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| 13:45.57 | prpplague | http://www.surpluscomputers.com/store/main.aspx?p=ItemDetail&item=CES11487 |
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| 14:14.58 | g1powermac | prpplague, I presume you could run some form of linux on that thing, right? |
| 14:15.51 | prpplague | g1powermac: i doubt it, but at a min the ntsc lcd would be nice for building retro gaming devices as well as burning your own videos on the mini-dvd's |
| 14:16.05 | g1powermac | thats true |
| 14:16.24 | prpplague | g1powermac: or even using the ntsc lcd for videos in the car |
| 14:16.34 | prpplague | g1powermac: just with a different video source |
| 14:16.39 | g1powermac | yea |
| 14:16.47 | g1powermac | is that a true ntsc lcd though? |
| 14:17.04 | g1powermac | or is the ntsc stuff in the mobo of that thing? |
| 14:17.31 | prpplague | g1powermac: usually the ntsc portion is in the lcd |
| 14:17.38 | g1powermac | cool |
| 14:17.43 | g1powermac | nice price then |
| 14:18.17 | prpplague | g1powermac: or more accurately, the ntsc decoding is usually done on the pcb attached to the lcd seperate to the mb of the dvd |
| 14:19.16 | g1powermac | fun |
| 14:19.32 | g1powermac | *part |
| 14:19.41 | g1powermac | and its actually working |
| 14:19.52 | g1powermac | was quite amazed how easy it was to setup |
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| 14:39.40 | cbrake | prpplague: ping |
| 15:05.45 | agaffney | http://www.woot.com/default.aspx <-- anyone think it will run linux? :) |
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| 17:13.43 | prpplague | cbrake: pong |
| 17:17.06 | prpplague | HOLY COW |
| 17:17.08 | prpplague | http://www.efytimes.com/efytimes/fullnews.asp?edid=20184&magid=11 |
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| 17:22.19 | chouimat|busy | prpplague: old news ... |
| 17:23.59 | cbrake | prpplague: well, zcomax wants a order commitment before signing the source deal -- sigh ... |
| 17:28.11 | prpplague | chouimat|busy: old? |
| 17:28.17 | prpplague | chouimat|busy: when did you know about it? |
| 17:28.26 | prpplague | cbrake: yea, we had to do the same |
| 17:31.29 | chouimat|busy | prpplague: a week ago ... when they sent the email on the lpc mailing list iirc :) |
| 17:36.21 | prpplague | chouimat|away: ahh, i'm not on the lpc list |
| 17:36.21 | prpplague | thats amazing though |
| 17:36.30 | prpplague | i wonder if nxp will do a better job of marketing their arm cores than sharp did |
| 17:37.14 | chouimat|away | prpplague: NXP is the new name of philips iirc? |
| 17:39.05 | ds2 | sharp did not market their arms :P so, that's a trivial job to do better ;) |
| 17:45.23 | CosmicPenguin | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5551137361.html |
| 17:48.12 | prpplague | chouimat|away: nxp is a spinoff company from phillips |
| 17:48.46 | prpplague | ds2: they did market their SoC'S just not to the smaller companies, and their documentation was horrific |
| 17:49.28 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: cute box |
| 17:50.24 | CosmicPenguin | I saw the board at OLS |
| 17:50.26 | CosmicPenguin | really well done |
| 17:50.50 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: nice |
| 17:51.14 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 17:57.51 | cbrake | CosmicPenguin: I've been using compulab pxa270 products -- I'm fairly impressed with their boards. The amount of stuff they cram on a module is amazing. |
| 17:58.45 | prpplague | $120 for the core module seems a little expensive |
| 17:59.49 | cbrake | prpplague: pxa270 module is less that $100 in quantity -- I've not found anyone else this low. |
| 17:59.56 | cbrake | prpplague: also depends on options, etc. |
| 18:00.16 | prpplague | cbrake: sorry i meant the gx core module |
| 18:00.31 | cbrake | prpplague: nod |
| 18:01.11 | prpplague | cbrake: do you really like the xscale arch over other similiar arm9 designs? |
| 18:02.08 | prpplague | well i guess mattel/fisherprice's contract with sharp will be taken over by nxp |
| 18:02.13 | ds2 | ewwwwwwww pxa |
| 18:02.28 | ds2 | die marvell die |
| 18:02.49 | prpplague | ds2: intel still sells pxa |
| 18:02.56 | prpplague | ds2: so its not just marvell |
| 18:03.13 | ds2 | really? thought intel only has the ixp? |
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| 18:07.25 | prpplague | ds2: no they still have some pxa sales |
| 18:07.41 | prpplague | ds2: techincally, intel has the right to make and sell any xscale based device |
| 18:09.18 | ds2 | I see... so marvell is really a intel licenee? |
| 18:09.31 | ds2 | (and this is despite intel not providing docs anymore?#$!@#!@#@$@##) |
| 18:10.10 | prpplague | ds2: more like a sub-license, as the xscale is actually a license from ARM of course |
| 18:10.35 | ds2 | right... I just assume one has to have both licenses to do xcale |
| 18:10.50 | ds2 | revive the strongarm!!! ;) |
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| 18:14.01 | cbrake | prpplague: well, I did not really care what was on the compulab module, but the compulab module is the cheapest module in its class. |
| 18:14.34 | ds2 | cbrake: did they make you buy the "dev kit" before they will sell you the module? |
| 18:14.41 | cbrake | ds2: yup |
| 18:14.41 | prpplague | cbrake: url? |
| 18:14.51 | ds2 | sigh... |
| 18:15.09 | cbrake | prpplague: http://www.compulab.co.il/x270/html/x270-cm-datasheet.htm |
| 18:15.36 | cbrake | ds2: they are only interested in dealing with people who are serious about volume production |
| 18:15.41 | ds2 | cbrake: is there a company that goes by applied something that has it for around the same price? |
| 18:15.54 | cbrake | ds2: applied data systems? |
| 18:15.58 | ds2 | yeah |
| 18:16.19 | prpplague | cbrake: interesting |
| 18:16.24 | cbrake | ds2: they are more into custom products |
| 18:16.30 | ds2 | for low volume, I think it might have been cheaper to lay out your own board then to buy their damn dev kits |
| 18:16.33 | prpplague | cbrake: so you were getting the module sub $100 ? |
| 18:16.38 | cbrake | ds2: ADS that is |
| 18:16.50 | ds2 | cbrake: I see... I talked to both and the dev kit requirement was the killer |
| 18:17.17 | cbrake | prpplague: yep, PXA270, UCB1400, 64MBSDRAM, 128MB NAND, RTC, for $87 or so |
| 18:17.29 | prpplague | ds2: yea ADS makes their money from dev kits and support |
| 18:17.41 | prpplague | cbrake: that is a good price |
| 18:17.45 | cbrake | ds2: LogicPD makes a modules/dev board for reasonable cost |
| 18:18.00 | cbrake | ds2: but their module price is quite a bit more than compulab |
| 18:18.16 | prpplague | cbrake: our s3c24xx boards are alot less than that, but don't include alot of the features on that board |
| 18:18.34 | prpplague | i would never ever ever buy another board from logicPD |
| 18:18.35 | cbrake | prpplague: compulab does real engineering -- check out the board density: http://www.compulab.co.il/x270/img/x270-cm-l-top-m.jpg |
| 18:18.39 | prpplague | their boards are shite |
| 18:18.59 | prpplague | cbrake: i have them beat |
| 18:19.18 | prpplague | cbrake: see /msg |
| 18:34.40 | ds2 | prpplague: if they ever become orderable... ;) |
| 18:34.57 | ds2 | IT LINKED!!!!!!!! there is an end to the ball of yarn!!!!! |
| 18:35.32 | prpplague | ds2: ? |
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| 18:35.34 | ds2 | whoa and it boots |
| 18:35.39 | prpplague | ? |
| 18:35.43 | ds2 | just doing some port forward of an old patch |
| 18:36.09 | ds2 | <--- total mm newbie who got a port forward for a mm patch dumped on him |
| 18:36.53 | ds2 | I am impressed by how resilient the mm module is to random hacking! |
| 18:45.28 | Exiles | ok |
| 18:45.44 | Exiles | does that mean the wifi card worked well |
| 18:46.01 | ds2 | Exiles: no... that's personal stuff... this is work stuff :( |
| 18:46.14 | Exiles | oh ok |
| 18:46.25 | ds2 | the mm subsystem is one of those things that one should not touch even with a 40 meter pole ;) |
| 18:46.50 | ds2 | drivers and arch specific stuff are so much more understandable |
| 18:49.03 | Exiles | work ick |
| 18:49.22 | ds2 | right |
| 18:50.08 | ds2 | btw, are there some cheap bluetooth enabled devices under <$50 that is hackable to run Linux on? |
| 18:51.30 | Exiles | I know there are some serial ones |
| 18:52.40 | ds2 | yeah... serial is easy to get but I want bluetooth... closest is a gumstix |
| 18:52.52 | ds2 | but that's ~$100 |
| 18:55.09 | prpplague | ds2: you are going to have a hard time finding a bt enable device for less than $50 |
| 18:55.27 | prpplague | ds2: best would be to get a device with usb host and just add a bt dongle |
| 18:55.58 | ds2 | prpplague: finding a BT device is not thathard... it is the linux part (i.e. the Wii controller is a tad under $50) |
| 18:56.09 | ds2 | prpplague: know a usb host enabled device for under $50? |
| 18:56.10 | prpplague | ds2: thats what i meant |
| 18:56.38 | prpplague | ds2: portable or not? |
| 18:56.52 | ds2 | portable preferred |
| 18:57.04 | ds2 | but must be under 10W =) |
| 18:57.33 | prpplague | ds2: how about a gamepark |
| 18:57.46 | ds2 | let me look up what that is |
| 18:58.00 | prpplague | ds2: you'd need to provide power for the usb host, but thats easy |
| 18:58.10 | ds2 | *nod* |
| 18:58.26 | ds2 | is this the GPX2-F100? |
| 18:59.28 | prpplague | yea |
| 19:00.03 | ds2 | for under $50? |
| 19:00.14 | ds2 | official store has it listed for $200 |
| 19:00.38 | prpplague | ds2: usually see them for around $50 used |
| 19:01.26 | prpplague | ds2: dig up one of the tvnow devices and add a usb host connector |
| 19:01.51 | ds2 | if I knew how to get Linux onto the TVnow.... |
| 19:02.35 | prpplague | http://wiki.buici.com/wiki/Sharp_Board_Support_Package |
| 19:02.58 | ds2 | no, physically get it on there |
| 19:03.03 | ds2 | still donno where the JTAG pins are |
| 19:04.32 | ds2 | with only one unit, your method of finding jtag doesn't apply |
| 19:04.57 | ds2 | i shall wait the market shall provide ;) |
| 19:04.59 | prpplague | ds2: not like they cost a zillion dollars |
| 19:05.08 | ds2 | not like they are easy to get ;) |
| 19:05.13 | prpplague | ds2: yea, someone will have to bite the bullet |
| 19:05.28 | ds2 | i prefer someone to violate an NDA and drop hints ;) |
| 19:08.11 | ds2 | it is not like it is a current product |
| 19:09.02 | prpplague | not really the point |
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| 19:09.42 | prpplague | for me, the fact that you'd prefer someone to break the law than do something yourself doesn't speak well for you |
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| 20:27.36 | dijenerate | hi all |
| 20:27.42 | dijenerate | goodmorning |
| 20:28.00 | dijenerate | have you guys seen this before? |
| 20:28.01 | dijenerate | http://www.dynamism.com/vega/main.shtml |
| 20:41.47 | prpplague | dijenerate: yea thats been around for awhile |
| 20:42.07 | prpplague | dijenerate: most of the umpc devices have kinda not done well because of price and capabilities |
| 20:56.42 | ds2 | prpplague: guess we look at things differently... with all the crap that is going on, IMO, an NDA has zero value to me... the only thing I respect is a verbal agreement between 2 people not a peice of paper written by lawyers for lawyers |
| 20:59.26 | prpplague | ds2: unfortunately the business world doesn't work that way |
| 21:00.00 | ds2 | prpplague: yes, that is true... but doesn't the way I see things. |
| 21:00.10 | prpplague | ds2: ?? |
| 21:00.34 | ds2 | I just don't agree with the business world! |
| 21:01.49 | prpplague | ds2: well, i have to earn a living, and i don't intend on breaking any NDA |
| 21:01.58 | ds2 | =) |
| 21:05.32 | prpplague | ds2: any i think you will find atleast in #edev, you are probably in the minority |
| 21:05.54 | ds2 | probally true |
| 21:06.47 | prpplague | i count 14 nicks that do professional embedded dev |
| 21:08.11 | ds2 | I go by a rule when working with people - we agree what can or cannot be talked about before hand... the NDA is a secondary thing |
| 21:09.58 | prpplague | ds2: yea, well, most companies won't trust you with that kind of arrangement |
| 21:11.49 | ds2 | seeing how the verbal agreements I usually do are stronger then their NDAs, it hasn'tbeen a problem |
| 21:13.43 | prpplague | ds2: i can't argue about something i have no knowledge of |
| 21:14.05 | prpplague | ds2: i do know that 95% of the companies i deal with would never share information without an NDA in place |
| 21:14.35 | ds2 | anyways, enough of a philosophical debate... Ineed to go back to the equivalent of your banging head on desk :-S |
| 21:24.09 | Exiles | as long as your verbal agreement won't stop me from implementing my own personal ideas for myself at home, and if it's actully worth somthing copywriting it formyself, as long as it dosn't infrindge upon company property, it's all good with me :) |
| 21:24.58 | ds2 | what is theirs is theirs, what is mine is mine... |
| 21:25.14 | Exiles | exactly |
| 21:25.20 | Exiles | thats how I feel it should be |
| 21:26.01 | prpplague | ds2: uh if that is your belief how can you can justify someone giving away what doesn't belong to them? i.e. the jtag locations? |
| 21:32.04 | ds2 | prpplague: think you missed my entire argument |
| 21:32.40 | ds2 | NDAs (the ones i see) are not mutual/fair as such...they will be teached as such |
| 21:32.47 | ds2 | but anywyas |
| 21:33.18 | prpplague | so because you think they aren't fair you think its ok to violate them? |
| 21:34.22 | Exiles | what does the usual NDA say about personal invertions? |
| 21:34.28 | Exiles | done in your own time |
| 21:34.37 | Exiles | not on company clock |
| 21:34.54 | ds2 | nothing.. the inventions assignment paperwork that covers that |
| 21:35.18 | ds2 | NDA just says you can't say stuff if it is not public |
| 21:35.19 | Exiles | hmmm |
| 21:35.54 | ds2 | usually, those are one way... you can't say stuff but if you tell them anything, they can announce it to anyone |
| 21:36.11 | prpplague | ds2: correct, thats why you have THEM sign an NDA |
| 21:36.54 | ds2 | yes and shortly after, a guy with a badge comes and escorts you off their grounds |
| 21:36.59 | prpplague | ds2: which still leaves the question why you think someone who has volunterily signed an NDA should break the NDA by release information that does not belong to them |
| 21:37.08 | prpplague | ds2: what? |
| 21:37.27 | Exiles | so, whats usally said about personal Inventions |
| 21:37.49 | prpplague | Exiles: thats normally in your employement contract |
| 21:37.54 | Exiles | okay |
| 21:37.56 | ds2 | I have tried asking for a mutual NDA... and the answer is usually a polite version of go away |
| 21:38.04 | Exiles | I've yet to graduate |
| 21:38.26 | Exiles | semi concered about my own things that I want to continue designing |
| 21:38.36 | prpplague | ds2: i think we are talking two different things, are you talking about getting an NDA with your employer? |
| 21:38.44 | Exiles | and working on and such |
| 21:39.16 | ds2 | prpplague: with potential clients |
| 21:39.44 | prpplague | ds2: ahh, you are doing contract work? |
| 21:40.01 | ds2 | I am not saying people should go around shouting everything they know... I am saying there should be more then just an NDA to bind things.... if all that have is an NDA, that's wworthless |
| 21:40.12 | ds2 | prpplague: *nod* |
| 21:40.51 | prpplague | ds2: i don't know about worthless, but we get mutual NDA just about every day of the week |
| 21:41.23 | ds2 | prpplague: maybe it is a size thing or they do things differently... I've been asked to sign an NDA just to get an interview |
| 21:41.39 | prpplague | ds2: and whats wrong with that? |
| 21:41.52 | ds2 | seems a bit goofy for just a mere chat |
| 21:42.40 | prpplague | ds2: not really, if they are hiring lets say a linux kernel developer, they might not want their competion knowing they have a linux product in the works |
| 21:43.45 | ds2 | prpplague: this is where I would value a statement saying ... this is confidental info.. and that's all it takes for me to never talk about it |
| 21:43.46 | prpplague | Exiles: i've never had a problem with NDA's, the only problems i've had is when a potential employer tries to sneak something in the contract where they claim ownership over EVERY invention you come up with, on or off company time |
| 21:44.08 | prpplague | ds2: hehe, thats what the NDA says |
| 21:44.14 | prpplague | ds2: (or should say) |
| 21:44.17 | ds2 | prpplague: it says a lot more |
| 21:44.30 | ds2 | hence my dislike of a paper written by lawyers for lawyers |
| 21:45.20 | prpplague | ds2: of course it depends on the actual NDA , but most are pretty standardized |
| 21:46.44 | prpplague | ds2: either way, the person who signed the NDA choose to do so, he wasn't forced. the question still is, why do you think its ok to break the NDA ? |
| 21:48.09 | ds2 | like I said, I don't respect the paper. |
| 21:49.36 | prpplague | ds2: so for argument sake, if you don't "respect" certain laws, you feel you can just disregard them? i.e. if you don't think its really reasonable to have 55mph speed limit its ok to disregard it? |
| 21:49.38 | ds2 | a lot of the ones I have seen aren't that standardize and there are a lot of weasel words in |
| 21:50.11 | ds2 | NDAs are not law |
| 21:50.13 | ds2 | different things |
| 21:50.23 | prpplague | they are contractual law |
| 21:51.30 | ds2 | they are themselves not a law... they are governed by the contract laws |
| 21:52.33 | prpplague | ds2: but they are a contractual agreement, you expect someone to violate their contractual agreement strictly because you don't respect it? |
| 21:53.20 | prpplague | ds2: if you don't like NDA's, don't sign one, but don't expect someone who does sign one to break it because of your beliefs |
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