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| 00:44.07 | Curalton | and i still have the stupid problem that X is not responding to keyinput on first start :/ |
| 00:44.15 | Curalton | i think ill also use Xorg from ubunto |
| 00:47.40 | shingouz | got myself my first apple the other day and figured a real o/s would be nice but the Powerbook Wallstreet does seem to need even Mac OS 8.5 to install debian onto it. of course i do not have the Mac cd anywhere here and even less of a clue of where to find one. cd image anyone? ;) |
| 00:47.44 | shingouz | ...or.. |
| 00:48.46 | shingouz | would it be possible to install debian onto the fresh drive on an intel box somehow or maybe booting over the network with some bootp magic? maybe a "bootdisk" on a flashcard in the pcmcia slots? |
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| 01:05.14 | Curalton | does it have open firmware? |
| 01:05.49 | shingouz | Curalton: nope as far as i know. i believe the thing to be an oldworld |
| 01:05.49 | Curalton | hmm, probably not :S |
| 01:08.15 | shingouz | luckily i do not need the thing really, i already have a bunch of laptops and other computers here running debian, would just be nice to play with an apple for a change. even if the thing sits here for some time it does not hurt too bad, i never had to pay anything for it ;) |
| 01:09.16 | Curalton | well, no idea about oldworld booting or so. yet iirc os 7 is free for dl if that helps |
| 01:10.47 | shingouz | yea, i know about the 7 but i am not too sure if it can even boot on the powerbook. there is also a problem of the laptop not having anything else that looks even remotely bootable than the network, pcmcia and cd. no floppies whatsoever on the gizmo |
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| 01:33.04 | Curalton | fuck, it's NOT X.org or was Xfree. still cant use my KB |
| 01:35.10 | Curalton | ah, wth is it starting on tty2 |
| 01:35.17 | Curalton | i have a getty there :S |
| 01:35.18 | Curalton | no wonder |
| 02:07.03 | shingouz | we will see if Darwin helps me get Debian on the wallstreet. downloading a couple of older versions that supposedly boot on the wallstreet, i think i will have to start looking for a poweradapter for the laptop and fixx0r the hinges |
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| 02:10.48 | Curalton | sounds fun :S |
| 02:12.41 | Curalton | heh, anyhow nn |
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| 03:22.05 | fluffy_wolf | anyone have any use for the domains hugsnet.com, hugsnet.net, or hugsnet.org? |
| 03:23.49 | fluffy_wolf | they're about to expire, and I'm not planning on renewing them, so I want to see if anyone I know wants a shot at them first. :) |
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| 04:24.59 | simonrvn | nah |
| 04:25.16 | fluffy_wolf | 3 days until I no longer own them... |
| 04:39.29 | myXtie | how about bitinglarrykeeper.net ? ( sorry bad joke ) Think of it as in futbol (soccer ) we need a new goal keeper. |
| 04:49.28 | myXtie | err bitkeeper larry ....not sports larry...simonrvn it was just a matter of time |
| 04:49.46 | myXtie | remember a few weeks ago I said they were switching trees like code monkeys |
| 04:50.01 | myXtie | well I knew they were having bk problems then |
| 04:50.34 | myXtie | took a month to admit it though |
| 04:52.39 | fluffy_wolf | heh |
| 04:52.57 | fluffy_wolf | it's open source, no? why doesn't someone else just take over maintaining it? |
| 04:53.31 | p8m | bk is a non-free, commercial product. |
| 04:53.45 | fluffy_wolf | you get the source to it, no? |
| 04:54.07 | p8m | In fact, part of Larry's change of heart was caused by a OSDL devel reverse engineering it's protocol |
| 04:54.31 | fluffy_wolf | hrmm, I always thought the source was available. |
| 04:54.36 | p8m | fluffy: Not as far as I know |
| 04:55.06 | fluffy_wolf | I wonder is mcvoy quite realizes how bad PR this move is for his company? |
| 04:55.21 | myXtie | I have always used cvs -z9 { } for speedy versoning since I came from BSD before linux with the -z9 you got all the speed you need |
| 04:55.54 | myXtie | I have been in *nix since 1982 |
| 04:56.40 | fluffy_wolf | is the reverse-engineered version usable, or just a specification? |
| 04:58.51 | fluffy_wolf | oh well. hopefully someone will hack together an equivelent program before the kernel falls apart. :) |
| 05:00.19 | p8m | He'll probably switch to monotone or arch. Because they are both decentralized like bk. |
| 05:00.34 | fluffy_wolf | I don't know much about bk... not a kernel hacker. |
| 05:01.26 | fluffy_wolf | only kernel hacking I've done was adding another possibilty to the rom contents check on a bad ne1000 clone to make the module recognize it has a ne1000 card... |
| 05:01.48 | fluffy_wolf | on a 486. :) |
| 05:02.08 | p8m | heh |
| 05:02.52 | fluffy_wolf | rather than having whatever standard byte pattern it was supposed to have, the card instead had its name in ASCII there. |
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| 05:04.51 | lnxduk | powerbook 1400c 333mhz 64meg ram |
| 05:04.58 | lnxduk | 1gig harddrive |
| 05:05.01 | lnxduk | will it work? |
| 05:06.41 | p8m | Check out the install guide: http://www.debian.org/releases/woody/powerpc/ch-hardware-req.en.html#s-hardware-supported |
| 05:07.10 | simonrvn | wiki.kisikew.org/bin/view/Know/MacModels |
| 05:08.01 | fluffy_wolf | blah. I think I'm getting sick. :( |
| 05:08.16 | simonrvn | :/ |
| 05:08.30 | p8m | I've got a cold. :( |
| 05:08.35 | lnxduk | fsck |
| 05:08.36 | lnxduk | damn it |
| 05:08.43 | lnxduk | I am in the list debian does not support |
| 05:08.52 | lnxduk | nubus |
| 05:08.57 | fluffy_wolf | lnxduk: sell it on ebay and buy something else |
| 05:09.08 | lnxduk | I would get shit for it |
| 05:09.17 | lnxduk | like $50 |
| 05:09.19 | lnxduk | no one wants it |
| 05:09.34 | myXtie | hey there are nubus kernels in unstable now ;) |
| 05:09.38 | lnxduk | it's a reasonably good laptop.. |
| 05:09.45 | lnxduk | but it had the g3 upgrade |
| 05:09.50 | lnxduk | so I think maybe it could do it? |
| 05:11.56 | simonrvn | yeh. with sid. |
| 05:12.10 | lnxduk | eh? |
| 05:12.14 | simonrvn | nubus-pmac.sf.net |
| 05:13.21 | lnxduk | pcmcia won't work? |
| 05:13.33 | lnxduk | that kind of sucks |
| 05:13.42 | lnxduk | because there will be no way to transfer files from it |
| 05:13.45 | simonrvn | i don,t know. go see the sf site |
| 05:13.47 | lnxduk | it can read with the cddrive |
| 05:13.54 | myXtie | thanks simon I was looking for that..your laptop is listed.. I run a nubus 601 ppc on woody and it runs fine without xwindows |
| 05:14.01 | lnxduk | maybe a non-debian distro would support it better? |
| 05:14.11 | lnxduk | without xwindows? |
| 05:14.16 | simonrvn | no. debian you have the best chances |
| 05:14.26 | lnxduk | heh |
| 05:14.27 | myXtie | nah they other distros are too heavy |
| 05:14.30 | lnxduk | god freaking damn |
| 05:14.33 | lnxduk | hehe |
| 05:14.41 | lnxduk | maybe gentoo |
| 05:14.45 | simonrvn | it will support it, but it's a) non-official b) a lot of work |
| 05:14.49 | lnxduk | but not enough harddrive |
| 05:15.00 | simonrvn | gentoo will be worse |
| 05:15.08 | lnxduk | I did gentoo on a sparc |
| 05:15.21 | simonrvn | i wouldn't want to build glibc on an oldworld box |
| 05:15.23 | lnxduk | hmm.. do you think netbsd would support it better? |
| 05:15.29 | simonrvn | possibly |
| 05:15.37 | lnxduk | ok, I may have to go that route |
| 05:15.41 | p8m | nah, netbsd needs openbios |
| 05:15.52 | simonrvn | what |
| 05:15.56 | lnxduk | what is that? |
| 05:16.02 | simonrvn | oh. OF |
| 05:16.06 | p8m | err, openfirmware |
| 05:16.09 | p8m | heh |
| 05:16.10 | simonrvn | openbios is for x86 dude |
| 05:16.18 | myXtie | xwindows will run on your nubus it is just slow on an older mac |
| 05:16.20 | lnxduk | so I don't have openfirmware |
| 05:16.29 | lnxduk | why would it be so slow? |
| 05:16.33 | lnxduk | it's 333mhz! |
| 05:16.36 | lnxduk | that is freaking fast |
| 05:16.48 | lnxduk | compared to my 50mhz server |
| 05:16.52 | simonrvn | ...but good point nonetheless |
| 05:17.02 | myXtie | what are you looking for better video drivers ? |
| 05:17.10 | fluffy_wolf | ok, that does it. |
| 05:17.15 | fluffy_wolf | I am no longer a directv installed. |
| 05:17.19 | fluffy_wolf | my boss can go fuck himself |
| 05:17.24 | fluffy_wolf | s/installed/installer |
| 05:17.25 | lnxduk | hehe |
| 05:17.36 | lnxduk | I just want to install linux and get something working |
| 05:17.39 | lnxduk | it's 800x600 |
| 05:17.43 | lnxduk | it's the best laptop I own |
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| 05:18.33 | p8m | Get an iBook, mine runs debian great. :P |
| 05:18.52 | myXtie | well get http://nubus-pmac.sourceforge.net/ or look into unstable ( not sure how woody to unstable with transpire on my nubus ) |
| 05:18.56 | lnxduk | can I trade this one in for an ibook? |
| 05:19.13 | lnxduk | because I have no money |
| 05:19.40 | lnxduk | I am beginning to realize why I got this thing for free |
| 05:20.31 | fluffy_wolf | he wants to send me out to chilcoot. mapquest estimates 7 and a half hours, and from my experience with this root, it's a good hour longer than that. for four jobs, totalling $375. $100 in gas makes that $275. 2 nights at a hotel, another $100. makes that $175. figure $60 parts makes that $115. car maintence, food, random small things, etc, makes that about $50. I am not driving for >20 hours and doing 4 installs for $50. |
| 05:21.20 | lnxduk | yeah |
| 05:21.21 | lnxduk | that is dumb |
| 05:21.29 | lnxduk | what about gas? |
| 05:21.39 | lnxduk | oh nevermind, you covered that |
| 05:21.47 | lnxduk | ask if you can use a company car |
| 05:21.53 | lnxduk | then it might be worth it |
| 05:22.14 | myXtie | people want you to work for free tell them to go to best buy ;) |
| 05:22.21 | myXtie | lukduk you sound like me I just got a sparc station 5 for free and it too is runing without xwindows ( can't handle it ) |
| 05:22.28 | fluffy_wolf | there is no company car. |
| 05:22.47 | fluffy_wolf | myXtie: I have a 170mhz sparcstation 5... haven't tried linux on it though. |
| 05:23.16 | myXtie | now I have 3 computers one on unstable one testing and one stable |
| 05:23.32 | fluffy_wolf | I run all mine with testing... use them too much to use unstable. |
| 05:23.35 | myXtie | mine is a 110mz sparc station 5 |
| 05:23.55 | myXtie | yours will have problems from what I have read |
| 05:24.05 | myXtie | it is unique |
| 05:24.15 | myXtie | your 170 mhz machine |
| 05:24.42 | fluffy_wolf | yep |
| 05:24.48 | fluffy_wolf | why I haven't tried linux yet. |
| 05:26.09 | myXtie | serial ports communicate at 38400 bps too, if you set them to higher the devices will not communicate properly |
| 05:26.30 | fluffy_wolf | heh |
| 05:27.00 | fluffy_wolf | I got an offer of a free rs/6000 box, but it couldn't run linux. |
| 05:27.05 | lnxduk | myXtie: someone ran solaris in graphical mode on this same computer |
| 05:27.09 | lnxduk | it's a sparc classic |
| 05:27.11 | lnxduk | 50mhz |
| 05:27.22 | lnxduk | although theirs had better statistics.. like 96ram |
| 05:27.24 | lnxduk | mine has 24 |
| 05:27.33 | lnxduk | anyway, mine is going to be a server |
| 05:27.40 | lnxduk | I'm putting it on the wireless network at my school |
| 05:27.55 | fluffy_wolf | 8 x 200mhz cpus, 4gb ram... but I had to pay $200 to ship it here... and it couldn't run linux. not worth $200 to get stuck with aix. |
| 05:28.05 | lnxduk | I suppose it would be appropriate for me to go bother people in #gentoo-ppc now? |
| 05:28.18 | lnxduk | aix haha |
| 05:28.25 | lnxduk | but still 8x200mhz is cool |
| 05:28.32 | lnxduk | what else will run on it? |
| 05:28.35 | fluffy_wolf | nothing |
| 05:28.39 | fluffy_wolf | no netbsd even |
| 05:28.39 | lnxduk | netbsd? |
| 05:28.42 | lnxduk | damn |
| 05:28.55 | lnxduk | what kind of processors? |
| 05:29.00 | lnxduk | hp or whatever? |
| 05:29.04 | lnxduk | I forget what aix is for |
| 05:29.04 | fluffy_wolf | some power variety. don't remember which. |
| 05:29.12 | fluffy_wolf | ibm |
| 05:29.15 | lnxduk | ok |
| 05:29.22 | lnxduk | well that is useless |
| 05:29.25 | lnxduk | so do you have it? |
| 05:29.40 | fluffy_wolf | problem was it used a non-standard MCA bus. not only does linux not support mca, it REALLY doesn't support their version of mca. |
| 05:29.42 | fluffy_wolf | nope |
| 05:29.53 | fluffy_wolf | wasn't going to pay $200 for it |
| 05:30.06 | fluffy_wolf | brb |
| 05:30.08 | lnxduk | why is shipping that much? |
| 05:30.11 | lnxduk | I can see like $80 |
| 05:30.18 | lnxduk | but $200?? |
| 05:33.28 | myXtie | lnxduk what the open source community needs to push for is better driver support from the manufacturers |
| 05:33.48 | lnxduk | what are they supposed to do? |
| 05:33.55 | lnxduk | beg? |
| 05:34.01 | myXtie | like you said someone ran sun os with gui and it was fast |
| 05:34.08 | lnxduk | I don't know about fast |
| 05:34.09 | myXtie | on your sparc classic |
| 05:34.12 | lnxduk | I didn't say that did I? |
| 05:34.17 | lnxduk | I thought they were dumb |
| 05:34.18 | p8m | myXtie: absolutely, esp 3d-acceleration |
| 05:34.26 | lnxduk | but he ran like apache with java or something too |
| 05:34.30 | lnxduk | on 50mhz |
| 05:34.42 | lnxduk | it's pretty damn slow honestly |
| 05:34.51 | lnxduk | it took 20 minutes to generate the dsa key for ssh |
| 05:35.51 | myXtie | well make be not fast lnxduk but it is better to have the drivers that are made for the machine or have open documentation to video cards etc... |
| 05:36.17 | myXtie | sure my sparc to 20 mins too for keys too |
| 05:36.46 | lnxduk | yeah |
| 05:36.52 | lnxduk | well I am running openbsd on it |
| 05:36.55 | lnxduk | and it works great |
| 05:38.38 | myXtie | just think if it did not have a risc processor how slow it would be lnxduk |
| 05:38.59 | fluffy_wolf | it weighed over 150lbs, and had to be shipped from new york to california, plus crating costs. |
| 05:39.33 | myXtie | I put openbsd on mine and thought of building from source ( i build on a 7400 ppc from source ) |
| 05:39.34 | lnxduk | I have a 366 x86 that is fast |
| 05:40.00 | myXtie | but after it took too long I wiped the drive and put debian on it |
| 05:40.29 | myXtie | the linux kernel takes a full day to build on the sparc |
| 05:41.04 | fluffy_wolf | I remember a kernel compile taking somewhere between 4 and 6 hours on my old 486... |
| 05:48.27 | myXtie | is the g-5 really a better design than the g-4 (74XX) it is my understanding that motorola was using mips code and that cycle was only 7 stages where IBM's powerpc was diff with more stages of add, multiply and divide. |
| 05:48.52 | myXtie | I don't miss any X86 fluffy_wolf |
| 05:49.49 | simonrvn | afaik it's 4. but i could be wrong |
| 05:50.31 | myXtie | ah thanks the 74XX uses 4 ? |
| 05:53.09 | simonrvn | iirc. but like i said i could be wrong |
| 05:53.14 | myXtie | well soon only X86 and powerpc will be around with sgi taking mips off the market for computer consumers and DEC Alpha will be gone this year according to HP who now owns the rights to the chip |
| 05:53.52 | myXtie | and motorola well we all know they were spun off too |
| 05:55.01 | myXtie | I think the FSF show be concerned about that too as when they have a monoply things could get expensive |
| 05:55.07 | myXtie | should* |
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| 06:31.45 | myXtie | I am off to dream of open prom with gpl flash bios and hardware that says give me debian :) |
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| 09:58.55 | lioda | Hi |
| 09:59.16 | lioda | try to find some experiences with a Powerbook G4 1.67GHz under sid |
| 09:59.20 | sloopy | hi |
| 10:00.57 | johill | lioda: hi. I am typing on one right now. |
| 10:02.55 | johill | I'd like to have lunch now, you can read about my experience on http://johannes.sipsolutions.net/PowerBook and ask me things when I get back from lunch. |
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| 11:14.53 | johill | back. |
| 11:18.08 | simonrvn | lioda left... |
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| 11:22.04 | johill | oh well. |
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| 12:25.35 | Curalton | what power source do ibooks use to keep the mainboard clock running? |
| 12:26.28 | Curalton | i had a 1970 reset after taking out the battery |
| 12:27.15 | pahartik | Curalton: there is no power source besides battery and external PSU |
| 12:27.20 | demon | the system battery powers the clock... there's a small separate battery that's dedicated to powering the (X)PRAM |
| 12:27.43 | demon | but it's very small |
| 12:27.50 | Curalton | heh, your two comments were contradicting now :) |
| 12:28.19 | pahartik | Curalton: if you want to be sure, keep PSU connected when playing with battery |
| 12:28.29 | Curalton | i'll take the scientific aproach and do a hwclock --systohc and restart plus pull out the powerchord |
| 12:29.28 | Curalton | actually i want to spare the battery the heatstress when playing with the system so i'm totally going without it |
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| 12:30.18 | pahartik | Curalton: you can "hotplug" battery |
| 12:30.32 | Curalton | i was looking for nearly-spent ibook batteries but they seem nowhere to be found |
| 12:32.03 | Curalton | pahartik: i know i can swap it yet i don't want to use it while i dont need it since i am stationary anyhow. |
| 12:35.01 | Curalton | hm, now the clock stayed up to date. maybe a shutdownscript just forgot to set the hwclock :S |
| 12:35.06 | pahartik | Curalton: i only have experience on iBook G4, so other iBooks might keep settings even when running out of battery |
| 12:36.42 | pahartik | Curalton: once i forgot to connect PSU when going to sleep... damn that |
| 12:38.25 | Curalton | maybe a small capacitator keeps the current for a bit, i only had it completely off for a few seconds, i'll know more tomorrow |
| 12:38.53 | Curalton | also because of that i'll now set up swsuspend |
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| 13:09.05 | Curalton | i'll see tomorrow how G3s are :) |
| 13:09.48 | Curalton | and suspend2 doesnt even "make oldconfig" .. *sigh* |
| 13:14.53 | Curalton | ah, swsusp2 does NOT work on ppc yet, figures |
| 13:15.16 | Curalton | leaving PM_DISK stuff |
| 13:16.17 | johill | Curalton: yeah, I ran into that too. been in contact with Nigel but nothing so far |
| 13:16.27 | johill | I need suspend2 because I want to suspend to encrypted swap ;) |
| 13:17.10 | Curalton | ah, im not even there yet |
| 13:17.23 | Curalton | atm i think ill just unmount my loop-aes partitions and kill the encrypted swap |
| 13:17.35 | Curalton | i.e. just have a "fastboot" option |
| 13:18.24 | johill | heh. if you manage to get it to work let me know, I haven't tested suspend at all yet |
| 13:18.49 | Curalton | maybe i can put a a subfs over my home so i can unmount it with apps still using it... |
| 13:19.09 | Curalton | i read reports that PM_DISK is actually working, ill go and compile now :) |
| 13:23.33 | Curalton | meh, cant find CONFIG_PM in my .config atm |
| 13:31.25 | Curalton | there, but no DISK option, seems i have a config that conflicts with it |
| 13:35.18 | Belxjander | hrmmm |
| 13:35.39 | Belxjander | well I am just hoping to get a 2.6.11.5 kernel running on a 604 @ 150MHz PowerMac S900 clone machine |
| 13:39.27 | pahartik | Belxjander: i have built Linux 2.6.11.6 for PowerPC 7400 and Alpha... not tried booting it yet but i expect no new problems |
| 13:40.05 | Belxjander | pahartik: on an old PowerMac that will need wipe+re-install if it breaks ? |
| 13:40.59 | Belxjander | darned thing only has 80MB's of memory, 1GB of HDD space and a PPC604 @ 150MHz to work with |
| 13:46.01 | pahartik | Belxjander: eventually i am going to build Linux 2.6.11.6 (or later) for two PowerPC 604e and one PowerPC 603e workstation |
| 13:46.50 | Belxjander | pahartik: well if you want I might be able to organize sending the powermac here somewhere if it screws up again Im selling it... no more fussing with it |
| 13:50.30 | pahartik | Belxjander: those three are running and stable... |
| 13:55.01 | Belxjander | "three" ??? |
| 13:55.10 | Belxjander | never mind... |
| 13:57.15 | pahartik | Belxjander: "three" as in "PowerPC 604e, PowerPC 604e, PowerPC 603e" |
| 14:00.29 | pahartik | Belxjander: one is stuck with Linux 2.4 because Advansys SCSI driver is broken in Linux 2.6 and i am not sure if new DVB drivers work now... difficult to test without harddisks (it is my DVB server) |
| 14:01.06 | Belxjander | ouch |
| 14:01.14 | Belxjander | well I am hoping I can get the 604 here usable... |
| 14:01.23 | Belxjander | dammed thing has a 2nd CPU slot as well |
| 14:01.34 | Belxjander | I won't bother upgrading/changing the box any further... |
| 14:01.46 | Belxjander | I'll just get whats working in it workable and go from thre |
| 14:02.48 | pahartik | Belxjander: does it have many PCI slots? |
| 14:03.04 | Belxjander | yup... 2xCPU + 6xPCI slots |
| 14:03.49 | pahartik | Belxjander: i would like to have that many PCI slots... :) |
| 14:04.08 | jaska | heh |
| 14:04.22 | Belxjander | pahartik: where are you and are you interested in buying the box ? |
| 14:04.23 | jaska | one of my boxen has 14 slots :) |
| 14:04.34 | Belxjander | I want to keep the PCI cards I have in it but the box itself I don't really care... |
| 14:04.43 | Belxjander | I wanted something else and ended up given it anyway |
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| 14:06.00 | pahartik | Belxjander: one for SCSI, one for ethernet, two (or three) for DVB tuners, one for IEEE-1394... still might have one free |
| 14:06.31 | Belxjander | pahartik: nope... that'd be the box as-is full... |
| 14:06.41 | Belxjander | and you would still be able to stick 2x604 into it as well |
| 14:06.51 | Belxjander | the CPUcards aren't "inline" to anything |
| 14:07.00 | Belxjander | as for "Ethernet" thats a built-in... so ignore that function... |
| 14:07.07 | Belxjander | 2xSCSI built-in on mainboard as well |
| 14:07.19 | Belxjander | unless you need 3xSCSI chains for the 3xDVBs ? |
| 14:08.01 | Belxjander | pahartik: go onto everymac.com and lookup UMAX Pulsar units... the "S900" base unit... |
| 14:08.05 | Belxjander | casework/mobo... |
| 14:08.20 | Belxjander | it'd be a clean send... with single CPUcard and no PCI cards or drives though... |
| 14:08.42 | Belxjander | I had to build it upto "blank slate" with parts from other places as well |
| 14:09.00 | Belxjander | got lucky in one of the gfxcards I got 2nd hand seperately is an OF chipped board |
| 14:09.13 | pahartik | Belxjander: that on-board SCSI is good enough for root filesystem but i would prefer to have data on faster SCSI bus |
| 14:09.28 | Belxjander | ahhh okay... well there is 2x mobo SCSI |
| 14:09.36 | Belxjander | 1x MESH controller and 1x other controller |
| 14:09.46 | Belxjander | some 53C94 or something chip |
| 14:10.11 | Belxjander | I only use the MESH controller SCSI atm for the CD-drive and HDD I added to it... |
| 14:11.31 | Belxjander | it has 1x Audio output, 2x ADB ports + SCSI external D25 connectors... then a small breakout card that is it's own seperate slot above the PCI for 2x RS-488 serial / 1xEthernet and some small weird port... |
| 14:11.40 | Belxjander | the weird port I don't know what the hell it is... |
| 14:11.53 | Belxjander | small thin and looks like an UW-SCSI for the clips each side |
| 14:12.35 | pahartik | Belxjander: it is ethernet, AAUI |
| 14:14.05 | Belxjander | I thought that was a MIDI D15 style connector as I have had a card with one of those... |
| 14:14.17 | Belxjander | this is smaller thinner and looks like a slot for a newstyle memory card |
| 14:14.17 | *** join/#debianppc abbas (abbas@cable-195-162-222-30.upc.chello.be) |
| 14:15.25 | abbas | i will install on my imac g4 debian sarge and macos how must i do ? |
| 14:15.57 | pahartik | abbas: you have to configure it well |
| 14:16.18 | Belxjander | abbas: recommended to install "Mac OS" first... then setup the Debian using a CD... |
| 14:16.18 | jaska | http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/generic/60f5/ |
| 14:16.21 | jaska | gah |
| 14:16.24 | jaska | wrong net |
| 14:16.27 | jaska | sorry. |
| 14:16.50 | abbas | it use for bootlader yaboot or lilo ?? |
| 14:17.27 | pahartik | abbas: "lilo" is strictly wintel-specific |
| 14:18.29 | Belxjander | abbas: yaboot for newstyle powermacs... |
| 14:18.34 | abbas | after install yaboot does reconise in bootloader the mac os and debian or must i configure it ? thanls |
| 14:19.57 | abbas | is there a how to for it thanks ? |
| 14:21.35 | Belxjander | abbas: check out "The Linux Documentation Project"... they have HOWTO's and other documentation |
| 14:21.51 | abbas | thanks |
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| 14:26.11 | abbas | bye |
| 14:34.55 | Curalton | what is the plain swsuspend (not suspend2) option in the kernel and what does it depend on? |
| 14:35.11 | Curalton | i hear that this works quite well currently |
| 14:35.23 | Curalton | yet it doesn't apear in my .11.6 config |
| 14:41.08 | johill | I don't think it depends on anything |
| 14:45.17 | Curalton | just can't find the option :S |
| 14:45.17 | johill | um. apparently it isn't linked into the config at all |
| 14:46.23 | Curalton | "linked"? |
| 14:46.44 | johill | well, in the Kconfig system |
| 14:47.38 | johill | http://channels.debian.net/paste/6 |
| 14:47.41 | Curalton | ah, you grepped all Kconfigfiles? |
| 14:48.05 | johill | yeah ;) |
| 14:48.19 | johill | I know it lives in kernel/power/Kconfig |
| 14:48.43 | johill | but it isn't included by any other config. the patch makes it go into the top level config which is ugly but works ;) |
| 14:51.33 | Curalton | johill: yay! |
| 14:53.00 | johill | :) |
| 14:53.40 | Curalton | ah, just swsuspend, no PM_DISK |
| 14:54.59 | johill | hm |
| 14:55.18 | johill | weren't those two merged again? |
| 14:55.37 | Curalton | possible, seems swsusp is the better working one anyhow atm |
| 14:56.48 | Curalton | johill: eeeh, there was a reason this was commented out :/ |
| 14:56.56 | Curalton | johill: kernel doesnt compile with it |
| 14:56.57 | johill | heh |
| 14:57.01 | johill | wait that can't be |
| 14:57.19 | johill | $ zcat /proc/config.gz |grep PM= |
| 14:57.19 | johill | CONFIG_PM=y |
| 14:57.28 | johill | oh PM not swsusp, sorry |
| 14:57.29 | Curalton | _PM is here too |
| 14:57.54 | Curalton | damn x86 centric devs |
| 14:58.13 | johill | wasn't this supposed to work? don't they keep discussing this on the debian-ppc mailing list? |
| 14:58.26 | Curalton | seems it broke again in .11.6 |
| 14:58.28 | johill | maybe only with 2.6.12-rc2 or whatever |
| 15:02.12 | Curalton | well, then i can just as well stick to my 2.6.8.1 |
| 15:02.35 | jaska | ugh, nfs seems to be rather borked in 2.6.x x>8 |
| 15:02.48 | Curalton | just .8 is borked |
| 15:02.53 | Curalton | thats why .8.1 was released |
| 15:03.01 | jaska | well, by x = 8 i mean 8.1 |
| 15:03.07 | Curalton | ow |
| 15:03.28 | jaska | when i use tcp+nfsv3, it floods the lan with null nfs requests |
| 15:03.50 | jaska | with udp, rsize=8192,wsize=8192 i get like 2.4kB/s thruput, when i drop it to 1024, i get 115k/s |
| 15:03.54 | jaska | kB/s |
| 15:03.57 | jaska | fun. |
| 15:04.17 | jaska | client seems to pause ~5s between requests :) |
| 15:04.26 | jaska | and other mystic stuff |
| 15:04.36 | jaska | sad thing is, i depend on nfs at work |
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| 15:37.52 | pahartik | jaska: "pbbuttonsd" finally crashed at wakeup, so i got to test Linux 2.6.11.6 |
| 15:39.20 | jaska | ah |
| 15:40.16 | pahartik | jaska: got nice 10 days of uptime |
| 15:47.43 | dj-death | max is 5 days with my ibookg4 |
| 15:49.23 | Curalton | does one of the -mm or so kernels have swsuspend re-enabled again? |
| 16:03.59 | Curalton | btw what is the "stable" release now of 2.6, the .11 etc. or .12 etc. ones? |
| 16:04.30 | Curalton | or is the 3rd digit irrelevant and they will put .1 .2 .3 onto every revision |
| 16:05.52 | johill | they'll put out 2.6.12 and then you use that until they fix a few bugs in 2.6.12.1 |
| 16:06.07 | johill | or you stick with 2.6.11.6 but that will not be maintained beyond 2.6.12 |
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| 16:14.41 | Curalton | so no diff betweeen .<even> and .<odd> |
| 16:14.54 | Curalton | and in .11<all fixes> becomes .12.<nothing here ever> |
| 16:15.57 | johill | why yes, maybe 2.6.12.1 will come some time |
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| 16:23.33 | iron_angel | How much does anyone here know about installing Debian on an RS/6000? |
| 16:24.09 | iron_angel | It's actually one of 2(.5) PPC machines I want to put Debian on, but the hardest to actually do it on |
| 16:24.50 | iron_angel | It's a 43p-140, with a video card not supported by X |
| 16:26.33 | iron_angel | GXT800, I think. Though I have a Radeon Mac Edition that I could put in if that helps matters at all |
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| 16:51.43 | abbas | does anyone give me a sample sourceslist ? |
| 16:51.54 | Q-FUNK | ? |
| 16:52.03 | abbas | i'am just install debian |
| 16:52.35 | abbas | i thing my sources list is not correct for install all plugins dvd flash .... |
| 16:56.08 | abbas | ? |
| 17:00.39 | demon | there is no flash plugin for ppc linux |
| 17:01.11 | abbas | ok |
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| 17:41.03 | fluffy_wolf | demon: gplflash doesn't work? |
| 17:41.27 | fluffy_wolf | as in, I know it doesn't work worth crap on x86, but I think it should at least be the same level of crappyness on ppc. :) |
| 17:44.54 | Curalton | nicely put :) |
| 17:50.31 | fluffy_wolf | lol |
| 17:50.48 | fluffy_wolf | the _only_ files I've ever gotten it to display are banner ads. |
| 17:50.52 | fluffy_wolf | NOTHING else. |
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| 17:51.28 | AlverGone | Hello. |
| 17:52.59 | AlverGone | I'm getting a G3/500 imac this saturday, and I'd want it to dualboot debian and OSX. I'll have to install debian first though, OSX afterwards. Is there anything I have to keep in mind? Windows eg. has a nasty habit of screwing up the settings of any previously installed OS, and I don't know about OSX. |
| 17:53.27 | *** join/#debianppc DarkNoise (~DarkNoise@203-166-251-101.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 17:53.38 | bioterror | install first OS X on with two partitions |
| 17:53.40 | bioterror | and then Debian |
| 17:53.56 | bioterror | I would do it like that |
| 17:53.59 | demon | fluffy_wolf: I've tried it... it breaks pretty badly on most SWFs |
| 17:54.05 | AlverGone | bioterror: I won't be able to do that - otherwise I'd have done it that way too :/ |
| 17:54.26 | bioterror | hmmm |
| 17:54.35 | AlverGone | on x86 one would just boot some rescue floppy and rerun lilo, but ppc is totally new for me. :) |
| 17:55.42 | demon | why can't you? |
| 17:55.58 | bioterror | in OS X there's a boot menu |
| 17:56.13 | AlverGone | because I can't get my hands on OSX cd's any sooner than a few weeks |
| 17:56.48 | demon | bioterror: you mean the Startup Disk prefs panel? |
| 17:57.01 | demon | that won't see a yaboot bootstrap partition |
| 17:57.15 | demon | but on a machine that recent, there's always Option booting |
| 17:57.22 | AlverGone | if it's really that much of a pain to get a dualboot with OSX installed afterwards, I might just drop the osx idea completely |
| 17:57.27 | AlverGone | But I'm kinda curious about it |
| 17:57.48 | demon | it's not that difficult, really... |
| 17:57.49 | bioterror | I have OS X machine and now I'm going to buy G3 machine just for *NIX |
| 18:00.24 | AlverGone | demon: well, I'll probably be lurking in here the week to come anyway, I'll check on it again when I actually can install osx. :) |
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| 18:34.13 | Belxjander | does anyone here know whether "U-Boot" would be functional for an "OldWorld" PowerMac S900 clone machine ? |
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| 18:53.30 | netbrain | anyone here with an ibook? |
| 18:53.43 | pahartik | netbrain: oh yes |
| 18:54.00 | netbrain | you using pbuttonsd? |
| 18:55.09 | pahartik | netbrain: yes |
| 18:55.38 | netbrain | how do you make it work? |
| 18:55.53 | netbrain | i mean, when i press my buttons nothing happens |
| 18:56.31 | pahartik | netbrain: with or without <fn>? |
| 18:56.51 | netbrain | both |
| 18:57.48 | pahartik | netbrain: configure with "powerprefs"? |
| 18:58.11 | netbrain | i havent done anything.. |
| 18:58.26 | netbrain | just installed.. and i expected it to work right away :D |
| 18:58.37 | netbrain | still have a bit of windows in me :D |
| 19:00.51 | iron_angel | Anyone here ever installed Debian on either an RS/6000 43p-100 or a PowerMac 8600? |
| 19:01.55 | netbrain | pahartik: if you dont mind me asking: what are you using for secondary mouse button? |
| 19:03.05 | pahartik | netbrain: <F11> and <F12> for second and third mouse button |
| 19:04.15 | netbrain | when exactly is third mouse button used? |
| 19:04.32 | fluffy_wolf | pasting |
| 19:04.43 | netbrain | right.. remember now.. |
| 19:05.21 | pahartik | netbrain: netbrain for context-sensitive menus... and defining other end of primary selection... |
| 19:05.36 | iron_angel | It's used for oodles of other things too. Depends on your DE/WM |
| 19:05.51 | netbrain | ok |
| 19:06.44 | pahartik | iron_angel: i think i had one "netbrain" too much |
| 19:07.08 | iron_angel | D'oh :-) |
| 19:07.09 | pahartik | netbrain: sorry about that |
| 19:08.54 | netbrain | oh.. dont worry.. i like it when people talk about me :D |
| 19:09.11 | iron_angel | Just how universal is OpenFirmware? Will a PCI video card that works in a 604e-based Mac also work in a 604e-based (PCI) RS/6k? |
| 19:09.43 | iron_angel | Google turned up some stuff about getting Gentoo to boot on a 43p-140 (which mostly applies to Debian too), but that person had some issues with their video |
| 19:10.05 | iron_angel | A GXT800P, which Xorg/Xfree86 hates. Unfortunately, that's the card I have :-( |
| 19:10.12 | netbrain | there wouldnt happen to be a norwegian keymap for ibooks? |
| 19:11.21 | iron_angel | netbrain: I think so, but I'm not entirely sure. |
| 19:11.32 | netbrain | where can i find resources like theese? |
| 19:11.43 | iron_angel | If nothing else, you can certainly use a USB keyboard with it, but I doubt that's what you want |
| 19:11.51 | iron_angel | Not entirely sure, but Google probably knows |
| 19:12.02 | netbrain | i mean.. where can i find documentation and help on those things? |
| 19:12.56 | iron_angel | googling for it now, maybe I'll find something useful. |
| 19:15.13 | netbrain | oh.. i found it.. |
| 19:15.17 | netbrain | relax iron_angel:D |
| 19:15.44 | netbrain | i can manage my own problems.. you just kick back and guide me :D |
| 19:16.54 | netbrain | you guys know where the configs for gnome are? .gnome and .gnome2? |
| 19:17.39 | netbrain | i want the same settings on root as regular user |
| 19:17.41 | iron_angel | .gnome2, but I think it kitter-katters a few other settings in other places. (Stuff for gtk2, etc) |
| 19:18.26 | iron_angel | I probably ought to RTM one of these days, since I'm about to inherit half-a-million GNOMEified boxen at work |
| 19:22.15 | Belxjander | oh bloody hell... |
| 19:22.36 | Belxjander | it IS "Command-Option-O-F" to reset the NVRAM from OpenFirmware right ? |
| 19:29.47 | demon | no |
| 19:29.56 | demon | that will drop you to an openfirmware prompt |
| 19:30.17 | demon | cmd-opt-P-R will clear the PRAM (which contains the OF settings) |
| 19:32.32 | Belxjander | bloody weird keyboard... |
| 19:33.23 | Belxjander | doesn't work with one of the command/option pairs but does work with the other |
| 19:33.33 | Belxjander | now all I need to do is sort out which kernel image to use in updating the unit |
| 19:34.08 | Belxjander | .elf-pmac apparently doesn't work |
| 19:38.55 | Belxjander | stuffit... |
| 19:38.58 | Belxjander | honestly... |
| 19:39.13 | Belxjander | however the hell "OldWorld" macs get to being workable standalone... |
| 19:43.01 | Belxjander | @$)@!&$)@#!&$)#@!$&#@!)($&#@!)($&#!@) fscking idiotic CRAP... |
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| 21:32.57 | jbailey | Hey, I'm just futzing with a new glibc for Breezy / Etch. Are there many commercial Linux/PPC apps that I have to worry about? |
| 21:33.48 | Bor_Ed | what is breezy/etch ? |
| 21:33.57 | jbailey | I'm more wondering about NPTL vs Linuxthreads. Commercial apps are occasionally written with "extern int errno" and other brokenness that NPTL doesn't like and dies with - but if we're not going to face that restriction with PPC, it would be interesting to consider NPTL only for PPC. |
| 21:34.10 | jbailey | Breezy is the Ubuntu release due out in the Fall. Etch is the name of the release after Sarge. |
| 21:34.28 | Curalton | Etch, sweet. still didnt watch toystory :) |
| 21:34.50 | Curalton | i asume he is a debian developer |
| 21:34.59 | Bor_Ed | ahh |
| 21:35.00 | Curalton | and Bor_Ed needs sleep ;) |
| 21:35.15 | Bor_Ed | naa, woke up at 8 am and it's only 0:35 am now |
| 21:35.24 | jbailey | Yes, I am a Debian developer and a Debian glibc comaintainer. I'm also employed by Canonical. |
| 21:35.25 | Bor_Ed | had 11 hour work day too |
| 21:35.30 | Curalton | concidering there isn't even a recent java for ppc i doubt there are commercial apps, imho |
| 21:35.56 | jbailey | So in practice, my daily concern is Ubuntu, although it makes sense for us to keep Debian and Ubuntu's glibc's as closely matched as possible. |
| 21:36.55 | Curalton | i'd ask that question at the debian.ppc mailinglist, there you will get a broader census |
| 21:36.56 | Bor_Ed | doesn't real still ship closed source player too for linux/ppc ? though I think most have moved to helix based already |
| 21:37.22 | Curalton | was there ever a realplayer for ppc? |
| 21:37.28 | Bor_Ed | yup |
| 21:37.34 | Curalton | i know opera has ppc binaires, but that all that comes to mind |
| 21:37.43 | Bor_Ed | at least rp8 has ppc binary |
| 21:38.03 | Curalton | ah, didnt even miss it :) |
| 21:38.27 | Bor_Ed | helix/realplay works pretty well and is up to date though |
| 21:39.21 | jbailey | Curalton: Yeah, I'm looking for the off-the-top-of-your-head responses now. The nice part is that we're not looking at Sarge/Hoary for this, so there's at minimum 3 or 4 months to screw it up and switch back for Ubuntu, a 1.5-3 years for Debian. =) |
| 21:39.43 | Curalton | hah! well, i know none then |
| 21:40.11 | Curalton | but i just have a little g3 ibook debian/hoary-for-kde-3.4 bastard |
| 21:40.39 | jbailey | Thanks for the suggestions. They'll be good places for me to do some tests. |
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