| 00:53.53 | *** join/#edev chouimat (n=dieu@r2351064.cidc.net) |
| 01:05.48 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl you get booted ok? |
| 01:25.42 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, yupper |
| 01:25.55 | g1powermac_apl | just about to begin testing usb gadget stuff |
| 01:26.03 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl good deal |
| 01:26.05 | g1powermac_apl | working on soldering up a usb cable for it |
| 01:26.09 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl what was the problem? |
| 01:26.26 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl have the z2 guys posted a pinout yet? |
| 01:26.39 | xzcvczx | anyone know what the accuracy is like using a ADC to obtain voltage->capacity left in battery? |
| 01:26.46 | g1powermac_apl | just needed to recompile the kernel from scratch |
| 01:26.51 | g1powermac_apl | not yet |
| 01:27.01 | g1powermac_apl | but I'll be working on that shortly |
| 01:27.09 | prpplague | xzcvczx battery life is a very difficult "art" |
| 01:27.14 | GPSFan | g1powermac: hey. you get your sd card mounted? |
| 01:27.21 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, yupper :-) |
| 01:27.27 | GPSFan | swell.. |
| 01:27.34 | GPSFan | prpplague: evening.. |
| 01:27.35 | g1powermac_apl | thats how I was able to insmod the usbgadget modules |
| 01:27.39 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl ahh ok so after you recompiled with a mke clean it worked? |
| 01:27.48 | prpplague | GPSFan greetings |
| 01:27.59 | prpplague | xzcvczx what did you have in mind? |
| 01:28.26 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, yup |
| 01:28.31 | prpplague | xzcvczx notice i said "art" and not science |
| 01:28.44 | xzcvczx | prpplague: well i am just look at a piece of disassembled firmware and trying to confirm whether it is using the adc for obtaining the capacit of the battery |
| 01:28.47 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl ahh good deal |
| 01:28.50 | GPSFan | art as in possibly "black art" |
| 01:29.03 | xzcvczx | you can use couloumb counters with ni-cds cant you? |
| 01:29.34 | prpplague | xzcvczx most of the li-io stuff we have done with adc's was accurate to within about 20-30 minutes |
| 01:29.54 | prpplague | xzcvczx it is possiblt to use the adc for that purpose |
| 01:30.06 | GPSFan | you can but they don't take into account memory effect, dendrite growth, self discharge, or cell mismatch |
| 01:30.17 | prpplague | xzcvczx but for real accuracy most batteries will include a dedicated "fuel gauge" chipset |
| 01:30.24 | prpplague | GPSFan exactly |
| 01:30.58 | prpplague | brb |
| 01:30.59 | GPSFan | some of which change nin-linearly over time. |
| 01:31.08 | GPSFan | s/nin/non |
| 01:31.14 | xzcvczx | prpplague: unfortunately not many button cells contain those though :P |
| 01:33.39 | xzcvczx | GPSFan: luckily those dont affect it too much as its a non-rechargable battery |
| 01:34.31 | GPSFan | xzcvczx: ah, if you are talking about a primary cell, in a single cell configuration, many of those effects don't apply. |
| 01:34.52 | GPSFan | what chemistry? and what size cell? |
| 01:35.37 | xzcvczx | Lithium 3v button |
| 01:36.16 | GPSFan | as in a 2032 or similar? |
| 01:36.51 | xzcvczx | DL2450 |
| 01:37.05 | xzcvczx | so yeah the skinnier bigger diameter ones |
| 01:37.42 | GPSFan | is your load constant of time variable? |
| 01:37.54 | xzcvczx | nope |
| 01:38.31 | GPSFan | sorry typo. that was constant or time variable |
| 01:39.05 | xzcvczx | yeah i didnt think it made much sense but i guessed what you meant correctly |
| 01:39.59 | GPSFan | so are you trying to determine the capacity of a cell of unknown load history? |
| 01:40.49 | xzcvczx | well i was more wondering what sort of accuracy you would have if you used a coulomb counter instead of an ADC |
| 01:41.11 | xzcvczx | and how un-linear a batteries voltage is |
| 01:41.18 | xzcvczx | with unknown load history |
| 01:41.39 | g1powermac_apl | hrm, this is not easy to solder |
| 01:43.24 | GPSFan | it would depend on the manufacturer and how consistant their cells are from lot to lot. I really don't know how close you could get it might be a case of needing to do some testing. |
| 01:44.08 | GPSFan | and how important the nature of the estimation is. |
| 01:45.19 | GPSFan | g1powermac: you need a good magnifier |
| 01:45.32 | g1powermac_apl | no, its not that |
| 01:46.03 | g1powermac_apl | its just not easy getting the wires coming from a usb cable to solder on the tiny tabs of the back connector |
| 01:46.15 | g1powermac_apl | the wires are quite unruly and thick |
| 01:48.51 | GPSFan | g1powermac: you need to interpose some small wires that fit into the connector pins. |
| 01:53.23 | g1powermac_apl | yea, I'm running some 30ga from the connector to the cable |
| 01:53.43 | prpplague | returns |
| 01:55.15 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl the best way to do that is to use 30 gauge wire wrap wire to a connector |
| 01:55.21 | prpplague | g1powermac then use a standard cable |
| 01:56.00 | prpplague | xzcvczx using a adc to estimate remainging time is completely doable for a generic non-rechargable battery |
| 01:56.14 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, thats exactly what I'm doing :-) |
| 01:56.31 | prpplague | xzcvczx a small random sampling of the batteries is an easy way to determine the range of capabilities |
| 02:15.23 | g1powermac_apl | interesting |
| 02:16.49 | g1powermac_apl | I let it boot to the zipit app and I got this in my dmesg on my linux box: http://pastebin.ca/1091393 |
| 02:19.22 | prpplague | looks |
| 02:19.26 | g1powermac_apl | loads up the usb gadget kernel now |
| 02:20.37 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, what do you think that means? |
| 02:21.26 | prpplague | the two major reasons you will see that is when the PLL for the usb interface isn't setup correctly |
| 02:21.37 | g1powermac_apl | ahh |
| 02:21.50 | prpplague | and the pull up control for the usb slave device aren't enabled |
| 02:22.07 | prpplague | my first guess would be that the usb slave device doesn't have the pull up enabled |
| 02:22.24 | g1powermac_apl | so that makes sense being that the zipit people did not setup the usb port in the software |
| 02:22.45 | prpplague | yep |
| 02:23.04 | g1powermac_apl | now we'll soon see what happens with the usb gadget kernel |
| 02:26.15 | g1powermac_apl | interesting |
| 02:26.21 | g1powermac_apl | now I'm not getting any error messages |
| 02:26.28 | g1powermac_apl | or any usb messages |
| 02:27.38 | g1powermac_apl | would have thought to see something |
| 02:29.32 | g1powermac_apl | aha |
| 02:29.46 | g1powermac_apl | unplugged and replugged and I got something |
| 02:30.24 | g1powermac_apl | http://pastebin.ca/1091400 |
| 02:31.17 | g1powermac_apl | weird messages |
| 02:33.07 | g1powermac_apl | http://pastebin.ca/1091401 |
| 02:33.19 | g1powermac_apl | got what the zipits dmesg says on that one |
| 02:40.06 | g1powermac | more to come tomorrow |
| 02:40.08 | g1powermac | gnight all |
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| 03:21.07 | Mirell | Hmm.. |
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| 11:38.09 | g1powermac | well, that wasn't good |
| 11:38.13 | g1powermac | I left my soldering iron on all night. . . |
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| 12:15.39 | Madsy | g1powermac: Ouch |
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| 12:35.50 | g1powermac | Madsy, luckily nothing bad happened |
| 12:36.02 | g1powermac | and the tip is still in great condition |
| 13:19.51 | *** join/#edev GPSFan (n=kenm@12.10.255.246) |
| 13:19.51 | *** mode/#edev [+o GPSFan] by ChanServ |
| 13:20.56 | g1powermac | morning GPSFan |
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| 13:22.43 | GPSFan | g1powermac: morning.. |
| 13:22.48 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, not sure if you seen my results last night when playing with usb gadget |
| 13:23.15 | g1powermac_apl | when I ran either the zipit app or the z2shell app, I got this in the dmesg of the host machine: http://pastebin.ca/1091393 |
| 13:23.15 | GPSFan | saw some dmesg pastebins, that's about all. |
| 13:23.38 | g1powermac_apl | however, when I loaded up the usb gadget kernel, I got something interesting |
| 13:23.48 | g1powermac_apl | http://pastebin.ca/1091401 |
| 13:24.32 | GPSFan | thata a good question for prpplague |
| 13:25.27 | g1powermac_apl | yea, unfortunately I went to bed last night before he could respond |
| 13:26.04 | g1powermac_apl | but I think those messages means its in working order, albeit somewhat oddly especially with that zaurus part |
| 13:27.40 | GPSFan | don't know about the error -71 |
| 13:28.18 | g1powermac_apl | thats fine, prpplague explained that is normal mainly because the usb port was not setup under the zipit app or the z2shell hack |
| 13:28.43 | GPSFan | ah. |
| 13:30.31 | g1powermac_apl | now the question is setting up gadget ethernet so I can communicate with the zipit over usb |
| 13:30.35 | GPSFan | you get your cable wired up? |
| 13:31.11 | g1powermac_apl | yup |
| 13:31.30 | g1powermac_apl | finished up sticking it all in the case and taping it up this morning |
| 13:31.44 | GPSFan | can you post a picture? of the guts? |
| 13:31.55 | g1powermac_apl | last night's test was a bit precarious as something could have shorted out |
| 13:32.31 | g1powermac_apl | yea, I'll be taking pics in a bit |
| 13:32.38 | GPSFan | swell |
| 13:33.07 | g1powermac_apl | you won't be able to see the soldering between the usb cable and the 30 ga wire as I have that taped up |
| 13:33.19 | g1powermac_apl | but you'll see the hook ups to the connector |
| 13:34.02 | GPSFan | ;>) |
| 13:36.28 | g1powermac_apl | so now I wonder what I need to do on the host side to setup usb gadget ethernet |
| 13:42.26 | GPSFan | what did you change in the .config? |
| 13:45.48 | g1powermac_apl | on which system? |
| 13:46.49 | GPSFan | to enable usbgaget etc? |
| 13:46.57 | GPSFan | on the z2 |
| 13:47.07 | g1powermac_apl | I patched it with the patch I created a few months ago |
| 13:50.45 | GPSFan | is that patch on your website? |
| 13:50.51 | g1powermac_apl | yup |
| 13:50.56 | g1powermac_apl | actually its in the cvs |
| 13:51.30 | g1powermac_apl | btw, if we finally get the wireless working under OSS software, we could upgrade to the latest vanilla kernel that already has this support built in |
| 13:52.12 | GPSFan | in cvs meaning in the zipitwireless's cvs. |
| 13:52.23 | g1powermac_apl | no, my sf cvs |
| 13:52.51 | g1powermac_apl | I don't add anything to their site |
| 13:53.00 | GPSFan | ah, found it. |
| 13:54.09 | GPSFan | what do you mean by "if we finally get the wireless working under OSS software" |
| 13:54.33 | GPSFan | ah, you mean the libertas driver. |
| 13:54.38 | g1powermac_apl | not having to use a precompiled binary |
| 13:54.46 | g1powermac_apl | yea |
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| 13:55.02 | g1powermac_apl | this is odd |
| 13:55.03 | GPSFan | gotcha. hopefully prp wil be able to contribute a bit there. |
| 13:55.35 | g1powermac_apl | is reading about that zaurus driver in the kernel that is loaded when I run the gadget ethernet kernel on the zipit |
| 13:56.36 | g1powermac_apl | http://pastebin.ca/1091765 |
| 13:57.22 | g1powermac_apl | that last paragraph is interesting |
| 13:59.23 | GPSFan | also read the zaurus.c file, interesting ablut non-standards compliance. |
| 14:00.29 | g1powermac_apl | the question is why is this module auto loading |
| 14:01.44 | g1powermac_apl | and its the module that is doing the 'unsupported MDLM descriptors' line in the dmesg |
| 14:04.39 | g1powermac_apl | I think i need to patch the host kernel |
| 14:04.47 | g1powermac_apl | http://docwiki.gumstix.org/index.php/Tutorial#USBNet_under_Linux |
| 14:05.26 | g1powermac_apl | this probably works in 2.6.26 being they merged the usb gadget patch with that kernel |
| 14:05.36 | g1powermac_apl | I'm currently running 2.6.24 here |
| 14:06.38 | GPSFan | I've never used usb ethernet/gaget it's always seemed to confused to me, maybe in 2.6.26/7 it's better. |
| 14:09.31 | g1powermac_apl | this could take a while to test |
| 14:09.44 | g1powermac_apl | this machine is slow when building full sized host kernels |
| 14:10.02 | g1powermac_apl | and hopefully it works when I install it |
| 14:10.10 | g1powermac_apl | last kernel always froze on boot |
| 14:10.41 | g1powermac_apl | ls |
| 14:10.43 | g1powermac_apl | oops |
| 14:12.19 | Madsy | I can't comprehend of much RapidSVN sucks. |
| 14:12.31 | Madsy | Like.. a progress bar is asking too much |
| 14:12.56 | Madsy | So I have no idea when the repo is commited |
| 14:17.02 | g1powermac_apl | alrighty, kernel compile is set to go |
| 14:17.19 | g1powermac_apl | oh, and I forgot to say, I turned 22 today :-) |
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| 14:35.15 | Madsy | g1powermac: Congrats |
| 14:46.44 | g1powermac | thanks |
| 15:01.59 | Madsy | Uploaded my first revision of my emulator \o |
| 15:02.09 | Madsy | Jeez how RapidSVN sucks.. |
| 15:02.15 | g1powermac | GPSFan, I've been going over the changelog for 2.6.26, and there's lots of goodies for the pxa27x |
| 15:02.37 | g1powermac | I wonder how much of the zipit patch we would even need if we switched to the newer kernel |
| 15:04.17 | g1powermac | GPSFan, oh, got a quick question for you before I forget it |
| 15:04.35 | g1powermac | GPSFan, is the entire rootfs of the zipit system an initramfs? |
| 15:05.57 | GPSFan | g1powermac: not really, when the z2 boots most of the stuff comes from the initramfs, but things like the z2 app are located in the mtd2 partition which is jffs2 IIRC. |
| 15:06.17 | g1powermac | ahh |
| 15:29.53 | solar | Any of you guru's know a better/cheaper place to pick up a lot of jumpers for a solderless breadboarding? Like this. http://www.nkcelectronics.com/solderless-breadboard-jumper-wire-kit.html |
| 15:32.37 | g1powermac_PB | ebay maybe? |
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| 15:38.12 | solar | ahh good old hackshack has them for about half the price. http://www.radioshack.com/sm-solderless-breadboard-jumper-wire-kit--pi-2103801.html |
| 15:53.15 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, well, same results with the newer kernel |
| 15:53.23 | g1powermac_apl | though I did get a new kernel out of the deal :-) |
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| 16:08.23 | g1powermac_apl | morning RobotGuy |
| 16:08.50 | RobotGuy | Mornin' |
| 16:09.16 | g1powermac_apl | is trying to get usb gadget working |
| 16:09.40 | g1powermac_apl | my host linux machine thinks my usb gadget kernel running zipit as a zaurus. . . |
| 16:10.39 | RobotGuy | sighs |
| 16:11.20 | RobotGuy | Things keep breaking in my linux setup and I don't know why. :( |
| 16:13.17 | RobotGuy | Now something seems to be broken with Python and PHP seems to be gone. |
| 16:16.21 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, more goodies: http://pastebin.ca/1091872 |
| 16:19.27 | solar | prpplague: cheaper than SFE and comes with the handy little header/jumper pins. http://www.nkcelectronics.com/sd--mmc-card-adapter.html |
| 16:20.27 | RobotGuy | My DigiKey parts arrived yesterday. |
| 16:21.42 | g1powermac_apl | bit more info: http://pastebin.ca/1091875 |
| 16:25.26 | g1powermac_apl | keeps adding more http://pastebin.ca/1091877 |
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| 16:58.39 | Madsy | On ARM (or specifically ARM920T) what registers are defined after a RESET? Just r15 and CPSR? |
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| 17:06.32 | RobotGuy | I think my hard drive(s) are going bad. :( |
| 17:08.01 | RobotGuy | I can't find any other reason file(s) would just disappear, especially when the rest of a package is still there. |
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| 19:13.00 | *** join/#edev prpplague (n=dave123_@ppp-70-244-161-13.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) |
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| 19:16.30 | g1powermac_apl | heya prpplague |
| 19:17.40 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, wanted to ask you, how did you create that initramfs? |
| 19:18.03 | GPSFan | I used buildroot |
| 19:18.32 | g1powermac_apl | how so? |
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| 19:21.15 | GPSFan | I just copied the results into /rfs. I had to copy real files from /dev since the ones from /root/dev are'nt really /dev nodes |
| 19:21.41 | g1powermac_apl | hmm, so you didn't do anything special with buildroot? |
| 19:22.31 | GPSFan | I had a working rootfs from my hammer work, that's where I started. |
| 19:22.48 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl hey |
| 19:22.57 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl worn out, had to do the yard |
| 19:23.04 | prpplague | hates yard work |
| 19:23.20 | g1powermac_apl | because if you go under the Target Filesystem Options in the buildroot config, it has an option about doing initramfs for initial ramdisk of linux kernel |
| 19:23.26 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, ahh, fun |
| 19:23.26 | GPSFan | once I find a good buildroot revision, I tend to stick with it for a while. bleedingg edge buildroots often don't work. |
| 19:23.39 | prpplague | i'd rather spend my extra weekend time downloading pr0n and drinking beer than working in the yard |
| 19:23.45 | g1powermac_apl | hehe |
| 19:24.08 | g1powermac_apl | was out at the stores these past few hours, having to get some food and stuff |
| 19:24.30 | GPSFan | g1powermac: that may or may not work, I tend to do things by hand and then someone tells me how you can do it automagically. I then say "oh is that so..." |
| 19:24.50 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, ahh, yea :-) |
| 19:25.01 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl yea buildroot is always on the move |
| 19:25.07 | prpplague | so you have to find one that works and repo it |
| 19:25.13 | GPSFan | but as a result I know the background of how it's done (that works) untill I forget ;>) |
| 19:25.37 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, I'm currently using an older svn one atm |
| 19:25.52 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl the hammer buildroot is very stable |
| 19:25.55 | g1powermac_apl | GPSFan, hehe, yea, I've been really forgetful these past few days |
| 19:26.20 | g1powermac_apl | still can't imagine how he forgot to shut off his soldering iron last night |
| 19:27.04 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, hmm, would you suggest I use the hammer's buildroot? |
| 19:27.21 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl yea, its a good start |
| 19:27.32 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl i've fix all the major issues and it is stable |
| 19:27.47 | g1powermac_apl | I'll have to switch to it soon |
| 19:28.16 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, oh, while you're here, I want to show you something: http://zipit2system.sourceforge.net/usbgadget.txt |
| 19:28.29 | g1powermac_apl | I gathered a batch of info with the usb gadget stuff |
| 19:28.58 | g1powermac_apl | probed around a bit on the zipit while it ran the usb gadget kernel |
| 19:29.45 | g1powermac_apl | what I don't understand is the host's behavior |
| 19:30.34 | *** join/#edev dijenerate (n=dijenera@72.22.142.107) |
| 19:30.41 | prpplague | yea there is something odd about that response |
| 19:31.31 | g1powermac_apl | I also upgraded the host's kernel to 2.6.26 because the pxa27x udc people said it was included in the vanilla kernel |
| 19:31.38 | g1powermac_apl | but no change in the response |
| 19:31.59 | g1powermac_apl | wasn't really positive on if it was going to change anyway |
| 19:31.59 | prpplague | strange that it thinks it is a zaurus |
| 19:32.02 | g1powermac_apl | yea |
| 19:32.30 | g1powermac_apl | the other weird part is the description of that kernel module in the config |
| 19:32.33 | g1powermac_apl | http://pastebin.ca/1091765 |
| 19:34.35 | g1powermac_apl | the other thing is, what is the second configuration the dmesg mentioned about |
| 19:36.43 | ds2 | anyone know of a site that sells cheap refurb LCD monitors? |
| 19:36.49 | ds2 | BESIDES ebay |
| 19:38.15 | g1powermac_apl | half.com? |
| 19:38.17 | g1powermac_apl | ducks ;-) |
| 19:38.30 | ds2 | @$@#!#!$@#$#@ |
| 19:38.49 | ds2 | there has to be a less then $100 way of displaying a DVI-D signal |
| 19:39.35 | g1powermac_apl | prpplague, do you think the host's kernel needs some modification to recognize the z2? |
| 19:45.01 | ds2 | bah pastebin is broq |
| 19:50.27 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl yea, seems strange that it recognizes it as zaurus |
| 19:50.36 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl probably need to tweak something |
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| 19:50.47 | prpplague | g1powermac_apl try to do some testing on monday |
| 19:51.09 | ds2 | checked the machine id from the bootloader? |
| 19:51.33 | g1powermac_PB | prpplague: k |
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| 20:00.26 | g1powermac_PB | hey RobotGuy |
| 20:00.38 | RobotGuy | g1powermac: Hi |
| 20:01.37 | RobotGuy | I've been busily trying to move as much as possible off the primary hard drive to the secondary. Got everything moved except / now. |
| 20:02.15 | RobotGuy | I don't know if the problem with python and/or emerge can be fixed though. |
| 20:04.02 | RobotGuy | Is there an option to cp that will prevent it from copying mount point dirs? |
| 20:05.13 | Madsy | Don't follow symbolic links? |
| 20:05.30 | Madsy | Should be a parameter. |
| 20:05.56 | RobotGuy | Madsy: That does not apply to mount points. I looked at man cp and info cp and there doesn't seem to be anything for this. |
| 20:06.24 | RobotGuy | Even -x states it will still copy mount point dirs, which is soooooooooooo stupid. |
| 20:06.42 | Madsy | Make a new group or user that doesn't have access to your mounted dirs. |
| 20:06.47 | Madsy | Tedious, but it should work. |
| 20:07.11 | RobotGuy | It would be just as easy to just boot my Knoppix CD and copy / that way. |
| 20:07.43 | Madsy | Or make a crude hack that parses the output of `mount` and doesn't follow those mounted paths. |
| 20:07.52 | Madsy | sed and awk ftw |
| 20:08.06 | RobotGuy | Madsy: That isn't worth the effort. I'm no sed/awk guru. |
| 20:08.27 | RobotGuy | cp -should- be able to do what I need, but it doesn't. |
| 20:09.21 | prpplague | standard cp does have those options, but busybox cp doesn't have some of them |
| 20:09.45 | RobotGuy | prpplague: I am using standard cp. |
| 20:11.05 | RobotGuy | I'll just do the copy outside of Gentoo. That seems to be the easiest and quickest way. |
| 20:12.26 | RobotGuy | I'll be right back if this works. |
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| 21:14.19 | RobotGuy | The operation was a success. I have all my Linux stuff moved off /dev/hda to /dev/hdb now. |
| 21:16.43 | RobotGuy | Now I just have to figure out if the problems can be fixed or not. |
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| 22:21.31 | RobotGuy | So far, I don't have any solution for my problem. :( |
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