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| 00:34.01 | xxadversaryxx | glad i found this |
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| 00:34.07 | xxadversaryxx | hello all |
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| 01:03.44 | specing | Is there a guide on installing devuan via debootstrap? |
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| 01:34.43 | specing | Can the i686 netinstall also install amd64 devuan? If so, why would even be an amd64 netinstall when the i686 one is smaller and more general? |
| 01:34.50 | specing | i386* |
| 01:40.02 | specing | there even be* meh, why am I always missing letters and whole words.. |
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| 02:07.18 | gnarface | specing: debootstrap should work the same as debian. just use the devuan repos instead. i don't know if the debootstrap in debian has been actually patched to work for devuan yet though. |
| 02:08.10 | gnarface | (and the reason that there is a separate i386 and amd64 netinstall iso is because your primary stated assumption is wrong) |
| 02:10.06 | xrogaan | I used it successfully |
| 02:10.21 | xrogaan | wait no |
| 02:10.29 | specing | I only worry that I'll forget to apply some step that the installer does and be left with a half-broken system |
| 02:10.51 | gnarface | xrogaan: debootstrap from debian? i know it was broken at one point. there was a patch, but i don't know how far it's propogated, if it even made it to debian stable or not |
| 02:10.52 | specing | so I'll do the proper install but then just copy the install to the existing ssd |
| 02:11.04 | gnarface | xrogaan: i think it was a simple change though |
| 02:11.07 | xrogaan | I forgot how I built my chroot |
| 02:11.29 | Xenguy | could never grok chroot for some reason... |
| 02:11.34 | xrogaan | probably debootstrap |
| 02:11.36 | fsmithred | specing, you can use a refracta iso to debootstrap devuan |
| 02:11.42 | fsmithred | there are instructions in the home dir |
| 02:11.48 | gnarface | specing: usually what goes wrong for people is they forget to install the kernel and grub |
| 02:11.51 | specing | fsmithred: I can do the bootstrap from Gentoo as well |
| 02:12.00 | specing | fsmithred: but there is value in the installer itself |
| 02:12.01 | fsmithred | have you tried it? |
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| 02:12.06 | specing | fsmithred: no |
| 02:12.26 | fsmithred | I know we had to patch debootstrap to get it to work with devuan. I don't know what gentoo has. |
| 02:12.43 | xrogaan | debootstrap 1.0.89-devuan2.1 |
| 02:12.51 | xrogaan | the version has devuan in it |
| 02:12.59 | fsmithred | cool |
| 02:13.23 | fsmithred | I usually forget to set a root password |
| 02:13.32 | specing | Gentoo has debootstrap-1.0.114 from debian |
| 02:14.01 | fsmithred | xrogaan, were you listing a package from gentoo or devuan? |
| 02:14.25 | xrogaan | the one I have on this machine, so devuan |
| 02:14.32 | xrogaan | from ascii |
| 02:14.39 | fsmithred | oh |
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| 02:20.55 | furrywolf | how's the current usability of testing? |
| 02:21.45 | fsmithred | pretty usable from what I can see |
| 02:22.17 | fsmithred | upgrade from ascii last week went smoothly |
| 02:23.05 | furrywolf | I'm thinking of switching to my other laptop as my main box, which has ascii on it, but I'd like newer versions of a number of things... |
| 02:23.51 | fsmithred | if any of those things are packages we change, check to see if they're done |
| 02:24.09 | furrywolf | applications, not system stuff. freecad, etc. |
| 02:24.10 | fsmithred | the policykit stuff is working, but you don't use any of that, do you? |
| 02:24.25 | furrywolf | it got installed, but I don't know if or how I use it. heh. |
| 02:24.41 | furrywolf | maybe I should just run frankendevuan.... |
| 02:25.02 | fsmithred | you're on icewm? |
| 02:25.31 | fsmithred | with or without display manager? |
| 02:26.29 | furrywolf | icewm, don't remember what display manager. |
| 02:26.52 | furrywolf | it's not the default one, because the default one didnt have the ability to select sessions properly, which was fucking idiotic. |
| 02:27.00 | furrywolf | turns it on and checks |
| 02:27.42 | fsmithred | F1 in slim toggles through the list |
| 02:28.26 | fsmithred | most of them have a place to click for a list |
| 02:29.20 | furrywolf | using lightdm now |
| 02:30.40 | fsmithred | so yeah, you're probably using policykit and consolekit. |
| 02:30.44 | furrywolf | I don't remember what the original dm was (this is a fairly old install)... slim doesn't sound familiar. whatever it was wouldn't remember the last choice, and other issues. |
| 02:30.58 | furrywolf | I gave up on making it useful and replaced it. |
| 02:31.09 | fsmithred | me too |
| 02:32.03 | furrywolf | is there a way to pull specific packages from testing by specifying the release name instead of the package version? |
| 02:32.30 | furrywolf | i.e. tell it to install freecad from testing, and update it whenever testing has a new version, not hold it at the version you specify? |
| 02:32.34 | fsmithred | yeah, I think that would work, but it might break stuff |
| 02:32.40 | fsmithred | better to backport it |
| 02:33.08 | furrywolf | I've been frankening debian for a while, not too much breaks if you do that... but I've always done it by installing foo=1.2.3, which means it won't automatically upgrade it. |
| 02:33.11 | fsmithred | you can mix testing and unstable, but mixing stable and testing is risky |
| 02:34.00 | fsmithred | yeah, you can get away with it for some stuff |
| 02:34.26 | fsmithred | sometimes only for a short time |
| 02:35.05 | fsmithred | try backporting it. Some things build easily. |
| 02:35.10 | furrywolf | so, accepting that risk, is there a way to specify "foo from testing" rather than "foo version 1.2.3"? |
| 02:35.48 | fsmithred | apt-get -t beowulf install foo |
| 02:36.21 | fsmithred | apt-cache policy foo |
| 02:36.26 | fsmithred | to see available versions |
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| 02:39.50 | furrywolf | debian really needs a button for "I built this from source", not a process... |
| 02:40.37 | fsmithred | more likely it would be an obscure command |
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| 02:51.17 | furrywolf | grrr, more menu stupidity... alsamixergui is in neither menu system. |
| 02:51.43 | furrywolf | rather than just removing systemd, can we entirely un-freedesktop debian? :P |
| 02:51.51 | furrywolf | I want an OS without a single thing they've touched. |
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| 02:54.24 | furrywolf | sits on golinux so she stops bouncing around |
| 03:02.38 | specing | If I were to document how to install on btrfs, should I make a new thread or hijack this one https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=2175 ? |
| 03:05.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | furrywolf: great, it helped :-) |
| 03:06.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | furrywolf: un-FD great idea |
| 03:07.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | indeed it seems freedesktop is the root of all evil |
| 03:12.29 | specing | it offers me two kernel images: linux-image-4.9.0-6-amd64 and linux-image-amd64 |
| 03:12.34 | specing | which should I pick? |
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| 03:12.55 | specing | Something tells me the second one is just an alias for the first one |
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| 03:19.38 | furrywolf | damnit, after a reboot my volume control keys no longer work |
| 03:19.52 | furrywolf | and I don't remember what I did like six months ago to make them work |
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| 03:28.38 | furrywolf | ah. because I accidentally dragged in pulse while installing something. and now my audio has crackles and my keys don't work. and then I removed pulse, and now my audio sounds right and my keys work again. |
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| 03:31.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | wow, that easy |
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| 03:32.47 | furrywolf | how can pulse suck so badly, and distros include it? |
| 03:34.38 | furrywolf | oh, completely unrelated, but I made glib1.2, gtk1.2, and xmms compile on current gcc. should we package those? :) |
| 03:35.01 | furrywolf | glib was the only real task, as it used macros that don't work past gcc3.3.... |
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| 03:37.06 | furrywolf | also needed to replace one of the configure files, as 64-bit targets didn't exist when they were written, and it couldn't id the system... |
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| 04:11.46 | Centurion_Dan | o/ |
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| 04:12.40 | Centurion_Dan | KatolaZ: Just had a report of a bare metal install of Devuan on TalosII with amd graphics!!! \o/ |
| 04:14.23 | golinux | Nice! |
| 04:15.32 | furrywolf | its Talos IV you really have to watch out for. |
| 04:15.37 | furrywolf | it's |
| 04:16.47 | golinux | is a trekkie |
| 04:17.37 | furrywolf | do you have rubber ears? :) |
| 04:18.06 | golinux | Actually I did have a pair many years ago |
| 04:18.30 | golinux | We're way OT |
| 04:18.47 | furrywolf | somehow I can imagine you pointing out that emotions are irrelevant... :P |
| 04:19.26 | golinux | to #debianfork |
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| 04:43.04 | gnarface | specing: yes, linux-image-amd64 just points to the current one. if you install it then you'll get kernel updates automatically, otherwise you have to pick them up manually |
| 04:43.43 | gnarface | (by that i mean, you'll get kernel updates along with regular package updates) |
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| 04:54.37 | JollyRoger` | Ahoy shipmates! Yarr harr, I be confirmin' Devuan Ceres ppc64le now be smoothly sailin' with a full desktop experience on the POWER9 Talos II, oo-arr! Splice the mainbrace! |
| 04:54.56 | Centurion_Dan | ^^ |
| 04:55.05 | JollyRoger` | P.-D |
| 04:55.16 | JollyRoger` | A screenshot be comin' shortly! |
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| 05:00.07 | furrywolf | doesn't think it's talk like a pirate day... |
| 05:01.33 | JollyRoger` | For me, just about every day is talk like a pirate day :P. |
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| 06:22.12 | KatolaZ | Centurion_Dan: great news :) |
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| 06:39.09 | Centurion_Dan | And even firefox works - that surporised us a bit ... |
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| 07:08.14 | tyil | I have a VPS that I can boot into a rescue system, can I get a tarball of a base Devuan install to unpack into the VPS' harddrive to make it a bootable Devuan system (and if yes, where can I find this tarball)? |
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| 07:11.42 | gnarface | tyil: check into debootstrap |
| 07:12.55 | tyil | I know that tool from Debian, but how can I get it from Devuan from a random rescue system? I can't boot the VPS from a Devuan installer ISO |
| 07:14.07 | gnarface | how did you boot it from the rescue system? |
| 07:14.36 | gnarface | can you boot a live iso with it? |
| 07:15.58 | gnarface | you could probably just copy the binaries |
| 07:16.20 | gnarface | i don't think debootstrap has a lot of dependencies |
| 07:16.39 | gnarface | if you're that determined, you can in fact probably just unpack the deb files from the installer manually |
| 07:17.22 | gnarface | but if you can't boot the VPS with an arbitrary ISO, i have doubts you'll be able to make any snapshot tarball boot either |
| 07:17.30 | tyil | there's an option to boot a rescue system, which gets me grml (which I haven't heard of before), and options to install Ubuntu, Debian or CentOS |
| 07:17.48 | gnarface | which debian? |
| 07:18.11 | tyil | 7 or 8 |
| 07:18.20 | tyil | oh, also a 9 |
| 07:18.47 | gnarface | all 3 of those should successfully upgrade to devuan after install |
| 07:18.53 | gnarface | so that's an option too |
| 07:18.57 | gnarface | maybe the easiest one |
| 07:18.58 | tyil | ah, then that may be easier :p |
| 07:19.03 | gnarface | definitely easier, probably slower |
| 07:19.25 | tyil | I was looking for a similar way as Gentoo, to just get a base system tarball, untar it into the root partition and set up a bootloader |
| 07:19.33 | tyil | eh, I'm not in a particular hurry |
| 07:19.51 | gnarface | i just don't know if such a tarball is laying around anywhere for devuan |
| 07:19.51 | tyil | I'm just looking to try out a non-systemd distro for my kubernetes minions |
| 07:20.01 | tyil | I don't know either, hence I asked :) |
| 07:20.58 | gnarface | of ot |
| 07:21.01 | gnarface | *if it'll |
| 07:21.24 | gnarface | ... let you do a minimal install, then it shouldn't take much longer to install debian then upgrade to devuan |
| 07:21.33 | gnarface | most the packages are the same |
| 07:21.55 | gnarface | that worked for me on one VPS i was renting somewhere |
| 07:22.15 | gnarface | no guarantees though, VPSes aren't all the same |
| 07:24.26 | furrymcgee | I dont know how to use a bootloader in a vps. you can try to scp, mount and debootstrap the iso image then chroot into the debootstrap directory. no reboot required for chroot and it will use same kernel. |
| 07:25.31 | gnarface | it depends on the type of VPS |
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| 07:26.07 | gnarface | some of them don't even use a bootloader and will just ignore whatever you install |
| 07:26.18 | gnarface | for them, usually the kernel is actually the host's kernel version whatever you install too |
| 07:26.36 | gnarface | but if it's not too different of a kernel version usually that'll still work |
| 07:27.25 | gnarface | other VPS software will mimic a whole physical machine for the guest, boot sectors and all |
| 07:27.44 | gnarface | for that stuff, it might just come down to version compatibility and permission from the host system |
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| 08:01.10 | tyil | gnarface: I'll try it out, thanks :) |
| 08:01.28 | gnarface | good luck |
| 08:01.35 | gnarface | do you know what type of VPS it even is? |
| 08:01.54 | gnarface | at some point, you're gonna want to know |
| 08:16.03 | tyil | gnarface: a vps with 1gb ram, 40gb hdd, 2 vCPU cores |
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| 08:16.12 | tyil | or well, 40 gb ssd storage |
| 08:16.56 | gnarface | yea, but it might matter whether it's xen or vmware or whatever |
| 08:17.01 | tyil | oh |
| 08:17.03 | tyil | kvm |
| 08:18.02 | gnarface | that one *does* mimic hardware, but also makes it possible for them to prevent you from screwing with the boot process |
| 08:18.32 | tyil | eh, we'll see what happens |
| 08:18.38 | gnarface | it depends on how they set it up and how nice they are really |
| 08:18.43 | tyil | it's not the first time playing around with a VPS in unintended ways :p |
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| 08:19.12 | gnarface | for science! |
| 08:19.24 | tyil | indeed |
| 08:19.44 | tyil | what good is a VPS if you can't have fun playing around with it after all |
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| 08:28.27 | Centurion_Dan | tyll you should be able to use a vagrant or cloud image for that too. |
| 08:28.40 | tyil | I don't like vagrant I think, I've never used it |
| 08:29.00 | tyil | it's going to be a minion for a kubernetes cluster, so I'd rather keep it rather simple and not add additional layers where it's unneeded |
| 08:29.30 | tyil | I'm trying to find an article that gives me a list of commands to run to convert debian 8/9 to devuan now |
| 08:29.58 | Centurion_Dan | or build an image to your liking in a kvm guest and then tar it up and dump it. |
| 08:30.25 | Centurion_Dan | .. on the vps. |
| 08:30.46 | tyil | sounds like a lot of effort when I can just install Debian 8/9 and run some commands to fixed it |
| 08:31.12 | tyil | I'd have to compile kvm/qemu first on my laptop to get started with setting up a kvm guest here |
| 08:33.41 | Centurion_Dan | fair enough then.. |
| 08:36.52 | gnarface | tyil: check the forum in /topic, i |
| 08:36.56 | gnarface | it's been well documented |
| 08:37.27 | tyil | gnarface: yeah, I found something by now, but I'll check the forums too, thanks! |
| 08:37.56 | gnarface | tyil: and read the release notes! |
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| 17:05.10 | specing | "The method driver /usr/lib/apt/methods/https could not be found" |
| 17:05.45 | KatolaZ | specing: what are you trying to do? |
| 17:06.08 | markizano | apt-get install apt-transport-https |
| 17:06.18 | KatolaZ | you need apt-transport https |
| 17:06.19 | KatolaZ | oh |
| 17:06.28 | KatolaZ | specing: note that deb.devua.org does *not* support https |
| 17:06.30 | specing | KatolaZ: trying to install Devuan ASCII to a qemu VM |
| 17:06.30 | markizano | comment out that https line first, and `apt-get update` to remove it from the package cache. |
| 17:06.43 | KatolaZ | please pick an HTTPS mirror from the mirror list |
| 17:06.46 | specing | KatolaZ: I'm using my reverse proxy accessed via http |
| 17:07.05 | KatolaZ | specing: then you know better than me |
| 17:07.07 | specing | and the reverse proxy goes out through https |
| 17:07.17 | KatolaZ | I don't know what your reverse_proxy does |
| 17:07.30 | specing | KatolaZ: it just pretends to be a devuan mirror |
| 17:07.46 | specing | forwarding all requests to https://ftp.fau.de and caching results |
| 17:08.07 | markizano | need to have `apt-transport-https` installed before it can connect. |
| 17:08.12 | specing | Given that this setup works for both Gentoo and Fedora, I must assume the problem is in devuan |
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| 17:08.47 | specing | and this failure happens after it had already downloaded several megabytes |
| 17:09.45 | KatolaZ | specing: does your proxy cache everything? |
| 17:09.50 | KatolaZ | or only the first requests? |
| 17:10.29 | KatolaZ | specing: note that devuan repos make a heavy use of redirects... |
| 17:10.42 | KatolaZ | (I guess I mentioned that already, but I don't remember) |
| 17:11.01 | specing | KatolaZ: when a request comes for a url, it checks if it has it in cache. If so, it checks if timestamps changed on the server and if not, uses local cache |
| 17:11.13 | markizano | specing: use the http repos to install `apt-transport-https` first, and then use the https-proxy. |
| 17:11.31 | markizano | or include that package when bootstrapping the OS with `debootstrap` |
| 17:11.33 | specing | markizano: this is a http repo |
| 17:11.47 | specing | my proxy server is only available through http, not https |
| 17:11.53 | markizano | specing: ok, so what happens after you install apt-transport-https ? |
| 17:12.26 | KatolaZ | specing: I guess you can't rely much on timestamps, due to the redirects |
| 17:12.31 | KatolaZ | but I might be wrong here |
| 17:12.47 | specing | markizano: testing |
| 17:15.34 | specing | markizano: https://linx.li/devuanerrors.png |
| 17:15.42 | specing | too many to type out |
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| 18:00.42 | specing | The forums have TLS difficulties |
| 18:03.57 | specing | I think I know what might have caused the issues |
| 18:04.13 | specing | for some reason the previous installation step was not finished |
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| 18:19.51 | specing | This is strange, installer complains of failing to download a file, yet I am tailing proxy logs and all requests get code 200 replies |
| 18:20.05 | specing | and when pressing "Retry", there is no new log entry made |
| 18:21.59 | specing | and alt+f4 says that apt-install or in-target is already running |
| 18:22.00 | specing | rip |
| 18:22.16 | specing | looks like I'll need to make another VM |
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| 18:23.32 | specing | or reformat inside the current one |
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| 18:25.38 | specing | no, reformat did not help, the live cd is busted |
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| 21:00.29 | specing | Ok, figured it out |
| 21:00.51 | specing | needed "proxy_redirect https://... /;" in nginx config |
| 21:02.46 | specing | disregard this, I only made it a bit further before hitting the issue again |
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| 21:08.03 | specing | Yes, now it fails at select&install software, apparently |
| 21:09.00 | golinux | specing: Have you seen the documentation of how amprolla does it? |
| 21:10.07 | specing | nope |
| 21:10.15 | specing | who/what is amprolla? |
| 21:10.21 | golinux | https://git.devuan.org/devuan-infrastructure/amprolla3 |
| 21:10.45 | golinux | Amprolla is how devuan sets up our repos |
| 21:12.16 | golinux | https://dev1galaxy.org/files/amprolla.png |
| 21:13.02 | specing | golinux: Secure Connection Failed |
| 21:13.03 | golinux | You might also find some hints here: https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/devuan_mirror_walkthrough.txt |
| 21:13.09 | specing | What is up with dev1galaxy.org? |
| 21:13.57 | golinux | Failed to what? d1g? |
| 21:14.10 | specing | it seems to be working now after doing what markizano suggested (installing apt-transport-https) |
| 21:14.13 | golinux | d1g is working fine here. |
| 21:14.33 | specing | golinux: An error occurred during a connection to dev1galaxy.org. SSL received a record that exceeded the maximum permissible length. Error code: SSL_ERROR_RX_RECORD_TOO_LONG |
| 21:14.53 | golinux | rrq: ^^^ |
| 21:15.25 | golinux | rrq does the backend admin for the forum |
| 21:16.13 | golinux | We do have some aggressive spam filters but don't know if that's related to your message. |
| 21:16.40 | golinux | rrq should just be waking up so be patient. |
| 21:31.04 | specing | Looks like 1.5GB for disk will not be enough for a gui-less install |
| 21:33.42 | KatolaZ | specing: what medium are you using to install? |
| 21:33.54 | KatolaZ | the base system form netinst requires about 300MB |
| 21:34.31 | KatolaZ | specing: you get to about 1GB if you selected "Console Productivity" |
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| 21:34.49 | specing | KatolaZ: $ dd if=/dev/zero of=devuan.img bs=1M count=1500 |
| 21:34.56 | specing | I selected console productivity |
| 21:35.07 | specing | Why does console productivity need 1GB? |
| 21:35.48 | KatolaZ | specing: ehm, because it installs *a lot of stuff*? |
| 21:36.30 | KatolaZ | if you want a minimal system to build upon, just skip tasksel |
| 21:36.51 | specing | too late for that :) |
| 21:36.58 | specing | or maybe in next VM |
| 21:36.58 | KatolaZ | specing: just have a look at the list of packages installed by Console Productivity |
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| 21:37.12 | specing | I'm definetely going to ruin this one smashing it into btrfs |
| 21:37.22 | specing | KatolaZ: how? |
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| 21:37.41 | specing | I'm a refugee from Gentoo, I have no idea about apt |
| 21:37.44 | KatolaZ | apt-cache show console-productivity |
| 21:38.03 | KatolaZ | console-productivity is a meta-package |
| 21:38.22 | KatolaZ | it has "Recommends:" on a whole lot of other packages |
| 21:39.25 | KatolaZ | including a lot of games, network stuff, editors, etc. |
| 21:39.42 | specing | haha, no space left on device. RIP |
| 21:40.26 | watchcat | you can turn off recommends, too. |
| 21:40.27 | specing | KatolaZ: Why aren't there more software groups? E.g. I see a lot of groups for various full blown desktop environments, but there is absolutely none for tiling |
| 21:40.57 | KatolaZ | specing: what do you need for tiling, if not just the tiling wm of your choice? |
| 21:40.59 | MinceR | my guess is tiling wm-s came too late |
| 21:41.04 | MinceR | by then debian turned into gnome os :> |
| 21:41.09 | KatolaZ | no MinceR |
| 21:41.15 | specing | gnome os haha |
| 21:41.36 | KatolaZ | actually, there is little scope to have a metapackage to just include dwm and three more packages, IMHO |
| 21:41.51 | KatolaZ | you can just install them with apt-get |
| 21:41.58 | specing | ok |
| 21:42.07 | KatolaZ | but if there is a need for that, we can definitely think about it |
| 21:42.14 | watchcat | apt install xorg i3wm slim is pretty basic for a metapackage, i guess. |
| 21:42.24 | KatolaZ | shrugs |
| 21:42.39 | MinceR | oh, also, i doubt there's any one tiling wm that's all that much more popular than the others |
| 21:43.02 | MinceR | and at the same time comes with a significant number of packages :> |
| 21:43.04 | KatolaZ | if we go down that lane, we should provide three-deps meta-packages for i3, xmonad, dwm, etc... |
| 21:43.15 | KatolaZ | yeah indeed |
| 21:43.56 | specing | at least you could offer these at tasksel stage, so people wouldn't have to chase down these packages |
| 21:44.49 | KatolaZ | specing: again, we should add something like 12 or 15 choices if we go down the route of tiling wms |
| 21:45.06 | KatolaZ | and basically to provide three or four packages for each choice |
| 21:45.09 | fsmithred | four pages of tasksel... |
| 21:45.33 | MinceR | maybe you can feed debian-installer a list of packages to also install by hand |
| 21:46.11 | KatolaZ | uh? |
| 21:46.40 | KatolaZ | oh you mean as pre-seed? |
| 21:47.36 | MinceR | something like that |
| 21:49.52 | fsmithred | or do it the way everyone has been doing it for years - minimal install, reboot into system, add what you want |
| 21:51.00 | KatolaZ | well, if you have to do several installs, pre-seed is useful |
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| 21:54.09 | fsmithred | yeah, that makes sense |
| 21:55.40 | KatolaZ | MinceR: it looks like there is no standard component to do that |
| 21:57.39 | MinceR | i see |
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| 21:58.56 | KatolaZ | MinceR: it wouldn't be hard to do, but I really don't see which niche it might fill, TBH |
| 21:59.29 | MinceR | maybe it would fill specing's need :) |
| 21:59.42 | KatolaZ | :D |
| 21:59.49 | KatolaZ | apt-get install already does, I guess |
| 22:05.11 | fsmithred | I want openbox with lxdm and lxpanel |
| 22:05.44 | fsmithred | miyo wants openbox with lightdm and tint2 |
| 22:08.58 | golinux | There would be infinite combos. Sounds like a huge headache to do that in the installer |
| 22:09.04 | fsmithred | mid-install you could chroot into the target, install xserver-xephyr and a few other things and then run synaptic in the target system |
| 22:09.51 | fsmithred | then it would be similar to some other distros' installers that let you choose from the entire repo for the install |
| 22:12.00 | KatolaZ | or, you could just reboot |
| 22:12.31 | fsmithred | but, but... |
| 22:12.50 | fsmithred | my first debian install, I tried to use dselect like suse's installer |
| 22:12.59 | fsmithred | browsing through the list and adding stuff |
| 22:13.09 | fsmithred | I got it so screwed up I had to start over |
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| 22:13.18 | watchcat | "choose one from column A, one from column B..." |
| 22:13.29 | KatolaZ | I didn't have much choice than using dselect on my first Debian install... |
| 22:13.40 | KatolaZ | I still install it today |
| 22:13.44 | KatolaZ | and still use it sometimes |
| 22:14.10 | fsmithred | probably helps if you understand some basics of debian package management |
| 22:14.20 | KatolaZ | it's a neat tool |
| 22:14.48 | fsmithred | I expect I'd do better with it today than I did installing woody |
| 22:15.19 | KatolaZ | actually, it looks pretty much like the initial "dpkg" |
| 22:15.31 | KatolaZ | which is not anything like the "current" dpkg, at all |
| 22:15.44 | fsmithred | you mean aptitude? |
| 22:15.54 | KatolaZ | nope |
| 22:15.58 | KatolaZ | I mean dselect |
| 22:16.05 | KatolaZ | http://kalos.mine.nu/histlinux/index.html |
| 22:16.15 | KatolaZ | there is an image ^^^ of Debian 0.91 there |
| 22:16.26 | fsmithred | I just started it here |
| 22:16.28 | KatolaZ | give it a spin and run `dpkg` |
| 22:16.34 | fsmithred | text mode - no curses |
| 22:16.48 | KatolaZ | dselect? |
| 22:16.49 | KatolaZ | sure |
| 22:16.56 | fsmithred | yeah, dselect is installed here |
| 22:17.14 | fsmithred | 'dpkg' just tells me that I didn't tell it enough |
| 22:17.25 | KatolaZ | I meant that dselect is indeed heavily inspired to the original `dpkg` |
| 22:17.30 | KatolaZ | yeah, fsmithred |
| 22:17.46 | KatolaZ | dpkg was a different thing in the first one or two debian releases :) |
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| 22:19.21 | KatolaZ | then it was re-written by Ian Jackson and a few others |
| 22:20.38 | fsmithred | holy shit, I just downloaded a whole OS in five seconds! |
| 22:20.49 | KatolaZ | what was that fsmithred? |
| 22:20.59 | KatolaZ | got high-speed bandwidth? |
| 22:21.06 | fsmithred | debian_0.91_qemu.img.xzâ saved |
| 22:21.14 | KatolaZ | HAHAHAHAHA |
| 22:21.21 | fsmithred | not terribly high - 1.97MB/s |
| 22:21.29 | fsmithred | in 5.8s |
| 22:21.32 | rrq | specing: join #d1g-users if you need to debug your d1g issue |
| 22:21.59 | KatolaZ | it would have taken several days back in 1994 |
| 22:23.43 | KatolaZ | fsmithred: I collected several other historical distros |
| 22:23.52 | KatolaZ | the idea was to make similas qcow images for them |
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| 22:24.02 | KatolaZ | I still have to find the time for that :) |
| 22:24.06 | fsmithred | what's login/password? |
| 22:24.38 | KatolaZ | root |
| 22:24.40 | KatolaZ | no password |
| 22:24.42 | KatolaZ | IIRC |
| 22:24.44 | fsmithred | yeah, tried that and it worked |
| 22:25.25 | KatolaZ | the host is called "debra" |
| 22:25.27 | KatolaZ | hahahahahah |
| 22:27.35 | KatolaZ | fsmithred: there is an image with packages available as well |
| 22:27.44 | KatolaZ | you just need to run dpkg_process in /root |
| 22:27.53 | fsmithred | yeah, I'm checking out package lists now |
| 22:28.32 | fsmithred | I want to try the monochrome xserver |
| 22:29.17 | KatolaZ | I don't remember how packages worked though |
| 22:29.39 | KatolaZ | there must be some doc in there I guess? |
| 22:29.51 | KatolaZ | oh maybe I just installed everything in that image? |
| 22:32.33 | KatolaZ | it looks like there is no X in that image |
| 22:32.41 | KatolaZ | but we are probably OT by now |
| 22:32.44 | fsmithred | 46 packages are installed |
| 22:33.14 | fsmithred | ok, I'm done |
| 22:33.38 | KatolaZ | I will get back to that project, sooner or later |
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| 22:35.14 | KatolaZ | I have images for slackware 1.1, redhat 1.0, and also the mirrors of SLS, Yggdrasil, TAMU and MCC |
| 22:36.51 | fsmithred | wow |
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| 22:45.04 | golinux | TAMU = Texas A & M University. LOL! |
| 22:45.45 | KatolaZ | fsmithred: I should put online the image which contains all the packages |
| 22:45.56 | KatolaZ | (for debian-0.91) |
| 22:47.03 | golinux | Right next to that image of the systemd hairball! |
| 22:47.14 | golinux | That would prove a point. |
| 22:48.16 | KatolaZ | ahahahahah |
| 22:48.45 | MinceR | the cultists wouldn't get it |
| 22:50.56 | golinux | But we would |
| 22:51.18 | KatolaZ | well, to little avail |
| 22:53.10 | KatolaZ | oh, I have to edit the X config file :D |
| 22:53.18 | KatolaZ | haven't done that in 10+ years I guess |
| 22:53.19 | KatolaZ | :D |
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| 22:53.53 | fsmithred | xconfig? |
| 22:54.41 | KatolaZ | nope |
| 22:54.43 | fsmithred | KatolaZ, is it possible to make a netinstall iso that does both i386 and amd64? |
| 22:55.00 | KatolaZ | not invented yet |
| 22:55.23 | KatolaZ | fsmithred: don't think so, but I haven't looked into that |
| 22:55.24 | specing | in theory it should be easy |
| 22:55.33 | KatolaZ | no specing |
| 22:55.40 | KatolaZ | since udebs are arch-dependent |
| 22:55.47 | specing | cross debootstrap? |
| 22:55.51 | KatolaZ | o_O |
| 22:56.00 | specing | well? |
| 22:56.01 | KatolaZ | that's not what we are talking about |
| 22:56.10 | golinux | specing: Maybe a project for you to develop . . . |
| 22:56.11 | KatolaZ | fsmithred asked about a netinst |
| 22:57.15 | fsmithred | I know some of the directories from each could be put together, but I don't know about other parts |
| 22:57.45 | KatolaZ | I don't think it's possible since the repo in netinst is flat |
| 22:57.50 | fsmithred | and I know it's possible to add a live dir to the netinstall and have a bootable live system as a boot option |
| 22:57.50 | KatolaZ | but we should have a look at that |
| 22:58.08 | KatolaZ | yeah, but it's a live for the same arch I guess |
| 22:58.10 | fsmithred | but only one arch at a time |
| 22:58.14 | KatolaZ | indeed |
| 22:58.27 | fsmithred | probably could be either arch - it has its own kernel and initrd |
| 22:59.10 | fsmithred | point of this is I'd like to have live isos and netinstall all on one usb |
| 22:59.33 | fsmithred | and netinstall can't find the cdrom when it's on a multiboot usb |
| 23:00.47 | KatolaZ | no fsmithred |
| 23:00.55 | KatolaZ | live iso is too big |
| 23:01.09 | KatolaZ | netinst is a few hundred MBs |
| 23:01.12 | fsmithred | too big for what? |
| 23:01.24 | specing | Would anyone be kind enough and add compress=lzo, compress=zlib, autodefrag and nossd to btrfs filesystem mount options in the installer? |
| 23:01.25 | KatolaZ | if we add live iso it will grow to more than 1GB... |
| 23:01.25 | fsmithred | oh, I'm talking about putting that image on usb |
| 23:01.45 | KatolaZ | specing: why? |
| 23:01.55 | KatolaZ | (I mean, why should that be in the installer?) |
| 23:02.21 | specing | KatolaZ: because the compress flags are used for new files only -> making install use less space if they are applied right away |
| 23:02.47 | specing | also make it use mkfs.btrfs --mixed for devices under 16GB |
| 23:03.21 | specing | KatolaZ: also related, is there an easy way to pause the installer right after setting up the partitions but before install base system runs? |
| 23:03.23 | KatolaZ | specing: an installer is a generic tool is not a tool to install just *your* system |
| 23:03.41 | specing | KatolaZ: in general those flags are good to have on a btrfs filesystem |
| 23:03.44 | KatolaZ | specing: just use the expert install option |
| 23:03.46 | specing | not just on mine |
| 23:03.52 | specing | ok |
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| 23:30.00 | specing | Why isn't the partitioner more like this? https://linx.li/logicalpartitioner.png |
| 23:31.58 | MinceR | afaik you can use multiple partition-like objects (even on multiple disks) as a single area for LVM on which to make logical volumes |
| 23:32.32 | specing | that is true, the same also holds for btrfs |
| 23:33.05 | specing | it is also confusing that they don't follow in logical order of setup |
| 23:33.11 | specing | SCSI - LUKS - LVM |
| 23:33.21 | specing | instead it is LUKS - LVM - SCSI |
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