| 02:24:02 | sgodsell | is away: I have got to go! |
| 03:41:59 | DragonEagle | is away: night all |
| 05:42:04 | vemikainen | hi.How to mount CF memory (vfat) in Familiar? |
| 05:48:25 | blakangel | gotta format it first |
| 05:48:39 | blakangel | er |
| 05:48:43 | blakangel | is it already formatted |
| 05:48:53 | blakangel | vfat |
| 05:49:01 | blakangel | need vfat kernel module i guess |
| 06:50:52 | vemikainen | ok thank you I've solved the problem |
| 12:03:24 | Che_Fox | Howdy folks! |
| 12:03:35 | Che_Fox | got Familiar installed on his 3630. :) |
| 12:03:45 | Che_Fox | It's cute.. I wish it was actually useful, tho. |
| 12:13:57 | Kero | heh |
| 12:49:37 | bitman | Hi there ! |
| 12:49:38 | bitman | I have a question for all Familiar specialists: If I modify the standard v0.5 boottrap root image, can I somehow save it back to a file ? |
| 12:49:38 | bitman | (I mean a file to use with bootldr_ |
| 12:49:38 | bitman | ) |
| 12:55:38 | blakangel | bitman |
| 12:55:46 | blakangel | you can get a tar.gz of the jffs2 image |
| 12:55:51 | blakangel | then edit it to your liking |
| 12:56:14 | blakangel | then mkjffs2 (or some command) on the ddir |
| 12:56:20 | blakangel | on your linux box |
| 12:56:24 | dave | hey there folks |
| 12:56:31 | blakangel | hey dave |
| 12:56:33 | blakangel | whats goin on |
| 12:56:54 | dave | Not much .. sobbering up from last night still |
| 12:57:02 | blakangel | haha |
| 12:57:03 | blakangel | nice |
| 12:57:08 | blakangel | i gotta go to work today |
| 12:57:11 | blakangel | noon to 6 |
| 12:57:12 | blakangel | ;/ |
| 12:57:39 | dave | I need to go in at some time too ... no set hours though just loads to do .. |
| 12:57:42 | Che_Fox | Ahh, Sikigami actually makes Familiar pretty cool. |
| 12:57:49 | Che_Fox | Japanese people rule. :) |
| 12:57:58 | blakangel | what is Sikigami |
| 12:58:01 | dave | Sikigami ?? |
| 12:58:33 | Che_Fox | Sikigami is an add-on to Familiar 0.4.. it installs Gnome, Japanese support, a real address book program, a file manager, a scheduler.. you know, useful things |
| 12:58:41 | blakangel | nice |
| 12:58:42 | Che_Fox | it's pretty cool, got it up now.. |
| 12:58:47 | blakangel | gnome is too big |
| 12:58:49 | blakangel | for me |
| 12:58:52 | blakangel | on my desktop |
| 12:58:54 | blakangel | i got rid of it |
| 12:59:03 | blakangel | too much hassle, and i didnt see any real benefits of it |
| 12:59:04 | Che_Fox | they make it work very well in sikigami |
| 12:59:09 | dave | been looking for one where did you get it ? |
| 12:59:11 | blakangel | cool |
| 12:59:20 | Che_Fox | dave: Are you asking me? |
| 12:59:34 | dave | yes please ? |
| 12:59:42 | Che_Fox | Uh, I downloaded it from www.sikigami.com :) |
| 13:00:39 | Che_Fox | Wah, but when I power down my iPaq, the next time I power up, the backlight is off and I can't actually use my pen to do anything |
| 13:00:41 | Che_Fox | sniffs |
| 13:00:50 | blakangel | hmm |
| 13:00:54 | Che_Fox | this is not so useful |
| 13:00:54 | blakangel | that happened to me |
| 13:00:59 | blakangel | cuz |
| 13:00:59 | Che_Fox | blak: how'd you fix it? |
| 13:01:06 | blakangel | my bootldr was too new for my kernel |
| 13:01:06 | dave | Hmmm unfortunatly I dont speak the lingo ;-< |
| 13:01:18 | blakangel | so i downgraded my bootldr and it worked |
| 13:01:28 | bitman | blakangel: Thank you. But I was more thinking like tuning my settings on the iPAQ and once I am happy, get that root system back into one that can be installed with bootldr. Is that possible ? |
| 13:01:44 | Che_Fox | blak: Hm. I'm running bootloader 2.14.15 with kernel 2.4.3-rmk2-np1-fam2 |
| 13:01:56 | Che_Fox | dave: Yes, you need to understand Japanese to download and install it |
| 13:01:57 | blakangel | hrm |
| 13:02:09 | blakangel | im not familiar w/ that kernel |
| 13:02:20 | Che_Fox | blak: it was in the familiar 0.4 directory |
| 13:02:26 | Che_Fox | 0.4.1 actually |
| 13:02:27 | blakangel | i'd downgrade the bootldr |
| 13:02:29 | blakangel | to 2.14.5 |
| 13:02:31 | blakangel | i think |
| 13:02:35 | blakangel | thats what i did |
| 13:02:36 | Che_Fox | hm |
| 13:02:40 | blakangel | when i had fam 0.4 |
| 13:02:53 | blakangel | im upgraded to 0.5 now |
| 13:03:03 | blakangel | and bootlodr 2.16.0 |
| 13:03:18 | blakangel | zImage-2.4.7-rmk3-np1-devfs-hh10 |
| 13:03:20 | blakangel | that kernel |
| 13:03:24 | blakangel | is what im usin now |
| 13:03:37 | Che_Fox | in any case, this stuff is cute, but it's still a toy :/ |
| 13:03:39 | blakangel | i gotta get goin |
| 13:03:42 | blakangel | gotta get ready for work |
| 13:03:44 | Che_Fox | but good work folks :) |
| 13:03:51 | blakangel | yea i like mine |
| 13:04:51 | nikos | Che_Fox: FYI, v0.4.1 is simply a copy of v0.4, there wlll not actually be a v0.4.1 release. |
| 13:05:11 | nikos | Che_Fox: What makes you say 'it's still a toy'? |
| 13:05:21 | BBrox | nikos: can you help me about a CVS problem :-) ? |
| 13:05:27 | nikos | BBrox: Sure |
| 13:07:21 | Che_Fox | nikos: Things like how it hangs when you resume it from sleep, how familiar without Sikigami doesn't even have a scheduler, and how I can't install random .deb files.. I was really looking forward to installing random arm .debs, but I can't. |
| 13:07:39 | Che_Fox | nikos: But people are actively working on it, which is great. |
| 13:07:47 | Che_Fox | I hope it'll become something really useful. |
| 13:09:16 | nikos | Che_Fox: That is because you installed a bootloader that doesn't match your kernel. |
| 13:09:44 | nikos | Che_Fox: A little installation instruction snafu certainly, but technically Familiar v0.4 does suggest 2.14.5 which works just fine. |
| 13:10:23 | nikos | Che_Fox: Actually you can install debs, but debs are monsters and you really don't want to do that. It is VERY easy to make an ipkg from a cleaned up deb. |
| 13:10:38 | Che_Fox | nikos: The instructions on the Familiar site do not tell you which kernel works with which bootloader. |
| 13:10:46 | nikos | Che_Fox: Scheduling is an application issue, not a system issue. |
| 13:10:54 | Che_Fox | nikos: I'm not looking for excuses! *chuckle* |
| 13:11:02 | bitman | I have a question for all Familiar specialists: If I modify the standard v0.5 boottrap root image, can I somehow save it back to a file ? |
| 13:11:03 | Che_Fox | nikos: The familiar folks are doing good work. |
| 13:11:06 | Che_Fox | But there's a long way to go. |
| 13:11:12 | Che_Fox | nikos: There are no docs on how to install debs. |
| 13:11:15 | nikos | Che_Fox: It's an unfortunate coincidence of the fact that v0.4 is old now and v0.5 is nearly complete. |
| 13:11:34 | nikos | Che_Fox: That's because we don't recommend it, BUT, if you had searched the website you would have found info about it. |
| 13:11:36 | Che_Fox | nikos: I will try Familiar again when 0.5 comes out. Sikigami + 0.4 works great for now. |
| 13:11:59 | Che_Fox | nikos: I read through the Wiki FAQ. :) |
| 13:12:01 | bitman | To give you some more details: I was I was thinking of tuning my settings on the iPAQ and once I am happy, get that root system back into one file that can be installed with bootldr. Is that possible ? |
| 13:13:17 | nikos | Che_Fox: Please keep in mind this is a 100% volunteer project, no one is paid to do this. We also label this currently as a v0.* release, which means among other things that you really need to be prepared to do significant research to use it. |
| 13:13:37 | Che_Fox | nikos: I'm a Debian developer. I know all about how volunteer programs work. :) |
| 13:13:55 | nikos | bitman: Please explain, I don't understand. |
| 13:13:56 | Che_Fox | nikos: I am very happy with what you all have done. I hope you make it to 1.0 swiftly. |
| 13:14:09 | nikos | Che_Fox: Well, that's good, just think of us as Debian several years ago then. ;) |
| 13:14:10 | Che_Fox | nikos: But, like I said, it's not a PDA yet. Soon, though, if folks help. |
| 13:14:19 | Che_Fox | nikos: I remember how Debian was back in 1995 very well. :) |
| 13:14:43 | bitman | nikos: I want to create an image like task-bootstrap.jffs2 from my iPAQ, once I have selected/deselected packages and modified settings to my personal likings. |
| 13:14:48 | nikos | Che_Fox: Well, that's a philosophical issue to some extent, many of us don't really think of the ipaq as a PDA, but as a small computer, so we haven't really been focussing on PDA issues. |
| 13:15:52 | Che_Fox | nikos: Sure. Me, I have a small computer. I want a PDA. :) |
| 13:16:05 | Che_Fox | nikos: The fact that it runs SSH is massive massive kudos to you all. |
| 13:16:18 | Che_Fox | nikos: Try getting SSH for WinCE. :) $80 for a BETA. |
| 13:16:23 | nikos | bitman: That's not how it works. |
| 13:16:43 | nikos | bitman: The jffs2 images are produced from ipkgs, so if you want to change things, you want to change the ipkgs. |
| 13:16:53 | nikos | Che_Fox: Ouch. ;) |
| 13:17:04 | bitman | bikos: Sorry ? I didn't understand that. |
| 13:17:27 | Che_Fox | nikos: Anyway, I will downgrade my bootloader. Is it safe to do so with the same procedure you'd use to upgrade? |
| 13:17:33 | nikos | bitman: And to change ipkgs, you need to discuss the issue with the current maintainer of each ipkg. The maintainer can be discovered using ipkg info <package name> |
| 13:17:45 | nikos | Che_Fox: Yeah, a simple 'load bootldr' does the trick. |
| 13:17:55 | nikos | Che_Fox: Since you are a developer though, I HIGHLY recommend installing v0.5 instead. |
| 13:18:14 | nikos | Che_Fox: Many of the v0.4 concepts are deprecated and are a dead end. |
| 13:18:34 | bitman | nikos: I think we are not talking about the same thing. Here a simnple example: I dont have PCMCIA stuff, so I would like a root image WITHOUT that particular package on it, to save time when I reinstall things |
| 13:18:58 | Che_Fox | nikos: I will back up my Sikigami installation first, then try 0.5. But I don't have a net connection for my iPaq yet, so I've been installing .ipks via zmodem. |
| 13:19:09 | dave | Che_Fox: Im seriosly thinking of playing with python and writting some seriose PDA software under it. What sort of thing are you looking for precisly ? |
| 13:19:27 | Che_Fox | dave: A clone of the Palm address book, scheduler, note pad, and to-do list. |
| 13:19:43 | nikos | Che_Fox: Are you aware of all the options? PPP, usbnet, wireless, ethernet? You should be able to setup networking. |
| 13:19:44 | Che_Fox | dave: Preferably one that hooked into [x]emacs's Big Brother Database. |
| 13:19:59 | Che_Fox | nikos: I don't have the PCMCIA jacket, only CF, and no CF network cards. |
| 13:20:20 | Che_Fox | nikos: I *could* do PPP.. |
| 13:20:37 | Che_Fox | nikos: I'd have to set up a PPP server on my big box. |
| 13:20:54 | Che_Fox | hms. |
| 13:21:01 | nikos | Che_Fox: What cables? |
| 13:21:08 | nikos | Che_Fox: serial only? |
| 13:21:15 | Che_Fox | nikos: I have both the serial and USB cradles. |
| 13:21:23 | nikos | Che_Fox: use usbnet |
| 13:21:25 | | i heard usbnet was at http://handhelds.org/z/wiki/How%20do%20I%20setup%20USB%20networking |
| 13:21:25 | nikos | ibot: usbnet |
| 13:21:29 | | Since Tue Oct 16 17:45:11 2001, there have been 120 modifications and 568 questions. I have been awake for 10 days, 20 hours, 36 minutes, 18 seconds this session, and currently reference 2933 factoids. Addressing is in require mode. |
| 13:21:29 | Che_Fox | ibot, status |
| 13:21:32 | | thanks Che_Fox :) |
| 13:21:32 | Che_Fox | ibot, botsnack |
| 13:21:34 | nikos | Che_Fox: MUCH faster and really easier to setup. |
| 13:21:35 | Che_Fox | ibot++ |
| 13:21:41 | Che_Fox | looks at usbnet |
| 13:22:30 | dave | Che_Fox .. Ive never played with the palm .. the main concern as far as db etc is the size it would use for storage .. Im looking at that sort of thing atm .. if you email me with your requirements ... IE cool tricks you like to do .. Ill look into some of them I have a good few ideas myself that would make this real PDA like .. but I am hopping to keep the size down ... IE this thing is a small computer to me as well not a PDA and I dont want |
| 13:22:30 | dave | the PDA software taking over the space |
| 13:22:35 | Che_Fox | nikos: Are these modules included in any of the distributions? |
| 13:22:41 | Che_Fox | nikos: I'm not so sure about building ARM kernel modules. :) |
| 13:23:12 | Che_Fox | dave: *nod* |
| 13:23:42 | nikos | Che_Fox: Everything you need is already on the ipaq. |
| 13:23:51 | nikos | Che_Fox: You just need usbnet for the desktop. |
| 13:23:59 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK, I'll poke at it. |
| 13:24:19 | dave | Im also wondering what it would take to be able to link it to MS Outlook .. I and many others are forced to use Outlook by uncaring evil buisness managers at work and would love to be able to give them two fingers and link it to linux |
| 13:25:28 | dave | Grins |
| 13:26:08 | Che_Fox | reboots to poke at usbnet, hoping he has a new enough kernel. No kernel recompilations for him! |
| 13:27:54 | Che_Fox | is back. |
| 13:28:11 | Che_Fox | Hm, looks like no usbnet for me, I'm running 2.4.10 |
| 13:28:21 | Che_Fox | "a working version was bundled with 2.4.13" |
| 13:28:22 | Che_Fox | heh. |
| 13:28:39 | nikos | Che_Fox: ??? |
| 13:28:54 | nikos | Che_Fox: usbnet works with kernel after 2.4.3 or so. |
| 13:29:05 | nikos | Che_Fox: You would just have to compile one file. |
| 13:29:07 | Che_Fox | nikos: from the usbnet URL above: |
| 13:29:17 | Che_Fox | It is bundled in Linux kernel since version 2.4.10, but working version is bundled since 2.4.13. You need to enable CONFIG_USB_USBNET in kernel config. |
| 13:29:20 | dave | I have it running happily on 2.4.8 |
| 13:29:43 | nikos | Che_Fox: That's about bundling, I agree it may not be bundled, but it is VERY easy to build the module yourself. |
| 13:30:03 | nikos | I'm running it on 2.4.3 |
| 13:30:05 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK, then, I'll try it. |
| 13:31:29 | nikos | Che_Fox: The only think you would need is kernel headers. |
| 13:31:54 | Che_Fox | nikos: Compiling is no problem, it's installed. |
| 13:32:17 | nikos | Great, now the order of starting is very important, so take care. |
| 13:32:40 | Che_Fox | reads. |
| 13:33:53 | nikos | Che_Fox: Here's my method, possibly not the most efficient: |
| 13:34:43 | Che_Fox | nikos: I'll BRB. Have to take Wichert back to the train station. |
| 13:35:12 | nikos | Che_Fox: Disconnect USB connection if not already disconnected, on ipaq 'modprobe usb-eth', connect USB, on desktop 'insmod usbnet', on ipaq 'ifconfig usbf up ... ; route add default gw ....', on desktop 'ifconfig usb0 up ... ; iptables ... ; echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward' |
| 13:35:17 | nikos | Che_Fox: K |
| 13:36:04 | dave | Che_Fox: and anyone else .. Big Brother.. Tell me if I am wrong but I think it is very unlikly for people to be running emacs on the ipaq directly. That said I can definatly see value in being able to import export from some futer PDA software to the BBDB. So the idea shoud be that we use a very gzipped db on the ipaq and create a send+recieve module that works over net or theough serial. Then on the PC end we create a client that can convert |
| 13:36:04 | dave | the date to and from bbdb. also we do the same from a windows PC for ms outlook etc .. thoughts ? |
| 13:36:16 | nikos | dave: I run xjed all the time. |
| 13:36:24 | nikos | dave: I have it packaged if you are interested. ;) |
| 13:36:29 | dave | yep |
| 13:36:56 | dave | never used xjed .. but will play with anthing thats what I got this little toy for ;-> |
| 13:37:07 | nikos | dave: I think use a standard would be the best bet, like SYNCML assuming no patent encumbrance. |
| 13:37:32 | nikos | dave: xjed is provide emacs lite and vi bindings among others. |
| 13:37:54 | | i think nikos feed is http://handhelds.org/~nikos/feed/ |
| 13:37:54 | nikos | ibot: nikos feed |
| 13:38:02 | nikos | dave: It's there if you want to try it. |
| 13:38:39 | dave | cheers Ill get it tonight .. |
| 13:39:09 | nikos | dave: I think most developers would prefer that you use either sleepycat, SQL, or python pickling. |
| 13:40:16 | nikos | dave: Please note, there is NO reason to gzip on the ipaq, jffs2 does zlib compression for you. |
| 13:40:45 | dave | SQL would be very cool and I know it v v well ... but the question again is space ... I need something that has a veryvery small storage format .. (can do that myself if one is not out there) then id need an SQL interpreter on top of that (that id have to get from somewhere) how much space is that gonna take ? |
| 13:40:57 | dave | oh cool |
| 13:41:09 | dave | very very cool |
| 13:41:24 | nikos | dave: There are lightweight SQL dbs in progress, like gadfly and a lite postgresql. |
| 13:41:52 | dave | ill serch it .. what format dose bbdb use do you know ? |
| 13:42:08 | nikos | dave: bbdb? |
| 13:42:33 | dave | emacses Big Brother DB as mentioned by Che_Fox |
| 13:42:55 | dave | Linking to it would be cool .. I can see the value to that very much .. |
| 13:43:01 | nikos | dave: I've never heard of it, sorry. |
| 13:44:47 | dave | Im looking up the pages on it now .. seems usefull .. I use xemacs exclusivly so would be into using that on my home desktop .. and using the structure I mentioned above that would allow me to sync at home then sync at work etc .. also those with expansion storage who one day may like xemacs on there pc would have the v small option onboard that the abbility to autolink when the sleave is on ? |
| 13:47:05 | dave | Gadfly looks pretty cool to .. Any ipk out there or a xcompilied bin .. ? |
| 13:47:08 | nikos | dave: Well, my opinion on applications on the ipaq is that storage is less of consideration than the UI. Storage is increasing quickly, as is RAM, it's not worth worrying about. On the other hand we will continue to have a smallish LCD and touchscreen interface with few buttons, so it is in my opinion worth considering. I'm sure even xeamcs could probalby be run on the 3800 models now available once Familiar does. Might require some trimmi |
| 13:47:08 | nikos | ng, but would it be usable? |
| 13:47:22 | nikos | dave: No, to my knowledge no one has actually tried it. |
| 13:49:13 | Che_Fox | is back. |
| 13:49:37 | bitman | Hi ! Another question: where can I get a tar.gz of the jffs2 image for familar v0.5 and can I edit it and recreate it on the skiff cluster ? |
| 13:49:38 | Che_Fox | starts with downgrading le bootloader.. |
| 13:50:12 | dave | nods true .. Tjhe idea is though to allow a serial/net link to a bbdb .. that would allow me to have offboard apps to link to any chosen structure BBdB or MS Outlook bing the main options atm It would work just as well internall if someone chose to inslall bbdb on there ipaq .. ? |
| 13:50:15 | nikos | bitman: Well, that's not the best way to do it, but a .tar.gz is in the same directory with the .jffs2 |
| 13:50:40 | dave | Im gonna have to set myself up to xcompile some stuff over this week aint I ... Im getting to need this now . |
| 13:50:44 | bitman | nikos: Which directory is that, and why isnt it a good way ? |
| 13:51:38 | dave | oh ... Gadfly is Python .. that should be pretty easy to get running ? |
| 13:51:43 | nikos | bitman: It's not that bad I guess, it's just not the way it's built in the first place. |
| 13:51:46 | nikos | dave: Yes |
| 13:52:08 | nikos | bitman: But I don't have all the details on how a7r builds the .jffs2 so, go right ahead. |
| 13:52:20 | nikos | bitman: The same place you downloaded familiar from. |
| 13:52:40 | bitman | nikos: OK I found the directory. But what do you mean by not the way ? Is it that I want to use the skiff cluster instead my linux box that is problematic, or is it that IO want to use the tgz file ? |
| 13:52:59 | Che_Fox | nikos: For what it's worth, the reason I have 2.4.15 bootloader installed is because the WinCE backup instructions said to use it. |
| 13:53:32 | nikos | bitman: The .tar.gz is simply another copy of the result of the process that a7r goes through, it's not what he starts with. As I said before, the original .ipk files are mostly used. |
| 13:54:05 | nikos | Che_Fox: Yes, but they were updated for later kernels that were not distibuted with v0.4. A mistake possibly, but it's done now. |
| 13:54:12 | bitman | nikos: I suppose there is no documentation about how to do it "correctly", or is there (by now I didn't find any) |
| 13:54:25 | Che_Fox | nikos: Oops. |
| 13:54:52 | nikos | bitman: Not that I'm aware of, only a few people have been building the .jffs2 images. The info is probably in the mailing list archives, but not really organized to my knowledge. |
| 13:55:33 | bitman | nikos: OK. Thanks for your help. So I try to go with the tgz then. (At least for now) |
| 13:55:41 | nikos | Che_Fox: Very few v0.4 users are still using the kernel that comes with v0.4, so we didn't catch the issue for some time. |
| 13:56:13 | nikos | bitman: Sure, just keep track of your changes so you can apportion them to the right packages later. |
| 13:56:21 | Che_Fox | Hm, minicom is rather lame when it comes to xmodem uploading.. |
| 13:56:28 | Che_Fox | nikos: I see.. |
| 13:56:36 | nikos | Che_Fox: Do you have lrzsz installed? |
| 13:56:45 | Che_Fox | nikos: of course |
| 13:56:58 | nikos | Che_Fox: Is the timeout the lameness you are talking about? |
| 13:57:32 | Che_Fox | nikos: No, it just doesn't seem to start the xmodem upload when I push a key, or at least it doesn't give any indication it is uploading |
| 13:58:00 | Che_Fox | Oops, now it's going. |
| 13:58:19 | Che_Fox | Hm, it is lame though, it keeps scrolling Retry 0: NAK on sector over and over |
| 13:58:23 | Che_Fox | but it is sending it, I think. |
| 13:58:26 | nikos | Che_Fox: I think that's the bootloader probably, the xmodem implementation is somewhat simple. |
| 13:58:29 | nikos | Che_Fox: Cancel it |
| 13:58:35 | nikos | Che_Fox: It will work but take forever. |
| 13:58:37 | Che_Fox | nikos: hm |
| 13:58:43 | nikos | Che_Fox: Then do it again and start the upload faster. |
| 13:58:51 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK... |
| 13:59:10 | Che_Fox | nikos: Ah, I think it's working right now.. |
| 13:59:23 | Che_Fox | nikos: There we go. |
| 14:00:10 | Che_Fox | Compaq OHH BootLoader, Rev 2-14-5 [BIG_KERNEL] [MONO] |
| 14:00:12 | Che_Fox | Ah hah. |
| 14:00:45 | Che_Fox | nikos: If I back up my flash now (32 megs), that will let me re-install Sikigami easily, right? |
| 14:01:07 | Che_Fox | I'm not totally familiar with where all the OS is store.d |
| 14:01:26 | nikos | Che_Fox: I'm not sure. Never tried it. |
| 14:01:34 | Che_Fox | nikos: Well, would it work with just Familiar? :) |
| 14:02:21 | bitman | Ahem .. where can I find mkfs.jffs2 ?? ( a) for iPAQ b) for Linux-> ipaq) ?? |
| 14:02:21 | nikos | Che_Fox: Again, I'm not sure, there is stuff about the bootloader that I don't know. It sure seems like it would, but I've never heard of anyone doing it. |
| 14:02:34 | | try http://linux-mtd.infradead.org/ |
| 14:02:34 | nikos | ibot: jffs2 |
| 14:02:45 | Che_Fox | nikos: Hm, sounds like a pretty common thing to want to do, to me |
| 14:10:39 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK! It's up. Now to generate ssh keys. |
| 14:10:43 | Che_Fox | (This is SICK. :) |
| 14:11:03 | nikos | ? |
| 14:11:36 | Che_Fox | ssh'ing into an iPaq |
| 14:11:40 | nikos | ah ;) |
| 14:12:41 | nikos | Anybody around using the combination of v0.5, a dual sleeve, and ipaqstat? |
| 14:13:24 | Che_Fox | woo, I'm ssh'd in. :) |
| 14:13:26 | Che_Fox | this is so wrong. |
| 14:14:19 | nikos | Che_Fox: Just the tip of the iceberg, get used to it. ;) |
| 14:15:04 | Che_Fox | nikos: I can ping yahoo from my iPaq. :) |
| 14:15:17 | Che_Fox | ... through USB, through 802.11b wireless, through a NAT router, through ADSL |
| 14:15:52 | nikos | Che_Fox: install dillo and you can use yahoo. ;) |
| 14:16:34 | nikos | Che_Fox: Now you just need to cut out a step, get a sleeve and use 802.11b directly on the ipaq, it's the only way... ;) |
| 14:16:43 | Che_Fox | nikos: I know, I know. :) |
| 14:19:09 | Che_Fox | nikos: should I press my luck and try to sleep the ipaq? ;) |
| 14:20:32 | nikos | Che_Fox: Please do |
| 14:21:35 | Che_Fox | tries. |
| 14:21:46 | Che_Fox | OK, it's asleep.. waking up.. |
| 14:21:48 | Che_Fox | whoa! |
| 14:21:49 | Che_Fox | fast |
| 14:21:52 | Che_Fox | works great |
| 14:22:04 | Che_Fox | last time, I tried to wake it up and it took 10 seconds, then froze after it brought the video back |
| 14:22:09 | Che_Fox | nikos: is much better |
| 14:22:14 | nikos | Che_Fox: Excellent |
| 14:23:19 | Che_Fox | nikos: Er, the 'reflash' utility on handhelds.org is a bit.. bloated |
| 14:23:25 | Che_Fox | [ben@ohmu:~/ipaq]% ls -l reflash 12:25$B8aA0(B |
| 14:23:25 | Che_Fox | -rwxr-xr-x 1 ben ben 1128995 8$B7n(B 14 05:31 reflash |
| 14:23:29 | Che_Fox | [ben@ohmu:~/ipaq]% file reflash 12:25$B8aA0(B |
| 14:23:29 | Che_Fox | reflash: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Advanced RISC Machines ARM, version 1, statically linked, not stripped |
| 14:23:31 | Che_Fox | hmmm |
| 14:23:41 | Che_Fox | that's rather big for an arm program :) |
| 14:24:24 | Che_Fox | reboots to back up the flash again. |
| 14:25:02 | Che_Fox | nikos: BTW, the usb-net died when I slept the ipaq :P |
| 14:25:43 | nikos | Che_Fox: Yes, no surprise there, pm is not complete in v0.4. |
| 14:27:33 | Che_Fox | ah. |
| 14:31:22 | Che_Fox | nikos: Tell me if I'm a crackhead, but I'm doing: |
| 14:31:30 | Che_Fox | boot> save flash 0x00000000 0x00ffffff |
| 14:31:40 | Che_Fox | That should back up my whole iPaq over xmodem. |
| 14:32:03 | nikos | Che_Fox: Well, I guess so. You would really have to talk to a bootldr developer. I've never used the save command. |
| 14:32:06 | Che_Fox | Then I can just load flash after I've installed the bootloader to restore Linux, I should think. |
| 14:32:07 | Che_Fox | OK. |
| 14:32:39 | nikos | Che_Fox: It would probably be safer to skip the bootloader sector and load it seperately. |
| 14:32:48 | Che_Fox | nikos: Ah, how big is that? |
| 14:32:53 | nikos | Che_Fox: If you screw up the bootloader you have a brick. |
| 14:32:57 | nikos | Che_Fox: 3600 model? |
| 14:32:58 | Che_Fox | nikos: true |
| 14:33:01 | Che_Fox | nikos: 3630 |
| 14:33:06 | nikos | Che_Fox: 256KB |
| 14:33:33 | Che_Fox | nikos: ah, I see what you mean. |
| 14:34:58 | Che_Fox | nikos: So I'll cancel it and start at 0x00040000. |
| 14:35:07 | nikos | Che_Fox: Sounds good. |
| 14:36:23 | Che_Fox | And away we go. |
| 14:36:28 | Che_Fox | boot> save flash 0x00040000 0x00fbffff |
| 14:36:31 | Che_Fox | That should be right. |
| 14:37:40 | Che_Fox | This is kind of nice, because it means I could conceivably share the Japanese install with you.. not many westerners could read the installation instructions for Sikigami |
| 14:37:47 | Che_Fox | it looks nice tho :) |
| 14:47:04 | Che_Fox | hmm.. |
| 14:47:19 | Che_Fox | I don't like the timeouts the xmodem download is getting in minicom |
| 14:47:26 | Che_Fox | just got a Retry 0: Sector number garbled |
| 14:47:33 | Che_Fox | this should not be happening over a direct serial connection... |
| 14:48:19 | nikos | Che_Fox: Did this happen immediately, or long after the download started? |
| 14:49:53 | Che_Fox | nikos: It happens about once a minute, during the download |
| 14:50:05 | Che_Fox | nikos: there have been random errors here and there. |
| 14:50:16 | Che_Fox | the flash image will probably be corrupt, eh. |
| 14:50:28 | Che_Fox | xmodem's error checking is not the best, if I recall correctly |
| 14:50:54 | Che_Fox | well, after this, I'll just tar everything up and send it over a scp |
| 14:51:00 | nikos | Hmm, the bootloader problem generally happens immediately and continuously. |
| 14:51:25 | nikos | Che_Fox: Yeah, xmodem doesn't ahve any error checking to my knowledge. |
| 14:51:25 | Che_Fox | Yeah, this one is just random time outs.. must be losing interrupts or something. |
| 14:51:44 | Che_Fox | nikos: Actually, IIRC, it has more than zmodem.. that's why it's so slow |
| 14:51:57 | Che_Fox | but I think it doesn't work that great |
| 14:52:07 | nikos | checksum at best |
| 14:52:36 | Che_Fox | yes, just a checksum I believe |
| 14:53:23 | Che_Fox | no big deal, I'll tar it up next |
| 14:53:31 | Che_Fox | just good to have a few backups |
| 14:53:46 | Che_Fox | these errors are gross |
| 14:53:50 | Che_Fox | save worl|Retry 0: Checksum136 | |
| 14:53:50 | Che_Fox | boot> sav|Retry 0: TIMEOUT 695 | |
| 14:53:50 | Che_Fox | usage: lo|Retry 0: Sector number garbled | |
| 14:53:51 | Che_Fox | boot> sav|Retry 0: TIMEOUT 224 | |
| 14:54:00 | blakangel | uh oh |
| 14:54:05 | Che_Fox | (ignore the save worl etc, the 'box' in the middle with the errors is what's interesting) |
| 15:23:25 | Che_Fox | nikos: What's the best way to upgrade to 0.5? |
| 15:24:03 | nikos | Che_Fox: To install it per the instructions. You CANNOT upgrade, too many changed. The installation is simpler than any upgrade anyway. |
| 15:24:07 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK. |
| 15:24:11 | Che_Fox | will do so. |
| 16:03:10 | Che_Fox | Hm. |
| 16:03:13 | Che_Fox | I got 0.5 installed.. |
| 16:03:18 | Che_Fox | got it up on the net.. |
| 16:03:21 | Che_Fox | but ssh and telnetd are not running. |
| 16:03:31 | Che_Fox | It also did not give me a shell or X. |
| 16:03:33 | | somebody said ssh was http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/OpenSSH and http://www.openssh.org |
| 16:03:33 | Disconnect | ibot: ssh |
| 16:03:37 | Che_Fox | So, how do I get into the damned thing? :) |
| 16:03:48 | Disconnect | Che_Fox: serial should have a shell, if you set the linuxargs correctly. |
| 16:04:00 | Che_Fox | Disconnect: Ah. So upload ssh via zmodem? OK. |
| 16:04:12 | Che_Fox | pokes at silly ipaq. |
| 16:04:16 | Disconnect | if its on the net you don't need zmodem. |
| 16:04:49 | nikos | wait |
| 16:04:52 | Disconnect | also, you -really- -really- want to install the postinst package and run the script. fam (for various reasons) doesn't work w/o those fonts. |
| 16:04:58 | nikos | ssh should be there in today's v0.5 image |
| 16:04:59 | Che_Fox | Disconnect: this is 0.5. |
| 16:04:59 | Disconnect | hands of to nikos. Am leaving this time, honest ;) |
| 16:05:01 | Che_Fox | nikos: it's not. |
| 16:05:02 | nikos | follow the instructions... |
| 16:05:05 | Che_Fox | nikos: I did. |
| 16:05:06 | nikos | ipkg install_pending |
| 16:05:24 | Che_Fox | nikos: Oh! \ |
| 16:05:26 | Che_Fox | Sorry. Yeah. |
| 16:05:30 | nikos | Not quite to the end... ;) |
| 16:05:35 | Che_Fox | nikos: Ah, and now we generate the ssh key. OK, sorry. :) |
| 16:05:52 | nikos | no biggy, that's one package that can't be installed before the jffs2 image is created. |
| 16:06:00 | Che_Fox | hm. Why not? |
| 16:06:06 | Che_Fox | just run the postinst afterwards |
| 16:06:28 | nikos | What's the difference between installing the package and running postinst? |
| 16:06:32 | nikos | The user does the same thing. |
| 16:06:57 | Che_Fox | Uh, you could include a .bashrc that runs one time and does the ssh key setup automatically upon first login. |
| 16:07:06 | Che_Fox | that's what real debian does for one-time setup |
| 16:07:20 | nikos | The ssh install takes too much time on the ipaq, we don't want it happening unless the user requests it. |
| 16:07:31 | Che_Fox | bah, do it in the background then |
| 16:07:35 | Che_Fox | it's important |
| 16:07:41 | nikos | Now you could make it ask on first login, true. But somebody has to do that. |
| 16:07:45 | Che_Fox | heh. |
| 16:07:47 | nikos | Che_Fox: You are welcome to contribute. ;) |
| 16:07:49 | Che_Fox | vi: Symbol `ospeed' has different size in shared object, consider re-linking |
| 16:07:50 | Che_Fox | vi: Symbol `PC' has different size in shared object, consider re-linking |
| 16:07:51 | Che_Fox | hmm.. |
| 16:07:54 | Che_Fox | nikos: Prolly will |
| 16:08:10 | nikos | Che_Fox: hmm, that's odd. |
| 16:08:17 | Che_Fox | nikos: yes. it is. |
| 16:08:25 | nikos | Che_Fox: I don't remember seeing that, get the same response from vim? |
| 16:08:33 | Che_Fox | nikos: trying to install task-complete.. |
| 16:08:41 | dave | nikos: Im planning to build a gadflk ipk .. Is there docs anywhere as to the file layout struct on familiar .. I noticed that mingle and toad place .pys in the /usr/lib/familiar-framework dir .. is there anywhere I can look to see the descs of what should go there etc ? |
| 16:08:42 | Che_Fox | going very slowly |
| 16:09:01 | dave | gadflk=gadfly |
| 16:09:32 | nikos | dave: That's because those are familiar framework apps, don't install there unless you are making a familiar framework app, use usual python policy. |
| 16:10:10 | dave | nods ... OOI what is the familiar-framework project ? |
| 16:10:24 | | nikos: excuse me? |
| 16:10:24 | nikos | ibot: salamander |
| 16:10:35 | | Check out http://cvs.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/familiar/framework/ |
| 16:10:35 | nikos | ibot: familiar framework |
| 16:10:50 | Che_Fox | 19:49:19 (64.06 KB/s) - `//tmp/ipkg/libglib1.2_1.2.10-2_arm.ipk' saved [70253/70253] |
| 16:10:54 | Che_Fox | yay, one o' my packages |
| 16:11:04 | Che_Fox | is so happy his bloated code is on arm. |
| 16:11:08 | nikos | :) |
| 16:11:23 | nikos | Che_Fox: I bet is was debloated a little before repackaging. ;) |
| 16:11:32 | Che_Fox | Configuring mixer...mv: cannot create regular file `/etc/X11/app-defaults/Emix': No such file or directory |
| 16:11:34 | Che_Fox | hmm. |
| 16:11:43 | nikos | Che_Fox: hmmm, that's my fault. |
| 16:11:54 | nikos | Che_Fox: That must be because it is installed prior to X install. |
| 16:11:59 | Che_Fox | Configuring xcalibrate.../usr/bin/python: error while loading shared libraries: libdb2.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 16:12:02 | Che_Fox | hmmm.. |
| 16:12:07 | Che_Fox | nikos: apt-get ipkg ain't |
| 16:13:18 | nikos | Che_Fox: Please write these down and report to a7r. |
| 16:13:23 | Che_Fox | nikos: OK. |
| 16:13:30 | nikos | Che_Fox: I don't know if very many people are using task-complete anymore, I sure don't. |
| 16:13:41 | nikos | Che_Fox: So it's not getting tested too well probalby in v0.5. |
| 16:13:45 | Che_Fox | nikos: Right. |
| 16:14:26 | dave | Hmmm |
| 16:20:50 | Che_Fox | sent. |
| 16:21:46 | nikos | Hmm, what's the best way to copy a file forcing the path to be created.... |
| 16:22:08 | Che_Fox | mkdir /path/to/file && cp /src/file /path/to/file/dest? :) |
| 16:22:15 | Che_Fox | nikos: hm, X startup is not happy |
| 16:22:19 | Che_Fox | can't open file /etc/gtk-menu; exiting... |
| 16:22:23 | Che_Fox | not so good |
| 16:22:25 | nikos | Che_Fox: ipkg install gtk-menu |
| 16:22:29 | nikos | Che_Fox: ipkg install menu-tiny |
| 16:22:33 | Che_Fox | er.. ok |
| 16:22:42 | nikos | Che_Fox: Feel free to report that one too |
| 16:22:44 | | gnats is at http://familiar.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/wwwgnats.pl |
| 16:22:44 | nikos | ibot: gnats |
| 16:22:46 | Che_Fox | nikos: ok |
| 16:22:58 | nikos | Che_Fox: Some of this should probably go to the gnats db I guess. |
| 16:23:27 | Che_Fox | Configuring menu-tiny...kill: usage: kill [-s sigspec | -n signum | -sigspec] [pid | job]... or kill -l [sigspec] |
| 16:23:31 | Che_Fox | hmm |
| 16:24:25 | nikos | Che_Fox: Little package bug, no worries, it's trying to kill the gtk-menu process which isn't running. |
| 16:24:29 | nikos | mkdir -p /etc/X11/app-defaults/ |
| 16:24:29 | nikos | mv $PKG_ROOT/tmp/Emix /etc/X11/app-defaults/Emix |
| 16:24:29 | nikos | mkdir -p /usr/lib/menu/ |
| 16:24:29 | nikos | mv $PKG_ROOT/tmp/mixer /usr/lib/menu/mixer |
| 16:24:33 | nikos | Acceptable? |
| 16:26:11 | Che_Fox | nikos: Sounds fine to me.. |
| 16:26:22 | Che_Fox | nikos: check that the permissions are right tho.. |
| 16:26:27 | Che_Fox | wow, the font in vim is so tiny |
| 16:27:56 | nikos | Che_Fox: ipkg install familiar-postinst ; ~/postinst ; ipkg remove familiar-postinst |
| 16:28:05 | nikos | Che_Fox: I have to assume you mean for rxvt? |
| 16:28:54 | Che_Fox | nikos: yeah |
| 16:31:47 | Che_Fox | nikos: the rotation is very cool! |
| 16:32:03 | Che_Fox | the xstroke menu entry REALLY gets in the way |
| 16:32:13 | Che_Fox | I've had to kill it 4 times starting up extras.. should have it check if it's already running |
| 16:32:14 | nikos | Che_Fox: I don't understand. |
| 16:32:21 | Che_Fox | nikos: two issues, sorry. |
| 16:32:35 | Che_Fox | nikos: it's easy to accidentally hit the Input Methods menu entry, and then accidentally hit xtroke |
| 16:32:36 | nikos | Che_Fox: The xstorke issue |
| 16:32:39 | Che_Fox | nikos: happened 4-5 times |
| 16:32:47 | Che_Fox | nikos: then you have to ps and kill the xstroke process |
| 16:32:49 | nikos | Because it's so long? |
| 16:32:52 | Che_Fox | nikos: yes |
| 16:33:10 | nikos | Che_Fox: Reasonable complaint, edit /usr/lib/menu/xstroke and send cworth some email. |
| 16:33:10 | Che_Fox | nikos: try it, just barely tap the Input Methods menu entry and 90% of the time you'll start up another xstroke |
| 16:33:21 | nikos | Che_Fox: I hit some other one all the time though, don't remember which one. |
| 16:33:34 | nikos | Really gtk-menu needs a little work to work better. |
| 16:33:39 | Che_Fox | yes. |
| 16:35:26 | nikos | Che_Fox: We are currently in interim mode on this, ion is not intended as a permanent solution. Mandrake is working on epaq. |
| 16:35:28 | | i heard epaq was at http://www.handhelds.org/z/wiki/ePAQ |
| 16:35:28 | nikos | ibot: epaq |
| 16:38:01 | Che_Fox | nikos: hm. |
| 16:40:48 | Che_Fox | 02:42:34 (43.17 KB/s) - `//tmp/ipkg/less_346-7_arm.ipk' saved [41734/41734] |
| 16:40:50 | Che_Fox | hallelujah |
| 16:40:57 | nikos | lol |
| 16:41:10 | nikos | I recommend bash too, trash ash |
| 16:41:23 | Che_Fox | I wish there was zsh, but yes, I know. |
| 16:41:27 | Che_Fox | already switched root's shell |
| 16:45:20 | blakangel | im using ash |
| 16:45:23 | blakangel | is bash a smaller binary? |
| 16:45:30 | blakangel | im runnin out of space on my 16mb flash |
| 16:45:33 | blakangel | ;( |
| 16:49:21 | Che_Fox | nikos: dillo is nice but WHOO BABY THOSE SCROLL BARS ARE SENSITIVE |
| 16:50:20 | Che_Fox | oops, dillo crashed |
| 16:50:21 | Che_Fox | sniff |
| 16:50:28 | Che_Fox | GLib-ERROR **: could not allocate -600 bytes |
| 16:50:28 | Che_Fox | aborting... |
| 16:52:18 | Che_Fox | ok, way way way way past bed time for me |
| 16:52:20 | Che_Fox | night folks |
| 16:52:21 | Che_Fox | *collapses* |
| 16:54:42 | nikos | Good night Che_Fox |
| 18:14:04 | bitman | Hi, again I have a question about using a custom jffs2 image .. I've done one and downloaded it, but I get a Kernel panic: No init found. Try passing init= option to kernel. ?? |
| 18:45:58 | Sparky009 | rofl |
| 18:46:07 | Sparky009 | you need to set the linuxparams in the bootloader |
| 18:46:18 | Sparky009 | there's instructions on what to set in both sets of instructions |
| 18:46:20 | Sparky009 | errr... |
| 18:46:21 | bitman | Sparky009: They are set !! |
| 18:46:36 | bitman | Sparky009: noinitrd root=/dev/mtdblock/2 init=/linuxrc console=ttySA0 |
| 18:46:42 | Sparky009 | weird |
| 18:46:49 | Sparky009 | beats me then |
| 18:46:58 | Sparky009 | could you tell me how to make a custom jffs? |
| 18:47:06 | bitman | Sparky009: That's exactly why I am asking thequestion, cause it is so weird I dont understand it. |
| 18:47:24 | bitman | Sparky009: Well I can tell you what I have done .. but obviously it is not yet really working :(( |
| 18:47:29 | Sparky009 | still |
| 18:47:44 | Sparky009 | my jffs2 image is giving CRC errors cause I installed stuff (or so I'm assuming) |
| 18:48:06 | bitman | Sparky009: How did you try to create it ?? |
| 18:48:10 | Sparky009 | I didn't |
| 18:48:21 | Sparky009 | I used the fam. .5 bootstrap and installed stuff |
| 18:48:25 | Sparky009 | and it gives me crcs |
| 18:48:28 | Sparky009 | it still works fine though |
| 18:48:48 | Sparky009 | oh, and do you know what package libXft is in? |
| 18:49:02 | bitman | I did a simple thing: tar -l -c -v -B -f - / /dev | (cd /tmp/task-bootstrap; tar -x -v -B -f -) |
| 18:49:10 | bitman | Followed by mkfs.jffs2.arm -r /tmp/task-bootstrap -o /tmp/current.jffs2 -e 0x40000 -l -p |
| 18:50:35 | bitman | Sparky009: about libXft I don't know. |
| 18:51:02 | Sparky009 | k |
| 18:51:12 | Sparky009 | I need to find out so my wm works :P |
| 18:51:21 | Sparky009 | also... what versino of fam. do you have installed? |
| 18:51:23 | Sparky009 | .5? |
| 18:51:27 | bitman | Yes |
| 18:52:14 | Sparky009 | does cardmanager give you fits on bootup? |
| 18:52:28 | bitman | I uninstalled it .. dont have an expansion slot |
| 18:52:42 | Sparky009 | I have one, but it gives me a ton of fits... |
| 18:52:48 | Sparky009 | even though it appearently mounts the CF regardless |
| 18:53:00 | Sparky009 | unless /dev/hda1 is actually the flash? |
| 19:07:21 | DaveH | Afternoon folks |
| 19:08:06 | blakangel | hey |
| 19:08:08 | blakangel | how you doin |
| 19:08:26 | DaveH | Im ok .. Looking into python atm |
| 19:11:33 | DaveH | and you ? |
| 19:12:08 | blakangel | im oco |
| 19:12:09 | blakangel | cool |
| 19:12:11 | blakangel | sittin at work |
| 19:12:21 | blakangel | got my ipaq here keepin me company |
| 19:12:31 | DaveH | what do you do .. ? |
| 19:12:57 | blakangel | i work at an internet service provider |
| 19:13:06 | blakangel | im workin onsome dsl stuff |
| 19:13:11 | DaveH | nods |
| 19:13:13 | blakangel | cisco routers |
| 19:13:15 | blakangel | etc. |
| 19:13:18 | blakangel | l2tp |
| 19:13:19 | DaveH | cool |
| 19:13:54 | blakangel | lala |
| 19:13:55 | blakangel | i got dillo |
| 19:13:59 | blakangel | on the ipaq |
| 19:14:02 | blakangel | i installed python and pygtk |
| 19:14:05 | blakangel | for som erason |
| 19:14:08 | Sparky009 | what does dillo do anyway? |
| 19:14:28 | blakangel | web browser |
| 19:14:29 | DaveH | web browser |
| 19:14:33 | Sparky009 | ah |
| 19:14:40 | Sparky009 | blak, you have .5 right? |
| 19:14:50 | Sparky009 | does cardmanager bitch on startup for you? |
| 19:15:03 | DaveH | its pretty good for a smallbe no real frams and cant handle https but other then that its pretty good |
| 19:16:07 | blakangel | yea |
| 19:16:09 | blakangel | no |
| 19:16:11 | blakangel | dont bitch |
| 19:16:11 | blakangel | afaik |
| 19:16:26 | Sparky009 | hmmm |
| 19:16:31 | Sparky009 | cardmgr[59]: could not adjust resource: IO ports 0xc00-0xcff: Invalid argument |
| 19:16:36 | Sparky009 | I get a bunch of those lines on startup |
| 19:16:46 | Sparky009 | do you have an expansion pack/CF card in yours? |
| 19:17:14 | blakangel | yea |
| 19:17:30 | blakangel | i got a pccard pack |
| 19:17:30 | Sparky009 | hmmm |
| 19:17:31 | blakangel | on it |
| 19:17:35 | Sparky009 | oh, hm |
| 19:17:37 | blakangel | no cards in it tho |
| 19:18:08 | Sparky009 | a1100_h3600_common_pcmcia_get_irq_info |
| 19:18:08 | Sparky009 | cardmgr[59]: starting, version is 3.1.22 |
| 19:18:08 | Sparky009 | cardmgr[59]: open_sock(socket 1) failed: Device or resource busy |
| 19:18:19 | Sparky009 | that's what I get, then a bunch of "could not adjust resource" crap |
| 19:18:24 | Sparky009 | which I assume is because of that |
| 19:22:39 | blakangel | wierd |
| 23:36:03 | mirov | Anyone know how to force a page reload in Dillo ? I'm trying to snarf my yard_cam, and keep getting the cached image... |
| 23:38:58 | blakangel | dunno |
| 23:41:26 | terrys | mirov: hit the symbol to the right of "home" |
| 23:45:01 | _Axu_ | hi |
| 23:45:47 | mirov | terrys: That does a reload, but it seems to take the bits from a local cache. If I stop/start Dillo I get the fresh image. |
| 23:47:23 | terrys | mirov: ahh I see - and if you cycle the forward & backward arrows, do you still get the cache image ? |
| 23:52:42 | mirov | terrys: yup, even if I visit another web page in between. netscape does the same thing, but I can press shift-reload |
| 23:54:29 | terrys | terrys: well that's no good - so you really need a shift key... |
| 23:57:16 | terrys | sends to himself... hmmm |
| 23:57:34 | terrys | mirov: well that's no good - so you really need a shift key... |