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| 00:19.24 | jaggz | mr bot, how update buster to bullseye |
| 00:19.27 | jaggz | !bullseye |
| 00:19.28 | dpkg | The release following Debian 10 "Buster" is codenamed "Bullseye" (Woody's horse in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 11. It is the current "testing" release. Remember that straight after a stable release, all sorts of mess suddenly lands in "testing" and it is best avoided if you don't like debugging things. https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2016/07/msg00002.html |
| 00:20.39 | jaggz | damn.. so why is my nvidia cuda from backports screwed up (in buster) |
| 00:21.16 | jaggz | nvidia-smi shows me I'm at cuda 10.2. libcuda1 provides that virtual package (along with 10.1, etc.). |
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| 00:22.47 | jaggz | but the only libcudart.so is libcudart.so.10.1.243 which comes from libcudart10.1 |
| 00:23.00 | jaggz | and I'm trying to figure out why something I'm building is complaining that it can't find the cuda device count |
| 00:23.14 | jaggz | (and ldd shows it links to the 10.1 lib) |
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| 00:52.02 | jaggz | Cute. https://forums.developer.nvidia.com/t/cuda-has-to-be-started-as-root-at-least-once-to-work-properly/32474 |
| 00:52.08 | jaggz | from 2014.. and it applied to me too |
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| 02:00.04 | Dormeus | when I run chromium from terminal, it runs but I see messages like : libpng warning: size in first frame's fcTL must match the size in IHDR |
| 02:00.04 | Dormeus | libpng warning: Skipped (ignored) a chunk between APNG chunks |
| 02:01.28 | kline | Dormeus: does this happen on many different sites or just one or a few sites? it might be worth checking that the PNGs in play are, indeed, valid with a different tool |
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| 02:13.33 | Dormeus | hmm, can't reproduce it now, so maybe it Was one particular site |
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| 02:36.00 | k-man | is there some way i can turn off hot cornes in gnome in debian stable? |
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| 03:11.23 | somiaj | k-man: https://askubuntu.com/questions/701592/how-do-i-disable-activities-hot-corner-in-gnome-shell/1097397 -- appears this can be done with the gnome-tweak-tool |
| 03:11.33 | somiaj | ,i gnome-tweak-tool |
| 03:11.35 | judd | Package gnome-tweak-tool (oldlibs, optional) in buster/amd64: adjust advanced settings for GNOME - transitional package. Version: 3.30.2-1; Size: 5.5k; Installed: 12k; Homepage: https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Tweaks |
| 03:13.49 | k-man | somiaj: last i checked, the version of gnome in stable is too old for that tweak |
| 03:13.56 | k-man | I will double check again |
| 03:14.54 | somiaj | I saw some other comment about extensions could do it too, maybe install an extension in $HOME |
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| 03:44.22 | Arrow900 | android-sdk is not available for bullseye ? |
| 03:44.33 | somiaj | ,android-sdk |
| 03:44.36 | somiaj | ,v android-sdk |
| 03:44.37 | judd | Package: android-sdk on amd64 -- stretch: 25.0.0+5; buster: 25.0.0+11+deb10u1; sid: 25.0.0+12 |
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| 03:45.26 | somiaj | Arrow900: debian testing questions belong in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net. https://tracker.debian.org/news/1171106/android-sdk-meta-removed-from-testing/ -- seems there are bugs blocking it |
| 03:46.10 | Arrow900 | okay thx |
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| 05:09.46 | Arrow900 | Now on stable I got android-sdk and platform etc installed, but with QtCreator I get one Android settings error "Platform SDK installed." i dont understand what am I missing ? |
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| 05:19.41 | Arrow900 | seems like I would need openjdk 8.0 for it to work, is there any way to downgrade from 11 to 8 on debian ? |
| 05:23.20 | Arrow900 | nevermind giving up on it, just going to make my app on Godot instead |
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| 05:54.06 | no_gravity | I never get over how beautiful it is to run a command on a remote machine via ssh. "ssh somemachine dosomething". |
| 05:54.24 | no_gravity | Could one combine it with pipes to distribute workload across machines? Like ssh imageRenderMachine makenewimage | ssh postprocessor postprocess |
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| 06:03.19 | k-j-m | hai anyone there? |
| 06:03.41 | anyone | k-j-m: Yup. Whats up? |
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| 06:07.22 | k-j-m | anyone:i was trying to customize urxvt . i looked for /usr/lib/urxvt/perl/ directory .but the problem is it said that no such file or directory |
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| 06:08.42 | anyone | k-j-m: Sorry, I am not an urxvt user. |
| 06:09.57 | k-j-m | anyone: ok no problem |
| 06:10.11 | k-j-m | i was trying to customize urxvt . i looked for /usr/lib/urxvt/perl/ directory .but the problem is it said that no such file or directory |
| 06:10.30 | anyone | Yeah, you said that 3 minutes ago. |
| 06:10.44 | anyone | And I replied that I am sorry but I am not an urxvt user. |
| 06:10.48 | anyone | Then you said its no problem. |
| 06:11.27 | anyone | I am pretty happy with mate-terminal. |
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| 06:13.05 | k-j-m | anyone :sorry its for urxvt users (if any ) |
| 06:13.16 | anyone | Yeah |
| 06:13.54 | nkuttler | k-j-m: what do you want to customize? |
| 06:15.32 | k-j-m | nkutter:i want extensitions iam a newbie to urxvt |
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| 06:17.27 | nkuttler | k-j-m: you can configure rxvt through your ~/.Xresources, and specify which directory to use |
| 06:17.36 | nkuttler | k-j-m: see e.g. https://github.com/muennich/urxvt-perls |
| 06:18.02 | k-j-m | nkutter:this is what i want ---"URxvt.perl-ext-common:default,matcher,resize-font,url-select,keyboard-select" |
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| 06:20.10 | k-j-m | nkutter:but this is what i see in terminal--"bash: cd: /usr/lib/urxvt/perl/: No such file or directory |
| 06:20.11 | k-j-m | " |
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| 06:28.01 | k-j-m | nkutter:thanks i got it (what you are trying to say) |
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| 07:02.36 | hegemoOn | is there something specific to buster/debian that when i put hosts: resolve in /etc/nsswitch.conf name resolution stops ? |
| 07:02.36 | hegemoOn | getent hosts foo is not working anymore |
| 07:02.36 | hegemoOn | while systemd-resolved is running and active ? |
| 07:02.41 | hegemoOn | In all systemd documentation it is said to add resolve in the hosts line of nsswitch.conf |
| 07:03.06 | hegemoOn | i activated systemd-resolved for dns cache function |
| 07:03.16 | hegemoOn | but my statistics are all 0 since 3 days |
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| 07:03.35 | hegemoOn | like if systemd-resolved is never requested |
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| 07:18.42 | Deknos | is anyone aware of software where you give the software pictures and it makes a nice static website for it where you can upload pictures and generated static html for it? |
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| 07:27.34 | jelly | Deknos, a static site generator, or something specific for photo albums? |
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| 07:29.04 | Deknos | specific for photo albums.. in that way: i have many photos i want to share and i want to just have them automatically organized and shown on a static website :) |
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| 07:30.51 | Deknos | uh, there's album in debian :) |
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| 08:28.42 | afidegnum | hello, anyone familiar with rEFInd ? i'm stacked since yesterday. i can see 2 configurations files /boot/refind_linux.conf and /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/refind.conf how are they related? |
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| 08:35.00 | Guest14928 | is it technically possible to rescue a 931,5GB external HDD to a 931,5GB mounted volume with ddrescue? |
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| 08:38.29 | Guest14928 | format of the HD: ntfs, format of the free volume: ext2 |
| 08:38.30 | RoyK | Guest14928: yes |
| 08:39.31 | Guest14928 | good. So i can ddrescue /dev/sdc1 to /dev/sda1 or /dev/sdc to /dev/sda? |
| 08:39.44 | RoyK | that is, you should run (g)ddrescue on the whole drive, that is, copying the whole thing with partition table and so on directly to an unmounted drive |
| 08:40.02 | Guest14928 | so the second option in my case? |
| 08:40.20 | RoyK | if you hve a larger drive, say 2TB, you could use a partition on that and ddrescue the whole disk or each of the partitions to a file there |
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| 08:41.18 | RoyK | IMHO that will ease things a bit later |
| 08:41.30 | RoyK | no need for kpartx and such |
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| 08:42.04 | Guest14928 | unfortunately both have one big partition each and are both 1TB (specified by vendor) |
| 08:42.40 | RoyK | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:42.59 | RoyK | something for later use for such projects, perhaps |
| 08:43.06 | Guest14928 | if it's possible wihtout a new disk i'd rather try that. |
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| 08:44.46 | RoyK | then I'd ddrescue the whole disk over, with partition tables. they should be exactly the same size, but AFAIK that's standardised now, some 10 years ago (except for SSDs, where it's the same havoc we had with spinning rust in the noughties and earlier) |
| 08:45.43 | Guest14928 | ok. does it matter that the ssd drive is ntfs and the internal hd is ext2? |
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| 08:46.23 | RoyK | Guest14928: see lsblk -b to doublecheck the size. if the target disk is smaller, it won't work too well. if it's larger, no problem |
| 08:47.09 | RoyK | Guest14928: the target disk will be *overwritten*, erased, gone, replaced with the stuff from the source disk. The filesystem there won't matter - to dd(rescue), that's just rubbish anyway |
| 08:47.55 | Guest14928 | ok. So ddrescue /dev/sdc to /dev/sda it is, does /dev/sda need to be unmounted or mounted for that? |
| 08:48.41 | RoyK | none of them should be mounted |
| 08:48.46 | RoyK | where's the rootfs? |
| 08:48.47 | Guest14928 | thanks |
| 08:48.54 | Guest14928 | on a different drive of cours |
| 08:49.07 | Guest14928 | or what rootfs do you mean? |
| 08:49.19 | RoyK | your "C:" ;) |
| 08:49.25 | RoyK | system partition |
| 08:49.30 | RoyK | mount | grep -w / |
| 08:49.33 | RoyK | that onee |
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| 08:50.30 | RoyK | btw, I'd use a mapfile if I were you. See man ddrescue. It'll make it possible to resume ddrescue in case of interruptions |
| 08:50.50 | Guest14928 | ok no worries, thanks for the hint. Scince i allready wasted 4h to that i want to be sure: |
| 08:51.21 | Guest14928 | the command would be 'ddrescue /dev/sdc /dev/sda /home/user/Backup/logfile.log'? |
| 08:51.54 | Guest14928 | (without either of the devices mounted) |
| 08:51.57 | RoyK | given that sdc is the old disk and sda is a working one without any data you might be needing, yes |
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| 08:52.34 | Guest14928 | good, thanks for the quick help |
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| 08:57.12 | Guest14928 | just one more thing to be certain: if it concerns only the (hopefully not) lost data on sdc wouldnt "ddrescue /dev/sdc1 /dev/sda1" be a better option? |
| 09:02.11 | Guest14928 | the circumstances are: the failing ntfs partition can't be mounted due to error. If i copy the partition table wouldn't /dev/sda have the same error? |
| 09:03.46 | foul_owl_ | I'm trying to find an alarm clock program for Debian that allows multiple sounds / easy changing of sounds. I used to use "alarm-clock" but that seems to have been pulled from the repos. I tried gnome-clocks but this does not allow mulitple sounds and changing the sound is incredibly convoluted. qtalarm will not compile in debian 10 since it uses qt4 |
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| 09:05.52 | Guest14928 | @foul_owl isn't there a version of 'beep' that uses the desktops sound? |
| 09:07.52 | diogenes_ | foul_owl_, you can make your own timer. |
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| 09:11.40 | Guest14928 | foul_owl, 'tput bel' |
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| 09:14.00 | Guest14928 | something like https://pastebin.pl/view/f49b0ace |
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| 09:26.46 | foul_owl_ | There was an excellent fully featured alarm clock program for gnome that I used for years and years, it's depressing to see Debian lose functionality as the years go by |
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| 09:28.02 | foul_owl_ | An alarm clock seems like a pretty common use case? Why not keep https://packages.debian.org/jessie/utils/alarm-clock ? |
| 09:28.12 | Guest14928 | using mate i can add a Timer-program to the panel |
| 09:28.38 | foul_owl_ | What is the package name? I will try that |
| 09:28.53 | diogenes_ | foul_owl_, i could try and make an alarm clock for you. |
| 09:29.20 | foul_owl_ | Well thank you...what about simply getting https://packages.debian.org/jessie/utils/alarm-clock added back to the repos? Seems like much less work right? |
| 09:30.14 | foul_owl_ | This thing had quite a few very nice features |
| 09:30.16 | foul_owl_ | https://screenshots.debian.net/package/alarm-clock |
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| 09:30.39 | diogenes_ | no, making a simple zenity alarm clock would be easier. |
| 09:31.35 | foul_owl_ | Well thank you, I won't turn that down :) |
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| 09:36.37 | Guest14928 | RoyK did you mean a logfile or explicitly a mapfile earlier? |
| 09:41.21 | RoyK | Guest14928: from the manual: NOTE: In versions of ddrescue prior to 1.20 the mapfile was called 'logfile'. The format is the same; only the name has changed. |
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| 09:44.31 | Guest14928 | ok i started the rescue now, overwriting /dev/sda. I hope i'll be able to use the output somehow |
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| 09:50.29 | Lope | what is the maximum possible MTU that I can use on a virtual bridge between a linux host and a linux guest VM using a virtio network device? |
| 09:51.01 | Lope | There are no physical network devices on this particular bridge, no other operating systems, no virtual hardware. Only virtio. |
| 09:51.53 | Lope | 4.19 kernels or newer. |
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| 10:02.58 | lyind | hi there, does anybody know why the package rasdaemon is not there in bullseye/testing? |
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| 10:06.29 | H4ndy | hmm it's in unstable but not testing ð¤ |
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| 10:29.59 | RoyK | ,v rasdaemon |
| 10:30.00 | judd | Package: rasdaemon on amd64 -- stretch: 0.5.8-1+b1; buster: 0.6.0-1.2; sid: 0.6.6-1 |
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| 10:31.28 | Guest14928 | Using a amd ryzen5 amdgpu is there a more recommendable package for debian 10 + mate than firmware-amd-graphics? |
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| 10:32.16 | lyind | H4ndy, RoyK: what could be the reason or is that a normal thing? |
| 10:33.10 | H4ndy | Sorry no idea, probably something that the maintainer must answer |
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| 10:39.12 | NetTerminalGene | Guest14928: does it even work? |
| 10:40.01 | Guest14928 | NetTerminalGene it does but it has a glitch when windows are being opened or closed |
| 10:40.44 | NetTerminalGene | Guest14928: ryzen apus are new for buster |
| 10:41.43 | NetTerminalGene | and there is no alternative packages for that |
| 10:44.02 | Guest14928 | the xserver didn't start when the fresh setup started. I installed the firmware-package and the GUI login worked well. But the screen tears into horozontal stripes when widows are opened or closed. |
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| 10:49.59 | jelly | dpkg, why is rasdaemon not in testing |
| 10:49.59 | dpkg | rasdaemon is not in testing for the reasons listed in https://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=rasdaemon |
| 10:50.04 | jelly | lyind, ^ |
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| 10:51.21 | jelly | lyind, this is normal, things in testing can be broken at times |
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| 10:59.09 | no_gravity | rdiff-backup lists some directories as changed that have not changed. I wonder how to figure out why. |
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| 11:02.13 | NetTerminalGene | Guest14928: you need newer kernel and graphics stack |
| 11:02.33 | NetTerminalGene | you shpuld try testing or sid |
| 11:02.37 | NetTerminalGene | should* |
| 11:03.19 | Guest14928 | i thought that this might be fixed somewhen. The machine is not in everyday-use so i'll just wait |
| 11:03.56 | NetTerminalGene | they won't fix it. believe me |
| 11:05.18 | aynik | hi, does anybody have some info on setting up xserver for a sony PCG-U3? |
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| 11:06.12 | Guest14928 | i allways thought linux and amd worked well together |
| 11:06.57 | Guest14928 | i mean regarding compatibility and support |
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| 11:08.30 | NetTerminalGene | Guest14928: debian 10 is stable release. it won't get new hardware support etc.. kernel and graphics stack is old for ryzen apus |
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| 11:12.08 | Guest14928 | NetTerminalGene i never tried anything else but stable. would using sid or testing help by giving feedback or surveying in some way? |
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| 11:15.28 | cluonbeam | Guest14928: No. You're literally using an in-development version of Debian. Newer things might work, until things break, as the name testing or sid (which is also called "unstable") implies. |
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| 11:16.26 | diogenes_ | why not trying just a newer backported kernel first? |
| 11:17.31 | EmleyMoor | What's an app for Debian that will allow me to print certain pages of a pdf? |
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| 11:18.01 | Guest14928 | i don't get it. isn't the kernel being updated on a regular basis anyway? |
| 11:18.40 | EmleyMoor | Guest14928: For fixes, not for features, as a rule |
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| 11:20.27 | oxek | is installing zram-tools package on debian and then configuring /etc/default/zramswap the correct way of using zram? Or is there a more suitable way, such as something that uses zramctl from util-linux? |
| 11:22.08 | Guest14928 | EmeleyMoor doesn't atril document viewer do that? |
| 11:22.09 | EmleyMoor | Just tried an lpr one-liner, three pages and an error printed |
| 11:22.45 | EmleyMoor | Guest14928: I don't know. Does/doesn't it? |
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| 11:24.18 | tramplefoot | lpr? are you trying to print something |
| 11:24.36 | EmleyMoor | As I said, not 8 minutes ago |
| 11:25.05 | cluonbeam | EmleyMoor: They weren't in the channel yet. |
| 11:25.10 | tramplefoot | ^ |
| 11:25.33 | tramplefoot | and yes, atril has cups integration |
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| 11:28.13 | EmleyMoor | My printer had been dormant for months for want of magenta toner. Getting low on yellow (but I have a spare) and black. |
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| 11:29.49 | tete_ | hi, i'd like to configure a service (matrix-synapse) so that it can update without touching the shipped configuration (homeserver.yml in /etc/matrix-synapse). can someone tell me how to do that? do i have to create a /etc/matrix-synapse.d/homeserver.yml and put my configuration in it? or do i have to create /etc/matrix-synapse/conf.d/homeserver.yml ? or does this completly depend on the application itself? |
| 11:29.58 | EmleyMoor | I also now see where I went wrong with evince |
| 11:30.30 | EmleyMoor | (always handy to have spare PDF viewers about - some handle some files better than others) |
| 11:30.37 | cluonbeam | tete_: Depends on whether or not that piece of software supports *.d config directories. |
| 11:30.47 | cluonbeam | tete_: Or otherwise has some ability to "include" other config files. |
| 11:31.35 | tete_ | ok thanks, then i'll ask in #matrix |
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| 11:34.47 | ws2k3 | how can i let htop sort bij memory? |
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| 11:36.38 | cluonbeam | ws2k3: man htop - sorting options are described. |
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| 11:39.18 | ws2k3 | cluonbeam: thx i have a kind of weird issue my machine seems to have allmost 2.5 GB ram in use. but i cant find which process its using it. top and htop shows me there are no processe thare are using a Huge amount of ram |
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| 11:42.35 | zamnedix | ws2k3: just guessing as this seems incredibly common - you got firefox or chrome open with dozens of tabs? if so, thats probably it |
| 11:42.47 | zamnedix | its not usually hard to figure out whats using your RAM if you actually look at whats running and think about it |
| 11:42.51 | ws2k3 | zamnedix: lol its a server so no gui is installed :P |
| 11:42.58 | zamnedix | ah okay |
| 11:43.15 | cluonbeam | ws2k3: How are you determining that your memory is in use? |
| 11:43.23 | ws2k3 | cluonbeam: free -m |
| 11:43.25 | ws2k3 | cluonbeam: https://pastebin.com/TMeHEeWm |
| 11:43.53 | cluonbeam | Wow, yeah, something is actually clobbering you. |
| 11:44.16 | cluonbeam | What all do you have mounted as tmpfs? |
| 11:44.20 | cluonbeam | mount -t tmpfs will show you. |
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| 11:49.00 | ws2k3 | cluonbeam: https://pastebin.com/nFgEZbXc |
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| 12:48.52 | Guest14928 | don't mean to be annoying but as i could have foreseen i got two faulty ntfs partitions i can't mount from 'ddrescue -f -r3 /dev/sdc /dev/sda /path/to/logfile'. Would 'ddrescue -f /dev/sdc1 /dev/sda1' have made more sense? |
| 12:49.31 | dvs | Guest14928, /dev/sdc and /dev/sda are whole disks, not partitions |
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| 12:50.22 | wsky | i need Qt5LinguistTools on buster |
| 12:50.30 | Guest14928 | yes i thought ddrescue would fix bad sectors somehow. btw Dmesg shows that the partition goes beyond EOD whatever that means. |
| 12:50.31 | wsky | which package holds that? |
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| 12:58.28 | cluonbeam | wsky: Debian buster Qt5LinguistTools on $searchEngine yielded an answer in about two seconds. You're looking for qttools5-dev. |
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| 12:58.44 | wsky | well i got this |
| 12:58.49 | wsky | still cmake fails to find it |
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| 12:59.22 | abrotman | maybe you should share the error ... |
| 12:59.27 | abrotman | making us guess is annoying |
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| 13:00.14 | wsky | here you go https://paste.debian.net/1162619/ |
| 13:00.28 | ratrace | Guest14928: ddrescue doesn't fix bad sectors, it only extracts as much data as possible amidst errors. and yes, it should've block-copied what you gave it, so using partitions (sda1 vs sda) makes more sense only if you actually want to copy partitions, not whole disk |
| 13:02.24 | ratrace | Guest14928: btw "fixing" bad sectors can happen if you _write_ over them multiple times, so the firmware reallocates them. But eh, if you have bad sectors cropping up, just replace whole drive asap |
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| 13:03.57 | wsky | abrotman: so you got any solution or are you just gonna tease me some more? |
| 13:04.45 | afidegnum | anyone successfully configure hibernation on rEFInd ? |
| 13:06.06 | cluonbeam | afidegnum: Are you running Debian or Ubuntu? |
| 13:06.39 | wsky | hm, the configuration seems to be done regardless of lack of the linguist tools |
| 13:06.42 | wsky | nevermind then\ |
| 13:07.56 | jelly | dpkg, highfive cluonbeam |
| 13:07.57 | dpkg | gives cluonbeam a big high-five |
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| 13:08.20 | cluonbeam | go me? |
| 13:08.22 | Grldfrdom_ | dpkg --purge |
| 13:08.22 | dpkg | Grldfrdom_: are you using Windows? |
| 13:08.33 | jelly | (not going to do it in #ubuntu ;-) |
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| 13:09.01 | cluonbeam | jelly: ;) Gotcha |
| 13:09.55 | Grldfrdom_ | dpkg --purge --force |
| 13:09.56 | dpkg | drinks a glass of salty water, sticks his fingers down his throat and throws up --force all over grldfrdom_ and _aeris_... |
| 13:10.49 | ratrace | wth.... |
| 13:12.03 | jelly | dpkg, botsnack |
| 13:12.03 | dpkg | jelly: aw, gee |
| 13:12.27 | jelly | there, the bot shouldn't be purging itself that much (or at all) |
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| 13:14.32 | Grldfrdom_ | dpkg Spell my nickname wrong it's Grldfrdom |
| 13:14.33 | dpkg | only one word of alphabetic characters supported |
| 13:15.07 | jelly | you do have a lingering underscore right now, Grldfrdom_ |
| 13:15.58 | ratrace | and dpkg is a drone. |
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| 13:18.34 | ratrace | does that mean you can't even rebalance it then? basically, fubared fs? |
| 13:18.41 | ratrace | oops wrong chan |
| 13:18.44 | wsky | ok i have the application up and runing correctly, no need for that lib after all i guess |
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| 13:31.13 | abrotman | wsky: sorry, got wrapped up in Work .. did you get it sorted, or a something to try? |
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| 13:31.53 | wsky | abrotman: appears these headers are optional, the configuration was finished and the app built correctly |
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| 13:32.18 | abrotman | well, that's exciting |
| 13:33.26 | Allain | ratrace i have a solution for the ~/.inputrc history-search-backward and forward: using \e[0A \e[0B instead of \e[A and \e[B |
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| 13:37.37 | ratrace | Allain: sorry, I'm missing context for that.... |
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| 14:52.05 | gribouille | hi |
| 14:52.16 | gribouille | how can I use kvm to boot a system that is on an USB stick? |
| 14:54.35 | nulleip | qemu-system-x86_64 -enable-kvm -drive file=/dev/XXX,media=disk,format=raw |
| 14:54.55 | nulleip | or qemu-whatever |
| 14:55.53 | gribouille | nulleip, I get the following error message : Could not open '/dev/sdd': Permission denied |
| 14:56.26 | nulleip | chmod 0666 /dev/kvm |
| 14:57.07 | nulleip | you mues be on disk group also I guess |
| 14:57.09 | nulleip | must* |
| 14:58.02 | nulleip | I use like this with some other bunch of parameters, you can use libvirt or another higher level vm like virtualbox and enable kvm on it |
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| 15:00.01 | ratrace | uhm, no. don't chmod kvm, put yourself in the "kvm" group. but you need _write_ permission to /dev/sdd. Either temporarly chown it root:youruser, or create a shared group and write an udev rule |
| 15:00.09 | ratrace | don't put yourself into "disk" group |
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| 15:03.10 | gribouille | I can't believe there isn't a simple solution |
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| 15:04.53 | ratrace | gribouille: that's the simplest you can get. OR you can install virt-manager and the whole GUI shebang and try clicky-clicky your way into that. you _will_ need sdd write permission one way or another. |
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| 15:08.20 | gribouille | ratrace, but when I mount the drive, I can write to it without modifying the permissions |
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| 15:08.51 | ratrace | gribouille: thats entirely different from using the drive for the VM, that's not mountpoints, that's direct low-level access |
| 15:09.16 | ratrace | gribouille: when you mount the drive, you can write to the _filesystem_ atop of it, not the drive device itself. |
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| 15:09.34 | gribouille | ratrace, I know |
| 15:09.58 | ratrace | gribouille: then what's your question |
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| 15:13.37 | gribouille | ok, it seems to work with chown |
| 15:14.31 | gribouille | isn't it going to wreack havoc in my host system? |
| 15:15.02 | ratrace | gribouille: chown root:youruser /dev/sdd ? nope |
| 15:15.07 | nulleip | you could just use `sudo` to do stuff too |
| 15:15.24 | nulleip | safer |
| 15:15.27 | ratrace | yeah no, don't run VMs as root |
| 15:15.29 | gribouille | ratrace, no, executing the system on the stick with kvm |
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| 15:16.00 | ratrace | gribouille: it's (hardware) virtualization, the guest doesn't see the host |
| 15:17.01 | gribouille | ok, thanks |
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| 15:20.48 | gribouille | ok it workd, but kvm captured my mouse. how can I get the mouse back? |
| 15:21.15 | ratrace | gribouille: ctrl+alt+g and it even says so in the VM's window |
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| 15:21.44 | ratrace | window *title bar whatsitcalled thing |
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| 15:22.28 | gribouille | ok |
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| 16:12.12 | atlizz | good afternoon |
| 16:12.34 | Guest14928 | If anyone wants to know: ddrescue one 931,5 GB ntfs partition to another ntfs partition of exact the same size fails due to 744960 bytes of disk space. |
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| 16:31.26 | oxek | which package contains ddrescue in debian? |
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| 16:32.46 | castleguard | Does #!/usr/bin/python still point to python2 in debian? |
| 16:35.09 | oxek | castleguard: yes, and it is broken |
| 16:36.05 | somiaj | oxek: broken? |
| 16:36.12 | oxek | meaning it breaks stuff |
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| 16:36.37 | somiaj | castleguard: afiak /usr/bin/python is going to keep point to python2 for at least another release, and maybe a bit longer. |
| 16:36.52 | somiaj | it shouldn't break anything in debian, this has been a debian standard for years |
| 16:37.25 | oxek | things in debian should not point to /usr/bin/python if they need python2, they are supposed to point to /usr/bin/python2 |
| 16:37.36 | oxek | that's why e.g. chromium is no longer being updated in debian |
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| 16:39.11 | somiaj | oxek: that is incorrect, in debian /usr/bin/python points to python2, this is debian policy, and debian packages all update and honor this. |
| 16:39.31 | somiaj | If you really want to see broken make that point to python3 (see so many people update that link and break their debian system) |
| 16:40.34 | somiaj | looks like they updated the policy to say /usr/bin/python2 is prefered, but "Scripts requiring the default Python 2 version may instead specify the interpreter /usr/bin/python. " |
| 16:40.47 | oxek | somiaj: are you telling me that new packages are acceptable to use /usr/bin/python if they want python2? |
| 16:42.24 | somiaj | For buster that was the policy, I think it still is in bullseye, though you can't get new packgaes in debian that depend on python2 anymore. I suspect after one release of python2 being removed they may reconsider the policy, but I'm not finding any updates |
| 16:42.49 | somiaj | actually python2 packages are being removed, but due to this standard in debian, I don't think they are updating the link in bullseye. |
| 16:43.23 | oxek | I'm not talking about updating the link, that would be horrible, I am talking about using /usr/bin/python if you actually want /usr/bin/python2 |
| 16:43.35 | somiaj | https://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ch-python.html#s-interpreter_name |
| 16:44.31 | somiaj | "Python scripts may specify python as the interpreter name only if they do not require any particular version of Python. (Note: this means any python2 version) " -- yes, usring /usr/bin/python for python2 has been a standard in debian for years, and still is (I haven't seen any updates). I know with the removal of python2, this might be looked at again, so I'm not sure on that |
| 16:45.07 | oxek | I get that it's ok to use /usr/bin/python if your script works fine in both python2 & python3, that's reasonable |
| 16:45.17 | somiaj | that is not what the policy says |
| 16:45.29 | oxek | Python scripts may specify python as the interpreter name only if they do not require any particular version of Python. (Note: this means any python2 version) |
| 16:45.33 | somiaj | the policy says you can use /usr/bin/python is for any version of Pytnon2 |
| 16:45.45 | oxek | hmm, not how I interpreted it. |
| 16:46.14 | oxek | I thought it means any version of python2, not just 2.7, *and* any version of python3 |
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| 16:46.32 | johnjay | you cant specify python3 in a script? |
| 16:46.56 | somiaj | johnjay: yes you can #!/usr/bin/python3, and that is what is requird in debian if you want to use python3 |
| 16:47.02 | johnjay | oh ok. |
| 16:47.24 | johnjay | but debian defaults to py2 |
| 16:47.50 | somiaj | #!/usr/bin/python was used for python2, as the default, and due to this being debian policy, they have strongly stuck with it. In debian /usr/bin/python must point to python2. |
| 16:48.40 | aaro | i can confirm it still points to python2 in testing |
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| 16:49.41 | oxek | I'd be surprised if /usr/bin/python would *ever* point to anything else than python2. At best /usr/bin/python will be removed in the future. |
| 16:49.56 | somiaj | I suspect the release after bullseye they may consider moving it, though due to the issue it caused, maybe they will just get rid of it all toghter. |
| 16:50.03 | johnjay | i guess ubuntu the same. rip python3 |
| 16:50.21 | oxek | johnjay: why rip python3? |
| 16:50.27 | somiaj | johnjay: no, just use /usr/bin/python3 -- debian build scripts already do this if the package declares a python3 dependency |
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| 16:50.59 | johnjay | so just typing python would give an error? |
| 16:51.03 | oxek | yes |
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| 16:52.25 | dax | johnjay: ubuntu has python-is-python2 and python-is-python3 packages, which change /usr/bin/python accordingly. i have no idea which one's default |
| 16:52.37 | dax | (#ubuntu would, obviously, know more) |
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| 17:13.06 | johnjay | it's probably the former based on my system but just a guess. |
| 17:13.19 | johnjay | i guess the lesson is never update your language to a new version |
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| 17:19.59 | cluonbeam | johnjay: A better option for the shebang line is #/usr/bin/env python3 |
| 17:20.10 | cluonbeam | That way you're not hard-coding a path to the python interpreter, but you are specifying that it's python3. |
| 17:20.11 | johnjay | right |
| 17:20.29 | johnjay | i'm still not sure i understand env that well |
| 17:20.42 | johnjay | in the guile tutorial it tries to access HOSTNAME in env and it's not defined for me |
| 17:20.47 | johnjay | confused me a lot lol |
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| 17:47.01 | castleguard | Thanks for the discussion guys, appreciated. I come from arch and it's a little nasty to have it point the other way, though tbh I personally only write python3, I just ... was curious if that was maybe what was screwwing up my vim settings or whatever. |
| 17:47.09 | castleguard | Anyways, that's all the info I needed, thanks. :) |
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| 17:52.10 | somiaj | yea, this has caused a lot of confusion, and some people manually change the /usr/bin/python link and break their whole system. In short debian had too many python2 packages using /usr/bin/python, so they had to stick with this to ensure no breakage. Though now that python2 is being removed, the link being dead is probably best to avoid any future confusion |
| 17:54.31 | castleguard | My preference would have been to kill /usr/bin/python entirely :) |
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| 17:54.38 | castleguard | vs. changing it. |
| 17:54.46 | castleguard | but um, yeah I didn't get a vote. :) |
| 17:54.57 | castleguard | (didn't deserve one, so I'm not too butthurt over it) |
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| 17:55.01 | castleguard | take care guys. :) |
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| 18:10.41 | toogley | hey i noticed, my debian 10 machine cannot play MPEG4 files. i noticed that by using http://demo.nimius.net/video_test/ - all other video files work fine. i have installed libxvidcore4 which is the correct codec as far as i understand. my firefox version is Mozilla Firefox 68.12.0esr |
| 18:10.53 | toogley | what can i do? |
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| 18:11.16 | diogenes_ | toogley, you need ffmpeg from contrib non-free. |
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| 18:11.32 | diogenes_ | !codecs |
| 18:11.32 | dpkg | A codec (portmanteau of "compressor-decompressor") is a program or device used to encode/decode a data stream or signal. Ask me about <libavcodec>, <w32codecs>. |
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| 18:13.31 | toogley | diogenes_ what exactly do i need? ffmpeg i is what i have installed |
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| 18:18.03 | toogley | ah, is it libavcodec-extra58 what i need? |
| 18:18.21 | toogley | because that cant be installed because of dependencies |
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| 18:19.17 | greycat | I wouldn't expect firefox-esr to use an ffmpeg library...? But hell, I don't know much about this stuff. |
| 18:19.47 | greycat | That said, if you can't install it, something else is wrong, like you have external dmo pkgs or something. |
| 18:20.14 | toogley | i have sid packages built from source but that shouldn't be a problem |
| 18:20.17 | toogley | i guess |
| 18:20.18 | diogenes_ | toogley, that test on that page is not good, just grab an .mp4 video file from your PC and drag-and-drop it into Firefox and see if that plays. |
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| 18:22.18 | toogley | hm, when i download the http://demo.nimius.net/video_test/videos/test.avi file, i can play it in mplayer but when i open that with firefox, it asks me to open it in mplayer |
| 18:23.30 | diogenes_ | toogley, yep then you need non-free codecs. |
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| 18:41.23 | toogley | diogenes_ thanks |
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| 19:12.16 | Emil | Hey |
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| 19:12.55 | Emil | What's the difference between cd-including-firmware and images-including-firmware |
| 19:14.02 | greycat | images may include more than cd-sized ones...? |
| 19:18.18 | rwp | Emil, More detail please? Which images are you asking about? |
| 19:18.48 | greycat | !firmware images |
| 19:18.48 | dpkg | Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/current/amd64/iso-cd/ The images are "unofficial" because "official Debian" includes only 100% free software. |
| 19:19.20 | rwp | That answers that question then. :-) |
| 19:19.25 | greycat | sounds like they went to http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/ |
| 19:20.20 | greycat | near as I can tell, one of the "directories" presented by the web server is a symlink to the other, because they both have the same contents |
| 19:20.45 | rwp | I am of the opinion that distributable binary blobs are okay. |
| 19:20.49 | rwp | Completely different from not having source to non-free drivers. |
| 19:20.50 | rwp | Free drivers with full driver source is extremely critically important. |
| 19:20.56 | Emil | So there is no difference? |
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| 19:22.26 | Emil | And cd-including-firmware directory is actually the same as images-including-firmware? |
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| 19:23.51 | sney | at a guess, they used to be separate when we couldn't make an iso that also worked as a flash image. but the debian installer images have been hybrid for years, so they're the same. |
| 19:24.14 | greycat | the important word here is "guess", because none of us can see anything more than you can see |
| 19:24.15 | rwp | They do appear to be identical by timestamp looking at the directory listings. |
| 19:25.13 | rwp | I suggest not stressing further about it and simply picking one of them and moving forward with it. |
| 19:27.14 | Emil | Thanks |
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| 19:28.05 | oxek | how bad is the latest xorg vulnerability? |
| 19:28.49 | sney | how bad for what, and for whom? |
| 19:29.14 | oxek | for a home user that browses the web |
| 19:29.22 | sney | negligible |
| 19:29.35 | oxek | so I can put off upgrading for a few days? |
| 19:29.36 | greycat | said home user can just run apt-get update; apt-get upgrade |
| 19:29.49 | oxek | I can't reboot right now though |
| 19:30.01 | greycat | don't have to reboot; just log out and back in, or restart X |
| 19:30.13 | oxek | can't logout/login right now either |
| 19:30.19 | oxek | restarting X would probably break stuff too |
| 19:30.37 | rwp | The simple answer is simply don't upgrade for a bit then. |
| 19:30.45 | greycat | why? |
| 19:31.20 | oxek | greycat: why what? |
| 19:31.28 | greycat | why would you delay the upgrade? |
| 19:31.50 | oxek | because I can't reboot or logout right now? |
| 19:31.54 | oxek | I don't understand |
| 19:31.58 | rwp | If oxek doesn't want to take a security upgrade today, then simply don't do it. |
| 19:32.14 | greycat | Just install the new packages, and then do nothing. |
| 19:32.21 | greycat | There is no reason NOT to install the new packages. |
| 19:32.21 | oxek | and it is not the sort of vulnerability where if I go to some webpage I get hacked? |
| 19:32.41 | sney | nobody is going to hack your gibson on a personal machine on your private network. Install the package and schedule a reboot for later. |
| 19:32.47 | oxek | I think I get what greycat means, I can do the upgrade, but the older session will stay. |
| 19:32.51 | rwp | Sometimes that doesn't work very well. Firefox for example detects this and forces a restart. |
| 19:33.02 | greycat | Either you'll lose power and then you'll be on the new version of X when you start back up, or you'll eventually reach a time where it's convenient to restart. |
| 19:33.10 | rwp | Also in the old days kernel upgrades always rolled to a new version number. But now kernel upgrades are often in place. |
| 19:33.35 | rwp | I have had problems taking a kernel upgrade and then trying to load a new module which is now mismatched to the running kernel. |
| 19:33.36 | greycat | This is not a kernel upgrade. |
| 19:33.38 | sney | firefox is enormous and has to hit the disk pretty often during normal operation. xorg is not the same. you can upgrade the package and restart the process later, it's fine. |
| 19:33.44 | rwp | Particular a problem on suspend resume of a laptop. |
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| 19:35.39 | rwp | X is probably okay with having new files on disk. And most things are. I usually upgrade and then run 'needrestart -b' to see what is still running using older files. |
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| 19:38.08 | greycat | is there a judd trigger to cough up <https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2020-14347> from the CVE? took me a few google searches to find it. |
| 19:38.31 | greycat | the obvious security.debian.org/CVE-2020-14347 |
| 19:38.33 | greycat | did not work |
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| 20:10.04 | jelly | dpkg, cve lookup CVE-2020-14347 |
| 20:10.04 | dpkg | Information about the security advisory CVE-2020-14347 may be found at https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2020-14347 |
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| 20:20.33 | mutante | dpkg: help |
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| 20:23.16 | mutante | upsidedown greetings to Australia |
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| 20:25.30 | jelly | dpkg, listkeys CMD: |
| 20:25.32 | dpkg | Factoid search of 'CMD:' by key (14 of 970): #del# cmd: beavisslap (.*?) ;; #del# cmd: eurosmite (.*?) ;; CMD: assrape (.*?) ;; CMD: bofhsmite (.*?) ;; CMD: chair (.*?) ;; CMD: cheesesteak (.*?) ;; CMD: clue (.*?) ;; CMD: confort (.*?) ;; CMD: consummate (.*?) ;; CMD: fedex (.*?) to (.*?) ;; CMD: kick (.*?) ;; CMD: wb (.*?) ;; _default cmd: ttt (.*?) ;; cmd: coffee (.*?). |
| 20:26.09 | jelly | okay, there're a bit more of those than I expected, but one of them is CMD: cve lookup (.*?) |
| 20:26.23 | jelly | !chair mutante |
| 20:26.24 | dpkg | throws a 150kg armored electric chair at mutante |
| 20:26.30 | jelly | how rude. |
| 20:26.31 | greycat | dpkg forget cmd: assrape (.*?) |
| 20:26.32 | dpkg | greycat: i forgot cmd: assrape (.*?) |
| 20:26.41 | jelly | now I'm curious. |
| 20:26.46 | greycat | 16:26 =dpkg> "cmd: assrape (.*?)" is "($1): <action> ass rapes $1" |
| 20:27.01 | oxek | oh wow |
| 20:27.03 | greycat | no reason to keep that |
| 20:27.11 | jelly | yeah. a bit obvious |
| 20:27.13 | oxek | I look away for a moment, and this channel reverts to that |
| 20:27.42 | jelly | to what, factoid cleanup day? |
| 20:27.55 | mutante | what? i did none of that. all i wanted was the command to search for package names |
| 20:28.23 | mutante | and was curious how "upsidedown" looks after seeing it in help |
| 20:28.32 | oxek | don't worry, I'm not a special snowflake, it's just surprising what I see in this channel sometimes |
| 20:28.41 | jelly | dpkg, upsidedown how now |
| 20:29.08 | jelly | <dpkg> unfortunately, upsidedown is disabled in my configuration |
| 20:29.13 | mutante | gotcha |
| 20:29.45 | jelly | !confort oxek |
| 20:29.45 | dpkg | There, there, jelly. oxek will give a spelling checker for your birthday. |
| 20:29.59 | jelly | dpkg, listkeys comfort |
| 20:29.59 | oxek | :D |
| 20:30.00 | dpkg | Factoid search of 'comfort' by key (2): CMD: megacomfort (.*?) ;; CMD: comfort (.*?). |
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| 20:30.08 | mutante | dpkg, listkeys package |
| 20:30.09 | dpkg | Factoid search of 'package' by key (15 of 133): #debian package a deb ;; #debian packages ;; #debian-bots java-package ;; _default installed packages ;; build package ;; in what package #del# ;; kernel-package ;; metapackages ;; package management ;; package pool ;; package search ;; packagepool ;; pseudo-packages ;; sid packages on potato #del# ;; which package #del#. |
| 20:30.29 | *** join/#debian Trieste_ (~T@unaffiliated/trieste) |
| 20:30.36 | mutante | dpkg, package search nginx-full |
| 20:30.36 | dpkg | mutante: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox? |
| 20:30.59 | jelly | judd, names |
| 20:31.00 | judd | (names <pattern> [--arch <amd64>] [--release <stable>]) -- Search package names with * and ? as wildcards. The current stable release and amd64 are searched by default. |
| 20:31.05 | jelly | try that. |
| 20:31.07 | mutante | thank you |
| 20:31.19 | jelly | also, /msg judd list judd |
| 20:31.21 | mutante | judd: names nginx --release stable |
| 20:31.22 | judd | Search for nginx in buster/amd64: nginx 1.14.2-2+deb10u2 |
| 20:31.39 | jelly | also2, ircbots.debian.net |
| 20:31.52 | jelly | ,names nginx* |
| 20:32.22 | mutante | hmm.. what is the difference between nginx-full and nginx-light.. |
| 20:32.30 | judd | Search for nginx* in buster/amd64: nginx 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; nginx-common 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; nginx-doc 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; nginx-extras 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; nginx-full 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; nginx-light 1.14.2-2+deb10u2 |
| 20:32.54 | jelly | ,info nginx-light |
| 20:32.56 | judd | Package nginx-light (httpd, optional) in buster/amd64: nginx web/proxy server (basic version). Version: 1.14.2-2+deb10u2; Size: 467.1k; Installed: 1174k; Homepage: https://nginx.net |
| 20:32.59 | mutante | :) cool, that's the one i keep forgetting and always think it was "dpkg" because .. you know ..the name |
| 20:33.10 | jelly | also3, |
| 20:33.13 | jelly | !msg the bot |
| 20:33.13 | dpkg | Please have conversations with the bots in a private message as much as possible. Instead of using "!topic" or "!tell <your nick> about <topic>" in the channel, you can just "/msg dpkg topic". See <bot help> and http://wiki.debian.org/IRC/DpkgBot to learn more and browse my factoids on-line at http://ircbots.debian.net/ . Also ask me about <judd>, which is another bot and window into the Ultimate Debian Database. |
| 20:33.32 | jelly | but right now noone seems to be asking any questions |
| 20:33.54 | oxek | are there any other bots than dpkg and judd in here? |
| 20:34.04 | jelly | debhelper is a bot |
| 20:34.10 | mutante | there should be a bot command to list all bots |
| 20:34.28 | mutante | meta-bot joins :p |
| 20:34.28 | jelly | only those two are able and willing to speak |
| 20:34.39 | oxek | debhelper does not react to regular users though, does it? |
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| 20:35.05 | jelly | there's a second copy of dpkg db in dselect_ in case dpkg is sick |
| 20:35.13 | jelly | dselect_, what are you |
| 20:35.40 | jelly | huh, I guess that is not a factoid |
| 20:35.43 | jelly | dpkg, what are you |
| 20:35.43 | dpkg | I am an infobot. For more information, ask me about <infobot>. |
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| 20:36.19 | oxek | dselect_ answers if I /query it |
| 20:36.55 | jelly | oh, the channel is still +r and dselect_ probably did not identify in time |
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| 20:37.36 | mutante | now i know that "full" means "standard" and "light" means "basic" :) but apt-cache show tells me a bit more which modules are in it |
| 20:37.38 | jelly | there's 3-4 more useful bots that are allowed to be in here |
| 20:37.49 | oxek | I'm still surprised this channel has over 1000 users |
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| 20:38.14 | jelly | used to be 1600ish |
| 20:38.30 | mutante | 600 taken by slack ?:/ |
| 20:38.55 | greycat | taken by ubuntu, mx linux, whatever |
| 20:38.57 | jelly | there's a debian slack? News to me |
| 20:39.15 | metro | there's not |
| 20:39.44 | metro | there is a debian OFTC IRC which is official |
| 20:39.52 | jelly | yes. |
| 20:40.01 | metro | 700 ppl there now |
| 20:40.11 | jelly | there's a significant overlap in membership |
| 20:40.12 | oxek | oftc is blocking users though |
| 20:40.16 | metro | a debian slack is laughable |
| 20:40.26 | metro | you need to register to comment is all |
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| 20:40.37 | oxek | metro: I can't even connect to oftc |
| 20:40.46 | jelly | you need to register to talk in here _right now_ as well |
| 20:40.51 | metro | oxek::dunno: |
| 20:40.51 | greycat | I seem to recall oftc has some bizarre means of registering that involves going to a web page. |
| 20:40.56 | mtnman | heynow |
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| 20:43.01 | jelly | heynow,what'sthematter withyou,girlsjust wannahave funnow? |
| 20:43.08 | mtnman | how can i specify the location of a new window that is opened? |
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| 20:43.29 | greycat | most X clients let you specify -geometry +x+y |
| 20:43.29 | oxek | what sort of window? |
| 20:43.35 | jelly | some X11-based apps take a -geometry parameter |
| 20:43.44 | mtnman | greycat hello and thank you |
| 20:44.04 | greycat | e.g. xterm -geometry +500+0 |
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| 20:44.39 | jelly | other times, if you have a fancy window manager it can override size and placement of new windows based on window or app names or some other properties |
| 20:44.58 | greycat | fsvo "fancy" |
| 20:45.29 | jelly | but if you have a crappy wm like Gnome does, you can use devilspie |
| 20:45.35 | jelly | ,i devilspie |
| 20:45.36 | judd | Package devilspie (gnome, optional) in buster/amd64: find windows and perform actions on them. Version: 0.23-2+b1; Size: 51.1k; Installed: 229k; Homepage: http://burtonini.com/wordpress/tag/devilspie; O: #644202 |
| 20:45.49 | jelly | orphaned! aw |
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| 20:46.53 | jelly | and $DEITY knows what happens with wayland-native apps and windows |
| 20:47.34 | mutante | ,i goattracker |
| 20:47.35 | judd | Package goattracker (sound, optional) in buster/amd64: C64 music editor. Version: 2.74+dfsg1-1; Size: 381.0k; Installed: 981k; Homepage: https://cadaver.github.io/tools.html; Screenshot: https://screenshots.debian.net/package/goattracker |
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| 20:49.29 | jelly | you probably can't do a https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5bzqhp1Jqk with that tracker |
| 20:49.35 | jelly | hides |
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| 20:53.38 | mtnman | greycat: client does not support --geometry. |
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| 21:11.30 | karlpinc | mtnman: Only one - |
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| 21:22.23 | alexrelis[m] | Wanna know what would be a cool Debian feature? If a user was trying to install Debian Stable with newer hardware, the installer should prompt "It looks like you are using new hardware, do you want to enable backports and use a newer kernel?" |
| 21:23.40 | nvz | pushes a confused Steven Tyler into the channel |
| 21:23.53 | nvz | he's here to sing Dream On for you.. |
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| 21:24.46 | nvz | though I been thinkin the same thing in light of the fact they are shipping machines now with PCIe NVMe disks that dont even show up in the installer |
| 21:25.06 | nvz | so there is no concievable way to just upgrade the kernel later |
| 21:25.29 | nvz | for a brief time the testing installer was letting you choose which branch to install.. in expert mode, idk wtf they changed that |
| 21:25.50 | nvz | cause at least then you can use the testing installer with a newer kernel to see the damn disk, and then just install stable with it |
| 21:26.21 | alexrelis[m] | nvz: Two of my friends were trying to install Debian Stable and they just couldn't because it would send up to a CLI post install. At that point it is just best that they use Testing I guess. |
| 21:26.46 | sney | kmuto used to maintain an unofficial stable installer with the bpo kernel. it's probably more needed now that he doesn't do it anymore than when it actually was available |
| 21:27.35 | alexrelis[m] | I remember the expert had some option where you could choose which kernel you wanted to install, but idk if it's still there. I haven't had to install Debian in a long time. |
| 21:27.53 | nvz | you dont need anything extra or special if they just keep making the testing installer able to install stable easily |
| 21:28.04 | nvz | which at one point in time, when I tested it, it had done |
| 21:28.21 | ElDiabolo | Are there any alternatives to quilt when doing debuild patch management? |
| 21:28.23 | nvz | if you used expert mode when you went to setup repos, it would ask you if you wanted stable, testing, unstable |
| 21:28.38 | nvz | but since it was a testing installer, it had the newer kernel running already |
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| 21:30.49 | somiaj | alexrelis[m]: this is kinda a strange thing to detect, but doesn't the installer already ask if you want to enable backports (the expert mode does for me) |
| 21:31.03 | kingsley | The Problems Debian Is Facing In 2020 are summarized at... |
| 21:31.06 | kingsley | https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Debian-2020-Problems |
| 21:31.11 | oxek | can anything bad happen if I try to load a kernel module that is already loaded? For example, zram kernel module is loaded and I do 'modprobe zram' |
| 21:31.13 | somiaj | alexrelis[m]: though if their hardware is too new for the kernel (even using the text installer), there is no way the kernel on the installer is going to help install anyways. |
| 21:31.39 | alexrelis[m] | kingsley: Yeah I read that article and I was thinking about it and one of the things that could really help Debian is an easier installer. |
| 21:31.56 | somiaj | nvz: Are you confuing the netinstall with the pxe netboot, that still lets you choose what version of debian to install. |
| 21:32.08 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: Please feel free to elaborate. |
| 21:32.54 | ElDiabolo | Reason is that #749069 (quilt can't do permission patches) is around for 6 years. I found that quilt also can not do patches for the deletion of hidden files. So looking for alternatives seems reasonable. |
| 21:32.55 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/749069 in quilt (open): «quilt cannot preserve git created patches containing file permission changes»; severity: normal; opened: 2014-05-23; last modified: 2014-05-23. |
| 21:33.06 | alexrelis[m] | kingsley: I feel like Debian is the kind of distro that once you set things up, you are good to go and don't need to do much else. But earlier I was talking about how if a user who had new hardware was trying to install Debian Stable, they will most likely encounter a CLI session post-install. |
| 21:34.06 | alexrelis[m] | Maybe Debian shouldn't make a netinstaller for different update channels. Maybe the netinstaller should just be based off of Sid and you can opt to install either stable, testing, or unstable. |
| 21:34.14 | alexrelis[m] | Idk of course. |
| 21:34.18 | alexrelis[m] | Just spitballing ideas. |
| 21:34.28 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: Is my guess correct that Debian stable seems to not support new video cards? |
| 21:35.20 | alexrelis[m] | kingsley: Yes. But I was even having trouble getting my sister's laptop working with just an Intel card with integrated graphics. |
| 21:36.03 | somiaj | It really depends on the hardware, but often times it does work (though I do admit not automatically) |
| 21:37.09 | somiaj | and the stable instaler using a sid kernel is contary to what debian means by stable...If you really need this feature, use the netboot image |
| 21:37.17 | ElDiabolo | alexrelis[m], Ooops, integrated intel graphics usually work like a charm. I always prefered laptops having these. |
| 21:37.36 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: For what it's worth, I also remember having trouble installing a GUI desk top. The biggest difference? It was 24 years ago! |
| 21:37.51 | kingsley | Maybe the more things change, the more they stay the same. |
| 21:38.15 | alex11 | well, i can see the benefit of choosing to use the backports kernel |
| 21:38.20 | alex11 | if the installer offered that |
| 21:38.40 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: But yeah, after I got it working, admin was easier. |
| 21:38.40 | somiaj | ElDiabolo: if it is an optimus (intel+nvidia) or missing firmware it can still be an issue. |
| 21:39.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1151] by debhelper |
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| 21:39.38 | alexrelis[m] | kingsley: Yeah. Honestly, Debian is the best distro for "staying on it" without having to reinstall. It's the one many people settle on. |
| 21:42.17 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: On a related note, I settled into using a Franken Debian box. It's a mix of used hardware and packages upgraded piecemeal from unstable. To be fair, it stops booting maybe once about every 5 years, which I seem to recall was fixed by upgrading all packages to their latest versions in unstable. |
| 21:42.55 | alexrelis[m] | kingsley: Yikes. I try not to do that. |
| 21:44.31 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: Note that with used hardware and free software, the main downside is the time it takes me to fix it about once every 5 years. |
| 21:44.31 | ElDiabolo | n8 |
| 21:45.05 | kingsley | alexrelis[m]: And I'm OK with that. |
| 21:45.55 | somiaj | might just be easier to run testing and not 'mix' things as much. |
| 21:47.50 | alexrelis[m] | somiaj: Yeah. Run testing, and then go to stable when your testing release becomes the new stable. Usually the best way to go. |
| 21:47.54 | somiaj | If you really want the newer packages, just run testing or sid (and mixing sid packages in testing for bugfixes/security fixes is a commonly accepted thing to do). |
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| 21:48.28 | somiaj | The main reason we suggest stable to people who don't know debian is because if someone needs the support or isn't familar with how debian does things, might as well run a well tested stable system. |
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| 21:49.01 | tramplefoot | i just noticed that i have the "faq-debian" package, but "info debian"/"info faq-debian" doesn't seem to work. do i need to manually dwww the manpages? |
| 21:49.08 | somiaj | alexrelis[m]: or just track testing and enjoy the wild ride after the release, I ran sid for years, but as I had more work to do, I decided the "fun" of things always changing wasn't something I had time for anymore. |
| 21:49.43 | somiaj | tramplefoot: I see no package in debian named 'faq-debian' |
| 21:49.53 | somiaj | ,i faq-debian |
| 21:49.54 | judd | No package named 'faq-debian' was found in buster/amd64. |
| 21:50.14 | alexrelis[m] | somiaj: I feel the same way. |
| 21:50.30 | tramplefoot | ,i debian-faq |
| 21:50.32 | judd | Package debian-faq (doc, standard) in buster/amd64: Debian Frequently Asked Questions. Version: 9.0; Size: 683.0k; Installed: 1277k; Homepage: https://www.debian.org/doc/user-manuals#faq |
| 21:50.36 | tramplefoot | ^ |
| 21:51.15 | tramplefoot | it installs a bunch of info-formatted html files in the /usr/share/doc/debian/FAQ directory |
| 21:55.09 | somiaj | tramplefoot: stuff in /usr/share/doc/packagename isn't in the man or infopath, just go to that directory and load the files in a pager or in this case a webbrowser |
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| 21:57.17 | tramplefoot | alright |
| 21:57.26 | tramplefoot | so thats expected behaviour |
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| 22:04.51 | somiaj | tramplefoot: yea, all debian packages will put documtation in /usr/share/doc/packagename/ as files, and you can just go read it using your prefered tool |
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| 22:05.57 | phogg | Is there an easy way to get a list of all currently-installed packages for which there is no installation candidate from a repo? What would be reported by apt-cache policy as being from /var/lib/dpkg/status? |
| 22:06.09 | somiaj | phogg: aptitude search ~o |
| 22:06.15 | phogg | thanks |
| 22:06.35 | somiaj | we call those obsolete packages, and aptitude can search for them (the ~o is a shortcut for that) |
| 22:08.43 | phogg | What about if there are installation candidates, but not for the specific version currently installed? I'm trying to resolve a situation where I had packages from testing, but then dropped testing as a source. I'm trying to figure out which related deps remain. |
| 22:12.18 | mutante | for package in $(dpkg --get-selections | cut -d$'\t' -f1); do apt-cache policy $package; done | grep testing ? |
| 22:12.38 | phogg | sure, as a last resort |
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| 22:17.39 | somiaj | I think you can do this with aptitude as well, but it is more complicated |
| 22:17.59 | somiaj | I think dpkg even has a factoid on this, let me see if I can dig it up |
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| 22:20.17 | phogg | if not don't worry about it, I can always apply a little script-fu to the problem |
| 22:21.12 | somiaj | !not available |
| 22:21.12 | dpkg | To get a list of packages you have installed now, that are not available from any repository in your sources.list: aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))' |
| 22:21.29 | somiaj | I think that works, it compares the version in the archive to the current version |
| 22:23.18 | phogg | hmm nice, better than the shell monster I was contemplating |
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| 22:24.39 | somiaj | aptitude has super cow powers |
| 22:24.44 | phogg | it covers both older (out of date) packages e.g. from prior releases and too-new packages, but I can pretty easily filter from there. |
| 22:24.51 | phogg | you can tell by the mooing |
| 22:25.35 | phogg | it's too bad aptitude's search features aren't more widely known, they do solve a lot of problems |
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| 22:30.40 | oxek | anyone have a helpful way of remembering the order of files when I do 'ln -s /path/to/x /path/to/y' ? |
| 22:30.45 | oxek | I always forget |
| 22:31.24 | phogg | I think that's a universal constant |
| 22:32.32 | oxek | I forget which one is supposed to be the actual file, and which one is supposed to be the link to it. |
| 22:32.58 | oxek | phogg: is there some common pattern I am missing? |
| 22:33.07 | phogg | no, it's counter-intuitive for sure |
| 22:33.57 | oxek | every time I have to run 'ln', I have to open the manpage first... |
| 22:34.07 | phogg | the thing to remember is that the target (/path/to/x in your example) isn't a file (and doesn't even need to exist), it's a string. |
| 22:34.46 | oxek | and that would create a broken link if /path/to/x does not exist, right? |
| 22:34.50 | phogg | yes |
| 22:35.16 | phogg | the last arg (the link name) is the file that you create, it will point to whatever target |
| 22:35.39 | phogg | or if its a dir a file named after the basename of each target will be created in that dir pointing at the full target string |
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| 22:35.59 | oxek | I guess what confuses me about it is that usually TARGETs come at the end of a command |
| 22:36.19 | phogg | normally but in the case of ln it might ambiguous |
| 22:36.22 | oxek | hmm, 'ln' takes two targets I guess |
| 22:37.02 | phogg | it takes one target if the link name is a file, but if it is a dir then it allows more than one (up to arg max) |
| 22:37.32 | oxek | I meant it targets both the file and the symlink |
| 22:38.05 | phogg | be clear "target" is the string the symlink points at (this is how it is described in the man page). It is never the symlink file itself. |
| 22:38.27 | oxek | you're right, I'm just confused |
| 22:38.38 | oxek | thank you |
| 22:38.55 | phogg | confusion about ln argument order is normal |
| 22:39.05 | phogg | I know it pretty well but will still sometimes call it backwards |
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| 23:04.56 | phogg | somiaj: this gets me what I was looking for: aptitude search -F '%p %v %V %O' '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))' | while IFS=' ' read -r pkg ver candidate origin; do if [[ $ver == "$candidate" ]] && [[ $origin == '(installed locally)' ]]; then echo "$pkg"; fi; done |
| 23:05.26 | phogg | I couldn't see how to get aptitude search to do the ?version(CURRENT) equal to ?version(TARGET) itself, but there might be a way |
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| 23:26.22 | somiaj | phogg: the docs are decent, but I still have trouble with it |
| 23:26.56 | somiaj | phogg: https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/aptitude/ch02s04s05.en.html -- did you find that |
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| 23:27.34 | somiaj | and if you really want to get funky, these also work with install/remove and aptitude, so you can script a lot of stuff (though it can also be dangerous, outside of using search I avoid wildcard installs with aptitude) |
| 23:28.08 | somiaj | the only one I often use is aptitude remove ~o (on systems I'm 100% stable) and there isn't anything in aptitude search ~o I want to keep, simplifies typing out all the package names |
| 23:32.12 | somiaj | hmm, i'm not seeing any way to do equal either. |
| 23:35.13 | somiaj | There might be a way with ?= (variable), but unsure |
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| 23:39.13 | tramplefoot | xfce4-weather-plugin on buster doesn't work anymore because the weather data provider met.no has changed their api again. the testing package doesn't seem to have this problem, but i don't want to mix testing and stable packages together. i want to create a private backport, but how possible is backporting when the main dependency issue is libc? |
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| 23:42.29 | somiaj | ,check-backport xfce4-weather-plugin |
| 23:42.30 | judd | Backporting package xfce4-weather-plugin in sidâbuster/amd64: unsatisfiable build dependencies: Build-Depends: debhelper-compat (= 11). |
| 23:42.38 | somiaj | !ssb |
| 23:42.38 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
| 23:43.21 | somiaj | Provided the package is mostly standalone, I think a backport from testing would be fine, debhelper-compat is in backports, so you should be able to build it on stable just fine. |
| 23:43.29 | somiaj | ,v xfce4-weather-plugin |
| 23:43.30 | judd | Package: xfce4-weather-plugin on amd64 -- jessie: 0.8.3-3; stretch: 0.8.9-1; buster: 0.8.10-1; bullseye: 0.10.1-1+b1; sid: 0.10.1-1+b1 |
| 23:43.41 | tramplefoot | sweet |
| 23:44.41 | alex11 | also, report the bug |
| 23:44.49 | alex11 | it might get fixed in the next point release |
| 23:48.29 | tramplefoot | looks like it was already reported by some other fellow just today |
| 23:54.45 | dvs | YOU! |
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| 23:58.22 | Heart_And_Chops | where are usb devices in debian? i see nothing mentioning the work 'usb' in /dev/ what am i missing here. |
| 23:59.21 | zamnedix | Heart_And_Chops: /dev/usb is only for HID devices. most usb devices dont have a path in the filesystem |
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