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| 00:17.10 | Hash | What happened? |
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| 00:18.11 | Hash | What's the best way to switch from a diff distro to debian but keep /home and try to prerve /etc/ and other configs (going from a debian based distro to debian) |
| 00:18.20 | Hash | Don't ask me why. Just help me. Thanks! |
| 00:19.32 | Hash | This machine needs conversion! |
| 00:19.48 | abrotman | you should ask the distro you're going to install to ensure their installer doesn't wipe the partition |
| 00:20.38 | Hash | Well, the goal is to take this machine, repalce ubuntu with debian stable, and try to preserve /home and perhaps some settings from /etc so I don't have to redo everthing. Try to save me some work. |
| 00:20.43 | Hash | If possible. |
| 00:21.16 | abrotman | oh, I' msorry, TO Debian |
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| 00:21.35 | abrotman | when you run the installer, there's an option to not format a filesystem |
| 00:21.58 | abrotman | we may need to know more about the filesystem if there's something special like LVM or luks or whatever |
| 00:22.47 | Hash | No I'll be installing a different partition altogether, so incase anything gets messed up, I can have the original ubuntu parition. Oh just direct partition access, on layers in the middle, GPT disk, 5800x cpu |
| 00:24.21 | Hash | I'm not wanting to save the package list, as that maybe different (diff package names etc.) but common configs like nginx, and various other stuffs, I think I'll just install debian to a diff partition, and then mount /etc from original partition, and copy over whatever I need for whatever ackage. |
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| 00:24.47 | Hash | Thing I wanted to worrya bout was, config file differences perhaps in the same software but diff distro mabye cause issues? I dunno this. |
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| 00:25.54 | Hash | The rest of the most of the configs would be in /home and again the worry is whether programs migh have changed their config file format or something from ubuntu 20.04 lts stable to debian stable latest. |
| 00:26.23 | somiaj | abrotman: due to differences it might be easier to just backup /etc and /home, and then copy over the stuff you want, this also is good practice so you have a backup of your data. |
| 00:26.32 | somiaj | arg |
| 00:26.35 | somiaj | Hash: ^^ |
| 00:26.39 | Hash | Oh thanks man |
| 00:26.48 | Hash | I shall proceed with diff partition then! |
| 00:27.41 | somiaj | though note, software configurations in $HOME should carry over just fine provided the versions match, often times configurations can go from older to newer version, but not newer to older as nicely (and this varies between software). Hence if you just backup and copy over stuff, you can test things out and see what configurations still work and don't. |
| 00:27.57 | Hash | HYmm |
| 00:28.06 | Hash | I will back up /home/usr/.config an any .dot files |
| 00:28.09 | somiaj | I once tried to share /home across a few dual boots, and quickly found out it was a pain due to different versions of software being slightly different. |
| 00:28.13 | Hash | That's a sound idea |
| 00:28.30 | Hash | yeah, that's I discovered once too which is why I'm very cautious now |
| 00:28.32 | somiaj | I would jsut backup all of /home/usr (or all of /home), as backups are always good ot have floatinga round. |
| 00:28.32 | Hash | I will backup home too |
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| 00:28.52 | Hash | well I mean just the dot stuff. |
| 00:29.14 | somiaj | Plus I find personally when I do this, I have changed, and so sometimes it is just easier to reconfigure to my new desires from defaults vs some old config that I have had floating around for many years. |
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| 00:43.24 | abstrn | Maybe this isn't the best place to ask this, but I haven't found an answer anywhere else: I have an external hdd that stays plugged in most of the time but sometimes I "safely remove" it via udisksctl --unmount/--power-off and then unplug it. Then when I plug it into the same USB port shortly after, it is not at all recognized by the system. 'lsblk' doesn't show it, it doesn't show up anywhere in |
| 00:43.25 | abstrn | /dev/sd* that I can find. If I plug it into another USB port, it shows up and I can mount fine. And if maybe a week goes by, I can plug it into the original port and it's recognized again. Does anyone know what's going on? Does the system somehow cache which harddrives are ejected, and ignore them for a while after they're removed? |
| 00:49.06 | somiaj | abstrn: that sounds like hardware issues, could that usb port just be failing? |
| 00:49.27 | abstrn | perhaps, but it |
| 00:49.36 | abstrn | 's happened on multiple usb ports |
| 00:49.45 | somiaj | maybe an issue with the usb controler? |
| 00:50.17 | somiaj | have you looked at 'demsg' right after you plugged the drive back in, you should get a hardware event even if it doesn't assign it a blk device |
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| 00:53.53 | abstrn | there's no indication in dmesg that it's been plugged in... maybe it is a hardware issue. but another strange thing is that when i plug in a usb hub into the original port, and plug the hdd into the hub, it is recognized |
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| 00:58.33 | somiaj | could be the usb drive is having issues, the usb controler, have you tried this in another computer? Do you have this issue with other usb devices? |
| 00:59.06 | somiaj | but what you are describing sounds like hardware to me, if the kernel isn't triggering any event when you plug it in (which should appear in demsg), then some hardware isn't triggering the event to send to the kernel. |
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| 01:12.54 | abstrn | makes sense, probably hardware then :(. i thought i remember it happening on a debian server a while ago but that was an old machine and could also have had a hardware issue. |
| 01:12.56 | abstrn | thanks |
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| 01:19.48 | somiaj | you could look at the kernel, but I would say hardware related, even if the hardware is mostly fine. |
| 01:20.06 | somiaj | but also makes it harder to debug, hence suggestion, try different computers, different devices |
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| 01:27.36 | ryouma | abstrn: i am curious about udisksctl --unmount/--power-off as i have not heard of them. have you considered hdparm -B and umount? |
| 01:37.47 | jmcnaught | ryouma: udisks2 can mount/unmount without root |
| 01:38.17 | jmcnaught | GNOME uses it for automounting, but it also has a CLI udisksctl. |
| 01:39.20 | abstrn | ryouma: yeah i use it bc it doesn't require root |
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| 01:41.01 | ryouma | ok |
| 01:41.10 | ryouma | did you try it though to see if it is different in your case? |
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| 01:43.41 | somiaj | This still shouldn't explain the issue, this option shouldn't be disabling a usbport somehow. |
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| 01:54.55 | abstrn | huh, looking again at the manpage, udisksctl power-off says that "the USB device will be deconfigured followed by disabling the upstream hub port it is connected to". so maybe that is the issue? ryouma: i haven't used hdparm to power off a device, i thought -B just changes power management/preformance? |
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| 01:55.43 | abstrn | or is unmounting the device enough? i guess i just got in the habit of doing udisksctl unmount / power-off before removing a device, maybe the second step isn't necessary? |
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| 02:06.53 | ryouma | idk if an unmounted partition's drive will still spin, i would only guess that it does. but ime the power management can be used to power off effectively. |
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| 02:08.44 | ryouma | abstrn: look at sdparm man page. eject, stop, and " In the Linux 2.6 series, especially with ATA disks, using sdparm to stop (spin down) a disk may not be sufficient and other mechanisms will start the disk again some time later. The user might additionally mark the disk as "offline" with 'echo offline > /sys/block/sda/device/state' where sda is the block name of the disk. To restart the disk "offl |
| 02:08.44 | ryouma | ine" can be replaced with "running". " |
| 02:09.07 | ryouma | there -y in hdparm but maybe only for an obsolescent bus |
| 02:09.34 | ryouma | although i believe it worked ok for external sata long ago |
| 02:10.12 | ryouma | so it sounds complex, unfortunately |
| 02:15.05 | abstrn | ryouma: hm, thanks for the info, i'll take a look at sdparm |
| 02:16.32 | ryouma | i use -B for those bus powered externals |
| 02:16.51 | ryouma | idk if i should be using more lately, haven't checked |
| 02:17.22 | ryouma | i.e. portables |
| 02:18.22 | ryouma | another question is whether you are improving anything other than power. for example, does it affect power surge response. or does arm parking status affect anything. |
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| 03:19.46 | YWH_1 | Does anyone know what package in Debian supplies GKSU? I did a package search at debian.org but received no results. |
| 03:20.51 | jmcnaught | ,v gksu |
| 03:20.52 | judd | Package: gksu on amd64 -- jessie: 2.0.2-9; stretch: 2.0.2-9+b1 |
| 03:20.55 | Grobo | Anyone use pure-ftpd? I'm trying to set it up but it's completely ignoring the .conf file |
| 03:21.07 | jmcnaught | YWH_1: it has not been in Debian since stretch |
| 03:21.24 | sney | ,bug rm gksu |
| 03:21.26 | judd | Bug https://bugs.debian.org/892768 in ftp.debian.org (closed): «RM: gksu -- RoM; RoQA; unmaintained»; severity: normal; opened: 2018-03-12; last modified: 2018-09-12. |
| 03:22.48 | sney | wow, that admin:/// hint in message 29 is a revelation |
| 03:25.45 | sney | doesn't seem to work in plasma though, oh well. |
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| 03:29.45 | Unit193 | pkexec? |
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| 04:29.00 | somiaj | grr, just discovered on my recent install I got my partitions backwards, welp gotta fix that (switched / and /home) |
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| 04:53.30 | gry | somiaj: sounds uncomfortable :/ |
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| 05:13.53 | riff-IRC | gry: yeah, a little suboptimal |
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| 05:14.32 | riff-IRC | my 1st thought was "switch the mountpoints in fstab" buuuuuuuut that's obviously not feasible |
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| 05:16.27 | Lope | In my /etc/network/interfaces I have a bridge, br0 configured to include eth0 in it's bridge-ports. In /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf I have unmanaged-devices=interface-name:br0;interface-name:eth0;interface-name:enp34s0 |
| 05:16.43 | Lope | And yet when I boot up, eth0 receives a DHCP IP address from the LAN |
| 05:16.50 | Lope | It's extremely annoying. |
| 05:17.00 | Lope | That IP is on the same subnet as my static IP on br0 |
| 05:17.14 | Lope | So I have to manually remove the IP from eth0 on every boot. |
| 05:18.11 | somiaj | Any reason you want to use network manager and myabe just result to only using the interfaces file? |
| 05:18.33 | somiaj | and you don't have any dhcp setup for eth0 or the bridge in the interfaces file? |
| 05:18.57 | somiaj | maybe (a) disable network manager, and make sure that is the culprit that is causing you the problem, if so one solution is just uninstall network manager. |
| 05:19.06 | alkisg | Does `nmcli` show this device as unmanaged? If yes, the problem would be in /etc/network/interfaces, you could pastebin its content |
| 05:19.32 | somiaj | Or let someone who knows network manager give a better way to check if it is managed or not. |
| 05:19.37 | ryouma | i have network manager purged and my system seems to work, fwiw. i was nervous about purging it. |
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| 05:19.52 | ryouma | and didn't change anything to purge it, just puirged it |
| 05:20.00 | Lope | somiaj, I only have NetworkManager because it makes it easy to connect to a wifi network. But I'm not currently using NetworkManager at all. I don't even have a wireless adapter installed/attached at the moment, so the NetworkManager widget in KDE is empty. |
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| 05:20.37 | somiaj | I personally use wpa_supplicant in roam mode and wpa_gui for this from my interfaces file, /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant has a good guide how to configure this |
| 05:21.06 | somiaj | If you want a non networkmanager way to manage wifi networks, but this maybe beyond your actual problem, and more avoids it. I would first folow alkisg advice and double check that network manager is really causing the problem. |
| 05:21.46 | Lope | alkisg, `nmcli` shows that every single network interface is unmanaged by NetworkManager, currently. |
| 05:22.26 | alkisg | Lope: then I would gather that the IP is set by ifupdown. Can you pastebin the contents of /etc/network/interfaces? Hide macs/ips if you want |
| 05:23.14 | Lope | oh... bastard. I found /etc/network/interfaces.d/setup |
| 05:23.32 | Lope | I've not used files in there before. |
| 05:23.46 | Lope | In that file it adds eth0 dhcp |
| 05:24.04 | somiaj | yea, more and more things are splitting up configuration files to make things more modular, but now you no longer have a single file to look through. |
| 05:24.07 | Lope | (Ive not used interfaces.d before) seems like a relatively new thing. |
| 05:24.18 | Lope | yeah. Thanks |
| 05:24.41 | Lope | That explains the BS I've been experiencing on my other PC as well :/ |
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| 05:24.51 | somiaj | Lope: yea, more and more there are foo.d/ directories all through out /etc |
| 05:25.04 | somiaj | so just make sure you keep your eyes out for them. |
| 05:25.18 | Lope | yeah |
| 05:25.41 | Lope | /etc/daddy.d/ who's your daddy? |
| 05:26.40 | alkisg | But note that each .d has its own rules; /etc/network/interfaces.d requires "no extension", while e.g. /etc/dnsmasq.d accepts "almost any extension, even .bak" |
| 05:27.16 | Lope | somiaj, thanks for the tip man! I've only used wpa supplicant a handfull of times, because I found that configuring wifi interfaces via config files was very arduous. |
| 05:27.30 | Lope | somiaj, but wpa_gui sounds promising. I'll check it out. |
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| 05:27.50 | somiaj | Lope: It is a very simple tool, and I rarely use it, but yea I like this as wpa_supplicant is installed and used anyways, so use its features vs something else |
| 05:29.04 | Lope | I actually don't like NetworkManager at all, I just find that it's helpful for connecting to WiFi. I've also used the network manager widget previously when testing VPN connections (only from very new live distros) which was quite nice, it even handled wireguard. |
| 05:30.12 | Lope | But generally I don't like magic, it's not often the magic does what I want specifically. And when it breaks, then if I've been reliant on magic, then I suddenly find myself with broken production systems, at step 1 of knowledge and negative time available to fix the issue. |
| 05:30.15 | alkisg | It's also nice that it displays an icon with the current status, so in desktop environments you can easily detect when the network cable has been unplugged :) |
| 05:31.33 | Lope | alkisg, yes, although I tell networkmanager that it's not allowed to touch my wired interfaces, so that functionality doesn't really work for me. |
| 05:32.03 | Lope | I found NetworkManager with bridges to be very unreliable. |
| 05:32.22 | Lope | And I often use bridges when I run VM's. |
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| 05:32.26 | alkisg | I'm using network-manager with bonding in about 100 schools with no issues, it's rather stable here |
| 05:32.36 | alkisg | Not bridging though; just bonding |
| 05:33.02 | Lope | is bonding like raid 1 or like failover? |
| 05:33.42 | alkisg | Both. It doubles the speed with 2 NICs, and can also work with a single NIC |
| 05:34.03 | Lope | So you need 2 NICs on each end both configured to bond? |
| 05:34.30 | alkisg | No. E.g. a server has 2 NICs, and 10 clients have 1 NIC. This means that the server can send/receive with 2 gbps instead of 1 gbps |
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| 05:36.04 | alkisg | (all in the same simple switch) |
| 05:36.11 | Lope | oh, wild, so can you connect the server's 2 NICs to an unmanaged switch, and bond the nics to have a single static IP? |
| 05:37.12 | alkisg | Yes, I even set the same MAC for both NICs from network-manager, so that it's easier to detect the server with arp from elsewhere |
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| 05:37.25 | Lope | wow, that's super wild |
| 05:37.37 | Lope | So only the server itself needs to know about the bonding? |
| 05:37.40 | alkisg | Right |
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| 05:37.48 | alkisg | And it's just an nmconnection file, nothing more |
| 05:37.49 | Lope | The switch is a dumb unmanaged switch, and the other nodes on the network don't know? |
| 05:37.54 | Lope | Amazing |
| 05:38.02 | alkisg | Exactly, cheap switches here, schools are poor :D |
| 05:38.09 | Lope | Wow, that's awesome |
| 05:38.25 | Lope | I've got a spare gbps port going to waste. |
| 05:38.54 | Lope | It's a pity that SFP+ and 10GBE is so expensive. |
| 05:39.39 | Lope | I mean, I could afford picking up some 10GBE cards at $100 each but then I ask myself "Do I really need it?" and the answer is "Not for a few hundred dollars." |
| 05:39.40 | Lord_Devi | I've got something similar setup with my home. 2 broadband connections at home, each tunneled into its own remote cloud server. I don't think it was a bonded setup, but they work in fail over mode and will under most circumstances boost my bandwidth. |
| 05:40.15 | Lord_Devi | I wanted a setup, where I could have 2 ISPSs, and any one of them could go down - but I'd still have internet. And if both were up, I might be able to download or upload things a bit faster. |
| 05:40.36 | Lope | Lord_Devi, interesting, I planned to do that previously. Are you using any special sauce to make it work? |
| 05:41.04 | alkisg | I'm hoping that we'll soon see switches that will support 2x 10GBE (bond) for the server, and the newish 2.5 GHz standard for the clients with the existing cabling. With the HDD > SSD upgrade, local disks are now much faster than LAN, and this will lower the gap... |
| 05:41.15 | Lope | Lord_Devi, I actually was going to do the same thing, but then it turned out that my secondary ISP was such a piece of crap and so unreliable as to be pretty much a waste of money, so I cancelled it. |
| 05:41.18 | Lord_Devi | Well it is OpenBSD based, and I was using ifstated to monitor the interface state. Then pf to make sure return traffic was going over the right interface. But honestly it wasn't working 100% right. |
| 05:41.32 | Lord_Devi | I'm still working on fixing the quirks with a person I found to help. |
| 05:42.27 | Lope | alkisg, the thing is though, that 10GB copper ethernet (whatever it's called) doesn't need to be expensive. and it even works over Cat5e over short distances (like one room to another). |
| 05:42.41 | Lope | They're just charging early adopter tax on it. |
| 05:43.07 | alkisg | Ah really? My use case is "a single computer lab of e.g. 25 m2", so it would work there with the existing cabling, nice! |
| 05:43.36 | Lope | alkisg, I can't bring myself to buy any 2.5Gbps equipment. You can basically get almost the same bonding 2x 1gbe ports together, and I've always got spare 1gbps nics banging around. |
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| 05:43.41 | alkisg | Then, 20 gbps for the server and 10 gbps for each client, would be as fast as NVMes, great! |
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| 05:44.01 | Lord_Devi | There is a 4 port 10Gb on amazon for like only 140 I think. It supports Copper as well as SFP+. Adapter needed for copper. |
| 05:44.07 | alkisg | Unfortunately we can't use bonding on the clients, not enough ports for that |
| 05:44.26 | Lord_Devi | The copper 10Gb's use way more power than the fibre optics though, and run really hot. |
| 05:44.30 | alkisg | Last time I checked, the 10Gb NICs were also expensive... |
| 05:45.09 | Lope | alkisg, and I almost always find it a waste of money to spend $30 on 2.5Gbps instead of $100 on 10Gbps, becauee invariably, I buy it initially, just because I want it. Then later I find out that I need it, and then the $30 I spent on 2.5Gbps is basically a mediocre solution that I have to discard, so the $30 was actually just a waste and I should have just spent $100 from the get go. Cheap is expensive. So I tend to delay pulling the trigger when possible, |
| 05:45.09 | Lope | but then go big when I do upgrade. |
| 05:45.10 | Lord_Devi | I'd generally only really use the copper if I had to run a longer 10Gb I think. NOT AN EXPERT though.. lol.. I just found that long fibre was really difficult to acquire, and then work with. |
| 05:45.57 | Lord_Devi | Lope: Yeah it really is a good idea to wait those extra couple of months to be able to just afford the correct solution the first time. If possible. |
| 05:46.21 | alkisg | A quick check here, says 30⬠for 2.5 Gb, and 143⬠for 10 Gb. Hmm, for e.g. 12 clients, schools couldn't afford 10 Gb yet :/ |
| 05:46.42 | Lope | But I even feel like 10Gbps is a bit of a joke. I've seen 40Gbps QSFP+ cards on ebay for a reasonable price. Problem is I'm in South Africa and shipping costs with "the virus" is worse than ever. Also apparently those old used QSFP+ server cards are very power hungry, which is also off-putting. |
| 05:46.46 | Lord_Devi | Schools don't know how to handle money. |
| 05:46.52 | alkisg | I guess we'll need to use SSDs for caching for a few years :D |
| 05:47.09 | alkisg | (fortunately most of our traffic is cache-able) |
| 05:47.28 | Lord_Devi | Lope: lol, i found out about the QSFP+ just after I had pulled trigger on ordering all my 10gb SFTP equip. Like.. the next day. I had thought I dug too!! |
| 05:47.33 | Lope | So I'm kind of irrationally waiting for reasonably priced 100GbE or at least like 50Gbe etc to feel like it's a worthy reason to spend money on a network upgrade. It's gotta at least reach something that resembles a single SSD speed. |
| 05:48.03 | Lord_Devi | Ideally on gear not produced or manufactured by skynet. |
| 05:49.25 | Lope | Lord_Devi, apparently getting SFP+ switches are cheaper, but then if you want to get the copper adapters it ends up being a lot more expensive. |
| 05:49.39 | Lope | So apparently there are 2 cost effective ways to homelab fast ethernet. |
| 05:49.55 | Lope | 1. QSFP+ with direct attach copper cables "DAC cables" |
| 05:50.26 | Lope | 2. Proper RJ-45 10GBE copper switch and NIC's. The switch prices have come down a LOT. The NIC's are unfortunately still $100. |
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| 05:51.35 | Lope | Lord_Devi, interesting, yes I've heard that coppper 10Gbe uses a lot more power but haven't looked into quantifying it |
| 05:52.13 | Lord_Devi | Yeah. That mattered to me too, because I was trying to build an ultra low power home lab. I even went so far as to get this special ATOM processor for my openbsd firewall. |
| 05:52.55 | Lord_Devi | Although... I think I am kind of not sure if I want to continue that trend. I really like the idea of my network being able to resist a ton of power outage. But at the same time, I am not super pleased with these low power atoms. |
| 05:55.50 | Lord_Devi | MikroTik has this really nice 16 port 10Gb I got, CRS317-1G-16S+RM, to tie into a 24 port 1Gb switch (CSS326-24G-2S+RM) that also has 2x 10Gb ports (to tie to the big ass 10Gb). Didn't cost much!! |
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| 05:56.37 | Lord_Devi | The 16 port mikrotik 10Gb was the most expensive part, but still I was shocked at how affordable it was. I think it is a bit more now.. costs like $350. I think I got mine for about $250... |
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| 05:58.35 | Lope | Lord_Devi, when you say low power atom, what model are you using and what's the idle power from wall? |
| 05:58.58 | Lord_Devi | Oh that's a fun question. |
| 05:59.33 | Lord_Devi | I think it was 17w TDP if I'm not mistaken. I have to go look at the manual/box to recall the model number though. |
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| 06:02.42 | Lord_Devi | Aha: hw.model=Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU C3558 @ 2.20GHz |
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| 06:03.36 | Lord_Devi | Yeah it says it is a 16w TDP. So I'm not 100% if that's exactly power from wall you asking for, but it is related. I get a little confused with those specifics honestly. |
| 06:03.58 | Lord_Devi | RUNS great. Takes FOREVER to boot. |
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| 06:32.19 | TheBigK | hi, I have a developer here that does have a root partition encrypted but the password which worked yesterday is not working anymore. https://paste.debian.net/1198067/ |
| 06:32.26 | TheBigK | does anyone have any idea about this? |
| 06:32.47 | TheBigK | i saw some errors logged in the smart memory... but the lukscontainer looks fine to me?! |
| 06:32.56 | TheBigK | is there some sort of check mechanism which i can use? |
| 06:33.17 | hwpplayer1 | Yes But this is a Security hole |
| 06:33.28 | hwpplayer1 | As in my understanding |
| 06:33.40 | hwpplayer1 | You need to prove the ownership |
| 06:33.43 | TheBigK | hes 100 % sure that he knows the password |
| 06:34.11 | TheBigK | is there a destroying mechanism for too many tries? no, right? |
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| 06:35.03 | hwpplayer1 | TheBigK: Are there a domain controller like Active Directory or OpenLDAP that forces 3 times to send password ? |
| 06:35.29 | hwpplayer1 | Are there a keyboard input issue like EN_US and local keyboard ? |
| 06:35.30 | TheBigK | hwpplayer1: what are u talking about... we r talking about cryptsetup... |
| 06:35.38 | hwpplayer1 | I know what it is |
| 06:35.41 | TheBigK | hwpplayer1: no... we tried in live system |
| 06:35.57 | hwpplayer1 | I got it okay |
| 06:36.04 | TheBigK | ur trolling, thanks |
| 06:36.19 | hwpplayer1 | Does the device works electronically on other computer ? |
| 06:36.41 | hwpplayer1 | No I am into forensics and I am sensitive when it comes to security and private ownership |
| 06:36.50 | TheBigK | the device works on his laptop as well.. why would i doubt it when i see that theres a luksContainer... |
| 06:37.35 | hwpplayer1 | Could you please test the device on other computer ? Do you have a chance for that ? |
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| 06:37.56 | TheBigK | not as easy... i would need a nvme adapter |
| 06:38.05 | TheBigK | why would i do that |
| 06:38.11 | hwpplayer1 | Okay gotcha let me think a solution |
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| 06:39.54 | hwpplayer1 | i saw some errors logged in the smart memory... but the lukscontainer looks fine to me?! // How did you realize that ? With a tool I mean or by hand ? I ask because I will check tools for that Okay ? |
| 06:41.41 | hwpplayer1 | TheBigK: Can I pm you ? |
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| 06:56.41 | Lope | Lord_Devi, in my experience it's pointless worrying about power consumption if you don't have a device that measures power consumption from the wall, because sometimes you'll do "optimizations" that you think save power, but they cause more power to be used, or sometimes you do "optimizations" that make the system painfully slow, but only save an irrelevant amount of power. So I now regard having such a device as a requirement before I do any power |
| 06:56.41 | Lope | tweaking. They're not expensive. |
| 06:57.27 | Lope | Expecially in the case of a desktop PC. At least with a laptop, if you run it from battery, powertop can tell you relatively accurately how much power you're using. |
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| 07:00.49 | hwpplayer1 | TheBigK: Are you there ? |
| 07:01.25 | Lord_Devi | Lope: Yeah. I agree with the need for a meter of some kind. I got a special kind of power supply bar for my rack that will measure the power drain at each outlet in it. You can connect to the power remotely to fetch data from it too. ALTHOUGH that's home lab stuff I haven't gotten to playing with yet. |
| 07:02.06 | Lord_Devi | I don't have anything like that for my desktop or various vdu's though. |
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| 07:03.22 | Lord_Devi | I am getting a sense for that problem you raise issue with though: The tweaking for 'irrelevant amount of power' differences. I probably could have gotten a an ATOM with a bit more power draw, like say.. 30 TDP and gotten WAY more performance out of it. |
| 07:03.40 | *** join/#debian funabashi (funabashi@185.52.0.236) |
| 07:03.57 | funabashi | Hi does debian has anything like ubuntu server without the GUI ? |
| 07:03.58 | hwpplayer1 | Lord_Devi: Lope What are you talking about ? |
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| 07:04.21 | hwpplayer1 | funabashi: Why not ? |
| 07:04.44 | Lord_Devi | We were discussing network gear, and their power usage. |
| 07:04.50 | Lope | hwpplayer1, Lord_Devi said he setup a low power atom server for his homelab. |
| 07:05.08 | hwpplayer1 | When it comes to server we usually run a server without a GUI |
| 07:05.13 | hwpplayer1 | funabashi: ^ |
| 07:05.14 | Lord_Devi | We were talking about 10Gb SFP+ networking gear, and I had mentioned how the copper adapters draw way more power on them than the fiber does. |
| 07:05.37 | *** join/#debian wintersky (uid453465@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zogwpvurgwtwawdy) |
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| 07:05.48 | hwpplayer1 | Okay I assumed that a spam message or lorem ipsum :) |
| 07:06.15 | Lord_Devi | hah, one of the things I said? Am I word salading? |
| 07:06.16 | hwpplayer1 | Maybe it is morning here Lope |
| 07:06.45 | hwpplayer1 | I could not be able to focus also I joined the channel for a few minutes |
| 07:06.53 | hwpplayer1 | I am into microservers |
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| 07:07.14 | Lord_Devi | You mean like containerized stuff? Podman and such? |
| 07:07.22 | hwpplayer1 | I will install a server release to this microserver and run the firewall and all thinks inside it |
| 07:07.32 | funabashi | hwpplayer1: so if i download deban 10 i have no GUI right? |
| 07:07.49 | hwpplayer1 | No it has a name MicroServer Like HP MicroServer It is like a box |
| 07:08.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1019] by debhelper |
| 07:08.08 | hwpplayer1 | You need to download netinstall funabashi |
| 07:08.14 | Lord_Devi | Oh! I see. Gotcha. Yeah I my atom is a SuperMicro!! Even moar micro. ;) |
| 07:08.25 | Lord_Devi | I don't think I like supermicro much tbh. |
| 07:08.59 | hwpplayer1 | I am into software defined anything/everything |
| 07:09.18 | hwpplayer1 | So I try to fix the issue with install bla bla on an OS |
| 07:09.45 | hwpplayer1 | I do not want to rely on for example Cisco and it's OS or similar |
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| 07:12.20 | Lord_Devi | Yeah I am in the same boat with that. It's that general feeling that lead me to just digging into 'pf' for openbsd, rather than bothering with pfsense. |
| 07:12.28 | hwpplayer1 | Lord_Devi: It seems that I talk about K8s or docker when i say microserver yes you are right |
| 07:12.40 | Lord_Devi | Similar scenario... Not cisco related. I was never interested in cisco for anything. |
| 07:13.11 | hwpplayer1 | I learned Cisco it is funny but I do not want any of their device or software |
| 07:13.11 | Lord_Devi | I'm JUST learning bout k8's now. It is actually kind of why I'm looking into Debian more seriously now. |
| 07:13.42 | hwpplayer1 | Debian is like Red Hat Ubuntu is like more like Fedora |
| 07:13.51 | Lord_Devi | I am trying to figure out what a good server farm for a lot of static websites might look like. K8's are sounding like a good option for me to be playing with. But TOTALLY new to me. |
| 07:14.09 | Lord_Devi | I'm just... like, a linux user from the 90's who's use virtual machines his whole life. |
| 07:14.29 | hwpplayer1 | You can handle if you know what is the kernel side and how UNIX is designed nothing new there |
| 07:15.18 | dreamer | hwpplayer1: eh? |
| 07:15.27 | Lord_Devi | Oh interesting grouping! I wouldn't have used that. I would have grouped them the other way around. "Ubuntu is like a mutant Debian." and, "Fedora is a mutant Red Hat". |
| 07:15.29 | hwpplayer1 | dreamer: ? |
| 07:15.35 | dreamer | "< hwpplayer1> Debian is like Red Hat Ubuntu is like more like Fedora" |
| 07:15.38 | dreamer | this doesn't make any sense |
| 07:15.43 | dreamer | and is not based in any reality I know of |
| 07:16.17 | hwpplayer1 | Okay I mean Debian and RHEL is more focused on stability and the others are focused on fast development |
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| 07:16.29 | dreamer | not really? |
| 07:16.35 | dreamer | ubuntu is not focussed on "fast development" |
| 07:16.44 | Lord_Devi | Ubuntu is based on Debian/sid. Red Hat kinda stems from Fedora. I say kinda.. because they have an odd chicken and egg thing going on. |
| 07:17.00 | hwpplayer1 | From my experience I see that But Fedora is really focused on fast development |
| 07:17.39 | tarzeau_ | ubuntu, redhat, fedora is offtopic here. thanks |
| 07:17.40 | Lord_Devi | I was toying with the idea of trying fedora for my k8 project. I like the idea of CoreOS and of silverbleu's immutable operating systems. |
| 07:17.48 | Lord_Devi | But ultimately.. RH are dicks, and don't like using their tech. lol |
| 07:18.26 | hwpplayer1 | tarzeau_: I know I am teaching the K8s to focus on it's own Debian instances, trying him to understand Debian |
| 07:18.29 | Lord_Devi | I went to the k8 homepage, and their instructions.. IMMEDIATELY dived into instructions for building k8 clusters with Debian. That was a great sign to me. |
| 07:19.05 | Lord_Devi | Just found out today Docker K8's are a no-go though. I wasn't aware of that. |
| 07:19.13 | Lord_Devi | Docker Pro? No thanks. Podman it is I guess. |
| 07:19.25 | hwpplayer1 | Google suggests or offers in their shell Debian as i know |
| 07:20.11 | hwpplayer1 | In short you can run Debian for anything Lord_Devi |
| 07:20.47 | hwpplayer1 | tarzeau_: What do you think about the cryptsetup issue above ? |
| 07:21.00 | hwpplayer1 | Do you know any forensics team for Debian ? |
| 07:21.34 | Hash | I'm working on a debian set of meta packages |
| 07:21.58 | *** join/#debian Darcidride (~Darcidrid@2a01:cb15:47a:4300:f1a1:d26e:14ca:57c9) |
| 07:21.58 | Hash | Forensics/security softwares, categorized, kind of life security pentesting distros |
| 07:22.12 | Hash | easily installable forensics or otherwise tools |
| 07:22.26 | Hash | I can't stand kali linux or ubuntu or any of that distros |
| 07:22.30 | hwpplayer1 | He was asking for his disk, he can not access it etc |
| 07:23.13 | Lord_Devi | Has: BlackArch |
| 07:23.17 | Lord_Devi | hash |
| 07:23.22 | Hash | Is it debian? |
| 07:23.37 | Hash | Arch tells me it's not debian in the name itself. |
| 07:23.37 | Lord_Devi | No. It's ArchBased. Defaults to AwesomeWM. |
| 07:23.46 | Hash | Oh thanks for the suggestion budd |
| 07:23.50 | Lord_Devi | Is there a good pentesting distro based on pure debian? |
| 07:23.51 | Hash | Nah, I like/want debian |
| 07:23.53 | Hash | :) |
| 07:24.09 | Hash | no but you do't ned a distro |
| 07:24.20 | Hash | you just need debian, and some meta packages to install said categorized tools. |
| 07:24.22 | hwpplayer1 | Debian is enough for your needs just apt install some tool |
| 07:24.24 | Hash | easy peasy |
| 07:24.34 | Lord_Devi | I hear you about Kali though. |
| 07:24.40 | Hash | IT's bloated bloatware |
| 07:24.42 | Lord_Devi | Ah yeah meta packages. Like build-essentials? |
| 07:24.50 | Hash | I want debian menu to show these programs, no matter the wm. |
| 07:25.00 | Hash | I use Xmonad only. |
| 07:25.04 | Lord_Devi | Sorry, it has been a while since I loaded up Debian. Refreshing myself on it right now. |
| 07:25.16 | Hash | meta packages are those that depend on other packages. Meta means about. |
| 07:25.37 | Hash | They are packages about packages, that install other packages. Or a collection fo packages by installing just one. |
| 07:25.38 | Lord_Devi | Yeah Xmonad is nice. I don't haskell though. But I used Xmonad for a few weeks on my laptop. It was actually the very first tiling window manager I ever used, and fell in love INSTANTLY. |
| 07:25.46 | gry | nice |
| 07:25.52 | Hash | you amek a meta package (*or jsut a package) and just put in whatgever it should dependon |
| 07:26.06 | Hash | Then you install that pckage, and everything it depends on wil be auto isntalled. |
| 07:26.17 | Hash | You can consider them tasks kind of like, in tasksel, but not really |
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| 07:26.20 | Hash | But kind of. |
| 07:26.25 | Lord_Devi | Yeah. Good to know there are cool pentest meta packages to look at. Also, sounds incredibly useful to perhaps just make a few of my own. |
| 07:26.33 | Lord_Devi | TASKSEL!! I remember that |
| 07:27.30 | Hash | Also ##security |
| 07:27.35 | *** join/#debian Texou (~Texou@unaffiliated/texou) |
| 07:27.40 | Hash | I'm doing my 2nd bachelors in science these days |
| 07:27.48 | Hash | Cybersecurity this time, first was comp. sci |
| 07:28.42 | Lord_Devi | Oh very cool. There is going to be an insatiable demand for security experts. The ransomware is spreading fear amoung the corps like crazy. |
| 07:29.23 | Lord_Devi | Plus it is fun. I may be wrong about this, but I think Cyber Security is as yet, the only real IT profession that is nearly purely gamefied. |
| 07:29.56 | Lord_Devi | You literally build your resume by playing security wargames. Way cooler than building a resume by having HR count your lines of codes and number of commits. |
| 07:30.43 | *** join/#debian Haudegen (~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at) |
| 07:30.47 | Hash | Security is the highest IT profession I feel. |
| 07:32.09 | *** join/#debian luuuciano__ (~luuuciano@unaffiliated/luuuciano) |
| 07:32.16 | Lord_Devi | Yes it encompasses all the rest of the IT professions. |
| 07:32.54 | Hash | You need to know multiple disciplines in order to be successful at it. You need to know networking, software dev/programing for software/buffer/etc exploit, you need to be able to use various OS comfortably, use various OSes command line tools and internals in depth, sytem admin work, settign up services and sercuring/hardening them, penetration testing, social engineering etc. etc. |
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| 07:34.04 | Lord_Devi | Yeah, "I don't like Mac, so i'm not going to touch it." is not something a security expert gets to say. About any OS really. |
| 07:34.47 | Hash | yup |
| 07:34.52 | Lord_Devi | Lord, I watch some of these videos of people walking through some of those pico challenges and wargames. It is CRAZY the obscure knowledge these guys need to get through the challenges. |
| 07:34.56 | Hash | no matter how annoying you find an os, you gotta know abou it |
| 07:35.10 | Hash | Anyway we're offtopic. |
| 07:35.22 | Lord_Devi | hah, yeah. ##security I guess. |
| 07:35.33 | Lord_Devi | Didn't know about that. I'll poke my headi n later. Thanx |
| 07:35.47 | Hash | Yup |
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| 07:50.53 | TheBigK | i ended up reinstalling the system. the dev needs to work. we gonna do a header backup now... that we can recover for next time |
| 07:50.58 | TheBigK | but i dont know what happened |
| 07:51.06 | TheBigK | im using crytpsetup for years... never had such issue |
| 07:51.18 | TheBigK | that all of the sudden my password isnt accepted anymore |
| 07:51.22 | *** join/#debian CAPTCHA_REQUIRED (44f2e88408@nat4.nuegia.net) |
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| 07:53.34 | Hash | Sorry to hear that. I never used it. |
| 07:53.58 | Hash | Who else knew the password? |
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| 07:54.52 | jelly | incoming drama |
| 07:54.53 | TheBigK | ??? |
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| 07:55.08 | Hash | Make sure if anyone else knew the pass, they didn't change it. |
| 07:55.10 | TheBigK | wtf is going on |
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| 07:55.21 | TheBigK | none knew the password... |
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| 07:56.18 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | freenode got h4xed |
| 07:56.27 | Hash | I think he's fine. A few sentences of venting is fine. Shit happened. It's natural. So I didn't follow your issue, but what happened? You upgraded something? Or when did yo notice disk was inaccessible? |
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| 07:57.02 | TheBigK | from one day to the other... he tried older kernel as well... we tried live system. his cryptsetup password did not get accepted |
| 07:57.25 | Hash | Something must have changed on the system. |
| 07:57.35 | Hash | Any package updatges or forigen repos? |
| 07:57.41 | Hash | Audit everything you can |
| 07:57.42 | TheBigK | how should i check when i cant access the device without the password :D |
| 07:58.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1010] by debhelper |
| 07:58.08 | Hash | The man should know if he did anytning to the system |
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| 07:58.18 | TheBigK | what would that change |
| 07:58.24 | TheBigK | i count mount the filesystem |
| 07:58.27 | TheBigK | cant |
| 07:58.36 | Hash | To try to determine what happend. |
| 07:58.43 | Hash | How do you know it won't happen again, magiclaly? |
| 07:58.44 | TheBigK | doesnt matter... we reinstalled |
| 07:58.52 | TheBigK | i dont know... |
| 07:58.58 | Hash | So try to find out I think. |
| 07:59.07 | TheBigK | not my job i think :) |
| 07:59.08 | Hash | Unless reinstall is easier, then just keep doig that. |
| 07:59.10 | Hash | :) |
| 07:59.26 | TheBigK | linux users are admins of their own computers... i can assist... but not do the job for him |
| 07:59.41 | Hash | and he does not know the passowrd? |
| 07:59.49 | Hash | Do you unlock each employee pc yourslef every day? |
| 07:59.50 | TheBigK | he thinks he does know the password 100 % |
| 07:59.52 | Hash | That sounds tedious. |
| 07:59.59 | TheBigK | but it wouldnt let me open the lukscontainer |
| 08:00.24 | TheBigK | i didnt do anything... he came to me that he cant enter his password |
| 08:00.37 | TheBigK | then i tried to assist... and wasnt able to for obvious reasons |
| 08:00.51 | TheBigK | his password worked yesterday and now it doesnt anymore |
| 08:00.54 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | hold on a minute |
| 08:01.04 | Hash | Som,ething on his sytem msut hve changed, obviosu. |
| 08:01.11 | Hash | my fingers suck right now. arhtrisi pain |
| 08:01.16 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | freenode just got fully hacked |
| 08:01.25 | Hash | dude. We're focusing on a issue |
| 08:01.26 | TheBigK | the only man who could have changed something is him... obviously |
| 08:01.51 | Hash | Exactly. Which is what I meant, by asking him, the man should know what he did |
| 08:01.53 | Hash | yesterday |
| 08:01.59 | Hash | did he update anything, isntall thigns, what did he do? |
| 08:02.03 | Hash | did he change the pass? |
| 08:02.16 | TheBigK | why would he... i doubt it and he would probably tell me ? :D |
| 08:02.18 | somiaj | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED: #freenode might be a useful channel if you care about that. |
| 08:02.24 | Hash | no |
| 08:02.30 | Hash | if he screwd that up |
| 08:02.32 | Hash | he won't admit |
| 08:02.37 | Hash | for fear of being let go |
| 08:02.45 | Hash | could be anything. You don't ever trust anyone. |
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| 08:02.59 | TheBigK | we r not in north korea here... he would have admitted it... trsut me |
| 08:03.13 | Hash | you can't say for certain anything about another's mind. |
| 08:03.26 | Hash | Hel |
| 08:03.34 | Hash | One can rarely ever even be certain of one's own mind. |
| 08:03.36 | Hash | ffs |
| 08:03.38 | Hash | :) |
| 08:03.49 | TheBigK | true... i mean... its not the biggest deal in the end of the day... annoying surely... but not a big deal.. everything he was working on, was checked in.... |
| 08:03.55 | Lord_Devi | I've totally nuked data in the past. Owned up to instantly. Kept that client for years. |
| 08:03.57 | another | Hash: Don't read my mind, please. |
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| 08:04.30 | Hash | I'll try not to! |
| 08:04.39 | another | Thanks |
| 08:04.46 | Hash | Are there other disk encruption solutions to use? |
| 08:05.03 | Hash | Also, do you back up encrypted disk? |
| 08:05.15 | Hash | way to backup encrypted disks is mirroring |
| 08:05.21 | TheBigK | why would i do anything... its his computer... |
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| 08:05.30 | Hash | It's yoru computer, |
| 08:05.36 | Hash | You're the owner, asusmingly |
| 08:05.54 | Hash | its your computer and your data. |
| 08:05.59 | TheBigK | its not. |
| 08:06.02 | TheBigK | but its okay |
| 08:06.27 | Hash | I thought you owned the office or something. |
| 08:06.33 | Hash | like ou're an owner of a dev studio or soemthing |
| 08:06.40 | Hash | something like that, my bad for assuming |
| 08:06.46 | TheBigK | im admin... hes my colleague |
| 08:06.52 | Hash | Oh ok |
| 08:06.55 | TheBigK | hes dev... im admin... |
| 08:07.06 | TheBigK | i help him in linux things when he needs assistance |
| 08:07.16 | TheBigK | but hes obviously responsible for his computer... |
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| 08:07.30 | TheBigK | i dont have access to it... so i cant be respsonsible for anything |
| 08:07.41 | TheBigK | im just nice... :) |
| 08:07.55 | Hash | nice people creep me out. |
| 08:07.57 | Hash | :) |
| 08:07.57 | Lord_Devi | No bofh training. |
| 08:08.29 | Hash | civil and polite are good. Nice... almost always psychopaths. |
| 08:08.31 | Hash | runs away |
| 08:09.20 | Hash | For example, I'm a good person, helpful guy, loving and caring man... but I'm not a very nice man. |
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| 08:09.34 | Hash | I will absolytely go out of my way to help you, but I might not be so ncie about it. |
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| 08:10.09 | Lord_Devi | A good way to help encourage people to learn lessons says I. |
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| 08:14.59 | Hash | question is, it's not magic |
| 08:15.10 | Hash | So what would/could have changed that made password not acceptable anymore? |
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| 08:21.14 | Hash | And about the recently oper kills, thre was this gy in ##security claiming he had 0 days aginat this very ircd and he was going to use them if the ops iddn't take his findings seriously |
| 08:21.23 | Hash | he said he would prove it. I wonder what's happening. |
| 08:21.47 | TheBigK | #freenode is the right place i would say |
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| 08:53.38 | queip | freenode is dying btw |
| 08:55.03 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | queip is right |
| 08:55.14 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | you shouldn't ignore this like this is some transient event |
| 08:55.43 | queip | https://fuchsnet.ch/freenode-resign-letter.txt |
| 08:56.20 | shtrb | queip, what do you mean freenode is dying ? |
| 08:56.38 | queip | shtrb: as in above letter from staff |
| 08:56.45 | EnchanterTim | It was bound to happen. You don't trust a dbag like Lee |
| 08:56.47 | EnchanterTim | FFS |
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| 08:57.20 | EnchanterTim | Also #debian-offtopic |
| 08:57.29 | EnchanterTim | or #freenode |
| 08:58.25 | queip | channels might need to move to other ircnet, esp if they are oriented around various aspects of free networks. I guess debian has OFTC #debian, so lucky for us |
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| 09:01.07 | shtrb | EnchanterTim, d-o become little bit toxic last time I visited , so I thank you but no |
| 09:01.33 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | OFTC is much nicer than freenode |
| 09:01.44 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | I remember emailing them because their javascript didn't work |
| 09:01.57 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | they validated my nickserv manually |
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| 09:07.43 | SymbioticFemale | hey everyone. theres a dumpster fire going on in freenode right now. if you have debian support questions or some copper wire to burn the insulation off of, come join the dumpster fire. |
| 09:07.51 | SymbioticFemale | sorry. in #freenode |
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| 09:10.07 | oxek | SymbioticFemale: shouldn't affect debian much, the official irc is on OFTC |
| 09:10.14 | oxek | also, #debian-offtopic |
| 09:10.23 | SymbioticFemale | oh yeah i forgot to tell -offtopic |
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| 09:13.26 | shtrb | It was an honor to chat with you all |
| 09:14.47 | ratrace | shtrb: can't move to OFTC if the Node implodes? :) |
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| 09:15.01 | oxek | I might end up switching ISP so that I can connect to oftc |
| 09:15.04 | shtrb | I'm sure some will move to other systems |
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| 09:15.15 | oxek | maybe starlink will work |
| 09:16.01 | wintersky | what's happening? |
| 09:16.39 | ratrace | wintersky: --> #freenode ; tl;dr corporate takeover, contradicting infowar, implosion (not) imminent |
| 09:18.02 | shtrb | ratrace, but your are not at OFTC :-( |
| 09:18.13 | ratrace | nope. I'm a diehard Freenoder |
| 09:18.36 | shtrb | in such case it was an honor |
| 09:19.24 | ratrace | 'twas! |
| 09:22.23 | oxek | ratrace: I'll miss you if we never see each other on IRC again... You helped me many times. |
| 09:22.42 | oxek | I'll miss many people in this channel |
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| 09:24.18 | Hash | OFTC debian is official for irc.debian.org and will remain |
| 09:24.32 | Hash | Makes no difference, as all official debian channels and project is there. |
| 09:25.27 | shtrb | Odin (OFTC) would make the benches ready for a glorious feast |
| 09:25.28 | Hash | Should something happen to freenode, there is always irc.debian.org #debian and all official channels. People will simply start joining there. |
| 09:25.53 | Hash | They should certainly get ready to expect more users perhaps. Who can say |
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| 09:26.07 | Hash | certainly + who can say. Sometimes I'm high. Nevermind me. |
| 09:26.44 | Hash | In fct |
| 09:28.40 | Hash | ok joined oftc debian in case something happens here |
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| 09:30.40 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | ITS HAPPENING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 09:31.21 | blackroot | what's happening? |
| 09:31.28 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | the death of freenode |
| 09:31.33 | blackroot | how so |
| 09:31.51 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | Fuch's personal website https://fuchsnet.ch/freenode-resign-letter.txt |
| 09:33.13 | ratrace | https://gist.github.com/shadowcat-mst/998cea12794768bdb3da2daeff31baad |
| 09:34.14 | Hash | This is noise. Please continue in another channel. |
| 09:34.16 | qrpnxz | ah, ig this isn't even the offish debian IRC eh? |
| 09:34.44 | qrpnxz | gonna join those |
| 09:34.47 | Hash | https://wiki.debian.org/IRC always with official information |
| 09:34.52 | qrpnxz | ty |
| 09:34.53 | Hash | Please do! |
| 09:34.56 | Hash | yw |
| 09:35.17 | qrpnxz | funny thing is that i'm on here on an XMPP bridge LOL |
| 09:36.05 | Hash | I use weechat 3.x |
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| 09:50.10 | tmm88 | heyho |
| 09:50.31 | *** mode/#debian [+o themill] by ChanServ |
| 09:51.08 | *** topic/#debian by themill -> Reminder that irc.debian.org points to irc.oftc.net ; Current Debian release is buster, 10.9 point release /msg dpkg 10.9; /msg dpkg buster; /msg dpkg stretch->buster; /msg dpkg apt suite changed | Stretch has limited LTS support: /msg dpkg stretch-lts ; /msg dpkg 9.13 | NO FLOOD: /msg dpkg paste | offtopic: #debian-offtopic | testing/unstable: #debian-next @ irc.oftc.net | chanlogs: /ms |
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| 10:45.15 | funabashi | Hi is there any lightwight debian version? i dont need any GUI. |
| 10:46.41 | ratrace | funabashi: yes. just don't install one during.... installation. |
| 10:46.49 | shtrb | or uninstall |
| 10:47.28 | ratrace | more precisely, don't _select_ the (Default (GNOME)) GUI during installation .. or uninstall which may be a bit more finnicky to do |
| 10:47.41 | shtrb | Is network cross posting is also bad practice ? |
| 10:47.56 | ratrace | yes |
| 10:48.00 | shtrb | :-/ |
| 10:48.12 | shtrb | ratrace, are you willing to join debian@oftc to answer there ? |
| 10:48.12 | funabashi | shtrb: :-) |
| 10:48.28 | ratrace | shtrb: freenode ain't dead yet :) |
| 10:49.12 | shtrb | One should know when to retreat and when to hold ground |
| 10:50.40 | ratrace | ain't over until the fat lady sings. |
| 10:51.02 | shtrb | She is packing her bags :) |
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| 10:56.51 | folti_ | <ratrace>: if freenode dies, libera? or matrix? |
| 10:57.04 | folti_ | "dies" |
| 10:57.22 | dreamer | "renamed" more like it |
| 10:57.59 | shtrb | irc will not fall |
| 10:58.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1024] by debhelper |
| 10:58.36 | folti_ | i really don't want to be offtopic, but i'm interesed in further plans |
| 10:59.26 | shtrb | first one would be to join debian at OFTC |
| 10:59.50 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | what if i told you, xmpp |
| 11:00.00 | jelly | ratrace, the fat lady may be prepping for stage right now |
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| 11:00.09 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | debian already has an xmpp channel |
| 11:00.13 | CAPTCHA_REQUIRED | on debian.org |
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| 11:17.03 | queip | how to copy files from mounted dir, that has some IO errors? |
| 11:17.39 | queip | file by file entire dir. replacing with 0000 things that cant be read, and making a log |
| 11:19.50 | jelly | ddrescue or dd_rescue can do one file or one block device at a time. |
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| 11:21.23 | jelly | iteration can be a separate subproblem to solve |
| 11:22.24 | shtrb | Anyone have a clue how to properly run flatpak under ssh -X |
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| 11:34.12 | Lope | mdadm create --verbose /dev/md/nvme --level=0 --raid-devices=3 /dev/nvme0n1 /dev/nvme1n1 /dev/nvme2n1 |
| 11:34.24 | Lope | error: mdadm: An option must be given to set the mode before a second device |
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| 11:37.15 | ratrace | shtrb: why? what's the error you get? |
| 11:37.44 | Lope | ah, supposed to be --create |
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| 11:46.27 | Lope | any recommendations for chunk-size for raid 0 of NVME? |
| 11:46.31 | Lope | 3x nvme drives |
| 11:48.57 | ratrace | Lope: depends on your file sizes histogram |
| 11:49.16 | jelly | about yay big |
| 11:49.20 | ratrace | Basically you want your most sized files to fit in 3 chunks |
| 11:50.01 | ratrace | 3 chunks *or more |
| 11:50.36 | ratrace | you don't want less. so for example if you use chunk size of 64k, any file smaller than that won't be spread in 3 stripes. only files 3x64k or bigger would. |
| 11:51.33 | ratrace | I use 8k for my steam games 2-way raid0, as an example. |
| 11:51.38 | Lope | ratrace, I'm confused. I thought mdadm --level 3 will spread data across the 3 devices so that any block stored on the md, will consume space across all 3 devices? |
| 11:52.12 | ratrace | Lope: yes but how do you think it'll make 3 stripes for chunk size N if the file is smaller than 3xN ? |
| 11:52.13 | Lope | if I specify --chunk=12K does that mean it'll put 4K on each device, resulting in a 12k chunk that I should format my filesystem with? |
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| 11:52.57 | ratrace | as far as I know, that's chunk size PER stripe |
| 11:53.09 | Lope | Is a stripe a single device? |
| 11:53.14 | ratrace | ya |
| 11:53.19 | Lope | mdadm man page doesn't say either way |
| 11:53.32 | Lope | okay, well the default was 512B so surely it must be. |
| 11:53.44 | ratrace | 512 KB |
| 11:54.06 | Lope | ratrace, oh, shit, you're right |
| 11:54.10 | Lope | 512KB is fucking huge? |
| 11:54.13 | Lope | why so big? |
| 11:54.19 | Lope | I misread and assumed 512B |
| 11:54.40 | Lope | 512K is insane in the membrane |
| 11:54.44 | ratrace | https://raid.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/A_guide_to_mdadm#Blocks.2C_chunks_and_stripes |
| 11:55.02 | Lope | How about 8K, that way it should work well on my NVME SSD's which might have 8K blocks internally. |
| 11:55.06 | shtrb | ratrace, that the problem I don't get an error (in any log I could find) I do ssh -X , do "flatpak run com.skype.Client" no error presnted but no drawing of X locally. I had even minimized it to local machine only (to be sure it's not a firewall or something like that issue ) so locally ssh -X differentuser@localhost would still fail |
| 11:55.18 | Lope | ratrace, I'm going to be storing large files, videos. |
| 11:55.28 | Lope | But I don't see any point in going with big chunk sizes |
| 11:55.36 | Lope | Might as well go with 8K per device. |
| 11:55.36 | shtrb | at OFTC a good soul mentioned it could be that flappak is failing to connect properly to dbus session |
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| 11:56.11 | ratrace | Lope: I did benchmarks. the biggest difference was for file size fitting in the full stripe width. for 8k chunks that was 16k or larger |
| 11:56.39 | ratrace | but between 8k or 64k or 512k, the difference was negligible in my tests in fact, coutner intuitively, it seemed as if smaller chunkss were faster |
| 11:57.43 | ratrace | (16k or larger, for a 2-wide raid0, thus 2x8k) |
| 11:57.47 | jelly | also you probably want to avoid giving SSDs too many tiny writes, even if their firmware and caching and write blocks are supposed to Deal With It |
| 11:58.40 | ratrace | that too. eraseblock sizes matter |
| 11:58.51 | jelly | SSDs have like 1M-4M blocks "internally" |
| 11:59.16 | Lope | jelly, interesting |
| 11:59.59 | ratrace | Lope: one thing though .... raid0 can be _slower_ than other levels, depending on the use case |
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| 12:01.42 | ratrace | so for a video hosting use case, it may happen that you're better off with a mirror, if performance is what you seek, assuming you can spare the space, if you have multiple processes contending for reads. it's not as clear cut, you should benchmark as close to your use case as possible |
| 12:03.38 | ratrace | the reason is relatively simple. A single read transaction will engange the full stripe width of disks, whereas for mirrors, a single reader process might use one disk, another will use anotehr disk and yet another will use the third. |
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| 12:04.19 | kline | https://www.kline.sh/ |
| 12:04.24 | ratrace | so 3-way raid1 can satisfy 3 readers independently, wheree a 3-wide raid0 can satisfy 1 reader for same drive engagement, bandwidth and iops per drive. |
| 12:05.28 | ratrace | (writes are the opposite: single writer will concurrently hit 3 disks for 1/3rd of bandwidth of single, compared to mirror) |
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| 12:06.18 | Lope | ratrace, I'm so lost reading about chunk size |
| 12:06.29 | Lope | I find it very weird that the default is 512K |
| 12:06.30 | ratrace | I was too, so I ran tests :) |
| 12:06.31 | Lope | Seems so insane? |
| 12:06.34 | ratrace | it is |
| 12:06.37 | Lope | hahaha good idea. |
| 12:06.41 | Walex | ratrace: that comparison between 3-wide RAID0 and RAID1 is way, way too simplistic, it depends a lot on access patterns, stripe size, rotational latency. |
| 12:06.44 | Lope | I suppose tests are the only way. |
| 12:07.05 | ratrace | Walex: correct. my point was that raid0==faster is not necessarily true, depending on use case |
| 12:07.06 | Walex | Lope: even tests can be misleading in the general case |
| 12:07.25 | Lope | Walex, right, so I'll test with my specific workload |
| 12:07.36 | Lope | Okay, will start with 8K for shits. |
| 12:08.06 | Walex | ratrace: thart is well expressed. |
| 12:08.25 | ratrace | however, the way mdadm works, it is my experience, maybe biased, that it's PID related. btrfs definitely is PID related (single PID will NOT balance and engage multiple disks on >1 async depth) |
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| 12:10.28 | Walex | ratrace: IIRC MDRAID is not PID related but the block subsystem and elevators may introduce similar behaviour. |
| 12:11.27 | kline | libera.chat is open btw |
| 12:11.45 | ratrace | yeah I did not dig deeper, just observing differences between mdadm+ext4, btrfs and zfs on same 2-way raid0 and 2-wide raid1 examples |
| 12:11.51 | qrpnxz | did you guys see the global ann from jess? |
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| 12:11.59 | ratrace | (the other way around, 2-way raid1, 2-wide raid0) |
| 12:12.48 | ratrace | qrpnxz: so it seems the Fat Lady is gurgling holy water and doing final vocal exercises before climbing the stage.... |
| 12:13.04 | Walex | Lope: this is a discussion of chunk size and latency: http://www.sabi.co.uk/blog/12-two.html?120221#120221 and in reality things are rather more complicated than that. |
| 12:13.14 | qrpnxz | lmao sorry geez |
| 12:13.18 | ratrace | whoops that ..... came out wrong. that was in relation to previous "ain't over until the fat lady sings" commentary about Freenode death |
| 12:13.28 | qrpnxz | kline, thx |
| 12:13.50 | qrpnxz | ah ok :) |
| 12:14.46 | ratrace | time to wipe out the nickserv profile .... see y'all on OFTC when this one implodes |
| 12:15.00 | qrpnxz | ðï¸ |
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| 13:05.47 | c0var | ratrace: OFTC is libera.chat? |
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| 13:06.07 | ratrace | no |
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| 13:06.41 | sappheiros | goodbye >_> since official debian is on OFTC |
| 13:06.51 | sappheiros | thanks for your help |
| 13:06.52 | ratrace | OFTC is OFTC, Debian has official channels on OFTC; this on FReenode is unofficially official; libera.chat is supposedly a fork of Freenode by ops who are resigning now en masse |
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| 13:07.39 | c0var | ah thx |
| 13:08.25 | SymbioticFemale | the new freenode is 10 times better because it doesn't permit TOR *and* it doesn't have working TLS |
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| 13:09.09 | ratrace | patience.... :) |
| 13:09.30 | SymbioticFemale | lol everyone is registerring over the clear / 6667 |
| 13:09.42 | SymbioticFemale | NSA will have everyone's password |
| 13:10.05 | c0var | https://restoreprivacy.com/tor/ |
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| 13:31.14 | shtrb|work | Could an OP modify the topic to say OFTC is the one we should be using ? |
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| 13:39.50 | ratrace | shtrb|work: isn't it already? |
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| 13:39.59 | ratrace | also .... OFTC no support for SASL plain ... :(((( |
| 13:40.10 | jelly | they have a certfp funcional equivalent |
| 13:40.19 | ratrace | pffft |
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| 13:40.54 | jelly | let me see if irc.libera.chat has server password, that seemed to work best on freenode |
| 13:41.19 | oxek | did anyone manage to grab the registration of #debian on the other network? |
| 13:42.18 | zaggynl | someone did, can't seem to connect to to the libera server anymore |
| 13:42.27 | ratrace | it's having a meltdown at the moment |
| 13:42.34 | zaggynl | slightly on fire |
| 13:42.55 | oxek | freenode on fire, libera on fire, ... |
| 13:43.00 | ratrace | just a smidge |
| 13:43.01 | oxek | I wonder if OFTC is doing fine right now |
| 13:43.07 | shtrb|work | ratrace, look at the topic here |
| 13:43.32 | jelly | oxek, #debian namespace is protected right now. |
| 13:43.43 | ratrace | shtrb|work: "Reminder that irc.debian.org points to irc.oftc.net" |
| 13:44.04 | shtrb|work | facepalm |
| 13:44.09 | oxek | I should ask for +o in here and take a screenshot |
| 13:44.14 | oxek | if these are the last days of #debian on freenode |
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| 13:44.23 | jelly | s/of #debian on// |
| 13:44.23 | shtrb|work | ratrace : -ChanServ- [#debian] Welcome to #Debian. This is a discussion channel; if you have a question about Debian GNU/Linux, ask and we will try our best to answer it. Newcomers should read the channel's guidelines by typing "/msg dpkg guidelines". Please do not paste in the channel; use #flood instead. Thank you. |
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| 13:45.03 | ratrace | oh that's chanserv's greeting. haven't seen it in a while |
| 13:45.06 | jelly | shtrb|work, the onjoin message is separate piece of setting |
| 13:45.22 | shtrb|work | yeh , sorry for that |
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| 13:45.56 | shtrb|work | What's libre address again ? |
| 13:46.54 | oxek | libera.chat |
| 13:46.59 | oxek | I can't connect |
| 13:47.18 | erle- | Why not move to OFTC where most Debian is? |
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| 13:47.50 | shtrb|work | oxek, what the TLS port there ? |
| 13:48.08 | xakan | libera chat is currently down due to its success |
| 13:48.15 | imMute | it's irc.libera.chat and TLS is 6697. it's also flappy due to load |
| 13:48.20 | oxek | shtrb|work: should be 6697 |
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| 13:49.57 | shtrb|work | github hosted ?! |
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| 13:51.22 | imMute | shtrb|work: ?? |
| 13:51.46 | shtrb|work | try pinging libera.chat |
| 13:52.11 | imMute | shtrb|work: irc.libera.chat is the IRC network. libera.chat seems to be using GitHub Pages' CDN, which honestly isn't a terrible idea until they get server sponsors sorted out |
| 13:52.34 | shtrb|work | Oh that explain why I can't connect :D |
| 13:52.42 | ratrace | imMute: no the actual IP address of the IRC server is in Github's ASN |
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| 13:53.12 | imMute | ratrace: I get 4 IPs for irc.libera.chat, and one of them is in Linode |
| 13:53.19 | ratrace | actually wait ... they've multiple |
| 13:53.34 | imMute | and two others are in some european looking area. |
| 13:53.40 | ratrace | who cares tho. as if Microsoft is not already deep, deep, deep inside ur kernelz. |
| 13:53.49 | imMute | ratrace: are you looking at irc.libera.chat or libera.chat? those are two very different things. |
| 13:54.02 | ratrace | imMute: yes yes, I confused, and irc.libera.chat has multiple IPs too |
| 13:55.36 | shtrb|work | "Disconnected (Connection reset by peer)" |
| 13:55.38 | shtrb|work | :-( |
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| 14:27.52 | another | ,file dig |
| 14:27.58 | judd | Search for dig in buster/amd64: [truncated] sofia-sip-bin: usr/bin/sip-dig; pdns-tools: usr/bin/nsec3dig, usr/bin/sdig; dnsutils: usr/bin/dig, usr/bin/mdig; libperldoc-search-perl: usr/bin/perldig; ripe-atlas-tools: usr/bin/adig; htdig: etc/cron.daily/htdig, usr/bin/htdig, usr/bin/rundig; knot-dnsutils: usr/bin/kdig; ntpsec-ntpdate: usr/bin/ntpdig; epic4: usr/share/epic4/script/dig; |
| 14:27.59 | judd | ardentryst: usr/share/games/ardentryst/dig.dig; monitoring-plugins-standard: usr/lib/nagios/plugins/check_dig; epic4-help: usr/share/epic4/help/8_Scripts/dig; grc: usr/share/doc/grc/contrib/mrsmith/conf.dig; htdig-doc: usr/share/doc/htdig-doc/examples/htdig/updatedig, usr/share/doc/htdig-doc/examples/multidig/multidig; libnet-dns-perl: usr/share/doc/libnet-dns-perl/examples/demo/perldig |
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| 14:35.33 | Strum | hi, i'm trying to get atomic crypto wallet installed and i get this Trace/breakpoint trap error |
| 14:35.40 | Strum | any suggestions anybody? |
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| 14:40.50 | ratrace | Strum: perhaps pastebin the exact error you get |
| 14:42.08 | Strum | that is the exact error, 1 line Trace/breakpoint trap |
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| 14:44.00 | ratrace | Strum: you'll have to ask the developers, that's something not packaged in Debian, right? |
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| 14:44.43 | Strum | i have contacted their support but thay say it will take up to 4 days to get back to me |
| 14:45.06 | Strum | just thought i'd try in here and see if anyone else had had the same issue |
| 14:45.50 | Strum | one webpage says they couldn't get it to run either and I also found a forum post saying they had the same error with no replies |
| 14:46.16 | Strum | othanks anyway ratrace |
| 14:46.39 | ratrace | Strum: seen the linuxbabe article? |
| 14:46.46 | Strum | yes |
| 14:46.55 | ratrace | then I have nothing more to add, sorry :) |
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| 14:47.07 | jelly | that's a horribly nondescriptive error |
| 14:47.08 | Strum | no worries, thanks for replying |
| 14:47.13 | Strum | yes jelly |
| 14:47.20 | Strum | leave you none the wiser |
| 14:47.22 | jelly | tried stracing the thing? |
| 14:47.37 | Strum | no, don't know how to do that |
| 14:47.42 | jelly | strace -f command |
| 14:48.12 | Strum | command not found |
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| 14:48.27 | jelly | it's a debug tool showing system calls. Need to install it first. if you're doing it for the first time ever you're probably not going to figure out much |
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| 14:52.13 | Strum | yeah huge pile of output that means very little to me |
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| 14:52.41 | Strum | +++ killed by SIGTRAP +++ |
| 14:52.50 | Strum | is the last line |
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| 14:54.27 | ratrace | that would imply someone left debugging things in the production code, but eh... |
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| 15:02.37 | Strum | i could try the windows version under wine i guess |
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| 15:03.38 | LunarAgent | LunarIRC (irc.lunarirc.net) - the friendliest IRC network around + free BNCs! We welcome retrogamers, coders and wizards. Drop by, feel at home, create and re-create channels and enjoy your stay! LunarAgent, over and out. |
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| 15:06.55 | ratrace | Strum: also, there's a bunch of wallets in Snap store.... maybe flatpak even has atomic |
| 15:07.16 | Strum | what is snap store? |
| 15:07.21 | wyatt8740 | an ubuntu thing |
| 15:07.26 | Strum | flatpak? |
| 15:07.29 | wyatt8740 | something i like to ignore |
| 15:07.41 | wyatt8740 | it's basically the same deal as flatpak but ubuntu's own version of containers |
| 15:07.52 | wyatt8740 | also snap store is proprietary |
| 15:10.12 | aecalaz | Hi! I have a problem with the video drive. Using i915 firmware on Debian Buster and kernel 4.19.0-16. Using chrome mainly, but also using gnome-shell. The error message on dmesg is "[drm] GPU HANG: ecode 7:0:0x...."; i saw this error on other distros (Ubuntu and Fedora). I tried upgrading the kernel; but it failed. Some idea about it? |
| 15:10.19 | aecalaz | *driver |
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| 15:11.36 | sney | aecalaz: there are some parameters you can pass to i915 to change behavior, some are for working around specific gpu quirks and may help you. see the list of parms at the bottom of 'modinfo i915' |
| 15:11.52 | sney | however, if it happens with any kernel in any distro it might also be a hardware defect. |
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| 15:13.13 | sney | there are some more details here as well. https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/v4.19/gpu/i915.html |
| 15:13.37 | ratrace | Strum: snap is a containerized software package manager like flatpak. snapstore is the (only) central hub for it. |
| 15:14.18 | ratrace | Strum: for software that's not regularly packaged as .deb in the repos, installing via snap or flatpak is a very good and functional alternative to installing random tarballs manually |
| 15:14.42 | aecalaz | @sney thanks; I had this problem before, on a different computer... and works correctly under Windows and FreeBSD. |
| 15:14.43 | aecalaz | This computer was working perfectly with Ubuntu a week ago; I switched it to Debian and the problem persists. I'll check that info! |
| 15:14.46 | aecalaz | Thanks again! |
| 15:15.10 | sney | np |
| 15:15.22 | Strum | i'll have a look at it i guess, thanks ratrace |
| 15:15.46 | ratrace | Strum: basically apt install snapd ; snap install <snapname> |
| 15:16.07 | ratrace | Strum: to remove a snap snap remove . it's containerized and doens't pollute the OS. |
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| 15:16.26 | ratrace | (unless you count the existence and running of snapd itself as pollution :) ) |
| 15:17.14 | Strum | not on snap store |
| 15:17.57 | ratrace | no atomic isn't, but a bunch of other wallets are, if that suits you |
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| 15:19.18 | Strum | well from my current research atomic looks like what i'm after |
| 15:19.33 | Strum | most of the others don't support a wide range of coins |
| 15:20.37 | Strum | and i'd rather have it all in one app than have dozens of wallets for different coins |
| 15:21.21 | Strum | might just have to wait for their support to get back to me |
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| 15:21.30 | Strum | or try wine |
| 15:22.08 | Strum | which i don't have setup yet |
| 15:25.18 | Strum | so much for a quick and easy setup |
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| 15:26.34 | Strum | why containers rather than statically linked binaries btw? |
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| 15:27.58 | Strum | in these days of massive HDs and huge amounts of ram is there the need for dynamic linking like there used to be? |
| 15:30.13 | petn-randall | Strum: Imagine the size high-level binaries. GUI programs would be several GB each. |
| 15:30.41 | petn-randall | If you approach is "linking is hard, let's go shopping!", then it might make sense. |
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| 15:31.28 | Strum | aren't they already several GB each anyway? |
| 15:31.30 | ratrace | Strum: because static linking is not the only thin you need for full isolation |
| 15:31.49 | ratrace | the programs run in namespaces, which require their own utilities, core utils etc... |
| 15:32.10 | ratrace | so you'd need to package a rootfs tarball anyway, in which case, static linking would have zero benefits |
| 15:32.34 | Strum | i see |
| 15:32.41 | ratrace | and yeah, size is not an argument: statically linking everything would result in nearly equal size |
| 15:34.11 | Strum | was expecting to get flamed and called a n00b for asking |
| 15:35.14 | ratrace | nah. we only flame questions that are hyper-lazy-i-couldn't-even-bother-to-ask-google :) understanding snaps is a bit more involved ;)) |
| 15:35.19 | Strum | was using arch before debian |
| 15:35.37 | Strum | and got a lot of that sort of reaction in their channel |
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| 15:42.20 | petn-randall | Strum: We can still flame you if you miss it ;) |
| 15:42.30 | petn-randall | You'll have to politely ask for it, though ;) |
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| 15:44.01 | Strum | thanks but no thanks |
| 15:44.06 | Strum | :) |
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| 16:34.22 | GenTooMan | so is debian check officially moving to OFTC? |
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| 16:34.52 | GenTooMan | chat not check sigh my hands are doing other things :D |
| 16:35.33 | ddsys | or libera? |
| 16:37.22 | somiaj | !oftc move |
| 16:37.22 | dpkg | irc.debian.org moved to OFTC on June 4th 2006, see http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/05/msg00012.html. Operators and bots (see <fact sharing>) will remain on both networks for the foreseeable future; you're welcome to either move to OFTC with i.d.o or stay on freenode. Questions? Ask in #debian on one or other network. See also http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/04/msg00333.html |
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| 16:38.17 | somiaj | Debian's offical irc network is oftc, and has been for some time. This channel is the only one left here to provide users support. |
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| 16:38.32 | cybrNaut | how might i list all debian packages that I installed, but filter out all the dependencies that installed automatically as a result of my command? "dpkg -l" lists /all/ pkgs and the manpage only shows how to filter by name |
| 16:38.33 | ratrace | just reg'd and enabled cert SASL for OFTC. |
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| 16:39.29 | ratrace | cybrNaut: apt-mark showmanual |
| 16:39.40 | ratrace | more info in the apt-mark(8) manpage |
| 16:39.44 | cybrNaut | thanks |
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| 16:43.56 | somiaj | aptitude search '~i !~M' -- also works, and once you are on bullseye (apt 2.0), you can use search flags with apt list '~i !~M' |
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| 16:45.03 | teratorn | hi! anyone aware of package repo for KDE Plasma desktop (latest releases, etc) that would work for Debian 10.9? |
| 16:45.52 | somiaj | teratorn: not really, desktops are huge beasts so they are often not backported. |
| 16:45.59 | somiaj | teratorn: would the version in bullseye suit your needs? |
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| 16:46.25 | unixbsd | teratorn: Ubuntu and systemd, modern kernel based on SID. all what you need ! |
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| 16:47.18 | teratorn | somiaj: I'm not sure what version that is, but it's probably newer, and probably yes it would suite my needs. I just like to be on latest release of plasma, which isn't always easy unless you're on ubuntu PPAs |
| 16:47.22 | somiaj | unixbsd: please keep your off topic noise to yourself, that isn't debian support. |
| 16:47.39 | teratorn | what is in debian 10.9 would probably suite my needs too... |
| 16:47.40 | somiaj | teratorn: bullseye is almost ready to be released (next month or two), for a desktop system it is reasonable to upgrade to. |
| 16:47.47 | unixbsd | stats showd that tthe linux poppulation uses at 70-80 pct Ubuntu, especially developers. |
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| 16:48.15 | ratrace | 98.67% of statistics is made up on the spot |
| 16:48.22 | somiaj | teratorn: You can upgarde now, though there are a few rc-bugs left and slow security support until the release actually happens. For a desktop system it is reaonsable and many are already using it. |
| 16:49.03 | unixbsd | ratrace: the rule of stats, higher n, the most accurate. |
| 16:49.04 | somiaj | teratorn: so if you want a newer kde now, upgrading isn't unreasonable (though it isn't offically released yet, but it has been frozen for a while). Or you could just make do with 10.9 until the release then upgrade then. |
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| 16:52.08 | somiaj | ,v plasma-desktop |
| 16:52.09 | judd | Package: plasma-desktop on amd64 -- jessie: 4:4.11.13-2; stretch: 4:5.8.6-1; buster: 4:5.14.5.1-1; bullseye: 4:5.20.5-4; sid: 4:5.20.5-4; experimental: 4:5.21.5-1 |
| 16:52.22 | somiaj | teratorn: If I read the version correct, 5.20 is the version you will get with bullseye. |
| 16:52.27 | somiaj | well 5.20.5 |
| 16:52.37 | teratorn | somiaj: sounds OK, but I still won't be able to track upstream Plasma releases, I guess, which is what I would prefer to do |
| 16:53.06 | teratorn | well I probably won't miss anything major |
| 16:54.02 | somiaj | teratorn: Yea, debian stable is a frozen release, and part of its stability is not tracking upstream. I know some who just run testing/sid to try to keep up to date (though there is still a lag to create the debian packages). |
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| 16:55.10 | somiaj | teratorn: Note that debian's philosophy isn't to provide newest software in its stable releases, but to provide frozen well tested software. Something to consider when choosing a distro. You could also choose to just build it yourself from upstream, though here again, desktops are big collections of code and this takes a lot of work (hence why there is a lag even in unstable to get the newer kde) |
| 16:55.57 | somiaj | teratorn: note running testing/unstable too has its issues, I use to run sid, but now only stable, as I find I don't really need shiny new stuff |
| 16:56.00 | teratorn | yeah, that is a TON of C++ etc to compile :/ and I have no idea just how much tweaking of upstream is done in debian package patches |
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| 16:57.21 | unixbsd | tthe kde libs are quite dirty, you cannot compile modern QT like that., apt-get install * and run ; automake ;) joke |
| 16:58.00 | somiaj | teratorn: well my suggestion is just use the version in debian stable, and about every 2 years get to upgrade. Or maybe run stable for most of its release then near the end upgrade to testing as it starts to freeze and just deal with limited security support. |
| 16:58.05 | teratorn | yeah, generally I prefer the older, stable, more-well-tested releases of most software... but I /like/ Plasma, and so prefer to be on latest release :/ if only to make bug reporting more relevant |
| 16:58.37 | somiaj | teratorn: yea, desktops are just very big and have a messy dependency tree. I haven't seen them backported to stable. |
| 16:58.38 | unixbsd | QT was commercial and is still commercial. it is not made to be nice code, but to give a nice desktop |
| 16:59.09 | unixbsd | QT 1 was easy to compile in comparison. See artic |
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| 17:53.04 | Oberon | Okay so I installed Apache2, chmodded the directory to www-data:www-data, and added my non-root user to the www-data group |
| 17:53.16 | Oberon | but I still can't edit the... oh hang on lemme check directory permissions |
| 17:53.44 | Oberon | there we go |
| 17:53.45 | Oberon | thanks! |
| 17:54.06 | prahou | no problem |
| 17:54.46 | Oberon | I can't believe I'm actually developing another web site |
| 17:54.53 | Oberon | I swore off web development in 2007 |
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| 17:56.33 | queip | cp: oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? oops IO error! what if I try again? |
| 17:56.41 | queip | mc copy: oops IO error! ok moving on, lmao |
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| 18:12.59 | ratrace | Oberon: a better pattern is the other way around, adding www-data into your (website) user group |
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| 18:28.26 | cybrNaut | I cloned my drive. The UUIDs are different (which is expected when using rsync to mirror). I ran "chroot /stagingmirror grub-mkconfig" then "chroot /stagingmirror update-grub" |
| 18:28.40 | cybrNaut | when it boots, GRUB still looks for the old UUID |
| 18:29.02 | ratrace | cybrNaut: did you prepare the chroot with appropriate mounts? |
| 18:29.35 | cybrNaut | but when I look in /stagingmirror/boot/grub/grub.cfg, the UUIDs are correct (no mention of the old UUID) |
| 18:29.53 | cybrNaut | ratrace: yeah.. did the rbind mounts |
| 18:30.08 | ratrace | sounds like you missed some. do you have a separate /boot? |
| 18:30.30 | cybrNaut | e.g. for i in /run /tmp; do mount --bind $i /stagingmirror$i; done && for i in /dev /proc /sys; do mount --rbind $i /stagingmirror$i; done |
| 18:30.41 | cybrNaut | yeah, /boot is separate |
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| 18:31.16 | ratrace | cybrNaut: by the way ... update-grub IS grub-mkconfig, and grub-mkconfig needs -o anyway which update-grub does |
| 18:31.19 | cybrNaut | so I first mount / to /stagingmirror, then "/boot" to /stagingmirror/boot |
| 18:32.00 | cybrNaut | ratrace: i wondered if it was redundant.. so should I just use one of the two? |
| 18:32.22 | ratrace | cybrNaut: I'm surprised grub-mkconfig didn't complain, or it did but you ignored it |
| 18:32.55 | ratrace | update-grub suffices, and also, what about install-grub? that's required to install the stage1 loader |
| 18:33.09 | ratrace | update-grub really just updates the /boot/grub/grub.cfg |
| 18:33.39 | cybrNaut | ratrace: ah, it looks like grub-mkconfig just dumped to stdout.. so it's as if I just ran update-grub |
| 18:34.39 | cybrNaut | i did "grub-install /dev/sdb" before I even mounted anything |
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| 18:35.28 | cybrNaut | if the old UUID is not mentioned in /boot/grub/grub.cfg, why is grub still looking for it? |
| 18:35.47 | ratrace | I take it you're booting off of a wrong drive |
| 18:36.00 | ratrace | OR there exists another instance of /boot which is found and used |
| 18:36.50 | ratrace | cybrNaut: I'm not 100% sure if install-grub doesn't also prime the stage1 for location of /boot/grub/grub.cfg to use; so you might want to do the grub-install from the chroot as well |
| 18:36.54 | cybrNaut | i remove the original drive, so the target drive is the sole drive in the machine. |
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| 18:38.52 | Oberon | okay this isn't explicitly Debian related, but... does anyone know what key combinations you use on Putty to send a literal 0x0D, 0x0A, and 0x1A characters? Those are carriage return, new line, and (sub), whatever that is |
| 18:38.53 | cybrNaut | this process actually worked for me, but then I later had to re-rsync. I repeated the process in my notes. Not sure why i'm getting this problem now, but according to my notes i never ran grub-install within chroot |
| 18:40.31 | ratrace | cybrNaut: okay so to be clear, what exactly you mean by "grub still looks for the old UUID" ... stage1 loader is looking for config, OR rootfs's UUID? |
| 18:41.04 | jhutchins | Oberon: What platform are you running putty on? |
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| 18:43.35 | Oberon | >.> |
| 18:43.41 | Oberon | Windows. I'm sorry. |
| 18:43.48 | Oberon | I didn't think that would affect it. |
| 18:44.09 | ratrace | Lol. Windows is so terrible, its users are appologizing for using it. |
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| 18:44.31 | Oberon | It really is. |
| 18:44.36 | epony | they should, it's used as a reflector for malware and ddos |
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| 18:50.01 | Oberon | Okay, I think I need to look at the actual packets here, what's the packet capture tool whose name I should be able to remember but can't because it's been like 15 years? |
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| 18:50.12 | Oberon | tcpdump right? |
| 18:51.08 | ratrace | yea |
| 18:51.31 | ratrace | and you can save to a file with -w and analyze later with wireshark (or you can use wireshark on teh same machine) |
| 18:52.07 | Oberon | thanks |
| 18:52.24 | ratrace | Oberon: but uh... if that's over ssh, you won't see anything in the packets. ssh is encrypted unless you use the null cipher thingy |
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| 18:52.49 | Oberon | it's not, it's plain unencrypted HTTP on port 80 |
| 18:52.59 | cybrNaut | ratrace: when grub boots, it gives an error like drive <old UUID> not found |
| 18:53.05 | Oberon | I can see the error log but that's not showing me exactly how the request is malformed, just that it's bad |
| 18:53.26 | Oberon | I'm writing some code that's going to run on a cellular modem, so it's like... |
| 18:53.34 | Oberon | ...yeah |
| 18:53.50 | Oberon | gotta look at the actual packets to figure out what's wrong, apparently |
| 18:54.04 | ratrace | what kind of low level stuff are you even doing there for http? |
| 18:54.18 | cybrNaut | ratrace: and i find that bizarre, because when i examine /boot/../grub.cfg, there is no mention of the old UUID |
| 18:54.21 | Oberon | making a.... thing... that will... |
| 18:54.27 | Oberon | it's complicated |
| 18:54.49 | Oberon | in the end there will be a piece of hardware that's small and has an embedded cellular modem which will interact with a server via HTTP |
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| 18:55.28 | ratrace | Oberon: there's small http libraries even in C |
| 18:56.03 | ratrace | cybrNaut: can you post the _exact_ verbiage or imgur a screenshot? |
| 18:56.14 | Oberon | I'm sure, but I don't know how to get one of those libraries onto this piece of hardware |
| 18:56.24 | Oberon | or if it's even possible |
| 18:56.29 | cybrNaut | ratrace: i'll work on that.. will take some time |
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| 18:56.58 | ratrace | cybrNaut: planning on censoring the UUID? |
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| 19:08.06 | cybrNaut | ratrace: yes. It's short, so i'll just type it. Exact output is: "error: no such device: 12345-..." \n "error: unknown filesystem." \n "Entering rescue mode..." \n "grub rescue> _" |
| 19:08.28 | cybrNaut | where "12345-..." is the old UUID |
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| 19:09.45 | cybrNaut | i have no idea what could cause it to look for the old UUID because that UUID does not appear in /boot/grub/grub.cfg of the new target |
| 19:10.22 | alkisg | cybrNaut: I just glanced at the last lines so I might be out of topic, but grub also checks the UUIDs of /etc/fstab |
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| 19:11.43 | cybrNaut | alkisg: i updated /etc/fstab before running update-grub just in case that's used as input |
| 19:11.59 | alkisg | OK, yeah that's what I meant, it is |
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| 19:13.27 | cybrNaut | i should also say that in my sample output, "12345-..." is standing in for the /boot partition of the previous drive |
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| 19:14.16 | Swift110-mobile | are you guys going to Libera? |
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| 19:15.26 | ratrace | alex11: no it doesn't |
| 19:15.42 | alex11 | ? |
| 19:15.42 | mdk | !oftc move |
| 19:15.43 | dpkg | irc.debian.org moved to OFTC on June 4th 2006, see http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/05/msg00012.html. Operators and bots (see <fact sharing>) will remain on both networks for the foreseeable future; you're welcome to either move to OFTC with i.d.o or stay on freenode. Questions? Ask in #debian on one or other network. See also http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/04/msg00333.html |
| 19:15.52 | ratrace | grub consults mtab, not fstab, during installation/update/setup, not on boot |
| 19:15.59 | alex11 | wrong ping, i think |
| 19:16.10 | ratrace | alex11: oh yes. alkisg ^^ |
| 19:16.14 | ratrace | sorry |
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| 19:16.36 | ratrace | cybrNaut: so that looks like inability to find /boot .. the UUID in question is of the /boot filesystem? |
| 19:17.20 | ratrace | cybrNaut: is there EFI involved or is this purely a legacy boot (gpt or mbr?)? |
| 19:18.47 | cybrNaut | ratrace: the UUID it looks for is /boot of the previous filesystem. But /boot/grub/grub.cfg correctly references the UUID of the new /boot |
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| 19:19.02 | cybrNaut | no EFI. |
| 19:19.33 | cybrNaut | it's an old BIOS, and GPT, but with the bios partition |
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| 19:20.27 | Achylles | Is this channel going to be moved to libera.chat? I have heard a buzz about freenode and such... |
| 19:20.36 | ratrace | cybrNaut: wait, what do you mean GPT, without bios partition? |
| 19:21.54 | somiaj | Achylles: the offical debian irc network has been oftc since 2006, so in essence debian has moved away. |
| 19:22.43 | somiaj | Achylles: I'm unsure on the current state of what is happeneing (and maybe nothing will become of this), but it could be that debian just no longer has channels on any network except oftc (not clear idea yet, and it really depends on how this all pans out) |
| 19:23.18 | cybrNaut | the partition table is a GPT partition table, which /normally/ only works on UEFI, but I created a bios partition which makes it possible to use GPT on a BIOS machine |
| 19:23.44 | cybrNaut | actually it's a partition of type "bios boot" |
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| 19:23.55 | Achylles | somiaj, ok. So, lets wait... to see where things are heading to... |
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| 19:24.38 | somiaj | but you can always find debian channels (and many more than just #debian), on the offical network irc.oftc.net (which is what irc.debian.net points at) |
| 19:24.50 | cybrNaut | run this to see what i mean => sfdisk --label gpt -T | grep -i bios.boot |
| 19:24.52 | ratrace | cybrNaut: so you mean you have GPT _layout_ and among GPT partitions there's the bios_grub one (required for grub on GPT), the /boot one and the root fs? |
| 19:24.58 | BlueMatt | as someone with personal experience with the new freenode owners outside of irc,.....yea run away |
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| 19:25.17 | somiaj | Achylles: https://wiki.debian.org/IRC, as you see there is quite a list of channels there for debian. |
| 19:25.24 | ratrace | I'll quit Freenode the moment Libera's nickserv is not overloaded and I can reg an account there. |
| 19:25.51 | cybrNaut | ratrace: that's right, plus a 4th for swap |
| 19:25.57 | ratrace | cybrNaut: and the old disk is nowhere physically present on the system? |
| 19:26.09 | Achylles | somiaj, ok. But, I like this one. That's why I asked... |
| 19:26.09 | somiaj | BlueMatt: freenode survived the crisis that almost disolved it in 2006, so I wouldn't jump the gun too quickly, I'm of the opinion to just wait and see what happens. |
| 19:26.19 | cybrNaut | that's right.. i removed the old drive |
| 19:26.21 | somiaj | Achylles: a lot of the users (espically the ops) are in both. |
| 19:26.48 | somiaj | Achylles: though oftc isn't as populated, it has a lot of good users and many of the main helpers you'll see on oftc as well as here. |
| 19:27.11 | ratrace | cybrNaut: well that doesn't make sense... unless grub-install bakes in the location of /boot |
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| 19:27.41 | ratrace | cybrNaut: OR you've got traces of old stages somewhere on the new drive |
| 19:27.43 | Achylles | somiaj, I am there in debian-next |
| 19:27.47 | cybrNaut | ratrace: grub-install finds the bios boot partition and uses it. |
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| 19:28.38 | ratrace | cybrNaut: yes, but like I said I don't know if it also bakes in it the location of /boot, or taht's 100% autodetection by stage1 . in which case, there HAS to be traces of the old /boot somehwere on the drive physically which the stage1 finds first |
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| 19:30.17 | cybrNaut | ratrace: perhaps i can search the bios boot partition for the UUID |
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| 19:31.06 | lenswipe | hey folks |
| 19:31.12 | lenswipe | got a broken debian system here im trying to reapir. |
| 19:31.32 | lenswipe | before i do that, i want to backup my cron jobs so I want to try and view (not edit, just view) where they live at rest on disk. |
| 19:31.42 | lenswipe | I've looked in /var/spool/ and there's no cron folder |
| 19:31.46 | lenswipe | open to any other suggestions |
| 19:31.55 | ratrace | cybrNaut: you can use `strings` on it, yes |
| 19:32.12 | ratrace | assuming it's stored as ascii string |
| 19:32.14 | mentor | Does the BIOS actually understand GPT? |
| 19:32.17 | cybrNaut | well, i grep'd the bios boot partition for the old UUID and no hit.. but that doesn't mean it's not there.. it could be encoded/compressed |
| 19:33.06 | ratrace | cybrNaut: but just to be 100% sure, did you re-try grub-install from _within_ the chroot? |
| 19:33.29 | cybrNaut | ratrace: i'll try that now |
| 19:34.27 | cybrNaut | it stands to reason that that could be the issue (that i ran it outside of chroot). My notes don't say to run it in chroot, but maybe my notes are wrong |
| 19:34.28 | ratrace | mentor: what do you mean? like, if it's too old for GPT? |
| 19:35.33 | ratrace | cybrNaut: I've made hundreds of installations on servers, I use a custom ansible and saltstack deployment scripts with deboostrap, and always used grub-install from within the chroot, so I don't know what would happen if you tried from outside |
| 19:35.46 | mentor | A BIOS boot GPT partition was mentioned, but not if a compatibility MBR was written for it or something |
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| 19:37.18 | ratrace | protective mbr should be done by grub-install afaik |
| 19:37.43 | cybrNaut | ratrace: what i suspect happened is perhaps i ran grub-install from within the chroot the 1st time when shit worked, for good measure in addition to running it outside of chroot.. and I may not have noted that I did that possibly critical step. I'll know in a few min.. i'm off to reboot now |
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| 19:39.26 | mentor | A normal protective MBR for a GPT just marks everything as being used. |
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| 19:46.17 | cybrNaut | ratrace: i'm back, and in fact running from the new clone. Indeed you were spot on. |
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| 19:47.16 | cybrNaut | I had to run grub-install from within chroot to ensure the bios boot partition had a pointer to the UUID of the correct /boot |
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| 19:48.06 | cybrNaut | so that explains the mystery of how /boot/grub/grub.cfg can have all correct UUIDs and still boot the wrong one |
| 19:48.19 | cybrNaut | thanks for the help! |
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| 19:50.52 | ratrace | cybrNaut: welcome |
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| 19:54.09 | lenswipe | im trying to repair a broken GRUB install on an LVM system |
| 19:54.17 | lenswipe | I'm following this: https://wiki.debian.org/GrubEFIReinstall |
| 19:54.53 | lenswipe | When I type mount /dev/mapper/crypt /mnt I get "mount: /mnt: unknown filesystem type 'LVM2_member'" |
| 19:56.05 | cybrNaut | lenswipe: did you do a "cryptsetup luksOpen .." first? |
| 19:56.44 | lenswipe | cybrNaut, yes |
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| 20:41.36 | ax562 | Is there anything official on Debian leaving freenode hence the scandal? |
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| 20:41.56 | imMute | ax562: this channel was never official. the official channel has been on OFTC for a long time. |
| 20:42.32 | ax562 | oh, well, is there any talk on leaving this channel. btw I'm on OFTC ;) |
| 20:43.03 | ax562 | I'm personally contemplating leaving freenode and I'm trying to way in the options. |
| 20:43.27 | imMute | I'm going to stick around in a few places until every channel I lurk on moves. I'm definitely going to be less active though. |
| 20:44.58 | ratrace | ax562: I'm done with freenode as soon as I manage to reg on Libera |
| 20:45.35 | ax562 | ratrace reason I was asking. was thinking most would jump ship. |
| 20:46.03 | ratrace | ax562: I'm not sticking around on the Andrewnet on principle |
| 20:46.31 | cybrNaut | suppose i partition a drive manually with LUKS partitions, some using keys and one using a password. Will the Debian installer give me a chance to enter the password to mount the encrypted partition, and then skip the partitioning step? |
| 20:46.36 | EdePopede | a mass leave would be nice while the new dude is online |
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| 20:47.29 | ratrace | cybrNaut: the partitioning step is still used, you select existing ones (you manually managed) to point at rootfs, boot, etc.... |
| 20:47.44 | ratrace | cybrNaut: that'd be manual partitioning step tho |
| 20:47.47 | imMute | EdePopede: the (now former) staff regaining control of the domain names would be even nicer. |
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| 20:48.03 | ratrace | imMute: hear hear. but eh... |
| 20:48.08 | EdePopede | that's why i'll stay here for the moment... |
| 20:49.02 | cybrNaut | EdePopede: i haven't read about the drama.. why is the new ownership getting hate? |
| 20:49.23 | EdePopede | this one has a lot of extra links https://gist.github.com/joepie91/df80d8d36cd9d1bde46ba018af497409 |
| 20:49.52 | cybrNaut | ratrace: will it ask for password or keys for existing encrypted partitions? |
| 20:50.10 | ratrace | cybrNaut: no, you must unlock them first, if you manually prepared the LUKS containers |
| 20:50.23 | ratrace | it _will_ detect the mapped devices and offer them to point at rootfs |
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| 21:05.01 | solrize | any plans to move this channel to libera? |
| 21:05.52 | nkuttler | there already is a #debian there |
| 21:06.04 | nkuttler | and official channels are on oftc anyway |
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| 21:10.37 | solrize | ah thx, i see earlier discussion too |
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| 21:48.48 | lenswipe | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:48.50 | YWH_1 | Free node has been taken over by a Donald Trump Supporter see slashdot.org |
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| 21:52.03 | lenswipe | anyone have any thoughts on how to repair a broken LVM GRUB system? |
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| 21:58.18 | sney | lenswipe: are you sure you are using the right /dev node for your root filesystem? on my laptop it is not /dev/mapper/crypt but a different name under /dev/mapper that includes the hostname |
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| 22:00.20 | lenswipe | sney, im honestly not sure....how would i know? |
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| 22:00.38 | sney | lenswipe: 'ls /dev/mapper' and see what you've got in there. |
| 22:00.41 | lenswipe | sney, i don't know what that even means and I'm very sleep deprived right now (this is a work machine) |
| 22:00.44 | lenswipe | okay, ill take a look |
| 22:01.16 | lenswipe | sney, i see control, crypt, and a few other items named after my LVM volume group and logical volumes |
| 22:01.22 | lenswipe | should i use the name of my LVM group instead? |
| 22:01.32 | sney | does one of them have 'root' in the name? |
| 22:01.49 | jelly | lenswipe, if you don't know anything about how lvm works it's going to be a pain to guide and help over irc |
| 22:02.03 | jelly | use a pastebin and show the whole output |
| 22:02.07 | lenswipe | sney, yes |
| 22:02.19 | sney | lenswipe: then that is your root filesystem. jelly is correct, also |
| 22:02.19 | lenswipe | jelly i can't it's on a different machine# |
| 22:02.32 | lenswipe | sney, so then i should mount /dev/mapper/myrootfs? |
| 22:02.32 | jelly | lenswipe, camera shot and imgur.com |
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| 22:03.15 | sney | lenswipe: try it. |
| 22:03.17 | jelly | output of "lsusb", and "lvs", too |
| 22:03.25 | jelly | sorry. "lsblk" and "lvs" |
| 22:03.26 | lenswipe | sney, it accepted the command |
| 22:03.48 | sney | then proceed with the rest of the wiki instructions. if you get stuck again, share pics as jelly suggests. |
| 22:03.52 | lenswipe | thanks |
| 22:03.56 | lenswipe | one quick question regarding the wiki instructions |
| 22:04.21 | lenswipe | the instructions after that- mount /dev/sdb2 /mnt/boot; mount /dev/sdb1 /mnt/boot/efi |
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| 22:04.35 | lenswipe | what are sdb2 and sdb1 in that context? are they info i can get from lvs like jelly said? |
| 22:04.40 | sney | if you do not have efi, then you can ignore any steps mentioning efi. |
| 22:04.42 | lenswipe | i assume i need the boot partition and the efi partition? |
| 22:04.44 | lenswipe | i do have efi |
| 22:05.00 | sney | then, those will be partitions outside your lvm. |
| 22:05.10 | lenswipe | i see |
| 22:05.29 | sney | 'fdisk -l' will show your partitions, as the example suggests, they will likely be the first 2 on the disk, and small |
| 22:05.35 | lenswipe | i ran lsblk and i see two other partitions outside my lvm - is there a way to figure out which is which? |
| 22:05.55 | lenswipe | oh |
| 22:06.04 | lenswipe | i think Devsda2 is my EFI partition |
| 22:06.13 | sney | iirc, /boot should be a linux filesystem, and /boot/efi should be vfat |
| 22:06.25 | lenswipe | i can see FAT-12 |
| 22:06.29 | lenswipe | guessing that's EFI |
| 22:06.31 | sney | yep |
| 22:07.04 | lenswipe | /boot im no seeing |
| 22:07.05 | lenswipe | not* |
| 22:07.10 | lenswipe | there is an apparently empty partition |
| 22:07.22 | lenswipe | oh wait no no no |
| 22:07.23 | lenswipe | i see it |
| 22:07.50 | lenswipe | should i refer to those paritions by /dev/nvme0n1p2 or /dev/sda1? |
| 22:07.55 | lenswipe | or does it not matter? |
| 22:08.10 | sney | if they are the same disk it doesn't matter |
| 22:08.25 | lenswipe | they're on the same physical SSD, yes |
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| 22:08.59 | factor | How can I get the libssl package 1.0 not the 1.1 |
| 22:10.05 | lenswipe | sney, one last thing |
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| 22:10.22 | lenswipe | grub install /dev/sdb presumably, sdb would be the top level physical disk there? |
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| 22:10.27 | sney | lenswipe: yes. |
| 22:10.31 | lenswipe | so /dev/nvmeblahblahwhatever |
| 22:10.40 | sney | factor: you want to *downgrade* libssl? what is your real goal? |
| 22:10.46 | hundfred | exit |
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| 22:11.50 | jelly | factor, what for, precisely? Debian has had two separate ABIs for binary packages of openssl 1.0.x |
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| 22:12.16 | jelly | ,v libssl1.0.0 |
| 22:12.17 | judd | Package: libssl1.0.0 on amd64 -- jessie: 1.0.1t-1+deb8u8; jessie-security: 1.0.1t-1+deb8u12 |
| 22:12.19 | jelly | ,v libssl1.0.2 |
| 22:12.20 | judd | Package: libssl1.0.2 on amd64 -- stretch: 1.0.2u-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 1.0.2u-1~deb9u1 |
| 22:13.00 | factor | Sorry was afk, back now. |
| 22:13.18 | factor | Its for a steam game , I had it on GOG before , and remember doing it then. |
| 22:13.31 | jelly | sney, it's not downgrading, just installing |
| 22:13.32 | factor | Steam Suriving Mars needs libssl 1.0 |
| 22:13.43 | factor | I just need a dual install |
| 22:13.54 | sney | hm, alright |
| 22:14.01 | jelly | factor, add back stretch repos and and see if it works with libssl1.0.2 |
| 22:14.09 | factor | check |
| 22:14.18 | jelly | be that 32bit or 64bit |
| 22:14.41 | factor | Probably 32 bit I would think.Not for sure. |
| 22:14.54 | jelly | you'd install libssl1.0.2:i386 in that case |
| 22:15.03 | factor | I dont thik I have any 64 bit game as steam is 32 |
| 22:15.07 | factor | okay |
| 22:15.29 | jelly | a 32bit steam can still install 64bit native games |
| 22:15.35 | factor | oh okay. |
| 22:15.47 | jelly | (I _think_!) |
| 22:15.59 | factor | Looking |
| 22:16.01 | pokota | yeah, it can |
| 22:16.10 | pokota | 32-bit steam lets me load 64-bit jupiter hell |
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| 22:17.12 | factor | I'll install 32bit as its an older game and I think that is what I instaled last time |
| 22:19.24 | factor | Would that be backports I add to repos. |
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| 22:20.56 | jelly | !stretch sources.list |
| 22:20.56 | dpkg | A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ stretch main" "deb http://security.debian.org/debian-security stretch/updates main" "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ stretch-updates main". Be sure to run «apt update» after editing sources.list. Also see <deb-src> <contrib> <non-free> <stretch/updates> <stretch-updates> <mirrors> and "man sources.list". |
| 22:21.33 | jelly | that stuff is old. Youll need to add repos for a previous release, stretch = Debian 9 |
| 22:22.23 | factor | okay |
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| 22:24.15 | jelly | adding repos for an older release does not have huge stability issues, as versions are always monotonically rising and it's hard to accidentally downgrade things |
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| 22:26.53 | factor | yes and I can disable it after install |
| 22:27.08 | factor | installed the 64 bit libssl 1.0 currently |
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| 22:28.10 | jelly | no need to disable it, as you're going to miss any potential security fixes that way |
| 22:28.32 | factor | ahh okay |
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| 22:33.03 | factor | got it installed |
| 22:33.25 | factor | Still issues starting will have to debug further , but recall that was one of the issues . |
| 22:33.37 | factor | afk. need to get some other stuff done. |
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| 22:59.17 | Caesar_NayKid | Hello. Got a big problem. Did a sudo apt upgrade. then rebooted. Now im gettting a failure to load fstab |
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| 22:59.35 | Caesar_NayKid | Im maybe exhausted on reading websites for help. |
| 22:59.38 | sney | what's the full error? |
| 23:00.03 | ratrace | also does the system actually boot up? can you reach the login prompt? |
| 23:00.29 | ratrace | fstab is not needed to mount rootfs, but other broken mounts might hog with start jobs |
| 23:00.33 | Caesar_NayKid | Well, from journalctl -xb |
| 23:00.42 | Caesar_NayKid | I got to root. |
| 23:00.51 | ratrace | k, so please pastebin the actual error you see |
| 23:01.02 | Caesar_NayKid | Systemd-fstab-generator |
| 23:01.18 | Caesar_NayKid | Sorry, im viewing this from another state via video call |
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| 23:01.44 | ratrace | we can't troubleshoot like that. you need diagnostics. pastebins. ability to run commands... |
| 23:02.38 | Caesar_NayKid | Systemd-fstab-generator[317] failed to create unit file /run/systemd/generator/home-paul-BackupINT.mount |
| 23:02.58 | Caesar_NayKid | Can you tell me how to edit fstab from root prompt? |
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| 23:03.11 | Caesar_NayKid | I can have commands run. |
| 23:03.23 | ratrace | nano /etc/fstab |
| 23:03.24 | sney | there is no indication that you need to edit fstab. |
| 23:03.29 | Caesar_NayKid | My mom literally is the one at the console. |
| 23:03.46 | ratrace | and... what sney said. should pastebin it to see why it's failing |
| 23:03.48 | Caesar_NayKid | I tried to start ssh so i could connect. |
| 23:04.05 | Caesar_NayKid | Kicks it back to emergency mode prompt. |
| 23:04.14 | ratrace | dunno if journald has more clues if you query the .mount unit |
| 23:04.42 | Caesar_NayKid | That particular mount is a backup hard drive i dont care about. |
| 23:05.14 | ratrace | for non-critical mountpoints that may be missing or broken on boot, but are in fstab, you should use the "nofail" option in the fstab options columns |
| 23:05.16 | Caesar_NayKid | If i could get booted in and access it via ssh or NoMachine on the LAN i could probably take it from there |
| 23:05.17 | ratrace | *column |
| 23:06.10 | Caesar_NayKid | So, do nanao fstab? |
| 23:06.21 | Caesar_NayKid | Nano fstab? |
| 23:06.31 | Caesar_NayKid | Or is there a command you suggest i run? |
| 23:06.59 | Caesar_NayKid | Only other red errors I've seen so far are nvidia but i think it's not that. |
| 23:07.02 | ratrace | nano is a text editor. you could also use vi, but then you'll have to pay up for us to tell you how to exit vi :) |
| 23:07.53 | Caesar_NayKid | I saw vi online but i wasn't sure that was in Debian |
| 23:08.05 | ratrace | before you edit fstab, question is do you know what and if at all, you need to alter in it |
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| 23:08.32 | Caesar_NayKid | Not necessarily but it appears to be just that particular drive. I maybe need the guid? |
| 23:09.18 | Caesar_NayKid | I tried "mount -a" earlier |
| 23:09.20 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: you can post the fstab entry for that mountpoint for us to see if anything jumps out |
| 23:09.29 | Caesar_NayKid | Parse error in line 1 |
| 23:09.49 | ratrace | also see if journalctl -u home-paul-BackupINT.mount has more clues (I don't know if does for .mount units like it does for service units) |
| 23:09.52 | Caesar_NayKid | Do i need to edit the fstab then to look at it? |
| 23:10.01 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: you can `cat` it |
| 23:10.25 | ratrace | you can pipe it to termbin.com at port 9999 via netcat if you want a quick pastebin |
| 23:10.26 | Caesar_NayKid | Cat /etc/fstab |
| 23:10.41 | ratrace | eg. cat /etc/fstab | nc termbin.com 9999 and then post here the URL you get. requires netcat installed |
| 23:11.28 | Caesar_NayKid | Im not familiar with the pastebin thing |
| 23:11.38 | Caesar_NayKid | Nor netcat |
| 23:12.33 | Caesar_NayKid | Vi /etc/fstab |
| 23:12.36 | Caesar_NayKid | ? |
| 23:12.36 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: a pastebin or a paste site is a site where you post larger amounts of text or images and get an URL for that, to share on IRC |
| 23:13.02 | Caesar_NayKid | I think that's too complex for my mom via internet skype session |
| 23:13.06 | ratrace | common netiquette states you shouldn't post more than 2-3 lines at once, thus teh paste sites where you post configs, outputs, etc... |
| 23:13.16 | Caesar_NayKid | I see. |
| 23:13.26 | ratrace | well... I don't know how else we can help. we need to see the contents of those files and you can't post them here |
| 23:13.34 | ratrace | files/outputs/... |
| 23:14.02 | Caesar_NayKid | Is vi /etc/fstab the command? |
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| 23:14.14 | ratrace | use nano instead of vi |
| 23:14.21 | Caesar_NayKid | Ok thanks lemme look |
| 23:14.35 | ratrace | or `cat` to just display it and see what's in it |
| 23:15.07 | ratrace | or `less` for paginated view / more advanced text viewer |
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| 23:16.31 | Caesar_NayKid | Thanks for helping yall. I should NOT have done a apt update while i was out of state. |
| 23:16.31 | apt | Caesar_NayKid: de rien |
| 23:16.54 | Caesar_NayKid | I can get a photo of the fstab sent |
| 23:17.02 | Caesar_NayKid | Then post that online? |
| 23:17.11 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: you can upload it to imgur and post the link here |
| 23:17.13 | Caesar_NayKid | Or a photo of any screenshot |
| 23:17.38 | Caesar_NayKid | Literally my mom is going to be at her work until i can bail her out somehow |
| 23:17.44 | Caesar_NayKid | So i thank you all |
| 23:18.23 | Caesar_NayKid | Ok got a pic lemme try the imgur |
| 23:19.15 | Caesar_NayKid | https://imgur.com/gallery/VWe5QsX |
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| 23:21.14 | Caesar_NayKid | Did that come through? |
| 23:21.39 | johnjay | if i want to set a static ip should i modify /etc/network/interfaces or if it's wlan0 do i need a different file? |
| 23:22.01 | johnjay | i ask because presumably the wlan0 config is somewhere else |
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| 23:22.43 | sney | Caesar_NayKid: comment out the bottom 3 lines, save and reboot, the system should come up. then you can optionally mount those other volumes from the running system. |
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| 23:22.55 | sney | johnjay: any interface can be configured from /etc/network/interfaces. |
| 23:23.05 | Caesar_NayKid | ratrace: you available? |
| 23:23.21 | Caesar_NayKid | Or sney any suggestions? |
| 23:23.30 | sney | Caesar_NayKid: I literally just told you. |
| 23:23.36 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: sney just told you |
| 23:23.39 | johnjay | well ok. but clearly wlan0 isn't being configured from that |
| 23:23.41 | johnjay | hence my qusetion |
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| 23:23.45 | Caesar_NayKid | Oh i see your comment now. This irc app is terrible on iOS |
| 23:23.49 | ratrace | but then ... I wonder what happened there since the fstab lines _already_ have the nofail option |
| 23:23.53 | johnjay | if i need a static ip for my wlan0 i may need to put it somewhere else |
| 23:24.06 | Caesar_NayKid | Comment out is # yes? |
| 23:24.12 | sney | johnjay: if you configure your wlan0 in /etc/network/interfaces, network-manager will no longer handle it. |
| 23:24.29 | johnjay | ok. so if that's true then it won't connect at all. |
| 23:25.19 | sney | you will also need to put your wifi ssid and psk in /etc/network/interfaces for it to work. the debian wiki has instructions, and there is a lot of information in 'man 5 interfaces' as well. |
| 23:25.21 | ratrace | johnjay: unless you set up wpa_supplicant directly |
| 23:25.29 | johnjay | alright |
| 23:26.45 | sney | there is a working example here, in the 3rd code block. make sure to change wlp2s0 to your actual device name. https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/HowToUse#Using_ifupdown |
| 23:26.47 | Caesar_NayKid | Question, in that pic, the first line shouldn't it also be commented out? Or is it correct with a leading slash? |
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| 23:27.23 | sney | Caesar_NayKid: the first line should be commented out, yes. looks like whoever opened the file accidentally pressed the / key. |
| 23:27.25 | Caesar_NayKid | I got a parse error in line 1 is why i ask and it not blue like a comment. |
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| 23:27.43 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: is that Debian btw... |
| 23:28.02 | ratrace | Bullseye? |
| 23:28.43 | ratrace | sney: well that's a good catch, I totally missed it |
| 23:29.23 | sney | ratrace: Caesar_NayKid asked, I just confirmed |
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| 23:29.43 | ratrace | I was looking at the first UUID= line and thinking why would you comment out rootfs :) |
| 23:29.58 | Caesar_NayKid | Debian yes. |
| 23:31.46 | Caesar_NayKid | Bullseye yes. |
| 23:32.03 | Caesar_NayKid | # out those three and now rebooted and to the GUI login!! |
| 23:33.13 | *** mode/#debian [+o jelly] by ChanServ |
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| 23:34.41 | sney | eyeballs the ops |
| 23:34.43 | *** mode/#debian [-o debchange] by debchange |
| 23:35.13 | Caesar_NayKid | So,.. wow. |
| 23:35.18 | ratrace | jelly: expecting trouble? :) |
| 23:35.30 | sney | maybe expecting a lack of services? |
| 23:35.39 | jelly | ratrace, not just yet |
| 23:35.58 | Caesar_NayKid | I have a question now, about those items i # commented out. Is there a way to check them now? |
| 23:36.10 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: "check"? |
| 23:36.24 | Caesar_NayKid | Like the mounts? |
| 23:36.37 | ratrace | what do you mean by "check" |
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| 23:37.01 | Caesar_NayKid | Ok well I don't want to break something I guess |
| 23:37.14 | Caesar_NayKid | Im in gparted |
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| 23:38.04 | Caesar_NayKid | Is there a potential something i need to avoid to not mess up my partitions? |
| 23:38.30 | ratrace | yes, don't touch them at all once the system is installed, unless you know very well what you're doing |
| 23:38.30 | Caesar_NayKid | They all appear to have correct mount points but that one backupINT |
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| 23:39.21 | Caesar_NayKid | All but /dev/sda |
| 23:39.57 | Caesar_NayKid | Dev/sdb is passed through to a VM as a secondary drive so it has no mount point either |
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| 23:40.52 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: speaking of, you have two fstab entries for the same mount point. is that deliberate? they can't both be correct at the same time |
| 23:41.06 | ratrace | but then, they all have nofail so I don't understand what kind of problem you even had there? |
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| 23:41.38 | Caesar_NayKid | I don't either. It was working then i did apt-get update then apt upgrade |
| 23:41.42 | Caesar_NayKid | Rebooted |
| 23:41.44 | Caesar_NayKid | Failure |
| 23:42.02 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: Failure _where_ exactly? before login screen, after? |
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| 23:42.26 | Caesar_NayKid | Yes. Earlier |
| 23:42.50 | ratrace | I suppose systemd choked on having two fstab entries for the same mountpoint |
| 23:43.14 | Caesar_NayKid | Probably |
| 23:43.21 | Caesar_NayKid | Got another problem |
| 23:43.26 | Caesar_NayKid | I updated NoMachine |
| 23:43.32 | ratrace | if you intend to enable the mountpoints, decide which one to remove, for /home/paul/BackupINT mountpoint |
| 23:43.46 | Caesar_NayKid | Then it told me something about the system id changed. |
| 23:43.58 | Caesar_NayKid | So it wanted to relog me. Now it failing |
| 23:44.06 | Caesar_NayKid | I connected via ssh in Putty |
| 23:44.13 | ratrace | Caesar_NayKid: Bullseye is still in testing. Even though it's soft frozen, there's no guarantees it won't break with an upgrade |
| 23:44.36 | Caesar_NayKid | Any idea how to restart NoMachine from a ssh command prompt? |
| 23:44.50 | ratrace | so you (have) made two mistakes: upgrading remotely, letting a non-tech user use debian testing with you not nearby to fix |
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| 23:45.11 | ratrace | has no idea what NoMachine is |
| 23:45.13 | Caesar_NayKid | Yes and i learned now the hard way never to do those again. |
| 23:45.29 | Caesar_NayKid | I will only update in the future when im at the console |
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| 23:46.23 | Caesar_NayKid | Any clues on restarting nomachine daemon? |
| 23:46.44 | Caesar_NayKid | Im logged in via ssh |
| 23:48.00 | Caesar_NayKid | Nevermind it's working now. |
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| 23:48.17 | pfred1 | working is good |
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| 23:52.30 | Caesar_NayKid | Hmm |
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| 23:55.22 | Caesar_NayKid | Is there a command to display all my drives by uuid? |
| 23:55.40 | Caesar_NayKid | I see the dupe entry but not sure what one of them is |
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| 23:56.05 | jelly | blkid |
| 23:56.42 | Caesar_NayKid | Command not found |
| 23:56.55 | ratrace | !buster su |
| 23:56.56 | dpkg | In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). See https://wiki.debian.org/NewInBuster#Changes for details. |
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| 23:57.25 | jelly | Caesar_NayKid, it's in /sbin |
| 23:57.44 | Caesar_NayKid | Sudo got it done. |
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