| 00:06.16 | *** join/#edev chouimat (n=dieu@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 00:11.41 | *** join/#edev redblue (i=star@ppp011.111-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca) |
| 03:22.41 | *** join/#edev LyosNorezel (n=LyosNore@unaffiliated/lyosnorezel) |
| 03:30.46 | *** join/#edev leoncamel (n=leoncame@219.238.107.107) |
| 04:12.10 | *** join/#edev chouimat|ibook (n=dieu@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 04:18.15 | *** join/#edev davidc___ (n=davidc@71.237.88.8) |
| 04:48.48 | *** join/#edev DrZimmerman (n=theo@217-162-225-59.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 04:53.10 | *** join/#edev davidc___ (n=davidc@71.237.88.8) |
| 05:37.34 | *** join/#edev leoncamel_ (n=leoncame@219.238.107.107) |
| 05:59.53 | *** join/#edev davidc___ (n=davidc@71.237.88.8) |
| 06:33.58 | *** join/#edev redblue (i=star@ppp107.108-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca) |
| 08:43.29 | *** join/#edev chouimat|ibook (n=dieu@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 09:05.31 | *** join/#edev chouimat|ibook (n=dieu@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 10:44.20 | *** join/#edev davidc___ (n=davidc@71.237.88.8) |
| 10:54.39 | *** join/#edev davidc___ (n=davidc@71.237.88.8) |
| 11:19.15 | *** join/#edev linac_ (n=lin@121.71.35.72) |
| 11:59.48 | chouimat | morning |
| 12:06.16 | Crofton | gm |
| 12:49.04 | *** join/#edev agaffney_ (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) |
| 13:03.03 | *** join/#edev T0mW (n=Tom@24.238.68.20.res-cmts.sth.ptd.net) |
| 13:03.12 | T0mW | MonMotha: ping |
| 13:04.07 | T0mW | MonMotha: http://productiveworkspace.com/detail.aspx?ID=64 |
| 13:29.09 | *** join/#edev sjhill (n=sjhill@real.realitydiluted.com) |
| 13:38.24 | *** join/#edev isenbeck (n=clint@rrcs-71-40-86-22.sw.biz.rr.com) |
| 14:00.05 | *** join/#edev prpplague (n=dave@65.71.224.163) |
| 14:23.11 | wmat | prpplague: just thought i'd let you know that i haven't ported over the old elinux stuff yet as I've been busy with my day job :( |
| 14:23.21 | wmat | to the new wiki, that is |
| 14:23.31 | prpplague | wmat: ahh ok |
| 14:23.38 | prpplague | wmat: been pretty busy myself |
| 14:23.53 | prpplague | wmat: probably won;t get back to my "hobbies" for another month or so |
| 14:25.50 | wmat | yep, i hear ya |
| 14:29.36 | *** join/#edev GPSFan (n=kenm@12.10.255.248) |
| 14:29.36 | *** mode/#edev [+o GPSFan] by ChanServ |
| 15:35.34 | *** part/#edev Winkie (i=sd@87-194-8-125.bethere.co.uk) |
| 15:39.50 | *** join/#edev redblue (i=star@ppp014.109-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca) |
| 15:45.56 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 15:56.00 | *** join/#edev CosmicPenguin (i=nobody@nat/amd/x-d465fabac1d40f69) |
| 15:56.00 | *** mode/#edev [+o CosmicPenguin] by ChanServ |
| 16:16.26 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: morning crack baby |
| 16:18.36 | CosmicPenguin | yello |
| 16:19.19 | *** join/#edev ico2 (n=ico2@modem-1501.cougar.dialup.pol.co.uk) |
| 16:24.09 | *** join/#edev ccjoe (n=ccjoe@www.clearcore.com) |
| 16:32.05 | *** join/#edev yaman (n=yaman@195.174.133.153) |
| 16:32.50 | *** join/#edev ico2_ (n=ico2@modem-922.chameleon.dialup.pol.co.uk) |
| 16:38.08 | *** join/#edev Crofton (n=balister@hc6521538.dhcp.vt.edu) |
| 16:48.16 | *** join/#edev yaman (n=yaman@195.174.133.153) |
| 18:16.35 | *** join/#edev prpplague^2 (n=dave@mailhost.amltd.com) |
| 18:47.36 | *** join/#edev LyosNorezel (n=lyos@unaffiliated/lyosnorezel) |
| 21:11.19 | *** join/#edev kRutOn (i=locutus@of.the-b.org) |
| 21:28.21 | *** join/#edev wmat (n=wmat@CPE000f6641f21a-CM00111adf5f4a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:35.12 | *** join/#edev T0mW (n=Tom@24.238.68.20.res-cmts.sth.ptd.net) |
| 22:39.28 | MonMotha | what's that philips/NXP ARM part number? LPC....? |
| 22:46.37 | T0mW | MonMotha: ? |
| 22:47.13 | T0mW | MonMotha: I've been using mainly LPC2214 as it has an external RAM bus interface |
| 23:01.42 | *** join/#edev redblue (i=star@ppp235.110-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca) |
| 23:07.35 | MonMotha | T0mW: that's the one |
| 23:07.49 | MonMotha | I was referring to the "ARM du Jour" before the Atmel part became favored for many applications |
| 23:08.55 | T0mW | MonMotha: I had looked at the Atmel parts many times, but just wasn't moved to even try to use them for a design. When the LPC2000 family was introduced, it just seemed "right". |
| 23:10.05 | MonMotha | T0mW: Atmel seems to be a bit more directly OSS friendly at times |
| 23:10.09 | MonMotha | that and I like their other parts |
| 23:10.52 | MonMotha | I wasn't aware that you could buy the NXP parts at digikey, which makes them slightly more attractive |
| 23:11.05 | MonMotha | pricing seems on par, really depends on what features you want though |
| 23:11.42 | T0mW | OH YEAH! If it isn't in Digikey or Mouser, it would have to be a really nice part before I attempt to have it sampled! heh |
| 23:12.24 | MonMotha | yeah, the headache of getting things like that in small production quantity (10s to hundreds) is often pretty bad |
| 23:12.28 | T0mW | Digikey recently revamped their website. I find it much more usable than before, and it was pretty good then |
| 23:12.38 | MonMotha | agreed. their new one is better |
| 23:12.53 | MonMotha | I think they were responding to the website rennovation done by Mouser |
| 23:12.59 | T0mW | no click click to the get the datasheet info, it is on the page |
| 23:13.09 | MonMotha | of course, Mouser's was MUCH more needed since they didn't used to even have parametrics |
| 23:14.01 | T0mW | fsck Mouser, their site sux. It looks real pretty but seems to have been designed for the PHB, or the guy in the purchasing department, to look at. Almost uselss search engine |
| 23:14.37 | MonMotha | really? I've not had that problem at all |
| 23:14.45 | MonMotha | their old website blew, for sure |
| 23:14.51 | T0mW | I'd sent Mouser email explaining to them why, as a design engineer, I won't use them and I use Digikey. |
| 23:15.47 | MonMotha | I tend to prefer Mouser. They have slightly cheaper prices, absolutely no minimums whatsoever, and most of what I need |
| 23:15.54 | T0mW | Digikey's search tool just seems to be less sensitive to queries and gives a broader population return. Then you can narrow that set down. |
| 23:15.59 | MonMotha | the thing that tends to drive me to digikey is when I need something that mouser just doesn't stock |
| 23:16.06 | T0mW | heh |
| 23:16.20 | MonMotha | oh, that and mouser's PRINTED catalog is better |
| 23:16.27 | MonMotha | I agree that digi-key's website is better |
| 23:17.17 | T0mW | I think that Mouser is listening though. I'd bitched about not having a 'stocked item' selection in the search and then they put one in. |
| 23:17.45 | T0mW | nothing like getting several hundred hits for stuff they don't even stock. |
| 23:17.58 | MonMotha | I think their rationale for not having it was that they always list stocked items first unless you say otherwise |
| 23:18.08 | MonMotha | but yes, it's nice to not get "1000 parts found!" when none of them are stock |
| 23:19.00 | T0mW | It looks like both Digikey + Mouser are keeping a vast datasheet collection, so that you can find something you want, then talk to them about ordering some. |
| 23:19.22 | MonMotha | not a bad business decision |
| 23:19.30 | T0mW | More of an engineering resource replacing the old Line Cards |
| 23:19.56 | MonMotha | two very important things need to be true before I can spec a part: I need a full datasheet, and I need to be able to buy it in small quantity (10 or less) |
| 23:20.12 | MonMotha | or sample it for cheap and buy in medium (100+) quantity |
| 23:20.24 | MonMotha | the issue I have is that I often get people coming to me who want 50 of something |
| 23:20.45 | T0mW | I'm doing a cost analysis on the one board I removed the LPC2138 and replaced it with LPC2214 + external RAM. Need to justify to myself that the cost is not going to substantially increase. |
| 23:21.16 | MonMotha | why the change? |
| 23:22.58 | T0mW | whole bunch of reasons, primarily the 32K SRAM of the LPC2138 was really pushing the limits. From experience, if you think you need it, design it in . |
| 23:23.49 | MonMotha | ah, definately |
| 23:24.06 | T0mW | Secondary, that design really is a low price version of another design. So, I tore the guts out of the larger design and packaged it into the cheaper ones form factor. |
| 23:24.07 | MonMotha | there's tons of stuff on this board that I'm wrapping up that probably won't be required |
| 23:24.20 | MonMotha | but putting pads down for external pull-up resistors is free if you've got the space |
| 23:24.29 | T0mW | Software is essentially the same between the two systems. |
| 23:24.40 | MonMotha | reving the board because the internal pull-up on your micro isn't strong enough is decidedly not free |
| 23:25.43 | T0mW | MonMotha: I put a 1mm FPC connector on the bottom of the board, it is wired into the SPI bus. Just in case, someday we need to populate that connector and hook another board to it. |
| 23:27.03 | MonMotha | T0mW: my boards tend to have plenty of that |
| 23:27.08 | MonMotha | and lots of unused IO brought out to headers |
| 23:28.11 | T0mW | nod, good practice IMO. I usually try to put some spare pins on the board as well, you never can tell if a cut & jumper might be needed in the future. |
| 23:35.59 | MonMotha | T0mW: heh, it also makes the hardware hackers happy |
| 23:36.21 | MonMotha | as does labeling your JTAG connector in an excruciatingly obvious manner |
| 23:36.39 | MonMotha | whether or not that's desirable is up for debate |
| 23:37.48 | T0mW | No probem, I keep a layer #255 "HIDDEN" and move the text label to that layer. The CAM operation doesn't include layer 255 into the gerber |
| 23:38.18 | MonMotha | T0mW: oh yeah, but I'm talking about actually putting it on the silk |
| 23:38.36 | MonMotha | like I said, may or may not be desirable |
| 23:38.53 | T0mW | MonMotha: the LPC2214 has CRP, Code Read Protection, once set, the JTAG is disabled. |
| 23:39.32 | MonMotha | lots of procs have that |
| 23:39.34 | T0mW | Also, the ISP, In System Programming, does not allow for an external Flash read or write. |
| 23:40.05 | MonMotha | plenty of procs have those features, though usually you can still perform a full chip erase over the ISP interface |
| 23:40.21 | T0mW | correct, as in "oops!" |
| 23:40.26 | T0mW | heh |
| 23:41.05 | MonMotha | well, being able to do nothing but a full chip erase doesn't allow much leeway for hardware hackers |
| 23:41.24 | MonMotha | yes, once erased you can load your own code back up, but with absolutely no reference, coming up with your own code is often a bit difficult |