| 00:03.58 | *** join/#devlounge mathrick (~mathrick@195.116.35.55) |
| 06:15.10 | *** join/#devlounge Spooky (~callum@203-167-185-219.dsl.clear.net.nz) |
| 11:09.26 | *** join/#devlounge pb_ (~pb@2002:5168:d330:1:a00:1fff:fe06:93c) |
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| 17:09.45 | kergoth | morning |
| 17:10.41 | pb_ | hi kergoth |
| 17:10.57 | kergoth | @futurama |
| 17:10.58 | kbot | kergoth: <Fry> That doesn't look like an "L", unless you count lower case. |
| 19:11.56 | TD | heya guys |
| 19:19.47 | *** join/#devlounge pb_ (~pb@2002:5168:d330:1:a00:1fff:fe06:93c) |
| 19:41.35 | scanline | <bender> you know we don't! *smack* |
| 19:43.57 | *** join/#devlounge wasabi (~wasabi@c-24-1-67-127.client.comcast.net) |
| 19:44.05 | wasabi | buh. |
| 19:44.22 | wasabi | I'm not joining a channel that's lead by java h8rs! |
| 19:44.32 | pb_ | too late |
| 19:45.06 | *** topic/#devlounge by TD -> MIKE HATES |
| 19:45.30 | wasabi | haha |
| 19:45.42 | kergoth | @futurama |
| 19:45.42 | kbot | kergoth: <Bender> Aw, this bends! |
| 19:51.04 | TD | man |
| 19:51.17 | TD | *why* do i always seem to end up using server-side java? |
| 19:51.43 | TD | it's like some bizarre magnetism. the planets align such that whenever i end up doing server side code, it's either (a) shell scripts or (b) java+tomcat |
| 19:51.47 | wasabi | Because it's good and people love it. ;) |
| 19:51.54 | TD | nobody loves java |
| 19:51.57 | wasabi | I do. |
| 19:51.59 | TD | maybe people *tolerate* it |
| 19:52.03 | wasabi | Psshs. |
| 19:52.07 | TD | it's a not a language you can love. too sterile |
| 19:52.08 | wasabi | bzzzzt |
| 19:52.10 | TD | too restrictive |
| 19:52.17 | TD | too factory-production-line oriented |
| 19:52.29 | TD | too many AccessorContextBeanFactoryLoaders |
| 19:53.16 | TD | and tomcat! |
| 19:53.24 | TD | aaaaaaaaah |
| 19:53.43 | wasabi | Hmm. I like tomcat too. |
| 19:54.12 | TD | hehe |
| 19:54.20 | wasabi | Different mind set. |
| 19:54.27 | TD | i guess so |
| 19:54.36 | TD | and to be fair, i'm not very experienced with the alternatives |
| 19:54.41 | wasabi | I obsessive compulsive. So Java lets me be that way. ;) |
| 19:54.42 | TD | maybe i'd hate PHP too if i had to use it all the time |
| 19:54.55 | TD | heh |
| 19:54.57 | wasabi | Java is, as you said, structured. |
| 19:55.14 | wasabi | And it's meant to be. It's meant to be. Sun goes thru hell to try to make procedures and processes for everything. |
| 19:55.18 | wasabi | Damnit |
| 19:55.21 | wasabi | I can't speak today. |
| 19:55.22 | TD | yeah, i know |
| 19:55.24 | TD | not really my mindset. |
| 19:55.29 | TD | i don't *mind* structure |
| 19:55.33 | TD | as long as it's not enforced. but in java, it is |
| 19:55.46 | wasabi | When you have a team of 50 programmers, working on a deadline, where 1 hour of downtime costs you 10k, you'll like it. ;) |
| 19:57.23 | TD | well, i have a team of 4 programmers, working to a deadline .... |
| 19:57.41 | TD | to be fair, if we were using any other language there'd be that many more ways for them to screw up |
| 19:58.32 | TD | ahhh the joys of edumacation |
| 20:00.31 | wasabi | I don't actively dislike many languages. |
| 20:00.31 | wasabi | Except like, VB. |
| 20:01.01 | TD | that's understandable |
| 20:01.24 | TD | i'd like java more if it could co-erce references to booleans |
| 20:01.28 | TD | if (!obj) ... |
| 20:01.33 | TD | instead of if (obj != null) |
| 20:01.38 | TD | that annoys me far more than it should |
| 20:01.42 | wasabi | yes. |
| 20:01.52 | wasabi | I think the second is easier to read. |
| 20:02.10 | wasabi | the first gives no hint of what you're really trying to do. |
| 20:02.19 | wasabi | doesn't even say if it's a reference or not |
| 20:03.56 | TD | well, i don't think it makes things harder to read, it's just a part of the language |
| 20:04.35 | TD | if you know the language you should know what it means, same as C |
| 20:04.59 | wasabi | even if you know the language, is obj a boolean or a reference? |
| 20:05.30 | TD | if your current scope is so huge you can't look it up given a seconds work then it probably needs refactoring anyway |
| 20:06.00 | wasabi | what about if (!obj.doSomething()) |
| 20:06.04 | wasabi | gotta go track down that method |
| 20:06.20 | TD | well, do you really need to know the type? or should it be obvious from the naming |
| 20:06.28 | TD | i never found that to obfuscate the code in well written C |
| 20:06.36 | wasabi | Is it a boolean or a Boolean? :) |
| 20:06.43 | wasabi | (seperate problem) |
| 20:08.11 | *** topic/#devlounge by TD -> this is a viral topic line from #devlounge, copy and paste it into your channel! |
| 20:08.16 | *** topic/#devlounge by TD -> this is a viral topic line from #devlounge, copy and paste it into your channel! spread the word! |
| 20:35.06 | kergoth | hey chip |
| 20:38.53 | ChipX86 | hey |
| 20:46.57 | *** join/#devlounge zecke|food (~ich@83-169-168-248-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 20:47.00 | zecke|food | ChipX86: hey |
| 20:47.26 | zecke_ | kergoth: #channel number 14 :} |
| 20:47.39 | pb_ | zecke_: heh |
| 20:47.44 | kergoth | i'm down to 11, did some trimming lately |
| 20:47.45 | kergoth | heh |
| 20:47.49 | ChipX86 | hey |
| 20:51.18 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I figured you wouldn't be interested in the 'quick hacks' |
| 20:51.27 | ChipX86 | how quick hacky are they? |
| 20:51.33 | ChipX86 | I just haven't had the time to maintain it |
| 20:52.05 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I can say the libgaim change is not done properly but I'm willing to do it more approriate |
| 20:52.18 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I had to clean away and server.c from Gtk usage |
| 20:52.23 | ChipX86 | yeah |
| 20:52.29 | zecke_ | and I mostly did that with #if 0 :} |
| 20:52.33 | kergoth | hehe |
| 20:52.39 | ChipX86 | I've mainly been waiting for libgaim 2.0.0, but that may be a while, so, quick hacks are fine for now :) |
| 20:52.55 | ChipX86 | maybe if you just want ot maintain a private tree for now, and at some point it can be merged upstream and I'll just give you commit access? |
| 20:52.59 | TD | heh |
| 20:53.34 | ChipX86 | I don't even have a zaurus with a charged battery right now :/ |
| 20:53.44 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I've no problem doing the libgaim change more properly (introducing a struct with function pointer for the away and stylize methods) |
| 20:54.10 | zecke_ | ChipX86: sadly I won't have enough time to really fix all bugs in qpe-gaim soon though |
| 20:54.12 | ChipX86 | well, I just blew away that code in my libgaim |
| 20:54.33 | ChipX86 | I pretty much decided long ago that I wasn't going to bother supporting those until we had them split out |
| 20:54.40 | ChipX86 | but if you want to do it that way, that's fine |
| 20:55.19 | zecke_ | I just couldn't live with shipping qpe-gaim with security bugs (even if the chanche of seeing them exploited on arm is quite low) |
| 20:56.50 | ChipX86 | yeah |
| 20:56.54 | ChipX86 | I really appreciate that work |
| 20:56.59 | zecke_ | kergoth: lol, I even forgot to push the patch |
| 20:57.06 | kergoth | sfiles -x is your friend :) |
| 20:58.39 | ChipX86 | we need galago packages and support after the release! ;) |
| 20:59.11 | zecke_ | ChipX86: http://oe-devel.bkbits.net:8080/openembedded/anno/packages/qpe-gaim/files/libgaim.patch%401.1?nav=index.html|ChangeSet@-1h|cset@1.2989 for the libgaim creation |
| 20:59.51 | ChipX86 | looks a lot like my patch, except not as hacky because gaim's come a bit further since then :) |
| 21:00.06 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I basicly looked at your Makefile.am changes |
| 21:00.38 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I'll mail you a more approriate change in the away handling and a header clean up this week (or should I mail somewhere else) |
| 21:00.47 | ChipX86 | cool |
| 21:00.58 | ChipX86 | well, it won't get into gaim proper |
| 21:01.02 | ChipX86 | so I guess to me is best |
| 21:01.18 | ChipX86 | libgaim will be so much easier to maintain once gaim 2.0 is out |
| 21:02.06 | zecke_ | ChipX86: if that is the case (not getting into gaim proper), I will probably focus on making qpe-gaim crash less often |
| 21:02.27 | ChipX86 | ok |
| 21:02.35 | ChipX86 | it would get into gaim proper if all that stuff wasn't already nuked |
| 21:02.51 | zecke_ | ChipX86: what is the timeframe for gaim 2.0? |
| 21:03.07 | ChipX86 | wish I knew... they're still debating over the UI |
| 21:04.09 | zecke_ | ChipX86: I've three to four bugs with qpe-gaim |
| 21:05.09 | zecke_ | ChipX86: QGaimTimer deletes itself (pretty bad), Registering of Jabber accounts results in an assert hit, Some issues with the configuration dialog, and if I create a jabber account and try to connect it crashes ;) |
| 21:05.34 | ChipX86 | oh fun |
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