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| 00:23.54 | asterismo_l | adding acpi parameters to grub, tried pm-suspend, echo "mem" | sudo tee /sys/power/state, but it cannot resume after suspend |
| 00:24.03 | asterismo_l | i get distorted graphic and system freeze |
| 00:24.17 | asterismo_l | is there anything else i can try? |
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| 00:31.07 | tomreyn | asterismo_l: suspend and whether or not it works well is highly platform specific. you did not provide ubuntu release, hardware or firmware information |
| 00:31.35 | tomreyn | for supported ubuntu releases, use systemd-sleep, not pm-utils |
| 00:31.59 | asterismo_l | it is a Dell Precision 530 MT Dual Xeon, with Intel 82860 chipset |
| 00:32.08 | quadrathoch2 | *cough* you are probably talking about debian release ;) not ubuntu |
| 00:32.12 | asterismo_l | i'm running Debian 10 buster i386 |
| 00:32.16 | tomreyn | oops, right |
| 00:32.33 | tomreyn | ahem, debian of course |
| 00:32.39 | asterismo_l | i was running Debian 7 before, and suspend/resume worked perfectly well out of the box |
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| 00:33.57 | tomreyn | see systemd-suspend.service(8) |
| 00:34.26 | tomreyn | https://manpages.debian.org/buster/systemd/systemd-suspend.service.8.en.html |
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| 00:37.04 | tomreyn | i would recommend switching to amd64 soon |
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| 00:38.53 | tomreyn | especially with smp |
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| 00:41.54 | asterismo_l | what does this grub parameter does? GRUB_GFXPAYLOAD_LINUX="vga=0" |
| 00:42.21 | tomreyn | your CPU is probably vulnerable to some spectre variants, too, and EOL, and needs to be replaced soon. |
| 00:43.07 | asterismo_l | tomreyn, like most Intel CPUs manufactured until 2015 o 2016... the kernel mitigates that anpways |
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| 00:43.51 | tomreyn | kernel mitigates partially, potentially fully with firmware support |
| 00:44.11 | tomreyn | i386 patches still less complete than amd64 |
| 00:44.29 | asterismo_l | thanks for the advice |
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| 00:52.55 | tomreyn | vga=0 would select the first (s)vga mode on a vesa compliant bios / (legacy BIOS) boot. |
| 00:53.19 | tomreyn | i.e. the first mode listed by vga=ask |
| 00:53.21 | asterismo_l | still not working the suspend |
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| 00:53.44 | asterismo_l | i can paste some logs, system info |
| 00:53.54 | asterismo_l | is there anything i can do to troubleshoot this? |
| 00:54.52 | tomreyn | you can try getting more logs out of systemd weith kernel parameters debug systemd.log_level=info |
| 00:55.15 | asterismo_l | where do i set that debug level? |
| 00:55.25 | tomreyn | kernel command line |
| 00:55.38 | asterismo_l | in grub? |
| 00:55.42 | tomreyn | i.e. press e in grub, append to "linux" line |
| 00:56.51 | tomreyn | consider also enabling persistent systemd-journal |
| 00:57.10 | tomreyn | sudo mkdir -p /var/log/journal |
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| 01:00.49 | OneLegend | holy fuck |
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| 01:00.50 | trui | though i think lots of logs are redirected, so you might get some duplicates, right? tomreyn |
| 01:00.50 | trui | i think there's a setting for that though |
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| 01:03.39 | tomreyn | trui: i'm not sure what you mean |
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| 01:03.52 | tomreyn | duplicates of what, what's redirected where? |
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| 01:05.26 | trui | as in, some of the journald stuff is put in the standard text log files |
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| 01:11.10 | tomreyn | yes, it'll also go to syslog if you haev a system logging daemon |
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| 01:11.55 | tomreyn | but you could remove that if you prefer journald |
| 01:12.29 | trui | yeah, that's what i read about |
| 01:12.53 | rrn | Hi, the OS engaged in thrashing during an apt-get upgrade, and after half an hour or so, I simply shut the power off (text console logins kept timing out merely from the username component, it never got to the password entry phase). |
| 01:13.10 | rrn | apparently it was in the middle of performing operations for Virtualbox |
| 01:13.18 | rrn | Any ideas on what to do now? |
| 01:13.33 | rk4 | friends let friends remove virtualbox |
| 01:13.47 | trui | ForwardToSyslog in /etc/systemd/journald.conf, tomreyn |
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| 01:14.52 | tomreyn | nods |
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| 01:15.48 | sponix | My Xorg crashed recently. Anyone care to have a look at my .xsession-errors log and see if something stands out ? |
| 01:17.32 | sney | !tell sponix about anyone |
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| 01:21.05 | sponix | sney: https://termbin.com/kblbk seems transmission was the last thing to speak up -- Yes, this is from MX Linux |
| 01:21.05 | rk4 | rrn: wait...virtualbox isn't even in debian stable because oracle :< - https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=794466 |
| 01:21.05 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/794466 in src:virtualbox (open, stretch, buster, bullseye, sid): «virtualbox: might not be suitable for stable releases due to lack of cooperation from upstream on security support for older releases»; severity: serious; opened: 2015-08-03; last modified: 2019-09-28. |
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| 01:21.07 | sney | virtualbox packages are no longer in stable because of that bug; however, virtualbox *guests* are still supported, and the vbox* modules are in mainline linux. so it depends what end of virtualbox you're on. |
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| 01:21.07 | sney | sponix: if you want mxlinux support you'll have to get a forum account |
| 01:21.07 | sney | !antix |
| 01:21.07 | dpkg | antiX is a fast, lightweight and easy to install systemd-free linux live CD distribution based on Debian Stable for Intel-AMD x86 compatible systems ( https://antixlinux.com/ ). It is related to MX Linux ( https://mxlinux.org/ ) which have support only in the form of forums https://www.antixforum.com/ and https://forum.mxlinux.org/ if you want IRC support, use a distro like Debian. antiX and MX are NOT supported here. |
| 01:21.07 | oerheks | sponix, at least you have the final adobe flashplayer, jolo |
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| 01:21.55 | sponix | oerheks: Yeah, I actually had something say it required flash :P |
| 01:22.10 | rrn | rk4, well it doesn't quite matter...point is, the system was shut off when apt-get upgrade was running at the actual filesystem manipulation stage, most likely... |
| 01:22.16 | sponix | needless to say, that thing is way out of date also |
| 01:22.53 | rrn | rk4, I saw Virtualbox operations, then it began seriously thrashing, I switched to a text console, and it kept timing out |
| 01:23.02 | rrn | rk4, after like half an hour I shut the power off |
| 01:24.08 | sney | rrn: boot the system again, run 'apt -f install', and see if it can recover itself automatically. if it can't, provide specifics. |
| 01:25.28 | rrn | sney, ok, thanks |
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| 01:38.39 | asterismo_l | in messages, i see this ACPI: (supports S0 S1 S3 S4 S5) |
| 01:38.52 | henko | is somebody here using zathura? I can't set the font to Terminus (bitmap font). It ignored the setting. Does somebody know a solution? |
| 01:39.00 | asterismo_l | but the PC BIOS allows me to switch to S1 or S3 |
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| 01:42.59 | eb0t | henko when i had problems setting the font ..it was normally becuase the font was not installed on the system |
| 01:43.18 | eb0t | so it defaults to an available font |
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| 01:44.47 | henko | eb0t: true, I also noticed that expected behavior, but I'm using Terminus everywhere. |
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| 01:45.01 | eb0t | ah ok |
| 01:46.20 | __dutch__ | henko: is zathura using pango? if so, pango dropped support for bitmap fonts in v. 1.44 |
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| 01:55.21 | henko | __dutch__: aaaahhh that might be it |
| 01:58.55 | henko | anybody else having that issue, you need this font: https://archlinux.org/packages/?name=terminus-font-otb which works with pango 1.44 |
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| 02:07.40 | Deyaa | Hello |
| 02:08.23 | Deyaa | Why can't I put underscore in hostname?? |
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| 02:33.36 | rk4 | Deyaa: man 5 hostname might provide some hints |
| 02:35.47 | Ede|Popede | Deyaa, the exact question: https://kb.iu.edu/d/afqs |
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| 02:37.45 | Deyaa | But why android phones use it without problems? rk4 Ede|Popede |
| 02:40.05 | Ede|Popede | no idea what android phones do, but can you reach them using these hostnames? can you ping them? |
| 02:41.37 | Ede|Popede | oh, hostname vs domain name https://stackoverflow.com/questions/10959757/the-use-of-the-underscore-in-host-names |
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| 02:49.36 | Ede|Popede | lol it seems completely broken https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/480723/how-to-deal-with-underscores-in-hostnames |
| 02:49.45 | Ede|Popede | a FIXED INVALID hostname Oo |
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| 03:03.32 | eb0t | hey how do you know how many man pages there are for hostname |
| 03:03.38 | eb0t | i normally type man hostname |
| 03:03.47 | eb0t | how to know to type man 5 hostname |
| 03:04.10 | eb0t | didnt even know that page existed |
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| 03:06.59 | __dutch__ | eb0t: man -k hostname or apropos hostname |
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| 03:07.14 | Ede|Popede | or man -a hostname |
| 03:07.15 | eb0t | thanks __dutch__ |
| 03:07.30 | eb0t | thanks Ede|Popede |
| 03:07.53 | Ede|Popede | oh my goodness, just did -k /o\ |
| 03:12.24 | rk4 | "Sams teach yourself Linux in 24 hours", circa 1999, was where i learnt these topics |
| 03:12.52 | rk4 | was an effective book, despite expectations |
| 03:13.17 | pfred1 | it did not take me 24 hours to learn how to spell Linux because I am a fast learner |
| 03:14.56 | rk4 | yeah but 23 hours to master a 5 letter word is only a minor boast |
| 03:19.00 | ryouma | gotta start someplace |
| 03:19.17 | ryouma | i learned unix by trying 1 letter commands then 2 letter commands |
| 03:20.38 | rk4 | how long did the 1 letters take |
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| 03:22.19 | ryouma | 26 * n |
| 03:22.33 | ryouma | within an afternoon i had figured out some basics like ls |
| 03:22.36 | pfred1 | I am curious what 1 letter commands there are |
| 03:22.57 | ryouma | there might have been none or htere might have been an alias or dunno maybe 1 or 2 existed |
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| 03:23.41 | ryouma | but it said "there is news" so i tried news, which was some non-usenet thing. then i found usenet. |
| 03:23.49 | ryouma | and there is maiol so i tried mail |
| 03:24.40 | ryouma | and i read the entire usenet spool in one afternoon, skipping over net.basketball |
| 03:24.48 | rk4 | $ apropos '.*'|awk 'length($1) == 1 {print $1}' |
| 03:24.48 | rk4 | [ |
| 03:24.50 | rk4 | w |
| 03:25.08 | ryouma | ah |
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| 03:25.38 | ryouma | then it was man pages and apropos. and i learned sh from the man page. which is astonishing at this point. |
| 03:25.58 | pfred1 | it seems like there's only 2 1 letter commands in /usr/bin |
| 03:26.10 | Ede|Popede | o |
| 03:26.20 | rk4 | w is a bit of an anomally, the shortest command but increasingly rarely used |
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| 03:26.37 | ryouma | oh i didn't say i knew the caommands. i tried keys. and 1 or 2 were commands. |
| 03:26.38 | pfred1 | there's X too |
| 03:28.01 | Ede|Popede | not a reliable method, you probably don't have all of them installed (seems o isn't available here atm either) |
| 03:28.33 | ryouma | o? |
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| 03:29.05 | pfred1 | I am pretty sure I have all of the expected core packages installed |
| 03:29.44 | Ede|Popede | don't ask me. i just remember it having been too often in mc's commandline after trying to C-o the panels and being executed when trying to cd |
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| 03:30.27 | pfred1 | might have just been an mc thing? |
| 03:30.35 | pfred1 | I was never a fan myself |
| 03:30.58 | pfred1 | must be why it is not installed |
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| 03:31.24 | rk4 | https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=buster&arch=any&mode=exactfilename&searchon=contents&keywords=%2Fo thing named o in a bin/ dir |
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| 03:31.28 | Ede|Popede | no, it executes whatever is in the cmd when pressing enter. maybe i should keep ctrl pressed just a bit longer :) |
| 03:31.31 | rk4 | s/thing/nothing/ |
| 03:33.55 | Ede|Popede | maybe an alias or a function from somewhere |
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| 03:38.43 | pfred1 | or some weird shell internal |
| 03:42.14 | f8e4 | folks, i do 'xset q' and after suspend to ram dpms is back on! |
| 03:42.23 | f8e4 | how to permanetnly 'xset -dpms'! |
| 03:43.38 | pfred1 | could put it into your ~/.xinitrc file |
| 03:44.14 | pfred1 | then every time X starts the command is issued |
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| 03:45.52 | pfred1 | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:46.09 | pfred1 | I think that has something to so with the mouse? |
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| 04:43.27 | sponix2ipfw | ever run an AMD GPU for the primary display and a Nvidia one for nvenc in the same machine? |
| 04:45.32 | dvs | ??? |
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| 06:13.50 | bradd_ | having a problem deleting a raid array from the partitioner in the installer.. can anyone tell me how? |
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| 06:15.27 | rk4 | you can switch to a shell in the installer, and do it the old fashioned way |
| 06:15.58 | rk4 | also, what is this 'raid array' |
| 06:16.41 | bradd_ | using 2 mirrored disks as a raid 1 array for '/' |
| 06:18.52 | rk4 | mdadm mirror? lvm mirror? btrfs mirror? [i don't recall what the installer UI supports] |
| 06:19.04 | bradd_ | mdadm |
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| 06:21.52 | bradd_ | k, I did it from the command line. thanks for the help |
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| 09:30.34 | mrig | Hello |
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| 09:32.18 | mrig | I am trying to install debian into a prexisting LUKS container: How can I get and use cryptsetup before running the disksetup so that my encrypted container and its LVM partitions are available from the setup options? |
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| 09:50.28 | another | i think you can switch to a console with alt+f2 |
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| 10:07.56 | mrAZ | Hi, what is the correct approach to get binaries starting without typing path in buster? e.g. ifup<enter>, instead of /usr/sbin/ifup<enter>? Where to set env variables? |
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| 10:12.08 | goksin | env variables are strored in $SHELL configuration files. You can set $PATH in conf file statically, or export $PATH wheren ever you need it. |
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| 10:14.20 | mrAZ | so i have to include export PATH=$PATH:/usr/sbin/ in ~/.bashrc , ~/.zshrc ... etc separately, or is there some way to set it for all shells? |
| 10:15.52 | goksin | Each shell has its own configuration file, therefore you need to edit all shell configuration files |
| 10:17.15 | mrAZ | goksin: thx |
| 10:17.23 | goksin | You are welcome |
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| 10:32.16 | DaRock | hey guys |
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| 10:33.16 | DaRock | I'm guessing there'd be a wider range o users here using ldap/krb5 auth - how do you get lightdm-webkit2-greeter to cooperate with those users? |
| 10:33.47 | DaRock | I can only get local users showing, and manual login is impossible |
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| 10:34.44 | pyrrhus | hi, I'm looking for some advice on installing software that isn't available in official Debian repositories. For university I |
| 10:36.04 | pyrrhus | am required to use MS Teams. I did use the official repository but didn't like the idea of having a vendor repo in my source list that could update any one of my packages. Do you think this is something I should realistically worry about? |
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| 10:40.29 | NetTerminalGene | pyrrhus: you may use snap or flatpak if msteams on there |
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| 10:50.17 | pyrrhus | NetTerminalGene: I switched over to flatpak but was having some issues with that version. The official repo version seemed to work so much better, that's why I want to know if I can switch back without having to worry about microsoft pushing a package update and breaking my system |
| 10:51.32 | NetTerminalGene | pyrrhus: good luck then |
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| 10:54.01 | goksin | pyrrhus: Any update to external repos are limited only for one specific software package. Ypu can update or unisntall it via package manager. |
| 10:54.16 | Mister00X | pyrrhus: does M$ provide Teams as .deb on their website as a download or are they providing their repo only? |
| 10:55.36 | goksin | pyrrus: I am running zoom on Debian 10 with official debian repos and zoom has only one ".deb" package for install and remove |
| 10:55.59 | Mister00X | Because if they are providing a downlodable .deb you could install it manual with apt |
| 10:56.25 | goksin | The down size is Zoom does not offere ant repo. You need to manually download, install, remove and update with apt ony. |
| 10:56.52 | goksin | Updating is removing old package and aintslling the newone manually. |
| 10:57.07 | goksin | I think it may be the same for M$teams |
| 10:57.33 | goksin | Zoom did not break anything yet ;) |
| 10:58.03 | jelly | goksin, MS has working apt repos for their skype, teams, vscode builds |
| 10:58.57 | goksin | jelly: thanks for info. I will keep that in mind |
| 10:59.21 | pyrrhus | goksin: oh right. so only the ms teams package can be updated by that repo? I am just hesitant with the idea that a non-official debian repo is able to inject whatever software they please when I update my system but maybe this is not possible anyway? |
| 10:59.57 | jelly | pyrrhus, you are right in that any package can be updated, apt works that way |
| 11:00.23 | pyrrhus | Mister00X: there is a .deb package on their site, however it seems that it adds the repo any way, at least it seems that way when I looked through the .deb archive |
| 11:01.15 | Mister00X | pyrrhus: Oh so you can't be safe from their PPA. How evil |
| 11:01.47 | pyrrhus | Mister00X: yes, it's quite intrusive |
| 11:01.54 | goksin | Well importing software to Debian requires using of official tools and repos. I think M$ is not that stupid to inject anything unofficial. |
| 11:04.56 | Mister00X | I don't believe M$ will do something like that with their repos. I just don't like the idea of M$ adding repos to my system or to be precise of anyone beside me adding repos |
| 11:07.09 | pyrrhus | could someone explain to me, or direct me to, how software is installed on Linux systems? For example when I use apt install, what files are installed on my system? Does apt simply download a bunch of executable binaries and put them in the correct directories on my system? |
| 11:07.30 | goksin | Absolutely it does |
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| 11:07.49 | goksin | Debian packagre are two kind: Binary and source packages |
| 11:08.16 | goksin | Binary packages are compiled and ready to deploy software by package mangement tools |
| 11:08.47 | goksin | Source packages are for users who want to appy custom config and buid their own packages |
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| 11:09.08 | goksin | APT and APTITUDE are cli tools, synaptics is a GUI tool |
| 11:09.08 | apt | ...but and aptitude is already something else... |
| 11:09.52 | Haohmaru | Synaptic |
| 11:09.53 | goksin | A package manager simply installs all binary stuff to proper directories, edits configuration files (sometimes) and stops |
| 11:10.06 | Mister00X | pyrrhus: I should mention if you ever want to uninstall Teams the repo created by the package will not be deleted form /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ you will have to do that by hand |
| 11:11.02 | goksin | Romeval is done in to ways: Either purge (remove all config files and binaries) or remove (keep config files) |
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| 11:11.50 | goksin | Anything in $HOME directories will reside there. So you can remove $USER related files manually when ever you need it |
| 11:11.56 | Haohmaru | purge and bleach |
| 11:12.11 | goksin | That is the simples form I can tell. Anything missing please insert |
| 11:12.53 | pyrrhus | will purge not remove config files that reside in the $HOME dir? |
| 11:13.00 | goksin | Synaptic is easy if you are not comfortable wtih CLI |
| 11:13.06 | pyrrhus | and thank you for such a detailed explanation |
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| 11:13.34 | goksin | $HOME is fır users. Software mangement tools won't intefere with that |
| 11:13.34 | jelly | pyrrhus, nothing in users' home dirs gets touched by package management, ever, in debian |
| 11:13.53 | jelly | other distros might have different policies |
| 11:14.10 | pyrrhus | interesting! I wish I had known that previously |
| 11:14.18 | goksin | If software mangemnt tools interfere $HOME directories things may get annoying |
| 11:14.56 | goksin | I did that once upon a time and result was horrible. An usable dektop environment and nothing works except mouse ;) |
| 11:15.15 | pyrrhus | I read something about installing binaries to a user home directory to keep it separate from the rest of my system. How could I go about doing that with MS Teams for example? I'm also a little confused as to how dependencies would work in this scenario |
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| 11:16.45 | goksin | pyrrhus: I am not familiar with that. AFAIK, build sourcecode requires some of the files on prefdefined directories in order to work |
| 11:17.23 | goksin | In case of CHROOT, all necessary files to run a software is placed under that directory to emulate a system for sohtware to run |
| 11:17.37 | goksin | I think that is what it is about. |
| 11:17.37 | NetTerminalGene | pyrrhus: you can use firejail sandox software |
| 11:17.44 | NetTerminalGene | sandbox* |
| 11:19.42 | pyrrhus | goksin: so does that mean I could theoretically just install a binary along with any of it's needed dependencies in the same directory and the software should work out of there? |
| 11:20.10 | pyrrhus | NetTerminalGene: I will look into that, thank you |
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| 11:21.41 | ayekat | pyrrhus: that usually won't work - tools usually expect things like libraries, configuration files, ... in specific places |
| 11:22.31 | ayekat | in many cases, you can make software search its stuff in other places, but it often depends on how it was written, built, and... even if it is possible, it involves a lot of tinkering |
| 11:22.31 | goksin | pyrrus: It is |
| 11:23.32 | ayekat | ah wait, missed the chroot point - ignore what I wrote ^^' |
| 11:23.59 | goksin | CHROOT is not easy. You need to know all the files needed for operation and configure it the way it is supposed to work |
| 11:24.13 | Ede|Popede | pyrrhus: usually i put things into /usr/local. works with firefox and some other tools too. sometimes a .deb isn't even crucial, unpacking it manually and throwing the file into it also works. depends on how the software is designed. some settings may be needed which are done during normal apt installation by the included scripts. |
| 11:24.14 | goksin | It is not an easy task. |
| 11:24.42 | Ede|Popede | if it's just about not putting files into aptland. |
| 11:25.32 | Ede|Popede | goksin: i thinl debtree could help? |
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| 11:25.39 | Ede|Popede | s/l/k/ |
| 11:25.51 | pyrrhus | okay, that makes sense, I think I was getting a little confused with building from source in the home directory, not just placing binaries in there. The only scenario that would work is if it was a statically linked binary right? So for example a golang executable file |
| 11:26.53 | ayekat | pyrrhus: for binary executables, you could set LD_LIBRARY_PATH to have the dynamic linker search libraries in your home directory as well, so it doesn't necessarily need recompiling |
| 11:27.06 | ayekat | but... not that I would recommend going down that line :-/ |
| 11:27.22 | pyrrhus | Ede|Popede: lol I like that way of correcting typos |
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| 11:27.52 | Ede|Popede | heh, i got used to it |
| 11:28.05 | goksin | Ede|Popede: I think so. It's been a long time since I had been to CHROOT installs |
| 11:28.41 | pyrrhus | ayecat: okay, that went over my head a little. I don't really understand dynamic linking all too well. |
| 11:28.53 | goksin | I might probably forgot many details and many things has changed till now |
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| 11:29.39 | goksin | dynamic lininkg is like borrowing a tool or ask a friend for help to do someting for you. |
| 11:30.18 | goksin | Static linking is like being the experti and doing all the work by yourself |
| 11:30.27 | Ede|Popede | pyrrhus: think "DLL". you have files with ressources *somewhere* where the programs can find them when they are started. plural because it's not necessary for each of them to bring their own copy. it's already there. |
| 11:30.32 | goksin | a bad example I guess |
| 11:31.20 | goksin | :-D |
| 11:31.20 | Ede|Popede | it's like the web function these days. just use the same cdn code like a million other people. |
| 11:31.29 | goksin | Good one! |
| 11:32.01 | Ede|Popede | and if a library (say, one that returns the bigger of 2 integers) is removed... half of the web is broken! |
| 11:32.25 | pyrrhus | goksin: no, your example was good. thank you |
| 11:32.39 | pyrrhus | Ede|Popede: that also makes sense to me |
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| 11:33.40 | goksin | Thank you |
| 11:34.02 | pyrrhus | I think I understand the core idea and differences between the two but I more mean that I don't understand exactly how the linking takes place and works. For example, does the program need the dependency linked at compile time or run time? |
| 11:34.12 | pyrrhus | I've been learning quite a lot about linux recently and it's mostly just been from tinkering and fudging around. What do you think would be a good way to learn the ins and outs of linux from the ground up? I would like to understand all the ins and outs. I was thinking to maybe find a book. Any recommendations? |
| 11:34.43 | Ede|Popede | or: it's just our whole production is working for centuries already. i've one seen sth on tv explaining the way of a simple bottle of beer: the content, the glass, the paper.... may make hundreds of km until your local brewery's product reaches your home. |
| 11:35.06 | ayekat | pyrrhus: if compiled for dynamic linking, the executable simply says "I need library XYZ when running" - when being started, the OS will then make sure to dynamically link library XYZ to the executable when launching it |
| 11:35.16 | goksin | Get an real harware and tinker with it. readl all the books and documantation you can get. Always hand on imperative |
| 11:35.18 | goksin | I have to log out and get back to my mundane daily life. See you all later. Bye for now |
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| 11:35.33 | ayekat | pyrrhus: you can run `ldd {program}` to see all the dynamic libraries that a {program} would want - the OS is then responsible for filling the gaps |
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| 11:35.49 | Ede|Popede | '"Sams teach yourself Linux in 24 hours", circa 1999' has been recommended yesterday, not sure if there's a newer edition |
| 11:37.35 | Ede|Popede | basics are much the same, the more basic, the less they tend to change. think hardware: there's some new media each decade, same for new memory technology. but generally PCs still work more or less the same. |
| 11:38.45 | Ede|Popede | only we don't use lilo anymore. and now systemV init is waving goodbye. |
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| 11:41.25 | pyrrhus | Ede|Popede: thank you for the recommendation, I will take a look |
| 11:41.41 | Ede|Popede | pyrrhus, maybe https://debian-handbook.info/ -- though i don't know how good it is in terms of generic linux introduction |
| 11:41.59 | Ede|Popede | at least it's for buster, which is a big plus |
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| 11:42.38 | Ede|Popede | i started myself with just the docs on the cd and then a generic linux book, iirc not even mentioning specific distros |
| 11:43.11 | Ede|Popede | and then https://www.debian.org/doc/books.html |
| 11:45.13 | Ede|Popede | the page could need some attention. the Rheinwerk book is on Stretch and and the Dutch one on Buster. |
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| 12:06.13 | pyrrhus | thank you! I really should use the official documentation more |
| 12:06.29 | pyrrhus | I am going to leave now but thank you everyone for your help |
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| 13:36.45 | admin0 | is it possible to execute script as a part of netplan ? |
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| 13:38.27 | rapids | admin0, https://netplan.io/faq/#use-pre-up-post-up-etc-hook-scripts |
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| 14:14.31 | robamkhrictjan | What is generally considered as a genius IQ score ? |
| 14:15.46 | dvs | 130 |
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| 14:23.14 | deeplogic | uses the Wellington Liunx Distro {based on Debian} |
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| 14:25.04 | deeplogic | Wellington is the oldest living penguin in captivity. Free Wellington ! |
| 14:26.24 | deeplogic | is the word "Debian" a registered trade mark ? |
| 14:27.12 | ansimita | deeplogic: yes, https://www.debian.org/trademark |
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| 14:28.03 | deeplogic | yes, i just found that |
| 14:28.05 | deeplogic | tnx |
| 14:29.11 | ndim | Is there a place I can just "git clone" to find the debian/ sources for Debian packages? |
| 14:31.56 | ndim | Or how can I find how packages build packages for Debian? |
| 14:32.20 | ndim | I have a Raspberry with Raspbian which I can use for basic things, but I really just wanted to check (in my role as upstream) what Debian packages make from my upstream release, preferably on my normal non-Debian system. |
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| 14:43.52 | deeplogic | ndim: you can get the source packages with apt-get |
| 14:44.14 | deeplogic | ndim: https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/how-to-get-source-code-of-package-using-the-apt-command-on-debian-or-ubuntu/ |
| 14:45.06 | deeplogic | long url's do provide more information |
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| 15:01.46 | ndim | deeplogic: Doesn't that give me just the current source snapshot? I am looking for the commit history with comments to the /debian/ subdirectory. |
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| 15:03.04 | n4dir | ndim: the changelog ain't sufficient? |
| 15:03.30 | n4dir | that is: really the commit history |
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| 15:07.09 | ndim | n4dir: debian/changelog is a summuary of the commit history. I cannot tell what actually changed in the other debian/ files to implement the changes summarized in the changelog. |
| 15:08.02 | deeplogic | n4dir: is there a patch log ? |
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| 15:09.25 | ndim | Wait a minute... how does Debian build packages in the first place? Do package maintainers just upload basically a tarball to be built, and which they construct locally using git, svn, files or whatever method they want to use? |
| 15:09.36 | n4dir | deeplogic: if you go to packages.debian.org; then to the package, it has a patch history, it seems |
| 15:09.58 | deeplogic | marvelous |
| 15:10.49 | ndim | I am coming from a distribution where the package source is in a public git repo, and that git repo is where packages are built from. Nobody says every distribution must use the same system architecture. |
| 15:10.54 | n4dir | deeplogic: i seem to recall something with a git repo, but can't find it. Perhaps try #packaging (on oftc irc server, i assume) |
| 15:11.20 | ndim | OK, thanks, will try over there. |
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| 15:14.41 | n4dir | https://salsa.debian.org/public ? perhaps, perhaps not |
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| 15:16.13 | n4dir | ndim: ^^ |
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| 15:20.58 | deeplogic | n4dir: ndim: there's an interesting git repo for gnutils -> https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/ |
| 15:21.30 | deeplogic | there may be be other project git repos more specific to your needs |
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| 15:26.23 | ndim | n4dir, deeplogic: https://tracker.debian.org/ contains (if it exists), a link to a VCS for the package. There is no guarantee that there is such a link, though. |
| 15:27.36 | n4dir | glad you found it. Thanks for the info too (i will probably have forgotten it once i need it again, but you never know :-) ). :-) |
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| 15:39.00 | ndim | n4dir: Oh. I just found that I had already noted the tracker.debian.org link a few years ago. |
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| 16:44.04 | jelly | <ndim> Wait a minute... how does Debian build packages in the first place? Do package maintainers just upload basically a tarball to be built, and which they construct locally using git, svn, files or whatever method they want to use? # yes, you got it right :-) |
| 16:45.25 | jelly | up to and including "whatever method they want to use" |
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| 16:46.45 | sney | it's nice when they do use salsa, because that makes it possible to find out "does this package have that patch" without having to actually consult the maintainer |
| 16:46.53 | jelly | except it's two tarballs and a signature these days |
| 16:47.21 | teclo- | evening, I changed my DNS server in the GUI in Debian GNU/Linux 10.x |
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| 16:47.28 | teclo- | but it doesn't seem to have any effecter |
| 16:47.31 | teclo- | effect* |
| 16:47.48 | teclo- | firefox-esr still goes to the wrong DNS server |
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| 16:48.03 | teclo- | any idea of what I have done wrong or forgotten ? |
| 16:48.18 | jelly | sney, you can look up the contents of debian/ over on sources.debian.org, regardless of whether salsa gitlab is used for source package maintenance or not |
| 16:49.12 | jelly | teclo-, what does /etc/resolv.conf say right now, and did you quit and start firefox after the change |
| 16:50.15 | teclo- | hi jelly thanks |
| 16:50.41 | teclo- | a I just did invoke-rc.d networking restart and now /etc/resolv.conf has the appropriate vvalue :) |
| 16:51.23 | teclo- | yeaah it works :) |
| 16:51.27 | teclo- | thank you jelly |
| 16:51.39 | sney | I always forget about sources.debian.org. |
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| 16:55.11 | teclo- | yeah the trick was to /etc/init.d/network-manager restart |
| 16:55.18 | teclo- | after changing in the GUI |
| 16:55.33 | teclo- | (or perhaps is there a more elegant solution, I don't know :) ) |
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| 17:27.50 | archetech | I got 2 mesa's installed |
| 17:27.50 | archetech | <archetech> lol any apt gurus here to remove the origianl and leave the experimental one? |
| 17:27.50 | archetech | <archetech> got 20.2 and 20.3 |
| 17:28.09 | archetech | on debian arm bullseye |
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| 17:32.02 | sney | !debian-next |
| 17:32.02 | dpkg | #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also https://wiki.debian.org/IRC and https://wiki.debian.org/GettingHelpOnIrc |
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| 17:34.00 | archetech | ok |
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| 17:34.25 | jelly | they're going to ask you to |
| 17:34.26 | jelly | !bat |
| 17:34.26 | dpkg | [Basic Apt* Troubleshooting]. To diagnose your problem, we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use https://paste.debian.net/ to provide us with this information. Also ask me about <localized errors>. |
| 17:34.33 | wwilliam | how to resolve this? |
| 17:34.34 | wwilliam | 20201221-12:16:44] [ERROR] X server for display 23 startup timeout |
| 17:34.47 | wwilliam | [20201221-12:16:44] [ERROR] another Xserver might already be active on display 23 - see log |
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| 17:34.59 | wwilliam | how to kill whatever is on display23? |
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| 19:31.12 | jhutchins | wwilliam: Start bym lookingat the log |
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| 20:21.01 | asterismo | hi |
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| 20:21.41 | dvs | lo |
| 20:21.43 | asterismo | well, i installed debian 8 and 9 in a spare HDD and tried suspend/resume, and it does not work in all of them |
| 20:22.08 | asterismo | so, debian 7 is the latest version in which suspend/resume is supported in my system |
| 20:22.59 | towo` | buy a ssd, then you don't need than nonsense |
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| 20:23.49 | dvs | and Debian 8 is when systemd took hold. Hmmmm... |
| 20:23.51 | sney | some intel 8xx support thing was lost between linux 3.2 and 4.9, it sounds like (which isn't too shocking) |
| 20:25.21 | greycat | jessie was linux 3.16 IIRC |
| 20:25.46 | sney | https://wiki.debian.org/DebianWheezy says 3.2, maybe 3.16 came in via backports? |
| 20:25.57 | sney | oh, jessie. yes, well |
| 20:26.34 | sney | judd steered me wrong. :< |
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| 20:32.34 | oxek | asterismo: fwiw suspend/resume never worked for me on any linux system, except high-end workdstations certified to run linux |
| 20:33.07 | oxek | it's ancient magic that is unlikely to ever work properly on non-windows systems |
| 20:33.20 | asterismo | this is a Dell Precision 530 workstation that is certified for RedHat i think |
| 20:33.25 | dvs | oxek: it works on both my desktop and laptop |
| 20:33.37 | asterismo | but suspend/resume worked out of the box in Debian 7 |
| 20:33.51 | oxek | asterismo: then it should work. Have you tried debian10, perhaps with kernel 5.10 from backports? |
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| 20:34.18 | asterismo | i tried kernel 5.9 and it does not work either |
| 20:34.19 | oxek | dvs: it's random, it works for some, it doesn't for others. I'm one of the unlucky one. |
| 20:34.47 | oxek | asterismo: is that the version with nvidia graphics? |
| 20:35.42 | asterismo | the workstation? |
| 20:35.45 | oxek | yes |
| 20:36.01 | asterismo | it has no video, i use a nVidia Riva TNT2 of 32MB |
| 20:36.14 | asterismo | very old, but it works pretty fine |
| 20:36.43 | asterismo | can i install kernel 3.2 from wheezy in debian 10? |
| 20:36.48 | oxek | I'm not familiar with how things are nowadays regarding drivers & such old cards, sorry. |
| 20:36.52 | asterismo | so it is the kernel? |
| 20:36.58 | oxek | yes |
| 20:37.05 | oxek | unless you got the drivers from elsewhere |
| 20:37.46 | oxek | if nouveuaux (I can't spell it) is being used, then suspend won't work. If proprietary nvidia drivers are used, then suspend won't work either. |
| 20:37.51 | oxek | that's my experience |
| 20:38.11 | sney | chances are good that linux power management drivers "upgraded" in ~2013 and that dropped support for whatever motherboard is in that thing |
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| 20:38.52 | sney | suspend support was always kind of wonky in those days anyway, and particularly on non-laptop hardware |
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| 20:40.34 | oxek | sney: is new hardware (lets say from 2019+) any better? I thought it's still terrible because hardware vendors don't care about linux, and suspend/resume is not a standards-based thing. |
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| 20:41.24 | sney | oxek: every post-2012 laptop I've had has supported suspend in linux without complaint. I haven't tested it much on desktops. |
| 20:41.36 | oxek | asterismo: it's very unlikely you'd be able to install kernel 3.2 in modern debian |
| 20:42.23 | sney | asterismo's machine was made in 2001, and they were still figuring out the kinks in acpi at that point. I still kinda suspect that if you tried a kernel with bios APM support, it might work better |
| 20:42.45 | sney | but bios apm support is also something that's been gone by default for 10+ years |
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| 20:47.06 | asterismo | i remember some apm setting in grub line |
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| 20:47.26 | asterismo | the BIOS says it supports suspend mode S1 or S3 |
| 20:47.51 | sney | S1 and S3 are acpi states, and you can't have both acpi and apm enabled at the same time. it's either/or |
| 20:48.36 | sney | and debian's kernels don't have apm support enabled by default anymore; the CONFIG_APM stuff is still in kernel.org's Kconfig, so it might be possible to build a custom kernel with it enabled |
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| 20:51.09 | sney | and yep, the driver is still in upstream linux. so it should be buildable, if not usable. https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/tree/arch/x86/kernel/apm_32.c |
| 20:51.52 | mrkramps | asterismo, have you tested suspending in S1 mode? |
| 20:51.55 | asterismo | sney, could i try adding in grub acpi=off apm=on something along those lines? |
| 20:52.11 | asterismo | S1 does not work either in newer debian |
| 20:52.24 | sney | asterismo: again, the apm driver is *not* in modern debian kernels. adding a grub option does not magically change that. |
| 20:52.32 | asterismo | https://debian-handbook.info/browse/squeeze/sect.power-management.html |
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| 20:52.39 | asterismo | ok |
| 20:52.50 | asterismo | i'll try building a custom kernel then |
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| 20:54.05 | mrkramps | i'd probably start with the acpi_sleep kernel parameter, testingg with s3_bios and s3_mode |
| 20:54.19 | asterismo | sney, but you think i could try to install kernel 3.2 for testing? |
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| 20:54.36 | mrkramps | because i still understand asterismo' problem to be about the display not waking up |
| 20:54.39 | asterismo | mrkramps, i tried that and didn't worked |
| 20:54.55 | sney | asterismo: see https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/tree/arch/x86/Kconfig for the APM options, and section 4.5 of https://kernel-team.pages.debian.net/kernel-handbook/ for the general rebuild/reconfigure procedure. |
| 20:55.04 | asterismo | i also disabled nouveau driver and did not worked |
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| 20:55.11 | asterismo | nomodeset |
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| 20:55.35 | asterismo | sney, thanks |
| 20:55.53 | asterismo | hey, this box is a true beauty from 2002's |
| 20:55.57 | mrkramps | asterismo, you already confirmed it's only display? so, the machine would be remotely available? |
| 20:56.00 | asterismo | 2GB of RAMBUS |
| 20:56.14 | asterismo | mrkramps, no, i cannot ssh to it |
| 20:56.19 | asterismo | it freezes |
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| 20:56.33 | mrkramps | ok, than it's of course not just graphics |
| 20:58.29 | asterismo | the only difference with and without nouveau enabled, is that with nouveau i can see a distarted desktop image when it freezes, and without it, it just freezes with the blank screen |
| 20:58.48 | sney | which is probably just framebuffer stuff and not really related to the suspend issue |
| 20:59.04 | mrkramps | ok, but the real point is it is freezing even for ssh |
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| 21:01.19 | sney | the real point is that nobody should be shocked that acpi suspend is broken on a workstation with a chipset that came out a year before acpi 2.0 was published |
| 21:01.49 | sney | and a 2010s attitude of "yeah just use the backport kernel and install firmware" is only appropriate for 2010s hardware. :P |
| 21:02.33 | mrkramps | sney, absolutely true, but for me - already having spend some hours with him - the matter of ssh was still an open question |
| 21:02.34 | sney | (even Dell wouldn't use draft acpi on a *workstation*, even if it snuck into some contemporary desktops) |
| 21:02.38 | asterismo | sney, but it worked out of the box in Debian 7 |
| 21:02.51 | asterismo | Debian 7 is 2013-2015? |
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| 21:03.12 | HelloShitty | Hello. I created a sparse file with 'dd' command and then, formatted it as a 'btrfs' filesystem. After formatting I mounted it on a folder inside /media. But when I try 'ERROR: not a valid btrfs filesystem: /media/btrfs', I get an error saying that this is not a btrfs filesystem. Any reason for this error? |
| 21:03.38 | sney | asterismo: debian is pretty good about supporting legacy hardware, but that doesn't make the hardware not legacy. eventually you have to do extra work to keep it all running |
| 21:03.39 | HelloShitty | ups, screwed up message |
| 21:04.20 | mrkramps | sney, is there a simple way to test if kernel was build with APM support? |
| 21:04.28 | mrkramps | in general |
| 21:04.46 | HelloShitty | Hello. I created a sparse file with 'dd' command and then, formatted it as a 'btrfs' filesystem. After formatting I mounted it on a folder inside /media. But when I try to run 'btrfs filesystem show /media/btrfs', I get an error saying 'ERROR: not a valid btrfs filesystem: /media/btrfs'. Any reason for this error? |
| 21:05.04 | petn-randall | mrkramps: probably by checking the config it was compiled with in /boot/config-*. |
| 21:05.08 | sney | mrkramps: broadly, 'grep APM /boot/config-$(uname -r) |
| 21:05.30 | asterismo | sney, yeah, i know. It's just that usually working things, dont stop working because of software... over time |
| 21:05.36 | mrkramps | sney, thanks! |
| 21:05.43 | asterismo | maybe they do, more often that i can imagine |
| 21:05.47 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: Did mounting it succeed? |
| 21:06.15 | asterismo | CONFIG_X86_APM_BOOT=y |
| 21:06.15 | asterismo | CONFIG_APM=m |
| 21:06.15 | asterismo | # CONFIG_APM_IGNORE_USER_SUSPEND is not set |
| 21:06.15 | asterismo | # CONFIG_APM_DO_ENABLE is not set |
| 21:06.15 | asterismo | # CONFIG_APM_CPU_IDLE is not set |
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| 21:06.16 | sney | asterismo: they totally do, but usually it's hardware that is no longer common, so few people notice. |
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| 21:06.28 | sney | asterismo: they totally do, but usually it's hardware that is no longer common, so few people notice. |
| 21:06.38 | sney | which kernel was that? and don't paste to the channel |
| 21:06.43 | asterismo | sorry, wrong paste |
| 21:06.56 | asterismo | https://paste.debian.net/1177870/ |
| 21:07.09 | wwilliam | jhutchins: that is the relevant info in the log. |
| 21:07.41 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: it did. I mounted using 'sudo mount -t btrfs volume.fs /media/btrfs' |
| 21:07.57 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: Can you share the output of `mount`? |
| 21:07.57 | sney | asterismo: what kernel is that? your paste doesn't say the version. wheezy? |
| 21:08.03 | HelloShitty | I already tried to copy a file inside the mount point and it also copied ok |
| 21:08.18 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: ok |
| 21:09.16 | asterismo | 4.19.0-13-686-pae |
| 21:09.18 | asterismo | debian 10 |
| 21:09.44 | sney | ohhh maybe it's disabled on amd64 |
| 21:09.53 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: this is the line from 'mount' where you can see it mounted: /home/psysc0rpi0n/Documents/encryption/volume.fs on /media/btrfs type btrfs (rw,relatime,space_cache,subvolid=5,subvol=/) |
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| 21:12.34 | sney | ,v apmd |
| 21:12.35 | judd | Package: apmd on amd64 -- jessie: 3.2.2-15; stretch: 3.2.2-15+b2 |
| 21:13.12 | asterismo | so? i could try ocpi=off apm=on on grub? |
| 21:13.29 | asterismo | does my kernel have this? |
| 21:13.31 | sney | if those are the right arguments for those modules, maybe, but you'll still need userland support |
| 21:13.49 | sney | apmd of course is gone since jessie |
| 21:13.59 | greycat | since stretch, it says |
| 21:14.25 | sney | it does say that. why am I reading everything backwards today? anyway |
| 21:16.07 | sney | and of course #891698 |
| 21:16.09 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/891698 in apmd (open): «apmd: daemon never starts (apm_available is hardcoded to no)»; severity: grave; opened: 2018-02-28; last modified: 2019-01-28. |
| 21:16.29 | mrkramps | noice |
| 21:17.01 | mrkramps | literal suicide |
| 21:17.55 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: Have you tried passing the path of the file instead? |
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| 21:26.10 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: how come? Pass the absolute path to the mount command? |
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| 21:27.03 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: `btrfs filesystem show /home/psysc0rpi0n/Documents/encryption/volume.fs` |
| 21:27.12 | HelloShitty | ah, no |
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| 21:27.17 | HelloShitty | will do that |
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| 21:29.04 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: result is the same |
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| 21:29.16 | HelloShitty | $ btrfs filesystem show /home/psysc0rpi0n/Documents/encryption/volume.fs |
| 21:29.19 | HelloShitty | ERROR: not a valid btrfs filesystem: /home/psysc0rpi0n/Documents/encryption/volume.fs |
| 21:29.41 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: also: |
| 21:29.43 | HelloShitty | $ file volume.fs |
| 21:29.46 | HelloShitty | volume.fs: BTRFS Filesystem sectorsize 4096, nodesize 16384, leafsize 16384, UUID=f963c2a1-6247-40bf-8716-c5d50cc07e6f, 131072/268435456 bytes used, 1 devices |
| 21:30.14 | HelloShitty | It recognizes the filesystem but somehow, btrfs doesn't like it |
| 21:30.38 | HelloShitty | Anyways, don't bother. I'm going to use LUKS to encrypt this file |
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| 21:31.06 | HelloShitty | I was thinking I could have a Luks formated volume but use a btrfs filesystem |
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| 21:31.35 | HelloShitty | but luks has it's own supported filesystems, luks, luks2 and a compatibility mode aes-loop or something like that |
| 21:31.40 | HelloShitty | accoring to luks man pages |
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| 21:31.49 | HelloShitty | s/accoring/according |
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| 21:34.32 | petn-randall | luks? LUKS knows nothing about filesystems, it takes an encrypted block device on one end and offers an unencrypted one on the other end. You can put whatever filesystem on it that you want. |
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| 21:38.32 | HelloShitty | yes |
| 21:38.36 | HelloShitty | nevermind what I just said |
| 21:38.41 | HelloShitty | I'm still reading about |
| 21:39.16 | HelloShitty | I'll format the volume after I have created the encrypted volume |
| 21:39.57 | HelloShitty | What kind of keys can I use as a password to created the encrypted volume? |
| 21:40.06 | HelloShitty | Can they be GPG encryption keys? |
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| 21:49.49 | Fromhell | hallo |
| 21:50.14 | sney | hi |
| 21:50.26 | KNERD | high |
| 21:50.57 | dvs | huh? |
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| 21:54.25 | Fromhell | can some one help |
| 21:54.34 | mrkramps | ask a question :) |
| 21:54.34 | Fromhell | https://paste.debian.net/1177877/ |
| 21:55.09 | sney | check your clock |
| 21:55.29 | Fromhell | sney ? |
| 21:55.50 | sney | a computer clock that is inaccurate can completely break pki/ssl |
| 21:56.14 | Fromhell | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:56.18 | Fromhell | it okey |
| 21:56.51 | greycat | that doesn't show the *day* |
| 21:57.11 | Fromhell | greycat where to check ? |
| 21:57.22 | sney | also make sure you have debian-archive-keyring installed and current |
| 21:57.45 | Fromhell | sney what i must do ? |
| 21:57.52 | Fromhell | i am not super user |
| 21:58.05 | greycat | just run 'date' |
| 21:58.14 | sney | 'apt policy debian-archive-keyring' will show you the package and its version |
| 21:58.19 | Fromhell | Mon 21 Dec 2020 11:58:11 PM EET |
| 21:58.23 | Fromhell | thats good |
| 21:58.34 | dvs | EET? |
| 21:58.38 | mrkramps | Fromhell, have you retried apt update? |
| 21:58.44 | Fromhell | EET estonia |
| 21:58.55 | mrkramps | maybe the mirror is updating? |
| 21:59.01 | Fromhell | mrkramps yes same problem |
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| 22:02.03 | oxek | Fromhell: paste contents of 'ls /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/' |
| 22:02.58 | Fromhell | oxek there is no files |
| 22:03.37 | sney | so again, debian-archive-keyring. |
| 22:03.50 | oxek | Fromhell: that's the problem then |
| 22:04.12 | Fromhell | oxek what must i do ? |
| 22:04.18 | oxek | sney: is it even possible to install that package if you don't already have the keys? |
| 22:04.24 | sney | sure, packages.debian.org |
| 22:04.40 | sney | there is an apt option to skip the check, but I don't remember it offhand |
| 22:04.53 | sney | --no-verify-something |
| 22:05.01 | oxek | Fromhell: try 'apt install debian-archive-keyring' and if that does not work, then one moment and I'll find what you need to download |
| 22:05.33 | Fromhell | 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded. |
| 22:06.02 | dvs | your sources.list correct? |
| 22:06.29 | jmcnaught | It is possible that the debian-archive-keyring package is installed and something/someone deleted the files from /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/ but there should also be duplicates in /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive* |
| 22:06.35 | oxek | Fromhell: assuming you're on debian 10 (buster), then download this http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/d/debian-archive-keyring/debian-archive-keyring_2019.1_all.deb |
| 22:06.45 | oxek | and then install it |
| 22:07.05 | dvs | with dpkg -i |
| 22:07.09 | Fromhell | dvs dvs |
| 22:07.10 | Fromhell | https://paste.debian.net/1177879/ |
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| 22:08.51 | Fromhell | oxek , make dpkd same problem |
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| 22:10.16 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: I tried to export my GPG key to give it as the key-file for LUKS to encrypt the volume, but when I try to open the volume, it doesn't accept the password. Does this means I can't use a GPG key as the encryption password to LUKS? |
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| 22:10.53 | oxek | Fromhell: paste the command you ran and the output |
| 22:11.08 | HelloShitty | I exported my GPG key using 'gpg2 --output pub-key.asc --armor --export KeyID-here' |
| 22:11.48 | Fromhell | oxek |
| 22:11.49 | Fromhell | https://paste.debian.net/1177880/ |
| 22:12.46 | oxek | Fromhell: is there anything in 'ls /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/' now? |
| 22:12.58 | jmcnaught | The files in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/ are conffiles so you need to run "dpkg --force-confmiss -i debian-archive-keyring_2019.1_all.deb" to replace those files. |
| 22:13.02 | Fromhell | no |
| 22:13.08 | Fromhell | oxek empty |
| 22:13.25 | oxek | then you need that dpkg reconfigure jmcnaught pasted |
| 22:13.57 | Fromhell | oxek how can i do that > |
| 22:13.58 | Fromhell | ? |
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| 22:14.18 | oxek | dpkg --force-confmiss -i debian-archive-keyring_2019.1_all.deb |
| 22:14.18 | dpkg | bugger all, i dunno, oxek |
| 22:14.25 | oxek | dpkg: shut up |
| 22:14.25 | dpkg | No, I won't, and you can't make me. :P |
| 22:15.31 | Fromhell | oxek , okey then try apt update > |
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| 22:17.21 | Fromhell | oxek |
| 22:17.22 | Fromhell | https://paste.debian.net/1177881/ |
| 22:17.22 | oxek | yes, now try apt update |
| 22:17.26 | Fromhell | now its, good |
| 22:17.27 | Fromhell | ? |
| 22:17.36 | oxek | sounds like it, yes |
| 22:17.48 | Fromhell | oxek, thanks , one more question |
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| 22:18.19 | Fromhell | Debian 4.19.118-2 (2020-04-29) can update kernel whith out restart ? |
| 22:18.29 | oxek | 'http://download.webmin.com/download/repository sarge InRelease' has "sarge" in the name, which might cause a bunch of issues maybe, but I'm not familiar with webmin |
| 22:18.46 | Fromhell | oxek yes i make it |
| 22:18.56 | mrkramps | Fromhell, no ⦠kernel upgrades still need a restart |
| 22:19.20 | Fromhell | Debian 4.19.118-2 (2020-04-29) need i update it ? or it,s good ? |
| 22:19.44 | oxek | if an upgrade is offered, then you probably should upgrade |
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| 22:20.11 | Fromhell | oxek, how can i offer it ? |
| 22:20.30 | Fromhell | i install debian 7 month ago |
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| 22:23.36 | mrkramps | Fromhell, running 'apt update && apt full-upgrade' should keep your system uptodate |
| 22:23.47 | Fromhell | ah okey |
| 22:24.02 | Fromhell | mrkramps , have you aver problem whith owncloud ? |
| 22:24.14 | mrkramps | Fromhell, never used it |
| 22:24.31 | mrkramps | just experimented a bit with nextcloud |
| 22:24.35 | Fromhell | it shows my php v3.4.0, need older |
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| 22:25.32 | Fromhell | mrkramps , have ther some to install nextcloud step by step |
| 22:27.26 | mrkramps | Fromhell, i used the official documentation https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/18/admin_manual/installation/index.html |
| 22:27.43 | Fromhell | thanks |
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| 22:28.19 | mrkramps | Fromhell, maybe using a docker image might be easier than manual installation |
| 22:28.41 | Fromhell | mrkramps , no thanks |
| 22:28.47 | Fromhell | i never use it |
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| 22:29.54 | jhutchins | !webmin |
| 22:29.55 | dpkg | Webmin is a lame web-based interface for unsafe system administration for Unix. Check it out at http://webmin.com/ Remember, dondelelcaro *hates* webmin. "i'd rather sit on the floor shoving table knives into live electrical outlets than run webmin on an exposed server." Removed from Debian post-Sarge, see http://bugs.debian.org/343897 . The Debian package from webmin.com is of poor quality. See <free whcp> for alternatives. |
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| 22:30.03 | Fromhell | mrkramps , it show me this problem whith kernel |
| 22:30.04 | Fromhell | https://paste.debian.net/1177887/ |
| 22:30.36 | mrkramps | Fromhell, so you tried restarting? |
| 22:30.37 | sney | Fromhell: try reading what it says. "you should consider rebooting" |
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| 22:30.58 | Fromhell | mrkramps i need to restart ? |
| 22:31.01 | mrkramps | yes |
| 22:31.32 | jhutchins | Fromhell: That is exactly what the message says. |
| 22:31.41 | Fromhell | ok will restart now |
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| 22:37.14 | Fromhell | how to OFF grafic , from console ? |
| 22:37.56 | sney | 'systemctl display-manager stop' should do it |
| 22:38.07 | Mister00X | init 3 ? |
| 22:38.11 | sney | er, reverse that. systemctl stop display-manager. |
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| 22:40.06 | Fromhell | okey i reboot |
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| 22:42.12 | P1gassu | so if while doing apt-get upgrade to 10.7 I see no space left on device, how to I delete old kernels or so |
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| 22:42.43 | P1gassu | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:42.44 | sney | 'apt autoremove' will usually get them, unless you have any that were not packaged, in which case manually delete from /boot |
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| 22:43.37 | sney | 'uname -r' will tell you the version of the running kernel. anything with a different version is safe to remove, via apt or otherwise |
| 22:43.49 | P1gassu | hmm apt autoremove tried but failed |
| 22:44.25 | P1gassu | yeah its 4.19.0-12-amd64 |
| 22:45.07 | Fromhell | jhutchins , Physical Memory how to make it lowe ?swap i know how |
| 22:45.36 | P1gassu | hmm, so just apt remove linux-image-foo ? |
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| 22:47.21 | P1gassu | and linux-headers-foo |
| 22:50.00 | Fromhell | P1gassu you for mee ? |
| 22:50.11 | dob1 | I don't understand I have a dir, I do ls -la from parent dir I see "dr--r--r-- 2 myuser myuser 1024 etc etc mydir" |
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| 22:50.46 | oxek | P1gassu: I had the exact same problem |
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| 22:50.55 | dob1 | ls -la mydir Permission denied and d????????? ? ? ? ? ? . |
| 22:51.02 | dob1 | what does this mean? |
| 22:51.08 | oxek | I'm weirdly happy that more people are running into the small default /boot |
| 22:51.16 | jmcnaught | dob1: you need the execute permission to enter a directory |
| 22:52.01 | dob1 | jmcnaught, damn right... |
| 22:52.02 | dob1 | thanks |
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| 22:52.39 | P1gassu | i'm just used to removing debian kernels, don't want to break it |
| 22:53.00 | P1gassu | seems i've a backlog though |
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| 22:54.41 | P1gassu | Fromhell, you want to swapon or something? |
| 22:55.26 | Fromhell | P1gassu, otal: 79% (Kernel + applications: 57% - Cached: 18% - Buffers: 4%) of psyhical memory |
| 22:56.59 | P1gassu | Fromhell, how much RAM do you have |
| 22:57.30 | Fromhell | 381.83 MiB1.46 GiB1.83 GiB |
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| 23:01.30 | P1gassu | https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=how+to+turn+on+swap+in+debian&ia=web |
| 23:02.24 | Fromhell | P1gassu swa not psyhicak |
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| 23:04.11 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: LUKS has nothing to do with GPG, I think you're on the wrong path. |
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| 23:07.12 | HelloShitty | petn-randall: you can encrypt volumes with LUKS and use a key file instead of a plain password |
| 23:07.24 | P1gassu | this seems to work https://www.tecmint.com/remove-old-kernel-in-debian-and-ubuntu/ |
| 23:07.36 | HelloShitty | What I'm asking is if I can use a GPG key as this key file for LUKS |
| 23:08.30 | P1gassu | Fromhell, that doesn't make sense |
| 23:08.48 | rk4 | don't say GPG key unless you mean a OpenPGP public or private key, it makes everythign very confusing |
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| 23:09.49 | HelloShitty | Well, we create GPG key pairs, right? Pub key and Private key |
| 23:09.58 | HelloShitty | It's this what I'm referring to |
| 23:10.09 | P1gassu | i keep getting /usr/share/bash-completion/bash_completion : no such file |
| 23:10.25 | rk4 | ok, so that's a very confusing thing to do, i don't understand why you would want to do that |
| 23:10.57 | HelloShitty | Do what? Create the GPG keys or use the keys with LUKS? |
| 23:11.07 | rk4 | yes. |
| 23:11.11 | Fromhell | P1gassu , ok thenks |
| 23:11.25 | HelloShitty | rk4: yes to which of the 2 options I mentioned? |
| 23:11.37 | P1gassu | looks like there is a /etc/bash_completion |
| 23:12.07 | rk4 | why do you want to use gpg public|private keys as keyfiles with LUKS |
| 23:12.15 | jmcnaught | HelloShitty: do you have some document that you are referring to regarding GPG and LUKS? |
| 23:12.35 | jmcnaught | Using your own public GPG key as the LUKS passphrase or keyfile sounds like a bad idea. |
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| 23:13.52 | HelloShitty | jmcnaught: I searched about encrypting volumes with LUKS and found a few articles but most of them are not using key files as the passphrases |
| 23:14.10 | HelloShitty | and if they are using key files, they are not using GPG keys explicitely |
| 23:14.22 | HelloShitty | they use other types of encryption |
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| 23:14.45 | HelloShitty | but none says that I can or cannot use GPG keys, so I was trying to understand if they can be used or not |
| 23:14.53 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: You are grossly misunderstanding how LUKS works. |
| 23:15.13 | HelloShitty | for instance here |
| 23:15.16 | HelloShitty | https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=120243 |
| 23:15.20 | HelloShitty | GPG is used |
| 23:15.26 | rk4 | perhaps it's easier to start from the other end of this confusion: what is it that you are trying to do? |
| 23:15.30 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: The encryption LUKS uses will be the same, no matter if you use a passphrase, an mp3 as keyfile, or your GPG (pub)key as keyfile. |
| 23:15.31 | HelloShitty | but I guess that it's to encrypt the key files themselves |
| 23:15.59 | HelloShitty | ahh ok |
| 23:16.13 | HelloShitty | I think I see now what I was doing |
| 23:17.00 | HelloShitty | but there are 2 encryption actions in that article |
| 23:17.14 | HelloShitty | the one with GPG an the other one with cryptsetup itself |
| 23:17.41 | rk4 | yeah but gpg and luks is all bullshit if we don't know what your goals are |
| 23:18.09 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: I can only recommend to use a good passphrase, and ignore the rest. If you use your GPG key, that's crap. |
| 23:18.13 | rk4 | gpg, and perhaps just luks, is complicating things beyond your ability to reason about |
| 23:19.07 | HelloShitty | ok |
| 23:19.20 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: Remember you need to provide the keyfile to open the LUKS container. So you can't have your root filesystem on LUKS because you need to use GPG to decrypt the keyfile. |
| 23:20.50 | HelloShitty | ahh no. I'm not going to mount a filesystem here |
| 23:21.03 | HelloShitty | It's just a small container to put some info inside |
| 23:22.27 | HelloShitty | is this command supposed to take long time to complete: gpg2 -v --cipher-algo aes256 --digest-algo sha512 -c -a > test.gpg |
| 23:22.33 | rk4 | LUKS might be completely inappropriate and/or useless, since we still don't know what you're trying to do... |
| 23:23.36 | rk4 | you're stuck in the weeds of gpg and luks, if you do get something working it seems more than possible that it'll provide zero confidentiality |
| 23:23.47 | HelloShitty | I have created a small sparse file of 256Mb, now I want to encrypt it with luks, then I format it with btrfs, mount it, save some info inside it like files, unmount it, close the luks volume and save that file somewhere safe |
| 23:24.26 | HelloShitty | Whenever I need that info, I hope I can open the volume and use the info inside it |
| 23:24.52 | HelloShitty | And this volume file, would also be encrypted |
| 23:25.09 | HelloShitty | like a small vault for some sensitive info |
| 23:26.00 | petn-randall | HelloShitty: Why not just encrypt the files with GPG? It saves you a lot of layers in between. |
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| 23:27.27 | HelloShitty | Well, an extra layer is never too much, and a small volume like this, allows for some organization |
| 23:27.40 | HelloShitty | like create folders and split files accoring to their contents |
| 23:27.55 | HelloShitty | also, it is a way of learning something different |
| 23:28.05 | HelloShitty | I didn't know of such thing as sparse files |
| 23:28.35 | HelloShitty | I was trying to run that command but it is taking too much time to complete |
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| 23:28.51 | HelloShitty | the gpg command: gpg -v --cipher-algo aes256 --digest-algo sha512 -c -a > test.gpg |
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| 23:30.01 | mrkramps | i still don't get it |
| 23:30.30 | rk4 | its waiting on stdin... |
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| 23:31.23 | HelloShitty | rk4: it's saying: gpg: writing to stdout |
| 23:31.33 | HelloShitty | but I don't see anything |
| 23:31.40 | HelloShitty | and I don't get the prompt back |
| 23:31.51 | mrkramps | because you redirect it to a file |
| 23:32.13 | HelloShitty | An shouldn't I get the prompt back? |
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| 23:32.36 | HelloShitty | if I ctrl+c, it treminates the command with: gpg: signal Interrupt caught ... exiting |
| 23:32.48 | HelloShitty | So, I guess the command was not finished |
| 23:32.51 | petn-randall | No, because it's still waiting on STDIN to EOF. |
| 23:33.27 | HelloShitty | And how am I supposed to send the EOF? |
| 23:33.32 | rk4 | i'm beginning to think you should maybe for now use lastpass or something....you've got some learning to do, gpg||luks presumes a bit of *nix knowledge, basic crypto and some gpg+luks specific stuff |
| 23:33.54 | rk4 | you can get there, but it's a multiday learning experience |
| 23:34.08 | petn-randall | Every extra layer is another opportunity to shoot yourself in the foot, by either invalidating the encryption, or making it impossible to recover your data. But in your case it seems like a valuable learning experience. |
| 23:34.32 | HelloShitty | well, for now, I'm just making some experiences |
| 23:34.40 | HelloShitty | so, no risk for now |
| 23:35.03 | rk4 | https://gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#CONCEPTS and https://gitlab.com/cryptsetup/cryptsetup/-/wikis/LUKS-standard/on-disk-format.pdf are important to read, but you'll need that basic crypto familarity for it to make sense |
| 23:35.34 | HelloShitty | Tahnks. Will save those links in my booksmarks |
| 23:38.21 | rk4 | crypto is interesting, if you're just making some experiences, a cliche thing to do is to write your own secrets/password store |
| 23:39.16 | rk4 | there's only a few building blocks needed, and once your'e familiar with them LUKS becomes trivial |
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| 23:40.13 | HelloShitty | password store? You mean to write an application to store my passwords? |
| 23:41.02 | HelloShitty | Luks is kinda trivial for basic operation. What is not so trivial, at least for me, is the amount of subjects one have in crypto |
| 23:41.31 | HelloShitty | I usually make some conffusion with what one can do with GPG keys, SSH keys, etc |
| 23:41.54 | HelloShitty | the cyphers, the algorythms, the curves, etc etc |
| 23:42.37 | HelloShitty | it's a lot of information to kinda know an understand where and how to use which types of encryptions, algorythms, curves, etc |
| 23:43.06 | rk4 | for the most part, if you just see toy RSA and toy DH working [50 year old tech?] then you can have a reasonable grasp of what's going on today |
| 23:43.25 | HelloShitty | So, for instance, I know GPG keys can be used to encrypt files, folders, and also a common usage is to encrypt communications |
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| 23:44.11 | HelloShitty | Don't even know what 'toy RSA' and 'toy DH' are |
| 23:44.17 | HelloShitty | I mean, I know what RSA is |
| 23:44.32 | HelloShitty | DH I presume to be Diffie-Helman or whatever it is spelled |
| 23:45.25 | HelloShitty | but the conffusion is mostly with the crypto lexico. It's quite big |
| 23:45.49 | HelloShitty | an for someone like me just trying to use a couple of things, it becomes dawnting very quickly |
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| 23:48.13 | rk4 | yip, well, you were seemingly trying to build your own construct from the pieces of gpg and luks, that was going to be hard. there's easier mainstream paths out there [eg: chromebooks, or an android, encrypt storage without the user needing to know anything about crypto] |
| 23:50.42 | HelloShitty | well, but the interesting part is the crypto part. :) |
| 23:54.45 | dob1 | what does it means in auth.log ssh log port 33711:11: the :11: ? |
| 23:54.53 | freem | port number. |
| 23:54.59 | freem | huh. no. |
| 23:55.01 | freem | stupid me. |
| 23:55.02 | dob1 | the port number is 33711 |
| 23:55.10 | dob1 | no problem |
| 23:56.12 | freem | maybe a session/pty number? |
| 23:56.22 | dob1 | maybe |
| 23:56.43 | dob1 | consider that it get disconnected so it's not a login |
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