| 06:27:17 | cmarqu | greetings |
| 12:27:00 | mpakula | when my iPAQ is getting back from sleep mode the terminal says cardmgr[59]:executing:'./network start eth0' +operation failed why? |
| 12:29:18 | mpakula | hi terrrys |
| 12:29:28 | terrys | hey marcin |
| 12:30:07 | mpakula | when you'll have a moment i'll occupy your time if i may again |
| 12:30:32 | terrys | sure no problem... |
| 12:36:22 | nikos | cworth: (as if you aren't already in enough conversations... ;) Morning! 2 ipkg questions. 1. What is the "right" way to ensure appropriate ownership/perms on installed files (postinst?)? 2. How can the install scripts know where the packages files were installed? Is there a VAR set to the install root? |
| 12:36:27 | nikos | Morning nelson |
| 12:37:52 | mpakula | Morning nikos |
| 12:37:53 | cworth | nikos: 1. Set the permissions before calling ipkg-build, (tar will preserve). Using fakeroot for this is highly recommended. |
| 12:38:02 | cworth | nikos: 2. PKG_ROOT is set. |
| 12:39:26 | nikos | cworth: Your solution for 1 is difficult on a shared development system (like skiffcluster). |
| 12:39:37 | nikos | Hey mpakula |
| 12:39:57 | cworth | nikos: huh? try fakeroot. |
| 12:40:48 | nikos | cworth: OK, now we just need that on the skiffcluster. ;) Thanks. |
| 12:57:15 | mallum | hi jg |
| 12:58:54 | perlita | hi |
| 13:02:00 | nikos | So 1 minute 2 seconds is the limit for today... |
| 13:02:13 | jg | hi. |
| 13:02:22 | nikos | Morning jg |
| 13:06:57 | nikos | Hmm. For packages like pcmcia-cs, do you want to stop installed services before they are installed and then start them again after they are installed. Or is it good enough to restart it after install. I'm particularly thinking of the case in which the same packages provides the /etc/init.d/ script. Which could mean that what stop does changes. |
| 13:07:22 | nikos | Is stopping and starting cardmgr 'safe'? |
| 13:13:01 | mallum | nikos: I do it on my laptop all the time |
| 13:22:01 | sjohnson | is away: I'm busy. |
| 13:22:09 | sjohnson | is back (gone 00:00:08) |
| 13:22:15 | nikos | cworth: I added the mention of PKG_ROOT to BuildingIkpgs wiki page. |
| 13:35:23 | dneuer_AWAY | hola |
| 13:35:31 | nikos | [Stupid Question] Cardmgr does not have to be running for PCMCIA cards to work does it? |
| 13:35:34 | nikos | Morning dneuer |
| 13:36:31 | dneuer | hi nikos |
| 13:36:45 | dneuer | nikos: a7r is just pretending to be here, huh? |
| 13:37:16 | nikos | dneuer: Apparently. |
| 13:50:52 | nelson | nikos: you ever mounted a filesystem using NFS from fam 0.4 ? |
| 13:51:19 | nikos | nelson: No, having a problem? Did you use -o nolock? |
| 13:51:51 | nelson | I've got a filesystem that one box can mount, but my ipaq cannot. In fact, rpciod is still running. |
| 13:51:58 | nelson | No, but I'll give it a try. |
| 13:52:31 | nikos | I suspect -o nolock will fix it. |
| 13:52:36 | nelson | did, thanks. |
| 13:53:04 | nikos | Cool. Makes me wonder if there is someway we could make that option standard for NFS or something. |
| 14:00:20 | jg | nelson: I've often mounted file systems via NFS from my iPAQ. |
| 14:00:33 | jg | you need the nolock option. |
| 14:05:08 | nelson | jg: apparently, yes that made it work. Now I can wander around the house and garden playing mp3's. Almost as good as a radio! :-) |
| 14:05:42 | jg | yup. |
| 14:05:46 | nikos | Almost? |
| 14:05:49 | jg | We need a radio app... |
| 14:05:52 | nikos | I think not. It's gotta be better. |
| 14:06:03 | nikos | jg: We do, scream does icecast and shoutcast streams. |
| 14:06:36 | jg | I meant a client application that can access lots of internet channels... |
| 14:06:57 | nikos | jg: I guess I don't understand what you mean. Are you talking about some other protocol? |
| 14:07:21 | jg | No, I'm talking about a decent UI to the various streams out there... |
| 14:07:36 | nikos | jg: That's what scream is, although 'decent' is subjective. |
| 14:08:04 | jg | I haven't played with it: audio driver broken on the kernel I have installed this isntant. |
| 14:08:20 | nikos | jg: The question has been how to browse the streams since shoutcast at least doesn't export anything other than its html site. |
| 14:08:37 | mpakula | is AWAY at 18:12:32 : Server Cleaning |
| 14:09:45 | nikos | cworth: Now that I'm beginning to bow to the religion that is emacs, it would be nice for us to have an imp that works through a terminal and X, have you ever looked at jed? |
| 14:10:10 | nelson | nikos: parse shoutcast's html. |
| 14:10:34 | jg | nikos: jove has been packaged. |
| 14:10:38 | nelson | nikos: it's not as good as a radio because it pauses. |
| 14:10:44 | nikos | nelson: Yes, but that is clearly problematic since they could change it at anytime. In addition, the only revenue stream I can see them get is the ads on the page. |
| 14:10:56 | nikos | nelson: Any idea why its pausing. |
| 14:11:06 | nikos | jg: Yes, but jove is console only as far as I can tell. |
| 14:11:26 | nikos | jg: In fact it is jove that is bending my will currently. |
| 14:11:38 | nikos | nelson: s/./?/ |
| 14:11:59 | nikos | nelson: Maybe you need to increase the stream buffer? |
| 14:12:07 | jg | vim has also been packaged, if you bow to that religion. |
| 14:12:33 | nikos | No, I normally use pansy windowing editors like nedit. |
| 14:12:39 | nikos | is a wimp. |
| 14:15:01 | nelson | nikos: no idea why it's pausing. Load average isn't high on ipaq, nfs server load is nil, and the microwave isn't running. :) |
| 14:15:56 | nikos | nelson: You need that hacked madplay that tried to force the mp3 into the cache. |
| 14:16:06 | dneuer | jg: I packaged up vim-tiny and put in in the familiar incoming area, but it hasn't hit the feeds yet |
| 14:16:41 | jg | I worship at the emacs altar, myself. |
| 14:17:57 | nikos | There's definitely something missing in Familiar so that apps can detect the terminal size. ssh works OK, but it fails on the serial console and I notice in rxvt as well. Anyone have any ideas? |
| 14:18:47 | nikos | In fact, once one of these apps runs, it appears to change the apparent terminal size so that the entire frame is not used. |
| 14:20:09 | nikos | Do we have something mapped to Alt/Meta? |
| 14:20:15 | nikos | A button I mean. |
| 14:25:21 | Disconnect | nikos: I hope so. but I don't think we do. (I'm planning to make up some button mappings later - possibly today - for ctrl, alt and escape.) |
| 14:25:51 | nikos | Disconnect: The Arrow button does ctrl (the button to the far right). |
| 14:27:14 | Disconnect | nikos: oh. wish I'd known that the other day ;) |
| 14:28:33 | Disconnect | notes that the baen free library (www.baen.com/library/) html versions work great under dillo. |
| 14:29:21 | nikos | Disconnect: Thanks for the link. |
| 14:29:32 | mpakula | is back after 0 d 0 h 20 m 54 s |
| 14:31:11 | Disconnect | nikos: np. I used to read them on the palmpilot, and w/ this pocketzip I wondered if dillo would turn the ipaq into a nice ebook reader. (It does.) |
| 14:33:20 | Disconnect | nikos: (of course, ide-floppy + pocketzip is unstable as hell. not sure why.) |
| 14:34:08 | nikos | Anyone remember how to do '|' (pipe) with xstroke? |
| 14:34:19 | Disconnect | nikos: gimme a sec to dig out the cheat sheet |
| 14:35:02 | nikos | I have a little one, but it doesn't seem to be on there. |
| 14:35:03 | Disconnect | L up-down-right |
| 14:35:16 | Disconnect | (L as in looks-like-an) |
| 14:35:25 | Disconnect | 7414789 on the grid |
| 14:35:37 | nikos | Yeah I just found it. It's labelled as BAR on my cheat sheet. |
| 14:35:40 | nikos | Thanks. |
| 14:39:19 | nikos | By the way, if anyone wants jove, I put a copy in my personal feed at http://handhelds.org/~nikos/feed/ as I was impatient. *Warning* packages in that feed are liable to be very unstable. |
| 14:50:08 | sjohnson | nikos: Your pcmcia-cs-3.1.27 .ipk is real version 3.1.22. |
| 14:50:28 | nikos | sjohnson: What? |
| 14:50:32 | nikos | sjohnson: That's not possible. |
| 14:50:52 | nikos | sjohnson: It must not have installed properly. |
| 14:52:55 | nikos | sjohnson: Then again.... |
| 14:53:24 | sjohnson | nikos: I just dobule checked. run strings on cardmgr. It's 3.1.22 |
| 14:54:01 | nikos | sjohnson: This is really weird. I downloaded pcmcia-cs-3.1.27.tar.gz from the source and am building from it. |
| 15:00:58 | nikos | sjohnson: OK, looks like it has something to do with the way I built it. It's using the pcmcia from the kernel (which in 2.4.6-rmk1-np2 is 3.1.22) rather than its own. I'm afraid I'm really getting out of my depth here. |
| 15:01:55 | Kero | aha! thanks, nikos! |
| 15:02:00 | nikos | Kero: ? |
| 15:02:14 | Kero | heh :) |
| 15:02:39 | Kero | built pcmcia modules from pcmcia-cs-3.1.27, but got a cardmgr from 3.1.22 |
| 15:02:53 | nikos | Kero: Are you working on this too? |
| 15:03:04 | Kero | It seems that's due to the kernel I built for... |
| 15:03:20 | Kero | is not working on it actively. |
| 15:04:09 | nikos | Yep, yep, CPPFLAGS=-I../include/static -I$(LINUX)/include -I../include |
| 15:04:26 | nikos | So the kernel headers get preferrenced over its own headers. |
| 15:04:40 | nikos | What is the 'correct' thing to do here? |
| 15:04:57 | nikos | Can I safely just reorder this? |
| 15:09:33 | sjohnson | nikos: Only one way to be sure. Banzai!! - make config all |
| 15:10:47 | nikos | Build 'trusting' versions of card utilities? What does this mean? |
| 15:11:47 | Kero | nikos: dunno |
| 15:11:59 | nikos | Guess I'll just go with the default [n]. |
| 15:12:14 | sjohnson | nikos: Allow non-root users to run utils |
| 15:12:59 | Disconnect | agggggggg. |
| 15:13:21 | Disconnect | bash-2.03# /tmp/mkreiserfs /dev/hda1 39440 .. and it hits "print_usage_and_die()" which is a define for undefined options. |
| 15:13:35 | nikos | sjohnson: Should I enable that do you think? |
| 15:13:53 | sjohnson | nikos: I would say yes. |
| 15:14:59 | nikos | make all is going... |
| 15:15:31 | nikos | Anybody care to comment on the proper way to handle the install in terms of stopping/starting cardmgr that I asked about before? |
| 15:15:55 | sjohnson | nikos: I would say yes. |
| 15:16:21 | sjohnson | nikos: Ignore that last comment... Wrong window |
| 15:16:47 | Disconnect | nikos: debian prompts and aborts the install if you can't stop cardmgr. |
| 15:16:52 | Disconnect | likes that. |
| 15:17:30 | nikos | Disconnect: I don't believe that answers my question. |
| 15:18:20 | Disconnect | nikos: the question: what to do about cardmgr when installing new pcmcia tools and/or modules. the answer: prompt (OT: we need a little gui prompter/message box) and either don't unpack/install or stop cardmgr, install, start cardmgr. |
| 15:19:09 | nikos | Disconnect: I'm hoping someone else has a different answer, that would be a real PITA for me to try to do at this point. |
| 15:20:25 | nikos | nikos@reefshark:/home2/nikos/linux/pcmcia-cs-install/sbin$ ./cardmgr -V |
| 15:20:31 | nikos | cardmgr version 3.1.27 |
| 15:20:35 | nikos | woohoo |
| 15:21:04 | Disconnect | nikos: how so? does ipkg give you a preinstall script option? "eg run this, if succeed then unpack, if succeed then run that" for pre/post install |
| 15:22:12 | Disconnect | nikos: people get annoyed if you stop cardmgr w/o warning them and they are, eg, running a wlan card. or have a mounted storage unit. etc. |
| 15:22:19 | nikos | Disconnect: I don't completely follow that explanation to be frank. |
| 15:22:42 | Disconnect | notes that if you have ever tried to xscrib-in a wlan encryption key, you'd see why doing that to them is a Bad Thing ;) |
| 15:22:51 | Disconnect | nikos: ok.. psuedo-shell-script ipkg install: |
| 15:22:55 | cworth | Disconnect: if the packages preinst script returns non-0 then ipkg doens't continue installing. |
| 15:23:25 | Disconnect | cd /tmp ; tar xfvz my.ipkg ; cd ipkg/my; ./preinstall.sh && cp -R . / && ./postinstall.sh |
| 15:23:46 | Disconnect | cworth: ok. so if he puts in a prompt, and it comes back non-zero (ie "Don't stop cardmgr") it'll abort. perfect. |
| 15:23:58 | cworth | Disconnect: yes. |
| 15:24:00 | Disconnect | cworth: any ideas why mkreiserfs is failing? |
| 15:24:14 | cworth | Disconnect: I know nothing about it. |
| 15:24:20 | Disconnect | built from sources. but its not erroring, just listing the usage. |
| 15:24:22 | Disconnect | ah. damn. :( |
| 15:26:35 | nikos | Disconnect: I think I follow. I'm not shell wizard though so for me this is still a PITA. ;) |
| 15:26:40 | nikos | s/not/no/ |
| 15:27:10 | nikos | did not plan to get into all this when he purchased 802.11b equipment. *sigh* |
| 15:27:20 | Disconnect | nikos: echo "[WARNING][WARNING][WARNING]" ; echo "To upgrade cardmgr, it MUST be stopped. This will stop ALL PCMCIA AND CF CARDS." |
| 15:27:35 | Disconnect | nikos: echo "To abort, press CTRL-C now." ; read a ; exit 0 |
| 15:27:51 | Disconnect | notes ctrl-c is a pisser on an ipaq, but the other option is: |
| 15:28:41 | Disconnect | nikos: echo -n "To allow this, type Y: " ; read a; if [ -s $a == 'Y' -o -s $a == 'y' ]; exit 0; fi ; exit 1 |
| 15:29:17 | Disconnect | nikos: for testing replace exit 0/exit 1 with echo exit 0 .. then exit 1 every time (so you don't reinstall 50000 times while testing the script ;) ..) |
| 15:35:43 | nikos | [stupid emacs question] I'm in emacs (gnu) and I hit ctrl-h for help mode, browsed through info, now I'm back to the help screen where it says Type q to exit, but when I hit q it complains that the buffer is read-only. Help. |
| 15:37:36 | a7r | hey.. |
| 15:37:42 | Disconnect | agg. found the problem. |
| 15:37:48 | a7r | nikos: hit Control-K |
| 15:38:04 | Disconnect | mkreiserfs.c:393: warning: comparison is always true due to limited range of data type |
| 15:38:07 | Disconnect | but the comparison is: |
| 15:38:20 | Disconnect | [char c; up above] while ( ( c = getopt( argc, argv, "fh:v:q" ) ) != EOF ) |
| 15:38:21 | nikos | a7r: thanks. |
| 15:38:26 | cworth | a7r: hello |
| 15:38:32 | Disconnect | what is wrong here? anyone? this is killing me, cuz it looks fine. |
| 15:38:33 | a7r | cworth: morning.. |
| 15:38:55 | cworth | Disconnect: int c |
| 15:39:49 | nikos | a7r: Wouldn't ctrl-K just delete to the end of the line? Did you mean ctrl-x k? |
| 15:40:05 | a7r | nikos: er.. yeah. |
| 15:40:12 | a7r | (all that crap is in muscle memory) |
| 15:40:19 | nikos | a7r: :) |
| 15:40:22 | cworth | nikos: fingers know much much about emacs commands than the brain... |
| 15:40:35 | Disconnect | cworth: cool. no warning, trying it now ;) |
| 15:40:43 | jg | morning a7r |
| 15:40:51 | Disconnect | cworth: ok now it segfaults. thats progress of a sort. ;) |
| 15:40:53 | a7r | jg: hey.. how's it going? |
| 15:41:52 | jg | forgot my machine at home today... Sigh... |
| 15:43:13 | Disconnect | um. skiff6 seems to have just crashed. |
| 15:43:15 | a7r | gah.. I'm getting so much email worm span today. |
| 15:43:37 | jg | So long as you don't run IIS... |
| 15:43:48 | nikos | sjohnson: For you benefit, a scriptless http://handhelds.org/~nikos/feed/pcmcia-cs_3.1.27-kc2-devfs_arm.ipk |
| 15:43:51 | nikos | s/you/your/ |
| 15:44:57 | nikos | Disconnect: It just rebooted it appears. |
| 15:45:09 | Disconnect | nikos: any idea where strace is on it? |
| 15:45:25 | nikos | Disconnect: I would get it from one of the debian skiffs instead. |
| 15:46:04 | nikos | Disconnect: skiffcluster2.handhelds.org:/usr/bin/strace |
| 15:46:11 | Disconnect | nikos: you rule, thanks :) |
| 15:46:35 | Disconnect | nikos: but isn't that one of the ones that won't ftp? lemme try scp. |
| 15:47:16 | Disconnect | nikos: whats the passwd for scp? |
| 15:47:58 | nikos | Disconnect: you can't scp without an account, how about telnetting in and ftping out? |
| 15:48:22 | nikos | Disconnect: I can FTP into skiffcluster2 without a problem. |
| 15:48:55 | Disconnect | nikos: ahh. anonymous failed but guest worked. (and on the others, guest fails but anon works. go figure) |
| 15:49:18 | Disconnect | nikos: all good. thanks :) |
| 15:50:24 | Disconnect | wow. this is horrible. :( |
| 15:51:14 | Disconnect | ioctl(3, BLKGETSIZE, 0xbffffc58) = 0 / close(3) = 0 / stat64(0x20156e4, 0xbffffa98) = 0 / stat64(0xbffffe24, 0xbffffb64) = -1073742300 / --- SIGSEGV (Segmentation fault) --- |
| 17:12:53 | sjohnson | nikos: I finally got prism2_cs compiled properly with pcmcia-cs-3.1.27. But I'm still getting a kernel opps. "Unable to handle kernel paging request at virtual address xxxx" |
| 17:14:29 | nikos | sjohnson: Thanks for testing. Time for printk debugging? |
| 17:14:45 | bhima | is 1.5MB a normal size for a kernel...? |
| 17:15:09 | bhima | waves at nikos here too :) |
| 17:15:34 | sjohnson | nikos: I've got a console output but I don't do arm. :( |
| 17:15:52 | nikos | bhima: If you compile in a lot of stuff and don't modularize it, then that sounds about normal. |
| 17:16:00 | sjohnson | root |
| 17:16:12 | nikos | sjohnson: Me neither, which is why I would tend toward the print method. |
| 17:16:13 | bhima | I tended to keep stuff in modules as much as possible. |
| 17:16:39 | bhima | can you boot a kernel from a backpack flash card? |
| 17:20:45 | sjohnson | wonders if he will every get wlan-ng drivers to work under 2.4.6 |
| 17:36:18 | nikos | sjohnson: We definitely will eventually. |
| 17:38:27 | nikos | Anybody have any idea how we have a slang1_1.4.4-1_arm.ipk although debian doesn't seem to have anything later than slang1_1.3.9-1.deb? |
| 17:39:26 | nikos | On the other hand, maybe I just don't understand the debian pool system. |
| 17:40:04 | bhima | apparently, netbsd just about has their kernel working with the compaq bootldr. |
| 17:40:46 | bhima | gonna be interesting to see competing PDA OSs :) |
| 17:48:04 | sjohnson | Damn. Now I'm getting a "SWI relocation" error when trying to compile the kernel. Does anyone remember what the fix is? |
| 18:08:17 | ellen | what tools are folks using to monitor performance within Familiar? |
| 18:10:28 | sjohnson | ellen: loadmeter will give to a load avg on the X display |
| 18:11:25 | ellen | sjohnson: thanks.. i was looking for other tools too... |
| 18:12:07 | sjohnson | Most of the other stuff is command line and /proc related. |
| 18:12:42 | ellen | sjohnson: thanks for the help! :-) |
| 18:37:54 | nikos | I've just put an xjed package in my feed, it has a bug where JED_ROOT env needs to be set to "/jed" |
| 18:44:27 | mallum | nikos: wheres your feed ? |
| 18:45:04 | nikos | mallum: http://handhelds.org/~nikos/feed/ |
| 18:45:12 | nikos | mallum: I copycatted you. |
| 18:45:31 | mallum | nikos: ;) |
| 18:45:51 | mallum | nikos: the poeple came and took my baby away to day |
| 18:45:59 | nikos | ? |
| 18:46:05 | nikos | What baby is that? |
| 18:46:07 | mallum | nikos: they took it to the netherlands so it can get better :) |
| 18:46:10 | perlan | puter |
| 18:46:20 | nikos | Netherlands? |
| 18:46:38 | mallum | where the compaq repair place is I guess ;) |
| 18:46:41 | nikos | mallum: Did you put CE back on it? |
| 18:46:56 | mallum | nikos: no, I lost the img files along time ago |
| 18:47:07 | nikos | mallum: Just curious. |
| 18:47:16 | mallum | nikos: I put a note in with it explaining. |
| 18:47:25 | nikos | I think that should be good enough. |
| 18:47:53 | mallum | 'If you dont fix it, I be on the first plane out with a big f**king axe' |
| 18:48:27 | mallum | obviously I didn't really put that |
| 18:49:12 | mallum | I won a new laptop on ebay yesterday |
| 18:49:24 | perlan | ? "won" ? |
| 18:49:25 | mallum | the guy is dropping it off at my work tommorow |
| 18:49:36 | mallum | perlan: qwon in auction |
| 18:49:47 | mallum | s/q// |
| 18:49:52 | perlan | ebay: where your junk is another man's gold |
| 18:50:02 | perlan | :-) |
| 18:50:06 | mallum | I hope is nots stolen |
| 18:50:14 | mallum | bit worried |
| 18:51:51 | mallum | I got a 500mhz compaq m300 for 400 quid |
| 18:51:58 | mallum | which is pretty good |
| 18:53:02 | BBrox | mallum: stolen UK Army decomissionned PC full of confidential informations :-) |
| 18:53:27 | mallum | BBrox: with the formula for fast factoring of primes |
| 18:54:09 | BBrox | mallum: of course.... And a hidden Quantum Computing PCMCIA card |
| 18:54:27 | BBrox | Just what you would need to war driving with the iPAQ :-) |
| 18:54:34 | mallum | he he |
| 18:58:18 | Disconnect | is arguing with his ipaq again. so far, it's winning. |
| 18:58:35 | perlan | use a .45, I always win with it |
| 18:59:15 | Disconnect | perlan: thats not an arguement. if I was going to do that I'd just slap wince back on it and sell it on ebay for $750 ;) |
| 18:59:15 | mallum | ? |
| 18:59:56 | perlan | you'd be lucky to get that much |
| 19:00:17 | perlan | is watching ipaqs on ebay looking for a serial cable |
| 19:02:27 | Disconnect | perlan: nah, its all ebay. if you describe it and miscategorize it properly, its legit and some moron will pay insane amounts to get it. |
| 19:02:28 | mowse | looking for someone who has been successful in getting prism2 based pcmcia cards to recognize as anything but "Anonymous Memory", working around the memory_cs problem, pcmcia config options, etc. |
| 19:02:45 | nikos | perlan: I was recently able to get one (as in yesterday) from outpost. |
| 19:02:56 | Disconnect | was watching them going for $1k and up earlier, when all you had to do was call radio shack and order one - 3 days later it would come in. |
| 19:03:13 | perlan | outpost? where is that? |
| 19:03:15 | nikos | mowse: Which card specifically? And are you using 2.4.6-rmk1-np2 from the lorien fieed? |
| 19:03:19 | nikos | perlan: outpost.com |
| 19:03:22 | perlan | k |
| 19:03:24 | nikos | s/fieed/feed/ |
| 19:03:44 | mowse | nikos: yes on the kernel, and the exact make, SMC2632W, DLink-DWL 650 |
| 19:03:46 | nikos | mowse: Mine (SMC2632) detects as Compaq WL110 (I think). |
| 19:03:51 | Disconnect | recommends against outpost - its more expensive than the rest of the world. (So is CDW, but if you call them up they'll usually knock some cash off. Esp if you have shopped there before.) |
| 19:04:00 | mowse | I've had great success getting the dual slot pcmcia adapter to work |
| 19:04:03 | nikos | mowse: Same card, add a W too mine, I forget. |
| 19:04:15 | mowse | yeah, I'm so close that I can feel it |
| 19:04:20 | nikos | mowse: Right now we are fighting trying to put together pcmcia and wlan-ng that will work for it. |
| 19:04:29 | nikos | And I'm just too clueless. |
| 19:04:50 | mowse | on what aspect? |
| 19:04:56 | mowse | building an 802.11 itself? |
| 19:05:00 | nikos | mowse: PCMCIA in general. |
| 19:05:01 | perlan | no serial cables until the end of Aug .... |
| 19:05:05 | perlan | at most places |
| 19:05:16 | nikos | perlan: Try calling them, I think they just got a shipment. |
| 19:05:25 | mowse | I just got one from Compaq yesterday |
| 19:06:08 | perlan | i will, didn't see it on the webpage |
| 19:06:47 | mowse | creating one from the usb cable isn't too bad |
| 19:07:11 | perlan | that's how I'm running now, but I have problems |
| 19:07:20 | nikos | Yeah, I find the dual cradle easier to use most of the time. |
| 19:07:21 | mowse | how so? |
| 19:07:37 | perlan | kernel crc errors & jffs2 crc errors |
| 19:07:49 | perlan | about 1 in 10 downloads actually work |
| 19:07:50 | mowse | 3670? |
| 19:07:56 | perlan | yes |
| 19:07:58 | mowse | :> |
| 19:08:02 | mowse | you don't say.. |
| 19:08:10 | perlan | tell me more! |
| 19:08:27 | mowse | do you have a dual pcmcia slot? |
| 19:08:31 | perlan | nope |
| 19:08:33 | mowse | single? |
| 19:08:40 | perlan | nope |
| 19:08:48 | mowse | ok, then it gets risky...but |
| 19:08:52 | perlan | just a flash |
| 19:08:56 | mowse | charge your battery all the way... |
| 19:09:06 | mowse | turn off the lcd during each flash. |
| 19:09:12 | perlan | i do that now |
| 19:09:18 | mowse | you do |
| 19:09:21 | mowse | and it's not getting warm? |
| 19:09:22 | perlan | seems to help |
| 19:09:24 | mowse | and it's still crapping? |
| 19:09:35 | perlan | right, it's better if I keep it cold |
| 19:09:41 | mowse | I kept mine off and cool, and got 9/10 successful flashes |
| 19:10:11 | perlan | i get a boot (finally) then cat the image into the flash and it works |
| 19:10:46 | mowse | oh. ha ha. someone replaced my kernel image with 2.4.3 in our master dir. |
| 19:10:55 | mowse | har har. so, no on the newer kernel I guess :p |
| 19:11:04 | mowse | hmm |
| 19:11:27 | mowse | I guess it truly is variable. |
| 19:11:40 | mowse | I had the same problem as yourself, with a custom cable, and it just worked when cooled |
| 19:11:44 | mowse | interesting |
| 19:11:48 | perlan | so just a crappy download process |
| 19:11:59 | mowse | how solid would you say your cable is? |
| 19:12:07 | mowse | did you coat exposed wire with plastic when you soldered? |
| 19:12:24 | mowse | that's REALLY important |
| 19:12:30 | perlan | this one is pretty good used wire wrap under a magnifier lamp |
| 19:12:38 | mowse | alright |
| 19:12:43 | mowse | so, you can assume that the cable is solid |
| 19:13:13 | mowse | I had the best luck at 10 minute rests between flashes with no LCD. |
| 19:13:20 | mowse | I guess at this point, it's the best that I can offer |
| 19:13:27 | mowse | but it did work eventually, then 9/10 times |
| 19:13:32 | mowse | but it wasn't pretty for a while |
| 19:13:34 | perlan | ever try a lower baudrate? |
| 19:13:46 | mowse | I thought about it, but the wait time reminded me of my C64. |
| 19:13:52 | mowse | and I felt sick to my stomach. |
| 19:13:58 | mowse | :> |
| 19:14:00 | perlan | hehe, doesn't work either anyway |
| 19:15:58 | martin | hey, the c64 was great, anyway... try using screened cable it helps a lot... |
| 19:16:08 | mowse | so am I right in assuming that I'm out of luck getting the prism2 cards to identify with 2.4.3? |
| 19:16:40 | nikos | mowse: Aren't you using the dual sleeve? |
| 19:16:57 | nikos | mowse: That doesn't work with 2.4.3, you would need at least 2.4.4, 2.4.6-rmk1-np2 is best. |
| 19:17:00 | mowse | yeah. and it works in 2.4.3 |
| 19:17:15 | nikos | mowse: It may seem like it, but according to the author (jamey) it doesn't. |
| 19:17:47 | mowse | 2.4.6 requires changes to accept a larger kernel image, yes? |
| 19:17:51 | nikos | mowse: It detects fine for me with 2.4.6-rmk1-np2, I just need working drivers. |
| 19:18:05 | nikos | mowse: No, there is a < 512K version also, although I am using the larger devfs one here. |
| 19:18:22 | mowse | did you pick it up from the CVS tree? |
| 19:19:17 | nikos | mowse: What? The kernel? |
| 19:19:20 | | lorien feed is probably ftp://lothlorien.handhelds.org/pub/linux/feeds/ |
| 19:19:20 | nikos | ibot: lorien feed |
| 19:19:30 | nikos | mowse: look in the demo feed at that URL. |
| 19:19:38 | mowse | oh, word. didnt notice "ibot" |
| 20:05:46 | dneuer | bye bye all |
| 20:54:53 | sjohnson | nikos: I've got the prism2_cs drivers working!!!!! |
| 20:55:00 | nikos | sjohnson: WHAT WHAT WHAT!!!!! |
| 20:55:13 | nikos | sjohnson: You better not be kidding m e |
| 20:55:37 | sjohnson | cardmgr[1010]: initializing socket 1 |
| 20:55:38 | sjohnson | cardmgr[1010]: socket 1: SMC 2632W 11Mbps 802.11b WLAN Card |
| 20:55:38 | sjohnson | cardmgr[1010]: executing: 'modprobe prism2_cs' |
| 20:55:38 | sjohnson | init_module: prism2_cs.o: 0.1.8-pre12 Loaded |
| 20:55:38 | sjohnson | init_module: dev_info is: prism2_cs |
| 20:55:38 | sjohnson | bitsy_pcmcia_configure_socket: socket=1 vcc=50 vpp=0 reset=0 |
| 20:55:40 | sjohnson | bitsy_pcmcia_configure_socket: socket=1 vcc=50 vpp=0 reset=0 |
| 20:55:42 | sjohnson | prism2_cs: index 0x01: Vcc 5.0, irq 32, io 0xf7000000-0xf700003f |
| 20:55:44 | sjohnson | ident: nic h/w: id=0x8002 1.0.0 |
| 20:55:46 | sjohnson | ident: pri f/w: id=0x15 0.3.0 |
| 20:55:48 | sjohnson | ident: sta f/w: id=0x1f 0.7.6 |
| 20:55:50 | sjohnson | MFI:SUP:role=0x00:id=0x01:var=0x01:b/t=1/1 |
| 20:55:52 | sjohnson | CFI:SUP:role=0x00:id=0x02:var=0x01:b/t=1/1 |
| 20:55:54 | sjohnson | PRI:SUP:role=0x00:id=0x03:var=0x01:b/t=1/2 |
| 20:55:56 | sjohnson | STA:SUP:role=0x00:id=0x04:var=0x01:b/t=1/4 |
| 20:55:58 | sjohnson | PRI-CFI:ACT:role=0x01:id=0x02:var=0x01:b/t=1/1 |
| 20:56:00 | sjohnson | STA-CFI:ACT:role=0x01:id=0x02:var=0x01:b/t=1/1 |
| 20:56:02 | sjohnson | STA-MFI:ACT:role=0x01:id=0x01:var=0x01:b/t=1/1 |
| 20:56:04 | sjohnson | Prism2 card SN: 99SA01000000 |
| 20:56:06 | sjohnson | cardmgr[1010]: executing: './wlan-ng start wlan0' |
| 20:56:08 | sjohnson | cardmgr[1010]: + default:linux-wlan,1,0,00:E0:29:91:94:9D |
| 20:56:13 | nikos | rock |
| 20:56:15 | sjohnson | nikos: I has to compile every thing from scratch to get it to work. |
| 20:56:21 | nikos | sjohnson: How much longer are you going to be around? :) |
| 20:56:31 | nikos | sjohnson: Everything? Kernel? |
| 20:56:48 | sjohnson | nikos: Kerne, pcmcia and wlan-ng |
| 20:56:52 | nikos | sjohnson: Damn |
| 20:57:21 | nikos | sjohnson: I don't have network here, will you be around in 45 minutes or so? |
| 20:57:23 | perlan | you could binary diff the results to find the broken bits |
| 20:57:52 | sjohnson | nikos: I'm headed home but should be back on line in 45 min. |
| 20:57:58 | nikos | sjohnson: Cool |
| 20:58:44 | sjohnson | nikos: I've got all of the pieces. I should have a feed setup some. But things are scatter on 3 different systems. |
| 20:59:14 | nikos | sjohnson: I'll be patient. |
| 20:59:21 | nikos | sjohnson: I've waited this long already... |
| 20:59:36 | sjohnson | is away: headed home |
| 21:00:18 | pong2015 | I've been thinking about getting an ipaq, and putting on Familiar... I'm just curious about what all is avaliable on it... what kinds of programs can be run under it... |
| 21:01:54 | nikos | pong2015: Well, just about anything you would for linux, assuming screen limitations, lack of an FPU, and somewhat limitted RAM and possibly storage depending on your setup. |
| 21:03:18 | pong2015 | What is the method most people use for input on it....? xstroke, or a screen-printed keyboard? |
| 21:04:06 | pong2015 | From most of the screen shots I've seen, I'm pretty impressed.... |
| 21:04:26 | perlan | external keyboard |
| 21:06:12 | nikos | pong2015: There is a software keyboard, handwriting recognition, etc. I use xstroke myself. |
| 21:07:25 | pong2015 | by 'handwriting recognition', do you mean the grafiti-like handwriting used by xstroke, or something more comparable to the WinCE version of the note-taking and handwriting recognition? |
| 21:07:47 | pong2015 | I've had a coworker show me his ipaq that has CE loaded on it, but I would prefer something I would *enjoy* using... |
| 21:09:12 | nikos | pong2015: xstroke is fully configurable, and newer versions will be much more configurable still. |
| 21:12:13 | pong2015 | Yes... I liked how you could define the keystrokes in the config files... |
| 21:12:35 | pong2015 | I'm just trying to think.... I'm trying to justify this to myself as something other than just an expensive toy = )( |
| 21:18:38 | pong2015 | are there 802.11 cards working for the ipaq with Familiar? |
| 21:19:10 | nikos | pong2015: Yes, wavelan cards should be fine, prism2 cards should work. |
| 21:21:17 | pong2015 | thanks for the info... |
| 21:23:20 | nikos | Sure |
| 21:24:21 | pong2015 | which widget library does Familiar use? |
| 21:26:08 | nikos | pong2015: None by definition. We have a packaging system like Debian, anyone can use whatever they like. |
| 21:26:24 | nikos | pong2015: But generally we will recommend X/GTK. |
| 21:26:40 | pong2015 | Yeah... I was just curoious from some of the screenshots... |
| 21:26:54 | pong2015 | It seems that kvkbd uses athena, but others seemed to use GTK |
| 21:27:07 | nikos | pong2015: The screenshots are a hodge podge going back a long time. |
| 21:27:14 | pong2015 | ah. |
| 21:27:15 | nikos | pong2015: A lot has changed very quickly. |
| 21:34:28 | perlan | must be a lot of people installing linux |
| 21:34:37 | perlan | no serial cables anywhere |
| 21:35:39 | mallum | is away: bed time - night all |
| 22:59:59 | blupingu | hi |
| 23:00:09 | nikos | Hi blupingu |
| 23:00:15 | blupingu | can i install familiar on a bare 3660 with 16 MB ROM? |
| 23:00:45 | nikos | Yes, but some people have had some diffculty, so be warned that it may not go smoothly. |
| 23:01:01 | blupingu | what kind of difficulties? |
| 23:02:10 | blupingu | I'm sorry to ask this, i haven't rtfm yet :p |
| 23:02:23 | blupingu | kinda busy day at work |
| 23:02:40 | nikos | blupingu: It's not clear, the transferring/flashing doesn't seem to work right. |
| 23:02:47 | nikos | It works sometimes but not other times. |
| 23:02:54 | nikos | But for some people it never fails. |
| 23:03:23 | blupingu | and if flashing goes wrong, i kind of screwed up the device, no way of backing up? |
| 23:04:06 | nikos | blupingu: No one yet has failed flashing the bootloader, and that's the only really dangerous part. |
| 23:04:14 | blupingu | okay, cool, thanks |
| 23:04:15 | nikos | blupingu: Even then, CRL will fix it for you. |
| 23:04:22 | blupingu | CRL? |
| 23:06:09 | nikos | Compaq Research Labs, they host handhelds.org and do much of the low level development. |
| 23:06:24 | a7r | nikos: Cambridge Research Labs |
| 23:06:54 | nikos | a7r: Ah right, thanks. |
| 23:07:38 | nikos | a7r: I'm doing too many things at once (1) and my multi-tasker is screwed. |
| 23:07:50 | blupingu | thanks very much, and sorry for bothering you |
| 23:07:55 | a7r | nikos: I hear yah.,. I'm about 5 minutes from taking a siesta. |
| 23:08:02 | blupingu | i have to go fetch meal very quickly, it's about 2:15AM here |
| 23:08:04 | blupingu | night |