IRC log for #edev on 20100120

00:05.47prpplagueho ho hum
00:05.58prpplaguechecks landley's rant page
00:06.22Mirellprpplague: Heh
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00:14.21prpplagueMirell so he has yet another interview?
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03:45.22_ABCHi, I'd like to know the difference in using dedicated FIQ/IRQ interrupt lines and pin change interrupts that you can get virtually on almost any pin (AT91SAM)
03:46.28SpeedEvildifferent priority?
03:46.36prpplague_ABC true IRQs can be trigger on falling or rising edge as well as pin changes, pin change interrupts only trigger when a level is registered different that before
03:47.18_ABCprpplague: so they basically have the same function, except one is specific about the triggering edge?
03:48.14prpplague_ABC correct, both are irq's, both can trigger irq routines, but only the true IRQ lines can be trigger on the edge
03:48.45_ABCprpplague: got it, thanks!
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04:37.59Mirellprpplague: Yep
04:42.21prpplagueMirell fun fun'
04:46.06Mirellprpplague: I'm having fun at my job now that I discussed it with my boss
04:46.18Mirellprpplague: I went in with, "I don't understand the point of my position"
04:46.24Mirellprpplague: And was prepared for the worst.
04:46.29prpplagueMirell oh? that usually doesn't turn out well
04:46.36Mirellprpplague: No, it doesn't.
04:46.42Mirellprpplague: But something had to be said.
04:47.02Mirellprpplague: And now I'm writing a Ruby API to talk to an application via a proprietary XML interface
04:47.21Mirellprpplague: Which is actually quite fun, since I'm learning about dealing with an asynchronous protocol stack
04:47.28prpplaguenice
04:47.51Mirellprpplague: It's also because the current API is via Tcl
04:47.59prpplagueMirell ahh
04:48.04Mirellprpplague: And my festering hate of Tcl is propelling me to replace it
04:48.36prpplaguehehe
04:49.34Mirelldevice.listFlows.each { |flow| device.createTest("flow") }
04:49.42MirellDoing that in Tcl...
04:49.45Mirell....is ugh.
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04:56.01prpplagueho ho hum
04:56.07prpplaguegot a ton of work to do tomorrow
04:56.31prpplagueMirell think i'm gonna have to do a java JNI library soon :(
04:56.42Mirellprpplague: I've got to investigate Layer 2/3 IPG!
04:56.48Mirellprpplague: JNI
04:56.50Mirell?
04:57.01prpplaguejava native interface
04:57.13Mirell...explain
04:57.18prpplaguebasically(as i understand it) like an API library
04:57.21MirellBecause I'm sure Google will have eye-gloss material
04:57.43MirellSo, what do you do with it?
04:58.12prpplaguehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_Native_Interface
04:58.58Mirellprpplague: Yes, what's a quick use case
04:59.46prpplagueMirell you have a custom piece of hardware that has an odd protocol and java doesn't have a class to handle communicating with it
04:59.55MirellAhh
05:00.00MirellSo, SWIG basically?
05:00.04MirellExcept for Java?
05:00.21prpplagueyea basically
05:00.45MirellAhh
05:00.50MirellSounds...not fun.
05:00.54prpplagueMirell indeed
05:01.11MirellI pretty much go from C to Perl/Python/Ruby/Lua
05:01.21MirellNothing much in-between
05:01.25MirellAnd I merely can read C
05:01.32MirellDon't really like programming in it
05:01.33prpplagueMirell this is ontop of the bootloader work i already have scheduled, 2 support items for completed projects, dev for the showdog, and dev for a future omap board
05:01.52MirellYesh.
05:01.53prpplagueMirell really?
05:02.00prpplagueMirell interesting, i love C
05:02.14prpplagueMirell i wish i had been introduced to it when i was a kid instead of basic
05:02.15MirellI appreciate C.
05:02.25MirellAnd I love the people who do C.
05:02.37MirellBut I personally don't like to program in it.
05:03.09prpplaguei have that same attitude with C++
05:03.46MirellI like being able to do blah.listMethods.each { |method| puts method.listThing("1") }
05:03.51MirellOr whatever
05:03.52MirellOh god.
05:03.57MirellI can't stand C++
05:04.09MirellIt's the only language I can't just glance at and figure out what it's doing.
05:04.31MirellC is fine, Objective-C even is fine, Java I can easily read...
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05:04.36prpplagueMirell yea i need to spend more time on Perl/Python/Ruby/Lua but they generally aren't used for the area of dev i work on the most
05:06.08MirellYah.
05:06.15MirellWell, like at Cisco,
05:06.47MirellThey had this giant C++ app to basically be a state machine
05:06.58prpplagueeh gad
05:07.05MirellAnd we kept running into C++ gotchas with memory and crud
05:07.09MirellAnd I'm thinking,
05:07.24MirellJesus. Just switch to Lua. Or Ruby. Or Python, whatever.
05:07.33MirellSave so much development time.
05:07.39MirellBecause the board was a PPC440
05:07.47MirellWith 256MB of memory
05:07.53MirellAnd 1Ghz.
05:08.21MirellAnd we had 100MB of NAND
05:08.22prpplagueahh
05:08.35MirellSo it's not like we were bare-bones embedded
05:08.51prpplagueyea
05:09.04prpplagueheads to bed
05:09.10prpplaguegotta get some zzz's
05:09.17MirellCrazy talk.
05:09.17prpplagueMirell shout at you tomorrow
05:09.26Mirellprpplague: A'ight.
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09:14.42MirellHmm.
09:14.53Mirell~seen landley
09:14.54purllandley <n=landley@cpe-66-68-109-179.austin.res.rr.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #edev, 13d 21m 37s ago, saying: 'You're welcome.  g'night.'.
09:15.13MirellThe man refuses to get on IRC because of
09:15.21MirellEr, Pidgin.
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09:16.56MadsyHm, who here had their hands on a Nokia N900 again? :-)
09:18.07MadsyI wondered if one has access to play around with the ring signal and the address book.
09:18.55MadsyI really want one, but I fear that the actual *phone* on the device is a black box.
09:19.37MadsyI'm an ARM geek, så I would love to mess around with the phone features.
09:23.38MirellMadsy: I'm sure several people here, albeit I'm not one of them.
09:24.05MirellMadsy: Although considering it's 3AM, and most of the peoples are American, probably not many awake now. :D
09:24.52MadsyYeah, I hoped I could get in touch with the lone european :-P
09:25.46MadsyAnd sorry for the stupid poll-question.
09:26.20Mirell'sall good
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10:54.41mnemocMadsy: i know people that worked developing the n900... but never put my hands on it
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10:57.27mnemocMadsy: try contacting people from http://planet.igalia.com/ ... most of them working developing the n900
10:57.36mnemocwork*
10:58.27MadsyThanks :-)
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11:02.16landleymirell: actually it's just that I forget to log on. :)
11:02.18mnemocwb rob!
11:02.25landleyHi mnemoc.  How goes?
11:03.03mnemocquite good, thanks, and you? any news from .ie yet?
11:03.08landleyI'm currently working on a "bisectinate" script that automatically git bisects build breaks in the unstable packages for FWL.
11:03.15landleymnemoc: nope.
11:03.31landleyHad a teleconference interview with a guy in zurich yesterday.
11:03.50landleyHe promised this one was the last interview, just like the people in california back on December 4 did.
11:04.07mnemoci guess they want you for a different position... chromeos related maybe?
11:04.28landleyMeanwhile a recruiter here in Austin has a line on an AIX development job, presumably for IBM.
11:04.59landleymnemoc: chromeos was the one I originally applied for 6 months ago.  Seems unlikely they'd go back to it after all this time.
11:05.08mnemocic
11:05.14landleyshrugs.
11:05.29landleyAfter the sixth month anniversary of my application I started applying at other places again.
11:05.37landley(That was a week ago today.)
11:05.39mnemocexpectable
11:05.50landleySo we'll see who comes through with a reasonable offer first.
11:05.51mnemoc6 months sounds like a fair limit
11:06.30landleyWell, the first three months of that I was looking at other places, but I stopped in October when they got back to me and started actually doing interview-like things.
11:07.03landleyI'm using my "bisectinate" script to track down why uClibc-0.9.32.2 broke mips.
11:07.20landleyThe static hello world runs, but bash doesn't.
11:07.56landleyOnce I get it reasonably working I need to hook it up to the nighty cron job.  It might actually make that sucker useful, who knows?
11:08.07landleyThe cron job builds are extremely useful in theory.
11:08.25landleyIn practice, they need infrastructure to deal with when it doesn't work.
11:08.35mnemocassuming uclibc gets civilized commit habits...
11:08.39landleyFinding out why has always been by hand, defeats the purpose of the automated testing if "it didn't work" is the norm...
11:08.50landleymnemoc: not holding my breath.
11:09.09landleyI'm just glad it only took them 3/4 of a year to get out a bugfix-only release.
11:09.58landleymnemoc: so what have you been up to?
11:12.35mnemocadding a web interface to my car washing project, playing a bit with android and studying to be fit to apply to the same position you are waiting for this year :)
11:14.16mnemocseeing all the problems you had i decided to postpone my application at least until august
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11:16.06mnemocchromeos and android build systems are *ugly*
11:17.26mnemoclandley: do you know http://empty.sourceforge.net/ ?
11:18.05landleymnemoc: yeah, mirell pointed me at that.
11:18.59landleyMy problem with android isn't the build system sucking, it's that it's not really an open source project.  http://landley.net/notes.html#10-01-2010
11:19.19landleyThe license is stupid.
11:19.24landleyThe java focus was dumb.
11:19.40landleyThere's about 5 other things wrong with it too, I've got a rant half-written somewhere.
11:20.40mnemocthey should have encouraged vendors to contrubute back... at least the hardware support
11:20.49landleyAlso, google trying to sell its iPhone wannabes directly is a bit silly since it doesn't have Apple Stores nationally.
11:21.06landleyApple spent 5 years building infrastructure, Google went "oh, they made it look easy, therefore it must be."
11:21.33landleyApple sells and supports its phones at apple stores, _and_ sells 'em through AT&T too.
11:21.44landleyGoogle's going "you can mail order them from us, then hope nothing goes wrong".
11:21.49landleyYeah, not the same customer experience, thanks.
11:22.17landleyThe blog entry I linked to above rants about the SDK license.
11:22.54landleyPlus the UI is sad.  If you look at android and iPhone right next to each other, android looks like a clear rip-off that just didn't get it.
11:23.23landleyLittle things are wrong.  For example, the iPhone buttons are big, edge to edge with other buttons.  The android buttons are small and half the screen is unused space.
11:23.43landleyThe iPhone is designed to be a PHONE, used with one hand while distracted.
11:24.39landleyThe android looks like somebody took a desktop metaphor and shrunk it down.  Whether or not you're supposed to use a cell phone while driving, it would be a lot harder with android's icons than with iphone's.
11:25.37mnemocvery true
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14:54.45chouimatmorning
14:54.50prpplaguechouimat: greetings
14:55.08chouimatprpplague: how things going
14:55.33kergothmorning
14:55.52prpplaguechouimat: not too bad
14:55.56prpplaguekergoth: greetings
14:56.06prpplaguechouimat: got a bunch of work lined up
14:56.16chouimatis fighting with UPS for the last 3 days ... what a bunch of incompetent morons
14:56.29prpplaguechouimat: just gonna have about a 3 week period of no payments coming it
14:56.49chouimatprpplague: 3 weeks is not so bad
14:57.20prpplaguechouimat: yea, i'm just OCD about not having regular income(even though i have the bills paid)
14:58.09chouimatprpplague: same for me, everything is paid but it's so easy to freak out when the money is slow coming in ;)
14:58.22prpplaguechouimat: indeed
14:59.28prpplaguechouimat: i turn into a miser when i don't have $$ coming in
15:00.20prpplaguehttp://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c284/MeAndMyRobot/Heatmiser.png
15:01.01chouimatprpplague: I'm impressed by how moronic some ups drivers are ... they had the good address but the guy was too lazy to find my door code in the not so userfriendly directory that he flagged the address as invalid .. so I called to get that fixed but since I was on a date monday night and last night they didn't have the confirmation that my address is valid so I had to call them again ...
15:01.27prpplaguejeeze
15:01.56prpplaguechouimat: yea i had a similar problem with UPS, since my neighborhood was new, it wasn't on any of their maps
15:02.56prpplaguechouimat: they kept trying to deliver to a street with the same name, but in a near by city
15:04.21chouimatprpplague: it's the first time I have problem like this with them. no problem with purolator, canada post (expresspost), fedex and dhl, ok once dhl have to call me because my name wasn't on the directory to get the door code, so since then they have it in their system and the driver simply write it on the package
15:04.31chouimatprpplague: ouch
15:05.24prpplagueman i need some coffee
15:05.32prpplagueruns around the corner to the gas station
15:05.43sorphinsighs
15:05.50chouimatsorphin: hi
15:26.05prpplagueahh dandy
15:26.10prpplaguewe now have coffee
15:27.55MirellMmm, Koffie.
15:30.55chouimatyay ...
15:31.50SpeedEvilescZZ to save
15:31.52SpeedEviloops
15:36.46chouimatgoes grab an ipod touch at the nearest RadioScrap
15:38.01CosmicPenguinSo not only am I so lazy that I only watch DVRed shows
15:38.21CosmicPenguinI go the extra step and troll the online listings for shows and then have my DVR record them - I don't even turn on the TV
15:38.38kergothlikes only watching dvr'd shows, not so much out of laziness, but to avoid "watching tv" .. fuck commercials, fuck channel surfing
15:38.50Madsy^kergoth: Amen.
15:39.18Madsy^TV is the devil.
15:39.33kergothi have better ways to piss my time away, thank you very much
15:39.42kergoth:)
15:39.44Madsy^Like IRC?
15:39.48Madsy^:-D
15:39.54kergothindeed!
15:39.54SpeedEviltends to read books rather than TV.
15:39.59kergothand checking my email way too often
15:40.02kergothSpeedEvil: that too :)
15:40.22Madsy^And Googletalks on youtube!
15:40.28kergothooh yes
15:40.30kergothand ted talks
15:40.41SpeedEvilAlso animals falling over.
15:40.46kergothhehe
15:45.17Madsy^Youtube is the new TV.
15:45.38Madsy^Only its contents does the brainwashing, so you don't need commercial breaks.
15:46.15kergothi really need to stop alt tabbing between my mail client, irc, etc every few seconds even though i know nothing has changed since i looked last
15:46.18kergothjust habit
15:47.00prpplagueCosmicPenguin: hehe, i've started doing that as well
15:50.07prpplaguekergoth: yea, do the same thing, i also tab in between a couple different news feeds
15:53.43MirellYay, got my laptop back.
16:10.06prpplagueman i'm having trouble getting started this morning
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16:11.26prpplaguelordy i don't want to do any java dev
16:18.24CosmicPenguinso don't
16:18.26CosmicPenguinyou have the power
16:19.52prpplagueCosmicPenguin: not really, customer has a legacy java app that they want working with new hardware and linux kernel
16:20.37prpplagueCosmicPenguin: i suspect i know what the problem is, just don;t know how to fix it in java
16:20.43CosmicPenguinQuit then - come work with make, make cell phones or whatever it is we do around here
16:20.48CosmicPenguins/makeme/
16:20.51CosmicPenguins/make/me/
16:20.59CosmicPenguinheh - I broke purl's litle mind
16:21.07prpplagueCosmicPenguin: hehe
16:21.29prpplagueCosmicPenguin: yea if it was local i would consider it
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16:45.42sjhillstumbles in
16:48.02prpplaguehands sjhill a cup of coffee
16:50.42sjhilltrades for tea
16:51.00prpplaguelordy lordy lordy
16:52.30MirellLordie Indeed.
16:52.42sjhillso how about that MA election last night
16:52.45sjhillheck yeah
16:52.50prpplaguesjhill: indeed
16:53.00sjhillhmm, maybe i should self-moderate myself
16:53.21chouimat<PROTECTED>
16:53.22chouimat<PROTECTED>
16:53.26prpplaguesjhill: hehe, well seeing how you and i are the only conservatives in the channel......
16:53.33sjhillheh
16:53.36chouimatremoves cat from desk
16:53.43sjhillwell, it should be a wakeup call to all the politicans
16:53.55sjhilldo OUR will you corrupt *****
16:54.01prpplaguesjhill: indeed
16:54.04chouimat:)
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17:05.52MirellThere is not enough pony dicussions going on.
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17:33.28MirellWe need more pony dicussions.
17:34.45CosmicPenguinpony keg?  Yes please.
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18:12.40Mirellhttp://i.imgur.com/jgopB.jpg
18:23.20Madsy^http://blogs.msdn.com/oldnewthing/archive/2010/01/20/9950638.aspx
18:23.21Madsy^haha
18:23.35Madsy^That's some crazy code.
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18:58.37prpplaguechouimat: hey you have access to any of the marvell docs?
18:59.14SpeedEvil<PROTECTED>
19:03.51chouimatprpplague: not anymore
19:04.15prpplaguechouimat: bummer, seems i have a parts list from one revision and the schematic from another
19:04.34chouimatprpplague: sound like marvell
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19:11.28sjhillprpplague: which part
19:13.46prpplaguesjhill: pxa300/pxa310 reference platform
19:13.54sjhillah
19:22.20sjhillyeah i'm no help
19:22.21sjhillsorry
20:13.50*** join/#edev _new_Dev_ (n=blabla@41.230.138.203)
20:14.02_new_Dev_Hello to all
20:14.45prpplague_new_Dev_: greetings
20:14.57_new_Dev_thx prpplague
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20:23.11p0kerAnyone played around with ppp on embedded systems? I get a segment fault when I run any kind of network app (like ping/trace/ssh/telnet/wget), but only happens when the pppd is up and running.
20:24.01prpplaguep0ker: yes a number of people here have, but the information you have provided is soooo vague that there could be a million different reasons
20:24.42p0kerhttp://lists.uclibc.org/pipermail/uclibc/2009-April/042366.html this is the only hint I found on the web, that looks just like my problem.
20:25.08p0kerI'm using a phidget SBC device, witch used buildroot/uClibc/busybox
20:26.23p0kerI've rebuild the firmware to add support for 3G USB modem, witch works fine now. But adding ppp and connets, all network apps fails. When I disconnect, they all work again.
20:27.15p0kerAs mention on the maillist, he used static build, but when adding that option to busybox, it didn't make a difference.
20:27.18SpeedEvilI'd try ppp over serial
20:27.26SpeedEvilsee if that explodes
20:29.35p0kerI'd say ppp over usb-serial will do for now
20:30.52prpplaguep0ker: are you using usb gadget or a usb to rs-232 adapter?
20:31.15p0kerusb gadget a Huawei E1752
20:33.12CosmicPenguinMy meetings today are poorly spaced
20:33.18SpeedEvilusb gadget means your system pretends to be a USB device.
20:33.42SpeedEvilIt's a custom serial adaptor for 'GSM modems' that's used with the huawai thing
20:33.48SpeedEvilserial driver
20:35.03p0kerProbably me not understanding, but the phidget is a standalone device, with a USB modem connected.
20:35.17p0kerthe modem uses usbserial
20:35.25p0kerif that's what you thinking of
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21:29.07_new_Dev_http://www.ohgizmo.com/2010/01/09/ces2010-rca-airnergy-charger-harvests-electricity-from-wifi/
21:30.53davidc___new_Dev_: PS, it doesn't work.
21:32.55_new_Dev_davidc__ i think so!
21:33.15davidc___new_Dev_: you think it works, or you think it doesn't.
21:33.20davidc__The laws of physics support my position.
21:33.37_new_Dev_i think that it doesn't
21:34.39_new_Dev_but it still interresting for small devices
21:35.00_new_Dev_tiny devices* ;)
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21:35.39_new_Dev_hi bgamari
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22:23.33landleyMirell: and lo, I remembered to log on for once. :)
22:24.15prpplaguelandley: greetings
22:24.22prpplagueor should i say
22:24.27landleyHiya prpplague.
22:24.29prpplaguelandley: greetings oh great cake baker
22:24.29landleyHow goes?
22:24.46landleyI did not, in fact, bake a cake this time.  (Well, ok, I didn't send one I mean.)
22:24.54prpplaguelandley: staying busy, wheeling and dealing trying to get some big contracts
22:24.55landleylast I checked Bernhard was in... amsterdam, was it?
22:25.02landleyCool.
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22:36.23sorphinprpplague: here... pin THIS cable out.. lol http://tinyurl.com/yc2815d
22:38.25prpplaguesorphin: i can do that in half an hour
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22:45.54sorphinlol
22:46.02sorphinprpplague: scary.. that's like 500 pairs
22:46.35sorphinPretty sure that's what comes out of the copper side of the VRAD (for uverse)
22:51.36Mirelllandley: *Gasp*
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23:10.32sunrunner20I can't seem to ask google the right question to get the answer: How long does a RFID broadcast & recive cycle take
23:18.23prpplagueheads home for the day
23:18.29prpplaguelandley: you be around for awhile?
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