| 00:05.13 | *** join/#devuan andrea__ (~Drugo@host4-1-dynamic.56-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 00:06.44 | *** join/#devuan cdanderson42 (~nuhrin@67.170.89.70) |
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| 00:50.49 | Jhntn-vbz | hello people |
| 00:53.07 | Jhntn-vbz | I want to install networkmanager and remove wicd. is it possible in devuan? |
| 01:00.53 | Centurion_Dan | Jhntn-vbz: probably not at this stage. |
| 01:01.09 | Jhntn-vbz | cebreidian: Systemd? |
| 01:05.00 | Centurion_Dan | Jhntn-vbz: ?? systemd, yes but it needs a functional systemd not just libsystemd0 installed IIRC |
| 01:05.46 | Jhntn-vbz | So if I want to create a l2tp vpn connection what should I do? |
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| 01:56.28 | pydsigner | At work I run NetworkManager without systemd so it isn't impossible |
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| 02:42.14 | neutron_stz | how ? |
| 02:57.09 | *** join/#devuan rhqq (~rhqq@99-110-220-91.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 03:02.14 | rhqq | hi, where can I browse packages for devuan? (like packages.debian.org style) |
| 03:03.34 | furrywolf | that's a frequently requested feature, but not implemented yet. packages.debian.org will show you 99% of devuan, since only 1% has changed. |
| 03:04.33 | rhqq | is it version to version in numbers? |
| 03:04.38 | rhqq | like, lets say gnome |
| 03:04.43 | rhqq | is going to be exact same version |
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| 03:05.09 | furrywolf | for most things. gnome might be part of that 1% - I haven't checked. |
| 03:06.21 | rhqq | and is there any list of most common packages known to be troublesome because of messed up systemd dependencies? |
| 03:06.43 | furrywolf | no. because those 1% are the ones where the systemd dependencies were fixed. :) |
| 03:07.01 | rhqq | coolio |
| 03:07.11 | rhqq | well, gonna give it a try tonight... |
| 03:25.11 | Lydia_K | gnome stuff generally is tightly tied to systemd |
| 03:25.19 | Lydia_K | and therefore is the most likely to not work. |
| 03:25.56 | rhqq | well, it works well on freebsd |
| 03:26.31 | rhqq | and theyre less likely to implement systemd than windows ;) |
| 03:26.44 | Lydia_K | if it works on freebsd then it should work on devuan, general rule of thumb, not neccessarily true all the time. |
| 03:26.47 | furrywolf | hops on Lydia_K's lap |
| 03:26.54 | Lydia_K | pets furrywolf |
| 03:27.03 | furrywolf | mrrf! :) |
| 03:27.41 | fsmithred | live-usb refracta with vdev - http://www.filedropper.com/r8i386vdevusb-hdd |
| 03:39.07 | fsmithred | instructions for use, md5 and sig files at: https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/experimental |
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| 03:43.13 | Lydia_K | rhqq: LOL |
| 03:44.05 | rhqq | well, freebsd feels good... too bad theres no google hangouts there :S |
| 03:44.50 | rhqq | feels like linux a decade ago... 'dear XYZ company, can i has freebsd version of your software?' |
| 03:45.00 | rhqq | :< |
| 03:46.31 | Lydia_K | LOL |
| 03:46.38 | Lydia_K | BSD is pretty good. |
| 03:47.18 | Lydia_K | I don't want to have to move to it, not because there's anything wrong with BSD, but because there are things I love about the linux ecosystem and philosiphy (which systemd is trying to destroy) |
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| 03:48.39 | rhqq | well, after like over a decade i've installed it again on a vm, i was surprised how well does it feel |
| 03:49.12 | rhqq | everything worked like a charm, i kinda want to be able to switch to it |
| 03:49.32 | rhqq | but well, work stuff requires me to use hangouts... |
| 03:49.54 | rhqq | may i ask what you like about linux ecosystem? |
| 03:49.59 | Lydia_K | It's tempting, it's a great OS, but I'm not about to abandon something I love just because some people are trying to take it in a direction I disagree with. |
| 03:50.27 | Lydia_K | The great thing about open source is that I can say "Fork you pal!" and make what *I* like, which is whatever everyone here is all about. |
| 03:50.33 | Lydia_K | Sure! |
| 03:51.10 | Lydia_K | The thing I love most about the linux ecosystem is it's diversity |
| 03:51.40 | Lydia_K | There's always someone trying something new, doing something different, most of those thins never make it as "the next big thing" but some of them do! |
| 03:52.12 | rhqq | linux is doomed... that's because of its fragmentation. we have a gazillion of flavours, now systemd is everywhere (with few exeptions), and a super-duper miniority is trying to make their own subflavour of non-systemd version. and then you have all those ~400 users of opernrc arch, less than a couple thousand of devuanists... old gentoo army, few void linux users, and that's it. |
| 03:52.42 | *** join/#devuan minnesotags (~herbgarci@c-50-137-242-97.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 03:52.49 | Lydia_K | Here are two great examples, bedrock linux, a distro that is based on installing other distros in chroots: http://bedrocklinux.org and rancherOS, an OS that is entirely about docker containers, to the point where the main OS is pretty much just a docker container itself: http://rancher.com/rancher-os/ |
| 03:53.24 | Lydia_K | the systemd versions are a fork, just like everything else in this community |
| 03:54.00 | Lydia_K | it's popular right now, and as a fork I think it'll do well, but the rest of the community will move on, those forks will grow, and that spirit of innovation will live on |
| 03:54.35 | rhqq | that's all about userbase, ubuntu is big not because of developers but because of the dev-to-users ratio |
| 03:54.53 | rhqq | well, mainainers, whoever-else that is not just an user |
| 03:55.56 | rhqq | for devuan the ratio of engaged users to normal users is just too big, adoption is too slow, because nobody out of the people who are interested is going to try it |
| 03:56.05 | Lydia_K | Linux wasn't popular for most of it's life. |
| 03:56.13 | Lydia_K | That's because we have not even had a 1.0 release! |
| 03:56.19 | Lydia_K | Besides, it's not about users |
| 03:56.26 | Lydia_K | it's about what the people writing the software want. |
| 03:56.37 | Lydia_K | they are building what they want, and if you build it, they will come. |
| 03:57.04 | rhqq | not really. they mostly dont care about systemd |
| 03:57.14 | Lydia_K | popularity will grow, other downstream distros will move to devuan instead of debian as a base, they will provide end users with a pretty, configured OS |
| 03:57.18 | rhqq | talked to enough `casual` linux users to see they really dont care |
| 03:57.28 | rhqq | and they like the idea of `hey, my laptop boots in 4 seconds` |
| 03:57.33 | rhqq | that systemd gives out of box |
| 03:58.51 | Lydia_K | LOL, "boot time" |
| 03:59.06 | Lydia_K | if you reboot your box that often you are probably and idiot and I don't care about you. |
| 03:59.24 | rhqq | you just dont care about majority of casual linux users |
| 03:59.25 | rrq | rhqq: not sure where you got 4s from |
| 03:59.26 | Lydia_K | Anyway, did you come here to just try to shoot us down? or do you actually want to talk about stuff? |
| 03:59.35 | furrywolf | eh, that's relevant on a laptop. |
| 03:59.47 | Lydia_K | You are correct, personally, I don't care about casual linux users. |
| 03:59.57 | rhqq | they're the power of the community |
| 04:00.04 | rhqq | even though we dont like them |
| 04:00.05 | Lydia_K | I don't care. |
| 04:00.11 | Lydia_K | Still don't care. |
| 04:00.14 | furrywolf | of course, the one I put a ssd in boots pretty damn fast with sysvinit too. :) |
| 04:00.31 | rhqq | furrywolf: mine boots in 2s to full gnome+all-the services |
| 04:00.42 | Lydia_K | The box with an SSD I built for our interactive table boots so fast you don't even see the boot messages |
| 04:00.45 | Lydia_K | sysvinit |
| 04:00.48 | Lydia_K | devuan actually |
| 04:01.04 | rhqq | well, my old laptop, archlinux before systemd was ~10, after was ~5 |
| 04:01.09 | Lydia_K | I was all preped to cover the boot messages and stuff, then it wasn't necessary at all. |
| 04:01.34 | rhqq | still, its just something that pseudo-techie people care about |
| 04:01.43 | rhqq | and thats what makes them `into` linux |
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| 04:01.54 | Lydia_K | I'll leave courting pseudo-techie people to the downstream distros |
| 04:02.10 | Lydia_K | ubuntu is a downsteam distro of debian |
| 04:02.18 | Lydia_K | ubuntu was (is?) very popular |
| 04:02.22 | rhqq | then you'll have only devs/maintainers here who are going to fade in time. anyways, im not here to shot you down or whatever |
| 04:02.24 | Lydia_K | moreso than debian proper |
| 04:02.47 | rhqq | im just looking for an alternative to my current setup that will not be waste of time in a perspective of next 5 years |
| 04:03.07 | Lydia_K | what do you mean by that? |
| 04:03.13 | Lydia_K | "in a perspective of next 5 years" ? |
| 04:03.42 | rhqq | my laptop is a workhorse, i cant afford having it "broken" or in "needs fixing" state for any time |
| 04:05.25 | rhqq | im kinda probing the community now, testing the waters, name it. point is that i'd like to be sure that system im going to chose is going to be alive enough to keep up with updates in a couple years from now |
| 04:05.48 | Lydia_K | devuan isn't going away, but it's still in it's early birthing in a sense. |
| 04:05.59 | Lydia_K | It's nearly at a 1.0 release, but there's a lot to do. |
| 04:06.23 | Lydia_K | that's my honest opinion there. |
| 04:06.54 | Lydia_K | Depending on your skill level, I've been using devuan since early alpha, more than a year, on both my work desktop and laptop. |
| 04:07.03 | Lydia_K | which are my workhorses, the machines I use everyday. |
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| 04:12.53 | minnesotags | rhqq, I have been using devuan on my laptop for the last two years without significant incident. Five years from now? On a laptop? You have got to be kidding, right? Five years ago this laptop had WinXP on it. |
| 04:13.39 | minnesotags | I mean, honestly. Five years has to be a joke. |
| 04:14.35 | rhqq | im using linux for over a decade now, in most cases i've been rsyncing my entire drives |
| 04:14.58 | Lydia_K | I've been using linux for 15+ years now. |
| 04:16.22 | rhqq | just answering to minnesotags |
| 04:17.42 | minnesotags | rhqq; then you should know as well as anyone that you can rsync whatever you need going forward, even if you use a Devuan install. |
| 04:18.05 | rhqq | rsync everything, that means my etc and stuff, that means i cant do this |
| 04:18.23 | minnesotags | In fact, I rsync things between Debian and Devuan distros on a daily basis. |
| 04:18.58 | rhqq | point is if im to switch to another system, that is obviously going to consume some time to approach all the small issues, i want to pick a system that is going to stay popular enough to not die. |
| 04:19.28 | rhqq | im not a fan of fixing shit over and over. my laptop has to be stable as macs used to be 5 years ago |
| 04:19.47 | minnesotags | Why, and or how could you or would you ever rsync /etc between a virtual machine server and a 5 year laptop? |
| 04:20.03 | rhqq | eh, i guess i wasnt clear enough |
| 04:20.11 | rhqq | from old laptop to new laptop only |
| 04:21.39 | minnesotags | Ok. Why and or how or why would you ever rsync /etc between a Centrino Duo laptop with a crap old hard drive and video card and audio, and a touch screen laptop with i7 and 24gb or ram and an ssd drive? |
| 04:22.15 | rhqq | yeah, you should have used example with amd k6 ;) |
| 04:22.17 | minnesotags | Because that is what happens when you go up in 5 years of lap top evolution. |
| 04:22.39 | rhqq | sandybridge -> broadwell was totally painless if you ask me |
| 04:23.08 | rhqq | ymmv though |
| 04:24.21 | minnesotags | This laptop is an old Centrino vpro2, it had Vista. Then it had wheezy, now it has Devuan Jessie. I've used it for at least two years. When I move on, I will be happy to do a new install and just swap files. |
| 04:25.12 | minnesotags | In fact, I will look forward to a fresh install, without all sorts of config file crust. |
| 04:25.36 | rhqq | well, with archlinux i never had this issue, find / -name *pacnew and |
| 04:25.39 | rhqq | you're good to go |
| 04:26.13 | minnesotags | And, I won't have to learn all new syntax for setting up a network or drivers or cron or anything else, because I never surrendered that to systemd. |
| 04:26.44 | minnesotags | Well, then you should use arch and good for you. Go with God. |
| 04:27.11 | rhqq | well, i have good old syslog, cron, and network manager as i used to use pre-systemd so no new syntax to me either. and again, i do want to leave systemd, i wouldnt be here otherwise, right? |
| 04:27.32 | rhqq | but i guess thats what happens when you try to find new home. old users are assholes ;) |
| 04:28.20 | minnesotags | When you call them assholes, then yes they will treat you in just that way. Has that been effective for you in the past? |
| 04:28.23 | rhqq | and then another flavor of linux just stays niche |
| 04:28.47 | minnesotags | Oh please. |
| 04:28.48 | rhqq | well, i came here with questions and actual arguments. |
| 04:29.16 | minnesotags | Why did you come with arguments, rather than an open mind? |
| 04:29.18 | rhqq | and experience i have, what i've been given back is 'go back to your sandbox, with god' |
| 04:29.38 | rhqq | because i have my own requirements. system is not a toy, its a tool to me |
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| 04:30.01 | rhqq | it has to address my own personal needs, not just enrlarge my virtual weewee |
| 04:30.06 | minnesotags | You probably don't understand that we have been battling systemd trolls for three years on this channel, right? |
| 04:30.32 | Lydia_K | whoa whoa, calm the fuck down around here. |
| 04:30.42 | rhqq | listen, if i was given an opprotunity to use a time machine in my life, id use it to go back in time and kill lennart |
| 04:30.50 | golinux | thinks rhqq is a reincarnation of the neo42 troll |
| 04:31.02 | minnesotags | Look, rhqq. This is the development channel for systemd. The anything goes channel is debianfork. |
| 04:31.14 | Lydia_K | rhqq, minnesotags is right, we've had a surprising amount of systemd troll come to harass us and nothing else, so forgive if we are a bit on edge when people get sharp |
| 04:31.46 | Lydia_K | But we have good reason for it, some people make it their mission to fuck with us for no other reason than they don't like what we are doing, and you can understand how that starts to really piss us off after a while |
| 04:31.51 | golinux | these trolls are all singing from the same hymnal, |
| 04:31.52 | minnesotags | rhqq; take your philosophical arguments to debianfork. |
| 04:32.03 | Lydia_K | we are building what we want, if you don't want it, then there are lots of different options, but this is what we want. |
| 04:32.23 | golinux | Even using the same exact words. So maybe one user with different accounts. Dunno |
| 04:32.30 | rhqq | ... |
| 04:33.35 | rhqq | yeah, i guess you had quite a harsh past with trols |
| 04:34.17 | golinux | and present! Please move this convo to #debianfork. It has no place in this channel |
| 04:35.11 | minnesotags | What golinux said. |
| 04:35.33 | Lydia_K | golinux is right, this channel is for development talk. |
| 04:35.42 | rhqq | then change your topic |
| 04:35.52 | rhqq | it sais `devuan discussion channel` ;) |
| 04:36.27 | minnesotags | How you are treated is offtopic. |
| 04:37.29 | minnesotags | I'm sure there is a channel to take your complaints to. |
| 04:37.39 | rhqq | yeah, /dev/null ;) |
| 04:38.05 | Lydia_K | LOL |
| 04:38.26 | minnesotags | That's one choice. Linux is about choice. |
| 04:38.29 | *** mode/#devuan [+o golinux] by ChanServ |
| 04:38.40 | Lydia_K | divirsity in the ecosystem! |
| 04:38.47 | Lydia_K | anywho, I'll shut up now. |
| 04:38.48 | rhqq | because its you who started putting ridiculus embolded examples as trolling my actual questions |
| 04:39.28 | minnesotags | :'(:'(:'( |
| 04:39.43 | Lydia_K | we've had to deal with a lot of trolls and you started to sound like them, not saying you are, but understand why people might have a reaction to that. |
| 04:39.44 | rhqq | then accused me for off-topic, after starting it on your own. gratz |
| 04:40.06 | golinux | lifts the ban hammer |
| 04:40.08 | Lydia_K | People get upset that we are doing what we are doing. |
| 04:40.31 | Lydia_K | just because they want everyone to agree with them. |
| 04:40.41 | rhqq | i understand, i wouldnt be here otherwise |
| 04:40.48 | golinux | Lydia_K: You're not helping |
| 04:41.08 | minnesotags | I said, and I will say again, that it is a ridiculous expectation that you can just rsync your /etc/ between dist-upgrade after dist-upgrade and different hardware because... I have no fucking idea why because. |
| 04:41.10 | Lydia_K | Sorry. |
| 04:42.20 | rhqq | if you keep your system up-to-date all the time, there's nommuch difference other than hardware, and if you pick hardware with enough care you can just simply replug the harddrive and run same system on new hardware too |
| 04:42.31 | rhqq | and i was curious whether i'll be able to do so with devuan |
| 04:42.35 | minnesotags | Because otherwise Devuan is "not viable"? How fucking ridiculous is that? If you can, or want to, or did, do that in Archlinux, and that is your measure of perfection, then hey, MOZOLTOV! |
| 04:43.16 | minnesotags | I am sure that you "could". WHY WOULD YOU EVER? |
| 04:43.52 | rhqq | because of time and effort? i have a handfull of different services that are configured and i'm not in a mood to re-configure them over and over with every new system i install |
| 04:43.53 | minnesotags | Because again, it is a damn unrealistic expectation of Devuan as a distribution. |
| 04:44.41 | minnesotags | rhqq; here is a test, take that exact same requirement to debianuser. See how far you get. |
| 04:45.02 | minnesotags | See how cordially your request is handled. |
| 04:45.08 | golinux | minnesotags: You're not helping either |
| 04:45.17 | minnesotags | No. I'm grumpy. |
| 04:45.26 | golinux | You're always grumpy |
| 04:45.32 | minnesotags | Yes. |
| 04:45.38 | minnesotags | I have a thorn in my paw |
| 04:45.51 | minnesotags | That's not entirely true. |
| 04:46.14 | *** mode/#devuan [-o golinux] by golinux |
| 04:46.44 | minnesotags | I am deeply appreciative of the people who positively move forward the project. |
| 04:47.02 | minnesotags | And, I also donate server resources. |
| 04:47.33 | rhqq | so what, when you deny the fact people have different requirements, hence discouraging other people from using it |
| 04:47.44 | minnesotags | Which translates to $$$ out of my pocket. |
| 04:48.36 | Lydia_K | paw? |
| 04:48.46 | rhqq | anyways, not gonna offtop here anymore, itspointless, /dev/null has more of an understanding ;) |
| 04:48.55 | minnesotags | I'm not discouraging you, I'm saying they are unrealistic to expect as a requirement of a distro. |
| 04:49.09 | golinux | Goodby rhqq |
| 04:49.12 | rhqq | well, it works well with arch, that means it is doable |
| 04:49.28 | rhqq | have fun with trolls though :S |
| 04:49.38 | minnesotags | Already do. |
| 04:53.04 | twotwenty | guixsd |
| 04:53.08 | minnesotags | Honestly though, if the requirement is to rsync your /etc, then why even upgrade your your distribution at all? It is working, don't upgrade. Boom. Simple. |
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| 08:23.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | what was that? |
| 08:25.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | wouldn't a "this is Devuan. Devuan is about getting rid of systemd (so far), nothing else, nothing beyond. For other features please ask debian!" have done? |
| 08:26.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | rsync /etc/, my ass |
| 08:26.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | since etc/ is the one dir that's supposed to be *identical* between all distros and all releases |
| 08:28.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | I wish I could rsync /etc/ from one box to another when they use the same distro |
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| 09:20.28 | anigma_ | Howdy. I'm following dev1fanboy's minimal install guide on https://git.devuan.org/dev1fanboy/Upgrade-Install-Devuan/wikis/Minimal-install-guide and I chroot can't seem to execute /bin/sh because there is no such file or directory. What gives? /bin/sh is obviously available. |
| 09:21.24 | anigma_ | perhaps /bin/sh should be available inside the jail? |
| 09:31.07 | anigma_ | Looks like I had to mount-bind /bin, /lib and /lib64 |
| 09:33.14 | anigma_ | great, dpkg does not seem to be included... |
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| 10:23.39 | paradigm | Lydia_K: may be worth noting that Bedrock Linux's usage of chroots is more a means to the end than the actual selling point. It's like describing Devuan as a distro based on a kernel written primarily in C - accurate, but, missing Devuan's defining feature. I'd be more inclined to describe Bedrock Linux as a distro which lets you use packages from a variety of distros, mostly simultaneously and transpar |
| 10:23.44 | paradigm | ently. If you want to describe *how* it does that, then sure - definitely mention chroot() (along with pivot_root, bind mounts, FUSE filesystems, etc) |
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| 11:34.46 | rrq | fsmithred: I have problems with r8_i386_vdev_usb-hdd.img |
| 11:35.06 | fsmithred | hi, what's up? |
| 11:35.16 | rrq | it appears the squashfs lacks its libc6 |
| 11:35.32 | fsmithred | ? |
| 11:35.55 | fsmithred | that would have to happen in making the original iso |
| 11:36.38 | rrq | it has two links /lib/i386-linux-gnu/i686/cmov/libc.so.6 -> libc-2.19.so |
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| 11:36.52 | rrq | and /lib/i386-linux-gnu/libc.so.6 -> libc-2.19.so |
| 11:37.08 | rrq | but no libc-2.19.so anywhere |
| 11:37.10 | fsmithred | I'll fire it up and look. |
| 11:39.03 | fsmithred | you booted read-only? |
| 11:39.36 | rrq | doesn't boot; kernel panic because /bin/sh needs its libc6 |
| 11:39.48 | rrq | all options |
| 11:40.14 | fsmithred | boots here |
| 11:40.18 | rrq | hmm |
| 11:40.29 | fsmithred | check md5sum? |
| 11:40.51 | rrq | I peeked into the squasfs via loopback |
| 11:43.27 | rrq | hmm img has 8392eada80c06b9ef4c5ee065bd8de43 which differs... |
| 11:43.43 | fsmithred | yeah, that's not right |
| 11:44.03 | fsmithred | and I've got a real libc-2.19.so here, booted ro |
| 11:44.39 | rrq | I downloaded http://www.filedropper.com/r8i386vdevusb-hdd |
| 11:44.55 | fsmithred | that looks like the right link |
| 11:45.03 | fsmithred | guess I should try downloading it |
| 11:45.22 | rrq | and it unpacks sensibly. hmm |
| 11:46.01 | rrq | includes file pkglist_r8_i386_vdev_test-20160907_2038 |
| 11:46.16 | fsmithred | yeah |
| 11:46.18 | rrq | sorry dir |
| 11:46.32 | fsmithred | refractasnapshot creates that file |
| 11:46.40 | fsmithred | dir and file |
| 11:46.48 | fsmithred | package list |
| 11:47.23 | rrq | file size of img is 965738496 |
| 11:48.26 | fsmithred | 965738496 |
| 11:49.05 | fsmithred | unfortunately, I have no way to check the md5sum on the server |
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| 11:51.16 | fsmithred | wow, I can't download it |
| 11:51.46 | rrq | I had o go to the URL anew to get a new dowload button |
| 11:52.41 | rrq | flooding me at 80KB/s .... |
| 11:52.50 | fsmithred | ouch |
| 11:52.53 | fsmithred | hi edbarx |
| 11:53.37 | fsmithred | omg, the 'activate adobe flash' window was hidden among the ads on the side. No wonder I didn't see it. |
| 11:56.40 | fsmithred | omg, finally, google-apis showed up in the noscript list |
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| 11:58.57 | fsmithred | getting good download speed here |
| 11:59.02 | rrq | I must have done something wrong. I can chroot into the squashfs |
| 11:59.23 | fsmithred | unpacked or still squashed?? |
| 11:59.26 | rrq | and now I see /lib/i386-linux-gnu/i686/cmov/libc-2.19.so |
| 11:59.49 | rrq | sorry; unpacked the image and loopbacked the squashfs |
| 11:59.55 | fsmithred | ok |
| 12:00.22 | fsmithred | still the issue of wrong md5sum |
| 12:00.51 | fsmithred | hm, would a zsync file be able to fix that for you? |
| 12:00.56 | rrq | yes ... and my kernel panics trying to use it ... under qemu |
| 12:01.21 | rrq | I don't have a toy baremetal |
| 12:01.38 | fsmithred | was that a yes to the zsync? |
| 12:02.11 | rrq | missed that question. yes was to md5sum problem |
| 12:02.19 | fsmithred | oh |
| 12:02.39 | fsmithred | I could make a zsync file, but I don't know if that would fix the file you downloaded |
| 12:02.49 | fsmithred | idea being not to download the whole thing again |
| 12:03.20 | rrq | I'm currently downloding again, but some cable is clogged somwhere so it'll be an hour or so |
| 12:03.56 | fsmithred | oh, I proabbly can't make a proper zsync anyway - I don't have a direct link to the file, just to their stupid download page. |
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| 12:05.09 | fsmithred | brb |
| 12:19.06 | edbarx | fsmithred: succeeded to set lower brightness. I have just ordered a new computer. Your image will come handy to test it. |
| 12:19.58 | fsmithred | great, thanks |
| 12:20.58 | fsmithred | I also made a usb disk image with a persistent partition, so testing can be done from live usb and changes can be saved |
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| 12:28.03 | rrq | I'm now trying qemu with -usbdevice .. and it's awfully slow; been loading the initrd for a minute or more |
| 12:29.02 | rrq | previoulsy I had the img as a disk. which ran faster ut ended in panic. |
| 12:29.08 | rrq | b |
| 12:32.25 | rrq | same panic. last 24 lines begin with: starting init: /bin/sh exists but couldn't execute it (error -20) |
| 12:33.38 | fsmithred | what qemu options you using? |
| 12:35.45 | rrq | qemu-system-i386 -enable-kvm -machine type=pc-i440fx-2.5 -cpu Broadwell -smp cpus=2 |
| 12:36.05 | rrq | ... then disk etc |
| 12:37.32 | rrq | you want all options? |
| 12:38.01 | fsmithred | hang on, I'll show you what I'm using |
| 12:38.14 | fsmithred | qemu-system-i386 -enable-kvm -m 320 -drive file=r8_i386_vdev_usb-hdd.img |
| 12:40.19 | rrq | ok ... I do have both "-drive file=(blank disk)" and "-drive=r8....img" plus a network device as well |
| 12:40.32 | rrq | I'll try it as only disk |
| 12:45.54 | rrq | hah.. it was too little RAM |
| 12:46.43 | fsmithred | oh |
| 12:47.20 | rrq | default is 128 MB |
| 12:47.29 | fsmithred | oh, that's not enough |
| 12:48.01 | fsmithred | 256 will work, as long as you don't open a browser |
| 12:49.14 | rrq | fair enough. I gave it 1G |
| 12:49.51 | fsmithred | I'm planning to install 1.2 today. Right now trying to figure out which partition can be wiped. I lost track of all the installations. |
| 12:50.38 | rrq | and right: the md5sum problem... |
| 12:51.18 | rrq | my second download is at 257 MB so far |
| 12:52.08 | rrq | will be tomorrow here before it's done |
| 12:52.49 | fsmithred | wow. all the relays down there are solar powered and go off at night? |
| 12:54.35 | rrq | yeah I don't know where the choking is but it appears to be held at about 80 KB/s |
| 12:55.11 | fsmithred | it's not the server. I got more than 1M down. |
| 12:57.44 | rrq | anyhow I'll let it go on. I suppose you reconfirmed the md5sum already. |
| 12:59.56 | rrq | oh. my fault again I think... I md5sum-ed the disk image after having tried booting it in rw mode |
| 13:00.35 | rrq | when I checked the original download copy it has the right md5sum |
| 13:02.21 | rrq | so all in all, I learnt that size matters. |
| 13:02.30 | fsmithred | lol |
| 13:03.55 | fsmithred | oh! It never occurred to me that you could change the disk image in qemu. Makes sense, though. |
| 13:04.12 | fsmithred | yeah, I checked the sum on the download and it's fine. |
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| 13:05.23 | rrq | I was clever enough to copy the image before using it, but not clever enough to look at the original when checking. |
| 13:07.16 | fsmithred | lol, that's ok, I thought my sdcard was dead the other day, and when I went to test it in a second laptop, I found the real sd card where the blank one should have been. |
| 13:11.50 | rrq | now: the first boot option leaves me with 2 running toplevel vdevd processes |
| 13:13.21 | rrq | (which is not right) |
| 13:14.59 | fsmithred | there should be more? |
| 13:16.33 | rrq | only one "top level", which is parent to dome daemonlet and vdevd forks. check with pstree |
| 13:17.04 | rrq | it should be aa single vdevd branch |
| 13:18.33 | fsmithred | does that mean it started twice? |
| 13:18.53 | fsmithred | I see what you're talking about |
| 13:19.30 | rrq | yes starting twice gives two branches |
| 13:20.48 | fsmithred | I'm rebooting into the system used for making that image |
| 13:21.58 | fsmithred | two |
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| 13:26.14 | fsmithred | ok, first vdevd runs when my init-wrapper script runs |
| 13:26.23 | fsmithred | second one runs when /sbin/init runs |
| 13:26.52 | fsmithred | boot entry has init=/sbin/init-vdev |
| 13:27.49 | fsmithred | init-vdev starts /etc/init.d/vdev and then starts /sbin/init |
| 13:28.21 | fsmithred | did I miss an rc link? |
| 13:28.38 | rrq | it has S03vdev |
| 13:28.53 | fsmithred | yeah, i thought I deleted that |
| 13:29.49 | rrq | ok I'll have a play and a beauty sleep and see where it gets me |
| 13:30.21 | fsmithred | I think the iso with openbox does not have this problem |
| 13:30.53 | rrq | bbl |
| 13:30.58 | fsmithred | bye |
| 13:38.24 | fsmithred | S03vdev is in the iso, too. shit. |
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| 14:23.16 | golinux | fsmithred: My md5sum was correct. But from reading the scrollback, it seems there is still a problem and I may need to dl again? |
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| 14:43.41 | fsmithred | golinux, I'm working on new images, but for the usb there's an easy workaround |
| 14:44.01 | fsmithred | brb |
| 14:45.12 | golinux | I thought I'd try it in qemu first. |
| 14:47.46 | fsmithred | it will boot in qemu. Kinda useless there for checking devices. |
| 14:48.05 | fsmithred | anyway, I forgot to remove a symlink in /etc/rcS.d/ |
| 14:48.34 | fsmithred | it can be deleted when you boot in persistent mode |
| 14:49.18 | fsmithred | don't use persistent in qemu, please. |
| 14:49.26 | fsmithred | or make a backup copy of the image first. |
| 14:55.10 | Lydia_K | Interesting point. |
| 14:59.12 | fsmithred | which? |
| 14:59.47 | Lydia_K | Whoops, wrong channel |
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| 15:51.59 | fsmithred | All 20 of you who downloaded the jessie_ob_vdev iso dated 09/06 might want to download the replacement iso, dated 09/08. https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/experimental/ |
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| 17:15.49 | robert-e | fsmithred: d/l'd todays new image..will try it live in the thinkpad around lunch time..I forgot to tell you: vdev seems to increment the device name each time a flash drive is mounted,..keeps the old name(d) ones. |
| 17:16.29 | robert-e | fsmithred: even tho they were unmounted. |
| 17:16.56 | fsmithred | robert-e, couple of things |
| 17:17.05 | robert-e | fsmithred: later; chores to do, and then lunch. |
| 17:17.10 | fsmithred | yeah, it increments the scanner device, too |
| 17:17.31 | fsmithred | and you can't install the wireless debs, because they can't find the stock initrd.img |
| 17:17.48 | robert-e | fsmithred: ok, thanks for all your efforts. |
| 17:17.49 | fsmithred | if you install to hard drive, you can then install them |
| 17:18.15 | fsmithred | there's a usb-hdd image that has a more complete system - xfce and more graphical apps |
| 17:18.50 | robert-e | bbl |
| 17:18.57 | fsmithred | link to that image is in the README (or read the bottom of the page) |
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| 20:55.42 | minnesotags | DocScrutinizer05; I think if you were counting on doing rsync /etc with different package versions of samba, apache2 (2.2 to 2.4 for example), etc, you would be hating life. |
| 20:56.07 | minnesotags | And that would have nothing to do with the distribution itself. |
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| 20:57.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | of course |
| 20:57.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 20:57.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | my point |
| 20:58.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | and particularly has nothing to do with Devuan |
| 20:59.09 | minnesotags | Exactly. |
| 20:59.26 | minnesotags | Yup |
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