s0 from ip a s, but I'll pase it if I've got problems. |
| 12:11.12 | coding_horribly | humph, network still unreachable, I'm going to copy ip link show in a paste |
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| 12:14.38 | coding_horribly | should I be pasting in the MAC? |
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| 12:16.37 | coding_horribly | Here's without my MAC address (put in xx:xx instead): http://paste.debian.net/1120339/ |
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| 12:18.33 | ratrace | coding_horribly: NO-CARRIER ... is the cable connected? broken? switch on the other side working? does the NIC need firmware? dmesg | grep -i firmware |
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| 12:19.51 | coding_horribly | Okay - i got it! |
| 12:20.38 | coding_horribly | I did two things at once, not sure what did it. One, I remembered that I'd tweaked NetworkManager.conf, and I thought maybe it was making problems, so I switched what I had originally done, and restarted networking. |
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| 12:20.45 | ratrace | "Did you turn it off and on?" -- Roy |
| 12:21.29 | Haohmaru | "installation complete" yeehaa |
| 12:21.36 | coding_horribly | Also, I did check the cable, and while I think it was connected, it was an itty-bit wiggly, so I won't rule out a cringe-worthy cable fail. |
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| 12:22.12 | coding_horribly | Phew! Thanks a ton for all the help, and working through this with me. |
| 12:22.15 | ratrace | coding_horribly: well, NO-CARRIER implies broken physical link |
| 12:22.30 | coding_horribly | Welp, I guess it's the more embarassing option, then. |
| 12:22.38 | ratrace | (through broken cable, missing equipment on the other side or firmware missing / issues) |
| 12:23.12 | coding_horribly | Another day, another piece of Debian wisdom learnt. |
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| 12:24.46 | Haohmaru | aww, now i don't see anything on the screen because the radeon haz no driver.. fortunately i installed ssh server on it, unfortunately, i don't know teh IP |
| 12:25.46 | coding_horribly | Haohmaru - I've actually dealt with something like this before, I think. You're trying to install an AMD GPU? |
| 12:26.25 | Haohmaru | no, i reinstalled the debian and i was gonna restore my /etc and programs afterwards |
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| 12:26.33 | Haohmaru | i happen to have a radeon |
| 12:26.38 | ratrace | coding_horribly: so wait, you fixed it, or not? |
| 12:26.45 | coding_horribly | I'm all fixed up. |
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| 12:27.00 | ratrace | coding_horribly: so it was the cable? |
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| 12:27.11 | Haohmaru | is there some trick to find out what IP it uses without being able to see? |
| 12:27.20 | coding_horribly | ratrace: I suppose? |
| 12:27.32 | Haohmaru | this is basic h4x0r 101 i guess |
| 12:27.54 | ratrace | coding_horribly: well does it work now? it got the IP via DHCP and you can access stuff? |
| 12:28.04 | coding_horribly | I mean, I did like a million things in between losing internet and getting it back, and the last thing was fixing the cable, so it could've been just that the whole time, but I sort of suspect not? |
| 12:28.14 | ratrace | ah, k. |
| 12:29.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1550] by debhelper |
| 12:29.39 | coding_horribly | Thanks a ton for the help, though. I was totally lost, and hadn't thought about the cable, especially since I had just had some networking issues. |
| 12:30.45 | coding_horribly | Haohmaru: Are the problems on a local machine? |
| 12:31.12 | Haohmaru | yes, it's right here, but the monitor says "out of range" |
| 12:31.31 | Haohmaru | i can only see up to GRUB and then slighty more from systemd before it switches resolution |
| 12:31.36 | coding_horribly | ratrace: Can you reboot and connect the monitor through VGA? |
| 12:31.49 | coding_horribly | whoops, meant Haohmaru |
| 12:32.08 | Haohmaru | it *is* thru VGA |
| 12:32.19 | coding_horribly | The radeon is cpu or gpu? |
| 12:32.27 | Haohmaru | uh, videocard |
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| 12:32.35 | Haohmaru | the cpu is some intel |
| 12:33.02 | coding_horribly | Got it. An inelegant solution could be to physically disconnect the GPU. |
| 12:33.22 | Haohmaru | yeah, bluh |
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| 12:33.34 | Haohmaru | it's all gonna get fixed if i can ssh into it |
| 12:33.50 | Haohmaru | or.. maybe i could just.. write commands on teh blind |
| 12:34.28 | Haohmaru | i *think* i didn't installed any desktop, so i guess it should be sitting in text mode waiting for username/password |
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| 12:38.10 | Haohmaru | oh, duh.. when i switched to ctrl+alt+F1 it changes to a low resolution and i can haz eyeballz |
| 12:38.18 | Haohmaru | sorry for teh noise |
| 12:38.26 | coding_horribly | ratrace, jm_, hesco: thanks a bunch for all the help! |
| 12:38.30 | coding_horribly | I'm out. |
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| 12:41.39 | Haohmaru | tar cfpvz /home/etc.tar.gz /etc <- how do you extract that thing afterwards? |
| 12:41.55 | Haohmaru | nvz wake up u |
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| 12:44.41 | jm_ | c=create, x=extract |
| 12:44.55 | jm_ | but you don't need -p for extract |
| 12:45.20 | Haohmaru | so.. xfvz? |
| 12:45.44 | Haohmaru | tar xfvz .tar.gz /path ? |
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| 12:46.55 | whislock | Haohmaru: tar xzf file.tar.gz -C /path/to/where |
| 12:47.26 | whislock | You can even omit the z, honestly. |
| 12:47.28 | whislock | Just xf. |
| 12:48.32 | whislock | Haohmaru: Ah, you're tarring /etc? |
| 12:48.48 | Haohmaru | no |
| 12:49.01 | whislock | Haohmaru: Your original command indicates such. |
| 12:49.05 | Haohmaru | i supposedly archived my /etc in order to restore it later after a complete reinstall |
| 12:49.14 | whislock | So now you're trying to untar it. |
| 12:49.19 | Haohmaru | so now i am trying to extract it |
| 12:49.28 | Haohmaru | back in its place |
| 12:49.31 | whislock | tar xpf etc.tar.gz -C /etc |
| 12:49.49 | whislock | The p flag is the default mode of operation if you're running the command as root. |
| 12:50.09 | Haohmaru | bruh, if "zip" could be used instead of tar.. |
| 12:50.30 | whislock | Had you used zip to create the archive, you could. |
| 12:51.19 | jm_ | I think he included /etc in tar, so cd / && tar xf ... |
| 12:51.19 | Haohmaru | nvz told me to use tar |
| 12:51.36 | Haohmaru | uh oh |
| 12:51.54 | ratrace | no need to cd, tar has -C |
| 12:52.14 | Haohmaru | yes, i now have etc inside /etc/ |
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| 12:52.16 | Haohmaru | >:( |
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| 12:52.35 | whislock | Haohmaru: Then run it again with -C / |
| 12:52.39 | ratrace | (and also by default leading slashes are stripped unless -P ) |
| 12:52.46 | whislock | ^ |
| 12:52.50 | Haohmaru | okay, since i have the old contents of /etc, can i erase the current one? |
| 12:53.03 | Haohmaru | coz it turned into a mess |
| 12:53.14 | whislock | Haohmaru: No. |
| 12:53.19 | Fox | you should backup the current one as well |
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| 12:53.30 | Haohmaru | Fox it's a fresh install |
| 12:53.33 | whislock | Haohmaru: What you can do is extract your archive, then see what files are in /etc that aren't in your archive and remove them. |
| 12:53.56 | Haohmaru | crap :~( |
| 12:54.01 | whislock | It's easy. |
| 12:54.47 | ratrace | tip of the day: diff can show differences between dirs too |
| 12:55.05 | Haohmaru | i erased /etc/etc |
| 12:55.11 | Haohmaru | ;P~ |
| 12:55.16 | whislock | ratrace: Exactly. :) |
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| 12:56.09 | Haohmaru | but now when i do dpkg --set-selections < packages.lst it throws warnings |
| 12:56.24 | Haohmaru | and in those warnings i see i386 mentioned |
| 12:56.40 | Haohmaru | nvz tossed me into a trap, didn't he |
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| 12:57.24 | jm_ | probably some packages in there are listed with :i386 - try replacing with :amd64, or ignore it and try installing them later |
| 12:57.46 | jm_ | (not i386 ones of course) |
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| 12:58.06 | andre144k | hi all... i have a <special> problem... maybe someone have an idea? in basement we connect an ESX-Host with 10G network (light) on cisco switch. in firstflore i have an linux-server with samba. - when i copy files from a guest on esx-server to linux server i have 1mb/s speed... when u use instead of 10G network (light) 1G network (copper) i have 100mb/s speed... |
| 12:58.43 | Haohmaru | the whole problem here was that, for some reason i had installed 32bit debian10.. no idea why, and now i'm doing this whole operation to change it to 64bit and keep all my stuff intact (supposedly) |
| 12:59.09 | andre144k | when i messure speed over light (10G network) via iperf3 i get round about 40mb/s - when i messure over copper (1G network) via iperf3 i get round about 110mb/s |
| 12:59.24 | diogenes_ | Hello guys, in the process of updating ebian 10 i got this ncurses question about selecting keyboard layout, which one is recommended? https://i.imgur.com/hFEF5nc.png |
| 12:59.37 | Haohmaru | in this packages.lst i see a pile of :i386 |
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| 13:00.15 | whislock | Haohmaru: Of course. |
| 13:00.21 | whislock | Haohmaru: You created that archive from a 32-bit system. |
| 13:00.26 | Haohmaru | right |
| 13:00.40 | whislock | Haohmaru: So remove the :i386 portion of the package name. |
| 13:00.49 | Haohmaru | they are like.. many |
| 13:00.55 | whislock | sed inline. |
| 13:01.09 | whislock | sed -i 's/:i386$//g' file |
| 13:01.33 | andre144k | i dnt understand i hve only 1mb/s speed wile copy files (ssh/samba) - and iperf shows 40mb/s |
| 13:01.37 | whislock | Haohmaru: Gotta get them shell command skills, man. |
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| 13:02.10 | whislock | andre144k: Protocols are not beholden to line speeds. It is a universal truth that a protocol will always be slower than the line it's using. |
| 13:02.11 | Haohmaru | whislock more like.. gotta avoid installing 32bit on a 64bit machine |
| 13:02.25 | ratrace | andre144k: I'm assuming you mean MB/s (mega BYTES) not bits (lowercase b)? Does your NIC require firmware? check dmesg | grep -i firmware . Also what whislock said. |
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| 13:03.06 | andre144k | megabytes/s |
| 13:03.14 | ratrace | andre144k: and also, you can have infinite network speed, but you'll be confined to hard disk (and SATA, and memory, and ...) throughput when you serve files over the pipe |
| 13:03.35 | Haohmaru | whislock i ran that and i still see :i386 in the file |
| 13:03.46 | andre144k | the thing is, when i change to copper cables from ESX to cisco i have full copy speed (110mb/s) |
| 13:03.46 | whislock | Haohmaru: Paste an example line. |
| 13:04.00 | Haohmaru | of what? |
| 13:04.02 | andre144k | megabytes/s |
| 13:04.08 | whislock | Haohmaru: The file we're working with, what else? |
| 13:04.17 | whislock | andre144k: I hate to be terse, here, but how is this a Debian issue? |
| 13:04.27 | ratrace | might be if firmware is missing |
| 13:04.40 | andre144k | whislock, it issnt - im sry, maby someone have an idea? |
| 13:05.03 | ratrace | andre144k: again.... are you missing firmware .... |
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| 13:05.05 | simplicius | Hello |
| 13:05.21 | simplicius | can you tell me how can I transfer files form android to linux debian? |
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| 13:05.25 | Haohmaru | whislock can't easily paste stuff.. for example "giblib1:i386 <either spaces or tabs here> install" |
| 13:05.34 | whislock | Haohmaru: Oh, I got the format backwards. Hold on. |
| 13:05.48 | whislock | sed -i 's/:i386//g' file |
| 13:05.52 | andre144k | ratrace, which firmwares? |
| 13:06.04 | ratrace | simplicius: I'm using jmtpfs (FUSE) and mount manually. GNOME and friends would have gvfs integration and automagic for that |
| 13:06.06 | Haohmaru | is that not the same?! |
| 13:06.14 | whislock | Haohmaru: No. |
| 13:06.17 | whislock | simplicius: https://wiki.debian.org/mtp |
| 13:06.37 | Haohmaru | you stole a dollar from it? |
| 13:06.40 | ratrace | andre144k: check with dmesg | grep -i firmware do it show something was tried to be loaded but is missing? |
| 13:06.41 | whislock | Haohmaru: Correct. |
| 13:06.53 | Haohmaru | u thief |
| 13:06.53 | simplicius | so I install jmtpfs |
| 13:07.03 | whislock | Haohmaru: Regular expressions. $ matches the end of the line. |
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| 13:07.54 | Haohmaru | okay, now dpkg still throws warnings |
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| 13:08.35 | Haohmaru | "warning: package not in status nor available database at line 2065: xfce4-whiskermenu-plugin" and many similar ones |
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| 13:09.23 | Haohmaru | for stuff like xfwm4, zip, xterm ... |
| 13:09.29 | ratrace | Haohmaru: are you doing that switch from x86_32 to x86_64 without reinstallation? |
| 13:09.39 | Haohmaru | i just reinstalled |
| 13:09.54 | Haohmaru | and now i copy/pasted my old /etc/ |
| 13:10.10 | Haohmaru | and now i'm doing the dpkg --set-selections thing |
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| 13:10.32 | Haohmaru | i did an "apt-get update" after copy/pasting the /etc/ stuff |
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| 13:11.14 | Haohmaru | i saw it scanned thru backports and such (so my old sources.list is there) |
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| 13:14.41 | simplicius | I've installed the software but I get this: https://pastebin.com/WQtDtJzP |
| 13:14.42 | ratrace | Haohmaru: perhaps too late now, but come to think of it, I'd rather suggest reinstalling only manually installed packages, eg. those from apt-mark showmanual list not whole selections, as i386 might have different dependencies |
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| 13:15.01 | Haohmaru | ehm, dpkg says, at the end "warning: found unknown packages; this might mean the available database is outdated and needs to be updated thru a frontend method;" |
| 13:15.32 | ratrace | simplicius: when you connected the phone via USB, did you change, on the phone to mtp/file transfer? depending on your android version, it may or may not be default |
| 13:15.49 | Haohmaru | okay, so basically the packages.lst i made is pretty much useless, i shall go ahead and install everything manually |
| 13:15.50 | Haohmaru | meh |
| 13:15.55 | simplicius | ratrace, yes I selected MTP not usb charhing |
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| 13:16.08 | Haohmaru | nvz: prepare some coffee for my 15 lawyers! |
| 13:16.20 | Haohmaru | ;P~ |
| 13:16.27 | ratrace | simplicius: sorry no idea then, could be exactly what the message says: unrecognized device model. which one is it, btW? |
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| 13:17.20 | diogenes_ | Sorry, got disconnected in case someone has replied to my keyboard layout question. |
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| 13:17.40 | Haohmaru | diogenes_ can't you change this choice later on? |
| 13:18.01 | ratrace | diogenes_: you can, and also, only you know what you have, there's no "recommended" here |
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| 13:18.15 | Haohmaru | i've personally no idea what dead keys are |
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| 13:18.22 | diogenes_ | Haohmaru, no clue, it just poppedup in the process of updating. |
| 13:18.37 | diogenes_ | i chose alt intl with deadkeys |
| 13:18.56 | Haohmaru | this looks like the thing you can later invoke by doing dpkg-reconfigure <something-keyboard> |
| 13:19.27 | diogenes_ | btw, i've noticed Debian switched to 68, nice move. |
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| 13:20.28 | ratrace | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:21.34 | diogenes_ | ratrace, i've rebooted and it seems to work fine, no difference before/after the update. |
| 13:22.05 | ratrace | diogenes_: well yeah, if that was during update, it would show current selection, so you can just hit enter until it finishes |
| 13:22.31 | hesco | yes, ratrace: thanks. Pretty sure you are right that my issue is my iptables. Been sorting through my puppet manifests to fix them. Really appreciate your help getting this far. Although I am still at it, opening up the firewall to that second IP bound to that interface. |
| 13:22.33 | diogenes_ | and there you got a great "surprise" the new firefox |
| 13:22.48 | diogenes_ | is incompatible with the bookmarks and everything from the previus one. |
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| 13:24.26 | ratrace | diogenes_: and it will be again for next ESR.... that pisses me off to no end and NO I will NOT sign up for a mozilla account just to transfer my settings. |
| 13:25.11 | diogenes_ | ratrace, i got no choice, if i stay and manually type all my bookmarks and stuff it will take forever. |
| 13:25.54 | ratrace | I dump and restore bookmarks, but I have cookieautodelete and other extension settings that I can't |
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| 13:29.31 | Haohmaru | "firmware-amd-graphics" is what i need for a radeon card, right? |
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| 13:31.51 | Haohmaru | uh oh, "dpkg: error processing package initramfs-tools (--configure): installed initramfs-tools package post-installation script subprocess returned error exit status 127" "Errors were encountered while processing initramfs-tools" |
| 13:32.10 | Haohmaru | i messed it up, didn't i |
| 13:33.24 | Haohmaru | or could that be because i ran dpkg --set-selections < packages.lst, and maybe some of the things there were "accepted" sorta, but.. i guess further steps are required to finish that job? |
| 13:33.41 | ratrace | Haohmaru: is your /boot full? |
| 13:33.59 | Haohmaru | i.. doubt? |
| 13:34.10 | Haohmaru | the / partition is like over 60GB |
| 13:34.29 | Haohmaru | assuming that's where /boot is |
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| 13:34.47 | Haohmaru | i installed grub itself "to the master boot record" |
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| 13:35.24 | Haohmaru | if dpkg --set-selections was successiful, what would have been the next steps required? |
| 13:35.29 | Haohmaru | something with apt maybe? |
| 13:35.40 | ratrace | apt install -f I'd assume |
| 13:35.54 | Haohmaru | yeah, and i haven't done that |
| 13:36.19 | Haohmaru | could this explain why i got these errors above when i tried to apt-get install firmware-amd-graphics ? |
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| 13:37.11 | ratrace | Haohmaru: ah, no, apt-get dselect-upgrade |
| 13:37.35 | ratrace | is sifting through his old notes |
| 13:37.36 | Haohmaru | ^ that's what i should've done? |
| 13:37.39 | ratrace | ya |
| 13:37.45 | Haohmaru | okay, didn't do that either |
| 13:37.57 | Haohmaru | the question is.. what to do |
| 13:38.15 | Haohmaru | ^ that, or another reinstall |
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| 13:38.18 | ratrace | try that, see what happens |
| 13:38.26 | ratrace | worse thing.... you'll reinstall if you bork it even more :) |
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| 13:39.37 | Haohmaru | it basically said "nothing to do except one not-fully-installed package" |
| 13:40.08 | Haohmaru | i said "yes" and it tried to "set up initramfs-tools" again |
| 13:40.17 | Haohmaru | okay, bluh |
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| 13:45.46 | Hydr0p0nX | any plan on rolling go 1.13 into buster or should i just do a manual install of it? |
| 13:46.28 | ratrace | ,v golang |
| 13:46.29 | judd | Package: golang on amd64 -- jessie: 2:1.3.3-1; jessie-security: 2:1.3.3-1+deb8u2; stretch: 2:1.7~5; stretch-backports: 2:1.11~1~bpo9+1; buster: 2:1.11~1; bullseye: 2:1.13~1; sid: 2:1.13~1 |
| 13:47.06 | ratrace | Hydr0p0nX: maybe it'll come via buster-backports. maybe. |
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| 13:47.36 | Hydr0p0nX | k, wasn't sure if it was already in talks or not ... i'll do a manual install for now |
| 13:48.50 | dreamer | I wouldn't expect it |
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| 13:52.47 | MaxFrames | sorry for earlier (rants) :| |
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| 14:16.17 | humbot | <PROTECTED> |
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| 14:18.17 | MaxFrames | I've noticed that on my debian buster vm if I display the gnome session there is a warning on the logon screen that the computer will suspend soon |
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| 14:18.59 | MaxFrames | not knowing any better, I've tried to log on to gnome and disable the auto suspend feature from the settings control panel, but that did not change a thing, the warning is still displayed |
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| 14:19.17 | MaxFrames | is this a false warning? is there another way to disable the auto suspend? |
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| 14:20.15 | humbot | what is the logon screen? is it gdm? |
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| 14:20.32 | MaxFrames | I honestly am unable to tell |
| 14:21.07 | MaxFrames | another strange thing is that I can no longer open the energy saving settings in gnome: as soon as I open them, the screen locks again (I need to reauthenticate) |
| 14:22.37 | MaxFrames | journalctl last line is: Error looking up permission: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name org.freedesktop.impl.portal.PermissionStore was not provided by any .service files |
| 14:23.48 | MaxFrames | how do I determine if the logon screen is gdm? this is a default debian 10 installation anyway, meaning I left all the choices at default |
| 14:25.23 | MaxFrames | another error is gsd-rfkill[5541]: Error setting up rfkill: Could not open RFKILL control device, please verify your installation |
| 14:26.05 | humbot | this is a vm right |
| 14:26.13 | MaxFrames | yes |
| 14:26.29 | humbot | do you need a login screen or any power management? |
| 14:27.31 | MaxFrames | I just need this vm to never go to sleep |
| 14:28.11 | MaxFrames | though it unnerves me that if I (which I don't plan to do often) log on to gnome and try to change some settings, I immediately get disconnected from the session for no apparent reason |
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| 14:29.55 | MaxFrames | there are a few bad looking errors in journalctl |
| 14:30.41 | MaxFrames | http://paste.debian.net/1120359/ |
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| 14:33.49 | MaxFrames | any idea? |
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| 14:37.53 | Miles8of9 | can debian write to ntfs filesystems? i remember there are license issues because ntfs is protected by M$ |
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| 14:39.59 | MaxFrames | I have disabled wayland on the login screen with the WaylandEnable=false directive in /etc/gdm3/daemon.conf |
| 14:40.14 | MaxFrames | I dunno... what else to do |
| 14:40.26 | Haohmaru | well, i reinstalled yet again, this time, after merely extracting my old etc.tar.gz into /etc - immediately the monitor went into some cyclic sh*t |
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| 14:42.26 | Miles8of9 | Normally Linux systems can only read from Windows NTFS partitions, but not write to them which can be very annoying if you have to work with Linux and Windows systems <-- wtf legal issues! |
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| 14:43.58 | towo^work | Miles8of9, there is no problem with writing on ntfs with debian |
| 14:44.08 | Regor | Miles8of9: yes it can .... ntfs-3g package is usually installed..by default.. |
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| 14:44.32 | towo^work | only important thing is, if windows is installed parallel, you have to make sure, fastboot is disabled |
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| 14:46.47 | MaxFrames | is this what I need to do to disable this senseless suspend warning? https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=893964#22 |
| 14:46.48 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/893964 in gdm3 (forwarded): «gdm3: System goes into suspend mode unless a user is logged in on the console.»; severity: normal; opened: 2018-03-24; last modified: 2018-03-28. |
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| 14:51.34 | MaxFrames | I can't help thinking that it should not be this hard. these are trivial issues, the solution cannot be some mysterious alchemy. |
| 14:52.14 | jelly | MaxFrames: best adjust your expectation of how polished things are on debian |
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| 14:52.42 | MaxFrames | it appears so. I just did not have these problems with wheezy. |
| 14:53.21 | MaxFrames | I just want to disable auto suspend. and be able to use a control panel without the session crashing (or disconnecting?) by itself. nothing else |
| 14:53.40 | Haohmaru | so it seems at least extracting stuff over /etc/ on a running system is not absolutely "safe" |
| 14:53.47 | Haohmaru | it seems to have immediate effects |
| 14:54.05 | Haohmaru | smells like it's time for a third reinstall |
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| 14:57.34 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: files kept open at that moment should still be available for the application, the other ones can be reinstalled (or copied back) |
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| 14:58.07 | EdePopede | some particular file causing problems? |
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| 14:59.02 | Haohmaru | well, after a reinstall, in text mode i logged in as root, and did "tar xpf /home/etc.tar.gz -C /" |
| 14:59.19 | Haohmaru | and this time immediately the monitor went into a black cycle |
| 14:59.42 | Haohmaru | i couldn't do much besides ctrl+alt+del a pile of times |
| 14:59.53 | Haohmaru | and now the sh*t looks pretty broken |
| 15:00.37 | Haohmaru | the first time i did this same thing, it went "okay" and i could even do "apt-get update" and i could see it's using my old sources.list which has backports and stuff |
| 15:01.01 | Haohmaru | but this time it reacted (badly) immediately as i uncompressed the stuff onto /etc |
| 15:01.53 | TimBandTech | When I choose LXDE on a fresh standard install it chooses wicd for the network manager, which fails to recognize my wifi. It's a Dell Precision M3400 with the 3411 Broadcom wifi pci adapter. I load the b43 after the network install over wired eth. Then I change over to gnome's network manager and everything is fine. I'm blaming wicd, but i have not dug deep on this one. |
| 15:02.11 | Haohmaru | now if i try to re-extract the stuff into /etc, i get piles of errors like "tar: etc/console-setup: cannot change ownership to uid 0, gid 0: read-only file system" |
| 15:02.15 | EdePopede | oh so you literally threw some old stuff over /etc. i thought it was as least some .deb unpacking |
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| 15:02.33 | Haohmaru | nope |
| 15:02.33 | EdePopede | ah, / was remounted in the meantime? |
| 15:02.41 | Haohmaru | uhm |
| 15:02.41 | EdePopede | syslog should have something to say |
| 15:03.35 | EdePopede | and if the tarball is still there, maybe you could check which possibly critical files were overwritten |
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| 15:04.07 | Haohmaru | no idea.. basically, after a fresh install, i can't use login screen because the radeon doesn't have the fancy driver and throws an odd resolution at the monitor, so i switch to ctrl+alt+F1, login as root, and extract my old etc.tar.gz on top of /etc |
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| 15:04.37 | hugo_ | Hello all, i usually use "ssh-agent && ssh-add" commands to save my ssh passphrase. What command could i use to know if my ssh key was added to the session ? |
| 15:05.00 | Haohmaru | no idea about syslogs, there were 2 reboots since then |
| 15:05.06 | Haohmaru | maybe it's gone |
| 15:05.15 | EdePopede | fixing a gpu issue like this brought up a gpu issue. may be related ;) |
| 15:05.39 | Haohmaru | in my case i didn't have any issues besides the installation being 32bit |
| 15:05.43 | Haohmaru | for some weird reason |
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| 15:05.51 | Haohmaru | so i wanted to change to 64bit |
| 15:06.08 | Haohmaru | ..and keep all my configuration/customization and stuff |
| 15:06.28 | Haohmaru | the radeon works fine when it's with the fancy driver |
| 15:07.04 | Haohmaru | or maybe it works fine now too, but the monitor itself is too dumb? i don't know |
| 15:07.29 | EdePopede | Haohmaru > zgrep remount /var/log/syslog*gz |
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| 15:07.55 | EdePopede | (have the same problem atm btw, but that's ok until the next reboot) |
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| 15:08.29 | Haohmaru | no such file or directory |
| 15:08.35 | EdePopede | ah, was that the laptop with originally some 32bit ubuntu? |
| 15:08.49 | EdePopede | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:09.04 | EdePopede | (still stretch here, did they remove it in buster?) |
| 15:09.42 | EdePopede | nope, also available on the other machine |
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| 15:11.35 | jelly | MaxFrames: does the workaround described in that bug report not work? |
| 15:11.41 | Haohmaru | "gzip: /var/log/syslog*gzls.gz: no such file or directory" "/var/log/syslog:Dec 9 16:34:37 cad kernel: [ some.numbers] EXT4-fs (sda2): re-mounted. Opts: errors=remount-ro" |
| 15:12.09 | MaxFrames | jelly: I have applied it an am waiting to see if the suspend warning will still come up |
| 15:12.32 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: that's it. now the question is, why was it remounted? related to the unpacking maybe? |
| 15:12.40 | Haohmaru | hm, EdePopede seems i've entered the wrong command |
| 15:12.50 | MaxFrames | that said, the system never went to sleep. I've left it unattended for about two hours. so I don't even know if the suspend warning is "real" or a red herring |
| 15:12.56 | Haohmaru | ls actually returns just /var/log/syslog |
| 15:12.59 | EdePopede | btw, the numbers are the timestamp as %s.%N (man strftime, man date) |
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| 15:13.28 | Haohmaru | before that i entered the "ls .." command at the end of the zgrep command |
| 15:13.33 | Haohmaru | x_x |
| 15:13.37 | EdePopede | heh |
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| 15:15.06 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: if you look at the ctime of the files you unpacked, does it correspond to the timestamp of the remount? |
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| 15:15.59 | Haohmaru | i.. don't know how to check any of that |
| 15:16.24 | Iarfen | hi! |
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| 15:18.21 | jim | I did: checkbackport git, and the reply was: "Backporting package git in sid→buster/amd64: all build-dependencies satisfied using buster, virtual.", and my question is, what's this virtual thing? |
| 15:19.17 | jim | Iarfen, hi |
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| 15:19.26 | jelly | !virtual |
| 15:19.26 | dpkg | i guess virtual is when you can see it, but its not there, as opposed to hidden, where you can't see it, but it is there, when its gone, then you can't see it and it isn't there. a model of reality, in a handy carrying case, or <virtual package>, or <virtualization>. |
| 15:20.14 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: either you could reformat the timestamp to something readable: $ date -d @<YOUR_TIMESTAMP_HERE> ## and then do `ls -lctr` on a directory which the files you changed, this brings the newest files at the end. and then check the timings. |
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| 15:21.46 | jim | jelly, that doesn't really explain in the context of the backporting |
| 15:22.03 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: or do a 'stat -t' on such a directory and grep for a timestamp similar to the one from that log line. e.g. it was just 1575904851, in this case i'd check for 1575904, that's around 14 minutes |
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| 15:23.09 | Haohmaru | nah, it has gotten severely messed up |
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| 15:23.52 | Haohmaru | even if i just run "pico" i get "unable to create directory /root/.local/share/nano/: no such file or directory" |
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| 15:24.58 | Haohmaru | seems like i should just toss everything in the garbage, reinstall again, and .. oh boy :~( |
| 15:25.20 | Haohmaru | start installing all the programs back and doing all the configuration again |
| 15:25.26 | Haohmaru | such much meh |
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| 15:27.14 | Haohmaru | altho i do wonder why i was able to extract etc.tar.gz over /etc on the first reinstall and then it seemed to "work" enough so as to do apt-get update and get no errors |
| 15:28.05 | Haohmaru | is there anything i can try to do that would take less time than another full reinstall? |
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| 15:28.45 | Haohmaru | like.. i don't know.. run a live iso, then erase /etc/, extract etc.tar.gz into /etc and see if it works then? |
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| 15:29.40 | Haohmaru | and, actually, can i do these operations from the netinst iso.. cuz i don't happen to have another flash stick |
| 15:30.15 | Haohmaru | i know these kinds of interventions are normally done via a live image |
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| 15:31.32 | Haohmaru | hm, but if with netinst i have to type crazy commands to "mount" partitions - then no, i'd rather take a live image cuz that works easier x_x |
| 15:31.35 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: the only thing that should matter is if the "live image" has enought "tools" to do what you want. |
| 15:31.52 | horseshoecrab | (although im not entirely sure i understand exactly what you are trying to do) |
| 15:31.57 | horseshoecrab | scrolls up a bit... |
| 15:32.06 | Haohmaru | horseshoecrab they do.. don't they? i even apt-get install gparted in a live iso |
| 15:32.28 | horseshoecrab | i think netinst is pretty minimal |
| 15:32.39 | Haohmaru | yeah, i know.. it probably won't work |
| 15:32.41 | horseshoecrab | but im not 100% sure |
| 15:32.47 | Haohmaru | or at least.. not so "easy" |
| 15:32.57 | horseshoecrab | if you are in the doo-doo and you gotta boot from some media |
| 15:33.00 | horseshoecrab | and mount your disks |
| 15:33.04 | horseshoecrab | and maybe chroot etc... |
| 15:33.25 | Haohmaru | i certainly know i can do it with a LXDE live image, i can click via the PCManFM filemanager to get stuff mounted and then type commandz in terminal |
| 15:33.34 | horseshoecrab | if its got to that horrible stage already, why make it worse? start downloading the fattest live iso you can find and get the coffee on. |
| 15:33.54 | Haohmaru | i don't wanna waste more time |
| 15:34.08 | Haohmaru | trying to prevent doing a 3rd reinstall |
| 15:34.15 | whislock | Haohmaru: Continuing to screw with this like this is going to waste way more time. |
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| 15:34.32 | horseshoecrab | i tend to agree with whislock |
| 15:34.39 | Haohmaru | what does that mean? |
| 15:34.55 | Haohmaru | what should i do? |
| 15:35.01 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: i think if you did something like: i can just take a tarball of the machine in this state and then extract it |
| 15:35.07 | Haohmaru | forget my etc.tar.gz and start from zero? |
| 15:35.11 | horseshoecrab | (not being mean) |
| 15:35.22 | horseshoecrab | you've demonstrated a certain lack of understanding. :P |
| 15:35.40 | Haohmaru | i haven't claimed i know wtf i'm doing |
| 15:35.46 | horseshoecrab | you can continue messing around and it will (depending on your personal attitude to life) possibly be a very good learning experience |
| 15:36.03 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: shure, / is read-only. no chance at all to create or change anything there until it is mounted rw again. |
| 15:36.05 | horseshoecrab | but if you just want it to work, then you should probably look at other options (which means a reinstall) :( |
| 15:36.28 | Haohmaru | okay, so another reinstall then |
| 15:36.39 | EdePopede | of the packages or of the os? |
| 15:36.41 | whislock | Haohmaru: Reinstall and fresh configuration. Don't try this /etc thing again. |
| 15:36.50 | Haohmaru | the reason i did this etc.tar.gz thing is because mr nvz told me so |
| 15:36.58 | horseshoecrab | i mean its fine to try |
| 15:37.06 | horseshoecrab | i might even try it if i was desperate enough |
| 15:37.12 | Haohmaru | (because i wanted to keep all my configz and customizations there) |
| 15:37.21 | EdePopede | /etc is apt-get wonderland. restricted area, prosecutors will be... punished ;) |
| 15:37.23 | horseshoecrab | but i wouldnt expect it to work on any machine that didnt have a very simple config. |
| 15:37.47 | Haohmaru | EdePopede that's what i told nvz too, because i thought it's gonna mess up things |
| 15:37.48 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: keeping the old /etc/ to help you rebuild the new machine is a different matter. |
| 15:37.53 | horseshoecrab | that can be very useful |
| 15:37.53 | EdePopede | manual changes have to be done carefully and minimalinvasive as possible (i don't even touch the original apache files) |
| 15:38.03 | horseshoecrab | but a drag and drop is chancing it at best (imvho) |
| 15:38.16 | Haohmaru | okay |
| 15:38.25 | Haohmaru | bluh |
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| 15:38.48 | EdePopede | d&d shouldn't even work, such tinkering should happen on the console |
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| 15:42.29 | Haohmaru | [10:35] <nvz> Haohmaru: tar cvf etc.tar /etc |
| 15:43.55 | horseshoecrab | EdePopede: i only use the console personally. i was using "drag and drop" metaphorically. |
| 15:44.16 | horseshoecrab | and i do realise how complicated i made that particularly as someone who tends to dislike most guis. |
| 15:44.28 | whislock | snarf'n'barf |
| 15:44.36 | horseshoecrab | :) |
| 15:44.48 | horseshoecrab | although the console does give us a lot of power to do that there too. |
| 15:45.13 | EdePopede | ah i see. yes, i really dislike them. have double commander installed but don't use it, still going with xterm+mc |
| 15:46.06 | Haohmaru | horseshoecrab, whislock http://paste.debian.net/hidden/09c204f4/ |
| 15:46.07 | EdePopede | some features of total commander from windows would be nice to have, maybe i even would switch then. but if this would replace mc's subshell paradigm? |
| 15:46.32 | Haohmaru | i knew i shouldn't trust him |
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| 15:49.23 | EdePopede | hmm. in parts i can read sarcasm, but not totally sure about all of it |
| 15:49.46 | Haohmaru | he's a tricksy little hobbit, isn't he? ;P~ |
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| 15:50.43 | Haohmaru | it's not the first time he's suggesting things i should try, and then he vanishes away, and leaves me alone as the brickwall approaches |
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| 15:56.07 | EdePopede | his tar approach really sounds... strange |
| 15:56.35 | EdePopede | i may try it on the other machine at some point, see what it breaks |
| 15:57.14 | Haohmaru | EdePopede well, as i said, on the first reinstall, extracting the tar "worked" .. what didn't work was the dpkg --set-selections |
| 15:57.37 | Haohmaru | because my packages.lst contains too many things that had :i386 (duh) |
| 15:58.07 | Haohmaru | that's why i'm thinking maybe it could work but not while the system is running |
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| 15:58.32 | Haohmaru | cuz on my second reinstall, it messed up immediately after extracting to /etc |
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| 15:59.21 | Haohmaru | monitor went black, into some cycle, had to reboot it by pumping ctrl+alt+del, then systemd wanted to vomit |
| 15:59.57 | EdePopede | i had just a few i386 things installed over the years. mostly i remember skype, and i think it is(was?) one of the typical proprietary software issues: they want to build only one version, and there were 64bit for intel AND amd. so typing `make` 3 times? nah, by far too much work |
| 16:00.00 | MaxFrames | that is some colorful description |
| 16:00.13 | Haohmaru | EdePopede my whole debian installation was 32bit |
| 16:00.23 | Haohmaru | i don't remember why |
| 16:00.32 | EdePopede | a good reason to do a clean install with 64bit ;) |
| 16:00.45 | Haohmaru | that's.. what i thought i was doing |
| 16:00.46 | jelly | perhaps you installed it first back when there was no 64bit |
| 16:00.49 | EdePopede | downloaded the wrong iso for the initial install? |
| 16:01.36 | Haohmaru | jelly i think it might have been either debian 8 or 9, and i read about "btrfs" and had the impression it might be kewl, so i installed it on btrfs |
| 16:01.47 | Haohmaru | and maybe i've went for 32bit then |
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| 16:02.21 | simplicius | hello |
| 16:02.22 | Haohmaru | then as years passed, i've both upgraded and maybe also rescued/reinstalled it and i had the impression it's 64bit |
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| 16:02.41 | EdePopede | uname -a ;) |
| 16:02.50 | simplicius | ratrace, I managed to mount the device.. but I can only navigate the filesystem though root |
| 16:02.57 | EdePopede | never even tried to remember all the other options it has :D |
| 16:03.42 | Haohmaru | anyway, reinstall numero tres |
| 16:04.06 | Haohmaru | as they say in le germanistanish |
| 16:04.36 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: you only can learn from it ;) |
| 16:04.50 | annadane | pretty sure that's spanishtanish |
| 16:05.07 | EdePopede | there also may be quatro cinco cinco seis! |
| 16:05.15 | greycat | two words of English, two of Spanish |
| 16:05.19 | Haohmaru | no, no quatro pls |
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| 16:05.33 | annadane | aaaand now that song is stuck in my head |
| 16:05.36 | Haohmaru | muh beard is already quite long already |
| 16:05.39 | EdePopede | :D |
| 16:06.02 | Haohmaru | i know that song too, back from when MTV played... music o_O |
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| 16:07.36 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: i think he was possibly trying to be helpful but maybe bottled it when things got a bit rich for his blood. |
| 16:07.57 | horseshoecrab | (re. the pastebin) |
| 16:08.20 | Haohmaru | he thought i wouldn't actually do all that he instructed? |
| 16:08.41 | horseshoecrab | i dunno - lets not dwell on the past. |
| 16:08.47 | Haohmaru | yeah |
| 16:08.57 | Haohmaru | i have put him on my little list here |
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| 16:09.13 | Haohmaru | he was already on it, i don't know why i gave him a chance |
| 16:09.21 | horseshoecrab | i think a good takeaway might be: "etc has a lot files. some of these are very simple default boilerplate stuff, but some are very complicated" |
| 16:09.38 | Haohmaru | basically, i knew this already |
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| 16:09.57 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: you needed help and he appeared helpful. id prefer not to project to much, i kind of assume he was trying to help as well. :) |
| 16:10.07 | horseshoecrab | i dont see much evidence of him being malicious per se. |
| 16:10.31 | Haohmaru | that's why i was looking at alternative ways like "CrossGrading" (but they told me it's very difficult), and reinstalling (which i didn't want to do if there's a faster way) |
| 16:11.04 | simplicius | I have mounted a device with sudo jmtpfs /home/gidna/simplicius |
| 16:11.06 | greycat | "Crossgrading" is the word used for "in-place architecture gration" |
| 16:11.10 | greycat | mi |
| 16:11.17 | greycat | glares at fingers and keyboard |
| 16:11.27 | Haohmaru | horseshoecrab he's on my list not because he's malicious, but because he's probably in a different timezone, and as i try out what he suggested, he's already gone |
| 16:11.31 | simplicius | I cannot access without root priviledges |
| 16:12.00 | Haohmaru | greycat got entagled? ;P~ |
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| 16:12.22 | Haohmaru | it would've been funny if you were a greyoctopus |
| 16:12.31 | greycat | "Crossgrading" is the word used for "in-place architecture migration". Whether it WORKS or not is highly questionable. It is definitely a "back up everything first" situation. |
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| 16:12.57 | EdePopede | Haohmaru: just for fun i did a minimal istall on the lenovo. still 200+ packages. when i started with linux (slackware, then debian with a 2.0 kernel) everything was much smaller. no useable internet, so i had the peace of mind to walk through my filesystem. |
| 16:12.58 | horseshoecrab | it sounds scary. |
| 16:13.10 | Haohmaru | yeah i had packed up my projects, just didn't want to loose my configs and customization.. my /home is a separate partition |
| 16:13.21 | Haohmaru | but i got stuff in /etc for sure |
| 16:13.23 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: that can be very hand. |
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| 16:13.39 | EdePopede | maybe have a 2nd system or a vm to potentially break things |
| 16:13.47 | horseshoecrab | Haohmaru: id take the approach of regularly backing up etc. but just not to "drop in place" when i came to restore / rebuild |
| 16:14.12 | horseshoecrab | more a reference. i might selectively just copy *some* stuff over network/interfaces perhaps |
| 16:14.33 | horseshoecrab | but never just all of it and expect to work - but that comes from bitter experience. :) |
| 16:14.40 | Haohmaru | right.. it originally never even passed thru my mind to do such things with /etc/ because i knew it has delicate things there.. untill nvz changed my mind |
| 16:15.12 | Haohmaru | and as i said, it appeared that it might work, and it also appeared that it can break horribly |
| 16:15.14 | Haohmaru | ;P~ |
| 16:15.29 | horseshoecrab | also this might be worth considering, even though i am fairly experienced i tend to "leave my own version and ignore package maintainers..." |
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| 16:15.42 | horseshoecrab | that gets you so far but eventually you'll be bitten in the arse. |
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| 16:15.59 | horseshoecrab | that time when you rebuild and need to migrate the etc crap over is a great chance to address that. |
| 16:16.32 | horseshoecrab | anyway... |
| 16:16.34 | horseshoecrab | hometime. |
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| 16:23.16 | generic | i really like the new firefox 70. But it's crashing so often |
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| 16:23.28 | generic | tabs crash |
| 16:23.41 | generic | the whole thing crashes |
| 16:23.58 | ratrace | must be why it's not packaged in debian :) |
| 16:24.33 | annadane | i think we're on 71 now |
| 16:24.48 | ratrace | yeah, though in sid only |
| 16:24.57 | annadane | yeah i just mean mozilla in general |
| 16:24.58 | greycat | 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1 |
| 16:25.21 | annadane | the question of should i use esr or not is one i wrestle with a lot and right now it's "no" |
| 16:25.22 | generic | ratrace is there any other release? |
| 16:25.29 | annadane | not in debian |
| 16:25.35 | annadane | stable, anyway |
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| 16:25.53 | annadane | firefox ESR is all you'll get in debian stable |
| 16:25.57 | annadane | which is 68 currently |
| 16:26.12 | generic | i like it for the fact that its using alsa |
| 16:26.31 | ratrace | annadane: why not though? |
| 16:26.45 | generic | however maybe updating is a good idea |
| 16:26.46 | ratrace | generic: you can try via snaps / snapd |
| 16:27.05 | annadane | ratrace, ? |
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| 16:27.10 | annadane | oh, why i don't use ESR |
| 16:27.15 | ratrace | annadane: why not ESR |
| 16:27.40 | annadane | right now it's just for reddit enhancement suite, and i think before that it was because of dns over https (though i think in esr 60 you could still set it in about:config) |
| 16:28.03 | ratrace | oh you actually _want_ that feature :) |
| 16:28.38 | annadane | maybe eventually i'll get tired of breakage or changes or whatever and use esr i guess |
| 16:28.55 | generic | how do i update one packet ? |
| 16:29.13 | greycat | generic: apt-get install whatever |
| 16:29.24 | greycat | and the English word you want here is "package" |
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| 16:30.55 | annadane | the browser is essentially the one thing i want a new version of |
| 16:31.09 | ratrace | btw, how is firefox 70 using alsa, I thought they default builds to pulseaudio since... many versions now. you'd need to recompile for alsa, no? |
| 16:31.18 | generic | annadane unlike me |
| 16:32.11 | generic | ratrace: dont ask me fresh sid and no pulse on it (double checked) |
| 16:32.50 | generic | ratrace: no apulse either |
| 16:33.22 | annadane | oh, you're running sid. |
| 16:33.36 | annadane | well, if you have any technical questions, go ask #debian-next on irc.oftc.net |
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| 16:35.38 | unborn | @generic: apt update packagename should solve your problem.. if you on sid, perhaps you should ask on debian-next channel, however sid runs very smooth.. |
| 16:35.58 | annadane | not apt update packagename |
| 16:36.02 | annadane | apt upgrade packagename |
| 16:36.06 | unborn | \ |
| 16:36.17 | greycat | as I already told them, it's "apt (or apt-get) install packagename" |
| 16:36.17 | annadane | apt update refreshes the mirror list |
| 16:36.22 | annadane | oh, right. |
| 16:36.29 | annadane | :| my memory is horrible, sorry. |
| 16:36.34 | unborn | annadane: yes your are correct.. |
| 16:36.38 | annadane | no, i'm not |
| 16:36.41 | annadane | greycat is |
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| 16:38.27 | nvz | technically apt update, updates the apt cache |
| 16:38.27 | unborn | apt update would only update current db apt upgrade will upgrade all installed packages and apt install package name would install your beasts.. I was incorrect how to update the installed packages.. sorry about that |
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| 16:39.13 | annadane | clearly debian is too difficult for me |
| 16:39.16 | unborn | it shout be su,.. then apt update && upgrade -y :) |
| 16:39.16 | annadane | goes to ubuntu |
| 16:39.25 | annadane | ugh -y |
| 16:39.35 | annadane | i like seeing what apt is doing first... |
| 16:39.35 | unborn | annadane: its easier then ubuntu trust me |
| 16:39.41 | annadane | i'm joking |
| 16:39.47 | greycat | unborn: the question was how to upgrade only ONE package. And the answer was "apt-get install whatever". |
| 16:40.20 | unborn | you will.. apt do-thingy will give you terminal output and also progress bar - which is beautiful |
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| 16:40.46 | greycat | you're allowed your opinion |
| 16:40.54 | nvz | apt install foo would install package foo, if its already installed and a newer version is available in the cache, it will upgrade, and if no newer version is available and its auto-installed it will be marked manually installed |
| 16:40.54 | apt | I think you lost me on that one, nvz |
| 16:41.18 | unborn | greycat: please correct me with your greatest know-how however I would do it is apt upgate and then apt upgrade package.. |
| 16:41.32 | greycat | "apt update" and "apt install mypkg" |
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| 16:42.17 | srged | why is my write speed higher then the read sped on my ssd ? |
| 16:42.27 | whislock | Write caching. |
| 16:42.29 | jelly | nvz: I _think_ apt in buster was fixed and keeps the auto flag unchanged on apt install foo |
| 16:42.42 | annadane | i'm highly suspicious of anyone who recommends using -y for apt operations |
| 16:42.46 | unborn | srged: what type of chips your ssd have mb or mx? |
| 16:42.53 | annadane | why not read the output first? |
| 16:43.19 | greycat | personally, I use "apt-get update" and "apt-get -u upgrade" so it tells me everything it wants to do |
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| 16:43.35 | srged | unborn: i dont know its a samsung evo 840 120gb |
| 16:43.37 | whislock | srged: Not sure why you're being asked that. Write caching will give the appearance of extremely fast writes. |
| 16:43.55 | unborn | annadane: you can try apt with test command? however since not on ubuntu I do not remember it run-dry could be? |
| 16:44.01 | srged | whislock: how do i avoid cashing ? |
| 16:44.02 | nvz | jelly: http://paste.debian.net/1120392/ |
| 16:44.10 | whislock | srged: What? Why on earth would you want to? |
| 16:44.17 | whislock | srged: Write caching is a good thing, it's there for a reason. |
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| 16:44.54 | jelly | nvz: well at least it tells you about it |
| 16:45.00 | srged | k |
| 16:45.16 | unborn | srged: since 3th gen of ss evos does run 3d nand with mx you should not feel the differences but if you run older version you could after few minutes of starting copying files |
| 16:45.30 | nvz | jelly: yeah well.. I THOUGHT it wouldnt do that if you said upgrade.. but it does it either way if no new version is available |
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| 16:46.54 | nvz | jelly: it'd make sense for it not to do it on upgrade.. cause you're TELLING it that you want to UPGRADE.. where when you tell it you want to install... if its already installed its understandable to take that to mean you want it manually installed |
| 16:47.32 | unborn | its normal.. even under windows.. mb degrade the speed as files or electronic impulses come into flow which means you would often would be left with slower speed while copying - something similar with cheap mirco cards in phones.. the more youre copying the slower process would be.. you can google it all.. |
| 16:47.47 | whislock | unborn: What the hell are you going on about? |
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| 16:49.26 | whislock | Write caching. Writes get cached in memory until the filesystem is synced. Memory absorbs writes a hell of a lot faster than the disk does. Simple. |
| 16:49.40 | unborn | whislock: Im sorry just google it.. he asked and I answered there is huge difference how flash memory process the things regards mb and mx types.. there are even helpful videos about it on youtube :) |
| 16:49.48 | Cerb | hi. I am trying to install the clisp package on debian stretch . it seems it is not in the repositories that I am using and I cannot find a source that tells me how to update them |
| 16:50.06 | whislock | unborn: Just stop, please. There's enough garbage information on the internet, we don't need to add to it here. |
| 16:50.13 | nvz | I think you're confusing Crucial MX and BX SERIES |
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| 16:50.24 | whislock | unborn: And no, he didn't ask. He asked why writes are faster than reads. Simple explanation. |
| 16:50.59 | greycat | ,v clisp |
| 16:51.00 | judd | Package: clisp on amd64 -- buster: 1:2.49.20180218+really2.49.92-3+b2; bullseye: 1:2.49.20180218+really2.49.92-3+b3; sid: 1:2.49.20180218+really2.49.92-3+b3 |
| 16:51.02 | unborn | sure. why I was even bothered. |
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| 16:51.29 | nvz | with the difference between slc, mlc, and tlc |
| 16:51.42 | whislock | None of which is relevant to the question. |
| 16:51.56 | Cerb | greycat: that is what i found on the wiki.debian page. But then what do I do with that line? |
| 16:52.00 | nvz | yeah.. well.. thats two different issues :P |
| 16:52.11 | greycat | There isn't a clisp package for stretch. Just buster. |
| 16:52.24 | Cerb | i see |
| 16:52.28 | Cerb | :( |
| 16:52.32 | greycat | You can either upgrade to buster, or attempt to backport the clisp package to stretch, or attempt to build upstream's clisp on stretch. |
| 16:52.45 | nvz | whislock: way I see it is, its easier to get them to understand something that doesnt exist in reality than understand the meaning of a question :P |
| 16:53.04 | whislock | nvz: If you can't dazzle with brilliance, baffle with bullshit? |
| 16:53.04 | nvz | there is no mb vs mx.. that is more easily verifyable :P |
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| 16:54.13 | Furry_Kitty | Has Debian finalized their decision about the init system? |
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| 16:54.28 | nvz | Furry_Kitty: what year is it? |
| 16:54.34 | whislock | Furry_Kitty: Debian's been using systemd for a long time now. |
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| 16:54.43 | Furry_Kitty | It appears they have decided to officially support systemd only |
| 16:54.48 | Haohmaru | eyeballz nvz |
| 16:54.49 | Cerb | greycat: thanks. all options (other than upgrading to buster) seem beyond what i am able to do. it is strange because i am trying to install a very old software that requires clisp...and wants version at least as new as one from 2006 |
| 16:54.52 | whislock | Sensible. |
| 16:54.56 | greycat | whislock: there is a vote upcoming about the init system, and all the systemd-haters are in a turmoil about it |
| 16:54.58 | annadane | no, but there's a current resolution |
| 16:55.05 | annadane | yeah what greycat said |
| 16:55.15 | annadane | it's systemd decision part 2 |
| 16:55.46 | Furry_Kitty | nvz It's 2019. I was not speaking of the default init system Debian is using, which is systemd for very good reasons. I was speaking about supporting other systems of which I don't see a point |
| 16:56.15 | whislock | greycat: When is that, anyway? |
| 16:56.18 | nvz | Furry_Kitty: sounds like you're speaking politics then.. not technicals.. and you're in the wrong place.. try reddit or something |
| 16:56.39 | greycat | Probably January, because of the holidays. |
| 16:56.43 | whislock | greycat: Thanks. |
| 16:56.44 | annadane | it was just a question |
| 16:57.01 | annadane | there's a page for the init system discussion, i just can't remember where it is |
| 16:57.06 | whislock | https://www.debian.org/vote/2019/vote_002 |
| 16:57.12 | unborn | eyeballs @ nvz |
| 16:57.22 | whislock | Actually, the voting period is open. |
| 16:57.23 | greycat | google... yeah, that |
| 16:57.37 | Furry_Kitty | I thought it was over |
| 16:57.41 | nvz | does a strip tease and wanders off since there are so many eyeballs on him |
| 16:57.42 | whislock | Who votes, and how does one vote? |
| 16:57.44 | annadane | so apparently voting lasts til dec. 27 or something |
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| 16:58.01 | greycat | that's a strange decision for the endpoint |
| 16:58.14 | Furry_Kitty | whislock : I don't think a random person online can vote there. |
| 16:58.28 | greycat | only Debian developers get a vote |
| 16:58.36 | whislock | Furry_Kitty: The first question was "who." |
| 16:59.15 | Furry_Kitty | The proposal for officially supporting systemd only had the most number of seconds. The last time I checked. |
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| 16:59.24 | unborn | whislock: debian developers as it was said.. |
| 16:59.24 | whislock | Still does. |
| 16:59.37 | whislock | unborn: No shit. I wasn't responding to you. |
| 17:00.04 | succ | hi |
| 17:00.09 | unborn | whislock: no shit I know.. but someone should tell you as it was mentioned before |
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| 17:00.25 | whislock | unborn: greycat already told me. |
| 17:00.34 | unborn | great |
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| 17:01.07 | Furry_Kitty | whislock : Is it that annoying for you to listen to two people speaking the same thing unknowingly? Lol |
| 17:01.24 | whislock | Furry_Kitty: Not at all. There's other context, here. |
| 17:01.40 | Furry_Kitty | Ok. good |
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| 17:02.35 | unborn | whislock: Im sorry did not know that.. please node. my apologies. |
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| 17:03.31 | karlpinc | Is there a way to check the installed packages to see that required(or even recommended) packages are installed? I'm thinking of what happens when apt (apt-get, etc.) start giving me choices about resolving conflicts and how to find out if bad choices have been made in the past. |
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| 17:04.12 | greycat | "apt-get -f install" should report any issues |
| 17:04.23 | Fyrdung | stable buster oldstable stretch |
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| 17:04.39 | greycat | oh hey, it's a tcl dictionary |
| 17:04.52 | Fyrdung | 'sudo apt-get -f install |
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| 17:06.46 | karlpinc | greycat: Thanks. I see the approach. I've never had to worry about this before but am walking onto a system which someone else has been administering and am afraid there's going to be cleanup required. |
| 17:07.28 | annadane | if i want to zero out a hard drive fully before installing debian, a) how long does it take roughly and b) it's just "dd if=dev/zero of=/dev/sda" and then install? |
| 17:07.30 | *** join/#debian television (~alex@unaffiliated/arexr) |
| 17:07.41 | jelly | karlpinc: don't do any install or upgrade or {dist,full}-upgrade before making sure sources and pinning are sane |
| 17:07.51 | greycat | missed a slash in if= |
| 17:08.10 | greycat | dd's default block size is rather small, so you might also want something like bs=64k |
| 17:08.12 | karlpinc | jelly: It's a little late for that. Which is why I asked. |
| 17:08.13 | annadane | yeah /dev/zero |
| 17:08.14 | eblip | hey i have installed okular on debian to opena an epub...but there is not the option to open a epub |
| 17:08.18 | eblip | any ideas |
| 17:08.21 | jelly | !pal karlpinc |
| 17:08.21 | dpkg | points at karlpinc and laughs hysterically |
| 17:08.34 | annadane | 64k really? not 1M? |
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| 17:08.39 | greycat | sure, whatever |
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| 17:08.47 | jelly | annadane: more is not worse in this case |
| 17:08.54 | greycat | just, the default block size of 512 bytes is small enough to be a noticeable source of slowness |
| 17:09.01 | annadane | this hard drive is 900+ GB, i'd be here all day if it were 64k :P |
| 17:09.11 | greycat | shakes head and sighs |
| 17:09.13 | jelly | if it's an SSD you might want to avoid writing, and do a SATA Secure Erase instead |
| 17:09.40 | jelly | doing that on an HDD will typically take similar amount of time as writing zeros |
| 17:10.13 | jelly | (unless it's a self-encrypting hdd, but those are typically sas and enterprisey) |
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| 17:11.10 | dka | Hi, I am looking for the name of the movie of the Bruce Lee's life. It's in two part and part 1 was when he was kid and went to US. what's the second movie ? |
| 17:11.19 | karlpinc | annadane: Secure erase is nice. As a bonus you can then make sure that there's enough free space reserved (0%-20%, depending on SSD quality) that you don't get write amplification. Best is to simply not partition the reserved space. |
| 17:11.20 | annadane | ................................ |
| 17:11.24 | rainfyre | lol |
| 17:11.28 | greycat | dka: try #debian-offtopic or something |
| 17:11.38 | annadane | i... give up on life |
| 17:11.45 | unborn | dka: it calls youtube |
| 17:13.01 | annadane | karlpinc, are you talking pure SSD or HDD too? |
| 17:13.28 | karlpinc | annadane: SSD. It's a flash memory thing. |
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| 17:16.59 | jim | dka, maybe search imdb.com for bruce lee documentary |
| 17:17.44 | dka | well, already tried, and it's a movie |
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| 17:19.59 | galvanoport | <dka> die hard 2 |
| 17:20.05 | karlpinc | annadane: SSDs can suffer from write amplification, which means very slow writing, forever, once the drive has started to get full. Spinning disks, if you're going to be tweaky, are faster on the outer cylinders because the heads don't have to move to the next track as often. So you can put the stuff you want to be really fast in (the) partition(s) at the beginning of the drive. |
| 17:20.47 | karlpinc | annadane: It's not worth tweaking the regular HDs IMO. |
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| 17:21.41 | karlpinc | annadane: Secure erase undoes the "forever slowness" of a SSD. |
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| 17:22.28 | whislock | It's called trim. |
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| 17:23.29 | unborn | dka: we are open source community supporting something else here.. we do not share files or torrents to illegal activity, we only share our knowledge and torrents leading to debian linux operating system. have good day - ALL. |
| 17:24.07 | annadane | good grie |
| 17:24.07 | annadane | f |
| 17:26.31 | unborn | man I wouldnt think they would check out ircs :D |
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| 17:26.49 | annadane | it wasn't even a 'i have adversaries' question, it was just like, making sure the drive was clean... or something... before installing |
| 17:26.58 | annadane | despite the fact the d_i probably does that already |
| 17:27.13 | greycat | It's simply not a thing one needs to do. |
| 17:27.13 | annadane | i'm not very smart |
| 17:27.49 | annadane | when i inevitably trash this computer then yeah i'll dd it |
| 17:27.55 | greycat | When you make a file system, it initializes whatever sectors it actually has to initialize and declares the rest of the disk to be "available", regardless of whatever rubbish is on it. |
| 17:28.07 | annadane | yeah yeah yeah. |
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| 17:30.38 | GenTooMan | if you wish to securely wipe a hard disk I've used shred it takes overnight on a 2T hard disk however. |
| 17:32.47 | unborn | GenTooMan: drill bit and drill.. few minutes like 2 minutes, rest could be microwaved in 2 minutes and there is zero... its shredded properly |
| 17:33.10 | annadane | WHAT are you TALKING about |
| 17:33.37 | greycat | unborn: wipe as in "reuse it afterward", not destroy |
| 17:33.44 | EdePopede | or throw it into an aluminium fire |
| 17:34.15 | GenTooMan | wiping a hard disk clean. you can't reformat a modern HD as that can only be done by the manufacturer. |
| 17:34.39 | GenTooMan | secure erase is the closest thing at this time to reformatting one. |
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| 17:36.51 | unborn | greycat: ah I see.. well.. yes - Im after night shift here it is 17:36 and I had been up since day before and before that time...I know not excuse for me.. I think I will get a sleep... that is perhaps I get destroy like wipe out.. means I am tired.. Im sorry about that. - but be devil and do destroy everything to lead towards you ;) night night. |
| 17:37.24 | jelly | GenTooMan: shred(1) with its 3 overwrites is probably overkill on modern disks |
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| 17:38.06 | unborn | EdePopede: not many of us can afford aluminium fire :) simpler would be just drill holes and burn data with radiation |
| 17:38.20 | unborn | ok ok Im off.. |
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| 17:38.32 | EdePopede | unborn: init 6 ;) |
| 17:38.53 | unborn | EdePopede: :) what else? |
| 17:38.56 | GenTooMan | jelly yes you are very likely right (almost wrote that write ... ) at the time I had some old maxtors and was doing those at the time. |
| 17:39.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1577] by debhelper |
| 17:39.33 | annadane | i will never memorize man page conventions enough to use (1) in casual conversation :P |
| 17:39.37 | GenTooMan | unborn sleep is not over rated. It leads to sanity. :D |
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| 17:40.26 | greycat | in this context, "shred(1)" means "the actual program whose name is shred, that you can execute as a command", as opposed to the English word, or the general concept of data shredding |
| 17:40.38 | annadane | oh that's fair enough then |
| 17:41.29 | unborn | GenTooMan: only open source and linux and human beings with love leads to sanity - yes sleep and sex too.. - man which part of the I am off you did not understood - now I am forced to dnd button - it looks nice somehow.. bey |
| 17:41.42 | jelly | annadane: uh, (1) for one normal command, (8) for root stuff requiring infinite power, (5) for file syntax, eg. hosts(5) ("hosts" has five letters) |
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| 17:42.09 | greycat | the main place you NEED to use it is "man 5 crontab" vs. "man 1 crontab" |
| 17:42.14 | jelly | ^ |
| 17:42.44 | GNU\colossus | just remember to have a look at man-pages(7) :^) |
| 17:43.13 | jelly | I won't ever remember man-pages. I can remember man man and man intro |
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| 17:44.21 | GenTooMan | I dare someone to do man ffmpeg :D |
| 17:44.39 | jak2000 | hi in my network 192.168.8.* i have a server that listen in 8006 port (proxmox server)... my question is, how to fin the server(which ip)? |
| 17:44.52 | greycat | *plonk* |
| 17:45.32 | annadane | man bash |
| 17:47.03 | unborn | GenTooMan: we use libav *plonk* - really off |
| 17:47.59 | unborn | GenTooMan have look @ avconv |
| 17:48.26 | jelly | ,v ffmpeg |
| 17:48.28 | judd | Package: ffmpeg on amd64 -- stretch: 7:3.2.14-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 7:3.2.14-1~deb9u1; buster: 7:4.1.4-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 7:4.1.4-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 7:4.2.1-2; sid: 7:4.2.1-2; stretch-multimedia: 10:3.3.9-dmo1+deb9u1; buster-multimedia: 10:4.1.4-dmo1+deb10u1; bullseye-multimedia: 10:4.2.1-dmo7; sid-multimedia: 10:4.2.1-dmo7 |
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| 17:48.46 | jelly | unborn: ffmpeg is available in debian. |
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| 17:49.43 | unborn | yes jelly I know.. I use debian myself. |
| 17:49.44 | hejux | yeah, sure |
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| 17:50.42 | unborn | jelly his is possibly on version bellow however - avconv provided me better past 3 years.. |
| 17:51.27 | unborn | - Im sleeping. now. |
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| 17:53.27 | furrykitty | s |
| 17:53.42 | furrykitty | Sorry that was a mistake |
| 17:54.09 | furrykitty | karlpinc : That's why there's trimming for |
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| 17:55.48 | NetTerminalGene | ,v firefox-esr |
| 17:55.49 | judd | Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; stretch: 60.7.1esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 60.9.0esr-1~deb9u1; jessie-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb9u2; buster: 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 68.2.0esr-1+b1; sid: 68.3.0esr-1 |
| 17:55.50 | jelly | jak2000: use nmap |
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| 17:56.10 | NetTerminalGene | what do you guys think about firefox update delay? |
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| 17:56.46 | annadane | i've read 68.3 isn't here yet (btw, be more specific) because stuff in stable has to be backported |
| 17:56.57 | annadane | or rather, backported for stable so firefox can migrate |
| 17:57.02 | annadane | i'm not certain though |
| 17:57.28 | jelly | jak2000: read the manual, but in general do some sort of tcp scan on -p 8006 on 192.168.8.1-254 (I'm assuming it's a /24 segment, if it's not you might need to include .0 and .255 as well) |
| 17:57.47 | greycat | Is the build toolset significantly different between f-esr 68.2 and 68.3? |
| 17:58.08 | annadane | no clue |
| 17:58.13 | jelly | mozilla does crazy things sometimes. |
| 17:58.37 | annadane | https://www.reddit.com/r/debian/comments/e7i5dp/delay_over_firefox_esr_6830/ |
| 17:58.52 | annadane | wrar's reply |
| 17:58.57 | jelly | and debian's insistence on bootstrapping the whole distro from itself can be problematic |
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| 17:59.16 | NetTerminalGene | thanks annadane . that explains |
| 17:59.33 | jelly | otherwise you'd be able to have binary packages that work on buster but can only be built in bullseye or sid |
| 17:59.38 | annadane | https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/rust-cbindgen isn't in testing yet, is apparently the reason |
| 17:59.45 | annadane | so it can't be backported |
| 17:59.51 | NetTerminalGene | why the heck an esr require new stuff anyways? |
| 18:00.03 | annadane | well i understand it when it's 8 version jumps |
| 18:00.08 | jelly | NetTerminalGene: ask mozilla. |
| 18:00.09 | annadane | a minor point release though yeah is weird |
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| 18:01.18 | jelly | keeps using /opt/firefox/firefox which self-updated last week or so |
| 18:02.08 | NetTerminalGene | so, what should we do? |
| 18:02.15 | annadane | it's in my home folder |
| 18:02.43 | annadane | well use sid and see if that package is buggy and file bugs i guess |
| 18:02.53 | jelly | !slap annadane |
| 18:02.53 | dpkg | strikes a resounding *THWAP* across annadane's face |
| 18:02.54 | annadane | (use sid on a separate machine i mean, obviously) |
| 18:03.04 | annadane | yeah, bad use of language |
| 18:03.05 | NetTerminalGene | -_- |
| 18:03.15 | annadane | i meant, install sid separately, fix bugs so stuff can migrate |
| 18:03.17 | jelly | let the bot slap myself for using binary builds from upstream, too |
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| 18:03.27 | jelly | !slap jelly |
| 18:03.27 | dpkg | strikes a resounding *THWAP* across jelly's face |
| 18:03.43 | GenTooMan | that sounded very messy |
| 18:04.08 | jelly | !slapstrike |
| 18:04.11 | annadane | (don't install firefox or rust-cbindgen from sid on your stable machine, that's not what i'm suggesting) |
| 18:04.25 | jelly | multislapping not implemented |
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| 18:04.45 | annadane | or basically: wait, until it becomes available in stable. *shrug* |
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| 18:04.59 | jelly | or use Mozilla's binary from their tarball |
| 18:05.09 | annadane | yarp |
| 18:05.10 | jelly | or don't start firefox for a couple days |
| 18:05.34 | annadane | can we just abandon browsers already and move back into the caves? |
| 18:06.46 | NetTerminalGene | i just switched to mozillan binary -_- |
| 18:06.50 | NetTerminalGene | after the news |
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| 18:07.42 | GenTooMan | nah we should go back to using gopher :D |
| 18:08.09 | NetTerminalGene | anyways, binary is more optimized |
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| 18:10.27 | pie3 | <pie3> >>> from collections import deque |
| 18:10.27 | pie3 | <pie3> what is better |
| 18:10.28 | pie3 | <pie3> & valid? |
| 18:10.28 | pie3 | <pie3> >>>import collections |
| 18:10.29 | pie3 | how? |
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| 18:14.46 | EdePopede | pie3: bettererst would maybe be to ask in the channel related to the language |
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| 18:21.39 | wrksx | How are you supposed to intall an older version of a package in debian? Not sure what happens, but I want to install an older version of mariaDB (10.3.17) but it only sees the 'current'version. |
| 18:21.54 | wrksx | ie 10.3.18 |
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| 18:22.45 | jhutchins_wk | !snapshot |
| 18:22.45 | dpkg | http://snapshot.debian.org/ is an archive of almost all Debian packages uploaded since 2005, including those removed from the official archives because they were very buggy, unusable, broken, vulnerable or in some way non-free. This service replaces snapshot.debian.net. http://www.debian.org/News/2010/20100412 |
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| 18:25.24 | wrksx | jhutchins_wk: thanks seems like what I want. |
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| 18:27.34 | jhutchins_wk | Note that the dpkg system does not support rollbacks, you'd have to uninstall and install the older version. There might be features implemented in the database that aren't backwards compatible, but that shouldn't happen with a minor version change. |
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| 18:28.43 | wrksx | jhutchins_wk: right, thanks for the warning. |
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| 18:30.58 | bitunix | exit |
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| 18:32.58 | jak2000 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 18:37.03 | liam_ | . |
| 18:39.00 | jak2000 | jelly? any advice thanks |
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| 18:40.34 | onla | I have wheezy on a vps, apt-get update W: Failed to fetch http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/wheezy-updates/non-free/binary-i386/Packages 404 Not Found [IP: 2001:67c:2564:a119::148:12 80] brings this... apt-get clean either. How can I fix my sources.list |
| 18:41.26 | somiaj | !wheezy sources.list |
| 18:41.26 | dpkg | Debian 7 "wheezy" is archived. A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for wheezy has one line: «deb http://archive.debian.org/debian wheezy main». Be sure to run «apt-get update». Also see <deb-src> <contrib> <non-free> <mirrors> <apt-spy> and «man sources.list». |
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| 18:41.44 | somiaj | I think wheezy has moved to archive.debian.org, now that lts support is over. |
| 18:41.51 | somiaj | !wheezy lts |
| 18:41.51 | dpkg | Security support for Debian 7 "Wheezy" from the Debian Security Team ended on 2016-04-25. The amd64, i386, armel and armhf architectures receive additional long term support (LTS) via <wheezy/updates> until 2018-05-31. See http://deb.li/2aC for excluded packages. No changes to /etc/apt/sources.list are needed for wheezy-lts. limited commercial support extending further on exists in form of <elts> |
| 18:42.16 | somiaj | in general if your system is exposed to the internet, you shouldn't be running wheezy anymore |
| 18:42.22 | nyov | it has wheezed it's last breath |
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| 18:44.52 | nyov | probably more useful to add a jessie/stretch source and upgrade than the wheezy archive |
| 18:45.42 | nyov | but I'm curious, do the archived releases get latest debian security updates merged into it before being archived? |
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| 18:46.12 | greycat | Yeah. Via one final point release, I think. |
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| 18:49.10 | nyov | okay, was always curious but couldn't verify it |
| 18:49.49 | onla | thanks |
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| 18:51.58 | greycat | wheezy support ended May 31, 2016 and they put out wheezy 7.11 on June 4 |
| 18:52.05 | jak2000 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 18:53.26 | oooo_ | hy |
| 18:54.41 | greycat | by |
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| 18:55.59 | somiaj | Wonder if/how any of the LTS updates make it to the archive. |
| 18:56.32 | tom_work | How can I install Debian Sarge? |
| 18:56.45 | tom_work | I can't seem to find a package archive |
| 18:56.50 | somiaj | tom_work: check out archive.debian.org |
| 18:57.19 | whislock | Did you just say "sarge"? |
| 18:57.22 | tom_work | somiaj, will the netsinst work or do I need to do something special like build a custom install disk |
| 18:57.26 | somiaj | http://archive.debian.org/README |
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| 18:57.55 | somiaj | The netinstall won't, maybe you could point the netboot at the archive, I think the archive also has copies of sarges installer |
| 18:58.12 | somiaj | also seems that wheezy/updates got coppied over to archive.debian.org which will contain LTS updates |
| 18:58.51 | somiaj | oh nevermind, seems they don't do that anymore, (instead use point release) wonder if they sneak in the LTS updates or not. |
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| 18:59.02 | tom_work | somiaj, sources too? |
| 18:59.19 | somiaj | yes, archive contains both binary and sources, though really old releases only sources. |
| 18:59.31 | tom_work | ok, phew. that's good |
| 18:59.35 | somiaj | I think buzz, rex and bo only have sources, but somewhere in there they also have binary |
| 18:59.43 | greycat | Sarge is pretty freakin' old. |
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| 19:01.15 | tom_work | somiaj, Are you sure about the installer? I can't find it |
| 19:01.46 | somiaj | https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/archive/ |
| 19:01.53 | somiaj | seems the cdimage archive is separate |
| 19:02.24 | greycat | "/msg dpkg archive" => ..."Old Debian <ISO> files are archived at http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/archive/" |
| 19:04.13 | tom_work | greycat, can you clarify the syntax? |
| 19:05.36 | greycat | the what |
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| 19:06.44 | tom_work | crap, only the netinst are there |
| 19:06.57 | tom_work | and a 'business card' cd |
| 19:07.04 | greycat | So, install a minimal system, add archive-based sources, and add packages. |
| 19:07.13 | tom_work | all the other cds are misssing except for checksums |
| 19:07.19 | tom_work | *dvds |
| 19:07.42 | tom_work | dpkg archive sarge i386 |
| 19:07.42 | dpkg | tom_work: bugger all, i dunno |
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| 19:10.28 | X200-1984 | Hola |
| 19:10.33 | karlpinc | tom_work: The installer should let you choose from where you install. You can point it to the archive. (If nothing else, by editing sources.list in a vt. But that shouldn't be necessary.) |
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| 19:13.09 | greycat | or, spend the bare minimum amount of time in the installer, and just add the additional pkgs you want after booting into the installed system |
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| 19:14.10 | wrksx | jhutchins_wk: worked perfectly ty. |
| 19:14.21 | wrksx | (the debian archive) |
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| 19:15.15 | somiaj | karlpinc: I think you need to be careful there, the standard installer installs the base system from the installer (not where you point it to), the exepctio to this is the netboot image. |
| 19:15.34 | genericum | and there i was Thinking that |
| 19:16.06 | genericum | updating Firefox might solve the problem |
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| 19:16.25 | genericum | it did for 1/2 hour |
| 19:16.57 | genericum | until it exited due to channel error |
| 19:17.34 | genericum | no big deal essentially but private browsing is now useless |
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| 19:18.44 | X200-1984 | HI |
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| 19:19.27 | genericum | however chromium crashing firefox crashing I miss my 2.6 kernel |
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| 19:27.52 | dka | unborn, I was not asking for a torrent, just a movie title |
| 19:30.30 | karlpinc | I don't use apt-get a whole lot. Does it (by default) always ask before removing packages? |
| 19:31.42 | karlpinc | I'm trying to see what it wants to do without doing it. --trivial-only seems to abort kind of early, telling me that it's not removing a package but I see "260 not upgraded" and I wonder what they are. |
| 19:34.43 | somiaj | apt-get asks for conformation if it ever has to do more than you told it to |
| 19:34.56 | somiaj | so if you say apt-get remove package1, but package2 also needs to be remoed, it will ask. |
| 19:35.07 | ksk | how about "--simulate"? :P |
| 19:35.21 | somiaj | simulate won't ask, it will just tell you what would have gotten removed |
| 19:35.56 | somiaj | but the install is the same way, if it has to install more packages than the one you asked for it will ask |
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| 19:42.22 | karlpinc | somiaj: Thanks. |
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| 19:59.15 | greycat | Well, I bit the bullet and upgraded my containered VPS wheezy system to jessie, by forcing the init system to remain decrepit. Because 2.6 kernel. Can't systemd. But I haven't rebooted it yet. |
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| 20:05.42 | nyov | tom_work: still looking for sarge cds? |
| 20:11.03 | nyov | tom_work: or dvds? https://paste.debian.net/1120415/ |
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| 20:13.30 | tom_work | nyov, ah, so the jigdo thing. thank you |
| 20:14.06 | somiaj | the netinstall should be sufficent provided you have network access. |
| 20:14.23 | greycat | that's, like, 4 times we've said it now, I think... |
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| 20:27.13 | tom_work | netinst doesn't work |
| 20:27.15 | tom_work | I've tried |
| 20:27.35 | tom_work | does jidgo verify downloads via GPG? |
| 20:27.46 | greycat | it catches on fire? it fails to boot with an "out of cheese" error? |
| 20:28.27 | tom_work | close, it fails to recognize archive as a valid repo |
| 20:28.48 | tom_work | and the printer is on fire |
| 20:28.51 | greycat | so what? you just complete the installation, boot into the system, and edit files by hand to make 'em work. |
| 20:29.19 | tom_work | greycat, can't complete an install with nothing but the netinst content |
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| 20:30.11 | greycat | well then file a bug report against this 15 year old oh wait |
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| 20:30.35 | tom_work | now your getting it |
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| 20:31.18 | greycat | No, now I'm ignoring you, because YOU ARE STATING THINGS THAT FLY IN THE FACE OF COMMON SENSE AND OF EVERYONE'S EXPERIENCE, without giving any actual details to back up these outlandish claims. |
| 20:33.43 | tom_work | cool it |
| 20:34.47 | humbot | you're |
| 20:37.16 | somiaj | netinstall contains a base system, install the base system, boot into it, and go from there |
| 20:37.31 | somiaj | but really the question is why are you trying to install sarge? |
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| 21:02.40 | physiology_ | Is it possible to set up an installation so that it is "reinstalled" to factory fresh on a nightly basis? |
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| 21:03.36 | petn-randall | physiology_: You mean a kiosk/live system? |
| 21:04.01 | greycat | A virtual machine that you "restore" from a saved image daily? |
| 21:05.25 | physiology_ | A machine installed on bare bones hardware. |
| 21:05.39 | physiology_ | VM I could probably figure out, I was just thinking there could be like a "reinstall" cronjob. |
| 21:05.43 | greycat | What I'm saying is, do the other thing instead of that thing. |
| 21:05.56 | physiology_ | ha |
| 21:06.28 | physiology_ | We have to try it on hardware next. I could reinstall manually daily, but I was hoping you guys might know a better way. |
| 21:06.46 | greycat | (thought that's what I was SAYING...) |
| 21:06.48 | somiaj | well you could reimage the harddrive, but you can't do this while the os is running. |
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| 21:07.05 | greycat | !wayttd |
| 21:07.05 | dpkg | What Are You Trying To Do? |
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| 21:08.57 | physiology_ | Never afraid to get torn apart by a room of Linux guys. :). I am trying to start from a base installation each morning (after we ruin the machine with testing during the day). |
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| 21:10.02 | greycat | and the reason you won't use a virtual machine, when this is like 100% absolutely clearly what a VM is intended for...? |
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| 21:11.49 | physiology_ | Because we've been asked to test on physical machines now! We've found that some of the work that we are developing works on VMs but not physical. So we must test physical now to be sure. |
| 21:11.55 | physiology_ | I guess manual instal is the only answer? |
| 21:12.58 | greycat | Well, the "real hardware" way is to copy the disk image to a disk, once a day, which will take a few hours. So, you probably want to have THREE copies of each hard drive -- the master, the one in use being destroyed, and the one you'll use next morning. |
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| 21:13.43 | greycat | Come in, remove the destroyed disk, put in the one you copied yesterday, and begin the next copy onto the destroyed disk, to be used tomorrow. |
| 21:14.26 | greycat | see also /msg greybot b21 |
| 21:15.03 | greycat | (and b25 and b26) |
| 21:15.28 | physiology_ | They aren't on this channel? |
| 21:15.35 | physiology_ | Thanks for the answers, by the way. |
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| 21:18.11 | somiaj | physiology_: any reason these tests can't be done on a live system? |
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| 21:18.15 | nyov | ,v clonezilla |
| 21:18.15 | judd | Package: clonezilla on amd64 -- jessie: 3.10.11-1; stretch: 3.21.13-1; buster: 3.27.16-3; bullseye: 3.35.2-1; sid: 3.35.2-1 |
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| 21:18.46 | nyov | https://clonezilla.org/ |
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| 21:19.12 | physiology_ | somiaj: They will be done on a live system throughout the day. Then, at night, I'm aiming to reset the system through some automated means. |
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| 21:19.22 | physiology_ | So that there is a free build to break every morning. |
| 21:19.42 | somiaj | physiology_: I don't think we are using 'live system' to mean the same thing. |
| 21:20.12 | somiaj | physiology_: but you cuold use live-build to build a live system, boot from this live system, and do everything form the live system. Once the live system is shut down, it will always boot back to its initial state. |
| 21:20.16 | greycat | You cannot remove and reimage a physical disk "automatically" unless you program a robot to open up the machine, remove the disk, etc. |
| 21:20.35 | somiaj | physiology_: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_CD |
| 21:20.50 | physiology_ | Oh, I see. |
| 21:21.01 | physiology_ | I suppose that a live system would work, then. |
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| 21:21.32 | somiaj | depending on what you can do, this can be memeory intensive (since the whole system is being run in memeory and not from a physical hd) |
| 21:22.04 | physiology_ | This is good to be talking it out with you guys. somiaj, that makes sense and at least is a place to start. |
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| 21:22.14 | somiaj | but if what you are doing can be done from a live system, this can avoid the whole imagagin process, just boot the live system, destory it you want, then reboot and you are back to your base case (though you may need to learn to build your own custom live systems) |
| 21:22.15 | physiology_ | Failing that, a bit of manual work needs to be done |
| 21:22.56 | somiaj | debian live has tools and documents on how to build a custom live system (using live-build) from debian. |
| 21:24.12 | physiology_ | This could be a fun project. I've never been in that world. |
| 21:24.12 | nyov | physiology_: clonezilla can re-image harddisks from a central server over the network. |
| 21:24.20 | andres833 | Hi everyone, anyone had trouble with ssh cipher when try access to old server with a Debian version old? thanks |
| 21:24.27 | physiology_ | nyov: Can it be automated/scripted? |
| 21:24.55 | nyov | physiology_: if your client machines can be booted WOL, should work |
| 21:25.03 | nyov | Wake-On-Lan, that is |
| 21:25.39 | somiaj | physiology_: though imaging can take some time, hence I like greycat's idea of having multiple disks you swap around, so the imagaing is happening while you are working on the days system. |
| 21:25.54 | nyov | but check the docs. I remember we used norton ghost for that and windows clients |
| 21:25.54 | physiology_ | I gotcha. I see no reason that they couldn't be. I'm not configuring it to any compliance level. Just plain install. |
| 21:25.56 | somiaj | physiology_: depending on the image size, it could take hours for the image to work over the network. |
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| 21:26.27 | physiology_ | Thanks, guys. I have a Plan A and a Plan B. |
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| 21:31.49 | physiology_ | On the greybot messages: I *did* say the restrictions from the start! haha |
| 21:31.58 | annadane | btw do people want firefox migrated to Stable due to a security issue? |
| 21:32.03 | annadane | 68.2 -> 68.3 |
| 21:32.08 | annadane | i'm not in the loop |
| 21:32.36 | greycat | Near as I can tell you've never given any reason for having to do it on "bare metal". |
| 21:33.44 | somiaj | annadane: DSA went out this morning, anyone with security soruces should update. |
| 21:33.49 | annadane | there's a link where you can see the security status for individual packages but i forget how to find it |
| 21:34.16 | annadane | https://tracker.debian.org/news/1085667/accepted-firefox-esr-6830esr-1deb10u1-source-into-stable-embargoed-stable/ ah |
| 21:35.00 | greycat | Unpacking firefox-esr (68.3.0esr-1~deb10u1) over (68.2.0esr-1~deb10u1) ... |
| 21:35.11 | greycat | (so, now what broke...) |
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| 21:35.59 | jhutchins_wk | physiology_: What about the idea of taking one snapshot, then restoring that every day. They do that for computer labs. |
| 21:36.32 | jhutchins_wk | physiology_: The other thing they do is have a master image on a server and boot to that image every day, without the ability to write back to the master. |
| 21:36.53 | physiology_ | jhutchins_wk: That ties in with using Clonezilla (or some similar solution), I think. Some centralized server would be required, but yeah. |
| 21:37.08 | physiology_ | jhutchins_wk: I appreciate it. :) |
| 21:37.16 | greycat | Oh, that's a reasonable alternative too. Diskless clients that boot from the net. |
| 21:37.25 | BazookaTooth | drbl |
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| 21:38.45 | BazookaTooth | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskless_remote_boot_in_linux |
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| 21:51.49 | tukta | how do I get xfce to populate my username in lightdm ? or how do I do session control seems I have > 1 session |
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| 23:25.06 | karlpinc | jhutchins: Do they pxe boot and have their initrd copy the image (if necessary) to a local hd and pivot root? |
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| 23:57.21 | tom_work | physiology, you could mount all your system partitions read-only and use a tmpfs overlay for /home which will zero itself every reboot. then just schedule reboots in cron. I don't know if this will work with systemd though so you may have to replace it with sysv or any other init |
| 23:57.46 | tom_work | look at how OpenWRT handles overlays |
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