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| 09:01.40 | lightgeek | good morning everybody ;) |
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| 09:30.57 | lightgeek | somebody awake ? |
| 09:31.43 | Nalle_ | Yes |
| 09:35.34 | lightgeek | great :) up for some question regarding debian on a powerbook ? |
| 09:40.32 | Nalle_ | Would be fun, but unfortunately I am probably not that much of help. Debian is fairly new to me too. Still trying to learn as I go along :) Maybe Bor_ed would want to help ? |
| 09:42.10 | lightgeek | Bor_Ed, , sounds good ? ^^ |
| 09:43.14 | lightgeek | coming from a mac background and changed to ubuntu and x86 PCs i am wondering if i can get se same "functionality" with a debian or ubuntu based distro on a powerbook or powermac. |
| 09:43.15 | pahartik | lightgeek: Which PowerBook? |
| 09:43.37 | lightgeek | the last revision, powerbook 1.67 high res. |
| 09:43.55 | Nalle_ | I'd imagine so. A Linux is a Linux is a Linux. Just a matter of installing the suitable packages. |
| 09:43.56 | lightgeek | still got a powermac g5 1.8 standing here, but thats going on ebay soon |
| 09:44.13 | Nalle_ | lightgeek, sell it to me? |
| 09:44.39 | lightgeek | okay. so i can....well install all the stuff i use now on a "standard" ubuntu ? e.g. all my x86 programms like gimp, GNOME color manager and stuff ? |
| 09:44.51 | lightgeek | where youre from ? |
| 09:44.54 | lightgeek | @ Nalle_ |
| 09:44.58 | Nalle_ | has been looking for a last gen G4 PowerMac or G5 PowerMac to run MOS on :) |
| 09:45.21 | Nalle_ | lightgeek: there are versions of those in the debian repo without a doubt. |
| 09:45.59 | Nalle_ | I use debian on my server machine (old G3 Mac) though, so I havent really looked at any desktop stuff. |
| 09:46.12 | pahartik | lightgeek: It is very good for Debian GNU/Linux workstation... |
| 09:46.13 | Bor_Ed | debian/ppc runs just same apps as debian/x86 |
| 09:46.24 | lightgeek | *nods* |
| 09:46.28 | lightgeek | Bor_Ed, GREAT :) |
| 09:47.10 | lightgeek | i am typing on a HP laptop and next to me stands a intel xeon dual workstation....but...i am still missing the neraly perfect mac hardware |
| 09:47.35 | lightgeek | even though i cant image going back to os x right now .... .oO i never thought id say that one day :)) |
| 09:48.12 | Bor_Ed | osx is slow, closed and bloated compared to debian/xfce :D |
| 09:49.07 | pahartik | lightgeek: My main workstation has been iBook G4 since 2004, bought it for running Debian |
| 09:49.44 | lightgeek | ^^ well, the workstation right now runs elemantary OS , striving to rival os x in "usability" and easyness one day. but i agree that os x ist slow @ Bor_Ed . i sued it as my main production system for years. being a photographer |
| 09:50.02 | lightgeek | o.o |
| 09:50.09 | lightgeek | umm, something got cut offf... |
| 09:50.57 | lightgeek | meant to write: i am running "elemantary OS" right now, a linux striving to rival os x in "usability" and easyness one day. |
| 09:50.58 | pahartik | lightgeek: Latest PowerBook seems to have ATI Mobility Radeon 9700 graphics adapter, should be well supported |
| 09:51.08 | Nalle_ | I have a lastest gen iMac at home with OS X. I am pretty happy with it :) |
| 09:51.11 | lightgeek | kk |
| 09:52.27 | Nalle_ | Upping the memory from 4gig to 8Gig did a HUGE difference though |
| 09:52.32 | Nalle_ | OS X seems to like memory a lot |
| 09:53.09 | lightgeek | japp. i remember running os x with 1 gig on an generation 1 17" powerbook |
| 09:53.20 | lightgeek | say hi to "slowness" :D |
| 09:53.44 | Nalle_ | Heh. I have a last gen G4 iBook with 1,25gig running OS X 10.5. |
| 09:54.11 | Nalle_ | It is usable, but a tad slow sometimes. I attribute that to the relatively slow CPU and slow ass 4200rpm HDD tho |
| 09:54.24 | Nalle_ | With modern HDD it should improve. |
| 09:54.32 | Nalle_ | haven't just gotten around into replacing the HDD yet |
| 09:55.10 | lightgeek | do i get that right that i have to use a "special" PPC sepcific version of debian for a powermac/book system ? |
| 09:56.09 | lightgeek | thats my desktop right now :) http://www3.pic-upload.de/07.10.10/btowczxk9p5u.png |
| 09:57.57 | pahartik | lightgeek: Each architecture runs architecture-specific binaries |
| 09:58.07 | Bor_Ed | debian/ppc runs on any new powermac |
| 09:59.28 | lightgeek | pahartik, that trnasloates into "you cant use ubuntu or any other x86 linux distribution on your powerlc, but you CAN on a intel mac is this right ? |
| 10:05.24 | pahartik | lightgeek: For example, document at "http://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=emacs23" shows list of architectures that Debian has built "emacs23" for |
| 10:09.53 | lightgeek | i am not getting it somehow :P |
| 10:11.18 | pahartik | lightgeek: Ubuntu has PowerPC port, but it is not part of official release and not supported anymore... If you know structure of Debian archive mirrors, Ubuntu has ports at "http://ports.ubuntu.com/" |
| 10:15.15 | lightgeek | ah ok. but i could install any actual linux distro on a "actual" mac ? |
| 10:15.28 | lightgeek | because its x86 architecture ?? |
| 10:19.48 | pahartik | lightgeek: PowerPC runs executables built for "powerpc", does not know what to do with executables built for "alpha", "amd64", "armel", "hppa", "i386", "ia64", "m68k", "mips", "mipsel", "s390", "sh4" or "sparc" |
| 10:20.53 | lightgeek | so, the easy answer is "you cant run ubuntu 10.10 e.g. on your powermac. but can without any problems on your HP or intel MAC ? |
| 10:22.07 | Nalle_ | Easy yes, not that's not exactly true, per se. |
| 10:24.00 | lightgeek | ah okay |
| 10:27.07 | pahartik | lightgeek: Current Ubuntu Linux may or may not work, official port or support for PowerPC architecture does not exist... However, installer is at "http://ports.ubuntu.com/dists/maverick/main/installer-powerpc/current/images/powerpc/" |
| 10:29.13 | Nalle_ | Compiling is also always an option if there are no ready binaries for a specific platform |
| 10:31.05 | lightgeek | *nods his head* so i am better off using "standard" x86 hardware i guess, me being not an expert. |
| 10:32.27 | Nalle_ | Depends on your needs. Debian/PPC has ports for pretty much any application you could possibly want. |
| 10:32.28 | pahartik | lightgeek: Debian is just better, with broadest support for different architectures |
| 10:34.32 | lightgeek | Nalle_, so i DO have to use ports for my applications / programs ? |
| 10:35.28 | lightgeek | well what i need is a free, fast, easy to use and beautiful (thats important to me, too, at least) OS :) |
| 10:38.28 | Nalle_ | lightgeek: ofcourse you do have to use the builds of the apps made for that specific Linux version. |
| 10:39.19 | Nalle_ | Just like there is say GIMP for Linux, Windows, OS X and what ever. You cannot use say OS X version on Windows. That just won't work but instead you have to use the Windows version of Gimp. Same kind of deal here. |
| 10:40.35 | pahartik | lightgeek: Package management system installs only packages that are suitable for architecture it is running on... |
| 10:41.30 | Nalle_ | Yes and if there is no suitable version of the application for that specific architecture, but you do know, that it exists on some other architecture, you can get it. It just requires a bit work. |
| 10:41.36 | Nalle_ | Thats the nice part about Linux |
| 10:44.17 | lightgeek | oh...wellok, i guess i get it now. |
| 10:44.31 | lightgeek | thanks alot :) |
| 10:45.42 | Nalle_ | No worries. |
| 10:47.23 | lightgeek | here we go..off to work bye everybody |
| 10:52.44 | pahartik | Nalle_: When are you coming to Tampere for installing Linux on PowerMacintosh 4400? |
| 11:00.49 | Nalle_ | I don't. I gave it already to co-worker :) |
| 11:01.04 | Nalle_ | He is having a bit trouble with it but slowly getting there :) |
| 11:01.46 | Nalle_ | Which reminds me; need to take down the "Annetaan:" add in hopeinenomena .. |
| 11:02.09 | Nalle_ | But now => some more coffee :) |
| 11:31.31 | Nalle_ | Mmm |
| 11:55.18 | pahartik | Nalle_: Is "BootX" copied to filesystem already? |
| 11:57.29 | Nalle_ | I think he had a problem that the MacOS 8.5 doesn't apparently support .dmg files |
| 11:57.37 | Nalle_ | So I will copy the contents to him separately |
| 11:58.10 | Nalle_ | Also there is a problem that the network card that the 4400 has, as standard, doesn't also work with MacOS 8.5 without some additional driver which, ofcourse, he nor I have access to. |
| 11:58.20 | Nalle_ | So it is putting up a decent fight |
| 11:58.21 | pahartik | Nalle_: "Disk Copy" that is on traditional MacOS install media, supports mounting disk images |
| 11:58.40 | Nalle_ | Really? |
| 11:58.44 | Nalle_ | I will let him know this |
| 11:58.56 | Nalle_ | I did tell him to drop to this channel for help if needed though :) |
| 12:00.23 | pahartik | Nalle_: I have used that image myself, to get "BootX" on freshly installed MacOS 8.5 system... However, "Disk Copy" is not installed by default along traditional MacOS, it is on separate folder on install media |
| 12:02.24 | Nalle_ | Ah, good to know :) |
| 12:03.07 | pahartik | Nalle_: "Netscape 4.5" can be installed along with traditional MacOS, that I have used to fetch image from my HTTP server... But of course that requires supported network adapter |
| 12:06.49 | pahartik | Nalle_: And requires local IPv4 network, since traditional MacOS does not support IPv6 |
| 12:07.18 | Nalle_ | Yes. The standard installation installs Netscape |
| 12:07.26 | Nalle_ | It just is useless due to the driver problem with the NIC |
| 12:18.07 | Nalle_ | I found couple of websites that carry old Mac NIC drivers |
| 12:18.45 | Nalle_ | Hopefully one of those will work but then again, those are probably not needed if we can get the damned BootX to install since then debian has it's own drivers that will fill in the need. |
| 12:19.07 | Nalle_ | I do think Bor_ed warned me though, that the default drivers that Debian uses for the NIC will not work and some alternative driver needs to eb used. |
| 12:19.13 | Nalle_ | Do you have any information on that? |
| 12:19.35 | pahartik | Nalle_: Which network adapter? |
| 12:19.48 | Nalle_ | No recollection really |
| 12:19.53 | Nalle_ | The stock one on 4400/200 ? |
| 12:20.02 | Nalle_ | Maybe Asante card |
| 12:23.22 | pahartik | Nalle_: I have never tried PowerMacintosh 4400... Only 5400, 5500, 7300, 7500 and 9600 |
| 12:24.09 | Nalle_ | From what I gather, 4400 was a bit of a oddball |
| 12:24.32 | Nalle_ | Anyway, I have no real information about the NIC issue other than what Ari told me quite a while back. |
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