| 00:07.00 | zorton | zorton.org/dmesg-7100.txt |
| 00:07.05 | zorton | thanks everyone, it works just fine |
| 00:09.22 | *** join/#debianppc Jeedo (~Ofurfluga@adsl6-56.simnet.is) |
| 00:23.31 | *** join/#debianppc sourdough (eb@ash.penguinppc.org) |
| 00:37.35 | *** join/#debianppc micklweiss_lapto (~chatzilla@adsl-068-209-110-207.sip.mia.bellsouth.net) |
| 00:38.12 | chlunde | Report from the future: linux (on ppc) doesn't crash in 2004 :P |
| 00:38.58 | hoytt | wow, thanks ;) |
| 00:40.14 | micklweiss_lapto | oh shit, i dropped my computer and now the video is messed up |
| 00:40.23 | micklweiss_lapto | my 7600/132 |
| 00:40.35 | hoytt | you're tossing a PM7600 around? |
| 00:40.41 | hoytt | who are you? The Hulk? |
| 00:42.11 | micklweiss_lapto | no, i was working on it, and it fell |
| 00:42.21 | micklweiss_lapto | it waqs on another computer case |
| 00:42.32 | micklweiss_lapto | i have 8 computers out and i'm in a small room |
| 00:42.41 | micklweiss_lapto | i needeed to conserve space |
| 00:42.53 | hoytt | sounds very geeky ;) |
| 00:43.49 | micklweiss_lapto | ya, but i don't recommend it |
| 00:44.16 | micklweiss_lapto | ok, now this com puter will only be accessible via vnc |
| 00:44.23 | micklweiss_lapto | oh well, another server :) |
| 00:46.28 | micklweiss_lapto | damn, i can't see anything in the install |
| 00:46.35 | micklweiss_lapto | text is too mangled |
| 00:46.43 | micklweiss_lapto | can anyone recommend something? |
| 00:46.56 | micklweiss_lapto | like installing via another computer? |
| 00:51.46 | micklweiss_lapto | i think it is possible to install a system via another, right? |
| 01:03.34 | sourdough | micklweiss_lapto sure something wasn't just knocked loose? |
| 01:04.30 | micklweiss_lapto | hmmm, i'll double check |
| 01:05.30 | LarstiQ | serial console, firewire/usb slave? |
| 01:05.37 | LarstiQ | or netinstalls |
| 01:06.24 | micklweiss_lapto | can't be |
| 01:06.28 | micklweiss_lapto | its onboard |
| 01:06.56 | micklweiss_lapto | currently its netinstall via floppy |
| 01:08.23 | micklweiss_lapto | i see like waves going across my screen and fonts are not legible |
| 01:08.48 | micklweiss_lapto | i guess i'm lucky that the other stuff works |
| 01:08.50 | micklweiss_lapto | :/ |
| 01:56.28 | micklweiss_lapto | is it possible to start the boot floppy and have it autodetect networking and start sshd or something |
| 01:56.44 | micklweiss_lapto | so that i can login and continue the install |
| 02:06.56 | sourdough | micklweiss_lapto sure, make a custom initrd floppy |
| 02:07.38 | sourdough | probably easier to just add console=ttyS0,38400n8 to the kernel args and use a serial terminal |
| 02:08.39 | micklweiss_lapto | i'm actually just stareing at the screen for 5 minutes at a time trying to decypher the text |
| 02:09.46 | micklweiss_lapto | when partitioning, there is length, base, size For the first block - do i put the base for the free partition |
| 02:12.26 | micklweiss_lapto | length: 2503530, base: 132, size: 1.2G Free Space |
| 02:12.41 | micklweiss_lapto | do i do this: |
| 02:12.46 | micklweiss_lapto | c |
| 02:12.52 | micklweiss_lapto | First block: 132 |
| 02:15.02 | sourdough | use the partiiton number of the free space partiton |
| 02:15.04 | sourdough | 2p or so |
| 02:23.04 | micklweiss_lapto | do you remember what it says after First block: |
| 02:23.13 | micklweiss_lapto | i see this: |
| 02:23.42 | micklweiss_lapto | Length (in blocks #%@#$^ 4^#$^ #$ ^$# ^#^$#&^%) |
| 02:23.55 | micklweiss_lapto | what comes after blocks? |
| 02:24.28 | micklweiss_lapto | i think i see>>>>> or G3 (G)): |
| 02:24.32 | micklweiss_lapto | somewhere in there |
| 02:28.41 | micklweiss_lapto | damnit, isn't there an autopartition or something? |
| 02:29.01 | micklweiss_lapto | the numbers must be wrong since everything is (out of range) |
| 02:32.39 | micklweiss_lapto | sourdough: how do i create a custom inid floppyt? |
| 02:32.55 | micklweiss_lapto | i'm at the end of my rope here |
| 02:34.11 | micklweiss_lapto | is the base the first block in that partition? |
| 02:35.51 | MrKennie | I think its last - first .. worked for me looking at it that way anyway :) |
| 02:36.09 | MrKennie | although depends how big you want the partition.. |
| 02:36.26 | MrKennie | kb after blocks I think |
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| 02:37.43 | MrKennie | Length (in blocks, kB (k), MB (M) or GB (G)): |
| 02:39.03 | sourdough | http://penguinppc.org/projects/yaboot/doc/yaboot-howto.shtml |
| 02:39.03 | sourdough | http://penguinppc.org/projects/yaboot/doc/mac-fdisk-basics.shtml |
| 02:39.03 | sourdough | http://people.debian.org/~branden/ibook/ |
| 02:39.27 | MrKennie | that pretty much sums it up :) |
| 02:40.40 | micklweiss_lapto | ah |
| 02:40.42 | micklweiss_lapto | i see |
| 02:42.35 | micklweiss_lapto | b create a type of: NewWorld bootloader |
| 02:42.54 | micklweiss_lapto | i guess "d" and then "C" |
| 02:43.02 | micklweiss_lapto | insyead of using b |
| 02:43.03 | MrKennie | yes.. you need a bootstrap partition |
| 02:43.19 | MrKennie | for newworld |
| 02:43.20 | sourdough | bootstrap partiiton is for neworld right now, but eventually you may need it on oldworld too |
| 02:43.28 | sourdough | C you should not use |
| 02:43.31 | sourdough | c instead |
| 02:43.41 | micklweiss_lapto | ok, i'm confused |
| 02:43.41 | sourdough | use `i' to clear the partition table |
| 02:43.48 | micklweiss_lapto | i'm on an old world mac |
| 02:43.59 | MrKennie | sourdough: ooh, I look forward to that day :) |
| 02:44.01 | micklweiss_lapto | does it matter that the bootstrap is New World? |
| 02:44.11 | MrKennie | wont hurt |
| 02:44.18 | micklweiss_lapto | oh ok |
| 02:44.26 | MrKennie | just wont be using it |
| 02:44.35 | micklweiss_lapto | i guess leave the Driver partitions in there, right? |
| 02:44.40 | MrKennie | you need to check out the oldworld docs tho.. |
| 02:45.04 | MrKennie | I dont even think you can delete them anyway |
| 02:45.13 | micklweiss_lapto | perhaps my question should be: where are the oldworld docs ;) |
| 02:45.16 | sourdough | drivers are cruft |
| 02:45.23 | sourdough | no macos means remove them |
| 02:45.27 | arcady | driver are for MacOS to load itself with |
| 02:45.32 | MrKennie | mac-fdisk wouldn't let me |
| 02:45.47 | sourdough | you must use hte `i' command to remove them |
| 02:45.53 | micklweiss_lapto | i think that i got a prompt before that said, Don't delete them |
| 02:45.56 | MrKennie | said it cant do it (yet) or something so I just left them.. whats a few k anyway |
| 02:46.08 | micklweiss_lapto | ya, its fine |
| 02:46.09 | sourdough | its false, if you don't have macos you don't need them |
| 02:46.11 | micklweiss_lapto | i'll leave them |
| 02:46.12 | MrKennie | hmm.. now that sounds familiar |
| 02:46.27 | MrKennie | 'i' |
| 02:46.43 | sourdough | mac-fdisk just doesn't know how to delete them, it does know how ot create a new clean partition table which doesn't have them in the first place |
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| 02:47.06 | sourdough | driver partiitons introduce corruption into the block zero map of the partition table, mac-fdisk doesn't know how to repair that |
| 02:47.21 | MrKennie | sourdough: cool.. now that will come in handy the next time |
| 02:47.43 | MrKennie | I recall doing that on the 9500 |
| 02:48.29 | MrKennie | I can always bz2 the install and redo it and put everything back |
| 02:48.55 | micklweiss_lapto | where can i find the old world docs? |
| 02:49.10 | simonrvn | micklweiss_lapto: as in? |
| 02:49.28 | micklweiss_lapto | docs that cover oldworld specific stuff |
| 02:49.35 | micklweiss_lapto | like not using yaboot etc. |
| 02:49.41 | MrKennie | debian docs? |
| 02:49.47 | micklweiss_lapto | ya |
| 02:49.51 | MrKennie | I'm sure the install guide mentions both |
| 02:49.55 | micklweiss_lapto | no gentoo :P |
| 02:50.04 | simonrvn | www.penguinppc.org, simonraven.nuit.ca/macppc/ the install guide, and google |
| 02:51.20 | chlunde | Hmm, sound skips when I turn off the backlight on my iBook, that didn't happen i 2.4, did it? |
| 02:51.35 | chlunde | It happens every time in 2.6.0 |
| 02:51.45 | MrKennie | no surprise there |
| 02:52.19 | MrKennie | try 2.6.1-rc1 ? lots of things fixed |
| 02:52.38 | micklweiss_lapto | ok, i just used "i" and i was wondering, should i use the NewWorld bootstrap, or Apple_bootstrap |
| 02:53.00 | MrKennie | does not really matter in your case |
| 02:53.04 | micklweiss_lapto | ok |
| 02:53.13 | chlunde | I will tomorrow, but now I'm almost asleep (that's why I turned of the backlight ;)) |
| 02:53.24 | MrKennie | :) |
| 02:53.27 | MrKennie | night |
| 02:53.59 | chlunde | Good night/new year ;) |
| 02:54.34 | sourdough | micklweiss_lapto they are the same thing, the bootstra parittion is good to create, but for now will be unused |
| 02:54.43 | simonrvn | micklweiss_lapto: i'd put a NW_Bootstrap there. you'll need it later |
| 02:54.57 | micklweiss_lapto | k |
| 02:57.26 | micklweiss_lapto | whats a good number to use for a swap partition? |
| 02:57.45 | micklweiss_lapto | i'm getting used to this... thats so much guys :) |
| 02:57.56 | micklweiss_lapto | even though i can't read much ;) |
| 02:58.03 | MrKennie | depnds |
| 02:58.36 | MrKennie | I usually double my ram.. but thats just me |
| 02:59.59 | MrKennie | that is swap size double my system memory |
| 03:00.00 | micklweiss_lapto | 16 MB |
| 03:00.06 | MrKennie | .. |
| 03:00.29 | MrKennie | you have 16M ? |
| 03:00.39 | micklweiss_lapto | 16 x 2 = 32 |
| 03:00.51 | MrKennie | how big is the hdd ? |
| 03:00.54 | micklweiss_lapto | http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac/stats/powermac_7600_132.html |
| 03:01.07 | micklweiss_lapto | i _believe_ |
| 03:01.12 | micklweiss_lapto | not sure though |
| 03:01.27 | micklweiss_lapto | 1.2 Gig |
| 03:02.09 | MrKennie | dunno.. I'd say about 128? but again.. thats what I'd do.. |
| 03:02.29 | micklweiss_lapto | what should i type in under "type" |
| 03:02.37 | MrKennie | swap |
| 03:02.45 | sourdough | don't use the C command |
| 03:02.46 | micklweiss_lapto | oh just swap? |
| 03:02.53 | micklweiss_lapto | ok, nevermind |
| 03:02.54 | sourdough | you should not be getting asked for type, only name |
| 03:03.00 | sourdough | name must be swap |
| 03:03.07 | MrKennie | thought that sounded strange |
| 03:03.08 | sourdough | we don't have types yet |
| 03:03.10 | micklweiss_lapto | so: c instead |
| 03:05.08 | MrKennie | sourdough: with the paritions like root partition etc, should they be named their mount points? I have been |
| 03:05.25 | MrKennie | like my root partition is named / |
| 03:05.56 | MrKennie | couldn't work out if it was required |
| 03:06.00 | MrKennie | did it anyway |
| 03:07.26 | sourdough | doesn't matter |
| 03:07.38 | MrKennie | ok |
| 03:07.41 | sourdough | name is up to you, except for swap where installers overload name as type |
| 03:07.54 | sourdough | because were broken and don't have our own types yet |
| 03:08.37 | MrKennie | makes it nice and easy to spot which partition is which tho :) |
| 03:08.47 | MrKennie | at a glance |
| 03:08.57 | sourdough | we need to come up with a partition type that makes sense |
| 03:09.05 | sourdough | i would say just one for swap one for fs |
| 03:09.13 | sourdough | not one per each fs type, that is silly |
| 03:09.24 | MrKennie | hmm |
| 03:09.47 | MrKennie | you mean like on x86 you have 84(?) for swap? |
| 03:09.47 | sourdough | BSD uses something like BSD, then create thier own disklable inside that |
| 03:10.13 | sourdough | MrKennie yes, except with apple tables its a 31 char string, not a short int |
| 03:10.19 | MrKennie | ouch |
| 03:10.28 | sourdough | Apple_* is reserved, we should not be using them |
| 03:10.40 | sourdough | with one exception Apple_Bootstrap, we need that because the firmware looks for it |
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| 03:10.52 | MrKennie | hmm |
| 03:11.13 | sourdough | and ive got a unofficial understanding with apple developers that they own Apple_Boot for osx, and we own Apple_Bootstrap for our bootloaders |
| 03:11.40 | MrKennie | Apple_UNIX_SVR2 <- thats the type ? |
| 03:11.50 | sourdough | yes that belongs to apples old A/UX |
| 03:12.15 | MrKennie | would make sense to bin it |
| 03:12.17 | sourdough | they could add support to OSX for that old a/ux fs and osx would start offering to erase the corrupted a/ux (linux/ fs |
| 03:12.39 | MrKennie | but what about dual booting machines? would it effect the "other" os? |
| 03:13.01 | sourdough | MrKennie apple OSes only look at Apple_* types, and ignore everything else |
| 03:13.08 | MrKennie | I see |
| 03:13.20 | sourdough | apple specifically documents that they own Apple_* namespace, 3rd party must use anything but Apple_* |
| 03:13.25 | MrKennie | that would be a safer bet |
| 03:13.31 | sourdough | and using anything but Apple_* is perfectly safe and compatible |
| 03:13.33 | sourdough | yes |
| 03:13.55 | sourdough | ive suggested GNU and Linux_swap, but some don't like GNU |
| 03:14.03 | MrKennie | about time it was fixed then! ;) |
| 03:14.08 | sourdough | Linux doesn't make sense, OS other then Linux support our fs |
| 03:14.12 | sourdough | such as Hurd |
| 03:14.43 | sourdough | and one type per fs is horridly silly, soon as you run mkfs they become innaccurate |
| 03:14.55 | sourdough | and we don't use the broken mount by parttion type scheme macos uses |
| 03:15.23 | sourdough | its easy to fix, the only things that care about partition types are dist installers |
| 03:15.27 | sourdough | the kernel doesn't care |
| 03:15.31 | MrKennie | the see a apartitio and mount it anyway thing? |
| 03:15.41 | MrKennie | er.. partition |
| 03:15.50 | sourdough | MrKennie macos will only mount Apple_HFS type partitions |
| 03:16.02 | sourdough | old ones would mount Apple_PRODOS too |
| 03:16.13 | sourdough | osx will mount Apple_UFS |
| 03:16.32 | sourdough | a/ux mounts Apple_UNIX_SVR2 |
| 03:17.37 | myXtie | so much for bootless kernel-less os like Tunes ( I was talking w/someone I said I guess it doesn't even need a computer ) |
| 03:17.51 | MrKennie | so who needs convincing we need to get out of apples namespace? |
| 03:19.04 | MrKennie | the community? I say do it!!!!! :> |
| 03:23.00 | MrKennie | I think Linux_* |
| 03:23.19 | MrKennie | what else could it be? |
| 03:27.51 | micklweiss_lapto | i need to get some rest |
| 03:28.03 | micklweiss_lapto | staring at a messed up screen gives me a headache |
| 03:28.16 | micklweiss_lapto | atleast the netinstall is working now |
| 03:28.19 | micklweiss_lapto | thats a lot guys! |
| 03:28.22 | micklweiss_lapto | :) |
| 03:29.35 | sourdough | MrKennie Linux_ is not right |
| 03:29.45 | sourdough | MrKennie these are not linux specific/linux-only fs |
| 03:29.48 | sourdough | ext2 is used by Hurd |
| 03:31.47 | MrKennie | hmm |
| 03:31.57 | MrKennie | Free_* :) |
| 03:32.06 | MrKennie | that could be misleading |
| 03:34.32 | MrKennie | how about an acronym |
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| 03:40.37 | sourdough | i was thinking FOS_ |
| 03:40.46 | sourdough | Free Open Software or Free OS |
| 03:40.59 | sourdough | FOS_fs |
| 03:41.02 | sourdough | Linux_swap |
| 03:41.13 | sourdough | FOS_swap |
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| 03:45.00 | myXtie | but netbsd and openbsd use different partition scheme and how will you tell the difference between reiser4, ffs, and xfs etc.. if it says FOS ? |
| 03:45.31 | sourdough | myXtie *bsd use a *BSD type, which has thier disklabel |
| 03:45.45 | sourdough | myXtie why would you need to tell fs type from a partition type? |
| 03:45.54 | sourdough | myXtie we don't now, we don't on x86 (all use the same one 0x83) |
| 03:46.17 | sourdough | you tell fs type by probing for superblock magic numbers, not orthogonal things like partition tables |
| 03:46.52 | sourdough | myXtie if you really wanted that on your system you could use teh name feild for that, which everything should ignore |
| 03:47.35 | myXtie | unless it is broke then knowning type is nice |
| 03:47.50 | sourdough | thats up to the admin |
| 03:48.04 | sourdough | and space is available in the apple partition table for admin defined info (the name) |
| 03:48.24 | sourdough | having a type for each fs is silly and makes things like installers, partitioners much more complicated |
| 03:48.35 | sourdough | instead of an installer needing to know about one type it has to know about 50 |
| 03:49.02 | sourdough | and the fact is NOWHERE do we use types for fs, we don't now, we don't on x86 and nobody seems to be hurt by this |
| 03:49.27 | sourdough | just because apple and MS do it with all 2 of each's fs doesn't mean we should with our 2 dozen fs |
| 03:50.24 | sourdough | besides if you originaly install with ext2, and has Linux_ext2 types, then later move to xfs by mkfs your partitions they still say Linux_ext2 in the partition table |
| 03:51.04 | myXtie | again the only advantage is if the type is unknown and fs is broken |
| 03:51.13 | sourdough | and thats not much of one |
| 03:51.29 | sourdough | and its already accomidated if you want it, via name |
| 03:51.46 | sourdough | which should be ENTIRELY user defined, we should not overload it with typing stuff in installers like we do now |
| 03:51.53 | sourdough | (if its not named swap, its not swap bullshit) |
| 03:52.35 | MrKennie | slackware looks for swap in a similar way |
| 03:52.55 | sourdough | they all use the same broken Apple_ type stuff |
| 03:53.27 | MrKennie | unless you LFS |
| 03:53.40 | MrKennie | then you dont get the installer thing |
| 03:53.42 | MrKennie | :) |
| 03:54.39 | myXtie | I'm interested in how you could mesh with disklabel is that possible ? |
| 03:55.18 | sourdough | myXtie what do you mean? |
| 03:56.02 | myXtie | move closer together on standards |
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| 03:56.46 | sourdough | bsd lives in its own world regarding thier disklabel |
| 03:57.02 | sourdough | and really it makes life difficult |
| 03:57.23 | sourdough | since bsd won't even really see partitions outside its disklabel |
| 03:57.23 | myXtie | I know |
| 03:57.34 | sourdough | and the disklabel is limited to 16 entires or somsuch |
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| 05:38.44 | spacecowboy | sourdough: you about ready to start using 2.6? |
| 05:38.49 | spacecowboy | @kernel |
| 05:38.53 | spacecowboy | ~kernel |
| 05:41.36 | sourdough | no |
| 05:42.52 | sourdough | i won't even consider using it until andrew's list of `must fix brokeness' list is empty |
| 05:43.58 | myXtie | where is andrew's list ? |
| 05:45.53 | myXtie | happy new year whenever it begins for you, cheers .. |
| 05:48.47 | sourdough | ftp://ftp.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/akpm/must-fix/must-fix-7.txt |
| 05:49.29 | sourdough | ftp://ftp.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/akpm/must-fix/should-fix-7.txt |
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| 05:49.59 | myXtie | thanks |
| 05:52.27 | burntash | how do i get that dri trunk |
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| 06:31.40 | mojo | howdy howdy all... i have a fairly small/big problem.. installed debian for the first time on a mac last night.. for whatever reason now though it wont boot up. it installed, then told me a key combo to press incase of this problem but i dont remember the key combo.. any help would be great |
| 06:34.35 | sloopy | mojo: to boot cd you hold down 'c' |
| 06:34.50 | sloopy | what machine is it? |
| 06:34.56 | mojo | an oldworld mac clone |
| 06:35.13 | mojo | holding c doesnt work sadly, i had to go from disk, but it wont boot from that either |
| 06:35.29 | mojo | its a powercomputing mac with scsi.. |
| 06:35.38 | mojo | im wondering if it did not setup right or something.. not quite sure |
| 06:37.01 | sloopy | it wont boot linux directly... |
| 06:37.24 | sloopy | it needs to boot mac os and then run bootx to get to linux |
| 06:38.11 | mojo | seriously? |
| 06:38.16 | sloopy | yes |
| 06:38.31 | burntash | what the shit, none of the benh kernels i use ever work |
| 06:38.42 | burntash | they start booting and my screen turns completely black |
| 06:38.51 | mojo | afk half a sec |
| 06:38.54 | sloopy | well you can get direct boot for linux on oldworld but requires deep black magic a sacrificial chicken and two mojo advisors ;') |
| 06:39.11 | sloopy | burntash: on oldworld or newworld? |
| 06:39.27 | burntash | new |
| 06:39.52 | sloopy | hmmm usuing fbdev? or specific card driver? |
| 06:40.18 | burntash | i dunno |
| 06:40.42 | sloopy | what video card does it have (or machine is it if you dont know the video card) |
| 06:40.44 | kimo_sabe | sloopy: I heard goat sacrifice, not chicken |
| 06:40.45 | burntash | just installed debian a day ago and ive been trying to get the X to work, i have the new ibook g4 with radeon 9200 |
| 06:41.01 | sloopy | kimo_sabe: it is a mac clone not true mac, you can skimp ;') |
| 06:41.09 | kimo_sabe | sloopy: ah |
| 06:42.03 | sloopy | burntash: the drivers for it havnt been completed fully you will probly get a blank screen cause it is using fbdev which has a couple bugs in it... it should still run and X should give you a screen... |
| 06:42.50 | kimo_sabe | burntash: until XF4.3 or a more-patched 4.2 goes into the archives tell it you have a 9000... |
| 06:43.07 | kimo_sabe | burntash: Add "ChipID 0x4966" to the Device section of your XF86Config-4 |
| 06:45.34 | burntash | i have xfree 4.3 experimental installed |
| 06:46.25 | kimo_sabe | burntash: hmm, that should recognise it |
| 06:46.41 | burntash | i dont have a chipid in my xf86config though |
| 06:46.56 | burntash | and i think i might need that dri tree? |
| 06:47.11 | mojo | sloopy if it will boot off of the disk why wont it boot off of the hd? if i set it up to boot macos first, your saying i need to boot mac os9 or so to get it to boot up in to linux? |
| 06:47.24 | kimo_sabe | burntash: the experimental 4.3 should be fine, I think |
| 06:47.37 | *** part/#debianppc myXtie (~rod@dialup-67.75.148.245.Dial1.Atlanta1.Level3.net) |
| 06:47.44 | sloopy | mojo: yeah... it has to boot mac os (any version from 7.5-9.1) |
| 06:47.46 | burntash | whats X have to do with booting the system though. when i choose to boot the new kernel |
| 06:47.55 | mojo | hrm |
| 06:48.05 | mojo | i would have to buy a copy of 7.5 or something then.. :( |
| 06:48.47 | burntash | i put that chip id in and rebooted and it still goes black when the kernel is loading |
| 06:48.51 | sloopy | mojo: yeah... |
| 06:49.04 | mojo | hrm what is required in making it work with out booting in to macos? |
| 06:49.09 | sloopy | or do you have another mac around? |
| 06:49.10 | kimo_sabe | burntash: hmm, radeonfb isn't happy either? What kernel? |
| 06:49.11 | mojo | no |
| 06:49.49 | burntash | rsync -avz rsync.penguinppc.org::linux-2.4-benh /usr/src/benh |
| 06:49.50 | sloopy | getting it to boot without mac os is a VERY difficult proposition... near impossible without mac os... |
| 06:50.13 | mojo | what about booting with disk to linux? |
| 06:50.26 | mojo | would that be one way aroun dit? |
| 06:50.28 | sloopy | cd? |
| 06:50.29 | mojo | er around it |
| 06:50.31 | sloopy | or floppy? |
| 06:50.33 | mojo | no floppy |
| 06:50.40 | mojo | i cant boot from cd's on this mac |
| 06:50.56 | sloopy | ahhh doesnt have a apple cd rom drive... |
| 06:50.56 | kimo_sabe | burntash: hmm. You can't shove a gig of ram into one of those, can you? |
| 06:51.12 | burntash | eh? |
| 06:51.13 | sloopy | mojo: what kind of inet connect you have? |
| 06:51.33 | mojo | cable outbound, 100baset internal network |
| 06:51.50 | mojo | 2 linux box's running on the network but both i386 |
| 06:52.17 | mojo | this is my first time setting up linux on a mac.. learning a lot of the install bit and partitioning and stuff over again for this |
| 06:54.37 | burntash | im usin this http://jodok.muellers.ms/linuxppc/ |
| 06:54.38 | burntash | as my guide |
| 07:00.25 | burntash | damnit |
| 07:00.27 | Sam-I-Am | mmm yeha too mush alcohocol |
| 07:00.32 | Sam-I-Am | mmm, drunk |
| 07:09.46 | burntash | damn dri trunk |
| 07:09.48 | burntash | doesnt work for shit |
| 07:28.08 | sourdough | sloopy you need a serial terminal to see whats going on |
| 07:28.18 | sourdough | sloopy then you can fix it to boot properly |
| 07:30.08 | sloopy | sourdough: i know... i have done it before... |
| 07:30.19 | sourdough | http://penguinppc.org/projects/quik/quirks.shtml |
| 07:31.54 | burntash | can someone tell me how to get X working on the new ibook g4 |
| 07:33.59 | sloopy | sourdough: it is mojo who is the one asking ;') |
| 07:34.17 | sourdough | oh |
| 07:34.19 | sourdough | oh well |
| 07:34.21 | mojo | i ask to many questions :) |
| 07:34.57 | sourdough | burntash have you gotten console framebuffer to work correctly yet? (cat /proc/fb if it contains Offb then answer is No) |
| 07:35.06 | sourdough | mojo what model specifically? |
| 07:35.33 | mojo | power computing power center pro 180 with an upgraded g3 to 240mhz |
| 07:36.31 | sourdough | PowerComputing PowerCenter Pro (All Models)1.0.5 |
| 07:36.32 | sourdough | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:36.32 | sourdough | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:36.33 | sourdough | * OF Video Only Displays on Mac DB15 Monitor Port. |
| 07:37.12 | burntash | sourdough: it has 2 lines, both say 0 OFfb and 1 OFfb |
| 07:37.16 | mojo | ya im running rom the monitor port from the machine its self, not the ati 128 pro in it |
| 07:37.34 | mojo | rom = from |
| 07:37.40 | sourdough | burntash you have not gotten console framebuffer working yet then, and that means you cannot use X |
| 07:37.53 | burntash | sourdough: how do i get console frame buffer working |
| 07:37.56 | sourdough | or your booting with video=ofonly |
| 07:37.57 | mojo | man this computer is a butt kicker in so many ways.. ehhe |
| 07:38.02 | sourdough | burntash enable the right framebuffer driver |
| 07:38.32 | sourdough | mojo you get into OF yet? |
| 07:38.32 | burntash | and i dont see video=ofonly in my yaboot.conf |
| 07:38.52 | sourdough | burntash offb is a fallback if no usuable framebuffer driver is found |
| 07:38.59 | sourdough | offb == ofonly |
| 07:39.04 | sourdough | == no X |
| 07:39.08 | sourdough | == slow |
| 07:39.17 | mojo | no, when i try it on the screen comes up for a second then backs down to like it has no signal |
| 07:39.45 | mojo | then it doesnt do anything, i let it sit for 30 minutes like that, with the linux boot disk i made last night and letting the HD try |
| 07:39.47 | burntash | sourdough: how do i enable the right framebuffer driver |
| 07:39.47 | sourdough | mojo probably need serial terminal |
| 07:40.03 | sourdough | burntash kernel config |
| 07:40.25 | mojo | i dont think i cna make a serial terminal |
| 07:41.45 | sourdough | got asecond machine? |
| 07:41.58 | sourdough | connect the serial ports wiht a NULL adapter and use minicom |
| 07:42.10 | mojo | not a second mac |
| 07:42.55 | sourdough | doesn't need to be a mac |
| 07:43.15 | sourdough | my 9600 is connected to my x86 |
| 07:43.38 | mojo | ill see if i can find a null adapter |
| 07:43.40 | burntash | sourdough: would the benh kernel have the right framebuffer |
| 07:43.51 | mojo | if not ill go through it by gussing, it would take me less time |
| 07:44.24 | sourdough | mojo i have the specs for a RS422 -> RS232 adapter |
| 07:44.27 | sourdough | works nicely |
| 07:44.43 | sourdough | burntash it has a newer radeonfb |
| 07:44.59 | sourdough | burntash i was talking to him last night, at least sleep doesn't work on those machines yet, and won't for quite a while |
| 07:45.04 | burntash | sourdough: i had compiled it, and when i boot with it, the screen turns black |
| 07:45.14 | sourdough | and its because of the video chip |
| 07:47.20 | sourdough | ATI needs to cough up some code |
| 07:47.52 | burntash | ah well i have no idea on how to compile kernels myself |
| 07:49.40 | mojo | ill see what i can figure out.. woudl like to avoid serial connection if possible |
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| 10:32.38 | drw | this is odd... on my PMac4400 when using quik, no combination of vmode:,cmode: will result in anything other than 8-bit working properly in the FB, or X. If, on the other hand, I use bootx from MacOS 8 in millions of colours, with video=ofonly, X works flawlessly. |
| 10:33.12 | drw | it seems that when macos inits the hardware, it's fine, otherwise I'm stuck in 256col paletted mode |
| 10:33.50 | drw | oh, when macos inits it and I use ofonly, I don't actually have a console. |
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| 12:20.39 | sourdough | drw more then 8 bit color on console is pointless |
| 12:20.58 | sourdough | drw vmode etc don't work with video=ofonly, you want a real framebuffer driver |
| 12:56.36 | drw | no, you don't understand. |
| 12:59.11 | drw | if I do anything other than boot macos, then use bootx and essentially disable the framebuffer video, I can't run X in anything other than 8 bpp without having the colour messed up. 15-bit is crap, 16-bit is crap, 24 bit is very yellow. (if I don't use macos/bootx and disable console fb) |
| 13:00.01 | drw | I've tried all the vmode cmode combinations that I could with atyfb, none work. |
| 13:00.14 | drw | (well, I have working console, but crap colour in X) |
| 13:01.18 | sourdough | well macos is not the solution |
| 13:01.19 | *** part/#debianppc sourdough (eb@ash.penguinppc.org) |
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| 13:58.31 | vash | is building the kernel for any different between x86 and ppc? |
| 14:00.28 | chlunde | Not really, you need to select the right architecture too. |
| 14:00.58 | vash | beyond the architecture, am i building bzImage or vmlinux? |
| 14:01.19 | nusse | anyone still the buffer of the last 24h and could grep for http for me? |
| 14:01.32 | chlunde | vash: This is #debianppc, here we use make-kpkg (from kernel-package). |
| 14:02.01 | vash | what does make-kpkg do? |
| 14:02.19 | vash | i'm trying to build a stock 2.6.0 kernel |
| 14:02.24 | chlunde | vash: Make a .deb of your kernel, so you can do a clean uninstall etc. |
| 14:02.42 | chlunde | vash: And you can easily ship it to multiple machines, and more. |
| 14:03.05 | vash | well, the reason why i ask is simple: what kind of output file am i looking for |
| 14:03.14 | vash | for x86, i am used to bzImage |
| 14:03.17 | vash | updating lilo |
| 14:03.19 | chlunde | vash: Basically; configure as normal and du make-kpkg. |
| 14:03.27 | vash | but when i build |
| 14:03.33 | vash | do i build bzImage or vmlinux |
| 14:04.29 | chlunde | Someone else would have to answer that, or just read the kernel-package documentation. |
| 14:05.05 | chlunde | Try "apt-cache show kernel-package" |
| 14:05.16 | vash | in the README, it only talks about bzImage and lilo |
| 14:05.19 | vash | very x86 specific |
| 14:06.43 | chlunde | apt-get install kernel-package; cd /usr/src/linux; make menuconfig; fakeroot(?) make-kpkg kernel_image; sudo dpkg -i ../kernel-image-2.6.0-...deb |
| 14:07.07 | drw | vash: make zImage |
| 14:07.14 | chlunde | And.. sudo ybin -v |
| 14:07.18 | dude | fakeroot yes, untar kernel-source after apt-get install ;-) |
| 14:07.34 | vash | make zimage? |
| 14:07.45 | vash | not make bzImage or vmlinux? |
| 14:07.51 | drw | capitol I |
| 14:07.54 | drw | make zImage |
| 14:08.01 | chlunde | vash: Please at least try kernel-package, it will make your life better ;) |
| 14:09.54 | drw | chlunde: I've been using debian for 4 years now, and I've yet to understand what the benefit is to using make-kpkg unless the resulting .deb is intended for distribution. |
| 14:09.55 | vash | but i want a 2.6.0 image |
| 14:10.12 | drw | vash: and? |
| 14:10.17 | vash | and would rather use yaboot to configure which i load |
| 14:10.25 | drw | vash: and? |
| 14:11.58 | chlunde | If you use kernel-package that's alreay done for you.. just run ybin after installing the new image. |
| 14:11.59 | chlunde | drw: Clean uninstall? Read /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/Rationale.gz |
| 14:13.10 | drw | chlunde: yeah, I can see that for new users that don't know where things end up, but rm -r /lib/modules/<kversion> && rm /boot/*<kversion> is a pretty clean uninstall. |
| 14:14.24 | drw | regardless, I've got kernel-package, and use it for distributing kernels to my remote boxes. I understand your point of view as well. |
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| 14:15.00 | chlunde | drw: And it sets up the /vmlinux(.old) links etc., basically it would solve all of vash's problems. |
| 14:16.54 | vash | i'm not trying to distribute a kernel other than to this machine |
| 14:17.02 | vash | i have a vanilla 2.6.0 image |
| 14:17.05 | vash | i am build vmlinux |
| 14:17.16 | vash | now i have to figure which file goes where, then update yaboot.conf |
| 14:17.52 | drw | vash: as chlunde says, if you don't know where it goes, make-kpkg will do that for you. |
| 14:18.05 | drw | otherwise, yes, you need to muddle about doing those things. |
| 14:18.40 | vash | with my build kernel and modules, how would i use make-kpkg? |
| 14:19.47 | chlunde | apt-get install kernel-package; *get linux source* cd /usr/src/linux; make menuconfig; fakeroot make-kpkg kernel_image; sudo dpkg -i ../kernel-image-2.6.0-...deb ; ybin -v |
| 14:23.32 | vash | chlunde: i'm using make-kpkg now |
| 14:24.14 | vash | will using make-kpkg also build modules and modules_install? |
| 14:24.43 | chlunde | Yes, it will build your modules etc. |
| 14:24.58 | vash | ok, so now i know the debian way to build the kernel |
| 14:25.23 | vash | i've been used to doing it completely manual, no matter what distro |
| 14:34.18 | vash | well, the problem is i don't know what type of kernel i am building for ppc and which ones to copy somewhere to add yaboot.conf |
| 14:34.33 | vash | with x86, i know to build bzImage, copy that somewhere, add it to lilo/grub |
| 14:34.34 | vash | done |
| 14:39.52 | chlunde | vash: yaboot.conf is already set up for /vmlinux and /vmlinux.old |
| 14:40.02 | chlunde | (At least if I remember correctly) |
| 14:40.12 | vash | my current one doesn't have vmlinux.old |
| 14:40.32 | chlunde | Your config or your root directory? |
| 14:41.05 | chlunde | Anyway, install the new kernel and make a /vmlinux.old entry if your yaboot.conf doesn't have one. |
| 15:10.31 | vash | time to test the new kernel image |
| 15:22.25 | *** join/#debianppc vash (~vash@cpe-66-27-219-47.socal.rr.com) |
| 15:22.38 | vash | i wasn't able to boot my new kernel |
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| 15:48.09 | nusse | is there a way to modify boot-floppy-hfs.img to use a hd as root fs? |
| 15:55.04 | spacecowboy | hey all |
| 15:55.11 | spacecowboy | :) |
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| 16:22.54 | aleph80 | can i install debian on an external firewire hard drive connected to a powerbook? |
| 16:24.10 | liiwi | iirc someone has done that |
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| 16:32.19 | aleph80 | can i install debian on an external firewire hard drive connected to a powerbook? |
| 16:32.31 | data | anyone burning cds with 2.6 without scsi emulation? |
| 16:36.34 | liiwi | I am |
| 16:40.30 | *** join/#debianppc mzilikazi (~glenn@68.170.26.43) |
| 16:42.35 | mzilikazi | i can't find the manpage for mac-fdisk- the link from Debin's no good- any ideas? |
| 16:42.45 | mzilikazi | all i need to know is what to enter for 'type' |
| 16:43.26 | mzilikazi | linux doesn't work, swap doesn't work and it defaults to Apple_UNIX |
| 16:44.13 | dude | data: yep |
| 16:45.12 | dude | mzilikazi: how 'bout c= create new linux parition ? |
| 16:45.36 | dude | data: what's your question concerning 2.6 + cd recodring ? |
| 16:46.17 | mzilikazi | c creates a new Apple_UNIX partition and the installer won't use it |
| 16:46.33 | mzilikazi | C allows you to specify type but what to enter for type? |
| 16:48.07 | dude | my partitions are labeled apple_unix_svr2, apple_unix should be right; what does the debian-installer says exactly ? |
| 16:50.54 | nusse | where do i get the sources for the boot floppies? |
| 16:51.27 | mzilikazi | dude: it seems to be working now- dunno what i did |
| 16:51.31 | mzilikazi | thanks :) |
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| 16:55.12 | data | nah, forget ab out it, now it works... |
| 17:01.47 | mzilikazi | nusse http://www.debian.org/distrib/floppyinst |
| 17:06.14 | MrKennie | mzilikazi: you need to name it "swap" |
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| 17:10.18 | nusse | miguellinux: i need the sources for it... |
| 17:22.33 | MrKennie | does the ati X driver work with the iMac ATI Rage 128? |
| 17:22.58 | MrKennie | Cannot read V_BIOS (5) |
| 17:23.08 | MrKennie | No DFP detected |
| 17:26.24 | *** join/#debianppc jcm (~jcm@jcmichel.net1.nerim.net) |
| 17:26.52 | MrKennie | aah.. Option "UseFBDev" |
| 17:33.14 | jcm | hi, i get these msgs in syslog when i plug in a damaged firewire disk: ohci1394_0: Unexpected PCI resource length of 1000! \ ohci1394_0: OHCI-1394 1.0 (PCI): IRQ=[40] MMIO=[f5000000-f50007ff] Max Packet=[2048] \ ieee1394: Host added: ID:BUS[0-00:1023] GUID[003065fffeb77ea0] \ ieee1394: ConfigROM quadlet transaction error for node 0-00:1023 |
| 17:33.27 | *** join/#debianppc Quozzy (~yourmothe@tbnb-98-17.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 17:33.42 | Quozzy | Hi all |
| 17:33.43 | jcm | and no scsi device answers correctly to dumpe2fs for instance |
| 17:33.51 | Quozzy | Just a little technical question |
| 17:34.41 | Quozzy | Where do I find the URLof a download mirror for GNU Debian/RedHat/any other linux version which is Mac-Compatible? |
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| 17:36.40 | Quozzy | ... |
| 17:37.30 | jcm | Quozzy: http://www.debian.org/mirror/list |
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| 18:09.45 | MrKennie | ooh.. have I found a bug? |
| 18:09.52 | MrKennie | (EE) R128(0): Idle timed out, resetting engine... |
| 18:09.56 | MrKennie | lots of them |
| 18:10.17 | MrKennie | google search dont turn up much |
| 18:11.59 | liiwi | hrm, 2.6.1-rc1-ben1 does not compile |
| 18:11.59 | liiwi | or rather, link |
| 18:12.03 | liiwi | drivers/built-in.o(.text+0x374c0): In function `start_request': |
| 18:12.03 | liiwi | : undefined reference to `__udivdi3' |
| 18:12.09 | liiwi | drivers/built-in.o(.text+0x374d8): In function `start_request': |
| 18:12.09 | liiwi | : undefined reference to `__umoddi3' |
| 18:13.06 | MrKennie | ooh.. |
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| 19:25.02 | MrKennie | is it possible to adjust the screen in console on iMacs? its slightly shifted and I cant read text on the left |
| 19:35.23 | drw | you need to use a different refresh rate |
| 19:35.44 | drw | do you have vmode/cmode in your append line? |
| 19:36.08 | MrKennie | no |
| 19:37.07 | drw | http://lppcfom.sourceforge.net/fom-serve/cache/1043.html |
| 19:37.17 | drw | try different refresh rates |
| 19:37.41 | MrKennie | thanks |
| 19:38.33 | MrKennie | probably something I needto fix in XF86Config too |
| 19:38.37 | MrKennie | deos the same |
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| 20:01.03 | MrKennie | whoops |
| 20:01.14 | MrKennie | serious typo in yaboot.conf :P |
| 20:08.27 | MrKennie | well.. I changed them to different settings and its exactly the same.. tried different refresh rates |
| 20:09.06 | MrKennie | strange that the lower the cmode the better the color |
| 20:09.13 | MrKennie | whichis opposite to that document |
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| 20:14.01 | PluueeR | I am still having problems with X on my iMac 233 |
| 20:14.40 | MrKennie | what's the error? |
| 20:15.48 | MrKennie | and what driver are you using ? |
| 20:17.47 | PluueeR | ati driver |
| 20:18.03 | PluueeR | No core pointer device specified |
| 20:18.16 | PluueeR | Unable to determine the screen layout |
| 20:18.34 | PluueeR | Error from xf86Handleconfigfile |
| 20:18.47 | PluueeR | and the fatal server error is: no screen found |
| 20:19.00 | MrKennie | so you have a syntax problem |
| 20:19.07 | PluueeR | i believe so |
| 20:19.46 | PluueeR | but don;t know what, I found this config file using google, but it does not seem to work |
| 20:20.01 | MrKennie | try ruuning xf86config ? |
| 20:20.26 | MrKennie | may have to provide the full path to it |
| 20:46.06 | PluueeR | why does the mouse use ImPS/2 while it's USB ? |
| 20:46.15 | PluueeR | I see all the examples use ImPS/2 |
| 20:47.39 | PluueeR | okay, am further now |
| 20:47.55 | PluueeR | added Option "CorePointer" "true" to my mouse config |
| 20:48.01 | drw | maybe 'cause imps/2 is a ps2/usb mouse... it's possible that it uses the same protocol over ps/2 and usb (pure speculation) |
| 20:48.21 | MrKennie | right |
| 20:49.00 | PluueeR | wiw it works |
| 20:49.10 | PluueeR | wow it works |
| 20:49.12 | MrKennie | :) |
| 20:49.18 | PluueeR | something with the PCI config |
| 20:49.36 | PluueeR | nog deciding which Windowmanager to use |
| 20:49.40 | *** join/#debianppc ebynaq (~roland@c-134-116-93.m.dial.de.ignite.net) |
| 20:51.01 | PluueeR | i am thinking of changing to Testing instead of stable |
| 20:51.32 | MrKennie | expect things to get broken |
| 20:51.38 | MrKennie | if you do |
| 20:51.45 | Bor_Ed | I'm running unstable for ages... works just fine |
| 20:52.10 | MrKennie | but its not fun when it all goes wrong |
| 20:52.53 | MrKennie | just saying dont expect things to go smoothly |
| 20:52.56 | *** part/#debianppc ericb (~eric@lns-vlq-4-82-64-220-34.adsl.proxad.net) |
| 20:54.29 | PluueeR | okay using stable then |
| 20:55.04 | MrKennie | well its just sometimes you may need to prod things to get them to go :) |
| 20:56.03 | nusse | is there any documentation for miboot? |
| 20:59.11 | dude | Bor_Ed: apropos xfce4, is it possible to configure the wm to be completely usable via keyboard only ? (/me is on the lost quest for the ultimate wm) |
| 20:59.41 | Bor_Ed | I rarely touch the mouse here unless I load up mozilla so more or less |
| 21:05.59 | *** join/#debianppc robink (robink@h-68-166-180-28.STTNWAHO.covad.net) |
| 21:08.05 | *** join/#debianppc jc_ (~jcm@jcmichel.net1.nerim.net) |
| 21:12.32 | PluueeR | is XFCE 4 in testing ? |
| 21:13.03 | dude | nope;unstable |
| 21:13.41 | PluueeR | grmbl |
| 21:13.51 | PluueeR | and what version of KDE en Gnome are there in stable ? |
| 21:14.08 | Bor_Ed | kde 2.2 and gnome 1.4 or so :) |
| 21:15.05 | PluueeR | krappy old software :) |
| 21:15.14 | dude | PluueeR: using xfce4 from unstable with testing is no pb; doesn't require to update any library |
| 21:15.53 | Bor_Ed | well stable isn't called stable for no reason :P |
| 21:16.17 | PluueeR | okay, but do you need stable on a desktop computer? |
| 21:16.37 | Bor_Ed | I run unstable here on desktop/router |
| 21:19.35 | PluueeR | well I am thinking of using Wmaker :) |
| 21:19.45 | PluueeR | it's small and bloody fast : |
| 21:20.07 | Bor_Ed | can't say xfce4 is bloated either, runs nicely on 601/90 with 64 megs |
| 21:20.51 | Bor_Ed | if I get keyboard to 486 I might install that there too (16 megs ram :) |
| 21:21.13 | PluueeR | how do I update to testing ? |
| 21:21.38 | Bor_Ed | change sources on /etc/apt/sources.list and do dist-upgrade |
| 21:22.51 | PluueeR | and how do I know which sources to use? |
| 21:23.14 | Bor_Ed | just change 'stable' on lines to 'testing' and that's it |
| 21:23.46 | PluueeR | okay |
| 21:27.01 | PluueeR | is it possible that my sources don't have testing? |
| 21:27.56 | Bor_Ed | if it's full debian mirror, it has all 3 current versions |
| 21:29.22 | spacecowboy | howdy all |
| 21:30.53 | weasel | on an ibook, are there different xevents for left and right shift? |
| 21:31.43 | dude | weasel: false |
| 21:32.00 | weasel | ok, then it isn't just me |
| 21:32.06 | weasel | is this ppc or ibook specific? |
| 21:32.20 | PluueeR | the dirs are on the ftp |
| 21:32.33 | PluueeR | testing dirs |
| 21:34.53 | weasel | so, pinball is unplayable on ppc? |
| 21:35.55 | weasel | can anybody please confirm this before I file a bug? |
| 21:36.46 | dude | weasel: on it |
| 21:36.58 | Bor_Ed | here those have keycodes 50 and 62 (.fi KB) |
| 21:37.11 | weasel | in x? |
| 21:37.20 | Bor_Ed | yup |
| 21:37.24 | Bor_Ed | checked on xev |
| 21:37.29 | *** part/#debianppc ebynaq (~roland@c-134-116-93.m.dial.de.ignite.net) |
| 21:37.40 | weasel | hmm I get state 0x1, keycode 50 (keysym 0xffe1, Shift_L), same_screen YES, |
| 21:37.41 | Bor_Ed | tho this is pmac 7200 ... |
| 21:37.43 | weasel | no matter what |
| 21:37.53 | spacecowboy | how is everyone? |
| 21:38.02 | Bor_Ed | spacecowboy: more or less alive :) |
| 21:38.08 | spacecowboy | Bor_Ed: good to know |
| 21:38.11 | spacecowboy | spacecowboy yea |
| 21:38.13 | spacecowboy | wtf |
| 21:38.15 | spacecowboy | weird |
| 21:38.16 | Bor_Ed | hehe |
| 21:38.54 | PluueeR | ok updating to testing, or just fuckin up a couple of days of work :) |
| 21:39.19 | Bor_Ed | hehe |
| 21:39.34 | Bor_Ed | took here couple of days to get woody to sid 100% working :) |
| 21:40.17 | dude | weasel: can't play pinball dreams either :-( |
| 21:41.06 | weasel | ok, thanks |
| 21:45.53 | MrKennie | anyone know it mac os stores screen geometries in the firmware or something? |
| 21:46.02 | MrKennie | s/it/if |
| 21:46.24 | MrKennie | seems I cant shift the screen enough.. and I know my config is correct |
| 21:47.08 | MrKennie | this is my X config btw.. not mac os |
| 21:48.05 | MrKennie | geometry is identical to my console.. in its present state |
| 21:48.18 | MrKennie | which leads me to believe something else needs tweaking |
| 21:52.10 | *** join/#debianppc bighawk (~xyz@a62-216-21-87.adsl.cistron.nl) |
| 21:54.18 | *** join/#debianppc xLobeznox (~xxx@80.224.240.47) |
| 21:54.19 | xLobeznox | hi |
| 21:54.23 | xLobeznox | somebody using sid? |
| 21:54.24 | xLobeznox | :) |
| 21:55.18 | Bor_Ed | sure |
| 21:56.15 | xLobeznox | have you upgraded sid last days? |
| 21:56.26 | xLobeznox | I have dependencies problems with gimp and gimp-data |
| 21:56.34 | xLobeznox | :\ |
| 21:56.34 | Bor_Ed | don't have gimp installed |
| 21:56.43 | xLobeznox | oh |
| 21:56.43 | xLobeznox | ok |
| 22:04.09 | *** join/#debianppc Gnuman_ (~gnuman@c-24-4-62-208.client.comcast.net) |
| 22:04.48 | Gnuman_ | hmmmm. . . |
| 22:04.56 | Gnuman_ | someone is using my nick? |
| 22:05.37 | bighawk | ghost him |
| 22:06.23 | Gnuman_ | Eh? |
| 22:06.36 | Gnuman_ | I don't havi his password. . . |
| 22:06.48 | bighawk | then it's not your nick |
| 22:06.51 | Gnuman_ | and I did not register this nick yet. . |
| 22:07.42 | Gnuman_ | just because I've been using it for the last 5 years means nothing then. |
| 22:08.06 | Gnuman_ | and that I'm 8nown by that nick either, means nothing. |
| 22:35.55 | MrKennie | hmm.. adjusting the screem geomtry under mac os seems to have fixed my problem |
| 22:35.55 | MrKennie | screen* |
| 22:36.29 | MrKennie | could use twisting clockwise slightly.. but hell that will do |
| 22:37.47 | MrKennie | be useful if X hada tool to do all that anyway |
| 22:40.53 | MrKennie | found it by accident :P |
| 22:41.11 | *** join/#debianppc _mechanix (~carlos@200.157.104.59) |
| 22:41.59 | _mechanix | hello guys... |
| 22:42.05 | MrKennie | hi |
| 22:42.41 | _mechanix | there are more people here (just like me) using some oldworld powermac? |
| 22:43.00 | _mechanix | i'm in a cyberjunkie Power Macintosh 8500/150 ';) |
| 22:43.56 | Bor_Ed | I've got 7200/90 here running right now |
| 22:44.21 | _mechanix | kewl....using stable? |
| 22:44.27 | *** join/#debianppc sourdough (eb@ash.penguinppc.org) |
| 22:44.39 | _mechanix | u had any problems with installation or some? |
| 22:45.18 | Bor_Ed | using unstable currently |
| 22:45.36 | _mechanix | hmmmm |
| 22:45.39 | Bor_Ed | installer was picky about floppies and didn't like to play nice with quik install at start |
| 22:46.00 | _mechanix | 7200 is PCI? |
| 22:46.29 | Bor_Ed | yup, the first :) |
| 22:46.55 | _mechanix | i have 2 drives here , one is with yellow dog 3.0, a really cool distro, but is more pointed at rpm and newworld macs |
| 22:47.17 | _mechanix | and in the other i have debian 3.0r0 that i dist-upgraded to 3.0r1 |
| 22:47.37 | Bor_Ed | I dist-upgraded this to unstable some months back |
| 22:48.12 | _mechanix | here in the 8500 i didn't had any problems at all in installing , my problem is that i think stable veeeeeeryyy outdated |
| 22:48.15 | MrKennie | hey sourdough |
| 22:48.43 | Bor_Ed | stable isn't really considered as bleeding edge, that's true |
| 22:49.46 | sourdough | Bor_Ed thats an understatement |
| 22:49.59 | Bor_Ed | umm ? |
| 22:50.24 | sourdough | <Bor_Ed> stable isn't really considered as bleeding edge |
| 22:50.40 | sourdough | if your not using gnome or kde stuff then really its fine |
| 22:50.53 | sourdough | versions for the rest of everything don't matter much, its all mature stuff |
| 22:50.55 | Bor_Ed | true |
| 22:51.08 | sourdough | i use woody |
| 22:51.15 | Bor_Ed | tho I upgraded to sid to get dang xfce4 _finally_ |
| 22:51.17 | sourdough | only gui stuff iuse are gnucash and galeon |
| 22:51.30 | sourdough | and really galeon/mozilla in woody are stable and complete enough not to be an issue |
| 22:51.41 | sourdough | except for debian's refusal to do security updates for them |
| 22:51.55 | sourdough | i snagged the security updates before they deleted them again |
| 22:52.07 | Bor_Ed | hmmm |
| 22:52.23 | sourdough | gnucash in woody is stable and does everything i need, so i don't care that its old |
| 22:53.10 | sourdough | i use windowmaker, which is pretty much the same version as in sid |
| 22:53.14 | Bor_Ed | I didn't manage to get xfce4 to run (cvs and some tarball tries) so I did dist-upgrade to sid and this hasn't been less stable than woody was |
| 22:54.00 | sourdough | debian's slow release process is going to solve itself really, once gnome/kde are stable and mature, not filled with bugs people won't need to be on the latest versions of them so much |
| 22:54.06 | *** join/#debianppc Dizzutch (~jule@h00501811aed7.ne.client2.attbi.com) |
| 22:54.19 | *** join/#debianppc _mechanix (~carlos@200.157.104.86) |
| 22:54.25 | _mechanix | hi , i'm back |
| 22:54.53 | _mechanix | sorry, i'm having some problems in electricity in my neighborhood due too a electrical storm ;// |
| 22:55.39 | _mechanix | Bor_Ed : where we were at? |
| 22:55.59 | _mechanix | Bor_Ed : ahh , i was talking bout my partitioning scheme |
| 22:56.12 | Bor_Ed | umm, I think that outdated packages on stable |
| 22:56.21 | _mechanix | yeah yah |
| 22:56.30 | _mechanix | i really liked so much the debian distro |
| 22:57.01 | _mechanix | yellowdog is cool too, it has fresh packages and its rpm support is neat, using apt-get too.... |
| 22:57.30 | Bor_Ed | umm, try to upgrade to testing or unstable if you want new packages |
| 22:57.36 | _mechanix | but yellowdoglinux is pointed more at making money than growing the number of linux users |
| 22:57.50 | _mechanix | so it is aimed at newworld's.... |
| 22:57.57 | sourdough | yup |
| 22:58.12 | _mechanix | i found that debian is stable enough to me |
| 22:58.21 | sourdough | more stable |
| 22:58.28 | _mechanix | i have installed a USB PCI card on my mac.... |
| 22:58.54 | _mechanix | is a generic via card....got from a pc junkyard near me..... |
| 22:59.11 | sourdough | probably need to reconfigur ethe kernel for it |
| 22:59.20 | _mechanix | linux pci system recognizes it ok..... |
| 22:59.23 | sourdough | ppc kernels alawys use the ohci drivers since thats what all newworld macs have |
| 22:59.29 | sourdough | x86 always uses uhci |
| 22:59.32 | Bor_Ed | time got a nap here ... work in 2 :I |
| 22:59.38 | _mechanix | hmmmmmm |
| 23:04.14 | bighawk | sourdough: i dont think x86 always uses uhci |
| 23:04.29 | sourdough | bighawk maybe not always, but definitly most of the time |
| 23:04.44 | bighawk | only from some vendors |
| 23:04.50 | bighawk | like intel and via |
| 23:05.04 | bighawk | which indeed make most of the mainboards |
| 23:05.15 | sourdough | which means `most of the time' |
| 23:06.06 | bighawk | oki |
| 23:06.31 | sourdough | and since he said its a generic via card, this obviously applies to him, so stop wasting time with the intelectual nitpicking bullshit |
| 23:07.10 | bighawk | what's intellectual about it? |
| 23:07.22 | *** join/#debianppc farruinn (~chatzilla@dialup-67.75.19.121.Dial1.Boston1.Level3.net) |
| 23:08.17 | sourdough | you have this exceedingly obnoxious habit of spending inordinate ammounts of time nitpicking stupid things for apparently no other reason then to try and act like some tenured university pinhead professor |
| 23:09.56 | bighawk | i'm just correcting incorrect information so that people dont get misinformed |
| 23:10.24 | sourdough | then go correct the kernel documentation which tells the same damn thing i said |
| 23:10.36 | sourdough | if you have powerpc you have ohci, otherwise your going to need uhci |
| 23:10.54 | sourdough | the chances of having an x86 with ohci are so close to nil it matters not |
| 23:11.04 | bighawk | oh does it? |
| 23:11.08 | bighawk | no it doesnt |
| 23:11.10 | sourdough | now he will probably spend an hour fiddling thinking maybe it will work, when it won't |
| 23:11.10 | bighawk | sourdough: bull |
| 23:11.19 | bighawk | there are _major_ chip manufacturers who use ohci |
| 23:11.21 | sourdough | i waste no more time with you |
| 23:11.24 | bighawk | like ALI and SiS |
| 23:11.33 | bighawk | do those have a nil marketshare? |
| 23:11.34 | bighawk | i dont think so |
| 23:11.38 | sourdough | your on ignore save your typing |
| 23:12.01 | bighawk | you're reacting extremely hostile to something which was only mentioned to complete you. |
| 23:12.04 | spacecowboy | sourdough chill out |
| 23:12.19 | spacecowboy | sourdough: jesus you always do this... just chill |
| 23:12.41 | sourdough | im sick and fucking tired of his arrogant `im smarter then god' attitude of his |
| 23:12.46 | bighawk | also kernel documentation says the same thing as i said |
| 23:13.14 | bighawk | The USB host controllers on most non-Intel |
| 23:13.14 | bighawk | architectures and on several x86 compatibles with non-Intel chipsets |
| 23:13.14 | bighawk | -- like SiS (aktual 610, 610 and so on) or ALi (ALi IV, ALi V, |
| 23:13.14 | bighawk | Aladdin Pro..) -- conform to this standard. |
| 23:13.25 | bighawk | (about ohci) |
| 23:13.32 | bighawk | non-intel architecture refers to non-intel chipset |
| 23:14.20 | spacecowboy | sourdough: ch ch ch chilll out |
| 23:14.27 | spacecowboy | lets all take our medication |
| 23:14.29 | spacecowboy | and be happy |
| 23:14.31 | spacecowboy | ok |
| 23:14.31 | sourdough | spacecowboy sh sh shut the fuck up |
| 23:14.37 | spacecowboy | sourdough: wow... |
| 23:14.47 | bighawk | he must have had a bad new years eve :( |
| 23:14.51 | *** join/#debianppc kimo_sabe (foobar@ip68-107-131-120.tc.ph.cox.net) |
| 23:15.02 | bighawk | how else is it possible to get such a bad mood on such a beautiful day :( |
| 23:15.18 | sourdough | spacecowboy oh please |
| 23:15.20 | spacecowboy | true |
| 23:15.23 | sourdough | spacecowboy im not going to kick you |
| 23:15.27 | spacecowboy | sourdough lol |
| 23:15.53 | sourdough | spacecowboy just stop being a hippie stoner doofus |
| 23:17.21 | spacecowboy | i'm not a stoner |
| 23:17.24 | spacecowboy | or a hippie |
| 23:17.26 | spacecowboy | or a doofus |
| 23:17.28 | spacecowboy | i'm 15 |
| 23:17.34 | spacecowboy | shit! ... 16 now |
| 23:17.52 | sourdough | and the difference is? |
| 23:20.23 | jcm | speaking of ohci |
| 23:20.38 | jcm | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:20.49 | jcm | and no scsi device answers correctly to dumpe2fs for instance |
| 23:21.16 | jcm | is there a way to address a firewire disk to be able to use dd ? |
| 23:22.49 | sourdough | did you run rescan-scsi.sh or whatever its called |
| 23:23.07 | sourdough | you have to run that now, devices are no longer assigned automatically |
| 23:23.29 | jcm | yes, found this info but didn't found rescan-scsi.sh :( |
| 23:23.37 | sourdough | its in scsi-tools |
| 23:23.49 | sourdough | scsitools rather |
| 23:32.50 | jcm | the package is installed but i have no dir named scsitools |
| 23:33.15 | jcm | and apt-cache show scsitools doesn't show rescan-scsi |
| 23:33.20 | jcm | where should i search ? |
| 23:36.53 | sourdough | jcm its in /sbin/ |
| 23:37.03 | sourdough | jcm this isn't macos |
| 23:37.30 | sourdough | rescan-scsi-bus.sh |
| 23:37.37 | sourdough | as root |
| 23:38.37 | jcm | sorry i don't have this in /sbin |
| 23:38.57 | sourdough | you don't have scsitools installed then |
| 23:39.18 | sourdough | eb@socrates ~$ dlocate -S /sbin/rescan-scsi-bus.sh |
| 23:39.18 | sourdough | scsitools: /sbin/rescan-scsi-bus.sh |
| 23:39.18 | sourdough | eb@socrates ~$ ls -l /sbin/rescan-scsi-bus.sh |
| 23:39.18 | sourdough | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 2675 Feb 11 2002 /sbin/rescan-scsi-bus.sh |
| 23:39.55 | jcm | sorry, i thought i had them, installed |
| 23:41.13 | jcm | my firewire pb subsists though: |
| 23:41.15 | jcm | Host adapter 0 (ide-scsi) found. |
| 23:41.17 | jcm | Host adapter 1 (sbp2_0) found. |
| 23:41.19 | jcm | 0 new device(s) found. |
| 23:41.21 | jcm | 0 device(s) removed. |
| 23:41.36 | sourdough | it may be too damaged |
| 23:42.19 | sourdough | it found the 1394 card, but nothing connected to it |
| 23:43.46 | jcm | would it be better if i could connect this hd to an ide chain ? |
| 23:44.00 | jcm | would dd be able easily to copy from hdb ? |
| 23:44.17 | sourdough | it might |
| 23:44.23 | kimo_sabe | jcm: if the drive isn't hose, sure |
| 23:44.51 | jcm | hose ? |
| 23:45.00 | kimo_sabe | err, hoseD |
| 23:45.03 | sourdough | use dd if=/dev/hdb of=brokendisk bs=512 conv=noerror,sync |
| 23:45.17 | sourdough | that way it will continue even when some blocks can't be read |
| 23:45.34 | sourdough | those irrecoverable blocks would just be blocks of 0 on the image |
| 23:45.48 | bighawk | sourdough: do you still have me on ignore? |
| 23:45.48 | sourdough | better chance of fsck or so being able to recover something that way |
| 23:45.49 | jcm | i need to find a 2.5 to 3.5 adapter then to connect it to a server, my pwb won't be enough |
| 23:46.15 | jcm | it's an osx hfs+ disk, so no hfs :( |
| 23:46.20 | jcm | er, no fsk i mean |
| 23:46.34 | psycow | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:46.36 | sourdough | well there is darwin fsck.hfs, but it sucks |
| 23:46.38 | psycow | meh :c |
| 23:46.53 | jcm | i suppose it's the one used by apple's disk recovery |
| 23:46.59 | sourdough | yup |
| 23:47.07 | jcm | but this didn't solve much |
| 23:47.12 | sourdough | its mostly the same code as OS9's disk first aid |
| 23:47.20 | sourdough | and we know how well that util works |
| 23:47.44 | jcm | strange that apple moved to unix (er, bsd) but still relies on hfs+ fs |
| 23:47.47 | sourdough | what sort of data are you trying to recover? |
| 23:48.01 | jcm | they could have borrowed some better journalized system |
| 23:48.07 | sourdough | jcm bassackwards cruftibility |
| 23:48.24 | sourdough | current ufs with softupdates isn't bad |
| 23:48.28 | jcm | documents: mail, photoshop and other adobe works |
| 23:48.42 | sourdough | even the openstep ufs is better, at least it has decent utils |
| 23:48.46 | jcm | doesn't mol work even without hfs ? |
| 23:49.02 | sourdough | no, mol broke thier stuff to not work with ufs |
| 23:49.19 | jcm | so why does apple need hfs to run classic ? |
| 23:49.28 | jcm | mol needs a nfs volume ? |
| 23:49.32 | sourdough | because classic IS macos |
| 23:49.48 | sourdough | jcm mol uses a disk image or partition, and boots anormal macos install from that |
| 23:50.01 | jcm | no, i think it's like mol, emulating old rom within a unix process |
| 23:50.06 | sourdough | classic is like mol, just hacked so it doesn't run in a window |
| 23:50.28 | sourdough | but classic is still running macos9 |
| 23:50.34 | sourdough | the full macos9 os |
| 23:50.40 | jcm | yes i know this |
| 23:50.40 | sourdough | that means you need an hfs partition |
| 23:51.13 | sourdough | you can still install on ufs and have a macos9 parittion for classic to boot from |
| 23:53.42 | mojo | sourdough is there anyway besides serial term to get my mac to boot up on a os9 cd? |
| 23:54.17 | jcm | openfirmware ? |
| 23:54.52 | mojo | im not 100% sure what openfirmware is on a mac |
| 23:55.49 | jcm | the minimal script system you can use to change boot params |
| 23:58.19 | mojo | ok, as far as im aware i cant access it |
| 23:58.29 | mojo | my mac is older than dir |
| 23:58.29 | mojo | t |
| 23:58.36 | jcm | what model ? |
| 23:58.54 | sourdough | mojo reset the nvram, and it will go back to booting the macosrom |
| 23:59.38 | mojo | ok whats the keys for that again? |
| 23:59.48 | sourdough | cmd opt p r |