| 00:04.35 | prpplague | roxfan yea, i have one, but you really need to know what kind of processor it is |
| 00:05.22 | prpplague | i guess since we know it is an arm9 we can try the basic arm9 stuff |
| 00:07.26 | roxfan | i wrote one which (i think) should be pretty universal... |
| 00:08.20 | prpplague | this might be a s3c2416 |
| 00:08.57 | RobotGuy | That goes to 393 MHz? |
| 00:10.18 | prpplague | yea |
| 00:10.32 | prpplague | the s3c2450 goes up to 500mhz |
| 00:10.46 | RobotGuy | Ooooooooooooooooo, very shiny.. :D:D |
| 00:10.53 | prpplague | once i remove the processor i can see how many balls it has |
| 00:11.02 | prpplague | so that will help to narrow the search |
| 00:11.10 | roxfan | you should be able to get cpu id from jtag, no? |
| 00:11.21 | RobotGuy | When processors have balls, that just doesn't seem quite right.. ;) |
| 00:11.46 | prpplague | i'm seriously thinking it is a s3c2416 |
| 00:12.04 | RobotGuy | This would be good. |
| 00:12.15 | roxfan | prpplague: i start by bruteforcing TCK and TMS... i send reset TAP then shift DR and observe all other pins for a possible 32-bit ID |
| 00:14.00 | RobotGuy | ARM926EJ-S core |
| 00:14.14 | roxfan | this way i know tms, tck and tdo... finding tdi is pretty simple task fromt there :) |
| 00:15.02 | prpplague | roxfan got a copy for the source i could look at? |
| 00:15.05 | roxfan | sure |
| 00:15.56 | RobotGuy | S3C2416: 266MHz/400Mhz operating frequency |
| 00:16.31 | roxfan | http://pastie.org/263342.txt?key=oh7dfqscbz7hibcqskqpkw it's for a luminary board but shouldn't be hard to port |
| 00:17.47 | RobotGuy | The 2415 is 400 BGA, 2416 is 330 BGA |
| 00:18.15 | roxfan | start function is permutations... it tries all possible combinations of 2 pins out on NPINS and eventually calls try_id() for each iteration |
| 00:18.19 | prpplague | RobotGuy 2415? |
| 00:18.48 | prpplague | roxfan ahh so you used a bank of gpio's and just rotated the functionality? |
| 00:18.58 | roxfan | yep |
| 00:20.03 | prpplague | doesn't look like the datasheets for the 2450 and the 2416 are available |
| 00:20.16 | roxfan | i set current tms and tck to output and the rest to input and then observe them while shifting DR |
| 00:24.42 | prpplague | nice idea |
| 00:24.51 | prpplague | i could use a atmega to do the same |
| 00:25.02 | RobotGuy | prpplague: Yes, the s3c2415/s3c2416 |
| 00:25.17 | prpplague | where do you see info on a s3c2415? |
| 00:25.38 | RobotGuy | http://www.arm.com/community/display_product.php?ProductId=2255&display= |
| 00:26.06 | roxfan | this way you won't have to desolder the cpu so worth a try imo :) |
| 00:26.23 | RobotGuy | Good find? |
| 00:31.44 | RobotGuy | The s3c2415 only goes to 266 MHz though, unless it's being way over clocked. |
| 00:33.11 | roxfan | prpplague: if you do port it to atmega i'd love to have the source too :) |
| 00:53.06 | solar | RobotGuy: you said there was some sale over on markershed? Where does it say they are having a site wide sale? |
| 00:54.30 | RobotGuy | In an e-mail I got |
| 00:55.10 | RobotGuy | 20% off everything at Maker Shed until Sunday. Drats, not for me. |
| 00:55.49 | solar | August Special - Save $10 off Make & Craft Box Sets <-- that's the only thing on the site and prices look standard everywhere else |
| 00:57.04 | RobotGuy | Use code dogdays for 20% off |
| 00:58.10 | solar | nice |
| 00:58.45 | RobotGuy | http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2008/08/use_code_dogdays_at_the_m.html |
| 01:00.17 | solar | brings the motorsheild down to 15 bucks |
| 01:02.11 | RobotGuy | Pretty nice savings. |
| 01:08.28 | solar | heh. So it seems they really don't have all that cool stuff on the site that I can think to buy. |
| 01:08.45 | solar | too bad it's not lynxmotion or SFE having the sale |
| 01:18.35 | prpplague | solar yea use "dogdays" as the promo code iirc |
| 01:26.04 | solar | ha you spoke. Now I'll curse you with an arduino that you can make fun of everyday |
| 01:30.26 | RobotGuy | Got Making things Talk? |
| 01:30.49 | RobotGuy | Lynxmotion is October 12th |
| 01:31.02 | RobotGuy | 15% off everything |
| 01:31.36 | RobotGuy | I wish SFE would do that sometime. |
| 01:31.55 | RobotGuy | My carts at both Lynxmotion and SFE are way too full. |
| 01:32.27 | prpplague | solar ?? |
| 01:32.31 | solar | RobotGuy: yeah I got th book. It's ok. Could be a bit better. |
| 01:32.43 | solar | prpplague: too late I already ordered you one |
| 01:32.51 | prpplague | roxfan yea, if i get something up an running, i'll send you a copy |
| 01:32.53 | prpplague | solar doh |
| 01:33.15 | solar | Not really. I'm 10 seconds away from entering my CC: number. |
| 01:33.22 | prpplague | hehe |
| 01:33.22 | solar | But I don't think you should fight it |
| 01:33.50 | prpplague | hehe, do whatcha gotta do, you'll get more stuff you know in the end |
| 01:34.42 | RobotGuy | I'm doing another Gentoo install. Wanna take odds on my success this time? |
| 01:35.12 | RobotGuy | solar: What are you getting besides the motor shield? |
| 01:39.37 | solar | RobotGuy: two more arduino's One for the motorshield. The other for prpplague for his reference. |
| 01:40.36 | solar | could not find anything else really worth wasting the money on. |
| 01:41.18 | RobotGuy | Hmmmm, you must be pickier than I am. :p |
| 01:43.55 | solar | hrmm starting to miss the ex-semi-gf. My house is a wreck. Kinfda looking fwd to her getting back from burningman. |
| 01:45.07 | prpplague | suspects from solar's last statement that solar has been drinking some fire-water |
| 01:45.52 | RobotGuy | They have a book on personal FABrication. |
| 01:46.04 | solar | none. Just looked around and thought. Were do I have room for more junk |
| 01:47.01 | prpplague | solar hehe |
| 01:47.04 | solar | my kitchen counter has turned into my soldering station and my living room into the sink |
| 01:47.14 | prpplague | HA |
| 01:47.31 | RobotGuy | waits for solar to get a toaster oven and turn it into a reflow station.. |
| 01:47.53 | solar | RobotGuy: baby steps. gimme a few months on that |
| 01:47.58 | prpplague | RobotGuy interesting, the 2415 isn't even listed in our product listing |
| 01:49.06 | solar | RobotGuy: I think next is a much bigger solar panel and some sealed AGM batterys for the window. |
| 01:49.14 | RobotGuy | Wow, but you saw it there. |
| 01:49.43 | RobotGuy | solar: I will soon have an available chair to do with whatever I choose. ;) |
| 01:50.03 | prpplague | hmm, the leapfrog chip is 15x15mm |
| 01:50.04 | solar | wanna sell it? I was looking at chairs as a good chassis. |
| 01:50.19 | solar | RobotGuy: j/k on the selling part. |
| 01:50.22 | RobotGuy | Where have I heard "baby steps" before.. <scratches chin> Hmmmmm. :) |
| 01:50.26 | solar | But I was checking them out. |
| 01:50.54 | RobotGuy | solar: If I can get that inexpensive motor controller for these motors, there are possibilities. |
| 01:52.22 | prpplague | solar which arduino board did you get? |
| 01:52.55 | solar | I picked you up one of these https://www.makershed.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=MKSP1 |
| 01:54.28 | solar | which will give you a platform to quickly test .pde files for the build-system. |
| 01:54.32 | solar | and reference. |
| 01:54.43 | solar | when you are done. Make something cool and give it to the kid |
| 01:54.56 | prpplague | hehe will do |
| 01:55.01 | RobotGuy | I'm working on a project to create a new IDE for Arduino and compatibles. |
| 01:55.28 | solar | prpplague: kids showed any interest in geeking out? |
| 01:55.49 | RobotGuy | Arduino would be perfect for them. |
| 01:56.45 | prpplague | solar mostly script kiddie stuff at the momment |
| 01:57.00 | prpplague | solar we do lots of small things right now, make flashlights |
| 01:58.39 | solar | thats cool. |
| 02:00.40 | solar | Make any progress towards linux.pde files? |
| 02:01.02 | prpplague | solar yea, pretty good so far, trying to decide on some of the process though |
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| 02:01.16 | prpplague | solar i can compile stuff like the morse with no problems |
| 02:02.27 | solar | a process for defining pin layouts? a process for building? |
| 02:05.06 | prpplague | more for the process |
| 02:05.25 | prpplague | the pin layout was really the same based on the wiring stuff |
| 02:09.43 | prpplague | hmm, i can't seem to find any arm9 SOC's in a 15x15mm package |
| 02:22.16 | prpplague | leapfrog is the best at keeping their stuff closed |
| 02:22.38 | solar | that's why you got this device no? For the challenge |
| 02:22.46 | prpplague | indeed |
| 02:29.44 | prpplague | bingo, identified the onboard flash |
| 02:30.45 | solar | are you taking pics the entire time? |
| 02:32.34 | prpplague | no yet, just starting to identify parts and working on generic block diagram |
| 02:33.02 | prpplague | solar already found something interesting |
| 02:33.29 | prpplague | solar it appears they've had problems with 3 of the onboard inductors |
| 02:33.41 | prpplague | solar the center of them are ceramic |
| 02:33.58 | prpplague | solar looks like they are covering them with hot glue to keep them from breaking |
| 02:39.44 | solar | all the parts were not coverred with epoxy I take it then |
| 02:41.14 | prpplague | nope |
| 02:41.20 | prpplague | pretty standard board |
| 02:41.22 | prpplague | however |
| 02:41.39 | prpplague | almost all the parts are marked with codes, no logos |
| 02:41.44 | prpplague | or identifying parts |
| 03:10.47 | prpplague | lovely |
| 03:10.52 | prpplague | not a bad nights work |
| 03:10.59 | prpplague | identified 3 major components |
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| 03:17.23 | joe_bleau | which 3? |
| 03:18.02 | prpplague | http://www.elinux.org/Didj |
| 03:19.10 | prpplague | joe_bleau flash, sdram, and audio codec |
| 03:22.51 | solar | cool. And you shoved it in the wiki :) |
| 03:23.50 | prpplague | looks like the lcd is a standard 50-pin tft |
| 03:23.53 | prpplague | 3.2" |
| 03:24.19 | prpplague | giantplus |
| 03:26.07 | solar | these are $70-90 devices? |
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| 03:28.30 | prpplague | wheeee found the lcd |
| 03:28.37 | prpplague | solar $89 for didj |
| 03:32.33 | solar | not bad so after the parts are identified. You will use the flyswatter to upload a new linux image to the device? Or thinking hard modifcations |
| 03:33.31 | prpplague | yea, assuming i can, i'll upload a new bootloader, linux kernel, and root file system |
| 03:33.33 | prpplague | overall goal |
| 03:36.16 | RobotGuy | Won't the loader identify the processor? |
| 03:36.30 | prpplague | solar all hinges on me identifing the processor |
| 03:36.33 | prpplague | RobotGuy it might |
| 03:39.23 | solar | if you have access to the flash and jtag port. Cant you read the flash |
| 03:39.33 | solar | save that to file and work from that POV? |
| 03:41.06 | prpplague | yea |
| 03:41.19 | prpplague | solar but because it will all be binary |
| 03:41.26 | prpplague | solar it will take some work to decode |
| 03:41.45 | prpplague | solar start by doing strings on the imager |
| 03:41.47 | prpplague | image |
| 03:42.06 | solar | or even desolder the flash. add a new one that replaces it with bootloader and all |
| 03:42.15 | solar | ya I've hacked a few images over time |
| 03:42.49 | solar | never from the hardware level. But one would think it could be done with a generic bloated arm kernel |
| 03:42.53 | prpplague | yea i was considering on tuesday removing the flash, and soldering it to a breakout board |
| 03:43.35 | solar | more of a last resort however? |
| 03:44.03 | prpplague | well this is a last resort condition since i don;t know the actual cpu make/model |
| 03:44.33 | prpplague | leapfrog has custom stencils for their devices |
| 03:44.35 | RobotGuy | Isn't 393 MHz kind of an odd speed? |
| 03:44.59 | prpplague | RobotGuy no, thats a pretty common PLL based on the 12mhz clock |
| 03:45.18 | RobotGuy | Oh, OK. |
| 03:45.58 | prpplague | the thing that is odd is the package size |
| 03:46.01 | prpplague | its 15x15mm |
| 03:46.20 | solar | not an avr kinda thing perhaps? |
| 03:46.58 | prpplague | solar naw, most of the arm9 processors are either 14x14 or 13x13 |
| 03:47.07 | prpplague | its bigger than i expected |
| 03:47.56 | solar | 64 pins? |
| 03:48.08 | prpplague | hehe, a little more than that |
| 03:48.12 | prpplague | looks to be 400 |
| 03:48.34 | RobotGuy | It should be at least BGA 330, shouldn't it? |
| 03:48.44 | prpplague | ya |
| 03:49.32 | joe_bleau | jeez, arm has 247 licensees for the arm9. |
| 03:49.33 | solar | perhaps this? AT91SAM9RL64 is available in a 217-pin 15x15mm 0.8mm ball pitch BGA |
| 03:49.50 | prpplague | solar hehe, yep, was already looking at that |
| 03:50.22 | joe_bleau | What's in the Z2...Marvel? |
| 03:50.30 | solar | cpu speeds don't match ;/ |
| 03:51.06 | RobotGuy | The s3c2415 is a BGA400 |
| 03:51.21 | RobotGuy | But it only goes to 266 MHz |
| 03:51.52 | solar | ahh there are classes of the AT91 that seem to fall within the range however |
| 03:52.40 | RobotGuy | It's not a 2415 or 2416 at 15mmx15mm |
| 03:52.46 | RobotGuy | s/mmx/mm |
| 03:52.53 | prpplague | RobotGuy exactly |
| 03:53.48 | prpplague | solar yea, i think it can be identified, but it is going to take some work |
| 03:54.53 | solar | could be the ARM9 MPU faimly vs the ARM9 MCU |
| 03:55.14 | joe_bleau | I'd bet on MPU |
| 03:55.45 | prpplague | yea, i don;t think its a MCU, too many things point to a MPU |
| 03:56.35 | joe_bleau | How's the display quality? Good, like a decent PDA, or crummy, like the Juicebox? |
| 03:57.17 | prpplague | joe_bleau the lcd is pretty darn good |
| 03:57.24 | prpplague | joe_bleau giantplus does some good work |
| 04:01.02 | solar | check out the AT91SAM9G20 ? |
| 04:02.09 | prpplague | yea, it looks like a good candidate, but some of the pins don't match up |
| 04:02.18 | prpplague | i had planned on relooking at it |
| 04:04.21 | prpplague | heads to bed |
| 04:07.55 | solar | cya |
| 04:14.53 | RobotGuy | It's not an s3c2450 |
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| 04:20.47 | prpplague | stops by the computer before heading to bed |
| 04:21.01 | prpplague | night all, if you think of any questions on the didj, let me know |
| 04:21.06 | prpplague | heads to bed |
| 04:21.07 | RobotGuy | OK |
| 04:21.12 | RobotGuy | G'Niht |
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| 04:37.35 | RobotGuy | I hope he at least salvages the screens from the Didj he damages. |
| 04:38.01 | RobotGuy | 3.2" QVGA |
| 04:44.45 | solar | lots of good parts in that device really |
| 04:46.09 | RobotGuy | I don't doubt it. I'm waiting to see if I should get one eventually. |
| 04:46.22 | RobotGuy | No hurry, for sure. |
| 04:46.54 | solar | I got my money on it being an offshoot of the AT91SAM9G20 |
| 04:47.13 | RobotGuy | It may well be. |
| 04:47.54 | solar | he said it looked to be 400 pins. 217 vs 400 is a big diff. But when you have that many pins. I'm sure it's hard to quickly tell |
| 04:48.18 | RobotGuy | And it's so big too - 15mm x 15mm |
| 04:48.39 | RobotGuy | He's got a lot of experience with this sort of thing though. |
| 04:48.45 | solar | the mhz is only a few off. And for the price they are offering it at. It's hard to picture it having a full MMU. So I'm not seeing many other products on the market that fit the bill |
| 04:48.57 | solar | yes he sure does know his poo |
| 04:49.39 | solar | he just picked it up today right? |
| 04:50.10 | RobotGuy | Yes |
| 04:50.46 | RobotGuy | It almost seems like it could be an older chip, as large as it is. |
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| 05:10.13 | RobotGuy | I found a BGA324 part in the AT91SAM9 series. |
| 05:10.29 | RobotGuy | Going to look at it closer - got all the data on it now. |
| 05:11.22 | RobotGuy | Size -does- matter in this case. :) |
| 05:16.56 | RobotGuy | solar: I don't think it's Atmel |
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| 14:41.07 | solar | morn |
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| 16:23.09 | RobotGuy-AFK | D'Day |
| 16:23.12 | RobotGuy-AFK | G'Day |
| 16:24.19 | RobotGuy | Let's try again.. G'Day. :) |
| 16:26.14 | RobotGuy | I don't think we are going to figure out what processor the Didj uses by trying to match processor features and physical size. |
| 16:30.27 | solar | was searching all night or some such? |
| 16:31.33 | RobotGuy | No, but I exhausted Atmel stuff. LeapFrog may have their processor in a larger than normal package for the chip, which would sure confound detection like this. |
| 16:32.20 | RobotGuy | The newer chips are getting smaller, not larger, and I don't think LeapFrog would use someting old - not with the capabilities the Didj has. |
| 16:32.57 | RobotGuy | In fact, LeapFrog may have more than one chip in that 15mm x 15mm package. |
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| 16:34.53 | solar | well I was thinking the atmels based on the price of the device. |
| 16:35.01 | RobotGuy | That's what was in my head when I woke up this morning. :) |
| 16:35.23 | solar | they must be taking quite a loss on this. counting on making $$ via the cartriges |
| 16:35.49 | RobotGuy | solar: True, but the packages and features don't match up. I only found one that has over BGA300 and it's physically too small. |
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| 16:40.04 | RobotGuy | solar: Yep, as prpplague said, they must be hoping to make all their money on the cartridges. Heck, I think it would be fun to have one. Nice screen and I like Jack & Daxter. |
| 16:40.24 | RobotGuy | Or maybe it's Sonic the Hedgehog. I like them both. |
| 16:41.38 | solar | I've got enough little projects going on atm to not need anything new like them |
| 16:43.17 | RobotGuy | I have projects too, and just started one with some of the Arduino guys I can work on without requiring hardware (at least for awhile). |
| 16:44.51 | RobotGuy | I almost have a brand new Gentoo installation built. Got to love build scripts. :) |
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| 17:00.03 | RobotGuy | solar: I wrote a bash script, based on how you have your Make file for Gentoo Embedded, which will build all the software I want on my system. Repeatable. :) Still haven't figured out how to get past the Python 2.5 breakage of emerge though, other than switching back to Python 2.4.4. |
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| 17:18.22 | chouimat | a gentoo embedded make file????? |
| 17:23.43 | solar | chouimat: sure makes life eaiser. |
| 17:24.08 | solar | does. make firmware ; make image ; make system etc. |
| 17:24.18 | chouimat | solar: is it publicly available? |
| 17:24.35 | solar | chouimat: I write them on the fly to suit the needs of the task at hand |
| 17:24.41 | solar | nothing special really. |
| 17:24.59 | chouimat | I see |
| 17:25.35 | solar | http://rafb.net/p/TRg4AL68.html (for example for the Nail) |
| 17:25.51 | chouimat | i'm currently having fun porting redhat es5 on arm (don't ask the marketing drones say it make their life easier to sell the product) |
| 17:26.47 | RobotGuy | chouimat: My script isn't anything fancy. Just a bunch of for loops that loop through some constant lists of packages to build. The only special handling is for building the servers, which also adds them to the default run level and translates the startup script names for special cases like bind (named) and openssh (sshd). |
| 17:26.52 | solar | do they have an arm compiler? |
| 17:28.01 | chouimat | solar: the toolchain is natively bootstrapped ... I'm building everything natively on a few 500MHz marvell orion boxes |
| 17:28.45 | solar | rpmbuild -be $pkgnames or some such? |
| 17:29.32 | RobotGuy | tries to figure out why kdemultimedia requires openrc. |
| 17:33.21 | chouimat | solar: yup |
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| 17:49.20 | solar | somebody might of done it already. http://ftp.linux.org.uk/pub/linux/people/arm/centos/ |
| 17:50.24 | solar | can't find anything useful however. So good luck |
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| 19:46.13 | RobotGuy | waves at landley |
| 19:46.34 | RobotGuy | landley: Good work on the Verizon thing! Bravo!! |
| 19:48.11 | landley | Morning. |
| 19:48.15 | landley | It was all the SFLC. |
| 19:48.23 | landley | (What there something new on the Verizon thing?) |
| 19:48.34 | landley | I thought it was settled months ago... |
| 19:48.45 | landley | I haven't had to sign anything recently... |
| 19:50.37 | RobotGuy | I just didn't know about it until recently. |
| 19:51.26 | landley | Ah. |
| 19:51.41 | landley | Yeah, there's been something like a half-dozen settlements by this point. |
| 19:51.47 | landley | The SFLC is pretty good at this... :) |
| 19:51.51 | RobotGuy | That's cool! |
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| 19:53.36 | chouimat | ladies ;) |
| 19:53.51 | RobotGuy | prpplague got himself a LeapFrog Didj Friday. |
| 19:54.18 | RobotGuy | drops some very ugly mixed C/C++ code on chouimat.. :p |
| 19:55.17 | chouimat | RobotGuy: I can live with it ... and I will had ugly perl to the mix ;) |
| 19:55.41 | RobotGuy | Just goofing around. :) |
| 19:56.09 | RobotGuy | Starting on a project to create a new Python based IDE for Arduino with some other Arduinofolks |
| 19:56.33 | chouimat | RobotGuy: just have a beer and taking a break ... spent all day cleaning my apartment ... and I also learn that my mother will be here on next friday instead of the 8th :( |
| 19:57.02 | RobotGuy | Better get that cleaning done in case she brings white gloves with her.. |
| 19:58.20 | chouimat | RobotGuy: hehe yes but she have nothing to say since her house, last time I was there, was more cluttered than my apartment :) |
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| 20:08.32 | RobotGuy | I need to get rid of some clutter so I can get more stuff. :) |
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