| 00:00.01 | wodim | the manual says to use cp |
| 00:00.05 | ksk | eh, not quite the faq I was looking for :) |
| 00:00.09 | wodim | i guess three things are the same |
| 00:00.14 | ksk | !usb install |
| 00:00.14 | dpkg | You can install Debian from a USB stick/thumbdrive/pen drive/key on x86 systems, as long as your system's BIOS can boot from USB. Details are in the Installation Guide, see http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch04s03 and ask me about <install debian> for hybrid CD/DVD images. Use http://sf.net/projects/win32diskimager/ to write images from Windows. For BIOSes not capable of USB boot, ask me about <plop>. |
| 00:00.21 | wodim | but dd has status=progress... |
| 00:00.33 | ksk | yeah dd and cat are for sure, cat just has some better defaults for copying to a usb-drive (you can tune dd of course..) |
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| 00:00.46 | wodim | you mean bs, right? |
| 00:01.09 | wodim | i know the default is bs=1 which is inadequate, but something like 10M should work okay |
| 00:01.19 | ksk | I would think so, yes. not too deep into filesystems and drives though^^ |
| 00:01.30 | wodim | yeah well, thank you |
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| 00:20.49 | Gerowen | Would it be ill-advised to just upgrade every package in stable from backports? I've got a laptop that freezes randomly, and I'm not sure if whether a newer kernel, firmware package, etc. would fix it. |
| 00:21.08 | Gerowen | Thinking of just doing: apt -t buster-backports upgrade |
| 00:21.23 | joepublic | that sounds pretty ill advised, yeah |
| 00:21.31 | ksk | Gerowen: nah, dont do that. Just pull from BPO what you want newer versions of.. |
| 00:21.36 | ksk | s/want/need/ |
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| 00:23.15 | Gerowen | K, I'm just not sure which packages would help or hurt it. I've seen a few errors about missing radeon files for my integrated vega grapics, so I'll try just pulling in a new kernel and the firmware* packages. |
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| 00:23.55 | ksk | Gerowen: how about debugging your problem? :o |
| 00:23.57 | ksk | do you have dmesg/journalctl from the crash? (the last lines logged on your machine) |
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| 00:28.08 | Gerowen | Negative. I've got my system log viewer up and have looked through there in the past immediately after a crash, but have never been able to find anything suspicious. |
| 00:28.43 | Gerowen | Problem is the crashes are seemingly random, I'm not sure how to go about reproducing them reliably. |
| 00:28.53 | ksk | if you have standard debian setup with journal and no rsyslogd, I dont think the journal is persistant (meaning it resets on power-off) |
| 00:29.23 | joepublic | but /var/log/kern.log should hang around |
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| 00:34.54 | lastebill1 | I have a 3 tb hard drive. Why will ext4 only see 800 gb? |
| 00:35.07 | lastebill1 | I'm using parted |
| 00:35.08 | ryouma | sound is still not working. i have tried https://wiki.debian.org/Sound as best i could. i have my stretch system on a new box. i don't fully understand modules, but /seem/ to have them for the card. my user is in audio group. i installed pulseaudio (the previous box worked without it). pavucontrol says there are no sound cards. lspci says "00:1b.0 Audio device [0403]: Intel Corporation 5 Series/3400 Series Ch |
| 00:35.08 | ryouma | ipset High Definition Audio [8086:3b56] (rev 06)" and "Subsystem: Lenovo 5 Series/3400 Series Chipset High Definition Audio [17aa:3604]" |
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| 00:36.13 | joepublic | lastebill1, good question. perhaps use gparted or some such to create a fresh new partition table on the drive, and try again |
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| 00:36.22 | HelloShitty | hello |
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| 00:37.04 | joepublic | this may result in data loss. your mileage may vary. |
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| 00:43.10 | Gerowen | Ran cat /var/log/kern.log | grep rror (to account for upper and lowercase E), looking at kern.log.1 and whatnot right now. |
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| 00:43.37 | ksk | lastebill1: might it be the partition is only 800G? :) show us a "parted /dev/device, print" output |
| 00:44.42 | ksk | GPT also comes to my mind, but you should see about 2T if that was the Issue - if I remember that correctly.. |
| 00:45.45 | Gerowen | Two errors I seem to see repeated. This one seems to repeat constantly: https://paste.debian.net/1123104/ |
| 00:46.02 | Gerowen | This one appears occasionally: https://paste.debian.net/1123105/ |
| 00:47.21 | joepublic | they appear related, the first being errors maybe with the storage device, and the second being failure and reset of the storage device |
| 00:48.20 | lastebill1 | ksk could you type out the excakt commands I need to run? It's my first run at parted. Sda is the disk |
| 00:48.29 | Gerowen | I'm running the drive encrypted with the default LUKS option, set it up during install. The drive is just a plain old 2.5" SATA SSD. |
| 00:48.49 | lastebill1 | ksk: I type sudo parted and it opens parted |
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| 00:48.59 | joepublic | maybe a loose connection to the ssd? |
| 00:49.27 | joepublic | clean connectors, reinstall, wiggle a little? |
| 00:49.29 | Gerowen | Possibly, I've got a replacement keyboard/clamshell arriving in a few days, so I'll have to take it apart anyway when it arrives. |
| 00:50.03 | ksk | Gerowen: might be helpful to let us dedice whats bad and what not (Share full output) |
| 00:50.16 | nvz | lastebill1: lsblk | nc termbin.com 9999 |
| 00:50.18 | Gerowen | To be honest, I'm not thrilled with this thing, it had dead pixels upon arrival, RMA'd it and the replacement also has a dead pixel and a bright spot in the bottom right of the panel. |
| 00:50.19 | ksk | I can only say it does not look too nice that error, but no Idea without context (the rest of dmesg output) |
| 00:50.19 | lastebill1 | ksk: /dev/sda (3001GB) |
| 00:50.27 | lastebill1 | when I type print devices |
| 00:50.29 | Gerowen | ksk: I'll just upload my whole kern.log then. |
| 00:51.04 | ksk | lastebill1: it would then be "parted /dev/sda" -> "print" - this should print you the partition table |
| 00:51.07 | ksk | !paste |
| 00:51.07 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 00:51.56 | ksk | 00:50 < lastebill1> ksk: /dev/sda (3001GB) -- this then means linux does recognize the hdd having 3T - a good first sign ;) |
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| 00:56.40 | lastebill1 | https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/wNGHJRzA/my%20disk%20lsblk |
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| 00:57.27 | nvz | @.@ |
| 00:57.35 | ksk | lastebill1: that is not "parted /dev/sda print" output :P |
| 00:57.54 | lastebill1 | nc termbin.com 9999, what is this? |
| 00:58.14 | nvz | it was going to output that command to a plain text no b.s. link I could access |
| 00:58.18 | nvz | unlike the one above |
| 00:58.24 | ksk | that connects your computer to termbin on port 9999 (its used for easy pasting from CLI only machines) |
| 00:58.28 | nvz | I'm barely on IRC at the moment |
| 00:58.47 | lastebill1 | ok! |
| 00:59.07 | ksk | there is also the debian package "pastebinit", you could do "parted /dev/sda print | pastebinit" and get a link to share in return |
| 00:59.27 | ksk | (install pastebinit first of course, all the other ways and also copying manual is valid ;) |
| 01:01.08 | lastebill1 | http://paste.debian.net/1123111/ |
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| 01:01.41 | ksk | lastebill1: okay, confirmed than, you have a 800G partition on that 3T drive. |
| 01:01.45 | ksk | s/than/then/ |
| 01:01.50 | nvz | you have a single 802GB partition on the disk it would seem |
| 01:02.19 | ksk | it also has the boot flag set, as a sidenode - finally diskspace to install all the kernels that have been and will ever be :D |
| 01:02.35 | nvz | idk what kinda crap other than the HTTPs that irccloud.com has, cause I never got past that point.. just kept spinning and spinning |
| 01:02.53 | nvz | it did the dns lookup, the tls handshake, then just nothing |
| 01:03.11 | ksk | lastebill1: I assume you want a 3T partition? and further, that you a) have no data stored there, that you need anymore? |
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| 01:04.16 | ksk | nvz: works over here on lynx - tells you to enable JS (or use the raw link) ;) |
| 01:04.18 | lastebill1 | yes, I'd like to (safely) expand 700gb to all 3tb |
| 01:04.35 | nvz | ksk: yeah I didnt bother trying to use links2 or something :D |
| 01:04.38 | ksk | lastebill1: in filesystems, there is no "safe" so to say. |
| 01:04.49 | lastebill1 | well, if it breaks, it breaks |
| 01:04.53 | lastebill1 | as safe as possible :p |
| 01:04.55 | ksk | I would have told you how to delete that partition, and create a new 3T one. |
| 01:05.22 | nvz | sounds like its about as nasty as pastebin.com |
| 01:05.27 | lastebill1 | ok, it's better to just delete it and make a new one? |
| 01:05.44 | ksk | much less knowledge required of doing so, I would say. |
| 01:05.44 | joepublic | gparted will cheerfully resize it for you if the filesystem is clean |
| 01:05.47 | nvz | lastebill1: its quicker and easier |
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| 01:06.04 | lastebill1 | ok |
| 01:06.23 | ksk | if you dont *need* to resize a partition, I would rather stay away from that. but yeah sure, you should be able to do it without any problems most of times |
| 01:06.27 | nvz | lastebill1: resizing will take awhile and if you dont need any data on it, then there is no reason to be resizing it |
| 01:07.08 | ksk | lastebill1: soo, to delete the partition and create a new one, its basicly these steps: |
| 01:08.24 | ksk | "parted /dev/sda <enter> print (to make sure sda is selected, and disks looks like you expect) <enter> del 1 <enter> (will delete first partition) |
| 01:08.50 | ksk | make sure sda is the device you want to "reformat" - your data will be lost by issuing the del command! (more or less..) |
| 01:09.10 | nvz | I somehow doubt that |
| 01:09.49 | ksk | then you do "mklabel GPT" (again, iirc, and it will ask you for a fancy name) - then mkpart with start 1 and end -1 - then you exit parted, then you call "mkfs.ext4 /dev/sda1" and be done |
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| 01:10.18 | ksk | deleting the partition table will of course not delete your data, but still you should not be doing that if you want to keep it in the first place.. :P |
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| 01:11.15 | joepublic | it will "make your data go away" which is kind of a fine distinction |
| 01:11.20 | ryouma` | i asked a question about audio a short while ago in an irc session that became wedged. i am back, but stil wedged in that versin of it and i have no scrollback and did not see any answers. |
| 01:11.51 | joepublic | fwiw ryouma` I saw it but have nothing to add. Be encouraged, most here are however smarter than I |
| 01:12.04 | ksk | ryouma`: as far as I can tell nobody shared any insights about that. maybe try again tomorrow, its sunday night right now in europe ;) |
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| 01:13.57 | lastebill1 | ksk: how about making a partition for the rest of the disk space? The rest of the space is currently unpartitioned, correct? |
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| 01:15.00 | ksk | man parted :P |
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| 01:15.45 | ryouma | ksk: joepublic thank you. i seem to have magically unwedged. |
| 01:15.54 | ksk | and yes, everything from "802GB" to "rest" is unpartitoned right now |
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| 01:22.19 | jim | trying to build a kernel package, it says it wants to install gcc 9 but it's not installable (and a couple others)... does this mean I can't build a kernel package under buster? |
| 01:22.43 | lastebill1 | so I use mkpart, extended. Is there a way to just start at the unpartitioned part of the disk and stop at the end? |
| 01:23.12 | lastebill1 | or is the only way to spesify the excakt location for both? |
| 01:23.44 | ksk | jim: "apt-cache search gcc-9" begs to differ.. what are you trying to install? care to paste? |
| 01:24.05 | ksk | lastebill1: good question, let me know the answer :P |
| 01:24.17 | lastebill1 | ok |
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| 01:25.44 | jim | ksk, just trying to build a 5.3.9 kernel (same version as buster backport) and try to use the newer-than-kernel-package way to do it (not sure yet what that is, discovering as I go) |
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| 01:26.41 | nvz | jim: debian packaging is mainlined |
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| 01:27.36 | jim | do you mean that the kernel source from kernel.org knows how to do it? |
| 01:27.57 | jim | if not, what do you mean? |
| 01:27.59 | joepublic | if you make deb-pkg on the sources from kernel.org it will make .deb files |
| 01:28.08 | nvz | jim: yes thats what I mena |
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| 01:28.27 | jim | nvz, ok, that's what I'm using |
| 01:29.19 | jim | I did make oldconfig on a copy of the config from the backport kernel, had to answer a couple questions, then I ran make deb-pkg |
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| 01:29.33 | nvz | jim: wget "https://mirrors.edge.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v5.x/linux-5.3.8.tar.xz"; tar Jxf linux-5.3.8.tar.xz; pkexec apt install flex bison build-essential; cd linux-5.3.8/; make menuconfig; make deb-pkg |
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| 01:30.02 | nvz | erm well.. I guess I used 5.3.8 not 5.3.9 :D |
| 01:30.06 | nvz | but you get the point |
| 01:30.26 | jim | nvz, I got the kernel source from git |
| 01:30.26 | nvz | I built a 5.4.1 recently I'm running now, but I jumped the gun a bit |
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| 01:30.43 | nvz | I'm sure linus would be proud :P |
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| 01:31.12 | jim | that would require that he cared about something |
| 01:31.48 | nvz | jim: what version are you using an oldconfig from? |
| 01:32.19 | jim | the buster backport one |
| 01:32.38 | nvz | ah.. so you're building a kernel just for the fun of it? |
| 01:32.43 | jim | yep |
| 01:32.53 | jim | pretty much, exactly |
| 01:33.04 | jim | dunno even if I'm gonna run it |
| 01:33.26 | nvz | that was pretty much why I did it.. but I didnt realize that virtualbox didnt yet support 5.x |
| 01:33.38 | nvz | but 6.1 was just released which now works with 5.x |
| 01:33.53 | joepublic | virtualbox is a great reason not to use newer kernels |
| 01:33.54 | jim | 6.1 of vbox? |
| 01:34.07 | nvz | yeah, its the first one to build 5.x kernel modules |
| 01:34.14 | nvz | just release a couple days ago |
| 01:34.25 | jim | or a great reason not to use virtualbox :) pick one :) |
| 01:34.42 | joepublic | I pick the latter and use qemu/kvm with aqemu |
| 01:35.10 | jim | whatsaqemu? |
| 01:35.15 | nvz | I tried qemu again awhile back.. still seemed like a bad idea to switch |
| 01:35.19 | joepublic | if you (1) can use virtualbox, and (2) are really patient, you can use aqemu |
| 01:35.33 | nvz | its still far more cumbersome to use, and didnt seem to support dynamic disks |
| 01:35.35 | joepublic | aqemu is a frontend for qemu/kvm vaguely similar to the virtualbox interface |
| 01:36.04 | jim | oh, like virt-manager? |
| 01:36.22 | joepublic | something like virt-manager, but looks-n-feels more like virtualbox in my opinion |
| 01:36.34 | jim | oh ok |
| 01:37.14 | nvz | I only have a 128GB ssd in here and I like to keep VMs for all the DEs handy.. virtualbox allows me to do that, making large disks but only occupying the space actually used on them |
| 01:37.31 | nvz | so I have 9 buster VMs on here under 50G |
| 01:37.32 | jim | how do I search for held packages? |
| 01:38.39 | nvz | jim: you could try something like dpkg -l | egrep ^.h |
| 01:38.49 | nvz | but aptitude has more advanced search features |
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| 01:39.21 | nvz | or you can just run any apt command, and it'll tell you there are held packages |
| 01:39.33 | joepublic | nvz, qemu's native .qcow disk image format only take up space actually occupied. the qemu-img command can convert back and forth between disk image formats. |
| 01:39.48 | joepublic | .qcow2 I should say, I guess |
| 01:40.07 | nvz | joepublic: news to me. I still see no reason to switch |
| 01:40.28 | joepublic | the newer kernel issue would be the reason to switch if it caused you a problem. |
| 01:40.43 | nvz | I like the ease of use of virtualbox, the saved state, the scale/seamless/fullscreen/windowed modes.. etc |
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| 01:41.02 | nvz | I just went back to the stock kernel and waited a few days for the new virtualbox release :P |
| 01:41.19 | joepublic | those features exist in clunkier versions in qemu, but qemu doesn't do video acceleration, so that would be a big reason not to switch if you need that. |
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| 01:42.44 | joepublic | for my qemu virtual machines I run them in the background and connect to the with vnc. not vncserver running on the host, but connect straight to qemu with krdc vnc client, which shows whatever's on the guest machine's screen, from bios post on. |
| 01:43.13 | r4u1 | SET theme chaves.theme |
| 01:43.34 | joepublic | THEME SET failed. Thanks and have a nice day. |
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| 01:43.41 | spaceghost | Hello. |
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| 01:43.49 | joepublic | greetings. |
| 01:43.55 | spaceghost | I am having a problem trying to use weechat. |
| 01:44.24 | spaceghost | Oh, it is like more with my user. |
| 01:44.31 | spaceghost | Could not chdir to home directory /home/spaceghost: No such file or directory |
| 01:44.31 | spaceghost | $ weechat |
| 01:44.32 | spaceghost | Error: cannot create directory "/home/spaceghost/.weechat" |
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| 01:45.02 | ksk | spaceghost: why dont you have a home directory? you are running weechat as user, yes? |
| 01:45.12 | joepublic | out of curiosity what does `whoami` or `ls -al ~` say? |
| 01:45.32 | spaceghost | Yes. |
| 01:45.35 | ksk | rather what joe-public says, if you dont know answers to my questions ;) |
| 01:46.15 | jim | spaceghost, could you run: ls -ld / /home /home/spaceghost /home/spaceghost/.weechat 2>&1 | nc termbin.com 9999 |
| 01:46.39 | joepublic | much better jim. |
| 01:47.03 | jim | well I think that would identify the problem |
| 01:48.04 | jim | we'll get the error messages too |
| 01:48.12 | jim | if any :) |
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| 01:49.46 | jim | joepublic, I built a feature into my irc script that turns /home/spaceghost/.weechat into / /home /home/spaceghost /home/spaceghost/.weechat |
| 01:50.06 | joepublic | well done. |
| 01:50.18 | spaceghost | Uhm. |
| 01:50.39 | jim | because I discovered that permission problems come up here often enough to justify hacking it into there |
| 01:50.44 | spaceghost | As soon as i log i see this: |
| 01:50.55 | spaceghost | Could not chdir to home directory /home/spaceghost: No such file or directory |
| 01:51.04 | jim | uhoh |
| 01:51.19 | joepublic | that takes us back to, wonder why you don't have a home directory. how's that paste coming? |
| 01:51.31 | spaceghost | I changed the password recently, not sure if that can be related. |
| 01:51.33 | jim | that identifies the problem, like a sledgehammer on a christmas reindeer |
| 01:51.56 | *** part/#debian dctrud (~dctrud@cpe-70-119-131-248.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 01:52.06 | ksk | might be you put your /home on a partiton/disk/whatever that is not available right now, but thats rather something you can tell us, than the other way round.. |
| 01:52.15 | jim | spaceghost, are you using that same machine to irc here? |
| 01:52.20 | spaceghost | https://termbin.com/junf |
| 01:52.24 | spaceghost | No jim. |
| 01:52.36 | spaceghost | I am trying to install an irc client in my vps. |
| 01:52.44 | spaceghost | Here i am connected from my localhost. |
| 01:53.15 | jim | so, did you create the user for that today? |
| 01:53.24 | joepublic | have you ever logged in to your server and not seen a warning about no home directory? if so, what changed between then and now? |
| 01:53.51 | ksk | also your ls "/home" shows "Aug 30" -- which is quite some days from this day.. |
| 01:54.11 | jim | spaceghost, so, did you create the user for that today? |
| 01:54.30 | jim | (or similarly recently) |
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| 01:56.51 | spaceghost_ | <jim> spaceghost, so, did you create the user for that today? |
| 01:56.53 | spaceghost_ | No. |
| 01:57.11 | spaceghost_ | I changed the password for it, but it can't be 30 august. |
| 01:57.25 | spaceghost_ | It was less than a week ago. |
| 01:57.53 | ksk | spaceghost: "grep spaceghost /etc/passwd" shows what exactly? |
| 01:57.53 | spaceghost_ | A good practice would be create a new user just for the irc relay? |
| 01:58.36 | spaceghost_ | spaceghost:x:1000:1000::/home/spaceghost:/bin/sh |
| 01:59.07 | ksk | seems you deleted it, then. |
| 02:00.15 | spaceghost | Should i create it again?, how is possible that i could login to it? |
| 02:00.54 | spaceghost | The installation is quite new, maybe i will reinstall all. |
| 02:01.01 | ksk | you dont need a home directory to login (as you see) |
| 02:01.19 | ksk | you should rather think about how you could delete the folder, without noticing.. |
| 02:01.52 | ksk | regarding the user, just delete it and then add it again - no reason to re setup the whole box again |
| 02:02.07 | ksk | you can also just create the dir, and set the user accordingly of course. |
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| 02:17.26 | jim | spaceghost, do you have any kind of root access to it? when did you first try creating the spaceghost login on it? |
| 02:18.18 | spaceghost | I just reinstalled the server, i have a doubt however. |
| 02:18.42 | spaceghost | The good practice is to login as a simple user and use sudo to install things, right? |
| 02:18.46 | jim | also, what command did you use to create the user? |
| 02:19.01 | spaceghost | Useradd spaceghost. |
| 02:19.16 | jim | ok that' |
| 02:19.26 | jim | is why it didn't create the home dir |
| 02:19.57 | spaceghost | What is the command to delete the user and create it again? |
| 02:20.16 | jim | first, userdel spaceghost |
| 02:20.23 | jim | that will delete it |
| 02:20.43 | jim | what do you want for its primary group? |
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| 02:21.40 | spaceghost | I don't know, i want it only to run my irc client, what permissions i should give?, as less as possible. |
| 02:21.57 | spaceghost | bash: userdel: command not found |
| 02:22.22 | jim | you'd have to do it as root, with the correct path established |
| 02:23.15 | spaceghost | I am as root now. |
| 02:23.42 | jim | is /usr/sbin in your path? |
| 02:24.26 | spaceghost | No, i was going to ask what would be that, thank you. |
| 02:24.39 | jim | echo $PATH to see what's in there now |
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| 02:26.58 | spaceghost | It gives me: /usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games, so cd /usr/local/bin? |
| 02:27.30 | ksk | you missed the "-" when su-ing.. |
| 02:28.21 | ksk | !su |
| 02:28.22 | dpkg | extra, extra read all about it, su is switch/set user. It is used to change User ID's and/or gain super user access. Since Debian Buster, "su -" or "su -l" is needed to access programs located in /sbin. It provides an root environment as if the superuser had logged in directly. See "man su". |
| 02:28.37 | jim | so get out of that root shell using: exit <enter>, then get back in using su - |
| 02:28.45 | spaceghost | Ahh. |
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| 02:30.30 | jim | about the user... normally, debian will create a group that's the same name as the user, and make that your primary group |
| 02:30.42 | jim | spaceghost, want to do that? |
| 02:30.46 | spaceghost | Oke. The user is deleted. What command to create the user now? |
| 02:30.48 | joepublic | hint, yes you do |
| 02:30.55 | spaceghost | Yes. |
| 02:31.01 | joepublic | adduser spaceghost |
| 02:31.24 | jim | ok, the command adduser <username> will do all that for you |
| 02:31.45 | ksk | spaceghost: btw, "man useradd" would kind of have told you to use adduser instead ;) |
| 02:32.12 | spaceghost | Thank you. |
| 02:33.09 | jim | also, useradd would need a "-m" flag to create the home directory -and- populate it with whatever is in /etc/skel |
| 02:33.22 | jim | adduser will just do that |
| 02:33.58 | forbid | not gonna lie i wasted a lot of my time fiddling with useradd before i realized adduser is way better |
| 02:34.20 | spaceghost | One more question, i put this: sudo apt-get update and then i am asked for password of spaceghost and it says that is not in the sudoers list. |
| 02:34.31 | ksk | you should maybe invest in the habit of reading manpages before trying commands out :P |
| 02:34.32 | spaceghost | Then for what is sudo? |
| 02:34.58 | ksk | spaceghost: for "su" you need to know the root-pw. to use sudo your own user password |
| 02:35.18 | forbid | well the thing is i did use the man page for useradd but i glossed over the fact that adduser is better :) |
| 02:35.18 | ksk | but you need to allow your user to become root (via sudo) first |
| 02:35.20 | jim | spaceghost, you can add sudoers to the user's list of secondary groups |
| 02:35.51 | spaceghost | <ksk> but you need to allow your user to become root (via sudo) first |
| 02:36.05 | jim | (and -no-, that's -not- sewerdewers) |
| 02:36.07 | spaceghost | How i do that and is security riskly? |
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| 02:36.17 | spaceghost | Risky. |
| 02:36.48 | ksk | it means that anyone who knows your users password can become root - in contrast to anyone knowing root its password - so not really a risk if you are aware of that little difference |
| 02:37.09 | joepublic | spaceghost, you could also as root use the command visudo to add your user to sudo - there is a line that looks like 'root ALL (ALL:ALL) ALL' -- right under it, add an identical line that says spaceghost instead of root |
| 02:37.15 | ksk | and you do that by adding your user to the sudoers group, as jim pointed out. |
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| 02:38.17 | jim | (trying to add yourself to sewerdewers will not work, since there's no such group, and even if there were, kinda gross...) |
| 02:38.22 | ryouma | i always get useradd and adduser mixed up |
| 02:38.42 | joepublic | not that they are confusingly similarly named or anything |
| 02:38.46 | spaceghost | Oke. |
| 02:38.54 | spaceghost | I found it is: usermod -aG sudo spaceghost. |
| 02:39.24 | jim | spaceghost, almost |
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| 02:39.39 | jim | usermod -aG sudoers |
| 02:39.45 | ksk | its rather the debian way to add user to group, imho |
| 02:39.54 | jim | oops that's wrong too |
| 02:39.56 | ksk | and yes group is called "sudo" only. |
| 02:40.02 | jim | usermod -aG sudoers spaceghost |
| 02:40.14 | jim | oh it is? |
| 02:40.27 | jim | then you were right in the first place |
| 02:40.47 | spaceghost | Oke. |
| 02:42.23 | jim | spaceghost, take a look at: cat /etc/group | grep sudo |
| 02:42.50 | spaceghost | sudo:x:27:spaceghost |
| 02:43.02 | jim | the group name will be on the left side, with members on the right side of the colon after the groupid |
| 02:43.04 | spaceghost | But still it doesn't work. |
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| 02:43.15 | ksk | you need to login again for it to work ;) |
| 02:43.27 | ksk | or, start a new shell should do. |
| 02:43.32 | spaceghost | Thank you. |
| 02:43.47 | ksk | (check with the "id" command if it shows you the sudo group) |
| 02:43.53 | spaceghost | It works now. |
| 02:44.01 | jim | spaceghost, ok, good |
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| 02:44.55 | jim | now that we're here, solved the thing about the user not having a home dir, was there something else? |
| 02:45.04 | spaceghost | Yes. |
| 02:45.09 | jim | ok |
| 02:45.26 | spaceghost | When i try to do apt-get upgrade it says: E: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'sudo dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem. |
| 02:45.54 | spaceghost | Even being a clean installation, maybe because i killed a process to delete the user spaceghost? |
| 02:46.01 | jim | ok |
| 02:46.11 | jim | run: sudo -i |
| 02:46.12 | joepublic | i suggest trying something like 'sudo dpkg --configure -a' |
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| 02:46.41 | spaceghost | <jim> run: sudo -i. Done. |
| 02:46.48 | jim | (and he didn't recommend my way because you have to be really careful |
| 02:47.09 | jim | you should be at a root shell (ending in #), yes? |
| 02:47.16 | spaceghost | Yes. |
| 02:47.34 | jim | ok, try: dpkg --configure --pending |
| 02:47.58 | spaceghost | Processing triggers for libc-bin (2.28-10) ... |
| 02:48.17 | spaceghost | Now i must kill a process? |
| 02:48.23 | jim | sounds like it had more stuff to do after being interrupted |
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| 02:48.25 | jim | nho |
| 02:48.36 | jim | let it go |
| 02:48.50 | ksk | no. you dont really ever have to kill a process if you are doing things the correct way. |
| 02:48.52 | jim | err, rather, let it continue |
| 02:49.00 | spaceghost | Oke. |
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| 02:49.44 | jim | ('let it go' has another meaning that I'd rather reserve) |
| 02:50.21 | spaceghost | Oke, now apt-get upgrade worked, thank you folks. |
| 02:51.08 | jim | "oh, you're aiming a nuke at that other irc user who's giving you trouble? put the nuke down carefully, we know you're mad, so just let it go" |
| 02:52.31 | jim | spaceghost, do you remember what command was interrupted? |
| 02:53.47 | jim | do you remember what you were trying to do? |
| 02:54.23 | spaceghost | I was trying to delete the old spaceghost created with useradd and then it was impossible because two processes. |
| 02:54.55 | jim | sec |
| 02:54.58 | joepublic | ah, can't delete a user that owns processes. |
| 02:55.28 | jim | do you remember what you were doing before you wanted to do that? |
| 02:55.53 | jim | well let's see... |
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| 02:57.17 | spaceghost | Maybe it was an apt-get update. |
| 02:57.24 | jim | spaceghost, could you run: (cat /etc/debian_version ; echo --------------- ; cat /etc/apt/sources.list) | nc termbin.com 9999 |
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| 02:58.05 | spaceghost | https://termbin.com/hz4w |
| 02:59.34 | jim | what does df -h /var say? |
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| 03:00.23 | spaceghost | Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on /dev/vda1 25G 1.4G 22G 6% / |
| 03:00.33 | Elon_Satoshi | hello |
| 03:00.45 | jim | hi |
| 03:00.58 | Elon_Satoshi | where can I get support for running a java jar file? it seems ##java isn't for tech support? |
| 03:00.58 | jim | ok, you have plenty of space there... |
| 03:01.36 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: if its more than "java foo.jar" I suppose by the vendor you got that jar from? |
| 03:01.37 | Elon_Satoshi | (on debian 10, that is) |
| 03:01.43 | jim | spaceghost, could you run: apt -d dist-upgrade, see if that wants to do anything |
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| 03:02.14 | Elon_Satoshi | the problem is the "vendor" aka developer hasn't been seen on github in months |
| 03:02.37 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: what kind of problems do you run into? |
| 03:02.39 | Elon_Satoshi | lemme see if there was a response yet to the issue i posted |
| 03:02.45 | jim | Elon_Satoshi, I think debian has openjdk packaged |
| 03:03.01 | Elon_Satoshi | so this is the issue https://github.com/titinko/utsu/issues/26 |
| 03:03.19 | Elon_Satoshi | and I've experienced the same issue after installing openjdk-11-jre with apt |
| 03:04.01 | jim | Elon_Satoshi, do you have the command java? |
| 03:04.04 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: you did install " openjdk-8-jre and openjfx" as the dev suggests? |
| 03:04.08 | Elon_Satoshi | here, lemme try said apt package again though just to be sure |
| 03:04.27 | spaceghost | 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded |
| 03:04.51 | Elon_Satoshi | ksk: openjdk-8-jre doesn't seem to exist though |
| 03:05.08 | Elon_Satoshi | there's nvidia-openjdk-8-jre but isn't that a bit different? |
| 03:05.09 | jim | spaceghost, ok, you should be good, nothing to do for dist-upgrade |
| 03:05.43 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: there is a package "openjdk-8-jre" in buster - try that :P |
| 03:06.05 | ksk | also, you have another folder "assets" in the folder where the jar file is? |
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| 03:06.45 | ksk | eh no, wrong machine, sorry. |
| 03:06.49 | ksk | ,v openjdk-8-jre |
| 03:06.50 | judd | Package: openjdk-8-jre on amd64 -- stretch: 8u222-b10-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 8u232-b09-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 8u232-b09-1~deb9u1; sid: 8u232-b09-1 |
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| 03:07.52 | jim | spaceghost, what do you like to do with your debian installation? (or, what -would- you like to do if you could)? |
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| 03:09.22 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: mhhm, it seems to me only "openjdk-11-jre" is in buster - 8 is rather old I suppose |
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| 03:09.27 | spaceghost | Use it for an irc bouncer, maybe a vpn, and an online radio. |
| 03:09.38 | Elon_Satoshi | ksk: indeed |
| 03:09.50 | jim | ,v openjdk-11-jre |
| 03:09.51 | judd | Package: openjdk-11-jre on amd64 -- buster: 11.0.4+11-1~deb10u1; stretch-backports: 11.0.5+10-1~bpo9+1; buster-proposed-updates: 11.0.5+10-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 11.0.5+10-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 11.0.6+7-1; sid: 11.0.6+7-1 |
| 03:09.52 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: I think you are then down to "get java from oracle" - if they still have a supported java8 version at all - or tell the dev to upgrade to a supported and maintained java release |
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| 03:12.24 | ksk | Elon_Satoshi: if you then are forced to run unmaintained java8, I would suggest doing so in a virtual machine, if possible. |
| 03:13.20 | ksk | "Java SE at a Glance |
| 03:13.39 | ksk | eh. "Java SE 8 from Oracle at java.com, until at least the end of December 2020 for Personal, Development and other Users." |
| 03:14.07 | jim | spaceghost, it'll take a bit of effort, but you can probably set znc up on it |
| 03:14.20 | ksk | so it seems you might still have one year of "Java SE 8" support, whatever that "standard edition" means, anyways.. |
| 03:14.54 | ksk | spaceghost: might also be you are looking for a "tmux + irssi (insert CLI irc client here" setup - I quite like it myself |
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| 03:15.52 | ksk | you then connect to your box via ssh (or mosh), re-attach to the screen/tmux and have your irc client running. it will continue running if you are gone/not logged in - and you can connect back to it at any time |
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| 03:19.46 | moaker_ | hey guys |
| 03:20.05 | moaker_ | got debian working ;p |
| 03:20.23 | nvz | dpkg, gender? |
| 03:20.23 | dpkg | I'm hermaphroditic |
| 03:20.46 | moaker_ | wondering if theres a program to increase color saturation |
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| 03:21.14 | moaker_ | there should have to be |
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| 03:22.50 | nvz | moaker_: which DE are you using? |
| 03:23.05 | spaceghost | <ksk> spaceghost: might also be you are looking for a "tmux + irssi (insert CLI irc client here" setup - I quite like it myself |
| 03:23.14 | moaker_ | kde atm.. but open to others |
| 03:23.27 | nvz | ,i kolor-manager |
| 03:23.28 | judd | No package named 'kolor-manager' was found in buster/amd64. |
| 03:23.29 | spaceghost | Yes, or weechat plus glowing bear or quassel server plus quassel client. |
| 03:23.50 | moaker_ | ahh thx nvz |
| 03:24.01 | nvz | ,i kolormanager |
| 03:24.02 | judd | No package named 'kolormanager' was found in buster/amd64. |
| 03:24.46 | moaker_ | hmm repos cant find it either heh |
| 03:25.06 | moaker_ | but ill google |
| 03:25.20 | nvz | I know the nvidia driver implements something called digital vibrance which is pretty amazing |
| 03:25.43 | nvz | but without a fancy driver based tool, icc_profiles are a PITA especially system wide |
| 03:27.32 | moaker_ | yeah ;/ |
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| 03:30.30 | nvz | moaker_: it either has to be done in hardware (monitor), driver, or software.. like compiz or such compositor |
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| 03:31.36 | moaker_ | compiz only supports single windows no |
| 03:32.01 | moaker_ | dpkg: error processing package oyranos (--install): |
| 03:32.01 | dpkg | moaker_: That isn't an error, post the whole output to a pastebin (/msg dpkg pastebin). |
| 03:32.02 | moaker_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:32.35 | moaker_ | o.o that was a quick response |
| 03:32.59 | ksk | dpkg is a bot :P |
| 03:32.59 | dpkg | ksk: I wish you would RTFM. |
| 03:33.07 | moaker_ | kool will do |
| 03:33.22 | moaker_ | lol |
| 03:41.49 | moaker_ | oh well almost everything works |
| 03:42.04 | ksk | !next |
| 03:42.04 | dpkg | Another happy customer leaves the building. |
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| 03:52.08 | nvz | moaker: you hangin around awhile? |
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| 03:56.05 | goofball128 | when is debian 10.3 coming out |
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| 04:05.52 | annadane | goofball128, i think roughly mid january |
| 04:06.18 | annadane | it's never an exact thing with debian releases, either major versions or point releases |
| 04:07.07 | goofball128 | thanks annadane |
| 04:07.13 | goofball128 | just wanted an approximate date |
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| 04:09.56 | ryouma | i just came in. what is rougholy mid january? |
| 04:10.11 | goofball128 | debian point release |
| 04:10.17 | ryouma | ah |
| 04:10.40 | ryouma | when does stretch become lts? this is not listed on the lts page last i checked (just |
| 04:10.44 | ryouma | 2020) |
| 04:11.20 | goofball128 | is this of any help? ryouma https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian_version_history#Release_table |
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| 04:14.10 | annadane | stretch becomes LTS in july of 2021 |
| 04:14.25 | annadane | oldstable has full support for one year after release of stable |
| 04:15.12 | goofball128 | if debian is run as a server by a lot of people, how do they update it, do they have to? |
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| 04:17.10 | annadane | there's unattended-upgrades |
| 04:17.18 | annadane | not sure what a lot of people use though |
| 04:17.37 | annadane | but yes most updates are security fixes, so they do have to |
| 04:17.55 | ryouma | annadane: goofball128 thanks |
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| 04:18.09 | ryouma | so i have /a little/ time |
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| 04:24.58 | jim | goofball128, let's get concrete here a moment... do you have a server running debian that you might want to ask about? |
| 04:25.51 | goofball128 | jim i don't, sorry to bother, it was a question just out of curiosity |
| 04:26.34 | jim | ok... might you be planning such a server, either for yourself, for your work or for someone else? |
| 04:27.03 | goofball128 | jim no but i am planning to switch from Windows to Debian, for learning purposes |
| 04:27.35 | ryouma | the thing about my sound card is, the speaker clicks (like it does when you plug in the plug) upon reboot. i wonder if that indicates anything about software? or is it just that power is lost momentariily? |
| 04:28.47 | jim | (debian is pretty flexible as far as upgrades... in order to upgrade, you would need disk space in the /var directory so the upgrade process can download package files there) |
| 04:29.26 | nvz | moaker: does this help if key == 'red': |
| 04:29.29 | nvz | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:29.29 | nvz | meh |
| 04:29.34 | goofball128 | jim so there's no need to completely reinstall the OS? if a new stable version came out that is |
| 04:29.45 | nvz | moaker: does this help? http://paste.debian.net/1123121/ |
| 04:30.15 | ryouma | goofball128: you can dist-upgrade for many years |
| 04:30.33 | jim | goofball128, exactly... you need to follow a couple of rules for that to happen properly, and, they're easy |
| 04:30.51 | nvz | moaker: for me, turning down the gamma makes the contrast look higher.. |
| 04:31.08 | goofball128 | jim that's interesting, thanks for the information |
| 04:31.11 | ryouma | the instructions for buster were pretty intimidating. but maybe theya re ok. i should take another look. |
| 04:31.17 | nvz | moaker: or the saturation rather |
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| 04:32.09 | ryouma | goofball128: then the problem is, if you want to take your sinstallation and run it on different hardware. i do this, and it works, but i'm haveing sound card issues. |
| 04:32.13 | ryouma | i.e. no sound |
| 04:32.19 | jim | I like to let it just download package files, at a time when I'm eating dinner or sleeping... then I can start the upgrade again and let it install the packages (part of what I mean by flexibility) |
| 04:32.26 | nvz | changes line 23 to read: widget['widget'] = Scale(self, from_=0.1, to=10, orient=HORIZONTAL, resolution=0.001, name=setting) |
| 04:32.37 | nvz | as it supports much higher floating point resolution than I thought :P |
| 04:32.49 | ryouma | jim: is this just an option to apt-get and apt? |
| 04:33.08 | jim | yes, specifically the -d option |
| 04:33.34 | ryouma | then you don't wait for those incessant configuration dialogs -- they are all at once? |
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| 04:34.13 | nvz | moaker: http://paste.debian.net/1123123/ |
| 04:34.33 | jim | well that's not what I mean... you can jsut download package files, and you can install those packages... the former is with -d, the latter, without |
| 04:34.40 | nvz | moaker: just save it as a file "pygamma" then "chmod -x pygamma" and "./pygamma" |
| 04:34.44 | annadane | ryouma, the thing with any instructions is you have to decide what's important to you - people have a lot of different configurations/expectations so the release notes are more detailed than the average person perhaps needs |
| 04:35.05 | annadane | generally a lot of people probably can just update sources, apt update, apt upgrade, apt dist-upgrade... but do read the notes |
| 04:35.13 | annadane | if only to skim |
| 04:35.27 | nvz | is a regular tkinter one-trick-pony |
| 04:35.33 | jim | if you're running a server for someone else, of course you have to be very careful |
| 04:36.02 | ryouma | annadane: yeah i think i am ok at that. i was intimidated by e.g. internet interface renaming. but then i ran into it and figured out on my own taht you can do config -a and then add a line to /etc/network something or other, and there is no fancy other stuff you need to do |
| 04:36.23 | ryouma | (that is i think i am ok at discardign most o0f the irrelevnatn stuff. but it was still intimidating) |
| 04:36.51 | jim | annadane, there's usually a step before all those, before even changing your sources: you would first bring your -current- version up to date |
| 04:37.59 | ryouma | jim: i thought that is what you meant. to dist upgrade to buster do you do apt update; apt -d upgrade; apt -d dist-upgrade, then do the samet hing without -d? |
| 04:38.06 | annadane | "issues to be aware of for $stablereleasename" is probably more important than "stuff that's new" |
| 04:38.15 | annadane | and a lot of it won't apply to most people |
| 04:38.18 | nvz | that lil tool can def use some cleanup :P *shrugs* |
| 04:38.48 | annadane | though, do back up your stuff before release upgrades |
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| 04:39.25 | jim | annadane, example, if you're running stretch and you want to get to buster, you would first run dist-upgrade without changing sources |
| 04:39.53 | jim | then change sources to buster, then go from there according to the release notew |
| 04:39.57 | jim | notes |
| 04:41.06 | ryouma | indeed, but presumably the release notes tells you to do so. i hope. |
| 04:43.13 | annadane | i was surprised to learn release upgrades are relatively painful in the BSDs |
| 04:43.26 | annadane | debian by contrast is kind of famously known for ease of transition |
| 04:43.40 | annadane | and if you want to be really sure the problems are ironed out, wait until x.1 |
| 04:44.09 | annadane | or even x.2 for the truly paranoid, you do get a year of full support |
| 04:44.26 | ryouma | my problem is i read the realease notes and take notes on them and then... if they change i won't know |
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| 04:47.05 | jim | ryouma, I think I would: apt dist-upgrade (with -d if I don't have time, and without again when I have time); at this point the older dist should be uptodate; then change sources to the next version of debian (no further than one though), then apt -d upgrade (then without -d when I have time then), then apt upgrade with -d if I don't have time (but then I run it again without the -d to complete this part of the upgrade) |
| 04:47.47 | annadane | and do change your sources to the code name, not 'stable' |
| 04:48.21 | jim | annadane, yes, if you change them to "stable", you could get surprised :P |
| 04:49.11 | annadane | i still haven't done an actual release upgrade |
| 04:49.21 | annadane | all my installs of stretch and buster were new |
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| 04:50.49 | jim | annadane, how many stretches do you have/. |
| 04:50.50 | jim | ? |
| 04:50.50 | ryouma | annadane: installing takes forever though. you have to create all your accounts, and make sure you have the same packages that you used to (not sure what to do for tihs as there are different instructions out there), then make sure your /etc is appropriate, right? |
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| 04:51.30 | annadane | jim, 1, i've reinstalled a bunch |
| 04:51.41 | annadane | ryouma, pretty much |
| 04:51.51 | annadane | well, i have zero stretches right now |
| 04:51.59 | annadane | i'm on 10 |
| 04:52.03 | jim | annadane, what purpose does your one stretch serve? |
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| 04:52.19 | jim | oh, you don't have any? |
| 04:52.28 | annadane | nope, just the one install |
| 04:52.48 | jim | how many busters you got |
| 04:52.49 | jim | ? |
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| 04:53.05 | annadane | like i said, 1 |
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| 04:54.17 | jim | oh ok :) maybe if you have the disk space, you could install a stretch to see how an upgrade of it would go |
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| 04:56.54 | annadane | i've pretty much used debian the most ineffficient ways possible |
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| 05:18.26 | pythonhelpadjjj | I have a very stupid question. |
| 05:18.38 | pythonhelpadjjj | Why is /bin and /sbin not added to the $PATH on a fresh install by default? |
| 05:19.35 | pythonhelpadjjj | Is this a recent change? |
| 05:19.57 | auscompgeek | don't fresh installs merge those into /usr? |
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| 05:20.42 | pythonhelpadjjj | I'm not sure auscompgeek, I just found when I installed ufw I couldn't call it due to a broken path |
| 05:20.52 | pythonhelpadjjj | It was a quick but annoying fix. |
| 05:21.10 | pythonhelpadjjj | Right now I'm just writing my first ever unit file! |
| 05:21.20 | pythonhelpadjjj | I'm so glad we went systemd. |
| 05:21.35 | auscompgeek | https://wiki.debian.org/UsrMerge |
| 05:22.09 | auscompgeek | so a fresh install of buster onwards should be defaulting to the /usr merge |
| 05:22.22 | pythonhelpadjjj | So ufw needs to be updated? |
| 05:22.28 | auscompgeek | no |
| 05:22.28 | pythonhelpadjjj | The ufw package in the repos at least |
| 05:22.35 | pythonhelpadjjj | That's weird |
| 05:23.17 | pythonhelpadjjj | I don't feel like submitting a official bug report so if someone else wants to. Debian 10, fresh install, install ufw, can't access ufw without modifying $PATH to contain /bin |
| 05:23.49 | pythonhelpadjjj | Not even root can |
| 05:23.50 | auscompgeek | is /bin not a symlink on your freshly-installed system? |
| 05:24.00 | pythonhelpadjjj | no |
| 05:24.04 | auscompgeek | weird |
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| 05:24.41 | pythonhelpadjjj | My system works perfectly otherwise |
| 05:29.03 | pythonhelpadjjj | I'm just learning how to handle systemd |
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| 05:37.02 | ryouma | firefox-esr is crashing before it even comes up. i have completely replaced my .mozilla directory with a known good one and it still crashes. this has occurred before recently and spontaneously fixed itself. is there some other source of data firefox reads from? |
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| 05:42.02 | nvz | ryouma: ~/.cache/fontconfig ~/.cache/mozilla ..etc |
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| 05:43.22 | nvz | ryouma: mkdir ~/ffesr-test; HOME=~/ffesr-test firefox-esr |
| 05:43.42 | nvz | ryouma: should run it like new, create a dotfile tree under ~/ffesr-test so you know what files it uses |
| 05:45.03 | ryouma | nvz: will try |
| 05:48.05 | ryouma | nvz: it still crashes (with the same dialog but not themed for gtk). it creates files in .cache and .mozilla. it does not create any fontconfig things. |
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| 05:48.56 | nvz | it could still be getting things from dbus or something |
| 05:49.38 | nvz | only sure fire way to test it clean is make a new user |
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| 05:50.32 | nvz | there is also a -safe-mode option |
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| 05:52.10 | pythonhelpadjjj | Quick question! |
| 05:52.24 | pythonhelpadjjj | Anyone know how to run a command when a systemd service dies and gets respawned? |
| 05:53.28 | pythonhelpadjjj | I want to pause for a few seconds, ensure the process has completely left memory, run a command to send a message, then begin the restart |
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| 05:57.26 | han-solo | pythonhelpadjjj: https://docs.python.org/3/library/atexit.html # something like that ? |
| 05:57.38 | ryouma | nvz: -safe-mode crashed. i tried using another user, but i don't have another user with any kind of x set up, and sux - no longer operates properly to make the other user show up on my user's x. |
| 05:59.19 | pythonhelpadjjj | han-solo, Yes but systemd |
| 05:59.36 | ryouma | nvz: ok, i did xhost +, run quickly from another user, xhost -. it crashed exactly the same as with main user |
| 05:59.53 | ryouma | it also said: ExceptionHandler::GenerateDump cloned child 24140 ExceptionHandler::SendContinueSignalToChild sent continue signal to child ExceptionHandler::WaitForContinueSignal waiting for continue signal... |
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| 06:01.23 | han-solo | pythonhelpadjjj: i mean, why do you want it to exit completely ? The script can do some processing on `exit` no ? |
| 06:01.53 | pythonhelpadjjj | han-solo, What script? |
| 06:02.04 | pythonhelpadjjj | I'm writing a systemd unit |
| 06:02.23 | nvz | pythonhelpadjjj: OnFailure= tells it what unit(s) to call on a failure |
| 06:02.42 | pythonhelpadjjj | nvz That looks like it should be it! |
| 06:04.02 | pythonhelpadjjj | That's it! |
| 06:04.08 | pythonhelpadjjj | nvz, thank you :)! |
| 06:04.16 | pythonhelpadjjj | han-solo, thank you for trying too! :) |
| 06:04.52 | han-solo | no problem |
| 06:05.00 | nvz | pythonhelpadjjj: thats if you dont have it auto restarting, and have a failure unit doing the restarting |
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| 06:05.31 | nvz | pythonhelpadjjj: another way might be ExecStartPre=, ExecStartPost=, ExecStop=, ExecStopPost=, or ExecReload= |
| 06:06.11 | nvz | pythonhelpadjjj: see the Restart= in systemd-service(5) |
| 06:06.38 | pythonhelpadjjj | nvz, so if I have it do Restart=on-failure I can't use OnFailure but instead must use ExecReload? |
| 06:07.08 | annadane | what actually are the best resources for systemd learning? |
| 06:07.12 | pythonhelpadjjj | I just wanna write this down before I got to bed. Writing this unit file has kept me up an extra 2 hours. I've never done it before and now I feel comfortable doing it again |
| 06:07.54 | pythonhelpadjjj | annadane, The documents are extremely verbose and don't get to the point fast, but they do tell you a lot. stackoverflow has been a god send to me and reading other unit files in /etc/systemd/system has been very very helpful! |
| 06:08.07 | han-solo | maybe `ExecStopPost=`... |
| 06:08.17 | annadane | freedesktop has some good pages |
| 06:08.29 | annadane | it's just such a massive thing that it's hard to keep on top of |
| 06:08.30 | han-solo | annadane: https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd.service.html # this one ? |
| 06:08.44 | nvz | annadane: man pages or freedesktop.org or #systemd |
| 06:09.17 | ryouma | i can't even keep on top of /bin/true |
| 06:09.32 | han-solo | i wish, they showed more example use case service, timer, tareget units |
| 06:09.35 | pythonhelpadjjj | ryouma, I suggest you try /bin/false instead! |
| 06:09.42 | ryouma | that's even worse! |
| 06:09.50 | pythonhelpadjjj | what about /bin/yes?! |
| 06:10.01 | annadane | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:10.21 | pythonhelpadjjj | I have a /bin/fish. this explains why it smells. |
| 06:10.26 | pythonhelpadjjj | :s |
| 06:11.04 | annadane | i've messed around briefly with fish and zsh, i wonder how much the ones in debian are useful compared to the more recent upstream versions |
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| 06:12.06 | pythonhelpadjjj | I just use bash |
| 06:12.17 | annadane | same really |
| 06:12.24 | pythonhelpadjjj | I'm going to get shot and +b for what I'm about to say but it's worth it |
| 06:12.27 | annadane | my muscle memory is suited to that |
| 06:12.32 | pythonhelpadjjj | I use php scripts in place of bash scripts for automation. |
| 06:12.44 | pythonhelpadjjj | fight me. |
| 06:12.55 | nvz | while true; do /bin/there; done that |
| 06:12.55 | annadane | !start a shell war |
| 06:12.56 | dpkg | bash sucks! |
| 06:13.14 | han-solo | while you are at it, why not an editor war too |
| 06:13.35 | ryouma | well i don't think i, who use bash, have any moral right to fight anybody over any language |
| 06:13.44 | pythonhelpadjjj | I've been insulted so many times for using nano instead of vim / emacs |
| 06:13.58 | pythonhelpadjjj | "just use vim! its a real editor! it does so much more!!!" |
| 06:14.10 | ryouma | if it works, it works |
| 06:14.17 | ryouma | wfy i mean |
| 06:14.18 | pythonhelpadjjj | "its easy to learn! just use emacs!" |
| 06:14.23 | pythonhelpadjjj | ryouma, Exactly! |
| 06:14.28 | annadane | !start an editor war |
| 06:14.28 | dpkg | edlin is known to decrease your lifespan! |
| 06:14.34 | pythonhelpadjjj | I've been hooked to nano for all of time |
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| 06:14.38 | annadane | !ed |
| 06:14.38 | dpkg | methinks ed is the standard editor! http://www.cs.hmc.edu/~smikes/emacs/ed.html, or http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=1991Jul11.031731.9260@athena.mit.edu&output=gplain |
| 06:14.55 | annadane | oh hi there broken link |
| 06:15.12 | pythonhelpadjjj | !nano |
| 06:15.12 | dpkg | GNU nano is a text <editor>, the default editor on Debian systems since 4.0 "Etch". nano is also a DFSG-free alternative to <pico>. http://www.nano-editor.org/dist/v2.2/faq.html http://www.nano-editor.org/ |
| 06:15.24 | pythonhelpadjjj | nano just works. |
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| 06:15.36 | pythonhelpadjjj | No learning curve, it works. It's almost always there |
| 06:15.43 | ryouma | and it has instructions right there too! (i use emacs) |
| 06:16.19 | pythonhelpadjjj | Exactly |
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| 06:16.26 | nvz | https://xkcd.com/378/ |
| 06:16.38 | pythonhelpadjjj | I don't need my text editor to be a full blown OS of it's own. |
| 06:17.12 | pythonhelpadjjj | That's just me. |
| 06:17.23 | pythonhelpadjjj | Now that I'm getting to know systemd, I wont leave it. |
| 06:17.23 | nvz | na, we got webbrowsers for that :P |
| 06:17.32 | pythonhelpadjjj | :p |
| 06:17.46 | pythonhelpadjjj | anyways. Its 1:20AM, I'm going to go to sleep |
| 06:17.47 | pythonhelpadjjj | TTYL |
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| 06:17.54 | pythonhelpadjjj | ty for all the help |
| 06:18.02 | annadane | REAL programmers don't need sleep |
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| 06:18.25 | andre144k | hi all |
| 06:18.40 | ealfonso | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:18.51 | andre144k | how is syntax to find files with beginning "." - eg: .foobar ? |
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| 06:19.03 | annadane | ealfonso, apt install netcat |
| 06:19.11 | nvz | isn't sure if he should throw a pillow or a programming manual at annadane |
| 06:19.14 | ryouma | lol at the full blown os comment and the systemd comment by the same user :) |
| 06:19.36 | han-solo | `find -name ".*"` ? |
| 06:19.38 | annadane | andre144k, ls -l |
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| 06:19.43 | annadane | errr |
| 06:19.44 | annadane | ls -a |
| 06:19.52 | andre144k | with all subdirectorys? |
| 06:20.07 | annadane | ls -Ra |
| 06:20.08 | ryouma | andre144k: find . -name .\* i think |
| 06:20.14 | han-solo | ls -a will show all files, including dot files too |
| 06:20.20 | annadane | oh, you want only . |
| 06:20.22 | annadane | sorry |
| 06:20.24 | andre144k | ryouma, thnx ill try |
| 06:20.41 | annadane | i guess real programmers do need sleep... |
| 06:22.04 | nvz | either that or a CSF Dialysis machine |
| 06:23.19 | ealfonso | annadane how come apt-file doesn't list it? apt-file find --regexp '/nc$' |
| 06:23.20 | ealfonso | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:23.32 | andre144k | ryouma, thx - this is working perfect "find . -name .\* -type f" |
| 06:23.46 | ryouma | yw |
| 06:24.13 | ryouma | oh right you said files |
| 06:24.40 | ealfonso | "apt-file list netcat" only lists 3 files, none of which are "nc". I even tried apt-file update |
| 06:24.52 | ryouma | i can answer THAT kind of question but i can't get sound to work on my stupid ancient lenovo |
| 06:24.58 | annadane | right, but nc is a shorthand for netcat |
| 06:25.16 | nvz | and it should be installed already |
| 06:25.22 | nvz | ,file bin/nc |
| 06:25.28 | judd | No packages in buster/amd64 were found with that file. |
| 06:25.30 | ryouma | or get firefox to work |
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| 06:26.20 | ealfonso | it wasn't installed in my buster release. |
| 06:26.21 | nvz | ,file bin/nc.traditional |
| 06:26.25 | judd | Search for bin/nc.traditional in buster/amd64: netcat-traditional: bin/nc.traditional |
| 06:26.40 | nvz | ,i netcat-traditional |
| 06:26.42 | judd | Package netcat-traditional (net, standard) in buster/amd64: TCP/IP swiss army knife. Version: 1.10-41.1; Size: 65.3k; Installed: 136k |
| 06:27.12 | nvz | ealfonso: how was it installed? |
| 06:27.21 | Rodon | is it possible to have colored text of apt output ? |
| 06:27.33 | nvz | Rodon: of course |
| 06:27.59 | ryouma | i think my firefox problems at leasst this time started because it crashed. which was because home fs /ewasn't available and became ro |
| 06:28.12 | ealfonso | this should be discoverable by apt-file, right? how am I supposed to know that I need to search for nc.traditional or netcat. nvz installed by cloud provider |
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| 06:30.18 | Rodon | nvz: please link the docs |
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| 06:32.34 | nvz | Rodon: man apt |
| 06:32.41 | nvz | Rodon: it already has colors enabled |
| 06:33.24 | Rodon | but i dont see it ..though i see colors for most other commands .. |
| 06:33.32 | annadane | oh, til about netcat-openbsd vs netcat-traditional |
| 06:33.47 | han-solo | which one had that `-e` option ? |
| 06:33.56 | han-solo | i liked that :) |
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| 06:36.15 | ZaZaGX | hello |
| 06:37.07 | nvz | Rodon: http://nvz.farted.net/apt-color.mp4 |
| 06:38.32 | nvz | Rodon: notice the orange and green in the output of those commands |
| 06:39.19 | nvz | thats one of the key differences between the old apt-get/apt-cache and newer apt commands, apt has the color enabled |
| 06:40.01 | nvz | ealfonso: so in other words it is probably only a base system.. netcat isn't in base |
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| 06:40.45 | nvz | ealfonso: which nc returns /bin/nc and ls -l /bin/nc returns -> /etc/alternatives/nc which if you ls -l that points to.. |
| 06:41.07 | nvz | ,why task-mate-desktop netcat-traditional |
| 06:41.39 | nvz | whistles while he waits |
| 06:41.53 | nvz | taps fingers |
| 06:42.02 | judd | No dependency chain found between packages task-mate-desktop and netcat-traditional in buster/amd64. |
| 06:42.21 | annadane | !smack judd |
| 06:42.21 | dpkg | smacks judd upside the head. |
| 06:43.09 | Rodon | nvz: thanks âï¸ |
| 06:43.35 | ZaZaGX | was that a colored star? |
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| 06:47.37 | fraktor | I'm using Debian Sid, and I wanted to do a dist-upgrade, but it listed a whole lot of packages to remove, including g++, rustc, cargo, all the llvm libraries, and so on. What caused this to happen? |
| 06:47.40 | nvz | the answer is task-mate-desktop Recommends libreoffice which recommends libreoffice-report-builder which depends on libpentaho-reporting-flow-engine-java which depends on libapache-poi-java which depends on libjaxb-java which depends on libistack-commons-java which depends on libmaven3-core-java which Suggests liblogback-java which suggests libtomcat9-java which suggests tomcat9 which suggests tomcat9-user |
| 06:47.46 | nvz | which depends on netcat... |
| 06:48.00 | nvz | fraktor: using sid |
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| 06:48.31 | nvz | the point being, that standard desktop installs will have netcat, base will not |
| 06:49.23 | fraktor | nvz: Okay. Let me rephrase the question: will this be fixed in the near future? |
| 06:49.37 | fraktor | It seems to me that a lot of these packages are rather important. |
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| 06:50.15 | nvz | fraktor: yes, it will likely be fixed.. and then break again |
| 06:50.20 | nvz | fraktor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjKuMCJqdW4 |
| 06:50.39 | nvz | fraktor: thats what sid is named after.. sid breaks things.. thats what he does.. |
| 06:51.17 | nvz | fraktor: if you're going to run sid, you're suppose to know how to avoid these problems, fix them, report them, etc. |
| 06:52.15 | fraktor | I just did a regular upgrade instead of a dist-ugprade. I don't think I can add any more information, since these would affect every single developer on Debian. I just wanted to understand why this was happening. |
| 06:53.08 | nvz | you shouldn't be using dist-upgrade unless you are doing a dist-upgrade.. which since you're on sid, there is nothing to dist-upgrade to |
| 06:53.58 | nvz | dist-upgrade allows apt to be more lax in resolving things.. including removing things |
| 06:54.35 | nvz | you also shouldn't be running sid |
| 06:54.41 | fraktor | I see. I'll keep that in mind in the future. |
| 06:55.34 | annadane | what you can do meanwhile is apt upgrade first, so it upgrades the things that *can* be, then see if there isn't a transition going on (debian-devel mailing lists or the debian transition tracker) or maybe wait a few days, or at your discretion use aptitude to resolve stuff |
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| 06:55.48 | annadane | but yeah, this is what you get running sid |
| 06:56.00 | nvz | "performs the function of upgrade but will remove currently installed packages if this is needed to upgrade the system as a whole." |
| 06:57.09 | annadane | what i liked to do with sid is to investigate things with aptitude to see why stuff was happening but i'm just weird and like doing that and not everyone can trace dependencies |
| 06:57.27 | annadane | i basically never accepted aptitude's proposals, i only used it to see what was going on |
| 06:58.00 | annadane | !tell fraktor about debian-next |
| 06:58.42 | fraktor | Is that testing instead of unstable? |
| 06:58.54 | annadane | which part? |
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| 07:00.03 | fraktor | What is debian-next? |
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| 07:00.54 | annadane | a channel for testing/sid questions |
| 07:01.00 | annadane | for future reference |
| 07:01.28 | fraktor | Oh, awesome. Thank you! |
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| 07:02.30 | annadane | sid does assume you're familiar with debian |
| 07:02.53 | annadane | if you're using sid because you want newer stuff, many people don't actually need new stuff, and if you do it's relatively trivial to get most things in stable |
| 07:03.05 | nvz | the better approach is to run stable, and ask your real question here |
| 07:03.15 | fraktor | I tried that for a while, but I do kind of like bleeding-edge stuff. |
| 07:03.21 | fraktor | Maybe I should just go back to Arch. :P |
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| 07:03.52 | nvz | I can't speak to that. I never have and never will run arch |
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| 07:05.16 | nvz | I will however likely run testing/unstable again at some point.. just not right now.. as I have one machine I use regularly.. and I want it to work |
| 07:05.53 | fraktor | I've got two machines, so I should be good if something really screws up |
| 07:07.27 | nvz | I have 5 machines, but I dont wanna be dragging others out and fooling with em.. it'd all be nothing but a useless waste of my time right now |
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| 07:08.17 | nvz | well 6 if you include my server.. but I dont technically /have/ that with me. heh.. and it too runs stable |
| 07:08.47 | annadane | what? no experimental on your server? what are you even doing? |
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| 07:09.22 | fraktor | I have a tiny VM that I'm running Debian stable on, but for my daily drivers I want newer versions of things. |
| 07:09.40 | nvz | counterfieting.. duh.. making the most authentic looking US$16 bills you ever seen.. |
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| 07:11.38 | nvz | then I take em to WV to get em changed.. since nobody else is dumb enough to accept a $16 bill .. but this hillbilly will give me two $8s or four $4s for em every time.. |
| 07:12.21 | nvz | smirks |
| 07:12.46 | nvz | fraktor: yeah, so do I.. which is why I use stable |
| 07:13.16 | nvz | cause I want it to work, even when I want something newer |
| 07:13.39 | fraktor | I need muh Blender 2.8 |
| 07:13.45 | nvz | ,v blender |
| 07:13.46 | judd | Package: blender on amd64 -- jessie: 2.72.b+dfsg0-3; jessie-security: 2.72.b+dfsg0-3+deb8u1; stretch: 2.79.b+dfsg0-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 2.79.b+dfsg0-1~deb9u1; buster: 2.79.b+dfsg0-7; bullseye: 2.80+dfsg-4; sid: 2.80+dfsg-4 |
| 07:13.55 | ealfonso | nvz yeah. but I still expect it to be easier to discover what package I need to install nc, even if I'm on a base install. shouldn't the "nc" symlink be managed by the netcat* package? |
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| 07:14.44 | ealfonso | I also noticed that, before installing netcat, nc gave me: "nc: command not found". but after removing netcat{,-traditional}, I get "/usr/bin/nc: No such file or directory" |
| 07:14.46 | nvz | ealfonso: no, its managed by the alternatives package near as I can tell |
| 07:15.35 | nvz | via a debconf directive to register the alternative |
| 07:16.15 | ealfonso | seems confusing but ok. |
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| 07:24.46 | nvz | well they left and my screencast tool crashed.. I was recording how simple it was for me to get blender 2.8 on stable |
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| 07:26.45 | nvz | I'm tempted to stop this ssb, cause I dont have any interest in blender, and I highly doubt there are any key feature differences beween 2.79 and 2.80 that they are concerned about |
| 07:27.03 | nvz | but since I already got it started, I may as well let it finish |
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| 07:29.18 | nvz | I do however have to get my power cord.. heh.. backporting something like this has me drawing 16.3w instead of the 4.5w or so I was drawing before.. |
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| 07:39.31 | nevivurn | Hi, I want to set up a debian server to host my personal email, hopefully to start using it as my mail email if it turns out to be reliable enough. There seems to be a very wide array of software I can piece together to do this, do you guys have any suggestions? |
| 07:40.03 | nevivurn | I'm familiar enough with general server administration, but email is a first for me. |
| 07:41.38 | nevivurn | And I want to be able to send and receive mail from a local email client, such as thunderbird. (so I don't require a web interface). |
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| 08:24.10 | nick11 | Hi. I am storing my laptop for a long time, like 1 year. It will not be used. How much battery should I charge it at before storing? It is a Lithium ion battery. Thoughts? |
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| 08:27.27 | Ede|Popede | !hardware |
| 08:27.27 | dpkg | Before buying any hardware, make sure it is supported by all operating systems you want to use; ask me about <hcl>. To acquire details about your current hardware, ask me about <whats my hardware>. Please ask all non-Debian-specific hardware questions in ##hardware on irc.freenode.net. |
| 08:27.32 | Ede|Popede | may be more effective, nick11 |
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| 09:42.07 | cluelessperson | Hi there. I'm confused about something. I'm using network manager in a debian instance, however I'm having problems with it not autoconnecting to wifi. |
| 09:42.13 | cluelessperson | I can manually connect to wifi |
| 09:42.34 | cluelessperson | but otherwise it doesn't autoconnect, and sometimes after suspend, network manager reports "networking disabled" in an xfce indicator. |
| 09:42.48 | cluelessperson | so far, requiring a reboot |
| 09:42.50 | cluelessperson | to fix |
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| 09:53.46 | kaleidekopy | hi can i ask a question here about encrypted /boot |
| 09:53.57 | kaleidekopy | and grub, especially relating to https://cryptsetup-team.pages.debian.net/cryptsetup/encrypted-boot.html |
| 09:54.12 | kaleidekopy | or is there a better place to ask? |
| 09:54.41 | Habbie | kaleidekopy, just ask |
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| 09:57.42 | xaaa | how stable is ZFS in Debian Stable? |
| 09:58.15 | xaaa | is it nowdays as realiable as ext4 for data partition (not for root)? will be using it raid'ed over 2 disks, and also over cryptsetup encryption |
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| 10:00.23 | kaleidekopy | Thankss Habbie. I'm attempting to run an encrypted /boot partition and seperate UEFI partition. |
| 10:00.40 | kaleidekopy | when i boot, it drops into a grub> prompt and i'm unable to insmod cryptdisk |
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| 10:01.12 | kaleidekopy | when i run "insmod cryptodisk" it says "error: file `/grub/x86_64-efi/cryptodisk.mod` was not found |
| 10:01.45 | kaleidekopy | which makes sense, because the /grub/x86_64 folder itself isn't decrypted yet... but then how do i get it to put it into the efi image? |
| 10:02.22 | kaleidekopy | .efi files all i see in the /EFI folder are the |
| 10:02.28 | kaleidekopy | efi files |
| 10:03.07 | kaleidekopy | and the grub.cfg |
| 10:05.02 | kaleidekopy | i dont know if this is related? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/1565950 |
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| 10:05.31 | kaleidekopy | is this because i'm using ubuntu and not vanilla debian? |
| 10:06.34 | jim | kaleidekopy, well people don't want to support anything besides plain original vanilla debian |
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| 10:06.55 | jim | (word to the wise, they'll get grumpy about it) |
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| 10:07.43 | jim | at least in here they don't |
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| 10:08.46 | jim | anyway... what's the system debian created for making bootable images with selected packages installed? |
| 10:10.37 | kaleidekopy | well the ubuntu land is a bit... less technically oriented :) |
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| 10:11.20 | kaleidekopy | okay i think i see a solution in that bug report actually |
| 10:11.30 | kaleidekopy | i need to build the grub image manually instead of relying upon grub install |
| 10:11.39 | kaleidekopy | i will report back if it works |
| 10:11.42 | jim | kaleidekopy, oh ok... who knows, maybe then you'd like plain original vanilla debian? |
| 10:13.52 | ratrace | xaaa: it's stable enough for us to trust all our production servers with rootfs on ZFS |
| 10:15.08 | ratrace | xaaa: the only problem I currently have with it, is that due to those licensing shenanigans and upstream fixes being broken, ZFS on Debian for now disabled any SIMD support. This currently only affects the fletcher4 checksumming as ZFS in Stable is still 0.7.x, thus no native encryption (which is heavily affected by that) |
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| 10:24.49 | xaaa | ratrace: the ZFS code can not use some of CPU instructions? wtf O_o |
| 10:25.27 | xaaa | ratrace: how can ZFS checksum data files, if the file is image of a VM, and the VM does many small writes? |
| 10:25.37 | ratrace | xaaa: yea, the kernel changed license around some API that ZFS was using for SIMD, to GPL-only and caused huged mess |
| 10:25.58 | ratrace | xaaa: for VMs on ZFS use ZVOLs, not files |
| 10:26.01 | xaaa | does it keep sum for like each 16K or something? even then it needs to recalculate, and read, 16384B for each e.g. 256B write inside vm |
| 10:26.29 | xaaa | ratrace: ok and if I wouldn't, then how bad/slow it is then? |
| 10:26.43 | xaaa | (other files also might get arbitrary reads in the midle, well, DB for example) |
| 10:26.47 | ratrace | xaaa: ZFS is block-level, so it does that regardless of whether it's a VM or not. it looks at a transaction and has dynamic recordsize, so if 16k was written, it'll write out a block of 16k |
| 10:26.56 | ratrace | (and checksum it as one blok) |
| 10:27.32 | ratrace | xaaa: it's very slow in some cases, if "page" size and recordsize of the modified block is not aligned. |
| 10:27.45 | ratrace | xaaa: problem is with modification of prevously written blocks, not with writing out new blocks. |
| 10:28.19 | ratrace | if you had a block that was part of, say, 128k transaction (default recordsize), and now you modify only 1k inside of it, ZFS needs to load up, checksum, modify, checksum and write out the whole 128k block. |
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| 10:28.54 | ratrace | that's why you want to separate recordsize policies to different datasets. for example, our postgres databases use separate dataset with recordsize=8k which is aligned with postgres 8k pages |
| 10:30.31 | xaaa | ratrace: doesn't that become a problem for files like databases, or torrents while being downloaded |
| 10:31.32 | ratrace | xaaa: it does if you're not aligning recordsize with applications "page" size or whatever. for postgres, that's 8k, so having recordsize of 8k means that ZFS won't consider blocks larger than that, and even if a 512k transaction was made, it'll split it up (and checksum inidividually) into 8k blocks. |
| 10:31.54 | ratrace | so when it's aligned like that, there's no problem. |
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| 10:32.21 | ratrace | bottom line is, ZFS is a very slow filesystem. you don't wanna use it if speed is more important than data integrity. |
| 10:32.53 | ratrace | on the read-intensive side, ZFS kicks ass due to superb ARC algorithm and multiple caches it uses |
| 10:34.04 | ratrace | however, you can mitigate some of those issues with a) enough RAM for ARC to fit most frequently accessed data, b) proper recordsize, c) a SLOG devices (eg. an SSD or nvme) that buffers up write intensive activity before it flushes it to spinning rust |
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| 10:34.51 | ratrace | xaaa: if you have general questions about ZFS, pop into #zfsonlinux. these are so far not debian specific ;) |
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| 10:41.29 | u1f320 | Does anyone know if, in lxqt, the desktop icons(toggled from Desktop Preferences) My Computer, Network and Trash, are dependent on systemd to work? |
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| 10:45.00 | u1f320 | Would this command be necessary if I hadn't set any root password? # usermod -aG sudo user |
| 10:45.31 | u1f320 | I mean, when installing |
| 10:47.15 | ratrace | u1f320: probably not, those icons have nothing to do with systemd. |
| 10:47.33 | u1f320 | k thx |
| 10:48.17 | damex | ratrace: depending on workload but for example in our case zfs kicks ass on writes due to zil/slog so zfs is not a slow 'file system' :) |
| 10:48.55 | ratrace | damex: it is, compared to others, regardless of slog. just the fact that it checksums each block on read/write slows it down considerably compared to other fs |
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| 10:50.49 | ratrace | damex: the advantage of ZFS in that case is ARC and multiple caches it does. so when compared to "regular" (LRU) pagecache (eg. ext4), it's more effective. |
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| 10:51.44 | ratrace | disadvantage of that is that while it _acts_ like pagecache, the kernel doesn't see it as such, and in some high memory pressure situations there can be out-of-ram issues if ZFS doesn't free the caches up fast enough |
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| 10:52.19 | ratrace | (which is the reason why by default ZFS takes only 50% of RAM for ARC, and it's not advised to ramp that up to total RAM size) |
| 10:52.21 | damex | well, you can limit arc :) |
| 10:52.58 | ratrace | you can but it's manual operation. there _can_ be situations where regardless of your limit, other parts of the system require RAM and ZFS doesn't free it fast enough |
| 10:53.52 | xaaa | ratrace: will ZFS ever be in main repo of debian? with contrib, as it seems to be now, I'm worried about quality of suporting it, and of bug fix releases |
| 10:55.17 | ratrace | I don't know if it will, but I wouldn't worry about that. worst case, you'll pull in sources from github and build locally. been there, done that, it's not a problem at all. |
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| 10:57.06 | xaaa | security bugs in zfs would be fixed "as good" as debian stable main repository? |
| 10:57.14 | xaaa | (including: as fast) |
| 10:57.36 | ratrace | dunno, haven't see any so far, but I'm guessing yes, they'd be treated the same. |
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| 11:02.50 | ratrace | xaaa: Ubuntu is taking ZFS to be first-class citizen, supported by installer and other parts of the system. With that alone I wouldn't worry about ZFS support in Debian. iirc some maintainers of it are doing both debian and ubuntu ZFS packages. |
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| 11:03.26 | kaleidekopy | yeah im still having a problem with grub :( i am completely unable to get cryptomount to work |
| 11:04.16 | kaleidekopy | i rebuilt my grub image, it said that it included the proper modules.. but then when i boot from it, it looks like it doesnt include them at all |
| 11:05.01 | u1f320 | how do I know which debian I'm using? |
| 11:05.10 | u1f320 | like buster or something |
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| 11:05.51 | kaleidekopy | lsb_release -a |
| 11:05.53 | lastebill1 | hmm, uname -a? |
| 11:05.56 | ratrace | u1f320: cat /etc/debian_version, or lsb_release -a |
| 11:06.18 | ratrace | lsb_release won't tell you which point release you're on, though, so /etc/debian_version is the best source of that information |
| 11:06.34 | u1f320 | cool, all great info, cheers all! |
| 11:06.44 | u1f320 | buster 10.2 btw:) |
| 11:10.09 | u1f320 | any non-javascript place to put/share screenshots? |
| 11:10.52 | u1f320 | oh got it: /msg dpkg paste |
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| 11:11.44 | u1f320 | (doesn't really matter it requires javascript) |
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| 11:14.15 | u1f320 | (ok it has curl, so no javascript needed) |
| 11:16.11 | humbot | uh |
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| 11:26.50 | u1f320 | what's fdsg1 in grub2 (2.02+dfsg1-20) |
| 11:26.57 | u1f320 | *dfsg1 |
| 11:27.16 | Fox | https://wiki.debian.org/DFSGLicenses |
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| 11:30.31 | u1f320 | hmm when I read DFSG-free I'm thinking like sugar-free :) |
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| 11:37.41 | u1f320 | ok file.io is useless for sharing screenshots if they 404 after first view (even with expiry set) |
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| 12:52.19 | Bigterd | https://paste.debian.net/1123158/ any ideas? system is puking using it's own package program |
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| 12:54.50 | towo` | /var/lib/dkms/spl/0.6.5.9/build/make.log sayes what? |
| 12:55.06 | Bigterd | towo`: printed at bottom of pastebin |
| 12:56.01 | Bigterd | no targets, no make file |
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| 12:56.24 | Bigterd | oddly after consuming nearly zero cpu cycles for almost 7-10 minutes |
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| 12:57.26 | towo` | This is a transitional dummy package. It can safely be removed. |
| 12:57.35 | towo` | what makes you think, you need that? |
| 12:57.53 | Bigterd | trying to install zfs-dkms |
| 12:58.37 | Bigterd | maybe i'm not understasnding the process. do i need a different package for zfs? |
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| 13:06.37 | Bigterd | pastebin of installing zfs-dkms https://paste.debian.net/1123162/ |
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| 13:06.57 | Bigterd | so, ideas? |
| 13:07.51 | towo` | what debian version is that? |
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| 13:19.30 | ratrace | patienceless people.... all they needed was spl-dkms installed first. Also... ZFS is a big no-no on 32-bits. |
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| 13:34.34 | towo` | ratrace, since it is an arm device, i don't know, if that dkms stuff can work at all |
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| 13:39.21 | tw | that zfs-dkms build doesn't actually look like a debian system. |
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| 13:41.53 | ratrace | ,v zfs-dkms |
| 13:41.54 | judd | Package: zfs-dkms on amd64 -- stretch/contrib: 0.6.5.9-5; stretch-backports/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1; buster/contrib: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1; stretch-backports-sloppy/contrib: 0.7.13-1~bpo9+1; buster-backports/contrib: 0.8.2-3~bpo10+1; bullseye/contrib: 0.8.2-4; sid/contrib: 0.8.2-4 |
| 13:42.03 | ratrace | tw: probably stretch |
| 13:42.43 | ratrace | and basically, one installs zfsutils-linux, which pulls in both spl-dkms and zfs-dkms, but there's a bug on buster where you have to install spl-dkms first and before zfs-dkms |
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| 14:49.17 | Akuw | i need to download openjdk-0-jre 8u121-b13-1~bpo8+1 |
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| 14:49.33 | Akuw | where can i get all packages of jessie? |
| 14:49.34 | ksk | ,v openjdk-0-jre |
| 14:49.35 | judd | No package named 'openjdk-0-jre' was found in amd64. |
| 14:49.43 | ksk | -0-? I highly doubt that.. |
| 14:49.45 | Akuw | sorry |
| 14:49.51 | Akuw | i need to download openjdk-8-jre 8u121-b13-1~bpo8+1 |
| 14:49.57 | ksk | ,v openjdk-8-jre |
| 14:49.59 | judd | Package: openjdk-8-jre on amd64 -- stretch: 8u222-b10-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 8u232-b09-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 8u232-b09-1~deb9u1; sid: 8u232-b09-1 |
| 14:50.08 | ksk | Akuw: how about upgrading? |
| 14:50.15 | Akuw | no, i cant |
| 14:50.35 | Akuw | that dvices use Jessie only |
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| 14:51.44 | Akuw | what is the url that exactly take me to etch packages or iso to download |
| 14:51.50 | ksk | no luck for you then. you might be able to install java from upstream. |
| 14:51.59 | ksk | etch? eeh |
| 14:52.59 | ksk | as the bot kind of told us, there is no jre8 in the jessie repos, and there never was. |
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| 14:56.03 | Akuw | yes i saw, but in jessie there is only openjdk-8-jre-headless |
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| 14:59.22 | Akuw | i am here http://cdimage.debian.org/mirror/cdimage/archive/9.0.0/ |
| 14:59.29 | Akuw | but there is not .iso |
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| 14:59.49 | ksk | Akuw: that is interesting. there still will be no jre-8 in jessie, no matter how deep you look into the archives |
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| 15:00.17 | Akuw | 9 is stretch |
| 15:00.28 | Akuw | not jessie |
| 15:00.29 | ksk | apples are green. |
| 15:01.16 | joepublic | some apples are yellow. |
| 15:01.16 | ksk | if you are looking to install a strech package in jessie - it will most likely not work at all (because of unmet dependencies) |
| 15:01.50 | ksk | Akuw: how about setting up a virtual machine with a newer debian version? |
| 15:02.25 | Akuw | what iwill do is to download and extract package |
| 15:02.52 | joepublic | 'luck. |
| 15:05.15 | Akuw | actually the problem is to get this version 8u121-b13-1~bpo8+1 |
| 15:05.42 | Akuw | only found 8u131-b11-2 |
| 15:05.42 | ksk | which in itselfs sounds like a totally sane thing to want (spoiler: not!) |
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| 15:06.02 | ksk | if you -need- jre8, get one that is still supported and maintained by oracle. |
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| 15:06.37 | Akuw | but the devices use 8u121-b13-1~bpo8+1 |
| 15:06.47 | Akuw | and i have to install same for the new device |
| 15:06.54 | Akuw | that will be a replacement |
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| 15:08.43 | ksk | sounds reasonable to setup a new machine with an OS thats supported until 30 june 2020 also :P |
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| 15:11.38 | Akuw | i said the same, but tha computers are for controlling equipment, so are no exposed to internet or network |
| 15:11.56 | Akuw | and i am reponsible only to install OS ans configure |
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| 15:30.53 | damex | is there a way i could boot vanilla debian on a device from https://d-i.debian.org/daily-images/arm64/20191229-02:07/device-tree/ ? one that does not have a separate specific kernel in debian package tree. for example something like this https://d-i.debian.org/daily-images/arm64/20191229-02:07/device-tree/rockchip/rk3328-roc-cc.dtb |
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| 15:31.32 | damex | it is pretty straightforward booting raspberry pi 3 though. otherboards are not :/ |
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| 15:51.31 | guysoft42 | hey all, how do I set the default architecture in a multi arch system? Aka I want dpkg --print-architecture to print something else. Is this hardcoded to the dpkg binary or can it be modified? |
| 15:51.44 | greycat | The "default" architecture is what you installed from. |
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| 15:54.11 | hesco | which package provides the ss utility which replaces netstat? |
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| 15:54.20 | Akuw | trying to add this deb http://httpredir.debian.org/debian jessie-backports main contrib non-free |
| 15:54.34 | greycat | ,file bin/ss |
| 15:54.40 | Akuw | but got does not have a Release file |
| 15:54.41 | judd | Search for bin/ss in buster/amd64: iproute2: bin/ss |
| 15:54.53 | greycat | hesco: iproute2 (see bot response above) |
| 15:54.56 | Akuw | is working that server? |
| 15:55.13 | hesco | thanks greycat, judd. that is helpful |
| 15:55.14 | greycat | !httpredir.debian.org |
| 15:55.14 | dpkg | The httpredir.debian.org redirector (based on HTTP 302s) was shutdown on 2017-02-13 and replaced by <deb.debian.org>. Existing entries in sources.list will keep working as the DNS entries for httpredir.debian.org have been pointed to deb.debian.org. |
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| 15:58.30 | greycat | So, one answer is "Yes, it should work." Another answer is "You should migrate your sources.list to the new thing." The real answer, if I remember correctly from last week, is "Fix or work around whatever broken HTTP proxy is causing all of your problems." |
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| 16:00.42 | JPT | I'm having trouble with systemd 241 (latest on debian buster) and vlan interfaces on systemd-networkd. :| |
| 16:00.57 | Akuw | got same error |
| 16:01.13 | JPT | I use udev rules like this to rename the real interfaces according to their mac address: SUBSYSTEM=="net", ACTION=="add", ATTR{address}=="00:1b:21:da:b3:85", NAME="eth0" |
| 16:01.46 | JPT | However, for some now partially known reason, systemd-udevd decides to rename my vlan interfaces right after systemd-networkd created them. |
| 16:02.09 | Akuw | The repository http://deb.debian.org/debian jessie-backports Release does not have a Release file |
| 16:03.12 | Akuw | but that server gives ping response |
| 16:03.15 | JPT | So systemd-networkd creates a vlan interface like eth0.7 on top of eth0, and then systemd-udevd comes along and tries to rename it - the interface gets stuck with a name like "rename10". |
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| 16:04.44 | JPT | I've already heard that this behaviour might be due to a new NamePolicy feature in systemd, but that does not help me understand, what exactly to do to fix my situation up. |
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| 16:06.01 | guysoft42 | greycat, is there a way to install a different dpkg arch from within dpkg? Or do I have to extract it and copy manually? |
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| 16:07.55 | greycat | If your actual goal is "Oops, I installed i386 I wanted amd64 how do I turn it into amd64", the only supported answer is reinstall. See also !crossgrade |
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| 16:14.26 | CrystalMath | what file should i edit to change the build configuration for the firefox package? |
| 16:14.36 | CrystalMath | i want to add --disable-pulseaudio --enable-alsa --enable-jack |
| 16:14.58 | greycat | Doesn't Debian already do that? Or did they finally give up? |
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| 16:15.14 | CrystalMath | greycat: the debian package here uses pulseaudio, but i run it with apulse |
| 16:16.33 | CrystalMath | oh... |
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| 16:16.38 | CrystalMath | it seems that it works with just alsa |
| 16:16.44 | CrystalMath | i've been using apulse for nothing |
| 16:16.52 | CrystalMath | heh |
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| 16:21.29 | CrystalMath | well, oops |
| 16:21.34 | CrystalMath | problem solved: problem not found |
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| 16:22.54 | jhutchins_wk | Akuw: http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/jessie/Release.gpg exists. |
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| 16:25.10 | guysoft42 | greycat, I am the developer of CustomPiOS. I am creating a raspbian (raspberrypi debian) 64 bit version |
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| 16:27.36 | jhutchins_wk | Akuw: Oh, so does http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/jessie/Release |
| 16:27.37 | guysoft42 | greycat, so its not reinstall, its building on top of the existing image. I am doing that to have the closest image as possible to what Rapi foundation is releasing. |
| 16:27.58 | guysoft42 | !crossgrade |
| 16:27.58 | dpkg | Converting an i386 installation into an amd64 installation in-place is quite difficult. It's much easier to reinstall the system with the new architecture -- ask me about <install debian>. If you've got good backups, plenty of time and are feeling lucky, you can try https://wiki.debian.org/CrossGrading but really... good backups... |
| 16:28.08 | ksk | guysoft42: eh? then get a list of packages they install, and install a new debian system. then add these packages? |
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| 16:28.38 | guysoft42 | ksk, they have other stuff there due to the bradcom non-free things. Also its a non-mainline kernel |
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| 16:30.07 | guysoft42 | Looks like https://wiki.debian.org/CrossGrading is assuming i686 -> amd64 . But I have a feeling you are going to get a lot of armf->aarc64/arm64 soon |
| 16:32.56 | guysoft42 | ksk, Also, I want the 32bit system. There are lots of bugs at the moment with the 64bit arch. Its experimental. What I am trying to get is a docker host which is aarch64. So it can host https://github.com/photoprism/photoprism . Just started joining the team there on this :) |
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| 16:33.15 | guysoft42 | They are using a few things that are 64bit only. |
| 16:33.42 | guysoft42 | Also, I think its worth the Rpi community to have a bit multiarch image now to play with the new 64bit kernel |
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| 16:40.54 | DeepSpaceObserve | @y@ |
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| 16:43.44 | prompt32 | Rpi community NEEDS someone build/host a firefox arm build. The only options is firefox-esr version b.c and the most private browser in universe : Chromium. Help ..., ;) Mozilla dont .... |
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| 16:49.56 | petn-randall | prompt32: This is a Debian support channel. How is this related Debian? |
| 16:51.13 | petn-randall | guysoft42: While I have sympathy for your cause, neither Raspbian nor your custom OS based on it are Debian, so you might want to pitch it in #raspbian or #raspberrypi. |
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| 16:51.41 | CpAj0 | i have created a deb package for a .net core gui application with gtksharp and extracts the directory to /usr/share/app-name then create a ink to /usr/bin/app-exe but when i click in the menu launcher does not work but if i type in terminal app-exe works |
| 16:51.42 | prompt32 | petn-randall, It dont ! I just say my complain... hahha |
| 16:51.44 | CpAj0 | i'm doing something wrong? |
| 16:52.22 | petn-randall | prompt32: Ah, you might want to join a different channel then, like: |
| 16:52.24 | petn-randall | !chat |
| 16:52.24 | dpkg | This is not a chat channel, this is a Debian user support channel. Unless you have a Debian support question, please chat elsewhere, like #debian-offtopic, or #moocows on irc.oftc.net or ##chat on irc.freenode.net. |
| 16:52.31 | prompt32 | everything is debian to me ._ |
| 16:52.49 | petn-randall | prompt32: I can assure you it isn't for us. :-> |
| 16:53.19 | prompt32 | petn-randall, i'm ok, dont worry. Just continue ... |
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| 16:53.41 | prompt32 | petn-randall, let me know better my setup and my hacks ... |
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| 16:57.56 | petn-randall | prompt32: What hacks? Are you running Kali or Parrot? |
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| 17:01.51 | damex | well, it turns out that debian just boot linux-image-arm64 kernel from on any of that 'supported' sbc that have dtb available and 'just works' i guess it couldn't be simpler but sadly there is no docs about install on such boards (every situation is 'unique'). i guess someone (rolling eyes) have to write it |
| 17:03.04 | c0rnelius | which sbc are you talking about? |
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| 17:05.26 | c0rnelius | for most you also need the bootloader and need to know where to write it too. |
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| 17:07.26 | damex | c0rnelius: well.... raspberry pi3b, libretech all-h5-cc, orange pi (a20), orange pi pc2, rk3328-roc-cc, meson-gxl-s905x-libretech-cc |
| 17:08.00 | c0rnelius | i got most those boards |
| 17:08.11 | damex | rpi boot kernel directly or can use uboot, others boot usinng uboot, pretty straightforward though. |
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| 17:08.50 | c0rnelius | yeah simples. i make my own IMGs for mine. |
| 17:10.31 | c0rnelius | rk3328-roc-cc what garbage that board turned out to be. i just use it as a web server now. |
| 17:10.35 | c0rnelius | thing is useless |
| 17:11.13 | damex | c0rnelius: is there something wrong with the board? |
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| 17:17.17 | c0rnelius | damex - yeah. support ;) |
| 17:18.09 | c0rnelius | which i don't really care about anymore. it's all good. makes a fine lil server. |
| 17:18.30 | damex | c0rnelius: i thought that 'libre.computer' is one of the most supported boards in sbc world :) |
| 17:18.37 | c0rnelius | I do like the all-h5 and le potato |
| 17:18.50 | c0rnelius | not the renegade |
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| 17:19.05 | c0rnelius | firefly doesn't even support it |
| 17:19.11 | c0rnelius | and it was a joint effort |
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| 17:19.29 | c0rnelius | but it is rockchip to be fair. |
| 17:19.42 | damex | well, you don't really need it if upstream has support? |
| 17:19.48 | damex | like uboot and kernel |
| 17:20.06 | damex | and design that does decent job at not making your life harder |
| 17:20.09 | c0rnelius | the kernel last time i checked has shit upstream support |
| 17:20.19 | c0rnelius | the dtb is useless |
| 17:21.24 | c0rnelius | i would assume i could find patches and such for it but I don't wanna be bothered anymore. |
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| 17:21.43 | c0rnelius | a lot of work for lil reward |
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| 17:25.02 | c0rnelius | why do I get the impression i'm chatting wih, Da? :D |
| 17:30.36 | damex | c0rnelius: well, seems like upstream does not have support for rk3328-roc-cc :( |
| 17:30.50 | damex | atleast uboot does not have it |
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| 17:32.49 | c0rnelius | damex - mhmm |
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| 17:40.52 | damex | c0rnelius: well, i pick such 'libre.computer' boards specifically because of raspberry pi formfactor. to stack them by using brass standoffs ... any idea if there is any other decent boards in similar rpi formfactor? |
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| 17:42.42 | joepublic | I have a couple olinuxino lime2 boards mounted on a 1 foot square board. They work pretty well. |
| 17:43.02 | joepublic | running debian jessie, but running it great. |
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| 17:49.47 | c0rnelius | damex - good question. off the top of my head Friendlyarm and Radxa both have a RK3399 board in that form factor. |
| 17:51.27 | c0rnelius | i don't own either board, but I do have a Nanopc-t4 from friendlyarm and it's a very solid build. If it wasn't for Rockchip not being my thing I would have prob looked into them. |
| 17:51.30 | joepublic | I have attached ssds to the olinuxinos mounted as / that makes them not so slow |
| 17:55.14 | c0rnelius | damex - there is also hardkernel with the odroid-c2 (i thinks that is what it's called?) But I also can't speak for it because I don't own it. Pretty sure it's an amlogic SoC. |
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| 17:55.46 | damex | well, odroid is just asking 70$~ for shipping ;/ |
| 17:55.56 | damex | probably not so good to pick them |
| 17:55.56 | c0rnelius | amazon dude |
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| 17:56.55 | damex | sadly we don't have amazon here |
| 17:57.08 | c0rnelius | oh. sucks |
| 17:57.13 | c0rnelius | i guess |
| 17:57.57 | c0rnelius | not many boards with a good SoC in that form factor if i'm to be honest. |
| 17:58.04 | ZaZaGX | where? |
| 17:58.13 | damex | Kazakhstan it is |
| 17:58.19 | ZaZaGX | whoa |
| 17:58.26 | ZaZaGX | how about a raspberry pi? |
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| 17:58.54 | damex | well, i have rpi3b and waiting for rpi4 to arrive. see no reason to get rpi3b+ or earlier models at this point |
| 17:59.11 | ZaZaGX | oh i had a rpi3b, i didn't like it |
| 17:59.24 | ZaZaGX | the rpi4 is already out |
| 17:59.25 | c0rnelius | 3b is kind of garbage |
| 17:59.35 | c0rnelius | 3b+ was alright tho |
| 18:00.21 | ZaZaGX | yeah i didn't like the ram limited to 1GB |
| 18:00.30 | ZaZaGX | maybe 2GB would be better |
| 18:00.37 | rainfyre | that would be usable |
| 18:00.38 | damex | well, i had 3b since release and it was much better then alternatives :) |
| 18:01.08 | damex | rpi4 coming in 4gb configuration. sadly no so many boards offer 4-8gb ram |
| 18:01.57 | ZaZaGX | thats too much memory lol |
| 18:03.52 | damex | well, not really, i would prefer even more :) |
| 18:04.40 | ZaZaGX | yeah but you might as well use a real computer |
| 18:05.14 | damex | ZaZaGX: i do. i have bunch of intel nucs and other mini computers running here, sadly its all x86_64. |
| 18:05.42 | ZaZaGX | isn't that a good thing? |
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| 18:06.15 | damex | ZaZaGX: yes and no, currently i need variety of different platforms. |
| 18:06.23 | ZaZaGX | oh thats cool |
| 18:06.28 | damex | emulating arm is no fun |
| 18:06.34 | damex | or even ppc ! |
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| 18:06.39 | ZaZaGX | i bet |
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| 18:09.05 | c0rnelius | damex - pretty sure the pi4 4G variant still has probs with the USB3 port. You need to limit the board to 3Gigs for the port to work properly. |
| 18:10.22 | damex | c0rnelius: oh, usb ports, video/audio output and other stuff that does not contribute to disk/memory/cpu performance won't have any use here though |
| 18:10.40 | damex | and ethernet performance :) |
| 18:10.46 | c0rnelius | gotcha. just letting you know. |
| 18:10.55 | ZaZaGX | i kind of want a raspberry pi 4 now |
| 18:11.20 | damex | c0rnelius: yeah, thanks, i heard raspberry pi 4 also break wireless when you enable 4k60 video output |
| 18:11.21 | ZaZaGX | but i see no point |
| 18:11.27 | c0rnelius | i've been waiting till the bugs get worked out. |
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| 18:11.48 | c0rnelius | damex - haven't heard that. nice to know. |
| 18:12.19 | c0rnelius | I really interested in the Odroid-N2 |
| 18:12.44 | c0rnelius | not the same form factor but looks like a solid SBC. |
| 18:12.52 | damex | it looks definitely great. would be nice if they had intel nuc-like 4x4 case :) |
| 18:13.08 | c0rnelius | you can dream |
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| 18:13.33 | c0rnelius | would nice, that's for sure |
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| 18:14.51 | damex | http://espressobin.net that one seem to be interesting. sadly no one ship it here for any reasonable amount of money |
| 18:15.01 | damex | and formfactor is kinda meh |
| 18:15.08 | jhutchins_wk | Guys, a few lines is one thing but an extended discussion of hardware does not belong here. |
| 18:16.04 | c0rnelius | k |
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| 18:19.05 | ZaZaGX | will it run on raspbian? |
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| 18:23.31 | c0rnelius | ZaZaGX - why would you want too? raspbian is armhf (32bit) |
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| 18:24.21 | ZaZaGX | well, i was trying to install debian on it. but people on here recommend me to use raspbian |
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| 18:32.38 | jim | ZaZaGX, does debian support the arch of your arm machine? |
| 18:33.07 | ZaZaGX | i believe so |
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| 18:35.14 | lovelytingy | hi new here need little help |
| 18:35.14 | jim | ok... I dunno for sure, but I guess debian would be worth a try |
| 18:35.24 | jim | ok |
| 18:35.37 | ZaZaGX | it won't load lo |
| 18:36.02 | jim | not sure I understand... |
| 18:36.04 | lovelytingy | i deleted a dir in /usr/lib python3.8 my some programs not opening |
| 18:36.46 | greycat | (a) that's not in Debian 10, (b) restore it from your most recent backup an dpray |
| 18:37.26 | jim | and spray?! |
| 18:37.34 | greycat | and pray |
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| 18:38.24 | ZaZaGX | i don't think the debian gods will like that |
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| 18:39.22 | greycat | deleting random directories and then wondering why things don't work is... uh... |
| 18:39.24 | jim | lovelytingy, the thing is, it's your machine... you can do whatever you want... and, if you want to keep the debian-ness of it, you shouldn't go deleting things from places that debian packaging thinks it owns |
| 18:40.01 | greycat | wonders what OS that actually *is* |
| 18:40.07 | jim | and one of those places is /usr (anywhere except /usr/local) |
| 18:40.27 | greycat | if *any* of those places requires root to delete... |
| 18:41.42 | ZaZaGX | Ubuntu using sudo |
| 18:41.56 | jim | python 3.8 is in experimental, land of the packages that can't install or remove or something |
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| 18:43.50 | jim | lovelytingy, how did you get that version of python? |
| 18:44.16 | kreyren | How do i compile a debian package with a patch? |
| 18:46.18 | jim | you mean how to have the build process automatically apply the patch? |
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| 18:47.17 | greycat | I think the main question is which style of package you've got there -- one using "quilt" or something older. |
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| 18:47.27 | greycat | So, omitting the package name/version isn't helping. |
| 18:48.17 | ZaZaGX | should i get a chromebook pixel go? |
| 18:48.26 | ZaZaGX | not sure if i should install debian 10 on it |
| 18:48.37 | kreyren | greycat, i have this patch https://bugs.winehq.org/attachment.cgi?id=65931 that i need to test on wine where my source-base stratums are not available atm and compiling wine manually is pain -> i want to try compile it on debian |
| 18:48.42 | jim | kreyren, that's true... so, what package is it, and which version? |
| 18:48.56 | jim | is it a package that's in debian now? |
| 18:49.11 | kreyren | 4.21 was affected but 5.0 (current) would also be sufficient |
| 18:49.16 | ksk | kreyren: compiling wine from upstream is not nearly as much pain as you would expect - I suggest you give it a try if not done recently.. |
| 18:49.19 | greycat | apparently one of the wine* packages, but we don't know which one yet... |
| 18:49.23 | kreyren | the package should be in debian, but i'm using sources from upstream |
| 18:49.33 | greycat | *sigh* |
| 18:49.34 | kreyren | winehq-devel for example |
| 18:49.42 | greycat | Then you asked the WRONG QUESTION. |
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| 18:49.50 | kreyren | what is the right question then |
| 18:49.54 | greycat | If you are not building a .deb then just follow upstream's instructions. |
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| 18:50.14 | kreyren | pita to perform, afaik apt-src should be able to do it? |
| 18:50.19 | greycat | NO |
| 18:50.23 | kreyren | why |
| 18:50.24 | greycat | NOT WITH NON-DEBIAN SOURCE ARCHIVES |
| 18:50.29 | OursBlanc | hi everyone . is it possible to avoid to type the password each time i wish to do something with synpatic or other soft... ? |
| 18:50.35 | kreyren | using debian source archive is also an option |
| 18:50.40 | ksk | kreyren: that would only work if debian did not do any changes to "whatever version of wine that patch was designed for" |
| 18:50.53 | ksk | so cut all the debian foo, get the source of the right version of wine, apply patch, and compile |
| 18:51.13 | kreyren | ok, thanks for info |
| 18:51.29 | lovelytingy | @jim i installed manually by tar file from python.org |
| 18:52.05 | jim | lovelytingy, still got the dir where the python source is? |
| 18:53.01 | lovelytingy | no permanatly deleted |
| 18:53.02 | jim | lovelytingy, oh, also, if you're going to compile manually, don't have the --prefix be /usr |
| 18:53.25 | lovelytingy | and path i also tweak that |
| 18:53.42 | lovelytingy | now python2.7 also not working |
| 18:53.51 | lovelytingy | only 3.7 is runing |
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| 18:54.39 | jim | put it somewhere in your home dir, like /home/you/py38-inst, or in /usr/local |
| 18:54.47 | greycat | or /opt |
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| 18:55.25 | jim | those are all places that debian packaging is not permitted to touch |
| 18:55.42 | greycat | /usr/local/ is like a community soup cauldron that everyone can dip into... /opt is closer to segregating each cook in their own kitchen |
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| 18:57.05 | lovelytingy | is there a why i can unistall all python version and install again |
| 18:58.01 | jim | lovelytingy, what version of debian do you have? |
| 18:58.17 | lovelytingy | ubuntu |
| 18:58.20 | greycat | *plonk* |
| 18:58.24 | greycat | Idiots. |
| 18:58.42 | ksk | !ubuntu |
| 18:58.43 | dpkg | Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian. Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu on chat.freenode.net instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>. |
| 18:58.51 | ZaZaGX | lol |
| 18:58.52 | ZaZaGX | i knew it |
| 18:59.03 | greycat | It's true. You did guess correctly. |
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| 19:00.12 | jim | lovelytingy, folks here don't want to support anything except plain original vanilla debian... and they get grumpy about it... |
| 19:00.13 | annadane | i know /usr/local overrides existing debian packages, and /opt won't |
| 19:00.27 | annadane | and that's kinda the only difference i'm aware of |
| 19:00.29 | greycat | it's not "overrides packages", it's just in your $PATH |
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| 19:01.10 | lovelytingy | can plz send me your $PYTHONPATH |
| 19:01.24 | lovelytingy | And $PYTHONHOME |
| 19:01.35 | lovelytingy | anyone |
| 19:01.37 | jim | with /opt, is it usually a dir off that per project? |
| 19:01.49 | towo` | no, no one here is using ubuntu |
| 19:02.09 | ZaZaGX | maybe in the other room, they weren't any help |
| 19:02.16 | towo` | lovelytingy, go to yor distro channel |
| 19:02.22 | jim | neither of those variables are set for me |
| 19:02.31 | lovelytingy | they not responding |
| 19:02.50 | towo` | lovelytingy, not the problem of this chan |
| 19:02.54 | towo` | go away |
| 19:03.03 | bipul | lovelytingy, Install debian then |
| 19:03.16 | ZaZaGX | but he'll have wifi driver's problem |
| 19:03.27 | jim | lovelytingy, OR, install debian |
| 19:03.35 | ZaZaGX | and won't connect to the internet and won't go on IRC |
| 19:03.42 | lovelytingy | so tell me debian is good for software developers |
| 19:04.02 | jim | lovelytingy, it definitely is |
| 19:04.04 | bipul | Python2 & python3 ? apt-get install python2 python3 |
| 19:04.35 | towo` | lovelytingy, if it would not, ubuntu wouldn't exist |
| 19:04.39 | unborn | hello, is there any way I can copy my terminal input output to txt file separate from history? like an shadow copy |
| 19:04.41 | jim | bipul, possibly he needs --reinstall |
| 19:04.51 | bipul | humm.. |
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| 19:05.16 | unborn | I know about script and scriptreplay but I would like to keep it in one-file.txt |
| 19:05.43 | lovelytingy | i mean to say can i install softwares like android studio,vscode,wine |
| 19:05.45 | greycat | script(1) is what you want. just skip the optional timing file. |
| 19:06.00 | jim | he's removed dirs in /usr, so at best he has now a frankenbuntu |
| 19:06.35 | robobox2 | lovelytingy: yes, as long they as they have debian package files |
| 19:06.46 | bipul | lovelytingy, I feel like 90% of Linux distro today is being derived from Debian. |
| 19:06.51 | ZaZaGX | lovelytingy, download the debian iso and install debian on your machine |
| 19:07.30 | jim | lovelytingy, wine is packaged, the rest you can install from thier site (but remember, don't install outside software in places debian packaging thinks it owns) |
| 19:07.33 | unborn | greycat: sure.. I did use it for a while but when open log.txt file there are strange formatting thingy |
| 19:07.48 | greycat | that's part of what the program wrote to your terminal. |
| 19:07.50 | bipul | FreeBSD is also good :D |
| 19:08.35 | ZaZaGX | will bluetooth work for a bluetooth speaker on debian 10? |
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| 19:08.38 | jim | lovelytingy, you can test to see if debian would find your wireless... interested in trying that? |
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| 19:09.05 | unborn | greycat: is there any way to clear it from that log file? |
| 19:09.30 | andyjpb | hey! |
| 19:09.36 | jim | lovelytingy, if you are interested, I'll give you an image to download, write to a usb stick and boot |
| 19:09.44 | andyjpb | how can I tell if the fix for https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=930764 is going to make it into buster? |
| 19:09.45 | greycat | Ideally you would invoke the application in such a way that it does NOT produce terminal control sequences in the first place. E.g. turning of --color in some commands. |
| 19:09.45 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/930764 in cyrus-common (closed, patch): «Fails to configure package due to "unknown type of DB: BACKUP" on upgrade-db»; severity: grave; opened: 2019-06-20; last modified: 2019-12-21. |
| 19:09.53 | greycat | off* |
| 19:09.58 | ksk | unborn: you would kind of loose information by doing that. view the file with for example "less -R" |
| 19:10.03 | andyjpb | it looks like it has fine in the original buster package but got broken in a buster update at some point |
| 19:11.05 | towo` | lovetolearn, if you want to try debian, use the unofficial non-free iso |
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| 19:11.44 | karlpinc | !firmware images |
| 19:11.44 | dpkg | Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/amd64/iso-cd/ |
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| 19:12.38 | ZaZaGX | i wasn't sure if lovetolearn was asking for that image. wasn't it lovelytingy? |
| 19:12.53 | jim | towo`, you may have the wrong nick |
| 19:13.33 | jim | ZaZaGX, technically, he hasn't asked for it yet |
| 19:13.39 | towo` | ZaZaGX, yes, you are right, haven't seen he was gone |
| 19:13.41 | robobox2 | I use the firmware isos, and my weird hardware works fine. |
| 19:14.18 | OursBlanc | hi everyone . is it possible to avoid to type the password each time i wish to do something with synpatic or other soft... ? |
| 19:14.37 | robobox2 | What DE do you use? |
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| 19:16.23 | annadane | synaptic is generally sort of meant to be started with root isn't it? so that's a bit of its own case |
| 19:16.27 | annadane | i'm not sure |
| 19:16.48 | greycat | I think it can do some stuff like searching without root |
| 19:16.49 | annadane | though if you have a password manager its autocomplete can really save you time if you have a long password |
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| 19:17.57 | robobox2 | I think most desktop environments can save passwords. |
| 19:19.19 | annadane | actually you can just copy paste your password, idk why i suggested autocomplete |
| 19:19.28 | annadane | also autocomplete isn't even the right word |
| 19:19.31 | annadane | auto type |
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| 19:19.48 | annadane | can i just like, get permanently banned from #debian |
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| 19:20.31 | ZaZaGX | maybe g-lined from the whole freenode server |
| 19:22.30 | OursBlanc | robobox2, i use debian 10 with cinnamon desktop |
| 19:23.37 | OursBlanc | its very boring to each time type the password. (Its a long one) if my session is unlocked and hard drive decrypt : its ok ! its me :D dont worry computer :p |
| 19:23.51 | OursBlanc | i'll keep an eye on password manager |
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| 19:35.29 | OursBlanc | Is it possible to combine Nemo's reduced windows into a single tab? (debian 10 cinnamon desktop) |
| 19:35.40 | OursBlanc | i dont know if the problem come from nemo or cinnamon |
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| 19:37.33 | ZaZaGX | can't you just drag it onto the other window? |
| 19:37.39 | ZaZaGX | and it'll make a tab? |
| 19:37.53 | Malivaso | hello |
| 19:37.59 | Malivaso | i am exst |
| 19:37.59 | OursBlanc | ZaZaGX, sorry i dont explain very well... wait |
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| 19:38.57 | OursBlanc | When I minimize a window, it appears at the bottom of my screen in the bar. I'd like to group all the reduced "nemo" windows under a single tab; Same thing for all the windows of my terminal (I don't like UXTerm I installed konsole instead but whatever). |
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| 19:39.38 | ZaZaGX | what happens when you right click on that minimize window? |
| 19:39.44 | ZaZaGX | (tab) |
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| 19:41.28 | Malivaso | so you mean all into 1 icon? |
| 19:42.23 | towo` | OursBlanc, https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=cinnamon+grouped+window+list |
| 19:42.53 | robobox2 | https://imgur.com/a/FVHADcu |
| 19:43.10 | robobox2 | oops wrong channel |
| 19:43.27 | ZaZaGX | i don't get that image |
| 19:43.44 | robobox2 | it was meant for another chaneel |
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| 19:44.00 | ZaZaGX | yeah |
| 19:44.40 | OursBlanc | towo`, seem to be exactly what i need :) |
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| 20:01.02 | joe42 | Hi |
| 20:01.08 | ZaZaGX | hi |
| 20:01.48 | dvs | lo |
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| 20:03.01 | karlpinc | !ask |
| 20:03.01 | dpkg | If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>. |
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| 20:09.27 | dvs | !next |
| 20:09.27 | dpkg | Another happy customer leaves the building. |
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| 20:12.16 | joepublic | dpkg: what's your position on bot pollution? |
| 20:12.17 | dpkg | wish i knew, joepublic |
| 20:12.22 | joepublic | k |
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| 20:14.48 | annadane | !botsnack |
| 20:14.48 | dpkg | annadane: thanks |
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| 20:47.51 | ryouma | is chromium ok to use in stretch? i.e. it's about as secure as firefox-esr and it's about as supported (i.e. new versions show up and so on) |
| 20:48.13 | ryouma | also are there any good dark themes and dark content extensions for it? |
| 20:48.14 | greycat | stretch is still security-supported. |
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| 20:54.03 | ksk | yap, until mid 2020 - and chromium was not in the list of packages exluded for LTS support last time I checked - so you should be fine. |
| 20:54.26 | greycat | there's no compelling reason to remain on stretch, though |
| 20:54.27 | Habbie | assuming upstream does the useful thing, like firefox-esr does |
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| 20:54.48 | Miles8of9 | when will buster have its firefox updated? |
| 20:54.56 | Habbie | Miles8of9, every time firefox-esr updates |
| 20:55.29 | greycat | more precisely, every time upstream drops support for one version of firefox-esr |
| 20:55.59 | greycat | we lost support for esr 60 two months ago, so we were forced to esr 68 at that time |
| 20:56.02 | Habbie | greycat, but also when upstream does a release within the branch debian is currently tracking, right? |
| 20:56.16 | greycat | yes, I guess so |
| 20:56.30 | greycat | I assumed the question was about the major jumps. |
| 20:56.43 | Habbie | well, now we covered both dimensions |
| 20:56.46 | Habbie | :) |
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| 20:58.30 | Miles8of9 | ahh there is no firefox 71 in esr... |
| 20:58.38 | greycat | !esr |
| 20:58.38 | dpkg | Eric S. Raymond, a very clever Linux d00d with lots of very interesting philosophical and political texts. a guy who has some ideas about guns and who can't figure out CUPS. The geezer who wrote Cathedral and Bazaar. Somebody whose sgeigerbot's computer thinks about when it boots: "ESR value before enabling vector: 00000000", or http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond, or <iceweasel esr> |
| 20:58.41 | greycat | ... |
| 20:58.44 | greycat | !firefox esr |
| 20:58.44 | dpkg | Iceweasel Extended Support Release, see https://wiki.mozilla.org/Release_Management/Calendar . Since Debian needs to support packages for years (not weeks!) only the ESR versions are uploaded to unstable as developers only upload packages that are suitable for being included in a release. Other versions are at <mozilla.debian.net> and in <experimental>. |
| 20:59.28 | greycat | According to that calendar, esr 68 goes away in September 2020. That's when we will be forced to use 78. |
| 20:59.54 | Miles8of9 | ahh ok |
| 21:00.16 | ryouma | my firefox-esr on stretch is crashing before it starts (with a dialog box). i have tried a known-good .mozilla. i have tried -safe-mode. i have deleted .mozilla. i have run as a different user using xhost +. they all crash. i have reinstalled. any idea why this is possible? |
| 21:00.48 | ryouma | (still crashes after reinstallation) |
| 21:00.49 | greycat | missing video chipset firmware, or needs a different driver? |
| 21:01.09 | greycat | it might be helpful if you said what's in the "dialog box" |
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| 21:01.13 | ryouma | it worked great yesterday than all of a sudden started crashing. same thing a few weeks prior. |
| 21:01.44 | Miles8of9 | dialog box surely reports an error..! |
| 21:01.56 | ryouma | "Firefox had a problem and crashed. Weâll try to restore your tabs and windows when it restarts. To help us diagnose and fix the problem, you can send us a crash report." |
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| 21:02.47 | ryouma | every time i run it |
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| 21:05.00 | ryouma | i am told i will have better results with firefox if i download it from upstream. i am still trying to figure out the sig. |
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| 21:05.48 | greycat | 'cause yeah, just running down some random path is better than answering questions like "what does the error message say" or "I have xxx chipset" or "dmesg|grep -i firmware says zzz" |
| 21:06.18 | ryouma | beg pardon? |
| 21:06.19 | *** join/#debian rokshis (~rokshis@78.157.84.102) |
| 21:06.21 | greycat | we could try random guessing, too! maybe you have TWO video chipsets, the dreaded Optimus hardware |
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| 21:06.32 | rokshis | guys can anyone translate me this command: ssh root@IP.IP.IP.IP -L 18422:localhost:8334 -N |
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| 21:06.33 | ryouma | error message says "Firefox had a problem and crashed. Weâll try to restore your tabs and windows when it restarts. To help us diagnose and fix the problem, you can send us a crash report." |
| 21:06.53 | rokshis | i am portofrwarding port 18422 to IP.IP.IP.IP localhost's 8334? |
| 21:07.08 | ryouma | dmesg|grep -i firmware says nothing |
| 21:07.09 | greycat | rokshis: yes, a tunnel. |
| 21:07.21 | ryouma | i have no idea about chipsets |
| 21:07.26 | greycat | ryouma: so this is *older* hardware? |
| 21:07.26 | ryouma | sarcasm isn't helping |
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| 21:07.35 | ryouma | it is old hardware |
| 21:07.35 | rokshis | greycat, so im all requests on my machine to localhost:18422 will be forwarded to the IP.IP.IP.IP port 8334? |
| 21:07.47 | rokshis | correct? |
| 21:07.48 | greycat | rokshis: yes |
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| 21:08.05 | rokshis | greycat, great. Could you also tell me, why, when I input this command, it does not do anything? And the terminal just stays hanging |
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| 21:08.18 | rokshis | like the only way I can continue with terminal is with ctrl=c |
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| 21:08.51 | ryouma | (i.e. i don't know what a chipset is exactly and which one to look for and what to look for it with) |
| 21:08.51 | greycat | That would close the tunnel. |
| 21:09.11 | rokshis | greycat, oh i see. Is it possible to open the tunnel in a detached mode or sometihng? |
| 21:09.25 | greycat | If it were me, I would run that command as is, keeping the tunnel open, inside some specific screen/tmux window. |
| 21:09.30 | shibboleth | anyone in here actually find that ubuntu is improved by ditching debian components? |
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| 21:09.41 | shibboleth | first init for upstart, sharing searches with amazon, replacing ifupdown for "netplan" and now good bye to the debian installer |
| 21:09.44 | ryouma | it's intel video and audio. video works great. audio does not produce audio. |
| 21:10.00 | greycat | But yes, you could also add the -f option to ssh to make it fork a background child after it's done with the foreground authentication requirements. |
| 21:12.40 | rokshis | greycat, okay thanks |
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| 21:15.01 | jhutchins_wk | ryouma: Did you purge it, or did you just --reinstall? |
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| 21:15.37 | ryouma | jhutchins_wk: purge then install |
| 21:15.58 | jhutchins_wk | ryouma: Do you have other browsers installed? |
| 21:16.20 | ryouma | jhutchins_wk: no, juhst text ones. just installed chromium just in case. |
| 21:16.43 | jhutchins_wk | ryouma: Yes, whether chromium works is a good datum. |
| 21:16.50 | ryouma | ah, will try |
| 21:17.15 | jhutchins_wk | ryouma: You can also try launching firefox from an xterm and see if it spits out anything useful. |
| 21:18.15 | jhutchins_wk | ryouma: Upstream people will always say use upstream, Debian people will always say use the Debian packages. |
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| 21:20.31 | ryouma | that was a good idea. chromium crashed. first chromium told me that /run/user/1000 was not accessible. and it did look like i needed to chown it to user:user. so why, idk. so i did and re-ran chromium. but then it crashed saying out of memory. but i have 4.4G "avail" according to free -ht. (most of memory is in buffers/cache.) |
| 21:21.28 | ryouma | i tried firefox-esr from terminal and it spits out lots of gtk garbage, BUT running from another user does not. |
| 21:21.36 | ryouma | (and crashes) |
| 21:21.39 | greycat | you will definitely want to figure out what's wrong with your /run |
| 21:22.45 | ryouma | well, it looked a bit broken, but idk what to doi to find out what caused the owndership and roup to be root. |
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| 21:23.21 | ryouma | it might be that the dribe was disconnected and /home was made ro. but that was not hte case the previous time firefox crashed a week or so ago. |
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| 21:24.06 | ryouma | in a while i will try rebooting, in case there are similar evanescent fses that are broken (i assume run is evanescent, perhaps it is specifically not so, dunno) |
| 21:24.28 | greycat | you can type "df /run" and see |
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| 21:25.09 | greycat | it *should* be a tmpfs. if yours is NOT, then that's a clue something has gone seriously pear-shaped. |
| 21:27.34 | ryouma | anyway chromium says [21288:21308:1230/142714.712927:FATAL:memory.cc(22)] Out of memory. size=131072 |
| 21:28.29 | greycat | maybe in addition to breaking ownership of subdirs in /run, something filled it up with files |
| 21:28.38 | greycat | the output of df /run would be helpful there |
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| 21:29.27 | ryouma | tmpfs 578012 22608 555404 4% /run |
| 21:29.52 | ryouma | (Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on) |
| 21:30.08 | greycat | Hmm, that's ... not immediately the obvious cause of your out of memory error. |
| 21:30.36 | greycat | 22608 used is a bit higher than mine (2436) but I don't know what the normal amount is for a desktop environment |
| 21:31.23 | greycat | maybe other programs are using up all your memory (checking "free" would be good), or maybe you've somehow managed to set a resource limit (ulimit -a) |
| 21:31.36 | ryouma | i run fluxbox and no dm/de/whatever |
| 21:32.17 | ryouma | no ulimit directly at least. free says Mem: 5780108 709308 289836 141852 4780964 4631648 which is total used free shared buff/cache available |
| 21:32.40 | ryouma | which means, again, 4.6 available |
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| 21:55.56 | karlpinc | If I give apt a regexp which matches everything for Unattended-Upgrade::Package-Blacklist (and configure unattended upgrades to email me) will unattended-upgrade not update anything automatically but email if something needs upgrading? |
| 21:56.18 | karlpinc | Seems like it should work, but the only way to test for sure is to have a package installed that needs upgrading. |
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| 21:56.55 | karlpinc | Is there any way I can rig up a test? |
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| 22:00.02 | nkuttler | btw, why does judd list dmm versions if we recommend not to use them? |
| 22:00.28 | greycat | same reason the CDC lists diseases |
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| 22:02.40 | nkuttler | i don't know.. it more like a drug dealer advertising a new high or something |
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| 22:26.36 | Mazhive | can someone guide me to install a package i have installed multiple times but now it does install but is not available ??/ quite confusing hu,... it concerns vlc i am using buster. it installs the |
| 22:27.01 | Mazhive | package via the usual way |
| 22:27.33 | towo` | Mazhive, tell us the exact problem |
| 22:27.37 | Mazhive | it tells me it is installed all though typing vlc gives command not found |
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| 22:27.50 | towo` | what command you have used and what was the output |
| 22:28.08 | Mazhive | Reading package lists... Done |
| 22:28.08 | Mazhive | Building dependency tree |
| 22:28.08 | Mazhive | Reading state information... Done |
| 22:28.08 | Mazhive | vlc is already the newest version (3.0.8-0+deb10u1). |
| 22:28.08 | Mazhive | 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded. |
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| 22:28.50 | Mazhive | sorry |
| 22:29.22 | Mazhive | bash: vlc: command not found |
| 22:29.55 | towo` | Mazhive, which vlc is sying what? |
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| 22:30.40 | Mazhive | sudo apt install vlc gets me that output |
| 22:30.55 | Mazhive | typing in vlc gets me the second output |
| 22:31.08 | towo` | you should type which vlc in an terminal |
| 22:31.18 | Mazhive | yes i did |
| 22:31.29 | towo` | no, you didn't |
| 22:31.30 | coruja | 'which vlc' |
| 22:31.41 | towo` | the command you should type is 'which vlc' |
| 22:31.55 | Mazhive | it gives me zero output |
| 22:32.16 | towo` | Mazhive, apt --reinstall install vlc |
| 22:32.23 | Mazhive | done that |
| 22:33.01 | towo` | apt install vlc != apt --reinstall install vlc |
| 22:33.15 | Mazhive | yup |
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| 22:33.50 | Mazhive | vlc command not found |
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| 22:34.14 | moaker_ | hey guys, how are you |
| 22:34.38 | towo` | Mazhive, /usr/bin/vlc |
| 22:35.18 | Mazhive | no such file |
| 22:36.06 | Mazhive | i would have thought after a reinstall it would be there but no it is not there not even after a reinstall |
| 22:36.14 | towo` | Mazhive, dpkg -l | grep vlc |
| 22:36.32 | coruja | !paste |
| 22:36.32 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: http://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: http://file.io/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): http://file.io or http://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <wgetpaste>. |
| 22:37.53 | Mazhive | https://paste.debian.net/1123242/ |
| 22:38.10 | B|ack0p | Error mounting /dev/sdb at /media/m/disk: no medium found on /dev/sdb. |
| 22:38.18 | B|ack0p | what does this error mean? |
| 22:38.20 | towo` | Mazhive, apt --reinstall install vlc-bin |
| 22:38.52 | towo` | Mazhive, and binaries do not disappear by themselves |
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| 22:42.35 | Mazhive | i get a output but no gui , i had done some compiling on th source code of vlc i think there were some overwrites on the files that should not happen ... probably my error |
| 22:43.09 | melkor | Hi everybody. I'm having a weird issue. I attempted to install wine and my wifi stopped working. if I stop network-manager and do iwlist it shows no networks, but my other computer is connected. I've run through a bunch of stuff including re-installing the wl driver and I'm kind of at a loss of where to look next. |
| 22:43.19 | towo` | Mazhive, sure, it's your error |
| 22:43.43 | towo` | clueless compiling and installing by bypassing the package management is allways a stupid idea |
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| 22:44.34 | towo` | Mazhive, apt purge $(dpkg -l | awk '/vlc/{ print $2}') && apt install vlc |
| 22:44.36 | Ede|Popede | B|ack0p: what kind of device is sdb? |
| 22:44.44 | melkor | I'm not really getting any errors in any logs that look related to this and ip a shows my card with an assigned mac address. |
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| 22:45.45 | B|ack0p | Ede|Popede: usb floppy drive |
| 22:45.57 | B|ack0p | does it mean no diskette inside? |
| 22:46.22 | OerHeks | is there a diskette inside? |
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| 22:47.33 | Habbie | it sounds like there is not : |
| 22:47.33 | Mazhive | towo' i appreciate your help , i still have no gui |
| 22:47.35 | Habbie | :) |
| 22:47.39 | OerHeks | put one in and try the magic again.. or wait, it automounts? |
| 22:47.43 | melkor | oops, nm, just modprode -r wl and modprobed b43 and that seemed to fix it, maybe wine removed the correct driver for some reason. |
| 22:47.55 | towo` | Mazhive, dpkg -l | grep vlc |
| 22:48.11 | Habbie | wine generally does not mess with modules, though |
| 22:48.38 | B|ack0p | OerHeks: i dont have diskette that s why i cant test if it works or not :/ |
| 22:48.46 | B|ack0p | i bought it 2nd hand today |
| 22:49.08 | Mazhive | https://paste.debian.net/1123243/ |
| 22:49.12 | melkor | Habbie, I didn't think it would, but there where was no other precursor I could imagine messing with that. |
| 22:50.04 | melkor | Would adding and removing modules show up in the syslog? |
| 22:50.07 | Ede|Popede | B|ack0p: i'd have an unopened package of 5.25â if this might help ;) |
| 22:50.34 | towo` | Mazhive, and there is no output in your terminal, if you type vlc there? |
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| 22:50.47 | B|ack0p | Ede|Popede: what is that? diskette package? |
| 22:50.56 | Ede|Popede | yep, the bigger ones |
| 22:50.59 | war9407 | fail2ban question (using Debian's fail2ban) Anyone able to get a host ABOVE a matching regex? (the line above)? - I have the asme problem as this guy but can't get it to work -> https://github.com/fail2ban/fail2ban/issues/2492 |
| 22:51.03 | B|ack0p | lol what do you use them for? |
| 22:51.25 | Ede|Popede | maybe i feel like using that old floppy again some day |
| 22:51.30 | towo` | Ede|Popede, i don't think, there is any usb floppy for 5.25" discs |
| 22:51.37 | Mazhive | i get output VLC media player 3.0.8 Vetinari (revision 3.0.8-0-gf350b6b5a7) and the next line my cursor is blinking waiting to type something :) |
| 22:51.53 | Ede|Popede | towo`: wouldn't surprise me if there was a mod for some 1541 |
| 22:52.34 | Mazhive | ah i see its my compiled version |
| 22:52.38 | B|ack0p | Ede|Popede: that s why i got a floppy drive :p for sake of old days |
| 22:52.52 | Mazhive | vlc --version says its my compiled version |
| 22:53.53 | towo` | Mazhive, selfcompiled? then you have done something wrong |
| 22:54.19 | towo` | i'm out |
| 22:54.20 | Ede|Popede | B|ack0p: why not, as long as there are disks available. only i wouldn't really want to install buster from them |
| 22:54.22 | Mazhive | https://paste.debian.net/1123246/ |
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| 22:54.31 | B|ack0p | lol Ede|Popede |
| 22:55.24 | Mazhive | ahum clearly |
| 22:56.18 | ryouma | ok gonna reboot and stuff to try to fix firefox |
| 22:56.21 | Ede|Popede | atm my other system works a bit like in the old days. live system and installer both boot fine in BIOS and EFI mode, only i don't get it to see the installed buster. so at least a use some kind of boot disk again after all these years :) |
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| 23:00.58 | B|ack0p | :p |
| 23:01.04 | B|ack0p | which is your other system Ede|Popede ? |
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| 23:05.21 | Ede|Popede | B|ack0p: a used lenovo. thinkcentre 82. typical office machine. meant to run windows and office and explorer. |
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| 23:07.38 | B|ack0p | Ede|Popede: cool. i am ThinkFan :p |
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| 23:08.21 | B|ack0p | i used thinkcentre at office. i have thinkpads but one day i wanna buy thinkcentre too |
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| 23:09.41 | Ede|Popede | around 100 bucks, including win10home. official license, so why not. upgraded to 8GB, runs fine. only that it doesn't find anything to boot with just the debian disk in it. |
| 23:10.29 | Ede|Popede | even with the 4GB it had at the beginning it was way faster than this machine with only 2, so yes, enough RAM is crucial. |
| 23:10.43 | B|ack0p | Ede|Popede: which model of tcentre? |
| 23:11.10 | Ede|Popede | M82 though i'm not sure if there's only a single variant of it |
| 23:11.28 | B|ack0p | hmm |
| 23:11.53 | B|ack0p | toolless opening right? |
| 23:12.16 | B|ack0p | small size but not tiny |
| 23:12.43 | Ede|Popede | yep, both sides. and some carriage for the HDDs (so if you get one, remember to get some more of them for later) |
| 23:12.48 | Mazhive | towo' thank you for your assistance i figured it out to have it working again ... i recompiled it and uninstalled the compiled version with make uninstall |
| 23:13.10 | B|ack0p | yep |
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| 23:21.12 | un214 | how do I set an interrupt key for systemd timeouts? |
| 23:21.43 | un214 | it wants to wait for many minutes for things that are clearly never going to come up if they didn't come up in the first two seconds |
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| 23:24.39 | Boodie | Hi guys, I am with stretch; I need to upgrade to buster, are there any instructions? |
| 23:24.47 | joepublic | is there a good, purpose-built app in debian for recording video capture? VLC doesn't see the audio and webcamoid is cumbersome |
| 23:26.03 | un214 | change stretch to jessie in /etc/apt/sources.list and update |
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| 23:26.14 | karlpinc | !release notes |
| 23:26.15 | dpkg | The release notes for Debian 10 "Buster" are at https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/ . See also <stretch->buster>, <buster install guide> |
| 23:26.20 | joepublic | to jessie? |
| 23:26.23 | karlpinc | !stretch->buster |
| 23:26.29 | un214 | sloppy of me :( should be buster |
| 23:26.54 | karlpinc | Boodie: You must upgrade a release at a time, from one to the next. |
| 23:27.12 | karlpinc | Boodie: Follow the instructions in the release notes. |
| 23:27.33 | Boodie | I might be with jessie, apologies ... how do I check? |
| 23:27.38 | karlpinc | Boodie: Do _not_ try to upgrade and skip releases. |
| 23:27.45 | karlpinc | Boodie: cat /etc/debian_version |
| 23:27.49 | un214 | see /etc/apt/sources.list |
| 23:28.07 | Boodie | 9.11 |
| 23:28.11 | joepublic | I don't think there are many released between stretch and buster. |
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| 23:28.30 | karlpinc | Boodie: You are on stretch. So follow the buster release note instructions. |
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| 23:28.34 | un214 | there aren't any |
| 23:29.16 | karlpinc | happens to be upgrading stretch boxes to buster just now |
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| 23:30.21 | Boodie | Has anyone upgraded successfully? |
| 23:30.37 | karlpinc | Boodie: Lots and lots. |
| 23:30.41 | Ede|Popede | i've heard of someone succeeding |
| 23:30.43 | joepublic | upgrading successfully is the norm. |
| 23:31.01 | karlpinc | Boodie: _If_ you follow the instructions. |
| 23:31.03 | Boodie | So the upgrade works |
| 23:31.15 | Boodie | Excellent |
| 23:31.39 | karlpinc | Boodie: Basically, anything non-debian should (probably) be removed and then re-installed after upgrading. (That's one of the things the instructions say.) |
| 23:32.08 | Boodie | all the packages non-free? |
| 23:32.22 | karlpinc | Boodie: Upgrading is the big test on how well you have administered your system. |
| 23:32.35 | karlpinc | Boodie: Non-free packages are fine. So long as they come from the debian repos. |
| 23:34.48 | Boodie | I basically have nothing installed other than from the repositories in sources.list |
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| 23:35.56 | karlpinc | Boodie: Perfect. |
| 23:35.57 | Boodie | Or, nothing that I can remember installing, in general all my experiments of packages installed from source failed, so I gave up |
| 23:36.28 | karlpinc | Boodie: (There's a tl;dr version that the dpkg bot has, but it does not seem to be displaying it now. :( ) |
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| 23:37.24 | Boodie | Is there a way to identify if there is anything alien in the system? I think that it's probably diffcult |
| 23:37.33 | karlpinc | Boodie: The upgrade instructions go on forever, and cover all the contingencies. You basically need only a few commands. Usually. But when you don't it's really good to have read the instructions. |
| 23:37.50 | karlpinc | Boodie: See the instructions. It has a method. |
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| 23:38.30 | Boodie | So, if I type "/msg dpkg stretch->buster" I should be given the guide; |
| 23:38.48 | karlpinc | Boodie: (Unless you've done "make ; make install". There are better ways. See the "don't break debian" page at wiki.debian.org.) |
| 23:38.59 | karlpinc | Boodie: Supposedly. |
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| 23:39.19 | karlpinc | Boodie: That's the super-short version. Better to skim the long version with all the warnings and suggestions. |
| 23:40.00 | karlpinc | Boodie: Like I said, the bot didn't respond to me on that factoid. |
| 23:40.22 | karlpinc | !release notes |
| 23:40.22 | dpkg | The release notes for Debian 10 "Buster" are at https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/ . See also <stretch->buster>, <buster install guide> |
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| 23:44.02 | Boodie | How long does it take (approx), I have a pretty recent machine? |
| 23:44.26 | karlpinc | Boodie: It's mostly download time. |
| 23:45.08 | karlpinc | Boodie: It always takes me way longer than I think it will. I make sure I have a backup. I actually read the instructions (again). And so forth. |
| 23:45.42 | Boodie | The last time I did an upgrade it was probably to Jessie a while ago and I ended up without the graphic interface, so I struggled a bit |
| 23:46.04 | Boodie | As I am not so proficient with the command line |
| 23:46.31 | karlpinc | Boodie: There's occasional cases where apt-listchanges tells me that something has changed and I need to adjust a config file somewhere. Or maybe I'm using a package and the release notes tell me that there's a major upgrade and it needs work, etc. |
| 23:48.01 | karlpinc | Boodie: Commands can be cut-and-paste from the instructions. |
| 23:48.01 | karlpinc | (That's what I do.) |
| 23:48.03 | karlpinc | It is possible that there's a period during the upgrade where X stops working. So I like to upgrade from a vt. |
| 23:48.04 | karlpinc | !vt |
| 23:48.04 | dpkg | vt is, like, Virtual Terminal, like the console; change VTs using Alt+Left/Right or Alt+F1, Alt+F2 etc. To get from X to a VT, use Ctrl+Alt+F1 (and Alt+F7 to get back, most likely). You can also use "chvt" to switch VT. VT is also used to mean Intel VT-x or VT-d (virtualization support; the AMD counterpart is called AMD-V or Pacifica), ask me about <xve>. |
| 23:48.38 | karlpinc | (The 3 or so actual commands that upgrade.) |
| 23:49.34 | un214 | I'm planning to upgrade my system to systemd to see if it's still completely hosed |
| 23:49.43 | karlpinc | Boodie: It is always possible that you'll need to edit something to get X working again. (Not likely, but if you're using proprietary graphic drivers than that's a complication.) |
| 23:50.09 | karlpinc | un214: Give up. The hozed is built-in. |
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| 23:50.35 | un214 | what do you run for init karlpinc? |
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| 23:50.40 | karlpinc | Boodie: Anyway, it helps to be able to use an editor that does not rely on the gui. You can always used nano. |
| 23:50.59 | karlpinc | un214: I gave up and went to systemd. It's just what's happening on linux. |
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| 23:51.27 | un214 | so the question to find out is whether it's still utterly incompatible with my raid driver |
| 23:51.42 | karlpinc | un214: I still can't do things like reboot with a fsck without editing the kernel's command line from the bootloader. But that's life. |
| 23:52.23 | un214 | I'm seriously plotting making a package that does dpkg-divert for some pieces of systemd and completely hijacks early boot |
| 23:52.23 | karlpinc | un214: I stay away from hardware raid. Unless I have a spare identical controller. Otherwise if the controller fries my data's gone. |
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| 23:52.57 | un214 | lol man I've checked this; all I have to do is take the disks out and set them up on any arbitrary PC and I can read them |
| 23:53.21 | karlpinc | un214: Jolly good. Best to test! |
| 23:53.23 | Boodie | Ok thanks for the hints: I'll try tomorrow! |
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| 23:54.18 | karlpinc | un214: You're sure it's real hardware raid, and not just proprietary software raid done with a driver? |
| 23:55.03 | un214 | it's smart enough to keep track of which side of the mirror is fresher on power loss--software raid can't do that |
| 23:55.03 | karlpinc | un214: Otherwise may as well just use software raid. (Which also "just works", and has raid, when you plug it into an arbitrary PC. :-) |
| 23:55.34 | karlpinc | un214: Nice. (I suppose it _could.... I haven't kept up.) |
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| 23:56.11 | un214 | saved my behind when grub2 auto-installed itself and enabled UUID probe and caused the kernel to bypass the RAID and write to one side |
| 23:56.17 | un214 | it knew which side it was |
| 23:58.11 | un214 | hardware raid has the advantage of storing consistency info in NVRAM |
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