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| 04:37.32 | *** topic/#debian is Current Debian release is buster, 10.6 point release /msg dpkg 10.6; /msg dpkg buster; /msg dpkg stretch->buster; /msg dpkg apt suite changed | Stretch has limited LTS support: /msg dpkg stretch-lts ; /msg dpkg 9.13 | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net | chanlogs: /msg dpkg irclog |
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| 04:59.39 | qman__ | you can tweak those settings and they may help keep the conneciton alive, but it can break for any number of reasons anyway |
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| 05:00.21 | qman__ | if you're trying to keep an active command running, run it inside of screen or tmux, so when it does disconnect, you can reattach to it, the command will not be interrupted and keep going while you're disconnected |
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| 05:17.00 | themill | (autossh + screen ftw) |
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| 05:18.03 | PaddyF | yeah, good idea with tmux. thanks qman__ |
| 05:18.04 | mtlsw | ssh+tmux! |
| 05:18.16 | mtlsw | PaddyF, you beat me to it! |
| 05:18.20 | PaddyF | :) |
| 05:18.25 | mtlsw | >:| |
| 05:19.04 | mtlsw | anyone hear about that new MS blog came out a week ago about having full 'ext4' support on WSL2. |
| 05:19.20 | mtlsw | largely we don't care, but I thought that can attract some of them migrators tehehehe |
| 05:20.40 | PaddyF | or when you are stuck with a game that runs better on windows |
| 05:22.29 | PaddyF | dangit, i forgot that i cant delete my posts on irc |
| 05:24.03 | mtlsw | PaddyF_, wait we are on irc? :o |
| 05:24.10 | mtlsw | PaddyF_, dang! |
| 05:24.35 | PaddyF_ | you maybe not. maybe you use a crypto tool and an irc bridge :) |
| 05:26.56 | mtlsw | PaddyF_, lol -- I'm not crazy about irc encryption |
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| 06:03.30 | jelly | dpkg, tell Enissay about snapshot |
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| 06:06.28 | mtlsw | PaddyF_, how's your tinder-irc chat going? XD |
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| 06:12.08 | PaddyF_ | hehe |
| 06:12.20 | PaddyF_ | no disclosure planned yet |
| 06:13.35 | mtlsw | PaddyF_, still fishin' for herrings huh |
| 06:13.43 | mtlsw | smiles :) |
| 06:13.49 | PaddyF_ | :P |
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| 08:49.38 | netcrash | Hello, using logrotate if I specify rotate 12 monthly will it rotate 12 times per month or rotate during 12 months |
| 08:49.41 | netcrash | ? |
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| 08:50.39 | PaddyF | the man page should enlighten you |
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| 08:58.13 | msn | I am trying to preseed an arm device with buster What i am trying is use a 32GB SD card and leave some space empty at the end. Currently it gets stuck at partitioning since the last partition exists but is not used/formatted/mounted. Any suggestions? |
| 08:58.26 | msn | my preseed http://paste.debian.net/1167064/ |
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| 08:59.59 | msn | basically its ignoring partman-basicfilesystems/no_mount_point options |
| 09:01.10 | netcrash | PaddyF: should... |
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| 09:03.03 | Haohmaru | netcrash what's the name of the parameter you're specifying? |
| 09:03.10 | jelly | netcrash, "rotate 12" is one setting, "monthly" is another |
| 09:03.21 | benjam2000 | For redirection whats the differenct between "2>&1" and "2>1" ? |
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| 09:04.15 | jelly | netcrash, "monthly" defines frequency (once a month), "rotate ..." defines retention (keep 12 old copies) |
| 09:05.51 | jelly | benjam2000, 2> part redirects fd2, stderr. 2>1 will redirect it to file named "1" |
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| 09:07.05 | jelly | benjam2000, useful links to read on: https://mywiki.wooledge.org/Redirection |
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| 09:08.32 | jelly | benjam2000, compare "Output Redirection" and "Duplicating File Descriptor" on the first linked page https://wiki.bash-hackers.org/howto/redirection_tutorial |
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| 09:13.31 | benjam2000 | @jelly, thanks. |
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| 09:26.00 | netcrash | jelly: thank you |
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| 09:35.59 | T_Brown92 | Could someone please send me a link on how to change the time in Debian 10 Gnome... Thanks :) |
| 09:36.28 | T_Brown92 | Would Like to Change it to Eastern Time Zone |
| 09:36.54 | *** join/#debian MikeDebian (~none@2001:8a0:759e:ed00::9982) |
| 09:38.00 | jelly | !tz |
| 09:38.00 | dpkg | A time zone is the standard time (aka local time) in a particular region. To change the timezone on Debian systems, execute "dpkg-reconfigure tzdata". Alternatively: "cp -b /usr/share/zoneinfo/$TZ /etc/localtime". Note that tzselect(1) does not change the timezone. Postfix users: execute "service postfix restart" to update localtime in the chroot. |
| 09:39.19 | ansimita | T_Brown92: Settings > Details > Date & Time > Time Zone |
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| 09:41.16 | T_Brown92 | dpkg: Thanks For Your Complex Help LMAO Sorry I had to go with | ansimita: That was a little more simpler Thanks A lot :) |
| 09:41.16 | dpkg | my pleasure, T_Brown92 |
| 09:41.35 | T_Brown92 | dpkg: Are you a wizard? |
| 09:41.36 | dpkg | T_Brown92: KCI error, or a problem with the Keyboard-Chair Interface. |
| 09:41.51 | shtrb | T_Brown92, dpkg is a very good bot |
| 09:42.00 | jelly | dpkg, what are you |
| 09:42.00 | dpkg | I am an infobot. For more information, ask me about <infobot>. |
| 09:42.21 | T_Brown92 | shtrb : Jesus Christ I Thought He Was Looking At What I Was Typing LMAO |
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| 09:43.23 | shtrb | T_Brown92, bots are becoming better and better everyday. some even work in support |
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| 09:44.10 | T_Brown92 | dpkg : Off-Topic IRC |
| 09:44.10 | dpkg | T_Brown92: parse error: dunno what the heck you're talking about |
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| 09:44.34 | shtrb | T_Brown92, you have #debian-offtopic if you like |
| 09:44.39 | gBlob | hey guys if i want to use a debian package on another iteration/distro is that an easy task (build from source if no ports in host os package repos) |
| 09:44.59 | gBlob | not debian based in this case am using manjaro |
| 09:45.24 | T_Brown92 | shtrb : Thanks |
| 09:45.27 | gBlob | the package in question is lshw |
| 09:46.07 | shtrb | gBlob, it depends what you intend to do , AFAIK majarno is arch based and has a different build system , so I don't know how the deb package will help you out |
| 09:46.13 | jelly | gBlob, build it from source, sure |
| 09:46.31 | gBlob | oops make |
| 09:47.01 | jelly | but lshw is a well known tool, it's unusual your (source-based?) distro does not have it already |
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| 09:47.27 | gBlob | rofl shtrb thanks man |
| 09:47.41 | jelly | maybe ask the manjaro people first, and help them include it properly if it's absent? |
| 09:47.54 | gBlob | i think not |
| 09:48.24 | gBlob | no its not here by default just installed last night |
| 09:48.48 | jelly | lots of things are not there in Debian by DEFAULT |
| 09:49.01 | gBlob | will ask got mixed up must of been using ubuntu or raspian or something and assumed its always been on manjaro too |
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| 09:49.04 | jelly | but you can install them later |
| 09:49.38 | gBlob | yes true jelly =) ty |
| 09:49.38 | jelly | gBlob, https://discover.manjaro.org/applications/lshw |
| 09:49.53 | jelly | this implies it should be installable |
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| 09:50.41 | jelly | perhaps. The page seems to have incomplete command lines. |
| 09:51.08 | jelly | so, ask in #manjaro I guess |
| 09:51.17 | Haohmaru | jelly it says "discover.manjaro" maybe it's supposed to be exciting and full of mysteries |
| 09:51.30 | gBlob | thanks jelly rofl |
| 09:51.51 | gBlob | falls off chair |
| 09:52.30 | shtrb | gives gBlob a stable chair which is running debian buster |
| 09:52.36 | gBlob | iv used it alot on my boxes, just not noticed it not being on manjaro before today |
| 09:52.52 | gBlob | rolf loves it |
| 09:53.16 | gBlob | gives debian the props it deseves |
| 09:53.21 | Matrox | is there an easy way to make a cron script that will automatically do apt-get dist-upgrade (with dpkg --force-oldconf) |
| 09:53.22 | gBlob | deserves |
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| 09:53.32 | Matrox | or shouldnt i do dist-upgrade but upgrade only |
| 09:53.50 | shtrb | Matrox, why would you like to do so ? you have unattended-upgrades already |
| 09:54.08 | Matrox | shtrb, how do i have unattended-upgrades? |
| 09:54.39 | shtrb | Matrox, https://wiki.debian.org/UnattendedUpgrades |
| 09:55.28 | shtrb | Matrox, but why would you like to have such an action ? |
| 09:56.32 | Matrox | shtrb, i have set up an xmpp server, and i want it to do dist-upgrade (or upgrade if its safer) daily for security. |
| 09:56.47 | Matrox | without me having to ssh login and do that |
| 09:56.49 | genr8_ | dpkg, Off-Topic IRC is located at #debian-offtopic |
| 09:56.49 | dpkg | genr8_: okay |
| 09:57.04 | genr8_ | dpkg : Off-Topic IRC? |
| 09:57.04 | dpkg | well, off-topic irc is located at #debian-offtopic |
| 09:57.39 | genr8_ | and there you have it boys, the bot just leveled up |
| 09:57.53 | shtrb | dpkg, secret Off-Topic channel is located at ##debian-offtopic |
| 09:57.53 | dpkg | okay, shtrb |
| 09:58.12 | shtrb | lol I was banned :D |
| 09:59.15 | gBlob | apt vs apt-get is the later old and not used/only used for specific tasks;apt can do most frequently needed updating and installation of packages and dependencies? im confused as to what is the case please explain to me |
| 09:59.15 | apt | in a one on one showdown, is the later old and not used/only used for specific tasks;apt can do most frequently needed updating and installation of packages and dependencies? im confused as to what is the case please explain to me wins. |
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| 09:59.36 | gBlob | please |
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| 09:59.49 | Matrox | apt-get is for scripts mainly |
| 10:00.25 | Matrox | apt-get, apt-file, apt-cache etc have much more functionality but you want use it. just use apt |
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| 10:00.58 | genr8_ | doesnt matter much, its all based on the same thing |
| 10:01.03 | gBlob | ty |
| 10:01.27 | ksk | !apt |
| 10:01.27 | dpkg | Advanced Packaging Tool (APT) is a package management system used by Debian and its derivatives. APT is a C++ library of functions that are used by several command line programs for dealing with packages, notably apt-get, apt-cache, and aptitude and, from Debian 8 "Jessie" onwards, apt. See also <aptitude> <apt-get>, <apt-cache>, <apt myths>. |
| 10:01.48 | ksk | okay, not really what I wanted. Endusers should just use "apt" :) |
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| 10:02.05 | gBlob | part of the same mothership: lols thanks for that anyway |
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| 10:02.20 | Matrox | shtrb, in your link i see: Automatic call via /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades or Automatic call via /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/02periodic . should i use one or the other? |
| 10:04.58 | genr8_ | one is the parent of the other, i believe |
| 10:07.35 | genr8_ | you could also just put DPkg::Options::="--force-confold" into any file in there and have it take effect for everything |
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| 10:09.19 | genr8_ | another relevant place would be : /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/70debconf that says: // Pre-configure all packages with debconf before they are installed. // If you don't like it, comment it out. |
| 10:10.25 | genr8_ | since its already talking about dpkg and confs, might as well pick that one. |
| 10:10.41 | Matrox | so if i comment out debconf, basically i always keep my old configs |
| 10:11.08 | genr8_ | yes but it may have other impacts besides just config files so im not sure |
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| 10:12.19 | Matrox | alright also, in case of unattended-upgrades, is a simple upgrade safer than dist-upgrade? afaik dist-upgrade does what upgrade does but also installs new packages, and also removes packages. |
| 10:13.03 | ksk | Yes, indeed. People in here do not recommend unattended-upgrades, though. Why not just run apticron and let the box mail you if there are updates available? |
| 10:13.05 | genr8_ | yea |
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| 10:13.47 | genr8_ | dist-upgrade is usually fine though unless you start doing weird things |
| 10:15.03 | Matrox | ksk, i dont see what might break with unattended-upgrades |
| 10:15.39 | Matrox | but i have an ansible config setup, so even if something breaks i cant redeploy the system fast |
| 10:16.38 | genr8_ | probably why it was invented honestly, might as well use it |
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| 10:18.48 | ksk | Its not a sane thig to do in an enterprise environment, that one is for sure. |
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| 10:19.19 | ksk | but if you do not test software updates, why not use unattended-upgrades, granted. |
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| 10:26.42 | genr8_ | I just found out about 'cat /proc/net/nf_conntrack' and 'apt-get install conntrack' It enables them to view and manage the in-kernel connection tracking state table. Once installed, conntrack allows you to update network flows without adding a new iptables rule, e.g. update the conntrack mark |
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| 10:28.40 | genr8_ | also 'apt install iptstate' A top-like interface to your netfilter connection-tracking table |
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| 10:33.26 | Matrox | if i do apt-get purge openssh-server |
| 10:33.33 | Matrox | does this kill the process in ram? |
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| 10:38.29 | jelly | Matrox, it should stop the service but not kill established connections |
| 10:38.44 | Matrox | alright i hope so |
| 10:38.57 | jelly | why do you want to purge it? |
| 10:41.21 | Matrox | i modified openssh-server and bumped version to 9.9.9 so it doesnt get overwritten. now i want to downgrade to the official debian version |
| 10:41.38 | Matrox | but i will use this instead: apt-get install openssh-server=1:7.9p1-10+deb10u2 |
| 10:42.15 | Matrox | so i dont have to remove anything |
| 10:43.08 | Matrox | by the way, is there way to see the remote version of openssh? when i do apt-cache search openssh-server it shows only my version because it has the highest version |
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| 10:43.44 | ksk | apt-cache would show you one version per repo, no? |
| 10:43.48 | genr8_ | apt list -a openssh-server |
| 10:43.57 | genr8_ | or apt policy openssh-server |
| 10:44.10 | ksk | and I believe sshd does send a version identification string, so yes, you can detect remote end version. |
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| 10:44.43 | genr8_ | it sends whats compiled in, not the debian package |
| 10:45.02 | jelly | Matrox, what purpose does that serve? <Matrox> i modified openssh-server and bumped version to 9.9.9 |
| 10:45.57 | genr8_ | he didnt want it messed with on upgrades, and thought that was how to do it |
| 10:46.12 | jelly | WHY did he not want it messed on upgrades |
| 10:46.28 | genr8_ | cause HE messed with it himself :P |
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| 10:46.38 | Matrox | well i know i can also put a package on hold |
| 10:47.08 | Matrox | i modified it to check the headers that it sends. removed package-versioning.patch debian-banner.patch and changed version.h |
| 10:47.35 | Matrox | it works but its safer to upgrade regularly instead of obfuscating the ssh header |
| 10:48.52 | genr8_ | debian is taking care of ssh for us, a fix would be out within a day if a bug was found |
| 10:50.00 | genr8_ | the old version 7.9 header is not worth freaking out over |
| 10:50.03 | jelly | Matrox, what was the idea behind all that? |
| 10:50.44 | jelly | you're doing something very unusual, so you probably should have very unusual requirements to do it |
| 10:51.07 | Matrox | nothing just giving less info. an nmap scan shows this: 22/tcp open ssh OpenSSH 7.9p1 Debian 10+deb10u2 (protocol 2.0) |
| 10:51.33 | jelly | maybe don't allow 22/tcp from anywhere, instead |
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| 10:51.43 | genr8_ | theres ways to deal with that, port knocking, not allowing password logins, whitelisting IPs |
| 10:52.03 | jelly | not allowing password logins won't affect the ssh protocol banner |
| 10:52.11 | Matrox | the openssh 7.9p1 part is from upstream (it can be removed according to the docs, the SSH 2.0 part is mandantory only) and debian also adds an extra banner showing package version and effectively OS and OS release |
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| 10:52.36 | Matrox | but i will just use DebianBanner no in sshd_config to hide the debian part, and leave only the openssh 7.9p1 part |
| 10:53.06 | jelly | good |
| 10:53.26 | genr8_ | thats arguably worse ;p then someone will think its an OLD 7.9 and try to attack in, vs a fixed debian 7.9 |
| 10:53.29 | Matrox | i have already enabled passwordless logins with gpg keys only. but didnt want to give extra info. it works fine. but i have to sacrifice regular openssh updates, because i have to modify every package to do that |
| 10:54.21 | jelly | weigh the risks of not updating sshd in time vs exposing a banner |
| 10:54.57 | jelly | esp. given that Banner and DebianBanner options exist. |
| 10:55.11 | Matrox | yeah its better to upgrade regularly. also there is this debian-banner.patch that allows an option in the config to hide the debian part |
| 10:55.22 | Matrox | the Banner only option i am not sure what it does |
| 10:55.27 | jelly | !tias |
| 10:55.27 | dpkg | TIAS is "Try It And See". |
| 10:55.59 | genr8_ | its like a MOTD kind of banner, not the ID string |
| 10:56.41 | Matrox | by default no banner is displayed according to the manpage. so its something else |
| 10:57.50 | genr8_ | you know all that spam you get when you log into a terminal ? it would be that kind of banner but for pre-auth SSH. |
| 10:59.18 | genr8_ | kinda confusing to mean 2 different things i guess |
| 10:59.59 | jelly | and then there's a VersionAddendum which sounds VERY similar to DebianBanner |
| 11:00.33 | genr8_ | The default is none. |
| 11:01.16 | Matrox | with "DebianBanner no" this is displayed only: 22/tcp open ssh OpenSSH 7.9p1 (protocol 2.0) |
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| 11:02.11 | Matrox | according to the ssh docs, the OpenSSH 7.9p1 part can help with compatibility with some clients |
| 11:02.23 | Matrox | but is not strictly mandatory |
| 11:03.37 | jelly | sftp will lose eg. "df" output if you hide it or make it low enough |
| 11:04.03 | jelly | go sshfs to an old server to see what happens |
| 11:04.14 | Matrox | i dont use sftp |
| 11:04.23 | hmuller | Matrox, if obfuscation is your objective you might consider changing ssh port to nonstandard also |
| 11:04.47 | Matrox | hmuller, yeah thats a good idea. although nmap can scan all the port range pretty fast |
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| 11:05.34 | genr8_ | its better if its not a default or common number, you will stay off the bots radar for longer, unless they're already onto you. then they will scan you deeper. thats my belief anyway |
| 11:05.44 | hmuller | ^^^ |
| 11:06.27 | Matrox | i get scanned every second with a dictionary attack, i see countless attempts to login with things like nginx user, admin, debian, etc |
| 11:06.45 | Matrox | i cant even read journalctl anymore, its full of these messages |
| 11:06.55 | hmuller | another reason to use a nonstandard port |
| 11:06.57 | Matrox | (ssh attempted logins) |
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| 11:07.19 | gBlob | Matrox, what tells you that you're being scanned(what os program using) |
| 11:07.37 | Matrox | gBlob, i mean i just look at journalctl for the sshd messages |
| 11:07.43 | gBlob | okay |
| 11:08.21 | genr8_ | you should also start banning them with fail2ban |
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| 11:08.37 | Matrox | will look into that. sounds good |
| 11:09.24 | genr8_ | someone needs to make a comprehensive SSH survival guide |
| 11:09.32 | hmuller | I would read that |
| 11:09.48 | Matrox | by the way for system stability is it advised to do only apt-get upgrade, or apt-get dist-upgrade? i had issues before many years with dist-upgrade (although i did an autoremove as well which is what probably ruined the system) |
| 11:10.40 | jelly | Matrox, the latter is required every now and then |
| 11:10.53 | jelly | so you might as well do it all the time |
| 11:11.01 | gBlob | what does your string look like Matrox sudo journal -u ssh.service ? |
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| 11:11.42 | jelly | Matrox, fail2ban will reduce the amount of new connections to a publicly exposed 22/tcp |
| 11:11.57 | gBlob | sshd |
| 11:12.31 | Matrox | gBlob, that lists all the sshd logs of attemped logins |
| 11:12.48 | jelly | it's ssh.service on debian |
| 11:13.05 | gBlob | ty both |
| 11:13.59 | Matrox | i dont see any string in the journal, only attempts to login |
| 11:14.51 | genr8_ | shouldnt we invent a meta-package for this: "E: Unable to locate package sshd" <- so it points to openssh-server like "ssh" does now ? |
| 11:15.12 | genr8_ | it doesnt make a whole lot of sense that the sshd is not actually a d |
| 11:15.21 | Matrox | what port should i use for ssh? just pick on randomly? |
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| 11:15.46 | hmuller | that's what I did |
| 11:15.58 | hmuller | used the random function of my calculator |
| 11:16.11 | genr8_ | when humans try to pick random numbers they tend to be bad, because they also want to remember them, so theres kind of an art to it |
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| 11:17.23 | Matrox | total number of ports: 65535. Each registered port is in the range 1024â49151. Ports with numbers lower than those of the registered ports are called well known ports; port with numbers greater than those of the registered ports are called dynamic and/or private ports. |
| 11:17.35 | genr8_ | indeed |
| 11:17.44 | genr8_ | pick a 4 or 5 digit one between said range |
| 11:17.45 | Matrox | maybe a port number higher than 49151 is less likely to be scanned by bots |
| 11:18.15 | genr8_ | sure, maybe try that |
| 11:18.45 | ksk | IT might also lead to "people with strange network equipment" not being able to reach your Serice. I do remember a friend not being able to reach my server which IP ended in ".255" - that has to be a broadcast-address, after all! |
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| 11:19.43 | genr8_ | its also more obvious if you consider the range to scan is only 16,000 above that number and 48,000 below it |
| 11:19.53 | genr8_ | who knows what these bots think. |
| 11:20.46 | Matrox | most scan utilities, first go for the well known ports, and optionally for the rest |
| 11:21.00 | genr8_ | yes, that much we know |
| 11:21.25 | Matrox | i think bots try to get the low hanging fruit. ports 1-1024 and dictionary with most common usernames/passwords from rockyou.txt |
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| 11:23.30 | genr8_ | yeah. but I also think theyve gotten more advanced and try as much extra stuff as they have the resources for. |
| 11:23.31 | Matrox | and maybe notify the hacker if they detected a known vulnerable version of openssh. they can get a list of servers from shodan.io and just scan them en masse with those in mind |
| 11:23.43 | genr8_ | right |
| 11:23.46 | genr8_ | that happens for sure |
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| 11:24.26 | Matrox | lets hope openbsd paranoia keeps openssh not vulnerable |
| 11:24.41 | genr8_ | indeed |
| 11:26.12 | genr8_ | theres also deeper stuff to know about SSH that people dont agree on, such as what type of algorithms and ciphers to use or not use |
| 11:27.13 | genr8_ | they're not just scanning for passwords |
| 11:28.39 | genr8_ | staying ahead of the skript kiddies is just step 1. |
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| 11:38.10 | ksk | Im inclined to believe that the chipers coming with Debian sshd are fine ;) |
| 11:38.47 | genr8_ | they're meh |
| 11:39.59 | genr8_ | I'll link this again https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/ , this package is in bullseye but our buster version is too old. so you have to get it from python pip. |
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| 11:41.37 | genr8_ | it recommends a few things you can disable, when you dont need backwards compatibility with outdated things |
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| 11:46.42 | ksk | thx, will take a look and judge you later :P |
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| 11:49.52 | genr8_ | the author is way smarter than me, and within reach of communication, ive talked to him. it can be improved with pull requests or feedback |
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| 12:08.10 | Matrox | whats annoying is that when there is a kernel upgrade (even one patching a security vulnerability) i have to reboot for it to be applied |
| 12:08.53 | genr8_ | theres supposedly a live patching feature in the kernel itself to upgrade itself but ive not investigated how thats supposed to work. |
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| 12:09.59 | willow_ | i'm trying to compile a list of daemons|components|features that can/should be disabled in a guest vm. for example things like power management, bluetooth, etc. any recommendations? |
| 12:10.05 | genr8_ | CONFIG_HAVE_LIVEPATCH=y CONFIG_LIVEPATCH=y |
| 12:10.47 | genr8_ | yes good question. Cups. Avahi. RFkill. (off the top of my head) |
| 12:10.55 | willow_ | ty |
| 12:11.46 | genr8_ | i was gonna make a list myself with a fresh install, but I never made one, i just disabled things on my own slowly over time then forgot |
| 12:12.52 | willow_ | any info will help. including if there is a special kernel or other features that are recommended |
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| 12:14.01 | genr8_ | rtkit-daemon (realtime pulseaudio scheduler) , wpa_supplicant |
| 12:14.56 | willow_ | right. i would completely remove networkmanager and connman and use netplan |
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| 12:15.35 | genr8_ | yep. I think thats all I can remember |
| 12:15.52 | willow_ | what about any cron-related activities? |
| 12:16.10 | genr8_ | unattended-upgrades ? |
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| 12:17.19 | Matrox | genr8_, live patching? some sort of editing the binary in ram? like you would with a hexeditor? |
| 12:17.32 | Matrox | you certainly cant reload stuff, the kernel isnt modular |
| 12:17.48 | genr8_ | i think it re-loads its entire self. |
| 12:17.54 | genr8_ | using some kind of kexec jump |
| 12:18.05 | jelly | genr8_, live patching requires support from kernel vendor. Debian does not provide that support. (Canonical with their derivative distro does, but I don't know if it's free or paid service) |
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| 12:18.10 | Matrox | oh thats nice, will look into it |
| 12:18.17 | genr8_ | jelly, those options are enabled in our kernel |
| 12:19.39 | willow_ | vmware recommends the "clock=pmtmr divider=10" kernel option for linux guest VMs |
| 12:19.51 | jelly | willow_, linux-image-cloud-amd64 kernel flavor is a little lighter than the default one and seems to work on kvm and esxi |
| 12:19.56 | genr8_ | ive not heard of that one |
| 12:20.13 | jelly | willow_, which vmware? |
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| 12:20.28 | jelly | I mean, for which product? esxi? workstation? player? |
| 12:20.30 | willow_ | jelly: this is the doc: https://www.vmware.com/content/dam/digitalmarketing/vmware/en/pdf/techpaper/linux_install_config.pdf |
| 12:20.52 | willow_ | actually it's from 2008 so looks way out of date |
| 12:20.56 | genr8_ | kinda old |
| 12:21.18 | willow_ | yes 2.6 kernel is OLD |
| 12:21.42 | jelly | willow_, do not follow the advice there, thye mention VMI which has been deprecated since like esxi 5.0 |
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| 12:21.52 | willow_ | i'm not using vmware btw. will be using lxc/kvm |
| 12:22.04 | genr8_ | then yeah, try the cloud kernel |
| 12:22.07 | ForgeAus | I think I'm using stretch but many packages give either the annoying error that no package provides python3:any >= 3.3.2-2~ or perl:any |
| 12:22.59 | genr8_ | ForgeAus, paste the result of "apt policy" |
| 12:23.04 | jelly | !bat |
| 12:23.04 | dpkg | [Basic Apt* Troubleshooting]. To diagnose your problem, we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use https://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>. |
| 12:23.07 | jelly | ForgeAus, ^ |
| 12:23.11 | willow_ | what about acpid? |
| 12:23.22 | jelly | willow_, what about it? |
| 12:23.30 | genr8_ | normal should be ok |
| 12:23.44 | willow_ | jelly: remove it in the guest VM? |
| 12:24.05 | ForgeAus | genr8 I don't want to flood... |
| 12:24.15 | genr8_ | !paste |
| 12:24.15 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: https://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: https://imgbb.com/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): https://filebin.net or https://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <termbin>. |
| 12:24.21 | jelly | ForgeAus, read what dpkg bot said above, carefully |
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| 12:24.48 | genr8_ | willow_, acpid the package isnt installed by default to begin with |
| 12:25.02 | ForgeAus | uh is there still a pastebin or something like that? |
| 12:25.24 | genr8_ | read |
| 12:25.45 | jelly | wonders whether ForgeAus reads any responses or their client is lagging |
| 12:26.18 | ForgeAus | https://pastebin.com/itpTzUPq |
| 12:26.50 | jelly | willow_, consider starting your installation with a base install, and work from there up, installing just what you need, instead of starting with lots of things and then disabling them |
| 12:27.05 | ForgeAus | oh you have a debian-specialized paste nice ...:) |
| 12:27.47 | willow_ | jelly: in this particular case i have a running bare metal server that i'm going to virtualize. but that does make sense for creating a new VM |
| 12:28.09 | jelly | willow_, eh, we P2V ours as-is |
| 12:28.16 | genr8_ | ForgeAus, your apt policy looks good to me. I thought it could be broken but im not finding any errors in it. |
| 12:28.41 | ForgeAus | most things work its just when I install something that depends on either python3 or perl |
| 12:28.46 | jelly | reomving just the platform specific bits if they're annoying |
| 12:29.06 | ForgeAus | I get messages that no package provides either of those |
| 12:29.22 | ForgeAus | which seems quite strange because python3 is already installed |
| 12:29.24 | genr8_ | have you ran apt-get update recently ? |
| 12:29.28 | ForgeAus | not sure about perl probably taht too |
| 12:29.32 | jelly | ForgeAus, follow what dpkg bot said. |
| 12:29.33 | ForgeAus | yes |
| 12:29.57 | ForgeAus | well I didn't use aptitude I used SMART I think it was.. |
| 12:30.09 | ForgeAus | but I can check the cache policy one if you like |
| 12:30.31 | jelly | ForgeAus, reproduce the issue with ANY one of the command line tools, and pastebin ALL the info |
| 12:30.33 | genr8_ | he means paste the actual error |
| 12:30.49 | ForgeAus | the actual error |
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| 12:31.02 | ForgeAus | Can't install python3-httplib2_0.9.2+dfsg-1: no package provides python3:any >= 3.3.2-2~ |
| 12:31.10 | jelly | that's not the whole thing |
| 12:31.13 | ForgeAus | thats just a sample package... |
| 12:31.15 | genr8_ | right, but what package caused that ? |
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| 12:31.19 | ForgeAus | wny python3 package fives that |
| 12:31.37 | genr8_ | you said you were trying to install A package, and getting B python 3 error. what is A ? |
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| 12:31.50 | willow_ | jelly: do you rsync the image to the virtual disk? |
| 12:31.59 | jelly | genr8_, just let them paste the complete command line and output |
| 12:32.10 | genr8_ | he doesnt get what we mean |
| 12:32.21 | ForgeAus | I just pasted it one example would be python3-httplib2_0.9.2+dfsg-1 |
| 12:32.40 | genr8_ | where did that come from ? |
| 12:32.51 | ForgeAus | shrugs |
| 12:32.53 | jelly | ForgeAus, are you able to paste the complete command line and output from "apt-get install python3-httplib2" |
| 12:33.10 | genr8_ | shrugs then |
| 12:33.10 | ForgeAus | jelly ok I'll run that see what happens |
| 12:33.25 | jelly | ForgeAus, that was a YES NO QUESTION |
| 12:33.41 | jelly | are you ABLE do to it, not DO THAT RIGHT NOW |
| 12:34.30 | genr8_ | ,v python3-httplib2 |
| 12:34.32 | judd | Package: python3-httplib2 on amd64 -- jessie: 0.9+dfsg-2; jessie-security: 0.9+dfsg-2+deb8u1; stretch: 0.9.2+dfsg-1; buster: 0.11.3-2; bullseye: 0.18.1-1; sid: 0.18.1-1 |
| 12:34.42 | jelly | ForgeAus, because if you are, then paste all of that, and some more, like dpkg says: |
| 12:34.47 | jelly | !basic apt troubleshooting |
| 12:34.48 | dpkg | [Basic Apt* Troubleshooting]. To diagnose your problem, we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use https://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>. |
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| 12:34.54 | genr8_ | ,v python3 |
| 12:34.55 | judd | Package: python3 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.4.2-2; stretch: 3.5.3-1; buster: 3.7.3-1; bullseye: 3.8.2-3; sid: 3.8.6-1 |
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| 12:35.41 | jelly | genr8_, probably a botched release upgrade with releases skipped, but I'd reserve judgment until I see actual output |
| 12:35.47 | ForgeAus | ok looks like I do have some broken packages... ok going to try fix them |
| 12:36.11 | genr8_ | interesting |
| 12:36.29 | ForgeAus | something about qemu was broken but when It ry fixing it can't fetch the packages :( hmm... |
| 12:36.34 | jelly | ForgeAus, please stop doing what you're doing and try to follow instructions to the letter right. |
| 12:36.52 | jelly | otherwise, you might do more damage and it becomes harder to help |
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| 12:41.38 | ForgeAus | jelly: https://paste.debian.net/1167091/ |
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| 12:41.59 | genr8_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:42.44 | genr8_ | are you behind a firewall that wants to make your life hard ? |
| 12:43.02 | ForgeAus | maybe, but I don't think so |
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| 12:43.24 | genr8_ | i think its old DNS entries. |
| 12:43.38 | ForgeAus | I used sudo apt-get update |
| 12:43.54 | genr8_ | yeah everything is normal, except something about your network |
| 12:43.58 | ForgeAus | shouldn't that update dns entries ? |
| 12:44.11 | ForgeAus | oh ok ... oh well thx anyway... maybe try some other time? |
| 12:44.21 | genr8_ | it should ask for new ones, but it may be outside of this machines control |
| 12:44.38 | genr8_ | the *.80.204 IP doesnt actually exist under security.debian.org at this moment |
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| 12:45.01 | ForgeAus | so is it a problem with sources.list or something? |
| 12:45.07 | genr8_ | no, thats fine |
| 12:45.27 | genr8_ | its a DNS problem. do you run your own network ? |
| 12:45.40 | ForgeAus | I'm fonfused why is it trying to find an IP that doesn't exist |
| 12:45.56 | genr8_ | indeed. well, DNS comes from upstream |
| 12:45.56 | ForgeAus | my own network... hmm.. I have my own router to my ISP if thats what you mean |
| 12:46.02 | genr8_ | yes |
| 12:46.31 | ForgeAus | since NBN almost everyone in Australia does |
| 12:46.59 | genr8_ | something is lazy and caching an old IP for this DNS entry. the question is who and why |
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| 12:47.24 | ForgeAus | I can't force an update to the cache somehow can I? |
| 12:47.31 | ForgeAus | or request a fresh one? |
| 12:47.33 | genr8_ | perhaps |
| 12:48.15 | ForgeAus | oh scrap that not everyone, I don't know about fttn if it works the same I'm fttc |
| 12:48.18 | genr8_ | we'd need to know what was running, or take a guess at how to fix it. |
| 12:48.22 | ForgeAus | (fibre to the node vs fibre to the curb) |
| 12:48.34 | ForgeAus | would something like a tracert be useful? |
| 12:48.56 | genr8_ | try this first "sudo systemd-resolve --flush-caches" |
| 12:49.34 | ForgeAus | sd_bus_open_system: No such file or directory |
| 12:49.48 | genr8_ | oof |
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| 12:51.03 | genr8_ | tell me the result of "cat /etc/resolv.conf" |
| 12:51.27 | genr8_ | should be 1 IP in there |
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| 12:52.42 | ForgeAus | theres 3 |
| 12:53.11 | ForgeAus | 127.0.0.1, 0.0.0.0 and fec0:0:0:ffff::1 |
| 12:53.30 | genr8_ | well thats odd. |
| 12:54.04 | ForgeAus | oops wrong, not 127.0.0.1 , 192.168.1.1 (sorry...) |
| 12:54.12 | ForgeAus | thats my router's address I think |
| 12:54.16 | genr8_ | ok that makes more sense |
| 12:54.22 | genr8_ | yes, then its the router |
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| 12:54.48 | genr8_ | i would go reboot your router first, then your PC, then come back and apt-get update / apt-get upgrade again. |
| 12:54.50 | jelly | ForgeAus, see all those package names in lines 10-14 and line 3 of https://paste.debian.net/1167091/ ? Show the step 2 that dpkg bot asked for: 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, |
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| 12:55.45 | ForgeAus | shouldn't I just use 8.8.8.8 or something for dns, isn't that google? |
| 12:55.57 | genr8_ | you could try that. |
| 12:56.05 | ForgeAus | how to set it to that? |
| 12:56.22 | genr8_ | just edit the file, and it will take effect immediately on the next network command |
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| 12:56.35 | genr8_ | comment out the other stuff with a # |
| 12:57.15 | ForgeAus | goina copy a backup version of it first |
| 12:57.38 | genr8_ | smart. |
| 12:58.11 | Haohmaru | s.m.a.r.t. |
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| 12:58.51 | ForgeAus | uh now its finding them |
| 12:59.02 | ForgeAus | as in the fetch is working |
| 12:59.57 | ForgeAus | I was mildly worried the 8.8.8.8 thing might have just been slow due to locality or something but seemed snappy enough |
| 13:00.20 | genr8_ | great |
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| 13:00.56 | ForgeAus | ok so if the broken packages get fixed is that likely to fix the other thing? |
| 13:01.04 | genr8_ | likely. |
| 13:01.10 | ForgeAus | ahh done |
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| 13:03.14 | genr8_ | how long was this broken like this ? just today ? |
| 13:04.38 | genr8_ | if it was more than today that means your router got stuck using the old IP for a while. thats not good. |
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| 13:08.34 | genr8_ | google DNS should be fine to use. its not the fastest thing in the world but it works |
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| 13:11.40 | genr8_ | ok |
| 13:11.42 | genr8_ | now i have my own question |
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| 13:12.29 | Haohmaru | how dare u |
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| 13:13.15 | genr8_ | I need to learn how to make a chroot of my existing system, and then add about 50 packages to it |
| 13:13.31 | azeem | !schroot |
| 13:13.32 | dpkg | schroot is an easy way of setting up a <chroot> in a way that can be treated as a session. If desired, modification to the chroot can be prevented using overlayfs or LVM snapshots, making it very convenient for building packages or simply running packages from other releases with minimal containment. See https://wiki.debian.org/Schroot and http://linuxgazette.net/150/kapil.html |
| 13:13.36 | genr8_ | as opposed to starting from scratch, or contaminating the main system |
| 13:13.38 | genr8_ | ok |
| 13:13.44 | greycat | First, make a directory. Then perform a debootstrap into it. Then use dpkg --get-selections to clone your package set into it. |
| 13:14.01 | genr8_ | greycat, i want to avoid that. azeem's way sounds better |
| 13:14.05 | ForgeAus | overlayfs sounds good :) |
| 13:14.20 | ForgeAus | I wonder if bedrock linux works that way |
| 13:14.21 | genr8_ | yes, overlay concept was exactly what i had in mind |
| 13:14.25 | azeem | schroot also entails creating a chroot |
| 13:14.28 | azeem | I believe |
| 13:14.33 | ForgeAus | I know it chroots (although I got the impression it was more of an underlay than an overlay) |
| 13:15.18 | jelly | genr8_, wait, chroot the same as the existing system? |
| 13:15.26 | genr8_ | yea |
| 13:15.44 | ForgeAus | jails r fun :) |
| 13:15.47 | jelly | last time I did that I just rsync'd the whole OS into a new folder |
| 13:16.11 | genr8_ | brute force way |
| 13:16.54 | jelly | ¯\_(ã)_/¯ it worked |
| 13:17.25 | jelly | it's still there /opt/chroots/lennyish-32bit-www |
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| 13:27.07 | lenswipe | hey folks |
| 13:27.23 | lenswipe | anyone know if it's possible to mount a file on an HTTP server as a local file? |
| 13:27.46 | lenswipe | or at least make it appear as such to any local applications |
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| 13:30.26 | ForgeAus | lenswipe httpfs? |
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| 13:31.19 | greycat | If it's read-only, that might work, but if you want to *modify* the content, you need something more. Like WebDAV, or ssh. |
| 13:31.29 | ForgeAus | there may be a way to do that with fuse somehow, I'm not entirely sure... |
| 13:32.29 | azeem | or use the httpfs translator, if you're on hurd-i386 |
| 13:32.38 | greycat | fuse on the client will not magically make the web server start accepting uploaded data chunks and merging them into the files |
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| 13:34.13 | ForgeAus | greycat true, I think you need some kind of httpfs there |
| 13:34.34 | ForgeAus | looks like there's an httpfs2 even dunno much about it... even microsoft ifs had an httpfs driver! |
| 13:35.06 | ForgeAus | well not first party, some third party IFS site had an httpfs driver... I should have said |
| 13:35.13 | ForgeAus | (so its not microsofts own) |
| 13:35.25 | lenswipe | greycat, i have a PNG stream from octoprint that I want to make my zoom background. |
| 13:35.42 | greycat | so download it and then use it as your background |
| 13:35.44 | lenswipe | So my idea was to try and fake mount the PNG stream so that zoom thinks it's a local file |
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| 13:36.23 | ForgeAus | does this help? https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/67568/mount-http-server-as-file-system |
| 13:36.34 | jelly | lenswipe, curlftpfs |
| 13:36.35 | lenswipe | possibly |
| 13:36.50 | lenswipe | I tried dav:// in file manager but it didn't work so i dont know if i need an additional plugin |
| 13:37.03 | lenswipe | jelly, sounds interesting...bear in mind this will be a continuous HTTP request though |
| 13:37.05 | greycat | You are seriously overcomplicating this. Just download the PNG to a temp file. |
| 13:37.07 | jelly | curlftpfs works better if the web server has indexes enabled |
| 13:37.08 | lenswipe | i.e: a never ending PNG |
| 13:37.18 | lenswipe | greycat, Oh...Right! |
| 13:37.20 | lenswipe | good idea |
| 13:37.38 | jelly | lenswipe, you will have to be careful about configuring that FUSE-based fs to avoid any caching, then |
| 13:37.59 | jelly | so VFS doesn't fill up your RAM |
| 13:38.23 | lenswipe | jelly, even if i do curl? |
| 13:39.33 | jelly | lenswipe, curlftpfs IS the fuse-based fs I'm talking about |
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| 13:39.54 | jelly | I don't see if someone mentioned a curl solution |
| 13:40.22 | lenswipe | yeah someone mentioned just curling the PNG down |
| 13:40.29 | lenswipe | just tried it - looks like zoom doesn't like that |
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| 13:41.01 | jelly | lenswipe, are you sure zoom accepts animated png AT ALL |
| 13:41.31 | jelly | maybe it's going to always just pick the first frame and stop there |
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| 13:43.07 | jelly | did not even know there was zoom on linux |
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| 13:47.48 | asterismo | hi |
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| 13:49.57 | lenswipe | jelly, it didn't even do that, it just showed a blank image. I guess it doesn't like PNG streams |
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| 13:50.13 | lenswipe | and no, I'm not at all sure zoom accepts animated PNG ;p |
| 13:51.13 | jelly | you might have to do with v4l2loopback and do video mixing yourself |
| 13:51.50 | jelly | (assuming the general goal is "have fancy background in video meetings") |
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| 13:53.11 | jelly | eg. https://github.com/fangfufu/Linux-Fake-Background-Webcam |
| 13:53.25 | jelly | > https://github.com/fangfufu/Linux-Fake-Background-Webcam |
| 13:53.33 | jelly | > The Linux version of Zoom only supports background replacement via chroma key. |
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| 13:53.49 | greycat | what in the bloody hell is a chroma key |
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| 13:56.55 | jelly | greycat, sit in front of a green bcakground, software replaces all the pixels with specific value of RGB with a different image |
| 13:57.05 | greycat | *nod* I just googled it... |
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| 13:59.04 | greycat | I have to assume there's some way to tell Zoom *what* image to use in the "chroma key" green screen replacement thing. |
| 14:00.05 | jelly | so you can do weather forecasts for the people in your office |
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| 14:11.52 | asterismo | i'm having an issue, i did apt-build some packages and now i have a repository of build packages |
| 14:12.48 | asterismo | i deleted one of those packages to force the official download instead the apt-built one, and did apt-get update |
| 14:13.28 | asterismo | but apt-get still wants to install that apt-build package, how do i refresh apt-build repository for apt-get? |
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| 14:24.00 | jelly | asterismo, what does "apt-cache policy affectedpackage" say |
| 14:24.08 | jelly | !paste |
| 14:24.09 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: https://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: https://imgbb.com/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): https://filebin.net or https://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <termbin>. |
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| 14:32.27 | genr8_ | N: Unable to locate package affectedpackage |
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| 14:35.05 | greycat | ... you seriously have to censor the package name?!? *plonk* |
| 14:35.37 | Haohmaru | libboobs |
| 14:35.39 | greycat | ... oh, that was some sort of "humor". You are not the OP. |
| 14:35.54 | genr8_ | ... oh, that was not some sort of "humor". |
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| 14:36.08 | greycat | waits for asterismo the OP to make the same statement so I can /ignore the correct person |
| 14:36.37 | Haohmaru | greycat needs moar coffee |
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| 14:37.27 | genr8_ | blame me for sarcasm not transmitting over the interwebs |
| 14:38.13 | fireba11 | genr8_: sarcasm doesn't fit into the tubes? |
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| 14:41.04 | EdePopede | that's why i usually go with $affectedpackage |
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| 14:43.57 | jelly | should I always use the recommended metasyntactic variables, to avoid making greycat annoyed by proxy? |
| 14:44.25 | Haohmaru | Unable to locate package $needle in repository $hay |
| 14:45.00 | Haohmaru | ,v needle |
| 14:45.01 | judd | No package named 'needle' was found in amd64. |
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| 14:45.31 | Haohmaru | u need apt-magnet |
| 14:45.58 | greycat | !wrench |
| 14:45.59 | dpkg | * HaQDaQ wants to use apt-get agaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaain <greycat> HaQDaQ: then do so. <HaQDaQ> it doesn't work anymore... dependency erros : <greycat> HaQDaQ: fix them. <HaQDaQ> greycat: how ? <greycat> HaQDaQ: with an apt wrench. Are you going to ask any more stupid questions? * HaQDaQ is linux n00b, and how to apt wrench ? <HaQDaQ> greycat: how to apt wrench ? |
| 14:46.33 | Haohmaru | >:) |
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| 14:47.53 | EdePopede | in HaQDaQ's case it may have been apt nuqneH instead |
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| 14:49.42 | EdePopede | jelly: do you remember these admin stories from the days back when non-IT people weren't used to computers at all? |
| 14:50.35 | Haohmaru | the golden era |
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| 14:54.23 | EdePopede | yeah. liked those stories. that one was about a terminal in a university library (note: non-IT students had no place in computer rooms), where the student staff had attached a paper to the wall to explain them how to login and what they'd expect. then a user just wasn't able to login. went there, looked over her shoulder while she was trying to follow "USER NAME: your username here". you guess it... |
| 14:54.47 | EdePopede | and now take into account youtube videos like "if doom/quake/... was done today" |
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| 15:04.19 | genr8_ | can someone translate this for me ? "nvme nvme0: I/O 91 QID 6 timeout, aborting" |
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| 15:05.14 | genr8_ | besides "io timed out", like... what is IO 91 QID 6 ? |
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| 15:06.59 | genr8_ | today I have IO 94 and 95 from QID 4 timeout, then hours later I have IO 88,89,90,91 from QID 6. |
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| 15:08.08 | asterismo | jelly, https://paste.undernet.uy/?b9f2b3c059acd823#Ca6C2juZk76en5YNbGUBb7L4SAK8BRPBFYE4V5jxk8Hg |
| 15:08.33 | greycat | genr8_: google gives me https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=202633 but I don't know whether that's helpful |
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| 15:09.05 | greycat | looks at that paste url and can't imagine it's going to work in curl |
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| 15:10.12 | genr8_ | well its helpful for me to now know its beyond help |
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| 15:11.40 | greycat | PrivateBin is a minimalist, open source online pastebin where the server has zero knowledge of pasted data. Data is encrypted/decrypted <i>in the browser</i> using 256 bits AES. |
| 15:11.44 | genr8_ | the system doesnt actually hang, it just soft locks and my internet disconnects, until the drive can flush itself and recover |
| 15:11.47 | greycat | so yeah, not a good pick |
| 15:12.30 | asterismo | ok, i disabled the apt-build source and it worked |
| 15:13.34 | genr8_ | it was some kind of priority issue then |
| 15:13.55 | jelly | asterismo, the version in your custom repo is bigger than the version in stretch |
| 15:14.24 | asterismo | bigger? |
| 15:14.33 | genr8_ | yeah the higher version number takes priority |
| 15:15.31 | jelly | asterismo, newer. higher? remove that package from the repo, and recreate repo metadata (Packages) and rerun apt-get update |
| 15:15.51 | jelly | then rerun the policy command |
| 15:16.32 | asterismo | i did apt-get update and deleted the package, but none of this worked |
| 15:16.38 | asterismo | disabling the repo did it |
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| 15:18.20 | jelly | asterismo, you do need to recreate repo inventory |
| 15:18.48 | jelly | alternatively, put NotAutomatic: yes in Release files for that repo |
| 15:19.49 | asterismo | how do i recreate the repo? |
| 15:20.16 | jelly | I suppose the same way you created it in the first place |
| 15:21.04 | greycat | jelly said to recreate the *inventory*, not the entire repository |
| 15:21.45 | asterismo | yes inventory |
| 15:22.02 | asterismo | i guess it created it automatically |
| 15:22.06 | asterismo | i used apt-build |
| 15:22.12 | asterismo | apt-build update? |
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| 15:26.08 | jelly | read apt-build docs and see if there's something to just recreate metadata for an existing repo |
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| 15:27.58 | jelly | does not know, never used apt-build |
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| 15:51.11 | gribouille | hi |
| 15:52.44 | gribouille | I want to install debian on a USB stick ; the stick must be bootable with several computers with different hardware configurations. is it possible? |
| 15:53.19 | nkuttler | !live |
| 15:53.19 | dpkg | The Debian Live project provides pre-built Debian live system images and allows creation of your own. These can be used to install a Debian system (although the installer is better to use). Live images are available from http://www.debian.org/CD/live/ . https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-live/ #debian-live on irc.debian.org. See also <live firmware>. <UEFI> mode is supported by Debian Live images. |
| 15:53.36 | greycat | "install on a USB stick" is not necessarily a "live" install |
| 15:53.57 | nkuttler | gribouille: you can use a live image, booting from usb can be tricky, depends on the machine |
| 15:54.12 | greycat | Since it was a yes/no question, the simplest answer is "yes", and the follow-up "how??" is simply "you specify the USB stick as the hard drive to install onto". |
| 15:54.49 | greycat | But certainly, using a live image instead of installing regular Debian onto USB is also a viable choice. |
| 15:56.52 | gribouille | greycat, what is the advantage of a live image over a regular install on the USB? |
| 15:59.10 | nkuttler | the live images are built for the use case of running them on most machines. your own install might not be. the disadvantage is that persistent storage is a little more work |
| 16:02.08 | gribouille | the idea is to create a system on a USB stick that is usable if I have a problem with the main system or the machine. it must be identical to my main system, but usable on several machines |
| 16:02.55 | nkuttler | why would your main system not be usable any more? and if the usb is identical, why would it still be usable? |
| 16:03.41 | gribouille | nkuttler, threre could be a hardware failure |
| 16:04.31 | nkuttler | it sounds like what you really want are backups and a proper restore procedure |
| 16:04.54 | gribouille | nkuttler, I'm already doing backups |
| 16:05.45 | nkuttler | still not sure which problem you're trying to solve |
| 16:05.46 | jelly | gribouille, live images are mostly read-only and compressed -- more software in limited space, but less pressure on a cheap usb stick that typically has a very limited number of block rewrites |
| 16:06.23 | jelly | if however you put an m.2 SSD into a usb3 case, you might as well make a proper installation |
| 16:06.31 | nkuttler | let's say your cpu dies, but you have other machines. which advantage does the usb stick have over using a different machine and restoring a backup? |
| 16:06.52 | jelly | or just putting the disk from the old machine into a new machine |
| 16:07.03 | jelly | for me it's instant usability |
| 16:07.10 | nkuttler | or that, if the disk is still good |
| 16:07.21 | jelly | so I usually have 2 working computers or more. |
| 16:07.37 | gribouille | nkuttler, once, the graphics card on my machine died. the machine wasn't usable anymore until I replaced it. If I had had the stick, I could have plugged it into another machine and continue working |
| 16:07.50 | jelly | sometimes I sacrifice one and upgrade it to testing or unstable |
| 16:08.20 | jelly | gribouille, you could have put just the disk into a different computer |
| 16:08.29 | greycat | what does "continue working" mean in this context? does your "working" not require ANY data from the machine you're sitting in front of? |
| 16:09.38 | gribouille | greycat, at least, I could have had the same configuration, with the same software |
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| 16:11.07 | gribouille | jelly, taking the disk from the old machine to the new machine won't necessarily work if they don't have the same hardware |
| 16:11.51 | greycat | ...? |
| 16:12.09 | greycat | is it just the network interface name? or video drivers/firmware? |
| 16:12.10 | gribouille | greycat, isn't it clear? |
| 16:12.24 | gribouille | greycat, everything |
| 16:12.28 | greycat | I am really struggling here to understand what your goals and requirements are. |
| 16:13.20 | gribouille | greycat, my goal is to create a system that can be used on several computers |
| 16:13.27 | greycat | You want a generic Debian-on-a-stick that will allow you to "continue working" if your real system is hit by an asteroid, but you don't have a new system, but you have lots of new systems, but you can't move a disk over, because "hardware is different", and yet the Debian-on-a-stick can somehow work...??!?? |
| 16:13.42 | jelly | gribouille, things might not 100% work but you can typically make it boot and fix the important bits easily |
| 16:13.43 | greycat | Nothing makes sense yet. |
| 16:14.27 | jelly | gribouille, you will have the same issue plugging the hypothetical usb installation to different hw plaforms... |
| 16:15.01 | jelly | sata disk, nvme disk, usb disk, doesn't matter |
| 16:16.12 | jelly | iface names will vary, gpu devices will vary, hell, keyboards might vary and your Fn-F5 to mute the speaket might not work |
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| 16:17.53 | gribouille | when I boot the system, it tries to find the disks it has already used. how can I change this? |
| 16:18.06 | greycat | man fstab |
| 16:18.32 | gribouille | greycat, that's not only fstab |
| 16:18.42 | greycat | then I have NO FUCKING IDEA what you are talking about |
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| 16:19.00 | greycat | This is irritating me beyond all ability to cope with. *plonk* |
| 16:19.52 | gribouille | greycat, the kink of *plonk* |
| 16:20.00 | gribouille | s/kink/king |
| 16:20.18 | jelly | both? Both. |
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| 16:21.18 | tramplefoot | does the debian janitor fix spelling errors? |
| 16:21.31 | jelly | gribouille, you will have to show actual output from "system [...] tries to find the disks it has already used" if you want better help or even a solution |
| 16:22.10 | jelly | there could be more than one cause and even more than one symptom matching that |
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| 16:23.07 | jelly | tramplefoot, only some of those I think |
| 16:23.29 | tramplefoot | darn it |
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| 16:23.45 | tramplefoot | i really don't want to open a bug report for a minor grammar error |
| 16:27.15 | jelly | then don't, and it won't be fixed. I think packages on salsa may start accepting drive-by merge requests, github style at some point |
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| 16:30.40 | n4dir | gribouille: there is a non-debian-repo tool called refractasnapshot. You install, configure, run the tool and have a configured live image to boot from, say, USB-stick. There is a similar tool in antix, and i think debian has some options too. Back in the days we looked at the debian tools, and they didn't do it in a comfortable way, but that might well have changed. |
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| 16:33.26 | gribouille | n4dir, ok, I'll git it a try |
| 16:33.49 | n4dir | i too am not that sure if i understood you correct. Just a hint. |
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| 16:36.30 | gribouille | how can I see the systemd boot messages from another system? |
| 16:37.14 | gribouille | I've tried with journalctl --root=/mnt, but it doesn't work |
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| 16:56.38 | boktan | what is the reason that ubuntu can boot if i try or windows same but kali linux on ssd not recognized by uefi? because of it jumps directly to bios |
| 16:57.26 | joepublic | I dunno. What did the kali folks say? |
| 16:57.33 | boktan | nothing |
| 16:57.40 | boktan | they everytime say nothing :D |
| 16:57.44 | joepublic | maybe no reason, then. |
| 16:57.49 | boktan | since 5 years 1 question they not reply |
| 16:57.53 | boktan | :D |
| 16:58.09 | greycat | Sucks to be you. Maybe you should stop running Kali, then. |
| 16:58.11 | EdePopede | they may have no clue? |
| 16:58.27 | boktan | is ubuntu debian based_ |
| 16:58.28 | boktan | ? |
| 16:58.39 | joepublic | ubuntu is based on debian. |
| 16:58.44 | joepublic | dpkg, tell boktan about based on debian |
| 16:58.48 | greycat | Why do you hate us so very, very much? |
| 16:58.58 | boktan | also kali is same |
| 16:59.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1202] by debhelper |
| 16:59.19 | boktan | ubuntu works , windows works, but not kali |
| 16:59.30 | tramplefoot | yes kali lidux is also debian-based |
| 16:59.31 | greycat | So use ubuntu. |
| 16:59.34 | EdePopede | a lot is debian based: https://distrowatch.com/images/other/distro-family-tree.png |
| 16:59.54 | tramplefoot | debian is pretty much the grandfather of a myriad of distros |
| 17:00.05 | boktan | so if it jumps directly to bios on boot it means there is something wrong on efi or bios settings or not? |
| 17:00.07 | Matrox | if you want something easy based on debian, dont go for ubuntu. use mx-linux. i can highly recommend it |
| 17:00.28 | greycat | boktan: We do not know, and we do not care, what is wrong with Kali and why it does not work. |
| 17:00.39 | tramplefoot | there is another room for that |
| 17:00.39 | boktan | greycat who is we? |
| 17:00.39 | greycat | Go to the Kali support channel. Or use Ubuntu. Or use Debian. |
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| 17:01.03 | EdePopede | the only relevant point of kali is that their users tend to land here sooner or later. |
| 17:01.04 | boktan | ooh |
| 17:01.06 | boktan | i see |
| 17:01.12 | boktan | sorry operator i love you :D, |
| 17:01.13 | boktan | hahaha |
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| 17:01.48 | tramplefoot | and yeah ubuntu is no longer the go-to debian derivative for beginners |
| 17:02.13 | tramplefoot | mx has been no.1 on the distrowatch charts almost for 4 or 5 months now |
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| 17:02.23 | tramplefoot | not sure how trustworth dw is |
| 17:02.30 | tramplefoot | but yeah i guess that's a big deal |
| 17:02.52 | blodkorv | i dont put much merit on dw tho |
| 17:03.03 | blodkorv | but it gives some percentage |
| 17:03.23 | tramplefoot | i hope they don't pump the numbers |
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| 17:03.55 | Matrox | distrowatch measures interests and page clicks not usage. ubuntu has the biggest recorded userbase according to a tool that reports usage stats, and then debian, and then everything else |
| 17:04.30 | Matrox | (those stats where for desktop i think though, didnt measure server usage) |
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| 17:05.19 | Matrox | or ubuntu just forces them to use that tool, microsoft style. who knows |
| 17:05.24 | tramplefoot | don't think ubuntu'll triumph over debian in the server market |
| 17:05.46 | tramplefoot | s/'ll/ can |
| 17:06.03 | Matrox | they offer zfs support out of the box now, and zsys which is a frontend (although it must suck from what i read) |
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| 17:08.39 | gribouille | where are systemd logs stored? |
| 17:09.44 | tramplefoot | for the current init session, you can try dmesg |
| 17:09.59 | tramplefoot | for previous logs check /var/log |
| 17:10.25 | tramplefoot | if you are looking for a practical log reading tool, sudo apt-get install lnav |
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| 17:11.55 | gribouille | what is /var/log/journal? |
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| 17:12.21 | sney | that's where the persistent journal is stored, and is the real answer to your question |
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| 17:12.31 | sney | (not all systems have a persistent journal, but yours probably does) |
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| 17:12.59 | gribouille | sney, the disrectory is missing |
| 17:12.59 | Matrox | journalctl saves the log in binary format, so its not readable anyway. you must use journalctl > mylog.txt or journalctl -u service > mylog.txt |
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| 17:13.39 | sney | piping it to a text file is optional if you're just looking at the log ofc |
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| 17:17.41 | sney | gribouille: it may be in ram in /run/systemd/journal instead; if you want journald to log on disk again, enable Storage=persistent in /etc/systemd/journald.conf and/or recreate the directory in /var/log. (it's not clear if you need to do both) |
| 17:17.44 | Matrox | systemd saves this binary file at /run/log/journal for volatile storage, and /var/log/journal for persistent storage |
| 17:18.13 | greycat | dpkg persistent journal |
| 17:18.13 | dpkg | In Debian releases 8-10, systemd's journal is not persistent by default. To enable a persistent journal, enable Storage=persistent in /etc/systemd/journald.conf. Persistence will be the default in Debian 11 Bullseye. |
| 17:19.00 | Matrox | does debian have more or less problems since the adoption of systemd? |
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| 17:19.09 | Matrox | its seems like a complicated program |
| 17:19.22 | greycat | It has different problems, I'd say. |
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| 17:19.27 | sney | agreed |
| 17:19.31 | greycat | Some things got better, some got worse. |
| 17:20.42 | gribouille | is here a kernel boot parameter to disable network? |
| 17:23.25 | sney | there may be something specific. also if you boot in recovery, the network will not come up automatically |
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| 17:43.04 | AndyAndyBoBandy | If I always use apt as 'apt -yqq --no-install-recommends', do I still need to have additional handling to ensure non-interactive mode, like 'DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive`, or is it enough? |
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| 17:49.05 | tramplefoot | some kind person has uploaded a patched version of the xfce4-weather-plugin for all you buster users |
| 17:49.25 | tramplefoot | check 970259 |
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| 18:37.29 | tinga | Security upgrade on strech changed Firefox to increase the size of the URL box when in focus, not even fitting into its surroundings. Also added pocket nuisance. |
| 18:37.45 | tinga | Any idea how I can undo those changes? |
| 18:37.54 | greycat | Not just stretch. That is the new firefox-esr, even on stable. |
| 18:38.15 | tinga | WTF is up with Mozilla. |
| 18:38.51 | greycat | This is precisely why Debian waits as long as it possibly can before moving to a new version of firefox-esr, or any other program. |
| 18:39.37 | tinga | Any Firefox fork that's less obnoxious? |
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| 18:45.31 | AndyAndyBoBandy | tinga: FWIW, about:config extensions.pocket.enabled |
| 18:45.34 | NetTerminalGene | tinga: you can undo in about:config |
| 18:47.25 | greycat | so... I'm reading the google result for "firefox pocket", and it's basically just cloud bookmarks, right? |
| 18:47.47 | kline\0 | tinga | WTF is up with Mozilla. |
| 18:48.01 | kline\0 | mozilla is dying and it trying to extract value from the brand before it actually goes under |
| 18:48.36 | kline\0 | this is what they were talking about when they said "product" over engineering when they fired everyone not working on integrations |
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| 18:54.44 | NetTerminalGene | greycat: i use firefox. i disabled it when it was first released. i don't even know what it is lol |
| 18:54.55 | AndyAndyBoBandy | greycat: I think it's also suggestions for links you've never been to |
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| 19:01.55 | lloyd15 | whats up my fellow buster users |
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| 19:19.08 | astronavt | lloyd15 no buster users here, bullseye only ð |
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| 19:19.16 | greycat | incorrect |
| 19:20.04 | Matrox | did debian remove /usr/bin/python? |
| 19:20.25 | greycat | not yet! |
| 19:20.37 | Matrox | i cant find it in my system. after doing dist-upgrade |
| 19:20.43 | Matrox | which python , returns nothing |
| 19:20.44 | sney | it was removed in bullseye |
| 19:20.45 | greycat | which version of debian? |
| 19:20.50 | Matrox | debian 10 |
| 19:20.50 | sney | if you're on testing go to #debian-next on oftc |
| 19:21.00 | greycat | in Debian 10, it should still be there |
| 19:21.04 | sney | what does "cat /etc/debian_version" say |
| 19:21.04 | greycat | it points to python2 |
| 19:22.24 | Matrox | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:22.25 | Matrox | 10.6 |
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| 19:22.49 | greycat | well, /usr/bin/python is in the python-minimal package, which you should have |
| 19:22.56 | Matrox | i see only python3 on my system. running python3 works, running plain python doesnt exist |
| 19:23.27 | sney | if you somehow managed to remove python2 from a buster system, it's broken now and won't be able to boot. |
| 19:23.27 | greycat | is "python" (the pkg) installed? |
| 19:24.28 | Matrox | python is not installed |
| 19:24.47 | Matrox | (i didnt do anything, my friend uses the same box, probably thought python2 is deprecated) |
| 19:25.14 | greycat | well, the obvious answer would be "apt install python" |
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| 19:26.07 | Matrox | is there a way to symlink /usr/bin/python to python3 instead of python2 ? |
| 19:26.13 | greycat | no |
| 19:26.15 | Matrox | sney, system boots fine |
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| 19:35.12 | sney | using python3 as /usr/bin/python is one of the goals of the ongoing python transition in bullseye. |
| 19:35.41 | sney | it's currently possible but can be iffy still with a few packages |
| 19:36.35 | greycat | It is *not* a supported configuration in buster. |
| 19:36.42 | greycat | Basically, don't try this at home. |
| 19:36.57 | alex11 | or anywhere else |
| 19:37.27 | sney | by currently I mean in bullseye. the sheer length of that transition should scare anyone sane away from trying to do it manually on a previous release |
| 19:37.45 | sney | (or an actual release, I guess, since buster hasn't had one yet.) |
| 19:37.49 | sney | bullseye. |
| 19:37.54 | sney | stares at his fingers |
| 19:38.53 | sney | debian 12 won't have a codename beginning with "bu", right? this has been hell on my typing autopilot. :P |
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| 19:39.01 | greycat | feel free to blame Debian developers for two releases starting with "bu" in a row |
| 19:39.17 | sney | I do. |
| 19:39.36 | jmcnaught | Debian 12 will be bookworm, so still a b-word. |
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| 19:40.15 | greycat | two and a half releases in a row |
| 19:40.24 | brigo | now i understand why so many people say Debian is difficult. |
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| 19:41.39 | greycat | I still stumble over stretch & squeeze sometimes, and those are 3 apart. |
| 19:42.16 | sney | remember this one? |
| 19:42.19 | sney | !squeezy |
| 19:42.19 | dpkg | Debian 7 <stable> is codenamed <wheezy>. The previous <oldstable> distribution, Debian 6.0, is codenamed <squeeze>. There is no "squeezy" or "wheeze". |
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| 19:42.41 | alex11 | lol |
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| 20:22.00 | invis | first time on debian I don't get it. How do I install app if my user isn't in the sudoers file and root password is locked? |
| 20:22.24 | blodkorv | login as root and add your user to sudo |
| 20:22.58 | invis | the default password is empty? |
| 20:23.08 | invis | the default password is ""?* |
| 20:23.27 | blodkorv | you set the root password on install |
| 20:23.32 | greycat | When you installed Debian, you were asked for a root password. If you supplied one, you can use that with "su -" or a direct console login. |
| 20:23.44 | greycat | If you left the root password blank, then you got sudo installed, and you were added to the sudo group. |
| 20:24.37 | greycat | If you're getting an error about the sudoers file, it sounds like you did not give a root password, or else you installed sudo afterward. |
| 20:24.47 | invis | looks like my first attempt had typo, thank you |
| 20:25.01 | invis | password worked |
| 20:29.59 | EdePopede | is !codenames updated when a release becomes stable? still missing names for 11+12 |
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| 20:33.01 | sney | dpkg factoids are like a wiki, anyone can edit them and it's the community's job to keep them current. that one has a last-modified date of 2011 though so I wonder if it has some special case automatic updates behind the scenes |
| 20:33.01 | dpkg | ...but factoids is already something else... |
| 20:33.17 | sney | !botsnack |
| 20:33.17 | dpkg | aw, gee, sney |
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| 20:34.21 | somiaj | EdePopede: there is often a lot done the few weeks after a release to update most factoids as this happens, but each one is manually updated, so it takes time and some are overlooked |
| 20:34.56 | greycat | factinfo probably doesn't get updated correctly when people do =~ |
| 20:35.56 | somiaj | yea, it doens't |
| 20:35.58 | EdePopede | i bet it is, wouldn't it be an approach to use some $(oldstable)/$(stable) grep on the db to at least get a list of potential candidates for update? |
| 20:36.10 | greycat | "grep on the db"?? |
| 20:36.13 | somiaj | ran across that issue trying to track down a change, and =~ isn't recorded (which is too bad) |
| 20:36.26 | *** part/#debian Thete (~thete@unaffiliated/thete) |
| 20:36.39 | EdePopede | no idea what format it uses. but since even the userdb here seems to be a plain text file.. ;) |
| 20:36.54 | greycat | pretty sure it's a mysql/mariadb database |
| 20:37.03 | somiaj | EdePopede: Most of that is done, there is also a spreadhseet that was created that contains the main ones that are updated, but it could be codenames isn't updated until the release, since debian 11 isn't out yet, I don't see that factoid being out dated |
| 20:37.08 | greycat | I don't remember who's running the bot these days, though |
| 20:38.12 | EdePopede | heh. on my old home network there was a bot in a channel for years after it's lost relevance. cable internet connection, still noone could remember who was running it |
| 20:38.34 | invis | I don't feel like reinstalling the light version of debian. I want to use my installed i3-WM instead of the provided DM |
| 20:38.47 | invis | How can I switch them? |
| 20:39.09 | greycat | invis: the traditional way would be to create a ~/.xsession file that has "exec i3wm" or whatever the right command is |
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| 20:39.23 | invis | where is the default one? I'll just edit it |
| 20:39.32 | greycat | the default what? |
| 20:39.48 | EdePopede | sney: i'd have done it, but i prefer some sandboxed dry-runs before i maybe nuke something ;) |
| 20:39.56 | greycat | if you want the non-traditional but Debian-ish way, it would be either update-alternatives --config x-session-manager or update-alternatives --config x-window-manager |
| 20:39.59 | invis | file that launch ?Gnome .xsession probably |
| 20:40.05 | somiaj | the bot is still dondelelcaro, but others do most the updating of the factiods. |
| 20:40.11 | greycat | oh fuck, GNOME???! |
| 20:40.14 | greycat | gaaaahhh, good luck |
| 20:40.20 | invis | wait no I have no idea |
| 20:40.27 | greycat | might be best to forcibly remove gdm3 |
| 20:40.31 | greycat | then you have a prayer |
| 20:40.48 | somiaj | gdm3 should have various sessions, one of them will source ~/.xsession |
| 20:40.49 | invis | ya its gnome... |
| 20:41.08 | greycat | either tell gdm3 to run a Debian session instead of a GNOME session, or replace gdm3 with something else |
| 20:41.23 | invis | Bah I'll wipe lol |
| 20:41.25 | greycat | if you tell it to run a Debian session, then the x-session-manager or ~/.xsession solutions apply |
| 20:41.29 | somiaj | invis: most who use windowmanagers and want a display manager are using lightdm these days, though the older xdm is still around too |
| 20:42.01 | invis | Can you describe display manager please? |
| 20:42.15 | greycat | !dm |
| 20:42.15 | dpkg | DM means Display Manager, the app that brings up a graphical login screen and starts your login session. <lightdm>, <gdm3>, <xdm>, sddm, <kdm>, <wdm>, pdm, login.app and <slim> are all examples of display managers. Ask me about <nodm> if you want to disable the DM. Or Debian Maintainer: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianMaintainer . For the deb-multimedia repository, ask me about <dmm>. |
| 20:42.56 | invis | I thought it was Desktop Manager for all those year |
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| 20:45.07 | sney | EdePopede: for that one, I'd still wait for the stable release anyway |
| 20:45.49 | EdePopede | sney: heh, no, i meant changing the factoid |
| 20:45.49 | ryouma | can i purge libservlet3.1-java and libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb and libservlet3.1-java? or is it necessary for ordinary libreoffice operation? |
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| 20:46.23 | greycat | "aptitude why libservlet3.1-java" |
| 20:46.40 | greycat | libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb is only a Recommends |
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| 20:47.54 | sney | EdePopede: that's what I mean. there isn't really a "debian 11" right now, it's still a work in progress, so there shouldn't be a factoid claiming it exists. |
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| 20:49.07 | EdePopede | still would be nice to have the codenames (since everyone is using them) and [[DebianReleases]] already lists them anyway |
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| 20:51.10 | greycat | <release history> only has "Next: Bullseye." |
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| 20:54.38 | somiaj | though eventually there will to too many codenames to fit in a single factoid... |
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| 20:57.01 | blackbart | Hi. I recently installed a new nvme ssd in my machine. It doesn't have nvme on the mobo so I had to install into a pcie, which I know the mobo can't boot from, but I left the old 500gb spinny disk in the machine to have the boot loader on. I also wanted to switch to btrfs, so I formatted /dev/nvme0n1p2 and ran rsync -aPxl / /media/ssd. I also ran update-grub. When I boot, I see "Debian GNU/Linux (on |
| 20:57.07 | blackbart | /dev/nvme0n1p2)" in the grub menu, but when I boot the machine / is still mounted from /dev/mapper/omni--vg-root instead of /dev/nvme0n1p2 (even after I manually change fstab). Can anyone advise? |
| 20:58.09 | greycat | blackbart: what do you have for root= in /proc/cmdline? |
| 20:58.40 | blackbart | greycat: BOOT_IMAGE=/vmlinuz-4.19.0-10-amd64 root=/dev/mapper/omni--vg-root ro quiet |
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| 20:59.06 | greycat | so it's definitely coming from the boot loader... |
| 20:59.13 | EdePopede | somiaj: yeah, 426 chars already. maybe 3 more and then BANG |
| 20:59.59 | another | <PROTECTED> |
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| 21:02.21 | greycat | blackbart: I can't tell how the root device gets chosen for grub.cfg. Too many variables coming out of god knows where. If you regenerate the grub.cfg (update-grub), does that change it? |
| 21:03.12 | blackbart | greycat: I did run update-grub, so I guess not? |
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| 21:15.28 | Azrael_- | hi |
| 21:15.50 | recyclehero | hey guys any exprience with VIA vt6105 onboard ethernet |
| 21:16.15 | recyclehero | I am getting Trasmit timed out |
| 21:16.30 | recyclehero | reset not comlete yet, trying harder from via-rhine driver |
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| 21:18.04 | recyclehero | interrupt conflict? |
| 21:18.08 | Azrael_- | i'm using sury as an additional php source with jessie. the next upgrade is planned but now i needed an additional php package from them. unfortunately they dropped the support, is there a mirror of those packages? |
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| 21:22.21 | diabel | Hello |
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| 21:37.09 | sney | Azrael_-: afaik ondrej sury is still the php maintainer for debian, maybe those packages were moved into backports, or maybe you could contact sury directly |
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| 21:40.29 | Unit193 | Or jessie is EOL. :3 |
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| 21:42.57 | alex11 | it's funny to have people say debian is so old and the packages are obsolete but then you get all these people using ancient debian versions |
| 21:43.54 | sney | I don't think there's much venn overlap between those groups |
| 21:44.39 | Unit193 | I'm sitting here on unstable, there's some outdated packages but generally a more fresh state. :) |
| 21:45.14 | Azrael_- | that's the fun of debian, it just "work" most of the time, so the pressure to upgrade often is just not that high and thus you run into this ancient stuff |
| 21:45.23 | Azrael_- | *works |
| 21:45.54 | sney | haha yeah having a server in prod for years with no complaints and then you log in to check a config and it's like "this was last updated WHEN??" |
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| 21:58.55 | hesco | I am running debian 9.3 and KDE on my desktop. Rather than shutdown everything every time I need to edit video, I have just created a new user specifically for that task. Audio works fine when logged in as my self. But when I hibernate my work on the desktop and switch user to the video editor user, I get no audio. Is this the right channel to ask for help debugging that? If not what channel should I |
| 21:58.58 | hesco | use? If so, are there logs I should be watching? What are my first steps for resolving this issue, please? |
| 22:00.11 | n4dir | there is #opensourcemusicians and #lau (linux audio users, i guess) |
| 22:00.48 | cheapie | Doesn't Debian run PulseAudio per-user by default? I wouldn't expect more than one instance of it to work at a time. |
| 22:00.52 | jhutchins | hesco: Check what groups your main user is a member of, which probably includes "audio". Join the alt user with that group. |
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| 22:01.25 | n4dir | probably want to say if you are using pulseaudio. And what cheapie says, i seem to recall similar trouble with jack audio server |
| 22:01.33 | jhutchins | hesco: You might still have problems if both users are active in X and both are trying to "own" the audio hardware. |
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| 22:02.14 | Franciman | DAMN I istalled arch linux and the wifi doesn't fail |
| 22:02.15 | cheapie | I think there's a way to run PA systemwide which might be the way to go, but I've never done it so I might not be too much help there :P |
| 22:02.16 | Franciman | but I tried debian sid |
| 22:02.25 | Franciman | and it failed, so I think, maybe it's some other non free component? |
| 22:03.03 | cheapie | Franciman: You might need firmware for your adapter. Is it installed? |
| 22:03.06 | n4dir | i'd check which kernel driver arch uses for wifi, then search for that in debian. Or compare. Or such. |
| 22:03.34 | Franciman | cheapie, yes |
| 22:03.39 | Franciman | now I'm gonna do what n4dir suggests |
| 22:03.41 | Franciman | I was just sad :< |
| 22:03.44 | Franciman | but happy! |
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| 22:05.01 | jhutchins | Also look through dmesg for mentions of firmware. (Use less for dmesg.) |
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| 23:34.02 | b1ack0p | hi |
| 23:34.35 | b1ack0p | i am upgrading from deb9 to deb10 but while installing a popup screen appeared asking me if i enable automatic restarts or no |
| 23:34.47 | b1ack0p | that some packages may require restart |
| 23:35.03 | b1ack0p | but if i choose yes to auto-restarts how will it continue installing new packages? |
| 23:35.10 | b1ack0p | should i run apt upgrade again? |
| 23:35.11 | sney | those are service restarts, not system reboots |
| 23:35.16 | b1ack0p | oh ok |
| 23:35.27 | b1ack0p | yes right they are services |
| 23:35.37 | b1ack0p | hope it doesnt crash.. |
| 23:35.43 | b1ack0p | it is really old laptop |
| 23:37.50 | b1ack0p | seems upgrade will take ages.. |
| 23:37.57 | b1ack0p | only 3% done yet |
| 23:38.15 | coruja | patience is a gift |
| 23:38.25 | b1ack0p | i cant wait :p |
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| 23:43.31 | EmptyMessage | whats more exciting than debian! :) |
| 23:44.05 | b1ack0p | 13% hopefully |
| 23:44.15 | b1ack0p | it is 20 years old ibm thinkpad |
| 23:44.25 | b1ack0p | sooo i wonder if it is gonna crash with debian 10 or not |
| 23:44.28 | astronavt | im on an x220 from what, 2003? |
| 23:44.43 | b1ack0p | astronavt: x220 is 2011 0r 2012 made |
| 23:44.48 | astronavt | 2013* |
| 23:44.49 | b1ack0p | my T23 is 2001 made |
| 23:44.49 | astronavt | yeah |
| 23:44.56 | astronavt | fair |
| 23:45.11 | astronavt | choose your DE wisely and dont use a web browser |
| 23:45.18 | b1ack0p | xfce |
| 23:45.31 | b1ack0p | it was running debian 9.13 - xfce pretty nice |
| 23:45.44 | b1ack0p | but it didnt let me fresh install debian 10 |
| 23:45.52 | b1ack0p | so dont know if upgrade will work or not |
| 23:46.02 | astronavt | hm. i wonder if its driver compatibility or what |
| 23:46.24 | b1ack0p | no idea |
| 23:46.30 | astronavt | the only thing that chokes up the x220 is firefox or chrome, and of course compiling software |
| 23:46.44 | b1ack0p | now screen got black and doesnt bring login screen |
| 23:46.54 | astronavt | what happened when you tried to fresh intsall? |
| 23:46.55 | b1ack0p | grrr |
| 23:47.11 | b1ack0p | astronavt: it freezed at very first install screen |
| 23:47.22 | astronavt | you used the graphical installer? or the text mode one |
| 23:47.34 | b1ack0p | text mode |
| 23:47.38 | astronavt | oof |
| 23:47.55 | b1ack0p | i see black screen and mouse pointer flickers |
| 23:48.00 | b1ack0p | now |
| 23:48.23 | b1ack0p | might be using too much source that doesnt let me use desktop it seems |
| 23:48.33 | b1ack0p | why didnt i start it on tty instead of desktop :/ |
| 23:50.41 | b1ack0p | what if i restart now while it is installing backages at background? |
| 23:50.50 | b1ack0p | because i cant access to desktop |
| 23:51.02 | astronavt | ive done that before.. but not while upgrading the system |
| 23:51.21 | b1ack0p | what if i run upgrade in tty instead of terminal? |
| 23:51.48 | astronavt | should help. but if you restart mid-upgrade there's no telling what the state will be |
| 23:51.53 | sponix | b1ack0p: you broke it ? |
| 23:52.08 | b1ack0p | sponix: maybe debian 10 is too heavy for this old laptop |
| 23:52.29 | b1ack0p | is there a way to get in to desktop without breaking it? |
| 23:52.33 | sney | if debian 9 ran, 10 shouldn't be a big deal |
| 23:52.34 | coruja | if it's about 20% it probably is still just downloading packages |
| 23:52.46 | b1ack0p | cant see percentagre |
| 23:52.49 | sponix | b1ack0p: I would recommend xfce on older hardware |
| 23:52.50 | b1ack0p | percentage |
| 23:53.02 | b1ack0p | it auto turned off screen after a while |
| 23:53.09 | b1ack0p | now it doesnt bring me login screen |
| 23:53.12 | EmptyMessage | yeah I wouldn't worry about running debian 10, first I would go to a lighter graphical environment, like JWM or fluxbox |
| 23:53.12 | sney | you can ctrl-c, exit your X session, then re-run apt upgrade and it'll pick up where it left off |
| 23:53.44 | b1ack0p | sney: i have black screen seeing mouse pointer flickering only |
| 23:53.55 | b1ack0p | probably tryng to get login screen but failing |
| 23:54.02 | sney | then ctrl-alt-f2 or whatever and log in to the tty instead |
| 23:54.07 | EmptyMessage | is that black screen in the TTY or in Xorg? |
| 23:54.12 | sney | upgrading the whole system from a gui is never a good idea |
| 23:54.40 | b1ack0p | i am on tty |
| 23:54.52 | b1ack0p | EmptyMessage: in Xorg |
| 23:55.08 | b1ack0p | now is there a way to access to desktop where i left ? |
| 23:55.19 | b1ack0p | somehow to stop current upgrade and re-run on tty? |
| 23:55.29 | sney | [17:53:12] <sney> you can ctrl-c, exit your X session, then re-run apt upgrade and it'll pick up where it left off |
| 23:55.45 | dvs | b1ack0p: you shouldn't be running the GUI during a system upgrade. |
| 23:56.08 | b1ack0p | sney: since i cant open desktop terminal how can i ctl c? |
| 23:56.15 | b1ack0p | dvs: it is an experience |
| 23:56.19 | b1ack0p | next time i wont |
| 23:56.34 | sney | b1ack0p: well, killing X will also kill that terminal |
| 23:56.44 | jmcnaught | Also it is a good idea to run the upgrade in a GNU screen or tmux session that you can reattach to and will keep running in the background if a terminal emulator closes. |
| 23:57.30 | EmptyMessage | ooh thats a good tip, thanks! |
| 23:57.40 | sponix | I just never upgrade anymore. Keep backups of my data, and my OS light, so a clean install doesn't take very long |
| 23:58.24 | jmcnaught | Debian is pretty upgradable, the upgrade instructions in the release notes are worth following in my opinion. |
| 23:58.25 | EmptyMessage | I do the same as sponix. I have a list of key packages I use so with 1 `apt install` and 1 `git pull` I can be in business on a fresh install |
| 23:58.34 | dvs | agrees |
| 23:59.47 | sponix | EmptyMessage: I have a text file called applist.txt where I have documented everything I run, and what little configuration it needs |
