| 00:08.15 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: It should be accessible from www.hybotics.us/hammer-kit.zip |
| 00:25.54 | sunrunner20 | grrr |
| 00:26.14 | sunrunner20 | I want regular people to be able to use it |
| 00:26.19 | sunrunner20 | but not corperations |
| 00:27.41 | MonMotha | use or distribute? |
| 00:27.48 | MonMotha | there's a distinction |
| 00:27.55 | sunrunner20 | to use |
| 00:28.03 | MonMotha | well, then you're into EULAs |
| 00:28.16 | *** part/#edev dbtid (i=m1bmcfmr@cpe-65-24-173-154.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 00:28.20 | MonMotha | which have questionable enforcibility to begin with |
| 00:28.33 | MonMotha | I'm still unaware of one ever actually being upheld to the letter |
| 00:29.05 | MonMotha | distribution is very clear cut due to the way copyright law works |
| 00:29.08 | sunrunner20 | EULA is still a lisence :) |
| 00:29.10 | MonMotha | but use is not |
| 00:29.21 | MonMotha | a EULA is really more of a contract than a license |
| 00:29.53 | MonMotha | the parts of it which apply to distribution (and all of them pretty much say that distribution is not allowed) would certainly be a license in every sense |
| 00:30.09 | MonMotha | however, the parts which prohibit certain kinds of usage fall into a somewhat uncharted territory |
| 00:30.23 | MonMotha | especially for things which are sold at retail |
| 00:31.37 | MonMotha | the general consensus seems to be that prohibitions on the number of simultaneous usages (i.e. making copies without distribution) are likely to be at least somewhat legit, but terms on exactly how you can and cannot use the product ("usage of this product by men from mars is prohibited") are probably not |
| 00:31.52 | MonMotha | but I'm unaware of either of those cases being specifically heard in a court of law in the USA |
| 00:32.11 | MonMotha | usually there's some other circumstance which overshadows that kind of nitty gritty |
| 00:33.00 | MonMotha | it also tends to depend on how the user agreed to the EULA |
| 00:33.16 | MonMotha | in the case of retail shrink wrapped software, the EULA is pretty much shoved down your throat |
| 00:33.31 | MonMotha | if a product is sold with negotiations on the usage terms, then it really is just a contract |
| 00:33.40 | MonMotha | and you can contract to do/not do just about anything |
| 00:34.31 | MonMotha | you'll note that most "open source friendly" licenses concern themselves only with distribution and liability shielding |
| 00:34.33 | MonMotha | not actual usage |
| 00:34.56 | MonMotha | part of that is philosophical, but part of it is that people aren't sure you CAN limit how a product is used by the end user |
| 00:35.18 | MonMotha | at least not with a click-wrap "license agreement" |
| 00:35.46 | MonMotha | being able to limit distribution, however, is very well understood |
| 00:38.12 | MonMotha | the part that supposedly makes commercial EULAs enforcible is the fact that you can supposedly not accept it and return the software for a refund |
| 00:38.32 | MonMotha | the part that others argue makes them unenforcible is, well, good luck getting said refund on opened commercial software |
| 00:39.09 | SpeedEvil | That's not really a valid argument though. |
| 00:39.16 | SpeedEvil | That's the problem with the shop |
| 00:39.23 | SpeedEvil | s/the/a/ |
| 00:39.26 | MonMotha | but all software shops are like that |
| 00:39.44 | MonMotha | and the original publisher won't offer up the $$$, either |
| 00:39.55 | SpeedEvil | Simply because all software shops violate the law does not mean that it's legal |
| 00:39.58 | MonMotha | in the case of free (as in beer) softare, this isn't an issue |
| 00:40.07 | SpeedEvil | (taking the hypothetical case that it's not legal) |
| 00:40.17 | MonMotha | there's some other stuff that comes into play when you sell somebody something at retail |
| 00:40.32 | SpeedEvil | Chinese company |
| 00:40.41 | MonMotha | the whole "fitness for a particular purpose" implied warranty |
| 00:40.43 | SpeedEvil | Selling GPLd software with no license. |
| 00:40.47 | SpeedEvil | s/soft/firm/ |
| 00:41.03 | MonMotha | well, that's simple copyright violation if they don't agree to the licesne or violation of the license (which is a contract issue) if they do accept the license |
| 00:41.14 | SpeedEvil | Of course. |
| 00:41.15 | MonMotha | actually, I think the GPL includes a termination clause |
| 00:41.22 | MonMotha | which makes it copyright infringement |
| 00:41.29 | SpeedEvil | However, I think the chinese courts may be somewhat less interestted. |
| 00:41.32 | MonMotha | that matter is pretty darned clear |
| 00:41.47 | MonMotha | but yes, Chinese courts in general do not respect US copyright (or copyright in general, though they do respect trademark law in many cases) |
| 00:42.04 | SpeedEvil | However, it's a seperate offence for the UK distributors. |
| 00:42.26 | SpeedEvil | But getting any prosecution or even anyone to start making noise about it is hard. |
| 00:42.32 | MonMotha | yes, you could nail the UK arm probably |
| 00:42.40 | SpeedEvil | There isn't one. |
| 00:42.41 | MonMotha | you'd have to have some sort of legal presence in the UK to do it |
| 00:42.50 | SpeedEvil | Nor a US one. |
| 00:42.56 | MonMotha | there has to be some entity in the US if they are selling it |
| 00:43.05 | MonMotha | if they are selling it through a reseller, then the reseller is liable |
| 00:43.27 | MonMotha | you can't do business in a country without some sort of presence, either a corporate entity of some sort of as an individual |
| 00:43.37 | SpeedEvil | Of course - now getting someone to actutually chase the reseller is going to be hard. |
| 00:43.53 | MonMotha | or a business owned by an individual, of course (such as a sole proprietorship or partnership) |
| 00:44.31 | MonMotha | actually, this is likely to be a simple civil matter |
| 00:44.37 | MonMotha | the copyright owner can sue them in civil court |
| 00:44.45 | MonMotha | they'd need to register their copyright, which is fairly simple |
| 00:44.46 | SpeedEvil | Yep - copyright violation for one. |
| 00:45.01 | SpeedEvil | linux kernl/busybox |
| 00:45.09 | MonMotha | I doubt this qualifies as criminal copyright to begin with (and that doesn't itself eliminate the possibility of civil issues even if it does) |
| 00:45.11 | MonMotha | oh, busybox? |
| 00:45.17 | MonMotha | just chuck them on the hall of shame :) |
| 00:45.25 | SpeedEvil | that's not being updated |
| 00:45.51 | SpeedEvil | And the lawyers mentioned on the busybox site can't do anything as there is no US presence. |
| 00:45.56 | MonMotha | eventually Erik Anderson may go after them |
| 00:46.03 | MonMotha | well, his dad I think is the lawyre |
| 00:46.13 | MonMotha | is the product being distributed in the US? |
| 00:46.19 | CosmicPenguin | well - now they use the open source legal group |
| 00:46.22 | SpeedEvil | Not as far as I kno |
| 00:46.24 | MonMotha | if it is, there's somebody who is liable |
| 00:46.24 | CosmicPenguin | the name escapes me |
| 00:46.30 | MonMotha | then you can't go after them in the US |
| 00:46.33 | MonMotha | it's that simple |
| 00:46.39 | SpeedEvil | I know - I'm in the UK. |
| 00:46.49 | SpeedEvil | And bought it from a UK distributor. |
| 00:46.51 | MonMotha | ok...I don't know UK law as well as US law, I'm sorry |
| 00:46.58 | MonMotha | but I'm guessing SOMEBODY in the UK is still liable |
| 00:47.05 | SpeedEvil | In principle, yes. |
| 00:48.47 | MonMotha | I know that UK law can be quite different from US law |
| 00:48.54 | Dr{Afk} | warftpd has an interesting license he did that precludes governments.. if that helps? |
| 00:48.54 | MonMotha | especially wrt how case precedent comes up |
| 00:49.30 | MonMotha | well, in the case of free (as in beer) software you may be able to ge tby with more since the user isn't on the hook for anything if they reject the usage terms |
| 00:49.47 | MonMotha | unlike with shrink wrapped software where, in practicality, they eat the cost of the purchase if they reject the EULA terms |
| 00:58.58 | SpeedEvil | I don't personally see that as any different from for example, a bed shop refusing to take back a matress that a shop employee had urinated on. |
| 00:59.26 | SpeedEvil | But lawyers are strange beasts. |
| 00:59.47 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Did you get the new hammer kit? |
| 01:00.12 | RobotGuy | It has a prepatched kernel, which is real nice. |
| 01:00.23 | Mirell | Mmm, EVDO card. |
| 01:02.23 | RobotGuy | www.hybotics.us/hammer-kit.zip |
| 01:02.47 | Dr{Afk} | ya i downloaded it |
| 01:03.10 | Dr{Afk} | thanks.. |
| 01:03.26 | RobotGuy | Good |
| 01:08.47 | Dr{Afk} | http://elinux.org/Hammer_How_to_Reflash_Apex_and_kernel |
| 01:09.04 | Dr{Afk} | ok is that some app prompt ? apex> |
| 01:10.24 | Dr{Afk} | looks like special shell? is that part of the bootloader? |
| 01:10.32 | Dr{Afk} | ya must be. |
| 01:10.48 | RobotGuy | APEX can be used interactively, but you don't need to use it that way to flash hammer. |
| 01:11.23 | Dr{Afk} | ok so that is a shell running on the hammer as an interactive shelll to zmodem up a new image |
| 01:11.31 | Dr{Afk} | err xr thats xmodem. |
| 01:12.17 | Dr{Afk} | 2 methods correct? using the boot loader to reload a new image or the flyswatter. right? |
| 01:12.49 | Dr{Afk} | well i guss you could probably dd directly to the flash from a running kernel on the board. |
| 01:13.46 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Copy hammer.cfg, hammer.ocd to a dir under root. |
| 01:14.21 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Then copy apex.bin, zImage, and the rootfs to that dir. |
| 01:14.49 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: You need to have built openocd and have the ftdi libraries installed per the Wiki. |
| 01:16.28 | Dr{Afk} | prebuilt one exists on the cd |
| 01:16.37 | Dr{Afk} | seems to work ok had to adjust the lib's |
| 01:16.55 | RobotGuy | Yes, there are prebuilt files there. |
| 01:17.18 | RobotGuy | openocd seems to like to be run as root, but it's silly. |
| 01:17.41 | Dr{Afk} | ok so i will have to plugin the flyswatter for this i presume this is a jtag programmign method we are doing currently. |
| 01:18.14 | Dr{Afk} | i have both boards all setup. i just put posts on them yeasterday and booted it thats as far as i got. |
| 01:18.52 | Dr{Afk} | hmm jtag is not keyed.. what is pin 1? |
| 01:19.37 | Dr{Afk} | ill go look at the doc if you dont recall |
| 01:21.40 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Yes, you need the flyswatter |
| 01:22.51 | Dr{Afk} | what doc has the pcb silk screen layout? |
| 01:23.39 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Red wire to outside edge of board |
| 01:24.14 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: I think there are just inages of the carrier board right now. |
| 01:24.33 | Dr{Afk} | hmm ok so the jtag header what is pin 1? |
| 01:24.40 | RobotGuy | Yep, this is JTAG programming |
| 01:25.35 | Dr{Afk} | yep. so the connector is a jtag header but i need to know what the pinout is or i will have the wrong polarity on the connector |
| 01:25.42 | RobotGuy | The key on the JTAG conector goes towards the opposite end of the Hammer (red wire on cable towards edge of board) |
| 01:26.37 | RobotGuy | I have my carrier board mounted on W.A.L.T.E.R. now. |
| 01:27.16 | Dr{Afk} | ok looks like underneath the pin 1 is marked as a square pad. |
| 01:27.29 | Dr{Afk} | just cant tell from the top of the hammer when its on the carrier. |
| 01:28.36 | Dr{Afk} | does the usb port on the fly work to program ? |
| 01:28.52 | RobotGuy | Dr{Afk}: Yes |
| 01:28.55 | Dr{Afk} | cool |
| 01:29.26 | RobotGuy | I have some scripts I wrote that automates a lot of stuff. |
| 01:58.22 | Dr{Afk} | im going to reboot.. bbiab |
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| 02:03.46 | Dr{Who} | i managed to munge my kernel bad this week : c ) was starting to get silly and time to reboot. |
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| 02:26.31 | RobotGuy | This week was not good for me, but it is looking up again. :) |
| 02:27.17 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: I guess prp didn't get that update done for today? |
| 02:27.34 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: No, I don't think he did. |
| 02:28.08 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: I noticed he wasn't on today. I wonder if the storm in Dallas was that bad |
| 02:29.08 | RobotGuy | He does not get on here much on weekends, if at all. |
| 02:29.37 | ce_geek | Yea |
| 02:29.59 | ce_geek | Today is Friday though, right? He said he might get that release done for Friday |
| 02:30.04 | ce_geek | Not a big deal at all, just curious. |
| 02:33.35 | RobotGuy | Oh, it IS Friday! |
| 02:33.49 | ce_geek | :) |
| 02:34.15 | RobotGuy | Well, not having a regular schedule like school or work, my days get all crossed up sometimes. |
| 02:34.22 | ce_geek | Understandable. |
| 02:34.37 | ce_geek | This has been an odd week for me too. |
| 02:35.06 | RobotGuy | My week started out on Monday with my power wheel chair stranding me for several hours. |
| 02:35.14 | RobotGuy | It went downhill from there. |
| 02:35.18 | ce_geek | Well that's handy! |
| 02:35.19 | ce_geek | :-/ |
| 02:35.39 | RobotGuy | I had to call a friend to come rescue me. |
| 02:35.49 | ce_geek | Yikes. did the chair fail? |
| 02:36.54 | RobotGuy | The controller did fail to operate properly. It would not let me move the chair at all. I had to put the wheels in freewheel mode and backup to get it to a place out of the way of everyone. |
| 02:37.31 | RobotGuy | My chair is just out of warantee too. :( |
| 02:37.35 | ce_geek | ! |
| 02:37.43 | ce_geek | What was the longer term solution? |
| 02:38.05 | RobotGuy | I have to get up and get my legs strong enough to walk distances. |
| 02:38.46 | RobotGuy | With my balance problems, it can be interesting at times walking. |
| 02:38.52 | ce_geek | Will you be able to get your chair reparied? |
| 02:38.55 | ce_geek | *repaired |
| 02:39.33 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: Not likely. They want $80.00 just for somebody to come out and listen to me and see for themselves what it does. |
| 02:39.51 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: Jeez |
| 02:40.05 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: It will probably require a new controller to fix - around $1500.00 - $1800.00 |
| 02:40.33 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: Lots of lawyers built into such controllers I bet. |
| 02:40.56 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: Probably. I have had all sorts of problems with this chair ever since I got it. |
| 02:41.11 | RobotGuy | It's never been fully working right. |
| 02:41.21 | ce_geek | Joystick type control? |
| 02:41.24 | RobotGuy | Yes |
| 02:41.39 | ce_geek | Is it one of those inductive joysticks? |
| 02:41.49 | RobotGuy | I know where to tap into the control system. |
| 02:42.09 | RobotGuy | I am not sure what type of joystick it is. |
| 03:15.33 | Dr{Who} | flash write_bank is depricated.. so is erase current svn of openocd wont work with the shipped scripts. |
| 03:16.02 | Dr{Who} | err write_binary that is |
| 03:19.06 | RobotGuy | Just build the openocd from the CD |
| 03:19.19 | Dr{Who} | i just changed the configs |
| 03:19.27 | Dr{Who} | to match what the newer openocd wants |
| 03:19.38 | RobotGuy | That may not work for Hammer though. |
| 03:19.59 | Dr{Who} | not sure when they changed it i will check svn.. but probably a good idea to ship out newer configs if they depricated it then it has been on the slate for killing it for a long time. |
| 03:20.34 | RobotGuy | When starting out, it's best to go with what is on the CD. |
| 03:21.08 | Dr{Who} | i was not able to make it work with my system. didnt seem to like my kernel driver's |
| 03:21.22 | RobotGuy | The openocd from the CD? |
| 03:21.27 | Dr{Who} | nope |
| 03:21.48 | RobotGuy | Do you have the libftdi installed? |
| 03:22.16 | Dr{Who} | the cd came with |
| 03:22.19 | RobotGuy | You have to build openocd with the correct option or it will not work |
| 03:22.27 | RobotGuy | It's on the CD |
| 03:22.55 | Dr{Who} | ya i built with ft2232-libftdi |
| 03:25.04 | RobotGuy | What was the problem you had? |
| 03:25.15 | Dr{Who} | would not see the flyswatter would die |
| 03:25.44 | Dr{Who} | let me try again with the pre built version |
| 03:25.54 | Dr{Who} | now that i have built my own ft2232 lib |
| 03:26.41 | Dr{Who} | Error: ft2232.c:1345 ft2232_init_ftd2xx(): unable to open ftdi device: 18 |
| 03:29.31 | Dr{Who} | ahh it needed usbfs mounted |
| 03:32.20 | RobotGuy | I think you built openocd with the wrong option. Needs to be for libftdi |
| 03:32.33 | RobotGuy | Oh, OK, that would make a difference. |
| 03:32.44 | Dr{Who} | the one i built worked fine programming |
| 03:32.49 | RobotGuy | Cool |
| 03:33.04 | Dr{Who} | just needed differnt commands because this one is old and those commands are no longer used |
| 03:35.42 | Dr{Who} | https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/openocd-development/2008-February/000977.html |
| 03:36.06 | Dr{Who} | just recently happened. but it looks like it was on the slate for a while. |
| 03:36.42 | Dr{Who} | they just removed it finally to force people to use the new functions. |
| 03:37.04 | Dr{Who} | prob would be a good idea to update the stuff here |
| 03:38.08 | RobotGuy | Yes, it probably would be good to do updates. |
| 03:40.45 | Dr{Who} | would have to look at how many are using the old version and would be ok to update.. |
| 03:41.06 | Dr{Who} | like me i prefer to get svn stuff most times to get the latest fixes / features |
| 03:41.18 | Dr{Who} | as apposed to someoen elses bin's |
| 03:42.03 | Dr{Who} | at least after i have a good test like using the distro tools. |
| 03:43.01 | Dr{Who} | well i have to get going wife wants me to pick her up.. have a good one.. ill probably do more on this this weekend. |
| 03:47.02 | RobotGuy | I usually like to get the latest sources too. |
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| 18:47.45 | Dr{Who} | morning all. |
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| 19:06.18 | landley | Morning. |
| 19:06.25 | landley | drwho: so you have a hammer board now? :) |
| 19:20.03 | Dr{Who} | so far so good. |
| 19:20.12 | Dr{Who} | ya i plugged it in yeasterday |
| 19:20.33 | Dr{Who} | currently just playing with flashing it with the swatter. |
| 19:21.10 | Dr{Who} | using the provided openocd bin's are good. compiling from svn the openocd is not so good. some of the commands are now deprecated in the hammer.ocd |
| 19:21.50 | Dr{Who} | im playing with it now to see if i can get it to work. The newer openocd flashes it ok but fail's at the end during some check of the data written.. |
| 19:21.58 | Dr{Who} | and then restarts the erease / write process |
| 19:22.33 | Dr{Who} | dont know if i will play with this much more but i figured since im here i may as well see if i can figure it out. |
| 19:23.05 | Dr{Who} | Warning: jtag.c:1234 jtag_check_value(): value captured during scan didn't pass the requested check: captured: 0x00000004 check_value: 0x00000009 check_mask: 0x00000009 |
| 19:23.06 | Dr{Who} | Warning: jtag.c:1180 jtag_read_buffer(): in_handler reported a failed check |
| 19:23.06 | Dr{Who} | Error: arm7_9_common.c:2114 arm7_9_write_memory(): JTAG error while reading cpsr |
| 19:23.06 | Dr{Who} | Info: options.c:50 configuration_output_handler(): error: access caused data abort, system possibly corrupted |
| 19:25.44 | Dr{Who} | reading the emails from the openocd developers they seem to have some internal issues as to direction. mostly revolving around using sectors or addresses |
| 19:27.44 | landley | I have yet to build openocd from source. |
| 19:28.51 | Dr{Who} | ya its probably not a battle worth taking on at this time.. it does not work and since it is deep into how the data is written to a device like this something i dont have enough exp in yet i will probably move on. |
| 19:28.53 | landley | I'm happy to have somebody else play with that part of it. :) |
| 19:28.57 | Dr{Who} | but it should be looked into by someone.. |
| 19:29.03 | landley | Flasher and bootloader, both parts of the board-specific weirdness I try not to get involved in. |
| 19:29.09 | landley | It just doesn't generalize... |
| 19:29.19 | Dr{Who} | ya |
| 19:29.34 | landley | Poke prpplague about it, maybe. |
| 19:29.40 | Dr{Who} | ya its on my list.. |
| 19:29.46 | Dr{Who} | speaking of lists.. wiki? can i get access? |
| 19:29.51 | Dr{Who} | so i can keep notes like this. |
| 19:29.59 | landley | My laptop doesn't have net access at my new job (just the company supplied desktop), so I can't hang out on irc during the day from houston. |
| 19:30.02 | Dr{Who} | ie.. dont use svn of openocd its broken : c ) |
| 19:30.33 | Dr{Who} | i can keep it in my own for now but would prefer to let all get use |
| 19:30.48 | landley | Next week I hope to be in a hotel that actually has net access so I can at least get on in the evenings more reliably than going out to the Route 59 Cafe. |
| 19:31.10 | Dr{Who} | travelling? |
| 19:31.51 | landley | back and forth between austin and houstin, anyway. |
| 19:32.05 | Dr{Who} | ouch. a bit of a drive |
| 19:32.12 | landley | Houston monday-friday, austin on weekends at the moment. |
| 19:32.29 | landley | Still helping Fade unpack stuff in the condo. |
| 19:32.47 | landley | It's about 3 hours each way if traffic isn't bad. |
| 19:32.53 | landley | If traffic _is_ bad, it can easily be 5. :P |
| 19:33.34 | Dr{Who} | i hate driving so i cant even emagin.. i have a prius and it gets less than 1m per day |
| 19:33.47 | Dr{Who} | well unless the wife or kid need me to take them all over the place. |
| 19:33.53 | landley | So I've got arm-tinycc to build a "hello world" but it immediately segfaults. |
| 19:33.53 | landley | Poking at it... |
| 19:33.53 | landley | Hammer has hardware floating point support, right? |
| 19:34.20 | landley | I don't mind driving. I do mind $40 to fill up the tank. |
| 19:34.47 | landley | It would actually be slightly cheaper to stay in Houston. :P |
| 19:35.06 | Dr{Who} | no |
| 19:35.23 | Dr{Who} | at least not the binary that is loaded in now |
| 19:35.37 | Dr{Who} | it loads a software floating point lib in the current flash image |
| 19:36.37 | Dr{Who} | btw.. in the end i did figure out my boot initrd problem. its a bug in bash a buffer read out of bounds. |
| 19:37.03 | Dr{Who} | i posted to bash but it was rejected will have to try again another day. |
| 19:37.54 | Dr{Who} | i also posted to the lkml the problem could be better handled in the kernel. if process 1 segfaults it spinlocks the kernel.. should instead dump a message and panic and and halt. |
| 19:56.11 | *** join/#edev chouimat|work (n=mchouina@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 20:14.53 | Dr{Who} | landley.. few questions will save me time.. does the kernel need any special patches to work on the hammer. |
| 21:05.01 | *** join/#edev purl (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 21:05.01 | *** topic/#edev is a channel for the discussion of hacking small consumer electronic devices, mostly ARM based; Hammer Development boards now available at http://www.tincantools.com/ |
| 21:46.42 | *** join/#edev bbradley (n=bbradley@82-32-35-42.cable.ubr05.azte.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 21:50.11 | Dr{Who} | anyone alive? that understands apex a little? i am a syslinux user so thats a bit new to me. |
| 21:51.27 | Dr{Who} | my distro relies heavily upon /proc/cmdline to control the init process i may have to change this. Changing this on syslinux is a matter of modifing a file syslinux.cfg this does not seem as trivial on apex's boot loader.. |
| 22:13.37 | *** join/#edev ce_geek (n=ce_geek@roger-blanchette-4.umelst.maine.edu) |
| 23:20.11 | *** join/#edev RobotGuy (i=robotguy@dsl093-038-120.pdx1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 23:20.38 | RobotGuy | Greetings |
| 23:28.34 | Dr{Who} | hwdy |
| 23:43.54 | RobotGuy | How is everything today? |
| 23:44.28 | Dr{Who} | not bad.. so far things are moving along ok. |
| 23:45.03 | Dr{Who} | Q. for you. |
| 23:45.14 | RobotGuy | OK |
| 23:45.16 | Dr{Who} | your hammer is now mounted on your robot so |
| 23:45.29 | RobotGuy | Yep |
| 23:45.31 | Dr{Who} | the system you are building will have some bash scripts or something i presume |
| 23:45.37 | Dr{Who} | that will do the work you want. |
| 23:45.44 | Dr{Who} | or are you going with bin's? |
| 23:45.54 | RobotGuy | I will be using Python and perhaps some bash scripts. |
| 23:46.02 | Dr{Who} | ok cool. |
| 23:46.19 | Dr{Who} | so will you be using the flash device then to hold your code so you can edit it? |
| 23:46.54 | RobotGuy | I have the important stuff in my initrd, but the rest will be stored on a 2 GB thumb drive. |
| 23:47.10 | Dr{Who} | ahh ok so you will have more room.. got it. |
| 23:47.23 | RobotGuy | I will have a native toolchain on my Hammer also. |
| 23:47.25 | Dr{Who} | your going to only then maybe modify your init process to start some programs up |
| 23:47.40 | RobotGuy | Yes, probably start a Python script |
| 23:47.46 | Dr{Who} | native toolchain? |
| 23:48.08 | RobotGuy | I have also built PHP and TCL for Hammer. Yes, a full C/C++ toolchain on Hammer. |
| 23:48.20 | Dr{Who} | ok so not uclibc then |
| 23:48.30 | RobotGuy | Yes, it is uLibC |
| 23:48.44 | RobotGuy | Built from Buildroot |
| 23:48.52 | Dr{Who} | oh ok well i guess i figured that was already on the hammer by default.. |
| 23:49.04 | Dr{Who} | at least the stuff that is provided on the cd |
| 23:49.04 | RobotGuy | No, the toolchain takes quite a bit of space. |
| 23:49.19 | Dr{Who} | ahh so then dont have uclibc libc? |
| 23:49.36 | RobotGuy | Everything should be uclibc since it is all built from buildroot. |
| 23:50.07 | Dr{Who} | ya just checked looks complete im sure more libes can be added but it has the standard libc stuff |
| 23:50.24 | RobotGuy | I want to port eggdrop to Hammer also, so I can have an IRC BOT running on HAmmer |
| 23:50.25 | Dr{Who} | you just adding libc++? |
| 23:50.31 | RobotGuy | Yes |
| 23:50.35 | Dr{Who} | ahh ok.. |
| 23:51.14 | RobotGuy | I have to build a battery supply for Hammer so it can run off battery or wallwart |
| 23:51.24 | Dr{Who} | that would be fun then you can command it via an /msg |
| 23:52.00 | RobotGuy | I am planning a full IRC and WEB interface for W.A.L.T.E.R. He will be a well connected robot. :) |
| 23:52.14 | Dr{Who} | neet. i like that idea |
| 23:52.50 | Dr{Who} | brb going to see if the kernel i built will boot |
| 23:52.53 | RobotGuy | The WiFi isn't reliable right now, so I have to wait for a 2.6.24 or later kernel. |
| 23:52.55 | RobotGuy | OK |
| 23:53.47 | Dr{Who} | zwave |
| 23:54.09 | Dr{Who} | if possible i think it may be a more relevent communication method.. |
| 23:54.21 | Dr{Who} | very reliable and the range is good |
| 23:54.36 | Dr{Who} | and less complicated and prone to probs than 802.11x |
| 23:54.40 | Dr{Who} | also uses less power |
| 23:55.08 | Dr{Who} | though it wont just connect anywhere it will have to connect to some zwave->ethernet bridge |
| 23:55.18 | Dr{Who} | so its less portable.. but probably better for around the house. |
| 23:55.39 | RobotGuy | zwave? |
| 23:55.52 | Dr{Who} | ya its used for home automation |
| 23:56.08 | RobotGuy | Ahhhh, interesting possibilities there.. |
| 23:56.25 | Dr{Who} | http://www.z-wave.com/modules/AboutZ-Wave/ |
| 23:57.33 | Dr{Who} | has huge benifits over 802 for that type of stuff power, range, open standards simplicity |
| 23:57.39 | Dr{Who} | and cheep |
| 23:58.14 | Dr{Who} | Linux Hammer 2.6.22 #1 Sat Mar 8 15:45:02 PST 2008 armv4tl unknown |
| 23:58.18 | Dr{Who} | ok thats done. |
| 23:58.44 | Dr{Who} | now lets see about the init |