| 00:00.02 | *** join/#debian polardroid (~polardroi@185.92.26.216) |
| 00:01.26 | *** join/#debian de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) |
| 00:02.04 | *** join/#debian hyskaru (~hyskaru@unaffiliated/hyskaru) |
| 00:02.36 | *** join/#debian yonder (~yonder@unaffiliated/yonder) |
| 00:04.10 | *** join/#debian openface (~of@78.83.169.22) |
| 00:06.53 | *** join/#debian forgotmynick (uid24625@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ztgjmskcnslefmoe) |
| 00:09.14 | *** join/#debian black_ant (~antilope@unaffiliated/black-ant/x-1505394) |
| 00:09.16 | *** join/#debian television (~alex@unaffiliated/arexr) |
| 00:12.08 | *** join/#debian gnufr33dom (~gnufr33do@ip24-253-15-85.lv.lv.cox.net) |
| 00:12.15 | *** join/#debian rgdgnfnfgh (~van@220.84.215.65) |
| 00:14.01 | *** join/#debian kupi (uid212005@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zdpoxaeiczciavjn) |
| 00:17.25 | *** join/#debian martian67| (~martian67@about/linux/regular/martian67) |
| 00:25.56 | *** join/#debian _Matth_ (~Matth@2401:bf00:1:7ed9:e12d:f67e:782c:1dbd) |
| 00:27.41 | *** join/#debian lief871 (~koenraad@115.23.198.11) |
| 00:28.07 | *** join/#debian blurkis (~blurkis@213-67-53-121-no157.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 00:30.10 | *** part/#debian polardroid (~polardroi@185.92.26.216) |
| 00:34.02 | *** join/#debian shibboleth (~shibbolet@gateway/tor-sasl/shibboleth) |
| 00:40.43 | *** join/#debian heiner__ (~heiner@dslc-082-083-033-136.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 00:51.45 | *** join/#debian diniwed (~gavron@185.253.99.99) |
| 00:52.48 | *** join/#debian emperorOfTrebiz1 (~EMPEROR_O@173.44.37.62) |
| 00:54.03 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | anyone know what the state of software update transparency is for apt? |
| 00:55.17 | *** join/#debian jeddi (~jedd@203-129-25-127.cb8119.syd.static.aussiebb.net) |
| 00:58.18 | *** join/#debian mnemonic (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 00:59.19 | annadane | er... transparency? in what sense |
| 00:59.32 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | like CHAINIAC |
| 00:59.34 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 00:59.37 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | or these guys: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1711.07278.pdf |
| 01:00.03 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | defending against targeted malicious updates, etc |
| 01:01.01 | annadane | hmm, i'm not an expert in that area but we have (not 100%) reproducible builds and package checksums |
| 01:01.09 | annadane | but someone else can probably answer |
| 01:01.27 | annadane | ,i debsums |
| 01:01.29 | judd | Package debsums (admin, optional) in buster/amd64: tool for verification of installed package files against MD5 checksums. Version: 2.2.3; Size: 48.6k; Installed: 120k; Screenshot: https://screenshots.debian.net/package/debsums |
| 01:01.58 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | does this address a malicious build server? |
| 01:02.04 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | (thx) |
| 01:02.06 | sney | all package updates are tracked, source is available for audit, it's pretty transparent IME but some parts of the process are the responsibility of individual package maintainers which has at least once historically led to a security flaw. |
| 01:02.42 | sney | in any case, #debian is more of a tech support channel and you may have better results asking a dev mailing list. |
| 01:02.51 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | oh right, OK |
| 01:03.00 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | thanks on both counts |
| 01:03.08 | sney | np |
| 01:03.38 | annadane | and if you stick to stable i guess you get more security to assuage your paranoia that someone hasn't uploaded a malware package to unstable |
| 01:03.46 | annadane | though i doubt a debian developer would ever do that |
| 01:04.13 | annadane | although if you're using stuff like node packages or external things then the bet becomes less certain |
| 01:04.36 | annadane | not that that was really your question :P |
| 01:05.09 | sney | it's very unlikely that a debian developer would intentionally ship malware but there's always the possibility of something like this happening again and slipping through the cracks: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/05/random_number_b.html |
| 01:05.37 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | thanks much appreciated! I know there is some research interest in this stuff, but I wasn't sure if it ever actually got into use with any of the big distros |
| 01:06.00 | *** join/#debian FennecCode (~user@cpe-172-250-82-66.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 01:06.32 | sney | see tracker.debian.org for a look at how versions, patchsets, etc are tracked within the debian ecosystem |
| 01:08.25 | *** join/#debian thiras (~thiras@unaffiliated/thiras) |
| 01:08.37 | annadane | still, debian might benefit from (and i'm not seriously proposing this, more of a fun thought experiment because i can) the equivalent of those companies that hire people to try to break into their systems/offices, have someone occasionally try to upload malware and see how good the system is at catching it |
| 01:08.51 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 01:08.59 | annadane | but anyway. :P |
| 01:10.23 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | I agree |
| 01:10.39 | FennecCode | Like an emergency drill sort of thing? ð |
| 01:11.25 | annadane | there's a filtering process from sid to testing but that's more of a bug thing, not checking each line of code for "hey this is actively malicious" |
| 01:11.30 | annadane | AFAIK, anyway |
| 01:12.01 | annadane | still, if you did that as a DD you'd be ostracized forever |
| 01:12.40 | *** join/#debian Acheron (~Acheron@unaffiliated/acheron) |
| 01:14.58 | annadane | this is also why 'diff' is good, if i'm the maintainer for WINE and version 4.8 of WINE was 100% vetted but i slip some malware into 4.9, you see that |
| 01:15.30 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 01:16.35 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 01:17.44 | *** join/#debian ddsys (~ddsys@unaffiliated/ddsys) |
| 01:19.25 | *** join/#debian palimaar (~oasd@KD113148020047.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp) |
| 01:19.27 | *** join/#debian satousan (main@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/satousama) |
| 01:24.13 | *** join/#debian k-man (~jason@unaffiliated/k-man) |
| 01:24.38 | emperorOfTrebiz1 | annadane: great point. For sure building for yourself is one way to avoid some problems, but its hard to audit well, and sooner or later almost everyone needs packages, where the problem of targeted malicious updates "rears its ugly head" clearly, I'd say |
| 01:29.05 | *** join/#debian zalt_ (~devp@unaffiliated/lambda443) |
| 01:29.51 | alexrelis[m] | Anyone here flash Libreboot on their computer running Debian? |
| 01:31.18 | alexrelis[m] | How did you set up full disk encryption on an already configured system? I have a Thinkpad X200 with stock BIOS right now with an encrypted / but an unencrypted /boot stored on a separate USB flash drive. I'm going to flash Libreboot on it soon and I'm looking for the best method. |
| 01:31.27 | *** join/#debian sidmo_ (~ident@p5b24e8aa.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 01:35.05 | *** join/#debian citypw (~citypw@gateway/tor-sasl/citypw) |
| 01:38.06 | *** join/#debian gnufr33dom (~gnufr33do@ip24-253-15-85.lv.lv.cox.net) |
| 01:42.08 | *** join/#debian dominic34 (Thunderbir@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dominic34) |
| 01:44.00 | *** join/#debian gnufr33dom (~gnufr33do@ip24-253-15-85.lv.lv.cox.net) |
| 01:44.58 | *** join/#debian fmaurer (~quassel@188.126.171.189) |
| 01:45.49 | *** part/#debian emperorOfTrebiz1 (~EMPEROR_O@173.44.37.62) |
| 01:54.36 | *** join/#debian Rothgar (~admin@ppp201-15.static.internode.on.net) |
| 01:54.37 | *** join/#debian zevenar (~zevenar@node-1w7jr9y7xhvzkfgyggy7svhve.ipv6.telus.net) |
| 01:54.43 | zevenar | devuan |
| 01:55.13 | zevenar | reggin |
| 01:58.14 | *** join/#debian zeden (~user@unaffiliated/zeden) |
| 01:58.24 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 02:00.59 | zevenar | debian is lgihter weight thna arch? |
| 02:08.58 | *** join/#debian _Matth_ (~Matth@2401:bf00:1:7ed9:e12d:f67e:782c:1dbd) |
| 02:09.53 | alexrelis[m] | zevenar: That depends on how each system is configured. |
| 02:13.31 | *** join/#debian Newami (~Newami@ip174-68-64-138.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 02:16.27 | *** join/#debian diniwed (~gavron@194.5.53.76) |
| 02:21.17 | *** join/#debian isnice (~isnice@unaffiliated/isnice) |
| 02:27.29 | *** join/#debian thiras (~thiras@unaffiliated/thiras) |
| 02:31.58 | *** join/#debian oahong_ (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 02:36.08 | *** join/#debian Zppix (uid182351@miraheze/Zppix) |
| 02:36.13 | *** join/#debian secntech (~secntech@unaffiliated/secntech) |
| 02:38.06 | *** join/#debian Cabanoss- (~Cabanossi@ppp-88-217-89-25.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 02:46.01 | zykotick9 | alexrelis[m]: FYI, with Libreboot you have GRUB as a BIOS, thus you can do FULL disk encryption if you want, and not have an unencrypted /boot at all. Most secure option, but a bit of a pain when kernel updates happen as you have to reinstall LB each time. Sidenote #2, I'd strongly suggest you keep a backup of your origional BIOS (can't "really" be replaced, with same MAC) - I'm SO happy I did. Best |
| 02:46.07 | zykotick9 | of luck. |
| 02:50.48 | alexrelis[m] | zykotick9: Thanks, friend. Full disk encryption is what I'm trying to accomplish. I didn't know you had to reinstall Libreboot after EVERY kernel update. Do I just simply need to apt upgrade and flashrom it again to get my system running the new kernel? |
| 02:51.49 | zykotick9 | alexrelis[m]: ya. Hardware flash only required first time, it's trivial in comparison, you just need to update the "path" to the new kernel/version. |
| 02:59.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1134] by debhelper |
| 03:00.43 | zykotick9 | alexrelis[m]: from way-back-machine, if you scroll down and see the "libreboot installtion" titled photo, that's me and the creator of libreboot back in 2016 backstage at Libreplanet, that's my t400 in pieces on the desk https://web.archive.org/web/20160304124812/https://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/libreplanet-2015-highlights-and-what-comes-next |
| 03:06.57 | *** join/#debian ajeremias (~ajeremias@static.73.172.216.95.clients.your-server.de) |
| 03:08.52 | *** join/#debian Sloyment (~thomas@2a04:4540:6b10:c600:ca1f:66ff:fe13:2a) |
| 03:14.56 | *** join/#debian ajeremias (~ajeremias@static.73.172.216.95.clients.your-server.de) |
| 03:23.47 | alexrelis[m] | zykotick9: Wow. Very cool. I was considering paying Leah to flash Libreboot for me but I decided to do it myself since it's a special occasion. Not sure if it's a good idea since I easily break things, but we'll see how it goes, lol. |
| 03:31.02 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 03:33.37 | *** join/#debian aliasnumber10 (~crix@cpe-76-167-192-248.san.res.rr.com) |
| 03:34.31 | *** join/#debian sincere_fox (uid337158@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-knhhfmsyjxaizzee) |
| 03:36.00 | *** join/#debian stunder (~smuxi@ip68-4-111-49.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 03:47.57 | zykotick9 | alexrelis[m]: best of luck. I actually flashed my x200 myself. |
| 03:49.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1127] by debhelper |
| 03:52.45 | *** join/#debian dominic34 (Thunderbir@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dominic34) |
| 03:55.23 | *** join/#debian karstensrage (~karstensr@unaffiliated/karstensrage) |
| 04:08.13 | *** join/#debian Cabanossi (~Cabanossi@ppp-88-217-89-25.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 04:09.52 | *** join/#debian nickodd (~nickodd@unaffiliated/nickodd) |
| 04:11.24 | *** join/#debian Jade_NL (~JadeNL@unaffiliated/jade-nl/x-0507005) |
| 04:14.28 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 04:18.21 | *** join/#debian palimaar (~oasd@KD113148020047.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp) |
| 04:27.15 | *** join/#debian gavlee (~gav@unaffiliated/gavlee) |
| 04:31.56 | *** join/#debian a0z (~a0z@88-107-186-139.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 04:42.15 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 04:42.20 | *** join/#debian gavlee (~gav@unaffiliated/gavlee) |
| 04:42.35 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.122.51) |
| 04:48.55 | *** join/#debian Grldfrdom (uid391113@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kkrkmfbvmyvnaciy) |
| 04:58.45 | *** join/#debian ajeremias (~ajeremias@static.73.172.216.95.clients.your-server.de) |
| 05:13.00 | *** join/#debian stunder (~smuxi@ip68-4-111-49.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 05:17.37 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 05:18.59 | *** join/#debian StathisA (~StathisA@unaffiliated/stathisa) |
| 05:23.02 | *** join/#debian StathisA_ (~StathisA@unaffiliated/stathisa) |
| 05:25.42 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 05:26.55 | *** part/#debian nickodd (~nickodd@unaffiliated/nickodd) |
| 05:30.28 | *** join/#debian bocaneri (sauvin@about/linux/staff/sauvin) |
| 05:31.59 | *** join/#debian Barralastic (~Barralast@92.255.124.118) |
| 05:32.06 | *** join/#debian czesmir (~stefan@egs27.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 05:32.57 | *** join/#debian bmlzootown (~bmlzootow@unaffiliated/bmlzootown) |
| 05:34.02 | *** join/#debian thatpythonguy (thatpython@gateway/vpn/mullvad/thatpythonguy) |
| 05:37.17 | *** join/#debian Furai (~Furai@cookiehoster.furai.pl) |
| 05:37.24 | *** join/#debian gordonfish (~gordonfis@unaffiliated/gordonfish) |
| 05:38.40 | *** join/#debian r3m_ (~launch@unaffiliated/r3m) |
| 05:40.28 | *** join/#debian u0m3 (~u0m3@gateway/tor-sasl/u0m3) |
| 05:41.38 | jhutchins | ;q |
| 05:41.42 | jhutchins | wzir |
| 05:41.47 | jhutchins | exit |
| 05:43.32 | *** join/#debian Arahael (~arahael@203.158.51.122) |
| 05:44.25 | *** join/#debian dastier_ (~dastier@178.127.112.124) |
| 05:45.49 | *** join/#debian jhutchins (~jonathan@136.34.212.57) |
| 05:48.13 | *** join/#debian wytchmaster (~wytchmast@2003:a:a13:3002:161e:d791:2a2c:975d) |
| 05:48.37 | *** join/#debian oahong_ (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 05:49.57 | *** join/#debian jeddi (~jedd@203-129-25-127.cb8119.syd.static.aussiebb.net) |
| 05:50.10 | *** join/#debian StathisA (~StathisA@unaffiliated/stathisa) |
| 06:00.46 | *** join/#debian SirLagz_ (~SirLagz@59-102-117-8.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 06:02.04 | SirLagzz | can anyone shed some light on this error message - "(Reason: Unit nginx.service failed to load properly: Is a directory.)" <-- I can't figure out *What* is a directory, the unit file seems ok, I can start nginx by hand as well. I've googled that specific error but haven't found anything useful yet. |
| 06:02.25 | SirLagzz | I haven't modified the unit file at all by hand |
| 06:06.08 | *** join/#debian medard (~medard@unaffiliated/medard) |
| 06:09.37 | *** join/#debian bobey (~bobey@cpe-70-94-44-250.kc.res.rr.com) |
| 06:16.00 | *** join/#debian swift110_ (~swift110@unaffiliated/swift110) |
| 06:16.13 | themill | That might just be something returning errno 21 and it's being interpreted that way, or it might actually be the error :( |
| 06:16.39 | *** join/#debian ich (~ich@ip-62-143-216-215.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 06:17.04 | *** join/#debian martinus__ (~martin@132.31.201.77.rev.sfr.net) |
| 06:17.44 | *** join/#debian CombatVet (~c4@gateway/tor-sasl/combatvet) |
| 06:19.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1135] by debhelper |
| 06:19.51 | *** join/#debian Haohmaru (~Haohmaru@195.24.53.110) |
| 06:23.19 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.122.51) |
| 06:23.58 | *** join/#debian tagomago (~tagomago@47.61.152.183) |
| 06:29.44 | *** join/#debian r3m (~launch@unaffiliated/r3m) |
| 06:30.43 | *** join/#debian duskmourn (~duskmourn@2600:1700:e7d1:5000::45) |
| 06:32.27 | *** join/#debian r3m (~launch@unaffiliated/r3m) |
| 06:33.58 | *** join/#debian JobMuffin (uid456047@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xajhpqgaaqrmjrjo) |
| 06:37.48 | RoyK | ratrace: IIRC the boot logs are rotated per boot, not daily. But the data should be in the kernel logs as well |
| 06:37.53 | *** join/#debian electro33 (uid613@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vwinbydswfytebmq) |
| 06:38.26 | RoyK | wee bit of mental lag there :) I had scrolled up nd forgotten about it |
| 06:38.28 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 06:41.07 | *** join/#debian FennecCode (~user@cpe-172-250-82-66.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 06:42.16 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@188.25.162.103) |
| 06:45.57 | ratrace | RoyK: there's no special "boot log" default config for rsyslog, and /var/log/syslog gets *.* by default (a bit inefficient as several files overlap in messages they store) |
| 06:46.14 | ratrace | ideally, yes, persistent journal would've been most helpful |
| 06:47.45 | RoyK | ratrace: /var/log/boot.log is there on my buster box |
| 06:49.24 | *** join/#debian FennecCode (~user@cpe-172-250-82-66.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 06:50.00 | RoyK | ratrace: anywy - I doubt many will rotate logs daily |
| 06:50.10 | ratrace | RoyK: oh... right. but that's not rsyslog doing, is it? |
| 06:50.11 | *** join/#debian NetTerminalGene (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/dontknow) |
| 06:51.22 | RoyK | ratrace: hm⦠I have no idea wht makes that file :) |
| 06:52.40 | ratrace | indeed me neither, trying to google for it, but nothing's coming up really |
| 06:52.40 | *** join/#debian M4n4tWork (~M4n4tWork@82.84.74.109) |
| 06:53.41 | RoyK | weird |
| 06:54.37 | *** join/#debian mibo (~mibo@194.213.207.197) |
| 06:55.14 | ratrace | I know openrc had that ability and config option, to store its early messages into a boot.log, but this is systemd... |
| 06:56.23 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@188.25.162.103) |
| 06:56.43 | ratrace | RoyK: plymouth does it |
| 06:57.14 | RoyK | h |
| 06:57.23 | ratrace | plymouth-log.service, apparently |
| 06:57.30 | *** join/#debian nebunez (~user@c-73-35-73-198.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 06:58.37 | *** join/#debian Haudegen (~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at) |
| 06:59.20 | *** join/#debian __marco (~marco@195.218.6.205) |
| 07:00.31 | RoyK | I see - thanks |
| 07:01.14 | ratrace | I hate these unintuitive, hard to figure out black boxes on linux. HATE them. utterly. |
| 07:01.46 | ratrace | undocumented even |
| 07:04.44 | RoyK | agreed |
| 07:05.17 | *** join/#debian mezzo (~mezzo@176-141-171-88.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 07:06.06 | *** join/#debian Funkin-Stoopid (~xavier@149.91.87.251) |
| 07:07.17 | *** join/#debian gryffus (~gryffus@unaffiliated/gryffus) |
| 07:08.32 | *** join/#debian sphenxes (~sphenxes@80.123.111.76) |
| 07:10.55 | *** join/#debian well_laid_lawn (~Jean-luc@115.64.118.230) |
| 07:11.50 | *** join/#debian AJ_Z0 (~AJ_Z0@pdpc/supporter/professional/ajz0) |
| 07:21.33 | *** join/#debian openface (~sunzero@78.83.169.22) |
| 07:23.41 | *** join/#debian strive (~sedlav@unaffiliated/strive/x-8457361) |
| 07:25.52 | *** join/#debian Gamuuth (~Gamuuth@stespq3502w-lp130-02-70-29-206-122.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 07:32.52 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 07:33.11 | *** join/#debian nicolaf (~nicolaf@2a01:cb14:2d7:e000:dcbe:c1d5:a97f:c050) |
| 07:35.24 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 07:36.53 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p548b7f0a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 07:39.06 | *** join/#debian luuuciano_ (~luuuciano@unaffiliated/luuuciano) |
| 07:39.15 | *** join/#debian mbrad (~mbrad@94.3.236.23) |
| 07:41.22 | *** join/#debian winy (~vince@82-64-134-124.subs.proxad.net) |
| 07:42.20 | *** join/#debian nicolaf_ (~nicolaf@lfbn-lyo-1-943-183.w86-194.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 07:44.41 | *** join/#debian Funkin-Stoopid (~xavier@149.91.87.251) |
| 07:45.02 | *** join/#debian ropeiX0e (~ropeiX0e@85-76-5-161-nat.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 07:45.52 | *** join/#debian Ycarus (~Ycarus@2001:bc8:47b0:1b0b::1) |
| 07:47.08 | *** join/#debian Slashman (~Slash@cosium-fo-152-18.fib.nerim.net) |
| 07:47.24 | *** join/#debian hqdruxn08 (hqdruxn08@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/hqdruxn08) |
| 07:51.06 | *** join/#debian leorat (~leorat@unaffiliated/leorat) |
| 07:53.11 | *** part/#debian Gamuuth (~Gamuuth@stespq3502w-lp130-02-70-29-206-122.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 07:54.13 | *** join/#debian shtouff (~shtouff@lfbn-poi-1-760-211.w82-125.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 07:54.21 | *** join/#debian oahong_ (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 07:56.48 | *** join/#debian HerbY_NL2 (~HerbY_NL2@2001:67c:2564:518:f174:140b:a61a:4710) |
| 07:57.13 | *** join/#debian Vizva (~Vizva@gateway/tor-sasl/vizva) |
| 07:59.02 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1141] by debhelper |
| 08:00.44 | *** join/#debian doubletwist (~doubletwi@cpe-70-113-215-60.stx.res.rr.com) |
| 08:08.30 | *** join/#debian StathisA (~StathisA@unaffiliated/stathisa) |
| 08:09.15 | *** join/#debian sphenxes (~sphenxes@80.123.111.76) |
| 08:12.50 | *** join/#debian Kevlar_Noir (~manjaro-u@2a01:e0a:5d7:e1e0:1119:628c:e282:2954) |
| 08:16.27 | *** join/#debian chele (~chele@ip5b416ea2.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 08:18.39 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p548b7f0a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:18.46 | *** join/#debian CxP (~CxP@mail.paulcosma.com) |
| 08:25.33 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.121.138) |
| 08:30.40 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab001526f942ab3a6e94.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:32.20 | *** join/#debian Highlander (~alain@2a01:e35:2ec2:dcd0:c7d8:415:204e:8d7f) |
| 08:33.40 | JobMuffin | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:33.56 | *** join/#debian dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) |
| 08:36.05 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 08:41.16 | *** join/#debian AimHere (~David@92.237.236.151) |
| 08:41.34 | *** join/#debian SirLagzz (~SirLagz@59-102-117-8.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 08:45.26 | *** join/#debian asymptotically (~asymptoti@gateway/tor-sasl/asymptotically) |
| 08:48.08 | *** join/#debian winy (~vince@82-64-134-124.subs.proxad.net) |
| 08:49.05 | *** join/#debian black_ant (~antilope@unaffiliated/black-ant/x-1505394) |
| 08:49.12 | *** join/#debian xcm (~xcm@static.90.45.69.159.clients.your-server.de) |
| 08:53.49 | *** join/#debian nifker (~Thunderbi@200116b80aaf230067426e1c4f414678.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 08:54.08 | *** join/#debian _aeris_ (~aeris@april/board/aeris) |
| 08:54.42 | *** join/#debian morph000 (~m1sosoup@port-92-194-104-198.dynamic.as20676.net) |
| 08:56.06 | *** join/#debian ruffni (~user@194.230.155.218) |
| 08:56.57 | ruffni | sooo, during a dist-upgrade my tiny root partition was filled to 100% (which of course led to the upgrade being halted). is it possible to solve the issue without re-setting-up the whole system? |
| 08:57.55 | ruffni | there aren't any directories with unnecessary data which i could just delete |
| 09:02.08 | ruffni | nvm; was able to resize the partition :) |
| 09:06.43 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:07.22 | *** join/#debian Gazooo (~Gazooo@097-101-147-050.res.spectrum.com) |
| 09:08.33 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:12.37 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:12.42 | *** join/#debian lucad111 (~lucad111@linaro/lucad111) |
| 09:13.18 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 09:13.57 | *** join/#debian fred1m (~quassel@2a01:e0a:8e:8b20:7f27:bb0d:81b2:ecb9) |
| 09:18.44 | *** join/#debian fred1m (~quassel@2a01:e0a:8e:8b20:7f27:bb0d:81b2:ecb9) |
| 09:19.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1147] by debhelper |
| 09:19.05 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:19.07 | *** join/#debian Night-Shade (~TimF@2001:8b0:1650:4d40:943e:4da0:df5e:dc14) |
| 09:20.21 | *** part/#debian ruffni (~user@194.230.155.218) |
| 09:22.05 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:24.03 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:26.04 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:27.10 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 09:27.45 | *** join/#debian seaef (~seaef@unaffiliated/minimal-life/x-7984400) |
| 09:27.51 | *** join/#debian p0bailey (~p0bailey@unaffiliated/p0bailey) |
| 09:33.41 | *** join/#debian unluckyshrubbery (~unluckysh@unaffiliated/unluckyshrubbery) |
| 09:34.17 | *** join/#debian frostschutz (~frostschu@55d47f84.access.ecotel.net) |
| 09:36.07 | *** join/#debian dionysus69 (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/dionysus69) |
| 09:37.12 | *** join/#debian dusmourn__ (~duskmourn@2600:1700:e7d1:5000::45) |
| 09:39.08 | *** join/#debian Zblakany (~Zblakany@host-188-122-1-230.finemedia.pl) |
| 09:49.49 | *** join/#debian rockethead (~rockethea@2001:41d0:302:2100::6dae) |
| 09:55.21 | *** join/#debian troulouliou_div2 (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-div2/x-0271439) |
| 09:56.51 | *** join/#debian Admiral_Purr (~Admiral_P@175.157.52.186) |
| 10:01.03 | *** join/#debian lovemytux (~lovemytux@2a03:e40:2a:200:a5e1:3b50:446f:ee2b) |
| 10:07.48 | *** join/#debian fred1m (~quassel@2a01:e0a:8e:8b20:7f27:bb0d:81b2:ecb9) |
| 10:09.07 | *** join/#debian xcm (~xcm@static.90.45.69.159.clients.your-server.de) |
| 10:10.06 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 10:11.10 | *** join/#debian dselect (~dselect@unaffiliated/themill/bot/dselect) |
| 10:11.30 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab004c8f058a46d3a463.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:13.35 | *** join/#debian fred1m (~quassel@2a01:e0a:8e:8b20:7f27:bb0d:81b2:ecb9) |
| 10:15.58 | *** join/#debian Lupricon (~Lupricon@89.249.73.34) |
| 10:16.03 | *** join/#debian TomyLobo2 (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab004c8f058a46d3a463.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:17.17 | *** join/#debian TomyLobo2 (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab004c8f058a46d3a463.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:19.15 | *** join/#debian yokel (~yokel@unaffiliated/contempt) |
| 10:25.25 | *** join/#debian Night-Shade (~TimF@2001:8b0:1650:4d40:d18:21c2:5369:a36f) |
| 10:26.05 | *** join/#debian tomg_ (~tomg@64-7-151-59.border7-dynamic.dsl.sentex.ca) |
| 10:27.31 | *** join/#debian fstd_ (~fstd@unaffiliated/fisted) |
| 10:30.50 | *** join/#debian hqdruxn08 (hqdruxn08@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/hqdruxn08) |
| 10:33.01 | JPT | I upgraded a machine from 9.0.31-1~deb10u1 to 9.0.31-1~deb10u2 and funnily enough, that broke a tomcat application. Is there a way to take a look at the patches between those two versions so i can explore what's going on? Unfortunately, the application logs don't really make sense. |
| 10:33.24 | JPT | (The application claims the filesystem to be read-only and being unable to read files which clearly exist despite permissions being alright) |
| 10:33.47 | JPT | (sudo-ing into a shell as tomcat also reveals that the permissions are fine, so i'm lost.) |
| 10:34.15 | JPT | I was already betting on AppArmor or SELinux crashing the party, but those didn't log anything that was denied or blocked. |
| 10:35.50 | ratrace | selinux is not default on debian, you'd have to very knowingly install and break 80% of it. apparmor is, so check journalctl _TRANSPORT=audit | grep "DENIED" |
| 10:36.16 | ratrace | next check filesystem mount options (did it remount ro?) and ACLs with getfacl |
| 10:36.54 | JPT | I'll check getfacl for completeness. :) |
| 10:37.42 | *** join/#debian kreyren (~kreyren@fsf/member/kreyren) |
| 10:37.56 | *** join/#debian zalt (~devp@unaffiliated/lambda443) |
| 10:38.00 | JPT | getfacl isn't available. That's odd, i expected it to be a standard tool. |
| 10:38.01 | ratrace | oh wait, that's stretch... even apparmor ain't default |
| 10:38.29 | ratrace | getfacl is in package `acl` |
| 10:39.06 | *** join/#debian format_c (~format_c@unaffiliated/format-c/x-8927423) |
| 10:39.19 | JPT | I guess i'll install that to inspect acls, but given i sudo into a shell as tomcat, shouldn't all those acls apply for an interactive session, too? |
| 10:39.30 | JPT | I could read, write and create files just fine in that shell |
| 10:39.45 | JPT | Even those that the application complained about that it couldn't in the logs. |
| 10:41.11 | ratrace | ACLs have nothing to do with shell sessions, they're extension to regular DAC permissions |
| 10:42.17 | *** join/#debian kriger (~norge@unaffiliated/kriger) |
| 10:42.40 | JPT | Okay, but ACLs should apply regardless of context. So if tomcat was forbidden to read or write a file, i could verify that by spawning a shell process as tomcat and try it out, right? |
| 10:43.26 | ratrace | assuming that shell also has all the GIDs as the tomcat process |
| 10:43.51 | ratrace | so, you DO have fACLs on those files? |
| 10:44.15 | JPT | I didn't set any, so all that should be there would be setup by debian packages |
| 10:45.25 | JPT | No ACLs present, just the regular permissions |
| 10:45.40 | ratrace | afaik no debian package installs any fACLs, except systemd/logind that uses them to manage seats and device access |
| 10:45.48 | *** join/#debian AquaL1te (~AquaL1te@unaffiliated/aqual1te) |
| 10:46.26 | JPT | Apart from tomcat9, tomcat9-common and libtomcat9-java only libnss3 was upgraded before the whole thing stopped working. |
| 10:47.06 | ratrace | so, the filesystem didn't remount RO, ther are no fACLs involved, no AppArmor, no SELinux or any other MAC in effect, and you can access files if you run a shell as the same user the tomcat process runs as? |
| 10:47.40 | JPT | That's correct. |
| 10:47.42 | ratrace | did you try with `su -l` just to exclude differences in ENV? |
| 10:48.06 | ratrace | or sudo -i I think they're equivalent |
| 10:48.16 | JPT | I tried with sudo -u tomcat bash |
| 10:48.37 | JPT | tomcat has nologin as a shell, so -i and su wouldn't work afaik |
| 10:48.38 | ratrace | right, add -i to that for full login as tomcat |
| 10:48.48 | ratrace | give it a temporary shel |
| 10:49.40 | JPT | That also work's as expected. |
| 10:49.43 | ratrace | which filesystem is that, btw? |
| 10:49.57 | JPT | Mostly xfs, there's some ext4 in / |
| 10:50.07 | JPT | Pretty sane stuff i think |
| 10:50.08 | *** join/#debian thoros (~thoros@194-166-46-9.hdsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 10:50.25 | ratrace | well I'm out of ideas then. |
| 10:50.49 | *** join/#debian hqdruxn08 (hqdruxn08@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/hqdruxn08) |
| 10:50.56 | JPT | That's why i'm curious about the patches for that step from 9.0.31-1~deb10u1 -> 9.0.31-1~deb10u2 for tomcat9 |
| 10:50.59 | ratrace | apt get changelog <tomcat or whatever the actual package name is> to see the changelog, if thrre are relevant changes |
| 10:50.59 | apt | ACTION fetches changelog <tomcat or whatever the actual package name is> to see the changelog, if thrre are relevant changes |
| 10:51.05 | ratrace | apt-get changelog .... |
| 10:51.53 | JPT | Those look good. I like fixing security issues. :) |
| 10:53.02 | JPT | But there's nothing mentioned that is related to whatever happened on my machine |
| 10:53.26 | ratrace | oh also... any chroots involved? systemd service unit doing any hardening? |
| 10:54.11 | n1ce | hi, hola |
| 10:54.24 | ratrace | like, ProtectSystem=strict and rw paths NOT marked as such via ReadWritePaths ? PrivateTMP involved somewhere and some process trying /tmp/foo directly? |
| 10:54.50 | JPT | The systemd-unit is unmodified, so it does the usual thing. The ReadWritePaths look fine, they include the paths that the app is complaining about. |
| 10:55.06 | ratrace | JPT: and ProtectSystem=strict? |
| 10:55.15 | JPT | Yup, that's on strict. |
| 10:55.31 | ratrace | try commenting that out, run systemctl daemon-reload and restart your tomcat service. does it still complain? |
| 10:56.48 | *** join/#debian fred1m (~quassel@2a01:e0a:8e:8b20:7f27:bb0d:81b2:ecb9) |
| 10:56.51 | *** join/#debian Lord_of_Life_ (~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362) |
| 10:58.17 | JPT | ... that seemed to have fixed something. I'll track that unit file now, i guess. |
| 10:58.48 | *** join/#debian cdown (~cdown@89.32.122.5) |
| 10:58.52 | JPT | Thanks a lot for walking me through this! Now i have to figure out what is going on regarding that. :| |
| 10:59.30 | ratrace | JPT: are CATALINA_* directories mountpoints? |
| 10:59.58 | ratrace | ie. the ones in ReadWritePaths? I'm assuming, as you said the unit file is unmodified, it's identical to this? https://sources.debian.org/src/tomcat9/9.0.37-1/debian/tomcat9.service/ |
| 11:00.04 | JPT | Not directly, but /var is its own partiton, so maybe yes. |
| 11:00.18 | ratrace | JPT: and this complain is on boot or every time you try to start the service? |
| 11:01.11 | *** join/#debian xcm (~xcm@static.90.45.69.159.clients.your-server.de) |
| 11:01.11 | ratrace | if it's only on boot, there could be a race condition between fs mount and the service starting. which is a bit weird as the unit has RequiresMountsFor |
| 11:01.17 | JPT | The file you linked is 100% the one i'm using (apart from commenting out the ProtectSystem line) |
| 11:01.26 | JPT | The issue comes up everytime tomcat is started |
| 11:01.53 | JPT | So, no race condition with mounts not being ready |
| 11:02.21 | ratrace | JPT: well I'd recommend you toy with strace to see what _exactly_ it's trying to access on the filesystem |
| 11:02.41 | *** join/#debian xcm (~xcm@static.90.45.69.159.clients.your-server.de) |
| 11:03.04 | JPT | Good idea |
| 11:04.04 | ratrace | you can add strace to the ExecStart of the unit, use -o to strace into a file, and -f to include children processes, and dont' forget to re-enable ProtectSystem=strict, and systemctl daemon-reload to notice changes |
| 11:04.04 | *** join/#debian rgr (~rgr@ip-109-40-242-181.web.vodafone.de) |
| 11:04.09 | *** join/#debian teknokadim (~teknokadi@178.246.21.49) |
| 11:05.28 | *** join/#debian dpkg (~dpkg@unaffiliated/dpkg) |
| 11:05.57 | ratrace | JPT: alternatively, strace -f -p 1 in one terminal and run systemctl start in the other but that'll have a tiny megaton of extra output from preparing and starting the service itself, which is not what you really need, you need traces AFTER the execve of the ExecStart |
| 11:06.04 | *** join/#debian sphenxes (~sphenxes@80.123.111.76) |
| 11:06.26 | *** join/#debian captSamIngram (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/captsamingram) |
| 11:06.36 | JPT | strace -o didn't output into /tmp/foo.txt so ... hm. |
| 11:06.45 | JPT | I'll try a readwritepath |
| 11:07.01 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@93.116.130.26) |
| 11:07.51 | JPT | Logging that into a file was a wise choice. I already got about 24M worth of strace |
| 11:07.53 | ratrace | oh one more thing.... I don't know if CacheDirectory would implicitly add /var/cache/tomcat9 to the internal list of ReadWritePaths, so perhaps add THAT one as well to ReadWritePaths explicitly, see if it fixes it |
| 11:08.53 | JPT | I'll try that once i get my exception logged, so i can stop strace :) |
| 11:08.53 | *** join/#debian doubletwist (~doubletwi@cpe-70-113-215-60.stx.res.rr.com) |
| 11:09.39 | JPT | 113M of strace. Nice. Now for the next experiment |
| 11:10.45 | ratrace | you can grep for the paths it's complainig about, see just the syscalls related to them |
| 11:11.53 | ratrace | brb food |
| 11:12.07 | JPT | :) |
| 11:12.27 | JPT | openat() returns with EROFS. What the hell... |
| 11:13.12 | JPT | That file is perfectly writable |
| 11:13.36 | *** join/#debian dvs (~hibbard@cwv.teksavvy.com) |
| 11:16.11 | *** join/#debian huwjr (~huwjr@213.205.192.255) |
| 11:16.29 | JPT | Look like adding the cache directory didn't help |
| 11:17.04 | JPT | So to sum it up: ProtectSystem=strict somehow results in syscalls for opening files to come back with EROFS, which is misleading |
| 11:17.24 | JPT | I just realized something. |
| 11:19.19 | JPT | Let's add the webapp directory to that list which we - for SOME reason - did place in a completely different location. |
| 11:19.36 | JPT | This is pure evil |
| 11:20.16 | JPT | How did this ever work before? |
| 11:21.19 | *** join/#debian donofrio (~donofrio@host-252.subnet-17.med.umich.edu) |
| 11:21.47 | JPT | Yep, that helps. Alright, i call my issue solved. ratrace, thank you so much for holding my hand and giving ideas! |
| 11:25.13 | *** join/#debian palimaar (~oasd@KD113148020047.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp) |
| 11:28.26 | ratrace | JPT: yw |
| 11:29.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1153] by debhelper |
| 11:30.48 | JPT | :) |
| 11:31.26 | *** join/#debian luckman212 (luckman212@unaffiliated/luckman212) |
| 11:34.25 | *** join/#debian _Matth_ (~Matth@ccnetptb.64.63.78.64.nns.ne.jp) |
| 11:37.26 | *** join/#debian CxP (~CxP@mail.paulcosma.com) |
| 11:40.42 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 11:40.59 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@93.116.130.26) |
| 11:42.45 | *** join/#debian ddsys (~ddsys@unaffiliated/ddsys) |
| 11:46.46 | *** join/#debian Kiwis (5a3586d3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.90.53.134.211) |
| 11:56.57 | *** join/#debian brabao (~danilo@201.159.183.227) |
| 11:58.17 | *** join/#debian CxP (~CxP@mail.paulcosma.com) |
| 12:06.37 | *** join/#debian gigetoo (~gigetoo@c83-251-253-157.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 12:15.29 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 12:19.04 | *** join/#debian Kevlar_Noir (~manjaro-u@2a01:e0a:5d7:e1e0:1119:628c:e282:2954) |
| 12:21.08 | *** join/#debian martian67 (~martian67@about/linux/regular/martian67) |
| 12:21.49 | *** join/#debian palimaar (~oasd@KD113148020047.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp) |
| 12:26.15 | *** join/#debian cdown_ (~cdown@163.114.131.1) |
| 12:30.43 | *** join/#debian ConnectingMedia (~Connectin@b2b-130-180-64-186.unitymedia.biz) |
| 12:33.23 | *** join/#debian martian67 (~martian67@about/linux/regular/martian67) |
| 12:35.16 | *** join/#debian nevivurn (~nevivurn@unaffiliated/nevivurn) |
| 12:40.28 | *** join/#debian fnaticrisk (~fnaticris@177-202-32-39.user3p.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 12:49.20 | *** join/#debian semeion (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 12:52.45 | *** join/#debian cdown_ (~cdown@89.32.122.5) |
| 12:54.49 | *** join/#debian cdown (~cdown@199.201.66.0) |
| 12:55.08 | *** join/#debian thiras (~thiras@unaffiliated/thiras) |
| 12:55.16 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 12:55.24 | *** join/#debian blurkis (~blurkis@213-67-53-121-no157.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 13:02.47 | *** join/#debian steven_saus (~steven_sa@cpe-74-131-36-220.kya.res.rr.com) |
| 13:05.48 | radkos | Hello I'm having trouble with nvme performance under Debian 10 |
| 13:06.46 | *** join/#debian debsan (~debsan@unaffiliated/debsan) |
| 13:06.50 | radkos | Under ubuntu 20.04 it's better. I'm trying to find the reason in some kind of module - but no luck so far. |
| 13:07.18 | radkos | The NVME model is SAMSUNG MZ1LW1T9HMLS-00003 |
| 13:07.19 | *** join/#debian jeddi (~jedd@203-129-25-127.cb8119.syd.static.aussiebb.net) |
| 13:08.24 | *** join/#debian tieinv (~username@unaffiliated/tieinv) |
| 13:11.05 | *** join/#debian bliv (~bliv@unaffiliated/blivande) |
| 13:12.00 | diogenes_ | radkos, cat /sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler |
| 13:12.04 | diogenes_ | what does it say? |
| 13:12.26 | ratrace | radkos: define "better" |
| 13:17.50 | *** join/#debian sveva65 (~sverre@unaffiliated/sveva65) |
| 13:19.36 | *** join/#debian nsrafk (nsrafk@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-akyxerfsuqjbxwox) |
| 13:20.31 | *** join/#debian Brainium (~brainium@unaffiliated/brainium) |
| 13:25.31 | *** join/#debian foul_owl_ (~foul_owl@108.62.57.54) |
| 13:27.36 | radkos | well I'm having 8,94 Load avg /1 min on Debian 10 comparing to 1,24 Lavg/1 min under Ubuntu 20.04 |
| 13:28.29 | ratrace | radkos: that's a very vague measure that doesn't say anything at all |
| 13:29.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1159] by debhelper |
| 13:29.15 | ratrace | if you have 1m load avg of nearly 9, it'd be easy to look up the process tree or top and see which processes are causing it, compared to same on ubuntu, for the same workload you're comparing |
| 13:30.04 | radkos | It's while doing FIO test |
| 13:30.16 | radkos | same command on both OSes |
| 13:30.29 | radkos | date; echo; fio --filename=/dev/nvme0n1 --direct=1 --rw=randread --bs=4k --ioengine=libaio --iodepth=256 --runtime=600 --numjobs=10 --time_based --group_reporting --name=iops-test-job --readonly --output=fio_log.randread4k.log; date |
| 13:31.16 | ratrace | radkos: and aside from load avg that doesn't really saay anything, what are the final numbers in terms of IOPS and bandwidth? same? similar? very different? |
| 13:31.51 | radkos | and ksoftirqd is eating like 70% CPU which is signal for a trouble |
| 13:32.25 | radkos | IOPS are the same just seems that CPU irq can't handle it |
| 13:32.34 | ratrace | don't forget you're running two different kernel versions with a number of releases between them |
| 13:33.02 | radkos | I did install 5.4 from backports |
| 13:33.11 | radkos | the result is still the same |
| 13:33.52 | ratrace | so same IOPS and bandwidth on fio? |
| 13:34.05 | radkos | yes |
| 13:34.58 | radkos | forgot to mention it's happening with XEN hypervisor - the package versions are the same just builder is different |
| 13:36.39 | ratrace | what ELSE do you have there's that WAY different from your original question :))) |
| 13:37.07 | ratrace | It's debian. Okay, not really it's a dom0 Debian. Okay not really, it's dom0 Debian with backported kernel. Okay not really it's Ubuntu. |
| 13:37.18 | ratrace | sorry, domU. stop confuzing me :) |
| 13:38.07 | ratrace | so, like, is the Ubuntu thing you compared to ALSO a domU? |
| 13:42.54 | *** join/#debian captSamIngram (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/captsamingram) |
| 13:42.56 | radkos | yes I've compared it with Ubuntu with domU |
| 13:43.09 | *** join/#debian zeden (~user@unaffiliated/zeden) |
| 13:43.30 | ratrace | radkos: all the relevant firmware loaded in both? |
| 13:45.08 | *** join/#debian captSamIngram (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/captsamingram) |
| 13:48.00 | *** join/#debian cliluw (~cliluw@unaffiliated/cliluw) |
| 13:48.36 | *** join/#debian cheet (~cheet@modemcable246.155-226-192.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 13:48.48 | radkos | that's the thing I'm trying to find if the firmware regarding this NVMe device is different |
| 13:49.11 | radkos | all I have is installed nonfree firmware on debian and linux-firmware installed by default in ubuntu |
| 13:49.59 | radkos | on third run of FIO I've found calltrace |
| 13:50.00 | radkos | [ 1015.472572] igb 0000:0d:00.0 eno1: Reset adapter |
| 13:50.00 | radkos | [ 1050.769229] rcu: INFO: rcu_sched self-detected stall on CPU |
| 13:50.00 | radkos | [ 1050.769278] rcu: 0-....: (1 GPs behind) idle=3ae/1/0x4000000000000004 softirq=4458/4459 fqs=2187 |
| 13:53.18 | radkos | another possible reason might be availability of linux-modules under Ubuntu - which I thing is an extra package of modules for some devices |
| 13:53.24 | radkos | *think |
| 13:54.58 | *** part/#debian tieinv (~username@unaffiliated/tieinv) |
| 13:57.03 | *** join/#debian ChmEarl (~chmearl@unaffiliated/prymar56) |
| 13:57.56 | *** join/#debian coruja (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 13:58.10 | ratrace | radkos: there are three places where the differences could mean something: kernel version, kernel patches (SAUCE patches on Ubuntu that aren't upstreamed), firmware package version |
| 13:59.33 | *** join/#debian greycat (~greg@209.142.155.49) |
| 14:00.14 | *** join/#debian bashcu (~Thunderbi@190.113.110.122) |
| 14:01.17 | *** join/#debian RoyK^ (~roy@unaffiliated/royk) |
| 14:08.43 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab00e4f610bc568ba8ca.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:09.24 | *** join/#debian realtime-neil (~realtime-@76.24.118.23) |
| 14:10.30 | *** join/#debian endstille (~endstille@mail02.grolman-group.com) |
| 14:11.56 | *** join/#debian Antioch (~Antioch@h175-177-044-119.catv02.itscom.jp) |
| 14:12.18 | *** join/#debian electro33 (uid613@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rgympzffqhlvedas) |
| 14:12.41 | *** join/#debian dvs (~gilford@cwv.teksavvy.com) |
| 14:14.34 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 14:20.16 | *** join/#debian CrystalMath (~coderain@reactos/developer/theflash) |
| 14:21.00 | *** join/#debian Marbug (~Marbug@94-226-224-14.access.telenet.be) |
| 14:21.52 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 14:21.53 | *** join/#debian mfranzwa (~mfranzwa@c-98-244-50-121.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 14:22.39 | *** join/#debian \\Mr_C\\ (~mrc@cpe-75-187-191-230.neo.res.rr.com) |
| 14:28.34 | *** join/#debian StathisA (~StathisA@unaffiliated/stathisa) |
| 14:29.15 | *** join/#debian thiras_ (~thiras@unaffiliated/thiras) |
| 14:31.20 | *** join/#debian dominic34 (Thunderbir@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dominic34) |
| 14:31.33 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.121.235) |
| 14:34.31 | *** join/#debian martian67 (~martian67@about/linux/regular/martian67) |
| 14:35.20 | *** join/#debian m0rph (~m1sosoup@62.23.209.50) |
| 14:38.03 | *** join/#debian Tom01 (~tom@a89-183-26-150.net-htp.de) |
| 14:38.10 | *** join/#debian morph000 (~m1sosoup@port-92-194-104-198.dynamic.as20676.net) |
| 14:40.04 | *** join/#debian comradegarry (~comradega@cpe-173-174-238-78.satx.res.rr.com) |
| 14:40.10 | *** join/#debian cybercrypto (~morpheus@gateway/tor-sasl/cybercrypto) |
| 14:40.17 | *** join/#debian andypoenas (~andy@92.223.85.92) |
| 14:46.08 | *** join/#debian njka (~njka@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 14:47.34 | *** join/#debian dijong_ (~dijong@gateway/tor-sasl/dijong) |
| 14:47.39 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 14:49.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1165] by debhelper |
| 14:50.03 | *** join/#debian tristero (~nobody@unaffiliated/transfinite) |
| 14:50.39 | genr8_ | actually Im having the same issue with NVME performance |
| 14:50.56 | *** join/#debian dvs (~gilford@cwv.teksavvy.com) |
| 14:51.53 | genr8_ | sounds very similar to his |
| 14:53.08 | *** join/#debian openface (~sunzero@78.83.169.22) |
| 14:56.36 | *** join/#debian EagleTG (~eagletg@c-68-80-69-121.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 15:00.36 | *** join/#debian rgwu (~rgwu@2605:6000:1a12:c57c:f135:eb33:9ed9:760a) |
| 15:01.20 | *** part/#debian cybercrypto (~morpheus@gateway/tor-sasl/cybercrypto) |
| 15:06.25 | *** join/#debian LtL (~ltl@unaffiliated/ltl) |
| 15:06.59 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 15:11.40 | genr8_ | i see a vastly different result between 2 drives. 140MB/s vs 1200MB/s reads. writes are around 70 at the start but drops down to 15, vs 277 sustained on the other one. gonna change slots on my motherboard. |
| 15:12.21 | *** join/#debian AquaL1te (~AquaL1te@unaffiliated/aqual1te) |
| 15:13.43 | NetTerminalGene | i get 30 MB/s write performance with my ssd |
| 15:14.08 | *** join/#debian johnnyfive (~johnnyfiv@unaffiliated/isalive) |
| 15:14.14 | *** part/#debian verm1n (~verm1n@pool-72-93-72-163.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 15:16.15 | ratrace | y'all also check if you've got TRIM enabled, perhaps switch to fstrim daily or weekly runs |
| 15:19.24 | genr8_ | thats not auto enabled? |
| 15:19.58 | NetTerminalGene | ,v thunderbird |
| 15:19.59 | judd | Package: thunderbird on amd64 -- jessie: 1:52.8.0-1~deb8u1; buster: 1:68.7.0-1~deb10u1; jessie-security: 1:68.9.0-1~deb8u2; stretch-proposed-updates: 1:68.9.0-1~deb9u1; stretch: 1:68.10.0-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 1:68.10.0-1~deb9u1; buster-proposed-updates: 1:68.10.0-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 1:68.10.0-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 1:68.10.0-1; sid: 1:68.10.0-1; |
| 15:20.00 | judd | experimental: 1:78.0-1 |
| 15:20.47 | genr8_ | whats the deal if i have LVM. where do i set the discard mount ? |
| 15:21.44 | *** join/#debian dfcnvt (tagraf@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dfcnvt) |
| 15:22.44 | *** join/#debian cryptic (~cryptic@142.196.139.17) |
| 15:25.11 | genr8_ | my LVM seems to have discard on it, but it doesnt show that it does... |
| 15:27.44 | *** join/#debian oahong_ (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 15:28.27 | frostschutz | genr8_, lvm has a issue_discards option, but that just means it removes your data when you lvremove. discard for filesystems always works normally, lvm does not change anything there |
| 15:28.50 | genr8_ | fstrim[21468]: /home: 336.8 GiB (361649537024 bytes) trimmed on /dev/mapper/HELLOGOODBYE--vg-home |
| 15:28.52 | n_1-c_k | I'm looking for a contacts editor that can import and export .vcf files, any recommendations? |
| 15:28.56 | genr8_ | omfg |
| 15:29.11 | *** join/#debian Nefertari (~Nefertiti@unaffiliated/nefertiti) |
| 15:30.21 | frostschutz | genr8_, that's just how much free space you have, it doesn't mean it wasn't trimmed before, that only the ssd itself knows |
| 15:30.28 | genr8_ | oh |
| 15:31.44 | genr8_ | actually im not sure about that. I just ran it again, and it came back with 0 |
| 15:32.02 | frostschutz | genr8_, reboot and it'll do all free space again |
| 15:32.14 | genr8_ | ok |
| 15:33.02 | frostschutz | that's unless you have a filesystem that remembers these across reboots... ext4 doesn't... xfs always trims everything even if you don't reboot between. you're not supposed to run fstrim that often anyway |
| 15:33.43 | genr8_ | I think that fixed it... |
| 15:34.58 | *** join/#debian zeden (~user@unaffiliated/zeden) |
| 15:35.27 | frostschutz | make sure to have good backups... there is no data recovery after trim |
| 15:35.48 | *** join/#debian lambda-smith (~user@180.183.132.84) |
| 15:36.27 | *** join/#debian nickodd (~nickodd@unaffiliated/nickodd) |
| 15:36.31 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@188.26.248.165) |
| 15:36.45 | *** join/#debian user217_ (~user217_@195.138.71.41) |
| 15:39.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1158] by debhelper |
| 15:39.24 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.121.235) |
| 15:39.31 | *** join/#debian czesmir (~stefan@eke144.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 15:42.09 | *** join/#debian rpthms (~rpthms@unaffiliated/rpthms) |
| 15:43.12 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 15:45.55 | *** join/#debian palimaar (~oasd@KD113148020047.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp) |
| 15:49.34 | ratrace | genr8_: that output means that 336 GB was actually trimmed. I also set fstrim to run daily instead of weekly for more frequent and smaller trims |
| 15:50.38 | ratrace | anyway, problem with online trim is that some/many SSD firmwares are buggy. linux kernel contains a blacklist^W denylist of devices with buggy TRIM and will block them, but that list isn't complete |
| 15:51.48 | *** join/#debian m0rph (~m1sosoup@62.23.209.50) |
| 15:52.22 | *** join/#debian b1ack0p (~m@unaffiliated/blackop) |
| 15:55.14 | *** join/#debian gnufr33dom (~gnufr33do@ip24-253-15-85.lv.lv.cox.net) |
| 15:58.37 | *** part/#debian Acheron (~Acheron@unaffiliated/acheron) |
| 15:59.02 | *** join/#debian FreEm1nD (~freemindm@189.114.92.75) |
| 16:00.46 | dadinn | hi all |
| 16:00.49 | *** join/#debian Acheron (~Acheron@unaffiliated/acheron) |
| 16:01.40 | dadinn | Is there a way to test for crypsetup LUKSv2 format support in scripts? |
| 16:04.05 | *** join/#debian aaro (aaro@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-lrrpcbunoxsjpzty) |
| 16:04.42 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 16:05.18 | *** join/#debian user217217 (~user21721@178-133-237-135.mobile.vf-ua.net) |
| 16:06.03 | *** join/#debian towo` (~towo@unaffiliated/towo/x-4064351) |
| 16:06.30 | epictetus2 | dadinn: cryptsetup --version |
| 16:06.30 | epictetus2 | cryptsetup 2.1.0 |
| 16:07.24 | *** join/#debian lambda-smith (~user@180.183.132.84) |
| 16:07.26 | dadinn | epictetus2: thanks a lot! exactly what I was hoping! ;) |
| 16:07.34 | *** join/#debian Night-Shade (~TimF@2001:8b0:1650:4d40:d18:21c2:5369:a36f) |
| 16:07.49 | *** join/#debian spigot (michael@unaffiliated/spigot) |
| 16:10.37 | *** join/#debian Spr1ng (~Spr1ng@unaffiliated/spr1ng) |
| 16:14.21 | annadane | a version number can tell you if it has support in scripts? what/ |
| 16:14.23 | annadane | ? |
| 16:14.32 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 16:15.59 | *** join/#debian adapter (~adapter@2601:600:c500:2d0:f0:1b0e:a761:1256) |
| 16:16.00 | ratrace | cryptsetup support luks2 as of 2.0.0 |
| 16:16.32 | *** join/#debian yanmaani (~yanmaani@gateway/tor-sasl/yanmaani) |
| 16:17.02 | yanmaani | I ran apt-get dist-upgrade, and I got a few 'no space left on device messages', but the exit code was zero. Is tehre anything I can do to fix it? |
| 16:17.19 | *** join/#debian aaro (aaro@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-eukxqqvwqdjuinet) |
| 16:17.48 | *** join/#debian wyre (wyre@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-xqhznyjriqwrgnhn) |
| 16:18.10 | ratrace | aside from freeing up space? |
| 16:18.30 | yanmaani | the space is freed up now; I had some applications that were being updated open, so the old files weren't cleaned properly |
| 16:18.44 | yanmaani | but did it break my system? |
| 16:19.18 | yanmaani | It said "dkms: WARNING: Linux headers are missing, which may explain the above failures.", but there weren't any failures above. Should I worry about that? |
| 16:22.04 | annadane | sure, but then you have to know it's supported as of luks2 and if you have to ask the question it takes a mental leap to go from cryptsetup --version to "yes, it's supported" |
| 16:23.03 | yanmaani | huh? Did my install break and is there anything I can do to fix it? |
| 16:24.02 | epictetus2 | yanmaani: no you are fine. run dist-upgrade again and apt upgrade and see what happens |
| 16:25.10 | ratrace | yanmaani: frankly I'm not sure if dpkg does fully transactional installations, something tells me it doesn't. to be safe, I'd look up which packages were upgraded via /var/log/apt/history.log, and I'd run a reinstall for them, after trying just dist-upgrade again |
| 16:26.20 | yanmaani | epictetus2: thanks. nothing happens so it seems fine |
| 16:26.36 | *** join/#debian crushpest (~crushpest@195.181.166.106) |
| 16:27.13 | *** join/#debian mibo (~mibo@ip-89-103-149-132.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 16:28.59 | *** join/#debian XsiSec (~xsisec@h-37-123-162-226.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 16:30.23 | ratrace | yanmaani: I'd still re-run the installations. or you can try debsums and check package integrity. for example, I know for a fact that post-inst scripts may fail and the package would not be marked failed |
| 16:30.30 | ratrace | so it's not fully transactional. |
| 16:31.11 | epictetus2 | restore your system from backups and do it again. BECAUSE YOU DO HAVE BACKUPS RIGHT? |
| 16:31.49 | *** join/#debian XsiSec (~xsisec@h-37-123-162-226.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 16:32.51 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 16:33.06 | yanmaani | epictetus2: I keep backups of my home dir but I've never actually bothered with slash. hm maybe I should do that |
| 16:33.28 | greycat | /home and /etc are the two most critical thinsg to back up |
| 16:33.30 | yanmaani | oooh debsums, that seems promising |
| 16:33.35 | *** join/#debian JerryXiao (~JerryXiao@unaffiliated/jerryxiao) |
| 16:33.58 | *** join/#debian nifker (~Thunderbi@200116b80aaf230067426e1c4f414678.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 16:34.23 | epictetus2 | yanmaani: on personal systems? nah I dont bother either. I only have redundant backups of ~/real_home/ |
| 16:38.08 | *** join/#debian dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) |
| 16:42.23 | jhutchins | I've never had problems with apt* failing to clean up files for open programs. |
| 16:48.16 | ratrace | I'd be more concerned with files not installed or updated due to 'no space left on device' |
| 16:49.20 | *** join/#debian dreamon (~dreamon@unaffiliated/dreamon) |
| 16:53.04 | *** join/#debian dez (uid92154@fedora/deSouza) |
| 16:55.39 | *** join/#debian oahong (~samigarus@unaffiliated/samigarus) |
| 16:56.03 | *** join/#debian erentar (~erentar@ptr-7tzn4e9upmbug4ljgfj.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:56.12 | *** join/#debian diniwed (~gavron@ool-44c21938.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 16:58.23 | *** join/#debian sa-ghosts (~sa-ghosts@unaffiliated/sa-ghosts) |
| 16:58.53 | *** join/#debian r00tobo (~r00tobo@unaffiliated/r00tobo) |
| 17:01.16 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 17:03.41 | *** join/#debian blurkis (~blurkis@213-67-53-121-no157.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 17:04.29 | *** join/#debian dastier_ (~dastier@178.127.112.124) |
| 17:05.51 | *** join/#debian rustbuckett (~downtime@2602:304:b226:5019:ac85:d2f7:c46e:4358) |
| 17:08.10 | *** join/#debian Vizva (~Vizva@gateway/tor-sasl/vizva) |
| 17:09.15 | *** join/#debian Medusa-chan (~Medusa-ch@pool-98-118-47-241.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:09.24 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 17:10.27 | *** join/#debian bobey (~bobey@cpe-70-94-44-250.kc.res.rr.com) |
| 17:12.52 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.121.126) |
| 17:13.43 | *** join/#debian plantroon (~plantroon@91.236.69.232) |
| 17:16.31 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 17:16.47 | *** join/#debian gelignite (~gelignite@55d4d4d6.access.ecotel.net) |
| 17:17.12 | *** join/#debian Kevlar_Noir (~manjaro-u@2a01:e0a:5d7:e1e0:1119:628c:e282:2954) |
| 17:17.24 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 17:19.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1165] by debhelper |
| 17:21.59 | *** join/#debian Lupricon (~Lupricon@89.249.73.34) |
| 17:22.22 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab00b03e5978dc377dca.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:22.35 | *** join/#debian ceska (~Cieska@95.145.197.2) |
| 17:24.00 | *** join/#debian TripleDES (~sjr@213.195.114.153) |
| 17:30.10 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 17:31.42 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 17:31.50 | *** join/#debian winy (~vince@pop.92-184-104-41.mobile.abo.orange.fr) |
| 17:32.04 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 17:34.15 | *** join/#debian zv (~zv@unaffiliated/zv) |
| 17:36.03 | *** join/#debian pingfloyd (~pingfloyd@unaffiliated/pingfloyd) |
| 17:36.03 | *** join/#debian EmleyMoor (42b789682f@firthpark.tinsleyviaduct.com) |
| 17:39.41 | Regor | how to check recently installed applications in a week ? any filter/ grep witin apt ..? |
| 17:40.31 | annadane | well you can check /var/log/apt/history.log and scroll to the bottom |
| 17:42.09 | *** join/#debian cheet (~cheet@modemcable246.155-226-192.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 17:43.51 | *** join/#debian dvs (~hibbard@cwv.teksavvy.com) |
| 17:45.02 | *** join/#debian noosanon (~user@154.127.251.194) |
| 17:45.40 | erentar | how can i manually trigger an offline upgrade |
| 17:45.49 | erentar | gnome-software broke |
| 17:46.47 | Regor | thanks.. |
| 17:49.01 | *** join/#debian a-l-e (~a-l-e@pool1-13.cgn.as8758.net) |
| 17:50.03 | *** join/#debian Newami (~Newami@ip70-179-45-125.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 17:51.09 | *** join/#debian Betal (~Betal@unaffiliated/betal) |
| 17:54.18 | *** join/#debian diogenes_ (~diogenes_@188.208.120.9) |
| 17:57.09 | *** join/#debian huwjr (~huwjr@213.205.192.255) |
| 17:58.23 | *** join/#debian sa-ghosts_BNC (~sa-ghosts@unaffiliated/sa-ghosts) |
| 17:58.51 | *** join/#debian r00tobo (~r00tobo@unaffiliated/r00tobo) |
| 18:01.42 | *** join/#debian Zblakany (~Zblakany@host-188-122-1-230.finemedia.pl) |
| 18:06.36 | *** join/#debian aaro (~aaro@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-pmtxoscxeydpvblr) |
| 18:07.20 | mason | Oh... Does the Buster fdisk support gpt well enough to be safe now? I'm wondering if it's time to discard gdisk. |
| 18:07.24 | *** join/#debian leorat (~leorat@unaffiliated/leorat) |
| 18:07.42 | greycat | fdisk has supported GPT for *several* releases... since jessie, I think |
| 18:07.58 | mason | greycat: Ah, nice nice. One tool to rule them all. \o/ |
| 18:08.25 | greycat | Yeah, just checked the jessie man page and it says it supports GPT. |
| 18:08.54 | greycat | The wheezy man page explicitly says it doesn't support GPT. |
| 18:08.57 | mason | If it's been in that long, that's enough time for the sharp edges to have worn away on the flesh of the neophiles. |
| 18:09.56 | mason | !sns |
| 18:09.57 | dpkg | Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>. |
| 18:10.12 | mason | ^ My favourite thing on IRC. |
| 18:10.33 | *** join/#debian plasticle (~plasticle@cpe-107-15-173-212.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 18:10.35 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 18:11.00 | *** part/#debian nickodd (~nickodd@unaffiliated/nickodd) |
| 18:12.22 | annadane | funnily enough we have two factoids for it |
| 18:12.25 | annadane | !sns syndrome |
| 18:12.25 | dpkg | Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>. |
| 18:12.43 | greycat | dpkg literal sns syndrome |
| 18:12.43 | dpkg | "sns syndrome" is "<reply> see sns" |
| 18:13.10 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@5-12-254-23.residential.rdsnet.ro) |
| 18:14.06 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 18:20.30 | *** join/#debian Medusa-chan (~Medusa-ch@pool-98-118-47-241.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) |
| 18:21.09 | *** join/#debian Nefertiti (~Nefertiti@unaffiliated/nefertiti) |
| 18:26.43 | *** join/#debian nsrafk (nsrafk@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-zyrsduftueomtyju) |
| 18:28.48 | *** join/#debian hyskaru (~hyskaru@unaffiliated/hyskaru) |
| 18:31.20 | *** join/#debian aaro (aaro@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-bxsmxicmcksmzgbz) |
| 18:31.34 | *** join/#debian wyre (wyre@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-qjggqlgsodvbqufj) |
| 18:32.45 | *** join/#debian rakor (~rakor@45.77.54.30) |
| 18:36.00 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@188.25.172.111) |
| 18:37.08 | annadane | where can i see patches for an already installed package? |
| 18:37.14 | *** join/#debian bashcu (~Thunderbi@190.113.110.122) |
| 18:38.13 | towo` | about what patches you speak? |
| 18:38.23 | rudi_s | annadane: apt-get source package and look in the debian/patches/ directory |
| 18:38.24 | annadane | just generally |
| 18:38.25 | greycat | packages.debian.org/yourpkg -> pick a version -> "Download Source Package" menu, you can fetch just the debian.tar.xz or whatever |
| 18:38.50 | annadane | ah ok i just thought there was an existing way to do it that has escaped my attention beyond apt source package |
| 18:38.55 | annadane | had* |
| 18:39.10 | *** join/#debian WizJin (~WizJin@136.244.99.92) |
| 18:40.06 | genr8_ | finally I figured out where my default application assosciations were stored: ~/.config/mimeapps.list |
| 18:40.14 | WizJin | hello, i am facing a weird issue.. i just created a VPS on vultr, installed debian 10.3. Now if i try to connect via Console facility of vultr, the root password works but the very same password does not work while i log in from putty or bitvise |
| 18:40.46 | greycat | ssh denied root logins by default; you can change that in sshd_config |
| 18:41.12 | WizJin | ok |
| 18:41.15 | greycat | grep PermitRoot /etc/ssh/sshd_config |
| 18:41.21 | genr8_ | the console on vultr is a physical terminal |
| 18:41.28 | genr8_ | tty1 |
| 18:42.01 | genr8_ | i havent found a way to break that yet :) good feature from Vultr |
| 18:42.03 | *** join/#debian ZeNEX (~ZeNE@151.red-83-54-241.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 18:42.32 | WizJin | yes, its set as prohibit-password |
| 18:42.44 | WizJin | what should i change it to ? |
| 18:42.50 | greycat | yes |
| 18:43.06 | greycat | and don't forget to remove the # comment character (or copy the line and remove the # on the copy) |
| 18:43.15 | ZeNEX | Hello guys, weird issue: when I launch Konsole I am in the sudo group. When I launch gnome-terminal I am not in the sudo group, what's going on?? |
| 18:43.27 | genr8_ | you should really be using SSH keys for root logins on publicly exposed SSH ports |
| 18:43.37 | greycat | ZeNEX: did you change your groups since you last logged in to GNOME? |
| 18:44.11 | rudi_s | WizJin: But be very careful when doing this on a public port like gen<tab> said. There are many scanners out there which will attempt many passwords to gain root access. |
| 18:44.13 | genr8_ | when you add yourself to a group, it doesnt take effect till you re-login or start a new session |
| 18:44.16 | ZeNEX | Nope, I logged out, then logged in, verified I was in sudo, *then* installed gnome-terminal |
| 18:44.27 | greycat | or, is your gnome-terminal possibly using a multiplexed persistent session, from the distant past, when you were not in that group yet? |
| 18:44.31 | rudi_s | So best only consider that as a temporary action and use pubkeys when you can. |
| 18:44.37 | ZeNEX | greycat, maybe that's it |
| 18:44.58 | ZeNEX | admittedly, I have no idea what a m. session is |
| 18:45.55 | greycat | like, tmux or screen ... or whatever the flip gnome-terminal does |
| 18:46.04 | ZeNEX | I'll reboot, if I don't come back that means it worked, thanks |
| 18:47.39 | genr8_ | WizJin, if you insist on being lazy and using a password, make it a VERY strong password, 12 chars + and follow the complexity rules. "PermitRootLogin yes" is the directive you're looking for. also make sure "PasswordAuthentication yes" is on. |
| 18:48.00 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 18:48.49 | WizJin | i am not familar with publickey method but i need to usually access this box from multiple other boxes, so i assume for publickey method i will have to generate key for each client right ? |
| 18:48.52 | greycat | Key logins are strongly advised if it's exposed to the Internet. |
| 18:49.42 | mutante | WizJin: you don't have to, you could also just copy/paste the same key. usually people recommend using one for each client though |
| 18:50.19 | greycat | You generally want to avoid ever copying the private key, if possible. |
| 18:50.35 | WizJin | this is just a temp vps for something i am experimenting with |
| 18:50.43 | WizJin | i ll probably destory it in 3-4 days |
| 18:50.55 | WizJin | and host the solution on a full-fledged server |
| 18:51.02 | mutante | the botnets will start testing your password within the first hour though |
| 18:51.03 | WizJin | but anyways, i need to learn this private key affair |
| 18:51.18 | WizJin | so i ll take that road ahead |
| 18:53.09 | *** join/#debian linzst (~linzst@unaffiliated/linzst) |
| 18:53.09 | *** part/#debian yanmaani (~yanmaani@gateway/tor-sasl/yanmaani) |
| 18:55.42 | gordonfish | One of the first thing I do when setting up a new server (often VPSs) for a client that there's any chance I'll need to access again, is set key auth only for ssh (along with some iptables/nftables to further lock it down.) |
| 18:58.11 | *** join/#debian Sierra (~sierrakom@botters/Sierra) |
| 18:58.49 | *** join/#debian nifker (~Thunderbi@200116b80aaf230067426e1c4f414678.dip.versatel-1u1.de) |
| 19:00.11 | *** join/#debian BenDover (~Thunderbi@78.154.135.185) |
| 19:01.24 | *** join/#debian plasticle (~plasticle@cpe-107-15-173-212.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 19:01.42 | *** join/#debian k4nz1 (~Thunderbi@122.234.11.156) |
| 19:04.03 | *** join/#debian Colty (Miramar-FL@2a00:c1e0:0:2:0:1:208:ab5e) |
| 19:05.49 | *** join/#debian idhugo (~idhugo@563472ae.rev.stofanet.dk) |
| 19:06.58 | *** join/#debian mnemonic (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 19:14.02 | *** join/#debian cdown_ (~cdown@163.114.131.1) |
| 19:15.16 | *** join/#debian bashcu (~Thunderbi@190.113.110.71) |
| 19:18.13 | *** join/#debian erle- (~stephan@2a04:ee41:3:3297:1c40:ab51:2d7d:8b2a) |
| 19:20.05 | *** join/#debian captSamIngram (~Thunderbi@unaffiliated/captsamingram) |
| 19:22.28 | *** join/#debian troulouliou_div2 (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-div2/x-0271439) |
| 19:24.21 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 19:24.44 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 19:30.52 | *** join/#debian medard (~medard@unaffiliated/medard) |
| 19:32.54 | *** join/#debian semeion_ (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 19:33.38 | jhutchins | Also good to run it on an alternative port. |
| 19:34.55 | *** join/#debian yonder (~yonder@unaffiliated/yonder) |
| 19:35.53 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 19:45.19 | *** join/#debian k4nz1 (~Thunderbi@115.199.105.11) |
| 19:48.04 | *** join/#debian luuuciano (~luuuciano@unaffiliated/luuuciano) |
| 19:49.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1157] by debhelper |
| 19:49.15 | *** part/#debian StyXman (~mdione@grulic/root/StyXman) |
| 19:50.08 | *** join/#debian krabador (~krabador@unaffiliated/krabador) |
| 19:52.02 | *** join/#debian winy (~vince@gre92-13-83-156-229-210.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:55.18 | *** join/#debian plasticle (~plasticle@cpe-107-15-173-212.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 19:58.32 | *** join/#debian chris (~chris@79.103.209.199.dsl.dyn.forthnet.gr) |
| 20:00.07 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 20:08.22 | genr8_ | is there a way in "ls" to chase down and follow all symlinks when im trying to "ls" a symlink and it leads to like 6 more symlinks (like when related to the "alternatives" system) |
| 20:08.34 | greycat | ls -lL |
| 20:09.13 | genr8_ | ok that leads me to the end. what about the ones in the middle. bash script time? |
| 20:09.14 | greycat | depends on what you actually want to see, though |
| 20:10.03 | genr8_ | actually that didnt even work properly. the path wasnt right |
| 20:10.23 | *** join/#debian duskmourn (~duskmourn@2600:1700:e7d1:5000::45) |
| 20:10.38 | greycat | "ls -lL /usr/bin/vi" for example shows me the size and permissions and so on for the ultimate target of the /usr/bin/vi symlink chain |
| 20:10.39 | *** join/#debian czesmir (~stefan@egp86.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:10.51 | greycat | but it doesn't show me the *location* of the final target, if that's what you were after |
| 20:10.54 | *** join/#debian cnsunyour (~cnsunyour@103.149.162.12) |
| 20:10.59 | genr8_ | yeaaa |
| 20:12.53 | NetTerminalGene | when will debian 10 be released? |
| 20:12.57 | NetTerminalGene | debian 11* |
| 20:13.00 | *** join/#debian Betal (~Betal@unaffiliated/betal) |
| 20:13.04 | greycat | !bullseye |
| 20:13.04 | dpkg | The release following Debian 10 "Buster" is codenamed "Bullseye" (Woody's horse in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 11. It is the current "testing" release. Remember that straight after a stable release, all sorts of mess suddenly lands in "testing" and it is best avoided if you don't like debugging things. https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2016/07/msg00002.html |
| 20:13.24 | sney | when it's ready. (probably around this time next year) |
| 20:13.25 | greycat | pretty sure there's a partial timeline on the wiki page... doesn't seem to be linked from the factoid though |
| 20:13.50 | NetTerminalGene | they say gnome 3.16 is very smooth |
| 20:14.09 | NetTerminalGene | 3.36* |
| 20:15.14 | *** join/#debian UrielCorinthian (~urielcori@169-0-211-31.ip.afrihost.co.za) |
| 20:15.17 | *** join/#debian dfcnvt (tagraf@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dfcnvt) |
| 20:16.06 | ratrace | like a lubricated giant baloon covered in silk? |
| 20:16.22 | *** join/#debian dominic34 (Thunderbir@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dominic34) |
| 20:20.14 | *** join/#debian Barralastic (~Barralast@92.255.124.118) |
| 20:22.58 | annadane | https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBullseye |
| 20:24.23 | tarzeau | is someone doing npm packages in here? i really like homebridge.io but i just install npm, then npm install the stuff i need |
| 20:24.35 | tarzeau | (i'm aware of npm2deb thing) |
| 20:25.40 | tarzeau | NetTerminalGene: i've got a guess of when the next stable release comes out at http://bootes.ethz.ch/bts (i think there was bot bets for that as well) |
| 20:26.21 | greycat | the announcements of the actual projected timeline by the Debian devs has pretty much killed the "betting pools" |
| 20:26.55 | tarzeau | where can i read those announcements? |
| 20:27.09 | greycat | https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBullseye |
| 20:27.32 | tarzeau | i've got a home in the forest (it's fiber internet connected) but still. /me goes read that up (i never run that old stable stuff, i call it software from yesterday) |
| 20:27.42 | greycat | which links to ... uh, a broken link, but it shoudl be https://release.debian.org/bullseye/freeze_policy.htm |
| 20:28.01 | *** join/#debian tehnull (~tehnull@unaffiliated/tehnull) |
| 20:28.03 | tarzeau | link worked for me, 2021-02-12 soft freeze, +1 month hard freeze |
| 20:28.09 | greycat | fixes |
| 20:28.50 | greycat | crap... should be https://release.debian.org/bullseye/freeze_policy.html I meant |
| 20:28.57 | greycat | that's what I changed it to, since that's the one that works |
| 20:29.02 | greycat | I don't know why it pasted the broken one in IRC |
| 20:29.07 | tarzeau | ah |
| 20:29.25 | tarzeau | let's release, nice slogan below the title, misses the let's dance |
| 20:30.47 | *** join/#debian chalcedony (~chalcedon@unaffiliated/chalcedony) |
| 20:31.33 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 20:31.41 | *** join/#debian Guest65681 (~chris@79.103.209.199.dsl.dyn.forthnet.gr) |
| 20:37.43 | *** join/#debian DirkS (~DirkS@b2b-130-180-51-242.unitymedia.biz) |
| 20:39.26 | *** join/#debian m0rph (~m1sosoup@port-92-194-104-198.dynamic.as20676.net) |
| 20:42.41 | *** join/#debian rgr (~rgr@ip-109-41-67-40.web.vodafone.de) |
| 20:49.16 | *** join/#debian chalcedony (~chalcedon@unaffiliated/chalcedony) |
| 20:50.29 | *** join/#debian winy (~vince@gre92-13-83-156-229-210.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:52.17 | *** join/#debian IsThatAPlanet (~dawgy@unaffiliated/iidot) |
| 20:55.23 | *** join/#debian squirrel (~mj@unaffiliated/squirrel) |
| 20:57.18 | *** join/#debian dvs (~hibbard@cwv.teksavvy.com) |
| 21:04.21 | *** join/#debian dutchfish (52a1cbdd@82-161-203-221.ip.xs4all.nl) |
| 21:04.38 | *** join/#debian morph000 (~m1sosoup@62.23.209.50) |
| 21:07.46 | *** join/#debian artemisfo (~artemis@anon-62-145.vpn.ipredator.se) |
| 21:08.01 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 21:09.00 | *** join/#debian aliasnumber10 (~crix@cpe-76-167-192-248.san.res.rr.com) |
| 21:12.56 | *** join/#debian blurkis (~blurkis@213-67-53-121-no157.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 21:13.29 | *** join/#debian m0rph (~m1sosoup@port-92-194-104-198.dynamic.as20676.net) |
| 21:17.57 | *** join/#debian disillusion (disillusio@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/disillusion) |
| 21:19.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1148] by debhelper |
| 21:21.11 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 21:22.40 | *** join/#debian Eduard_Munteanu (~Eduard_Mu@5-12-132-63.residential.rdsnet.ro) |
| 21:30.21 | *** join/#debian AJ_Z0 (~AJ_Z0@pdpc/supporter/professional/ajz0) |
| 21:39.31 | *** join/#debian TomyWork (~TomyLobo@p200300e80f24ab00b0367d79b91b1d73.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:41.07 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 21:41.55 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 21:44.49 | *** join/#debian Orcs53 (~Orcs53@101.186.21.40) |
| 21:49.29 | *** join/#debian longears (longears@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/longears) |
| 21:49.50 | *** join/#debian tonyoy (~tonyoy@2a01:e0a:507:82b0:6e62:5d0a:a360:530f) |
| 21:53.30 | *** join/#debian ddsys (~ddsys@unaffiliated/ddsys) |
| 21:55.14 | *** join/#debian Megaf (~Megaf@unaffiliated/megaf) |
| 21:56.36 | *** join/#debian Shinku (~user@cpe-67-11-164-88.satx.res.rr.com) |
| 22:01.05 | *** join/#debian behanw (uid110099@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yshkjlsxdsdxxbhj) |
| 22:01.30 | *** join/#debian crash_ (~pi@h-254-30.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) |
| 22:02.10 | *** join/#debian m_g_lewis (~melvin@2601:541:8202:33d0:8a51:fbff:fe48:1e94) |
| 22:03.18 | *** join/#debian timur_davletshin (~timur_dav@unaffiliated/timur-davletshin/x-6536285) |
| 22:06.37 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 22:08.44 | *** join/#debian de-facto (~de-facto@gateway/tor-sasl/de-facto) |
| 22:18.04 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 22:19.02 | *** join/#debian diniwed (~gavron@194.5.53.76) |
| 22:19.27 | *** join/#debian naptastic (~david@c-67-182-225-67.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 22:25.19 | *** join/#debian Kruspe (~kvirc@x4d035949.dyn.telefonica.de) |
| 22:26.01 | *** join/#debian sdud (~sdud@66.42.66.32) |
| 22:31.02 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 22:31.33 | *** join/#debian warsoul (warsoul@gateway/shell/xshellz/x-hqtflamvyrmenotq) |
| 22:38.07 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 22:39.22 | *** join/#debian torbo (~user@162.249.163.177) |
| 22:40.00 | *** join/#debian Kruspe (~kruspe@x4d035949.dyn.telefonica.de) |
| 22:40.50 | *** join/#debian immae (~immae@2a01:4f8:141:53e7::) |
| 22:41.25 | *** join/#debian esaym153 (~esaym153@net153.net) |
| 22:43.33 | *** join/#debian cdown_ (~cdown@89.32.122.5) |
| 22:49.10 | *** join/#debian troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@unaffiliated/troulouliou-dev/x-4757952) |
| 22:49.55 | *** join/#debian halvors (~Thunderbi@ti0071a400-8846.bb.online.no) |
| 22:52.33 | *** join/#debian ddp` (~ddp@d-d-p.it) |
| 22:53.14 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 22:54.31 | *** join/#debian debsan (~debsan@unaffiliated/debsan) |
| 22:54.39 | *** join/#debian duskmourn (~duskmourn@2600:1700:e7d1:5000::45) |
| 22:56.00 | *** join/#debian dominic34 (Thunderbir@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/dominic34) |
| 22:56.38 | *** join/#debian Adbray (~Adbray@2600:6c48:6f7f:d764:74ae:4509:240e:eec) |
| 22:57.16 | *** join/#debian plt (~Lollwlwle@sbbs.dynu.net) |
| 22:57.19 | plt | Is there any other vpn software that is free other then crippleware openvpn? |
| 22:57.49 | mason | plt: wireguard is the flavour de jeur. |
| 22:57.52 | *** join/#debian Lord_of_Life_ (~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362) |
| 22:58.09 | plt | Is the client license free? |
| 22:58.22 | mason | ,v wireguard |
| 22:58.23 | judd | Package: wireguard on amd64 -- buster-backports: 1.0.20200513-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 1.0.20200513-1; sid: 1.0.20200513-1 |
| 22:59.14 | mason | https://www.wireguard.com/#license |
| 22:59.34 | quadrathoch2 | ply i guess so, as it is gplv2 |
| 22:59.40 | quadrathoch2 | plt ^ |
| 23:00.27 | plt | IS not available on the debian pacage |
| 23:00.34 | *** join/#debian shibboleth (~shibbolet@gateway/tor-sasl/shibboleth) |
| 23:01.07 | plt | Do you where I can get wireguard.deb? |
| 23:01.12 | mason | ,v wireguard |
| 23:01.14 | judd | Package: wireguard on amd64 -- buster-backports: 1.0.20200513-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 1.0.20200513-1; sid: 1.0.20200513-1 |
| 23:01.15 | mason | plt: ^ |
| 23:02.11 | avu | tinc is also nice, depending on what kind of infrastructure you want to build |
| 23:02.22 | plt | apt-cache search wireguard |
| 23:02.22 | plt | shell:~# |
| 23:02.36 | avu | plt: did you read what judd wrote? |
| 23:02.48 | avu | plt: it's in backports |
| 23:03.26 | mason | plt: You can read about backports here: https://backports.debian.org/ |
| 23:03.42 | plt | Is stable is the backports? |
| 23:04.15 | mason | Stable is buster, so buster-backports are backports created for stable, from testing. |
| 23:04.44 | mason | plt: Read the top of the page I linked for a really clear, concise description. |
| 23:05.27 | *** join/#debian van3077 (~paxon@node-11kt.pool-101-51.dynamic.totinternet.net) |
| 23:06.07 | plt | That is not good |
| 23:06.30 | plt | He should move it to the stable version of debian |
| 23:06.39 | mason | It'll be in the next stable version. |
| 23:07.07 | mason | You can also build it from source yourself if you want complete control. |
| 23:07.09 | plt | When your developing programs you should do the release on the stable version of the os |
| 23:07.16 | plt | bad |
| 23:07.21 | avu | plt: that's not how Debian stable works |
| 23:07.40 | plt | The stable version of 9 and 10 work for me just fine. |
| 23:07.45 | avu | plt: once it's released, it doesn't get new software, just bug fixes and security updates |
| 23:08.02 | plt | That is still bad |
| 23:08.24 | plt | I am having been a software developer for the past 30 years. |
| 23:08.43 | plt | thanks |
| 23:08.47 | mason | It's quite good, and the primary reason why we all run Debian. |
| 23:08.58 | quadrathoch2 | and why should it be bad that software only gets bug and security fixes? |
| 23:09.09 | mason | plt: I've got a decade on you for development experience. You'll come around. |
| 23:09.24 | plt | When I develop applications if 11 is the newer version then I test it on only 10. |
| 23:10.22 | quadrathoch2 | that's why there is testing and sid oO |
| 23:11.26 | plt | The developer should have done it ine reverse order write and distrubute on the stable version first m wait 6 months then do the next release |
| 23:11.53 | mason | plt: Wireguard isn't written by Debian. |
| 23:12.10 | plt | I know and I will have a chat with him. |
| 23:12.39 | annadane | if you've been a software dev for 30 years why do you not take 5 minutes to READ DEBIAN'S POLICIES |
| 23:13.03 | plt | I know. |
| 23:17.54 | plt | I do not crazy stuff like that |
| 23:18.00 | *** join/#debian k4nz (~Thunderbi@115.199.105.11) |
| 23:24.11 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 23:26.06 | PyR3X | lol |
| 23:26.20 | *** join/#debian bobey (~bobey@cpe-70-94-44-250.kc.res.rr.com) |
| 23:36.03 | *** join/#debian coruja_ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 23:44.24 | *** join/#debian semeion (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 23:46.15 | *** join/#debian semeion_ (~semeion@unaffiliated/semeion) |
| 23:46.34 | *** join/#debian format_c (~format_c@unaffiliated/format-c/x-8927423) |
| 23:46.49 | shibboleth | https://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html |
| 23:47.01 | shibboleth | stallman lives |
| 23:47.36 | shibboleth | it has been like.... eleven other inquisitions so it had slipped my mind |
| 23:47.56 | annadane | ihnfc what you're going on about |
| 23:49.47 | shibboleth | richard stallman is a *nix/gnu legend |
| 23:50.01 | shibboleth | but he got in trouble with the wokemaster general a while back |
| 23:51.05 | *** join/#debian coruja__ (~coruja@unaffiliated/coruja) |
| 23:51.10 | *** join/#debian _aeris_ (~aeris@april/board/aeris) |
| 23:52.23 | annadane | his website was down? |
| 23:52.36 | annadane | like i have no idea what you're talking about if you don't provide context |
| 23:52.42 | annadane | obviously i know who stallman is |
| 23:55.32 | *** join/#debian bobey (~bobey@cpe-70-94-44-250.kc.res.rr.com) |
| 23:55.49 | *** join/#debian njka- (~njka-@unaffiliated/njka) |
| 23:56.04 | shibboleth | i appreciate that he got through the spanish inquisition |
| 23:57.47 | shibboleth | he was taken off the board(s), lost his apt and all kinds of shit |
| 23:58.08 | shibboleth | stallman lives, which is great |
| 23:58.21 | *** join/#debian voidSurfr (~todd_dsm@ip68-225-227-86.oc.oc.cox.net) |