| 00:00.28 | g1powermac | it has a debug interface on it, kinda reminds me of jtag |
| 00:00.54 | g1powermac | thats how the flash is written to it |
| 00:01.21 | g1powermac | its interesting that it isn't using the serial port in this case, but a bootloader could easily be written for it |
| 00:01.53 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, you need to check this chip out |
| 00:03.37 | RobotGuy | omero: I don't have any experience with buildroot except for Hammer (ARM9). |
| 00:04.01 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: You mean that 8051 with ZigBee? |
| 00:04.05 | g1powermac | yup |
| 00:04.24 | g1powermac | btw, if you download the datasheet of that chip, it'll look a little skimpy |
| 00:04.25 | RobotGuy | I don't think I could solder a 48 pin QFN. |
| 00:04.45 | g1powermac | mainly because its just a supplement for the cc2430 |
| 00:05.03 | g1powermac | the cc2430 is almost identical to the cc2431 minus the location module thingie |
| 00:05.15 | g1powermac | nah, get a schmartboard |
| 00:05.19 | ds2 | there are no leads to break off on a QFN :) that ought to make it easier, right? ;) |
| 00:05.43 | RobotGuy | I have some SchmartBoards but they are for QFP. |
| 00:05.51 | g1powermac | http://www.schmartboard.com/index.asp?page=products_csp&id=78 |
| 00:11.17 | RobotGuy | Right now I just need to figure out why X won't run and fix that. |
| 00:11.56 | g1powermac | bbiab |
| 00:12.00 | omero | RobotGuy: I wont surrender... and thanks for getting interested ;) I'll do some more digging ... |
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| 01:15.37 | g1powermac_PB | drools over this 8051 from ti |
| 01:54.22 | Lars_G | Sigh i can't wait for ALP devices to come out. i want one |
| 02:05.34 | g1powermac_PB | hey Lars_G |
| 02:13.10 | g1powermac_PB | Lars_G: take a look at this 8051: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/cc2431.html |
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| 02:35.41 | RobotGuy | Boo! |
| 02:36.29 | RobotGuy | ce_geek, g1powermac_PB: Greets |
| 02:50.14 | g1powermac_PB | hey RobotGuy and gnight :-) |
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| 09:26.15 | [AD]Turbo | yo |
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| 11:35.04 | g1powermac_PB | morning GPSFan |
| 11:35.31 | GPSFan | g1powermac_PB: good morning. |
| 11:38.04 | g1powermac_PB | this is interesting: http://www.physorg.com/news130152277.html |
| 11:38.22 | g1powermac_PB | though it figures that its quite close to what I want to do |
| 11:39.31 | GPSFan | pretty sparse on details |
| 11:39.36 | g1powermac_PB | yea |
| 11:42.31 | g1powermac_PB | is in love with the cc2431. . . |
| 11:42.37 | g1powermac_PB | this is a bad thing ;-) |
| 11:43.25 | GPSFan | needs a nap, this is a bad thing |
| 11:46.56 | g1powermac_PB | needs a flyswatter to program these chips though |
| 11:47.05 | GPSFan | bbl |
| 11:47.06 | g1powermac_PB | need an spi port to program it |
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| 12:17.34 | g1powermac_PB | could be interesting to write a loading program for this sucker |
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| 13:08.08 | sunrunner20 | http://www.popsci.com/diy/article/2008-05/eee-pc-school-add-keyboard-backlight-under-15 |
| 13:08.11 | sunrunner20 | :\ |
| 13:08.18 | sunrunner20 | I expected better out of Pop sci |
| 13:08.46 | sunrunner20 | there are plunty of places to source 3V inside an Eee |
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| 14:38.34 | g1powermac | ponders if he should just buy a new soldering station. . . |
| 14:43.26 | SpeedEvil | g1powermac: why not? |
| 14:43.46 | g1powermac | money :-) |
| 14:44.16 | g1powermac | need to figure out if I can swing both a soldering station and a flyswatter |
| 14:46.55 | g1powermac | I'm looking at this station: http://www.circuitspecialists.com/prod.itml/icOid/8396 |
| 14:49.40 | g1powermac | the nice part about circuit specialists is that I can get some schmartboards from them as well |
| 14:49.53 | SpeedEvil | how much isi it? |
| 14:49.58 | g1powermac | and I can get a really nice free dmm: http://www.circuitspecialists.com/prod.itml/icOid/8883 |
| 14:49.58 | SpeedEvil | and what does it do? |
| 14:50.11 | SpeedEvil | TANSTAAFL |
| 14:50.52 | g1powermac | TANSTAAFL? |
| 14:53.33 | g1powermac | hates spending money though on replacement equipment, though I know I really could use better tools |
| 14:55.25 | SpeedEvil | There ain't no such thing as a free lunch |
| 15:02.20 | g1powermac | heh, yea |
| 15:14.15 | sunrunner20 | lol |
| 15:14.27 | sunrunner20 | my dad broke my $150 soldering iron |
| 15:14.33 | sunrunner20 | err |
| 15:14.34 | sunrunner20 | wand |
| 15:14.47 | sunrunner20 | the rest of teh station still works |
| 15:14.53 | g1powermac | that sucks |
| 15:15.56 | sunrunner20 | but more importantly right now is where the *$&U#@* is my deorderant |
| 15:18.29 | sunrunner20 | i tried to get him to replace it with a rework wand |
| 15:18.35 | sunrunner20 | didn't' work out so well |
| 15:19.03 | sunrunner20 | he just went out and bought a cheapo soldering iron |
| 15:19.07 | sunrunner20 | >_> |
| 15:31.30 | g1powermac | ugh |
| 15:31.33 | g1powermac | how cheap? |
| 15:31.43 | g1powermac | cause, I'll sell you mine if you want |
| 15:32.13 | g1powermac | its not great, but will definitely be better than the super cheapo type |
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| 16:07.56 | sunrunner20 | uh |
| 16:07.57 | sunrunner20 | like |
| 16:07.58 | sunrunner20 | $80 |
| 16:08.05 | sunrunner20 | not awful |
| 16:08.05 | sunrunner20 | just |
| 16:08.10 | sunrunner20 | not nearly as good :) |
| 16:08.21 | g1powermac | ok, thats a bit more than what mine cost :-) |
| 16:08.31 | g1powermac | thats why I need a replacement ;-) |
| 16:08.41 | sunrunner20 | lol |
| 16:08.43 | sunrunner20 | i just realized |
| 16:08.46 | sunrunner20 | i could hack together |
| 16:08.53 | sunrunner20 | A high tech LSD dealer |
| 16:09.18 | sunrunner20 | i wonder what the cops would do |
| 16:09.25 | sunrunner20 | i bet they would freak |
| 16:09.49 | g1powermac | heh |
| 16:10.00 | sunrunner20 | ZOMG how do we deal with this ?? |
| 16:12.19 | g1powermac | *sigh* I could soooo much money. . . |
| 16:12.24 | g1powermac | *spend |
| 16:12.27 | g1powermac | oops :-) |
| 16:12.52 | SpeedEvil | I have plans that could easiy spend several tens of billions. |
| 16:13.26 | g1powermac | not sure about billions, but I know I could easily spend a few million in about two days |
| 16:13.48 | g1powermac | and thats not on really expensive stuff like houses or cars ;-) |
| 16:15.54 | sunrunner20 | heh |
| 16:16.06 | sunrunner20 | or women |
| 16:16.58 | SpeedEvil | Outright buying those is frowned on in most jurisdictions. |
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| 16:26.46 | sunrunner20 | lol |
| 16:52.20 | sunrunner20 | ya know |
| 16:52.22 | sunrunner20 | it would be interesting |
| 16:52.26 | sunrunner20 | to make the machine |
| 16:52.32 | sunrunner20 | just for the hell of it |
| 16:52.39 | sunrunner20 | because I _can_ |
| 16:53.45 | sunrunner20 | wonder if you can buy fuel cells yet |
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| 18:19.11 | g1powermac | hey RobotGuy |
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| 18:45.09 | landley | I need to dig up my nail board. |
| 18:45.11 | landley | Took it out of my backpack due to the caselessness. Last I saw it was in a pile of papers near the kitchen... |
| 18:45.13 | landley | I keep remembering to do this when I'm not at home. :) |
| 18:45.25 | g1powermac | heh |
| 18:46.07 | RobotGuy | Hi |
| 18:46.07 | purl | que tal, robotguy |
| 18:46.34 | RobotGuy | I'm online with Gentoo and X works now. :) |
| 18:47.25 | RobotGuy | landley: Greets |
| 18:47.31 | g1powermac | heya RobotGuy |
| 18:47.39 | g1powermac | nice |
| 18:47.46 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Hi |
| 18:49.20 | solar | RobotGuy: cool. Did you have any problems getting your cross-compilers setup? |
| 18:50.11 | RobotGuy | solar: I have not got that far yet. I lost all my stuff on /home where I saved my notes. :( |
| 18:50.42 | RobotGuy | I know I need to install crossdev |
| 18:50.42 | solar | http://linbsd.net/404/doh.jpg |
| 18:50.53 | g1powermac | hah |
| 18:51.20 | solar | I redirectly my gf all port 80 to my random 404 handler. She wakes me up this morn saying the entire internet is 404 |
| 18:51.42 | RobotGuy | Funny! |
| 18:51.45 | g1powermac | is looking at this for his TI 8051s he got: http://www.tinyos8051wg.net/information |
| 18:51.49 | SpeedEvil | redirects solars girlfriend to him. |
| 18:52.03 | solar | you can have her |
| 18:52.04 | SpeedEvil | g1powermac: why do you like these 8051s so much? |
| 18:52.16 | g1powermac | SpeedEvil, soo many neat features |
| 18:53.10 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Interesting. Is that 8051 with the ZigBee available on any boards? |
| 18:53.22 | g1powermac | yup |
| 18:53.23 | RobotGuy | That would be wonderful for my RSRs. |
| 18:53.27 | RobotGuy | Link? |
| 18:53.40 | g1powermac | http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/cc2431.html |
| 18:53.54 | g1powermac | the cc2431 has the location module too |
| 18:54.18 | g1powermac | so if you have multiple chips going at the same time, you can have it triangulate the location of non-stationary chips |
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| 18:57.34 | RobotGuy | Is that the only differences from the 2430? |
| 18:57.40 | g1powermac | mainly |
| 18:58.49 | RobotGuy | Pairing a cc2431 with Hammer.. Hmmmmmm.. :) |
| 18:59.53 | RobotGuy | So, theoretically, if I had three stationary nodes running a CC2431, I could triangulate the position of a mobile robot? |
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| 19:11.10 | RobotGuy | landley: Connectivity issues? |
| 19:11.53 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Would there have to be three stationary nodes running the CC2431 to triangulate the position of a mobile robot? |
| 19:12.45 | landley | Yup. |
| 19:12.49 | landley | Coffee shop. |
| 19:16.29 | RobotGuy | Hmmmmmmm.. The CC2431 as an addon to Hammer. That would get me my ZigBee and more. |
| 19:16.51 | *** join/#edev landley_ (n=landley@216-188-225-16.dyn.grandenetworks.net) |
| 19:18.41 | landley_ | This is _sad_. |
| 19:19.42 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, relative stationary |
| 19:21.05 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, from what I can tell, you need to know where the three points are located |
| 19:21.25 | g1powermac | and then it'll compute where the moving points are to a .25m |
| 19:23.04 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Ahhh, OK. That would still be useful for an indoor environment though. |
| 19:23.17 | g1powermac | oh for sure |
| 19:23.39 | g1powermac | I'm thinking of even using it for calculating arm and leg movements |
| 19:23.47 | RobotGuy | My apartment complex has three 'wings' setup in an 'X' shape. |
| 19:23.57 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Hmmmmmm, IK? |
| 19:24.24 | g1powermac | have three 'stationary' sensors on a persons torso, and then strap on two sensors, one on your wrist and one on your ankle |
| 19:24.52 | g1powermac | it should be able to calculate how much movement your arms and legs are moving |
| 19:25.06 | RobotGuy | Interesting.. That could be useful ON a robot too, so position of an end effector of an arm could be calculated. |
| 19:25.29 | g1powermac | obviously .25m isn't the smallest measurement, but it'll still work |
| 19:25.43 | RobotGuy | It depends how far away from the mobile unit the stationary units have to be for it to work. |
| 19:26.00 | g1powermac | yea |
| 19:26.10 | RobotGuy | .25m wouldn't be accurate enough for the end position of the arm though. |
| 19:26.35 | g1powermac | unfortunately, no, but it will show movement |
| 19:26.41 | RobotGuy | True |
| 19:27.28 | g1powermac | hmm, so thats about 9.84 inches |
| 19:27.47 | RobotGuy | I have what I believe to be the final design for the arm on W.A.L.T.E.R. now, with the double joint. I think the arm will be able to reach the gripper to the floor as well as into the cargo deck. |
| 19:27.57 | g1powermac | that really isn't bad considering using only three stationary points |
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| 19:28.22 | RobotGuy | Hmmmm, W.A.L.T.E.R. is 11 1/2" diameter.. |
| 19:28.42 | g1powermac | now what would be interesting is to couple accelerometers to these things |
| 19:28.59 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Ummm, yes, that would be interesting for sure.. |
| 19:29.18 | g1powermac | you'd have approximate 3 axis location + 3 axis acceleration |
| 19:29.32 | RobotGuy | accerometer or an IMU with the CC2431 would be interesting. I already have a 3 axis accelerometer. |
| 19:30.17 | RobotGuy | I would like to be able to tell where the gripper is in 3D. |
| 19:30.29 | g1powermac | hmm, Inertial Measurement Unit, now thats something new to me |
| 19:32.16 | SpeedEvil | Basically, IMUs don't exists that are worthwhile for this |
| 19:32.23 | SpeedEvil | They are _horribly_ drifty |
| 19:32.26 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 19:32.46 | SpeedEvil | As in of the order of 1cm/s/s^2 |
| 19:33.06 | SpeedEvil | Or after 1 minute, 1.5m/s out, or 45m |
| 19:35.10 | g1powermac | only annoying part is that this chip doesn't have i2c on it. . . |
| 19:35.26 | g1powermac | gonna need a zigbee chip for the zipit that is i2c |
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| 19:36.59 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Here is something to drool about: http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8454 |
| 19:37.20 | RobotGuy | That is annoying, no I2C. Hmmmm. SPI? |
| 19:37.20 | g1powermac | haha, nice |
| 19:37.30 | g1powermac | yea, think it has spi |
| 19:37.47 | RobotGuy | I really must learn how to use SPI. |
| 19:38.03 | g1powermac | yea, it has spi |
| 19:38.35 | RobotGuy | That IMU has an LPC2138 on it already. |
| 19:46.15 | g1powermac | bbiab |
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| 21:27.26 | g1powermac | ok, this is an interesting chip too: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/cc2480a1.html |
| 21:27.42 | g1powermac | total zigbee system on a chip |
| 21:28.08 | g1powermac | it has the full stack stuff already setup and you choose your own mcu to interface with it externally |
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| 21:31.42 | g1powermac | it doesn't have the location stuff in it though |
| 21:32.01 | MonMotha | ouch @ price |
| 21:32.18 | RobotGuy | I wonder if there is one with the locator module. |
| 21:32.33 | MonMotha | that's 2.5-3x what a radio alone costs, and you know you already have a MCU, so you just make it bigger |
| 21:32.41 | g1powermac | $8? it isn't that bad |
| 21:33.31 | g1powermac | RobotGuy, don't think so |
| 21:33.45 | MonMotha | that's very expensive compared to a radio alone |
| 21:34.08 | MonMotha | now, you will have to possibly upsize your mcu to use a "bare" radio, but I doubt it'll cost you $6 to do that... |
| 21:34.10 | g1powermac | maybe, but you're getting the full zigbee system |
| 21:34.31 | g1powermac | no fussing with the bare hardware or any network stacking |
| 21:35.47 | g1powermac | this thing also has some interesting peripherals on it |
| 21:36.11 | g1powermac | wonders if this chip is just a cc2430 preloaded with zigbee software. . . |
| 21:36.21 | MonMotha | well yes if you have a serious development time issue and time per unit is not a factor, then go for it |
| 21:36.39 | MonMotha | but $4-6 per unit is a pretty big cost in almost any application |
| 21:37.09 | g1powermac | maybe, but thats not my concern for what I'm doing |
| 21:37.28 | g1powermac | I'm prototyping stuff, not creating stuff that I'm actually going to make 1000's of |
| 21:38.25 | RobotGuy | I'll bbiab. Got to get my documents from windows. |
| 21:38.46 | MonMotha | in that case, good luck with your QFN ;) |
| 21:39.01 | g1powermac | my main concern is getting a multi-channel semi-mesh like wireless network going without massive overhead of making such system :-) |
| 21:39.25 | g1powermac | meh, qfns aren't too hard to solder with the right stuff |
| 21:39.56 | roxfan | easier than bga |
| 21:40.03 | g1powermac | heck yea |
| 21:40.27 | g1powermac | had to solder a qfn-like oscillator to his minila |
| 21:40.41 | g1powermac | got it done with the abysmal soldering equipment i have |
| 21:41.01 | MonMotha | just the little 4 pad crystals? those aren't hard if you set the PCB lands up right |
| 21:41.19 | MonMotha | the 0.5mm 48 lead monsters with epad - those are different beasts |
| 21:41.58 | MonMotha | well, 48 pad; they have no leads after all |
| 21:42.02 | g1powermac | true, but I was not using a decent soldering iron |
| 21:43.28 | g1powermac | yea, this chip really is just a cc2430 with preloaded software, maybe a few hardware changes |
| 21:45.40 | RobotGuy | It says the cc2431 has a hardware location engine though. |
| 21:46.05 | g1powermac | yea, the cc2431 has that, the cc2430 doesn't |
| 21:46.36 | RobotGuy | But you still need software to make it all work. |
| 21:46.46 | g1powermac | very true |
| 21:47.30 | RobotGuy | So the 8051 still needs to be programmed to do everything you want to do. |
| 21:47.34 | RobotGuy | Or I want to do. |
| 21:47.55 | g1powermac | yes |
| 21:47.56 | RobotGuy | I wonder if location stuff could be done just in software. |
| 21:48.06 | g1powermac | I was wondering that myself |
| 21:48.41 | RobotGuy | If so, it frees us from having to use the cc2431. We could use any ZigBee module. |
| 21:49.20 | RobotGuy | I just got some ZigBee chips from TI. Have to see which ones I got. |
| 21:51.46 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: I got CC2520RHT |
| 21:52.13 | g1powermac | heh, funny, I'm looking at its cousin, the CC2510F32 |
| 21:58.22 | RobotGuy | I have 5 of the cc2520 |
| 21:59.16 | g1powermac | alright, time for me to head home |
| 21:59.20 | g1powermac | bbl |
| 22:35.53 | *** join/#edev g1powermac_PB (n=g1powerm@unaffiliated/g1powermac) |
| 22:40.48 | *** join/#edev sweetdream (i=sweetdre@ip70-187-210-104.dc.dc.cox.net) |
| 23:32.53 | RobotGuy | g1powermac_PB: WB |
| 23:38.23 | g1powermac_PB | thanks |
| 23:38.23 | purl | gern geschehen, g1powermac_PB |
| 23:44.17 | g1powermac_PB | this cc2480 chip is quite interesting |
