| 00:02.39 | Mirell | Always. |
| 00:02.41 | Mirell | Watching. |
| 00:02.46 | Mirell | Solar == PedoBear. |
| 00:03.29 | HTT-Bird | well, if he's pedobear, I'm the security camera in the parking lot |
| 00:08.20 | solar | Mirell: oh no. Not like that ;/ |
| 00:12.28 | prpplague | ho ho hum |
| 00:13.19 | prpplague | good lord if i get one more call for someone wanting me to do work this week i going to run around the parking lot naked screaming' |
| 00:13.40 | prpplague | did too much "selling" |
| 00:14.01 | wmat | wow, really. That's a good problem to have. |
| 00:14.46 | prpplague | yea well, i need to figure out how to take advantage of it |
| 00:14.57 | wmat | subcontract |
| 00:15.08 | prpplague | yea, well how do you find reliable people |
| 00:15.40 | wmat | ask firends/coworkers from the past? |
| 00:16.31 | prpplague | right |
| 00:16.46 | prpplague | wmat what i am worried about is managing all that |
| 00:16.58 | prpplague | like right now, i have three contracts i need people for |
| 00:17.49 | prpplague | in need someone to do an x86 thinclient buildroot image, i need someone familar with atmel at90 programming, and i need someone to look into openbravo erp and pos systems |
| 00:18.34 | prpplague | wmat all three aren;t high dollar items initially, but would lead to much bigger contracts |
| 00:18.56 | HTT-Bird | prpplague, at90...hmmm... |
| 00:19.02 | HTT-Bird | that rings a bell as to something |
| 00:19.17 | prpplague | HTT-Bird ?? |
| 00:19.49 | wmat | oddly, I'm extracting openbravo right now |
| 00:20.07 | HTT-Bird | I suspect that they are talking about AVR...did they just say 'at90 programming'? |
| 00:20.20 | prpplague | wmat seriously i have about 20 companies in the west indies that want to install openbravo |
| 00:20.51 | prpplague | HTT-Bird hehe, no it actually is the at90USB chipset, pc based usb device needed for proof of concept |
| 00:21.32 | HTT-Bird | prpplague, at90USB = ATmega = AVR |
| 00:21.48 | HTT-Bird | those are ATmega family parts with built in USB FS devices. |
| 00:21.56 | prpplague | at90 is avr , but it isn't atmega |
| 00:22.10 | wmat | prpplague: yep, i'm on it. I'll be watching the hockey game tonight, but will see what it's all about tomorrow or later tonight. |
| 00:22.10 | prpplague | very distinct differences |
| 00:22.19 | HTT-Bird | the AT90USB is listed with the ATmega parts on Atmel's site |
| 00:22.28 | prpplague | thats odd |
| 00:23.14 | prpplague | anyway, at90usb HID based device is basically what we are looking at |
| 00:23.50 | HTT-Bird | prpplague, actually, my bad. you are correct, the AT90USB is not quite an ATmega (no HW multiply) |
| 00:23.59 | HTT-Bird | but yeah, that's beside the point in the end :) |
| 00:24.08 | HTT-Bird | tried paying #avr a visit? |
| 00:24.14 | prpplague | no not yet |
| 00:24.21 | HTT-Bird | do so. :) |
| 00:24.28 | prpplague | i've been inadated today |
| 00:24.50 | prpplague | i had planned to do the project myself, but i got a major contract that i have to start on instead |
| 00:25.21 | prpplague | is avr freaky anyway |
| 00:26.01 | HTT-Bird | :D |
| 00:26.22 | HTT-Bird | well, the uni over here does some AVR C in their introductory embedded programming class |
| 00:27.02 | prpplague | HTT-Bird although i am big on uni experience, i need proven work, hang on the channel for a year or so, hehe |
| 00:27.03 | HTT-Bird | so it kind of came naturally, also, AVR is easier than most other 8-bit archs to dev with on Linux hosts |
| 00:27.07 | HTT-Bird | :) |
| 00:27.24 | HTT-Bird | yeah...I'm in the middle of nowhere wrt engineering work |
| 00:27.48 | prpplague | HTT-Bird just out of school? |
| 00:28.10 | HTT-Bird | prpplague, no...closest actual engineering jobs are like a day's drive :P |
| 00:28.19 | prpplague | HTT-Bird ahh |
| 00:28.25 | HTT-Bird | we simply don't have any firms that do computer/electronics engineering work |
| 00:28.28 | HTT-Bird | in this area |
| 00:28.44 | prpplague | wmat i need docs on install openbravo erp and pos on linux systems and which sql databases work the best |
| 00:28.57 | prpplague | HTT-Bird what area is that? |
| 00:28.57 | HTT-Bird | so either a) you move to get a job in your field, or b) you do the work of a CS or MIS major |
| 00:29.10 | HTT-Bird | prpplague, eastern NE/western IA |
| 00:29.28 | prpplague | ahh |
| 00:30.05 | HTT-Bird | closest people I know of who do that sort of stuff would be Garmin in Kansas City |
| 00:30.15 | prpplague | ahh indeed |
| 00:30.25 | prpplague | i grew up in a similar place, east texas |
| 00:30.38 | HTT-Bird | yeah, you had to drive all the way over to the Silicon Hills, heh |
| 00:32.54 | prpplague | Mirell ping |
| 00:42.49 | NightMonkey | Hi all. I'm looking for any linux-friendly boards which support RJ45 bupass, aka failsafe for two Ethernet jacks, becoming instant layer 1 bridges on software/hardware failure. |
| 00:44.01 | NightMonkey | Anyone worked or heard of such a beast? |
| 00:45.03 | *** join/#edev JoeLlama (~snork@unaffiliated/joellama) |
| 00:46.17 | NightMonkey | I want to build a small network device that can handle packet sifting and some low-intensity analysis, but not take out a LAN when it fails. |
| 00:47.41 | NightMonkey | Googling for such a thing brings up devices which have this feature (St. Bernard's rackmount systems, for one), but do any OEM embedded boards have this? |
| 00:48.00 | NightMonkey | Or through add-on cards? |
| 00:52.50 | NightMonkey | Or is this specialty hardware that isn't generally available? |
| 00:53.29 | HTT-Bird | NightMonkey, you could build this sort of HW fairly easily |
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| 01:48.19 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: Ah, I was afraid of that. ;) I'm not against building, but I don't have an EE degree... but do you have any links to a HOWTO or such? |
| 01:48.36 | HTT-Bird | sadly no...no HOWTOs |
| 01:50.02 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: How would you go about building it (high level explanation-style)? |
| 01:50.56 | HTT-Bird | basically, grab a GPIO and a cheap MOSFET (BS170 for instance) |
| 01:52.23 | NightMonkey | begins Googling |
| 01:52.30 | HTT-Bird | and a 4PDT relay capable of high frequency operation (an RF relay is what I'm thinking of, not sure what the big boys use, but it sure isn't a big ol' power relay) |
| 01:53.18 | HTT-Bird | or actually, two 4PDTs |
| 01:53.29 | HTT-Bird | (unless you want 10/100 only, in which case you can get away with one) |
| 01:53.40 | NightMonkey | PDT? |
| 01:54.09 | NightMonkey | Ah, found them. |
| 01:54.21 | HTT-Bird | NightMonkey, are you interested in Gigabit Ethernet support? |
| 01:55.06 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: Yes. If anything, I don't want the device causing problems with fragmentation on switches it is attached to. |
| 01:57.03 | HTT-Bird | well, switch the relay only when the link is idle |
| 01:58.37 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: For the GPIO device, I found this vendor (?) info page: http://www.maxim-ic.com/solutions/gpio/ |
| 01:58.56 | HTT-Bird | NightMonkey, well, you may or may not need a GPIO chip |
| 01:59.08 | HTT-Bird | it depends on if you have a free GPIO line on the board you are working with |
| 01:59.26 | HTT-Bird | if not, a GPIO expander like the ones you are looking at can be used to solve the issue :) |
| 01:59.34 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: Ah, okay, so my board spec must include free GPIO lines. |
| 01:59.42 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: Ah, I see. |
| 02:00.09 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: So, what I linked to is what you'd use if your board *doesn't* have free GPIO lines, yes? |
| 02:00.53 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: (Thank you very much for the pointers, btw) |
| 02:01.11 | HTT-Bird | yeah |
| 02:01.17 | HTT-Bird | I will be back in a bit tho |
| 02:01.34 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: No problem. You've given me good food for thought! |
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| 02:18.22 | HTT-Bird | back NightMonkey |
| 02:33.16 | NightMonkey | HTT-Bird: Thanks for the info earlier. I'm going to have to think about my options a bit. Hard to believe that no one offers an add-on board with a pair of ports with this functionality. :/ |
| 02:34.05 | HTT-Bird | NightMonkey, yeah...it's not a particularly common req |
| 02:36.02 | NightMonkey | Even my Cisco/Sipura 3102 has it, but for RJ11 ports. *sigh* |
| 02:38.32 | SpeedEvil | Umm - why are you approaching this as a hardware problem |
| 02:38.37 | SpeedEvil | surely it's software? |
| 02:38.53 | SpeedEvil | Or am I missing something as it's late and I should be asleep. |
| 02:39.16 | HTT-Bird | SpeedEvil, because it's a failsafe in case the software running on the device processor should crash/hang/... |
| 02:39.42 | HTT-Bird | or the device needs to be offlined |
| 02:40.08 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Good question. :) I'm specing a network device to build to, among other things, be able to snort WAN<->LAN traffic. However, I don't want to risk the networks in question should the device fail, for whatever reason. |
| 02:40.21 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Yes, what HTT-Bird said. ;) |
| 02:40.29 | SpeedEvil | NightMonkey: what speed of traffic? |
| 02:40.45 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Gigabit, most likely. |
| 02:41.24 | SpeedEvil | the simplest solution would be hardware disabling the return line, and a simple hub type thing |
| 02:41.36 | SpeedEvil | this may not be practical with GE though |
| 02:41.42 | HTT-Bird | SpeedEvil, there are no hubs for GigE |
| 02:41.47 | SpeedEvil | with 100mbit or 10, it's trivial |
| 02:41.49 | SpeedEvil | I know |
| 02:41.59 | HTT-Bird | no way to handle collision |
| 02:42.02 | roxfan | do you want to just inspect traffic or filter/modify it? |
| 02:43.28 | SpeedEvil | advanced switches should be able to throw all traffic at a port, and ignore anything that comes from it I'd have thought |
| 02:43.33 | NightMonkey | roxfan: Inspect and filter. However, if I have to choose, just inspect and alert based on data seen. |
| 02:44.11 | roxfan | if the former, you don't need any failsafes, if the latter, you're not gonna handle gigabit traffic without using some kind of high-speed network processor imo |
| 02:44.24 | NightMonkey | roxfan: However, I know I'll be working with embedded hardware, so only very basic filtering, no complex, tiered rulesets. |
| 02:44.48 | NightMonkey | roxfan: I should say, "cheaper" embedded hardware. |
| 02:45.25 | SpeedEvil | What do you mean by embedded hardware? |
| 02:45.47 | SpeedEvil | It may be cheaper in at least small quantities to just use a PC. |
| 02:45.53 | SpeedEvil | Or at least a PC motherboard. |
| 02:47.00 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: re: advanced switches... You mean port mirroring? Yes, that's possible, but, if it is a gigabit port on a gigabit switch, it is possible to have lots of dropped packets if the per-port bandwidth is exceeded. Plus, my target is underfunded non-profits, who may not have switches with such nice features... |
| 02:47.50 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: By embedded hardware, something that fits in a DSL-modem sized box, primarily. |
| 02:50.05 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Yeah, you're probably right regarding low costs and PC mobos. But I'm still stuck on the failsafe RJ-45 problem, I think. |
| 02:50.52 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Some of the folks who are my target users have rooms of ancient PII PCs and such. But, in that case, I'd need the failsafe even more. ;) |
| 02:51.37 | NightMonkey | Sorry, PIIIs, not PII (shudder). |
| 02:52.22 | SpeedEvil | What are you hoping to do with this box? |
| 02:56.03 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: 1. Provide remote access (SSH tunnels) for remote support. 2. Inventory networks with SNMP 3. Alert on "suspicious" traffic 4. OpenVPN LAN-to-LAN tunnels 5. Arpwatch 6. Tunnel individual services (Nagios) to Amazon EC2 or similar central hosts ???. Non-profit! |
| 02:56.09 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: At least for now. |
| 02:56.48 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: But, basically, offer a flexible platform on which to build those network-oriented services. |
| 02:57.15 | NightMonkey | SpeedEvil: Oh, and to learn more about embedded systems. ;) |
| 02:58.29 | NightMonkey | bbl, dinnertime. Thanks for thinking with me on my little project, SpeedEvil, roxfan, HTT-Bird. |
| 02:58.36 | SpeedEvil | Good luck. |
| 02:59.14 | SpeedEvil | I suspect you're - sanely - looking at a 'normal' PC in a small box. Unless you want to do _LOTS_ of design. |
| 03:01.01 | HTT-Bird | yeah, a normal PC in a small box with some tweaked hardware on the Ethernet port side, pretty much |
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| 04:21.00 | Mirell | prpplague: Yes? |
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| 15:58.41 | prpplague | GPSFan: ping |
| 16:02.45 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: you haven't made the changes on the wiki page, do you want me to do it? |
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| 16:24.29 | GPSFan | prpplague, dong |
| 16:35.45 | sjhill | g'day all |
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| 16:39.27 | prpplague | sjhill: greetings |
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| 16:47.34 | sjhill | prpplague: howdy |
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| 16:56.45 | NullMoogleCable | hi prpplague |
| 16:56.58 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: greetings |
| 16:57.11 | NullMoogleCable | sorry about not makeing the changes |
| 16:57.49 | NullMoogleCable | back pain stared bad last night and had to take my pain meds early |
| 16:57.57 | NullMoogleCable | *started |
| 16:58.20 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: ahh np, just wanted to make sure you hadn't forgotten |
| 17:00.19 | NullMoogleCable | know any good back doctors prpplague? |
| 17:01.23 | NullMoogleCable | my latest DR told me to "deal with it" |
| 17:01.53 | prpplague | sorry no |
| 17:03.02 | SpeedEvil | I suggest taking the strain off by going to live on the moon. |
| 17:03.13 | NullMoogleCable | you dont by any chance know anything about NY workmans comp laws do you? |
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| 17:14.48 | NullMoogleCable | prpplague :) bootloader is stored in NAND on the didj |
| 17:15.36 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: right |
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| 18:18.28 | chouimat | is looking for a good invoice template |
| 18:23.19 | wmat | chouimat: I have a PDF one I use. It's pretty simple though. |
| 18:23.52 | chouimat | wmat: I lost my latex based one ... |
| 18:27.19 | sjhill | chouimat: openoffice templates invoice |
| 18:27.23 | sjhill | chouimat: google |
| 18:27.27 | sjhill | that's where i got mine |
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| 18:29.07 | jacques | anyone going to CELF Embedded Linux Conference ? |
| 18:29.27 | wmat | is |
| 18:29.32 | bsdfox__ | who is going to ESC silicon valley in april? |
| 18:29.49 | wmat | is not |
| 18:30.05 | jacques | bsdfox__: got a lonk for that one? |
| 18:30.13 | jacques | s/on/in/ |
| 18:30.16 | prpplague | sjhill: i never could figure out how to use the templates in openoffice |
| 18:30.35 | bsdfox__ | jacques: yeah 1 sec |
| 18:32.39 | bsdfox__ | http://esc-sv09.techinsightsevents.com/ |
| 18:32.49 | wmat | chouimat: there's lots of online invoiceing apps now too. I was looking at switching to freshbooks.com perhaps. |
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| 18:33.48 | jacques | bsdfox__: thanks! |
| 18:38.58 | chouimat | sjhill: I found a few and they look good thanks |
| 18:40.38 | sjhill | chouimat: welcome |
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| 19:26.54 | NullMoogleCable | prpplague what if i told you the Didj has an ide interface :) |
| 19:27.12 | ohsix | he's probably say most socs in that class do |
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| 19:50.08 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: most SoC's do have ide, but most mobile developers aren't interested in using IDE |
| 19:50.26 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: too many traces and they have to be impedance matched |
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| 20:01.08 | roxfan | for uk people: http://www.silica.com/events/seminars/seminar-overview/mbed-seminar-uk.html |
| 20:04.59 | SpeedEvil | Interesting. (though out of my range) |
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| 20:22.42 | Chocobo | Do any of you know of a good tutorial for interworking ARM and THUMB code? For example... if I have a bunch of C code I want to compile in ARM and a small ASM routine I want in ASM... what I need for compile flags. |
| 20:27.26 | roxfan | depends on the compiler |
| 20:27.47 | roxfan | if you use a recent eabi compiler it shoud "just work" |
| 20:28.44 | roxfan | if it's gcc you might have to add -mthumb-interwork |
| 20:32.37 | HTT-Bird | Chocobo, what ARM are you using? |
| 20:33.08 | roxfan | oh, and in asm routine you should use bx lr to return |
| 20:40.26 | roxfan | i'm not sure what's more annoying, people who ask and leave after one minute or people who ask and go afk... |
| 20:44.26 | alex4nder | hah |
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| 21:04.09 | NullMoogleCable | prpplague |
| 21:04.10 | NullMoogleCable | http://wtfmoogle.com/?page_id=798 |
| 21:09.06 | prpplague | NullMoogleCable: dandy |
| 21:15.18 | Mirell | prpplague: You poked me forever ago? |
| 21:15.36 | prpplague | Mirell: yea |
| 21:34.16 | Chocobo | roxfan, where would I add -mthumb-interwork? would that be only for compiling the thumb modules or all? or just the final compile of all the modules into the executable? |
| 21:37.01 | roxfan | i think for all modules that can be called from a different mode |
| 21:37.14 | roxfan | but as i said, it might |
| 21:37.18 | roxfan | "just work" as is |
| 21:44.01 | Chocobo | Sorry about vanishing I lost track of time and had to go teach a class. |
| 21:45.30 | HTT-Bird | Chocobo, what ARM are you using? |
| 21:46.11 | Chocobo | Cortex A8. The gumstix. |
| 21:57.05 | Chocobo | I am gone now. Thanks for the help. |
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| 23:45.41 | NullMoogleCable | hi hi |
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