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| 03:55.44 | MonMotha | ibot webpal |
| 03:55.45 | | well, webpal is a set top box appliance that can run Linux. see http://webpal.bigbrd.com/, or http://www.softwareandstuff.com/h_misc_webpal.html, or only $13 + shipping!, or schematics are available from: http://www.geocities.com/webpalstuff/ |
| 03:57.30 | MonMotha | anyone have any reccomendations for a 100Mbit ISA card that has a chance in hell of working with the webpal (as in, hardware compatible...so no DMA!) |
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| 05:36.25 | MonMotha | has anyone actualy tried to compile a kernel for the webpal? |
| 05:45.12 | Aelhaz | the 7500fe chip is pretty well supported |
| 05:45.40 | Aelhaz | I've got a 7500fe based settop here that would run linux if anyone ever figured out how to appease the watchdog timer on the board |
| 05:45.53 | Aelhaz | Curtis Mathes thing |
| 05:45.59 | Aelhaz | some guy in florida has 10k of them in a warehouse |
| 05:46.12 | Aelhaz | 56mhz, not fast enough to do much more than play mp3s |
| 05:46.21 | Aelhaz | maybe some light web browsing |
| 05:46.36 | Aelhaz | lacks connectivity, tho. no ethernet. |
| 05:47.17 | Aelhaz | linux kernel boots on it, and shortly thereafter there's a watchdog reset |
| 05:47.17 | MonMotha | 56Mhz? faster than a webpal |
| 05:47.21 | MonMotha | heh |
| 05:47.31 | MonMotha | isn't that documented in the manual for the proc? |
| 05:47.31 | Aelhaz | before the kernel is even finished executing |
| 05:47.41 | Aelhaz | thing is the watchdog isn't on the cpu |
| 05:47.45 | Aelhaz | it's somewhere else on the board |
| 05:47.49 | MonMotha | ah |
| 05:47.55 | MonMotha | so disconnect it :) |
| 05:47.57 | Aelhaz | and there are at least two and maybe three programmable devices that could be doing it |
| 05:48.07 | MonMotha | ah, not a dedicated hardware device |
| 05:48.15 | MonMotha | send one to me, I'll take a look at it |
| 05:48.18 | MonMotha | L(" |
| 05:48.19 | MonMotha | :) |
| 05:48.27 | Aelhaz | basically something on the board needs an interrupt every minute or so or it resets the board |
| 05:48.37 | Aelhaz | heh |
| 05:48.56 | Aelhaz | the neat thing about the box is that it runs RISCos off an ide harddrive |
| 05:49.07 | Aelhaz | and aparantly you can put a standard riscos installation on it |
| 05:49.11 | MonMotha | interesting |
| 05:49.19 | Aelhaz | it boots off of two big rom chips |
| 05:49.28 | Aelhaz | and then runs the os and apps off a 210 meg hd |
| 05:49.41 | Aelhaz | If i were working i'd ship the thing to you |
| 05:49.41 | MonMotha | I should see about upgrading my webpal to 2M of flash |
| 05:49.47 | Aelhaz | but i aint got no damn money for shipping |
| 05:50.04 | MonMotha | 1MB's cutting it close (kernel is usually 500k+), but 2M you can actually do things in |
| 05:50.11 | MonMotha | as long as you use things like busybox, uClibc, etc |
| 05:50.20 | Aelhaz | Yeah |
| 05:50.28 | Aelhaz | i forget, does the webpal have some way to install a nic? |
| 05:50.35 | MonMotha | there's pads on the flash SIMM, just unpopulated |
| 05:50.39 | MonMotha | has an ISA slot that the modem comes ni :) |
| 05:50.44 | Aelhaz | ah, cool |
| 05:50.48 | MonMotha | a crippled ISA slot mind you, but an ISA slot |
| 05:51.14 | Aelhaz | the docs for the 7500fe say something about an "ISA-like" interface, but the C-M box uses a big plastic connector for it's built in modem |
| 05:51.26 | Aelhaz | i forget if it has an lpt port that you could theoretically hang an ethernet device off of |
| 05:52.01 | MonMotha | the bus is very ISA-like |
| 05:52.05 | Aelhaz | You can do a lot with a crippled ISA slot, just look at the stuff you can get for a tivo |
| 05:52.09 | MonMotha | just steal some address lines and some data lines |
| 05:52.15 | Aelhaz | yeah |
| 05:52.16 | MonMotha | oh yes |
| 05:52.26 | MonMotha | basically it just lacks the DMA and memory mapped stuff |
| 05:52.38 | Aelhaz | the damn TurboNet was announced right after i bought a tivonet adapter |
| 05:52.52 | MonMotha | I'm looking for a 100Mbit ISA card that doesn't need DMA |
| 05:52.55 | MonMotha | haven't found one yet |
| 05:53.10 | MonMotha | hum, there must be something odd here |
| 05:53.16 | MonMotha | both of these kernel sources error in the same place |
| 05:53.22 | Aelhaz | and i smacked my forehead and said "YES! I SHOULD HAVE REALIZED!" because the edge connector on the tivo mobo is right where the Walnut development board had a pcmcia slot |
| 05:53.24 | MonMotha | armksyms.c:234: `abort' undeclared here (not in a function) |
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| 05:53.30 | Aelhaz | a 3.3v pcmcia slot |
| 05:54.00 | Aelhaz | MonMotha: the TurboNet card for the tivo uses an Asix 3.3v pcmcia chip that's 10/100 one-chip-solution |
| 05:54.08 | MonMotha | anyone know the kernel source well enough to give pointers or should I just dive in? :) |
| 05:54.10 | Aelhaz | and can be configured for ISA |
| 05:54.23 | Aelhaz | I have no idea if you can get that chip on an isa card |
| 05:54.28 | Aelhaz | but it's just a really fast ne2k |
| 05:54.58 | Aelhaz | so look for an isa 10/100 nic that claims to be "ne2k compatible" |
| 05:55.07 | Aelhaz | there are a lot of chips out there, just most of them end up in 16 bit pcmcia cards |
| 05:55.08 | legodude_ | why you looking for 10/100? |
| 05:55.21 | MonMotha | remote X display :) |
| 05:55.26 | legodude_ | what machine? |
| 05:55.29 | MonMotha | webpal :) |
| 05:55.38 | legodude_ | you think that'd make a difference? |
| 05:55.48 | MonMotha | you could probably push 20-50Mbit through it |
| 05:55.53 | legodude_ | wow |
| 05:55.54 | Aelhaz | how fast is the webpal? |
| 05:55.57 | MonMotha | that's a lot faster than 10, and 20+ is where X is quite usable |
| 05:55.59 | MonMotha | 40MHz ARM |
| 05:56.04 | Aelhaz | ah |
| 05:56.04 | legodude_ | didn't know webpal could handle that fast |
| 05:56.13 | MonMotha | I don't see any reason it couldn't |
| 05:56.15 | legodude_ | you try out the sound driver yet? |
| 05:56.20 | MonMotha | the ISA bus is actually being clocked very fast |
| 05:56.21 | legodude_ | I just got my webpals yesterday |
| 05:56.26 | Aelhaz | MonMotha: My experience with 16 bit pcmcia 10/100 nics is that they max out at about 20mbit - isa w/o dma is probably similar |
| 05:56.27 | MonMotha | no, I don't even have linux on them |
| 05:56.28 | legodude_ | still have to build serial board for them |
| 05:56.36 | Aelhaz | oh, faster than 8mhz? |
| 05:56.37 | MonMotha | I'm trying to build a kernel for them |
| 05:56.39 | Aelhaz | might get better than 20mbit |
| 05:56.41 | MonMotha | Aelhaz: I think so |
| 05:56.51 | legodude_ | why can webpal only use ne2k? |
| 05:56.54 | MonMotha | they're driving it off the local bus of the PS7500 |
| 05:57.04 | MonMotha | legodude_: because that's all the drivers that have been made to work |
| 05:57.04 | Aelhaz | legodude_: it's not that - it's that there's no dma |
| 05:57.16 | MonMotha | all you need is a card with no DMA and that doesn't need memory mapped acces |
| 05:57.22 | legodude_ | okay |
| 05:57.23 | legodude_ | I see |
| 05:57.28 | MonMotha | and that can be MANUALLY CONFIGURED to use the right IO port and IRQ (only 1) |
| 05:57.29 | legodude_ | and ne2k is only common one that does that? |
| 05:57.33 | MonMotha | pretty much |
| 05:57.55 | legodude_ | the linux flash procedure looks pretty scary |
| 05:58.06 | Aelhaz | there are some old 3com boards that do |
| 05:58.09 | legodude_ | worse than tuxscreen even |
| 05:58.12 | Aelhaz | and some old WD boards |
| 05:58.21 | MonMotha | heh, and no JTAG on this bad boy :) |
| 05:58.26 | legodude_ | ja |
| 05:58.28 | MonMotha | though as long as you can bring up that remote debugger you're fine |
| 05:59.02 | legodude_ | how much ram you gonna have in yours? |
| 06:00.17 | MonMotha | probably 8 or 16 |
| 06:00.28 | MonMotha | unless I can find some 32s or 64s, then I'll hook up the RA11 line |
| 06:00.28 | legodude_ | I'm gonna try with stock 4 at first |
| 06:00.42 | legodude_ | try to avoid X |
| 06:00.48 | legodude_ | but I don't think that's possible |
| 06:00.55 | MonMotha | I'm just trying to get a damn kernel build |
| 06:00.57 | MonMotha | built |
| 06:01.00 | legodude_ | can't you use a prebuilt? |
| 06:01.15 | MonMotha | armksyms.c:234: `abort' undeclared here (not in a function) |
| 06:01.15 | MonMotha | armksyms.c:234: initializer element is not constant |
| 06:01.15 | MonMotha | armksyms.c:234: (near initialization for `__ksymtab_abort.value') |
| 06:01.22 | MonMotha | legodude_: I guess, but I'd like to know why I'm getting that |
| 06:01.26 | MonMotha | haven't even looked at the code yet |
| 06:01.31 | legodude_ | ahso |
| 06:01.48 | legodude_ | I'm fooling with getting linux on stupid laptop first |
| 06:01.58 | legodude_ | then I'll have a machine to beat on |
| 06:02.06 | MonMotha | I'm attempting to bootstrap it by hand over the rdp, without flashing :) |
| 06:02.11 | MonMotha | should be fun |
| 06:02.20 | MonMotha | the kernel has a mini bootloader |
| 06:02.38 | MonMotha | the code it uses is kinda interesting |
| 06:02.59 | MonMotha | pb showed it to me earlier (oddly enough, pb is listed as the maintainer of the PS7500 port) |
| 06:03.36 | legodude_ | is the keyboard that same as the tux? |
| 06:04.05 | MonMotha | no |
| 06:04.12 | MonMotha | yeah, I need an uncompressed vmlinux image |
| 06:04.14 | Aelhaz | http://ficonet.de/phpnuke/sections.php?op=printpage&artid=24 |
| 06:04.25 | Aelhaz | an ne2k compatible 10/100 isa nic in germany . . |
| 06:04.54 | legodude | ebay maybe/ |
| 06:04.56 | legodude | ? |
| 06:05.01 | Aelhaz | wait, maybe not |
| 06:05.24 | Aelhaz | it's SMC91C100 |
| 06:05.35 | Aelhaz | aka "Worst fast ethernet controller ever" |
| 06:05.39 | MonMotha | hhe |
| 06:05.40 | MonMotha | heh |
| 06:05.41 | Aelhaz | if i remember right |
| 06:05.48 | Aelhaz | it was so bad, even SMC didn't use it |
| 06:05.55 | MonMotha | hah |
| 06:06.12 | legodude | hahah |
| 06:06.13 | legodude | that's great |
| 06:06.26 | Aelhaz | Yeah, SMC sold cards with DEC Tulip chips instead |
| 06:06.32 | legodude | yup |
| 06:06.34 | Aelhaz | after a short run of cards with their own controller |
| 06:06.35 | legodude | I love those |
| 06:06.47 | Aelhaz | the EtherPowerII is a great ethernet controller, tho. SMC finally figured it out. |
| 06:07.12 | Aelhaz | it can do neat things like pass you the packet header and ask you if you want the rest of the packet |
| 06:07.33 | legodude | neat |
| 06:07.43 | legodude | I'm currently looking for docs on the DEFPA |
| 06:07.56 | legodude | I'd like to write a driver for it... |
| 06:08.00 | MonMotha | Aelhaz: that's quite nice actually |
| 06:09.45 | legodude | what kind of smartcard does the webpal use? |
| 06:10.03 | MonMotha | I don't think anyone knows |
| 06:10.38 | legodude | looks proprietary as heck |
| 06:11.56 | Aelhaz | yeah, it can be hard to tell unless someone just knows |
| 06:13.14 | legodude | does the FB work? |
| 06:13.41 | Aelhaz | 7500fe framebuffer is supposed to work in linux - there might be other chips on the board to initialize |
| 06:13.59 | Aelhaz | the 7500fe is an all-in-one job, built in vga so they say |
| 06:14.42 | MonMotha | your best bet would be to try to coax the code out of the microcontroller |
| 06:14.42 | MonMotha | the smart card socket is handled by the atmel uC up front |
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| 06:15.13 | Aelhaz | that makes it easier in some ways, if you know how to drive the smartcard controller |
| 06:15.27 | Aelhaz | if you don't know how to drive it |
| 06:16.08 | Aelhaz | hook the CLK line on the smartcard slot up to an oscilliscope and figure out what the clock is |
| 06:16.13 | legodude | I don't even see the arm chip on this board |
| 06:16.24 | Aelhaz | then apply said clock to a simple (dumb, serial port attached) smartcard controller |
| 06:16.32 | Aelhaz | legodude: it'll say Cirrus Logic on it |
| 06:16.39 | legodude | ooh |
| 06:16.46 | Aelhaz | P7500FE, iirc |
| 06:16.47 | legodude | that's integrated vga and arm and whatnot/ |
| 06:16.52 | Aelhaz | yeah |
| 06:16.55 | legodude | I see |
| 06:17.36 | legodude | can X work in only 4mb? |
| 06:18.19 | Aelhaz | Yeah |
| 06:18.22 | Aelhaz | the question is, which server |
| 06:18.33 | Aelhaz | which implementation of X, rather |
| 06:18.44 | legodude | tinyx |
| 06:18.46 | legodude | or something like tha |
| 06:18.51 | Aelhaz | and i don't know what to suggest |
| 06:18.58 | Aelhaz | in the old days, xterminals had around that much ram |
| 06:19.28 | legodude | the x-term I'm using as we speak has 48mb in it |
| 06:19.34 | legodude | and supports 128 |
| 06:19.35 | legodude | or 256 |
| 06:20.03 | Aelhaz | wild |
| 06:20.08 | Aelhaz | I have two xterms here |
| 06:20.17 | legodude | what kinda? |
| 06:20.18 | Aelhaz | a Samsung SGS-17C that supports up to 10, iirc |
| 06:20.22 | MonMotha | yes, looks to me like the RDP is implemented entirely in software |
| 06:20.27 | legodude | I'm using HPs and I love them |
| 06:20.31 | MonMotha | so you blow that away and you've got a brick until you reprogram the flash by hand |
| 06:20.36 | Aelhaz | drives a regular vga monitor, regular at keyboard, and a very specific model logitech mouse |
| 06:20.51 | Aelhaz | it's old |
| 06:20.55 | Aelhaz | the other is a DEC VT-1200 |
| 06:20.56 | legodude | mine use any vga, and ps2, any keyboard |
| 06:20.57 | Aelhaz | it's much older |
| 06:21.04 | legodude | is that the plamsa screen one? |
| 06:21.15 | Aelhaz | uses an LK-201 keyboard, a very weird mouse, and a monochrome monitor that i don't have |
| 06:21.18 | Aelhaz | it has 4 megs of ram, iirc |
| 06:21.19 | Aelhaz | maybe less |
| 06:21.31 | legodude | only problem with my HPs is that the audio doesn't work |
| 06:21.35 | Aelhaz | ah |
| 06:21.40 | legodude | and my NCD blows chunks |
| 06:21.43 | Aelhaz | what model is that HP? |
| 06:21.44 | legodude | although it has 100mbit |
| 06:21.48 | Aelhaz | I used to have some NCDs |
| 06:21.51 | legodude | I have two Envizex IIs |
| 06:21.53 | Aelhaz | ah |
| 06:21.55 | legodude | and a Entria II |
| 06:21.59 | legodude | very nice machines |
| 06:22.05 | legodude | HP has software for download |
| 06:22.08 | Aelhaz | I keep seeing Envizex's for sale at university surplus sales |
| 06:22.11 | Aelhaz | I've never bought one |
| 06:22.14 | legodude | which makes all teh difference in the world |
| 06:22.23 | Aelhaz | OH, I also have a Wyse terminal here with a broken case and no power supply, and software. |
| 06:22.31 | legodude | only caveat with Envizex II is that you need EVC->VGA cable |
| 06:22.40 | Aelhaz | EVC? |
| 06:22.42 | legodude | I have HDS @workstation too |
| 06:22.47 | legodude | but software is impossible to find |
| 06:22.53 | legodude | and a older xterm of some sort |
| 06:22.55 | legodude | ya |
| 06:23.05 | legodude | it was a somewhat common monitor connection |
| 06:23.10 | legodude | on lots of HP parisc machines |
| 06:23.15 | legodude | and some ibm stuff |
| 06:23.19 | Aelhaz | I've got Wyse software . . . . . I have a cd that claims to be Wyse software . . . . it might be in french |
| 06:23.38 | Aelhaz | three mini-coax's in a hood? |
| 06:23.43 | legodude | nada |
| 06:23.46 | legodude | that's Dec |
| 06:23.52 | MonMotha | god dammit |
| 06:23.55 | Aelhaz | DEC and Mips co. |
| 06:24.00 | legodude | evc reminds me a lot of DVI |
| 06:24.01 | MonMotha | cirrus logic put a "no copy" on their datasheet |
| 06:24.16 | MonMotha | so we'll make it a postscript and copy from that |
| 06:24.27 | Aelhaz | OH, i've seen that thing |
| 06:24.28 | MonMotha | damn I had PDFs sometimes (and idiots who think they have to "protect their IP") |
| 06:25.44 | Aelhaz | What's the video specs on the Envizex? |
| 06:26.01 | Aelhaz | The only thing i *hate about my Samsung terminal is it's utter lack of anything more than 8 bit color |
| 06:26.02 | legodude | I think it's got 1mb |
| 06:26.15 | legodude | so I run at 24bit 800x600 |
| 06:26.15 | Aelhaz | I won't put up with 8 bit color anymore |
| 06:26.18 | Aelhaz | *nod* |
| 06:26.19 | legodude | or 16bit |
| 06:26.22 | legodude | I forget which |
| 06:26.24 | legodude | 24 I thikn |
| 06:26.38 | MonMotha | has anyone made a patch to xpdf to remove the copy protection crap that the author decided it was nesecary to implement? |
| 06:26.42 | legodude | NCD has teh 24bit terminal with 8mb vram |
| 06:26.53 | legodude | but it has stupid 10mbit ethernet |
| 06:26.55 | legodude | and they're rare |
| 06:27.37 | legodude | MonMotha I can't believe someone would put that into the program |
| 06:28.35 | Aelhaz | MonMotha: you mean encryption or copy protection? |
| 06:28.43 | Aelhaz | encryption is overcome by installing a special pdf file on your system |
| 06:28.52 | Aelhaz | I think the error message even gives you a url for it |
| 06:28.55 | legodude | damnit |
| 06:29.15 | legodude | why doesn't this stupid cardbus nic work |
| 06:29.36 | legodude | anyone have experience with cardbus nics in linux? |
| 06:29.45 | MonMotha | Aelhaz: no, the copy protection crap |
| 06:29.51 | legodude | kernel says it's supported |
| 06:29.51 | MonMotha | the "Error: Can't copy text fomr this" |
| 06:30.04 | legodude | but it doesn't work |
| 06:33.57 | Aelhaz | Never have seen that |
| 06:34.05 | Aelhaz | why not just print to a file? |
| 06:34.11 | Aelhaz | hmm |
| 06:34.27 | Aelhaz | or look in the source, maybe you can just remove that part of the code |
| 06:38.44 | Aelhaz | hmm, went to spicey with the bean soup again. Maybe i should throw a pound of ground beef in it and say it's chilli. |
| 06:39.34 | legodude | nite all |
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| 06:48.16 | MonMotha | what endienness is the webpal? |
| 06:48.26 | MonMotha | either this rom dump is byte swapped or it's big endien |
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| 07:57.12 | MonMotha | at least the first part looks byte swapped |
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| 14:36.02 | _legodude | gah |
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| 16:12.39 | de_legodu | does the webpal need rts and cts? |
| 16:12.45 | de_legodu | or just txd and rxd?\ |
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| 16:39.12 | Tigren | I have got a Cassiopeia A-11, and was wondering if there are any "distros" that would run on it. I am willing to tweak and whatnot, just for the fun of it. |
| 17:02.51 | file | Tigren: Google :) |
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| 17:35.12 | CosmicPenguin | file: you told him.. ;) |
| 17:39.52 | file | lol |
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| 17:50.52 | Tigren__ | thanks for all the help |
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| 18:04.21 | CosmicPenguin | oops |
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| 19:48.38 | MonMotha | de_legodu: It certainly seems to run with no flow control, but I hooked them up anyway (you should have a spare receiver and transmitter on your MAX232 if you use one) |
| 19:53.13 | legodude | time to test it out |
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| 22:52.35 | sorphin | scanline: make up your mind |
| 22:53.03 | scanline | connection being flaky or something... |
| 22:53.17 | sorphin | cheap resnet ;) |
| 22:53.28 | scanline | I think it's a conspiracy against me |
| 22:53.42 | scanline | something's been filtering port 6667 |
| 22:53.50 | sorphin | scanline: an anti-picogui alliance ? |
| 22:54.03 | scanline | heh |
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| 23:45.35 | sorphin | andersee: evening erik |
| 23:46.10 | kergoth | hey dan, erik |
| 23:46.15 | kergoth | whats goin on |
| 23:49.16 | sorphin | nada, you ? |
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| 23:50.12 | sorphin | GPSFan: allo ken |