| 00:02.59 | g1powermac_PB | GPSFan: I have no clue either |
| 00:03.04 | g1powermac_PB | we'll see tomorrow |
| 00:03.44 | g1powermac_PB | I think either prpplague misread something, or there's something wrong with the datasheet |
| 00:04.00 | GPSFan | g1powermac_PB: ok, it's important, if one suspects incorrect datasheet/layout info to validate known/unabmiguous pins |
| 00:04.25 | GPSFan | suchas the sdram signals. |
| 00:04.29 | g1powermac_PB | yea, I figure he'd do that |
| 00:04.46 | GPSFan | but I'm sure prpplague knows how to do all that// ;>) |
| 00:06.05 | GPSFan | g1powermac_PB: did T0mW ever say what happened to his bricked Z2? |
| 00:06.49 | g1powermac_PB | yea, he said he sent it to someone, I think he said rossimo |
| 00:07.38 | GPSFan | ah, let me check the archives. |
| 00:08.01 | g1powermac_PB | hmm, he didn't mention it on #zipit though, he said it here |
| 00:09.40 | GPSFan | T0mWg1powermac_PB: roxfan has a bricked unit that I sent him that he was going to strip |
| 00:09.51 | g1powermac_PB | oh its roxfan |
| 00:09.56 | g1powermac_PB | ok |
| 00:10.18 | GPSFan | from the #edev archives. so roxfan2 what happened to the z2 borad? did you strip off the parts or what? |
| 00:11.18 | g1powermac_PB | wants to strip the parts off this old phone. . . |
| 00:12.06 | roxfan2 | no... i was hoping i can figure out jtag points but it turned out harder than i thought |
| 00:12.35 | g1powermac_PB | can't believe the size of the resistors and caps on this thing, they're like grains of sand |
| 00:12.41 | roxfan2 | and then i had to do other stuff |
| 00:12.43 | GPSFan | 0402 |
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| 00:12.59 | g1powermac_PB | roxfan2: ahh |
| 00:14.51 | GPSFan | roxfan: what are you going to do with the board now? |
| 00:15.36 | roxfan | well if prpplague really figured it out i can try doing jtag stuff again |
| 00:17.31 | roxfan | at least i have a working jtag cable and program for pxa270... |
| 00:18.52 | GPSFan | I stripped the active parts of a working Z1 to find out some of the unknowable data about it's guts. tom stripped all the parts (passive and active) off one too. What sort of jtag cable & program do you have? |
| 00:20.12 | roxfan | i used the lm3s-811 eval board |
| 00:20.55 | roxfan | it has a jtag out connector which bypasses the cpu when you connect ground pins of the connector |
| 00:21.27 | GPSFan | so that's your target it comes with a jtag interface that works with xscale too? |
| 00:21.30 | roxfan | and i used bbflash which is a port of intel's jflashmm for something called "balloon3" |
| 00:22.00 | GPSFan | you have used this setup on an xscale part? |
| 00:22.04 | roxfan | yep |
| 00:22.07 | GPSFan | cool. |
| 00:22.25 | roxfan | had to adapt the program to work using ftdi's jtag dll instead of parallel port... |
| 00:23.06 | GPSFan | so this is a windows solution. |
| 00:23.18 | roxfan | well the program works on linux too |
| 00:23.28 | GPSFan | that's good |
| 00:23.45 | roxfan | i tried both urjtag and openocd... urjtag did detect the chip but memory reads did not work for some reason |
| 00:24.17 | roxfan | and openocd wants to upload a debug monitor to the chip and for that it needs trst and nsrst signals |
| 00:24.27 | roxfan | which my board does not provide |
| 00:25.01 | GPSFan | what xscale part? |
| 00:25.05 | roxfan | (lm3s-811 one, the target does have them) |
| 00:25.09 | roxfan | pxa270 |
| 00:25.49 | roxfan | in a different package though (vf-bga) |
| 00:26.06 | GPSFan | the chip inside is the same. |
| 00:26.33 | GPSFan | as long as you can read & write dram & flash, it should be ok |
| 00:27.06 | GPSFan | does your jtag use the same fdti chip as the TCT Flyswatter? |
| 00:27.06 | roxfan | took me 20h to dump 32 megs... i'm sure it can be improved but i needed it done only once so didn't care much :) |
| 00:27.33 | roxfan | it's 2232d |
| 00:27.56 | GPSFan | that's the same problem the nslu2 folks ran into with the xscale in the nslu2. |
| 00:28.12 | GPSFan | very slow operation |
| 00:28.48 | roxfan | pxa270 has special jtag instructions which affect only flash pins |
| 00:29.19 | roxfan | so it's only 76 bits instead of 504 or so |
| 00:29.21 | GPSFan | what's your opinion of porting that application to the flyswatter? |
| 00:29.54 | roxfan | it can be done... but i don't really need it myself |
| 00:30.20 | GPSFan | you don't but all us folks who want to flash our Z2's might. |
| 00:30.24 | roxfan | porting urjtag migh be faster too |
| 00:31.14 | roxfan | i'm not sure why it didn't work for me... could be something i changed making it compile under mingw |
| 00:33.58 | GPSFan | where did you get bbflash |
| 00:34.59 | roxfan | http://balloonboard.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/balloon/trunk/bbl/ |
| 00:35.09 | roxfan | my bad, it's just "bflash" |
| 00:38.59 | GPSFan | ah, that's better, bbflash is some warez cracking program |
| 00:48.07 | g1powermac_PB | hmm, so bflash is what you're using to program the pxa270 over jtag |
| 00:48.35 | roxfan | well, it's one of the options |
| 00:50.40 | g1powermac_PB | I wonder if my jtag cable would work with it |
| 00:51.24 | g1powermac_PB | http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/Catalog.cfm?Nav1=Products&Nav2=Cables&Cat=Cable |
| 00:51.33 | g1powermac_PB | mines the jtag3 cable, the parallel port one |
| 00:52.03 | GPSFan | for windows users, ocd commander supports PXA27x parts, I've used it before on PPC quite successfully. |
| 00:53.46 | GPSFan | bflash with a wiggler type parallel port interface seems like it would be a good linux alternate to ocdcommander. |
| 00:53.57 | GPSFan | for pxa parts. |
| 00:54.20 | g1powermac_PB | what about openocd though |
| 00:56.08 | GPSFan | g1powermac_PB: prpplague swears by it. the only time I really needed jtag was debugging the early kernel bootup on a ppc board I was getting kernel 2.6.x ported. openocd only supports arm at the moment. |
| 00:56.40 | GPSFan | openocd it the jtag prograqm of choice for the hammer |
| 00:56.48 | g1powermac_PB | ahh |
| 00:59.47 | g1powermac_PB | http://projects.linuxtogo.org/pipermail/openembedded-devel/2008-January/004065.html |
| 00:59.56 | g1powermac_PB | seems to be usable |
| 01:00.45 | g1powermac_PB | err, maybe not, misread that |
| 01:00.51 | GPSFan | I bet that is what prpplague will use if/when he finds the jtag pins |
| 01:03.13 | g1powermac_PB | well, unfortunately he only has the board, the rest of the parts are here |
| 01:03.29 | g1powermac_PB | so he can't really run it without some of the other parts |
| 01:03.38 | GPSFan | all he needs is to plug in a 5V wally. |
| 01:04.05 | GPSFan | if the jtag is alive he should be able to get the pxa270 chip id |
| 01:04.06 | g1powermac_PB | yea, but without a keyboard, how would you turn it on? |
| 01:04.29 | GPSFan | just press the on/off key on the front |
| 01:04.51 | GPSFan | all the keybaord is a rubber membrane |
| 01:05.20 | g1powermac_PB | hmm, I thought the keyboard part had a metalic thing on it |
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| 01:05.59 | GPSFan | iirc it powers up automatically when you put in the 5V power adapter, mine just did. |
| 01:06.16 | g1powermac_PB | oh, true, it does do that |
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| 03:48.16 | RobotGuy | Squashfs is not hard to create afterall. |
| 03:58.02 | Redhatter | squashfs is eeeeaasy! :-) |
| 03:58.27 | Redhatter | Easier than making an ISO image |
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| 04:09.04 | RobotGuy | Possibly. |
| 04:09.12 | RobotGuy | I just needed the squashfs-tools package |
| 04:09.57 | RobotGuy | I will need to make a new ISO also. |
| 04:34.09 | Madsy | Hah, yay. Finally figured out how I can make binaries with plain opcodes. Perfect to test my emulator with. |
| 04:34.53 | Madsy | It seems that the binary BFD is an invalid target for the linker, but it works for objcopy -O |
| 04:39.14 | Madsy | Hm, I see when registers are set to point to a label, (ADD r2, pc, #16), the immediate is two instructions too short. Is this because pc points two instructions ahead? |
| 04:47.08 | RobotGuy | If all goes well, I'll have a brand new PCLinuxOS ISO image that includes a pre-made buildroot with a C/C++ toolchain. Yes, I know buildroot can't be used from a CD due to creation of files within the buildroot directory. |
| 04:47.55 | RobotGuy | The toolchain should be usable via PATH though. |
| 04:55.59 | Redhatter | Wouldn't it be easier to just build the toolchain? |
| 04:59.46 | RobotGuy | I am just building the toolchain. |
| 05:00.09 | RobotGuy | You can't do that on a CD. |
| 05:01.08 | RobotGuy | I'm also going to make a bootable thumb drive, but unfortunately will have to go to a friend's home to test it. |
| 05:02.05 | Redhatter | I realise you can't make it on the CD... but you can just compile the toolchain... seems silly to store *all* of buildroot + a compiled toolchain, when you could just store the latter? |
| 05:03.05 | RobotGuy | I don't think the toolchain only can be stored. Buildroot has hard coded paths. Where it is built is where the toolchain has to be run from. |
| 05:05.31 | RobotGuy | I think I can fool it a bit though - I will know if this is possible soon. |
| 05:07.06 | Redhatter | http://dev.gentoo.org/~redhatter/misc/arm-elf.Makefile.bz2 <-- That may be a useful makefile for placing a toolchain on the CD. You'll have to rip out the newlib and place in something to build uClibc instead, but that'd be a starting point. |
| 05:08.32 | RobotGuy | Will that require less space on the CD? I am adding this buildroot to a squash fs image. |
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| 05:28.58 | RobotGuy | Making a squashfs image really drags my PC down. |
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| 07:24.06 | [AD]Turbo | yo |
| 08:06.32 | KazaLite | hi all |
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| 08:20.22 | Mineirin | PÁ |
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| 10:02.40 | Mr_Bonga | hi |
| 10:02.53 | Mr_Bonga | can anyone help me about a UDP socket?? |
| 10:03.37 | Mr_Bonga | my application receive udp packet's , but it losing some packets |
| 10:04.17 | Mr_Bonga | and if I use ethereal to capture traffic...everything goes wright |
| 10:04.44 | Mr_Bonga | I think the problem it's the internal buffer sizer or window size |
| 10:04.56 | Mr_Bonga | but I don't know how to configure it |
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| 13:39.55 | g1powermac_PB | morning prpplague |
| 13:40.05 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: greetings |
| 13:40.32 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: it is looking more and more likely that the test pads that are circled just above the SoC are the jtag |
| 13:40.58 | prpplague | goes for coffee |
| 13:41.09 | g1powermac_PB | ahh, like TP1006? |
| 13:41.39 | g1powermac_PB | or the ones that aren't labeled but circled? |
| 13:43.18 | chouimat|work | morning |
| 13:43.41 | g1powermac_PB | heya chouimat|work |
| 13:46.25 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: its the ones that are circle but not labeled |
| 13:46.29 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: masked over |
| 13:47.17 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: i'll do more testing today |
| 13:47.31 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: should have some more solid info before EOD |
| 13:48.29 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: i've removed some of the glue |
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| 13:48.47 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: i desoldered the 1.2k resistor at the top to have a look |
| 13:48.47 | g1powermac_PB | k, sounds good |
| 13:49.23 | g1powermac_PB | hopefully it all works again :-) |
| 13:49.27 | prpplague | the silk screen on this is terrible |
| 13:49.35 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: yea i'll put it back the way i found it |
| 13:49.36 | RobotGuy | Greetings |
| 13:49.40 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: else i'll buy it |
| 13:49.40 | g1powermac_PB | hehe, k |
| 13:49.46 | prpplague | RobotGuy: hey |
| 13:50.05 | g1powermac_PB | morning RobotGuy |
| 13:50.23 | g1powermac_PB | prpplague: btw, once you find the jtag, you can actually test it |
| 13:50.30 | RobotGuy | prpplague, g1powermac_PB: G'Morning. |
| 13:50.32 | g1powermac_PB | just plug in power and it'll automatically turn on |
| 13:50.51 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: yea, i'll have to do some checking first |
| 13:50.58 | g1powermac_PB | not sure what would happen when nothing is connected to it though |
| 13:51.08 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: yea thats what i have to check |
| 13:51.29 | g1powermac_PB | alrighty |
| 13:51.34 | g1powermac_PB | lemme get you what voltage and stuff it uses anyway |
| 13:51.34 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: if the LED backlight for the lcd comes on without a load, its possible to over heat |
| 13:51.42 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: that would be great |
| 13:52.08 | prpplague | i have alot of work to do today, so it will probably be this afternoon before i do much |
| 13:53.24 | g1powermac_PB | looks like +5v at 1.2a |
| 13:53.42 | g1powermac_PB | alright, thats cool, I'm in no rush :-) |
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| 14:03.47 | g1powermac_PB | bbiab, going to work |
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| 14:29.01 | prpplague | anyone got a reference schematic for a pxa270 dev board? |
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| 14:31.16 | ce_geek | cracks his knuckles and starts writing. |
| 14:31.24 | ce_geek | prpplague: ;-) |
| 14:31.34 | ce_geek | prpplague: I'll probably have questions for you today :) |
| 14:31.35 | prpplague | ce_geek: greetings |
| 14:31.37 | prpplague | ce_geek: np |
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| 14:33.20 | ce_geek | prpplague: One thing that came up with my presentation last week was a discussion about what memory is where. Perhaps you can help me straighten that out. When I do 'df', I see /dev/ram0 of size 2.4M, and I see /dev/mtdblock1 of size 12.1M. Why is this split up this way? |
| 14:34.17 | SpeedEvil | ce_geek: mtdblock should normally be physical flash. |
| 14:34.22 | prpplague | ram0 is a virtual "hard drive" in sdram |
| 14:34.32 | prpplague | where as the mtdblock is physical flash |
| 14:34.57 | ce_geek | prpplague: Okay. What physical device is being used for this virtual hard drive? |
| 14:35.02 | ce_geek | And why is it 2.4M? |
| 14:35.02 | SpeedEvil | SDRAM |
| 14:35.49 | prpplague | ce_geek: the sdram is being used, and the 2.4 was simply the size needed to hold the initial root file system with a little left over for temporary files |
| 14:36.26 | ce_geek | prpplague: Hmmn but the hammer board has 32MB of SDRAM (16M x 16 bit)... How come only about half of that is accounted for? |
| 14:36.58 | prpplague | ce_geek: do a cat /proc/meminfo |
| 14:37.12 | prpplague | ce_geek: that list all of the sdram usage |
| 14:37.36 | ce_geek | MemTotal: 30404 kB |
| 14:38.22 | prpplague | ce_geek: about 2mb is used for some stacks and the kernel |
| 14:38.26 | prpplague | ce_geek: so thats normal |
| 14:38.26 | ce_geek | Heh, I guess you need memory hanging around for purposes other than disk storage :) |
| 14:38.49 | g1powermac | ugh, haven't been here in three days and its a mess |
| 14:40.25 | prpplague | g1powermac: i think i found a reference schematic |
| 14:40.29 | prpplague | g1powermac: for pxa270 |
| 14:40.29 | ce_geek | prpplague, SpeedEvil: So just to clarify, /dev/ram0 and /dev/mtdblock1 are both on the same physical device, it's just the way it was split up? |
| 14:40.37 | prpplague | ce_geek: no |
| 14:40.46 | g1powermac | prpplague, oh nice |
| 14:40.48 | prpplague | ce_geek: /dev/ram0 is sdram, mtdblock1 is flash |
| 14:41.19 | g1powermac | prpplague, where did you find it? |
| 14:41.44 | prpplague | google |
| 14:41.49 | ce_geek | prpplague: Okay, I see. The hammer has 32MB SDRAM + 16 MB Flash. |
| 14:41.54 | prpplague | http://soc-it.com/download/training/embed/Intel(R)%20PXA27x%20Processor%20Developer's%20Kit%20Schematics.pdf |
| 14:42.01 | prpplague | ce_geek: correct |
| 14:42.28 | g1powermac | prpplague, very nice |
| 14:44.16 | ce_geek | prpplague: What if I wanted to have things live in /mnt/flash when the system booted? Is this possible without using JFFS2? |
| 14:44.19 | g1powermac | stares at the 1200 page pxa27x developers guide he found the other day. . . |
| 14:44.38 | g1powermac | never seen such a huge doc on one chip |
| 14:45.04 | prpplague | ce_geek: yep - http://www.elinux.org/Hammer_How_to_JFFS2_Root |
| 14:45.22 | ce_geek | prpplague: So it is not possible without using JFFS2? |
| 14:46.55 | prpplague | ce_geek: you can use other filesystems if you so choose, however you need to make sure you use a filesystem that does wear leveling and other features needed for flash |
| 14:49.22 | ce_geek | prpplague: Ah, okay. Right now, /mnt/flash is just open space i can write to after the thing boots. If I wanted to have some files stay in there after a powercycle, I need to implement some sort of filesystem. Is that accurate? |
| 14:49.49 | prpplague | ce_geek: nope |
| 14:49.55 | ce_geek | prpplague: :( |
| 14:50.13 | prpplague | ce_geek: /mnt/flash is the nor flash and mounted |
| 14:50.31 | prpplague | ce_geek: it is currently running JFFS2 and is read/write enabled |
| 14:50.42 | prpplague | ce_geek: so it does store data |
| 14:51.00 | prpplague | ce_geek: the root file system that is mount on /dev/ram0 is in sdram |
| 14:51.11 | g1powermac | ponders what fs is on the zipit, never took notice |
| 14:51.15 | prpplague | ce_geek: and when sdram looses its power, it looses it's data |
| 14:52.18 | g1powermac | it is jffs2, according to the dmesg |
| 14:53.21 | ce_geek | prpplague: Okay, that make sense. Still a little stuck on /mnt/flash though. The way the hammer is shipped, I can write files to /mnt/flash, but they disappear when the system loses power too. Same reason? |
| 14:53.42 | prpplague | ce_geek: uh it shouldn't |
| 14:53.52 | prpplague | ce_geek: if /mnt/flash is mounted with jffs2 |
| 14:54.14 | prpplague | ce_geek: after your system boots, issue the mount command with no arguments and pastebin the results |
| 14:54.19 | ce_geek | prpplague: That explains the misunderstanding then. :) |
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| 14:56.12 | ce_geek | prpplague; Heh.... okay. Stuff definitely stayed. Not sure why I thought otherwise. I was sure that I had put stuff in there and that it had disappeared. That is likely because of all the jtag'g I've been doing.... at one point I did that more often than powercycling when I was trying to get stuff working. |
| 14:57.15 | ce_geek | prpplague: Sorry about that! |
| 14:57.20 | g1powermac | prpplague, oh, I had a question about openocd I wanted to ask you |
| 14:57.44 | g1powermac | prpplague, can you use it with only the four main jtag pins? ie, no ntrst and such? |
| 14:59.10 | prpplague | ce_geek: yes indeed the jtag flash script does erase the jffs2 |
| 14:59.30 | prpplague | ce_geek: which is why i recommend using the bootloader to load things like a new kernel or initrd |
| 14:59.34 | ce_geek | prpplague; Alrighty, this makes sense now. I just got confused. |
| 14:59.41 | ce_geek | prpplague; Another great point. |
| 14:59.56 | prpplague | g1powermac: generally to be effective it needs to have control of both the nTRST and nRST |
| 15:00.03 | prpplague | ce_geek: np |
| 15:00.35 | g1powermac | prpplague, ok, so now we must see if the zipit board has those lines out |
| 15:00.45 | prpplague | g1powermac: yea |
| 15:00.56 | g1powermac | and if it does, then i need a new jtag cable, mine doesn't have those |
| 15:01.07 | prpplague | g1powermac: i suspect that the nTRST is brought out as well since it needs to be pulled up |
| 15:01.31 | g1powermac | its just a really simple 6 pin connector with the four main jtag lines and vcc/gnd |
| 15:01.35 | prpplague | g1powermac: well all the testing i'll do will be with the flyswatter |
| 15:01.48 | g1powermac | ahh, ok |
| 15:02.11 | g1powermac | was looking at the flyswatter this morning |
| 15:02.11 | sjhill | prpplague: good morning |
| 15:02.14 | g1powermac | looks interesting |
| 15:02.16 | ce_geek | There are 3 chips on the hammer: The 2410, FLASH, and what's the third? |
| 15:02.17 | sjhill | prpplague: where's my Nail? |
| 15:02.19 | prpplague | sjhill: greetings |
| 15:02.28 | prpplague | sjhill: getting close, we are doing the QA now |
| 15:02.38 | prpplague | ce_geek: sdram |
| 15:02.41 | sjhill | cool |
| 15:03.07 | g1powermac | I hate to spend more money on another jtag cable thingie though |
| 15:03.25 | prpplague | g1powermac: yea, this one is worth it, hehe |
| 15:03.40 | ce_geek | At a real high level, why sdram and flash? Why not just have flash? |
| 15:03.41 | g1powermac | of course you'd say that ;-) |
| 15:04.01 | SpeedEvil | ce_geek: most flash is not fast enough to run code from. |
| 15:04.09 | sjhill | most, if not all |
| 15:04.12 | g1powermac | prpplague, what else can it do beside the extra serial port? |
| 15:04.17 | SpeedEvil | ce_geek: and has sharply limited writes, and very slow writes too. |
| 15:04.25 | sjhill | Linux VR tried that...and failed |
| 15:04.32 | prpplague | ce_geek: although you can run XIP, you really need some ram to execute programs in |
| 15:04.34 | SpeedEvil | sjhill: there are sorts of flash that intel claim is fast enough. |
| 15:04.51 | sjhill | SpeedEvil: and you believe them? |
| 15:04.52 | SpeedEvil | sjhill: and it might even be true - in the case of slow micros. |
| 15:04.58 | prpplague | g1powermac: well the flyswatter actually can do SPI/I2C and bit banging gpio |
| 15:05.16 | g1powermac | interesting |
| 15:05.33 | ce_geek | ok |
| 15:05.42 | g1powermac | I figure you'd have total control over the jtag port to do what you want with it |
| 15:06.43 | prpplague | ce_geek: basically just like a desktop pc you need fast memory (SDRAM) and storage media (hard drive) |
| 15:07.14 | ce_geek | prpplague: That makes good sense. |
| 15:07.24 | prpplague | ce_geek: indeed |
| 15:07.32 | prpplague | ce_geek: you can mix different combinations |
| 15:07.37 | ce_geek | prpplague: Just going to comment on some of this stuff a bit in the paper at Rick's request. He was curious too. |
| 15:07.54 | prpplague | ce_geek: have bare min ram in combination with lots of flash, or bare min flash and lots of sdram |
| 15:08.10 | ce_geek | prpplague: When I use JTAG to send the root filesystem over, where does the compressed file live, and where does it get expanded to? |
| 15:08.29 | ce_geek | prpplague: Well I guess as per our previous discussion it gets expanded into SDRAM |
| 15:08.41 | prpplague | ce_geek: correct |
| 15:08.57 | ce_geek | prpplague: The compressed file lives in FLASH then? |
| 15:09.02 | prpplague | ce_geek: normally the compressed image is storaged in the flash at 0x30800000 |
| 15:09.23 | prpplague | ce_geek: when the bootloader starts it copies the image from flash to sdram |
| 15:09.25 | ce_geek | prpplague: Okay. Cool. Similar with the Kernel I assume. |
| 15:10.06 | prpplague | ce_geek: sorry i did a typ0 |
| 15:10.11 | prpplague | ce_geek: normally the compressed image is storaged in the sdram at 0x30800000 |
| 15:10.56 | ce_geek | prpplague:.... but sdram loses its data when it loses power :( |
| 15:11.06 | prpplague | ce_geek: that is correct |
| 15:11.23 | prpplague | ce_geek: which is why each time the bootloader starts it is copied from the flash |
| 15:11.55 | ce_geek | prpplague; Okay. So, the compressed file gets copied from flash to SDRAM, and THEN it is decompressed into more SDRAM? |
| 15:12.29 | prpplague | ce_geek: one sec |
| 15:12.37 | ce_geek | yup np |
| 15:14.52 | prpplague | ce_geek: that is correct |
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| 15:17.04 | prpplague | ce_geek: the bootloader copies the image from flash to the sdram |
| 15:17.27 | prpplague | ce_geek: for example with apex the copy looks something like: copy nor:1280k+2048k 0x30800000 |
| 15:18.02 | prpplague | ce_geek: copy from nor flash starting at the offset of 1280k with a size of 2048k to the sdram memory location of 0x30800000 |
| 15:18.09 | g1powermac | prpplague, if I buy a flyswatter, would ya shove it in the box with the zipit so I don't have to pat shipping? |
| 15:18.21 | g1powermac | err, *pay |
| 15:18.27 | prpplague | g1powermac: hehe yea, i'll see what i can do |
| 15:18.36 | g1powermac | cool, thanks |
| 15:18.37 | prpplague | g1powermac: let me get all done testing before you order |
| 15:18.44 | g1powermac | k |
| 15:19.09 | ce_geek | prpplague: Okay cool |
| 15:20.06 | prpplague | ce_geek: basically its the same with your standard desktop pc |
| 15:20.37 | prpplague | ce_geek: just that the files are retrieved from the hard drive rather than from flash |
| 15:21.07 | ce_geek | Flash:hammer::harddrive:desktop |
| 15:21.57 | RobotGuy | prpplague: I got another e-mail from the GeckSystems fellow. |
| 15:27.25 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, kewl |
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| 15:29.19 | prpplague | ce_geek: yeo |
| 15:29.23 | prpplague | RobotGuy: good deal |
| 15:29.31 | prpplague | RobotGuy: maybe you can turn it into some income |
| 15:30.04 | RobotGuy | prpplague: That would be very nice, if it could turn into something I can support myself on. |
| 15:33.07 | RobotGuy | Have you seen these CareBots(tm) at http://www.geckosystems.com ?? |
| 15:39.39 | prpplague | RobotGuy: you asking me? or everyone? |
| 15:39.55 | RobotGuy | Everyone, and of course, you are part of that. :D |
| 15:48.04 | RobotGuy | Crap, I'm overdrawn. :( :( |
| 15:48.27 | RobotGuy | Good news is I am getting a package today. I don't know which one though. |
| 15:49.25 | g1powermac | getting packages always makes you feel good :-) |
| 15:53.19 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I hope this is the one from TCT. :D:D |
| 15:56.54 | g1powermac | hehe |
| 15:57.02 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, bought a hammer, ehh? |
| 15:57.21 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Replacement for the one I killed. |
| 15:57.45 | g1powermac | might buy the flyswatter, as my jtag cable may not be robust enough for openocd |
| 15:58.16 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I highly recommend the Flyswatter. I have the complete Hammer Kit. |
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| 15:59.25 | RobotGuy | prpplague: Could your IT people please restore the stay logged in feature of the TCT forums? |
| 16:00.01 | solar | don't like the all in one nail? |
| 16:14.53 | RobotGuy | solar: Hi |
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| 16:27.08 | prpplague | RobotGuy: i'll mention it to the boss |
| 16:27.15 | RobotGuy | prpplague: Thanks. |
| 16:35.47 | RobotGuy | I don't have a Nail. |
| 16:42.40 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, heh, you know, you're listed on every subforum that has a thread as the guy who made the last post over at tct :-) |
| 16:43.11 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: This does not surprise me. :) |
| 16:44.19 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I am still surprised when my posts on some forum or list comes up on Google searches. |
| 16:44.26 | g1powermac | heh, yea |
| 16:45.41 | g1powermac | has a long history using this nick name |
| 16:45.47 | g1powermac | its splattered everywhere |
| 16:49.57 | RobotGuy | I am on so many lists and forums it's hard to track sometimes. |
| 16:56.14 | RobotGuy | Rebooting |
| 17:01.20 | *** join/#edev ce_geek (n=ce_geek@roger-blanchette-4.umelst.maine.edu) |
| 17:03.05 | ce_geek | ~seen prpplague |
| 17:03.07 | purl | prpplague <n=dave@mail.americanmicrosystems.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #edev, 35m 59s ago, saying: 'RobotGuy: i'll mention it to the boss'. |
| 17:05.43 | *** join/#edev RobotGuy (n=robotguy@dsl093-038-072.pdx1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 17:06.23 | g1powermac | cool, just got my analog 8052s in today |
| 17:07.23 | RobotGuy | Cool - I just added content to a LiveCD, made a bootable ISO image, and burned a CD with it that does boot. :D:D |
| 17:09.55 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I am waiting for my ADI samples. |
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| 17:18.03 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, nice, what livecd distro? |
| 17:18.28 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: PCLinuxOS at present, but I want to try Feather Linux also because it is supposed to be even smaller. |
| 17:18.39 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 17:18.44 | g1powermac | whats the size? |
| 17:19.03 | RobotGuy | About 284 MB |
| 17:19.08 | RobotGuy | For PCLinuxOS |
| 17:19.21 | g1powermac | meh, thats pretty big |
| 17:19.30 | RobotGuy | Adding a prebuilt Buildroot makes it 684 MB |
| 17:20.19 | RobotGuy | PCLinuxOS Minime is nice though - just enough to make it usable. |
| 17:20.26 | g1powermac | look into using morphix |
| 17:20.35 | RobotGuy | Link? |
| 17:20.36 | g1powermac | was/maybe still is a morphix dev |
| 17:20.39 | g1powermac | morphix.org |
| 17:21.29 | RobotGuy | Do I just need to start with the Kiosk ISO? |
| 17:22.31 | RobotGuy | What exactly is the "locked down version" of Firefox? |
| 17:22.55 | g1powermac | no, look into the lightgui version and/or icewm |
| 17:23.12 | g1powermac | the kiosk ones are meant for like internet kiosks |
| 17:24.23 | g1powermac | the cool part about morphix is that its really simple to modify |
| 17:24.28 | g1powermac | its all modularized |
| 17:24.41 | g1powermac | and you also have auto-morphing tools |
| 17:26.15 | g1powermac | I haven't been up on it in years, but I know all the main dev guys and can introduce ya to them |
| 17:29.13 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Cool. I am downloading the lightgui version now and will check it out. |
| 17:30.27 | RobotGuy | My PC can't boot from USB devices. :( At least I can't find a setting to enable it in the BIOS. |
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| 17:49.27 | Robotguy | returns with Morphix |
| 17:52.43 | Robotguy | OK, off to Windows now. |
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| 17:57.35 | g1powermac | cool |
| 18:01.53 | RobotGuy | I think I will tinker with Morphix a bit, but don't know if I will use it for this particular project. |
| 18:12.53 | g1powermac | *sigh* |
| 18:13.14 | g1powermac | wishes he had his home made ekg attachment for his zipit built and ready to use |
| 18:13.29 | g1powermac | would've been interesting to see the batch of skipped heart beats I just had on the monitor |
| 18:17.20 | RobotGuy | Is your heart racing for some reason? |
| 18:17.43 | g1powermac | not atm |
| 18:19.50 | RobotGuy | I am getting a bit anxious |
| 18:20.57 | g1powermac | hrmm, if I get any more of these today, I really need to go see my Dr. . . . |
| 18:21.19 | RobotGuy | What is happening? |
| 18:21.47 | g1powermac | skipped heart beats (actually they're extra beats technically) |
| 18:22.04 | g1powermac | it feels like a large thump in your chest |
| 18:22.19 | RobotGuy | You should get that checked out ASAP then. |
| 18:22.25 | g1powermac | I have |
| 18:22.38 | g1powermac | went to the hospital about a month and a half ago for it |
| 18:22.46 | g1powermac | was put on a whole month heart monitor |
| 18:23.04 | g1powermac | been in and out of cardiologists and other doctors |
| 18:23.06 | RobotGuy | Well, you need to go back to the doctor then and make them find out what is wrong. |
| 18:24.03 | g1powermac | sadly its a slow process and technically skipped beats aren't deadly unless it turns into a full arrhythmia which generally doesn't happen |
| 18:24.53 | RobotGuy | I hate stuff like that. I have issues of a similar nature - balance problems, losing hearing in my left ear also. |
| 18:25.04 | g1powermac | got an appointment set to see an endocrinologist later this month as my thyroid/pituitary was showing some odd levels in the blood tests |
| 18:25.29 | g1powermac | oh fun |
| 18:25.35 | g1powermac | have you had an mri? |
| 18:26.15 | g1powermac | had a ct scan and mri about a year ago for some memory issues I was having (prolly all stress related) |
| 18:26.18 | RobotGuy | Yes,. I've had MRI, CT, etc. I've had times where I have passed out or something, once on mass transit. |
| 18:26.36 | SpeedEvil | fainting? |
| 18:26.38 | g1powermac | but they found an enlarged pituitary during the scans |
| 18:26.46 | SpeedEvil | immediately after standing? |
| 18:26.52 | SpeedEvil | ->robotguy |
| 18:27.13 | g1powermac | and now the heart issue which could all be related to the pituitary |
| 18:27.20 | RobotGuy | SpeedEvil: Sometimes, but not always. I can be walking and suddenly go off to the right - like the floor is falling out from under me. |
| 18:27.28 | SpeedEvil | Oh |
| 18:27.41 | g1powermac | SpeedEvil, I've almost passed out apon standing up |
| 18:27.44 | SpeedEvil | also has slight arythmia. |
| 18:27.46 | RobotGuy | I've been to the ER several times with this. |
| 18:27.59 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Have your b12 level checked. |
| 18:28.14 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, hmm, I take b12 supplements everyday |
| 18:28.32 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I have to get a B12 shot every month. |
| 18:28.32 | SpeedEvil | fainting on ceasing excersize can be pretty benign. AIUI it can be managed behaviouraly. |
| 18:28.52 | SpeedEvil | I.E. cooldown, or jog on spot, don't just stop. |
| 18:28.57 | g1powermac | yea |
| 18:29.15 | g1powermac | my almost fainting stuff I think is related to the slow heart rate I have |
| 18:29.27 | g1powermac | its one thing that concerns my cardiologist |
| 18:29.37 | SpeedEvil | RobotGuy: lots of marmite sandwitches! |
| 18:29.46 | RobotGuy | Marmite? |
| 18:29.47 | g1powermac | my heart rate during the monitoring dropped below 40 bps a few times during the day |
| 18:29.56 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: That doesn't sound good. |
| 18:30.52 | g1powermac | he wasn't totally sure what it meant |
| 18:30.57 | SpeedEvil | en.wikipedia.org/wiki/marmite |
| 18:31.16 | Crofton | um marmite |
| 18:31.22 | Crofton | I had some on toast this morning |
| 18:31.22 | g1powermac | I'm in pretty decent shape, so my heart rate should be fairly low to begin with |
| 18:31.47 | g1powermac | the thing that really concerned him was the slow heart rate that would immediately speed up within one beat |
| 18:32.12 | SpeedEvil | But can you get it to do drum solos? |
| 18:32.20 | g1powermac | hahah |
| 18:32.54 | g1powermac | my dad's heart almost did that once, but thats when he overdosed on caffeine |
| 18:33.29 | g1powermac | he actually went to sleep with a really bad arrhythmia without telling my mom till the next morning |
| 18:33.56 | g1powermac | she took one listen to his heart beat and rushed him to the hospital |
| 18:34.29 | g1powermac | she almost beat the crap out of him after he got better for not telling her sooner ;-) |
| 18:34.33 | RobotGuy | Heart trouble run in your family? |
| 18:34.52 | g1powermac | yea, mainly my mom's side |
| 18:35.11 | g1powermac | the thing with my dad was a total fluke due to him drinking WAY too many cokes |
| 18:35.33 | RobotGuy | Well, just take care of yourself as best you can and watch that heart. |
| 18:35.43 | g1powermac | yup, yup |
| 18:36.27 | g1powermac | its one reason why I want to go into nutritional science and/or biomed engineering and/or both :-) |
| 18:36.53 | RobotGuy | I see that now. Good choice. You can help a lot of people by going into that field. |
| 18:37.45 | g1powermac | now if I can just fix myself so I can actually help people. . . :-) |
| 18:38.51 | RobotGuy | Hopefully that will help you so you can help others too! |
| 18:40.17 | g1powermac | ya |
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| 18:54.27 | g1powermac | mmm, left over chili |
| 18:55.27 | RobotGuy | Durn, it looks like I won't get my package until later today. |
| 18:55.30 | RobotGuy | prpplague: ping |
| 18:59.12 | ce_geek | prpplague: It's looking like I'll be able to get all the stuff I've done and experienced with the hammer documented pretty well for Friday when I give it to Rick for the purpose of my class. |
| 19:00.37 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: Neat! |
| 19:00.48 | ce_geek | prpplague; There are so many other things i want to do and write about that will just have to wait. I will be spending time with it next week too. I think by early next week I'd like to get it to the point where you feel that it's a useful document for TCT. Hopefully that won't be much different from Friday's edition. |
| 19:01.31 | RobotGuy | He must be off doing regular work |
| 19:02.05 | ce_geek | Yerp. |
| 19:02.32 | ce_geek | There's a lot of stuff I still want to learn and document, but I've got to draw the line somewhere. Right now I just want to graduate :) |
| 19:02.48 | RobotGuy | I want to learn everything! :D |
| 19:05.02 | RobotGuy | I got a one year diploma in Electronics Techology. I never got the AS though. |
| 19:06.27 | prpplague | RobotGuy: pong |
| 19:06.35 | RobotGuy | Ah, there you are! |
| 19:08.00 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
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| 19:21.19 | ce_geek | prpplague: Around tomorrow? |
| 19:21.52 | ce_geek | prpplague: I just gained tomorrow (thankfully) to work on things. I thought I had to drive to NH to look at an apartment, but they rented it out from under me so I get to sit in the lab and work on the hammer stuff. |
| 19:22.26 | ce_geek | prpplague: Heading out now to do other graduation related stuff. |
| 19:22.31 | RobotGuy | Time to play with toys, eh? |
| 19:22.59 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: haha |
| 19:23.16 | g1powermac | toys == goodness :-) |
| 19:23.16 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: Nah, have to drive an hour and a half south to complete the sale of my old vehicle. |
| 19:23.28 | g1powermac | hmm, you know |
| 19:23.28 | RobotGuy | Wow. You are so busy. |
| 19:23.31 | ce_geek | making room for the quasi-graduation present new one. |
| 19:23.46 | RobotGuy | ce_geek: What's your GPA? |
| 19:23.47 | g1powermac | should've sent that wifi phone he has to prpplague with the zipit to find the jtag on that sucker too |
| 19:24.03 | ce_geek | RobotGuy: I dunno 3.6ish and change or something like that? I forget. |
| 19:24.24 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: What phone is it? |
| 19:24.25 | ce_geek | heads out |
| 19:24.49 | g1powermac | http://elinux.org/SMC_WSKP100 |
| 19:26.10 | RobotGuy | Interesting. I would love to have an AT&T Tilt. I might try and get a refurb. |
| 19:26.38 | g1powermac | has a couple of old verzion phones laying around |
| 19:26.51 | g1powermac | one I've ripped apart already, it was an old kyocera |
| 19:27.04 | RobotGuy | I need GSM. Have you considered digging in and finding out what's inside them? |
| 19:27.06 | g1powermac | really old, no color screen, no camera, nothing |
| 19:27.09 | RobotGuy | Oh, OK |
| 19:27.21 | g1powermac | nah, its verzion, no gsm in them |
| 19:27.43 | RobotGuy | I will probably end up getting a Samsung Blackjack II. |
| 19:27.50 | g1powermac | the other camera is a motorola, nice little flip phone i got about three years ago I think |
| 19:28.01 | g1powermac | err, s/camera/camera phone |
| 19:28.36 | g1powermac | the kyocera though has some interesting chips in it, albeit all bgas though |
| 19:28.49 | RobotGuy | BGA is EVIL! |
| 19:29.13 | RobotGuy | I have a Nokia 6600 right now. Slow, very slow. |
| 19:29.23 | g1powermac | heh, they're not evil, just well, umm, ok they're evil ;-) |
| 19:30.27 | g1powermac | doesn't own a working cell phone atm |
| 19:30.48 | g1powermac | though I'm thinking about turning my zipit into a phone once I get my gsm module from china |
| 19:31.17 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: SFE has some GSM/GPS modules. |
| 19:31.28 | g1powermac | yea, but they're insanely expensive |
| 19:31.48 | g1powermac | I got this one: http://www.sureelectronics.net/goods.php?id=100 |
| 19:32.04 | g1powermac | though from that guys ebay auction not directly from his site |
| 19:32.31 | g1powermac | supposedly it comes with a breakout board and a sim card slot, according to SpeedEvil |
| 19:32.52 | RobotGuy | That's cool if you can handle SMD. |
| 19:33.13 | g1powermac | well, if it comes with a breakout board, the only thing is soldering it to the board |
| 19:33.23 | g1powermac | which shouldn't be all too hard |
| 19:33.33 | RobotGuy | True. |
| 19:33.48 | RobotGuy | I can handle breakout boards. I have several modules from SFE. |
| 19:34.14 | RobotGuy | They just came out with a nifty digital 3-axis accelerometer (I2C interface) |
| 19:34.18 | g1powermac | pre tin all the pads, lay the chip on the pads, tape it to the board, and hit each pad with an iron |
| 19:34.45 | g1powermac | heh, yea, I bought them out of their $19.99 one they had that was messed up :-) |
| 19:35.51 | g1powermac | supposedly they messed up the breakout board, so it could only do i2c instead of being able to choose i2c and spi |
| 19:36.41 | g1powermac | http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8658 |
| 19:37.52 | RobotGuy | http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=758 |
| 19:38.12 | g1powermac | ahh, ya got that one |
| 19:39.35 | g1powermac | Maker Faire would've been awesome to attend. . . |
| 19:39.40 | RobotGuy | I want that one because it will be easier to interface to Hammer because of I2C. Hammer only has two ADCs broken out. |
| 19:39.58 | g1powermac | yea |
| 19:40.07 | g1powermac | thats why I went with the $19.99 one |
| 19:40.30 | RobotGuy | I have way too much in my SFE shopping cart. |
| 19:40.38 | g1powermac | hehe |
| 19:41.39 | RobotGuy | Hmm, not too bad. Only $300.00 worth. |
| 19:42.03 | g1powermac | wants to get their hot air rework station |
| 19:42.11 | RobotGuy | I could easily bump that to $1000.00 or more though with things I would like to tinker with. |
| 19:42.50 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I thought about getting one of those when I was deciding on a soldering station. I didn't think I would use the hot air that much though. I may have been wrong. |
| 19:43.11 | g1powermac | I've been debating that as well |
| 19:43.18 | SpeedEvil | Hot air is very useful. |
| 19:43.29 | g1powermac | but I'm need of a halfway decent soldering system |
| 19:43.53 | g1powermac | and am pondering about going all out on one |
| 19:44.02 | SpeedEvil | Everything from heatshrinking, melting hot-glue, preheating. |
| 19:44.17 | g1powermac | SpeedEvil, very true |
| 19:44.26 | SpeedEvil | I'm happy with my $150(ish) station. |
| 19:44.50 | g1powermac | is yours just the hot air part or does it have an iron too? |
| 19:44.54 | SpeedEvil | hot air and iron |
| 19:44.55 | RobotGuy | Hey! They have a USP GPS dongle now. |
| 19:44.59 | SpeedEvil | digital readout. |
| 19:45.02 | g1powermac | nice |
| 19:45.05 | RobotGuy | I have the Weller WES51 |
| 19:45.33 | g1powermac | SpeedEvil, thats that one from china, right? |
| 19:45.53 | g1powermac | recalls someone talking about buying one from their |
| 19:45.59 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 19:46.03 | g1powermac | of course I never remember who it was |
| 19:46.42 | g1powermac | ahh, ok |
| 19:46.53 | g1powermac | whats the name of it again? |
| 19:47.10 | g1powermac | needs to bookmark this stuff |
| 19:47.59 | SpeedEvil | search ebay for kada |
| 19:48.08 | SpeedEvil | or ayoui |
| 19:48.13 | RobotGuy | curses his stupid power chair |
| 19:49.00 | g1powermac | aoyue? |
| 19:49.18 | g1powermac | thats the one sparkfun sells. . . |
| 19:49.42 | SpeedEvil | yaoi? |
| 19:49.46 | SpeedEvil | I dunno |
| 19:49.49 | SpeedEvil | maybe |
| 19:50.14 | RobotGuy | Whew! I won't lose my internet this month. |
| 19:50.15 | g1powermac | http://cgi.ebay.com/AOYUE-968-SMD-Hot-Air-3-in-1-Repair-Rework-Station_W0QQitemZ110248367332QQihZ001QQcategoryZ100184QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
| 19:50.22 | g1powermac | now thats nice |
| 19:50.23 | SpeedEvil | Ok - google reveals it's definately, definately not yaoi. |
| 19:51.04 | RobotGuy | That's definitely heavy duty for a nice price. |
| 19:51.36 | g1powermac | wonder if I could solder bgas with that |
| 19:53.45 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 19:53.51 | SpeedEvil | well - in principle. |
| 19:54.19 | SpeedEvil | Assuming adequate hand/eye coordination. |
| 19:54.48 | g1powermac | hmm |
| 19:55.27 | g1powermac | hmm, that seller has lots of soldering goodies at his site: http://store.sra-solder.com/index.php |
| 19:56.18 | RobotGuy | Are there any good pencil type irons? Something that can easily be transported? |
| 19:56.57 | g1powermac | mmm, gold solder |
| 19:58.03 | g1powermac | http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6145&xSec=22 |
| 19:58.12 | g1powermac | that actually looks really good for the money |
| 19:59.27 | RobotGuy | I am thinking just a pencil type iron, but of good quality, not like Radio Shack stuff. |
| 19:59.54 | g1powermac | I'd save your money to buy a halfway decent station with temp control |
| 20:00.11 | g1powermac | http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6427&xSec=79 |
| 20:00.16 | g1powermac | now THAT is awesome |
| 20:01.29 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I want something easy to transport. I already have a WES51 |
| 20:01.36 | g1powermac | oh |
| 20:01.43 | g1powermac | how easy? |
| 20:01.55 | g1powermac | cause you could get one of those butane fired irons |
| 20:02.09 | g1powermac | got one of those. . . |
| 20:02.19 | g1powermac | just make sure it has a halfway decent shield around the tip |
| 20:02.50 | g1powermac | burnt the crap out of my finger once when using it, the flesh turned golden brown. . . |
| 20:04.03 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I am thinking -just- a pencil type iron. |
| 20:04.30 | g1powermac | the nice part about the butane type is that you don't have to worry about electrical plugs |
| 20:04.45 | Crofton | I have a faded scar on my thumb from burning myself on an iron when I was around 8 or so ... |
| 20:04.51 | RobotGuy | I don't want something flamable. |
| 20:05.14 | g1powermac | Crofton, heh, but did you feel molten solder? its quite interesting :-) |
| 20:05.57 | g1powermac | that was from a second burn with my standard electrical iron, accidentally touched the tip of the iron with a blob of solder on it |
| 20:06.17 | g1powermac | http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6228&xSec=47 |
| 20:06.24 | g1powermac | ok, I could kill myself with that ;-) |
| 20:06.47 | RobotGuy | Ouch |
| 20:07.22 | g1powermac | has burnt/sliced/diced/stabbed/fried my hands many times throughout my life |
| 20:08.07 | g1powermac | still got a scar on my right hand between the knuckles from when I was like three years old |
| 20:08.38 | g1powermac | accidentally stabbed myself with a screwdriver opening something |
| 20:09.25 | g1powermac | (oh yea, I'm right handed too, but for some reason I still use my left hand alot to wield tools) |
| 20:10.16 | g1powermac | I think I maybe ambidextrous or something |
| 20:10.23 | CosmicPenguin | Or not |
| 20:10.40 | g1powermac | yea, I don't know |
| 20:11.06 | CosmicPenguin | thats why I don't use my right hand, when I do then people get hurt |
| 20:11.07 | CosmicPenguin | usually me |
| 20:11.27 | g1powermac | back when i was in college though, I use to switch hands writing notes to freak out my professors ;-) |
| 20:11.48 | RobotGuy | I do OK most of the time with either hand. I can almost write with my left, even though I am right handed normall. |
| 20:11.49 | g1powermac | then i switch writing styles |
| 20:12.12 | g1powermac | it would look like 10 different people wrote my notes |
| 20:12.30 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Maybe you have MPD. |
| 20:12.41 | RobotGuy | grins |
| 20:12.51 | g1powermac | nah, I was bored, it gave me something to do while taking notes ;-) |
| 20:13.12 | *** join/#edev DrZimmerman (n=theo@77-56-246-76.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:13.36 | RobotGuy | I hate these socalled "free" offers, but you have to sign up for so many of their offers to qualify. |
| 20:13.44 | RobotGuy | they are always soooooooooooooooooooooo tempting too. |
| 20:14.38 | RobotGuy | I think UPS has gone braindead on me again. They were supposed to deliver a package yesterday, but said they couldn't find me. I never saw a UPS truck either. |
| 20:18.06 | g1powermac | ugh, not that stuff |
| 20:18.21 | g1powermac | man, we use to get that all the time here, since our store was on a new street |
| 20:18.39 | g1powermac | its gotten better, but dhl still can't figure our address out sometimes |
| 20:19.09 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: They probably have a substitute driver on this route this week. The regular drivers know me. |
| 20:20.02 | RobotGuy | I get stuff through DHL, UPS, and FedEx. |
| 20:20.21 | RobotGuy | Mostly UPS and FedEx. |
| 20:24.33 | RobotGuy | FedEx messed up a PC I had shipped across the country. Took almost 3 months to get them to pay up on that. |
| 20:33.06 | g1powermac | ahh, fun |
| 20:33.12 | g1powermac | likes our fedex guy |
| 20:33.31 | g1powermac | he's been delivering here for a couple years now |
| 20:33.57 | g1powermac | fedex ground is setup like a franchise so you get the same driver all the time |
| 20:34.05 | g1powermac | unless he goes on vacation or something |
| 20:34.29 | g1powermac | ups on the other hand. . .we get different drivers it seems almost every day |
| 20:35.01 | RobotGuy | Yeah, FedEx has been good delivering here also. It's UPS that can be variable. |
| 20:35.11 | RobotGuy | I've lived here almost 3 years. |
| 20:37.50 | g1powermac | huh, rework station with builtin external power supply: http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6265&xSec=26 |
| 20:38.40 | RobotGuy | Nice |
| 20:43.09 | g1powermac | http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6368&xSec=26 |
| 20:43.22 | g1powermac | nice for somebody who wants just hot air |
| 20:47.57 | g1powermac | ooo, http://store.sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=6505&xSec=26 |
| 20:48.09 | g1powermac | infrared soldering, now thats awesome :-) |
| 20:52.49 | g1powermac | http://www.aoyue.com/en/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=413 |
| 20:53.00 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, that makes bgas not so evil ;-) |
| 20:57.09 | RobotGuy | Ummm, yeah, at what price? :P |
| 20:57.55 | g1powermac | thats the question ;-) |
| 21:00.10 | g1powermac | huh, I never installed wget on my imac here |
| 21:00.28 | g1powermac | surprised I went this long without compiling/installing it |
| 21:00.29 | *** join/#edev magnetron (n=magnetro@unaffiliated/magnetron) |
| 21:04.12 | g1powermac | heh, you need to watch the video for the bga station |
| 21:09.47 | g1powermac | it makes doing bga soldering like its a piece of cake :-) |
| 21:13.07 | RobotGuy | Some of those videos don't work for me under Linux. |
| 21:13.31 | RobotGuy | Well, I think I just nixed a very interesting project. |
| 21:14.12 | RobotGuy | As soon as I saw the price of the equipment I'd be working with, I knew it wasn't going to happen. |
| 21:15.05 | RobotGuy | I can't watch WMV on Linux right now. I'm not sure what I would need to do that. |
| 21:15.27 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 21:16.38 | g1powermac | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43J3BQ0ih5w |
| 21:16.58 | g1powermac | thats their desoldering station in use, really nice compared to an iron + solder sucker |
| 21:18.45 | RobotGuy | That makes it look so easy. |
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| 21:35.03 | *** join/#edev Mr_Bonga (n=Rui_Silv@194.65.138.120) |
| 21:38.26 | Mr_Bonga | hi |
| 21:55.06 | RobotGuy | Hello |
| 22:02.43 | *** join/#edev CosmicPenguin (n=nobody@163.181.251.103) |
| 22:02.44 | *** mode/#edev [+o CosmicPenguin] by ChanServ |
| 22:03.41 | RobotGuy | CosmicPenguin: Greetings |
| 22:03.56 | CosmicPenguin | nod |
| 22:04.16 | RobotGuy | How is everything? |
| 22:04.21 | CosmicPenguin | the usual |
| 22:06.40 | *** join/#edev linac (n=lin@121.41.34.12) |
| 22:09.48 | RobotGuy | I'm still waiting for my package from TCT |
| 22:13.55 | *** join/#edev dijenerate (n=dijenera@72.51.91.11) |
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| 22:42.24 | g1powermac | dang: http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/categories.php?cPath=2_105 |
| 22:42.31 | g1powermac | I wish they had that |
| 22:42.45 | g1powermac | though supposedly they're olimex boards. . . |
| 22:43.23 | RobotGuy | They are frequently out of the most interesting stuff. |
| 22:43.48 | g1powermac | looks like olimex still has them |
| 22:43.58 | g1powermac | mmm, home made eeg and ecg. . . |
| 22:44.07 | g1powermac | all attached to my zipit ;-) |
| 22:44.49 | g1powermac | http://www.olimex.com/gadgets/index.html |
| 22:49.22 | RobotGuy | Amazing |
| 22:49.23 | g1powermac | full info about those boards: http://openeeg.sourceforge.net/doc/modeeg/modeeg.html |
| 23:05.08 | SpeedEvil | wishes NMR were easy. |
| 23:08.35 | g1powermac | can prolly adapt this eeg to use his analog 8051 he got |
| 23:08.46 | g1powermac | the digital side of it is really simple |
| 23:10.31 | ds2 | NMR is easy... you just do the electromagnetic version of ringing a bell and listen for something else to ring back ;) |
| 23:10.47 | ds2 | actually implementing it is left as an exercise for the reader! |
| 23:11.02 | g1powermac | I wonder if I can merge the ecg circuitry in with the eeg |
| 23:11.26 | g1powermac | I need to read up on analog circuitry |
| 23:11.54 | MonMotha | or just get yourself the darned AVR :) |
| 23:11.58 | MonMotha | they're not that expensive |
| 23:12.09 | g1powermac | bah, cost isn't the issue :-) |
| 23:12.23 | MonMotha | I like 8051s, too, but I like AVR better |
| 23:12.28 | MonMotha | unless I need to divide a lot... |
| 23:12.29 | g1powermac | loves to tinker with premade stuff to make it his own :-) |
| 23:12.39 | MonMotha | as do I |
| 23:12.43 | g1powermac | it forces me to learn stuff |
| 23:12.51 | MonMotha | but this seems silly |
| 23:12.59 | MonMotha | now, if they were using a PIC... :) |
| 23:13.16 | g1powermac | not really, the 8051 I have is much more powerful than the avr they're using |
| 23:14.15 | MonMotha | perhaps that's because they didn't need any more power |
| 23:14.19 | g1powermac | plus if I can do the ecg in combo, then I got less stuff to hook upto the zipit |
| 23:14.23 | MonMotha | because there are certainly some HUGE AVRs |
| 23:14.31 | g1powermac | of course |
| 23:14.34 | MonMotha | (huge to the point of "why don't you just use an ARM?") |
| 23:14.41 | g1powermac | heh, true |
| 23:14.57 | g1powermac | especially since atmel makes ARMs too |
| 23:15.03 | *** join/#edev ico2_ (n=ico2@modem-2604.cougar.dialup.pol.co.uk) |
| 23:15.22 | MonMotha | indeed |
| 23:15.25 | MonMotha | though I'm not a huge fan of them |
| 23:15.38 | MonMotha | if they'd put the peripherals of the AVR on their ARMs, it would be awesome |
| 23:15.55 | g1powermac | I'm not up on their ARMs |
| 23:16.08 | g1powermac | I looked at them a long time ago |
| 23:16.12 | MonMotha | but their ARM peripherals seem needlessly complex at times (to the point of having "bugs" due only to the complexity that you can't work around) |
| 23:16.37 | MonMotha | like their SPI controller, which has automatic chip select generation that makes assumptions about when it's legit to release chip select |
| 23:16.49 | MonMotha | fortunately, that one you CAN work around by just doing it in software (otherwise the SPI would be completely unusable) |
| 23:16.51 | g1powermac | oh fun |
| 23:17.16 | MonMotha | their I2C ("TWI") controller has an inherent race condition since it generates stop conditions automatically when you stop feeding it data |
| 23:17.31 | g1powermac | euh |
| 23:17.33 | MonMotha | their timer/counters seem half missing |
| 23:17.49 | g1powermac | the race condition stuff is bad |
| 23:17.52 | MonMotha | none of the issues are what I'd call "fatal", but many are downright annoying |
| 23:18.01 | MonMotha | yes, the race condition is bad |
| 23:18.38 | g1powermac | knows first hand how that goes when I designed my own 8bit bus to connect multiple 8051s for an independent study course |
| 23:18.39 | MonMotha | the only real "solution" seems to be to use the interrupt driven model (rather than polling it, which is sometimes useful) and make sure interrupts are never off for "too long" |
| 23:19.05 | MonMotha | what gets me is like RMII support on their Ethernet controller |
| 23:19.09 | MonMotha | it's fully documented and everything |
| 23:19.22 | g1powermac | http://www.g1powermac.com/propbus.txt |
| 23:19.26 | MonMotha | but if you read the errata, one of the items is "Ethernet RMII mode is not functional. Workaround: Use MII mode" |
| 23:19.28 | g1powermac | that was a fun project |
| 23:19.38 | MonMotha | hopefully you notice that before you commit a PCB design |
| 23:19.39 | ds2 | hehehe |
| 23:19.46 | ds2 | or have the board stuff ;) |
| 23:19.53 | g1powermac | funnnn |
| 23:19.53 | MonMotha | either is bad |
| 23:20.04 | ds2 | but that's why it is available as a QFP so you can run the extra oops jumpers to support MII ;) |
| 23:20.13 | MonMotha | good luck... |
| 23:20.16 | MonMotha | it's a 0.5mm QFP |
| 23:20.26 | ds2 | I've seen rework folks do it |
| 23:20.26 | MonMotha | I can tack one wire down, but not several right next to each other |
| 23:20.38 | MonMotha | the wire is bigger than the pins! |
| 23:20.43 | MonMotha | by quite a bit |
| 23:20.52 | g1powermac | heh |
| 23:20.55 | MonMotha | that and if you're using the IO for something else, you're kinda screwed |
| 23:20.58 | ds2 | I think I had the rework folks do that so we can attach a probe |
| 23:21.10 | g1powermac | 0.5mm qfp, not fun to work with |
| 23:21.20 | g1powermac | though it can be done |
| 23:21.21 | MonMotha | the NAND CRC functionality doesn't seem to agree with large page devices |
| 23:21.26 | MonMotha | on their ARM9s with NAND controllers |
| 23:21.36 | g1powermac | the main cpld on the minila I build is a .5mm qfp |
| 23:21.39 | MonMotha | eh, I can solder them down, but rework is limited |
| 23:21.50 | g1powermac | soldering that sucker was fun with the tools I got |
| 23:21.59 | MonMotha | like I said, I can tack down a lone wire to a pin, but I can't put down several in the same area |
| 23:22.10 | g1powermac | yea |
| 23:22.36 | MonMotha | I need to get my PCB panel out |
| 23:22.40 | MonMotha | I think I've got a full panel worth |
| 23:22.52 | MonMotha | so I get 5 of everything for ~$200 shipped |
| 23:23.09 | g1powermac | what ya making? |
| 23:23.11 | MonMotha | it's not a bad deal if you end up with a whole panel worth of designs |
| 23:23.14 | MonMotha | several things |
| 23:23.17 | ds2 | do they do the series of holes so you can just snap it off? |
| 23:23.23 | MonMotha | ds2: no, you cut apart |
| 23:23.32 | MonMotha | a shear is very, very handy |
| 23:23.37 | ds2 | oh |
| 23:23.52 | MonMotha | but the price is right for made in the USA to high standards |
| 23:24.01 | MonMotha | even if you don't pay for ET, they will replace defective ones |
| 23:24.17 | g1powermac | MonMotha, what pcb house are you using? |
| 23:24.18 | *** join/#edev flavioribeiro (n=flaviori@200.97.67.61) |
| 23:24.19 | ds2 | how many layers? |
| 23:24.31 | MonMotha | 2 layers, 6/6 trace/space, 15mil finished holes |
| 23:24.37 | MonMotha | Advanced Circuits |
| 23:25.14 | MonMotha | plated holes, soldermask both sides, silkscreen both sids |
| 23:25.15 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 23:25.27 | g1powermac | used pcbfabexpress to make his minila boards |
| 23:25.33 | MonMotha | $33 each for 4 + 1 free |
| 23:25.37 | g1powermac | really liked the quality |
| 23:25.42 | MonMotha | for 60 sq in |
| 23:26.07 | MonMotha | I've not heard of them |
| 23:26.38 | MonMotha | I have heard of people getting stupid good deals from pcbnet.com before, though |
| 23:26.42 | MonMotha | the "place your bid" thing |
| 23:26.51 | MonMotha | just specify "4 month leadtime" or something like that |
| 23:27.03 | g1powermac | this is what I had them build: http://minila.sourceforge.net/ |
| 23:27.11 | MonMotha | basically they just run it whenever they have the line set up suitably |
| 23:27.29 | g1powermac | I made a whole run of boards and sold them off to a bunch of people at ##Microcontrollers |
| 23:28.14 | MonMotha | g1powermac: heh, couldn't get it to pass EMC tests with the JTAG hooked up? :) |
| 23:29.02 | g1powermac | heh, i didn't design it |
| 23:29.57 | MonMotha | I had been meaning to make something like that |
| 23:30.19 | g1powermac | I still got a board here if you want it. . . |
| 23:30.21 | MonMotha | was going to use a high-speed USB capable micro to DMA things to the PC |
| 23:30.28 | g1powermac | I have almost a complete set |
| 23:30.40 | MonMotha | well, I'll think about it |
| 23:30.43 | MonMotha | we might want one at work |
| 23:30.50 | g1powermac | k |
| 23:33.00 | g1powermac | interesting book: http://www.amazon.com/Linear-Circuit-Handbook-Engineering-Devices/dp/0750687037/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1210202681&sr=8-3 |
| 23:34.20 | MonMotha | going to do some work |
| 23:34.21 | g1powermac | has no analog circuit experience, all my knowledge is of digital stuff, and really more high level stuff |
| 23:34.26 | MonMotha | $$ = desirable |
| 23:34.33 | MonMotha | heh, analog is fun |
| 23:34.36 | MonMotha | mixed signal even more so |
| 23:34.51 | MonMotha | one of the recent boards I did was total mixed signal hell |
| 23:34.52 | MonMotha | it works, though |
| 23:35.16 | MonMotha | lots of digital comm, lots of analog sensors, A/D, D/A, oh, and a power supply |
| 23:35.28 | MonMotha | it's a two-board brick |
| 23:35.29 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 23:35.40 | MonMotha | but by golly it runs off 24-200V |
| 23:35.54 | MonMotha | (DC) or 24-130VAC |
| 23:35.55 | g1powermac | thats what essentially this eeg and even the ecg circuit I was looking at is |
| 23:36.10 | MonMotha | one of the widest input power supplies I've ever seen |
| 23:36.16 | g1powermac | wow, yea |
| 23:36.41 | MonMotha | you can pull about 12W out of it too, so it's no slouch |
| 23:36.46 | g1powermac | has never ventured into making a power supply even remotely close to that |
| 23:36.48 | MonMotha | it's NOT small, though |
| 23:37.06 | MonMotha | and it's not overly cheap, either |
| 23:37.13 | MonMotha | but it does what is desired |
| 23:37.18 | MonMotha | "apply power here" |
| 23:37.21 | g1powermac | I just use a power brick and a 5v regulator :-) |
| 23:37.35 | g1powermac | or other regulator when needed |
| 23:37.38 | MonMotha | now that wouldn't be any fun :) |
| 23:37.43 | MonMotha | anyway, bbl |
| 23:38.03 | g1powermac | heh, never had an interesting in building a power supply anywhere beyond that :-) |
| 23:38.10 | g1powermac | *interest |
| 23:47.54 | *** join/#edev agaffney (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) |
| 23:55.16 | RobotGuy | I wish I knew the tracking number of my package. |
| 23:56.25 | g1powermac | I wonder what happened to prpplague, he was suppose to have some idea about the zipit tonight |
| 23:56.38 | RobotGuy | I don't know |
| 23:57.09 | g1powermac | ordered that analog circuit book |
| 23:57.50 | g1powermac | I need to figure this stuff out, I think its more important than buying soldering iron at this point |