IRC log for #debian on 20191213

00:00.01somiajthe software should do the same thing everytime giving the same conditions, so some conditions are changing between boots, which leads to firmware/memeory.
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01:30.58*** topic/#debian is Current Debian release is buster, 10.2 point release /msg dpkg 10.2; /msg dpkg buster; /msg dpkg stretch->buster; /msg dpkg apt suite changed | Oldstable Stretch: /msg dpkg stretch; /msg dpkg 9.11; 9.11 needs dist-upgrade | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog
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04:13.24somiajis it possible to UNSET an enviroment variable in a current running tmux, all my new shells inherit an env var that I would like to just unset
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04:13.57somiajI can unset it in a current running shell easy enough, but how about the shell tmux is inheriting its default envvars from?
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04:42.30at0m,v mpv
04:42.31juddPackage: mpv on amd64 -- jessie: 0.6.2-2; stretch: 0.23.0-2+deb9u2; stretch-security: 0.23.0-2+deb9u2; buster: 0.29.1-1; bullseye: 0.30.0-1; sid: 0.30.0-1; stretch-multimedia: 1:0.27.2-dmo1+deb9u1; buster-multimedia: 1:0.29.1-dmo2; bullseye-multimedia: 1:0.30.0-dmo1; sid-multimedia: 1:0.30.0-dmo1
04:43.26annadaneevery time you don't /msg the bot, a kitten dies
04:43.39dvsdo it again!
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04:56.43nyovWith virtualbox going out of style in debian, is there a way for me to move a handful oldish activated windows VMs over to qemu, by emulating vbox hardware well enough that the OS won't ask for reactivation?
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05:13.20nvznyov: upstream packages work well enough for me that I just keep using virtualbox
05:14.07nvznyov: I just installed the new 6.1 upstream package, fixed issues I had with guest additions and now supports linux 5.x
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05:24.09nvzdpkg, vbox-install buster is <reply>Lucas Nussbaum maintains an unofficial and unsupported backport of the sid package at https://people.debian.org/~lucas/virtualbox-buster/ and you can install the upstream package by doing: echo "deb [arch=amd64] https://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian buster contrib" | pkexec tee -a /etc/apt/sources.list.d/virtualbox.list && wget -q
05:24.11dpkgokay, nvz
05:24.15nvzhttps://www.virtualbox.org/download/oracle_vbox_2016.asc -O- | pkexec apt-key add - && pkexec apt update && pkexec apt install virtualbox-6.1
05:24.18nvzmeh
05:25.00nvzdpkg vbox-install buster =~ s#wget -q#wget -q https://www.virtualbox.org/download/oracle_vbox_2016.asc -O- | pkexec apt-key add - && pkexec apt update && pkexec apt install virtualbox-6.1#
05:25.00dpkgnvz: that's too long
05:25.11nvzdpkg vbox-install buster =~ s#wget -q#wget -q https://www.virtualbox.org/download/oracle_vbox_2016.asc -O- | pkexec apt-key add - && pkexec apt update#
05:25.11dpkgnvz: that's too long
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05:25.25nvzwe will have a longer discussion in /msg :P
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05:30.30nvzupdated <virtualbox>, added <vbox-install buster> and <vbox buster backport> factoids.
05:30.38nvzdpkg, vbox-install buster
05:30.38dpkgYou can install the upstream package by doing: echo "deb [arch=amd64] https://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian buster contrib" | pkexec tee -a /etc/apt/sources.list.d/virtualbox.list && wget -q https://www.virtualbox.org/download/oracle_vbox_2016.asc -O- | pkexec apt-key add - && pkexec apt update && pkexec apt install virtualbox-6.1 see also <vbox buster backport>
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05:32.13nvzdpkg, vbox-install buster
05:32.13dpkgAsk me about <vbox buster backport> or install the upstream package by doing: echo "deb [arch=amd64] https://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian buster contrib" | pkexec tee -a /etc/apt/sources.list.d/virtualbox.list && wget -q https://www.virtualbox.org/download/oracle_vbox_2016.asc -O- | pkexec apt-key add - && pkexec apt update && pkexec apt install virtualbox-6.1
05:32.20nvzthat works better I guess
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05:35.37echosystmi read somewhere nftables might be replaced with something else in future, but i can't find it now
05:36.03echosystmwhats the most future proof thing right now? iptables? nftables? some other thing?
05:36.04nvzreally I believe in most cases we should be using pkexec instead of sudo in documenting things.. cause 1) neither is in base, sudo only installed if no rootpw set, but pkexec is installed with any DE 2) pkexec takes modern freedesktop.org standards and security concerns into consideration
05:36.07jm_surely you mean iptables and nftables?
05:36.20echosystmno, im aware nftables deprecates iptables
05:36.20nvzechosystm: nftables is the new thing, that replaces iptables
05:36.30nvzdpkg, nftables
05:36.30dpkgnftables is the next generation of iptables, incorporating both v4 and v6: https://wiki.debian.org/nftables
05:36.32jm_I certainly hope you are wrong
05:36.36echosystmbut i read somewhere that theres some even newer thing coming around
05:36.45echosystm(which i really hope is untrue lol)
05:37.16echosystmi haven't done server stuff for a while - is buster fully onboard with nftables at this point?
05:37.23echosystmor are we still in a transitional phase?
05:37.24jm_the only thing I can think of is something using BPF
05:37.59jm_specifically bpfilter
05:38.06echosystmthat might be it
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05:38.33nvzand ebtables but that is a specific use case
05:38.35echosystmit sounds familiar
05:40.07echosystmalso, whats the state of systemd in buster? i think last time i was messing with servers i was on jesse and it seemed like debian hadn't fully bought in yet to the level of centos etc.
05:40.24nvzwe're all in on systemd in buster
05:40.30echosystmcool
05:40.34echosystmand nftables?
05:40.39nvzjust certain bits are still iffy
05:40.47nvzand nftables too
05:40.53echosystmcool
05:41.08echosystmgood. looks like i'll be using debian then :)
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05:42.02Unit193echosystm: There's a question for bullseye as to go systemd-only, require support for non-systemd, or do best efforts.
05:42.52Unit193https://www.debian.org/vote/2019/vote_002
05:43.54echosystmah i see!
05:44.09echosystmso buster still has a lot of init script stuff, not just systemd config files?
05:44.36echosystmi've been out of the game for a while and dont remember the details of how systemd was implemented in debian last time
05:44.57nvzthe files may still be included to support non-systemd use.. but systemd doesn't use those.. it can use such files to build units..
05:45.01jm_well with so many packages not everything has been convereted to systemd
05:45.18Unit193nvz: Systemd does use init scripts.
05:45.55echosystmfrom memory, the redhat world had gone all in on systemd and that was the only option
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05:46.07nvzUnit193: that'd be news to me.. all I seen was that it can build a unit from sysvinit scripts not use them directly
05:46.11echosystmwhereas debian was only using systemd to bridge the old init stuff or something to that effect
05:46.29jm_redhat has quite smaller amount of packages compared to debian
05:46.48Unit193nvz: I believe the unit files are basically 'run init script'.  A *lot* of packages only have init scripts which systemd sort of translates.
05:46.50jm_no, some stuff has been fully convreted to systemd, but as I said above, not all
05:46.56jm_debian is full in on systemd
05:47.01echosystmof course. dont get me wrong, im a debian fanboy. i'll take it over rhel.centos any day haha.
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05:47.15Unit193jm_: Can you define 'full in'?
05:47.32jm_Unit193: as in there's no way back
05:47.34echosystmjust for this particular project i want to go all in on the "latest standards"
05:47.53Unit193jm_: Please see the link I just posted, that's not yet accurate.  It's actually the question being posed.
05:48.10nvzyeah well this has been a rocky time for that.. kind of like the period when we'd faced devfs, hal, udev transitions
05:48.11jm_Unit193: I am aware of it, what I said above is reality though :)
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05:48.36nvzthere are a lot of things like wayland, python3 migration, etc.. that have things kind of up in the air
05:48.41Unit193jm_: Not really, I have a sid system with Xfce that uses sysvinit.
05:49.13jm_Unit193: yeah, I know, I also had systems using sysvinit until lately and still could
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05:56.37echosystmso tldr; in terms of the latest "standards", do you think buster or latest centos is a better choice?
05:56.46echosystmor no difference?
05:57.26nvzI couldn't give two cents about centos
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05:59.33jm_you're in #debian, what do you expect to hear? :)
06:00.03echosystma more balanced opinion than i would get in #centos :P
06:00.09echosystmprobsbly less hostile too
06:01.12echosystmmy interactions with the rhel community havent been as positive as here
06:01.17nvzyeah, cause people who use the original debian, not one of a billion spinoffs, are likely to go using a spinoff of a totally different system :P
06:01.27Unit193It wouldn't surprise me if CentOS had more native units than Debian did, but as far as "standards" go..
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06:03.26nvzsince I found debian I've only installed two other linux OSes, SLES cause someone else was paying for me to get a CompTIA Linux+, figured I may as well glance at the OS its based on.. and GUIXSD cause after watching a debconf talk about it, I just had to see somethng so ridiculous with my own eyes. neither I used more than maybe an hour
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06:05.02jm_is GUIXSD a thing with multiple versioned packages coexisting or something along that line (perhaps each package in its own dir instead)? I've heard of the name, just don't remember the details
06:05.46nvzjm_: thats guix, yes, and GuixSD is the distro.. guix itself is just the whole shebang that they think can co-exist inside other distros... but I shave, so GuixSD isn't for me.. heh.. you gotta have a neck beard to at least your sternum.. heh
06:07.12nyovsomething like nixos? kinda wish debian could go that road a little bit, with multiple package versions co-installable
06:10.27nyovI mean, some package already do co-installs. Just make it somehow global, like multiarch did for arch's, and enhance update-alternatives to handle package versions, or something along those lines
06:10.47nvzidk what nixos is, but guix is crazy.. you can have not just multiple versions but compiled against multiple different versions of deps and such.. each specific build gets a UUID kinda deal attached to its version number and everything is all symlinked into a tangled web and you manipulate symlinks and path vars to use different ones your ps output shows mile long strings of symlinked binaries with UUID type
06:10.53nvzcrap..
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06:11.42nvzits one of those things you just have to see to believe
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06:13.32nvzhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2XS92qrLUc  [My crush on GNU Guix - Vagrant Cascadian - DebConf18]
06:14.06nvzplays like one of those aliens documentaries.. you just gotta see it..
06:15.34nyovoh yeah, I saw that. https://meetings-archive.debian.net/pub/debian-meetings/2018/DebConf18/2018-08-03/
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06:47.26pragomerhi I got a question about cryptsetup/luks: I used passphrase "a" for both: my systemdrive and an external usb drive. now I wanted to change the passphrase for my system from "a" to passphrase "b". it worked. after verifying, I did "cryptseup luksRemoveKey /dev/sdx" to my root partition and deleted passphrase "a" from it. But after that, the key was also removed from my external usb drive. and i could only open it with pw "b". Is this
06:47.27pragomernormal?
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07:47.20MaxFrameshello
07:48.18MaxFrameslast week I created a debian virtual machine running on windows server hyper-v; it ran smoothly for a few days; then suddenly yesterday it stopped responding; I was offsite so I couldn't diagnose; today I found this situation:
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07:49.40MaxFramesthe vm was running on the hyper-v host, but would not respond to pings or accept any connections; I opened the hyper-v console (i.e. display the gui of the vm) and I found that it was displaying the logon screen (as expected) but with some artifacts that after a few seconds disappeared
07:49.53MaxFramesimmediately after that, the vm started responding again
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07:50.17MaxFramesso I connected via ssh and started journalctl to see what happened
07:50.47MaxFramesthe last "normal" entry was around 11.30 am yesterday, then absolutely nothing until the moment I connected to the console and "resurrected" the vm
07:52.01MaxFramesI will pastebin some relevant lines in journalctl, but what sprung to my attentionin particular is a "rcu: INFO: rcu_sched self-detected stall on CPU" followed by "rcu: rcu_sched kthread starved for 190768 jiffies!"
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07:53.18MaxFramesan immediate question is: does debian 10 already have (as in "installed by default") all the daemons and services required to run as an hyper-v guest? I think so, but can you confirm? just to rule out the cause being some missing integration component
07:53.56MaxFramesaround the time the issue happened, I was doing maintenance on the hosts, so the vm got live migrated from host 1 to host 2 and then back to host 1, one of these live migrations _may_ have caused the issue
07:54.12MaxFramesbtw this morning I live migrated it again back and forth, and it is still working
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08:00.41MaxFrameshttps://paste.debian.net/1120869/ => this is a paste of the first entries in journalctl after the vm was "resurrected"
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08:12.54MaxFramesthe only best practice that I didn't follow for a linux guest on hyper-v was to set a static mac address (apparently linux does not like it to change dynamically, which can happen when the vm is live migrated); I fixed this now, but I doubt it was the cause of the "cpu stall"
08:13.41MaxFrameswhat is surprising is that the vm resumed smoothly... no errors, no kernel panic, it just kicked back to life by just "touching" it... it looks more like it was hibernated, but I (think I have) disabled suspend
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08:15.49MaxFramesbtw can you point me to a definitive surefire guide to disable all energy saving functions on debian buster?
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08:20.16MaxFramesis this authoritative?
08:20.19MaxFrameshttps://wiki.debian.org/Suspend
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08:20.45MaxFrames"sudo systemctl mask sleep.target suspend.target hibernate.target hybrid-sleep.target" => disables all types of suspension in debian 10?
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08:34.29MaxFramestime zone is killing me
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08:53.42Eryn_1983_FLhey guys i installed samba or reinstalled it and now my samba is not starting again
08:53.45Eryn_1983_FLhttps://paste.debian.net/1120883/
08:53.49Eryn_1983_FLnot sure what going on
08:54.29Mathisenam i just dumb or why is blkid missing from util-linux ?
08:54.50Mathisenutil-linux is already the newest version (2.33.1-0.1). zsh: command not found: blkid
08:55.39Mathisennevermind.... i was dumb needed root priv
08:56.10WaveHuskyHow can I specifically view init(8) and not init(1)?
08:57.14jm_man 8 init
08:58.18MaxFrameshi jm_
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08:58.38jm_heya
08:59.00MaxFramesI trust your knowledge, so if you could have a look at the backlog, whenever able, that'd be great :)
08:59.53MaxFramesin short, my buster vm apparently "froze" for one day and I'm not sure why; I hope I have solved it by disabling all suspend features, but tbh I don't know what happened
09:00.26MaxFramesthere is a possibility it doesn't like hyper-v or being live migrated
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09:01.25jm_MaxFrames: I saw it when you posted, but I am really not up to speed with what you asked about, I only ever use very old suspend methods s2disk (not anymore really) and s2ram, as for hyperv stuff, I've only ever got in contact with it when they created a development VM for me :)
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09:01.51MaxFramesok np :P
09:02.15jm_in general suspend is normally user triggered, and you would see it in logs I believe, so I doubt that was it
09:02.35jm_but what you said about MAC might be something that matches non-working pings
09:02.52MaxFramesgenerally speaking, what does "self detected cpu stall" mean?
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09:03.44MaxFramesI don't think it was the dynamic mac thing btw, because that would not explain journalctl not having recorded any events for one entire day
09:04.07jm_have daily cron jobs at 6:25 also not run?
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09:04.18MaxFramesnothing ran, based on those logs
09:04.43MaxFramesthere is a gaping hole from 11:30 am yesterday to 8:30 am today when I connected to the console
09:04.53jm_I would focus on hyperv side of things to inspect things, i.e. if it shows guest activity status and so on
09:04.59MaxFramesit smells like some issue with the hypervisor
09:05.06jm_(like CPU, memory, block devices)
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09:10.50MaxFrameshttps://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/RCU/stallwarn.txt => this is far too complicated for my knowledge
09:12.22jm_yeah RCU mechanis has that built in, it's a novel but quite advanced concept
09:12.40jm_well not so novel anymore :)
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09:29.14hejux_i don't get it, ping6 is a link to /bin/ping, ping6 ipv4host.com returns error, ping ipv4host.com returns ipv4 address, what's the magic here?
09:30.25jm_well it can check how it was run and change behaviour based on that, so obviously in one case it's AAAA lookup, which does not work for you?
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09:33.54hejux_i mean, if ping6 is a symbolic link to ping, why does ping6 forces ipv6 only?
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09:34.39jm_what's the exact error you get?
09:34.43hejux_ping6 is not an alias, not a function, but a soft link to ping.
09:36.16hejux_jm_: using ping6 to ping a ipv4 only host, No address associated with hostname, ping6 on a dual address host, Network is unreachable.
09:36.26Unit193hejux_: It can know what binary is being called though, that's how busybox works too (link 'ls' to busybox, etc.) even firejail has this function to sandbox specific applications.
09:36.33hejux_i have only ipv4 on local
09:36.40jm_hejux_: then it won't work
09:37.11hejux_Unit193: that makes sense, how does a soft link know that ping6 is ping -6 ?
09:37.53Unit193'ping' knows you are calling 'ping6', so it works accordingly.
09:37.54jm_very simplified version: if (!strcmp(argv[0], "ping6"))
09:38.05Unit193↑
09:38.48hejux_jm_: thanks for the info, get it now.
09:38.57jm_no problem
09:39.32hejux_this is crazy, some old system does not have 'ping -6' only have ping6, some new system does not have ping6, only have 'ping -6'
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09:39.59jm_ipv6 adoption is a sad thing
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10:10.07EdePopedewhy, we all need it for the Internet of Trash
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10:48.55nyovand here I thought 2020 would be the year for shutting off ipv4 :D
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11:12.57EdePopedebefore this happens we'll reach the world climate targets. or BER opens. or trump gets the peace nobel prize. or facemash becoees a *real* social network.
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11:18.18g0zzy"Dec 13 10:01:50 asusdesk nm-dispatcher[605]: req:1 'hostname', "/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/mail-tj-stub": complete: failed with Script '/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/mail-tj-stub' exited with error status 1."
11:18.31g0zzyWhat is 'hostname' there do you think?
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11:32.04nyovIs anyone aware of a ADSL2/Annex J type pc card or a hackable DSL modem running linux?
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11:34.55g0zzyWell of course they mostly all run Linux ;). But check out the OpenWrt hardware list
11:35.30jellymost are hackable with an ax only
11:35.48nyovg0zzy: Not looking for a router, just a modem.
11:36.21nyovor something that lets me look at the mostly raw incoming wire traffic
11:36.33g0zzyAh. I only know of modem-routers
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11:36.49horseshoecrabnyov: you probably want a router running linux set up in bridge mode then i suspect
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11:37.09horseshoecrabso that it is effectively just working as a pppoe thingy.
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11:39.32hummingbee"raw incoming wire traffic"?
11:39.43nyovhorseshoecrab: yeah, possibly.
11:43.15horseshoecrabhummingbee: excellent question - i guess my answer was a little ppp specific (with a touch of implied l2tp)
11:43.31horseshoecrabother protocols and ofc. "modems" are available.
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11:44.22nyovhummingbee: well, there is that magic stuff like TR-069 going on, and I'd kinda like to know what stuff the network is sending to the device.
11:44.28nyovputs tinfoil hat on
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11:48.04DrOwlHi All, i am not sure if this is a bug in xfce or some thing more debian specific... I have mutiple monitors on of which has a xfce4-panel at the top... but i am getting a reserved space at the top of the second monitor too, any suggestions?
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12:41.34mqhello. Does brave webbrowser require unprivileged_userns_clone=1 in debian 10? Is there a way to work around it?
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12:51.18srged_I have an old laptop with a broken display. If I'd connect a monitor to the laptop. Is there any way to make it start directly? I mean I don't want to always manually switch the screen to monitor...
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12:52.34karlpincMy laptop automatically displays on a plugged in monitor.  If yours does not maybe there's a bios/whatever setting.
12:53.07srged_karlpinc: ok thx for answering
12:54.02jellysrged_: see if powering on the laptop when the monitor is already connected and also powered on helps things a bit
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12:55.05srged_ok thanks guys, ill go and test it out
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13:01.54paolobhi guys! since pound isn't in debian buster, what can I substituti it with?
13:02.14jellypaolob: what does it do?
13:02.16jelly,v pound
13:02.17juddPackage: pound on amd64 -- jessie: 2.6-6+deb8u1; jessie-security: 2.6-6+deb8u1; stretch: 2.7-1.3+deb9u1; sid: 2.8-2
13:02.24jelly,i pound
13:02.25juddNo package named 'pound' was found in buster/amd64.
13:02.31jelly,i pound --release sid
13:02.33juddPackage pound (net, optional) in sid/amd64: reverse proxy, load balancer and HTTPS front-end for Web servers. Version: 2.8-2; Size: 98.5k; Installed: 258k; Homepage: http://www.apsis.ch/pound/; Screenshot: https://screenshots.debian.net/package/pound
13:02.48jellypaolob: haproxy perhaps?
13:02.54paolob@jelly it manages hpps and forwards to varnish+apache
13:02.57paolobhttps
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13:03.13jellyor nginx
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13:24.22nyovpaolob: I'd recommend hitch for varnish, haproxy otherwise
13:24.59jelly,v hitch
13:25.00juddPackage: hitch on amd64 -- stretch: 1.4.4-1; buster: 1.5.0-1; bullseye: 1.5.0-2; sid: 1.5.2-1
13:25.01paolob@nyov I'm using varnish already as an apache' cache
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13:26.15nyovpaolob: then you may want hitch, but haproxy works as well, ofc
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13:26.36paolobthank you
13:26.44jelly> Hitch is a libev-based high performance SSL/TLS proxy by Varnish Software [...] performant up to 15 000 listening sockets and 500 000 certificates
13:26.59jellyTIL!
13:29.34nyovhitch is mostly a lightweight SSL terminator only, if you do routing logic etc. in varnish. haproxy is more full-featured
13:31.28nyov(but there are some features lacking in hitch, e.g. https://github.com/varnish/hitch/issues/283 + https://github.com/varnish/hitch/issues/212 )
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13:34.31jellyunix domain socket as backend is a nice touch
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14:08.45kreyrenis there any package that would be able to open a preview of a jekyll website on debian?
14:08.58kreyrenneeds something that just opens the website in a new window for gitpod integration
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14:10.56jellyI've set vm.swappiness = 0, dropped caches so there's 3GB free free RAM, not even cached and available, and this stretch system is _still_ putting some stuff onto swap.  Why.
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14:13.37diogenes_jelly, some applications use swap for their needs also i've noticed when copying files with gui, it also uses swap even when there is plenty of RAM.
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14:14.31jellyhow precisely does a userspace app say "I'd like this page to be paged out to swap"
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14:14.49jellyI don't think that's a thing that exists
14:14.55nyovxD
14:15.15nyovthat'd be the day. swap-dos
14:15.34servermansoftware defined swap
14:15.58jellytmpfs is the closest thing, but it's still backed by ram+swap not just swap
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14:20.35whislockWhy is swap usage such a negative thing?
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14:21.32colo-workjelly, there's MADV_DONTNEED for madvise(), which is the closest thing to what you're asking for, afaik
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14:24.02nyovmaybe just disable the swap if you don't want it used anyway?
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14:24.44jellyI just like things that behave predictably
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14:25.34whislockWhy change the default swap configuration at all? Let memory management do its job.
14:26.01whislockI'm sure there are valid use cases for changing it, sure, but those are generally niche things.
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14:31.28nyovCan I find RFP/ITP bugs by software name?
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14:33.02nyovwould like to know if anyone has considered packaging pagure
14:33.49rom1vhi, I installed Debian 10.2 on a new laptop (I removed Windows), but it does not boot due to UEFI stuff: https://tmp.rom1v.com/windows_boot.jpg
14:34.04rom1vas you can see there is no grub or something: https://tmp.rom1v.com/boot_list.jpg
14:34.19rom1vit seems there is a problem with item 2.
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14:34.32nyovtry disabling secure boot. just a guess
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14:34.43rom1vI can't, the item is disabled
14:34.51rom1vI can't switch it do disabled
14:34.57nyovoh, ok
14:35.17nyovhow did you install debian?
14:35.39rom1vfrom a usb key (I dd the .iso to the key)
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14:36.44nyovhum, they do have signed images these days, right? sorry, not my forte
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14:38.15rom1voh, I can disable secure boot if I set a supervisor password :)
14:38.20rom1vbut it does not solve the problem in fact
14:38.27rom1vthere is still no grub or anything
14:38.29rom1vto boot on debian
14:39.01rom1voh in fact there is
14:39.06rom1vit has just no name \o/
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14:52.21vltHello. Where do I configure a boot menu timeout in a debian-live install?
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15:22.08nvzvlt: /etc/default/grub   do update-grub afterwards
15:22.19nvzvlt: and don't use live images to install
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15:47.49store_scarecrow<nvz> vlt: and don't use live images to install
15:47.51store_scarecrowWhat do you mean?
15:48.25greycatDebian's live images have a long history of failing BADLY when one attempts to use them to install Debian.
15:48.34greycatMaybe it'll work.  Maybe not.  Who knows.
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15:49.55annadaneexcept perhaps calamares
15:49.58annadanewhich i have not tried
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15:50.19annadane(calamares is an installer within the live image, new as of debian 10)
15:51.16store_scarecrowHas anyone noticed aliases dropping at random in Buster?
15:51.42greycatShell command aliases?  Email aliases?  Anti-aliased fonts?
15:52.22store_scarecrowLike, I tried to do useradd and it said it didn't exist, so I did /usr/sbin/useradd and it worked.
15:52.27greycat!buster su
15:52.28dpkgIn buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). To approximate the previous behaviour, put "ALWAYS_SET_PATH yes" in /etc/login.defs. See https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster#Changes for details.
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15:52.36greycatThat's not an alias.
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15:53.07ayekatThat's a can-be-found-somewhere-in-my-PATH.
15:53.07store_scarecrowYeah, I knew as soon as I wrote it it wasn't gonna be right.
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15:53.31store_scarecrowIf I reboot, it'll return to normal operation.
15:53.45store_scarecrowFor this reason, I have yet to upgrade past Stretch for my servers .
15:54.22greycatRebooting has nothing to do with your PATH.  Read the wiki page that the bot gave you.
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15:55.25store_scarecrowI bet that's what happened.
15:56.16francis_murtaghHi, would someone be able to help me with packaging? Or is there a channel specially for it?
15:56.59store_scarecrowSo, ALWAYS_SET_PATH yes in /etc/login.defs would be close to what I'm used to.
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15:58.26rplevkahi all, is there a build for powerpcspe somewhere or was it discontinued?
15:58.35rplevkahttps://buildd.debian.org/status/architecture.php?a=powerpcspe gives me "unknown arch"
15:58.48rplevkawiki for it is still alive: https://wiki.debian.org/PowerPCSPEPort
15:59.19greycatthere's a #debianppc channel that might know more about it than we do
15:59.32rplevkagreycat, oh nice! thanks!
15:59.42annadanefrancis_murtagh, i suppose you can try asking here but maybe more helpful, #debian-mentors (for official debian packages) or #packaging (for local packages not for debian), both on irc.oftc.net
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16:00.49OS-63198!beta
16:00.49dpkg[beta] software ready to be tested, or a high energy electron or short for Betamax, a defunct video cassette standard
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16:03.15annadanelocal packages not for inclusion in the official debian repos, i guess i should say
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16:30.07francis_murtaghI'm using sbuild to build and install my package in a minimal isolated environment. For x86 I override_dh_auto_test to call my UnitTest executable which is in the temporary build area but not included in the package, that works fine as a form of verification. However the tool also has a use case wherein its crosscompiled for aarch64. Is there any way to run the crosscompiled aarch64 executables using sbuild so as to verify the
16:30.07francis_murtaghcrossbuild worked?
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16:32.22nvzyou'd probably need qemu or something for that
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16:39.40polk2hi, have anyone faced sqlserver installed on Debian. ms docs says Ubuntu is supported. what are the chances it will work on dbn?
16:40.30masonpolk2: Supported and working are distinct things. You can almost certainly get it working on Debian, but it won't be supported, so it'll depend on your support needs I guess.
16:40.46Mathisenhmm any idea why my dns server is kinda getting flooded with requests "0.debian.pool.ntp.org" see image > https://i.imgur.com/cGlQV1O.png what could ne wrong
16:40.54Mathisenthis is happening like every 10 min
16:41.22masonpolk2: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=ms+sql+server+debian&ia=web  shows quite a few examples
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16:43.42nvzMathisen: you have machines on your network trying to keep their clock synchronized?
16:43.53ctrlriscI think you're referring to missing radeon firmware
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16:44.35freebenchmason, I assume by 'supported' they mean it works there and it is supported on Ubuntu for now
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16:46.28masonfreebench: 'supported' means a combination of 'it works,' 'it's supposed to work,' and 'here's some help'
16:46.29ctrlriscsorry, please disregard last message. my chat buffer was at the top rather than bottom, very old conversation I was responding to
16:47.18greycathappens a lot :)
16:48.11freebenchmason, right. and it should work indeed, at least some core functionality
16:48.45masonThe first link also notes the possibility of just running it in a container, incidentally. So, letting in that method, just about anything ought to work.
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16:50.02Mathisennvz, i dont even have ntpdate installed on any debian machine
16:50.22greycatthat's the new normal
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16:56.00jellyMathisen: there are other ntp client packages, not just "ntp" with ntpd and ntpdate, there's chrony, even systemd has its own systemd-timesyncd
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16:57.17jellyMathisen: if "timedatectl status" tells you NTP service: active, that's probably systemd-timesyncd
16:58.45Mathisenyep thats active
16:59.53Mathisenthanks i stoped the service for now
16:59.57Mathiseni see if it helps
17:00.18jellywho even wants a correct clock anyway
17:01.07greycatntp, chrony, openntpd, and systemd-timesyncd, are the main players on this stage
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17:08.43somiajnvz: I think eventually virtualbox is going to be put here, http://fasttrack.debian.net/
17:09.49annadaneinteresting
17:10.14jellyand this is called "fasttrack" instead of "volatile" because... reasons?
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17:10.52somiajUnsure on that, this is just a new thing that I have heard virtualbox and similar software will be put that cannot be backported due to it cannot be in stable.
17:11.33jellyit's a good thing
17:11.34somiajthough we will see if this ever gets any traction, but there are packgaes there allready
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17:13.42somiajalso be nice if firefox is put there too
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17:14.57jellyit's probably a better idea than having mozilla.d.n separately
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17:15.42jellyhowever if mozilla packaging team had resources to package it, they probably would have done that already
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17:19.54NetTerminalGeneis fasttrack official?
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17:20.25jellyNetTerminalGene: nothing on .debian.net domain is official, those are all side projects
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17:20.39jellystuff on .debian.org is official
17:21.12karlpincWasn't backports originally on .debian.net?
17:21.16jellyyes
17:21.31somiajit was also its own thing for a while backports.org or something like that
17:21.37karlpincNetTerminalGene: So, there's hope.  :)
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17:33.43mikeymopI am trying to find how to switch java virtual packages
17:33.50mikeymopI have jdk 11 and 8 intalled
17:34.03mikeymopI understand it's a bunch of symlinks like a versino manager
17:34.22mikeymopI want readlink -f /usr/bin/javac
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17:34.39mikeymopto display /usr/lib/jvm/java-8-openjdk*
17:34.41jellyupdate-java-altenatives --config
17:34.45mikeymopthank you
17:35.49jellyoh, sorry, update-java-alternatives has no --config, you'll have to --list and --set ...
17:36.06mikeymopupdate-alternatives: error: no alternatives for mozilla-javaplugin.so
17:36.15mikeymopyea I got that far
17:36.34mikeymopI have something missing on my system I believe but now I now what I am looking at, thanks again
17:36.56jellysome jdks have no java plugin, and that's fine.  I think 8 was the last one
17:37.08mikeymopah
17:37.10mikeymopsudo update-alternatives --config java
17:37.30mikeymopsome other package manages the java version manager that manages the jdk
17:37.45jellythat's an alternative yeah
17:37.56jellyno pun intended
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17:39.14jellybut "update-alternatives --config java" will, I believe, only tune /usr/bin/java and not, say, /usr/bin/javac
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17:43.20Inconveniencehas anyone gotten the xscreen to save
17:43.40Inconvenienceim sick of rearanging my screens
17:44.31joepublicarandr will save the screen layout as a shell script
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17:46.18Inconvenienceim in the nvidia settings thing
17:46.21Inconveniencewhat do i do
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17:47.16joepublicI am unfamiliar with the nvidia settings thing.
17:49.03darkstalkernvidia-settings can save into a xorg.conf file
17:49.25darkstalkeryou can use that to update your config. or do what i do that is just copying the relevant line
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17:50.06darkstalkerthe one that starts with: Option         "metamodes"
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17:50.28greycatI guess I do not have any clue what "xscreen" means.  I thought it was like "The X version of screen".
17:50.53greycatbut it's not a package, and it's not a command that I already have...
17:51.12joepublicI interpreted it to mean "the screen layout of my X windows environment", with a bit of guessing
17:51.29greycatyeah, I understood your answer in that context
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17:54.58Inconvenienceyes i was able to save
17:55.15Inconveniencebut it doesnt seem to matter
17:55.44greycatfrom darkstalker's responses, I guess it means "I am running multiple monitors, and every time I start X I have to tell it which one's on the left/right/top/bottom and I'd like this configuration to be stored permanently"
17:55.44Inconveniencei verified that it did save to xorg
17:55.57Inconvenienceyes
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17:59.40joepublicMy 4-monitor setup under xfce seems to remember setup fine with my current video card, a GTX 780ti.  with the card it replaced (a GTX 760), I got some random scramble each time.  No other change.  Inexplicable to me, but there you go.
17:59.57vltnvz, store_scarecrow, greycat: I don't want to install, I just want to use it.
18:00.40greycat!debian-live
18:00.40dpkgThe Debian Live project provides pre-built Debian live system images and allows creation of your own.  NOT recommended for installing Debian.  Live images are available from http://www.debian.org/CD/live/ .  https://wiki.debian.org/DebianLive  #debian-live on irc.debian.org; also see <live login>, <uefi live>.
18:00.41nvzsomiaj: I'll have to look into that.. dont think I'm really up to speed with fasttrack (heh)
18:00.41vltnvz: Do I put etc/default/grub into config/includes.chroot?
18:00.54nvzMathisen: systemd does time management
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18:01.09Inconvenienceim using gnome
18:01.14annadanewonders if maintainers will even have the time to maintain fasttrack
18:01.55nvzvlt: uh.. you can stop addressing me then, cause I have no idea what you're talking about I'd never use a live like that.. I'd just install to a thumbdrive and not fool with all that crap
18:02.23nvza regular install to a thumbdrive is much easier to manage than a live if you're using it long-term and want to configure it
18:02.24vltgreycat: I'm using exactly that. When booting from the generated ISO I get a boot menu (both legacy and EFI mode) without a default timeout and have to press Enter. I want it to start after n seconds.
18:02.51greycatThe important bit was " #debian-live on irc.debian.org"
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18:03.28vltgreycat: :D You're absolutely right.
18:03.30greycatbut if you manage to find someone here who actually knows it (e.g. nvz) then great
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18:03.37nvzto me a live iso is one of those things thats great when you need one.. like a life preserver.. but I wouldnt just wear it all the time :P
18:03.57nvzdoing all that extra stuff with live isos is just silly to me
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18:04.52vltnvz: In my case I need the non-editable part of a customized iso. Works great so far including parts loading from LUKS encryption.
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18:05.42nvzI consider the proper use of a live iso for demonstration, a quick easy rescue media to repartition or something like that, use someone else's computer real quick without fussing with their passwords, settings, etc.. but if you just want a portable system that you want to configure, install like you would normally to a thumbdrive, if you want an install media, use the regular install media..
18:06.06nvzuse the right tool for the job :P
18:06.26nvzfidgeting with a live iso do do stuff other things are better at is just silly to me
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18:07.30somiajnvz: Yea, time will tell if it actually becomes a commonly used thing, but I think the idea is to provide a backporting path directly from sid for packages like virtualbox, firefox, or other fast moving software that cannot be supported in stable.
18:07.54nvzsomiaj: sounds good.. for now I've been going upstream for virtualbox with mostly good result
18:08.19somiajyea, that is where I point people too.
18:08.48nvzsomiaj: I only became aware of the community effort to package it on people.d.o when I consulted the wiki last night
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18:09.04nvz/that/ seems like a waste of time :P
18:09.53nvzpersonally I been spending the last two days compiling retroarch.. thats something we need to get fasttracked cause the debian packages are pretty much useless
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18:10.46nvzdoesnt help I was compiling ALL the cores on a damn thin client like an idiot instead of using a faster machine :P
18:11.20somiajYea, I like the idea of fasttrack, there is just a lot of fast moving software that isn't appropriate for stable, but the debian community would benifit from having a more offical package of
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18:11.43somiajbut I think it is a matter on if it is deemed in lines with the debian project and manpower, with the second probably being the more limiting factor.
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18:13.08annadanealso wonders how they're going to deal with conflicting dependencies between fasttrack and stable
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18:14.24somiajannadane: I would assume similar to backports, there are some issues that arise due to limitations in pinning
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18:21.18|san|what would be the best way to make an image/backup of a debian system? Im looking around here https://wiki.debian.org/BackupAndRecovery and can see several methods...
18:21.28greycat!best
18:21.28dpkgBest for what?  Please define what you mean by "best".  Gloria Gaynor!  Tina Turner!  Aretha Franklin!  Men without Hats!  Women without Hats!  Men at Work!  Women at Play!  Anyone for Tennis!
18:21.41|san|lol768_, good one.
18:21.45|san|lol even*
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18:22.11|san|by best i mean lightweight, not to advanced...
18:22.35somiajI prefer to backup data and reinstall vs make an image of the whole system.
18:22.41somiajIf you want to backup package lists things like
18:22.43somiaj!aptitude clone
18:22.43dpkgTo clone a Debian machine using aptitude (or install your favourite packages) use aptitude search --disable-columns -F%p '~i!~M!~v' > package_list; on the reference machine; xargs aptitude --schedule-only install < package_list; aptitude install; on the other machine.  This preserves information about "automatically installed" packages that other methods do not.  See also <reinstall>, <things to backup>, <debian clone>, <apt-clone>.
18:22.56somiajthen you can /msg dpkg things to backup
18:23.02greycatsome USB storage devices have very low mass.  that's what you mean by "lightweight", right?  physical mass of the backup media?
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18:26.06|san|basically, what I want to achieve is this; i'm running a debian based system on a chromebook. Not the build in linux, but partitioned with linux and boots up on dedicated partition. I spent several weeks adjusting and personalizing my system, but along the road i messed something up with a grub update and decided to reinstall and start all over. Now im done reinstalling and i want to save this
18:26.07|san|system while it is still in working order and the basics are done.
18:26.33|san|So if something happens again, then i can start not totally from scratch
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18:27.10somiaj!debian-based
18:27.11dpkgYour distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian.  We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare http://futurist.se/gldt/).  #debian only supports Debian and pure <blend>s; please respect our choice to volunteer here to help Debian users.  Support for other distributions is off-topic on #debian, even if your own distro's channel is clueless or non-existent.
18:27.18jhutchins_wk1One method would be to boot to an iso and clone the disk.
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18:28.19somiaj|san|: You should really use appropriate support, due to both social and techencial reasons we support only debian pureblends. As for your situation, you need to look at various methods and decide what is best for you. I personally only back up data and then reinstall the os. You can make a copy of the whole file system, or image the whole harddrive, lots of options.
18:28.23|san|I see. Thanks for the advice.
18:28.48somiajalso you should have regular backups int he first place
18:28.57|san|somiaj: duely noted. That being said, do you happen to know if it would be possible to install pure debian on a chromebook?
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18:29.12somiajI think so, but I haven't done it.
18:29.23|san|Ok :-)
18:29.38jhutchins_wk1!chromebook
18:29.39dpkgDebian may be installable on some models of Chromebook. Search the wiki: https://deb.li/3SRYU . If your model is not listed here and you succeed, consider adding a DebianOn wiki page for your model. See also: <crouton>
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18:29.50somiajIs it an arm based chromebook, debian's arm port only supports some arm processors
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18:31.02|san|Its intel.. .Haswell
18:31.28|san|jhutchins_wk1: thanks :-)
18:32.04|san|u sure are prepared for a noob like me, cool.. :) I'll look into it.
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18:33.37annadanei backup very little when i reinstall
18:33.52annadanethough that's also just me being me and keeping backups fairly regularly anyway
18:33.54annadane!things to backup
18:33.55dpkgSome things you should back up include: /etc /home /root /usr/local /usr/src /opt /srv.  Tailor to your own purposes.  If you think you don't need /var, make sure you don't forget /var/lib/dpkg /var/backups /var/lib/apt* /var/lib/mysql /var/mail /var/www /var/cache/debconf /var/spool/cron ...
18:34.11ChmEarlmy buster install had /var/lock as a directory, not symlinked /run/lock . Is this always the case?
18:34.14annadanemy own personal preference is to have a relatively fresh system
18:34.37|san|annadane; yeah that was also why i decided to start all over this time...and then try to do it better this time...
18:35.23Inconveniencehow do i find which ips are connected
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18:35.36karlpincss
18:36.02jhutchins_wknetstat
18:36.17karlpincss is newer
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18:36.27jhutchins_wkChmEarl: I believe there's an explanation in the release notes.
18:36.28|san|whenever i sit with my linux box i'm doing hundreds of google searches for everything...really time consuming, but also fun and educating...especially when someone remembers the details
18:36.44annadane!newcomer
18:36.44dpkgWelcome to Debian! Here's some resources to help you on your merry way: The Debian Handbook: https://debian-handbook.info/ Reference manual: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ FAQ: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/ - reading https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian is also a very good idea.
18:36.48|san|that someone being "me".
18:36.54annadane|san|, once you've decided to run debian and not debian based, check that out
18:37.00karlpinc|san|: You might try the man and info pages before random advce from strangers.
18:37.11annadaneyeah, careful with random internet advice
18:37.16|san|annadane: Cool, thanks.
18:37.39|san|yeah, i already messed up some things where the advice differ on some essential things
18:38.04annadanedebian changes, internet advice stays around forever
18:38.11annadaneon top of the already bad advice
18:38.11|san|lol true :-)
18:38.20annadane"want this software? just add an ubuntu ppa, and..."
18:38.55|san|i just got the linux bible 9th edition from the library, i guess the different editions actually mean something
18:39.03somiaj!don't break debian
18:39.03dpkgi guess dont break debian is https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
18:39.17somiajproblem is you aren't running debian, so if you ask debian what to do, they may not give you proper advise
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18:40.05annadanelooks at the handbook
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18:40.08annadane"debian 8"
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18:40.38somiajit is still mostly relvent, a lot of that stuff hasn't really changed for 10+ years
18:40.39greycatWriting books is hard and time-consuming, and Debian 8 at least has systemd, so the basics are the same.
18:41.08somiajand it includes systemd, just missing fine details, but those can differ from system to system
18:41.08annadaneno for sure, it's just funny in the context of 'don't consult the internet, use the debian resources'
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18:42.14annadanei'm sure there have been debian 9/10 revisions but the problem is if you put 'debian 10' as the title then it's another way of saying 'this is guaranteed proof-read that all of this is accurate for debian 10'
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20:12.08Akuwi just configure reposity as local
20:13.01Akuwbut after copy some packages to directory i got error Failed to fecth file
20:13.10Akuwso, how can i update Package file
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20:19.10lilith93Hi, I want to change LC_NUMERIC=de_DE.UTF-8 to LC_NUMERIC=en_US.UTF-8 and I modified the /etc/default/locale file already. But after reboot "locale" still shows me the german version for LC_NUMERIC
20:19.31somiajI think systemd has it's own method for setting locale, see localectl
20:19.32lilith93Can anyone help, please?
20:19.34greycatAre you using GNOME?  Are you using gnome-terminal?
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20:19.47lilith93greycat: XFCE
20:20.37greycatjust for grins, if you login directly on a console (ctrl-alt-f2), do you get the correct local in the login shell?
20:20.41greycatlocale*
20:21.29lilith93greycat: Yes!
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20:21.51greycatthen it sounds like xfce has its own ideas about your locale, and it's overriding what PAM sets
20:22.12lilith93greycat: do I have to change the keyboard settings?
20:22.23greycatI don't know anything about desktop environments.
20:22.39lilith93ok
20:22.41lilith93thanks
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20:23.04diogenes_graingert, you live in cli?
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20:23.26graingertYes
20:23.29greycatwooledg    733   724  0 Nov18 tty1     00:13:20 fvwm
20:23.55graingert??
20:24.01greycatgraingert: they meant me, probably
20:24.23diogenes_graingert, sorry it was meant for greycat
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20:24.44graingertOh
20:25.26diogenes_i never heard of fvwm.
20:25.37BLZbubbathat is the classic virtual window manager from the 90's
20:25.46BLZbubbamy first *nix desktop environment
20:25.51greycatit's one of the older ones, yes
20:26.40BLZbubbait was great, i still miss the app swallow feature
20:26.43Akuwwhy i am getting errors with Packages file
20:26.52Akuwwhe do apt-get update
20:27.28diogenes_greycat, but you won't install it on family members PCs right? or they use macs.
20:27.50greycatWorse.
20:28.13diogenes_windows?
20:28.28somiajAkuw: you have to give us some actual output
20:28.29somiaj!bat
20:28.31dpkg[Basic Apt* Troubleshooting]. To diagnose your problem, we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy".  Use https://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information.  Also ask me about <localized errors>.
20:28.39somiajAkuw: ^^ provide us all the above information
20:29.22annadanei'll use fvwm... someday... maybe... nah
20:29.27Akuwi am using     deb [trusted=yes] file:///srv/loacl-apt-repository     in my   /etc/apt/sources.list.d/local-apt-repository.list
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20:31.40BLZbubbagreycat: dos 3.3?
20:31.52greycathah, no.  windows.
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21:06.54ws2k3lets say i create a br0 in my /etc/network/interfaces how do i bridge it with eth0. where would that be defined?
21:10.16somiajalso in your interfaces file
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21:11.02somiajhttps://wiki.debian.org/BridgeNetworkConnections -- I think it is bridge_ports eth0
21:12.35ws2k3somiaj lol i just see it now in my config xD
21:13.02ws2k3somiaj so..... this means eth0 is connected to br0?
21:13.24ws2k3somiaj so can i configure the ip on eth0 and br0? is there a difference which one is woukd pick?
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21:14.26somiajyou configure the ip on br0, its been a while since I've done this, I just followed the samples in the wiki I linked
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21:15.09ws2k3somiaj but currently my biggest question is can i also configure the ip on eth0?
21:15.30somiajI don't think so, it is being used as a bridge
21:15.48somiajbut you could configure another virtual interface that uses the bridge
21:15.52somiaj(I think that is how it works)
21:16.26somiajif no one answers here people in ##networking might actually know what is going on, I just only ever set it up once so my vms could be visible on my network (and not on a virtual network)
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21:16.36DammitJimdo you guys have recommendations on external hard drives?
21:16.58DammitJimI'm looking for a usb 3.1 / thunderbolt 3 -> SSD
21:17.23DammitJimand what are sort of expected performance
21:20.04somiajI think the bottleneck is usb3, so getting an ssd won't help out much, unsure about thunderbolt, never used it
21:21.16Sleaker3.1 support 5Gb/s .. I imagine that's faster than most platter drives can handle though.
21:23.11Sleaker7200 rpm drives cap out at what 1Gb/s
21:23.42Sleakerso an SSD *should* perform better than an HDD.
21:25.43somiajahh guess it has been a while since I've used a 7200 drive, though they had a bit faster read/write speed
21:25.44bzedDammitJim: get an usb 3.1 <> nvme case and put a samsung evo plus 970 inside..
21:26.24DammitJimthanks
21:26.59Sleakerthere's no reason to get a m.2 nvme drive. just get the SSD version.
21:27.43bzedSleaker: a nvme drive is - technically - an SSD drive
21:27.49Sleakersorry, sata.
21:28.00bzedSleaker: no. sata is way slower
21:28.10Sleakeryou're rate limited on the USB bus anyway
21:28.16Sleakerno point in going nvme
21:28.39bzedDammitJim: https://www.pcworld.com/article/3432134/orico-usb-31-nvme-ssd-enclosure-review.html thats what I'd get
21:28.39DammitJimso, what practical speeds should I expect?
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21:29.20DammitJimI've tried the usb 3.1 stuff but my speeds aren't that great
21:29.39bzedDammitJim: maybe your system can't handle it
21:29.56SleakerDammitJim: you're going to be rate limited to USB 3.1 if that's what it supports (500MB/s essentially) unless it has USB-C connector support and dual transfer
21:30.22Sleakerif it supports dual-lane USB-C then you can get up to 1GB/s
21:30.23bzedSleaker: why would one not use usb-c?
21:30.33Sleakerbzed: depends on what gen it supports
21:31.07DammitJimI have USB-C but the system isn't detecting it properly
21:31.23bzedDammitJim: then you should fix that first
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21:31.37bzedDammitJim: or, maybe you need to install the thunderbolt tools and allow connections on your ports
21:32.11DammitJimoh wow... I didn't know there were thunderbolt tools!
21:32.15DammitJimthat's a good hint
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21:35.09metbsdis zfs the best fs so far?
21:35.22somiaj!best
21:35.23dpkgBest for what?  Please define what you mean by "best".  Gloria Gaynor!  Tina Turner!  Aretha Franklin!  Men without Hats!  Women without Hats!  Men at Work!  Women at Play!  Anyone for Tennis!
21:35.34somiajmetbsd: personally I prefer ext4 since it is standard and well tested on the linux kernel
21:35.44metbsdfor file sharing
21:35.49metbsdfile server
21:36.08metbsd2-10g file
21:36.17metbsdmovie
21:37.05greycatwhy would you think you need fancy crap for a simple file server?
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21:37.34DammitJimbzed, what is the package name for thunderbolt tools you are talking about?
21:38.29bzedDammitJim: there is a bolt package and a thunderbolt-tools package
21:38.38bzednot sure which one works better/different
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21:41.59Sleakermetbsd: I just use ext4
21:42.53metbsdbecause i was watching people making cloud system at home. and they prefer zfs over others.
21:43.03metbsdso i guess zfs is better.
21:43.08greycat!sns
21:43.09dpkgShiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released.  If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>.
21:43.10bzedmetbsd: if you are asking that question you proably might want to start with a simple filesystem
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21:44.36rander2hello
21:45.07yann-kaeligHi
21:45.09annadanezfs from what i hear is certainly fine and really useful but i think using the defaults in general is an underappreciated thing
21:45.16annadanedefault filesystem for debian being of course ext4
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21:45.33annadanezfs isn't like btrfs which people have horror stories of failing
21:45.48annadanebut that's just anecdotal, i'm very much not an expert
21:46.11greycatI've never used either one, but I can confirm I hear bad things about btrfs most often, out of all the file systems.
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21:46.59ChmEarlhow can I find all packages that depend on libssh-4 in Stretch
21:47.36greycatChmEarl: apt-cache showpkg libssh-4   and look under Reverse Depends.
21:48.49ChmEarlgreycat, thanks , trying it now
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21:52.32yann-kaeligI need help :) Really,  I try to find an answer to my problem but without succes. I'm creating a package.deb from a source files. Until this package , I had no problem to create my .deb, but with this one I get this warning: ignoring deletion of file package/deps.mak, use --include-removal to override. This file look like it's not extracted or droped when I execute dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -rfakeroot.  Idon't know why. Everythign
21:52.32yann-kaeliglook good inside the *.orig.tarball. I don't know what to do, can you help me ? thx
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21:57.09jelangkunghi, how do i debug themes?
21:59.26jelangkungi copied themes and icons from manjaro and used it in debian 10 xfce but ram usage is significantly higher when using said themes/icon
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22:19.17zerocoolfriends is there a way with virt-p2v-make-disk to put non-free firmware, for like a perc card?
22:20.11ws2k3how can i find out which mac adres i should use for an bridge interface in an lxc container
22:20.26zerocoolwell, to be honest, i don't know that this will be a problem yet im sorta predicting the problem
22:21.22ws2k3eth0 is configured as 02:00:00:21:85:2f but when i add a eth1 with 02:00:00:21:85:2g it refuses to start lxc-start: conf.c: setup_hw_addr: 2205 mac address '02:00:00:21:85:2g' conversion failed : Invalid argument
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22:21.46rander2anyone here know as run hping3 script ? The script are written in tcl
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22:23.20Sleakerws2k3: don't use invalid mac addresses
22:23.37ws2k3Sleaker how do i know an mac adres is invalid?
22:23.43Sleakerws2k3: use an online tool?
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22:24.31Sleakerpretty sure you can let lxc generate it's own mac's too anyway.
22:24.58Sleakermaybe not
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22:26.42ws2k3Sleaker thanks that worked. only it seems i cant have 2 ipv4 gateway in my config is this correct?
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22:27.23whislockws2k3: You should only ever have default route in the routing table.
22:27.26whislockone
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22:27.52ws2k3whislock lxc.network.ipv4.gateway does this means default gateway?
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22:28.22whislockMy familiarity with lxc is somewhat lacking, but that's what the name suggests.
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22:30.57ws2k3Sleaker whislock if i try to ping out on that interface i get Destination Host Unreachable ping: sendmsg: Operation not permitted
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22:46.45ws2k3turn out shorewall is blocking the traffic. now need to find out how i can allow everything on one zone
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22:54.23karlpinc!tell rander2 about anyone
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22:57.04rander2I'm trying to run hping3 default scripts, but ever I get error
22:57.41karlpinc!errors
22:57.41dpkgIf you don't tell us the exact error messages you get, we can't tell you what's wrong, and it's also useful to know exactly what command you're typing.  Please look for the *first* error that occurs, as this is often the cause of later errors -- ask me about <localized errors> too.  Please don't paste in the channel, use a pastebin instead; ask me about <pastebin>.
22:57.41rander2ok, it's a old program , but tcl is again supported
22:58.13karlpincrander2: Did you install it from the debian repos?
22:58.22rander2yes
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23:02.33Sleakerws2k3: unsure, I don't use shorewall.
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23:04.06karlpincrander2: You'll have to respond with what's asked for above in the <errors> factoid to get help.
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23:06.14karlpincws2k3: I once considered using shorewall because iptables syntax is so grody.  But I chose ferm instead.  These days nftables is basically ferm.  (And there's something newer which might be better... I forget.)
23:06.53rander2https://paste.debian.net/1120967/
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23:09.33rander2I changed the default eth0 with wlan0, but the same thing is with all default scripts
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23:10.40rander2I'm using debian buster 64bit, the script are under /usr/share/doc/hping3/examples
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23:35.00UterNeutrino inside of earth mapping system... Use the neutrinos to map the inside of the earth. A Dyson Sphere neutrino detector...
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23:38.40math_Good morning guys. I'm running Debian 10 Buster on a very old Asus Eee-pc (Atom 1.3Ghz with 2Gb DDR2). It runs very well but i'm looking for a way to play videos. Actually videos plays at a very low fps rate. (I dont talk about youtube or streaming)
23:40.03bzedmath_: uh well, more ram would be a good start. and a faster CPU. or try to recode your videos in the resolution you can use on that machine and with a codec that doesn't need much cpu. Might need more disk space, though...
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