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| 18:22.39 | calamari | hi |
| 18:24.20 | calamari | I have an oldworld powermac with a 1.2gb drive. There isn't really enough space to keep OS 8.6 on there. Is Quik what I need, or do I need to keep some kind of Mac OS on here? |
| 18:25.29 | simonrvn | depends. what kind of mac |
| 18:25.53 | calamari | Power Macintosh 7200/120 |
| 18:27.54 | simonrvn | yeh you can, but there might be issues |
| 18:28.12 | simonrvn | look up netbsd's page |
| 18:28.18 | simonrvn | sec, get you url |
| 18:29.18 | calamari | thanks |
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| 18:31.49 | simonrvn | @macmodels |
| 18:31.51 | ravenbird | http://simonraven.kisikew.org/bin/view/Know/KbTopic8 or http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/macppc/models.html |
| 18:32.02 | simonrvn | ha! bot had it ;) |
| 18:32.07 | simonrvn | calamari: ^^^ |
| 18:36.12 | calamari | simonrvn: and that's all about the boot loader, etc? because BootX works great to get to the Debian installer |
| 18:36.47 | simonrvn | that's issues with the machine firmware, which affects the bootloader |
| 18:38.21 | calamari | man, it's like Apple wants you to use only their OS :P ;) |
| 18:39.34 | simonrvn | it's easier to get around it on later gen. machines |
| 18:39.56 | simonrvn | even same generation, some support going directly to firmware |
| 18:41.03 | simonrvn | just happens to be the 2.x (apple version) OF revisions, which most also happen to have issues with the ide/ata bus... *sigh* |
| 18:41.11 | simonrvn | busses |
| 18:42.34 | Bor_Ed | 7200 has only scsi bus... |
| 18:42.53 | Bor_Ed | hi btw |
| 18:42.56 | calamari | Bor_Ed: yeah, I'd agree with that.. both hd and cdrom are scsi |
| 18:43.02 | calamari | hi Bor_Ed :) |
| 18:43.10 | Bor_Ed | :) |
| 18:43.35 | simonrvn | i'm not just talking about the 7200 *hinthint* |
| 18:43.39 | Bor_Ed | I used to have 7200/90 and it ran just fine with quik only |
| 18:43.48 | Bor_Ed | simonrvn, I know, I know :) |
| 18:43.54 | calamari | Bor_Ed: cool! |
| 18:44.13 | simonrvn | the best were the 1.0.5 series, unfortch |
| 18:44.14 | Bor_Ed | had 8200/120 too working as server for some years... ran debian/unstable all the time |
| 18:44.33 | simonrvn | unfortunately because of of having to manually set it so it would go to OF |
| 18:44.43 | simonrvn | annoying |
| 18:46.34 | Bor_Ed | 1.0.5 allowed OF only on serial uplink... it was a real joy |
| 18:46.54 | simonrvn | yeh, and defaulting to serial |
| 18:47.05 | Bor_Ed | didn't work on screen at all |
| 18:47.13 | Bor_Ed | at least on 7200 and 8200 |
| 18:47.20 | simonrvn | yeh, 7500 did though |
| 18:47.22 | calamari | Bor_Ed: did you ever have luck booting from floppy on your 7200? |
| 18:47.24 | Bor_Ed | though the cable is easy to make |
| 18:47.28 | simonrvn | s,did,does, |
| 18:47.48 | Bor_Ed | floppy drive on 7200 is picky... I needed around 12 fresh floppies to get 1 working one for it |
| 18:48.02 | calamari | lol, ok that explains it |
| 18:48.12 | simonrvn | and floppies nowadays are crap |
| 18:48.22 | Bor_Ed | boot.bin is the crucial, root.img can be written on failed floppy |
| 18:48.43 | calamari | yeah it probably doesn't help that most of my floppies are 10+ years old |
| 18:48.49 | simonrvn | you need 3 now ;p |
| 18:48.53 | Bor_Ed | I had to drop some to get fresh tdk disks |
| 18:49.07 | Bor_Ed | eventually I got working set from them |
| 18:49.26 | simonrvn | though the effing official images won't support actual booting... |
| 18:49.37 | simonrvn | the old ones do |
| 18:49.53 | calamari | floppy images too? I thought that was just cdrom |
| 18:49.55 | Bor_Ed | last time I've installed from floppies, I used woody images |
| 18:50.13 | Bor_Ed | easy to dist-upgrade to fresh |
| 18:50.23 | calamari | I'll have to try woody images.. think it was etch |
| 18:50.28 | calamari | thanks |
| 18:50.34 | simonrvn | yeh woody is easiest. you still can with etch and sarge, but you gotta go find some working sven luther versions |
| 18:50.58 | simonrvn | he built them using the needed bits |
| 18:51.02 | Bor_Ed | just install basesystem from woody so it won't be that big dist-upgrade |
| 18:51.15 | calamari | yeah |
| 18:51.20 | simonrvn | yeh, that's a good choice |
| 18:52.09 | calamari | I appreciate all this help in getting my obsolete mac running linux :) |
| 18:52.23 | Bor_Ed | hey, it's still usable little piece of hardware :) |
| 18:52.29 | simonrvn | yeh |
| 18:52.44 | Bor_Ed | I just retired pmac 4400/200 as server and replaced it with beige g3/315 |
| 18:52.54 | calamari | yeah, I want to hook a wireless to ethernet bridge on it and use it to play songs in the living room |
| 18:54.04 | simonrvn | Bor_Ed: how much ram you got on it? tower or desktop model? |
| 18:54.06 | Bor_Ed | get zydas zd1211 based wireless usb stick to it... I had a-link wlan usb on ppc and worked just fine |
| 18:54.19 | Bor_Ed | simonrvn: on g3? 160M ram and desktop model |
| 18:54.27 | calamari | usb? lol |
| 18:54.46 | simonrvn | sure, mac os won't see it, but who cares ;) |
| 18:54.50 | Bor_Ed | usb... the sticks are dirt cheap and pci -> usb2.0 cards are too |
| 18:55.14 | Bor_Ed | I've got some VIA chipset based card on the server even now... a sec |
| 18:55.32 | Bor_Ed | 00:0e.0 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 61) |
| 18:55.35 | Bor_Ed | 00:0e.1 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82xxxxx UHCI USB 1.1 Controller (rev 61) |
| 18:55.38 | Bor_Ed | 00:0e.2 USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. USB 2.0 (rev 63) |
| 18:55.38 | Bor_Ed | such... works just fine |
| 19:00.03 | calamari | Bor_Ed: so I can put normal PCI cards in there? haven't really opened it up before to look |
| 19:00.11 | Bor_Ed | yup |
| 19:00.14 | Bor_Ed | it has 3 pci slots |
| 19:00.28 | calamari | nifty |
| 19:00.42 | Bor_Ed | gfx cards are pita, others work 90%+ |
| 19:01.47 | calamari | if I was going to try to watch movies on this, I think I'd need a more powerful machine |
| 19:02.19 | Bor_Ed | yea... 601/120 really doesn't shine on movie decoding |
| 19:02.47 | Bor_Ed | though you could use hauppauge, creative etc decoding card to get mpeg2/4/whatever they support |
| 19:02.53 | calamari | main idea with the mac is that it's relatively quiet |
| 19:03.33 | Bor_Ed | you can even kill the psu fan or connect it to +5V if you strip the psu casing a bit... though remember that you have 110 or 230 volts there free to touch then |
| 19:03.42 | calamari | no thanks.. haha |
| 19:04.03 | calamari | don't want my kids getting electrocuted |
| 19:04.31 | Bor_Ed | you'll still have the case on the box... it's just open internally when the top is removed from the psu |
| 19:05.26 | calamari | oh, I see.. interesting idea |
| 19:05.40 | Bor_Ed | exchanges the heat better with free flow |
| 19:06.16 | Bor_Ed | 5V supply to the psu fan works too with no other hacks... though it can potentially heat up the psu switching transistors |
| 19:09.49 | calamari | it sounds like you've done this before :) |
| 19:10.08 | Bor_Ed | yup... macs don't tend to heat that much :) |
| 19:10.16 | calamari | how long did you run it with the psu stopped? |
| 19:10.25 | Bor_Ed | couple of years |
| 19:10.35 | calamari | wow |
| 19:10.48 | Bor_Ed | had to connect back when I sold the system to new retro hobbyist |
| 19:11.18 | Bor_Ed | only noise I had from the box was buggr scsi disks |
| 19:11.29 | Bor_Ed | and that wasn't that quiet in the end :D |
| 19:11.47 | calamari | haha |
| 19:12.48 | Bor_Ed | you know the sound of that grmbl quantum trying to hold on in the case |
| 19:13.20 | calamari | my cdrom drive sounds like that when I open the drawer.. sounds like it's going to die any second but it keeps working |
| 19:13.26 | Bor_Ed | btw, if you feel like checking out what's in, the case cover slips out just by pressing the 2 clips at the bottom front of the case iirc |
| 19:13.40 | calamari | ok |
| 19:14.55 | calamari | I'll have to dig thru my pci cards and see what useless junk I can load the system down with |
| 19:15.27 | Bor_Ed | ide or scsi card for a starter, possibly usb card for expansion and better sound card, sb live worked great |
| 19:15.53 | Bor_Ed | just my .02$, you might have other interests |
| 19:18.55 | calamari | yeah did a quick look for that usb wireless, it was really cheap.. thanks for mentining it |
| 19:19.15 | Bor_Ed | no problemo |
| 19:22.40 | Bor_Ed | you still need the usb pci card but then again, you can use external drives (480Mbps) and so on gear on the box... the scsi bus of 7200 is 5MB/s stock and runs 10MB/s with kernel conf... and usb 2.0 around 45MB/s |
| 20:05.15 | calamari | the woody floppies seem to work good.. at least if something goes wrong I can still boot up |
| 20:06.40 | Bor_Ed | there you have a good base for the expirement then |
| 20:06.57 | Bor_Ed | I need to drop dead... wakeup in some hours for work |
| 20:07.13 | Bor_Ed | have fun on the hack |
| 20:08.00 | simonrvn | Bor_Ed: g'night |
| 20:09.13 | calamari | Bor_Ed: thanks a lot! |
| 20:09.16 | calamari | good night |
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| 20:15.58 | calamari | simonrvn: as I understand it, I need to install Debian first, then quick, is that correct? |
| 20:16.03 | calamari | quik |
| 20:16.34 | simonrvn | gets installed with it |
| 20:19.56 | calamari | ok good :) |
| 20:33.30 | calamari | simonrvn: I have 6 partitions on my drive.. do I need to get rid of all of them, or only the HFS? it says it cannot remove the "driver 4.3" partitions |
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| 21:09.17 | Derailed | Hey guys, I just installed etch on a PowerMac G5, it's all working great except that the machine refuses to boot without a monitor plugged in, I *really* need this to be a headless box. What are my options? |
| 21:17.22 | calamari | Derailed: I wonder if you can trick it with some kind of adapter |
| 21:18.21 | Derailed | Well I'm seeing that people have done that with a fake VGA thing. but it's got a dual DVI card in there at the moment so I'm not to sure how you'd do it that way, but more importantly, I just can't *believe* i'd have to resort to that -- there MUST be a software way to do it. |
| 21:21.20 | calamari | any idea how far it gets on the boot? |
| 21:21.40 | Derailed | not really -- without a monitor, how can you tell? :-) |
| 21:29.52 | calamari | hmm.. good question |
| 21:30.06 | calamari | how about this.. try booting without the monitor, then plug it in after it stops |
| 21:30.45 | Derailed | I'm going to try that again in a second -- the first time I tried it there was no video signal after I plugged the monitor back in |
| 21:30.54 | Derailed | so I couldn't see anything as to how far it had gotten |
| 21:32.25 | calamari | anyhow, if it's stopping during the mac part of things, then you might be out of luck.. something tells me that's what's happening too |
| 21:32.44 | calamari | because then it'd be a firmware thing, right? |
| 21:34.09 | Derailed | maybe, maybe not, after all, you are theoretically able to run leopard (mac os 10.5) server on this machine, which should work headless -- so presumably they get around the problem somehow |
| 21:38.56 | Derailed | It doesn't look like it's getting to a point where it can write any useful information into the debian system lohs |
| 21:38.58 | Derailed | (logs) |
| 21:58.35 | simonrvn | calamari: well, you can, in reality, but won't hurt to keep the driver partitions |
| 22:03.04 | calamari | simonrvn: lol, too late! but it's okay.. last night I made a backup of the entire drive |
| 22:03.20 | calamari | so I should be able to restore it completely back if I need to |
| 22:07.00 | calamari | boy was that a pain and a half.. the woody install disk libc didn't match up 100% with woody.. but I finally found ncftpput that just depended on libc, and replaced it with the woody libc using a static busybox |
| 22:09.44 | calamari | yay, it's booting woody! :) awesome |
| 22:28.22 | calamari | ooh segfault updating apt.. nice |
| 22:52.46 | calamari | needed to add APT::Cache-Limit "33554432"; |
| 23:16.16 | calamari | ugh, stupid dist-upgrade.. should've just upgraded things myself :( |
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| 23:30.29 | calamari | ahh crap.. bricked :( |
| 23:31.12 | calamari | let's see.. cmd opt p r |
| 23:32.47 | calamari | okay good, that worked |
| 23:33.24 | calamari | whew, guess not bricked after all |
| 23:34.46 | calamari | what does dist-upgrade do for me anyways? is there some kind of advantage to it? |