| 00:00.08 | prpplague | crazy eh? |
| 00:01.49 | ce_geek | Well done, well done. |
| 00:04.33 | ce_geek | Heard of this guy? |
| 00:04.35 | ce_geek | http://www.kalinskyassociates.com/ |
| 00:15.21 | ce_geek | Doing some training at work for us |
| 00:16.10 | ce_geek | Going back to Orono for a flying by the seat of my pants type visit. I should try and borrow (steal) the hammer kit so I can play with some stuff. |
| 00:17.00 | ce_geek | I never did bill the department for the $30 worth of connectors and hardware and stuff for the prototyping setup I made. Oh well. |
| 00:32.00 | prpplague | ce_geek i'll cheek with the boss tomorrow on your kit status |
| 00:32.12 | ce_geek | prpplague: ok |
| 00:32.35 | prpplague | ce_geek how does that guy do with his training? |
| 00:33.08 | ce_geek | prpplague: Pretty good. It's a real intro class, so some of it is a bit boring if you've had any exposure to the material, but he definitely seems to know his stuff. |
| 00:33.21 | ce_geek | There are some whitepapers on his website that are similar to the slides he shows in class |
| 00:33.42 | prpplague | interesting |
| 00:34.08 | ce_geek | I'm interested in his more advanced classes that are more mathematical and such. |
| 00:34.26 | ce_geek | Also has some advanced debugging classes that are probably really good. |
| 00:35.00 | prpplague | hmm, the course descriptions seem pretty vague |
| 00:35.18 | ce_geek | He doesn't seem to be a huge fan of Linux, doesn't speak very highly of it. Uses other real time operating systems in the examples. |
| 00:35.37 | ce_geek | uC/OS, VxWorks, and some others |
| 00:37.16 | ce_geek | It's hard to say. I haven't spoken to anyone that has taken his advanced classes, but we all seem to agree that the intro class has a bit of a slow pace. It's tricky though because it's a large, very diverse group he's got to deal with. |
| 00:37.29 | ce_geek | It would be better if it were a smaller class with students that had a specific background. |
| 00:39.28 | ce_geek | Talked today about process syncrhonization, message passing, message queues, real time scheduling issues, etc. |
| 00:41.45 | prpplague | interesting |
| 00:42.06 | prpplague | i'm fairly skeptical about most of these classes |
| 00:42.15 | ce_geek | Prioritized interrupts, nested interrupts, |
| 00:42.36 | ce_geek | I'm considering it to be mostly a review of stuff I've learned in my various classes. |
| 00:42.48 | ce_geek | Unfortunately no hands on stuff |
| 00:42.59 | ce_geek | Only a 2 day class |
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| 01:32.18 | g1powermac_PB | well, that was really fun |
| 01:32.45 | g1powermac_PB | I decided to set up a ds89c430 to play with some TI led controllers I got yesterday |
| 01:33.23 | g1powermac_PB | now since I decided to do this under linux (which I haven't done before) and this was a new circuit, there could be many points of failure |
| 01:34.46 | g1powermac_PB | the loader program failed trying to load the program on the ds89c430, so I checked all the hardware and even made sure the max233 is sending and receiving the serial info |
| 01:36.08 | g1powermac_PB | it all came down to the stupid writer of the loader program hard coding the message the ds89c450 and only the 450 would send back on initialization of the loading circuit |
| 01:36.42 | g1powermac_PB | so it won't work with the other chips in the family, as they send a different message, even though its suppose too |
| 01:40.39 | solar | OSCON has been pretty boring so far. |
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| 03:10.04 | sunrunner20 | yayayaya |
| 03:10.09 | sunrunner20 | i has my L button lol |
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| 03:37.11 | sunrunner20 | >_< |
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| 07:26.33 | [AD]Turbo | hola |
| 07:48.28 | methril | morning |
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| 09:49.34 | Mr_Bonga | hi everyone |
| 09:50.09 | methril | hi |
| 09:50.51 | Mr_Bonga | methril do you know how can I "catch" a kernel interrupt in user space ?? |
| 09:51.23 | methril | what interrupt? |
| 09:51.31 | methril | you mean doing user-space drivers? |
| 09:51.45 | Mr_Bonga | hmmm |
| 09:51.59 | Mr_Bonga | I will try to explain what I want to do |
| 09:52.27 | Mr_Bonga | I want to detect when I have a change of my eth link status |
| 09:52.51 | methril | but you don't need to "catch" that interrupt |
| 09:53.12 | methril | you have that capability in your driver (most of them have it) |
| 09:53.14 | Mr_Bonga | when I plug or unplug the ethernet cable, my kernel dislay some msg |
| 09:53.27 | Mr_Bonga | really?? |
| 09:53.45 | Mr_Bonga | and how could I detect those changes?? |
| 09:56.12 | Mr_Bonga | methril ?? |
| 09:56.56 | methril | do you have ifplugstatus cmd? |
| 09:59.04 | Mr_Bonga | on my embedded system I don't have it |
| 09:59.59 | methril | wait a moment |
| 10:04.40 | Mr_Bonga | ok |
| 10:05.24 | methril | well, i don't know how to trap that signals |
| 10:06.05 | methril | but i know that in debian machines you have in /etc/network/if-down.d and if-up.d |
| 10:06.42 | methril | dirs where you could put some start/stop scripts |
| 10:11.17 | Mr_Bonga | hmmm |
| 10:11.23 | methril | udev could mannage this |
| 10:11.26 | methril | too |
| 10:11.36 | Mr_Bonga | udev?? |
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| 10:25.41 | methril | take a look at ethstatus |
| 10:48.28 | Mr_Bonga | I am using montavista pro 4.0 on my embedded system |
| 10:48.43 | Mr_Bonga | and it don't have those tools installed |
| 10:48.45 | Mr_Bonga | :( |
| 10:52.55 | methril | you don't have ipkg or opkg? |
| 11:22.25 | Mr_Bonga | no |
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| 14:16.17 | prpplague | power spike |
| 14:24.06 | chouimat|work | morning |
| 14:35.11 | Mr_Bonga | hi again people |
| 14:35.13 | Mr_Bonga | :) |
| 14:35.27 | Mr_Bonga | how can I set a timer on linux ?? |
| 14:42.07 | prpplague | Mr_Bonga: d00d, have you purchased a copy of "linux device drivers " yet? |
| 14:45.06 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 14:47.57 | Mr_Bonga | copy ?? no |
| 14:48.09 | Mr_Bonga | but for what prpplague ?? |
| 14:48.30 | prpplague | Mr_Bonga: to answer the questions you are asking here |
| 14:49.37 | Mr_Bonga | timer's ?? |
| 14:49.56 | Mr_Bonga | I am using setitimer () |
| 14:50.36 | Mr_Bonga | but I get an error on function that handles SIGALRM |
| 14:51.17 | prpplague | Mr_Bonga: are you doing a userspace application or a kernel driver? |
| 14:51.31 | agaffney | can kernel code even use signals? |
| 14:51.47 | prpplague | agaffney: no but they can use timers, so i was making sure |
| 14:53.03 | Mr_Bonga | user space prpplague |
| 14:54.30 | agaffney | `man 2 signal` |
| 14:58.08 | Mr_Bonga | ?? |
| 15:00.07 | Mr_Bonga | but why size of the code inside os the signal handler function it's a limit ?? |
| 15:00.16 | Mr_Bonga | I don't understand that |
| 15:04.02 | agaffney | fails to parse that |
| 15:05.14 | chouimat|work | hi prpplague agaffney |
| 15:05.15 | prpplague | as well |
| 15:05.22 | prpplague | chouimat|work: hey |
| 15:05.35 | agaffney | 'morning chouimat|work |
| 15:06.38 | chouimat|work | agaffney: is there some documentation on how to cross compile a gentoo stage ? like amd64 to ppc well any notes or doc will do :) |
| 15:07.56 | prpplague | chouimat|work: solar would be the person to ask |
| 15:08.10 | chouimat|work | prpplague: :) |
| 15:10.28 | agaffney | chouimat|work: what prpplague said :P |
| 15:10.32 | chouimat|work | agaffney: hehe |
| 15:11.05 | agaffney | I do cross-compiling with distcc (yeah, yeah...it's not *real* cross-compiling :P) and building stages natively |
| 15:11.16 | *** join/#edev CosmicPenguin (n=nobody@163.181.251.103) |
| 15:11.16 | *** mode/#edev [+o CosmicPenguin] by ChanServ |
| 15:11.21 | agaffney | but with all my work, the target is also the host |
| 15:11.36 | agaffney | much easier that way ;) |
| 15:12.16 | chouimat|work | agaffney: we do this at work too ... and compiling our es4 derived product on an orion based device take time :) |
| 15:21.38 | Mr_Bonga | people help me |
| 15:21.39 | Mr_Bonga | :D |
| 15:24.51 | agaffney | Mr_Bonga: you're asking basic C and *nix programming questions |
| 15:24.55 | agaffney | which don't really belong here |
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| 15:35.26 | prpplague | Mr_Bonga: probably need to ask these questions in a channel dedicated to programming C in a unix environment |
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| 15:41.13 | prpplague | samuelr: hehe thanks for the mention of #edev , hehe |
| 15:42.03 | kergoth`work | morning |
| 15:42.16 | kergoth`work | Mr_Bonga: try the ##c channel |
| 15:42.33 | CosmicPenguin | hah - I wasn't going to touch that with a 0x10 foot pole |
| 15:43.37 | kergoth`work | Mr_Bonga: or pick up Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment, classic book, great for reference :P |
| 15:43.55 | CosmicPenguin | mandatory book |
| 15:44.17 | chouimat|work | losts his copy :( |
| 15:44.40 | kergoth`work | "the PTO Board of Patent Appeals and Interferences has now supplied an answer to that question: A general purpose computer is not a particular machine, and thus innovative software processes are unpatentable if they are tied only to a general purpose computer." <-sweet |
| 15:45.00 | CosmicPenguin | \o/ |
| 15:45.10 | chouimat|work | kergoth`work: source? |
| 15:45.14 | kergoth`work | LWN |
| 15:45.22 | kergoth`work | http://www.patentlyo.com/patent/2008/07/the-death-of-go.html |
| 15:45.25 | kergoth`work | there's the original source |
| 15:47.05 | chouimat|work | ewwww legalese .... |
| 15:47.57 | kergoth`work | hehe |
| 15:48.53 | kergoth`work | you guys might like this ff extension i was playing with yesterday.. Book Burro. it shows a panel in the corner with prices from 10 other book sites, when you're on a book page on one of the sites. pretty nifty. picked up a computer architecture book from a used place i found through it for $22+$5shipping, when its normally $76.. here's hoping the wear isnt too bad :) |
| 15:49.13 | chouimat|work | this is evil: http://uuner.doslash.org/forfun/sedtris.sed |
| 15:49.18 | chouimat|work | kergoth`work: ^^^^^ |
| 15:49.39 | kergoth`work | ack |
| 15:49.41 | kergoth`work | thats just scary |
| 15:49.58 | CosmicPenguin | cute |
| 15:58.47 | kergoth`work | http://hundredpushups.com/ cool simple little exercise program |
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| 16:25.50 | prpplague | ho ho hum |
| 16:25.57 | prpplague | tries to assemble a m8050 |
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| 17:14.59 | samuelr | prpplague: no problem :-) |
| 17:25.16 | Mr_Bonga | prpplague my arm processor has 4 timers |
| 17:25.35 | Mr_Bonga | one of those are high-resolution timer |
| 17:25.42 | Mr_Bonga | how can I use it ?? |
| 17:25.56 | Mr_Bonga | you could help me?? |
| 17:28.26 | kergoth`work | google can help you. |
| 17:28.28 | kergoth`work | first link -> http://high-res-timers.sourceforge.net/ |
| 17:28.43 | kergoth`work | "The code will be compliant with and will implement the POSIX 1003.1b Section 14 (Clocks and Timers) API." |
| 17:28.48 | kergoth`work | now google for that |
| 17:29.09 | kergoth`work | i expect its probably timer_gettime/timer_settime, the posix real time extensions api, but thats j ust a guess, never used hrt |
| 17:36.05 | prpplague | Mr_Bonga: http://www.elinux.org/High_Resolution_Timers |
| 17:37.14 | kergoth`work | nice |
| 17:37.17 | kergoth`work | cyclictest looks cute |
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| 17:45.02 | CosmicPenguin | anybody want to answer an 8051 question? |
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| 17:45.43 | CosmicPenguin | speak of the devil |
| 17:48.17 | CosmicPenguin | T0mW: can you answer me a quick 8051 question? |
| 17:49.58 | CosmicPenguin | actually, never mind - I think I figured it out |
| 17:51.03 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: 42 |
| 17:51.28 | Tom_itx | prpplague! how goes it.. |
| 17:51.58 | prpplague | Tom_itx: it's going |
| 17:52.14 | prpplague | Tom_itx: and you? |
| 17:52.29 | Tom_itx | about the same |
| 17:54.26 | Tom_itx | any good links to get me started programming for my ipaq h2200? |
| 17:54.55 | prpplague | Tom_itx: i'd check the handhelds.org wiki pages first |
| 17:55.16 | Tom_itx | ya, i've looked there a bit |
| 17:59.55 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: yes |
| 18:01.02 | CosmicPenguin | T0mW: I was lookign at the math functions here http://www.8052.com/codelib/8051Maths and I didn't grok that SUBB handled the borrow automatically |
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| 18:03.42 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: yes, it does affect the borrow |
| 18:05.02 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: there is a subtract with borrow and a subtract without borrow. both affect the carry flag as to the outcome of the operation. One takes the borrow and includes it into the subtraction, there other ignores it. |
| 18:05.33 | T0mW | s/into the subtraction/into the subtraction operation |
| 18:05.53 | T0mW | CosmicPenguin: bbiab |
| 18:07.34 | g1powermac_PB | hmm, I found a really interesting TI chip |
| 18:07.56 | g1powermac_PB | but its only for high volume customers, yet digikey has the chip available |
| 18:08.09 | g1powermac_PB | but you have to contact TI for a full datasheet. . .hmm |
| 18:10.00 | g1powermac_PB | http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tsb43cb43a.html |
| 18:10.40 | g1powermac_PB | I wonder if there's any chance of me getting a real datasheet |
| 18:12.59 | ds2 | ewwwwwwwwwwwwwww 8042 instead of an 8051? ;) |
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| 18:37.30 | g1powermac_PB | wonders why he finding an arm board with firewire is so difficult. . . |
| 18:37.46 | g1powermac_PB | s/he// |
| 18:42.54 | MothaWork | ARM SoCs with built in USB are very common. IEEE1394 not so much |
| 18:43.11 | MothaWork | most 1394 hosts are also designed to sit on, say, a PCI bus, not a CPU local bus |
| 18:43.13 | g1powermac_PB | yea, but I can't find a single board |
| 18:43.23 | MothaWork | I'm guessing demand is so low that nobody bothers |
| 18:43.26 | g1powermac_PB | unfortunately on that one |
| 18:43.46 | MothaWork | there are some OHCI 1394 hosts that are designed to sit on local busses and be accessed like SRAM |
| 18:43.57 | MothaWork | usually designed for extremely high volume consumer electronics |
| 18:43.58 | g1powermac_PB | yea, from TI |
| 18:44.00 | MothaWork | Ti has a couple |
| 18:44.02 | MothaWork | yes |
| 18:44.04 | ds2 | there are ARM boards with PCI |
| 18:44.10 | MothaWork | there are ARM boards with PCI, yes |
| 18:44.17 | MothaWork | you could add 1394 to one :) |
| 18:44.28 | MothaWork | I've seen them in a PC104+ formfactor |
| 18:44.30 | ds2 | refrains from any comments on the affordability of such boards ;) |
| 18:44.40 | MothaWork | heh, indeed |
| 18:44.57 | g1powermac_PB | the hard part with the pci variant ones is portability issues |
| 18:45.10 | ds2 | the bigger reference boards from ARM tend to have PCI...even with a stock PC slot |
| 18:45.11 | g1powermac_PB | the thing combined can't be the size of a brick :-) |
| 18:45.35 | ds2 | the official ARM reference boards are much bigger then a brick... so it is definitely NOT the size of a brick :P |
| 18:45.44 | g1powermac_PB | heh |
| 18:46.02 | MothaWork | nice |
| 18:46.37 | prpplague | the problem with arm boards with PCI are the fact that many PCI cards contain microcode that is executed on the host device |
| 18:46.53 | prpplague | and that microcode is generally x86 asm |
| 18:46.56 | g1powermac_PB | pc104 isn't such a bad option |
| 18:47.10 | g1powermac_PB | there are pc104 firewire cards |
| 18:47.11 | prpplague | so your choice pci cards is alot more limited |
| 18:47.18 | prpplague | for use with arm boards |
| 18:47.37 | g1powermac_PB | http://www.embedded-designs-plus.com/pc104fw/pc104fw.htm |
| 18:47.51 | prpplague | http://www.simtec.co.uk/products/EB110ATX/ |
| 18:48.24 | g1powermac_PB | yeesh, yea, thats a bit, umm, huge :-) |
| 18:49.43 | g1powermac_PB | I think pc104 might work |
| 18:49.51 | ds2 | are there free IP for firewire? |
| 18:50.02 | ds2 | if so, there is an Actel FPGA with an ARM core option |
| 18:50.45 | g1powermac_PB | there is something at opencores |
| 18:57.15 | MothaWork | you'd still need a PHY |
| 18:57.27 | MothaWork | and the bare PHYs are also usually targetted towards high volume (usually ASIC) applications |
| 18:57.43 | ds2 | discrete parts/hand wounded xformers? |
| 18:57.53 | g1powermac_PB | pc104 takes care of that problem. . . |
| 18:58.03 | MothaWork | issue is that many FPGAs can't toggle their IOs fast enough to handle the 1394 bus |
| 18:58.06 | MothaWork | especially not the faster standards |
| 18:58.20 | MothaWork | now, if you have something like the MGTs on the Xilinx Virtex series, you could possibly do it |
| 18:58.47 | ds2 | wouldn't you come out ahead powerwise using an x86 instead of a Virtex? |
| 18:58.48 | MothaWork | same problem with high-speed USB |
| 18:59.03 | ds2 | the OMAPs seems to keep up with HS USB |
| 18:59.04 | MothaWork | depends on your design, but if you use a Geode, Atom, or one of the Vias, possibly |
| 18:59.22 | MothaWork | but you're using a dedicated set of pins probably |
| 18:59.37 | ds2 | extern phy actually ;) |
| 18:59.40 | MothaWork | those IO pads are designed for the high speed and probably have a deserializer |
| 18:59.43 | MothaWork | oh, well, then there you go |
| 18:59.48 | MothaWork | back to what I was saying: external PHY |
| 19:00.06 | MothaWork | they make them for 1394, just like USB HS |
| 19:00.19 | MothaWork | TI is a big maker |
| 19:00.24 | MothaWork | I think Via may also have something |
| 19:00.37 | ds2 | I wonder if davinci has a 1394 bus |
| 19:01.10 | MothaWork | the davincis are just ARM paired with a DSP and marketed a certain way |
| 19:01.17 | MothaWork | though given their target market, they may |
| 19:01.43 | MothaWork | most STBs I've torn apart (though it's been a few years) with 1394 have at least an external PHY if not an external MAC |
| 19:03.11 | ds2 | don't see a board with davinci and 1394 |
| 19:22.05 | MothaWork | hum, anybody know if it's possible to configure the number of entries in the gvim "Buffers" menu before it sorts by alpha range? |
| 19:22.20 | MothaWork | I've attempted to google, but it's not something easy to hit on |
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| 20:17.03 | MothaWork | prpplague: around? |
| 20:17.22 | prpplague | MothaWork: asquare? |
| 20:17.46 | MothaWork | prpplague: aparallogramindeed |
| 20:18.02 | CosmicPenguin | meh |
| 20:18.05 | MothaWork | prpplague: are the AML barcode equipped handhelds beefy enough in terms of CPU/memory to run simple browser based apps? |
| 20:18.20 | MothaWork | no fancy AJAX or anything, but static web pages with postbacks and such |
| 20:18.45 | prpplague | MothaWork: yea the 7220 series has lynx on it |
| 20:18.53 | prpplague | MothaWork: you can run it in text or graphical |
| 20:18.56 | MothaWork | what kind of screen on those suckers? |
| 20:19.10 | MothaWork | enough to get ~30 characters across? |
| 20:19.17 | prpplague | 160x160 |
| 20:19.24 | prpplague | small font you can |
| 20:19.25 | MothaWork | hum, that might be pushing it |
| 20:19.30 | MothaWork | but ok |
| 20:19.34 | MothaWork | I was just curious |
| 20:19.44 | MothaWork | firefox (or mobile firefox) would be nice, but that's asking a bit much |
| 20:19.51 | prpplague | yea |
| 20:19.55 | MothaWork | especially in terms of screen required |
| 20:20.04 | prpplague | MothaWork: the m8050 will be alot more robust |
| 20:20.16 | prpplague | MothaWork: but alot of people use the lynx for web based apps |
| 20:21.04 | MothaWork | ok |
| 20:21.36 | MothaWork | the system I've got going here is neat, but it's currently tied to a computer powerful enough to run both a web browser and hook up a barcode scanner |
| 20:21.46 | MothaWork | I could use a handheld with USB OTG or something, but that's a bit ugly |
| 20:22.17 | MothaWork | my laptop is a bit unwieldy to carry around to cabinets with one hand while scanning with the other |
| 20:22.30 | prpplague | MothaWork: yea, exactly the type of stuff the 7220 was made for |
| 20:22.37 | MothaWork | what I really want is a "PocketPC" style device with a barcode scanner |
| 20:22.54 | MothaWork | and a few hard buttons that I can map |
| 20:23.37 | prpplague | MothaWork: the m8050 probably would do for what you want |
| 20:24.01 | MothaWork | well, I know how expensive those suckers can get |
| 20:24.13 | MothaWork | I don't think there's the budget for it atm |
| 20:24.14 | MothaWork | but we'll see |
| 20:24.56 | prpplague | MothaWork: don't hold me to it, but it is my understanding that the m8050 will retail for about $1100 |
| 20:25.32 | MothaWork | yeah, that's a bit more than I can probably justify |
| 20:44.56 | g1powermac_PB | so what do you guys think of this: http://www.enterpoint.co.uk/component_replacements/craignell.html |
| 20:51.00 | prpplague | g1powermac: interesting |
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| 20:51.14 | prpplague | g1powermac_PB: figured you;d go for the fpga from SFE |
| 20:51.56 | g1powermac_PB | prpplague: yea, I was really looking at that one but then someone from ##microcontrollers mentioned this craignell |
| 20:52.50 | g1powermac_PB | the neat part with the craignell is that it works out of the box with 5v I/O and doesn't need me to do anything else with it except provide power and programming |
| 20:58.48 | g1powermac_PB | that company has some other interesting things |
| 20:58.56 | g1powermac_PB | like this baby: http://www.enterpoint.co.uk/moelbryn/darnaw1.html |
| 21:10.04 | g1powermac_PB | this one is pretty neat too: http://www.enterpoint.co.uk/component_replacements/drigmorn1.html |
| 21:10.11 | g1powermac_PB | though not in the dip packaging |
| 21:14.29 | prpplague | lordy lordy lordy |
| 21:14.40 | prpplague | i am SOOOO sick of cleaning up the stupid EE's mistakes |
| 21:21.45 | wmat | prpplague: ok, stop showing off |
| 21:22.22 | prpplague | wmat: ?? |
| 21:23.09 | wmat | heh, just that most people would hold EE's on somewhat of a pedastal; at least most managers I've worked with anyway |
| 21:24.12 | prpplague | wmat: yea, the boss thinks this guy walks on water |
| 21:24.34 | prpplague | wmat: but tell me, how hard can it be to get the pinout for a fsck'n push button switch |
| 21:24.35 | prpplague | ??? |
| 21:24.37 | MothaWork | hey now, GOOD EEs are quite useful |
| 21:24.46 | MothaWork | prpplague: actually... |
| 21:24.50 | prpplague | this guy is a complete idiot |
| 21:24.53 | MothaWork | you'd be amazed how crappy some of those datasheets are |
| 21:24.55 | g1powermac_PB | what about a CE? :-) |
| 21:25.03 | MothaWork | but I usually just buy one and take a multimeter to it in that case |
| 21:25.13 | prpplague | MothaWork: exactly |
| 21:25.16 | g1powermac_PB | would like to finish his degree in CE at some point |
| 21:25.23 | MothaWork | g1powermac: C meaning the conventional "Civil" or the new "Computer"? |
| 21:25.28 | ds2 | some push button switches have 8 pins, 6 N/C's ;) |
| 21:25.30 | g1powermac_PB | Computer Engineering |
| 21:25.43 | ds2 | go all the way and get a EE |
| 21:25.45 | wmat | i know some CE's that can make a good cup of coffee; EE's are generally best left to tea ;) |
| 21:25.56 | g1powermac_PB | though really, I'm one of those people who'd go into all fields of engineering |
| 21:25.57 | MothaWork | my degree is actually in Computer Engineering. I however hang with the EE crowd and tend to mention that unless somebody actually asks |
| 21:26.00 | g1powermac_PB | I love the stuff really |
| 21:26.06 | ds2 | <-- EE |
| 21:26.07 | MothaWork | most people hear "computer engineering" and thing I have some programming certificate |
| 21:26.12 | kergoth`work | should get a degree at some point |
| 21:26.30 | wmat | too |
| 21:26.43 | g1powermac_PB | wmat: hehe, I like tea over coffee :-) |
| 21:27.14 | chouimat|work | <----- B.Sc.A es Informatique de genie (in english B. Applied Science in CE/SE) |
| 21:27.26 | wmat | has a degree in pub crawling, at leas that's all he remembers doing at Uni |
| 21:27.32 | g1powermac_PB | personally, I'd do a multiply BS degree in CS, CE, and EE maybe with ME stuff too :-) |
| 21:27.48 | ds2 | ME would be fun |
| 21:27.49 | g1powermac_PB | I like mechanical stuff too |
| 21:27.52 | MothaWork | I attempted to double major CpE/EE, but they decided that wasn't allowed the day I went to declare it |
| 21:27.55 | ds2 | MS ME |
| 21:28.00 | prpplague | yea this is a double pole single throw |
| 21:28.09 | MothaWork | the computer engineering degrees are given by the EE department at my school |
| 21:28.11 | g1powermac_PB | MothaWork: heh |
| 21:28.35 | MothaWork | it is in fact the ECE department officially: "Electrical and Computer Engineering" |
| 21:28.37 | ds2 | the way the world seems to work is - ASIC/Silicon makes get to make mistakes "errata" that the EE's have to work around and fix but they get to make their mistakes that software guys have to fix |
| 21:28.51 | MothaWork | ds2: pretty much |
| 21:28.55 | MothaWork | and there is a reason for that |
| 21:29.00 | ds2 | the SW guys then have to put out new releases to fix their mistakes ;) |
| 21:29.04 | MothaWork | mostly the time and cost associated with a rev. |
| 21:29.06 | ds2 | MothaWork: $$$$$$$$ |
| 21:29.29 | prpplague | brb |
| 21:29.50 | g1powermac_PB | I really should check out the mechanical engineering stuff at the university I'm thinking of finishing my degree at |
| 21:30.05 | MothaWork | time (not necessarily man-hours, but actual time) is rather high on ASIC spins, and is at minimum a few days for PCB prototypes, and of course there's also the issue of inventory if you discover an erratum after purchasing production quantities |
| 21:30.34 | MothaWork | and, well, ASIC spins are REALLY expensive, and complex PCBs can easily cost 4 figures each for 2-5 prototype quantities |
| 21:30.39 | g1powermac_PB | I can't tell you how many mechanical engineering like projects I've done in the past few months, I love building stuff |
| 21:31.10 | ds2 | I wish the local JC offered a real AS ME |
| 21:31.50 | g1powermac_PB | the university I'll be heading to is actually participating in the solar car race thing |
| 21:32.19 | MothaWork | the college I went to did have a solar car, but they decided not to participate for purely financial reasons the year before I went there |
| 21:32.25 | MothaWork | apparently it was a really expensive project |
| 21:32.50 | g1powermac_PB | yea |
| 21:33.01 | wmat | UWaterloo (school where I live) always has a team in that, I believe |
| 21:33.30 | ds2 | the school actually paid for it? thought most of these teams are sponsored |
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| 21:33.53 | g1powermac_PB | wb prpplague |
| 21:34.01 | MothaWork | ds2: it was sponsored, mostly by the SGA |
| 21:34.07 | prpplague | thanks |
| 21:34.14 | MothaWork | they had a number of commercial sponsors as well, but it was just REALLY expensive |
| 21:34.17 | chouimat|work | cool since the CTO is gone to go back in school I'm, the one who get all the new toys :) |
| 21:34.24 | ds2 | I see |
| 21:34.34 | g1powermac_PB | chouimat|work: haha |
| 21:35.24 | chouimat|work | g1powermac_PB: I have now 5 new orion based device to install our product on them ... and a few mips one ... it's so cool :) |
| 21:35.40 | g1powermac_PB | nice |
| 21:40.14 | g1powermac_PB | bbiab |
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| 22:02.49 | prpplague | funny, all the linux people love the fact that the elinux wiki has all the docs for the hammer |
| 22:02.57 | prpplague | all the microcontroller people hate it |
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| 22:17.18 | wmat | prpplague: why do the mc people hate it? |
| 22:18.12 | prpplague | wmat: i really don't know |
| 22:18.29 | wmat | and how do you know this? |
| 22:18.32 | prpplague | wmat: its almost like they prefer a single pdf document with step-by-step instructions |
| 22:18.42 | wmat | oh, i see, so they're lazy ;) |
| 22:18.43 | prpplague | wmat: numerous complaints |
| 22:18.53 | wmat | odd |
| 22:18.59 | prpplague | http://www.tincantools.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=496 |
| 22:19.11 | prpplague | pretty typical response from the uC guys |
| 22:35.54 | g1powermac | meh, what a whiner |
| 22:36.26 | g1powermac | is still really a mc guy, but geez, that kind of complaint is crazy |
| 22:47.33 | wmat | no doubt |
| 22:49.11 | wmat | the tincantools docs on elinux.org are awesome comparatively |
| 22:52.28 | g1powermac | yea |
| 22:53.57 | g1powermac | documentation is a luxury, even in the mcu world |
| 22:54.22 | g1powermac | you're happy with what you can find, and if its not enough for your skill level, go find something easier |
| 23:04.04 | CosmicPenguin | wait - they want a single PDF documention rather then multiple ones, and you are arguing this point? |
| 23:04.32 | CosmicPenguin | I've been killing myself trying to get our documentation guys to put everything in a single document |
| 23:04.37 | CosmicPenguin | cancels the cluebatting |
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