| 00:11.45 | das_plague | ho ho hum |
| 00:11.54 | das_plague | lots of changes in the arm stuff for 2.6.28 |
| 00:13.54 | das_plague | aml really needs a full time userspace app devr |
| 00:23.59 | das_plague | ho ho hum |
| 00:24.23 | das_plague | CosmicPenguin: hows the transition to ARM dev going? |
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| 00:30.25 | joe_bleau | I'm like 95% userspace at work. |
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| 00:35.37 | joe_bleau | And of course, 95% supervisor space. |
| 00:42.56 | CosmicPenguin | well |
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| 01:09.18 | das_plague | CosmicPenguin: good deal |
| 01:32.27 | Ian_Daniher|XO | anyone have a netbook that they run linux on? |
| 01:46.46 | Ian_Daniher|XO | c/w 23 |
| 02:10.50 | das_plague | Ian_Daniher|XO: i've got a couple of eeepc's |
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| 02:12.12 | das_plague | ho ho hum |
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| 02:40.58 | Mirell | Hmm.. |
| 03:01.52 | Ian_Daniher|XO | das_plague: what do you think of your eees? |
| 03:02.11 | Ian_Daniher|XO | screen readability in sun/build quality/computing power? |
| 03:02.22 | Ian_Daniher|XO | from a hacker's POV |
| 03:11.43 | das_plague | Ian_Daniher|XO: i personally love them, and so do my kids |
| 03:13.50 | Mirell | I was going to look at the Lenovo netbook myself.. |
| 03:21.19 | Ian_Daniher|XO | that's what I'm thinking of getting |
| 03:21.31 | Ian_Daniher|XO | apparently it has some linux compatibility problems though :/ |
| 03:21.49 | Ian_Daniher|XO | broadcomm chipset isn't linux friendly and the mic doesn't get along with alsa |
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| 05:37.43 | Mirell | Garr... |
| 05:37.58 | Mirell | They majorly borked 2.6.28 |
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| 07:30.08 | onnoval | hello everyone |
| 07:31.48 | onnoval | i am trying to change the firmware of an ARM-board so that i can install linux on it, but can't figure out how to access bootloader. |
| 07:34.51 | roxfan | which board is it? |
| 07:35.06 | onnoval | it s from VIA |
| 07:35.14 | onnoval | VT 8430X |
| 07:35.36 | roxfan | do you have a serial connection? |
| 07:36.30 | roxfan | most bootloaders stop on a keypress just after reset |
| 07:36.40 | onnoval | well i haven't got any documentation about the board so i am trying to figure it out by guessing |
| 07:38.12 | roxfan | well, you need to find either jtag or serial connection |
| 07:38.13 | onnoval | i think it is angel bootloader ARM boards generally use but have no idea how to get the boot menu so that i can upload kernel image |
| 07:39.56 | onnoval | i think i have got the serial port now i am just trying to identify the transmit and recieve pins of UART0 |
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| 07:43.27 | onnoval | i am planning to use minicom or some other terminal emulator to communicate with the board, what do you suggest roxfan? |
| 07:43.54 | landley | onnoval: screen /dev/ttyUSB0 115200 |
| 07:45.09 | roxfan | you know that you need a voltage converter right? |
| 07:46.01 | onnoval | roxfan:voltage converter for what? i am not getting you. |
| 07:46.11 | roxfan | for serial port |
| 07:46.38 | roxfan | ttl<->rs232 |
| 07:47.02 | landley | Which board? (I missed...) |
| 07:47.10 | roxfan | [08:35] <onnoval> it s from VIA |
| 07:47.10 | roxfan | [08:35] <onnoval> VT 8430X |
| 07:47.17 | onnoval | VT 8430X VIA |
| 07:47.25 | landley | shrugs. Unfamiliar with that one. |
| 07:49.25 | onnoval | i have cross-compiled the toolchain and kernel image for ARM, i just have to put it on the board, but for that i need to access it first somehow. |
| 07:51.38 | onnoval | The board already has some application running of digital signage which starts running after powered on. It obviously wont have BIOS, so i need to access the bootloader and flash the kernel image on it |
| 07:56.50 | onnoval | landley: screen /dev/ttyUSB0 115200 Is it for serial communication with the board ? |
| 07:57.16 | Mirell | onnoval: As opposed to minicom, et cetera |
| 07:57.21 | Mirell | onnoval: So yah |
| 07:57.42 | Mirell | onnoval: /dev/ttyUSB0 being whatever your serial port is, obviously. |
| 07:59.37 | onnoval | Mirell:do i have to connect it to serial port or USB? It gets powered on when connected to USB. |
| 08:00.02 | Mirell | onnoval: I dunno on that part. Not familiar with the board. |
| 08:00.41 | *** mode/#edev [+o Mirell] by ChanServ |
| 08:07.24 | landley | If screen's first argument is a char device instead of a program to run, it acts like a term program, and takes its second argument (if any) as the baud rate. |
| 08:07.30 | landley | Little known function of screen. :) |
| 08:07.53 | landley | You can also use the "netcat -f" function of busybox, which talks to a term program. The help page for busybox netcat shows how to set up the tty stuff... |
| 08:08.32 | landley | http://busybox.net/downloads/BusyBox.html#item_nc |
| 08:08.41 | onnoval | but will i be able to send and recieve commands to the board ? |
| 08:08.58 | landley | Sorry, the -f option of netcat talks to a file, usually a /dev/ttyS0 device. |
| 08:09.02 | landley | onnoval: these are term programs. |
| 08:09.05 | landley | They talk to a serial port. |
| 08:09.13 | landley | Hooking that serial port up to your board is a separate issue. |
| 08:09.17 | landley | That's hardware. |
| 08:09.42 | landley | On modern hardware, _getting_ a serial port usually involves buying a USB to serial adapter. |
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| 08:13.55 | onnoval | <PROTECTED> |
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| 08:19.42 | landley | onnoval: the standard way to do that is to use a JTAG. |
| 08:19.52 | landley | (Unless the bootloader already on the device can reflash it...) |
| 08:20.31 | onnoval | landley:for that i need to buy JTAG dongle right? |
| 08:21.10 | landley | onnoval: if you're here during the day (US time), lots of people (such as prpplague) can tell you about it. |
| 08:22.07 | landley | onnoval: jtags are fiddly if you ask me... |
| 08:23.32 | onnoval | landley: cant i do something using only serial port without jtags ? |
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| 08:26.05 | methril | yo |
| 08:26.06 | landley | onnoval: that would be the "unless the bootloader already on the device can reflash it" part. |
| 08:26.45 | landley | The serial port can talk to programs already running on the device. A jtag can run the device's bus manually to write to memory and program devices and such. |
| 08:27.06 | onnoval | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:27.17 | landley | If you accidentally overwrite the bootloader, the only way to unbrick the device is with a jtag. |
| 08:27.36 | landley | onnoval: then you probably need a jtag. I'm not an expert there. |
| 08:27.56 | landley | The people you want to talk to won't be here for another 6-7 hours. |
| 08:28.03 | landley | (It's 2:30 am in my time zone.) |
| 08:28.43 | onnoval | landley: you are right about overwriting,thats why i am being careful |
| 08:29.10 | onnoval | oh i will wait for the guys then. |
| 08:30.42 | onnoval | this is the board i was talking about http://www.aiteer.com/products_sort.asp?Id=146 |
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| 08:34.49 | landley | Looks nice. |
| 08:34.50 | methril | onoval what bootloader do you have? |
| 08:34.58 | landley | Wait for prpplague to get on, then bug him. He knows everything. :) |
| 08:35.26 | onnoval | landley: i will |
| 08:36.31 | onnoval | methril: i dont have bootloader its already on the board and i cant access it, its probably angel |
| 09:16.46 | roxfan | it says "UART Connector*2" |
| 09:17.18 | roxfan | so if there is a connector why don't you connect to it and see what's there? |
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| 09:18.29 | onnoval | no i dont have connector i am trying to connect it with some serial cable |
| 09:18.55 | roxfan | don't connect it directly to rs232 on pc |
| 09:19.08 | roxfan | or you might burn it |
| 09:19.29 | onnoval | then where should i connect it? |
| 09:19.54 | roxfan | as i said, you need a ttl<->rs232 converter |
| 09:21.29 | roxfan | boards like that usually use 0/5V or 0/3.3V while rs232 is -12/+12V |
| 09:22.01 | onnoval | oh thanks for that i was just about to connect it |
| 09:25.41 | onnoval | roxfan:this is the board http://www.aiteer.com/products_sort.asp?Id=146 |
| 09:26.01 | roxfan | yeah i see it |
| 09:26.28 | roxfan | looks like there are some unsoldered pins in the middle... might be it |
| 09:26.50 | roxfan | are they labeled? |
| 09:28.05 | onnoval | yes thats what i think, pins in the middle must be serial port . No they are not labeled. |
| 09:30.40 | roxfan | wait, what is the sub-d connector at bottom left? |
| 09:34.04 | onnoval | i think thats for audio |
| 09:35.53 | roxfan | sub-d for audio? i really doubt it |
| 09:35.58 | onnoval | well if i am wrong about which bottom left then please tell me |
| 09:36.02 | roxfan | i think that's one of the serial ports |
| 09:36.22 | roxfan | bottom left on the photo |
| 09:36.23 | onnoval | that one is for video out |
| 09:36.29 | roxfan | oh |
| 09:36.37 | roxfan | it has video? |
| 09:36.55 | onnoval | yes very powerfull board |
| 09:37.15 | roxfan | so it's a vga connector? |
| 09:37.22 | onnoval | yeah |
| 09:37.24 | roxfan | i see |
| 09:38.51 | onnoval | there are few differences in the photo n real board though. |
| 09:39.22 | roxfan | if you can make some hi-res photos or scans that might help |
| 09:40.23 | onnoval | can u see the memory card slot? just ahead of it there is 8 pin slot which is i think serial port |
| 09:40.43 | onnoval | n in the board i have got it has pins to connect too. |
| 09:41.06 | onnoval | in the photo its just holes |
| 09:42.22 | onnoval | For photos n scans u have to wait for some time |
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| 12:58.22 | mnemoc | hi, OT question, do you recommend any book about debugging/gdb? (yes, i'm on those sick guys who prefer branded/deadtree-based documentation material) |
| 13:01.10 | onnoval | prpplague u there? |
| 13:01.40 | Mirell | onnoval: Still pretty early here in Texas. |
| 13:02.11 | Mirell | onnoval: prpplague is one of those weird day schedule people. :D |
| 13:02.27 | onnoval | ok man. so any idea when he will be available? |
| 13:03.10 | Mirell | Possibly within 2-3 hoursish |
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| 13:30.23 | wmat | mnemoc: there was a GDB book published last year I think |
| 13:30.31 | wmat | mnemoc: amazon will know |
| 13:31.15 | mnemoc | wmat: yes, amazon know books, but not give a good recommendation :) |
| 13:32.45 | wmat | the one stallman wrote is fairly useful |
| 13:33.20 | wmat | http://www.delorie.com/gnu/docs/gdb/gdb_toc.html |
| 13:44.43 | mnemoc | wmat: aha! thanks :) |
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| 14:35.16 | Chocobo | Ok all... I need help picking out a uC. I am looking for something good at floating point math. I will be doing matrix inversions, etc. I am thinking something in the 200 MHz+ range, with FPU. So far I have found the EP9302 and the LPC3180. |
| 14:37.04 | Chocobo | this is interesting. I am trying to compile a simple program with floating point numbers: http://pastebin.com/m18962c2e |
| 14:52.54 | *** join/#edev rokr1 (i=ActionX@59.92.8.180) |
| 14:53.02 | rokr1 | hello all |
| 14:53.20 | rokr1 | guys any 1 who do firmware modification here |
| 14:56.26 | Chocobo | I must be doing something wrong |
| 14:56.28 | Chocobo | [swinchen@strongbad ~]$ arm-none-eabi-gcc -O3 -mcpu=arm926ej-s -mtune=arm926ej-s -mthumb-interwork -mfpu=vfp -mhard-float -c main.c |
| 14:56.28 | Chocobo | main.c:1: sorry, unimplemented: -mfloat-abi=hard and VFP |
| 14:57.09 | methril | rokr1 what do you mean with firmware modifications? |
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| 15:24.23 | joe_bleau | Freescale might have a ppc microcontroller with fpu. I'd look through their automotive lines. |
| 15:26.58 | joe_bleau | Super-H might also be worth a look. |
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| 15:35.03 | Chocobo | joe_bleau, Thanks. I have looked at the Super-H, I have been a little afraid because I don't know what the Linux development environment is like for those. gcc/jtag/etc. |
| 15:36.25 | joe_bleau | Pretty sure there's a gcc port, but no idea how developed it is. No idea on jtag, but I wouldn't count on it. |
| 15:36.27 | adyer1 | Chocobo: I believe TI OMAP 35xx, Freescale i.MX31 have VFP, as do some marvell SoC (if you can get them). TI C67XX DSP has lots of FP :-) |
| 15:37.03 | Shani | hello |
| 15:37.21 | joe_bleau | MPC534? |
| 15:37.26 | Chocobo | from what I know about DSP development is that it is EXPENSIVE. I should have mentioned I am also trying to use opensource tools :) |
| 15:37.51 | joe_bleau | Scratch the '534--it's only a 40 MHz ppc core. |
| 15:38.18 | Shani | hello |
| 15:39.14 | Shani | how to renew external ip on pppoe connection BusyBox v0.61 router ? |
| 15:39.28 | Chocobo | joe_bleau, speed is the one thing I am unsure about what I need. 40MHz might be enough along as I have a FPU. The FPU Is pretty much a "must have" |
| 15:41.58 | Shani | anyone |
| 15:42.45 | Chocobo | Sorry Shani... I have no idea. maybe udhcpcd? |
| 15:42.45 | gustavoz | Shani: you must kill the ppp connection and hope you'll get assigned a new ip, there's no other way |
| 15:42.59 | Chocobo | oh, I missed the pppoe |
| 15:43.10 | Shani | how to kill that |
| 15:43.17 | Chocobo | this is the processor I am currently considering: http://www.nxp.com/acrobat_download/datasheets/LPC3180_2.pdf |
| 15:43.38 | Shani | syntax? |
| 15:44.07 | gustavoz | Shani: that depends on the specific setup, usually nuking the pppd daemon process |
| 15:44.31 | Shani | i have BusyBox v0.61 |
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| 15:44.42 | Shani | can u tell me the command |
| 15:45.00 | gustavoz | that depends on how busybox was built and what they use for ppp |
| 15:45.34 | Shani | hmm |
| 15:45.39 | gustavoz | Chocobo: if you go for ARM choose one that uses a "standard" fpu (i.e. not the cirrus logic ones) |
| 15:46.08 | Shani | ps command showed me the processess runnning |
| 15:46.09 | gustavoz | afaik maverick crunch isn't supported by gnu tools |
| 15:46.23 | Chocobo | gustavoz, yeah... this one has the Vector Floating Point (I believe that is the standard one) |
| 15:46.25 | Shani | which process to kill |
| 15:46.33 | gustavoz | Chocobo: yup vfp is standard |
| 15:46.37 | joe_bleau | Is the '3180 a microcontroller? The NXP page I'm looking at lists it as romless. |
| 15:47.43 | gustavoz | Shani: ps for some ppp process and kill that one |
| 15:48.06 | Shani | i will post the list |
| 15:48.15 | gustavoz | please use pastebin for that |
| 15:48.20 | Shani | ok |
| 15:48.30 | Chocobo | joe_bleau, I will have to glue some flash and SRAM on there. I agree, it is interesting that digikey lists that as a microcontroller. |
| 15:49.01 | Shani | brb |
| 15:50.36 | joe_bleau | If you don't need a true microcontroller, that opens up a few more chips. Plenty of ppc cores with FP out there. |
| 15:51.19 | adyer1 | Chocobo: by the time you're done you might just want to use a mini-ITX with some VIA proc :-( |
| 15:52.30 | Chocobo | Well that is another thing... I won't be using an OS on this. It is going to be a stability & control + navigation computer for an unmaned aerial vehicle. |
| 15:53.40 | Chocobo | PPC isn't bad. well supported in gnu tool. The only thing I don't know about them is "breathing life" into the board. I have done ARM development and somewhat understand using JTAG with them. Not sure with ppc. |
| 15:54.32 | adyer1 | Chocobo: what kind of power budget do you have? |
| 15:56.05 | Chocobo | adyer1, I would like to keep it under 1W. 2W max. Although we can always add batteries (to a point) |
| 16:01.53 | joe_bleau | I guess it comes down to learngin PPC startup hacking or learning VFP hacking. |
| 16:04.34 | Chocobo | yeah, it looks like gcc supports vfp pretty well. I will have to discuss it with the group, but I am going to push for the ARM I think. |
| 16:04.52 | adyer1 | joe_bleau: PPC is generally not that great on power. |
| 16:08.23 | Shani | gustavoz: http://pastebin.com/m2e9b3982 |
| 16:08.25 | Chocobo | plus I already have an ARM jtag dongle :P |
| 16:10.49 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:12.20 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:13.30 | Shani | if i kill the pppoe pid then how i reconnect?? |
| 16:13.42 | adyer1 | Chocobo: it looks like qemu supports some arm FP emulation, maybe that's something to try to get banchmarks |
| 16:14.46 | gustavoz | Shani: usually it should reconnect itself unless it's a very crappy router |
| 16:14.59 | Shani | ok i will try |
| 16:15.02 | Shani | brb |
| 16:26.30 | prpplague | ho ho hum |
| 16:26.39 | prpplague | got a late start today due to the weather |
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| 16:28.16 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:28.34 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:30.12 | gustavoz | Shani: in some circumstances it may not change your ip, that depends on your ISP |
| 16:30.12 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:30.25 | Shani | hmmm |
| 16:30.28 | Shani | i see |
| 16:30.34 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:30.52 | Shani | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:31.37 | Shani | the process pid changes evertime |
| 16:31.41 | Shani | everytime |
| 16:31.51 | gustavoz | Shani: do you have the killall or pidof commands? |
| 16:33.41 | Shani | none of these |
| 16:34.22 | Shani | see this http://pastebin.com/m1a991eb3 |
| 16:34.44 | Shani | these are the commands on BusyBox v0.61 |
| 16:34.47 | kergoth | you could make your own pidof/killall in shell using /proc/[PID]/status |
| 16:34.50 | kergoth | heh |
| 16:35.28 | prpplague | Shani: busybox 0.61? wow that is old |
| 16:35.32 | Shani | pidof/killall not available |
| 16:36.18 | Shani | prpplague: it's the isp's router :P |
| 16:36.44 | Shani | kergoth: pidof/killall commands not available |
| 16:36.54 | kergoth | yes, i heard you the first two times |
| 16:37.25 | Shani | how would i make a batch file for this |
| 16:38.18 | Shani | these commands are aviable http://pastebin.com/m1a991eb3 |
| 16:38.21 | prpplague | Shani: what process are you trying to kill |
| 16:38.24 | Shani | available |
| 16:38.27 | prpplague | Shani: please don't repeat yourself |
| 16:38.30 | prpplague | Shani: very annoying |
| 16:38.32 | Shani | the pppoe |
| 16:38.37 | Shani | ok |
| 16:40.55 | prpplague | Shani: you are very limited on the commands available, kergoth is right that you will need to search the /proc/[PID] entries for the PPPOE |
| 16:41.08 | prpplague | Shani: are you using a script to start the pppoe? |
| 16:42.14 | *** mode/#edev [+o prpplague] by ChanServ |
| 16:42.16 | Shani | it's automatically started as i start the router must be script |
| 16:43.10 | gustavoz | if it's the usual busybox adsl modem/router it probably doesn't even have ls (echo * being a handy replacement) |
| 16:43.33 | Shani | it has ls |
| 16:44.14 | gustavoz | grep? |
| 16:44.38 | Shani | ya it's available tooo |
| 16:44.53 | gustavoz | cut or awk? |
| 16:45.33 | Shani | i don't know that :( |
| 16:46.02 | gustavoz | just invoke busybox, it usually gives a list of supported commands |
| 16:47.08 | Shani | i just give u a list of avaible commands on pastebin |
| 16:47.23 | prpplague | Shani: grep is not listed, is grep a standalone app? |
| 16:48.15 | Shani | ya it's pretty odd it's not listed but it's available when u enter it |
| 16:48.47 | Shani | probably because it's linux/MontaVista |
| 16:48.53 | Shani | ? |
| 16:49.10 | gustavoz | maybe there's a pidfile in /var/run for pppd too |
| 16:49.20 | Shani | i will check |
| 16:49.22 | Shani | wiat |
| 16:50.17 | Shani | these 2 are listed ppp0.pid udhcpd.pid |
| 16:51.06 | gustavoz | try kill `cat /var/run/ppp0.pid` |
| 16:51.13 | gustavoz | if there's cat of course |
| 16:51.28 | Shani | ya cat is available too :) |
| 16:51.46 | Shani | do i give it a try? |
| 16:52.18 | gustavoz | depends if you wanna loose your connection again |
| 16:52.52 | Shani | no problem for lossing the connection |
| 16:54.01 | Shani | gustavoz: do i give it a try? |
| 16:54.08 | gustavoz | Shani: that's your choice |
| 16:54.32 | Shani | ok here it goes |
| 16:54.38 | Shani | brb |
| 16:58.24 | prpplague | if he repeats himself one more time i'm gonna kick him from the channel |
| 16:58.32 | *** join/#edev Shani (n=sajdj@116.71.8.151) |
| 16:58.45 | Shani | hurray |
| 16:58.47 | Shani | it worked |
| 16:59.05 | Shani | gustavoz: Thanks a lot for helping me out |
| 16:59.54 | Shani | Thanks gustavoz,@prpplague,kergoth and alla |
| 16:59.59 | Shani | Thanks gustavoz,@prpplague,kergoth and all |
| 17:00.36 | Shani | you guys are so helpful :) |
| 17:02.18 | Shani | i can't access the router. weired |
| 17:03.09 | Shani | it is just saying Connecting To 192.168.1.1... |
| 17:03.15 | Shani | :( |
| 17:15.57 | *** join/#edev shanicoolest1 (n=sajdj@116.71.22.104) |
| 17:17.06 | Shani1 | hello |
| 17:18.05 | Shani1 | i had a power failure :( |
| 17:20.53 | *** part/#edev Shani1 (n=sajdj@116.71.22.104) |
| 17:35.40 | *** join/#edev regint (n=ajay@123.239.215.172) |
| 17:56.17 | *** join/#edev onnoval (i=sameer@123.201.45.30) |
| 17:56.34 | onnoval | hello everyone |
| 17:56.48 | onnoval | nice to see u prplague |
| 17:57.56 | onnoval | i am trying to install linux on embedded board n for that i need to access bootloader |
| 17:58.25 | onnoval | but dont have much idea other than ising JTAG |
| 17:59.26 | prpplague | onnoval: yea, i look at what i could find about that processor |
| 17:59.34 | onnoval | i am going to use serial cable for connecting board with pc n then try to communicate with board |
| 17:59.34 | prpplague | onnoval: it does appear to be an ARM926T device |
| 17:59.46 | onnoval | yes thats right |
| 17:59.48 | prpplague | onnoval: which by default means that it should include a jtag interface |
| 17:59.58 | onnoval | its ARM926EJS |
| 18:00.12 | prpplague | onnoval: the picture of the board you have is not very good so i could not identify the jtag header |
| 18:00.30 | prpplague | onnoval: ARM926EJS is a superset of ARM926T |
| 18:00.43 | prpplague | onnoval: do you have a better picture of the board you are using? |
| 18:00.56 | onnoval | actually the photo in the link is little different from the one i have |
| 18:01.08 | prpplague | onnoval: ahh |
| 18:01.21 | prpplague | onnoval: well ARM926 is fully supported by openocd |
| 18:01.36 | prpplague | onnoval: which means as long as you can identify the jtag header you can work with it |
| 18:01.51 | onnoval | so i have to use JTAG |
| 18:02.14 | prpplague | onnoval: if you are serious about doing the dev, yes |
| 18:03.06 | onnoval | can't i do something to access the bootloader inbuilt with the board? |
| 18:04.19 | prpplague | onnoval: no idea without looking at the bootloader |
| 18:04.34 | prpplague | onnoval: so you either need to know how the bootloader is configured or atleast have the source |
| 18:04.35 | onnoval | it just starts playing ads when powered on. |
| 18:04.47 | prpplague | onnoval: most cases its just easier to start with a known bootloader |
| 18:05.17 | onnoval | i think its angel bootloader in ARM |
| 18:05.47 | prpplague | onnoval: yea, you can boot linux from that, but it isn't optimal |
| 18:06.36 | onnoval | so should i rather install U-boot on the board n then install linux on it? |
| 18:07.15 | prpplague | onnoval: yea, or any other arm capable bootloader(i generally use APEX instead of U-boot) |
| 18:07.16 | mnemoc | prpplague: hi! please don't forget the tracking number :) (/me in bug mode) |
| 18:07.49 | prpplague | mnemoc: yea sorry, weather has been bad, promise i'll get it for you shortly |
| 18:08.15 | prpplague | mnemoc: your boss still in amarillo? |
| 18:08.52 | onnoval | but how would i install bootloader in the board, since it already has a bootloader without damaging firmware |
| 18:15.13 | prpplague | onnoval: ok, lets back up |
| 18:15.32 | prpplague | onnoval: let us start by asking "what do you want to accomplish with this board?" |
| 18:16.26 | onnoval | prpplague: i just want to install linux on the board like pc |
| 18:16.54 | prpplague | onnoval: ok that means that you will need to replace the bootloader and firmware with your bootloader and linux firmware |
| 18:17.37 | onnoval | prpplague: looks like that. so serial communication is of no use in this case? |
| 18:18.02 | prpplague | onnoval: not without knowing more about the bootloader and what options are enabled |
| 18:18.49 | onnoval | prpplague: so how can i access the bootloader? |
| 18:18.52 | mnemoc | prpplague: yes, he is there with 2 installers... he plans to get the car wash running today :| And I haven't finished these *censored* features yet :\ |
| 18:19.06 | mnemoc | I was supposed to have yet another day :( |
| 18:19.20 | prpplague | mnemoc: hehe, well i bet he is very cold, lots of ice last night |
| 18:19.42 | prpplague | onnoval: the easiest is to dump a copy of the bootloader via the jtag interface and disassemble it |
| 18:19.58 | mnemoc | prpplague: and they passed the night working |
| 18:20.12 | prpplague | onnoval: with that you can verify the actual bootloader name, as well as other details like if their is a serial port console available |
| 18:21.17 | *** join/#edev Omegamoon (n=egoe@demolitionman.xs4all.nl) |
| 18:21.29 | onnoval | prpplague: so i should use JTAG. Is serial communication of any use in this case? |
| 18:21.47 | prpplague | onnoval: only if you can find out about the bootloader |
| 18:22.14 | prpplague | onnoval: you probably could probe around, but the likelyhood of you finding something is going to be pretty small |
| 18:23.01 | onnoval | prpplague: so JTAG is the best option? |
| 18:23.35 | prpplague | onnoval: jtag is always the best option when dealing with a device without known documentation and source |
| 18:23.42 | prpplague | s/know/unkown |
| 18:24.24 | onnoval | board is unknown |
| 18:25.18 | onnoval | no manual or any circuit diagram. |
| 18:25.49 | prpplague | onnoval: yea, jtag is always best |
| 18:25.55 | onnoval | prpplague: So to use JTAG interface do i need to buy some external hardware? |
| 18:26.17 | prpplague | onnoval: yes you will need to get a jtag interface for your PC, there are a number of them available |
| 18:26.37 | prpplague | onnoval: http://www.elinux.org/JTAG |
| 18:26.47 | prpplague | onnoval: i;d recommend the Flyswatter, but i'm biased |
| 18:28.27 | onnoval | prpplague: i have never used JTAG before, so do i need to read some guide to use it? |
| 18:28.57 | prpplague | onnoval: http://www.elinux.org/JTAG |
| 18:29.07 | prpplague | onnoval: there are a number of guides and faq's listed there |
| 18:29.59 | prpplague | onnoval: openocd is the application you will want to use |
| 18:30.02 | onnoval | prpplague: and is there anything else i would require? |
| 18:30.47 | prpplague | onnoval: a linux pc, a cross-compiler, and possible a soldering iron with some wires |
| 18:32.07 | prpplague | onnoval: device hacking is not for people who are impatient |
| 18:32.21 | onnoval | prpplague: i have almost everything ready, so i will try to get the JTAG asap. |
| 18:32.23 | prpplague | onnoval: takes alot of time and work to hack a device with no documentation |
| 18:33.45 | onnoval | prpplague: but suppose i want to try using serial communication how would i approach it? |
| 18:35.22 | prpplague | onnoval: from what i gather there are two serial ports available, i'd hook up a scope and check the tx/rx lines to see if there is any data being toggled during bootup |
| 18:35.37 | prpplague | onnoval: if there is, measure the timming to determine the baud rate |
| 18:36.57 | prpplague | onnoval: some good closeup pictures of your pc would help |
| 18:36.58 | onnoval | prpplague: For this i need to use serial cable and some terminal emulator? Am i correct? I m pretty newbie to these things. |
| 18:37.18 | prpplague | onnoval: alot more complicated than that |
| 18:37.41 | prpplague | onnoval: do you have an oscope? |
| 18:37.48 | onnoval | prpplague: i will try to send u photos as soon as possible. |
| 18:37.59 | onnoval | prpplague: no |
| 18:38.18 | prpplague | onnoval: feel free to register at http://www.elinux.org and start a project page to document the project |
| 18:38.49 | onnoval | prpplague:yeah surely |
| 18:39.02 | prpplague | onnoval: you can post the board pictures there |
| 18:42.57 | onnoval | prpplague: thanks a lot for all the suggestions and help. i will see u soon with the further progress on it |
| 18:44.40 | roxfan | usually you can figure out serial port with a multimeter and some probing, but you still need a ttl converter |
| 18:45.45 | onnoval | roxfan: but can i use it to change the firmware? |
| 18:45.55 | roxfan | depends on the bootloader |
| 18:46.05 | roxfan | sometimes you can |
| 18:46.17 | roxfan | what os is it running now? |
| 18:47.10 | onnoval | roxfan:its linux but not what i want,it was preloaded to run some signage application |
| 18:47.40 | onnoval | roxfan: i need a general purpose os like on normal pc |
| 18:47.51 | roxfan | hmm if it's linux then i'd say it's likely the bootloader will allow reflashing |
| 18:48.20 | roxfan | can you login into that linux? |
| 18:49.06 | onnoval | no i cant, in fact i cant do anything. It just starts running the video as soon as powered on. |
| 18:49.13 | roxfan | i see |
| 18:49.20 | *** join/#edev archae0pteryx (n=snewman@207.47.42.130.static.nextweb.net) |
| 18:49.39 | roxfan | well, getting the serial port will likely get you a console too |
| 18:50.33 | onnoval | u mean using the terminal emulator? |
| 18:51.02 | roxfan | yes |
| 18:52.25 | onnoval | roxfan:but i am finding it very difficult to find and connect the serial port. |
| 18:52.38 | roxfan | did you get a ttl converter? |
| 18:52.45 | onnoval | no |
| 18:53.17 | roxfan | well, you can't do much without one :) |
| 18:54.30 | prpplague | onnoval: like i said, you really need a good picture of the board. with that we can help you identify the parts and options available |
| 18:54.38 | roxfan | http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/HowTo/AddASerialPort some solutions are discussed here |
| 18:54.38 | onnoval | roxfan: so what will be better option to get a ttl or jtag? i cant get both. |
| 18:54.57 | roxfan | you can get both, why not? :) |
| 18:55.16 | prpplague | onnoval: generally the procedure for hack a device like this is to first get pictures of the board, then create a list of all the components on the board, along with connectors |
| 18:55.22 | roxfan | jtag is more powerful but trickier to get working imo |
| 18:55.30 | prpplague | onnoval: once you know what hardware you have, you can make better choices about how to work with it |
| 18:55.44 | roxfan | serial is simpler but you'll be limited by the bootloader |
| 18:56.09 | onnoval | i will try my best to get u pics of the board by tommorrow. |
| 18:56.23 | prpplague | onnoval: this is an example page of where to start with a board: http://www.elinux.org/JuiceBox_Hardware |
| 18:56.51 | roxfan | i think i saw a 4-pin strip on the board... that's very likely candidate for serial port |
| 18:57.50 | onnoval | i think that one is I2C port, the other one 8-pin strip is what i guess is serial port. |
| 18:58.09 | roxfan | hmm could be |
| 18:59.55 | onnoval | in the board i have there are pins to connect to at 8-pin strip. |
| 19:00.12 | prpplague | onnoval: like i said, hacking devices is not for the impatient, lots of research has to be done before can do anything with the device |
| 19:03.00 | *** join/#edev Bluenarf (n=Paul@apollo.paulsnet.org) |
| 19:09.29 | onnoval | thanks a lot guys i will see u tommorow |
| 19:54.14 | *** join/#edev mpk (n=mpk@aggr.com) |
| 19:56.01 | prpplague | ~RobotGuy |
| 19:56.05 | prpplague | ~seen RobotGuy |
| 19:56.09 | purl | robotguy <n=robotguy@pool-96-225-210-142.ptldor.fios.verizon.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #edev, 38d 22h 40m 25s ago, saying: 'Mirell: Hi'. |
| 20:00.12 | CosmicPenguin | too bad - he was an okay guy |
| 20:02.10 | *** part/#edev adyer1 (n=adyer@adsl-69-223-13-78.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 20:05.55 | CosmicPenguin | prpplague: since you were asking, -rc3 just hit, and it looks like its full of some churn, so I wouldn't expect 2.6.29 for a while |
| 20:06.58 | CosmicPenguin | woo - house defeated the DTV delay bill |
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| 20:11.57 | *** join/#edev JoeLlama (n=snork@unaffiliated/joellama) |
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| 20:20.08 | solar | prpplague: yeah not seen him in a while either. |
| 20:22.31 | *** join/#edev roxfan2 (n=dunno@58.193-246-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 20:52.53 | prpplague | CosmicPenguin: yea, i was looking at some of the stuff, i figure 2.6.29 probably won't be release until april |
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| 21:48.22 | prpplague | hmm, these clubpenguin cards don't appear on the face to be very secure |
| 21:52.45 | prpplague | joe_bleau: how's that project of yours going? |
| 21:56.34 | joe_bleau | On hold. Plants have been working weekend, so we can't get in and do any welding. |
| 21:56.47 | joe_bleau | The ice storm has them shut down, so things are even worse now. |
| 21:56.56 | joe_bleau | Mock-up at the trade show looks good however. |
| 21:58.49 | joe_bleau | YES! Bunnie's gonna set me up with a slightly broken Chumby as my 'name the ware' prize. |
| 22:15.29 | prpplague | joe_bleau: hehe |
| 22:15.53 | prpplague | i just don't get the appeal of the beagle or the chumby |
| 22:16.34 | Crofton|work | the beagle does FP, so I can easily hack at sdr apps |
| 22:16.43 | Crofton|work | but, I am a freak |
| 22:20.41 | joe_bleau | In my case, the appeal is the free. |
| 22:21.05 | joe_bleau | To me, beagle seems like a really hot cpu with bare bones I/O. |
| 22:21.23 | joe_bleau | Interesting, but not something I can see buying anytime soon. |
| 22:41.44 | mnemoc | just better marketing :) |
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