| 00:00.12 | flyback | WHOA |
| 00:00.12 | flyback | http://www.sentex.net/%7Emwandel/tech/changer.html |
| 00:02.53 | flyback | jbevren check this |
| 00:02.54 | flyback | http://www.hackaday.com/entry/1234000630073724/ |
| 00:03.37 | flyback | mabye you can just reprogram the gpu to default to composite sync |
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| 00:08.39 | jbevren | heh |
| 00:08.39 | jbevren | well, |
| 00:08.44 | jbevren | I do know this matrox card can do it |
| 00:08.58 | jbevren | the question is whether or not the linux fb code will do it |
| 00:11.06 | jbevren | :) |
| 00:11.17 | jbevren | some time I'll be less lazy and make an attempt with the display |
| 00:11.21 | jbevren | theyre nice old 20" displays |
| 00:11.25 | jbevren | I paid $20 for the pair ;-) |
| 00:11.39 | jbevren | real shame these DHTs dont ahve three pci slots |
| 00:11.41 | jbevren | out! |
| 00:11.46 | flyback | oh matrox |
| 00:11.49 | flyback | EVIL CANUCKS |
| 00:11.56 | flyback | but they do know how to make good 2d cores :) |
| 00:12.44 | flyback | I dunno why matrox doesn't join the emebdded space for cell phones etc |
| 00:12.48 | flyback | like nvidia and ati have |
| 00:12.53 | flyback | they could hold their own at least there |
| 00:27.21 | jbevren | matrox didnt even admit the milleniums can do composite or SoG sync |
| 00:27.22 | jbevren | hehe |
| 00:27.33 | jbevren | even though their cards did in alpha and ppc workstations |
| 00:34.13 | flyback | it's sad cause they have wicked ass 2d tech |
| 00:34.19 | flyback | they should deep more into embedded space |
| 00:34.35 | flyback | hell a g200 would probably burn any small scale lcd on the market for cell phones etc |
| 00:34.58 | flyback | all they have to do is do a die shrink, remove the ramdac and mabye update the lcd type interfaces |
| 00:35.41 | flyback | that's the beauty of embedded |
| 00:35.51 | flyback | NOW ONE GIVES A FLYING (#&*#&*((#&*# WHAT YOU SCORE ON 3DMARK |
| 00:36.01 | flyback | they just want the *(&@*&#*@ machine to run 24/7 without burning up |
| 00:36.14 | flyback | - /rant off |
| 00:36.14 | flyback | :P |
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| 00:49.48 | sunrunner20 | ROTFLMAo: http://www.rotten.com/library/crime/drugs/methamphetamine/methmakeover.jpg |
| 00:54.50 | flyback | omg it works |
| 00:58.16 | flyback | I put the knoppix iso on a ntfs partition and told the cd the command line |
| 00:58.25 | flyback | bootfrom /dev/hda1/KNOPPI~1.ISO |
| 00:58.34 | flyback | now I Just gotta tell it not to even try to load root from the cd |
| 00:58.49 | flyback | the built in dvd-rom drives are defective |
| 00:58.58 | flyback | they work okay for enough bios calls to load a kernel into ram |
| 00:59.02 | flyback | but go to hell after that |
| 01:15.08 | jbevren | man srams take forever to translate |
| 01:27.54 | jbevren | grumble |
| 01:28.01 | jbevren | people wonder why I dont try anything |
| 01:28.17 | jbevren | if 'wait' is a standard vhdl statement, why doesnt the xilinx ISE support it? |
| 01:29.26 | flyback | jbe |
| 01:29.31 | flyback | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCY0ejfxeZY&search=shuttle |
| 01:29.33 | flyback | shuttle vs bird |
| 01:29.34 | flyback | HAHAHA |
| 01:30.40 | agaffney | damn it |
| 01:30.48 | agaffney | I wish youtube let you download the video like google video does |
| 01:30.52 | agaffney | no flash on amd64 |
| 01:32.47 | jbevren | ok so waht do I use instead of wait |
| 01:33.03 | jbevren | the xilinx website doesnt know the error I'mg etting exists |
| 01:37.56 | jbevren | and the error message doesnt exist on the internet |
| 01:37.58 | jbevren | at all |
| 01:38.00 | jbevren | quite. lovely. |
| 01:38.14 | jbevren | I should have known this software was crap the first time I tried to install it |
| 01:56.07 | MonMotha | jbevren: and you only paid how much for it? |
| 02:03.36 | jbevren | MonMotha: theyre doing a damn good job of convincing corporate clients to not buy the pay software |
| 02:03.45 | jbevren | -none- of the errors that are coming up exist |
| 02:04.18 | MonMotha | jbevren: the xilinx software does kinda suck |
| 02:05.25 | jbevren | recommend something else for me please |
| 02:05.33 | jbevren | meanwhile I'll be carrying these dev boards to the trash |
| 02:05.55 | jbevren | I really have no idea at all how anyone ever gets anything done with this toolkit |
| 02:06.31 | jbevren | I cant make ti recognize new libraries, so there goes yet another model for me to learn from |
| 02:07.09 | MonMotha | jbevren: for developing for Xilinx parts? you have no alternative, really |
| 02:07.21 | jbevren | no, |
| 02:07.22 | MonMotha | I've heard good things about Altera's software, though don't fall into their "AHDL" trap |
| 02:07.23 | jbevren | another brand |
| 02:07.25 | jbevren | like altera maybe |
| 02:07.37 | MonMotha | Lattice's software also sucks |
| 02:07.45 | MonMotha | it seems to be a requirement that all EE CAD software must suck |
| 02:08.08 | jbevren | it just irritates me that a company claims so much standardization and nothing standard works with their toolkits |
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| 02:09.19 | MonMotha | I' |
| 02:09.24 | MonMotha | I've not written VHDL with Xilinx |
| 02:09.30 | MonMotha | their Verilog support is fairly standard |
| 02:11.03 | jbevren | shrug |
| 02:11.10 | jbevren | I'm making an attempt at learning on xilinx's tools |
| 02:11.16 | MonMotha | they work |
| 02:11.19 | MonMotha | they suck, but they work |
| 02:11.20 | jbevren | of course, I'd have more success walking across a lava pool barefoot |
| 02:11.25 | jbevren | because nothing I try works |
| 02:11.34 | jbevren | well I cant say that |
| 02:11.37 | jbevren | I can divide the clock signal |
| 02:11.38 | jbevren | yay |
| 02:11.40 | jbevren | woo |
| 02:11.53 | jbevren | but all Iw ant to do is make a tristate register (a-la 1byte ram) |
| 02:12.16 | jbevren | I attempted a tristate register, but XST failed on some bs about something not being supported |
| 02:12.52 | jbevren | hm lots of logic blocks on the maxII board |
| 02:13.41 | jbevren | not sure I need a pci edge though :) |
| 02:13.52 | MonMotha | you have to make sure that the device you've said your working on supports the function you're asking |
| 02:14.18 | jbevren | why wouldnt their flagship PLD support a common function like 'wait' that's used in nearly every async design on the planet? |
| 02:14.33 | jbevren | I understand that not all devices can support all functionalities |
| 02:14.46 | jbevren | but soemthing as common as wait.. I dunno |
| 02:15.01 | jbevren | and every error it spits out isnt found in the online help thing |
| 02:15.19 | jbevren | that's a big irritation |
| 02:16.45 | MonMotha | I don't know what "wait" does in VHDL |
| 02:17.42 | jbevren | in summary, its a ram behavior that processes an event for data, cs, we, oe, and address in an infinite loop |
| 02:17.51 | jbevren | the wait apparently causes this loop to pause until a transition occurs |
| 02:18.02 | MonMotha | so it's like an always block? |
| 02:18.07 | jbevren | if you remove the wait, XST whines of course |
| 02:18.08 | jbevren | yeah |
| 02:18.13 | jbevren | block until change |
| 02:18.36 | jbevren | http://tams-www.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/vhdl/models/sram-simple/sram64kx8.vhd |
| 02:18.46 | jbevren | that's a model I was arguing with |
| 02:19.03 | jbevren | I learn best by example |
| 02:19.22 | jbevren | flyback's attention span is probably longer than mine when it comes to learning theory |
| 02:19.51 | jbevren | other than the wait statement, the module seesm to work |
| 02:20.21 | jbevren | there's another simple ram model, but it uses a custom library that I cant get ISE to recognize |
| 02:24.51 | jbevren | altera's website cant even sorty by price.. I'm not sold |
| 02:26.09 | flyback | hah |
| 02:26.22 | flyback | na you are right though 100% |
| 02:26.25 | flyback | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:26.40 | flyback | it's simple stuff like that, that makes a engineer go "forget you!" |
| 02:26.42 | flyback | and move on |
| 02:26.50 | flyback | I guess these idiots haven't figured it out yet |
| 02:26.55 | jbevren | and simple syntax errors giving 404's in the ISE |
| 02:27.28 | flyback | have you guys seen www.engrish.com |
| 02:27.32 | jbevren | yeah |
| 02:27.33 | jbevren | its a riot |
| 02:28.16 | jbevren | back to the shelf with the xilinx crap |
| 02:28.40 | jbevren | narrow room ;) |
| 02:29.09 | flyback | yeah that's bullshit |
| 02:29.32 | flyback | when will these companies learn it doesn't matter if the part will suck your ..... if yuo can't find the on switch |
| 02:29.48 | flyback | sometimes I think I should do marketing |
| 02:29.52 | jbevren | there's no switch on this board |
| 02:29.55 | jbevren | but I get your poitn ;-) |
| 02:30.04 | flyback | dude that was figuartive :) |
| 02:30.52 | jbevren | MonMotha: I'll try again in a couple months with verilog |
| 02:30.54 | jbevren | or later |
| 02:31.07 | jbevren | I have no idea which language to learn to be honest |
| 02:31.32 | jbevren | I grew up reading schematics of computers whose memory decoding was done with discrete logic |
| 02:31.34 | jbevren | hehe |
| 02:32.35 | flyback | heheh |
| 02:33.22 | jbevren | my luck would be that the flagship spartan 3 would not support something I try to do even in schematic capture mode |
| 02:33.36 | flyback | man a few rys ago and I lost the video since |
| 02:33.45 | flyback | was of this ac motor driver |
| 02:33.54 | flyback | I mean a large as a room one for driving a giant factory motor |
| 02:34.00 | flyback | it used a array of fpga banks |
| 02:34.08 | flyback | man that thing sounded so smooth starting up I about cried |
| 02:34.25 | jbevren | out |
| 02:34.36 | flyback | the fpga's let them change algorithums, etc without having to rewrire |
| 02:40.22 | MonMotha | jbevren: the Spartan series is hardly Xilinx's "flagship" series of FPGAs |
| 02:40.40 | MonMotha | look at a Vertex II some time :) |
| 02:41.43 | MonMotha | actually, I believe it's Virtex |
| 02:41.50 | MonMotha | you get the idea |
| 02:42.06 | MonMotha | they're for prototyping large ASICs, processors, etc. |
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| 12:29.50 | flyback | I can't get over how these usb to ide adaptors give you a 1:1 mapping |
| 12:47.05 | jbevren | how else would it be done? |
| 12:49.44 | flyback | dude |
| 12:49.50 | flyback | I am NOT used to stuff that actually works |
| 12:52.04 | jbevren | haha |
| 12:52.06 | jbevren | How about -- "Geriatric and the Pacemakers"? |
| 12:52.09 | jbevren | We have them... They're called the "Rolling Stones". |
| 12:52.13 | jbevren | slashdot rocks sometimes |
| 12:52.17 | flyback | man I am scrolling in videos |
| 12:52.28 | flyback | and it responds just like it was attached to udma133 ata |
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| 12:52.56 | jbevren | morning dave |
| 12:54.00 | jbevren | I remember voltron |
| 12:54.07 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 12:54.16 | flyback | yeah it generally sucked but lion episode 5 rocked |
| 12:54.30 | flyback | that's the one where the new castle emerges from the old one |
| 12:54.33 | flyback | that's just cool |
| 12:54.42 | flyback | what's wrong bud? |
| 12:59.10 | flyback | uhh that might make him feel worse |
| 12:59.25 | jbevren | he'll be fine after the 10th one |
| 12:59.27 | jbevren | :) |
| 12:59.41 | flyback | man I like want to make love to this usb to ide adaptor or something |
| 12:59.45 | flyback | this is just so freaking cool |
| 13:05.41 | prpplague | jbevren: blood pressure and stress |
| 13:19.48 | flyback | actually prpplague that's a good idea |
| 13:20.00 | flyback | peppermint oil soothes stomach and colon |
| 13:20.18 | flyback | apprentely it also pisses off ants and can be used as a non toxic ant repellant |
| 13:20.34 | flyback | has to be real pure oil though can't be artifical stuff :P |
| 13:26.42 | jbevren | the artificial stuff has too much sugar ;) |
| 13:28.57 | flyback | well that and I think it doesn't have the same chemical response |
| 13:29.05 | flyback | you know birds HATE artificial grape |
| 13:29.30 | flyback | also we are the only creature I guess that eats hot peppers cause they cause a sensation of death in animals |
| 13:29.56 | jbevren | lol |
| 13:30.02 | jbevren | if you eat enough you'll want to be dead |
| 13:31.07 | flyback | well true :) |
| 13:31.17 | flyback | I HavE HAD flaming cornhole symdrome before |
| 13:32.03 | flyback | while I think a lot of chemical incesticides and repellants they use now can be used safely, if we can avoid using anything questionable we should when we can |
| 13:32.18 | prpplague | flyback: way too much info |
| 13:32.30 | flyback | besides I am trying to find ways to keep termites and pests out of the house without killing any pets |
| 13:32.32 | flyback | oh sorry :P |
| 13:32.44 | jbevren | terminix can do it ;) |
| 13:32.53 | flyback | well yes and no |
| 13:32.58 | flyback | some of the stuff they use is toxic to pets |
| 13:33.07 | jbevren | so dont let your pets lick the outside of your house |
| 13:33.08 | jbevren | drr |
| 13:33.09 | jbevren | :) |
| 13:33.10 | flyback | google boric acid this stuff is the shit |
| 13:33.18 | flyback | going to wash all the walls down in the basement with it |
| 13:33.20 | flyback | and all the bathrooms |
| 13:33.23 | flyback | you can leave it on |
| 13:33.30 | flyback | kills mold and mildew |
| 13:33.38 | jbevren | use good heavy gloves :) |
| 13:33.54 | flyback | fireproofs wood and kills termites and ants and they can't develope immunity |
| 13:34.02 | flyback | uuhh it's a mild acid they used to use it as a eye wash |
| 13:34.13 | flyback | made from borax |
| 13:35.01 | flyback | it's also dirt cheap I can get a 64oz powder bottle for $4 |
| 13:40.51 | jbevren | I know this. Hydrogen peroxide is also used to clear up wounds |
| 13:40.54 | jbevren | in a 3% solution |
| 13:41.13 | jbevren | short-term exposure is ok for skin with borax, but if youre going to be handling it for hours, get some gloves :) |
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| 14:04.19 | flyback | well yeah if you handle anythnig for hrs you should |
| 14:04.22 | flyback | but it's generally sage |
| 14:04.23 | flyback | safe |
| 14:05.38 | flyback | damn |
| 14:05.51 | flyback | if there any boottime kernel option to just disable dma for 1 device |
| 14:07.04 | *** join/#edev evildevil (n=evildevi@143.93.17.29) |
| 14:15.53 | flyback | you go to hell you die! |
| 14:17.48 | *** join/#edev CosmicPenguin (n=nobody@svl-ext-proxy01.amd.com) |
| 14:22.39 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hey |
| 14:23.02 | jbevren | flyback: there's a build-time option to disable dma for non-harddisk devices |
| 14:27.03 | CosmicPenguin | morning |
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| 14:31.24 | flyback | oh cool |
| 14:31.44 | flyback | I can't even find much info about this drive |
| 14:32.00 | flyback | it was part of a multimedia upgrade dvd+rom + pcmcia dvd decoder |
| 14:32.03 | flyback | it's a torisan |
| 14:35.03 | prpplague | jbevren: hehe, i'm thinking we should hit old t0mW up to do some layout for some pixter pcbs |
| 14:38.19 | flyback | hehe |
| 14:38.26 | jbevren | :) |
| 14:38.43 | jbevren | something with an xD slot and IR remote transciever/ |
| 14:38.46 | jbevren | ? |
| 14:39.54 | prpplague | hehe |
| 14:39.59 | prpplague | jbevren: giant remote? |
| 14:40.24 | jbevren | ubersmart remote |
| 14:40.37 | jbevren | kids' remote :D |
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| 14:51.30 | prpplague | jeeze, some of these media people are just amazing |
| 14:51.52 | prpplague | they are making fun of stephen hawkins because he advocates colonizing the moon and mars |
| 14:52.16 | CosmicPenguin | heh - if you have a colony of important bacteria, do you keep it all in the same petri dish> |
| 14:53.02 | *** join/#edev tuxmaniac (n=aanjhan@60.254.67.17) |
| 14:54.13 | prpplague | yep |
| 15:07.55 | flyback | <flyback-> Eh Hole |
| 15:07.55 | flyback | [11:06] <flyback-> (U.S. states bordering CAN) Canadians, in reference to how they say "eh?" |
| 15:07.55 | flyback | [11:06] <flyback-> I DIDN'T KNOW THIS ONE! |
| 15:11.34 | prpplague | flyback: d00d |
| 15:11.41 | prpplague | flyback: please stop pasting that stuff |
| 15:12.04 | flyback | ok :0 |
| 15:12.09 | flyback | I thought one time was ok but :P |
| 15:12.20 | prpplague | flyback: its getting very old |
| 15:16.55 | jbevren | its bad enough that I do it |
| 15:16.56 | jbevren | hah :) |
| 15:23.34 | tuxmaniac | prpplague> silly doubt. I have a problem which I thing might be my make. tell me if I have a alp for a arch how do I cross compile? |
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| 15:24.19 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: i am sorry, i did not understand your question, please try asking it again |
| 15:24.48 | tuxmaniac | I have a ALP for say an arm architecture. I want to cross compile. I wrote a make file. command is make ARCH=arm ? |
| 15:25.27 | tuxmaniac | Assembly Level program |
| 15:25.38 | tuxmaniac | prpplague> ^ |
| 15:26.08 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: yea, if you want to set the ARCH that is the correct syntax |
| 15:26.38 | tuxmaniac | ugh! what the crap. |
| 15:26.43 | tuxmaniac | not compiling |
| 15:26.49 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: using gcc? |
| 15:26.53 | tuxmaniac | yep |
| 15:27.09 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: asm with gcc can be difficult |
| 15:27.29 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: i'd suggest looking at some simple programs that do asm for arm |
| 15:27.29 | tuxmaniac | prpplague> any extra libs to be installed? |
| 15:28.40 | tuxmaniac | yeah.. C file compiled. but this asm is giving silly syntax errors |
| 15:28.58 | tuxmaniac | prpplague> eg. There are no such instructions :-) |
| 15:29.31 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: http://www.elinux.org/wiki/JuiceBoxCodeTestMakefile |
| 15:29.43 | prpplague | tuxmaniac: that is an example make file for doing asm with gcc |
| 15:29.59 | tuxmaniac | aah ok let me see and I will get back |
| 15:30.04 | tuxmaniac | thanks prpplague |
| 15:30.08 | prpplague | np |
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| 15:49.26 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: HA |
| 15:49.32 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: get this |
| 15:49.41 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: just went to ratebeer.com |
| 15:49.55 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: they rotate photos on their main page |
| 15:50.08 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: lo and behold - http://www.ratebeer.com/images/fd/2.jpg |
| 15:50.33 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: i see my very own smilling face in the very back of that photo |
| 15:50.50 | CosmicPenguin | proxy is down - I'll have to check it later |
| 15:50.56 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: hehe, np |
| 15:50.57 | jbevren | prpplague: youre famous! |
| 15:50.58 | jbevren | hehe |
| 15:51.01 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: just thought it was funny |
| 15:52.18 | prpplague | T0mW: ping |
| 15:53.53 | flyback | prpplague |
| 15:53.57 | flyback | what doesn't feel well |
| 15:54.29 | prpplague | flyback: chest , blood presure, depression |
| 15:55.06 | flyback | ugh |
| 15:55.09 | prpplague | i have a ton of work to do and i can seem to get focused |
| 15:55.20 | flyback | I go thru this every day :/ |
| 15:55.37 | flyback | hmm |
| 15:55.50 | flyback | you on any meds for adhd etc? |
| 15:56.20 | prpplague | no, its generally not this bad, but i have some other personal issues going on |
| 15:56.30 | flyback | oh :/ |
| 15:56.35 | flyback | I hope they get better for you man |
| 15:56.37 | flyback | hang in there |
| 15:56.50 | flyback | I was going to suggest trying an energy drink to get a temp kick to the head |
| 15:57.00 | flyback | but if the chest pain is anything more than anxienty might nto be a good idea |
| 15:57.17 | flyback | also if you already on stuff sometimes it makes you feel like your heart is going to explode |
| 15:57.22 | flyback | if you aren't used to it |
| 15:57.54 | flyback | I can't drink them anymore cause of my stomach but they did help get the gears going in my head |
| 16:03.38 | flyback | just don't be like that dipshit that decided to drink 4 at once before a basketball game |
| 16:03.45 | flyback | forever 18 yrs old and stupid |
| 16:24.36 | flyback | what the heck was the name of that patch again for the linux kernel to get it down to less than 1 meg |
| 16:25.30 | prpplague | flyback: tiny linux iirc |
| 16:25.40 | flyback | thx |
| 16:25.41 | prpplague | flyback: but most of that is in the main kernel now |
| 16:25.50 | flyback | oh cool |
| 16:30.30 | flyback | prpplague am I correct in assuming that theer is nothing that requires the juicebox buttons to stay as buttons? |
| 16:30.41 | flyback | they are just gpio lines so I wanted to hack in a keyboard and mouse I could |
| 16:30.50 | flyback | assuming I converted the protocol etc |
| 16:30.56 | prpplague | flyback: uh yea |
| 16:32.00 | T0mW | prpplague: pong |
| 16:32.44 | prpplague | T0mW: whats cookin? |
| 16:33.22 | T0mW | prpplague: the new PCB |
| 16:33.28 | prpplague | T0mW: ahh |
| 16:33.39 | T0mW | prpplague: another LPC2138 design, single processor |
| 16:33.55 | prpplague | T0mW: lovely, getting better supplies of them? |
| 16:35.01 | T0mW | prpplague: well, no. I got mine by calling the Philips Rep and telling him I needed some for prototyping. He got me some LPC2136 parts which have only 256K Flash instead of the LPC2138 parts (512K Flash). |
| 16:35.11 | T0mW | prpplague: engineers *always* get parts |
| 16:35.18 | prpplague | hehe |
| 16:35.36 | T0mW | heh, "you want me to design you in, get me some parts" |
| 16:35.57 | prpplague | T0mW: hehe, naw, i got too many projects already |
| 16:36.33 | T0mW | prpplague: I've a few here, but I'm trying to divide my time up with the ZipIt stuff |
| 16:36.52 | prpplague | T0mW: yea i saw your announcement |
| 16:37.04 | prpplague | T0mW: i'm thinking of doing a couple of boards myself |
| 16:37.18 | prpplague | T0mW: maybe you can look them over before i send them to the pcb shop |
| 16:37.45 | T0mW | prpplague: the only way to make that board available is to mount it myself. Too easy to break things inside that unit. |
| 16:37.53 | T0mW | prpplague: can do that for you. |
| 16:38.06 | prpplague | T0mW: yea, your logic is clear on that |
| 16:38.11 | T0mW | prpplague: send me the gerbers and I'll look them over. |
| 16:38.25 | prpplague | T0mW: i want to do a board for the juicebox and one for the picter |
| 16:38.33 | T0mW | prpplague: btw, RS-274X is the format to use for gerbers today. |
| 16:39.13 | prpplague | T0mW: yea, i'll be using the cheap eagle cad |
| 16:39.17 | prpplague | for linux of course |
| 16:39.22 | flyback | hey that was nice of the philips rep |
| 16:39.32 | flyback | then again if anyone can make philips some $$$$$ with uses |
| 16:39.32 | T0mW | RS-274X contains aperature + tool-drill data within the individual gerber layer files. It used to be that you needed seperate files for them. |
| 16:39.34 | flyback | it's you monkeys :) |
| 16:39.57 | T0mW | flyback: it is not "nice", it is "how it works". :) |
| 16:40.09 | flyback | oh I know but still it's cool they work that way |
| 16:40.18 | flyback | helps spark little prokjects that lead to some killer app |
| 16:40.57 | flyback | that's a arm chip right? |
| 16:41.10 | prpplague | flyback: ?? |
| 16:41.16 | T0mW | some outfits offer credit card purchase of small quantities. This is good also, I don't expect to build something for no money. If they have no parts available via the credit card purchase, then I bug the Rep. |
| 16:41.17 | flyback | ?? |
| 16:41.28 | prpplague | <flyback> that's a arm chip right? |
| 16:41.37 | T0mW | flyback: yeah, LPC2138 is ARM7TDMI-S |
| 16:41.38 | flyback | I am not failiar with that model |
| 16:41.44 | flyback | ah |
| 16:41.45 | flyback | cool |
| 16:41.57 | flyback | arm7tdmi the "m68k" of the arm world :P |
| 16:42.01 | flyback | err no |
| 16:42.07 | flyback | dragonball of the arm world |
| 16:42.07 | T0mW | flyback: 32K SRAM + 512K Flash in the chip |
| 16:42.09 | flyback | bah |
| 16:42.11 | flyback | nice |
| 16:42.26 | T0mW | LPC2106 is 64K SRAM + 128K Flash |
| 16:42.32 | flyback | nice |
| 16:42.45 | flyback | might not be able to run linux but make a hell of a co processor for something |
| 16:42.54 | T0mW | I'd rather see something with 8K Flash + 1Meg SRAM |
| 16:43.04 | prpplague | T0mW: yea me too |
| 16:43.06 | flyback | yeah I know but not everything needs that :P |
| 16:43.31 | T0mW | small boot, then bring the O/S in from an SD card (via SPI / SSI bus) |
| 16:43.35 | prpplague | T0mW: actually i would prefer nothing but sram, with a standard x8 nand interface |
| 16:43.42 | flyback | mmmm |
| 16:43.55 | flyback | or hell even a serial flash bootloader :P |
| 16:44.15 | T0mW | prpplague: heh, but a tiny Flash boot offers more bootstrap options for differing nand hardware |
| 16:44.53 | flyback | wow |
| 16:44.55 | T0mW | flyback: IIRC, Cirrus offers a serial flash bootloader on their 93xx series ARM9 |
| 16:44.55 | flyback | even has a rtc |
| 16:45.10 | T0mW | too bad the chip is a monster |
| 16:45.14 | flyback | 2 i2c, 2 spi |
| 16:45.19 | flyback | 2 uarts |
| 16:45.19 | flyback | nice |
| 16:45.23 | prpplague | T0mW: true |
| 16:45.35 | T0mW | flyback: also PWM + ADC |
| 16:45.37 | flyback | wicked little soab tomw |
| 16:45.39 | flyback | yeah I see that |
| 16:46.05 | flyback | The LPC2131, LPC2132 and LPC2138 are available now and are priced at $3.20, $3.90 and $7.00 in quantities of 10,000. The LPC2134 |
| 16:46.06 | flyback | damn |
| 16:46.07 | T0mW | flyback: SSI (second SPI interface) can run @ 20MHz |
| 16:46.10 | flyback | I can see that selling well |
| 16:47.05 | T0mW | flyback: Philips got overwhelmed with orders and is struggling to ramp production up. |
| 16:47.14 | flyback | woah it even has some error correction capability |
| 16:47.25 | flyback | T0mW that can be a good thing in the long run :) |
| 16:47.28 | flyback | good sign |
| 16:47.56 | flyback | no one likes late parts but at least they know fish are biting |
| 16:48.11 | T0mW | flyback: yeah, not like motorola |
| 16:48.22 | flyback | ? |
| 16:48.29 | T0mW | motorola will discontinue a chip in a heartbeat |
| 16:48.42 | flyback | are they any better since they split off |
| 16:48.58 | T0mW | only reason the 68HC11 lasted so long was the overwhelming popularity amoung small companies |
| 16:49.11 | flyback | yeah the average bwm was using like 70 of those |
| 16:49.14 | flyback | bmw |
| 16:49.22 | T0mW | flyback: I dunno, after the did it to me a couple of times, I stopped using them. |
| 16:49.33 | flyback | I don't blame you |
| 16:49.48 | flyback | my canuck friend was teaching me about can networks |
| 16:49.56 | flyback | pretty sweet from what I understand |
| 16:50.02 | flyback | it can sustain a lot of damage and keep going |
| 16:50.34 | flyback | T0mW did you see that new 8051 mcu with mram onboard |
| 16:50.55 | flyback | if someone comes up with a arm core even the 7tdmi with mram it will probably clear the stock fast |
| 16:51.03 | flyback | mram = near unlimited writes |
| 16:51.35 | flyback | prblem is it doesn't process scale well but for small amounts like a 8 bit mcu or low end 32 bit mcu it's ok |
| 16:51.51 | T0mW | no, I had been looking to replace the 8051 in new designs. The ARM7TDMI has too many advantages over the 8051, mostly the fact that devel tools are readily available + cheap. Plus JTAG debugging... |
| 16:52.07 | flyback | well I mentioned it more for the fact that it has mram |
| 16:52.24 | flyback | yeah and tdmi cores are getting so cheap now |
| 16:52.41 | flyback | I think ST or atmel had one down to like $2 |
| 16:52.53 | T0mW | besides, there is only so much you can do with one DPTR (or several). |
| 16:53.11 | T0mW | flyback: LPC2101 |
| 16:53.13 | flyback | DPTR? |
| 16:53.22 | T0mW | data pointer |
| 16:53.29 | T0mW | 16 bit data pointer |
| 16:53.40 | flyback | oh |
| 16:54.20 | T0mW | It makes programming clumsy as you are constantly moving values in / out of the DPH + DPL registers to form 16 bit pointer addresses. |
| 16:54.28 | flyback | yeah I know |
| 16:54.32 | flyback | 16 bit data in a 8 bit world |
| 16:54.41 | flyback | I guess it's like x86 segments |
| 16:55.11 | T0mW | 8051 is primarily an 8bit processor, a spin-off of the old old 8039 and 8040 cores |
| 16:55.19 | flyback | a spi at 20mhz how much thruput is that primarily |
| 16:55.26 | flyback | wtf |
| 16:55.31 | flyback | there was a 8039 and 8040? |
| 16:55.36 | flyback | I know there was a 8048 |
| 16:55.43 | flyback | and it was a worthless pos for anything but keyboards |
| 16:55.47 | flyback | cause it was so braindead |
| 16:55.59 | prpplague | flyback: spi is a single bit operation |
| 16:56.03 | T0mW | they just allowed the 8051 program counter to cross 256 byte boundries, in the 8039 you had to branch across pages to build large code. |
| 16:56.19 | prpplague | flyback: so 20mhz is about 20mbit |
| 16:56.24 | flyback | WOW |
| 16:56.39 | flyback | not bad |
| 16:56.58 | prpplague | flyback: so basically about 2.5mbaud |
| 16:57.06 | T0mW | flyback: dunno about 8048, they used 8041 + 8042 for that. |
| 16:57.17 | flyback | We now have multiple UART, I2C and SSP/SPI interfaces on each device and we are developing a range of USB interfaces for introduction early next year," he noted. |
| 16:57.22 | flyback | mmmmm usb |
| 16:57.47 | T0mW | IMHO, usb is someones' very bad LSD trip. |
| 16:57.55 | prpplague | agreed |
| 16:58.22 | prpplague | usb spec page 1 "here is how you should implement this...." |
| 16:58.27 | flyback | well yeah personally I wouldn't use usb for a bus cause it's too complex |
| 16:58.39 | flyback | but I mean it's neat that your device could possibly talk to off the shelf usb devices |
| 16:58.45 | prpplague | usb spec page 2 "if you don't like how page 1 reads, just do whatever you like..." |
| 16:59.01 | flyback | prpplague or "see via" |
| 16:59.11 | flyback | Intel |
| 16:59.12 | flyback | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:59.12 | flyback | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:59.12 | flyback | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:59.41 | T0mW | prpplague: you can cover a multitude of sins in a Windows USB driver... |
| 16:59.51 | prpplague | hehe |
| 17:00.31 | prpplague | T0mW: really should a nice web page for "Convicted windows usb driver writers" |
| 17:00.37 | prpplague | i/make |
| 17:00.43 | T0mW | if you don't like the mass-storage spec, just ignore it an do your own. |
| 17:00.50 | prpplague | yep |
| 17:01.06 | prpplague | that's what drives me insane |
| 17:01.12 | prpplague | i/more |
| 17:01.20 | *** join/#edev CosmicPenguin (n=nobody@aus-ext-proxy02.amd.com) |
| 17:01.29 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: re |
| 17:01.39 | T0mW | IIRC, the USB spec is a protocol, FIREWIRE / SPI are transport mechanisms |
| 17:01.44 | CosmicPenguin | nod |
| 17:01.53 | prpplague | T0mW: yea |
| 17:02.08 | prpplague | T0mW: you should look at the usb CDC specs |
| 17:02.13 | prpplague | T0mW: thats a real nightmare |
| 17:02.18 | T0mW | no, thank you |
| 17:02.39 | T0mW | I've successfully avoided usb |
| 17:03.07 | flyback | dudes |
| 17:03.15 | flyback | I was talking about for interopbility |
| 17:03.20 | flyback | not for generally using the usb bus for stuff |
| 17:04.01 | T0mW | well, you need a master on the USB bus someplace, if you are doing a small microcontroller system then USB places a cost burden on that system |
| 17:04.29 | prpplague | T0mW: hey, i had something i was gonna ask you |
| 17:04.32 | prpplague | T0mW: cpld |
| 17:04.40 | T0mW | yeah...? |
| 17:04.46 | prpplague | T0mW: and fpga |
| 17:05.00 | prpplague | T0mW: one of those with an arm chip |
| 17:05.23 | T0mW | ? |
| 17:05.24 | prpplague | T0mW: using it to basically mux a couple of gpios |
| 17:05.30 | T0mW | oh |
| 17:05.41 | prpplague | T0mW: i.e. i have two gpio's |
| 17:05.54 | prpplague | T0mW: i only want to use one at a time, but i want to be able to choose which one |
| 17:07.35 | T0mW | well, you merely have to express the operation using language. |
| 17:07.48 | T0mW | prpplague: you looked into CUPL yet? |
| 17:08.04 | prpplague | T0mW: CUPL? sorry no |
| 17:08.08 | prpplague | T0mW: url? |
| 17:08.13 | prpplague | T0mW: but its doable? |
| 17:08.40 | T0mW | WinCUPL, it is a language to build the JEDEC files necessary to program the "fuses" in the CPLDs |
| 17:08.50 | T0mW | JEDEC == fuse maps |
| 17:09.03 | T0mW | ~WinCUPL |
| 17:09.15 | prpplague | uh "win" ??????????? |
| 17:09.15 | T0mW | ~WinCUPL? |
| 17:09.31 | T0mW | purl: you awake? |
| 17:09.39 | jbevren | purl: botsnack |
| 17:09.39 | purl | jbevren: aw, gee |
| 17:09.49 | T0mW | ~kick purl |
| 17:09.50 | purl | bugger off sod! |
| 17:10.00 | T0mW | purl is a maggot |
| 17:10.14 | prpplague | T0mW: yea googled it |
| 17:10.25 | prpplague | T0mW: hmm, i'd have to find something linux native |
| 17:10.49 | T0mW | http://www.atmel.com/dyn/products/tools_card.asp?tool_id=2759 |
| 17:10.51 | T0mW | prpplague: cannot |
| 17:11.16 | T0mW | prpplague: the bast!ds all charge you for the unix versions. |
| 17:11.31 | prpplague | yea, then i'd have to look for something else |
| 17:11.59 | T0mW | prpplague: the main reason I have VMWare is to run Windows98 to run the free tools |
| 17:14.15 | prpplague | yea, i don't even run psuedo machines with winblows |
| 17:14.21 | prpplague | i try to go all native apps |
| 17:16.27 | T0mW | prpplague: http://rafb.net/paste/results/FBKTC156.html |
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| 17:17.08 | prpplague | T0mW: an example of cupl? |
| 17:17.22 | T0mW | prpplague: that is a CPLD source file for a glue logic chip in an Amateur Radio repeater controller. |
| 17:17.34 | prpplague | T0mW: ahh |
| 17:17.38 | prpplague | T0mW: interesting |
| 17:17.41 | T0mW | 16v8 |
| 17:18.02 | prpplague | T0mW: the problem that i've always had trying to play with cpld's is that i needed some additional hardware, i.e. the programmer |
| 17:18.11 | jbevren | T0mW: you a ham operator? |
| 17:18.35 | prpplague | what does CUPl stand for? |
| 17:19.10 | T0mW | jbevren: WN3L |
| 17:19.16 | jbevren | cool |
| 17:19.43 | jbevren | I'm not myself, but when I was young I hugn out with kc0cc (wb0zla) while he operated his station |
| 17:19.45 | T0mW | prpplague: which is why I purchased the Needham Electronics EMP-3 programmer, it did CPLDs |
| 17:20.01 | prpplague | T0mW: ahh cool, i looked at those |
| 17:20.04 | T0mW | jbevren: much easier to get the ticket now. |
| 17:20.07 | prpplague | T0mW: wasnt sure about getting one |
| 17:20.10 | prpplague | T0mW: you like yours? |
| 17:20.30 | T0mW | prpplague: it's been a good investment, I've made money with it. |
| 17:20.30 | prpplague | T0mW: hows it run under linux? |
| 17:20.35 | T0mW | prpplague: it won't |
| 17:20.41 | T0mW | prpplague: again: vmware |
| 17:20.42 | prpplague | T0mW: you sure? |
| 17:21.05 | jbevren | T0mW: kc0cc is a retiree license (veteran, viet nam) |
| 17:21.21 | prpplague | maybe i am thinking of a different unit |
| 17:21.23 | jbevren | he's been inactive since the bank got the KY out |
| 17:21.36 | T0mW | prpplague: the EMP3 is now discontinued. Allen, at Needham, was threatening to send me a non-disclosure so I could port his app over to linux, but he never followed through. |
| 17:21.53 | CosmicPenguin | heh - threatening to send a non disclosure |
| 17:22.02 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: yeh |
| 17:22.02 | prpplague | yea, i'm thinking of the willum |
| 17:22.49 | T0mW | jbevren: heh, KY as in jelly? |
| 17:22.50 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: ?? |
| 17:23.03 | jbevren | T0mW: yeah. They refused to help him refinance so he lost his land |
| 17:23.11 | T0mW | pw |
| 17:23.14 | T0mW | ow |
| 17:23.16 | jbevren | he lives in a rental now, and they wont allow him to set up his antennae |
| 17:23.25 | *** join/#edev tuxmaniac (n=aanjhan@60.254.67.17) |
| 17:23.33 | T0mW | jbevren: BTDT, there is always 30ga wire |
| 17:23.39 | prpplague | T0mW: |
| 17:23.40 | prpplague | Item number: 7630764866 |
| 17:23.40 | jbevren | too true |
| 17:23.47 | jbevren | I told him to set up his mobile rig again |
| 17:24.07 | jbevren | he used to run micropower (~2.5 watts) on 80meter using a pair of tuned antennae on a suburban |
| 17:24.13 | T0mW | jbevren: yeah, I had a lot of fun with a DK3 screwdriver antenna on HF from the mobile |
| 17:24.22 | jbevren | he had em tuned for length as well as distance. Took him some time to get it right :) |
| 17:24.51 | T0mW | jbevren: I just used a random length of 30ga wire, it worked very well. |
| 17:25.39 | T0mW | jbevren: the woman in the apartment downstairs mentioned that she could hear me talking on SSB. Then I installed some ferrite on her speaker wires. |
| 17:26.56 | T0mW | jbevren: I'm waiting for July, there is a big hamfest over in New Jersey. I need to rebuild my outdoor 17M / 40M (18MHz / 7MHz) dipole antenna. |
| 17:27.49 | jbevren | T0mW: Yeah, a local cb operator was running a questionable booster (125 watts) |
| 17:28.06 | jbevren | any tape player (or any device with a magnetic coil) would pick up his audio-range EM leakage |
| 17:28.14 | T0mW | prpplague: in CUPL, you express the device operation in DeMorgan terms |
| 17:30.22 | T0mW | prpplague: this implements a flip-flip in the logic, this is the TuxIDE CPLD: http://rafb.net/paste/results/HeOJWe13.html |
| 17:32.25 | jbevren | enjoy! |
| 17:38.20 | prpplague | hmm |
| 17:38.30 | prpplague | T0mW: whats does the # mean in the equations |
| 17:41.04 | prpplague | T0mW: hmm, several cplds i'm seeing say they have jtag |
| 17:41.08 | prpplague | T0mW: you hear of that? |
| 17:48.32 | prpplague | http://image.weather.com/images/sat/atl_oce_sat_720x486.jpg |
| 17:48.40 | prpplague | looks like we are gonna get some rain |
| 17:59.09 | prpplague | jbevren: the package arrived here on the island 2 weeks ago today |
| 17:59.26 | prpplague | jbevren: every day since them the promise goes like this |
| 17:59.39 | prpplague | jbevren: AM "we'll be delivering it this afternoon" |
| 17:59.51 | prpplague | jbevren: PM "we'll be delivering it tomorrow morning" |
| 18:06.05 | jbevren | prpplague: grumble |
| 18:08.46 | T0mW | prpplague: JTAG is used to download the fuse data. You will see this on the larger parts: FPGA, not on the smaller CPLDs. |
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| 23:57.19 | prpplague | darn |
| 23:57.27 | prpplague | i was hopin tom was still around |
